Chris Cellaļ¼ Opioids, Robbing the Mafia, Burning Down the Entourage House, and How God Saved Him
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 41 minutes
Words per Minute
189.47595
Summary
In this episode, we talk about addiction and how it runs in our family, and how to deal with it. We also talk about how addiction runs through our family and how we deal with addiction, and why it runs so deep in our DNA.
Transcript
00:00:00.000
You pepper sprayed a member of the Mexican mafia and stole his heroin.
00:00:03.280
I sprayed him in the face with pepper spray and put something to his throat.
00:00:08.140
It was making me tense, man, just telling me this story.
00:00:10.240
And he had girls in his halfway houses that he was giving heroin, giving crack and pimping them out and then sending them back to treatment where they would ultimately fail their drug test and have to go to detox.
00:00:23.880
And guess who gets a kickback from the detox center?
00:00:27.820
It's a revolving door of suffering and just pain for the addict.
00:00:38.560
She's like, what the are you doing in my house?
00:00:43.700
If you have your kids sleeping in there, you're kind of a shitty mom.
00:00:46.640
So you insult the lady with the gun pointed at you.
00:01:16.160
So I was addicted to opioids from the age of 15 to 23.
00:01:20.000
Kind of on and off, you know, in and out of rehab for those eight years.
00:01:27.400
So I grew up in, I was born in Dallas, grew up in South Orange County, moved there when
00:01:31.520
I was five, kind of bounced around, but all in kind of relatively the same area.
00:01:40.800
And my sister or my family, you know, addiction kind of just runs in my family.
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There is a genetic component to, you know, kind of the addictive personality.
00:01:58.580
How much, how much alcoholism is there in Israel?
00:02:07.720
So, you know, my, so, so growing up, my dad was, he was a general counsel at an oil company
00:02:16.040
So he was traveling a lot and he was also a heavy drinker.
00:02:20.480
He would, he is not the type of person who like needed to wake up and, you know, drink
00:02:24.160
in the morning to function, but he would go on benders, you know, for days, weeks at a
00:02:29.060
And, and then my, my mom, she was a long distance runner and she had a diving accident that left
00:02:38.380
Basically, she was a victim of big pharma's push in the early to mid nineties for Oxycontin
00:02:48.740
And, you know, this little pathetic pill pushing quack is, you know, giving her just massive
00:02:54.040
And she liked the way she, she hated the way it felt.
00:03:01.940
And the doctor's like, well, you need to keep taking it.
00:03:04.040
And so she, she decided to flush them down the toilet once.
00:03:06.840
And, uh, and she went into excruciating withdrawal and, uh, you know, I'll touch more on withdrawal
00:03:18.320
So your dad's the general counsel of a big company.
00:03:22.160
So these are like competent people who've got their act together.
00:03:25.500
These are not like, this is not the junkie profile.
00:03:28.900
Like my father, he was, um, he graduated, uh, college at, um, 19, um, and he went to
00:03:40.060
Cause I think that, I think it's important to set this in a socioeconomic frame.
00:03:46.140
Addiction does not, uh, you know, it does not, it doesn't matter whether you're rich,
00:03:50.380
poor, black, white, whatever, you know, it's indiscriminatory, indiscriminatory.
00:03:57.860
So this doctor keeps pushing opioids on your mom.
00:04:02.080
And by the way, to be a distance runner, um, I admire that, but it suggests like true
00:04:08.900
self-discipline, uh, high level of awareness of your body.
00:04:13.880
I mean, who's a distance runner, you know, only people who are very, very into fitness
00:04:19.520
and very, very kind of like battened down people.
00:04:24.600
No, my mom was absolutely, you know, one of the most disciplined, um, people that I've
00:04:33.180
And I mean, a lot of long distance running to me is absolutely, sounds like torture.
00:04:40.980
And, um, so, you know, she had these multiple surgeries that only exacerbated the issue and
00:04:47.900
A neck injury that she got from, it wasn't related to her long distance running, but it
00:04:55.920
And, um, and, uh, so yeah, this guy's first, she's pushing, uh, Oxycontin on her and then
00:05:02.620
he says, okay, well, let's try something different.
00:05:04.340
It might be less, um, like, you know, less addictive possibly, you know, cause fentanyl
00:05:09.360
was brand new and, uh, you know, might, might make you feel a little bit better to where
00:05:15.320
So he puts her on fentanyl and fentanyl is so powerful.
00:05:21.860
Otherwise you'll cry because it's like fentanyl is the most, so powerful that it has to be
00:05:28.200
Like, you know, like the 25 micrograms, whereas most drugs are administered in milligrams.
00:05:39.600
She's married to a general counsel of a company.
00:05:46.380
Oh no, she, well, uh, she was living in Dallas when she became, uh, uh, addicted to the
00:05:53.980
Um, uh, and then when we moved to Southern California, we moved to Southern California.
00:05:57.940
My dad started his own practice with his brother.
00:06:01.540
So, um, and then, uh, yeah, so my sister and then my sister, she had, um, a serious, um,
00:06:11.760
uh, issue with bulimia and anorexia from the age of 10 to 28.
00:06:15.740
Uh, like so serious that, you know, her potassium levels were so low that ambulances at our home
00:06:23.820
And there was multiple times when they said, you know, your daughter might make it, not,
00:06:27.760
might, might not make it to, you know, to my father.
00:06:29.680
And so witnessing all of this at a very young age, and again, I'm not trying, again,
00:06:34.120
I just want to like preface, this is not an excuse for my actions.
00:06:37.300
Like I own everything that I did and all the terrible things that I did was not, but I
00:06:41.340
think that the chaos that I had, that I, you know, basically I didn't have this, the necessary
00:06:47.720
things like structure and discipline that I think are so important for everyone, but
00:06:53.860
especially for people with addictive, uh, addictive personalities to, um, to have that,
00:06:58.860
you know, that rigid kind of, I'm going to wake up, I'm going to make my bed, I'm going
00:07:03.280
And, and so like my parents, I was never sure I knew my parents loved me.
00:07:06.960
Like my parents, they, um, I was never, you know, short on that, but they were so busy
00:07:12.740
trying to deal with my sister and, you know, and their own issue.
00:07:16.520
And my, my father, he's been clean, he's been off, he stopped drinking, he just cold, cold
00:07:20.780
turkey, stopped drinking for, it's been 25 years now.
00:07:26.380
And, you know, he never went to AA or anything like that.
00:07:28.780
And so, so again, it's, it's, you know, um, addiction or, you know, treatment can be, uh,
00:07:36.420
It doesn't have to include, you know, rehab and all these different things.
00:07:39.480
But, um, uh, so yeah, my, so my sister, your mom, uh, she, so she, um, eventually switched
00:07:49.360
over to Suboxone from fentanyl and then she weaned herself off of that.
00:07:57.860
I mean, compared to like the alternative, which is, um, methadone, which is so, so addictive.
00:08:04.820
I mean, the, the withdrawals from that, um, I've heard are much worse than, you know, your
00:08:11.460
average opiate or even heroin, um, just because it's, it's more drawn out and yeah, terrible.
00:08:25.080
And your dad got better, but you grew up in an environment where there was a lot of this
00:08:29.420
And, um, so yeah, and lacking that structure, it made me, you know, I think it led to a sense
00:08:36.360
of low self-esteem and the constant need for the approval of others.
00:08:42.480
Like I look back now and I'm like, you know, why the fuck do I, did I care so much about
00:08:48.880
And it's, I guess, you know, I can't, you know, but after years of therapy, they've kind
00:08:55.440
of pinpointed as to like, you know, you know, your quote unquote inner child didn't get enough
00:09:01.900
And so, yeah, you know, I was so constantly trying desperately to fit in.
00:09:07.080
So, you know, when I got into, uh, middle school, high school, um, and, you know, I
00:09:11.840
was, you know, uh, honor roll student, um, very, very, you know, I was, I was very, um,
00:09:20.740
But, uh, once I got into like college where you actually have to start kind of trying a
00:09:24.980
little bit like algebra two and whatnot, I was like, uh, you know, cause I started hanging
00:09:29.760
out with kids who were smoking weed, drinking and smoking cigarettes.
00:09:33.500
So not that I necessarily wanted to smoke weed, drink and smoke cigarettes, but that's
00:09:39.720
So I wanted, you know, I wanted their approval.
00:09:45.040
And so I started drinking, you know, smoking cigarettes and smoking weed.
00:09:48.640
And, uh, so that went on for, you know, I, I quit the wrestling team.
00:09:53.640
I, uh, you know, I pretty much abandoned everything that, you know, was positive, you know, all
00:09:59.540
the positive things that I was doing for my life and just kind of became a stoner.
00:10:04.640
And, um, and, you know, I know a lot of kids who were potheads in high school, you know,
00:10:09.000
that I'm friends with that are more successful than I today.
00:10:13.400
But I mean, then what happened was it progressed to the, cause I was in, you know, advanced
00:10:22.100
So I was in like algebra two as a sophomore where, you know, I was, it was mostly juniors
00:10:28.020
And so I started hanging out with the juniors and seniors and they were doing, uh, it's called,
00:10:37.700
Um, they were, you know, snorting that, taking Xanax pills, stuff like that.
00:10:41.480
And, um, and my stoner buddies, where were they getting the pills?
00:10:47.060
There was pretty much, we had like one source and he was, uh, a guy that just, uh, lived
00:10:54.720
Um, it's always a guy in an apartment complex, isn't it?
00:10:59.760
And he, he, um, his grandmother was getting prescription, getting these prescription drugs
00:11:08.200
So, you know, he would sell them for 60 bucks a pop, um, and, you know, we would buy them.
00:11:15.060
Uh, but eventually, you know, that it becomes too expensive.
00:11:20.780
And that's why so many people transition to heroin.
00:11:23.840
Um, but you know, my, even my stoner friends were like, Hey, you should like, you should try
00:11:29.440
And I'm like, okay, yeah, I'm going to take your heaping loads of moral condemnation stoner.
