The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #951

00:00:00.000 Hello, and welcome to Podcasts of the Loders Eaters, episode 951 on the 8th of July 2024.

00:00:08.520 I am joined by Josh.

00:00:10.040 Hello.

00:00:10.620 And Calvin.

00:00:11.620 Who's not here yet.

00:00:12.300 Who isn't here, yes. But he will be here. He's just, I don't know what he's doing. Is he blessing loaves or something?

00:00:17.560 I think what's happening is Keir Starmer has been in office for a few days and he's already made the trains not run on time.

00:00:23.820 Oh, I see. Yes, it could be that. Yes, or tending to the need. I don't know.

00:00:27.160 But he will be here, we are promised, at some point during the first segment.

00:00:33.020 A couple of announcements. We didn't get all the video comments on election night and also we kind of need to make more time for our lovely, lovely subs because you all adore us so much.

00:00:43.740 And so therefore, the third segment today is going to be all about you guys.

00:00:46.560 We do the video comments that we missed and if you get your comments in, we try and do a lot more of those.

00:00:52.540 I'm hearing that Calvin might have arrived. Oh, here we go. Look at that.

00:00:55.860 Wow. Right. Brace yourselves, ladies and gentlemen.

00:00:59.780 Just in the nick of time.

00:01:00.800 Cameras are being enabled.

00:01:03.460 Calvin is seating.

00:01:04.800 That's the most dramatic timing possible there.

00:01:06.840 Hello, hello. How are we doing, chaps?

00:01:09.440 Very well indeed, sir. How are you?

00:01:11.180 Glad I could make it.

00:01:12.060 Good.

00:01:12.640 Good.

00:01:13.200 Yes, so, extra video comments.

00:01:15.200 We've got some rumble rants that we can stick in as well, but we're going to do both.

00:01:20.080 We're going to do rumble rants and we're going to do our lovely subscriber ones.

00:01:24.520 And also, apparently, I've got to let you know that the Islander magazine has started going out, but they do it in batches, apparently.

00:01:30.920 So, some of you will get it and then some more and then some more, whatever, that kind of thing.

00:01:35.180 Right.

00:01:35.380 I have an announcement before you get going.

00:01:38.180 I'm not very well, so please be nice to me.

00:01:40.800 Yes.

00:01:41.500 I had an emergency dental appointment with the NHS yesterday because I've got a wisdom tooth coming through and I have an infection.

00:01:50.020 So, I'm feeling absolutely awful.

00:01:51.680 I'm on every painkiller under the sun.

00:01:54.300 I'm basically Joe Biden.

00:01:55.620 I'm so drugged up.

00:01:56.640 Are you going to be ripped out?

00:01:58.000 No, actually.

00:01:59.200 It's just particularly bad in growing through.

00:02:01.880 But we're really short-staffed.

00:02:03.860 Carl and Connor in America.

00:02:05.940 Harry's up north somewhere.

00:02:07.500 Who knows?

00:02:08.120 He's feral.

00:02:09.040 And Stelios is getting married.

00:02:10.780 So, to keep the podcast going, I've come in even though I feel awful.

00:02:14.960 Oh, good man.

00:02:15.780 But, yes.

00:02:17.060 Enough moping about myself.

00:02:18.540 Why don't you leave this into your segment?

00:02:20.640 Yes.

00:02:22.220 So, you may remember this zero seats campaign.

00:02:26.220 Obviously, we talked about it a lot.

00:02:29.000 So, if you watch Lotus Eaters at all, you've probably heard us talking about it.

00:02:32.820 So, I'm going to talk a little bit about the origin of this.

00:02:35.700 This was, of course, started by Dr. Nima Parvini that goes by Academic Agent Online.

00:02:41.600 And here's the video that sort of kick-started it where it was an AI-edited Rishi Sunak talking about how the Conservative Party should be destroyed because they've betrayed this country, which is true.

00:02:52.940 They have.

00:02:58.140 Sorry, keep going.

00:03:00.440 Okay.

00:03:00.680 And that was actually created by...

00:03:06.680 Torrin Fowl something?

00:03:09.460 Yes, up here.

00:03:10.220 My stream deck is not working.

00:03:11.620 It's all going wrong.

00:03:12.820 It's like election night all over again.

00:03:14.600 But this person right here, to give them credit, they were the ones that created the video for him.

00:03:19.160 So, well done to them.

00:03:20.640 He also did our election preview teaser video and a whole bunch of other ones, actually.

00:03:27.740 So, yes, if you're watching, thank you very much.

00:03:29.960 That was some great work right there.

00:03:31.940 Skilled individual.

00:03:33.000 Mm-hmm.

00:03:34.240 So, here he is, the man who started the meme, talking to Jacob Rees-Mogg.

00:03:41.360 And in this interview, he actually dropped the zero seats to the Conservative leader of the House of Commons, which I think is quite the thing to do in the interview.

00:03:52.280 And did it subtly.

00:03:53.040 So, he sort of didn't pick up on it.

00:03:55.120 And funnily enough, following this, Jacob Rees-Mogg lost his seat.

00:03:59.140 So, maybe it worked a bit like a curse, where, you know, he said zero seats and he disappeared.

00:04:05.680 Mogg's all right.

00:04:06.340 He's back on GB News tonight.

00:04:07.820 He's okay.

00:04:09.500 He's certainly not one of the most egregious Conservatives.

00:04:12.220 I'll give him that.

00:04:13.420 No.

00:04:14.200 I think the criticism being levelled at him, in particular, is that he should have put his faith first.

00:04:18.540 If he stuck to his faith, he would have been more Conservative in his policies, rather than saying, oh, I separate the two.

00:04:23.840 My faith will not dictate how I vote.

00:04:25.560 Well, it should dictate how you vote, mate.

00:04:27.180 Well, yeah.

00:04:27.600 I think that a lot of the time, the Conservatives have been guilty of putting party politics above their own personal principles.

00:04:34.500 Above the nation.

00:04:35.460 Exactly.

00:04:36.660 And I think that that is very short-sighted and part of the reason why they've done so poorly.

00:04:41.700 And so, this meme has carried on to lots of other outlets.

00:04:45.180 They've been talking about zero seats for the Conservatives.

00:04:48.540 And it's been great.

00:04:49.580 It's been quite a successful thing.

00:04:51.460 And I'm glad to see that it's been spreading.

00:04:53.720 And, of course, our election night coverage, which I am incredibly proud of, and all of our team.

00:04:59.320 It was not only great fun, but I feel like everyone involved enjoyed it.

00:05:04.040 But, yes, we went with the theme of zero seats.

00:05:06.460 You can see it.

00:05:07.720 Oh, that's not right.

00:05:09.440 In our coverage here.

00:05:11.140 So, here it is.

00:05:12.280 So, it's been pretty important.

00:05:13.800 And, of course, our election stream was the biggest election stream in the UK, which, you know, I'm going to take this small moment to brag a little bit.

00:05:22.480 Absolutely.

00:05:23.200 But barring the BBC, but they're next.

00:05:26.840 Eh.

00:05:27.380 We're overtapped the BBC.

00:05:28.820 But, yeah, I think we got to about 80,000 live viewers at one point, which is pretty big for, you know, late at night, isn't it?

00:05:35.440 Well, and that we didn't have $4.3 billion in funding.

00:05:38.480 That's true.

00:05:39.580 Yes.

00:05:39.900 But we beat Channel 4, ITV, GB News, LBC, Talk Radio.

00:05:44.120 We beat them all.

00:05:44.960 We didn't have any advertisers.

00:05:46.360 It's all funded from you people at home.

00:05:48.740 So, you made this happen.

00:05:49.900 Thank you very much.

00:05:50.800 Yeah, it's well done.

00:05:51.160 But it's not just about bragging for us.

00:05:53.580 It's about the fact that people are fed up of the legacy media.

00:05:56.060 The mainstream media is the establishment.

00:05:58.040 They're part of the problem.

00:05:59.260 People are awake to that.

00:06:00.620 And, yeah.

00:06:01.180 So, well done for making it happen.

00:06:03.340 This couldn't have succeeded as much as it had without you people at home.

00:06:07.120 And let's talk a little bit about the results because the Conservatives did not achieve zero seats.

00:06:12.780 But this is the lowest number of seats since the formation of the modern Conservative Party in the 1830s at 121.

00:06:21.640 So, the camera is in the way.

00:06:23.880 But they did get zero seats in Wales.

00:06:25.680 That's true.

00:06:26.560 So, if you're Welsh and you said zero seats, it actually came true.

00:06:30.160 And Cornwall and Devon.

00:06:31.300 Oh, okay.

00:06:31.700 That's true.

00:06:32.480 Oh.

00:06:34.240 South West Devon was still Conservative.

00:06:36.320 Oh, did it?

00:06:36.900 Yeah.

00:06:37.120 That's my home constituency.

00:06:38.640 Oh, we wore that bit off then.

00:06:39.900 But, yeah.

00:06:41.760 Sorry about that.

00:06:43.360 Who's your MP, by the way?

00:06:45.360 It used to be Gary Streeter, but it was someone, a lady this time that I didn't recognise.

00:06:49.920 They let ladies run for Parliament these days.

00:06:52.180 But, yes, they still lost 251 seats, which is massive.

00:06:57.220 So, it certainly wasn't a good time for them.

00:06:59.660 And I thought it'd be good to talk about some of the senior Conservatives that lost their seats so we can gloat a little bit and enjoy it and make the most

00:07:06.900 Yes, that'd be fun.

00:07:07.680 What could have been better, but it's still somewhat of a victory, I feel.

00:07:11.940 So, obviously, one of them is former Prime Minister Liz Truss, who I think actually people warmed to after she came out of office and started repeating a lot of talking points that we have been saying.

00:07:23.720 And she's also been very useful in understanding how the Civil Service and the sort of Bank of England and all these sorts of unelected bureaucrats get in the way of elected politicians actually doing stuff.

00:07:35.840 I mean, given that she's a Tory, I quite like her.

00:07:38.020 But it is a phenomena that when politicians leave office, they always become a lot more sensible.

00:07:44.060 To be fair, I've always liked her.

00:07:45.720 I don't support her policies.

00:07:46.960 I think she's a massive neolib, but I've always liked her.

00:07:49.720 The problem is, once she left office, she went more conservative.

00:07:52.240 She dropped her neolib policies and went more in line with where the rest of us are.

00:07:56.260 So, I think that's populism.

00:07:57.720 But it didn't work out for her.

00:07:59.620 However, if she'd have remained in office, we might have been in a different position than what we're in right now.

00:08:03.320 That's true.

00:08:03.880 Nobody wanted Rishi Suner.

00:08:04.960 So, I have two main criticisms of her.

00:08:07.240 I did quite like her sort of economic budget.

00:08:10.420 I thought that was actually quite good.

00:08:11.820 However, she should have stuck it out.

00:08:14.460 I think that stepping down was short-sighted.

00:08:16.740 And I also dislike that she comes out of office and then starts saying good things.

00:08:21.040 If you can't say what you believe as the Prime Minister, then what office do you need to speak your mind?

00:08:27.140 She needed better quality advisors.

00:08:29.020 Because there were some of us who saw that Bank of England stitch up as it was unfolding.

00:08:33.020 And she clearly didn't have anyone who could see it in her team.

00:08:35.560 And therefore, she accepted the mainstream media line that it was her fault.

00:08:39.200 And it wasn't.

00:08:39.680 It was a stitch up.

00:08:40.460 Yeah, the reason she – the moment she got rid of Quasi Quartank, her tenure was up.

00:08:44.240 She could not back herself when she got rid of the person who was responsible for her economic policies, which was all that she stood for.

00:08:50.120 You know, she had the IEA.

00:08:51.380 She had the – who else did she have?

00:08:53.020 The TPA.

00:08:53.740 She had all of those neoliberal economic think tanks backing her, giving her great policies.

00:08:58.220 But you're right.

00:08:59.080 She needed political advisors as well.

00:09:01.040 She didn't have the sound.

00:09:01.700 People who actually understood the underlying policy.

00:09:04.380 And how – well, how to implement it and when to implement it.

00:09:06.480 Not just to say, this is what we're doing, and then shake up the system.

00:09:08.920 Because the system did not want her in place to begin with.

00:09:11.340 So, of course, they were going to do everything they could to eject her.

00:09:13.340 And the money men have many ways to hurt you.

00:09:15.300 Indeed.

00:09:15.560 Indeed.

00:09:16.720 And another person who lost their seat was Penny Mordaunt.

00:09:20.420 Yes.

00:09:21.600 Sorry, I shouldn't have –

00:09:22.440 I'm glad about this one.

00:09:23.580 God.

00:09:24.560 This woman – the reason she gets on my nerves so much is because so many conservatives, so many members thought she was an actual conservative.

00:09:31.580 They're like, yeah, we need Penny as our leader.

00:09:33.140 Like, this is the woman who wants to trans kids.

00:09:35.900 This is the woman who thinks that a trans man is a woman or vice versa, whatever it is.

00:09:39.980 She's delusional.

00:09:41.280 She's captured because her – is it her twin brother or just a regular brother – is part of the LGB alphabet spaghetti community.

00:09:49.260 So, she is not conservative.

00:09:50.740 Well, her brother came out and said that the conservatives have been the most oppressive to LGBT people in history.

00:09:58.900 Oppressed in what way?

00:09:59.800 Oppressed in the opposite way, surely.

00:10:01.060 Most oppressive – what a load of nonsense.

00:10:02.960 They've done the most for them of any government in history.

00:10:05.980 But it's the alphabet people who are the most oppressive people.

00:10:08.180 I feel oppressed by the alphabet people.

00:10:09.880 I can't walk down my capital city without being attacked by child mutilation flags.

00:10:15.520 Even when I was doing a shop in Tesco, it's just like, this place is a safe space for LGBT people.

00:10:20.240 Where's the safe space for Christians?

00:10:22.680 Not even the church anymore, especially not in this country.

00:10:25.560 Which shop is unsafe for them?

00:10:27.860 Well, indeed.

00:10:28.960 John Lewis had the child mutilation flags.

00:10:31.220 Even Mox and Spencers had child mutilation flags.

00:10:33.420 Tesco had them.

00:10:34.540 Sainsbury's famously, which is why Lawrence Fox said he would no longer patronize there.

00:10:37.600 Which supermarket is not safe for LGBT people?

00:10:41.080 Tell me and I'll shop there.

00:10:43.440 Now, actually, I know her constituency, Portsmouth.

