The StoneZONE with Roger Stone - Will the Deep State Still Try to Prosecute Donald Trump？ w⧸ David Schoen

00:00:00.000 The Stone Zone, with legendary Republican strategist and political icon and pundit Roger Stone.

00:00:07.600 Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents.

00:00:11.620 He is a New York Times bestselling author and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump.

00:00:17.260 As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts, spoken at countless venues,

00:00:22.640 and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society.

00:00:27.660 Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone has become a pop culture icon.

00:00:33.640 And now, here's your host, Roger Stone.

00:00:41.160 Welcome, I'm Roger Stone, and yes, you are back in the Stone Zone.

00:00:46.760 Continued controversy of President Donald Trump's appointment of Pete Hegseth,

00:00:51.720 the Fox News commentator and decorated combat veteran, to be Secretary of Defense.

00:01:00.460 To help break this down, let me bring in my co-host for today,

00:01:05.340 the Illinois Business Review founder, publisher, and editor, Mark Vargas.

00:01:12.260 Roger, good to be with you.

00:01:14.240 Great to be with you.

00:01:15.180 Well, Mark, you've got a lot of experience in Washington.

00:01:19.020 You've seen this before, the feeding frenzy by the deep state and their allies in the fake news media.

00:01:28.880 Personally, I think Pete Hegseth is fully qualified to be the Secretary of Defense.

00:01:35.060 And the media has him withdrawing, but that doesn't appear to be the case.

00:01:39.700 Here's a video of Pete Hegseth only this morning.

00:01:45.180 He said, keep going, keep fighting.

00:01:56.540 Behind you all the way.

00:01:57.820 So you're in this all the way.

00:01:59.820 Why would I back down?

00:02:00.800 I've always been a fighter.

00:02:01.960 I'm here for the war fighters.

00:02:04.580 This person is passionate for me.

00:02:07.020 You're not withdrawing your name from consideration, just to be clear.

00:02:10.220 Meeting all day with senators.

00:02:11.960 I know your mom was just on Fox.

00:02:14.100 She says that you are a change.

00:02:20.840 Well, that seems to be very contrary to the mainstream media narrative, which has Hegseth on the verge of withdrawing.

00:02:29.200 It doesn't look to me like a guy who's withdrawing at all.

00:02:32.880 Mark, what do you think?

00:02:34.060 No, and we're seeing how nasty this confirmation process is when you've got these never-Trumper senators like Mitch McConnell and Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski, totally ineffective senators.

00:02:46.800 But, Roger, I used to work at the Pentagon, working for the Secretary of Defense as a civilian staffer on a special task force.

00:02:54.460 So I'm very familiar with that building and how the Office of Secretary of Defense works.

00:02:59.260 And he is, in fact, overqualified as a decorated combat veteran.

00:03:04.080 But for the mainstream media to be bashing such a decorated and honorable veteran should be no surprise.

00:03:12.720 And trying to claim that other individuals are going to be already taking his place certainly should be no surprise.

00:03:20.380 Yeah, there was a particularly nasty hatchet piece in The New Yorker regarding Hegseth.

00:03:28.600 I went through it.

00:03:29.780 I think I found 27 specific errors of fact.

00:03:34.200 And then things reported, but out of context, criticism of Hegseth by his own mother, which she withdrew literally years ago.

00:03:46.640 I think this is symptomatic of what we're seeing.

00:03:49.660 You raised an excellent point about these RINO senators, some of them not even RINOs.

00:03:57.340 It was interesting.

00:03:58.480 Yesterday afternoon, James Lankford, known in Oklahoma as the shrimp, the senior senator, and Mark Wayne Mullen, who seems to be more Trump-friendly,

00:04:11.160 initially said that they wouldn't necessarily be voting for Kash Patel as the president's nominee for FBI director.

00:04:20.040 I'm told that both of their offices were so flooded with phone calls from constituents, telling them that the president deserves his nominees.

00:04:31.980 Well, by late afternoon, Mark Wayne Mullen, the junior senator, had changed his tune, said he would support Patel, who I saw your show the other day.

00:04:43.740 Patel, I think, is one of the president's very best nominees so far.

00:04:48.560 Speculation at the Wall Street Journal and elsewhere that Governor Ron DeSantis will now replace the nominee, Pete Hegseth.

00:05:02.680 I dug into this first thing this morning.

00:05:06.440 I can tell you, Mark, this is entirely without foundation.

00:05:12.080 Now, I do think it's important because people lose track.

00:05:14.900 When he withdrew from the presidential race, Ron DeSantis has never endorsed Donald Trump for president.

00:05:22.380 If you go back and look at his remarks, what he said was he had concluded that a majority of Republicans favored the renomination of Trump,

00:05:30.580 and therefore he was withdrawing his candidacy.

00:05:33.640 That is not exactly a full-throated endorsement.

00:05:37.780 The truth of the matter is that Ron DeSantis owes his entire career to Donald Trump.

00:05:45.640 He was an undistinguished and largely unknown congressman, running at about 8 percent in the polls when he was elected in 2018.

00:05:56.280 His opponent, the state agriculture commissioner, Adam Putnam, a former congressman,

00:06:03.300 had been endorsed by all 62 of the Republican county chairmen in Florida,

00:06:10.160 every single Republican in both the state House and the state Senate,

00:06:15.240 the all-powerful state Senate president, the very powerful Speaker of the House,

00:06:21.060 every Republican member of Congress from Florida, with the exception of Matt Gaetz.

00:06:26.420 And his campaign was hopelessly doomed.

00:06:29.800 He was having trouble raising money.

00:06:31.340 He went on bended knee and begged Donald Trump for an endorsement.

00:06:37.420 Trump evidently did not know that in 2016, when DeSantis was running for Congress

00:06:44.200 and Trump was the Republican nominee for president, DeSantis refused to endorse Trump in that election,

00:06:50.280 actually saying, it's almost an exact quote,

00:06:53.220 just because we're both on the Republican ticket does not mean I support Donald Trump.

00:06:58.280 It was only after Trump was elected president that DeSantis saw his main chance to emerge as a defender of Trump in the Russian collusion hoax.

00:07:10.900 I think this is probably the first time he ever came to Trump's attention.

00:07:14.660 Then, at the behest of Matt Gaetz, Trump endorsed DeSantis.

00:07:20.800 DeSantis went from 8 to 68 in the polls almost overnight, swept to the Republican nomination for governor.

00:07:29.440 Because he had no grounding in state issues, he'd really been planning a U.S. Senate race.

00:07:36.220 He brought on the extraordinarily capable Susie Wiles, who essentially put together very quickly a very efficient grassroots campaign for him,

00:07:47.100 since his nomination, was a manifestation of his appearances on conservative talk radio and Fox.

00:07:55.160 And, of course, he won by a very narrow 25,000 votes.

00:07:59.440 And then, only because President Donald Trump changed his schedule three times to visit Florida in the final weeks of the 2018 campaign,

00:08:08.420 to drag DeSantis over the finish line. 0.97

00:08:11.880 So, my prediction to you today is that this is a fake news, that Ron DeSantis will not be appointed the secretary of defense.

