TRIGGERnometry - The Real History of Islam with Raymond Ibrahim

00:00:00.800 It's not Islam, it's Islam, and it's not Muslim, it's Muslim.

00:00:05.140 And the two words are connected, and what that means is submit or surrender.

00:00:09.080 You know, how did it go from this guy who was just sitting in a cave?

00:00:13.420 They've conquered most of what was the old Roman world.

00:00:17.540 66%, let's say, of the original Christian world.

00:00:21.320 Where are these Islamic radicals?

00:00:23.100 Where are they?

00:00:23.740 Yeah.

00:00:25.040 Everywhere.

00:00:26.400 The UK's problems, man, they're just kind of mind-boggling.

00:00:30.420 Your Islam problem is less about Muslims, and it's more about the people who are enabling

00:00:35.120 and empowering and bringing them in against your will.

00:00:37.900 I mean, I see in the UK radical Muslims screaming, you know, like actual Islamic jihadist stuff,

00:00:44.320 and they don't get in trouble.

00:00:45.420 But then when a British person fights back, they get arrested.

00:00:48.600 Do you think the religion of Islam is compatible with the West?

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00:01:53.220 Raymond Ibrahim, welcome to Trichonometry.

00:01:55.160 Happy to be with you guys.

00:01:56.400 Thanks.

00:01:57.020 It's super cool having you on.

00:01:58.380 We've been looking forward to this for a long time.

00:02:01.000 You are someone who's written a bunch of books, particularly about the Islam and the interaction

00:02:05.620 between Islam and Christianity.

00:02:08.320 And the most interesting thing to start with, I think, is to talk about how Islam comes into being.

00:02:14.980 It doesn't exist.

00:02:15.880 Christians and Jews have existed for hundreds of years at this point.

00:02:18.840 Tell us about the start of Islam.

00:02:21.220 Sure.

00:02:21.580 So, as usual, especially nowadays, there's different approaches to history and there's conspiracy theories, etc.

00:02:27.940 So, what I'm going to give you is the traditional account of the coming of Islam, which Muslims believe,

00:02:32.600 and which Christians and non-Muslims in general also believe, and they have for centuries.

00:02:36.720 And I only tell you this by way of preface because, as of late, there's a lot of attacks on the early historicity of Islam and Muhammad.

00:02:43.600 And did he exist?

00:02:44.580 Did he not exist?

00:02:45.680 Much of it, I think, is kind of polemical.

00:02:48.020 It's the same sorts of things that arose against Jesus, etc.

00:02:51.600 So, anyway, the standard theory or, sorry, the standard idea of the rise of Islam, of course, is tied up to the person of Muhammad, the prophet of Islam,

00:03:00.700 who's born around 570 AD in the Arabian Peninsula.

00:03:04.560 And by the time he's 40, around 610, he starts having revelations, as he calls it, by the angel Gabriel, who tells them,

00:03:14.980 Ikra, Ikra is the word we get Quran from, which means recite.

00:03:18.620 And so he supposedly starts reciting what becomes the Quran, the verses.

00:03:23.720 And this goes on year after year, for decades, actually.

00:03:27.380 And these are all, so now you have the Quran, it's supposedly based on that,

00:03:31.920 and you have surahs, which is essentially chapters made of ayahs, which are verses,

00:03:35.840 which he supposedly recited because Gabriel told him.

00:03:39.460 And these are supposed to be understood as the words of Allah, the God of Islam, of Arabia, the God.

00:03:46.900 In fact, the word Allah is Al-Ilah.

00:03:49.840 It's in Arabic, it really means God.

00:03:51.780 So it's, you know, when they translate it as God, that is not unfair.

00:03:56.020 I prefer using the, you know, the proper name Allah, because it's more distinct.

00:04:00.240 At any rate, so Muhammad does all this, and he starts reciting and telling the people around him,

00:04:05.920 the Arabians, who are by and large polytheists at this time.

00:04:09.600 Especially, he comes from the Quraysh tribe.

00:04:11.760 He starts, essentially, he tries to, he presents himself in a long line of the prophets that are,

00:04:18.880 everyone knows about, all the way from Abraham to Jesus, who, of course, is a prophet,

00:04:23.420 according to the Islamic tradition and according to Muhammad.

00:04:26.520 And anyway, so he preaches basically a sort of staunch monotheism.

00:04:30.460 And that's why, if you look at the Quran, there's a lot of things that, you know, Christians and Jews would find agreeable.

00:04:37.620 And then the important thing that we have to understand is that, because I told you, it goes on for year after year,

00:04:42.260 and it's in stages.

00:04:43.620 And so, it actually, the tone of what Gabriel is telling him to read kind of changes over time.

00:04:49.660 And it really, if you look at it, it depends, and if you want to look at it as a cynical non-believer,

00:04:54.980 or if you want to look at it as a pious believer, as a cynical non-believer who's trying to read between the lines,

00:04:59.560 who doesn't believe that Muhammad was necessarily being told to recite from God,

00:05:04.600 whether he made it up, or whether, you know, it was an evil spirit talking to him.

00:05:08.200 And these, of course, are the popular non-Muslim, especially Christian, understandings of what Muhammad was going through.

00:05:14.420 In fact, Muhammad himself, when he was first broached by Gabriel, thought it was a demon,

00:05:19.480 because it was sort of, it physically attacked him and squeezed him, and he was sweating,

00:05:24.120 and he had to go to his wife, Khadijah, and she told him, oh no, this is from God.

00:05:28.600 Okay, so even in the Islamic tradition itself, it's a little curious.

00:05:33.400 I'm sorry, let me interrupt you very briefly.

00:05:35.120 Who is Muhammad when he begins to receive these revelations?

00:05:39.680 He's just a, he's a camel driver, and he's part of the Qurish tribe,

00:05:43.620 which is kind of noble, but he's a lesser noble who's being, he's an orphan,

00:05:47.680 and he's being raised by his uncle.

00:05:50.100 And at this time, he's very relatively unknown and insignificant,

00:05:53.640 and he marries Khadijah, who's an older woman, and who is rich.

00:05:58.820 She's got wealth, she's got property, livestock,

00:06:01.740 and he starts essentially kind of working for her.

00:06:04.740 So that's, so he's relatively an insignificant, obscure person

00:06:08.820 in the larger scheme of things.

00:06:11.700 And that's why in the beginning, so what I was trying to say is,

00:06:14.820 there's, Muslims understand two stages.

00:06:18.200 He starts off in Mecca, this is where he's young, and where he's born,

00:06:21.880 and where he grows up, and this is where he starts getting his early revelations.

00:06:25.460 So from, let's say, 610, 622, those 12 years,

00:06:29.400 it's what's called, when you look at the Quran,

00:06:31.080 these are known as the Meccan verses.

00:06:33.320 And at this time, Muhammad is essentially, as I just said,

00:06:36.140 he's insignificant, he's weak, he's preaching,

00:06:38.180 he's an itinerant preacher, and, you know,

00:06:40.740 he has like a handful of followers,

00:06:42.620 and over 10, 12 years, he has maybe 100 followers,

00:06:45.280 most of them are family.

00:06:46.240 And basically, so his message is not violent.

00:06:54.580 It's all about, it's all about, you have your religion,

00:06:57.820 I have my religion.

00:06:58.900 So when you get moderate Muslims, and they quote from the Quran,

00:07:01.640 there are, in fact, moderate verses that say,

00:07:04.860 there's no coercion.

00:07:05.820 which means there's no, literally, yeah,

00:07:09.380 you can't be coerced in matters of religion.

00:07:12.080 And, like I said, you have your religion, I have my.

00:07:14.560 So he was preaching that when he was weak and outnumbered,

00:07:17.120 because he had to,

00:07:18.520 because he had no military power whatsoever.

00:07:21.680 And then eventually, you know, due to his agitations,

00:07:24.140 apparently the Quraysh, the polytheists, drive him out,

00:07:26.680 and they mock him, you're not a real prophet,

00:07:28.400 you're making this up, you're a liar, etc.

00:07:29.640 And he ends up going to Medina, at the time, Yathrib.

00:07:34.680 And there he starts getting a bigger following.

00:07:37.640 And he becomes essentially a political leader now.

00:07:40.600 And this is so, this is called the Hijra,

00:07:42.420 in the year 622, and he goes to Yathrib.

00:07:45.320 And this becomes, it's so important in Islam,

00:07:47.880 because it becomes year one in the Islamic calendar, 622.

00:07:51.880 And he goes there and he becomes essentially a warlord.

00:07:54.540 Okay, and now he starts going on raids

00:07:56.600 against everyone who does not submit.

00:08:00.080 Okay, so Islam, you know,

00:08:02.040 unfortunately, I always end up pronouncing things

00:08:04.020 like an American.

00:08:05.100 It's not Islam, it's Islam.

00:08:07.200 And it's not Muslim, it's Muslim.

00:08:09.900 And the two words are connected, right?

00:08:11.920 A Muslim is one who does Islam.

00:08:14.320 So you see the S-L-M.

00:08:15.780 And what that means is submit or surrender.

00:08:18.280 Okay, so that was it.

00:08:19.460 So the one who is a Muslim is someone

00:08:21.540 who is submitting and surrendering to Muhammad's call.

00:08:25.120 Because if you didn't, you'd get killed at this point,

00:08:27.680 now that he's gone to Medina and he's become a warlord.

00:08:29.660 To Muhammad's call or to the glory of Allah?

00:08:32.700 Well, they're the same, aren't they?

00:08:34.120 Muhammad's presenting it as,

00:08:36.160 if you do what I say, you're doing God's will

00:08:38.740 because I'm the prophet.

00:08:39.960 I'm the last prophet who has come to correct.

00:08:42.960 And the other thing, he positioned himself as,

00:08:45.120 as the last prophet, meaning there's been

00:08:47.180 a succession of prophets from, like I said,

00:08:48.980 Abraham, Moses, et cetera, all the way to Jesus.

00:08:54.180 And, but the problem is Christians and Jews,

00:08:56.540 even though they were given scriptures,

00:08:58.060 they're known as the people of the book,

00:08:59.580 they've over the years distorted it.

00:09:01.840 So for example, when it comes to the person of Jesus,

00:09:04.480 he was just a prophet,

00:09:05.420 but the Christians made him into the son of God.

00:09:08.140 And so for example, in the Quran,

00:09:09.320 you actually have thundering verses

00:09:11.020 that are attacking Christians and calling them infidels

00:09:14.160 or kufar, which is a very bad designation

00:09:16.220 because they make Jesus to be the son of God,

00:09:19.240 as one example.

00:09:20.000 And then also attacks on the Trinity and so forth.

00:09:23.220 So he presents himself as,

00:09:25.080 I'm coming to basically straighten out the true religion,

00:09:28.460 which these Christians and Jews were handed,

00:09:30.520 but they've ruined it.

00:09:32.000 And that's why they say till today,

00:09:34.240 the Bible or the New Testament,

00:09:37.100 the Old Testament, whichever case has been,

00:09:39.040 Muslims claim, has been tampered with.

00:09:41.040 It's not the original.

00:09:42.540 Okay, and I gave you the perfect example about Jesus.

00:09:44.580 So they say that that's been added in later and so forth.

00:09:48.920 Anyway, so now he goes on the war path

00:09:51.460 and it becomes jihad, jihad.

00:09:53.720 And that's just a word which means to strive and to struggle.

00:09:57.420 And I always find that ironic

00:09:58.820 because it's the apologist for Islam.

00:10:01.220 Or let me go back a little bit.

00:10:03.500 Orientalists, back in the day,

00:10:05.200 Europeans, when they would translate the word jihad,

00:10:07.800 and they had to do this,

00:10:08.760 they would just usually translate it to holy war,

00:10:10.900 which was fair.

00:10:12.220 I mean, it's legitimate.

00:10:12.860 You can't, when you're translating words,

00:10:15.160 you can't just sit there and break it down

00:10:16.680 and get into the etymology.

00:10:17.980 So that's what they do.

00:10:18.980 But then the apologists lately say,

00:10:20.840 no, it doesn't mean that.

00:10:21.680 It means strive and struggle.

00:10:24.020 And it does.

00:10:25.500 But the irony is that actually makes it worse.

00:10:27.840 And it just shows you how multi-tentacle

00:10:29.480 the idea of jihad is.

00:10:31.220 Because, so yes, it does mean strive and struggle,

00:10:33.800 jihad, which was introduced again by Muhammad,

00:10:35.860 especially now in this final phase

00:10:38.480 when he's in Medina and he's on the war path.

00:10:41.240 But historically, the only way you can struggle,

00:10:44.300 and what is it you're trying to struggle and do?

00:10:46.420 Like you said, it's you're trying to bring Islamic rule.

00:10:49.620 You're trying to bring the glory of Allah, okay?

00:10:52.200 And the logic is,

00:10:53.900 and according to Islamic teaching till today,

00:10:56.300 Islam must continue to spread, including by force.

00:10:59.020 Not that you have to convert by force.

00:11:00.840 You're not supposed to force people to convert,

00:11:03.200 especially if they're people of the book,

00:11:05.080 because they're kind of close enough.

00:11:06.940 But Islamic law has to govern the whole globe.

00:11:09.840 And so if you are a Christian or a Jew,

00:11:11.600 you have to live in tribute, you know, pay tribute,

00:11:13.740 and you're like second-class citizen.

00:11:15.700 And if you're not, you do have to convert.

00:11:17.660 If you're a pagan, if you're a Buddhist or a Hindu,

00:11:20.160 theoretically, you're supposed to convert or die.

00:11:22.820 You can't even pay tribute.

00:11:24.420 So I just tell you that to give you the idea.

00:11:26.460 So when they do jihad,

00:11:27.960 and they say it means to strive or struggle,

00:11:29.820 that makes it all the much worse,

00:11:32.660 because historically,

00:11:33.540 the only way you're going to spread Islam

00:11:34.860 was through force and violence.

00:11:37.020 Who's going to accept it?

00:11:38.500 You're not, in Europe, for example,

00:11:40.160 when the time came for the jihad to enter there,

00:11:43.620 you know, Europeans fought tooth and nail,

00:11:45.340 and I'm sure we'll get into that.

00:11:46.780 But today, of course,

00:11:49.300 you are able to trick people and empower Islam,

00:11:53.180 not through force.

00:11:54.660 So today you can do,

00:11:55.920 there's all these classifications

00:11:57.040 of different kinds of jihad,

00:11:58.640 which is different forms of struggle.

00:12:01.080 And they actually have,

00:12:02.020 I can give you quickly their names in Arabic,

00:12:04.420 you know,

00:12:04.920 jihad al-lisane,

00:12:06.120 jihad of the tongue,

00:12:07.380 jihad al-qalam,

00:12:08.640 jihad of the pen,

00:12:10.360 jihad al-mal,

00:12:11.420 jihad of the money,

00:12:13.100 you know,

00:12:13.700 wuladat al-jihad,

00:12:15.380 or basically the baby jihad.

00:12:17.400 All of these,

00:12:18.640 in their own way,

00:12:19.220 help empower Islam.

00:12:20.200 So with your mouth,

00:12:21.180 you can engage in propaganda.

00:12:22.940 With your money,

00:12:23.760 you can support disseminating Islam,

00:12:26.140 you can support terrorist groups.

00:12:28.000 And with your womb,

00:12:28.960 women are encouraged to have as many kids as they can,

00:12:31.160 Muslim women,

00:12:31.980 and men also,

00:12:32.920 to impregnate women,

00:12:34.440 including non-Muslim women,

00:12:35.520 with their seed.

00:12:36.440 So you can,

00:12:37.200 you know,

00:12:37.900 inundate the world with Muslims.

00:12:39.880 And these are actually,

00:12:40.820 this isn't me theorizing,

00:12:41.980 this is actually,

00:12:42.640 lots and lots of Islamic clerics

00:12:44.020 have modern-day clerics

00:12:45.460 articulated what I'm telling you right now.

00:12:48.340 And, you know,

00:12:49.320 obviously I jumped from Muhammad to this

00:12:50.680 to give you an idea of what jihad is.

00:12:52.700 But historically,

00:12:53.840 during his time,

00:12:54.460 you can't get away with that stuff.

00:12:55.860 You're not gonna,

00:12:57.020 through propaganda or lying,

00:12:58.840 trick anyone,

00:12:59.520 because everyone had their own faith

00:13:00.840 that they were gonna fight to the death for.

00:13:02.280 So,

00:13:03.220 he goes on the war path,

00:13:05.260 he wages jihad.

00:13:06.900 How much is he able to secure

00:13:09.500 in terms of land

00:13:10.620 by the time of his death?

00:13:12.540 Almost the whole of Arabia,

00:13:14.360 as we know it.

00:13:15.340 Yeah,

00:13:15.660 but I mean,

00:13:16.040 there's still,

00:13:16.820 it's funny too,

00:13:17.480 because a lot of them

00:13:18.360 just in the hinter regions,

00:13:20.200 not all of it,

00:13:20.900 but a big chunk of it.

00:13:22.020 And his ultimate goal was Mecca,

00:13:23.880 which, you know,

00:13:24.420 he was driven out

00:13:25.360 and then he came back

00:13:26.280 and he conquered it.

00:13:29.000 But,

00:13:29.500 a lot of the,

00:13:30.720 a lot of the hinter tribes

00:13:31.860 kind of gave paid lip service.

00:13:33.800 And,

00:13:34.260 and then once he died,

00:13:35.400 it was interesting

00:13:35.900 because what happened immediately

00:13:36.960 was the Riddha Wars,

00:13:38.260 which is known as

00:13:39.100 the Wars of the Apostasy.

00:13:40.540 Right when he died,

00:13:41.420 it was all these tribes,

00:13:42.960 especially that were away

00:13:44.040 from the center,

00:13:45.460 immediately kind of were like,

00:13:46.500 okay,

00:13:46.700 so the jig is up.

00:13:47.400 He's dead.

00:13:47.960 We're going back to our ways.

00:13:49.780 And the first Khalifa,

00:13:50.760 Abu Bakr,

00:13:51.740 waged another new jihad

00:13:53.140 against the apostates.

00:13:54.700 What does Khalifa mean?

00:13:56.060 Khalifa,

00:13:56.760 which Khalifa in Arabic

00:13:57.960 means successor.

00:13:59.180 Ah.