00:10:45.460 I think she's Portsmouth North.

00:10:47.160 Now, Portsmouth, I had no doubt that they were going to kick her out.

00:10:50.740 Because all during COVID, that place was a sort of hotbed of revolution.

00:10:54.980 It had one of the lowest vaccine uptakes of all the constituencies.

00:10:58.800 And you just saw graffiti everywhere, which was anti-regime, say no to the vax, reject it, stuff like that.

00:11:05.120 So I was never in any doubt that she was going to go.

00:11:08.520 But yes, she dresses well.

00:11:10.020 She holds a sword well.

00:11:10.920 But that is not criteria for women.

00:11:12.060 She can give a base sounding speech, but it's a pretense.

00:11:15.300 She's just not conservative, let's be honest.

00:11:18.560 Also, Gillian Keegan, another person who is gone.

00:11:21.880 Oh, thank God, thank the Lord.

00:11:23.940 Yes.

00:11:24.480 She's famous for being the education secretary who swore on air.

00:11:29.260 She also oversaw the handling of the reinforced autoclaved aerated concrete scandal,

00:11:36.120 where she closed a bunch of schools seemingly needlessly because there was concrete in there that was a bit crumbly,

00:11:41.920 which seemed a bit of an overreaction.

00:11:44.260 And after kids had lost lots of school time from the COVID times, the lockdowns,

00:11:49.620 it seemed a bit of an overreaction to my mind.

00:11:53.040 But obviously, you guys also have gripes with her as well.

00:11:56.640 I can't remember who.

00:11:57.320 I was going to say she's one of the worst education secretaries, but it's a low bar.

00:12:00.220 You've got, what, Justin Greening, Nikki Morgan.

00:12:01.900 I don't know which one was the worst one.

00:12:03.520 All of them, since Michael Gove, were awful.

00:12:05.740 But I sat on a panel with her back in the days before I was out and out conservative,

00:12:09.220 when I was a bit more moderate.

00:12:11.100 And it was me, her, and a lefty.

00:12:13.500 And she was siding with a lefty on every single thing against me.

00:12:15.740 I'm like, what's going on?

00:12:16.240 You're supposed to be a conservative MP.

00:12:17.860 Why are you fighting against me?

00:12:19.040 We should be on the same page.

00:12:20.540 I can't stand people like this.

00:12:21.680 Not conservative at all.

00:12:22.980 Just a waste of a seat.

00:12:24.380 It's quite remarkable that she managed to lose Chichester.

00:12:26.540 If anyone who's ever been to Chichester, it is distilled middle class, upper middle class.

00:12:31.860 I mean, it is a sort of quintessential Tory seat.

00:12:34.840 And for years, it had been regarded as basically, you know, unlosable for the Tories.

00:12:39.800 So for her to manage to lose that is genuinely impressive.

00:12:42.940 And in fact, it was Aaron Ice Cream, wasn't he?

00:12:45.700 He went there and basically spoke to people on the streets.

00:12:49.720 And they were just as fed up as it was everywhere else.

00:12:52.380 Because for a long time, this sort of massive immigration had been thrown into the big cities

00:12:55.680 where you didn't really tend to notice it that much because, you know, who goes to big cities?

00:12:59.860 Apart from people who live there.

00:13:00.820 But when it's sort of in your face on the streets of Chichester, you know, the people reacted to it.

00:13:07.420 And she was an education secretary who didn't educate her party on the electoral maps of lockdowns,

00:13:12.560 record taxation, mass immigration, wokeism.

00:13:17.000 She didn't understand her remit.

00:13:18.340 She was a minister without a portfolio, essentially.

00:13:21.440 Just one of these careerist politicians that would take any ministerial job.

00:13:24.380 Doesn't matter what it was, how much she cared about it or knew about it.

00:13:27.020 She would just take the job.

00:13:27.920 Well, she was a Cameron appointee, like so many of them.

00:13:30.100 So, I mean, the tide really turned when Cameron came in.

00:13:32.740 Because the first thing he did is rig candidate selection.

00:13:35.340 Yeah, woke candidates.

00:13:35.640 So that woke candidates got in.

00:13:37.980 So basically anyone who's joined since 2010 has to be suspect and is probably a wokester.

00:13:42.840 It was affirmative action.

00:13:43.980 Yeah.

00:13:44.300 It should be illegal.

00:13:45.180 Well, she also did nothing to curb the indoctrination of children in schools as well,

00:13:50.340 in, you know, gender ideology and all of that sort of stuff.

00:13:53.100 But it goes on.

00:13:54.120 But she worked against her government.

00:13:55.300 So the government said, look, I mean, to their credit, they said, look, this has got to

00:13:58.640 stop going on in schools.

00:13:59.860 And we will issue this guidance so that schools, because schools were like, well, we're not

00:14:03.180 going to do anything until the government tells us what to do.

00:14:05.160 And the government said, OK, you've got to stop transing children.

00:14:07.820 As the education secretary, she should have put the guidance out to schools to say, you

00:14:11.540 can stop.

00:14:12.220 Here is the guidelines.

00:14:13.760 But she didn't.

00:14:14.660 She let them get on with it.

00:14:16.440 And they push it at a young age.

00:14:17.760 I mean, I have to vet, you know, I've got a five-year-old daughter and I have to vet her books

00:14:21.140 when she comes home from school, because she'll be given a book and I'll just quickly check

00:14:24.640 it out.

00:14:24.940 And it's like, oh, it's a story about my two mummies.

00:14:27.160 Right.

00:14:27.340 OK, no, we're not reading that.

00:14:29.160 A child has one mother and one father.

00:14:31.400 Yeah.

00:14:31.540 So on the topic of questionable things, Liam Fox is gone.

00:14:38.680 He's known for being the most scandalous human being ever to have existed, I think.

00:14:43.220 He's had lots and lots of scandals.

00:14:45.020 So he had the best man scandal where the best man at his wedding attended lots of his meetings

00:14:53.280 as defense secretary, as a sort of unofficial advisor.

00:14:57.300 And this wasn't, you know, none of the people involved in this were notified of his presence.

00:15:04.680 And he was actually there at the majority of his meetings and they were in business together

00:15:09.300 quite a lot of the time.

00:15:10.340 And this was...

00:15:11.000 Handler?

00:15:11.300 What was going on?

00:15:12.520 Well, I think they were just making money together.

00:15:15.340 But he was found in breach of the ministerial code.

00:15:18.980 And then in 2020, it was revealed that Russian hackers had stolen trade papers from his email

00:15:24.440 account and then they were leaked ahead of the 2019 general election and used by the Labour

00:15:29.100 Party, ironically enough.

00:15:30.700 And then in 2022, he was accused of receiving a £20,000 donation from a COVID testing firm,

00:15:37.860 which he then recommended to the government during the pandemic.

00:15:41.380 And then in 2023, there was the lobbying scandal where he had been paid £16,000 for just 21

00:15:48.800 hours work by a lobbying firm, which then he lobbied on behalf of... to the prime minister.

00:15:56.960 He's quite fun down the pub, though.

00:15:58.420 When I used to work in Western Australia, I used to go down the pub with him.

00:16:00.740 He was a nice enough guy.

00:16:02.000 He'd buy lots of rounds, I imagine.

00:16:04.120 Yeah.

00:16:04.540 And he was a good Brexiteer.

00:16:06.260 But it seems not the most...

00:16:08.480 Well, probably one of the least incorrupt.

00:16:11.000 Then there is Grant Shapps, which I am very glad to see go on.

00:16:16.420 Obviously, he pushed a lot of the green agenda and lots of things that he's done.

00:16:21.020 He ran a get-rich-quick scheme under the alias Michael Green.

00:16:24.540 He got caught editing his own Wikipedia page to make himself look better.

00:16:29.420 He cut his own holiday short with his own COVID travel restrictions and then had to force

00:16:34.800 himself to go into quarantine because he couldn't even adhere to his own rules properly.

00:16:40.300 And also, this is one of my favourites, I think.

00:16:45.420 Taking from Joseph Stalin himself, he photoshopped Boris Johnson out of a picture.

00:16:51.380 And if you look closely, you can see Boris Johnson's elbow still remained there.

00:16:55.660 Oh my gosh.

00:16:56.540 If you look...

00:16:57.660 That's so embarrassing.

00:16:58.680 So you see here?

00:16:59.880 Oh, the mouse...

00:17:01.020 Oh, there we go.

00:17:01.900 There, look.

00:17:02.580 Oh, yes.

00:17:03.500 That's Boris Johnson's elbow because he didn't want to be associated with him anymore.

00:17:07.240 So when it is politically expedient to distance himself from him.

00:17:12.680 So that is actually something that Stalin did, which I think is interesting.

00:17:18.340 And then another bad person gone, Teresa Coffey.

00:17:22.780 She was known for being one of the rudest Conservative MPs.

00:17:28.660 And she was accused of having a 184,470 and 97 pence disparity in her expenses between 2022

00:17:39.000 to 23 and 2023 to 24.

00:17:42.400 And she also oversaw the unprecedented sewage pollution scandal in British waterways while

00:17:48.840 she was Environment Secretary.

00:17:50.160 So that is rather unfortunate for her.

00:17:54.240 And then another senior person was Johnny Mercer.

00:17:58.080 Oh, yes.

00:17:58.440 This is the best one.

00:17:59.320 Wasn't he...

00:18:00.400 Was he the 77th Brigade guy?

00:18:02.760 No, no.

00:18:03.460 That's the...

00:18:04.440 No.

00:18:05.980 Oh, T, T, T, Thomas...

00:18:08.000 We'll get to him, I'm sure.

00:18:09.320 Right.

00:18:09.860 No, it wasn't him.

00:18:10.600 You're about Tobias Elwood.

00:18:12.200 Yeah, Tobias Elwood.

00:18:13.000 Yes, I thought so.

00:18:13.860 He's a right Ukraine guy there, isn't he?

00:18:15.680 Johnny Mercer is the...

00:18:16.580 He's done a lot of good work for vets, to give him credit where he's...

00:18:18.600 Yeah, I know some people in his team, got some friends back home, because he was an MP for

00:18:26.040 Plymouth, which is, you know, my home turf, and he has done a fair amount for veterans

00:18:32.060 because he was veterans minister and he pushed that.

00:18:34.700 And he has been doing a lot for, you know, former veterans in the military, which I respect,

00:18:42.040 at least, that is some good work.

00:18:43.560 Not the most humble, though.

00:18:44.180 No.

00:18:45.280 He came out to campaign for me once when I was standing as a local candidate, and he got

00:18:48.720 there, he's like, oh, you expect me to speak to the people?

00:18:51.040 I thought I'd just be giving a speech.

00:18:53.020 Okay, well, no, we expect you to knock on doors like the rest of us, mate.

00:18:56.500 And I don't know what people will make of this, but he did refuse to hand over the names

00:19:00.460 of SAS troops to those who wish to prosecute them for war crimes.

00:19:04.940 That was last year, but I suppose he's out of his role now, so he's not going to be

00:19:09.400 prosecuted for that.

00:19:10.520 The guy I was thinking of was Tobias Elwood.

00:19:12.600 That's right, yes.

00:19:13.100 Did he keep his seat?

00:19:14.100 No.

00:19:14.720 Ah, good.

00:19:16.900 We've also got, oh, that link's not there, I don't think.

00:19:20.400 Oh, no, maybe it is.

00:19:21.600 There he is.

00:19:23.040 Michael Fabricant, known for the worst wigs in Parliament.

00:19:26.540 I like how he owns it, though.

00:19:28.140 He does, yeah.

00:19:28.840 He can make fun of himself.

00:19:30.420 Yeah.

00:19:31.100 I put that in there for a bit of comic relief.

00:19:33.700 And someone I know you spoke about on election night when he actually lost his seat,

00:19:38.400 Steve Baker.

00:19:40.040 I asked him to come on here, and he said no.

00:19:43.800 I can understand why, to be honest.

00:19:45.800 We've given him a bit of a hard time.

00:19:48.060 But yes, he was a Brexiteer.

00:19:49.400 He played a significant part in Brexit, and he seemed to get caught up in the Tory party

00:19:54.640 machinery, it seems.

00:19:56.140 So he gave a post-election interview with Ed Balls, who is the former Shadow Chancellor,

00:20:02.200 and Gideon, who is the former actual Chancellor.

00:20:04.960 And he was talking about the collapse of the monetary system, and everything he said

00:20:08.180 was spot on.

00:20:09.420 And Ed Balls and Gideon, they just grinned at him.

00:20:12.260 They clearly didn't have the first clue what he was talking about.

00:20:15.920 So he's actually quite sensible when it comes to monetary stuff, and he sees it.

00:20:19.700 But why he went through that weird woke phase, I'll never know.

00:20:22.700 I've always liked him, right?

00:20:23.840 So when he first, he was a Spartan, he fought for Brexit, but when he first started going

00:20:28.760 woke, I dropped him in line, because I thought, it's better to speak to these people privately

00:20:32.420 than to blast them publicly, in the first instance at least.

00:20:35.240 And he said, look, I've got a constituency that's going a certain way, the demographic's

00:20:40.340 changing.

00:20:40.800 I was like, yeah, but you do not understand critical race theory is the antithesis of

00:20:44.960 conservative values.

00:20:45.980 It goes against everything we believe in.

00:20:47.960 And anyway, he adopted that.

00:20:49.480 And then he started jumping on the trans stuff too.

00:20:51.300 He said, look, you don't understand, Calvin, I've got an employee who's trans and this

00:20:55.200 and that.

00:20:55.520 I'm like, it doesn't matter.

00:20:57.400 The truth is the truth.

00:20:59.120 And as a Christian, you should be saying, look, God made us man, God made us female, and

00:21:03.120 he loves us the way we are born.

00:21:04.940 And we're not to alter our image in making an idol of us.

00:21:08.500 Anyway, the whole thing is just, he bends to the will of the people around him, unfortunately.

00:21:12.940 I thought he was a stronger guy than that.

00:21:15.780 So some more sort of honorable mentions is Alex Chalk, the former Justice,

00:21:21.300 Secretary, Simon Hart, the Chief Whip of the House of Commons, and Robert Buckland, the

00:21:25.520 MP for this very constituency we're in right now, South Swindon.

00:21:29.700 No, he didn't.

00:21:30.480 He was a bit sore.

00:21:31.620 And he was former Secretary of State for Wales.

00:21:34.540 And there were also a bunch of notable names that did hold their seats.