00:08:21.360 I'm sticking with Hegseth.

00:08:23.020 I know you are.

00:08:24.140 As long as Donald Trump is for him, that's who I'm for.

00:08:27.880 Any thoughts?

00:08:29.780 Roger, I can tell you that in Illinois, it was the never-Trump base of the Illinois Republican Party that endorsed DeSantis over President Donald Trump,

00:08:39.400 even though President Trump had a 40, nearly a 40-point advantage over DeSantis.

00:08:45.380 It was these same officials like Richard Porter, the Republican National Committeeman, who said Donald Trump can't win independent voters in the swing states,

00:08:53.440 and that MAGA supporters in their heart of hearts know that's just not possible.

00:08:57.300 He was a deep DeSantis supporter.

00:09:01.920 Another Republican, Illinois Republican Party leader, Jeannie Ives, also backed DeSantis over President Trump.

00:09:07.860 So, I can tell you, in my firsthand experience, just here in Illinois alone, DeSantis' failed presidential campaign attracted all the never-Trumpers.

00:09:16.860 And so, I couldn't imagine, I'm so glad with your analysis, I couldn't imagine that Ron DeSantis would be even considered for secretary of defense.

00:09:25.620 And, Roger, I'd have to think that MAGA has a very good memory.

00:09:28.860 Yeah, I think that's an excellent analysis.

00:09:33.680 Obviously, there's been a lot of speculation here in Florida that Governor DeSantis would appoint Laura Trump, 0.86

00:09:41.200 who I think did an exceptional job as Republican National Co-Chairman, particularly in the area of election integrity,

00:09:47.980 where this time the party was extremely well-prepared.

00:09:51.560 For example, when there were irregularities in the voting in Butler, Pennsylvania,

00:09:56.980 party lawyers sprung into action, won important judgments there to provide for a fair, honest, transparent election.

00:10:05.580 I think that that is unlikely, but there are some wags in the press who are now saying,

00:10:10.420 well, maybe there's a deal here, maybe DeSantis will agree to appoint Laura Trump to the seat being vacated by Senator Marco Rubio, 0.94

00:10:22.340 and in return, Trump will make him secretary of defense.

00:10:26.180 First of all, Donald Trump doesn't operate that way.

00:10:29.580 Secondarily, I think candidly, Governor DeSantis has his own designs on that seat.

00:10:37.220 Let me explain how this works.

00:10:38.800 Assuming that Senator Rubio resigns in January in order for his name to be sent to the Senate,

00:10:47.680 where I think his confirmation as secretary of state is virtually certain,

00:10:52.900 because he is resigning in the first three years of a six-year term,

00:10:58.960 the special election for that seat would be held in November of 2026.

00:11:04.600 That's at the end of Ron DeSantis' term as governor.

00:11:07.900 DeSantis cannot run for another term.

00:11:10.900 He's barred from a third term by the state constitution.

00:11:15.120 So I have been predicting, continue to predict,

00:11:17.980 that the governor of Florida will put a placeholder into the Senate seat,

00:11:23.320 someone who will not run, and seek that seat himself in order to position himself for another run for president in 2028,

00:11:32.500 in which he will once again be ignominiously defeated.

00:11:38.080 I called this one very early.

00:11:40.480 We have a little video here.

00:11:41.780 It's controversial, but we're going to show it to you anyway.

00:11:44.500 Roger!

00:11:45.500 My man, I didn't even see this.

00:11:47.660 How could I not see my right?

00:11:49.180 God bless you.

00:11:50.180 That is back at a time, Mark, where I was taking a lot of abuse because I was telling people,

00:12:06.420 DeSantis is going to run for president against the man who made him, Donald Trump.

00:12:10.180 And people are saying, no, stop dividing us.

00:12:12.860 Why are you saying that?

00:12:14.020 He would never do that.

00:12:15.220 I think I proved to be right about this.

00:12:18.660 He's not trustworthy.

00:12:20.340 By the way, the people who say he's a great governor,

00:12:23.020 they tend to be the people who don't live in Florida.

00:12:26.660 Our insurance rights are skyrocketing.

00:12:29.980 The insurance on my car has tripled since Ron DeSantis has been governor.

00:12:35.180 Our utility rates are at an all-time high.

00:12:40.040 After DeSantis took $9.5 million from Florida Power and Light and their various subsidiaries

00:12:47.780 for his presidential campaign, his regulators approved the greatest single increase in

00:12:54.100 electricity rates in Florida history.

00:12:57.200 We also have a rising crime problem here in the country.

00:13:01.720 So this idea that he's a great governor, I hear that from people in Ohio, people in Texas,

00:13:07.300 people in Illinois, don't hear that so much from people here in Florida.

00:13:13.600 Another interesting development I wanted to touch on, by the way, David Schoen, the president's,

00:13:19.440 I think, most effective impeachment lawyer is going to join us momentarily for a discussion

00:13:26.800 of what exactly is going on with Jack Smith and the cases filed against President Trump,

00:13:33.600 also analyze the Georgia case and what we may be looking at from the New York courts.

00:13:39.500 But it is interesting, I don't know if you saw this, Mark, that the president nominated

00:13:45.520 a North Florida sheriff, Chad Chronister, to be the head of the DEA.

00:13:53.460 And then it became clear that during the pandemic incident, the pandemic problem, that Chronister

00:14:03.200 had gone into a church in Tampa and actually arrested Pastor Howard Rodney Brown in the middle

00:14:10.180 of the services in that church, trying to enforce the COVID law.

00:14:17.020 Christian backlash was so overwhelming yesterday that President Trump announced that he would

00:14:23.780 withdraw the appointment of Chronister.

00:14:28.800 Strike, wrap one up for Jesus Christ.

00:14:32.280 This was an outrageous appointment to begin with.

00:14:35.340 You know, Mark, by tradition, U.S. senators are only supposed to oppose a nominee for a

00:14:43.140 cabinet position on the basis of some malfeasance, some crime, some other disqualifying factor.

00:14:50.360 They're not supposed to oppose the president's nominees because they don't agree with their

00:14:54.860 political philosophy.

00:14:56.500 That seems to be out the window here.

00:14:59.360 I think the president's nomination of Kash Patel, you had a great show here when you guest-hosted

00:15:07.140 on The Stone Zone on this very subject.

00:15:09.660 I think this is among the president's very best appointments.

00:15:15.060 Watching acting FBI director Andrew McCabe, a man who never even served as a station chief

00:15:22.520 for the FBI, say that Kash Patel is unqualified, this is laughable nonsense.

00:15:30.420 But I think the most important message, I think, for those who are out there listening to us,

00:15:36.300 particularly if you live in one of these states like Alaska or Maine, or Oklahoma for that matter,

00:15:44.140 is contact your senators.

00:15:46.480 You go online, find their cell phone numbers, find their email addresses, be respectful, be polite,

00:15:54.800 but make it very clear to your elected officials that you expect them to respect the mandate of the

00:16:02.060 American people.

00:16:03.160 You expect them to respect the mandate of the voters, and they need to vote for President Donald

00:16:09.960 Trump's nominees.

