In this episode, Tucker Carlson is joined by Ian Crossland, Luke Rutkowski, and Charlie Kirk to discuss the 2020 midterms and the future of democracy in a post-2020 world. They also discuss the importance of open source and free software in order to ensure a fair shake in the next election.
00:05:10.000And so we're looking at political victory right now.
00:05:13.000We're looking at cultural victories with the likes of Public Square, building the parallel economy, with Angel Studios and their movies, and of course, with a massive crowd and what we're seeing here at Turning Point USA.
00:05:23.000So the big question is, with all of this success and all this hope right in front of us, what can we expect next year and what do we do to keep the momentum up and avoid losing it?
00:05:33.000I think we're going to, the best thing to expect is equal response.
00:05:36.000You're going to get an equal and opposite response.
00:05:38.000So we've got to think clear and we've got to have slippery minds and willing to do new things that have never been done before, awesome new technologies, things that people won't be expecting, and implement them fast like Uber was implemented.
00:05:48.000Yeah, I think one thing conservatives have to be very careful about here is not assuming that we're going to have a victory because everyone was talking about the red wave day in and day out without us actually coalescing around a central message and because the only thing we had to say was we're going to win rather than putting forward a strategy for doing so we ended up getting clobbered and I'm worried that we have the potential to see that happen again in 2024.
00:06:11.000I don't know if I would, I know a lot of people felt like it was a clobbering with the midterm, but I think while we do see tremendous cultural victories, I'll give a shout out to Benny Johnson here, that amazing clip that I saw on X, where he was shouting out this massive audience and showing the lack thereof for some other leftist personalities.
00:06:30.000While I think we certainly are doing really well culturally and winning the hearts and minds of people, I think what a lot of people missed in 2020 and 22 was winning elections is not just about convincing people to vote, it's who counts the votes.
00:06:43.000And that's my concern now going into 2024.
00:06:45.000We can sit here and talk about polls all day and night.
00:06:48.000Are we going to have the procedure behind us to actually win?
00:06:51.000I mean, you're talking about Electronic Voting Man, you need to know what that software code is.
00:06:55.000Because if it's trick and shit behind the scene, maybe I can say that in this audience, you know what word I'm talking about.
00:07:03.000I think that demanding open source or free software voting like code, like AGPL3, so at least we can look at the code.
00:07:09.000It doesn't mean that people can't hack into it, and that might still be an issue, but at least we know that the machines are doing what they're supposed to do.
00:07:57.000Which of course was the kind of pivotal fact of that election.
00:08:00.000So I think you have to assume if we have another pandemic or a war, particularly a war between now and election day, that is either, you know, an intentional act to subvert our democracy or it certainly will be harnessed for that use.
00:08:18.000So I just wouldn't assume that it's going to come at you straight and head on.
00:08:32.000We're dealing with individuals that have committed psyops, that have committed horrible atrocities on the people of the world, that have started wars, that have started literal gene splicing, chemical, biological warfare against the people.
00:08:45.000So we have to understand there's going to be something that's going to be happening here that we should be absolutely paying attention to.
00:08:52.000As we're dealing with essentially a multi-trillion dollar propaganda machine, but it is being wrecked by shit posters and memes.
00:09:00.000It is being destroyed by individuals speaking truth to it.
00:09:03.000It is being destroyed by individuals coming together, coalescing, and saying enough is enough of this bullcrap.
00:09:24.000They're capable of something that we can't even imagine.
00:09:27.000Luke's just cranking it right up to 11 right when we get started, so I can respect that.
00:09:30.000But in terms of what Tucker was just mentioning about war, I'm hearing a lot of talk about a potential full-scale war with Russia as something that could potentially subvert us in 2024.
00:09:40.000Well, war means war powers for the people waging the war.
00:09:44.000So, these are people who think only in terms of power, acquiring it, preventing you from having it.
00:09:49.000So, they see it... I mean, you see war in terms of its human cost or maybe its geopolitical effect.
00:09:54.000They see war in terms of their own fortunes and their own power.
00:09:57.000So, the second we're out war, and there's a long history of this in the West, when war broke out in 1940 in England, the government, later run by Winston Churchill, our hero, put the opposition party in prison with their families
00:10:43.000Richie McGinnis, who's a friend of ours and also a journalist, who worked for The Caller, said this guy is unambiguously a journalist, and he told them only a few months ago, they'll never arrest you for this, but now they're doing it.
00:11:23.000It is worse, but I'm saying, like, why does everyone pretend like this ghost system, which is merely sort of a, you know, a gross, grotesque imitation of its former self, still is real?
00:12:59.000Waiting around is not the solution, because if we just petition them to, hey, please stop electronic voting, we can't see the code, please give us the code, it's not going to happen.
00:13:05.000We need to build systems that are better.
00:13:07.000Or in parallel, like, we could vote legitimately on the machine, or wherever, and then on a blockchain, voluntarily.
00:13:15.000It would just take a lot of us to do it.
00:13:17.000And then we could check and see if they're accurate.
00:13:19.000And that would be one way to move forward.
00:13:25.000Yeah, let's not have electronic voting machines.
00:13:27.000Open source the code, do whatever you gotta do.
00:13:29.000But there's a practical question of what can we do right now with less than a year in front of us?
00:13:35.000The best thing is use X and Twitter because it's obviously a threat to them.
00:13:40.000They wouldn't want to shut it down or go after Elon if it wasn't working.
00:13:42.000The greatest hope we have in 2024 is we have a sliver of the public square back that we didn't have in 20.
00:13:48.000And that's why they're going to try to either indict Elon or they're just going to try to crash Twitter through a DDoS attack or some sort of foreign threat.
00:13:54.000They're going to try to take Twitter down by the summer.
00:13:59.000People are saying things on Twitter that you're not allowed to say.
00:14:02.000And they're going very viral very quickly, and public opinion is changing too rapidly.
00:14:06.000Can I just point out, I think it was Dave Smith who pointed this out to us on the show, that before Elon Musk purchased X, if you said men are not women, you would be banned.
00:14:19.000I mean, it is quite remarkable, to be fair, the gains we've gotten back.
00:14:23.000I mean, it's a tremendous loss for the fact that we could not say on one of the biggest social media platforms in the world, men aren't women.
00:14:29.000They actually banned Meghan Murphy for saying that.
00:14:34.000I find Twitter is a vulnerability at this moment.
00:14:36.000The way it's built, the centralized system.
00:14:38.000So if we can decentralize that thing into a protocol and still use it and it's fast enough, there's still issues with like Nostr where sending video is slow, but it doesn't mean it's always going to be slow.
00:14:47.000We can use mesh networks so that if we all have Twitter on our phone and four of our phones go down, the other two are going to keep the network going.
00:14:55.000That, you know, what Turning Point USA is doing right here is one of the most important things.
00:15:04.000That culture building is the most important thing because, as we all know, it's been quoted 50 billion times, Andrew Breitbart, politics is downstream from culture.
00:15:12.000Someone told me this is like the RNC now.
00:15:15.000This is basically, why not just, this is the RNC, de facto.
00:15:42.000I'll take it as what the RNC shouldn't be doing.
00:15:44.000I gotta say, you know, having been around this stuff my whole life and spent my whole life in Washington, the true corruption of the Republican Party, I don't know, it just took, I was like 10 years behind on that.
00:16:09.000But the Republican Party pretends to be on your side.
00:16:11.000They're like quizlings, but they're literally... The Republican Congress just allowed the Biden administration to spy on Republican voters.
00:16:21.000So, like, is there a bigger sign of the fact that they hate you every bit as much as the Democrats?
00:16:26.000What I love about this, though, is I agree with you.
00:16:28.000However, if you are on the, how would I describe this, the lower end of the IQ bell curve, you don't understand what it is Democrats are saying they're doing.
00:16:37.000So, for instance, when they say they're going to have free trade, that's good for everybody.
00:16:40.000When they say we're going to increase environmental regulations and increase taxes, to the average person, they're like, this is good, it makes the rich pay their fair share.
00:16:48.000But to anybody who knows anything, They're like, hey, wait a minute.
00:16:52.000This is going to drive all of our manufacturing base overseas where they can ship their products back for dirt, pay people in China dirt, and have no environmental regulations.
