The Tucker Carlson Show - MAJOR SHIFT： Will Trump Split From Israel？ Israeli Journalist on the Critical Situation in Iran.

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00:00:30.000 gideon thank you so much for joining us for americans who are distracted by what's happening

00:00:39.160 in iran and with the u.s economy and by so many other things can you bring us up to date on what

00:00:43.800 is happening right now in gaza the west bank judaosamaria and lebanon it's a war with some

00:00:54.200 interruptions it's a roller coaster you go to sleep in tel aviv with a ceasefire you wake up

00:01:01.680 in the morning with ballistic missiles over your head gaza is bleeding and totally forgotten i

00:01:09.220 guess we'll have the opportunity to talk more about gaza which is very dear to my heart in

00:01:15.440 lebanon israel is fighting for nothing without any purpose people are killed villages all

00:01:22.560 villages are being destroyed systematically, very similar to Gaza. Israeli soldiers are killed

00:01:28.620 on a daily basis almost. And the whole thing seems like an ongoing war without any purpose,

00:01:36.840 without any justification, and above all, without any endgames, any real goals. What

00:01:44.260 will stop it except of this desire to fight and to fight and to fight and to kill?

00:01:52.560 And what is the point?

00:01:55.220 You say there's no point to it, but it clearly is part of a larger strategy, I would assume.

00:02:02.520 I mean, it's got to be.

00:02:05.180 What do you think the bigger point of this is?

00:02:09.420 So first of all, Israel was taught to believe that it is doomed to live on its own.

00:02:15.000 That the only language that we can talk in this region as we are the phila in the jungle, so to say,

00:02:21.640 the only language that we can use here is the language of military power and as brutal as

00:02:28.380 possible. This was before Netanyahu. Many things, by the way, were before Netanyahu.

00:02:33.800 Netanyahu intensified those things. And today, the only language clearly that Israel is speaking

00:02:39.500 is the language of war. Anything can be solved only by war. Nothing can be solved by any other 0.85

00:02:48.540 way, like diplomacy, compromises, etc. And here we are involved in so many fronts. You know,

00:02:57.160 Tucker, there are around 6 million people in the Middle East who were experts from the homes,

00:03:06.540 who are uprooted. Part of them will never see their homes again. 2 million in Gaza,

00:03:13.260 1 million in Lebanon, for a while there were also 2 million in Iran, now not anymore.

00:03:19.660 But think about this.

00:03:22.560 All of them because of laws of choice, all of them because of a very violent policy of 0.93

00:03:31.000 Israel, which might here and there have the justification, like after the 7th of October, 0.85

00:03:36.920 another thing that I think we'll get into.

00:03:39.880 But the proportion, the scale, and where are we aiming?

00:03:44.980 Where are we aiming for God's sake? 1.00

00:03:47.560 Is Israel today a better place?

00:03:49.600 Is it a safer place than 2023? 0.98

00:03:53.680 Is it more popular in the world?

00:03:56.180 What did we gain out of all those costs?

00:03:59.380 And unfortunately, Tucker, those questions are hardly being discussed in Israel.

00:04:04.800 And this, in many ways, depresses me almost more than the wars itself.

00:04:11.080 The fact that a whole people, 10 million people, very intelligent, very ideological and with very clear views go to all those wars blindly and automatically without asking ourselves why, what for, what do we gain?

00:04:29.140 Put aside the moral side. 0.88

00:04:31.840 Let's say morality is for, you know, spoil the Gidon Levis or leftists, the self-hating Jews. 0.73

00:04:41.440 Practically, are we living in a better place? 0.98

00:04:45.760 The answer is unfortunately not.

00:04:48.520 You can add to it, obviously, Tucker, all the personal motivations of Benjamin Netanyahu,

00:04:56.040 which in my view are not exclusive.

00:04:58.260 They are not the only, there are those among my friends who think that he does everything only for his career, only in order to stay in power.

00:05:07.800 I give him more credit because I think he has an ideology, a very dangerous one, but he has an ideology which motivates him as well.

00:05:17.200 But no doubt that those last wars serve, first of all, his personal interest.

00:05:23.220 He has a trial. He's doing very badly in the Poles.

00:05:28.000 And here he comes with another war, war after war. 0.64

00:05:30.680 I want to ask, why did we have this need to bomb in Beirut two days ago?

00:05:36.820 What did we achieve by this bombardment? 0.59

00:05:40.360 Israel achieved anything out of it except of provoking Iran. 0.56

00:05:45.400 And then we got this sleepless night last night with dozens of ballistic missiles over our heads.

00:05:55.080 No one talks about it.

00:05:56.280 No one asks it.

00:05:57.840 And it's quite depressing to live in a society in which the main issues are not discussed.

00:06:03.440 We discuss the wife of the prime minister.

00:06:06.000 We discuss what kind of gossips.

00:06:08.020 We don't touch the core of the issue.

00:06:11.760 I live in a country very much like that.

00:06:14.080 So I know the feeling well, but just to stay on the point that you made about the practical

00:06:20.220 effects of this, leaving aside the moral stain, whether it's the right decision ethically

00:06:25.540 or not, but as a practical matter, you have to wonder how many wars a country as small

00:06:32.900 as Israel, just physically small with a population that small and an economy that small, just

00:06:37.180 a little country. How many 0.96

00:06:39.160 can you fight before you

00:06:40.820 risk, you know, real

00:06:43.080 retaliation, risk your own existence?

00:06:45.680 I mean, how dangerous is this?

00:06:49.000 So

00:06:49.200 fortunately or unfortunately, 1.00

00:06:52.600 Israel is 0.79

00:06:53.420 a regional superpower from the

00:06:55.260 military point of view.

00:06:57.160 And no other country in the Middle East 0.82

00:06:59.380 can beat Israel. 0.96

00:07:02.120 They just can't. 1.00

00:07:03.080 If they could, maybe they would.

00:07:04.580 But Israel has still a very, very strong army with devices, technology, ammunition, and arms that your country was kind enough or too kind to supply Israel blindly and almost without conditions or limits. 0.83

00:07:22.560 And Israel has the military answer almost for any challenge. 0.71

00:07:26.160 And this is, on one hand, obviously very good because we are safer. 0.87

00:07:31.900 On the other hand, it corrupts also a country because it lets Israel to go wild, to go to all kinds of military adventures, knowing that by the end of the day, we are not endangering the existence or real assets. 0.90

00:07:48.740 But because we are always stronger and we won all the wars, military, politically, we lost them all. 0.76

00:07:54.480 is there a concern that the united states in the next i don't know five or ten years

00:08:01.580 might begin to withdraw its unconditional support for israel you say five ten years and i would say

00:08:09.760 five to ten months yes i agree with that it's happening right now i think that we are reaching

00:08:16.880 a stage in which we will face a major shift in u.s policy toward israel

00:08:23.260 When Biden was the last Zionist, so to say, president, Donald Trump was the last one who 0.92

00:08:31.400 accepted almost all the ideas, the craziness of Israel, and until now, we still have time 0.89

00:08:39.960 to see, but until now, he went along the Israeli cycle, but the next president, would 0.74

00:08:47.460 he be democrat or republic one thing is sure those relations will be challenged more or less

00:08:56.420 but they will not go anymore automatically and blindly maybe the aid will continue but at least

00:09:03.420 it will be conditioned the problem is that it's you know what you want to supply israel you think

00:09:09.700 that the israel israel is the most the country that it is at need more than any other country

00:09:16.620 in the world. And you want to supply it with everything like any country in the world. Fair

00:09:22.140 enough. Put some conditions. Put some conditions according to the American interest. Israel is not

00:09:29.540 following neither the international law nor the American advances for many, many years.

00:09:35.560 The United States is speaking about the two-state solution for decades, and Israel is just ignoring

00:09:40.960 making it and doing anything possible to sabotage this idea.

