The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #1042

00:00:00.000 hello and welcome to the podcast of the lotus eaters episode 1042 i'm your host harry joined

00:00:13.800 today by beau otherwise known as bbd and josh otherwise known as the firm and today we're going

00:00:20.660 to be talking about the daniel penny trial how police intimidated a journalist over a year old

00:00:26.500 tweet and how to preserve bodies in pompeii could be gay experts say you're gonna break into a rap 0.73

00:00:34.560 there they could be gay experts say you're you're anyway you're an expert on gay affairs josh so i'll

00:00:40.280 be referring to your expertise on this you weren't meant to tell them about those and an announcement

00:00:45.900 as well for everybody uh common sense crusade is going out in this afternoon as normal but it will

00:00:50.940 be shifted from 3 p.m to 4 p.m uk time so if you look subscribe to the website and looking forward

00:00:55.900 to that please be aware it's on at 4 p.m today and calvin's going to be talking about the state

00:01:00.620 of britain with charlie bentley astor very special guest so that'll be very interesting with that

00:01:06.140 anything else you'd like to add gentlemen have fun enjoy no all right then so let's do an update of

00:01:13.880 the daniel penny trial which i have deemed as the process is the punishment for a very simple reason

00:01:19.480 which is that this is not going to be a trial that the prosecution are having any fun in

00:01:23.840 they've found the jury they've been going through some of the witness testimony recently

00:01:27.980 and it is an absolute slam dunk for the defense because there is no real case about daniel penny

00:01:34.680 if there is any conviction whatsoever on the manslaughter charges that he's been put forward

00:01:39.700 with i would be shocked i'd be very very shocked so what is the point of putting him through the trial

00:01:44.980 when it's an open shut case well to punish him with the process in the first place getting him in

00:01:50.660 the public i like this parading him in front of the news cameras making him a circus act where he's

00:01:56.700 put in front of them humiliated time wasted reputation destroyed potentially among some

00:02:01.780 parts of society and that's the point and let's not forget why this is happening is because basically

00:02:07.780 he is a white man on the underground in new york who decided to defend people isn't he also a former

00:02:16.100 soldier and also he did it on behalf of protecting other people which you would think would be

00:02:22.360 something that in a normal society we would celebrate and say yeah dare i say in a different

00:02:28.560 time we would have perhaps called him a hero um yes for taking down a violent um drug addict and i think

00:02:35.700 that in many ways um the way western society is going because we defer violence to the police in some

00:02:42.380 cases for our justice um you're not allowed to at least in britain at least in some american states

00:02:48.700 thankfully they have it the right way around you're not allowed to defend your home with with violence

00:02:53.520 um you're not allowed to defend yourself with violence you're not allowed to defend other people

00:02:58.040 with violence and if someone who initiates violence happens to die in the process of you defending them

00:03:03.680 so be it i think i think that's the way the law should go that's a very sensible way of looking at

00:03:09.640 the matter but the other element to this is that yes daniel penny is being punished through the

00:03:14.840 process itself but that punishment being so public being so visible is something that's going to put

00:03:20.480 you off if you're on the new york subway or in any other public situation you see somebody who's

00:03:25.460 about to commit violence is hoping that maybe instead of doing anything to step in you'll look

00:03:30.360 the other way and let chaos reign on the streets because the government would prefer if you didn't do

00:03:35.580 that now it'll be interesting when trump takes office to see if this is a situation that holds

00:03:40.720 because this is essentially the remnants of the old administration punishing somebody and we'll see

00:03:47.380 when trump gets in if they carry on in that way or if penny does somehow remarkably be convicted

00:03:53.340 if they pardon him or if these sorts of things become less and less and less frequent

00:03:58.200 i just think we should clone penny we need a few divisions of men like that 0.99

00:04:03.900 yeah it's frustrating that a man who in my opinion has not only not done anything wrong but done

00:04:12.220 something right is now being punished for it and of course the as you're saying i 100 agree with what

00:04:18.820 you're saying and probably will go on to say um that they're dragging him through it to make an example

00:04:25.520 of him because they don't want people to be pro-social and to look out for other people

00:04:29.880 they want them to be subservient to the state they don't want them to have autonomy and to be able to

00:04:36.880 stick up for what is right and what is good because they stand against all those things and hopefully

00:04:42.340 under a new administration things will change but speaking of the former paradigm some people as i

00:04:47.660 mentioned do not want you to acknowledge that this has been done specifically mainly because not only do

00:04:52.680 they want chaos in the streets but specifically they do not want white americans to be able to

00:04:57.280 think that they are able to defend themselves or defend others because that can be something of an

00:05:02.860 impulse that they have to do people like or on mcintyre have pointed out daniel penny is guilty of 0.83

00:05:07.740 defending other uh defending others while white it's that simple james lindsey noted uh homosexual 0.88

00:05:14.020 activist and uh clown children's entertainer says woke right does woke identity politics so of course 0.80

00:05:21.160 he's trying to keep you boxed in not admitting that reality is exactly what it says what it looks

00:05:27.240 like and uh here's a nice massive l for him to take which is that as part of the trial the defender

00:05:33.460 the prosecution have labeled him the white man literally the prosecution while trying to put their

00:05:39.360 case forward about daniel penny at one point repeatedly labeled him the white man in an attempt to

00:05:45.300 dehumanize him and really and remove all of his characteristics except for the fact that he is a 0.58

00:05:50.660 white man the most frustrating thing about what lindsey is saying there is that he's been able to 0.89

00:05:56.780 see years and years of people talking about oh they they were murdered because they were black they

00:06:03.600 blah blah blah blah because they were black this over and over and over again and the fact that this 0.93

00:06:09.360 has obviously brought race into every discussion now um should be obvious to anyone because of course 0.92

00:06:16.020 they only make a fuss when it's a white person doing it to a black person even if that black person 0.50

00:06:21.080 is an you know a violent criminal doing violent criminal things it has to be stopped violent homeless 0.63

00:06:29.080 man who has attacked people on the streets previously that's fine that doesn't get fixed by the system

00:06:35.000 in fact he was supposed to have been held in a social care or mental health services facility

00:06:41.020 and he just walked out of it which is why he ended up on that subway car with daniel penny in the

00:06:47.960 first place this sort of thing assumes you take on board the paradigm that being white is a

00:06:54.480 pejorative well we don't of course we don't a lot of people don't have not bought into that

00:07:01.800 at all so but they are banking that the dehumanizing rhetoric of the past 10 years and the past longer if

00:07:08.740 you think about it uh will prejudice a jury against him if he is reduced only to the fact that

00:07:13.880 he's a white man they don't want to think oh he's a former marine he's an individual uh with his own

00:07:19.640 values and virtues instead he is just a white man victimizing a black man but they're only that's what 0.96

00:07:26.280 they want they're only allowed to get away with this sort of thing because we don't have enough

00:07:30.260 uh pride in who we are basically as as a civilization and i saw a clip recently of a man in africa

00:07:38.140 uh talking about um his views of the white man very positively he's just like what they've done

00:07:43.560 is amazing the technology they've brought here is amazing the fact that the man from zimbabwe wasn't 1.00

00:07:48.880 it was yeah about yeah and he was talking about how airplanes and electricity and it's like it defies

00:07:55.740 all expectation to us and and that you know we should be thankful and you know they should be very

00:08:03.040 proud of their achievements and and when you you hear from someone outside of the western political

00:08:08.480 paradigm they have a very very different view of us than we have to ourselves and actually quite often

00:08:13.720 more positive also the physiognomy never lies if you line daniel penny up next to um james lindsey

00:08:21.840 a chinless pot-bellied dwarf versus some sort of giant warrior some sort of charlemagne-esque

00:08:30.620 ariovistus warlord it doesn't feel like a fair comparison no it's not fair it's just not fair

00:08:36.560 i didn't think ariovistus would be brought up no i wasn't expecting that either but good one

00:08:42.940 good job uh but if you want to see the this inner city press was doing a few transcripts of what was

00:08:48.200 going on in the trial and here you can see the um uh the prosecutor when you saw the white man

00:08:53.980 holding on to mr neely how were they his arm on his neck where is mr neely's back with respect to

00:08:58.580 the white man was mr neely lying on top of the white man like this he had him held so it's just

00:09:03.700 repeating it over and over again repetition to try and hammer it into the jury's head this is not a

00:09:08.340 person this is an abstract figure and an abstract figure of oppression on the black man yeah what

00:09:15.860 they're trying to do there is dehumanize him he's not an individual he's not a person with um you

00:09:23.020 know desires and wishes and a family and a deep and rich emotional life he's just a white man 0.95

00:09:29.340 evil white man coming to get you they're trying to turn him into a boogeyman just the personification 0.99

00:09:34.160 of white hate that's all he is exactly just an avatar for white hate he's not got any agency of 0.99

00:09:40.680 genuinely evil to do this it is but it's no surprise they're taking this um this tact because

00:09:48.420 other than this other than aiming for the base prejudices that they're hoping that the jury

00:09:54.800 already have against white men they don't really have much of a case and we'll see that as i go

00:10:00.380 through some of the trial updates here and a lot of the witness testimony that's been coming out

00:10:04.560 as well as some of the police body cam footage as well so first of all penny's lawyer as a result of

00:10:10.780 all of this talk of white man and judge allowing one of the witnesses the one of only two anti penny

00:10:17.760 witnesses that have gotten up and spoken so far to repeatedly refer to him as a murderer which was

00:10:24.440 the witness johnny grima who is literally formerly a homeless person who's now a homeless activist

00:10:30.160 so of course he's very homeless people does he oh of course he's very prejudiced against daniel

00:10:36.320 penny because he just sees him again avatar of white hate victimizing a poor homeless black man

00:10:41.520 he repeatedly referred to as a murderer so penny's lawyer was attempting to get it thrown out of

00:10:47.080 court as a mistrial kenneth accused the district attorney's office of trying to paint penny as a 0.99

00:10:51.340 white vigilante now the da has put that right in front of them to reinforce a narrative that this

00:10:56.000 architecture student who served his country admirably that was on the train with an unhinged

00:11:00.360 nut job according to witnesses like that he added that in there is a vigilante there's no longer any

00:11:05.280 way that my client can get anything resembling a fair trial at this point given what has happened

00:11:09.100 over the last few days but the judge maxwell wiley denied the motion for mistrial do you know what

00:11:14.500 this is um ingrained into white european culture and it was imported to north america is the notion that

00:11:21.860 if someone is in distress um you help them this is something that is deeply ingrained into us in a

00:11:29.400 way you know it does exist in other cultures that's not um entirely unfair to say but i think it's more

00:11:35.900 heavily emphasized and i think that people from other cultures just don't get it they don't get

00:11:41.380 our need to help other people they see it as strange and and as if we're suckers to be taken advantage

00:11:48.200 of some of them certainly do some of them don't but some of them certainly do either way the actual

00:11:53.520 witness testimony except for those two people the one who was part of the white man discourse and then

00:11:59.100 the one who just kept getting going up and calling him a murderer all the other witness testimony has

00:12:04.520 been very much on his side and reinforcing the information that we had right at the beginning of

00:12:09.980 this whole situation in the first place as soon as the video footage came out that he had murdered