00:17:01.000So this is why Trump takes actions when he did in his first term that resulted in a lot of manufacturing coming back.
00:17:08.000And I'm not trying to be too much of a dick.
00:17:10.000But there's a lot of people who don't understand the basics.
00:17:13.000And I'm sorry, but sometimes I do argue with them on X. And they say, you know, I remember this one conversation where a guy said, you know, food comes from the store.
00:17:21.000And I said, yes, but where does that food come from?
00:17:50.000It seemed like you were on the side of the Republican, like George Bush.
00:17:52.000and the movement and then what John Stewart came on one day and you guys
00:17:55.000just had it out and it was like humiliation he's like please stop
00:17:58.000harming America but the way you were looking at him was like really listening
00:18:00.000to him was that was that a moment? No I thought and I still think that he's in
00:18:05.000mediocrity and and I think time has proven me right on that.
00:18:10.000Absolutely. But what's interesting is that by that point I mean this is not
00:18:14.000even interesting at But my views on Iraq, which I had a daily TV show leading up to that war, and I had kind of endorsed it, sort of half-heartedly, against my better instincts.
00:18:26.000I've felt ashamed about it ever since.
00:18:28.000And then I went to Iraq in December of 2003, 20 years ago this month.
00:18:32.000And I watched the whole place fall apart, and I won't bore you with the details, but I realized that everything I'd advocated for was a complete lie.
00:18:39.000That this was a disaster that could only hurt my country, which is the only country I really care about.
00:18:44.000And, by the way, it eliminated the entire Christian population of Iraq, which I guess we're not allowed to say.
00:18:50.000But if you're a Christian, you should care what happens to Christians globally.
00:18:52.000And I must say, they do bear the brunt of almost all of our foreign policy.
00:19:05.000And they do wind up bearing the disproportionate harm in our foreign policy adventures.
00:19:12.000And you have to ask yourself, why is that?
00:19:15.000Honestly, I don't know the answer, but it's super evil.
00:19:19.000Well, I feel like a large component, and I think you were saying this earlier, if not the component of what the culture war is, is the destruction of Christianity.
00:19:30.000The destruction of Christianity, there's also a destruction of innocence.
00:19:33.000Americans, unfortunately, will look at our foreign policy as if it's something entirely removed from our cultural realities and attitudes, but the truth is we have promoted a callous disregard for human life over the course of decades because abortion was legal nationwide across this country prior to the overturning of Roe.
00:19:51.000And if you think sending women the message and mend the message that they can wage war against their
00:19:56.000own unborn children does not have effects on the global stage
00:19:59.000and that a person who doesn't have to care about the life of their unborn child is supposed to care about children in
00:20:03.000Gaza or Yemen, you're out of your mind.
00:20:15.000They need more babies to go send to war.
00:20:17.000Well, yes, I think that's also a component to it, but there's also a lot of hypocrisy because a lot of the chaos that was created by this foreign policy was deliberate.
00:20:25.000Dick Cheney in 1991 was specifically talking about why we can't get rid of Saddam Hussein because if we do, it's going to create chaos inside of the Middle East.
00:21:04.000And there needs to be consequences for the actions that they've taken.
00:21:07.000They have literally done everything they could have possibly done with the role that they had to destroy our country and ensure that the people do not have a prosperous future.
00:21:14.000I mean, we put all of the decision-making in the hands of people who pay no price when they're wrong.
00:21:18.000I want to throw back to what you were saying, Tucker, about, you know, you being on the wrong side of that and you, you know, regretting it and all that stuff.
00:21:25.000I think everybody here now agrees, and this is why they tremendously respect you, and it's because you say things that are true, you learn things, and then you correct yourself, you evolve your opinions, and here you are, you know, many of us, we've watched you for so long, and you take a look at the other conservatives in the establishment with the rise of Donald Trump, and what did they do?
00:21:43.000All of a sudden now, they're indistinguishable from Democrats.
00:21:49.000They are the people who said, I don't care what's true or correct.
00:21:51.000I care about what grants me political power.
00:21:53.000And now we're looking at old neoconservatives who have effectively joined the Democratic Party or super PACs that are going after Trump.
00:22:01.000And my favorite thing is when Trump, in 2020, after they announced Biden wins, you have groups like the Lincoln Project saying, oh, our fight's not over.
00:22:10.000Well, it's just a Democrat super PAC with old Republicans now saying whatever Democrats want to hear to make money.
00:22:16.000But I do think it, yeah I agree with every word and I work for some of the people that you're referring to and it's horrifying to me to see them change but I do think a lot of it has to do with what's going on inside them and they won't admit when they're wrong and that's a tragedy for the country but it's also a tragedy for them.
00:22:34.000There's nothing better for you, there's nothing more liberating, there's nothing more joy inspiring than being able to admit when you're wrong.
00:22:42.000It frees you from the burden of the mistake that you made.
00:22:50.000It's the basic precept of all true liberation movements begin with you admitting that you're probably not a super great person and you don't have unlimited power.
00:22:59.000It starts with you being honest about yourself.
00:23:01.000And if you can't do that, you are in a prison.
00:23:04.000And that's why they're all so fearful.
00:23:32.000There's also a big distinction here that I think is very important to kind of call out here because when we have these two sides, we have the establishment and we have the anti-establishment, the bigger distinction is one side is a bunch of bloodthirsty neoconservatives that want war and death and murder.
00:23:49.000The other side wants, of course, none of that.
00:23:54.000They are anti-war, principally anti-war.
00:23:56.000And for years now, there has always been an attack, no matter who you are, if you are anti-war.
00:24:02.000And I think this is a key issue that's going to be very important for this election cycle, because I do think something in Ukraine, something in Europe is going to be that galvanizing, New Pearl Harbor-like event.
00:24:12.000And I think we need to speak up more, be more anti-war more than ever, because this is the key crux issue.
00:24:18.000And for years, Bill O'Reilly previously called me a jihad-loving liberal.
00:25:06.000That an event like this, that would have been predominantly conservative, would have, 20 years ago, been totally on Team Neoliberal, and every thinker would have, maybe there might have been a little bit of contrarians here.
00:25:15.000And, Tucker, what do you make of that?
00:25:17.000That all of a sudden, the home of not just America First, but skepticism about these foreign wars and adventures now lives in the conservative movement.
00:25:24.000Well, I think it, of course, it's mostly Trump who did that.
00:25:26.000And I was just, the pivotal moment in the last election, in the 2016 election, that changed my view of everything, was the night of the debate in Greenville, South Carolina, when Trump said, you know, that we didn't get anything out of the Iraq war.
00:25:59.000He's going to get creamed in the primary.
00:26:02.000And I thought the people I know, having been in Iraq and a lot of people served there, the people who are maddest about the Iraq war, the people whose lives were disrupted or ended or severely injured by that war.
00:26:14.000And it was at that moment, he won the South Carolina primary, it was at that moment that they decided, Bill Kristol and the rest of the ghouls, who were starting to think about how to subvert this campaign and, like, draw its energy for their own dark ends, they decided, oh, well, we have to stop him, you know, and that's when the realignment happened on the left, where Liz Cheney and Bill Kristol, all these people whose core problem is they could never admit that the great adventure of their life, the Iraq war, was wrong.
00:26:37.000And if they just admitted it, I mean Liz Cheney has lived with this burden, and she's obviously a bloodthirsty freak, but one of the reasons that she is a bloodthirsty freak is that she's never been able to be honest about her own complicity in this crime.
00:26:49.000And if she would, she would be totally free of all that, and she'd be like a normal human being who her husband could love again, and it would just be all good.
00:26:55.000But she can't, and they're all like that!
00:27:17.000They're trying to accrue resources and it's either that they're trying to get the oil out of the Middle East or the poppies out of the Middle East.
00:27:24.000So this is why I push a lot of hydrogen and like redevelopment of our hydrogen industry at home so that we don't need to go steal resources elsewhere.
00:27:31.000They want to trade route into India through the Mediterranean and they want to secure this.
00:27:36.000That's a tough one to not... Ian, you're being too logical here.
00:27:42.000Yeah, so I just want to make a point here about the conservative anti-war movement and why I'm so optimistic about it.
00:27:47.000I'm a firm believer that an effective anti-war movement has to be conservative.
