This Past Weekend with Theo Von

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00:00:30.000 I have some new tour dates to tell you about.

00:00:32.500 I'll be in Boise, Idaho on June 28th at the Extra Mile Arena.

00:00:38.680 Idaho Falls, Idaho on June 29th at the Hero Arena.

00:00:43.400 And Salt Lake City, Utah on June 30th at the Maverick Center.

00:00:49.140 Pre-sale is active now for these dates with code RATKING.

00:00:54.800 General on-sale starts Wednesday, May 1st at 10 a.m. local time.

00:01:00.000 Today's guest is a financial advisor and a radio host.

00:01:04.300 You know him from The Ramsey Show, where he gives advice to callers who have questions about their finances.

00:01:11.100 He has a two-day live stream event coming up later this month, which we'll talk a little bit about.

00:01:15.980 I'm grateful to spend time with him today, Mr. Dave Ramsey.

00:01:21.760 Shine that light on me

00:01:26.080 I'll sit and tell you my stories

00:01:31.820 Shine on me

00:01:36.780 I can't believe you guys made my studio here, Dave.

00:01:52.340 We just want you to be home and come back again.

00:01:55.300 Well, yeah, I'll stay.

00:01:56.680 Come back now.

00:01:58.320 Anytime.

00:01:59.080 I'll stay, man.

00:01:59.980 Apparently, it's no big deal.

00:02:00.940 I didn't know you guys had an Airbnb.

00:02:02.360 You guys were running Airbnbs here.

00:02:05.220 Yeah, we totally replicated my studio here in your Ramsey.

00:02:10.840 Is this a campus, pretty much?

00:02:12.360 Yeah, I guess that's what we call it.

00:02:13.600 Yeah.

00:02:14.220 And is it so you have investment, like what's on the campus?

00:02:18.640 Because this is, it's beautiful.

00:02:20.280 Well, thank you.

00:02:21.080 Thank you.

00:02:21.480 We've got two office buildings and, of course, the main lobby area where we broadcast the shows on the glass.

00:02:26.800 So the area for the public to come in and hang out while we're doing the shows.

00:02:30.320 And then we've got a 2,500-seat auditorium up on the hill up there that we do events in.

00:02:35.900 Wow.

00:02:36.320 The event center.

00:02:37.160 So it's been quite an adventure.

00:02:40.020 Like what type of events will you do up there?

00:02:42.060 Well, we do our Ramsey events.

00:02:44.680 I mean, we've got, number one, we've got 1,100 team members.

00:02:46.940 So we do staff meeting up there and devotional on Wednesday up there.

00:02:51.600 And then, but we'll do weekend-long events.

00:02:54.340 We've got a money and marriage event with Rachel Cruz, my daughter, and Dr. John Deloney,

00:02:58.320 two of our Ramsey personalities in the fall.

00:03:00.360 It'll be mammoth.

00:03:01.380 We'll have it sold out here in a couple of weeks for a total money makeover weekend.

00:03:05.240 So it's public coming in for public events to learn something that we're doing usually around the money subject

00:03:10.820 or the leadership subject.

00:03:11.820 We use it for our entree leadership stuff.

00:03:13.920 So it stays pretty busy.

00:03:16.020 Yeah, it's remarkable.

00:03:17.860 Dave Ramsey, man.

00:03:18.880 Yeah, thanks so much, man.

00:03:20.200 So you, so just for a lot of our viewers will know you, but some who wouldn't.

00:03:24.640 So you started out in finance.

00:03:26.520 Like how did you get in?

00:03:27.420 Like what made you care about money out of the gate?

00:03:29.340 Like did you have a, did you guys have allowance issues in the home?

00:03:33.600 Yeah, we did.

00:03:34.620 You did?

00:03:34.940 Yeah, we were not on allowance.

00:03:36.380 We were on commission.

00:03:37.200 Work, get paid.

00:03:37.960 Don't work, don't get paid.

00:03:39.680 So yeah, I grew up in a blue collar neighborhood.

00:03:42.640 So daddy believed in work, like real work.

00:03:46.640 Like I was 12 years old and I came in and said, I need some money to go to the quick sack and get an IC.

00:03:50.900 And he said, no, you need a job.

00:03:53.640 I said, what could you do?

00:03:54.840 And I said, well, I guess I could cut grass.

00:03:56.440 And he took me down here on Nolensville road and printed up 500 business cards that said, Dave's lawns.

00:04:02.680 Go knock on the closest 50 doors and ask the opportunity to provide their lawn care needs.

00:04:08.220 So at 12, I ended up with 27 yards to cut.

00:04:11.420 So I think they call that child abuse now.

00:04:13.300 Yeah, look, yeah.

00:04:14.600 Well, yeah, I think if you have, if you force a kid to get a job nowadays, I think protective services will come and get you.

00:04:19.640 That's exactly right.

00:04:20.480 You know, it's pretty, sometimes it can be like that.

00:04:22.440 It can be kind of alarming.

00:04:23.560 There wasn't a protective service that would have protected them from my parents.

00:04:26.720 But yeah, so anyway, we grew up doing that.

00:04:30.140 And then I started buying and selling real estate in my 20s and got rich starting from nothing.

00:04:36.000 And I had, at least where I came from, I mean, I had a million dollar net worth and I was making $20,000 a month in 1983.

00:04:42.960 Oh, yeah.

00:04:43.680 But then.

00:04:44.580 That's rich.

00:04:45.100 Where were you driving?

00:04:46.240 A Jag.

00:04:47.220 That's what I always, because none of my friends could spell Jaguar.

00:04:49.480 So I needed a Jaguar, you know, so.

00:04:52.440 And, but I'd done stupid stuff and too much debt and the bank got sold, called our notes and spent the next three years of our life losing everything.

00:05:00.380 And that's what made me care about money, to answer your question.

00:05:04.500 Wow, because, yeah, because if you go out, if you go to a high pretty early, that's wild.

00:05:08.500 Yeah.

00:05:08.840 So did you think at that point you thought, oh, this is it, life's just going to be a.

00:05:12.740 Yeah, I thought I had it.

00:05:13.700 I thought I had it all dialed in and I had nothing dialed in.

00:05:17.080 Dang.

00:05:17.460 I was stupid on steroids.

00:05:18.900 Yeah.

00:05:19.380 And so we, yeah, with a brand new baby and a toddler and a marriage hanging on by a thread, we got the opportunity to start again in 1988, September 23rd.

00:05:30.840 Well, you remember it like that.

00:05:32.800 Yeah.

00:05:33.020 Well, I mean, that's the day we filed bankruptcy.

00:05:34.440 That's a, that's like, that's hell day, you know.

00:05:37.700 Do you have to go to the bank to file it or how do you do it?

00:05:40.120 No, it's a federal court.

00:05:41.820 It's a nice little procedure that you go through that's pretty intimidating.

00:05:46.680 And what do you, were you still like, was your dad still like a mentor at that point for business or anything?

00:05:52.340 Was that like.

00:05:52.820 No, no, they had, they had moved away by then.

00:05:55.080 And I had guys around here that were, that were family friends and stuff that we'd grown up with.

00:06:00.240 But, um, but I had started, um, I had started a faith journey.

00:06:05.380 I'd met God.

00:06:06.120 And so as an adult, cause I was pretty much a wild character in my youth.

00:06:10.460 And, um, so, uh, I started finding out that the Bible said something about money and then I started talking to old rich people.

00:06:18.880 And both of these things said, you know, just common sense is live on less than you make, have a plan, get out of debt.

00:06:26.720 And, you know, I've got all these degrees and letters and licenses and crap after my name that says I'm supposed to know something about money, but I was broke.

00:06:33.480 And so I need a new set of information.

00:06:35.540 So I found common sense and started using it.

00:06:37.720 And then people started asking us, okay, how did you turn your life around after all that garbage?

00:06:43.300 And this is what we did.

00:06:44.740 And they went, can we do it?

00:06:46.000 I'm like, yeah.

00:06:46.600 And we started showing people.

00:06:47.620 And then, you know, 35 years later, here we are showing people millions of them.

00:06:52.960 Yeah, no, it's unbelievable.

00:06:53.880 I mean, everybody knows Dave Ramsey and everybody's had, you know, has used you for financial guidance and stuff over the years or, um, or gone to you with certain questions.

00:07:03.840 I know you guys take so many questions on your show.

00:07:05.480 And with that turnaround moment, was there like, did it lead you to be like, I need more than just believing that finances are going to take care of me or like?

00:07:15.080 Yeah, I think that's probably part of the, part of the journey there.

00:07:17.640 I mean, somebody said, how'd you bounce back?

00:07:19.760 And I'm like, dude, when you fall that far, you don't really bounce.

00:07:22.240 It's splat.

00:07:23.660 So, you know, we hit, we hit, we hit, we sat around, whined and moaned and blamed everybody else for about a year and, you know, um, figured out finally it wasn't everybody else's fault.

00:07:33.660 It was my fault.

00:07:34.380 I caused it.

00:07:35.000 I'm the idiot.

00:07:35.580 Signed up for the trip and got to take it.

00:07:37.220 So I had to, you know, I had to course correct and adjust.

00:07:39.920 Um, and so, yeah, I, I, I think our, our faith, our new faith at that point, it was very young and tender and not a lot of knowledge or anything.

00:07:48.960 But anyway, we're, we're just trying to figure out how do you navigate with two little babies and sitting here broke.

00:07:54.120 And, you know, my wife's from the hills of East Tennessee, frying pan throwing, there's an Olympic event.

00:07:58.800 You know what I mean?

00:07:59.180 It's like, it's a hillbilly woman.

00:08:00.940 So it was, it was, it was rough.

00:08:02.800 And so we about killed each other and, uh, I think she would have left, but she didn't have a car.

00:08:07.500 So, um, but yeah, the, uh, so yeah, I mean, that's the stuff that we did.

00:08:11.760 And, but again, gradually we just sat down with the yellow pad and said, okay, here's what we have coming in.

00:08:16.520 We can't spend more than that.

00:08:18.540 And we're always going to give some, we're always going to save some and we're going to feed ourselves.

00:08:23.220 And then what do we do next?

00:08:24.540 And then the next week and then the next week.

00:08:26.140 And okay, now we got to get a little bit better and started gradually getting our income back up.

00:08:31.880 And, um, it was, it was not a bounce back.

00:08:34.960 It was years.

00:08:35.660 It feels like, but then, you know, it, uh, the thing about this stuff, this common sense thing, it's not a microwave.

00:08:42.440 It's a crock pot.

00:08:43.540 Yeah.

00:08:44.020 It cooks up good, but it takes a while.

00:08:46.380 It takes a long while.

00:08:47.760 Yeah.

00:08:48.080 And then sometimes you realize you look in the thing and you're like, I don't even have this thing plugged in either.

00:08:51.800 There's that too.

00:08:53.660 Yeah.

00:08:54.020 There's that problem.

00:08:54.840 You're just sitting there and watching a bowl of cold meat water for eight hours.

00:08:58.880 So sometimes.

00:08:59.700 Sounds like it's from experience, man.

00:09:01.600 That's a.

00:09:02.200 Might have just happened.

00:09:03.100 Yeah.

00:09:03.260 I've been through some things.

00:09:04.240 Yeah.

00:09:04.700 Well, if you don't have a wife, you have a crock pot.

00:09:07.940 This is true.

00:09:09.000 I mean, it's definitely, and it's a sad day for a man when you realize you're like, oh, damn, this is, you know, when you go in to get your crock pot, you know.

00:09:17.980 So that's, that's signing up for it right there.

00:09:20.880 It is really.

00:09:22.480 And you name or some people name it after a woman and I'm like, well, this is getting a little crazy.

00:09:26.820 I feel like, but, um, when you look at like, yeah, like when I think back on jobs that I had, like I was, you know, I sold what I used to sell hamsters outside of, uh, raves.

00:09:37.920 When I was young, I've sold, I worked in dairy, I sold, um, Mexican food door to door.

00:09:44.540 I used to clean out wishing wells in our town.

00:09:46.880 We had a plethora of wells in our parish.

00:09:50.140 Um, what else?

00:09:51.980 Collecting cans and taking them over to the scales.

00:09:54.660 I sold, uh, um, Italian or semi-Italian food.

00:10:00.060 Um, just all types of things.

00:10:02.320 And, and I try to offer suggestions to like people that were like me growing up, like how do you find a job that could start to change?

00:10:11.660 Like if you don't have much and I often go to like pressure washing, that's what I'll tell people.

00:10:17.960 You buy a pressure wash, you can get a pretty good one for about 600 bucks and then you can start a business.

00:10:22.860 You can make your Dave's lawn care cards and next, you know, two weeks later, you're a dang business owner.

00:10:28.580 You know, are there suggestions like you have like that for people that are like, you know, like, and it can be a first job even like, what do I start?

00:10:36.600 I mean, lawn care is a great one.

00:10:38.400 Yeah.

00:10:38.800 I mean, it's amazing to me what people will pay you to do if you're just willing to go do it and you show up on time.

00:10:45.380 Um, and then I think the piece that goes with that is, okay, you, you don't want to start pressure washing and go, Hey, I want to be 63 years old, which is what I am and still be pressure washing.

00:10:55.540 And that's not a plan, but to get you through this week, you can do a battle.

00:10:59.100 You can do a lot of pressure washing.

00:11:00.220 You're right.

00:11:00.680 That you can turn into a car deal, detail company and then turn it into something else and then sell that and do something else.

00:11:05.860 And what I figured out was these wealthy people, um, they, uh, they don't think, thank God it's Friday.

00:11:13.420 Oh God, it's Monday.

00:11:15.200 They're not living for the weekend, right?

00:11:17.340 Yeah.

00:11:17.520 They're, they're, um, you know, every move they make is a step towards where I want to be in 10 years where I want to, who I want to become.

00:11:25.940 And so, okay, I might be pressure washing so I can get the money to go to code school and pay 10,000 bucks and go to code school.

00:11:32.900 Oh, then you can make 150 a year coding.

00:11:35.380 Right.

00:11:35.880 And so you, what's the step, what's the, what's the method to get there?

00:11:39.600 What's the path to get there?

00:11:40.840 And so the problem I think sometimes is if you take a, feel like you're taking a job like that and I've done all that, not the exact same thing, but I've done a bunch of crappy jobs too, uh, and entrepreneurial things.

00:11:50.920 And, you know, I buy an old car, a repo lot and come home, fix it up, put it back on the market.

00:11:55.740 And back in those days, there were classified ads in the newspaper.

00:11:58.880 Oh yeah.

00:11:59.340 And so we'd sell, turn around, sell the car and, or buy a bunch of junk at some auction.

00:12:04.180 I was there by the house, but I buy half the estate and then put it in, turn into a garage sale next week.

00:12:08.500 Oh yeah.

00:12:08.780 You got a damn Pontiac full of candelabras or something.

00:12:11.580 That's it, man.

00:12:12.060 You get some, you get some deals on stuff.

00:12:14.580 And so it was a lot of fun.

00:12:15.500 I was horse trading, we called it growing up, but no horses involved, but there was, you know, somebody knew how to buy something and flip it over.

00:12:21.100 Or go to the police auction.

00:12:22.420 That was always a big thing.

00:12:23.140 Yeah, that's a good, that's a lot of fun.

00:12:24.480 There's some weird stuff there, man.

00:12:26.160 Is there?

00:12:26.620 But yeah.

00:12:27.240 And the, uh, all that stuff.

00:12:29.300 And so, but it needs to be that that's not where you're staying.

00:12:34.460 It's a path of where you're going.

00:12:37.100 And, you know, that changes everything.

00:12:38.780 It's like, you know, even your, you know, this meteoric, fabulous, famous career that you've done.

00:12:44.540 I mean, you're just, man, amazing.

00:12:46.900 Congratulations.

00:12:47.820 And, uh, but I mean, there's a lot of bad comedy clubs in the lineup.

00:12:55.020 Oh, yeah.

00:12:55.700 Before you, with wrong people in the audience before you get to be the Theo Vaughn of today.

00:13:02.520 You know, there's a price to be paid to win.

00:13:04.840 You don't, you don't win, you know, you're an overnight success.

00:13:08.860 Yeah.

00:13:09.020 I worked my butt off for 30 years to be an overnight success.

00:13:11.720 You've worked your butt off for a decade plus to be an overnight success.

00:13:14.840 Yeah.

00:13:15.440 And just cause somebody found you on Netflix last week, that don't mean you just started

00:13:18.560 on that.

00:13:19.000 Right.

00:13:19.480 I don't know how it happened.

00:13:20.620 Right.

00:13:20.960 Yeah.

00:13:21.120 I mean, even when I think back, like I used to get all these comments, I would get all

00:13:24.640 the email cards and go before the shows and put them on all the tables so I could get

00:13:28.680 back in touch with people.

00:13:29.840 So I would buy like the CD or DVD burner and burn a DVD and then sell it after the show.

00:13:36.420 I'd burn it like, and I remember when I got a three disc burner, so I could burn three

00:13:41.180 at a time.

00:13:42.180 Wow.

00:13:43.000 And what'd those sell for, man?

00:13:44.260 I had, uh, they were probably 300 bucks, 400 bucks.

00:13:48.120 Wow.

00:13:48.820 Well, you could get that little stack.

00:13:49.820 No, I'm not talking about the burner.

00:13:50.780 What were you selling the CDs for?

00:13:51.900 Oh, the CDs for probably 10, but I'd take eight.

00:13:57.180 And volume discount, too.

00:13:58.480 If you want 10 of them to give for Christmas presents, I'll set you up.

00:14:02.080 Oh, I sold one to a lady one time.

00:14:03.820 This was in Mishawaka, Indiana.

00:14:05.340 She bought one.

00:14:06.720 She drove three hours home.

00:14:07.720 She said it didn't work, and she drove back the next day to come and change it all.

00:14:11.460 Like, it's just a dang $8.

00:14:13.300 Yeah.

00:14:13.600 She spent more in gas, but I guess it was just the point of making sure she got what

00:14:18.460 she paid for, which I understand.

00:14:20.260 But yeah, when I think about all the different things or missing certain like events in people's

00:14:25.240 lives or something to work, like, sometimes I wish I'd have had a little bit better balance.

