The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - June 10, 2025


PREVIEW： Brokenomics ｜ Keir Starmer’s Prospects - With the Academic Agent


Episode Stats

Length

27 minutes

Words per Minute

157.79407

Word Count

4,290

Sentence Count

335

Misogynist Sentences

13

Hate Speech Sentences

9


Summary

In this episode of Brokernomics, the lads are joined by Dr. Nima Parvini to talk about all things Star Wars and politics, including the return of the M. Bison chic and the Tony Blair/Angela Rayner conspiracy theory.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Hello and welcome to Brokernomics. Now, I do believe I have probably reached the age where I can be a grumpy old man and just sort of sit and talk about something.
00:00:07.440 And that also applies to my very special guest, Dr. Nima Parvini. Thank you very much for coming in.
00:00:13.360 Noted grumpy old man.
00:00:14.780 Yes. So we've had the pleasure of getting you a little bit more lately for your courses.
00:00:23.100 Yes.
00:00:23.580 That we're working with you.
00:00:24.920 Absolutely. It's almost like I'm a little part-timer here every Thursday.
00:00:28.360 Yes. How are you enjoying it coming in?
00:00:32.480 Well, I mean, it's all right, apart from having to talk to people all day, you know.
00:00:35.920 Well, isn't it a nice break from the lodge of just you and your cigar?
00:00:44.520 Oh, well.
00:00:45.360 I can see the appeal, but.
00:00:48.560 Well, I mean, yeah, it's been fun.
00:00:50.900 Right, okay.
00:00:51.560 To be fair, it's been fun to talk to the lads.
00:00:53.640 Good, good.
00:00:54.160 Get to know people. That guy who was on the show was quite interesting.
00:00:57.760 Oh, Steve. Steve Wolfe, yes.
00:00:59.120 Steve, yeah.
00:00:59.560 Interesting guy, yeah.
00:01:00.780 Actually, I'm supposed to pass on an idea to you.
00:01:03.620 Bo thought, have you ever seen our lads hour that we do?
00:01:06.640 I have, yes.
00:01:07.140 A slightly irreverent thing.
00:01:08.760 Bo thought, is there any chance of you coming in to do a dictator's top trumps?
00:01:15.500 Because I don't think, we could just steal the IP.
00:01:19.480 But it kind of feels like you should be there.
00:01:22.080 Well, I don't know.
00:01:23.660 I don't want to be, I mean, speaking of grumpy old men, me and Carl did that stream many, many years ago.
00:01:30.840 It would be a little bit like, do you remember like in the 80s when the Beach Boys got back together?
00:01:37.540 And it was like, it wasn't the Beach Boys in the 60s.
00:01:40.360 It was the Beach Boys in the 80s.
00:01:42.220 Hey!
00:01:42.440 And I don't want to be like trying to like, you know, bring back the, bring back the greatest hits, but.
00:01:49.760 Well, it could, it could be, not Godfather Part 2, Predator Part 2.
00:01:54.400 Predator Part 2.
00:01:55.380 Yes.
00:01:55.900 Well, okay.
00:01:56.820 Well, I'll think about it.
00:01:57.600 I'll think about it.
00:01:58.300 Yeah.
00:01:58.940 I mean, I did have a suggestion that Angela Rayner, do you remember Cheryl Cole had that.
00:02:06.400 What's the connection?
00:02:07.040 Well, there is a connection.
00:02:09.180 Cheryl Cole had a single where she dressed as M. Bison from Street Fighter 2.
00:02:14.620 Oh, did she?
00:02:15.540 Yeah, she had like a full military, military hat, dictator hat.
00:02:20.020 And it was M. Bison chic.
00:02:22.400 Okay.
00:02:22.780 And I thought that as part of the new kind of based labor containment arc, that Angela Rayner could bring back the M. Bison chic.
00:02:31.500 You could get, could get that outfit from Cheryl Cole and be like, you know, make a real statement.
00:02:38.760 Funny you mentioned that.
00:02:39.640 Just, just while you were getting your coffee and stuff.
00:02:43.480 Was it Politics UK?
00:02:45.080 One of those things popped up on Twitter and it was Angela Rayner was apparently making the rounds that she would make a credible left wing alternative to Keir Starmer.
00:02:54.140 Mm-hmm.
00:02:54.980 Feels like she's on maneuvers.
