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00:02:54.520 This is Gavin Newsom.

00:02:57.080 And this is Newt Gingrich.

00:03:01.480 I just wondered, if I could, just briefly, up top,

00:03:04.740 you sent out a couple of tweets over the last 24 hours,

00:03:07.800 specific to Ukraine, obviously topical issue.

00:03:10.800 And I appreciated, candidly, your tweets,

00:03:14.400 which were a little more assertive,

00:03:15.860 pushing back on this notion that somehow

00:03:18.180 time is our ally with Putin,

00:03:22.440 that it's time to be a little more muscular,

00:03:24.460 time to call him out.

00:03:25.480 You also called out, I thought, an important fact

00:03:28.080 that's not necessarily part of the discourse.

00:03:30.640 He spent 21 years in Sweden.

00:03:33.400 I mean, these guys have a longer version of the future.

00:03:38.120 That was actually the Napoleonic Wars.

00:03:41.040 Yeah.

00:03:41.560 But it was Putin who said,

00:03:43.100 look, we fought Sweden for 21 years.

00:03:45.260 You think I'm going to slow down?

00:03:46.760 You think I'm going to slow down?

00:03:47.920 So tell me, I mean, where are you in the over-under?

00:03:50.160 I mean, I appreciate your advocacy for Trump, et cetera.

00:03:54.520 But I think, I mean, is the revelation

00:03:56.800 that he's waking up to this new reality

00:03:58.980 that this is not something you can just snap your fingers?

00:04:01.400 Putin's a different kind of character.

00:04:03.600 Well, I think that, first of all,

00:04:07.020 he probably shares a lot of people's concern

00:04:09.680 that if you push Putin too hard,

00:04:13.260 you end up in a tactical nuclear war,

00:04:17.220 and then maybe more.

00:04:19.860 So I think there's a dance around Putin

00:04:22.500 that's a little more complicated

00:04:24.380 than just yes or no.

00:04:26.660 On the other hand,

00:04:28.020 I think he actually believed from his first term

00:04:32.100 when they'd had a pretty good relationship,

00:04:34.700 although he had sent lethal weapons to Ukraine.

00:04:37.340 He was much tougher than Obama had been.

00:04:40.660 But he was pleasant.

00:04:41.820 They had no major fights.

00:04:43.700 And I think he had in the back of his head

00:04:45.340 that, look, we're reasonable.

00:04:47.780 We can talk with each other.

00:04:49.840 And it's taken him, I think,

00:04:52.000 about five months to realize

00:04:53.280 nothing Putin says matters,

00:04:56.800 that what matters is what Putin does.

00:04:59.820 And when he says to you,

00:05:01.420 oh, I'd really like to get to a truce,

00:05:02.980 but by the way, for the next three days,

00:05:05.020 I'm going to bomb civilians.

00:05:07.680 After a while, it begins to sink in.

00:05:09.760 You know, it's the opposite of George W. Bush.

00:05:11.760 I'll never forget the day Bush said

00:05:13.780 that he looked into Putin's eyes

00:05:15.760 and he saw his soul.

00:05:17.880 And I knew that was nuts

00:05:19.300 because you can't be a KGB lieutenant colonel

00:05:22.000 and have a soul.

00:05:23.220 So, I mean, the whole concept of, you know,

00:05:25.860 somehow we try to make him a Western figure.

00:05:29.040 He's not.

00:05:29.700 He's a Russian figure.

00:05:31.180 And Russia is a different culture

00:05:32.700 than Western Europe.

00:05:34.240 And so the idea of what,

00:05:36.900 secondary oil sanctions you're advocating for?

00:05:39.880 Well, I mean, I'd advocate four big things.

00:05:43.800 More weapons faster.

00:05:46.260 Something which the German minister,

00:05:48.540 prime minister said today

00:05:49.540 that they'd agreed to,

00:05:51.100 which is use the weapons in Russia.

00:05:53.780 So you start causing him pain in his territory.

00:05:57.280 And this is a longer range weapons,

00:05:59.360 allowing them more range.

00:06:00.640 We've begun to give them weapons

00:06:02.860 that can reach Russia.

00:06:03.740 And, of course, they have lots of,

00:06:06.080 they're going to produce

00:06:06.880 some astonishing number of drones this year.

00:06:09.900 I mean, what, I think like a million five

00:06:12.060 or something.

00:06:13.100 I mean, people forgot.

00:06:15.540 Ukraine used to be a major industrial center

00:06:18.060 for the Soviet Union.

00:06:19.480 There's a lot of engineers in Ukraine,

00:06:21.500 a lot of hardworking, smart people.

00:06:23.660 And they now mobilize and fighting.

00:06:26.580 I think, so second,

00:06:28.540 you give them permission to fight inside Russia.

00:06:30.780 Third, you apply very severe,

00:06:33.740 sanctions on particularly sale of oil,

00:06:36.800 which is their only currency

00:06:38.020 that they generate any hard currency with.

00:06:40.500 And fourth, I would start picking up

00:06:42.860 all of the ships that are carrying illegal oil

00:06:45.320 and just literally let it be known worldwide.

00:06:48.980 You know, if you own a ship

00:06:50.280 and you use it to carry Russian oil,

00:06:52.900 you're going to lose the ship.

00:06:55.040 We're going to basically impound it forever.

00:06:58.060 And at that point,

00:06:59.300 his method of hiding from the sanctions collapses.

00:07:03.240 His ability to sell within the sanctions collapses.

00:07:06.460 And then the other thing I would do,

00:07:07.880 which has some legal implications,

00:07:09.920 but I'm a historian, not a lawyer,

00:07:11.580 so I don't worry about that,

00:07:12.920 is I would take the 300 billion

00:07:15.180 that is impounded in the West of Russian money.

00:07:17.900 I give it all to Ukraine.

00:07:19.000 What has been the reticence of that?

00:07:22.180 What's what, I mean,

00:07:23.140 it's interesting that Trump

00:07:24.500 didn't move more aggressively to do that,

00:07:26.220 or is it part of a tactical negotiation?

00:07:28.680 State Department and Treasury will tell you

00:07:30.700 there are all sorts of complicated questions

00:07:33.220 about doing that,

00:07:35.060 to which my answer

00:07:36.600 in the Franklin Roosevelt tradition is fine.

00:07:40.980 Let them fight it out in court.

00:07:42.740 Take the money.

00:07:44.320 I appreciate it.

00:07:45.160 Well, that's a perfect segue

00:07:46.500 into your new book,

00:07:47.840 Trump's Triumph,

00:07:48.560 because I think a lot of that

00:07:49.860 is sort of reflected

00:07:50.900 sort of this notion of action

00:07:53.140 and moving beyond process

00:07:55.500 and having a more entrepreneurial mindset

00:07:58.040 in terms of governance, et cetera.

00:08:00.220 But let's frame this book.

00:08:01.660 This book comes out on June 3rd.

00:08:04.580 It's your, how many, Mr. Speaker,

00:08:06.300 seriously, how many books have you written?

00:08:08.740 Well, I'm told 44.

00:08:12.260 And are you,

00:08:13.080 and you're,

00:08:13.440 you're writing all these books.

00:08:15.480 You actually write these books.

00:08:17.220 You don't have ghost writers.

00:08:18.140 I usually have help,

00:08:19.440 but I write all these books.

00:08:21.660 And this one,

00:08:22.580 unsurprising that you'd come out

00:08:24.180 with a book about Trump's triumphs.

00:08:26.200 But, but you,

00:08:27.000 but what surprised me a little bit

00:08:28.980 is this notion that you place them

00:08:31.060 as one of the five giants

00:08:32.640 up there with Jackson

00:08:34.560 and Jefferson

00:08:35.680 and people like Lincoln

00:08:37.680 and FDR himself.

00:08:39.860 I mean, is that your,

00:08:41.000 your current belief

00:08:42.140 or is that one that reflects?

00:08:44.520 I believe that

00:08:45.960 since the summer of 2015.

00:08:53.420 Because I watched him

00:08:55.040 do two things

00:08:56.680 that were kind of amazing.

00:08:57.840 One was tap into

00:09:00.320 the deeply felt emotions

00:09:02.840 of at least half the country.

00:09:05.880 And particularly,

00:09:06.980 and this is one of the great ironies

00:09:08.140 that I know you're wrestling with

00:09:09.800 and I've heard you talk about it.

00:09:11.400 You know,

00:09:11.680 we're having this switch

00:09:12.820 of which party

00:09:13.520 is the working class party

00:09:14.840 and which party

00:09:15.860 is the elite party.

00:09:17.440 Well,

00:09:18.780 Trump intuited this

00:09:20.440 and people forget

00:09:22.000 he had 13 years

00:09:23.300 of doing The Apprentice

00:09:24.220 on NBC.

00:09:25.300 He was a natural salesman

00:09:27.840 and a natural showman.

00:09:29.260 So his instinct was

00:09:31.660 to go right

00:09:32.540 for the blue collar worker.

00:09:34.480 And he did two things

00:09:36.520 in August of 2015.

00:09:40.200 Vince Haley,

00:09:40.820 who's now the

00:09:41.460 domestic policy director

00:09:44.080 at that time

00:09:45.260 was working with us.

00:09:46.320 And he walked in one day

00:09:47.540 in August and said,

00:09:48.620 you have to see

00:09:49.840 the C-SPAN coverage

00:09:51.620 of Trump in Arizona.

00:09:54.400 Because Trump is talking

00:09:55.960 about illegal immigration.

00:09:57.060 and then he invites

00:09:59.200 the father

00:09:59.920 of a young man

00:10:01.120 who's been killed

00:10:01.880 to come up on stage

00:10:03.960 and then Trump

00:10:04.940 steps way back

00:10:06.060 and allows this guy

00:10:07.940 to have like five

00:10:08.640 or ten minutes

00:10:09.320 on stage.

00:10:11.680 A willingness

00:10:12.580 to give up

00:10:13.280 the spotlight

00:10:14.480 that most people

00:10:15.520 who watch Trump

00:10:16.120 will think is not likely

00:10:17.020 and that most politicians

00:10:18.920 would find

00:10:19.480 very scary

00:10:20.600 to give control

00:10:21.720 of the microphone

00:10:22.300 to this person.

00:10:23.500 And I watched

00:10:24.820 the way

00:10:25.300 that the dynamics

00:10:26.540 of that

00:10:27.100 and then you may

00:10:28.300 remember the very

00:10:28.860 first debate

00:10:30.080 Chris and I

00:10:32.500 were watching

00:10:32.940 in our living room

00:10:34.020 and there was

00:10:35.880 the one where he got

00:10:36.480 in this really nasty

00:10:37.500 I mean

00:10:38.000 embarrassingly

00:10:39.080 personal fight

00:10:39.940 and

00:10:41.860 Was this the

00:10:43.400 Megyn Kelly?

00:10:44.360 It was Megyn Kelly.

00:10:45.420 I mean

00:10:45.560 it was just

00:10:46.380 it was kind of like

00:10:47.220 ooh

00:10:47.640 I don't

00:10:48.040 Yeah

00:10:48.800 nothing about that.

00:10:50.560 Look,

00:10:51.100 I thought

00:10:51.680 that was it.

00:10:52.480 I thought it was over.

00:10:53.940 They were racing

00:10:54.780 to the bottom

00:10:55.420 and I think

00:10:56.320 he got there first

00:10:57.260 and

00:10:59.380 which is a line

00:11:00.420 actually

00:11:00.920 that a year later

00:11:02.280 somebody would use

00:11:04.820 to describe

00:11:05.440 the fight

00:11:06.160 with Hillary

00:11:06.580 in the last month

00:11:07.380 that she was going

00:11:08.840 towards the bottom

00:11:09.480 but we thought

00:11:09.900 we could beat her to it.

