00:04:14.940And it's also that having been a woke leftist and having changed my mind, I have a good idea for what works.
00:04:22.580And I've tested it in going around to different universities and talking to students who really disagree with everything it is that I stand for and that I have to say.
00:04:31.380And I found that the best course of action for talking to those sorts of people is, A, trying to understand where they're coming from, and B, not really indulging in those ad hominem attacks that we sometimes want to throw out at people and trying to usher them over to the other end of the spectrum by just giving them facts and trying to meet them where they're at.
00:04:55.180And I felt with the Matt Walsh video, much like you both did, that something needed to be said because I didn't want that to be a representation of where we are in the fight against gender ideology.
00:05:05.960And you're very young for someone to be to be on the other side of the political spectrum.
00:05:11.980Normally it happens in their 30s and their 40s when they start to earn a bit of money and they go, hang on a second.
00:05:17.900Right. So what was the moment for you? What was your red pill moment? Let's just call it that.
00:05:22.560Sure. There were many. I say this a lot. There was no specific light bulb moment that really flipped things over for me. It was gradual meeting of just roadblocks when it came to what I was trying to support.
00:05:37.820And I tried so desperately to hold on to my left-leaning ideology because I had staked so much of my life on it and so much of my identity on it. I even have a black power fist that's tattooed on my arm here that people can see in my other videos.
00:05:52.560And I got that when I was 16 years old thinking, you know what is brilliant? Let me brand myself
00:06:01.800with this sort of pseudo religious symbol because I'm never going to deviate from this sort of
00:06:07.560thinking. But if I could hone in on one moment in particular, when I was working for this
00:06:12.600organization, we would come together and have meetings. And before every meeting, we do community
00:06:17.680agreements, which are basically rules that everybody abides by throughout the duration
00:06:22.340of the conversation. So things like state your pronouns before you speak for the first time,
00:06:27.820or if someone has a story that is particularly oppressive and sad, let them speak the whole
00:06:34.140way through, no interrupting. And I had a coworker come up and at the end of her community agreements
00:06:40.220essentially say that all the white, cisgendered, heterosexual people in the room just shouldn't
00:06:45.440speak at all during this meeting. It just wasn't their time. They had their time in history and
00:06:50.720being biracial, I was raised by the white side of my family. So I sort of looked around this room
00:06:56.520of people who were nodding in agreement and thinking that was the right thing to do. And I
00:07:00.900just had this little thought that was like, Amala, you're in the wrong room, I think. I think you're
00:07:06.860in the wrong room and just ended up exploring that further. And now here we are. Do you think
00:07:13.200part of the problem with the left is if they stuck to the idea of, look, society is unequal,
00:07:18.660there's rich and there's poor, there's an ever-widening gap between the two. This is
00:07:23.100clearly unfair. We need to do something to make society fairer economically. You might not have
00:07:29.420had that moment, and other people might not. Yeah, I think had they stuck to some of the
00:07:38.940earlier tenets of their ideology, we would be just really in a better place as a society.
00:07:44.640It seems as though when we look at, I guess, left versus right, if we want to even put it that
00:07:48.660simply today, they've sort of crossed over each other in a lot of different ways. The left used
00:07:54.980to be super pro-skepticism. They were pushing pro-equality. They were anti-establishment.
00:08:00.960And those were the tenets that people really grasped onto. And I think that's an amount of
00:08:05.740progressivism that every society needs. Progressivism is always welcome and it's
00:08:10.640necessary to move forward as a pluralistic society. But they sort of just changed and
00:08:16.080shifted and morphed into something that is completely deviated from what were the original
00:08:20.240tenets. And that's why a lot of people have problems and they're switching. I think like
00:08:24.580all of us right now having this conversation, maybe we do have liberal leanings in us. I think
00:08:29.460everybody does, but what they've become now is just so far from liberal. Well, let's talk about
00:08:35.740that because you are right off center, Francis, and I didn't even go as far as that. I don't think
00:08:41.300we're kind of somewhere in the middle trying to work out exactly what we think. But one of the
00:08:46.500things we've talked a little bit about already is wokeness. And apparently we keep being told
00:08:51.320that this is a very hard thing to define. In fact, no one who criticizes can define it at all.
00:08:55.740Do you have a definition of it that you use?
00:09:00.000Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of different definitions because it takes so many different
00:13:49.300I was going to interrupt you and say, you know, a lot of the criticism is rightful.
00:13:52.380Our generation is pretty messed up, at least in my experience in meeting them.
00:13:57.060Why? I think that's just youthfulness at its core is wanting to be transformative, wanting to be rebellious.
