The Roseanne Barr Podcast

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00:00:49.260 What is it? Nafilam, Anunnaki, Time Travelers. We should do bots now after that story broke about

00:00:58.100 the right-wing influencers getting paid by Iran and Russia. We should welcome the bots too.

00:01:02.360 Iran bots, Qatari bots, you know, the devil's minions, Nazis, whoever's here. I guess God sent

00:01:12.360 your consciousness dead. You were magnetized to it. But above all else, of all living beings,

00:01:18.480 animals, the most intelligent of all beings. Because unlike humans, they don't need to bullshit

00:01:24.060 themselves to enjoy the joy of living. Welcome to the Roseanne Barr podcast.

00:01:36.940 Well, y'all know how I love to talk to geniuses. In particular, I love talking to women geniuses

00:01:44.520 because there are so few and far between of them. Most women are just blithering fucking idiots that

00:01:51.460 do whatever men want them to do. I'm so sick of it. But anyway, we've got one today, a b-b-b-b-b-banger

00:02:00.300 of a show. She's a friend and a kindred spirit and somebody who's gone through a lot of stuff with

00:02:11.780 the same network I went through a lot of shit with and also has a great podcast and is an incredible

00:02:19.600 human being. So help me welcome stage steel. Thank you. Sage steel. I've been called a lot

00:02:27.240 worse. Sage steel. Hi. Sage. I can't believe I'm in Roseanne's studio. This is freaking cool.

00:02:36.280 Oh, we're happy to have you here. Thank you. We love you. I loved you before you loved me though.

00:02:42.720 Yeah. That's okay. You hear that a lot. But now I love you more than you love me because it's not

00:02:48.600 possible for you to love me more than I love you since I'm way older than you. Just a little. I

00:02:54.620 understand love way more than you. Well, we met Sage on Bertram, right? You want to tell people or you?

00:03:02.000 Oh yeah, we did that show with Adi. Carola, yeah. For Daily Wire. Yep. For Daily Wire. Do you remember how I was a late

00:03:08.220 add to that? That's what I was going to talk about. Yeah. No, I didn't know anything about it. What's that?

00:03:12.100 She replaced Klandis. That's what we call her now. Oh, is that true? Yeah. Candis got fired from Daily Wire. It was

00:03:19.200 going to be her role and they put Sage in. So you were added like weeks before? Oh, it was like three weeks

00:03:24.320 before it came out. Yeah. And I had never done that kind of voiceover, which is done before the edit, right?

00:03:33.760 I mean, well before. And what I learned because I was in just the live TV world is that they,

00:03:39.600 you know, they match everything to your tone, your cadence, all of it. So Candis was, her job was

00:03:46.740 completed. She was done and everything was ready to go with her voice and everything in it. And then

00:03:52.940 they fired her. So they needed another black female conservative, I guess. And I don't know how many

00:03:58.800 there are of us. Publicly. I know there's a lot of us privately, but publicly. So they had me come in. But it

00:04:03.900 was so hard because I had to, we're doing it backwards and I had to go in and try to match every single

00:04:10.040 thing she did. And if it, if that one sentence was 4.2 seconds. So you had to like embody Candis. Yeah.

00:04:16.140 Kind of. Yeah. Was that scary? There's a lot there. Was it? Did that scare you? Nope. Nope. Because you know what?

00:04:22.480 I don't think, I think Candis today, June 2025 is different than Candis May 2024. Yeah. Definitely

00:04:31.320 different. And I, I wasn't fully understanding what exactly had happened with her at Daily Wire. And I

00:04:37.580 don't know that I fully do still understand this. All I know is that I got the call and love and worship

00:04:43.360 Adam Carolla. So hell yeah, I'm going to say yes to that. It was just such a process to have to recreate

00:04:51.180 her voice, her tone. That's weird. Yeah, that'd be weird. And as you know, like in those little

00:04:56.180 segments. You had to match the voice. Match the voice. I mean, and not, obviously I can't match

00:05:00.940 her voice specifically. No, the timing. The timing is impossible. So the edit is within, you

00:05:06.120 know, 1 18th of a second. Yeah. And it was like, do it over and go 1 18th of a second slower.

00:05:10.680 And I'm like, huh, how do I do that? That's hard. So it was hard. And then they didn't do

00:05:15.380 another season, did they? No, I guess it got shit canned. That might be my fault. No,

00:05:21.940 they're still trying to shop it, but it's not going to be on the Daily Wire. That's all

00:05:25.220 I know. Well, that was a fun show. I enjoyed it. And they told me, the writer said, wait

00:05:30.860 till second season because we've got you doing all kinds of crazy stuff, which I loved because

00:05:36.700 I love being a huge bombastic character because, you know, after Roseanne, that would just be

00:05:46.460 so fun to be like, she was a, a, an ex Marine and she is beating guys up in a bar. I loved

00:05:54.600 it. It was great. And it was, you know, we, we watched it that premiere with, you know, a

00:06:00.360 live audience and it was cool for me to watch you in that theater while everyone else is

00:06:07.220 reacting to you. It was beautiful. I had never been part of it. That's Hollywood. That's not

00:06:12.020 my world. So that was my first time being part of anything like that. But then to be sitting

00:06:16.320 right near you and watching their reaction was really cool. You probably saw me roaring

00:06:21.320 at myself. Oh, your cackles really were louder than anybody else. And they were at times where

00:06:28.140 everybody else was quiet, right? That's how it is. You should have gotten to see Ace Ventura

00:06:32.200 with her. We saw that six times in the theater. She ruined the experience for everybody. I

00:06:36.320 love that movie so much. Ace Ventura and Sleeper. Yeah. I urinated on myself. What do you mean

00:06:43.360 she ruined it? Do you ever see Cape Fear when Robert De Niro's got the cigar and he's like,

00:06:47.140 I'm ruining the movie for everyone. That was her in the crowd at Ace Ventura. I can't stop

00:06:50.900 laughing. She laughed uncontrollably. And she, I'm not kidding. She went five times to the

00:06:55.360 theater and laughed as hard every time. And people would move from the theater around

00:06:59.080 her because they couldn't hear the movie. But it was that good. Ace Ventura is the greatest

00:07:04.120 comedy I've ever seen. I have underrated. Hysterical. But it was. He never did anything

00:07:07.440 as good after. Yeah. He's changed too. He's another one of those. Yeah. But that was cool

00:07:13.560 for me to see it. And I had never, I'd never been around your mom. You know, I'd never been

00:07:17.380 around you. So to witness that and your genuine cackles in between made us laugh harder.

00:07:21.620 You know, it was great. But my favorite part was in the bar after. Like the next day, I guess,

00:07:29.060 wasn't it? Or was it that afternoon before maybe? I don't remember. But we sat there for a couple

00:07:33.120 hours at the bar in that hotel in LA, wherever we were. That was, I think, after. Yeah, that was a lot

00:07:39.620 of fun. I think it was the next day. That was the day I went down out of our hotel and walked down to

00:07:45.940 get a drink because our hotel was a piece of shit that didn't have alcohol before 6 p.m.,

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00:09:40.680 shipping. Don't wait. Cleanse your body and take back control today. And I'm like, oh Christ, here we go.

00:09:48.540 I gotta act nice. And up comes, oh, I can't remember her name. She's the, I don't know her name.

00:09:56.920 Oh, I forget everybody's name. She's a stand-up comic. She's got a show coming out. Oh, she's got a big show

00:10:01.440 now. She's like Roseanne of your ilk. Yeah, she's so brilliant. Morgan, Leanne Morgan. And I'm like,

00:10:11.480 damn, I love you. What are you doing here? Well, she was doing something. And of course,

00:10:18.080 she don't drink or anything. She's got a clean lifestyle, which is disgusting. But yet, she was

00:10:25.540 still funny and adorable. And I sat there with her a couple of hours, and I just love her. She is such

00:10:32.960 a great comic, and that was a delight. And then I staggered back home, and we went in the, I don't

00:10:41.320 know what we did, but I just remember drinking with you. You're a fun drinking partner. Yeah, we had a

00:10:45.680 really good time. Me and Jake were like, she's real. She can, first of all, she can carry her

00:10:50.720 liquor, and then she gets even more interesting. You've had a really interesting life. Okay, wait.

00:10:56.980 So, so my fiance is sitting over in the corner. Is he handsome enough? He's hot, right? Oh my God,

00:11:03.560 that guy's gorgeous. He thinks I'm a lightweight though, and now you're giving away like the real

00:11:08.720 deep, dark secrets. That's just when she's on a trip without you. That I'm a lush. Well, you have

00:11:13.800 to pretend you're sweet and sober till the marriage. You're getting married this year. I am. I'm getting

00:11:20.540 married in September. Congrats. So that's only a few months where you got to act like you're okay. I

00:11:25.660 have to behave a little bit longer. Then you trap him. Exactly. And hey, I mean, once they put a ring

00:11:31.060 on it, it's over. That's right. They can't get out now. It's over. It's totally over. Yeah, now the

00:11:35.820 things come out. Anyway, I got to tell you guys yesterday that, and this is like another one of

00:11:40.260 our kind of spiritual connections, but I met him just last fall. So yes, it's quick. Get out of my

00:11:46.340 mentions. Yes, it's fast. But when you're old, you can do that. Yeah. It's not really though. You have

00:11:50.000 a history. You're 50 plus. You have a history. Well, but our history is something that we didn't know

00:11:54.740 until we met, but our mothers have been friends for 32 years. Oh my God, that's God given right there.

00:12:01.040 Yes. So if he dumped me, his mom would be pissed. So that's the thing. I feel like I'm protected

00:12:07.580 by a lot of people. You are. You got a hedge. Because our moms like each other more than they

00:12:10.800 like us. Yes. So he's kind of stuck already. See, you've got that hedge of protection around

00:12:15.820 you. She's going to gain like 250 pounds this time next year. He don't care. You don't care,

00:12:22.220 right? No, he cares. Oh my God, look at the way he looks at you. Yeah, who trapped you here?

00:12:27.960 It's so huge. Look at that ring. Oh my Lord. I know. Look at that ring, son. It's beautiful. I

00:12:34.080 have a funny, kind of a funny story. So we hang out at the bar, right? Yeah. We want to get back on

00:12:37.960 track a little. And we love Sage. Like she's the best. I get her number. She tells us that she has

00:12:44.240 help. I don't want to give too much away, but she- Help, yes. You successfully sued Disney.

00:12:50.420 Correct. Oh my God, you're our idol. And you won. Right, but real quick- We settled. So does that

00:12:56.520 mean- Okay, we'll get back to that. Yes. I just want to say, so I got her number and then I put in

00:13:00.820 the wrong number. Of course you did. He's horribly dyslexic. All my kids are dyslexic. I didn't know

00:13:06.340 that. And she doesn't respond to me for a year. Nuh-uh. Yeah. And I'm texting her. I'm like, okay,

00:13:10.900 man, she's a fake. Another fucking Hollywood fake. Oh my God. I was so mad at you. And

00:13:14.840 then Sage, another project comes up and she calls me and she's like, I miss you guys and

00:13:18.540 talked to you. And I noticed right then it was a totally different phone number. And

00:13:22.300 I'd been cursing you for like a year. Wait, you cursed at me? Well, you weren't responding

00:13:26.020 to my text. Okay. I was very upset. Wow. He goes, Sage hates us. He said, mom, she acted

00:13:32.960 like she liked us, but she hates us. Yep, one big fake. No, I'm a terrible actress. I apologize.

00:13:38.520 But what I left from that, that to me was the best, and I'm not saying this because

00:13:42.560 you're here. I told my mom and dad right away, I'm like the best part of the Bertram

00:13:46.660 thing. Besides seeing Megyn Kelly, who's one of my idols. She's a doll. And talk about

00:13:51.600 brilliant and goals. Yeah, she's fierce as hell. She is. And we had the same attorney

00:13:55.420 with, because she was with NBC when she got canceled and Brian Friedman is the attorney

00:14:00.820 and then I had him. Chris Harrison from The Bachelor, he had Brian Friedman. He's one that's

00:14:06.440 with Justin Baldoni now and that thing's not over, not over. Yeah. But anyway, I left

00:14:12.640 and told my mom and dad, I'm like, oh my gosh, you know when you have an impression of somebody

00:14:18.160 and then, but then you're almost afraid to meet them because you're afraid you're going

00:14:21.580 to be disappointed. Isn't that what everybody says? Don't meet your idols. Don't meet people

00:14:25.440 that you love who are famous because they're going to disappoint you. You were so shockingly

00:14:30.940 nice. That's a compliment. I hope you take it that way. Because of Hollywood people.