00:11:11.740 So

00:11:12.180 so anyway

00:11:12.940 so we watched

00:11:13.900 this debate

00:11:14.480 and

00:11:15.880 everybody

00:11:16.800 I mean

00:11:17.080 Frank once

00:11:17.980 had a focus group

00:11:19.000 they all thought

00:11:19.800 Trump had lost

00:11:20.620 everybody like

00:11:21.640 everybody on our level

00:11:23.120 thought Trump

00:11:23.980 had lost

00:11:24.520 watching these

00:11:25.960 various online

00:11:26.980 things

00:11:28.100 and he's at

00:11:28.880 70 and 80%

00:11:29.960 out of 16

00:11:30.860 and I'm thinking

00:11:32.920 now wait a second

00:11:33.440 there's a mismatch

00:11:34.960 here

00:11:35.280 between everyday

00:11:36.600 Americans

00:11:37.160 and the elites

00:11:39.060 on a giant scale

00:11:40.900 and at that point

00:11:42.420 I decided

00:11:43.080 that what you had

00:11:44.660 was a phenomenon

00:11:45.540 who had

00:11:47.120 somehow tapped

00:11:48.920 into a core

00:11:49.940 desire

00:11:50.540 of the American

00:11:51.900 people

00:11:52.380 that they

00:11:53.800 wanted

00:11:54.340 to have a leader

00:11:56.300 who would

00:11:57.680 profoundly

00:11:58.300 change Washington

00:11:59.300 and in Trump

00:12:01.440 you had somebody

00:12:02.160 who by personality

00:12:03.720 and by background

00:12:05.280 was pretty enthusiastic

00:12:06.840 I mean

00:12:08.180 he's

00:12:08.880 he's always

00:12:09.560 wanted

00:12:10.020 to be a person

00:12:11.420 of consequence

00:12:12.240 and you know

00:12:13.840 if you're the guy

00:12:14.400 who breaks up

00:12:15.120 the Rooseveltian

00:12:16.060 system

00:12:16.660 after 90 years

00:12:18.020 you get to be

00:12:18.940 a person

00:12:19.260 of consequence

00:12:19.920 and so

00:12:21.480 it fit

00:12:22.200 it fit

00:12:22.900 what the

00:12:23.300 his

00:12:24.060 what his

00:12:24.540 particular half

00:12:25.240 of the country

00:12:25.680 wants

00:12:26.000 it fit

00:12:26.760 what I think

00:12:27.280 is a historic

00:12:27.880 necessity

00:12:28.380 as a

00:12:29.240 conservative

00:12:29.760 political leader

00:12:30.700 and

00:12:31.860 it fit

00:12:33.140 you know

00:12:33.600 his personal

00:12:34.180 desire

00:12:34.680 to have a

00:12:35.760 pride

00:12:36.040 he wanted

00:12:36.620 and it's very

00:12:37.120 interesting

00:12:37.320 to think back

00:12:37.780 to this

00:12:38.120 in terms

00:12:38.440 of the

00:12:38.680 politicians

00:12:39.040 you've

00:12:39.300 known

00:12:39.440 his slogan

00:12:40.680 wasn't

00:12:41.800 Trump

00:12:42.180 his slogan

00:12:43.980 was make

00:12:44.520 America

00:12:45.280 great again

00:12:46.120 so he was

00:12:46.880 picking a

00:12:47.380 topic

00:12:47.700 bigger than

00:12:48.360 himself

00:12:48.920 within which

00:12:50.980 he could

00:12:51.340 grow

00:12:51.740 and

00:12:54.260 I think

00:12:55.380 after surviving

00:12:56.420 the two

00:12:56.780 assassination

00:12:57.280 attempts

00:12:57.900 he really

00:12:59.000 personally

00:12:59.720 believes

00:13:00.220 that God

00:13:01.520 spared his

00:13:02.100 life

00:13:02.460 for the

00:13:03.320 purpose

00:13:03.600 of actually

00:13:04.020 achieving

00:13:04.400 that

00:13:04.600 so

00:13:04.820 I would

00:13:06.100 my point

00:13:07.120 is not

00:13:07.420 whether you

00:13:07.700 like him

00:13:08.000 or dislike him

00:13:08.460 but if you

00:13:09.000 look at the

00:13:09.400 great change

00:13:09.980 agents

00:13:10.360 they really

00:13:11.240 are

00:13:11.480 Jefferson

00:13:12.000 Jackson

00:13:13.360 Lincoln

00:13:13.860 and FDR

00:13:15.120 and I

00:13:15.960 think there's

00:13:16.380 a 50-50

00:13:17.520 chance

00:13:17.840 it's not

00:13:18.200 a certainty

00:13:19.420 yet

00:13:19.700 and I've

00:13:20.520 told him

00:13:21.000 all he did

00:13:22.620 was he

00:13:23.300 earned

00:13:23.700 a ticket

00:13:24.600 to the

00:13:24.980 dance

00:13:25.360 now if

00:13:26.860 he dances

00:13:27.320 well enough

00:13:28.020 and he

00:13:28.680 wins the

00:13:29.320 26 election

00:13:30.640 then he'll

00:13:32.440 earn a ticket

00:13:32.980 to winning

00:13:33.780 the 28 election

00:13:34.820 which will

00:13:36.680 probably be

00:13:37.160 J.D.

