The Tucker Carlson Show - Israel’s Purging of Christians From the Holy Land and the Plot to Keep Americans From Noticing

00:00:00.000 There's something about true things that just sound different.

00:00:05.020 When you hear something that's true, there's a different pitch or tone or vibration.

00:00:12.340 It's kind of hard to describe.

00:00:14.180 But when someone says something true, even if you don't exactly understand what it means,

00:00:18.480 it sticks with you.

00:00:20.200 The truth rings differently from lies.

00:00:24.200 And recently, for a lot of different reasons, mostly because of the pressure being exerted

00:00:30.920 on our society, you're hearing a lot of lies, but you're also hearing a lot of true things.

00:00:34.620 And some of them are about the nation of Israel.

00:00:38.960 And they're obvious things like, does the United States have an actual interest in supporting

00:00:45.100 Israel unequivocally?

00:00:46.640 Is Israel really our closest ally?

00:00:48.900 Is there a good reason for this?

00:00:50.340 Why are so many members of Congress taking money from a foreign government lobby?

00:00:55.360 Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

00:00:57.180 These are all true things.

00:00:59.020 They point to the truth.

00:01:00.900 They are questions that evoke true answers.

00:01:05.880 And the response to this has been very, very telling.

00:01:10.300 The response has been shouting and screaming accusations.

00:01:16.560 It has not been engagement.

00:01:18.220 Almost nobody on the other side of the debate has said, for sure, let me calmly explain why

00:01:24.080 Israel's our greatest ally, and we should say, fund the killing in Gaza.

00:01:27.740 Here's why it's good for the United States to spend this much money on Israel's, well, at

00:01:32.720 this point, seven simultaneous wars.

00:01:35.540 A seven-front war.

00:01:36.740 We're paying for it.

00:01:37.600 Why is that a good idea for the United States?

00:01:39.780 How is it morally justifiable?

00:01:41.240 And what's the purpose of this exactly?

00:01:43.600 Is it really to defend the country, or is it to expand its territory?

00:01:46.480 No one will answer those questions.

00:01:49.660 And that is why, simply, you're hearing this very loud conversation about anti-Semitism,

00:01:56.860 which all of a sudden is everywhere.

00:01:58.340 It's America's biggest problem.

00:01:59.680 Well, there is, of course, anti-Semitism, and it's wrong.

00:02:03.300 It's always wrong to hate people for their blood.

00:02:07.140 There's no question about that.

00:02:08.900 But is anti-Semitism really America's biggest problem?

00:02:11.860 Well, no, it's not.

00:02:13.240 It's not even in the top 100 biggest problems, bad as it is.

00:02:18.020 You're hearing about it as a way to shut down truthful, honest questions.

00:02:24.360 And that's, of course, the dynamic.

00:02:25.820 And it's very clear to anybody who's paying attention.

00:02:28.960 The problem with this dynamic is that it can inspire a lot of anger and, in fact, a lot

00:02:35.800 of hate.

00:02:36.200 People are getting madder and madder and madder on this topic on both sides, and you have

00:02:42.500 to wonder why that is.

00:02:44.160 Why doesn't someone just stand up and say, let's have a reasonable discussion about this?

00:02:47.840 Let's just lay it out there in non-emotional terms, non-hateful terms, without attacking

00:02:53.540 an entire group of people, any group of people.

00:02:55.920 Whether it's the Jews or the Muslims or the Christians, let's just slow down and be rational

00:03:00.840 about this.

00:03:01.960 Why is no one doing that?

00:03:03.020 Well, it's possible that there are some people in this conversation, maybe on both sides,

00:03:07.580 who want to inspire hate.

00:03:11.220 And that's not a good idea for anyone.

00:03:13.820 For this country, for Christians, it's forbidden.

00:03:15.780 Christians are not allowed to hate people.

00:03:17.780 They understand that it's against God's law.

00:03:20.440 It's also the fastest way to corrode your soul and turn you into a monster.

00:03:24.180 And of course, you don't want that.

00:03:26.600 So how do you have a rational conversation about what's best for your country without

00:03:31.060 becoming hateful yourself or inspiring hate in other people?

00:03:34.560 We've really thought a lot about this.

00:03:37.080 Don't become what they call you.

00:03:39.980 That's our number one imperative, at least on this show.

00:03:43.020 They call you a hater, don't become one.

00:03:45.960 So we're trying.

00:03:46.780 So we're doing a couple of things.

00:03:47.700 The first is we're flying to Jerusalem to interview Mike Huckabee.

00:03:51.440 Mike Huckabee is, of course, the American ambassador to Israel, someone I've known for over 30 years

00:03:59.900 and always liked, and also a Baptist preacher of some kind, but certainly a prominent Baptist

00:04:07.460 religious figure, also U.S. ambassador, and someone who has views that I just don't agree

00:04:14.320 with at all on questions of American foreign policy and also on questions of theology.

00:04:18.800 He's a famous Christian Zionist and a famous proponent of neocon foreign policy.

00:04:24.520 I disagree with both.

00:04:25.780 However, it seems like of all the people you could talk to, maybe Mike Huckabee is a guy

00:04:31.640 you could talk to in a reasonable way, in a calm way, without shouting or hatred.

00:04:39.860 By the way, if you want a picture of what hell itself is like, it's shouting and hatred.

00:04:43.760 It's a large group of people screaming, calling for violence.

00:04:48.840 That is literally a picture of hell, and don't live in it if you can help it.

00:04:52.320 We don't want to.

00:04:53.620 So maybe Huckabee is the guy to begin a reasonable conversation about what's best for the United

00:05:00.480 States and what's true about Christian theology.

00:05:02.740 So we're going to try.

00:05:03.360 We're flying to Jerusalem.

00:05:04.160 Difficult to do, not without risk, but we're doing it because we really believe that the

00:05:10.760 direction that this conversation is moving is bad.

00:05:13.860 It's bad for everybody.

00:05:15.080 It's bad for the country, and it's bad for our souls.

00:05:17.700 So maybe that's a start toward making it better.

00:05:21.320 And the second thing we're really trying to do is to speak to Christians in the Middle East

00:05:27.400 about the situation in the Middle East.

00:05:29.340 And maybe not accidentally, that is the one group you almost never hear from in the United

00:05:35.080 States.

00:05:35.640 There are an awful lot of particularly Protestant evangelical ministers, leaders talking about

00:05:41.420 Israel, Israel as they often call it, and what Christians are supposed to think about

00:05:46.560 it, what they're required to think about it, what the U.S. government and the U.S. military

00:05:49.320 should do to aid Israel, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

00:05:52.260 And those are almost always framed in terms of the West versus Islam, you know, Israel,

00:05:59.400 United States versus the Muslims.

00:06:01.060 Okay.

00:06:02.320 But there's almost never any mention of the fact that the world's oldest Christian community

00:06:08.620 is in that area, in the Levant, in Israel, Palestine, Lebanon, and Syria, that part of

00:06:16.680 the Middle East that is not so far away, it's on the Mediterranean, and is, of course, the

00:06:22.980 birthplace of Christianity, of Jesus himself.

00:06:26.440 And there have been Christians there for 2,000 years, uninterrupted.

00:06:31.400 And we know that both from the historical record and from DNA tests.

00:06:35.000 So if you're interested in Christianity, if you are a Christian, one of the first questions

00:06:39.480 you ought to ask is, how are Christians in the Middle East doing?

00:06:42.980 And the political lines have changed, of course.

00:06:46.480 And after the fall of the Ottoman Empire, at the end of the First World War, that whole

00:06:50.640 area was carved up into different countries, nation states, run by colonial powers, France

00:06:55.900 and England.

00:06:57.040 And they became Syria, Lebanon, Palestine, then after 1948, with the creation of Israel,

00:07:02.000 Israel, and then after 67, the West Bank.

00:07:04.620 I mean, it's been carved up over thousands of years by many different empires.

00:07:08.780 But that region has remained the same, and its population has remained remarkably stable,

00:07:14.380 and the Christian population has never left.

00:07:16.400 These are not converts.

00:07:17.400 These are the original Christians.

00:07:19.560 It doesn't mean they're right about everything, but it means if you want to know what's actually

00:07:24.440 happening, maybe you should talk to them.

00:07:26.620 And two, it's great shame.

00:07:27.860 It's great shame.

00:07:29.300 The American evangelical community, such as it is, or its leaders, have been very resistant

00:07:34.060 to talking to Middle Eastern Christians, or even to thinking about Middle Eastern Christians

00:07:42.160 and the effect of American policy on those people.

00:07:45.080 But we think it's really important for two reasons.

00:07:47.640 One, it's just inherent.

00:07:49.760 Like, what about the Christians is a fair question for Christians to ask.

00:07:53.180 In fact, they should be required to ask that question.

00:07:55.140 And second, because sincere Christians are not allowed to hate or be anti-Semitic or hate

00:08:01.500 all Muslims or hate all anybody or hate at all, it's forbidden by their religion, talking

00:08:07.860 to them directly is a great way to de-escalate what is, by design, becoming a tribal war.

00:08:17.420 There is no reason for any conversation about American foreign policy to devolve into Jews

00:08:24.860 versus everyone else or everyone versus Jews or any of this stuff.

00:08:28.000 It's all awful.

00:08:28.980 It's all a dead end.

00:08:29.980 It will end in violence.

00:08:31.880 That's obvious.

00:08:32.980 And then censorship and all the things that you don't want in your country.

00:08:37.420 So, like, don't go there.

00:08:39.740 And we've really tried not to go there.

00:08:42.860 And of course, they've called this show anti-Semitic, Nazi, and all this stuff and all of their

00:08:46.960 paid shills have joined in on this, but we still have to resist becoming what they call

00:08:54.900 us.

00:08:55.200 That is our job, period, as Americans and as Christians, to keep the hate out of our hearts

00:09:01.460 and to stay reasonable.

00:09:03.960 And talking to Middle Eastern Christians, sincere Christians, is a really important way to keep

00:09:10.720 the conversation exactly where it should be.

00:09:12.540 So, if you spend the evening at my house, you are guaranteed to find yourself in a conversation

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00:11:32.940 So with that introduction, I want to introduce you to Fares Abraham, who is a Christian minister.

00:11:42.640 He leads a ministry here in the United States, who is originally from a town called Bet-Sahur,

00:11:46.820 which is right outside Bethlehem, birthplace of Jesus.

00:11:49.860 Bet-Sahur, you're going to hear him explain in a minute, is the place where the shepherds saw,

00:11:56.340 and the wise men saw, the angels announce Jesus' birth in the Gospels.

00:12:02.000 And so he is literally from that town.

00:12:04.340 It is a Palestinian village in what we call the West Bank, the West Bank of the Jordan River,

00:12:10.660 that was part of Jordan until 1967, but has always been there.

00:12:14.580 And it is a majority, about 80% Christian village.

00:12:18.180 And it's disappearing.

00:12:19.500 The Christians are leaving.

00:12:21.400 And there's not a lot of debate about why they're leaving.

00:12:25.000 They're not leaving because, primarily because of the Muslims,

00:12:28.540 are leaving because of Jewish settlers moved into the town by the Israeli government

00:12:35.720 with funding from the United States, from a lot of Christians, by the way, in the United States,

00:12:39.260 not just Jews, Christians in the United States,

00:12:41.280 paying for these settlers to come and are driving out the Christian population.

00:12:45.060 There is no rational justification for this.

00:12:49.240 There's no moral justification for it.

00:12:50.900 It's an atrocity.

00:12:52.620 And it is almost never spoken about in non-polemical, honest ways.

00:12:58.140 And this man came to our attention some months ago.

00:13:01.880 We've talked to him extensively.

00:13:03.920 We think he is a truly decent man who has no hate in his heart.

00:13:08.440 You can judge for yourself.

00:13:09.680 But no matter what side of this conversation you're on,

00:13:12.720 and particularly if you're a Christian Zionist,

00:13:15.080 and by the way, go ahead and remain one if you like,

00:13:17.760 but you should know that your views,

00:13:21.220 and in some cases your money,

00:13:22.960 is funding the displacement and the murder

00:13:26.620 of the oldest Christian community in the world.

00:13:31.500 So with that, here's Faraz Abraham,

00:13:34.520 originally from Bet-Sahur in the West Bank.

00:13:38.120 Thanks for doing this.

00:13:39.060 So you are from a Christian village

00:13:42.120 outside Bethlehem, birthplace of Jesus, correct?

00:13:45.840 Yes.

00:13:47.100 From Bet-Sahur.

00:13:48.300 Bet-Sahur.

00:13:49.140 So what is Bet-Sahur?

00:13:51.240 So first of all, thank you for having me here, Tucker.

00:13:53.420 Oh my gosh, of course.

00:13:54.680 And I wish I never had to do this interview,

00:13:57.000 to be honest with you.

00:13:58.460 But I feel compelled.

00:14:00.180 I feel a sense of urgency

00:14:01.400 because the little town that I come from

00:14:03.460 is under existential threat.

00:14:05.720 And let me say,

00:14:07.340 I come here as a Christian,

00:14:08.940 first and foremost,

00:14:10.420 very proud Christian,

00:14:11.500 and I'm a Palestinian-American Christian.

00:14:14.000 And I'm very proud of this country

00:14:15.840 and for what this country stands for

00:14:18.060 and for the great opportunity

00:14:19.420 that I was given as a Palestinian.

00:14:20.920 And this is my new homeland.

00:14:23.600 America gave me education, work,

00:14:27.400 and then later I got married.

00:14:29.380 I met the woman of my dreams here,

00:14:32.400 who, you know, my wife comes from Gaza.

00:14:34.740 And we met here in the States.

00:14:35.920 We started a family.

00:14:37.080 We pursued the American dream.

00:14:38.380 And I'm so grateful and so thankful.

00:14:39.940 But I'm here because I feel that

00:14:42.640 the little town of Beit Sahur

00:14:44.820 is really under imminent danger

00:14:49.040 that if nothing happens,

00:14:51.680 if we don't do anything about it,

00:14:53.020 there will be no more Christians

00:14:54.440 living in Beit Sahur today.

00:14:57.000 So it's a Christian-majority town.

00:15:00.380 And it's known for the shepherd's fields.

00:15:04.080 In Luke chapter 2,

00:15:05.920 when the angel of the Lord

00:15:07.420 appeared to the shepherds

00:15:08.640 who were tending to their flocks,

00:15:11.120 the angel appeared to them

00:15:12.740 and pronounced the greatest event

00:15:14.840 that ever happened in history,

00:15:16.540 which is the birth of the Messiah

00:15:17.920 in next door town,

00:15:20.260 in a little town.

00:15:20.940 So it says they were right outside town

00:15:22.760 and that's where they were.

00:15:24.240 Absolutely.

00:15:24.940 So this happened in Beit Sahur.

00:15:27.420 And if you go to Beit Sahur today,

00:15:28.520 the shepherd's field is there.

00:15:30.500 The people are there.

00:15:32.380 And the angel appeared also

00:15:34.800 with a chorus of angelic hosts

00:15:37.260 singing glory to God in the highest,

00:15:40.520 peace on earth

00:15:41.240 and great joy to great man.

00:15:42.880 Now, the significance of Beit Sahur

00:15:44.600 is that God chose this little town,

00:15:48.400 the town of the shepherds,

00:15:49.640 to announce the birth of Jesus.

00:15:52.500 God didn't choose the spiritual elites

00:15:54.940 and the religious institutions in Jerusalem.

00:15:57.040 Right.

00:15:57.900 And he did not choose the powerful politicians

00:16:02.080 and military in Rome,

00:16:03.760 but he chose to announce the birth of a Savior

00:16:06.520 in a town called Beit Sahur.

00:16:10.080 And when the shepherds went to Bethlehem,

00:16:12.640 they saw baby Jesus,

00:16:13.680 they came back rejoicing.

00:16:15.560 And they were the first evangelists

00:16:17.920 that told the world about the birth of Jesus.

00:16:21.180 God with us.

00:16:22.420 It was in those fields

00:16:25.560 where they were tending their flocks.

00:16:28.000 They were poor.

00:16:29.160 They were marginalized.

00:16:31.060 They were ordinary men and women

00:16:32.720 who just happened to be there

00:16:35.460 and God chose them to be there.

00:16:37.400 So Beit Sahur takes pride.

00:16:39.740 And it's not that we are privileged

00:16:41.280 and better than anybody else,

00:16:43.020 but that's the essence of the Christmas story

00:16:45.000 that God gives hope

00:16:46.620 to the people in the margins first.

00:16:48.980 God's grace reaches those people first.

00:16:51.900 And the town of Beit Sahur

00:16:53.540 takes very pride of this heritage

00:16:57.280 and this legacy.

00:16:58.800 How long has it been majority Christian?

00:17:00.540 It's been always majority Christian.

00:17:02.180 So for like thousands of years.

00:17:03.660 Since the time of Jesus.

00:17:05.760 We, you know,

00:17:06.440 the town of Beit Sahur

00:17:07.140 is the early descendants

00:17:08.480 of the first Christmas story.

00:17:10.840 And they have maintained

00:17:12.160 uninterrupted continuous presence

00:17:15.480 since the day of the announcement

00:17:18.800 of the birth of Jesus.

00:17:20.640 That's amazing.

00:17:21.120 How long has your family been there?

00:17:23.360 Generations.

00:17:24.480 We always jock around like,

00:17:26.500 we go back thousands of years.

00:17:31.580 Unfortunately,

00:17:32.100 we don't have a family tree

00:17:33.140 that could trace back

00:17:34.120 to the time of Jesus.

00:17:36.140 But the people have always lived there.

00:17:38.240 The people have always

00:17:39.340 farmed their lands.

00:17:40.860 So you're not a new convert

00:17:41.720 to Christianity.

00:17:42.580 We're not newcomers.

00:17:43.780 We don't come from

00:17:45.000 neighboring countries.

00:17:46.940 We're not converts.

00:17:48.120 We're not converts.

00:17:48.960 We're not newcomers.

00:17:50.020 We're not immigrants.

00:17:51.000 We're an indigenous people of the land.

00:17:53.380 Christian people.

00:17:54.040 Christian Palestinians

00:17:55.060 have a unique story to tell.

00:17:57.560 What's interesting is that

00:17:58.640 over that 2,000 year period,

00:18:01.400 you know,

00:18:01.680 a lot has happened.

00:18:02.720 A lot of different people

00:18:03.420 have ruled that area.

00:18:04.580 Of course,

00:18:04.900 originally the Romans.

00:18:05.960 Yes.

00:18:06.220 2,000 years ago

00:18:07.660 it was the Romans.

00:18:08.460 And then,

00:18:08.960 then of course,

00:18:10.920 you,

00:18:11.160 you know,

00:18:11.680 move up from Arabia.

00:18:13.480 Islam starts.

00:18:15.900 And then you have

00:18:16.860 the Crusades

00:18:17.700 kind of flip it over.

00:18:18.880 And then you have it flip back

00:18:20.320 and it becomes the Ottomans.

00:18:22.040 And then Muslims

00:18:23.460 run out of Istanbul,

00:18:26.260 Constantinople,

00:18:27.560 Turks.

00:18:28.200 And then you have the Brits

00:18:29.400 and now you have

00:18:30.400 the Israelis.

00:18:31.320 So during

00:18:31.840 all that time,

00:18:34.080 that village

00:18:35.000 remained Christian,

00:18:35.780 but you're saying now

00:18:37.060 under Israeli rule,

00:18:38.900 because it is ruled

00:18:39.880 by the Israelis,

00:18:40.560 correct?

00:18:41.080 Yes.

00:18:41.980 It's in danger

00:18:42.780 of becoming extinct.

00:18:45.060 I call Palestinian Christians

00:18:46.900 empire survivors.

00:18:48.660 Yeah.

00:18:49.320 We have survived

00:18:50.580 empires,

00:18:52.260 armies came and left,

00:18:54.160 rulers came and left.

00:18:55.160 A lot of them.

00:18:56.600 Identity changed,

00:18:57.940 language changed,

00:18:59.260 culture has been shaved

00:19:00.320 by those empires.

00:19:01.660 But the people

00:19:02.560 have always remained there.

00:19:04.720 the church

00:19:06.300 has always

00:19:07.180 been open

00:19:08.340 to worship,

00:19:09.580 has always maintained

00:19:10.900 a gospel witness.

00:19:12.440 And this is my

00:19:13.680 deepest concern

00:19:16.080 that if nothing

00:19:17.080 has happened,

00:19:18.400 if we don't do

00:19:19.420 anything about it,

00:19:20.160 there will be no more

00:19:20.960 Christians

00:19:21.360 in the Holy Land.

00:19:22.900 So they remain there

00:19:24.020 from, you know,

00:19:25.080 33 AD

00:19:26.040 until

00:19:27.260 1967.

00:19:28.720 1967.

00:19:30.180 And then in 1967,

00:19:31.240 when this area is annexed

00:19:32.880 by the government,

00:19:34.100 the real threat begins.

00:19:36.260 That's what you're saying.

00:19:37.160 Yes.

00:19:37.740 Israel has pursued

00:19:38.840 one strategy,

00:19:40.200 Tucker,

00:19:41.060 over decades,

00:19:42.300 which is take

00:19:43.260 as much Palestinian land

00:19:44.820 as possible

00:19:45.660 and keep

00:19:47.220 as few

00:19:48.080 Palestinians

00:19:48.760 on the land

00:19:49.600 as possible.

00:19:51.300 This has been

00:19:52.280 their strategy.

00:19:53.480 It has worked

00:19:54.620 for them

00:19:55.380 because they're

00:19:56.420 constantly

00:19:56.980 taking

00:19:57.500 Palestinian land

00:19:58.500 within,

00:19:58.840 we're talking about,

00:19:59.960 not proper Israel,

00:20:00.900 but we're talking about

00:20:01.540 1967

00:20:02.280 when they captured

00:20:03.480 West Bank,

00:20:04.440 East Jerusalem,

00:20:05.020 and in Gaza.

00:20:06.080 They have been

00:20:06.880 taking land.

00:20:07.620 They have been

00:20:08.080 building

00:20:08.620 settlements there.

00:20:10.820 And

00:20:11.180 this is

00:20:12.180 threatening

00:20:12.720 the local population,

00:20:14.180 especially

00:20:14.600 it comes

00:20:15.280 at a heavy price.

00:20:17.020 So

00:20:17.260 that has been

00:20:18.500 the policy

00:20:19.320 for decades

00:20:20.300 and it has

00:20:21.360 worked for them

00:20:22.040 because it's

00:20:22.560 almost near

00:20:23.180 completion now.

00:20:24.100 Yeah.

00:20:25.380 If you look

00:20:26.740 at Bethlehem,

00:20:28.220 the governor

00:20:28.800 to Bethlehem,

00:20:29.600 the district

00:20:30.020 of Bethlehem,

00:20:30.640 it is surrounded

00:20:31.660 by Israeli settlements.

00:20:33.920 And it's actually,

00:20:34.720 if you look it up,

00:20:35.760 the Bethlehem ring,

00:20:36.760 it's actually a thing.