00:14:06.520and a little bit of cynicism I think is mixed in in youth as well and I think with that you have
00:14:12.600this perfect cocktail for wanting to be a leftist we are searching for value or searching for a
00:14:19.880fight at least I certainly was at that age and it was served to me on a silver platter not only do
00:14:26.920you have something to fight but it's given to you by virtue of being born the way that you're born
00:14:30.520so here's the fight here's what you have to do and the only way that you get through this is by
00:14:35.520going out and convincing other people to be activists towards this cause. So it's extremely
00:14:40.520enticing. And then you couple that with a group of people who also wants to give you everything.
00:14:46.160We want you to have a free school. We want you to have universal basic income. We want to sort of
00:14:51.900even out the economy and make sure that there's no poverty and everybody's doing well and
00:14:56.040everybody's educated. And all of these things sound wonderful. Plus they give you a fight to
00:15:01.220fight. So I think that's why young people love leftism. Conservatism or even going through and
00:15:08.080trying to find objective truths is a lot harder to do. And it's a lot less fun. It's definitely
00:15:14.160not as cool to hear that you don't have as many problems and you don't have sort of a crutch to
00:15:19.180stand on for where you're at in life. But also, I mean, if you look at the history of the United
00:15:25.060States, it's not great. Like a lot of histories or actually every history of every country,
00:15:29.800there's been inequality, there's been racism. So isn't there a kernel of truth to these people's
00:15:34.520arguments? Yes. So I talk a lot about where woke ideas come from and how they sort of become
00:15:43.020courses essentially at college that you can now take. And a lot of people will say, well, how
00:15:47.980dare, how could you be against critical race theory? They're teaching it at Yale, they're
00:15:50.940teaching it at Harvard, things like that. And it's because these ideas start with a very strong
00:15:56.120a moral impulse. I think a lot of people who are anti-woke get one thing in particular wrong,
00:16:01.960and it's that these people sort of lack a strong sense of morality or that they are inherently
00:16:06.660immoral. That's not the case at all. In fact, they're very strongly driven by their moral
00:16:12.000impulses. And when you look at America's history and the transgressions that have been committed,
00:16:18.280a lot of people have moral impulses towards those things. And they go, absolutely,
00:16:21.760that is a horrible thing that should have never happened. And of course, we need to take some form
00:16:26.860of reparative measures. And that's what woke leftists think they're doing now. The only issue
00:16:31.720is they tend to skew to the most radical form of prescription that you could possibly give to
00:16:39.800a problem like racism or sexism. Instead of saying, this thing is wrong, and we should call
00:16:46.660out people when they do it, and there should maybe be social repercussions for somebody who
00:16:51.000is racist or sexist, they skew all the way over to the left and say, well, if you are white,
00:16:56.800you are inherently racist. If you are a man, you are inherently sexist. And we learn this
00:17:01.440throughout our history. So they use the kernels of truth to make a much broader claim that people
00:17:07.720fall for. And what are these kernels of truth, Amela? Yeah, I mean, we went through quite a long
00:17:15.760history of slavery in this country. And after freeing the enslaved, we went through a Jim
00:17:22.760Crow era where we still could not manage to legally prescribe equality to our society.
00:17:28.080We went through a period of time where women couldn't vote. They were not enticed to get
00:17:34.720educations or have jobs. There are certain disparities among people based on their race,
00:17:42.440their age, their size, all of these things exist and should be discussed and talked about.
00:17:48.820And it's funny, we fight on the prescription for how we solve these things, but we also fight on
00:17:55.420whether or not we're willing to acknowledge. And I think everybody should acknowledge that these
00:17:59.200transgressions have existed throughout our history. It's not a wrong thing to say. In fact,
00:18:04.540acknowledging the transgressions should be a fulfilling thing because we also acknowledge
00:18:10.060the progress that we've made out of them. You know what's weird to me, Amala? I wasn't born
00:18:16.420here in the UK. I'm from Russia originally. I don't know what your family background is. I
00:18:21.060imagine you were born in the US. But you probably know that the things that you were talking about,
00:18:25.940not in an identical way, but they happened in every country. I mean, I talk about it in my
00:18:33.140book. Slavery was pretty common everywhere. And actually, the British Empire was the first to end
00:18:39.600it as opposed to being the worst of the culprits and so on. So do you have any insight into why
00:18:46.220our societies in particular have become so self-flagellating? And instead of looking at
00:18:53.120those things that we've just discussed in a kind of, well, that's history. Thank God we're not
00:18:59.240there anymore. Let's be grateful approach, which is my view of it, really. We sort of go, no, no,
00:19:05.760we're all terrible and we must beat ourselves up endlessly about it.
