00:09:50.840We didn't get granted our emergency stay order, which we've been banking on, hoping on.
00:09:57.140We had faith in this system and thought for sure that there would be some sort of due diligence that you would be able to have an emergency stay order while you seek the rest of your legal rights or legal opportunities like Supreme Court.
00:10:13.500So we're sitting in an open call order as of today.
00:10:16.600So this means that CFIA can come rolling in at any time?
00:10:20.040yep uh this level of anxiety for the last nine months nobody should ever have to feel in the
00:10:26.840world we've been just trying to prove it's right from wrong we've been asking for testing of these
00:10:32.400animals for nine months nine months and then they just keep moving the goalpost you know it was
00:10:38.520trading partner policies and then we got the largest trading partner to say whoa slow down
00:10:43.220stop we're going to collaborate with you and offer the fda and nih then they moved it back to we had
00:10:48.660novel reassortment then we showed that the novel reassortment has been seen before it's under
00:10:54.980reported and it's less of a threat you're talking about the h5n1 that they the cfia is claiming is
00:11:03.060in these birds that's right sorry so that was off of two pcr tests in december remember this we're
00:11:09.140running off two pcr tests two pcr tests in december and uh i'm on the deck sorry i have dogs barking
00:11:16.820it's a real farm and i can tell you you weren't inside that's for sure yeah um two pcr tests in
00:11:24.360december we are running off uh then they then they went after novel reassortment that kind of died
00:11:30.680that went that went dead then they went back to trading partner policies and now we're back to0.91
00:11:36.060now we have one of the most biggest threats of h5n1 in canada or that they've seen um remember1.00
00:11:42.420too that this ohio they're blinking it back that this this strain of h5n1 they bring up the ohio1.00
00:11:49.340worker the worker in ohio that worker in hoa in ohio he didn't get it from walking along the
00:11:55.720beach or hanging out on his deck i mean he got h5n1 for being active in a call he was he was
00:12:02.780participating in an active call order and and his symptoms were pink eye a runny nose this is
00:12:10.140nothing that we should be alarmed of that the government is fear tacting you know using their
00:12:14.700fat fear tactics and they are um fear-mongering us and we have to wake up if we don't wake up
00:12:21.600right now we are on our road to another pandemic um have you seen the uh the canadian press article
00:12:29.040today uh this is the one of the interviews that katie did earlier today and they're saying cfi
00:12:34.840says ostrich farm report backing stay of cull improperly seeks scientific ruling what they're
00:12:41.880saying there is that it's unfair to ask a judge to make a ruling based on the science yeah but
00:12:50.120they haven't allowed any of your science at all have they nope so our expert witness reports have
00:12:56.360been struck from the record from day one we have been um and i you know we even said to them hey
00:13:02.140okay, you win. You win. Your justification for the call order date of December 31st,
00:13:08.720you win. It was justified, right? So let's remove that whole thing and let's move away from the
00:13:15.220December 31st court because that's what led us into our judicial appeal, everything that we had,
00:13:21.860our federal court of appeal. You won. Now it's time to look at the reconsideration,
00:13:27.440The facts from December 31st to 241 days today, we are healthy animals with a firewall of antibodies that pose so much more opportunity for Canada than they alive than they do dead.
00:13:41.680So we went after we went to try and rebring in Dr. Pellick's expert witness report and had that again denied.
00:13:52.300but yet they were allowed to bring in fresh evidence from their veterinarian expert witness
00:13:58.120Kathy Furness so I don't know I'm sure Dr. Pellick I don't know if you've heard about this today
00:14:05.180but um so how are we how are they allowed to introduce new fresh evidence but Dr. Pellick
00:14:10.300is not we've had top immunologists epidemiologists virologists all on this we are not sitting with a
00:14:18.800skeleton crew of no no experience we have the we have a robust amount of experience sitting behind
00:14:25.340the fight that we're fighting and it's to test these animals because they are not a threat they
00:14:30.540have a firewall of antibodies that could be used for potential for human and animal health or yeah0.73
00:14:35.700like it's this is our we're being stripped of our rights this is um katie there's a penalty0.71
00:14:42.700that the cfia will enforce of fines and possible jail time if you're found guilty of releasing
00:14:51.960any testing that you've had done independently yeah and you released that information today
00:14:59.140didn't you we released dr pellick's expert witness reports it's time the world sees them
00:15:03.760they don't want anybody to see them so this is the part of the court of the public opinion now0.67
00:15:08.800and the public opinion needs to see the evidence this is absolutely ridiculous0.86
00:15:13.400dr pellick with his experience and his um expertise and be to be able to do what he does
00:15:20.500uh not just not him here he is i'm just like we love you you are so brilliant and if we
00:15:29.240actually believe that antibodies don't exist and they don't exist in memory cells and that's how
00:15:34.740we create a firewall to the next virus and the next virus humanity is done if we stop from
00:15:40.420believing in antibodies and believing in natural immunity we're done so yeah we released dr pellick's
00:15:46.560results of uh of our older egg yolk to show what the eggs hold and dr pellick what did you find doc
00:15:55.020Well, I mean, we knew way back in, I guess, in March of this year that when I tested using a test that is specific for the H5 and the N1 proteins that distinguish this virus, that 18 samples, 18 different eggs, they all had antibodies that reacted with different parts of the hemagglutinin protein,
00:16:24.000the H5 protein version, and the neuroamidase, the N protein and one protein. And so it was evident.