00:14:31.900 But also liked working.

00:14:34.460 You know, I think I really liked it.

00:14:36.500 But yeah, I don't think it's as easy as having, like, things evolve, though, too.

00:14:42.220 Like, one thing I'm thinking, say, if you start a pressure washing, right?

00:14:45.660 You're going to start to learn how to do business.

00:14:48.140 That's something you don't realize you're going to learn by starting a business sometimes

00:14:51.400 is that you're going to learn how to do business.

00:14:53.540 And next thing you know, you might have an employee.

00:14:56.400 And then you're like, oh, wow, now I'm an employer.

00:14:59.140 I've never been an employer.

00:15:00.440 What's that like?

00:15:01.020 And you just learn, like, you'll do taxes and business that you'll file for LLC.

00:15:05.480 You'll do all these things.

00:15:06.520 And then you're just building up knowledge.

00:15:08.520 And then part of you, or for me, I notice, will start to bloom a little bit and be like, well, now what else do I want to do?

00:15:17.000 Because you've seen one thing that you tried and started with, you've seen it work or not work even.

00:15:22.280 You've learned that, hey, it didn't work out.

00:15:25.140 But yeah, the more, like, kind of steps you take into doing business, the more that you become somebody who walks like a business guy in some ways.

00:15:35.220 Well, you change your identity.

00:15:37.060 You change who you are.

00:15:37.780 I mean, I'm not the little redneck hillbilly kid, hell raisin, that I was when I was in high school.

00:15:42.860 I got a lot less hair, for one thing.

00:15:44.320 But I'm also not that guy anymore.

00:15:46.340 For that matter, I've been married 43 years.

00:15:47.940 My wife's not married the same guy she married 43 years ago.

00:15:50.460 Thank God, because he wasn't much.

00:15:51.980 Yeah.

00:15:53.680 What kind of hair do you have?

00:15:54.900 Something good?

00:15:56.500 Not as good as yours.

00:15:57.640 Yeah.

00:15:57.920 I never got that.

00:15:58.620 But I had that 70s thing going with the little feathers on the side.

00:16:02.200 You remember those?

00:16:02.740 Yeah.

00:16:03.040 You don't remember them, but you've seen pictures.

00:16:04.500 Oh, yeah.

00:16:05.100 The problem with the part down the middle is the part gets wide if you're not careful.

00:16:08.460 Yeah, yeah.

00:16:10.440 Dude, what would you say to somebody who's going into business with a friend?

00:16:14.820 That's one thing I think about a lot of times.

00:16:16.360 What are things like a partnership with a friend, right?

00:16:18.720 Or starting a partnership with just a new business person.

00:16:21.560 It could even be a spouse.

00:16:22.940 What are pitfalls that people can look out for in advance of that kind of stuff?

00:16:28.340 Well, I mean, the biggest thing we run into, we coach about 10,000 businesses with the Entree Leadership brand, small businesses.

00:16:35.620 And they're anywhere from 500 to 200 team member size.

00:16:39.140 And so what I tell those guys, and I'll be speaking to them, you know, we do an event with about 3,000 of them once a year.

00:16:45.520 I'll be speaking to them in the next couple weeks here.

00:16:47.760 And so one of the things we tell them is really your beer drinking buddy and you sitting around talking about opening a business is a bad idea.

00:16:55.960 Yeah, you know, one of y'all needs to open it and the other one needs to work there.

00:16:59.800 And you can pay him out of the profits if you want.

00:17:01.620 You can be generous.

00:17:02.920 But somebody, anything with two heads is a monster.

00:17:05.680 And the only ship on sale is a partnership.

00:17:07.520 So generally speaking, don't do a partnership, generally.

00:17:10.380 Now, if you're going to have friends work on your team, which, I mean, I got a bunch of them.

00:17:13.820 A bunch of my team is friends.

00:17:15.280 And they either became friends while they're here or they were friends and then they came here.

00:17:19.320 I've got family in the building.

00:17:21.200 My kids work here in their 30s.

00:17:23.000 And so how do you navigate that?

00:17:26.620 Well, we had to learn from a family business perspective, and it works for friends as well, to separate the hat that we wear.

00:17:35.620 And so my hat that I wear with my buddy, you know, it's friend.

00:17:39.960 And, you know, we're having a cigar together or playing golf or we're doing whatever it says friend on it.

00:17:45.420 Fantasy football, yeah.

00:17:46.580 Yeah, whatever.

00:17:47.180 And so but when we're at work, my hat says CEO.

00:17:51.600 Right.

00:17:52.000 And his says, you know, technology or whatever.

00:17:55.980 And so you do your job.

00:17:57.980 I'll do my job.

00:17:59.820 And I'm going to treat you like I would treat the other team members because I treat them all nice and good and with dignity.

00:18:06.840 I don't scream because of people.

00:18:08.420 So, I mean, we treat them right.

00:18:10.360 And you're going to treat me with the same respect that you would if you worked in a place where the CEO walked in the room.

00:18:17.180 Not that you bow or something like that, but you don't.

00:18:19.260 Yeah.

00:18:19.500 You don't roll your eyes and go, you know, use friend talk at your CEO.

00:18:23.980 Yeah.

00:18:24.260 And so you can't run up and tickle them or whatever.

00:18:27.260 Well, that's strange.

00:18:29.640 But, yeah.

00:18:29.840 But the idea being that, like, my kids, you know, my daughter, Rachel Cruz, is a huge personality, three, four number one bestsellers and, you know, speaks all over America.

00:18:43.340 It's constantly on the network TV and stuff.

00:18:45.480 And we've got eight of those people that are personalities that do different things.

00:18:50.320 And so she gets paid, not as my daughter, but based on the work that she does there.

00:18:57.040 And then when I'm, you know, she's got three of my grandkids.

00:19:01.400 So when I got Papa Dave hat on when I'm with the grandbabies at Thanksgiving dinner.

00:19:05.560 But when we're here, I'm dealing with her.

00:19:08.500 Everybody in the room knows she's my daughter.

00:19:10.440 But I treat her the same way I would treat Dr. John Deloney or Ken Coleman, the other personalities as well.

00:19:16.040 So you just got to separate that and wear different hats.

00:19:18.640 So when you're wearing your friend hat, then act that way.

00:19:21.620 And, you know, when you're at work, you're wearing this hat.

00:19:24.040 And, you know, you've got to perform.

00:19:25.460 I've got to perform.

00:19:26.940 And so family doesn't get a pass and a friend doesn't get a pass for incompetence or, you know, just I'm not going to come to work today.

00:19:34.500 No, that's not how we were all coming to work today.

00:19:37.540 Yeah.

00:19:37.900 If you are going into business with a friend, what are something that people can, like, what discussions need to be had up front?

00:19:43.860 Say you're going into a partnership with a buddy, you know, so you don't run into lawsuits down the line.

00:19:49.740 Well, you may.

00:19:50.920 Nothing you do keeps you from, I mean, people can file a lawsuit for anything, even if it's not true.

00:19:57.040 They can just make up something.

00:19:58.440 So it's, and they do.

00:20:00.360 We've run into that.

00:20:01.200 But what we tell folks, if you're going to do a partnership, make sure you've got really good documentation.

00:20:06.580 And the best thing you can do is talk through and have in the document all the bad things that can happen.

00:20:13.180 And a lot of them are Ds.

00:20:15.300 Divorce.

00:20:16.500 Drug use.

00:20:18.420 Disinterest.

00:20:18.900 I don't want to work anymore.

00:20:21.300 Disability.

00:20:22.540 Death.

00:20:23.700 You know, what happens when these things happen?

00:20:26.340 So, because you may be just great working with your buddy and he owns half the company, but his wife's cuckoo and he dies?

00:20:35.280 Now you're partnered with cuckoo.

00:20:37.180 Yeah.

00:20:37.520 You know, that's a bad plan.

00:20:39.080 So you need to have this laid out.

00:20:40.700 What's going to happen in these situations?

00:20:42.680 I mean, you know, I've had, I had a guy working here that was one of, one of our top leaders many years ago, got MS.

00:20:51.640 He's driving home, six miles home, got lost on the way home.

00:20:55.320 Brain lesions.

00:20:56.120 And so he obviously became disabled.

00:20:59.360 So what happens to that guy?

00:21:02.300 He was one of my top guys.

00:21:03.520 He was, you know, he's paid off the bottom line like he was a partner and just a wonderful man.

00:21:08.440 He's passed away now.

00:21:09.360 And, you know, how do you treat him, how you treat his family in the worst case scenario and how you're going to take care of them?

00:21:17.140 And because you want to take care of your buddy.

00:21:18.780 Yeah.

00:21:19.260 You don't want your buddy's kids to be homeless because something happened to him if he's your partner.

00:21:23.360 In this case, this guy was my, one of my right arms, you know.

00:21:26.100 So you just got to think that stuff through because it's going to come.

00:21:30.280 Something's going to come at you.

00:21:31.640 And if you haven't anticipated it, because everybody goes into this stuff like, oh, it's all going to work.

00:21:36.780 Nothing works like it's supposed to work ever.

00:21:39.360 It never works.

00:21:40.240 It's never as easy as it sounds when you're sitting and talking about it the first time.

00:21:44.880 Yeah.

00:21:45.360 Did you find yourself having unrealistic expectations about going into business spaces?

00:21:49.480 That's some things that I've struggled with in my life, especially recently.

00:21:52.720 It's like just unrealistic expectations that things are going to work or that they should be a certain way.

00:21:58.420 Like not leaving space for anything really.

00:22:02.620 Trying to just really have a lot of my own will, I guess, in some ways it is.

00:22:05.580 But also it's just.

00:22:06.860 You know, observing you from the outside, I think you probably suffer from this intense desire to be excellent.

00:22:14.680 Yeah.

00:22:15.020 And all that means is you're excellent.

00:22:18.880 And so if you demand that of yourself, it's okay to demand that of the situation, of the project, any of the people.

00:22:26.060 I work my tail off.

00:22:27.680 And so I don't hesitate if somebody's not to go, hey, come on, pick it up.

00:22:34.000 Right.

00:22:34.120 You know, it's not like I'm kicking back and asking you to go.

00:22:37.580 No, I'm going.

00:22:39.020 Right.

00:22:39.320 So keep up.

00:22:40.320 Right.

00:22:40.640 You know?

00:22:41.160 And same thing with a project.

00:22:42.740 We get on these projects now.

00:22:43.880 So I do.

00:22:44.380 I still have unrealistic expectations.

00:22:46.940 I do have a reality perception after 30 freaking years of doing stupid stuff.

00:22:52.380 Yeah.

00:22:52.640 I mean, I'm convinced we've survived about 90% of our ideas.

00:22:56.900 Everything good that's happened happened on about 10% of them.

00:22:59.700 But when you're starting it, I mean, you're going for a walk in the morning and, you know, or you're sitting on the dock having a cup of coffee at the lake and you have this idea.

00:23:09.180 They're all good then.

00:23:10.900 You know, but when you're, you know, half a million dollars in and you go, oh, this sucks.

00:23:15.060 This is awful.

00:23:16.140 Yeah.

00:23:16.260 And so you've come to the realization that even though we demanded excellence, even though we drove the lane, put the ball in the hoop, even though we didn't have product market fit, something's off, pricing's off, something's off.

00:23:26.560 And, I mean, but if you're not trying stuff, you're not growing.

00:23:32.320 You've got to try stuff.

00:23:33.220 But you're going to screw up a lot of it even though you demand excellence.

00:23:37.120 But I don't have a hesitation at all expecting excellence and expecting it.

00:23:42.740 You know, why would you enter something you didn't think was going to work?

00:23:44.720 Of course we think it's going to work.

00:23:47.040 You know, like a stupid reporter the other day is like, did you ever have any idea it would be this big?

00:23:51.900 And I'm like, well, of course I did.

00:23:53.740 I'm getting people out of debt.

00:23:55.100 They're like, everybody is my market, you know.

00:23:57.360 Of course I thought it.

00:23:58.460 But what I didn't know is how much work it was going to be.

00:24:00.560 I didn't have any idea I was going to have $100 million in payroll.

00:24:03.760 You know, I didn't have any idea that it was going to take that to do it.

00:24:06.660 But I knew there was a lot of need.

00:24:08.100 I knew that it could be big, but I didn't know how bad it was going to be, how hard it was going to be.

00:24:13.000 Yeah, I think that's the thing that – you know what?

00:24:15.360 That's funny when I hear you say that because, yeah, like I started to get busier with stuff that was business.

00:24:20.900 I just wanted to be a comedian, you know, and then got into podcasting.

00:24:24.740 And then you have employees and then they have feelings.

00:24:29.000 And they have feelings.

00:24:30.800 Yeah, and you have relationships with them, you know.

00:24:33.980 And so it's like all these things.

00:24:36.280 Next thing you know, it's like I spend a lot of my day – most of your time gets gone kind of because there's another responsibility.

00:24:44.320 And so then I'm just like, man, I'm just – I never – I didn't expect this much more work to come out of, I think, just having some goals, you know.

00:24:54.100 Yeah, I thought I was going to be on the radio and sell some books on getting out of debt.

00:24:58.280 And, I mean, who knew I needed 400 people in a tech department, you know.

00:25:02.920 And so it's the same thing.

00:25:04.460 You're exactly right.

00:25:05.600 But the good news is that, like you said earlier, it's an opportunity to learn, an opportunity to grow.

00:25:10.160 So that way you don't just stay in the pressure washing business.

00:25:14.860 And so I still enjoy the stage.

00:25:19.000 I still enjoy being on the radio, on the podcast, the YouTube every day.

00:25:23.120 We still do that show every day, three hours a day.

00:25:25.420 I still enjoy all that stuff.

00:25:26.760 But I also enjoy running this place.

00:25:28.480 I'm running it with my son.

00:25:29.660 He's the president now.

00:25:30.700 That's awesome.

00:25:31.280 You know, we had breakfast this morning and we're having a lot of fun working on the problems and, you know, looking at the new opportunities and all that.

00:25:39.040 So it's the entrepreneurial side is fun.

00:25:41.720 Yeah.

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00:26:59.680 You know, when we started selling a T-shirt online, my friend Kevin made it in his basement and he would ship it out.

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00:28:11.100 What do you say to, like, employees who want to talk to their employer about getting a raise or getting – like, what is a good way to approach an employer about that kind of stuff?

00:28:21.580 Like, you know, a lot of stuff in business like that are relationship things.

00:28:24.980 If you'll just switch the moccasins a minute, where are there moccasins?

00:28:28.120 So if you were the supervisor or you're the owner of the business, how would you want someone to talk to you about it?

00:28:35.580 And so, I mean, I really appreciate when our folks come in and go, hey, you know, I'm making this and, you know, here's two or three positions in the marketplace that are more for the same position.

00:28:46.980 And so, you know, what I'm curious about is what I can do to be worth what those people are doing because I want to be worth more to the business.

00:28:55.320 And if they say it that way, oh, man, yeah, I'm like, yeah, okay, here, yeah.

00:28:59.300 Well, matter of fact, you know, we probably have overlooked that.

00:29:01.480 We probably just need to give you a raise.

00:29:02.720 But maybe, yeah, maybe there's three things you need to do to level up to be ready to do that.

00:29:07.120 And so it's an opportunity for growth and those kinds of things because, really, you know, if you're an employer, your team has to make you more or save you more than they cost.

00:29:19.220 Or by definition, you go out of business mathematically.

00:29:22.520 And so if you'll look at that as a team member, it's like how can I add more value than I cost or save more money and depend on what they're working on than I cost,

00:29:34.100 then, you know, it's kind of a no-brainer unless the employer's a jerk and greedy or whatever.

00:29:39.060 But most employers are just trying to figure it out, too.

00:29:42.020 We're just trying to go, especially small business people.

00:29:44.280 I mean, we love our people.

00:29:45.240 They're family to us.

00:29:46.340 And, you know, we want to help them win.

00:29:48.960 We want their kids to go to college.

00:29:50.780 We want to be with them 20 years and watch them grow up.

00:29:53.440 You know, we want all that.

00:29:54.600 We want good stuff for you.

00:29:56.320 But we also don't want to close because we overpaid everybody and didn't make any stinking money.

00:30:00.560 Yeah.

00:30:00.900 So then everybody loses.

00:30:01.980 So you've got this balance.

00:30:03.540 The employer's got that stress they're carrying.

00:30:05.660 So if you'll keep that in mind when you're asking, how can I add value that's more than I cost or save you more than I cost,

00:30:15.200 then like I've got a lady in logistics.

00:30:17.360 I mean, she saved us several hundred thousand dollars with contract negotiations with our logistics people and shipping more than she cost.

00:30:26.540 Wow.

00:30:26.760 Well, it's easy to say, yeah, you're worth that.

00:30:29.820 That's a no-brainer.

00:30:31.040 I like sharing with her.

00:30:32.740 I mean, we always tell people around here, if you kill it and drag it home, you know, go out there, kill it, drag it to the cave, I'll share it with you.

00:30:38.160 Let's figure it out.

00:30:38.900 You know, you bring in a million dollars in revenue, we can probably divvy that up.

00:30:43.120 We can probably figure out something to do with that.

00:30:44.480 Yeah.

00:30:44.780 You know, I don't need to take it all home, but I also don't need to give it all to one person either.

00:30:49.560 So we figure this out.

00:30:51.080 And you can do that when you're adding value.

00:30:54.160 And so just look at it that way, not like, on the other hand, I had a guy come in years ago, a long time ago.

00:30:59.520 And he'd been to school half his life.

00:31:02.260 He had more degrees than a thermometer.

00:31:04.000 And he just, you know, he said, hey, man, you know, at these big companies, people that got this many degrees, they make a certain amount of money.

00:31:14.180 And he said, I'm not making that here.

00:31:17.820 We need to adjust my income.

00:31:19.700 And I said, well, dude, I'm sorry, this is small business.

00:31:22.400 Your raise is effective when you are.

00:31:24.760 We don't pay you for degrees.

00:31:26.560 We pay you for bringing in more than you cost.

00:31:31.300 And right now you're not.