00:13:59.480 So he's the successor

00:14:00.400 of Muhammad.

00:14:02.280 And a caliphate

00:14:03.280 is a form of governance

00:14:04.880 based on the successors

00:14:06.220 of Muhammad.

00:14:06.760 Just come back to Muhammad

00:14:07.700 for one second

00:14:08.340 because

00:14:08.780 it's quite an extraordinary story.

00:14:11.560 A man,

00:14:13.180 not particularly anybody

00:14:15.400 really preaches

00:14:17.260 the revelations

00:14:18.520 that he's got,

00:14:19.780 gets chased out of the city

00:14:21.040 he's from,

00:14:21.540 goes to another city,

00:14:22.740 and then suddenly

00:14:23.900 he's a warlord

00:14:25.220 who effectively conquers

00:14:27.220 a huge swath of land.

00:14:28.960 What do we know

00:14:31.600 about Muhammad

00:14:32.260 that meant

00:14:33.420 that he was able

00:14:34.260 to do this?

00:14:35.420 Well,

00:14:35.860 I mean,

00:14:36.640 keep in mind,

00:14:37.340 by the time he dies,

00:14:38.340 it's not really

00:14:38.920 a huge swath of land.

00:14:40.020 We're talking about

00:14:40.640 the Arabian Peninsula,

00:14:41.700 which looks large,

00:14:42.740 but it's mostly desert.

00:14:43.800 Yeah.

00:14:44.020 And he has control

00:14:44.720 over various tribes.

00:14:46.580 And I think

00:14:47.060 what you're getting at

00:14:47.760 is ultimately,

00:14:48.340 it's not he himself.

00:14:50.120 I mean,

00:14:50.560 one century after Muhammad,

00:14:52.460 Islam now governs

00:14:53.600 all of North Africa,

00:14:54.660 all of the Middle East,

00:14:55.400 and is in the middle of France.

00:14:57.080 So that's the historical

00:14:58.980 kind of conundrum

00:15:00.340 that a lot of people

00:15:01.080 have been wondering about.

00:15:01.960 How did,

00:15:02.420 it does, of course,

00:15:03.300 start with Muhammad.

00:15:04.180 Yeah.

00:15:05.320 And, you know,

00:15:05.960 how did it go

00:15:06.480 from this guy

00:15:07.440 who was just

00:15:08.120 sitting in a cave

00:15:09.800 talking to Gabriel

00:15:11.240 to a century later

00:15:12.720 essentially

00:15:13.540 you know,

00:15:14.480 they've conquered

00:15:15.220 most of what was

00:15:16.680 the old Roman world

00:15:17.780 and most of it

00:15:18.580 on Christian territory

00:15:19.340 and even further east

00:15:20.340 into outside

00:15:21.260 of the Roman Christian world.

00:15:23.280 So that's always been

00:15:24.420 the great riddle.

00:15:25.800 And earlier historians,

00:15:27.480 including those

00:15:28.000 who were contemporary,

00:15:29.000 believe it had to do

00:15:30.100 with the fusion of jihad,

00:15:31.600 the doctrine of jihad.

00:15:32.860 Because up until then,

00:15:34.220 look, you had war.

00:15:35.500 People engaged in war.

00:15:36.720 Non-Muslims engaged in war.

00:15:38.520 Christians engaged in war.

00:15:40.040 But it had,

00:15:40.760 especially with Christians,

00:15:41.820 it became a just war type thing.

00:15:43.240 And there were limitations

00:15:44.220 to how you can do it.

00:15:46.160 But with Muhammad,

00:15:47.460 he basically,

00:15:48.660 what I always say

00:15:49.480 is the genius of Muhammad,

00:15:50.580 which goes to your question,

00:15:52.100 is that he basically fused

00:15:53.700 the sort of tribal mores

00:15:56.220 of his society

00:15:57.940 and re-articulated them

00:15:59.880 rather than fuse.

00:16:00.760 But he fused them

00:16:01.440 with theology

00:16:02.040 and re-articulated them

00:16:03.220 through sort of

00:16:04.340 a theological paradigm.

00:16:06.740 So they became,

00:16:07.500 okay,

00:16:07.700 so what is tribalism?

00:16:08.680 The tribalism of Arabia,

00:16:10.220 which also prevailed

00:16:11.340 in most tribal societies,

00:16:12.860 pastoral societies,

00:16:14.020 was basically,

00:16:15.280 what is tribalism?

00:16:16.020 It's me and my kin.

00:16:16.960 You know,

00:16:17.120 that's it.

00:16:17.600 Everyone outside of the tribe

00:16:18.860 is the enemy.

00:16:19.820 That's how tribalism works.

00:16:21.200 It's not that

00:16:21.800 we're not your friends.

00:16:22.620 You are the enemy.

00:16:23.400 You exist for me

00:16:24.120 to kill and plunder

00:16:24.900 and enslave

00:16:25.480 and do whatever with.

00:16:27.180 And the tribe,

00:16:29.000 of course,

00:16:29.340 you know,

00:16:29.460 the closest is,

00:16:30.720 you know,

00:16:31.480 the nuclear family

00:16:32.900 and then it keeps spreading,

00:16:33.840 you know,

00:16:34.080 cousins and whatever.

00:16:35.320 So it keeps growing.

00:16:37.000 What Muhammad did

00:16:38.140 is he maintained

00:16:39.160 that paradigm,

00:16:40.740 which was integral

00:16:41.580 to the Arab society

00:16:42.700 that he was born in.

00:16:44.140 But like I said,

00:16:45.040 he re-articulated

00:16:46.040 with these Islamic teachings.

00:16:47.520 So now,

00:16:48.680 so now you still hate people.

00:16:52.360 The Quran commands

00:16:53.180 Muslims to hate

00:16:54.580 not outside tribal people,

00:16:57.340 but anyone who's not a Muslim.

00:16:58.800 And you can see

00:16:59.300 how that's tribalistic

00:17:00.360 because we are the ummah,

00:17:02.200 right,

00:17:02.420 the nation,

00:17:03.300 we are the Muslims.

00:17:04.340 Everyone outside of it,

00:17:05.460 we are commanded to hate.

00:17:06.880 And this is in the Quran.

00:17:07.800 This is Quran 64

00:17:08.900 where Allah says

00:17:10.600 you have a good example

00:17:11.880 in Abraham or Ibrahim

00:17:13.840 because,

00:17:15.660 and so,

00:17:16.160 and this gives you

00:17:16.720 another really good example

00:17:17.840 of what I'm talking about,

00:17:18.540 how Islam appropriates

00:17:21.160 the biblical figures

00:17:22.560 but recasts them

00:17:23.980 in a way

00:17:24.500 that validates itself.

00:17:26.220 So they say,

00:17:26.980 so we know the Abraham

00:17:27.820 from the Old Testament

00:17:29.040 in the Bible,

00:17:30.220 he leaves what God calls him,

00:17:31.500 he leaves,

00:17:31.800 what is it,

00:17:32.180 the land of Ur

00:17:32.840 and, you know,

00:17:33.520 he begins the great migration

00:17:35.300 towards the Holy Land

00:17:37.640 which eventually gets conquered,

00:17:39.540 Joshua, etc.

00:17:41.240 But when he leaves Abraham

00:17:43.300 in the Bible,

00:17:43.900 there's nothing about hating anyone.

00:17:45.460 In the Quran,

00:17:46.200 all of a sudden,

00:17:47.240 Allah tells Muslims,

00:17:48.520 you have a good example

00:17:49.200 in Abraham

00:17:49.720 because he told his kin,

00:17:51.720 we hate you

00:17:52.480 and enmity will last between us

00:17:54.240 until you believe in Allah alone.

00:17:55.980 And so that became

00:17:56.940 sort of an Islamic,

00:17:57.760 like in the Quran,

00:17:58.720 it also says similar things

00:18:00.420 about how a true Muslim

00:18:01.720 can't,

00:18:02.440 hey,

00:18:02.660 he has to have these feelings

00:18:03.780 and disassociate from his father,

00:18:05.580 his mother,

00:18:06.040 his brother,

00:18:06.540 his wife.

00:18:07.980 I have an Islamic cleric recently

00:18:09.780 who I translated a while back

00:18:11.480 who literally says

00:18:12.540 because of this doctrine,

00:18:13.480 you can,

00:18:14.060 as a Muslim,

00:18:14.620 marry a Christian

00:18:15.880 or a Jewish woman,

00:18:17.140 people of the book

00:18:17.760 because that is permitted in Islam,

00:18:18.960 but you have to hate them

00:18:20.160 and you have to show them

00:18:21.660 you hate them.

00:18:22.560 But you can copulate with them

00:18:23.800 and you know,

00:18:24.380 but you always have to make sure

00:18:26.080 they know you hate them.

00:18:27.700 Okay,

00:18:27.880 so this is an ironclad teaching

00:18:29.740 and as you can see how,

00:18:31.260 so this is tribalism,

00:18:32.400 of course,

00:18:32.760 101,

00:18:33.220 but now it has a theological veneer.

00:18:35.640 And then,

00:18:36.320 so what do you do in tribes?

00:18:37.740 We hate each other?

00:18:38.400 Well,

00:18:38.980 I go and I plunder you,

00:18:40.140 right?

00:18:40.420 So that became jihad.

00:18:41.940 Jihad is warfare on the outsider

00:18:44.380 who I'm already bred to hate.

00:18:47.680 I could say,

00:18:48.380 I mean,

00:18:48.760 in a secular setting,

00:18:50.040 tribalism doesn't necessarily,

00:18:51.780 I wouldn't say teach you

00:18:52.700 to hate the outsider.

00:18:53.560 You just fear him.

00:18:54.500 They're outsiders

00:18:55.220 and you can kill them.

00:18:56.860 But it's much more

00:18:58.000 when you really hate that person.

00:18:59.580 And this is something

00:19:00.540 we can get into

00:19:01.080 because it's really,

00:19:01.980 this is the whole,

00:19:03.000 the heart of the matter.

00:19:04.160 To me,

00:19:04.640 this doctrine that I'm belaboring

00:19:06.460 and in Arabic,

00:19:07.960 it's kind of,

00:19:08.520 it's a dichotomized doctrine.

00:19:10.680 It's called

00:19:10.920 two Arabic words.

00:19:13.120 Well,

00:19:13.220 that means loyalty

00:19:13.920 and love for Muslims,

00:19:15.420 which we can put that aside.

00:19:16.980 And what I'm looking at

00:19:18.300 is the barat,

00:19:18.900 which is hatred and enmity

00:19:20.160 for non-Muslims.

00:19:21.440 Okay?

00:19:21.760 And so that manifests in jihad.

00:19:23.940 And so anyway,

00:19:26.200 so,

00:19:26.440 and then if you die,

00:19:28.360 right?

00:19:28.580 So you're the warrior,

00:19:29.940 you hate the infidel,

00:19:31.300 you do jihad.

00:19:31.980 Now in a secular setting,

00:19:34.220 that happens all the time,

00:19:35.660 historically,

00:19:36.280 even in the present day

00:19:37.200 and people go fight

00:19:38.020 to plunder,

00:19:38.620 right?

00:19:39.120 But now,

00:19:39.920 if you win,

00:19:41.280 well,

00:19:41.580 you get all these,

00:19:42.380 whatever,

00:19:42.980 the booty,

00:19:43.880 you know,

00:19:44.560 animate and inanimate,

00:19:45.620 you can gain.

00:19:46.740 And,

00:19:47.260 but if you die,

00:19:48.020 you get even more.

00:19:49.160 Now you go straight to heaven,

00:19:50.820 straight to paradise,

00:19:51.620 where it's,

00:19:52.340 again,

00:19:52.620 hedonistic and materialistic.

00:19:53.980 And you get women

00:19:54.800 and,

00:19:55.900 you know,

00:19:56.100 it's very carnal,

00:19:57.120 the way it's described

00:19:57.760 in the Quran,

00:19:58.540 okay?

00:19:59.140 You know,

00:19:59.380 there's beautiful boys

00:20:00.440 circulating around

00:20:01.420 looking like pearls

00:20:02.280 and these supernatural women

00:20:03.660 who you will copulate

00:20:04.520 with in perpetuity

00:20:05.680 who are made specifically

00:20:07.300 for sex,

00:20:08.920 okay?

00:20:09.240 And rivers of wine,

00:20:10.600 et cetera.

00:20:11.460 Rivers of wine?

00:20:12.540 Yeah,

00:20:13.100 yeah,

00:20:13.380 now you can drink wine

00:20:14.180 once you get to heaven,

00:20:15.320 but not here.

00:20:17.660 I'm sorry,

00:20:18.500 maybe rivers of honey

00:20:19.700 or wine,

00:20:20.380 but I know there is wine.

00:20:22.020 Yeah,

00:20:22.240 sorry,

00:20:22.660 I just saw it.

00:20:23.460 That just took me.

00:20:24.440 Yeah,

00:20:24.640 yeah,

00:20:24.800 it might be something.

00:20:25.900 I'm being,

00:20:26.520 it's poetic language

00:20:27.700 which is being used.

00:20:28.540 Yeah, okay, fine.

00:20:28.960 And I,

00:20:29.600 you know,

00:20:29.860 but definitely,

00:20:30.360 but I do know

00:20:31.140 alcohol is permissible then

00:20:32.680 because that's something

00:20:33.400 they talk about.

00:20:35.020 So my point is,

00:20:36.500 the genius of Muhammad,

00:20:37.340 if you're asking,

00:20:38.160 is that he just

00:20:39.040 took that tribalism

00:20:40.240 but re-articulated it

00:20:41.440 in a way

00:20:41.740 that it became

00:20:42.220 a win-win thing.

00:20:43.220 So now,

00:20:44.060 when I go and plunder

00:20:45.020 the outsider,

00:20:46.500 the non-Muslim,

00:20:47.600 the infidel,

00:20:48.460 I'm the good guy now.

00:20:49.720 I'm pious.

00:20:50.760 And if I win

00:20:51.700 and I subjugate,

00:20:53.200 kill,

00:20:53.580 whatever,

00:20:54.260 rape,

00:20:54.660 take,

00:20:55.460 and conquer,

00:20:56.300 well,

00:20:56.500 then I'm even more righteous.

00:20:58.400 And if I die,

00:20:59.340 I get the highest level

00:21:00.260 of paradise.

00:21:01.380 So that was one

00:21:02.280 of the earliest

00:21:02.940 interpretations

00:21:04.140 by non-Muslims

00:21:05.240 as to the efficacy

00:21:06.780 of jihad.

00:21:08.300 It's not very popular nowadays.

00:21:10.080 You know,

00:21:10.280 your average secular historian

00:21:11.820 will laugh at this

00:21:12.680 and tell you no-no.

00:21:13.920 But your average secular historian

00:21:16.180 will also tell you

00:21:16.800 no one really knows

00:21:17.560 how to explain

00:21:18.100 the Arab conquests

00:21:18.880 and how rapid they were

00:21:20.120 because,

00:21:21.300 you know,

00:21:21.820 they shouldn't,

00:21:22.400 by any means,

00:21:23.240 they should not have done

00:21:24.080 what they did.

00:21:24.980 The most popular theory

00:21:26.200 is that the two contending powers

00:21:28.060 that the Arabs eventually

00:21:29.160 in the 7th century conquered,

00:21:31.340 Rome or Byzantium

00:21:32.420 and the Sasanian Persians

00:21:33.680 were so weak

00:21:34.380 because they had been

00:21:35.320 fighting each other.

00:21:35.980 So that's kind of

00:21:36.680 the most popular theory.

00:21:38.420 But still,

00:21:38.920 I don't think that's convincing

00:21:40.160 in and of itself.

00:21:41.820 The news doesn't just tell you

00:21:43.460 what's happening.

00:21:44.420 It so often tells you

00:21:45.480 what to think is happening.

00:21:47.160 And these days,

00:21:48.060 the biggest red flag

00:21:49.040 isn't what's said,

00:21:49.980 it's what gets left out.

00:21:51.400 That's why I use Ground News.

00:21:53.800 It's the only site and app

00:21:55.380 that compares coverage

00:21:56.360 from across the political spectrum

00:21:57.860 and highlights

00:21:59.040 which stories

00:21:59.940 are being ignored entirely.

00:22:01.660 See for yourself

00:22:02.340 at ground.news

00:22:03.600 slash trigonometry.

00:22:04.920 Their blind spot feed

00:22:05.840 is one of my favorite features.

00:22:07.760 It surfaces around

00:22:08.700 20 stories a day

00:22:09.940 that are being overlooked

00:22:10.960 by either the left

00:22:11.940 or the right.

00:22:12.720 It's a simple

00:22:13.600 but powerful way

00:22:14.480 to track media bias

00:22:15.620 in real time.

00:22:16.700 Like this,

00:22:17.660 NIH scientists

00:22:18.840 recently published

00:22:19.760 a declaration

00:22:20.420 criticizing

00:22:21.220 Trump's cuts

00:22:21.880 to public health research.

00:22:23.580 That's a major move

00:22:24.580 and yet

00:22:25.460 only 2% of the coverage

00:22:27.620 came from right-leaning outlets.

00:22:29.600 A new study found

00:22:30.480 that 2024

00:22:31.400 saw the most armed conflicts

00:22:33.220 globally since 1946.

00:22:35.320 A staggering statistic.

00:22:36.980 But you would have missed it

00:22:37.820 if you'd only read

00:22:38.640 left-wing news sources.

00:22:39.980 Ground News

00:22:40.480 gives you the full picture.

00:22:41.960 Headlines,

00:22:42.620 ownership,

00:22:43.260 bias ratings

00:22:43.880 and context.

00:22:44.780 So you can actually

00:22:45.880 understand what's going on

00:22:47.140 not just react

00:22:48.260 to what you're told.

00:22:49.040 Head to ground.news

00:22:50.720 slash trigonometry

00:22:51.540 for 40% off

00:22:53.420 their unlimited

00:22:54.240 advantage plan

00:22:55.140 the same one we use

00:22:56.460 and start thinking

00:22:57.540 for yourself.

00:22:58.220 Getting ready for a game

00:23:04.080 means being ready

00:23:04.860 for anything

00:23:05.480 like packing

00:23:06.460 a spare stick.

00:23:07.680 I like to be prepared.

00:23:09.320 That's why I remember

00:23:10.120 988

00:23:10.880 Canada's

00:23:11.640 Suicide Crisis Helpline.

