The Saad Truth with Dr. Saad

00:00:00.000 Hey everybody, this is Gatsat's second interview this week while being unbelievably sick, but you

00:00:07.440 know what? The defense of truth doesn't care if you've got a cold or a cough, and so here I am

00:00:12.360 today with the intrepid and courageous journalist Andy Ngo, who is a senior editor at the Post 0.99

00:00:19.260 Millennial News and also a New York Times best-selling author, god damn you, unmasked 1.00

00:00:26.640 Inside Antifa's Radical Plan to Destroy Democracy came out in 2021. How are you doing, Andy? 0.91

00:00:32.520 I'm very happy to be speaking with you. I've been looking forward to this.

00:00:36.520 Likewise, it's been years where we've been saying, hey, when are you coming on and so on,

00:00:40.560 and finally it's here. I asked you offline and you said I could share. You've now moved from the

00:00:47.560 utopia of Portland, Oregon, where everybody sings Kumbaya, to London, which is greatly

00:00:56.540 enriched by noble adherence of peace. How is that going?

00:01:01.280 So I get asked similar questions all the time, like, is which place is worse? And

00:01:08.940 the challenges that are posed in both places are very different. So Portland or many left-wing

00:01:17.740 urban areas in the U.S. have elements of radical leftism where it's dominated in government and

00:01:26.220 education. The judicial system is corrupt. The prosecutor's office are corrupt in that they

00:01:34.760 turn a blind eye to left-wing political violence. So you can have arson, rioting, incitement to

00:01:42.120 violence, death threats, maiming, and injuries of people. And you see over and over, if they're

00:01:47.320 doing it for the leftist political reasons, they are not prosecuted or on the rare chance that they

00:01:53.080 are. And actually convicted, they're given some type of sweetheart deal, no jail time, small fine.

00:01:59.620 Whereas in the U.K., you don't. The criminal justice system is, in my view, less corrupt compared to the U.S.

00:02:10.100 The way it's set up, it's less politicized. However, the challenges in Western Europe and in the U.K.

00:02:20.080 are immense in that certain immigrant demographic communities are radicalized for more than two,

00:02:35.040 for two generations, I would say. And you have some communities that operate in a separatist way.

00:02:42.480 You have, and I mean, I'm speaking a bit euphemistically, but I know in your show,

00:02:47.780 we can cut through the BS. I'm talking about Muslim communities. We've seen over and over how 1.00

00:02:54.900 whenever there's conflict involving Israel, there's a rise in anti-Semitic attacks. There's also

00:03:03.240 many more instances of Islamic terrorism here. And so that is an immensely deep challenge that they

00:03:12.080 deal with here. It's very different than the other set of challenges that I just talked about in

00:03:16.640 Portland and other places. Although now we're seeing an interesting phenomenon crystallize a bit

00:03:22.900 more, particularly in the U.S., although it's happened more in Europe and the U.K. in that

00:03:28.640 the coalition building between the radical left and the Islamists.

00:03:34.740 Yeah. So Jamie Glazoff, are you familiar with him? Do you know who that is?

00:03:38.160 No, please tell me more.

00:03:38.980 Jamie Glazoff is, I think by training, is a historian. I think he got a PhD in history

00:03:44.640 somewhere in Canada. I can't remember where. I think he now lives in Southern California.

00:03:49.280 He wrote a book a few years ago. I hope I don't butcher the title. I think it was called

00:03:54.760 United in Hate, where he specifically speaks exactly about the alliance that you just mentioned,

00:04:00.580 the alliance between sort of the progressive left and the Islamists. And of course, the progressive 0.94

00:04:05.780 left, I think their blind spot is that they think that somehow by uniting and going to bed with the

00:04:11.940 hardcore Islamists, somehow they will be spared when, you know, if the Islamists were to ever take 1.00

00:04:16.920 over, it's not as though they love the progressive left, correct?

00:04:21.860 Well, that's correct. But we, I mean, with the radical left, they never have the interests of their

00:04:28.560 own countrymen at heart. In fact, they hate their fellow citizens. And I mean, we see this just

00:04:36.980 in recent days with all these queers for Palestine, trans for Palestine. I mean, these people are stupid, 1.00

00:04:43.500 but they are also aware clearly of what happens to LGBTQ plus people in the Palestinian territories. 1.00

00:04:51.300 I'm not only talking about Hamas run Gaza, I'm also talking about the Palestinian authority run

00:04:57.940 West Bank, life is horrific for gay people there as well. And in spite of that, or perhaps because of

00:05:04.560 that, one could even argue, they still show up for these demonstrations with these banners, with those

00:05:10.640 who really would like to see them killed. Well, I mean, I just had a few days ago, I don't know if you've had a

00:05:17.240 chance to look at it. If you haven't, please do. And I'm also imploring my listeners and viewers to

00:05:23.360 watch it. I had two days ago, a Yemeni, who now lives in Sweden, activist. So of course, he was born

00:05:31.480 into a Muslim family. So he understands Islam very well. He speaks Arabic, of course, as I do. And he

00:05:37.280 happens to be a gay man. And so, you know, he, not surprisingly, he shared what, you know, what would

00:05:43.980 happen to you in Yemen if you were openly gay, if somebody found out, and so on. And it's really

00:05:49.660 quite remarkable that it doesn't matter how much evidence you provide to parasitized Western minds,

00:05:58.240 somehow they know better, right? The person in Portland, or in New York, walking around with the

00:06:04.600 banners, Queers for Palestine, knows better about the reality of gay life in the Middle East, 0.97

00:06:10.500 than this gentleman. His name is Luwai Ahmed. Is there any way, I mean, yes, I wrote the book

00:06:19.060 called The Parasitic Mind, but I'm growing increasingly pessimistic at the possibility

00:06:26.080 of being able to offer people inoculation against these parasitic thoughts. Are you more hopeful than I

00:06:33.060 am? I'm not, I'm actually very pessimistic, I think. For several years now, we see that there is a

00:06:42.120 consistently ready supply of essential foot, essentially foot soldiers for leftist causes,

00:06:49.440 young people, adolescents, youth, many of them who have been radicalized in the public education

00:06:56.000 systems. And we're not talking only about universities anymore. We that that's a discussion

00:07:01.300 from 10 years ago. Now we're seeing it in the high schools, junior highs, and even primary schools.

00:07:08.020 One troubling trend that's been adopted in the UK, very recently, just in the last 48 hours. Now there

00:07:16.780 are these school strikes for Palestine that are sort of emulating what we've seen happen in the US

00:07:22.820 class previously for either BLM or for up for Palestinian causes. Now we have in Muslim areas,

00:07:29.780 students skipping class to go out and protest. I just went to one of these predominantly Muslim

00:07:36.260 boroughs to observe and to document what's going on. And unsurprisingly, as I've written out about

00:07:43.780 before it, it is a parallel society. I'm not just talking about it happening to be a Muslim majority

00:07:52.100 borough, you see a whole different set of different values, obviously different religious practices,

00:07:58.020 but how life is oriented is entirely different. And in my view, the I mean, it's a sign of Islamist 0.98

00:08:06.820 separatism when you have children, girls who are all entirely veiled, some of them even not just wearing a 0.79

00:08:14.580 hijab, but actually even covering their faces. Last week, we saw similar scenes in Brooklyn, New York,

00:08:23.460 of these children, many of them wearing niqabs, shouting, not just Allahu Akbar, but also other 0.94

00:08:32.020 Islamic chants and going around intimidating Jewish owned businesses in Brooklyn. And these type of scenes

00:08:40.020 are now that it's happening more and more, I'm concerned that people have just sort of accepted

00:08:45.460 that this is, well, obviously, this is life in Europe, but this is relatively new to the US,

00:08:51.540 this type of open Islamist activism in terms of the crowds that we're seeing, and the youth that are

00:08:58.180 involved. And we don't really see people talking about it. There's kind of banal statements by some

00:09:03.780 politicians, Democrats who've talked about anti Semitism and all that. But I don't think it's

00:09:10.340 really getting to the, like the deeper issue. Yes, it's anti Semitism and a lot of this, but there's

00:09:17.220 also there's more going on. Yeah, you know, about two, I can't remember if it was about two weeks ago,