00:16:10.940 Now, Elon Musk, who's a man worth a few bucks, has said that he will finance primary challenges

00:16:18.140 to those Republican senators who do not support the president's nominees.

00:16:24.140 Mark, you have a very good understanding of Republican primary voters and how they work.

00:16:28.740 I think this is a very potent threat, don't you?

00:16:33.260 I do, and there needs to be accountability.

00:16:35.660 And what happens when you've got these U.S. senators that have been in there for so long

00:16:41.740 that they forget who they're really supposed to represent, their interests are no longer

00:16:46.480 serving the people, it's serve me, serve us to serve us.

00:16:51.940 And so it's no surprise that we're going to have these rhino senators oppose anything that 1.00

00:16:59.540 President Trump, anyone that President Trump nominates.

00:17:03.240 But here's what's very interesting, Roger, is that Rahm Emanuel gave a speech in Chicago

00:17:08.720 yesterday, and he gave several media interviews.

00:17:11.080 He was in town for Thanksgiving, and he had pretty harsh words for Democrats and for the

00:17:16.060 establishment.

00:17:16.920 And he said, you know, the Democratic Party used to be the party of the establishment.

00:17:20.180 But what we saw on November 5th is that Donald Trump represents the anti-establishment,

00:17:25.680 and that anti-establishment belief system is what the overwhelming majority of Americans

00:17:33.760 represent.

00:17:35.200 They are anti-establishment.

00:17:37.180 And so this flies completely contrary to what these establishment U.S., Republican U.S.

00:17:42.880 senators believe.

00:17:44.520 And so I think it's great that Elon Musk is going to target them, because the only way

00:17:48.080 to make a difference is to hold them accountable, put up strong primary challengers, and get some

00:17:52.620 funding behind them, and get them out of office.

00:18:00.520 Marshall, break.

00:18:01.460 And when we come back, Mark and I are going to interview David Schoen, one of the premier

00:18:06.740 criminal defense lawyers in the country, a man who very ably represented President Donald

00:18:12.340 Trump in one of the two impeachments, a lawyer who has specialized in civil rights, civil liberties,

00:18:17.980 ballot access issues, really, I think, one of the leading legal minds in the country.

00:18:25.040 Folks, only last week was the 61st anniversary of the murder of President John F. Kennedy in

00:18:32.960 the streets of Dallas.

00:18:34.680 If this is a historical issue that interests you, if you still wonder who really killed JFK

00:18:42.360 and why, well, let me recommend my book to you.

00:18:45.800 It is The Man Who Killed Kennedy, The Case Against LBJ.

00:18:51.180 This is a New York Times bestseller.

00:18:54.280 It is both heavily documented and heavily footnoted.

00:18:57.640 And in it, I make the case that JFK was murdered as a result of a, I hate this word, conspiracy

00:19:05.780 that involved not only the Central Intelligence Agency, organized crime, major financial interests,

00:19:14.140 the banks, big Texas oil, the FBI, and the Secret Service.

00:19:21.080 You can get your copy of The Man Who Killed Kennedy.

00:19:25.300 You can get a signed copy by going to themanwhokilledkennedy.com.

00:19:30.720 That's themanwhokilledkennedy.com.

00:19:33.520 Now, you could go to Amazon or Barnes & Noble or some other multinational corporation that

00:19:41.240 hates your guts and buy the book.

00:19:43.660 And if you do choose to go there, by the way, get the paperback because it has three additional

00:19:48.780 chapters.

00:19:49.960 But I would urge you to go to themanwhokilledkennedy.com.

00:19:54.640 And yes, I will personalize it for you if you wish.

00:19:59.620 So it's an excellent birthday or anniversary gift.

00:20:03.500 Or if there's a history or political buff in your family and they're interested in this

00:20:08.720 topic, which I think all Americans are still interested in, you can order your copy today.

00:20:14.420 Many thanks.

00:20:15.480 Mrs. Stone will be quite grateful.

00:20:18.000 We have to keep the lights on here at The Stone Zone.

00:20:20.580 All right.

00:20:21.780 Joining me now is one of the premier criminal defense attorneys in the country, David Schoen.

00:20:28.920 He is a sole practitioner, specializes in complex criminal and civil matters, has made a specialty

00:20:36.620 of civil rights, civil liberties, and ballot access issues.

00:20:41.540 Very ably represented President Donald Trump in one of the two impeachments.

00:20:46.280 You may remember him.

00:20:47.820 He was the lawyer on the Senate floor who showed that epic video of Democrat after Democrat after

00:20:54.720 Democrat calling for violence and insurrection.

00:20:58.940 David Schoen joins both Mark Vargas and I now in The Stone Zone.

00:21:04.740 Thank you very much for having me.

00:21:07.040 David, delighted to be back with you.

00:21:10.020 David did my 77 WABC radio show last week.

00:21:13.740 I'm happy to tell you it was the highest-rating show we have ever had in the history of the show,

00:21:20.680 both on Nielsen and also those listening online.

00:21:24.600 It was a great show.

00:21:27.300 We're going to cover some of the same ground here because the issues are very topical.

00:21:33.240 Last week, I believe it was, perhaps it was the week before,

00:21:36.180 the case against Donald Trump regarding the January 6th matter was dropped by special counsel

00:21:47.140 Jack Smith, but they dropped it in such a legal way that the case could later be revived.

00:21:56.080 I found this surprising.

00:21:57.740 David, can you walk us through this?

00:21:59.620 Sure, and you're absolutely right, and I think what's particularly surprising

00:22:03.060 is that that dismissal without prejudice, which means, as you say, they can bring it again,

00:22:09.200 potentially, was done on consent with President Trump's lawyers.

00:22:14.160 That struck me as particularly odd.

00:22:16.800 And my understanding is, you know, they felt they didn't want that additional battle,

00:22:21.740 but there really was nothing to it.

00:22:23.520 In other words, Jack Smith had to file a motion to dismiss.

00:22:27.700 It's the binding Justice Department policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted

00:22:33.860 or be subjected to the criminal process in any regard.

00:22:39.520 And that same goes for a president-elect under the Presidential Transition Act,

00:22:43.840 and the government has conceded that.

00:22:45.380 Jack Smith's team, a memo written by Molly Gaston, another dubious member of the so-called

00:22:52.420 Public Integrity Section in Washington, D.C.

00:22:55.180 I have a sanctions motion going against her for misleading a federal court.

00:23:00.240 But anyway, that's an aside.

00:23:02.620 Yeah, so theoretically, Jack Smith, and certainly it's his intention based on the making sure

00:23:09.860 that it was filed without prejudice, would like to bring this case again

00:23:13.180 after President Trump's term is finished.

00:23:16.600 Another option would have been to try to hold it in abeyance.

00:23:20.000 But the memo makes clear the Department of Justice policy reflected in a memo October 16, 2000,

00:23:26.180 and again this year reaffirming it, piggybacking on a memo in 1973,

00:23:30.760 it's clear that you cannot have these kinds of charges, criminal charges,

00:23:34.280 hanging over the head of the institution of the presidency.

00:23:36.820 It creates a stigma.