00:20:38.220 It's a ring

00:20:38.980 of settlements

00:20:39.700 all encircling

00:20:41.220 every town,

00:20:42.820 every Palestinian village,

00:20:44.320 and they choose

00:20:45.340 these specific lands

00:20:47.460 strategically

00:20:48.240 on hilltops,

00:20:50.240 taking water resources,

00:20:52.180 building walls

00:20:53.080 around these settlements,

00:20:54.300 building new

00:20:55.880 roadblocks,

00:20:56.720 building new

00:20:57.240 checkpoints,

00:20:58.180 building new

00:20:58.920 security measures,

00:21:00.560 they call it,

00:21:01.140 motion sensors,

00:21:03.160 electric

00:21:03.640 barbed wires,

00:21:05.080 and it comes

00:21:05.800 at a really

00:21:06.700 deep expense

00:21:07.920 at the expense

00:21:08.580 of the local population.

00:21:10.040 So when,

00:21:10.580 so you grew up there?

00:21:12.040 Yes,

00:21:12.300 I grew up

00:21:13.020 in the town

00:21:14.180 of Bezahor.

00:21:15.040 What was that like?

00:21:15.940 What was

00:21:16.400 your experience

00:21:17.580 of the Israeli government

00:21:18.580 growing up

00:21:19.120 as a Christian

00:21:19.700 there?

00:21:20.200 Well,

00:21:21.740 I lived

00:21:22.160 through the

00:21:22.940 first

00:21:23.500 intifada

00:21:24.480 and we

00:21:26.500 lived next

00:21:27.420 to the

00:21:28.640 YMCA

00:21:29.240 in Bezahor.

00:21:30.580 There is actually

00:21:31.140 a YMCA

00:21:31.720 in Bezahor.

00:21:33.080 And down

00:21:33.700 the road

00:21:34.080 from us,

00:21:34.580 there was

00:21:34.900 an Israeli

00:21:35.640 bypass road

00:21:36.820 only.

00:21:38.240 What does that

00:21:38.700 mean?

00:21:39.340 It means

00:21:39.780 whenever they

00:21:40.560 build settlements,

00:21:41.260 they build

00:21:41.920 those roads

00:21:42.720 that are only

00:21:43.880 accessible

00:21:44.320 to settlers,

00:21:45.980 which

00:21:46.280 these roads

00:21:47.360 connect

00:21:48.080 the entire

00:21:49.200 settlements

00:21:50.520 together

00:21:51.020 and they

00:21:51.440 are directly

00:21:52.660 connected

00:21:53.080 to proper

00:21:53.560 Israel

00:21:53.900 so they

00:21:54.360 can

00:21:54.680 easy

00:21:55.520 of movement

00:21:56.140 for the

00:21:56.600 settlers

00:21:56.880 to go.

00:21:57.180 What do you

00:21:57.380 mean for

00:21:57.720 settlers?

00:21:58.240 You mean

00:21:58.440 you're not

00:21:58.820 allowed on

00:21:59.240 them?

00:22:00.120 No,

00:22:00.500 absolutely

00:22:00.860 not.

00:22:01.540 Some roads

00:22:02.140 in area

00:22:02.920 B

00:22:03.800 of the

00:22:04.380 West Bank

00:22:04.860 Palestinians

00:22:05.900 are allowed

00:22:06.660 on them

00:22:07.120 like between

00:22:07.760 the roads

00:22:08.180 between

00:22:09.120 Bethlehem

00:22:09.760 and Hebron

00:22:10.400 or Bethlehem

00:22:11.440 and Jericho.

00:22:12.160 There are

00:22:12.520 some few

00:22:13.500 very limited

00:22:14.320 roads that

00:22:15.500 you can't.

00:22:16.200 I mean,

00:22:16.440 what are

00:22:16.820 you going

00:22:17.000 to do?

00:22:17.680 We have

00:22:18.260 to share

00:22:18.580 the roads

00:22:18.940 but in

00:22:20.320 many of

00:22:20.680 these roads

00:22:21.140 Palestinians

00:22:21.660 are not

00:22:22.140 allowed to.

00:22:23.120 You're not

00:22:23.400 allowed?

00:22:23.880 No.

00:22:24.240 Like as

00:22:24.420 someone who's

00:22:24.740 born there?

00:22:25.680 Absolutely

00:22:26.120 not.

00:22:27.080 But that

00:22:27.960 road down

00:22:29.340 the street

00:22:29.840 from us,

00:22:30.920 we would

00:22:31.240 see

00:22:31.440 settlers

00:22:31.760 come and

00:22:32.280 go.

00:22:33.140 We would

00:22:33.460 see

00:22:33.880 Israeli

00:22:34.640 army

00:22:34.980 vehicles

00:22:35.460 come and

00:22:35.900 go.

00:22:36.640 And one

00:22:37.040 day we

00:22:37.360 were playing

00:22:37.740 outside.

00:22:38.240 Wait,

00:22:38.400 I'm sorry.

00:22:39.120 I mean,

00:22:40.080 I've been

00:22:40.780 there but

00:22:42.100 it's hard.

00:22:42.680 I didn't

00:22:43.140 fully digest

00:22:43.800 this I guess

00:22:44.280 at the

00:22:44.540 time.

00:22:44.920 So how

00:22:45.680 about right

00:22:46.020 now?

00:22:46.320 You're an

00:22:46.860 American,

00:22:47.320 you live in

00:22:47.880 the United

00:22:48.120 States,

00:22:48.420 you've been

00:22:48.580 here a

00:22:48.820 long time.

00:22:49.380 Could you

00:22:49.720 go and

00:22:50.140 get on

00:22:50.420 one of

00:22:50.640 those roads?

00:22:51.800 Let me

00:22:52.060 explain it

00:22:52.460 this way.

00:22:53.040 Imagine

00:22:53.400 you are

00:22:53.840 in San

00:22:54.240 Diego.

00:22:55.000 And then

00:22:55.600 a group

00:22:55.980 of people

00:22:56.420 from Mexico

00:22:57.080 come to

00:22:57.820 San

00:22:58.040 Diego

00:22:58.320 and take

00:22:58.780 a piece

00:22:59.120 of property.

00:23:00.640 And they

00:23:01.280 build

00:23:01.580 fence around

00:23:02.500 it.

00:23:03.360 And then

00:23:03.880 all of a

00:23:04.420 sudden

00:23:04.660 they plant

00:23:05.780 a Mexican

00:23:06.440 flag on

00:23:07.880 that.

00:23:08.440 Not to

00:23:08.940 say that I

00:23:09.440 love Mexicans

00:23:10.160 but this is

00:23:10.600 hypothetical.

00:23:11.300 I get it.

00:23:11.620 But it's a

00:23:11.960 country too.

00:23:12.760 Yes.

00:23:13.040 I love

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00:25:13.400 So for the sake of

00:25:14.680 this, for the sake of

00:25:16.660 this analogy, imagine

00:25:18.420 they come and they

00:25:19.080 build fence around

00:25:19.840 this property and

00:25:20.740 now it cuts your

00:25:22.020 property in half and

00:25:23.320 sometimes it slice it

00:25:24.520 up so you

00:25:25.380 become, San Diego

00:25:26.420 becomes fragmented

00:25:27.860 and they set up this

00:25:29.800 fence around it, they

00:25:31.240 take the water

00:25:31.880 resources, they build

00:25:33.660 walls, sniper towers

00:25:35.600 and all of a sudden

00:25:36.580 you see the

00:25:38.240 Mexican army

00:25:39.260 coming to

00:25:40.020 protect those

00:25:40.780 new settlers

00:25:41.440 and those

00:25:42.500 settlers are not

00:25:44.220 friendly neighbors.

00:25:45.340 They're not

00:25:46.000 coming to San

00:25:47.180 Diego to be

00:25:47.920 neighbors.

00:25:48.980 They're coming to

00:25:50.040 take the land

00:25:51.340 from San

00:25:52.320 Diego.

00:25:53.440 And now if you

00:25:54.840 are a mother,

00:25:56.620 a Christian

00:25:57.020 mother who

00:25:57.580 puts her

00:26:00.060 children in

00:26:00.780 Christian school

00:26:01.460 and you

00:26:02.540 want, and

00:26:03.120 your school

00:26:03.900 now is

00:26:05.720 behind those

00:26:06.840 new roads

00:26:08.300 that these

00:26:09.060 Mexican settlers

00:26:10.580 built.

00:26:11.840 They built a

00:26:12.460 new road that

00:26:13.420 connects San

00:26:14.180 Diego to

00:26:15.020 Tijuana

00:26:15.480 across the

00:26:17.080 border.

00:26:18.840 And you are

00:26:20.000 a mother who

00:26:20.640 wants to go,

00:26:21.480 who wants to

00:26:21.880 drop off her

00:26:22.440 kids to a

00:26:24.040 school that is

00:26:24.740 beyond those

00:26:26.640 bypass road

00:26:27.760 only.

00:26:28.300 And this

00:26:30.420 is not

00:26:30.800 theoretical for

00:26:31.600 us.

00:26:32.100 This is

00:26:32.520 reality.

00:26:33.680 When you go

00:26:34.260 to Beit

00:26:34.580 Sahur, you

00:26:35.120 will see the

00:26:35.900 settlements

00:26:36.380 encircling the

00:26:37.980 little town,

00:26:38.860 choking it.

00:26:39.520 It's like slow

00:26:40.280 suffocation.

00:26:41.400 It prevents it

00:26:42.420 from its

00:26:42.880 natural growth.

00:26:44.720 That story

00:26:45.520 that I told you

00:26:46.040 about the

00:26:46.360 mother is

00:26:46.840 actually my

00:26:47.380 cousin, who

00:26:48.580 takes her

00:26:49.500 children, she

00:26:51.860 has twins, and

00:26:52.640 she has a

00:26:53.020 six-year-old, to

00:26:54.620 the American

00:26:55.300 evangelical school

00:26:56.600 built in Beit

00:26:57.400 Sahur.

00:26:59.700 And with

00:27:00.420 this new

00:27:00.980 settlement they

00:27:01.580 have built,

00:27:02.440 they have set

00:27:03.080 up a roadblock,

00:27:03.940 a checkpoint,

00:27:04.700 where Israelis

00:27:05.360 come and man

00:27:06.620 those checkpoints

00:27:07.260 to protect the

00:27:08.080 settlers.

00:27:09.600 Now, one day

00:27:10.260 she was taking

00:27:10.960 her children to

00:27:11.740 school, and

00:27:13.100 the Israeli

00:27:13.560 army pointed

00:27:14.480 guns at

00:27:15.220 them, instructing

00:27:16.920 them to let

00:27:18.500 the kids walk

00:27:19.820 across the

00:27:21.500 checkpoint to

00:27:22.520 make it to

00:27:22.960 the school to

00:27:23.400 the other

00:27:23.720 side.

00:27:24.620 Now, this

00:27:25.140 is not an

00:27:25.780 isolated

00:27:27.080 incident, this

00:27:28.300 is not

00:27:28.800 something that

00:27:29.620 happens every

00:27:30.680 once in a

00:27:31.140 while.

00:27:32.180 The army is

00:27:33.200 always present

00:27:34.100 to protect

00:27:35.420 the settlers.

00:27:37.120 So, my

00:27:38.060 cousin told

00:27:38.680 her, six-year-old,

00:27:40.280 you're strong,

00:27:41.240 you can do

00:27:41.780 this, and

00:27:43.500 we can walk

00:27:44.860 through it, the

00:27:45.540 teacher on the

00:27:46.320 other side is

00:27:46.880 going to receive

00:27:47.560 you.

00:27:48.300 As soon as she

00:27:49.140 walked, she

00:27:49.940 held her head

00:27:51.020 up high, she

00:27:52.420 passed through

00:27:52.960 the soldier, and

00:27:54.920 she fainted at

00:27:55.980 the feet of

00:27:56.500 the school

00:27:56.880 staff.

00:27:58.140 Now, this

00:27:58.600 brings a lot

00:28:00.100 of psychological

00:28:00.860 trauma.

00:28:02.840 It brings a

00:28:03.880 lot of

00:28:04.480 nightmares.

00:28:05.920 That's what

00:28:06.360 Christian families

00:28:07.460 in Beit

00:28:08.040 Sahur are

00:28:08.680 experiencing.

00:28:10.120 Now, I

00:28:10.340 remember I

00:28:10.780 told you about

00:28:11.360 this, our

00:28:12.820 home back in

00:28:14.540 Beit Sahur.

00:28:15.420 It's not too

00:28:16.100 far from the

00:28:16.680 school, it's not

00:28:17.180 too far from

00:28:17.720 the new

00:28:18.100 settlement they

00:28:18.640 are building

00:28:19.040 in Beit

00:28:19.360 Sahur.

00:28:19.660 And down

00:28:20.920 the road is

00:28:21.480 the Israeli

00:28:22.020 bypass road,

00:28:23.320 which is only

00:28:24.340 for settlers

00:28:24.900 and Israeli

00:28:25.760 armed vehicles.

00:28:27.480 In 1990, we

00:28:30.260 watched settlers

00:28:31.400 come and go.

00:28:32.780 There was an

00:28:33.260 Israeli army

00:28:34.000 vehicle that

00:28:35.420 stopped.

00:28:36.920 And we saw, I

00:28:37.600 was 10 at that

00:28:38.280 time, I saw an

00:28:39.840 Israeli soldier

00:28:41.180 stepping out of

00:28:41.940 the vehicle,

00:28:42.980 pointing a rifle

00:28:43.700 at us, and he

00:28:44.600 started shooting

00:28:45.160 at us.

00:28:45.800 You?

00:28:46.560 We were a

00:28:47.280 bunch of kids.

00:28:47.840 I mean, my

00:28:48.300 siblings, my

00:28:49.640 mother was

00:28:50.280 there, and

00:28:51.300 some of my

00:28:51.720 cousins.

00:28:52.260 He started

00:28:52.960 shooting live

00:28:53.880 ammunition at

00:28:54.820 us, and then

00:28:55.880 my mother rushed

00:28:57.060 us all into

00:28:57.980 the door.

00:28:59.400 She was the

00:29:00.040 last one to

00:29:00.840 get in.

00:29:01.580 She caught a

00:29:02.180 bullet in the

00:29:02.780 back.

00:29:03.100 Your mother?

00:29:03.760 Yes, my

00:29:04.340 own mother, who

00:29:05.780 loves the Lord

00:29:06.420 and he loves

00:29:07.040 Jesus.

00:29:08.560 And exit one,

00:29:09.600 she dropped

00:29:10.160 on the floor,

00:29:12.640 pool of blood.

00:29:13.680 I heard to

00:29:14.980 the back

00:29:16.220 door, called

00:29:17.220 my dad, my

00:29:18.220 uncle who was

00:29:18.860 a physician,

00:29:19.640 put pressure

00:29:20.460 on the

00:29:20.740 wound, took

00:29:21.720 her to the

00:29:22.160 hospital.

00:29:23.700 You saw

00:29:24.280 this happen?

00:29:25.120 In front of

00:29:25.780 my eyes.

00:29:27.660 My own

00:29:28.160 mother.

00:29:28.840 I'm sorry, I

00:29:29.300 should say we've

00:29:29.740 been talking

00:29:30.140 off camera before

00:29:30.840 we started this

00:29:31.360 interview, and I

00:29:32.320 didn't know the

00:29:33.360 story.

00:29:34.600 It's not in my

00:29:35.440 interview notes,

00:29:36.320 and I detected

00:29:37.540 no bitterness

00:29:38.220 whatsoever in

00:29:39.100 anything that you

00:29:39.740 said.

00:29:40.120 I don't know

00:29:40.560 how.

00:29:41.340 Okay.

00:29:41.720 Sorry, so you're

00:29:42.260 just shocking me?

00:29:43.000 I didn't expect

00:29:43.660 to hear that.

00:29:44.300 Palestinian

00:29:45.400 Christians take

00:29:47.440 the Sermon of

00:29:48.500 the Mount very

00:29:49.340 seriously.

00:29:50.060 Apparently.

00:29:51.300 When Jesus

00:29:52.080 comes and he

00:29:53.100 elevates our

00:29:54.120 thinking, when

00:29:55.460 he elevates our

00:29:56.860 outlook on

00:29:58.500 life, when he

00:29:59.820 takes morality

00:30:00.720 to a whole new

00:30:02.700 standard, when he

00:30:04.100 said, you have

00:30:04.660 heard, do not

00:30:06.060 kill.

00:30:06.700 But I tell you,

00:30:07.500 if you look at

00:30:08.120 your brother and

00:30:08.680 you call him

00:30:09.260 Raqqa, Aramaic

00:30:10.260 word for fool

00:30:11.440 or stupid, you

00:30:13.320 just have

00:30:13.800 committed the

00:30:14.480 murder.

00:30:15.920 And when he

00:30:16.340 said, and

00:30:17.040 remember the

00:30:17.560 context, Jesus

00:30:18.300 was talking to

00:30:19.300 a Jewish

00:30:20.460 audience who

00:30:21.160 were under

00:30:21.660 ruthless Roman

00:30:22.960 occupation.

00:30:24.000 They were

00:30:24.720 persecuted.

00:30:25.880 They were

00:30:26.740 discriminated

00:30:28.140 against.

00:30:29.180 It was very

00:30:29.940 brutal to live

00:30:30.700 under the Roman

00:30:31.280 occupation.

00:30:32.420 But Jesus

00:30:32.840 telling his

00:30:33.480 followers, love

00:30:34.820 your enemies.

00:30:36.320 Pray for those

00:30:37.000 who persecute

00:30:37.740 you.

00:30:38.920 This is

00:30:39.540 something that

00:30:40.320 we have

00:30:40.820 grown up

00:30:42.840 understanding

00:30:43.600 the very

00:30:44.240 essence and

00:30:45.700 the meaning

00:30:46.380 of this

00:30:48.240 Sermon of

00:30:48.740 the Mount.

00:30:49.900 Wow.

00:30:50.360 I'm sorry.

00:30:51.340 I've totally

00:30:52.040 derailed your

00:30:52.680 story because

00:30:53.240 I'm just

00:30:53.680 shocked.

00:30:54.380 I really

00:30:54.740 didn't know

00:30:55.020 that was

00:30:55.280 coming.

00:30:56.000 So you're

00:30:56.580 10 years

00:30:57.040 old.

00:30:57.320 You watch

00:30:57.720 your mother

00:30:58.340 get shot

00:30:59.060 by this.

00:30:59.560 Okay, so

00:30:59.840 many questions.

00:31:01.200 Why did

00:31:01.940 he do this?

00:31:02.560 Do you

00:31:02.760 know?

00:31:03.940 This has

00:31:04.360 been just

00:31:04.940 random.

00:31:07.100 They do

00:31:07.740 this not

00:31:08.320 just to

00:31:08.780 Palestinian

00:31:09.500 Christians.

00:31:09.960 I mean,

00:31:10.460 that has

00:31:10.760 been the

00:31:11.060 policy.

00:31:12.020 They do

00:31:12.560 it to

00:31:12.760 the Muslims.

00:31:13.300 They do

00:31:13.520 it to

00:31:13.880 any

00:31:14.480 Palestinians.

00:31:15.780 Did she

00:31:16.520 survive?

00:31:17.280 She did.

00:31:18.380 Miraculous.

00:31:18.980 The bullet

00:31:19.520 was just

00:31:21.020 millimeters

00:31:21.520 away from

00:31:22.620 the spine.

00:31:23.260 It was

00:31:23.600 an American

00:31:24.020 rifle, I

00:31:24.620 assume.

00:31:25.660 Who knows?

00:31:26.260 Of course.

00:31:26.800 We don't

00:31:27.020 know the

00:31:27.380 soldier.

00:31:27.560 Five-five-six

00:31:28.000 round, right.

00:31:28.680 Okay, so

00:31:29.160 that's my

00:31:29.440 next question.

00:31:30.180 So some

00:31:31.620 soldier, your

00:31:32.560 mother wasn't

00:31:32.980 throwing rocks at

00:31:33.680 him or

00:31:34.040 screaming for

00:31:34.620 jihad or

00:31:35.120 anything.

00:31:35.500 We were just

00:31:35.700 playing in

00:31:36.160 front of the

00:31:36.520 house.

00:31:37.980 We were just

00:31:38.680 kids playing.

00:31:40.960 How can you

00:31:42.020 live in this

00:31:42.500 country and

00:31:42.960 listen to

00:31:43.520 people who

00:31:44.300 have no

00:31:44.720 idea what

00:31:45.080 they're talking

00:31:45.560 about?

00:31:46.040 This is the

00:31:47.180 real threat of

00:31:48.260 the new

00:31:48.680 settlements.

00:31:49.560 It's not

00:31:50.360 just taking

00:31:51.800 Christian land.

00:31:53.240 It's not

00:31:54.140 acquiring and

00:31:55.980 taking by force

00:31:56.700 the resources

00:31:57.420 of the land,

00:31:58.600 of Christian

00:31:59.180 lands, who

00:31:59.940 lived there for

00:32:00.580 generations.

00:32:01.240 it's inviting

00:32:04.600 violent

00:32:06.480 settlers to

00:32:08.840 your

00:32:09.020 neighborhood.

00:32:10.280 They're coming

00:32:10.940 to take the

00:32:11.520 land.

00:32:11.820 They're coming

00:32:12.160 to squeeze.

00:32:12.940 They're coming

00:32:13.300 to crush.

00:32:14.020 They're coming

00:32:14.340 to...

00:32:14.800 Why are they

00:32:14.820 mad at you?

00:32:15.200 What did you

00:32:15.720 do?

00:32:17.960 Being born in

00:32:18.940 the...

00:32:19.460 I don't

00:32:20.020 understand the

00:32:21.120 hate, and I

00:32:22.400 certainly have

00:32:23.160 been the

00:32:23.800 target of it,

00:32:24.340 but I don't

00:32:25.080 understand...

00:32:25.540 I mean, I

00:32:26.220 understand why

00:32:26.800 people don't

00:32:27.140 like me.

00:32:27.740 I'm doing

00:32:28.360 interviews like

00:32:28.780 this, but I

00:32:29.200 don't understand

00:32:29.860 why the...

00:32:32.420 Why would

00:32:32.760 someone shoot

00:32:33.540 a mother in

00:32:34.320 front of her

00:32:34.720 children?

00:32:35.220 Like, I just

00:32:35.620 don't get that.

00:32:36.400 Like, what is

00:32:36.920 that?

00:32:38.280 You interviewed

00:32:39.280 Bishop Hossam,

00:32:40.880 and he mentioned

00:32:41.680 the story, the

00:32:42.620 recent story, just

00:32:43.400 last month.

00:32:44.200 Yes.

00:32:44.920 The attack on a

00:32:45.820 Christian widow.

00:32:47.120 She's a Christian

00:32:47.840 widow.