00:09:23.460 maybe I put out a tweet that went really, really viral. I don't know how many people, 11, 12,

00:09:30.180 15 million people saw it, it got all kinds of attention. And one of the reasons I think it got

00:09:34.580 a lot of attention is because people were surprised by the somber tone that that tweet took, where

00:09:43.140 usually, even when I'm dealing with very serious issues, I can always find a way to be sarcastic,

00:09:47.460 or humorous, or flippant, or jovial. But here, it was very dark, because it was really reflecting

00:09:53.700 my, you know, ever growing realization that there's a perfect confluence of factors that makes

00:10:00.980 the problem almost intractable. Let me explain and I'll have you weigh in. You know, if, if your

00:10:08.180 physician tells you, God forbid that, you know, you have stage four cancer, and then, you know,

00:10:14.420 here are some intervention strategies that we can try to hopefully beat it. And then your answer is,

00:10:19.220 well, first of all, there is no such thing as cancer. And if there is such a thing as cancer,

00:10:22.980 it's probably the Jews who did it. And probably they have the cure for cancer, and they're withholding 1.00

00:10:28.660 it because they're trying to make money. And as a matter of fact, I'm going to smoke four packs a day

00:10:32.980 and inhale a bag of asbestos, because I want to prove to you that there is no such thing as cancer.

00:10:39.220 That's really what you're seeing in the West, which is, you know, there are opportunities to correct,

00:10:45.460 to auto correct now and do things that hopefully will ensure that our grandchildren will have,

00:10:51.220 you know, a better society than the one we're currently facing. But there is absolutely no

00:10:56.100 stomach from Western leaders to implement or even discuss some of the strategies that need

00:11:02.020 to be implemented. And of course, I, as you said, this is a no bullshit show. The reality is when you let 0.96

00:11:08.660 in millions of people who do not share, many of whom do not share, and when I say many,

00:11:14.500 it's not 20% don't share, you know, you've got Pew surveys that show that people coming from the

00:11:20.900 Middle East have about a 95 to 99% expressed Jew hatred. Well, then it's not surprising that when 0.98

00:11:29.620 the numbers of immigrants coming from those cultures reach a certain tipping point, you're going to have 1.00

00:11:35.140 increased Jew hatred, you don't need to be a fancy professor to get that. So is there a way to eventually 0.67

00:11:40.660 break through to our policymakers? I mean, I know that in Britain, there was a woman who was recently

00:11:46.820 fired as home secretary, who was trying to talk about this. And her reward was, she was summarily

00:11:54.100 fired. Do we have any hope Andy? So, in the US, I asked myself, actually, what can be done given sort of

00:12:02.900 the the legal framework around protections with the free speech in the First Amendment. So some of the

00:12:11.060 interventions that have happened on the some countries in Western Europe, so in the UK, they,

00:12:17.860 there's incitement to racial hatred is illegal. And this is the legislation that is being used to

00:12:24.900 arrest a number of suspects that have been arrested at these pro Palestine pro Hamas rallies, and also

00:12:31.620 expressing support or inviting support for banned terrorist groups is also criminal offence here

00:12:39.380 in the UK. So some people have been arrested, and are facing charges based on that there's the

00:12:45.700 similar legislation that exists in other countries in the EU as well. France banned the pro Palestine

00:12:54.020 rallies and fear of knowing that, you know, anti semitic incitement of violence would occur.

00:12:59.860 Germany's restricted and ban a number of them as well. So those type of interventions cannot take place

00:13:06.660 legally in the US because of the First Amendment. And so I, I don't, I don't have a good sort of,

00:13:17.060 I haven't thought of any way, at least within America that you could really challenge at the legal

00:13:22.580 level, some of these issues that we're seeing, because fundamentally, it is a speech issue. And

00:13:29.940 what I've seen some people on the right struggle with for the last few, since the 7th of October,

00:13:35.140 is like, people who previously have described themselves as very free speech absolutists are kind

00:13:42.340 of now really struggling with seeing, well, we are having an environment where this type of incitement to

00:13:49.220 terrorism, incitement to hatred is, is being allowed and, and, and done with impunity, because it can be.

00:13:56.020 So I'll, I'll give my remedy, which I'm not sure if it works within the legal framework of the United

00:14:04.260 States. I am a free speech absolutist. You probably heard me mention in the past that I support the

00:14:10.180 right of Holocaust deniers to deny the Holocaust. It is almost inconceivable to think of something more

00:14:16.660 insulting and offensive than that, right? The wholesale industrial scale level eradication of an entire

00:14:22.100 people that's obviously fully historically documented. Someone can get up and say, well,

00:14:26.980 it didn't happen. And if it did happen, it was only 2000 Jews that were killed, not 6 million.

00:14:32.020 And yet I recognize that in a free society, you have to, you have to be able to tolerate the most

00:14:37.140 offensive speech. But on the other hand, and I don't think this violates my commitment to

00:14:43.220 free speech absolutism. I think that you could have belief systems that by their very nature are

00:14:51.460 a incitement to violence. In other words, the DNA of their content is such that there is,

00:14:59.140 you know, I mean, I can literally quote all the passages from those particular belief systems that

00:15:04.260 are direct incitements to violence. So the only way that I could see this being resolved,

00:15:09.780 although I understand that with the, uh, the, the, uh, the tradition of having freedom of

00:15:16.020 conscience of the United States, it might be difficult to go after religious beliefs.

00:15:20.820 It might need to be the case that certain religious tenants are viewed as seditious. They are,

00:15:27.380 they are, they are literally treasonous against the host nation. And that will be the only way that you

00:15:33.380 would be able to deal with it. But I don't see that the West in general, and even the United States

00:15:38.420 with this first amendment protection ever having the stomach to do that.

00:15:41.860 Um, I think one possible way that, um, these ideas could be challenged outside of like a criminal

00:15:52.740 justice system is if civil society was quite, um, equipped to recognize this type of extremist

00:16:01.060 language and views and, and to challenge it, such as in America, what they do for like far-right neo

00:16:07.380 Nazi type groups. You have all these so-called hate watch groups. Uh, the media is obviously very

00:16:13.140 good at it and there's so much, um, focus on it. Actually, I think what's happened is that,

00:16:19.460 um, they've painted a narrative that like the, the threat to democracy, the threat to, uh, everything

00:16:26.660 American freedom and in minorities and all that is only coming from the right and the far right. 0.71

00:16:33.940 And so all these organizations, many of them have a lot of money. I'm talking about like SPLC,

00:16:38.660 ADL and others. They, now that they've been forced to, um, well, hopefully they've been forced to

00:16:47.060 recognize that, um, there's all this, uh, Jew hatred that's operating on the left and, and among many

00:16:54.900 Muslim Americans. Unfortunately, they don't have the tools, um, to deal with it at all. And neither 1.00

00:17:02.900 does the media. And I guess this speaks more broadly to the precepticized mind that you, you write

00:17:08.660 about and speak about, um, the institutions that these people are a part of have, have been captured as

00:17:14.900 well. So it's, I mean, even if they, there's no will also to even, you know, confront, uh, these

00:17:23.700 challenges, um, in their own organizations to just to better inform the public.

00:17:30.340 And I think, so, you know, I've, I've long thought about all these issues. I've been talking about them

00:17:34.580 for decades. There is something in the Western mind that views it as incredibly gauche to criticize

00:17:41.860 a religion, right? That's sacrosanct, right? But of course, religions don't come in the same form. An 0.58

00:17:49.620 extremist Jainist, right? It's someone who practices Jainism is someone who really goes out of their way 1.00

00:17:56.580 to not step on ants, right? So if you, if you know the practice of Jains, they walk around with a sweep, 0.99

00:18:02.500 with a broom, and they sweep the floor as they walk because they don't want to inadvertently

00:18:08.340 step on any living organism. So someone who is a fundamentalist Jainist, who really takes

00:18:14.980 their religion seriously, is really sweeping the street as they walk to not, uh, you know, 0.98

00:18:20.980 squash an ant. Now, extremists or fundamentalists of other religions, because they're operating with

00:18:27.700 a different memoplex, a different set of ideas, are going to arrive to different behavioral patterns

00:18:34.260 as a result of their commitment to their religion. But yet the Western mind, because it has been so

00:18:39.620 inculcated with this notion that, you know, the US was founded on religious liberties, so there is no

00:18:46.260 instinctual reflex for the, for a Western or American person to say, no, I am in the right to criticize

00:18:54.580 these tenets from this particular religion. And I think what allows this to happen is another idea,

00:19:00.260 pathogen, cultural relativism, right? Who are you to judge whether other cultures view it okay to cut

00:19:07.140 off the clitorises of five-year-old girls? If you do that, Andy, you are a cultural imperialist. Don't 0.99

00:19:13.940 impose your standards on another. So because of these cocktails, it leaves us completely exposed and

00:19:19.620 vulnerable. So I observed, um, in, in the US and Canada that actually there's quite a lot of, um,

00:19:26.740 hatred of Christianity and insulting of people with Christian beliefs. That's, um, for a long time,

00:19:32.980 the, the one religion that people in public, politicians included, feel comfortable insulting

00:19:39.940 and degrading. And I, and I make this observation as somebody who is not religious myself, by the way.