00:13:37.500 Vance

00:13:37.740 on our side

00:13:38.280 and if

00:13:39.100 we get

00:13:39.420 the Trump

00:13:39.900 vice

00:13:40.260 president

00:13:40.620 who's

00:13:40.740 only 40

00:13:41.180 years old

00:13:41.640 if we

00:13:42.440 get the

00:13:42.740 Trump

00:13:42.980 vice

00:13:43.300 president

00:13:43.700 on top

00:13:44.800 of the

00:13:45.040 Trump

00:13:45.240 presidency

00:13:45.740 then he

00:13:46.680 will be

00:13:47.140 in a league

00:13:47.880 with those

00:13:48.580 guys

00:13:48.920 we're going

00:13:49.760 to get

00:13:50.020 to that

00:13:50.320 and we'll

00:13:50.520 get to

00:13:50.760 26 in a

00:13:51.620 second

00:13:51.840 but I want

00:13:52.340 to go

00:13:52.580 back a little

00:13:53.200 bit

00:13:53.440 I'm not

00:13:53.800 doing your

00:13:54.180 show

00:13:54.560 and by

00:13:57.700 the way

00:13:57.960 I realize

00:13:58.820 you're only

00:13:59.120 thinking about

00:13:59.920 it

00:14:00.220 no all I

00:14:01.060 want to say

00:14:01.500 is I'm

00:14:01.840 grateful

00:14:02.160 you're

00:14:02.460 here

00:14:02.760 this is

00:14:03.480 a hell

00:14:03.800 of a

00:14:04.040 thing

00:14:04.240 that the

00:14:04.560 two of

00:14:04.840 us are

00:14:05.060 having

00:14:05.240 this

00:14:05.420 conversation

00:14:05.960 so take

00:14:06.780 me back

00:14:07.260 it's

00:14:07.480 interesting

00:14:07.840 you know

00:14:08.440 and you're

00:14:09.160 absolutely

00:14:09.440 right

00:14:09.700 and I

00:14:09.880 appreciate

00:14:10.160 because we

00:14:10.500 had Frank

00:14:10.860 Luntz on

00:14:11.360 and I want

00:14:11.620 to talk a

00:14:11.980 little bit

00:14:12.220 about what

00:14:12.960 Frank talked

00:14:13.500 about in a

00:14:13.940 minute a little

00:14:14.400 bit going

00:14:14.740 back the

00:14:15.700 contract with

00:14:16.240 America etc

00:14:16.820 but but Frank

00:14:17.980 made that point

00:14:18.580 about those

00:14:18.980 focus groups

00:14:19.640 but I want

00:14:20.280 to I'm

00:14:20.880 curious your

00:14:22.160 point of

00:14:22.660 view then

00:14:23.100 with Trump

00:14:23.600 you must

00:14:24.000 have known

00:14:24.500 him tangentially

00:14:25.400 but you

00:14:26.300 were the

00:14:26.780 leader of

00:14:27.160 the as you

00:14:27.540 said yourself

00:14:28.160 a second

00:14:28.560 ago

00:14:28.840 conservative

00:14:29.440 movement

00:14:29.960 here's a

00:14:30.700 former

00:14:31.240 Democrat

00:14:31.820 kind of all

00:14:32.840 over the

00:14:33.240 place

00:14:33.500 no strong

00:14:34.080 ideological

00:14:34.760 moorings

00:14:35.660 necessarily

00:14:36.320 I mean you

00:14:37.240 must have

00:14:37.540 been pretty

00:14:38.060 distrustful

00:14:39.060 early on

00:14:40.100 were you

00:14:40.780 of Donald

00:14:41.500 Trump

00:14:41.820 you weren't

00:14:43.100 first of all

00:14:43.880 I've known

00:14:44.100 Trump for a

00:14:44.600 quarter century

00:14:45.180 right

00:14:45.740 so you know

00:14:47.000 his politics

00:14:47.620 though he

00:14:48.120 wasn't always

00:14:48.760 aligned with

00:14:49.260 you

00:14:49.380 I knew him

00:14:49.940 back when he

00:14:50.280 was a

00:14:50.460 businessman

00:14:50.820 but he was

00:14:51.680 a very

00:14:52.040 noisy

00:14:52.440 businessman

00:14:52.980 and I'd

00:14:56.240 read his

00:14:56.540 two books

00:14:57.040 which I

00:14:57.840 recommend

00:14:58.300 everybody

00:14:58.800 if you

00:14:59.540 want to

00:14:59.760 understand

00:15:00.040 Trump

00:15:00.340 you read

00:15:00.660 The Art

00:15:00.920 of the

00:15:01.100 Deal

00:15:01.280 and The

00:15:01.480 Art

00:15:01.580 of the

00:15:01.780 Comeback

00:15:02.240 comebacks

00:15:03.460 the more

00:15:03.740 important

00:15:04.100 of the

00:15:04.320 two

00:15:04.540 because

00:15:05.000 it opens

00:15:05.580 up with

00:15:06.700 some very

00:15:07.460 telling lines

00:15:08.300 doesn't it

00:15:08.860 it's amazing

00:15:09.460 he opens

00:15:09.900 up with

00:15:10.420 my property

00:15:12.100 in Atlantic

00:15:13.380 City is

00:15:13.760 losing money

00:15:14.340 the economy

00:15:16.400 is going

00:15:16.760 down because

00:15:17.320 of Iraq

00:15:17.920 I'm

00:15:18.720 900 million

00:15:20.160 dollars in

00:15:20.680 debt personally

00:15:21.300 to the banks

00:15:21.880 and my wife

00:15:22.840 just called

00:15:23.380 and said

00:15:23.760 she wanted

00:15:24.060 a divorce

00:15:24.500 and he has

00:15:25.300 this great

00:15:25.640 line he

00:15:25.980 says this

00:15:26.760 is the

00:15:27.060 moment you

00:15:27.920 either get

00:15:28.480 depressed

00:15:29.060 or you plan

00:15:30.240 a comeback

00:15:30.700 this book

00:15:32.200 which also

00:15:33.560 tells you

00:15:34.060 a lot

00:15:34.360 about how

00:15:35.080 he survived

00:15:35.580 the last

00:15:35.920 four years

00:15:36.480 this is a

00:15:38.060 guy who's

00:15:38.480 resilient

00:15:38.920 on a scale

00:15:39.720 that is

00:15:40.420 historic

00:15:40.800 we first

00:15:41.880 talked with him

00:15:42.500 I had breakfast

00:15:43.380 with him

00:15:43.760 in Des Moines

00:15:44.740 of all places

00:15:45.400 in February

00:15:46.940 of 2015

00:15:48.100 and we talked

00:15:49.180 about running

00:15:49.960 for president

00:15:50.440 because we'd

00:15:51.360 run in 12

00:15:51.940 and learned

00:15:52.740 the hard way

00:15:53.580 that if the

00:15:54.240 other guy

00:15:54.580 has many

00:15:55.340 millions

00:15:55.680 more than

00:15:56.140 you

00:15:56.400 bet on

00:15:57.320 the money

00:15:58.180 but I learned

00:15:59.780 a lot

00:16:00.040 about running

00:16:00.400 for president

00:16:00.900 even though

00:16:01.400 you won

00:16:01.840 easily

00:16:02.400 by any

00:16:03.160 objective measure

00:16:03.740 you won

00:16:04.040 all those

00:16:04.380 damn debates

00:16:05.060 at least

00:16:05.620 enough TV

00:16:07.820 ads could

00:16:08.400 undo the

00:16:08.800 debates

00:16:09.180 for me

00:16:11.180 it was a

00:16:11.480 wonderful

00:16:11.800 learning

00:16:12.120 experience

00:16:12.620 and I

00:16:14.180 think in

00:16:14.600 my

00:16:14.940 willingness

00:16:15.980 to take

00:16:16.520 on the

00:16:16.820 news media

00:16:17.360 head on

00:16:17.820 I was

00:16:18.460 probably a

00:16:18.980 forerunner

00:16:19.580 for Trump's

00:16:20.600 invention

00:16:20.960 of fake

00:16:21.360 news

00:16:22.060 but we

00:16:24.700 talked at

00:16:25.160 length about

00:16:25.700 running

00:16:26.300 and it

00:16:27.760 was very

00:16:28.160 interesting

00:16:28.600 and you

00:16:29.220 could tell

00:16:29.680 that he

00:16:30.880 had now

00:16:31.440 moved from

00:16:32.080 that would

00:16:32.740 be an

00:16:32.960 interesting

00:16:33.240 thing

00:16:33.700 to kind

00:16:34.420 of a

00:16:34.640 businessman

00:16:35.080 thinking

00:16:36.240 through

00:16:36.620 what would

00:16:37.080 it take

00:16:37.480 how much

00:16:37.860 would it

00:16:38.100 cost

00:16:38.380 how would

00:16:38.720 you

00:16:38.820 structure

00:16:39.160 it

00:16:39.480 and so

00:16:40.580 I watched

00:16:41.100 his development

00:16:41.800 all through

00:16:42.760 15

00:16:43.180 and I

00:16:45.260 wasn't

00:16:46.600 particularly

00:16:46.940 pro-Trump

00:16:47.540 at that

00:16:47.840 point

00:16:48.100 right

00:16:49.320 frankly

00:16:51.140 if you

00:16:51.680 remember

00:16:52.000 Jeb Bush

00:16:52.940 was the

00:16:53.280 front runner

00:16:53.680 he had

00:16:55.100 the most

00:16:55.840 money

00:16:56.160 100 million

00:16:57.100 in a pack

00:16:57.680 he had

00:16:58.280 his father

00:16:58.780 and his

00:16:59.100 brother

00:16:59.420 he had

00:17:01.000 nationwide

00:17:01.460 name ID

00:17:02.180 and watching

00:17:03.880 Trump

00:17:04.360 psychologically

00:17:06.060 take him

00:17:06.800 apart

00:17:07.220 low energy

00:17:08.300 the case

00:17:09.000 study

00:17:09.360 well he

00:17:10.420 got so

00:17:11.020 far inside

00:17:11.720 Jeb's

00:17:12.060 head

00:17:12.380 that Jeb

00:17:13.420 is running

00:17:13.840 around

00:17:14.300 New Hampshire

00:17:15.220 in shorts

00:17:17.280 jogging

00:17:18.000 now the

00:17:18.820 average

00:17:19.100 New Hampshire

00:17:19.580 right

00:17:19.920 regards the

00:17:20.980 idea of

00:17:21.280 a presidential

00:17:21.800 candidate

00:17:22.340 who's

00:17:22.640 jogging

00:17:23.220 has

00:17:23.980 disqualification

00:17:25.660 on grounds

00:17:26.680 just automatically

00:17:27.580 which was

00:17:29.060 really unfortunate

00:17:29.740 because Jeb

00:17:30.240 actually was

00:17:31.140 a very good

00:17:31.820 reformed

00:17:32.300 governor of

00:17:32.680 Florida

00:17:32.920 but Trump

00:17:34.260 just had

00:17:34.680 this ability

00:17:35.320 to somehow

00:17:36.720 set the

00:17:37.400 stage

00:17:37.900 where you

00:17:38.760 couldn't

00:17:39.080 win

00:17:39.380 and it's

00:17:41.740 a very

00:17:42.800 unusual

00:17:43.420 capability

00:17:44.120 Amy Robach

00:17:47.900 and TJ

00:17:48.320 Holmes

00:17:48.620 here

00:17:48.920 Diddy's

00:17:49.600 former

00:17:50.060 protege

00:17:50.580 television

00:17:51.120 personality

00:17:51.800 platinum

00:17:52.480 selling

00:17:52.860 artist

00:17:53.240 Danity

00:17:53.900 King

00:17:54.180 alum

00:17:54.720 Aubrey

00:17:55.460 O'Day

00:17:55.920 joins us

00:17:56.460 to provide

00:17:56.840 a unique

00:17:57.500 perspective

00:17:58.040 on the

00:17:58.500 trial

00:17:58.820 that has

00:17:59.420 captivated

00:18:00.080 the attention

00:18:00.580 of the

00:18:01.120 nation

00:18:01.480 Aubrey

00:18:02.000 O'Day

00:18:02.240 is sitting

00:18:02.640 next to

00:18:02.960 us

00:18:03.100 here

00:18:03.380 you are

00:18:04.480 as we

00:18:05.080 sit here

00:18:05.420 right up

00:18:05.800 the street

00:18:06.200 from where

00:18:06.660 the trial

00:18:07.240 is taking

00:18:07.660 place

00:18:08.080 some people

00:18:08.780 saw that

00:18:09.400 you were

00:18:09.600 going to be

00:18:10.080 in New

00:18:10.540 York

00:18:10.860 and they

00:18:11.640 immediately

00:18:11.940 started

00:18:12.300 jumping

00:18:12.640 to conclusions

00:18:13.360 so can

00:18:13.820 you clear

00:18:14.280 that up

00:18:14.740 first of

00:18:15.240 all are

00:18:15.800 you here

00:18:16.300 to testify

00:18:17.000 in the

00:18:17.520 Diddy

00:18:17.660 trial

00:18:17.880 Aubrey

00:18:18.400 will offer

00:18:18.880 her opinions

00:18:19.560 and expertise

00:18:20.440 based on

00:18:21.660 her first

00:18:22.220 hand knowledge

00:18:22.880 from her

00:18:23.420 days on

00:18:23.980 making the

00:18:24.420 band as

00:18:24.840 she emerged

00:18:25.320 as the

00:18:25.620 breakout star

00:18:26.300 the truth

00:18:27.140 of the

00:18:27.400 situation

00:18:27.820 would be

00:18:28.220 opposite

00:18:28.600 of the

00:18:29.080 glitz

00:18:29.400 and glamour

00:18:30.020 it

00:18:30.540 wasn't

00:18:30.940 all bad

00:18:31.700 but I

00:18:32.860 don't know

00:18:33.320 that any

00:18:33.700 of the

00:18:33.960 good

00:18:34.160 was real

00:18:34.760 I

00:18:35.540 went

00:18:35.800 through

00:18:36.000 things

00:18:36.560 there

00:18:37.440 listen

00:18:38.180 to

00:18:38.480 Amy

00:18:38.880 and TJ

00:18:39.320 presents

00:18:39.940 Aubrey

00:18:40.660 O'Day

00:18:41.120 covering

00:18:41.680 the

00:18:41.900 Diddy

00:18:42.100 trial

00:18:42.420 on the

00:18:42.820 iHeart

00:18:43.140 radio

00:18:43.820 apple

00:18:44.220 podcast

00:18:44.820 or wherever

00:18:45.580 you get

00:18:46.160 your

00:18:46.300 podcasts

00:18:46.920 have you

00:18:48.600 ever thought

00:18:49.160 about going

00:18:50.100 boy sober

00:18:50.780 i'm hope

00:18:51.960 woodard

00:18:52.320 a comedian

00:18:53.220 creator

00:18:54.000 and seeker

00:18:55.200 of male

00:18:55.760 validation

00:18:56.340 to most

00:18:59.040 people i'm

00:18:59.820 the girl

00:19:00.100 behind

00:19:00.480 boy sober

00:19:01.100 the movement

00:19:01.820 that exploded

00:19:02.640 in 2024

00:19:03.620 boy sober

00:19:04.980 is about

00:19:05.460 understanding

00:19:06.140 yourself

00:19:06.720 outside of

00:19:07.540 sex and

00:19:07.940 relationships

00:19:08.520 it's more

00:19:09.800 than personal

00:19:10.700 it's political

00:19:11.840 it's societal

00:19:13.200 and at

00:19:13.900 times

00:19:14.420 it's far

00:19:15.380 from what

00:19:16.140 i originally

00:19:17.020 intended

00:19:17.640 it to be

00:19:18.320 these days

00:19:19.500 i'm interested

00:19:20.660 in expanding

00:19:21.700 what it means

00:19:22.360 to be

00:19:22.660 boy sober

00:19:23.220 to make

00:19:23.980 it customizable

00:19:24.760 for anyone

00:19:25.580 who feels

00:19:26.140 the need

00:19:26.680 to explore

00:19:27.520 their relationship

00:19:28.540 to relationships

00:19:29.820 i'm talking

00:19:31.220 to a lot

00:19:31.780 of people

00:19:32.240 who will

00:19:32.800 help us

00:19:33.440 think about

00:19:33.940 how we

00:19:34.500 love each

00:19:35.020 other

00:19:35.400 it's a very

00:19:36.200 very normal

00:19:36.840 experience

00:19:37.500 to have

00:19:38.500 times where

00:19:39.200 a relationship

00:19:39.840 is prioritizing

00:19:40.940 other parts

00:19:41.540 of that

00:19:41.760 relationship

00:19:42.200 that aren't

00:19:43.300 being naked

00:19:43.680 together

00:19:44.080 how we

00:19:44.680 love our

00:19:45.020 family

00:19:45.420 i've spent

00:19:46.140 a lifetime

00:19:46.660 trying to get

00:19:47.640 my mother

00:19:47.920 to love me

00:19:48.320 but the price

00:19:48.960 is too high

00:19:49.620 and how we

00:19:50.620 love ourselves

00:19:51.620 singleness

00:19:52.140 is not a waiting

00:19:52.820 room

00:19:53.120 you are actually

00:19:54.560 at the party

00:19:55.440 right now

00:19:55.960 let me hear it

00:19:56.720 listen to Boy Sober

00:19:59.060 on the iHeartRadio app

00:20:00.460 Apple Podcasts

00:20:01.660 or wherever

00:20:02.420 you get your

00:20:02.960 podcasts

00:20:03.500 a lot of times

00:20:08.000 the big economic

00:20:09.200 forces we hear

00:20:10.180 about on the news

00:20:11.080 show up in our

00:20:12.080 lives in small

00:20:13.320 ways

00:20:13.840 three or four

00:20:14.780 days a week

00:20:15.220 I would buy

00:20:15.720 two cups

00:20:16.880 of banana pudding

00:20:17.620 but the price

00:20:18.780 has gone up

00:20:19.420 so now I only

00:20:20.160 buy one

00:20:20.740 the demand

00:20:21.520 curve in action

00:20:22.420 and that's just

00:20:23.060 one of the things

00:20:24.220 we'll be covering

00:20:24.960 on everybody's

00:20:25.880 business

00:20:26.300 from Bloomberg

00:20:26.920 Business Week

00:20:27.540 I'm Max Chafkin

00:20:28.900 and I'm Stacey

00:20:30.000 Vanek-Smith

00:20:30.600 every Friday

00:20:31.660 we will be

00:20:32.240 diving into

00:20:32.960 the biggest

00:20:33.480 stories in

00:20:34.100 business

00:20:34.500 taking a look

00:20:35.260 at what's

00:20:35.780 going on

00:20:36.280 why it

00:20:36.800 matters

00:20:37.140 and how

00:20:37.740 it shows

00:20:38.060 up in

00:20:38.480 our

00:20:38.640 everyday

00:20:39.000 lives

00:20:39.540 but guests

00:20:40.440 like

00:20:40.700 Business Week

00:20:41.280 editor Brad

00:20:41.900 Stone

00:20:42.320 sports reporter

00:20:43.420 Randall Williams

00:20:44.120 and consumer

00:20:44.860 spending expert

00:20:45.720 Amanda Mull

00:20:46.480 will take you

00:20:47.280 inside the

00:20:47.960 board rooms

00:20:48.740 the back rooms

00:20:49.540 even the

00:20:50.140 signal chats

00:20:50.940 that make

00:20:51.560 our economy

00:20:52.100 tick

00:20:52.500 hey I want

00:20:53.360 to learn

00:20:53.560 about V-chain

00:20:54.080 I want to

00:20:54.540 buy some

00:20:54.940 blockchain

00:20:55.460 or whatever

00:20:56.040 it is

00:20:56.440 that they're

00:20:57.520 doing

00:20:57.860 so listen

00:20:59.080 to everybody's

00:20:59.840 business on the

00:21:00.620 iHeartRadio app

00:21:01.660 Apple Podcasts

00:21:02.800 or wherever you

00:21:03.600 get your podcasts

00:21:04.540 the Medal of Honor

00:21:05.660 is the highest

00:21:06.320 military decoration

00:21:07.380 in the United

00:21:08.040 States

00:21:08.500 recipients have

00:21:09.880 done the

00:21:10.200 improbable

00:21:10.760 showing immense

00:21:11.800 bravery and

00:21:12.600 sacrifice in the

00:21:13.620 name of something

00:21:14.380 much bigger than

00:21:15.240 themselves

00:21:15.800 this medal is

00:21:17.380 for the men

00:21:18.100 who went down

00:21:19.120 that day

00:21:20.060 it's for the

00:21:21.280 families of those

00:21:22.240 who didn't make it

00:21:23.060 I'm J.R.

00:21:24.020 Martinez

00:21:24.340 I'm a U.S.