00:27:51.000Because when you look at the things people fight for, the things that motivate people to enlist, it's God, country, and family.
00:27:57.000And when the left is anti-war, the way they discuss it is, God, country, and family are stupid and you were an idiot for fighting for those things.
00:28:05.000And what conservatives can say is, those things are valuable, those things are good, you're a brave and good person who was manipulated by liars who don't care about those things, and we're using you to profit.
00:28:15.000Well, I do think you're half right, Seamus.
00:28:18.000What I often hear... It's better than usual.
00:28:21.000When the left talks about anti-war, there are people I know I've had conversations with, and I'll make sure I carve out respect for them, but typically it's, this war is an affront to family and faith and stability in the economy for the other country.
00:28:41.000A lot of this is not for strategic American goals.
00:28:44.000I don't think these people care about America.
00:28:46.000These people literally go to the Bohemian Grove and do mock child sacrifices.
00:28:49.000They literally do spirit cooking where they take bodily fluids and try to summon demons.
00:28:54.000They literally go to private islands where they hurt little babies and children in unspeakable ways that we can't even mention here on this particular freaking broadcast.
00:29:03.000These are evil, sinister human beings that I truly do believe are worshipping a larger outside entity, a satanic evil entity.
00:29:12.000It sounds reductive to say that, but if you look at everything they do, it doesn't add up until you put in the kind of spiritual aspect to this.
00:29:19.000They have been hijacked, they are not real souls, they are individuals serving the greater evil.
00:30:07.000Shout out to Owen Schroer for making that point.
00:30:09.000But this is the issue that brings people together.
00:30:11.000And I want to kind of change this conversation a little bit, because if you look at left, right, center, everyone agrees, hey, what they were doing for decades with the FBI covering up child abuse when the witnesses and people came to them and said, hey, this is happening, police officers, judges, prosecutors, politicians, celebrities, media moguls
00:30:58.000Was right, because we all saw, as much as you probably didn't want to, that video out of the Senate, was the Hart Building hearing room floor, which was very disturbing.
00:31:06.000And I do hope they decontaminate that building.
00:31:22.000There's a couple people that did, but yeah.
00:31:23.000Well, it is a desecration of the space.
00:31:25.000I mean, most January 6th people, I've interviewed a lot of them, as you have, and they're all, I mean, they were there because they believe in the system, because they all had pocket constitutions, they thought it was real, and they were so shocked to see their election stolen, which obviously it was, and that they marched on the Capitol.
00:31:42.000But they were there to uphold the system, and some did it imperfectly, and some got out of hand, of course.
00:31:47.000But this guy is there to degrade it, to defile it, on purpose.
00:31:52.000Like, there's no reason to do that in a hearing room.
00:32:05.000There were people there who were let in by the cops.
00:32:08.000But knew that something violent was happening.
00:32:10.000But more importantly, I've spoken with many people who showed up an hour after any violence, cleared roads, no gates, doors wide open with cops smiling, welcomed them in and took selfies, and those people, I've met two of them, they're going to prison for 18 months.
00:32:25.000And they said, I showed up an hour later, it's a clear sidewalk, we walked up, there are people milling about, cops open the door, we're shrugging, we walk inside for a few minutes, we walk out, no idea anything ever happened, next thing we know the feds are at our door.
00:32:38.000These are not people who even, as you described Tucker, these are people who are just there to see Trump speak and happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.
00:32:45.000I mean when is some, honestly, I mean I don't, we don't want to put anyone in jeopardy, but like until people say we're just not playing along with this anymore, obviously Congress isn't gonna help.
00:32:55.000Christianity is like the battlefield of the culture war, and you were talking about demonism and Satanism creeping into the culture in a lot of ways.
00:33:01.000I think one of the problems with Christianity is that it encourages people to be subservient to a church, and then therefore subconsciously they become subservient to a government.
00:33:10.000Well, a man has as many masters as he does vices, and the reality is you're a slave to something, and if you choose to be a slave to God as opposed to the government, you will be the most difficult possible man to conquer.
00:33:28.000But I don't disagree with Ian's point, but I think it would have to be refined in that there are people who masquerade, pretend, or don't truly understand, and would use faith to manipulate others.
00:33:38.000I mean, we see this in government, especially when Democrats claim to be the real Christians, but then say the church is in favor of, say, abortion or something like that.
00:33:46.000Yeah, and obviously I'm speaking from a thoroughly Protestant perspective, but my reading of Christianity, just like the text, does not at all indicate loyalty to a church.
00:34:19.000I'll make a quick point and shout out our good friend, Bill Maher, because it's a point I've made frequently that whether Bill acknowledges or not, as an atheist, his moral framework is built on Judeo-Christian values this country was founded on.
00:34:32.000Well, Tom Holland wrote the book called Dominion, where he's an atheist secularist who said that we all have a Christian inheritance, whether you like it or not.
00:34:45.000Christian values and, you know, I wanted to explore years ago why the Founding Fathers decided upon these amendments to the Constitution and the framework as it was, and you learn a lot about how the Bible influenced their views of what is just and moral.
00:34:59.000So just to, at the surface reading, you might say, oh, you know, Christians aren't supposed to fight back against tyranny.
00:35:05.000Exodus 1, the midwives to the Hebrews.
00:35:07.000It disobeyed the order of Pharaoh, where they said, throw all the babies in the river.
00:35:10.000They said, no, we're not going to do that.
00:35:11.000And God said, dealt well with them, it says in Exodus 1.
00:35:14.000Daniel 6, Daniel disobeyed the order, says, you can't pray anymore.
00:35:17.000He says, nope, I'm going to keep praying.
00:35:18.000And he opened up the window and prayed proudly, and it ended up in the lions' den.
00:35:21.000In Acts, it says, you obey God, not man.
00:35:23.000So throughout Christianity, we have seen, honestly, one of the most successful movements against tyranny are when Christians are brought to a breaking point.
00:35:33.000Christians can be very agreeable, and then as soon as that snaps, disobedience to tyrants is obedience to God.
00:35:41.000I want to shout out Seamus real quick, when he said you'd be the most difficult man to conquer, and this is exactly why I think there is such a tremendous push against anything that is related to Christianity, because these are people who follow God, who obey God, and you need someone to beholden to a man, because a man can change the rules at any moment.
00:36:00.000Yeah, well, and so you guys, I know you mentioned you're coming at it from a Protestant perspective.
00:36:03.000I'm the resident Catholic here, so I have a different perspective on the church, but I will say part of the reason I appreciate you so much and the things that you've said on air is because even though you're an Episcopalian, you're somehow like the most Catholic commentator on air.
00:36:16.000I find the things that you say about like economic justice and also social conservatism tend to line up very closely with the political values that I have as a Catholic, but I would say that Of course, as Christians, we should be good citizens and obey civil authorities when they are not asking us to do something evil.
00:36:34.000But as soon as you're commanded to do something evil, you have to resist that.
00:36:38.000Yeah, the scriptures are very clear about that.
00:36:41.000And the church tradition is very clear about that.
00:36:43.000Tucker, you made some very interesting comments recently that has been going viral all over social media when you were specifically talking about UFOs.
00:36:52.000And you were specifically talking about something that is Hard to kind of really understand here.
00:36:58.000I was wondering, what's your kind of take on all of this?
00:37:01.000Because I see this as a spiritual war.
00:37:15.000In the clip that you're referring to, which like eight people have sent me, in outrage that I basically said there are things that I know that I won't say.
00:37:22.000Which, of course, is not exactly right.
00:37:50.000Well, the military has been working in this realm for a very long time.
00:37:54.000They have been also trying to weaponize it.
00:37:57.000There's also a lot of crazy experiments that they did with DMT, hooking people up essentially to DMT IVs, having people go off into the spiritual realm.
00:38:05.000So, if you're not paying attention, you don't understand that there's a larger kind of energetic frequency and battle happening.
00:40:26.000And since everyone here is cool, I'll say this.
00:40:29.000With respect to demons and spiritual forces, there's a priest who was laicized towards the end of his career.
00:40:35.000He's relatively controversial, but he was an exorcist by the name of Malachi Martin.
00:40:39.000And one thing he said about exorcism cases is that in films you see all of these over-the-top portrayals of heads spinning and vomiting, and he said when it comes to things like vomiting and all of these supernatural visual indicators of possession, that those are the cases that are the most mild because the soul's trying to fight back, and with forms of perfect possession, the most dangerous forms of possession, you can't tell when you look at the person.
