TRIGGERnometry - Alistair Williams on Comedy Censorship

00:00:00.000 Hello and welcome to Trigonometry. I'm Francis Foster. I'm Constantine Kitten.

00:00:09.320 And this is a show for you if you're bored with people arguing on the internet over subjects they

00:00:14.380 know nothing about. In Trigonometry, we don't pretend to be the experts, we ask the experts.

00:00:20.080 Our guest this week is a brilliant comedian and a good friend of ours, Alistair Williams.

00:00:24.020 Welcome to Trigonometry. You're laughing being described as an expert.

00:00:26.540 I'm being described as an expert. I'm like, this is going to be bad.

00:00:29.060 but i think in terms of comedy you certainly have some interesting experiences to to talk about

00:00:34.600 yeah so that's what we'll get into but before we do that for anyone who doesn't know who you are

00:00:39.020 just tell everybody who are you how are you where you are and what's been your journey through life

00:00:43.300 so far okay just a nice softball um who am i i'm alistair williams i'm a stand-up comedian

00:00:49.000 and um how am i where i am today um i just went out there to say what was funny i guess

00:00:56.440 and now I'm in all sorts of bother, it would have been.

00:00:59.640 Well, I think the thing that most people will know you for

00:01:02.080 is the fact that you made a really good video, a routine about Brexit.

00:01:06.900 Right.

00:01:07.480 And that, I think, became, it went viral and a lot of people have watched that.

00:01:11.860 And since then, your career has taken an interesting turn, which we'll get into.

00:01:18.220 But what I really like about that video is I thought, first of all,

00:01:21.780 most people who watched it wouldn't know this,

00:01:23.760 but you recorded it in central London at a very liberal comedy club

00:01:28.280 where I would estimate having played all of us,

00:01:30.820 all three of us have played it many, many times.

00:01:33.660 You know, 95% of the audience there are Remainers, I would imagine.

00:01:37.640 And you got an applause break and lots and lots of laughter

00:01:40.820 for what is just a really good comedy bit, right?

00:01:44.100 Well, what people don't know is one minute before that,

00:01:46.640 I was doing Remain jokes.

00:01:48.280 One minute before that, I was doing second referendum jokes

00:01:50.620 and the audience went with me on that.

00:01:52.240 and then it was just

00:01:53.240 I was like okay

00:01:53.860 well I'm just going to flip it

00:01:54.840 and I'm going to do the other side

00:01:56.180 and they went with me

00:01:57.200 on that as well

00:01:57.900 but that is the big problem

00:01:59.780 it's the fact that

00:02:00.840 I went against the grain

00:02:01.720 and did something on the other

00:02:02.560 that I dared to do it

00:02:03.820 and it doesn't

00:02:04.560 it hasn't made any difference

00:02:05.540 that it was funny

00:02:06.420 it doesn't make any difference

00:02:07.180 that it was popular

00:02:07.880 it's just like

00:02:08.860 that's not what comedians say

00:02:10.400 I've had people call me

00:02:11.720 and they want to talk to me

00:02:12.920 for an hour

00:02:13.340 if you realise what you've done

00:02:15.000 400 word texts

00:02:17.320 I said do you realise

00:02:18.660 I'm like

00:02:19.360 it just blew me away

00:02:21.460 to be honest

00:02:21.880 Well, before we get into that, let me ask you this in terms of the political stuff, because we've known you for a long time.

00:02:29.900 I remember when I started out in comedy, you'd already been going for quite a while.

00:02:34.220 I remember watching you kind of when I was doing my first gig, going, oh, this guy's a really good comedian.

00:02:38.000 But you never used to talk about politics in any way.

00:02:40.320 You were never political on stage.

00:02:44.080 What was it that made you think, well, I actually want to talk about this stuff?

00:02:47.620 Is that something that you suppressed before because you knew what the punishment would be?

00:02:51.060 No, I just figured out what was going on.

00:02:54.120 I was like, this lady isn't trying to get us out of the European Union.

00:02:57.700 She's pretending that she is, but she's not.

00:03:00.460 And it was too funny.

00:03:01.540 What was going on was too funny.

00:03:03.100 I couldn't not touch it.

00:03:04.420 I was so sure.

00:03:06.060 I was like, she's not trying to leave the European Union.

00:03:08.360 She's just doing the worst deal ever for like two years.

00:03:10.780 I'm like, she's not trying.

00:03:11.840 And then the idea of something simple like being in a Burger King

00:03:15.200 and trying to get out and your friend, the idea came to me.

00:03:18.180 And I was just like, in my head it was funny.

00:03:20.820 And I was just like, oh, no, I'm doing that.

00:03:22.460 And actually, when I got to Top Secret,

00:03:23.860 Nico, who's the guy who runs the show at Top Secret

00:03:27.320 on a Sunday and a Tuesday,

00:03:28.940 he was like, mate, everyone's bored of Brexit.

00:03:30.560 He was like, don't mention any Brexit stuff.

00:03:31.980 He was like, everyone's bored of it.

00:03:33.240 And I was like, yeah, but that's the point.

00:03:35.240 It's like everyone is sort of bored of it,

00:03:37.700 but they're bored because they're just being told the same thing.

00:03:40.180 They're being told this was happening, this was happening.

00:03:41.780 And they secretly know that it's not.

00:03:44.020 It's like the Dave Chappelle with the Jussie Smollett thing.

00:03:46.300 Everyone knows.

00:03:47.120 everyone's got a laugh

00:03:48.820 oh he said

00:03:49.860 what we all think

00:03:50.740 there's a laugh

00:03:52.360 to be had

00:03:52.780 just from

00:03:53.300 going against

00:03:54.660 the grain

00:03:56.140 even if it's

00:03:57.220 you know

00:03:58.140 only factual

00:03:58.840 people are just like

00:03:59.600 oh my god

00:04:00.240 he said that

00:04:01.100 absolutely

00:04:02.060 I remember the

00:04:02.820 night before you did it

00:04:04.320 the night you did it

00:04:05.360 we went for a coffee

00:04:06.120 didn't we

00:04:06.500 yeah

00:04:06.760 yeah we went for a coffee

00:04:07.960 yeah you all claimed

00:04:08.700 the assist on this one

00:04:09.800 definitely

00:04:10.200 yeah

00:04:10.580 I remember

00:04:11.120 yeah

00:04:11.560 oh well that's my

00:04:12.400 career gone as well

00:04:13.340 oh sorry

00:04:14.820 sorry

00:04:15.260 don't kill Francis

00:04:17.100 as well

00:04:17.560 was this before

00:04:18.740 or after the gig

00:04:20.220 it was before

00:04:20.880 oh so you're claiming credit

00:04:22.680 no I'm not claiming credit

00:04:23.760 I'm claiming

00:04:24.180 we started writing together

00:04:25.300 we started going

00:04:25.920 we started

00:04:26.380 deciding to come up

00:04:28.240 with ideas together

00:04:29.160 and the next day

00:04:30.500 I came up with

00:04:31.380 my favourite bit of comedy

00:04:32.280 I've ever done

00:04:32.820 so yeah

00:04:33.440 I would say that's got

00:04:34.660 lots to do with it

00:04:35.340 yeah and then you went

00:04:36.120 and did it

00:04:36.680 and then

00:04:37.060 I just thought it was

00:04:38.420 a great bit

00:04:39.020 I didn't even see

00:04:39.840 I'll be honest with you

00:04:40.600 I didn't even see it

00:04:41.720 as being a pro Brexit bit

00:04:42.940 it's not

00:04:43.260 I saw it being

00:04:44.260 as a bit

00:04:45.040 of pure

00:04:46.220 observational comedy

00:04:47.580 this is where we are

00:04:49.020 this is the ridiculousness

00:04:50.640 of the situation

00:04:51.620 and you go

00:04:52.520 that is the role

00:04:53.380 of a comedian

00:04:53.940 to observe

00:04:54.560 and present

00:04:55.400 in a comedic way

00:04:56.520 that we all laugh

00:04:57.480 and go

00:04:57.800 that's true

00:04:58.620 I think I got in trouble

00:04:59.840 because it's true

00:05:00.340 I think I got in trouble

00:05:02.080 because it's true

00:05:02.420 I think I got in trouble

00:05:03.740 because Theresa May

00:05:04.720 wasn't really trying

00:05:05.560 to do a good job

00:05:06.960 to get us out

00:05:07.720 of the European Union

00:05:08.260 I mean she'd come up

00:05:09.620 with a deal

00:05:10.000 that was worse

00:05:10.560 than remaining

00:05:12.240 and

00:05:13.860 I don't think

00:05:15.180 I don't think

00:05:15.700 And it took her two years to do that.

00:05:16.980 I don't understand how she was trying.

00:05:19.840 Do you know what I'm saying?

00:05:20.780 Yeah.

00:05:22.040 What I was asking you before this, but I'm curious about this because you were not very, in my experience, having known you for a while, you were not ever political, right?

00:05:30.580 And if I chatted to you between gigs or whatever, we just used to talk comedy and play life and stuff like that.

00:05:37.260 But it seems to me now, particularly your YouTube channel, is you've become a political commentator.

00:05:43.560 And why is that?

00:05:44.400 Well, I realize that they're going to smash me.

00:05:47.220 They're going to smash everything I've worked for.

00:05:49.560 They're going to stop me doing comedy because I want to say what I think is really going on.

00:05:57.140 And once you realize that, just everything else doesn't seem so important.

00:06:01.640 It seems like society is going off a cliff.

00:06:04.360 You know, we're all in a little rowing boat and we're going off the edge of a waterfall and I can see the edge.

00:06:09.120 And now I'm just paddling backwards.

00:06:10.880 And everyone's like, why are you doing that?

00:06:11.820 It's like, you maybe don't see the edge.

00:06:14.060 It's like if we really do live in a country where you can't just go up there

00:06:18.780 and have a laugh and say what you think without being utterly smashed,

00:06:22.720 utterly smashed, that's just not fair.

00:06:26.280 Do you know what I mean?

00:06:26.840 I want to do something about it.

00:06:28.460 And so how have you been smashed?

00:06:29.660 Just give us a couple of examples.

00:06:30.880 Well, I can't make a living through live comedy anymore.

00:06:33.700 Not enough comedy clubs will get back to my emails.

00:06:36.400 Not enough people will book me.

00:06:37.700 It's impossible for me to make a living out of live comedy anymore.

00:06:40.100 And that's what I wanted to do.

00:06:41.400 I wanted to be a live comedian.

00:06:42.680 Now I'm making YouTube videos in my bedroom, which is fine,

00:06:46.080 and I'm enjoying doing it, but that's not what I set out to be.

00:06:48.900 Like you said, I wanted to be a comedian on the stage,

00:06:51.160 but I figured out, like, oh, they're not going to let you do that.

00:06:53.620 They're not going to let you do that.

00:06:54.840 They're not going to let you do another one of those Brexit Burger Kings.

00:06:57.760 And so has it been a lot of clubs?

00:07:00.120 Has it been them saying to you, oh, we can't book you because?

00:07:03.960 I just can't make a living out of live comedy anymore.