00:12:15.220 um murdered jordan neely we already knew the story which was that this guy was an unhinged nut job he 0.70

00:12:20.800 was homeless he was on the streets of new york screaming and ranting at people he'd probably been

00:12:25.260 on drugs and he was scaring the passengers we already had the witness testimony from the time 0.78

00:12:29.680 saying that he was walking around saying to people that i'm going to kill you i don't care if i live or

00:12:34.640 die some i don't care if i go to prison etc etc so daniel penny was stepping in to prevent the

00:12:41.340 situation from escalating and uh the witness testimony is damning to any kind of case that

00:12:46.320 the prosecution were hoping to put against him so here ala alithia get it um alithia gittings who is

00:12:52.680 this black woman here she got up on the witness testimony she also gave a statement to the police

00:12:57.400 after it happened she said that um she sold jurors on friday that she was scared estless by neely's

00:13:03.300 rantings could be seen on officer christian brito's body cam footage giving a statement amid

00:13:08.020 the ensuing mayhem i think this guy was on drugs she said you know because when he came in he was

00:13:13.280 unbelievably off the charts he scared the living daylights out of everybody gittings told uh said

00:13:18.600 that daniel penny took neely to the ground and put him in a choke hold not a hard choke hold but just

00:13:23.020 enough to secure him she also later said the guy in the tan take him uh took him down like very

00:13:28.580 respectfully and held him he just held him yeah he didn't choke him good for her on saying that well

00:13:35.300 yeah for being honest because i imagine that um her saying that publicly is not going to go

00:13:41.060 unnoticed by certain people and she might get a hard time for that so yeah and he been held on

00:13:46.120 remand the whole time i'm not certain of that i know in june after he was charged he gave a personal

00:13:51.500 statement regarding this where he filmed him filmed himself talking to camera as far as the statements

00:13:55.940 have come from the trial so far he's not said anything he's not taken the stand we don't know if he's

00:14:01.120 going to take the stand because people are saying he doesn't really need to because the witnesses

00:14:04.560 are building the case for him and he's barely said anything he's been very very stoic which is

00:14:10.340 probably the best approach i think that's probably upon his lawyer's advice isn't it that the lawyer's

00:14:14.700 basically saying well you know we've got video evidence we've got lots of witness statements

00:14:19.800 um he's probably trying to just play it safe here by being quiet yeah which is probably the best and

00:14:26.680 people would at the time of the rittenhouse trial also saying that rittenhouse shouldn't have taken

00:14:30.560 the stand but that ended up helping his case even though again the witnesses were all building the

00:14:36.180 case for him and i think would have sold it for him anyway but in this case i don't think he needs

00:14:40.880 to either so on friday the manhattan district attorney's office called two police witnesses for

00:14:45.200 brief testimony one nypd lieutenant who said he thought that neely had overdosed when he got to the

00:14:50.400 scene and another who testified about efforts emergency workers made to revive the troubled homeless man

00:14:55.460 because of course neely literally did not choke him to death he held him in a chokehold but again

00:15:00.580 the testimony there was pretty damning just saying he held him and then he let go of him he was still

00:15:07.440 breathing they still had a pulse the police were there for at least 15 minutes much longer than that

00:15:13.300 and then it was when he got to the hospital that he died what was the cause of death heart attack was it

00:15:17.880 the cause of death was put down by the coroner as as asphyxiation so they did put it down as a

00:15:23.600 homicide there are parallels here aren't there there are a few parallels here yes witness laurie

00:15:30.120 citro said that even though she had seen many troubled people during her 30 years riding the

00:15:35.280 new york subways jordan neely's rant felt different and scary enough for her to barricade her five-year-old

00:15:41.340 son no i did not feel safe when he was moving around erratically she said i've taken the subway for 30

00:15:47.020 years and i've seen a lot i've seen a lot of unstable people this felt different to me i felt concerned

00:15:51.980 concerned enough to put a barrier in front of my son saying that her fear of neely was next level

00:15:57.440 she said neely was coming within a foot or less of people's faces on the f train subway car he was

00:16:02.540 riding and she was scared of what he might do and when marine veteran daniel penny intervened she was

00:16:07.840 relieved and that's something that's consistent with all of these witnesses except for the actual

00:16:12.680 activist who got up which was as soon as penny stepped in they all felt relieved and felt like

00:16:17.500 they were safe because they all felt unsafe because again this guy is ranting going back and

00:16:23.160 forth down this train car getting in people's faces screaming how he's going to hurt somebody how he

00:16:27.840 doesn't care if he lives or dies or goes to prison would you you can notice a very big tone shift

00:16:34.160 between that of a certain case in a in a certain time 2020 and this one that the witnesses are a lot

00:16:43.400 more sympathetic to the penny than certain police officers oh yeah well also because of the fact

00:16:50.240 that the footage that came out was immediately checked against the witness statements police

00:16:55.820 body cam footage has been released now and it wasn't politicized to anywhere near the extent that

00:17:00.340 the floyd uh the floyd case was before anybody had chance to check anything that had happened with

00:17:05.080 the floyd case the footage had been released that was what most people saw first and they made up their

00:17:10.480 minds from that moment on and as you know first impressions are the most striking they stick with

00:17:15.100 you people couldn't get over those first impressions of what looked like a man choking a man out even

00:17:21.480 joe rogan said that it looked like he choked him out which i still don't believe personally joe rogan

00:17:27.620 you are a um an mma guy you know what a choke hold looks like you know how to choke a guy out 0.98

00:17:33.440 do you really believe a man can be choked with a knee on the back of the neck

00:17:37.500 never seen it in competition neither have i but food for thought there's been more testimony since

00:17:45.040 last friday as well uh the bombshell what's going on here was that one of the key witnesses the man

00:17:51.020 who was caught in the footage helping daniel penny because he was holding jordan neely's hands

00:17:56.020 admitted that he lied about daniel to daniel penny and the cops as well when he was giving his first

00:18:01.540 statement so on tuesday eric gonzalez who helped penny restrain neely that day admitted he didn't

00:18:07.920 tell the truth when he was initially interviewed by the manhattan district attorney's office following

00:18:11.760 the man's death during his testimony gonzalez who was on his way to a construction job at the time

00:18:16.060 told the court that he falsely claimed that he got to the scene earlier than he actually did

00:18:20.380 and that the former marine decided to act after neely hit him in reality gonzalez said that penny

00:18:25.940 already had neely in a choke hold when he got to the train the bronx man said he fibbed about what

00:18:30.280 happened that day because he feared that he would get pinned for the murder and wanted to justify his

00:18:35.540 own actions so lied cowardly so he knew that this was going to be a big case yeah no i get it

00:18:42.640 like what yeah now now the key witnesses recanted what he originally told the police and entered a

00:18:48.980 non-prosecution agreement with the da's office so he's not going to get charged with anything so i

00:18:55.580 imagine that he's probably going to get discounted as an unreliable witness because he's previously

00:19:01.200 lied and has admitted to it as well early tuesday gonzalez said that it looked like neely was trying

00:19:06.360 to escape from penny's hold everyone was frantic saying call the cops i figured one was trying to

00:19:11.240 restrain the other until the cops came um and that was referring to penny and neely i jumped in to try

00:19:16.560 and help so adding that he told penny i'm going to grab his hand so you can let go so he's made an

00:19:21.480 agreement a non-prosecution agreement with the da's office who are the ones prosecuting him in the

00:19:25.940 first place and all of a sudden his story has flipped and now not only is he saying no he didn't

00:19:32.480 hit me i lied about that now he's also trying to make neely look bad by saying that i had his hands

00:19:38.680 in place and i was telling him to let go there was another time when i said you can let him go i'm

00:19:43.320 holding on to him he said to the jury why are there so many liars in the world it's not that difficult

00:19:48.320 to go through the world without lying it really isn't it's not that difficult if you're not doing

00:19:53.240 anything wrong but this guy didn't need to lie about anything at any stage but even if what he's

00:19:58.180 now saying is true if you're in daniel penny's situation you're trying to help all of these

00:20:02.440 people this guy was being frantic gonna hurt people beforehand oh some random guy has come up

00:20:07.860 and restrained his hands loosely and he goes oh you can let go now how am i supposed to know that

00:20:14.480 you're gonna keep him restrained you can't restrain someone with their hands alone if

00:20:18.720 they're lying flat on the ground and you hold their hands down they can still move the rest of 0.68

00:20:23.220 their body yes it's a completely ridiculous argument but again trying to push the jury in

00:20:30.100 one direction saying that oh see daniel penny because the only case that they have the prosecution's

00:20:35.360 office is not that daniel penny shouldn't have intervened it's that he intervened for too long

00:20:41.100 which is what ended up killing jordan neely but again if the witnesses are saying and daniel penny

00:20:47.140 seems to be uh what at least his defense attorneys are maintaining that he was only holding him for

00:20:53.000 as long as he felt was necessary to neutralize the threat you don't know necessarily when that is

00:20:58.580 going to be until the threat is neutralized correct this is a bit of a weak point but you could easily

00:21:04.580 argue um if if that's what they're suggesting that the the lack of police response time could be

00:21:12.200 equally to blame here if you are apportioning blame at all which i don't think they should

00:21:17.320 speaking of the police intervention though nypd officers arrived on the train at fulton station

00:21:23.220 at 2 33 p.m two officers confirmed that neely still had a pulse when they arrived and there is

00:21:29.480 police body cam footage of this and i'm going to mute this and play it so that people can see it

00:21:34.340 because their attempts to revive him are somewhat pathetic shall we say well they probably didn't

00:21:40.260 want to go near him because he's a drug addict and he's homeless and you don't want to give like 0.79

00:21:43.680 mouth to mouth to so this is them confirming that he's still got a pulse and they're all sitting

00:21:51.180 there they could see that he was still breathing and all they do and you can see how many police

00:21:57.700 officers there are as well they just give him a little they just give him a little shake on the

00:22:01.260 chest look wake up buddy sure you brought enough guys yeah how many are they there they literally

00:22:07.800 just shake him wake up buddy it looks like he's is that sweat or is he wet himself because that

00:22:14.280 might explain why the police would be hesitant to to give him cpr i can't say for certain of course

00:22:19.420 put him in the recovery position well that's interesting footage of penny after he'd gone limp

00:22:24.780 putting him in the recovery position all right in fact if i go back to i think it might be this one

00:22:31.060 here it is oh yeah yeah that that's perfect he would have learned that in the military anyway

00:22:36.580 you know he basically stayed that's right he's got that he's gonna move his hand up to his his face

00:22:43.040 and in in fact there's uh oh i don't know what that guy's doing

00:22:46.120 there's a footage well not footage but daniel penny has said that what happened was that one of the

00:22:53.820 guys was trying to pour water on his forehead and daniel penny said stop don't do that no that's silly

00:22:59.520 that's that's a stupid thing to do so we know that he did everything that he could outside of 0.83

00:23:04.560 giving him cpr to make sure that he was going to be safe but again the police officers they just kind 0.99

00:23:09.620 of shook him around i got a pulse one said a second officer confirmed he felt a pulse nearly was

00:23:14.500 unconscious unconscious lying on the subway car floor when asked how neely ended up there penny

00:23:18.660 replied i put him out despite initially detecting a pulse they issued narkin a drug overdose to reverse