00:32:49.560 That a violent

00:32:50.160 settler came to

00:32:51.080 her property,

00:32:52.600 grazing on the

00:32:53.520 land with his

00:32:55.380 cattle, and then

00:32:56.600 he hits her with

00:32:57.400 a stone on

00:32:58.040 her head, fractures

00:32:59.860 her skull, takes

00:33:00.860 her to...

00:33:01.420 You know, she

00:33:03.080 almost lost her

00:33:03.840 life, and when

00:33:04.440 her son tried to

00:33:05.980 defend her, the

00:33:07.320 son gets arrested

00:33:08.180 by the Israeli

00:33:08.920 military.

00:33:10.540 And then when

00:33:11.360 the settlers, a

00:33:12.120 bunch of

00:33:12.360 settlers, they

00:33:13.300 showed up at

00:33:13.780 the house in

00:33:14.840 the presence and

00:33:15.500 the full support

00:33:16.160 and the complicity

00:33:16.800 of the Israeli

00:33:17.340 army, they

00:33:18.480 knocked down

00:33:18.940 the door.

00:33:20.120 Her daughter

00:33:20.640 was inside,

00:33:21.660 Neriman, and

00:33:22.460 I talked to

00:33:23.000 her.

00:33:24.060 She drew the

00:33:24.760 sign of her

00:33:25.240 cross, and

00:33:27.380 when they

00:33:27.800 found out that

00:33:28.380 she was

00:33:28.680 Christian, you

00:33:29.280 know what the

00:33:29.700 settler told

00:33:30.280 her?

00:33:30.760 What?

00:33:31.260 He told her,

00:33:31.720 what are you

00:33:32.320 doing here?

00:33:33.340 This is not

00:33:34.020 your land.

00:33:35.100 You don't

00:33:35.600 belong here.

00:33:37.020 He said, go to

00:33:37.760 France or go

00:33:38.660 somewhere else.

00:33:39.340 You don't

00:33:39.600 belong here.

00:33:40.400 God gave us

00:33:41.360 this land.

00:33:42.840 Now, this

00:33:43.900 settler violence

00:33:44.940 that has been on

00:33:45.880 the rise, the

00:33:47.200 town of Taipei

00:33:47.960 where they burned

00:33:50.180 centuries-old

00:33:51.840 church, they

00:33:53.200 burned the

00:33:53.600 crops, vandalized

00:33:55.280 properties, write

00:33:57.180 graffitis, spitting

00:33:58.480 on clergy and

00:33:59.560 pastors and

00:34:00.280 leaders.

00:34:02.320 All of these

00:34:03.280 atrocities are

00:34:05.580 done in broad

00:34:06.460 daylight, they're

00:34:08.120 done without

00:34:08.740 accountability, and

00:34:10.680 no one is being

00:34:12.140 held responsible

00:34:13.900 for these

00:34:14.600 atrocities.

00:34:15.700 Well, 2026 is

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00:34:17.380 year that some

00:34:17.980 companies will

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00:34:20.400 it.

00:34:20.880 During the

00:34:21.200 Biden years,

00:34:21.780 corporate America

00:34:22.320 thought hating our

00:34:23.160 country was the

00:34:23.840 thing to do, so

00:34:24.400 they did it.

00:34:25.520 Now, we're in a

00:34:26.120 new era, they are

00:34:26.980 coming back to

00:34:27.960 reality.

00:34:28.520 It's not real,

00:34:29.180 though.

00:34:29.360 It's a trick.

00:34:30.040 They don't mean

00:34:30.660 it at all.

00:34:31.620 Black Rifle means

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00:34:34.200 since day one.

00:34:35.500 They're not just

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00:34:37.120 they were founded

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00:34:39.400 As this country

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00:34:42.340 Black Rifle is

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00:35:34.140 coffee.

00:35:34.820 I was talking to

00:35:35.720 my wife when I

00:35:36.860 was on the road

00:35:37.460 for a few weeks

00:35:38.140 and I was

00:35:38.480 talking to her

00:35:39.000 at breakfast

00:35:39.500 this morning

00:35:40.380 about that

00:35:41.280 interview with

00:35:41.820 the Anglican

00:35:42.480 Archbishop that

00:35:43.600 we did on the

00:35:44.860 banks of the

00:35:45.240 Jordan River.

00:35:45.840 And we're

00:35:47.140 Anglicans, we

00:35:47.820 grew up in it,

00:35:49.200 and the Anglican

00:35:49.980 church in the

00:35:50.400 United States is

00:35:51.840 not very Christian

00:35:53.240 anymore.

00:35:54.700 And I was

00:35:55.180 telling her,

00:35:55.720 that man,

00:35:56.700 off camera,

00:35:57.640 I said to him,

00:35:58.900 people spit on

00:36:00.000 you?

00:36:00.340 And my first

00:36:00.820 thought was,

00:36:01.240 why don't you

00:36:01.680 shoot them?

00:36:02.440 Like, don't

00:36:02.780 allow someone to

00:36:03.400 spit.

00:36:03.480 I didn't say

00:36:04.000 that because I,

00:36:04.520 you know,

00:36:04.980 but that was

00:36:05.380 my thought.

00:36:06.280 Shows what a

00:36:06.620 bad person I

00:36:07.140 am.

00:36:07.840 And he said,

00:36:08.720 every time

00:36:09.160 someone spits

00:36:09.820 at me,

00:36:10.140 I feel blessed.

00:36:11.520 They spit at

00:36:12.180 Jesus.

00:36:14.080 And I was

00:36:14.680 telling my wife,

00:36:15.320 I think Christians

00:36:16.100 who live in

00:36:17.380 that kind of

00:36:18.280 environment

00:36:18.940 understand

00:36:20.140 Christianity in

00:36:21.240 a much deeper

00:36:21.840 way than we

00:36:22.380 do here.

00:36:23.560 I think that.

00:36:24.580 To hear you say

00:36:25.200 that you don't

00:36:25.640 feel bitterness,

00:36:26.140 your mother

00:36:26.400 didn't feel

00:36:26.780 bitterness after

00:36:27.660 being shot in

00:36:28.580 front of her

00:36:28.920 children for no

00:36:29.940 reason.

00:36:30.480 And this is what

00:36:31.040 the gospel does.

00:36:32.260 It transforms the

00:36:33.200 heart.

00:36:33.480 Yes, I

00:36:34.120 totally agree.

00:36:35.640 It's, it's,

00:36:37.420 yes, I want to

00:36:38.720 seek justice,

00:36:39.940 but in the

00:36:40.380 meantime, I don't

00:36:41.160 want to allow

00:36:41.700 hatred to poison

00:36:43.380 my soul.

00:36:44.800 I don't want...

00:36:46.040 okay, please,

00:36:46.500 everyone watch this,

00:36:47.220 rewind, watch that

00:36:48.300 again.

00:36:48.720 Can you say that

00:36:49.200 again?

00:36:49.500 I love that.

00:36:50.600 I don't want to

00:36:51.420 allow the, the,

00:36:54.580 the atrocities and

00:36:56.800 the sins that have

00:36:58.680 been committed

00:36:59.340 against Christians

00:37:00.400 to allow bitterness

00:37:03.940 to grow in our

00:37:04.860 hearts.

00:37:05.520 Amen.

00:37:06.000 Jesus provided a

00:37:07.260 better way.

00:37:08.900 Jesus gave us the

00:37:09.880 example of forgiving

00:37:11.600 and for loving our

00:37:12.820 enemies.

00:37:13.960 Jesus forgave the

00:37:14.900 people who even

00:37:15.800 crucified him.

00:37:17.860 And that's the

00:37:18.400 model.

00:37:19.300 That's why Christians

00:37:21.060 in the Holy Land

00:37:22.420 are the salt of the

00:37:24.700 earth, are the light

00:37:25.980 in the midst of the

00:37:26.800 darkness.

00:37:27.340 And if we don't

00:37:28.040 preserve that gospel

00:37:29.660 witness, this is the

00:37:30.980 reason I decided to do

00:37:32.100 this interview with you,

00:37:33.000 Cuttugger.

00:37:33.420 And I said a prayer this

00:37:34.260 morning in my sauna that

00:37:35.240 you would, that God would

00:37:36.180 speak through you and he

00:37:37.100 is.

00:37:37.840 It's the gospel witness.

00:37:39.840 We want to keep the

00:37:40.800 message of Christ alive

00:37:42.240 in the lands of its

00:37:43.280 birth.

00:37:44.440 We want to share the

00:37:45.920 good news of the

00:37:46.700 gospel with every

00:37:48.280 person who is, who is

00:37:50.180 traumatized, with every

00:37:51.440 person who is suffering,

00:37:52.960 with every child in Gaza

00:37:54.620 who has lost everything.

00:37:57.360 The only hope is to tell

00:37:59.120 them that God loves them.

00:38:00.420 That's right.

00:38:00.860 The only hope is to break

00:38:02.740 this, that cycle of

00:38:04.120 violence between the

00:38:05.300 Israelis and the

00:38:05.960 Palestinians.

00:38:06.420 It's not, it's not

00:38:08.140 going, I don't, you

00:38:09.740 know, law will restrain

00:38:12.400 your physical being.

00:38:15.900 But God sets your

00:38:17.320 spirit free.

00:38:19.020 He sets your soul free.

00:38:20.560 Ah, you're making me

00:38:21.120 emotional.

00:38:22.480 No, that's totally right.

00:38:23.740 He redeems us.

00:38:25.740 And these are, these are

00:38:27.900 the basic values that are

00:38:30.600 lived on daily basis by

00:38:32.440 Christian Palestinians.

00:38:33.540 Ah, let me tell you

00:38:36.720 about my friend, Salam.

00:38:39.720 Salam was the only child

00:38:41.220 to his family who lived

00:38:42.900 right down the street

00:38:44.440 from me, closer to this

00:38:46.380 Israeli bypass road.

00:38:49.320 And on February 18, 1991,

00:38:52.960 a hateful Israeli

00:38:55.960 settler parked his vehicle

00:38:58.140 next to Salam's house.

00:38:59.420 house and he shot him

00:39:01.440 in the head inside his

00:39:03.220 house through a window

00:39:04.480 while having dinner with

00:39:06.260 his family.

00:39:07.740 A new settlement coming

00:39:09.320 to town is going to

00:39:12.280 pose real existential

00:39:14.880 threat to everyone

00:39:16.900 living there and the

00:39:19.180 Christian witness will be

00:39:21.440 diminished.

00:39:22.380 So this is, this is a

00:39:23.640 part that's hard to

00:39:24.280 understand as an

00:39:24.940 American.

00:39:25.560 And let's just start a

00:39:26.900 few minutes previous in

00:39:28.660 the conversation.

00:39:29.960 A Israeli soldier, IDF

00:39:31.760 soldier, shoots your

00:39:32.680 mother for no reason.

00:39:35.340 Who is that soldier?

00:39:37.600 Was there a trial?

00:39:38.800 Did you ever hear what

00:39:39.700 happened to him?

00:39:40.520 No, was he, I mean,

00:39:41.020 these sound like dumb

00:39:41.520 questions, but I'm an

00:39:42.320 American.

00:39:42.660 Was he punished?

00:39:43.340 Like what happened next?

00:39:44.380 We have no idea.

00:39:47.740 So nobody from the

00:39:48.940 occupation authority, from

00:39:50.020 the supposedly humane

00:39:51.880 Western, Western Israeli

00:39:53.880 government ever went to

00:39:54.880 your house and said, you

00:39:55.520 know, we've questioned

00:39:56.200 this guy or even followed

00:39:57.460 up at all.

00:39:58.000 Absolutely not.

00:39:59.820 You see, this is the

00:40:00.560 issue.

00:40:00.680 You just shot your

00:40:01.220 mother like an animal

00:40:01.960 and then never.

00:40:02.660 The core issue here is

00:40:05.340 that there is a culture

00:40:06.380 of impunity.

00:40:08.880 A lot of these acts, they

00:40:10.640 go unchecked.

00:40:11.800 Oh, I've noticed.

00:40:13.580 It's a culture.

00:40:15.360 And that comes, it's not

00:40:17.140 insulated incidents.

00:40:18.520 And just to give you

00:40:19.240 numbers.

00:40:20.000 Okay.

00:40:20.160 The Rasing Center in

00:40:21.460 Jerusalem, it's an

00:40:22.680 Israeli human rights

00:40:23.960 organization.

00:40:24.520 So in case, you know,

00:40:26.380 people discredit the

00:40:27.520 Palestinian testimony of

00:40:28.820 Palestinian Christians, you

00:40:30.400 know, we often get

00:40:31.020 discredited.

00:40:31.840 Oh, I've noticed.

00:40:32.860 Yes.

00:40:33.400 And it breaks our heart

00:40:35.360 when even our brothers and

00:40:36.880 sisters in Christ do that.

00:40:39.140 Well, I want to ask you

00:40:39.940 about that because that's

00:40:40.780 where I have trouble

00:40:41.360 controlling.

00:40:41.800 But I'm going to come

00:40:42.480 back to the Rasing

00:40:43.480 Center.

00:40:44.260 They documented 111

00:40:46.640 attacks on Christians in

00:40:48.380 2024 alone.

00:40:51.020 111.

00:40:53.320 You go to any Israeli

00:40:55.140 human rights organization

00:40:56.160 such as Beth Salem,

00:40:58.260 Peace Now, documenting

00:41:00.120 every single incidence.

00:41:02.540 And you will find a

00:41:03.380 pattern that these attacks

00:41:05.180 are not random.

00:41:06.940 They're not, they don't

00:41:09.920 happen out of the blue.

00:41:10.980 They're systematic.

00:41:13.160 Israel has created a

00:41:15.480 pervasive system.

00:41:17.580 And we call it a

00:41:19.020 structural pressure that

00:41:21.580 they keep applying on the

00:41:23.180 Christian population to

00:41:24.440 push them out of their

00:41:25.560 land.

00:41:26.620 When I speak to

00:41:27.760 Palestinian Christians in

00:41:28.940 Beth Sahur, what they

00:41:29.780 fear the most, they saw

00:41:31.100 what's happening in Gaza.

00:41:32.480 They have relatives in

00:41:33.500 Gaza and they fear that

00:41:35.100 they are next.

00:41:35.800 It's a real danger that

00:41:38.960 is pointed at Beth

00:41:41.840 Sahur community right

00:41:42.880 now.

00:41:43.800 And this new settlement,

00:41:44.800 and it's not the only

00:41:45.500 settlement.

00:41:45.960 I mean, Beth Sahur is

00:41:46.640 surrounded by settlements.

00:41:47.780 And we have long

00:41:49.280 history of these

00:41:50.920 settlers coming and

00:41:52.080 taking the Palestinian

00:41:54.180 lands and building

00:41:55.420 those, you know,

00:41:57.000 lavish settlements.

00:41:58.040 But ugly, very ugly.

00:42:00.100 You know, they fill up

00:42:01.500 their swimming pools.

00:42:03.420 They put their

00:42:04.040 green grass.

00:42:06.880 While Palestinian

00:42:07.780 Christians, they wait

00:42:09.500 for two or three weeks

00:42:11.000 for a water truck to

00:42:12.420 fill up their tanks on

00:42:13.760 top of the roof.

00:42:14.980 Giant black plastic

00:42:16.480 tank that we're not

00:42:17.900 allowed to even have

00:42:18.840 running water.

00:42:19.780 I've seen them.

00:42:21.020 Can I ask, just because

00:42:22.260 I don't want anything to

00:42:22.900 fall through the cracks

00:42:23.500 here.

00:42:23.740 your friend who was

00:42:25.900 murdered while having

00:42:27.140 dinner by a settler,

00:42:28.740 what happened to that

00:42:29.440 settler?

00:42:30.180 Salam Misleh.

00:42:31.640 We don't know who the

00:42:32.420 seller was.

00:42:33.460 He just stopped his

00:42:34.200 vehicle, shot at him,

00:42:35.460 and left.

00:42:36.560 And Salam is not the

00:42:37.320 only one.

00:42:37.980 Wait, may I ask, like,

00:42:39.120 was there no

00:42:39.620 investigation of this?

00:42:40.800 No one was arrested

00:42:41.460 for it?

00:42:42.860 Nope.

00:42:43.460 Absolutely not.

00:42:45.800 Salam is not the

00:42:46.660 only one.

00:42:47.520 There was another guy

00:42:48.540 named Edmon Ghanem.

00:42:53.740 You know, back in the

00:42:54.920 days, this policy used

00:42:56.400 to be in much bigger

00:42:58.260 full force.

00:42:59.520 They called it

00:43:00.200 home mapping.

00:43:01.620 I don't know if you're

00:43:02.140 familiar with home

00:43:02.780 mapping.

00:43:04.060 I'm American.

00:43:04.740 I don't know anything.

00:43:05.560 I've been lied to about

00:43:06.320 this for so long.

00:43:07.020 So thank God for

00:43:07.840 an organization like

00:43:09.180 Breaking the Silence,

00:43:10.880 which is a group of

00:43:11.860 former IDF soldiers,

00:43:13.200 and they're there

00:43:13.640 sharing their stories

00:43:14.700 and their experiences

00:43:16.000 in the West Bank.

00:43:17.780 So home mapping is

00:43:19.620 when an Israeli army

00:43:22.020 decides to go into a

00:43:23.380 Palestinian home for

00:43:24.380 the purpose, quote

00:43:25.160 unquote, of collecting

00:43:26.500 intelligence.

00:43:28.400 And what they usually

00:43:29.440 do is they lock up the

00:43:30.680 whole family in a room

00:43:31.820 for a day or two and

00:43:33.900 sometimes for weeks,

00:43:34.860 and they take over the

00:43:36.260 house.

00:43:37.220 And this usually is done

00:43:38.820 to give the new

00:43:39.940 soldiers some practice

00:43:40.920 and training.

00:43:41.860 It's called home

00:43:42.500 mapping.

00:43:43.820 So when I grew up,

00:43:45.720 and these are stories

00:43:46.440 from my childhood,

00:43:48.300 Edmon was walking

00:43:49.320 down the street

00:43:50.180 when an Israeli

00:43:52.300 soldier was on top

00:43:54.080 of a Palestinian

00:43:54.800 house roof,

00:43:56.620 dropped a stone

00:43:57.520 on Edmon

00:43:58.460 and killed him

00:43:59.360 instantly.

00:44:01.520 Why?

00:44:01.900 A Christian,

00:44:02.320 young man

00:44:04.940 for no reason.

00:44:08.420 Anton Shomeli,

00:44:09.660 he was caught

00:44:10.500 by an Israeli,

00:44:12.360 you know,

00:44:12.620 he ran away from

00:44:13.420 the Israeli army

00:44:14.240 for some reason.

00:44:15.640 He got scared.

00:44:16.960 They caught him

00:44:17.640 and they shot him

00:44:19.100 in a close proximity

00:44:21.300 in cold blood.

00:44:23.720 And I can give you

00:44:24.500 stories of stories.

00:44:25.380 Those are not

00:44:26.240 terrorists.

00:44:27.320 Those are not

00:44:28.520 people who seek

00:44:30.140 violence.

00:44:31.320 Those are people

00:44:32.320 who want to

00:44:34.040 simply stay

00:44:35.160 in their land,

00:44:37.140 work,

00:44:38.380 live,

00:44:39.660 have a future,

00:44:41.240 live in peace.

00:44:42.560 And let me tell you,

00:44:43.160 you know,

00:44:43.800 highlighting the violence

00:44:45.300 of the settlers

00:44:46.760 does not mean

00:44:48.900 we ignore

00:44:49.820 the violence

00:44:50.880 committed by

00:44:51.500 some Palestinians.

00:44:52.800 I mean,

00:44:53.060 as Christians,

00:44:53.760 we recognize

00:44:54.480 there are some

00:44:55.540 Palestinians who

00:44:56.360 carry out

00:44:57.260 attacks

00:44:59.620 and inflict

00:45:01.680 terror on

00:45:02.760 innocent Israelis

00:45:04.240 as well.

00:45:05.040 And we're not

00:45:05.540 going to bury

00:45:06.060 our heads in the sand

00:45:06.920 and say,

00:45:07.260 oh,

00:45:07.340 it doesn't happen.

00:45:08.280 You know,

00:45:08.580 stabbing,

00:45:09.660 ramming into

00:45:10.360 some Israeli citizens.

00:45:12.100 And as Christian

00:45:12.920 Palestinian American,

00:45:14.580 we condemn

00:45:15.440 any attacks

00:45:16.620 on any civilians.

00:45:17.980 We condemn

00:45:18.520 any form of

00:45:20.360 violence

00:45:20.720 to achieve

00:45:21.320 justice.

00:45:22.640 This is the very

00:45:23.500 core of the

00:45:24.160 Christian message.

00:45:25.280 We reject

00:45:26.000 violence

00:45:26.540 altogether.

00:45:27.440 Palestinian Christians

00:45:28.040 have always

00:45:28.780 extending the hands

00:45:29.700 of making peace

00:45:30.500 with our

00:45:30.920 Jewish neighbors,

00:45:32.020 with our Muslim

00:45:32.560 neighbors,

00:45:33.080 with everyone.

00:45:34.120 We just want to

00:45:34.580 live in peace.

00:45:35.060 So we condemn

00:45:35.560 violence at all

00:45:36.840 levels.

00:45:38.060 But there is a

00:45:38.920 difference between

00:45:39.840 when a Palestinian

00:45:41.140 commits a violence

00:45:42.200 versus when a

00:45:43.520 settler commits

00:45:44.160 a violence.

00:45:45.280 When a Palestinian

00:45:46.100 commits a violence,

00:45:47.640 wrong to be

00:45:49.100 condemned,

00:45:49.580 not to be

00:45:49.980 condoned,

00:45:50.540 to kill innocent

00:45:51.240 civilians,

00:45:52.920 usually he or she

00:45:54.740 are shot on the

00:45:55.420 spot.

00:45:55.720 And if they

00:45:56.240 make it out

00:45:56.720 alive,

00:45:57.380 they get

00:45:58.380 detained and

00:45:59.120 they're thrown

00:45:59.620 in prison.

00:46:01.440 And right now

00:46:01.920 the Israeli

00:46:02.320 government is

00:46:02.900 really pushing

00:46:03.440 hard to

00:46:04.420 pass a law

00:46:05.060 to legalize

00:46:06.340 the death

00:46:06.720 penalty in

00:46:07.400 Israel for

00:46:07.940 Palestinians.

00:46:09.340 But anyway,

00:46:10.260 he gets thrown

00:46:10.840 in prison.

00:46:12.040 His house,

00:46:13.680 his family,

00:46:14.760 his family's

00:46:15.620 house gets

00:46:16.640 demolished.

00:46:17.800 And his

00:46:18.740 family gets

00:46:20.620 a security

00:46:21.160 block not to

00:46:22.220 travel anywhere

00:46:23.280 outside town

00:46:24.220 collectively

00:46:25.760 punishing the

00:46:27.320 parents for

00:46:28.540 the crime

00:46:29.100 that their

00:46:29.560 son or

00:46:29.960 their daughter

00:46:30.360 committed.

00:46:31.700 Now, this

00:46:32.020 is what

00:46:32.300 happens.