00:07:05.960 and

00:07:06.960 you know I know that my level

00:07:11.780 is at where I should be able to

00:07:13.280 I think whatever people

00:07:15.640 think about your views

00:07:17.100 as someone who's seen your career

00:07:19.800 develop and seen your Edinburgh shows

00:07:21.700 and stuff there is no way that

00:07:23.800 someone of your calibre in comedy

00:07:25.940 shouldn't be able to make a living from comedy

00:07:27.660 that's definitely true

00:07:28.560 I actually met

00:07:31.760 somebody we were both in Edinburgh for the festival

00:07:33.780 I met somebody who said to me

00:07:35.480 yeah, I can't book Alistair anymore.

00:07:36.980 Yes.

00:07:37.500 And I was like, why not?

00:07:38.880 And is it the Brexit thing?

00:07:41.060 And they went, no, it's not the Brexit thing.

00:07:43.360 But I watched some of his videos and his thing about pride,

00:07:47.980 they said I thought was homophobic.

00:07:50.400 Right.

00:07:50.740 Therefore, I'm not.

00:07:51.900 I don't feel comfortable.

00:07:53.200 Did they mention specifically what I said that was homophobic?

00:07:55.340 No, no.

00:07:55.600 I'd love to hear that.

00:07:57.020 I've seen the same video.

00:07:58.040 I didn't think it was homophobic.

00:07:58.880 Because I always get this.

00:07:59.880 I get people say, oh, Alistair, people doesn't like you.

00:08:02.400 I say, what did I say?

00:08:03.620 And they go, oh, da-da-da-da.

00:08:05.040 that. But I'm like, well, no, no, no, that's the really important thing here. If someone's got a

00:08:08.900 problem with something I said, I'm desperate to have a conversation with someone about something

00:08:11.700 I said, and I never have one because I didn't say anything wrong. All the people after the Brexit

00:08:16.360 thing, they were like, Alice, you've gone nuts. I'm like, what did I say? They go, no, no, no,

00:08:19.640 listen, you've gone crazy. It's like, well, I need to know specifically what I said because I think

00:08:24.600 I haven't said anything wrong. And until someone comes to me and says, no, you said this wrong,

00:08:28.360 then I can't have that conversation because I don't feel like I've said anything wrong.

00:08:33.120 And the interesting thing about the pride thing, it's like we live in a country now where you've got,

00:08:38.200 I watched a video the other day of a lady in a hijab yelling at some gay people saying you should be ashamed of yourself.

00:08:44.440 It's like, hey, all you lefties, you've got to pick a side now.

00:08:47.000 Okay?

00:08:47.340 You can't have both of them.

00:08:48.540 You can't be on both of those sides.

00:08:50.300 It's impossible.

00:08:51.540 So whichever side you pick in that, in the new society we live in, you've got a choice now, lefties.

00:08:57.080 You can be Islamophobic or you can be homophobic.

00:08:59.880 You go pick.

00:09:00.600 And if someone says, well, that's a homophobe, well, maybe I must have picked the homophobe in your eyes.

00:09:04.920 But we live in a society now where you've got to pick.

00:09:08.260 You've got to pick.

00:09:09.060 Personally, I think we should just go for both.

00:09:10.660 Right.

00:09:12.620 And that's the Russian approach, mate.

00:09:15.140 That's the Russian approach, mate.

00:09:17.320 But no, but just on that, if you want to talk about that, if you want to talk about what's happening in Birmingham and the schools and the protests, you're going to take some risks there.

00:09:23.700 You're walking on a tightrope if you're going to talk about those two issues.

00:09:26.460 That's like a clash of the titans.

00:09:28.120 Someone's got to win.

00:09:28.820 Someone's got to lose.

00:09:29.380 So if you're going to talk about it, it's almost just like if you want to talk about the issues that are really going on,

00:09:33.860 you have to risk people calling you a racist, sexist, homophobe.

00:09:37.020 But on the positive side, they say that about everyone that they don't like.

00:09:39.940 Well, I'm a Nazi.

00:09:40.660 Right, there you go.

00:09:42.340 Jewish Nazi, best time.

00:09:44.780 Yeah, you know, he's racist, but he's also great with the books.

00:09:52.460 So you were talking about that.

00:09:54.300 Did you know that you were going to get this backlash from that Brexit joke?

00:09:59.780 I didn't know, but to be honest, I did put some text in the,

00:10:04.120 you know those little words that I put down,

00:10:05.700 but I deserved some sort of backlash for that, okay?

00:10:08.100 So I'm not an idiot.

00:10:09.620 I've realised that by calling out, like,

00:10:13.540 I think I put in there something like,

00:10:14.800 this guy will never work again.

00:10:16.740 Oh, guess what?

00:10:18.420 Guess what?

00:10:19.340 What am I?

00:10:20.300 Like, you know, a clairvoyant?

00:10:22.700 How did I know that?

00:10:23.520 I knew that.

00:10:24.120 I knew by doing that, oh, this is it now.

00:10:27.600 But it's like a choice.

00:10:31.260 You can either say what you really want to say

00:10:33.580 and then you'll never have access to all these things

00:10:35.840 or you can have access to all those things

00:10:37.540 and you can say what they agree you can say.

00:10:42.100 There's a choice.

00:10:43.500 And if you want to be a real comic, there's no choice there.

00:10:45.660 You've got to go that way.

00:10:46.920 Like Dave Chappelle.

00:10:47.920 Everyone's like, oh, it's so great that Dave Chappelle's like,

00:10:49.880 they're trying to cancel Dave Chappelle.

00:10:51.860 What do you think they're doing to me?

00:10:53.980 They're trying to cancel David Chappelle.

00:10:55.760 Oh no, leave Alistair Williams alone.

00:10:59.160 And I remember because you did that set and it was great.

00:11:06.360 And it was very interesting, the people who didn't retweet it.

00:11:09.560 Right, which is everyone.

00:11:10.820 Yeah.

00:11:11.420 More or less.

00:11:12.040 Yeah.

00:11:13.000 See, I get offended every time you say that.

00:11:14.740 No, right.

00:11:15.220 I was fucking retweeting.

00:11:16.140 Yeah, I retweeted it as well.

00:11:17.740 But you guys are real comedians.

00:11:19.280 Yeah.

00:11:19.760 You're still becoming comedians.

00:11:21.680 You're still out there working.

00:11:22.540 and I'm talking about

00:11:23.380 you know the people

00:11:24.100 that have already made it

00:11:24.980 and they've got this huge following

00:11:25.920 and it's sort of their responsibility

00:11:27.660 to help young comedians

00:11:28.900 I'm like hey guys

00:11:30.040 I'm being murdered

00:11:30.560 for being a comedian

00:11:31.060 I'm a lefty

00:11:32.940 awesome

00:11:33.320 cool

00:11:33.880 and then you went

00:11:35.640 and spoke at the Brexit party rally

00:11:37.540 do you know why?

00:11:39.380 tell us

00:11:39.800 I'm going to write a bit of comedy

00:11:41.640 about Brexit

00:11:42.120 I'm going to tell people

00:11:42.800 what's really going on

00:11:43.540 and I'm going to wait

00:11:44.080 and see who calls me

00:11:44.940 maybe Comedy Central will call me

00:11:46.920 maybe Channel 4

00:11:47.660 maybe BBC

00:11:48.260 the only people that called me

00:11:49.840 was the Brexit party

00:11:51.920 they said

00:11:52.500 come and do your comedy for our people.

00:11:53.960 I said, sure, of course.

00:11:56.240 I'm a comedian, I want a gig.

00:11:58.120 And also, I believe in the Brexit party.

00:12:01.480 I think it would be great for us to leave the European Union.

00:12:03.680 There, I said it, strike me down, right?

00:12:06.120 And it's like, you've got a choice.

00:12:07.740 If you want to fight for Brexit, you can join UKIP

00:12:10.320 or you can join the Brexit party, realistically.

00:12:13.360 Right, well, guess what they're going to say?

00:12:14.580 If you're going for Brexit, they're going to say you're Nigel Farage.

00:12:16.720 If you go UKIP, they're going to say Tommy Robinson.

00:12:18.800 So, again, you've got a choice.

00:12:20.460 Everything you know, you've got a choice.

00:12:21.660 You want to sport fight for breakfast?

00:12:23.040 You can be Nigel Farage or Tommy Robinson.

00:12:24.680 And every time they talk about you, they'll go,

00:12:27.080 well, let's tell you you were standing next to Nigel Farage.

00:12:29.680 I'll be honest, I didn't see Nigel Farage seemed like a nice man when I met him.

00:12:34.020 I mean, I'm used to people telling everyone how terrible I am before they meet me.

00:12:37.580 So now when someone says, oh, that person's terrible,

00:12:39.460 I go, I'm going to wait until I meet him

00:12:40.580 because I'm sure everyone's telling everyone else how terrible I am.

00:12:43.320 And I found nothing wrong with Nigel Farage.

00:12:46.120 It's so funny that you say that because when my thing happened with SOAS,

00:12:49.100 that contract oh yeah that was the number one takeaway for me from that whole experience

00:12:53.940 which was to go never ever ever believe what people say about somebody in the newspapers

00:13:00.300 just from my own experience and it's not just it's not just bad stuff it's also good stuff people

00:13:05.820 once you become in any way a public figure your reputation becomes a thing of its own it's not

00:13:12.260 actually who you are it's just this conglomeration of ideas about who you are that other people have

00:13:17.840 imposed on you

00:13:18.560 I can understand

00:13:20.700 I mean

00:13:21.080 when you say it like that

00:13:22.060 it makes perfect sense

00:13:22.880 I'm guessing

00:13:23.600 if the Labour Party

00:13:24.480 had invited you

00:13:25.300 to do a gig there

00:13:26.860 you probably would have

00:13:27.680 done it as well

00:13:28.880 I'm not sure

00:13:29.700 I'm not sure

00:13:31.840 because

00:13:32.160 there we go

00:13:33.060 the hypocrisy

00:13:33.760 has been exposed

00:13:34.560 I know what it's like now

00:13:36.140 when you go and do

00:13:36.980 and if I was a bit naive

00:13:38.000 when I said yes

00:13:38.760 to the Brexit bar

00:13:39.280 I know what it's like

00:13:39.800 what they have you do

00:13:40.400 is you perform your set

00:13:41.600 and then you sit down

00:13:42.560 on the stage

00:13:43.700 and then when everyone else

00:13:45.140 gets up to speak

00:13:45.860 they'll stand right next to you

00:13:47.020 and they'll take photos

00:13:47.820 of you clapping and it's like when you agree to go up there i didn't realize this before i did it

00:13:52.900 you're agreeing to all the politics that's on stage so you have to be more careful now i mean

00:13:58.220 i've recently be asked to i've been asked to do another one and i actually was a bit more sensible

00:14:02.240 about it i said like no no i don't want to just dive into you and be a speaker at your conference

00:14:06.120 i said but how about i come and meet you guys and find out what you stand for and then maybe i'll be

00:14:10.480 a speaker at your conference i think that's a smart thing to do if you're if you're going to do

00:14:14.180 a political event, you need to be sure that you're in line with everything the political

00:14:18.360 party stands for. But I was fine doing that with the Brexit party because I think we've

00:14:22.340 reached a point where it's like, we need Brexit to save the

00:14:26.340 country, I believe. So if there's a party that stands for Brexit

00:14:30.420 number one, and I haven't seen anything else out of the Brexit party apart from We Want Brexit.

00:14:34.740 I haven't seen them say anything bad. I haven't seen them say anything that I would

00:14:38.400 go, ooh, I don't agree with that. All I've seen them say is, we want out of the European Union.

