The Tucker Carlson Show - Breaking News： Israel Shuts Down Christ’s Resurrection Site. Bishop Strickland & Tucker Respond.

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00:00:30.000 bishop strickland thank you so much for doing this what do you make of the closure of the

00:00:40.160 church of the holy sepulcher by israeli authorities on palm sunday well really tucker um i probably

00:00:48.860 some things have developed even since the last thing i saw but it looked like they were deciding

00:00:53.700 to open it after all or whatever um to me really tucker this comes down to a consequence of

00:01:01.500 the the evil that we see that we're witnessing um and i think we need to pay attention to it

00:01:08.600 in that context as we already discussed the the large-scale destruction of civilian life

00:01:17.740 is never morally justifiable by any nation, by any entity, for any reason. It's just not.

00:01:25.700 And to me, the closure of the Holy Sepulchre, the holy side for us, there's so many in the holy

00:01:32.860 land, but the closure of that and not allowing the procession of Palm Sunday is a tragic

00:01:41.220 consequence of just how far off the mark really the world is at this point in so many ways and

00:01:48.720 what's going on there we must speak calmly lovingly clearly that no we can't allow this and

00:01:59.180 the closure to me is just one of many tragic consequences where um the this has to be addressed

00:02:10.480 and we've got to keep going back to that principle

00:02:14.080 that the large-scale destruction of civilian life

00:02:18.700 can never be morally justified.

00:02:22.640 Amen.

00:02:23.480 And I'm glad to hear at least one religious leader

00:02:26.500 in the United States say that so clearly.

00:02:28.200 I think that any believing Christian would agree with that

00:02:31.260 as a foundational part of the faith,

00:02:35.020 but you're hearing just the opposite.

00:02:37.800 And I want to ask about that in just a minute,

00:02:39.200 But you don't seem like you believe that the Church of the Holy Sepulchre was closed for, quote, safety reasons.

00:02:49.500 Well, I really don't know, Tucker.

00:02:53.120 And maybe for some, making those decisions, that's the reason.

00:02:57.820 But why would it be judged to be a place that is unsafe because of this chaos that surrounds it?

00:03:07.740 So, like I said, I think it's a consequence of everything we're seeing, which is immoral and is destructive to humanity in very significant ways.

00:03:22.220 you're a man of history and we all need to be people of history and if we look at history

00:03:29.180 these days will be marked in history as a very devastating time similar to things that we can

00:03:38.400 look back in the last 100 years 200 2000 years that when these kind of moral

00:03:47.440 um aberrations begin to just take over we need to speak up and i really don't know um the motivation

00:03:58.980 for the closure of the holy sepulcher i mean i can surmise a lot of things

00:04:04.320 they the the possible reopening or partial that i've heard about i don't know if even that's

00:04:11.060 accurate that's part of i know what you're fighting and what we're all fighting is

00:04:15.720 so much misinformation so many false messages it's really hard to know what what is yes and

00:04:22.960 that's why i think it's so important and i will be a broken record repeating we can never justify

00:04:29.840 the large-scale destruction and devastation of civilian life um as morally justifiable we can't

00:04:38.840 do that and i think we have to keep going back to that home base with all the chaos that we're

00:04:45.280 all dealing with i i think one of the things that we can say is that christianity targeted or not

00:04:54.440 the core tense of christianity whether on purpose or not is often in the crosshairs we know that

00:05:01.500 i believe talking to people in jerusalem this morning that there were no synagogues completely

00:05:06.500 closed um and we know that the church the holy sepulchre was not closed during the last two

00:05:12.560 world wars. We know that the idea was to have a Catholic leader and three others in there for a

00:05:19.980 live stream service, and that was banned. So it's hard to understand how this was done for safety

00:05:26.340 reasons. And moreover, I wasn't aware that the government, the secular government of Israel,

00:05:31.340 owned the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, or by the way, the Dome of the Rock, or any other

00:05:38.700 religious building owned by someone else in East Jerusalem? I mean, where does this authority come

00:05:45.180 from that you can just close someone else's church? Well, I don't think it is true authority.

00:05:53.300 And it's basically totalitarian saying, we've got the power, we've got the bombs,

00:06:03.120 We can do what we want. And that is, again, as we look at history and we look at this moment, that is about as scary as it gets to have that attitude.

00:06:17.120 And sadly, we're seeing that attitude.

00:06:20.640 We are the ones with the power, so we are the ones calling the shots.

00:06:25.660 Forget what is moral, forget what is true, forget what has historic precedent.

00:06:33.980 I mean, I'm sure both of us, for several years now, I get tired of the word unprecedented

00:06:41.500 because we hear it all the time.

00:06:43.280 But we're living in unprecedented times.

00:06:46.540 For all the more reason, we need to go back to foundational pillars of life and faith.

00:06:54.380 Of course, as a Catholic bishop, Jesus Christ is that pillar that we keep returning to,

00:07:01.620 listening to him, looking at the model of his life, which flies in the face of anything violent.

00:07:08.980 And that doesn't mean that he was not addressing the terrible issues of his stuff.

00:07:16.580 I mean, you mentioned, you used the phrase in the crosshairs, cross is where Jesus Christ

00:07:23.760 died.

00:07:25.320 And ironically, Tucker, and I'm sure it isn't lost on you, that in my experience as a bishop

00:07:33.180 and a priest. Holy Week is always a time where things are in the crosshairs, and it's different

00:07:41.740 issues and different situations historically, but there's something about Holy Week that calls us

00:07:48.300 back to who is Jesus Christ? Do we believe him or not? And if we do, we must morally be guided

00:07:57.480 by his light. We must. It suggests that there's something else going on here,

00:08:05.560 perhaps influenced by the spiritual war ongoing around us, that Christians would be the target, 0.52

00:08:11.180 since it is, at its core, a religion that opposes violence against innocence and the destruction

00:08:17.880 of innocence. And so here, I mean, a totalitarian regime, at least as you think of it in your mind,

00:08:24.260 or I do, targets violence against its enemies, the threats.

00:08:30.040 There's nothing less threatening than four Christian clergymen standing in an empty church 1.00

00:08:36.100 live-streaming the sacraments, but they went after those guys.

00:08:41.860 So what does that tell you of all the enemies?

00:08:45.780 Why are they in a threat?

00:08:46.340 Really, Tucker, what it tells me is that truth is threatening.

00:08:54.260 And if you think about the drama of Holy Week, which we in the Catholic faith are in the midst of, when Jesus Christ is before Pilate, and that is historic reality for whatever your faith perspective, this Jesus of Nazareth stood before Pilate, the leader of the Roman Empire that was stationed there in Jerusalem.

00:09:19.020 And Pilate says, what is truth?

00:09:22.520 And the mob that was there, Pilate himself, everyone was threatened by this Jesus who we know, we believe, is truth incarnate.

00:09:36.680 He is the truth.

00:09:37.860 And as he's standing there, really, Tucker, I think that is what's threatening.