00:09:45.700 I think this is over.

00:09:47.780 And it's a question of months, not of years, maybe still in Donald Trump's time, maybe

00:09:53.280 the next president, and then Israel will be in a real problem.

00:09:57.000 Because without the United States in its current position, this will be a challenge that Israel 0.75

00:10:03.800 never faced before, in my view, much more dangerous and existentially dangerous than 0.77

00:10:10.940 the nuclear of Europe. 0.67

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00:12:02.100 Blokes, I agree with that.

00:12:04.540 Do others in Israel see that coming?

00:12:07.460 And what do they think of it?

00:12:08.640 What is the view of the United States and Donald Trump in Israel?

00:12:13.140 Donald Trump, as you know, is more popular in Israel than in the United States.

00:12:17.960 Yes.

00:12:18.660 Actually, he's more popular in Israel than any other place in the world.

00:12:22.760 it can change obviously if he will change his attitude and the problem is again that the

00:12:30.620 israeli discourse does not touch those questions we don't speak about the occupation we don't speak

00:12:36.680 about the apartheid we don't speak about our relations and our in the our dependence on the

00:12:42.860 united states you know we are now in a stage of dependence which we never faced before i don't 0.56

00:12:47.760 think Israel ever faced such dependence of the United States, because all the rest of

00:12:55.460 the world, you know how it's treating Israel and what do the majority of the people in

00:13:02.000 the world, what do they think about Israel? 0.99

00:13:04.120 Paul's show what a pariah state is Israel, and in many ways rightly so. 0.99

00:13:10.500 And here comes the United States, and if the United States will change its policy, what 1.00

00:13:16.000 will Israel do?

00:13:17.760 How will it go on, even military, not to speak about politically in the international arena?

00:13:25.240 Europe is just waiting to get a green light from the United States to change its policy

00:13:31.340 to Israel.

00:13:32.160 Europe is paralyzed because of the fear of Donald Trump and the United States.

00:13:37.880 Once the United States will shift its policy, I'm sure that you will see big, major shifts

00:13:43.660 also in Europe, because the public opinion is by far more hostile to Israel than the

00:13:48.840 government's in Europe.

00:13:50.440 This will have to be expressed by policies, by real measures, not only by articles in

00:13:58.700 newspapers.

00:13:59.800 So we are facing a really horrible challenge in the coming months, not in the coming years,

00:14:06.280 and there is no one to deal with it.

00:14:09.800 We still think that we can do whatever we want. 0.89

00:14:14.400 And this Sotakir got such a boost 0.98

00:14:17.160 after the 7th of October. 0.94

00:14:20.080 Israelis tend to believe

00:14:21.940 that after the 7th of October,

00:14:23.540 we have the right to do whatever we want.

00:14:26.740 And this is very dangerous.

00:14:29.180 Yes.

00:14:30.600 It's interesting.

00:14:31.600 Everything you said is very clear from here.

00:14:34.700 It matches my perceptions exactly.

00:14:37.580 but you say no one is saying this out loud in Israel?

00:14:41.940 And if he says, nobody would listen, yeah.

00:14:45.700 No, look, major principal issues are not discussed in the last three years.

00:14:52.100 You cannot express it.

00:14:54.160 We are still victimizing ourselves about the 7th of October. 0.97

00:14:58.900 However, we are still victimizing ourselves as the David against the Goliaths, the whole Arab world wants to exterminate us, to push us to the ocean, and we still believe that we are the chosen people. 0.55

00:15:14.240 Yes, if you will scratch under the skin of every Israeli, I believe, secularist and religious, you will hear again and again, no, no, we are better, we know better, we are better. 0.93

00:15:27.580 Take, for example, the international law.

00:15:30.480 Israel is very much in favor of the international law. 0.93

00:15:33.400 It was brought to the world after the Holocaust, after World War II.

00:15:38.240 Israel is very much in favor of it.

00:15:41.100 But it is not a Bible about Israel because we are a special case.

00:15:47.840 And therefore, the international law cannot be applied to Israel.

00:15:50.840 And if you dare apply it to Israel, you'll be labeled as an anti-separate.

00:15:56.680 How dare you?

00:15:58.420 We are a special case, Tucker.

00:16:01.540 And this way of thinking must bring Israel to very dark allies,

00:16:07.000 to very dark corners, which I don't know how we'll get out of them. 0.67

00:16:10.820 And I'm sorry that I'm so pessimistic,

00:16:13.000 but the last three years, really, we went too far, too far.

00:16:18.280 Yes.

00:16:19.020 Well, you see this with individuals and not just countries.

00:16:21.920 It's called hubris in English.

00:16:24.000 and it usually doesn't end

00:16:26.820 until there's a lot of suffering

00:16:28.080 and people wake up from their delusions about,

00:16:31.120 I mean, I think it happens to every man,

00:16:32.400 that's happened to me,

00:16:33.400 but it happens at the scale of a nation too, it's sad.

00:16:37.100 So let me ask you about Gaza. 0.51

00:16:38.520 What is the point of Gaza?

00:16:41.700 In the US, our media says the point is to dismantle Hamas,

00:16:46.480 which is a terror organization,

00:16:48.740 effectively illegal in the United States

00:16:50.560 to say nice things about Hamas.

00:16:52.500 What is Hamas?

00:16:54.000 From your perspective, and is the war in Gaza or the military bombardment of Gaza designed to end Hamas? Is that true?

00:17:04.120 No, Taker. And this is a conclusion that I came to just recently. It's very clear for me that the war in Gaza is a war to crash the Palestinian society in Gaza and finally also to make them leave.

00:17:20.540 Now, how do I know it?

00:17:22.920 The matter of fact is that Israel is opposing any kind of deal about Gaza.

00:17:28.100 It's not that they don't want Hamas, but they don't want also the PA.

00:17:32.400 They don't want an international force. 0.55

00:17:34.420 They don't want nothing.

00:17:35.980 They want the people of Gaza, over 2 million people, both of them living now in tents.

00:17:42.180 I have some friends and old age friends who are living now two and a half years in a tent

00:17:48.140 without electricity.

00:17:49.540 close friends

00:17:51.760 one of them is after a stroke

00:17:54.420 lying on the ground

00:17:55.940 on the sand for two and a half

00:17:58.300 years now without his medicines

00:17:59.880 I mean I can't describe you

00:18:02.040 his agony, his suffering 0.99

00:18:04.220 Israel wants to crush 1.00

00:18:06.220 the society 1.00

00:18:07.160 to make them you know 0.99

00:18:09.880 a bunch of handicapped

00:18:12.500 wounded

00:18:13.400 traumatized

00:18:15.260 society without leadership

00:18:18.360 without any functional society,

00:18:22.200 any functional institutions. 1.00

00:18:24.720 Why are we opposing that Hamas 0.78

00:18:26.680 will run the civil life in Gaza? 0.63

00:18:29.680 They are the only ones who can do it right now.

00:18:31.440 There is no one else.

00:18:33.440 Why can't they be the teachers?

00:18:34.920 Why can't they be the lawyers,

00:18:37.520 the judges, the street cleaners,

00:18:40.660 the policemen?

00:18:42.620 No, we say no because we don't want

00:18:44.380 all this to exist.

00:18:45.340 We want anarchy there.

00:18:47.120 and then will come the real 0.99

00:18:49.940 wet dream of some Israelis, not all 0.55

00:18:52.040 of them, to get to the 1.00

00:18:53.880 real, I don't want to

00:18:55.920 use the word, final solution,

00:18:58.020 but to get to a real solution

00:18:59.920 which will last, namely

00:19:01.760 to push them to the south and

00:19:03.840 then from the south to try to find them

00:19:05.840 another place on earth which

00:19:07.700 they will never find.

