The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #1059

00:00:00.000 good afternoon ladies and gentlemen welcome to the podcast the low seaters for monday the 9th

00:00:13.080 of december 2024 i'm joined by stelios and josh and today we're going to be talking about the fall

00:00:18.580 of the house of asad the woke right and bringing back mammoths from the dead so we can have juicy

00:00:25.640 mammoth burgers and other things and other things well we can have other thing burgers as well

00:00:30.300 not bugs yeah no i mean to be honest with you there's something kind of hyper carnivore about

00:00:36.340 it that i really appreciate so look i don't just eat meat i bring things back from extinction to

00:00:40.700 eat them you know well i also like the idea of the bigger the animal you're eating in your burger the

00:00:46.680 more of a man you are yeah there is something about that too um anyway right so uh before we begin

00:00:52.120 though we have finally uh got the ability on the website for to allow you to purchase premium

00:00:59.020 subscriptions for other people i realize this is taking a long time but now we have that and you

00:01:04.160 can purchase it as a you can purchase whatever lover you want as a gift subscription and give it to

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00:01:13.780 subscription to the website so they can enlighten their mind with our premium content uh do go and

00:01:18.940 do that uh right away anyway let's get into the news right things have been nothing's been happening

00:01:24.980 i understand right so in the past a few weeks there has been a cataclysmic series of events that

00:01:31.500 has led to the downfall of of bashar al-assad he has fled syria and he has been given asylum by russia

00:01:38.660 and everyone is now asking what is going to be the next day for syria and what will also that mean

00:01:44.480 for europe and the world at large but before we say more about this you can visit our website we

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00:02:01.760 i think this doesn't apply for people who are already it's not a subscribe for themselves it's a

00:02:07.860 subscribe for other person yes so so definitely visit our website and consider that that option

00:02:14.320 right so back to our topic the war in syria is a very complex war the conflict has started since

00:02:24.840 2011 and it has led into it has gone through several phases and there was a sort of balance

00:02:32.500 up until recently that balance was resting on a on an agreement that the president of turkey

00:02:41.760 rozef erdogan had with bashar al-assad they had a ceasefire agreement but now this balance has been

00:02:49.260 completely disrupted and all hell broke loose for assad and his regime fell so what happened here is

00:02:58.100 that the the previous balance had lots of kurds controlling the northwest northeast part of syria

00:03:08.640 there have been several turkish back forces in the in the north fighting the fighting the syrians

00:03:15.960 there is also a a rebel coalition here named hts i think it's called the organization for the

00:03:24.440 liberation of the levant and uh assad was controlling most of syria and uh but all this

00:03:32.280 fell like a deco like a house of cards collapsed over the weekend yeah so the question is why did

00:03:38.400 this balance get disrupt disrupted there are several reasons

00:03:43.100 part of it has to do with uh the with the transitional period in the u.s trump hasn't been sworn in but he has

00:03:52.320 been vocally against um meddling into the affairs of syria we will talk about this but i think

00:03:59.400 the main reason has to do with the war in israel and especially israel in lebanon attacking hezbollah

00:04:07.120 and iran so what what's going on is that the assad regime was backed mainly by russia iran and also

00:04:15.220 hezbollah the attacks of israel in lebanon made lots of uh hezbollah supporters and hezbollah members

00:04:24.820 as well as iran to focus their attention and their forces on lebanon and a lot of people said well this

00:04:32.740 is right now the opportunity to to make gains so we have hts in the northwest they cap they launched a

00:04:41.540 surprise offensive they captured several villages and provinces of aleppo they blocked the m5 highway

00:04:48.340 which connects aleppo to damascus which is the capital here in the in the south and everyone

00:04:55.300 started making advances because it was evident that assad had lost the the backing of the army his army

00:05:05.220 wasn't particularly enthusiastic and also russia who is his main ally was his main ally it has all its

00:05:13.940 focus on ukraine they're a bit committed elsewhere yes so what happened was that they started they

00:05:19.700 took aleppo they took hama the a lot of rebel coalitions in the in the south attacked damascus

00:05:27.460 from the from the south they captured southern provinces then we have some other forces here

00:05:33.140 backed by the us who attacked damascus from the north then they can the hts continued attacking

00:05:42.100 continued its advanced south in home we had also the the turkish backed forces making advances also

00:05:49.620 the kurds making advances so literally everyone now is competing for a pie of assad's previous uh grounds

00:05:57.620 listen i've got about 3 000 hours in rome total war here's how assad can still win this right

00:06:01.860 i hope that translates because i've got an embarrassing amount of hours and total i know

00:06:08.980 right so here we the as we say assad is leaving and everyone is focusing now attention on

00:06:16.580 the leader of hds who is called al jolani i think he looks like uh zelensky with a tan a little bit

00:06:23.140 and a beard i think that's on purpose as well he's he's kind of jihadi camo right so what happens

00:06:31.060 here is that they essentially as they say the military since early in the civil war had depended

00:06:37.380 heavily on outside forces to reinforce its lines iran and the syrian regime rolling militias from

00:06:43.060 lebanon iraq and afghanistan russia had provided warplanes their defenses and military advices

00:06:48.420 yet as assad dialed for help from foreign governments in his last house as syria's leader

00:06:53.620 he found here run out of allies and military allegiance and i think late this saturday he left he fled

00:07:00.180 syria he went to russia right so here rebel sees damascus and there are several considerations about

00:07:09.220 what is going to happen the rhetoric in some groups seems a bit more friendly towards christians let's

00:07:15.780 say but this is always something to be aware about we have you can see this is trending there is anxiety

00:07:22.580 about what was going to happen we have people essentially saying that they these people are

00:07:29.220 islamists and that's bad news for christians and however much people blamed assad assad was someone who

00:07:36.100 could hold this area under under control and he also could be good for the for the christian population

00:07:45.860 of syria so people can scroll down here and look at all the other videos that we have yet

00:07:55.380 personally i'm very worried i have to say that i'm very worried and i don't uh i don't accept i don't

00:08:01.940 sympathize with lots of the statements coming from the eu and the west about how this is a brand new day

00:08:08.340 and an excellent day and everything is just rosy it's it's not yeah if we let's pause on that for a

00:08:13.860 minute go ahead i was just gonna say well there's lots of potential for some unfortunate circumstances

00:08:20.420 at least assad was a stabilizing force whereas we we don't know whether there's going to be a

00:08:26.020 significant radical islamic terror group establishing itself i think we do because the guy who we'd

00:08:33.380 previously um just looked at is a terrorist well it's more um as if obviously obviously there are lots

00:08:42.660 of different um groups competing and we don't know which one is going to ultimately triumph and so

00:08:48.340 that's what i was getting at here but with the kurds as well they've obviously uh got history with

00:08:53.860 communism and liking it which i don't like so we we've got this wonderful blend of do we do we get

00:09:00.020 communists do we get islamists um i mean whatever happens whatever the outcome is i don't think it's

00:09:06.420 going to be good for our side of politics personally and the people celebrating it are

00:09:12.980 very naive so they're very premature just to think i'm not even worried about our side of politics what

00:09:17.460 like syria is essentially a kind of artificial state right it's a kind of you know something that

00:09:25.220 i don't doubt the western powers essentially carved up and now we're trying to stitch together a bunch

00:09:30.500 of people who just don't want to be in a political state with one another right the i think aristotle's

00:09:35.540 right being the base of the state's friendship and these people don't have that and so you've got

00:09:40.020 these dramatically competing groups and we're just we're just going to be like okay well assad's gone

00:09:47.860 there are a bunch of um people who i'm just going to describe as jihadis taking over as well as

00:09:53.460 other ethnic interests who are also ideological like this is going to become a real just i don't want

00:10:01.300 to swear it's going to go very badly it's not going to be good no i i don't think if i would

00:10:06.900 phrase it in the exact way but i think that one of the interesting things to look at here is whether

00:10:11.940 in this case in this area of the world religious identity matters more than ethnic identity some

00:10:17.700 people show themselves as syrians other view themselves as muslims or yeah but the thing is

00:10:23.380 there's also the like there's like ethno-religious identities where certain tribes are certain kinds

00:10:30.260 of that paradigm of religion right and so you know you've got different particularities where you

00:10:39.460 can't just say oh well it's just one abstract these are christians these are this these are that and

00:10:43.860 therefore this all maps conveniently to a kind of philosophical framework is it's not that simple it's

00:10:49.940 all about relations because it's all tribal war yeah exactly yeah and now one of the considerations

00:10:54.740 has to do with how are all these people going to coexist and one of the persons who has put himself

00:11:00.420 forward as the potential leader of the of the new coalition of forces is abu muhammad al jolani i

00:11:07.700 think he was born in 1982 in saudi arabia and he has been associated with al-nusra a lot of people say he

00:11:15.460 founded it yeah or and if he wasn't alone he was one of the founders yeah and al-nusra was supposed to

00:11:22.260 be closely affiliated to al-qaeda but a lot of people are saying that he has at least rhetorically

00:11:30.660 tried to take some distance from it okay okay but let's pause there right so you've got a foreign

00:11:35.620 ideological leader who's been leading a jihadi insurgency against the syrian regime for what goal well

00:11:44.020 it's not for the benefit of syrians no it's going to be the benefit for any a dogmatic islamic regime

00:11:49.060 right and it's not like we haven't seen this before so it's just like okay but why would you

00:11:53.380 want that guy like if you were a syrian why would you want that guy i mean he's literally a terrorist

00:11:58.820 he's not allowed to enter britain he would have been arrested and as you've got there well maybe

00:12:02.500 maybe we'll take him off of it so so what the taliban coming off the terrorist list i mean like

00:12:08.340 is all that is required to not become a terrorist anymore is knock off the government

00:12:12.740 and now you're not a terrorist like yeah well objectively yes exactly right but but the point

00:12:20.900 is and the fact that the west is essentially a massage his reputation in the west like well you

00:12:26.420 know look guys i know he's a part of al-nusra and al-qaeda and all this but you know he's literally