00:21:25.560 Army veteran

00:21:26.180 myself

00:21:26.620 and I'm honored

00:21:27.980 to tell you the

00:21:28.840 stories of these

00:21:29.540 heroes on the

00:21:30.560 new season of

00:21:31.420 Medal of Honor

00:21:32.520 Stories of Courage

00:21:33.760 from Pushkin

00:21:34.640 Industries

00:21:35.200 and iHeart Podcast

00:21:36.780 from Robert Blake

00:21:38.560 the first black

00:21:39.600 sailor to be

00:21:40.200 awarded the medal

00:21:41.000 to Daniel Daly

00:21:42.360 one of only 19

00:21:43.720 people to have

00:21:44.660 received the

00:21:45.280 Medal of Honor

00:21:45.840 twice

00:21:46.440 these are stories

00:21:47.920 about people who

00:21:48.740 have distinguished

00:21:49.400 themselves by acts

00:21:50.580 of valor

00:21:50.980 going above and

00:21:52.600 beyond the call

00:21:53.780 of duty

00:21:54.280 you'll hear about

00:21:55.920 what they did

00:21:56.620 what it meant

00:21:57.980 and what their

00:21:58.900 stories tell us

00:21:59.800 about the nature

00:22:00.600 of courage

00:22:01.440 and sacrifice

00:22:02.700 listen to Medal of

00:22:04.440 Honor on the

00:22:04.960 iHeart Radio app

00:22:06.060 Apple Podcasts

00:22:07.380 or wherever you

00:22:08.100 get your podcasts

00:22:08.980 what happens

00:22:10.480 when we come

00:22:11.340 face to face

00:22:11.880 with death

00:22:12.440 my truck

00:22:13.340 was blown up

00:22:13.800 by a 20 pound

00:22:14.380 anti-tank mine

00:22:15.180 my parachute

00:22:16.500 did not deploy

00:22:17.320 i was kidnapped

00:22:19.060 by a Druckertil

00:22:20.380 i just remember

00:22:22.020 everything getting

00:22:22.840 dark

00:22:23.300 i'm dying

00:22:25.140 when we step

00:22:26.700 beyond the edge

00:22:27.380 of what we know

00:22:28.100 to open our

00:22:29.320 consciousness

00:22:29.880 to something

00:22:30.920 more than just

00:22:31.700 what's in that

00:22:32.260 western box

00:22:33.080 and we turn

00:22:33.640 i clinically died

00:22:35.700 the heart stopped

00:22:36.640 beating

00:22:36.940 which i was

00:22:37.700 dead for 11.5 minutes

00:22:39.260 my name is dan bush

00:22:40.400 my mission is simple

00:22:41.540 to find

00:22:42.320 explore

00:22:43.060 and share these stories

00:22:44.620 i'm not a victim

00:22:45.660 i'm a survivor

00:22:46.620 you're strongest

00:22:47.640 when you're the most

00:22:48.280 vulnerable

00:22:48.660 to remind us

00:22:49.680 what it means

00:22:50.340 to be alive

00:22:50.960 not just that i was

00:22:51.860 the guy that cut

00:22:52.440 his arm off

00:22:52.900 but i'm the guy

00:22:53.880 who was smiling

00:22:54.660 when he cut his arm off

00:22:56.380 alive again

00:22:57.120 a podcast about

00:22:58.480 the fragility of life

00:22:59.580 the strength

00:23:00.400 of the human spirit

00:23:01.240 and what it means

00:23:02.080 to truly live

00:23:02.940 listen to alive again

00:23:04.400 on the iheart radio app

00:23:05.580 apple podcasts

00:23:06.520 or wherever you listen

00:23:07.800 to your favorite shows

00:23:08.680 so it's interesting

00:23:13.320 so i appreciate

00:23:13.920 in 2015

00:23:14.760 you started

00:23:15.480 i mean

00:23:15.940 there was sort of

00:23:16.640 the dance

00:23:17.360 of sort of

00:23:17.840 developing more

00:23:18.520 of this formal

00:23:19.580 relationship

00:23:20.160 as it relates

00:23:20.760 to the political

00:23:21.420 and so did you find

00:23:23.020 him particularly

00:23:23.660 policy driven

00:23:25.260 then was he

00:23:26.020 inquisitive

00:23:26.880 in terms of

00:23:27.460 tactics or policy

00:23:28.700 look he's talking

00:23:30.000 about tariffs

00:23:30.760 40 years ago

00:23:31.860 yeah true

00:23:32.840 talking about

00:23:33.600 immigration

00:23:34.140 i mean

00:23:34.680 he's talking

00:23:35.660 about the corruption

00:23:36.280 of washington

00:23:36.740 there are some

00:23:37.760 basic themes

00:23:38.420 but what i was

00:23:39.360 going to say

00:23:39.740 though is

00:23:40.120 and this may

00:23:41.040 help you understand

00:23:41.880 where i'm coming

00:23:42.340 from

00:23:42.640 trump is not

00:23:44.300 a conservative

00:23:44.840 right

00:23:46.060 trump is the best

00:23:47.520 anti-liberal

00:23:48.900 politician of my

00:23:50.260 lifetime

00:23:50.640 better than reagan

00:23:52.340 reagan was the

00:23:53.940 great conservative

00:23:54.700 articulator

00:23:55.560 i sort of stood

00:23:56.660 on his shoulders

00:23:57.360 with the contract

00:23:58.020 with america

00:23:58.620 and we came

00:23:59.800 out of a

00:24:00.300 formed

00:24:00.940 philosophical

00:24:02.040 background

00:24:02.740 trump

00:24:05.380 understands

00:24:06.820 that the

00:24:07.320 current

00:24:07.740 system

00:24:08.460 doesn't work

00:24:09.220 and that the

00:24:10.260 woke phase

00:24:11.060 of the american

00:24:11.700 left

00:24:12.060 is totally

00:24:13.960 destructive

00:24:14.480 of the american

00:24:15.840 system

00:24:16.320 this is my

00:24:17.140 view obviously

00:24:17.680 and

00:24:18.720 therefore

00:24:20.300 he is prepared

00:24:21.220 to fight

00:24:22.100 everybody i want

00:24:22.960 to fight

00:24:23.340 now the fact

00:24:25.000 that he doesn't

00:24:25.520 read bill buckley

00:24:26.560 uh and he

00:24:27.520 doesn't have a

00:24:28.320 national review

00:24:29.120 subscription

00:24:30.080 i don't care

00:24:31.380 because i know

00:24:32.620 that instinctively

00:24:33.560 he'll get up

00:24:33.980 every morning

00:24:34.480 and think

00:24:35.460 you know what

00:24:36.260 part of the

00:24:36.860 left can i

00:24:37.340 take apart

00:24:37.840 today

00:24:38.240 and one day

00:24:39.260 it'll be

00:24:39.540 harvard

00:24:39.920 and another

00:24:40.820 day it'll be

00:24:41.180 the new york

00:24:41.540 times

00:24:41.980 and another

00:24:42.760 day it'll be

00:24:43.180 some bureaucracy

00:24:43.960 but every day

00:24:45.220 he will cheerfully

00:24:45.940 go out and

00:24:46.420 engage

00:24:46.860 uh and

00:24:47.900 uh tear apart

00:24:49.720 the people who

00:24:50.620 i think need

00:24:51.200 to be torn

00:24:51.600 apart

00:24:51.960 so i'm

00:24:52.860 i'm very

00:24:53.500 happy

00:24:53.860 to have

00:24:54.680 a non-conservative

00:24:56.040 anti-liberal

00:24:57.280 uh entrepreneurial

00:24:58.100 activist

00:24:58.820 uh with all the

00:25:00.160 skills of a

00:25:00.640 great businessman

00:25:01.220 well so i

00:25:02.420 at peril i jump

00:25:03.520 right into the

00:25:04.180 book and get

00:25:04.740 chapters and

00:25:05.340 chapters ahead

00:25:06.040 he's also

00:25:06.800 taking on

00:25:07.440 things that

00:25:07.980 you've

00:25:08.340 championed

00:25:08.980 i mean

00:25:09.280 you've

00:25:09.680 highlighted

00:25:10.140 in the

00:25:10.580 book

00:25:10.840 the importance

00:25:11.820 of of

00:25:13.040 genomics

00:25:13.720 and synthetic

00:25:14.340 biology

00:25:14.980 and discovery

00:25:15.820 and invest

00:25:17.260 you know

00:25:17.660 in r&d

00:25:19.040 the issues

00:25:19.760 obviously

00:25:20.240 with darpa

00:25:21.320 etc

00:25:21.880 i mean

00:25:22.740 how concerning

00:25:23.460 including by

00:25:24.240 the way

00:25:24.460 you just

00:25:24.760 did a

00:25:25.100 documentary

00:25:25.480 with your

00:25:25.860 wife

00:25:26.240 on of

00:25:26.900 all things

00:25:27.600 uh four

00:25:28.540 letter word

00:25:29.100 for some

00:25:29.580 of your

00:25:29.820 friends

00:25:30.160 pbs

00:25:30.840 um

00:25:31.840 uh very

00:25:32.460 proud

00:25:32.900 pbs to

00:25:33.900 me

00:25:34.160 but on

00:25:34.880 journey to

00:25:35.420 america

00:25:35.820 on immigration

00:25:36.500 and so i'm

00:25:37.820 curious just

00:25:38.720 that tension

00:25:39.640 i get this

00:25:40.240 sort of

00:25:40.540 owning the

00:25:41.440 lib and

00:25:41.900 liberalism

00:25:42.640 more broadly

00:25:43.100 defined

00:25:43.560 but where

00:25:44.360 do you

00:25:44.720 are you

00:25:45.320 where are

00:25:46.420 you in

00:25:46.700 this sort

00:25:46.940 of

00:25:47.060 how

00:25:47.300 i think

00:25:48.760 i think

00:25:49.160 when everything

00:25:49.600 shakes out

00:25:50.360 let's start

00:25:52.360 with immigration

00:25:52.920 trump is

00:25:55.560 as pro

00:25:56.300 legal

00:25:57.040 immigration

00:25:57.640 as he

00:25:59.100 is anti

00:25:59.760 illegal

00:26:00.200 immigration

00:26:00.660 i mean

00:26:02.280 two of his

00:26:02.760 wives are

00:26:03.280 foreign born

00:26:03.960 yeah

00:26:04.820 his mother

00:26:05.540 came from

00:26:06.080 scotland

00:26:06.600 uh

00:26:07.660 you know

00:26:08.140 he's not

00:26:08.500 going to

00:26:08.740 jump up

00:26:09.100 and down

00:26:09.380 and he

00:26:09.900 has said

00:26:10.200 openly

00:26:10.560 he's come

00:26:11.280 up with

00:26:11.500 this idea

00:26:11.900 of this

00:26:12.240 five million

00:26:13.160 dollar you

00:26:14.060 avenue to

00:26:15.100 america

00:26:15.620 what happened

00:26:16.540 to that

00:26:16.940 well i

00:26:17.940 suspect it'll

00:26:18.520 be implemented

00:26:19.060 uh

00:26:19.740 he wants

00:26:20.120 the money

00:26:20.520 uh

00:26:21.180 i'm not

00:26:23.020 sure his

00:26:23.420 calculations

00:26:24.400 are right

00:26:24.960 yeah no

00:26:25.900 i was a

00:26:26.360 little generous

00:26:26.920 people show

00:26:28.080 up to

00:26:28.380 make it a

00:26:29.080 big deal

00:26:29.400 but it'll

00:26:29.660 be but

00:26:30.200 canada

00:26:30.600 other

00:26:30.840 countries

00:26:31.420 have had

00:26:32.180 very similar

00:26:32.840 smaller scale

00:26:33.960 projects

00:26:35.100 uh

00:26:35.920 there's no

00:26:38.360 question that

00:26:39.140 the

00:26:39.480 most

00:26:41.340 aggressive

00:26:42.020 pieces of

00:26:43.160 the trump

00:26:43.480 coalition

00:26:43.960 would do

00:26:45.120 things that

00:26:45.580 i would

00:26:45.820 regard as

00:26:46.400 destructive

00:26:47.920 there's also

00:26:49.160 no question

00:26:49.620 if you look

00:26:50.040 at for

00:26:50.700 example the

00:26:51.140 caliber of

00:26:51.580 the people

00:26:51.900 he's appointed

00:26:52.580 at the

00:26:53.520 center for

00:26:53.860 disease control

00:26:54.660 or the

00:26:55.640 national institute

00:26:56.220 of health

00:26:56.700 these are

00:26:57.660 very smart

00:26:58.540 very senior

00:26:59.140 people

00:26:59.580 uh

00:27:00.300 and

00:27:00.620 and i

00:27:02.520 just had a

00:27:02.980 conversation

00:27:03.400 with the

00:27:03.680 new head

00:27:03.940 of nih

00:27:04.300 who clearly

00:27:05.520 wants to

00:27:06.400 clean out

00:27:06.880 the underbrush

00:27:07.600 but and i

00:27:08.840 say this as

00:27:09.380 a guy who

00:27:09.920 while balancing

00:27:11.040 the federal

00:27:11.500 budget uh

00:27:12.780 for four years

00:27:13.500 in a row

00:27:13.760 the only time

00:27:14.480 in a hundred

00:27:14.800 years uh

00:27:15.880 we doubled

00:27:16.440 the size of

00:27:17.020 nih

00:27:17.280 while balancing

00:27:18.780 the budget

00:27:19.300 so deeply

00:27:20.860 in science

00:27:21.340 but i'll also

00:27:22.060 tell you

00:27:22.460 it's now a

00:27:23.240 big i mean

00:27:23.960 it kept

00:27:24.200 growing uh

00:27:25.580 so what we

00:27:26.420 doubled was

00:27:27.360 the baseline

00:27:27.920 from which it

00:27:28.420 just kept

00:27:28.800 growing and

00:27:29.700 it's a big

00:27:30.260 bureaucratic

00:27:30.860 system with a

00:27:31.920 lot of

00:27:32.240 baloney i

00:27:32.700 mean when

00:27:33.280 you're paying

00:27:33.800 65 percent

00:27:35.620 more than

00:27:36.880 the grant

00:27:37.400 so that

00:27:38.620 harvard or

00:27:39.300 stanford or

00:27:39.920 somebody can

00:27:40.760 pay for

00:27:41.180 overhead

00:27:41.740 there's a

00:27:42.860 lot you

00:27:43.220 can do

00:27:43.680 that doesn't

00:27:44.860 hurt genuine

00:27:45.660 reform you

00:27:46.540 also have a

00:27:47.040 big problem