00:11:33.740
But, but in reality, it's like when the potheads are telling you that to stay away from these
00:11:42.800
And, uh, so, you know, of course, you know, my, again, that low self-esteem, that desire
00:11:48.480
to fit in started using, um, pills and opiates in particular.
00:11:54.020
They took away that feeling of that, like that low self-worth.
00:12:03.140
I, you know, I felt great at the beginning, in the beginning, in the very early stages
00:12:08.440
So like the first, you know, two, three months.
00:12:12.120
Um, I was a telemarketer at a, uh, golf club selling quote unquote custom made, made clubs.
00:12:18.080
They're literally made in a warehouse underneath the call center by illegals.
00:12:21.980
And they're, it was either graphite or steel, and they might, uh, give you extra grips on
00:12:26.580
That's the extent of the quote unquote customization.
00:12:30.280
But comparable to the tailor-made R11, you know, okay.
00:12:34.260
So you're selling custom, faux custom-made golf clubs from a call center.
00:12:40.620
And, and, uh, you know, go in the car, do a line of Opana and come back in and it's just
00:12:46.580
like, oh my gosh, you know, I have more confidence and I'm pushing, pushing harder on the sales
00:12:51.140
and things like, and, and, and my sales numbers are going up.
00:12:54.060
So I'm like, why would I stop when this is like, I feel great about myself.
00:13:03.060
Uh, so, you know, I saw it as like, there's like, there's no downside until.
00:13:09.600
And by the way, there have been a lot of, as you know, um, artists, jazz musicians, you
00:13:14.820
know, who used opioids because they thought it increased their, you know, ability to enhance
00:13:22.380
And I think, you know, it, it, to an extent it can, but that is short lived.
00:13:27.180
It is not, you know, it's temporary because especially with opiates, they, again, they,
00:13:32.960
what they did, they literally, they erode your soul and you're eventually going to run out
00:13:41.660
And so, so what happened in your case, you started by doing a line in your car during
00:13:51.000
Um, you know, I was like doing like, you know, one, one pill, one 40 milligram pill every
00:13:55.920
couple of days to two every couple of days to, you know, and just going up and up and the
00:14:09.900
You, you, you quickly develop a tolerance and, uh, yeah.
00:14:14.240
And you just need more and more to get to that because you're always chasing that first
00:14:18.560
You know, you're never going to get it again, but that's what like, you know, the chasing
00:14:21.880
the dragon, um, you're always trying to get to that level, but you're never going to get
00:14:29.700
I mean, I think every childhood weed smoker remembers that first time when you just like
00:14:35.540
burst into laughter hysterically with your buddies and it's like the funnest, funniest thing that's
00:14:42.120
I mean, that's truly fun, but that doesn't ever happen again.
00:14:45.720
No, it's, and, and you, you, you're so desperate to try to get back there.
00:14:49.920
And, and that kind of, you know, the whole, like, you know, addiction makes you insane.
00:14:53.920
It's like, you know, you're never really going to get back there, but you're still trying.
00:15:02.600
I mean, you know, like the definition of insanity, trying things over and over again, expecting
00:15:05.800
the different result, especially when you get into the point where you're like, you're
00:15:08.700
trying to get sober, um, and like, okay, yeah, this hasn't worked 15 times.
00:15:17.880
Um, and so, but yeah, so I was, yeah, so it progressed very quickly.
00:15:25.420
And, um, progressed within, I don't know, maybe like two, three months to
00:15:32.220
buying heroin, um, up in, you know, South Los Angeles.
00:15:40.660
Uh, so, uh, you know, basically what, what happened was when we met this guy, um, I think
00:15:46.840
he was at like the continuation school down the street from, uh, our high school.
00:15:53.000
It's like, um, basically if you get like booted out of, um, you know, a regular high
00:15:58.220
school, it's kind of like, it's kind of like a way to get a, get a diploma without
00:16:03.380
having to get a GED, but like, it's like kind of like a, it's like a bootleg diploma.
00:16:11.160
So some of the kids who've had a bumpy road are in the continuation school.
00:16:16.380
I mean, I mean, they even like, they like, even though there was like mostly kids under
00:16:20.960
the age of 18, they had a little smoking section at the school.
00:16:28.440
And I, yeah, I mean, I'm still a nicotine fiend.
00:16:33.920
I was like, you know, I was, and I was honestly, I was pretty impressed with myself that I was
00:16:39.420
able to do that because that was almost, I don't want to say almost as hard, but very
00:16:42.480
difficult and, you know, trying to get rid of that addiction, um, you know, compared to
00:16:49.100
I quit drinking and drugs at 33 and I quit cigarette smoking at 45.
00:17:00.380
It's really a hard addiction to break and I'm still addicted to nicotine, you know?
00:17:11.780
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Okay, so 10th grade, all of a sudden you go from, like, doing, like, bumps of some ground-up oxy-derivative pill at the golf sales place to driving to South Los Angeles.
00:19:55.060
You meet this kid from the continuation school, and he's your heroin connection.
00:20:10.820
I mean, just, yeah, just some guy that, you know, we were only, the only reason we associated with him was because he had that connection.
00:20:18.900
And, yeah, not exactly, you know, he's the type of guy who would steal your wallet and help you look for it.
00:20:28.400
He was, he was a big user, and he was actually, I found out he was ripping us off when I got a direct connection, and he was basically saying it was double the price for the amount, because you get, like, a, you get a little package with 12 balloons in it.
00:20:40.960
And it was $45, and he was saying it was $90, so he was able to, like, get to pocket one and give one to us.
00:20:52.680
He didn't have a car, so, you know, I would drive him in my 1998 Jeep, and we'd all just pile in there.
00:20:59.460
And this, the feds were watching, like, these, like, they literally, there was an article in the OC Register.
00:21:06.600
Um, I think it came out while I was in rehab, but, uh, basically, just kind of giving an overview of the whole thing.
00:21:16.160
The number you'd call, the guy's name was Boss, so you call his phone number, and, and this guy goes, all right, how, what do you want?
00:21:22.840
And you tell him how many packs you want, and then he's like, all right, meet, and it would be, like, one of three freeway exits, you know, right in that area.
00:21:30.300
And, like, always, like, a fast food parking lot, something like that, you know.
00:21:41.780
So you're meeting in, like, In-N-Out Burger or Wendy's or something?
00:21:45.200
Yeah, yeah, yeah, just, yeah, some, yeah, we can just pull in real quick.
00:21:48.500
Um, and then, they'd, um, they, you'd meet the, they would always send a runner, and usually it was a different person, but, um, I started, you know, so, yeah, they'd meet you, they'd say, all right, you know, come into the car, that you'd get into the passenger seat, they'd reach into the, um, the air vent, pull it out, give you the, give you the dope, give them the money, boom.
00:22:15.180
Um, you know, this is, this is the kind of one of the craziest.
00:22:18.500
Easier things about this whole, this whole experience.
00:22:20.760
So, the runner that I had the most contact with, uh, he was, you know, he's a cool guy, just this little Hispanic guy, you know, I mean, obviously a gangbanger who would, you know, shoot you as soon as to look at you, but, um, he was very, you know, very nice to me, um, and, you know, he would give me discounts occasionally, and he actually, finally, he was like, hey, you know what, you no longer have to call boss, you can just, here, I'll give you my personal line, um, and you can just call me and then, you know, have to say,
00:22:48.480
save you the hassle of going through the whole, the whole process.
00:22:53.200
And so, you know, we developed a kind of, you know, friendship, I guess, and, uh, it's probably the wildest story that I have.
00:23:01.600
So, we, uh, so my friends from South Orange County, again, very affluent, you know, um, I don't know if you've heard of, like, Nellie Gale in, in South Orange County.
00:23:10.000
It's like, uh, it's a, it's like one of the ritziest neighborhoods in the country.
00:23:14.820
Uh, it's got, like, horse trails running through it, you know, um, and, you know, the houses are, like, at a minimum, you know, $5 million.
00:23:21.240
Uh, so, yeah, it's a very nice area, very affluent area, and that's where pretty much all my friends lived.
00:23:27.520
And, uh, but, uh, this girl we knew, um, her uncle was, uh, he owned the house.
00:23:36.060
Uh, yeah, so, um, he owned the house that, um, at least, like, two seasons of the show were filmed in.
00:23:41.700
And she's like, yeah, we can go up there for the weekend.
00:23:45.500
And so, it's funny, we drive all the way to Beverly Hills, like, two and a half hour drive, and up this private road to this, you know, this beautiful mansion.
00:23:52.880
The door's locked, and she kind of lied or, you know, misled us about having permission to go to the house.
00:24:01.880
And, anyways, uh, excuse me, uh, so, I ended up finding, uh, I saw, like, a door-sized window, um, like, on the side of the house.
00:24:10.920
And so, I maneuvered my way up there, pushed on the door, and it just popped open.
00:24:15.180
And I was, like, waiting for an alarm to go off.
00:24:18.740
And so, I walk in, open the front door, and we're in.
00:24:22.280
And, uh, and then I was like, oh, man, I really need some, some heroin, but I don't want to drive down to Southgate, you know.
00:24:28.460
Um, and so, I called the guy, and I was like, hey, man, we've got a huge mansion, you know, there's only, like, seven of us.
00:24:36.820
This is why you don't let your niece bust into your house with her junkie buddies.
00:24:42.820
Um, and I was like, yeah, you know, if you want to, if you can, you know, I know you don't typically do deliveries, but if you could bring me an order, you know, you're welcome to stay.
00:24:54.020
So, he brings, like, two, two big, two big Mexican dudes, and, like, ten big booty Latina beautiful, beautiful chicks.
00:25:02.880
Um, and a candy dish with all these different pills, Valium, Xanax, uh, you know, Oxys, uh, just all that.
00:25:12.880
And at least an eight ball of Coke, a giant bag of Coke.
