The StoneZONE with Roger Stone

00:00:01.000 The Stone Zone, with legendary Republican strategist and political icon and pundit Roger Stone.

00:00:08.460 Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents.

00:00:12.680 He is a New York Times bestselling author and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump.

00:00:18.280 As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts, spoken at countless venues,

00:00:23.920 and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society.

00:00:28.660 Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone has become a pop culture icon.

00:00:34.660 And now, here's your host, Roger Stone.

00:00:42.280 Welcome, I'm Roger Stone, and yes, you are back in the Stone Zone.

00:00:48.120 It has been a tumultuous week, as Donald J. Trump is the first former president of the United States ever to stand trial in a criminal trial in New York City,

00:01:04.280 in what is, to many of us, an obviously politically motivated witch hunt.

00:01:10.740 Here to help me break this down and to interview our distinguished guest, former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich,

00:01:21.580 is my co-host Troy Smith from Slingshot.News.

00:01:27.740 Roger, it's an honor, and I love the red stripes and the hat combo looking really fresh today.

00:01:32.780 Well, we had to do a radio this morning, so I'm running a little behind, but let's get right to it.

00:01:39.040 We are honored today to have former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich.

00:01:45.300 He's also a former member of the U.S. House of Representatives.

00:01:49.600 I understand why the Obama administration had to frame and jail him, even though he was only guilty of practicing politics,

00:02:02.560 and that's because Rod Blagojevich is so talented as a political communicator and was such a great governor.

00:02:12.260 Well, I think he would have been president, which is why they had to derail him.

00:02:16.640 My friend, Governor Rod Blagojevich, joins us in the Stone Zone now.

00:02:23.460 Thank you very much, Roger, for that nice introduction.

00:02:26.000 I've been alone.

00:02:26.800 Now I'm on the Stone Zone.

00:02:28.320 I'm back, and I'm blessed.

00:02:30.320 And no, I never became president.

00:02:31.980 Instead, I became inmate number 40892424.

00:02:35.800 Would have been a lot better to be in the White House than the Big House.

00:02:38.780 But I've learned a lot from that journey, and I do believe that there's a reason why things happen.

00:02:42.440 And I had a chance through those eight years that I was in prison to get closer to my God by reading the Bible every day in ways I never did before.

00:02:49.720 Gives you a better perspective.

00:02:51.560 Gets rid of the hate and anger that you feel.

00:02:53.340 And pretty much reminds you, at least it did me, that, you know, thy will, Father, thy will.

00:03:02.720 And you do God's will.

00:03:03.820 And the object of life, as Martin Luther King said, isn't so much to pursue happiness, but do God's will.

00:03:08.600 And I do think that with all the things that have happened now, what they've done to me, what they're doing to President Trump,

00:03:13.140 I think there's a reason why these things are happening.

00:03:16.780 I think there's a reason why my life has intersected a little bit with President Trump's and with yours,

00:03:21.660 you having been a victim of political persecution as well.

00:03:24.420 And I think, God willing, the voters make the right choice and Trump becomes president.

00:03:28.360 There's an opportunity for us to save our country and stop these weaponized prosecutors from destroying our democracy and stealing our freedoms.

00:03:36.100 Those are the criminals.

00:03:37.180 Those are the people who belong in prison.

00:03:38.880 And those are the ones who have to be stopped if we're going to save our freedoms.

00:03:41.400 You know, Governor, the question I'm always asked, because like you, you know, I practice politics over a long period of time.

00:03:50.040 People always say to me, well, was it always like this?

00:03:53.440 I mean, was it always like this where Democrats are trying to lock up their political opponents?

00:04:01.120 They're trying to destroy them financially.

00:04:03.580 They're trying to destroy their reputation.

00:04:05.420 But more importantly, they're trying to send them to jail.

00:04:08.160 Was it always like this?

00:04:09.980 Listen, I have to say, no, it was not always like this.

00:04:14.320 I mean, there was a day in America when I had friends in the Democratic Party,

00:04:19.940 when we would eat together and drink together and hang out together and tease each other relentlessly.

00:04:27.040 Sometimes they beat us.

00:04:29.000 Sometimes we beat them.

00:04:30.580 When they beat us, we would say, well, I'll get you next time when and vice versa.

00:04:36.540 That that civility is it has seems to me to be completely gone.

00:04:42.840 Now, I'm not saying that I wasn't a fierce partisan.

00:04:46.140 I was.

00:04:47.200 Absolutely.

00:04:47.760 I always said I would do anything necessary to elect my candidate short of breaking the law.

00:04:55.100 But what we're seeing today, the weaponization of our Justice Department today, I don't know about you, Governor, but this is unlike anything I have seen.

00:05:05.060 I saw it in your case.

00:05:06.440 I saw it in my case.

00:05:09.000 But 20 years ago, this was not the norm.

00:05:12.640 Yes, I think you're right.

00:05:15.760 And you have great experience and would better understand that issue than me.

00:05:20.600 And yet I can tell you that through my experience and my political career started in the 1990s and kind of went up pretty fast.

00:05:27.060 And then it came crashing down.

00:05:29.940 But, no, I totally agree.

00:05:32.040 When I was a congressman, a Democrat congressman, I had all kinds of good, healthy relationships with the Republican members.

00:05:38.720 Mike Pence was a member of Congress, so I served with several of them.

00:05:41.460 I could name a whole bunch.

00:05:43.500 And it wasn't this politics like it is today.

00:05:46.260 There were elements of that back in the 90s because some of these guys were doing things to, you know, we had Bill Clinton with his issues, which were certainly wrong.

00:05:55.720 And he should have been censured.

00:05:57.280 And maybe he should have resigned.

00:05:58.240 That could have been the right thing to do for what he did.

00:05:59.720 But they were impeaching him on things that weren't constitutional.

00:06:01.980 But now the Democrats have taken this to a whole new level and to the point where now, you know, this has become the – it isn't so much a business where you do the politics so that you can govern and get things done for people.

00:06:15.700 It becomes only politics all the time.

00:06:18.440 And the politics is such where it's prosecution, persecution, and the politics of personal destruction.

00:06:24.520 And I think – I truly believe that it started at a high level with a Democrat governor, me, which was done to me at the AAA level to a Democrat governor.

00:06:32.480 And they're not – they've taken what they've learned from that, two trials.

00:06:35.660 They couldn't convict me in the first trial under fake charges because there were no crimes.

00:06:39.060 But then they moved lines unlawfully.

00:06:41.200 And I see the playbook that they used against me that they're doing to President Trump.

00:06:44.860 And they've taken this now to the major league level against a Republican president and leading presidential candidate from the party that's not in power for non-crimes.

00:06:53.100 And that's the amazing thing.

00:06:54.580 And all of a sudden, Donald Trump, who's in his 70s, has lived his whole life, never been charged with any kind of crime.

00:07:00.680 And suddenly, now that he's going to run for president again, they're trumping up fake charges.

00:07:05.900 It's so obvious to me what they're doing.

00:07:08.240 But the problem is that it isn't so much one thing that's happening by itself.