00:23:13.220 It's good to know

00:23:13.940 just in case.

00:23:15.400 Anyone can call

00:23:16.200 or text

00:23:16.660 for free confidential

00:23:17.660 support from a

00:23:18.480 trained responder

00:23:19.180 anytime.

00:23:20.860 988

00:23:21.180 Suicide Crisis Helpline

00:23:22.600 is funded by the

00:23:23.340 government in Canada.

00:23:24.100 So Raymond

00:23:27.580 so we have

00:23:28.440 Mohammed

00:23:28.820 by the end of his life

00:23:30.620 he has conquered

00:23:31.480 the Arabian Peninsula

00:23:32.700 he dies

00:23:34.080 so what happens next?

00:23:36.120 Who comes after him?

00:23:37.520 The successor

00:23:38.640 Abu Bakr

00:23:39.440 who was also

00:23:40.320 his father-in-law

00:23:41.040 and whose daughter

00:23:42.360 Aisha

00:23:43.280 the young child

00:23:44.600 bride of Mohammed

00:23:45.260 one of his wives

00:23:46.820 that he married

00:23:47.380 he becomes a successor

00:23:48.960 but only for two years

00:23:49.820 because he's elderly

00:23:50.500 and he dies

00:23:51.140 so his claim to fame

00:23:52.840 is what I was saying

00:23:53.380 the Ridda Wars

00:23:54.080 the apostasy wars

00:23:55.160 which is

00:23:56.160 so he's the one

00:23:56.840 that really consolidates

00:23:57.740 Arabia

00:23:58.080 more than Mohammed

00:23:59.480 Mohammed

00:23:59.860 it begins with

00:24:00.620 and there's a lot of

00:24:01.600 you know

00:24:02.200 like I said

00:24:03.120 you know

00:24:03.680 nominal

00:24:04.640 submission to him

00:24:06.220 but also a lot

00:24:07.040 of real submission

00:24:07.680 but once he dies

00:24:09.040 Abu Bakr

00:24:09.680 those two years

00:24:10.460 he's known as the guy

00:24:11.320 who brings in

00:24:12.120 and really consolidates

00:24:13.460 Arabia

00:24:13.780 and then

00:24:14.320 under the

00:24:15.780 the second caliph

00:24:17.320 Omar

00:24:18.200 Omar I

00:24:19.620 this is when

00:24:21.040 the great Arab

00:24:21.520 conquests begin

00:24:22.160 so from 636

00:24:24.400 which is when

00:24:26.080 Omar

00:24:26.800 becomes the caliph

00:24:28.080 this is when

00:24:28.680 the jihad

00:24:29.320 erupts

00:24:30.380 on everyone around

00:24:32.080 okay

00:24:32.560 and of course

00:24:33.000 so Arabia

00:24:33.700 the first part

00:24:34.440 they attack

00:24:34.860 is what's called

00:24:36.140 greater Syria

00:24:36.900 which really encompasses

00:24:37.680 the entire

00:24:38.220 you know

00:24:38.620 eastern Mediterranean

00:24:39.440 Syria

00:24:40.500 all the modern day

00:24:41.520 countries that you can

00:24:42.200 think of

00:24:42.480 Lebanon

00:24:42.760 Israel

00:24:43.340 Jordan

00:24:44.540 portions of Iraq

00:24:46.460 people forget

00:24:47.040 were actually very Christian

00:24:48.520 but they also attack

00:24:49.920 Persia

00:24:50.440 you know

00:24:50.980 they go there

00:24:51.500 and even go further

00:24:52.480 and this is all

00:24:54.720 so during

00:24:55.340 Omar's

00:24:56.640 caliphate

00:24:57.420 which I think

00:24:57.840 lasts a decade

00:24:58.700 that's when you had

00:25:00.800 the massive Arab conquest

00:25:01.960 so Egypt

00:25:02.720 was conquered

00:25:03.360 around 640

00:25:05.320 641

00:25:06.280 and like I said

00:25:07.380 all of the

00:25:07.840 greater Syria

00:25:08.680 there's a pivotal battle

00:25:09.660 the battle of Yarmouk

00:25:10.480 I wrote my master's thesis

00:25:11.540 on that actually

00:25:12.380 25

00:25:13.480 over 25 years ago

00:25:15.040 because it's that pivotal

00:25:15.940 historians call it

00:25:17.600 the most consequential battle

00:25:18.780 in history

00:25:19.500 because

00:25:20.260 had the Arabs

00:25:21.760 been defeated

00:25:22.600 at the battle of Yarmouk

00:25:24.200 which is a river

00:25:24.920 in Syria

00:25:25.900 it's believed that

00:25:27.440 you know

00:25:27.780 history could have been

00:25:28.760 completely different

00:25:29.420 but because they beat

00:25:30.520 the Romans

00:25:30.960 that's when

00:25:31.640 it was like a domino effect

00:25:33.040 and they started

00:25:33.620 conquering

00:25:35.040 you know

00:25:35.540 Egypt

00:25:35.880 Jerusalem was conquered

00:25:36.780 a year later

00:25:37.420 Egypt like I said

00:25:39.100 640

00:25:39.540 641

00:25:40.140 and then further

00:25:40.820 west

00:25:41.620 until

00:25:43.240 so by 711

00:25:46.100 all of North Africa

00:25:47.680 has been conquered

00:25:49.280 and now they're in Spain

00:25:50.360 the Arabs

00:25:51.160 conquering Spain

00:25:52.020 now it's important

00:25:53.000 to keep in mind

00:25:53.660 because most people

00:25:55.120 don't get this

00:25:56.220 but when we talk

00:25:57.340 and this is by design

00:25:58.480 I believe

00:25:58.780 but when we talk

00:25:59.680 about these regions

00:26:00.500 if I say Egypt

00:26:01.560 or Syria

00:26:02.160 or whatever

00:26:02.840 Morocco

00:26:03.340 or Mauritania

00:26:04.060 to give it

00:26:04.400 its historical name

00:26:05.220 people just

00:26:06.100 had this idea

00:26:06.900 that these areas

00:26:07.540 were kind of

00:26:08.020 always Muslim

00:26:08.600 or something

00:26:09.000 those were of course

00:26:10.780 the heartlands

00:26:11.740 of Christendom

00:26:12.600 not Europe

00:26:13.180 okay

00:26:14.040 so if you looked

00:26:15.240 at Christianity

00:26:16.040 the Christian world

00:26:16.980 and it had

00:26:17.800 you know

00:26:18.280 spread very far

00:26:19.120 especially after

00:26:19.800 Constantine

00:26:20.480 in the early

00:26:21.700 you know

00:26:22.380 300s

00:26:23.080 because he was

00:26:23.760 the first Christian

00:26:24.300 emperor

00:26:24.540 but all of North Africa

00:26:26.020 right

00:26:26.400 so from Egypt

00:26:26.940 to Morocco

00:26:27.400 all of the Middle East

00:26:28.520 all of Asia Minor

00:26:29.740 Anatolia

00:26:30.260 what we call Turkey

00:26:31.100 and then you know

00:26:32.360 Europe of course

00:26:33.340 you know

00:26:34.460 the southwest

00:26:35.000 of the Danube

00:26:35.700 and Rhine

00:26:36.100 that's Christianity

00:26:38.300 that's Christendom

00:26:39.240 okay

00:26:39.520 and in that

00:26:40.480 one century

00:26:41.320 that we're talking

00:26:41.840 about from 632

00:26:42.720 Muhammad's death

00:26:43.500 to 732

00:26:44.680 which is the Battle

00:26:45.320 of Tours

00:26:45.860 which is in the middle

00:26:47.140 or by Poitiers

00:26:48.280 in the middle of France

00:26:49.340 they conquered all that

00:26:50.680 which if you look

00:26:51.780 at the map

00:26:52.280 is something like

00:26:53.120 you know

00:26:53.520 depending on how

00:26:54.720 you look at it

00:26:55.140 two or three quarters

00:26:56.000 of 66%

00:26:58.760 let's say

00:26:59.260 of the original

00:27:00.180 Christian world

00:27:00.960 and the more important

00:27:02.160 one

00:27:02.440 because there were

00:27:03.320 five ecclesiastical

00:27:04.720 centers

00:27:05.320 you know

00:27:05.960 bishoprics

00:27:06.520 essentially

00:27:07.080 Rome is the one

00:27:08.280 that everyone remembers

00:27:09.040 which was in the west

00:27:09.980 and that didn't get conquered

00:27:10.960 the other four did

00:27:12.660 right

00:27:13.200 and that would be

00:27:13.800 Alexandria

00:27:14.460 Antioch

00:27:15.540 Jerusalem

00:27:16.000 and Constantinople

00:27:17.080 itself

00:27:17.460 later

00:27:18.020 got conquered

00:27:19.060 so

00:27:19.680 I know

00:27:21.000 we're talking about

00:27:21.780 an ideology

00:27:22.480 Raymond

00:27:22.840 that is incredibly

00:27:23.560 powerful

00:27:24.100 and it's heavily

00:27:25.520 incentivized people

00:27:26.660 to go and be warlike

00:27:27.700 and also to be fearless

00:27:28.900 because you know

00:27:29.540 that if you die

00:27:30.120 you're gonna

00:27:30.480 you know

00:27:31.300 you're gonna get

00:27:31.720 all the ladies

00:27:32.240 shall we just say

00:27:32.920 so it's

00:27:33.380 you know

00:27:33.700 it's a good deal

00:27:34.560 and personally

00:27:35.340 if I was around

00:27:35.880 then I might well

00:27:36.400 have signed up

00:27:37.040 however

00:27:37.960 there must have

00:27:39.920 been something else

00:27:40.960 to these warriors

00:27:43.060 because to take on

00:27:44.420 the Romans

00:27:44.940 to take on

00:27:45.980 all these ancient

00:27:46.920 civilizations

00:27:47.700 the Persians

00:27:48.460 they must have been

00:27:49.760 incredibly well drilled

00:27:51.120 as armies

00:27:51.680 and ferocious fighters

00:27:53.660 and also

00:27:54.620 highly trained

00:27:55.580 okay

00:27:56.480 so yeah

00:27:56.980 like I said

00:27:57.640 this is known

00:27:58.260 as one of the big

00:27:58.800 mysteries of history

00:28:01.360 the Arab conquest

00:28:02.320 they're not easy

00:28:03.080 to explain

00:28:04.800 okay

00:28:06.360 some of the theories

00:28:07.160 there was this

00:28:07.780 massive desiccation

00:28:08.700 of Arabia

00:28:09.180 they claim

00:28:09.700 where it was

00:28:10.120 really becoming

00:28:10.820 barren

00:28:11.200 and so this caused

00:28:11.880 a massive migration

00:28:12.960 that we don't

00:28:13.880 really know about

00:28:15.060 of who knows

00:28:17.000 the number

00:28:17.380 of Arabs

00:28:18.420 with their women

00:28:19.060 and children

00:28:19.520 and camels

00:28:20.080 just inundating regions

00:28:21.300 that's one theory

00:28:22.440 the other theory

00:28:23.520 which I already

00:28:24.120 mentioned

00:28:24.420 the most prominent

00:28:25.580 one which is

00:28:26.140 that the Persians

00:28:26.760 and the Romans

00:28:27.280 were so exhausted

00:28:28.080 from constant warfare

00:28:29.060 but you can't really say

00:28:32.080 that these guys

00:28:32.660 were well militarily trained

00:28:33.940 they actually weren't

00:28:34.640 and when you

00:28:35.180 and we know

00:28:36.000 their weapons

00:28:36.860 their weapons

00:28:37.700 or whatever

00:28:38.080 they could plunder

00:28:38.640 from their slain victims

00:28:39.780 you know

00:28:40.020 okay

00:28:40.200 I mean that was it

00:28:41.060 so and they didn't really

00:28:42.780 we don't know

00:28:43.260 of any kind of Arab

00:28:44.420 military

00:28:45.740 you know

00:28:46.400 formations

00:28:47.000 it was just

00:28:47.760 it was the Bedouin raid

00:28:49.140 where you know

00:28:49.820 which continues

00:28:50.640 in fact

00:28:51.200 with a lot of

00:28:51.940 historically

00:28:52.820 the Islamic nomadic

00:28:53.900 peoples

00:28:54.320 Turks and Mongols

00:28:55.240 and Arabs

00:28:55.820 they were great horsemen

00:28:57.480 that's for sure

00:28:58.200 so I mean

00:28:58.840 they definitely had

00:28:59.380 that lightning speed

00:29:00.400 the Battle of Yarmouk

00:29:01.700 for example

00:29:02.160 we know that

00:29:02.760 one of the reasons

00:29:03.320 that they won

00:29:04.020 is because

00:29:04.500 they were used to

00:29:05.280 desert fighting

00:29:06.320 and apparently

00:29:06.740 there was a desert storm

00:29:07.880 which the Romans

00:29:08.520 couldn't handle

00:29:09.220 and it blinded them

00:29:10.120 whereas the Arabs

00:29:10.740 were used to those

00:29:11.580 conditions

00:29:12.440 but one of the things

00:29:14.100 that I always found

00:29:14.720 interesting

00:29:15.040 is there's a

00:29:15.840 relatively obscure

00:29:17.260 but early

00:29:17.960 chronicle

00:29:19.280 it's from Spain

00:29:21.340 and it's

00:29:21.840 in the 8th century

00:29:23.180 so it talks about

00:29:24.080 the 700s

00:29:25.840 it talks

00:29:26.180 it's very early

00:29:26.980 and it talks about

00:29:27.780 the Arab conquest

00:29:28.740 and it makes us

00:29:29.660 kind of curious

00:29:30.280 remark about how

00:29:31.280 they did not win

00:29:32.440 through manliness

00:29:33.520 but through stealth

00:29:35.220 and deception

00:29:36.080 okay

00:29:37.160 which you know

00:29:38.740 I mean

00:29:39.080 I don't know

00:29:39.520 how to interpret that

00:29:40.400 but basically

00:29:41.880 the idea is

00:29:42.580 they weren't

00:29:43.400 they wouldn't fight

00:29:44.300 head on

00:29:44.800 in a kind of

00:29:45.880 you know

00:29:46.120 in a sort of

00:29:46.680 chivalric

00:29:47.120 which didn't even

00:29:47.800 exist at that point

00:29:48.540 necessarily

00:29:48.980 kind of way

00:29:49.880 or like

00:29:51.080 blunt force

00:29:52.120 it was just

00:29:52.580 hit and run tactics

00:29:53.740 kind of deception

00:29:54.680 which definitely

00:29:56.620 marks the later

00:29:57.500 excuse me

00:29:58.940 way of war

00:29:59.580 of like I said

00:30:00.260 the Turks

00:30:00.760 and the Ottomans

00:30:01.480 and the Seljuks

00:30:02.060 and these groups

00:30:02.660 so that's another

00:30:03.760 you know

00:30:04.160 thing I'm throwing

00:30:04.740 out there

00:30:05.180 because I

00:30:05.580 I don't hear

00:30:06.380 people talk about it

00:30:07.160 but it is

00:30:07.560 in the chronicles

00:30:08.560 the official

00:30:10.400 Christian explanation

00:30:11.480 was God

00:30:12.180 had done this

00:30:12.840 to punish us

00:30:13.380 for our sins

00:30:13.920 he had raised

00:30:14.880 Amalek to come

00:30:15.880 and punish us

00:30:16.600 because we deserved it

00:30:18.080 for cross-dressing purposes

00:30:19.980 I'm not even kidding

00:30:21.280 there's an early

00:30:22.400 there's an early document

00:30:23.840 that talks

00:30:24.660 and it says

00:30:25.200 and it says

00:30:26.380 I have it quoted

00:30:27.260 in my book

00:30:28.020 Sword and Scimitar

00:30:28.640 I'm forgetting right now

00:30:29.920 pseudo-Methodius

00:30:31.620 I think

00:30:32.080 but it says

00:30:33.160 something like

00:30:33.800 he raised them up

00:30:35.520 to punish us

00:30:36.280 and because

00:30:37.320 and it lists

00:30:38.060 all kinds of numbers

00:30:38.800 of immoralities

00:30:39.560 and one of them

00:30:40.100 is because men

00:30:40.860 would dress like women

00:30:41.840 there you go

00:30:43.880 well

00:30:44.680 so God is anti-trans

00:30:46.500 go on to trans fight

00:30:47.620 anyway

00:30:48.860 but that must have sent

00:30:50.600 real shockwaves

00:30:51.860 through the Christian world

00:30:53.060 to see

00:30:53.740 this new religion

00:30:55.080 these new armies

00:30:56.660 fighting this

00:30:57.440 new style

00:30:58.440 almost guerrilla warfare style

00:30:59.940 and just cut through

00:31:01.500 swathes of Christian heartland

00:31:03.400 and that's

00:31:04.300 see that's the missing

00:31:05.360 piece of the puzzle

00:31:06.520 and nobody

00:31:06.920 you know

00:31:07.380 invariably when we talk about

00:31:09.440 Muslim Christian hostilities

00:31:11.140 from a historical point of view

00:31:12.220 it starts with the crusades

00:31:13.880 everyone starts with the crusades

00:31:15.580 and nobody seems to understand

00:31:16.880 what was building up

00:31:18.400 towards the crusade

00:31:19.260 which included a lot of fear

00:31:20.680 and terror

00:31:21.600 because

00:31:22.320 you know

00:31:23.060 Bernard Lewis has a great quote

00:31:24.300 which I quote from him

00:31:25.180 and he talks about