00:16:33.020And I wouldn't say that the documents that expert reports I filed, they were rejected,
00:16:41.340like they weren't part of the record. They actually are part of the record. But what happened was the
00:16:46.440judges, they ignored the data. They basically did not consider the scientific arguments that
00:16:54.600we had presented as part of what they considered in coming up with their decisions. And the same
00:17:00.680thing happened again with Justice Heckman's today statement, his decision, which I've now read in
00:17:10.560And I recognize that many of the points that were raised in the previous judges' decisions were basically adopting what the Canadian Food Inspection Agency's experts had stated, that in fact is wrong, is actually incorrect, and it's actually misinformation.
00:17:33.180And if the judges are making their decisions based on this information, which I've challenged
00:17:41.280and given references in the scientific literature, then their decisions are not based on science.
00:17:49.940And when I read through the decision, it seems as though it's looking at precedents and other
00:17:56.080cases that are actually kind of rather, in my opinion, irrelevant to the question is,
00:18:02.180are these ostriches safe? Is there a situation where the impact that these ostriches have,
00:18:12.900if we don't kill them, is going to jeopardize not just the health and safety of animals and people,
00:18:20.980but also the poultry industry, the ability to actually export animal products from poultry farms0.97
00:18:31.980and actually the arguments don't stand up to what we actually have seen happen in real life
00:18:39.520and so i mean i can go through some of the things that were said by the judge
00:18:43.900and a few of the the basic things was the judge referred to this 50 fatality rate for h5n1 in
00:18:53.640people well we've had over 71 cases of h5n1 most of them asymptomatic most of them on individuals
00:19:02.760as katie's pointed out that have involved in calling operations most of them from actually
00:19:09.560operations done on dairy farms not actually poetry farms is a virus like this dr pellick
00:19:17.160really transmissible or is it something that you have to work hard to get
00:19:23.600well it's very hard to transfer it from a bird to a person or a mammal it's very rare like i said
00:19:33.720we have 70 cases in last few years about 71 cases in in canada united states only one in canada
00:19:41.900you know this 13 year old girl who did get quite sick that's why we're aware of it but she
00:19:47.000she recovered and then we have sorry sorry can i pipe in she came to visit the farm that's right
00:19:53.360she didn't she said they're using my case to kill millions of animals and i want them to stop
00:19:59.560so jocelyn came to the farm we had a beautiful press conference and release jocelyn came saw
00:20:05.300the ostriches she was on our property she was here she left she didn't get sick yeah sorry
00:20:11.700That's right. Dr. Pellick, we're talking about this H5N1, the lack of transmissibility.
00:20:19.100Right. If you have an asymptomatic individual, a person or an animal, now it's not impossible for0.99
00:20:27.060them to transmit the virus before they get sick, right? Because there is a period there where1.00
00:20:34.700the virus is active. It isn't encountering an immune response. But after the animal's been sick
00:20:41.700and there's no evidence of it anywhere else in the population of that herd, then the immune
00:20:50.540system of the birds has already eradicated the virus. So there's no compelling reason to believe
00:20:56.960they're infectious. If someone is sick, for example, with influenza and they recover,
00:21:02.360We don't consider that they're going to be transmitting the virus when they go back to work after they've recovered from their illness, certainly within two weeks.
00:21:11.980It seems like we never do this because we know that they're not transmissible after they recover.
00:21:19.080It seems like they're using COVID logic here, obviously.
00:21:23.100um cfia also claimed what was it katie a couple of days ago now that they're actually these
00:21:30.600ostriches could be carrying a more deadly strain of h5n1 yes this is correct and again we're running
00:21:38.440off so where was fresh where's the fresh testing where's the again they just moved the goal post
00:21:43.940on us you know they're now they're basically putting out fear-mongering tactics to the public
00:21:48.980to justify what they're about to do here on our farm and and it's absolutely absurd again what
00:21:55.620just dr pellick just said so you're telling me now they found out that they've had nine months
00:22:01.060to figure this out and i have to point out it was the media the media found out first do you not
00:22:07.920find something weird in that the media found out first that they're they're claimed that we have
00:22:13.040this you know more virulent strain and um so they're just creating a narrative it's really
00:22:20.220disappointing because i do and i believe that that eroded trust between such a powerful organization
00:22:25.500should be should be healed and the canadian citizens and our farmers um and before you go on
00:22:32.820this on this yeah i just wanted to ask dr pellick is it possible that they could have found this new
00:22:40.700deadlier strain from these two pcr tests the couple of points just to clarify so out of those
00:22:47.44071 or so cases there's only been like one death okay so it's not half the people that are infected
00:22:54.260you know can die from this that's completely ridiculous although that is in the judge the