00:19:45.700 Um, it, I think, um, I mean, I guess I would be less irritated about this if it was sort of a free-for-all

00:19:53.780 for all religious beliefs, but certain religious beliefs are, um, particularly with Islam are quite,

00:20:01.540 are treated as, um, sector sacrosanct and above criticism. Um, I think partially, uh, a lot of that's

00:20:10.740 motivated by this relativism that you, you just talked about. Some of it's motivated by just left-wing

00:20:17.860 ethics and views. And then some of it's motivated by fears as well. Um, there's just, there's just

00:20:25.220 been too many terrorist attacks in the West related to people who have been accused of blasphemy. Um,

00:20:32.100 so yeah, that's, um, that's really the reality we, we live in. And going back to what we were just

00:20:40.500 talking a moment ago about, um, what can be done either through civil society or through governments,

00:20:46.580 you know, I think the, the approaches that have been done in, in the UK and the EU are really

00:20:52.740 band-aid. Um, Exactly. They're small band-aids. I mean, okay, you, you charge somebody with incitement,

00:21:00.180 somebody is convicted of incitement to hatred, racial hatred. Um, there's usually a fine. Um, and then,

00:21:07.700 I mean, that doesn't really solve like the bigger issues that are happening in some of these

00:21:12.500 communities. Um, uh, and you mentioned Suala Braverman who is the, um, the head of the, um,

00:21:19.780 the home office in the UK and that's equivalent of DHS, uh, in the US. Yeah. And she was just fired, 0.92

00:21:26.820 uh, earlier this week and she was very brave in many of what she, her open criticisms of multiculturalism and,

00:21:36.020 and she branded these Palestinian marches as hate marches. And that was, I mean, she was absolutely

00:21:44.260 destroyed in the press and by the chartering classes. Um, and, and now David Cameron's brought

00:21:50.980 back in as a, in a cabinet office, former prime minister, David Cameron. I mean, it was under

00:21:56.260 when he was prime minister that there were, there were all these IS Islamic state attacks and all

00:22:01.940 these British citizens were, um, leaving to go to Iraq and Syria. And the government was scrambling to

00:22:08.980 find like, what let's identify what British values are so we can try to make society more cohesive. And they

00:22:16.500 defined it as, um, tolerance and democracy. I mean, that's, that's not an identity that,

00:22:25.060 sorry, in my view, that's an, that's not an identity that Muslims are going to buy into 1.00

00:22:29.940 tolerance and diversity in democracy.

00:22:32.580 So a couple of points, number one, regarding your bandaid stuff, here's an analogy that I've used to,

00:22:37.940 to, to demonstrate the inefficacy of a lot of these bands, you know, let's ban the pro Hamas. 0.69

00:22:44.580 Yes. I mean, okay, sure. It's, it's a step forward, but the analogy that I would use is your hair is on

00:22:50.260 fire. And rather than putting out your hair being on fire, you seek ways to deal with the dandruff

00:22:59.220 in your hair, right? So I'm going to handle the dandruff, but the fact that my hair is literally on

00:23:05.860 fire, that's just secondary. I won't worry about that. So that, so I'm completely on board, but you

00:23:10.980 know, the, the issue of, uh, you know, trying to inculcate some of these, uh, immigrants with, 1.00

00:23:15.700 you know, quote British values that speaks to a point. I'm actually thinking of writing a, uh,

00:23:20.740 an article for one of the popular outlets on this. So are you familiar, Andy? And if you're not,

00:23:26.100 that's fine. I'll explain it. Are you familiar with the notion of theory of mind? Do you know what

00:23:29.780 that is? Have you heard that? Please explain. Theory of mind is a psychological ability that basically

00:23:37.860 argues that for humans to engage in meaningful dialogue, we're a social species. You and I

00:23:44.820 have to talk to each other, negotiate reality. I have to have theory of mind to be able to have

00:23:51.460 a meaningful conversation with you. Meaning what? I have to put myself in your mind to know what you

00:23:57.660 might be thinking and you do the same with me. And the ability to have reciprocal theory of mind

00:24:03.640 allows us to typically communicate in a hopefully productive way. One of the things that you do with

00:24:09.420 people that, uh, children that you think might be autistic is you actually, from a very young age,

00:24:15.460 give them a test to measure if they have theory of mind. So by a certain age, a child should be able

00:24:22.880 to put themselves in the mind of another in solving some task and autistic children fail theory of mind. 0.98

00:24:29.860 Now you might say, well, okay, well, what are you talking about? Does that relate to what we're

00:24:32.640 talking about? So I am proposing that there is a form of lack of cultural theory of mind in the West.

00:24:40.400 So rather than me talking about, I may or may not have theory of mind when it comes to interacting

00:24:46.100 with Andy, no, it's, do I have cultural theory of mind? Meaning do I understand, for example, the

00:24:54.020 middle Eastern mindset to be able to know what are the values that, you know, incite them to do the

00:25:02.040 things that they do and do they share my values? And of course the West doesn't have cultural theory

00:25:08.420 of mind. I argue precisely for what you said, which is they view that if you're tolerant, if you're

00:25:14.560 magnanimous, if you're infinitely kind, if you're infinitely generous, if you're infinitely welcoming,

00:25:21.340 those values are so virtuous that they will have an impact on the one to whom you're imparting those

00:25:30.160 values. Whereas as someone who comes from the Middle East, I could tell you that what that is communicated to

00:25:37.540 many folks in this region is weakness, weakness, weakness, weakness to be conquered. And so that's an

00:25:47.560 intractable problem because if you don't understand what are the values that are, you know, shaping how

00:25:53.720 the other is interacting with you, you're going to make the same mistakes over and over again.

00:26:00.300 I, you know, I, I, I'm often criticized for being, I guess, harsh in some of my writings against

00:26:08.060 some of these migrant communities. And I think one, one area that I want to illuminate a bit more on is

00:26:16.280 that I have sympathy in the fact that like, many of these, speaking in UK and Europe, some of these

00:26:27.220 immigrants who come, will move into a particular area where there are many people from the same home

00:26:33.240 country. And then once they're there, they, the organizations that are operating there are these Islamist 1.00

00:26:43.180 groups. And so it's like the, the host country for so long, I think now they're starting to recognize

00:26:50.380 some of the issues. I don't know if they're doing much about it, but they, they weren't aware that

00:26:56.700 these organizations that were propped up, some of them received government funding or people who

00:27:02.220 had language barriers were directed to these organizations for support, were explicitly directing

00:27:09.320 them to organizations that do preach or, or have like a religious essence of separatism. And so it's,

00:27:19.240 it's also a failure of the state in part for, for integration. And I mean, this discussion,

00:27:26.520 though, has been going on for how many years now? And do we see anything really changing on the ground?

00:27:32.440 No, you can look at different models, the French, laicite, I guess, from an American's perspective can

00:27:40.360 be seen as very sort of harsh. You know, the state has the state in France has the power to shut down

00:27:49.160 religious institutions, they've shut down a number of mosques. The US doesn't have the power to do that.