00:23:38.360 It's a distraction.

00:23:39.740 It's a separation of powers violation.

00:23:42.020 And so on.

00:23:43.860 So all the lawyers had to do was agree to the dismissal,

00:23:47.940 but then fight the issue of whether it's with prejudice or without.

00:23:50.840 There is a dangerous set of footnotes, 33 through 35, of the October 16, 2000 memo

00:23:56.460 that suggests that maybe they could bring it again

00:23:59.500 and that the statute of limitations would be told, frozen in time.

00:24:03.700 So, you know, given the attacks that we've seen from these folks over and over and over again

00:24:07.980 without merit, it's not hard to imagine that they would try that after four years.

00:24:11.920 It would have been worth it to try to fight against that.

00:24:15.940 An excellent analysis.

00:24:17.420 Mark, you have a question for Counselor Schoen.

00:24:22.160 Yeah.

00:24:22.620 You know, we're hearing, you know, the money wasted,

00:24:24.900 $30 million is what I've been reading on Jack Smith's fake investigations of President Donald Trump.

00:24:31.580 David, is there any mechanism in place to try and get that money back that was wasted?

00:24:38.060 I don't think there is.

00:24:39.500 I think that money is gone and the American people were cheated,

00:24:42.880 just as they've been cheated by all of the money spent on the Mueller investigation,

00:24:47.920 which, you know, Rogers certainly knows very well.

00:24:51.000 There was no basis for ever appointing special counsel in that case,

00:24:54.760 let alone having it run by someone like Andrew Weissman,

00:24:58.880 the single most ethically bankrupt prosecutor, in my opinion, that I've ever gone up against.

00:25:05.020 No way to justify the Jack Smith appointment.

00:25:08.620 Unfortunately, Merrick Garland, who, frankly, I had a case with when he was a judge.

00:25:13.340 I found him to be an excellent judge.

00:25:15.080 And I supported his appointment originally.

00:25:17.140 He turned out to be nothing more than a political hack, I'm very sorry to say.

00:25:21.400 And he really proved that point, by the way, if you didn't believe it beforehand,

00:25:25.080 when he claimed executive privilege allowed him to withhold the video of the Biden-Her interview.

00:25:33.060 There's no basis for executive privilege to apply to that whatsoever.

00:25:36.720 So you raise an important point.

00:25:38.780 A lot of taxpayer dollars wasted.

00:25:41.500 I would suggest to you, the Democratic Party doesn't think they were wasted

00:25:44.280 because they consider them to be PR expenses,

00:25:47.260 more attacks against Donald Trump that, frankly, were not successful.

00:25:51.400 based on the election results.

00:25:54.000 Yeah, in that particular matter, it occurs to me there is indeed a precedence.

00:25:58.760 When the existence of the White House recordings of President Richard Nixon became known,

00:26:05.900 Nixon moved in the courts claiming that those could not be released

00:26:09.060 because they were protected by executive privilege.

00:26:12.140 The Supreme Court ruled, I think, almost unanimously against him

00:26:15.860 in the course of the tapes were released, which ultimately brought down his presidency.

00:26:21.400 I'm not sure why the same principle would not apply here.

00:26:25.060 The idea that this recording by the special counsel of President Joe Biden

00:26:30.920 was protected by executive privilege seems to be,

00:26:34.140 would not stand up on the basis of that precedent, but then a non-lawyer.

00:26:39.660 But you're 100% right, Roger, and even more so.

00:26:41.880 There was no way in which Joe Biden thought he was speaking to anyone in a privileged manner.

00:26:46.720 He was being interviewed by a prosecutor looking to bring charges against him.

00:26:50.880 No way would that be privileged.

00:26:52.380 And Merrick Garland is just way off base.

00:26:55.000 Yeah, I see your point.

00:26:57.200 Here's another question, which I really hadn't focused on until our radio interview last Sunday.

00:27:04.200 As you know, Judge Cannon in Florida, in the 11th Circuit, dismissed the charges against Donald Trump

00:27:12.120 regarding the so-called documents case by claiming that the appointment of Jack Smith was unconstitutional.

00:27:20.200 She based that, based on my reading of her ruling, on the fact that Smith had never been confirmed by the U.S. Senate

00:27:27.220 to have these sweeping prosecutorial powers, that there is no provision in law for a special counsel.

00:27:37.640 There's no law that creates this position.

00:27:40.320 There's no budgeting to pay for what was a multimillion-dollar investigation.

00:27:46.900 And lastly, that no member of the executive branch can be unfireable by the chief executive.

00:27:54.920 That matter went to the 11th Circuit, where it was challenged by Jack Smith, and everybody

00:28:02.580 presumed it would ultimately go to the Supreme Court.

00:28:06.400 Now, while the case against the president has been dropped, the case against the two gentlemen charged as co-conspirators with him

00:28:16.820 has not been dropped.

00:28:18.940 And presumably, their lawyers, Stanley Woodward, a very able lawyer, represents one of them,

00:28:26.260 will raise this question, or the question will continue to be raised in the 11th Circuit.

00:28:33.360 And therefore, it would seem to me, regardless of how the circuit ultimately rules, I'm not

00:28:38.920 certain how that comes out, this still could end up before the Supreme Court.

00:28:43.620 And the whole question of the constitutionality of Smith's appointment, and therefore Robert

00:28:50.000 Mueller's appointment, could yet appear before the Supreme Court.

00:28:53.860 Is that analysis about right, David?

00:28:56.020 Yeah, but I wish when you would give the disclaimer that you're not a lawyer, you would explain that

00:28:59.520 what you mean is, you know, more than 99.9% of the lawyers out there.

00:29:04.680 No, it's an excellent description.

00:29:07.600 No, that's right.

00:29:08.380 I mean, look, I think as a practical matter, you will see, Jack Smith has resigned already.

00:29:13.660 I think you will see the case dismissed against all of them.

00:29:17.900 I think the current Justice Department will come in and do it.

00:29:20.200 And in a sense, you know, why not?

00:29:22.560 Because now the Trump administration will have a license to appoint a special counsel based on

00:29:27.480 the Democratic theory.

00:29:28.940 You know, an interesting twist on this, by the way, as you may well know, Hunter Biden's lawyer

00:29:33.660 filed a motion to dismiss one of the prosecutions against him based on this theory that the

00:29:38.860 appointment of the special counsel, Mr. Weiss, was unconstitutional.

00:29:43.580 He has a tougher road to hoe there, actually, because Weiss had been a U.S. attorney. 0.90

00:29:47.740 But still, the argument may well have prevailed.

00:29:50.720 But I think the case will be dismissed as a practical matter.

00:29:53.200 Jack Smith is gone.

00:29:54.300 There's nobody really to carry it through.

00:29:57.560 But theoretically, yes, it could end up before the United States Supreme Court as to those

00:30:03.280 remaining defendants, because the constitutionality of the appointment of the prosecutor who brought

00:30:09.040 the case against them, Jack Smith, would still be a live legal issue.

00:30:14.580 Mark Vargas, next question to you.