00:22:59.740judge's uh uh basically decision he refers to this so that is completely untrue the other thing too
00:23:09.760is that when you look at, I guess you're asking, is it possible they've discovered a new
00:23:16.740variant that's more infectious? Actually, the data they did when they had the sequencing of
00:23:23.560the full genome is they realized that it wasn't the highly pathogenic H5N1. It was actually a
00:23:31.300hybrid between a low pathogenetic version of h5n1 and the highly pathogenic version and when you
00:23:40.100combine like this you don't end up with a more pathogenic version you end up with a less
00:23:45.260pathogenic version which is demonstrated by the fact that 85 percent of the birds
00:23:49.900on that that herd were healthy they never got sick so and they did not die so so this is this
00:23:59.220is completely contrary to what the data from the Canadian Food Inspection Agency and the
00:24:06.360observation in terms of the number of birds that actually died. And again, when we look at if this
00:24:15.540was to spread to people, the one in 70 or so cases, that's based on the idea that we know
00:24:23.760everybody who actually got infected with the H5N1 virus that was handling it. It was probably a much
00:24:28.280larger number so we're talking about a fraction of a percent and the person who died actually had
00:24:34.200comorbidities and was not actually working on a farm they it was their backyard chickens
00:24:39.800that got infected so you know you have to put in perspective i mean one of the other things
00:24:43.880that that was referred to was that uh by the judge was that the the um the the virus was
00:24:53.160still in the soil and on the land and therefore when new birds come that they're going to get
00:24:59.400infected with this virus that could you know survive for for years the judge himself says
00:25:05.480years which was what was repeated in the the original prior judgment but the cfa ai itself
00:25:14.360only referred to one year and the study that they referred to was with a virus that was put into
00:25:22.120to lake water that was highly filtered to remove anything that was larger than the size of this
00:25:28.200virus, so no microbes that could digest it. It was put in the dark. It was put at barely
00:25:35.880freezing temperature. And then later, a year later, at the longest, that's the longest data
00:25:42.200point they had, they could get active virus to infect cells and culture. And the reality is that
00:26:12.220And on top of that, this is not transmissible as a fomites off of a surface.
00:26:22.140It's required as an aerosol that you breathe in through your nose and down into your mouth and into your upper lungs.
00:26:31.140This is not the way this virus propagates and is transmitted.
00:26:35.980I mean, there's so much that's so bad in the science you're referring to.
00:26:40.560Would you see Dr. Millick, would you see Dr. Millick, so all the ducks that are flying around, I mean, then I guess it would be everywhere surviving for everywhere for, but our beaches were open, our lakes were open this summer, everybody was boating and drinking lake water.
00:26:59.300I live in Richmond and close in Terranova to the Dights. We have tens of thousands of birds
00:27:07.700that are passing by and landing and roosting and leaving their excrement everywhere in the parks,
00:27:16.600in the schoolyards. We have had no warnings that these birds, which are highly infected with the
00:27:24.520at least at some points and the virus would be in their excrement we have no hardly know this one
00:27:31.080case of h5n1 the whole country i mean this is this is the the risk when you actually look at at the
00:27:38.960the incidence of how these birds are in the wild in our cities coming and and you know basically
00:27:48.340defecating everywhere and there's no warnings because there actually is no risk and meanwhile
00:27:54.300I was worried about this farm with two lakes out of tens of thousands of lakes, that this is the one where these birds are going to come and get infected.
00:28:32.480No, I mean, the thing is, they probably could have had the viral infection.
00:28:38.560And remember that, and that's again, in the judge's decision, not this last one, but the prior one,
00:28:45.880The judge started off with his decision saying that these birds were tested positive for H5N1, you know, from that PCR test.
00:28:54.380The PCR test, firstly, it did not test for N1 at the time, and it did not test for highly pathogenic apine virus.
00:29:02.920It only tested for H5, and there are many low pathogenicity viruses that are H5.
00:29:09.620Subsequently, later, after they issued the call order, then they confirmed from the whole genome sequencing that, you know, it was H5N1 and there was this reassortment.
00:29:20.380And it's only in the courts that we learned when we had done the cross-exam of their expert witness, and they've never talked about this,
00:29:28.820they have over 100 cases of reassortment of H5N1 virus in the 533 or so outbreaks that we've had
00:29:40.200in Canada for the last couple of years. So this is not rare. And the reassortments did not happen
00:29:48.240in the birds, because firstly, in the ostriches, because this is a very rare event. You have to
00:29:55.000have two separate viruses, different strains of the same kind of virus, influenza virus,
00:30:01.960infecting not only the same animal, but the same cells in those animals. So this is the perfect
00:30:07.860storm of virus. This is all already in the birds, the wild birds. It didn't happen in the ostriches.