00:19:09.820Yeah, I wish I knew why our society in particular chose to take that route. I would like to say
00:19:17.000maybe it's we've become so comfortable and we don't have as many problems here that we are
00:19:21.960now trying to find them. And we've looked to history to do that. But there's a lot of other
00:19:26.160countries who are just as comfortable as we are here in the US. I think our academic structure
00:19:32.820is maybe different than other countries. And a lot of these ideas, when you trace them back to
00:19:37.480their roots are going back to the sixties and seventies where, you know, you, you, you essentially
00:19:42.520had college students writing theories and, and, uh, writing theories about these ideas of critical
00:19:49.620race theory or, or critical feminism. And then these journals are published and reviewed and
00:19:55.360published and reviewed. And eventually they become tenured professors and they're teaching classes
00:19:59.140like that. And I think maybe our structure in academia or our system here has given way to
00:20:06.240these issues. But I can't really pin down why America has so much guilt towards its history
00:20:14.100and other countries don't. No, you identified a couple of very good points. One is comfort,
00:20:19.400the other, indoctrination in school. You put those two together. You're going to get some
00:20:24.420pretty powerful results. Yeah. When I was first going through this journey of finding people
00:20:30.240whose ideas really resonated with me, I found a man by the name of Yuri Bezmenov, which I'm sure
00:20:36.260you're probably both familiar with. And he did several speeches on ideological subversion and
00:20:42.180how it starts with education. And his videos, if the people listening have not seen them,
00:20:48.940please go and watch them because I think there's no better description of what is happening right
00:20:54.400And he claims that it starts in education. So maybe that's the root cause.
00:20:59.940Amala, do you think as well it's social media, especially when you look at during the pandemic, what happened when we were all effectively locked in our homes and we mainline social media and into our eyeballs for 18 hours a day?
00:21:14.260No wonder that social justice and all these organizations rose to prominence.
00:21:20.520yeah it is it's crazy how bad you will think the world is if you're on social media it's
00:21:26.620unbelievable i'm of the opinion that we should not be as hooked into news as we are it's sort
00:21:34.000of unbelievable if we break down on a scale how many sad happy it doesn't even matter uh the the
00:21:41.360sort of emotion behind the stories but how many stories we are hearing on a daily basis how often
00:21:45.960we are looking at other people's faces on a daily basis, how often we are seeing our own faces
00:21:51.020mirrored back to us on a daily basis. I don't think any of this is particularly helpful or
00:21:56.140healthy for the human mind. And social media, I mean, we've studied and researched as far as we
00:22:02.540know now, because it's a relatively new thing on the human brain, is deteriorating young minds
00:22:09.400in particular. You have not only this influx of stories that you're hearing all the time,
00:22:15.780which can make you think the world is a lot worse than it actually is, but you also have
00:22:20.760comparing your life to other lives, and young women in particular are really susceptible to
00:22:27.240developing mental health issues due to that, and social media is also working on a cycle of
00:22:33.400glamorizing, fetishizing, oppression, mental health problems, and you go farther on social
00:22:41.600media, the more unique you are. And it's unfortunate that not everybody can be the
00:22:45.760most unique person in the world, but we can all try to emulate and sort of absorb the things we're
00:22:52.480seeing on social media. And unfortunately, I think we're absorbing some of the worst bits of what's
00:22:57.340on the internet. And anecdotally, looking at your own generation, in particular women, what have you
00:23:03.980seen? I mean, with young women on the internet, I think it's really changed everything. The
00:23:12.500internet used to be, at least social media in particular, used to be a sort of highlight reel
00:23:16.780of your life. And everybody, for the most part, knew it was fake. You're not on the beach every
00:23:21.200day. You just took 50 photos and now you're posting them. And you're not really living
00:23:26.280this glamorous life. And you and your boyfriend are so in love, but I saw you guys fighting last
00:23:30.440weekend at the football game, stuff like that. But now social media is just how many pieces of
00:23:36.360myself can I put on the internet? And we're sort of mining all the bits of us that we feel we can
00:23:42.500commercialize to other people. And young women, when they're going through just their formative
00:23:50.160years, I went through it, being exposed to social media can just fry your brain. You're seeing
00:23:55.220people who look nothing like you, who are getting all of this attention. You see just basically an
00:24:03.660algorithm that's telling you what is valuable and just how valuable it is. And you start applying
00:24:09.900yourself to your own social media accounts and seeing what bits of you people take to and what
00:24:15.840bits of you people don't. And essentially you're creating metrics for your personality and who you
00:24:20.620are as an individual. And young women right now are struggling way more than they ever had with
00:24:27.220suicidal ideation, with different mental health comorbidities. And I struggle to think that
00:24:35.320social media is not a deeply set part of that problem. Yeah. Particularly when we look at young
00:24:45.020women and what's happened to them. It always shocks me when I see women of your age, Amela,
00:24:50.780and they've got Botox. Why have you got Botox? Why have you got lip fillers? You are in the
00:24:56.140flush of youth. The last thing you need is to freeze parts of your face so you don't get wrinkles.