00:09:43.080 To those who are not living by the truth and humbly seeking the truth, which we all have to do, I don't claim to have it all figured out, but I look to Christ because he is the truth.

00:09:54.080 For those who are promoting all of these things, closure of holy sites and attack of innocent people, they are definitely threatened by the truth, not by some propaganda, but by the real truth.

00:10:11.780 they find it threatening and to me that really what Cardinal Pizzaballa and the others were

00:10:17.940 going to try to do just a live stream very small scale really that was threatening because it's

00:10:25.260 about proclaiming truth that really begins to cause people of good hearts whether they have

00:10:34.980 faith or not, it causes the human instinct to say, wait a minute, what's going on? When they hear

00:10:42.460 truth, that is disruptive, not in a violent way, but just because truth cuts through it all.

00:10:51.300 That's what they're afraid of. I truly believe that. So we're still in the middle of Lent,

00:10:56.380 inching closer and closer to Holy Week, the days leading up to Easter, when we are called to walk

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00:13:03.660 somebody else does. One of the truths that seems the most threatening is that violence is not the

00:13:09.920 answer. And so the... I'm sorry? Well, the power of the world isn't the answer. That is what

00:13:21.560 threatens them, and that's what they don't want to get into the hearts and minds of just everyday

00:13:29.380 people. They don't want that word to get out there that war isn't the answer. Sometimes it,

00:13:36.580 I mean, the church, the Catholic church has a doctrine of justifiable war, which is pretty 0.99

00:13:43.720 strict and pretty clear, and probably very few wars have qualified. And there's serious questions

00:13:52.340 about this war. I think it's pretty much unqualified. But that's what we have to keep

00:13:58.520 looking at. Look at the principles. And really, Tucker, what I would encourage your viewers and

00:14:04.380 all of us, I mean, I'm just one of the viewers in many situations. I'm a bishop who doesn't even

00:14:10.320 have a diocese anymore, but I do have an apostolic call that I take very seriously. And I say to

00:14:16.840 myself, to you, Tucker, as a good man seeking truth, and all of us who are in this, we need

00:14:23.820 to take a breath, we need to calm our hearts, and we need to simply seek the truth. I believe,

00:14:31.800 and I feel compelled to proclaim to the world, we know the truth. The truth sets us free. It's

00:14:39.600 Jesus Christ. And certainly that was the threat that the Romans and the Jewish leaders wanted to 0.97

00:14:47.440 get rid of. That's historic reality. They plotted to rid themselves of this truth problem. And in

00:14:56.300 many ways, we see the same thing repeated. I mean, it gets masked in a lot of ways, but

00:15:02.140 And I pray daily for the leaders of the world, for every nation, for leaders who have the power and the responsibility in this moment to go back to those basic principles.

00:15:16.400 They need to take a deep breath and ask themselves, is this true, what I'm promoting, what I'm doing?

00:15:25.080 Is it about the truth that sets us free?

00:15:28.960 And when we ignore the truth, that is when we are the most bound by violence and evil.

00:15:36.180 And we're seeing it played out in our lifetime right in these moments on the TV screen, on

00:15:43.000 our phone screens, on the airwaves.

00:15:46.600 We're seeing ignoring truth has consequences, and it comes down to each of us individually.

00:15:53.140 when we ignored the truth that I am a sinful man who needs to repent and I need to seek the life

00:16:00.480 that is Jesus Christ when we try to to hide that to ignore it to eliminate it it doesn't go away

00:16:08.820 it will not be eliminated any more than killing Jesus Christ on a cross in the first century

00:16:16.480 eliminated the truth that he is truth will not be eliminated but a lot of innocence can be harmed

00:16:24.720 when we think we can avoid the truth and do it our way and do it with our power when we go down

00:16:33.740 that path it's destructive in so many ways even to those individuals that are doing it but the

00:16:40.540 tragedy is there's so many innocents that get lost in it that we must speak against innocent lives

00:16:49.560 being just you the the term is collateral damage but that in itself says we have to be very careful

00:17:00.360 about allowing our hearts to hearten that we just use terminology for innocents dying oh they're

00:17:07.940 just collateral damage. May I ask you to go back for a second as a Protestant myself who's often

00:17:15.860 heard the term just war theory, which I think derives from Augustine, but I could be wrong.

00:17:22.480 Can you summarize that for people who aren't familiar with what it is just in broad terms?

00:17:28.700 What's a justified war? Well, there are four basic points that I can't claim that I can get

00:17:35.500 all of them as you know it's it's pretty simple most of the time the truth is pretty simple

00:17:41.000 but it has to be the just for theory is based on if war which should be avoided if at all possible

00:17:49.920 if it is to be justified it has to be proportionate it has to be now it can't be preemptive it it

00:17:58.500 It really, Tucker, goes back in a lot of ways to the right to self-defense, the right to self-defense of one person, the right to self-defense of a nation.

00:18:11.360 That is really the core of the just war theory.

00:18:15.120 It has to be a real threat, not a perceived threat, not a future threat, but a real threat.

00:18:21.740 It has to be in proportion.

00:18:23.140 i mean you know putting it on the the just person to person context i mean somebody slaps you

00:18:31.800 you don't shoot them that is not proportional yes it has to avoid harming um innocents that are

00:18:41.380 really have nothing to do with whatever the conflict is in any direct way um and and so

00:18:47.660 those basic points are what you have to look at. It has to be, it has to have a reasonable

00:18:55.040 expectation of success, that this will accomplish the protection of innocence that it should be

00:19:04.280 about. Those points are what we have to keep looking at. And like I said,

00:19:10.620 there probably aren't many wars in human history that would qualify as meeting all the criteria.

00:19:20.300 Some meet more than others. But I don't know that this present conflict, they're not even

00:19:25.340 calling it a war. And I think that tells us something. But this present conflict, I don't

00:19:31.640 know that it qualifies on any of those points. Because yes, there was some threat there, but

00:19:37.800 But was it justifiable to immediately address that threat, which seemed to be a future threat that may have been very real?

00:19:49.880 I don't claim to know all of that, but I think the leaders are challenged to really look more deeply at that.

00:19:57.660 And certainly the idea of protecting innocence, honestly, I mean, and again, I haven't been in any war rooms or heard the real discussion, but it seems and what we're seeing, it's like we can expect and we can plan for the collateral damage, which should be always stated as we can plan for innocence to die because of this action.

00:20:27.660 Because that's what collateral damage really is talking about.

00:20:32.420 So that, I think, is a reasonable, probably not the most scholarly exposition of the just war theory.

00:20:42.180 But those are the basic points.

00:20:44.340 And again, if people say, oh, it gets too complicated, just think about defending yourself, defending your home, defending your family.

00:20:52.900 You can't go out and, you know, you have a neighbor that's talking crazy and go and put a bomb in their front yard. I mean, that's not proportionate. That is not reasonable. And it has to be something that is a reasonable.