00:30:17.740 David, I mean, President Trump has been harassed for years, costing his businesses billions

00:30:22.740 of dollars, the character assassination, the money that he's had to personally spend on

00:30:28.900 legal fees.

00:30:30.840 Is there anything that President Trump could do legally to sort of fire back a counter lawsuit

00:30:37.720 for this harassment where Jack Smith can just say at the flip of a switch, OK, I'm filing

00:30:44.420 motions, investigations are over, pretend this never happened, just kidding.

00:30:50.560 Is there any legal mechanism that President Trump could use to fire back and push back

00:30:57.180 on these sorts of these targeted legal harassment cases?

00:31:01.420 Yeah, theoretically, there is a mechanism, especially if you could show the government's claims against

00:31:06.620 him were not substantially justified.

00:31:08.080 I think, you know, he may just well want to move on, although he's, you know, proven to be somewhat

00:31:14.340 aggressive with the lawsuits in the past.

00:31:17.740 But, you know, that would also mean going all through the discovery process.

00:31:21.280 And part of the reason we want these things to be over is because they are a distraction

00:31:25.260 to the presidency.

00:31:27.080 And, you know, this would mean potentially taking testimony from him and all of that.

00:31:31.440 So, yes, I think there is a mechanism.

00:31:34.100 I'm not sure it would prevail in this case, and I'm not sure that it's worth it as a practical

00:31:38.460 matter.

00:31:39.040 I'd like to see it and move on.

00:31:40.780 You know, that's easy to say because I'm not the person who's been under attack mercilessly,

00:31:45.220 not just for the last four years, but for eight years.

00:31:47.820 It started, you know, with the Mueller commission, as you well know.

00:31:50.640 And that was part of their strategy is Jerry Nadler famously said once, we can't rely on

00:31:55.980 the voters to get rid of Trump.

00:31:57.340 And so they try all of these extraneous methods and at taxpayer expense.

00:32:02.860 And, you know, the Trump haters cheer it on.

00:32:05.720 You have a shadow team of prosecutors, Norm Eisen, Donya Perry, Joyce Vance, Andrew Weissman

00:32:12.000 and others will make up these model prosecution memos.

00:32:15.060 We've never seen anything like it, frankly.

00:32:17.040 It's a disgrace.

00:32:18.480 And fortunately, the President Trump, the election went his way.

00:32:22.920 The American people, I believe, are fair minded.

00:32:25.180 And they were sick and fed up with this lawfare.

00:32:29.800 Let's switch, if we may, to the big news item, which transpired between the time you were

00:32:35.460 I interviewed you on Sunday and today.

00:32:37.600 That would be the pardon of Hunter Biden.

00:32:41.960 Now, this is kind of sensitive to me because people continue to go online and say, well,

00:32:47.120 Roger Stone and his wife evaded $2.3 million in taxes, but he was not prosecuted.

00:32:52.620 And this is unfair.

00:32:56.140 It proves that Hunter was politically prosecuted.

00:33:00.260 There are a number of substantial differences here.

00:33:02.320 First, I reported every penny of income to the IRS, and I accurately pointed all of my assets.

00:33:10.360 They brought a civil case against me simply based on my inability to pay.

00:33:14.540 I do owe the IRS $2 million, of which 75% is interest and penalties.

00:33:22.960 And this, by the way, are for my 2006 taxes because I'm current for every year from 2006 forward.

00:33:31.400 Also, every year since 2007, all 12 months a year, I have made payments to the IRS without

00:33:38.740 ever missing a payment or even being late with the payment.

00:33:43.260 And those payments over time have gone up depending on how well I'm doing, trying to make a living.

00:33:51.340 They've also gone down because of the Mueller investigation, which left my wife and I virtually

00:33:57.860 indigent, as I think you both know.

00:34:00.540 We lost our home.

00:34:01.920 I lost all my insurance.

00:34:04.060 I lost my car.

00:34:07.100 I had to sell my prized electric guitar.

00:34:10.080 That one really hurt me.

00:34:12.280 We really had no choice.

00:34:15.320 But when Hunter Biden's lawyers raised this question at trial, saying, well, Your Honor,

00:34:20.940 Roger Stone and his wife evaded, we evaded nothing.

00:34:24.680 And frankly, I'll probably be paying the IRS until the rest of my life.

00:34:28.880 Now, normally, in the offer and compromise system, you would be able to negotiate some

00:34:35.100 reduction in the interest or penalties.

00:34:38.800 The IRS has not been willing to do that.

00:34:42.840 The toll, we're almost at the toll period.

00:34:45.680 That's why these taxes would have extinguished.

00:34:49.680 And that's why we ultimately settled the matter.

00:34:53.820 But when Hunter Biden's lawyers brought this up in court in his case, the judge says, we

00:35:00.360 reviewed Stone's case.

00:35:01.660 This is the difference between apples and oranges.

00:35:04.900 I resent this idea that we evaded taxes.

00:35:07.960 It is false.

00:35:09.720 I resent the idea that we got some special break.

00:35:13.540 Yeah, we got a special break.

00:35:15.160 We will be paying for the rest of our lives.

00:35:17.540 Again, one quarter of the amount that I owe is actually past due tax.

00:35:22.680 The rest of it, almost all interest in penalties.

00:35:27.180 Sorry, gents, but I had to get that off my chest. 1.00

00:35:30.160 David, here's my question.

00:35:32.200 Why do you think they backdated Hunter Biden's pardon all the way back to 2014 during the period

00:35:40.040 that Joe Biden was vice president?

00:35:42.780 Well, I think why they backdated it is to protect Joe Biden.

00:35:48.680 I think it's to protect him with respect to the, and certainly Hunter Biden, with respect

00:35:54.060 to the Ukraine matters.

00:35:55.080 Remember, President Trump was impeached the first time around simply for asking for an

00:35:59.500 investigation, not a prosecution, an investigation of the dealings between Hunter Biden, Joe Biden,

00:36:05.500 and the Ukraine, and that getting rid of that special prosecutor with the Burisma case,

00:36:10.580 and so on.

00:36:11.280 So this matter, I think the only reason it goes back that far is to try to protect for this matter.

00:36:19.760 I think it could backfire because Hunter Biden no longer has a Fifth Amendment right with respect

00:36:24.540 to any federal charges related to that.

00:36:27.420 He's going to have to testify about Joe Biden's role in that matter if he's called upon to testify.

00:36:35.020 There are also potentially legal issues surrounding the validity of this pardon.

00:36:40.440 Before I get to that, I would say to you, just to piggyback on what you said about the apples

00:36:45.000 and oranges, you may well have seen that the federal judge in the tax case expressed outrage

00:36:50.320 in an order yesterday at the suggestion that there was unfair treatment, biased treatment

00:36:55.580 against Hunter Biden in the tax prosecution, to which, of course, you know, he pled guilty

00:37:00.520 to felony and misdemeanor counts.

00:37:02.960 That judge expressed outrage at the way Joe Biden handled the thing.

00:37:06.720 But what's also interesting about the validity of this broad, nonspecific pardon for crimes committed

00:37:14.280 or which may have been committed, so unknown crimes, meaning, quite frankly, that, you know,

00:37:20.900 as of November 30th, if Hunter Biden sold 10 kilos of heroin, as I have said before,

00:37:27.780 he's given a pardon for that for many federal charges, as long as it was before December

00:37:32.720 1st.