00:25:02.680That to me, it strikes me as awful. Yeah, it's crazy. And I live in LA, so it's like every woman,
00:25:10.340every woman is, it's just so normal. I'm like, oh, what are you doing this Saturday? Oh, you know,
00:25:14.340I'm going to get Botox or I'm going to get filler. And there's a long line of girls all doing the
00:25:18.060same and they're all in their early twenties. And we've just, it's grown so normal when you go on
00:25:25.800social media and you see people who are using face filters or their Instagram models, and they've
00:25:31.400gotten all this work done. You think, oh, well, why shouldn't I do the same? And in fact, it's
00:25:35.300greatly encouraged. I can't tell you how many videos that I see of women saying, if you need
00:25:40.640a sign to go get Botox. Here's your sign to do it today. Look at my face. It's so beautiful.
00:25:46.340And it sucks that women are so obsessed with aging and something that's going to happen
00:25:54.240naturally. And it sucks that we cannot take on aging as something that is beautiful and something
00:26:00.500that should be celebrated. We're celebrating all the wrong things. And in fact, reinforcing
00:26:06.300what feminists claim to be against. It's this idea that beauty is something that needs to be
00:26:11.900held onto, or beauty is something that you cannot keep if you age naturally. And it's just so,
00:26:17.820so harmful. And I can't imagine having a young daughter in this day and age who is looking up
00:26:23.980and seeing all of these standards that they're somehow supposed to meet naturally, but can never
00:26:28.340do that. And do you think that's part of the reason as well that you kind of drifted to the
00:26:34.580right? When you look at the things that are being espoused by society, and a lot of the time,
00:26:42.120but also by people on the left, you know, that you can be whatever you want. You can change your
00:26:46.160gender. You can change this. You can change that. And the reality is, is they're denying biology.
00:26:52.380They're denying human nature. And then it's a denial of nature itself.
00:26:57.340Yes. The denial of truth was a big mover for me in changing my viewpoint on a lot of different
00:27:04.440subjects. And it's also the fact that there's so much hypocrisy in that statement of you can be
00:27:10.900whoever you want to be when you really get down to the root of how they are implementing this in
00:27:15.100their own lives. If you look into leftism and you look into it deeply, and especially identity
00:27:19.840politics, you will find that there is no space to be whoever it is that you want to be. There is no
00:27:24.680space to think whatever it is that you want to think. And in fact, they are hellbent on pushing
00:27:30.040people into boxes. I felt no greater racism than going on the internet and saying, I am a
00:27:37.640conservative. It was unbelievable how quickly people jumped to me and said, well, you're a
00:27:43.060female. You couldn't possibly be conservative. You're half black. You couldn't possibly be
00:27:46.860conservative. This is the box that is created for those identity markers. And we must jam you
00:27:51.780into that box. And if you do not fit, you are alienated. You are no longer a part of the club.
00:27:57.100So as much as they say everybody's special and unique and they can be whoever they want to be, they don't think that at all. And they think there's no greater, I guess, social experiment to prove that that is the case than what's happening right now with gender.
00:28:11.880If you look at somebody like Dylan Mulvaney, who came up in that Matt Walsh video, who we've both been talking about quite a bit, Dylan Mulvaney is a feminine man.
00:28:20.440It's as simple and plain as that, but because he's expressed himself femininely, they say, well, you must now shove yourself into the box that is womanhood, and we must now claim you as a woman, we must call you she and her, and this is the box that you now fit in.
00:28:34.960I'm pretty sure Dylan is quite happy to be shoved in that box. I think Dylan is desperate to get in that box.
00:28:40.880He really is. I think he's proven that time and time again, but the, the, the issue still stands.
00:28:46.820There's no, I get your point completely. And, um, you know, it's the denial, the whole, I mean,
00:28:54.800if you're, if you're a fan of Thomas Sowell, the whole idea of nature, he's written extensively
00:28:58.940about how the left and the right see that very differently. Um, and I'm curious with you living
00:29:05.120in LA. Do you have any friends? I do. I have managed to find friends. I've got some brilliant
00:29:14.800friends, some of whom I've met through PragerU, others who I've met just through moving to the
00:29:19.360city, met my boyfriend here in LA somehow. I just think I've been very lucky. No, it's funny.