00:02:56.280 Well, interesting that I noted that she had a live event around December.
00:03:05.140 It was around Christmas time with a certain Dark Lord, Tony Blair.
00:03:09.780 And I thought, hmm, that's unusual.
00:03:12.200 Tony doesn't really seem like the sort of guy you'd get on with Angela.
00:03:15.220 And then it transpired that Tony Blair had personally talked Angela Rayner out of resigning.
00:03:23.980 Because she was going to resign over the pushback she was getting on building the houses.
00:03:30.220 You know, she was like, it's impossible to get done.
00:03:32.880 I'm going to resign.
00:03:33.560 And Blair personally intervened and got her to stay.
00:03:39.800 Now, again, this is a bit of theory crafting by news.
00:03:44.560 But if I were to read between the lines, you know, if you read the Star Wars, you know, EU, the expended universe.
00:03:55.680 Palpatine, even though there's the rule of two, he never only had one apprentice on the go.
00:04:02.080 He always had backups.
00:04:03.180 So as well as Vader, there was, like, people he was keeping in the shadows.
00:04:08.500 And I wonder if Rayner is a backup in case Starmer is non-rehabil...
00:04:16.180 You know, Starmer's pretty hated.
00:04:18.540 Or he was pretty hated up until he started being based.
00:04:22.420 I've had this theory that Rayner, and I know it sounds crazy, that she could be sold to the British public.
00:04:30.920 Okay.
00:04:31.700 Yes, she's thick as mints.
00:04:33.480 Yeah, she's a bit rough, right?
00:04:35.300 But, but, do you remember when she went to Ibiza?
00:04:39.940 Yes.
00:04:41.060 She was dancing to Elflander Rouse or something.
00:04:42.860 Yeah.
00:04:43.400 Well, I can't remember if she was dancing to, but...
00:04:45.540 Yes.
00:04:45.780 The public enjoyed that.
00:04:48.460 Yes.
00:04:49.440 It didn't, like, the Tories were trying to make hay with it, look at this disgrace and so on.
00:04:54.200 Actually, people thought it was relatable.
00:04:56.660 And I think she's got a human touch that Starmer lacks.
00:05:00.460 Yes.
00:05:00.800 And it could be a plan B in case the establishment of the Starmer Reich fails.
00:05:08.000 Because Starmer, it isn't going brilliantly for Starmer.
00:05:10.800 I just had to make a video yesterday where, to put it, I was trying to say something very,
00:05:20.920 very carefully without saying it to do with all these young male models who seem to know
00:05:26.280 where he was living a few years ago.
00:05:28.120 And, for whatever reason, have a particular issue with him.
00:05:34.500 Mm-hmm.
00:05:35.420 So, and that is, that just feels to me like that's something.
00:05:38.720 This episode is probably going to go out in a couple of weeks' time because I have the temerity
00:05:41.900 to go on holiday.
00:05:42.800 But I feel that that's blowing up.
00:05:44.720 Well, I mean, that could be used as a pretext.
00:05:51.140 Like I said before, any prime minister, any time they want, they can pull the trigger and
00:05:55.760 get some, use some pretext to get rid of them.
00:05:59.360 I would push back a bit though, Dan.
00:06:01.500 I remember last year, before the election, or the day after the election, I said, look,
00:06:06.940 in a year's time, you can hold me to this, Labour would have reduced legal immigration.
00:06:13.100 400,000?
00:06:14.040 Figures came out today.
00:06:15.360 They would have reduced illegal immigration, which I think they have done by about 12%.
00:06:19.820 And they all are going to fix the potholes.
00:06:22.200 Okay?
00:06:23.480 They're starting.
00:06:25.680 And I said, if they could do those three things, Labour should do enough, basically,
00:06:30.680 to stay in power, come what may.
00:06:33.020 Right?
00:06:33.600 Don't forget, they've got five years.
00:06:35.860 Now, I put that out, and within a couple of weeks, Southport happened.
00:06:41.560 And a lot of people were like, hey, you've gone mad, you've lost your touch.
00:06:44.860 Your mindless touch is gone.
00:06:46.400 What's happened?
00:06:47.540 And I was like, look, just wait.