00:31:26.000 how you know

00:31:27.040 by the time it was

00:31:28.060 you know

00:31:28.420 after these Arab conquests

00:31:29.900 and now let's say

00:31:30.760 it's the 8th and 9th century

00:31:32.120 the Europeans were just traumatized

00:31:34.060 and devastated

00:31:34.620 and a lot of what we called

00:31:36.760 or used to call

00:31:37.680 it's not a very favorable term anymore

00:31:39.540 but the Dark Ages

00:31:40.380 was in large measure

00:31:41.980 because of these Arab conquests

00:31:43.400 okay

00:31:44.000 and Henry Perrin

00:31:45.500 for example

00:31:46.080 he was a historian

00:31:46.960 19th century

00:31:47.760 that was his thesis

00:31:48.540 which is that

00:31:49.860 the Dark Ages

00:31:50.580 was a byproduct

00:31:51.680 of these Muslim conquests

00:31:53.640 which took

00:31:54.220 what was once

00:31:54.940 a Roman Christian lake

00:31:56.260 at the time

00:31:57.080 right

00:31:57.360 Egypt

00:31:58.280 had commerce

00:31:59.080 with Spain

00:31:59.800 and with Rome

00:32:00.680 and Syria

00:32:01.440 you know

00:32:01.780 it was one

00:32:02.220 it was Christendom

00:32:04.020 and by

00:32:05.040 you know

00:32:06.020 chopping that in half

00:32:06.880 and essentially appropriating

00:32:08.260 and seizing the older

00:32:09.180 richer

00:32:09.600 more sophisticated

00:32:10.460 more educated

00:32:11.320 region

00:32:12.100 which was the Middle East

00:32:13.280 and the Near East

00:32:14.060 that's one of the main reasons

00:32:15.780 that Europe

00:32:16.200 entered into this

00:32:17.360 perilous dark age

00:32:18.340 and Henry Perrin

00:32:19.100 also you know

00:32:19.740 I think the title of his book

00:32:21.080 or

00:32:21.320 his argument is

00:32:22.720 or his famous line

00:32:23.560 is that

00:32:23.880 without Muhammad

00:32:24.700 there's no Charlemagne

00:32:25.540 okay

00:32:26.420 so the one necessarily

00:32:27.540 led to the rise

00:32:28.360 of the other

00:32:28.900 and that entire system

00:32:30.240 and you know

00:32:31.380 so most people

00:32:32.360 don't know

00:32:32.900 what built up

00:32:33.700 and what was coming

00:32:34.520 you know

00:32:34.920 in the centuries

00:32:35.500 before the First Crusade

00:32:37.300 they just assume

00:32:38.000 there's these

00:32:38.400 you know

00:32:38.580 these powerful land

00:32:39.560 grabbing hungry

00:32:40.260 greedy knights

00:32:40.820 want to go

00:32:41.260 and just

00:32:41.620 I've quoted this quote

00:32:44.160 and I'm going to quote it

00:32:44.680 for you guys

00:32:45.120 so many times

00:32:45.660 I think I've memorized it

00:32:46.680 but it just

00:32:47.420 it shows you

00:32:48.080 the rot of academia

00:32:49.200 and it really underscores

00:32:51.000 what I'm trying to tell you

00:32:51.840 and it's by

00:32:52.280 John Esposito

00:32:53.160 this is a professor

00:32:55.020 at Georgetown University

00:32:56.160 I don't know

00:32:56.480 if he's still there

00:32:57.100 he's probably very old

00:32:58.400 right now

00:32:59.240 but he was there

00:33:00.400 when I was there

00:33:00.880 I went to Georgetown University

00:33:02.240 for a time

00:33:02.800 in Washington DC

00:33:03.580 and it's a bastion

00:33:06.480 of kind of Islamic studies

00:33:07.820 and whatnot

00:33:08.220 but I didn't know this

00:33:09.260 at the time

00:33:09.680 but it was a very

00:33:10.640 kind of compromised

00:33:11.540 bastion

00:33:12.180 anyway

00:33:13.240 one of his books

00:33:14.020 which is

00:33:14.380 it's called

00:33:15.540 Islam the Straight Path

00:33:16.660 and keep in mind

00:33:17.740 this guy

00:33:18.180 he was

00:33:18.580 this is in the early 2000s

00:33:20.840 let's say

00:33:21.280 he was very very active

00:33:22.620 and his book came out

00:33:23.560 he's the editor

00:33:24.560 of the Oxford

00:33:25.240 History of Islam

00:33:27.040 for example

00:33:27.660 he was the guy

00:33:28.860 that the FBI

00:33:30.400 and the CIA

00:33:31.160 intelligence analysts

00:33:32.100 they talked to him

00:33:32.840 to understand about Islam

00:33:33.880 and whatever

00:33:34.420 he has this line

00:33:35.820 in his book

00:33:36.340 Islam the Straight Path

00:33:37.160 which verbatim

00:33:38.360 I might be getting

00:33:39.140 a little off

00:33:39.720 but he says

00:33:40.140 five centuries

00:33:40.840 of peaceful coexistence

00:33:42.340 elapsed

00:33:43.020 between Christians

00:33:43.980 and Muslims

00:33:44.460 before an imperial

00:33:45.780 papal power play

00:33:46.940 led to a series

00:33:48.280 of so-called

00:33:49.500 holy wars

00:33:50.200 that have left

00:33:50.720 an enduring legacy

00:33:51.740 of mistrust

00:33:52.460 from Muslims

00:33:53.260 to Christians

00:33:54.180 so what he's saying

00:33:55.980 is before the First Crusade

00:33:57.260 which starts in 1095

00:33:58.720 everything before that

00:34:00.540 from Muhammad's life

00:34:02.540 until all the stuff

00:34:03.640 I'm telling you

00:34:04.140 was peaceful coexistence

00:34:05.860 okay

00:34:06.980 that's the official narrative

00:34:08.860 so that's why

00:34:09.720 I think it's very important

00:34:10.680 to really highlight

00:34:12.300 what you just mentioned

00:34:13.120 which is this really

00:34:14.080 this was a traumatizing event

00:34:16.360 the sundering

00:34:17.680 you know

00:34:18.080 the first breakup

00:34:18.860 of Christendom

00:34:19.800 with most of it

00:34:20.600 being conquered

00:34:21.700 by this hostile faith

00:34:23.200 and the rest of it

00:34:24.220 being bombarded

00:34:24.940 in the 8th century

00:34:25.980 all these islands

00:34:26.820 the Mediterranean islands

00:34:28.160 were constantly

00:34:28.760 being attacked

00:34:29.480 and conquered

00:34:30.300 slave raids

00:34:31.980 were constantly

00:34:32.660 a given thing

00:34:33.880 the whole idea

00:34:34.860 so much of what we know

00:34:36.060 as feudalism

00:34:36.840 had to do with

00:34:38.100 all these

00:34:38.380 the coasts

00:34:39.800 of the southern coast

00:34:40.640 of Europe

00:34:41.020 so many people

00:34:41.920 actually abandoned them

00:34:42.960 because they were

00:34:43.820 the site of raids

00:34:44.700 slave raids

00:34:45.200 coming from the Islamic world

00:34:46.520 now North Africa

00:34:47.400 and they would

00:34:48.320 habitually go

00:34:49.060 and enslave Europeans

00:34:50.120 and take them back

00:34:51.340 and the emporium

00:34:53.260 for white flesh

00:34:54.160 was Cordoba

00:34:55.760 in Spain

00:34:56.320 which was conquered

00:34:57.040 like I said

00:34:57.580 starting in 7-11

00:34:58.840 and that's where

00:34:59.800 they would

00:35:00.140 that was where

00:35:01.180 they would sell

00:35:01.760 white flesh

00:35:02.520 which always

00:35:03.140 you know

00:35:03.800 fetched a high price

00:35:04.780 amongst the Muslims

00:35:05.500 so before we move

00:35:08.240 on to the crusades

00:35:09.120 I just wanted to

00:35:10.060 concentrate on

00:35:11.300 the Islamic golden age

00:35:12.720 was that around

00:35:13.720 the time

00:35:14.340 that we know

00:35:15.060 as the Islamic golden age

00:35:16.400 yeah

00:35:16.920 so the Islamic golden age

00:35:18.380 well there's kind of two

00:35:20.360 and the one is the Abbasids

00:35:22.180 in Baghdad

00:35:23.160 and this is the

00:35:24.640 Abbasid empire

00:35:26.240 starts after the Umayyads

00:35:27.880 and the Umayyads

00:35:28.900 are like

00:35:29.260 so around 750

00:35:30.180 usually the Abbasid golden age

00:35:32.640 would be sometime

00:35:33.280 after 800

00:35:34.360 okay

00:35:35.280 and this is

00:35:36.480 Harun al-Rashid

00:35:37.340 who's now allied with

00:35:38.740 or on friendly terms

00:35:40.380 with Charlemagne

00:35:41.100 but there's also

00:35:42.600 a supposed golden age

00:35:43.780 in Spain

00:35:44.440 Umayyad Spain

00:35:46.020 in Cordoba

00:35:47.480 and what

00:35:48.820 what needs to be understood

00:35:50.460 about the golden age

00:35:51.280 is this

00:35:51.820 um

00:35:52.320 the

00:35:53.480 let me try to

00:35:54.840 start it off

00:35:55.380 by giving an analogy

00:35:56.280 right

00:35:56.740 I forget which

00:35:58.220 which Arab country

00:35:59.340 or you know

00:35:59.980 in the Gulf

00:36:00.400 which is the one

00:36:00.860 that has those

00:36:01.280 skyscrapers

00:36:01.960 that everyone

00:36:02.400 Dubai

00:36:03.200 Dubai

00:36:03.660 UA

00:36:04.160 yeah

00:36:04.720 okay

00:36:05.180 imagine

00:36:06.620 you know

00:36:07.200 many many

00:36:08.160 let's say decades

00:36:09.360 or centuries from now

00:36:10.100 those buildings

00:36:10.780 are still standing there

00:36:11.820 and you know

00:36:13.200 the whole

00:36:13.540 everything's changed

00:36:14.380 and you know

00:36:14.680 Islam maybe is gone

00:36:15.520 or whatever

00:36:15.860 and um

00:36:17.560 people look at it

00:36:18.640 and go wow

00:36:19.200 that was a golden age

00:36:21.180 that country

00:36:21.820 that civilization

00:36:22.580 because look what it led to

00:36:24.180 now we would say

00:36:25.500 well no

00:36:26.100 I mean

00:36:26.660 they had their Islam

00:36:27.680 sure

00:36:28.040 but this is actually money

00:36:29.320 and westerners built it

00:36:31.080 western technology

00:36:32.380 western workers

00:36:33.360 and it just so happened

00:36:34.500 that these Arabs

00:36:35.260 had the money

00:36:35.840 to spend on it

00:36:36.600 that I submit to you

00:36:37.960 is the best way

00:36:38.380 to understand the golden age

00:36:39.580 that happened historically

00:36:40.860 it didn't happen

00:36:42.080 due to anything

00:36:42.900 to do with Islam

00:36:43.980 quite the contrary

00:36:44.760 it happened despite Islam

00:36:46.240 okay

00:36:46.820 and it was basically

00:36:47.760 so let's uh

00:36:48.360 if we go to the Abbasid

00:36:49.760 as I was telling you

00:36:50.440 which is the primary golden age

00:36:51.640 um

00:36:52.520 this is now

00:36:53.620 okay

00:36:53.940 so now the Abbasid empire

00:36:55.200 is more Persianized

00:36:56.420 and it's

00:36:57.040 it's in

00:36:57.500 it's in Baghdad

00:36:58.460 okay

00:36:58.980 and it's

00:36:59.800 it's very

00:37:00.820 it's heavily Persianized

00:37:01.920 and um

00:37:03.540 at the time

00:37:05.080 a lot of the people

00:37:06.060 keep in mind

00:37:06.800 when these Arab

00:37:07.540 Muslim conquests

00:37:08.440 happen

00:37:08.880 most of

00:37:10.040 so let's say

00:37:10.560 Egypt and Syria

00:37:11.440 which were highly Christian

00:37:12.580 let's say

00:37:13.120 in the 8th century

00:37:14.640 9th century

00:37:15.180 10th century

00:37:15.620 there's still

00:37:16.120 majority Christian

00:37:17.280 and there's Jews

00:37:18.920 also as well

00:37:19.980 especially in Alexandria

00:37:21.020 and various cities

00:37:22.040 and you have a lot

00:37:23.040 of Zoroastrians

00:37:23.800 and Persia

00:37:24.780 okay

00:37:25.420 you have all these

00:37:26.100 different groups

00:37:26.860 who are living

00:37:27.720 underneath now

00:37:28.600 Islamic rule

00:37:29.380 they're the ones

00:37:30.500 who are doing

00:37:30.960 all the stuff

00:37:31.600 that we call

00:37:32.040 the golden age

00:37:32.640 okay

00:37:33.180 it's Christians

00:37:34.740 it's Jews

00:37:35.260 and especially

00:37:36.400 it's Persians

00:37:37.820 in the Abbasid era

00:37:39.500 and it's not because

00:37:40.800 of anything special

00:37:41.840 about Islam

00:37:42.520 I mean they are

00:37:43.120 literally not Muslims

00:37:44.100 and a few of them

00:37:45.740 who are

00:37:46.240 are literally

00:37:46.800 they just

00:37:47.640 converted

00:37:48.520 they're first generation

00:37:49.720 converts

00:37:50.100 which means

00:37:50.960 they're still

00:37:51.580 primarily

00:37:52.320 whatever their

00:37:52.920 former religion was

00:37:54.220 so the best

00:37:55.340 that you can say

00:37:55.880 is that the Muslims

00:37:56.740 you know

00:37:57.980 sponsored it

00:37:59.660 maybe paid for it

00:38:00.840 okay

00:38:01.180 but there was

00:38:02.020 nothing intrinsic

00:38:03.020 to Islam

00:38:04.120 and once Islam

00:38:05.060 started to harden

00:38:06.200 because even at this time

00:38:07.460 the Abbasid Caliphate

00:38:08.560 in the golden age

00:38:09.600 there's still debates

00:38:10.560 between the various

00:38:12.200 schools of Islamic law

00:38:13.240 and there's some

00:38:13.720 that were actually

00:38:14.280 considered liberal

00:38:15.100 you know

00:38:16.040 if we can use that term

00:38:17.660 but by

00:38:19.260 I forget the exact time

00:38:20.800 something like

00:38:21.280 in the 10th century

00:38:22.320 what's known as

00:38:23.520 the doors of Ishtahad

00:38:25.000 Ishtahad was a way

00:38:26.000 for the liberals

00:38:26.640 to get around

00:38:27.520 draconian Islam

00:38:28.820 and the saying is

00:38:30.680 the doors were closed

00:38:31.680 and basically

00:38:32.260 the hardliners won

00:38:33.880 the Islamic debate

00:38:35.400 and now

00:38:36.340 if anything

00:38:36.920 all that stuff

00:38:37.820 started dwindling away

00:38:39.000 okay

00:38:39.520 so it was never

00:38:40.660 because of Islam

00:38:41.520 but there was a time

00:38:42.700 where Islam

00:38:43.160 in its early

00:38:43.880 nascent period

00:38:44.620 was you can say

00:38:45.800 liberal enough

00:38:46.420 to allow this sort

00:38:47.440 of thing to happen

00:38:48.000 but the people

00:38:48.860 who were doing

00:38:49.460 the achievements

00:38:50.600 were actually

00:38:51.840 not Muslims

00:38:52.620 and if they were

00:38:53.340 they were like

00:38:53.860 literally just converted

00:38:54.960 to join the winning crowd

00:38:56.240 like a lot of people

00:38:56.980 did over the years

00:38:57.960 and their mind

00:38:59.200 and the way they thought

00:39:00.080 and their heritage

00:39:00.900 was still non-Muslim

00:39:02.480 so that's why

00:39:03.000 I give you that analogy

00:39:04.840 you know

00:39:05.320 of yeah

00:39:06.340 Saudi Arabia

00:39:07.720 and these places

00:39:08.300 if you look at their

00:39:09.140 world view

00:39:10.260 their culture

00:39:10.940 which is based on Islam

00:39:12.080 well yeah

00:39:12.920 it's draconian

00:39:14.100 Sharia law

00:39:14.720 living in a desert

00:39:15.540 polygamy

00:39:16.140 etc etc

00:39:16.760 but they have wealth

00:39:18.260 and look at what

00:39:19.040 they can have

00:39:19.600 and they can build

00:39:20.960 skyscrapers

00:39:21.620 they can have

00:39:21.940 the greatest stuff

00:39:22.600 that westerners

00:39:23.520 can't have

00:39:24.120 that doesn't mean

00:39:25.000 it's actually

00:39:25.700 part and parcel

00:39:26.540 of Islam

00:39:27.140 so that's the best way

00:39:29.320 I think to understand it

00:39:30.240 the holidays are supposed

00:39:32.660 to be relaxing

00:39:33.740 but between travel

00:39:35.040 gifts and family gatherings

00:39:36.600 it's chaos

00:39:37.720 you lose track

00:39:39.140 of what's going out

00:39:40.160 what's coming in

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00:41:14.160 and you mentioned that