00:25:19.640
Uh, but, uh, and so we spent the night partying, um, you know, hanging out in the indoor pool, you know, doing lines off of, you know, girls' stomachs.
00:25:34.060
I mean, it was, like, literally, like, the show Entourage, but, like, junkie version.
00:25:52.980
Um, it's, it's so, like, cause I was, I was going back and trying to, like, remember things.
00:25:57.580
And it's, like, some of it is so blurry that it's hard to, like, wait, when, how old was I?
00:26:03.620
Yes, I grew up in that area, so I know what you're talking about.
00:26:10.660
The next morning, myself and a few other people leave.
00:26:16.680
No, slept, no, I didn't sleep, didn't sleep for a second.
00:26:19.980
Um, and, yeah, left the next morning with a few of my buddies and, and the, the game bangers departed.
00:26:31.200
Um, and, uh, so, you know, I go back to Orange County and, um, the next day, a police officer comes to our house.
00:26:41.740
And, um, it was, like, a female, um, investigator and she's, like, asking me questions.
00:26:47.720
Like, were you at this house and blah, blah, blah.
00:26:49.800
And I was, like, I was there on, she's, like, were you there, like, Saturday?
00:26:57.100
I was told we were allowed to be there because I thought it was breaking and entering.
00:27:01.160
And so, I was, like, I was told we were supposed to be there, allowed to be there.
00:27:04.440
And, you know, so, and she's, like, well, you're, you're not aware that, that, uh, that portion of the house was burned down?
00:27:14.560
And, uh, so, she proceeds to tell me the story.
00:27:18.820
Apparently, um, some of the other people that, uh, the girl invited out for the next night,
00:27:25.160
one person got really high, fell asleep with, like, a, uh, frozen pizza in the, uh, oven or something like that and started a fire.
00:27:33.800
And instead of, like, trying to put out, they just left.
00:27:42.540
And so, there's, like, literally smoke billowing from this.
00:27:47.140
So, like, you can see it from, like, like, very far away.
00:27:57.320
Um, and so, like, they're driving down the hill as the fire, uh, you know, the ambulance and the cops are coming up the hill.
00:28:05.280
And the cop flips a U and he's, like, because it's a private road and only leads to that house.
00:28:09.840
And, uh, so, they're, like, are you leaving that house?
00:28:20.300
So, you know, the, and, um, the, I think one of them ended up getting charged with, like, fleeing the scene of a crime or something like that.
00:28:39.480
Because the, the house owner basically gave her a list of everyone who was there.
00:28:44.840
Like, the girl who took us out there basically gave the, uh, investment.
00:28:51.660
So, as you're doing lines off the navels of Big Booty Latinas with your gangbanger heroin dealer buddy in some girl's uncle's house where Entourage was filmed, what are your parents thinking at this point of, like, what you're doing?
00:29:10.820
Uh, well, my parents, you know, God bless them.
00:29:15.720
And, like, and my, and my dad, you know, had this consistent belief that, you know, our kids will do the right thing because it's the right thing to do, not because of the consequence that could come from it.
00:29:27.680
And, you know, as, as, you know, as noble as that is, it's just, it doesn't work.
00:29:35.500
Otherwise, you will run rampant and think you can do whatever you want.
00:29:42.060
I grew up around, I mean, they sound like Southern Californians in their attitudes that way.
00:29:46.060
And, you know, yeah, my dad was just, you know, very, you know, had a very strong moral conviction that, you know, he believed just was passed on to us.
00:29:56.140
And so, so my parents were, again, you know, had no idea what was going on until kind of another story, basically, long story short, I had a friend who was put into a coma.
00:30:11.960
Um, we were at a party and this guy, this guy came out really angry and just punched my friend in the face.
00:30:21.180
And, um, he wakes up three weeks later and my mom is there.
00:30:26.780
And she, and he says, Patty, you need to get Chris away from, and she named out, she named, you know, some of the kids that I was associating with.
00:30:36.560
You know, because, you know, they were at my house.
00:30:38.160
That was the first thing he said when he came out of a coma?
00:30:47.440
It was, uh, and then of course, you know, at the time I was like that, you know, snitch, uh, you know, that kind of mentality.
00:30:54.840
It's like, why are you trying to rain on my parade?
00:30:58.660
Um, and, uh, but yeah, you know, I mean, my friends tried several, like, you know, my, my, my, my quote unquote stoner friends tried several interventions.
00:31:08.140
Um, and I was just like, you know, extremely defensive and like, who are you people to tell me anything, you know?
00:31:16.220
Um, and, you know, but again, they had my best interest at heart.
00:31:21.100
And, uh, and, you know, many of those people I'm still in contact with today and, um, I'm so grateful that they, you know, took the time and the effort to try to save me from myself.
00:31:33.740
Are you still in, are you still in high school at this point?
00:31:38.960
Going to class, you know, leaving early, uh, stuff like that, you know, ditching, you know, like fifth period, fourth period to go hang out and, you know.
00:31:51.580
Like, what's the schedule for heroin addiction?
00:31:59.560
So it's, so in California, um, heroin's mostly black tar heroin.
00:32:10.660
Um, but, uh, yeah, it's like this, like, little black, yeah, like square.
00:32:18.540
You put a lighter underneath it and you get a straw and it makes like, it goes, it'll like trail down the tinfoil and you're, and the smoke's coming up and you suck it through the straw with the lighter.
00:32:39.740
Again, you feel like you're on, you're on top of the world.
00:32:42.540
You can, it doesn't matter if you're literally, your life is falling down around you.
00:33:01.180
And again, it all depends on like your tolerance level and things like that and things like that.
00:33:04.900
But I would say like, uh, you know, probably three, four hours, five hours.
00:33:13.960
So while you're in high school, when are you smoking heroin?
00:33:17.720
Uh, so I would do it, uh, before school, uh, you know, at home.
00:33:30.260
They, so when my friend got out of the coma, they, you know, started to kind of try to keep
00:33:36.220
a closer eye on me, but I was still, you know, I was incredibly deceptive and very manipulative.
00:33:44.580
Very manipulative and deceptive, uh, with my parents, uh, making them think that, oh,
00:33:53.220
Uh, um, and God, when I think about like the torment that I put my parents through, it
00:33:59.220
Where were you getting the money to buy all this heroin?
00:34:02.200
Uh, so I was, um, I had, I had, I still had that job at the, um, uh, golf or selling golf
00:34:11.100
And, um, and then I, you know, I would occasionally take money from my parents, um, whatever I needed
00:34:18.480
to do, um, and then things I'm, you know, not proud of.
00:34:24.540
Uh, but yeah, that's the nature of the disease is you will do anything to get that, get that
00:34:33.940
Um, and, uh, so from smoking, it quickly deteriorated to, um, to shooting up because, you know,
00:34:47.400
I'd say within like a month of smoking it, I started shooting up because, you know, my
00:34:53.340
couple of my buddies started doing it and they're like, oh my gosh, dude, you only have to use
00:34:56.720
like one fifth of the amount and you get like a high that's like 10 times better.
00:35:05.120
And yeah, I remember the first time, like I remember the first time my buddy and I did
00:35:08.620
it, we looked it up, how to inject, you know, great Google search, how to inject heroin into
00:35:16.220
It's like, and then they have like images of like, cause you're supposed to go like diagonally
00:35:19.720
like with the, you know, like just go straight down.
00:35:22.140
Cause you want to, you want to go into the vein.
00:35:25.140
And then, and then you basically draw back the syringe and once you see blood, cause you
00:35:30.220
know that it's in the vein, then you inject it.
00:35:38.180
Uh, you basically, what happens is like you don't, and you don't get that immediate euphoric
00:35:45.440
That's, that doesn't come with smoke, like smoking it.
00:35:50.280
It's like that it's instantaneous and it's, it hits so much harder.
00:36:03.320
So how long between you, you know, the moment you first crushed a pill and snorted it and
00:36:15.940
Uh, I would say less than a year, probably about like nine months.
00:36:29.680
So what was it like the first time you shot heroin?
00:36:32.540
Uh, it was at my buddy's, uh, buddy's house in, um, in Laguna Hills in, in Nell, that neighborhood
00:36:44.340
And, uh, so yeah, we were, um, in his room and I did it.
00:36:50.640
And then, yeah, again, it's that, just this overwhelming sense of euphoria and yeah, everything
00:36:58.000
is wonderful, even if, you know, you're, even if your life sucks and, and again, I understand
00:37:05.260
why a lot of, you know, like homeless people do drugs.
00:37:07.200
It's like, because their life is literally just in shambles and, you know, so I mean.
00:37:17.980
Why not just live in like a, you know, almost like a metaverse, you know?
00:37:25.680
So, yeah, so I went to like, probably I would say not exaggerating over 10 rehab centers
00:37:34.540
Wait, so how did you get, okay, so you start shooting heroin.
00:37:42.320
So, uh, I, uh, I was, uh, so I was shooting up on a daily basis and I actually started going
00:37:50.380
to a continuation school because I was just, I stopped going to class.
00:37:57.380
Um, and you know, I basically got kicked out of school.
00:38:05.120
The, the place I'm, the place I would ridicule and mock, like, and then I'm now I'm one of
00:38:15.760
No, because he was, um, he was like much older.
00:38:20.240
Or like, yeah, he was, uh, yeah, he was a senior when I, like I was a sophomore and he, and
00:38:25.260
Like I saw him a few times on campus, but he barely went to school even when he was at
00:38:30.140
Um, and yeah, we, we really didn't associate with that guy other than just to go buy drugs.
00:38:34.980
But, um, cause he was not exactly, you know, a fun person to be around.
00:38:39.100
Uh, and so I doing drugs, doing hair, or doing, shooting up heroin before school.
00:38:46.300
And for some reason that day I decided to take my, uh, take all my drugs with me.
00:38:52.540
I had a little like Ziploc packet with my syringe, my, uh, you know, my, uh, what I use
00:39:00.480
to tie off, you know, you know, all my equipment.