00:06:49.320 They'll find a way.
00:06:51.180 And of course, there was a lot of shenanigans within the Labour Party.
00:06:54.800 There was that Minister Sue Gray, do you remember?
00:06:57.020 Oh, yes.
00:06:58.540 Well, she wasn't minister, she was an advisor.
00:07:00.520 And she was basically gatekeeping Downing Street and keeping people from seeing Starmer.
00:07:07.740 But she wasn't the Dark Lord's creature, was she?
00:07:10.300 Well, she was against Blair.
00:07:11.740 And do you remember there was that period where they kept on snubbing Blair?
00:07:15.800 They told him, no, we're not doing your AI thing.
00:07:18.300 Digital IDs.
00:07:19.160 We're not doing digital ID.
00:07:21.020 They told him to do one.
00:07:22.440 There was all these headlines saying, why is Starmer not returning Blair's texts?
00:07:26.980 And why is he ignoring the advice of Tony?
00:07:29.520 And so on and so forth.
00:07:30.500 She was ousted in November last year.
00:07:35.060 And around that time, there was a bit of a signal shift from Starmer.
00:07:41.120 Remember all of the really unpopular stuff, Southport, the farmers, the winter fuel allowance stuff.
00:07:49.700 All of that stuff happened early.
00:07:51.040 And since that meeting with Blair and Rainer, I think he's been back in the picture, Blair has.
00:08:03.660 And not only that, he has got his men, Blairites, within the Labour cabinet surrounding Starmer at all levels, basically.
00:08:15.080 Including Peter Mandelson, who is now the ambassador to the US.
00:08:18.480 There's a guy called McFadden, who's in there.
00:08:24.560 He's an arch Blairite.
00:08:26.640 And the other thing that Blair did around January, February time, is he had a meeting with 40 MPs.
00:08:33.180 He had private meetings with backbench Labour MPs at their homes, private meetings.
00:08:41.380 It was reported in the media as Blair keeping an eye on future stars.
00:08:45.940 Didn't I just see something about 40 Labour MPs did something very recently?
00:08:49.900 And then recently, 40 MPs wrote a letter about the Net Zero and Ed Miliband.
00:08:56.360 Ah.
00:08:56.700 So, it is obvious, right, that within Labour, there is a tension between the Blairite faction and, let's just call them leftists.
00:09:09.380 OK.
00:09:10.040 Well, isn't Angela Rainer a leftist?
00:09:12.340 Well, Rainer's interesting.
00:09:14.920 Rainer is interesting because she is...
00:09:20.060 People will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the deputy leader of Labour is the only position not selected by the Prime Minister.
00:09:29.860 Indeed.
00:09:30.880 She is selected by the trade unions.
00:09:33.040 Now, the fact that Blair is personally intervening and cultivating this relationship with Rainer shows to me that he has spotted a little node, if possible, a little node that may escape his control.
00:09:49.680 So, if they can get Rainer onto the Blairite side, it basically means she represents the unions.
00:09:57.540 And so, it means that the unions are not going to be a threat to the Blair faction.
00:10:03.160 And this is important because a lot of the stuff that the Blairites want to do and the Star Wars do is going to be pretty unpopular with the unions.
00:10:10.280 There's going to be showdowns.
00:10:12.920 What are the keynote things you're thinking here?
00:10:15.900 I mean, is it the fact that the sums just don't add up and they need to cut?
00:10:18.980 Well, I mean, they want to shrink the administrative state.
00:10:21.800 They want to privatise.
00:10:25.220 They want to outsource stuff.
00:10:27.420 They want to bring in...
00:10:30.360 They want to do these public-private partnerships all over the economy.
00:10:34.640 They want to bring in AI, which is going to lose a shit ton of jobs.
00:10:39.120 All of these things are basically described by the Tony Blair Institute.
00:10:45.240 These are all things that have been announced as plans.
00:10:48.360 It's not going to be easy.