00:07:13.360 This is now the new politics today.

00:07:15.660 And I fear for our democracy.

00:07:18.220 And all I can say is, you know, to my fellow Democrats, you don't like the guy, vote against him.

00:07:23.260 But nobody can be for this, what they're doing, which is so obvious.

00:07:27.060 The irony is I think it's actually helping Trump politically.

00:07:29.320 And I think he's going to get a lot more votes in the Democrat constituency groups than he otherwise would, because I think a lot of groups like black voters, for example, they understand what it's like when the criminal justice system unfairly comes down on them.

00:07:40.100 And they see what's happening to Trump.

00:07:41.740 And Trump is gaining, I think, real ground, especially among African-American men.

00:07:46.140 I want to take a moment, Governor, to talk about your case, because, in essence, you were convicted of practicing politics.

00:07:58.760 Illinois had a coming vacancy in the U.S. Senate.

00:08:03.380 They claim that you somehow improperly sought to utilize that vacancy.

00:08:12.300 Yet the tape recording in which they say these crimes were committed, they've never released that.

00:08:18.200 No one's ever been allowed to hear it.

00:08:20.640 Walk through for folks, because they're going to say, oh, it's the Roger Stone show with Rob Blagojevich.

00:08:26.660 If you're indicted, you're invited.

00:08:28.580 So I think I want to give you a minute to tell people what really happened.

00:08:34.140 Yes, thanks for asking that, Roger.

00:08:35.680 Well, I was arrested in this house right here the morning of December the 8th, 2008, as a sitting governor.

00:08:42.360 Morning of December 9th, I'm sorry, 2008, as a sitting governor, 6 o'clock in the morning.

00:08:47.760 And then they started telling the big lies.

00:08:50.580 And I'm writing a book, and I told Troy about this.

00:08:53.340 And my book is a story that starts with one President Obama, ends with another Trump who pulled me out of there.

00:08:57.640 And in between, there's a governor in prison with gangster disciples, Crips and Bloods, and Sinaloa cartel, drug dealers, and murderers.

00:09:04.240 They put me in a higher prison.

00:09:05.560 The whole thing was about trying to squeeze me.

00:09:07.600 But nobody ever says I took a single penny.

00:09:09.540 It was all political talk.

00:09:10.900 And the talk began by Obama, because on election night, he sent an emissary to me to say, hey, look, Barack Obama wants Valerie Jarrett to be the United States senator.

00:09:19.460 He asked me to come and talk to you to see if you might be willing to do something about this, because I was the governor with the power to appoint the senator.

00:09:25.500 And Barack wants to know what you want.

00:09:28.980 So the very next morning, I'm on the phone talking to one of my top aides.

00:09:32.420 I was on the phone talking to several of them, telling them what happened, and we need to discuss what we might ask for.

00:09:37.820 That's when I made this infamous remark after I got done running eight miles.

00:09:40.820 I'm laying on the floor stretching, sweating and stretching.

00:09:43.700 And I said, you know, I got to tell you, this is effing gold, and I'm not giving it up for nothing, meaning it's going to be a political deal, not anything corrupt.

00:09:50.600 But these corrupt prosecutors, what they did was they took snippets of those conversations, you know, the worst hits, put them out there at a big press conference and kept just using less than 1% of the conversations.

00:10:02.600 And to this day, they blocked 98% of those tapes from being heard, and they got a court order, a gag on those tapes.

00:10:10.680 They're gagging Trump.

00:10:11.540 They gagged my tapes.

00:10:12.460 They gagged me.

00:10:13.960 And I can't get those tapes released because the next question is, well, what does he say after this is effing golden?

00:10:19.660 You know, I'm not giving it up for nothing.

00:10:21.020 If I said something like, I want $10 million in a Swiss bank account, you got me.

00:10:24.920 That would have been criminal.

00:10:25.700 I belong in prison.

00:10:26.440 But there was never anything like that.

00:10:27.580 And by the way, Roger, eventually the appellate court, four and a half years into my prison sentence, reversed that charge because they could never uphold that standard because that would criminalize political deals and horse trading that happens every day and Congress and state legislatures and city councils all across the country.

00:10:43.960 So I was there for a fake crime that was ultimately reversed.

00:10:47.100 And then they held me there for three fundraising requests, but there never was a quid pro quo by using a jury instruction at a second trial because they didn't convict me the first time.

00:10:55.980 They tried me a second time and moved the line and got convictions for things that were legal.

00:11:01.000 And I'm still trying to get the truth out.

00:11:03.460 You know, Winston Churchill said a lie can travel halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to put its pants on.

00:11:09.060 And I'm still trying to get my pants up above my knees.

00:11:11.520 But thank you for saying that.

00:11:12.920 You're helping me make a little progress anyway.

00:11:16.140 Folks, if you're just tuning in, we're here with former Democratic Governor Rob Blagojevich of Illinois.

00:11:23.640 He has suffered under a weaponized and criminalized justice system directly.

00:11:30.880 We're happy to have him here to tell folks the true story of what happened to him because, like me, he sees many parallels in what is happening to President Donald Trump and what happened to both of us.

00:11:43.120 We'll be right back with more of Governor Rob Blagojevich after this commercial message.

00:11:49.620 And when we return, my co-host, Troy Smith, will have the first question for the former governor.

00:11:57.080 Don't go away.

00:11:57.920 We'll be right back.

00:11:59.360 We'll be right back.

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00:13:11.260 Sounds rolling.

00:13:12.260 All three cameras.

00:13:13.220 We're good.

00:13:13.660 Is there any regrets that you have in life?

00:13:19.760 I should sit here and say, yeah, I got a lot of regrets.

00:13:24.700 But when I look back on my life, and I understand the lives that were lost, I mean, I'm sitting here with you.

00:13:33.300 And I can tell my story.

00:13:37.800 Former National Security Advisor Lieutenant General Michael Flynn is pleading guilty today for lying to the FBI.

00:13:43.160 He was one of the most respected generals in the military.

00:13:45.420 He was, by definition, the most dangerous possible person for Donald Trump to hire.

00:13:51.140 He's the only brilliant military career, serving 33 years.

00:13:54.400 Why was he being so elusive?

00:13:55.940 Mike Flynn told the truth and facelike him personally.

00:13:58.500 Welcome back, folks.

00:14:24.440 If you're just tuning in, Troy Smith, my co-host from Slingshot.news, and I are here with former Illinois Governor Rod Bogoyevich,

00:14:35.600 who has himself, very much like me, been the victim of a politicized and corrupted prosecution for political purposes.

00:14:46.420 And we're honored to have him.

00:14:48.720 Also very excited about that book, Governor.

00:14:51.420 When you finish that, I want to invite you to come back on and see if we can help people, help you sell it to people and help people understand much better what happened to you.

00:15:05.240 Now, looking at the situation in New York, you wrote yesterday on your very, very lively X feed, X being formerly Twitter,

00:15:16.980 that you don't believe the judge actually has the authority to require Donald Trump to sit through this criminal trial when he should be out campaigning.