00:29:25.480The reason I ask is a very good friend of ours called Bridget Fetasy, who you probably have
00:29:30.180heard of um when we traveled around america last year we did a whole trip and we went to uh we went
00:29:36.420to virginia and washington and new york and a bunch of places and everywhere we went there's
00:29:41.060gigantic american flags all over the place loads of houses have them outside and then we got to
00:29:47.160bridget's house and she had this like tiny little american flag in the corner of a little bit of a
00:29:52.640door and and i went that's california patriotism you have a flag but it is about this big in a
00:29:58.080corner because you can't you can't have the big one no yeah you're 100 right most of the people
00:30:03.080who i meet who watch my content here in la i i can see them because they kind of walk up to me
00:30:09.300and they whisper that they that they like what i have to say or that they follow me on instagram
00:30:14.320you can't say anything too loud you have a lot of quiet friends here in los angeles
00:30:19.100but surely amela it's going to come to a point with la we're in san francisco when you look
00:30:27.900around and you go this can't carry on this is this is insanity I like to think that's gonna
00:30:35.460happen I don't know I really don't know it's crazy to watch as things just deteriorate and people
00:30:42.620I don't know if they're not making the connection between what they're voting for and what's
00:30:48.100happening in their city or if they just simply cannot bring themselves to you know tick the
00:30:54.060ballot box of somebody who they they feel they fundamentally disagree with i don't know that
00:30:58.800it's going to change and all the conversations that i have with people who are supporting the
00:31:02.540stuff that's happening in la it's kind of like they just turn a blind eye to to the destruction
00:31:09.220and you would think like yuri vesmanov says you you don't really recognize it until the military
00:31:16.260boot kicks you in the ass the military boot is kicking them in the ass here and they're not
00:31:20.600making the connection. I don't know. I don't know how long this lasts for. You should be the person
00:31:25.400who has the answer to this, because I guess the question would be four years ago, if someone had
00:31:30.560said to you, look around, you know, there's drug addicts who are not getting the help they need,
00:31:35.900sleeping on the streets, being sexually assaulted, spreading disease to each other and the rest of
00:31:41.180the population, like all of that. Surely, Amala, you're against that as a woke activist. Surely
00:31:46.240you want those people to be better, right? So what would your answer have been?
00:31:51.520I think I would have found a way to blame it on the people who I disagree with.
00:31:55.220I really think I would have managed. I was really good at just running my mouth and twisting words.
00:32:05.020And I think that's exactly what I would. I probably would have spun it and said, you know,
00:32:08.840the income disparity is created by conservatives and we need to tax the rich. And that's what's
00:32:14.220going to help these people who are impoverished and who are you know doing drugs on the street
00:32:18.580I would have found a way knowing myself but you know it kind of like I said there's got to be a
00:32:26.280point because there are a couple of days ago Guy Pearce came out the famous Hollywood actor who
00:32:31.460actually I'm a massive fan of I love his work and he came out and went look you know shouldn't actors
00:32:40.400be able to play all different types of roles?
00:33:13.880And then obviously, you know, the might of all the people who came out
00:33:21.680and were just saying he's this, he's that, he's whatever else.
00:33:24.580And he had to make a groveling apology, as they all do.
00:33:28.240But you look at it, and again you go, surely,
00:33:33.360even an opinion as reasonable as this one,
00:33:36.480which is shared by, I would say, probably 98% of the population, and it's deemed to be incorrect,
00:33:45.080this isn't sustainable. It's not. It's certainly not sustainable. And I don't know exactly how it
00:33:51.420falls apart. I think a lot of it is going to be with sort of exactly what you just described,
00:33:56.400them eating each other alive. Because with liberal people, center people, right-leaning people,
00:34:03.560For the most part, there's room. There's quite a bit of room for disagreement within their respective camps. With wokeism, there isn't. And that was where I felt a lot of pressure myself and felt pushed away by them to answer the questions that I had, because I would maybe raise my hand and go, oh, wait a second, you know, maybe open borders doesn't sound like the best solution to the problems we're talking about here.
00:34:26.080And you are chastised to hell. I mean, it's crazy to even the amount of pressure you feel to completely be subservient to everything that they say and to toe the line. And I can imagine that that pressure can be a lot. And it's a big weight for a lot of people who would self-describe as woke leftists.
00:34:46.900And I think it has to be personal for you to change your mind. And often that personal experience that people have is being canceled or feeling that pressure of having a dissident opinion and maybe not being able to verbalize it or when you verbalize it, going through the attacks that you feel.
00:35:03.140So I think that is part of how this falls apart, but it's also going to fall apart in just the chaos that we're experiencing in cities. It's unfortunate that that doesn't happen, however, until it hits the backyard of legislators.