00:10:50.560 And I mean, the basic idea, I think, is that Starmer is in there to do a job and to be able to face down all of those elements in Labour or on the left that are going to kick up a fuss.
00:11:04.680 Now, if it was a Tory prime minister, there'd probably be riots on the street.
00:11:10.740 Because as a Labour prime minister, it's going to be harder because the left have got nowhere to go.
00:11:16.800 So this is what I think is happening.
00:11:19.640 And what's happening at the minute is that Blair has got control.
00:11:24.160 He didn't have control at the start.
00:11:25.640 He's gained control from around December, January time.
00:11:31.520 And now he's consolidating.
00:11:33.980 And I mean, do you remember in Order 66 where Vader's hunting down the Jedi?
00:11:40.360 Yes.
00:11:40.760 I mean, there are still holdouts.
00:11:42.540 Miliband is one.
00:11:44.300 And there's few other voices.
00:11:46.480 Like, there was a Labour MP who went to see Starmer about his Islands of Strangers speech and said he should apologise.
00:11:53.620 Now, really, that should be a signal they have to get rid of that one escape the purge, if that makes any sense.
00:12:03.000 So this is what I think is happening.
00:12:06.540 And it's happening because Labour want to maintain power and they want to keep reform out.
00:12:17.020 They want to keep populism down.
00:12:19.240 And they maybe thought that would be easier than it was when they first came into power.
00:12:24.060 But now they understand they need to go to the master who truly understands power.
00:12:29.240 Yeah.
00:12:29.460 I think when they first got in, Starmer was like, look, I don't want to be under Blair's shadow.
00:12:34.740 I've got my own ideas about things.
00:12:36.940 Some of them are left wing, by the way.
00:12:38.600 And I want to try to go it alone.
00:12:42.760 And he had Sue Gray there telling him, look, I'm going to try out all these things.
00:12:47.060 And I think what's happened basically is that with Southport and with the farmer protests and the fuel allowance and the 16% approval rating they had at one point,
00:12:58.360 which is astonishingly bad for a new prime minister and the more recently, the council elections where reform won 600 seats plus, 600 councillor seats.
00:13:12.160 With all of those things, they're saying, right, the Blairites will be saying, look, you're not listening to us and it's going wrong.
00:13:18.380 You're not listening to us and it's going wrong.
00:13:20.020 The more you listen to these leftists, the more it goes wrong.
00:13:23.260 And every single time it happens, they gain more power within the party and also they gain power to say the base things and do the base stuff.
00:13:32.840 And what's the source of this power?
00:13:35.620 Because on one hand, I can't help but think that if you're actually in government, you are always constrained by your limited bandwidth, just responding to things.
00:13:43.780 And Blair has an enormous organisation of people who just sit and plan.
00:13:47.860 Yes.
00:13:48.120 And somebody needs to do that.
00:13:50.240 It doesn't take place in government.
00:13:51.940 You can't trust the civil service to do it.
00:13:54.500 And therefore, really, the only people who can do it is Tony Blair.
00:13:57.980 So that means you can either accept the wisdom and agenda of Tony Blair and look, you get all these roadmaps, detailed, sophisticated roadmaps laid out for you.
00:14:09.000 Plans, yeah.
00:14:09.760 Or you do your own thing and then you lose.
00:14:13.480 Exactly.
00:14:13.960 And the thing is, it's not just Tony Blair Institute is now the biggest by a mile in terms of employees and the size of the biggest think tank in the world.
00:14:23.740 I mean, it's certainly the biggest one in Britain.
00:14:26.540 Yeah.
00:14:26.600 I mean, it's Scott, he employs more people in the government than Downing Street does, as an example.
00:14:34.260 He has more direct staff.
00:14:36.160 I think there's like over a thousand or something ridiculous.
00:14:38.060 Yes.
00:14:38.240 There will be other think tanks and other people writing these white papers, coming up with these plans.