00:14:42.360 and I'm fine to sign myself up to

00:14:45.240 yeah that's what I believe in too

00:14:46.500 you know

00:14:47.500 and how

00:14:48.780 I can't believe I'm asking this question

00:14:51.860 oh I'm excited

00:14:52.460 so what was the feedback like

00:14:54.920 when you stood on stage with Nigel Farage

00:14:56.960 at the Brexit party

00:14:58.000 instant

00:14:58.400 instant

00:14:59.580 I got my Twitter mentions

00:15:00.720 everyone goes

00:15:01.100 Alistair's a racist

00:15:01.880 look at the racist

00:15:02.800 racist racist racist

00:15:03.940 you know

00:15:05.200 people that I used to be friends with

00:15:06.940 taking photos

00:15:07.520 getting screen grabs of me

00:15:09.000 with Nigel Farage

00:15:09.740 and sending it around on Twitter

00:15:10.680 saying Alistair's a racist

00:15:11.800 and far right

00:15:12.680 and this and that

00:15:13.300 just overnight

00:15:14.400 before you was alright

00:15:16.880 and you was decent

00:15:17.520 and they might say hello to you

00:15:18.560 now you're a racist

00:15:19.360 and these people know

00:15:20.420 that you're not racist

00:15:21.100 they know you're not racist

00:15:22.860 they don't care

00:15:24.020 you're on the other side now

00:15:25.680 it's time for your reputation

00:15:27.740 to be destroyed

00:15:28.420 I also found that

00:15:30.380 with my contract as well

00:15:32.460 you instantly find out

00:15:33.520 who your friends are

00:15:34.140 and you find out very quickly

00:15:35.500 it's a lot fewer people

00:15:36.460 than you thought

00:15:37.140 a lot fewer people

00:15:38.580 than you thought

00:15:39.100 well it depends

00:15:39.420 on what side you're on

00:15:40.100 Louis CK has this great bit on it

00:15:43.300 where on his comeback he goes

00:15:45.240 and the people who you want to be your friends

00:15:46.940 they're not your friends

00:15:47.900 it's always the people supporting you

00:15:49.960 you're like you're my friend

00:15:50.940 oh for fuck's sake

00:15:52.280 you're on my side

00:15:55.040 oh come on

00:15:55.800 I really appreciate Francis lumping us in with Louis CK

00:15:58.460 let's put that picture in people's heads

00:16:01.200 thanks Francis

00:16:01.920 Alistair Louis CK Constantine

00:16:04.240 that's what you want

00:16:04.820 yeah yeah no thanks

00:16:05.360 but I did say this at the time

00:16:09.960 irrespective of what people's views are about Brexit or you or whatever,

00:16:15.560 some of the bullying that went on, and it was bullying.

00:16:18.560 The people saying they kicked you off a podcast, all the shit.

00:16:22.100 It was just, it was disgusting.

00:16:23.960 I don't think it's bullying.

00:16:25.220 I don't think it's bullying.

00:16:26.100 It's like everyone's got a right to run their own.

00:16:29.360 Like people always say, it's a private platform, it's a private platform.

00:16:31.980 I don't own any comedy clubs.

00:16:33.660 If they don't want to let me in their comedy clubs, that's cool.

00:16:35.760 And people say, why don't you call them and why don't you blah, blah, blah.

00:16:38.940 It's like, no, I don't want to.

00:16:41.580 I don't want to be like, oh, please, sir, let me.

00:16:43.400 No, if you don't want to book me, you've seen the work that I do.

00:16:47.480 You've seen the response that I get from an audience.

00:16:49.260 If you don't want to book me, okay, you must have other people that can do what I can do.

00:16:54.080 Fine.

00:16:54.660 Okay, get them in.

00:16:55.940 Get them in.

00:16:56.580 But people are slowly starting to figure out, like, wait a minute, something's going on here in entertainment.

00:17:02.600 Things are getting worse, aren't they?

00:17:04.360 A blanket across the board.

00:17:05.880 It's because the soul is being crushed out of everything.

00:17:08.940 and it's obvious

00:17:09.920 who's doing the crushing

00:17:10.720 it's the people saying

00:17:11.640 you can't say this

00:17:12.280 you can't do that

00:17:12.860 you can't joke about this

00:17:13.720 you can't do that

00:17:14.280 and all the while

00:17:14.980 entertainment's getting worse

00:17:15.880 and everyone's going

00:17:16.260 I wonder why

00:17:16.820 and why do you think

00:17:18.160 they do that

00:17:19.120 why do you think

00:17:19.840 they say you can't joke

00:17:20.720 about this

00:17:21.160 or you can't joke

00:17:21.840 about that

00:17:22.340 or the rest of it

00:17:23.220 I just think it's

00:17:24.060 comedy is British

00:17:25.720 we've always been funny

00:17:27.480 we've always had a laugh

00:17:29.080 there's something

00:17:29.500 quintessentially British

00:17:30.900 about comedy

00:17:31.520 well everything that's British

00:17:33.420 is being flattened

00:17:35.160 everything that's British

00:17:36.760 is being flattened

00:17:37.300 and comedy is just

00:17:37.880 one of those things

00:17:38.640 like

00:17:39.820 the flag

00:17:41.520 you can't love

00:17:42.400 the

00:17:42.620 cross of St. George

00:17:44.160 that makes you a racist

00:17:44.840 right

00:17:45.120 you can't want to be

00:17:46.380 independent from your opinion

00:17:47.600 that makes you a racist

00:17:48.420 like

00:17:48.760 everything

00:17:49.760 I think has just been

00:17:51.820 everything that's British

00:17:52.860 has been attacked

00:17:53.480 and comedy is one of those things

00:17:54.680 and what do you think that is

00:17:56.700 what do you think

00:17:57.500 I think politics is moving

00:17:58.880 further to the left

00:17:59.600 I think we'd all agree

00:18:00.900 that politics is moving

00:18:01.600 further to the left

00:18:02.080 if politics keeps moving

00:18:03.420 to the left

00:18:03.880 at some point

00:18:04.940 comedy dies

00:18:06.200 like go to North Korea

00:18:07.520 and open a comedy club

00:18:08.360 let me know how that goes.

00:18:10.180 You know, you can't.

00:18:11.380 See, I don't know whether politics has gone to left.

00:18:13.480 Actually, I think...

00:18:14.400 Culture.

00:18:15.140 Culture.

00:18:15.660 Yeah, that's what I meant, sorry.

00:18:16.900 That's what I was going to say, yeah.

00:18:17.580 Culture has gone massively to left.

00:18:19.640 This is what I was going to ask you.

00:18:21.020 There's a few of us now, you know, Andrew Doyle, Titania, myself,

00:18:26.100 Jeff, Francis, Leo, Kers, Jeff Norcott.

00:18:30.100 When I said Jeff, Jeff Norcott.

00:18:31.320 There's a few of us who are, Dominic Frisbee as well,

00:18:34.980 we are kind of anti-woke.

00:18:36.900 Right.

00:18:36.960 Not all of us. I'm certainly not right wing. I'm not conservative. I'm somewhere in the center. There's some old school lefties like Andrew Doyle. There's some right leaning people like Jeff Norcott. Where are you on that kind of spectrum? Are you just someone who hates all this woke shit? Or do you have a political kind of more broader view about where you are on the spectrum?

00:18:57.080 I would say I was a liberal, if you ask me.

00:18:59.880 I just believe that everyone's independent.

00:19:02.780 Some people are good.

00:19:03.520 Some people are bad.

00:19:04.740 And it's up to you.

00:19:05.580 You get to decide.

00:19:06.420 That's it.

00:19:07.320 Right.

00:19:08.120 But in terms of like, I think it goes further.

00:19:13.340 It's gone further now than the political spectrum.

00:19:16.160 You know, if you left, you right, you this, you that.

00:19:19.020 It's just like, with things like comedy.

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00:19:48.580 That's R-A-K-U-T-E-N dot C-A.

00:19:54.560 It's as simple as people are supposed to be allowed to say what they think.

00:19:58.160 They're supposed to be allowed to do that.

00:19:59.560 And if we're not allowed to do that anymore, can we at least be open about that?

00:20:03.160 I feel like it's being sort of silently pushed down and no one's really saying anything about it.

00:20:09.460 And when I say I can't really do comedy anymore, people's reaction is usually,

00:20:13.060 oh, that can't be true, you must be making it up, blah, blah.

00:20:17.300 I'm not even out here saying I want to be on this, I want to be on the TV.

00:20:20.060 I don't care about my own career in entertainment.

00:20:25.080 I think if you do still care about your career in entertainment,

00:20:27.580 are you not seeing what's going on?

00:20:29.340 Are you not paying attention?

00:20:30.900 There's something way bigger going on.

00:20:32.920 I think people need to be honest about what's happening

00:20:36.000 in terms of freedom of speech that we're supposed to have.

00:20:41.860 Comedians would be the first people to feel it, right?

00:20:44.680 And you'll get an email saying,

00:20:45.920 sign this contract before you make people laugh.

00:20:48.180 I mean, how many more red flags do these people want?

00:20:52.060 It's funny because I think there's also a backlash happening.

00:20:55.240 So all the people I listed and yourself, we all had a great Edinburgh pretty much.

00:20:59.860 We sold tickets.

00:21:00.980 People came to see our shows.

00:21:02.600 We got the political reviews that you'd expect.

00:21:04.940 So The Guardian and some idiots slammed me.

00:21:07.340 But other publications really liked it.

00:21:10.120 And I guess we're in this kind of culture war.

00:21:13.140 And all of us have ended up on one side of it.

00:21:16.460 And I think that's why I guess that's what you're talking about is it feels like a lot of the people who control certainly the TV comedy and perhaps quite a lot of live comedy as well.

00:21:25.520 They lean very much to one side and the Internet and the Internet and Google and YouTube and Facebook and Twitter.

00:21:32.480 So it's quite all encompassing. Yeah. The forces that are trying to hold it down.

00:21:40.020 It's like, it's insane.

00:21:42.220 Like, the Burger King Brexit video was, it must have been,

00:21:46.700 it was retweeted in my mentions for six, seven days, two weeks.

00:21:51.840 It wasn't going to trend on Twitter.

00:21:53.460 It would not trend anywhere on Twitter.

00:21:56.140 It's like, but if you came up with a Remain,

00:21:58.380 oh, it would be number one, hottest thing ever.

00:22:01.060 Like, the playing field isn't even anywhere.

00:22:04.020 it and and i feel like um people like you and people like jeff are the people that are winning

00:22:10.800 that people want the playing field isn't even and people are still choosing um our side if you like

00:22:18.320 i don't i was a side of just having a laugh you put it that way

00:22:20.960 that's so much side i feel i'm on yeah the side of joy that is so weird now isn't it that like

00:22:28.360 just believing in the fundamental principle of western civilization which is free speech

00:22:33.360 that's like a side now.

00:22:34.660 Yeah.

00:22:35.100 And I always say that's supposed to be the side that we're all on.

00:22:38.500 Yeah.

00:22:39.140 Because that's what this society is about.

00:22:42.060 That's why we're having a good time.

00:22:43.400 Yeah.

00:22:44.440 Get a list of the countries that don't have free speech.

00:22:46.700 Go through it and plan your holidays.