00:23:24.960 opioid overdoses to neely and started cpr at 2 38 p.m paramedics from northwell health arrived at the

00:23:32.280 train at 2 48 p.m 15 minutes after the police at 3 13 p.m almost 45 minutes after the police first

00:23:40.100 arrived neely was still on the train surrounded by paramedics from the time police received the

00:23:45.340 dispatch call it took seven minutes for first responders to arrive another 10 minutes before

00:23:49.160 emergency services with a deliberate defibrillator and more resources and he was not pronounced dead

00:23:54.200 until he arrived at lennox health hospital in granite's village later that afternoon so it's a bit

00:23:59.760 difficult to accuse him of murder when he spent more time away from neely um you know struggling for

00:24:08.460 his life than he did in the chokehold in the first place yep i don't really see yeah i don't really

00:24:14.280 see how he is responsible for him dying of asphyxiation if he was breathing and had a pulse long after

00:24:21.340 penny has left the scene you can't stop breathing for an hour and still be alive yeah like someone's

00:24:27.360 chokes you unconscious then you're breathing for ages then you die of asphyxiation what it's a very

00:24:33.180 very strange call from the coroner to put it down as a homicide and there's one detail there the

00:24:39.980 paramedics gave him anti-opioid drugs yep so wait it does seem that there are quite a few parallels

00:24:46.340 yeah george floyd case wait was he did he have heroin or whatever it is did was he have all that

00:24:52.920 stuff in the system or not i mean i've not found any reports from the coroner that say that he did

00:24:57.840 but they might just not have reported it is worth mentioning as well people drugs do they just give

00:25:02.200 people drugs like that in case they are is that how that works it might be normal procedure okay i

00:25:07.820 really don't know when it shouldn't when it's a homeless guy freaking out the way he had i would

00:25:11.880 imagine that there's probably witness testimony suggesting that he was probably on drugs and

00:25:16.140 therefore that might be every everybody thought that he was on yeah and i think it's worth pointing

00:25:20.900 out as well that floyd obviously they found chauvin guilty he had three times the lethal dose of

00:25:26.780 fentanyl in the system do you remember their argument for that what was that that he had

00:25:31.020 taken so much fentanyl over the over over his years that he had built up a tolerance and resistance to

00:25:37.200 it so he needed a super dose an even bigger super dose of fentanyl three times the dose i mean he was 0.97

00:25:43.980 a big guy and even if it's a stupid argument it was it was an excuse because that was obviously what

00:25:49.600 had killed him either way the trial goes on we'll see what updates happen hopefully he is found 0.97

00:25:54.940 innocent and acquitted because i do not see how there is any case for him being guilty because it

00:26:00.380 does not seem that he actually had much to do with the death in the first place judging by some of the

00:26:05.180 information that's already been released so we'll see how it goes on one of the most important

00:26:09.260 questions left unanswered is is that a perm or is that his natural hair he is he was 24 at the time

00:26:17.680 he's only 25 now i think so it might just be the natural zoomer cut

00:26:21.360 all right i guess you've got a few uh super chats yes we've got the rumble rants now so

00:26:27.760 uh first of all reese jam peace says hi lads just want to say thank you for hosting the podcast

00:26:32.240 non-ofcom regulated media outlets such as this give me hope that the true working class people of britain 1.00

00:26:36.400 can have their voices heard well thank you very much do what we can

00:26:39.520 uh cranky texan for ten dollars thank you i don't understand what woke right is supposed to mean

00:26:46.240 i was even more confused after watching lindsey's video supposedly explaining it it doesn't mean

00:26:50.880 anything it means that james lindsey doesn't like you it is worth mentioning uh stelios and i had a

00:26:57.080 conversation over a year ago where we just talked about um thought patterns um that mirrored the left

00:27:03.840 but we were talking about it in a sense of just people thinking irrationally we didn't necessarily

00:27:08.780 identify specific beliefs like lindsey did yeah if you want to know what the woke right actually is

00:27:14.960 if you want an actual definition it is people like james lindsey it is people like constantin kissin

00:27:20.280 if you want a perfect example right read the last 10 or so pages of lindsey's book that he wrote with

00:27:26.440 helen pluck rose cynical theories which lays out a 10 commandments of classical liberalism which is 1.00

00:27:34.300 literally we affirm that we like gay rights we affirm that we like civil rights

00:27:38.380 we affirm that we love all of these victories that the progressives had from the 90s well 60s through

00:27:43.460 to the 90s but also we just don't like how embarrassing the wokest are that's that's 1.00

00:27:48.660 literally their only disagreement we agree with the destination just not the journey

00:27:52.280 so that's that's that's woke right as far as i'm concerned uh say oran 555 says alvin bragg is a

00:28:00.040 george doros da and is a devoted to the cause of destroying new york city yes very true absolutely

00:28:06.100 and that's a random name for a dollar here's another haiku and this is your new thing isn't

00:28:11.400 it nearly acting crazy choking on a big penny nothing to see here very well put

00:28:17.120 okay so i thought we'd talk a little bit about um two-tier policing again that's happening in britain

00:28:27.760 where a telegraph journalist alison pearson um had a knock on the door from the thought police

00:28:37.140 um now before we go into it if anyone doesn't know alison pearson she is um on some things on a lot of

00:28:45.320 things she's pretty based pretty good uh but you know on other things not so much i think she was

00:28:52.700 relatively pro blm at the time during the height of their stuff but all of those of other things

00:28:57.540 she's pretty based um so so yeah anyway anyway she uh had done a tweet about a year ago something

00:29:08.360 about the covid stuff in fact do we have the actual tweet um i think we've got the actual tweet somewhere

00:29:14.880 wasn't part of the thing that she didn't even know what the tweet was at the time yeah well that was

00:29:19.600 that's one of the that's one of the things that is crazy they don't tell you apparently

00:29:23.260 what it actually i think this is the tweet um where she says she's she's being ironical about

00:29:30.740 vaccines and wuhan i think so nothing nothing it's just nothing right but obviously obviously

00:29:36.020 writing for the telegraph and being a relatively or pretty high profile journalist i suppose um

00:29:41.500 someone somewhere in the upper echelongs of things sort of the eye of sauron fell upon her

00:29:46.920 someone made a complaint or felt offended i say it's sort of a racial hatred thing that's what

00:29:53.360 it came down to um she wrote an article all about it of course as you would um and yeah and she says

00:30:02.000 that they knock on your door another thing that was interesting she says since about 2014 probably

00:30:08.080 like quarter of a million of these have been issued the non-crime hate incidents where they

00:30:13.200 either register it or go to someone's house and basically make them check their thinking

00:30:19.160 um when they've not actually committed any crime and of course non-crime the fact that you've got two

00:30:26.400 um representatives of the state that are legally allowed to commit violence onto you and you've got

00:30:34.320 to basically stay on their good side otherwise you have your life ruined by them that's scary it doesn't

00:30:39.900 matter who you are if you care about your life your future your family that's a cause for concern

00:30:46.500 it's not something that should be done lightly for things that aren't even crimes in the first place

00:30:52.500 you know there there are many crimes on the books as is that i think are ridiculous so the fact that

00:30:58.280 they're talking to people for non-crimes you know also add on to that the fact that what is it 99

00:31:03.360 percent of thefts go unsolved yeah i think people care more about that than tweets that the police

00:31:10.380 find unsavory i think most burglaries go and essentially uninvestigated certainly unsolved

00:31:15.920 most crimes i think in general but yeah there's a non-crime hate incident an nchri now i knew that

00:31:23.100 thousands of these have been done i didn't know it was quarter of a million that's way more than i

00:31:28.020 thought i knew it was significant i knew it was bad i knew it was in the thousands i didn't know it

00:31:32.240 we could have some on our police file they they can give us oh yeah non-crime hate incidents there

00:31:39.360 is no there is a they don't even have to tell you about it yeah there's zero chance that we do not

00:31:43.400 have these my thinking is um my thinking is let them do i don't i don't care as long as you don't

00:31:51.720 actually take my liberty well not that i don't care of course i care sorry let's get that that

00:31:55.260 straight i really do care it's a terrible thing but just let them do it if they don't actually take 0.97

00:31:59.120 your liberty away just do whatever you're going to do you're going to do it anyway right i see what

00:32:03.280 you're saying like the intelligence services are watching me go on then it's not that you don't

00:32:08.100 want them to watch you it's just that of course okay it's terrible it's this is the breakdown this

00:32:12.920 is how societies break down and fall apart and it's the thin end of the wedge to a police state

00:32:17.940 it honestly is of course it is um so they knocked on our door and they say you did a tweet

00:32:23.280 two young officers you did a tweet like a year ago and uh we've sort of opened a non-crime

00:32:30.840 hate incident on you and she's like what was that what then what was it what what was the tweet and

00:32:37.640 they're like we can't tell you that's mad that's insane and she's like well who who had issue with 0.94

00:32:43.400 it and i said we can't tell you that that's slightly less insane to me uh like protecting the victim

00:32:48.480 of course they're not a victim this is the that whole paradigm is insane but the thing is yeah i

00:32:52.840 get that but not to tell me but yeah and that and that it's as many layers of insanity it's literally

00:32:58.280 not a crime so who is it hurting yeah there's many layers of nonsense about this it's literally the

00:33:04.580 curtain twitcher society of the busy bodies can ring up the police and say this has offended me

00:33:09.720 then write it down and get you in trouble at least traditional curtain twitchers look out the window 0.55

00:33:14.600 for like public disorder or like petty crime not just you said an unsavory thing online

00:33:20.600 anonymous informers again that again that is how a police state uh how tyrannies operate really

00:33:27.900 soviet union even if you go back to ancient times i'm thinking of uh the informer society under

00:33:33.340 tiberius or domitian or caligula all these places where anyone can accuse anyone of anything

00:33:39.700 anonymously anonymously yeah that's a fast track to to a horror yeah um it's also oh sorry oh i was

00:33:48.560 just gonna say so the thing that is a non-crime in the first place insane uh the thing that the

00:33:54.380 your accuser can remain anonymous well all right i can actually argue about that the thing they won't

00:34:00.400 tell her what the actual thing was the actual tweet that is now into the realms of kafka and that's

00:34:07.440 one of the things she said that we're now in a kafka-esque uh a state or one of the other

00:34:13.040 another telegraph article talking about saying it's kafka-esque which kafka wrote about

00:34:20.520 usually very disquieting strange things that throw you off balance and the injustice i mean the only

00:34:30.200 kafka i ever read was metamorphosis because it's not very long uh that's the only kafka i've actually

00:34:35.020 ever read yes it's actually worth three it's probably worth a read that's the only kafka i

00:34:39.520 ever read and that was a long time ago read um the trial which is where i think kafka probably

00:34:43.840 comes from yeah yeah yeah so the basic premise is that someone is put on trial and they're not even

00:34:49.880 aware of what their crime is and they go through this long convoluted process and that's normally

00:34:54.860 um what this term has come to mean it comes from that book i think yeah yeah i would have thought so

00:35:01.060 and also that you're just living in a completely bizarre world there's that element to it i think

00:35:07.920 when people say kafka-esque sometimes yeah the world's been turned upside down nothing makes sense