00:39:04.640
So, uh, there are certain pharmacies that will, you know, if you say, uh, you know,
00:39:09.100
my, my grandmother's a diabetic or whatever, um, that, and I think nowadays they just give
00:39:14.360
them to you in a lot of places, especially like Northern California.
00:39:18.740
Anything they can do to encourage a drug addicted population, therefore.
00:39:25.780
The money, like, you know, he talks about this multifaceted plan to attack the opioid epidemic.
00:39:30.460
It's like, yeah, you've spent billions of dollars and it's only gotten worse.
00:39:37.160
Um, and so I got, uh, so I decided for some dumb reason to bring my, uh, drugs to school
00:39:45.700
And, uh, and I also did something that I would never normally do.
00:39:51.140
It's, I, I told some random person that I'd never met that I was high on heroin, like in
00:39:57.060
class, like someone I sat next to the first time seemed like a cool person, cool guy.
00:40:04.660
And like, didn't seem like he was going to tell on me.
00:40:08.980
And, uh, and so I'm in, I remember like two periods later, I'm in class and, uh, some
00:40:17.120
administrator comes into the room and says, um, Chris Chella, can you come to the office?
00:40:22.180
And, and I saw a cop behind her and I was like, oh, fuck.
00:40:25.980
And so I go down to the office and, um, she's like, yeah, um, we heard a rumor that you were
00:40:43.260
Um, but they're like, she's like, okay, well, um, you know, we're going to search you.
00:40:48.200
And I was like, I don't think you guys have the, I don't think you guys have the legal
00:40:54.960
And she's like, if we have probable cause and like, you know, the, basically I, I allowed
00:41:00.540
I wasn't sure if it was legal or not, but, um, I was hoping that, and, and so they searched
00:41:11.280
And then she says, wait, let me check your socks.
00:41:23.660
It's just like high socks with it just like right here.
00:41:27.000
And, um, so I get, you know, arrested or detained and my, you know, the cop releases me into
00:41:41.940
Like, uh, you know, I don't want to hear anything about it.
00:41:47.980
And your mom is like someone who knows opioids, like how bad it is.
00:41:52.920
And, um, and that's why she would, you know, at times, you know, when it was like, I was
00:41:59.160
in terrible withdrawal and I was like, mom, I, I'm dying.
00:42:03.280
Like, I, I need, like, please just give me like, you know, and, you know, she would occasionally
00:42:07.760
give me a little bit of money just to, cause she felt, cause she knew, she knew and God
00:42:13.540
You know, she just, I put so, I, you know, I rained down so much terror and chaos upon my
00:42:21.400
They just, they were just trying everything they could think of.
00:42:24.560
And, you know, some things they did really well.
00:42:26.920
Some things, obviously, you know, again, being a parent is hard, especially a parent of a
00:42:34.440
Um, uh, and, and, and, and dealing with, you know, obviously, you know, my sister's issues
00:42:41.060
Um, but as soon as my mom turned her back, I stole the $80 she had in cash out of her
00:42:47.300
wallet and drove to LA and obviously, um, um, oh, so the gangbanger that I, I left this
00:42:56.580
out, the gangbanger that I was partying with, and I really regret doing this because, you
00:43:01.460
know, I consider him a friend, but I was desperate at the time.
00:43:05.560
And so I was like, all right, I'm going to rob him.
00:43:12.120
Um, and so I, I, that doesn't seem like a good decision.
00:43:15.960
No, no, um, again, but you know, so desperate in, in agony and like, what else can I do?
00:43:25.100
Um, so I got this like 220 pound, 225 pound Scottish kid and this big kid from the football
00:43:33.320
Um, and I'm like, yeah, we're just going to rob this little skinny Mexican guy.
00:43:38.540
And, um, as, as, as we were getting up there, wait, wait, wait, wait, like super dumb people
00:43:48.140
One of, one of them, one of them became a meth head.
00:43:50.260
He mocked me for being a heroin addict and like, you know, shunned me, but then he became
00:43:55.020
And, um, uh, but when I like, but you just go to them cold, Hey, we're going to rob some
00:44:02.080
And I, I failed to mention that he was, you know, a gangbanger and, you know, had associations
00:44:11.100
And, uh, and so I, I kind of let, I accidentally let that slip, um, on the ride up there and
00:44:17.260
they're like, uh, we don't want to do this anymore.
00:44:21.880
And, and, and, and so like we get there and I'm like, you fucking pussies.
00:44:27.440
Um, so I just, uh, uh, get into the car myself and commit it and commit the robbery.
00:44:37.280
So, um, I sprayed him in the face with pepper spray and, um, uh, put something to his throat
00:44:45.620
I just reached into the, cause I knew where he kept it and just reached and grabbed it.
00:44:52.040
My friend was in the driver's seat and I was like, go.
00:44:59.000
Like, um, cause it's very narrow streets in that area.
00:45:09.020
Uh, this was in like Southgate, like the same, same area that, you know, I was going to pick
00:45:16.720
You pepper sprayed a member of the Mexican mafia and stole his heroin.
00:45:26.500
Have you apologized to him, by the way, years later?
00:45:32.860
Uh, if, if, if, if you're watching, I apologize, man.
00:45:36.560
Okay, I was about to say, would you like to say sorry?
00:45:43.860
So my friend's driving down the street and we, I see him driving down the like perpendicular
00:45:51.780
I just like unloaded a bunch of pepper spray in his face.
00:46:01.440
Um, and so we're, uh, like my, so I'm like, all right, just keep driving.
00:46:07.080
And he, for some reason, he like just does like a wild turn onto a very narrow, um, residential
00:46:21.140
I've, I've, I've, I've, yes, I've gone to confession so many times.
00:46:26.060
But just to say thank you too for being here, for being alive.
00:46:34.560
I mean, the amount of, not just, you know, the stupid things that I was doing outside
00:46:38.700
of my use, but I mean, the, like, if I was an addict in the age of fentanyl, where like
00:46:44.580
fentanyl is laced in, I would probably would have died.
00:46:47.360
Um, just because I stopped in 2016 when that was like, when it started to really get like
00:46:53.240
when, when they started to put heroin into fentanyl or fentanyl into heroin and other drugs
00:46:59.100
When Trump got elected and the Chinese decided to just like kill a huge part of our population.
00:47:14.160
And by the way, can I just make one other editorial comment as a product of Southern
00:47:23.500
Um, and I grew up there, you know, in the, in the early eighties was when I was your
00:47:28.980
eight, you know, uh, the age you describe and it was so decadent that I, I almost never
00:47:35.600
But, um, but you were a product of that society.
00:47:42.900
You may not learn until you're older, but I'm going to tell you now, it's very hard to
00:47:57.880
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Anyway, okay, so your friend, you see the guy from the Mexican Mafia.
00:48:41.080
He's somehow recovered from getting shot in the face with pepper spray.
00:48:45.060
Of course he has a gun in the vehicle and he's looking to kill you.
00:48:50.500
Your friend swerves down a narrow road and head on.
00:49:06.600
So you're still like jumpy withdrawal guy at this point.
00:49:09.900
And, but I like, I stashed it and this one, like there was like, cause there was a bunch
00:49:14.780
of people like they immediately started to like, and my two friends take off by the way.
00:49:31.120
I mean, well, one of them was Hispanic, so maybe not so much, but, but the Scottish guy.
00:49:43.620
I stash my drugs, sit down on the curb and wait for the police.
00:49:47.620
Um, you know, cause there's, there's so many people there, so many witnesses.
00:49:51.000
Um, and, but again, no one knew that what had just transpired all this, all again, like
00:49:58.340
it was just a, a, a car accident as far as they were concerned.
00:50:05.800
And so, uh, yeah, my friends run and the cops, the cops come, they show up, they're like,
00:50:14.440
I was like, we were trying to find a friend's house.
00:50:16.020
We got turned around, um, uh, yeah, made up some bullshit story.
00:50:24.600
And, um, and he's like, well, do you need to go to the hospital?
00:50:30.520
And he's like, okay, well, um, do you, do you have a ride?
00:50:34.200
I was like, yeah, I'm going to call somebody to pick me up.
00:50:37.300
And, um, so, you know, I wait for them to depart and go back into the little bush and of
00:50:44.740
Uh, and, um, and then I, uh, I got, I ended up getting a ride from a buddy, another user.
00:50:51.700
And I was like, Hey, I'll give you some, give you some dope.
00:50:54.600
Because I was, I was very concerned that they were going to like, you know, I was like, I
00:51:03.500
So I was like, dude, just please come, come pick me up.
00:51:11.500
Well, I, I was, I was actually this, this nice lady.
00:51:14.160
Um, she was, uh, like her house was like right next to where the accident took place.
00:51:19.240
And so I was like, do you mind if I just like post up on your, on your front step?
00:51:22.260
Like, I was like, I'm, I just want to wait for my ride.
00:51:25.440
And, you know, it's kind of, I'm kind of scared.
00:51:28.080
I'm in a dangerous neighborhood, you know, played like the little, oh, you know, uh, and,
00:51:36.420
Uh, and so I just sit there and wait and, um, and, you know, I have like the drugs in my
00:51:40.540
fist ready to like toss them at a moment's notice if I need to or whatever.
00:51:43.920
Um, and, and then I get picked up and that's that.
00:51:47.980
Um, but what transpired after, because thankfully they only knew me by CJ, like Chris Jr., my
00:51:56.100
initials, that's what I went by, my nickname from like kindergarten through, yeah, through
00:52:02.700
Um, and then they, and they knew I lived in South Orange County and, but they didn't know
00:52:08.440
And so they would, so they, they switched up the way they did their, um, uh, like the way
00:52:15.080
they did the process of selling the dope where they would, now you had to, so you had
00:52:18.860
to meet up, then follow them down like this empty street or an alley or something like
00:52:23.560
that, then stand up against a chain link fence and get searched.
00:52:29.100
And then you could get into the car and get your stuff.
00:52:32.940
And, and they would ask every single person, do you know CJ, do you know, uh, CJ from
00:52:37.420
South Orange County, do you know where he lives?