00:41:17.360 after the rapid expansion

00:41:20.100 you might even say explosion

00:41:21.380 of Islam across

00:41:22.300 what was prior to that

00:41:23.420 the Christian world

00:41:24.240 there were nonetheless

00:41:25.320 lots of Christians

00:41:26.560 and Jews

00:41:28.220 living there

00:41:29.000 and also of course

00:41:29.660 in the Persian side

00:41:30.480 Zoroastrians

00:41:31.140 which was the religion

00:41:32.120 of Persia

00:41:32.900 until the Islamic conquest

00:41:35.600 what was life like

00:41:38.820 for non-Muslims

00:41:40.820 under Muslim rule

00:41:41.780 well so we

00:41:44.100 okay let's first start off

00:41:45.420 with what Islam teaches

00:41:46.460 because Islam is very

00:41:47.760 specific about life

00:41:49.560 for non-Muslims

00:41:50.820 if you're going to be

00:41:52.180 a

00:41:52.600 if you're going to be

00:41:54.800 a non-Muslim

00:41:55.580 so again like I said earlier

00:41:56.800 theoretically

00:41:57.900 according to Islamic law

00:41:59.020 you have to be a person

00:41:59.900 of the book

00:42:00.380 to be granted

00:42:01.320 any measure of tolerance

00:42:02.980 all right

00:42:03.500 monotheistic

00:42:04.120 you have to believe

00:42:04.740 there's one God

00:42:05.300 yeah

00:42:05.580 yeah

00:42:06.560 and well

00:42:07.280 or do they mean

00:42:09.400 specifically Christians

00:42:10.480 and Jews

00:42:10.820 no

00:42:11.120 well that's

00:42:11.800 that's the question

00:42:12.580 the term is

00:42:13.380 Ahl al-Kitab

00:42:14.260 which means literally

00:42:15.020 the people of scriptures

00:42:16.260 or the book

00:42:17.040 and the idea

00:42:18.000 it was

00:42:18.840 more or less

00:42:19.620 the Jews

00:42:20.040 and the Christians

00:42:20.600 but then later on

00:42:21.680 it sort of became

00:42:22.960 it was extended

00:42:24.960 to people

00:42:25.720 who weren't Jews

00:42:26.500 and Christians

00:42:26.980 and that was because

00:42:28.120 they got tired

00:42:28.720 of the bloodbath

00:42:29.640 so for example

00:42:30.360 when

00:42:31.280 for five centuries

00:42:33.140 I want to say

00:42:34.360 between let's say

00:42:35.020 the year 1000

00:42:35.700 to 1500

00:42:36.500 Muslims

00:42:37.700 according to well-documented

00:42:39.300 historians

00:42:40.180 historical sources

00:42:41.880 and the historian

00:42:42.880 I'm thinking of

00:42:43.360 I know his name

00:42:45.540 but he's an Indian historian

00:42:47.260 and anyway

00:42:48.620 he says that

00:42:49.540 in that five centuries

00:42:50.600 80 million Hindus

00:42:52.800 were slaughtered

00:42:54.000 because they weren't

00:42:55.240 granted

00:42:55.600 the option

00:42:56.780 of becoming

00:42:57.780 dhimmis

00:42:58.380 which Christians

00:42:59.080 and Jews could

00:42:59.740 you could keep

00:43:00.700 your religion

00:43:01.100 you just have to pay

00:43:01.800 extra tribute

00:43:02.540 and you of course

00:43:03.760 have to be a second

00:43:04.320 class citizen

00:43:04.960 which was not

00:43:06.080 in any way

00:43:06.560 shape or form

00:43:07.020 just dig into that

00:43:07.840 so you have to pay

00:43:08.940 jizya

00:43:09.320 yeah

00:43:09.820 don't know if I'm

00:43:11.220 pronouncing that correctly

00:43:12.240 no yeah jizya

00:43:13.360 jizya

00:43:14.080 I thought you laughed

00:43:15.120 in my face

00:43:15.620 for the pronunciation

00:43:16.220 no it's just a funny word

00:43:18.180 yeah

00:43:18.540 so you have to pay jizya

00:43:20.280 and you are allowed

00:43:24.040 and not allowed

00:43:25.060 certain things

00:43:25.800 right

00:43:26.420 so talk to us

00:43:27.280 about what that

00:43:27.960 looks like

00:43:28.460 sure

00:43:28.520 okay

00:43:28.780 so it goes back

00:43:30.100 according to Islamic

00:43:31.020 teaching

00:43:31.360 remember the caliph

00:43:32.100 Omar

00:43:32.520 yeah

00:43:33.000 the second caliph

00:43:34.240 so apparently

00:43:35.700 historians aren't sure

00:43:37.600 where

00:43:37.860 but the Islamic

00:43:38.500 tradition believes

00:43:39.280 it's when Jerusalem

00:43:40.200 was conquered

00:43:40.740 in 637

00:43:41.840 and he came there

00:43:43.360 there's this big

00:43:44.020 narrative about

00:43:45.160 how he came there

00:43:46.000 and what not

00:43:46.580 but supposedly

00:43:47.160 he made a pact

00:43:48.200 it's called in Arabic

00:43:49.660 Ahd Omar

00:43:50.340 or the pact of Omar

00:43:52.580 with the Christians

00:43:53.840 and they basically

00:43:55.460 told them

00:43:56.100 here's what you have to do

00:43:57.260 in order for us

00:43:58.540 to not kill you

00:43:59.880 basically

00:44:00.260 and according to this pact

00:44:02.140 things that they could not do

00:44:03.240 they can't build churches

00:44:04.240 they can't repair churches

00:44:05.820 they can't sing out loud

00:44:08.040 they can't show a crucifix

00:44:09.820 or a bible around Muslims

00:44:11.140 they certainly can't

00:44:12.460 try to proselytize

00:44:13.300 they can't stand in the way

00:44:14.940 of their own relatives

00:44:16.220 being

00:44:16.780 turning Muslim

00:44:17.860 okay

00:44:18.440 and it's a

00:44:19.740 it's a number of lists

00:44:20.700 I actually translated

00:44:21.520 in one of my books

00:44:22.240 and it's called

00:44:23.220 the conditions

00:44:23.700 or stipulations

00:44:24.400 of Omar

00:44:24.920 some of them are

00:44:25.900 if a Muslim

00:44:26.360 wants your seat

00:44:26.980 get up and give it to them

00:44:27.900 if a Muslim

00:44:28.720 is traveling

00:44:29.220 and wants to enter your house

00:44:30.140 you have to let him live there

00:44:31.140 okay

00:44:31.680 so it's not stuff

00:44:32.860 that you necessarily

00:44:33.560 want to enjoy

00:44:34.100 but what it really

00:44:35.240 coalesced around

00:44:36.160 is

00:44:36.800 it's still evidence

00:44:37.780 till today

00:44:38.820 okay

00:44:39.380 is you know

00:44:40.400 you're just

00:44:40.980 you know

00:44:41.600 it's

00:44:41.940 I guess to give you

00:44:43.220 a good analogy

00:44:43.960 is kind of think of

00:44:45.160 you know

00:44:45.920 how blacks were treated

00:44:47.300 in America

00:44:47.880 and you know

00:44:48.920 before civil

00:44:49.620 civil rights

00:44:50.700 and that

00:44:52.260 which is kind of like

00:44:53.140 who do you think you are

00:44:54.180 okay

00:44:54.860 you know

00:44:55.300 to even

00:44:55.800 think you're my equal

00:44:57.640 that kind of mentality

00:44:58.680 is what prevailed

00:44:59.440 in these Islamic societies

00:45:00.760 if you're a Christian

00:45:01.380 or a Jew

00:45:01.880 you better know your place

00:45:03.320 and don't complain

00:45:04.480 and don't

00:45:04.860 if someone

00:45:05.400 if they abuse you

00:45:06.680 or Muslims rise up

00:45:07.800 and commit an injustice

00:45:09.360 against you

00:45:10.000 the law is not going to

00:45:11.140 come on your side

00:45:11.920 that continues

00:45:12.960 till this very day

00:45:13.660 even

00:45:15.040 even in

00:45:15.640 you know

00:45:16.040 the things about

00:45:16.540 like building churches

00:45:17.300 that's still very evident

00:45:18.380 in places like Egypt

00:45:19.320 you know

00:45:20.160 where it's so hard

00:45:21.200 for them to get

00:45:21.780 you know

00:45:22.180 it used to be

00:45:22.840 actually you need

00:45:23.360 a presidential decree

00:45:24.540 to build a church

00:45:25.600 in Egypt

00:45:26.020 okay

00:45:26.660 and now it's supposedly

00:45:28.140 become lenient

00:45:28.820 but a lot of that

00:45:29.440 people say

00:45:29.860 it's just for show

00:45:30.660 for western consumption

00:45:31.700 but in Egypt

00:45:32.980 constantly

00:45:33.420 just this weekend

00:45:34.120 I covered a story

00:45:35.720 which has happened

00:45:36.420 countless times

00:45:39.240 including

00:45:39.860 going centuries back

00:45:40.960 which is basically

00:45:41.640 some sort of

00:45:42.680 romantic liaison

00:45:43.500 group between

00:45:44.300 a Christian man

00:45:45.580 in Egypt

00:45:45.920 and a Muslim woman

00:45:46.640 and so the Muslims

00:45:48.200 after Friday prayers

00:45:49.520 rose up

00:45:50.300 completely devastated

00:45:51.700 the Christian village

00:45:53.080 or where the Christians

00:45:54.080 were living

00:45:54.520 burned homes

00:45:56.020 attacked through rocks

00:45:57.220 rioted

00:45:57.860 screaming

00:45:58.100 Allahu Akbar

00:45:58.740 and why

00:45:59.920 well actually

00:46:00.640 because according

00:46:01.340 to Islamic law

00:46:02.240 a Muslim man

00:46:04.140 can marry

00:46:05.080 a Christian

00:46:05.980 or a Jew

00:46:06.460 or a person

00:46:07.100 of the book

00:46:07.640 like I said

00:46:08.220 but he has a hater

00:46:08.820 but a non-Muslim

00:46:11.020 cannot marry

00:46:11.520 a Muslim woman

00:46:13.020 and the obvious

00:46:14.220 reason in the

00:46:14.800 Islamic mentality

00:46:15.860 is the man's

00:46:16.540 in charge

00:46:17.120 so we cannot have

00:46:18.500 an infidel

00:46:19.020 in charge

00:46:19.480 of a Muslim

00:46:20.020 okay

00:46:20.800 but it's okay

00:46:21.360 if the man's

00:46:21.900 a Muslim

00:46:22.220 and the infidel

00:46:22.780 it's already

00:46:23.560 a second class

00:46:24.200 so it's a woman

00:46:24.900 you know

00:46:25.240 that's the mentality

00:46:26.120 so that's why

00:46:27.860 they got angry

00:46:28.460 but this story

00:46:29.060 has happened

00:46:29.600 countless times

00:46:30.420 in Egypt

00:46:31.080 where they get up

00:46:32.120 and they engage

00:46:32.720 in collective punishment

00:46:33.600 which the conditions

00:46:35.140 of Omar

00:46:35.680 which I was describing

00:46:36.680 to you

00:46:36.960 actually

00:46:37.360 it says

00:46:39.220 if one of you

00:46:40.060 does this

00:46:40.600 then the pact

00:46:41.200 is broken

00:46:41.560 for all of you

00:46:42.120 so it actually

00:46:42.780 does promote

00:46:44.060 collective punishment

00:46:45.000 of the dhimmi's

00:46:46.120 as they're known

00:46:46.700 and this

00:46:47.540 like I said

00:46:47.940 it just happened

00:46:48.420 this week

00:46:48.780 it happened

00:46:49.160 maybe two weeks

00:46:49.740 before that

00:46:50.440 because there was

00:46:51.140 a rumor

00:46:51.440 of a church

00:46:51.900 being built

00:46:52.380 also in Egypt

00:46:53.020 and it goes

00:46:53.640 way way back

00:46:54.380 so my point

00:46:54.980 is that

00:46:55.960 it's actually

00:46:58.040 a written

00:46:58.500 codified thing

00:46:59.420 and it's become

00:47:00.980 absorbed

00:47:01.500 in Islamic law

00:47:02.720 and Islamic Sharia

00:47:03.440 but it's also

00:47:04.380 just part of the society

00:47:05.540 because it's a

00:47:06.820 supremacist idea

00:47:07.880 okay I'm better

00:47:08.820 than you

00:47:09.300 you're the dirty

00:47:10.080 kafir

00:47:10.500 you're the infidel

00:47:11.240 you're the Christian

00:47:11.900 you're the Jew

00:47:12.460 whatever

00:47:13.080 so how dare you

00:47:14.560 want equal rights

00:47:15.640 with me

00:47:16.140 that's the overarching

00:47:17.320 principle

00:47:17.960 and it continues

00:47:19.080 to manifest itself

00:47:20.060 with extreme

00:47:20.660 regularity

00:47:21.360 and your thesis

00:47:22.400 essentially

00:47:23.000 is if I'm

00:47:23.820 understanding you

00:47:24.720 correctly

00:47:25.120 is you have

00:47:26.220 this rapid

00:47:27.520 expansion

00:47:28.080 of the Islamic

00:47:28.880 world

00:47:29.280 from nothing

00:47:29.920 into taking

00:47:31.400 over most

00:47:31.920 of the Christian

00:47:32.340 world

00:47:32.620 including its

00:47:33.360 key areas

00:47:34.140 that would be

00:47:34.480 equivalent

00:47:34.820 of like

00:47:35.560 most of Europe

00:47:36.820 and half of the

00:47:37.400 United States

00:47:38.060 being conquered

00:47:38.820 by Hindus

00:47:39.640 right

00:47:40.220 over

00:47:41.720 what

00:47:42.580 100 years

00:47:43.160 something like that

00:47:43.880 yeah

00:47:44.500 yeah

00:47:44.820 I mean

00:47:45.180 let's say

00:47:46.460 the

00:47:46.740 I mean

00:47:47.340 in the first

00:47:48.080 10 years

00:47:48.680 a huge chunk

00:47:49.600 Egypt and Syria

00:47:51.180 were taken

00:47:52.080 which by Syria

00:47:53.620 I mean

00:47:53.780 the Middle East

00:47:54.280 and Egypt

00:47:55.440 and most of

00:47:55.980 what we would

00:47:56.360 call Libya

00:47:56.780 though there

00:47:57.160 wasn't much

00:47:57.580 there anyway

00:47:58.080 and then

00:47:59.340 Tunisia

00:48:00.160 I mean

00:48:01.320 think about

00:48:01.640 Augustine

00:48:02.280 St. Augustine

00:48:03.040 who was known

00:48:03.320 as the father

00:48:03.820 of sort of

00:48:04.480 western theology

00:48:05.840 well he was

00:48:06.560 from North Africa

00:48:07.240 from Hippo

00:48:08.120 which I believe

00:48:08.820 is in Tunisia

00:48:10.680 that too

00:48:11.420 was conquered

00:48:11.840 very early

00:48:12.320 maybe by like

00:48:12.980 650s

00:48:13.740 so continuing

00:48:14.900 my metaphor

00:48:15.480 let's say

00:48:16.640 for just

00:48:17.480 for the

00:48:17.840 avoidance

00:48:18.320 of any

00:48:18.880 triggering

00:48:19.800 too far

00:48:20.620 the Hindus

00:48:22.560 have taken

00:48:22.960 over most

00:48:23.440 of Europe

00:48:23.800 and half

00:48:24.360 of the

00:48:24.720 United States

00:48:25.300 and North

00:48:26.020 America

00:48:26.420 and you're

00:48:28.380 what you're

00:48:28.860 saying is

00:48:29.400 that plus

00:48:30.540 the way

00:48:31.060 that the

00:48:31.820 pre-existing

00:48:32.880 population

00:48:33.580 were being

00:48:34.100 treated

00:48:34.500 by their

00:48:35.280 conquerors

00:48:36.460 is what

00:48:37.540 gives rise

00:48:38.120 to the

00:48:38.420 Crusades

00:48:38.900 yeah

00:48:40.280 yeah

00:48:40.840 no

00:48:41.400 I mean

00:48:41.780 it depends

00:48:42.860 on the

00:48:43.320 time we're

00:48:44.360 talking

00:48:44.720 I still

00:48:45.060 haven't gotten

00:48:45.520 to what

00:48:45.920 really gave

00:48:46.580 rise

00:48:46.980 which is

00:48:47.460 similar

00:48:47.940 it was

00:48:48.680 more of

00:48:49.140 the same

00:48:49.600 okay

00:48:50.460 so in

00:48:50.800 other words

00:48:51.120 what I'm

00:48:51.400 talking about

00:48:51.860 is you know

00:48:52.380 the 7th

00:48:52.900 8th

00:48:53.240 9th

00:48:53.700 centuries

00:48:54.400 and that's

00:48:55.360 what's

00:48:55.500 going on

00:48:56.100 and you know

00:48:56.880 Europe knows

00:48:57.420 about it

00:48:57.900 Europe is also

00:48:58.660 bombarded

00:48:59.540 especially from

00:49:00.260 Spain

00:49:00.760 because that's

00:49:01.520 now the

00:49:01.900 latest

00:49:02.400 they're in

00:49:03.620 the continent

00:49:04.060 right

00:49:04.280 they're in

00:49:04.520 Europe

00:49:04.760 but right

00:49:05.980 before the

00:49:06.480 first crusade

00:49:07.040 there was a

00:49:07.460 new sort

00:49:07.980 of

00:49:08.220 outburst

00:49:09.120 Islamic

00:49:09.520 outburst

00:49:10.000 and now

00:49:10.800 the Turks

00:49:11.260 come onto

00:49:11.700 the scene

00:49:12.140 they start

00:49:13.820 coming in

00:49:14.320 really in

00:49:14.780 the 9th