00:31:33.640 So, you know, he left and went and worked for corporate America where they'll pay him for those degrees and they can get away with that.

00:31:39.220 But small business can't do that.

00:31:40.640 Yeah.

00:31:41.320 Yeah.

00:31:41.700 What do you say?

00:31:42.220 Like, what is some of the adder, even just like to get a little bit more minute with it, like, what are just, say somebody's out there listening, like, man, I feel like I want to talk to my boss about a raise.

00:31:51.860 Or I want to, how do they, what are some, should they tell themselves certain things to prep themselves to go in there?

00:31:58.100 If they, should it just be comfortable?

00:32:00.520 Because it's just a space where a lot of people get really uncomfortable, I think, you know?

00:32:04.120 Yeah.

00:32:04.300 You know, anytime I'm in a situation like that where I'm uncomfortable, where there's conflict or a negotiation, if you want to call it that.

00:32:11.620 And I found that the more options I have, the calmer I am.

00:32:17.820 And so if there's only one thing, I mean, if I don't get this, I'm dead.

00:32:20.980 But if you've got, like, six people wanting to hire you, and, you know, you want to go in and go, hey, you know, I'd like to stay, and I like it here, and I like you, and I want it to work, but I got all this other stuff.

00:32:33.740 Your body language changes, you know?

00:32:35.660 Yeah.

00:32:35.840 You don't have to be cocky about it.

00:32:38.140 You don't have swagger in or something, but you can come in with a lot of confidence if you've got options.

00:32:42.600 But if you've got it all dialed in, it's just one thing, and if I don't get this one thing, the whole thing's over, and you add this drama, then you tighten up.

00:32:49.560 Yeah, you can feel that energy in there, too.

00:32:50.980 Yeah, and it changes the conversation.

00:32:53.480 Your vocal cords change, even.

00:32:54.880 Yeah, and there can be things, even if it's not financial, you could get, well, is there a possibility that my car could be paid or insurance?

00:33:02.680 I think there's always different possibilities of things you can ask for, even that, you know.

00:33:07.300 Yeah, I mean, depending on how the business is structured and what's going on, there's a lot of different things you can do to help people and do different things.

00:33:14.600 And sometimes we've had situations where someone was just in a financial situation, you know, they got in trouble, and they come in, we sit down, we go over their budget, and we go, okay, number one, we're going to get you in a situation.

00:33:24.880 So you're never here again with your budget, how you're handling your money.

00:33:29.440 But then, number two, you know, your house is four payments behind, so we're going to catch the house up.

00:33:34.840 And so that's just like a one-time thing.

00:33:36.740 That's not a permanent raise, because the raise wasn't the problem.

00:33:39.460 Their mismanagement at home was the problem.

00:33:41.540 Ah, I see what you're saying.

00:33:42.380 So, you know, we help them fix the mismanagement, and then we catch them up.

00:33:45.240 Now they're at even.

00:33:45.960 Now they can run.

00:33:47.320 Yeah.

00:33:49.320 Would you buy it?

00:33:50.160 Do you still think it's good to buy a house?

00:33:52.420 I'm a homeowner, right?

00:33:53.520 Like, for the first time, like, last year or two years ago.

00:33:56.620 And sometimes I'm like, is this the best thing to do?

00:34:00.960 Like, it's tougher to have, like, freedom to just go where you want.

00:34:05.000 You know, you can't just go.

00:34:06.200 And then sometimes it feels like there's so many expenses with a home.

00:34:09.820 Sometimes it feels like, and I'm not saying it's true, but it feels like I'm not really building up any equity or saving money.

00:34:17.960 What do you think about it, Dave?

00:34:19.220 Well, again, over the scope of time, you're making money, without a doubt.

00:34:23.640 By owning a home?

00:34:24.620 Absolutely.

00:34:25.580 I mean, again, I'm old, so I've gotten to see this thing happen.

00:34:30.700 You know, I mean, I got my real estate license three weeks after I turned 18 years old in 1978.

00:34:35.820 And the first house I sold was to a buddy of mine from high school, which means he wasn't smart because he let me sell him a house.

00:34:41.220 And I'm stupid.

00:34:42.320 You're like, now I'm going to live in one of the rooms, buddy.

00:34:45.700 I just want you to know straight up.

00:34:47.300 How's this going?

00:34:48.460 But, yeah.

00:34:49.380 Anyway, I sold him that house for $42,500.

00:34:52.680 And it's on East Ridge over in Antioch.

00:34:55.620 And that house today would be probably $800.

00:34:59.620 Wow.

00:34:59.960 So, you know, and if you bought a house four years ago, you've gotten in Nashville, I mean, you've made serious money on it in four years in terms of value increase.

00:35:10.360 But, yeah, the nickel-dime expenses, the messing with the repairs, I mean, crap, the more stuff you own, the more repairmen you have to know.

00:35:17.140 I mean, it doesn't matter what it is, whether it's got a motor in it or it's cars or houses or boats or all this stuff.

00:35:23.920 Something's always freaking breaking.

00:35:25.520 There's always something screwed up.

00:35:26.800 And it does get the feeling of just the hassle and the aggravation.

00:35:31.680 There's no simplicity to it at all.

00:35:33.660 Your life gets more complicated.

00:35:35.500 So be careful what you wish for.

00:35:36.740 Yeah.

00:35:37.160 But home ownership in general, absolutely.

00:35:39.660 We did the largest study of millionaires ever done in North America.

00:35:42.860 I saw that.

00:35:44.980 And the typical millionaire that we found, 89% of them were first generation, meaning they did not inherit their money.

00:35:53.660 That's not how they became millionaires.

00:35:55.160 So 9 out of 10, that's good news for everybody.

00:35:57.220 We all got a shot.

00:35:58.900 And then the – but the two things that got them there was simply putting money in their 401K and buying a house and paying it off.

00:36:06.040 And so I'd meet a guy, you know, he's 42 and he pay – he owes – you know, he had a house of $600,000 or $700,000.

00:36:13.660 And he had like $600,000 or $800,000 in his 401K and he's 42 years old.

00:36:18.460 So he's worth over a million dollars and he paid off his house.

00:36:21.160 So home ownership is a key part of the first, you know, $1 to $10 million of net worth that somebody builds.

00:36:28.920 And so, yeah, I'm a huge believer in home ownership.

00:36:32.060 Don't do it stupid because buying a house you can't afford makes you broker.

00:36:36.140 That's why they call them brokers.

00:36:37.280 But, yeah, it's a problem.

00:36:39.900 Yeah.

00:36:40.400 Yeah, this is your study right here.

00:36:41.620 How did you come upon these millionaires?

00:36:44.360 You know, we did a detailed study and sent out not just from us, but we just went to the population and found them.

00:36:52.600 We had a research firm in New York City looking over our shoulder to make sure our research methodology was tight

00:36:58.560 because we knew we'd get a ton of pushback from, you know, people who think that America is dead

00:37:06.120 and there's no chance for anybody to win.

00:37:07.840 You can't get up off the bottom.

00:37:09.560 Little man can't get ahead, that whole thing.

00:37:11.640 You're saying that's not true.

00:37:12.740 The problem is little man gets ahead every day in America.

00:37:15.420 We see it right here.

00:37:16.220 And I've met them for 30, 40 years, you know, doing this.

00:37:19.320 I run into them and some of them did it because they did our stuff.

00:37:22.240 But some of them just said, you know, I'm going to live on less than I make.

00:37:24.660 But, you know, it was an interesting result.

00:37:30.340 So these are the top five careers of the millionaires that you guys looked at?

00:37:33.440 Yep.

00:37:33.960 Engineer.

00:37:34.360 Well, what we found was what occurred most often.

00:37:37.520 Okay.

00:37:37.780 Engineer was number one.

00:37:39.620 The most often occurring among the people we surveyed that were millionaires was engineer.

00:37:43.900 Number two was accountant.

00:37:44.900 Number three was teacher, which is surprising.

00:37:47.460 Number three, management, business.

00:37:49.240 Number five was attorney.

00:37:50.560 Medical doctor didn't even make the top five.

00:37:52.460 And we always think of doctors and lawyers, you know.

00:37:54.140 Yeah.

00:37:54.320 But they're actually number six, but they're notoriously bad with money.

00:37:58.200 They make a lot of money, but they're like music stars or something.

00:38:01.760 They're notoriously bad with money.

00:38:04.320 And so that was interesting.

00:38:06.440 We couldn't figure out at first what these things had in common because they don't seem

00:38:11.920 to have anything in common.

00:38:12.600 What we finally figured out is all five of these are process people.

00:38:17.580 You follow a process, a set of rules, and you learn the rules and you follow the rules.

00:38:22.880 You know, if you're an engineer, there's only one way to build that building and it doesn't

00:38:27.280 fall, right?

00:38:28.100 If you're an accountant, there's not, you don't, it's not art.

00:38:30.500 It's not art.

00:38:31.140 You don't get to make up how you do accounting.

00:38:32.680 There's one way to do it.

00:38:34.680 Teachers have a lesson plan they have to follow.

00:38:36.800 Business has always a set of best practices.

00:38:39.260 Attorneys, you know, there's the law and you can only conduct yourself in court a certain

00:38:45.420 way or the judge will smack you backwards, right?

00:38:47.660 And so all of these are process people.

00:38:50.400 So they discovered because of the way the brain worked that led them into these careers,

00:38:56.040 they discovered the process of living on less than make, living on a budget, starting

00:38:59.380 to invest, being generous, paying off their house, that kind of stuff.

00:39:03.120 And they follow that process and that's what got them there.

00:39:05.720 It was not that, the interesting thing is one third of them, 33%, made less than $100,000

00:39:11.340 a year.

00:39:12.100 Wow.

00:39:12.500 They were not making bank.

00:39:14.380 They were not earning their way into it, really.

00:39:16.240 Yeah, because you would think teachers, you always hear, we got to pay these teachers more,

00:39:19.440 you know?

00:39:19.760 And we do.

00:39:20.440 I mean, that wouldn't be bad at all.

00:39:21.740 But there's, the way the teacher's brains work, they do process and that's the secret

00:39:27.160 sauce.

00:39:29.260 And all of those, I guess you have to have an education for.

00:39:33.000 Well, that's true.

00:39:34.220 We have to go to college.

00:39:35.040 Do you have to go to college to be a teacher?

00:39:36.380 I don't know if you have to.

00:39:37.200 You do?

00:39:37.560 Yeah, definitely.

00:39:38.900 Sorry, teachers, I didn't.

00:39:40.720 Some of mine didn't go.

00:39:42.200 Some of mine.

00:39:43.200 Some of yours didn't go to class.

00:39:45.260 Some of mine didn't either.

00:39:46.400 Some of mine would be in classes with me.

00:39:48.400 I was like, what?

00:39:50.420 It's like Ric Flair came on here one time and he said he was in a rehab facility for

00:39:54.540 drugs and alcohol.

00:39:55.400 And he looks over one day at lunch and one of the doctors is also in the facility.

00:40:01.820 That's not a good sign.

00:40:03.320 Yeah, it's like, well, that's definitely, you're at a Hooters, bro.

00:40:06.240 I'm like, you're not, you're just at a Hooters.

00:40:08.000 Yeah, that's what the people say a lot of times is it does feel like that now.

00:40:13.460 It feels there's a lot of energy in the air.

00:40:15.260 It feels like the American dream isn't possible, that it doesn't exist.

00:40:21.340 Where do you think a lot of that energy comes from?

00:40:25.520 That that is the, it feels like that's the consensus these days.

00:40:30.040 Would you agree with that?

00:40:30.720 It feels like that?

00:40:31.920 There's a lot of, there's a lot of loud people that have that.

00:40:36.080 I don't know that it's necessarily a consensus among Americans.

00:40:41.500 Because consensus means that most people agree with it?

00:40:43.360 Right.

00:40:43.720 Okay.

00:40:44.200 So I'm not sure of that, but there's enough, there's enough people that are making noise

00:40:47.480 in that regard, but there kind of always has been.

00:40:49.860 I mean, if you go back to the, you know, the seventies with the hippie movement, it was

00:40:54.200 the same kind of thing.

00:40:55.320 Right.

00:40:55.640 And so there's always been a, you know, my group, the baby boomers.

00:40:59.220 And so there's always been somebody in the group that felt like the system was rigged,

00:41:03.880 man, we got to get the system, you know, we can't beat the system.

00:41:07.180 The little man can't get ahead, you know?

00:41:08.940 And so the neighborhood I grew up in, people say that, you know, and they never said it

00:41:11.940 with like enthusiasm.

00:41:12.800 It's like the little man can't get ahead.

00:41:15.380 Yeah.

00:41:15.660 Like Eeyore is their spirit animal.

00:41:17.420 Oh yeah.

00:41:17.700 Where's my tail?

00:41:18.880 Yeah.

00:41:19.240 It's just that season.

00:41:20.960 I'm stuck and life's bad.

00:41:23.080 And, you know, and no, you're not get up off your butt and go get a pressure washer.

00:41:26.500 I mean, there's stuff to do, you know?

00:41:28.080 So, uh, and most of these people, again, these millionaires, um, and a million dollars

00:41:34.240 is not, that's not a billion dollars.

00:41:37.160 That's a million.

00:41:38.260 There's a lot of difference.

00:41:39.620 Millionaires don't have jets.

00:41:41.540 Millionaires don't have seven cars and four houses.

00:41:43.920 No, no, they, they just got, they've just got a paid for house and some money in their

00:41:48.540 retirement.

00:41:48.900 That's what it amounts to.

00:41:50.220 And so there's a, people kind of have a different mindset there and they think, okay, I can't be

00:41:54.980 like this rock star.

00:41:56.120 Well, you might not be, there's not as many billionaires as there are millionaires.

00:42:00.200 Yeah.

00:42:00.680 So, but anyway, can it be done?

00:42:02.040 Yes, it can be done.

00:42:02.800 And there is, there's a lot of, uh, loud noises out there.

00:42:05.540 I don't know where that comes from.

00:42:06.660 It's a, I think it starts with, and one of the reasons I pushed back and did this study

00:42:11.680 and then we ended up doing a number one bestselling book on it, Baby Steps Millionaires,

00:42:15.300 pushing back in the marketplaces against those voices is because they're not, it's not true

00:42:20.940 that you can't get ahead.

00:42:23.000 Right.

00:42:23.300 And when you convince someone that it's true, you're stealing their hope and you shouldn't

00:42:28.020 steal people's hope, man, that's evil.

00:42:30.020 Yeah.

00:42:30.320 And so you ought to encourage people to go do stuff.

00:42:33.400 Now you should not encourage them to go on American Idol if they can't sing.

00:42:37.620 Yeah.

00:42:37.920 Okay.

00:42:38.120 But you, you should, you know, so stop their nightmares, but also encourage their dreams.

00:42:42.660 So this hopelessness that goes with that, I feel stuck.

00:42:46.460 I, I'll never get a house.

00:42:48.440 I'm a, a Gen Z.

00:42:50.020 I'm a millennial.

00:42:50.840 I can't get ahead in today's world.

00:42:53.020 You boomers bought your house for two baskets of strawberries.

00:42:55.980 And so now I'm stuck and you don't understand.

00:42:58.520 And, and housing is so expensive.

00:43:00.700 Honey, it's always been expensive.

00:43:03.600 I was doing an interview on NPR the other day and the lady said, you know, I was riding

00:43:07.360 with the Uber driver and the Uber driver said his daughter is a dancer and a barista and

00:43:13.540 she couldn't get a house.

00:43:15.000 And I went, that's been true in every generation.

00:43:18.040 Yeah.

00:43:18.480 If you serve coffee and you're in Nashville and you're a dancer, you can't get a house.

00:43:24.120 That's just going to be, that's not, those are not, you know, career fields that you're

00:43:28.640 going to make enough to be able to afford a house.

00:43:30.160 That's not, that's not a new thing.

00:43:31.640 That doesn't mean the system has failed.

00:43:33.000 Yeah.

00:43:33.420 And who's buying Java off a stripper either, you know, to be honest, I'm not saying

00:43:38.620 what kind of dancer I didn't, I didn't have any idea there, but yeah.

00:43:41.520 Oh, okay.

00:43:42.100 Yeah.

00:43:42.300 I thought, yeah, I didn't know, but yeah.

00:43:43.660 I'm like who also, I guess it would be nice though if a stripper just shows up as a nice

00:43:47.800 cup of coffee.

00:43:49.840 Actually, that's probably not a bad deal.

00:43:51.640 Don't they have that nude barista drive-thru or something?

00:43:55.200 Where's that at?

00:43:56.160 You know, that is a thing.

00:43:57.120 That's right.

00:43:57.540 I saw that.

00:43:57.940 That's a while back.

00:43:58.800 That's old news.

00:43:59.780 It's old news, but it definitely still, I think some people pretend like it's new news

00:44:03.740 every day when they roll up there.

00:44:06.520 Like, let me see the headlines, huh?

00:44:08.480 I'm not sure exactly how we got there, but okay.

00:44:11.960 Well, yeah, but I'm just saying that's a unique business right there.

00:44:14.640 That's kind of wild, you know, that'll be a gift for me.

00:44:17.740 But back to your thing, the thing is hope is a decision and it's got to be based on,

00:44:26.400 you know, you've had the actual reality in your life of going from collecting cans to

00:44:34.720 sitting here.

00:44:35.840 I've had the reality in my life of going from mowing grass to millionaire in my 20s to losing

00:44:42.520 it all.

00:44:43.100 I'm so dumb I had to do it twice.

00:44:45.440 So, you know, I've got that reality.

00:44:48.060 And so when someone says it can't be done, I went, uh, wait a minute.

00:44:52.260 Hello.

00:44:53.020 Um, and I don't really, I'm fairly smart, but I'm not a rocket surgeon.

00:44:58.600 I mean, I don't, I don't really know how to do stuff.

00:45:00.860 I just, I'm figuring it out as I go.

00:45:03.120 Right.

00:45:03.760 And, and so I think anybody can do it.

00:45:07.140 No, it's good to hear.

00:45:08.380 Yeah.

00:45:08.740 I think people having a hope like that is important, you know, and I think that's, yeah, it's

00:45:13.540 just really important to hear that.