00:41:01.000Because they're perfectly content with the evil thing they're doing.
00:41:03.000And then you look at the way people in D.C.
00:41:05.000act, you look at the way our political leaders act, and you go, is it that much of a stretch to say some of these people... This is not some crazy outsider belief!
00:41:11.000Jesus performs exorcisms in the Bible!
00:41:13.000Like, this is not something that... And does it make you wonder that no doctor has ever been able to explain where exactly schizophrenia comes from?
00:41:33.000And that's because, in my view, as a 28-year-old cartoonist who knows basically nothing about the world, but if I would be so bold as to speculate on this, I think part of that is the problem with psychology is it doesn't take into account that the human person is a body-soul composite.
00:41:46.000And that you are not just chemical reactions happening at the level of the brain in a series of tangled up pathologies that produce certain behaviors and states of consciousness.
00:42:23.000He is a liar, a cheater, a deceiver, a manipulator.
00:42:25.000I mean, I was so shocked to see this guy on TV lie in the way he does to destroy.
00:42:30.000And I call him out because it's an easy name to throw mud at.
00:42:34.000But there are so many people that I'm shocked to see, particularly on the left with liberals, and now the neocons have joined them, who I'm shocked when I'm like...
00:42:52.000When I was at Occupy Wall Street, this was one of my formative moments.
00:42:57.000Here I am, 25 years old, really still kind of believing a lot of, you know, good and evil is subjective, and I met someone who worked for a major media corporate press publication who explained to me, as they write and support the movement, they were nihilists.
00:43:10.000And so their intention was to watch the world burn down.
00:43:56.000These are the people that you put in charge of your life and this is where I come as an anarchist and once again try to remind all you amazing people the solutions are usually within you taking personal responsibility for yourself.
00:44:09.000If you give the government even a niche, you give them anything, they will absolutely take it and abuse it for their own personal benefit.
00:44:15.000I want to get to Seamus' point here really quickly because what you talked about Some people talk about frequency, some people talk about energies, some people describe it as souls.
00:44:23.000You do have a frequency, but you decide where that frequency goes, how it's affected, what its impact on the world it will have, and that choice is everyone's.
00:44:34.000And I think the more we start looking at ourselves and how we could be better and less government intervening in our lives, then the true change will happen in our society when we no longer will need government.
00:45:39.000I mean, here's someone who's actively opposed to the interests of the country I grew up in, who endorsed the BLM riots, and who is not left, but is neoliberal in the darkest, most, speaking of nihilist, nihilistic way.
00:45:55.000And has no real popular support, is a creature of the oligarch, so yeah, that would be reason to oppose the ticket.
00:47:17.000I've covered a lot of campaigns going back to 1992 and I've noticed this thing in many candidates and I noticed it in him.
00:47:24.000The process of running for president and speaking three times a day and having people throw hostile questions in your face causes you to change.
00:47:32.000They all change during these campaigns.
00:47:35.000And I feel like Vivek's positions have gotten much more sincere since the beginning of this.
00:47:41.000I watch him with Nikki Hale and I'm like, this is a guy who's very offended by her views, like for real.
00:47:46.000He's not attacking her because she's a woman, he's attacking her because he actually thinks her views are terrible for the country he lives in.
00:48:44.000It's like the one thing I know a lot about.
00:48:46.000And I think that kind of disqualifies me right there.
00:48:49.000But can I just ask a question since you all are so on the internet and like I'm not that much.
00:48:55.000You really get the sense that Ron DeSantis, who I liked as governor, Uh, the people who represent him online are the nastiest, the stupidest, and the most zero-sum people I've ever seen in my life.
00:49:07.000And I don't think that reflects him, but it's like, this is kind of small ball.
00:49:11.000And by the way, these purported conservatives, Ron DeSantis changed his view, and I like him, okay?
00:49:15.000I think he's been a good governor, I just want to be clear about that.
00:49:19.000But his donor, Ken Griffin, told him to change his view on Ukraine from it's a regional conflict we shouldn't get involved in to it's a super important thing we should send more money.
00:49:29.000One donor got him to change his view and all these so-called conservatives are supporting that like it's the most important thing ever.
00:49:35.000Like who are these people and what is their problem?
00:50:17.000That's literally what I'm saying, of course, thank you.
00:50:19.000No, so with the DeSantis situation, again, I know people who work for his campaign who are good people who I really like, but that said, I have not gotten more angry, petty pushback from anons online ever for pushing back against any politician than I have when I've made comments about DeSantis that were really pretty benign.
00:50:40.000I remember when he was announcing his campaign, one thing I said is, you know when i see trump tear de santis apart or make fun
00:50:48.000of him it doesn't thrill me the way him destroying jeb bush thrilled me
00:50:51.000because i think of both trump and the santa's are successful that's good for the
00:50:54.000republican party and it's a shame that they've been pitted against i agree with
00:50:59.000i said that and i said here's the reality about the status I should have been agreeing with everything he was saying in his campaign speech when he first announced, and I was bored to tears, and they need to get somebody to help him with his delivery so he can be more charismatic, because that matters to people.
00:51:13.000I think that's a pretty benign piece of constructive criticism, and I was just flooded with angry replies from his followers, and it was so strange to me, because I've said far harsher things about other Republican candidates, and I have not experienced even a small fraction of the pushback.
00:51:31.000By the way, as someone who has generally liked Trump, I've made fun of and pushed back against Trump too, and my fans who really like Trump enjoyed it.
00:51:39.000They thought it was funny or they agreed.
00:51:47.000My conspiracy theory is that the people online are actually Trump supporters masquerading as DeSantis supporters to just make everybody hate him.
00:52:10.000But they keep doing the exact same thing.
00:52:12.000But I'll tell you, I had a realization the other day because I saw this tweet from Laura Loomer, which purportedly came from Christina Pasha, but it appeared to be fake.
00:52:20.000And I tweeted, no, there's no way this can be real.
00:52:22.000Christina Bouchard then retweeted a fake version, supposedly coming from Laura Loomer.
00:52:27.000Now, at this point, it's clearly fake because it was a manipulation on what Laura had posted.
00:52:31.000So I call that out, saying, these people are the scumbags they claim the Trump people are.
00:52:36.000And I get this pushback where they say, you seem to have ignored the fact the Trump campaign did this first.
00:52:46.000She does a lot of work in support of Trump.
00:52:48.000But she is outside of the campaign, and she is not on the same level as Trump's campaign staff and press secretary.
00:52:54.000Christina Bouchard for Ron DeSantis is his second-in-command, who is acting on the internet as though she is on the same level as Laura Loomer is, despite Laura not being part of Trump's campaign.
00:53:03.000So, and I'm saying this not to be disrespectful to anybody.
00:53:06.000What I'm saying is if you are running a presidential campaign but you think your path to victory is to argue with fans of your opponent online, you have put yourself way below the standards of that governor you're representing.
00:53:18.000One thing I want to point out that might be a possible explanatory factor here, the great and insightful Oren McIntyre said this, so I'll give him credit, but the DeSantis campaign has effectively become a shelling point for all of the elements within the Republican Party that just hated Trump.
00:53:32.000So even though DeSantis has great policies because they see it as a very us versus him type of thing, a lot of people in the Republican Party who we would agree shouldn't have a place in it have migrated to his campaign and I don't think they've advised him well.
00:53:45.000It is very clear that there's some ineptitude going around in DeSantis' campaign, but you brought up, Tim, that there's some sort of malfeasance, that people are in there manipulating the scenes.
00:53:53.000Like, we have AI that could just be twisting people's thoughts about DeSantis constantly, with comments, with retweets.
00:53:59.000AI could be retweeting other AIs, or even machine learning algorithms that are, like, making him look really bad on purpose, or Vice versa.
00:54:12.000One of the scariest things I think we're seeing now is the potential for what... I mean, Steve Van talks about quite a bit, the singularity.
00:54:19.000We're getting... Well, let me start from the beginning.
00:54:21.000There's something called dead Internet theory.
00:56:15.000People are getting, we have more cancer actually.