00:35:12.120 anymore we've taken some weird left turn somewhere so there's a few things to say about the fact

00:35:17.660 they're not saying what actually committed the crime because that was the same thing at you know

00:35:22.260 the member of our audience that got a visit from the police uh in august sort of time i think it was

00:35:27.460 maybe a little bit later um they didn't say what the offending tweet was what the offending post was

00:35:33.180 and they just cautioned her and said be careful what you post online and things like that

00:35:37.940 um and there's also something else to this that i think another element to it that um there were many

00:35:45.260 many cases of people being prosecuted uh for memes and jokes and whenever it's reported on they don't

00:35:53.240 actually tell you what it was you know so there are police officers for example getting dismissed for

00:35:59.040 jokes um you know losing their job um for posting memes things like that they don't say what the meme

00:36:06.060 is they don't say um whether it is meant in jest whether it's a serious statement of belief which jokes

00:36:12.660 rarely are um and so by not telling the public what the actual offending article is what it forces the

00:36:20.780 public to do is we have to be extra vigilant because we don't know where the line is because people

00:36:27.660 don't go and read the legislation they look at real world examples and if the real world examples are

00:36:33.860 you get a knock on your door because you put out a tweet that the police don't like or you're a police

00:36:38.680 officer yourself and you post a meme in a group chat um that one person reports you for because it helps

00:36:44.780 their promotion um to to basically grass on their colleagues then everyone's going to be so hyper

00:36:52.920 vigilant to the point where it just enforces conformity and i think that that's the point

00:36:57.220 yeah oh no telling people that for that reason yeah no absolutely definitely that is the point um

00:37:02.760 in fact she's she's collaborated with toby young before and they picked on the wrong person

00:37:07.220 they did pick on the wrong person she's obviously got a big voice 1.00

00:37:11.040 uh writing for the telegraph and uh having a decent sort of exposure she's one of the telegraph

00:37:17.560 journalists that i see the most of right yeah they picked the wrong lady to do this to because she 1.00

00:37:23.860 can immediately hit back and people will hear about it um but yeah i mean she said that that 0.98

00:37:28.960 and that toby young has said things like um that's the whole point of it is that they say look you

00:37:33.940 haven't committed any crime but you're on our radar and you'll be on our records now and uh you best

00:37:39.500 behave yourself and just sort of encourage you to self-censor going forward oh it's of course

00:37:45.360 right another way of putting it is intimidation absolutely yeah absolutely state intimidation

00:37:51.480 to get back in the box shut your mouth be quiet we're watching you dare notice let alone say that

00:37:57.880 you've noticed big starmer is watching you yeah big starmer he is i mean it he's getting ready to

00:38:03.540 blow his nose in my direction and uh i i do feel for her the only thing i would say is it did come

00:38:08.100 across a little bit to me like um oh it's real now it's happened to me i mean that's a bit unfair

00:38:15.340 because um she has been based on a fair few issues although not across the board but she has been

00:38:21.220 based on a fair few stuff so uh but i think that's also just human nature as well isn't it it's like i

00:38:26.460 don't really care about that there's two-tier policing until it happens to me i don't really care

00:38:31.200 about all the rape gangs until it's someone in my family i don't really care about being displaced in

00:38:35.860 my own ancestral homeland and become becoming a hated minority until it actually affects me

00:38:40.980 that's just unfortunately human nature a bit isn't it well i think that people find it difficult to

00:38:45.240 conceptualize things that they have no experience of because for most people they live via experience

00:38:49.980 rather than in abstract stop worrying about loads of mosques being built until one's built in your 0.59

00:38:55.500 back garden backing onto your back garden until the call to prayer wakes you up in the middle of the

00:39:01.020 night and then it's an issue but again i suppose it's just that's just human nature um so yeah it's

00:39:05.940 just another example of this i mean i just would not accept their premise if they knocked on my door

00:39:11.820 or probably when they knock on my door i would to go down i would go down the line of sorry am i under

00:39:19.180 arrest are you actually taking me in take me in oh you're not okay well i'm not having any further

00:39:23.400 conversation bye bye guys that's how they should be treated i've seen loads of clips of people doing

00:39:28.400 exactly that i think my approach would be slightly different obviously whenever the police knock on

00:39:33.200 your door record it oh yeah get your phone immediately and don't accept when they say you

00:39:38.080 can't film this you go no i can i am legally allowed to yeah there's nonsense um but what i

00:39:43.360 would be tempted to do is just try and tease out as much information from them as possible

00:39:47.820 because they can't do anything to you anyway and so you may as well find out

00:39:52.820 what's going on here and then tease out and get a better idea of why they're there in the first

00:39:59.080 place that would be my sort of inclination but you try that and they just stonewall you saying 1.00

00:40:02.700 well we can't tell you that we can't tell you that we can't tell you that we're just here to sort

00:40:07.200 of check your thinking there are lots of different ways to ask the same sort of questions i would

00:40:11.220 just do ascertain that i'm not under arrest and then that's it just get rid of them as soon as

00:40:16.320 possible and if you are under arrest until you get representation it's sort of be like name a

00:40:22.640 number only like a bit like yeah like yeah i'm not i'm not talking to you guys at all i'm not

00:40:27.540 answering any of your questions ever until i get ever talk to the police without legal representation

00:40:31.700 under any circumstances even if you know you know you're 100 innocent because they will stitch you

00:40:37.140 up that's that's just the way it's their job to get a conviction they're not there to find out

00:40:41.000 the truth many police officers have said exactly that just that yeah don't ever talk to the

00:40:46.020 police they're just there to to get it sorted as quickly as possible they don't care if you're

00:40:49.880 guilty a lot of the time they're not your friend there's a great clip i've posted on twitter i think

00:40:53.460 more than once certainly once and it's in america but it nearly perfectly applies to anywhere in the

00:41:00.140 west britain australia but he is an american guy and he says even if you're completely innocent you know

00:41:05.380 you're completely innocent you've got evidence showing you're completely innocent you've got witnesses

00:41:09.800 to back up your completely all of that still don't talk to the police at all until you've got a lawyer with

00:41:15.800 you because it will not be in your interests too you can you can accidentally say something which

00:41:21.340 is the truth and doesn't incriminate you but they take it down and later in a court of law a clever

00:41:25.500 prosecutor twists it around and all sorts of things don't talk to the police without a lawyer because

00:41:32.340 it's just not in your interest they're not there to help you and that they say they do oh it's in

00:41:36.740 your interest if you say something now which you later rely on in court it might be held against you

00:41:40.780 all right well we'll see then yeah thanks for that thanks for that tidbit and we'll see yeah until

00:41:45.560 then representation please lawyer lawyer thanks that's it it's as simple as that and if they're

00:41:54.340 not even arresting you they've just come around to sort of wag their finger in your face no no no no

00:42:00.960 i'm a grown man thank you very much i'm not having that i'm just not having it that's you know

00:42:06.100 the notion of the state can send around their armed thugs to threaten you to do what they want

00:42:12.160 is a disgusting thing you know when it when it's the mafia it is a lot scarier to people but they're

00:42:19.140 basically the same thing aren't they their base is basically just the government is a protection 0.89

00:42:22.980 racket that sends thugs to your door to shake you down and make you behave otherwise you get whacked

00:42:28.640 there is something comical about the idea though especially given the way that they recruit police

00:42:32.840 officers these days that you open the door one day and find two four-foot karens at your door 0.79

00:42:37.980 telling you that you've not committed a crime yeah like if only they could do that every day if they

00:42:43.460 could come into my house every day to the front door knock and tell me here's a little badge you've

00:42:47.420 not committed a crime today well done that's what they're doing is they're telling you you posted

00:42:52.040 something mean on twitter you've not committed a crime though i would say well thank you very much

00:42:55.720 for reminding me i felt very proud would you like to talk to my manager it would be difficult not to

00:43:00.780 get sarcastic with them if they didn't go away just say so it's not a crime then and they start

00:43:04.500 speaking oh so it's not a crime then that all that sort of thing getting play am i being rewarded

00:43:08.800 in something for this would you like me to be like my tweet yeah more offensive next time do i get bigger

00:43:14.780 prizes it was a good tweet did you like it i hope you liked it so i would like to say um for this tweet

00:43:21.460 this account i think is inflating numbers um this this account is basically fake news okay um so

00:43:30.480 it's been shared around one of the ones that's actually run by an indian it might well i don't

00:43:35.320 even know how that link got in there i don't think i put this link in there but um yeah elon musk replied

00:43:40.340 to this but oh is that what it was sorry oh that's right yeah here it is that's what elon musk just

00:43:45.920 musk is uh i think i saw another tweet from him saying specifically about pearson saying this must

00:43:53.100 end or something along those lines but uh but yeah this inevitable west person they just make up the

00:43:59.700 news like they said that farage and tice are going to join jeremy clark's in the farmers protest and

00:44:04.800 there's literally no mention of that anywhere oh is that online except on their twitter so they're just

00:44:09.820 a liar always be hesitant with something like this where they're saying breaking hundreds of british

00:44:14.000 you want at least one or two links that they post underneath the original tweet actually verifying

00:44:19.460 what they've said well i mean alison pearson who i imagine uh to give her the benefit of the doubt has

00:44:25.940 got um you know at least some journalistic integrity and in her article on the telegraph it said there'd

00:44:32.500 been quarter of a million of these yeah yeah i trust there have been we can take that as true yes

00:44:37.360 okay i imagine that the editable of double check yeah they're saying this weekend regarding x posts that's

00:44:43.080 that's a very different thing to that yeah the non-crime hate incident thing is an epidemic

00:44:47.760 and i've spoke to harry miller about this a few times and it's one of the things that he's very hot

00:44:54.280 on pursuing because he basically sees it as a massive waste of time and tyrannizing the public which i 100%

00:45:00.380 agree with yeah i do not accept their their moral indignation a slightly uh spicy tweet i reject it

00:45:11.580 well it's just weak isn't it yeah it's just it's like oh i said something you didn't like oh boohoo

00:45:18.040 what are you going to do about it yeah grow up you know it's not a schoolyard anymore and anyway

00:45:22.360 sticks and stones don't break your bones again is it a crime are you do break your bones are you going

00:45:26.380 to are you going to uh take my liberty away well you're not okay well there's no more conversation

00:45:31.740 to be had then that's it that's how i'm pretty hard lying about it and anyway uh mrs pearson says

00:45:39.980 um i think this was today even um she says that the where she talked about it in the telegraph

00:45:46.480 sort of straight away and then that annoyed the police essex police in this instance she says that

00:45:52.600 they said that she was unethical for her to have reported uh her awful experience rich irony in that of

00:46:00.300 it's unethical for you to report on us on our unethical visit to your home when you didn't

00:46:05.340 commit a crime yeah the fact that what they're essentially saying is that's mean hey that's mean

00:46:11.220 oh you're bullying you're bullying the police oh the police are actually trying to cry bully you

00:46:16.540 teacher teacher all i did was visit her house come on what's going on yeah and well it's good that

00:46:25.420 she then immediately just tweets that right again it's it's good it's unapologetic um she says the

00:46:32.060 british people deserve to be informed about the kafka-esque state of their justice system instead of 1.00