00:52:39.860
And yeah, so for a very long while, um, and you know, I was like so grateful when I saw
00:52:45.420
that OC Register article, the fact that they had, and I saw that his picture, um, in the,
00:52:50.040
you know, his mugshot in the article, the wild, um, and his name listed, uh, I'm just not
00:52:57.380
going to say it, uh, but, um, yeah, I mean, crazy stuff.
00:53:02.340
Let me just pause to ask you, the, the guys who you were with on that caper where you
00:53:09.000
assaulted the member of the Mexican mafia, did they turn out okay?
00:53:18.540
Um, and it's ironic because when they got like, when they got, uh, caught, they got caught
00:53:24.160
at like a seven or a Starbucks, um, cops picked them up and they immediately just spilled
00:53:30.400
everything, they told them the whole story for no reason.
00:53:33.360
And I know for a fact because my father represented him in the hit and run and the, the, the, the,
00:53:40.640
I took the, uh, DA like until almost the end of the trial to figure out that I was also associate
00:53:46.780
and like, he's like, wait, your son was involved in this.
00:53:49.940
And, and, and my dad was like trying so hard to thread the needle, you know, to not get
00:53:55.860
me, not expose me to any potential criminality and also, you know, defend my friend.
00:54:08.020
And the other one, uh, I kind of lost, lost contact with, have no idea.
00:54:11.420
How many of the guys that you partied with in high school are sober now?
00:54:17.340
Um, from high school, uh, most, uh, yeah, I, I, one friend passed away, um, opiate user,
00:54:25.860
good guy, but, um, you know, he wasn't like a particularly heinous junkie.
00:54:33.260
Um, but he was a good, I like, you know, good hearted.
00:54:40.160
Uh, and, um, you know, I had, I met a few friends in rehab.
00:54:44.680
One, whom I was very close to, lived in New York and, you know, we stayed in contact,
00:54:49.260
met in Florida, stayed in contact, um, and for, you know, like four years.
00:54:54.380
And then, uh, you know, I got a call from his mom that saying that he had OD'd, you know,
00:54:58.520
relapsed and, uh, and, you know, it was just heartbreaking.
00:55:01.900
Uh, but, uh, yeah, most, but no, most of my friends, like the, like the stoners from high
00:55:07.320
school, um, are very successful individuals, college graduates, um, you know, working in
00:55:14.640
finance, working in different, you know, sectors and having a great life.
00:55:22.180
Uh, the opioid users kind of like, they, they have the advantage of like, um, uh, many of them
00:55:29.300
that I hang out with or hung out with, excuse me, were already, you know, their family was
00:55:35.440
Um, like one of them, one of their fathers was the CEO of a company called AmeriQuest.
00:55:43.100
Uh, so they, uh, they had a, you know, a lot of money to fall back on.
00:55:48.340
So like they tried opening up like a clothing line, different thing, but ultimately.
00:55:58.100
No, there were other kids in our, uh, in, in Orange County that did do that, that started,
00:56:13.540
Um, but, um, anyway, so yeah, so I've, uh, well, yeah, but most of my friends from high
00:56:21.440
And, uh, I mean, my, like the one, the stoners are, yeah, yeah.
00:56:25.760
Um, but unfortunately, yeah, I've lost multiple friends, you know, people that I actually genuinely
00:56:33.360
cared about, not just, you know, acquaintances, acquaintances.
00:56:36.680
You know, I had too many acquaintances to count, but, um, you know, real friends, it's been
00:56:42.200
Do you have any idea what happened to the guy you pepper sprayed?
00:56:49.640
When I was in rehab, so the guy, the guy boss, right?
00:56:53.260
He had different runners, like, you know, multiple guys who would run to cars.
00:56:56.520
And one time I had this guy and, um, and so I was in rehab and it was like a, it was
00:57:12.320
And, uh, yeah, it's like, you're setting yourself up to fail.
00:57:17.340
Um, but, uh, they, uh, had like, it was a mansion and then it, uh, kind of like a bungalow.
00:57:25.120
They had little like bungalows, um, like type things.
00:57:27.980
And so it could house about like 30, 40 people.
00:57:30.800
And so they, um, had me there and this guy comes in and I'm like, he looks familiar.
00:57:38.980
And I didn't like, I didn't, I couldn't put my finger on where I'd seen him before.
00:57:43.480
And he goes, he goes, Hey man, he said, he said, I used to, he said, I used to run for
00:57:49.040
And I, uh, he's like, I, I think I delivered to you once.
00:57:54.160
And he's like, and he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, you're friends with
00:58:04.300
And, um, I was like, I heard he was locked up though.
00:58:10.760
And he's like, I'll tell him you said hi when, cause that you get a seven day blackout and
00:58:15.800
Uh, when you first go in a lot of treatment centers have that rule.
00:58:19.840
Um, and so he's like, yeah, I'll tell you said what up when I, uh, when I talked to him,
00:58:27.980
I'm like, Oh my God, he's, this guy's going to knife me in my sleep, you know?
00:58:32.540
And I was seriously, I, I was concerned, I was going to tell, uh, like my therapist
00:58:38.460
and see, you know, what could potentially be done because I was genuinely, cause you
00:58:44.080
could easily in that place, sneak out of your bedroom, go in and go into someone else's
00:58:51.000
You know, they have, you know, quote unquote people that are watching at night, but the
00:59:00.680
No, no, of course not because, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
00:59:05.900
Um, people were buying air duster and like, you know, like anything to get a buzz.
00:59:11.360
And I was just like, wow, uh, that was kind of eyeopening for me, but not eyeopening enough
00:59:21.140
Uh, total between California and Florida, probably somewhere between 15 and 20, 15 and
00:59:28.600
Um, I got, cause I got kicked out of a bunch of places for stupid, for, for reasons that
00:59:33.460
were not related to drugs necessarily, uh, fratner's eight, fratnization.
00:59:39.460
Hooking up with girls that were grabbing the girls.
00:59:52.520
And, um, so I mean, I was like 17, 18 years old.
00:59:56.920
Um, and, uh, and you, and you have heroin affect your sex drive.
01:00:05.080
And then when you come off of it, horny 24, seven, like, yeah.
01:00:12.400
And, and it's, it's interesting because like my, one of my therapists described, um, withdrawal
01:00:18.240
as your body basically being in shock because you've been numbing all your senses for so
01:00:25.340
And then when you stop, your body is like, everything is just like taking in light.
01:00:34.780
Like my eyes hurt, my teeth hurt, every muscle and bone in my body ached.
01:00:40.400
Like it, it is, if you could find a way to like inject that into like find a way to like
01:00:46.340
inject that feeling into like a, for interrogation purposes, let that guy sweat it out for a
01:00:54.180
I assure you, you know, it is like a truly, I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.
01:01:00.680
So did you have to detox, I guess every single time, 15 or 20 times?
01:01:06.380
Um, there were a few times when I was, uh, like kind of just on and off using.
01:01:13.300
And so it was like the withdrawal was like, yeah, I kind of felt it, but there were, yeah,
01:01:18.520
probably about 10 times when I went through hardcore withdrawal.
01:01:22.640
And, uh, yeah, every single time I was like, I never want to feel this feeling again, you know?
01:01:28.920
And, but I wasn't, I still wasn't committing to myself that I wanted to stop.
01:01:39.480
Uh, I mean, it's, they say like up to like seven days typically, but I mean, in reality,
01:01:45.520
I, I mean, my, um, withdrawal, um, the, my last withdrawal lasted about like three, it
01:01:53.760
was like three weeks before I remember, I remember like the day I was like laying in bed and I
01:02:02.760
Like I, I can, I'm like, I feel, I feel kind of normal.
01:02:07.540
I mean, and it's like, again, the first week is just like absolute hell.
01:02:11.840
You're sweating bullets, you're, uh, cold, like the sweat on your body makes you cold.
01:02:18.620
And again, all the other things I described, um, and that just slowly.
01:02:24.080
And then, and then the, the discomfort, it's like the epitome of discomfort.
01:02:29.140
Um, uh, some people, some people got like diarrhea, things like that.
01:02:33.080
I did, uh, I didn't, some people got like would vomit and stuff, but that never really
01:02:38.780
It's, I guess it's just, you know, it depends on the person, but, um, yeah, it just, just,
01:02:44.500
uh, overwhelming like sense of just, yeah, shock, I guess is the best way to put it.
01:02:59.080
So rehab, I mean, you're making a pretty strong case.
01:03:03.180
I mean, if you went to 50, I mean, God knows what that cost, by the way, you know, someone
01:03:08.200
I don't know if it was your family or some insurance program, the state taxpayers, whatever,
01:03:13.280
Um, yeah, the, so the first rehab I ever went to was, it was called the Phoenix house and
01:03:18.500
it was in, um, it was in like Northern Orange County and it was a state run facility.
01:03:23.880
And like you, it was like a, kind of like a bootcamp style.
01:03:28.760
You had to like fold your bed with the military, you know, corner crease and everything like
01:03:33.360
All your, um, shirts had to be lined up your, um, you know, your toiletries had to be perfectly
01:03:41.620
Um, and you know, I did that and I was like, I was like, I hate this, this sucks.
01:03:50.240
And all I want to do is get out and you, you know, I'm just like, I just can't wait
01:03:56.040
And, and I was like, I was like, I don't think I want to do, I was like, I, at that time
01:03:59.920
I was like, I don't think I want to do heroin, but I definitely want to like, I still want
01:04:06.480
And like, and, uh, I mean, to this day, I still, you know, smoke marijuana and drink, uh,
01:04:19.680
And that I, or, you know, I just wasn't ready to quit yet.
01:04:22.640
And I think what, what it's really, you can go to as many different treatment centers,
01:04:30.480
It has to be, I think, an intrinsic motivation to better yourself.