00:49:15.100 century

00:49:15.400 as slaves

00:49:16.880 slave

00:49:17.260 soldiers

00:49:17.660 and they're

00:49:18.560 very good

00:49:19.140 warriors

00:49:19.460 so the

00:49:20.000 caliphates

00:49:20.520 start bringing

00:49:21.100 these Turks

00:49:21.840 from Central

00:49:23.260 Asia

00:49:23.580 as slaves

00:49:24.660 and they

00:49:25.240 Islamize

00:49:25.800 them

00:49:26.060 and they

00:49:26.380 just train

00:49:26.780 them to

00:49:27.040 be great

00:49:27.400 warriors

00:49:28.000 jihadists

00:49:28.680 and before

00:49:29.640 long

00:49:29.940 they essentially

00:49:30.420 take over

00:49:30.920 and so

00:49:31.980 this is the

00:49:32.380 Abbasid

00:49:32.780 Caliphate

00:49:33.260 the Golden

00:49:33.840 Age

00:49:34.120 Caliphate

00:49:34.620 and before

00:49:35.520 long

00:49:35.980 you know

00:49:36.320 you have

00:49:36.640 these

00:49:37.000 the Turks

00:49:37.580 especially

00:49:38.420 with the

00:49:38.780 Seljuk

00:49:39.180 Empire

00:49:39.640 this is

00:49:40.120 now

00:49:40.440 we're

00:49:40.780 coming right

00:49:41.140 before the

00:49:41.500 first crusade

00:49:42.100 they essentially

00:49:43.480 they keep the

00:49:44.000 Abbasid

00:49:44.540 Caliph as a

00:49:45.760 puppet

00:49:45.980 right

00:49:46.700 but now

00:49:47.180 they're the

00:49:47.500 real power

00:49:48.000 and they're

00:49:49.480 the sultan

00:49:49.920 in fact the

00:49:50.400 word sultan

00:49:50.800 means power

00:49:51.440 holder

00:49:51.760 so now

00:49:52.880 so let's

00:49:53.940 say

00:49:54.220 okay the

00:49:54.760 first crusade

00:49:55.160 is 1095

00:49:55.680 the Turks

00:49:56.800 really start

00:49:57.360 spreading and

00:49:58.040 causing havoc

00:49:58.600 around 1037

00:49:59.560 and it's

00:50:00.840 especially against

00:50:01.420 the Armenians

00:50:02.060 you know

00:50:02.660 you talk about

00:50:03.040 the Armenian

00:50:03.400 genocide

00:50:03.840 it actually

00:50:04.560 goes back a

00:50:05.140 millennium

00:50:05.520 before what

00:50:06.220 we think

00:50:06.680 you know

00:50:07.380 it's not

00:50:08.000 it's not

00:50:09.020 in the year

00:50:09.780 just 1900

00:50:10.740 early 1900s

00:50:11.860 or late 1800s

00:50:12.800 it actually

00:50:13.220 goes back

00:50:13.640 to the year

00:50:13.960 1000

00:50:14.340 and if you

00:50:15.540 read the

00:50:15.840 sources

00:50:16.160 and I have

00:50:16.680 in mind

00:50:17.000 especially

00:50:17.400 Matthew

00:50:17.880 Vedessa

00:50:18.300 who's a

00:50:19.600 near

00:50:19.740 contemporary

00:50:20.240 what the

00:50:22.020 Turks were

00:50:22.420 doing to

00:50:23.080 the Armenians

00:50:23.920 and of course

00:50:24.340 other Christians

00:50:24.980 as they

00:50:25.400 went further

00:50:26.540 west into

00:50:27.360 Asia Minor

00:50:28.060 is just

00:50:28.920 mind-boggling

00:50:29.540 I mean

00:50:29.880 it talks about

00:50:30.680 tens of

00:50:31.440 thousands of

00:50:32.140 Armenians

00:50:32.500 being massacred

00:50:33.440 thousands of

00:50:34.480 churches

00:50:34.800 being set

00:50:35.380 on fire

00:50:35.860 the capital

00:50:36.800 at the time

00:50:37.380 Ani

00:50:37.780 was known

00:50:38.160 as the

00:50:38.480 city of

00:50:39.220 1001 churches

00:50:40.240 all of which

00:50:40.860 were just

00:50:41.200 completely

00:50:41.700 devastated

00:50:42.180 and torched

00:50:42.780 and you know

00:50:44.100 it's also

00:50:44.640 interesting to

00:50:45.400 note

00:50:45.600 and a lot

00:50:46.160 of historians

00:50:46.460 don't do

00:50:46.840 this

00:50:47.080 they make

00:50:47.420 you think

00:50:47.660 okay

00:50:47.920 these Seljuks

00:50:48.600 were nominal

00:50:49.180 Muslims

00:50:49.740 you know

00:50:50.860 yeah

00:50:51.160 they're called

00:50:51.600 Muslims

00:50:51.940 but they

00:50:52.360 were just

00:50:52.740 you know

00:50:53.060 fighters

00:50:53.420 who were

00:50:53.960 conquering

00:50:54.300 whoever

00:50:54.600 but in

00:50:55.460 the sources

00:50:55.820 you see

00:50:56.320 the religious

00:50:56.760 hostility

00:50:57.360 okay

00:50:57.740 where they

00:50:58.180 like to

00:50:58.660 go and

00:50:59.120 desecrate

00:50:59.600 break crosses

00:51:00.580 and decapitate

00:51:02.040 statues

00:51:02.560 and gouge

00:51:03.080 the eyes

00:51:03.440 of icons

00:51:04.120 and you know

00:51:04.780 of course

00:51:05.160 and desecrate

00:51:06.780 tabern

00:51:07.340 or the

00:51:07.840 altars

00:51:09.000 so that

00:51:10.640 also comes

00:51:11.420 out

00:51:11.720 and

00:51:12.160 this is

00:51:13.660 now going

00:51:14.060 on

00:51:14.460 until the

00:51:15.640 year 1071

00:51:16.340 now in

00:51:16.840 1071

00:51:17.380 you have

00:51:17.940 the pivotal

00:51:18.520 battle

00:51:18.900 of Manzikert

00:51:19.860 which is

00:51:20.380 in that

00:51:20.720 area

00:51:21.020 it's actually

00:51:21.780 it's again

00:51:22.440 in Asia Minor

00:51:23.120 sort of near

00:51:24.040 Lake Vaughn

00:51:24.680 I think

00:51:25.060 again by

00:51:25.860 the Armenian

00:51:26.300 areas

00:51:26.780 and the

00:51:27.880 Eastern Roman

00:51:28.440 Emperor

00:51:28.820 the Byzantine

00:51:29.640 Emperor

00:51:29.960 marches

00:51:31.380 one of

00:51:31.620 their

00:51:31.740 largest

00:51:32.100 armies

00:51:32.880 to stop

00:51:33.820 these

00:51:34.120 Turks

00:51:34.500 and they

00:51:35.380 lose

00:51:35.760 and it's

00:51:36.200 one of

00:51:36.420 the worst

00:51:36.860 and the

00:51:37.380 Emperor

00:51:37.860 gets captured

00:51:38.480 the first

00:51:38.980 one in

00:51:39.400 like a

00:51:39.880 thousand

00:51:40.100 years

00:51:40.340 I think

00:51:40.680 and

00:51:41.560 so now

00:51:42.920 after that

00:51:43.700 they start

00:51:44.380 just spreading

00:51:44.900 further west

00:51:45.640 and cover

00:51:46.080 all of

00:51:46.520 Asia Minor

00:51:47.040 Turkey

00:51:47.660 till they're

00:51:48.700 not far

00:51:49.180 from

00:51:49.360 Constantinople

00:51:50.060 now at

00:51:50.880 the same

00:51:51.200 time

00:51:51.580 these same

00:51:53.000 Turks

00:51:53.400 are

00:51:54.280 from the

00:51:55.960 moment the

00:51:56.480 Holy Land

00:51:56.960 was conquered

00:51:57.580 it was very

00:51:58.280 early on

00:51:58.740 a lot of

00:51:59.020 these

00:51:59.200 Caliphs

00:51:59.600 including the

00:52:00.020 Abbasid

00:52:00.440 like I

00:52:00.740 told you

00:52:01.180 who was

00:52:01.740 sort of

00:52:02.620 diplomatic

00:52:02.980 relations

00:52:03.580 with Charlemagne

00:52:04.460 they allowed

00:52:05.280 pilgrimage was

00:52:06.300 very important

00:52:06.800 to Christians

00:52:07.340 okay

00:52:08.240 especially after

00:52:09.180 Constantine

00:52:09.960 you know

00:52:10.980 really rebuilt

00:52:11.720 Jerusalem

00:52:12.260 built the

00:52:12.760 church

00:52:12.980 of the

00:52:13.180 Holy Sepulchre

00:52:13.860 around where

00:52:14.760 Christ was

00:52:15.400 buried and

00:52:16.200 crucified and

00:52:16.840 resurrected

00:52:17.160 was a huge

00:52:17.600 complex

00:52:17.980 so pilgrimages

00:52:19.500 were a major

00:52:20.000 thing

00:52:20.340 and a lot of

00:52:21.140 Muslims allowed

00:52:21.680 Christians to

00:52:22.180 come

00:52:22.380 especially during

00:52:23.780 the Abbasid

00:52:24.340 period

00:52:24.640 you have to

00:52:25.600 pay of

00:52:26.020 course

00:52:26.360 and you

00:52:26.940 know

00:52:27.040 put up

00:52:27.340 with all

00:52:27.600 sorts of

00:52:27.920 things

00:52:28.180 but they

00:52:29.060 would come

00:52:29.460 but now

00:52:29.800 these Turks

00:52:30.840 they really

00:52:32.180 went

00:52:32.480 they ran

00:52:32.980 havoc

00:52:33.400 and they

00:52:34.600 started attacking

00:52:35.260 pilgrims

00:52:36.060 they started

00:52:36.640 charging them

00:52:37.620 even more

00:52:38.060 money

00:52:38.360 and then not

00:52:38.900 letting them

00:52:39.340 go

00:52:39.640 and one of

00:52:40.460 the worst

00:52:40.860 anecdotes

00:52:43.160 that was pretty

00:52:43.620 famous that

00:52:44.140 happened in

00:52:44.560 1064

00:52:45.120 was a large

00:52:46.540 German pilgrimage

00:52:47.440 went to

00:52:49.180 went to

00:52:50.320 the Holy Land

00:52:50.880 and among

00:52:51.720 them is

00:52:52.480 described

00:52:53.000 it's an

00:52:53.880 early source

00:52:54.400 they describe

00:52:54.940 a very

00:52:55.320 beautiful

00:52:55.720 abbess

00:52:56.220 head nun

00:52:56.900 who was

00:52:57.960 told don't

00:52:58.380 do it

00:52:58.660 because everyone

00:52:59.080 knew it was

00:52:59.620 dangerous to

00:53:00.320 go on

00:53:00.580 pilgrimage

00:53:00.920 but she

00:53:02.180 wouldn't

00:53:02.440 relent

00:53:02.820 and she

00:53:03.160 went

00:53:03.380 and they

00:53:03.660 say

00:53:04.000 all of

00:53:04.960 them were

00:53:05.760 killed

00:53:06.040 by the

00:53:06.380 Turks

00:53:06.600 and she

00:53:07.000 was gang

00:53:07.500 raped

00:53:07.820 until she

00:53:08.680 died

00:53:09.080 and then

00:53:09.800 it says

00:53:10.120 in the

00:53:10.360 end

00:53:10.520 and the

00:53:11.080 Turks

00:53:11.260 did this

00:53:11.640 very

00:53:11.840 frequently

00:53:12.240 to

00:53:12.480 pilgrims

00:53:12.880 and of

00:53:14.200 course

00:53:14.360 they were

00:53:14.620 desecrating

00:53:15.200 the Christian

00:53:16.200 holy sites

00:53:16.840 including

00:53:17.440 the holy

00:53:17.840 sepulcher

00:53:18.300 and actually

00:53:19.540 before that

00:53:20.220 before the

00:53:20.840 Turks

00:53:21.040 just so you

00:53:21.800 don't think

00:53:22.180 it's just

00:53:22.640 the Turks

00:53:23.160 but a

00:53:23.940 Fatimid

00:53:24.460 Caliph

00:53:24.860 from Egypt

00:53:25.580 Hakim

00:53:26.460 Amrallah

00:53:26.940 in the

00:53:27.480 year

00:53:27.620 1009

00:53:28.280 actually

00:53:29.220 destroyed

00:53:29.920 the holy

00:53:30.600 sepulcher

00:53:31.020 raised it

00:53:31.860 to the

00:53:32.060 ground

00:53:32.340 and according

00:53:33.500 to Muslim

00:53:33.960 sources

00:53:34.400 and I'm

00:53:35.360 thinking of

00:53:35.880 Al-Makrizi

00:53:36.920 who's an

00:53:37.320 Egyptian

00:53:37.560 historian

00:53:38.040 he wrote

00:53:39.040 that

00:53:39.360 this guy

00:53:40.640 this Fatimid

00:53:41.220 Caliph

00:53:41.520 destroyed

00:53:42.280 30,000

00:53:43.200 churches

00:53:43.680 and synagogues

00:53:45.700 in Egypt

00:53:46.900 in greater

00:53:47.360 Syria

00:53:47.680 which makes

00:53:48.220 sense

00:53:48.620 because like

00:53:49.040 I told you

00:53:49.440 that was

00:53:49.900 a very

00:53:50.220 Christian

00:53:50.700 heavily

00:53:51.320 Christianized

00:53:51.960 region

00:53:52.340 one of the

00:53:52.720 oldest

00:53:52.980 and at that

00:53:55.580 time in

00:53:55.920 1009

00:53:56.380 the Pope

00:53:56.800 of the time

00:53:57.180 wanted to

00:53:57.620 call

00:53:57.920 a proto-crusade

00:54:00.500 they didn't have

00:54:00.940 it at the

00:54:01.240 time

00:54:01.480 and nothing

00:54:02.500 happened

00:54:03.020 but then

00:54:03.720 like I said

00:54:04.580 so now

00:54:05.100 it's building

00:54:05.520 up and you're

00:54:06.080 getting these

00:54:06.540 Turks doing

00:54:07.060 what they're

00:54:07.380 doing

00:54:07.680 and they're

00:54:08.020 killing

00:54:08.300 European

00:54:08.780 pilgrims

00:54:09.300 and now

00:54:10.320 the Emperor

00:54:10.900 of Constantinople

00:54:12.620 they're right

00:54:13.340 there

00:54:13.620 at his

00:54:13.940 doorstep

00:54:14.480 in Asia

00:54:15.880 Minor

00:54:16.160 right across

00:54:16.840 the Straits

00:54:17.320 from Constantinople

00:54:18.580 so he calls

00:54:19.140 for aid

00:54:19.520 and that was

00:54:21.000 the origin

00:54:21.620 of the First

00:54:22.120 Crusade

00:54:22.540 and what was

00:54:23.560 the stated

00:54:24.600 objective

00:54:25.060 of the First

00:54:25.580 Crusade

00:54:25.840 what did they

00:54:26.260 actually want

00:54:26.820 for the

00:54:27.420 pilgrims

00:54:27.760 to be able

00:54:28.120 to go

00:54:28.480 unmolested

00:54:29.060 or to

00:54:29.560 recapture

00:54:30.060 the land

00:54:31.060 or what

00:54:31.380 was the

00:54:31.740 plan

00:54:31.960 well the

00:54:32.380 ultimate

00:54:32.640 goal

00:54:32.920 of course

00:54:33.300 was to

00:54:33.700 have

00:54:33.900 pilgrims

00:54:34.360 to be

00:54:34.640 able

00:54:34.820 to go

00:54:35.120 to the

00:54:35.380 Holy

00:54:35.560 Land

00:54:35.880 unmolested

00:54:36.500 that was

00:54:37.180 number one

00:54:37.900 but it was

00:54:38.380 obvious

00:54:38.640 that's not

00:54:38.980 going to

00:54:39.180 happen

00:54:39.400 it hadn't

00:54:40.240 really happened

00:54:40.720 even before

00:54:41.220 the Turks

00:54:41.640 like I told

00:54:42.040 you there

00:54:42.220 was a lot

00:54:42.560 of exploitation

00:54:43.260 and abuse

00:54:43.820 but now

00:54:44.260 they were

00:54:44.680 just running

00:54:45.200 you know

00:54:45.920 amok

00:54:46.380 and killing

00:54:46.980 anyone

00:54:47.360 and everyone

00:54:47.760 and abusing

00:54:48.180 them

00:54:48.420 so it was

00:54:49.140 basically

00:54:49.500 time to

00:54:50.140 retake

00:54:50.800 the Holy

00:54:51.220 Land

00:54:51.480 which used

00:54:51.940 to be

00:54:52.180 Christian

00:54:52.500 before the

00:54:52.900 Muslims

00:54:53.200 took it

00:54:54.120 and

00:54:54.760 because you

00:54:55.940 couldn't rely

00:54:56.360 on the Muslims

00:54:56.780 anymore

00:54:57.100 so it was

00:54:57.440 time to

00:54:57.780 retake

00:54:58.300 and rededicate

00:54:59.420 and you

00:55:00.460 know

00:55:00.540 cleanse

00:55:00.980 the Holy

00:55:01.460 Land

00:55:01.800 from

00:55:02.200 these people

00:55:03.300 that was

00:55:03.860 number one

00:55:04.260 but also

00:55:04.780 the number

00:55:05.920 one

00:55:06.100 the second

00:55:06.500 one which is

00:55:07.000 not really

00:55:08.040 remembered much

00:55:09.400 about is

00:55:09.840 was to help

00:55:10.600 fellow Christians

00:55:11.260 the Eastern

00:55:11.800 Church

00:55:12.160 the call

00:55:13.040 from

00:55:13.320 you know

00:55:14.000 according to

00:55:14.380 some historians

00:55:14.880 that was

00:55:15.440 the chief

00:55:15.940 catalyst

00:55:16.480 one historian

00:55:18.860 recently wrote

00:55:19.440 a book

00:55:19.640 Franco Pan

00:55:20.320 I think

00:55:20.580 is his name

00:55:21.080 and that's

00:55:21.460 the whole

00:55:21.720 thesis

00:55:22.100 which is

00:55:22.480 this was

00:55:22.760 really

00:55:23.160 orchestrated

00:55:24.480 and ultimately

00:55:25.100 because of

00:55:25.640 Alexius

00:55:26.140 the Emperor

00:55:26.600 who needed

00:55:27.080 because of

00:55:28.120 what was

00:55:28.460 happening

00:55:28.720 to him

00:55:29.040 and so

00:55:29.700 one of the

00:55:30.040 verses

00:55:30.300 even that

00:55:30.920 biblical

00:55:31.400 verses

00:55:31.740 a lot

00:55:32.120 of Christians

00:55:32.660 and you

00:55:33.260 see

00:55:33.500 it was

00:55:34.160 basically

00:55:34.560 you know

00:55:34.920 where Jesus

00:55:35.300 says

00:55:35.620 love God

00:55:36.120 with all

00:55:36.340 your heart

00:55:36.680 and love

