How Reagan Won the Cold War & What Trump Can Learn from Nixon's Deep State Takedown ｜ The StoneZONE
Summary
Ken Kochigian was a speechwriter for both presidents Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan. He became an intimate advisor to both presidents at a time when he was working, actually, in two of the same campaigns with Nixon in a far junior capacity. He has written a fascinating book, Behind Closed Doors: In the Room With Reagan and Nixon. And now, Ken joins us on the Stone Zone with Roger Stone to talk about Watergate, Watergate, and Watergate itself. Roger Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents. He is a New York Times bestselling author, and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump. As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts, spoken at countless venues, and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society. Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone is a pop culture icon. And now his host, Roger Stone, is your host, on The Roger Stone Show on my radio show on WBC in New York. WBC is the largest, second-largest show we have ever had, and the most powerful, influential AM radio station in America. WAC is the place you can get your most authentic, authentic and authentic news and information about politics and pop culture wherever you go. The Stone Zone is a show you won t want to miss! WAC is your guide to all things political and culture related to politics and culture in the 21st century. - Roger Stone and WACO is your go-to resource for everything you need to know about politics, including everything you could possibly get on the or from Roger Stone s zone in this episode from WACOT is a must-listen to be on this episode on The Stonezone is a place you should be listening to it. , right here on it's guide to it, right here and more than that, right there on it s right here, right on it, anywhere else you should get it on it . Thank you, Mr. Roger s zone, so much so that you're not missing it, so listen to it on the whole thing, right at it's it's not even , and so much more, right that s not gonna miss it, it s not even a good one, right he s got it right there right there
Transcript
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Stone's Zone, with legendary Republican strategist and political icon and pundit Roger Stone.
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Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents.
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He is a New York Times bestselling author and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump.
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As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts,
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spoken at countless venues, and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society.
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Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone has become a pop culture icon.
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Welcome, I'm Roger Stone, and yes, you are back in the Stone Zone.
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Well, if you are a political junkie or you're interested in history, well, today is this show for you.
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Last weekend on my 77 WABC radio show, The Roger Stone Show, which is aired from 3 to 6 p.m. Eastern Time
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on the most powerful, influential AM radio station in America,
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I had the privilege of interviewing Ken Kochigian, who has written a terrific new book.
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Ken Kochigian was a speechwriter for both presidents Richard Nixon and President Ronald Reagan,
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but he was, as his book revealed, so much more than just a speechwriter.
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He became an intimate advisor to both presidents at a time when I was working, actually,
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in two of the same campaigns with him in a far junior capacity.
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He has written a fascinating book, and our ratings last weekend were, I think it is the second biggest show
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we've done, the only other one that was larger, was with President Donald Trump.
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The name of this book is In Behind Closed Doors, In the Room with Reagan and Nixon,
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and now Ken Kochigian, political strategist, speechwriter, presidential advisor,
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and all-around good guy, joins us on the Stone Zone.
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Let me say while Ken is working on the microphone that people need to write.
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So, as I said, you have produced an extraordinary book here.
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Anybody who wants an intimate, riveting look at what happens inside the Oval Office,
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inside Air Force One at Camp David and at the Western White House,
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and this crucial and important role that Ken plays not only as a speechwriter for President Richard Nixon,
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not only as a speechwriter for President Ronald Reagan, an advisor to both, a trusted aide,
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but a man who plays a crucial role as Richard Nixon, the consummate politician,
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the only man to serve on six national tickets, advises Ronald Reagan not only how to win the presidency,
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Ken is, as I said, our show last weekend on 77 WABC was the largest, second largest show we have had.
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And it's very interesting because, of course, I lived in these same times, quite junior to you.
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When I went to my own files, I had so many copies of so many of the memos that President Richard Nixon had given you to pass on to Reagan
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because, well, Nixon believed in a belt and suspenders, as you know.
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Well, let's start with the old man, as we called him.
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People have this caricature of Nixon that's been painted by the hostile liberal press,
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but I know what he was really like, but you spent even far more time than I did with him.
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I spent most of my time in his post-presidential years.
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Tell people about the Richard Nixon that you knew.
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You know, I got to know him first in the White House in the campaign in 1968.
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I was a very junior guy and then worked very hard to get his election,
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and then got into the White House and then was in the fire during Watergate.
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And in the last few days, and of course, that's the first chapter, as you know,
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the first chapter of my book, Roger, is the last days of Watergate, the last seven or eight days, which I document.
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And as you know, I was the only person there that said I didn't want him to resign.
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And that's when I learned how steely our fight was in those last few days and how difficult the war was.
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And when I got to know him was after he resigned, which I didn't want him to do.
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But he left for San Clemente, and about 10 days after he resigned, I followed him to San Clemente.
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I was still in the White House, and Ron Ziegler called me and said,
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And here I was, 29 years old, and here he was just a few days after his resignation.
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They were trying to disbar him in New York, disbar him in California.
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And I sat down with him for the first time one-on-one.
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And my life was devastated, 29-year-old young man.
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And he had lost the most precious thing in his life.
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And you asked me about the President Nixon I know.
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And he sat down with me, and you've been in that office in the Western White House
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and he's in a bay window with the Pacific Ocean over his shoulder.
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And he said to me, Ken, he says, don't get down.
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And so he asked me about the Richard Nixon I know.
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And this is something he had done for the entire time since 1946, 1947,
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And he took on the entire establishment of the entire United States
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and the State Department and the Eastern Establishment Press, Roger.
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And people have created this caricature as some kind of ogre.
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He knew what my favorite drink is because he used to mix martinis for him.
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In 1984, I had the job of going to Saddle River every Friday
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to brief him on the latest from the Reagan campaign,
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a formal briefing with polling, stuff that Ed Rollins would give me once a week
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and say, here's what we want the old man to have.
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And he could be, as you know, he was great, great company.
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And he knew all kinds of history, De Gaulle, Churchill, Eisenhower, getting stoned in Caracas.