00:21:39.580 Here's a little graphic that the Telegraph mocked up here.

00:21:43.340 So I'm just going to read some of them out.

00:21:44.640 Of course, Rishi Sunak held his seat, although it was in question.

00:21:48.260 He was worried about this, but I think he threw enough money at it.

00:21:51.440 So he got to keep some of his dignity, at least.

00:21:54.700 Yes, exactly.

00:21:55.860 Priti Patel.

00:21:57.200 That's a good one.

00:21:58.460 Jeremy Hunt, which I was a bit upset about.

00:22:01.440 Ian Duncan Smith, former Tory party leader.

00:22:03.640 I'm pleased with that one.

00:22:04.280 That's good.

00:22:05.160 Suella Braverman, as well.

00:22:06.820 Tom Tugganhat, who wants to send everyone to Ukraine.

00:22:11.880 James Cleverley, involved in some of the pandemic stuff.

00:22:15.840 Oliver Dowden, who I have a personal grudge against for the online harms bill.

00:22:20.220 I think that is an awful piece of legislation.

00:22:23.300 And yes, he even put in there that he wanted to end online anonymity on the internet.

00:22:28.920 Just for, you know, bullying and things like that.

00:22:31.780 I think it was just a means of the government controlling the internet.

00:22:34.520 Because it's one area that they can't control.

00:22:36.500 I mean, that won't affect me because, of course, my face is out there.

00:22:38.520 But if you work for an employer who is left-wing, which is basically all of them at this point,

00:22:44.120 it just means you can't have a political opinion.

00:22:45.820 Well, that's exactly it.

00:22:47.040 It would mean that many people watching this right now wouldn't be able to engage in the political process

00:22:51.620 because of how employers enforce their policies, really.

00:22:59.120 And Kemi Badenock stayed in as well, as did Gavin News.

00:23:03.200 I hear that Kemi Badenock is a ghost creature.

00:23:05.560 That's part of the reason why Gove came out, because he's going to be puppeting Kemi from the background.

00:23:10.640 Estimate of A stayed, common sense.

00:23:12.460 Yes, that's true.

00:23:13.700 Robert Jenrick as well.

00:23:16.000 And Gavin Williamson.

00:23:17.960 Gavin Newsom, the governor of California.

00:23:20.880 Get my wires crossed.

00:23:22.420 Who do you like for Tory leader, then?

00:23:26.360 I mean, who do you think is going to make it?

00:23:27.560 Of those, Suella.

00:23:30.280 Yeah, I could see it.

00:23:31.740 I hear Jenrick isn't too bad.

00:23:33.900 I could see Kemi being popular with the remaining Tories, perhaps.

00:23:38.540 But I imagine they might go in a slightly more left-wing direction.

00:23:43.540 Oh, well, it's a safe bet that the Tories will always learn from anything.

00:23:48.500 We should have been more left-wing, including this election loss.

00:23:51.700 I know.

00:23:52.160 Worst in their history, and they'll make the same mistake again, which works for me, to be honest.

00:23:56.300 The membership would vote for Suella, Kemi, or Priti.

00:23:59.680 I would say so, yeah.

00:24:00.660 But the Parliamentary Party will probably avoid any of those.

00:24:05.080 But you're right, Gove has an influence there, so maybe Kemi will be the one that they go with in the end.

00:24:09.480 He's sort of a Tory party kingmaker, isn't he?

00:24:11.720 He's been suggested that he's been involved in some of the coups going on internally.

00:24:16.900 Absolutely.

00:24:17.760 I would not allege that myself.

00:24:19.760 I would allege that.

00:24:20.560 Michael Gove and Dougie Smith have been heavily involved behind the scenes in all of this,

00:24:24.480 all the coup d'etats and all the stuff that's gone on.

00:24:27.200 They can shoulder a lot of the blame for where the party is right now.

00:24:31.200 So I wanted to have a quick look at some of the Tories blaming their historic loss.

00:24:37.380 Grant Shapp seems to think it was an endless political soap opera, which I don't think it was.

00:24:43.400 Of course, there might have been an element of that in that, you know, they're backstabbing their own leaders.

00:24:49.400 There's constant sleaze and things like that.

00:24:52.360 Maybe it's a little bit, but I think one person that did get it right, actually, was Robert Jenrick.

00:24:59.000 And he said the Tories lost because we failed to deliver.

00:25:02.200 They didn't keep their promises to the public, which I think it actually is true because migration was one of the central issues of this election.

00:25:11.320 And they didn't reduce it.

00:25:13.380 They actually did the opposite and they paid the price at the ballot.

00:25:16.620 And it's actually quite good to see.

00:25:18.320 And I think overall, although we didn't achieve zero seats, and I think Dr. Parvini said that anything under 100 seats would be a zero seats victory,

00:25:28.180 121 is still quite a good result, I think.

00:25:31.320 Yeah, I don't understand his abstract number of 100.

00:25:33.820 Where does that come from?

00:25:34.760 I think having less than 139 was their record loss, wasn't it?

00:25:38.820 So I think for me, that classes as zero seats.

00:25:41.880 They had a record defeat.

00:25:43.540 That's great.

00:25:44.840 But either zero seats meaning zero seats, as in they lose all their seats, or zero seats meaning they have a record defeat.

00:25:51.180 I don't understand the 100 abstract number at all.

00:25:54.220 What do you think, Dan?

00:25:55.940 Zero seats victory?

00:25:56.980 I mean, it could have been a lot better, if it weren't for perhaps some aspect that we might be coming to shortly.

00:26:04.040 Sure.

00:26:04.660 Ooh, foreshadowing.

00:26:06.040 But yes, I think the zero seats campaign was a lot of fun.

00:26:09.560 I enjoyed it.

00:26:10.360 It was good to give the Tories a sort of lashing in a political sense for their failures and their broken promises.

00:26:17.960 And I'd like to see the party shrink further.

00:26:20.980 Absolutely.

00:26:21.240 Right.

00:26:22.500 Let's talk about, because I think we need to, Peter Hitchens.

00:26:27.300 First of all, is he okay?

00:26:29.200 Well, I'd be wondering that.

00:26:31.840 Because, of course, we quite like it, especially his early work.

00:26:34.300 Yeah.

00:26:34.980 He's greatly respected.

00:26:36.480 You know, the office out there is just littered with his books.

00:26:40.880 You know, we've always thought well of the man.

00:26:43.820 I used to live in Oxford, and I used to see him occasionally.

00:26:46.260 We used to get the same train back from London.

00:26:47.700 Occasionally, we'd walk back together and have decent conversations.

00:26:50.260 He seems like a nice enough chap.

00:26:52.180 You know, I've only seen him smile once, but he seems like a decent enough bloke.

00:26:56.820 What won't have happened on the day he smiled?

00:26:58.740 It was actually the launch party for the Michaela movie.

00:27:01.720 You know, the Michaela Community School documentary.

00:27:04.220 And he smiled when he was there.

00:27:05.740 Maybe it was the free drinks.

00:27:06.540 I don't know.

00:27:06.980 But that's the only time I've ever seen him smile.

00:27:09.080 His once-a-decade allowance of smiles or something.

00:27:11.180 My motto was always, never go full Hitchens.

00:27:13.600 Because he is the epitome of black pill, doesn't he?

00:27:16.220 Like, it's bleak, despair.

00:27:18.340 And despair is a sin.

00:27:19.980 Yes.

00:27:20.320 There's always hope.

00:27:20.940 But I do appreciate his works.

00:27:23.460 Absolutely.

00:27:23.860 I recommend this book, The Cameron Delusion.

00:27:26.680 The opening few chapters of this is just a blistering tirade against the Conservative Party.

00:27:33.020 It is a wonderful denunciation of everything that they are.

00:27:37.400 I'm going to have to quote a little bit from this book.

00:27:39.760 The Tories had also decided that New Labour's policies were not only dangerous, but desirable.

00:27:46.560 And in fact, enviable.

00:27:47.820 In their view, New Labour's policies were not only the route back to office.

00:27:51.320 They were good and acceptable policies by which any professional politician would be wise to adopt.

00:27:57.360 The Conservative Party, in any case, is just as committed to New Labour as a fiercely egalitarian economic and social policy,

00:28:04.420 combined with very high public spending and dependent on its success on excess borrowing.

00:28:10.500 It entirely and unshakably supports Britain's membership of the European Union,

00:28:14.540 which means it cedes 80% of its lawmaking powers and control of the national borders by the way of trade policy and foreign power.

00:28:21.460 By implications, it ceases to have any real policies of its own on these topics.

00:28:26.860 He's always been great on this stuff.

00:28:28.940 He's consistently great.

00:28:30.180 Well, he was consistently great.

00:28:31.800 He even expressed the whole sentiment of zero seats before Parvini.

00:28:37.440 So Parvini basically just picked up Hitchens' idea from this book and just gave a modern spin on it and coined the term zero seats.

00:28:46.020 But he has been pushing this for much longer.

00:28:47.700 Samson, can you play the video of Hitchens, please?

00:28:53.300 And it seems to me that people underestimate hugely the power of the political parties and the need to reform them.

00:28:59.100 And they could be reformed.

00:29:00.280 Now, I concentrate on the Conservative Party because most of the people who read me support the Conservative Party.

00:29:04.540 And I've dedicated my life to the way that Emil Zola at one stage said that until Dreyfus was free, he wasn't going to write about anything else.

00:29:12.620 I can't quite do that because the editor wouldn't approve of it.

00:29:15.020 But I genuinely believe that my life's mission is to destroy the Conservative and Unionist Party.

00:29:19.260 Because if only one could do that, we might get a serious Conservative Party, which would produce all kinds of changes.

00:29:25.600 Now, look, imagine two corpses in the later stages of rigor mortis propped against each other.

00:29:31.560 Knock one of them away and the other one falls down.

00:29:34.160 Now, both the political parties are corpses.

00:29:36.160 When I was growing up, they had millions of members.

00:29:38.640 People went to their meetings.

00:29:39.920 People voted for them enthusiastically.

00:29:42.440 Now, they're both dead within.

00:29:43.780 They have nothing to do.

00:29:44.620 If the Conservative Party fell, what would hold the Labour Party together?

00:29:48.000 Nothing.

00:29:48.420 The Labour Party is harmonious as Yugoslavia.

00:29:50.420 They loathe each other.

00:29:51.980 They can't stand each other.

00:29:53.060 The only thing which keeps them together is the old – it's like an animal farm when the pigs say, if you don't do this, Jones will come back.

00:29:59.000 In the Labour Party, it's if you don't do this, Thatcher will come back.

00:30:01.920 That's the only thing that holds them together.

00:30:03.040 The Tories collapse, and they can't say that it's Thatcherism coming back, and they have a more rational, intelligent opposition.

00:30:08.680 They haven't got anything either.

00:30:09.960 So, you could join me in my project.

00:30:13.880 So, Peter, I've been making the case for many years that the uniparty system is just two corpses propped up against each other, and when one of them goes down, the other one will go down.

00:30:24.760 And a lot of us embrace that view.

00:30:26.620 The only difference is, in 2010, it wasn't possible, because the Tories were rising, Labour Party had sort of failed at that point.

00:30:34.480 But in 2024, it was possible to destroy the Tory Party, to make way for a genuine right-wing party.

00:30:40.880 And we understood, as this meme describes here, the age of managed decline in blue is over, and the time of managed decline in red has come.

00:30:49.000 This is the first opportunity we've had to put his plan into play.

00:30:52.960 Yes, the very first opportunity, yeah.

00:30:54.980 On the topic of Lord of the Rings references, I'm not sure you're going to make it, but he is the archetype of Denethor, Lord of the Rings, that when the time is right to fight and stand your ground and actually stand up for what you believe in, he folded and gave up and abandoned hope and let the enemies in the gates.

00:31:18.740 Yeah, so given he'd been advocating this for some years, it came a bit of a surprise when...

00:31:24.560 Oh, my clicker's not working. Can we go to the next link?

00:31:27.360 Oh.

00:31:30.640 There we go.

00:31:31.860 So, yeah, it came a bit of a surprise to find that he was...

00:31:35.740 Well, he will argue this point. He wasn't suggesting anyone vote Tory.

00:31:41.000 He was simply suggesting that they don't vote Reform and they don't vote Labour.

00:31:43.980 Yeah, yeah.

00:31:46.300 So Lib Dem's okay then?

00:31:48.400 Well, Lib Dem's never came up.

00:31:50.940 So, but I should mention that because he gets very, very upset when people suggest that he...

00:31:55.880 Very upset.

00:31:56.440 Yes, when he was suggesting that he was voting Tory.

00:31:58.380 He was simply suggesting you should not vote for anyone who isn't Tory.

00:32:02.780 But the Tories have been doing this forever.

00:32:04.280 This is part of what he was talking about, the parties propping them up.

00:32:06.880 They've been saying, Tories have been saying, don't let Labour get in.

00:32:10.380 You'll have a Corbyn government. Don't vote for Labour.

00:32:12.340 As in, vote for us because we're not the other guy.

00:32:14.880 And Labour have been doing the same.

00:32:15.980 Don't vote for the Tories because you'll get another Thatcher.

00:32:18.840 Yeah.

00:32:18.920 Like, they have never had a selling point.

00:32:21.040 They've never had a reason to vote for them.

00:32:22.440 It's always against the other person.

00:32:24.000 And so he's just doing the Tory party line.

00:32:27.540 Well, it is a bit of propaganda, really, because it's not inevitable that you have to vote for them, right?

00:32:32.520 You can vote for other people.

00:32:33.960 Maybe they won't win, but that's the point of democracy, right?

00:32:37.700 If you vote for the people that you want to win, if you vote tactically, sure, sometimes it might get results.

00:32:43.640 But also, you're sacrificing your principles.

00:32:45.880 You know, the ends justify the means, which is how you get, you know, the Soviet Union.

00:32:51.420 So there's been great bafflement on our side with what Peter was coming at.

00:32:55.640 And I think I might have figured some of it out.

00:32:57.880 I mean, he will tell us no, of course.

00:32:59.640 But I think I might have figured some of this out.

00:33:03.500 He wrote this article, for example, which is rather devoid of an argument, but I picked some bits out of it.

00:33:09.520 He was saying, when asked, you know, why were you in favour of zero seats and then you flipped against it?

00:33:15.340 He says, well, in 2010, and for many years before, the problem is this.

00:33:18.380 The Conservative Party was the target of a push.