00:12:30.420 a terrorist but he is diversity friendly and it's like oh come on yeah this is the

00:12:36.980 over extension of the quiz for palestine rhetoric very much so yeah now it expands throughout the

00:12:42.820 middle east sure but what it what it demonstrates is that the islamic jihadis are not only not native

00:12:50.260 syria um like they weren't in iraq or afghanistan um but they are also being used by this sort of neocon

00:12:59.220 establishment in the west as a way of knocking off allies of russia and iran now i'm not saying we can't

00:13:04.900 knock off allies of russia or iran or anything like that but i want us to be honest about it

00:13:08.900 and not be like oh yeah well actually these are the good guys like no they're just a convenient

00:13:13.620 political tool that we're using to attack our enemies that's fine just be honest so i've got a

00:13:19.380 couple of things um to add first of which i don't think that we should intervene this is none of our

00:13:24.660 business or america's really and i also think one thing that is likely to happen is that israel is

00:13:30.740 going to try and hoover up a lot of territory um of what was formerly syria and it's probably going

00:13:36.900 to continue to take more because that it's going to be relatively disorganized and they can capitalize

00:13:42.340 being an organized force against a disorganized mixture of groups i'm sure that a lot of people are

00:13:48.420 like turkeys probably eyeing up territory in the north i would imagine so yeah yeah but this is what

00:13:53.700 happens when a kind of inauthentic state like syria ends up collapsing right so here what do we default

00:13:59.700 back to if not the kind of nationalistic construct of the you know late 19th early 20th century well

00:14:07.220 we go back to ethnic tribal groups okay well maybe it should have been carved up that way in the beginning

00:14:12.660 i agree well it may i think that it may lead towards that unfortunately it may lead to work towards this

00:14:21.300 yeah but is it unfortunate or is it essentially a kind of well the restoration probably the means

00:14:27.300 with which sure people are going to lead towards that is is going to be the unfortunate oh yeah i

00:14:32.660 mean it's i don't think they're going to wake up one day and say okay fine take this area take that

00:14:36.660 other area and we're going to live in peace because a lot of the the ideology a lot of a lot of these

00:14:43.140 groups have is very expansionist and it seems to be directly opposite to something a solution of the

00:14:49.940 story but but also like the we're just going to see the same effect that removing saddam had which

00:14:57.060 is okay you've killed the bloodthirsty dictator but you've left a massive power vacuum and the people

00:15:02.500 the dictator was persecuting weren't also good people like they weren't like liberal democrats who

00:15:08.420 were like who were like yeah we just want democracy and political representation and constitutionalism guys

00:15:12.980 no they were also they were actually worse than the dictator in many ways there are some parts of the

00:15:16.900 the world where everyone is bad yeah well not even necessarily just everyone is bad it's just

00:15:20.820 the political factions are worse so like i remember a few years ago reading a book about the the beginning

00:15:27.220 on the rise of isis and these guys were just mental absolutely mental no way yeah no i know you

00:15:33.620 struggle to believe it but basically um a career criminal uh was converted in prison like not converted

00:15:39.140 but radicalized in in some sort of jordanian prison and he was an insane thug who would go around

00:15:46.100 raping men and things like this right and then suddenly oh well we're gonna have like a provisional

00:15:52.260 government in iraq it's like you know you know what you're gonna get is like incredibly devoted bands

00:15:58.740 of really bad men going around doing terrible things and that's what they did for years and it's the same

00:16:05.380 sort of environment is being created in syria and right now it's like okay this is just again i'm not

00:16:11.620 like some humanitarian i don't really care what happens in syria but you're going to get a lot of

00:16:15.940 terrorism coming out of this that's it so um donald trump issued a statement and he sort of echoes

00:16:22.660 joshua's sentiment he says that the us should have nothing to do with it this is not a fight let it play

00:16:28.340 out do not get involved suffice it to say that the the us is backing the kurds but i will say that

00:16:36.660 the this this seems to me to be there seems to me to be something behind this i really don't think

00:16:43.860 that this is as simple as he says yeah i don't and i i really doubt that the us is going to pull

00:16:49.140 out as trump says well just a quick thing on that then okay so there seems to be quite a lot of

00:16:54.580 evidence at this point and keith woods actually did a really good thread showing that the israelis

00:16:59.460 have been giving aid and sucker to the jihadis in syria and they have been for years so okay well i mean

00:17:04.820 again they're not doing it because they're sympathetic to the cause they're doing it because

00:17:08.100 they're a useful tool is that okay well who gives all of this money and material to israel to be able

00:17:13.300 to do that well it's the united states and the rest of the west so okay this is our problem actually

00:17:19.220 you will see where my segment is heading because you have anticipated some of the stuff i'll show towards

00:17:23.620 the end jd van says uh the same thing he also says i'm nervous because the last time this that uh

00:17:30.980 people were celebrating in about things like that in syria we saw the mass slaughter of christians

00:17:36.740 and a refugee crisis that destabilized europe so now we have a lot of people from a lot of syrian

00:17:45.300 nationals who are across europe cheering here we have them in germany in england in belgium in greece

00:17:51.540 they're everywhere well they can all go home now can't they because you know the oppressor asad is gone

00:17:56.660 and they can have their islamic utopia so i look forward to seeing every single one of them step

00:18:01.460 on a plane and never come back some of them are some of them are fighting in in the uk no this is

00:18:08.500 a meme okay yeah oh no it's a real thing of course it is why did i i mean it makes sense because if if

00:18:16.500 if countries import people from uh areas in conflict well a lot of these uh loyalties don't get suddenly

00:18:24.660 erased that's why they can't be replicated fighting on the streets too many greeks i'm joking

00:18:31.460 yeah so basically what i wanted to say is that the fighter groups now are saying that

00:18:38.980 israel is next i'll take that with a pinch of soul yeah right when do they ever attack israel i'll take

00:18:45.620 that with a pinch of soul that you've got a page but as you'll see you'll see where this segment is

00:18:51.140 going right so the israelis now are airstriking targets in syria in the south and also in damascus

00:18:57.860 because they want to destroy equipment so that it doesn't fall into the hands of the rebels and

00:19:06.340 what i there should have been a link here but there isn't but anyway so what what what the issue is

00:19:13.140 here that we are trying to think of what is going to happen now in syria first of all i don't think

00:19:19.300 that it's going to be peaceful i'm not saying that i don't want peace there i want but i sadly think

00:19:26.900 that there won't be any peace the major players now are going to be the kurds in the north east

00:19:33.780 and the and lots of turkish-backed forces in syria now turkey and israel are having a sort of a feud

00:19:43.780 because erdogan is saying that netanyahu is essentially a war criminal and a

00:19:52.180 someone who is a satanic state represents a satanic state that's what erdogan says netanyahu says is that

00:20:02.900 he who doesn't stop lying about israel slaughters the kurds in his own country and denies the

00:20:07.620 terrible slaughter of the armenian people who shouldn't preach to israel erdogan stop lying so

00:20:12.980 just a quick thing it always cracks me up when middle eastern regimes try to morally grandstand

00:20:17.860 against each other just own it yeah yeah just guys guys you're all awful i just say yeah i killed

00:20:24.740 them and i'm happy about it like come on man just so what's gonna what i think is going to happen

00:20:32.340 now is the following that the israelis are going to try to form an alliance with the kurds maybe

00:20:40.500 the turks want to hurt the kurds and they will they also want to project might in the region and they

00:20:48.740 are already somehow backing the hts i think that this is going to continue so if if the hts controls

00:20:57.380 syria and the hts has really strong ties to turkey then the borders between turkey and israel are

00:21:05.060 yeah they're really close they're not as far as they used to be trump says that he's going to stop

00:21:11.460 backing the kurds and stop backing people in the region i don't believe that if israel says that they're

00:21:18.500 going to form an alliance with the with the kurds i think trump is going to aid israel and also aid the

00:21:24.580 kurds yeah and here i have the i just found this which i think confirms that there are some tendencies

00:21:32.900 for this israel's foreign minister calls for ties with kurds and other minorities in the middle east

00:21:39.620 they're saying they're natural allies for israel as relations with turkey sour but we need to also

00:21:45.060 remember it isn't just with turkey that kurds are bordering with it's also iran yeah and iran is

00:21:54.180 yet another enemy of israel so it seems to me that we are going to look at a lot of conflict there

00:22:02.660 it isn't going to stop most probably the there are going to be extra migration flows to europe and

00:22:10.660 uh it seems to me that uh everyone who is cheering is cheering really prematurely yeah i think it's

00:22:18.260 crazy somehow it's going to be my tax dollars and my tax dollars shooting each other uh again but um

00:22:24.900 yeah no i think nothing good comes of any of this actually and uh brilliant what a wonderful development

00:22:31.780 for the uh end of 2024 um glee says uh as someone who's racked up thousands of hours of hearts of iron

00:22:39.460 i can conclude that assad used the wrong occupation garrison template well i think assad's problem

00:22:44.740 really was relying on syrian troops and the syrians have always been terrible soldiers or else would he

00:22:49.860 get them from well i mean foreign mercenaries i don't know like machiavelli wouldn't have advised

00:22:55.860 it but if your choice is between syrians and foreign mercenaries i think there's a long and storied

00:22:59.860 history isn't there yeah there is but the thing is there's a long and storied history of the syrians not

00:23:03.540 being great warriors so we were talking about this before as well yeah where i i could have sworn that

00:23:10.180 the syrian archers in in for rome were quite good it might just be because in rome too they're some of

00:23:16.660 the best units although again they may there may have been a small unit of auxiliary archers from syria

00:23:22.180 who were notable um but that's not an army that's true it's not an army but anyway um dragon

00:23:30.420 like yeah again my run two experience um dragon lady chris says i remember the libyan slave markets

00:23:35.860 came back after gaddafi was overthrown this feels like sort of repeat yeah well this is the point

00:23:39.300 isn't it like because okay yeah i'm not like a fan of middle eastern dictators but at least gaddafi had swag