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This morning I wrote a book, I wrote a piece for Substack on Bob Woodward,
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because Bob Woodward is, as we both know, a liar, lied in his books about Nixon,
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lied about the Iran-Contra situation with Bill Casey's claim that Bill Casey gave him a deathbed
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confession regarding his role in Iran-Contra at a time that Bill Casey had been incapacitated
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with a brain tumor and no longer had the capacity of speech, lies later about the conditions under which
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we got into the Iraq War, lies about John Belushi and his celebrated biography of that comic.
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It is Woodward who was kind of the first in the media who knows of the taping system,
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It also established that while Alexander Haig, the president's last chief of staff,
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knew about the taping system, he neglected, he delayed telling Nixon that it was likely to come up
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in the Senate Watergate hearings, denying the president the opportunity to file an emergency
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junction under the principle of executive privilege.
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Those tapes worked, that question worked its way through the courts.
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Those tapes ultimately, of course, would bring Nixon down, although you and I agree that they're
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Governor John Connolly, who Nixon admired for his toughness and his swagger,
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And Pat Buchanan urged him to destroy the tapes as well.
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You know, I think it's just that Richard Nixon was such a man of integrity.
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And he had such a sense of history, Roger, that no matter what happened during Watergate,
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no matter what the consequences were, no matter how history ended up judging him,
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that there was so much history on those tapes of the resolution of the war in Vietnam, the opening
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to China, his decisions that he made with regard to the Soviet Union, the assault talks, the anti-ballistic
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missile decisions he had made, the ABM treaty he did with the Soviet Union, the great decisions he had made, that would eventually, over a period of dozens of years, a quarter of a century and a century and 200 years from now, that he would be judged differently, and that history would benefit from the fact that those tapes would be out.
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So I, and I think he thought that if he destroyed those tapes, that forever he would, they would
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think that he would be, because that he would be destroying evidence and that they would be
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So he, basically, he, it was, he was such a man of integrity, and people don't give him credit for that.
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So he didn't destroy them, not because he thought he was guilty, but because he was, because he thought he was not guilty.
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Yeah, interestingly enough, one of the things he told me was that one of the reasons he didn't destroy them is because they proved that he was the architect of the end of the war in Vietnam.
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He was the architect of SALT, the Strategic Arms Limitation Agreement with the Soviets.
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He was the architect of the overture and bringing China in out of the cold, and he feared that after his death, Henry Kissinger, who implemented those policies, would take credit for them.
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The other thing I find interesting here, Ken, is the controversy over the president, well, let's get to President Reagan.
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I think it was Clark Clifford who wrongly called him an affable dunce.
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Your book proves that not only is Reagan quite smart and quite savvy, but he's very much his own man.
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He knows what, he knows the tone of what he wants to say.
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He knows the, he knows the pace of what he wants to say.
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I was very impressed in those parts of the book, and I've now read all of it.
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And folks, you can get this book, In Behind Closed Doors in the Room with Reagan and Nixon.
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Yes, you can get it at Amazon or Barnes & Noble or Bookshop or Target or Walmart, but you can also go to Reaganandnixon.com, Reaganandnixon.com, and you can get your copy there.
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This is a book you absolutely do not want to miss.
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So talk to us about Reagan, because I think I'm happy to see this new movie about him, because it helps correct that record.
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First of all, they're trying to play down and ignore the incredibly successful presidency in which he gave us a robust economy, rebuilt our military, appointed conservatives to the court, and took down the Cold War, at least prepared the path that that would happen.
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And I found in there are three chapters of my book.
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There are three chapters of my book that one of the reasons I want people to read is I had extensive conversations with him where he talked about the economy and how he went on and on.
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And I made extensive notes because I thought it was so important to history that how he, you know, he was an economics major at Eureka College.
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And people thought he didn't know much about the economy, but he knew extensively about the economy, especially because he did a lot of reading and studying.
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And he believed so strongly in the free enterprise system and about lowering taxes.
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And he gave all these long lectures to his staff about that.
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And this is when Murray Wiedenbaum was in the room with him and Alan Cranston and all his economic advisors and Martin Feldstein and Marty Anderson.
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And he would point to them and say, look, fellas, he said, you got to understand this about the economy that, you know, when you lower taxes and and cut regulations, you unleash the human qualities of people in the free enterprise system and the economy will explode.
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And I think, you know, sometimes I don't think they were paying attention to him, especially the, you know, the people around him that Bush brought in, Baker and Darman and Gergen and Stockman, who opposed all these policies, the supply side policies.
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He was he was a brainiac when it came to economics.
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I think Reagan's embrace of of deep tax cuts have been used by President John Kennedy to lift all boats and foster economic growth and his turn away from the root canal wing of the Republican Party who just wanted to sell austerity.
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Reagan understood, like Jack Kemp, who I think really brought him to this philosophy, that that that that it was a positive, uplifting message of unleashing economic opportunity as opposed to the austerity, which was you're just going to have to accept less as we as we, you know, cut spending.
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Troy was, of course, not born when either one of these presidents were at the height of their popularity and public affairs.
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But I'm going to let him ask the next question.
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And I you know, my question is, you know, I try to relate this to modern times and we see the attacks that were launched against Nixon.
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And we look at these attacks now against Donald Trump.
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My question to you, sir, is what do you think Donald Trump can take from the Nixon situation, from what happened to him and apply it to what he's going through right now?
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What can he really take away from that as something to learn and build on as somebody who's been, you know, subject to these attacks?
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Well, I think he needs to he needs to focus more.
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He needs to not try to get diverted with and not try to divert his attention in the way he's been doing.
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He needs to focus on the the policies that have been successful.
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Troy, he's had such a successful first term with his policies, his economic policies, his international policies, his defense policies, the fact that he had a peaceful four years in his term of office.
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And so if he could deflect the tension away from the negative that he deals with in his life and focus on the success he had and then point to the future, I think like Nixon did and move forward, move on, move forward, look ahead.
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I know he's dealing with a lot of slings and arrows and problems.
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My advice to him is let your surrogates deal with that.
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You've got a lot of surrogates out there like Roger Stone and a lot of capable people.
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Let them hit the bad guys and let them let the other ones take the shots for you.
