This Past Weekend with Theo Von - E524 Sen. Bernie Sanders

00:00:00.000 I have some new tour dates I want to tell you about.

00:00:03.120 We will be in Lafayette, Louisiana, Thanksgiving weekend on November 29 at the Cajun Dome, baby, down there in Poirier country.

00:00:14.260 And we will also be in Balmont, Texas on November 30 at Doggett Ford Park Arena.

00:00:22.520 Get your tickets early starting Tuesday, August 13th at 10 a.m. local time with pre-sale code RATKING.

00:00:30.000 General on sale begins Wednesday, August 14th at 10 a.m. local time.

00:00:34.740 We will also be in Las Vegas, Nevada at the LSU-USC opening weekend of football, August 30th and 31st.

00:00:44.560 Bend, Oregon, Spokane, Washington, Portland, Oregon, Vancouver, B.C. in the Canada.

00:00:54.040 Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, North Little Rock, Springfield, Missouri, Kansas City, Missouri, Sioux Falls, South Dakota, La Crosse, Wisconsin, Green Bay, Wisconsin, and Moline, Illinois.

00:01:06.560 You can get all your tickets at Theovan.com slash T-O-U-R.

00:01:12.880 And thank you so much for supporting live comedy and our show.

00:01:18.440 Today's episode was filmed at the Venetian Soda and Cocktail Lounge in Burlington, Vermont.

00:01:25.980 And we want to thank them for hosting us and allowing us in their beautiful space.

00:01:30.700 And our guest, he's a United States Senator from Vermont.

00:01:36.040 He's an independent, though he's been friendly with the Democratic Party over the years.

00:01:41.020 He's been a congressman, a senator, a presidential candidate, and he's one of the biggest lightning rods in American politics.

00:01:50.660 At the very end of the interview, we did experience some difficulties with our microphones, so we apologize for the change in sound there.

00:01:59.660 We're grateful to welcome today's guest, Senator Bernie Sanders.

00:02:11.020 So do you travel the country doing these things?

00:02:37.500 Yeah, mostly I travel doing a stand-up comedy,

00:02:39.300 but about six years ago I started doing podcasting just in my kitchen at home.

00:02:44.180 And mostly was just talking about, like, I've been in recovery for years, so mostly just talking about that kind of stuff.

00:02:50.360 Alcohol or?

00:02:50.860 Yeah, alcohol and drugs and intimacy disorders.

00:02:53.620 So a lot of that kind of stuff.

00:02:55.180 And then we started having guests after about two years and went on Joe Rogan a few times, and that helped boost the steam, you know?

00:03:04.080 And, yeah, it's been surprising since then, you know?

00:03:08.640 Congratulations.

00:03:09.300 Thanks.

00:03:10.140 It's made me grow up some, which is a blessing and a curse, you know?

00:03:15.940 But, yeah, and I just went to the Grateful Dead the other day with my brother, so pretty cool.

00:03:20.300 You ever see the Grateful Dead?

00:03:22.160 No.

00:03:23.560 You remember?

00:03:24.220 What was the first concert you ever went to?

00:03:25.620 A name you probably wouldn't know.

00:03:31.080 You ever hear of Pete Seeger?

00:03:32.980 I've heard of Bob Seeger.

00:03:34.680 Yeah, I think they listened to a lot of it.

00:03:36.120 I was kind of into folk music more than that.

00:03:38.780 Billy Strings.

00:03:39.420 Have you ever heard of him?

00:03:40.500 Yep.

00:03:40.740 Yeah.

00:03:42.300 He's awesome.

00:03:43.540 He's one of my favorites.

00:03:44.520 Pete Seeger, that's him right there.

00:03:45.960 That's God.

00:03:46.700 That was fast.

00:03:48.640 Yeah.

00:03:49.060 He's an interesting guy.

00:03:50.340 And there's another guy who died a long time ago.

00:03:55.320 I don't know if you know his name.

00:03:56.480 Woody Guthrie.

00:03:57.040 Is that the name of him?

00:03:57.500 Woody Guthrie.

00:03:58.120 I've heard of him, yeah.

00:03:58.900 Yeah.

00:03:59.040 And actually, his granddaughter helped me out during my campaigns.

00:04:04.740 He wrote a lot during the Great Depression.

00:04:08.480 So he went around the hobo camps, talked to poor people, you know?

00:04:11.820 Oh, wow.

00:04:12.400 And he wrote songs.

00:04:13.780 You ever hear the song, This Land Is Your Land Is?

00:04:15.960 That's his song.

00:04:16.620 Oh, wow.

00:04:17.200 I didn't even think somebody wrote that.

00:04:20.840 No, he was a great songwriter and a great singer.

00:04:24.260 Woody Guthrie.

00:04:25.320 Woody Guthrie.

00:04:25.840 I'm going to have to tap into some of his stuff.

00:04:27.480 Yeah, my brother and I went.

00:04:30.160 You have a brother?

00:04:30.980 You have a brother.

00:04:31.440 I have an older brother, yeah.

00:04:32.180 Yeah.

00:04:32.480 You guys ever go to a concert together?

00:04:35.040 Nope.

00:04:35.500 I don't think we are.

00:04:36.040 He lives in Oxford, England.

00:04:37.900 Yeah.

00:04:38.420 It's fancy over there.

00:04:40.280 It is.

00:04:40.740 Well, have you ever been to England?

00:04:43.800 Yeah.

00:04:44.440 And they have this old university called Oxford University, which is one of the great universities

00:04:49.220 in the world.

00:04:50.040 Yeah.

00:04:50.380 I stayed in a house, God, like it was 1,400 or 1,300.

00:04:55.380 Who the hell knows?

00:04:55.900 I mean, really, it goes way, way back.

00:04:59.260 Oh, yeah.

00:04:59.680 The plum.

00:05:00.100 Yeah.

00:05:00.300 You got to bring your own plumment, I'm sure.

00:05:02.740 Well, they've advanced a little bit, but.

00:05:04.940 Bernie Sanders, thank you so much for joining us today.

00:05:07.080 Great to be with you, Theo.

00:05:07.940 I really appreciate it.

00:05:10.300 Whenever you started in politics, I'm sure that there was like a real idea of like one

00:05:14.180 person can really affect change, right?

00:05:17.640 Do you think that that's still possible today with like a lot of the lobbies and stuff that

00:05:23.240 they have that goes on?

00:05:24.640 Well, I think, you know, one of the points I think everybody knows is you have a government

00:05:29.320 dominated by big money interests, right?

00:05:31.160 That's no great secret.

00:05:32.080 But see, you have these billionaires now in their super PACs.

00:05:36.840 If you're a billionaire, you can contribute hundreds of millions of dollars to elect people,

00:05:39.920 to feed people.

00:05:41.320 If you're a large corporation or you represent the pharmaceutical industry, do you know how

00:05:46.440 many lobbyists there are in Washington, D.C. representing the big drug companies?

00:05:50.160 Take a wild and crazy guess.

00:05:53.620 2,000.

00:05:54.540 You got it.

00:05:55.060 That's a pretty good guess.

00:05:55.900 About 1,800.

00:05:56.740 Wow.

00:05:57.080 So there are 100 members of the Senate and 435 members of the House.

00:06:02.080 Got it?

00:06:03.260 535.

00:06:04.420 And you got 1,800 lobbyists.

00:06:06.800 Well-paid former leaders of the Democratic Party, leaders of the Republican Party.

00:06:11.020 They're there to say, hey, Congress, do everything you can to make sure we make as much money as

00:06:16.020 possible and who gives a damn whether people can afford the prescription drugs they need.

00:06:20.000 So that's power.

00:06:21.220 So you have a whole other drug government almost going on.

00:06:23.940 Absolutely.

00:06:24.340 That's even bigger than our own government.

00:06:25.900 Numbers-wise.

00:06:28.520 Well, we could define what we mean by bigger.

00:06:31.640 That's fair.

00:06:32.480 But if you look at Wall Street, the power of Wall Street, the drug companies, the insurance

00:06:37.600 companies, the fossil fuel industry, you have enormous wealth, enormous power.

00:06:42.380 And if your question is, is it government that tells them what to do or they tell what

00:06:47.000 the government to do, more the latter.

00:06:49.980 They tell the government what to do.

00:06:51.720 Very powerful.

00:06:52.280 Does it feel like that's changed over your time in politics or has it always been that

00:06:57.540 way?

00:06:57.800 I think to some degree, you know, money talks, right?

00:07:00.620 No great secret.

00:07:01.500 That's always been the case.

00:07:02.540 It's worse now.

00:07:03.240 And I'll tell you why.

00:07:04.900 As a result of this Citizens United Supreme Court decision, you familiar with that?

00:07:10.180 So people brought action.

00:07:12.840 Billionaires really brought action.

00:07:13.960 They said, hey, it's undemocratic.

00:07:16.020 You're taking away my freedom of speech, right?

00:07:18.120 I have a First Amendment right.

00:07:19.800 We're on TV now.

00:07:21.540 You could say whatever you want to say.

00:07:23.200 And I'm a billionaire.

00:07:24.560 And I want to spend unlimited sums of money to defeat this candidate or support this candidate.

00:07:29.420 And you have laws on the books now, which restrict my freedom to buy the election.

00:07:34.520 You understand what I'm saying?

00:07:35.300 A hundred percent.

00:07:35.980 Okay.

00:07:36.640 And the Supreme Court said, well, guys, you're right.

00:07:39.040 You're billionaires.

00:07:39.640 You should be able to spend as much money as you want to buy elections.

00:07:43.660 And that's what you have.

00:07:44.840 So right now, this is literally the truth.

00:07:47.080 You have super PACs where billionaires can put unlimited amounts of money, hundreds and

00:07:52.440 hundreds of millions of dollars to defeat people they don't like or to support people

00:07:56.520 they do like.

00:07:57.940 That's power.

00:07:59.640 And that is a corruption of what democracy is supposed to be.

00:08:02.520 Look, you and I can disagree on an issue, right?

00:08:04.840 Ten people.

00:08:05.620 We argue it out.

00:08:06.760 We vote.

00:08:07.520 I get the majority.

00:08:08.380 You get the majority.

00:08:09.460 Somebody wins.

00:08:10.040 Somebody loses.

00:08:11.200 I don't think billionaires should be able to buy elections.

00:08:13.940 And I think most people think that.

00:08:15.780 Most people are like, why are corporations or companies allowed to give money to candidates

00:08:22.260 and influence elections, right?

00:08:23.700 Almost every person I know says that that should be no.

00:08:28.160 Whose responsibility is it to make sure it doesn't happen?

00:08:30.340 Is it ours or is it the politicians?