00:19:10.220 But you cannot explain otherwise

00:19:12.100 the attitude of

00:19:13.900 Israel towards solving the problem of

00:19:15.900 Gaza, if Israel would have really liked to get a solution,

00:19:19.420 she would have had to come up with an idea 0.52

00:19:23.700 of how to make Gaza a livable, viable place and society.

00:19:29.920 Israel is doing all the opposite that it can, 0.91

00:19:34.280 crashing the society. 1.00

00:19:35.480 And I'm afraid that the next stage will be the West Bank, 1.00

00:19:39.020 crashing the Palestinian people, 1.00

00:19:40.760 and not only militarily making it a non-society 0.99

00:19:46.000 because many Israelis truly believe

00:19:49.320 that it's either us or them

00:19:51.020 and I believe it is us and them

00:19:53.900 but I am very lonely in Israel now.

00:19:58.560 If the government of Israel were to succeed

00:20:01.440 in expelling almost 2 million Palestinians from Gaza

00:20:04.900 and then took it over,

00:20:07.860 does anyone believe that is itself

00:20:10.080 a solution? I mean, it's obviously a crime, but

00:20:13.200 the long-term repercussions from that 0.93

00:20:16.420 will destroy Israel, it would seem to me. 0.85

00:20:19.680 Take the moral calculation out of it 0.74

00:20:22.640 as a practical matter that seems insane.

00:20:26.620 It worked very well in 1948. 1.00

00:20:31.400 The first Nagba 1.00

00:20:32.420 was a hell of a success. 1.00

00:20:37.020 We expelled over 600,000 Palestinians. 1.00

00:20:41.700 We destroyed all the villages. 1.00

00:20:43.880 We didn't leave anything except of some mosques and some graves, 0.94

00:20:47.900 all the rest totally destroyed.

00:20:50.140 Covered it up with trees and nice parks, and it worked.

00:20:57.480 And me as a child, growing up in this place, born here, going up here,

00:21:02.840 You know, the first time I heard the word Nakba was when I was 20, 25.

00:21:08.820 I never asked myself, what are those ruins around me here and there in Tel Aviv, in other places?

00:21:15.120 Never thought that maybe someone owns it. 1.00

00:21:18.940 Maybe someone is living now in a refugee camp instead of his home.

00:21:23.960 Those things were totally oppressed and were not legitimate. 0.96

00:21:28.200 Until now, they're not legitimate. 0.99

00:21:29.440 So the first Nakba was a hell of a success. 1.00

00:21:32.840 Why not to continue? 1.00

00:21:34.340 I mean, for those people, 0.84

00:21:35.840 I don't say the majority of Israelis

00:21:37.440 want this to happen.

00:21:39.820 The majority of Israelis 1.00

00:21:40.960 have another disease, 1.00

00:21:42.940 namely being apathetic and indifferent.

00:21:46.200 But the right-wingers, for sure,

00:21:47.960 they want it to happen

00:21:49.000 and they are the only decisive part

00:21:51.820 of the society.

00:21:54.320 The settlers, the right-wingers,

00:21:56.720 the fascists,

00:21:57.480 they are the most powerful 0.98

00:21:58.860 and most active.

00:22:00.900 They have at least a plan

00:22:02.840 What plan do the leftists in Israel have, the Zionist leftists? 0.76

00:22:07.860 What do they suggest? 0.88

00:22:09.040 The alternative now, the opposition.

00:22:10.620 What is their idea?

00:22:11.660 What is their plan for God's sake?

00:22:13.740 They are opposing now a two-state solution.

00:22:16.180 Yeah, I'll appeal the other side.

00:22:17.740 They say the head of the opposition, yes, say that not in the coming 10 years, another

00:22:23.000 10 years, which it's not coming.

00:22:25.800 And meanwhile, I believe that the two-state solution died a long time ago.

00:22:29.700 We missed this trade.

00:22:30.700 But in any case, what do you suggest?

00:22:33.300 What are we suggesting to seven and a half million Palestinians who live between the

00:22:39.620 river and the sea, together with 7.5 million Jews who are living between the river and

00:22:45.480 the sea? 1.00

00:22:46.100 What are we offering them?

00:22:48.580 Apartheid forever? 0.99

00:22:50.720 They're right when there's at least seven planes. 1.00

00:22:52.580 Now we'll expel them.

00:22:53.920 One day. 1.00

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00:24:45.940 Where do they imagine millions of Palestinians will go?

00:24:51.080 if they're expelled.

00:24:54.920 That's the weak part of their fantasy

00:24:57.180 because they don't believe they will find a place

00:25:00.040 they were looking for, as you know,

00:25:02.120 even in recent months.

00:25:04.200 They look in Somalia and Aritrea

00:25:06.400 and God knows where, Africa, all kinds of places. 1.00

00:25:09.820 We give them money and we'll send them to Palestine. 1.00

00:25:12.080 Didn't work. 1.00

00:25:13.100 And it will never work.

00:25:14.240 I mean, no country in the world 1.00

00:25:15.520 will accept millions of Palestinians. 1.00

00:25:17.500 No way. 1.00

00:25:17.980 Egypt doesn't want to get them, obviously. 1.00

00:25:20.140 And like he saw, Jordan had enough with the refugees of 48. 1.00

00:25:24.780 Lebanon had enough on the refugees of 48. 0.81

00:25:28.180 They have no place to go.

00:25:29.760 But the fact that this idea is motivating the present is by itself very dangerous. 0.68

00:25:36.820 Maybe finally it will end up like the Native Americans, you know, totally forgotten, be 1.00

00:25:44.540 in all kinds of reserves, 1.00

00:25:46.580 living without any heritage,

00:25:48.820 without anything in Kormonia,

00:25:52.380 a bunch of people who lost their identity. 1.00

00:25:55.840 Maybe this will be the animals of the Palestinians 1.00

00:25:57.860 if it will go on like this.

00:26:01.200 Is the United States government doing anything 0.55

00:26:03.620 to restrain Israel in these plans that you can tell?

00:26:08.260 I think the United States is a full partner.

00:26:10.960 Look, we cannot think that what Israel is doing, knowing the dependence of Israel on the United States, we can't say that the United States is opposing it.

00:26:24.260 You know, all the big liberal presidents, above all Barack Obama, with his wonderful, wonderful speeches and ideas.

00:26:32.540 I had tears in my eyes when he was elected.

00:26:35.200 What did he do?

00:26:37.140 Did he stop Israel?

00:26:38.220 Well, his military aid was bigger than any other president.

00:26:42.740 Unconditioned.

00:26:44.320 So the United States is a partner for everything. 0.65

00:26:47.020 If we talk about genocide in Gaza, the United States is a partner.

00:26:51.500 If you like it or not.

00:26:53.120 It's not the main partner.

00:26:54.720 Our accountability above all.

00:26:57.160 But you know, they supply, they support, and they could do differently.

00:27:03.240 It's not like you say, you know, some country in Africa who wants to stop a genocide, but

00:27:10.640 it can't do anything.

00:27:12.280 United States has the skills, has the leverages to stop, and it never, never did, not the

00:27:18.280 settlements.

00:27:19.280 When did the Americans stop the settlements, which is much more innocent than a genocide?

00:27:25.760 What did they really do to stop the settlement project? 0.75

00:27:29.100 They could, in one phone call, put an end to it, one phone call in which they would say, I'm oversimplifying it, obviously, one phone call saying, listen, if you build one more terrace in the occupied territories, there is no aid to Israel, period. 0.66

00:27:46.300 And in this day, the settlement movement would have died, but there was no president to do so.