00:21:08.440 And I think one of the greatest points of the Just War Theory, is it likely to be successful? 0.70

00:21:18.720 Is it likely to have an outcome that brings more peace, more protection, not just to the individuals that you're specifically responsible for, but brings it to the world?

00:21:30.220 And so I think that we've got to honestly assess what is happening and acknowledge that no nation seems to be really, and I love the United States.

00:21:44.000 I was raised as a patriotic kid. I still believe in a lot of the principles, but when we lose sight of the basic principles of our founding as a nation or as of our faith of Christianity or whatever our faith is, those basic principles have to guide us.

00:22:03.120 And we can't allow popular opinion or political agendas to override those basic moral values that should be the pillars that found us, that stabilize everything that is shaking in the world today.

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00:24:20.000 worth it so this morning the president of the united states whom i campaigned for and defended

00:24:29.100 daily for 11 years not attacking him but he issued a statement um threatening to destroy

00:24:37.420 the civilian infrastructure of iran including the desalinization plants and energy grid

00:24:41.680 of iran and that seems to be a threat against innocence i don't know any other way to read it

00:24:48.260 how would you assess that?

00:24:52.940 Is that consistent with a just war?

00:24:56.300 No.

00:24:57.040 And as you said, Tucker,

00:24:58.960 we have to acknowledge that it is,

00:25:03.840 to directly do that is wrong, is immoral.

00:25:08.500 Going back to that basic principle I started with,

00:25:12.060 And anytime civilian life is devastated, it's not morally, it's not done morally.

00:25:22.720 It's not something we can just turn a blind eye and say, well, we got to do this.

00:25:28.420 The large scale destruction of civilian life is never morally justified.

00:25:34.520 Like I said, if I'm a broken record making that point, I believe I need to be because the more I think about that, the more I pray about that, the more I look at what's happening, it says, let's put a stop to this.

00:25:50.660 Let's pull back from this.

00:25:53.740 And I understand from what I see in the news that there are efforts of talking about some sort of solutions.

00:26:02.160 But the talk seems to always have much less focus and much less power behind it than the bombs and the destructive forces.

00:26:15.000 I guess that is, you know, by human nature, maybe that's somewhat natural that when you've got the power, it's hard to restrain yourself from using it.

00:26:26.200 We see that played out in so many ways.

00:26:28.520 But that is where the moral values have to kick in for the individual man or the individual nation and the leader that is a man or a group of men and women that are leading a nation.

00:26:44.760 They need to constantly go back to those principles and asking themselves, is this justifiable?

00:26:52.280 Is this something that is moral to do?

00:26:54.640 And if it's not moral, then we should just put up a big, bright red stop sign and say, we're not going to do this because it is morally questionable, much less clearly immoral.

00:27:09.500 And when we go down the path of saying, well, we've got to do some immoral things, I mean, it's like the end justifies the means.

00:27:17.660 I mean, some basic principles of philosophical, logical thought that have guided nations and individuals through history.

00:27:27.920 You know, if we get on a path where we say the end justifies the means, then the means can become so immoral that it's just devastating for not just the individuals or the nations involved, but for all of humanity.

00:27:45.300 We've got to be very cautious about going down that path.

00:27:50.560 And I'm afraid that many of the things that we've seen have crossed that line of just

00:27:57.720 saying, we believe, yeah, this is evil.

00:28:01.340 Okay, it's evil, but we've got to do it for the good end.

00:28:05.760 That is very dangerous territory.

00:28:09.980 Also common, I think.

00:28:11.840 I mean, people, as you said, who have power tend to misuse it, an often noted phenomenon,

00:28:17.760 because it's true. What's different, at least in my lifetime, is seeing self-described Christian 0.56

00:28:24.360 leaders not only defend violence, but attack anyone who questions its use, and then use the

00:28:32.400 Bible to justify it. So I guess what I'm saying is one of the battles here is over what Christianity

00:28:38.640 is as a faith. And that seems to me a very important battle, certainly a conversation.

00:28:45.160 So what you're seeing some Christian leaders do is say, well, there's violence throughout the Bible

00:28:50.440 and God justifies it in some cases, defends it through what the Christians call the Old Testament

00:28:57.340 from beginning to end, there's violence against innocence. So it's therefore okay. What is your

00:29:03.780 response to that? Well, Tucker, quite simply, probably not surprising, my response is Jesus

00:29:13.360 Christ. If we claim, which I do, and I do my best, I mean, I'm a sinner, I mess up all the time.

00:29:21.500 We do individually, if we're smart enough to be humble enough to acknowledge that.

00:29:25.940 We as nations and we as individuals, we get off the mark, we mess up, but we can always

00:29:31.880 repent of that and seek again to follow the truth that is Christ. And that's the distinction that I

00:29:39.100 would make. If people are calling themselves Christians, we are of the body of Christ that

00:29:45.260 is his church. And we have to look to him. Yes, in the Old Testament, there are many examples of

00:29:54.020 destructive power, but that is not the world that we live in. We believe that Jesus Christ

00:30:01.960 has redeemed everything. And one of the key points of Jesus Christ, and St. Paul says it

00:30:10.540 very well, we are neither Greek nor Roman. We are not individual nations. We are Christian.

00:30:18.420 and to use Christianity as a weapon against one part of his body to another part of his body,

00:30:27.320 that's a misuse of the message of Jesus Christ. If we look to him, I mean, he died on the cross

00:30:35.660 because he embraced that freely as a man and as the son of God, but he was willing to do that.

00:30:45.300 He was willing to personally receive the greatest violence of destroying his body and his human life for the sake of the peace that he brings.

00:30:59.080 And if we look to Jesus Christ, we can't justify the violence that we're seeing.

00:31:07.400 You can hearken back to the Old Testament.

00:31:09.640 But if you believe Jesus Christ is the new covenant, that he, I mean, he came out of that world of the Old Testament.

00:31:18.820 He is of Hebrew origin, and we should embrace that absolutely.

00:31:25.440 That is historical reality.

00:31:27.520 But he came to bring a new covenant and to bring a redemption of all of that.

00:31:33.280 And just one example of what Christ, if we look to Christ, he's often saying, yes, we used to do this, but this is the new way that through the Father sending me to you is being revealed.

00:31:49.940 It used to be an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.

00:31:53.280 That cannot be that way with us.

00:31:55.900 He says to his disciples, and we have to really listen to that.

00:32:00.980 We may not like listening to Christ himself, but that is what we're called to, especially if we call ourselves Christian.

00:32:12.060 That is probably, as you point out, Tucker, one of the greatest issues that we have to face now, because there are many non-Christians in the world. 1.00

00:32:21.780 And for Christianity to be really co-opted and hijacked in the way that we're seeing is destructive to the message of truth that is Jesus Christ.

00:32:36.600 Because I can imagine people saying, well, if this is what Christianity is really all about, I've considered it, but I'm not going to even look at Christianity if that's what it's about.