00:14:46.980 But of course, there's a competition there.
00:14:49.740 And what Blair is really doing, is very good at doing, one, because he's Tony Blair, but two, because that network he's built has got so many influential people and powerful people in it.
00:15:00.260 They get their plan there first, they get their plan, in fact, ahead of the, you know, I always remember a conference that Blair put on that went on two weeks or three weeks before Davos.
00:15:16.080 And it was remarkable to watch it because it was like, we're going to set the agenda at Davos.
00:15:23.480 What should it be?
00:15:24.640 What should we, what should the world leaders be thinking?
00:15:27.880 We're going to dictate that now.
00:15:31.040 Then in three weeks time, this is what we're going to be taking to Davos.
00:15:34.620 And I just thought it was very interesting that they do the agenda setting before, like, it's like a one stage prior to all of these ones that people would have heard of, like Davos.
00:15:46.660 And they do the same thing with the government.
00:15:48.400 They announce their, they print their plans and, you know, say what the agenda is.
00:15:53.160 And then within six months, oh, now it's the government policy.
00:15:57.200 It's happened with digital ID.
00:15:58.560 It happened with, it's happening with AI at the moment.
00:16:03.140 It happened with COVID.
00:16:05.360 Yes.
00:16:05.760 But this is a remarkable amount of power for one man to wield.
00:16:09.560 It feels like we on our side are at a significant disadvantage for not having it or an equivalent of this.
00:16:22.580 But then on the other hand, we have got the hive mind of basically the whole energy of the Internet.
00:16:30.160 So our side is very chaotic.
00:16:32.820 Lots and lots of nodes.
00:16:34.780 Yes.
00:16:34.960 But I'm not sure which of those two is necessarily more powerful.
00:16:39.920 Well, I honestly think that our best bet is to work almost in symbiosis and with an awareness of the structure.
00:16:47.480 So if you think at the moment, Blair and Friends, even though everything they're doing is to maintain their power for pure Machiavellian reasons,
00:16:58.680 even if in their heart of hearts, they don't care about immigration, et cetera, et cetera, they're still saying and doing stuff about it.
00:17:09.040 So I think that we, on our side of things, need to get into a mindset where we don't really care about who or why or how they're going about these things.
00:17:22.580 What we care about is that they are happening.
00:17:25.060 Right, i.e., right, now today, that net immigration number came down by half.
00:17:35.960 And we've got into a stage where you've got the left, you've got Labour crowing about a massive reduction in immigration as if it's a good thing.
00:17:46.660 Very interesting.
00:17:47.560 Right, now we don't need to control anything because the tempo of the discourse has already been set.
00:17:54.720 I like that because that is levelling up politics because the naive way that most people never get out of their entire life is I'm going to support a team,
00:18:04.060 like a football club or a political party, and I'm going to bet everything on them winning the trophy.
00:18:10.900 And then once I win the trophy, all my problems will be solved.
00:18:14.900 Whereas in reality, well, okay, maybe sometimes you win the trophy, but once you have won the trophy,
00:18:20.000 nothing interesting ever happens.
00:18:21.740 You get disappointed all of the time.
00:18:24.500 Perhaps it is a more sophisticated levelling up to say, well, actually, no, we don't control the government.
00:18:29.680 The elites control the government.
00:18:31.260 What we have to do is we have to influence the incentive structure of the elites.
00:18:36.540 Let that then circle back into government to us, and we will just move ourselves ahead in the cycle.
00:18:43.760 Look at Keir Starmer now.
00:18:45.660 Every tweet he's made since the Island of Strangers speech has been signalling to us.