00:08:32.400 Well, what happened is there were laws put in place, not as strong as I would like, which

00:08:38.020 did limit the power of big money.

00:08:40.320 Yeah.

00:08:40.500 And what that Supreme Court decision said is what Congress did was unconstitutional.

00:08:45.700 Denied big money, their freedom of speech.

00:08:48.020 If you're a billionaire, you have freedom of speech.

00:08:50.420 That means you can run ads all over the day and beat Bernie Sanders, beat anybody.

00:08:56.260 And that's what happened.

00:08:57.320 So what we have got to do now is once again pass legislation that will do that.

00:09:04.380 Are there politicians that aren't viable, kind of?

00:09:09.600 Or aren't influenced by lobbyists?

00:09:11.980 Of course there are.

00:09:12.740 There are.

00:09:13.180 There are.

00:09:13.440 Yeah.

00:09:13.760 There's some very good people.

00:09:15.580 But many people, look, just to write an example, you're running for election, okay?

00:09:20.880 Your opponent is spending millions of dollars.

00:09:22.880 These TV ads are up there, all right?

00:09:25.100 You think you're going to stand up to powerful special interests who say, you know, Theo, listen,

00:09:30.740 I like you, but you're going to take that position on that issue.

00:09:33.240 I've got to be running millions of dollars of ads against you.

00:09:35.820 What do you think you're going to do if you want to get elected?

00:09:37.880 And you can say, well, go to hell.

00:09:39.780 I'm going to do it anyhow.

00:09:40.600 And many would do.

00:09:41.720 Or you run the risk of, you know, seeing that kind of money come against you.

00:09:47.360 Or you then have to find a lobbyist that has an interest of yours and you have to try

00:09:50.480 and fight back.

00:09:51.200 Which is a pretty pathetic thing, right?

00:09:52.720 Right.

00:09:53.340 So to some degree, what you have right now, it's a funny kind of thing.

00:09:56.920 It's, let's say you were running against me.

00:09:58.620 It's not you against me.

00:09:59.700 It's your moneyed interest versus my moneyed interest.

00:10:02.860 That's what super PACs are.

00:10:04.740 Now, corporations cannot directly contribute to your campaign, but they, big money interest,

00:10:10.260 billionaires can contribute to a super PAC.

00:10:13.100 So you have all these, if what I would say to you, people watch the show here, look at

00:10:17.740 the ads that are on television.

00:10:19.060 They'll be underneath it.

00:10:20.300 You'll see paid for by supporters of an American way of life or whatever the hell it is.

00:10:25.740 Understand that in most cases, these are billionaires putting money into a candidate.

00:10:29.980 So the super PAC is kind of the loophole is how they do it.

00:10:33.540 So it's not directly from there.

00:10:34.860 Exactly.

00:10:35.240 There are limits.

00:10:36.000 All right.

00:10:36.360 You wanted to contribute to my campaign.

00:10:37.920 They're pretty stringent limits.

00:10:39.220 You can't contribute.

00:10:39.940 I think it's, I don't know, it's 5,000 bucks through a super PAC.

00:10:43.580 You can contribute a hundred million dollars.

00:10:46.060 Wow.

00:10:47.180 That's a big issue.

00:10:48.320 We don't talk about it enough.

00:10:49.760 And then you can understand that if you're an ordinary person, who's going to listen to

00:10:56.380 your interests, your needs, right?

00:10:58.520 When billionaires are putting in this kind of money.

00:11:00.980 Right.

00:11:01.160 If the best I can help you out with is 5,000 bucks, you might show up and shake my hand.

00:11:05.420 But when something really, when the rickshaw hits the road or whatever, you're going to

00:11:09.560 be working for the big dogs for the cash.

00:11:11.820 You got it.

00:11:12.380 And that's the way the system works.

00:11:14.000 And how do we change that?

00:11:15.900 Well, first of all, this campaign finance reform is a big deal.

00:11:18.740 Just this one issue.

00:11:19.760 And I'm glad you raised it.

00:11:21.000 We got to do away for citizens.

00:11:22.520 You know, we have to have restrictions.

00:11:23.480 When I ran for president, the average contribution was $27, roughly speaking.

00:11:30.940 And we've got millions of people to contribute.

00:11:33.300 So I think there has to be a real stringent limit on the amount of money that any individual

00:11:37.840 can put into the political process.

00:11:40.280 And I also believe that we should move to what we call public funding of elections.

00:11:44.120 You're a candidate.

00:11:44.900 You want to run for governor.

00:11:46.040 You want to run for senator.

00:11:46.800 If you show that you have a certain amount of support, you got X number of thousands

00:11:51.960 of people willing to put $5 into your campaign, you can be able to get public funding.

00:11:57.100 And there's a limit of how much you can spend.

00:11:59.200 These are not radical ideas.

00:12:00.460 They exist in many countries around the world, actually.

00:12:02.680 Yeah, it's pretty normal.

00:12:04.800 Do you think that our election process is still democratic?

00:12:08.200 Do you think it's still?

00:12:10.280 Yes and no.

00:12:11.480 I mean, you know, you want to run for office.

00:12:13.760 Can you?

00:12:14.280 Yeah, you can.

00:12:14.880 You've got a certain number of signatures.

00:12:17.660 But if you're going to win, and I have 10 times more money than you do, I will beat

00:12:21.820 you 95% of the time.

00:12:23.260 Wow.

00:12:23.860 I mean, that's a fact, right?

00:12:24.800 Right, 100%.

00:12:25.600 You'll beat me.

00:12:26.020 Maybe if you're really an exceptional candidate and I'm a real idiot, you will beat me once

00:12:29.920 in a while.

00:12:30.300 But by and large, the money people will win.

00:12:33.060 So if you're asking me, are we a democracy?

00:12:35.320 In one sense, we are.

00:12:36.780 All right?

00:12:37.040 You can run for office.

00:12:38.000 You can raise your issues.

00:12:39.380 On the other hand, in terms of who has the real power, money people do.

00:12:43.120 And I use the term oligarchy.

00:12:46.240 And oligarchy is a society where small numbers of very wealthy people control the economic

00:12:51.920 and political life of the country.

00:12:53.980 I think we are moving rapidly in that direction.

00:12:57.100 Yeah, I feel like it's, to me, it feels like an almost privatized communism in a way.

00:13:01.200 Right.

00:13:01.720 That's a very good point.

00:13:03.280 It's a very good, it's an interesting way of looking at it.

00:13:06.260 Yeah.

00:13:06.400 And I don't know exactly, sometimes, everything of what communism is and what socialism is,

00:13:10.260 but sometimes that's how it feels.

00:13:12.320 Well, let me give you an example.

00:13:13.260 Let me pick, can I pick up on your point?

00:13:14.540 Yeah, for sure.

00:13:15.000 Okay.

00:13:16.100 I believe we are the only nation on earth, major nation, wealthy nation, that does not

00:13:22.120 guarantee health care to all people.

00:13:23.520 Okay?

00:13:24.660 Get in your car, go 50 miles where you are sitting right now in Burlington, Vermont.

00:13:28.620 You have a terrible automobile accident.

00:13:30.500 You're in the hospital for a month in Canada.

00:13:32.100 You know what the bill is when you come out?

00:13:36.440 Zero.

00:13:36.980 Nothing.

00:13:37.680 Okay.

00:13:38.460 You know how much the Canadians spend per person on health care compared to us?

00:13:42.260 One half as much.

00:13:44.600 They spend half as much, you don't take out your wallet.

00:13:47.640 If you get sick, you're the doctor that you want.

00:13:49.700 Okay?

00:13:50.500 I believe in that type of system.

00:13:52.120 They guarantee health care to all of their people.

00:13:54.700 It's publicly funded the way we fund police departments, fire departments, and libraries.

00:13:59.180 Okay?

00:13:59.580 You got to pay taxes for it.

00:14:01.080 But at the end of the day, it is less expensive for your health care.

00:14:04.800 You follow what I'm saying?

00:14:05.680 Yeah.

00:14:06.060 Okay.

00:14:06.620 Yeah, because you're a proponent for health care for all, right?

00:14:10.100 Absolutely.

00:14:10.960 Yes.

00:14:11.460 And you always have been.

00:14:13.380 But how the system seemed, that system seemed so rigged because you have, like, one of the

00:14:20.580 number one causes of bankruptcy in America is medical debt, right?

00:14:25.200 Yes.

00:14:25.600 Unbelievable.

00:14:26.040 Like, people can't, you know, people, they go in, they don't even know the cost.

00:14:31.800 They sign an agreement that they're going to be billed later, right?

00:14:34.500 It's like, and then they get the bill and it's astronomical and they spend the rest of

00:14:38.740 their life literally a slave to the health care system or to the medical billing system

00:14:45.320 or the, you know, dealing with their insurance.

00:14:47.920 And not to mention they're sick.

00:14:49.220 So, the added stress of that, it just feels like, yeah, like something so much better could

00:14:55.140 be done.

00:14:55.800 You know, that is so pathetic and so sick and so cruel.

00:14:59.380 I mean, we did a hearing on this and roughly speaking, and I know the viewers will think

00:15:05.440 this is like hard to believe.

00:15:08.560 Half of the people who are dealing with cancer, now cancer is a terrible disease, right?

00:15:12.300 Your point.

00:15:12.840 A hundred percent.

00:15:13.420 You're struggling for your life, right?

00:15:14.760 Bad, yeah.

00:15:15.140 Maybe you make it, maybe you don't, but you got radiation, chemotherapy, bad stuff,

00:15:18.920 right?

00:15:20.240 Half the people who get cancer treatment either end up in bankruptcy or utilizing all of

00:15:28.400 the financial resources of the family.

00:15:30.140 They're depleted.

00:15:30.680 They're broke.

00:15:31.500 So, imagine that.

00:15:32.280 You go into the hospital.

00:15:33.580 Doctors are still, sorry, you got cancer, terrible.

00:15:35.760 You're worried to death, right?

00:15:37.060 Your friends, your family are worried.

00:15:38.800 And then on top of that, what are you worried about?

00:15:40.820 Oh, my God.

00:15:41.840 What, am I going to have to sell my house?

00:15:43.840 Am I going to have to go bankrupt in order to pay medical bills?

00:15:46.500 That is insane.

00:15:47.460 Yeah.

00:15:47.860 And if you're trying to deal with cancer, then you got to worry about financial stress.

00:15:52.540 Think it's going to make your condition any better?

00:15:54.180 No, the worst.

00:15:55.120 You spend half your day.

00:15:55.980 You can't even, in the insurance companies, it's all a rigmarole.

00:15:58.600 It's constant stress.