00:22:48.960 Go see which one of those you want to go for two weeks.

00:22:52.180 You won't.

00:22:53.120 Yeah.

00:22:53.720 You won't.

00:22:54.320 We've got to keep hold of it.

00:22:55.620 Super important.

00:22:56.940 Do you think things are getting worse, Alistair?

00:23:00.640 Well, no, for the reasons Constantine said.

00:23:03.740 Yes and no.

00:23:05.000 Yes and no.

00:23:05.840 We're being,

00:23:06.400 I think we're being cracked down on slightly harder.

00:23:08.860 But like you say,

00:23:09.680 I think there's a massive will of people

00:23:11.700 that they don't want anymore.

00:23:13.600 No one's stupid.

00:23:14.540 No one wants more control

00:23:15.740 over what they say and what they think now.

00:23:18.160 No one's out there going,

00:23:19.000 no, it's not like 1984 at all.

00:23:20.500 No, no, not at all.

00:23:21.320 I don't know what you're talking about.

00:23:22.200 No one's saying that.

00:23:23.420 Except in Brighton, man.

00:23:25.500 I did a preview in Brighton.

00:23:27.120 Oh, mate, I did a preview of my show in Brighton.

00:23:29.700 I did a preview of my show in Brighton.

00:23:31.320 And at that point, I used to ask people, do you feel more scared to say what you think now than you did 10 years ago?

00:23:37.540 And every other preview of my show I did anywhere else in the country, it was like, yeah, definitely.

00:23:43.220 In Brighton, they all looked at me and went, no, as if to go like, I'm not racist.

00:23:47.900 I'm not.

00:23:48.320 Oh, wow.

00:23:49.380 So there is about probably.

00:23:51.560 So the stats are there's some research on this.

00:23:54.120 About 76 percent of people feel that political correctness has gone too far.

00:23:58.220 Right.

00:23:58.440 So there is a 24% of people who are like, no, no, we need more of this.

00:24:02.840 Do you know what I'd love to see?

00:24:04.340 That Venn diagram with those people and vegans.

00:24:08.680 Just a circle, mate.

00:24:09.840 Yeah, it's just a circle.

00:24:11.660 Absolutely.

00:24:12.460 Yeah, no one's going, right, we need a laugh, bring the vegans in.

00:24:15.200 I'd just like to apologize to our vegan subscribers and viewers at this point.

00:24:19.320 We do actually have some people who go like, can you please stop making fun of vegans?

00:24:22.680 We actually watch your show and like it.

00:24:24.320 We just don't want to kill animals, that's all.

00:24:26.280 We just don't like brutality against another species.

00:24:29.660 It's nothing to do with our political views.

00:24:31.940 Yeah, we need more of those people.

00:24:33.100 Yeah, right-wing vegans.

00:24:35.620 That's an Edinburgh show.

00:24:36.880 Someone's writing that right now.

00:24:38.380 Right-wing vegan.

00:24:39.860 Killed a balloon today.

00:24:41.780 But yeah, I think you're absolutely right in that the vast majority of people are fed up with this shit.

00:24:46.860 And there's no question about that.

00:24:48.880 And I think maybe in a way the reality is that, you know, whenever I talk to people about this,

00:24:53.740 I'm like, well, if you want to be the countercultural comedian who challenges the mainstream narrative, by definition, you're going to take a beating.

00:25:02.980 You've taken a beating.

00:25:04.120 I've taken a beating.

00:25:04.980 Francis has taken it.

00:25:05.960 All of us who are challenging the mainstream narrative are getting the lumps kicked out of us because we're doing what comedians are supposed to do.

00:25:14.260 and I guess in a way

00:25:15.900 you hope then

00:25:16.660 that the rewards for that

00:25:18.040 that come with that

00:25:19.660 which is you're saying

00:25:20.680 what a lot of people

00:25:21.440 are thinking

00:25:21.820 but are afraid to say

00:25:22.660 will also come

00:25:23.640 and you've had

00:25:24.340 I would say

00:25:25.860 a tremendous amount of success

00:25:27.480 with your YouTube channel

00:25:28.380 thanks

00:25:28.960 doing that

00:25:29.560 yeah

00:25:30.000 do you feel that way

00:25:30.720 you happy with how it's going

00:25:31.720 yeah I love

00:25:32.420 I love making videos now

00:25:34.760 don't get me wrong

00:25:35.660 I'm not sad about

00:25:36.760 the way things have turned out

00:25:37.720 I'm really enjoying it

00:25:40.160 it's actually

00:25:40.580 I'm enjoying it more

00:25:42.100 than doing

00:25:42.760 it seems like you can do more

00:25:43.940 you know like if you're doing comedy how many people are in the comedy club like a couple of

00:25:47.640 hundred well it's going to take a long time to change the way people think or to have any sort

00:25:52.820 of effects that way right what you need to be effective then is for someone to film what you're

00:25:57.600 doing put it on tv get get it in front of loads of people well you could do all of those things

00:26:02.140 yourself so if you are a comedian sitting there going oh no one's helping me it's like what what

00:26:07.960 what do you need that you can't do yourself you can as long as you can find an audience somewhere

00:26:13.160 and I'm assuming you can get a camera and you've got the internet,

00:26:16.360 well, then you've got everything you need.

00:26:18.660 So I think the days of comedians saying,

00:26:21.580 oh, I don't have a career because no one let me have one.

00:26:23.680 It's like you can get one yourself.

00:26:25.880 You just have to go and do it.

00:26:28.260 And like you say, yeah, if you want to go the way,

00:26:30.200 if you want to go the unestablishment way, it's going to be harder.

00:26:33.320 But it's also quite hard to go on Channel 4 or the BBC

00:26:36.360 and write a programme that's funny if you think about it.

00:26:39.700 You're going to be on the tram lines, right?

00:26:41.480 Think of a new way to say that Trump's a racist, go on.

00:26:44.460 Yeah.

00:26:44.880 It's all been done, isn't it?

00:26:46.100 Yeah.

00:26:46.560 No, it's completely all been done.

00:26:48.420 And what I find always really, really interesting is how we saw a lot of people

00:26:53.560 and a lot of comedians look up to Bill Burr or they look up to Chappelle

00:26:57.180 or, you know, Colin and all these people.

00:26:59.340 But the moment somebody in the British establishment goes,

00:27:03.940 oh, I don't agree with this, I don't agree with that,

00:27:05.680 that's a moment they all come down on them like a ton of bricks.

00:27:07.880 Right.

00:27:08.420 That does make me laugh.

00:27:09.760 Yeah.

00:27:09.940 When comedians in this country are like, oh, Chappelle's so amazing.

00:27:12.840 It's like, if you wrote any of those jokes in this country,

00:27:15.860 you would never work again, and you all know it.

00:27:18.780 Oh, absolutely.

00:27:19.360 You all know it.

00:27:20.000 We all know it.

00:27:20.500 Oh, Chappelle, you wouldn't dare.

00:27:23.820 Yeah.

00:27:24.080 You won't even stand up for someone that tries to go in that direction

00:27:27.200 and gets crushed.

00:27:28.300 So it's all very well applauding people making real jokes.

00:27:31.480 We're not allowed to make real jokes,

00:27:33.660 and no one's going to do anything about it.

00:27:35.700 I think the thing that's something that beautifully was that tweet

00:27:38.320 which showed the Hannah Gadsby, you know, the Rotten Tomatoes rating from the critic

00:27:45.860 and then the audience matched it with a chapelle.

00:27:50.380 In fact, Anton, if we can put it up on the screen, that would be great.

00:27:55.200 That was so funny.

00:27:57.260 And it's just like, it's almost like the people who think that they set,

00:28:02.360 you know, the tastemakers, if you will,

00:28:04.760 are completely disconnected from what the real public want.

00:28:07.940 it's the opposite

00:28:08.540 it's like upside down world

00:28:09.940 it's like weird

00:28:10.440 the best type of comedy

00:28:11.580 is ones with no jokes

00:28:12.800 that are serious

00:28:13.880 that are about

00:28:14.840 the worst stuff in the world

00:28:15.760 it's like

00:28:16.060 you've got all of that wrong

00:28:17.900 obviously

00:28:19.060 like people

00:28:20.080 people want comedians

00:28:21.060 that love to do comedy

00:28:22.080 Hannah Gadsby's like

00:28:23.180 I'm quitting comedy

00:28:23.820 it's terrible

00:28:24.440 it shouldn't be allowed to happen

00:28:25.660 best comedy show

00:28:27.000 comes back next year

00:28:28.880 with another show by the way

00:28:29.740 right is it

00:28:30.300 yeah she

00:28:30.820 well she did another show

00:28:31.780 the next year

00:28:32.260 she quit comedy so hard

00:28:33.720 she came back with another show

00:28:35.020 she fell right through

00:28:36.520 the floor of comedy

00:28:37.500 bounce back

00:28:38.400 yeah

00:28:38.680 through the Australia

00:28:39.900 and somehow she's back

00:28:41.180 doing another show

00:28:41.960 it's almost like

00:28:42.700 she didn't mean

00:28:43.720 to quit comedy

00:28:44.260 you know what I like

00:28:45.620 about that

00:28:46.060 in her defence

00:28:46.980 so she said

00:28:48.040 I'm quitting comedy

00:28:48.740 she got this show

00:28:49.540 she made loads of money

00:28:50.540 so you tell your boss

00:28:51.300 you know what

00:28:51.560 I'm fucking quitting

00:28:52.200 oh here's your pay rise

00:28:53.300 anyway see you on Monday

00:28:54.960 oh well good for her

00:28:57.500 hello guys

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00:29:37.720 i've got the recipe so you can actually just learn how to cook better stuff and different stuff it

00:29:41.900 was great do you reckon they could help me they're not miracle workers mate all right chill out have

00:29:46.100 you noticed there's no fucking russian dishes on there are there there you go venezuela neither

00:29:50.460 to be honest but just an empty plate yeah yeah with somebody saying how socialism is brilliant

00:29:56.160 yeah anyway hello fresh are offering trigonometry fans 60 pounds of four boxes i really recommend

00:30:04.520 head over to hellofresh.co.uk enter our special code which is of course trigonometry and start

00:30:10.860 to enjoy delicious meals made from scratch by you your youtube channel is going very well

00:30:17.960 uh you're doing great you're putting some interesting content out um you what's happening

00:30:23.500 with YouTube? Are you at the point

00:30:25.540 where now you're starting to make some money from it?

00:30:27.820 Is that going to help you make a living now

00:30:29.340 going forward? Is that something you can live off?

00:30:32.820 I'm not sure

00:30:33.660 that the subscribe star

00:30:35.420 helps more than YouTube, to be honest. Pretty much all my videos

00:30:37.500 are demonetised. Welcome to the club, brother.

00:30:39.560 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

00:30:41.220 It's almost like they don't want us talking about

00:30:43.480 this stuff, isn't it?

00:30:45.100 To be fair, our last video was about ISIS.

00:30:47.420 Yeah. I'm not sure that makes for good advertising.

00:30:49.620 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what it is.

00:30:51.680 It could be the swearing.

00:30:52.740 Do they not like swearing?

00:30:53.600 They love swearing.

00:30:54.400 This is the thing.

00:30:55.200 I was driving in because I'm a big fan of rap, right?

00:30:57.340 And I was driving in today to do this interview.