00:27:47.480 which i don't

00:27:47.860 know how

00:27:48.120 they're going

00:27:48.340 to solve and

00:27:48.840 that is they've

00:27:49.900 gotten into this

00:27:50.540 rope-a-dope

00:27:51.080 system where

00:27:52.240 people will file

00:27:53.220 for a research

00:27:53.920 project not

00:27:55.340 reach the

00:27:55.880 conclusion because

00:27:57.580 they've already

00:27:58.060 filed for

00:27:58.700 continuing and

00:27:59.820 if they reach

00:28:00.320 the conclusion

00:28:00.940 they'd have to

00:28:01.820 go out and

00:28:02.140 find a whole

00:28:02.560 new topic

00:28:03.140 yeah that's

00:28:04.340 yeah a fair

00:28:05.260 amount of

00:28:05.940 slowing down

00:28:07.000 research by

00:28:08.120 bureaucratizing it

00:28:09.220 so i mean i'm

00:28:10.440 passionate about

00:28:11.060 this stuff i'll

00:28:11.720 give you one

00:28:12.040 other example

00:28:12.520 i am totally

00:28:13.780 committed to

00:28:14.340 space i have

00:28:15.480 been since uh

00:28:16.660 in 1981 i

00:28:18.520 introduced the

00:28:19.220 northwest ordinance

00:28:20.680 for the moon

00:28:21.220 saying that if

00:28:22.240 you got to a

00:28:22.780 certain population

00:28:23.540 you could apply

00:28:24.420 for statehood

00:28:25.040 which at that

00:28:25.820 time people

00:28:26.220 thought was

00:28:26.620 nuts now they

00:28:27.600 still think it's

00:28:28.120 nuts but not

00:28:28.580 quite as nuts

00:28:29.220 i remember you

00:28:29.980 in the debates

00:28:30.560 talking about

00:28:31.180 space and we

00:28:32.060 were wondering

00:28:32.700 what the you

00:28:33.500 know you were

00:28:34.040 on the edge

00:28:34.880 there so you

00:28:35.380 have been you

00:28:35.920 100 percent

00:28:37.160 consistent i'm

00:28:38.500 just glad that

00:28:39.000 elon came

00:28:39.480 along and

00:28:40.280 made it

00:28:40.640 doable uh

00:28:41.980 i mean i'll

00:28:42.580 give you an

00:28:42.820 example when

00:28:43.260 the starship

00:28:43.840 actually gets

00:28:44.580 settled down

00:28:45.100 and works

00:28:45.460 properly it

00:28:46.700 has 33

00:28:47.380 engines it

00:28:48.620 produces 2.3

00:28:50.100 times as much

00:28:50.940 thrust as the

00:28:52.020 saturn 5 the

00:28:53.240 rocket went to

00:28:53.960 the moon 2.3

00:28:55.300 times as much

00:28:55.960 so your choice

00:28:57.160 is to go with

00:28:57.760 the traditional

00:28:58.240 nasa spend an

00:28:59.740 amazing amount

00:29:00.300 of money and

00:29:01.120 maybe get two

00:29:01.820 people on the

00:29:02.360 surface of the

00:29:02.780 moon or this

00:29:04.160 thing will lift

00:29:04.920 100 people or

00:29:06.600 150 tons

00:29:08.040 so you

00:29:09.880 can you

00:29:10.260 can put 50

00:29:11.040 to 70

00:29:11.420 people on

00:29:11.880 the moon

00:29:12.200 in one

00:29:13.400 bite i mean

00:29:13.980 just boom

00:29:14.540 to your point

00:29:16.660 that requires

00:29:17.440 an nsf it

00:29:18.640 requires all

00:29:20.240 of the innovation

00:29:20.900 and entrepreneur

00:29:21.420 i mean it

00:29:21.880 requires research

00:29:23.240 institutions it

00:29:24.780 requires presumably

00:29:25.840 institutions of

00:29:27.060 higher learning as

00:29:27.880 well are you

00:29:28.340 concerned about

00:29:29.000 what's happening

00:29:29.920 in terms of

00:29:30.700 those partnerships

00:29:31.800 i mean just i

00:29:32.520 think about

00:29:32.940 sandia labs

00:29:33.760 lawrence livermore

00:29:34.460 labs i think

00:29:35.200 about all the

00:29:36.320 r&d that's

00:29:37.160 happening with

00:29:37.720 military and

00:29:38.620 obviously uh

00:29:39.820 with academia

00:29:40.660 i mean are you

00:29:41.380 concerned that

00:29:42.180 there's a

00:29:42.640 recklessness i

00:29:43.580 appreciate solving

00:29:44.540 for issues of

00:29:45.720 some abuse uh

00:29:47.360 or some

00:29:48.320 inefficiencies but

00:29:50.000 there seems to

00:29:50.540 be a blunt uh

00:29:52.420 approach

00:29:53.000 no first of all i

00:29:54.460 think there is and

00:29:55.060 as a historian i

00:29:56.600 would argue that

00:29:57.220 when you try to

00:29:58.580 make change on

00:29:59.320 this scale you're

00:30:01.380 going to have very

00:30:02.040 sloppy margins

00:30:03.000 that you you

00:30:04.460 you cannot move

00:30:05.920 slow enough to

00:30:07.600 be careful or

00:30:08.760 the old order

00:30:09.320 will surround you

00:30:10.200 and drown you

00:30:11.160 you you have you

00:30:12.980 have to be which

00:30:13.940 means you're going

00:30:14.400 to make mistakes

00:30:15.020 and you're going

00:30:15.400 to screw things

00:30:15.900 up you got to

00:30:16.760 go back and fix

00:30:17.400 them at the same

00:30:18.560 time i would say

00:30:19.440 uh i really i

00:30:21.260 worry about our

00:30:22.020 greatest universities

00:30:22.940 partially from i

00:30:25.180 suspect the

00:30:25.800 opposite of your

00:30:26.280 view which is

00:30:27.360 partially i think

00:30:28.160 they're so left

00:30:28.660 wing now that

00:30:29.640 they're virtually

00:30:30.080 totalitarian and

00:30:31.680 that they create

00:30:32.820 a group think

00:30:33.500 that is really

00:30:33.960 destructive and

00:30:35.220 yet at one point

00:30:37.020 just a generation

00:30:38.500 ago these were the

00:30:39.740 greatest centers of

00:30:40.660 learning on the

00:30:41.200 planet uh and

00:30:42.820 that does worry me

00:30:44.040 how do you how do

00:30:45.700 you keep the best

00:30:46.840 of harvard or the

00:30:47.660 best of mit or the

00:30:49.180 best of stanford or

00:30:50.240 berkeley uh without

00:30:52.020 well at the same

00:30:53.200 time taking head on

00:30:54.320 the kind of

00:30:55.340 ideological group

00:30:56.380 think that has

00:30:57.440 become uh literally

00:30:58.760 almost totalitarian in

00:31:00.520 its unwillingness

00:31:01.440 to have any

00:31:02.300 competition of

00:31:03.000 ideas and i think

00:31:04.720 that's a real

00:31:05.460 challenge and we

00:31:06.620 don't truth is we

00:31:07.720 don't have a good

00:31:08.300 answer no i mean

00:31:09.680 how do you square

00:31:10.600 that circle specifically

00:31:11.720 on this notion of the

00:31:12.840 journey to america and

00:31:14.580 i want to talk to you

00:31:15.280 about the timing of

00:31:16.200 that and by the way

00:31:17.300 congratulations 90

00:31:18.420 minute documentary on

00:31:19.400 pbs that's really a

00:31:20.800 love letter to uh

00:31:22.120 absorbing the best and

00:31:23.160 the brightest and who

00:31:23.960 we are as america in

00:31:24.860 the spirit of reagan

00:31:26.300 like you talked about

00:31:27.100 the life force of new

00:31:28.680 americans uh that

00:31:30.100 language evocative of

00:31:31.400 who we are but now

00:31:32.540 we're starting to talk

00:31:33.300 about 20 27 of the

00:31:35.000 student body as

00:31:36.340 international at

00:31:37.360 harvard and you're

00:31:38.120 basically saying now

00:31:39.080 you don't need to

00:31:40.200 apply and they're

00:31:41.020 opening up their arms

00:31:42.260 and their wallets in

00:31:43.760 places like china how

00:31:45.240 do we square that

00:31:46.160 no i think it's i think

00:31:48.120 it's very hard i'm

00:31:49.200 look i i i uh

00:31:50.920 i think that there are

00:31:54.160 two conflicting things

00:31:56.160 going on and they're

00:31:57.680 and we don't talk

00:31:58.820 about them very

00:31:59.220 honestly i think

00:32:00.740 what's happened in

00:32:01.620 much of europe where

00:32:03.540 the culture is

00:32:04.980 literally being

00:32:05.660 drowned uh should be

00:32:07.740 a much greater alarm

00:32:09.220 and it's something you

00:32:10.320 can't even talk about

00:32:11.240 but if you look at

00:32:12.940 uh places in britain or

00:32:15.540 france or sweden or

00:32:18.120 neighborhoods in

00:32:19.400 brussels uh you're

00:32:21.660 seeing basically the

00:32:22.740 end of western

00:32:23.260 civilization uh on so

00:32:25.400 on the one hand you

00:32:26.500 have to say are there

00:32:28.080 legitimate concerns

00:32:29.200 about who comes here

00:32:31.520 and why they come

00:32:32.340 here the other side

00:32:33.600 of that is with the

00:32:34.820 chinese a very great

00:32:36.760 deal of china's

00:32:38.060 technological advance

00:32:39.160 has come from

00:32:40.160 american universities

00:32:41.140 where chinese students

00:32:42.560 come learn a heck of a

00:32:44.080 lot and go back home

00:32:45.020 uh and if china is our

00:32:47.000 biggest competitor uh

00:32:49.260 which i think may turn

00:32:51.300 out to be exaggerated a

00:32:52.580 decade from now

00:32:53.380 uh nonetheless for

00:32:55.260 planning purposes they're

00:32:56.680 our biggest competitor

00:32:57.560 uh do you really want

00:32:59.340 caltech uh and mit to be

00:33:02.740 providing the best chinese

00:33:03.900 scientists in the world

00:33:05.020 so they can go back home

00:33:06.240 i mean those are those are

00:33:07.740 topics that deserve a lot

00:33:10.320 deeper and more

00:33:11.460 conversation uh and and i

00:33:13.800 think i'm perfectly happy

00:33:15.920 to say that there will be

00:33:17.600 pieces of the make america

00:33:21.500 great again movement that

00:33:23.200 are going to have to go

00:33:23.860 back and be fixed because

00:33:25.540 they're going to be

00:33:26.000 destructive some of them

00:33:27.360 are just plain going to be

00:33:28.040 wrong uh i mean i'm a

00:33:30.040 very big advocate for

00:33:31.400 science i wrote a piece

00:33:32.780 recently on why we should

00:33:34.400 not cut uh science funding

00:33:36.340 at nasa for example uh on

00:33:38.520 the one hand i'm totally in

00:33:39.940 favor of wiping out the

00:33:41.480 space launch system which is

00:33:43.240 stunningly expensive and has

00:33:45.020 accomplished nothing and by

00:33:46.720 the way you could probably pay

00:33:48.360 for a decade of nasa science

00:33:51.580 with the cost of the uh space

00:33:53.840 launch system does it's that

00:33:55.980 you know so i think there are

00:33:57.620 ways that there are good

00:33:58.780 things we should protect and

00:34:00.260 that's going to lead to

00:34:00.920 fights because you're going

00:34:02.140 to have some people who are

00:34:03.160 clumsy or sloppy or who

00:34:04.900 ideologically are pretty

00:34:06.580 cheerful about being ignorant

00:34:07.760 i mean

00:34:08.520 and i mean look you you you

00:34:12.060 talk about doge in the book

00:34:13.500 you write about it rather and

00:34:14.560 you but you write about it

00:34:15.760 very in laudatory terms but

00:34:17.340 you make the point you just

00:34:18.500 made as it relates to if

00:34:20.200 you're going to move fast

00:34:20.920 you're going to break some

00:34:21.600 things but this notion of

00:34:23.300 iteration and time to move

00:34:25.720 and in speed you you even

00:34:27.360 highlight old peter drucker

00:34:29.080 talking about uh excellence and

00:34:31.500 efficiency which i appreciated

00:34:33.060 uh but i mean what is your

00:34:34.960 over under just you know doge in

00:34:36.740 particular is it uh you know

00:34:39.840 are you satisfied with the two

00:34:42.420 trillion dollars in savings

00:34:43.720 turn out it'll turn out to have

00:34:46.040 at least two patterns one is

00:34:50.280 more noise than achievement

00:34:51.660 yeah uh and the other is that

00:34:55.000 it will have exposed for us a

00:34:57.920 number of things that were going

00:34:59.340 on that are kind of astonishing

00:35:00.600 uh and that you you know so you

00:35:03.200 on the one hand

00:35:04.100 condoms in gaza which you know

00:35:06.860 turn out not to be the case

00:35:08.340 what do you mean

00:35:09.380 well for example it's pretty

00:35:11.460 clear that i think at least 10

00:35:13.280 percent of the u.n refugee

00:35:14.620 workers in gaza

00:35:15.620 were pro-hamas