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I think my advice to Trump is to rise above it all and use the strengths you have in your office and be presidential.
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Recently, Chris Wallace said that if Reagan was alive today, he would not be supporting Donald Trump.
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Since I introduced Donald Trump to Ronald Reagan in New York in 1979 and they hit it off extraordinarily well, I don't think Chris Wallace knows what he's talking about.
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Reagan's policy was that of Eisenhower was a peace through strength policy, a more traditional, conservative, hardline, anti-communist foreign policy.
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I think if he were alive today, he would most definitely be supporting Donald Trump.
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You know, I never like to put words in the mouth of President Reagan.
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Reagan believed in a tighter budget and cutting back government.
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And Donald Trump believes in a tighter budget and cutting back government.
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Ronald Reagan believed in a strong national defense.
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And Donald Trump believes in a strong national defense.
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Ronald Reagan believed in a strong foreign policy, a one of strength.
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And Donald Trump believes in a strong foreign policy and one of strength.
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Now, when you put all that together, where do you think Reagan would be?
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So I don't put words in President Reagan's mouth, but I compare their two feelings and
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philosophies and records and let people make their own decisions.
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And they both, of course, understand the dangers of communism.
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They're both hardline anti-communist, something that they have in common.
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The other interesting piece, there's a lot of interesting stuff in this book, folks.
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By the way, it's, again, In Behind Closed Doors, In the Room with Reagan and Nixon by Ken
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Yes, you can get it at Amazon and Barnes and Noble, Bookshop, Target, Walmart, if you want
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to pay a multinational corporation that hates your guts.
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But if you love history and politics and you're endlessly, people are endlessly interested
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about Richard Nixon and Reagan is being disserved by the media today, this really is the book
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One of the things you talk about, Ken, is the decision by President Trump, pardon, President
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Reagan, when he agrees to go to Bitburg, Germany, to go to the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp.
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He got a lot of criticism for agreeing to do that, but he had given his word, I believe
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it was to Helmut Kohl, I think, the German leader.
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This put enormous pressure on him, and therefore I have to believe some pressure on you to say
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the right thing so that the world would understand why he was doing it, certainly not paying homage
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Many people said this was his single greatest speech.
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Others say that it's up there with his call to Mikhail Gorbachev to chair down the wall.
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What's interesting is that former President Nixon, once Reagan told him he was not going
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to buckle, that he was going to go, Nixon wanted it known that he had advised Reagan to follow
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And he asked me to be sure that I leaked it to a reporter at the Washington Post, which
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He and Reagan both took some criticism for it, but your speech really encapsulated why
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Well, as you remember, President Reagan, that was his first personal crisis of his presidency.
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And then all of a sudden, when this crisis came where his advance men messed up and before
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he was going to go to Germany and placed a wreath at the cemetery where they found Nazi soldiers
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buried there, and the whole world didn't want him to go.
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Congress didn't want him to go, and he was being accused of anti-Semitism, and the press,
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there was a big press uproar, and Nancy was fighting with him.
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Mrs. Reagan didn't want him to go, but he had made a commitment to Helmut Kohl that he had
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to go, and by the way, you'll recall, we had Pershing missiles in Germany at the time,
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so there was a strategic, military strategic purpose for going as well.
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And you rightfully point out that President Nixon supported him quietly and sent him a
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secret, long secret memo, a classified memo that is now declassified that I reprint in
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the appendix of the book. But the pressure was on to redeem himself with the world and to show that
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there was a purpose of going there and also that he did not hold views of anti-Semitism and that
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he was sensitive to the Holocaust. And so Nancy demanded that someone come in to help him work
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on a speech to redeem himself, and they picked the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp. And so I flew
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in on the red-eye from California, Mike Deaver's request, the personal aid to President Reagan,
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and worked, met with President Reagan. That was the worst moment I'd ever seen. He was down and out,
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he was feeling so poorly, and he was sad when I met with him. But he said, we've got to come up with
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some words here. And he had left it to me pretty much to come up with the phrasing. And I started
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working on it, I went back to California, then I came back again. And finally, I came up with some
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phraseology, mainly inspired by my own feelings of memories that were stirred by memories of my
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own childhood, hearing about my father talk about the Armenian genocide. So I knew what it was like
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to talk about the Holocaust, the feelings that the Jews felt during the Holocaust. So that sensitivity
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flowed it from my hand to the paper and then to Reagan. And he only changed three words in that
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Have you seen the movie? You told me actually on the radio you had seen the movie Reagan by Mark
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Joseph. I liked it enormously. I was kind of disappointed that Len Nofsiger wasn't in there,
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to be honest, because he was such a crucial character, Reagan's press secretary, who had worked
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also for President Nixon, really a character, a great man. But what was your impression of the movie?
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Well, I thought on the whole, you know, movies are dramatizations, Roger. It's Hollywood. But on the
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whole, it was a very good movie. And it was a very important movie. And it captured it captured
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Reagan very well. You can't put a whole life into 120 minutes or 118 minutes or whatever it was.
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But Dennis Quaid did a very good job. And I thought John Voight's portrayal of that KGB agent was
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excellent. I sat next to him in the showing that we did here in Newport Beach. And I thought, wow,
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you know, you still got it, man. He was so good. And the portrayal by Penelope Ann Miller of Nancy
00:27:17.960
Reagan was, I thought, spot on. But I thought it was such an emotional capture of him. And,
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you know, they dramatized a lot of portrayals, I think, scenes with Tip O'Neill and Reagan.
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There was a lot of it was Hollywood, but that's normal. But on the whole, they captured the Reagan
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years and the Reagan administration and how he handled the different aspects. But the essence
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of it about the revolution he brought to the economy, the revolution he brought to foreign policy,
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a strong national defense, about ending the Cold War, about his opposition to communism,
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about his relationship with Mrs. Reagan. All the broad picture things were very, very important,
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Roger. I think that's the main thing to take away. And Quaid did a good job in that.
00:28:12.140
Yeah, my good friend Robert Davi plays Brezhnev. It's a small, but a meaty. He does a great job.