00:30:13.860um okay so the cfia has said that if there is any independent testing done
00:30:24.840that there's a penalty of two hundred thousand dollar fines per test plus the possibility of
00:30:32.980six months in jail and you have had testing done since that order was issued yes uh and but remember
00:30:44.720we when i tested it and i have to be careful here right yeah um these were not the birds
00:30:50.640you know after they've been infected these are eggs from the birds in the summer of 2024
00:30:57.660so we know already before the outbreak that these birds had already been exposed in the past to h5n1
00:31:07.000and had already developed antibodies and that's very important because that was more than three
00:31:11.620quarters of our farm never had symptoms no deaths that makes sense because dr pellick found that in
00:31:19.120their egg yolk they already had h5n1 antibodies in their memory cells so why did they not get sick
00:31:26.720why did they not die because they already had their firewall of antibodies built up to h5n1
00:31:32.940and then we had the newer ostriches on our farm from 2020 afterwards they were the ones that had
00:31:40.020to build up their firewall of antibodies and immunity and we had to go through the natural
00:31:45.360process of the burning out phase which is you just let it run its course you do your due diligence
00:31:51.760you dispose of your animals properly you quarantine you clean up this is the due
00:31:55.980diligence of any farmer out there because you don't want any of your other animals sick
00:32:00.960and then you have to just keep remembering too though that back in 2020 when we did
00:32:06.940we had deaths back in 2020 and they resembled the same symptoms that we have now we had a vet do all
00:32:13.940that you had that you had now because there's no symptoms right now right no symptoms yet that we
00:32:19.920had back in 2020 we had a vet do the appropriate testing tissue sampling came back positive for
00:32:27.220pseudonymous bacteria we lost about 10 ostriches out of 300 back in 2020 everybody was fine that
00:32:35.900is when we believe they gained their firewall to h5n1 we really believe too that they did they
00:32:43.540didn't test for pseudonymous bacteria they didn't test for anything else as dr pellica's saying the
00:32:48.520only test for the h5 um they didn't test soil samples there's been no water samples done they
00:32:54.880haven't been here in over six months on our farm that they could have died the ones that we had
00:33:02.340from pseudonymous bacteria but had h5n1 they very likely might have and most likely probably
00:33:13.580had it but they weren't dying from it so this is like during covid when somebody fell off a ladder
00:33:20.260they would classify it as a covid death if they tested a pcr test at 40 cycles and found the
00:33:26.400covid virus in their system it was a covid death guy fell off a ladder from three stories well
00:33:31.160actually it's the analogy is more like covid 19 where people who have died from covid 19 you know
00:33:39.420were infected with the SARS-CoV-2 virus, but what they actually died from was a pneumonia
00:33:45.720infection. So typically, if you have an influenza infection, in the case of the birds, it would be
00:33:52.400more likely a pseudomonas, but in the case of humans, it's more likely to be really a pneumonia
00:33:58.520that they died from. And that's why during COVID-19, where they didn't give antibiotics to
00:34:04.980these people that were really, really sick, they may have been able to have saved many of those
00:34:10.380people had they given them antibiotics in parallel. And of course, we don't even talk
00:34:16.140about the comorbidities that were involved because it was a COVID death, a COVID death.
00:34:20.060On average, four comorbidities per death. So without any possibility, like there is no
00:34:28.600possibility now of Supreme Court, Katie, this is it? We can do an application. We'll have an
00:34:34.720open call order until then. So right now we have no protection. In our last order, they made it
00:34:39.920very clear that they could continue to plan their slaughter on these healthy animals while we were
00:34:47.740waiting for that interim stay order. So we were waiting for our interim stay order, which we got
00:34:55.260the decision today on the interim stay order. And that was the interim stay order was us seeking an
00:35:00.960emergency stay order to allow us time to apply for our legal avenues that every Canadian has
00:35:08.880right to which is a Supreme Court and so instead while we try to apply for a Supreme Court now
00:35:15.540we're sitting with an open call order and they feel very justified they feel like they've justified
00:35:22.820their reasoning behind it the media again I want to point out the media got told before we did that
00:35:28.740we supposedly have a new viral in this strain of h5n1 so you can almost it's like they're writing
00:35:35.340that they're writing this script as we go right now they're letting everybody know this is why
00:35:39.820we're going to do it we just found out that there's this worst case strain and at edgewood0.86
00:35:44.640and we're going to come in and kill them and here's justification why um and it's very disheartening0.70
00:35:52.380it's just that you know our freedoms and our rights are being stripped away from us at an0.96
00:35:56.980alarming rate from an organization that operates with excessive freedom and and no accountability
00:36:01.260and we need to start to have some accountability here the judges made this statement about sign
00:36:07.200you know we're talking about the scientific um information but i had made a note you know
00:36:12.120this isn't about asking the court to become an arbiter of science it's about asking the court
00:36:17.520to ensure government policy is accountable to evidence law and our fundamental fundamental
00:36:22.340fairness we have there we have the right to have our have a fair have a fair time to be able to
00:36:28.020share our uh reconsideration material all of the material that should be heard and seen from the
00:36:35.260call order date to now nine months well i guess it's been now 12 241 days of healthy amazing
00:36:43.320animals that have antibodies that can help change the world you know it's interesting um if john
00:36:49.100carpe from the justice center of constitutional freedoms was here right now on the show with us
00:36:53.640he'd be laughing you just said that and and this uh canadian press story today says cfia says
00:37:00.360ostrich farm report backing stay of cullen properly seek scientific ruling john carpe was on the show
00:37:06.160about a month ago and he said that he couldn't believe it when an ontario judge actually said
00:37:12.140that in court regarding a covid case because he had heard this same judge make scientific rulings
00:37:19.100dozens of times before any of that happened and now suddenly it seems like judges can't make
00:37:27.160a ruling based on science are you kidding me that's their job it's what they're supposed to
00:37:32.120be doing they're supposed to be judging things and balancing yeah and who's more credible
00:37:38.540there's one other thing i wanted to comment um because it's not so much the science but in terms
00:37:43.980of the the poultry industry the idea is that as long as there's one zone in british columbia
00:37:52.460the province itself is unable to do a certain trade apparently our trade with mexico and the
00:38:00.060russian republican chickens is uh at jeopardy here some he points at somewhere around 36 38 million
00:38:08.220dollars but but as it turns out the world organization for animal health if you call the
00:38:18.620animals then and they're disease free for a month then that zone is disease free but the world
00:38:27.420Organization for Animal Health also recognizes that if you allow the infection to burn out
00:38:34.460and you don't have an infection in a year, you also get back that zone-free, you know,
00:38:42.620status for disease, disease-free status for the zone. So if these ostriches stay alive for another
00:38:50.400three months then the whole restriction that would be applied you know for for trade is gone0.98
00:38:58.920it's it's it would be just as disease-free zone as any other zone where you've actually hit
00:39:05.480stamping out so i can't even believe that this is that this is real you know it's funny the one
00:39:15.020question and katie and i talked on the phone earlier this afternoon and a couple of other
00:39:18.460folks. If you feel sick and you go to the doctor and the doctor says to you, and this is what we
00:39:27.940were talking about this afternoon, the doctor says, well, you've got cancer and you're going to
00:39:31.240die. And so you naturally would say, well, I want a second opinion, right? Because I think you might
00:39:37.700be wrong. So I want to go to another doctor and seek another opinion. And I would imagine that
00:39:43.940this is the same situation we're dealing with here.