00:27:51.820 so the united states if you speak about the settlement united says he's a partner if you

00:27:58.660 speak about the war in gaza you may agree with me that it was a genocide or not it doesn't matter

00:28:03.740 the united states is a partner a manager with moral responsibility yes

00:28:11.560 everything you're saying is true and provably true these are not opinions these are facts

00:28:17.540 what what is up for debate is why why has a succession every u.s president since harry

00:28:25.600 truman in 1948 gone along with this why has there been no meaningful condition attached to any of

00:28:34.720 this aid military and economic like what is this i think it's up to you to answer taker for me it's

00:28:43.120 a big mystery. Really, there were

00:28:45.240 years in which I really

00:28:47.280 felt that we

00:28:49.320 don't know who is the superpower between the

00:28:51.240 two. Yes. There were those

00:28:53.120 years that Israel really 1.00

00:28:54.720 put the United States in its 0.83

00:28:57.120 small pocket, as we say in Hebrew. 0.98

00:28:59.560 Totally ignoring, you know,

00:29:01.020 totally ignoring advisors,

00:29:02.960 condemnations, threats, totally

00:29:05.040 ignoring it, doing whatever it wants

00:29:07.120 without any restraint.

00:29:09.420 And I asked myself, how come

00:29:10.900 with all this money and political

00:29:12.920 Well, hey, the United States is paying a hell of a price, I don't have to tell you, for the support to Israel and the game.

00:29:20.860 Please continue to support, but put some conditions to this.

00:29:25.680 I have no answer.

00:29:26.700 It's a mystery.

00:29:27.300 You know, to say that it is the Jewish lobby will be oversimplification because it cannot be that one minority is so powerful.

00:29:37.960 Not only it smells anti-semitic, but I don't think it can be the full answer.

00:29:42.920 Yes, the Jewish lobby was very powerful for many years. 0.98

00:29:46.820 Not enough. 0.63

00:29:48.300 United States does not share the guilt feelings of Euro. 0.71

00:29:51.880 There, the guilt feelings about the Holocaust 0.72

00:29:53.580 are very influential

00:29:56.080 and stay in the back mind of any politician in Euro.

00:30:00.480 In the United States,

00:30:01.440 you don't share any guilt feelings about Israel.

00:30:04.620 I don't know.

00:30:05.240 You should answer this.

00:30:07.580 For me, it's an absurd.

00:30:08.900 I don't have an answer myself.

00:30:10.760 um and i i agree with you apac is very powerful apac is disgusting from my perspective but

00:30:17.940 they're not powerful enough to do what we're seeing now so i i agree um i only have theories

00:30:24.920 no real answers but it is a question that we should be thinking about i think um what is the

00:30:30.440 board of peace do you think in gaza yes the president has announced this international

00:30:39.480 board that's going to run Gaza to redevelop it as a real estate project and put in casinos

00:30:46.100 and make this beautiful new world, he has said.

00:30:50.580 But I think most Americans are confused as to what this actually is.

00:30:56.200 Do you have any idea?

00:30:58.640 No, and there is no idea.

00:31:00.440 There were very nice ceremonies, as the president liked.

00:31:04.840 Did they renovate one house in Gaza?

00:31:06.660 We are now almost three years.

00:31:09.920 One house was renovated, one institution. 0.96

00:31:13.520 One person in Gaza can say that he lives human life now? 1.00

00:31:18.440 One?

00:31:19.300 In the entire Gaza Street? 1.00

00:31:21.400 I don't know what they do, but I know one thing, 1.00

00:31:24.780 that as long as we will not see facts on the ground, it's meaningless.

00:31:30.360 There were so many so-called peace councils before with all the

00:31:36.660 After each attack of Israel, major attack on Gaza, there was always a huge conference somewhere in Europe or the United States with a lot of surprises to rehabilitate Gaza, to bring a lot of investors to Gaza, to rebuild Gaza.

00:31:56.300 Now, me personally, I was once, I will never forget this day, invited to a launching of a new hotel in Gaza, which was supposed to be like a resort place for Israelis.

00:32:09.660 Two weeks later, started another war and the place was totally destroyed. 0.58

00:32:14.900 So all the talking about rebuilding Gaza are not valid, even if the money is there.

00:32:21.140 and the money is also not coming there because there is no political plan for Gaza.

00:32:27.320 It's very nice, your good intention to build casinos there.

00:32:32.220 First of all, who is going to run Gaza?

00:32:34.960 Gaza will be a free place?

00:32:37.080 This is the first question, not the last question.

00:32:40.340 First of all, guarantee the freedom of Gaza.

00:32:43.720 It is impossible that 2.5 million people will not even have citizenship.

00:32:49.520 Tell me, Tucker, which people in the world lives without citizenship of any country?

00:32:54.280 The most oppressed people live with citizenship. 0.60

00:32:57.820 Those people in Gaza have no citizenship, no passport of any country. 1.00

00:33:01.860 Is it sustainable? 1.00

00:33:03.640 Is it acceptable?

00:33:04.840 We are in 2026 that this phenomenon will continue again.

00:33:10.120 It's not only that they don't have.

00:33:11.760 There is no plan for the future, no vision, nothing.

00:33:16.040 so I cannot take it seriously

00:33:19.840 by the way like also this

00:33:21.940 horrible aid

00:33:23.840 organization that the American had

00:33:25.760 before as you know

00:33:27.780 I saw your unbelievable

00:33:29.840 conversation with Dr.

00:33:31.680 Minard the British

00:33:33.840 surgeon from

00:33:35.920 Oxford which you talked

00:33:37.800 with in

00:33:39.020 my view

00:33:40.440 really shaking conversation

00:33:43.720 I was so shaken by this conversation

00:33:45.820 of you. And listen

00:33:47.740 to me what he has to say about this

00:33:49.880 organization who was supposed to

00:33:51.800 bring food to Gaza. How many

00:33:53.880 people lost their life on the lines

00:33:55.860 to this food? Again,

00:33:57.440 American initiative.

00:33:59.740 So this will not be the solution. 0.94

00:34:02.020 You first of all have to

00:34:03.360 make Gaza a free place.

00:34:06.280 And then you have

00:34:07.740 to find a way to 1.00

00:34:09.840 let Gaza be run by

00:34:11.700 itself. There are human beings

00:34:13.640 like any other human being. Let

00:34:15.760 them build their own institutions they deserve it by the way i agree so much with dr meinard because

00:34:24.160 he described in your conversation how much he loves the people of gaza if there is one place

00:34:30.640 in the world in which i would love to be one more time in my life this is gaza i mean i know that

00:34:37.120 for most of the israelis this sounds insane but i wish more israelis would have met the people of

00:34:44.080 gaza the courage of gaza the sense of humor of gaza but you know if i say it in israel they think

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00:37:12.180 Is there a sense within Israel

00:37:14.760 of what's happening in Gaza?

00:37:16.600 How many people have died in Gaza?

00:37:20.880 No sense and no interest. 0.99

00:37:23.100 It's very interesting 0.95

00:37:24.380 because Israel, as you know,

00:37:25.600 has a free media,

00:37:27.920 a free press, most of it private-owned,

00:37:32.900 private-owned, and we are free to write whatever we want.

00:37:37.320 I'm the best example.

00:37:38.400 I have total freedom of speech.

00:37:40.720 The problem is that because of commercial considerations,

00:37:45.380 they want to please their viewers, their readers,

00:37:49.520 and not to bother them.

00:37:51.260 This goes on for many years.

00:37:53.040 The occupation is not covered at all in Israel,

00:37:57.300 And then came the 7th of October.

00:37:59.840 Again, I'm getting back to this crucial day which changed Israel. 0.87

00:38:05.820 Changed for many years, I'm afraid. 0.81

00:38:08.100 And after the 7th of October, it was very clear to every Israeli that we have no interest in Gaza.