00:16:00.680 But how is it set up like that?

00:16:02.920 Like, what is the gimmick between insurers and the hospital?

00:16:07.100 What's the, that's the thing I don't know.

00:16:09.060 What's going on?

00:16:09.780 Take it a step.

00:16:10.480 Let's take a step further.

00:16:11.680 Okay.

00:16:11.960 Let me talk about the Canadian system.

00:16:13.420 All right?

00:16:13.560 Okay.

00:16:13.740 Simple system.

00:16:15.200 You pay taxes.

00:16:17.120 And progressive.

00:16:18.160 The more you make, the more you pay.

00:16:19.400 But everyone pays taxes.

00:16:20.580 All right.

00:16:21.100 End result is, you walk into the hospital, you sign your name, you have all the treatment

00:16:24.380 you need.

00:16:24.900 And it's good quality healthcare.

00:16:26.680 You don't have to argue with insurance companies.

00:16:29.080 You get the care that the doctors think you need.

00:16:32.060 End of discussion.

00:16:34.280 And in my view, that's the way it should be.

00:16:36.140 We spend, it's not just that the insurance companies make huge profits.

00:16:40.640 They do.

00:16:41.420 Not just they pay their CEOs exorbitant salaries, which they do.

00:16:46.220 Everybody's got to fill out a thousand different forms, right?

00:16:48.780 Goes crazy.

00:16:49.700 Filling out forms to see what you're entitled to, what you're not entitled to, deductibles,

00:16:53.720 right?

00:16:54.160 Yeah.

00:16:54.340 The bureaucracy.

00:16:55.100 It's ridiculous.

00:16:55.660 Right.

00:16:55.760 Is that called bureaucracy?

00:16:56.800 Yeah.

00:16:57.100 Yeah.

00:16:57.300 That's exactly what it is.

00:16:58.460 All right.

00:16:58.680 So look, you may have health insurance, but by, I just talked to a person the other day,

00:17:02.840 we had a meeting.

00:17:03.420 You know what their deductible was?

00:17:05.460 $13,000.

00:17:06.620 What does that mean?

00:17:08.180 It means that the first $13,000 of illness, they got to pay out of their own pocket.

00:17:13.340 How many people can make $13,000?

00:17:15.240 So if you get hit by a truck and you earn up a million dollar bill, yeah, the insurance

00:17:18.500 companies will kick in.

00:17:19.520 Yeah.

00:17:19.840 Presumably.

00:17:20.840 All right.

00:17:21.080 So the whole idea that healthcare in America, unlike every other major country, all right,

00:17:27.780 go to Europe, go to Canada, go to many Latin American countries.

00:17:31.140 It is a bloody right, not a privilege.

00:17:34.420 And that's what I think it should be.

00:17:35.920 So we have a system that works very well for the insurance companies and the drug companies.

00:17:41.220 In some cases, you're going to pay 10 times more for medication in America than they do

00:17:45.300 in other countries.

00:17:46.460 That's a whole other story we're trying to deal with right now.

00:17:49.280 But it's a corrupt system benefiting the people who own it, not the ordinary American.

00:17:53.600 You go out on the street, go out on the street, say to people, do you think healthcare

00:17:56.240 is a human right?

00:17:56.960 All people in America should have it.

00:17:58.960 Yeah, we do.

00:17:59.440 That's what I'm fighting for.

00:18:01.180 And who are the lobbyists that are against that then?

00:18:03.920 What do you think?

00:18:04.800 Guys from the insurance companies and the drug companies.

00:18:07.020 Okay.

00:18:07.300 And then what politicians work with those?

00:18:09.120 Like, why don't we know what politicians are cheating us so that we don't have them

00:18:13.380 in anymore?

00:18:14.260 All right.

00:18:14.980 You're a smart guy.

00:18:15.960 You tell me.

00:18:17.500 How often have you heard a discussion in this country about how broken the healthcare system

00:18:23.140 is and comparing it to other countries?

00:18:25.720 A lot.

00:18:26.760 All right.

00:18:27.000 You've heard a lot about this?

00:18:28.420 Well, I mean, I think I hear a lot about, I look into it a lot.

00:18:31.400 All right.

00:18:31.540 You look into it.

00:18:32.260 But how many people even know that we are the only major country on earth not to guarantee

00:18:36.540 healthcare to all people?

00:18:37.520 So when people say, oh, Bernie Sanders is a radical idea.

00:18:40.060 He thinks everybody should have healthcare.

00:18:42.100 Really?

00:18:43.000 That exists in Canada.

00:18:44.180 There's some friends in England, in Denmark, in Sweden, in every bloody country on earth,

00:18:49.120 virtually rich country.

00:18:50.920 So it's not a radical idea.

00:18:51.680 Even Mars, I heard they have healthcare there now.

00:18:54.820 I wouldn't be surprised.

00:18:56.380 Now, some people would say that the argument against that would be that then there's less

00:19:00.380 personal responsibility to take care of yourself, right?

00:19:03.060 But do you...

00:19:04.680 Really?

00:19:06.260 But that would be in other countries anyway, right?

00:19:08.720 That would be anywhere.

00:19:09.220 Well, of course, if God forbid you or I came down with a serious illness, am I going to

00:19:13.320 blame you for coming down with cancer?

00:19:15.820 I mean, is that a personal responsibility?

00:19:18.240 That's a good point.

00:19:19.520 Yeah, probably not.

00:19:20.480 That might just be kind of a ghost of an argument.

00:19:23.720 But to pick up on that point, what should one of the priorities of a good healthcare

00:19:29.820 system be?

00:19:30.840 It should be to try to keep people healthy.

00:19:33.300 So it should encourage people to have good diet, to do exercise, to stay away from addictive

00:19:38.560 stuff, right?

00:19:39.840 Do we do a particularly good job on that?

00:19:41.340 Not so much.

00:19:41.920 Because where do the insurance companies make their money?

00:19:44.600 Hey, if you're really sick, pretty good.

00:19:47.540 Yeah.

00:19:48.100 We keep you healthy, not so much.

00:19:50.980 Are they one of the largest lobbyist groups?

00:19:54.140 Yep.

00:19:54.600 Wow.

00:19:55.460 Very, very.

00:19:56.060 They're huge.

00:19:56.800 I mean, we started this discussion.

00:19:58.840 You talk about privatized communism, whatever the expression you used, is I believe that

00:20:05.560 Medicare is the health insurance program for the elderly.

00:20:09.620 Medicaid is for lower income people.

00:20:11.860 I think we should combine all these and guarantee healthcare to all people.

00:20:15.320 But your point is that in the private sector, we are moving to a monopoly, and it's true.

00:20:21.440 People like UnitedHealth, unbelievable.

00:20:25.080 UnitedHealth, to the best of my knowledge, has under contract or hires 10% of the doctors

00:20:32.260 in America.

00:20:33.520 Wow.

00:20:33.960 Got that?

00:20:34.660 One insurance company.

00:20:35.520 One company.

00:20:35.720 10% of the doctors.

00:20:37.000 And so how would you even start to undo something like that?

00:20:39.960 Like, what's a realistic path to reform, I guess?

00:20:42.760 Here's, thanks, great question.

00:20:44.920 Because I wrote the bill, I know the answer.

00:20:46.940 Okay.

00:20:47.560 Okay.

00:20:48.380 All right.

00:20:48.680 Right now, you have Medicare, which is a very popular program.

00:20:52.400 It's life-saving to many elderly people.

00:20:54.340 That was developed in the 1960s by President Lyndon Johnson.

00:20:58.140 Okay, very popular program.

00:20:59.540 You've got Medicaid for the lower income people, also a popular program.

00:21:02.880 What I would do is, over a four-year period, take Medicare.

00:21:06.620 First thing you do is expand Medicare, because Medicare does not now cover dental, hearing,

00:21:14.500 or vision.

00:21:15.400 A lot of people can't afford to go to a dentist.

00:21:17.700 Got me?

00:21:18.300 Yeah.

00:21:18.740 Okay.

00:21:19.280 You expand it.

00:21:20.460 And then you say, right now, to be eligible for Medicare, you've got to be 65 years of

00:21:24.780 age.

00:21:25.140 Okay.

00:21:25.500 First year, lower it to 55.

00:21:27.420 So you're 57, congratulations.

00:21:29.760 You don't have to worry about whether you have insurance on your job.

00:21:32.240 You want to hear something else crazy about the private insurance system.

00:21:36.180 You work for a big corporation, okay?

00:21:38.300 They give you good health insurance.

00:21:40.460 He works for McDonald's, virtually nothing.

00:21:43.560 All right?

00:21:44.160 That's pretty crazy.

00:21:45.200 Where you work determines the kind of health care you get.

00:21:47.100 Anyhow, so we've got from 65 down to 55.

00:21:50.900 55 next year, down to 45.

00:21:53.080 45 to 35.

00:21:54.520 Fourth year, you cover everybody.

00:21:56.180 Gradual absorption.

00:21:57.400 So you have a Medicare system that covers all people.

00:22:02.700 You no longer have to pay any more deductibles or co-payments, no more premiums.

00:22:09.760 You get your health care because you're an American citizen.

00:22:13.220 Will your taxes go up?

00:22:14.400 They may.

00:22:15.340 Will it be less than what you pay right now in private insurance?

00:22:19.200 Yes, it will be.

00:22:19.860 It's a good deal.

00:22:20.800 Can we afford that as a country, you think?

00:22:22.560 Sure.

00:22:23.200 Yeah?

00:22:23.720 We are now spending over $4 trillion on health care.

00:22:26.980 We spend double.

00:22:27.900 Here's another point to be made.

00:22:29.680 We spend twice as much per person on health care as any other country.

00:22:33.300 Because it's designed to make money for the insurance companies and the drug companies.

00:22:36.400 Wait, so explain that to me.

00:22:37.160 So we spend twice as much on health care.

00:22:39.600 We are spending right now, you know.

00:22:41.660 As any other country.

00:22:42.680 Yes.

00:22:43.040 Per person.

00:22:43.720 Yes.

00:22:44.240 But we're not, but the money isn't going towards them getting.

00:22:48.920 So we'd almost save the money just by.

00:22:51.180 You got it.

00:22:51.900 All right.

00:22:52.420 Here, example.

00:22:53.160 Is that true?

00:22:53.900 Yes, it's true.

00:22:54.900 Check it out.

00:22:55.360 It is true.

00:22:55.900 Chairman of the bloody committee.

00:22:57.240 Yes, it is true.

00:22:58.460 All right.

00:22:58.680 Bloody, literally.

00:22:59.520 People are bleeding out.

00:23:01.720 All right.