00:14:35.420 I don't like them. They're not my people. No, they're not. And they're not, that's not

00:14:39.500 who you are though. And I was so blown away at how genuine you were and look me in the

00:14:46.660 eye and were interested and just talking to me as a human being. Like I didn't feel

00:14:51.840 like I was annoying you, I guess. No, you weren't annoying. It was really special.

00:14:55.220 You were very fun and very interesting and intelligent. I'm glad your son doesn't hate

00:14:59.480 me anymore. Yeah, we were so relieved. I go, you fucking idiot. You always write everyone's

00:15:04.520 numbered down. Actually, that's not true. It's the first time I've ever, honestly, the

00:15:07.940 first time I've ever done that that I know of. No, it isn't. There have been a few people

00:15:11.440 that have iced this. Maybe I've done one of the ones. But it doesn't matter. The bottom

00:15:14.440 line is we're here and we're all friends and I'm very happy about it. Now I get to get

00:15:19.640 really nosy about all the things I want to know. Let's get into it. Well, real quick, you

00:15:23.100 were at ESPN SportsCenter. You were canceled. I was. I feel like that's a badge of honor

00:15:28.380 now to be canceled. Do you want to ask about that later or get into it? Yeah, because I wanted

00:15:32.200 to know what made her tick to get there. Oh. I mean, I know you, your dad was in the

00:15:38.200 military. Yes, ma'am. And so you grew up in the military, right? Yeah. So when people

00:15:44.040 say where are you from, like pick a place, all of them. I was, I'd lived in four countries

00:15:50.620 by the time I was 11. Jeez. So like all over. And I could speak a couple languages. I mean,

00:15:56.660 a little. And now hopefully English is perfected, but that's all I got. Yeah. I grew up just moving

00:16:05.380 and knowing that every two years or so that we're going to go on a new adventure. And that's

00:16:09.700 how my mom approached it was because it was hard, right? And you make friends and then this

00:16:14.520 is way pre-internet. I mean, I'm 52 now. So this is in the eighties when you have friends in junior

00:16:21.220 high and high school. Yeah. And you don't, you can't text them or snap them or email them even.

00:16:27.360 Right. It's a handwritten letter where you licked a postage stamp and you send a letter away to your

00:16:32.800 little best friend and it takes a week to get there. And then two weeks later you might get a

00:16:37.360 response, but therefore you couldn't keep friends. Yeah. You know those, you remember those days. Yeah.

00:16:41.920 And so it was hard to every couple of years say goodbye to friends and have to start over and hope

00:16:47.020 that you get invited to the birthday parties or get picked for kickball at recess when you're the

00:16:51.680 new kid. But the beauty of it is that in the military, all the kids feel that. And so they're

00:16:57.780 all very welcoming. Our neighbors, the adults are welcoming. Everybody would bring over a bottle

00:17:03.020 of wine and some banana bread and say, here's my phone number if you need us. It was genuine. It was

00:17:08.040 the best upbringing. It's a real community. Such a community and so diverse. Yeah. Before we,

00:17:14.660 I even knew what diversity was. It just, people get mad. A lot of people get mad when you say

00:17:20.400 that you don't see color. Yeah. Obviously we see it. Like don't take it literally, but that's

00:17:25.480 not what you lead with. Right. And then that's what it is in the military. It didn't lead with

00:17:29.420 white, black, Asian, a lot of interracial marriages. I come from a interracial marriage

00:17:34.480 as well and it just didn't matter. It was the most, I say diverse, but protected. Yeah.

00:17:41.760 And secluded, not secluded. What's the word I'm looking for? Protected. Insulated. Insulated.

00:17:46.280 Yeah. I mean, I was. Well, don't you think it's because you all have a common goal and a common

00:17:52.520 viewpoint and you're not easily divided like the civilians are in our country? Yeah. And maybe the

00:18:00.480 timing, you know, probably made a difference as well in the, in the eighties and living in different

00:18:06.780 countries, but yeah, you're on an American base. We went to school on an American base. And even

00:18:13.880 though people have different political opinions, I can look back now and kind of see some of it.

00:18:18.040 There was respect and it didn't matter. And the goal was the same. And that was to represent our

00:18:22.380 country. Right. As Americans. Right. Respectfully. And with respect to where we were living, I lived in

00:18:30.140 Belgium. I lived in Greece. My Girl Scout troop would go to Paris for the day. You know, I would

00:18:36.400 get annoyed because I'm like, oh my God, we have to go to Paris again because family would come visit

00:18:41.240 from the States. Or my third grade field trip was to the Acropolis, which was 45 minutes away from our

00:18:46.020 house when I lived in Greece. That's amazing.

00:18:48.740 But as Americans, you, like we knew to have respect for their culture, just like we hope today that they

00:18:55.280 have respect for ours, which is a whole different story. But it was just a beautiful, innocent. I was

00:19:00.920 very naive because of it, because it was insulated and people were just kind. But I had the, people

00:19:08.420 say, well, what is it like? You don't have a hometown to go to. It's true. I don't know where home is.

00:19:13.740 Home is where I am at that moment.

00:19:15.460 That's what home is though.

00:19:17.080 I agree. I don't have a hometown. Like to take my kids back to where I went to elementary school or

00:19:23.020 where my, you know, first t-ball game was. Like I don't have that. It's impossible. But

00:19:30.020 I wouldn't change it. I thought that was normal. I did get back to the States in seventh grade and

00:19:35.140 I was like, what do you mean you guys have known each other since kindergarten? That's so weird.

00:19:38.800 Why would you want to know someone for that long? You know?

00:19:41.480 Yeah.

00:19:41.700 So I think there's positives and negatives to both, but I had the best upbringing.

00:19:46.700 Where did your parents meet? I'm just nosy because they're, you know, a mixed couple.

00:19:52.060 Yeah. And I wonder where, where did that meet and what year? Because that was, that's an

00:19:58.380 interesting thing for America. It is, especially considering in October, it'll be their 54th

00:20:03.720 wedding anniversary. Oh my God. That's amazing. I know. I know. Um, and you know what I say

00:20:10.680 to people when I'm on stage and I ask how long they've been married and they say things like

00:20:14.860 that 54 years, all the time, all over America. So I always go, why?

00:20:22.240 It's a great question. They met in 1970, right when my dad graduated from West Point.

00:20:29.460 Well, Ma, we've been traveling. We've been in Texas for a little while now, like a few months

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00:20:47.380 say, Hey, I want to cook a big meal, big family gathering. Let's do the, you know, the raw

00:20:51.440 ingredients. I think it's like the Lord has just put stuff on my porch. You know, I forget

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00:21:50.700 come. You have to subscribe. What was your mom doing? She was a flight attendant for Eastern

00:21:55.540 Airlines. Back in the day when being a flight attendant was a big deal. Yeah, it was. It

00:22:01.900 was fancy. And I mean, can you imagine these people today having to adjust to the rules of

00:22:08.900 like my mother would have to get on a scale. They would weigh her before every flight. We

00:22:13.420 have to go back. Sorry. I know. That's amazing. I know. But like their hair had to be tied back

00:22:18.920 for a certain length. Yeah. It was fancy. It's kind of like the military. Actually, it was

00:22:24.680 with the uniforms. But it was a privilege to be a flight attendant. And everybody dressed

00:22:30.860 up. Everybody. Yeah. When you're traveling, it was glamorous. Yeah. And so anyway, that's

00:22:35.440 what she was stationed. She was based, not stationed, based in New York City. Grew up in

00:22:39.840 a small town in Massachusetts, West Springfield, Mass. You know, blue collar, Catholic, all white

00:22:47.940 town. So my mom's half Irish, half Italian. You'll like this. My grandfather's name was

00:22:54.240 William Edward O'Neill. So that's her Irish side. And my grandmother was Filomena Lina

00:22:59.620 de Portola. Wow. So the Irish and Italian. My mother actually is beautiful, looks a lot

00:23:06.440 like you, just with green eyes, white hair, kind of spiked. She's gorgeous. She's almost

00:23:11.620 76. And so super white Irish Italian mom. And then my very black, beautiful dad, who also

00:23:20.040 was a military brat. And they had a birthday party for him after he graduated from West

00:23:23.660 Point in 1970. And she showed up. And actually, on my show, The Sage Deal Show, thank you. You

00:23:30.960 would love this, Roseanne and Jake. I just got to sit down with my parents. I did an hour

00:23:35.460 and a half, two hours. Oh, how awesome. With my mom and dad. And heard things that I had

00:23:39.540 never heard from my parents about their relationship. A lot of tears. I did it so long after I'm

00:23:48.860 gone. Great, great grandkids. They can see the why and how I found strength to stand up

00:23:58.900 for myself much later on. But what they went through makes my step up. Did they go through

00:24:03.820 a lot? Yeah, they did. And that's why I think I have good perspective that my cancellation

00:24:09.760 and those struggles weren't fun and super hurtful and changed my life. But it's nothing compared

00:24:15.940 to what so many others go through, frankly, including my parents in some ways. They got

00:24:21.620 married in 1971. And, you know, my mom's family, my mom's not her family, her parents disowned

00:24:28.520 her. Oh, God. The Irish side, probably, though, right? I don't know. No, it was more my grandmother's

00:24:35.460 Italian side, which is interesting. But you have to, what, what, first of all... You never

00:24:40.340 know what people are going to do. You don't. And we had an incredible conversation about

00:24:45.300 this, actually, at a bar right here in your town last night. My fiance and I did last night

00:24:49.320 where, you know, it took six or seven years. And my mom's parents came back. Oh, cool.

00:24:55.760 Yeah. Forgiveness. Never forget, but forgiveness and a lot of healing. And it ended up being

00:25:01.200 a beautiful relationship. And I got to know them, too. So it was great. But whenever I

00:25:06.300 tell the story, people are like, oh, it's so shitty. Yes, it's shitty. And you have to

00:25:12.080 understand where people come from. It's not an excuse for bad behavior, for racism.

00:25:16.100 Right.

00:25:16.400 Right.

00:25:16.720 But you have to respect their viewpoint. And if they had never been around black people...

00:25:21.900 Right.

00:25:22.260 And in their small Catholic town in Massachusetts, in the 1960s and early 70s, it's foreign to

00:25:30.420 them. And if all you saw is what was on TV, that black people are... I mean, the way that

00:25:37.140 they were referred to as Negroes, and they're inferior. And then they only show clips of violence.

00:25:43.180 Yep.

00:25:43.760 That's what you think is real. Well, then sometimes it's understandable why they were afraid for

00:25:50.180 their daughter. And then they learned. I think the coolest, coolest thing that I learned about

00:25:57.380 my parents that changed me and, again, my perspective on all my crap later... I didn't

00:26:02.760 know this about my parents until about six years ago. They got married. Her mom and dad did not show up

00:26:09.500 at the wedding. That's hard.

00:26:11.340 Her brother did, though, who was 20 at the time and walked her down the aisle. They got

00:26:17.060 married at West Point, where my dad had graduated from. And then we're stationed in Panama, where

00:26:22.260 I was born, Canal Zone.

00:26:23.720 Yeah.

00:26:23.880 Oh.

00:26:24.200 And my dad, apparently, from the moment they got married, and I don't know for how long,

00:26:29.480 Dave, did they say for years, once a month, would pull out a pen and paper and write my mom's

00:26:36.420 parents a letter, just to let them know that she's okay and that he is taking care of their

00:26:42.760 daughter.

00:26:43.460 Oh, my God. Your dad is something else.

00:26:45.660 I'm going to send you the video clip.

00:26:47.260 I have chills from your dad.

00:26:48.500 Every month for years, he did that and sent it to my... And in the video, you'll see my mom,

00:26:55.020 and she's like, I told him it's a waste of time. I told him don't do it. And he kind of...

00:26:59.000 You could see him get tight, and he was like, I needed them to know that despite what they

00:27:03.260 thought of me, I was taking care of their daughter. And I was like, oh, my God.

00:27:08.020 What a guy.

00:27:08.940 He didn't know if they ever read the letters, but he was doing the right thing. And so when

00:27:15.200 your family leaves you, and again, comes back, and we are all so close to this day. And even

00:27:22.300 friends back in 1971 didn't agree with an interracial marriage. It had just become legalized

00:27:29.360 a few years prior.

00:27:30.180 Yeah, right.

00:27:30.860 My mom and dad got to be...

00:27:32.120 And 65.

00:27:33.180 Right? So this is so new. My mom and dad got to be like this. Their relationship was so

00:27:39.300 close because they knew all they had was each other.