00:18:51.240 Yes.
00:18:51.460 Whether he's thinking about it or not, that is what is happening.
00:18:54.900 He is signalling to us.
00:18:56.480 Because we have the eyeballs.
00:18:57.760 Well, not only do we have the eyeballs setting the tempo of the discourse, because the world has changed.
00:19:06.460 It used to be that the tempo of the discourse was set by the BBC or by somebody like James O'Brien and so on.
00:19:16.920 Yes.
00:19:17.040 But there's such a disconnect between people's lives and their lived experience and, you know, the sorts of concerns, woke and all this stuff that they've been pushing, that they've kind of, at least for the time being, they've lost on that front.
00:19:32.400 They need to win people's trust back.
00:19:34.740 And the way to win their trust back is by saying, we made a mistake, which he said as a country.
00:19:41.580 Basically, Starmer apologised for the government.
00:19:43.640 Yes, it was a Tory government, but he told the nation this was a radical experiment, which has failed.
00:19:51.820 But now, OK, and I see it every day because I'm ecstatic about what's happening, right?
00:19:58.900 Because I've always been big on the Labour containment plan, as people know.
00:20:02.720 I wrote an essay calling for zero seats and the Labour 600, OK, remember?
00:20:09.260 The second part of that was less talked about.
00:20:11.240 Yeah, now the Labour 600 part was less talked about.
00:20:14.040 But what was the basic idea, OK?
00:20:16.820 The basic idea was, look, if Labour are so totally in power that it's so obvious that they own the whole piece,
00:20:24.780 they then basically have to take on the form of almost like a kind of dictatorial government because they have total power.
00:20:34.420 The Tories have been reduced to nothing.
00:20:36.100 So Labour own everything and they can't play this back and forth partisan game.
00:20:41.660 They own the whole piece, OK?
00:20:44.020 They did do that for the first few months of the government of trying to blame the previous Tory government.
00:20:47.820 I've noticed they've just given up with it.
00:20:49.520 Yes.
00:20:50.440 Now, here was the other part of that.
00:20:52.780 This was the kind of quote unquote genius of the zero seats plan, OK, even though it was my plan.
00:20:58.200 So if it felt like, let's say Labour came in and they were awful, they were absolutely atrocious.
00:21:05.700 And we've seen that because Labour were atrocious in the first three months, Southpaw, all the rest of it.
00:21:12.040 That's why Starmer was hated, OK?
00:21:15.600 Then that would be good because it would give, it would zero seats Labour next time there was an election because the ultimate aim of zero seats was to break the two-party system.
00:21:27.680 Ideally killing the Tories, but if Labour had to die too, fine.
00:21:31.340 Or the alternative scenario was they actually, because they are totally the government with an absolute majority, they have to actually think like an actual government with total accountability for the nation, OK?
00:21:48.420 Which means that they actually then start to do things to fix the problem, which sounds crazy.
00:21:56.460 But those are the incentives if you're actually thinking like a government as opposed to a political party.
00:22:04.920 And this is where my interest in Blair is, you know, become quite intense is because in his book, in his power book that he brought up.
00:22:14.680 The leadership, the recent one.
00:22:15.440 Yeah, the recent leadership one.
00:22:17.300 And in all of his interviews, he has talked directly about this.
00:22:21.040 He is talking about power in the same way Machiavelli would or in the same way any of the elite theorists would, i.e. it doesn't, party politics is less important than the actual ABCs of governance and power.
00:22:36.380 And because they're thinking like that, I always thought that Labour would be more likely to actually do something to fix the problem.
00:22:46.180 And, yeah, they had a disastrous start, which made me look stupid, which I didn't like.