00:23:45.380 no i'm joking he did but like the the point being what the what the secular dictators did

00:23:52.740 is persecute the jihadis who want to literally start cutting off people's heads because that's

00:23:58.660 what the prophet muhammad would have done or some stupid nonsense like that and so like we're looking

00:24:02.820 oh look at all these syrian refugees in europe hey why are they refugees why was a sad person

00:24:07.380 cute oh right they were they were well it's it's um a ridiculous sort of notion that all of these

00:24:16.740 american uh foreign office people think that if you get rid of the secular dictatorship you'll get

00:24:23.300 liberal democracy but what you actually get is islamic theocracy yeah your choice is between

00:24:28.820 secular dictatorship or islamic theocracy you can't really have oh phuk here like and i'm not entirely

00:24:35.300 against us either he says i'm for a dogmatic islamic regime in syria like yeah okay fair

00:24:41.460 enough i mean that's you know if if that's what is going to happen i'm not necessarily even against

00:24:46.740 it it might not be inappropriate for the region or something like that but like the the the reason

00:24:53.620 that the west demonizes the secular arab dictators is just because they're allied with people like

00:24:58.580 russia right we were big fans of saddam hussein right up until the point where he was like no i don't

00:25:03.380 want to have any of it and then we overthrow him it's like it's it's not like i'm sick of this oh

00:25:08.180 look at the human rights violations it's like oh shut up you know we don't care about that no that's

00:25:13.620 that's a total cover it's like we didn't have to pay for it and we didn't have to take the the

00:25:17.620 refugees i wouldn't care what was going on in syria it's not a problem they don't care either which

00:25:22.020 is why they were allied with him while he was doing these terrible things you know and so it's it's all

00:25:26.900 such a a flimsy front for everything and i'm just like look you know it's all just naked self-interest

00:25:34.420 between different ethnic groups in the middle east fine whatever just solve it just just you know

00:25:38.980 resolve it however you want i don't care it's not my business anyway let's move on

00:25:46.260 so there has been a um upset between the classical liberals and uh the woke right quote unquote um

00:25:55.540 that we have seen play out mostly on twitter obviously uh but that's where all the interesting

00:26:01.060 discourse is actually happening and it's been going on throughout 2024 and it kind of came to a head

00:26:05.540 recently i thought it was just worth actually talking it out a bit and trying to un uh examine

00:26:11.380 some of the underpinnings of the discussion um because i think there is actually quite something

00:26:15.940 quite substantive here so i mean we can begin in february 2024 when constant kissin wrote a substack

00:26:22.740 article just called tucker carlson and the woke right where he's describing what he thinks uh the

00:26:28.100 woke right is in contrast to classical liberals and how uh tucker carlson fulfills that um i personally

00:26:35.860 didn't respond to any of this because i was just like i don't know if i'm woke right i don't think i'm

00:26:42.260 woke right um and this kind of bubbled on the back burner andrew doyle wrote something similar

00:26:48.660 in november and james lindsay decided to uh push this to the fore by um essentially tricking

00:27:00.100 a christian nationalist publication uh that i'd never heard of in by rewriting large sections of

00:27:08.100 the communist manifesto and rewriting them in great detail as well so you would have to i mean to be

00:27:14.020 fair it should never have got past their sort of uh smell test because there are some obvious uh

00:27:20.660 allusions to the communist manifesto in it and they should have known they were being essentially ragged

00:27:24.180 on uh but they didn't but the point being the

00:27:29.220 bits that he had interpreted weren't promoting communism they were promoting christian nationalism

00:27:34.820 and that's why they published it um and james when challenged on this had to default back to well

00:27:40.260 it's the same logical structure it's like well the logical structure is there is something we don't

00:27:46.100 like and we should change it therefore yeah you could apply that to literally anything i mean liberals

00:27:51.220 would be fine with that and so this uh this kicked up a huge mouth stink and back in october um

00:28:00.420 connor had written an article saying well look there is no work right and what this really is and i think

00:28:05.380 he's right on this is cracks showing in the woke coalition charges of wokeness are being leveled by

00:28:11.620 various at various figures by politically homeless liberals the problem with the term work rises it'll

00:28:16.500 define self-contradictory and a tactical blunder for an anti-work coalition to use and so i think this

00:28:21.220 is um something worth talking about because there is essentially the argument being made from the liberal

00:28:29.060 side of the liberal side of this that okay the problem with the woke left is that it's woke and not that

00:28:36.580 it's left right that's i think really the issue because what they they would summarize woke as being um

00:28:45.780 a uh systematic critique of power relations in society and drawing attention to oppressions and

00:28:55.860 injustice now the the average liberal should have no real problem with that concept because that is

00:29:02.820 of course what liberalism itself was founded on there's the purpose of liberalism was to critique

00:29:07.700 the aristocratic regimes under which they lived point out they had no moral justification according

00:29:13.140 to a different moral analysis and well frankly bring about revolutions which is what the american and

00:29:19.220 french revolutions were about and instantiate a new liberal order and so to say well

00:29:24.420 well we can't have a systematic critique of power and injustices is kind of off the table for the

00:29:32.420 liberal the liberal has to admit that they're fine with that because that is of course the very nature

00:29:36.500 of liberalism disagree at all yet i disagree yeah well what do you respectfully on on that on that critique

00:29:42.420 what do you disagree okay so i think i heard that someone said that the problem with a woke left is that

00:29:51.620 it's woke not that it's left i think that this isn't this isn't accurate the the the criticism is and

00:30:00.420 when i say the criticism right now i'm essentially arguing for my own view because it's not that

00:30:07.940 someone instantly has to say you know you're with this person or with the other person right now let

00:30:13.700 let me just rephrase the whole thing well hang on before we go on but did you did you object to my

00:30:20.740 my characterization of liberalism yes why because liberalism has a political dimension which manifests

00:30:30.340 in historically in constitutional monarchy and republicanism classical republicanism mainly these two

00:30:37.620 areas and they do have they do have they do tend to come with a realistic critique of how power works

00:30:46.500 sure a lot of people are criticized when they talk about liberalism they're either criticizing deranged

00:30:51.860 leftism or a caricature of libertarianism which is okay just the state should have nothing to do with

00:30:59.460 essentially something close to to ancap sure but if if being woke is defined as applying a

00:31:06.660 structural critique of power relations that from my understanding to identify injustice from my

00:31:12.740 understanding of this conversation it isn't just the applying the systematic critique because for

00:31:19.620 instance realism which we could see a lot of the u.s founding fathers and uh also burke and his

00:31:27.620 critique of the french revolution they were using the issue isn't that there there is a systematic

00:31:34.820 critique of of um social phenomena the issue is that there are some overlaps and that this systematic

00:31:43.460 critiques take some some particular forms and what lindsay and kissin are saying and a lot of

00:31:50.740 people is that for instance the same way lots of people on the left are saying well it's the way

00:31:56.740 the white straight male who's responsible for everything they say for instance that a lot of

00:32:01.860 people are saying this for for the jewish people or lots of people are saying this for the classical

00:32:06.900 liberals so what they're trying to do is they're trying to say that there are lots of you know

00:32:12.580 attitudinal overlaps between the way these two people these two camps think and they have lots more

00:32:19.940 in common than they would like to think sure but the the drilling down into it is the point i'm trying

00:32:25.540 to make is the idea of just labeling a systematic critique as a woke position which i've a lot of

00:32:33.300 people are doing and we'll get to in a minute how other people are doing well if that's woke then

00:32:39.620 liberalism itself was always woke then everything is woke yeah almost everything except but not

00:32:45.860 not necessarily everything but the everything in modern politics then by their standard right there

00:32:51.460 are definitely political views that aren't systematic critiques of things but liberalism began

00:32:56.340 as a systematic critique of the way that society and the justified forms of yeah it was essentially saying

00:33:03.780 that human beings occupy the same position in the great chain of being and the feudal system was

00:33:10.260 based on the idea that some people are naturally superior yeah and so it's it's it is in and of

00:33:15.380 itself it has to be that so if the classical liberals say well it's being woke is the problem

00:33:21.060 then well are you really a classical liberal then because classical liberalism has that baked into it

00:33:26.660 but the the point being i think is the issue that actually it's the systematic critique from the left

00:33:31.780 rather than one from a centrist or right-wing perspective i think it's when it takes particular

00:33:36.900 forms it's not the it's not that's what i'm saying the problem isn't that there is a systematic

00:33:41.540 critique the problem is when we have very low resolution analysis so for instance i don't

00:33:47.220 know i don't even think it's that i think the problem is the impulse that underpins the nature

00:33:52.660 of the critique why are you leveling a critique that renders straight white men as the enemy of

00:33:57.540 civilization when like you say they're responsible for everything they're kind of the authors of

00:34:01.700 civilization actually so why is the critique being leveled from that perspective the idea of the critique

00:34:07.300 itself is fine and so that's not the issue with being woke the issue with being woke is attacking

00:34:14.660 the majority population of the country yes yeah right so that's the point i was trying to drill down

00:34:21.060 to like the the classical liberal has to concede that there is of course a critique of power and

00:34:26.340 structure contained within liberalism so that's not what they're objecting to um and i've noticed that the

00:34:31.780 the point that they want though is to arrive at oh well i'm happy with like the 90s liberal

00:34:38.660 you know establishment consensus and so if you are to say uh go any further than that and engage with

00:34:46.740 critiques made from the left by what i think are quite brilliant left-wing thinkers whether you like

00:34:53.300 them or not you have to concede their skills then suddenly they view this as oh that's communism

00:35:01.700 okay well look the the reason you're afraid of this because you don't properly understand it and

00:35:06.420 you feel like you have no defense against it right i personally am never going to become a frankfurt

00:35:12.100 school communist because i'm not any kind of communist i'm for hierarchy i'm not against it i'm not

00:35:18.580 trying to achieve their goal but after reading various members of the frankfurt school for me it's