01:04:43.240
If you're doing it for your child, if you're doing it for your wife, if you're doing it for
01:04:49.140
Hey, it's Tucker Carlson, not to be a moralizer, but some things, and you know this as well
01:04:54.480
They may not be illegal, but you'd never do them for reasons of self-respect, if no other.
01:04:59.160
And teabagging, sorry to say it, teabagging is one of those.
01:05:04.760
And yet the big nicotine pouch companies encourage you to teabag.
01:05:08.880
They call them nicotine pouches, but they're basically teabags.
01:05:26.960
Now you can show that self-respect with our no teabagging t-shirt, which you can find right
01:05:33.900
Okay, so let me just ask you, I've heard and known, I've heard this story and I've known
01:05:40.680
many people who've lived this story where they're addicted to something, whether it's
01:05:48.240
And they just go to rehab after rehab after rehab, relapse after relapse after relapse,
01:05:55.900
And, you know, they feel like losers, you know, when you keep failing at something, it's
01:06:01.440
So why do we have, like, what's the point of this?
01:06:03.980
Like, why do we have, these centers clearly don't work.
01:06:10.380
I mean, again, it's, it's, I think that like, it's, it's, it all depends on the person,
01:06:18.280
That's the bottom line is like, you have to want it.
01:06:19.880
And like these treatment centers, they can't, they do some good, but they should not be like,
01:06:25.480
you should not say, you know, rehab is a cure or AA is a cure because,
01:06:30.860
like, yeah, if you're go, if you go into those places, you can sometimes develop the
01:06:35.900
intrinsic motivation through therapy or through discussion with other people or whatever.
01:06:41.200
But I mean, for me, it was so, uh, fast forward a little bit.
01:06:46.580
So, you know, I, I get basically kicked out of every rehab in California.
01:06:49.660
So my parents are like, all right, let's send you to Florida.
01:06:53.560
And, and, uh, South Florida was like the rehab capital.
01:07:02.080
Um, uh, and it was just, I mean, I was shocked that like some of the places where the halfway
01:07:11.080
houses were, or the, um, sober homes were located like down the street from like the known markets
01:07:18.660
where people like, we're, you know, it's a scam.
01:07:23.420
I'm a sober person, totally opposed to drugs and alcohol, period.
01:07:29.960
This is a, these places are a scam, not all of them.
01:07:32.960
But a lot of them are just a money-making scam profiting off the misery and death of addicts.
01:07:39.240
They see you as an insurance policy with a heartbeat.
01:07:47.280
This most, the most sinister man probably, uh, in, if you want to just pick one out is,
01:07:53.700
He was, uh, I, that was the first treatment center I went to in Florida.
01:07:57.400
So **** owned a treatment center and he owned several halfway houses.
01:08:01.600
But they were all, everything was in his wife's name.
01:08:04.760
That's one thing that was like a red flag to me.
01:08:06.860
Um, and so, and this guy shows up to the, to the rehab center in like a three-piece, you
01:08:11.740
know, Armani suit with like a Gucci belt and like, you know, um, like dressed like a pimp,
01:08:17.340
you know, I mean, and, and ironically, he is a pimp.
01:08:21.460
He was, so he had girls in his halfway houses that he was giving heroin, giving crack and pimping
01:08:28.100
them out and then sending them back to treatment where they would ultimately fail their drug
01:08:36.860
And guess who gets a kickback from the detox center?
01:08:42.260
And then it was the South Florida rehab shuffle.
01:08:46.440
If you, you know, you just Google that, you'll see, you know, a bunch of different stories,
01:08:49.780
but as I would say is like the kingpin of just absolute scumbag, like you said, villain,
01:09:00.280
It's so, yeah, it's, it's, it's incomprehensible to me as a human being.
01:09:08.420
And so does he, does he, is he still in this business?
01:09:11.040
No, he's, he's, he was sentenced to 27 years in prison.
01:09:15.120
So the, the feds, the feds started to crack down on the, the Florida rehab shuffle.
01:09:19.740
Although I read, uh, somewhere that it's supposedly coming back, um, that the, you know, cause it's
01:09:26.680
basically, and you know, wasn't the, he was probably one of the worst offenders, but a
01:09:31.360
lot of these guys were, you know, they, they would just like, you know, get these cheap homes,
01:09:35.520
um, fill them with as many addicts as they could.
01:09:38.800
Um, sometimes they would charge rent like 75 bucks a week or something like that.
01:09:42.680
Plus the money they're getting from, uh, you know, kickbacks from the, uh, whichever treatment
01:09:48.200
So, you know, they're housed, they send them, and then, and then if they go to detox, you
01:09:52.840
know, the kickback, it's, it's a revolving door of chaos and, you know, revolving door
01:10:01.660
And, uh, and, but they're making money at every stop.
01:10:08.020
Do the addicts in the rehab center understand that they are pawns in a profit making scheme?
01:10:15.280
I think, uh, a lot of people were starting to wake up to it.
01:10:17.860
And I, and I knew one of the girls who was, um, one of his victims and she would, she was
01:10:24.240
always like, man, I just want to get the hell out of here.
01:10:26.980
And she had this like look in her, like, I could see that there was something.
01:10:30.780
And I thought she was just very like, you know, maybe had some, some issues with her family
01:10:35.180
or whatever, just a very depressed, sad person, even for an addict, even for an addict.
01:10:39.140
Like I could tell that there was something like she was in absolute, like misery and
01:10:46.080
She was afraid of, they were afraid, many people were afraid of him and what he would do if
01:10:52.880
And, uh, it was just, it was heartbreaking for me to see that.
01:10:57.560
Uh, you know, even as someone who's, you know, obviously committed crimes and things like
01:11:02.420
that, I, I can't even imagine having the, the, the, the will to carry out such a monstrous
01:11:14.640
So, I mean, that many rehabs, you met a lot of people.
01:11:20.800
Addicts are some of the most resourceful, intelligent people on the planet.
01:11:28.180
Like you drop an addict in the middle of the, the desert and they're going to find the nearest,
01:11:33.160
um, tribe, um, with an opium pipe, uh, you know, within 30 minutes.
01:11:37.500
Um, and so if you get, they're single-minded, aren't they?
01:11:41.980
Well, yeah, but if you get them to, uh, if you can, you know, separate them from the drug
01:11:48.800
and separate them from the addiction and turn that into something that's good, like,
01:11:54.540
you know, an addiction to work or addiction to helping others, you know, that you can get
01:11:58.580
addicted to, like, I mean, for me, um, the, the reason I got sober, I think there's, uh,
01:12:09.460
Obviously God, uh, you know, and, um, and the intrinsic motivation, you know, that I talked
01:12:15.940
about, uh, and, and having a fantastic support system that was there for me.
01:12:21.500
They were just waiting for me to come to them, you know, just like, Hey, we're here.
01:12:29.120
My family and, um, and, um, one of the, uh, one halfway house owner who was kind of
01:12:36.400
participating in this game, but he cared, like he cared.
01:12:38.680
He genuinely cared about the people who were coming to his house.
01:12:41.360
He did not allow any drug use or anything like that.
01:12:44.500
There was, I was at one place that was selling this, this guy was selling crack to his clients
01:12:52.960
And he was selling crack to just people in general.
01:12:55.380
So we would get knocks on our doors at three o'clock in the morning from total fucking spun
01:13:03.260
And there was no door on the bathroom that it was a hundred, you know, it was the middle
01:13:09.560
It's like 110 degrees out, no air conditioning, just fans littering the, you know, littered
01:13:14.340
across the living room and down the hallways and stuff.
01:13:19.960
And people are smoking crack in the halfway house.
01:13:35.240
Uh, I'd say it is, it's very destructive, um, obviously, but in terms of like a high,
01:13:42.980
it's, it's like you're, it's like 30 minutes of like, I can, you know, kind of that I can
01:13:49.880
You want to start doing all these like different tasks that you've been putting off, like, because
01:13:53.860
you feel confident about them now, but then it wears off and then you're just like so depressed
01:13:59.040
and you think about every bad thing you've ever, it's like, uh, yeah, like, um, I don't
01:14:03.360
know if you've ever had like cocaine withdrawal, like, or, you know, just coming off of cocaine
01:14:09.160
Like my dad would tell me that when he would do coke, like, he was just like, you think
01:14:12.240
about like, yeah, in third grade when I pushed that kid, you know, uh, again, into the stairwell
01:14:16.980
or whatever, uh, just like every, you know, and just like, you just feel like a piece of
01:14:26.500
And, and, and the crack, it lasts, it's like the, it, the high is so fleeting too.
01:14:31.400
Like with heroin, at least you get like a few good hours of, you know, a solid buzz, but
01:14:36.240
with crack, it's like, uh, you know, it goes away relatively fast.
01:14:41.660
Did you, how many people in rehab or halfway houses did you meet who were determined to get
01:14:50.980
How, um, every person, I think without exception, I know who's been addicted to drugs or alcohol
01:14:58.380
who got better has a sense that there's, what does he say in AA, a great, you know, a greater
01:15:05.840
And that, you know, human beings have souls and each one is unique and important and life
01:15:13.360
And, you know, it's sort of like the basic branding of monotheism.
01:15:17.260
So, like how big a role did God play in any of these rehab centers?
01:15:22.160
Well, well, when I was, so I was living in the, the halfway house, I was selling, the guy
01:15:26.280
was selling crack to, to us and, um, I had, I just smoked some marijuana for the first time
01:15:32.140
And it made me like very introspective, you know, we can do that, um, say kind of like
01:15:38.340
Um, and, and I was like, you know, I just, I, and I heard a voice in my head that I can
01:15:43.320
only assume is just, you know, a spiritual awakening God saying like, what are you doing?
01:15:51.140
Like looking around, I'm just like, I have so much more to offer the world than what I'm,
01:15:57.020
you know, I mean, I've, I'm just a derelict and I don't have to be.
01:16:01.800
I have people who would, you know, would die for me.
01:16:04.760
Uh, you know, my family is, you know, uh, you know, are so loyal, uh, and they love me so much.