00:27:41.400 Them against the world.

00:27:42.460 Yes. That's why... 54 years.

00:27:45.040 Yeah.

00:27:45.180 That's why they're my heroes. And that's why they've... Gosh, it's just humbling to see what

00:27:51.940 they went through. And that's the other reason why I call BS on all these people who talk

00:27:56.200 about, oh, my gosh, being a black person in America today, Whoopi Goldberg, give me a

00:27:59.940 break. Like, I can't with them because Whoopi understands, too. And she's full of it. And

00:28:05.020 it's disappointing. But that's the kind of upbringing I had.

00:28:09.260 I'll smack that bitch right across her face if she ever has the displeasure to run into

00:28:13.700 me.

00:28:14.440 Can I be there to witness it?

00:28:16.320 Yeah, we have to set that in.

00:28:17.780 Can I hold her arms back while you do it?

00:28:21.300 She's just an ugly soul. She's an ugly soul.

00:28:24.240 She didn't used to be, though, I feel like.

00:28:26.320 They never were. There's conditioning happening.

00:28:29.000 I think they make her be that way on ABC. ABC is just a racist bullshit company. It really

00:28:35.480 is horrible. But let's go to your dad going to West Point. That was a big deal for a black

00:28:43.600 man.

00:28:44.360 It was.

00:28:44.900 In the, what, 60s?

00:28:46.320 Yeah, he started there. His first year was 1965.

00:28:51.300 Wow.

00:28:52.760 And he was a football player and a track athlete. His grades were pretty good to get in.

00:28:57.700 My dad was a football player, too.

00:28:59.460 He was?

00:28:59.820 Uh-huh. Jerry Barr, the boy built like a barrel. He was the center.

00:29:05.000 Oh, if you're the center, you're like the captain of the office.

00:29:08.360 Yeah, uh-huh.

00:29:08.600 And that was your guy. He's the one that you fell in love with comedy with with your dad.

00:29:13.640 Yeah, he taught me everything.

00:29:14.440 Wow.

00:29:15.260 It's crazy, huh?

00:29:16.440 Yeah.

00:29:17.240 He was a weirdo, though. He wasn't like your dad. So your dad was like incredibly self-disciplined

00:29:26.300 is what I'm taking from it.

00:29:27.000 He was.

00:29:27.400 Because he doesn't like it when I talk about this, but he, I don't know. He never makes

00:29:37.600 it about himself. And so I do. I try to do that for him. He played football. And if you

00:29:44.300 think about the timing in the mid-60s, he was six, six and a half, 220 pounds, whatever

00:29:51.600 it was. That's a big man today. But back then, it's a big man.

00:29:58.100 And he actually broke the color barrier and was the first black man to play varsity football

00:30:03.440 ever at Army.

00:30:05.260 Oh, wow.

00:30:05.820 Oh, my God. That's exciting.

00:30:07.840 But he doesn't like to talk about it because he's like, I just was a football player. I

00:30:11.320 just wanted to be a good teammate. It's super cool, though. NFL Films did a beautiful piece

00:30:15.920 on my parents, and it's pinned forever to my ex-profile. I'll always leave it there because

00:30:20.280 it's so cool. It just tells their story.

00:30:22.260 Are you playing in the NFL?

00:30:23.580 He did not because back then, you had to fulfill your military obligation if you're

00:30:27.900 coming out of a service academy. He got drafted, though, by the Detroit Lions in the 17th round.

00:30:33.460 Wow.

00:30:33.840 Back when they had 17 rounds.

00:30:35.540 Didn't they have like 20?

00:30:36.600 What's that?

00:30:37.240 They had like 20 rounds.

00:30:38.540 Oh, at least 18.

00:30:39.380 Yeah.

00:30:39.560 Yeah, yeah. So even though they knew he couldn't play, they still drafted him, which is super

00:30:43.900 cool.

00:30:44.220 Wow. That's cool.

00:30:45.480 But he just says, listen, somebody had to be first, and it just happened to be me.

00:30:51.980 So humble.

00:30:52.520 He is. But he was a stud, second team All-American, East-West Shrine game, like just was a great

00:30:59.180 and track too. But one of the cooler things is that he was there at the same time as his

00:31:03.720 brother. So his family had both of their boys, their black boys at West Point in the 60s.

00:31:11.280 And that brother ran track. So they were studs. And again, they won't say that, but I will.

00:31:19.940 And their father, my grandfather, was a Buffalo soldier.

00:31:23.620 Wow.

00:31:24.540 You talk about proud for him to have been segregated, couldn't even fight with white men or stand

00:31:32.620 alongside his fellow troops who were white. And then to see his boys there was super cool.

00:31:39.780 What a great American story.

00:31:41.600 It really is. But it's funny. And I love his humility. Because we don't want to make it

00:31:46.120 about race, actually. That's not what we should lead with. But I do think there's that balance

00:31:50.340 of not forgetting history. And people are like, it took that long.

00:31:53.180 Well, the breakthrough that changed it all is so incredible.

00:31:57.300 Because that could only happen in America. We're always talking about our dirty history and

00:32:02.180 slavery and racism here. But we changed it.

00:32:06.100 We did.

00:32:07.440 Yeah.

00:32:07.620 That shows progress and evolution. That's why I don't want statues taken down.

00:32:11.900 No matter what it represented at that time, it's important that we remember that we can

00:32:17.340 all change and be better and work harder. You mentioned the word discipline. Every Saturday

00:32:24.000 morning, my dad had room inspections, bedroom inspections for us kids.

00:32:29.940 Uh-oh.

00:32:30.460 Just like he was at West Point.

00:32:32.800 Did they bounce the quarter off the mattress kind of deal?

00:32:35.400 Might as well. It was everything else. But he would, it was 0900 hours, not nine o'clock.

00:32:41.120 It's be ready at 0900. Like, okay, dad. Yeah, we talked in military time because he wanted

00:32:47.120 us to understand that. And so at 0900 hours, he would come and knock on the door, knock

00:32:51.960 twice, just like when he was in school. And we'd have to salute.

00:32:56.120 Wow.

00:32:56.400 And he'd say, are you prepared for inspection? And we're like, it was a joke. We weren't scared.

00:33:01.560 It was a, he created a competition with my brothers and to treat us respect for the nice

00:33:07.520 things we had. And hey, this is a military salary, not fancy. My parents didn't have any

00:33:13.640 money, but we thought we did because we never wanted for anything, but there was a respect

00:33:19.940 for that nice comforter that I got to pick out for my bed. You know, how are, how are things

00:33:25.540 folded in my drawers? And he would go around and he'd use a glove and see if there's dust on

00:33:30.100 the dresser. God, I love that. God, I need to do that.

00:33:32.120 And I know, you have time. Your girls are young. You can do it.

00:33:35.460 I'm not, yeah. I have to change who I am first and then I'll, and then I'll think of it.

00:33:38.960 They'll be like, hypocrite, right?

00:33:41.660 Not my dad. My dad sat there in his underpants, which were stained. And he never took a bath or

00:33:49.520 nothing. Shut up.

00:33:50.540 And he sat there in front of the TV and all he loved was sports, of course. And he got

00:34:01.000 himself a bell next to his chair there. And he, he ringed this bell, ding, ding, ding,

00:34:07.620 ding, ding. And that meant a certain number of rings meant bring me cheese.

00:34:13.440 Cheese? Yeah, we had it. We was on the welfare cheese. And so he always wanted the entire

00:34:20.500 brick of cheese, not just a slice. We have to bring him the whole brick of cheese with

00:34:25.840 the wrapping paper on it. And we did this whole, here, here you are, sire. And then he just

00:34:36.820 hold up the cheese and he only had eight teeth on the top and eight teeth on the bottom.

00:34:41.080 And so he'd take a big old bite out of the welfare cheese there and say, thank you. And

00:34:49.400 then the next ring of the bell, you had to bring him a bowl of Cap'n Crunch. Those are

00:34:55.220 the only things he ate. Cheese and Cap'n Crunch.

00:34:57.360 Yeah. And then we put the cheese back in the fridge and we told our friends, daddy just takes

00:35:05.720 big bites off our cheese. And they said, no, he don't. Cause they're all nice blonde Mormon

00:35:10.940 folk. And so I go, yeah, he does. He just bites off the welfare cheese log. And so they go,

00:35:18.360 we got to see. I go, yeah, cause he, it's only got eight teeth in there, eight on top, eight

00:35:23.720 on bottom. So we charge our friends a nickel when, when the parents were busy. And they come

00:35:32.300 in through the kitchen door and we opened the cheese door for a nickel drawer and they'd

00:35:38.080 go, oh my God. They had all these like rat bites out of it.

00:35:43.980 Just one tooth here.

00:35:44.980 From his chiclet teeth.

00:35:46.240 Yeah. Summer teeth.

00:35:47.880 So he wasn't quite as elegant as we were, dad.

00:35:52.580 That's okay. You wouldn't be who you are today without it, right? Thank God. He was perfectly

00:35:58.500 exactly how he was supposed to be. My, with the room inspection. So when, whenever there

00:36:02.620 was an infraction, if something wasn't done right, we'd have to drop and give him 10 pushups.

00:36:07.380 Oh my God.

00:36:08.600 And they had to be like real pushups. We're not on our knees and our, you know, butt isn't

00:36:14.300 up in the air and our elbows are tight. So my arms looked great from a very young age.

00:36:21.060 Where'd you get the idea? Did you develop a love of sports from your dad?

00:36:26.300 Uh huh. It was his fault. Yeah. Yep. Yep. That was unusual for a girl. It was back

00:36:32.720 then. But you know what? And I was going to say this about your dad. Isn't it amazing

00:36:36.600 the influence they can have? Yeah. Especially for fathers and daughters. Yes. Especially.

00:36:41.360 Times two over there. Yep. Yeah. That's the most, it's the best blessing in life. The best.

00:36:46.740 And I believe her daughter's the most important relationship. Yeah, it is. And I have two daughters.

00:36:51.900 And yeah, I believe it's the most important relationship. 100%. Um, I wanted to spend time

00:36:56.860 with my dad. Yeah. And you know, he was busy. He didn't sit down much, especially on weekends

00:37:02.100 because we had soccer games or swim meets or, you know, just fun stuff. And he'd been working

00:37:06.600 all week. But if he did sit, um, there would be either NBA, basketball, Lakers, Celtics usually,

00:37:13.360 um, or Cowboys Redskins. And remember we lived in Europe and Belgium. So there was one TV with like

00:37:21.500 four channels, maybe two, three of them spoke English. So there were not many options. And on

00:37:29.420 weekends, that's what was on. So that's what we would do. We'd sit and watch football and I loved

00:37:33.620 it. I saw my dad's happiness enjoying it, especially with football since he played and always wondered if

00:37:39.800 he could have made it in the NFL after being drafted. Um, and I also saw from like a patriotic

00:37:47.960 perspective, um, especially with the Dallas Cowboys, that was America's team and living in

00:37:52.680 Belgium, living in Greece, living in Europe, they didn't know much about American football because

00:37:56.980 that's soccer, but they knew the Dallas Cowboys and they knew the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders,

00:38:00.440 right? Yeah. Oh, they were big. Yeah. And I mean, they were beautiful and it was Americana. It was.

00:38:05.620 And so what I learned at a very young age is that sports brings people together. Yeah. And it is the

00:38:14.680 one time a week, whatever it is for football, basketball, a couple of times a week for baseball,

00:38:19.840 when everybody is sitting in a stadium, you could have 80,000 people there. And if it's a home game

00:38:24.920 at Cowboy stadium, you're all on the same team for three hours and your politics don't matter.

00:38:30.540 Your socioeconomic status doesn't matter. Your religion, who you sleep with, none of it matters.

00:38:35.300 You're just rooting for the Cowboys and you're high-fiving people that you might never see

00:38:38.620 again. Yeah. Right. And I felt that and I loved it. The team aspect, which is similar to the

00:38:44.620 military where you're in this together. So that's where it started. And, and I said when I was 11

00:38:50.200 years old that I was going to be a sportscaster and I wanted to work at ESPN. And you did.

00:38:56.180 How hard was that to get into? Oh my God. For a woman. That's when I need alcohol.