00:35:17.180 okay that's separate separate i'm

00:35:19.480 just i'm just i'm lamenting on

00:35:21.080 the sort of orwellian notion of

00:35:23.020 50 million dollars of condoms which

00:35:26.000 the president uh reminded me of in

00:35:28.240 the oval office which i told him

00:35:29.980 was not true

00:35:30.620 there's a good californian i'm sure

00:35:32.340 you fondly remember reagan

00:35:33.540 uh and there were i do i and by

00:35:36.640 the way mr speaker i'm in his

00:35:38.220 office every day as a point of

00:35:39.840 pride

00:35:40.200 that's right well that's right i

00:35:41.220 mean

00:35:41.400 right there and right there in the

00:35:42.840 governorship

00:35:43.260 yeah every once in a while reagan

00:35:45.800 would see something in the

00:35:46.700 newspaper

00:35:47.140 and it would click in his head

00:35:49.160 uh i would

00:35:50.320 would repeat it endlessly i see

00:35:52.360 where you're going

00:35:53.140 and so now look i there

00:35:55.800 there's a great um

00:35:57.780 uh real key is a german poet

00:35:59.900 once said if you drive away my

00:36:02.420 demons will my angels flee also

00:36:04.760 oh well the challenge with a

00:36:06.700 charismatic leader of trump's

00:36:08.080 power

00:36:08.400 is there's five or ten percent

00:36:10.980 where you go really

00:36:11.680 and then there's this other stuff

00:36:13.740 that is amazing and historic

00:36:15.120 and you may not be able to

00:36:17.420 separate the two

00:36:18.260 yeah or yeah i mean i i may have a

00:36:21.060 different i'm maybe 90 10 uh

00:36:23.160 of your 10 20

00:36:24.260 that's one of the reasons i wanted

00:36:28.980 to do the show with you i remember

00:36:30.320 when we talked about citizenville

00:36:32.860 yeah

00:36:33.460 and all the ideas you had

00:36:34.960 a decade ago

00:36:35.640 before you ran into the sacramento

00:36:37.160 bureaucracy

00:36:37.840 god bless

00:36:38.700 by the way i still tell people

00:36:42.080 that's a really worthwhile book

00:36:43.680 i appreciate you for saying that

00:36:45.560 by the way i think so much it's

00:36:47.160 interesting i i reflected on that

00:36:49.220 our conversations and a little bit

00:36:50.920 on that book as i was reading your

00:36:52.460 book i mean you

00:36:53.160 talk about you know governing not

00:36:55.960 just campaigning you talk about

00:36:57.560 issues around efficient and effective

00:36:59.840 government

00:37:00.300 and more novel and i think

00:37:02.380 what what's always interested me

00:37:04.380 about you

00:37:05.040 is your willingness to lean into the

00:37:07.000 future and talk about health care

00:37:08.700 differently than others as you did

00:37:10.680 again

00:37:11.080 uh here even highlighted my old friend

00:37:13.680 dean ornich in terms of some of his

00:37:15.620 work on wellness and prevention

00:37:16.980 these four p's

00:37:17.940 you talk about predictability

00:37:19.740 um and personalization in the health

00:37:22.460 care space

00:37:23.020 but you also take on other spaces

00:37:25.080 which i appreciate as well

00:37:26.340 like the old eisenhower frame

00:37:28.740 on the military industrial complex

00:37:31.180 and i'm curious in relationship to

00:37:32.880 the doge question

00:37:33.720 why do you think there's been so

00:37:35.480 little willingness

00:37:36.680 to enter into that space

00:37:38.460 even the the space launch

00:37:40.160 example you just gave

00:37:41.660 i think um

00:37:43.980 you know i had one fight

00:37:46.880 in the first bush's

00:37:48.340 trump's first term

00:37:49.840 um over huawei

00:37:52.660 and what we needed to do

00:37:54.440 to dramatically strengthen

00:37:56.140 american telecommunications

00:37:58.060 and it's the one fight that i clearly

00:38:00.240 decisively lost

00:38:01.660 and i lost it because

00:38:03.780 at&t was on the other side

00:38:05.680 and at&t is so big

00:38:08.480 contributes so much money

00:38:10.600 has so many lobbyists

00:38:12.580 buy so many tv ads

00:38:14.560 that you know

00:38:16.260 i just just ran over me

00:38:17.940 it was an exciting experience

00:38:19.500 but i felt like

00:38:21.240 a lot

00:38:21.760 i felt like the guy

00:38:22.600 in Tiananmen square

00:38:23.420 i mean the tank

00:38:24.280 didn't stop

00:38:24.920 so i start with that

00:38:26.940 i mean it is

00:38:28.040 i think the space launch system

00:38:30.400 is one of the best examples

00:38:32.560 of the sickness

00:38:34.140 of the old order

00:38:34.980 and and what eisenhower

00:38:36.400 did warn about

00:38:37.040 i mean people should go back

00:38:38.280 and read his farewell address

00:38:39.680 because he's very clear

00:38:41.060 and this guy had been

00:38:41.940 five-star general

00:38:43.240 commander of allied forces

00:38:44.820 in europe

00:38:45.320 as well as president

00:38:46.820 so he had pretty good knowledge

00:38:48.520 and he's saying correctly

00:38:50.960 in in order to build

00:38:53.800 a system big enough

00:38:55.060 to defeat

00:38:55.660 or contain the soviet empire

00:38:57.440 uh you have to turn over

00:39:00.200 so much money and power

00:39:01.860 to a bureaucracy

00:39:03.340 which will then hire

00:39:05.000 big corporations

00:39:06.240 that you're going to have

00:39:07.460 the permanent danger

00:39:08.380 that they grow together

00:39:10.140 uh into sort of a single organism

00:39:12.800 uh which then operates

00:39:14.760 for its own benefit

00:39:15.620 and that's an enormous problem

00:39:18.540 across the it's a problem

00:39:19.640 in health care too

00:39:20.400 i mean big health

00:39:21.700 in many ways

00:39:22.780 is as bad as big defense

00:39:24.120 uh and i'm working

00:39:26.140 on a paper right now

00:39:27.100 which will amuse you

00:39:28.020 when we finally comes out

00:39:29.100 uh uh talking about

00:39:31.260 trump time

00:39:32.220 uh and trump savings

00:39:33.800 uh and going back

00:39:35.380 to the uh

00:39:36.180 uh the skating rink

00:39:38.640 in new york

00:39:39.720 yeah city had

00:39:41.140 the the rink

00:39:42.120 had quit making ice

00:39:43.280 which makes it very hard

00:39:44.580 if you're a skating rink

00:39:45.440 and the city had

00:39:47.220 for six years

00:39:47.980 tried to fix it

00:39:49.180 had spent 13 million dollars

00:39:50.660 trump talks about this

00:39:51.860 in his first

00:39:52.740 in the book

00:39:53.340 uh the art of the deal

00:39:54.480 this is one of his

00:39:55.500 great successes

00:39:56.360 yeah

00:39:56.920 objectively

00:39:57.380 and he says you know

00:39:58.420 he's looking

00:39:58.680 his apartment

00:39:59.880 looks out over the rink

00:40:01.500 the woman rink

00:40:02.280 and so

00:40:03.200 he finally gets so pissed off

00:40:04.800 at six years

00:40:05.880 they can't make ice

00:40:07.200 and he challenges

00:40:08.980 the mayor publicly

00:40:09.800 and says

00:40:10.240 you give it to me

00:40:11.540 and i will fix it

00:40:13.300 in less than a year

00:40:15.600 for uh under three million

00:40:18.480 dollars

00:40:18.820 well he fixed it

00:40:20.900 in four months

00:40:21.680 and we came in

00:40:23.240 25 percent below budget

00:40:24.480 now they already spent

00:40:25.200 six and a half million

00:40:26.080 he came in 25 percent

00:40:28.460 below the three million

00:40:29.340 dollar budget

00:40:29.920 totally fixed

00:40:30.840 in four months

00:40:31.400 and his

00:40:32.320 in the book

00:40:33.000 he has this great line

00:40:33.740 where he says

00:40:34.100 they had this firm

00:40:35.880 in florida

00:40:36.540 that had won the contract

00:40:38.540 and didn't know

00:40:39.500 what they were doing

00:40:40.140 and so i said to myself

00:40:42.100 who builds

00:40:43.320 skating rinks

00:40:44.380 i thought

00:40:45.540 canadian

00:40:46.180 excuse me

00:40:50.780 so he goes to the

00:40:51.880 national hockey league

00:40:52.720 and says

00:40:54.040 who builds the skating rinks

00:40:55.480 and this is

00:40:56.200 firm in montreal

00:40:56.980 and they fly down

00:40:58.460 and they look at it

00:40:59.540 and they go

00:40:59.820 this is really embarrassing

00:41:01.200 this is so easy

00:41:02.500 to fix

00:41:02.920 you can't believe it

00:41:03.840 and when he finally

00:41:05.260 got it done

00:41:05.740 somebody said

00:41:06.100 what happened

00:41:06.500 he said

00:41:06.800 it wasn't magic

00:41:07.780 it was common sense

00:41:09.320 and management

00:41:10.040 well to the degree

00:41:12.460 that we could bring

00:41:13.320 common sense

00:41:14.020 and management

00:41:14.680 we would

00:41:15.940 i think you could get

00:41:17.160 better defense

00:41:17.980 for 25 percent less

00:41:21.400 than the current

00:41:22.580 defense budget

00:41:23.240 if you could clean out

00:41:24.780 all the bureaucracy

00:41:25.940 and all the cronyism

00:41:27.120 and all the bad contracts

00:41:28.740 i tell every audience

00:41:30.780 if you took the pentagon

00:41:33.260 and turned it into a triangle

00:41:34.600 and took the other two thirds

00:41:36.980 and turned it into a museum

00:41:37.920 you would get

00:41:39.580 you would get

00:41:40.120 a better defense system

00:41:41.560 overnight

00:41:41.900 and the reason is simple

00:41:43.680 you'll understand

00:41:44.580 this is a governor

00:41:45.240 of a state

00:41:45.600 with a huge bureaucracy

00:41:46.540 they built the pentagon

00:41:48.580 in 1943

00:41:49.380 so that 26,000 people

00:41:52.120 could manage

00:41:53.280 world war ii

00:41:54.080 with carbon paper

00:41:57.260 manual typewriters

00:41:58.700 and filing cabins

00:42:00.100 and in fact

00:42:02.140 marshals chief of staff

00:42:03.580 used to run drills

00:42:05.100 to see how fast

00:42:06.360 you could find paper

00:42:07.280 if you needed

00:42:08.800 a certain document

00:42:09.660 where is it

00:42:10.220 how do you get there

00:42:10.940 well everybody

00:42:12.900 in the pentagon now

00:42:13.560 has a smartphone

00:42:14.380 an ipad

00:42:15.640 a laptop computer

00:42:16.900 and i have never gotten

00:42:18.280 you might be able

00:42:19.060 to get somebody

00:42:19.480 to caltech

00:42:19.940 to figure this out

00:42:20.640 i've never been able

00:42:21.620 to get an exchange rate

00:42:22.640 that is

00:42:23.720 if you have one person

00:42:25.100 over here

00:42:25.420 with a carbon paper

00:42:26.420 distribution

00:42:27.760 and one person

00:42:28.940 over here

00:42:29.440 with a smartphone

00:42:30.560 or an ipad

00:42:31.240 or a computer

00:42:32.100 what's the relative

00:42:33.340 exchange rate

00:42:34.240 of information flow

00:42:35.160 my guess is

00:42:36.180 it's above a million

00:42:37.300 well guess what

00:42:39.400 you have the same

00:42:40.080 26,000 people

00:42:41.300 now since they're

00:42:43.980 not filing paper

00:42:44.960 and they're not

00:42:45.440 writing on carbon

00:42:46.260 what they're doing

00:42:47.460 is writing each other

00:42:48.500 to prove that

00:42:50.020 their job is important

00:42:50.980 so they can stay employed

00:42:52.360 so you screw up

00:42:53.980 the whole system

00:42:54.800 with person a

00:42:56.120 writing person b

00:42:57.040 who writes person c

00:42:58.040 who then writes person a

00:42:59.060 and they beat

00:43:00.900 these things to death

00:43:01.900 and exactly the way

00:43:03.620 new york city

00:43:04.140 was failing

00:43:04.660 with the ice rink

00:43:05.300 because you have

00:43:06.640 a bunch of bureaucrats

00:43:07.400 who write papers

00:43:08.060 that have no meaning

00:43:09.340 and i think

00:43:12.000 i helped found

00:43:12.780 the military reform

00:43:13.580 caucus in 81

00:43:14.440 i helped pass

00:43:16.300 the goldwater nickels

00:43:17.160 reform in 86

00:43:17.960 against every

00:43:19.560 active duty

00:43:20.480 senior officer

00:43:21.300 none of them

00:43:23.100 wanted it

00:43:23.880 nowadays i'll tell you

00:43:24.840 it's invaluable