00:15:30.460 Talk to us about that.

00:15:31.680 Yes. Yes. Now, look, I'm not claiming to be a constitutional law expert, but I do believe I know I'm right about this.

00:15:38.640 There's no nothing in the Constitution that requires a defendant to sit at his trial.

00:15:44.160 He has a constitutional right to be at his trial, but there's nothing that says he has to be there.

00:15:49.200 He has, in fact, when you have a situation like President Trump has, where he's a leading presidential candidate, he has a First Amendment right to go out and campaign and make his case to the voters.

00:15:59.180 And we have a constitutional right as voters to see him campaign and decide whether we're going to vote for him or against him or vote for the other guy or however the case may be.

00:16:07.780 These are constitutional rights that are at play. There's a constitutional right, of course, that requires him to answer the charges.

00:16:16.400 I mean, he has to be in court to make a case at some point in time, but he doesn't have to be there.

00:16:22.340 Now, as a practical matter, he's right to be there, because what they'll do if he was not there, imagine the field that they would have, not just in the media, but more importantly, right now for his purposes, in front of the 12 men and women who are sitting on that jury.

00:16:35.720 They'll basically be lied to by the judge and by the prosecutors, and they'll be prejudiced against Trump even further than they already are.

00:16:42.500 And they clearly are, because those are Democrats who are sitting on that jury.

00:16:45.920 Ninety-two percent of that jury pool are Democrats from New York City who don't like Trump.

00:16:49.800 But he has to be there as a practical matter, because it'll just make his case even more difficult in what I already, frankly, fear is a regged trial that he's facing because of the dynamics and the people who are running the show there.

00:17:03.640 But, no, he doesn't have to be there constitutionally.

00:17:06.320 He can go out to campaign. He can go to his son's graduation.

00:17:09.940 The problem is a practical matter, Roger, is that just imagine what those prosecutors and what the judge will do to the jury when Trump's not sitting there.

00:17:16.960 And they'll basically say that he's showing disrespect to the 12 of them.

00:17:20.880 So he's right to be there.

00:17:22.800 But it's just another example of how they twist and misuse and abuse the justice system and the rules of the court not to do justice, but to do politics and to destroy somebody personally.

00:17:35.480 Okay, Troy, do you have a question for our good friend, Governor Rod Blagojevich?

00:17:41.140 Absolutely, Governor. I think your story is so important because you've seen what happens to somebody in the political world when they go against the grain and they're a Democrat.

00:17:51.060 And I think the comparison that I like to make is that you're seeing what Trump's seeing, but from the perspective of a Democrat, and you've already seen it.

00:17:57.780 It's why your perspective is so valuable on this.

00:18:00.240 Can you talk about what happened to you politically when you went through and you were arrested because you saw the entire political world turn against you just as President Trump has seen, but just from a different perspective?

00:18:11.660 I think that's valuable for the audience.

00:18:13.100 You know, when they make accusations like they did against me and they do what they did in such a dramatic way where they actually arrest the sitting governor.

00:18:21.220 And, you know, Roger's been through this himself.

00:18:23.100 And I'm really sorry, Roger, they did that to you.

00:18:25.180 I watched that happen to you when I was in prison.

00:18:27.560 Frankly, it was the first time I knew who you were.

00:18:29.760 And I fell in love with Roger Stone when I saw him there, defiant the way I was, except he had more style because he did the Nixon thing, you know.

00:18:38.000 And that was fantastic.

00:18:39.660 But, no, they arrested me and it was done for a purpose.

00:18:42.240 It was all shock and awe.

00:18:43.780 It was all a tactical move for public relations.

00:18:46.740 Instead of simply doing their job, and that is bringing cases into the court and staying within the court, they destroy you publicly.

00:18:52.820 And immediately what they do is they contaminate the jury pool and they prejudice people, the public, or eventually 12 of them will sit on the jury who will judge you.

00:19:01.380 So they did that for a very strong reason.

00:19:05.020 And they also did that, I believe, to create a political dynamic.

00:19:08.620 I know they did this for a political dynamic where it would be impossible for me to survive and stay in office, to fight back with the position I had as governor where I would have a bully pulpit and can make a case that this was all, you know, a political hit job.

00:19:23.040 So they did that as well.

00:19:24.480 And I had political enemies in my own party, the Democrat Party chairman, Madigan, who's been there for a thousand years.

00:19:30.440 In fact, he's now currently in federal indictment.

00:19:32.940 But Madigan ran the state.

00:19:34.860 It's why our state is the highest tax state in the nation.

00:19:37.460 And I was a new young Democrat governor.

00:19:39.760 I wouldn't just play ball with him.

00:19:41.240 And so when they saw that I was wounded like I was, they piled on my own party and joined the Republicans.

00:19:48.340 And, you know, I knew my days were numbered and I basically had six weeks before they could procedurally do it.

00:19:53.740 And I did my job between then.

00:19:55.480 And part of what I tried to do was to defend myself.

00:19:57.560 But I think what the prosecutors expected was when they brought that shock and awe on me that I would just give in and that I would make a deal and that I would cut my losses, recognizing that, you know, they win 97 percent of their cases.

00:20:09.780 I know why they do now, because the system's rigged.

00:20:13.440 But at that time, I still had trust in the court system, which I learned the hard way was misplaced trust.

00:20:20.320 But they did that because they wanted me to, I think they figured I wouldn't fight back and I would just surrender.

00:20:26.980 And frankly, I was like a Donald Trump light.

00:20:30.420 I fought back from the very beginning.

00:20:32.180 And interestingly enough, he saw that.

00:20:34.340 And then he invited me on Celebrity Apprentice, which I didn't know him.

00:20:36.880 And the great irony, here's the hand of God, Troy.

00:20:40.320 The great irony is that he and I, our lives would intersect in a small way.

00:20:44.560 And he was really good to me on that show.

00:20:46.120 And Roger can tell you about his personal kindness when he, you know, when you know him.

00:20:50.940 But never in my wildest dreams do I think in October of 2009, when I'm doing Celebrity Apprentice, as a governor has been thrown out of office.

00:20:57.240 And I've been described by the prosecutors and by the media as this guy that was trying to sell the demigod Obama Senate seat when the truth was Obama started the whole thing.

00:21:06.440 He wanted to make a deal.

00:21:07.840 Never in my wildest dreams did I think when Trump was about to fire me on that show correctly that he would one day free me all those years later, that he would become the president of the United States seven years later.

00:21:18.060 Never crossed my mind.

00:21:19.100 And here again, it's a, the whole thing's a miracle that I'm home and that my life and his have such parallels.

00:21:26.580 And it has to be a reason.

00:21:28.580 And I know he loves America.

00:21:30.480 Why would a billionaire, successful guy like that go into this business?

00:21:33.740 I think Roger can tell you, as rough and tumble as it is.

00:21:35.960 Unless you really saw what people, what was happening to our country and you felt like you wanted to do something to make it better.

00:21:41.760 Why would you do it?

00:21:42.720 He loves his country.