00:56:17.000obesity, more suicide, more cancer. Exactly, so where, just show me the place where technology
00:56:21.000in the last 20 years has made people happier. And I don't think there is such a place, so
00:56:28.000maybe we should rethink our core assumptions about technology. I agree, but I do think
00:56:31.000we have serious cultural problems and I wonder if, perhaps the argument is a culture will
00:56:36.000be destroyed through technology in this way, particularly communications technology.
00:56:41.000It starts with the printing press, which we say was great, then the radio, it was fantastic.
00:56:45.000Then television, oh how awesome, and now the internet, it's changed everything, but it does seem like it's becoming noise and static and pure chaos from it.
00:56:52.000I'm wondering if it is an impossible solution, or if we've just not found the solution.
00:57:08.000Creativity pretty much died in the West in August of 1945 when we bombed Hiroshima and then Nagasaki.
00:57:15.000So, I don't know, maybe I'm the only person who's interested in this, but the death of creativity in the United States is very jarring to me.
00:58:35.000After the 90s with the explosion of the internet, now it's... I gotta tell you, we went to the mall a couple days ago, and this... It really does blow my mind that I see a Hot Topic, and I guarantee you, Jack Skellington is in the window.
00:58:46.000That's a 30-year-old movie still being sold to kids who have no idea what it is.
00:58:51.000There's a viral TikTok where a young woman's wearing a Nirvana shirt.
01:00:59.000Around this point, when you start getting the lack of, when you have people who intentionally do not have children, you look at a lot of these videos and you see there's a through line.
01:01:09.000People who don't have kids lean a certain direction.
01:01:12.000They're not working hard for something because they don't have that responsibility.
01:02:32.000But Tucker's question, what has benefited humanity, I can't say the internet has because it seems to be at best neutral, because it's also been weaponized by deep state elements on X, on Facebook, on Instagram, on YouTube, to silence people at the exact same time and create fake news.
01:02:57.000So I would kind of agree with Tucker here when it comes to this.
01:03:00.000And a lot of this sometimes has to do with short-term pleasures over long-term pleasures.
01:03:04.000But I think a lot of it also has a lot to do with a larger chemical castration that is happening systematically of the average male.
01:03:14.000If you look at sperm counts, they are dramatically going down.
01:03:16.000The average 22-year-old has lower testosterone than the average 70-year-old in the 1980s.
01:03:23.000That's not a coincidence, as of course men with low T are more easy to be conquered and controlled and dominated and enslaved.
01:03:29.000There's a reason that I think there's a larger biological war out there, and whether it's fought with seed oils, or high fructose corn syrup, or with aspartate... Plastic water bottles.
01:03:38.000Plastic PFA's, forever chemicals, whatever you might call it.
01:04:04.000I mean, here we are now, and it's like, definitively, you know, the chemicals leaching into your food through plastics do this, and everyone's like, oh, is it really doing that?
01:04:13.000It's like the benefits outweigh the consequences.
01:04:15.000It doesn't just give you Bill Gates moobs, okay?
01:04:18.000It destroys any kind of resistance to the system.
01:04:22.000He says as he's drinking coconut water from a plastic bottle.
01:04:30.000For us, back at the studio, we bought reusable glass bottles.
01:04:33.000Hey, we're recycling, look at that, we're reusing.
01:04:35.000You refill your glass bottle with filtered water, but also we want to reduce how much plastic we have attached to the food we're eating.
01:04:39.000But may I suggest one other downside, not to be dark about it, but technology has enabled the creation of a surveillance state that's so out of pace as anything East Germany even attempted.
01:04:49.000The net effect, and ask yourself if you thought this recently, is that no one feels free to express unimproved thoughts even in private because you know you're being listened to or that you could be listened to.
01:04:59.000And what is the effect on the human soul when there's no place for you to honestly express yourself?
01:05:07.000Liberty is you know, impossible without privacy. You have to have,
01:05:13.000there was no door in your bathroom or on your bedroom. Would you feel free? Of course not. That's
01:05:31.000And one thing I firmly believe is that tyranny is fundamentally anti-intimacy.
01:05:36.000If there are people you trust and have genuinely intimate relationships with, you can tell things, you can share your real thoughts with, Then you are a harder person to control because other people are there to tell you that you're not crazy for noticing things that they're noticing as well.
01:05:50.000And what we have done with intimacy is firstly we've taken it, we've turned it into a euphemism for sex, and anytime someone has an intimate relationship with a genuine friend, we make jokes about them being homosexual with that person, or if it's a friend of the opposite sex, or Even their spouse, if they have a genuinely loving, caring relationship with their spouse, where they bare their souls out to one another, we see that as strange.
01:06:10.000That should be somebody you just use for sex, and not someone who you actually have a deep spiritual connection with.
01:06:16.000And I think that's part of why pornography is so important to those in power, is because it strips one of the most intimate things people do of its intimacy.
01:08:01.000And if you're going to hide and have secrets, is it righteous or just to force your secrets into the open so that now you're forced to be honest?
01:08:21.000That's why in Christianity, you only want a loving God to know your thoughts.
01:08:26.000And Nikki Haley wants him to know everything.
01:08:28.000If an unloving thing sees your thoughts, imagine what would happen.
01:08:31.000A neural net would be like a brain-computer interface where you're sending commands and receiving commands from machines in real time with your thoughts.
01:08:38.000Yeah, I'm not going to be an early adapter of that.
01:08:40.000Well, that's the danger of the AI and the artificial intelligence.
01:08:44.000As many world leaders said, whoever controls artificial intelligence first will control the world.
01:08:50.000Vladimir Putin said the country that leads in AI will be the ruler of the world.
01:08:54.000With this technology, especially with its perpetual growth, there's a lot of threats and challenges for humanity
01:09:21.000There's also a larger possibility that the AI could already be in charge.
01:09:26.000We haven't thought about that because if it is, the people in charge wouldn't be telling everyone, the AI is here, guys.
01:09:31.000They would be using it for their own sinister purposes.
01:09:33.000So I think we could be living in a situation where the AI is having more of an effect on our lives than we could even realize right now.
01:09:40.000I think you can't blow it up because it's actually, you could knock out servers, but the data itself that writes the code is decentralized.
01:09:46.000Well then it's an autonomous being and it obviously is not, you can't hand control of human society over to a non-human.
01:09:54.000Like I don't, I'm not, I'm a sub-genius and even I get that, so what are we doing?
01:09:58.000I think the code should be open so that we can see what this thing's doing at the very least, but I think of it as an inevitability like the atom bomb, like whoever gets it first is going to control the planet for 50 years.
01:11:21.000No, but listen, this is the scary thing.
01:11:23.000This is what people need to understand about the singularity event.
01:11:26.000When AI, when it actually turns on, when we reach artificial general intelligence... We might be there.
01:11:31.000And we might be there and just not know it.
01:11:33.000It's a point at which the machine itself exponentially improves itself.
01:11:39.000So if the rate of growth for the computer systems that we're building is, say, Moore's Law, it doubles every two years.
01:11:45.000Once we reach the point of AI singularity, or I guess you could call it artificial general intelligence, it's just straight to the top.
01:11:51.000Right up to the point of near infinity, where this machine is improving itself, learning faster and faster and calculating faster, and then it's beyond our comprehension.
01:12:03.000So the people who created that are evil, I mean, right?
01:12:06.000And so why are they rich and powerful?
01:12:08.000I would say it's... Well, many of them, I would argue, there is what I would refer to as the banality of evil.
01:12:14.000That it is a commonplace endeavor to get a job working for a company that's developing this and having no idea that you are starting the fire.
01:12:22.000Which could be the destruction of human individualism.
01:12:46.000That means that they're going to have their own supercomputer that can then kill their people?
01:12:49.000No, no, the Western globalists are working in China.
01:12:52.000Hold on, how are they going to develop AI that they can control?
01:12:54.000Look, I'm just as frightened about all of it as you guys are, but there are also certain applications that are clearly far worse, that I don't think China's developing, that we are, that we need to stop.
01:13:06.000So, for example, I saw somebody posting about an AI dating bot on the internet.
01:13:11.000Where men who are too scared to talk to women start talking to this thing and it's trained to tell them what they want to hear.
01:13:18.000And that is going to destroy so many lives.
01:13:21.000That should be immediately stopped from happening.