00:46:36.920 so instead of solving frightening crime police are frightening people um yeah so i think a lot of

00:46:44.160 people sort of middle class normies center of right middle class normies uh just waking up to

00:46:50.940 this and it's uh you know it's not just people that are on the fringes of things um so that's

00:47:00.200 mainly that's mainly the article but one last thing i thought i'd mention is uh talking about fringe ideas

00:47:06.840 fringe uh arguments that sometimes people have been ostracized for such as someone like steve laws or

00:47:14.180 myself um talking about remigration or mass remigration mass deportations now trump is has got

00:47:20.760 a a cabinet putting together a cabinet which says they're going to mass deport people um sam ashworth

00:47:28.160 haynes in the uh haze in the telegraph again has mentioned today that mass deportations

00:47:36.400 uh are probably going to be necessary um so it's still a bit milquetoast it's only going to get a

00:47:42.580 visit from the police i'm only really yeah it's only really talking about smashing the gangs and the

00:47:46.380 small boat people and people that are here illegally still it's moving the overton window a bit where it

00:47:50.360 used to be completely beyond the pale would get a hope not hate piece written about you and get you

00:47:54.380 de-platformed from places and get you kicked off of you get deselected get deselected from places

00:47:59.920 people like toby young say that it was beyond the pale well now the u.s government are pro it and

00:48:06.360 even the telegraph are starting to print in mainstream media the irony of toby young saying

00:48:12.340 that something someone says is beyond the pale when he runs the free speech union yeah

00:48:17.540 come on man well remember one principle there oh this is cowards he thought i was beyond the pale

00:48:24.140 um remember what he did for sam melia nothing sweet fa i seem to recall yeah

00:48:29.900 okay well anyway that's the end of that segment all right we've got some rumble rents if we'd like

00:48:36.080 to go to them i'll read through them or if you would oh jim mason so what is the point of stopping

00:48:41.380 at your home at home to address a social media post if they can't tell you what you did wrong

00:48:45.500 how do you learn to change even if you wanted to i think we addressed that but mainly intimidation

00:48:50.700 get you to be confused because you don't know where the line is so or in 555 again be a government

00:48:56.060 informer betray your family and friends fabulous prizes to be won to be honest i thought

00:48:59.780 red dwarf was supposed to be a joke uh not so much anymore that's a random name this type of

00:49:05.020 stuff is ever present at present here in canada i work at a hospital and the north african and black

00:49:09.660 workers in my department are constantly anonymously accusing all of the white staff

00:49:14.380 of nonsense is it witchcraft of jeans yeah jeans that's what they're accusing them of

00:49:20.040 accused of being possessed by an evil spirit that's a random name again the popo was called

00:49:25.320 a non-crime was reported i got deported glee 777 big ear care is listening that's right and he's

00:49:37.340 after your sausages reese jam pierce uh peace says in scotland they opened up an online hate crime

00:49:43.360 hotline their definition is so vague that you don't have to be a uk citizen to file a report

00:49:47.480 everyone just flooded with hums's white speech lol i remember yeah it was wonderful it's like the

00:49:52.780 same same way that uh when the government had to make you register your chickens loads of people

00:49:57.760 registered supermarket dead chickens as chickens oh yeah bad law has consequences government that is

00:50:04.260 the good thing about the scots they've got they have got a sense of humor they really have nearly

00:50:09.900 always apart from when i get mine from their abundance of heroin even that don't joke about our

00:50:15.720 heroin we might think you're you're asking us to share it well i'm asking you if you if you know a

00:50:20.800 guy you are northern so we'll sort you out not like those southerners yeah yeah not like you 0.96

00:50:27.820 you great southern puff anyway speaking of speaking of speaking of josh being gay he's going to ask the 0.93

00:50:34.380 question is this gay because he's excited that's true and by the way the northerner two southerners 0.92

00:50:41.180 all right we've eastern west one northerner makes up at least five southerners in terms of in body

00:50:47.640 mass absolute body mass one of the most nonsensical things ever said on this podcast down greg's at

00:50:53.980 record rate samson's look he's shaking his head listen one baz could take on every southerner in

00:51:01.660 this office insane take that's absolutely wrong do you want to you want to go outside you want to 1.00

00:51:07.180 go outside and sort this out on gravy you want to wind your neck in mate fuck you out by the way i 0.99

00:51:15.240 wouldn't harry's like twice the size of me and in good shape and younger oh thank you also you have 1.00

00:51:20.980 an intimidating beard though you look like you would give me some really really dense lectures on

00:51:26.640 marxist economic theory i'll strap up your face okay or give me a glasgow smile to be clear we're

00:51:34.620 all friends off of camp yeah yeah people think we're actually about to attack each other when we

00:51:40.220 have a bit of fun this is just laddish banter that's what we're like you're right we're not being mean to

00:51:45.480 each other well we are but that's part of the fun exactly but anyway i'm going to talk a little bit

00:51:52.520 about pompeii today and uh being gay in pompeii and uh just to refresh your memory um everyone

00:52:00.920 knows what happened in pompeii don't they if you don't you must live under a volcano or something

00:52:05.700 but in 79 ad mount vesuvius erupted um it spewed ash pumice and toxic gases into the sky which then fell

00:52:13.560 on the town i think it's a town isn't it of pompeii and uh many people died quite quickly but many died

00:52:20.160 pretty horrific deaths and um there was obviously intense heat there were gases there were ash clouds

00:52:26.800 which could reach up to about 250 degrees celsius which is 482 um fahrenheit that's the there you go

00:52:36.220 americans don't say i don't do nothing for you um and then over time thick layers of ash and pumice

00:52:42.000 covered the city and encased all the bodies protecting them from um decaying and it cut off

00:52:47.460 the oxygen and moisture so that's why we get things like this because um over the centuries

00:52:52.980 these bodies decomposed and they left empty cavities in the shape of the people who died

00:52:57.960 and archaeologists found these cavities and poured plaster into these voids and created

00:53:03.900 basically casts of the people in their final positions of death and i think these are some of

00:53:10.060 the most haunting things one of the most harrowing um things that exists on planet earth because

00:53:17.860 you see entire families here like here in their last moments together cowering in fear probably in agony

00:53:25.540 and when i was preparing this segment i actually had to get up and walk away because it is one of

00:53:32.660 those things where if you put yourself in the shoes of those people the sheer horror of your you and

00:53:40.800 everyone you know dies a sudden horrific agonizing death that cannot be escaped and you watch it

00:53:49.040 happen and everyone you know and love dies with you suffocating and or burning to death yeah being 0.94

00:53:55.460 crushed to death by pumice and stuff yeah it would have been a horrible way to go yeah yeah terrifying and

00:54:00.120 and and so that's part of the reason why people are so interested in pompeii not only is it a good

00:54:04.620 window into um you know ancient rome but also the the human tragedy of it and and as you see there

00:54:13.600 there's little kids dogs cats all sorts of things it's a a tremendously sad thing um and and i i feel like

00:54:23.800 that aspect of it isn't necessarily emphasized enough i know they're almost 2 000 years old now but

00:54:30.000 it doesn't there are still human beings still worthy of respect and dignity and this is what

00:54:36.840 we're going to be talking about today this is one of the more um famous ones they were often referred

00:54:41.860 to as the lovers because they're sort of embracing in death and i'm going to talk about a daily mail

00:54:50.620 article that is reporting on some recent research and i'm going to look at the article first and then

00:54:57.160 we're going to actually look at the research because the two are not the same can i say a quick

00:55:03.100 of course yeah yeah go ahead um i've actually been to pompeii twice um it's in the bay of naples of

00:55:10.440 course and uh pliny writes about it very movingly he was killed in it in fact and um wait no wait how

00:55:18.060 can that be there are multiple pliny's you know it's be plenty the elder oh yeah yeah he wrote

00:55:24.960 about it and then didn't escape quick quickly enough and later he spent too much time writing

00:55:29.240 that's right is that right anyway um you can read about it by pliny and um but i've been there twice

00:55:35.340 and herculaneum which is a smaller town which is right or herculano as they call it the italians

00:55:40.780 call it today but it was herculaneum and that's right right under mount vesuvius i've even been

00:55:47.900 up mount vesuvius and looked down into the crater and stuff and um the whole top of the mountain blew

00:55:52.720 off um a bit like mount saint helens where half the mountain blows up and massive chunk of the bay

00:55:59.280 of naples was completely covered and even if you go down to like sorrento there's meters and meters and

00:56:03.760 meters of pumice so the people at herculaneum and pompeii were covered in houses tall amounts of

00:56:12.040 pumice it's not that they just sort of choked to death a bit or it got a bit too hot and they and

00:56:17.900 they died no they were completely covered by meters and meters of pumice just and um oh sorry carry on

00:56:25.060 i was just going to say on the pliny thing yeah he uh pliny the elder died at mount vesuvius um at

00:56:30.400 at pompeii uh when man vesuvius went off and was actually um there stationed with the roman navy

00:56:36.540 and organized a rescue mission and ended up as part of that asphyxiating that's right so yeah he was

00:56:42.000 he was trying he was trying to save people i remember the story now he was on the other side of i think

00:56:45.900 he was on the other side of the bay of naples saw it saw it it happened wrote an account of it and when

00:56:51.980 he really should have been running the other way at that point he went towards it and yeah and then got

00:56:56.040 caught up yeah supposedly they later found his account yeah so anyway it says the helmsman

00:57:01.220 advised turning back to which he replied fortune favors the bold famous not always yeah not always

00:57:08.320 um admirable spirit though yeah last thing i'll say before i sort of let you carry on with your

00:57:13.640 the story in the take is that uh herculaneum is an incredible thing because pompeii is usually

00:57:19.440 filled with tourists i do advise anyone that goes to naples to visit herculaneum but pompeii itself

00:57:26.020 um is an incredible it's honestly incredible because it's like a snapshot of the first century ad you

00:57:33.180 know everything is everything's been it's a snapshot in time that's been frozen in time you know and

00:57:38.640 there's a lot of it that's still left unexcavated loads left unexcavated if i found myself absolute

00:57:44.040 tyrant of italy at some point i would because there's a modern town built on top of a lot of

00:57:49.080 i would like to know the circumstances that left you tyrant of italy we can only guess at what might

00:57:55.660 happen we can only hope um but there's a modern town built on still a lot of the ruins of pompeii

00:58:01.020 um you can't just evict these people but if i was a complete tyrant i'd evict them and get the rest

00:58:06.720 of pompeii excavated because there's still loads under there to be found still makes you a better tyrant

00:58:11.760 than most western leaders today you're being mean to people for the sake of archaeology i'd rehouse

00:58:17.540 them somewhere better how about that is that can we make that deal i'll give you a better home so

00:58:22.640 that we can excavate the rest of pompeia plenty of homes in it um loads of vacant homes uh but yeah

00:58:27.540 and but the human side of it um the human side of it is is really harrowing i remember first seeing it

00:58:33.340 first becoming aware of it the plaster casts of the dead people when i was a child and being sort of

00:58:38.760 haunted is a bit much but you know affecting me a bit because as you say let's never ever forget

00:58:46.300 that these are real people in their last death agonies um and quite often nearly a lot of the

00:58:53.760 time they're huddled together as you would be you know there's a pyroclastic flow on the way or you're