00:35:23.460 marcuso hawkheimer and dorno i can't deny that these are brilliant thinkers and that they have incisive

00:35:29.700 critiques of the world whether you like them or not and i know you don't like them i they are

00:35:35.700 impressive thinkers well there's a reason that the left have captured these institutions right

00:35:40.180 exactly there's a reason that we live in the shadow of these people and everyone's running around

00:35:45.460 screaming like they're satan and so i mean like in in this um marquis is one dimensional man right it is

00:35:54.180 a good critique of what liberal democracies end up unconsciously doing to themselves go and watch

00:35:58.500 my book club on on the website and in fact gift a subscription to someone else so they can watch it

00:36:04.260 too right because i spent literally like a month studying this book trying to properly understand it

00:36:10.020 and he is right that there is a kind of totalizing perspective within enlightenment and liberal democracy

00:36:17.620 as in it feels that it has to and it not even feels it has to it can't help but disenchant the world

00:36:25.300 and make no space for the legitimacy of non-rational thinking right there's just no question of that so

00:36:33.220 first of all i i'm a i'm a rationalist so when you're talking about the legitimacy of non-rational

00:36:39.140 thinking yeah okay count count me in yeah well i'm totally against you yeah same we will fight

00:36:46.580 right go yes so when it comes to what you're talking about the disenchantment of the world i would

00:36:51.620 say that a lot of people who are critiquing who are suddenly discovering the internet and they can

00:36:57.780 talk about they can talk about everything instantly the disenchantment of the world has lots of reasons

00:37:06.020 lots of causes behind it most of it are technological they have to and they have to do with metaphysical

00:37:12.340 positions yes for instance like materialism i'm not a materialist but materialism is or it's a completely

00:37:19.380 orthogonal view on this i don't know if it is and i don't want to get into the long debate of it now

00:37:24.660 the point being it is a worthwhile debate to be had yes definitely mark hughes was making an incisive

00:37:31.380 critique of what was happening but just what one one sentence what i find insufferable about

00:37:38.820 yeah what i what i find insufferable is they're constantly talking about problems without offering

00:37:43.940 solutions so constantly they say okay instrumental reason is destroying all the world and all these you know

00:37:49.220 bad people yeah do you have do you have the guts to actually go back to traditionalism in metaphysics

00:37:57.060 traditionalism in philosophy and do it they didn't i know they didn't i know but the i know i know they

00:38:02.900 constantly spoke about the problem lamenting i know but they didn't have the guts to go back to antiquity

00:38:08.900 i know and the the i like i don't want to get into it but like yeah the the the they don't they're

00:38:16.740 essentially just it's a one long big lament that communism is never really going to come about

00:38:20.820 right that's all all of this is and like you said they don't have the guts to actually accept that

00:38:26.740 a slightly uh i guess we just call it traditional frame actually has legitimacy blah blah blah and

00:38:32.340 it's actually funny in in this where marcuser goes well the the problem with um instrumentalizing

00:38:38.580 high culture is that you destroy it and a true high culture requires an aristocratic class that can

00:38:44.580 separate it from the everyday material world and it's like that you're looking at me yeah well

00:38:48.900 no the thing is and he he reluctantly admits that that has to be the case or else you get like you

00:38:55.460 know you listen to bach or mozart in the elevator with elevator music so there's no transcendental

00:39:00.100 experience when you're enjoying it there's nothing there's nothing new there's nothing that takes you

00:39:03.700 out of the world and it becomes just just melded into the one dimensional you know you're sat in your

00:39:10.100 fluorescent lit office listening to something that does nothing to you and brings you no new experiences

00:39:16.020 and it's just like everything gets mushed down into the same layer it's a great critique it's

00:39:20.980 very incisive i would argue that a lot of these things a lot of the the magic of the modern world is

00:39:25.380 the proletariat proletariatization of the world in that everything is very accessible to well that's

00:39:32.580 the lowest common denominator and i think that's terrible i don't want it to be that's exactly his

00:39:37.220 critique he's like look these things can only essentially be magical when they're not freely

00:39:41.700 available to everyone when they're not just played in the elevator do do do do you know like it has to

00:39:46.660 be something special and uh held back and so that it you know am i woke right for thinking that i have no

00:39:54.740 idea you know you're not you're not i don't think i am either but also you're not according to the most

00:40:00.660 of the definitions well putting forward well let's let's get to definitions of woke right because i think

00:40:05.780 the the the issue here is that the classical liberals are just essentially afraid of the

00:40:11.540 intellectual development the the the philosophical culture has made throughout the 20th century they

00:40:17.460 don't want to engage with it they don't want to accept it and they want to kind of just default back

00:40:21.540 to something that you know john stuart mill would have been happy with okay i think that what is going

00:40:27.300 on here is that in a lot of people in let's say on the right or in lots of classical liberals let's say

00:40:36.100 they are worried that a lot of people especially on social media are adopting the no enemies to the

00:40:43.940 right tactic and they are pandering to audiences of people without drawing red lines yeah so what's what

00:40:51.540 happens is that they are trying to propose where to draw the red line do i agree with i agree that

00:40:58.580 a red line has to be drawn but obviously there is a question to be had as to where it has to be drawn

00:41:05.860 sure and so i that's that's what i think is is happening here sure and we've got it we've got a line

00:41:12.100 drawn here by james lindsay uh the woke right uh modern day fascists in exactly the same way the woke left

00:41:18.180 a modern day communist well there's an interesting interesting admission that like fascism's left

00:41:23.140 wing but uh sorry gone woke left modern day communists there's overlap there sure but

00:41:32.740 they are definitely communists but like it's it's like saying you know my my childhood self is me

00:41:39.220 and i'm the modern day version of my childhood self it's like yeah there's a i feel like it's

00:41:46.340 unsatisfactory yeah it's a terrible definition yeah because communist conjures up can the notion

00:41:52.900 of a conventional communist like lenin mao um karl marx and it's ideologically distinct even though

00:42:00.340 there is crossover i don't know if i'd say it was ideologically distinct um the the the woke left

00:42:06.820 are descendants of those people because people like lenin were like okay why hasn't the communist

00:42:11.700 revolution come about and a lot of people uh p and then he he of course is instrumental in the

00:42:17.940 russian revolution but then you have people like gramsci being like okay well why didn't it come

00:42:20.820 about in the west and then you've got a very long and autistic history of people looking at the concept

00:42:27.780 of ideology and saying right it's the things that the west believes and instantiates into itself that

00:42:33.300 prevents communism coming about and therefore you've got kimberly crenshaw who directly picks up

00:42:37.860 gramsci's uh argument that we would need a war of position rather than a war of maneuver against

00:42:44.180 the um establishments and governments of the west in in order to dissolve the cultural fabric of our

00:42:51.460 societies which is exactly the point of intersectionality and so it's not that they're

00:42:56.580 not communists what they are a communist sort of like oh we failed there we failed there we failed

00:43:00.660 there we need a tactic in order to win so they are communists they're doing exactly what the communists

00:43:05.700 have always done if marx had lived in this day and age rather than back in the 19th century he would

00:43:09.780 have done this exactly the same thing because he would just have been he would have been given access

00:43:13.940 to the intellectual equipment and tools that our modern communists have so you know it is true they

00:43:19.940 are modern day communists but it's not really describing yeah what has happened i mean to to sort of

00:43:26.500 give the devil its due here i think the closest thing that the woke is to communist is as you said the the use

00:43:33.380 of intersectionalism to create these divisions and and basically divide and conquer isn't it

00:43:38.100 except rather than it being on a class basis it's on lots of different demographic details and therefore

00:43:43.620 it's more effective no no because what what what the communists want is the the dissolution of society

00:43:48.900 right because it is in society itself that inequality and hierarchy are formed that's what i mean yeah but

00:43:54.580 that's but that's intersectionality is just a tool to continue on down that path the the idea behind

00:44:01.540 this uh demarcation isn't that they are exactly the same is that they have sufficiently sufficient

00:44:08.740 commonalities that are corrosive of society yeah i think what we can agree on is we don't like them

00:44:14.500 and we want to crush them politically no matter whether they're woke or communists but the um but the

00:44:21.380 point being like say these are just modern day fascists and it's like okay but the the fascists are not

00:44:29.060 what the dissident right are because fascism again is it's itself like a rationalistic philosophy

00:44:36.260 whereas the dissident right are more in the sort of burkean tradition so post-modern burkeanism

00:44:41.380 frankly where it's it's not that they have like a a single structured plan for the entire world and

00:44:46.660 then you get the christian nationalists i don't think it's fair to call them fascist i think they i'm

00:44:52.100 not saying they're not going to be authoritarian but they're going to be theocratic which obviously

00:44:57.060 fascism wasn't so but the the question here is whether you think that this is desirable or not

00:45:03.780 because for instance fast as you said fascism as a rationalistic view i think fascism was precisely

00:45:10.740 anti-rationalistic that's why they prioritized irrational stuff like blood it no no i well no

00:45:17.780 fascism didn't prioritize blood it prioritized statehood it was nazism prioritize blood but anyway it's

00:45:24.980 it's like i'm actually kind of tired of people saying oh fashion was just irrational it's like

00:45:30.100 well yeah but it wasn't though so okay on some level yes but on other levels no okay so except

00:45:35.700 of the liberal construction of the state okay so sorry gone no i would say that temperamentally

00:45:41.940 sure what there are some people who say okay i'm bored of constantly listening to

00:45:47.860 the problems of fascism and also the mustache guy yeah me too right uh the i think we should

00:45:55.220 constantly listen to this but also we should constantly listen to stalin so for for me it's

00:46:00.420 important one of the one of the things that lead to totalitarianism is slow habituation into viewing

00:46:07.940 violence as something that is more acceptable than it should be in in society so when when particular

00:46:15.300 views are constantly desensitizing people with respect to this then you you have lots of people

00:46:22.580 who forget so my point is yeah the the it it may be boring but i think people should constantly be