00:45:15.200 Yeah.

00:45:15.600 If you take away somebody's hope, cause I guess that's what a lot of this, this, uh,

00:45:19.700 these loud voices are doing.

00:45:21.240 Right.

00:45:21.520 I never thought about that that much.

00:45:23.000 They're just trying to take away your hope because once they have your hope, they can

00:45:26.420 kind of keep you there.

00:45:28.320 I feel like if they're running us, if they're running a game, you know, and they're, they're

00:45:32.460 manipulating, that's one thing.

00:45:34.160 And that's particularly evil.

00:45:35.700 But the other one is just, they really have lost hope.

00:45:39.620 And so they're angry and they don't want, and they want to loudly proclaim that it's not

00:45:44.920 possible.

00:45:45.600 Which makes them feel okay that they're not winning, that they haven't gone and done

00:45:49.160 something yet.

00:45:49.900 And cause winning's hard, man.

00:45:51.700 It's hard.

00:45:52.720 Yeah.

00:45:53.300 It takes a lot of work, man.

00:45:55.100 Yeah.

00:45:55.240 I was talking, they had a kid rock was on a couple of weeks ago and he was talking about

00:45:58.280 how, um, yeah.

00:46:01.120 If you want to re if you want to have success, you're going to have to probably work 60 hours

00:46:05.700 a week, six, you know, 60 to 80 hours a week.

00:46:08.120 He was saying, and for a period of time, not your whole life.

00:46:10.840 Right.

00:46:11.260 I mean, we started this thing, man, I was 16 hours.

00:46:14.260 My wife had, you know, and she's like, I was a single mom for two years.

00:46:18.120 You know, you were gone.

00:46:19.460 I was on the road doing book tours.

00:46:21.480 I was out speaking everywhere.

00:46:22.760 I was going crazy, going to cities, trying to get radio stations to carry the show.

00:46:26.100 Back when talk radio was the thing.

00:46:28.000 And that's how we all got started was in talk radio.

00:46:30.680 Oh yeah.

00:46:31.100 Do you ever meet Paul Harvey?

00:46:32.480 Uh, no, I didn't.

00:46:33.800 No, I didn't.

00:46:34.540 That was so cool.

00:46:35.380 I know y'all's timelines.

00:46:36.460 It's iconic.

00:46:37.120 It's off.

00:46:37.320 Yeah.

00:46:37.860 Yeah.

00:46:38.180 I knew all the guys that are current Rush and Sean Hannity and all those guys are all

00:46:43.180 contemporaries and they're all friends and, um, you know, people that have been around

00:46:48.140 the business like that, but, uh, and, and a lot of the new guys that are doing really

00:46:51.380 good work too.

00:46:52.280 But, but anyway, that, you know, we're just out there hustling, man, and you got to leave

00:46:56.580 the cave, kill it, drag it home.

00:46:57.640 And my wife grew up on a farm.

00:46:59.380 So she's like, um, yeah, hard work's how you do this.

00:47:03.160 So get after it.

00:47:04.280 Now you can't maintain that.

00:47:05.960 That was two years.

00:47:07.240 It wasn't 20, 20.

00:47:09.080 I would have lost my family.

00:47:10.400 Yeah.

00:47:10.520 You know, you can't, you can't maintain relationships.

00:47:12.320 My kids would have been messed up.

00:47:13.980 And so by the time my kids got on up, I, you know, I didn't miss a prom.

00:47:18.820 Uh, I didn't miss a hockey game.

00:47:20.860 You know, I didn't miss a, whatever the big games.

00:47:23.340 I mean, little stuff I'd be gone during the week, but you know, but we started putting

00:47:26.960 these dates on the calendar and we would book our events around them.

00:47:29.680 You, you couldn't, you couldn't book on top of that.

00:47:31.560 And I still do that.

00:47:32.480 Yeah.

00:47:32.880 Um, when people talk about, uh, when people talk, like you hear a lot of discussion these

00:47:40.000 days about, um, how inflation is going, is getting so, is growing so fast, I guess,

00:47:47.180 that it's not, that the wage, minimum wage isn't keeping up with it.

00:47:52.700 Um, it feels like detrimental.

00:47:54.720 Like if you like, it feels sometimes impossible.

00:47:56.780 If you look at the minimum wage, you're like, how is this going to, it would feel impossible

00:48:01.440 almost, I feel like if you were trying to take care of a family or something on that,

00:48:05.460 you know?

00:48:06.720 Well, truthfully, uh, minimum wage has, uh, never, I don't think since even it was formed

00:48:14.100 in the seventies, I don't think any time in history, minimum wage has been enough to take

00:48:18.360 care of a family.

00:48:19.340 Uh, so you've always had to think beyond minimum wage.

00:48:22.620 If you wanted to excel, if you wanted to have, you know, a build some wealth or B just

00:48:27.800 take care of a family, those kinds of things.

00:48:29.320 So minimum wage is not designed for the entry level jobs are, that's not designed.

00:48:35.020 What, what's more disturbing than minimum wage is the, that wages in general, average

00:48:40.820 household incomes have not kept up with inflation.

00:48:43.820 And so that's alarming, that that's more alarming because that's the whole population.

00:48:48.580 It's not just this segment that enters, uh, you know, entry level stuff at minimum wage,

00:48:53.320 because, you know, if we go all the way back to minimum wage, I'm cutting grass for $3 a

00:48:57.620 yard in 1972.

00:49:00.940 Okay.

00:49:01.360 A thousand, there were dinosaurs in the yard.

00:49:03.100 We had to get them out of the yard, but you know, I mean, 1972, $3 a yard, but minimum

00:49:06.500 wage was a buck 65.

00:49:08.500 My buddy's working at, at, you know, Burger King flopping whoppers and he's making a buck

00:49:13.540 six, five.

00:49:14.160 If I can cut that $3 yard in an hour, I'm making double minimum wage at 12 years old.

00:49:20.300 And that's how my little math brain was working.

00:49:22.100 And so I'm running that mower, you know, I'm going.

00:49:25.160 And so, uh, so you even cut somebody's yard and just go to the door and be like, Hey,

00:49:29.060 just cut your yard.

00:49:30.600 No, I mean, that was my job.

00:49:32.960 I, they were one of my clients.

00:49:34.200 I had to go cut their grass, but some people, I bet if you rolled up to my door and knocked

00:49:37.420 on my door and said, Hey man, I just cut your yard.

00:49:40.360 Will you give me 10 bucks for it or whatever?

00:49:42.120 Except for that other guy you hired to do it.

00:49:43.760 That's coming next week.

00:49:44.660 Yeah.

00:49:45.360 There's a problem with him, but yeah.

00:49:47.160 But yeah, the, uh, but yeah, I mean that, that you've never, you've always had the opportunity

00:49:52.000 to beat minimum wage.

00:49:53.620 So you don't want to sit and say, okay, minimum wage is my gauge of whether I can go win because

00:49:59.340 I can go do something that beats minimum wage.

00:50:01.820 Right.

00:50:01.980 So that's kind of a, sometimes that's kind of a political football that gets kicked around

00:50:05.200 a lot, I guess, then, you know,

00:50:06.940 it is.

00:50:07.540 And it enters into this discussion falsely.

00:50:09.580 It's a false narrative where I think the real narrative that is a little bit scary is that

00:50:14.440 wages have not kept up with inflation.

00:50:16.440 And because we've had this unusual surge in inflation and it's blamed on Biden politically,

00:50:23.720 but it, some of it's his fault, uh, his, uh, policy issues, but most of it is just the,

00:50:30.500 the lingering results of, of the pandemic.

00:50:33.780 And so the shortage, shortages of things always drive prices up on anything, anything,

00:50:39.780 there's a shortage of prices go up.

00:50:41.500 Okay.

00:50:41.600 And there was a shortage of freaking everything.

00:50:43.300 Yeah.

00:50:43.700 Remember supply chain and all that stuff people are talking about.

00:50:46.140 Oh yeah.

00:50:46.480 And so everything shot up, real estate shot up because people sat around in their houses

00:50:51.840 during the pandemic.

00:50:52.720 And then, you know, when the sun came out and the curve was flattened and all whatever,

00:50:58.280 you know, and we're all back out, well, these people all wanted new houses.

00:51:02.280 I mean, they came out of their house, like a Baptist after a casserole, they were going

00:51:05.580 for it, man.

00:51:06.100 I mean, they were, they were getting it, you know?

00:51:07.800 So, uh, and house prices, you know, 20, 21, wow.

00:51:12.200 That was an artificial thing though, that was created by the market being dormant and people

00:51:17.720 being trapped.

00:51:18.460 And then this idea of looking around at their house going, this, my house sucks.

00:51:21.280 I need a new house.

00:51:22.240 Boom.

00:51:22.660 They hit the market hard and it's still not recovered from that.

00:51:25.760 It's still got the ripple of that.

00:51:27.200 And some of the other things are hit that way too.

00:51:29.700 Um, and, and, but there's some things again, the policy issues, but most of it is just the,

00:51:34.520 the smoothing out of that.

00:51:36.440 And Trump nor Biden should get the credit nor the blame.

00:51:39.820 It was more how the marketplace was functioning.

00:51:41.840 So you think that inflation will come down?

00:51:44.440 Is that the right term to talk about inflation?

00:51:46.560 I do.

00:51:46.980 I, I, I don't think it's permanent.

00:51:48.740 Um, again, it, to the extent that the politicians leave their hands off of stuff, but the, um,

00:51:54.760 both parties, but the, um, as a marketplace will smooth out again, demand prices go up.

00:52:03.140 Number of people want to pay that.

00:52:04.460 No.

00:52:05.620 So now demand goes down, which brings prices down, you know?

00:52:09.160 So the thing smooths out eventually you find this equilibrium, this balance.

00:52:12.640 And the problem is the price, the shortage drove the prices up and the shortage remained.

00:52:17.400 And then people's appetite, they just kept coming, man, like freaking piranha.

00:52:21.380 And that, the, the marketplace surges is what drove the pricing as much as anything.

00:52:26.400 Now that's not true in oil and gas at the pump.

00:52:28.880 That's a whole different subject.

00:52:30.000 That's not true on a few other things, but housing for sure.

00:52:33.840 You know, bread, uh, grocery store cart.

00:52:37.320 Yeah.

00:52:37.720 All that for sure.

00:52:39.060 You always hear about like the national debt, right?

00:52:43.860 People talk about that all the time.

00:52:45.780 It, and it just keeps going up apparently.

00:52:48.440 Like, is that a real thing that affect, it almost seems so fictional now that it's like,

00:52:54.620 is it a real thing that could cause something to happen in like in our lives or like, is it

00:53:01.520 like, what is it?

00:53:03.220 You know what I'm saying?

00:53:04.120 Cause everybody's like, you know, it's just zillions.

00:53:06.500 They're making up amounts of money now.

00:53:08.520 Yeah.

00:53:08.720 Some kid told me yesterday it was 65 zillion, your jillions.

00:53:16.060 And I'm like, that's how much it is.

00:53:18.040 I mean, right now it's 34.

00:53:19.740 It's a number that I don't even know.

00:53:22.100 How can you teach kids numbers in school, but you can't even teach them a number that

00:53:27.180 would let them explain the national debt.

00:53:29.700 Yeah.

00:53:29.940 Uh, you know, I went through a period of time in my twenties when I was first starting to

00:53:35.580 do this stuff, late twenties that, uh, that I was worried that the hockey stick of this

00:53:42.380 thing, that the, the, the growth of the debt is, was going to cripple the economy and even

00:53:47.320 cause a complete collapse.

00:53:49.000 Um, and you know, I, so I've observed people in my world, write books on the end of the

00:53:56.240 world.

00:53:56.980 You know, here's the economic end of the world coming economic end of the world.

00:54:00.120 Here's the, and, and, and they keep being wrong.

00:54:05.600 So I don't want to write that book.

00:54:07.360 So, uh, is it concerning?

00:54:10.360 Yeah, it's concerning because anytime a group of people, us keep spending more than we make

00:54:16.160 and we keep electing people that don't have any ability to curb their appetite for our

00:54:22.720 money, uh, it's, uh, man, that, that philosophically, spiritually is scary.

00:54:30.920 Mathematically is scary.

00:54:31.940 Is it going to cause a crash?

00:54:35.320 Apparently not because it, I mean, I've been doing this a long, I mean, I've been watching

00:54:39.840 this thinking when, you know, when, you know, but it's not.

00:54:43.080 And obviously what the national debt is, what it does do factually is it robs money from the

00:54:51.760 economy that could be producing something.

00:54:53.980 And so, because what happens is, is the government issues a bond.

00:54:58.440 That's how they finance the debts, treasury bonds.

00:55:00.920 T bills and T bonds.

00:55:03.080 And so they issue that bond and then an investor goes and buys that government bond because

00:55:09.360 they're going to pay him interest on it.

00:55:11.480 If that investor had done something else in the marketplace with that money to produce

00:55:16.360 something rather than sit on this bunch of fat in DC, it would have, it would have ginned

00:55:22.500 up the economy.

00:55:23.460 I see.

00:55:23.940 So it's stealing money from the economy in that sense.

00:55:29.420 And it's becoming a large, the interest only on it is becoming a larger and larger portion

00:55:33.920 of the quote, budget, unquote, as if they've got a budget.

00:55:38.000 But, you know.

00:55:38.400 Yeah, I have, I put money into kind of T bills.

00:55:42.780 I'm kind of a say.

00:55:44.020 Oh, it's you.

00:55:44.900 Yeah.

00:55:45.560 It is.

00:55:46.280 I didn't know who it was.

00:55:47.300 It was you.

00:55:47.780 Okay.

00:55:49.380 Because there's a lot of me.

00:55:50.680 I don't trust the stock market that much.

00:55:52.740 I feel like it's so manipulated these days.

00:55:55.240 I feel like there's like darker forces that are like, you can use the media to control

00:55:59.900 it and like, can like create articles to affect how the market goes.

00:56:04.280 So that's kind of like, so I prefer something like a T bill or something like that.

00:56:08.600 That's just like a safe, I know what it's going to be pretty much.

00:56:12.060 Well, there's always been falsehood and manipulation in the market.

00:56:19.280 There's always been to a degree.

00:56:21.080 Do you think it's still a safe place for people to invest?

00:56:23.260 I do.

00:56:23.580 I've got, I've got millions and millions of dollars in mutual funds.

00:56:27.080 So the, the way to offset that is number one, if you don't, I believe it's there.

00:56:33.640 I believe it's a very small percentage and I don't know where it is exactly.

00:56:38.180 I can't point and say that guy, that one, you know, that girl, that thing right there.

00:56:41.320 I don't know exactly where it is, but I mean, is there people that fluff the thing?

00:56:45.880 Absolutely.

00:56:46.620 They fluff it.

00:56:47.480 Absolutely.

00:56:48.340 Is there people that, you know, that, uh, right before the news article goes out, they

00:56:52.220 sell their stuff insider trading happens all the time.

00:56:55.160 Sometimes they get caught and go to jail.

00:56:56.480 It's illegal, but does it happen?

00:56:58.660 Oh, it's common practice.

00:57:00.220 Is it so widespread that it makes the investment, uh, improper or imprudent?

00:57:06.600 No, I don't believe that.

00:57:08.320 Otherwise I wouldn't be investing.

00:57:09.500 Um, uh, so, uh, so I invest.

00:57:13.840 So if I'm in a mutual fund, I'm in 90 to 200 different stocks and it's stuff that you

00:57:20.000 drive by every day.

00:57:21.740 It's McDonald's or Home Depot or Dell computer or Apple or Exxon or whatever, right?

00:57:28.600 Yeah.

00:57:28.800 That's in the room.

00:57:29.720 Go or whatever.

00:57:30.560 Exactly.

00:57:31.380 All that.

00:57:32.160 And so, uh, in those 90 to 200, is there some percentage of that problem going on?

00:57:38.520 Yeah, there is some percentage, but not enough that it, in general, those 90 to 200 companies,

00:57:44.620 I'm, I'm spread out wide enough, diversified.

00:57:46.900 I'm spread out enough that I'm catching all the good and it's more than offsetting the falsehood

00:57:53.960 that's out there.

00:57:55.100 And it's more than offsetting that.

00:57:56.180 So as Home Depot makes more money than I'm participating as whoever, Apple makes more

00:58:04.240 money than I'm participating because I'm one of the owners of the company, tiny, tiny little

00:58:08.920 bit when I own, you know, in that 90 to 200 stocks.

00:58:11.620 So that's how I don't buy single stocks mainly because they're higher risk and much more volatile

00:58:16.900 and you're much more prey to what if that was the company that was screwing around?

00:58:21.640 Yeah.

00:58:22.300 Then boom, you know, you bet the whole dadgum farm on that one horse race and that guy

00:58:27.580 fell up.

00:58:28.080 No, we're not doing that.

00:58:29.420 So I don't like that much risk.

00:58:31.120 So I like the diversification of mutual funds.

00:58:32.880 That's where my, all my retirement is.

00:58:34.860 Uh, it's what we recommend, what we teach.

00:58:36.780 Um, so I only do two kinds of investing.

00:58:39.560 I buy real estate that I pay cash for and I buy mutual funds.

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01:01:43.520 So if someone had like a, they have a, you know, some money they're thinking about putting

01:01:49.020 it into the market or they're thinking about buying like maybe a small apartment building

01:01:52.540 or something like that, do you feel like that's a good choice for people?

01:01:55.740 Yeah.

01:01:55.860 I don't get in partnerships on them like we discussed earlier.

01:01:58.520 I just buy them.

01:02:00.040 But yeah, real estate makes more.

01:02:02.680 If it's good income producing real estate, you'll make more on it than you will in mutual

01:02:07.080 funds.

01:02:07.900 Mutual funds average 10%, 12%.

01:02:09.700 Real estate, you ought to make 17 to 20, including the tax benefits, the appreciation that's

01:02:14.320 going up in value, and the cash flow.

01:02:15.880 Those three things do it.

01:02:17.380 The problem with real estate is it's a pain in the butt because you've got to deal with

01:02:22.800 it.