00:23:03.380 If I buy a car tomorrow for $80,000, you buy a car for $40,000.

00:23:08.500 What is the presumption?

00:23:09.900 Should my car be a better car than yours?

00:23:11.960 Yes.

00:23:12.500 Okay.

00:23:12.960 I'm spending twice as much.

00:23:14.820 All right.

00:23:15.200 But I got a really much great better car than you have.

00:23:18.300 All right.

00:23:18.520 We are spending per person, per person, over $13,000.

00:23:25.040 All right.

00:23:25.220 Spending $13,000 on you, $13,000 on me, $13,000 on a five-year-old, $13,000 on a 90-year-old.

00:23:31.180 All right.

00:23:31.580 $13,000 per person, over $4 trillion nationally.

00:23:36.240 Canadians are spending about half of that per person.

00:23:39.340 And they're taking care of everybody.

00:23:40.840 Yes.

00:23:41.720 And the British are spending less than that.

00:23:44.020 Other countries, a little bit less.

00:23:45.160 But does that affect us with the population number that we have?

00:23:47.720 No, it doesn't matter.

00:23:48.340 I mean, per person.

00:23:49.760 Got it.

00:23:50.260 Okay.

00:23:50.520 I'm not talking about in gross.

00:23:51.860 Right.

00:23:52.140 Per person.

00:23:53.380 How do you stop hospitals from overcharging?

00:23:57.880 That's part of it.

00:23:59.020 It's a corrupt system.

00:24:00.300 If they know that the government's going to pick up the tab.

00:24:02.500 Good.

00:24:03.020 Very good question.

00:24:04.380 The answer is what they do.

00:24:05.600 I mean, it's not like we're inventing something.

00:24:07.320 Other countries do it.

00:24:08.240 What they say to hospitals is, look, you're not going to be charging Theo when he's in the hospital.

00:24:13.400 You're not going to be charging him a nickel.

00:24:15.660 But we know, roughly speaking, in a year what you are going to be.

00:24:19.100 You need a certain number of doctors and radiologists and nurses and all that stuff.

00:24:23.080 Here is your budget.

00:24:24.540 It's like a police department.

00:24:25.500 Here's your budget.

00:24:26.640 In a year.

00:24:27.220 You need more, maybe we'll come up with more.

00:24:29.000 You get what we call a global budget.

00:24:30.940 It's like the Dodgers or something.

00:24:33.860 But you got a global budget.

00:24:35.060 Right.

00:24:35.180 You got a budget.

00:24:35.760 And you take care of all the needs.

00:24:37.420 It's not per person.

00:24:38.620 You get it.

00:24:39.000 And what you do there, we spend as a nation, one of the other insanities of this healthcare system, we spend hundreds of billions of dollars on billing.

00:24:50.520 You know what I mean by that?

00:24:51.540 Medical billing, yeah.

00:24:52.220 All right, so I'm the insurance companies.

00:24:55.200 First of all, you've got to fill out forms.

00:24:57.080 I hire people who are not doctors or nurses, right?

00:25:00.760 They just bill.

00:25:01.380 Oh, yeah.

00:25:02.060 All right.

00:25:02.400 You've got bill collectors.

00:25:03.820 You go to a hospital, go down to the basement, you've got a hundred, well, depending on the size of the hospital, dozens and dozens of people.

00:25:09.160 They don't want to see a patient.

00:25:10.320 They're just filling out forms.

00:25:12.160 Yeah, half the Philippines is people just doing medical billing over the phone, you know?

00:25:15.920 Well, there are countries where you show your card, and that's the end of the discussion.

00:25:20.060 But we waste hundreds of billions of dollars just on billing people.

00:25:25.080 And there's another issue I want to discuss.

00:25:27.980 Life expectancy.

00:25:29.480 What do we know about life expectancy?

00:25:31.120 We're getting pretty long in the tooth.

00:25:33.380 Nope.

00:25:34.740 We're not living long.

00:25:36.800 Nope.

00:25:37.560 Compared to whom?

00:25:38.900 Compared to probably Vietnam.

00:25:42.620 I'm sure maybe.

00:25:43.700 All right.

00:25:44.520 But, all right, we are the richest country on earth.

00:25:49.640 Do we live longer lives than other people?

00:25:53.140 No, we don't.

00:25:53.820 We do not.

00:25:55.100 In fact, we're pretty far down the list.

00:25:56.960 Why is that?

00:25:58.480 Well, I mean, I think it could be that we're not taking as good care of ourselves.

00:26:02.420 Okay.

00:26:02.980 And I think it could be that, yeah, that we don't have as good a health care.

00:26:08.060 That's right.

00:26:08.680 All right.

00:26:08.920 I think that's two out of three.

00:26:11.820 All right.

00:26:12.100 Now, there are two facts.

00:26:14.520 We, country, Japan, other countries, will live four or five years, six years longer than we do.

00:26:24.240 That's a lot.

00:26:25.220 You know what I mean?

00:26:25.980 Yeah.

00:26:26.320 So they'll live, I forgot what it is.

00:26:27.800 Like 8% or something.

00:26:28.900 Yeah.

00:26:29.220 Right.

00:26:29.800 It's a lot.

00:26:30.260 But here's another fact that is really unbelievable.

00:26:33.880 It's not just that we live shorter lives, despite spending so much on health care.

00:26:38.060 The gap between the 1% and the working class is 10 years.

00:26:44.440 If you're rich, you'll live as long as people in other countries, you'll have a long life,

00:26:49.280 the 80s or whatever it is.

00:26:51.000 If you're working class, you're going to live 10 years younger.

00:26:54.380 How does that happen, do you think?

00:26:55.500 Wow.

00:26:56.260 Because just stress, burnout?

00:26:58.340 Man.

00:26:58.880 All right.

00:27:00.020 I'm going to sign you up there.

00:27:01.340 You got it.

00:27:02.200 Look, I think I like a lot of the things that you think about.

00:27:05.100 All right.

00:27:05.300 Let's deal with the issue of stress.

00:27:06.720 Okay.

00:27:07.160 Yes, you're right.

00:27:08.220 It is twofold, it seems to me.

00:27:09.620 Number one is, if you're rich, you go to any doctor you want.

00:27:12.440 When you want it, get paid for all the drugs you need.

00:27:14.760 Right?

00:27:15.140 Yeah.

00:27:15.420 All right.

00:27:15.580 That's a real advantage.

00:27:16.920 But above and beyond that, working class people live under enormous stress.

00:27:22.280 Right?

00:27:22.540 And that takes a toll on you.

00:27:24.320 Takes a toll on you physically and mentally.

00:27:27.260 And that is, we have parts of this country where life expectancy is actually in decline.

00:27:34.520 Got it?

00:27:35.420 People are living shorter lives.

00:27:36.680 Because of the stress.

00:27:37.580 Because of the stress.

00:27:38.320 And with that stress and the hopelessness, they turn to drugs, they turn to alcohol,

00:27:42.620 they turn to suicide.

00:27:43.880 Yeah.

00:27:44.340 All right?

00:27:44.860 Bad stuff.

00:27:46.260 Oh, yeah.

00:27:46.760 I think those are things that, yeah, they don't even take those factors into consideration

00:27:50.580 when they're making all of these, you know, you call to get your medical bill.

00:27:54.440 It's a nightmare.

00:27:55.240 It's like, it's a fight.

00:27:56.780 You almost want to.

00:27:58.260 This is crazy.

00:27:58.940 There's been times when I've been like, I would rather take my own life than sit here

00:28:03.520 and make another fucking call.

00:28:04.800 And I'm not even sick, you know?

00:28:06.800 I'm just somebody trying to get to the bottom of the.

00:28:09.160 All right.

00:28:09.360 And what, why does that happen?

00:28:11.440 What's.

00:28:12.300 Because it's loopholes.

00:28:13.360 They want you, they don't want you to get paid.

00:28:15.060 You got it.

00:28:15.820 Not that hard.

00:28:16.640 Look, you pay me money through insurance, right?

00:28:20.140 So you're sick.

00:28:21.060 I'm supposed to, you know, pay your bills, right?

00:28:24.660 If I drive you crazy, you're going to say, screw it.

00:28:29.420 I'll hold with it.

00:28:29.960 I'll pay the goddamn thing myself.

00:28:31.160 It's not worth it.

00:28:31.700 Yeah.

00:28:31.980 Good.

00:28:32.400 I'm the insurance company.

00:28:33.260 Right on, man.

00:28:34.880 That's exactly what I wanted.

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00:31:11.140 So then how do we change that as a system?

00:31:14.080 What do we do?

00:31:14.860 Because it feels like we're electing people that have this in our best interest.

00:31:19.600 If it's the number one cause of bankruptcy is medical billing, how do our politicians not see that this is extremely important and that things need to be different?

00:31:27.420 Like, what are they lobbying so powerful with?

00:31:30.180 I know it's money, but it's like, I just can't imagine that people wouldn't see the good, the value, and what is right.

00:31:40.700 Well, you know, it's all that I can tell you is money talks to a larger gain.

00:31:47.060 It's not to suggest that, you know, members of Congress are evil or terrible people that want people to suffer.

00:31:51.880 They don't, but you have a system which almost says, oh, you can't even think about guaranteeing health care to all people.

00:31:58.840 Oh, my God.

00:31:59.740 What kind of, you're a far leftist.

00:32:02.040 Yeah.

00:32:02.300 Well, you're a communist man.

00:32:03.360 What are you?

00:32:04.700 You don't want to take on the insurance companies, hardworking people, you know.

00:32:08.040 So it almost, you're not even allowed to talk about those issues.

00:32:13.260 And meanwhile, we're the only country that doesn't guarantee health care.

00:32:16.660 Yeah, I mean, my one caveat, and I don't know exactly what caveat means, but I think my one, you know, left turn on it would be, yeah, how much responsibility then do people, are people going to just have totally less responsibility and just be taking pills?

00:32:32.940 You know, I don't know, maybe that's just a crazy thought, but if it's not happening in other countries, then maybe that's a good example that it wouldn't happen here.

00:32:39.840 It is an issue in other countries.

00:32:41.140 For example, all right, you're a lonely older person, maybe you're living by yourself.

00:32:46.360 Hmm, I'm feeling lonely.

00:32:48.160 Maybe I'll go to the doctor, right, when I'm not really sick, right?

00:32:50.700 Oh, yeah, for sure.

00:32:51.200 Will people abuse it?

00:32:52.220 Yeah, so what?

00:32:52.920 I mean, it happens, and you try to discourage that.

00:32:56.540 So no system is perfect.

00:32:58.160 Right.

00:32:58.420 But the bottom line, as Americans, we have to answer a very simple question.