00:43:25.380 we need a deep

00:43:27.180 thorough review

00:43:28.620 of all of our

00:43:29.680 national security

00:43:30.320 not just defense

00:43:31.120 all of it

00:43:31.960 if we're going to

00:43:33.240 compete in the

00:43:33.800 modern world

00:43:34.380 amy robach

00:43:38.240 and tj holmes here

00:43:39.240 diddy's former

00:43:40.360 protege

00:43:40.900 television personality

00:43:42.120 platinum selling

00:43:43.160 artist

00:43:43.560 danity king

00:43:44.500 alum

00:43:45.060 aubry o'day

00:43:46.240 joins us to

00:43:46.880 provide a unique

00:43:47.800 perspective on the

00:43:48.820 trial that has

00:43:49.740 captivated the

00:43:50.540 attention of the

00:43:51.440 nation

00:43:51.800 aubry o'day is

00:43:52.740 sitting next to us

00:43:53.400 here you are

00:43:54.800 as we sit here

00:43:55.740 right up the street

00:43:56.520 from where the

00:43:57.180 trial is taking place

00:43:58.400 some people saw

00:43:59.540 that you were

00:43:59.920 going to be in

00:44:00.660 new york and

00:44:01.760 they immediately

00:44:02.240 started jumping to

00:44:03.180 conclusions so can

00:44:04.140 you clear that up

00:44:05.060 first of all are you

00:44:06.340 here to testify

00:44:07.300 in the diddy trial

00:44:08.220 aubry will offer her

00:44:09.440 opinions and expertise

00:44:10.740 based on her

00:44:12.140 first-hand knowledge

00:44:13.200 from her days on

00:44:14.300 making the band as

00:44:15.140 she emerged as the

00:44:15.940 breakout star the

00:44:17.100 truth of the

00:44:17.720 situation would be

00:44:18.540 opposite of the

00:44:19.400 glitz and glamour

00:44:20.520 it wasn't all bad

00:44:22.000 but i don't know

00:44:23.620 that any of the

00:44:24.280 good was real

00:44:25.060 i went through

00:44:26.300 things there

00:44:27.760 listen to amy and

00:44:29.400 tj presents aubry

00:44:31.000 o'day covering the

00:44:32.220 diddy trial on the

00:44:33.140 iheart radio app

00:44:34.120 apple podcast or

00:44:35.560 wherever you get

00:44:36.480 your podcasts

00:44:37.220 have you ever

00:44:39.100 thought about going

00:44:40.400 boy sober i'm hope

00:44:42.280 woodard a comedian

00:44:43.540 creator and seeker of

00:44:45.820 male validation

00:44:46.660 to most people i'm the

00:44:50.240 girl behind voice

00:44:51.160 sober the movement

00:44:52.140 that exploded in

00:44:53.340 2024 voice sober is

00:44:55.560 about understanding

00:44:56.440 yourself outside of

00:44:57.860 sex and relationships

00:44:58.840 it's more than

00:45:00.540 personal it's political

00:45:02.160 it's societal and at

00:45:04.200 times it's far from

00:45:06.120 what i originally

00:45:07.320 intended it to be

00:45:08.640 these days i'm

00:45:10.480 interested in

00:45:11.360 expanding what it

00:45:12.460 means to be voice

00:45:13.260 sober to make it

00:45:14.440 customizable for

00:45:15.540 anyone who feels the

00:45:16.700 need to explore their

00:45:18.200 relationship to

00:45:19.420 relationship

00:45:20.120 relationships i'm

00:45:21.260 talking to a lot of

00:45:22.240 people who will help

00:45:23.440 us think about how we

00:45:24.820 love each other it's a

00:45:26.260 very very normal

00:45:27.160 experience to have

00:45:28.800 times where a

00:45:29.760 relationship is

00:45:30.460 prioritizing other

00:45:31.560 parts of that

00:45:32.080 relationship that are

00:45:33.180 being naked together

00:45:34.380 how we love our

00:45:35.340 family i've spent a

00:45:36.640 lifetime trying to get

00:45:37.960 my mother to love me

00:45:38.640 but the price is too

00:45:39.660 high and how we love

00:45:41.240 ourselves singleness is

00:45:42.680 not a waiting room you

00:45:44.000 are actually at the

00:45:45.540 party right now let me

00:45:46.640 hear it

00:45:47.040 listen to voice over on

00:45:49.620 the iheart radio app

00:45:50.780 apple podcasts or

00:45:52.320 wherever you get your

00:45:53.280 podcasts

00:45:53.820 a lot of times the big

00:45:59.040 economic forces we hear

00:46:00.480 about on the news show up

00:46:02.140 in our lives in small

00:46:03.640 ways

00:46:04.160 three or four days a

00:46:05.380 week i would buy two

00:46:06.560 cups of banana pudding but

00:46:08.580 the price has gone up so

00:46:10.020 now i only buy one

00:46:11.060 the demand curve in action

00:46:12.740 and that's just one of the

00:46:14.180 things we'll be covering

00:46:15.260 on everybody's business

00:46:16.560 from bloomberg business

00:46:17.580 week i'm max chavkin

00:46:19.220 and i'm stacy vanek

00:46:20.600 smith every friday we

00:46:22.220 will be diving into the

00:46:23.500 biggest stories in

00:46:24.420 business taking a look

00:46:25.560 at what's going on why

00:46:26.940 it matters and how it

00:46:28.200 shows up in our everyday

00:46:29.320 lives but guests like

00:46:31.000 business week editor brad

00:46:32.240 stone sports reporter

00:46:33.740 randall williams and

00:46:34.740 consumer spending expert

00:46:36.040 amanda mull will take

00:46:37.440 you inside the board

00:46:38.700 rooms the back rooms even

00:46:40.240 the signal chats that make

00:46:41.880 our economy tick hey i

00:46:43.520 want to learn about v chain

00:46:44.420 i want to buy some

00:46:45.260 blockchain or whatever it

00:46:46.540 is that they're doing

00:46:48.200 so listen to everybody's

00:46:50.140 business on the iheart

00:46:51.280 radio app apple podcast

00:46:52.960 or wherever you get your

00:46:54.260 podcasts the medal of

00:46:55.820 honor is the highest

00:46:56.620 military decoration in the

00:46:58.100 united states

00:46:58.820 recipients have done the

00:47:00.520 improbable showing immense

00:47:02.120 bravery and sacrifice in

00:47:03.780 the name of something much

00:47:05.080 bigger than themselves

00:47:06.120 this medal is for the men

00:47:08.400 who went down that day

00:47:10.380 it's for the families of

00:47:12.260 heroes who didn't make

00:47:13.160 it i'm jr martinez i'm a

00:47:15.520 u.s army veteran myself and

00:47:17.820 i'm honored to tell you the

00:47:19.160 stories of these heroes on

00:47:20.740 the new season of medal of

00:47:22.600 honor stories of courage from

00:47:24.540 pushkin industries and i

00:47:26.280 heart podcast from robert

00:47:28.520 blake the first black sailor

00:47:30.240 to be awarded the medal to

00:47:31.960 daniel daly one of only 19

00:47:34.040 people to have received the

00:47:35.600 medal of honor twice these are

00:47:37.920 stories about people who have

00:47:39.180 distinguished themselves by acts

00:47:40.900 of valor going above and beyond

00:47:43.360 the call of duty you'll hear

00:47:46.020 about what they did what it

00:47:47.960 meant and what their stories

00:47:49.640 tell us about the nature of

00:47:51.260 courage and sacrifice listen to

00:47:54.380 medal of honor on the iheart

00:47:55.660 radio app apple podcast or

00:47:57.900 wherever you get your podcast

00:47:59.280 what happens when we come face to

00:48:02.000 face with death my truck was

00:48:03.840 blown up by a 20 pound anti-tank

00:48:05.240 mine my parachute did not deploy i was

00:48:09.020 kidnapped by a drug cartel i just

00:48:11.920 remember everything getting dark

00:48:13.620 i'm dying when we step beyond the

00:48:17.460 edge of what we know to open our

00:48:19.640 consciousness to something more

00:48:21.580 than just what's in that western box

00:48:23.400 in return i clinically died the

00:48:26.540 heart stopped beating which i was

00:48:28.000 dead for 11.5 minutes my name is

00:48:30.240 dan bush my mission is simple to

00:48:32.260 find explore and share these stories

00:48:34.920 i'm not a victim i'm a survivor you're

00:48:37.420 strongest when you're the most

00:48:38.600 vulnerable to remind us what it

00:48:40.440 means to be alive not just that i was

00:48:42.160 the guy that cut his arm off but i'm

00:48:43.800 the guy who is smiling when he cut his

00:48:46.200 arm off alive again a podcast about

00:48:48.800 the fragility of life the strength of

00:48:50.880 the human spirit and what it means to

00:48:52.580 truly live listen to alive again on the

00:48:55.020 iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever

00:48:57.600 you listen to your favorite shows

00:48:59.000 it just seems of all things and you know

00:49:05.360 i appreciate the the skating rink because

00:49:07.760 it's a reminder of under promise over

00:49:09.860 deliver and we can talk about uh some of

00:49:12.360 those day one actions that trump may or

00:49:14.260 may not have succeeded with in a moment but

00:49:16.640 i'm curious as it relates to the issues

00:49:18.800 of the pentagon i mean trump's been bold

00:49:21.400 and he's provided a lot of space for doge

00:49:24.780 and certainly musk in the last you know

00:49:27.260 hundred days but but but the pentagon

00:49:29.640 does seem to be off limits i mean is

00:49:32.360 that no is that accurate i don't think

00:49:35.180 so i think i think they will presently be

00:49:38.800 as ruthless at the pentagon as they will

00:49:40.640 be anywhere else interesting f-35 comes

00:49:43.600 to mind huh what f-35 comes to mind

00:49:47.320 actually i've gotten real pushback on

00:49:49.240 that because i did you i was i was one

00:49:51.220 of the people who was really critical

00:49:52.280 yeah i've had three or four people who

00:49:54.380 i'm writing this paper and i was talking

00:49:56.900 about examples of cost overruns and i've

00:50:00.540 had three or four people who do not work

00:50:02.500 for lockheed aren't part of the system but

00:50:04.060 they're very smart write back and say to

00:50:06.320 me that is an inaccurate measurement that

00:50:09.180 you actually look at the plane they have

00:50:11.840 built it has no relationship to the

00:50:14.460 original contract it is vastly superior

00:50:17.400 and the price has dropped now to about a

00:50:20.340 reasonable price for a fifth generation

00:50:22.160 fighter i mean i was shocked i i took it

00:50:24.640 out of my paper because there were too

00:50:26.140 many people writing me back and saying

00:50:27.680 the other examples are terrific this

00:50:30.320 one's just dumb it's not technically

00:50:32.140 right so because i would a week ago i

00:50:35.760 would have said to you exactly that

00:50:37.040 yeah i know it's sort of it's it's we

00:50:39.600 throw that one around now i'm getting

00:50:41.420 beaten up by people who know a lot more

00:50:43.280 than i do saying it now though i have a

00:50:45.460 lot of good examples in my paper but

00:50:47.280 that ain't one of them that ain't one

00:50:48.720 of them interesting so all right so

00:50:50.860 you're you'll you'll stipulate we should

00:50:52.440 see some more i mean obviously uh the

00:50:54.780 secretary of defense has done some

00:50:56.500 personnel um moves etc but they seem

00:50:59.300 relatively modest compared to the overall

00:51:02.060 reforms that that you're advocating for

00:51:04.080 but you know one of the things i struck in

00:51:05.640 the book and again unsurprising is it's

00:51:08.800 been a consistent theme with you is sort

00:51:11.260 of anticipating the next war not

00:51:13.820 necessarily re-litigating and reflecting

00:51:16.280 exclusively on on the last one and the

00:51:19.020 issues of electronic electronic emf issues

00:51:21.700 that you've been sort of focused on issues

00:51:24.440 of space in relationship to defense

00:51:26.440 etc talk to me a little bit about what you

00:51:29.180 sort of posit or you at least promote in

00:51:31.460 this book as it relates to future security

00:51:33.420 and national offense i think there are three

00:51:35.800 big things the first is we need to quit

00:51:39.160 talking about war fighting and think

00:51:41.620 about war winning the fact that we have

00:51:44.780 great tactical capabilities and wonderfully

00:51:46.520 courageous people who go for 21 or 22

00:51:49.500 years in a place like afghanistan and