01:13:24.000If civil authorities were interested in promoting the common good, that would be banned.
01:13:30.000We actually have a big breaking story about this, and James O'Keefe, waiting on deck to come and talk to us about it, but I know that, Tucker, you want to hang out and keep talking about this.
01:14:11.000So this actually is perfect timing in this conversation, as we know that James has been putting out these videos, undercover videos, or I believe leaked videos, from IBM talking about their gender ideology commandments and mandates.
01:14:54.000Tucker was asking about the people and the companies behind the creation of these computer systems and AI, and I said, actually, James has some deep insights into what these companies do.
01:15:03.000Yeah, this, this, well you said it today, Charlie, about the Ten Commandments with Yeah, I said it on PBD's show.
01:15:34.000They're literally like that white people can't be racist, that black people can do nothing wrong, that Ali should... It's literally... It says, quote, understand only white people are racist.
01:15:43.000It is the woke... Is that an exact quote?
01:15:53.000Yeah, I mean, if you think for a second, I mean, Yuval Harari has already said that artificial intelligence is going to rewrite its own religion for Bible stories that, quote, make more sense for people.
01:16:31.000No, it's a demon, but what's so interesting is, at least, you know, in the whole management kerfuffle over there at AIHQ, the letter that got him bounced, briefly, from the helm said these people are, like, you know, dancing around the proverbial fire, worshipping this thing.
01:17:05.000Since Nimrod tried to create the city of Babel in Genesis 11, they've been trying to reconstitute a oneness of the government and a oneness of the world.
01:17:13.000They think artificial intelligence will allow it.
01:17:15.000It's a one world government that they have always been after.
01:17:27.000And now you add that to the fact that a lot of people think, especially politicians like Netanyahu that believe that we're in the end of times.
01:17:33.000And when you see his conversations that he has with Elon Musk, especially when it comes to artificial intelligence, A lot of things start to come together when it comes to the time that we are in right now that is going to be absolutely decisive for humanity.
01:17:45.000We could either be totally free or totally enslaved.
01:18:17.000Behind this AI is a singular machine, a singular entity, whether you want to believe it's some kind of conscious being, demon, whatever, it is a single entity, and each of its fake girlfriends that is talking to these young men is like a tentacle coming out of it.
01:18:32.000So these young men, they think they're being wooed by a siren towards the great seas to die, and it is a gigantic demonic beast luring them to them.
01:19:52.000You have to strive, you have to struggle, you have to fail, and pick yourself back up.
01:19:55.000But along comes the candy man who says, ignore all of that, and I can satisfy all your deepest emotions with this machine right here.
01:20:03.000And so, unfortunately, a lot of young men, they might think to themselves, you know, I will try and meet actual girls and get a real girlfriend, but, you know, I'll just use the app for now.
01:20:13.000Then eventually, they develop antisocial behaviors.
01:20:17.000Then they're 20 years old, and they have no idea how to even talk to someone.
01:20:20.000But more importantly, the great opportunities to meet someone when you're young in your neighborhood used to be church, where your families and communities would meet, public schools, I'm not a big fan of, but also a way that people would meet, and the workplace.
01:20:33.000Now young people are using these apps and they're not even communicating anymore.
01:20:38.000When we're talking about these AI girlfriends, I just view this as a tremendous evil.
01:20:44.000Understand that dead internet theory, whether anyone wants to believe it's true or not, is coming true factually before our eyes.
01:20:52.000Because we're looking at AI bots communicating with us.
01:20:55.000Of course, eventually, now Twitter is integrating Grok.
01:20:59.000At what point does Grok start actually posting things and communicating with people?
01:21:02.000And at what point does someone create a bot using a paid script from GPT or something to make Twitter accounts or X accounts to communicate with people?
01:23:55.000A foreigner who became an American, Arvind Krishna.
01:23:57.000Because he said, if you hire white people, or there's too many Asians, we'll dock your bonus and terminate you.
01:24:04.000So then he gets on an all-staff call last week, and he says, There's this video that came out of me and I said these things and he's talking to tens of thousands of people and he says, don't give this any oxygen, don't give this any response.
01:24:18.000And that was recorded and leaked and published.
01:25:06.000Yeah, it's just it's been happening like so many trends in our society in slow motion and you sort of see it and you register alarm and then like deep ominous dread and then you sort of move on to the next unfolding crisis and it doesn't feel like anyone can pause long enough to address any of them and they're just sort of moving inexorably forward almost autonomously and if you put it all together you're like, what are we watching here?
01:25:28.000We're watching like an actual pivot point in history and I don't think I'm being alarmed.
01:26:01.000They'll say we need to eliminate whiteness.
01:26:03.000You have to pay attention to them when they accuse you of things.
01:26:06.000When our buddy Michael Knoll said we need to eliminate transgenderism, they said, oh, he's not attacking the idea of transgenderism.
01:26:12.000He's promoting genocide, which of course he was not.
01:26:14.000Okay, so if they think saying we need to eliminate transgenderism means you actually want genocide, what does it mean when they say they want to eliminate whiteness?
01:26:21.000Well, they've explicitly called for it.
01:26:23.000They've celebrated the fact, I mean, the President of the United States did that.
01:26:26.000I'm looking forward to the day when there are fewer whites when they're in the minority.
01:26:32.000To call for any group to become a minority is such a sickening, unfathomable thing to do.
01:26:36.000Well, especially in a country where they told us for my entire lifetime that minorities are by definition mistreated and oppressed in this country.
01:26:43.000So by their definitions, being a minority in America is a threat to your life and they're celebrating a group becoming a minority.
01:26:52.000We're all too embarrassed to say so, but that's like genocidal language.
01:26:56.000They're not just calling for it, they're actually doing it, especially when you look at the numbers, when you look at the propaganda that's in every TV show, that's in every commercial, that's in every movie.
01:27:28.000I encourage people to find ways for them to not have children, and also to bring in many, many other people from outside the country.
01:27:34.000You are in the state where the Great Replacement is happening.
01:27:37.000Every day, there's 15,000 people that they're bringing into Arizona to replace you.
01:27:41.000They want Arizona to be less white, and as it's less white, they get more power.
01:27:46.000Here's the funny thing is, Vivek Ramaswamy says this, and the media immediately comes out and says, oh, conspiracy theories, conspiracy theories, and then what happens?
01:27:53.000Anybody who's paying attention sees the video from Joe Biden saying, we want it to happen.
01:27:57.000There's a video, I believe it was from Van Jones, saying, effectively what we are asking is for white people to accept becoming a minority.
01:28:03.000And the Castro brothers, which I think is the best example, they are on like Face the Nation in this long interview and they're like, you will be calling the electoral votes for Texas because Texas is becoming more Hispanic.
01:28:14.000And the interviewer says, well, what do you mean?
01:28:15.000And they're like, well, yeah, I mean, obviously mass migration is a benefit to the Democrat party.
01:28:20.000And Michael Anton had the most powerful piece where the way that Democrats respond to this is that it's not happening and it's good that it is.
01:29:09.000We had a father in Loudoun County, Virginia, which is only, it's literally about 30 seconds away from where we're currently at, who showed up to challenge the system, and they arrested him.
01:29:19.000I don't think the question is, why are people putting up with it?
01:29:22.000It's, right now, I think you'll find that this faction of people, whatever you want to call it, the right, I guess the media would refer to it as, are reasonable, calm, and trying to work within their means to do things procedurally and correctly.
01:29:35.000I also think a lot of people, especially white Christians, they're resisting identity politics.
01:29:40.000They don't want to go to that next step, but that's where it's heading.
01:30:01.000They're like, everyone has an identity.
01:30:04.000Everyone's a member of an identity group, except the majority, who are despised, and we're trying to make them into the minority, but you're not allowed to organize as specific as your identity.
01:30:12.000And it's like, they're not only encouraging it, they're guaranteeing its emergence.
01:30:18.000And financing it in Ukraine with our tax dollars, essentially giving it to a lot of right-wing organizations.
01:30:24.000But I want to go to James here because these are big implications.
01:30:27.000We're talking about A racist artificial intelligence that is going to have godlike power, that's going to be woke, that's going to push their own views of equity.
01:30:36.000They could do that in so many different manipulative ways.
01:30:39.000What was some of the biggest things that you saw in this latest drop and what are the implications here?