00:32:49.100 It's not what it's about.

00:32:50.600 But when voices are saying, we can, again, going back to that basic idea of we can destroy civilians violently and in drastic ways and say that it's moral because we're claiming to be Christian, that's nonsensical.

00:33:12.480 And it's as offensive to Christ himself as anything could be.

00:33:19.260 He is a man of peace.

00:33:21.760 And that, it doesn't mean just let yourself be run over.

00:33:27.340 But real peace is about respecting our lives and the lives of others

00:33:34.780 and always seeking without violence to embrace the truth that sets us free.

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00:35:00.220 It does seem like this is an effort to co-opt Christianity and change the world's understanding 0.95

00:35:08.380 of Jesus, and it seems like Holy Week maybe is particularly hard for people who want to

00:35:14.400 do that because the whole message of Holy Week is the opposite.

00:35:17.140 I mean, you're the theologian, but I think Jesus is coming into Jerusalem at a time when

00:35:21.520 it's occupied by foreign pagan authorities that are oppressing the people of Jerusalem,

00:35:26.420 and a lot of people watching assumed Jesus was going to liberate the city in some using force.

00:35:32.880 He was the king, but he doesn't come in on a war horse.

00:35:36.280 He comes in on a donkey and then submits to being tortured to death

00:35:40.420 because the victory is larger than a military victory.

00:35:44.400 It's a final victory.

00:35:45.440 It's a spiritual victory.

00:35:47.260 And that seems like the message as a non-theologian Protestant, 0.72

00:35:52.340 that seems like a very clear message.

00:35:54.200 But you tell me, is that the message?

00:35:56.420 Tucker, you are spot on. And that's why I mentioned earlier in our conversation,

00:36:04.020 Holy Week is a week of drama. And it's a week of waking up and realizing the real message of

00:36:11.720 Jesus Christ. I mean, the whole passion story of Christ is the elements there. I mean, we have

00:36:20.480 Judas Iscariot, who, why did he betray Christ? I mean, I don't claim to be able to read his mind

00:36:28.520 or his heart, but the indications are he betrayed Christ because he wanted the kind of military

00:36:38.940 leader that many wanted. Christ's triumphant entry into Jerusalem is, it's a very interesting

00:36:49.600 scene that we need to constantly go back to and look at in terms of what's really going on.

00:36:58.140 Just before Christ, as recorded in scripture, just before Christ enters triumphantly into

00:37:06.260 Jerusalem, the verses are talking about the authorities seeking and plotting to assassinate

00:37:14.980 Lazarus, the one he

00:37:16.920 had raised from the dead.

00:37:19.620 Which is

00:37:20.860 really one of the most, it's

00:37:22.620 described in John, and it's one of the most amazing

00:37:25.280 passages in the entire

00:37:26.860 Bible. Jesus has just raised this man

00:37:28.840 from the dead four days after his death.

00:37:31.880 One of the amazing

00:37:32.860 things he did. The guy's alive

00:37:34.920 and the religious authorities

00:37:36.720 want to murder him?

00:37:38.820 It's like, sorry, excuse me. 0.98

00:37:41.020 It's amazing.

00:37:42.480 It really is.

00:37:43.480 And the drama is right there.

00:37:46.440 We have to see it and recognize the way it continues to unfold in our lives.

00:37:51.880 I mean, I don't want to label anyone Judas Iscariot, but we need to ask ourselves, every one of us, and I include myself, we have to be very careful and ask, are we beginning to move in a direction that Judas Iscariot would have approved?

00:38:09.000 when we are saying we want hail jesus uh hail to the son of david but we want to shape the son of

00:38:19.400 david according to our agenda that is where it gets very dangerous and it culminates in

00:38:25.960 in destruction for judas iscariot and apparent i mean real destruction for christ because he is 0.89

00:38:33.140 truth, because he is God's divine son, what the world can throw at him can't destroy him because

00:38:40.400 he's beyond creation. He is the Lord of creation, but he allows it to happen out of love for all of

00:38:49.140 us. I mean, it's just so rich with images that can be beneficial to all of us, but for us to

00:38:59.780 hear Christ in this time, in this moment in our history, for the world, for this nation,

00:39:05.820 for the Catholic Church for Christians, to hear Christ say to those who are literally

00:39:12.320 in the moment, nailing him to a cross, killing him, Father, forgive them.

00:39:18.360 They know not what they do.

00:39:20.600 To have that kind of mercy and compassion in your heart is, and we've seen some saints

00:39:27.260 that have echoed it. St. Stephen, the first martyr, echoed his Lord in saying that. But that

00:39:34.120 that is, again, going back to where's the threat? That is a very threatening sentiment when you

00:39:42.960 think, when we think, when the world thinks that the powers of the world can ultimately prevail,

00:39:49.960 to hear the man being destroyed by the world saying, Father, forgive them. They know not what

00:39:57.580 they do. It reminds us that we've got to retune our hearts and our minds to the message of Jesus

00:40:05.900 Christ and to face everything we're facing. It's like Holy Week being played out again

00:40:15.760 writ large in our time the the the hidden messages and the the plottings and the confusing

00:40:23.300 i mean here we have things being hailed as wonderful and then underneath it on the the

00:40:30.480 underbelly is a darkness of plotting the the destruction of innocence and the destruction

00:40:37.440 of lives that really have nothing to do with this so once again i go back to that idea of

00:40:45.140 we have to i mean the gauge has to be the large-scale destruction of civilian life

00:40:53.580 can never be morally justified and you know with christ i mean it was one man but in terms of

00:41:02.340 reality in terms of the universe trying to kill jesus christ son of god jesus of nazareth killing

00:41:11.620 him. I mean, they were successful in killing him. He died on the cross. But that is large-scale

00:41:17.220 destruction of innocent life, of civilian life. And that is the principle we just have to keep 0.95

00:41:25.260 going back to, to keep really looking at everything through that lens and urging the leaders of Israel,

00:41:35.220 the leaders of the United States, the leaders of Europe, the leaders of the world to come together

00:41:41.580 and to listen to the words of Jesus Christ, even those who don't believe him, because they are true

00:41:50.060 words, they resonate in hearts if people will just listen and really open their hearts to what he's

00:41:58.280 saying. I mean, certainly, I believe the world will embrace Jesus Christ before it ends. That

00:42:06.360 is prophecy and that is logic when the world will embrace truth not everyone we're all left with our

00:42:14.360 free will and that is i mean the free will of the individual and writ large the free will of nations

00:42:22.120 um and we see that in old testament god doesn't necessarily stop the free will of nations or

00:42:30.960 individuals from doing something that God knows is contrary to truth. And the consequence of

00:42:37.740 ignoring the truth, really, I mean, we can see it as God's punishment, but really it goes deeper

00:42:43.900 than that. It's simply in conflict with reality. And when we oppose the truth, we're opposing

00:42:53.400 reality. And the consequences will follow, maybe not immediately, but the consequences will catch

00:43:02.400 up with us when we ignore truth. And Tucker, I know that the people that you interview as your

00:43:09.080 life, your career, your good work of doing your best to share truth, you're constantly talking

00:43:15.940 to people who have themselves lived through the consequences and hopefully awakened to the

00:43:22.100 reality i've got to follow truth when we ignore truth and it i mean it it's in countless ways

00:43:29.580 in our society today but when we ignore the truth we get on a path that brings us harm

00:43:38.860 and sadly can the more influence we have the more that path involves other innocent people

00:43:46.900 the more we can bring destruction down on the heads of the most innocent when we decide

00:43:54.820 I'm going to consciously deviate from the truth because I've decided I know better.