00:46:32.720 So, when a

00:46:33.580 Palestinian commits

00:46:34.340 a crime, this

00:46:34.780 happens.

00:46:35.220 But when a

00:46:35.700 settler commits

00:46:36.380 a crime, there

00:46:37.700 is an Israeli

00:46:38.340 army that

00:46:39.120 backs it up.

00:46:40.280 There is a

00:46:40.840 system that

00:46:41.880 gives it

00:46:43.000 impunity.

00:46:44.000 And this is

00:46:45.020 the grave

00:46:45.520 injustice.

00:46:46.100 As a Christian

00:46:46.960 minister, this is

00:46:48.000 why I come to

00:46:48.740 your show and

00:46:49.280 say, this

00:46:50.360 should not be

00:46:51.020 done.

00:46:51.960 Especially when

00:46:53.440 Christians are

00:46:54.780 supporting this

00:46:56.380 without knowing

00:46:57.340 the facts and

00:46:58.040 the reality on

00:46:58.900 the ground.

00:47:00.180 This is what

00:47:00.620 really brings

00:47:01.460 my mind.

00:47:01.480 Some of them do

00:47:01.620 know the facts

00:47:02.300 and reality on

00:47:03.000 the ground.

00:47:03.740 And I don't

00:47:04.800 think that applies

00:47:05.440 to your average

00:47:06.300 evangelical Christian

00:47:07.460 scientist in the

00:47:08.040 United States.

00:47:08.480 I don't think

00:47:08.720 they have any

00:47:09.060 idea.

00:47:09.960 But some of

00:47:10.340 their leaders

00:47:10.680 know perfectly

00:47:11.180 well what's

00:47:11.560 happening.

00:47:12.620 Because I know

00:47:13.340 them and I know

00:47:13.840 that they know.

00:47:14.600 And they know

00:47:15.060 the Christians by

00:47:15.760 name.

00:47:16.220 And they have

00:47:16.640 their data.

00:47:17.140 And they know

00:47:18.660 where they live.

00:47:20.520 So, and I

00:47:21.600 want to get, I

00:47:22.560 have way too

00:47:23.280 many questions

00:47:23.700 for you, but

00:47:24.020 thankfully we

00:47:24.520 have time.

00:47:25.760 But this seems

00:47:26.520 like a good

00:47:26.920 time to try to

00:47:27.920 understand what's

00:47:28.560 going on there.

00:47:29.520 And I've already

00:47:30.100 admitted that's

00:47:30.720 where my anger

00:47:31.280 lies is toward,

00:47:32.460 you know, the

00:47:33.660 people like me,

00:47:34.480 Christians in

00:47:35.080 America who are

00:47:37.560 making excuses for

00:47:38.460 this or abetting

00:47:39.720 it, making it

00:47:40.340 possible.

00:47:41.280 What is that?

00:47:42.780 Why is that

00:47:43.260 happening?

00:47:45.380 October 7 was

00:47:46.420 horrific.

00:47:47.140 Yes, I

00:47:48.520 agree.

00:47:48.740 It was horrible

00:47:49.380 what Hamas has

00:47:50.380 done, killing

00:47:51.900 innocent civilians,

00:47:53.820 kidnapping

00:47:54.500 babies.

00:47:55.220 I totally

00:47:55.600 agree.

00:47:56.020 This is wrong.

00:47:57.080 This needs to

00:47:57.560 be condemned.

00:47:58.220 And Palestinian

00:47:58.680 Christians have

00:47:59.300 been consistent

00:48:00.260 in condemning

00:48:01.120 violence to

00:48:01.780 achieve justice,

00:48:02.480 as I said.

00:48:03.960 But the

00:48:04.480 overwhelming

00:48:05.140 suffering lies

00:48:06.860 on Gaza right

00:48:07.560 now.

00:48:08.440 The disproportionate

00:48:09.600 response.

00:48:10.300 I was in South

00:48:10.880 Africa on October

00:48:12.500 7.

00:48:12.920 I was getting

00:48:13.460 ready to speak

00:48:14.300 at a Christian

00:48:15.220 conference

00:48:15.880 before 5,000

00:48:18.800 people in the

00:48:19.340 room in Cape

00:48:19.780 Town.

00:48:21.020 And before I

00:48:22.180 got up there,

00:48:23.780 my phone

00:48:24.520 started all

00:48:26.600 kind of

00:48:26.940 notifications

00:48:27.480 going on.

00:48:28.540 And I

00:48:29.040 learned about

00:48:29.900 October 7.

00:48:30.860 Immediately that

00:48:31.780 night, I

00:48:32.720 went on my

00:48:34.240 hotel room

00:48:35.060 and I

00:48:36.200 recorded a

00:48:36.720 video.

00:48:37.480 I said, I

00:48:38.740 condemn this

00:48:39.340 horror.

00:48:39.820 This is not

00:48:40.280 the way we

00:48:42.000 need to

00:48:42.400 condone.

00:48:45.420 We condemn

00:48:46.280 this act of

00:48:46.900 violence.

00:48:47.720 But in the

00:48:48.080 meantime, I

00:48:49.340 leaned over to

00:48:50.880 my friend, my

00:48:51.740 pastor friend,

00:48:52.520 and I said, I

00:48:54.060 am shaking

00:48:56.100 because of the

00:48:58.300 level of

00:48:59.580 retaliation that

00:49:00.520 the Israeli

00:49:00.960 military is

00:49:02.100 going to

00:49:02.500 respond.

00:49:03.280 Well, you

00:49:03.440 grew up with

00:49:03.840 that, so you

00:49:04.320 knew.

00:49:05.500 My wife

00:49:06.340 grew up in

00:49:07.440 Gaza Baptist

00:49:08.200 Church.

00:49:09.880 Gaza Baptist

00:49:11.040 Church.

00:49:11.200 Not too many

00:49:11.580 people know

00:49:12.020 that Baptists

00:49:13.060 have made it

00:49:13.480 all the way

00:49:13.820 to Gaza.

00:49:15.040 And Gaza

00:49:17.000 Baptist Church

00:49:17.760 was burned,

00:49:19.580 was bombed.

00:49:22.500 There was

00:49:23.220 some family.

00:49:23.840 Gaza Baptist

00:49:24.360 Church was

00:49:24.820 bombed?

00:49:25.440 Yes.

00:49:26.120 Now, imagine

00:49:26.740 that first

00:49:27.800 Baptist Church

00:49:28.740 of Dallas

00:49:29.640 people were

00:49:31.180 bombed.

00:49:32.620 Or of

00:49:32.920 Little Rock.

00:49:33.460 I believe

00:49:35.480 the whole

00:49:36.320 United States

00:49:37.240 Army and

00:49:38.340 Marine and

00:49:39.140 military and

00:49:39.740 air force

00:49:40.380 will be going

00:49:41.120 after the

00:49:41.680 perpetrator.

00:49:42.580 Maybe not.

00:49:45.280 But, yeah,

00:49:46.520 it would be

00:49:47.680 obvious that

00:49:48.300 that is a

00:49:49.160 crime.

00:49:49.540 I just don't

00:49:50.060 understand, and

00:49:50.720 I've raised

00:49:51.100 this question

00:49:51.660 many, many

00:49:52.780 times, with

00:49:53.820 Christian leaders

00:49:54.400 in the United

00:49:54.820 States.

00:49:55.320 What did the

00:49:56.900 Baptists in

00:49:57.560 Gaza do wrong?

00:49:59.140 Why are we

00:50:00.000 paying to

00:50:00.400 bomb their

00:50:00.780 church?

00:50:01.560 Do you know?

00:50:02.040 It's not just

00:50:02.680 the Baptists.

00:50:03.340 It's all the

00:50:04.120 Palestinian people

00:50:05.480 are being

00:50:06.020 collectively punished

00:50:07.000 in Gaza.

00:50:07.440 And what's

00:50:07.820 happened in

00:50:08.280 Gaza, it's

00:50:08.880 really horrific

00:50:10.340 atrocity that

00:50:11.240 no one should

00:50:12.040 be, you know,

00:50:13.320 if it doesn't

00:50:14.160 shake us at

00:50:15.120 our core, I

00:50:16.160 don't think we

00:50:16.640 have any

00:50:17.060 humanity.

00:50:17.420 Well, we're

00:50:17.740 Americans, so we

00:50:18.360 have no idea

00:50:18.960 what's happened

00:50:19.820 in Gaza, so

00:50:20.460 why don't you

00:50:20.840 tell us?

00:50:23.400 In October,

00:50:25.220 there was a

00:50:25.820 bomb that

00:50:26.420 killed 17

00:50:27.740 Christians.

00:50:29.520 Historic

00:50:30.020 church was

00:50:30.740 bombed.

00:50:31.820 Fifth century

00:50:32.440 church was

00:50:33.540 bombed.

00:50:33.920 In Gaza.

00:50:34.580 In Gaza and

00:50:35.240 killed so many

00:50:35.860 Christians.

00:50:36.960 There is a

00:50:37.840 lady that

00:50:38.380 played the

00:50:38.800 piano at

00:50:39.340 Gaza Baptist

00:50:39.900 Church.

00:50:40.780 Her name

00:50:41.140 was Ilham

00:50:41.800 Farah.

00:50:42.580 She was an

00:50:43.180 icon, music

00:50:44.020 icon in

00:50:44.600 Gaza.

00:50:44.880 Everybody

00:50:45.180 loved her.

00:50:45.920 She was

00:50:46.140 84.

00:50:47.260 She went

00:50:47.820 to her

00:50:48.140 house to

00:50:49.700 check on

00:50:50.060 the house

00:50:50.340 if it's

00:50:50.660 still standing

00:50:51.180 or not.

00:50:51.880 She gets

00:50:52.440 sniped, shot

00:50:54.640 in the leg

00:50:55.500 by an

00:50:55.940 Israeli

00:50:56.300 soldier.

00:50:56.820 left to

00:50:58.320 bleed to

00:50:58.900 death for

00:50:59.360 three agonizing

00:51:00.800 days.

00:51:02.020 She was

00:51:02.280 on the

00:51:02.520 phone until

00:51:02.960 her phone

00:51:03.380 was dead

00:51:03.900 on one

00:51:04.720 of my

00:51:04.960 closest

00:51:05.260 friends.

00:51:06.060 He was

00:51:06.300 with her

00:51:06.720 on the

00:51:07.020 phone.

00:51:08.120 And a few

00:51:08.420 weeks later

00:51:08.960 when they

00:51:09.300 went to

00:51:09.680 bury her,

00:51:10.420 they found

00:51:10.820 out that

00:51:11.200 the Israeli

00:51:12.060 tank

00:51:13.000 crawled over

00:51:13.600 her body.

00:51:15.740 Ilham

00:51:16.080 Farah.

00:51:17.360 She played

00:51:18.160 the piano.

00:51:19.600 She was

00:51:19.860 part of the

00:51:20.420 worship team

00:51:20.960 in Gaza

00:51:21.320 Baptist

00:51:21.680 Church.

00:51:23.540 Nahida and

00:51:24.140 Samar.

00:51:24.380 When did

00:51:24.700 this happen?

00:51:25.600 That was

00:51:26.020 in November

00:51:26.740 2023.

00:51:28.360 So we

00:51:29.100 know it

00:51:29.460 was a

00:51:29.800 vengeance

00:51:30.100 campaign.

00:51:30.720 It was a

00:51:31.060 retaliation.

00:51:31.460 But why

00:51:31.880 vengeance

00:51:32.380 against 84

00:51:33.480 year old

00:51:34.060 Christian

00:51:34.440 piano

00:51:34.780 players?

00:51:35.380 Like what

00:51:35.580 does she

00:51:35.840 have to

00:51:36.120 do with

00:51:36.400 it?

00:51:37.600 Nahida and

00:51:38.320 Samar

00:51:38.640 Anton,

00:51:39.320 another two

00:51:39.960 ladies,

00:51:40.260 a lady in

00:51:41.000 her 80s

00:51:41.700 and her

00:51:42.120 daughter.

00:51:43.140 They were

00:51:43.580 gunned by

00:51:44.300 an Israeli

00:51:44.800 sniper on

00:51:45.700 church

00:51:46.160 ground,

00:51:47.340 holy family

00:51:48.240 church.

00:51:49.020 That was

00:51:49.400 also later

00:51:50.040 on bombed

00:51:51.180 and three

00:51:52.140 people were

00:51:52.900 killed.

00:51:54.560 Those are

00:51:55.380 real stories.

00:51:56.420 Those are

00:51:56.760 real people

00:51:57.600 who have

00:51:58.100 suffered

00:51:58.660 because of

00:52:01.280 this military

00:52:02.720 power that

00:52:04.460 is directed

00:52:05.360 on them

00:52:06.000 day and

00:52:06.600 day and

00:52:06.920 night.

00:52:07.560 And the

00:52:08.540 whole idea

00:52:09.300 is really

00:52:09.840 honestly is

00:52:11.320 getting rid

00:52:12.300 of Palestinians.

00:52:13.160 It's pushing

00:52:13.680 them out.

00:52:14.300 Doesn't matter

00:52:14.760 whether they're

00:52:15.220 Christians or

00:52:15.860 Muslims.

00:52:17.100 That has been

00:52:17.680 the strategy

00:52:18.240 and now

00:52:18.820 they're taking

00:52:20.040 a different

00:52:20.440 approach in

00:52:21.060 the West

00:52:21.340 Bank by

00:52:22.180 suffocating

00:52:22.860 the communities

00:52:23.600 by creating

00:52:24.360 as many

00:52:25.700 Israeli

00:52:26.460 settlements as

00:52:27.180 possible so

00:52:28.200 they can

00:52:28.640 squeeze the

00:52:29.880 communities out.

00:52:32.240 They push

00:52:32.640 them out of

00:52:33.100 their land.

00:52:34.560 And when

00:52:35.420 you were a

00:52:35.900 child,

00:52:36.480 there were

00:52:36.740 Israeli

00:52:37.020 settlements

00:52:37.360 near your

00:52:37.820 home.

00:52:38.640 Yes.

00:52:39.640 Did you

00:52:40.320 ever have

00:52:40.840 positive

00:52:41.360 interactions

00:52:41.920 with the

00:52:42.340 settlers?

00:52:43.300 You know,

00:52:43.500 to be honest

00:52:43.880 with you,

00:52:44.560 some settlers

00:52:45.080 have no

00:52:45.680 idea.

00:52:46.660 They just

00:52:46.960 moved in

00:52:47.420 there.

00:52:48.600 And again,

00:52:49.460 we can't

00:52:50.000 really paint

00:52:50.580 with white

00:52:51.040 brush and

00:52:51.460 say all

00:52:52.260 these people

00:52:52.740 are evil.

00:52:53.500 But there

00:52:53.720 is a

00:52:54.000 system that

00:52:54.800 is enabling

00:52:55.540 this evil

00:52:56.800 to take

00:52:57.220 place.

00:52:57.240 Some settlers,

00:52:57.800 it's just

00:52:58.120 cheaper,

00:52:58.600 right,

00:52:58.860 to live out

00:52:59.280 there.

00:52:59.580 They get

00:52:59.900 subsidized and

00:53:00.960 they get

00:53:01.520 government

00:53:02.960 subsidies to

00:53:03.840 move into

00:53:04.700 the West

00:53:05.700 Bank and

00:53:06.160 they call it

00:53:06.620 Judea and

00:53:07.180 Samaria.

00:53:08.260 And

00:53:08.320 unfortunately,

00:53:08.860 going back to

00:53:09.580 your questions,

00:53:11.080 there is an

00:53:11.700 organization,

00:53:12.400 not just one,

00:53:13.000 but there's one

00:53:13.460 that I know

00:53:13.920 of and they

00:53:14.480 boast about it

00:53:15.420 on their

00:53:15.700 website that

00:53:16.240 they have

00:53:16.600 raised and

00:53:17.740 spent $3.5

00:53:19.940 billion to

00:53:22.380 support these

00:53:23.040 settlements and

00:53:24.160 to bring people

00:53:25.300 from all over

00:53:26.540 the world to

00:53:27.560 return to

00:53:28.700 their, you

00:53:29.580 know,

00:53:30.300 ancestral

00:53:30.820 homeland of

00:53:31.820 Judea and

00:53:32.380 Samaria.

00:53:33.280 And they

00:53:33.800 raised those

00:53:34.380 $3.5

00:53:35.180 billion from

00:53:37.400 evangelical

00:53:38.000 Christians,

00:53:39.200 from Christians

00:53:40.080 in the United

00:53:40.660 States.

00:53:41.640 Now, if

00:53:42.680 you're American

00:53:43.220 here and

00:53:44.020 you go to

00:53:45.720 church, you

00:53:46.760 love Jesus,

00:53:47.520 you love

00:53:47.820 scriptures just

00:53:48.600 like we do,

00:53:49.860 you worship

00:53:50.220 every Sunday,

00:53:50.960 you're involved

00:53:51.520 in ministry,

00:53:52.500 you're volunteering

00:53:53.040 at your local

00:53:53.780 church, and

00:53:54.980 if you hear the

00:53:55.600 vision from

00:53:56.500 your pastors

00:53:57.100 that, hey,

00:53:58.440 we're, you

00:53:59.760 know, the

00:54:00.020 Jewish people,

00:54:00.920 they have

00:54:01.520 gone under

00:54:02.500 severe,

00:54:05.580 horrific

00:54:06.000 holocausts

00:54:07.760 during World

00:54:09.000 War II,

00:54:09.520 and now

00:54:11.200 we have

00:54:11.900 the opportunity

00:54:13.700 to bring

00:54:14.920 some of

00:54:15.340 these survivors

00:54:16.160 back to

00:54:17.400 Israel, to

00:54:18.000 their homeland.

00:54:19.200 If you're an

00:54:19.540 American watching

00:54:20.300 this and

00:54:20.840 hearing this,

00:54:21.460 wow, this

00:54:21.780 sounds really

00:54:22.380 great, this

00:54:22.980 sounds very

00:54:23.520 noble, and

00:54:25.200 I agree, I

00:54:26.380 mean, as a

00:54:27.480 Palestinian, I

00:54:29.300 want the Jewish

00:54:29.940 people to live in

00:54:30.740 safety and

00:54:31.280 dignity.

00:54:31.940 Of course.

00:54:33.020 But it

00:54:33.380 doesn't have to

00:54:34.460 come at the

00:54:35.180 expense of the

00:54:36.480 local Christian

00:54:37.580 Palestinians and

00:54:38.700 the local

00:54:39.340 Palestinian

00:54:40.180 indigenous

00:54:41.300 people who

00:54:41.980 have lived in

00:54:42.600 that land for

00:54:43.080 the past

00:54:43.380 2,000 years.

00:54:44.620 You see, what

00:54:45.060 they're telling

00:54:45.480 you is that

00:54:46.020 this is a

00:54:46.500 great vision.

00:54:47.340 It's, you

00:54:48.220 know, Christian,

00:54:49.880 when they hear

00:54:50.740 about Zionism,

00:54:52.080 it's a

00:54:52.520 compelling

00:54:52.900 vision.

00:54:54.020 It's bringing

00:54:54.760 people who

00:54:55.480 don't have

00:54:55.980 any land and

00:54:56.760 have, and

00:54:57.680 create a

00:54:58.580 homeland.

00:54:58.960 A land

00:54:59.280 without people

00:55:00.360 for people

00:55:00.880 without land.

00:55:01.500 Yes, but

00:55:01.900 the land

00:55:02.260 had people.

00:55:03.080 I know.

00:55:03.940 So what

00:55:04.320 do you do

00:55:04.600 to create

00:55:05.160 room is you

00:55:06.120 keep pushing

00:55:06.600 them out?

00:55:08.300 So, can I

00:55:09.560 ask what you

00:55:10.160 referred to

00:55:10.660 Judea and

00:55:11.180 Samaria?

00:55:11.800 I know that

00:55:12.400 under Ron

00:55:13.580 DeSantis in

00:55:15.260 the state of

00:55:15.880 Florida, it's

00:55:16.300 now like

00:55:16.780 required by

00:55:17.780 law to

00:55:18.460 call it

00:55:18.780 Judea and

00:55:19.260 Samaria.

00:55:19.560 What we

00:55:19.780 call the

00:55:20.080 West Bank,

00:55:20.480 which was

00:55:20.680 part of

00:55:21.180 Jordan,

00:55:22.680 formerly

00:55:22.940 Transjordan,

00:55:23.920 whatever,

00:55:24.300 but it's

00:55:24.860 right outside

00:55:26.560 Jerusalem,

00:55:27.360 all the way

00:55:28.220 to the

00:55:28.500 Jordan River.

00:55:29.040 It's the

00:55:29.200 West Bank

00:55:29.480 Jordan River.

00:55:29.900 that area

00:55:30.660 was taken

00:55:31.460 from Jordan

00:55:32.300 in the

00:55:32.720 Six Day

00:55:33.180 War in

00:55:33.440 1967.

00:55:34.680 And so

00:55:35.860 we've called

00:55:36.360 it my

00:55:36.580 whole life

00:55:37.180 the West

00:55:38.200 Bank.

00:55:38.880 And now

00:55:39.720 we're required

00:55:40.680 to call it

00:55:42.640 Judea and

00:55:43.280 Samaria.

00:55:43.940 I don't really

00:55:44.760 care.

00:55:45.400 I wonder why

00:55:46.020 some American

00:55:46.980 politician is

00:55:47.600 telling me

00:55:47.940 what I have

00:55:48.300 to call

00:55:48.920 a place

00:55:49.700 across the

00:55:50.580 ocean,

00:55:51.160 because he's

00:55:52.380 taking a lot

00:55:53.000 of money

00:55:53.300 from proponents

00:55:54.440 of this,

00:55:54.860 of course.

00:55:55.780 But why are

00:55:56.700 they so intent

00:55:57.620 on forcing me

00:55:58.460 to call it

00:55:58.920 Judea and

00:55:59.360 Samaria?

00:55:59.680 I honestly

00:56:00.280 don't understand.

00:56:00.980 It's not just

00:56:01.400 Florida.

00:56:01.980 I mean,

00:56:02.220 I love

00:56:02.580 Florida.

00:56:03.300 I do too.

00:56:03.860 It's a great

00:56:04.740 sunshine state,

00:56:05.640 you know.

00:56:06.200 I moved here

00:56:06.980 in 2020

00:56:07.680 because I

00:56:09.480 heard that

00:56:10.100 Governor DeSantis

00:56:11.800 banned COVID

00:56:12.700 here.

00:56:13.200 Amen.

00:56:14.240 So we moved

00:56:15.320 here because

00:56:15.700 we love

00:56:16.060 Florida and

00:56:16.480 we still

00:56:16.780 enjoy it.

00:56:17.160 But they

00:56:17.660 passed a

00:56:18.060 law to

00:56:18.600 call Judea.

00:56:20.680 But why

00:56:20.920 is some

00:56:21.620 American

00:56:22.000 politician

00:56:22.480 telling me

00:56:23.200 that?