00:55:37.000 your fellow

00:55:37.320 man

00:55:37.620 so

00:55:38.260 loving God

00:55:39.400 was going

00:55:39.720 because holy

00:55:40.640 places

00:55:41.020 mattered

00:55:41.600 then

00:55:42.100 and it

00:55:42.720 was going

00:55:43.080 to liberate

00:55:44.040 his holy

00:55:44.580 the holy

00:55:45.060 land

00:55:45.320 and loving

00:55:45.940 your fellow

00:55:46.260 man

00:55:46.480 was helping

00:55:46.980 these eastern

00:55:47.660 Christians

00:55:48.040 and pilgrims

00:55:49.100 who wanted

00:55:50.100 you know

00:55:51.040 to go

00:55:51.420 and not be

00:55:52.040 molested

00:55:52.480 so that

00:55:53.160 and it

00:55:54.340 you know

00:55:54.880 it's just

00:55:55.300 sad because

00:55:55.880 a lot of

00:55:56.460 people and

00:55:57.160 historians

00:55:57.780 will argue

00:55:58.520 you know

00:55:59.440 give you

00:55:59.700 these cynical

00:56:00.160 motives

00:56:00.660 you know

00:56:01.900 oh this

00:56:02.320 is second

00:56:02.700 sons

00:56:03.160 this was an

00:56:03.900 old thesis

00:56:04.380 that I think

00:56:04.780 goes to

00:56:05.300 you know

00:56:05.780 Runciman

00:56:06.280 Stephen Runciman

00:56:08.680 where basically

00:56:10.140 oh a lot

00:56:11.080 of these

00:56:11.300 were just

00:56:11.580 second sons

00:56:12.120 who just

00:56:12.520 had no

00:56:12.860 inheritance

00:56:13.200 so they

00:56:13.560 just wanted

00:56:13.820 to go

00:56:14.140 and it was

00:56:14.600 it was a

00:56:15.040 colonizing

00:56:15.480 mission

00:56:15.760 that had

00:56:16.120 no rhyme

00:56:16.940 or reason

00:56:17.380 well if you

00:56:18.180 look at the

00:56:18.540 sources

00:56:18.800 that's all

00:56:19.220 they talk

00:56:19.600 about is

00:56:20.040 what's happening

00:56:20.560 to Christians

00:56:21.100 how they're

00:56:21.780 being slaughtered

00:56:22.680 how the

00:56:23.240 holy land

00:56:23.760 is being

00:56:24.060 defiled

00:56:24.580 and polluted

00:56:25.220 and how we

00:56:26.020 have to do

00:56:26.440 something about

00:56:26.960 it

00:56:27.140 so I mean

00:56:27.960 that is

00:56:28.560 unequivocally

00:56:29.180 clear from

00:56:29.780 an objective

00:56:30.740 reading of

00:56:31.220 the sources

00:56:31.600 there's

00:56:32.960 something

00:56:33.220 powerful

00:56:33.700 about going

00:56:34.360 back to

00:56:34.800 first principles

00:56:35.560 especially

00:56:36.340 when it

00:56:36.740 comes to

00:56:37.040 thinking

00:56:37.340 about

00:56:37.640 politics

00:56:38.120 and

00:56:38.500 liberty

00:56:38.860 the

00:56:39.280 federalist

00:56:39.780 papers

00:56:40.140 do

00:56:40.440 just

00:56:40.740 that

00:56:41.060 they lay

00:56:41.820 out

00:56:42.080 the

00:56:42.300 original

00:56:42.760 arguments

00:56:43.340 behind

00:56:43.780 the

00:56:44.000 US

00:56:44.220 constitution

00:56:44.860 written

00:56:45.580 by people

00:56:46.220 who had

00:56:46.600 just won

00:56:47.020 a revolution

00:56:47.600 and were

00:56:48.220 trying to

00:56:48.720 build

00:56:48.980 something

00:56:49.400 better

00:56:49.880 Hillsdale

00:56:50.660 college's

00:56:51.240 new

00:56:51.460 online

00:56:51.900 course

00:56:52.320 the

00:56:52.520 federalist

00:56:53.040 takes

00:56:53.380 you

00:56:53.540 inside

00:56:54.060 these

00:56:54.360 essays

00:56:54.720 you'll

00:56:55.300 learn

00:56:55.480 how

00:56:55.680 Hamilton

00:56:56.160 Madison

00:56:56.740 and

00:56:57.020 Jay

00:56:57.260 thought

00:56:57.960 about

00:56:58.260 government

00:56:58.700 human

00:56:59.100 nature

00:56:59.480 and

00:56:59.740 freedom

00:57:00.120 and why

00:57:01.000 their

00:57:01.200 ideas

00:57:01.700 still

00:57:02.120 matter

00:57:02.400 today

00:57:02.840 watch

00:57:03.400 it all

00:57:03.660 now

00:57:03.860 for free

00:57:04.400 at

00:57:04.740 hillsdale.edu

00:57:06.300 slash

00:57:07.020 trigger

00:57:07.300 it's not

00:57:08.040 a dry

00:57:08.360 history

00:57:08.700 lesson

00:57:09.080 it's a

00:57:09.820 window

00:57:10.140 into the

00:57:10.760 foundations

00:57:11.260 of real

00:57:12.020 democracy

00:57:12.640 how to

00:57:13.360 design a

00:57:13.920 system

00:57:14.200 that guards

00:57:14.740 liberty

00:57:15.120 without

00:57:15.700 collapsing

00:57:16.220 into

00:57:16.600 chaos

00:57:17.020 it's

00:57:17.600 thoughtful

00:57:18.000 clear

00:57:18.620 and

00:57:18.980 entirely

00:57:19.460 free

00:57:19.820 if you

00:57:20.500 care

00:57:20.740 about

00:57:20.960 political

00:57:21.380 philosophy

00:57:21.960 good

00:57:22.540 government

00:57:22.960 or

00:57:23.320 just

00:57:23.580 want

00:57:23.820 to

00:57:23.960 understand

00:57:24.340 how

00:57:24.600 power

00:57:24.940 is

00:57:25.160 supposed

00:57:25.560 to

00:57:25.820 work

00:57:26.180 go

00:57:26.500 to

00:57:26.700 hillsdale.edu

00:57:27.960 slash

00:57:28.680 trigger

00:57:29.000 and enroll

00:57:32.920 for free

00:57:33.580 and we

00:57:35.280 had another

00:57:36.060 historian

00:57:36.500 Dan Johns

00:57:37.020 on the

00:57:37.240 show

00:57:37.340 to talk

00:57:37.740 about

00:57:37.940 the

00:57:38.100 crusades

00:57:38.480 it

00:57:38.620 didn't

00:57:38.860 sound

00:57:39.160 like

00:57:39.440 the way

00:57:40.160 he told

00:57:40.540 it

00:57:40.640 at least

00:57:40.880 like a

00:57:41.180 particularly

00:57:41.460 successful

00:57:42.060 or happy

00:57:42.500 story

00:57:42.860 really

00:57:43.200 yeah

00:57:43.940 really

00:57:44.700 the only

00:57:45.020 successful

00:57:45.500 was the

00:57:45.880 first

00:57:46.060 one

00:57:46.260 it

00:57:46.920 did

00:57:47.140 achieve

00:57:47.380 its

00:57:47.560 mission

00:57:47.840 it

00:57:48.020 liberated

00:57:48.520 Jerusalem

00:57:50.000 and

00:57:50.460 not just

00:57:51.760 Jerusalem

00:57:52.060 but

00:57:52.240 they had

00:57:53.460 various

00:57:53.760 counties

00:57:54.260 and the

00:57:55.560 first one

00:57:55.920 being

00:57:56.100 Edessa

00:57:56.560 and

00:57:57.240 principalities

00:57:58.120 so they

00:57:59.000 carved a

00:58:00.060 whole

00:58:00.360 niche

00:58:00.920 that became

00:58:01.400 part of

00:58:01.780 Christendom

00:58:02.300 and pilgrims

00:58:03.400 were allowed

00:58:03.720 to come

00:58:04.200 and

00:58:04.420 what not

00:58:05.080 but then

00:58:05.360 after that

00:58:05.840 yeah

00:58:06.040 every other

00:58:07.420 crusade

00:58:08.000 the second

00:58:09.060 was a

00:58:09.340 complete

00:58:09.540 disaster

00:58:10.060 the third

00:58:11.020 had made

00:58:11.500 minimal gains

00:58:12.300 with King

00:58:12.780 Richard

00:58:13.080 but

00:58:14.000 it didn't

00:58:15.060 it didn't

00:58:15.560 re-win

00:58:16.240 Jerusalem

00:58:17.380 but it

00:58:17.940 made good

00:58:18.480 gains

00:58:18.860 because right

00:58:19.540 before it

00:58:20.060 right before

00:58:20.640 the third

00:58:20.980 crusade

00:58:21.400 it looked

00:58:21.820 like

00:58:22.080 Saladin

00:58:22.400 was going

00:58:22.660 to completely

00:58:23.040 eject the

00:58:23.700 crusaders

00:58:24.040 once and

00:58:24.440 for all

00:58:24.800 that was

00:58:25.460 his goal

00:58:25.840 but with

00:58:26.640 the third

00:58:27.380 that's the

00:58:28.240 second most

00:58:28.720 successful

00:58:29.220 King

00:58:30.180 Richard

00:58:30.420 actually

00:58:30.820 gave kind

00:58:31.780 of a

00:58:32.000 breathing

00:58:32.180 space

00:58:32.520 back to

00:58:32.860 the

00:58:33.000 Christians

00:58:33.320 and

00:58:33.920 re-won

00:58:34.720 various

00:58:35.240 regions

00:58:35.680 and then

00:58:37.140 you know

00:58:37.380 the fourth

00:58:37.940 crusade

00:58:38.380 was neither

00:58:38.940 here nor

00:58:39.360 there

00:58:39.680 that just

00:58:40.100 went

00:58:40.320 spun off

00:58:41.080 course

00:58:41.420 completely

00:58:41.900 well they

00:58:42.880 sacked

00:58:43.140 Constantinople

00:58:43.880 that's the

00:58:44.180 one where

00:58:44.460 they sacked

00:58:44.820 Constantinople

00:58:45.600 and I

00:58:46.620 mean that's

00:58:46.960 the big

00:58:47.240 aha moment

00:58:47.920 that everyone

00:58:48.380 loves to

00:58:48.940 like harp

00:58:50.200 on you know

00:58:50.720 the fourth

00:58:51.240 crusade

00:58:51.820 and it's

00:58:52.800 just I don't

00:58:53.480 find it as

00:58:53.920 remarkable as

00:58:54.560 most people

00:58:54.900 think

00:58:55.240 if you really

00:58:56.420 look at it

00:58:57.160 it started off

00:58:58.620 as a normal

00:58:59.020 crusade and

00:58:59.580 you had all

00:58:59.960 these various

00:59:01.600 crusaders I

00:59:02.280 think from

00:59:02.540 France

00:59:02.860 wanted you

00:59:04.580 know commissioned

00:59:05.440 Venice to

00:59:05.960 build a lot

00:59:06.480 of ships

00:59:06.740 for them

00:59:07.060 but when

00:59:08.240 the time

00:59:08.580 came only

00:59:09.020 one-third

00:59:09.500 of the

00:59:10.400 crusaders

00:59:10.960 actually

00:59:11.360 showed up

00:59:11.760 the rest

00:59:12.180 came to

00:59:13.140 the Holy

00:59:13.420 Land

00:59:13.680 I think

00:59:13.980 they were

00:59:14.160 going to

00:59:14.420 Egypt

00:59:14.620 again

00:59:14.900 that was

00:59:15.560 the target

00:59:15.920 but they

00:59:16.200 went through

00:59:16.480 different routes

00:59:17.120 and they

00:59:17.800 couldn't pay

00:59:18.320 and the

00:59:19.200 you know

00:59:19.460 the Venetians

00:59:20.120 just insisted

00:59:20.840 so the

00:59:21.300 Venetians

00:59:21.660 kind of said

00:59:22.060 all right

00:59:22.380 you know

00:59:22.700 we'll forgive

00:59:23.540 the dead

00:59:23.840 but come

00:59:24.200 help us

00:59:24.540 conquer

00:59:24.820 these guys

00:59:25.560 fellow

00:59:26.820 Christians

00:59:27.200 who were

00:59:27.680 creating

00:59:28.200 problems

00:59:28.660 for Venice

00:59:29.280 the long

00:59:30.600 story short

00:59:31.160 though is the

00:59:31.600 Pope was

00:59:31.980 completely

00:59:32.400 against all

00:59:32.920 this

00:59:33.180 you know

00:59:33.760 and if you're

00:59:34.160 going to judge

00:59:34.820 an institution

00:59:35.340 you have to

00:59:35.680 look at its

00:59:36.040 head

00:59:36.300 not the

00:59:37.160 individuals

00:59:37.800 who go off

00:59:38.600 you know

00:59:38.980 go off on

00:59:39.720 their own

00:59:40.020 thing

00:59:40.400 and a lot

00:59:41.060 of the

00:59:41.300 Christians

00:59:41.620 even when

00:59:42.580 they made

00:59:43.080 this pact

00:59:43.480 left

00:59:43.880 so it was

00:59:44.260 a small

00:59:44.680 corps

00:59:45.120 that went

00:59:46.100 and sacked

00:59:46.860 this I think

00:59:47.600 it's Zora

00:59:48.100 on behalf

00:59:50.140 of Venice

00:59:50.980 and then long

00:59:52.000 story short

00:59:52.680 you know

00:59:53.100 they still

00:59:53.500 were trying

00:59:53.840 to go

00:59:54.200 and they

00:59:54.580 ended up

00:59:55.060 you know

00:59:55.660 making an

00:59:56.220 alliance

00:59:56.580 with some

00:59:57.060 ousted

00:59:57.560 Byzantine

00:59:58.440 prince

00:59:58.900 and you

01:00:00.500 know

01:00:00.660 and they

01:00:01.040 helped him

01:00:01.800 and this

01:00:02.320 goes on

01:00:02.680 for two

01:00:02.940 years

01:00:03.300 but then they

01:00:03.760 don't get

01:00:04.060 what he

01:00:04.400 said

01:00:04.820 they should

01:00:05.280 get

01:00:05.660 the reward

01:00:07.060 or whatever

01:00:07.580 and finally

01:00:08.380 they just

01:00:08.820 ran amok

01:00:09.360 and conquered

01:00:09.880 it

01:00:10.080 and they

01:00:11.480 all got

01:00:12.080 excommunicated

01:00:12.880 Pope Innocent

01:00:14.100 III was just

01:00:15.280 completely

01:00:15.660 disgusted

01:00:16.560 with the

01:00:16.860 whole affair

01:00:17.280 so my

01:00:18.040 point is

01:00:18.560 you know

01:00:18.800 of course

01:00:19.760 things go

01:00:20.660 off the

01:00:21.000 rail

01:00:21.240 but officially

01:00:22.260 the representatives

01:00:23.200 of the

01:00:24.320 crusading

01:00:24.640 venture

01:00:24.920 were completely

01:00:25.360 against it

01:00:25.940 you know

01:00:26.580 so these

01:00:27.020 individuals

01:00:27.440 did what

01:00:27.820 they did

01:00:28.280 but anyway

01:00:29.720 and then

01:00:30.840 the fifth

01:00:31.140 crusade

01:00:31.720 comes

01:00:32.620 and that

01:00:32.980 goes again

01:00:33.460 to Egypt

01:00:34.180 and that

01:00:34.680 almost won

01:00:35.440 they almost

01:00:36.380 were victorious

01:00:37.100 because before

01:00:38.300 long they

01:00:38.620 realized you

01:00:39.160 can't hold

01:00:40.080 Jerusalem

01:00:40.480 without conquering

01:00:41.120 Egypt

01:00:41.440 and so a lot

01:00:43.340 of them

01:00:43.580 that became

01:00:44.360 the focal

01:00:44.860 point

01:00:45.320 but that

01:00:46.220 also

01:00:46.760 failed

01:00:47.660 and the

01:00:49.640 sixth crusade

01:00:50.540 isn't really

01:00:50.960 a crusade

01:00:51.500 it's you know

01:00:52.200 the emperor

01:00:52.860 Frederick

01:00:53.360 I forget

01:00:54.540 which number

01:00:55.100 but he

01:00:55.820 actually

01:00:56.120 reclaims

01:00:56.820 Jerusalem

01:00:57.200 and without

01:00:58.620 war

01:00:58.940 and he's

01:00:59.940 hated

01:01:00.260 because

01:01:01.480 the way

01:01:01.800 he did

01:01:02.080 it

01:01:02.220 is seen

01:01:02.640 very cynical

01:01:03.140 and he

01:01:03.460 in fact

01:01:03.720 is kind

01:01:04.100 of a cynical

01:01:04.500 guy

01:01:04.840 he's a very

01:01:05.200 interesting

01:01:05.500 character

01:01:05.860 I talk

01:01:06.260 about him

01:01:06.640 in that

01:01:07.700 book

01:01:07.900 actually

01:01:08.260 but he

01:01:09.480 kind of

01:01:09.840 you know

01:01:10.040 he just

01:01:10.340 mocks

01:01:10.620 Christians

01:01:11.000 and Jews

01:01:11.420 and Muslims

01:01:11.920 and thinks

01:01:12.340 they're all

01:01:12.680 you know

01:01:13.220 but he'll

01:01:13.600 give lip service

01:01:14.380 to whoever

01:01:15.020 anyway

01:01:16.100 it was seen

01:01:16.720 as a cynical

01:01:17.180 deal

01:01:17.560 that was not

01:01:18.040 good or

01:01:18.380 advantageous

01:01:19.100 and before

01:01:19.720 long it all

01:01:20.280 does unravel

01:01:21.020 again

01:01:21.460 and one

01:01:22.720 of the worst

01:01:23.180 attacks

01:01:23.560 comes soon

01:01:24.100 after

01:01:24.480 which prompts

01:01:25.560 the seventh

01:01:26.180 crusade

01:01:26.700 in 1244

01:01:28.680 the attack

01:01:29.980 by this

01:01:30.480 kind of

01:01:30.920 Muslim

01:01:31.720 Egyptian

01:01:32.920 Tatar

01:01:33.420 or

01:01:34.160 they're both

01:01:35.620 Muslims

01:01:35.960 some savage

01:01:36.660 group

01:01:36.980 the

01:01:37.480 who come

01:01:38.660 from the

01:01:38.960 east

01:01:39.280 and they

01:01:40.180 engage in

01:01:40.620 some of

01:01:40.840 the most

01:01:41.280 obscene

01:01:41.980 atrocities

01:01:43.000 against the

01:01:43.460 Christians

01:01:43.880 of the

01:01:44.180 holy land

01:01:44.700 who are

01:01:44.880 already

01:01:45.140 quickly

01:01:45.720 dwindling

01:01:46.180 and then

01:01:46.420 you get

01:01:46.700 the seventh

01:01:47.580 crusade

01:01:47.960 King

01:01:48.200 Louis

01:01:48.460 St.