01:02:23.520 You know, the roof leaks, whether it's commercial office building, whether it's a house, doesn't

01:02:29.740 matter.

01:02:30.060 And so, and I've got a lot of both.

01:02:32.980 And, but there's all, you know, there's a tenant that doesn't pay or does pay or it's

01:02:36.580 empty and I can't get a tenant.

01:02:37.760 Uh, you know, there's, uh, there's a hassle factor to dealing with it.

01:02:42.440 Even if you hired management, I mean, uh, my son-in-law runs all the Ramsey real estate

01:02:46.760 stuff and he and I grew up in real estate, so I love working with him on it, but he handles

01:02:51.700 the day to day to day.

01:02:52.640 I don't screw with all that today, but, but it's a pain.

01:02:56.020 So this idea that I hear this stuff on social media stuff, real estate's passive income,

01:03:01.200 bull crap, nothing passive about it.

01:03:03.680 Your butt's active.

01:03:04.680 I mean, you're right in the middle of it or, or you're getting screwed one of the two.

01:03:08.400 Yeah.

01:03:08.640 You get in.

01:03:09.180 Oh yeah.

01:03:09.680 I got into some real estate and it was, uh, it was a night, it was so much extra work

01:03:14.700 that I didn't realize, you know, complaints, somebody's Airbnb in the building, somebody's,

01:03:20.700 um, you know, started a fire or something, you know, because they didn't want to use the

01:03:25.820 heat in their unit or whatever.

01:03:27.120 It's like, you can't just do a fire.

01:03:29.060 Like you got a need a fireplace.

01:03:31.520 Yeah.

01:03:32.140 Yeah.

01:03:33.840 Just crazy.

01:03:34.880 People just, yeah.

01:03:35.940 People just, yeah.

01:03:36.720 Doing fires.

01:03:38.460 Yeah.

01:03:38.820 Just stuff like that.

01:03:39.720 I think a lot of alarming stuff.

01:03:41.640 Um, but yeah, there's no easy real, there's no easy way to it.

01:03:46.400 Well, I mean the T bill, you know what you're talking about?

01:03:48.860 That's, you don't buy it and you forget it and they send you a check.

01:03:51.940 It's not as big a check, but there's no hassle.

01:03:54.700 Yeah.

01:03:55.080 You know, mutual funds, a little more risk because you're in there with all these companies

01:03:58.720 or could be something going on.

01:04:00.120 Even if you're in 90 to 200 and limited the risk by spreading it out, you still got more

01:04:05.020 risk than you would in a T bill, but you're going to make a little more.

01:04:07.340 Yeah.

01:04:07.820 You want a little more hassle, go to the real estate.

01:04:09.820 You're going to make a little more.

01:04:10.700 So you don't want to be, uh, you know, I try to just say it's a risk return ratio.

01:04:17.120 If I'm going to take some risk and have some hassle, I want some extra money for that.

01:04:21.980 Yeah.

01:04:22.380 Yeah.

01:04:22.700 Cause it's the stress it causes.

01:04:23.920 It's like, do I want to be, cause I'll notice, yeah, like some stocks is too much stress for

01:04:27.980 me cause I'll check them too much and I don't like it.

01:04:30.160 And then it's like, I've spent, you know, 30 minutes of my day dang checking stocks and

01:04:34.160 that's money time.

01:04:35.360 I could have just had him doing my work.

01:04:36.980 Yeah.

01:04:37.280 I buy a mutual fund, set it and forget it.

01:04:39.580 I don't even know what the market has done this year.

01:04:41.580 Wow.

01:04:42.020 And I do this for a living.

01:04:43.240 Wow.

01:04:43.680 I don't keep up with it.

01:04:44.520 I don't, cause it's, I'm not betting on this week.

01:04:47.820 I'm saying, okay, you know, look at what the stock market has done since 1980, since

01:04:54.360 1990, since 2012, look at what I would have made if I'd have put $10,000, what it would

01:04:59.960 have made.

01:05:00.340 And that's how I'm playing it is the long haul, the long play.

01:05:04.260 Wow.

01:05:06.240 God.

01:05:06.680 Well, there it is.

01:05:08.560 1992, $1,000 would have turned into $5,000.

01:05:12.420 Was there, was there ever a stock that you bought Dave where you were like, man, I wish

01:05:15.640 I would have held onto that, that you just remember, like even when you were younger,

01:05:18.760 was there one?

01:05:19.200 No, I never bought single stocks ever.

01:05:21.600 The only dumb thing I did is I bought gold one time.

01:05:24.880 This buddy of mine, again, you know, these buddies in my twenties, he was making money

01:05:29.080 and he had this gold guy that we could buy options on gold, which we don't even buy in

01:05:35.160 the gold, just buying the right to buy the gold.

01:05:37.340 And he said he put in $5,000 and if it goes up, the option goes from $5,000 to $50,000.

01:05:43.480 I'm going to 10X my money.

01:05:45.440 And 14 times in a row, this guy had hit.

01:05:50.320 Wow.

01:05:50.680 You put it in and like he had predicted and he said, okay, we need to go in right now

01:05:54.400 and put $5,000, I dropped $5,000 in there.

01:05:57.100 15th time he didn't hit.

01:05:58.280 But it's all or nothing.

01:05:59.820 So I lost the whole $5,000 and no sign of $50,000, right?

01:06:04.220 No.

01:06:04.540 So I'm done.

01:06:05.820 You think it was a pyramid scheme or not?

01:06:07.580 No, no, it's an option.

01:06:08.680 That's how options work.

01:06:09.620 It's just your, it's an uber high risk situation.

01:06:12.240 It's super crazy.

01:06:13.440 It was just gambling.

01:06:14.460 I mean, it's just gambling.

01:06:15.580 You ever been in a pyramid scheme?

01:06:18.100 No.

01:06:19.100 I've been in a couple.

01:06:23.060 Are you talking about multi-level or pyramid?

01:06:25.240 I mean, I don't know what it was.

01:06:27.000 Whatever level it was, I lost on it.

01:06:29.640 I know that.

01:06:30.760 You didn't get off the ride fast enough.

01:06:32.100 Oh, yeah.

01:06:32.720 No, we had, yeah.

01:06:33.740 Oh, yeah.

01:06:34.240 One, I was a child.

01:06:35.320 I got involved.

01:06:36.000 I'd saved up, I mean, probably most of the money I had.

01:06:39.740 And I got into this thing and it was a scam.

01:06:42.820 And that was horrible.

01:06:44.840 God, that killed me.

01:06:46.140 And then another time they had a dude, somebody was selling like glitter mining or something

01:06:51.060 in our area and they sold a bunch of shares of that shit and screwed everybody.

01:06:56.260 You know, I remember in the 80s, everybody decided that emus were going to be the new

01:07:01.500 meat.

01:07:01.940 What?

01:07:02.680 Really?

01:07:03.300 Why?

01:07:03.980 All these rednecks are buying.

01:07:05.640 Pull one up.

01:07:05.880 This is unbelievable.

01:07:06.420 All these rednecks are making emu farms.

01:07:10.200 And so, like, it's like ostrich meat, right?

01:07:12.500 And so, they were.

01:07:13.820 Oh, come on, brother.

01:07:15.220 So, they were, it's, it was a big deal.

01:07:17.800 And a lot of people decided they were going to sell everything and open an emu farm.

01:07:21.480 Really?

01:07:21.960 And because for the meat, it's like ostrich meat.

01:07:24.820 It's like, I don't know, it's a big bird meat, big white meat.

01:07:28.360 So, yeah.

01:07:29.080 Just bring up a picture of an emu, brother.

01:07:30.840 I can't find a dang emu.

01:07:31.960 You can't find one now, I guess.

01:07:34.000 Yeah, he got images right there.

01:07:34.380 Well, you got the commercial, right?

01:07:35.560 There he is.

01:07:35.940 Scroll down a little bit.

01:07:37.080 Let me see what we got.

01:07:38.120 See, he's got a little meat on.

01:07:39.120 Oh, gosh, yeah.

01:07:41.040 Yeah, I, yeah, so, yeah, it's hilarious, though.

01:07:43.920 These rednecks around Tennessee, they were having emu farms.

01:07:46.980 Damn, you ever had any of them?

01:07:48.200 No, I managed to stay out of that scam.

01:07:50.640 That was one of those fad things that didn't work, so.

01:07:54.180 Yeah, that's a damn tall turkey, huh?

01:07:55.700 It's like buying, like, Beanie Babies.

01:07:56.920 Everybody's collecting Beanie Babies.

01:07:57.940 Dude, I remember Beanie Babies.

01:07:59.320 They were going to get rich on Beanie Babies, right?

01:08:01.020 Oh, yeah, and now they have two garbage bags.

01:08:03.780 Women fighting, like, like, cage match fighting.

01:08:07.760 In the airport gift shop to get the Beanie Babies, right?

01:08:11.060 Remember the Princess Diana Beanie Babies that came out?

01:08:12.320 There it is, yeah.

01:08:13.180 It's supposed to go for, like, $10,000?

01:08:15.000 Never happened.

01:08:15.760 Never once.

01:08:16.960 Nope.

01:08:17.380 Sorry.

01:08:18.120 Oh, this is a...

01:08:18.520 My dog plays with them now.

01:08:19.940 Yeah.

01:08:20.120 But we had the whole freaking collection.

01:08:21.860 Not because it was an investment, but because my wife was freaking obsessed, and I was traveling,

01:08:25.820 and she's at every airport.

01:08:26.780 She's been there.

01:08:27.380 So, yeah, see, $49,000 on eBay for the Princess.

01:08:31.840 Never sold, though.

01:08:32.820 No, that's the thing.

01:08:33.940 Never sold.

01:08:34.540 Didn't happen.

01:08:34.980 Never sold.

01:08:35.840 Yeah, they had...

01:08:36.700 My buddy won his family's football pool.

01:08:41.760 It was like their NCAA, their college football pool they did every year.

01:08:45.240 He won us, like, $600, dude.

01:08:47.360 He was so excited.

01:08:48.620 He could have changed his life.

01:08:49.880 And instead, his mom convinced him to buy a Christmas village of, like, rare Christmas

01:08:57.060 village houses.

01:08:57.980 Oh, yeah!

01:08:59.140 They're back.

01:09:00.360 They're back.

01:09:01.820 They're coming right...

01:09:02.500 They're happening right now.

01:09:03.640 My buddy to this day is...

01:09:05.740 He's big into Christmas houses.

01:09:07.580 No rent.

01:09:08.520 Rent in much.

01:09:09.160 The tenants don't make much noise.

01:09:11.700 And the streetlights are always on.

01:09:15.620 Electric bill's low.

01:09:16.580 Oh, is he?

01:09:17.300 Yeah, so, yeah.

01:09:18.180 He's running into a lot of issues, but, God, that just broke him, man.

01:09:22.780 He never recovered from that.

01:09:26.040 Dude, I met a dude yesterday in Tennessee.

01:09:27.780 He said he took out an $800 life insurance policy on his wife.

01:09:31.980 I'm like...

01:09:32.500 $800?

01:09:34.580 That's pretty insulting.

01:09:36.060 Well, yeah, that's what I felt like.

01:09:39.140 I'm like, dude, do not tell her that.

01:09:41.180 I was like, she's going to be pissed off.

01:09:42.620 Yeah, this is like...

01:09:44.620 And he's like, well, my truck payment's $7.99 a month, so...

01:09:48.180 That solves it.

01:09:50.520 Yeah, speaking of, like, yeah, like, kind of traps, I guess, like, what are...

01:09:54.920 Like, so, a lot of things...

01:09:56.320 You've spoken out against crypto, I know.

01:09:58.100 I'm not a crypto fan.

01:09:58.980 I lost $2,000 in crypto, just like every one of my friends did when it first came out,

01:10:02.900 right?

01:10:04.800 Like, NFTs, things like that, that kind of pop up that really...

01:10:08.740 They're almost...

01:10:10.060 To me, some of them seem like the modern-day pyramid scheme, in a way.

01:10:13.520 The emu farm.

01:10:14.540 Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a lot of emu farms, baby.

01:10:17.860 What do you...

01:10:18.340 How do you...

01:10:19.420 Why are more people falling susceptible to these types of things, do you think?

01:10:23.680 We always have.

01:10:25.760 It's human nature.

01:10:27.580 We want...

01:10:28.580 We're wired by God to look for the shortest path, to look for optimum, to look for the

01:10:36.200 best, the quickest, the easiest.

01:10:38.000 And there's nothing wrong with that.

01:10:39.220 That makes our lives better, because we create inventions and things that make our lives better.

01:10:43.040 That very wiring created the automobile, or created the iPhone, or created things that

01:10:48.740 make our lives better.

01:10:49.600 And so that's a good wiring.

01:10:51.320 But where it gets off track is where we think we can short-circuit a proven process.

01:10:58.220 And it causes you to jump from investor to speculator.

01:11:02.940 And investors are always the crockpot.

01:11:04.500 They're always the long play.

01:11:06.200 They're always saying, okay, I'm going to invest in mutual funds.

01:11:09.100 I don't care what stock market did this year.

01:11:11.180 I'm thinking, what's it going to be in 20 years?

01:11:13.320 What's it going to be in 15 years?

01:11:14.920 And how am I going to be doing?

01:11:16.660 You know?

01:11:17.020 And so I'm thinking long-term.

01:11:18.700 The speculator needs a quick flip.

01:11:22.480 And so Bitcoin has never really been about investing.

01:11:26.680 It's a speculation.

01:11:28.060 It's a short-term play.

01:11:29.600 No one bought that and said, you know, in 20 years, this is going to look brilliant.

01:11:33.760 Yeah.

01:11:33.980 No one did.

01:11:34.480 They all thought quick money, easy money.

01:11:37.120 No one flips houses with nothing down that they saw on TikTok.

01:11:42.260 You know?

01:11:42.880 Quick flip.

01:11:43.500 Quick flip.

01:11:44.380 When a builder even builds a home that they're not custom building, they call it a spec house.

01:11:51.460 It means speculation.

01:11:53.140 They're speculating that they're going to sell that house.

01:11:55.220 It's a short-term play.

01:11:57.060 They're not building that house in that subdivision hoping to sit on it 10 years.

01:12:01.360 They're building it hoping to sit on it 10 days.

01:12:04.340 And so it's speculation.

01:12:06.060 So where you get confused, where you mess up is where you can fall into scams and get

01:12:10.660 rich quick and violate basic investing principles is when you move from investing, which is long-term

01:12:17.700 mentality, to speculation, which is quick hit.

01:12:20.300 I want quick money, easy money, quick money, easy money.

01:12:22.440 And that's that wiring that's positive wiring gone astray.

01:12:26.300 Yeah.

01:12:26.700 You know, become toxic.

01:12:27.680 And so, uh, and, and in a sense, that's what happened to me when I went broke in real estate

01:12:32.540 because I was buying houses.

01:12:33.940 I was doing flip this house before Chip and Joanna were born, you know?

01:12:36.960 And so that's what we were, we were getting it.

01:12:39.340 And I've owned like 2000 houses in my life.

01:12:41.600 So I was, I was churning them, man, but I was doing it on 90 day notes, short-term notes

01:12:46.400 because I was not buying them as a long-term play.

01:12:48.820 I was buying them to fix them and flip them.

01:12:50.520 And the bank got sold to another bank.

01:12:52.320 They look up and they can call my notes in 90 days.

01:12:55.020 So they called a million two in 90 days and it crashed me.

01:12:57.800 And so, cause I was a speculator.

01:12:59.520 I wasn't an investor.

01:13:00.500 Now I would have told you I was a real estate investor, right?

01:13:03.500 But the actual definition of the term investor means longer term horizon, long window.

01:13:10.560 And so if it's, thank God it's Friday, oh God, it's Monday.

01:13:12.860 If I got to move it this calendar year or in the next two calendar years to make money

01:13:16.800 on it, then, you know, you're playing the roulette wheel.

01:13:19.000 You're playing Texas hold'em.

01:13:20.180 You're that's speculation.

01:13:21.860 You're gambling then.

01:13:23.060 And that's a different thing.

01:13:24.280 It's okay if you want to do some of that, but quit calling it investing because then

01:13:28.620 it causes you to put too dadgum much money in it because you lose your butt then.

01:13:32.160 And that's where you get scammed is you're looking for something for nothing quick, a

01:13:36.140 quick turn, double my money fast because I don't think I can get there long-term.

01:13:40.900 So I'm so desperate and so scared, so fearful, so greedy that I got to get it right now.

01:13:46.460 And that's what I was doing.

01:13:47.320 And it worked.

01:13:47.920 I got a million dollars worth of stuff, but I didn't keep it because I built a house

01:13:51.280 of courage.

01:13:52.880 Obviously, when you work, sometimes it's weird.

01:13:54.740 Like, people ask me, like, what hobbies do I have and stuff?

01:13:57.040 But the weird thing is, like, a lot of my hobbies became my jobs, you know?

01:14:04.940 Is that kind of what happened for you?

01:14:06.840 Or do you still, like, have things that you like to do outside of?

01:14:10.620 You know, as I got further down in the business in the last several decades, I actually do have

01:14:16.000 things I do outside of here.

01:14:18.000 But in the first few decades, it was just, you're right.

01:14:21.220 I get great joy out of the stuff we do.

01:14:23.980 Yeah.

01:14:24.180 We help people.

01:14:25.400 You know, a lot of people are real scared.

01:14:27.000 They're broken.

01:14:27.560 They're about to lose their house.

01:14:28.620 They've been through bankruptcy.

01:14:29.600 Their marriage is on the rocks, whatever.

01:14:31.180 We're able to help them.

01:14:32.140 And that's, you know, it's wonderful.

01:14:33.840 I have a lot of fun doing the show still.

01:14:36.700 Again, I mean, once you've been on stage with an audience, our gig's a different gig.

01:14:41.700 But it's still, you know, it's fun to be with people and it's fun to be with people that

01:14:45.720 want to be there, you know?

01:14:46.900 And it's addicting in that regard.

01:14:49.620 So I enjoy that whole thing.

01:14:51.080 I enjoy that scene.

01:14:51.920 I enjoy running the business.