00:27:55.640 For example, Britain is very tolerant with its multiculturalism approach to its immigrant

00:28:05.880 communities. And that hasn't produced good integration either. I mean, yeah, I mean, there's so

00:28:12.600 many British radicalized Muslims. So it, I mean, in my view, it does seem like, regardless of the

00:28:20.520 country, you have pretty big issues. Some people point to America as being the best example of Muslim

00:28:27.960 integration. In my view, I think it's because the Muslim numbers are quite low. Exactly right. 1.00

00:28:36.280 Yeah, exactly right. It's, it's all okay, until it isn't right. Lebanon, where I was born and raised,

00:28:43.640 was all good and, you know, pluralistic and tolerant until you had to wear running shoes and really run

00:28:50.360 fast so that your head is not decapitated from the rest of your body. So, so yes, it's, it, the United

00:28:56.520 States appears to be a bit, you know, better on that trajectory for the exact reasons that you

00:29:01.800 mentioned, but demography is destiny and wait till those numbers increase as we're now seeing,

00:29:07.800 right? I mean, one of the reasons, there's Michigan, there is Minnesota, right? So I, I put out a,

00:29:14.520 one of those kind of Socratic polls that I put up on Twitter, where I'm trying to show people. So,

00:29:20.920 so I say, let's suppose, as a hypothetical exercise, you know, there was an increased number

00:29:27.320 of Rashida Tlayib and Ilhan Omar in, in, in Congress. Would that result in a greater protection of,

00:29:36.360 you know, American freedoms or lesser? Well, the fact that a single person would actually argue for

00:29:42.200 greater freedoms, it shows that it's bad, but you should just go and watch the numbers that I

00:29:46.840 receive. And now again, remember, you know, I'm, I probably have an audience that is, you know,

00:29:51.800 more attuned with, you know, the way they should properly be thinking. And yet you get tons of

00:29:56.360 people who say, oh yeah, more, more Ilhan Omar could only benefit the United States. So that's why I,

00:30:03.000 I put out that tweet where I was so pessimistic, because if the individual doesn't,

00:30:08.040 or the individual or the society don't have a self-preservation instinct, then it's all doomed.

00:30:15.960 You know, I've seen a lot of extremist protest activity happen at the university that

00:30:25.160 you're, you're at, and obviously at many, many other universities across America and Canada.

00:30:31.960 And when I look at that, and then also I see this, these activities and

00:30:38.600 happening at high schools and involving children, I, I don't know how you de-radicalize these,

00:30:46.520 these people. It's like, it's the problem is here. And it's, to me, it seems like it's

00:30:53.720 kind of too late to do anything. I agree. So I, I've often said, and now, I mean, I hate to be the

00:30:59.880 guy saying, I told you so, but I get tons of emails from people saying, oh boy, I should,

00:31:04.760 we should have listened to you five years ago, 10 years ago. But I think that when people will wake

00:31:10.280 up, what will end up happening is that there will be a lot more violence than had we solved the

00:31:16.280 problem 10 years ago, 15 years ago, 20 years ago. So there will be an awakening. The problem to your

00:31:22.840 point is that the awakening, when it happens, will only take one form. It will have to be

00:31:29.560 violence everywhere. As we're seeing it now with the protest, right? Right now with the protest,

00:31:34.840 you're not seeing orgiastic eradication of people the way you would in Rwanda and Iraq or Lebanon.

00:31:40.920 But believe me, wait another 20, 30, 50 years. And that's what you will have. And I think the

00:31:47.000 problem is that, first of all, people don't have the imagination of being a futurist, right? They

00:31:52.440 can't extrapolate from current trends to where we're going. And also, even if they have the ability,

00:31:59.480 they don't want to do that because that's goddamn scary, right? I'm too busy worrying about my daughter's

00:32:05.800 graduation and getting the onions for tonight's dinner. I don't want to be thinking about such

00:32:11.400 existential angst. So it's better for me to bury my head in the sand and hopefully the problem will

00:32:16.120 go away. Okay, so we both acknowledge there are a lot of issues in all these countries.

00:32:24.600 What do you think are, what do you think can be done? So my, you know, I'm glad you brought it

00:32:30.440 back to hopefully actionable solutions. I think that there are certain belief systems that once they

00:32:37.320 become, never mind in the majority, in a sizable minority, that puts an end to that society. And

00:32:44.360 we've got so much historical evidence of that. So in an abstract sense, although I think I'm being

00:32:50.680 very concrete, it is impossible to coexist amongst certain belief systems. It's as simple as that,

00:32:57.960 right? Karl Popper famously talked about the paradox of tolerance, right? That, you know,

00:33:03.640 in our infinite desire to be liberal and tolerant towards the intolerable, those intolerable beliefs

00:33:11.000 end up killing you once they are in the majority. So the only way I see this being resolved

00:33:17.240 is if those belief systems are kept at such small numbers that they could never cause harm to the

00:33:24.600 host societies. So you can fill in the dots of what that might mean, but there really is no other

00:33:31.720 solution. So to draw an analogy that some people might be offended by, but it is an analogy that,

00:33:39.560 you know, cancer is dangerous and there is no way to say, but, you know, let's be nice. Cancer

00:33:46.360 cells also have a right to, right? You, if you want to fight cancer, you have to eradicate cancer.

00:33:52.920 There are certain, now, again, most people that belong to these, you know, challenging belief systems

00:34:01.800 are perfectly lovely. And I don't need to preface this and repeat this, but the reality is that those

00:34:08.920 people don't stand up to defend your right to exist as a gay man and my right to exist as a Jewish man,

00:34:16.360 when they are in the majority. So then it becomes difficult to decide who's the nice one, who's the

00:34:22.280 radical one, who's going to kill me, who's going to stand by on the sideline and cheer while others 0.73

00:34:28.280 are killing me. And I think Sam Harris had mentioned this when he was talking about the concentric circles

00:34:33.800 of what constitutes the fundamentalist and the next group and the next group. So the only way I see it is

00:34:40.280 that you have to develop the reflex to not tolerate intolerable belief systems. I mean,

00:34:46.120 does that offer an answer or am I still being too abstract for you?

00:34:51.560 You're being abstract in the sense that to enact what I think you're trying to get at, it would

00:34:56.760 involve draconian chain measures and an erosion of, I guess, maybe liberal democratic norms and

00:35:09.320 and in precedence.

00:35:12.360 So then what? Okay, so then, so let's suppose we want to adhere to those liberal democratic norms.

00:35:18.920 Can I bring up a specific example? So the UK has been dealing with huge numbers of illegal migration

00:35:29.080 for years now. And since Brexit, it's only actually gotten worse with migrants coming from 1.00

00:35:36.360 Muslim societies in Eastern Europe, going through the EU, going up to France, and then just taking 1.00

00:35:45.000 boats, there's these whole smuggling networks, they just come in. And as soon as they don't even have,

00:35:50.600 they don't have to land on British soil, they just have to get within British water. And then the military

00:35:57.880 will take them in and escort them in provide housing, food and the numbers have been surging

00:36:04.200 for years now. It's been a crisis, it's been a huge pressure point for the conservative government,

00:36:08.680 who has overseen this issue get worse and worse year after year, you know, they they promise and

00:36:14.280 their platforms and all the speeches that we will, we will stop the boats, they haven't been able to. And

00:36:19.240 Suella Braverman has brought up that, well, it's because the the Britain is part of the European Court of

00:36:27.800 Human Rights. So they are legally bound to date one, they have to bring these people in. And then

00:36:35.880 there has to be this whole process of every case has to be heard. Obviously, if a asylum claim,

00:36:41.880 because all of them just claim asylum, even though they're coming from safe countries, and going

00:36:46.760 through a number of safe countries, but they claim asylum, even if it happens to be the case happens to be

00:36:52.360 rejected, they can appeal it. That takes many, many months, and then in the process, they often

00:36:58.120 disappear. And so she's, she and a number of people have argued that, well, the UK will have to leave

00:37:05.880 the European Court of Human Rights. And that, that is just seen as sort of, we can't do that, that would

00:37:10.600 be violating British values, we violating our international obligations, etc, etc. So it's, it's long

00:37:19.720 stopped. And I, I don't know this as a fact, but I assume that pressure point was one of the reasons,

00:37:25.160 probably why she was forced out, because she was willing to actually say, well, this is what we have