00:37:33.240 It's an 11-year, 10-year, 11-month broad pardon.

00:37:38.460 So some writers from, let's say, the Brookings Institute, for example, were Trump haters.

00:37:43.480 During the Trump or after the Trump administration and before the Trump administration, when they

00:37:48.580 saw him coming in, wrote articles talking about how he might Trump, President Trump, might

00:37:52.520 abuse the impeachment process, and there's a suggestion that a pardon which is done for

00:38:00.140 the purpose and with the intent in mind of protecting the president and his co-conspirators

00:38:05.000 might be an invalid pardon, drawing on early debates in the Constitution and so on.

00:38:10.160 So that's one potential defect in it.

00:38:12.500 And the other is whether it's valid to give a broad, nonspecific pardon to crimes that we

00:38:18.180 don't even know what you're talking about.

00:38:19.500 So it's interesting how it plays out.

00:38:22.020 But, you know, obviously, he gave a dozen interviews and so did his minions, and it

00:38:26.580 would never happen.

00:38:27.400 He believes in the justice system to come out with this kind of statement that he did,

00:38:31.520 the double standard, all of the things that have happened to Trump, he now claims have

00:38:34.960 happened to him, that the Justice Department has attacked him.

00:38:37.740 So in that sense, he supports President Trump, that it's a politically motivated Justice Department.

00:38:42.340 But, you know, he campaigned on calling President Trump convicted felon, which he's not.

00:38:46.480 There's never been any judgment entered in that case.

00:38:49.800 But anyway, all of this nonsense.

00:38:51.740 And now, you know, we see this very interesting article yesterday, by the way, to get a sense

00:38:56.020 of Hunter Biden by former mistress of his, who outlines the details, the drug use and all

00:39:03.380 of that kind of stuff going on.

00:39:04.760 It's a pitiful case.

00:39:05.560 But it's offensive that after, you know, suing people over the laptop and accusing the agents

00:39:11.140 of lying and misleading and so on, that now we're supposed to feel some sort of empathy

00:39:17.240 that he was the victim of this system.

00:39:20.100 He wasn't the victim.

00:39:22.420 Kind of interesting that Senator Joe Biden was the sponsor of the bill that provides the harsh

00:39:28.340 mandatory penalties for possession of a firearm while you're on drugs, which he is now, of

00:39:37.780 course, as you know, hundreds of thousands of African-Americans and other poor people have

00:39:42.920 been subjected to prosecution under that law.

00:39:45.820 But he's just pardoned his son for that very infraction.

00:39:50.080 I also saw another legal analysis that said that if there was an investigation, let's say,

00:39:55.660 into payments that Joe Biden or members of his family took during the time that he was

00:40:01.080 vice president, and therefore during a time in which he had no presidential immunity, that

00:40:06.580 Hunter Biden would have no choice if he were called to testify.

00:40:09.920 Because he's accepted this pardon, he would not be able to use a Fifth Amendment defense.

00:40:17.140 David, is that accurate?

00:40:18.620 Yes, it is.

00:40:19.400 And he could be charged with perjury or contempt if he refuses to.

00:40:23.260 Now, that's the downside of this kind of pardon.

00:40:26.740 And again, you know, those who didn't like President Trump wrote article after article

00:40:31.260 warning that, boy, it might be a good thing if he gives a full pardon to so-and-so,

00:40:36.400 because then they'll really have to testify.

00:40:38.840 I don't know if the House is inclined to go forward with inquiries about President Biden or not,

00:40:43.860 but if they are, Hunter will have to testify.

00:40:46.720 And I would warn this also, which is something I've argued vehemently against during the second

00:40:50.880 impeachment trial.

00:40:51.560 The Democratic Party's theory, the House managers put this in their brief, in the impeachment

00:40:56.480 brief, is that any former president can be impeached from time immemorial.

00:41:01.640 They could impeach Thomas Jefferson for holding slaves or any former president.

00:41:08.320 So Joe Biden is vulnerable to that, depending on if the House intends to make further inquiry,

00:41:14.420 or maybe they just want to move forward and let President Trump have his positive agenda to get

00:41:21.080 the country righted.

00:41:23.160 Yeah, very interesting question.

00:41:25.940 I don't know if you gentlemen saw this, but the trust fund baby congressman from Manhattan,

00:41:30.780 Dan Goldman, on CNN yesterday, said that Roger Stone blackmailed Donald Trump into giving him a pardon.

00:41:38.260 And that's a lie.

00:41:40.180 David, you represented me in the sentencing portion of my trial.

00:41:44.040 There is no evidence to support that whatsoever.

00:41:47.180 Hakeem Jeffries said it in a tweet.

00:41:49.220 I've saved that.

00:41:50.920 But unfortunately, both of them hide behind their congressional immunity.

00:41:54.960 So I have no ability to seek legal redress.

00:41:58.180 There's no evidence of that whatsoever.

00:42:01.800 In fact, after BuzzFeed sued the Justice Department to ultimately force them to disgorge

00:42:09.760 the last remaining redacted section of Robert Mueller's final report, he admitted that he'd found

00:42:18.180 no Russian collusion, no WikiLeaks collaboration on my part.

00:42:22.620 And he goes on to say that even if he had found such evidence, which he didn't,

00:42:26.600 he concluded it wouldn't have been a crime.

00:42:30.340 This idea that members of Congress can vilify private citizens, say anything they want,

00:42:36.180 and that they have no recourse because of their congressional immunity is particularly obnoxious.

00:42:42.040 So I, and this is, the story about this today is very simple.

00:42:46.180 Congressman Goldman, waive your congressional immunity.

00:42:50.260 Prove your defamatory claims in court.

00:42:53.380 Put up or shut up.

00:42:54.840 I don't think we'll be hearing anything more about that from Congressman Goldman.

00:43:00.100 It's an outrageous lie.

00:43:01.580 It's an outrageous lie.

00:43:02.800 I'm familiar, as you know, with the situation.

00:43:05.360 There's zero basis to it, less than zero basis.

00:43:08.240 And you wouldn't still command the respect that you do with the administration and the

00:43:12.940 friendship and all of that if there were any truth whatsoever to that.

00:43:16.720 It's not in you.

00:43:17.640 And it didn't happen.

00:43:19.540 And maybe there's an exception to the speech or debate clause, depending on the forum,

00:43:22.640 which he said it and context and all that.

00:43:24.560 But anyway, it's not worth your time to go after.

00:43:27.200 There's no basis to it.

00:43:28.160 It is interesting to me that, of course, after I was pardoned, Andrew Weissman, who you have

00:43:35.600 correctly identified as the most corrupt prosecutor in U.S. history, said Stone can still be grabbed,

00:43:42.720 dragged before a grand jury now to testify what he knows about Trump.

00:43:46.680 With all due respect, Mr. Weissman, you had three years to bring me for the grand jury.

00:43:51.480 You never did.