00:44:03.820 That should be a huge caution, ultimately stoplight for all of us. Be very careful about

00:44:12.040 going down that path because we've seen it in history and we see it in our time when the

00:44:18.880 individual says i'm somehow above or outside the truth then they may prevail for a moment

00:44:28.060 but it will always come to destruction there was a controversy six weeks or so ago around a woman 0.72

00:44:37.260 called Carrie Prejean Bowler, who was a member of the president's Religious Liberty Task Force.

00:44:44.420 She was expelled from it. Really, from my reading, for two reasons. One,

00:44:50.400 she called attention to the deaths of innocents in Gaza and made the point that their lives were

00:44:56.240 as valuable as anyone else's. And two, she refused the basic tenets of Zionism, political Zionism,

00:45:04.460 and said that she didn't have to sign up for that as a Christian,

00:45:09.140 and she was expelled for that.

00:45:10.220 And there were a number of religious leaders, Christian leaders,

00:45:13.240 who approved of her expulsion and, in fact, who made it possible.

00:45:17.980 You weighed in on this.

00:45:20.540 Can you tell us why you did that and what you said?

00:45:27.400 Yeah, thank you, Tucker.

00:45:28.860 um well really again you know i'm a simple guy and it comes down to basic simple truth

00:45:37.600 ultimately truth is simple yes it's deep it's rich it's hard to fathom but it's not complicated

00:45:44.000 in the way that our world is so often complicated as you said i think carrie was removed because

00:45:52.040 they didn't like the truth she was speaking the truth about gaza which is verboten by many

00:45:58.040 the innocents that have devastatingly died there is just horrible it truly is a holocaust of our 0.98

00:46:06.260 time but she was they didn't like that truth and they didn't like the truth of her pushing back

00:46:14.240 against the agenda that is saying this political zionism is something that christians need to

00:46:21.120 embrace no it's not and the catholic church is very clear from everything that i've seen i had

00:46:27.520 a conversation with Carrie before I put out my statement, and I had the conversation because I

00:46:36.520 was hearing things, and I just wanted to, really, my intention with reaching out to Carrie was just

00:46:42.900 to be a pastor and to offer her some support and some consolation. In the midst of that conversation,

00:46:50.280 she basically challenged me and asked me, Bishop, if what you're saying you really believe

00:46:57.080 your message. My message to her, if I really believed it, was I willing to publicly speak it?

00:47:05.020 And I told her I would pray about it and I would consider it. But even as I told her that I would

00:47:13.540 pray about it, I knew in my heart that I was, as we say sometimes, Christians say, I was convicted.

00:47:22.820 I knew that if I was going to be the man I want to be, if I was going to be the Christian that I want to be, I had to speak up and to not attack anyone, but simply say, you know, and what I tried to do in a rather several more words than this, but basically was say,

00:47:44.580 Carrie was removed from that committee because she was speaking truth that the powers that be didn't want to be spoken. 1.00

00:47:57.740 And because of that, I felt the need to speak out for her.

00:48:05.240 You know, I don't think Carrie claims to be a sinless, some sort of perfect woman. 1.00

00:48:10.560 but she was right in what she was speaking uh you know people can say i mean very often and i know

00:48:18.040 you hear this all the time um you know people will when they don't like the truth that's being said

00:48:25.480 they'll very often go after the tone and it's human to for the tone to get a little elevated

00:48:33.660 when we're speaking truth that especially when it's being opposed i know i can personally confess

00:48:40.820 that sometimes as that happens we can when we're facing pushback against something we know deeply

00:48:50.400 in our hearts to be the truth we can hopefully not get violent but we can get very animated in

00:48:58.280 how we're doing that but and i think that that's what people really pretty cleverly will say oh

00:49:05.500 well it was the tone well yeah sometimes the tone but sometimes it may be appropriate when truth is

00:49:13.260 being ignored we need to get attention sometimes and again looking to christ is the model um i mean

00:49:20.900 he said, love your enemy, but he also was willing to call a spade a spade. And when the leaders that

00:49:32.080 he was speaking with were clearly not in the line of truth, he was willing to get pretty animated

00:49:40.080 in the way he spoke to them and said things like, you brood of vipers. I mean, I think that was

00:49:46.400 actually john the baptist but christ said those kinds of things to the leaders because that's

00:49:55.780 what truths demand sometimes we should not return to violence in order to stand for the truth but

00:50:02.740 we should do it with vigor with strength and to me that's where where carrie was rejected primarily

00:50:11.820 because they didn't want her to speak that truth.

00:50:15.880 And they, you know, and you've seen it.

00:50:18.960 Well, I think you're an example, Tucker.

00:50:21.020 I mean, you were a man speaking truth

00:50:24.120 and they tried to silence you.

00:50:26.460 Carrie was speaking truth.

00:50:28.000 They tried to silence her

00:50:29.240 and it ultimately backfires.

00:50:31.960 When it is truth,

00:50:34.280 when someone or a group is speaking truth,

00:50:38.860 trying to oppose that, it does backfire. I think of Gamaliel and the Acts of the Apostles,

00:50:47.380 a Jewish leader who said, y'all need to be careful. If this is of God, you'll find yourself

00:50:54.180 finding God. If it's not of God, then it'll go away on its own. What Gamaliel is saying,

00:51:01.020 truth lasts truth prevails truth continues because of the essence of what it is it is truth

00:51:10.620 and we see that over and over again when truth is being proclaimed and whatever powers of the world

00:51:19.420 trying to squelch that truth try to silence it so often i mean jesus christ what is the whole

00:51:27.280 drama of Jesus Christ. The world, the powers that were in the first century tried to eliminate him

00:51:35.220 and where are we now in the 21st century? He is still that voice of truth that can and should

00:51:45.820 guide us. So Carrie was removed as one voice echoing the truth that is Jesus Christ. She was

00:51:54.140 removed because of that. And look what's happened. Her voice has grown. I had no idea who Carrie

00:52:01.640 preaching Bowler was before she got removed. And then I ended up making a statement about her.