00:39:00.900 That's where, um, very hard, but I loved the challenge. I wouldn't change a thing. It took

00:39:10.040 11 years once I graduated from college and then you start local TV, you know, like all hours of

00:39:16.580 the day and night. And there were no women doing it. No. And they let me know. There were coworkers

00:39:22.700 who were not happy I was there. Some even said, I heard through a friend of a friend who'd say,

00:39:29.420 you know, that one said, the only reason you're here is because you're, um, a double whammy

00:39:34.240 like HR loves you. You're a woman and a woman of color. You're getting hired. So I, of course

00:39:39.380 I heard for years that that was the only reason I was there. That was before DEI was an acronym

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00:41:00.840 tallow. Like this is what a chip, this is how I remember chips tasting when I was a kid. And I knew

00:41:04.060 that, and you know what, maybe it was true at times, but you're not going to last there when you're on a TV

00:41:10.740 screen. Well, sometimes it opens a door, but it don't keep you in the room. Right. Because you'll

00:41:15.840 get exposed on live TV really, really fast. You did it for a long time. I did. I mean, 11 years,

00:41:22.040 local regional TV, and then 16 years at ESPN. Yeah. And honestly, I loved every moment. I started off

00:41:31.940 in South Bend, Indiana, a medium-sized market, like a good-sized market considering I had zero experience

00:41:38.400 and did not deserve a job. Yeah. But that was a, you know, a friend of the man that I interned for

00:41:44.040 at Indiana University who made a call to his friend who ran the station who said, give her a shot, you

00:41:48.540 know. Yeah. Cool. All who you know and how you treat people along the way. And I think I had good

00:41:53.260 parents to remind me to always just be kind, like whatever that means. When I say whatever that

00:41:59.780 means, I mean like it doesn't matter where you are. And if you think someone can do something for

00:42:04.760 you, just be nice. It's the right thing and it pays off for your heart, most importantly,

00:42:10.780 your soul. But also, who knows what people do with that when you're kind to them. And so I was on TV

00:42:16.980 during the day and waiting tables at night. And they would recognize me. Where they're like,

00:42:22.520 wait, aren't you that girl? And I'm like, yes. How would you like your stay? But I loved that time.

00:42:27.220 I was so poor. I was so broke. And I wasn't going to call my parents for help because they didn't have

00:42:32.080 any money. And also, I wanted to do it on my own. So I look back at those days.

00:42:36.100 How old were you then? Right out of college, 22, 23. And then fast forwarding all those years later

00:42:43.900 to ESPN. What was it like to work there? That must have been weird. Yeah, I think it depends on when.

00:42:53.700 Yeah, they weren't always owned by ABC or Disney, by the way.

00:42:56.140 When I was there. Or bought. When I was there, it was. It was. Yeah, I started in 07. I don't know

00:43:01.700 when that took place, that merger. I can look it up. But yeah, ESPN was very cool when it first

00:43:06.900 started. It was, which was 79. Yeah. So that was way before me. But think about the 1990s. And

00:43:13.420 that was my CTV. And that was before phones and everything. So if you wanted to see how your team

00:43:19.220 did, you had to either stay up late or wake up in the morning and see it. And then it'd be on repeat.

00:43:24.540 So a lot of us would skip classes in college and really, oh my gosh, did the Celtics win? I have

00:43:31.920 to stay to see what happened. Because we didn't have any other way of knowing if you missed it on

00:43:37.160 TV or whatever. So I was there at the beginning in 2007. I feel like it's heyday. Kind of on the tail

00:43:44.740 end of where the greats were, the Dan Patrick, the Stuart Scott, of course, who was one of my best

00:43:52.840 friends who helped me so much. Keith Olbermann, before he became a psycho a-hole.

00:43:57.620 He was great. Yeah.

00:43:58.800 Yeah. He was good on there.

00:44:00.280 He was great at that. He's brilliant. He was a beautiful writer. So I choose to remember him

00:44:04.600 that way, not how he is now or how he has become the last 15 years. But they were great. And they

00:44:10.340 made it. Chris Berman, who's still there. He was one of the originals from 1979.

00:44:14.240 Boomer, he's the best.

00:44:15.160 Boomer is still there. So I got to watch them and learn from them. Most were pretty nice. Most

00:44:21.600 were pretty cool. But that first day that I was ever on SportsCenter, someone was sick. Someone

00:44:28.960 called in sick and they didn't have someone to fill in. It was that type of thing. I was

00:44:31.960 going to get on it eventually within a month. But that day, I was not ready. And it was a

00:44:35.900 disaster. I was terrible. I was awful. I can't even look at the tape. But I remember 30 seconds

00:44:42.140 before that red light on the camera went on. And I could hardly breathe. And I literally

00:44:47.760 went back to that 11-year-old girl on the couch with my dad, with this crazy dream in

00:44:55.640 1984, a dream that girls didn't have, especially girls who looked like me. There were a couple

00:45:01.660 of women nationally, but they didn't look... They were white. And that was just a different

00:45:06.160 time. And I tried... I had to really keep it together that first day. And for many years

00:45:12.320 after that, and remembering how far I'd come and how many people, really, so many people

00:45:19.160 helped me along the way and gave me a shot, even when I sucked. And I sucked for a long

00:45:22.860 time. Like I was really bad.

00:45:24.780 Well, they saw something in you that you didn't...

00:45:26.740 They saw potential.

00:45:27.720 They didn't harness it yet, but they saw it was there.

00:45:30.160 And they kept... People didn't really work with you in TV. I don't know. They just were

00:45:35.520 like, okay, let's give another chance. They saw I worked hard. And they saw that I knew

00:45:39.820 my stuff.

00:45:40.640 Yeah.

00:45:41.020 It was just the delivery.

00:45:42.440 Yeah.

00:45:42.800 And slowing down. And it's still a problem. Whatever. It's too late at this point. Like

00:45:45.840 I can't change it, right? It is what it is.

00:45:47.520 What do you think you brought to sports casting that nobody brought before you?

00:46:00.320 Oh, gosh.

00:46:00.600 With your unique, you know, who you are and how you see things?

00:46:07.440 I've never been asked that question before. I... Others certainly had had these qualities

00:46:14.320 before me, long before me. But what drove me was my curiosity. And genuinely wanting

00:46:21.320 to know what these athletes were feeling at that moment, right before kickoff, on the

00:46:29.240 free throw line, and game seven of the NBA finals. Like I wanted to know what was going

00:46:33.460 through their minds because I've never been there and I never will be there. And that was

00:46:37.260 my job was to get those feelings, those answers out of them. So the audience, the millions of

00:46:42.040 people at home, could come into their world too. That's why we love them because they're

00:46:46.600 doing things that we're not capable of. So when I asked questions, and I always ask my own

00:46:51.960 questions, people didn't write my scripts. Like it was important. Very few people have scripts

00:46:56.560 written for them at ESPN. And so I really wanted to know the answer. It wasn't like a fake thing.

00:47:04.920 So...

00:47:05.040 She's talking about ESPN. She needed a drink.

00:47:07.000 And you heard me?

00:47:08.120 Oh, my gosh.

00:47:08.260 I texted her.

00:47:08.900 Hannah, can you bring me cigarettes out of my room on my grocery machine?

00:47:12.460 Thanks, Hannah.

00:47:13.720 Hannah, and your one-year-old, can you please get the cigarettes? Thank you.

00:47:17.500 Wait, what is this?

00:47:18.400 I think you humanized...

00:47:19.440 It's champagne, I think.

00:47:20.220 It's champagne.

00:47:20.640 Yes, darling.

00:47:21.860 Roseanne Bar Podcast. This is the official fuel.

00:47:23.940 I think you humanized the athletes.

00:47:26.260 Yeah.

00:47:26.620 And that hadn't been done. I think only a woman could do that.

00:47:30.140 Oh, I agree with you on the woman part.

00:47:31.980 The fact that you, you know, have that rich, how will I say this?

00:47:42.580 Well, you have that rich ethnic...

00:47:45.540 Upbringing.

00:47:47.940 Culture.

00:47:48.420 I mean, my look is different, right?

00:47:53.700 You have that tradition of just that great strength of humanity, and you brought that

00:48:03.740 also, a kind of a lifting up and making human in a black woman way.

00:48:12.120 I can't think of the right words.

00:48:13.620 I'm not...

00:48:13.840 No, thank you.

00:48:14.360 ...very verbose.

00:48:14.960 I get that.

00:48:16.020 But I was proud of you.

00:48:18.540 Oh.

00:48:19.340 And I was like, she humanizes the whole sport, and I think that that was a great thing to

00:48:27.780 see a woman do, especially in such a masculine thing, you know?

00:48:34.320 But I grew up with brothers.

00:48:35.860 Yeah.

00:48:36.080 And I was such a tomboy, and I had more guy friends than girlfriends, because guys are usually

00:48:42.480 easier than girls, right?

00:48:43.880 Yeah, I did too.

00:48:44.780 Yeah, I can't stand girls.

00:48:45.280 And just in the sports world, it's always difficult.

00:48:47.180 Women are the worst.

00:48:48.380 Women suck.

00:48:50.540 They're horrible.

00:48:50.760 I'm kidding, kidding.

00:48:52.440 I'm not.

00:48:53.160 They're terrible.

00:48:54.100 Some.

00:48:56.660 Thank you, darling.

00:48:57.500 We have so many hours of footage of Hannah Crawley with the baby.

00:49:00.320 Thank you.

00:49:00.800 Thank you, babe.

00:49:01.580 You know what I was going to say that I wonder what you think about this?

00:49:03.780 What?

00:49:03.980 It's funny.

00:49:04.480 It's funny.

00:49:05.140 Through the years, I've had so many young women come to me and say, because I kept my

00:49:11.240 hair curly and didn't straighten it, that that was part of it.

00:49:17.220 I had so many bosses through the years who asked me to straighten my hair.

00:49:22.620 Really?

00:49:23.240 Yeah.

00:49:23.620 And I was also told one time I didn't get a job, a really, really big job that I would

00:49:27.380 have died for.

00:49:29.220 The producer who's still around, still doing very big things.

00:49:33.840 Harvey Weinstein, is it?

00:49:37.540 No.

00:49:37.940 Sounds like Ol' Harv.

00:49:39.120 No.

00:49:39.840 Right?

00:49:40.700 Actually, it's a great point.

00:49:41.860 Oh, I wish I could say his name.

00:49:43.300 The book's going to be really good, right, Dave, if I ever freaking finish it.

00:49:46.880 Anyway.

00:49:47.860 I'll figure it out.

00:49:49.000 I'll tell you later.

00:49:49.720 All right.

00:49:50.100 Okay.

00:49:50.200 This producer told my agent, she's great, we love her, for a sideline reporting job.

00:49:55.880 Oh, God.

00:49:56.120 The biggest one.

00:49:57.600 Okay.

00:49:57.760 And said, but her hair.

00:50:01.340 Was he white?

00:50:02.460 Yeah.

00:50:03.520 And I thought, my hair.

00:50:04.640 Sometimes it's black people that say that about black people.

00:50:07.340 Well, now black people.

00:50:07.940 Oh, that's a whole part of my story.

00:50:10.080 Oh, my gosh.

00:50:10.580 Did they give the job to someone else with straight hair?

00:50:13.120 Yeah, of course.

00:50:13.960 Oh, crap.

00:50:15.200 Yeah, of course.

00:50:15.640 Black woman or?

00:50:16.540 What?

00:50:16.880 Was it a black woman?

00:50:17.900 With straight hair.

00:50:18.580 No, a white woman.

00:50:20.180 This is in 2000.

00:50:22.100 You'll tell me.

00:50:22.600 Two or three.

00:50:23.480 Okay.

00:50:24.020 Anyway, he said, but her hair.

00:50:26.440 And I'm like, my hair.

00:50:28.420 But at that point, I was like, oh, I'll straighten it.

00:50:30.400 I'll do whatever.

00:50:31.540 Because this is the pinnacle job at that point in my career.

00:50:34.820 And probably in anyone's career who was doing what I was doing at the time.

00:50:38.420 And I thought, okay, can you imagine someone saying that now to an agent?

00:50:43.680 I mean, maybe they would, but they certainly wouldn't say it publicly, have the balls to

00:50:46.860 say it publicly.

00:50:47.880 So at the end of the day, I was...

00:50:49.520 Nowadays, think about it, what they'd say about black hair.

00:50:53.400 Well, now...

00:50:54.040 Black people would say about black hair.

00:50:56.360 What do you mean?

00:50:57.140 I mean, everything's so fucked up.

00:51:00.100 You know?

00:51:01.100 You know, culture is just fucking crazy.

00:51:04.760 Yeah.

00:51:05.260 And now, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if they...

00:51:07.820 Well, I won't say it.

00:51:09.060 No, no, no.

00:51:09.460 I'll get in trouble.

00:51:10.280 No, go.

00:51:10.860 I'll go with you.

00:51:11.960 You can do it.

00:51:12.380 I won't put it in.