00:33:20.820 The aim of this push was to rip up all remaining Conservative fixtures and fittings of the Tory party

00:33:25.120 and make it conform to revolutionary changes made in this country by the 1997 Blair Campbell government.

00:33:32.040 Absolutely right.

00:33:33.000 The Tory party has become a blue Blairite party.

00:33:37.240 He goes on to say,

00:33:38.120 I still believe that had any members of the Conservative commentariat, including those who now follow reform, joined in my attack,

00:33:44.780 Cameron could have been so badly defeated in 2010 that the Tory party would have split and collapsed,

00:33:49.300 making way for a new properly Conservative formation that would have easily swept aside Gordon Brown at the next election.

00:33:55.980 Brown, remember, was isolated, exhausted and deserted by the Blairites.

00:34:00.220 So, I mean, what he's trying to say there is that 2010 represented an opportunity

00:34:05.020 because of the way Labour Party was fundamentally weaker.

00:34:08.120 So, he's like, you didn't join me when I wanted to do it, therefore it's not worth doing that.

00:34:11.340 I don't understand. We weren't ready in 2010.

00:34:13.300 I was also 15 years old, so, I mean, I can't be blamed for that one.

00:34:17.260 The opportunity wasn't as ripe as it was this year.

00:34:19.140 And I would go further and say, the Tory, the Labour Party is still ridden and divided.

00:34:25.280 Oh, absolutely.

00:34:25.620 You know, a simple point is, Labour won this election with fewer votes than Corbyn got in either of his two elections.

00:34:32.720 So, since 2010, the Corbynistas have taken a massive grasp of the Labour Party.

00:34:36.760 So, the Labour Party is more splintered now than it was in 2010.

00:34:39.880 Yeah.

00:34:40.320 I can guarantee the Labour Party will fracture.

00:34:42.740 Yeah, absolutely.

00:34:43.420 And, in fact, the larger the majority of the Labour Party had, the more likely and the quicker it is to fracture.

00:34:48.420 But it will.

00:34:49.100 I mean, you'll start having all sorts of caucuses.

00:34:51.640 I mean, you'll have a Gaza caucus.

00:34:54.040 You'll have a Muslim caucus.

00:34:55.880 You'll have all of these sort of caucuses that start to appear.

00:34:58.900 The Trade Union is caucus.

00:34:59.960 Because they will start fighting, as well as that strong Corbyn thing.

00:35:02.660 Because, you know, bluntly, Starmer got fewer votes than Corbyn did.

00:35:07.040 Corbyn lost his elections, of course, but because the toys were so unpopular.

00:35:09.380 It's also a lot of bitterness within the Labour Party about how Corbyn was dealt with.

00:35:13.980 Yeah.

00:35:14.080 Because I'm certainly no fan of Jeremy Corbyn, but I do think that some of the things that the Labour Party did to him were a little bit unfair.

00:35:22.160 And if, you know, someone as right-wing as I can say that and recognise that in the Labour Party, it sort of begs the question, well, what do the people on the left of the Labour Party think?

00:35:31.120 Hmm.

00:35:32.620 Yes.

00:35:33.320 He says,

00:35:33.680 Meanwhile, Starmer, unlike Brown in 2010, will not be easy to remove.

00:35:37.820 By enfranchising 16-year-olds, and I strongly suspect EU citizens living in this country, an idea he has espoused but claims to have now dropped, he will make himself hard to shift.

00:35:48.460 If he succeeds, his plan's constitutional change will make it extraordinarily hard for anyone to undo his actions.

00:35:53.860 So, just addressing that, because, I mean, we're trying to figure out what it is.

00:35:58.700 Why has he done this vault face?

00:36:00.720 Why has he done it?

00:36:01.520 That's not true based on the polling.

00:36:02.680 The polling suggests that young people are actually going more towards reform.

00:36:05.660 So, I mean, I don't think we will enfranchise 16-year-olds, but if we did, the results wouldn't be as he's suggesting.

00:36:11.160 Yeah, reform are in number one amongst 16s.

00:36:13.560 However, of course, he doesn't like reform at all.

00:36:15.880 Right.

00:36:16.600 Now, I'm coming to why that is, but...

00:36:20.540 Does he dislike reform more than he dislikes the Tories?

00:36:23.520 He dislikes anything new.

00:36:25.100 So, the key line in this entire article, because I was searching it for a killer argument as to why we should be so much more afraid of Labour than we should have the Conservatives.

00:36:35.660 And this is something I tried to...

00:36:36.900 I had a whole conversation with him before the election, and we've come to my conversation and your conversation.

00:36:43.440 But I think what's driving is this one line in the article.

00:36:46.660 From what could we now fashion a new Conservative movement, if we had the will and the opportunity, where is the human material?

00:36:56.420 And I think that's the nub of it.

00:36:57.920 He basically doesn't credit anyone under the age of 65 as having anything worth saying at all.

00:37:04.020 He just doesn't have any faith in the new generation of the right.

00:37:08.820 And, I mean, you see this when he's on stage with people.

00:37:11.180 I mean, he will be reasonably courteous to people of his own generation.

00:37:14.960 But, I mean, he's been very rude about myself, about yourself, everyone else he interacts with.

00:37:22.940 I mean, he did that unheard stage thing with Matt Goodwin and called him a child.

00:37:28.880 You know, I think...

00:37:30.960 And, Peter, if you're watching, correct me on this.

00:37:34.760 Do correct me, which I'm sure you will.

00:37:36.460 And you're welcome to come on the show and put your point of view across.

00:37:39.120 And beyond that, you know, you can come in.

00:37:42.900 We'll send a car to your house or we can come to you or you can do it remote.

00:37:46.720 If you want the right to reply, you've got it.

00:37:50.280 But I think fundamentally, he just has no faith in the younger Conservative movement or the younger right-wing movement.

00:37:59.680 Sounding cliche, the young Conservative movement is the future of the Conservative movement.

00:38:03.600 In fact, the younger people are now bucking the trend.

00:38:08.420 Normally, as people get older, they become more Conservative.

00:38:11.120 And it's actually the opposite now, isn't it?

00:38:13.440 That the young people are more Conservative than, say, the baby boomers.

00:38:17.820 And by a significant margin as well.

00:38:19.560 And that's true of lots of other European countries as well.

00:38:22.800 So it seems to be a movement all across Europe and perhaps North America as well.

00:38:27.240 But it seems to certainly be going on in all over Europe.

00:38:31.740 Well, it depends what you're trying to conserve.

00:38:33.960 And I found this very interesting thread by not a well-known account, but I think this was a great thread and sort of explains it by Dr. Sign or whatever he is.

00:38:44.380 And he put this good thread up and I tried to promote it, but it didn't do particularly well where he looked at Hitchin's philosophy over time.

00:38:52.380 And I just want to pick a few bits out because this, for me, kind of gets the closest that I've seen to a genuine explanation of what's going on.

00:39:01.500 And his analysis is, the first thing to clear up is that he, Peter Hitchins, has never been particularly animated by the survival of ethnic Britons.

00:39:10.180 It is not meant as a criticism of the great man.

00:39:12.500 It is just a statement of fact.

00:39:14.380 For all those tearing their hair out, that doesn't seem to be as an abiding priority.

00:39:19.480 It never was.

00:39:20.540 A far higher value of supreme importance to Peter Hitchins has been the unique liberties and institutions locked up within the peculiar evolution of Britain over the centuries.

00:39:31.880 He's much more what you would call a structuralist than a nationalist.

00:39:35.680 He intuits that a Starmer supermajority will utterly abolish its last vestiges.

00:39:41.600 So don't think him a hypocrite when you imagine him betraying principles which he's never actually held.

00:39:47.360 His whole destroy the Tories bit was a function of what he was really trying to protect.

00:39:53.420 And now, them remaining on parliamentary life support serves the same ends to him.

00:39:58.420 Thus, in this effect, it's based on your understanding of Hitchins, while at the same time he doesn't understand you.

00:40:06.180 The ignorance is quite bilateral.

00:40:07.960 Really, if he does have a failing, it is a woeful lack of comprehension.

00:40:13.840 And that kind of rings true for me.

00:40:15.620 It's not...

00:40:17.260 And the key is, he doesn't so much care about the British people.

00:40:21.760 He cares about Britain, the set of the institutions.

00:40:24.640 And we are all coming at it from the point of view of the Britain, the people.

00:40:28.800 And it just...

00:40:30.500 And that, when I read it, I just thought, that explains so much of why we're talking past each other.

00:40:38.280 Yes, because in that original video, he said, you know, there has to be a new conservative movement to replace the old conservative.

00:40:45.200 And in that article, he said there has to be some kind of new conservative.

00:40:48.040 But you've pointed out he doesn't like anything new.

00:40:50.100 So it wasn't about a new movement.

00:40:51.980 It was about a new way to control what the status quo was.

00:40:55.080 Exactly. And just looking, because I've had loads of interactions with him on Twitter, a number of us have.

00:41:03.380 That, just for me, it just sounds right.

00:41:06.040 He's not trying to preserve us, the people.

00:41:08.060 He's not trying to preserve the Britons.

00:41:09.560 He's trying to preserve the set of institutions that existed at the time of his youth.

00:41:14.660 Which a Birkin conservative would say, we have to protect the institutions, we have to conserve the institutions to the point that they are still fit for purpose to their original objective.

00:41:22.680 And when they go off target, then we should reform them and or demolish them.

00:41:26.360 And that's where we're at.

00:41:27.200 Things like the BBC are a good example.

00:41:29.240 And the NHS, they're no longer fit for purpose.

00:41:32.120 Therefore, we should either reform them or demolish them.

00:41:34.320 Because, I mean, I had a number of exchanges.

00:41:35.880 One of the ones I said to him is, look, Peter, you're not going to convince anybody until you address the trade-off of immigration.

00:41:42.980 And basically, I was explaining, you know, the reason why we were fearful of the Labour Party was because we didn't want to get swamped with mass immigration.

00:41:52.060 Well, if the Tories are doing that to us anyway, it removes the reason as to why we want to keep Labour out.

00:41:57.980 So, therefore, we might as well destroy the Conservative Party and get something else in its place.

00:42:01.320 And he just couldn't connect with the point that I was making.

00:42:05.080 And he just shot back some insult along with, I've been talking about mass immigration for years.

00:42:09.320 And it's like, no, no, no, you know I'm not talking about mass immigration in general.

00:42:13.000 I'm talking about the trade-off at this election, which I think I might have this further on.

00:42:17.980 But again, look, Peter, if you think I'm wrong, I mean, you got my email.

00:42:21.780 We've corresponded.

00:42:23.940 Come in or we go to you or you can do a remote link.

00:42:27.040 And if you want to correct the record on any of this, but I genuinely do feel that we've been talking past each other.

00:42:33.100 And I am trying genuinely to try and get my head around what your criticism is.

00:42:39.980 In fact, I can back this up a little bit with my next link.

00:42:43.460 Let's see if I can get that.

00:42:46.220 Because, of course, when he was making the argument that, you know, vote against the Labour Party, don't vote for anyone.

00:42:53.320 Well, of course, people will come back and say, well, well, what if I live in Clacton?

00:42:58.340 That surely means I've got to vote for Nigel Farage.

00:43:01.560 Because that would be voting against the Labour Party or, you know, or otherwise.

00:43:06.660 And he comes back with former not-conservatives.

00:43:09.380 They are right-wing nationalist radicals.

00:43:11.860 So therefore, it's not voting against Labour at all.

00:43:15.300 It's not tactical voting.

00:43:16.540 If in Clacton, the Reform Party has the best chance of defeating the Labour Party, and he says don't vote for them because they're not conservatives, then it's not about voting against Labour.

00:43:25.400 Yeah, because reform does not represent anything that he considers valuable.

00:43:29.380 He wants to protect institutions.

00:43:31.500 And what he's saying to you there is, first of all, you know, the right-wing nationalist.

00:43:34.600 So first of all, he doesn't care for nationalism.

00:43:36.660 He doesn't care for the people as such.

00:43:40.880 He just doesn't see that as a concern.

00:43:43.000 It's the institutions he wants to protect.

00:43:45.500 So when he calls the nationalists, i.e. irrelevant, and second, radicals, reform are far more likely to come along and put in place new institutions.

00:43:55.220 That's the problem, though, isn't it?

00:43:56.280 Because what conservative is?

00:43:57.600 A smart chap like him would see that a right-wing nationalist party is conservative because they want to conserve the nation.

00:44:03.260 They want to protect the demographic of the country.

00:44:05.400 But I don't...

00:44:06.400 It's not just the people.

00:44:07.240 It is the idea of the nation, too.

00:44:08.480 Yes, but I mean, I'm not wedded to the constitutional arrangements because they've all been so polluted and corrupted.

00:44:17.060 I'm quite happy to tear them all down and start again.

00:44:20.160 And my concerns are protecting the people, which is not a concern for him.

00:44:26.220 So I think that tweet is very revealing when you break it down.

00:44:29.060 Yeah.

00:44:29.800 It's all about that conservatism.

00:44:31.220 So then we ought to get on to some of the spats that might have cropped up because it turns out that mild, mild Calvin here has been incredibly rude to Peter Hitchens.

00:44:47.460 He says, replying to somebody else who presumably was defending you,

00:44:51.940 As far as I know, I may have missed it, Calvin has not apologised for his extremely rude and factually mistaken of me yesterday.

00:45:00.480 Like you, I wish he would, but I cannot forgive him until he does.

00:45:04.240 So, Calvin, you were extremely rude, were you?

00:45:07.760 I was like, all I said is that you've been speaking about demolishing the Conservative Party for decades and then at the last hurdle, you're buckled.

00:45:14.640 And that's what the word I use, buckled.

00:45:15.980 He said that was nasty and extreme.

00:45:17.840 I'm like, how is that?

00:45:18.720 And his responses have been pretty rude, to be fair.

00:45:22.000 This is just one of many.

00:45:23.020 Well, let's have a look at this extremely rude tweet of yours.

00:45:26.540 Do you want to read it or shall I?

00:45:27.620 You have spent years telling us that the Conservative Party must be utterly destroyed,

00:45:31.820 that this is the only way to break free from the political malaise,

00:45:35.600 and when we finally got an opportunity to do so, you buckled and backed them.

00:45:39.500 Will you be working to dismantle what remains of the Tories in the next election,

00:45:42.760 or are you on board with the Uni Party now?

00:45:44.580 Well, I really don't believe that Peter Hitchens has led such a sheltered life that he genuinely believes that that is a rude tweet.