00:21:43.860 And in spite of what happened to me, I love my country because I've lived the American dream considering where I came from and how I got to be the governor of the fifth largest state.

00:21:51.620 It isn't our country that's wrong.

00:21:53.400 It's the people who are running our country and destroying our country that's wrong.

00:21:56.720 And that's what this fight is about.

00:21:57.980 And that's why when you have people who think outside the box and go outside the box to shake things up, if you don't play ball within the parameters of the game that they've established, the swamp in Washington, swamp in state governments, in state capitals,

00:22:11.900 they destroy you.

00:22:13.460 And they did it to me, a Democrat.

00:22:15.560 And, you know, some of the very same people who prosecuted me, Fitzgerald, are lined up with Comey and Mueller, the same people that were doing it to Trump.

00:22:23.800 In fact, Fitzgerald and Comey have a personal relationship, but one of the two is the godfather to the other's child.

00:22:29.480 So these people are all on the same team and they're interchangeable, really, and they're all allies.

00:22:34.240 They're like a third political party.

00:22:35.800 And this is the greatest danger to our democracy and our Constitution since the American Civil War.

00:22:43.400 If you're just tuning in, folks, we're here with former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich.

00:22:49.840 He does embody the American dream.

00:22:53.340 He went from being a leg man for Alderman Eddie Verdoliak all the way to being one of the most successful and effective governors in Illinois history.

00:23:03.840 Governor Rod, what's happening in Chicago today?

00:23:09.540 Chicago seems to be coming apart at the seams under the great Richard J. Daley Sr.

00:23:17.820 New York.

00:23:18.640 Chicago is one of the greatest cities in the world, one of the safest cities in the world.

00:23:24.640 Chicago seems to me to be coming apart at the seams.

00:23:28.480 Can you tell us what's the latest there in Chicago?

00:23:31.520 I think the biggest problem with the governance in Chicago is that the leaders, this particular mayor and his predecessor, Cory Lighten, they forgot that the first duty of government is public safety.

00:23:44.720 And the way you get public safety is you have the police.

00:23:48.340 And the way you protect the public is that you support the police.

00:23:52.180 You don't run away from the police.

00:23:53.760 You don't stab the police in the back.

00:23:56.520 You don't tie their hands and keep them from chasing the criminals.

00:24:00.440 You should hold bad cops accountable for wrong acts.

00:24:03.880 That's for sure.

00:24:05.120 But in my experience, having been a former prosecutor at the state level, working under the first mayor, Daley's son, Richard M. Daley, who was the Cook County State Street at the time.

00:24:13.800 He was way up there and I was a traffic court.

00:24:15.440 So I never knew him until I got into politics years later.

00:24:17.420 But the police and the police are on the run in Chicago, as they are probably in a lot of other big cities.

00:24:24.120 I know they are.

00:24:25.380 And the criminals know it.

00:24:27.320 You know, Roger, I spent eight years in prison living with criminals.

00:24:29.820 I lived with violent criminals for almost three years, murderers and violent criminals and gangbangers and those that I talked about a moment ago.

00:24:38.320 And whether it's in the higher prison or at the other prison that they sent you, I got to go to because I was a model inmate, begged myself, you get to go to the camp.

00:24:48.640 The rule of thumb was when the cats away, the mice play.

00:24:51.860 You watch these guys.

00:24:53.300 This is what they do for a living.

00:24:54.640 And it's always a cat and mouse game between the cops and the criminals.

00:24:58.480 And the criminals are smart.

00:25:00.000 They're not stupid.

00:25:00.660 And when the cops are not around, they come out of the woodwork to do their deeds that are on the wrong side of the law.

00:25:08.300 And so the gangbangers in Chicago and they outnumber police 75 to one.

00:25:12.360 They know what's going on with the police.

00:25:14.220 And so they blatantly and brazenly go into stores and they just steal stuff and walk right out.

00:25:19.760 Nobody stops them, nor do they feel like they're going to be held accountable.

00:25:23.380 And then they go into court and the Democrats here, Pritzker, our governor, a billionaire with his own security detail that the state pays for.

00:25:30.260 And if the state didn't pay for it, Pritzker, who used to work for me, wasn't the governor, he'd be able to afford his own security.

00:25:36.980 But most of us can't.

00:25:38.720 And so the criminals know that, you know, they can get away with these things.

00:25:42.620 And then they go to court when they're in those situations where they're arrested.

00:25:46.320 And there's no bail laws now that take away from a judge the discretion to decide on a given case whether this particular person might be a risk or a threat to the community.

00:25:56.420 And so they walk in knowing nothing's going to happen.

00:25:58.780 They walk right out and commit more crimes.

00:26:00.660 We've had murders take place in Chicago from some of these guys who were let out on these no bail laws.

00:26:06.080 The whole thing is upside down.

00:26:07.780 And I got to tell you, Roger, it's humbling, too.

00:26:10.360 You know, pride is a sin.

00:26:11.840 And the Bible talks about that.

00:26:13.240 And, you know, I realized that was probably something I had maybe too much of.

00:26:17.480 But I realized, boy, when I came home from prison after all those years, man, you ain't so great.

00:26:22.320 You know, the world doesn't wait for you.

00:26:23.560 It just keeps spinning around.

00:26:24.600 And, boy, has it changed when I returned home, not just my party, not just the city I live in and the city I was born and raised in, but our country and the values and the attitudes and the loss of common sense.

00:26:36.240 So Chicago is a mess, largely because of crime.

00:26:40.540 Chicago is a mess, largely because the criminals have no respect for the law to begin with and now have contempt for those who have to enforce the law and make the law accountable so that make people accountable to the law.

00:26:53.120 And so they're running rampant, knowing that they can do so with impunity and law-abiding citizens are living in fear.

00:27:00.440 And many are fleeing the city, a great city, a historic city, a beautiful city with mostly great people in it.

00:27:08.160 But it's our political leaders that are failing.

00:27:10.160 And these are Democrats who are playing, you know, the politics of listening to some of these crazy socialist left-wing groups that have now taken over the Democrat Party in Chicago.

00:27:19.700 So when Governor Blagojevich and I were at Mar-a-Lago one night for dinner after the president had both given both of us executive clemency so that we could avoid prison and Rod's case to be released, the president late at night likes to spin the tunes.

00:27:42.380 He has a laptop set up in front of him, he's hooked up to Spotify, he controls the public address system, he's got a lot of musical favorites, but he will often have folks who work for him come to the table and ask you if you have any special requests.

00:27:58.380 So when he came to our table without a blink, it was Rod Blagojevich who asked for Elvis Presley's Jailhouse Rock.

00:28:08.520 I thought it was an incredible, incredible moment.

00:28:14.620 Let's talk about this general election.

00:28:18.260 You know, a lot of our data, a lot of our information is anecdotal.

00:28:23.000 I don't know why this is, but as I move around and see people in public, you know, the grocery store, the liquor store, the drug store, even at church, I find a lot of people who most definitely did not vote for Donald Trump in the last election.

00:28:43.280 A, now telling me they intend to vote for him because just, quote unquote, things were better.