00:30:59.300 And I'm watching, I'm listening to this YouTube stuff that my wife is putting on for me because I'm asking her to do it.

00:31:04.660 And it's all like gangster rap.

00:31:06.280 It's like kill him, do this.

00:31:08.420 The N words getting dropped every two seconds.

00:31:12.060 And then suddenly an advert pops up.

00:31:13.520 And I'm like, what?

00:31:15.740 So when we talk to Andy Ngo about being beaten up by Antifa,

00:31:20.400 that is not suitable for advertising.

00:31:22.640 But talking about killing people to make money off drugs,

00:31:25.940 oh, that's fine.

00:31:27.240 Let's advertise that.

00:31:28.260 Of course.

00:31:28.840 Let's send that to 15-year-olds around the world.

00:31:31.040 To be fair, they do make it insanely catchy.

00:31:33.860 Well, they would, wouldn't they?

00:31:35.640 They would, but you'd make a good point.

00:31:37.560 Where is all that?

00:31:39.140 If 10, 15 years ago, if I asked you for people that wrote love songs,

00:31:42.440 you'd give me 60 names.

00:31:44.200 Lionel Richie, Boyz II Met.

00:31:45.560 You'd reel them off.

00:31:46.700 Give me four now.

00:31:48.780 Give me five.

00:31:49.540 Give me two.

00:31:50.380 Like Adele, Ed Sheeran, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:31:53.380 Right?

00:31:53.580 We've taken away that whole genre and we've replaced it.

00:31:56.800 Most music sounds the same now.

00:31:58.480 It's exactly the same sort of, I've got loads of stuff.

00:32:01.480 I've got loads of things.

00:32:02.440 Right?

00:32:03.980 How many times do we have to listen to that song before we get bored of that song?

00:32:07.680 Do you know there's a machine now that can tell whether a song is going to be a hit?

00:32:11.860 Right.

00:32:12.300 It just analyzes the rhythm of it and that's it.

00:32:14.760 that's all there is

00:32:15.700 we were talking yesterday

00:32:16.680 about I played some of

00:32:17.740 Freddie Mercury live

00:32:19.380 at Wembley

00:32:19.980 watch the video

00:32:21.280 watch the audience

00:32:22.080 and look at how

00:32:23.300 they're all in one

00:32:24.200 they're all having a great time

00:32:25.260 you watch any concert

00:32:26.480 it's such an obvious

00:32:30.220 example of how

00:32:31.900 life is being downgraded

00:32:34.400 you know what I mean

00:32:35.400 less fun is being had

00:32:36.860 guys come on

00:32:37.540 can we notice now

00:32:38.960 and just sort of

00:32:39.800 turn it around the other way

00:32:40.880 no but it is true

00:32:42.800 you know

00:32:43.160 especially Instagram

00:32:44.000 and you know

00:32:44.680 everything's being filmed

00:32:45.940 for the gram

00:32:46.520 everything

00:32:47.500 you're doing it

00:32:48.400 for the likes

00:32:48.980 do you wish you could

00:32:49.620 get off Instagram

00:32:50.140 yeah

00:32:51.700 right me too

00:32:52.580 yeah

00:32:52.980 I'd love to throw my phone

00:32:54.100 in a fish tank

00:32:54.620 see you later

00:32:55.400 go back to

00:32:56.440 before we had them

00:32:57.100 I wish I could get off

00:32:58.540 all social media

00:32:59.300 the only reason we do

00:33:00.260 social media is our show

00:33:01.260 that's what I say

00:33:02.020 yeah

00:33:02.340 yeah

00:33:03.000 my career

00:33:03.780 yeah

00:33:04.400 back in line

00:33:05.700 do you think

00:33:06.940 social media is actually

00:33:08.040 making us more polarised

00:33:09.340 it's designed to

00:33:10.460 by design

00:33:11.840 and anyone can look this up

00:33:14.020 The people that created Facebook, Instagram, it's designed to make you isolated, to make you alone, to demoralize you.

00:33:20.340 And it does exactly that.

00:33:21.800 Like Instagram, you know, when you go onto your Instagram and there's an image at the top of your Instagram, right?

00:33:26.480 But there's a thousand images your Instagram could show you.

00:33:29.020 That's what Instagram wants you to think.

00:33:31.820 That's what it wants you to think.

00:33:32.900 And sometimes you refresh that image and it stays there.

00:33:35.040 There's other images it could show you.

00:33:36.700 But it's like, no, no, think about this.

00:33:38.120 Sometimes the image it shows me, it makes me feel so sad.

00:33:41.220 It knows how to manipulate you as a person.

00:33:47.100 Like your phone has so much information on you.

00:33:48.840 Google has so much information on you.

00:33:50.680 Ridiculous amount of information on you.

00:33:51.980 I'm sure they're having a great time.

00:33:53.120 Yeah, I know.

00:33:54.420 So if Instagram makes you sad, it's by design.

00:33:59.240 Can you give me an example of like an image?

00:34:01.780 Okay.

00:34:02.240 I did a show and I call it the demoralizer.

00:34:05.700 It's this gig in a pub.

00:34:07.000 It's in the corner of a pub.

00:34:08.680 You have to, excuse me, everyone.

00:34:10.880 can you please

00:34:11.380 you know the gig

00:34:12.600 it's around the corner

00:34:14.320 half the people

00:34:15.200 aren't paying attention

00:34:15.720 we all know that gig

00:34:16.920 right

00:34:17.320 I've done it once before

00:34:18.640 and then I came back

00:34:19.380 the second time

00:34:20.040 and I was like

00:34:20.760 okay I'm just going to

00:34:21.500 notice all the ways

00:34:22.320 this gig tries to

00:34:23.320 demoralise me

00:34:24.020 and I go in there

00:34:25.520 and it's the same

00:34:26.540 as it always is

00:34:27.320 it's horrible

00:34:27.680 and I come outside

00:34:28.500 and I go on my Instagram

00:34:30.300 and the first image

00:34:31.580 it shows me

00:34:32.180 is another comedian

00:34:33.380 that we all know

00:34:34.120 supporting Bill Burr

00:34:35.180 on tour in a stadium

00:34:36.180 like this

00:34:36.820 just at the moment

00:34:37.980 when I was like

00:34:38.660 oh what am I doing

00:34:40.020 it's like

00:34:40.480 because I knew

00:34:42.420 about the refresh

00:34:43.060 I refreshed it

00:34:43.640 eight times

00:34:44.100 it was still on the front

00:34:44.860 I was laughing

00:34:45.940 just so at the end

00:34:46.800 I was laughing

00:34:47.280 just like oh

00:34:47.860 how do you know

00:34:48.400 and I went outside

00:34:49.220 in the other comic

00:34:49.920 there's two comics

00:34:50.580 he was sitting there

00:34:51.300 like this

00:34:51.560 I said I bet

00:34:52.280 you're thinking

00:34:53.060 about quitting comedy

00:34:53.780 he goes how do you

00:34:54.300 know that

00:34:54.700 I'm like it's the point

00:34:55.900 it's what this gig is

00:34:57.360 you know

00:34:58.420 it's also about

00:35:00.260 what gets clicks

00:35:01.040 and hate

00:35:01.620 and anger

00:35:02.600 are things that

00:35:04.100 because of the way

00:35:05.760 our brains evolved

00:35:07.000 and the way our brains

00:35:07.720 are wired

00:35:08.120 hate

00:35:08.820 anger

00:35:09.320 and fear

00:35:10.480 They are the things that will always attract way more attention than love,

00:35:14.500 than any of the good positive stuff.

00:35:16.680 It's like injuries.

00:35:17.740 Sometimes my Instagram shows me injuries.

00:35:19.680 Really?

00:35:19.980 Yeah, right.

00:35:21.160 Football injuries.

00:35:21.900 Right, or someone who's in hospital with a skin around.

00:35:25.240 I'm like, I don't want to see this.

00:35:27.940 And it's like, you know I don't want to see this, Instagram.

00:35:31.300 You know who I am.

00:35:32.940 It's stuff like that that no one asked for,

00:35:35.180 that's just sort of Trojan horse its way into your life now.

00:35:37.800 and it's so hard

00:35:38.960 to get rid of social media

00:35:40.040 because everyone's got it

00:35:41.140 and you think

00:35:42.360 if I don't have it

00:35:43.040 how will I contact people

00:35:43.960 yeah

00:35:45.400 now here's a question

00:35:46.280 if you

00:35:46.960 would you go into comedy again

00:35:49.560 if you knew

00:35:50.200 that everything

00:35:50.680 that happened to you

00:35:51.620 and the journey

00:35:53.580 you would be on

00:35:54.120 would you do it

00:35:54.820 I do feel sorry

00:35:55.860 you know comics

00:35:56.840 that are starting now

00:35:57.680 and it's sort of like

00:35:59.660 the circuit itself

00:36:01.640 is so hard

00:36:02.240 to make a living out of now

00:36:03.300 at least when we started

00:36:04.420 it was like

00:36:05.260 oh well when I get there

00:36:06.300 there'll be like nice gigs

00:36:07.520 and there'll be money and I might be able to make a living.

00:36:09.620 If you're starting now, you must be looking at the end post going,

00:36:13.820 what a, I can't even, even if I win, I can't make this happen.

00:36:18.280 You know, like most of the gigs,

00:36:19.320 some of the gigs that used to be 400 people in London on Friday or Saturday

00:36:22.180 are now 12, right?

00:36:25.500 And it's like, oh, when I started,

00:36:27.600 I used to get on stage at these clubs and be like,

00:36:29.440 oh, wow, there's 200 people, I'm doing it.

00:36:32.380 Right now, like even when you've got to that stage now,

00:36:34.860 you're like, oh, it's 12 people and a cat.

00:36:36.460 it's funny to me talking to people who've been going 15 20 years because they're like oh yeah

00:36:42.140 i did my first gig and then did another gig and then i got my paid 10 and paid 10 minute spot and

00:36:47.580 i got paid 50 quid and you're going nowadays a comic starting out now they might not be paid

00:36:52.700 for the first three years of their career if they're lucky if they're lucky yeah i had to do

00:36:56.660 a year of unpaid 10 spots my first clubs in london i had to do a year of no money 10 minutes for a

00:37:02.580 year. And that was fine. Other people

00:37:04.620 are like, I can't believe you're doing that. I'm like, I don't feel exploited

00:37:06.500 at all. Like, that's somebody learning

00:37:08.580 my craft on a Friday and a Saturday night.

00:37:10.660 I just don't think that that

00:37:12.220 amount of stage time is there for

00:37:14.560 young comics anymore. And the thing as well

00:37:16.620 is, in the context of what we're talking

00:37:18.640 about, which is hyper-wokeness and

00:37:20.540 hyper-sensitivity, and I feel this,

00:37:22.760 you know, we've all got career

00:37:24.140 progression that we want to get to.

00:37:26.540 We want to get to the bigger clubs and play

00:37:28.480 blah, blah, blah. If you

00:37:30.520 do edgy stuff, or stuff that's

00:37:32.560 perceived as being edgy, that is a risk that you just can't afford to take

00:37:36.560 in this hyper-competitive industry. Because if it goes wrong,

00:37:40.820 France and I were talking about this before, most bookers in a comedy

00:37:44.580 club, they prefer a guy or a woman who does 7 out of 10 every night.