00:28:20.200
One of the reasons I love your book so much is, well, Ken, you and I just like all the same people.
00:28:25.580
Maybe it has become real Reaganites. Reagan came to believe that his 1982 tax increase was what was
00:28:36.540
among his single greatest mistakes. He writes that in his diary. Tell us how that the 82 tax increase
00:28:44.300
happened. Well, it, he was, he was maneuvered into that. He, I met with him just before his
00:28:59.660
82 State of the Union address. And just before that, as we met in December of 81, I was brought in just to
00:29:09.980
consult with him. I didn't actually work on the speech, but they wanted me to consult with him on
00:29:15.180
it. And boy, he gave me this long lecture about, uh, we can't increase taxes, that that was a big
00:29:22.300
mistake. Margaret, that Maggie Thatcher made in London when she increased, when she switched her view
00:29:28.140
on taxation and increased taxes, and that he would never do that. And it, it, uh, it, uh, suffocates, uh,
00:29:36.860
enterprise. And, and he went through the whole economic, uh, lecture with me. And then all of a
00:29:44.460
sudden, um, uh, he started changing his mind and I, I couldn't figure out what was going on. And I
00:29:51.340
realized that what I found out was I found a bunch of secret documents in the, in the National Archives
00:29:56.860
that nobody else found. And it was the, uh, notes taken by Sarah Fritz, the U S news reporter. And, um, as you
00:30:05.820
know, there's these, uh, gossip columns in the, uh, newsweeklies back in the day. Newsweek had called,
00:30:11.740
I think theirs was called Periscope. And, um, you know, U S news had, uh, uh, uh, their own column.
00:30:19.020
And Sarah Fritz was the reporter and they did background and off the record interviews. Well,
00:30:23.900
she had left it to the archives and, and made it public. And then that, uh, that's where I found out that,
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uh, uh, uh, uh, Gergen and Baker and Darman and William, uh, and Rich Williamson and Craig Fuller
00:30:37.100
and, um, um, and all the rest of them were, uh, were working behind, um, uh, uh, President Reagan's
00:30:45.020
back to maneuver him, uh, to work with Congress to, to raise taxes in that 82 tax bill called the Tax
00:30:52.540
Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act, TEFRA. Uh, and, and they told Reagan, look, uh, Mr. President,
00:31:00.300
you're going to get, uh, $3 of, uh, of budget cuts for every dollar tax increase. And by the way,
00:31:06.860
you're not going to really raise taxes. These are just, uh, uh, excise taxes that they're not really
00:31:11.740
tax cuts or tax increases anyway. So, um, they convinced him, uh, that he wasn't really raising
00:31:19.660
taxes. And by the way, you're going to get these massive budget cuts. Well, all of this was a lie.
00:31:26.620
And, uh, and they conspired with the Senate and, um, I'm afraid to say this almost that
00:31:32.940
of these conspired with Bob Dole and, uh, others in, and in the house, uh, who convinced them, uh,
00:31:39.980
that, uh, he was going to get these, uh, uh, budget cuts, but, uh, you know, they lied to him, Roger,
00:31:46.300
uh, as we found out. And instead of, uh, uh, uh, getting the budget cuts, they, they actually,
00:31:52.380
for every dollar of, uh, tax increase, um, he got, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, he got a $1.74,
00:32:02.460
uh, every dollar, uh, budget cut, he got a $1.74, uh, tax increase. So he got it just the other way
00:32:09.020
around. And, um, he, he said to me later, he said, that was the, uh, one of the worst mistakes
00:32:15.420
I made in my presidency. And the boy, the fellows, the fellows misled, misled me. He was so mad.
00:32:22.940
Yeah. It's, it's interesting. Uh, you'll go through that list. Jim Baker, uh, Dick Darman,
00:32:27.740
uh, Rich Williamson, none of them of course supported Ronald Reagan for the presidential
00:32:32.860
nomination in 1980. Uh, and, uh, of course you really nailed Dick Worthland, the pollster,
00:32:39.900
one of the most duplicitous human beings, uh, it I've met in a 45 career career, uh, in, uh,
00:32:46.780
American politics. Uh, there are times when you do things out of principle and sure, of course,
00:32:52.620
sophisticated survey research is useful. Uh, Reagan had the courage of, to swim upstream nationally when
00:33:00.540
he thought he was right about something. And of course he gets proved to be right. Let's go to his,
00:33:06.700
probably his most famous speech where he, uh, challenges, uh, Mikhail Gorbachev to tear down
00:33:13.740
wall dividing East and West Germany, the, the, uh, the iron curtain, uh, the state department, uh,
00:33:20.860
according to the Reagan movie, but also other, uh, historical documents indicate that his secretary
00:33:26.700
of state, George Schultz, uh, may have been opposed to that. There's no question that the striped pants
00:33:32.860
set, uh, at foggy bottom were against it. Uh, and in the end, uh, although the movie indicates that
00:33:39.500
Dana Rohrabacher wrote that line, uh, I think you told me on the radio, it was a young Peter Robinson,
00:33:46.060
a terrifically talented speech writer. Uh, but, uh, that was a great victory for Reaganism. That was him
00:33:51.900
telling those, uh, in the, uh, in the neocon wing of the party, in the nascent growing neocon wing of
00:33:58.860
the party that no, we were not going to, we were not going to, uh, drop our strident anti-communism.
00:34:05.340
And we were going to bring down the evil empire. It was an amazing moment.
00:34:10.300
It was. And, and the fact is, is that there was the state department, uh, they never wanted that line
00:34:16.940
in the speech. They, they opposed it. They kept fighting it. And, uh, and the speech writing staff,
00:34:23.100
and, uh, I give Peter credit, uh, fought for his language to keep putting it back in. And, uh, it,
00:34:30.540
it was, uh, you know, it was, that was one of those moments in, in time when, uh, the president needed to
00:34:38.460
rejuvenate his anti-communist, uh, uh, his anti-communist, uh, uh, uh, spirit because,
00:34:45.340
you know, um, uh, through all the Geneva summits, it was beginning to look like he was sort of softening
00:34:51.500
his position. And in, and in private letters to me, uh, two private letters to me, President Nixon
00:34:57.660
was expressing concerns that he thought that, uh, Reagan was, uh, beginning to look, uh, a little soft,
00:35:05.020
uh, in terms of, of his positions with, uh, Gorbachev, that Gorbachev was taking advantage of Reagan.