00:39:46.340The CFIA has said there is a virulent strain of H5N1 here0.99
00:42:46.960because once you've actually been exposed to the virus
00:42:50.880and you've mounted an immune response,
00:42:53.460it's very rare that you're going to get reinfected again.
00:42:57.400The COVID situation is not a typical situation that you can apply because the vaccine itself appears to damage the immune system and makes it easier for you to get reinfected, contrary to what public health has suggested.
00:43:14.300the data from the Cleveland Clinic and many other studies have shown that the more you're
00:43:21.520vaccinated, you have a temporary, you know, protection, but you're switching your immune
00:43:27.460system to one to being tolerant. But the situation of these ostriches is quite different. You know,
00:43:33.500we're not vaccinating them. We don't vaccinate any of these birds. The response they have is
00:43:40.200a natural immune response can be very robust and last for years so you're you're satisfied dr
00:43:48.120pellick that these ostriches are fine there there is absolutely no chance of them no i i'd be more
00:43:54.440worried about their claws than i would be about any virus so what's next then we just wait or do0.78
00:44:03.300we call that veterinarian who works for the cfia is she the one katie who came up with this this
00:44:08.840new virulent strain story yeah kathy furnace yes yeah yeah yeah you know i think basically what the0.54
00:44:19.740judges have been saying in in this last judgment i sort of see it as well but in the previous
00:44:25.760judgment they're basically pointing to the minister of health uh sorry minister of agriculture
00:44:33.080minister of health can make some statements but it's a minister of agriculture which is there's
00:44:38.320been quite a bit of changeover actually in this last year most recently it's hugh mcdonald who's
00:44:45.400overseeing the ministry keith mcdonald i think keith mcdonald yeah that's right yeah and he's
00:44:51.100everybody needs to remember his name and call him yes so he's the one who's overseeing the
00:44:58.160canadian food inspection agency and the agency is acting on his behalf and he's assuming that
00:45:05.620the agency is actually making the right decisions based on solid science. And of course, I'm
00:45:12.580questioning that science based on actually looking at what they're stating and being appalled by some
00:45:18.860of these statements which are completely not supported by any real evidence. And the question
00:45:25.680then is, are we in a situation kind of a bit like what we're starting to hear from the Canadian
00:45:31.600Revenue Agency, where people are not happy with the service, and there's bad morale.
00:45:38.180I don't know what's going on with the Canadian Food Inspection Agency. They're so adamant
00:45:42.800that they do not want to be challenged. They don't want to be proven wrong. They don't want
00:45:50.120to reconsider, based on new evidence, what the threat is to the public. The judge, when he was
00:45:59.220making this decision in this last case, basically recognized that there was a great deal of
00:46:07.280harm that would come to the farm. And there was also harm potentially to the general public's
00:46:14.540health and the poultry industry. And he was measuring between the two, but he was measuring
00:46:20.660it based on information, which is actually incorrect. It was coming from the food inspection
00:46:27.180agency. It's really, it may well be that if we have this kind of problem going on within the
00:46:35.600administration of the food and inspection agency, that we should be worried that they're making
00:46:42.800their decisions based on this kind of operation in terms of, you know, how they've handled the
00:46:48.020situation, how they've actually, you know, supported what their actions are. Stephen,
00:46:53.840have you ever seen science work like this where other scientists only with COVID-19 I mean you've
00:47:00.440been doing this a long time you've been a scientist a very long oh yeah I've been doing research for
00:47:05.620I guess it works out with my training about 50 years so 50 years and scientists are generally
00:47:12.460cooperative there could be some some fiery debates about things but ultimately you know you've got to
00:47:18.500listen to reason you've got to sit back and go you know what I think she's right about this I think
00:47:22.380maybe we should give this a shot because that's how it works but we want we want to make decisions
00:47:29.320to solve problems based on you know sound understanding so that the solutions we come
00:47:36.180with are going to be effective and if we start um making suppositions that are you know unrealistic
00:47:43.240and we apply practices that are actually quite destructive and and and don't deal actually with