00:37:49.100 Guaranteed. Never fails. Always 7. They would much

00:37:52.680 prefer that to someone who's a 6 today and a 10 tomorrow. And if you

00:37:56.680 try to take risks with your comedy, which a good comedian should always do,

00:38:00.120 you will sometimes end up being

00:38:02.180 6 out of 10

00:38:02.920 or 5 out of 10

00:38:03.780 you piss people off

00:38:04.720 how many times

00:38:05.180 do you guys gig with me?

00:38:07.740 quite a few probably

00:38:08.680 yeah

00:38:08.900 how many times

00:38:09.940 have you seen me

00:38:10.640 not get a good response

00:38:10.960 but that's the thing

00:38:11.400 you're not an energy comedian

00:38:12.240 seriously ask the question

00:38:13.180 how many times is it

00:38:14.360 have you seen

00:38:14.840 zero right?

00:38:16.220 I've always seen you do well

00:38:17.040 yeah

00:38:17.220 right

00:38:17.540 exactly

00:38:17.900 so I know

00:38:19.120 where my level of competency is at

00:38:21.380 and I know

00:38:22.260 when I'm being removed from lists

00:38:23.620 and I don't do that anymore

00:38:24.400 it's got nothing to do

00:38:25.520 with my comedic ability

00:38:27.100 I'm not talking about you

00:38:27.800 no no no

00:38:28.120 but what I'm saying

00:38:29.320 is that I'm using myself

00:38:30.060 as an example

00:38:30.480 because I know

00:38:31.200 I'm at the shows

00:38:33.180 I've watched

00:38:33.540 so I know

00:38:34.140 that I'm being removed

00:38:34.960 for reasons that aren't

00:38:36.000 so I know

00:38:36.460 that it happens to me

00:38:37.280 so I know

00:38:37.700 it must be happening

00:38:38.360 to a lot of other people

00:38:39.600 and so I don't

00:38:42.440 I don't subscribe

00:38:43.080 to the notion

00:38:43.800 that if you're

00:38:44.520 an edgy comic

00:38:45.840 that you're like

00:38:47.040 more risky

00:38:47.760 like the people

00:38:48.620 you mentioned

00:38:49.140 all the names

00:38:49.640 that you mentioned

00:38:50.100 like yourself

00:38:50.680 Jeff

00:38:51.000 I don't see them

00:38:51.760 have bad shows

00:38:52.460 I don't see it

00:38:53.820 I see people go

00:38:54.940 oh wow

00:38:55.380 something different

00:38:55.960 this is awesome

00:38:56.740 you know

00:38:57.600 oh how refreshing

00:38:59.820 I don't see them, but I see them get more from an audience

00:39:03.680 because they realise, like, oh, this guy isn't saying what he's supposed to do.

00:39:08.140 You know?

00:39:08.680 People, they love it, I think.

00:39:11.000 Yeah, I remember one time actually playing in a London club,

00:39:14.460 and I was very new to the time,

00:39:16.660 and I had this bit about why we need Special Olympics for white people,

00:39:20.760 and I really enjoyed doing it.

00:39:23.120 And after the gig, a black police officer came up to me,

00:39:28.020 And it was like, oh, and you've got to understand, this is a point where I've been going for like a year and a half.

00:39:32.100 I'm very new.

00:39:33.020 He goes, where can I see you for an hour?

00:39:35.920 And this is ridiculous for someone who's been going that long, right?

00:39:38.800 Oh, I see.

00:39:39.340 Do you know what I mean?

00:39:39.900 Yeah.

00:39:40.260 And so I totally get there is a certain group of people who really go, oh, that's different.

00:39:45.260 I'll watch that.

00:39:46.300 Right.

00:39:46.460 But in terms of a booker, I do think a lot of people feel like, oh, well, let's not take a risk here.

00:39:53.280 Let's not. Why would we have someone talking about a white guy talking about race when we can just have someone talking about the way his wife puts on tights or whatever?

00:40:00.580 You know what I mean? Yeah, I guess so. You don't agree, which is fine.

00:40:03.660 No, no, I guess so. It's hard to get in the mind. It's hard to get in the mind of the bookers.

00:40:08.600 But if you wanted to change the way comedy worked, that would be the class of people that you would infiltrate.

00:40:13.660 You would make sure they all aligned in one political direction and that the booking was done based on that.

00:40:19.780 I mean, someone should look into it.

00:40:22.360 Maybe there's loads of right-wing comedy bookers.

00:40:24.180 I don't know any, but maybe they're out there.

00:40:26.120 I think the people who dictate line-ups inevitably are TV.

00:40:30.440 Right.

00:40:30.640 Because if you get on TV, then all of a sudden you bring cachet to the gig.

00:40:35.100 Right.

00:40:35.480 You bring cachet to the gig, you're more likely to get booked.

00:40:37.800 For instance, there's a whole chain of London clubs where you can only get on if you've done live at the Apollo.

00:40:42.100 Yeah, it's almost like that group of bookers, and so they have to okay you or you can't even get a voice, isn't it?

00:40:47.920 Yeah, absolutely.

00:40:48.800 And they're the ones who have done, you know,

00:40:50.940 and there's lots of comedians.

00:40:52.020 Many of them are very, very good.

00:40:53.080 Yes.

00:40:53.380 And they all do exclusively pro-Remain material.

00:40:56.240 Again, there's nothing wrong with that.

00:40:57.980 No.

00:40:58.340 But to the point where it's just like,

00:41:00.420 this is just one voice.

00:41:02.720 But the reason it's getting weird now

00:41:04.100 is because no one really watches TV anymore.

00:41:07.100 So it doesn't make as much sense as it used to.

00:41:08.920 It used to be, well, you have to be on Live at the Apollo

00:41:11.160 or blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:41:11.980 You have to be on the BBC.

00:41:13.640 It's like, no one really watches that anymore.

00:41:15.880 Like, it used to be you went on Live at the Apollo

00:41:17.320 and it was like, boom.

00:41:18.540 Oh, yeah, absolutely.

00:41:19.080 Oh, well, you're all over the place.

00:41:20.960 I know comics now.

00:41:22.160 Oh, yeah, I went on there.

00:41:23.040 I got a few thousand followers.

00:41:24.260 That's it.

00:41:25.100 It's all the same now.

00:41:26.980 It's not quite the – it's still great, but it's not – you know what I mean?

00:41:30.920 It's not quite the same.

00:41:32.820 It's being downgraded, all of those things that we used to want.

00:41:36.900 It's all about the internet now, and that's the great thing about it

00:41:39.760 is that people were coming up to me after my show in Edinburgh

00:41:42.400 and going, well, thank God for what you're doing, whatever.

00:41:45.380 And I'm like, well, it's not really that brave

00:41:47.620 when they're saying you're being really brave.

00:41:48.880 It's not really that brave because, you know,

00:41:50.880 400 years ago, all of us would be burned at the stake.

00:41:53.780 Yes.

00:41:54.180 Right?

00:41:54.740 Now, we've got our own YouTube shows.

00:41:57.180 Do you know what I mean?

00:41:58.760 It's not quite as bad a punishment.

00:42:01.020 We're not safe yet, man.

00:42:02.980 Right, I know what you're saying.

00:42:03.860 Do you know what I'm saying?

00:42:04.560 Yeah, absolutely.

00:42:05.300 Like, the antagonism that we get from certain quarters

00:42:08.960 in some ways is a benefit.

00:42:11.240 It is a benefit, but I also think as well,

00:42:13.420 it is detrimental to your mental health

00:42:15.780 in that, I'll be honest with you,

00:42:17.500 when I've been doing this show

00:42:20.520 this is the loneliest I've felt in comedy

00:42:22.140 right

00:42:22.520 that's only because you're sitting next to me

00:42:24.180 yeah it's true

00:42:24.980 I'm feeling it too

00:42:26.500 by the way

00:42:28.460 you was talking about being burnt at the stake

00:42:30.580 I'm disappointed

00:42:31.300 none of us made a gammon joke

00:42:32.660 but anyway carry on

00:42:33.520 we've still got time

00:42:34.220 yeah

00:42:34.540 no you're probably right

00:42:36.020 you're probably right

00:42:36.760 but like I'm telling you

00:42:37.500 if I'm right about phones and social media

00:42:40.080 being designed to demoralise this

00:42:41.400 you would feel

00:42:41.940 maybe it's not just you

00:42:43.560 maybe people who work in all kinds of jobs

00:42:45.400 are like

00:42:45.640 I'm the loneliest I ever feel

00:42:47.280 How would you know?

00:42:48.400 Everything's about mental health.

00:42:49.860 You know, it's always like mental health, mental health, mental health.

00:42:52.420 This was not the way 20 years ago.

00:42:55.360 No one was, you know, having these problems.

00:42:59.440 Kids don't play on the street where I live.

00:43:01.920 When I used to go and see my mum, when I was a kid,

00:43:04.040 my mum and dad's house, kids would be playing all over the place.

00:43:06.600 I said to my dad, I said, are kids ever playing?

00:43:08.120 He goes, no.

00:43:09.540 Kids have stopped playing on the streets, guys.

00:43:12.280 There's a real problem with an overall level of, I don't know, sadness, loneliness.

00:43:19.320 I think there was a statistic like the young people these days,

00:43:22.480 when you ask them how many close friends you've got, the average is zero.

00:43:25.780 Close friends, the average is zero.

00:43:28.000 I had like eight, nine, ten close friends.

00:43:29.860 Everyone did.

00:43:30.720 I had eight, nine, ten close friends before we had these phones

00:43:34.140 that connect us to everyone, right?

00:43:36.280 I need to cheer up a bit.

00:43:37.700 oh what a great comedian to have on

00:43:41.980 this has turned into a mental health special

00:43:44.200 I'm like oh thanks the voice of dude

00:43:46.440 this is what Alistair shows are always like

00:43:48.060 yeah come let me cheer you up

00:43:49.800 let's be fair this is what every groom room is like

00:43:52.520 you know it's comedians being miserable

00:43:54.480 and depressed everybody on the other side

00:43:56.320 is having a great time

00:43:57.340 do you just call it a groom room

00:43:59.000 yeah a groom room

00:44:00.420 that's more like a BBC green room

00:44:04.100 yeah absolutely

00:44:05.340 or certain comedians

00:44:07.040 no but you know

00:44:11.260 it's a good point

00:44:14.000 that you're making

00:44:14.660 in that we do

00:44:15.640 we have become

00:44:16.440 disconnected

00:44:17.100 big time

00:44:18.160 yeah

00:44:18.480 this myth of

00:44:19.600 connectivity

00:44:20.080 and the fact

00:44:20.900 oh we're more

00:44:21.560 connected to everybody

00:44:22.480 than we've ever been

00:44:23.520 but the reality is

00:44:24.300 we're not

00:44:24.660 I think it was

00:44:25.660 Elon Musk on Joe Rogan

00:44:27.540 when he was saying

00:44:28.080 it's a bandwidth thing

00:44:29.020 he was saying

00:44:29.320 we think we communicate

00:44:30.400 with our thumbs now

00:44:31.220 most of the time

00:44:31.720 well there's only so much

00:44:32.800 communicating you can get

00:44:33.580 done with a thumb

00:44:34.160 it's a very small amount

00:44:35.900 it's even less than

00:44:36.920 the typewriter.

00:44:37.720 It's less.