00:37:29.960 to do. If you want to have the legal authority to actually stop, stop these boats and deport these

00:37:34.680 people immediately. But that, but I mean, that, again, speaks to my analogy of you're taking care of

00:37:42.120 the dandruff, when your hair is on fire, right? You're trying to, I don't mean you, I mean,

00:37:47.160 let's say, in case of the former Home Secretary, even though, of course, she's very brave, and her

00:37:54.480 height, her heart and mind are in the right place. She's trying to operate within, and I understand

00:38:00.520 that, you know, we're not a anarchy, you have to operate within certain legal constraints. But in

00:38:07.400 trying to argue, you know, let's walk out of this, let's do this, let's see that the hand that the

00:38:13.160 dandruff is okay. Millions of people are coming in, which one day become in the majority, it guarantees

00:38:20.080 that your liberal democratic values that you are so keen on protecting and abiding by as you try to

00:38:26.620 resolve the problem, all of those will be eradicated. So again, that's why Karl Popper's paradox of

00:38:32.760 tolerance is so prescient, right? So, so I'm arguing that there has to be a, a cataclysmic change in the

00:38:41.700 way you handle it. So, so think about the, the, the savagery of war. Most people want to go about

00:38:49.040 life living, you know, without hurting another, without murdering someone. But then once war

00:38:53.780 happens, you end up carpet palming cities, right? Here is Dresden, bye-bye Dresden. And now we might

00:39:01.100 argue, oh, was that proportional or not? Well, if you want to finish war, you sometimes have to do

00:39:05.760 really, really nasty things so that you could then start afresh and have a peaceful and prosperous

00:39:12.620 world. So I'm arguing that there needs to be metaphorically a carpet bombing of some of these 0.99

00:39:21.620 constraints that we have. There is a serious fundamental existential problem, which is for

00:39:27.740 all sorts of reasons, millions of people are coming into Western societies whereby they don't share an

00:39:35.560 ounce of any of the foundational values. That needs to stop. We can debate what is the mechanism,

00:39:42.120 but until we realize that that needs to stop, we're going to get nowhere.

00:39:47.120 What do you think of the argument that people point, some people say, well, you're, you're placing

00:39:52.580 too much blame on Muslims when it's, you know, some of the people, many of the people who are going to

00:39:59.640 these hate rallies, if you will, in the US or in Canada have been like these white, white leftists, 0.55

00:40:07.780 you know, and so, and those are, I mean, those people aren't Muslim. And so, and they're totally 1.00

00:40:13.260 not just on board with the Palestinian nationalist cause, but many of them have been very explicitly

00:40:18.240 advocating for the actions of Hamas. I mean, that actually has been a little bit shocking to me.

00:40:25.620 We've all known that academics and people in these academic institutions are really radical,

00:40:30.760 but usually I found that they're a bit more subtle in it. Like, you know, like they would talk about

00:40:38.660 racial justice and use all these euphemisms, but I mean, the mass completely came off after

00:40:45.820 the sound of October with some of what they were saying. And a lot of them are Muslim, but many of

00:40:51.100 them are not as well. And so you do, I mean, I guess as part of this coalition building that I was

00:40:56.920 talking about earlier, but it, sorry, first your point. No, I'm just, I'm just bringing up that this

00:41:02.500 is immigration demographic stuff is part of this discussion. But I wonder if, if, if, if we are

00:41:13.360 overstating it, given sort of the salience of this cause, um, on the radical white left, if you will.

00:41:21.800 Yeah. So what you're saying is something that I would completely, uh, subscribe to, which is there

00:41:27.500 isn't a monopoly on, you know, human hearts being dark. So it's not as though I'm arguing as you

00:41:34.600 undoubtedly know, but maybe some of our viewers and listeners don't, it's not, I'm arguing, oh,

00:41:39.380 it's only people who come from Islamic backgrounds that could have very intolerant views. There are

00:41:45.240 Jewish people who are assholes and there are Christian people who are assholes and there are 1.00

00:41:49.100 atheist people who are assholes. And so there certainly isn't a monopoly. I mean, right. 1.00

00:41:53.600 Communism was not started by Muslims and Nazism was not. So, so of course there is no monopoly of,

00:42:01.020 you know, of bad ideas, but you can certainly say that stopping the entry of millions of

00:42:09.380 people. I mean, Angela Merkel, uh, I'm, I'm speculating here, but I think it's a pretty

00:42:14.280 accurate psychological analysis of, of her, her motivations. She had an existential grand sense

00:42:22.780 of guilt. My, my grandparents were really, really nasty. They were part of the Nazi generation. I'm 0.99

00:42:29.420 speaking as her now. And therefore when I am chancellor, I'm going to reverse this existential guilt

00:42:36.360 by demonstrating that here in Germany, we do the exact opposite of two, what two generations ago

00:42:42.940 we did. We're going to let in all sorts of noble people because we're just going to reverse history

00:42:49.680 and we're going to be kind. And then now a few years later, people said, oops, maybe it wasn't so

00:42:55.400 good to let in people that don't share some of your foundational values. It's, it really isn't rocket

00:43:00.140 science. But I mean, again, that speaks to why I wrote the parasitic mind, because there's nothing

00:43:05.420 more dangerous than a parasitized mind. It's not, it's not the weapons that are dangerous. It's the

00:43:11.560 minds that act on the weapons, right? And so bad ideas, dreadful ideas have consequences. It's

00:43:18.400 certainly the case that it's not only Islamic societies that have bad ideas. The entire history

00:43:25.320 is replete with people who had bad ideas. So I completely concede the point to you, but at least

00:43:31.580 we could start off by saying, let's not worsen the problem by having an open door policy to millions

00:43:37.860 of people. Since you're, you're, you're very familiar with the, uh, the history of the Palestinian

00:43:46.440 nationalists cause, I'm, I'm, I wonder why, um, I'm hoping you can illuminate on, on why their propaganda

00:43:54.840 has been so successful on an international scale. I don't think there's really any other like regional

00:44:02.220 conflict that has been able to become, um, you know, driving government decisions around the world.

00:44:08.020 I mean, nobody cared about, uh, what, what Assad was doing to his civilian population in Syria,

00:44:15.640 where hundreds of thousands of people were killed not that long ago. Um, it's not a big worldwide cause

00:44:22.000 for the Saudi Arabian backed, um, um, airstrikes in Yemen or conflicts in the past that happened

00:44:29.080 in Sri Lanka. I mean, you can just name all these conflicts around the world and Africa, et cetera.

00:44:33.000 And nobody cares on, you know, the left, the white left, uh, in the U S or Canada, Europe,

00:44:39.240 but on this particular issue, I mean, people are, are, are committing like, um, acts of vandalism

00:44:46.000 and violence and intimidation against our government, because they're like, they're, they're,

00:44:49.780 some of them are like willing to die for this cause. And I, I wonder how did, how does the

00:44:55.140 Palestinian propaganda become so effective? I love your question because I've actually 0.96

00:45:00.020 discussed it with some Israelis where I've told them my goodness, for all of your strengths as,

00:45:05.860 as a military, right. In terms of IDF, in terms of intelligence with Mossad, in terms of, uh, all

00:45:11.840 sorts of these physical war manifestations, boy, are you losing the informational warfare. So to your

00:45:20.320 point. So I think it's a couple of factors. I number, so there, there are several ways I could

00:45:25.140 answer it. I'll, I'll tackle maybe a few, uh, part of it is that there is def, it is definitely a

00:45:32.260 manifestation of Jew hatred, that double standard. So who cares if Saudi Arabia is doing, that's just 0.82

00:45:39.800 between brothers and cousins. And it does, you know, the old, no Jews, no news. So there is an 0.94

00:45:45.580 element of that, but I think there's more than that. I think that the, what the Palestinians have 1.00

00:45:50.380 been able to do is to set up the narrative as one of oppressor and oppressed. And whereby if,

00:46:00.520 if I were to use a singular image that captures a thousand words, it's the 14 year old intifada boy

00:46:08.100 with the slingshot and the rock facing the big mean IDF tank. So most people, Andy, as I think,

00:46:18.600 you know, are, and I don't say this as an elitist statement, it's just a straight factual statement. 1.00

00:46:24.460 Most people are breathtakingly idiotic and misinformed, right? So if you just go out into 1.00

00:46:30.980 the street and say, oh, you just screamed from the river to the sea, which river, which sea can,

00:46:35.780 you know, I'm going to give you a 20 multiple choice questionnaire on the conflict, they would

00:46:44.060 all get zero. So people are cognitive misers, meaning that they, they are intellectually lazy. 0.92

00:46:50.060 They like to use very simplifying heuristics to explain the world. And so when it comes to the

00:46:57.040 Palestinian-Israel conflict, it doesn't matter what the reality is. The Israelis are these nasty 1.00

00:47:04.700 Jewish tanks who are indiscriminately engaging in an ongoing genocidal ethnic cleansing of peaceful, 1.00

00:47:15.420 noble, kind, slingshot throwing 14 year olds. That's the narrative. That's the narrative that

00:47:22.660 is taught in Near East studies at Columbia University and Cornell University. So it's not

00:47:27.800 surprising then that if I am a cognitive miser, meaning I'm an intellectually lazy, I'm an utter 0.99

00:47:33.640 imbecile, and I am fed all this brainwashing, then their narrative is going to win. And they are 0.99

00:47:39.620 winning. What do you think of this explanation?