00:28:50.660 But the people who seem friendly is the people who recognize me the most and want to talk for whatever reason.

00:28:59.680 They're disproportionately African-Americans.

00:29:02.780 This happened to me last night.

00:29:04.120 I was in a restaurant.

00:29:05.440 Family came back twice, wanted pictures.

00:29:07.580 I was happy to pose for pictures with them.

00:29:10.560 I think there's a realignment going on in America.

00:29:14.700 I think there is a shift.

00:29:16.260 I think you're seeing traditional Democratic voter groups, African-Americans, Hispanic-Americans, younger Americans, moving towards Donald Trump.

00:29:30.960 Anecdotally, and in your experience, Rod Blagojevich, do you see that as well?

00:29:36.400 Yeah, you see, Roger, you're such a great political thinker because of your life experience and your reliance on that, what you just said, that sort of anecdotal stuff that you feel on the street from real people, by interacting with real people as opposed to simply relying on what the pollsters tell you from faraway places like Washington or wherever they may be, or listening to these political consultants who just have you talk in soundbites but not really talk real truth to people.

00:30:03.140 I've had success in politics.

00:30:05.140 I mean, one thing I was good at in life was that and, you know, ran elections and they were all competitive and I was behind in every one of them when I started.

00:30:13.260 I mean, I got this crazy last name that people aren't used to, you know, seeing and much less be able to say over a time they got used to saying it.

00:30:21.500 But, you know, there were some disadvantages that I had starting out, but I was always active as a candidate out there among the people.

00:30:28.940 And as I got in, you know, started at the local level and then got to, you know, state lawmaker and then Congress and ran big statewide, fifth largest state, you know, your campaigns, as you know, Roger, become more sophisticated.

00:30:39.000 And you have to rely somewhat on polling and political consultants and all the rest.

00:30:44.220 But what really gave me a sense of what the people were thinking was being out there and campaigning all over the state among real people and hearing them and feeling, getting a sense of what was on their mind.

00:30:55.260 And what you just said about that anecdotal stuff last night at a restaurant with an African-American person, a black person, is very much the case that I experienced when I'm out in a bond.

00:31:04.880 I was at a big event, the Italian-American Sports Hall of Fame boxing event last night, hundreds, you know, a couple of thousand people there.

00:31:12.300 And the response was very positive for Trump.

00:31:16.700 And people see me, they know that I have this, you know, small relationship with President Trump.

00:31:22.200 And they are very supportive of him.

00:31:24.520 And these are traditional constituents of the Democrat Party, Latino voters, working class Italian-American voters, working class white ethnic voters, and some African-American voters.

00:31:35.160 And it isn't just last night, but like you say, out and about wherever you may be.

00:31:40.900 So there is a real powerful, very real undercurrent out there among people who are disenchanted and disgruntled with how things are.

00:31:48.620 They are concerned about the issues we just talked about, of course, crime.

00:31:51.580 The migrant crisis is so preposterous.

00:31:55.040 The idea, the lack of common sense that migrants are coming from foreign countries, breaking into our country illegally, and now they're being treated in cities like Chicago with tax dollars in ways that are taking money away from impoverished, low-income communities that are disproportionately Black and Latino.

00:32:12.920 You know, the people in those neighborhoods see that they also then see what's being done to Trump, and they associate his hardships with some of theirs.

00:32:21.600 And so what you're saying is absolutely right.

00:32:23.660 And the polls are going to say certain things, but I assure you, Roger, like it was in 2016, those polls are going to be not close to being right.

00:32:33.180 Even the polls that have Trump ahead won't get it right.

00:32:35.720 He will do better than any poll is showing in all of those battleground states and in the other states that are not battleground states.

00:32:42.580 There is a group of the silent majority of Americans, which you know all about, that Richard Nixon was a champion of, that are out there, and they're talking amongst themselves, and they know what they're seeing, and they're not stupid.

00:32:55.780 And Bill Clinton used to say this, the people almost always get it right.

00:32:59.320 That's my bad Bill Clinton impersonation.

00:33:01.400 And the people get it right, because they see the baloney, they see the dishonesty, they see the lies that are coming from the people who have power, and they're not stupid, and they don't like it.

00:33:10.160 And all of this, ironically, is helping Trump among constituency groups that otherwise would not vote for him.

00:33:18.160 So I predict, Roger, not only winning in November, got to be vigilant about making sure that all the rules are followed in the election,

00:33:25.960 but I think Trump's going to do way better in the election than the polls are going to indicate leading up to the election.

00:33:31.400 Yeah, there's very definitely a phenomenon, particularly today, and particularly with a telephone or cell phone or online-operated poll,

00:33:41.780 I think that there is a hesitation by some people to tell someone they don't know that they're voting for Donald Trump.

00:33:48.380 They don't want to be harassed, they don't want to be targeted, and therefore they're going to keep their political opinions to themselves.

00:33:55.220 I've seen this phenomena before.

00:33:57.860 Frank Rizzo was the mayor of Philadelphia.

00:34:01.040 He was very popular, very controversial, very polarizing, but he won as a Democrat.

00:34:10.580 And he always showed in the polls that he was narrowly losing, and then he always comfortably won.

00:34:16.800 And the pollster, who was quite brilliant, pointed out that there was a special factor here, that because he was so polarizing,

00:34:25.240 many people would not tell a stranger that they were going to vote for him.

00:34:30.140 Great man, Frank Rizzo, Richard Nixon's favorite mayor.

00:34:34.360 Troy, do you have a question for Governor Blagojevich?

00:34:38.440 Absolutely, Governor.

00:34:39.740 We've been talking about this for a while on the show now.

00:34:41.860 The DNC convention is going to be held in Chicago in 2024.

00:34:45.840 I'd like to get your comments on that.

00:34:47.820 And you see a lot of people excited for that in the streets of Chicago.

00:34:53.040 No, no.

00:34:54.880 Most people are not, you know, like political insiders or, you know, are thinking about political conventions.

00:34:59.520 Right now it's springtime in Chicago.

00:35:01.300 People are more concerned about, well, the Cubs and the White Sox have been losing.

00:35:05.140 But, you know, things like the NFL draft, those things.

00:35:10.240 But they are watching what's happening to Trump.

00:35:12.240 That's certainly something that's on the minds of people, of course.

00:35:15.080 But the Democratic convention is far away.

00:35:16.960 It's going to be in August here in Chicago.

00:35:19.900 And I would urge all those delegates who are coming from other places to be very careful.

00:35:25.600 And maybe they want to bring a security person with them to Chicago.

00:35:28.960 I hate, I shouldn't laugh about it, but it's not exactly the safe place it once used to be.

00:35:32.900 We've always had issues with crime, but we've never seen it like it is now.

00:35:36.760 And I think that, you know, it'll be interesting to see how the Democrats who crown the city and Democrat Governor Pritzker, who was instrumental in getting Chicago as the place for the convention, you know, what they do to protect the people who are coming from other places.

00:35:49.780 And they're going to have divided loyalties because they're going to have to try to protect the delegates.