00:46:30.500 reminded this from both sides not just one and say well i don't like hearing constantly about the

00:46:36.260 about one of the guy or i don't like constantly hearing about the other okay well moving on uh constantin

00:46:41.140 decided he was going to uh withdraw the term woke right which is fine now again i i never felt

00:46:46.500 attacked by it i don't know what it's supposed to characterize if you mean christian nationalist just

00:46:51.060 say christian nationalist i don't i don't i just don't see the point of creating an other rising term

00:46:58.260 which as you pointed out when we were talking about this before um that's what this is it's a way of

00:47:02.020 just saying enemies yeah compared to friends which pure schmidtianism which is fine i mean there's

00:47:07.540 nothing wrong with doing that you have to draw the line and remember that a lot of the criticisms

00:47:12.340 of classical liberals is that they haven't been drawn lines sure that's definitely a left-wing

00:47:17.300 criticism of classical liberals um but the the point being he says okay well look provide me a better

00:47:23.300 term and this is essentially the definition that he's trying to get to right and i think

00:47:27.380 this is perfectly fine for us to discuss says um thinking the west is bad and siding with its enemies

00:47:33.620 right so i don't think there are any groups on the right that think the west is bad i think what

00:47:39.060 there are groups on the right that at worst think that the regime that controls the west is bad as

00:47:44.820 in they're against liberalism and internationalism and therefore they like people like assad and putin

00:47:51.540 because they see in assad and putin a kind of totemic force against global homogenization of the

00:47:58.580 entire world and so it's not that these people are necessarily uh desperate for the russians to

00:48:06.260 take over the west and replace the western population with russians or something like that

00:48:11.060 what they see is just anti-liberalism well i i would say one of the very few things uniting all of

00:48:16.820 the right is a certain sense of western chauvinism isn't it yes it's it's the west is the best and

00:48:23.300 it is undeniably yeah an absolute sort of aggressive parochialism my issue with this is that

00:48:30.820 there are many conceptions of the west so some people view west entirely as biological and others

00:48:37.140 view it culturally others view it as christianity others view it as a strand of christianity it's it's

00:48:43.300 it's a very vague statement i think vague statements do lead to confusion um sure um i think constantin would

00:48:52.980 argue though that it essentially means the anglosphere and europe yeah but what about them

00:48:59.780 because if you constantly that they change the mix of the population let's say in in in those areas you

00:49:07.140 you basically destroy the west you don't yeah no i agree but the i know i know but the point is

00:49:11.940 someone in woke right would have to think the west is bad and siding with its enemies um so again i

00:49:16.980 don't think that people are against the west as we've defined it there what it is they're against the

00:49:22.580 regimes that control the west such the european union the democrat party the you know international

00:49:27.860 deep state whatever it is right so there's that i think essentially makes these criteria essentially

00:49:34.900 don't refer to anyone that's the problem so the next one is playing identity politics on the basis

00:49:39.940 that their group is oppressed by a secret invisible force controlled by another group slash groups it's

00:49:45.220 like okay well i mean to say that identity is and concerns of identity make you woke right like

00:49:55.700 because what this is a very very specific and narrow definition that would carve out a very small

00:50:00.340 constituency of hysterical people on twitter but to suggest that say um identity politics that represent a

00:50:08.500 group as being oppressed by not even a secret force just any invisible force that's controlled by the

00:50:13.220 groups well that's obviously true right so the example being um left-wing uh activists who staff

00:50:23.220 our institutions again they're not secret or invisible but they are actively discriminating against

00:50:28.500 straight white men which take the example for the um air force recently they're like oh we're just

00:50:33.860 getting useless straight white men applying as pilots we're not going to get them so okay so we you know

00:50:38.500 there is definitely a group of people who have a particular ideological agenda who are discriminating

00:50:44.340 and oppressing therefore using state power and institutional power the majority population i mean

00:50:51.780 there was a there was an example of the police force in like cheshire where this guy had wanted to

00:50:55.940 become a cop his entire life he was like the perfect candidate and he got refused and then sued them

00:51:00.580 and proved that they had racially discriminated against him so it has to be true that there are identity

00:51:07.620 politics based on group oppression or else why would we complain about woke there won't be borders if

00:51:14.980 there were in the case exactly what would the people woke then if that wasn't true you know i have

00:51:19.860 particular objections from this coming from constantin kissin because of course he was the person who

00:51:27.300 was was telling the victim of the grooming gangs uh not to talk about identity and i think that that

00:51:34.500 really left a sour taste in my mouth and and to be honest i think that was an identitarian issue

00:51:38.660 there was a particular yeah pressing someone else because they belong to another group and i think

00:51:42.980 that you can't close pandora's box now if you want to raise the the issue of ethnic identity um the way

00:51:50.260 in which you avoid getting taken advantage of is to stand up for yourself and i don't think that um telling

00:51:57.780 people that engaging in identitarianism is now bad because if we don't do this we will be taken for a

00:52:05.860 ride as we are we will have to pay benefits for foreigners and other people because we can't

00:52:10.740 distinguish the the the native british population say or the native whichever country it is from the

00:52:17.620 people who've come here the taking advantage of us basically and that but also it means you can't

00:52:24.180 apply a structural critique about the problems that the left has created so if the left institutionalizes

00:52:30.660 a load of minoritarian based anti-majoritarian racial ethnic gender sexuality um policies then okay but

00:52:41.940 to be able to root them out we have to be able to at least identify them and say well look this this

00:52:48.180 group is oppressing this group for xyz reasons so like that that is us having to look at the identity

00:52:56.260 politics and address it even if you and you know even if you want to be a pure formal proceduralist

00:53:02.660 about it you you have to accept that the structural critique is valid otherwise what are we even doing

00:53:08.660 and otherwise what you've done is allow the left to drag our institutions radically to the left and

00:53:14.340 they go right okay guys this is where we're staying we're staying neutral now it's like no we don't

00:53:18.900 want to be neutral now that's not the that's not the future i want you know i don't want my children

00:53:22.820 being institutionally discriminated against because of their race and so we have to accept that there's

00:53:28.100 a critique anyway um having an obsession with group-based victimhood and grievance well it depends

00:53:33.220 on how much it's affecting your direct personal life like why is it my children i try the the the

00:53:39.220 teachers in my schools are trying to get my children to go to mosques and bow in prayer as a

00:53:45.940 as a way of like you know sharing their culture with us but the the muslim children are never brought

00:53:51.140 to a church and they engage in prayer in a church right but like this this matters this you're right

00:53:58.100 on this and i fully agree with you here and here is where i think that they are going very astray yeah

00:54:03.700 let's trade with this because you philosophically speaking identity politics well you can carve

00:54:09.700 identity in all sorts of ways in the same way you can do that with west there are all sorts of of

00:54:16.340 friends and enemies and you everyone is drawing the red line somewhere yeah so depending on whether you

00:54:22.980 draw the road the red line you have at least two identities that matter i agree i i totally agree but the

00:54:30.500 point and it's also very abstract because you know we shouldn't just examine it in the abstract it's

00:54:36.100 just we're talking about a society a society with particular problems that have arisen historically so

00:54:42.660 could it be that could it be that group-based victimhood has arisen for group-based reasons if

00:54:51.140 yes then people should view it and also the the nature of victimhood doesn't have to be an

00:54:56.660 like it doesn't have to be a grooming gang right it can it can be something that's more subtle that

00:55:02.020 you don't want to call being a victim but is in some way sort of a sandpaper effect to the culture

00:55:10.340 you could say anything relating to a two-tier society yeah yeah yeah something like that and

00:55:15.300 this is a problem we live in now so again like to say well being concerned about that essentially puts

00:55:20.660 you in the work right is is to say no i'm fully committed to the atomic liberal perspective on what a human

00:55:26.100 being is and actually i don't think that's correct and i can see in my real life everyday life how

00:55:32.740 this is not going to solve the problems that are being imposed on us from the left um but there are

00:55:38.500 strong yeah there are you know various other things revising and perverting history to fit an

00:55:42.500 ideological narrative well i mean history is a set of lies agreed upon so that's anyone is guilty of

00:55:47.540 that frankly i agree with napoleon on that one to be honest uh reacting to disagreement with name

00:55:52.500 calling ostracism and bullying well who who has done that james lindsay who's been calling people

00:55:58.260 woke right as an otherizing term like sorry you know when tim paul came out i was like well that

00:56:03.300 makes james lindsay and the classical liberals the woke right the right hand of the left yeah well that's

00:56:08.340 true by this own definition sorry you know and then creating a culture of fear among more center

00:56:13.300 leaning people to prevent criticism so well i don't think there should be a culture of fear obviously

00:56:16.980 what amazes me though is why people react so much against this why is it that people react as if

00:56:23.140 they're like demons and you throw and you throw garlic or holy water in them well this is you know i

00:56:28.820 made i made the post and yeah a lot of the people that now are you know are trashing uh lindsay they

00:56:37.300 they did the same to me and even worse yeah i know so i think it's just the nature i'm just asking

00:56:42.660 myself why why did why did they not ignore it i mean it's the same with like like the james lindsay

00:56:49.540 fans calling me a communist because i was like no i i think that actually these people had good

00:56:55.780 critiques of modern society and we should take them seriously because they're highlighting our

00:56:58.980 weaknesses that we can solve and they're like oh right you're a full communist now it's like that's

00:57:02.900 right comrade you know collectivize the means of production i'm only a business owner yeah i want

00:57:07.460 my i want the state to take over my business idiots can i say something yeah go ahead confession

00:57:14.180 that's funny but when you debated with you and connor debated phil labonte and oh yeah on liberalism i

00:57:23.220 posted and said phil if you need help with these commies call me i mean just of all the things to

00:57:30.420 call me a communist is so funny anyway we'll leave that there because i know i've been going on for quite

00:57:35.460 a time uh some time but basically you know what are we even trying to do here right it's it's fine

00:57:40.580 to have structural critiques it's fine to have an identity and it's fine to want to protect that