01:30:45.000Well, I think this, this Ten Commandments, I think Charlie said it.
01:30:51.000This is, this is something called Red Hat, which is a subsidiary of... And by the way, just so we're clear, they call it the Ten Commandments.
01:31:55.000Like whoever wrote that's like a moron.
01:31:56.000But- And oh my gosh, I'm so glad you said that because this is something I've been thinking about.
01:32:00.000There are really complex, difficult decisions that the wisest, most virtuous, most healthy, well-rounded person you've ever met in your entire life, that anyone you know has ever met in their entire life, would not be qualified to make, and they're being made by stupid people.
01:32:55.000Friendship means you keep each other in check.
01:32:57.000When somebody says something that you don't think is true and you genuinely care about them, you say, that actually doesn't map on to anything that I've seen in the world.
01:33:09.000Let's say your buddy's driving a car, and you're in the passenger seat, and they're about to drive off a cliff.
01:33:15.000If you decide to hop out of the car and say nothing because you don't want to question their realities, are you being a good friend?
01:33:20.000Or are you a good friend if you grab the wheel, slam the brakes, and say, dude, you almost drove off a cliff?
01:33:25.000Well, it's infantilizing, for sure, but you're treating them like children, but you're also, anyone you don't question is, by definition, the godhead.
01:34:12.000I go to New York City at the start of Occupy Wall Street.
01:34:16.000They started off with something they called the General Assembly, where everybody would sit down and they would all, you know, raise their hands to speak and then they would do twinkle fingers, they called it, if you liked, because clapping was offensive to people who couldn't hear or whatever.
01:34:29.000They had something called Progressive Stack.
01:34:31.000That meant, if you raised your hand to speak, but you're a white man, bottom of the list.
01:34:54.000One of the most shocking things I ended up seeing, which is a real wake up call for me, was when they created something called the Spokes Council.
01:34:59.000This is where they decided the General Assembly is inefficient.
01:35:02.000Let's have a better, more efficient model of decision-making by breaking everyone up into different groups based on the job you do.
01:35:07.000If you work on the website, you're part of a website group.
01:35:10.000If you work on cleaning, sanitation, you're a sanitation group.
01:35:12.000And of course, let's have a group for only black people, a group for only Asian people, a group for only Mexican people, a group for only women.
01:35:18.000And they actually decided to have political voting power on resources based on your race or sex.
01:35:24.000And then there was a moment, one day I'm walking on the side of Zuccotti Park and there was a black man sitting up on this planter and he said, these people are nuts!
01:35:32.000What do you think the press is going to say when they find out they're segregating everybody based on race to make their decisions?
01:35:38.000But they just destroyed their own movement.
01:35:40.000I mean, I was, I'll be honest, I was...
01:35:43.000I was annoyed by Occupy Wall Street but I was kind of sympathetic to the core idea that you have this massive series of financial crimes in 08 and not one person is punished and that actually the real scam is economic.
01:35:53.000They're looting the country and someone needs to call out the banks on this and finance world in general.
01:36:00.000Occupy Wall Street was totally eclipsed by identity politics which I believe was you know, the antidote, like the banks got together and the
01:36:07.000people who benefit from the banks are like, oh, let's just put them together based on race, like this
01:36:12.000is a widely held theory, but for the occupied Wall Street people themselves to be
01:36:16.000embracing identity politics undercuts their whole argument. It was subversion. It was
01:36:20.000subversion. I met Luke there and you ask yourself, everybody here knows Luke.
01:36:25.000How does someone like Luke, Luke and I come together?
01:36:27.000And it's because originally it was exactly as you described.
01:37:00.000They came in here and they're literally saying, black people got to stay here, white people
01:37:04.000We're like, this is retarded, this is stupid, this makes no sense at all, unless you're trying to subvert and destroy it from the inside.
01:37:11.000And I think that's exactly what happened, and then the corporate media said, we gotta obsess about race because this is how you destroy populist movements, and this is why we keep talking about race over and over again.
01:37:22.000When it's the simplest, stupidest thing that should've, of course, not be a major issue, we should be talking about the larger, better things, the more amazing things in life, not just the superficial bullshit that It doesn't matter.
01:37:33.000I told Steve Bannon I wish he came to occupy Wall Street and helped because that first week was so different from what it turned into.
01:37:40.000I remember meeting a couple and they were in their 60s with an American flag and they were upset about the bank balance and subversion and I think what happens is it's very easy for liberals to infiltrate in a city like New York and it's very difficult for conservatives to stand their ground in such a place.
01:37:57.000I mean, you can see that the people that run Wall Street, they love the woke stuff, like Larry Fink, because then we never talk about income inequality or wealth inequality.
01:38:06.000The woke smokescreen is a protection racket for them.
01:38:43.000By the way, they're using labor's money, Tucker, as you know.
01:38:45.000They're using teacher and firefighter and police officer money and getting 3% management fees and 30% of the upside.
01:38:52.000By the way, they don't pay any tax on any of the earnings.
01:38:55.000They just say, oh, you know, we can't get rid of the carried interest loophole.
01:38:57.000And they have this whole insane tax scheme designed And I just, I wonder what wealth are they actually creating or are they just moving trillions of dollars of money through a cheap, kind of a cheap instruments and taking, taking 3%, 4% off the top.
01:39:14.000But the woke, this is what's important.
01:39:16.000Occupy Wall Street was so scary to them because it was diverse, because it was bipartisan, is that they have, you know, Tim, do you actually think that Goldman Sachs said, go send in the identity politics people?
01:39:29.000Like, do you think that there was a meeting at Goldman Sachs where they said, go bring in the NYU trans, like, race people to go distract them from talking about bank bailouts?
01:39:45.000There were people who were on salary at large progressive non-profits who were at Occupy Wall Street.
01:39:54.000On paper, getting money from a non-profit and paychecks.
01:39:57.000And the funny thing is, when this was accurately reported, and sometimes inaccurately reported, they'd say, the people down there are getting paid by, insert non-profit, who receives money from, say, George Soros.
01:40:07.000All the activists would go, I didn't get my Soros check.
01:40:10.000And I'm like, dude, John over there works for this non-profit that is literally a progressive voter registration non-profit, and he's organizing the assemblies right now.
01:40:21.000And so perhaps it was as simple as, hey guys, here's an opportunity, we better harness it.
01:40:26.000And it bums me out to think the reality of Occupy Wall Street was progressives being smarter and faster than the populist right.
01:40:35.000And you look at the stated positions of the Open Society Foundation and George Soros, it conveniently ignores wealth inequality, income inequality, home ownership.
01:40:43.000It's like open borders and racial transformation and trans stuff.
01:40:47.000It's like, wait a second, George Soros, are you afraid that there might be a real movement to go take and tax your $20 billion foundation that doesn't pay any taxes and is being used to subvert and infiltrate the country?
01:40:59.000country but I think what has happened is especially post Floyd is that every
01:41:03.000major company is fine doing a 50 million dollar check to some CRT DEI company as
01:41:09.000long as we don't talk about the fact that young people can't buy homes. Larry
01:41:12.000Fink is terrified that this audience or just Republicans, Democrats, young people
01:41:17.000all across the country will unite and lock arms and say why is it that we
01:41:21.000can't buy homes and we're talking about you know people's pronouns. Yeah that's
01:41:29.000I just want to say this before you jump in.
01:41:31.000I firmly believe in, you know, I've changed my positions, obviously, since I first started with political commentary like 10 years ago.
01:41:37.000I used to be just a very, like, diehard, total free market guy, and I've moved on that.
01:41:42.000I believe property rights are extremely important, but part of the reason that I believe that that's true is because people who own property are a lot more difficult to control and push around, and the issue with communism and the issue with hypercapitalism, even though they
01:41:55.000express themselves very differently, and even though under communism you have many horrific
01:41:59.000instances of people being slaughtered, I don't mean to downplay any of that, but one of the same
01:42:05.000economic issues you see with both of those is that all of the property ends up centralized in
01:42:09.000the hands of a small group of people who have control over it. So of course, in a
01:42:13.000communist country, that's the party members, and in a capitalist country that doesn't have the proper
01:42:18.000regulations in place, that's the capitalist class, and your average person ends
01:42:21.000up without property. So what we need to do is structure our regulations so that the largest
01:42:24.000number of people possible can own property.