00:51:13.240 Well, certain black people, you know, that are in the power structure, you know, they just

00:51:18.960 want to go with what's popular.

00:51:22.140 They don't really...

00:51:23.380 I don't think they, in Hollywood, they don't feel any pride in their ethnicity or their

00:51:31.220 people or nothing.

00:51:32.380 It's just about the dollar.

00:51:34.140 Yeah.

00:51:34.680 So they probably go, oh, she needs to be in a blonde wig.

00:51:38.120 Yeah.

00:51:39.400 I know who you're talking about.

00:51:41.260 Yeah.

00:51:41.700 Yeah.

00:51:42.300 It's interesting.

00:51:42.740 You know what I mean?

00:51:43.800 I do.

00:51:44.640 And I don't know that world as much, but it's interesting.

00:51:47.840 You should hear what they tell Jews.

00:51:49.480 Well, let me tell you this.

00:51:50.280 She does this every week.

00:51:51.380 She talks about how each culture, in order to gain power, especially in Hollywood, black

00:51:55.560 Jew, woman, whatever, you kind of have to sell it your own people.

00:51:58.440 That's the sacrifice to that.

00:51:59.680 That's how it works here.

00:52:00.880 That's what she's...

00:52:01.380 Yeah.

00:52:02.140 No, for sure.

00:52:02.960 For sure.

00:52:03.800 You got to...

00:52:04.420 Every group does this.

00:52:05.300 You have to buy the narrative, which is...

00:52:10.380 You have to show your masters that you're one of them.

00:52:13.460 Yes.

00:52:13.800 And not one of who you really are.

00:52:15.100 Oh, well, and in the black community, oh, the hate is real.

00:52:20.180 No, I know.

00:52:20.920 On me and has been for years and years.

00:52:23.080 No, I know.

00:52:23.360 And by the way, I'm one of many.

00:52:24.800 This is not, oh, woe is sage.

00:52:26.300 No, I know.

00:52:26.660 I honestly am totally fine with it.

00:52:28.700 And it's almost expected at this point.

00:52:32.960 I mean, just from a visual perspective, when you look at TV now, I mean, about the hair

00:52:37.640 thing, part of it was true in that you never, if you watch local TV, if you're watching

00:52:44.240 in Dallas, Texas, or New York City, there was never a single female anchor who had curly

00:52:49.700 hair.

00:52:50.020 No.

00:52:50.580 Even if they had curly hair, that shit was straightened, right?

00:52:53.020 Mm-hmm.

00:52:53.180 And so it wasn't, I was unique in that way at that time, but it was only because I didn't

00:52:59.180 know how to straighten it.

00:53:00.040 Like, this would have taken me hours, and I was having babies.

00:53:02.900 I was, it was a different, I didn't have time or money to straighten it.

00:53:06.320 It was like, this is what it is.

00:53:07.920 I had straightened it one time at ESPN, and I had three bosses come up to me, they're

00:53:11.080 like, can you do that every day?

00:53:12.960 I'm like, no.

00:53:13.920 I mean, are you going to pay for it?

00:53:15.100 Because I can't do this.

00:53:16.780 And so you go back to what God gave you, frankly, is the decision I made.

00:53:21.080 I'm like, no, this is how God made me, and it is what it is.

00:53:23.840 Now you look at TV, and watch ESPN, watch any news or sports network, and people are much

00:53:32.840 more themselves with all kinds of hair, right?

00:53:35.220 There's a girl on ESPN who shaves her head bald on purpose.

00:53:38.200 No, I like that, though.

00:53:39.580 I like bald.

00:53:39.980 Go do you.

00:53:40.900 Yeah.

00:53:41.500 So I feel like, I mean, it's awesome to have seen the evolution of it.

00:53:45.360 Yeah.

00:53:46.180 But I don't know.

00:53:47.500 I'd like to think that I was kept around because I did a good job and was a good teammate

00:53:52.620 and wasn't there to fill some quota.

00:53:56.140 And I know that, for sure.

00:53:59.220 But the industry has certainly changed.

00:54:01.180 But they always throw a few things at you anyway, even if you're great.

00:54:05.220 Oh, for sure.

00:54:05.980 They always try to belittle you every way they can, if you're a woman.

00:54:11.640 I don't know that they do that to men.

00:54:13.240 It seems that they always try to build them up.

00:54:16.240 And I was always, I read about it.

00:54:18.740 They seem to always want to build men up as if they understand that men need that.

00:54:24.620 But with women, it's like, she needs to be knocked down a few notches.

00:54:29.740 For sure.

00:54:30.700 I think so.

00:54:31.760 And I mean, just watching on TV, just at my old network, men could get old and fat and

00:54:40.880 bald and all of it.

00:54:42.120 And it didn't matter.

00:54:42.780 It was fine.

00:54:43.360 I mean, their shirts aren't wrinkled.

00:54:45.400 They could look a hot mess.

00:54:46.760 Some of them still do.

00:54:47.740 Yeah, they do.

00:54:48.560 But for us, are you kidding me?

00:54:49.580 And it's crazy because as the show evolved through the years, SportsCenter wasn't just

00:54:53.620 done behind a desk.

00:54:55.460 It is, you are walking and talking.

00:54:57.740 You're doing highlights and four-inch heels running to the other side of the set.

00:55:01.600 And top to bottom, it mattered.

00:55:03.480 So not many, at the time, heavy women in that role on national TV.

00:55:10.360 You could be old and fat and ugly as a guy, but not as a woman.

00:55:14.480 And that is not immune to just my industry, my goodness.

00:55:17.720 But obviously, for a visual medium, and that's what you see, the standard, there was certainly

00:55:23.420 a double standard.

00:55:24.480 You know, I have two daughters, and I admit now, I think I see now more how I probably

00:55:36.240 fell into some traps with that, with trying to make sure I looked the part.

00:55:43.020 It's good.

00:55:43.920 I exercised my whole life and stayed healthy for them.

00:55:48.440 But what I did realize, and I'd love to know your perspective on this, when you are

00:55:53.920 on air, on stages, performing, acting, hosting, I mean, you're in front of a mirror before

00:56:01.540 you go on and do it every single time.

00:56:03.760 And it's really hard to age in front of a mirror every day with the world looking at

00:56:10.080 you.

00:56:10.440 And I didn't realize how much it got into my head until more recently, where then you

00:56:15.520 get older, and your body changes as women, and your hormones change, and you have no control

00:56:21.340 all of a sudden.

00:56:21.860 I'm like, what the hell is going on?

00:56:23.320 And this is different.

00:56:26.440 It's tough.

00:56:27.520 And it's not a forgiving world.

00:56:29.280 Now, in some ways, I guess you could say it is, because now there's all the sensitivity

00:56:33.300 to that, and you have big, huge, out-of-shape girls in bikinis, and that's who's doing the

00:56:39.400 ads for all the sports.

00:56:40.340 God, that pisses me off.

00:56:41.140 To see Gross Ann on Mad Magazine.

00:56:42.980 Gross Ann.

00:56:43.700 Eating the whole sandwich on the...

00:56:45.380 Yeah.

00:56:45.980 I ate a whole cow in the Mad Magazine.

00:56:47.160 I don't know if you know this.

00:56:47.800 My mother wasn't a beauty pageant winner, when she...

00:56:51.160 Yeah.

00:56:52.820 It wasn't hard for me to age, because I was always a big, fat slob.

00:56:57.540 So it wasn't...

00:56:58.480 You know, I think I got better looking as I aged.

00:57:00.640 Everyone agrees, and I agree.

00:57:02.200 But I never...

00:57:04.120 I mean, I always knew I was out of the running anyway.

00:57:06.720 Yeah.

00:57:07.540 But I...

00:57:09.120 I knew I was breaking boundaries.

00:57:13.640 I was going to say, you were iconic in that way, because really, who else came before you

00:57:18.980 who was the first mainstream person, much less superstar, to be wholly who you are?

00:57:27.800 Normal.

00:57:28.120 Who you are.

00:57:28.660 Representative of America.

00:57:30.040 Yeah.

00:57:30.760 I don't know.

00:57:31.500 That's a good question.

00:57:32.380 Well, you know.

00:57:32.680 I mean, Lucy, she was kind of a model, wasn't she?

00:57:36.300 But, yeah, I think I busted the model.

00:57:39.800 Yeah.

00:57:40.100 But...

00:57:40.620 You broke the mold literally and figured it out.

00:57:41.960 Yeah.

00:57:42.580 Uh-huh.

00:57:43.860 But I...

00:57:44.700 But thank goodness, honestly.

00:57:46.140 Yeah.

00:57:46.180 Because in Hollywood in particular, my world is a lot smaller than yours was, you know?

00:57:51.060 Yeah.

00:57:51.340 And there was no one else like you to do that and to own it.

00:57:56.000 Yeah.

00:57:56.200 And that's...

00:57:56.740 I mean, that's one of many reasons why you did...

00:57:59.280 That show did so well from its inception is because you represented normal people.

00:58:04.700 Normal people.

00:58:06.200 Yeah.

00:58:06.400 I looked like everyone else in the heartland.

00:58:10.760 Yeah.

00:58:10.900 And so I think that's why people believed the family, because they looked like everybody.

00:58:17.820 But...

00:58:18.020 And then had issues like everybody.

00:58:20.300 Yeah.

00:58:20.440 And you put it out there in the best possible way.

00:58:22.900 Yeah.

00:58:23.000 But you know what's funny is after the success of Roseanne, then it became okay for normal

00:58:27.020 looking Americans on TV.

00:58:28.460 But if you think about it, it was a big fat dad, but the wife was still hot.

00:58:32.680 I just realized that now.

00:58:33.740 Like Kevin James and Leah Remini...

00:58:35.500 Yeah.

00:58:35.820 They still never adjusted after you.

00:58:37.620 They started to try and sleep back into that bullshit.

00:58:40.160 They don't.

00:58:41.060 It's kind of gross when I think about it.

00:58:41.940 No fat chicks.

00:58:42.620 That's why I was so irate over...

00:58:45.060 Well, I mean, I did so much stuff for fat women, but...

00:58:51.160 I know where you're going.

00:58:53.900 Our first viral clip on this podcast.

00:58:55.780 What?

00:58:56.180 About...

00:58:56.540 Lizzo.

00:58:56.900 That Lizzo?

00:58:57.620 Yeah.

00:58:58.780 Oh, gosh.

00:58:59.880 Because, you know, I got mad because all these fat women that broke into things, and it's

00:59:05.760 because of me, and not one of them goes, we'd like to thank big fat Roseanne for breaking

00:59:11.380 the boundaries for our big fat ass, but they pretend like they did it, and it really makes

00:59:16.960 me mad, but that's another thing of being a woman that's very successful and breaks a

00:59:23.720 lot of boundaries for women, and I didn't know it till I got fired, but women hate you

00:59:30.820 for it.

00:59:31.440 Oh, my gosh.

00:59:32.260 Women hate you for breaking down boundaries for women, and I didn't know that.

00:59:38.200 I thought they would be proud and happy that doors were opened and stereotypes smashed,

00:59:44.700 but no, they want to be the only woman.

00:59:51.180 They don't want to thank women who came before or even acknowledge them.

00:59:56.560 They want to erase them.

00:59:57.700 And so I was going to ask you, I really want to get into this part.

01:00:04.420 What took you down at ESPN?

01:00:07.660 I want to hear it.

01:00:10.980 First of all, I want to say you are so right with women, and that's been one of the most

01:00:14.160 disappointing things throughout my journey, because women are the ones that preach about,

01:00:21.520 we are women, hear us roar in the glass ceiling, da-da-da-da, where's the ladder?

01:00:27.600 You're not pulling people up with you, but you're going to crush men along the way and

01:00:30.720 tell men to be better.

01:00:32.060 So I have always been, more so lately, I'd say, open and constructively critical, I hope,

01:00:41.340 when in that, with that situation and that topic, because it's so hypocritical when we

01:00:49.200 criticize men, but then we don't even take care of each other and then are ugly to each

01:00:52.840 other.

01:00:53.280 So, so ugly.

01:00:55.280 Yeah, it's not okay.

01:00:56.260 And I tell that to my daughters, no mean girls, no mean girl shit, like absolutely not.

01:01:02.100 And, you know, they catch themselves, and they've got beautiful hearts, and I will remind

01:01:08.620 them, but I always tell them, and of course, my daughters are 23 and 19, and I have a son

01:01:14.840 in the middle who's 21, who's in between the two psycho daughters, as I say, because they

01:01:18.940 are nuts, because girls are nuts.