00:43:52.860 You conducted this investigation in secret, but constantly leaking it as a pressure tactic.

00:43:59.860 I could have been called to the grand jury at any time.

00:44:03.260 But if I were compelled to testify, I would have nothing to say.

00:44:07.760 I know of no misconduct whatsoever by Donald Trump.

00:44:11.940 There was no Russian collusion.

00:44:13.500 There was no coordination with WikiLeaks or any other crime that I'm aware of.

00:44:18.500 The whole thing is a canard.

00:44:20.820 People understand the purpose was to pressure me to testify falsely against the president,

00:44:26.920 and that I refused to do that.

00:44:29.040 I thank God that the president was able to see what was going on here,

00:44:33.340 that this was a baseless political persecution.

00:44:36.860 By the way, my testimony before the House Intelligence Committee was voluntary.

00:44:40.580 And for you to violate the False Statements Act, not only must your statement be willful,

00:44:46.720 it must be material, meaning it had to hide some underlying crime.

00:44:52.260 But Mr. Mueller could never identify any other underlying crime because there was none.

00:44:59.160 Those who say that Trump, now that he's in office, that he wants retribution, that he wants revenge,

00:45:07.900 I reject that idea.

00:45:10.140 I think what he wants is a recalibration, a rebalancing of the scales of justice.

00:45:15.260 We need to have one criminal justice system.

00:45:19.300 John Brennan, the CIA director, went before the U.S. Senate and lied under oath about him spying on a Senate committee

00:45:27.200 that was investigating his illegal use of torture, but he wasn't prosecuted.

00:45:32.700 James Comey lied under oath multiple times before the Congress regarding material matters.

00:45:40.020 Of course, he wasn't prosecuted.

00:45:42.100 Hillary Clinton, of all people, she lied under oath to Congress repeatedly, but she was never prosecuted.

00:45:50.340 Now, this isn't about revenge or retribution.

00:45:53.260 I think it's about a criminal justice system that is based in the rule of law.

00:45:59.740 It was interesting.

00:46:00.280 I saw an interview with Weissman the other day in which he said he wasn't worried about his own prosecution

00:46:05.580 because that would be decided by grand juries and by judges as if there is no evidence of malfeasance

00:46:13.600 or misconduct or illegality on his part.

00:46:16.900 Now, David, since he and his colleagues loved writing memos to the Justice Department outlining

00:46:23.020 the alleged crimes of Donald Trump, maybe you should take pen to paper and send the Justice Department

00:46:28.880 a memo regarding the alleged crimes of one Andrew Weissman, because they go all the way back to his days

00:46:35.120 as a prosecutor in Brooklyn in which he covered up mob murders by Sammy the Bull.

00:46:40.620 And then, of course, when he suppressed exculpatory evidence and had other misconduct in the Enron case,

00:46:49.400 in the case against Arthur Anderson, in the case against Merrill Lynch.

00:46:53.380 He also famously, when the cell phones of the Mueller prosecutors were subpoenaed by Special Counsel John Durham,

00:47:02.700 he destroyed evidence.

00:47:04.100 That's obstruction of justice, I believe.

00:47:07.060 There we have two systems of justice here in the country.

00:47:11.320 Mark, let me give you, I just want to interrupt one second.

00:47:13.900 Let me give you one example so your viewers and listeners know just how far back this goes

00:47:18.240 and how disgusting it is. 0.68

00:47:22.620 Andrew Weissman, back in the 90s, was a prosecutor in a mob case in which a corrupt FBI agent

00:47:28.780 was later charged with murders on behalf of the mob he had picked aside in the Colombo War and so on.

00:47:34.320 Of all of the prosecutors in the case, Chief Judge Sifton singled out one, Andrew Weissman,

00:47:40.120 for a suggestion that he should be taken to the bar for his, what he called,

00:47:43.480 myopic view of his ethical obligations and discovery obligations.

00:47:47.700 The U.S. attorney for the Eastern District at that time intervened,

00:47:50.820 wrote a letter to the judge asking him to remove Weissman's name from the order,

00:47:55.540 and the judge complied.

00:47:56.780 I have a copy of both orders and the letter.

00:47:59.360 I've never heard of anything like that in my life,

00:48:01.780 and Weissman took it clearly as license to do what he has done since then.

00:48:05.740 Yeah, it is, his public comments are kind of beyond belief,

00:48:12.420 but he and his friend Norm Eisen seemed to be very, very upset about something.

00:48:16.740 And then I saw Jake Sullivan.

00:48:18.720 Now, I remember very specifically, Jake Sullivan was well aware of the fact

00:48:23.880 that the claim that Donald Trump had a computer terminal at Trump Tower

00:48:28.140 that was directly connected to a Russian bank,

00:48:31.140 and that he told Hillary Clinton that she could go ahead and say that publicly,

00:48:34.460 he knew that was false at the time, yet he has paid no penalty for that at all.

00:48:41.020 Roger, with the Hunter Biden matter,

00:48:43.060 they enlisted the services of former intelligence officers

00:48:46.600 who we had held up as credible leaders in the intelligence community

00:48:50.140 to say that the laptop was part of a Russian hoax

00:48:54.000 and Russian intelligence effort and all of that.

00:48:57.940 That's extraordinary.

00:48:58.960 That should never happen again.

00:49:00.100 And when you say President Trump now wants to, not vengeance,

00:49:03.860 but wants to sort of right the ship, you know, that's what's required.

00:49:07.540 We've never seen anything like this.

00:49:09.240 And you mentioned that Hillary Clinton got a pass.

00:49:11.240 Your viewers and listeners should know that Robert Mueller was working for the law firm

00:49:15.760 that represented Hillary Clinton, and a member of his staff was her personal attorney.

00:49:19.960 Yeah, that's, by the way, the same woman who was the chief prosecutor in my case.

00:49:27.040 When Robert Mueller was brought before the House, he actually said he didn't know that.

00:49:30.780 He was unaware of the fact that his law firm had represented Hillary Clinton.

00:49:35.820 How likely is that?

00:49:37.880 Every prosecutor in my case had previously worked for the Clintons in another incarnation,

00:49:43.240 every single one of them.

00:49:44.720 But we expected them to be unbiased prosecutors.

00:49:49.320 Mark, your final thoughts on this legal issue, and then we'll get, let David go,

00:49:53.820 and we'll talk a little bit more politics.

00:49:55.980 Final thought.

00:49:57.460 You know what, David, it's laughable that Joe Biden now is claiming a selective,

00:50:02.080 you know, prosecution of his son Hunter.

00:50:04.200 But I just want to ask you just one quick question.

00:50:06.120 You know, Supreme Court Justice Stephen Breyer said that these uncontrolled prosecutors

00:50:10.520 are a threat to the separation of powers, as brilliant as our founding fathers were.

00:50:14.960 They never envisioned these out-of-control prosecutors and special counsels to have this

00:50:19.920 sort of, this much unbridled power.

00:50:22.120 Is there anything we could do in the Trump administration in having control of both chambers?

00:50:25.900 Is there any language that we could put together or any mechanisms in place to at least rein this

00:50:31.700 in and balance things out a little bit?