01:16:12.220
They just want me to stop being a piece of, piece of garbage.
01:16:15.380
And, uh, and I just, that day I was like, I am done with this stuff.
01:16:22.300
Like, and, and I, and I wanted to better myself.
01:16:26.460
That was, so, you know, I think that was God instilling the motivation.
01:16:31.740
So, yeah, I mean, yeah, I got sober at a crack house.
01:16:36.280
It's kind of funny, you know, tried 50 different rehab centers, but ended up, you know, getting
01:16:49.860
And yeah, you could smoke anything you wanted in there pretty much.
01:16:57.580
I knew I was never going to touch an opiate again.
01:16:59.540
And I know people say like, you, you have to wake up and make a decision every day that
01:17:02.900
you're not going to use, but it's like, I don't even, it doesn't even like register in
01:17:06.720
Like, like to fit, to say it, like, oh, I'm not going to use heroin today because like,
01:17:14.640
It's like, because it's like, I look back and I'm like, that's, I'm a different person.
01:17:21.420
It was like a powder pillar becoming a butterfly or, you know, whatever analogy you want to
01:17:26.380
use, but, um, just, and looking back and thinking, how could I have possibly done all this?
01:17:33.400
And, uh, and yeah, I mean, Christ plays a huge role, uh, and I think it's really important.
01:17:39.860
And even for people who are, excuse me, uh, you know, maybe atheistic or whatever, but
01:17:47.280
just believing in something greater than yourself that can, uh, that, you know, you can strive
01:17:54.760
to be better and strive to, you know, just whatever, set goals for yourself and achieve
01:18:00.980
And by doing that, you are, you know, I think that's how people can, can find a way out of
01:18:09.340
addiction and then, and then you grasp onto something, find things that you really enjoy.
01:18:13.560
So like what, I was like, okay, what do I enjoy?
01:18:17.360
I'm a huge movie fanatic and I like, I'm really interested in politics and journalism.
01:18:21.520
And ironically, what, I mean, I was always, uh, you know, my, like Fox news was on my parents
01:18:28.500
television 24 seven, you know, so I grew up conservative.
01:18:30.660
My grandmother, um, was a, uh, door knocker for, um, uh, for Reagan and for, um,
01:18:41.120
Um, no, the, he was the first, the first conservative to run.
01:18:49.960
And, um, so yeah, politics kind of is in my DNA, I would say.
01:18:56.260
And, uh, I remember watching Fox in the lead up to the presidential election.
01:19:00.880
It was like the perfect time to be, get interested in politics, right?
01:19:07.580
And, and then, uh, I remember seeing you and I was like, and I'm not just saying this
01:19:19.140
And I was like, I, I like, I love the way this guy does the news.
01:19:28.780
You're like, here's a Southern Californian who had addiction problems and he turned out.
01:19:39.880
No, I was just like, I was just like, wow, this guy is like so much different than the
01:19:45.420
I mean, not to, you know, I mean, you know, you just had, it brings such a unique perspective.
01:19:52.180
You're willing to, you know, uh, go against, you know, you quote unquote, the party and
01:19:57.520
call out the, you know, the rhinos and neocons and all that stuff.
01:20:03.900
And so let me ask you like a philosophical question.
01:20:08.260
So in between jobs, once I got fired from another job, I was an unpaid fellow at a libertarian
01:20:15.360
And I thought it was a libertarian sort of am libertarian in a lot of ways still, you
01:20:20.700
know, I really don't want to bother other people, but I, I left after a drug policy conference
01:20:27.020
that I went to that really kind of changed my thinking on the world.
01:20:29.520
And at it, they explained the libertarian position on drug policy, which is kind of America's
01:20:33.840
position on drug policy, which is, it's the drug addicts fault.
01:20:41.100
And it's kind of the demand explanation for the drug epidemic.
01:20:45.300
It's like, we have a lot of drugs because people want a lot of drugs in this country.
01:20:48.400
It's not Mexico or China's fault or the drug dealers.
01:20:51.200
No, the, the, the, um, yeah, the desire for it.
01:20:56.460
It's like, if you people didn't want it so badly, you know, it's, and I thought, you
01:21:01.980
I mean, it's kind of like one of those lines you hear, they're like, yeah, that sounds
01:21:05.360
And then you think of your own life and then you think of the people, you know, who
01:21:10.740
got, you know, tragically fucked up or killed by drugs.
01:21:13.560
And I, of course I know a lot of them and you think, no, actually, like some of them are
01:21:19.460
like your mom, super healthy person, obviously a distance runner, the healthiest person like
01:21:24.500
in America, you know, they're distance runners.
01:21:27.040
And she has an injury and some doctor gives her a drug and she becomes an addict.
01:21:31.720
And my, and my dad, literally one time he went into the office and he grabbed the guy by
01:21:40.580
And, and, um, I should say your parents, such a beautiful, you told me off camera are still
01:21:58.960
And the reason, just really quick, the reason my dad fell in love with my mom, like at first
01:22:03.020
sight was because he said she was the only woman in New York he saw that was wearing
01:22:06.800
a crucifix, like he, that he'd seen in New York.
01:22:16.820
I'd like to throw a few doctors against the wall myself.
01:22:21.280
And then there's your story, which is like insecure high school kid.
01:22:25.280
Like how many high school kids are not insecure?
01:22:28.440
Like the feelings that you described, like, I don't quite fit in.
01:22:39.080
And then you become like a crazed, you know, needle dependent heroin addict and you're pepper
01:22:45.120
spraying members, the Mexican mafia and almost getting killed.
01:22:49.840
So that suggests to me that what we have is a supply problem, not a demand problem.
01:22:54.380
Like you're in it, you know, you probably would have been happy with Bud Light or Coors Light
01:22:59.740
And instead you wind up on heroin because you had access to this drug.
01:23:05.060
So if you take 100 people and give them heroin every day for a month, like what percentage
01:23:13.080
So for sure it was I was just thinking this at this drug policy conference and I was like,
01:23:22.080
And it's the Cato Institute and they're definitely liars.
01:23:25.240
I can say that now, but I didn't understand it until because this is the one topic I knew
01:23:32.200
But like, what is the answer to this problem that kills over 100,000 people a year?
01:23:39.600
Like from like a from like a government perspective?
01:23:41.620
Yeah, like what are we it seems like we're paying addicts to use drugs.
01:23:46.840
I mean, I mean, I think that one thing we should not be doing is what California is doing and
01:23:52.480
trying to do set up like little basically porter pot, porter potties for addicts to go in and,
01:23:56.960
you know, use and, you know, like little centers with clean needles and all that stuff.
01:24:10.940
You that is the worst thing you can do because they're just going to continue using.
01:24:16.020
And heroin is not a drug that you can use like and like it's not like a, you know,
01:24:22.340
because there's a lot of functional alcoholics and functional, you know, people who, you know,
01:24:27.100
are on like, you know, Valium or whatever, you know, kind of pill poppers that that, you
01:24:34.160
But yeah, heroin, I just I've never seen anyone who doesn't it doesn't become a lifestyle.
01:24:39.760
It's not it's not like a side thing, you know, or hobby or whatever.
01:24:52.620
Meth, like inside and out to heroin doesn't quite like do the damage to your like your
01:25:08.700
And so in northern California, because we moved to northern California after when I was when
01:25:17.220
I remember my dad came down to San Diego because I was in rehab in San Diego and he picked
01:25:22.440
me up and we drove north to where to the Bay Area to the East Bay.
01:25:40.580
Well, Concord has been kind of been taken over by there's a lot of gang activity.
01:25:48.360
So they're like, I think they're probably going to do something about it because Clayton's
01:25:52.080
So they're probably going to start cracking down more because, you know, the rich people
01:25:56.860
You know, and so, yeah, so we moved up there and again, I started associating with the worst
01:26:06.100
of the worst that just, you know, gangbanging meth heads.
01:26:11.800
And I remember I was just at this guy's house and he pulls out a pipe like, all right.
01:26:33.720
But my but but like my became my best friend was it was a dealer.
01:26:40.640
So it's like I would always just, yeah, take it like a puff or two.
01:26:45.240
There was one point where I stayed up for 12 days straight and then slept for eight hours
01:26:50.180
and stayed up for another sort of total of 17 days.
01:26:55.360
And because doing heroin and meth, it's like like meth when you're like basically like,
01:27:04.040
you know, you're up for a day or two, you start to get weird seeing shadow people and
01:27:09.760
Then you do heroin and it's like it's like resets you almost.
01:27:12.860
It's kind of like it's like it's like you it's like almost like you slept a little bit and your
01:27:16.760
brain's like back to normal and it's not going into crazy mode.
01:27:21.100
I have seen meth heads like I remember this one story.
01:27:26.060
So I was we were at this girl's house in her garage and as myself, our dealer and this
01:27:35.040
chick and she had, you know, just all of her face scratching it from scratching.
01:27:47.480
You know, we're just going, you know, from place to place trying to, you know, find a
01:27:51.720
spot to, you know, kick it and rest or whatever.
01:27:53.880
And so we're smoking in there for like three, four hours.
01:27:56.500
And her and my friend go into the bathroom or inside or inside her house.
01:28:02.960
And I just kind of like sit back and I end up like falling asleep.
01:28:07.580
And I didn't realize I was like, I woke up and I was like, I had no idea how long I'd
01:28:11.500
been asleep, like 30 seconds, 30 minutes, whatever.
01:28:16.100
So I like knock on the garage and not garage door kind of peek my head in.
01:28:29.340
She's like, what what are you doing in my in my house?
01:28:44.800
And like, it's this switch that flips for some people.
01:28:49.380
But this flip that switches and you they just become in a totally different, irrational,
01:28:58.140
And so so this woman has a gun pointed at me and she's like, I want she's like, empty
01:29:04.580
And I I went like this and pulled out like, you know, I was like, look, I didn't steal
01:29:10.520
I poked my head into your place for two seconds.