00:45:52.040 I mean, it's quite blunt and to the point, which is how I tweet, but I don't think it's rude.

00:45:56.260 I don't think I was nasty.

00:45:56.840 You could say that to somebody's face.

00:45:58.640 He said this was nasty.

00:45:59.920 Yes.

00:46:00.800 Well, that is the sort of thing that you would say to somebody's face.

00:46:03.480 I absolutely would, yeah.

00:46:04.220 And that is apparently being described as extremely rude.

00:46:09.680 And I forget it was just because I didn't show due reverence.

00:46:13.340 Well, you're under 65, so...

00:46:14.840 Right.

00:46:16.400 As we've established, he doesn't care for that much.

00:46:18.860 Maybe he's just a very devout Confucian.

00:46:22.420 That might be it.

00:46:23.780 You've really got to respect one's elders above all.

00:46:26.900 But I've only replied twice, so I put this out, and then I put that response you've just seen.

00:46:29.960 There's like a dozen tweets that he's tagged me in, and I don't always see them because of the way he does his weird tweeting.

00:46:35.920 But he's gone on a rampage.

00:46:37.760 He's gone on a rant, and he's got really personal ad hominems.

00:46:40.580 It's like, how am I the nasty one here?

00:46:43.060 Yes.

00:46:43.700 Because I dared question.

00:46:45.180 Yes.

00:46:45.940 How dare I question you?

00:46:47.820 Well, yes.

00:46:48.640 I mean, essentially, he's very upset that somebody who isn't Owen Jones has the sheer temerity to speak to him as if they've got something to say on his level.

00:46:59.960 Because, weirdly, he will have conversations with Owen Jones and Aaron Bustani.

00:47:04.760 But for whatever reason, he avoids engaging with anyone on the right.

00:47:08.620 He won't accept the arguments.

00:47:10.780 But if we are going to accept the premise that Peter is allergic to anyone ever being rude...

00:47:19.960 Oh, here we go.

00:47:21.500 Actually, there's another one on yours.

00:47:23.340 I strongly object to being told untruly that I support or sympathize with the Tories.

00:47:29.380 Yes, Peter, you simply engineered a situation where people kind of had to vote for them in order to follow your advice.

00:47:36.380 He has a massive influence as well.

00:47:38.040 When he writes in the Daily Mail blog, vote against Labour and don't vote for reform or whatever he's saying, he's telling people to vote for the Conservatives, whether he believes it or not.

00:47:46.680 And he'll argue against that point, but it's unavoidable.

00:47:51.760 Absolutely unavoidable.

00:47:52.820 If you're saying, you know, there are three doors, a red door, a yellow door and a blue door,

00:47:57.680 and you must at all costs avoid going through the red door.

00:48:01.160 But don't go through the blue door.

00:48:02.380 Yes.

00:48:03.080 Yes.

00:48:04.460 Yes, quite.

00:48:05.400 Anyway, so on the point of Peter Hitchens being allergic to being rude in tweets,

00:48:11.340 this is a tweet that he sent me a while back, more mucus from King Bingo.

00:48:17.460 This is the one that I mentioned earlier about how I said, look, you've got to address the mass immigration issue as it relates to this election.

00:48:25.140 And he dodged that.

00:48:27.620 So there he is accusing me of mucus.

00:48:31.660 Let's go to another one.

00:48:32.740 Oh, this is the one where he calls me deluded.

00:48:35.180 I've got loads of these, by the way.

00:48:37.980 What was I saying in this one?

00:48:40.060 Whatever it is, you don't understand.

00:48:41.500 This is the problem.

00:48:42.120 This is the snobby intellectualism of these kind of people.

00:48:45.420 You don't understand.

00:48:46.600 You can't engage with me.

00:48:47.400 You just don't understand.

00:48:48.640 Like, okay, then spell it out.

00:48:50.020 What is the problem?

00:48:50.700 And how do you see it?

00:48:51.580 Make the argument.

00:48:52.300 And then we can find common ground.

00:48:53.260 Make the argument.

00:48:54.020 Either you don't understand the workings of the electoral system or you are deluded.

00:48:58.920 A large reform vote by people who would normally vote Tory would deliver Keir Starmer and make Ed Davey opposition leader.

00:49:08.300 Reform might get one seat.

00:49:09.820 Well, okay, let's just dig in on that.

00:49:12.460 They didn't get one seat.

00:49:13.220 They got five.

00:49:14.380 Well, he's not reading the prevailing wind, is he?

00:49:16.740 Because it was entirely obvious that the Conservatives did not stand a challenge in this election.

00:49:21.560 They were obviously going to be decimated.

00:49:24.720 And that's why I think a lot of people felt like they could vote reform because they knew that, okay, well, the Conservatives aren't going to form the government anyway.

00:49:33.040 I don't even have to vote to keep Labour out because we know we're going to get them anyway.

00:49:36.520 So we can vote on our principles.

00:49:38.020 Well, he's making a number of errors.

00:49:39.440 I mean, first of all, like I said, they got five seats, not one.

00:49:42.260 And actually they came second in 98 seats.

00:49:45.020 So had he have got on board and used his platform of influence to get on board zero seats, reform could have had anywhere up to 103 seats and they would be the official opposition.

00:49:56.380 And his lifelong dream of destroying the Tory party would be achieved.

00:49:59.740 But, as I said above, I think the only thing he would ever want to replace the Conservative Party with is a party that is even more wedded to the conservation of the institutions, not the people, which is a different thing.

00:50:13.020 So, yeah.

00:50:15.140 A lot of us thought Labour are going to win regardless.

00:50:18.580 Yes.

00:50:18.960 Not that they're going to get a landslide, but the Tories are going to lose.

00:50:22.160 So the Tories are going to hand this to Labour.

00:50:24.100 Therefore, if Labour are going to get in office anyway, we can send a message to the Tories.

00:50:27.900 Well, I don't think it's sending a message.

00:50:30.340 I would say that.

00:50:31.260 Some of us would say it's because people like him, maybe you would join him in arguing that that's sentimental and you can't vote sentimentally.

00:50:37.760 But I think a lot of people in this country have said we're sick and tired of the Conservative government.

00:50:41.400 14 years they haven't delivered on immigration, on NHS, on education, on cultural issues, on economic issues.

00:50:47.760 They haven't worked towards making this a better country.

00:50:50.960 Therefore, we're no longer going to lend them our vote.

00:50:53.720 And so we're going to vote reform instead.

00:50:55.200 And we can because Labour are going to get into power anyway.

00:50:57.000 And that might be slightly sentimental, but that's how people think.

00:50:59.900 I'd only change your framing on that is that I wouldn't describe it as lending them my vote.

00:51:05.700 Because if what you meant by that is that it is naturally a Conservative vote, then I'm taking it away from them.

00:51:12.340 No, I'm saying I'm not going to lend the Tories my vote in this election.

00:51:15.340 I'm going to lend it to someone else because they don't own it.

00:51:17.240 They're not entitled to my vote.

00:51:18.540 Yes, and I think one of the fundamental assumptions that Peter is making is that if reform didn't exist, all of those reform votes would simply go straight to the Conservatives.

00:51:27.660 I think most people – I didn't decide until an hour before the vote.

00:51:31.040 I was thinking I'm either going to not bother turning up or if I do turn up, I'll spoil my ballot.

00:51:35.900 And I'm a natural Conservative voter.

00:51:37.460 I've always voted Conservative.

00:51:38.840 So I wasn't going to vote Conservative if reform weren't there.

00:51:41.280 I happened to speak to my reform local representative who was a Christian and believed in sanctity of life, so I voted for her.

00:51:47.200 But if I hadn't voted for her, I would not have voted for the Tories.

00:51:50.180 Well, you got the polling on this and they found that only 26% of reform voters would switch back to the Tories if there wasn't a reform candidate.

00:52:01.240 So he's wrong, objectively wrong.

00:52:02.740 So, I mean, certainly in my case, there was no way that I was going to vote for the party that locked me down for two years.

00:52:06.820 Well, I'm never going to vote Conservative ever again, under no circumstances, no matter what they do.

00:52:11.440 I just don't trust them.

00:52:13.320 I'm happy to say never in this circumstance because the entire apparatus is captured by people that don't mean Britain well.

00:52:21.680 I don't trust them at all.

00:52:23.320 And I think that many of the Conservatives that sacrifice their principles for the sake of furthering their careers

00:52:28.800 and basically making more money have got off lightly by losing their seats, to be honest.

00:52:34.080 Yeah, given what they did to us over those two years and everything else, all the other crimes they perpetrated.

00:52:41.860 But yeah, fundamental misunderstanding on that one.

00:52:44.980 What have we got on the next one?

00:52:46.880 Oh, this is the one who's calling me dishonest.

00:52:50.780 And what's this one about?

00:52:52.940 Oh, yeah, this is a follow-up point to another one I think may further on, which is,

00:52:58.540 no, I don't think the Tories are going to be destroyed in this election, but you need to break the spell.

00:53:02.500 The whole thing with zero seats is that you get reform a larger share of the votes and then the following election they get properly replaced.

00:53:10.860 And he was trying to suggest it was dishonest to me.

00:53:14.260 I mean, I've read all your bloody books, Peter.

00:53:15.900 I know what your argument on this one.

00:53:18.200 So that's why it calls me dishonest.

00:53:19.460 What's the next one?

00:53:19.720 This country has been stuck in a tribal mentality for so long that we either turn up to,

00:53:24.060 even if we say up until the moment, yeah, I'll vote UKIP, yeah, I'll vote Brexit, whatever.

00:53:27.040 Up until that moment, we turn up in the polling booth, we go, okay, I've always voted Tory, I've got to vote Tory.

00:53:32.460 Or my family's always voted Labour, I vote Labour.

00:53:34.760 And it's a two-party, uni-party system because it's first past the post.

00:53:38.740 This is the first election, I feel, where we're breaking that perception.

00:53:44.040 And so you're right, in the next one, it could be even different because people are starting to say,

00:53:47.400 wait a minute, I don't have to vote for one of those two.

00:53:50.080 The other party does have a chance.

00:53:51.520 And reform can do the whole Lib Dem trick now of, in 98 constituencies, saying only reform can win here.

00:53:57.780 Which would be true.

00:53:58.860 Yes, which would be true, yeah.

00:54:00.240 This is the one where he calls me snide and untruthful.

00:54:03.940 Don't worry, there's loads of these.

00:54:05.640 Why does he always resort to ad hominem?

00:54:07.880 Well, I think the reason he does it is because if he can't win the argument on its own grounds,

00:54:13.840 what he wants to do is to bait you into saying something unpleasant,

00:54:19.560 at which point he can then immediately claim a moral victory.

00:54:23.220 And the thing is, I mean, look at my tweet below.

00:54:25.980 I was, you know, Peter, the offer for a courteous face-to-face discussion remains open.

00:54:30.560 But this format is achieving little.

00:54:32.520 You know, and all the time I'd been extremely respectful because I've seen him do this so much

00:54:37.080 that I know that he wants to bait you.

00:54:40.680 So he's a cry bully, is what he is.

00:54:42.280 Is what?

00:54:42.540 He's a cry bully.

00:54:43.760 Like, he'll get you to say something offensive so he can put,

00:54:45.940 oh, look at this guy.

00:54:47.140 It's like, no, you are the problem.

00:54:48.460 Yeah.

00:54:49.280 Yeah.

00:54:50.380 So what else have we got?

00:54:52.400 Oh, this is where he calls me pretentious.

00:54:56.020 Nobody has even voted yet and you are being manipulated by the polls.

00:54:58.820 You seem anxious to avoid any responsibility for helping to elect a militant Labour government.

00:55:02.980 Well, I didn't vote for them.

00:55:03.880 I've never voted for them.

00:55:05.240 And in fact, I might just dig into, you know, the point I was making.

00:55:10.420 If I can, here we go.

00:55:11.660 So basically, one of the key arguments I had to him, you know, let's go into this one.

00:55:17.980 Because at some point he accused me of being an idiot for not understanding that the SNP

00:55:21.740 were a thing, you know, as an attempt for a new political party to form.

00:55:24.940 And I said, well, I am very familiar with the SNP, but let's cast our minds back further.

00:55:29.360 Let's go back to the 1910 election.

00:55:31.460 So the 1910 election, the Tories were competing against the Whigs.

00:55:37.680 The Tories were a very unpopular, in fact, the whole ruling class was unpopular.

00:55:42.000 And people voted out the Tories and went to the Whigs and they won this huge majority.

00:55:46.960 But it didn't solve the fact that there was this ruling class dissatisfaction.

00:55:52.900 And that 1910 liberal landslide, or was it 1906, 1906 liberal landslide, basically set

00:56:01.900 them up for destruction because they couldn't deliver on anything because they didn't have

00:56:06.080 any answers.

00:56:07.540 And by 19, I think it was 1922, the liberal party was destroyed.

00:56:13.080 Right.

00:56:13.180 And so this is the argument I was making to him.

00:56:16.360 Yeah, it's been done.

00:56:17.780 And I made this argument to him.

00:56:19.800 And in the post before, I was saying, you know, well, you haven't addressed the argument.

00:56:23.400 And at some point he shoots back with, I have addressed it, you lost.

00:56:27.620 But you didn't address it.

00:56:29.080 You never addressed any of these arguments.

00:56:30.360 You just continue to, you just throw out these ad hominins in the hope that you can

00:56:34.760 claim a moral victory.

00:56:36.360 Well, I've just ignored him now.

00:56:37.500 I'll just let him shout in the wind.

00:56:39.000 He keeps, he's still quote-treating me as we're on air now.

00:56:41.380 It's like, just get on with it, mate.

00:56:42.680 If you want to have a little rant, if it makes you feel better, good for you.

00:56:46.640 Well, he's, I, so, I mean, I put that stuff up about the difference between trying to

00:56:51.440 defend a people and trying to defend a set of institutions, because I think that does

00:56:54.780 go to a lot of it.

00:56:55.780 I think you've done that in good faith as well.

00:56:57.100 And I hope he does come back and have a conversation with you.

00:56:58.980 Well, and he's, I mean, you got my email.

00:57:00.660 We've exchanged emails.

00:57:01.620 You're more than welcome to come on and put your point of view.

00:57:04.360 But I'm just genuinely trying to get to why there is this massive schism between people

00:57:09.280 who admire you and what you seem to be saying.

00:57:11.860 And I think it boils down to, you're trying to preserve institutions, not people.