00:35:18.300In San Francisco, we saw Mayor London Breed go, you know, the crime has gotten too crazy and we need to do something about it.
00:35:24.280And we need to reinforce our police officers when she was one of the main pushers of the defund the police.
00:35:29.480But it wasn't until the crime hit her her side of town that she had to say something about it.
00:35:35.580And that's the unfortunate part of all of this. You have to feel the failing.
00:35:39.640Yes. And another unfortunate part of it is how racist it all is.
00:35:44.900You see white liberals, and they're not liberals,
00:35:48.420but let's just call them what they would identify as.
00:36:13.060So I said before, the most racism I've ever experienced was after coming out as a conservative, and I cannot press that enough.
00:36:22.320So I grew up in a really small rural conservative town, was surrounded by mainly white people, was subscribed completely to this idea of racism and white people being inherently racist, but had never experienced an ounce of it.
00:36:37.060I come out as a conservative, and suddenly every single piece of racist rhetoric that is typically ascribed to conservatives was hurled at me. I mean, I was called a house Negro. I was told that I would always be seen as an N-word no matter what I did. I was told that I was an Uncle Tom, a coon.
00:36:55.060And of course, this is the same experience of Larry Elder, of Tom Sowell, of Candace Owens, of anybody who chooses to come out and say these things.
00:37:02.760If you want to really experience or get as close to the Jim Crow experience as possible, be a black person that comes out as a conservative and you will experience it instantly.
00:37:14.440I'm like, can I ask you something about like your earlier years?
00:37:18.200Because you mentioned growing up in a, in a mostly white, small conservative town.
00:37:22.580You said you're raised by the white side of your family, right?
00:37:36.200Like how, how are you then able in that situation to think that, you know, all white people are inherently racist when you've got a white mom.
00:37:44.440who, who, who got together with a black guy and who's raising a mixed race daughter. Presumably
00:37:50.600she wasn't calling you the N word in your crib, right? Right, right. No, my mom never called me
00:37:55.400the N word just for the record. So yeah, my mom of course is a, she's a white ally, but it's
00:38:03.080interesting when I, when I was working with all of these white people, including my mother at this
00:38:08.460organization, they feel so much white guilt that they themselves feel there's no way to sort of
00:38:15.860separate themselves from the history of white people. And although it might not take form as
00:38:24.500blatant racism towards black people, they may have black friends, they may marry a black person and
00:38:29.260have biracial kids, they still recognize things like unconscious bias, or say, you know, that they
00:38:34.840can still be fall victim to prejudice against people of color or maybe have some internalized
00:38:41.080ideas towards people of color. So there's always just a little kernel still left there to be able
00:38:46.940to push the narrative that white people are inherently racist. But what about you? Like,
00:38:52.740you've got a white mom and you believe that all white people are. So your mom is inherently racist.
00:38:59.060Yeah, I mean, I can tell you I didn't look into these ideas too deeply.
00:39:04.840definitely say that, uh, which is why they fell apart whenever I was pressed on them.
00:39:10.320I, what is so enticing about leftism is not only that you don't have to look into the idea so
00:39:17.540deeply, but also you are safeguarded in somewhat of a cultish manner that you have no obligation
00:39:24.700to defend those ideas. And that in fact, the, the very act of trying to challenge somebody
00:39:31.220on those beliefs is an act of racism, is an act of sexism. So all I had to do was when people were
00:39:38.200asking me questions about this, go, oh, you're racist just for asking me that. You're sexist
00:39:42.200just for asking me that question. And you're encouraged to make those accusations and to not
00:39:47.820talk to people who you disagree with. Yeah. You've talked and you've mentioned the fact that you're
00:39:54.340a conservative. What does conservatism mean to you? Because the thing is, with all these labels,
00:39:59.740they actually mean something very different to different people like someone will say
00:40:04.060I'm conservative and you know what you ask a conservative in this country their chances are
00:40:09.860they're pro-gay marriage and they're anti-gun now if you do that in the United States that
00:40:14.740kind of means you're a democrat yeah it's interesting and I I sort of came out of the
00:40:20.640gate when I had this transformation and went okay well I actually fell for the same problem that I
00:40:27.540had when I was a leftist where I said, well, if I'm not a leftist, then I must be a conservative.
00:40:30.760And I sort of went really hard on that and said, well, if these people are wrong, then these people
00:40:36.980must be right. And now I'm sort of floating in this space of, okay, do I identify as conservative
00:40:44.180or am I just right-leaning on an issue-by-issue basis? And I'm totally honest in saying that
00:40:50.120that's something that I'm still exploring. I mean, for the most part, I am anti-feminist as far as
00:40:55.740modern-day feminism is concerned. I am pro-gun and pro-Second Amendment. I am pro-gay marriage.