00:50:33.940 It's a great question.

00:50:34.860 You know, one of the great justices of all time, Robert Jackson, wrote a very important article,

00:50:38.960 became a speech about the danger of the rogue prosecutor.

00:50:43.200 I think that what Congress can do with the prosecutors is to really impose greater sanctions

00:50:50.780 for misconduct.

00:50:51.880 Literally, I've had a sanctions motion pending for now maybe two years against these folks,

00:50:57.460 J.P. Cooney, Molly Gaston, and another woman from that public integrity section,

00:51:02.780 for literally lying to a federal judge to get a lawyer's email records and so on.

00:51:07.940 There have to be more teeth, more of a disincentive from prosecutors for overreaching. 0.90

00:51:13.120 We've seen too many cases now in which that's really ruined lives and so on.

00:51:18.240 We're going to see now, as this thing, by the way, pans out in Georgia, since Fannie Willis,

00:51:23.060 apparently the office lied and said there were no communications with the House January 6th

00:51:27.860 Committee, Benny Thompson, or with Jack Smith, and Jim Jordan came up with a letter from 2021

00:51:33.480 in which Fannie Lewis asked for assistance from Benny Thompson.

00:51:37.800 We're going to see how that plays out now in terms of, you know, rogue prosecutors.

00:51:44.640 Absolutely fascinating.

00:51:46.880 All right.

00:51:47.420 I think we're going to leave it there.

00:51:48.900 I guess on that final note, David, will the Georgia case ultimately be dismissed, in your opinion?

00:51:56.840 It has to be.

00:51:57.620 It has to be dismissed.

00:51:58.800 The prosecutor may try to hold it in abeyance, but for the same reasons underlying the Justice

00:52:03.140 Department memo, all of the distractions that it causes, separation of powers issue,

00:52:07.860 the supremacy clause issue, and so on, supremacy clause issue, it has to be dismissed, finished with.

00:52:14.760 It's even a simpler case than the New York case, and it ought to be done now.

00:52:19.120 Listen, I'm glad they're getting this other information, meanwhile, and showing that the

00:52:23.120 lies, but the case has to be dismissed.

00:52:26.040 All of this has to be put behind them.

00:52:29.080 I guess that leads to one other final question, and that is, we still have pending the Alvin

00:52:34.740 Bragg case, the so-called hush money case in New York, which the president has, I think,

00:52:40.880 unjustly been found guilty.

00:52:42.780 As I understand it, he cannot appeal the case until he's sentenced, and sentencing has been

00:52:48.960 postponed.

00:52:50.480 This is another case that I think just personally ought to be dismissed, but how do you think

00:52:55.480 this plays out?

00:52:56.920 Has to be dismissed.

00:52:58.140 I'm afraid, though, knowing Judge Merchant, as I do, that he's going to go, remember, the

00:53:02.020 prosecution in that case now has said, well, okay, let's hold it in abeyance during the

00:53:06.360 four years, have it hanging over the president's head, and stop it now, hold it in abeyance.

00:53:11.400 On Monday, this past Monday, President Trump's lawyers filed a motion to dismiss, recounting

00:53:17.500 some of the previous arguments, but the main focus is to be on the election immunity, the

00:53:22.380 immunity that arises from him being now president-elect and soon to be the sitting president.

00:53:27.120 I think that Judge Merchant, given his record in the past, will probably go with the prosecution,

00:53:32.180 agree that it should be held in abeyance.

00:53:33.700 At that point, it is 100% true that the underlying conviction can't be appealed until there's

00:53:38.760 a judgment entered.

00:53:39.880 Judgment isn't entered until there's a sentencing.

00:53:41.760 But I believe there can be interlocutory appeals of the immunity rulings in the case, for the

00:53:47.260 case to be dismissed and eventually could be taken to federal court over it, may end up

00:53:50.640 in the Supreme Court over it.

00:53:52.200 Or, President Trump could agree to waive his immunity, get sentenced, and then appeal the

00:53:56.820 entire conviction.

00:53:57.700 I worry about any implications for that for any other claim of immunity, but there are

00:54:02.680 a lot of options out there.

00:54:04.040 I'm not positive that Judge Merchant will do the right thing for now, but eventually that

00:54:08.780 case will have to be dismissed.

00:54:11.220 All right.

00:54:11.960 We're going to leave it there.

00:54:13.420 Let me thank our guest, David Schoen, criminal justice, pardon me, criminal defense lawyer

00:54:19.260 par excellence, one of the guys I go to for the very best legal analysis in the country.

00:54:25.020 As I said, our show on 77 WABC last weekend, the highest rating show I've had since President

00:54:32.500 Trump.

00:54:32.900 He's the only one who beat your ratings, David.

00:54:35.160 We're very proud to call you a friend and to have you on the show.

00:54:38.440 Thanks for joining us.

00:54:39.680 Thank you very much, both of you.

00:54:41.880 All right, Mark, let's talk for a moment about the Illinois Review.

00:54:45.960 Where can people go to follow some of your great independent journalism?

00:54:49.940 Thank you, Roger.

00:54:51.920 Well, on Facebook, Illinois Review, on X, Illinois Review, and IllinoisReview.com, the largest

00:54:58.840 conservative pro-Trump, pro-MAGA news publication in Illinois and in the Midwest.

00:55:05.840 All right.

00:55:07.120 I want to thank Mark Vargas for dropping in with us today and filling in for Troy Smith,

00:55:13.060 who's not feeling all that well today.

00:55:16.220 I want to remind you folks that you can go to the app on your phone and download the

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00:55:24.060 And when you do, you go to rumble.com slash Roger Stone, hit that little follow button

00:55:33.020 up there in the corner, and then set a notification.

00:55:35.940 You have several opportunities to see us here at the Stone Zone.

00:55:39.060 You can see us at 4 o'clock Central at worldviewtube.com.

00:55:45.540 That's 5 o'clock Eastern, or later at 8 p.m. by going to rumble at rumble.com slash Roger Stone.

00:55:54.220 There it is once again.

00:55:55.840 Until tomorrow, my thanks to Mark Vargas for joining us here in the Stone Zone.

00:56:00.480 God bless you, and Godspeed.

00:56:02.720 We'll see you tomorrow.

00:56:03.640 A man who's gone through hell, but he's kept going, and he's smart, and he's strong,

00:56:10.920 and people love him.

00:56:12.980 Not everybody, but people love him and respect him.

00:56:15.440 Roger Stone.

00:56:16.500 Where's Roger Stone?

00:56:17.600 Roger Stone.

00:56:22.920 Yeah.

00:56:23.080 I'm

00:56:23.540 I'm

00:56:24.040 I'm

00:56:26.520 I'm

00:56:26.800 I'm

00:56:28.520 I'm

00:56:29.840 Okay.

00:56:30.020 I'm

00:56:30.640 I'm

00:56:31.340 Okay.

00:56:31.920 I'm

00:56:34.280 I'm

00:56:35.060 You

00:56:36.160 I'm

The StoneZONE with Roger Stone - December 04, 2024

Will the Deep State Still Try to Prosecute Donald Trump？ w⧸ David Schoen

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