00:57:16.780 And that you just don't think that there is any human capital in the under 65s that is

00:57:21.660 worth having.

00:57:22.200 And therefore, you have no faith in us to build anything new of any value.

00:57:25.340 So, you know, if I'm wrong, let me know.

00:57:27.740 Got some video comments, I believe.

00:57:32.160 Yes.

00:57:32.520 George Carteret was born into nobility on the Channel Island of Jersey in about 1610.

00:57:42.220 His family helped the deposed Stuarts escape England and was favored upon their restoration.

00:57:47.540 Carteret became one of the Lord's proprietor, basically an investor, in half of New Jersey,

00:57:52.700 buying the colony off then Duke of York James.

00:57:55.640 Carteret was also one of the first investors in the Royal Africa Company.

00:57:59.480 For this, after the death of George Floyd, his statue on Jersey was defaced with white

00:58:04.180 paint, though at least it wasn't removed.

00:58:07.600 Interesting.

00:58:08.260 I didn't hear about that one, actually.

00:58:09.760 No.

00:58:13.280 Greetings from Canada.

00:58:14.700 I've not got a camera, but I do have an article here that I thought might be of some

00:58:17.900 interest that I've not heard anyone speak on.

00:58:19.600 I've seen this one twice already.

00:58:20.120 In the 90s and...

00:58:20.900 We played this one on the election stream twice.

00:58:23.900 So, you've got a lot of time for that one.

00:58:26.620 Oh.

00:58:27.460 Blimey, what is this?

00:58:28.520 I think there's a prime minister or former Russia.

00:58:31.840 Zero seats, zero seats.

00:58:36.060 Tories, feel the heat.

00:58:39.580 All your lies, all your deceit.

00:58:43.200 We're dancing to your defeat.

00:58:47.280 Zero seats, zero seats.

00:58:49.160 Feel the pain, feel the heat.

00:58:54.800 Zero seats, zero seats.

00:58:56.780 Yeah, that's a perfect summation of that prime minister grinning from the cuck chair and

00:59:07.840 the absolute debasement of Britain as if it's a good thing.

00:59:11.240 Yeah.

00:59:11.780 That pop music.

00:59:13.100 I know it was AI generated, but still, it was too close to being real.

00:59:18.460 Yeah.

00:59:19.080 Predictions.

00:59:19.480 Traditionally, election nights are all about predicting the outcomes.

00:59:22.520 These are the predictions from the Lotus Eaters for reform seats.

00:59:25.300 Carl, 16, Harry, 25, Connor, 7, Bo, 7, and Josh Waffling in at 5 to 10.

00:59:30.280 Interested to see who comes in the closest.

00:59:32.600 Moving on to other predictions.

00:59:33.820 After seeing what happened in France, I wonder if anyone in the studio has any predictions

00:59:37.140 regarding riots.

00:59:38.240 Interested in your thoughts, there gents.

00:59:39.760 Lastly, do you believe that reform will follow their manifesto or pull a Maloney and cave

00:59:43.480 to those who want to import the populations of other countries to your shores?

00:59:46.380 Looking forward to hearing your current predictions.

00:59:48.380 07.

00:59:48.780 Well, there will be riots in France.

00:59:52.160 That's, you know, the sun will rise tomorrow.

00:59:55.060 There will be riots in France.

00:59:56.780 It's the same thing, isn't it?

00:59:58.400 Doesn't take a lot to make the French riot.

01:00:00.300 And also, I mean, it's difficult to tell whether reform will enact their manifesto because

01:00:04.880 the next chance they have to be in power is 2029.

01:00:07.920 I mean, let's say they do come into 2029.

01:00:09.760 There was a bit of a schism within form, if what I'm hearing is true.

01:00:14.400 There's the Tice wing, which is the cuck wing.

01:00:16.780 And then you've got Faraj, who is a bit more sensible on this stuff.

01:00:20.780 And Tice wants to sort of go down the neolib, well, obviously with Ukraine.

01:00:26.280 He wants to go down the sort of social liberalism.

01:00:29.180 He wants to do all of those things because he thinks that if he can do all of that, people

01:00:33.840 will stop calling him racist, stop calling him, you know, anti-whatever, anti-trans or something.

01:00:39.460 He's just a Tory.

01:00:40.740 Yeah, he is.

01:00:42.520 For the record, I predicted six seats for reform.

01:00:45.040 So I think I was quite close.

01:00:46.220 Yeah.

01:00:47.240 One off, yeah.

01:00:48.900 But yeah, Tice is establishment, bless him.

01:00:51.160 He's a nice guy, but he's just the toys from five minutes ago.

01:00:54.880 I feel like sometimes I'm a bit too harsh on the guy because he did put a lot of money

01:00:58.560 into the reform party and set it up for Nigel and then surrendered the seat to him.

01:01:03.620 I don't agree with his politics, but at least he did create the infrastructure for Faraj

01:01:08.460 to take over.

01:01:09.160 Well, the infrastructure to get me and Bo booted out anyway.

01:01:11.900 That's true, yeah.

01:01:13.080 So yeah, boot to Tice for that.

01:01:14.620 Because I said that foreign criminals should be deported, which is now on page three of

01:01:18.600 their manifesto after Nigel came back.

01:01:20.700 And it wasn't all Tice's money.

01:01:22.220 A lot of people invested in the Brexit party, which became the reform party.

01:01:25.280 A lot of people have, you know, even just one pound, people have donated and kept it

01:01:28.520 going for a long time.

01:01:29.300 And I think there was a redemption arc for Tice, but you have to understand that you are barking

01:01:34.460 up the wrong tree.

01:01:35.200 You are playing the wrong politics.

01:01:36.580 You're playing your enemy's politics and it doesn't work.

01:01:39.260 Stop doing it.

01:01:40.020 G'day, Lotus.

01:01:44.280 It is from the Southern Hemisphere.

01:01:46.480 This is not necessarily about election, but if you're heading over to the United States,

01:01:49.840 I would suggest hitting up the podcast, The Drinking Bros.

01:01:52.760 They're a bit of a political analysis podcast and culture stuff over in Austin, Texas.

01:01:58.740 And if you can, I would suggest getting an interview with Christian Craighead, or better

01:02:02.540 known as Obi-Wan Nairobi, a UK Special Forces soldier who's currently trying to live in

01:02:08.120 the United States after some certain UK political book BS.

01:02:14.840 Was that the chicken bros?

01:02:17.380 Did you say?

01:02:17.900 The drinking bros.

01:02:18.780 The drinking bros.

01:02:20.040 Well, thanks for the suggestions and I hope you managed to escape that printer you're trapped

01:02:23.460 in.

01:02:26.140 Just sharing some support and good vibes to Sophie and anybody else who might be

01:02:32.540 battling their own chemical habits.

01:02:35.740 I know it's going to be hard.

01:02:37.160 It's going to feel like shit.

01:02:38.640 It's probably going to feel like it's not even worth it at times, but I promise you it

01:02:42.620 is.

01:02:43.140 And I know for a fact you can do it.

01:02:45.620 I do believe in you.

01:02:47.620 Good luck, you guys.

01:02:50.720 It's lovely Ru the Dave in the chat.

01:02:52.580 Hello.

01:02:53.940 Yes, and a lovely sentiment there as well.

01:02:55.780 I very much commend it.

01:02:57.940 Oh.

01:02:59.640 We have an error message.

01:03:01.080 Mr. Western crashed.

01:03:02.540 He's there.

01:03:04.240 I'm curious to know, if reform do end up getting more seats than people have predicted, or else

01:03:13.420 hoped for in the case of liberal media and liberal parties in general, how do you think they would

01:03:23.000 try and spin that in their favour if they can?

01:03:26.900 Well, the Tories, will they just say that, look, they've only got X number of seats, in this case

01:03:33.140 five.

01:03:34.120 So they just dismiss them and, you know, ignore them as much as possible.

01:03:38.500 Well, this may well be a comment from the actual election live stream, in which case, you know,

01:03:44.280 if they did, yeah.

01:03:46.800 So I think that what they probably would have gone for is they would have said, oh, well,

01:03:53.840 this is just a protest vote, and they would have just dismissed it as being not even worth

01:03:58.280 their time.

01:03:58.940 They would have said, well, look at their candidates.

01:04:02.660 These people aren't proper politicians.

01:04:04.540 They're not to be taken seriously.

01:04:05.560 They, and ignored them, is what would have happened.

01:04:09.640 Question for Alex, B-R-L-N-E-R.

01:04:14.240 We've seen this one, I believe.

01:04:15.620 We have, yes.

01:04:16.660 Good evening, lads.

01:04:18.320 Dispatches from the Man Cave Part 2.

01:04:20.660 I'd just like to raise a glass to the most successful and most viewed and bigliest of the

01:04:27.060 election streams here in the UK, smashing Sky News and Channel 4 out of the water.

01:04:30.640 Fantastic to see.

01:04:31.520 Yeah, I've been a viewer since the beginning, and Sargon before that, so it's lovely to

01:04:36.760 see some old faces back.

01:04:37.820 Really, really nice to see.

01:04:39.360 And just in case Sargon is watching, here is some Warhammer, and here is some more.

01:04:49.500 Going to make Carl jealous there.

01:04:50.860 Well, Carl is off in America doing his Warhammer tournament, so I think he's even more immersed

01:04:55.640 in it at the moment.

01:04:56.740 But no, thank you for the kind words and the support for such a long time.

01:04:59.960 And I hope you have a nice evening watching us.

01:05:03.780 I don't know what the politics of the band The Prodigy are.

01:05:06.760 I assume something to the left wing.

01:05:08.900 Working my way through my music collection, I came across their track Narayan, a Sanskrit

01:05:13.280 word meaning son of the primeval man.

01:05:15.960 Their songs have a nationalistic bent that cannot be ignored, so I wonder that they must

01:05:19.800 be quite litigious, as it strikes me that they would be a natural fit as an anthem for

01:05:23.520 the Reform Party, perhaps bridging the gap between my 50 years of age and the younger generation.

01:05:28.600 To be fair, I heard Prodigy getting radio play not too long ago, which surprised me.

01:05:40.520 So they're still getting recognition.

01:05:42.680 I'm not necessarily a fan of theirs, but it's not bad.

01:05:44.820 I mean, they're going to have a nationalist bent on the basis that absolutely everybody

01:05:48.560 did, including the left wing, until about 20 years ago.

01:05:51.700 That's true, yeah.

01:05:52.760 You know, walking through Sydney here, and all of these stores have all these high-end

01:06:00.500 goods in them, their clothes, their jewelry, watches, everything around here.

01:06:08.060 But all of these stores are empty.

01:06:10.640 Like, nobody's shopping at them.

01:06:12.120 If you walk in, you look at the prices on this stuff, I can see why nobody could afford

01:06:16.540 this.

01:06:16.920 It's like, how do these city economies operate like this?

01:06:21.040 I really want to know.

01:06:23.840 I suppose when the goods are that expensive, they need to have fewer customers in order

01:06:28.660 to make a profit.

01:06:30.080 Yeah, I know a little bit about this sort of industry, and I think that a lot of it is

01:06:35.000 within specific hours.

01:06:37.100 And also, they'll get customers who come in and buy a lot in bulk, and it's very expensive.

01:06:41.860 So they actually don't need that many customers, and there won't be that many people in there.

01:06:46.840 And just having a presence in a shop isn't necessarily that important as well, because

01:06:53.180 it could potentially be ordered to the house of the person ordering, those sorts of things.

01:07:00.400 Is that...

01:07:01.120 Oh, no.

01:07:04.500 We've seen this one.

01:07:06.460 It's all right.

01:07:07.740 Good evening, Lotus Eaters.

01:07:08.980 I hope you are all doing well this evening, and that the Conservatives will soon be graced

01:07:13.240 with zero seats.

01:07:14.920 I would be most grateful, if the panel would be able to provide their thoughts, even though

01:07:19.620 it's not related to the election itself, of our former Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli,

01:07:25.720 their thoughts regarding his policies, his ideology, which has been the basis of one-nation

01:07:30.700 conservatism.

01:07:32.080 Although, I believe that the current crop of one-nation conservatives, as they call themselves,

01:07:36.920 don't deserve the title on the basis that they have absolutely nothing in common with

01:07:42.140 his policies and his ideals.

01:07:45.860 Yes.

01:07:47.240 I can't answer that one, but I know a man who can, and I'm about to do a Brokonomics with

01:07:54.260 Apostolic Majesty on the obituary of the Tory party, and I will ask him about Disraeli.

01:08:00.520 So, if you watch Brokonomics in a week's time, you'll get your answer.

01:08:04.580 Also, the one-nation Tories, as they like to call themselves now, form under the banner

01:08:09.580 of the Tory reform group, and they are the left wing of the party.

01:08:12.700 And then on the right, you've got the Conservative Way Forward, who are more conservative on economic

01:08:18.660 stuff, but not necessarily on social stuff.

01:08:20.360 And then you've got the CSG, the Common Sense Group, who are more conservative on the

01:08:23.420 social stuff.

01:08:23.940 So, the Tory party is still splintered from within, but it's only important because this

01:08:28.000 civil war is happening right now, and the TRG, the Tory reform group, the so-called one-nation

01:08:32.280 Tories, are the ones who are vying for power and trying to push the party further left, saying

01:08:38.260 we need to be more centrist in order to win the next election.

01:08:41.300 And so, we'll see same old mistakes being made, thanks to the one-nationists.

01:08:45.340 I mean, the one-nation was originally the country Gent and the lower orders.

01:08:52.540 It doesn't mean what it means now, which is basically just wets.

01:08:55.440 Yeah.

01:08:55.940 It is just the wets.

01:08:56.900 I did a running series in my series Contemplations, back when it was running, where I looked at

01:09:03.020 Victorian values, and I talked about some Disraeli quotes with Bo, just about how they reflected

01:09:09.440 some of the values of the time in terms of politics and that sort of thing.

01:09:13.620 So, that might be the place to go for some of my opinions, but I don't know a potted history

01:09:19.860 of that political landscape, really.

01:09:24.020 Hey, Lotus Eaters.

01:09:25.220 Just thought I'd give you a little break from the politics talk and show you the old Craftsman

01:09:30.580 table saw I've been rebuilding.

01:09:34.680 Right here, I redesigned and did all the new front paneling, remachined all these new stainless

01:09:43.000 steel knobs on my grandfather's lathe, and painted everything all anew.

01:09:49.380 Got it all working again.

01:09:51.380 Happy Treason Day, boys.