00:52:09.080 That is a beautiful example of what we all need to remember for ourselves and our personal journey

00:52:16.120 against sin and death. And in the global journey, we need to remember if it's the truth, it will

00:52:23.960 come out, and it will prevail. So we better do our best to stay with the truth. I love the image

00:52:32.060 of the plumb line of truth that comes from Old Testament prophets, to stay with the truth. I

00:52:39.460 waver, I weaken, I'm a sinner, but I do my best to return to that plumb line of truth. And that's

00:52:47.660 what we need to do as individuals and as nations. We need to constantly be willing to challenge

00:52:55.120 ourselves. Am I, in whatever way, avoiding or trying to obfuscate the truth? And to the degree

00:53:03.280 that I'm doing that, I'm sinning, I repent, I ask forgiveness, and I get back to the truth.

00:53:09.860 what kind of response did you get to the statement that you wrote about carrie

00:53:18.240 i'd have to say overwhelming i mean i've been on x even when it was back when it was twitter

00:53:26.240 um and i've had some things that i've said that have gotten significant response um and you know

00:53:34.260 I don't even know what you call the numbers that you see, but whatever, the biggest number there

00:53:40.200 is close to a million at this point of people. And sometimes those numbers don't all necessarily

00:53:47.300 mean that people are in agreement, but the vast majority of people have said, thank you for being

00:53:54.060 a bishop, a successor of the apostles that was willing to speak to this. And, you know, Tucker

00:54:01.560 over and over again. And I can imagine, I mean, you're in a large, you have a big voice in today's

00:54:08.320 world. And I know you know that. And I know you do your best to take that responsibly, which we

00:54:13.840 have to. I'm the first to be surprised to have a million acknowledgements of what I've said,

00:54:23.560 for the most part, very positive. So the response has been tremendous. And it's, I mean, the words,

00:54:30.240 I believe the words that I've posted, I believe they came from prayer, they came from real

00:54:36.340 consideration of the truth that I believe in.

00:54:39.740 But it wasn't my words that people are really responding to.

00:54:44.660 It's truth.

00:54:46.060 People are hungry.

00:54:47.660 They are starving.

00:54:49.760 There is a worldwide famine for the truth.

00:54:55.180 Thankfully, it's there.

00:54:56.160 We can find it, but we have to fight for it sometimes.

00:55:00.240 And that's what I saw in the response is people are grateful when a voice and, you know, when Carrie and I spoke, you know, God has blessed me in tremendous ways.

00:55:13.880 And really, Tucker, I mean, we've never met, but I see you.

00:55:18.800 Our story is very similar.

00:55:22.100 They tried to cancel you.

00:55:24.160 I mean, back in the culture when people speaking truth were getting canceled.

00:55:29.120 And what has happened?

00:55:30.020 your voice has grown, and I think it should, thankfully. I mean, I know you're not the

00:55:35.960 perfect man, but you are a man seeking truth. That's how I understand Tucker Carlson.

00:55:41.520 And because of that, they fired you and they tried to eliminate your voice, and that voice

00:55:48.140 has only grown. The same thing for me. I'm a bishop removed from his diocese, and my voice

00:55:55.180 has grown. I mean, I still am the kid from East Texas, but my voice of doing my best to be

00:56:04.240 faithful to the truth and to be willing, and that's, I think, where both of us can stand

00:56:11.020 together. We've been willing to speak the truth when it wasn't popular, when it was sometimes

00:56:19.000 threatening to be further consequences if we stay with that voice of speaking the truth.

00:56:27.980 But I think both of us, in different ways, I can't speak for you, but I can speak for myself,

00:56:34.620 I have to do what I've done. I can't knuckle under and say, okay, just quit speaking the truth. I

00:56:42.880 was told to quit it. Stop it. Quit speaking the truth. You are told as well. And I'm sure behind

00:56:48.540 the scenes you could share lots of stories of people saying oh tucker don't you know calm down

00:56:54.740 don't do this get back off but we can't when it's the truth and you know it deep in your heart

00:57:01.480 that is is what christ was able to do in a beautifully peaceful way he endured everything

00:57:10.940 the world could throw it in and you know in many ways i haven't had anything thrown at me

00:57:16.820 but I've been willing to speak the truth when it wasn't popular and when it basically got me

00:57:24.080 kicked out of the club but I'm still a bishop I'm still a successor of the apostles and so

00:57:31.260 it's essential that I continue to speak not my truth I mean you know that's where some it gets

00:57:39.140 crazy people speak of oh well that's your truth and that's my truth there's truth and we all have

00:57:45.180 the obligation to seek it, to be willing. And I've said this many times, and I say it again.

00:57:52.180 Anytime I speak something that I'm claiming to be the truth, if people can show me that this is not

00:57:58.940 the truth, I want to hear that. I don't want to ever be in a position where people are saying,

00:58:07.580 oh, well, he's got a big voice, so I won't tell him he's wrong on that. I want to hear if I'm

00:58:12.580 wrong. And I have been. I can be, for sure. I'm a man, weak and sinful and easily confused and

00:58:21.800 easily diverted from the truth, but I keep going back to trying to do my best to proclaim it.

00:58:28.140 That's what we're all called to do. And I'd say Carrie right there with us as a woman,

00:58:34.440 a mother and a wife and a woman with a voice and once you have a voice you have an obligation to

00:58:43.660 speak the truth with it you said you're on acts you're clearly paying attention to what's happening

00:58:50.880 around the world it's very easy to become discouraged jesus is under fire the the the

00:58:58.640 church broadly is under fire. Truth is obviously a target, maybe the main target. So it's

00:59:07.540 discouraging. Do you see God moving as a counterbalance to that? Do you see God moving more

00:59:14.460 as evil becomes more obvious?

00:59:18.060 Tucker, thank you for asking that question because I think absolutely I see goodness

00:59:25.840 and beauty and truth changing hearts and moving people in all kinds of ways that's been one of

00:59:34.860 my blessings i i'm basically basically i'm an itinerant bishop now who travels all over the

00:59:40.940 place and speaks in different settings and meets people across this nation and really around the

00:59:46.560 world. And I have seen that goodness and those hearts seeking the truth. And of course, I believe

00:59:56.200 that God is, it's still his world. It's still his church. And he isn't absent from any of this.

01:00:06.880 Free will allows us to destroy ourselves if we make that foolish choice. But God is always

01:00:14.840 offering the opportunity to each of us individually and to each of us in whatever group,

01:00:20.920 whatever definition of a group of humanity. For us, we're all brothers and sisters. We're all

01:00:28.380 the children of God. But I believe, absolutely answering your question, that God is working

01:00:36.320 in hearts. God is working through all of this. I mean, look at all the evil that's been exposed.