00:44:38.580 We think we're getting more

00:44:40.060 but really it's less.

00:44:42.420 If I'm talking to my girlfriend

00:44:43.820 or something

00:44:44.120 and she's like,

00:44:44.680 oh, what happened last night

00:44:45.920 on a text?

00:44:46.640 And I'm like,

00:44:46.920 I don't want to text you

00:44:47.860 what happened

00:44:48.320 because I'll skip all the details

00:44:50.280 and all the stuff

00:44:50.800 and I'll give you a short version

00:44:51.900 because I can't be bothered.

00:44:53.360 And most of your communication

00:44:54.340 is with people by text

00:44:55.600 and you go on your WhatsApp

00:44:56.620 and you've got six people

00:44:57.500 to get back to

00:44:58.060 and if you don't get back

00:44:58.680 to one of them,

00:44:59.440 they're going to be mad at you.

00:45:00.560 So it becomes admin.

00:45:02.320 Like, oh God, friends.

00:45:04.700 You know?

00:45:04.940 it's weird how differently conversations happen face to face versus online yeah like there's so

00:45:10.920 many people that i've had arguments with or disagreements with on social media and then we

00:45:15.200 meet up for a drink and it's like oh wait we actually agree on everything yes yeah you know

00:45:18.580 yeah it's it's a very combative medium you can't get tone you can't get um you know all the readings

00:45:26.420 like sitting here talking to you guys i know that you're not attacking me in any way and i can have

00:45:31.140 a nice conversation

00:45:31.780 if we are on

00:45:32.460 Twitter or something

00:45:33.560 you don't get any

00:45:34.180 of those reads

00:45:34.880 off people

00:45:35.380 you just get their

00:45:36.340 plain words

00:45:37.360 and if you notice

00:45:38.360 with Twitter

00:45:38.700 it very rarely

00:45:39.300 solves anything

00:45:40.440 no one ever goes

00:45:41.460 oh yeah

00:45:42.360 oh I'm with you

00:45:43.840 it just goes

00:45:46.360 backwards and forwards

00:45:47.240 it's a very

00:45:48.220 combative medium

00:45:49.400 it's almost

00:45:50.360 yeah like you said

00:45:51.200 it's been designed

00:45:51.820 that way hasn't it

00:45:52.620 right but

00:45:53.220 on a positive side

00:45:54.680 like if you come up

00:45:55.500 with a good piece

00:45:56.060 of comedy

00:45:56.340 you can still use

00:45:57.000 something like Twitter

00:45:57.660 and people will share it

00:45:58.700 so these things

00:45:59.820 that are built

00:46:00.420 to keep us apart from each other can actually be used for positive means.

00:46:06.000 You know, it's not all negative news.

00:46:07.980 We're more connected now than we have been previously.

00:46:10.680 It's just trying to get it on a more of a human level.

00:46:14.080 Like talking to people on the phone,

00:46:15.500 I've noticed I can't get a good connection to anyone on the phone.

00:46:18.340 You know, I can send you an HD video,

00:46:19.880 but if I try and call you, I feel like I'm, you know,

00:46:23.840 save it, private Ryan or something.

00:46:25.400 I've got one of those like, hello, how's it going?

00:46:27.480 I thought someone's back.

00:46:28.660 I can't remember what we were talking about

00:46:34.160 I was going to ask you what your plans are going forward

00:46:36.740 what do you see your career developing as

00:46:38.940 are you going to start doing your own shows

00:46:41.340 to your own audience

00:46:42.480 are you sticking with the YouTube for now

00:46:44.180 I think I'm going to keep doing my shows to my own audience

00:46:47.380 like my show How to Lose Weight and Be Less Racist

00:46:49.760 I think is a great show

00:46:50.920 I think I can take that to other countries and places

00:46:53.520 and people will be interested in that show

00:46:55.160 So that's my favorite thing to do with comedy is to research a topic,

00:47:00.660 find out stuff about it, and then try and make it funny

00:47:02.560 so that people will sit through it.

00:47:04.240 If you lecture people on what food to eat, they get bored quite quickly.

00:47:06.760 If you can make it amusing, it's a good way of getting information into people.

00:47:09.900 So I still want to do that.

00:47:11.020 But I do a live stream every night about 10 o'clock

00:47:14.600 where we just chat for two hours to people on my YouTube.

00:47:17.440 And I enjoy doing that the most, I think.

00:47:19.300 So I think I'm going to turn that into my own sort of nightly podcast, radio show.

00:47:24.600 I don't know. It's not too serious

00:47:26.480 where we just chat about what's going on, but

00:47:28.440 I think that's what I'd like to do. Just have that

00:47:30.600 little part of the internet where you can

00:47:32.520 tune in every night and we just talk about what's

00:47:34.620 going on and try and

00:47:36.460 lift morale, if you know what I mean.

00:47:38.940 Just like you've done in this interview.

00:47:40.440 Yes, of course.

00:47:43.820 What do you think

00:47:44.580 is going to be the future of comedy, Alistair?

00:47:48.000 Where do you think

00:47:48.620 it's going to go? Hopefully

00:47:50.380 in the Dave Chappelle direction.

00:47:52.480 Hopefully that is the foot in

00:47:54.480 the door of like, no,

00:47:56.640 we're not going down the way where we can't

00:47:58.540 do it. Hopefully that will snowball

00:47:59.980 into everyone gets to do that again.

00:48:02.760 Where everyone again gets to go, no.

00:48:05.500 No, he was clearly

00:48:06.660 lying.

00:48:09.120 Juicy small.

00:48:12.380 That is such a funny idea.

00:48:14.240 Oh, it was brilliant to watch, man.

00:48:16.280 And that's what I think comedy needs.

00:48:18.340 People at the top of the pyramids

00:48:20.140 to be like, I got this. I'll take these

00:48:22.360 guys on. Don't you like

00:48:23.680 But people like us aren't going to do it.

00:48:26.320 They'll just crush us like an egg and just keep stomping on.

00:48:29.340 You say that, though.

00:48:30.060 I mean, obviously, we're nowhere near that level.

00:48:32.940 But you and I, I'm sure all of us, get a lot of messages from people going from newer comedians or just other comedians.

00:48:40.460 Some comedians are way ahead of me going, well, I'm really glad you're talking about it because someone should.

00:48:45.040 I'm really glad you're doing this because someone should.

00:48:47.720 I'm sure you get that.

00:48:48.620 Overwhelmingly.

00:48:49.100 When comedians meet me in person, it's 99% positive.

00:48:52.420 Yeah.

00:48:52.900 And it's usually, oh, yeah, keep going.

00:48:55.020 It's like, yeah, I need you publicly.

00:48:56.740 Yeah, I had a lot of that, to be fair.

00:48:59.960 But, you know, some people, it's easy for us because it's like that quote I love from Fight Club,

00:49:06.040 which is it's only once you've lost everything that you're free to do anything.

00:49:09.340 It's easy for us because we don't have much to lose.

00:49:11.400 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:49:11.980 If you've already got a huge career, it's a harder thing to ask someone to do.

00:49:17.500 Yeah, no, I totally understand that.

00:49:19.380 I do totally understand that.

00:49:20.320 Because they've got a mortgage and they've got kids.

00:49:22.280 And look, at the end of the day, everybody's got their own decisions to make.

00:49:26.180 But I know certainly when I was getting a lot of flack,

00:49:29.680 I appreciated some people who I can't name because they didn't want to be public

00:49:32.900 who were really supportive, big-name people.

00:49:37.040 And I asked them, do you want to say something about public?

00:49:39.260 And they were like, I can't.

00:49:40.500 Right.

00:49:40.920 But they were helpful anyway.

00:49:42.560 And, you know, everybody's got their own role to play.

00:49:44.760 It was nice.

00:49:45.720 Everybody's got their own role to play, their own path to walk.

00:49:49.540 I think people aren't stupid.

00:49:50.460 they look at what was

00:49:51.460 happening to you

00:49:52.000 and they go

00:49:52.500 well that ain't good

00:49:53.720 I should help that guy

00:49:54.960 you know what I mean

00:49:55.740 yeah

00:49:56.000 I can see how that would be

00:49:57.700 turned around on me later

00:49:59.260 if I don't help this guy

00:50:00.500 when it's happening to him now

00:50:01.520 but Joe Brand came out

00:50:02.620 in defence of you

00:50:03.220 she did

00:50:03.620 she did

00:50:04.180 and look what happened to her

00:50:05.120 yeah

00:50:05.400 what happened to her

00:50:06.180 did you not follow

00:50:06.920 the whole acid Nigel Farage

00:50:08.320 oh yeah

00:50:08.680 yeah

00:50:09.040 and then they

00:50:10.200 you know

00:50:10.820 and then she got strung up

00:50:11.960 later on

00:50:12.580 yeah

00:50:12.860 and all the same lefties

00:50:15.100 who came out

00:50:16.200 and said

00:50:16.800 that I was a Nazi

00:50:18.060 and all this shit

00:50:18.640 they were the same ones

00:50:19.800 who were deeply upset about her being.

00:50:22.300 See, I got a problem with,

00:50:24.040 because around the time she said that, right,

00:50:26.260 I'm being photographed standing next to Nigel Farage

00:50:28.420 and people are sending around photographs of that going,

00:50:30.180 this is who Alistair is.

00:50:31.180 And then I tell the BBC and she's like,

00:50:32.940 hey, it'd be funny to throw acid at Nigel Farage.

00:50:34.880 I'm like, I'm one step removed from this guy.

00:50:37.180 I don't like that joke.

00:50:38.920 Throw battery acid, hee, hee, hee.

00:50:41.120 It's like, no, I don't think that's funny at all.

00:50:43.640 I think that's close to being illegal, to be honest.

00:50:46.300 You can't name someone and be like,

00:50:48.300 maybe you should chuck acid.

00:50:49.260 So she didn't actually name him, to be fair.

00:50:51.400 Right, but we all knew.

00:50:53.120 No one was like, who does she mean?

00:50:54.580 Well, that's interesting.

00:50:55.300 So you think, I don't know, I just want to clarify.

00:50:58.320 When you said it's close to being legal, are you joking or are you being serious?

00:51:01.420 Well, like, this was around the time when people were getting milkshakes chucked at him.

00:51:04.840 I remember the context.

00:51:05.660 Some people that I look at and I go, well, that's just a commentator from YouTube that has said nothing wrong, really.

00:51:12.180 And he's getting milkshakes chucked at him.

00:51:13.600 I don't like that.

00:51:14.740 I think that's dangerous for people to have milk because it's like a first step down the road.

00:51:18.540 Yeah, of course she is.

00:51:19.440 We're totally on board with that.

00:51:20.080 And I felt like her joke

00:51:21.140 was almost saying like,

00:51:21.980 well, if you want to throw

00:51:22.800 battery acid, you know,

00:51:24.800 hey, hey, hey.

00:51:25.660 It's like, can we not,

00:51:27.180 I'm not saying it's a lipid,

00:51:28.180 but can we not just,

00:51:29.480 I can understand you can

00:51:30.160 encourage people to go that way

00:51:31.880 or you can say, hey,

00:51:33.720 I know that we don't like people,

00:51:35.040 but let's not throw stuff at them.

00:51:36.600 I'd rather we went in that direction.

00:51:38.020 I agree with you.