00:47:50.560the problem in in reality in the long term then this is a waste of money like you're going to be
00:47:56.180spending millions of dollars by the time they compensate the farm and they're paying basically
00:48:01.080you know to have these animals uh he's executed i don't know how they're going to be able to do
00:48:06.060it humanely although they claim they're going to try and think of the millions of dollars already
00:48:13.300fighting us so that you know over a million dollars in legal fees when we could have just
00:48:16.800tested the animals. I'll promise you any farmer would much rather pay the money to have their
00:48:21.680animals tested rather than end up in nine months of court and have them come at us with six lawyers
00:48:28.560sitting in the courtroom and we have one or two. That reminds me too, one of the interesting points
00:48:36.860that the judge came up with was that, well, we have to be able to empower these agencies to do
00:48:46.300this and this case they're concerned that if the farm the united universal ostrich farm actually
00:48:56.940you know won this case you know based on you know going through the court system
00:49:02.060other farmers you know that are handling livestock will do the same thing of course
00:49:08.220i think this is why this is such an important case for not pulling out the stops in the case
00:49:14.220imagine if we just change sorry imagine if we change the policy
00:49:23.660they don't want a precedent in the courts that's going to allow other people to challenge
00:49:28.300basically what's what's happened but you know but talking about this case
00:49:33.820even if we lose and these birds are ultimately you know executed we've learned so much in how
00:49:42.140the arguments that we could have presented, you know, had we had more experience and we might
00:49:51.840have been able to, for future cases like this, we might be able to be much more effective going
00:49:58.440forward. So I wouldn't use this case if we lose it as a precedence to discourage other farmers
00:50:04.820from going out where they think that they're being unjustively treated. I think we've actually
00:50:11.960learned a lot from this no matter what and it's going to be a lot of problems for the canadian
00:50:17.480food inspection agency unless they change their their practices well they're not answerable to
00:50:24.200pretty much anybody except for what the minister of health or is it the minister
00:50:29.080keith mcdonald and ultimately to the prime minister because the prime minister is the boss
00:50:35.240right um so we know that people have been doing letter writing campaigns email campaigns
00:50:42.600it hasn't gotten us anywhere yet katie you've been working with uh john casimaditas the american
00:50:48.840billionaire and animal lover you've also through him managed to get in touch with dr oz and rfk
00:50:55.960jr even um yeah i thought you were gonna say something there oh sorry it cut out
00:51:05.240for a second i apologize okay for a second no uh yeah yeah we've been working with such amazing
00:51:11.580people amazing people that all are using their common sense rfk went on this was months ago now
00:51:18.040to say they you know it's it's known that it doesn't indefinitely they're not shedding the
00:51:22.960virus indefinitely but what they do have is something that create opportunity for um on a
00:51:28.860global scale to treat this virus and viruses in the future and it's something that should be explored
00:52:25.300Well, I understand that there was discussions.
00:52:29.200And, you know, Robert Kennedy Jr., basically he reached out because he thought that there was a tremendous opportunity for the science to learn from these birds.
00:52:40.620And you have to remember that because the calling policy has been in practice for the last few years, both in Canada and the United States,
00:52:47.600we have very few flocks where they've actually been able to see how a natural burnout of the
00:52:56.420virus works and how long it can last. So we will see probably more infections again
00:53:05.300in the poetry industry with the next migration. But I suspect that already in the wild,
00:53:14.760most of those birds have natural immunity because they've been exposed to it.
00:53:20.320There's been no culling going on of the wild birds.
00:53:23.700Plus the viruses do mutate and you get these reassortments that are less pathogenic
00:53:30.460and they out-compete generally the more pathogenic versions.
00:53:36.300And so I suspect we'll actually see fewer cases.
00:53:39.640We haven't had really any cases of the influenza outbreaks on farms since the last nine months.
00:53:50.920And I'm not aware if there's any recent cases.
00:53:54.640The last time I looked a couple of weeks ago, there was no.
00:53:58.180I challenge people to go get your antibodies tested and carry around an antibody card.