00:38:14.420 Why would we bother about Gaza? 0.99

00:38:15.920 They are all terrorists. 1.00

00:38:16.740 They are all Hamas. 1.00

00:38:18.460 And the media cowardly stopped covering Gaza. 0.88

00:38:23.640 I can ensure you, Tucker, that any TV viewer in Omaha, Nebraska, saw so much more of Gaza than a Tel Avivian who lives next to me.

00:38:36.300 I can ensure you. 1.00

00:38:37.920 And they don't want to see it.

00:38:39.820 It's not that they want to see it and the media doesn't show it.

00:38:43.060 No, we don't want to hear it.

00:38:44.480 We don't want to see it.

00:38:46.400 Look, can I give you an example?

00:38:48.640 Please.

00:38:49.060 I'm coming

00:38:51.360 Monday is my travel day

00:38:53.660 to the West Bank

00:38:54.500 I travel today to the

00:38:57.200 hospital in Gaza in Hebron 1.00

00:38:59.480 I wish it was Gaza 0.98

00:39:00.500 hospital in Hebron

00:39:02.060 in which I met the family of the baby

00:39:05.540 of 7 months who was killed

00:39:07.660 by an Israeli soldier last Friday

00:39:09.560 Israeli soldier

00:39:11.560 shooting a baby of 7 months

00:39:14.160 in the car of his 0.85

00:39:15.580 family, daytime

00:39:17.240 I mean there was daylight

00:39:18.700 Seven o'clock in the evening was daylight.

00:39:21.500 The whole family, grandmother, father, mother, and two children in a car.

00:39:26.960 The car stops.

00:39:28.920 The soldier, after the car stops, brought two shots, killed the baby in his head.

00:39:36.320 Horrible story.

00:39:38.680 Do you really think that Israel was troubled by this story?

00:39:41.740 Except of my newspaper, I always do think that anyone bothered to bring the story.

00:39:46.700 They mentioned it, yeah.

00:39:48.700 But the framing of it was, you know, some kind of incident, not really serious.

00:39:54.560 Imagine yourself a Jewish baby is being killed like this, with a rifle from 10 meters.

00:40:00.940 Nothing. 0.97

00:40:02.280 He saw them, and he shot.

00:40:04.580 I don't know why.

00:40:05.860 He claims he felt dangerous.

00:40:07.700 It is so dangerous to meet a family with two children and grandmother who is 80.

00:40:14.520 It is so dangerous to the soldier.

00:40:16.780 And he shot him.

00:40:17.460 Now, the fact that this is happening has to do also with the fact that it doesn't bother any Israeli or almost no Israelis.

00:40:25.720 Not many.

00:40:26.620 True, there are those who are very devoted. 0.99

00:40:29.520 But most of the Israelis don't want to hear about it.

00:40:32.500 And if they hear about it, you know, I told it today to some friend of mine and she told me, yeah, but he didn't intend to kill him.

00:40:42.260 For God's sake, how do you know that he didn't intend to kill him?

00:40:45.620 Two months ago, they killed another family in the car.

00:40:48.520 Which form is this automatic justification to the army and to everything they do?

00:40:54.300 So getting back to your question, when you don't want to know, when you live in denial,

00:41:01.700 look, you cannot maintain such a brutal occupation for so many years, 59 years now, without denying it.

00:41:11.220 Because otherwise you would be out of your mind.

00:41:13.780 The Israelis are not monsters.

00:41:16.020 They have their emotions. 0.74

00:41:17.700 The part of them are liberals.

00:41:19.560 They couldn't live with it.

00:41:21.100 The only way to live with it is by denying and live with this denial and keep the denial

00:41:28.780 so that no one will break the denial because we really don't want to know.

00:41:34.900 You know, and your viewers know, the West Bank is half an hour away from our home.

00:41:39.700 It's not overseas, some colony.

00:41:42.240 In half an hour, in one hour, I'm in Hebrew.

00:41:45.600 In one hour, I'm in Gaza by car.

00:41:48.540 It's here, our backyard.

00:41:50.800 But we don't want to know what's going on here.

00:41:53.980 And the Israeli media, unfortunately, most of it,

00:41:56.720 is the biggest collaborator with the occupation

00:42:00.160 by supplying their consumers the service of pleasing them 0.78

00:42:06.980 and not bothering them and not telling the Israelis 0.57

00:42:10.260 the truth about what we are doing on a daily basis.

00:42:14.360 And again, Tucker, this is not only Netanyahu

00:42:17.480 and Ben Thierry and Smotrich.

00:42:19.820 It started much before.

00:42:21.840 They did it worse, much worse.

00:42:24.160 They legitimized many things.

00:42:25.820 They did.

00:42:26.880 But don't blame them and don't hope that after they will be gone,

00:42:31.100 things will be different.

00:42:32.420 They will not be different on those issues.

00:42:34.480 Other issues, yes.

00:42:35.700 The occupation will be as barbaric as it is.

00:42:38.880 Gaza will continue to suffer as it suffers

00:42:41.760 if it will be small as, what's his name,

00:42:45.880 Lapid or Eisencote or whoever.

00:42:49.760 Same thing.

00:42:51.860 You anticipated my next question,

00:42:54.180 which was, will this change

00:42:55.440 when the current leadership changes?

00:42:57.660 And that's a depressing answer that you just gave.

00:43:00.340 I wonder, how much do Israelis pay attention

00:43:04.640 to their supporters in the United States?

00:43:07.180 We have a number of high-profile supporters of Israel in the United States

00:43:10.080 who have the same positions as Smotrich and Ben-Gavir and Netanyahu.

00:43:15.000 Are Israelis aware of that? Does it matter to them?

00:43:19.480 For many years, it matters to the Israelis.

00:43:22.980 When the United States hugged Israel,

00:43:26.680 when Israel was the darling of the West, 0.66

00:43:30.080 and it was the darling of the West,

00:43:31.660 Israel could do things that no other country in the world could do.

00:43:37.180 But when the public opinion in the United States, like elsewhere, started to shift, it was immediately labeled as anti-Semitic, as you know personally.

00:43:48.580 Yes.

00:43:50.220 Exactly as you know personally.

00:43:52.260 And immediately they labeled everyone as anti-Semitic.

00:43:55.780 And then the only way to cope is by blaming the United States.

00:44:00.420 It's not us.

00:44:01.340 It's you. 1.00

00:44:02.200 You are an anti-Semitic. 1.00

00:44:03.220 It's not us, criminal of war. 1.00

00:44:06.060 It's you, the anti-Sem, right. 0.95

00:44:08.400 That's the point. 0.56

00:44:10.120 So Israelis are aware that they are the evangelists who still support Israel.

00:44:14.900 There are still some members of the Jewish communities, obviously, who support blindly Israel. 0.85

00:44:21.780 But Israel gave up on the world, I think.

00:44:25.960 The Israelis convinced themselves that whatever we do, the world is against us.

00:44:31.020 So why would we bother?

00:44:33.020 And you see, practically, we know we are not beloved, but it doesn't bother us enough.

00:44:39.340 That's the point.

00:44:40.320 We don't ask, why don't they love us?

00:44:42.980 We are not courageous enough to look at the truth and ask ourselves, why did they love

00:44:47.760 us after Oslo?

00:44:49.340 Why after Oslo, Israel was so popular? 0.98

00:44:52.880 And why now Israel is a parasitic? 0.99

00:44:54.920 We put immediately the blame on the world, not on ourselves. 1.00

00:44:58.540 We never check ourselves.

00:45:00.720 We did something wrong. 0.97

00:45:02.840 Maybe we exaggerate in Gaza.

00:45:05.520 Maybe bombarding Beirut is not the right thing to do.

00:45:10.660 No, no.

00:45:11.340 It's the world who hates us.

00:45:14.620 Well, in a world of the globalized economy, that has real consequences potentially.