01:00:42.140 we hate it we're horrified but it needs it's like a wound that needs to be cleansed a new a wound

01:00:52.740 that needs to be opened up and the putrefied flesh needs to be cleansed that's we're in a time of

01:01:00.700 cleansing of purification God is allowing the the truth that has been hidden for so long so much

01:01:07.880 corruption it just it does get overwhelming and i've put out messages to encourage people

01:01:14.060 don't despair it's so easy to despair and we see it i know both of us see it too often especially

01:01:22.040 young people lives ending sometimes intentionally because they're just despair of this dark world 1.00

01:01:30.960 But we can never despair. We should be people of hope and acknowledge the evil that's there,

01:01:40.160 but believe that God is with us. Jesus Christ prevails as truth prevails. And I guess that's

01:01:48.000 because I know many of the people that probably listen to you are not people of faith. But again,

01:01:54.180 I would go back to simply truth prevails when it's the truth and we know I believe that Jesus

01:02:00.980 Christ is truth incarnate truth walk this earth and we believe in the Catholic faith he remains

01:02:07.440 here through the sacraments through the life of of baptized people in goodness living in the world

01:02:14.080 but truth prevails and when we are willing to challenge ourselves to always go back to the truth

01:02:23.340 that will lead us nowhere but to god and and so god is working through all of this

01:02:31.560 and there's so much goodness out there the things that have been hidden literally for centuries

01:02:37.800 that are coming to light i'm what comes to mind for me is is a an apparition of our lady

01:02:44.540 called Our Lady of Good Success, that is in Ecuador, Quito, Ecuador.

01:02:54.920 It happened shortly after Our Lady of Guadalupe.

01:02:59.280 Our Lady of Guadalupe appeared in 1531 there in Tepeyac, outside Mexico City.

01:03:06.960 The image of Our Lady of Guadalupe still is revered there by Catholics and others there.

01:03:13.160 of that miraculous appearance. This apparition happened in the 1570s, I believe, shortly after

01:03:20.000 Our Lady of Guadalupe. And what's interesting is the apparition, it's to a nun, Our Lady

01:03:28.300 speaks to a nun, and this has been approved as private revelation, but it is accepted as authentic

01:03:38.040 by the church um but basically the apparition is mary says to this uh nun mother mariana that

01:03:49.140 for the 20th and 21st century this will come to light and will help people navigate a world

01:03:59.520 and a church deeply affected by the chaos of not following the truth i mean that's what it comes

01:04:07.620 down to. We believe the church will prevail. The gates of hell will not prevail against the

01:04:16.420 Catholic church. That is our faith. We believe what Christ says in the gospel, and we believe

01:04:21.420 it applies to this church. But that doesn't mean that we human beings, and the church has gone

01:04:27.420 through every kind of storm that humanity can come up with, but we believe the church will not

01:04:34.760 be destroyed, so we can't despair. But what's interesting to me is that this apparition,

01:04:42.680 it's a sign of the goodness, a sign of the hope, a sign of God still with us. One of the things that

01:04:50.920 as a bishop, as a lifelong Catholic, one of the great realities that I think is always helpful to

01:04:58.200 me is to remember God is timeless. That's hard for us to grasp. We can't really grasp it. How can

01:05:05.860 God be outside time? But he is. God is eternal. And so the things unfolding, we would say,

01:05:13.240 well, this was 400 years ago, and now it's happening now, and how does this work?

01:05:18.380 For God, there is no time. It's simply truth, goodness, and beauty always flowing from the

01:05:25.120 heart of the Trinity, God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. So keeping that perspective always reminds

01:05:31.860 us, reminds me to be careful about presuming things about history because God's outside all 0.92

01:05:40.520 of that. I mean, history is a reality of the creation that God has given us, which is precious

01:05:48.260 and is good. As God says in Genesis, he saw that it was good. But the evil and the bad can come

01:05:55.760 when we who are created in God's image and likeness begin to ignore truth. That is constantly

01:06:03.620 what it comes down to. When I sin, I'm ignoring truth. I mean, we may not say, oh, I'm going to go

01:06:10.000 ignore some truth today. But if we trace it back logically, what I'm doing when I sin

01:06:16.940 insignificant or the just small ways, sometimes it's literally telling a lie, ignoring the truth,

01:06:25.060 pretending that this is the way things are, or this is what I've done. But when we ignore truth

01:06:32.860 on the personal level, on the national level, in the midst of history, when we ignore truth,

01:06:39.640 we are on a destructive path. So we're always challenged to go back to the truth. And in this

01:06:46.820 conversation once again i repeat the destruction the wanton destruction of innocence of civilians

01:06:56.840 is never morally justified that's the anchor of truth that's the pillar of truth that we have to

01:07:04.520 keep returning to when we get caught up in the confusing and chaotic realities that we're all

01:07:11.160 facing. We have to go back to the truth and humbly acknowledge, Lord, I'm wondered in significant or

01:07:18.580 maybe just in basic ways, but the more we allow ourselves to put blindfolds on and ignore the

01:07:26.080 truth, and I think that's a lot of what's happening right now. It's like, you know, the political

01:07:33.140 entity that is called Israel is getting a free pass for facing the truth for whatever reasons,

01:07:40.940 for political agendas or some kind of co-opted religious idea, but when we ignore the truth

01:07:47.760 that atrocities have been committed against civilians, against innocents, then when we

01:07:54.900 won't speak of that, like Gaza, then we're on a dark path and it becomes something, it's sort of

01:08:03.800 like the club of complicity where we say, well, we'll all ignore that truth, won't we? And we

01:08:10.020 move forward. And too much of that happens in today's world. You wonder why. I mean, there are,

01:08:18.980 you know, a lot is written about this. There's a lot of speculation about it. Why would people

01:08:23.660 intentionally lie in the United States about what everyone can see about the atrocities you just

01:08:30.820 mentioned? Why would our political leaders do that? Why would so many of our religious leaders

01:08:35.200 do the same. And there are all these theories, well, they're being paid off or... Those are not

01:08:41.640 adequate explanations from my perspective. It does feel like, and there are instances of this,

01:08:47.960 Paul alludes to this in Galatians, that it's almost like there's a spell, there's a supernatural

01:08:52.920 quality where people can't see things. They sincerely can't see things. Their vision is

01:08:58.520 clouded. Do you think that that phenomenon exists now? Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Evil is real.

01:09:07.780 The Catholic Church sees evil personified in Satan and his demons. Christ has, I mean,

01:09:15.820 Satan has no power, really. But we, individual human beings and any group of human beings,

01:09:24.340 when we give into ignoring the truth, we really are giving into the power of evil. And like you're

01:09:33.920 alluding to, Tucker, I mean, that's why, thankfully, God clearly tells us through His Son and in other

01:09:43.040 passages, even in the Old Testament, we are not to judge each other. We are not the judges. We are to

01:09:50.580 make judgments about what is true, but we're not to judge the individual person. And I think that

01:09:57.680 that's where we have to always remember, because, you know, the atrocities that happen, and that

01:10:04.620 doesn't mean what we just say, well, you know, out of respect for this person, I need to allow

01:10:09.740 this to happen or allow myself to be attacked. That is not what we're talking about. But we do

01:10:17.300 have to always acknowledge when it comes down to judging the person, we should simply not do it

01:10:23.740 and acknowledge that maybe there is evil. And I truly believe that the delusion of evil has

01:10:34.640 many in its grasp in the world today. We all have the obligation to set ourselves free from that,

01:10:44.700 to see the light and to make the choice to turn from it.