00:57:44.980 identity and that might not be most doctrinaire liberal position but sorry we live in the world

00:57:50.820 in which we live we don't live in homogenous 90s societies things have changed we have to change with

00:57:56.180 them um just going to read a couple of uh comments uh super chats quickly uh the engaged view says i

00:58:02.660 agree with stelis's arguments but it'd be easier to support his positions if you ran a comb through

00:58:05.860 his hair yeah stelis i didn't want to bring it up right i don't like any haircut oh it like i hate

00:58:13.300 getting a haircut i can tell honestly and oh it's because they're all turkish barbers isn't it

00:58:18.820 i've actually found non you know i found yeah please oh you tell me afterwards um

00:58:25.060 secret don't shut down this is a nice philosophical discussion but it doesn't dissuade me from my belief

00:58:30.180 that communists need to be driven back to hell with a flaming sword well that's what we're trying

00:58:33.380 to explain is necessary um matthew says a great thinker james lindsey thinks he is then why is he

00:58:39.380 having such a hard time making the complex understandable about what he really means by

00:58:43.300 work right because if he said that what he really meant by work right he would essentially have to

00:58:48.260 admit that in his most fundamental presuppositions he's a communist look forward to that being clipped

00:58:53.780 i also think that simple people try and sound smart and smart people try and sound simple

00:58:59.060 i've watched a bunch of james lindsey's sophistry on twitter the other day he was like well look

00:59:03.540 they're they're putting their ethos under their logos ethos means ethics it's like no ethos means

00:59:09.860 authority that's how these are aristotle's three methods of persuasion you've got logic authority

00:59:15.620 and persuasion and emotion and uh james lindsey just didn't even do the basic using it's just

00:59:21.700 jargon is one of the most pathetic things to my mind i've i've been through the whole thing where

00:59:26.580 i've had to read neuroscience papers and it's just a lot of a lot of work to understand words but if

00:59:32.660 you're willing to put it in you anyone can do it so it's not impressive it doesn't make you look

00:59:37.620 smart and it makes you a bad communicator it's a gatekeeping mechanism that's what it is and it's

00:59:41.540 a way of bamboozling people who don't properly understand the subject that's why i i wasn't

00:59:46.180 impressed with lindsey's arguments but anyway we'll leave there and uh we'll move on okay so we might

00:59:53.540 be bringing some animals back from extinction very soon and this is obviously quite controversial and

01:00:00.260 i'm going to be talking about the ethics of this and and i i know carl as the resident luddite you

01:00:05.540 might have some reservations no i want mammoths to come back all right well i agree but i think that

01:00:13.460 part of um our duty on this planet to sound a little bit like an environmentalist i have talked

01:00:19.380 about environmentalism on my show before but i have a very different view than that that of the

01:00:23.940 left i i sort of really like the biblical view of stewardship over the land you're you're sort of

01:00:30.020 like a shepherd to all of of life on earth and you have a duty um that no animals go extinct under

01:00:38.580 your watch and i think that that's a fair thing to say um and i think that if they have gone extinct

01:00:44.580 they should be um reintroduced into the wild if they went extinct because of modern human action

01:00:51.700 so i i don't necessarily mean here i don't necessarily mean like you know we should bring

01:00:56.900 back dinosaurs i don't want your answer of that but i'm not in favor of reintroducing wolves into

01:01:02.100 the english countryside well wolves haven't gone extinct from the planet have they no but they weren't

01:01:06.420 extinct from england who cares about that then there's plenty of we've got no shortage of wolves okay

01:01:11.940 just checking i i just i think that the loss of an animal species is like the burning of a sacred

01:01:17.220 piece of art it's it's a real travesty it's a real loss to the experience of life on planet earth i

01:01:24.100 don't know i think when we exterminate like eye worms from the congo or something it's in the congo who

01:01:30.180 cares exactly see i don't know i i think yeah but i'm on about europe oh right okay and north america okay

01:01:36.900 places where we actually have the capacity to wipe it's certain kinds of animals right it's animals that we

01:01:41.780 personally find aesthetically pleasing or have a significant role in the ecosystem for example

01:01:47.300 so i'm going to ask a question um if tapeworms go extinct we're not going to cry about it oh i

01:01:52.340 don't care about tapeworms horrible creatures um so just because we can do it doesn't mean we we

01:01:58.340 should because may i remind you both of the quote um from jeff goldblum's character in jurassic park

01:02:05.140 your scientists were so preoccupied with whether um or not they could they didn't stop to think if they

01:02:10.740 should yes do you agree with this in this context yes you do hang on a minute sorry could

01:02:17.060 you please repeat it basically no just because we could bring back um extinct versions of tapeworms

01:02:24.740 should we well i don't mean tapeworms no no i do i want to use the worst possible example

01:02:31.300 right i should bring back historical personalities well no the the point is it forces you to be

01:02:37.700 uh more specific with what you're saying um yeah okay all animals yeah okay not all animals but some

01:02:43.460 animals that are noble and otherwise aesthetically pleasing to us uh or you know fun to hunt or something

01:02:49.780 like that uh that that that's fine tapeworms for my enemies fluffy animals for me

01:02:57.380 prehistoric kittens for me sure yeah although they'd probably be pretty lethal so one animal is

01:03:03.700 this is the pyridion ibex obviously incredibly impressive we should definitely bring it so i'm

01:03:11.620 going to use this as a little story to introduce people into the concept of how this would go about

01:03:16.420 and then i'm going to talk about a few other animals that what was that sorry i'd like to hunt

01:03:20.500 one yeah well we need to bring them back first so it was found in the mountains of northern spain

01:03:25.940 and portugal and southern france surprise surprise that's where the pyrenees are and it went extinct on

01:03:31.300 january 2000 when a falling tree landed on the last surviving member of the species might explain why

01:03:37.220 they weren't extinct um they're at the top of a mountain in a fallen tree i know it's bad isn't it

01:03:43.860 but anyway um less than a year before she died this final um example of the species biologists took

01:03:50.260 skin biopsies of from her ears and put them into cold storage because believe it or not when you

01:03:56.260 have the last of something you try and preserve it don't you and this allows for the sequencing of

01:04:00.820 their genome and there's a company called advanced cell technology working with the spanish government

01:04:06.420 and other researchers which have sought to revive this species of ibex and reintroduce it and um

01:04:13.300 what they do need for this though is a species that is closely related that is able to carry

01:04:19.060 the embryo to term and this is a massive issue with renewing the populations of white rhinoceros

01:04:26.420 for example and also the babies need a similar gestation period and also birth weight as well

01:04:33.220 because of course they've got to be born and also you need to implant the embryo at just the right

01:04:38.740 moment and so there's lots of different factors and then they i think they got to the point where

01:04:45.220 they produced 500 cloned embryos and they implanted 154 into various female ibexes that were related to

01:04:52.260 this species and only five ended up pregnant and then only one managed to give birth and then it had

01:04:58.340 a normal heartbeat its eyes were wide open it was actively kicking its legs uh she just couldn't breathe and

01:05:04.580 and it died and so it's one of the few species that actually has gone extinct twice

01:05:10.020 um so researchers learned that the cloned goat had been born with an extra lobe in her left lung

01:05:15.780 which took up too much space in her chest and kept the lung from inflating properly

01:05:19.860 and so they were relatively close um but this is directly from the researchers physical defects in

01:05:25.620 the lung as well as in other organs have been reported in neonatal cloned sheep that have failed to

01:05:29.300 to survive as well and so this seems to be one of the problems that they need to crack

01:05:34.260 and they said at present it can be assumed that cloning is not a very effective way to

01:05:38.340 preserve endangered species however in species such as the bocado cloning is only possible to avoid its

01:05:44.740 complete disappearance and i think that's another name for this ibex so they've advised taking tissue

01:05:50.900 and cell samples from endangered species to make sure that when we do have the technology in the future

01:05:55.780 we can revive them if they do go extinct and i very much support that even though you know my

01:06:02.340 um opinions on cloning particularly people i feel like there's got to be some very strong

01:06:07.860 ethical constraints on this otherwise it could go down a worrying direction i want a clone i want

01:06:14.260 a clone of myself so he can do half the work i do that would be nice wouldn't it i have thought about

01:06:18.740 that before you want a meanie me yeah yeah i do a lot of work and i deserve a day off that's all i'm saying

01:06:25.460 so if you want to uh fund carl's clone program you can sign up to our website but what you can also

01:06:31.940 do now this is a new feature that we have released today well at the time of recording anyway um you

01:06:38.980 can purchase and gift subscriptions to people and um if you want to know how to do the process it is

01:06:45.380 very simple um it's right at the top of our faq which is on uh right at the bottom um on our website

01:06:52.740 so there's a video showing you how to do it so there's no excuse you've got to got to send out

01:06:58.500 those gifts because carl needs his clone yeah i can't get close if you want more carls in this world

01:07:03.140 you need to sign up to our website imagine how much content if i'd if i was battery cloning

01:07:07.780 like me by the end of the by the end of this like 90 percent of youtube don't do it too much you

01:07:13.700 you still need some variety of you know opinions you still need say employees oh yeah sure good

01:07:19.860 point good point we're gonna call josh next oh that works to be fair quite in demand these days anyway

01:07:27.540 let's have a look at something else um i believe there should be a picture there samson would you

01:07:35.700 be able to pull it up um so rather than spoiling that so i think we're both familiar with the tasmanian

01:07:42.580 tiger yeah um so there should be a photograph here there we go um this is the tasmanian tiger last

01:07:49.380 photograph this is the final one in 1933 obviously this has been colorized um so europeans in tasmania

01:07:57.060 basically blamed them for killing sheep and chickens and things and they believed that they

01:08:00.580 were interfering with livestock maybe they were who knows um but they exchanged their pelts for

01:08:06.500 government bounties and this meant that thousands of them were slaughtered and they became extinct

01:08:11.540 because it turns out if the government interferes even in nature it causes problems there's something

01:08:17.060 of a cryptid now actually because i've seen uh you know videos of people oh i've seen those