00:45:19.940 So if the United States begins to withdraw its support for Israel, Israel would need

00:45:25.260 a new partner in order to continue living as it has been living.

00:45:29.500 Who would that partner be, do you think?

00:45:32.060 But first of all, the right-wingers, the settlers, the radical right-wingers, they at least seem

00:45:41.000 not to care.

00:45:42.260 So we will, as they say, we will fight with our hands. 0.95

00:45:46.140 Yeah, we will fight Iran with our hands. 0.99

00:45:49.500 Good luck.

00:45:51.900 Others, because Israeli discourse does not include any thoughts about the future, any

00:45:59.620 thoughts.

00:46:00.020 we don't think what will be tomorrow

00:46:02.640 where are we aiming

00:46:04.780 I mean how will Israel look in 10 years

00:46:07.080 it's also our agenda

00:46:09.180 we are living the day

00:46:10.220 and therefore we ignore those questions

00:46:12.940 and people say

00:46:14.540 you know we trust ourselves

00:46:16.680 Israelis have this sense that we will

00:46:18.800 always be able to 0.95

00:46:20.340 improvise a new partner

00:46:22.760 or maybe mislead

00:46:24.780 another president and promise

00:46:26.900 him the sky

00:46:28.100 and continue to do it until now.

00:46:31.120 It was working very well for Israel, you must admit.

00:46:34.040 Yes. 0.66

00:46:34.760 Life in Israel is economically,

00:46:37.300 we are doing better than any, many other countries in the world,

00:46:41.180 even in times that we are passed.

00:46:43.820 And now it's there with the armed beings who will stop it.

00:46:50.560 What is the goal of the war with Iran?

00:46:54.640 What's the point of this?

00:46:56.040 so

00:46:57.480 that's the life project 0.88

00:46:59.980 of Netanyahu and we have to give him 0.79

00:47:02.000 a credit for this

00:47:02.980 he speaks about it

00:47:05.960 for decades

00:47:06.840 and I believe

00:47:09.960 that he believes that

00:47:11.820 it is a real existential

00:47:14.220 danger

00:47:14.780 and I believe that he believes

00:47:18.260 that this can

00:47:20.060 be challenged only by war

00:47:21.660 and his wet dream

00:47:23.940 was for years to attack

00:47:26.020 Iran, military. He didn't believe in any kind of agreements and deals, like he doesn't believe in

00:47:33.440 any agreement with the Palestinians or any kind of compromise or diplomacy. And he tried, as you

00:47:42.960 know, with few American presidents to persuade them to go for war together because Israel cannot

00:47:49.340 go to war with Iran without the United States.

00:47:53.340 It's practically not sustainable.

00:47:57.060 And then he found Donald Trump, and in a way, he succeeded to pursue a deal.

00:48:03.460 Again, I think the accountability is Trump's.

00:48:07.700 I don't buy it that Netanyahu can push Trump into a war.

00:48:12.400 You know Trump much better than I, and you know that he's not so easily pushed into a

00:48:17.840 war somewhere far away.

00:48:20.260 If Donald Trump decided to go for war with Iran, it's his responsibility, no less than 0.58

00:48:26.420 Netanyahu's. 0.99

00:48:27.880 Yes, I agree with you. 0.58

00:48:31.500 If this is the case, then Israel found, I mean, Netanyahu, it's all Netanyahu now, about 0.75

00:48:38.160 Iran, it's all Netanyahu. 0.70

00:48:39.300 He found the opportunity of his life to try, once and for all, a military campaign against Iran. 0.76

00:48:49.140 And maybe he believed that he can achieve the goals, namely regime change, dismantling the nuclear capability, dismantling the ballistic missiles, and also he had the dream to disconnect between Iran and the proxies.

00:49:07.460 what he didn't take into account

00:49:10.100 that all those goals are unachievable

00:49:12.460 even in a war

00:49:13.680 and now he stands before

00:49:16.440 a deadlock exactly like

00:49:18.180 Donald Trump stands before a deadlock

00:49:20.260 they tried war

00:49:22.220 quite messy

00:49:23.400 he didn't bring any

00:49:25.580 achievements, don't buy all those

00:49:28.340 talkings about

00:49:30.080 how many

00:49:31.540 boats were hit and how many

00:49:34.420 canards

00:49:35.960 you know

00:49:37.460 Iran is still strong, alive and kicking. 0.97

00:49:41.180 The regime is maybe stronger than it was. 0.98

00:49:44.100 And now there is no goal because the goals which were on the agenda

00:49:48.900 were found as unachievable.

00:49:53.420 Now, the idea is to realize that there are things which are unachievable

00:49:57.440 or for sure unachievable by force.

00:49:59.340 Not everything can be achieved by force.

00:50:02.680 But people like Netanyahu don't accept it.

00:50:05.440 What is not achievable by force will be achievable by more force.

00:50:11.820 That's the way they think. 0.68

00:50:13.880 And therefore, we are again and again in Lebanon, third time now,

00:50:17.400 with the same strategy, which twice totally failed and will fail now.

00:50:22.920 Same in Gaza, same in Iran.

00:50:25.400 It will lead us to nowhere. 0.97

00:50:27.740 But, you know, when a people does not learn from its own experience, 0.52

00:50:33.740 we face a problem.

00:50:35.440 why would netanyahu continue to push trump to keep the war going when no goals have been

00:50:47.340 achieved and it doesn't seem possible that any of them will be achieved iran is not going to fall

00:50:51.840 apart it's not going to disintegrate into civil war because of the u.s israeli bombing campaign

00:50:58.420 what why would netanyahu want to keep it going because otherwise he has to admit that his life

00:51:05.420 project failed. Otherwise, he has to admit that he was wrong along the way. He has to admit that

00:51:13.420 pushing Barack Obama to pull out of the agreement was an historical major mistake. He has to admit

00:51:22.480 all this. And besides, he maybe still believes that maybe more aggression will bring more results.

00:51:31.980 I don't know.

00:51:33.500 The fact is that even the bombarding of Lebanon is in a way also a tool to sabotage any agreement with Iran, between the United States and Iran.

00:51:45.940 And we see the linkage now.

00:51:48.840 And he will do anything possible to prevent an agreement still because either he doesn't believe in anything else or he's not courageous enough to stand in front of the mirror and say,

00:52:01.980 My life project failed.

00:52:04.580 I didn't get it, and I couldn't get it

00:52:07.200 because it's unachievable by force.

00:52:09.840 Yes.

00:52:10.280 But I don't think he's courageous enough for this.

00:52:14.180 What do Israelis think of the war with Iran?

00:52:17.400 First of all, you saw the first days,

00:52:19.980 93% of Israelis supported the war with Iran.

00:52:24.220 Now, Takir, 93% is a figure that you get only in North Korea.

00:52:29.740 Yes.

00:52:30.340 in polls, or in a good day, maybe also, there is nothing like 93.

00:52:36.880 If you go now to a poll asking Israelis if today is Monday, you will not get 93%.

00:52:43.960 You will not get. 1.00

00:52:45.020 No, that's so true.

00:52:47.340 Yeah, and some will say, I have no opinion, and others will say, I don't know.

00:52:51.720 You will not get 93%.

00:52:53.220 And here you got 93%. 0.57

00:52:57.440 First of all, you get support to end war in Israel 0.67

00:53:01.520 in its beginning, for sure, automatically and blindly.

00:53:05.240 There was not one war that Israel launched, 0.83

00:53:07.600 and we know today how many of the wars were unnecessary,

00:53:11.100 if not worse than this.

00:53:13.060 You get immediately a support.

00:53:14.700 The whole people unites along the lines of the army,

00:53:19.840 our military foes, our pride.

00:53:22.200 We have to do something.