00:35:11.420
So it was good that Reagan, um, uh, was, uh, taking a tough stance once again, and, and showing
00:35:17.900
that Gorbachev, look, I'm not back. I may be showing some, uh, slippage in my negotiations,
00:35:23.900
but I want to let you know that we're still going to have a tough position here. And sometimes rhetoric
00:35:29.340
can, uh, help you, uh, uh, uh, take a tough stance on foreign policy that the, uh, the private
00:35:36.220
negotiations can't. So that speech was very, very critical in reestablishing his position and
00:35:41.740
helping, uh, set the stage for George Bush to end, to finally end the Cold War.
00:35:48.620
All right. Well, we kind of, we have time for one more question, Troy. Seniority wins out in this case.
00:35:53.500
Uh, your book, I think has a very, uh, uh, important, uh, analysis of, uh, Nancy Reagan,
00:36:01.420
a woman who was, uh, a fierce defender and supporter of her husband and protector of her
00:36:07.260
husband. She had, uh, innate ability to see those who were seeking to help themselves rather than
00:36:12.860
help, uh, Ronald Reagan be a great president. Uh, you, you, I had my own experience with him.
00:36:18.780
She was coming in 1980 to, uh, uh, to Darien, Connecticut, to a women's Republican event.
00:36:25.260
I picked her up at LaGuardia, but it was a chilly day and I had noticed that. So I bought a
00:36:30.620
Pashima shawl on the way. Uh, and, uh, when I got, when we got there, it was chilly. It was an outdoor
00:36:36.380
garden party. She wore the shawl from that day forward. I could do no wrong with Mrs. Reagan.
00:36:42.140
She visited New York, New Jersey, and Connecticut, and she always treated me extremely well. But
00:36:47.500
you describe, uh, tensions, uh, over his final address to the Republican National Convention,
00:36:54.060
again, considered among his greatest speeches, which you worked on with him, uh, where he wanted
00:36:59.100
to call out the Democrats. And she was already beginning to think about his post-presidency in a
00:37:04.380
softer, less strident, maybe even less ideological image. Uh, I'm not giving you much time to answer
00:37:10.460
this, but tell us about the Nancy Reagan you knew. Well, she was my ally almost all of the time.
00:37:17.420
And I listened to her because she gave me great insight into, uh, President Reagan. And I admired
00:37:23.660
her. I mean, she was his best friend and, uh, every, everything, every piece of advice she gave,
00:37:30.060
I listened to. But on that 1988 convention speech, we had lunch at the patio at the ranch and,
00:37:36.460
and everybody said they, they, they didn't want a partisan speech. And, and I said, fine, look,
00:37:43.660
whatever the president wants is what he's going to get in the speech. Um, I'm not in charge of the
00:37:49.180
language of the speech other than giving him a draft. And we had lunch and she said, she kept
00:37:54.380
emphasizing vision and vision and vision and not a partisan speech. But what happened, Roger, is that the,
00:38:00.860
the, the, the Democrats in the, uh, convention prior to the Republican convention beat the hell out of
00:38:06.940
him. And they were slamming him, slamming and slamming him. And he got tired of it. And so it was, uh,
00:38:15.100
the president himself that wanted the tough language, not me. And, you know, I gave him, uh, some language
00:38:22.620
about defending, defending his administration, but he, he, he made it tougher and tougher. He kept making
00:38:28.380
it tougher and tougher every time he edited the draft. He wanted, he threw in the kitchen sink. He
00:38:34.220
wanted to defend his record. He wanted to defend his administration. And he was getting tired of
00:38:39.340
getting kicked in the butt. So I had, at that point, I had nothing to do with it. I wasn't in control.
00:38:46.140
And, you know, I, I, my position was, I wasn't the president. He was, he was in charge. It was between
00:38:52.860
him and, at that point it was between him and mommy. If, if, if they wanted to resolve the issue
00:38:59.820
of who's going to be tough and not tough, that was up to them. But, uh, I think she felt it was,
00:39:05.980
that I had some magic wand that I waved over him to control to what went in the speech, but I didn't.
00:39:12.060
All right, folks, once again, the book is in behind closed doors in the room with Reagan and Nixon,
00:39:19.020
uh, Ken Kochihan, not just a speech writer, but a shrewd political analyst, a strategist in his own
00:39:25.500
right and advisor to, uh, both these presidents. Also, I think the man most responsible for electing
00:39:32.060
one of the last great governors of California, George Duke Magian. You need this book folks.
00:39:37.740
You can get it at, uh, Amazon or Barnes and Noble or Bookshop or Target or Walmart,
00:39:43.580
but you can also go to reaganandnixon.com. I believe you can get a signed copy. This is,
00:39:50.140
if you love history, uh, and you love either or both of these presidents, this is a book you must
00:39:56.060
have. Uh, I want to thank our guest, Ken Kochihan, witness to history, uh, and a truly great American.
00:40:03.100
Thank you so much for joining us today in the stone zone, Ken.
00:40:06.380
Great to be in the stone zone, Roger. And Troy, good to see you. Stick with it, boy.
00:40:13.260
All right, uh, folks, uh, you know, in, I guess it was 2020, uh, in the run-up to the election,
00:40:19.580
I went to a incredible Trump boat parade on the east coast of Florida. As I recall, we,
00:40:26.140
we cruised from Jupiter to Palm Beach and back, uh, it was a letter perfect, uh, very, uh, blue sky,
00:40:36.460
blue day, barely a cloud in the sky. And as far as you could see, there were boats with all kinds
00:40:43.260
of Reagan banners and so on. I said then to my wife who was, had just been diagnosed with cancer,
00:40:49.740
this was kind of her last outing before her treatments began, that other than, uh, maybe
00:40:55.340
a Republican national convention, it was one of the greatest single political experiences, uh,
00:41:00.940
I had had. Well, there's a boat parade coming up this Sunday. Uh, that's right, folks. The weather
00:41:07.740
has cleared here. The, there is, uh, the fortunately a God's will. Uh, we were not hit in South Florida
00:41:15.100
badly by, uh, Hurricane Milton. Uh, and in fact, the weather prognostications for this Sunday, uh,
00:41:22.860
are to be a beautiful, beautiful day. Carlos Garvidia is the impresario, uh, who put together
00:41:30.460
the last boat parade that I went to that, which has been the best, but this year he has topped that.