01:08:22.340 tasmanian tiger or something like that and australia is a big place

01:08:24.980 you know so maybe well these are tasmanian so no no but they they could be on it could be in

01:08:30.180 australia too so you know they're saying oh in the australian outback something there's still them

01:08:34.740 who knows i don't know but so just quick thing i'm not that synthetic i think if something goes extinct

01:08:40.340 it's kind of kind of sucked but it went extinct because we deliberately targeted it and obviously

01:08:48.260 if we deliberately target anything eventually we'll make it extinct so i feel like we have a duty to

01:08:54.740 to look after these animals i think god created these animals and it's not up to you to kill them

01:08:59.700 okay we should bring dinosaurs back after they were your atheist rationalistic mind yeah no i'm a bit

01:09:06.100 more nietzschean on this i'm like no i'm darwinian it's the survival of the fittest and if you look if

01:09:11.700 you died off then you didn't deserve to survive this is my view on politics but but when it comes to

01:09:16.900 animals i have a different view i'm a hypocrite humans have the capacity to survive in in these

01:09:26.580 circumstances animals don't but it was tasmania's apex predator and so it occupied a very important

01:09:34.020 niche in controlling certain populations and things would be better if they were knocking about again

01:09:40.180 but anyway colossal biosciences a company that's texas based announced it plans to bring it back

01:09:46.020 they made this announcement in august of 2022 they also plan to bring back the woolly mammoth and

01:09:50.660 they've also received significant funding apparently just for this project alone they've received five

01:09:54.740 million australian dollars from one donor and haven't disclosed how much they've received from

01:09:59.380 other people as well um but previous attempts to bring it back were quite underfunded relative to

01:10:05.380 this one so it seems like it's going to be successful and at the point they said they're

01:10:10.740 in the process of sequencing the genome um it's also not an easy thing to do as well because we only

01:10:17.540 recently sequenced the human genome and of course there's no shortage of humans um i am one uh despite um

01:10:25.700 popular belief um josh's mark zuckerberg moment i was human once well normally the allegations are

01:10:33.140 sort of vampire or otherworldly creature which you know smidgen of truth but anyway um they've almost

01:10:42.020 completed this was october of this year um the genome which is quite impressive because they took the

01:10:48.980 genome um i believe from uh just a museum sample and they said the genome is more than 99.9 complete

01:10:57.460 with just 45 gaps which will soon be closed which is very impressive actually and they said the next

01:11:04.980 goal is to have a de-extincted phylocene-ish thing that's their words that's that's what the lab has said

01:11:12.100 very scientific yeah the thing is there's there is this kind of again the sort of the jurassic park

01:11:17.380 thing was this wasn't really a dinosaur well this is a kind of modern interpretation of a dinosaur

01:11:22.260 well what they said is it might be 90 phylocene though the ultimate goal eventually through breeding

01:11:28.900 will be 99.999 phylocene again it's always going to be slightly inauthentic ever so slightly but then

01:11:37.540 again there's there'll be enough um you know inauthentic dna that with enough generations of

01:11:44.500 breeding it will disappear eventually and what their plan is is that eventually they'll get to

01:11:48.820 a point where they can breed around 100 individuals and that's enough genetic diversity to release them

01:11:54.020 back into the wild and not have too many problems they're not all going to be cousins and what have

01:11:58.420 you supposedly i don't know yeah something something will happen i'm not um like woolly mammoths roaming

01:12:04.020 siberia again that'd be cool speaking of which um the woolly mammoth apparently this same lab

01:12:10.660 is working on it and i'm going to read a quote here ben lamb co-founder and ceo of colossal bioscience

01:12:15.460 told live science the company aims to produce its first mammoth lookalike calves by 2028 so it's only

01:12:23.700 about three years away now it's highly likely that one could see another species before then as well

01:12:28.820 so this seems to be coming about now that we're going to be able to bring animals back from extinction

01:12:35.380 um so the way that it works here is that they insert mammoth genes into the genome of asian

01:12:40.340 elephants its closest living relative and they've also fully sequenced the asian and african elephant

01:12:45.860 genomes as well so that's another roadblock out of the way so it seems to be coming along and we can

01:12:50.500 finally have our mammoth burgers because of course it's similar to um how hunting promotes the

01:12:55.860 preservation of animals because the hunters have a vested interest well farming you know one of the most

01:13:01.780 populous animals in in the world are chickens and that's because we like eating them cows yeah pigs

01:13:07.380 there definitely weren't this many cows and pigs around before we started husbanding them if you

01:13:11.140 want more mammoths start eating them yeah no i no no but that's true and i think that's a cool thing

01:13:15.780 you know we have a mammoth range go hunt yourself a mammoth eat it don't apply that to people if you're

01:13:21.460 concerned about human birth rates though don't start eating elon stop the papi new guineans have

01:13:26.500 already got that covered we don't need any more of that um but it also seems to be the case that

01:13:32.820 the dodo is going to come back this is from march of 2022 um apparently there was a small slice of

01:13:38.420 fragment of the dodo um which they could extract dna from the natural history museum so our 19th century

01:13:45.460 um eccentrics collecting animal specimens have actually sort of helped us out here so the anglo

01:13:51.380 autism has has led to a rejuvenation of animal life there we go quick thing on the dodo though

01:13:57.860 apparently they tasted awful really yeah well i don't know eat one then yeah because aren't they

01:14:03.540 closely related to pigeons and pigeons are great i i've never had pigeon but the the reports at the

01:14:08.980 time were just that it was really like fatty and not really edible is it a bit like duck no no no

01:14:15.140 well yeah but duck's nice but apparently the dodo was just really not not good to eat and this is

01:14:20.580 from like 17th century standards imagine the guy you know so like and they were probably like

01:14:25.380 starving on exactly yeah yeah exactly they were like oh great a bird uh so apparently yeah no we

01:14:31.060 can bring back dodos but only as a comic relief keep them in zoos or as pets or something i guess

01:14:37.940 and uh apparently um the closest living relative there's a little diagram here explaining how it

01:14:43.460 works for the dodo is the nicobar pigeon and which it diverged from 43 million years ago so that's

01:14:49.460 quite a distance but apparently they're um going to slowly introduce dna into some select uh in

01:14:56.420 captivity pigeons obviously and then eventually um you'll get to the point where there's enough code

01:15:02.820 in one of the embryos that it can be carried by a chicken surrogate um which is sounding very

01:15:08.420 convoluted it's a bit mad scientist-esque now cheeto chicken carried the genome at dodo

01:15:14.020 cheeto yeah cheeto so yeah i'm quite i i prefer like the other approach which is reverse engineering

01:15:22.020 uh the sort of the latent dna in chickens to give them teeth and stuff like that i reverse engineer

01:15:27.620 a dinosaur i have a chicken that's good i'm all for that yeah i mean it's probably incredibly

01:15:33.700 unethical to do these things but i i am sort of curious just to see what monsters we can create even

01:15:39.140 though i don't think it's probably a good thing for humanity and it could be our you know aren't

01:15:43.860 doing bringing back aliens will come back to our planet and see well what happened to all these

01:15:48.100 humans that we're knocking about and it turns out we genetically engineered a super chicken that killed

01:15:52.980 us all or something like that but obviously it's in its infancy i don't think it's as much of a danger

01:15:59.940 quite yet as ai unless you get squashed by a woolly mammoth but they're probably all going to be in

01:16:04.500 siberia anyway so who cares and then the final thing i wanted to touch on is the passenger pigeon

01:16:09.460 and i think this is one of the ones that is probably the best candidate for bringing back because it's

01:16:15.300 it was very very populous and it was explicitly brought to extinction by human hunting so what is

01:16:21.940 a passenger pigeon uh one of those oh right okay it's just a kind of pigeon so it was once the most

01:16:28.260 abundant bird in north america and this this was crazy to me the flocks were so vast that they took

01:16:33.940 days to pass overhead and they blocked out the sun so the cumulative beat of their wings was so

01:16:40.180 powerful that the ground beneath them chilled underneath them and it's estimated that they

01:16:44.980 numbered in the billions um before human beings started hunting them all right and we just shot

01:16:50.100 them we just shot that we had competitions where we just shoot but there are billions of them well

01:16:56.580 that's what they thought and look what happened um so they went extinct before any meaningful effort

01:17:02.420 could be um begun to save them and the last individual in captivity called martha died in

01:17:08.340 cincinnati zoo on the first of september 1914 so um there were many museum specimens to actually extract

01:17:17.220 dna from and they're very genetically similar to the band-tailed pigeon which is another common

01:17:22.740 species of pigeon so this one should be quite easy to bring back and might be one of the candidates for

01:17:27.620 the most likely and also the least objectionable because they're a pigeon yeah they'll fly about

01:17:33.860 but i would be curious to see these these massive clouds of pigeon i wouldn't want to stand underneath

01:17:38.740 it yeah no not without an umbrella um but what do you think now i've laid it out you think we need to

01:17:46.340 bring these animals back yeah i think i think we should i know you want dinosaurs carl well i mean

01:17:52.180 push the dinosaurs out there are definite ethic ethical questions but like be interesting

01:17:58.980 do you do you not feel the obligation to bring these things back the humanity wiped out and it was

01:18:03.860 our our actions our irresponsible attitude towards the natural world that's brought this about

01:18:09.700 well again i'm more of a ruthless darwinian when it comes to this sort of stuff but why can't you

01:18:14.180 be more like that in politics leave the poor innocent animals out of it they've not done anything

01:18:19.700 human beings deserve it sure but i don't know i'm like i'm joking by the way if if an animal can't

01:18:25.700 survive in the modern world then it's not fit for survival so but also if we applied that attitude to

01:18:31.620 all living things we'd be the only living thing other than maybe bacteria i don't agree there are

01:18:36.100 loads of animals that fit for survival that's why we farm them i mean carl i think the most resilient

01:18:41.700 resilience isn't necessarily an indication of worth because for instance if there is a nuclear holocaust