00:41:01.780So that's a point for the left-leaning end of things. And I'm just going through all these
00:41:07.200issues. And I guess why I said right of center at the beginning is that I feel I'm socially and
00:41:12.940fiscally to the right when it comes to American politics. Okay. And what does that mean? Let's
00:41:20.500dig a little deeper. What does that mean socially and fiscally? So, so socially, I guess it means
00:41:26.560rejecting a lot of the woke narratives and the identity of politics. I don't prescribe myself
00:41:33.280to the idea of oppression in this country. Socially, I am pro Second Amendment, which is a strong
00:41:40.780issue. I happen to be pro-life with some exceptions when it comes to abortion, which is a recent
00:41:50.000topic uh socially with feminism i'm very much against all of the the rhetoric there i'm trying
00:41:58.180to think what other what other common social issues are we going back and forth with uh
00:42:03.480you know what's interesting that other than the gun thing which is obviously a big divider in your
00:42:09.260country all of those things until about three minutes ago would have put you bang in the middle
00:42:14.320of politics in America and in the UK, actually.
00:43:16.600Because in many ways, I think, in being anti-woke,
00:43:21.220I did at some point get pigeonholed into conservatism.
00:43:24.360And sometimes you'll say things, and I'm sure you get this as well,
00:43:27.620where maybe conservatives will follow you
00:43:29.460because you have your certain stance on gender.
00:43:32.360And then you say something else, and it's like the roof is blown off
00:43:35.300because you're not fully subscripted to everything.
00:43:37.880Every week. Yeah, that happens every week.
00:43:39.480so that's that's an issue that i've gone through i congratulated dave rubin on having children uh
00:43:47.120through through surrogacy and that was like how dare you call yourself a conservative and this
00:43:51.880this happens so i'm honestly i think going to move to just an anti anti-label future and just
00:43:58.740let people deal with it it's crazy to me because i'm i'm a big supporter and fan of russell brand
00:44:03.620And I watch all the videos that he puts out. He's now called a far right extremist. And I just cannot fathom how anybody would make that characterization for him. So I think exactly what you said is right.
00:44:15.860Yeah. I suppose the challenge for you, if I can say so, might be that you have locked yourself into PragerU, which is a conservative organization. Nothing wrong with that. But you are kind of attached, aren't you?
00:44:29.360Yeah, I mean, I think I am free to express all the things that I've expressed today are the same things that I express on my show. I think they just happen to have that conservative label on their organization. I feel for the most part, with what Preview puts out, it very much resonates with me.
00:44:48.800So I don't know that I've been necessarily stuck with the label itself or that people see that from me.
00:44:58.700For the most part, when I'm meeting people or talking to people, I meet a really wide range of different ideological backgrounds and leanings.
00:45:36.680Yeah, like I said, they've completely switched.
00:45:38.740I mean, leftism, if you look back on what it was in maybe the 1970s,
00:45:42.320I was like, oh yeah, pro-skepticism, anti-establishment, you know, you are skeptical of government entities and you probably don't want it to grow beyond the point that it's at now. Oh yeah, that sounds like a leftist to me. I think I'd be able to get behind that, but it's just shifted and morphed. And I think as they pull farther left, the people, anybody who's on the other end is going to pull farther to the other side.
00:46:06.420And that's where they're actually going to run into some issues, because I can't imagine what a right-leaning equivalent would look like to some of the stuff that they're managing to pull off today.
00:46:17.520And I don't want to see that, quite frankly.
00:46:20.220Do you think America needs more political parties, Amala?
00:46:30.420It's so weird, because I don't know that it needs more political parties or just no political parties.
00:46:35.420I don't know how how I would go about doing this. Our founding fathers directly warned against the creation of political parties, George Washington in particular, and said and basically prophesied that it was going to lead to these tribalistic issues.
00:46:51.080and it essentially just becomes, you know, cogs in a wheel that are just stuck and they're never
00:46:57.780going to move anywhere, which is where we're at right now. And where our conversation comes about
00:47:04.080defining leftism, defining liberalism, defining conservative, these are major problems because
00:47:09.880most people sit in the middle on any particular given issue. But now we're in this sort of split
00:47:18.500case of left versus right or Democrat versus Republican. And people feel the need to go for
00:47:23.440the side that best represents how they feel on what, 10 different issues. So I don't know if I'm
00:47:29.520just anti all political parties like our founding fathers were. I guess in the system that we're in
00:47:35.340now, the necessity would be to create more because I don't think there's any way that we are going to
00:47:42.220break down the two-party system that we're in right now.
00:47:46.000And there's no better example of an issue on which actually there is that level of polarization and a complete lack of consensus than the Second Amendment and guns, which you brought up.