01:01:20.700 But I try to remind them, like, that boy needs to come second to your friends right now, especially

01:01:26.780 when you're teenagers and when you're young.

01:01:28.360 You know, you take care of each other, and so if we as mothers instill that in our daughters

01:01:33.840 from a young age, I hope and pray that then when they're going off in their careers, they

01:01:39.580 remember that, and they're better than what we saw and experienced.

01:01:44.580 There's room for, I say this at ESPN, especially with some of these women, I'm like, what the

01:01:47.980 heck was that?

01:01:49.140 Like, why?

01:01:49.980 We're all here.

01:01:50.780 We all have signed a contract and are making good money.

01:01:53.100 There is room for all of us.

01:01:54.360 Why are we being more divisive, and we've got to call them on it, and now it's so nice.

01:02:00.880 I don't have to care because I'm not there anymore, and I can say what I want.

01:02:03.780 Yeah.

01:02:03.980 What blew me up?

01:02:04.940 What ended it?

01:02:06.460 Yeah.

01:02:08.860 Me opening my big mouth.

01:02:10.320 I finally got my Roseanne Barr on, and I just said what I wanted to say.

01:02:14.140 What did you say?

01:02:15.140 I was on a podcast with former Bears quarterback Jay Cutler.

01:02:18.400 I mean, he's been retired for many years.

01:02:19.680 It was a new podcast for him, and his publicist said, hey, he hasn't had a woman on yet.

01:02:25.720 Would you like to come on?

01:02:26.480 I was like, sure, I'll talk.

01:02:28.420 And he asked me a couple questions, mainly about the Band-Aid on my arm, because I had

01:02:36.720 literally just come from getting the COVID vaccine.

01:02:41.580 And I got it because I was told by Disney and ESPN that if I didn't get a shot and was

01:02:48.300 fully vaccinated by September 30th, 2021, that I'd be fired.

01:02:55.100 Fascism.

01:02:56.460 100%.

01:02:56.820 And I fought it for the months leading up to it.

01:02:59.580 I talked to my agent, like, how can I get out of this?

01:03:01.460 And, oh, do a religious exemption.

01:03:02.760 Oh, do a medical exemption.

01:03:03.760 I'm like, okay, but that's not what this is.

01:03:05.860 I don't want to lie.

01:03:07.000 Like, I want to be honest.

01:03:07.900 I think this is wrong, and to force anybody to do this, it's experimental.

01:03:13.140 Just give us time for more research to have taken place.

01:03:17.180 It was a quick Google search.

01:03:19.160 I'm no scientist, but I could see easily, on average, it takes six to nine years for the

01:03:24.840 FDA to approve a vaccine.

01:03:26.180 That's right.

01:03:26.480 And I'm like, this is happening in a couple of months.

01:03:28.380 Realized how political it was.

01:03:30.560 You know, Trump was in office, and it was evil.

01:03:32.560 Biden's in office, and it's required, and it's good.

01:03:34.540 And if you don't get it, then you're evil.

01:03:35.840 So, once you started to pay attention a little, you could tell, right?

01:03:39.760 But I had this incredible job that I'd worked my whole life to get to that level at ESPN.

01:03:46.720 I had three kids.

01:03:48.520 I was very recently divorced and 100% responsible financially for everyone in my family.

01:03:55.400 So, I had to make that decision.

01:03:57.700 And to this day, Roseanne, honestly, I get, I'm still trying to forgive myself for caving

01:04:07.880 in and getting the shot.

01:04:10.100 Well, you had to.

01:04:10.860 You had children.

01:04:11.620 You should forgive yourself immediately.

01:04:13.700 And I know we talked at the bar.

01:04:15.460 Yeah, you had to.

01:04:15.960 I did have to.

01:04:17.120 You didn't have to.

01:04:17.500 I might have cried at the bar when I told this story.

01:04:19.220 Yes.

01:04:19.700 You did.

01:04:20.060 Because it was even more wrong.

01:04:21.140 But I didn't want to, I was so afraid of getting caught.

01:04:24.820 Because everybody was getting fake cards, too.

01:04:26.740 Yeah.

01:04:27.080 I thought about that long and hard because I was so afraid of getting it in my body.

01:04:32.480 Yeah.

01:04:32.680 But I thought, since they knew I was against it, that they might go double, triple check.

01:04:38.640 And then if I got busted, it'd be headlines, Sage Steele, fake vax card.

01:04:43.180 Yeah.

01:04:43.360 Who knows what they do to you?

01:04:44.680 Yeah.

01:04:44.800 This is 2021.

01:04:45.740 Yeah.

01:04:46.220 Everyone's crazy.

01:04:47.600 And so, I went to the pharmacy that day that I was scheduled to be on Jay's podcast.

01:04:52.660 It was the last possible day I could get the shot to be fully vaxed.

01:04:56.060 And I sat in my car and I cried before I went in there.

01:04:59.500 And I was like, and I prayed all night the night before and that day, like, if you want

01:05:04.500 me to walk away from this job, God, please give me a sign or a sign that I'm going to

01:05:10.480 be okay if I get this stupid thing.

01:05:12.680 So, long story short, I went in the pharmacy and the sweet woman who was administering it

01:05:18.340 looked at me and she saw my red eyes and she said, are you okay?

01:05:21.960 And I was like, no, I'm being forced to get this shot to keep my job and I don't want

01:05:27.180 to do it.

01:05:27.580 And she looked at me and she said, this is so wrong and I am so sorry.

01:05:33.720 And she held my hand and squeezed it and then she put it in my arm.

01:05:38.740 I've never been the same since here, here mentally.

01:05:42.280 Something changed in me that day.

01:05:44.560 Like an anger, I think.

01:05:46.920 I'm not an angry person, but for that situation, I was angry that they-

01:05:52.580 Because you knew it was unjust.

01:05:53.880 I knew it and the My Body, My Choice people, like I was livid, but I did what I had to

01:05:59.400 do at that moment.

01:06:00.460 I would do it differently today, but that's okay.

01:06:02.860 It led to today and I wouldn't change a thing, but I got back in that car, cried the whole

01:06:08.120 way home, went, oh my God, I have this podcast, flipped up the lid on my laptop and did the

01:06:13.140 FaceTime, Zoom, whatever it was and started talking.

01:06:15.520 And I forgot that I had that Band-Aid on my shoulder because it had just happened.

01:06:19.200 And when Jay asked me, and he asked me before, he's like, can we talk about the COVID stuff?

01:06:22.620 I was like, sure, I don't care, go for it.

01:06:24.540 And then when he asked me an hour later, I was like, what's the Band-Aid?

01:06:27.720 And it all was running through my head.

01:06:29.240 And I just said, well, I think it's sick and scary for any employer to force their employee

01:06:36.720 to do anything to their body.

01:06:39.200 But I work for a global company, Disney, and I guess I'm not surprised.

01:06:45.100 And I love my job and I need my job, but I think it's sick and I think it's scary.

01:06:49.780 And I took it.

01:06:50.800 And that's what I said.

01:06:52.180 And that was it.

01:06:52.840 So what happened?

01:06:53.840 How long later?

01:06:55.620 The podcast came out two weeks later and within a couple of hours, my agent called and he's

01:07:01.920 like, so, and I'd actually, I thought they were, I thought I might get in trouble for

01:07:05.980 something else, which I, it was the first time I talked about my divorce and I, it was

01:07:09.800 very, it was like a five second thing, but I thought they'd be like, you know, why did

01:07:14.040 you talk about your personal life?

01:07:15.720 And I really didn't, but it was more the part of having to bear the burden financially for

01:07:21.760 the ex-husband, for the kids.

01:07:23.160 And I was like stressing about that, you know?

01:07:27.340 And my agent was like, this is not going over well.

01:07:30.140 You're going to get a call from the number two in command, Norby Williamson.

01:07:34.600 And I was very close to him at the time and I'm not now.

01:07:37.820 And he has since been let go from the company after 38 years or something, 39 years.

01:07:42.880 And he called and he said, you whacked the company, you whacked Disney and you can't do

01:07:46.880 that.

01:07:47.200 And I said, what do you mean I whacked them?

01:07:49.260 First of all, I complied.

01:07:50.760 I took your shot.

01:07:52.000 I can have an opinion.

01:07:53.600 And he said it wasn't going over well in Burbank headquarters, Disney headquarters.

01:07:58.500 And the other thing I said that ticked them off was about Obama.

01:08:02.700 That's what I remembered.

01:08:03.820 I didn't know it was the COVID shot.

01:08:05.100 I thought it was the Obama thing.

01:08:06.380 What was the Obama thing?

01:08:07.480 The Obama thing was, Jay asked me why it was important for me to say that I'm biracial,

01:08:13.840 not black.

01:08:14.360 If someone says black, of course, yes.

01:08:18.480 If I'm asked, then I am a biracial woman.

01:08:23.220 I'm so proud to be white and black.

01:08:27.660 And I was on The View in 2014 and I was asked the same question.

01:08:32.380 And what I did in 2021 with Jay Cutler was I repeated the same story I said in 2014 to

01:08:36.620 Barbara Walters and Whoopi Goldberg and Sherry Shepard and Jenny McCarthy.

01:08:40.680 And it just hit a little different seven years later.

01:08:44.800 What did you say?

01:08:45.000 What I said was Barbara was upset that I wasn't saying I'm black.

01:08:49.580 Obama was president at the time.

01:08:51.240 And I said, and she goes, well, what happens when you fill out a census?

01:08:55.560 And I was like, well, I haven't filled out a census in a long time.

01:08:57.900 I don't know.

01:08:58.640 She goes, but what would you check?

01:08:59.780 And I would say, I'd check black and white.

01:09:01.600 I'm 50% each.

01:09:03.060 And she goes, well, our president does black.

01:09:05.520 Check's just black.

01:09:06.420 And I said, well, congratulations to the president.

01:09:10.320 I said, but I'm pretty sure my white mom was there the day I was born.

01:09:17.660 And she did not laugh.

01:09:19.920 I thought it was funny.

01:09:20.480 Such a good line.

01:09:21.100 As I said that, the monitor behind us put up a picture of my family with my white mom

01:09:26.720 and black dad and two biracial siblings.

01:09:29.100 And I, but the thing that got me in trouble there was I said, I just think it's fascinating

01:09:33.900 because Barack Obama was raised by his white mom and his white grandmother and his black

01:09:39.340 dad was not around.

01:09:41.200 Yeah.

01:09:41.700 But you do you.

01:09:42.880 That's fine.

01:09:44.520 I'll do me.

01:09:45.520 And I choose to, I don't know.

01:09:49.820 Honor.

01:09:50.640 Honor.

01:09:51.320 Yeah.

01:09:51.880 All of me.

01:09:52.780 Not just half of me.

01:09:54.260 And I'm so proud.

01:09:55.540 And I was sensitive to it because I had seen through the years where it was all about my

01:09:59.060 dad and the famous, you know, the football player from college and the colonel.

01:10:02.580 And like what my little white mom, you know, is the most beautiful soul and the glue that

01:10:08.340 kept us together with all the moving.

01:10:10.620 And isn't it, aren't we celebrating all of us?

01:10:12.800 Yeah.

01:10:12.940 Right.

01:10:13.580 That's diversity.

01:10:14.400 And I feel like my family represents diversity in so many beautiful ways.

01:10:18.160 So in 2014, it was fine.

01:10:19.600 In 2021, it was not when I relayed that story from seven years prior.

01:10:23.280 And so then I was racist and anti-Obama and I hate my black self.

01:10:29.380 And so I got, that's when I got suspended for like 12 days, paid suspension.

01:10:35.040 They don't want to call it a suspension because I got paid, but I'm like, it's just like in

01:10:38.600 baseball or something.

01:10:39.620 It's a paid suspension.

01:10:41.200 Took me off the air.

01:10:41.980 Had to publicly apologize for talking about those issues.

01:10:46.880 But it was interesting.

01:10:47.900 And you'll like this.

01:10:48.620 In the statement that had to go through Disney approval, I wasn't allowed to say the word

01:10:54.300 Disney.

01:10:55.060 I had to say the company, but not Disney.

01:10:59.440 Oh my God.

01:11:00.000 They wouldn't let that word in there.

01:11:01.360 I thought that was fascinating.

01:11:02.560 That is fascinating.

01:11:03.560 Yeah.

01:11:04.180 So they want to separate from you, but they're going to make sure you're crushed along the

01:11:09.040 way.

01:11:09.400 Yeah.

01:11:09.840 Absolutely.

01:11:10.240 So that's, that's how it began.