00:58:58.680 being you're being buried by pumice being burnt alive and asphyxiated you probably would huddle in a

00:59:05.140 corner with all the other people in that room probably wouldn't you at herculaneum down by

00:59:09.300 what would have been a quayside it's not really that near to see anymore but back then it was

00:59:14.480 there's loads and loads and loads of bodies were found all there where people would rush down to the

00:59:19.220 water's edge to try and escape or to try and do whatever they can to survive a moment longer and

00:59:25.820 they were all killed there filled with bodies and go down the street and it's it's a horrific thing

00:59:30.840 yeah so i just wanted to point that out i think before we carry on that these these were real

00:59:36.660 people and um they suffered terrible terrible deaths and uh i think that's a good segue into

00:59:43.080 this um two thousand years down the line they're being slandered uh the two maidens of pompeii may

00:59:48.740 have been gay lovers scientists say whenever something says scientists say scientists don't say

00:59:54.040 yeah as a scientist myself scientists disagree you know disagree about the most petty of nonsense

01:00:00.660 no scientists are very rarely in agreement about anything really he's a massive contrarian exactly

01:00:06.860 and when they say and when they say may have been you mean almost certainly weren't they may have

01:00:13.100 been transgender they may have been gay someone from deep in history yeah what you mean is almost

01:00:17.340 certainly weren't okay so this is talking about re-analyzing some of the the figures that were

01:00:23.140 particularly these ones and i'm going to read what the daily mail says and then i'm going to go to

01:00:28.480 the original paper and then i'm going to look i'm going to sort of do a wall of shame who reported

01:00:33.580 it badly and then a wall of good um of the people who did well um because you know i'm going to talk

01:00:39.600 about journalistic integrity wall of good it's not the most poetic way of putting it wall of goodness

01:00:46.240 like elliot ness let's do some good

01:00:48.140 i mean what the wall of shame the wall of pride that that word's got a bit of a taint to it

01:00:56.260 no i suppose when you're talking about this is the wall of pride all of glory yeah there we go

01:01:01.880 but anyway it i'll uh scroll down just so you can read along why not so it says new dna analysis the

01:01:09.860 of the body suggests that the iconic pair might need a new name researchers from the max planck

01:01:15.100 institute found that at least one if not both of the people were men notice the wording at least

01:01:20.780 one if not both so so still not got any idea so that so that means we know that one probably was

01:01:27.680 the other so it says david reich uh one of the authors of the new study said a pair of individuals

01:01:32.620 thought to be sisters or mother and daughter were found to include at least one genetic male

01:01:36.980 um these findings challenge traditional gender and familial assumptions no they don't

01:01:42.360 no they don't that what you're on about what that one sentence does not follow on to the other i

01:01:47.240 agree while the true nature of their relationship remains unclear experts say they may have been gay

01:01:51.900 lovers how can you tell that you don't have the evidence to back that up um massimo osana who is

01:01:58.500 the expert that they've consulted on this i don't know um but massimo osana superintendent of the

01:02:05.360 pompeii archaeological site previously said the fact that they were lovers is a hypothesis that

01:02:10.280 cannot be dismissed so there are two hypotheses here one that they were gay which you have no

01:02:16.580 evidence for and one that they were lovers which you know even if it were a stranger in the last

01:02:22.960 minutes you know just some comfort from another human being when you're inevitably facing death could

01:02:28.560 be a good enough explanation they don't even have to be lovers necessarily with the same with the same

01:02:33.920 legitimacy and validity your hypothesis there similarly can't be dismissed because we don't know

01:02:39.620 so let's have a look at the actual um research paper so unfortunately um the the paper itself you can't

01:02:47.160 access the full thing so we're just gonna have to read the abstract and if you humor me in reading

01:02:51.400 this i'll try and read it quite quickly uh from skeletal material embedded in the cast we generated

01:02:56.300 genome-wide ancient dna and strontium isotopic data so it's basically you know dating it um to

01:03:02.340 characterize the max planck institute so actual advanced physics i wondered why they had anything

01:03:07.260 to do with it i know yeah okay got it okay um the genetic relationship sex ancestry and mobility of

01:03:11.740 five individuals we show that the individual sexes and family relationships do not match the

01:03:15.840 traditional interpretations exemplifying how modern assumptions about gendered behaviors may not be a

01:03:21.080 reliable lens through which to view data from the past so there is a bit of of wokery in here but

01:03:26.680 what i think is going on here is they've done actual good research and they've done genomic

01:03:31.480 analysis but the the interpretation of that stuff and how it's being presented is basically

01:03:37.800 wokified so it gets picked up by media so they get more funding and this is one of those things that

01:03:43.200 unfortunately does go on in academia the funny thing about that very sentence is that modern

01:03:47.600 assumptions about gendered behaviors is that everybody's gay all the time everywhere even if they're 0.64

01:03:54.800 married even know it yeah even if they're married with children they'll probably do some buggering 1.00

01:03:59.180 on the weekend when no one's paying any attention that's the modern assumption but the point being

01:04:05.540 here that it doesn't necessarily have to be a modern assumption it's just that people didn't know their

01:04:10.600 relationships with one another and so people made up stories in the same way that people don't know

01:04:15.680 what the stars were and therefore created pictures and constellations to tell a story to understand them

01:04:22.060 better it's a similar sort of thing it's just human beings imprinting on the world what we see and

01:04:29.860 believe isn't it and of course the genomic analysis is valuable this paper is useful to the world but

01:04:37.080 how some of it is presented is bad and it says for example an adult wearing a golden bracelet with a

01:04:42.360 child on their lap often interpreted as a mother and child is genetically an adult male

01:04:46.880 and biologically unrelated to the child i lost my line similarly a pair of individuals who are

01:04:54.440 thought to have died in an embrace often interpreted as sisters included at least one genetic male

01:04:59.820 so that's implying that it could have potentially been heterosexual others i'm just throwing that one

01:05:06.840 out there all pompeians with genome-wide data consistently derived their ancestry largely from

01:05:12.960 recent immigrants from the eastern mediterranean as has also been seen in contemporaneous ancient

01:05:18.980 genomes of the city of rome underscoring the cosmopolitanism of the roman empire in this period

01:05:24.940 so there's another um sort of it's talking about multiculturalism yeah but there was basically loads

01:05:31.340 and loads and loads of manumissioned slaves back then just given given their freedom taken from places

01:05:37.520 like syria and levant bring them over to rome you're a slave and then we'll get so the eastern

01:05:42.260 mediterranean isn't that far away and it was part of the roman empire so it's a bit of a strange thing

01:05:49.720 to say yes there were some people from you know maybe greece maybe uh the adriatic is not that far

01:05:59.140 fetched when they say cosmopolitanism what they want you to think is scores and scores and scores of

01:06:03.960 sub-saharan africans which of course didn't happen so um obviously what is presented here is slightly

01:06:12.240 different than the daily mail article they're not saying we found some gay lovers are they they're

01:06:16.240 saying um these two people one of them was a man probably um we're not so sure about the other one

01:06:23.040 it's harder to date them because of course they found little bits of skeleton um remaining but

01:06:28.060 obviously with in the manner in which they died there's not going to be much biological material left

01:06:32.560 for them to analyze and so it would be difficult to to do well that's interesting again that's why i

01:06:37.600 guess they need sort of at the at the microscopic level again advanced physics the max planck institute

01:06:44.580 because when you first the other day first told me i said or we was a bit confused like how can that

01:06:50.860 be because there aren't there isn't anything of the body left that's the nature of it that it's a

01:06:55.580 plaster cast of a hollow the body itself was sort of annihilated um but obviously not completely

01:07:02.260 obviously there's tiny i would have thought tiny tiny fragments of things are left in the pumice

01:07:08.720 it's a shame really that it's still not even enough for the max planck institute to be sure about them

01:07:13.720 all so it's a shame that such great research is being wrapped up in in stuff like this because

01:07:21.400 it need not be yeah i mean you're doing great work it should stand on its own legs for confirmation of

01:07:26.600 this new gay theory they need to take the next step and do another genome examination to see if they 1.00

01:07:31.360 can find that one of the remains had the gay gene yeah well then that then we'll know if we can't 0.70

01:07:36.900 find it then we've got to say no so let's look at the wall of shame shall we the metro um of course

01:07:43.620 you can't even see because they've got an annoying banner they can't you can't even see it's the metro

01:07:47.380 if they're so embarrassed they're covering themselves but pompey's famous two maidens were 0.90

01:07:52.040 actually men and might have been gay lovers in brackets that's just a lie the metro is the pits

01:07:57.040 i commuted to london for years best part of 20 years i remember when metro first came out and

01:08:03.340 stuff it's it's honestly it's it's like the evening standard or worse i wouldn't wrap my

01:08:08.860 it's it's the most sub one of the most subversive rags is possible to get speaking of which um pink 1.00

01:08:17.680 news uh were the two maidens of pompey actually gay lovers it's certainly possible so actually pink 0.56

01:08:22.840 news said well it's possible so they've got more uncertainty pink news of all organizations than

01:08:30.140 the mail and metro there uh which i just thought was interesting they've got the most reason to

01:08:36.300 present it as unequivocal but there we go um and then we have another one here this is indian news

01:08:43.880 scientists claim pompey's two maidens were probably gay lovers i think that's them anyway 1.00

01:08:48.080 yeah it is an indian outlet and then here's the telegraph embracing figures at pompey could

01:08:54.440 have been gay lovers after scan reveals they are both men it didn't they didn't even go as far as

01:08:59.660 to just read the sentence in the summary yeah in the abstract yeah yeah it's journalists scientific

01:09:07.900 literacy is basically zero they can't even read a summary now i'm basically both both a scientist and

01:09:14.800 a journalist it drives me even more mad than it already did i already hated journalists as a

01:09:19.800 scientist both because i of my politics and the fact i was one um and this just makes me even more

01:09:25.660 for the pure sake of honesty the fact that they've said both men infuriates me oh there's there's no

01:09:31.020 evidence i just care about respecting history history is important you have to get it right you can't

01:09:35.760 just misrepresent it like this uh the week here pompey dna analysis explained volcano victims the two

01:09:42.620 maidens were gay lovers question mark no it's like they could have been gay lovers okay they could 0.61

01:09:47.460 have been anything they could have had green skin with yellow spots yeah they could have been in the

01:09:51.940 middle of a rugby tackle right literally anything could have been anything it could have been a mugging

01:09:58.620 they could have been two orangutans who knows um it'd be a bit weird and i'd like to point this out

01:10:06.040 because this went a little bit viral this 4chan post which got turned into a meme of uh the headline if

01:10:11.960 you're listening embracing figures at pompey could have been gay lovers after scan reveals they're 0.53

01:10:15.420 both men and it says be me drinking wine with best bro serve 10 years in the army together save my life

01:10:20.480 once name my son after the guy mounting explodes find house and hide for shelter give each other one

01:10:26.640 last bro hug ash buries us both 1 900 years later get found lol gay boys yeah just the is this 0.96

01:10:38.160 the imposition this really is the same as the scandinavian well we found her buried with a

01:10:42.540 sword so she must have been a warrior spoilers oh sorry no it's true we're only going to brush