00:22:51.700 But now it seems like they're course correcting.
00:22:54.920 They're saying stuff down there that has blown me away.
00:22:58.460 Not just the Islands of Strangers speech.
00:23:02.360 You know, Angela Rayner coming out and saying we have to cut any benefits to migrants.
00:23:07.560 That was based.
00:23:10.300 Chemically castrating sexual offenders.
00:23:12.540 And pedos was one of the few people that he hadn't offended at this point.
00:23:16.920 He's just lost them as well.
00:23:18.880 So that.
00:23:20.400 And then making the prisoners fix the bottles.
00:23:25.220 Now, if a Tory leader would come out and said those three things.
00:23:30.540 Oh, they just would have dared.
00:23:32.320 They would have been called fascists.
00:23:34.000 They would have been...
00:23:35.280 Because it's Labour.
00:23:37.620 Yeah.
00:23:37.840 Well, and the reason why Starmer's speech was compared so heavily to Enoch Powell's is because it was quite similar to Enoch Powell's.
00:23:45.160 Yeah.
00:23:46.340 Well, what are they going to do?
00:23:47.300 Yeah.
00:23:48.140 What are you going to call Labour the left-wing government?
00:23:52.780 Is there not...
00:23:54.340 Because Labour is comfortably the most right-wing party in the country today.
00:23:58.920 I mean, obviously more so than Conservatives, who I maintain are the most left-wing party, apart from possibly the Socialist Workers' Party.
00:24:06.120 But I'm not entirely sure because I don't...
00:24:08.120 It gets to be seen how many millions of third worlders the Socialist Workers' Party would bring in.
00:24:14.380 I think they're probably to the right of reform at this point because Nigel Farage has made it very clear, you know, no one's ever going back.
00:24:22.500 You know, he's just going to bring in a system where it's one in, one out.
00:24:25.900 You know, every time a British person gives up, you can have another Pakistani.
00:24:28.440 So Labour's the most right-wing party, but doesn't that just invite the emergence of a reform on the left?
00:24:40.200 I mean, Jeremy Corbyn has said that he's going to set up a new left-wing party, which is a little bit annoying.
00:24:44.940 So yes, it is true.
00:24:48.780 But really what should happen is it should realign the incentives for reform and the Tories.
00:24:57.880 Now, they're still taking a while to catch up and they're being slow, if you ask me.
00:25:04.480 But what reform and the Tories should both be doing is figuring out how to get properly back to Labour's right.
00:25:13.440 Right. And you see, I mean, I said this before.
00:25:18.860 I mean, again, I don't really want to give the Tory strategy or reform strategy because if you ask me, they're a waste of space, personally.
00:25:26.640 I believe that Labour will actually be more effective, as I've gone on record and say.
00:25:32.940 But if I was to give them advice, it'd be basically try to goad Starmer into calling you racist.
00:25:39.540 Right. What reform should be doing is going hard right now while the paradigm shift has been signalled by Starmer.
00:25:51.160 So rather than allowing Labour to flank them to the right, which they are doing right now, they should be seeing how much further they can push the boat in order to basically make where Labour is now the new centre, i.e.
00:26:12.900 or maybe even to the, maybe even the new left.
00:26:16.520 So that means that any pro-immigration voices are outside of the acceptable discourse.
00:26:24.160 We own the Overton window now.
00:26:26.740 But there isn't much further ground to the right from Labour other than basically where our sphere is.
00:26:33.260 Why do people who are, I mean, why do these people have millions and millions of followers?
00:26:47.660 Why is Donald Trump so popular in America?
00:26:51.460 That is where things are going.
00:26:54.160 Why over in the continent is it Maloney and all of the populace?
00:27:01.440 That is the only place to go.
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