00:56:23.420 It's many

00:56:23.720 different

00:56:23.980 states who

00:56:24.380 are seeking

00:56:25.980 to change

00:56:27.140 the name.

00:56:28.240 And for

00:56:28.980 us,

00:56:29.200 you know,

00:56:29.360 I'm a

00:56:29.700 Christian.

00:56:30.600 Yes,

00:56:30.920 it's the

00:56:31.320 biblical name.

00:56:32.220 That's what

00:56:32.760 Judea and Samaria

00:56:34.520 was called when

00:56:35.240 Jesus was there.

00:56:36.740 But instead of

00:56:38.020 really worrying

00:56:39.080 about calling

00:56:40.260 a region a

00:56:42.240 biblical name,

00:56:43.120 why can't we

00:56:44.000 apply biblical

00:56:45.080 principles?

00:56:45.740 No,

00:56:46.180 but I'm just

00:56:46.480 saying,

00:56:46.720 so the

00:56:47.640 Israelis are

00:56:48.580 telling our

00:56:49.440 lawmakers,

00:56:50.320 you must

00:56:50.600 force your

00:56:51.200 people to

00:56:51.960 use these

00:56:52.560 words.

00:56:53.700 And they're

00:56:54.300 doing that

00:56:54.780 across our

00:56:55.500 society.

00:56:56.420 And they say

00:56:56.860 they're doing

00:56:57.240 it, so

00:56:57.540 they're doing

00:56:57.960 it.

00:56:58.580 But why?

00:56:59.540 Why does it

00:57:00.180 matter to

00:57:00.680 them?

00:57:01.020 They want to

00:57:01.920 invoke divine

00:57:02.680 rights.

00:57:03.940 They want to

00:57:05.500 make the

00:57:06.920 connection that

00:57:07.980 this land

00:57:09.160 divinely and

00:57:11.180 theologically

00:57:11.900 belongs to

00:57:13.260 one group of

00:57:14.260 people.

00:57:15.320 Now, if you

00:57:15.760 look at the

00:57:16.160 West Bank,

00:57:16.920 let's break

00:57:17.400 it down.

00:57:18.560 There is a

00:57:19.260 legal implication,

00:57:21.480 but there's

00:57:22.400 also a moral

00:57:23.380 and theological

00:57:24.160 implication.

00:57:25.720 The legal

00:57:26.380 implication,

00:57:27.520 the U.S.

00:57:27.920 politicians

00:57:28.300 hate it.

00:57:30.100 They don't

00:57:30.540 like to get

00:57:31.120 into the

00:57:31.540 legal complexity

00:57:33.580 of the West

00:57:34.400 Bank because

00:57:34.960 it's a losing

00:57:35.780 case.

00:57:36.480 The whole

00:57:37.140 world agrees

00:57:38.260 that the

00:57:38.760 Israeli

00:57:39.540 settlements are

00:57:40.820 illegally built

00:57:42.000 by an

00:57:42.880 occupying force

00:57:43.720 on

00:57:44.000 Palestinian

00:57:44.420 land.

00:57:45.280 The land

00:57:45.760 is occupied

00:57:46.340 according to

00:57:46.940 United Nations

00:57:47.620 Fourth Geneva

00:57:49.080 Convention,

00:57:49.820 United Nations

00:57:50.400 Resolution,

00:57:51.240 Security Council,

00:57:52.160 even.

00:57:52.780 This has been

00:57:53.480 the long-standing

00:57:54.480 U.S.

00:57:55.140 policy for the

00:57:55.860 past 50

00:57:56.860 years.

00:57:58.000 I don't know

00:57:58.360 if you remember

00:57:58.800 the Hansel

00:57:59.420 memo, which

00:58:00.820 stipulates that

00:58:02.560 this land is

00:58:04.400 occupied and

00:58:05.880 the settlements

00:58:06.400 are illegal.

00:58:07.780 Now, from

00:58:08.120 different

00:58:08.460 administrations,

00:58:09.300 the language is

00:58:09.940 different.

00:58:10.540 Some administrations

00:58:11.660 like Obama,

00:58:12.340 they call it

00:58:12.940 obstacle to

00:58:13.960 peace.

00:58:14.700 Some

00:58:14.880 administrations

00:58:15.440 call it

00:58:15.960 illegitimate

00:58:17.140 settlements that

00:58:18.840 are preventing

00:58:19.760 and hindering

00:58:20.340 the two-state

00:58:21.760 solution.

00:58:23.120 But interestingly,

00:58:24.440 in Trump's

00:58:25.080 first administration,

00:58:26.700 when Mike Pompeo

00:58:27.700 was the

00:58:28.540 Secretary of

00:58:29.160 State,

00:58:30.040 he rescinded

00:58:31.340 the Hansel

00:58:32.880 memo.

00:58:33.700 And he said,

00:58:35.120 those Israeli

00:58:35.900 settlements are

00:58:37.340 not per se

00:58:38.320 inconsistent with

00:58:39.500 international law.

00:58:41.120 Whatever that

00:58:41.780 means, but

00:58:42.260 basically, these

00:58:45.100 are not

00:58:45.980 illegal.

00:58:47.680 They have a

00:58:48.320 legal right

00:58:49.160 to Judea and

00:58:51.680 Samaria.

00:58:53.000 For me, okay,

00:58:53.760 I'm not a

00:58:54.520 politician, I'm

00:58:55.340 not a legal

00:58:55.820 expert, I'm a

00:58:56.900 Christian minister,

00:58:57.900 I look at the

00:58:58.760 issue from a

00:59:00.100 biblical perspective,

00:59:01.440 from a moral

00:59:02.240 perspective.

00:59:03.420 What are the

00:59:04.220 biblical implications

00:59:05.280 of this?

00:59:06.380 Does God

00:59:07.820 really approve

00:59:08.980 displacement?

00:59:11.840 Of stealing?

00:59:12.780 Of land

00:59:13.700 theft?

00:59:14.960 And there's a

00:59:15.600 biblical story

00:59:16.220 actually about

00:59:16.880 this, Tucker.

00:59:17.560 You know, when

00:59:18.140 the evil king

00:59:20.080 of Israel,

00:59:20.780 Ahab, he

00:59:22.400 had an evil

00:59:23.080 woman, wife,

00:59:24.820 named Jezabel.

00:59:26.200 They looked

00:59:27.000 over and they

00:59:27.560 saw a vineyard

00:59:28.500 owned by Naboth.

00:59:30.820 And they

00:59:31.460 loved that

00:59:32.000 vineyard.

00:59:33.120 They said,

00:59:33.660 man, we

00:59:34.600 want to take

00:59:35.100 it.

00:59:35.200 And being

00:59:37.300 the king of

00:59:37.940 Israel, they

00:59:38.520 could have

00:59:38.840 invoked divine

00:59:39.660 rights.

00:59:40.160 He's the king

00:59:40.840 ordained by

00:59:42.060 God.

00:59:42.800 But unfortunately

00:59:43.400 he was a

00:59:45.440 dishonorable king.

00:59:46.420 He did not

00:59:46.900 obey the

00:59:47.280 ways of the

00:59:47.740 Lord.

00:59:48.060 So I

00:59:49.060 don't know

00:59:49.260 how much

00:59:49.640 divine rights

00:59:51.040 he can

00:59:51.380 claim.

00:59:52.160 But let's

00:59:52.600 say for the

00:59:53.080 sake of

00:59:53.380 argument, they

00:59:54.020 claim divine

00:59:55.000 rights.

00:59:55.860 They went

00:59:56.480 and they

00:59:57.020 tried to

00:59:57.500 acquire the

00:59:58.240 vineyard

00:59:58.760 legally.

01:00:00.060 They offered

01:00:00.640 Naboth

01:00:01.060 money.

01:00:02.020 Naboth

01:00:02.340 refused to

01:00:03.020 sell.

01:00:05.740 So what

01:00:06.200 do they

01:00:06.380 do?

01:00:07.240 They

01:00:07.480 conspire and

01:00:08.520 they kill

01:00:09.120 Naboth and

01:00:10.240 they steal

01:00:10.960 the land and

01:00:12.240 they take

01:00:12.760 it.

01:00:13.200 It's the

01:00:13.700 state backed

01:00:15.400 by divine

01:00:16.120 rights stealing

01:00:17.840 innocent man's

01:00:19.180 land.

01:00:19.720 May I ask,

01:00:20.220 did God

01:00:20.580 notice that

01:00:21.120 they did

01:00:21.420 this?

01:00:21.920 Of course

01:00:22.320 he did.

01:00:22.540 Oh, he

01:00:23.420 did.

01:00:24.160 He sent

01:00:24.740 the prophet

01:00:25.300 Elijah to

01:00:26.600 stand before

01:00:27.500 Ahab and

01:00:28.160 tell him,

01:00:28.820 what you did

01:00:29.460 was wrong.

01:00:31.120 God is going

01:00:31.800 to judge

01:00:32.280 you for

01:00:32.680 it.

01:00:33.320 I wonder

01:00:34.680 as a

01:00:35.100 Palestinian

01:00:35.540 Christian.

01:00:36.160 And then

01:00:36.540 what happened?

01:00:38.300 Where are

01:00:39.120 the

01:00:40.600 Elijahs

01:00:42.120 of our

01:00:43.300 world?

01:00:44.080 Where is

01:00:44.680 the church

01:00:45.220 standing up

01:00:46.580 to this

01:00:46.920 injustice?

01:00:50.080 They're

01:00:50.600 cowards and

01:00:51.640 they're making

01:00:51.980 the wrong

01:00:52.340 choice.

01:00:52.900 They're going

01:00:53.620 to have to

01:00:53.900 answer for

01:00:54.360 this.

01:00:54.820 And let

01:00:55.520 me be

01:00:55.840 very honest

01:00:57.040 with you,

01:00:57.460 Tucker.

01:00:58.220 We can't

01:00:59.200 paint with

01:00:59.600 a white

01:00:59.920 brush.

01:01:00.360 There have

01:01:00.640 been so

01:01:01.140 many great

01:01:01.880 American

01:01:02.900 missionaries

01:01:05.140 who have

01:01:05.540 come to

01:01:05.980 the Middle

01:01:06.280 East,

01:01:07.160 who have

01:01:07.760 labored in

01:01:08.380 the Middle

01:01:08.660 East.

01:01:09.360 A lot of

01:01:09.840 great churches

01:01:10.580 have given

01:01:11.300 sweat and

01:01:13.380 blood for

01:01:13.840 the Middle

01:01:14.160 East.

01:01:14.780 They built

01:01:15.560 great schools.

01:01:17.500 We have

01:01:17.820 one in

01:01:18.180 Beth Sahur,

01:01:18.860 an evangelical

01:01:19.480 church in

01:01:20.320 Beth Sahur.

01:01:21.760 And they

01:01:23.360 have built

01:01:23.920 hospitals,

01:01:24.500 they have

01:01:24.780 built schools,

01:01:25.540 they have

01:01:25.840 planted

01:01:26.340 churches.

01:01:27.840 But there

01:01:28.520 is a stream

01:01:29.400 of

01:01:31.240 Christians

01:01:31.800 that has

01:01:33.860 disproportionate

01:01:34.860 power and

01:01:35.580 influence on

01:01:37.360 U.S.

01:01:37.720 policy.

01:01:39.340 And it's

01:01:40.200 that policy

01:01:41.300 that is

01:01:43.240 inflicting

01:01:43.980 pain and

01:01:44.720 suffering on

01:01:45.500 a community

01:01:46.000 like Beth

01:01:46.520 Sahur.

01:01:47.760 This is the

01:01:48.700 core issue.

01:01:49.740 I know.

01:01:50.200 And they're

01:01:50.820 doing it in

01:01:51.500 the name of

01:01:52.120 the Bible,

01:01:53.280 where the

01:01:53.900 Bible is

01:01:54.280 innocent.

01:01:54.740 I got a

01:01:56.480 lecture this

01:01:56.960 morning from

01:01:57.500 an Israeli.

01:01:58.200 This morning,

01:01:59.440 you know,

01:02:00.020 I'm not an

01:02:01.340 anti-Semite.

01:02:02.280 I abhor

01:02:02.860 anti-Semitism.

01:02:03.700 It's against

01:02:03.960 my religion.

01:02:04.520 I've said that

01:02:04.900 a thousand

01:02:05.240 times and I

01:02:05.740 mean it.

01:02:06.100 If I was

01:02:06.520 an anti-Semite,

01:02:07.000 I'd just say

01:02:07.300 I'm an

01:02:07.500 anti-Semite.

01:02:08.020 I am not

01:02:08.380 an anti-Semite

01:02:08.880 and I'm

01:02:09.220 never going

01:02:09.700 to become

01:02:10.040 one,

01:02:10.360 no matter

01:02:10.620 what they

01:02:10.960 say.

01:02:11.920 So I'm

01:02:12.120 talking,

01:02:12.540 you know,

01:02:12.780 like,

01:02:13.320 what do you

01:02:14.300 want me to

01:02:14.620 do to prove

01:02:15.060 I'm not

01:02:15.300 an anti-Semite?

01:02:17.080 100%.

01:02:17.920 Recant your

01:02:19.460 attacks on

01:02:20.040 Christian

01:02:20.340 Zionism.

01:02:22.020 It wasn't

01:02:22.900 stop saying

01:02:23.640 mean things

01:02:24.220 about the

01:02:24.740 Jews.

01:02:25.040 I've never

01:02:25.340 said you mean

01:02:25.760 things about

01:02:26.060 the Jews.

01:02:26.340 I don't feel

01:02:26.700 bad things

01:02:27.180 about the Jews.

01:02:27.480 I'm not mad

01:02:28.100 at the Jews.

01:02:28.980 Period.

01:02:30.000 I'm mad,

01:02:30.480 as I've said

01:02:30.820 a million

01:02:31.100 times,

01:02:31.640 about my

01:02:32.940 people,

01:02:33.780 Christians,

01:02:34.460 distorting the

01:02:35.040 gospel in a

01:02:36.040 way that

01:02:36.440 allows theft

01:02:37.940 and murder

01:02:38.680 and the

01:02:39.380 degradation of

01:02:40.080 human beings.

01:02:40.840 I'm never

01:02:42.000 going to be

01:02:42.560 okay with

01:02:43.360 that.

01:02:44.280 And that's

01:02:45.400 what they're

01:02:45.640 mad at me

01:02:46.020 about is

01:02:46.740 because I've

01:02:47.180 called out

01:02:47.580 Christian

01:02:47.940 Zionism because

01:02:49.560 they see

01:02:50.260 that.

01:02:50.920 I just

01:02:51.560 had this

01:02:51.800 conversation

01:02:52.200 an hour

01:02:52.600 ago,

01:02:52.920 so it's

01:02:53.180 fresh in

01:02:53.580 mind.

01:02:54.200 They see

01:02:55.160 that as

01:02:55.880 critical.

01:02:56.800 You have

01:02:57.280 to have

01:02:57.800 American

01:02:58.640 evangelical

01:02:59.420 pastors

01:03:00.160 telling their

01:03:02.100 congregations

01:03:02.900 who are

01:03:03.240 sweet people

01:03:03.940 who don't

01:03:04.280 know any

01:03:04.600 better that

01:03:05.880 God wants

01:03:06.900 you to

01:03:07.360 support the

01:03:08.580 state of

01:03:08.960 Israel,

01:03:10.140 Benjamin

01:03:10.420 Netanyahu.

01:03:11.180 They need

01:03:12.240 that.

01:03:12.540 Is that

01:03:13.400 fair,

01:03:13.740 do you

01:03:13.880 think?

01:03:15.160 What

01:03:15.420 Christian

01:03:15.920 Zionists

01:03:16.600 get wrong

01:03:19.220 here is

01:03:20.060 that not

01:03:20.840 because they

01:03:21.520 want to

01:03:21.840 create a

01:03:22.620 safe place

01:03:23.380 for the

01:03:23.840 Jewish

01:03:24.080 people.

01:03:24.920 That could

01:03:26.040 be an

01:03:26.360 honorable

01:03:26.660 cause.

01:03:27.640 Yes,

01:03:27.920 I agree.

01:03:28.660 But the

01:03:28.980 process,

01:03:30.060 the implication

01:03:30.820 of what that

01:03:31.920 means,

01:03:32.640 to them,

01:03:33.760 Christian

01:03:34.060 Zionism means

01:03:34.860 creating a

01:03:35.480 safe place

01:03:35.860 for the

01:03:36.200 Jews where

01:03:36.700 they can

01:03:37.100 feel safe

01:03:37.680 and secure

01:03:38.140 and which

01:03:38.480 is honorable

01:03:38.960 great.

01:03:39.540 Got it.

01:03:40.340 But for

01:03:40.780 Palestinians,

01:03:41.640 Christian

01:03:41.920 Zionism means

01:03:43.020 taking our

01:03:45.220 land,

01:03:45.920 taking our

01:03:46.480 resources

01:03:47.200 while declaring

01:03:49.040 that you

01:03:50.620 have a

01:03:50.980 divine right

01:03:51.560 and the

01:03:52.100 descendants of

01:03:53.080 the shepherds

01:03:53.840 in the

01:03:54.420 little town

01:03:55.140 of Beit

01:03:55.520 Sahur who

01:03:56.740 have maintained

01:03:57.660 their Christian

01:03:58.320 presence for

01:03:58.880 the past

01:03:59.180 2,000 years

01:03:59.880 do not

01:04:00.800 somehow have

01:04:01.920 that same

01:04:02.420 divine right.

01:04:03.460 Our

01:04:03.720 ancestors were

01:04:04.580 Jewish.

01:04:07.260 Palestinian

01:04:07.740 Christians,

01:04:08.700 they first

01:04:10.040 accepted the

01:04:10.800 message of

01:04:11.260 Christ and

01:04:12.820 that church

01:04:13.620 is still

01:04:15.220 intact today.

01:04:16.480 As I

01:04:17.180 said,

01:04:17.840 some people

01:04:19.440 even converted

01:04:20.060 when Islam

01:04:20.560 came to

01:04:21.080 Palestine.

01:04:22.100 Some people

01:04:22.640 converted but

01:04:23.260 they did not

01:04:24.000 convert from

01:04:24.600 atheism.

01:04:25.840 Muslims

01:04:26.120 converted from

01:04:26.800 Christianity

01:04:27.380 and probably

01:04:28.760 some Jews

01:04:29.320 even converted

01:04:30.080 to Islam.

01:04:30.700 So you

01:04:30.940 might have

01:04:31.360 some Muslims

01:04:32.640 that can

01:04:33.520 claim that

01:04:34.120 they have

01:04:34.640 a Jewish

01:04:35.100 DNA.

01:04:36.420 But again,

01:04:37.400 identity

01:04:37.900 changes.

01:04:38.700 It's dynamic.

01:04:40.040 Of course.

01:04:41.440 Language

01:04:41.960 changes but

01:04:43.480 the people

01:04:44.200 are there.

01:04:45.180 So I

01:04:46.700 think now

01:04:47.060 is a

01:04:47.280 good time

01:04:47.640 to ask

01:04:48.980 you to

01:04:49.280 explain what

01:04:49.780 Christian

01:04:50.160 Zionism is

01:04:51.180 and I'm

01:04:52.400 at a

01:04:52.560 disadvantage

01:04:52.960 because I'm

01:04:53.680 so ignorant.

01:04:54.820 I just

01:04:55.140 didn't grow up

01:04:55.580 around this

01:04:55.940 at all.

01:04:56.480 So as

01:04:57.620 fairly as

01:04:58.100 you can,

01:04:58.540 can you

01:04:58.800 explain what

01:04:59.540 Christian

01:04:59.900 Zionism is?

01:05:00.460 And I

01:05:00.720 should say,

01:05:01.180 you came to

01:05:01.540 the United

01:05:01.700 States and

01:05:01.980 went to

01:05:02.180 Liberty

01:05:02.340 University,

01:05:03.360 correct?

01:05:04.060 Yes.

01:05:04.660 Lots of

01:05:05.140 great people

01:05:05.500 there.

01:05:05.740 Lots of

01:05:06.040 Christian

01:05:06.280 Zionists

01:05:06.740 there.

01:05:07.180 Lots.

01:05:07.820 So I

01:05:08.180 think you

01:05:09.080 understand it,

01:05:09.800 right?

01:05:09.940 And I

01:05:11.140 loved my

01:05:11.600 time at

01:05:11.980 Liberty

01:05:12.160 University.

01:05:12.580 So thankful

01:05:13.340 for the

01:05:14.320 great

01:05:14.680 education I

01:05:15.480 got there.

01:05:15.960 I had to

01:05:16.460 meet a

01:05:17.280 lot of

01:05:17.500 great

01:05:17.800 friends,

01:05:19.060 great

01:05:19.260 professors.

01:05:20.180 My life

01:05:20.680 was changed

01:05:21.240 there.

01:05:21.620 I actually

01:05:22.160 rededicated

01:05:22.920 my life

01:05:23.700 and I

01:05:25.180 committed

01:05:25.540 my life

01:05:26.260 to service

01:05:26.920 at Liberty

01:05:27.740 University.

01:05:28.460 And I

01:05:28.740 received the

01:05:29.300 vision to

01:05:29.700 start Levant

01:05:30.240 Ministries at

01:05:31.580 Liberty,

01:05:32.520 which is the

01:05:33.600 organization I

01:05:34.380 now lead.

01:05:35.140 But here

01:05:38.140 is where

01:05:38.740 Christian

01:05:39.940 Zionism

01:05:40.780 have a

01:05:42.280 different

01:05:42.580 understanding.

01:05:43.760 It's a

01:05:44.200 theopolitical

01:05:45.400 movement

01:05:46.820 that says

01:05:48.380 that God

01:05:49.180 has two

01:05:50.080 distinct

01:05:50.560 people

01:05:51.020 with two

01:05:52.160 distinct

01:05:52.560 plans

01:05:53.160 and two

01:05:54.040 distinct

01:05:54.460 covenants.

01:05:56.300 When Mike

01:05:56.880 Huckabee was

01:05:57.440 asked on,

01:05:58.960 he was on

01:05:59.460 an interview

01:06:00.400 at TBN,

01:06:02.520 Trinity

01:06:02.920 Broadcasting

01:06:03.560 Network,

01:06:04.440 and he was

01:06:04.940 asked,

01:06:05.360 what is the

01:06:05.860 verse that

01:06:06.340 guides your

01:06:06.960 day-to-day

01:06:07.580 job as a

01:06:09.380 U.S.

01:06:09.720 ambassador in

01:06:10.320 Israel?

01:06:11.280 You know

01:06:11.560 what he

01:06:11.780 said?

01:06:12.260 He said

01:06:12.560 Genesis 12

01:06:13.340 3.

01:06:14.460 I want

01:06:15.240 to be able

01:06:15.720 to bless

01:06:16.340 Israel so

01:06:17.000 I can be

01:06:17.540 blessed.