01:09:53.880 That is very cool.

01:09:55.240 I have immense respect for people who do this sort of thing in their spare time.

01:09:59.040 This is the kind of thing I want to be doing when I eventually, you know, in a million years'

01:10:03.240 time can afford a house.

01:10:04.620 Right, right.

01:10:06.200 Not in this country, mate.

01:10:07.400 Yeah.

01:10:09.840 Okay, we got some comments.

01:10:11.280 Plenty of comments, in fact.

01:10:12.900 Oh, goody.

01:10:14.400 We've got some general comments.

01:10:15.600 Would you like to read those, Dan?

01:10:17.460 Go on, then.

01:10:19.120 Based Biology teacher says, all recovered, lads.

01:10:23.040 No, I've got worse.

01:10:25.460 Just about, yeah.

01:10:26.720 I didn't need recovering.

01:10:27.680 I was having a blast the whole time there.

01:10:29.060 I was on the first panel, the last panel, and, you know, hourly in between.

01:10:34.360 It was a lot of fun.

01:10:35.380 I really enjoyed that live stream.

01:10:37.180 Yes.

01:10:37.520 And I was surprised at how we were still going at quarter to six in the morning and managing

01:10:42.420 to give some commentary, although it wasn't quite as lively as when we started.

01:10:46.000 Yes, to be fair, the last panel was not as inspired as it could have been.

01:10:50.460 You know, we did it.

01:10:51.620 Well, we knew that zero seats wasn't going to happen.

01:10:54.680 Yeah, so is that.

01:10:55.260 So, that taxes girl says, I just want to commend Samson and the other producers for running

01:11:00.800 a tight ship on election stream.

01:11:02.380 Really well done.

01:11:03.040 Yes.

01:11:03.500 Most of the segments had sound.

01:11:04.720 It was very good.

01:11:06.020 Very good.

01:11:06.440 Very good.

01:11:06.760 Right on, Samson.

01:11:08.460 Yes.

01:11:09.760 James Hayes says, great job on the election stream, lads.

01:11:12.980 Now, where's my Islander mag?

01:11:14.780 It's coming.

01:11:15.580 Yes.

01:11:15.920 The printy people are doing the printy thing, and the first batch of the posty people

01:11:19.680 have done the posty thing.

01:11:20.600 So, they are being done in batches for, apparently there's a reason.

01:11:25.300 Yeah, apparently there's a reason.

01:11:26.580 So, you will get it.

01:11:27.660 It is coming.

01:11:29.260 It's just, you know, happening.

01:11:33.180 Grant Gibson says, Dan, I actually laughed out loud so often during your segments on

01:11:37.620 the green screen.

01:11:40.840 First, when you wore a green shirt, then with your Lotus Eats exit pole map, and then many

01:11:45.440 times after that.

01:11:46.580 Well, I'm glad I could amuse you, sir.

01:11:48.720 Yeah.

01:11:50.280 Cokie Culture says, could you all compile all of Dan's green screen clips into one video?

01:11:56.720 I think it would be fun to watch together.

01:11:58.680 It would.

01:11:59.060 Good news.

01:12:00.020 It is happening.

01:12:00.980 So, I think that is an excellent idea, and I will have a word with the buttons people

01:12:06.680 to do the editing thing, and see if we can make that happen.

01:12:10.260 That is happening, and it's a good thing.

01:12:11.820 Yes.

01:12:12.120 Pedro Ferrari says, congratulations to Mr. and Mrs. Stelios.

01:12:22.180 Yes, congratulations to them.

01:12:24.160 Right, some from yours.

01:12:25.680 So, Stephen Stevens says, Reform UK could have won many more votes if they ran candidates

01:12:30.640 in many more constituencies.

01:12:31.920 I, for one, had applied to be a PPC, but wasn't accepted for one reason or another.

01:12:38.640 There were others, I'm sure, but none were on my ballot.

01:12:41.800 As a result, I voted for another party that I had reserved.

01:12:45.020 A truly exceptional election indeed.

01:12:46.620 I think that was just a funding thing, wasn't it?

01:12:49.800 And it was also a very last minute, and it caught Reform unawares.

01:12:52.460 So, I think Reform got a bit of a candidate, an issue here with the whole candidates thing,

01:12:56.840 because, I mean, I was a candidate, and I knew some of the other candidates.

01:12:59.580 Some of them really were the absolute epitome of a paper candidate.

01:13:02.560 I mean, there was some of them who were just very old, and their only interaction with politics

01:13:07.740 was occasionally commenting in a telegraph comment section.

01:13:11.500 Now, it's fine all the time that you've got five MPs, because it can be driven on the personality

01:13:18.380 of Nigel Farage, but if they want to make the leap now from having a presence to being

01:13:23.200 official opposition, they're going to need some people who can actually understand what's

01:13:29.140 going on.

01:13:29.780 They can play the political game, but they understand the issues.

01:13:33.260 They might have some expertise.

01:13:35.040 They're going to need people with CVs.

01:13:36.580 And if they don't get that sorted out by next election, well, you can't run it on Nigel's

01:13:41.600 personality forever.

01:13:43.160 You have got to make that transition.

01:13:45.860 Fyodor Pinnock says, I think Dr. Parvini's threshold of under 100 seats for zero seats

01:13:50.520 victory was simply because dropping from three digits to two digits is a pretty significant

01:13:56.000 threshold.

01:13:56.740 It puts you on the same order of magnitude as the Lib Dems.

01:14:00.320 And the quotes here, they've dropped so far, they're not even three digits anymore, is a

01:14:05.620 pretty striking message, whereas above 100, they're still on that level and they don't

01:14:10.400 suffer that PR hammer blow.

01:14:12.540 To be fair, I think that the Tories did actually suffer a little bit from first past the post.

01:14:16.920 I think their percentage of votes and the actual seats they got, there was a little bit of

01:14:22.520 a mismatch there, as you get with some of the smaller parties.

01:14:25.820 Thomas Howell says, Dan, I'm waiting for the 12th when the full results are released,

01:14:31.960 because I think Helen Dale on the election stream is right, and we'll see reform being

01:14:35.820 second to a sizable chunk of the winning MPs.

01:14:38.860 We've already seen that.

01:14:40.140 I've been looking at some of the constituencies' vote counts, and actually, in a lot of areas

01:14:45.200 where Labour won, or the Tories won, reform was still second.

01:14:50.160 And I think they were at about 14% of the national vote when I looked this morning.

01:14:55.580 But it'll be interesting to see, once we've got more complete data, how that's looking.

01:15:00.940 Wasn't they projected to get something like 17% or something?

01:15:04.260 Yeah, I think there were some projections that were even things like 20%.

01:15:08.280 No, no, no, I mean, on these actual results, I mean, I know they're still plotting together

01:15:14.360 some of the numbers, but I thought it was a bit higher than that.

01:15:17.520 But yeah, second in 98 seats, so there's a strong basis to go for opposition next time.

01:15:22.340 Binary Surfer says, Josh gets it.

01:15:25.800 You cannot forgive them.

01:15:26.720 The party would require a complete reboot before it can be trusted again.

01:15:31.340 Vote for them again equals, you've now been fooled at least four times, even before we

01:15:35.860 talk about COVID.

01:15:36.860 Shame on anyone who voted for them.

01:15:40.400 Josh, the Jew Hendon reform candidate.

01:15:43.120 I did my bit for zero seats in Hendon, the most marginal seat in the country.

01:15:47.900 Labour beat the Tories by just 15 votes.

01:15:50.020 I came third with over 3,000 votes.

01:15:53.280 The Tory candidate was not best pleased.

01:15:55.220 Well, well done.

01:15:56.440 Yeah, he was a decent candidate as well, which is unfortunate, but that's the game.

01:16:00.920 So Chase Ball says, I find myself wondering if being in Canada, we are ahead of the UK

01:16:06.100 or behind them.

01:16:07.080 Our PPC would be the closest to the UK's reform and currently they hold zero seats and

01:16:13.400 are not very popular despite being far more based.

01:16:15.980 If Pierre's Conservatives turn out to be a massive flop when they inherited the leadership

01:16:20.540 of the sinking ship that is Trudeau's Liberals, I can see the PPC resemble reform's rise in

01:16:25.580 the UK.

01:16:26.460 Inversely, I could see Pierre learning from the Tories' failures and he would be wise to

01:16:31.300 see it as a warning before he betrays the populace for the globalist vampire hive mind.

01:16:36.280 What do we think?

01:16:39.140 The globalists would do anything to prevent the Conservatives from getting into power.

01:16:42.980 Just look at what we just did in France, yeah.

01:16:46.060 Paul Hawkins says, so the APAVU vote won then.

01:16:50.620 Yeah.

01:16:51.280 I suppose so, yeah.

01:16:53.040 That was a very apathetic response as well.

01:16:55.840 Ewan Baker says, and there is still sewage pouring into our sea in Folkestone.

01:17:01.300 If ever there was an analogy for the Conservative government, that would be it.

01:17:04.120 It is, yeah.

01:17:06.860 Chris Rees, my local MP, was Simon Hart.

01:17:09.680 I begged him to vote against the vaccine passport, although it had no bearing on Wales.

01:17:13.760 I didn't want England to suffer as we did down here.

01:17:16.640 Well, thank you very much for that.

01:17:17.720 That's very nice of you.

01:17:18.820 He replied with, all the experts say bollocks.

01:17:21.600 So I replied to him, vowing to make sure he was never, ever elected.

01:17:25.640 Job well done.

01:17:27.080 It's good to hear.

01:17:29.200 Let me know if you want me to move on to your segment.

01:17:31.780 Oh, right.

01:17:32.260 Yes.

01:17:32.540 Binary Surfer, who I'm hoping to get in, by the way, says, of Peter Hitchens, extremely

01:17:39.220 rude is a form of pearl clutching when somebody doesn't have an actual argument to counter

01:17:44.120 with.

01:17:44.760 Hitchens is ultimately just another person caught in the boomer mindset, disappointing.

01:17:49.680 Yeah.

01:17:52.040 I think there has been a genuine talking past each other with Peter Hitchens.

01:17:56.500 He just doesn't understand where we're coming from at all.

01:17:58.520 It's obtuse.

01:17:59.100 At some point, it's on purpose.

01:18:01.140 Because when you don't make an effort to meet in common ground and you just resort to ad hominem

01:18:05.740 instead, it's like you're making a point of it.

01:18:08.320 Yes.

01:18:08.720 He doesn't want to find common ground with you.

01:18:10.920 I think there certainly is something in his psychology where he has spent a lifetime because,

01:18:16.100 of course, he was a communist, a trot.

01:18:19.140 Yeah.

01:18:19.340 And he started rising in the media ranks.

01:18:22.960 And then he had his conversion.

01:18:24.400 He started moving to the right.

01:18:25.700 And it's often the case he carried on moving further than a lot of people who started on

01:18:30.960 the right.

01:18:31.600 So he spent, you know, best part of whatever it was, 30 years as being alone and being,

01:18:39.140 you know, somebody apart from everybody else.

01:18:42.000 And I think he'd hardened his mental defences when he still had that sort of youthful neuroplasticity.

01:18:48.240 He hardened his worldview about being a man apart from the rest.

01:18:52.260 And then the internet comes along and he finds out that there's thousands of fans out there

01:18:56.100 who are sort of enthusiastically backing him.

01:18:58.840 And he can't, and it's very jarring for his psychology to suddenly have all these supporters.

01:19:03.200 And he doesn't like it.

01:19:04.240 He's like, no, I want to be, I want to be all by myself.

01:19:07.660 Yeah.

01:19:08.160 The hermit mentality.

01:19:09.580 Perhaps.

01:19:10.400 Yeah.

01:19:10.640 Something like that.

01:19:11.760 Because it's just, it's almost a pathological contrarianism with some of this stuff.

01:19:17.180 I mean, you kind of wonder if the day of judgment comes and Satan turns up, whether we'll be

01:19:21.680 on his side, you know, when the Lord comes down to save us.

01:19:25.140 I don't actually want to win because I want to be in opposition.

01:19:28.020 It's that mentality, isn't it?

01:19:28.960 I want to be the lone soldier kind of thing.

01:19:32.360 Yeah.

01:19:32.700 It's quite sad because there are many people who support you.

01:19:35.500 We're on your side.

01:19:36.540 Yes.

01:19:37.300 You started this move.

01:19:38.080 I mean, there were thousands of them.

01:19:38.900 I mean, this is the thing.

01:19:40.040 So when a number of us first started responding to him quite positively on Twitter, he wouldn't

01:19:47.240 accept it.

01:19:48.300 And, you know, at one point he threw at me, oh, you're, you know, you don't appreciate

01:19:53.160 my work.

01:19:53.600 You never have.

01:19:54.300 And I then sent him back a photo of me with an arm full of his books and said, well, look,

01:19:59.100 I've got all your books.

01:19:59.940 I think this goes deeper.

01:20:01.600 I think this is probably why he follows no one on Twitter.

01:20:04.080 Why the way he interacts with people online is, it mirrors that psychology.

01:20:09.060 Well, he does follow somebody online now.

01:20:10.580 Does he?

01:20:11.080 Yeah.

01:20:11.280 Let's have a look.

01:20:13.080 Let me just see if I can find it.

01:20:14.480 He follows Rowan Pelling, who is described as writer, dawdler, escapist, eroticist, lifelong

01:20:24.640 barmaid, still listening, editor perspective of the erotica view.

01:20:29.440 Oh, sorry.

01:20:31.020 He also follows.

01:20:32.280 I'm not joking.

01:20:33.360 That's very lefty.

01:20:33.740 He also follows Peter Hitchens quotes and the real Peter Hitchens.

01:20:40.340 So, Roy Rowan Pelling gets a...

01:20:42.740 It's a small gripe, but it is a gripe.

01:20:44.940 The fact that he can't reply in a thread and keep a conversation going.

01:20:48.060 He has to always quote tweet.

01:20:49.540 It's like he's throwing it out there to his army to just jump on board and everything's

01:20:52.580 a pile on.

01:20:53.400 Nothing is in good faith.

01:20:55.700 Yes.

01:20:56.180 I mean, it didn't work when he did it against me and I suspect it didn't work when he

01:20:59.040 did it against you.

01:21:00.020 But it's a shame.

01:21:00.340 He got massively ratioed.

01:21:01.360 Let's have a good conversation.

01:21:02.220 We're all on the same side.

01:21:04.600 Well, are we, though?