00:41:36.380
This is going to be the mother of all Trump boat parades. It's this Sunday, uh, starting at 11
00:41:42.940
o'clock, uh, in Jupiter. The day before Saturday, there's a music festival, uh, that you're also
00:41:49.580
going to want to get to, uh, and, uh, let us know when Carlos Garvidia is ready, uh, or let's run that
00:41:56.620
video so people can get some idea of what this is like.
00:41:59.820
His story begins in Jupiter, Florida, where Carlos was diagnosed with COVID-19.
00:42:16.780
In March, I got sick with COVID. I was hospitalized.
00:42:20.460
For the Garvidia family, life has been less than normal for the last two weeks.
00:42:24.220
I've been sick a lot before, but never 11 days. Street fever.
00:42:30.220
Despite the local hospital's refusal to administer hydroxychloroquine,
00:42:34.780
Carlos chose to believe in the president's backing of the medication and acquired the drug.
00:42:39.340
And I was so grateful to President Trump for the concoction medication,
00:42:44.060
because it saved my life, that I hung my Trump flag. And, uh, 30 complaints in three days to
00:42:50.380
bringing that flag down, contacted the Coast Guard, and I was able to wrap it and name it Trump.
00:42:57.980
From that moment on, he was now known as the owner of the official Trump boat,
00:43:04.140
gaining national attention. Carlos began to help plan boat parades called Trump tillers,
00:43:09.740
not only locally, but nationwide. I started putting it out on Facebook,
00:43:14.780
putting events out there, contacting my friends in California, New York, New Jersey,
00:43:19.180
Virginia, making that movement grow. And here it is, coast to coast, nationwide,
00:43:23.900
and I am honored to be part of it. These Trump tillers have become immensely
00:43:28.220
popular across this great nation. Truly a movement created by the people, for the people.
00:43:33.340
There's a lot of people out there supporting me and this Trump movement.
00:43:36.780
Don Jr., Kimberly Guilfoyle, Pam Bondi, Hogan Gidley, Roger Stone, and Laura Loomer.
00:43:42.940
We're all here for one reason, to help elect President Trump.
00:43:46.140
This great movement is one of peace, love, and unity. We want the nation to know that we
00:43:50.940
officially place any and all unlawfulness on notice. It is families waving flags. It's peaceful.
00:43:57.260
There's never been an issue, no problems, and no burning, no looting, no fighting,
00:44:02.300
because we're here for the future of America. And that's why we bring our kids to these Trump
00:44:06.460
movements. We invite every American to join us in this peaceful and patriotic movement
00:44:11.900
by hosting or creating your own Trump parade, by air, land, or sea. Reach out to everyone with
00:44:18.940
a warm smile and an open heart and become part of this movement.
00:44:24.620
I have my First Amendment rights to choose who I want to support. And guess what? That's why I live in
00:44:29.980
America. I will not stand down. I want President Trump to be elected because he is here for freedom
00:44:36.140
and the right for everybody to have their voice heard. Let the message be clear. We are all Americans
00:44:43.980
and pledge to honor one nation under God. Become indivisible with proud liberty seeking justice for all.
00:44:51.740
All right. Here is the man who is behind this Sunday's incredible Jupiter-based boat parade. This
00:45:02.060
is the mother of all boat parades. This will be the biggest, most incredible boat parade in American
00:45:08.220
history. You're going to want to be there. I just did a substack piece in which I got the days reversed. But
00:45:14.780
to be clear, the boat parade is on Sunday, which starts at 11. There is an American musical festival
00:45:21.740
on Saturday. That is, I believe, 12 to 5. But here is the man himself to tell us what can we expect?
00:45:28.380
Carlos Agarvidia. Roger, thanks for having me on board, buddy. Thank you. Good to see you again.
00:45:36.940
I'm so pumped about this. The last one was one of the most amazing political experiences I've had
00:45:42.780
in a 45-year career. And given what I see you have laid out here, I think you're going to top it. So
00:45:48.380
tell people what they can expect. Okay. So let's start with Saturday. And first of all,
00:45:54.540
thank God it has blessed us because I was worried sick about I'm flying in all the artists and we're
00:46:01.580
doing a big music festival, America First Music Festival, and we've turned it into a fundraiser for
00:46:06.380
Saturday. So believe me, I was stressed up until I woke up this morning and we have, you know,
00:46:12.220
clear skies even now. And by Saturday, Sunday, it's going to be epic. So on Saturday from 12 to 5 at
00:46:19.100
Harbor Place, we're having America First Music Festival. And we partnered with some Samaritan
00:46:24.940
Purse to raise money. We started about, now it's been 48 hours and we're at the 24,000 mark. So not bad
00:46:33.260
for two days and we just getting started. So my goal is to raise $100,000 this weekend for the victims of
00:46:39.900
Florida devastation and the North Carolina. I mean, these people need as much help as they can get.
00:46:45.660
And we went with Samaritan's Purse simply because it was President Trump endorsed them. It ran by
00:46:51.820
Mr. Graham, and we believe in that fundraiser. They're on the ground, boots on the ground helping.