00:33:03.800 Is health care a right of all people, whether you're rich, poor, medium, whatever you are?

00:33:08.200 I think the answer is yes.

00:33:09.700 Well, I think especially when you start to look at other places that we spend our money,

00:33:13.040 it would be very hard not to say that we should certainly spend it there first.

00:33:17.820 It's just fucking unbelievable that we're this powerful of a country,

00:33:20.840 and we don't have a, like, it's like we lost our emotional.

00:33:29.420 That's a good point, and I'll tell you something else.

00:33:31.980 Let me get off on health care for a second.

00:33:33.380 Okay, before we get off, I want to, so I know that you guys have a bill,

00:33:38.940 because I have a group that I've worked with, done volunteer stuff with,

00:33:42.340 called Power to the Patients, right?

00:33:44.140 Good.

00:33:44.260 And it's notating the prices of, like, say you get an MRI.

00:33:48.980 Like, the hospital now has to let you know that the MRI is $700,

00:33:52.740 so you can call the hospital down the street and see that there it's $550,

00:33:56.800 so you can make a choice, so you know up front.

00:33:59.580 That's good.

00:33:59.940 So you're not getting a $10,000 bill later on.

00:34:02.080 You got it.

00:34:02.700 It's called the transparency bill.

00:34:04.460 Transparency bill.

00:34:05.020 And is it passed yet or no?

00:34:06.080 No, it has not.

00:34:06.700 I'm working with a guy named Senator Braun from Indiana who's a Republican.

00:34:11.740 Good guy.

00:34:13.780 And look, it's exactly the issue.

00:34:15.460 People walk into an emergency room.

00:34:18.300 They walk into a hospital.

00:34:20.200 Do you have any idea?

00:34:21.840 You know, here, Theo, this is what we're going to do for you, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:34:24.680 And you come out and you drop dead because you see a bill of, you know,

00:34:27.140 tens of thousands of dollars, right?

00:34:28.340 That's a crazy part.

00:34:29.740 I mean, people go in and surgery.

00:34:31.780 They come out, hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt?

00:34:33.880 It's crazy.

00:34:34.880 It is.

00:34:35.280 It's insane.

00:34:35.740 All right.

00:34:36.100 And the point is, look, I should have the right to know.

00:34:42.040 You want to hear?

00:34:42.960 You think it's crazy?

00:34:43.960 Let me tell you how crazy.

00:34:45.220 It's even crazier than you think it is.

00:34:46.760 Okay.

00:34:46.980 Okay.

00:34:47.980 You have Blue Cross insurance.

00:34:49.940 I have another insurance company.

00:34:51.540 Same hospital.

00:34:52.900 You go and get an MRI.

00:34:55.200 Your insurance company will pay $500.

00:34:58.380 My insurance company pays $700.

00:35:01.500 So even in the same hospital for the same treatment, the price is different.

00:35:05.060 Not to mention different hospitals.

00:35:07.280 Well, it's just wild that they can do that.

00:35:09.240 It's almost like, I'm going to go to the grocery store.

00:35:11.460 I'm going to get an apple, right?

00:35:13.300 I'm going to eat it.

00:35:14.080 And then after I eat it, you're going to tell me how much it costs.

00:35:17.300 You got it.

00:35:17.640 That is.

00:35:18.000 And they're like, it's $400.

00:35:20.000 You're like, is it from the Garden of Eden?

00:35:22.820 You know?

00:35:23.080 But it's even worse.

00:35:24.300 You're exactly right.

00:35:25.700 But it's even worse because you had to go to the hospital.

00:35:27.940 Right.

00:35:28.700 Right.

00:35:29.600 Yes.

00:35:29.940 It wasn't a choice that you made.

00:35:32.580 I know you guys had launched an investigation even because this is kind of current about

00:35:35.960 Ozempic, right?

00:35:36.760 And the cost of Ozempic in different countries.

00:35:38.540 Because I was dating a girl or not dating, but we met, you know, we met up a couple of

00:35:42.320 times at night or whatever.

00:35:43.100 And it's like, she was leaving one morning to drive to Mexico to get Ozempic.

00:35:48.540 And I'm like, what are you, you're just driving in the middle of the, you know, at 5am to go

00:35:52.560 to, what's going on?

00:35:53.700 And she's like, well, it's just way cheaper there.

00:35:55.740 And I'm like, but is it as regulated?

00:35:57.340 You know, I don't know.

00:35:58.020 But I know that in some countries, um, the prices on it are so different.

00:36:02.380 Like in Canada, it's 150 something dollars and in America, it's 700 and something close

00:36:08.800 to a thousand.

00:36:09.400 It's close to a thousand dollars for a diabetes medication.

00:36:11.980 I know some people use it for, you know, uh, kind of weight loss or look the way they

00:36:17.540 want spring break or whatever.

00:36:19.880 But that's crazy.

00:36:21.420 Why is it that?

00:36:22.380 Why isn't it just the same?

00:36:23.820 Is it because they know they can charge us more because we have more money?

00:36:26.540 That's half of it, but only half of it.

00:36:30.120 That's a great question.

00:36:31.280 Thanks for asking it.

00:36:32.380 All right.

00:36:32.820 That's what my committee deals with every day.

00:36:34.260 We've had, by the way, some, some success in the last few years and the Biden people

00:36:38.240 have done a good job on this.

00:36:39.440 All right.

00:36:40.660 Why is it that, uh, I want to make sure I'm right here.

00:36:44.700 Well, certainly in Canada, it's about 150 bucks for, uh, Ozempic here.

00:36:49.960 It's 900, close to a thousand.

00:36:52.820 Why is that?

00:36:53.600 What the Canadians do and what countries around the world do, what makes common sense?

00:37:00.320 They purchase a lot of the drug, right?

00:37:02.920 All right.

00:37:03.400 So they sit down with the drug companies.

00:37:04.880 They said, look, you know, we have hundreds of thousands of people are going to use your

00:37:08.600 drug.

00:37:09.080 We're going to sit down and we're going to negotiate a price, right?

00:37:12.100 Right.

00:37:12.300 Of course, certainly after a few months, you'd be able to see the averages and make a good

00:37:15.740 business choice.

00:37:16.480 Yeah.

00:37:16.600 I mean, if you're a bulk person, if you're a businessman and you're, you're buying something

00:37:21.540 from me, you're buying, you know, thousands of items, I'm going to have to give you a

00:37:25.420 discount if I want your business, right?

00:37:26.980 Certainly.

00:37:27.500 All right.

00:37:27.600 That's the way the business works.

00:37:29.080 So that's what every country on earth does.

00:37:30.660 They sit down with the drug companies.

00:37:31.900 Some do it more stringently than others.

00:37:34.600 It's up until very, very recently, there have been no requirements, zero, for the drug companies

00:37:43.000 to negotiate anything.

00:37:44.420 So they come in and they say, they have the board.

00:37:46.740 What do you think we can get, Harry?

00:37:48.360 Sitting around there, board of directors.

00:37:49.680 Well, gee, I think you can get $10,000 a year.

00:37:52.940 No, I think you can go high.

00:37:54.040 They can get $20,000.

00:37:55.180 Look, we get what the market will bear.

00:37:57.220 The government has no power.

00:37:59.000 Charge them anything you want.

00:38:01.680 That's what they do.

00:38:02.360 So you got now, it's not just Ozempic, in which we pay, in some cases, 15 times more

00:38:09.340 than European countries.

00:38:11.660 It's all kinds of drugs.

00:38:13.220 So the answer is, the answer to your question is, up until recently, and the Biden administration

00:38:17.780 has done a good job of this, there have been no capabilities of the government, Medicare,

00:38:22.620 anybody else, to negotiate prices.

00:38:24.180 They charge you anything they want and as much as they possibly can.

00:38:28.460 And what we did is part of a bill called the Inflation Reduction Act, stupid title to the

00:38:33.160 bill, but that's what it was, finally have that the drug companies are going to have to

00:38:38.480 sit down with Medicare and negotiate prices.

00:38:40.580 They're going to be announcing some interesting results pretty soon.

00:38:43.280 So for the first time, there is the beginning of negotiating prices and it will lower prices.

00:38:48.580 Second of all, what we've done on my committee, a lot of people have asthma and they use

00:38:54.900 inhalers.

00:38:55.460 I don't know if you know anybody who uses an asthma inhaler.

00:38:57.380 Yeah.

00:38:58.600 All right.

00:38:59.780 10 times more expensive than the United States.

00:39:01.720 Well, we kind of shamed some of the big companies.

00:39:03.680 They lowered it down to, some of them, to $35.

00:39:06.480 So making some progress on lowering the cost of prescription drugs.

00:39:09.660 But to answer your question, up until a couple of years ago, drug companies could charge any

00:39:15.380 price they wanted for any reason.

00:39:18.060 And now, and that could be changing with the Inflation Act?

00:39:22.340 Yeah, Inflation Reduction Act.

00:39:23.440 What it basically says is the 10 top selling drugs, they're going to have to come then

00:39:28.500 and sit down and negotiate with Medicare price.

00:39:30.860 That is, by the way, what the Veterans Administration does.

00:39:33.740 The VA in America does a good job.

00:39:35.940 Yeah.

00:39:36.220 They don't pay outrageous prices.

00:39:38.100 They negotiate.

00:39:39.140 And that's what Medicare is beginning to do.

00:39:40.800 Yeah.

00:39:40.980 If you can't breathe, I mean, yeah, you're almost a fish if you can't breathe, you know.

00:39:44.400 Um, let's talk about some policy.

00:39:47.680 Oh, wait.

00:39:48.040 And so, and the price and the price transparency, that's happening now?

00:39:51.900 Like people have to show their prices or they don't?

00:39:54.820 No, they don't.

00:39:55.300 We still have them pass that bill.

00:39:56.700 Okay.

00:39:57.040 Do you think it's going to happen?

00:39:58.520 It's a popular bill.

00:39:59.360 I think we have a good shot to get it done.

00:40:00.720 Yeah.

00:40:01.300 That's cool.

00:40:02.460 Yeah, man.

00:40:02.860 It makes me just sick because somebody's already sick.

00:40:05.560 And you know they're sick.

00:40:06.480 Like if it, if it were your family member, what you would, you want them to just sit

00:40:09.680 there and just be angry.

00:40:11.280 They're on the phone every day.

00:40:12.320 Then they don't have any energy for their own family.

00:40:14.300 It's just, you're right.

00:40:15.300 You're absolutely, you're absolutely right.

00:40:17.420 I just don't, I just can't imagine choosing, especially when you're already making a ton

00:40:22.480 of money, choosing to make a little more money.