00:47:43.680 Well, I, I sometimes wonder if accusations of anti-Semitism are being recklessly overused in recent

00:47:53.600 weeks. Um, in the same way that we, um, you know, how often, and I'm not, I'm not saying that this is

00:48:04.100 necessarily what's happened here, but for example, um, there are Muslim activists and Muslim radicals

00:48:11.300 who, anytime you talk about some type of Islamic terrorist attack that's happened, you, you report,

00:48:17.240 I report on the religious aspect of a suspect in a terrorist incident, then that first accusation in

00:48:23.620 Islamophobia. I've seen some people saying that accusations of anti-Semitism are being used to

00:48:28.880 shut down discussions. Um, and also in part of this, what we've seen as well as all these Jewish 1.00

00:48:34.800 American groups and Jewish Canadian groups on the left who have led some of these protests and, you know,

00:48:41.780 they're basically saying not in our name and, you know, they get a lot of media attention. They've done

00:48:46.400 things in DC and, and many other places. And, you know, they're trying to say, it's not, you know,

00:48:52.100 this cause is not anti-Semitic at all. And I, yeah, I'm curious what you think of like those various

00:48:58.020 arguments that are, that are out there. Yeah. Uh, well, I appreciate you asking me questions because

00:49:03.560 I, you know, I often tell my guests, please, it's not an interview. So, so thank you for just having a

00:49:09.360 conversation rather than just a one way me asking you questions. I appreciate that. Uh, I do agree

00:49:15.720 that it is wrong to, to argue that any criticism of say Israel or any policies of Israel constitutes

00:49:23.680 anti-Semitism. I don't, I don't buy that. Right. And, and, and to your point, there are of course,

00:49:28.340 many committed, committed in the sense of, uh, Jews who identify very much with their Jewish identity,

00:49:34.480 who are at the forefront of criticizing certain, uh, policies and certain military actions that the

00:49:40.960 Israeli government's done. So, so I'm a hundred percent willing to concede that point. Uh, 0.84

00:49:46.020 but I do think that what we've seen subsequent to October 7th is to your earlier point where you

00:49:53.340 mentioned that you were surprised by how much open anti-Semitism you're seeing. I think that has

00:49:57.900 really served as a catalyst of, you know, kind of opening people's, right. You just scratch the

00:50:03.520 surface and you see this unbelievable Jew vitriol coming out. And, and this is not, you know, 0.94

00:50:09.600 I don't levy the accusation. You're a Jew hater just because you criticize Israel never, but here's

00:50:16.560 an example of Jew hatred. You're ready. And, and this is going to be relevant since you're living 1.00

00:50:20.940 now in England. If I share the very clear demographic reality of the folks who have been engaging in

00:50:31.460 industrial scale level gang rapes of young British white girls up and down of Britain in every single

00:50:39.560 city that you could think of. And they all have one thing in common. They all have as part of their

00:50:45.180 name, the word Muhammad. And then I get a thousand people who write to me and say, yeah, you know,

00:50:52.820 who's to blame for all those rapes. You're ready, Andy. It's the Jews. You know why? Because it was 1.00

00:50:59.440 Jewish philosophy that promulgated the idea that we should have open border policies. So when

00:51:07.380 Muhammad raped your 12 year old daughter, it was Mordechai who is really to blame. So that is Jew 1.00

00:51:16.620 hatred. I mean, it's, as a matter of fact, it's a form of diabolical Jew hatred. So I completely 1.00

00:51:21.680 concede your point. Not every criticism of some Jewish cause or some Israeli policy constitutes

00:51:27.760 anti-Semitism. But I think what we've seen since October 7th, in many cases, it's your garden 0.90

00:51:33.940 variety, Hitler type of Jew hatred.

00:51:37.700 How do you think people can better recognize when there is actually anti-Semitism operating in some

00:51:45.560 ideas where it may be perhaps there's a get out argument?

00:51:51.860 I mean, you know, some of the people who express a strong hatred of Soros, I think are motivated by

00:52:00.140 anti-Semitism. They will bring up the fact that he's Jew all the time. And then there are many,

00:52:06.000 I would say most, who bring up actually the criticisms of him as how he's used his money to support and fund

00:52:13.940 organizations that have been really destabilizing to a number of countries. Yeah, so I'm just...

00:52:22.120 I can answer that for you. I can answer that for you. So let's suppose, so Epstein, the pedophile,

00:52:29.820 was Jewish. Yes? That is not a manifestation that he did what he did because of his Judaism, 0.96

00:52:38.620 right? He didn't invoke a particular passage in Deuteronomy or in Genesis or in a particular

00:52:48.640 Talmudic scripture and say, oh, this is why I have Epstein Island. It's because I'm allowed.

00:52:53.740 So the fact that he was Jewish is completely irrelevant to him being a diabolical pedophile. 0.96

00:53:01.420 On the other hand, if somebody does something in the name of their religion and justifies it in the 0.97

00:53:08.720 name of their religion, then you ascribe it to exactly what he's telling you, right? So for example,

00:53:14.760 when you say, not you, but the Jew haters that write to me, when you say, oh, well, the economy is

00:53:21.100 tanking and then they list the following people who happen to be Jewish and who serve in the treasury 0.95

00:53:28.800 department, that is Jew hatred because it's not because they are Jews and they're using Jewish 0.50

00:53:36.320 scriptures that the government printed more money resulting in inflation to go up, right? You see

00:53:42.980 what I'm saying? So that's why, by the way, I sarcastically created the game Six Degrees of Jew, 0.81

00:53:50.540 which is a game that I was very familiar with in Lebanon where every single calamity is blamed on

00:53:56.640 the Jew. Your wife cheated on you? Well, it's because she consumed pornography that made her 1.00

00:54:04.660 libidinous and it's the Jews who control the pornographic industry. So I think that's how you 1.00

00:54:11.700 can gauge whether an argument is in good faith or not. Jews do a lot of horrible things, but they do 1.00

00:54:18.460 it not because they're Jewish, despite the fact that they're Jewish. And some Muslim, when a Muslim 0.99

00:54:23.880 goes into a bank to rob the bank because he just wants to support his crystal meth, I don't care 0.98

00:54:30.240 that he's called Muhammad. But if he flies a plane into a building and then quotes the Quranic verse

00:54:37.600 that justifies that he should do it, it is because he is Muhammad. Does that make sense? 0.91

00:54:43.520 Yeah. I mean, playing devil's advocate, couldn't want to argue that the rape gangs involving

00:54:51.940 Pakistani people, people of Pakistani background in the UK, that they weren't doing it on a religious

00:55:00.640 mandate. They were men who were involved in organized crime and the fact that it's being brought up all

00:55:06.240 the time that they're Muslim is Islamophobic. What do you think of that argument? Well, I mean,

00:55:12.020 I would totally agree that that were the case if I weren't aware that many of them have openly stated

00:55:18.620 that, you know, non-Muslim meat, as they say, uncovered meat is openly open for grabs. So again,

00:55:29.180 I'm not, right, there might be Albanian gangs who are Muslim, they're organized gangs, right? They are 1.00