00:46:57.660
But we've got 10 amazing Christian-based singers that are singing from Nashville, LA, North Carolina,
00:47:05.980
South Carolina, and a couple locals here. Natasha Owens is coming from LA. We've got
00:47:11.580
Becca Shea. She's amazing. She's coming from Nashville. We also have Jimmy Levy. I mean,
00:47:19.420
if you've never heard him sing, he's got a voice that will knock your socks off. Local legends are,
00:47:24.300
you know, Ricky Young, James, Anthony James. So we're really expecting a huge crowd here at Harborside
00:47:32.220
place. You know, and it's going to be, it's all family friendly. I got face painters. I got
00:47:37.580
balloon artists. I mean, we got the snow cone machine for the kids. So we really want, you know,
00:47:43.580
I didn't call it a Christian festival because I wanted everybody to come. I don't care if they're
00:47:49.580
Democrats, independents, Jewish, agnostic. I want everybody to be there because I want everybody to
00:47:55.740
to see good value. That's our goal. Just like president Trump wants to bring Christianity back
00:48:01.660
to America. Our goal is to make sure we bring wholesome values back to America. And that's why
00:48:07.660
instead of having a captain's party, like I've done 10 other times where it's just, uh, everybody's
00:48:12.060
partying. I really wanted to change it up and, uh, and change the motto. And this is how I did it.
00:48:17.740
So this is Saturday from 12 to five. You don't want to miss it. It's going to be,
00:48:20.780
it's a free event for everybody. No, there's no charge. If you'd like, I'd really love for you to
00:48:26.620
go to my Instagram, carlos.gavidia1776. And there's a link in my bio, donate directly to
00:48:35.260
Samaritan's Purse. We don't, we don't, I didn't want to do a, uh, go fund me where people, you know,
00:48:40.540
people take person. I wanted all a hundred percent, the links to go to Samaritan's Purse. Then as we close
00:48:46.620
up Saturday, we're getting geared up for the ultimate fundraiser for the hurricane Trump boat
00:48:53.100
parade. Uh, we changed the name. You know, we wanted to make that a fundraiser too. We want to
00:48:57.980
be out there waving the flag to support and raise money for the victims of North Carolina and Florida.
00:49:03.820
That's who needed the most right now. And we're getting an overwhelming response. We've got a lot
00:49:09.100
of VIPs that are coming. Uh, unfortunately, RK jr. He was going to be there, but God bless him.
00:49:15.100
His mother passed last night. So let's, uh, let's pray for his family that they, uh,
00:49:20.460
that I know it's pretty, a difficult time, but we still have a lot of VIPs coming. Um,
00:49:25.340
Jessica Krause from house of habit has been helping me promote it. She's already here in Palm beach.
00:49:30.620
We'll be seeing her tomorrow and Eric and Lord Trump are, are, are going to be there as well.
00:49:36.140
And I'm sure Don jr. And Kimberly, but we're going to have a, we have a list of VIPs and
00:49:40.780
we've had 2,100 boats as of yesterday, uh, signed up and ready to go. So this is going to be a
00:49:46.860
amazing event and the sun is going to be shining. We are completely blessed by God that, that it's
00:49:53.340
going to be, the sky is parting and the sun is shining. We are really blessed. No rain.
00:49:58.620
And the wind is only going to be five, five miles per hour. So we are really, really excited to show
00:50:04.620
our patriotism. But one thing about these, you know, it started back in 2020 when president
00:50:09.820
Trump could not rally because of the COVID. Well, we changed that for him. We started doing
00:50:15.740
a thousand boats. We even had a 4,000 boats in Tampa with Pam Bondi, you know, the Guinness world
00:50:21.100
record. I mean, that was the biggest parade and Roger, the one you won. I mean, that was an amazing
00:50:26.460
boat parade. Um, it's going to be just as amazing this time. Unfortunately, some things that have
00:50:32.860
changed. Um, but, and I hope, you know, everybody's going to understand, you know, the, uh, helicopters,
00:50:38.380
um, that we're going to do the parachute jumping and, and carry the flag. Unfortunately, they're on a,
00:50:45.100
on a super big mission. Walter, who has this two Stavorsky helicopters that have done my parades every
00:50:52.220
single time. He, I spoke to him and God bless him. He's doing life, you know, life-saving work. He's been
00:50:58.860
in North Carolina, pulling people out of their rooftops. And I certainly could not push to have
00:51:06.300
him here to fly the flag and do paratroopers. He's doing God's work and saving people. So I'm going
00:51:12.860
to, uh, we're going to take that money that we were going to pay him and we're going to donate it
00:51:17.260
tomorrow. I mean, I'm sorry, on Saturday, we're going to donate it to Samaritan's Purse. We want
00:51:23.100
that money to go to a good cause, just like he's doing. So God bless Walter for what he's doing,
00:51:28.540
with his two helicopters. And it's not going to be the, we're not going to have the air show,
00:51:33.100
but it doesn't matter. The patriotism is going to be amazing. Um, you experience it yourself,
00:51:38.380
Roger. People are going to be flagged, waving. It's going to be exciting. So can't wait. I got,
00:51:43.660
I got my mega shoes ready to go for all my VIPs. They're, they're amazing shoes. I got it. I got
00:51:48.940
a pair for everybody. And, uh, and that's it. And it's going to be amazing. You don't want to miss it.
00:51:54.620
This could be the last Trump boat parade ever. Cause you know, president Trump is, uh,
00:51:59.260
you know, this is his last term he's going to get, cause he's going to win.
00:52:02.460
And hopefully we can get Eric to run and then we'll do more Trump boat parades for Eric Trump.
00:52:07.820
I like that idea. Uh, Carlos, you are indeed a man of very deep faith. Uh, when we first heard
00:52:14.300
that there was a hurricane headed this way, I texted you and I said, oh my God, is this going to,
00:52:19.980
is this going to ruin the boat parade? You're going to have to reschedule. You said, no,
00:52:23.660
absolutely not. Cause everything's going to be fine. God has us. And I said, well, gee,
00:52:27.820
I don't know. I, I hear this is going to be bad. It's going to hit late and it could really disrupt
00:52:32.700
the Jupiter. You said, no, it'll be, it'll be 400 miles out to sea by then. We're going to have
00:52:37.820
the most perfect weather you've ever seen. I know it. And of course you've turned out to be
00:52:42.140
absolutely right. So just so folks are not confused, this is happening. Saturday is the music
00:52:49.100
festival, 12 to five. Uh, Carlos, tell people where that is. It's going to be at Harbor place
00:52:54.540
in Jupiter, Florida, right next to the Wyndham grand hotel. It's right there at the amphitheater.