01:18:47.620 and things get destroyed i think the only two species that are going to survive are going to be

01:18:52.580 cockroaches and crocodiles i wouldn't want to be a cockroach i'm not saying you you're going to become

01:18:58.900 a cockroach what what i'm saying is uh absent a nuclear holocaust um a thing has to be able to exist

01:19:06.340 and be able to get along on its own and if it's silly you know because the thing is we can't just hand

01:19:11.220 hold every species exactly that's why we don't want them to go extinct no no well you don't people

01:19:17.300 like these pigeons were just firing into the the big crowds and just wiping them out for sport in a

01:19:22.580 sort of sadistic evil well there are a billion of them and we still killed them that's bad 75

01:19:30.420 billion chickens per year do we that's a lot of chickens i contribute my my fair share i think

01:19:36.340 but yeah i mean i'm not against them doing this um you know no do with interesting animals i'd love

01:19:41.700 to see a mammoth you know that'd be cool so massive like you know they're genuinely gargantuan uh so

01:19:47.860 that'd be an interesting thing i want to bring back saber-toothed tigers and have them patrolling the

01:19:51.460 coastline along like greece and italy just to keep the migrant caravans out maybe introduce the

01:19:57.700 saber-toothed tower do you know it's a barbary lion to take out a few something that's really

01:20:02.260 interesting about the saber-toothed tigers they keep evolving it's like things turning into crabs

01:20:06.820 and tortoises turtles like the the body shape just keeps evolving and so there are three different

01:20:12.900 unrelated species of what we call saber-toothed tigers and they just evolved into that yeah they

01:20:17.700 just keep evolving these giant sabers and because apparently they're useful to have a couple of

01:20:22.420 massive daggers i suppose it's why there's a came and an alligator and a crocodile right

01:20:26.180 yeah they're all basically that's applying the same body shape just keeps coming back same with

01:20:30.580 crabs there are loads of things we call crabs that aren't crabs they just look like crabs and

01:20:35.220 so it's just like okay well i didn't realize this there's this great crab conspiracy but anyway

01:20:39.860 same with turtles like there are things that become turtles because it's a good body shape for

01:20:44.980 survival but i i feel like i survive better as a person than a turtle

01:20:49.220 you're not you know 100 million years old i just sound like i'm doubting evolution now but

01:20:56.100 anyway the point i'm trying to make here is that this is going on um whether you like it or not it

01:21:02.980 seems to be happening and maybe we can bring back some extinct species from beyond the grave and have

01:21:08.900 some nice mammoth burgers dragon lady christmas great point remember this when you extinct device

01:21:13.380 the gray squirrel yeah we're going to bring the red cam for bringing the red squirrel back because

01:21:17.300 i think peanut buck adorable yeah franken peanut yeah um right let's uh let's go to the video comments

01:21:29.460 um charlie uh also says uh uh by the way i personally see as sad as a modern joseph tito

01:21:36.020 a dictator that was able to rule multi-athletic multi-religious state and just as what happened when

01:21:40.020 tito died i suspect the same will happen now sad has gone yeah doubtless um nothing good's coming

01:21:46.100 here i hope to see um i hope this means sorry that we get the american carrier pigeon back i'd love to

01:21:51.700 see the massive flocks of them flying in the world well there we go they presage what i was going to

01:21:55.540 talk about by this logic we should bring back the neanderthal um i think we've already got the french

01:22:00.900 so we don't really need to double up on them were sophisticated and probably the reason that we're

01:22:06.980 like you know intelligent and creative i think we could give ourselves a bit more credit than that

01:22:12.820 but i i i want to i want to reclaim the the good name of neanderthals i do know that neanderthals um

01:22:19.460 ozzy osborne has a disproportionate amount of from them so before he dies they need to extract his dna

01:22:26.260 ozzy osborne 32 neanderthal i think he was something like seven or eight percent which is a lot

01:22:32.340 the average european's like two or three percent yeah yeah maybe brummies are just the lost tribes

01:22:38.340 of neanderthals it would make so much sense that's very funny let's get the first video coming

01:22:46.260 we can't hear it samson the onion stellios you you've got a strange looking face yeah

01:22:52.180 that is what is this i have good here yeah i have good here yeah silence there's there's no

01:22:58.820 one of deception yeah they're meant to be audio no but that's the onion of deception very clearly

01:23:06.260 it looks very sacred thanks yeah for such a uh unholy artifact why does it look so godly

01:23:14.100 because it is godly it always looks good that's the point ah yeah good point let's go to the next

01:23:22.180 one vox populi chat wanted me to do redwood tree week and that's coming soon first some groundwork

01:23:28.420 there are just three extant species coast redwood is the most famous one everyone knows it has the

01:23:33.940 biggest range from coastal california up into oregon giant sequoia live in a narrow range opposite the

01:23:40.180 other side of the valley within california only last is the dawn redwood which was only confirmed

01:23:45.700 to exist in the 1960s due to its extreme rarity and it's native to china oh i didn't expect that to

01:23:54.580 be native to china well there we go at least it's the least populous one talking about invasive species

01:24:01.620 like that we're being racist to foreign trees you need to step up your racism game carl you need to

01:24:07.620 be racist against trees now let's get the next one the old bridge of biddeford dates back in its

01:24:12.660 original wooden construction to 1280 being rebuilt in stone during the 1500s despite the new material

01:24:18.740 the uneven width of each of the arches was retained likely due to the known footings of each base local

01:24:24.260 parishes were required to contribute to the upkeep for each arch so poorer ones could be assigned smaller

01:24:28.900 spans widening and reconstruction have always taken care to leave the previous structures visible

01:24:34.340 the trust is a delightful story of a strange annual payment of 10 shillings 50p for the right to drive

01:24:40.100 sheep over the bridge last exercised in 2012. very cool i uh went through biddeford to play golf this

01:24:48.420 summer um so that was the last time i was there but yeah north devon uh that's where part of my family

01:24:54.340 comes from so very soft spot for me let's go to the next one do you have any idea how much diesel they

01:25:02.340 have to burn to mix that much concrete or make that steel and haul this out here and put it together

01:25:07.620 with a 450 foot crane you want to guess how much oil it takes to lubricate that thing or winterize it

01:25:13.380 in its 20 year lifespan it won't offset the carbon footprint of making it and don't get me started on

01:25:18.580 solar panels and the lithium in your tesla battery and never mind the fact that if the whole world

01:25:24.180 decided to go electric tomorrow we don't have the transmission lines to get the electricity to the

01:25:28.900 cities always winterize your wind turbines uh something i'm very concerned about yeah the the giant

01:25:39.780 um phallic symbols of vanity aren't they really of the eco people i might i might be sold on if they

01:25:46.500 were i think they're just crap yeah they're ugly and disgusting and a waste of time they're just

01:25:52.180 and the thing is they're just crap oh it's not windy today no electricity for you uh funny we've got the

01:25:56.820 nuclear power plant let's say something very controversial but i think the the old-timey

01:26:01.860 coal power plants look quite cool and you know having these big things billowing smoke out it's still

01:26:07.860 pretty cool and i don't mind seeing them over seeing wind turbines ruining lovely country views

01:26:14.020 turn turn the cities into horrible smoky hellholes like they used to be they use most of the power

01:26:18.500 anyway make them do it let's go to the next one

01:26:24.660 at least that makes me feel very good about myself now that i'm actually trying to learn how to draw

01:26:30.900 i'm loving the lotus eaters daily that's a really great idea and i just need to keep practicing so

01:26:37.620 i can draw some furry pawn and send it to stellio so i can traumatize him further you don't need to

01:26:44.900 be scared of my comments still is i i don't bite unless you want me to but that's fine your comments

01:26:52.580 always bite sophie okay let's go to the next one now that the asset regime has been removed

01:27:02.260 i assume all these people will be returning home and any new applications from syria will be rejected

01:27:10.660 uh apparently yes uh austria and germany have refused new applications of course there there's

01:27:15.780 going to be a wave of people who are fleeing jihadis shortly i imagine um is there another

01:27:20.500 one something there is blimey all right on the left side of my screen i have the california electoral

01:27:26.500 votes uh for trump v harris and on the right i have in orange all the harris votes or people who intend

01:27:33.700 to vote for harris if they were able to vote in the u.s election and all the blue ones are for trump

01:27:38.180 and i have to go all the way down to romania before i find an equivalent to california that is insane the

01:27:45.060 only ones that are willing to vote for trump over harris are russia serbia georgia hungary

01:27:49.220 bulgaria moldova slovakia slovenia that's it see i think the republicans should definitely be looking

01:27:56.180 at california and new york and not blue states like six million trump votes so you can get on the ground

01:28:03.380 get something do something about it you know come on like if i were the for the democrats i'd be like

01:28:08.820 christ why are we why have we lost 40 of the votes well you should be looking for complete

01:28:14.660 victory like any state being blue is a failure yeah exactly yeah get in there do deal with them

01:28:22.820 um kevin says alnustra appears to be biden and starmer's middle eastern blm they'll use them when

01:28:28.340 it's convenient to remove someone they can't control and then deny having ever liked them when the people

01:28:32.500 they put in charge show the true colors yeah that's basically how they're going to be used and um

01:28:36.580 it's not gonna be good um right let's go for one last comment uh maria says middle east has been

01:28:41.620 is and will continue to be too riven uh to be riven with tribal and religious conflicts the west should

01:28:47.860 treat any islamic land or grouping as a potential enemy um i don't know if we necessarily have to

01:28:52.020 treat them as an enemy but i think we should definitely just assume that they're going to be

01:29:01.380 too parochial to try and build into coalitions frankly that's how i'd be it anyway we are out of

01:29:07.540 time there folks so thank you so much for joining us uh we will be back tomorrow at the same time

01:29:12.580 and in the meantime if you want to support us go and buy someone a gift subscription to the website

01:29:17.220 see you tomorrow

01:29:33.860 you

The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - December 09, 2024

The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #1059

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