01:14:53.180 But I also have picked up a few things away from here so that I, distractions and I don't

01:14:58.440 know if they're hobbies, I guess, but I end up collecting stuff or whatever, doing that

01:15:02.500 kind of stuff.

01:15:03.120 And yeah, but there's nothing wrong with, especially in the first couple of decades with almost all

01:15:09.020 your energy doing that other than family stuff.

01:15:12.100 Yeah.

01:15:13.440 What are some, like, obviously you've learned a lot of financial lessons over the years.

01:15:16.420 Like, what were some personal lessons that you had to learn along the way too that like

01:15:20.380 kind of helped you?

01:15:21.180 Like, was there some things that have kind of stood out to you, you feel like?

01:15:24.400 You know, I, yeah, I didn't know how to lead.

01:15:32.320 I mean, like you said earlier, we're talking about hiring an employee.

01:15:35.580 Oh, yeah.

01:15:36.200 I, I just, I was so dumb that I thought if you hired people that they would like work.

01:15:42.320 Yeah.

01:15:42.620 They knew what to do.

01:15:43.800 Well, no, that they would just actually work.

01:15:45.220 I thought, I thought they would just show up.

01:15:46.700 I thought they'd be on time.

01:15:47.940 I didn't think they'd steal.

01:15:48.900 I was so dumb that I thought all that.

01:15:51.200 And so I just like, if you could fog up a mirror, yeah, let's go do this together, man.

01:15:55.220 Come on, get in here.

01:15:56.080 I'll put you on payroll.

01:15:56.840 Let's go.

01:15:57.440 And then I got all this crazy and all this drama and all this other stuff.

01:16:00.660 I was horrible.

01:16:01.960 And I was, I was pretty much a boss.

01:16:04.220 Bosses, uh, push leaders pull.

01:16:08.940 And man, when I was 32 years old, I didn't get that.

01:16:11.480 And we hired our first person when I was 32.

01:16:14.360 And so, you know, over the years I've had to learn to not be behind.

01:16:18.840 Cause I mean, if you're a boss, you're just at the back of the cattle and cracking the whip.

01:16:23.700 And it's like, you're moving at the speed of the slowest cow, you know, like the slowest common denominator in the room.

01:16:30.520 You know, it's like, you get on.

01:16:32.620 If you're the, a leader, you're standing at the train going, uh, we're leaving.

01:16:37.420 Anybody want to get on?

01:16:38.700 Cause this thing's going right.

01:16:40.440 You better keep up cause we're going hard.

01:16:42.740 And you better get it.

01:16:44.740 And so I had to get around front of that and say, all right, I'm going to lead.

01:16:49.000 And then I went to this Christian conference with a guy named John Maxwell, who's become a great friend.

01:16:53.640 He's one of the top leadership speakers in the world.

01:16:55.840 Is he really?

01:16:56.460 And he, um, he said, you know, you, you should be a servant leader.

01:17:01.400 And I went, say what?

01:17:03.540 I'm the one writing the check.

01:17:04.920 I ain't the servant.

01:17:06.760 I'm confused here.

01:17:08.520 And I, I thought he meant subservient.

01:17:11.300 And what he meant was you got to love your people and you got to care what's best for them.

01:17:16.400 And sometimes that means telling them hard truth that they don't want to hear.

01:17:20.500 Sometimes it means they can't work anymore because they can't behave, you know, uh, that kind of stuff.

01:17:26.760 And so I realized I had been serving my kids by making them brush their teeth against their will.

01:17:31.820 And, you know, so they have some teeth later that's serving them.

01:17:35.000 So it's a servant leader.

01:17:36.600 Right.

01:17:36.960 And so, yeah, I'm good with servant leadership.

01:17:39.120 And so I had to learn that.

01:17:40.620 I, I, again, I sucked.

01:17:42.380 I was a horrible boss.

01:17:43.520 Cause I just, I was going so hard.

01:17:45.200 I thought everybody else was going hard and I was pissed off cause they weren't keeping up.

01:17:48.260 Yeah.

01:17:48.620 And I'm like, well, you hired a bunch of donkeys and expect to win the dadgum Kentucky Derby.

01:17:53.020 Yeah.

01:17:53.280 And no donkey ever won, man.

01:17:54.780 So we had to look for thoroughbreds and have a donkey ectomy and it was a problem, man.

01:17:59.740 And so, yeah, I was, I sucked.

01:18:02.160 And, and I've, I'm, I, I mean, I'm a world-class leader today.

01:18:05.620 It's one of the things I'm best at.

01:18:06.740 I love our people.

01:18:07.580 I love our team.

01:18:08.600 The way this place functions and operates, it's one of the best places in Nashville to work.

01:18:12.620 Probably the best places in the world to work.

01:18:14.700 And it's not perfect.

01:18:15.840 We screw up, but, but we treat people right.

01:18:18.360 We care about them and we expect high things out of them.

01:18:20.820 We expect them to get it.

01:18:21.800 And, and they do.

01:18:23.360 We've got a great team.

01:18:25.260 Wow.

01:18:25.720 Yeah.

01:18:26.080 I think that's something that I did have slowly like had to, yeah, that's been an, that's

01:18:30.300 been a tough journey for me.

01:18:32.240 Like even just having a few employees and it's like, you're suddenly a, yeah, you're suddenly

01:18:38.600 a boss.

01:18:39.140 You didn't even want to be a boss.

01:18:40.000 Like some of that too.

01:18:40.960 I think just a realization like, oh, I'm the boss, I guess, you know?

01:18:45.400 And they're like, well, yeah, you are.

01:18:47.180 And I'm like, well, I was just trying, I was just trying to get crap done.

01:18:50.100 You know?

01:18:50.420 Who knew?

01:18:51.320 You know?

01:18:51.800 And I needed somebody to do that thing.

01:18:53.640 And you brought you in to do that thing.

01:18:55.000 And then you brought all your crap with you when you did that.

01:18:57.440 Now I got to deal with your crap.

01:18:58.540 So, you know, and that, that's been, that's been a 30 year journey.

01:19:02.780 And, and so.

01:19:03.840 That's huge.

01:19:04.340 Boss versus leader.

01:19:05.220 That's so, it's really, it's such a good way to look at it.

01:19:09.740 Um, and would you go to conference and stuff to learn about that stuff too?

01:19:12.520 Cause I'm sure you had to evolve in that space.

01:19:14.240 I did.

01:19:14.420 I read like a maniac.

01:19:15.720 And so I'm going to read, you know, leadership books, business books.

01:19:18.700 I still read like crazy.

01:19:20.160 I love to get new information in this digital age and old guy like me.

01:19:24.280 I got, I get, I get, I'm sitting in these meetings with these studs and I, I don't even know what they're saying.

01:19:29.820 And they work for me.

01:19:31.400 I'm like, what did you just say?

01:19:32.940 So I have to keep up.

01:19:33.980 I mean, I gotta, I gotta work hard.

01:19:35.320 I gotta pedal hard just to stay on the bike.

01:19:37.540 And so, um, yeah, I still do that stuff and I still, you know, hang out.

01:19:41.920 And the good news is some of the guys that are the best writers and thinkers in the world have become friends over the years.

01:19:47.180 And so they're my running buddies.

01:19:48.800 So we hang out.

01:19:49.520 I get to talk offline with them and they still teaching me stuff.

01:19:52.520 It's cool.

01:19:53.240 What about like fiction?

01:19:54.280 You read anything like that ever?

01:19:55.300 Oh yeah.

01:19:55.700 Always.

01:19:56.300 Yeah.

01:19:56.600 All the Jack Carr stuff.

01:19:57.980 You read Jack?

01:19:58.720 Yeah.

01:19:58.980 Yeah, I read all that stuff.

01:20:00.480 And Brad Thor's a friend.

01:20:02.240 I read all of his stuff.

01:20:03.360 All those spy novels and stuff.

01:20:05.620 Fiction makes airplanes fly fast.

01:20:07.900 Yeah, it does, huh?

01:20:09.560 Yeah, Jack Carr, that's wild, dude.

01:20:12.820 Yeah, I was like a big John Grisham fan when I was growing up.

01:20:15.000 Yeah, I read all of his.

01:20:16.280 Every one of his.

01:20:17.940 And.

01:20:19.260 Daniel Silva's the guy, the guy, he writes like, uh, the, uh, the character of the prog, uh, prognosis is, um,

01:20:26.760 uh, an Israeli Mossad, uh, spy, you know, versus Jack Carr's is a former SEAL team and, you know, and Brad Thor's is all the same stuff.

01:20:37.120 You know, they're, they're all former Delta, former SEAL or whatever, that kind of stuff.

01:20:39.880 So it's in the same genre and I've read all of his stuff too.

01:20:43.100 But again, I just, that, so yeah, I do read fiction.

01:20:45.680 Something you like, yeah.

01:20:46.540 Um, when people look at like, um, there's an election this year, it's an election year.

01:20:53.420 When people look at the election, do you feel like who they vote for could have an effect on their future finances?

01:21:02.480 Sure.

01:21:03.420 Sure.

01:21:04.160 Um, not as much as the candidates would like you to believe.

01:21:08.320 Right.

01:21:08.620 Um, it turns out that I've done stupid stuff under every single white house and I have done smart stuff under every single white house and I've increased our size of our business under every single white house.

01:21:20.400 None of them have been dumb enough to destroy my life and, um, none of them have ever sent me any money.

01:21:25.940 Yeah.

01:21:26.480 So most of them don't even send me my money back.

01:21:28.880 So, um, so, you know, what happens at your house is way more important than what happens at the white house.

01:21:34.660 But yeah, policy does matter.

01:21:36.580 It changes whether we've got $3 gas or $5 gas, you know, um, you know, uh, and, and that matters.

01:21:43.440 Cause if you run a heat and air company and you got 30 trucks out there and you're trying to feed your family and trying to feed that guy who's on that truck's family and the gas price doubles on that, run that truck down the road to fix somebody's heat and air.

01:21:53.560 It changes the whole P and L on that company.

01:21:55.560 And then that guy wants a raise and it ain't there cause some doober at the white house turned the faucet on or off on the wall.

01:22:01.160 And that stuff matters.

01:22:02.640 That shows up.

01:22:03.340 And so, um, you know, policy does matter in that regard cause it affects things and policy during, uh, stressful times matters because it caught, whether people feel, Ronald Reagan didn't do anything special, but he made people feel like it was going to be prosperous.

01:22:19.300 Whether you agree with him or not, he, he was a, he was a motivator.

01:22:22.940 He was aspirational.

01:22:24.920 And so.

01:22:25.760 It's a good point.

01:22:26.600 Huh?

01:22:27.020 I, he didn't really have any magic wands that he waved at the Reaganomics or, you know, raise, uh, an art.

01:22:33.320 Art Laffer that wrote the Reaganomic stuff lives here in town.

01:22:35.860 He's a friend of mine.

01:22:36.560 He was on Reagan's cabinet at the time.

01:22:38.400 He's in his eighties.

01:22:39.820 Wonderful man.

01:22:40.520 Brilliant man.

01:22:41.100 But art Laffer did not turn America around Ronald Reagan, but Ronald Reagan made people believe again.

01:22:47.060 And when you can believe instead of believe everything's bad, it's horrible, it's divisive.

01:22:50.800 We're not going to do anything.

01:22:51.900 People sit at home and they don't do things.

01:22:53.940 And then the economy starts to, that, that stuff does have an effect, but you can win in any situation.

01:22:59.240 So, uh, vote for, vote for who you want to vote for.

01:23:02.280 Um, but don't vote for them cause they're going to fix your life cause they're not.

01:23:05.920 Now that's a great statement.

01:23:07.740 Yeah.

01:23:08.220 Um, in the end, it really comes down to you, doesn't it?

01:23:11.820 You still believe that it really seems like that.

01:23:13.580 Yeah, I really do.

01:23:14.560 Um, you know, John Stossel wanted to interview me many years ago, went back when he did 2020

01:23:19.540 and all that stuff.

01:23:20.340 And he was a scary dude cause you know, if he's going to go come at your throat or whether

01:23:23.900 he's going to be a friend in an interview.

01:23:25.700 And we went down there and we were sitting off stage or on stage, I guess, doing the interview.

01:23:30.520 And he said, you know, I've read all your stuff and I'm, and he goes, I think, uh, I don't

01:23:36.280 think you're as much of a conservative as you think you are.

01:23:38.800 He said, I think you're a, uh, a social conservative and an economic libertarian.

01:23:45.180 I went, okay, I'll go with that.

01:23:47.400 And so, yeah, the economic libertarian would say, you know, uh, if it's to be, it's up

01:23:53.180 to me, get up, go mow some grass, get your pressure washer, get your butt in gear.

01:23:58.260 And you know, the government's just something you got to overcome.

01:24:01.360 They're in the way.

01:24:02.540 They're not going to lift me.

01:24:04.280 If I'm waiting on the government to lift me, all I can think about is the DMV line.

01:24:08.220 Yeah.

01:24:08.560 I mean, come on, you know, so I'm not, so I'm that guy.

01:24:11.900 Um, but it comes out of my Scotch Irish redneck history.

01:24:15.060 You know, I mean, the Scotch Irish are always been fighting everything.

01:24:18.400 They've always been independent.

01:24:19.880 Yeah.

01:24:20.200 I think a brave heart, you know, as independent blood pressure too.

01:24:23.380 Yeah.

01:24:23.720 That always looking for a fight, you know, um, always looking to stir something up.

01:24:27.580 If there's no drama, just make some.

01:24:29.560 And so I, that, you know, I've made a good living doing it though.

01:24:32.400 Yeah.

01:24:33.960 Um, where'd you meet your wife at, Dave?

01:24:36.420 College.

01:24:37.000 Oh, you did?

01:24:37.580 Yeah.

01:24:37.840 Marketing class.

01:24:38.960 Nice.

01:24:39.560 And you went to college in Tennessee or no?

01:24:40.880 I did.

01:24:41.200 University of Tennessee.

01:24:42.060 You did?

01:24:42.460 We both graduated from UT.

01:24:43.740 Yeah.

01:24:44.160 Nice, dude.

01:24:44.860 Is there a better place to see a football game than Neyland?

01:24:47.080 Wow.

01:24:47.700 It's a religion.

01:24:48.740 Yeah, it really is.

01:24:49.500 It's wild.

01:24:50.360 It's so sweet over there.

01:24:51.440 When they're winning, especially.

01:24:53.000 Yeah.

01:24:53.740 Yeah.

01:24:54.180 It's kind of nice lately.

01:24:55.020 Yeah, it helps.

01:24:55.680 The past two years has been definitely a good time to get on board.

01:24:57.720 Not good being with 110,000 people when you're losing, because they are angry rednecks.

01:25:01.560 But yeah, me, I'm one of them.

01:25:03.540 I'm like, oh, I'm pissed.

01:25:04.840 But yeah.

01:25:05.120 Do you go to some games ever?

01:25:06.360 We had, uh, suites for, uh, suite seats for years when our kids were down there.

01:25:11.680 And so we'd go down almost every game and, but the kids are grown and got grandkids and

01:25:17.000 we're traveling doing other stuff.

01:25:18.120 So we gave those up.

01:25:19.100 But so I'm not, I'm not mad about it.

01:25:21.040 It just kind of that phase went away.

01:25:22.640 Yeah.

01:25:23.060 Watch it on the TV now, but better, better experience anyway.

01:25:26.600 But yeah.

01:25:27.460 Yeah.

01:25:27.740 So where'd you meet your wife at, at school?

01:25:29.920 Do you remember where at school?

01:25:32.040 Yeah.

01:25:32.440 Yeah.

01:25:32.640 In marketing class.

01:25:33.820 Oh, in class.

01:25:34.360 You saw her, huh?

01:25:35.200 Yeah.

01:25:35.360 She was cheating off my paper.

01:25:36.560 Was she really?

01:25:38.700 But she was cute.

01:25:39.600 So I thought it was a good idea.

01:25:40.520 Let her look over it.

01:25:41.340 It was a good idea.

01:25:41.900 Yeah.

01:25:42.180 Yeah.

01:25:43.500 It's your paper.

01:25:45.320 It's your paper, honey.

01:25:46.580 Um, have you ever been approached by, uh, like, I know you've had different, um, obviously

01:25:53.000 books and, and, um, like programs for people to achieve wealth and to save their money.

01:26:00.500 Um, do, have you ever like had a package or something that you've taken to like a shark

01:26:05.060 tank or to like, uh, um, uh, something like that where they've tried to know, uh, because

01:26:11.260 we kind of bootstrapped every bit of this.

01:26:13.100 It was just like, we make a little money.

01:26:14.500 We try something new with that money.

01:26:15.740 We make a little more money.

01:26:16.600 We try something new with that money.

01:26:17.720 And again, we've lost a lot of money, done a lot of stupid stuff doing that, but we've

01:26:21.340 also done some things right that have worked.

01:26:23.240 And so, um, I mean, we're the second largest talk radio show in America, 680 stations,

01:26:30.060 about 10 million listeners on talk radio alone.

01:26:32.900 Uh, Hannity's number one.

01:26:34.600 Rush was number one.

01:26:36.040 Hannity was two.

01:26:36.640 We were three.

01:26:37.280 Rush passed away.

01:26:38.240 Not a good way to get to be number two, but it happened.

01:26:40.720 I mean, he's Elvis.

01:26:41.920 He invented rock and roll.

01:26:43.120 He invented talk radio.

01:26:44.780 So it was, it was, uh, and both of them did pills too.

01:26:48.240 I think, to be honest, but that's, I have no idea.

01:26:51.040 But I'm just saying, yeah, no idea.

01:26:52.840 But yeah, they, anyway, so anyway, we started in that world when it grew and grew and grew

01:26:57.060 and grew.

01:26:57.380 And I remember the day a guy walked in my office and said, Hey, we need a podcast.

01:27:01.700 And I'm like, what the flip is a podcast?

01:27:04.420 And he said, why do I need one?

01:27:05.960 And he goes, it's the thing.

01:27:07.200 And man, it was a long time ago.

01:27:08.880 So we were one of the first podcasts on Apple way back.

01:27:13.780 And cause a lot of people on talk radio didn't want to put it on podcasts because it competed

01:27:18.380 with the radio stations.