00:54:08.960no i'd rather show the my antibodies and not need to go for a vaccination and say i'm actually good
00:54:15.720i have a pretty good firewall myself thank you you know i would much rather people stay up out
00:54:20.700of my business these days about hey hey i want to know your uh you got chlamydia you know like
00:54:25.980seriously like get the help well it's like you want my personal health information how about
00:54:31.880you go f yourself i'm sorry but you know the world has been overcome with this safetyism
00:54:37.020violent and you know it i think that this is probably a reaction to that right like and it
00:54:43.120may have started years ago with oh the coffee is too hot uh or the coffee it might be hot in here
00:54:48.500they got to put that on the label now or they can get sued so you know they're overdoing it but we
00:54:55.200also know that this is part of that long-term u.n agenda right and that's why i have been so adamant
00:55:02.960about this case universal ostrich farms it's not just about the ostriches it's about all farms it's
00:55:11.280about land use it's about smart cities it's about all of this and um if they are successful in doing
00:55:20.420what they plan to do then everybody is a target right so i'm going to ask you again katie i asked
00:55:28.480you this a couple of weeks ago i know you've been talking to other farmers across the country and
00:55:32.760in the united states is anybody willing to stand up with you publicly yet we've had one farmer who's
00:55:41.380won a case that you have talked to that i'm pretty sure would but no no this is our time i say rise
00:55:48.180up canada if we're going to stop this as policies come to a farm near you and we're not stop if we
00:55:53.180don't stop it here you're not stopping it there so uh we got to band together come up be united
00:55:59.360it stronger together and we got to just make the policy changes and protect our agricultural sector
00:56:03.980and farmers all around because this is uh it's going to be one of the i don't even like thinking
00:56:09.760about it we're just going to keep fighting and we're going to take it to the finish line but
00:56:13.540these animals once their heartbeats are gone they're gone forever this could this will be0.96
00:56:17.460one of the biggest mistakes in canadian history if we kill these animals that have the potential
00:56:21.740to heal well you know the irony of this is um the whole point of of the universal ostrich farms was
00:56:29.080try to develop antibodies to as as their their their business and we know that these birds have0.76
00:56:35.880been infected uh with the h5n1 virus and we know from my own work that they have antibodies and
00:56:44.600these are amazing antibodies because the ostrich antibodies are very heat stable you can almost
00:56:51.480boil them and they still work and you can subject them to very diverse acidic or very basic conditions
00:56:57.880So they're very, very robust and stable.
00:57:00.600Now, there's no good source of antibodies against the H5 and the N1 virus.
00:57:09.600So in fact, the eggs from these birds, as well as the birds, are probably replant with these antibodies.
00:57:19.220And the B.C. government has decided that they want to put $25 million into a fund to help protect the birds on farms.
00:57:29.660And they're proposing to put in filters.
00:57:32.940And the Universal Auschwitz Farm has already done work showing that you can use filters with their collaborators in University of Kyoto.0.86
00:57:45.100that you can put spike protein antibodies for the SARS-CoV-2 virus0.79
00:57:52.980and capture the virus on those filters
00:57:57.140and also determine if they have masks,
00:58:00.780whether or not the person had been in an environment
01:10:00.200Nazis encouraged by Trump's Charlottesville response.0.68
01:10:03.380Trump defends Nazis, very fine people.
01:10:05.340That is the biggest hoax, political hoax ever. Trump retweets a neo-Nazi again. Trump disappoints neo-Nazi supporters. So these things don't come out of nowhere. I only blame one person at the end of the day for these murders, which is the crazy person who does the murders.
01:10:22.340But pretending that what is wildly asymmetrical, I think I have laid that out with evidence here, pretending that it's symmetrical is deeply, deeply dangerous.
01:10:32.060Piers, you know this because we've discussed it on my show.
01:10:34.740Even on your show, you have found it way more difficult to find rational, decent people on the left who will explain themselves thoughtfully and calmly and everything else.
01:10:43.960While the panoply of people you get on the right who shouldn't even be on the right, I would say certainly someone like that.
01:10:52.340...like me, I don't know exactly where Batya considers herself, but people with a variance
01:11:06.440of political opinions that now broadly are part of the MAGA thing is because of what
01:11:11.540I just read you, the endless hysteria of the left that has ginned up people to do crazy
01:11:17.360things. It's not to say you can't say the worst things. You want to say the worst things?
01:11:21.300Donald Trump's a Nazi it's so tough to say you want to say that go ahead and say it it falls on
01:11:26.140the person who pulls the trigger but if we're all sitting here saying yeah it's not true that Donald0.96
01:11:30.280Trump's a Nazi and it's not true that his supporters are Nazis and he's not Hitler and
01:11:34.600all of those things well then before you get to reconciliation a little bit of a mea culpa by some0.94
01:11:39.680of us might be valuable. Cenk? Yeah I mean look at this this is disgusting so this guy pretending
01:11:48.640to do consideration and I was going to be conciliatory to it. No apology. I'm sorry
01:11:59.140about that. He even tries to turn it around on Dave here. It's Dave's fault for even pointing
01:12:06.340it out. This is amazing to me. Towards Dave, if I spoke first, but apparently that's not
01:12:12.440what he's doing at all. So what he's trying to do is get people angry in a misleading
01:12:16.340way against me. Are you trying to get people to be violent? This is disgusting. No, no, no. Let
01:12:22.980me explain. Let me explain. Those are your titles. No, let me explain. You're asking me a goddamn
01:12:27.340question. So let me explain while you're trying to get people to do violence against me. You're1.00
01:12:32.440disgusting. So those are 80% of those titles. I've never called Trump a Nazi. And those titles1.00
01:12:38.980were about neo-Nazi reactions. So what do you want us to do? Not tell you. Say you never called
01:12:45.720Trump a Nazi. I think he's probably lying. I'm sure there's somewhere where he called Trump a
01:12:51.600Nazi. But even associating, like this is how they use words. The smart people, they will associate,
01:13:01.000right? Nazi, Trump, same headline, same title. Trump, Nazi, fascist, Nazi, fascist, Kirk.