01:10:47.700 over anyway um so let's look at the the wall of honor shall we um the telegraph eventually corrected

01:10:55.040 itself pompey's two maidens locked in dying embrace our heterosexual couple dna dna analysis suggests

01:11:01.220 to draw another parallel to something the damage from those other headlines may already be done because

01:11:06.200 you know that people are going to spam if you say anything about how pride parades are bad um or

01:11:12.980 anything like that somebody's going to spam oh gaze in pompey headline to you the same way that if you

01:11:18.480 say well africans haven't really got a history in the uk they'll spam cheddar man cheddar man cheddar 1.00

01:11:25.140 man was black which was also a hoax it was yeah so um here's another one the washington post of all 0.99

01:11:31.200 people science is revealing the true stories of pompey's victims beneath the ash they don't even talk about

01:11:35.460 it they're just talking about uh the fact that some of them were from the eastern mediterranean

01:11:39.980 and they talk about who these people were it's actually quite well written um so there you go

01:11:44.100 rare bit of praise for the washington post um here's science daily um obviously they're going to be a bit

01:11:51.300 better dna evidence rewrite story of people buried in pompey um they're not they're talking more about

01:11:56.760 the fact that they were from the eastern mediterranean than the actual sexes of the people

01:12:01.320 um i can't remember which publication this one is it says harvard on the uh top line there

01:12:07.800 oh yeah i didn't read the url computationally illiterate for some reason ancient uh dna challenges

01:12:15.460 stories told about pompey victims and it's just saying it contradicts interpretations before we had

01:12:21.200 the dna evidence which is fair enough um i imagine there's probably some wokeness within but the title

01:12:27.500 itself is okay and just to sort of wrap up i wanted to point out that this exists within a framework of

01:12:35.320 lots of other um reporting on archaeological finds being questionable so here is one from the guardian

01:12:43.220 of course 1000 year old remains in finland maybe non-binary iron age leader so what this is is someone

01:12:50.900 with kleinfelter syndrome which is a condition in which male babies are born with an extra x chromosome so

01:12:56.700 this is a very atypical scenario right and i imagine therefore non-binary yeah for some reason but 1.00

01:13:04.020 they have a they have a biological problem um and they sort of were buried in a sort of confusing way

01:13:14.520 in that they have swords but also buried in feminine attire and they also say that they are aristocratic

01:13:21.860 but they don't necessarily the study doesn't necessarily say they were a leader definitively

01:13:26.380 it it could well be and i think my sort of instincts are telling me this is just my speculation

01:13:31.400 that perhaps it was you know the child of a wealthy elite family and so they were taken good care of they

01:13:40.380 didn't necessarily have to you know go out and fight and so they had more um what's the word more

01:13:47.800 more comfortable um more freedom detailed clothes they probably had more freedom too and when they

01:13:53.840 were buried they were even a less sex typical thing because they were less sex typical because of a

01:14:00.040 biological condition so this and potentially just buried with weapons because it was an honorable

01:14:05.120 thing yeah i i think that um it using this very exceptional case to try and make judgments about

01:14:13.480 the past and try and say well it's actually just more modern bigotry that's suggesting this sort of

01:14:18.160 thing is very misleading and then you also have things like this 5 000 year old transgender skeleton 0.97

01:14:24.700 discovered and this um is someone i think they're from the corded ware culture originally and this was

01:14:31.880 found in a suburb of prague and i'm going to read a little bit from this so where's the text okay

01:14:39.020 somewhere down here so it says the body um was believed to be dated between 2900 and 2500 bc

01:14:46.880 and men's bodies of that age and culture are usually found buried with their heads towards the west

01:14:52.540 and with weapons but this skeleton was found with its head towards the east and surrounded by domestic

01:14:56.460 jugs as women's bodies from the time are usually found at a press conference in prague yesterday

01:15:01.760 archaeologists theorized that the person may have been transgender or third sex or they could have

01:15:07.080 been buried in a way that was meant to dishonor them maybe they were craven maybe they had betrayed

01:15:11.940 people maybe they were a criminal there are lots of reasons not to give someone a conventional burial

01:15:18.480 and to suggest that is jumping to a conclusion i mean it it could be possible but i think it's unlikely

01:15:26.440 personally i think it's imposing a modern value on the past in an anachronistic way and then finally i

01:15:33.800 wanted to point out this as well that um they're coming for anglo-saxons again the assault on

01:15:38.480 anglo-saxon history is unrelenting and that and this is of course university of liverpool which is

01:15:44.840 quite woke and i'm just going to read a little bit um in the archaeology of the early anglo-saxon

01:15:49.360 period in england weaponry horse riding equipment and tools are thought to be signals of masculinity

01:15:53.620 while jewelry sewing equipment and beads signal femininity and for the most part the pattern fits

01:15:58.940 so far though no convincing explanation has been put forward for the burials which appear to invert

01:16:04.400 the pattern and he talks about my phd research asks whether looking at these atypical gendered 0.98

01:16:09.600 burials through the lens of trans theory and the 21st century language of transness has the potential

01:16:16.280 to improve historians understanding of the early anglo-saxon gender i don't think so no and anyway

01:16:23.580 that's not even right if you look at the um if you look at the sutton who burial uh whether that

01:16:31.140 was in fact king raidwald or not or not is buried with all sorts of jewelry and beads and all sorts of

01:16:36.900 stuff all sorts of stuff again it could be a sign of wealth and status yeah exactly yeah yeah all sorts

01:16:42.560 of fine but but university of liverpool said not convincing not convincing my phd my phd says the trans

01:16:49.720 yeah and my my general my general point here is that all of this forced ideology just perverts

01:16:58.800 history and it's it's gross and it's disrespectful i think that you should do your best to follow what

01:17:05.500 the evidence suggests you know i've not tried to impose my ideological beliefs on this i'm just trying

01:17:11.560 to go by what the evidence suggests here and i think that people should do the same because you should

01:17:16.460 respect uh the people who came before as a matter of course because it is the right way to conduct

01:17:22.260 oneself and that is not happening here is it it's being incredibly disrespectful to deliberately try

01:17:30.920 and um subvert or pervert invert history is a terrible terrible crime in my opinion terrible knowing

01:17:40.040 that you're deliberately doing it it feels religious doesn't it if he's doing it in good faith and you

01:17:44.960 actually think oh the narrative of history is incorrect because of this or that evidence okay

01:17:48.880 but wait it's obviously just partisan um hackery it's obviously just um well it's just revolting

01:17:58.920 absolutely revolting behavior i think that's a good note to end on yeah let's go through a few of the

01:18:04.620 last rumble rants we got before we go through the video comments so bald eagle 1787 the roman navy

01:18:11.100 responders sailing to into certain death without regard for their own safety their only thought i

01:18:15.320 have to save my countrymen even if they knew they were going to die they would have gone anyway

01:18:19.140 very honorable would you like to read yours of course um how we live without the guardian posting

01:18:24.540 on x quite comfortably um it is a little bit of a shame that lots of leftists are leaving

01:18:30.500 they'll be back because i do enjoy owning them they'll be back in a month maybe less uh boba bad

01:18:37.560 says modern scientists are like pompeii more like pom gay um the only dykes in that city were in the 1.00

01:18:44.220 beds yes queen slay um and then proceed to the nearest gay bar for an academic instruction i don't think 1.00

01:18:51.600 if you paid me five dollars i would have willingly said that but but thank you anyway see how you dishonor 0.96

01:18:57.880 yourself on this podcast every day every day just a a new humiliation carl is just up here

01:19:02.840 puppeteering me making me say things i don't really want no i'm joking of course um that's a random name 0.86

01:19:07.660 guys i swear to god i hate poetry but this is kind of addicting uh what a lovely day to be gay in

01:19:13.480 pompeii and now i can't breathe that ties up all of the segments wasn't the only thing that was erupting

01:19:21.260 that day why do you hate poetry i wrote a nice poem in irelander and he hated it i hope not oh

01:19:28.120 everyone's been really nice about it i put in a lot of effort you're gonna put it on the fridge are

01:19:31.800 you i am where everybody can see it your mom's gonna be so proud josh ah thank you um evan 626

01:19:38.160 says on teasing out more information when visited by the coppers for uh the nchis no say nothing ask

01:19:45.900 nothing even if you're super duper curious no fair enough all right let's go through the video comments

01:19:52.640 there's been a lot of talk about uh trump's recent inroads with a lot of the minority communities in

01:20:00.300 america and i can't help but feel that the democrats whinging that he's going to be the second coming of

01:20:06.880 hitler might not have necessarily been a negative and maybe more of a selling point for some of the

01:20:12.880 communities they were trying to tell this to such as i don't know the middle easterner or african

01:20:18.540 communities who have much different views on you know hebrew communities than say the europeans do

01:20:25.180 that's a fair point yeah the arab swinging to trump was a bit curious wasn't it i didn't see the figures

01:20:33.540 on that did they actually go more towards trump in some constituencies yeah they did um yeah i think it

01:20:39.080 was it was it uh michigan or minnesota one of the one of the two uh there's an arab population and

01:20:45.700 they voted in the majority towards trump i would imagine that ethiopians would feel a bit differently

01:20:50.980 uh towards semitic peoples because weren't they early adopters i know they certainly were for 0.68

01:20:57.320 christianity and they've also got you know the stars of david and things like that but anyway

01:21:00.820 at the height of his acting powers in the 1990s ian richardson played the scheming francis urquhart in the

01:21:07.480 original adaptation of house of cards following that up by starring in an ungentlemanly act as

01:21:12.760 rex hunt the governor of the falkland islands during the 1982 invasion rex we've withdrawn to

01:21:19.200 the drill hall and now there are lots of argentinians outside well shoot them it's a touching dramatization 1.00

01:21:25.400 of events just before and during the action leading up to the surrender that set the task force off to

01:21:30.040 redress the invasion that's interesting yeah the original house of cards because there's the

01:21:37.240 remake with program wasn't it it was the original book is the lord dobbs michael dobbs so it's a

01:21:44.000 completely english you couldn't be more of a british or english thing house of cards originally anyway

01:21:48.600 the original one with him as urquhart is actually really good it's better much better i think than the

01:21:55.040 spacey modern spacey version it was a little bit pretentious the the american one it tried to take

01:22:01.460 itself a little bit too seriously i got halfway through season two and gave up i was like i don't

01:22:05.440 i don't care you've you've gone away from the dobbs book and i'm not interested anymore i stopped

01:22:10.200 watching when he i found out he was an alleged alleged pedophilic rapist oh what the allegedly

01:22:17.360 right okay kevin spacey famously interviewed by tucker carlson earlier was it the new year

01:22:24.480 very strange decision on carlson's well tucker carlson friends with hunter biden as well the

01:22:30.500 more you know eh is he is he i i need to look into that i've heard some people talk about it

01:22:34.860 you said you were opposed to the death penalty yes sir why you're not actually i'm very much in

01:22:40.880 favor of it i'd like to go back to hangings on the court-ass lawn if we could the only problem with

01:22:44.920 the death penalty roach is that we do not use it enough okay see well how do you decide who dies and

01:22:49.720 who doesn't okay you take the crime and you take the criminal now say a crack dealer guns down 0.99

01:22:55.260 undercover cop well you strap his ass to the chair flick the switch you know for some reason i i thought 0.99