01:06:18.200 I want

01:06:18.620 to secure

01:06:19.140 all the

01:06:19.580 blessings for

01:06:20.160 Israel so

01:06:21.360 the United

01:06:21.920 States can

01:06:22.720 receive the

01:06:23.360 blessings in

01:06:24.400 return.

01:06:25.820 So for

01:06:27.460 us, we

01:06:28.860 have to look

01:06:29.480 at this

01:06:30.040 theology.

01:06:31.640 Do you

01:06:32.300 know what

01:06:32.500 that means?

01:06:33.240 to me as

01:06:35.220 someone who's

01:06:35.900 interested in

01:06:36.400 words, a

01:06:36.900 former editor,

01:06:38.400 book writer,

01:06:39.220 I care about

01:06:39.840 definitions.

01:06:41.400 And so when

01:06:42.040 Christian Zionists

01:06:43.340 say Israel,

01:06:44.280 what are they

01:06:44.700 talking about?

01:06:45.920 That's a great

01:06:46.500 question because

01:06:47.160 as Christians,

01:06:47.980 we have to

01:06:48.700 look at the

01:06:49.480 scripture through

01:06:51.660 the lens of

01:06:52.240 Christ.

01:06:52.860 Christ is the

01:06:54.060 point.

01:06:55.400 Christ is the

01:06:56.260 fulfillment.

01:06:57.780 And the

01:06:58.260 way I look

01:06:58.880 at scriptures,

01:06:59.780 I look at

01:07:00.280 the Old

01:07:00.880 Testament,

01:07:01.740 the faithful

01:07:02.560 and the

01:07:02.940 righteous people

01:07:03.520 of the Old

01:07:03.940 Testament,

01:07:04.740 and the

01:07:05.360 righteous and

01:07:05.940 the faithful

01:07:06.600 people of

01:07:07.100 the New

01:07:07.380 Testament as

01:07:08.200 one faith

01:07:09.000 community.

01:07:10.280 They're

01:07:10.780 beautifully

01:07:11.260 connected

01:07:11.820 through the

01:07:12.500 cross.

01:07:13.480 The moment

01:07:14.080 that you

01:07:14.480 start separating

01:07:15.540 this, this

01:07:16.900 is when you

01:07:17.460 start getting

01:07:18.180 into different

01:07:20.640 interpretation of

01:07:21.600 what Israel

01:07:22.200 means today.

01:07:23.380 Is it the

01:07:23.900 government of

01:07:24.360 Israel?

01:07:24.760 Are God's

01:07:25.160 people or

01:07:25.720 not?

01:07:26.400 But when

01:07:26.900 we look at

01:07:27.480 the gospel,

01:07:28.360 we see Jesus

01:07:29.200 as the very

01:07:30.120 center.

01:07:31.280 We look at

01:07:32.180 the Old

01:07:33.320 Testament with

01:07:34.880 the lens of

01:07:35.880 the gospel.

01:07:37.100 We see Jesus

01:07:38.120 in the Old

01:07:38.780 Testament.

01:07:39.740 And what Jesus

01:07:40.520 did is very

01:07:41.460 critical and it

01:07:42.660 really is

01:07:44.460 important for us

01:07:45.500 to understand

01:07:46.260 what Jesus did

01:07:47.300 in the new

01:07:47.820 covenant he

01:07:48.440 brought and

01:07:49.400 how it changed

01:07:50.560 and it

01:07:50.980 transformed the

01:07:51.940 old covenant

01:07:52.600 that God had

01:07:53.760 with Abraham.

01:07:54.500 It didn't

01:07:55.120 abolish it.

01:07:56.360 It didn't

01:07:56.840 replace it,

01:07:57.580 which is,

01:07:57.960 you know,

01:07:58.160 we're not

01:07:58.480 replacement

01:07:58.900 theology.

01:07:59.500 I do not

01:08:00.340 agree with

01:08:00.820 replacement

01:08:01.180 theology.

01:08:01.700 God is not

01:08:02.240 done with

01:08:02.640 the Jews.

01:08:03.360 God is not

01:08:03.940 done with

01:08:04.440 anybody.

01:08:05.140 God wants

01:08:05.600 everybody to

01:08:06.560 come to

01:08:07.400 the saving

01:08:08.020 knowledge and

01:08:09.200 to enjoy his

01:08:10.060 grace and to

01:08:11.100 enjoy his

01:08:11.880 blessings.

01:08:13.160 God desires

01:08:13.740 this for God

01:08:14.400 so loved the

01:08:15.000 world, right?

01:08:16.700 But what Jesus

01:08:17.400 did, he did

01:08:17.980 not replace the

01:08:18.820 Jews, but it

01:08:20.100 was a journey

01:08:20.800 that God

01:08:21.320 started with

01:08:22.080 Abraham.

01:08:22.560 Abraham, and

01:08:23.960 when they

01:08:24.660 called Genesis

01:08:25.520 12, 3, that

01:08:27.740 was a private

01:08:28.360 conversation between

01:08:29.540 God and

01:08:30.060 Abraham.

01:08:31.080 And God

01:08:31.940 came to

01:08:32.380 Abraham and

01:08:32.840 told him, you

01:08:33.300 no longer are

01:08:34.100 called Abrams,

01:08:34.840 but you're going

01:08:35.260 to be called

01:08:35.900 Abraham, the

01:08:37.300 father with all

01:08:38.240 nations.

01:08:38.600 So God's

01:08:39.240 original plan is

01:08:40.280 to redeem all

01:08:41.300 nations, is to

01:08:42.340 bless the whole

01:08:43.240 world through the

01:08:45.160 seed of Abraham.

01:08:46.100 And when you

01:08:47.600 look at the

01:08:48.100 New Testament, you

01:08:49.800 read a verse

01:08:51.100 like Galatians

01:08:51.760 3, 16, where

01:08:53.060 it says, Abraham

01:08:55.080 has one seed.

01:08:57.560 He didn't say

01:08:58.240 seeds.

01:08:59.720 And through

01:09:00.380 that seed, you

01:09:02.100 get to enjoy

01:09:03.020 all the

01:09:03.700 Abrahamic

01:09:04.520 blessings.

01:09:06.240 So what Jesus

01:09:07.360 came to do, and

01:09:08.380 it's that seed, of

01:09:09.240 course, it's

01:09:09.760 Christ.

01:09:11.180 And that

01:09:11.780 journey that

01:09:12.500 Abraham started

01:09:14.040 with God, it

01:09:15.500 still in motion

01:09:16.620 today.

01:09:17.940 It didn't

01:09:18.460 divert.

01:09:19.440 It didn't get

01:09:20.220 replaced.

01:09:21.000 It didn't get, oh

01:09:21.940 well, Jesus

01:09:23.380 came and his

01:09:24.160 people didn't

01:09:24.680 accept him, so

01:09:25.300 let me go to

01:09:26.220 plan P.

01:09:26.960 There was

01:09:27.320 always one

01:09:28.660 plan for God's

01:09:29.840 redemption and

01:09:30.480 God's salvation.

01:09:31.460 It started in

01:09:32.240 Abraham and

01:09:33.540 it culminated in

01:09:34.680 Jesus, and we

01:09:35.760 are the extension

01:09:37.000 of that

01:09:37.820 Abrahamic

01:09:38.460 blessing.

01:09:38.880 So if I put

01:09:40.080 my faith and

01:09:40.720 trust in Jesus

01:09:41.340 Christ, I get

01:09:42.840 to claim the

01:09:43.940 Abrahamic blessings

01:09:45.140 in Genesis 12

01:09:46.340 3.

01:09:46.840 It seems that

01:09:47.380 way, but I

01:09:48.560 guess I don't, I

01:09:49.680 mean, I have so

01:09:50.100 many questions, but

01:09:50.660 I mean, first of

01:09:52.560 all, how could

01:09:53.580 Christians ever

01:09:54.580 support any

01:09:55.860 movement that

01:09:56.940 rejects Jesus?

01:09:58.880 I just don't, I

01:09:59.960 don't understand

01:10:00.920 that.

01:10:01.340 How could we, we

01:10:02.160 could say we

01:10:02.820 feel so sorry for

01:10:04.560 people who reject

01:10:05.180 Jesus, we want to

01:10:06.340 help them?

01:10:07.280 In simple terms, I

01:10:08.280 think Christian

01:10:08.880 Zionism has

01:10:09.580 replaced Jesus with

01:10:11.120 the current state

01:10:11.880 of Israel.

01:10:12.420 Obviously, that's

01:10:13.580 why I think it's

01:10:14.420 heresy, and I

01:10:15.120 don't mean that in

01:10:16.040 a, I mean, like I

01:10:16.800 should be calling

01:10:17.320 anyone else a

01:10:17.840 heretic, I've

01:10:18.440 lived such a bad

01:10:19.160 life, but, and

01:10:20.440 I'm not, I hope it

01:10:21.580 don't sound

01:10:21.840 self-righteous, I

01:10:22.520 just don't

01:10:22.840 understand, it's

01:10:23.720 like, I thought

01:10:24.280 Christianity was

01:10:25.080 about following

01:10:25.900 Jesus, and Jesus

01:10:27.160 was the key.

01:10:28.340 Is it not?

01:10:29.240 You're the, you're

01:10:29.760 the minister.

01:10:30.680 What Jesus did, he

01:10:31.860 did two important

01:10:32.840 things that we

01:10:33.360 cannot overlook.

01:10:34.640 He expanded the

01:10:36.200 scope of the

01:10:36.820 promise of Abraham.

01:10:38.820 Right, to

01:10:38.920 everybody, right?

01:10:39.700 To everybody, and

01:10:40.740 he expanded the

01:10:41.780 meaning of the

01:10:42.520 promise.

01:10:42.940 Okay, and let

01:10:44.040 me unpack this

01:10:44.760 for a little

01:10:45.240 bit, for our, for

01:10:46.780 the viewers to

01:10:47.400 really understand

01:10:48.120 the theological

01:10:49.200 importance and

01:10:51.080 significance of

01:10:51.920 this.

01:10:52.440 So, when he

01:10:52.920 expanded the

01:10:53.800 scope of the

01:10:54.520 promise, what

01:10:55.620 is the promise?

01:10:57.080 He expanded it

01:10:58.200 from a mere

01:10:59.460 geographical location

01:11:01.120 alongside the

01:11:02.580 Mediterranean coastline

01:11:03.920 to include the

01:11:05.180 whole earth.

01:11:05.980 Yes.

01:11:06.460 The New Testament

01:11:07.360 spells it out.

01:11:08.860 Oh, I know.

01:11:09.400 Apostle Paul, you

01:11:10.580 know, in his

01:11:11.020 letters to the

01:11:11.640 Romans, Romans

01:11:12.620 4, 13, he

01:11:14.440 said, by faith, God

01:11:16.360 made Abraham the

01:11:17.760 heir of the

01:11:19.460 whole world.

01:11:20.560 Exactly.

01:11:21.300 I've read it.

01:11:22.380 So, for God so

01:11:24.120 loved the world, that

01:11:24.760 he gave his only

01:11:25.340 son, that

01:11:26.000 whosoever, right?

01:11:28.340 So, not only

01:11:29.240 expanded the

01:11:30.380 geographical

01:11:31.080 location of the

01:11:33.080 land, he also

01:11:34.540 expanded the

01:11:35.360 ethnic line of the

01:11:37.160 people to include

01:11:38.380 every tribe, every

01:11:39.540 nation, every

01:11:40.600 tongue.

01:11:40.940 It says that again

01:11:41.660 and again and

01:11:42.400 again and again.

01:11:43.480 And that's the

01:11:44.040 story of Acts, it's

01:11:45.340 the story of

01:11:45.840 Revelation, it's the

01:11:46.460 story of the whole

01:11:46.880 New Testament.

01:11:47.980 That's what Jesus

01:11:48.940 instructed his

01:11:49.720 disciples to do.

01:11:50.640 He said, hey, leave

01:11:52.380 your nationalistic

01:11:53.500 aspiration aside.

01:11:55.400 We have a

01:11:56.080 kingdom to build.

01:11:57.520 The kingdom of

01:11:58.340 God is at hand.

01:11:59.740 The kingdom of

01:12:00.440 God is among you.

01:12:02.520 So, they let go

01:12:04.280 of their dreams to

01:12:05.840 build the kingdom

01:12:06.560 for Israel, and

01:12:07.880 they went and

01:12:08.720 they paid for

01:12:09.440 their life for

01:12:10.060 the kingdom, the

01:12:11.580 eternal kingdom

01:12:12.460 of God.

01:12:13.500 So, Jesus

01:12:14.240 expanded the

01:12:15.280 geography.

01:12:16.860 He is the

01:12:18.040 locus of the

01:12:19.160 land.

01:12:20.100 He is the one

01:12:20.940 that speaks in

01:12:21.700 Hebrew that, you

01:12:22.960 know, if we

01:12:23.400 enter in Jesus, we

01:12:24.480 find rest.

01:12:25.980 The land does

01:12:26.740 not give us rest

01:12:27.740 anymore.

01:12:28.160 So, he expanded

01:12:28.860 the geography, he

01:12:29.840 expanded the

01:12:30.420 ethnic line to

01:12:31.000 include every

01:12:31.520 nation, every

01:12:32.020 tribe.

01:12:32.560 And that always,

01:12:33.360 by the way,

01:12:33.720 it's been always

01:12:34.780 God's plan that

01:12:35.620 way.

01:12:36.220 In Psalm, the

01:12:37.160 Old Testament,

01:12:37.980 chapter 2, verse

01:12:38.720 8, it says,

01:12:40.000 ask me and I

01:12:40.780 will give you

01:12:41.340 the nations as

01:12:43.080 your inheritance.

01:12:44.900 So, God's plan

01:12:45.680 has been always

01:12:46.640 the whole world,

01:12:47.940 redeeming the

01:12:48.560 whole world,

01:12:49.080 restoring the

01:12:49.700 whole world, and

01:12:50.860 it's been always

01:12:51.680 inclusive for all

01:12:53.640 people, all

01:12:54.320 ethnicity.

01:12:55.040 It's so clear, and

01:12:55.980 it's clear in

01:12:56.480 Jesus' ministry.

01:12:58.020 I'm spending the

01:12:58.740 year just reading

01:12:59.260 the four gospels

01:13:00.040 again and again,

01:13:00.900 and that jumps out

01:13:01.940 at me.

01:13:02.860 I mean, who

01:13:03.520 does Jesus

01:13:04.700 praise most?

01:13:07.280 The Roman

01:13:08.400 officer.

01:13:09.220 I've not seen

01:13:09.740 anyone with faith

01:13:10.620 like this in

01:13:11.560 Israel, right?

01:13:12.300 Some pagan

01:13:12.960 guy.

01:13:13.460 Yes.

01:13:14.220 Right.

01:13:14.500 But the meaning

01:13:16.240 of the promise,

01:13:16.940 and this is

01:13:17.300 important, what

01:13:18.760 does it mean?

01:13:20.020 Do we inherit a

01:13:24.000 holy land between

01:13:25.320 the river and the

01:13:26.360 Mediterranean?

01:13:27.320 Or does it mean

01:13:28.080 something else?

01:13:29.440 The meaning of

01:13:30.260 that promise have

01:13:31.580 also been

01:13:32.340 transformed.

01:13:33.480 It's not just the

01:13:34.340 scope of the

01:13:34.980 promise, it's the

01:13:35.800 meaning of the

01:13:36.440 promise.

01:13:37.160 Right.

01:13:37.460 From temporary to

01:13:39.200 eternal, from

01:13:40.920 physical to

01:13:42.260 spiritual, from

01:13:43.960 conditional, because

01:13:45.220 it was conditional,

01:13:45.960 by the way.

01:13:46.560 You know, he didn't

01:13:46.980 just give them the

01:13:47.760 land and say, this

01:13:48.840 is your land.

01:13:49.460 It's God's land,

01:13:50.520 by the way.

01:13:51.240 He is the

01:13:51.900 landlord, and the

01:13:53.360 people that were

01:13:53.880 given the land, they

01:13:54.700 were tenants, and

01:13:56.300 they have to obey the

01:13:57.500 commandments of the

01:13:58.320 Lord.

01:13:58.820 They have to love

01:14:00.000 their neighbors.

01:14:01.460 They have to take

01:14:02.240 care of the

01:14:02.980 foreigners among

01:14:04.020 them.

01:14:04.900 And when they

01:14:05.760 don't obey the

01:14:07.020 covenant that was

01:14:08.240 given to them, God

01:14:10.040 always kicked them

01:14:11.640 out.

01:14:12.060 Oh, yeah, they

01:14:12.780 get taken to

01:14:13.400 Babylon.

01:14:14.140 Yeah.

01:14:14.420 Yes, twice.

01:14:15.680 And the Old

01:14:17.840 Testament gives

01:14:18.320 graphic language when

01:14:20.120 describes the, you

01:14:21.920 know, not for

01:14:22.960 Israel, not obeying

01:14:23.960 the laws of the

01:14:24.820 Lord.

01:14:25.120 It says, the land

01:14:25.960 will vomit you

01:14:26.920 out.

01:14:27.540 Excuse my

01:14:27.980 language.

01:14:28.820 So, it was

01:14:30.260 conditional when

01:14:31.260 it was given to

01:14:31.880 Abraham, but in

01:14:33.640 Jesus, it's

01:14:35.000 secure.

01:14:36.140 It's eternal.

01:14:37.580 It's no longer.

01:14:38.540 And you know, what

01:14:39.700 really makes me fall

01:14:41.960 in love with Jesus

01:14:43.020 and the patriarchs

01:14:45.280 and the fathers, the

01:14:47.620 church fathers, and

01:14:49.580 the church throughout

01:14:50.540 history, and the

01:14:51.660 Palestinian church

01:14:52.280 really understand this

01:14:53.320 because they truly

01:14:54.880 understand the meaning

01:14:56.200 of the covenant.

01:14:57.640 Abraham, Isaac, and

01:14:58.920 Jacob, it spells it

01:15:00.560 out in Hebrews that

01:15:01.600 they were not, they

01:15:02.580 were eagerly looking

01:15:03.920 for the new

01:15:06.120 Jerusalem, whose

01:15:08.800 architect and

01:15:10.680 builder is God.

01:15:13.020 They were not

01:15:13.820 fixated on a mere

01:15:15.040 strip of land.

01:15:16.540 That's temporary.

01:15:18.580 That's going to be

01:15:19.320 gone.

01:15:20.240 We should be focused

01:15:21.160 on what's eternal.

01:15:21.900 And obviously, when

01:15:23.160 Jesus came, and he

01:15:24.460 was in John 18, when

01:15:25.880 he was being tried

01:15:27.920 before Pilate, the

01:15:30.120 charge was, are you

01:15:30.920 a king?

01:15:32.100 Are you threatening

01:15:33.340 me?

01:15:34.220 Am I, are you a

01:15:35.800 threat to my kingdom

01:15:36.880 and my dominion?

01:15:38.520 Jesus said, yes, I am

01:15:39.500 a king, but my

01:15:40.920 kingdom is not from

01:15:41.660 this world.

01:15:43.800 My kingdom is not

01:15:44.960 from here.

01:15:45.420 Why are we bringing

01:15:47.060 back a pre-Christian

01:15:49.640 territorial mindset

01:15:51.240 to the church

01:15:53.080 today?

01:15:53.800 Well, exactly.

01:15:54.580 And it is pre-Christian.

01:15:56.060 It's not Western at

01:15:57.320 all.

01:15:57.880 It's Eastern.

01:15:59.120 And collective

01:15:59.720 punishment is the

01:16:01.380 sign that we're not

01:16:02.220 dealing with a Western

01:16:03.040 mindset at all, because

01:16:04.520 we reject collective

01:16:05.600 punishment.

01:16:06.360 I may be mad at you.

01:16:07.500 I can't kill your kids.

01:16:08.500 Not allowed.

01:16:09.220 Yes.

01:16:10.300 And there are some

01:16:11.380 sincere dispensationalists.

01:16:13.460 Let me say this.

01:16:14.080 I have some dispensational

01:16:15.200 friends, and Christians

01:16:16.100 should debate this

01:16:17.460 vigorously, but it

01:16:19.180 should stay in the

01:16:20.080 seminary.

01:16:20.580 It should be staying

01:16:21.340 within the walls of the

01:16:22.120 church.

01:16:22.240 Well, that's the

01:16:22.700 problem.

01:16:23.000 I haven't even gotten

01:16:23.740 involved in it because

01:16:24.740 I'm just too ignorant.

01:16:26.040 Okay?

01:16:26.480 When you said

01:16:27.180 replacement theology, I

01:16:28.760 don't know what that is

01:16:29.240 that I'm not going to

01:16:29.660 learn.

01:16:30.320 All I know is that

01:16:31.300 Christianity, my read of

01:16:32.460 it is just focus on

01:16:33.580 Jesus and you will be

01:16:34.940 transformed.

01:16:35.580 And so I'm just kind of

01:16:36.180 stick with that.

01:16:36.840 But as a political

01:16:37.660 matter, and that's what

01:16:38.540 I do cover and have my

01:16:39.800 whole life, I don't

01:16:41.380 understand what

01:16:42.660 Ambassador Huckabee,

01:16:44.060 for example, is saying

01:16:44.960 when he says, bless

01:16:45.860 Israel.

01:16:46.280 Okay.

01:16:47.040 What is Israel?

01:16:47.960 So my read of Genesis is

01:16:49.860 it goes from like a

01:16:50.720 tributary of the

01:16:51.700 Euphrates in Iraq all

01:16:54.880 the way, you know, to

01:16:57.040 the Nile.

01:16:59.380 So that's like six

01:17:01.000 countries.

01:17:01.800 What is that?

01:17:02.520 What are the

01:17:02.760 boundaries?

01:17:03.140 And that's still too

01:17:04.160 small for God.

01:17:05.680 Of course, as a

01:17:06.920 theological matter.

01:17:07.820 But I think if we're

01:17:08.920 speaking in political

01:17:09.740 terms, this is a

01:17:10.400 government run by, you

01:17:12.840 know, secular people by

01:17:14.020 and large.

01:17:14.640 Yes.

01:17:15.200 And they're saying

01:17:16.000 God gave us this land.

01:17:17.020 Okay, what land?

01:17:17.800 What are the

01:17:18.060 boundaries?

01:17:18.520 We should at least

01:17:19.080 define the terms.

01:17:19.880 Second, who's we?

01:17:21.800 What does it mean?

01:17:22.920 Who are the people who

01:17:23.620 inherited this?

01:17:24.500 So the prime minister of

01:17:26.040 Israel is not religious.

01:17:27.100 He doesn't keep the

01:17:27.740 Sabbath or keep kosher.

01:17:28.760 I'm not attacking him.

01:17:29.480 I'm just saying like,

01:17:30.700 then what are you

01:17:31.440 talking about?

01:17:32.260 Are you saying you've

01:17:32.800 a genetic inheritance?

01:17:34.300 Like what?

01:17:34.940 Okay, let's see.

01:17:35.600 Can someone who

01:17:36.300 converts to Judaism

01:17:37.320 claims divine right

01:17:39.160 from Brooklyn, New York?