00:51:39.000 But equally, as a comedian,

00:51:40.740 I don't imagine you thought,

00:51:42.020 oh, she should be being investigated

00:51:43.280 by the police for this, right?

00:51:45.240 That's down to the police.

00:51:46.680 I mean, from what I understand

00:51:48.100 is you can't openly incite to violence.

00:51:50.860 I can't go on TV and say,

00:51:52.240 I don't like this person

00:51:53.020 and maybe you should start

00:51:54.000 throwing shit at them.

00:51:54.980 But it was a joke, wasn't it?

00:51:55.800 Right, but you and I both know

00:51:58.900 you get in trouble for a joke.

00:52:00.540 I was joking.

00:52:01.740 If the police come to see you

00:52:03.060 for something you've said

00:52:03.700 and you go, oh, I'm joking,

00:52:05.280 they will literally go,

00:52:07.100 I'm not here about that.

00:52:08.660 It's not in the rules,

00:52:09.840 it's not in the law.

00:52:10.760 Hate speech.

00:52:12.600 Speech that won't save you

00:52:15.080 that you were joking.

00:52:16.360 It wouldn't save me.

00:52:17.480 I wouldn't expect it to.

00:52:18.800 What I'm getting at is,

00:52:19.900 do you think that's how it should be?

00:52:22.000 How do you mean?

00:52:22.520 No.

00:52:23.060 Right, you don't.

00:52:23.680 No, but I do think

00:52:24.560 if you're inciting violence,

00:52:25.720 I don't think you should be doing that.

00:52:26.620 Yeah.

00:52:26.940 I do not think you should be doing that.

00:52:28.320 Even if you're joking,

00:52:29.540 I think it's dangerous.

00:52:30.520 Okay.

00:52:30.880 If someone throws acid

00:52:32.120 at one of these guys.

00:52:33.040 No, no, of course.

00:52:33.880 You know?

00:52:34.720 It's not going to be hard

00:52:35.440 to link go well.

00:52:36.380 Maybe, where do you find the idea?

00:52:37.760 It's the only area of disagreement

00:52:39.180 we've had so far,

00:52:40.040 so I'm curious to explore it

00:52:41.580 in good old social media style.

00:52:45.160 George Carlin.

00:52:46.120 Right.

00:52:46.320 He had a whole routine, which was called, here's a list of people who should be killed.

00:52:50.120 Bill Hicks.

00:52:51.620 What's on the list?

00:52:52.460 I can't remember now.

00:52:53.560 They're all irrelevant now.

00:52:55.540 Bill Hicks had a whole routine about how, if you're in marketing or advertising, kill yourself.

00:53:01.260 Right.

00:53:02.100 And people would laugh nervously and go, I'm not joking, kill yourself.

00:53:05.920 Really?

00:53:06.540 Yeah.

00:53:07.360 So I think comedians have always joked with these ideas.

00:53:10.600 And I think it's dangerous to go down the path of saying, well, yeah, sure, it's a joke, but we're living in this kind of dangerous situation.

00:53:18.800 Therefore, I think comedians need to just, I personally, this is my opinion, is we need to just stand as one whenever anyone comes after anyone who's a comedian for a joke that they told, whatever the joke is to a large extent.

00:53:31.600 Obviously, if they've gone out and just been overtly racist and stupid, that's a different thing.

00:53:36.420 But I thought it was a bad joke.

00:53:38.540 I thought it was ill-advised in that context, but I defended her because I just think comedians should have the right to play with ideas, even if they make really bad mistakes.

00:53:46.280 Everyone's selfish, you know, just because I guess because I was in a position where I was being photographed standing next to Nigel Farage, and I felt like we was living in an atmosphere.

00:53:53.920 It's like, let's start throwing more things.

00:53:55.460 I'm like, hey, guess what?

00:53:56.480 I'm not on that bus.

00:53:57.980 You know, it's my own personal safety.

00:54:00.120 I'm like, no, no, no, yeah, please stop her saying that.

00:54:03.760 Maybe that's just me being selfish.

00:54:05.180 But I never thought we'd get in a scenario where it was coming to this level.

00:54:12.300 You know, I thought people would always solve things in a polite discourse kind of way.

00:54:17.860 Does that make sense?

00:54:19.000 Yeah.

00:54:19.200 I never thought we'd be saying, like, maybe we should be throwing stuff.

00:54:24.180 It does always seem that it's always it does seem to be going one way, if you know what I mean.

00:54:30.220 The incitements to ramp it up all does seem to be coming from the left.

00:54:35.960 I don't see anyone on the right saying, let's ramp things up.

00:54:38.260 You know, let's start throwing stuff.

00:54:40.340 Does that make sense?

00:54:41.320 Yeah, absolutely.

00:54:42.560 Yeah, absolutely.

00:54:43.300 I think especially in this country.

00:54:44.460 In America, there is some evidence that there are some far-right violent groups as well.

00:54:49.680 Right, yeah.

00:54:50.960 I think in this country, there's very little of that from what I've seen.

00:54:54.720 Like Andy Ngo as an example.

00:54:56.460 Well, yeah.

00:54:56.880 It's like, how do you still think you're the good guys?

00:54:58.720 You watch that video.

00:54:59.820 it's like

00:55:00.280 well we've had him on the show

00:55:01.240 you're obviously

00:55:02.040 well you know then

00:55:02.820 it's like I don't see

00:55:04.400 the other side to that

00:55:05.460 I don't see gangs of people

00:55:07.220 from the other side

00:55:07.960 going around

00:55:08.420 where's someone we can hit

00:55:09.780 I haven't seen it

00:55:10.840 if it's happening

00:55:11.540 I haven't seen it

00:55:12.880 but it does seem to be coming

00:55:15.420 from the other side

00:55:16.460 and they're not shy about it

00:55:18.400 they'll tell you

00:55:18.880 yeah that's what we're doing

00:55:19.900 we're finding people

00:55:21.440 who disagree with us

00:55:22.000 and we're going to rough them up

00:55:23.140 it's like

00:55:23.440 huh

00:55:24.400 and you're the anti-fascist

00:55:25.620 it's like

00:55:28.320 what

00:55:28.880 You take that video of Andy being beaten up and you go, OK, there's a there's a tiny little guy here and then there's a bunch of black clad people with helmets and bats.

00:55:38.680 Let's work out which one of those may be the fascists.

00:55:44.540 Is it the little guy being beaten for being a journalist or is it the guys who are trying to stop him from reporting on what's happening?

00:55:50.940 But what happens if he's got the wrong ideas?

00:55:52.600 Well, that's the point.

00:55:53.300 It was actually, it was a Tim Paul video on that that I saw where Andy was coming out and saying he was describing Antifa as a terrorist and this and all these horrible names.

00:56:03.640 And Tim Paul was defending me and saying, well, I think that's a little over-exaggerated.

00:56:06.800 I'm like, yeah, because they haven't hit you in the head with a pipe.

00:56:09.740 Like, that's what I mean.

00:56:10.500 That changes your perspective on it.

00:56:12.180 When all of a sudden there's a gang of people attacking you, your perspective changes to, oh, no, no, no, this is coming from that side.

00:56:20.220 I've got a brain injury.

00:56:21.920 You know what I mean?

00:56:22.820 Yeah.

00:56:23.300 It starts to become practical.

00:56:25.160 It does indeed.

00:56:25.860 Rather than theory.

00:56:27.060 And I think we've actually come to the end now.

00:56:29.480 Yeah, the brain injury bit is a really good ending.

00:56:31.500 Yeah.

00:56:31.920 Oh, yeah.

00:56:32.580 I'm such a ray of sunshine.

00:56:34.460 Let's be fair.

00:56:34.960 I'm surprised I'm not on more things.

00:56:38.240 Most comedians have some degree of brain injury.

00:56:40.560 Otherwise, you wouldn't do it, would you?

00:56:41.820 Let's be fair.

00:56:43.020 Obviously.

00:56:43.300 Other physical or mental.

00:56:44.820 Right, but we all...

00:56:45.720 I just have to share my talents with the world, mate.

00:56:48.720 Yes, final question.

00:56:50.020 Final question.

00:56:50.580 what is the one thing

00:56:51.400 that we're talking

00:56:52.060 we're not talking about

00:56:53.480 I'll do the final question

00:56:54.380 from now on man

00:56:54.980 that was just

00:56:55.420 the amount of times

00:56:58.260 he fucks up the intro

00:56:59.700 I stumble once

00:57:01.420 he's like

00:57:01.760 no I've got to do it now

00:57:02.940 I'm never actually

00:57:04.020 I take control of everything

00:57:05.440 everything is in charge

00:57:06.660 why is he doing

00:57:07.440 a Spanish accent

00:57:08.160 I have no idea

00:57:08.980 it's like a Jamaican

00:57:10.420 was in the room

00:57:10.980 you can't say that

00:57:13.740 I'm a white man

00:57:14.420 doing a Jamaican accent

00:57:15.500 I've definitely cancelled

00:57:16.540 right

00:57:16.860 I'm already cancelled

00:57:17.500 so what is the one thing

00:57:19.380 that we're not talking about

00:57:20.520 as a society that we really should be talking about um just in general terms just the the

00:57:27.620 general decline of morality you know what i mean the general just overall decline in morality

00:57:34.140 right people don't treat each other as nice or as well or as decently as they used to

00:57:40.220 and i think it's because you know that that side of our nature is not being pushed to the front

00:57:46.960 You know, we've always been told how different we are

00:57:48.660 and how saying this is wrong and saying this.

00:57:51.240 I watched a video yesterday on how saying the word guys is offensive.

00:57:55.300 Like, literally, they're trying to program people.

00:57:56.780 Like, if you said guys, you're a bad person.

00:57:58.280 You need to go and have a word with yourself.

00:57:59.280 It's like, we can't live in this world.

00:58:01.440 There's too many traps to fall into.

00:58:05.300 And I think the people doing that sort of thing,

00:58:07.480 I think they know that it's wrong.

00:58:09.100 I don't think they're trying to help anymore.

00:58:10.920 I think they're deliberately trying to make everyone feel like they're a bad person.

00:58:16.160 And I don't think you are, especially not if you said the word guys, you know.

00:58:22.280 Well, on that happy note.

00:58:23.900 Sorry.

00:58:24.520 No, no, it's all good, man.

00:58:25.520 No, it's fine.

00:58:26.220 Alistair, thank you so much for coming on.

00:58:27.660 Where can people find you online on all these horrible social media platforms?

00:58:31.340 My YouTube channel, please.

00:58:33.220 It's Alistair Williams Comedian.

00:58:36.180 Or if you want to just search Brexit Burger King, that should find you to me as well,

00:58:40.300 because it's quite difficult to search for me on social media.

00:58:42.480 But yeah, Alistair Williams Comedian YouTube channel is where I'd like you to go.

00:58:45.280 Yeah, and check out Alistair's Twitter as well.

00:58:47.520 As always, follow us on all the social media as well,

00:58:50.720 at TriggerPod, and that's pretty much it.

00:58:52.960 Leave us a nice iTunes review if you can,

00:58:54.880 and we will see you in a week from now

00:58:56.300 with another brilliant episode.

00:58:57.860 Thanks a lot, guys.

00:58:58.800 See you next week.

00:58:59.520 Bye-bye.

00:59:15.280 Thank you.

TRIGGERnometry - October 13, 2019

Alistair Williams on Comedy Censorship

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