00:35:54.500 At the same time, they don't want to be too hard on the criminals lest they offend people and lose votes.

00:36:00.180 And as cynical as that is, that is exactly how they think.

00:36:03.940 And that's reprehensible.

00:36:05.440 That's the sort of thing that ought to make people get up and vote them out of office because there's responsibilities to keep us safe.

00:36:11.840 So it'll be interesting to see what happens during the Democratic convention.

00:36:15.300 Roger knows very well what happened in Chicago during another Democratic convention back in 1968,

00:36:20.220 when we had riots with these anti-war protesters who disrupted the Democrat convention.

00:36:26.980 And it was tremendously catastrophic for the Democrat candidate Humphrey at the time.

00:36:34.460 And, Roger, you remember that Nixon came out of that.

00:36:37.160 The Democrats met in Chicago, and Nixon was up like 25 points after that.

00:36:41.940 And then he came to Chicago shortly thereafter to a hero of welcome because people in the city and in the northern part of Illinois came out in large numbers to back a candidate who was promising law and order.

00:36:55.360 And so those dynamics are very much in play today.

00:36:59.360 We'll see what happens at the Democrat convention this time around.

00:37:01.800 But I do feel cautiously optimistic and, frankly, more than cautiously optimistic that Trump is on the right side of history and the American people are fed up with what they're seeing.

00:37:12.460 And I think this is going to be an election where the choice is very simple.

00:37:15.920 You want to keep what you got, where 70 percent of the American people think we're going in the wrong direction, or do you want to go back to how it used to be before COVID?

00:37:23.700 And I think the contrast that Trump will be able to draw will be very stark.

00:37:28.020 And I think, again, it's going to be, as I said earlier, a successful election for Trump in a way much more than what the polls are going to show.

00:37:36.740 Yeah, I think there can be very little doubt that you're going to have the kind of pro-Palestinian demonstrations at the Democratic National Convention in Chicago,

00:37:47.740 very similar to the anti-Vietnam War demonstrations you had at the Chicago 1968 convention that Governor Blagojevich makes references to.

00:37:59.340 You have deep divisions in the Democratic Party based on the fact that Joe Biden and his national security apparatus, including Secretary of State Antony Blinken, are trying to have it both ways.

00:38:14.000 We've given $126 billion, I think it is, in unfrozen assets to Iran.

00:38:20.680 So we're financing the expedition of their nuclear weapons destruction program.

00:38:27.380 We're financing terrorism in the case of Hamas and Hezbollah.

00:38:33.180 At the same time, Joe Biden is telling our traditional ally, Israel, that they can't respond to these attacks from Iran.

00:38:43.220 At the same time, the attacks from Iran, which got a lot of news, didn't kill anybody.

00:38:47.900 Seems to have all been window dressing.

00:38:50.280 The Iranians told the Turks to tell the Americans to tell the Israelis when this was coming so they could move, you know, strategic personnel out of harm's way.

00:39:03.900 Same thing we saw in these raids in Syria, where raids by the United States, the folks there were pre-warned.

00:39:13.180 This all appears to be kabuki theater for the benefit of the voters.

00:39:20.400 Anyway, folks, we have to cut to a quick commercial break.

00:39:23.100 And when we're back, more with our special guest, Governor Rod Blagojevich of Illinois.

00:39:29.280 A lot of people are having great success with a weight management program with Bellatrip, but it's just a tool.

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00:40:08.860 Who doesn't want that?

00:40:10.760 Metabolite has the ability to stimulate satiety or reduce those cravings.

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00:40:34.680 Joining me at the news desk now is Rebecca Walzer of walzerwealth.com.

00:40:39.280 She has been a regular guest on my TV show, Brennan House Live, for a long time.

00:40:44.440 She's not just an economics expert, but she's an attorney.

00:40:48.260 Rebecca, you have a large firm.

00:40:50.260 How many people work for your firm?

00:40:51.600 Just about 30, yes.

00:40:53.060 30.

00:40:53.540 And tell me, how can people prepare for what's coming with the end of the dollar as we know it?

00:40:59.260 The end of the fiat system as we know it globally.

00:41:01.400 We are moving to hard asset-backed currencies again.

00:41:04.300 Thank the Lord.

00:41:05.180 Because fiat is where we get into all the problems.

00:41:07.660 When you have debt-based currency, you have debt-based problems.

00:41:11.080 And the United States, unfortunately, since 2020, has not stopped spinning at pandemic levels.

00:41:16.140 This is systemic, and it is unsustainable, and it is coming to an end, especially with the addition of Saudi Arabia and the UAE to the BRICS nations.

00:41:24.460 This is what controls our petrodollar.

00:41:26.300 This is the threat immediately in 2024.

00:41:28.940 For more information, walzerwealth.com.

00:41:31.220 Walzerwealth.com.

00:41:32.400 She is not your traditional financial planner.

00:41:34.720 Find out why at walzerwealth.com.

00:41:50.560 If you're just tuning in, I'm Roger Stone, and this is The Stone Zone.

00:41:55.500 I'm here with my co-host, Troy Smith of Slingshot.News.

00:42:00.780 If you're not subscribing to Slingshot.News, well, we highly recommend that to you.

00:42:06.940 It is absolutely free, and you will get some of the best cutting-edge political analysis and reporting in the country,

00:42:15.200 as well as covering a number of important and interesting cultural issues.

00:42:19.980 We're also here with our very special guest.

00:42:23.180 Former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich served his country with distinction in the U.S. Congress before being elected as the boy wonder governor of Illinois.

00:42:37.340 Rob, when I told my sister I was having you on the show today, she said,

00:42:42.420 Oh, that guy with the great hair.

00:42:45.160 I love him.

00:42:46.720 So I think your trademark here is still working.

00:42:50.860 Thank you.

00:42:52.880 Tell your sister that my hair is getting darker.

00:42:57.720 So how do you see this playing out?

00:43:00.960 In other words, when we move to the big picture of this, it seems to me that those who have launched this tsunami of lawfare against Donald Trump,

00:43:13.120 the purpose of this is threefold.

00:43:16.700 One, to drain his campaign funds.

00:43:19.840 Because like Biden, whose campaign expenses in the special counsel inquiry are being paid for by the Democratic National Committee,

00:43:28.880 Trump has to finance the millions of dollars it takes to pay for lawyers in multiple jurisdictions, Georgia, New York, Florida, and Washington, D.C.

00:43:41.360 It seems to me that they just want a conviction for anything.

00:43:48.840 I don't think they particularly care if there's a high probability that his conviction will later be overturned on appeal.

00:43:57.100 This is all calibrated to be election and fear interference.

00:44:02.800 In other words, drain his money, drain his time.

00:44:06.240 So when he should be out campaigning in Georgia and Wisconsin and Pennsylvania and Michigan,

00:44:13.220 instead he's stuck in a New York, at least at this point, a New York courtroom.

00:44:19.880 But I also fear, in all honesty, that this crazed demand to convict him of something, anything, no matter how contrived,

00:44:31.920 is so when he goes into the final days of the election, continuing to lead in the polls.