00:40:24.940 What do you need?

00:40:26.040 Well, now you're raising even another issue.

00:40:28.160 What do you need?

00:40:29.660 You're talking about corporate greed here, but that's another issue.

00:40:32.140 Yeah.

00:40:32.400 I know you hate it.

00:40:33.580 We all hate it.

00:40:34.340 I think America's at the point where they, the screw has been turned so fucking tight

00:40:38.980 that I think, yeah, it starts to, it starts to create radicalization, starts to create

00:40:44.700 a lot of stuff.

00:40:45.860 Let's talk about the, the election coming up right now or just the current candidacy.

00:40:52.600 I wanted in 2020, I believe that's when you ran, I wanted you and Donald Trump to be on

00:40:58.700 the same ticket, right?

00:40:59.820 That was a thought that I had because in my mind, I'm just a regular guy.

00:41:04.840 I don't know a ton about politics, right?

00:41:06.780 I wanted, I felt both y'all were outliers, right?

00:41:09.720 That's how it seemed to me.

00:41:10.700 These guys are both outliers.

00:41:12.020 They're both different, but seem to be doing their own thing.

00:41:18.360 You've been outspoken against Trump, right?

00:41:20.840 Do you think he's not, is he doing his own thing or is he?

00:41:25.380 He is like, look, I will give Trump credit, okay?

00:41:28.660 He does his own thing, okay?

00:41:30.200 He's a very different type of politician and that's clear.

00:41:35.340 But this is what I do think, Theo.

00:41:38.080 While I respect somebody who has the guts to do their own thing and be very much a non-traditional

00:41:43.960 politician, which is what he is, here's the facts.

00:41:47.580 He lies all the time.

00:41:48.720 And, you know, I got four kids and I got seven grandchildren and we really have to ask ourselves

00:41:55.980 whether the guy who is the leader of the country, whether that's the kind of example that we

00:42:01.520 want.

00:42:02.000 So I have a lot of friends in politics who differ with me, more conservative people.

00:42:06.280 They're not liars.

00:42:07.220 We disagree.

00:42:07.920 So you and I disagree on something.

00:42:09.240 It's fine.

00:42:09.480 So what?

00:42:09.860 It's called American democracy.

00:42:11.300 Yeah, it used to be fine.

00:42:12.340 That's right.

00:42:12.940 All right?

00:42:14.120 But Trump really is, I use the word pathological.

00:42:16.500 He lies every, when you see him, I tell him every, not everything, but a lot of lies.

00:42:22.480 Okay?

00:42:22.660 And I think that's, we can't have that.

00:42:25.660 You know, when he was in the private sector before he became involved in politics, he was

00:42:32.420 sued, his companies were sued 4,000 times.

00:42:37.620 And I just, above and beyond his political views, which I disagree with, but then those

00:42:42.060 you can discuss, I don't think you want somebody leading this country who is shady.

00:42:46.500 So you're saying the, he doesn't set the best example of a, of.

00:42:50.420 Exactly.

00:42:50.880 Look, you've got kids.

00:42:51.980 Do you have any kids?

00:42:52.760 I don't have any yet.

00:42:53.380 All right.

00:42:53.680 All right.

00:42:54.340 Well, you know, I hope you do.

00:42:55.400 And you want kids to be honest, right?

00:42:57.740 Yeah.

00:42:57.920 You don't want them to be bullies and picking on the weak.

00:43:01.200 And, and he, so that from a character point of view, I, I, I don't like it.

00:43:05.000 But also let me give another example.

00:43:06.260 I happen to believe, I don't know what your views are, uh, that women have a right to

00:43:11.080 control their own bodies.

00:43:12.080 All right.

00:43:12.440 I don't want, as a man, somebody saying, oh, Bernie, you know, you can't have a vasectomy.

00:43:16.420 You can't do this.

00:43:17.120 My business, not the government's and Trump does not hold that view.

00:43:21.600 Uh, I happen to believe strongly that climate change is real.

00:43:25.860 We got the, you know, just a week or two ago.

00:43:28.300 Yeah.

00:43:28.320 I saw your podcast with, um, Bill, Bill, Bill and cough, Bill McKibbin.

00:43:32.200 Of course.

00:43:32.480 I've known Bill McKibbin.

00:43:33.880 Yeah.

00:43:34.060 Yeah.

00:43:34.300 And Bill is, um, yeah, I wanted to, I want to get to speak to him.

00:43:36.980 He seems really interesting.

00:43:38.500 Smart guy.

00:43:39.280 Is he?

00:43:39.600 I've known him for years.

00:43:40.560 Yeah.

00:43:40.780 Cause I want to learn more about, you know, you just always hear about climate change.

00:43:43.500 And so, yeah, I want to learn more about it.

00:43:44.840 Good.

00:43:45.380 And I hope you do.

00:43:46.740 And I'm sure Bill would be happy to go on the show with you.

00:43:49.240 That'd be cool.

00:43:49.660 You know, I get, if you wanted, I can give him a call.

00:43:51.760 Awesome.

00:43:52.580 Um, in, in all of the scientists agree, when you put carbon into the atmosphere, it creates

00:44:01.420 a ceiling there, the earth warms up.

00:44:04.580 And then because of the earth warming up, you have, uh, extreme weather disturbances.

00:44:09.600 Like, you know, you come from Louisiana.

00:44:11.460 Do you?

00:44:11.540 Oh yeah.

00:44:12.100 We're sinking.

00:44:12.480 You've seen the terrible floods there.

00:44:14.240 We've had them here in Vermont.

00:44:15.540 Yeah.

00:44:15.740 They have in Savannah right now going on.

00:44:17.320 Right.

00:44:17.680 That's right.

00:44:18.100 You know, floods, the likes of which we've never seen.

00:44:21.720 You've seen drought, you know, in Saudi Arabia, temperature reached 125 degrees, which people

00:44:27.520 are dying by the hundreds.

00:44:29.860 So Trump does not believe that climate change is real.

00:44:32.380 And if he becomes president, that means not only will the United States, the whole world

00:44:38.160 will give up.

00:44:39.340 And I don't know what this planet is going to look like in, you know, 10, 15 years.

00:44:44.240 And do you say that because America is really the leader of the forefront of, uh, looking

00:44:48.560 out for climate change?

00:44:50.020 Oh, okay.

00:44:50.460 We're the largest economy in the world.

00:44:52.140 Right.

00:44:52.440 China is a bigger polluter than we are right now.

00:44:54.800 Oh yeah, dude.

00:44:55.620 They all smoke too.

00:44:56.580 A lot of Chinese people.

00:44:58.180 Yeah.

00:44:58.380 That kid that smokes on that bicycle or whatever.

00:45:00.340 He smoked like 11 cigarettes.

00:45:01.700 But if we were, if we say, Hey, the hell with it, then other countries are going to, because

00:45:07.480 you're, it's a global problem.

00:45:08.860 Right.

00:45:09.020 Then everybody's going to be like, oh, you got everybody backs off.

00:45:11.820 And then I don't know what this planet, you talk about floods, it's going to get worse

00:45:14.720 and worse.

00:45:15.520 Heat waves, worse, drought, worse.

00:45:17.720 Migrations.

00:45:18.520 There are millions, hundreds of millions of people, little farmers in poor countries.

00:45:23.180 They can't farm anymore.

00:45:24.260 Yeah.

00:45:24.720 Okay.

00:45:25.040 So I disagree with Trump on that.

00:45:27.060 So those are some of the reasons why, you know, I'm strongly against them.

00:45:30.240 Those are important issues, you know, I certainly, yeah.

00:45:32.340 And I don't think every, yeah, it's like everybody can have their own thoughts on different issues.

00:45:35.960 And, um, do you see why people like him?

00:45:38.780 I do, you know, because he's very disarming.

00:45:42.220 He gets up there and he says whatever the hell he wants.

00:45:44.160 Yeah.

00:45:44.460 He is not.

00:45:45.560 Yeah.

00:45:45.760 He doesn't seem like he's by the book.

00:45:47.340 That was a thing.

00:45:47.860 He is not by the book.

00:45:48.660 Right.

00:45:48.980 And so that's something, the same as you, it's like, he's speaking for, it feels like

00:45:53.180 they're speaking for themselves, right?

00:45:55.320 Whether you agree with maybe what they believe, they believe what they're saying.

00:45:59.460 And that I think comes through.

00:46:01.680 I think you're right.

00:46:02.440 Clearly to people.

00:46:03.300 I think, you know, he's certainly unusual.

00:46:05.500 Gets up there and he rants and he does his thing and he's not necessarily, I'm sure his

00:46:09.520 advisors go crazy, but he's not reading off.

00:46:13.020 You know, he doesn't have 14.

00:46:13.920 Kid Rock is one of his advisors, you know?

00:46:16.720 And look, I love Kid Rock, but you know, I don't know if every advice, you know, every

00:46:21.820 advice of his is the best, but now some of it is, that's for sure.

00:46:24.900 But some of it may not.

00:46:25.860 Right.

00:46:26.260 And you know, a lot of these politicians have 18 different consultants.

00:46:29.240 You can't use that word.

00:46:30.340 You can't say that, you know, and he's not like that.

00:46:32.400 And that makes it miserable.

00:46:33.160 He's not like that.

00:46:33.860 Right.

00:46:34.120 And people find that appealing.

00:46:35.460 I get it.

00:46:36.300 But you know, again, I don't think you could have a pathological liar if somebody doesn't

00:46:40.180 believe in women's have the right, women have the right to control their bodies.

00:46:43.660 You know, who doesn't believe in climate change.

00:46:45.360 I think that's, that's bad.

00:46:46.740 And by the way, I, I'm not quite so sure, but she believes in democracy as well.

00:46:50.580 Yeah.

00:46:51.540 Well, and look, yeah, those are, that's exactly, that's how you feel.

00:46:54.320 And it's important.

00:46:55.880 And you've always had your own feelings and I appreciate you always having them and sharing

00:47:00.320 what they are.

00:47:00.980 Did you feel like whenever the people tried to assassinate, did you think it was deeper

00:47:04.420 than that?

00:47:04.800 Do you think it was just some Reddit jockey just on the roof?

00:47:07.240 First of all, it was a horrible, I mean, I disagree with Trump on everything, but the

00:47:10.720 idea of people assassinating Trump or anybody else is.

00:47:14.660 Yeah.

00:47:15.020 It's crazy.

00:47:15.780 It's crazy.

00:47:16.600 It is horrible.

00:47:17.860 And it's, I mean, I can't give you the words.

00:47:20.160 It's just terrible.

00:47:21.480 We cannot have that in American politics.