01:29:12.560
And I'm like, by the way, if you have your kids sleeping in there, you're kind of a shitty
01:29:17.320
You know, because I'm like, so you insult the lady with the gun pointed at you.
01:29:21.020
Because I was thinking another if I can just ask you to pause, Chris, another unwise decision.
01:29:26.600
But I was thinking I was like, this woman isn't going to pull the trigger.
01:29:29.840
It was a neighborhood that the houses were like right next to each other.
01:29:41.840
So, you know, I'm not exactly in the best, you know, decision making frame of mind.
01:29:46.740
But anyways, so she's like, she's like, take your fucking clothes off.
01:29:59.280
I was like, I didn't steal a fucking thing from you.
01:30:06.420
And so, and I'm like, and I'm looking at my friend and I'm like, dude, and he's just
01:30:17.320
Like, so that night, so she's like, all right, get the fuck out of here.
01:30:21.320
And she opens her garage up for us and we leave.
01:30:24.180
And my friend calls an Uber and the Uber, like the, her phone died in the middle of the
01:30:34.640
And so the woman who was driving us was like, get out, get out of my car right now.
01:30:39.320
And, uh, we were like, uh, still like a couple of miles from our destination, uh, his sister's
01:30:52.660
And so we walk up the street, um, and there's this house and, uh, he's like, yeah, um, I forget
01:31:01.400
who he said owned it, but, um, he's like, yeah, it's cool if we crash here and he tries
01:31:06.980
He's like, all right, let me go around the back.
01:31:08.360
And he's like rummaging around, he's rummaging around in the backyard and I'm standing in
01:31:14.280
Cause I didn't think there was anything sketchy and this car drives by and it kind of slows
01:31:19.460
down and, um, and then it keeps going and I'm like, huh, that was weird.
01:31:33.440
I grabbed my backpack, hopped the fence into the backyard and I was like, Hey dude, someone's
01:31:41.360
Um, and I'm running and I, it's like, it's four, it's like four in the morning in Northern
01:31:49.200
And I'm running and it's pitch black and I fall into a pool.
01:31:53.880
Um, it was, this was like one of the worst nights of my life and I was in, and I was
01:31:58.880
in a low key opiate withdrawal too on top of all of that.
01:32:02.260
On top of the meth and the crazy girl pointing the gun at you.
01:32:06.940
And probably if I, yeah, if I had been, you know, if I was on heroin, it probably would
01:32:11.340
have gone down a lot differently, but, uh, I probably wouldn't have been as aggressive,
01:32:21.160
Um, I see flashlights like coming towards us and this guy has, has already booked it
01:32:33.680
Um, and so I, I like, I, um, get out of the pool and I try to climb the fence and I still
01:32:40.700
have my backpack on and, you know, like soaking wet and I couldn't climb.
01:32:44.780
So I just shed the backpack and just hop the fence and I'm running down this hill and, um,
01:32:51.640
and I run face first into a, um, chain link fence.
01:32:58.080
And, um, and my face is like, you know, so now my face is bleeding and my hands are bleeding
01:33:04.520
from climbing the fence and like, I, and, uh, I don't have any shoes on.
01:33:08.600
And, um, so, so I am just so cold and so miserable.
01:33:14.420
And so I, there was a, like a hill and then there was a grocery store, kind of a little strip
01:33:21.180
And so I go down there and I look for the sketchiest person possible.
01:33:30.920
They're my, using my radar and, uh, and I was like, Hey man, can I use your phone to call
01:33:35.560
Cause I knew if I asked any normal person, they saw me with blood on my face and no shoes
01:33:40.020
They'd be like, uh, get the fuck away from me, sir, please.
01:33:43.280
Um, but, uh, no, they were, uh, they were really nice.
01:33:48.340
They, um, let me use their phone and I called a taxi, jumped into the taxi.
01:33:53.800
I was like, please turn the heat up as high as you can.
01:33:56.460
And I, uh, went home and at first my parents weren't going to let me in.
01:34:03.300
And, um, I was like, listen, I'm, I'm probably going to get hypothermia if you don't let me
01:34:10.880
I, and I remember like going into their room and just like wrapping myself up in a, in
01:34:16.680
And, and I was, there was like, I'd never felt so, um, relieved in my life.
01:34:25.540
Um, I think it was someone who, uh, like, because the house, it turns out the house was
01:34:30.580
for rent and it was, uh, it was, um, there was no one in it.
01:34:35.520
And so I didn't, you know, of course I didn't know that he said, yeah, this is a spot that
01:34:41.100
I just assumed it was another dope fiends, another dope fiends place.
01:34:50.160
And, you know, one thing that really breaks my heart is like, it's really the, yeah, uh,
01:34:56.720
one of the most, I'd say difficult things that I had to accept that I did was, um, cause
01:35:03.080
my dad would from time to time figure out where I was and go to these, you know, these
01:35:09.340
crack houses and, and places like that and beg me to come home.
01:35:13.840
And I remember one time specifically, he said, please, please, Chris, please come home.
01:35:31.060
And he's like, okay, well at least take, and he gave me his, um, his crucifix and, uh, St.
01:35:39.260
Um, I still have, I broke the chain, but I still have them today, uh, to this day.
01:35:44.420
And, uh, gosh, even then it tore me up, you know, because I, I just wasn't ready to stop.
01:35:53.200
And I didn't know, like, you know, I didn't want to cause this pain that, you know, and
01:35:59.900
And so I drowned it out with this more use and, you know, to, to try to, um.
01:36:08.740
So when you quit 2016, how long did it take to get back your equilibrium for your brain
01:36:18.200
to start functioning as it had before you started using opioids?
01:36:22.180
Um, honestly, I don't know that it will, it, it has ever gotten back to where it was before,
01:36:28.620
but I think that it, it took about, I would say like nine months to a year to like, get
01:36:36.060
like the, all like to get the fog out and like, you know, have like, cause like my memory
01:36:45.700
And so in order to get, you know, to get those receptors and everything firing again and to
01:36:59.860
Um, I would say, I'd say memory loss is definitely a thing.
01:37:03.060
Um, equilibrium, like I have a very bad equilibrium.
01:37:06.640
Like people think I'm drunk sometimes because I'll like stumble, but it's just like, no, I'm
01:37:14.000
And, uh, I mean, obviously, you know, long-term like things like anxiety, you know, you know,
01:37:20.260
it's ironic because a lot of people use heroin to treat their anxiety and, um, but it causes,
01:37:28.720
Um, uh, and, uh, so yeah, anxiety, depression, um, just, yeah, a myriad of bad things.
01:37:38.300
Have you known, you know, people addicted to opioids and have heard that it affects your
01:37:47.220
I would say that, yeah, I didn't, I always, and I, you know, and, and even to this day,
01:37:52.360
like have this kind of sense sometimes of like imposter syndrome.
01:37:56.780
Like I like, you know, you know, for example, like getting a job in Congress, working for
01:38:03.180
Matt Gaetz and having Matt Gaetz compliment me and tell me and say all these nice things
01:38:07.620
It's like, I don't feel like I deserve this praise, you know?
01:38:14.540
I'm a, like, I'm a decent person, but yeah, I, it's like, I, it took me a while to just
01:38:20.520
understand that like, yeah, I am worthy of these.
01:38:26.900
I've done a lot of bad things, but I've done everything I can to try to, you know, repair
01:38:33.480
And so like, so no, I deserve, you know, it's just, it's hard to force yourself to, you know,
01:38:40.640
accept like, yeah, you're like, you're doing well.
01:38:43.360
Like just be, yes, you were, you were as bad as it could get, but you've turned it around.
01:38:49.080
And like, you know, I was, I was kind of nervous about this interview, but then I was like,
01:38:54.000
and I was talking to my dad and he's like, Chris, you stopped using heroin.
01:39:03.020
And I mean, yeah, you know, it was, um, and again, like I go back to the intrinsic motivation.
01:39:10.020
It's just so important to want to level up in life.
01:39:13.620
And I think that like, you know, I kind of compare it to like the whole body positivity movement.
01:39:19.100
And I'm not talking about people with like medical issues, but like you're 40 pounds overweight.
01:39:25.300
It's like, no, put the donut down, go to the gym.
01:39:27.400
Like, you know, stop, stop coddling people who are, you know, who have a food addiction.
01:39:33.000
Encouraging people to destroy themselves is the way I think about it.
01:39:36.260
Only, only people who are filled with hate would do that.
01:39:43.060
If you're encouraging someone to hurt himself, you hate that person.
01:39:51.500
If you did that to your kids here, get type two diabetes here, become a junkie.
01:39:55.620
You would be a terrible parent, but you would be acting of hate for your kids.
01:40:03.760
And, uh, you know, that's why, you know, like, you know, you see all these like Victoria's
01:40:07.000
Secret plus size, you know, it's like, and again, you shouldn't, you shouldn't do,
01:40:11.060
you shouldn't want to better yourself, you know, for societal acceptance, but for your
01:40:15.480
own sense of, you know, happiness and wellbeing and purpose, because you talk to any person
01:40:20.800
who's overweight, you know, and like, again, without medical conditions, um, like, obviously
01:40:25.760
they're going to say, yes, I would prefer to be, prefer to lose a few pounds.
01:40:28.700
I mean, I would assume I've never talked to every obese, I haven't talked to every obese
01:40:33.320
person on the planet, but the ones that I have talked to, yeah, I would like.
01:40:40.900
And, and, and, and, and, yeah, and like Victoria's Secret and these other places trying to tell
01:40:57.860
And that's, that's the worst thing you can do in this life, in my opinion.
01:41:02.400
Big pharma is the closest thing to like, you know, like if you just want to talk about
01:41:07.220
pure evil, like getting into the realm of demonically stick, big pharma is, I think,
01:41:14.100
the prime example, what they've done to this country.
01:41:17.780
Chris, thank you for spending all this time and for being so totally honest about your
01:41:21.760
And I never say, I hope this helps people because it feels like so banal, but I do hope
01:41:31.140
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