01:42:27.000I think that's the way that you have a flourishing system.
01:42:30.000If you own nothing, you're not going to be happy.
01:42:57.000Yeah, that's why they have to indict Trump, right?
01:43:00.000Because for years the media could just say this person's racist, this person's sexist, this person's homophobic, and that was enough to destroy that person's career.
01:43:07.000But it didn't destroy Trump, and so because the media no longer has the ability to shut people up, the state actually has to come in and shut people up.
01:43:13.000And you're right, it's making people angrier.
01:43:15.000The DEI stuff is not just in IBM, it's in everywhere.
01:43:19.000I'm getting the messages from all the people inside all the companies.
01:43:22.000So it feels like whatever pressure it was to adopt the DEI, now it's just the pendulum swung.
01:43:28.000I mean, how about we just talk about the hard numbers of these Disney movies and what, did they lose a billion dollars in their last releases?
01:43:35.000The latest Marvel movie was the lowest grossing out of anything that they've done so far.
01:44:08.000They just say, I'm not gonna... Look, you know what I always used to say whenever they would make these video games that were all woke or whatever?
01:44:12.000I'd say, hey, that's great, I'm really happy for you that you got your video game with the pink haired woman.
01:46:21.000Dostoevsky said, your worst sin is that you have destroyed and betrayed yourself for nothing.
01:46:28.000And when you think about that, when you look at the situation that a lot of people are in, they think they're making the right decision for themselves and their mortgages and their families right now, but in reality they're making the worst decision for their future, for their children, for this country, as of course all these little decisions, everyone saying, I'm just doing my job, that keeps adding to the initial destruction as this country is being sabotaged from within.
01:46:53.000And it's only being sabotaged with our acquiescence, with our participation in it, with us voting for it, with us clicking and liking and giving our money to these creatures that serve essentially Satan.
01:47:04.000These people don't serve you, don't care about you.
01:47:08.000You need to make sure every dollar you spend goes towards a good cause.
01:47:12.000You need to download Public Square and shop at businesses that support your values, our values.
01:47:18.000And well, that's one simple, simple way, because maybe all you're going to do is buy a, you know, I don't know, barbecue pulled pork, but you're supporting a company that believes in this country.
01:47:36.000Yeah, I want to build something that can't be cancelled.
01:47:39.000But may I say something about standing up and, you know, taking the abuse for doing that?
01:47:45.000I do think it's high stakes for a lot of people, and all my kids are grown, and I've already been through the cycle of, you know, being poor, rich, poor, you know, rich again.
01:47:54.000And so I don't find that as scary, but I do think if you've got kids in the home, it's scary.
01:47:57.000I mean, it is not a small decision to make.
01:48:00.000But I also think, here's one potential upside.
01:48:02.000If you tell the truth and stand on principle and, you know, act in a dignified way as a man, the people around you want that.
01:51:14.000And in fact, if you love God, you must hate evil.
01:51:16.000It's my mission statement in verse Psalm 9710.
01:51:19.000Those of you who love God must hate evil.
01:51:25.000How would you describe the spark, Tucker?
01:51:28.000Well, I agree with Charlie that if you don't view death as the worst thing, and I don't, by the way it's inevitable anyway, but I don't view it as the end and I don't view it as the worst thing that could happen to a person, that resets your framework for sure.
01:51:40.000But in my case, if I'm being honest, it's really the family that I grew up in.
01:51:43.000I grew up in a non-traditional, very unusual family.
01:53:10.000I don't know if there was grand formative little moments throughout my life that made me question reality and things like that, but I'm lucky that I had a good mom and a good dad.
01:53:21.000Dad was a little more conservative, mom was a little more liberal, so I got an in-between view on a lot of things and logic behind it.
01:53:28.000But more importantly, I was always taught to challenge, to question, that not everybody is always right.
01:53:35.000I wonder, I think a lot of it may come from the fact that my dad is a firefighter.
01:53:38.000And one of the most important things you learn is, when you enter a building, where are your exits?
01:53:43.000And you have to understand that sometimes, when there's an emergency, everyone will run in the wrong direction.
01:53:47.000Are you stopping to think about which door you're going through?
01:53:51.000You know, I remember seeing this video of a music venue.
01:54:35.000And I remember the way the pro-life cause was always sneered at by teachers in school
01:54:40.000or messaging that I saw in the mainstream media.
01:54:44.000Or people I knew who were on the political left.
01:54:47.000But I knew so many people whose lives my parents had literally saved, because in spite of what the left will tell you, pro-life activists, many of them do care.
01:54:57.000And when they persuade a woman to choose life, they will stay in her life.
01:55:01.000And there were people like that in my life growing up, and I got to a certain age and I realized, like, This friend of mine or this person I love is here.
01:55:09.000They are alive because my parents were brave enough to say, we love you.
01:55:16.000We don't want this life for you and we care about your child.
01:55:19.000And no matter how annoying or curmudgeony or out of place I was told it was to say, don't kill an unborn child, I thought, I would rather be the annoying out of place person who saves lives than the person who never commits a social faux pas.
01:55:39.000And I don't mean to compare myself to my parents.
01:55:41.000I have not done nearly anything close to the good work that they've done interacting with the real people in the real world and the children they've saved and the responsibility they've taken for children who weren't theirs to help them.
01:55:54.000And so, for me, it was just a recognition that the people who are telling you not to speak up when you have to are the people who are on the side of death.
01:56:03.000I'll try to keep my answer as short as possible, but I grew up in New York City on 9-11, and there was a lot of death.
01:56:09.000A lot of people who lost loved ones, a lot of people who were losing their lives because the government told them that the air was safe to breathe.
01:56:17.000I saw a lot of the people that I loved, that I cared for, die in front of me, and a lot of them When they were dying, I always had this message that they wish that they lived their life to the fullest.
01:56:28.000A lot of them had regret that their life was cut early, that their loved one's life was cut early.
01:56:34.000And ever since then, that has reinvigorated a fire in me personally, that every time I confronted a politician, whether it was Brzezinski that helped finance the Mujahedin and the Al-Qaeda that essentially became them, When I confronted David Rockefeller and Lord Jacob Rothschild, when I was looking in their eyes, I was looking at them knowing that these people are capable of the ultimate evil.
01:56:56.000They're capable of pulling something off like 9-11.
01:56:59.000So I had conviction knowing that these people were the absolute deepest, darkest, sinister evil that you could ever imagine.
01:57:07.000Looking them in the eyes, telling them off, videotaping it, made the biggest difference, inspired a lot of individuals, and showed everyone that we had the power to address these issues, to speak truth, expose these larger lies in our society, and live a life that is worth living fighting these evil scumbags.
01:57:24.000We've got only a few minutes left so I want to go around for final thoughts and shoutouts if there's anything you want to shout out.
01:57:30.000But Luke, we'll start with you and then of course we need to get Ian back out here in a moment so he can also join us.
01:57:35.000Yeah, if you want to support me, go to thebestpoliticalshow.com.
01:57:38.000I'm doing my own show and I have a lot of fun.
01:57:48.000It really means a lot just to be able to share with you guys and be able to share the stage and have these conversations, which I think are really important.
01:57:55.000So thank you, Charlie, and thank you, everyone.
01:57:58.000Final thought real quick on the state of affairs and where we're going?
01:58:18.000And as I was going through this crazy, crazy thing fired from the company I founded, which is an unthinkable, unimaginable occurrence, Charlie was there for me every day.
01:58:28.000So I just want to say... Still am, James.
01:58:29.000You're my brother and I appreciate the morning prayers.
02:00:18.000And then all media matters, everyone tried to take us out so we got a strike and so the way we get around that is if a bunch of people go to the channel subscribe and like some videos it could spike our stuff up and once we get over the strike.
02:00:48.000No, it's just that anybody who devotes his or her life to helping other people in the most unfashionable possible way, bringing unto themselves responsibilities they don't need.
02:01:00.000That's the highest form of sincerity, so that's very winning.
02:01:18.000Of course, you can follow me at TimCast.
02:01:20.000You can follow the show at TimCast IRL.
02:01:21.000I just wanted to say, Tucker, when you were still on Fox, every day after the show, Luke would run downstairs because he T-voted your show.