00:55:36.000 not in it, right? They engage in extortion and money laundering. They've been doing the smuggling of

00:55:42.760 the people into Britain by the boats, by the way. Oh, there you go. Now, in that case, the driving

00:55:49.600 motive is profiteering. There are Russian organized gangs, there are Israeli organized gangs, there are

00:55:57.720 Italian organized gangs. So all of those groups are doing what they're doing because they are motivated

00:56:04.280 by greed. They want to make money, right? And organized crime becomes the conduit by which I make

00:56:09.060 money. On the other hand, if I say I am bringing in loads of people from Islamic countries because the

00:56:17.520 principle of hijra, hijra is the Arabic word of immigration, we're going to conquer the miserable, 1.00

00:56:23.700 as the Muslim Brotherhood said, well, then you're doing it because of your religion. So again, a thinking 0.65

00:56:31.620 person is able to be honest and say, this is caused by your religion. This had nothing to do with your

00:56:38.520 religion. Regrettably, the Western mindset says, it doesn't matter how much evidence you show me

00:56:45.740 that it is because of your religion, I'm never going to accept it. That's why, by the way, in chapter six 1.00

00:56:51.960 of The Parasitic Mind, the chapter that I titled Ostrich Parasitic Syndrome, I describe how the, now it's

00:56:59.940 44,000 plus terror attacks since 9-11 alone in nearly 70 countries, all of which the terrorists

00:57:08.940 will say, we're doing it because of our religion. They'll quote the scriptures why they're doing it.

00:57:15.280 Then what does the West say? Let me just share a few of them with you. It's because of beard bullying,

00:57:21.160 right? The San Bernardino guy, it's because he was bullied for his beard. It's in France and in Belgium,

00:57:27.060 it's because of lack of art exposure. I mean, which of us didn't decide to go join ISIS and Raqqa to

00:57:35.800 throw those pesky gays off rooftops because we weren't exposed to enough Picasso? So again, it comes 1.00

00:57:42.740 from a reflex of, I never want to ascribe sinister actions to a religion. That's simply too gauche.

00:57:51.420 And until we're able to recognize that most Muslims are perfectly lovely people, but some Muslims take 1.00

00:57:58.800 their religion very seriously and will act on it, we're only going to get to a darker place.

00:58:03.940 So I've been on the ground now for almost six weeks covering these demonstrations that have happened

00:58:10.740 in the UK. And one thing I've witnessed is that pretty much almost all of them, people will do

00:58:20.560 shut down streets and then they'll do prayers, Islamic prayers on the streets and in public areas and

00:58:26.800 parks or in the middle of the road. Um, they'll blast out Islamic, um, uh, sound, um, not like prayers, 0.89

00:58:35.440 or loud, loud speakers. Um, and then then we'll do the Alahu Akbar chant. So is it, is it right to view

00:58:44.560 these actions as, um, provocative or are these, are they just meant to be acts of peaceful religiosity that

00:58:52.620 is happening at a protest?

00:58:54.700 100% the former, not 100%, 1 million percent the former, right? When, when you are below a certain

00:59:03.300 percentage, you don't do that. Once you become over a certain percentage, you, you, there are even Arabic 1.00

00:59:11.420 words that describe that kind of behavior, right? So it is a, an act of, we are here, get used to it,

00:59:20.360 right? Look, there are, I mean, I mean, this is literally true. There are well over 10,000

00:59:26.700 documented religions. Now, some religions, for example, Christianity, you could break it up into

00:59:31.940 many, many different sects, Seventh-day Adventists and Lutheran and Protestant. So let's call each of

00:59:37.520 these a different religion, right? Shia versus Sunni versus Ahmadi, let's call them those different 0.99

00:59:43.620 sects of Islam. So they're different. There are more than 10,000 documented religions. Why is it only

00:59:49.920 one that does it so publicly, right? Because it is part of the DNA of the religion to say that once we

00:59:59.140 become past a certain number, you will abide by, I mean, there are 57 countries that are, well, 56 plus

01:00:07.240 the Palestinian territories that are part of the organization of Islamic cooperation, right? Which

01:00:12.620 is an umbrella group for the Ummah. The Ummah is the Islamic nation. Well, each of those countries, Andy, 0.95

01:00:19.200 at one point in history had zero Muslims. And then by various mechanisms, many of those countries

01:00:26.400 became 100% Islamic. How did that happen? Was it by magic? Was it that they simply passed around 1.00

01:00:35.000 sweets and peaceful Socratic method? No. And so when you affirm your presence by shutting down streets,

01:00:44.300 it's a power play. Now, again, many Muslims will tell you, we don't like that. We don't want that to 1.00

01:00:50.360 happen. We're against that. We want to live by Western freedoms. But to answer your question,

01:00:55.740 it's absolutely, unequivocally a power play. You will accept it. You will shut your mouth and get used to it.

01:01:05.040 Some scenes that I recorded and I witnessed were quite, they were a bit surreal in the sense like when

01:01:12.240 there was a large crowd, angry protesters outside Westminster Abbey, which is centuries old. Monarchs

01:01:19.520 are buried there, you know, coronations happen there. There's, you know, it's one of the most

01:01:25.040 important historical sites for British history and identity. But this group went in front of it and

01:01:32.180 they were doing, they were chanting the Islamic faith creed. I can't say it, but you know,

01:01:39.380 you know, I know it. But if I say it, then I'm, then I'm officially a Muslim. So I better not say it. 0.99

01:01:45.300 And so in this religious aspect of these pro Palestine demonstrations, as they are called has been

01:01:53.940 kind of completely ignored by the mainstream press locally, I read, I mean, I read what the BBC and

01:01:59.100 ITV and others report on it. And they generally just say these are, these are peaceful protests of

01:02:04.400 people arguing for ceasefire or something like that. And I just, my observation is that with some of the

01:02:13.380 people there, many, they are viewing this war, Israel war with Hamas in a, as a, as a religious conflict,

01:02:24.180 and the type of language that they're using, some of these protests, I think some of the most extreme

01:02:29.040 one I went to, was one organized by Hizbid Tahrir, which is an Islamist group, they had 1000s of people

01:02:35.940 come, this group is banned in, I think, all the Arab countries because of, I mean, their, their, their goals 0.75

01:02:42.480 are revolutionary, to establish a caliphate, but they operate legally, in the UK, and they had up these

01:02:50.720 banners saying Muslim armies, they had speakers who are calling for jihad, that was their word,

01:02:59.040 trying to mobilize Muslims to fight the Zionist army, those were the type of language they used, and

01:03:06.400 it had, like, no coverage, in the establishment press, I was one of the few journalists there to

01:03:13.120 witness this and record, and it's, it's, it's, it's surreal in the way that, like, how banal it is, like,

01:03:20.720 it's happening in central London, and if you're a block away at some luxury cafe, or luxury designer

01:03:26.560 store, you wouldn't even know it's happening, and therefore it's so much easier to, to deny.

01:03:30.880 Yeah, exactly. Well, I wanted to actually ask you, you were kind enough to ask me several

01:03:35.920 questions, let me go back to asking you questions. What explains Andy knows bravery? And the reason why

01:03:43.360 I asked, I mean, it sounds as though I'm just complimenting you frivolously, but I, that's not

01:03:48.320 my point, is because I want to see if there is a way to bottle courage, right? I mean, metaphorically

01:03:55.720 speaking, because you, I mean, you really are one of the, the few, I mean, earlier, when I introduced

01:04:00.600 you, I said intrepid, I mean, that's, that really is a perfect description of you are, right? I mean,

01:04:05.220 you're walking amongst whatever the proud boys, you're walking amongst the crazy Antifa guys,

01:04:10.240 you were attacked famously, and, you know, and so on. And so there seems to be a, to use a term that

01:04:18.080 has been now become associated with me, right, when I say activate your inner honey badger,

01:04:22.820 that's not a call that you need to hear from me, because you already came into the world,

01:04:27.880 I guess, equipped with all of the honey badger attitude that one could have. Is that something

01:04:34.040 that you've always had? Is that something that you've developed? What's the secret of Andy knows

01:04:40.300 honey badger attitude? Well, thank you for those kind words. I, that's very, that's very nice of you to