01:21:05.500 Well, we should be.

01:21:05.840 I mean, are we trying to defend the same things?

01:21:08.140 We should be.

01:21:08.840 If he's just trying to defend the institutions of the 1950s, that's different to what I want.

01:21:13.600 Yeah.

01:21:13.880 Yeah.

01:21:14.660 Yeah.

01:21:15.920 All right.

01:21:16.540 Let's do some more.

01:21:19.120 Lord Nerovar says, apologies to anyone who's seen me ragging on Peter Hitchens all over

01:21:22.780 Twitter, but I really do feel we should be holding his feet to the fire over this.

01:21:25.800 His betrayal verging on that of the Tories themselves.

01:21:28.360 He may well have torpedoed zero seats for everyone.

01:21:31.100 He needs to get on message or get out the way.

01:21:33.600 Well, yeah, I mean, that's why I invited him on so he could have this conversation because

01:21:38.140 he has a very strong platform with the over 65s, but very little platform amongst the under

01:21:42.560 65s, whereas we're kind of the opposite.

01:21:45.040 I've seen people, a picture of lots of people, I think at Glastonbury with Peter Hitchens

01:21:52.500 t-shirts.

01:21:53.260 So they were young people.

01:21:55.000 You know, you'd be surprised.

01:21:56.100 Yeah.

01:21:56.560 I mean, there are a few, but, you know, our audiences generally don't overlap.

01:22:01.440 And I said, look, well, you can come on here and make a case to, because we are the biggest

01:22:04.620 online broadcaster by the BBC at this point, which is always complaining that he never gets

01:22:11.320 invited on.

01:22:12.040 But his retort to that was, why should I help you?

01:22:15.180 It's like, well, I wasn't trying to get you to help us, actually, but never mind.

01:22:20.640 Bleach Demon says, Hitchens to me is the embodiment of the boomer mentality on politics, currently

01:22:26.320 and vaguely right-leaning after spending a long time LARPing as a socialist, spent decades

01:22:31.160 tearing down institutions that don't suit him, and then when rotten fruits are borne

01:22:35.660 out, loudly beats the drums of preservation.

01:22:37.960 I have zero respect for Hitchens in particular, and this power-grasping boomer general mentality.

01:22:44.740 Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't say he's typical of the boomers, but there is certainly a bit

01:22:48.100 of a bit of that that seeps through.

01:22:50.260 I mean, actually, his original argument on the Tories, because his argument evolved a

01:22:57.060 number of times.

01:22:57.520 He first started putting it out, I think, in April, that we should be voting Tory, and

01:23:02.720 his original argument was, well, I don't want to have to live through a Labour government

01:23:06.120 in the last years of my life.

01:23:07.800 Right.

01:23:08.480 Now, he got dog-pawed on Twitter for that, because it was like the classic boomer take,

01:23:12.640 and then he evolved it to, well, it was possible to destroy the Tories in 2010, but it's

01:23:17.940 no longer possible.

01:23:18.920 And people kept pointing out, well, no, it's far, far more possible now.

01:23:23.080 And then you have the third evolution to, it's all about the Constitution, and about

01:23:27.700 how if you put Labour in, you'll never get them out, because 16-year-olds are all very

01:23:32.580 left-wing, Starmer supporters, apparently.

01:23:34.700 Which is also not true.

01:23:35.860 No.

01:23:36.100 Well, he's been saying, he was saying, you've never listened to me for quite some time.

01:23:41.520 I think it's very important to his psychology, because he feels like the world has betrayed

01:23:45.940 him, really.

01:23:46.700 And I think that that's why he's so bitter to the world.

01:23:49.120 This is what he said to me, you haven't even read my article, have you?

01:23:51.060 I was like, I have, and I quoted a piece from it, because I'm arguing, from an educated

01:23:54.760 standpoint, the assumption of ignorance, it's like, you guys have never supported me, you've

01:23:58.740 never read my work.

01:23:59.300 It's like, just, you know, come back to...

01:24:01.840 No, actually, actually, we have supported you, we admire your works.

01:24:06.560 Yeah, the expectation of hostility suggests to me that the world has been a bit hostile

01:24:10.400 to him, and he's sort of taken it to heart in a way that is unhealthy.

01:24:14.460 This is why the first question I asked is, is he okay?

01:24:18.280 Generally, yeah.

01:24:19.020 That's the thing I wonder.

01:24:21.220 Yeah.

01:24:22.380 Mr. Fubal says, my prime disagreement with Peter is on proportional representation.

01:24:27.220 It has been his point that it would deliver permanent left-wing weak governments.

01:24:31.600 It has just delivered a strong far-left one on 33% of the vote.

01:24:37.360 Yeah, so you're going to get a left-wing government either way, but, yeah, whether we're going

01:24:42.260 to vote our way out of this or not, I don't know.

01:24:45.980 The Unbreakable Litany says, re-Hitchings, how can one claim to be conservative and not

01:24:52.040 just view the people of the UK as its primary institution?

01:24:55.300 Yeah, quite.

01:24:58.680 Grant Gibson, Peter Hitchings seems to have simultaneously a need to be a contrarian and

01:25:05.600 correct.

01:25:06.580 He couldn't take the chance on calling on people to vote reform because it was both mainstream

01:25:12.460 on the right and ran the risk of being wrong.

01:25:15.300 Now he's on Twitter all weekend pretending that we can't look back and see what he was

01:25:19.480 saying earlier.

01:25:20.120 Um, yes.

01:25:23.800 But Mason Roy says, it turns out that Hitchings was not a political commentator that was ahead

01:25:28.720 of his time.

01:25:29.300 Instead, he was just a grumpy contrarian that revels being on misunderstood a pariah.

01:25:33.460 It makes him feel also intelligent, like he knows some forbidden truth that only his intellect

01:25:38.180 could comprehend.

01:25:39.680 Once calling for the extermination of the Tories became a popular rallying cry.

01:25:42.940 His ego demanded he take the opposite position just so he could return to the misunderstood

01:25:47.000 genius that he thinks he is.

01:25:48.920 I think that's nail on the head right there.

01:25:51.560 Yeah.

01:25:52.420 Yeah.

01:25:52.700 Well, it could be that.

01:25:53.320 I mean, or it could be that, um, he's not trying to preserve what we're trying to preserve.

01:25:58.780 It's something else.

01:25:59.680 It's a set of institutions.

01:26:01.900 If you, if you're watching, Peter, come on, let us know.

01:26:03.940 Um, Lord Nervar says, zero seats failed primarily because of first past the post.

01:26:09.960 Scrap it.

01:26:12.000 Um.

01:26:16.120 Yeah.

01:26:16.540 I mean, even though on, even on, what was it, what was the Frenchist?

01:26:19.360 Was the Frenchist in first past the post?

01:26:21.780 I don't think so, but I'm split on this.

01:26:24.280 No, the parliamentary one.

01:26:25.460 I don't think it was, was it?

01:26:26.760 I'm not sure.

01:26:27.240 If we get rid of first past the post, parties like Reform have a greater chance of getting

01:26:32.120 more seats, but also so do the Mohammedans.

01:26:34.800 There are a lot of, what, five Islamists who got seats and also five Reform candidates who

01:26:39.000 got seats.

01:26:39.080 Yeah.

01:26:39.180 So the people of this country have the same number of MPs representing them as the people

01:26:44.000 of Gaza do.

01:26:44.960 Yeah.

01:26:45.860 And meanwhile, the globalist institutions and the banks have the other 640 MPs.

01:26:50.780 Right.

01:26:51.240 I think, uh, perhaps having Islamists in members of parliament, although it'd be sacrilegious,

01:26:56.360 would also, um, be a bit of a wake up call when they start chanting Allahu Akbar in

01:27:01.420 a place like that.

01:27:02.420 But yeah, you're right.

01:27:03.600 But I think it's, we're already there, but there's so much denial.

01:27:05.760 People won't see it.

01:27:06.500 Look at just Phillips.

01:27:07.440 That's true.

01:27:08.040 Keep saying, oh, well, there's toxic masculinity.

01:27:10.020 It's because they're men that they're attacking me.

01:27:11.440 Not because of their faith.

01:27:12.640 It has nothing to do with it.

01:27:14.080 That is so dishonest, isn't it?

01:27:15.400 She knows what the real reason is.

01:27:17.340 Well, she's been feeding the crocodile for so long now.

01:27:19.120 She can't acknowledge that.

01:27:20.440 I don't know.

01:27:20.980 I don't know what they, what they understand, what they don't.

01:27:23.500 I mean, they, they could be in the houses of parliament with a bomb, a bomb vest on shouting

01:27:27.720 Allahu Akbar.

01:27:28.380 I should still say, look, it's because he's oppressed and he's from a, he's from a, I

01:27:31.900 don't know, ethnic minority background and this and that.

01:27:34.320 They would never say Mohammedanism is a problem.

01:27:37.320 Yeah.

01:27:39.400 Um, Nicole Spinner says, time to accept he isn't on our side.

01:27:42.600 Certainly not worth replying to on X.

01:27:45.080 Yeah.

01:27:45.280 I'm not replying to him on X anymore.

01:27:46.480 Like I said, I'll let him scream in the wind and, uh, get all the attention he needs from

01:27:49.580 his supporters, but he's not going to get it from mine.

01:27:51.300 I'll just leave him to it.

01:27:52.440 Yeah.

01:27:52.680 Bless him.

01:27:53.480 It's, it's, it's such a shame.

01:27:54.780 Such a shame.

01:27:55.660 Um, Josh Loverd, head to toe in liquid painkillers.

01:27:59.900 Okay.

01:28:00.620 That's true.

01:28:01.400 Says, I think Hitchens is just an arch contrarian.

01:28:04.320 Back in 2010, most of the right wing supported the conservatives, so he opposed them.

01:28:09.580 Now, um, he's in a pro-reform UK right wing echo chamber on Twitter.

01:28:13.820 So he opposes UK, reform UK party to support the Tories.

01:28:18.620 Maybe.

01:28:19.780 Yes.

01:28:20.080 Uh, Mr. Fibble says, I think Peter has been treated somewhat unfairly.

01:28:25.260 If I disagree with some of his points, people keep, uh, waving his destroy the Tory party

01:28:30.360 statement at him as if circumstances don't change and people can't change their minds

01:28:34.840 based on them.

01:28:35.980 Yeah.

01:28:36.080 But what are the circumstances that change?

01:28:37.760 Like I said, I quoted the article earlier and I've, I've, I've searched that articles.

01:28:41.480 I've looked through his other articles.

01:28:42.760 I've read a lot of his Twitter stuff.

01:28:44.420 I can't see the argument that he's making.

01:28:46.700 No, the circumstances have changed, but they're more in favor of his arguments.

01:28:49.820 And now he can change his mind, but then he has to be honest about changing his mind, which

01:28:53.200 he hasn't been.

01:28:54.280 So maybe it'd be helpful if he stated his underlying assumptions, what he values most

01:28:59.320 dearly.

01:29:00.100 Yeah.

01:29:00.260 Is it the people or is it the institutions?

01:29:03.700 Because if, and the thing is, we, we could, we could sort this argument out in an afternoon

01:29:08.300 if he engaged with good faith with any of us, but he won't do so.

01:29:12.500 He just, he just calls us names in the hope that we'd do it back and then he can claim

01:29:16.000 the victory.

01:29:16.620 So yeah, very sad.

01:29:18.760 Um, and I think that's run out of comments.

01:29:20.620 We have some honorable mentions quickly.

01:29:22.140 Oh, go on then.

01:29:22.920 Um, so JJHW says, Stanios is getting married and hasn't invited me.

01:29:28.800 Sorry to hear that.

01:29:29.660 That's why he didn't invite me either.

01:29:31.580 Um, Russian garbage human, uh, says the 19th anniversary of the seven, seven bombings

01:29:35.680 was yesterday.

01:29:36.220 Uh, both Keir Starmer in the home office and plenty of other places tweeted 52 lost their

01:29:40.980 lives.

01:29:41.820 No, they were murdered.

01:29:43.420 Um, such dishonest framing all over.

01:29:45.480 This wasn't an accident.

01:29:47.160 Despicable.

01:29:47.940 Um, might make a video comment just on this.

01:29:50.120 Do look back in anger.

01:29:51.440 I wholeheartedly agree.

01:29:52.560 And I think that people who are apologists for terrorists are traitors to this country

01:29:56.160 and have a hand in the murder of those innocent people.

01:29:59.220 A hundred percent.

01:30:00.040 They keep feeding the crocodile.

01:30:01.100 They won't address what the issue was on seven, seven.

01:30:03.180 Just like we'd lost some life.

01:30:04.240 No, we didn't lose lives.

01:30:05.420 Mohammedans murdered people in our capital city.

01:30:07.660 And that's a problem that's still going on.

01:30:10.180 Yeah.

01:30:11.660 Well, Dan, it's a.

01:30:14.720 Cool.

01:30:14.960 We got to the end.

01:30:15.800 Yes.

01:30:16.140 Right.

01:30:16.400 Well, thank you very much, Calvin and, uh, Josh.

01:30:19.900 Thank you.

01:30:20.280 And all of you.

01:30:22.080 And me.

01:30:22.820 Thank you for me as well.

01:30:24.180 Cheerio.

01:30:24.820 I'll be back on Thursday at 3 p.m. on Calvin's Common Sense Crusade.

01:30:27.760 Mm-hmm.

01:30:29.000 Mm-hmm.

01:30:30.840 Mm-hmm.

01:30:31.800 Mm-hmm.

01:30:33.800 Thanks for having me.

01:30:34.280 Mm-hmm.

01:30:35.080 Mm-hmm.

01:30:35.560 Mm-hmm.

01:30:37.120 Mm-hmm.

01:30:38.320 Mm-hmm.

01:30:38.480 Mm-hmm.

01:30:38.700 Mm-hmm.

01:30:41.260 Mm-hmm.

01:30:41.400 Mm-hmm.

01:30:41.840 Mm-hmm.

01:30:42.080 Oh, yeah.

01:30:44.140 Mm-hmm.

01:30:44.160 Mm-hmm.

01:30:44.820 Mm-hmm.

01:30:45.280 Mm-hmm.

01:30:53.480 Mm-hmm.

01:30:54.060 Mm-hmm.

01:30:54.080 Mm-hm.

01:30:54.740 Mm-hmm.

01:30:54.860 Mm-hmm.

01:30:55.580 Mm-hmm.

The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters - July 08, 2024

The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #951

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