01:13:08.420they're still doing it even now and he's denying it and it's sickening very fine0.99
01:13:16.520what's actually happening and so look did donald trump side with neil yes he did say that
01:13:21.820so charlottesville so as i'm not talking about the neo-nazis or the white supremacists who who
01:13:37.920should be condemned completely it's the biggest debunked conspiracy theory of all time you're
01:13:41.640still pushing that now you're still pushing the very fine people who listen now i'm shocked even0.99
01:13:47.120for you dave no dave shut up and let me answer your stupid question so on that day which now0.99
01:13:55.340we're going back to that for no goddamn reason other than you're trying to get people angry at0.99
01:13:59.340me for misleading things i'm reading your title you should be angry at your title he did shut up0.93
01:14:06.220and let me answer wow so did he say there are very fine people on both sides he did so that's
01:14:12.620a fact now who was he referring to as we've explained on the young turks he might have been
01:14:17.260referring to the people who were in favor of the confederacy and came out there to support confederate
01:14:22.220generals i didn't find that to be any better those people were in favor of slavery those
01:14:26.940people lynched black people so i'm not going to ever cheerlead for them and i'm not ever going0.97
01:14:32.220to shut up in the very next sentence can he say i'm not talking about the white supremacists0.99
01:14:44.620that's the level of discourse and he's probably one of the more sane ones1.00
01:14:50.300on that side of the equation chink wigger young turks1.00
01:14:55.180now i'm not sure if you ever watched videos of charlie kirk doing his thing at college campuses0.99
01:15:03.720very rarely if ever did he ever get mad he would sometimes come off as condescending and0.95
01:15:12.680maybe it looked like he was laughing at somebody once in a while some one of the more pathetic
01:15:20.440people, but he was always into, and you've seen the people that I'm talking about there,0.90
01:15:26.300but he always said, come to the mic, step up, talk to me, make an argument, make a case,
01:15:34.840bring some real facts to the table. Let's have it out with words, no yelling, no screaming,
01:30:33.720Doesn't have the best reputation amongst the population.1.00
01:30:37.380comes across as arrogant, self-important, egotistical, definitely a liar.0.98
01:30:47.660One of these critical race theory types.0.98
01:30:52.640She did something the other day in regards to Charlie Kirk's assassination.
01:31:01.460Michelle Ferrari made a video about it.
01:31:05.060Okay, this is important. And this is why we need to pick a side and there needs to be consequences when you are in a position of power. This is Nahini Nahani Fontaine's tweet. Nahani Fontaine is a minister in the provincial government in Manitoba for families and children. And this is what she wrote.
01:31:26.300Charlie Kirk was a racist, xenophobic, transphobic, Islamophobic, sexist, white nationalist mouthpiece who made millions of dollars inciting hatred in this country.0.99
01:31:36.480Whether it was his genocide denial, his transphobic tirades, his pushing for mass deportation or his normalizing Trumpism for years, the man stood for nothing but hate.0.99
01:31:47.440I extend absolutely no empathy for people like that.
01:31:51.060In this situation, my empathy is reserved for his children. May they grow up to live in a country
01:31:55.480that is the total opposite of everything their father envisioned. May all our children grow up
01:32:00.200to live in a country that values their lives enough to take gun violence seriously and reject
01:32:04.800any person who would try to justify senseless gun-related deaths, especially the deaths of
01:32:09.840children. This is why you have to pick a side. This is where we're at now, folks. You know when
01:32:17.420people say, why don't politicians work together? Because of that. They are intolerant and incapable
01:32:23.400of discourse and discussion. Charlie Kirk's whole message was, if you disagree with me,
01:32:29.300come to the front of the line. Because when discourse stops, violence starts. This woman
01:32:35.120has no idea who Charlie Kirk was or what he stood for or what his mission was, which was to
01:32:41.940de-radicalize North America and the West and to have healthy discourse and to and to go into
01:32:49.420universities to encourage critical thought because if you can't debate what you believe in then you
01:32:56.120either have to re-evaluate what you thought you knew or you should be able to defend it and that's
01:33:01.260how your brain grows that's how thought grows because a good idea should be a good idea regardless
01:38:53.900and you gotta make everybody interact digitally.
01:38:55.900And if you look at what he's doing with taxes
01:38:58.000and social security, he's trying to make everybody,
01:39:00.900you know, he's canceled pennies, but he's also canceled now.
01:39:04.140you know, normally I pay my taxes with paper and now he's saying, no, you got to do everything
01:39:08.680digital for, it's not this year, but next year. Really? So he's trying to, if you go through that
01:39:14.260list, I've got like, you know, 50 different items of what he's doing. And if you look at what
01:39:19.420they're doing with the Genius Act and stable coin, he said no CBDCs, but stable coin. So I don't know
01:39:26.100if you've read the Genius Act, which is the new plan for stable coins. Okay. A CBDC is issued,
01:39:31.380would be issued by the federal reserve so presumably the new york fed and the fed member
01:39:36.580banks okay now they are owned by their members so citibank jp mortgages they own as members they own
01:39:47.220the new york fed and you know basically govern it okay and and and the new york fed is the
01:39:52.980depository for the treasury and and the different banks work as agent to do those transactions okay
01:39:59.780Okay, so now under the Genius Act, what they're saying is the guys who own the New York Fed are all going to create subsidiaries and issue stable coin, which will be interoperable and can work with a social credit system.
01:40:12.640Now, here's the beauty of it. You know, the New York Fed, under the law, has direct obligations to Congress, and Congress has jurisdiction over them. If you do it through the owners of the Fed, through their private subsidiaries, you're going to have some degree of freedom.