00:52:59.980
We've got the whole amphitheater. We've got the, uh, all the vendors, meaning the restaurants are
00:53:05.020
going to have, uh, food carts out there. They're going to serve drinks. It's family friendly. I've
00:53:09.660
got rented, uh, like 400 chairs for the people to come. It's going to be an amazing event. It's going to be
00:53:15.420
really something not to be missed. And of course it's a free, you know, free, free festival for
00:53:21.100
everybody. We've had some amazing sponsors that have really come out and help us, you know, to
00:53:25.660
rent the equipment, Julie and, uh, Freddie Hyatt and, you know, even both gold, you know, from
00:53:32.060
California. I mean, a lot of people support president Trump. It's been amazing. They really,
00:53:37.260
really are. And a lot of individuals that just, you know, wanted, you know, they just said, no,
00:53:41.900
I just want to help in any way I can. So God bless them and God bless president Trump.
00:53:46.540
And we're going to get them back in office. And then we're going to make Eric Trump run because
00:53:49.900
we want Eric Trump in office next. Uh, you know, uh, I, I like that idea. Well,
00:53:56.780
I wouldn't mind making Pam Bondi the next governor of Florida while we're at it.
00:54:00.300
Uh, so, so let's say Carlos, I'm just a guy who's a Trump supporter and I got a boat,
00:54:07.020
whether it's a small boat or a medium sized boat or a big boat. And I want to participate
00:54:11.980
in the boat parade on Sunday, which starts at 11 o'clock. What do I do?
00:54:16.780
Uh, you should be at the lighthouse around 10 45 because Eric and I are going to be on the bow of
00:54:23.900
the official Trump boat. We've got a lot of gifts we're going to be giving out. We, you know, we give
00:54:28.220
out, uh, official Trump hats. Um, so be there to get, you know, some gifts from Eric. He's going to be
00:54:35.020
a tossing amount off the bow of the official Trump boat and Lord Trump will be there as well. So,
00:54:39.820
uh, we'll have a bunch of goodies to give away lots of flags and, uh, we're excited. So be there.
00:54:46.140
Then what we're going to do is once I do the blessing of the fleet, which will be around
00:54:51.340
11 30, we'll do the blessing of the fleet. And then we're going to, if you can clear the way
00:54:57.660
for the three lead boats, I've got three boats. Cause a lot of VIPs is going to be the official Trump
00:55:02.300
boat. And then I got a 50, uh, MTI and a 42 Valhalla. We're going to clear the way. And
00:55:08.860
I'd like to go down southward bound on the ICW, but at a slow pace, we want to really protect the
00:55:14.780
manatees and we want to make sure we don't go through any, uh, no wake zones. We want to go
00:55:19.260
five to seven miles per hour, have play some patriotic music, have some cocktails. Everybody
00:55:26.300
have a great time. Wave the flags, show your support and be show your patriotism. You know,
00:55:31.340
Roger, I still got that video of you dancing in the background. You've got some moves,
00:55:35.020
I got to tell you. So that's what we want. We want everybody. We want families out there.
00:55:39.100
We want them on the bridges. We want them on the shorelines, showing your support. This,
00:55:43.420
this election is probably the most important election in American history. I mean, this is
00:55:48.940
going to really save our country. And everybody's got to understand that this country is in a spiral
00:55:55.820
downward and we really need to save what's happening, not only for, for ourselves, but
00:56:00.860
for our future of our children. You know, it's, uh, it's, it's scary to think if we keep going
00:56:06.220
the way, I mean, tampon Joe, I mean, tampon Tim, I'm sorry. I mean, he's just completely messed up
00:56:12.300
Minnesota. And I don't think it's, uh, it's the way America should be. So I'm doing everything I can
00:56:19.500
in my path to ignite the boat. We need everybody to vote. Carlos, there is another way people can
00:56:25.100
participate if they don't have a boat. Uh, what amazed me last time is there were hundreds and
00:56:30.060
hundreds and hundreds of people on both sides of the intercoastal cheering us on, carrying Trump
00:56:35.980
signs, waving, waving flags. So tell folks the route so they can, they can cover both sides of the
00:56:42.700
interco, intercoastal. Absolutely. So, and that's very true. Every bridge was covered. I mean, they took
00:56:48.940
sheets, hung them over their flags, over the bridges. So we're going to go southbound from
00:56:53.340
Jupiter. We're going to go down southbound. We're going to pass the notorious Admiral's Cove on our
00:56:58.540
right. We're going to keep on going all the way down till we get to Jupiter, uh, past, past the
00:57:05.980
inlet. We're going to go all the way down to Peanut Island. When we get to Peanut Island, we're going to go
00:57:10.860
to the right, which is westbound and circle around. And then we're going to do a flotilla there at
00:57:18.380
Peanut Island. So once we're there, everybody's going to tie up. We're going to have a big party
00:57:22.700
for a couple hours and that will end the ultimate Trump boat parade. It's going to be an amazing
00:57:29.740
party. All right, folks. Uh, those, the details were the boats. I assume we'll return to Jupiter
00:57:35.260
after that. Yes. Yes, of course. Yes. Cause you got to get your car somehow. All right. Carlos
00:57:41.020
Garbidia, the impresario, the man himself. You don't want to miss this music concert,
00:57:46.220
Saturday, boat parade, Sunday, Troy, you ought to come down for it. It's going to be amazing.
00:57:51.660
Thank you, Carlos. And God bless you for putting this all together. Folks. We're pretty much out
00:57:56.460
of time. Don't miss this boat parade. You want to be there, be a part of history on behalf of Troy
00:58:01.660
and myself and the whole crew here at stonezone.com. God bless you and Godspeed. And we'll see you Sunday.
00:58:09.340
A man who's gone through hell, but he's kept going and he's smart and he's strong and people
00:58:17.980
love him. Not everybody, but people love him and respect him. Roger Stone. Where's Roger Stone?