01:27:19.620 Right.

01:27:19.780 So you compete in with your own numbers.

01:27:21.280 And you're messing it, messing up everything.

01:27:23.320 And you know, now, I mean, Spotify, Apple, we're number one, two, three on Apple, right

01:27:28.940 in there hovering me and Rogan and some NPR, uh, murder mystery stuff or something, you

01:27:34.080 know, always hanging out in the top 10 there.

01:27:36.440 So we're bouncing around in there and we've had a billion and a half downloads now.

01:27:40.860 And so, and I'm like, what's a podcast?

01:27:43.680 So yeah, you start, you know, you start new stuff and then YouTube, good God, the numbers

01:27:47.540 on YouTube are just cray, cray.

01:27:50.520 And so gone up into the right hockey stick.

01:27:52.800 And so now those two have now eclipsed, um, the, the talk radio business.

01:27:57.380 And so now I'm a podcaster apparently, um, at least you evolved with it though, you know?

01:28:01.940 Well, yeah.

01:28:02.280 I mean, cause we're, we're platform agnostic.

01:28:04.360 I mean, we're, wherever the, wherever the action is, that's where we're going to be.

01:28:07.020 And we didn't abandon when we didn't, we're still dancing with the girl that brought us,

01:28:10.740 you know?

01:28:11.040 So we're still with talk radio, still got 680 stations, still love talk radio.

01:28:14.800 Uh, but, and you know, we're on Sirius XM, Sirius XM came on, it was two companies, Sirius

01:28:19.640 and XM.

01:28:20.320 We went on both of them and everybody's mad.

01:28:21.720 You can't be on both and be on talk radio.

01:28:23.620 And I'm like, yeah, I'm on everything.

01:28:25.420 I'm on podcast.

01:28:26.440 And then we put it on YouTube and then, then, you know, Facebook live.

01:28:30.140 I mean, crap, we'll try anything.

01:28:31.420 TikTok.

01:28:32.440 Good God, help us.

01:28:33.580 We're on TikTok.

01:28:34.460 We're all are.

01:28:35.060 So, you know, it's like the Chinese, they say.

01:28:37.340 That's it, man.

01:28:38.060 Tic-tac.

01:28:38.520 Here we go.

01:28:39.280 So, but the, um, but Hey, you know, and cause you never know which one of these things is going to

01:28:43.720 become the next MySpace and just disappear.

01:28:47.540 And you don't know which one of these other things.

01:28:49.460 So I don't want to bet this whole thing and all these 1100 people are counting on me on

01:28:53.200 one single platform.

01:28:54.980 So we're, we're always innovating, always changing and moving.

01:28:59.120 Um, yeah, it's because yeah, you kind of don't know what the, yeah, you don't know what the

01:29:03.480 next thing can be.

01:29:04.140 That's really going to go well.

01:29:05.580 Um, there was something you said a second ago where like you made some money and then you

01:29:10.760 put it back into the company, right?

01:29:12.960 Or you tried something new with it.

01:29:14.800 That I think is a big, like one of the craziest things that ever happened to me was I was podcasting

01:29:21.160 in my apartment and a guy came along and he said, Hey man, I'm going to give you some

01:29:26.460 money.

01:29:27.660 You can pod, get you a studio, you know?

01:29:31.040 And he, oh, he bought some ads from me.

01:29:33.020 He said, I'm going to pay some ads for a pizza place.

01:29:35.080 It was in my neighborhood.

01:29:36.860 And, uh, and he said, let me give you some money.

01:29:39.720 You should use it to get a studio.

01:29:42.180 And my first thought was, I want to keep that money.

01:29:44.780 You know, I never had any money.

01:29:46.240 I'm keeping this money.

01:29:47.160 I'm not getting a studio.

01:29:47.920 I'll just, I'll just do it in my, to my, in my apartment till it fades out.

01:29:51.720 And then I'll have the money I made from the ads.

01:29:54.560 But he was right.

01:29:55.540 He just saw that thing that I couldn't see of putting the money back into getting myself

01:30:00.180 a studio, which then now I have a studio.

01:30:02.020 It's a little bit of a different place when people come, it's more of a business.

01:30:05.260 And now, you know, it was so hard for me to see that though, you know?

01:30:09.700 Well, and we get to see, I mean, those of us that are fanboys of your work, we'd see a

01:30:13.980 whole nother side of you that, you know, their standup.

01:30:17.040 And then these long form interviews that you're doing, and I'm here, I said, who knew that

01:30:20.580 was going to happen, but I mean, I've seen a bunch of these long forms that you've done.

01:30:23.940 And so it's a whole different, uh, thing.

01:30:26.300 And it's where people start to recognize what those of us in the business of being on stage

01:30:32.040 or in front of a microphone have known, we know, uh, for those of you out there, you

01:30:35.520 don't know this necessarily, but most of the top flight comedians, um, are very bright.

01:30:42.260 You know, comedy's hard.

01:30:45.260 It's more than one of the more, more hard art forms to do acting.

01:30:49.700 You can be dumb as a rock and be an actor because you just try to be somebody else.

01:30:53.240 That's all you're doing.

01:30:54.060 It's a process.

01:30:55.040 Sorry, you actors that are friends.

01:30:56.160 I'm sorry, but, but, uh, but I mean, comedy is, uh, you're, you're, you're messing with

01:31:01.040 people's lives.

01:31:01.860 You're messing with every part of things that mean something to them and you're twisting

01:31:06.180 it at just the right way with right, with the right hesitation, the right move of the,

01:31:10.300 of the sentence structure and everything.

01:31:12.420 It's, it's very difficult.

01:31:13.740 We, you know, we doing motivational speaking or teaching, I teach our guys, if our audiences,

01:31:19.520 if we got 2000, 3000 people in audience, if they don't laugh, laugh every seven minutes,

01:31:23.780 we're going to lose them and we're not comedians, but we have to study what you guys do.

01:31:29.380 So getting to see you do this has, it's brilliant.

01:31:33.220 It's a smart thing to do.

01:31:34.300 It's the same thing.

01:31:34.840 Broken did the same thing.

01:31:35.800 I mean, he moved from, you know, comedy into those long forms and what everybody loves

01:31:40.660 about Joe is the fabulous interviews.

01:31:43.660 Yeah.

01:31:44.040 And I'm a fan boy of his.

01:31:45.300 I watch a lot of his stuff.

01:31:46.380 Oh yeah.

01:31:46.840 He's so good at learning information.

01:31:48.180 He's so good at retaining information.

01:31:50.120 He knows a lot about a lot of stuff.

01:31:51.860 Oh, if you stop, I had dinner with him the other night after the UFC fights and yeah,

01:31:55.540 you're just ready to learn, brother.

01:31:57.060 You better, if you're going to sit down with Joe Rogan, you better be ready to learn something.

01:32:00.420 It doesn't matter if it's over a bowl of soup, a microphone.

01:32:03.260 Yeah.

01:32:03.480 He just loves learning, sharing information.

01:32:06.520 He really is kind of like a library, you know?

01:32:10.200 But what is the mentality that people, it's more of like the mentality of like investing

01:32:15.400 back in yourself, you know?

01:32:17.260 Because there's that fear that I want to just save this, you know?

01:32:22.360 Well, that, yeah.

01:32:24.980 If you realize that no matter what you try, some of it's not going to work, give yourself

01:32:29.140 permission to fail.

01:32:30.500 Then you say, okay, we're going to put this money and we're going to take some home and

01:32:34.020 enjoy it and be generous with it in the community and invest some of it.

01:32:38.300 But we're also going to invest some of it in the best investment, which is, you know,

01:32:42.820 the freaking goose that's laying the golden eggs.

01:32:45.480 Let's, let's, you know, let's have lots of these geese.

01:32:47.420 Let's get, figure out different things we can do, different ways we can move this business

01:32:51.520 around.

01:32:51.820 Do we move to podcasting?

01:32:53.580 Do we move to YouTube?

01:32:54.480 Do we build a studio?

01:32:55.320 Do we build an event center?

01:32:57.120 Do we, um, to create an environment that is a whole different thing than when I rent, uh,

01:33:02.820 a theater somewhere else, which we do both.

01:33:05.480 And we'll always go to these other cities and always be on tour, always do these things.

01:33:08.840 But, but the events on this campus feel way different to the customer when they come in

01:33:14.320 here, because we can control all the freaking variables.

01:33:16.680 I mean, we're Nick Saban playing home game.

01:33:18.980 Yeah.

01:33:19.280 I mean, we know who cuts the grass.

01:33:21.200 We know who dialed the microphone in.

01:33:23.020 I got a two dB drop from the front of the stage to the back of that auditorium.

01:33:26.800 Wow.

01:33:27.220 2,500 seats.

01:33:28.340 It's tight and it's dialed in.

01:33:30.980 And you don't, you know how that sound crap is.

01:33:33.060 It sounds even worse in our world because we're voice.

01:33:35.480 Music, you can just turn it up if the sound's bad.

01:33:37.740 Yeah.

01:33:38.100 You know, but man, you get in these auditoriums, you got bounce back, stinking hockey arena,

01:33:41.680 stinking, hitting the concrete wall coming back at you.

01:33:45.260 You can hear yourself three times and can't even tell what your timing is on stuff.

01:33:48.980 Yeah.

01:33:49.320 That's the worst.

01:33:49.800 You know what I'm talking about.

01:33:50.320 So we've got all that dialed in.

01:33:51.840 That's, that's a reinvestment back into something we know is going to work.

01:33:54.680 Yeah.

01:33:55.440 Yeah.

01:33:55.760 That's a good point, man.

01:33:56.940 Yeah.

01:33:57.100 I think that was a tough thing.

01:33:58.140 It was tough for me to like realize that one of my greatest assets can be myself.

01:34:02.280 Yeah.

01:34:02.880 You know, and be like, well, what if I really want to invest in something to invest in myself?

01:34:08.280 Yeah.

01:34:09.320 How does generosity play?

01:34:10.960 Like there's a lot of fear around generosity sometimes, you know, about like, I have to

01:34:15.040 made this.

01:34:15.640 I have to keep it all for me.

01:34:17.400 Yeah.

01:34:17.720 What is your journey been like with that in life or what have you learned about it?

01:34:22.400 You're exactly right.

01:34:23.320 There is fear around that and fear is the motivator is, is if I give it away, I'm going to have

01:34:27.940 less, which mathematically, you know, if I take a thousand bucks, I give away a hundred,

01:34:33.000 I go on 900.

01:34:33.840 So yeah, I'd get less, but that's a short term mentality.

01:34:37.580 And, um, what I finally figured out after studying this all these years and watching people

01:34:42.740 who are generous, there's a real correlation between people that build wealth and people

01:34:46.340 that are generous.

01:34:46.880 Um, very few wealthy people are really super greedy and don't give.

01:34:51.620 Most of them are very big givers.

01:34:53.300 They're big tippers.

01:34:54.480 They're not like tight.

01:34:55.900 They're not like mean about money.

01:34:57.740 They're very open-handed because they know they can get some more.

01:35:00.460 So what happens is generosity is not an action.

01:35:03.660 It's a character quality like integrity.

01:35:06.320 Integrity is not an action.

01:35:07.460 There are actions that come out when you have integrity.

01:35:09.960 There are actions that come out when you are generous.

01:35:12.660 Generous people are the one to hold the door open for you.

01:35:14.600 Generous people help you pick up the groceries when the stupid bag, they fall out and they're

01:35:17.740 rolling all over the parking lot in the grocery store and you're embarrassed.

01:35:20.340 But the generous person runs over and joins the party and helps you pick up the canned goods and all that.

01:35:25.320 That's the generous person.

01:35:27.000 The generous person is other-centered instead of self-centered.

01:35:32.860 And here's what's weird.

01:35:35.200 Think about who you want to work with.

01:35:37.280 Think about who you want to work for.

01:35:39.280 Think about who you want on your team.

01:35:40.740 Think about the vendor that you want to do business with.

01:35:42.780 The next deal you want to do on an advertiser.

01:35:45.620 You want to deal with a selfish person or a selfless, other-centered person?

01:35:50.260 Self-centered or other-centered?

01:35:51.860 Well, generosity makes people highly attractive.

01:35:56.340 We want to be around generous people.

01:35:58.280 Not because they're going to give us money, but just because of who they are.

01:36:01.620 They're just open-handed.

01:36:02.740 They're thinking about other people.

01:36:05.260 And so there's this huge correlation between generosity and prosperity.

01:36:09.320 You tend to prosper because people want you around.

01:36:12.440 They want you in the deal because you're not there for what you can get.

01:36:16.340 You're there for what you can give, and we're all going to win together.

01:36:19.880 We don't have to kill each other to win, you know?

01:36:22.280 And so that's how, like, Rush or Sean and I in the old days or other people in the talk radio business.

01:36:28.240 Laura Ingram was doing a talk radio show in those days.

01:36:30.460 She's on Fox Personality now.

01:36:32.020 You know, we're all friends.

01:36:33.260 Even though we were competitors, we were head-to-head.

01:36:36.180 If I knock Hannity off a station, I get that station.

01:36:39.180 So we're head-to-head.

01:36:40.020 But we also know I don't have to kill him to win.

01:36:43.760 I mean, I don't have to completely – so we don't – I never talk bad about my competitors in that world because I want to be a generous person.

01:36:51.340 I want to be a – and I'll help them.

01:36:53.140 I've actually helped every one of those people do different things over the time.

01:36:56.260 And so it's just interesting that – and then the giving of money is a natural result for someone who has the character quality of generosity.

01:37:07.840 So, you know, and I watch people – okay, here's the stupid thing.

01:37:11.540 This guy, I was watching him the other day.

01:37:12.780 He pulls up in front of me at the restaurant, the valet parking right here in Nashville.

01:37:17.800 We have valet parkers everywhere.

01:37:19.480 Yeah.

01:37:19.540 And –

01:37:20.800 Oh, wait, churches even have them.

01:37:22.360 Yeah.

01:37:22.760 I mean, who's working valet?

01:37:24.120 Okay.

01:37:24.560 The Lord is my valet, dude.

01:37:26.300 I'm telling you, man.

01:37:27.580 Well, there's that.

01:37:29.360 So I'm – but the guy that's working valet, he's out there in the sun.

01:37:33.880 He's out there in the rain.

01:37:35.240 He's putting up with people's garbage.

01:37:39.200 They're not nice.

01:37:40.900 You know, this is who's working the valet.

01:37:42.120 And this guy pulls up in a Mercedes, and I know the car.

01:37:45.100 It's a great car.

01:37:46.000 It's about $120,000, $130,000 car.

01:37:49.260 And he hands the valet $5.

01:37:52.040 I'm like, dude, that's just stupid.

01:37:56.220 So I pull up in my truck.

01:37:58.520 You know, it's a nice truck, but I pull up in my truck.

01:38:00.900 I hand the guy $20.

01:38:01.980 I'm like, please take care of my baby.

01:38:05.540 And you know where it was when I came out?

01:38:07.020 It was sitting right there.

01:38:08.040 Yeah.

01:38:08.580 You know?

01:38:09.380 So who prospered here?

01:38:11.160 Everybody won.

01:38:12.540 Everybody won.

01:38:13.160 But you didn't give Ferris Bueller's Day off the keys to your Mercedes for $5.

01:38:17.480 I mean, what kind of moron?

01:38:18.760 I mean, seriously, that's just short-sighted.

01:38:21.180 That lack of generosity is short-sighted where it sounds like I'm some kind of big guy

01:38:25.700 because I gave $20 or whatever to park my stupid truck.

01:38:29.820 But I'm not.

01:38:30.920 But there's a payoff there.

01:38:32.460 Hey, my truck didn't – there's nothing wrong with my truck.

01:38:34.240 It's sitting right there.

01:38:34.960 I don't have to wait on it when I come out.

01:38:36.200 The kid had a good night, at least partly, because of me.

01:38:40.000 So I think everybody came out on this transaction.

01:38:43.180 Yeah.

01:38:43.260 So that's how generosity works.

01:38:45.320 Yeah, that's interesting.

01:38:46.500 It's been slow to learn for me.

01:38:48.100 Not slow, but I think it's just been – yeah, I just came from such a fear mentality.

01:38:55.140 Yeah.

01:38:55.300 You know, we just didn't have any money, so it was like – I remember I'd keep my money

01:38:58.260 in a – I'd hide it.

01:38:59.700 Yeah.

01:38:59.920 God, I would hide that money.

01:39:01.360 Yeah.

01:39:01.720 I would spend half my day hiding my dang money, boy.

01:39:04.380 I met this guy –

01:39:04.780 Digging up dirt and hiding it.

01:39:06.120 Oh, I understand.

01:39:07.020 I met this guy who's an Orthodox Jewish rabbi, and we've become good friends, Rabbi Daniel Lappin.

01:39:12.240 He wrote a book –

01:39:12.380 Oh, he's hiding some.

01:39:13.420 He wrote a book – no, no.

01:39:15.120 He wrote a book called Thou Shall Prosper.

01:39:17.340 And he said the problem is when you have that fear is you think money is like cake.

01:39:22.120 Like if I get a slice away, I got less cake.

01:39:24.320 He said money is not like cake.

01:39:25.940 Money is like candles.

01:39:27.780 When you light it, you still got your candle.

01:39:30.220 When you light another one, you still got your candle.

01:39:32.200 You light another one, you still got your candle.

01:39:33.980 That's how money works.

01:39:35.080 Money will grow around you when you're doing the right stuff that you're supposed to be doing.

01:39:39.700 That's how it's a beautiful picture.

01:39:44.100 What role has faith played in your life?

01:39:45.640 You mentioned it a little bit.

01:39:47.060 How's that – what's that been like for you?

01:39:49.800 It's central.

01:39:50.520 I know you said other-centered earlier, which I thought was a term you hear a lot of times.

01:39:58.200 Yeah.

01:39:58.660 I guess that's maybe a faith phrase.

01:40:00.720 I don't know.

01:40:01.340 But it's – honestly, it's taught me how to be a better human being because I really wasn't a good one.