00:44:38.900 And then he shockingly loses because irregularities and anomalies or voter fraud.

00:44:48.000 They will then use that conviction or those convictions as their rationale as to why the election did not turn out the way people thought it would.

00:44:59.900 What do you think of that theory?

00:45:03.660 No, it's frightening because it's very plausible what you described.

00:45:07.540 And everything you said about the motivation behind these prosecutions,

00:45:11.940 that it's really all about politics and being used, the justice system, amazing, in the court system,

00:45:20.020 because they're not all criminal cases.

00:45:21.440 The justice system, the court system are being used as political weapons to tie up a leading presidential candidate is reprehensible that it's happening,

00:45:31.520 but it is happening, and that's the motivation.

00:45:33.200 You're exactly right.

00:45:34.520 And the seeking out a conviction before the election to try to sway independent voters,

00:45:39.540 but even more so what you just said, and that is to justify an outcome that would be really surprising to people

00:45:44.920 and would be an outcome that a lot of people would, again, not trust and not have confidence in.

00:45:50.000 So they have to be able to say something to why it all ended up the way you would indicate that it might,

00:45:56.120 and I fear that it might, although I still have confidence that the support for Trump is going to be so strong that even this can be overcome.

00:46:02.840 Having said that, yes, everything you just said there makes perfect sense to me.

00:46:09.280 And another example, Roger, of how astute you are in knowing the political process

00:46:14.180 and understanding the motivations of the different people that play in the game.

00:46:17.260 But see, here's the real problem with what they're doing.

00:46:20.940 It's just another indication how politics trumps everything with these people.

00:46:25.580 Nothing is sacred to them.

00:46:27.500 America and the Constitution and the rule of law and the tradition of the rule of law, forget about it.

00:46:33.080 We'll just use it for political purposes.

00:46:35.520 Nothing is sacred to these people.

00:46:36.940 And now we find ourselves in a place where if you can do this to a presidential candidate and a president of the United States, a former president,

00:46:44.960 and do what you did to me, a governor, a sitting governor at the time, nobody in America is safe.

00:46:50.020 Can you really think that you can do anything in this country?

00:46:52.620 And if somebody has a desire to get you, they'll use the law and simply lie about what the law is and misuse the system just to destroy you and get you.

00:47:00.880 They did it to you.

00:47:02.100 They did it to me.

00:47:02.780 They're doing it to Trump in spades.

00:47:05.060 And they can do it to everyday ordinary citizens.

00:47:07.920 And they've been doing it to, frankly, the Black community for hundreds of years in America.

00:47:12.900 Another reason why I think Trump's going to do a lot better among Black voters is because they understand that.

00:47:17.140 You know, Roger, when I got in my troubles, the one place where I was able to get comfort for my family and I and my little girls at the time,

00:47:23.780 when I was being condemned and vilified by everybody, you know, when the time they arrested me, Bernie Madoff was getting arrested.

00:47:31.960 And the two of us were the two biggest losers, scumbags in the world, according to these people.

00:47:36.220 I would say they were half right.

00:47:38.000 I wasn't.

00:47:38.720 He might have been.

00:47:40.020 But it's a lonely time.

00:47:42.840 And, you know, I was well known in my community.

00:47:45.660 And, you know, I got running and, you know, I hear certain things from people and I'd run.

00:47:49.080 And anyway, the place where my family and my little girls, they were just little girls.

00:47:53.780 And my wife and I could actually get some comfort and some love.

00:47:57.440 We're in the Black churches.

00:47:59.240 And they understood.

00:48:00.700 You can't always believe law enforcement.

00:48:03.100 You can't always believe the justice system.

00:48:04.740 And they could see through the lies, like I think many are now seeing through the lies of Trump.

00:48:09.380 So your scenario that you point out, I think, hits it on the head.

00:48:13.080 I think it's almost like you read a memo from the Democratic National Committee on what they want the Democrats to do and what their game plan is to win this election.

00:48:20.140 And the justification that they would have if, in fact, they do.

00:48:25.020 But I still think that there's such a powerful sense in America among the silent majority that now includes the realignment of politics, where this new Republican Party that Trump is creating has a place for Black voters and Latino voters.

00:48:38.100 No longer the party, the old country club, Republican corporate party of the Mitt Romneys and the Dick Cheney's and the Liz Cheney's and the Bushes.

00:48:46.020 I think that there's such a powerful force out there that in spite of my fears and what you just described, if this is handled the right way, President Trump can continue to get the financial support from his devoted followers.

00:49:01.820 I think America's hungry for change.

00:49:04.560 And he's the agent for change.

00:49:06.040 He's the real deal who will change things.

00:49:08.720 All right.

00:49:10.760 I'm afraid we have to leave it there.

00:49:12.840 Many thanks to our guest, former Illinois Governor Rob Lagojevich, a man who has who has not only survived but thrived after the egregious act of of corrupt prosecution for political purposes against him.

00:49:30.840 And I thank you for your faith, for your courage and for joining us today on The Stone Zone.

00:49:38.720 Thank you, Roger.

00:49:40.140 As the scriptures teach us, do justice, love kindness and walk humbly with your God.

00:49:44.820 Thank you.

00:49:45.300 Nice to meet you, Troy.

00:49:46.500 Nice to meet you, too.

00:49:48.200 Troy, I'm going to have you stick with us right now.

00:49:51.140 We're going to bring on Alex Stone, a special segment we call The Rolling Stones.

00:49:59.160 In just a moment, he is going to join us.

00:50:02.300 Folks, in the meantime, if you're interested in history or politics or even murder mysteries, let me recommend my book, The Man Who Killed Kennedy, The Case Against LBJ, to you.

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00:50:23.940 Go to the store there.

00:50:25.020 I'm extraordinarily proud of this book.

00:50:30.060 Multiple publishers said that this has no commercial appeal.

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00:50:42.140 The best place to get this book, the fastest way, at the best price, is to go to themanwhokilledkennedy.com, themanwhokilledkennedy.com.

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00:51:06.080 By the way, I only sell the paperback version, has two extra chapters.

00:51:12.380 But I make the case that Lyndon Baines Johnson was at the helm of a plot that included the CIA, a big Texas oil, organized crime, and the banking interests, as well as the others, including the Secret Service, and yes, the FBI, to murder President John.

00:51:36.080 It is a compelling murder mystery.

00:51:40.240 I recommend it to you.

00:51:41.640 Again, you can get it at themanwhokilledkennedy.com.

00:51:45.420 Joining us now, Alex Stone of The Alex Stone Show.

00:51:50.900 My adopted nephew joins us to close out the show.

00:51:55.620 Alex, welcome back to The Stone Zone.

00:51:58.680 Roger, thank you so much for having me back on.

00:52:01.080 I have my signed copy of The Man Who Killed Kennedy right in front of me.

00:52:05.000 It is a tremendous book.

00:52:06.620 I also have Stone's Rules in front of me as well.

00:52:09.220 Go get those books from Roger.