00:51:51.840 don't win should bother us because war

00:51:55.260 fighting is not the goal war winning is

00:51:57.480 the goal and as sun tzu wrote the group

00:51:59.680 from 500 bc the greatest of all generals

00:52:02.520 win bloodless victories so you know the

00:52:05.680 question is can america design a war

00:52:08.400 winning series of strategies rather than

00:52:10.640 war fighting strategies the second thing

00:52:12.940 i would say is you have to look at all

00:52:15.020 of national security you mentioned for

00:52:16.300 example the real threat of an

00:52:17.900 electromagnetic pulse attack and a very

00:52:20.140 close friend of mine bill fortune wrote a

00:52:22.460 remarkable novel called one second after

00:52:25.040 in which he shows you a village in north

00:52:28.240 carolina after electricity has been cut

00:52:30.540 off by an electromagnetic pulse i mean it

00:52:32.920 is a breathtaking book he was actually

00:52:34.860 invited to sandia you'd mentioned sandia

00:52:37.040 labs earlier he was invited there by the

00:52:39.100 physicists who were grateful that

00:52:41.080 somebody could explain what they worried

00:52:42.440 about and thought his book really was a

00:52:45.160 very accurate projection so you need to

00:52:47.640 think about not just the defense

00:52:48.700 department but the totality of national

00:52:51.040 security and then in the defense

00:52:52.880 department itself i've begun writing

00:52:55.480 something which only occurred to me by

00:52:58.100 watching ukraine we are seeing an

00:53:04.680 extraordinary change in the nature of

00:53:07.800 warfare and none of us understand it yet

00:53:10.560 i'm actually going to write a paper on

00:53:13.980 poitier crecy and agincourt which are the

00:53:17.020 three great battles in the middle ages

00:53:18.520 where the british annihilate the french

00:53:20.600 because the french cannot adjust they have to

00:53:24.240 be armored knights their culture requires it

00:53:26.880 and the british have developed a longbow

00:53:28.920 which slaughters armored knights and that

00:53:31.680 there are three so it takes place over a

00:53:33.700 century and in that entire period their

00:53:36.120 culture will not allow them to change

00:53:38.000 well we may have a similar problem we like

00:53:41.020 big expensive sophisticated long to develop

00:53:45.040 long to field systems you're now up against

00:53:48.040 as i said a while ago i think the numbers for

00:53:50.220 next year or for this year for ukraine are

00:53:53.520 going to be a million five hundred thousand drones

00:53:55.500 now most of them are small most of them are

00:53:58.960 simple uh most of our guys would look down their

00:54:02.040 nose at him but lord nelson who won the battle of

00:54:05.320 trafalgar uh set a one point numbers annihilate

00:54:08.240 and if you take the combination of artificial intelligence

00:54:12.060 robotics uh 3d printing new specialized kinds of chemistry

00:54:17.600 uh there's a there's a firm in your state actually called divergent

00:54:21.660 which is probably the most advanced factory on the planet

00:54:24.400 far ahead of anything in china and they use those techniques

00:54:27.960 to be able to shift what they make within a matter of hours

00:54:31.760 i mean it's astonishing to visit them and they're in la

00:54:35.240 uh not far from an in and out burger

00:54:38.200 uh and uh they uh i measure my trips to california

00:54:42.760 trust me a lot of people do have one of them too

00:54:45.100 they uh but anyway uh when you when you start thinking about

00:54:49.560 for example you don't just measure the chinese warship navy

00:54:53.680 all the chinese merchant ships have been designed now for 20 years

00:54:58.820 to be capable of launching drones

00:55:01.540 well if i have a ship and it happens to have 40 drones on it

00:55:05.360 is that an aircraft carrier or is that a merchant ship

00:55:08.220 and if i have 1800 of them does that count as part of my navy

00:55:14.680 or is that just an auxiliary group

00:55:17.180 and how many munitions does an american ship carry

00:55:21.320 and how many drones can it stop

00:55:23.720 if the other guy is able to send endless quantities

00:55:26.740 uh i'm just giving you a flavor

00:55:29.540 yeah i don't think we realize yet

00:55:31.480 you know i talked occasionally to the amazon people

00:55:33.960 about their use of robotics

00:55:35.520 which is part of the reason they've been able to be so amazing

00:55:38.680 um we have no notion yet

00:55:41.780 of how how fast the modern battlefield is going to become

00:55:45.560 and how complicated it's going to become

00:55:47.760 uh and our current bureaucracies and our current procurement system

00:55:52.740 makes it very difficult

00:55:54.540 to be agile enough

00:55:56.000 and frankly

00:55:56.580 excuse me

00:55:59.840 the dominance of these big corporations

00:56:03.380 the lockheeds the boeings what have you

00:56:05.500 raytheon

00:56:06.160 makes it very hard

00:56:08.320 to have the kind of entrepreneurial change

00:56:10.820 that you've seen in silicon valley for your entire lifetime

00:56:13.720 right

00:56:14.260 you know it's the small company

00:56:15.900 today that's the giant company in 20 years

00:56:18.580 and if you can't grow the small companies

00:56:21.380 because they can't get through the defense department's paperwork

00:56:24.180 then you're not ever going to have the rate and rhythm

00:56:27.640 of innovation that you need

00:56:29.380 no i appreciate it and that's something you highlight

00:56:32.000 sort of that framework of iteration

00:56:33.920 the sandbox and uh and procurement reform

00:56:36.640 which is so foundational

00:56:37.620 and it's it's really it's about you know

00:56:39.860 it's it's the incumbency racket

00:56:42.080 uh you talk about incumbency capitalism

00:56:44.740 uh versus innovation capitalism

00:56:47.060 and that sort of innovation capitalism

00:56:49.500 is is a big part of what we focus on

00:56:51.960 and obviously i think it's part of the secret sauce

00:56:53.580 to your point

00:56:54.080 uh of silicon valley

00:56:55.820 i'm curious just going back a little bit

00:56:58.180 and you know and bouncing around a little bit here

00:57:00.920 but again back to timing

00:57:02.300 uh because journey to america

00:57:04.280 you did it with your wife

00:57:05.200 and you guys have done how many documentaries now

00:57:07.340 you've done 44 books

00:57:08.360 we've done we've done 10 movies

00:57:10.160 and uh i've done 44 books

00:57:13.220 she and i've done

00:57:14.060 uh i think four or five of them together

00:57:17.060 she wrote uh six children's books

00:57:19.640 about ellis the elephant and american history

00:57:23.000 uh yeah well particularly interesting

00:57:25.380 because you know she's a music major

00:57:26.620 she was a piano major

00:57:27.640 plays the french horn

00:57:28.900 spent 20 years in a professional choir

00:57:30.600 at the basilica

00:57:31.880 uh in washington

00:57:33.300 uh so that's her natural background

00:57:35.680 uh then she was a clerk

00:57:37.120 in the agriculture committee

00:57:38.640 in the house

00:57:39.520 um

00:57:40.480 and she you know she works really hard

00:57:42.760 she works much harder than i do

00:57:43.920 and tune in for the rest of the conversation

00:57:46.360 with newt gingrich

00:57:47.420 amy robach and tj holmes here

00:57:52.660 diddy's former protege

00:57:54.320 television personality

00:57:55.580 danity king alum

00:57:56.980 aubry o'day

00:57:58.160 joins us to provide

00:57:59.100 a unique perspective

00:58:00.280 on the trial

00:58:01.060 that has captivated

00:58:02.320 the attention of the nation

00:58:03.720 it wasn't all bad

00:58:05.140 but i don't know

00:58:06.780 that any of the good was real

00:58:08.220 i went through things

00:58:10.020 there

00:58:10.900 listen to amy and tj presents

00:58:13.380 aubry o'day

00:58:14.600 covering the diddy trial

00:58:15.880 on the iheart radio app

00:58:17.260 apple podcast

00:58:18.260 or wherever you get your podcasts

00:58:20.360 have you ever thought

00:58:22.340 about going voiceover

00:58:24.000 i'm hope woodard

00:58:25.260 a comedian

00:58:26.160 creator

00:58:26.940 and seeker

00:58:28.160 of male validation

00:58:29.280 i'm also the girl

00:58:30.860 behind

00:58:31.480 voiceover

00:58:32.280 the movement

00:58:33.280 that exploded

00:58:34.420 in 2024

00:58:35.340 you might hear that term

00:58:37.520 and think it's about celibacy

00:58:38.940 but to me

00:58:40.100 voiceover is about

00:58:41.240 understanding yourself

00:58:42.440 outside of sex

00:58:43.480 and relationships

00:58:44.200 it's flexible

00:58:45.620 it's customizable

00:58:46.840 and it's a personal process

00:58:49.080 singleness is not a waiting room

00:58:50.820 you are actually

00:58:52.260 at the party right now

00:58:53.660 let me hear it

00:58:54.460 listen to voiceover

00:58:56.500 on the iheart radio app

00:58:57.920 apple podcasts

00:58:58.900 or wherever you get

00:59:00.280 your podcasts

00:59:01.040 a lot of times

00:59:03.560 big economic forces

00:59:05.040 show up in our lives

00:59:06.380 in small ways

00:59:07.660 four days a week

00:59:08.440 i would buy two

00:59:09.400 cups of banana pudding

00:59:10.780 but the price has gone up

00:59:12.380 so now i only buy one

00:59:13.620 small but important ways

00:59:16.160 from tech billionaires

00:59:17.580 to the bond market

00:59:18.480 to yeah

00:59:19.260 banana pudding

00:59:20.040 if it's happening in business

00:59:21.640 our new podcast is on it

00:59:23.100 i'm max chafkin

00:59:24.300 and i'm stacy vanek smith

00:59:26.040 so listen to everybody's business

00:59:28.060 on the iheart radio app

00:59:29.620 apple podcasts

00:59:30.720 or wherever you get your podcasts

00:59:32.520 the medal of honor

00:59:33.580 is the highest military decoration

00:59:35.660 in the united states

00:59:37.080 recipients have done

00:59:38.380 the improbable

00:59:39.280 the unexpected

00:59:40.100 showing immense bravery

00:59:41.940 and sacrifice

00:59:42.780 in the name of something

00:59:44.100 much bigger than themselves

00:59:45.640 this medal

00:59:46.680 is for the men

00:59:47.740 who went down

00:59:48.720 that day

00:59:49.560 on medal of honor

00:59:50.600 stories of courage

00:59:51.960 you'll hear about these heroes

00:59:53.740 and what their stories

00:59:54.900 tell us about

00:59:55.540 the nature

00:59:56.140 of bravery

00:59:56.960 listen to medal of honor

00:59:58.280 on the iheart radio app

00:59:59.740 apple podcasts

01:00:00.760 or wherever you get

01:00:01.760 your podcasts

01:00:02.440 what happens

01:00:03.700 when we come face to face

01:00:04.900 with death

01:00:05.440 my truck was blown up

01:00:06.800 by a 20 pound

01:00:07.400 anti-tank mine

01:00:08.180 my parachute did not deploy

01:00:09.980 i was kidnapped

01:00:11.120 by a drunker till

01:00:12.440 when we step beyond

01:00:14.340 the edge of what we know

01:00:15.480 i clinically died

01:00:16.760 the heart stopped beating

01:00:17.980 which i was dead

01:00:19.060 for 11.5 minutes

01:00:20.320 in return

01:00:21.040 it's a miracle

01:00:21.860 i was brought back

01:00:22.760 alive again

01:00:23.480 a podcast about

01:00:24.620 the strength

01:00:25.160 of the human spirit

01:00:25.980 listen to alive again

01:00:27.280 on the iheart radio app

01:00:28.480 apple podcasts

01:00:29.420 or wherever you listen

01:00:30.700 to your favorite shows

01:00:31.600 this is an iheart podcast

01:00:33.640 a contribution

01:00:37.400 you

01:00:37.700 you

01:00:38.600 you

01:00:40.280 you

01:00:40.760 you

01:00:41.680 you

01:00:42.640 you

01:00:44.840 you

01:00:46.980 you

01:00:48.960 you

01:00:51.040 you

01:00:52.900 you

01:00:53.000 you

01:00:57.260 you

This is Gavin Newsom - May 28, 2025

And, This is Speaker Newt Gingrich

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