01:40:11.220 I grew up – the crap we did, man, and the way I behaved in my early years of my life –

01:40:17.560 Were you just a dang anarchist or whatever?

01:40:19.220 Yeah, apparently.

01:40:20.720 I did all kinds of just redneck stupid stuff.

01:40:23.480 But I needed to be a better person.

01:40:29.300 And it turns out, again, better people have better lives.

01:40:32.160 So the whole character shift through the faith walk of meeting Jesus and changing that, you know, it cleaned up my view of things.

01:40:44.560 It cleaned up my actions and how I react and those kinds of things because, I mean, again, I grew up where it was, you know, a Scotch-Irish thing.

01:40:56.420 It's like a temper thing going on.

01:40:57.880 And so you can't do that and win out there.

01:41:01.120 You can't be a jerk everywhere.

01:41:02.640 And so you got to go in – you know, they don't want you back on the show if you're a butt in the green room.

01:41:07.820 And so it turns out that all worked out for me.

01:41:11.280 So, you know, the re-transformation, the be not conformed to this world but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, Romans says in the Bible.

01:41:21.500 And so the renewing of my mind over 45 years.

01:41:25.980 And I'm not arrived.

01:41:27.800 Don't misunderstand.

01:41:28.500 But like I said earlier, I'm a lot better husband than I was.

01:41:31.740 I mean, even with my grandbabies, I'm playing my grandbabies.

01:41:34.180 My kids are like, who are you?

01:41:36.520 Right.

01:41:36.600 I'm like, well, I can hand this one back.

01:41:39.500 This one smells bad.

01:41:40.500 It's broke.

01:41:40.980 You can take that one home.

01:41:42.580 But, yeah, who are you?

01:41:44.120 Papa Dave.

01:41:44.920 I mean, come on, man.

01:41:45.700 You wouldn't let us get by with that crap.

01:41:47.540 I'm like, yeah, I know.

01:41:48.160 But I had to make you behave or whatever.

01:41:49.760 You can take this one home.

01:41:50.560 You can teach it.

01:41:51.320 But, yeah, it's central to everything.

01:41:55.040 I know who I am.

01:41:55.960 I know where I'm going.

01:41:57.600 It affects how I deal with kids, marriage.

01:42:01.440 It affects my money.

01:42:02.760 It affects how I lead in the business.

01:42:04.880 It affects our decisions in the marketplace.

01:42:07.460 So, yeah, I guess it's central to everything if you want to look at it that way.

01:42:11.600 It's changed my life.

01:42:13.020 Yeah?

01:42:14.900 Really?

01:42:15.560 Yeah, absolutely.

01:42:16.560 Completely.

01:42:17.400 Wow, that's amazing, man.

01:42:18.520 It's nice to hear.

01:42:21.220 Did you, when you look at your future now, like what are things that you still want to do?

01:42:25.840 You've had so much success and such the opportunity to lead people, to make financial choices.

01:42:32.400 You helped my stepdad pay off our house because of knowledge he learned from you.

01:42:35.860 Wow.

01:42:36.320 I remember that.

01:42:37.120 Very cool.

01:42:37.680 And so it took him a little bit, but I remember one day he told me he'd heard it.

01:42:43.340 And then probably 11 years later, eight years later, something he said, house has paid off.

01:42:48.600 Yeah.

01:42:49.000 It's pretty cool.

01:42:49.740 I love it.

01:42:50.660 What are things that still excite you?

01:42:52.160 You know, things that move the needle and I get to see something move with a little bit of scale out there where we can affect someone's life.

01:43:01.840 And then I run into him.

01:43:04.620 I went in and, you know, this YouTube thing with a billion and a half downloads on that thing.

01:43:10.180 Now, it's a whole new market that, uh, talk radio was old white guys, right?

01:43:15.900 Yeah.

01:43:16.240 Right.

01:43:16.860 But YouTube's youngsters.

01:43:18.600 And so Sharon and I were in Best Buy and these two kids are like 17 years old, run up.

01:43:24.500 Like I'm some kind of freaking rock star or something like, man, I love your YouTube stuff.

01:43:29.620 It's like, man, I just paid cash for my first car because I'm watching you.

01:43:33.020 This stuff on TikTok's so funny and man, thank you.

01:43:36.040 And there was like, Sharon's like, golly, they're 17 years old, man.

01:43:39.840 It's great.

01:43:40.640 Yeah.

01:43:40.800 It's kind of make you feel good.

01:43:41.720 That kind of, that kind of stuff is worth, that makes it worth coming down here every day and, and, you know, flipping on the switch on the microphone, coming up with something, figuring out a way to connect and, uh, and be authentic.

01:43:51.340 You got to be real about it.

01:43:52.740 You can't just, you can't manipulate these platforms.

01:43:55.100 They're too, they're too nuanced and there, there's, um, people can see a fake a mile away.

01:44:01.400 Yeah.

01:44:01.500 Yeah.

01:44:02.280 Yeah.

01:44:02.620 I think it's true.

01:44:03.440 I think, well, it's interesting.

01:44:04.960 Yeah.

01:44:05.080 I think especially now there's so much stuff out there.

01:44:07.480 It's like, um, yeah, you want to try and be as authentic as you can to your own experience, you know, and you've had a lot of great experiences.

01:44:14.000 And so you want to be able to share those, you know, um, in a way that feels comfortable to people.

01:44:18.120 And, um, and obviously you guys have been doing that and doing it really well.

01:44:22.400 Um, yeah.

01:44:23.180 What do you say to somebody like right now?

01:44:24.520 Like what is some of your just basic advice, Dave, if there's somebody who's, you know, uh, they feel like maybe they don't have a chance.

01:44:31.500 Or something, what would you give a, just a, what's your kind of pep talk, your financial guidance for somebody like that?

01:44:37.120 Somebody who's just like, you know, they don't know if they can figure it out.

01:44:42.880 They don't know if they have a ton of hope for themselves.

01:44:45.380 Um, you can't change everything about them, but what are some things you remind them of?

01:44:48.980 Yeah.

01:44:49.460 Dr. John Deloney, that's one of our Ramsey personalities on our team has done a lot of trauma studies.

01:44:55.020 He's got a PhD in counseling.

01:44:56.420 And, um, he says when you're in the middle of trauma, like he's done been on police calls when they go in and there's a, uh, you know, murder or a suicide or something in the home, extreme trauma.

01:45:07.260 And, uh, your body physically reacts to trauma.

01:45:13.360 And he says the way to walk through those things is facts are your friends.

01:45:19.240 Your feelings are not true.

01:45:22.040 And so when you feel stuck and hopeless, you got to back out and start looking about, okay, here's what's really, here's the numbers.

01:45:31.880 And here's the reality of the marketplace.

01:45:35.300 Facts are your friends.

01:45:36.900 And so oftentimes when someone calls on the Ramsey show, that's all we're doing.

01:45:41.560 They call up and they're overwhelmed.

01:45:43.200 They're frozen.

01:45:44.000 They're paralyzed.

01:45:44.800 They don't know what to do.

01:45:45.820 And we're going, no, wait a minute.

01:45:46.920 How much you make a year?

01:45:47.740 We'll make a hundred thousand.

01:45:48.560 Okay.

01:45:48.900 And so, and we, we just, we're stuck.

01:45:51.240 We can't move.

01:45:51.740 We can't, we can't figure out what to do.

01:45:53.060 I'm like, okay, how much you own your car?

01:45:54.780 56,000.

01:45:55.540 Okay.

01:45:56.060 All right.

01:45:56.480 And how much, you know, do you have in retirement?

01:45:58.420 Nothing.

01:45:58.760 Okay.

01:45:59.240 How old are you?

01:46:00.160 I'm 26.

01:46:00.880 Okay.

01:46:01.440 All right.

01:46:01.980 And, you know, and okay.

01:46:03.700 Now, so the facts are that you really have plenty of money coming in and you bought a car you

01:46:10.160 can't afford, sell a stupid car.

01:46:12.460 Yeah.

01:46:13.420 He goes, oh man, you're like a genius.

01:46:17.220 It's like sixth grade math.

01:46:19.620 You know, it's like, so, but all we did was peel back the drama that our, all of us, our,

01:46:25.180 our bodies just freeze up.

01:46:27.160 We just get in freak hopelessness.

01:46:29.220 Yeah.

01:46:29.380 Freezing response to trauma.

01:46:30.720 We're stuck and we don't know what to do.

01:46:33.700 And, and all we do is cut the dadgum trees down so you can see the forest, you know,

01:46:38.560 and can't see the forest for the trees.

01:46:39.960 And so, um, you know, okay, here's your reality.

01:46:43.680 And it's like, you know, a lady called not long ago and she was, uh, she said, they're

01:46:48.120 foreclosing on my house Friday.

01:46:49.780 What am I going to do?

01:46:50.600 I said, I don't know.

01:46:52.280 I don't know.

01:46:53.000 It was Monday.

01:46:54.140 We have five days.

01:46:55.420 What are we going to do?

01:46:56.120 I don't know.

01:46:57.960 I said, one thing you can do is just go get another house.

01:47:01.720 She went, you can do that.

01:47:04.420 I went, yeah, just go get something to rent.

01:47:06.780 People will rent to you.

01:47:07.680 Yeah.

01:47:07.860 People will rent to you.

01:47:09.300 So you're not going to be homeless.

01:47:10.800 You make, she made $120,000 a year.

01:47:13.440 And I'm like, what, you know, we'll just go get you another house, but let's learn

01:47:16.480 about the details of the foreclosure and see if we can stop it.

01:47:18.580 We were able to actually figure out how to stop the foreclosure.

01:47:20.620 But, you know, the reality was her whole life was coming to an end on Friday and it's

01:47:27.160 a house.

01:47:28.260 There's one on every corner.

01:47:29.560 Let's go get another one.

01:47:30.540 Yeah.

01:47:30.860 You know, it's like, but we get just, you know, we get just hammered.

01:47:35.600 We had another one that was really sad.

01:47:37.120 A lady was being foreclosed on a different one.

01:47:39.140 And her husband, 36 years old, was a roofer.

01:47:41.560 He fell through the roof and got killed.

01:47:43.960 And she's got two little kids and the workers' comp didn't pay out.

01:47:48.440 They waited like forever.

01:47:49.560 So the house got behind and she's getting ready to be foreclosed on.

01:47:52.720 And we're like, uh, she owed $60,000 on a $300,000 house.

01:47:56.720 I'm like, no, you are not getting foreclosed on.

01:47:59.180 We are stopping this.

01:48:00.140 This is not happening.

01:48:01.040 You're a widow.

01:48:02.200 Somebody's going to take care of you.

01:48:03.620 And another roofing guy called our office while we're on the air and caught the house

01:48:07.880 up.

01:48:08.600 So, I mean, he said, we're going to take care.

01:48:10.160 Other people stepped in and heard the story start taking care of us.

01:48:12.480 You're not getting foreclosed on.

01:48:13.840 I'm a hundred percent sure it's not going to happen.

01:48:16.680 We're not losing this house, $300,000 house for 60K.

01:48:20.060 So, but she was completely overwhelmed.

01:48:22.100 Other people had taken her power.

01:48:24.160 The situation, the variables had taken her power.

01:48:26.900 She could not see.

01:48:28.340 She was frozen up.

01:48:29.320 And all we did was we weren't there.

01:48:32.200 And so we weren't frozen up and we could see what everybody, everybody listening, everybody

01:48:36.020 watching could see the same thing.

01:48:37.600 Of course, we're not going to let that house get sold.

01:48:39.420 Nothing else.

01:48:39.880 You sell it for 200,000 before Friday.

01:48:42.480 You know, you're not going to give it away for 60.

01:48:44.880 So we're going to do something.

01:48:46.700 But yeah.

01:48:47.160 The fear, people get stuck.

01:48:48.420 Yeah.

01:48:48.780 Yeah.

01:48:49.060 And that's all we do.

01:48:50.820 Is unlock them.

01:48:51.780 Yep.

01:48:52.140 Help unlock them.

01:48:53.040 Yep.

01:48:53.360 With facts.

01:48:54.400 With facts.

01:48:54.880 To somebody that's starting out right now, they're just starting out in the world.

01:48:59.060 They got their first couple of jobs.

01:49:00.380 They just got out of college.

01:49:01.300 How much money do they need to save if they want to have some freedom in the future?

01:49:04.780 What do you tell them, Dave?

01:49:06.620 Well, the first thing we tell them is get out of debt, everything but the house, and then

01:49:10.360 have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses.

01:49:13.040 We call it the baby steps.

01:49:14.660 There they are.

01:49:16.120 And so once you're at baby step three and you have three to six months of expenses, you

01:49:19.900 don't have any payments, but a house payment.

01:49:21.420 So you save three to six months.

01:49:22.700 And so you have savings to pay off for three to six months in case something happens.

01:49:25.880 Exactly.

01:49:26.340 It's a rainy day fund.

01:49:27.280 You don't, it's not a, I want a bass boat.

01:49:29.200 It's a rainy day fund.

01:49:30.660 It's not a, I need a new couch.

01:49:32.280 It's a rainy day fund.

01:49:33.220 You don't touch that.

01:49:34.300 If you're going to buy something else, you save up and pay for it.

01:49:36.900 But to answer your question, baby, step four is invest 15% of your income.

01:49:40.780 When you don't have any payments except a house payment, you can save 15% of your income.

01:49:46.080 And the average household income in America right now is $72,000 a year.

01:49:49.360 If you save 15% of 72,000 from 30 to 65, you're going to have about 5 million bucks

01:49:55.080 in mutual funds.

01:49:56.620 So say that again.

01:49:57.840 So if I'm like five X wrong, you're still a millionaire.

01:50:00.600 Shut up.

01:50:01.420 So you really can't screw this up.

01:50:04.300 It's like, but, but you can screw it up because you live in America and you can get a $1,200

01:50:07.900 car payment for freaking car.

01:50:09.820 You can't afford to impress people to stop light who don't even care about you.

01:50:12.760 Yeah.

01:50:13.240 You know, and that's what we do instead.

01:50:15.040 But, um, or I need another truck, you know, or I need another, whatever.

01:50:19.140 I mean, I'm the same guy, but yeah.

01:50:21.400 So then we say for kids college, uh, six is what your stepdad did.

01:50:24.640 We pay off the house early in 11 years.

01:50:26.100 By the way, oddly enough, 11 years is the average millionaire that paid off their houses

01:50:30.580 in 11 years, 11.2 years in the study that we were talking about earlier.

01:50:34.180 So, so that's one of the things that people did to become millionaires.

01:50:36.780 Yeah.

01:50:36.920 They walked right there on baby steps, millionaires.

01:50:39.300 They walked right up this, they get their house paid off in an average of 11 years.

01:50:43.480 Some of them seven years, some of them 14, but an average of 11.

01:50:46.360 Wow.

01:50:46.760 And then when you don't have a house payment, dude, I mean, that's two, 3000 bucks a month.

01:50:51.760 Oh yeah.

01:50:52.720 You got bank to be generous with bank to be investing.

01:50:56.160 And yeah, you can take a bath.

01:50:57.540 You can relax at your house and get in the bath.

01:50:59.660 Stacking cash.

01:51:00.280 That's it.

01:51:00.680 That's it.

01:51:00.960 God, maybe that's what I want.

01:51:03.980 I'll buy a dang bird bath and sit in that thing.

01:51:06.720 And if I'm debt free, I sit in the front yard in there and dang, use some dang soap up.

01:51:14.660 Dave Ramsey, anything else that you want to share with her that you think?

01:51:17.580 We've covered a lot of neat stuff, I think.

01:51:19.000 I feel like we've been through a lot of avenues.

01:51:21.080 It was an honor to be with you.

01:51:22.220 Yeah, you too, man.

01:51:23.060 I'm impressed with what you're doing.

01:51:24.160 It's so good.

01:51:24.800 Well, thanks, man.

01:51:25.500 Yeah, I just feel like-

01:51:26.620 You're watching your career and watching you clean up and get right and doing stuff.

01:51:30.580 I watched your content shift.

01:51:32.520 You're doing really good.

01:51:33.220 You're doing great.

01:51:34.460 I'm proud to know you.

01:51:35.640 Yeah, thanks, man.

01:51:36.880 Yeah, it's so crazy.

01:51:38.120 Yeah, I remember my stepdad said that.

01:51:40.200 And then two years ago, I'll be like, man, wouldn't it be crazy if we got to have Dave Ramsey on?

01:51:45.760 And then here we get to-

01:51:47.180 And then you could tell him you were underwhelmed.

01:51:49.280 But we didn't lose hope, man.

01:51:52.380 Anyway, that's true.

01:51:53.360 We didn't lose hope.

01:51:54.240 That's true.

01:51:54.740 And so, yeah, thank you so much.

01:51:55.980 Thanks for the guidance.

01:51:57.440 You guys can check out the Ramsey show.

01:52:00.240 And then there's just so many YouTube clips.

01:52:01.960 I mean, there's probably a clip for almost everything these days.

01:52:05.820 For everything you want to find out about finances, how to take care of yourself, how to move forward.

01:52:10.360 They can call into the show daily?

01:52:12.980 No.

01:52:13.380 Every day.

01:52:13.940 You can call into his show every day if you have a question.

01:52:17.440 And there's some great videos of some of the best questions that they've had online as well.

01:52:23.960 Dave Ramsey, thanks so much, man.

01:52:25.400 Thank you, bro.

01:52:25.840 Yeah, appreciate it.

01:52:27.080 And best of luck.

01:52:28.420 And I hope to see you around town sometime.

01:52:30.360 Well, hang.

01:52:30.820 Now I'm just floating on the breeze.

01:52:33.860 And I feel I'm falling like these leaves.

01:52:36.820 I must be cornerstone.

01:52:41.940 Oh, but when I reach that ground, I'll share this peace of mind.

01:52:46.760 And I found I can feel it in my bones.

01:52:51.880 But it's going to take a long time.

01:52:55.360 I'm just floating on the breeze.

01:52:56.200 I'm just floating on the breeze.

01:52:57.200 I'm just floating on the breeze.

01:52:59.200 I'm just floating on the breeze.

This Past Weekend with Theo Von - April 30, 2024

E498 Dave Ramsey

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