00:53:23.920 It's an opportunity, ta-ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.

00:53:27.120 Blah, blah, blah.

00:53:28.520 Then are coming the question marks. 0.55

00:53:31.700 With Iran, it was even more so because I don't remember 93% of support.

00:53:37.320 Now it's smaller, but it's still the majority.

00:53:40.040 You must understand that in Israel's mindset, 0.51

00:53:43.180 launching a war will always be more popular than a peace agreement. 0.83

00:53:48.620 Try to get now to any kind of agreement with Lebanon. 0.75

00:53:52.260 You will not get 93% and maybe not 39% of support. 0.93

00:53:58.600 That's the mindset. 0.80

00:53:59.940 The mindset is of living on the sword and only living on the sword and not believing in anything else, not believing that the Arabs are human beings like us, not believing in any agreements with them. 1.00

00:54:12.240 You can't trust them. 1.00

00:54:14.100 And the most funny notion is that the Arabs understand only the language of power. 1.00

00:54:22.260 Yes. 1.00

00:54:23.920 And violence. 0.80

00:54:25.040 While the matter of fact is that Israel is understanding language. 0.58

00:54:30.180 So, yeah, something very basic is calling for a reset in Israeli society. 0.64

00:54:37.640 And there is no one to do this reset.

00:54:40.760 And therefore, I'm so pessimistic.

00:54:43.120 How are you treated?

00:54:44.620 I mean, you've spoken so plainly and directly about what's happening in Israel.

00:54:51.920 And as you just said, 93% of the population disagrees with you.

00:54:56.300 So what is it like for you to live there right now as a lifelong Israeli?

00:55:00.560 First of all, I thank you for the compliment, 0.84

00:55:04.640 but there are no 7% of Israelis who agree with me. 0.99

00:55:08.180 So you exaggerate. 0.98

00:55:10.520 I really appreciate it, but I wish I had 7%.

00:55:14.280 No, there are no.

00:55:15.220 and

00:55:17.080 look

00:55:19.080 I'm

00:55:19.460 old enough

00:55:22.140 to look

00:55:22.720 backwards

00:55:23.380 and

00:55:24.780 I was

00:55:25.640 always

00:55:26.020 lonely

00:55:26.580 2014

00:55:29.300 I had

00:55:29.920 bodyguards

00:55:30.560 now I

00:55:32.200 feel very

00:55:32.660 safe I

00:55:33.220 must say

00:55:33.700 my freedom

00:55:34.600 of speech

00:55:35.440 is totally

00:55:36.140 kept

00:55:36.660 in my

00:55:37.820 newspaper

00:55:38.340 on the

00:55:39.740 other hand

00:55:40.280 there is

00:55:40.660 this

00:55:40.900 phenomenon

00:55:41.340 that for

00:55:41.860 example

00:55:42.240 in Israeli

00:55:42.820 TV

00:55:43.220 for three

00:55:43.880 years now

00:55:44.480 I used to be often on Israeli TV.

00:55:47.100 For the last three years, they didn't invite me.

00:55:48.860 I mean, they invited me twice in three years,

00:55:52.060 while I was at least once, twice a week on Israeli TV.

00:55:55.840 The Israeli media, except of Haaretz, which is my home and my safe place,

00:56:01.920 except of Haaretz, there's no room for views like mine.

00:56:07.020 It's not personal.

00:56:07.880 There's no room for it.

00:56:09.560 There's no room in all those endless panels on Israeli TV

00:56:13.540 for any kind of alternative view.

00:56:16.440 You must say only what everyone else says.

00:56:19.840 Otherwise, you would not invite.

00:56:22.200 Now, personally, on one hand,

00:56:24.200 I am very grateful to the fact

00:56:26.180 that I have still my freedom.

00:56:28.580 I can talk to you and say whatever.

00:56:31.580 Maybe people will curse me. 1.00

00:56:33.660 There is this woman who every morning

00:56:35.300 when I'm jogging in the park, 1.00

00:56:37.000 is screaming at me at 5.30 in the morning. 1.00

00:56:40.380 Oh, like a crazy woman. 0.98

00:56:43.540 But she's really an exception. 1.00

00:56:47.680 I'm not the issue.

00:56:48.620 Really not. 1.00

00:56:49.520 I'm very grateful to live in a place where at least if you are a Jew, 1.00

00:56:54.360 you have your rights at least until now. 0.72

00:56:57.140 I have my home, Haaretz.

00:56:59.620 I express my views.

00:57:01.060 I cannot complain about anything, but I feel more lonely than ever.

00:57:05.740 After the 7th of October, some of my best friends, as we say, shifted.

00:57:11.480 some of my best friends

00:57:13.200 changed their views

00:57:14.380 I was never so lonely

00:57:16.320 never

00:57:16.820 are you going to stay?

00:57:21.540 from my last

00:57:22.760 until my last breeze

00:57:24.300 sure I'll stay

00:57:25.000 I was born here

00:57:26.060 I died

00:57:26.840 my wife is Swedish 0.93

00:57:28.240 I could easily live 1.00

00:57:29.540 but sure I'll stay

00:57:31.860 that's my place

00:57:33.520 I mean

00:57:33.880 I'm attached to this place

00:57:36.260 I'm not

00:57:36.820 you know

00:57:37.760 observed

00:57:38.740 from the outside

00:57:40.060 I'm very attached to his place, and this makes the whole thing much more painful because I'm attached so much to Israel.

00:57:48.800 Because I feel that all those things are being done in my behalf, because I feel that I was cheated as a child, telling me all kinds of stories about the beginning of the state, which were not the full truth.

00:58:02.780 So I feel cheated. I feel ashamed in many cases. I feel guilty, deep guilt over the Palestinian people from the beginning, not from what's going on now, for all 48. But, but, you know, for the bad and for the good, it is my place. I will never leave as long as I can stay here. No, that's my language.

00:58:25.140 my parents came here

00:58:28.780 in 1939

00:58:30.200 my father was in an illegal boat

00:58:32.580 for half a year in the sea

00:58:34.320 600 people

00:58:36.980 on a boat, I can't even imagine

00:58:38.580 how it was, where from did they get

00:58:40.620 supply, any port in the

00:58:42.720 Middle East, in the Mediterranean 1.00

00:58:44.660 wouldn't let them get 1.00

00:58:46.740 down, until they were

00:58:48.740 detained in Beirut, Lebanon

00:58:50.660 finally he got here, he had 0.92

00:58:52.740 no clue, Judaism 0.87

00:58:54.460 And the Zionism never knew the difference between Purim and Yom Kippurim. 0.88

00:59:00.760 Between one Jewish holiday to the other, 0.84

00:59:02.640 always asked me, when do they fast?

00:59:04.400 When do they eat?

00:59:05.520 But so, no clue.

00:59:07.440 But this was his only rescue.

00:59:11.340 He couldn't go elsewhere.

00:59:12.560 He left his fiancée and parents and never saw them again.

00:59:15.920 My mother came here in a project of children, saving children. 0.50

00:59:19.400 She was 16 when she came here, Turkey Boots. 0.55

00:59:21.800 They were not Zionists or not anti-Zionists.

00:59:24.300 they were not political.

00:59:25.960 They had very nice life in Europe

00:59:28.000 and all of a sudden

00:59:28.880 something uprooted them from Europe

00:59:30.960 and Israel, Palestine 0.73

00:59:33.020 was their only rescue.

00:59:35.660 I cannot forget it.

00:59:37.620 And therefore,

00:59:38.280 I'm very, very attached

00:59:39.780 to all my memories.

00:59:41.460 Can you be attached from Maine,

00:59:43.260 from the United States?

00:59:44.500 I don't know.

00:59:45.920 I cannot.

00:59:46.880 To be uprooted from there,

00:59:48.260 I mean,

00:59:48.920 all my memories are here,

00:59:50.520 all my friends.