00:52:12.020 Roger, I have a couple.

00:52:14.120 You know, I just, I'm thinking about what is going on in the world today, especially relating to President Donald Trump.

00:52:22.960 Obviously, there's political persecution, and I'm curious as to what that is like, especially from someone such as yourself, Roger.

00:52:33.260 You know, what is that like?

00:52:35.300 Because you went through so much political persecution a few years ago.

00:52:40.080 What are some relations that you see in between now with President Trump and then just a few years ago with yourself?

00:52:47.960 Well, I mean, Alex, to be honest with you, the stunning raid on my home and then the stunning raid on Mar-a-Lago just speaks volumes.

00:52:57.340 I mean, look, even if they did decide to frame me for the fabricated charge of lying to Congress about Russian collusion that never actually took place, all they had to do was call my lawyer and say, we're going to be charging your client.

00:53:15.360 He needs to turn himself in.

00:53:17.160 And, of course, I would have been compelled and done so.

00:53:21.960 My lawyers actually spoke to Special Counsel Robert Mueller's office the day before my arrest.

00:53:28.300 We handed over 30 pages of text messages from Mr. Randy Credico that proved that I was telling the truth when I said that he was the source of the narrow information that WikiLeaks and Julian Assange had documents that were deleterious.

00:53:47.160 That were damaging to Hillary Clinton and that they would publish them in October and whatever they were, they would be devastating.

00:53:54.620 Now, Assange had pretty much said the same thing himself in public, so it wasn't a big secret.

00:54:01.080 But when I asked Mr. Credico how he knew this, he said in writing, I know a woman lawyer who works for Assange.

00:54:08.740 Now, don't ask any more questions.

00:54:11.100 Yet, that same woman lawyer testified in my trial saying that, no, she had never told Credico that.

00:54:20.440 And Credico for weeks said he didn't know any woman lawyers who worked for Assange.

00:54:25.000 So they both perjured themselves based on the evidence.

00:54:28.760 But as I learned the hard way, and I think President Trump is now learning, the law, the facts, the Constitution, the evidence, the rules, none of these things matter when you have a deeply partisan and hateful judge and a completely partisan jury pool of people who are your political opponents.

00:54:53.060 This idea of a juror, a prospective juror saying, I hate Donald Trump, I would never vote for him, but I'm certain that I could be objective on this jury is an absurdity.

00:55:04.860 But my case is still sealed, so I can't speak about individual jurors.

00:55:11.100 But in the larger case, I had no evangelical Christians on my jury.

00:55:16.100 I had no military veterans on my jury.

00:55:19.540 I had no Republicans on my jury.

00:55:23.140 I had no independents on my jury.

00:55:26.100 I did have people who worked in the Obama Justice Department on my jury.

00:55:30.720 I did have people that had worked for the FBI on my jury.

00:55:35.980 I had people, multiple people who had posted attacks on Donald Trump on social media on my jury.

00:55:44.300 Yet when they're asked, well, despite your political views, can you give an objective, render an objective decision?

00:55:52.100 In this case, they, of course, say yes to lie their way on to the jury.

00:55:57.660 So very hard for me to see in New York how Donald Trump is going to get a fair trial.

00:56:06.380 There are other parallels that I could go into.

00:56:10.920 It's very intriguing that people are waking up to what is actually going on.

00:56:15.360 ESPN's Stephen A. Smith ripped into Democrats' lawfare against President Trump.

00:56:20.160 He says, primarily, I have voted Democrat throughout my entire life, but I'm utterly disgusted with what I'm seeing.

00:56:26.040 They've clearly politicized this thing with Donald Trump because they can't come up with a strategy to offset the momentum he's clearly gained.

00:56:33.720 Just a little bit ago before coming on, I was watching the Flynn movie that just released.

00:56:39.400 And it's very interesting just seeing how they've used different pieces to try to get Donald Trump out of the way because they know that he's a threat to the system.

00:56:50.280 He's a threat to the Uniparty.

00:56:52.440 So they tried to get rid of General Flynn.

00:56:54.360 They tried to get rid of you.

00:56:55.580 They're trying to get rid of Donald Trump because they know that there is a person and a people that is standing in the gap and fighting for this country.

00:57:05.340 And we need more of that every single day in this country or else we're going to lose it.

00:57:14.700 General Flynn's movie is really compelling.

00:57:18.660 You can go see it, by the way, at FlynnMovie.com, FlynnMovie.com.

00:57:24.100 It's important not only because it tells you what happened to him, but more precisely, it tells you why it happened to him.

00:57:32.220 The bottom line of this is pretty clear.

00:57:34.340 When he was at the highest levels of our intelligence agencies, he refused to lie to Congress, along with all of the others, about the dangers of Islamic terrorism.

00:57:47.240 And for that, he had to be destroyed because he would not say things that weren't true, but in line with all of the others.

00:57:57.660 It's a gut-wrenching movie.

00:58:01.440 Troy and I saw it together.

00:58:03.420 Troy, your thoughts here.

00:58:06.420 Well, you know, what General Flynn has been through is exactly what you've been through, Roger, and it's you refuse to lie for the benefit of the establishment against Donald Trump.

00:58:15.860 And look, the establishment, I think, Alex, you put it great there, that they have put in roadblock after roadblock after roadblock, and they had plan A, B, C, D, E.

00:58:27.040 They had multiple plans to try to stop President Trump because they know that anybody that goes outside of the traditional norms of politics, the Republican-Democrat handshake deal things, and tries to get something done for the people, it throws the entire game off.

00:58:41.000 So, President Trump's mere existence threatens the establishment's political power, and it's exactly why Roger was persecuted, it's exactly why General Flynn was persecuted, and same with President Donald Trump.

00:58:51.480 All right, I think we are out of time here.

00:58:56.660 Alex Stone, tell people where and when they can see your great show.

00:59:03.420 Roger, thank you so much for having me on.

00:59:05.280 Guys, if you go to my X, go to Stone J. Alex, Stone J. Alex, you can also find me on Rumble at the Alex Stone Show.

00:59:13.320 I've had to take a little bit of a step back away from my show recently due to just personal family issues, but I will be back soon.

00:59:21.460 I'm not sure exactly when that will be, but I'll keep you updated, and I hope to be back soon for good.

00:59:29.060 All right, folks, we are out of time.

00:59:31.220 Let me thank my co-host, Troy Smith, with Slingshot.news, and also our guest today for the Rolling Stones segment, my adopted nephew, Alex Stone, who is sporting quite a good-looking lid there, my friend, a good-looking fedora.

00:59:49.440 Many thanks for joining us today on the Stone Zone.

00:59:52.060 Folks, until Monday, God bless you, and Godspeed.

00:59:56.460 A man who's gone through hell, but he's kept going, and he's smart, and he's strong, and people love him.

01:00:06.040 Not everybody, but people love him and respect him.

01:00:08.480 Roger Stone.

01:00:09.560 Where's Roger Stone?

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Framed, Imprisoned Fmr. Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich Talks Justice System Corruption – StoneZONE!

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