00:47:56.520And obviously there was this terrible shooting recently. And this is, by the way, when we were in America, we went to the gun range and shot some guns.
00:48:05.520We went to a big gun show. I always said I'm happy to live in Britain where we don't have private ownership of handguns other than for hunting.
00:48:13.620But if I lived in America, most places in America,
00:48:17.580I probably wouldn't have a gun in central New York.
00:51:20.420Yeah, I know what you mean. And it's a difficult issue. But I think I think you make the point. You make the right point, which is on a practical level, given the number of people that have to agree to to amend the Constitution.
00:51:35.660It's just not it's not a whether people whatever the rights and wrongs of it are, it's just not going to happen. Right. Right. Right. And it's I mean, economically, the government has no incentive to do something like that.
00:51:46.140And I think just the amount of, you know, the common arguments, the bad men with the guns who are running rampant in specifically our metropolitan areas, people want to protect themselves.
00:52:00.000And for the most part, law abiding gun owners are not necessarily the problem.
00:52:07.420I don't know about the case of this national shooter because I don't know that that what's come out there.
00:52:11.700I certainly think with issues of mental illness and people being assessed as a harm to themselves or a harm to others, there certainly needs to be stricter laws.
00:52:21.080I am certainly for stricter laws as far as gun control is concerned.
00:52:25.940And I don't think we should be in this frivolous society where you could just go anywhere and get anything at any given moment.
00:52:32.880Does it worry you, Amala, the divisions in your country, the fact that everyone has to pick a team, the fact that everyone has to pick a side,
00:52:40.540when the reality is most people don't care that much about politics and nor should they,
00:52:45.740because as we all know, there are far more important things in life.
00:52:49.260Why are we being forced to pick a team continually?
00:52:54.060Why are we being forced to pick a team continually?
00:52:58.000It's tough because where politics doesn't matter on a day-to-day basis,
00:53:03.320it is starting to affect people's daily lives a lot more.
00:53:08.340The reason that we're talking about these gender issues is because now we got like kids talking about sex and sexuality in school and developing mental health issues or trying to transition.
00:53:18.500So in the grand scheme, I think a lot of people think, oh, well, politics doesn't matter all that much.
00:53:24.320But politics and culture are great movers for social change and change in our daily lifestyles.
00:53:31.160So I think that's why people are polarized and asked to choose.
00:53:35.660Am I frightened a little bit about the amount of division? A little, a little bit. Sometimes I'm going to give out speeches and I think, OK, what does security look like at this event and what's going to happen? And somebody needs to keep an eye on things. So nobody should feel like that in doing the work that we do. And it seems as though everybody does. So I'm certainly concerned. I don't know what necessarily the solution is for breaking down the tribalism, though.
00:54:03.760Well, I think you're doing it, actually, which is it's honest inquiry, being prepared to change your mind, being able to see where people are coming from, trying to meet them where they're at and being honest with yourself.
00:54:14.820Because I think it's very, very tempting, as you talked about, the moment you realize that you are not you don't fit in the environment in which we found the same thing.
00:54:25.380We were two comedians in an extremely woke comedy industry from which, unlike the United States, there's no escape.
00:54:32.140There's one industry. And if you if you fall foul of that, there's no way for you to go unless you want to go to to another country.
00:54:39.720And once that happens, it's very tempting, as you say, to go to the other side and be like, oh, these guys have all the answers.
00:54:45.700But when you go there, you find out they really, really don't.
00:54:48.380And so I think honest inquiry of the type that you are engaged in and we try to engage in is the way to go.
00:54:54.800Listen, it's been an absolute pleasure chatting with you.
00:54:57.180We're going to ask you a few questions from our local supporters that only they will get to see the answer to.
00:55:02.140and they're always brilliant. But before we let you go, what is the one thing that we're not
00:55:06.860talking about as a society that you think we really should be? I think I'm going to go with
00:55:13.300this. I've been mulling it over. Relationships are very important. Familial, friendships,
00:55:17.640all of these just deeply set relationships that you can build in your life are really
00:55:21.140important and people should be focusing on that regardless of their political ideology. I get
00:55:25.900asked, I guess the most when I'm doing interviews is how is the relationship between you and your
00:55:30.680mom now, you're on two different sides of the spectrum. How is this working? And I tell people
00:55:35.700we are closer than we've ever been because we've decided that that is not the most important part
00:55:40.140of our relationship. And so many people now, I think, feel lonely where they're at. And that's
00:55:46.340also what is pushing forward this political divide. It's social media. It's a lack of
00:55:51.200relationships. It's a lack of human interaction and deep human interaction. So prioritize that