00:59:51.380 It's not even an issue.

00:59:52.900 It's not even an issue.

00:59:54.300 I will stay here as long as I can.

00:59:56.400 Maybe one day I'll be forced to leave. 1.00

00:59:58.860 With those Smotrichs, we'll continue. 1.00

01:00:01.500 Who knows? 1.00

01:00:02.540 But no, no.

01:00:03.380 I'll stay here.

01:00:04.120 I'm old enough or so.

01:00:05.780 I feel the same way about my country. 1.00

01:00:09.460 Looking back on your long life in Israel,

01:00:12.000 you said that the roots of what we're seeing now began long before Smotrich and Ben-Gavir took power.

01:00:20.000 what was the moment

01:00:22.480 you would point to

01:00:23.820 where the country changed

01:00:25.340 I'm not sure

01:00:28.500 it's the moment

01:00:29.100 that the country checked

01:00:30.080 I'm not sure

01:00:30.600 the country changed

01:00:31.700 I think my attitude changed

01:00:34.680 yes

01:00:35.460 because if I look now

01:00:36.720 backwards

01:00:37.460 you see that

01:00:39.460 it was all there

01:00:41.120 in the beginning

01:00:42.120 of that

01:00:42.660 it's not

01:00:45.060 the country basically

01:00:46.220 are using today

01:00:47.720 the same methods 0.95

01:00:49.020 like in the Nakba of 1948, namely uprooting the Palestinians, 0.99

01:00:54.900 trying to push them away, trying to tyrannize them

01:00:58.420 in order to push them out, trying to take over their economy,

01:01:03.380 their life, their heritage, everything.

01:01:05.780 This started long before the state was born.

01:01:09.120 This started with the beginning of Zionism and never stopped. 0.85

01:01:13.000 If it was acceptable then, you know, 48, Holocaust, people like my parents, you need to build their estate. 0.62

01:01:22.980 You cannot be too moral, so to say. 0.82

01:01:27.320 But we never stopped this in this very moment. 0.65

01:01:29.860 We spoke about Gaza before.

01:01:31.220 What's the difference?

01:01:32.120 Go and see the West Bank.

01:01:33.900 What they do now in the West Bank, I'm every week in the West Bank.

01:01:37.100 What they do now in the West Bank is exactly what the first scientists did in 48.

01:01:41.640 The thing is that then there was, and now we have this regional superpower and still we want more and still for more real estate and more land.

01:01:55.240 So, you know, those things are very hard to change.

01:02:00.620 So I don't think that Israel changed so much.

01:02:04.260 Yes, Smotrich, Ben Gavir, and above all, Netanyahu, who legitimized them, did a big shift, mainly by legitimizing.

01:02:13.680 You know, we had this Rabbi Emmanuel Kahana, who you Americans were kind enough to export him to us, and we are very grateful for this.

01:02:25.460 I really, if you should have any guilt feelings, it's for exporting Ben Gavir to Israel.

01:02:32.360 Yes, from Brooklyn to Israel, I remember it. 0.86

01:02:36.280 Exactly.

01:02:37.260 Thank you.

01:02:37.840 Thank you, America, for this.

01:02:41.300 But Mel Kahana, when he was speaking in the parliament, the Likud members would step out.

01:02:49.540 He was not legitimized because he was a racist.

01:02:53.140 Nobody was accepting him.

01:02:55.120 And finally, he was declared illegal until he was murdered in the United States.

01:03:00.300 Today, what is smart ritual?

01:03:02.860 Benkveri is a declared pupil of Kahana,

01:03:06.380 but much worse in his sadism.

01:03:09.760 I'm not sure that Kahana was such a sadist. 0.88

01:03:12.740 Benkveri is a real sadist.

01:03:14.640 Look how he treats the Palestinian prisoners. 0.91

01:03:17.780 You see the sadism, the happiness of watching them suffer. 0.99

01:03:23.400 There's really something sick in this man. 0.88

01:03:26.240 But this was there. 0.97

01:03:29.480 This government just legitimized it.

01:03:31.700 So this is a big shift, the legitimization.

01:03:35.240 But I see that above all, I changed, not Israel changed.

01:03:39.720 And I changed due to only one thing.

01:03:41.860 It's not like one day I was walking in the dark forest

01:03:45.720 and all of a sudden God revealed to me and told me,

01:03:49.660 you have to think about the Palestinian people.

01:03:52.160 In a very incidental way, back in the late 80s, I started to travel as a journalist to the West Bank and to Gaza. 1.00

01:04:02.980 Very innocent.

01:04:04.560 I was a good boy in Tel Aviv.

01:04:09.480 I was working with Shimon Perz for four years.

01:04:12.500 I was serving the Israeli army in the army radio station.

01:04:15.820 So I was not brought up as a dissident.

01:04:18.940 And I started to travel to the West Bank and Gaza. 0.66

01:04:23.820 And very soon I realized that the big drama of Israel is there.

01:04:30.680 This is what defines Israel, the occupation. 0.85

01:04:34.060 There is no one to tell it, or almost no one to tell it, and that I know nothing about it. 0.96

01:04:39.800 Me personally, I was in the darkness.

01:04:43.640 And then I started gradually to cover the occupation

01:04:46.880 until I made it the mission of my life.

01:04:50.240 And then gradually my view became more and more radical.

01:04:53.640 The more I saw, the more radical I became.

01:04:56.600 I believe that almost every Israeli who would witness 0.51

01:04:59.400 or would unwitness in the last 40 years that I'm working for Aretz,

01:05:03.120 I believe that it's part of the Israelis who would share the same views like me.

01:05:08.540 So the shift was in me, not in the country.

01:05:11.220 The country is doing the same, is running the same principles from 1948 until today.

01:05:18.540 And this is so worrying, because it's not that we all of a sudden change. 0.78

01:05:24.460 For the Zionist leftists, it's very convenient to say, oh, this Netanyahu, he brought this curse on our heads.

01:05:32.000 We were so beautiful before, so honest, so innocent, and then came this evil Netanyahu and made us into a pariah stick. 0.61

01:05:43.140 No, my dear friends, we did it before Netanyahu and we'll continue to do it after Netanyahu.

01:05:49.740 And Netanyahu did very bad things, but don't put everything on him.

01:05:54.560 And Shimon Peres and Tzakrabi, who got the Nobel Peace Prize, are responsible to more settlements than Netanyahu.

01:06:03.520 They started the project of settlements, together with other people in the Labour Party.

01:06:09.420 So let's realize that something much deeper is SIG, and not only Netanyahu and his government,

01:06:17.040 which I'd be very happy to see them stepping down, obviously, but it will not solve the basic problems.

01:06:24.560 unfortunately we have to find something optimistic taker we cannot just move on with the tide

01:06:30.920 i agree i i just i i i can't argue with anything that you've said and i hope that every american

01:06:40.640 watches the last hour of your explanation of what's happening in israel because i think it's

01:06:47.640 um i think it's essential for americans to understand that and i also keep thinking

01:06:52.240 30 years ago I knew

01:06:54.540 I felt like I knew many Israelis

01:06:56.500 who would say what you just said

01:06:58.320 and now

01:06:58.780 now you're almost alone

01:07:01.760 so thank you

01:07:03.320 thank you for everything you've said

01:07:04.620 and for what you're doing

01:07:05.380 and Godspeed

01:07:06.120 good luck

01:07:06.660 thank you Tucker for this opportunity

01:07:09.440 I really appreciate it

01:07:11.840 I do

01:07:12.340 thank you

01:07:12.620 thank you

The Tucker Carlson Show - June 12, 2026

MAJOR SHIFT： Will Trump Split From Israel？ Israeli Journalist on the Critical Situation in Iran.

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