01:17:40.300 I don't even want to

01:17:41.100 have these conversations.

01:17:42.460 They're the ones

01:17:42.960 pushing them.

01:17:43.620 I think people,

01:17:44.580 I'm happy to let people

01:17:45.560 practice their own

01:17:46.200 religions.

01:17:46.640 I don't want to get

01:17:47.040 involved.

01:17:47.760 I don't want to know

01:17:48.420 everything about Mormonism

01:17:49.340 or Islam or whatever.

01:17:50.560 It's fine.

01:17:51.780 But as long as you're

01:17:52.660 saying you have a right

01:17:53.460 to my money and your

01:17:55.500 parents' land on the

01:17:57.680 basis of this promise

01:17:59.660 in Genesis, I have a

01:18:01.200 right to ask you what the

01:18:02.300 heck you're talking

01:18:02.860 about.

01:18:03.620 Did you know that

01:18:04.560 Israel goes out of its

01:18:06.400 way to prevent

01:18:07.420 Messianic believers from

01:18:09.240 making Aliyah?

01:18:10.860 No.

01:18:11.700 Jewish believers in

01:18:12.820 Jesus, if they find

01:18:15.080 out that you believed

01:18:15.960 in Jesus, they don't

01:18:18.360 give you the right to

01:18:19.940 immigrate to Israel.

01:18:20.980 What?

01:18:22.380 So whose land?

01:18:23.980 Is that true?

01:18:24.860 Whose promise?

01:18:25.860 Yeah.

01:18:26.160 I have a lot of Jewish

01:18:27.180 friends who are believers

01:18:28.380 in Jesus and they share

01:18:29.520 with me.

01:18:30.340 And they can't move back

01:18:32.400 to Israel and get all the

01:18:33.420 rights of...

01:18:34.980 Not as...

01:18:36.020 So they're really...

01:18:36.880 Okay, so now that we're

01:18:37.500 talking like present-day

01:18:40.060 concrete political

01:18:41.220 realities, there are two

01:18:43.580 claims that they could

01:18:44.460 potentially be making.

01:18:45.520 One is faith-based.

01:18:48.580 So I believe in this

01:18:49.800 religion called Judaism.

01:18:50.760 And we could debate what

01:18:51.540 that religion is.

01:18:52.340 Is it Talmudic or

01:18:53.460 rabbinic?

01:18:54.180 Whatever.

01:18:54.480 That's a whole separate

01:18:54.980 conversation that I don't

01:18:55.860 want to have, but they're

01:18:56.900 pushing this.

01:18:57.700 But it's either faith-based,

01:18:58.820 I believe in this, or it's

01:19:01.180 blood-based.

01:19:02.020 It's genetic.

01:19:02.680 They have also historical

01:19:04.380 claims.

01:19:05.120 A Jew's been here.

01:19:06.340 We have...

01:19:06.720 But who are the Jews then?

01:19:08.520 Do you have more DNA?

01:19:11.520 I don't know if you even

01:19:12.680 know the answer, but do you...

01:19:13.880 If we were to say, okay,

01:19:14.620 who lived in first-century

01:19:16.860 Palestine, current-day

01:19:18.360 Israel, are you more

01:19:20.100 closely related to those

01:19:21.180 people, or is Benjamin

01:19:22.080 Netanyahu more closely

01:19:23.020 related to those people?

01:19:24.240 They should do DNA tests

01:19:25.740 and see.

01:19:26.260 And I did my DNA test.

01:19:27.700 Palestinian Christians

01:19:28.460 are Levantine of origin.

01:19:31.040 So, it's likely that you

01:19:34.280 have more Jewish ancestors

01:19:35.780 than Benjamin Netanyahu's

01:19:37.240 family's from Europe.

01:19:38.120 Probably.

01:19:38.880 Okay.

01:19:39.540 So, then it can't be

01:19:41.400 genetic because...

01:19:42.720 Right?

01:19:43.100 Yes.

01:19:43.580 Well, again, as Christians,

01:19:44.840 we have to put the gospel

01:19:46.300 lens.

01:19:47.080 Well, I agree.

01:19:47.920 I agree.

01:19:48.580 We can't ignore what Jesus

01:19:50.040 did, and this is the

01:19:51.180 significance.

01:19:52.300 You know, when Jesus went

01:19:53.860 into Nazareth, his hometown,

01:19:55.720 synagogue, on a Saturday,

01:19:57.760 he was baptized, went in the

01:19:58.980 wilderness, got tried with

01:19:59.920 the devil, overcame with

01:20:01.560 scripture, and then he went

01:20:03.100 to his hometown.

01:20:04.720 The scroll from Isaiah was

01:20:05.960 handed to them, and he said,

01:20:07.820 this is the Nazareth

01:20:08.580 manifesto.

01:20:09.160 This is the first sermon he's

01:20:10.560 ever preached, Jesus.

01:20:12.460 Okay?

01:20:13.600 Started, launched his ministry

01:20:15.500 in Nazareth, and it's so

01:20:16.500 beautiful.

01:20:16.920 He said, the Spirit of the

01:20:17.760 Lord is upon me.

01:20:19.200 He has sent me to set the

01:20:21.640 captive free, to bring sight

01:20:23.700 to the blind, to bring,

01:20:26.360 proclaim the good news to

01:20:27.360 the poor.

01:20:27.900 Remember, everybody in the

01:20:29.620 synagogue were so happy.

01:20:31.460 And remember the context.

01:20:32.600 It was very, a lot of

01:20:34.300 tension between the Jews

01:20:35.320 and the Romans.

01:20:36.220 So the Jews were waiting for

01:20:37.860 the Messiah, but they were

01:20:39.340 waiting for a military

01:20:40.520 liberator.

01:20:41.460 They were waiting for a

01:20:42.680 politician to come and lead

01:20:44.100 them against the Romans.

01:20:46.020 But then Jesus gave two

01:20:48.400 sermon illustrations.

01:20:50.360 One about a widow from

01:20:52.580 Sidon, which is current

01:20:54.740 modern day of Lebanon.

01:20:55.840 He said, not because there

01:20:57.280 weren't so many widows in

01:20:58.380 Israel, that Elijah was

01:21:01.380 sent to the Sidonian widow.

01:21:03.920 Okay?

01:21:04.560 A foreigner.

01:21:05.420 Keep in mind.

01:21:06.000 When there were lots of

01:21:06.940 needy widows in Israel at the

01:21:08.180 time.

01:21:08.480 But he went to a foreigner.

01:21:10.260 And not because there weren't

01:21:11.740 so many people with leprosy,

01:21:13.580 which is a skin disease, that

01:21:15.840 God's grace through Elisha,

01:21:18.520 Elijah's servant, reached a

01:21:20.800 Syrian army commander whose name

01:21:24.240 is Naaman.

01:21:25.260 So Jesus is saying the

01:21:27.280 foreigner gets to enjoy God's

01:21:29.960 blessings and God's favor.

01:21:32.060 And the enemy from Aram gets to

01:21:36.040 enjoy God's blessings and God's

01:21:37.700 favor.

01:21:38.460 When they heard this, they were

01:21:40.740 furious.

01:21:41.660 They took him to the edge of the

01:21:43.220 town that was built on and they

01:21:44.700 wanted to throw him over.

01:21:45.620 To murder him.

01:21:46.320 Yeah.

01:21:46.460 So Jesus' message, if we keep it

01:21:50.900 central and focus, it disrupts all

01:21:53.720 this exclusive mindset.

01:21:56.840 Why can't we share the land?

01:21:58.740 Why can't we live in peace?

01:22:01.080 We are extending an olive branch and

01:22:03.340 saying, let's find...

01:22:04.720 Obviously, there is 7 million Jews

01:22:06.740 and 7 million Palestinians living

01:22:08.880 currently between the river and the

01:22:10.900 sea.

01:22:11.100 Obviously, they're not going to kick

01:22:15.660 the Palestinians out, although

01:22:17.880 they've been trying very, very hard

01:22:20.140 to do that.

01:22:21.380 And had Egypt open the borders and

01:22:23.360 Gaza, I think the whole population

01:22:25.160 would have been pushed out.

01:22:27.520 And they are trying to do it very,

01:22:29.900 very closely to the Christians in

01:22:32.740 Bethlehem right now by bringing many

01:22:34.320 different settlements and making life

01:22:35.840 extremely miserable, restricted

01:22:37.540 movement on all of that.

01:22:38.640 So obviously, the people are still

01:22:41.420 there.

01:22:42.500 They're not going to kick us out.

01:22:43.660 The other option is that the

01:22:45.120 Palestinians are going to kick the

01:22:46.400 Israelis out.

01:22:47.240 And for me as a Christian

01:22:48.280 Palestinians, I don't want to see

01:22:49.380 that happen.

01:22:49.880 I don't want to see another tragedy

01:22:51.500 inflicted upon the Jewish people.

01:22:53.780 So the bottom line, and this is the

01:22:55.840 posture and this is the attitude

01:22:58.420 and this is the position that every

01:23:01.880 single follower of Jesus must adopt

01:23:05.540 and follow.

01:23:06.160 So let's find a way to share the land.

01:23:11.040 Let's find a way to make peace

01:23:14.160 instead of getting caught in end

01:23:17.420 time scenarios, something speculative

01:23:20.320 sometime in the future.

01:23:22.020 What is that?

01:23:23.300 Or, you know, preferring another group

01:23:27.560 of people over another.

01:23:29.660 It's superiority.

01:23:31.300 It's becoming an ethnostate.

01:23:33.100 Are we going to keep it as an ethnostate?

01:23:34.900 Or can we find a diplomatic solution?

01:23:37.060 The danger is when Christian politicians

01:23:40.540 start to mix the politics with theology

01:23:44.740 and they come up with this formula that

01:23:48.060 is indigestible, hard to solve, sows

01:23:52.980 confusion, and it keeps people on the

01:23:56.500 sideline instead of actively engaging and

01:23:59.660 becoming peacemakers.

01:24:00.800 Well, it, boy, you like every, you know,

01:24:06.060 the Levantine peoples are so diplomatic.

01:24:08.380 It's like unbelievable.

01:24:11.400 Yeah, it's way worse than that.

01:24:13.160 I mean, you wind up, I mean, as you, as

01:24:15.060 I know, you know, you wind up with

01:24:16.560 Christian politicians who are constantly

01:24:18.120 invoking the name of Jesus, supporting

01:24:20.720 the murder of their fellow Christians

01:24:23.000 in the Levant.

01:24:25.500 So, like, that is very, I think that's

01:24:28.600 very serious.

01:24:29.500 I don't think you should do that.

01:24:31.360 I think you're going to suffer for that.

01:24:33.140 Like, don't do that.

01:24:34.220 How can you excuse or aid in the murder

01:24:39.040 of innocence in the name of Jesus?

01:24:41.940 And I've said this directly to a bunch

01:24:43.660 of these politicians because I get very

01:24:46.040 upset about it.

01:24:47.280 And they're, like, under a spell.

01:24:48.980 Like, they don't, even in private,

01:24:52.300 they're like, well, we have to.

01:24:53.360 So, what is that?

01:24:54.660 Last December, the state of Israel,

01:24:57.260 the foreign ministry of the state of

01:24:59.060 Israel, sponsored a summit in Jerusalem.

01:25:03.460 They brought 1,000 U.S. pastors to

01:25:07.800 Israel to attend military briefings.

01:25:11.960 Military briefings?

01:25:13.000 Yes.

01:25:13.860 The head of the state was there.

01:25:15.380 The prime minister was there.

01:25:17.420 They were commissioning them as

01:25:19.920 ambassadors, not for Jesus, but for the

01:25:23.220 state of Israel.

01:25:24.220 They were talking about this unholy

01:25:27.180 alliance being formed.

01:25:29.620 Oh, they attacked me by name, I know.

01:25:31.260 Right.

01:25:31.660 And they attacked you and all of that.

01:25:34.420 But what really caught my attention,

01:25:36.860 Tucker, when I was reading over the

01:25:40.020 website of that summit, I was reading

01:25:43.000 some notes and some guidelines,

01:25:45.920 do's and don'ts.

01:25:47.100 One of the guidelines, it's a Christian

01:25:48.800 ministry also who's organizing this with

01:25:52.020 the foreign ministry affairs.

01:25:54.460 One of the guidelines stated that do not

01:25:57.840 speak of the name of Jesus.

01:26:00.380 Preaching is not allowed in Jerusalem.

01:26:05.360 Express your faith through acts of

01:26:07.340 kindness and all that, but do not mention

01:26:09.480 Jesus.

01:26:10.100 Why?

01:26:10.400 When I read that, my mind went back all the

01:26:14.680 way to the book of Acts, chapter five,

01:26:18.660 when the spiritual elites in Jerusalem,

01:26:21.120 they summoned Peter and the disciples.

01:26:23.360 And you know what they told them?

01:26:24.500 Do not speak of the name of Jesus.

01:26:29.240 Imagine those pastors coming to Jerusalem

01:26:31.760 to not be able to share their faith and to

01:26:36.180 share about their Christ and their Messiah,

01:26:38.360 the hope.

01:26:39.120 That's one thing.

01:26:40.040 The other thing, none of these pastors,

01:26:42.540 they went and they prayed over dead stones.

01:26:44.780 They went over and prayed over the Western

01:26:46.420 walls, which is, you know, fine.

01:26:48.100 They can do that.

01:26:49.240 But none of them stepped afoot in a Christian

01:26:53.420 church.

01:26:54.280 No.

01:26:55.480 None of them visited the local Christian

01:26:57.520 population.

01:26:58.820 Who is...

01:26:59.320 They didn't go to the Church of the Holy

01:27:00.560 Sepulcher?

01:27:01.540 Not to my knowledge.

01:27:03.300 It wasn't part of the itinerary.

01:27:04.880 How can...

01:27:07.160 Church of the Holy Sepulcher,

01:27:08.240 obviously one of the most holy places in

01:27:10.200 Christendom.

01:27:10.820 It's where Christians believe Jesus' tomb

01:27:13.100 was, sepulcher, tomb.

01:27:14.220 Yes.

01:27:14.960 And it's a wonderful place.

01:27:16.540 Amazing place.

01:27:18.120 One of the great places in the world,

01:27:19.080 in my opinion.

01:27:19.780 How could you not go there if you're a

01:27:22.480 Christian minister?

01:27:24.360 Mike Johnson, the Speaker of the

01:27:26.260 House...

01:27:26.740 Oh, yes.

01:27:27.760 ...is a very prominent evangelical third-in-line

01:27:32.620 presidency.

01:27:34.000 Last August, he went to Israel.

01:27:37.080 He prayed to the Western Wall.

01:27:39.900 He went to a settlement in the West Bank.

01:27:42.880 And he planted trees in those settlements

01:27:45.980 in the West Bank.

01:27:47.180 And he declared that these Judeans and

01:27:50.380 Sumerian hills belong to the Jewish people

01:27:53.780 by divine right.

01:27:58.240 What...

01:27:58.680 We're going to be so punished for this.

01:28:00.100 We're going to be punished for this.

01:28:01.260 I'm just telling you.

01:28:01.960 He never interacted and met with the...

01:28:06.340 You know, people go and visit the dead

01:28:07.900 stones, but they forget about the living

01:28:09.480 stones.

01:28:10.600 There are people there who are suffering

01:28:13.020 because of this system that keeps

01:28:18.300 oppressing them and applying pressure.

01:28:20.960 And their numbers are shrinking.

01:28:22.940 The people are leaving.

01:28:25.000 And people throw this number.

01:28:26.380 Well, it's because of the other pressures.

01:28:29.400 No, Israel is the only place in the Middle East,

01:28:31.840 the only democracy in the Middle East

01:28:33.740 that Christians feel respected and protected.

01:28:39.240 You know, the prime minister of Israel...

01:28:41.020 What year were you born?

01:28:42.580 I was born in 1980.

01:28:44.080 Okay.

01:28:44.460 So you grew up under the Israeli government

01:28:46.920 as a Christian.

01:28:48.180 Yeah.

01:28:48.380 And I watched also the Oslo Accord.

01:28:50.620 Yeah.

01:28:50.860 So, I mean, like, I'm talking...

01:28:51.980 You're sitting right here.

01:28:52.840 Is that...

01:28:53.200 What do you think when you hear that?

01:28:54.660 And I still minister there.

01:28:56.260 And we still...

01:28:56.700 Our ministry still serves in the Palestinian

01:28:58.620 territories.

01:28:59.600 And we serve in Jordan.

01:29:01.100 And we serve in Egypt.

01:29:02.060 And our ministry is focused on reaching

01:29:04.540 young people, equipping them and empowering

01:29:07.360 them so they can be agents of change

01:29:09.980 in their communities, so they can become

01:29:12.580 peacemakers.

01:29:13.380 This is why I left my secular job in D.C.,

01:29:15.720 a very successful job, and committed my life

01:29:18.780 to this mission.

01:29:19.900 Because the Christian presence in the Middle

01:29:22.580 East is at the brink of extinction.

01:29:25.000 If we can do...

01:29:25.620 If we don't do anything about it, especially

01:29:27.080 in Bethsao right now, there'll be no

01:29:29.280 Christians left.

01:29:30.700 But just to be clear, under the Israelis,

01:29:33.720 it's at the point of extinction.

01:29:35.940 Having survived the Romans and the

01:29:38.180 Crusaders and the Ottomans and the

01:29:40.500 English, it's under the Israelis that the

01:29:42.860 Christians are about to go to extinct.

01:29:44.200 This is exactly why I am not going to be

01:29:48.900 silent anymore.

01:29:49.600 Not because I'm not an activist.

01:29:51.660 I don't go on podcasts and just start

01:29:54.100 talking.

01:29:54.700 But when I see something against the values

01:29:57.400 that we believe in, the biblical values,

01:30:01.120 against the character of God, I have to be

01:30:05.340 that prophetic voice and say, not in our

01:30:08.000 name.

01:30:08.880 Jesus showed us a better way.

01:30:11.940 Jesus taught his followers to be the salt,

01:30:16.400 to be the light, to be the peacemaker.

01:30:18.400 He entrusted us with the ministry of

01:30:20.320 reconciliation.

01:30:21.200 How much reconciliation efforts are we

01:30:23.480 doing?

01:30:24.160 We're giving money and billions of dollars

01:30:28.280 to build these settlements.

01:30:29.720 So, and taking the land from Christians, but we're spending

01:30:37.080 little to no money in peace initiatives, in reconciliation

01:30:40.780 efforts, in understanding, in mutual understanding.

01:30:43.440 And there are so many Christian-led organizations on the ground

01:30:47.220 that are doing amazing work in raising up the next generation.

01:30:51.940 That's the whole reason I'm putting my life on the line.

01:30:55.860 Not to see Palestinian Christians and the next generation of Palestinians

01:31:02.360 go hopeless and in despair.

01:31:04.820 Are you, I mean, the violence and the worship of violence there is really like

01:31:08.760 no place I'm aware of in the world.

01:31:10.520 And, you know, people who follow this already know that.

01:31:17.480 And everybody's afraid.

01:31:19.080 Yes.

01:31:19.520 I have noticed when we're going to Israel and more people have called me.

01:31:23.340 You know, ooh, be careful.

01:31:24.680 Everyone's afraid.

01:31:25.600 Are you afraid?

01:31:28.920 Absolutely.

01:31:29.400 I mean, the people we serve in Bethlehem, when we tell the parents that we're

01:31:37.280 taking your kids to Jerusalem, whenever Israelis allow us to get permits,

01:31:42.000 it's becoming really very rare now that Israelis would allow Christians

01:31:46.380 from Bethlehem, which is five kilometers away, to go and spend a day in

01:31:49.720 Jerusalem.

01:31:50.780 But when we do get their permits and we tell them...

01:31:52.980 You don't get permits.

01:31:53.780 Christians in Bethlehem have difficulty going to Jerusalem three miles away?

01:31:58.560 Oh, absolutely.

01:31:59.960 The whole thing is the system is set up to restrict the movement to only...

01:32:05.540 You have to apply through the Israeli militaries to get permission to go from

01:32:09.500 a Palestinian city to an Israeli city, so Israeli control cities.

01:32:14.100 Think about it.

01:32:14.620 I mean, look, at the West Bank, it's like a Swiss cheese.

01:32:18.420 There are holes on the Swiss cheese.

01:32:20.740 Those are the Palestinian cities.

01:32:22.420 They live in 165 enclaves throughout the West Bank.

01:32:26.060 But Israel controls the whole cheese militarily, and they apply pressure on these

01:32:34.900 Palestinian cities.

01:32:37.160 Some people even call it the holy Swiss cheese.

01:32:39.800 So when Palestinians want to go from one Palestinian city to another, they have to drive on specific

01:32:47.360 roads, going through specific checkpoints, roadblocks, and around every city, there are

01:32:55.860 iron gates that Israel seals off every time they feel like it.

01:33:00.820 Our ministry director was coming back from a trip from Jericho to Bethlehem.

01:33:05.560 My drive should take him about 35, 40 minutes.

01:33:08.920 He got stuck at one of the checkpoints for eight hours.

01:33:14.480 He got hungry.

01:33:16.000 He ordered food on DoorDash, came through a motorcycle, delivered pizza for him.

01:33:20.200 But he got stuck there for eight hours.

01:33:23.980 And he'd had a team of ministers from the Netherlands, and they were all stuck together.

01:33:28.260 They saw it firsthand.

01:33:29.020 Lines and lines of trucks and Palestinian cars.

01:33:33.260 Why?

01:33:34.000 Because the Israeli soldier on that checkpoint felt like taking a nap.

01:33:39.440 Eight hours.

01:33:40.920 This is the daily reality.

01:33:42.620 This is not random.

01:33:44.500 A trip that will, you know, if you had a medical emergency, you miss it.

01:33:50.180 If you have a job interview, if you want to go from Bethlehem to Ramallah, from Jericho to any

01:33:57.840 other Palestinian town, Hebron, you will have to go through these, you will have to navigate

01:34:05.080 through the Swiss cheese.

01:34:07.400 And sometimes you get shot at randomly at gunpoint.

01:34:11.880 I was with a group of church leaders from Alabama, took them to the West Bank, went through Jordan, and then one of the

01:34:26.140 checkpoint that leads to Jerusalem, we got stopped.

01:34:31.040 Where is your passport?

01:34:32.360 Everybody held the American passport.

01:34:34.120 I had my American passport, which I'm very proud of.

01:34:37.080 So, we held it, but the soldier profiled me out of all the 10 church leaders.

01:34:43.580 And he said, you, where is your Palestinian ID?

01:34:45.920 I gave him my Palestinian ID, and he said, you're not allowed through this checkpoint.

01:34:50.180 You have to go through Kalundia, which is you have to walk on foot.

01:34:55.680 You're not allowed to.

01:34:57.460 Did you say, son, I pay your salary?

01:34:59.860 I'm an American citizen.

01:35:01.280 Don't speak to me like that.

01:35:02.420 I told him, you are embarrassing the state of Israel in front of our American friends who I brought from Alabama.