01:23:00.060 you were a liberal i am a liberal roar i do not believe in forgiveness nor in rehabilitation i believe 0.99

01:23:05.020 in safety i believe in justice

01:23:06.740 very good scene

01:23:10.540 i haven't seen that film actually

01:23:13.120 i i've not either i'm aware

01:23:15.380 of it uh being quite popular i do know i do have one problem with it though which is that the actual

01:23:20.500 narrative that the story is telling is based on a real event

01:23:23.140 and of course they flipped this the race

01:23:26.120 oh really what film is it i don't even know time to kill

01:23:29.240 you know the one with night you know with samuel jackson 0.92

01:23:31.780 shouts in the courthouse and goes i did kill him i'd do it again 0.99

01:23:35.840 right yeah that one i haven't seen well in the film his daughter was raped and murdered by a bunch of 0.99

01:23:42.600 white guys in reality the event that it was based on was some black guys broke into somebody's house and 0.98

01:23:49.460 raped and murdered his white daughters it's very subversive yeah yeah 0.99

01:23:54.820 anyway ah president trump what a lovely sound 0.99

01:24:01.600 i heard one of you guys ask the question how did tim waltz get

01:24:05.420 picked to run with kamala harris well that's pretty simple we call it the clinton obama formula

01:24:11.600 never have a running mate smarter than you are so clinton had gore obama had biden

01:24:17.180 biden had kamala so tim waltz is at the low bottom of the iq scale

01:24:22.580 his military service is questionable his leadership is subpar perfect kamala running mate

01:24:28.220 interesting art as well mccain had palin

01:24:32.060 i mean what waltz you're right about waltz's uh military record also the fact that he just seemed

01:24:38.760 to be an impulsive liar about the most impulsive as well probably probably both yeah both whatever

01:24:46.900 he seemed to just want to lie about the most non uh like the unimportant things it's such a funny

01:24:54.020 still image though isn't it of um vant sort of looking sort of suave a bit and waltz just being

01:25:01.360 like uh someone's gonna clip that now i made that face so i'm gonna get see that on twitter come up

01:25:07.460 in the next 10 minutes me doing that face but now you've said it is yeah see i'm sure that they

01:25:13.800 only picked waltz and i saw this reported well one obviously it's because kamala was a sacrificial 0.96

01:25:18.700 lamb and waltz needed to be a similar sacrificial lamb they didn't want a vp pick that was going to 0.90

01:25:23.260 burn out a load of presidential currency before the next election but also he's the guy who started

01:25:28.500 just calling trump and vance weird oh these guys are a bunch of weirdos and they went

01:25:32.640 there's our guy there he is okay let's go through some of the written comments for my segment

01:25:39.900 federal agent very nice to see that you're watching hope not hate a very similar case was

01:25:44.400 on a new york train in 2011 where joseph lozito sorry was stabbed seven times while subduing a

01:25:51.600 murderer the police on the train stood back and did nothing he sued the city who ruled police have no

01:25:57.020 duty to protect the public as both segments shows they are here to protect a failing system not you

01:26:02.500 the victim of it nobody is coming to save you well of course i will say there are good police officers

01:26:07.340 out there there are people who are joining the police just because they want to actually help

01:26:10.700 people protect the law make sure that there is safety on the streets but yes the very fact that

01:26:15.380 new york has explicitly said they're not here to protect you says all it needs to i think they're

01:26:20.500 agents of the state until proven otherwise ironically that's fair it is nice if you still live in a small

01:26:25.780 english town though and you might get to know some of the police officers if they're actually on their

01:26:29.320 rounds which some some places they still have so we're actually more dystopian than the universe of

01:26:35.080 robocop where robocop is serve the public trust protect the innocent and uphold the law and the

01:26:41.500 police are actively not doing those things okay good to know then scotty says as an englishman i'm

01:26:48.980 heavily in favor of both free speech and fairness and so i will concede that penny should be allowed

01:26:52.680 to be referred to as the white man and murderer on the explicit condition that nearly be referred to

01:26:57.160 as assaulter killer in waiting public menace the black man and threats to public safety yeah obviously 0.96

01:27:02.800 if there was that kind of fairness perhaps but they would never go with that the only reason he's 0.94

01:27:06.840 allowed to be called the white man and murderer is because it prejudices the case proletariat says a 0.52

01:27:11.880 reminder for you brits he's being prosecuted by new york state authorities if found guilty he could

01:27:16.500 only be governed pardoned by the governor of new york trump would be able to pressure the state

01:27:21.320 authorities in order to get them to do the right thing but trump won't be able to do anything for

01:27:25.080 penny directly all the more reason it's positive that they have literally no case against him

01:27:29.520 in that case do you want i think

01:27:31.980 i might be wrong i might be wrong i think a presidential pardon is completely overrides

01:27:42.080 everything i think i might be i might be wrong i fact check you um i've heard it said before that

01:27:49.280 a presidential pardon is um it's like it's some sort of weird thing that stands outside of every

01:27:56.060 everything else it sort of supersedes everything else i think that person would be right that not

01:28:02.580 normally a president can't just get a governor to do things but i think a presidential pardon

01:28:08.540 is its own thing but so here is the u.s government website um under the constitution the president has

01:28:15.780 the authority to grant the pardon for federal offenses the president cannot pardon a state criminal

01:28:20.500 offense oh okay but surely manslaughter or murder is a federal offense though i would imagine so

01:28:26.740 but he won't be tried in a federal court i guess so yeah anyway ann e moss says harry do you have

01:28:33.860 american cousins looking at pictures of daniel penny he looks like a relation clearly both heroic

01:28:38.740 bloodlines and uh it's better than the comparison yesterday i'm not going to repeat it yes do not

01:28:43.860 suits the red coat says what do we do when it comes to the supposed right wingers who

01:28:47.920 refuse to acknowledge the racial aspect of reality now when you say that i will say james lindsey

01:28:52.520 not right wing um constantin kissing not right wing constantin kissing in an exchange with me on twitter

01:28:58.620 explicitly said i am not your ally take me as a stand-in for you in that situation he does not care

01:29:04.520 about your interests and what's best for you and your people he is in it for himself and his people

01:29:09.340 you can take a wild guess to who they are the ones that when told they want to kill you because 0.93

01:29:13.980 you're white respond with you're just trying to divide us what you do is you ignore them and 0.96

01:29:18.960 alternatively laugh and ridicule them do not engage with their arguments logically there is no logic 0.70

01:29:24.060 behind their arguments most of the time it is a gut emotional reaction from them they are completely

01:29:28.820 useless not to be taken seriously anymore should we go with some some of your comments josh uh sure

01:29:35.740 we skipped bows oh i sorry i i keep seeing kafka and for some reason i think that sounds like a josh 0.75

01:29:40.900 segment it's true i have read kafka to to your credit there apologies bow i know you're an intelligent

01:29:46.820 man josh has read more kafka than i have apparently so fair enough base tape says i've been calling

01:29:53.740 this style of legal abuse uh damocles laws sort of damocles i imagine he means uh the idea is to

01:30:00.380 structure the law in a way that everyone is breaking it at all times then when a person gets in the way of

01:30:05.180 the regime they just drop the person's sword it's disturbingly authoritarian yeah that you've got

01:30:09.920 just a sword hanging over your head at all times hanging by thread which might snap at any moment

01:30:14.500 and you've just got to live with that yeah um like we said forcing people to self um self-censor

01:30:23.060 probably way beyond what is necessary just frightening people just intimidating people yeah it could also be

01:30:29.460 described as petty middle management if you've ever worked in a petty office uh governed by middle

01:30:35.880 managers they love to have all of the little rules so if you accidentally break one they can have your

01:30:40.960 head for it yeah dystopia doesn't come from nowhere it's sort of imbibed in the population over time in

01:30:46.860 places like that um devon seven says uh i'd say the first thing to do after police officers knock on your

01:30:54.780 door for a non-crime hate incident is to contact both the free speech union and we are fair cop

01:31:00.780 yeah get your phone out first the first thing get your phone out yeah video evidence is going to be

01:31:07.660 vital yeah okay afraid bentos for every hiation says maybe you could finally maybe you could finally

01:31:15.660 settled the debate on who's the most based lotus eater by finding out who has the most non-crime hate

01:31:20.560 instance on file probably bow yeah i'll take your reform stuff probably put you in the public eye a

01:31:28.700 lot more you had a hope not hate report you've been uh deselected from reform although to be fair i was

01:31:34.160 smug face when when connor was had his hope not hate report filed that was mostly about him being sat

01:31:39.940 next to me as i made comments including saying john stewart's actual name hate crime i have also been

01:31:46.840 here the longest so in in sheer amount of time i could have accumulated no i'm not let me show you

01:31:52.360 how milk toast i am harry oh let's not take this outside again or else you might be you know doing

01:31:56.500 a vesuvius on me in terms of actual uh uh column inches that uh hope not hate of of dad it's got

01:32:03.560 to be kyle kyle kyle's true yeah kyle's the the godfather wouldn't even be close would it of it

01:32:09.100 yeah uh but in terms of actual baseness i mean it's if if a man declares himself based he is not

01:32:17.320 based right yeah i'm gonna throw a wild card out and say stellios oh there we go any more you want

01:32:25.640 to read or should we go to josh's go to josh's there's so many aren't there okay um i quite like

01:32:32.520 um that one at the top there fane scotty saying great start to a segment about being gay two men

01:32:37.260 complimenting each other's manly bodies and beards listen it's not gay to have standards 1.00

01:32:42.200 federal agent says the good news is only 10 of pompeii's 20 000 residents were killed in the

01:32:47.080 disaster the bad news is it's overdue another eruption but this time it's um 600 000 that live

01:32:52.580 in the um the danger zone i think that's meant to be i must say uh vesuvius is largely dormant it's

01:32:59.420 not completely dormant but it will it will never blow again like it did in 79 ad

01:33:04.860 um the whole top of the mountain was blown off even if it erupts again it won't be

01:33:09.600 an explosive like mount st helen's thing it won't be so etna's a different story etna on sicily

01:33:18.040 that can and will go big at one point but i'm crossing that off the holiday not anytime soon

01:33:24.300 anyway vesuvius not anytime soon so i think i'll end on federal agent saying i'm glad you're with me

01:33:31.420 here at um at the end of all things sam no homo hobbits don't wear socks i nearly included 0.93

01:33:38.120 these stories about uh the two hobbits being gay i won't leave you master frodo it's just like you 0.94

01:33:45.220 can't have friends yeah yeah you can't yeah you can't say anything nice or be kind to another bloke 0.95

01:33:50.920 can't do it otherwise you're gay if woke carries on hundreds of years from now people will unearth 0.99

01:33:56.620 these clips from this podcast and just assume we're all gay yeah yeah and on that note to make 0.80

01:34:02.520 and on that note thank you very very much for watching the podcast today tune in to calvin

01:34:07.600 robinson's common sense crusade at 4 p.m today if you're subscribed to the website which you should

01:34:13.240 be if you don't i will come and i will bugger you in and until then we'll see you again tomorrow 0.93

01:34:18.960 on the podcast thank you for watching

01:34:20.660 you

The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - November 14, 2024

Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #1042

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