00:47:23.600 My own guess, and I'm not an expert, I'm sure there are a lot of, you know, conspiratorial

00:47:28.600 theories that are out there.

00:47:29.760 You know, I think you have, you know, we've seen it before.

00:47:32.640 You've seen seemingly normal people walking into schools with guns doing horrible things,

00:47:38.300 right?

00:47:38.700 Yeah.

00:47:38.900 You know, and I think you had, for whatever reason, I don't want to even speculate why this

00:47:44.760 young man did what he did.

00:47:46.500 But you just think it was a young man who just, that was it.

00:47:48.300 That's what the evidence seems to suggest so far.

00:47:50.580 Right.

00:47:50.780 But you didn't hear anything else.

00:47:51.860 You guys don't hear anything else as Congress people.

00:47:53.900 You don't hear anything deeper than that.

00:47:54.860 I don't know any great secrets that you don't know.

00:47:56.440 Yeah.

00:47:57.420 Do you think that Kamala Harris is the best person to run against Donald Trump right now?

00:48:02.040 Well, she is the person.

00:48:03.660 And that's-

00:48:04.440 And that won't change probably, huh?

00:48:05.940 No.

00:48:06.240 She'll be the Democratic candidate.

00:48:07.860 And, you know, I've known Kamala for a number of years.

00:48:11.800 Not best friends, but I've known her.

00:48:14.220 She was in the Senate for a short period of time.

00:48:16.080 She's very smart.

00:48:17.400 And she's determined.

00:48:18.880 I mean, above and beyond her views on the issues, which I, you know, support most of them,

00:48:24.260 not all.

00:48:26.200 You've got to give credit to somebody, a black woman, to move up the ladder.

00:48:30.300 That ain't easy stuff.

00:48:31.220 There's a lot of resistance to that.

00:48:33.120 And she's persistent.

00:48:34.780 She's strong.

00:48:36.040 And I respect that.

00:48:37.500 And, you know, I think she'll be a good candidate.

00:48:40.620 I was interested that Trump apparently backed out of a debate with her on ABC.

00:48:46.580 And I could, I wouldn't, you know, I have debated her, as a matter of fact.

00:48:52.020 She's tough.

00:48:52.880 She's tough.

00:48:53.820 Was there a chance that you were going to get that nominee or as an independent?

00:48:57.300 Can you get then plotted with the Democratic Party and put in?

00:49:00.860 Was there even a call about it or anything?

00:49:02.660 No.

00:49:03.040 You know, I ran in 16.

00:49:04.580 I ran against Hillary Clinton.

00:49:05.680 Then I ran in 20.

00:49:06.560 Yeah.

00:49:06.860 I remember.

00:49:07.420 And I felt like you, I felt like you didn't get treated fairly, to be honest with you.

00:49:11.560 And that's what happens when you take on the establishments.

00:49:14.060 What happened is we won the first three primaries.

00:49:17.300 And then the establishment got very, very nervous.

00:49:21.520 And they got a whole lot of candidates in the Democratic primary.

00:49:24.560 And they said, hey, be a good idea if you all dropped out.

00:49:27.300 Let Joe Biden be the one candidate.

00:49:28.800 People rallied around them.

00:49:29.800 And is there a call that you get and it's like you're not going to move forward?

00:49:34.180 Is it just like news articles?

00:49:35.900 How does the establishment kind of work?

00:49:37.160 Well, what happens is I won the popular vote in Iowa.

00:49:40.820 I won the New Hampshire primary.

00:49:42.320 I won the Nevada primary.

00:49:43.480 And those were the first three.

00:49:45.140 And then, four pages of the New York Times, Democratic establishment, very nervous.

00:49:49.140 Bernie Sanders could win the whole thing.

00:49:50.300 We were doing very well in the polls.

00:49:52.660 And, you know, I think behind the scenes, people thought, you know, there were like 15 different candidates.

00:49:58.300 And they were splitting up the vote.

00:49:59.720 And that's how I was.

00:50:01.220 I was not necessarily getting over 50%.

00:50:03.420 I was getting more than other people.

00:50:04.800 So I was on the way to victory.

00:50:06.600 And they said, look, Bernie shouldn't be the candidate for a variety of reasons.

00:50:11.320 We don't want him the candidate.

00:50:12.620 Drop out.

00:50:13.260 And then on one day, a lot of people, one or two days, a lot of people dropped out.

00:50:17.540 It was Joe Biden and me.

00:50:18.420 And Joe had a lot of support.

00:50:19.480 And all these people came behind them.

00:50:20.780 And that's what happened.

00:50:22.100 Let me also say, you know, having said that, Biden is a friend of mine.

00:50:25.660 I think he has done a very good job over the last three and a half years.

00:50:29.220 And I'm working very hard to see that Kamala is elected our next president.

00:50:33.660 The heat of summer is here.

00:50:35.640 God, it's hot.

00:50:37.420 My shadows are not even, I saw it having a lemonade yesterday and wearing ice pack on its neck.

00:50:44.800 Like God.

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00:52:07.700 Did you feel like, did it seem, it started to seem like people were losing faith in the media, right?

00:52:16.000 And I feel like that that's had a huge effect on society.

00:52:18.580 It's created a lot of opportunities for what are often labeled as conspiracy theories,

00:52:23.620 but then often end up being truth just because, not all, but yeah, often end up being truths

00:52:28.860 or having realness to them because the news media isn't even, you know, it's like they all just go down these same similar paths

00:52:38.240 and it's not, it doesn't even feel real anymore.

00:52:41.220 I mean, the fact that you and I are talking is wild, you know, it's like, I fucking wouldn't talk to me, you know,

00:52:46.640 but, but, but the, you know, but the fact, but look, the bad news is bad news and good news.

00:52:52.400 The good news is you got a program and by millions of people tune into it.

00:52:56.240 Yeah.

00:52:56.940 And part of that is that people not necessarily believe CBS, NBC, ABC, or even Fox or anybody else.

00:53:04.340 And so let me tell you what I think about that.

00:53:07.540 I think you're, you're touching on an important issue.

00:53:09.460 We talk about healthcare, you talk about media.

00:53:10.880 You have about eight large media conglomerates, you know, Comcast and all these guys.

00:53:19.760 They're huge.

00:53:20.460 Serious.

00:53:20.980 Exactly.

00:53:21.640 They, they, they own, you know, people turn on their.

00:53:24.420 Clear channel.

00:53:25.100 You got it.

00:53:25.680 You got it.

00:53:26.280 They're huge.

00:53:26.840 They own, they don't own one station.

00:53:28.920 They own radio stations.

00:53:30.900 They own TV stations.

00:53:32.420 They own movies, you know, producers.

00:53:34.660 So these are owned by very large billionaires, you know,

00:53:39.560 big companies owned by billionaires and they, they will discuss issues from here to here.

00:53:45.280 All right.

00:53:45.700 I gave you an example about Medicare for all.

00:53:47.900 We should be having a tremendous discussion.

00:53:49.920 Why we're the only country on earth not to guarantee healthcare.

00:53:52.260 It doesn't take place on television.

00:53:54.340 We should be talking about massive income and wealth inequality.

00:53:57.500 There are three people in America who want more wealth than the bottom half of American society.

00:54:01.200 Think that's appropriate?

00:54:02.160 No, sir.

00:54:03.020 Okay.

00:54:03.400 I think there should be a limit on how much a person can earn.

00:54:05.480 Okay.

00:54:06.260 To be honest with you, it may be, you know,

00:54:07.760 some, you know, some millions, but I don't think it should be billions.

00:54:11.520 I agree with you.

00:54:12.720 I agree with you, actually.

00:54:13.740 And I think most Americans would.

00:54:15.880 When's the last time you've seen that discussion on NBC?

00:54:18.720 It ain't going to take place.

00:54:20.460 All right.

00:54:21.260 We have.

00:54:22.200 But that's what the people want, though.

00:54:23.580 Yes, that is exactly.

00:54:25.160 That's why you're a success.

00:54:26.600 And why other people, you know, with very limited resources, if you like,

00:54:30.580 because you don't see that type of discussion.

00:54:33.140 I just did a poll.

00:54:34.360 My campaign did a poll just on these issues.

00:54:36.440 You know, talking about issues that working class people want and need that are almost

00:54:42.560 never discussed in politics or in the corporate media.

00:54:45.460 And the answer is people are hurting.

00:54:47.440 They want change.

00:54:48.400 No one's talking about it.

00:54:49.660 Yeah.

00:54:50.380 Yeah.

00:54:50.740 It's heartbreaking.

00:54:51.420 It's like, I don't know.

00:54:53.060 The people don't even get thought of anymore.

00:54:54.580 It feels like a lot of times.

00:54:55.920 And here's the toughest part.

00:54:57.160 I think Bernie is as a person who, you know, has felt like in their life, maybe their father

00:55:02.160 died in a war, their grandfather died in a war.

00:55:04.100 And they've been trying to pay their taxes and be a, you know, considerate person in

00:55:08.440 their town or their country.

00:55:11.740 After a while, those good people start, it starts to erode a little because they don't

00:55:17.860 feel like, and they lose their sense of purpose, man.

00:55:20.100 When you're, you lose the fabric of your society.

00:55:22.700 A lot of people, that's how they, they didn't even realize it.

00:55:26.140 A lot of us don't even realize that's, we identify as an American.

00:55:29.440 And when you realize, well, America, it's nothing, but it's a, it's a shell LLC for

00:55:34.200 fucking big corporations.

00:55:35.900 Then what am I?

00:55:37.020 I'm just a, I'm just a idiot.

00:55:39.660 You know, and you almost feel ashamed of yourself, you know, or you can, you know, anyway, just,

00:55:44.380 I don't know.

00:55:45.060 A lot of that stuff just, I just don't see how people think that that's good or how you're

00:55:49.740 going to still be able to get people to buy in.

00:55:52.240 Theo, I think you said it better than I did.

00:55:54.360 I mean, I agree with you.

00:55:55.160 I think a lot of people are ashamed.

00:55:58.280 They're giving up.

00:55:59.180 They're hurting.

00:56:00.780 Yeah.

00:56:01.140 And many of these people have fought and died of their families, have fought and died in

00:56:04.360 wars, and they're good people.

00:56:06.500 And maybe they're, you know, nurses and they're, you know, business people.

00:56:09.860 Yeah.

00:56:10.100 Anything, crossing guard, mailman.

00:56:12.120 Exactly.

00:56:12.680 They believe in their community.

00:56:14.040 Yeah.

00:56:14.600 And meanwhile, they're getting ripped off by people on top politically and economically.

00:56:18.260 Well, even the radio, like you're saying, it's like, you used to have like a newspaper

00:56:21.800 and you, you read and it meant something.