01:35:08.880 They watched the whole thing.

01:35:10.040 Some of them, they broke in tears.

01:35:11.920 They said, what is this?

01:35:13.400 And what happened?

01:35:14.940 And we made a U-turn and went to the other checkpoint.

01:35:18.780 But I mean, okay, you pay for this.

01:35:22.700 Like, you're an American taxpayer.

01:35:24.340 Palestinian, Christian, Americans, specifically.

01:35:27.860 We feel betrayed on two levels.

01:35:30.560 Yeah.

01:35:30.780 We pay taxes.

01:35:34.040 We work so hard to fund this system.

01:35:37.460 In the meantime, our sacred text and our sacred scripture is used against us.

01:35:44.680 You don't belong here.

01:35:46.160 God gave this land to somebody else.

01:35:48.820 So our money and our scripture is being flipped on us and weaponized against us.

01:35:55.900 I mean, I'm an Episcopalian from La Jolla.

01:35:57.660 I've got nothing to do with any of this at all.

01:35:59.580 And it makes me, just on justice grounds and decency grounds and Christian grounds, it makes

01:36:05.180 me like crazy.

01:36:06.320 I have to say prayers to calm down.

01:36:08.300 How do you stay so calm?

01:36:09.800 That's why we need to raise awareness.

01:36:12.140 I love the American church so much.

01:36:13.860 I believe there's, and I believe in the promise of America, Tucker.

01:36:17.840 I believe America can play a significant role in bringing peace and prosperity to the Middle

01:36:24.480 East, which is, that's the state of the intention.

01:36:27.800 But the way we go about it is sometimes it contradicts biblical values.

01:36:32.420 So you're an American and you have the blue passport, you're a taxpayer, you get mistreated by the

01:36:45.000 Israeli government, the IDF, which you also pay for, holding a weapon made in your country

01:36:50.380 that you paid for.

01:36:51.340 And you have an ambassador who serves supposedly your country at the U.S. embassy in Jerusalem.

01:37:01.400 So have you called Mike Huckabee about this?

01:37:04.840 We have given up on the politicians.

01:37:07.780 We have given up on the politicians.

01:37:08.180 Well, he's not a politician.

01:37:09.140 He is an emissary of the president who works for the United States State Department.

01:37:12.960 I'm the son of an ambassador.

01:37:13.980 I know how this works.

01:37:15.040 And his job is to reflect the views of his president and to defend his country in a foreign

01:37:22.140 country.

01:37:22.600 He represents America's interests in a foreign country.

01:37:25.340 That's not what he said on the last TBN interview.

01:37:27.640 He said, my job is to secure the blessings for Israel so America can get blessed.

01:37:33.680 So his primary concern is really blessing Israel about what that means.

01:37:37.840 Has America been blessed by this policy, do you think?

01:37:39.700 I've lived here for 56 years.

01:37:41.060 I don't think it's been blessed by this policy.

01:37:42.960 I don't see the blessings.

01:37:45.400 I don't think this is how God views blessings.

01:37:49.000 You see, we are blessed in Christ.

01:37:51.800 That's what the American church needs to get.

01:37:55.220 Christ in Christ.

01:37:56.880 Christ in you is hope of glory.

01:38:00.180 Yes.

01:38:00.520 What else do you really want?

01:38:02.880 That's the blessings that we get to enjoy.

01:38:06.100 But in the meantime, we want to live in a society that is fair, that is based on justice,

01:38:10.720 based on human dignity.

01:38:12.940 And we cherish these values, these American values, and these are based on biblical values.

01:38:19.160 And some people make the argument that the entire Western civilization is based on these

01:38:24.020 values.

01:38:24.320 Of course it is.

01:38:24.920 But when I see, you know, a regime in the Middle East that is claiming to be the only democracy

01:38:31.660 in the Middle East, and it's the extension of the West, and they're not holding, they're

01:38:39.380 not living up to these biblical values, then they need to be held accountable.

01:38:44.320 Well, yes, well, I couldn't agree more.

01:38:47.600 My whole life has been sidetracked by this question in the past few months because I feel

01:38:51.020 it so strongly, and I never wanted to have this debate, but whatever.

01:38:55.660 But just to the question of Huckabee, his job is to represent you and your government.

01:39:01.800 So if you called him, and don't want to, you know, Huckabee is not the most guilty person

01:39:05.960 I know him.

01:39:07.980 But I just have to ask, like, could you call Huckabee's, could you call the U.S.

01:39:10.980 embassy in Jerusalem and say, hey, I'm an American citizen, and I'm being, some guy

01:39:14.880 with a gun is, like, pulling me out of the car?

01:39:16.980 Yeah, but how would you have a conversation with somebody who says Palestinians don't exist?

01:39:24.640 Who says Palestinians, there are no such thing as Palestinians?

01:39:28.160 He said that?

01:39:28.940 Yes, it's on tape.

01:39:31.180 What does that mean, don't exist?

01:39:33.260 That means they're invented people.

01:39:34.460 They, oh, they, they're not indigenous to the land.

01:39:37.420 They came from somewhere and just-

01:39:40.020 Where did they come from?

01:39:41.300 Well, they claim that Palestinians came from neighboring countries to prevent the Jewish

01:39:46.400 state from being established.

01:39:48.280 They don't even recognize that these people have been on the land since the shepherds, at

01:39:55.280 least, if not longer.

01:39:55.760 Well, we can prove that since we've decoded the human genome.

01:39:58.640 We don't have to guess about any of this.

01:40:00.020 We give everybody in the, we give all 14 million people in this zone DNA tests, and we could find

01:40:06.120 out who's got the longest connection to land.

01:40:08.220 Couldn't we do that?

01:40:08.920 Yes, absolutely.

01:40:09.640 For me, and even, not just the ambassador, but also to, I want to appeal to the broader

01:40:17.620 evangelical community, and this is my tribe.

01:40:21.040 I, justice, human rights, safety, and security is not a zero-sum game.

01:40:31.860 Loving Israelis does not mean ignoring the suffering of the Palestinians.

01:40:37.380 Praying for the peace of Jerusalem, which I do it all the time.

01:40:41.460 I want Jerusalem to prosper.

01:40:43.780 I do too.

01:40:44.420 I want Jerusalem to thrive.

01:40:46.380 I totally agree.

01:40:47.440 But politicians are using this verse to say, I want to bless Jerusalem, pray for the peace

01:40:52.420 of Jerusalem.

01:40:52.880 That means Jewish sovereignty in Jerusalem.

01:40:56.500 Total disregard of the historic church that has been sitting there for the past 2,000 years.

01:41:01.920 I pray for the peace of Jerusalem, but praying for the peace of Jerusalem does not mean accepting the destruction of Gaza.

01:41:10.280 Justice is not a zero-sum game.

01:41:12.660 No.

01:41:12.760 Our political system and our pastors and leaders, they need to recognize that there is another way.

01:41:24.440 It's not either-or mentality.

01:41:27.820 It's not choosing to support and bless one group of people, because most likely it's going to end up at the expense of the vulnerable.

01:41:36.500 Can I ask you about that point, the expense of the vulnerable?

01:41:40.060 This is like theology 101.

01:41:42.540 As a Christian, can Christians ever accept as good the killing of innocents?

01:41:48.560 Absolutely not.

01:41:49.660 That's not even a close call, is it?

01:41:51.720 It's a crime against God.

01:41:55.140 Exactly.

01:41:56.000 Because everyone is created in the image of God.

01:41:58.660 Bless you.

01:41:59.360 Israelis, Palestinians, people with faith, people without faith.

01:42:04.240 But everyone is valuable to be cherished and loved by God.

01:42:09.320 But if you have done nothing wrong, it's wrong to punish you, correct?

01:42:14.200 It's wrong to shoot your mother for not doing anything.

01:42:16.700 No, I mean, not just your mother, anyone's mother, anyone's child.

01:42:20.180 You can't, you could say, well, that happens, which it does, of course, a lot.

01:42:24.620 And it's not just the Israelis who do it, of course, everyone does it.

01:42:27.620 But don't Christians have to say that's wrong?

01:42:29.780 Absolutely.

01:42:30.440 We have to go.

01:42:31.200 We have to raise a prophetic voice.

01:42:32.920 It's not, Christians are easy to be compassionate.

01:42:37.220 Because Jesus was compassionate.

01:42:38.380 He sowed the sheep without a shepherd.

01:42:40.340 He was moved with compassion.

01:42:42.220 But also, Jesus, when necessary, he raised a prophetic voice.

01:42:46.720 He braided a whip, actually, at one point.

01:42:49.140 Yes.

01:42:50.400 Yeah.

01:42:50.620 He spoke against the injustice and the evil doers with the goal of transforming their heart.

01:42:58.340 Now, whether, you know, I don't have the ability to convert anybody.

01:43:03.920 I don't have the ability to change anybody.

01:43:07.000 But I know the one who can.

01:43:08.960 Yes.

01:43:09.560 And if the church doesn't believe in that power, that the hardest of hearts can be transformed.

01:43:17.240 Paul, what changed Paul?

01:43:18.520 Exactly, exactly.

01:43:19.340 He was a ruthless terrorist killing Christians and dragging them, went to Damascus to drag them.

01:43:24.000 Just walking to Syria to kill more Christians.

01:43:25.720 Yes.

01:43:26.680 Yep.

01:43:27.220 Jesus changed them.

01:43:28.520 And he became the apostle.

01:43:30.520 We need more stories of this in the Middle East.

01:43:33.140 This is what gives me hope.

01:43:34.320 This is what keeps me up at night.

01:43:35.980 And this is what gets me up in the morning.

01:43:37.540 It's to see the Middle East healed, transformed by the love of God.

01:43:44.980 We need, if we have the power to stop the injustice inflicted upon the Palestinians, we need to speak.

01:43:51.280 If we have the ability to speak against the injustice committed against Christians in Syria, in Iraq.

01:43:58.020 In Lebanon.

01:43:58.600 I had a friend who pastored the Good Shepherd Evangelical Church in Sueda.

01:44:03.340 He was butchered with his family, 12 members, in cold blood by an Islamic terrorist.

01:44:13.120 We need, as Christians, we condemn that.

01:44:15.540 We don't condemn that.

01:44:16.620 This was in Syria?

01:44:17.520 This was in Syria not too long ago.

01:44:19.500 His name is Khaled Mazhar.

01:44:21.860 Yeah.

01:44:22.300 So, as Christians, we have a responsibility.

01:44:25.480 We have a sacred calling from God to advocate on behalf of the widow, the orphan, the poor, the marginal.

01:44:36.000 This was the very core message.

01:44:38.360 And many Christians, I want to point this out, they see this as, oh, well, I want to stick with the gospel.

01:44:43.640 I want to preach the gospel.

01:44:44.660 This is social.

01:44:45.620 That is the gospel.

01:44:46.440 But Jesus had these two missions that are not competing.

01:44:51.620 He preached the kingdom.

01:44:52.800 He preached forgiveness of sins.

01:44:54.800 He talked about repentance.

01:44:57.940 But in the meantime, he fed people.

01:45:00.460 He healed bodies.

01:45:01.940 He raised people from the dead.

01:45:04.000 You know, the good news to a child in Gaza who lost all of his family member in airstrike.

01:45:09.640 What is the good news to that child?

01:45:12.060 It's our proximity.

01:45:14.140 It's our presence.

01:45:15.220 It's delivering a cold cup of water for the least of these.

01:45:20.480 Of course.

01:45:21.080 This is the gospel message.

01:45:23.260 So, many Christians, they decide, say, well, I just want to focus on the gospel and end-time theology.

01:45:29.120 And they spend hours and resources and millions of dollars preparing for an event that's going to happen or may not happen in the future while people are living hell on earth.

01:45:43.380 So, Antti Wright, great theologian, he said, you know, heaven is not a place that you get to go to after you die.

01:45:50.980 But heaven is bringing God's love to people on earth.

01:45:56.460 That's right.

01:45:57.180 And hell is not just a place you're sent to.

01:45:59.700 It's a place you can experience whenever you see chaos and violence and deception.

01:46:04.180 Like, that's what hell is.

01:46:05.240 Yes.

01:46:05.520 It's people screaming lies.

01:46:08.080 I'm totally convinced of that.

01:46:09.580 So, let me ask you about a very controversial topic.

01:46:12.520 And that's Islam and the Muslims.

01:46:15.720 And I noticed that in the United States that anyone who says, wait a second, what is going on in Gaza or the West Bank?

01:46:22.800 Why are we paying for this?

01:46:24.300 Why are our ministers, our ministers, making excuses for this?

01:46:28.400 Anyone who says those things is accused of working for the Muslims or being a secret jihadi or taking money from some Muslim group or country or whatever.

01:46:37.800 However, this has happened to me, so it's a lot.

01:46:41.580 For the record, I've never taken money from anybody, Christian, Jew, or Muslim, and won't.

01:46:46.280 But whatever.

01:46:47.040 The point is, the response is, I don't want to talk about what your tax dollars are doing because Islam is so scary that we just have to go along with this or else we're all going to be living in a caliphate.

01:47:00.400 Yes.

01:47:00.860 Have you noticed this?

01:47:01.880 Well, this has been the media narrative, and we are told by Christians, and because I minister among Christian circles, that this is a cosmic battle between God of the Bible against his enemies.

01:47:18.640 Yes.

01:47:19.180 This is between good and evil, Islam versus the West.

01:47:22.940 Yeah.

01:47:23.240 Once you frame a conflict like this, you are destined for perpetual animosity and perpetual wars.

01:47:30.940 That's the whole point.

01:47:32.060 It was the point of 9-11, obviously.

01:47:34.020 Do we have our differences theologically with Islam?

01:47:37.540 Yes.

01:47:38.040 Nobody ignores that.

01:47:39.580 Do we have our understanding of God?

01:47:43.320 Yes.

01:47:43.580 But that doesn't mean we have to discriminate and demonize an entire group of people, almost 2 billion people, for the sins that are committed by bad actors who are using religious texts or whatever to justify violence.

01:48:03.280 That is to be called out.

01:48:04.960 And I believe many governments in the Arab world have rejected political Islam.

01:48:13.160 Well, they fear it, too, because it's a threat to their power.

01:48:17.020 But you have to wonder, like, something like Syria, where Israel teams up with Turkey.

01:48:21.340 This is true.

01:48:22.060 No one wants to hear it.

01:48:23.140 But to take out the last government, whatever.

01:48:26.240 And the net effect is to have savagery by jihadi groups against Christians and Alawites and other religious minorities.

01:48:33.900 But, like, okay.

01:48:36.240 I mean, I'm against jihadis.

01:48:37.700 I'm against radical Muslims, for sure.

01:48:39.200 Always have been.

01:48:40.520 But, like, they're not the ones who did this, actually.

01:48:42.720 They're not the ones who overthrew a secular regime and made it possible to murder all the Christians.

01:48:48.320 It's the same in Iraq.

01:48:49.060 They had a secular regime, not defending Saddam or Uday or Qusay.

01:48:52.800 Yes.

01:48:53.200 But it was the Israelis pushing the Bush administration to overthrow this regime that got millions of Christians in Iraq murdered or displaced.

01:49:02.120 That's just a fact.

01:49:03.020 And had we listened to the church leaders in Iraq, had we listened to the pastors and leaders who pleaded with the administration not to invade, we wouldn't have this catastrophe.

01:49:14.820 The Iraqi community is very small, but they're faithful, they're staying, but they have been devastated by the terrorists.

01:49:23.400 They're mostly gone now.

01:49:24.540 And you will see the same thing in Syria, same thing in Lebanon.

01:49:26.860 Who blew up the port of Beirut?

01:49:28.360 Yeah, because once you create a chaos, once you blow up a place, you create a vacuum.

01:49:32.760 Exactly.

01:49:33.200 A vacuum of hope.

01:49:34.720 And what's going to fill this hope is radicalism, extremism.

01:49:39.480 You know, I tell you a story about Ali Faraj from Gaza.

01:49:44.820 Little boy, I think he's six or seven or eight, can't remember his age.

01:49:51.860 He was blown off his apartment into the next door roof.

01:49:58.700 And it's a famous picture.

01:49:59.720 He's, you know, pointing hands and blooded.

01:50:03.180 He lost five of his sisters, 15 members of his family.

01:50:07.760 That creates a deep vacuum in his life.

01:50:13.800 If it's not filled with the hope, if it's not filled with God's love, this is the easiest, you know.

01:50:22.020 Of course.

01:50:23.260 You know, someone who's going, when you lose your agency, when you live in despair, I'm not giving excuses, but this is the vacuum that we need.

01:50:34.200 Obviously, obviously.

01:50:36.620 And I'm deeply concerned, you know, I leave the politicians to figure it out politically.

01:50:42.240 But as Christians, as ministers, our posture has to change.

01:50:47.660 Our attitude toward everybody, even our enemies.

01:50:52.360 Especially our enemies.

01:50:53.680 Especially our enemies.

01:50:54.940 Yeah.

01:50:55.300 We're not going to be naive and bury our heads in the sands and, you know, pretend that we're not.

01:51:02.500 But God is not calling us to be escapists.

01:51:05.360 No.

01:51:05.600 And as Jesus himself says, like loving your friends, loving people who love you, even pagans do that.

01:51:11.040 You don't get points for that.

01:51:12.260 We're required to love our enemies, the people who persecute us.

01:51:14.440 And engage in the culture.

01:51:16.420 Engage in the community with the gospel.

01:51:18.440 Because we have a powerful hope that can transform hearts and minds.

01:51:25.060 And this is the only hope that the Christian can really offer.

01:51:28.920 Can I ask you one last question?

01:51:30.040 And it's about the third temple.

01:51:32.720 So, in the world that you've lived in, I didn't fully realize just how in evangelical world you've been.

01:51:39.620 How old were you when you came to the U.S.?

01:51:41.420 I was 18.

01:51:42.640 18.

01:51:43.080 So, you come literally from the West Bank to the United States.

01:51:46.700 Yes.

01:51:46.960 And you go to Liberty.

01:51:48.460 And a lot of great people, but they have a totally different understanding of what's happening in the place that you grew up than you do.

01:51:55.000 And a totally different theology, maybe, than you do.

01:51:57.740 It's America.

01:51:58.420 It's different.

01:51:58.720 But one of the ideas that's common among Christian Zionists is that they need, Christians need to help rebuild this thing called the third temple.

01:52:10.500 Yes.

01:52:11.180 In Jerusalem.

01:52:12.000 Unfortunately, there's a mosque on the site.

01:52:13.380 One of the holiest places in Islam.

01:52:15.120 Aqsa Mosque.

01:52:15.800 But is that something that Christians should want to rebuild the third temple?

01:52:22.120 What is that?

01:52:22.840 Where does that idea come from?

01:52:23.860 And what would happen if it were attempted?

01:52:26.200 Absolutely not.

01:52:27.000 The short answer.

01:52:27.980 Okay.

01:52:28.620 Jesus in Ephesians 2, he knocked down the wall of hostility that separated the Jews and the Gentiles.

01:52:34.540 Yes.

01:52:34.960 Why are we bringing it back up?

01:52:37.620 Why are we building it?

01:52:39.120 There is no point.

01:52:40.740 There is no scripture that points to the fact that Christians need to build the third temple.

01:52:45.380 There is no prophecy about the third temple.

01:52:47.700 There is no way in scripture about anything close to the third temple.

01:52:51.660 Well, we're doing it.

01:52:52.280 I mean, we're moving toward knocking down Al-Aqsa Mosque and replacing it with the third temple.

01:52:59.580 I mean, all things being equal, it's going to happen.

01:53:01.240 It was just occupied yesterday by a bunch of settlers.

01:53:04.200 So, this is happening in slow motion.

01:53:06.280 Christians are paying for it.

01:53:08.520 Again, they're putting their hopes on earthly matters where I direct them to the faith that Abraham had,

01:53:14.760 where he fixed his eyes on what eternal, the new Jerusalem.

01:53:20.020 In Galatians chapter 4, it spells it out really clearly.

01:53:23.460 If you are in Christ, you belong to the free woman, Sarah.

01:53:32.340 And if you don't belong to Christ, you're still fixated and enslaved by the idea of an earthly Jerusalem.

01:53:40.680 The land matters, yes, we honor Jerusalem.

01:53:44.000 We remember what Christ had done there.

01:53:45.920 It carries deep memories.

01:53:48.320 But the question is, does it have any spiritual significance?

01:53:52.960 Does the temple have any spiritual significance?

01:53:56.740 When Jesus came, he transformed the whole meaning again.

01:54:00.340 You know, John chapter 1, it says,

01:54:02.920 Jesus, he pitched his tent among us.

01:54:05.940 The word became flesh.

01:54:07.340 The word became flesh.

01:54:08.300 He tabernacled among us.

01:54:10.340 That's the exact word that the Greek language uses to describe Christ's incarnation.

01:54:16.660 He tabernacled among us because he is the locus of the land.

01:54:21.620 If there is anything holy in the Holy Land, it's Jerusalem.

01:54:24.920 If there is anything holy in Jerusalem, it is the temple.

01:54:27.760 If there is anything holy in the temple, it is the holy of holies.

01:54:31.040 But guess what happened when Jesus was crucified?

01:54:34.780 That thing got destroyed, split in a half.

01:54:38.400 Because he is the final destination.

01:54:40.820 Everything in scripture points to Jesus, not to a third temple.

01:54:46.320 You know, when Jesus ascended and he sent his Holy Spirit,

01:54:49.880 he empowered his disciples to be the temple of the Holy Spirit.

01:54:54.220 Because God does not reside.

01:54:56.000 It's specifically said, it does not reside in a house built with hands and stones.

01:55:03.240 God resides in us human beings through the Holy Spirit.

01:55:08.420 So why are we so fixated on erecting a temple that does not have any spiritual significance whatsoever?

01:55:16.580 We are the temple of God.

01:55:18.080 Jesus himself is the high priest, according to the New Testament.

01:55:23.720 Jesus himself is the Lamb of God, the sacrifice.

01:55:27.960 And Jesus himself offered himself as the sacrifice.

01:55:32.060 So he is the Alpha and he's the Omega.

01:55:35.900 He's the author and the finisher of our faith, according to our Holy Scripture.

01:55:42.300 And Christians need to be fixated on that holy hope.

01:55:49.800 Thank you for the time you spent here.

01:55:51.640 It's an amazing conversation.

01:55:52.920 I appreciate it.

01:55:53.560 Thank you, Tucker.

01:55:55.040 Thanks for watching the Wednesday edition of the show.

01:55:58.880 We stream live every week, Wednesday, 6 p.m. Eastern on tuckercarlson.com.

01:56:04.640 Members can watch the show live, join the members only chat,

01:56:07.940 and take part in the conversation in real time.

01:56:10.320 We're grateful to be doing it and grateful that you watch it.

01:56:14.180 Thank you.

The Tucker Carlson Show - February 19, 2026

Israel’s Purging of Christians From the Holy Land and the Plot to Keep Americans From Noticing

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