01:04:47.380 say. I, I actually, and, you know, I don't, I often don't view myself as brave, because I remember

01:04:55.320 these times that I've been really actually terrified, returning to the streets to document,

01:05:01.720 given the attacks I suffered. And I do have a lot of fear, actually. And, but sorry, before you go on,

01:05:07.520 I'm going to interrupt you. The fact that you have fear, and your return actually speaks to you being

01:05:12.060 a honey badger. Well, thank you. I, for me, it was simply motivated by, I don't, the fact that I don't

01:05:22.900 see the public getting a full or accurate picture of the nature of these various protests. And you

01:05:29.600 outlined the number of things that are covered. Most people are familiar with my work covering the

01:05:33.600 violent far left in the US, particularly Antifa. And I thought, look, my, my words in essays and

01:05:40.700 writings are not going to be as convincing as people seeing the videos themselves of the violence

01:05:46.300 and the extremist statements and chants and slogans that are being used at these violent and extremist

01:05:55.140 rallies and protests. And I, I just went out and recorded and took photos. And for a long, for a while,

01:06:03.220 I was able to do that and just sort of blend in. Nobody knew who I was, so they didn't view me as a

01:06:08.400 threat. But once people started paying attention to my journalism, and I was getting published in

01:06:13.380 bigger places, that was when Antifa started to silence me. So, yeah, I think, I guess, one thing

01:06:23.760 I was forced to learn, and it has helped me become a bit more resilient is that when you go against the

01:06:31.960 grain, a lot of people are going to really going to hate you, and some violently hate you. And the world

01:06:37.960 may hate you. And you have to kind of be at peace at that, you know, it, it can be a bit distressing

01:06:44.020 to me when when you Google my name, and you see that I'm described as a far right provocateur,

01:06:48.840 far right extremist, you read what's on my Wikipedia, and you come up with, you know, a person that I

01:06:54.000 don't recognize as me, and my friends don't recognize as me. And that, that is hard. But that's,

01:06:59.900 that's the price you pay when you you speak out in a way that's inconvenient for the majority.

01:07:04.880 And so I think coming, you know, for people to, to develop a sense of bravery, they have to,

01:07:11.600 to be at peace with that. I mean, if you are, if you're just reaffirming everything that the New York

01:07:16.560 Times and Washington Post says, you then then you'll get the accolades, and it's not really

01:07:21.600 actually brave to go out and write the type of stuff that we see in the establishment media on these

01:07:27.680 controversial subjects and topics. With that said, you know, I try really hard for my my video work

01:07:35.120 to present it in a way that is neutral, you know, obviously, I know there's implicit bias, I'm using

01:07:40.160 the language of the left, it's there, it's in all of us. But I try really to tell people, okay, this is

01:07:44.640 the context when and where, and that's it. And it is surprising that the videos that I've recorded is seen

01:07:51.200 as as a huge provocation and threat to whatever narrative people have, to the point that some of

01:07:59.600 them are willing to try to kill me. Yeah. What I mean, I'm now we're sort of coming, of course, 0.63

01:08:08.240 I could talk to you for hours, but we're coming to the end of our chat. Hopefully, I'll have you again,

01:08:13.920 and it won't take years to bring you back. What are some so my last book was on happiness. And so

01:08:21.120 in in the in writing that book, I discussed, you know, the two most important decisions that you

01:08:26.480 could make that either impart great happiness or great misery upon you is choosing the right

01:08:31.440 partner, the right spouse, and choosing the right profession. And when I talk about choosing the right

01:08:35.600 profession, you know, I discuss things like things that allow you to instantiate your creative impulse.

01:08:41.200 You know, you could be a chef or stand up comic or a author or a journalist or an architect. These are

01:08:48.000 all very different professions. But what they share in common is that they all create something that

01:08:53.600 didn't exist until they came along and they created that that plate, that bridge, that book. So in your

01:08:59.760 case, is that what gives you purpose and meaning you want to document things that are out there and add

01:09:06.480 to the conversation? Are there other things that make you happy? What what are the secrets to

01:09:11.520 why Andy Ngo is hopefully a happy person?

01:09:15.920 Um, you know, I'll be honest here. There, there were times in the past where I

01:09:24.000 life felt dark for me, I think, particularly after the second time I was beaten by Antifa in 2021. I had

01:09:29.360 left Portland for a number of months, I went back and I was undercover and I was exposed and beaten

01:09:34.800 quite severely. There's video of me being attacked on the streets and I run into a hotel

01:09:40.800 for refuge. And after that, I really, I could, you know, that was when I, I was forced to accept the

01:09:48.880 reality that I could no longer do this type of undercover type of reporting on Portland, which is my home

01:09:54.960 cities where my, my family's based and, you know, faced with that reality and having to, to develop

01:10:02.960 different and new skills of reporting and getting information out was quite hard. And at times very

01:10:08.720 lonely because I, I also had to relocate for, for safety reasons away from Portland. So I was away

01:10:13.680 from my loved ones. I still am. And, and that's hard. What keeps me going is then I think, um,

01:10:21.760 I've been fortunate that I'm sometimes in situations like conferences or events or something

01:10:27.120 where people who are familiar with my work come up and get a chance to speak with me. And they let me

01:10:31.280 know how impactful my work has been, how it's really helped inform them on a number of issues.

01:10:37.520 And those types of personal testimonies face to face when I'm holding their hand or shaking their

01:10:41.760 hand is really powerful and encouraging because sometimes it, it can be, it can feel really lonely

01:10:50.000 when you have all these hit pieces out about you when, you know, with how social media works,

01:10:54.880 people can organize online mobs to try to swarm you and just send you hate and threats nonstop. And

01:11:02.400 it's easy for one to sort of center and put a lot of weight on that type of hate and forget about,

01:11:08.080 you know, these other statements of encouragement. So for me, it's about, um, trying to center

01:11:14.720 gratitude. You know, I'm, I'm really thankful that I, I have opportunities like this to speak with you.

01:11:20.240 Um, that, that, you know, there, there are other good journalists out there who, for whatever reason,

01:11:27.120 you know, they, they, their work just doesn't go big and then they stop. You know, I'm really

01:11:32.400 fortunate that there's been people who's, who read my work, watch my content and give me a chance and

01:11:39.120 invite me on their platforms. And I'm really thankful for that. I don't take any of it for granted.

01:11:43.520 Well, that's, that's beautifully said. I do have a section in the book on the importance of

01:11:47.600 existential gratitude, which you just expressed. So thank you for that. What are some projects?

01:11:52.240 Last question. What are some projects that you might be currently working on that you might want

01:11:57.680 to use this platform to promote? So, um, my website is www.andy-ngo.com. I, one thing that I'm

01:12:09.040 really keen to keep track of is how these Palestine protests, uh, grow and how they are, what's actually

01:12:17.200 happening on the ground at some of them. Uh, I, this is a moment in time that I think it really has to

01:12:24.480 be documented because if you just rely on sort of the record from establishment media, that is only a

01:12:32.160 fraction of the story. And so that is my current project. So you can, if you go on my Twitter at

01:12:37.680 Mr. A-N-D-Y-N-G-O, you can see the video coverage from what's been happening week to week, uh, in the

01:12:43.680 London area, you know, one of the world capitals, you can see, um, the extremism that's taking place

01:12:50.800 week after week. That's unfortunately becoming a banality. Wow. Well, uh, any books that you might

01:12:58.160 be thinking of writing next to follow up on your New York Times bestselling book? Um, that, yes,

01:13:05.280 but, uh, I'm not able to discuss stuff yet at this time. Ah, very good. Okay. Well, when you,

01:13:10.160 when that one comes out, we'll have you back. Andy, what an incredible pleasure to have you.

01:13:14.960 I think if there's a way to clone you so that we could spread more courage and intrepid journalism

01:13:22.320 out there, uh, the world would be a better place. Absolute pleasure having you. Thank you so much.

01:13:27.360 Come back soon. Uh, stay on the line so we could say goodbye offline. Real pleasure talking to you.

01:13:31.760 Thank you so much. Thank you.

My Chat with Journalist and Author Andy Ngo - On Defending the West (The Saad Truth with Dr. Saad_622)

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