00:56:24.080 Your community meant something.

00:56:25.220 It used to be that your grandpa worked at the factory and they made the table that you

00:56:29.360 have in your home.

00:56:29.960 And so everything had a story to it.

00:56:31.860 There's some connection.

00:56:32.640 And now it's like, we're buying stuff from countries that they're making it.

00:56:36.240 They don't care.

00:56:37.140 We're using it.

00:56:38.100 We don't care.

00:56:38.760 There's no story.

00:56:39.780 Nobody has any, like, uh, there's no, there's no thread.

00:56:45.700 You know, the thread just gets thin.

00:56:48.120 That's a very profound point you just made.

00:56:50.820 And so how do we get it back?

00:56:52.220 You know, it ain't easy.

00:56:53.640 Yeah.

00:56:54.040 But I think it, but I think you hit the nail on the head.

00:56:58.260 People, you know, you're in right now you're in Vermont, which is one of the smallest states

00:57:03.440 in the country.

00:57:04.720 It's very rural state.

00:57:05.860 Beautiful.

00:57:06.720 Burlington is the largest city with 40,000.

00:57:08.980 I used to be mayor here, you know, but you go into small towns, everybody knew everybody.

00:57:13.580 Often they were dairy farmers.

00:57:14.580 We had a lot of dairy farmers.

00:57:15.840 People work really hard being a dairy farmer.

00:57:18.060 Oh yeah.

00:57:18.260 I used to work at Cold Stone Kramers for a while.

00:57:20.200 So not the same, but I get it.

00:57:21.560 But I'm milking cows, you know, five o'clock in the morning on a cold winter day ain't easy

00:57:25.880 work.

00:57:26.920 But it was like, everybody knew each other.

00:57:29.600 Nobody cheated each other.

00:57:31.680 It was a sense of, then you have town meetings once a year and people argue about the school

00:57:35.560 budget and all that stuff.

00:57:37.320 And we are losing that big time for a lot.

00:57:39.800 Maybe next time we'll talk about that, but we're losing, we're losing that as you indicated

00:57:43.760 for a lot of reasons.

00:57:45.440 And if we don't get it back, I worry about the future of this country.

00:57:49.360 Yeah, we can, that is kind of a bigger topic.

00:57:51.620 I've heard you talk about the 32 hour work week, man.

00:57:54.540 It's intriguing.

00:57:55.520 When anybody, the second I heard that, I'm like, I'm in, you know?

00:57:58.940 I tell you, it got a lot of response.

00:58:02.560 Yeah.

00:58:02.680 I think there was a poll.

00:58:03.600 I don't know if it was a news week.

00:58:04.800 I don't know where it was that, yeah, the 32 hour work week.

00:58:09.300 And one of the reasons behind it is why.

00:58:11.560 Okay.

00:58:11.880 Here's why.

00:58:12.780 All right.

00:58:13.680 Let me back it up a little bit.

00:58:14.840 Okay.

00:58:15.460 I'm going to ask you a question.

00:58:16.480 Are you ready for a tough question?

00:58:17.860 Let's do it.

00:58:18.580 All right.

00:58:20.040 Over the last 50 years, five, zero years, massive changes in technology, right?

00:58:25.660 50 years ago, they didn't have this stuff.

00:58:28.580 Worker productivity has gone way up, right?

00:58:31.300 So you're a worker now playing with technology, machinery, whether it's a computer, whether

00:58:35.160 it's, you know, factory technology, you're producing a lot more, correct?

00:58:40.540 In terms of real-

00:58:41.960 You're producing more because you have machines that can help you.

00:58:43.840 Exactly.

00:58:44.020 Got it.

00:58:44.440 Okay.

00:58:44.680 Right.

00:58:45.420 Much more, by the way.

00:58:46.480 Right.

00:58:46.800 So a machine can do the work of 30 men in a day.

00:58:49.500 You got it.

00:58:50.100 Whatever it may be.

00:58:51.200 Okay.

00:58:51.380 In terms, despite all of that, worker, increased worker productivity, is the worker of today

00:59:00.900 in real inflation accounted for dollars, making more or less money than that worker was doing

00:59:06.640 or a worker, a similar type worker, 50 years ago?

00:59:10.400 What's the answer?

00:59:11.320 I would say less.

00:59:13.560 So less based on inflation and everything.

00:59:15.680 The workers making less now than they were then.

00:59:17.660 In real dollars.

00:59:18.300 Yeah.

00:59:18.540 We're called real dollars.

00:59:19.440 Inflation accounted for dollars.

00:59:20.580 Real dollars.

00:59:20.980 How insane is that if that worker is now producing so much more than he or she did?

00:59:28.240 Oh, I see what you're saying.

00:59:29.100 So now if a worker is operating a machine and that machine is doing the work of 20 workers,

00:59:33.660 then why isn't there some benefit to the worker?

00:59:36.700 You would think that the guys making more money, right?

00:59:40.960 Hey, you're producing a lot more.

00:59:42.580 Yeah.

00:59:42.820 Or widgets or whatever.

00:59:43.780 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:59:44.880 Okay.

00:59:45.460 Got it?

00:59:46.120 Okay.

00:59:47.020 Make it much.

00:59:48.160 Where did a lot of money go?

00:59:49.540 Who benefited from that?

00:59:50.500 Oh, the thing that I'll explain.

00:59:52.540 Oh, that same three to Tom, there was a study that there was a 50 trillion, untypical, redistribution

01:00:02.020 of wealth to a bottom 90% to the top 1%.

01:00:05.300 So, getting back to the 32-hour work week, it's a simple idea.

01:00:09.760 If you are a worker producing a hell of a lot more than was the case 30 years ago, you should benefit from an increased technology.

01:00:18.320 And one of the breakout people, as you mentioned, are you going to live under a lot of stress, right?

01:00:22.280 If you can lower that work week without loss of pay.

01:00:25.480 Right, so you're saying that there needs to be some keep back to them, because if everybody's earning more, if the company's earning more.

01:00:31.800 Yeah.

01:00:32.360 Yeah, some of the greed, it's just scary, man.

01:00:35.480 I don't know.

01:00:36.940 Yeah, it's just scary.

01:00:38.040 I want to get into, oh wait, but what about, would you have to raise the pay of people then?

01:00:43.860 Oh, I guess you would, because they're...

01:00:45.920 Yeah, you know, if you reduce, what we're doing here is reducing the work week, which is from 40 to 32, which, by the way, has not been changed since like 44.

01:00:58.880 Yeah, and that's when people had to do crops and everything.

01:01:01.040 Yeah.

01:01:01.820 Yeah, people were just, yeah, people were snitting by lightning bugging.

01:01:05.980 So, we are a much wealthier nation now, but I want that wealth to be distributed a little bit.

01:01:11.540 Yeah.

01:01:11.860 By the way, yeah, come on, tell us.

01:01:13.560 We're almost done, yep.

01:01:14.360 Okay, just one more issue I want to ask, and it'll be quick.

01:01:17.120 Last question, if you were to look at, if there's somebody out there today who's like a guy who you were, who wanted to see change,

01:01:23.300 who, you know, started protesting on campuses and got involved and became a mayor and wants to get into politics

01:01:29.980 and really thinks that they can make a difference, what path do they need to try for themselves now

01:01:35.800 with so much lobbying and stuff going on?

01:01:37.460 Like, what would you tell them?

01:01:40.160 All right, first of all, what you're involved in is some politics would change.

01:01:45.940 And being elected official is one way of bringing up a chance.

01:01:49.080 Let's not do any way.

01:01:50.200 You know, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. was never elected anything, right?

01:01:53.300 He had a profound impact on this country.

01:01:55.440 Never raped anything, all right?

01:01:58.560 And you're seeing young people who are concerned about climate change on campuses and little bit more.

01:02:03.180 So go with your passions.

01:02:05.320 You know, your passion may be different than what you're responsible.

01:02:07.380 I don't know this.

01:02:08.380 So work on that issue.

01:02:10.680 Greed people.

01:02:11.660 Educate.

01:02:12.400 Organize.

01:02:13.200 Greed people.

01:02:13.740 And if you then decide, hey, you may go along for the state legislature.

01:02:17.260 Never go along for times.

01:02:18.280 I want to get my, you know, hands dirty in politics.

01:02:21.800 Do it.

01:02:24.820 But first of all, don't do it just because I want to get elected.

01:02:28.240 That's bad, right?

01:02:29.620 Do it because you believe inside it.

01:02:32.180 And getting elected will help you do it fine.

01:02:34.500 If not, you can do it in other ways.

01:02:36.860 Yeah.

01:02:38.880 Bernie Sanders, thank you so much for your time, man.

01:02:41.080 Thank you very much.

01:02:42.380 And let me just say this.

01:02:43.360 Congratulations on your program.

01:02:44.620 And what programs like this do, I'm on TV a lot.

01:02:48.420 You know, I get seven seconds to make a point.

01:02:50.400 Can't make it seven seconds.

01:02:52.480 So we argue you can have a serious discussion about serious issues is really great.

01:02:56.920 I thank you for the opportunity and thank you for what you do.

01:02:59.660 Thank you.

01:03:00.100 I've always been a proponent.

01:03:00.960 And thank you for just being an outspoken person who believes in things and moves forward with

01:03:05.080 those beliefs.

01:03:07.760 Now I'm just floating on the breeze and I feel I'm falling like these leaves.

01:03:13.600 For 50 years now, hip-hop has been a reflection of culture and society.

01:03:18.920 That includes stories of struggle and pain, social injustice, racial inequality, the marginalization

01:03:24.880 of communities.

01:03:26.000 Today, we confront a health care system that has been rigged against all of us.

01:03:30.200 Hospitals force patients to sign contracts for services.

01:03:33.240 Without ever showing us actual prices.

01:03:35.880 Stifling competition.

01:03:37.040 Overcharging without accountability.

01:03:39.560 And if we can't pay, these same contracts.

01:03:42.440 Allow them to take everything we own.

01:03:44.560 Creating so much fear that millions and millions of Americans refuse to enter a hospital.

01:03:49.780 Putting our health and our lives at stake.

01:03:53.400 This is an American humanitarian crisis.

01:03:56.800 We love our nurses.

01:03:57.900 And we need our doctors.

01:03:58.860 But the hospitals and insurers.

01:04:00.780 Rigging a system to make profits off of people that says struggle is unforgivable.

01:04:06.980 We demand prices.

01:04:08.200 And transparency in health care.

01:04:10.460 Power to the patients.

This Past Weekend with Theo Von - August 13, 2024

E524 Sen. Bernie Sanders

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