01:11:12.500 And I was sidelined and then they, um, you know, the apology, but I didn't file the lawsuit

01:11:18.140 until six months later.

01:11:20.360 And the only reason I filed the lawsuit, I mean, I apologize.

01:11:23.820 They told me that I was going to go back to work, act like nothing happened.

01:11:26.860 The problem is they kept taking assignments away from me after that.

01:11:29.760 So the Rose Parade, Pasadena that I did every year, the last few years prior, um, New York

01:11:35.920 City Marathon, the events were disappearing and they weren't promoting the stories I was

01:11:40.800 doing, um, on a, uh, another streaming show that I had begun on the network.

01:11:45.620 All of a sudden they stopped promoting everything and they wouldn't talk to me.

01:11:48.160 And I'm like, what is going on?

01:11:49.180 And then when my coworkers went on the air and talked about abortion on an NBA show, Roe

01:11:58.980 versus Wade being overturned, or the don't say gay bill in Florida on a college basketball

01:12:04.140 show.

01:12:04.440 No, ESPN got radicalized.

01:12:04.860 Remember the moment of silence?

01:12:06.520 Yes.

01:12:06.960 So I'm like, wait, so you can have people who agree with you go on sports platforms and

01:12:13.080 talk about things that have nothing to do with sports.

01:12:14.520 And I was on a day off talking about my own experience and then I was suspended.

01:12:18.820 So when there's that hypocrisy and it's been happening for years, that's when, um, my

01:12:24.540 friend, Chris Harrison from the bachelor called and said, you need to talk to my guy, Brian

01:12:28.880 Friedman.

01:12:29.600 Yeah.

01:12:29.720 He got a raw deal, man.

01:12:31.160 No, same thing.

01:12:31.700 I just had him on my show the other day too.

01:12:33.620 Um, and exact same thing.

01:12:36.440 Yeah.

01:12:37.040 And that's when I realized, and when I talked to my attorney, well, I hadn't even hired him

01:12:41.100 yet.

01:12:41.260 When I told him the whole story, sobbing, because I'm like, first of all, you realize you're

01:12:47.720 hated by many, not all, but that's what the social media and internet tells you.

01:12:52.060 Yeah.

01:12:52.300 And he said to me, he went through all of it.

01:12:54.260 He fought with Disney before he got Megyn Kelly, everything she deserved from NBC after

01:13:00.160 they canceled her.

01:13:01.260 Yeah.

01:13:01.460 And he said, you have a decision to make.

01:13:03.760 Is this the time that you stand up for yourself and you say enough is enough, because I know

01:13:10.440 you've experienced this for years, or do you sit back and stay quiet?

01:13:14.900 Because this is a major undertaking, Disney, right?

01:13:18.840 Right.

01:13:19.320 And I, it's just me and I'm single and I have these three kids, one in college, two in high

01:13:24.880 school alone.

01:13:26.340 And I'm like, oh my God, I can't do this.

01:13:29.460 Yeah.

01:13:29.700 And I was a pleaser.

01:13:31.020 I was just that goody two shoes for all those years.

01:13:33.820 And I prayed about it and I talked to my parents about it.

01:13:36.500 And of course they were scared too, because they just saw their daughter getting crushed.

01:13:41.200 And I said, let's go.

01:13:43.220 Good.

01:13:43.600 And I did it.

01:13:44.780 And you won.

01:13:46.780 I think settling out of court with Disney is a victory.

01:13:49.320 I do too.

01:13:49.760 It is, definitely.

01:13:50.560 I do too.

01:13:51.340 I look forward to settling out of court with Disney with my lawsuit.

01:13:55.300 When is this happening?

01:13:56.620 Now.

01:13:56.920 We can't, we're not allowed to talk about it, but I will say we can't talk about it.

01:14:00.520 Okay.

01:14:01.160 We can, we can mention this, that you are pursuing what's rightfully yours.

01:14:09.560 Yeah.

01:14:10.420 Legally.

01:14:11.080 Yeah.

01:14:11.700 They, uh.

01:14:12.260 But did you get the letter from Disney?

01:14:14.000 What?

01:14:15.040 The scorched earth letter, like we're going to destroy you and ruin your life and kill your

01:14:18.940 firstborn.

01:14:19.140 I did not get what you got.

01:14:19.900 We got that.

01:14:21.160 We've gotten that.

01:14:22.840 Goodness gracious.

01:14:23.820 It is terrifying.

01:14:24.680 I read it.

01:14:25.540 It's terrifying.

01:14:26.460 I went, oh, well, they already tried to kill me.

01:14:29.600 Yeah.

01:14:29.820 I walked to mom and I was like, what do you think?

01:14:31.900 And she's like, nah, fucking, I'm too old to be, I'm, I'm too old not to fight.

01:14:35.440 That's what you said to me.

01:14:36.220 Oh, yeah.

01:14:36.920 And I am.

01:14:37.560 That was the most badass thing.

01:14:38.300 But that is so bad.

01:14:39.300 How many people would have said, I'm too old to fight?

01:14:41.940 Yeah.

01:14:42.420 And you said, I'm too old not to fight.

01:14:44.000 Yeah.

01:14:44.260 Hell yeah.

01:14:44.960 I've already, what are they going to take?

01:14:45.920 After all the shit I've lived through.

01:14:48.020 That is awesome.

01:14:49.540 Yeah.

01:14:49.900 I was scared.

01:14:50.700 I was like, I don't know, mom.

01:14:52.400 She's like, fuck it.

01:14:53.540 Let's do it.

01:14:54.140 Let's go.

01:14:56.460 And I think that, gosh, I think I would have regretted it if I had stayed quiet, even though

01:15:02.420 it would have been easier and cheaper and a lot of things, right?

01:15:06.580 Just to stay quiet.

01:15:08.380 Yeah.

01:15:08.720 But the fact that you're choosing not to.

01:15:11.860 I went to every lawyer in LA because I always wanted to fight because I knew what they did.

01:15:18.080 After they got, they told me it was only going to be one season because we were renewed

01:15:23.600 and that I had to pay for that season if I didn't sign my rights away.

01:15:29.320 And I said, well, what if you get more than one season?

01:15:32.280 They said, that'll never happen.

01:15:34.200 They did six seasons.

01:15:35.800 I think they did seven.

01:15:37.380 Seven or whatever.

01:15:39.700 And stole your show.

01:15:41.020 No, they swore.

01:15:41.600 I said, well, what if you do get another season?

01:15:45.520 Oh, well, then we'll renegotiate.

01:15:47.700 And then they said, we never said that.

01:15:49.740 So I went to every lawyer in LA and they all said, well, we previously represented Disney,

01:15:57.460 so we can't represent you.

01:15:58.840 So many.

01:15:59.720 So many, yes.

01:16:00.340 There was not one lawyer in LA or New York or Chicago.

01:16:06.380 And so I flew to Israel to find a lawyer.

01:16:10.160 And he said, yeah, you've got a case.

01:16:12.880 And I was so thankful and happy.

01:16:14.740 And then three days later, he called and said, I'm going to work for the Trump administration,

01:16:19.380 so I can't represent you.

01:16:21.940 And I never gave up looking.

01:16:24.220 It's been very difficult until I finally found some great Hispanic lawyers from Trump.

01:16:33.460 And I say Hispanic because.

01:16:39.860 They're the most fierce Americans right now.

01:16:42.200 They are fierce.

01:16:43.260 Yeah, God bless them.

01:16:46.060 Because a lot of them came from communist countries.

01:16:48.800 Yeah.

01:16:49.180 And they don't want to see what happened.

01:16:49.940 And they hate communism.

01:16:53.000 And that's what I needed.

01:16:54.940 And so we'll see.

01:16:56.760 Is there not a statute of limitations?

01:16:59.220 There is.

01:17:00.200 There is.

01:17:00.900 Okay.

01:17:01.540 But we.

01:17:04.800 We're shooting our shot.

01:17:06.160 You're on it.

01:17:06.640 Yeah.

01:17:06.840 Who knows?

01:17:07.340 But I firmly believe this is so important and so well-deserved for you to fight back,

01:17:15.680 I mean, to the nth degree.

01:17:17.520 And it's so much bigger than us.

01:17:19.780 Gina Carano.

01:17:20.660 Yeah.

01:17:21.040 Doing the exact same thing and battling with Disney.

01:17:23.260 I'm like, gosh, I wish Elon Musk had helped me with my last suit.

01:17:25.640 I know.

01:17:26.020 I do.

01:17:26.480 I would have helped financially.

01:17:27.540 She in the thread said, hello.

01:17:30.180 He's like, anyone else been fired?

01:17:31.600 And she's like, he never responded.

01:17:33.460 Interesting.

01:17:34.160 Very interesting.

01:17:35.060 Very interesting.

01:17:35.900 Yeah.

01:17:36.440 He never responds.

01:17:37.520 He's got his own.

01:17:38.400 But that's a whole other podcast.

01:17:39.720 But I mean, when you're called a racist, people.

01:17:44.900 When you're a civil rights activist for 30 years.

01:17:47.940 Yeah.

01:17:48.180 For 30 years.

01:17:48.980 And then you're called a racist because.

01:17:50.540 A little weird.

01:17:50.900 They have no geopolitical intelligence about Iran, especially then.

01:17:57.740 But now it's starting to come out what the Obama administration did with their Iran deal

01:18:03.640 in Iran against women's rights.

01:18:07.520 And that's what I was tweeting about.

01:18:08.940 But anyway, when you're called a racist, nobody wants to represent you because they're

01:18:17.780 like, we're not going to represent a racist.

01:18:20.600 Yeah.

01:18:21.100 It's a scarlet letter.

01:18:22.080 They run from it.

01:18:22.400 But can I ask you this?

01:18:24.000 Yeah.

01:18:24.300 And then we've got to wrap up.

01:18:25.600 Is it that time?

01:18:26.660 Yeah.

01:18:26.780 I want to talk all day.

01:18:28.180 I know.

01:18:28.760 Well, you'll come back because we have too much more to talk about.

01:18:32.580 Okay.

01:18:32.920 We have so much more to talk about.

01:18:34.620 Now that you don't ignore me anymore.

01:18:36.500 Stop.

01:18:37.120 Don't say that.

01:18:37.620 Well, including the fact that ABC and all these libtards that work for the CCP and all

01:18:45.280 this stuff.

01:18:45.820 They want segregation back.

01:18:52.420 Yep.

01:18:53.480 They do.

01:18:54.100 Don't they?

01:18:54.720 They do.

01:18:55.260 It's evil.

01:18:56.340 It's evil.

01:18:57.220 That is why we have to keep fighting.

01:19:01.380 Yeah.

01:19:01.560 We have to speak up.

01:19:03.020 And in your case with the lawsuit.

01:19:04.980 That is why, whether it's on social media, on your show, on my show, anytime that we have

01:19:10.860 the opportunity, we have to.

01:19:12.260 I know that you, if I have had as many people come up to me as I have, that you have had

01:19:17.060 it times 10, times 100 probably.

01:19:19.620 And people say thank you because they're afraid.

01:19:22.140 Yeah.

01:19:22.460 They're afraid to speak up for good reason.

01:19:24.060 Because if they see that Roseanne Barr can get canceled, which you haven't, you've been

01:19:27.940 punished, but not canceled.

01:19:29.040 You're still here.

01:19:29.800 Yeah.

01:19:29.920 Or me or anybody else who's done things really the right way for all those years, I always

01:19:35.260 say I understand why people stay silent.

01:19:37.160 Yeah.

01:19:37.300 Maybe we're the dummies and we should have just said, no.

01:19:40.320 So we have to do that for others.

01:19:42.500 Yeah.

01:19:42.800 I really, I believe that.

01:19:44.100 Because what we stand for, I think, is American values because we believe in integration.

01:19:51.960 I grew up in inner city, in Salt Lake City.

01:19:55.740 All my friends were black and, you know, I grew up in the inner city.

01:20:01.520 So I have those values of just seeing the light in everybody.

01:20:10.740 Yes.

01:20:11.120 Not just a specific people.

01:20:13.900 But to accuse someone of being a racist.

01:20:16.640 It killed me.

01:20:18.000 There's nothing.

01:20:18.580 I wept for three days.

01:20:21.020 And I kept calling ABC and Tom Warner, who owned my show, and I said, can you please put

01:20:28.560 out a statement saying that, you know, I am not a racist.

01:20:32.780 It killed me.

01:20:35.120 And then the next day they said, they said, if you'll sign away your rights, we'll make

01:20:41.240 that statement.

01:20:42.280 What?

01:20:42.880 Yeah.