01:10:49.200 But I know that it can become very difficult, seemingly impossible.

01:10:54.960 And I think that really, as we talk about all of this, Tucker,

01:11:01.500 I believe, again, it comes down to basic human choices.

01:11:08.280 The world leader that is deciding this is justified

01:11:13.320 because I have decided this, this, and this, it comes down to, and again, I think of us as

01:11:21.840 individual sinners. When we sin, we've simply decided, I know better. In this, you know, we

01:11:30.660 explain it away. We make rationalizations, but at the heart of it is, yes, this is what the world

01:11:39.500 says is true but i know better i've figured it out i know better and i think that that's where

01:11:46.820 you know the atrocities in gaza they are they are actively working to hide those and to

01:11:57.440 to squelch any voice that dares to speak up about innocence lives being destroyed because it

01:12:05.940 threatens their I know better attitude. It threatens that truth that they're trying to

01:12:13.520 create. We can all try to create our own truth, but it doesn't exist really. And that is what we

01:12:20.720 have to always be humble enough to acknowledge. And we have to pray that world leaders will be

01:12:28.160 people whose hearts are open because they've got the power to do drastically devastatingly

01:12:37.000 destructive things like we've witnessed in Gaza what we're witnessing in Lebanon um I mean very 1.00

01:12:44.400 little is spoken about some of these things because the powers that be don't want that truth

01:12:51.300 spoken because it threatens their false scenario and so it really is as basic as that um but i

01:13:02.620 think there are forces uh worldly and supernatural of evil that i mean just like when you know when

01:13:13.620 evil tries to cancel a voice of truth and our culture certainly in the supernatural realm

01:13:22.280 satan and his minions are trying to do the same thing i mean the saint michael prayer that we

01:13:28.600 offer as catholics is rooted in acknowledging that basic reality and not seeing a demon around

01:13:35.400 every corner but acknowledging that evil is real evil has its power when we give it power and that's

01:13:43.060 why we have to prayerfully turn to the truth. I urge everyone to do that. And if you aren't a

01:13:50.460 believer to at least, I mean, hopefully somewhat being sane is to embrace the truth. I mean,

01:13:59.160 to a definition of insanity is to say, well, I'm going to ignore what's true and just go into my

01:14:06.600 fantasy world. Sometimes that happens. But if we are people who are rational, then rationality

01:14:14.720 means based in the truth. And we all have an obligation to find the truth, to speak the truth,

01:14:21.980 and to live the truth. My final question is about persecution, which you've alluded to,

01:14:29.440 and you've said, oh, Jesus was murdered for telling the truth. That was the main threat

01:14:35.920 he posed, the fact that he was the embodiment of truth, and that that principle stands and that

01:14:41.260 people who, it's not the liars who are punished, it's people who tell the truth. So if we accept

01:14:45.740 that we're clearly in a new kind of world where trends are accelerating, you would have to think

01:14:53.460 that persecution will intensify specifically of Christians. And I think it is. I think it's

01:15:00.240 what we're watching. Do you believe that? And if you do, how should Christians respond 0.55

01:15:07.040 to persecution? Well, Tucker, I do believe that. I mean, it's very clear. I believe that

01:15:16.820 faith, really, any stance for truth, the real truth, is being persecuted.

01:15:30.240 Because the powers of chaos, the powers of that false message, are growing and gaining influence.

01:15:41.760 What is our response as Christians?

01:15:45.900 Well, you know, I guess it sounds pretty simplistic, but we stay with the truth.

01:15:52.460 We don't compromise.

01:15:54.280 We don't become violent in the face of violence.

01:15:57.240 we don't embrace hatred i mean i think that you know it it probably

01:16:04.060 is one of the most powerful things we can do is seek to truly love our neighbor

01:16:13.420 and certainly i mean christ tells us love god with all your heart mind and soul and your neighbor as

01:16:22.920 yourself, the great commandment. But I think that we need to put that into practice by not giving

01:16:30.740 in to the hate, no matter how much we are persecuted, no matter how much hatred is thrown

01:16:38.580 at us. And we have great examples in our Catholic faith in the saints of the ages, so many of the

01:16:46.240 saints. And Christ himself says, if they hate you, remember they hated me first. What is persecution

01:16:53.880 about? We're persecuted when they hate what we're doing, they hate who we are, they hate what we're

01:17:00.660 saying. And so we're in good company with Christ himself. How did Christ respond? He didn't waver

01:17:09.520 from the truth, but he didn't violently fight back either. That is, I think, the basic reaction

01:17:19.780 we should have. We should trust in the power of the truth. Yes, we can be eliminated. We can be

01:17:29.100 assassinated in this world and it happens but the truth continues to prevail and if

01:17:40.000 as christ died in service to the truth he was the truth and he died for the truth

01:17:46.760 um if it comes to that we shouldn't seek that our lives are valuable but if it comes to that

01:17:56.200 then we who believe in the truth should, you know, be the martyrs, be willing.

01:18:04.740 If that's what it takes to stand for the truth that I sacrificed my life in this world,

01:18:11.740 it begins to remind us that life is not limited to this world.

01:18:17.340 We believe in everlasting life.

01:18:19.720 The salvation of souls is what the church, the Catholic church exists for.

01:18:24.360 It may not always look like that through history and in our time, because too many voices seem to be too worried about this world.

01:18:32.820 But ultimately, to be alive is to have eternal life with God.

01:18:39.920 And so sacrificing this earthly life, if it comes to that, and we should, I've always loved the example of St. Thomas More.

01:18:48.920 He was a great lawyer, he was a great mind, and he did everything he could to keep from losing his life in this world.

01:18:59.600 But ultimately, he knew that if he had to sacrifice his life in this world, he could look to eternal life with God in heaven.

01:19:10.280 And he says that to his own daughter, to we shall merrily meet in heaven.

01:19:15.620 that has to be our attitude as well not wantonly and easily allowing our lives to be destroyed

01:19:24.100 that is not respectful of the treasure of our life that god has given us we should desire to

01:19:30.840 be here as long as god gives us breath but when that ends and we if we we lose that life because

01:19:40.740 we've stood for the truth, then we're in good company. So the Christian's response to persecution

01:19:48.200 should ultimately to be willing and to be strengthened and to strengthen each other

01:19:54.160 to stand with the truth, come what may. Amen. Bishop Strickland, thank you very much for

01:20:02.700 taking this time. That was great. Thank you, Tucker. God bless you. God bless you.

01:20:10.740 Thank you.

The Tucker Carlson Show - March 30, 2026

Breaking News： Israel Shuts Down Christ’s Resurrection Site. Bishop Strickland & Tucker Respond.

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