01:20:44.400 And I, all I cared about was that because it was my whole life and a vow I took to God

01:20:52.180 to fight fascism and Nazism and racism.

01:20:57.400 And it's all that consumed me.

01:20:59.740 And the next day, there was a ton of shit about my racist tweet.

01:21:06.860 And it had nothing to do with race.

01:21:08.880 I thought she was white.

01:21:11.220 And it was about the Iran deal, which was a destruction of women and women's rights.

01:21:19.960 And, um, it, it destroyed me, killed me.

01:21:26.220 I didn't think I would make it out alive of it.

01:21:30.380 And I had people in the army that said, you need to go to, uh, what's that town called in,

01:21:38.620 over there in, uh, Taiwan.

01:21:42.040 They said, you need to go because they're going to try to kill you.

01:21:45.760 Um, cause you had a number one show and you were Trump supporter and they're coming for

01:21:50.800 you.

01:21:52.020 And, uh, Singapore, I was going to go there, but, um, you know, I felt like God was talking

01:22:00.400 to me and saying, all you have to do.

01:22:03.140 And I mean, I was down.

01:22:04.580 Um, I couldn't even walk and, uh, I couldn't get out of bed.

01:22:11.180 I was devastated.

01:22:12.740 And then God came in, like he has a thousand times in my life.

01:22:18.100 And he wrapped his wings around me.

01:22:20.300 And he said, you will have to get louder and more fierce than you've ever been in your life.

01:22:30.700 And that's how you have to fight.

01:22:32.860 And so I did, I, I did.

01:22:36.000 I called, I got, I had so many people's numbers and I called them all.

01:22:41.400 And I'm like, I'm doubling down.

01:22:43.680 I'm tripling down.

01:22:44.540 I, I won't go quietly into that.

01:22:47.300 I won't go silent into that good night.

01:22:51.260 I won't.

01:22:52.380 Cause I've already fought hard enough.

01:22:54.100 You can.

01:22:54.440 And if people want to think I'm a racist, that's just cause they're racist and fuck them.

01:23:01.000 And, uh, I, let me ask you this real quick too.

01:23:05.080 And I know we have to wrap it up.

01:23:08.640 I'm wondering if the fact that Tom Warner would not say she's not a racist.

01:23:14.820 You know, when people that you know.

01:23:16.940 He called me six months later and said, I said, you're not a racist at NAPTI when I resold the Roseanne show.

01:23:23.240 That was nice of him.

01:23:24.020 Yeah, that was nice of him.

01:23:24.960 Okay.

01:23:25.300 Thanks, Tom.

01:23:26.100 Yeah.

01:23:26.760 Yeah.

01:23:27.220 Appreciate it.

01:23:28.460 But all the racist stuff.

01:23:30.220 But when push comes to shove.

01:23:30.700 All the racist stuff about her racist tweet where she called Valerie Jarrett, said Valerie Jarrett looked like an ape.

01:23:37.680 Um, they would never show the picture that I captioned, which shows her looking just like that woman in makeup.

01:23:48.980 They would never show it.

01:23:50.880 So I could never put context to it.

01:23:53.020 Of course.

01:23:53.300 Cause context truly matters.

01:23:54.860 Yeah.

01:23:55.020 But when people that know you stay silent.

01:23:58.080 They all stayed silent.

01:23:59.160 I think that's, that's the hard.

01:24:01.400 Well, cause they knew if they did stick up for me, they'd be called a racist too.

01:24:06.000 Yeah.

01:24:06.380 So it's their fear.

01:24:07.680 And I don't even blame them.

01:24:09.240 You know what?

01:24:09.560 I'm with you on that, but as, as we get further along in the culture wars and where we are as America, fuck you.

01:24:16.200 Like that now's not the time to be silent and a pussy.

01:24:19.680 It's just not.

01:24:20.440 Maybe 10 years ago I could understand it.

01:24:22.000 And I've actually defended a lot of them.

01:24:23.700 But right now I'm feeling the divine spirit.

01:24:26.820 Fuck you.

01:24:27.220 Like stand up, stand up.

01:24:28.740 This is, this is why bad shit's happening.

01:24:30.860 This is why bad shit's happening all over the world is because people are too afraid to stand up.

01:24:34.300 Because they're in, they're silent.

01:24:35.740 They're choosing.

01:24:36.620 They're pussies.

01:24:37.220 They're choosing.

01:24:37.800 Stop being a pussy.

01:24:39.180 And they chose to do that to me in order to do that to all Trump supporters.

01:24:44.420 Yes.

01:24:45.100 Yes.

01:24:45.520 And when I made the connection, I'm like, fuck it, I'm fighting.

01:24:48.660 Good.

01:24:49.400 Because those are my fans.

01:24:51.400 They're my people.

01:24:52.540 They're every reason I came to TV.

01:24:55.000 They're every color.

01:24:56.980 And, you know, I was always so proud that I had a diverse audience.

01:25:01.180 You know, whenever I did stand up, I had every color and nation of people in my audience.

01:25:06.100 And the last few times that I've done some shows, you know, I, I, they ruined that for me.

01:25:13.100 And it's devastating.

01:25:14.560 I don't, I don't, I don't think anyone will truly comprehend what that feels like.

01:25:20.620 It's horrible.

01:25:21.800 And especially because of the way you've lived your life.

01:25:23.920 I'm going to share this with you and then I'll shut up.

01:25:26.520 Okay.

01:25:26.880 I know it's crazy.

01:25:27.340 We never want you to shut up.

01:25:28.560 We want you to come back.

01:25:29.920 Can I?

01:25:30.560 Yes, please.

01:25:31.380 We don't want you to make your flight.

01:25:32.780 I know it's a fiancé.

01:25:34.420 We've got to party.

01:25:34.900 Settle down over there.

01:25:36.720 He's engaged.

01:25:38.120 I know.

01:25:38.920 I don't have a sex drive.

01:25:40.460 I'm just saying this.

01:25:42.220 Still don't have a sex drive when you look at him?

01:25:44.040 It's gone?

01:25:44.300 No, I have no sex drive.

01:25:46.200 Okay.

01:25:46.640 But young people, I'm glad they do.

01:25:49.140 But listen, you've got to come back and we've got to just hang out.

01:25:54.100 I'm going to show you how to use my tractor.

01:25:55.940 We're going to cut grass.

01:25:56.760 Please, I know.

01:25:57.460 We've got to have some more time together.

01:26:01.540 You are just a lovely person.

01:26:04.440 Thank you so much.

01:26:04.820 And I just love you.

01:26:06.380 Thank you.

01:26:06.580 You are a sister in arms.

01:26:09.180 I just love you so much.

01:26:10.820 Can I share this little prayer?

01:26:13.420 Because this has been the coolest, best thing I learned about your mom starting that day in Los Angeles.

01:26:19.880 I didn't understand the strength of your faith.

01:26:22.760 I didn't understand it.

01:26:24.000 And it is so beautiful.

01:26:25.380 And Dave and I were talking about this after our conversation yesterday where you really shared the story about when you were three years old and God told you what was going to happen in your life with your show.

01:26:36.700 Like, so beautiful.

01:26:37.480 I can't wait.

01:26:38.240 It's crazy, right?

01:26:39.280 I can't wait for people to see that on my show, too.

01:26:41.160 This is the prayer that my dad made us memorize as kids.

01:26:44.320 Oh, great.

01:26:45.500 From his days at West Point when he was forced to say it probably 10,000 times.

01:26:50.080 But this is what got me through everything in my life.

01:26:53.220 I love it.

01:26:53.740 And it reminds me of what you're doing right now.

01:26:55.640 What?

01:26:56.240 Help me to choose the harder right instead of the easier wrong and never to be content with a half truth when the whole can be one.

01:27:06.420 Amen.

01:27:07.020 I'm going to send this to you.

01:27:08.200 Please.

01:27:08.640 It's your mom because you can apply it to everything in your life.

01:27:12.780 Say again.

01:27:14.380 Harder right.

01:27:15.280 The harder right instead of the easier wrong.

01:27:17.060 Instead of the easier wrong.

01:27:18.020 Oh, yeah.

01:27:18.740 Right?

01:27:19.100 Like, think about that.

01:27:19.900 And what you're doing right now by fighting back, by saying I'm too old not to fight back, it is the harder right.

01:27:26.860 Yeah.

01:27:27.260 It would be easier to stay silent right now because, hey, you're good.

01:27:32.060 You're not hurting.

01:27:32.660 Yeah, you're not hurting.

01:27:33.580 You're hurting in life financially, whatever.

01:27:35.300 No, but I'm closer to going up there.

01:27:37.940 Correct.

01:27:38.520 To see my God where he goes, why were you silent?

01:27:41.960 Yes.

01:27:42.700 I know he'd ask me that.

01:27:44.260 I gave you a big fat mouth and you was always going around.

01:27:47.600 And you wasted it.

01:27:48.040 Yeah.

01:27:48.360 And now you're silent?

01:27:49.460 At the end, yes.

01:27:50.160 Because you have, in the last part of that prayer, you have the opportunity to not settle for a half truth.

01:27:56.460 Like, the whole truth has to come out.

01:27:58.380 Yeah, that's right.

01:27:58.980 And people don't know it.

01:27:59.660 I think now they're learning it in every aspect of our country and life and world with the anti-Semitism and everything.

01:28:06.460 It's bad.

01:28:06.800 So we have to speak the truth and not settle.

01:28:09.120 So thank you for doing that, for all these years for me and for so many others.

01:28:14.600 Well, I want you to give your dad a big hug and a kiss and give your mom a big hug and a kiss and say,

01:28:22.200 I sent it to them through you because what heroes and to create such a lovely child.

01:28:31.580 Don't make me cry again today.

01:28:33.360 I've already been crying in this whole episode a couple times.

01:28:35.320 Thank you.

01:28:35.660 I just love you.

01:28:36.420 You're on a beautiful life path.

01:28:40.400 Yeah, you're a rare person.

01:28:42.680 And this guy is something else.

01:28:44.100 I'll tell you.

01:28:44.560 Calm down.

01:28:44.740 Remember, he still thinks I'm a lightweight.

01:28:46.860 Let's let him believe that.

01:28:49.300 Let's enjoy the last few months of him smiling, shall we?

01:28:54.120 How lucky are you to hook up with her?

01:28:57.460 Listen, it takes around two sometimes, right?

01:28:59.860 Yeah.

01:29:00.380 Or three.

01:29:00.740 My second marriage is the best.

01:29:04.180 I've been four times and I'm never doing it again.

01:29:08.980 I'm just going to get a dog.

01:29:11.160 You can't even get a dog.

01:29:12.080 I can't let you get a dog.

01:29:12.760 He won't let me get a dog.

01:29:13.540 No, Jake knows.

01:29:14.940 Don't let her do it.

01:29:16.440 Get an AI boyfriend.

01:29:18.160 They have their AI's advanced.

01:29:18.800 I don't want any boyfriends.

01:29:20.420 I don't want to listen to one more man.

01:29:22.820 No, no, listen.

01:29:23.520 You could program AI to listen to you.

01:29:25.820 I don't want to listen to any man tell me anything ever again.

01:29:28.220 No, no, mom.

01:29:28.260 You can have an AI boyfriend.

01:29:29.540 And I don't want to be a lesbian because I hate women and all they do is, yeah.

01:29:33.420 I don't want to be a lesbian either.

01:29:35.400 Mom, listen to me.

01:29:35.920 You could program an AI boyfriend to just love every time you tell the same story over and over

01:29:40.600 and be like, you are the most amazing person.

01:29:42.560 You can do that.

01:29:43.200 That's why I have grandkids.

01:29:44.900 Tell me I'm beautiful.

01:29:46.020 Tell me I'm beautiful.

01:29:46.660 They love my stories, my grandkids.

01:29:49.220 They love it when I burp and laugh.

01:29:52.440 Wrap it up.

01:29:52.960 They're going to miss their flight.

01:29:54.140 She hasn't belched one time during this show.

01:29:56.540 I'm very disappointed.

01:29:58.200 There you go, baby.

01:30:00.540 Thank you so much for being here.

01:30:02.440 You're coming again.

01:30:03.580 We have much more to discuss regarding history in this country and where we're going.

01:30:09.420 I want to talk to you about that.

01:30:11.040 Love you.

01:30:12.100 Thanks for tuning in.

01:30:14.300 So you see, my patience is growing thin in this synthetic world we're living in.

01:30:27.620 Oh, you see, my patience is growing thin with this synthetic world we're living in.

"I'm Too Old Not To Fight" W⧹ Sage Steele ｜ The Roseanne Barr Podcast #104

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