01:01:49.040 Louis

01:01:49.220 another

01:01:50.200 abysmal

01:01:50.960 failure

01:01:51.520 you know

01:01:52.540 but the

01:01:53.080 guy meant

01:01:53.420 very well

01:01:54.020 that's why

01:01:54.680 he became

01:01:55.060 sainted

01:01:55.380 and then

01:01:55.780 the eighth

01:01:56.240 crusade

01:01:56.540 is him

01:01:57.060 again

01:01:57.360 and then

01:01:57.780 he finally

01:01:58.060 dies

01:01:58.580 and that

01:01:59.340 fails

01:01:59.700 and then

01:02:00.320 you have

01:02:00.480 the ninth

01:02:00.740 crusade

01:02:01.180 which is

01:02:01.560 very very

01:02:02.040 small scale

01:02:03.180 and it's

01:02:04.040 Prince Edward

01:02:04.580 who becomes

01:02:05.240 King Edward

01:02:05.760 Longshanks

01:02:07.040 and not

01:02:08.620 the bad

01:02:09.220 guy in

01:02:09.800 Braveheart

01:02:10.860 who's actually

01:02:12.660 kind of

01:02:12.960 he seems

01:02:13.260 like a good

01:02:13.600 guy though

01:02:14.000 when you

01:02:14.280 read the

01:02:14.940 actual

01:02:15.200 sources

01:02:15.600 but

01:02:15.860 and the

01:02:17.240 Longshanks

01:02:17.660 apparently

01:02:17.940 was very

01:02:18.300 tall

01:02:18.720 so anyway

01:02:19.740 yeah

01:02:20.020 ultimately

01:02:20.860 the crusades

01:02:21.600 were a failed

01:02:22.180 venture

01:02:22.520 but

01:02:22.860 when you

01:02:24.420 really look

01:02:24.820 at the

01:02:25.300 whys

01:02:25.840 if anything

01:02:27.500 they're actually

01:02:28.220 more impressive

01:02:28.860 because of

01:02:30.280 how long

01:02:31.160 they managed

01:02:32.020 to last

01:02:32.660 against the

01:02:33.480 odds that

01:02:34.040 they were in

01:02:34.460 remember this

01:02:35.500 is a small

01:02:36.180 group of

01:02:37.160 European Christians

01:02:38.120 traveling to the

01:02:39.440 heart of the

01:02:40.400 lion's den

01:02:40.900 and trying to

01:02:41.800 hold on to it

01:02:42.500 you know the

01:02:43.660 differences between

01:02:44.340 the crusades and

01:02:45.120 the Islamic

01:02:45.560 conquests is the

01:02:46.520 Islamic conquests

01:02:47.600 were basically

01:02:48.600 we're going to

01:02:49.180 conquer anyone

01:02:49.680 who's an

01:02:50.240 infidel

01:02:50.480 and so that

01:02:51.560 what that meant

01:02:52.160 is my immediate

01:02:53.120 neighbor

01:02:53.460 which also

01:02:54.640 meant I

01:02:55.220 got all

01:02:55.740 the resources

01:02:56.980 I'm not

01:02:57.920 deep into

01:02:58.500 enemy territory

01:02:59.300 behind me

01:03:00.040 are all my

01:03:00.500 whole world

01:03:01.580 right

01:03:01.840 I have an

01:03:02.800 endless supply

01:03:03.460 so I'm here

01:03:04.860 and I conquer

01:03:05.400 here and then

01:03:05.960 I consolidate

01:03:06.480 then I go here

01:03:07.260 and I conquer

01:03:07.820 and that's

01:03:08.140 exactly what

01:03:08.560 they did

01:03:08.880 but the

01:03:10.080 crusaders

01:03:10.580 for ideological

01:03:11.480 Christian purposes

01:03:12.640 went all the

01:03:13.760 way into

01:03:14.360 the heart

01:03:15.240 of it

01:03:15.600 and became

01:03:16.340 a tiny

01:03:16.780 group

01:03:17.320 that was

01:03:18.320 continuously

01:03:18.880 dwindling

01:03:19.440 okay

01:03:20.040 this is what

01:03:20.900 gave rise

01:03:21.380 to the

01:03:21.620 military

01:03:21.920 orders

01:03:22.280 who really

01:03:22.680 became the

01:03:23.180 heart of it

01:03:23.660 these guys

01:03:24.440 who were just

01:03:24.800 so utterly

01:03:25.300 committed

01:03:25.660 but and especially

01:03:26.980 as Europe

01:03:27.320 became more

01:03:27.820 and more

01:03:28.060 secularized

01:03:28.620 the numbers

01:03:29.440 became ridiculous

01:03:30.340 so habitually

01:03:31.740 in these battles

01:03:32.640 you would get a

01:03:33.660 guy like Saladin

01:03:34.540 or Baybars

01:03:35.360 they would show

01:03:35.880 up with just

01:03:36.420 ridiculous amounts

01:03:37.320 of numbers

01:03:37.800 which makes sense

01:03:38.500 because this is

01:03:38.940 their homeland

01:03:39.480 they can raise

01:03:40.600 any number

01:03:41.040 of armies

01:03:41.680 and the crusaders

01:03:42.740 are always limited

01:03:43.480 to a few hundred

01:03:44.200 thousand guys

01:03:45.200 so if anything

01:03:46.200 it's actually

01:03:46.780 remarkable that they

01:03:47.640 were able to

01:03:48.200 hold out that

01:03:48.800 long

01:03:49.080 so we've been

01:03:50.100 focusing a lot

01:03:51.260 on the Christian

01:03:52.800 and Muslims

01:03:54.080 so where were

01:03:55.620 the Jews in this

01:03:56.580 because obviously

01:03:57.440 they were in the

01:03:58.300 Holy Land

01:03:58.860 and I mean

01:04:00.500 we can see

01:04:02.160 what happened

01:04:02.760 to Jewish people

01:04:04.300 particularly with

01:04:04.960 Israel and so on

01:04:05.720 and so forth

01:04:06.300 but what role

01:04:07.220 did they play

01:04:07.840 in all of this

01:04:08.380 were they seen

01:04:09.120 as part of it

01:04:09.900 or were they

01:04:10.420 just marginalized

01:04:11.340 and very much

01:04:12.200 a secondary player

01:04:14.000 well I mean

01:04:15.880 it depends on

01:04:16.400 which era

01:04:16.880 and which country

01:04:17.580 and which region

01:04:18.280 so you know

01:04:20.200 the Jews are

01:04:20.640 especially prominent

01:04:21.400 in Spain

01:04:21.880 that's often

01:04:22.640 where you hear

01:04:23.160 about them

01:04:23.600 because you had

01:04:24.660 of course

01:04:25.740 Muslim control

01:04:26.600 in the south

01:04:28.080 and then you had

01:04:28.660 the small Christians

01:04:29.540 in the north

01:04:30.380 who began the

01:04:31.000 Reconquista

01:04:31.520 from the north

01:04:32.240 and spread downwards

01:04:33.200 and then you had

01:04:33.820 the Jews mostly

01:04:34.500 in the south

01:04:35.140 where also other

01:04:36.120 Christians as

01:04:36.760 Dimmis lived

01:04:37.540 and it really depends

01:04:39.840 oftentimes

01:04:40.200 they were actually

01:04:41.360 seen as working

01:04:42.260 and siding

01:04:42.680 with the Muslims

01:04:43.240 and in fact

01:04:44.520 so for example

01:04:45.340 when it came

01:04:46.000 to you know

01:04:46.540 the famous

01:04:47.080 expelling of Muslims

01:04:49.300 it was Muslims

01:04:50.960 and Jews

01:04:51.360 who were expelled

01:04:51.900 in 1492

01:04:52.740 out of Spain

01:04:53.300 and it was

01:04:54.320 kind of for the

01:04:54.940 same reason

01:04:55.420 because they were

01:04:56.500 and this is another

01:04:57.660 very complex topic

01:04:58.740 but you know

01:04:59.460 when

01:05:00.600 so we have

01:05:02.880 I guess

01:05:03.260 we should talk

01:05:03.840 about Spain

01:05:04.260 because it's really

01:05:04.760 a microcosm

01:05:05.560 of everything

01:05:05.940 we're talking about

01:05:06.540 absolutely

01:05:06.860 and you know

01:05:07.840 and a lot of things

01:05:08.560 are very clear

01:05:09.240 when you look there

01:05:09.960 but so

01:05:11.020 as I said

01:05:11.760 Spain gets conquered

01:05:13.020 in the year 711

01:05:14.100 and before that

01:05:15.200 it's Christian

01:05:15.800 okay

01:05:16.540 it was ruled

01:05:17.060 by the Visigoths

01:05:17.880 and anyway

01:05:20.000 a small remnant

01:05:22.040 survives

01:05:22.880 of these Visigoths

01:05:23.540 and they get

01:05:24.100 holed up in the north

01:05:25.020 in the mountains

01:05:26.240 of Astoria

01:05:26.820 in the northwest

01:05:27.800 and even the Muslim

01:05:29.120 sources kind of say

01:05:29.920 what are they going to do

01:05:30.760 who cares

01:05:31.120 let them live in

01:05:31.740 like live up

01:05:32.720 in that crag

01:05:33.540 like a bunch of bums

01:05:35.780 they're like

01:05:36.080 it literally

01:05:36.980 calls them like

01:05:37.720 12 people

01:05:38.260 living on honey

01:05:38.940 anyway

01:05:39.980 before long

01:05:41.440 they persevere

01:05:42.100 the Christians

01:05:42.640 and they start

01:05:43.200 what's called

01:05:43.560 the Reconquista

01:05:44.220 slowly kind of

01:05:45.220 coming southwards

01:05:46.160 and fighting

01:05:46.600 but before that

01:05:48.100 the Muslims

01:05:48.800 in El Andalus

01:05:50.220 as it's known

01:05:50.920 okay Spain

01:05:51.760 and that name

01:05:52.740 by the way

01:05:53.260 is you know

01:05:54.720 the Vandals

01:05:55.360 like the Visigoths

01:05:56.400 the Vandals

01:05:57.240 were another kind

01:05:57.980 of Germanic tribe

01:05:58.640 but they entered

01:05:59.160 into North Africa

01:05:59.980 so they were

01:06:01.060 familiar to Muslims

01:06:02.220 and so when they

01:06:02.960 came to Spain

01:06:03.740 you know

01:06:04.560 Visigoth

01:06:04.980 Vandal

01:06:05.240 same thing

01:06:05.660 but they just

01:06:06.100 knew the word Vandal

01:06:06.900 so Vandal

01:06:07.660 El Andalus

01:06:08.740 became the name

01:06:09.680 that's why it's

01:06:10.560 called that

01:06:10.960 so Muslim

01:06:12.760 controlled Spain

01:06:13.680 you had what

01:06:15.340 we were discussing

01:06:16.180 which is this

01:06:16.800 the me system

01:06:17.540 if you're a Christian

01:06:18.200 or a Jew

01:06:18.660 you live second class

01:06:20.580 right

01:06:20.980 and they lived

01:06:21.620 in their own

01:06:21.980 communities

01:06:22.400 at this time

01:06:22.980 they didn't really

01:06:24.540 consort with each

01:06:25.320 other

01:06:25.600 to a large extent

01:06:27.440 and then up in the

01:06:28.820 north you got

01:06:29.240 the free Christians

01:06:29.980 who are making

01:06:31.000 a comeback

01:06:31.500 okay

01:06:32.140 and so

01:06:34.040 that's the context

01:06:36.460 and this goes on

01:06:37.260 literally for centuries

01:06:38.180 until

01:06:38.840 you know

01:06:40.320 Spain

01:06:41.000 it was known

01:06:42.160 as the Spains

01:06:43.040 because it was really

01:06:43.680 just various kingdoms

01:06:44.720 Aragon

01:06:45.380 Castile

01:06:46.080 Leon

01:06:46.460 Portugal

01:06:47.280 became its own

01:06:48.160 but when it gets

01:06:50.040 unified with Ferdinand

01:06:51.140 and Isabella

01:06:51.780 right in the 1400s

01:06:53.360 they finally

01:06:54.600 managed to

01:06:55.720 get the last

01:06:56.560 Islamic stronghold

01:06:57.560 which is Granada

01:06:58.380 and it's had

01:07:00.200 like half a million

01:07:00.880 Muslims

01:07:01.360 and

01:07:02.480 what happened

01:07:04.300 is they let them live

01:07:05.180 they said

01:07:05.640 okay fine

01:07:06.220 you guys can stay here

01:07:07.160 you can even have

01:07:07.700 your own Islamic

01:07:08.340 culture

01:07:08.880 and your own law

01:07:09.780 and whatever

01:07:10.320 but what happened

01:07:12.420 is the Muslims

01:07:13.040 were always

01:07:14.100 seeking to subvert

01:07:15.580 so on the one hand

01:07:16.660 they acted like

01:07:17.240 they were friends

01:07:17.880 or being docile

01:07:19.720 on the other hand

01:07:21.780 they were conniving

01:07:22.700 with the Ottomans

01:07:23.660 and the Barbary Muslims

01:07:24.740 to help try to bring

01:07:26.320 Spain back to Islamic rule

01:07:27.640 and so

01:07:28.920 in this context

01:07:30.300 this is when

01:07:30.920 this is why

01:07:31.980 so for example

01:07:32.660 you know

01:07:32.960 you hear these crazy things

01:07:34.260 and the medieval Christians

01:07:36.040 just look so intolerant

01:07:37.560 and just evil

01:07:38.620 but here's the backdrop

01:07:39.820 so you hear how the Christians

01:07:41.620 said oh you have to become

01:07:42.780 Christian or get out

01:07:43.780 well that was because

01:07:45.640 before that

01:07:47.040 they gave them

01:07:47.940 the right to do their thing

01:07:49.240 so the idea of

01:07:50.240 Christianizing someone

01:07:51.180 was not because

01:07:52.320 I'm a fanatic

01:07:53.140 and I don't believe in you

01:07:54.000 having your own faith

01:07:54.840 it was that

01:07:55.760 you're never going to stop

01:07:57.040 trying to kill me

01:07:57.620 until you become like me

01:07:59.000 as long as you maintain

01:08:00.520 that tribalistic Islam

01:08:01.800 which they understood

01:08:02.520 you're going to be

01:08:03.840 you're going to

01:08:04.720 obviously work against me

01:08:06.280 so they came up

01:08:07.460 with a decree

01:08:07.940 which is basically

01:08:08.700 become Christian or leave

01:08:09.900 go back to North Africa

01:08:11.300 and then a fatwa

01:08:12.700 and then a fatwa appeared

01:08:13.440 fatwa is a decree

01:08:15.320 by a learned Islamic sheikh

01:08:17.020 which promoted the concept

01:08:18.900 of taqayya

01:08:19.600 and taqayya in Islam

01:08:21.380 is basically

01:08:22.460 you can

01:08:23.440 if you're under duress

01:08:24.480 or being threatened

01:08:25.100 by the infidel

01:08:25.680 you can lie

01:08:26.400 you can say

01:08:26.960 you can say anything

01:08:28.140 you can even engage

01:08:29.420 you can get baptized

01:08:30.380 you can engage in communion

01:08:32.180 you can do all these things

01:08:33.420 as long as in your heart

01:08:34.800 you're still working

01:08:35.580 you're still striving

01:08:36.500 for Islam

01:08:37.420 and then all

01:08:38.860 so overnight

01:08:39.340 like half a million Muslims

01:08:40.440 from Granada

01:08:41.140 became Christian

01:08:41.800 and the crown thought

01:08:44.280 okay

01:08:44.640 you know

01:08:45.240 but then what happened

01:08:46.640 is generation after generation

01:08:48.300 and you have the Christians

01:08:49.640 saying

01:08:49.960 these guys were acting

01:08:50.860 like they were better

01:08:51.460 Christians than us

01:08:52.160 they literally

01:08:53.420 just everything about them

01:08:54.600 was more Christian

01:08:55.400 they went every Sunday

01:08:56.780 but then they found out

01:08:57.740 they were still Muslim

01:08:58.600 at heart

01:08:59.000 and still actually

01:09:00.600 clandestinely working

01:09:02.160 to somehow

01:09:02.900 subvert Spain

01:09:04.120 to Islamic rule

01:09:04.940 and so that's when

01:09:06.200 it finally came to

01:09:07.040 okay

01:09:07.320 even if you convert

01:09:08.200 it doesn't work

01:09:09.060 so you have to leave

01:09:10.020 okay

01:09:10.800 now the Jews are also

01:09:12.260 and so the Inquisition

01:09:13.740 that's

01:09:14.580 the initial Inquisition

01:09:16.400 start in this context

01:09:17.400 because

01:09:18.240 you're saying

01:09:19.420 I'm a Christian

01:09:19.960 but you're really a Muslim

01:09:21.660 right

01:09:22.340 and they have words for them

01:09:23.960 both for the Jews

01:09:24.960 that were doing this

01:09:25.600 and the Muslims

01:09:26.500 who were doing them

01:09:27.020 Morisco

01:09:27.420 is the Muslim

01:09:28.240 and

01:09:29.060 I forget the Jewish word

01:09:31.080 or the word for the Jews

01:09:32.500 that were doing

01:09:32.860 Morenos

01:09:33.580 anyway

01:09:34.860 and

01:09:36.180 so

01:09:37.340 the Jews

01:09:38.140 you know

01:09:38.660 despite

01:09:39.740 despite how things are today

01:09:42.040 the Jews were often

01:09:43.220 actually

01:09:43.780 conflated with Muslims

01:09:45.340 okay

01:09:46.260 and

01:09:46.840 and

01:09:47.280 oftentimes

01:09:48.080 they did work

01:09:48.680 and help them

01:09:49.140 not always

01:09:49.720 and sometimes

01:09:50.480 the Muslims

01:09:50.860 turned and attacked

01:09:51.680 on the Jews

01:09:52.340 as well

01:09:52.820 I mean

01:09:53.340 so it's

01:09:53.680 it's kind of complicated

01:09:54.540 you can't say

01:09:55.240 you know

01:09:55.500 it was always this way

01:09:56.260 or always that way

01:09:56.980 but for example

01:09:58.800 when

01:09:59.340 you know

01:09:59.700 another famous

01:10:00.680 instance

01:10:01.600 where people attack

01:10:02.700 the crusaders

01:10:03.580 is

01:10:03.880 during the first crusade

01:10:04.940 the people's crusades

01:10:05.880 or the peasant crusade

01:10:06.860 went off track again

01:10:08.380 and attacked Jews

01:10:09.220 okay

01:10:10.000 and again

01:10:10.940 the church

01:10:11.540 and the nobles

01:10:12.180 were against that

01:10:13.040 because that's not

01:10:13.700 but the logic was

01:10:14.660 why are we traveling

01:10:15.600 and suffering

01:10:16.600 and going all the way there

01:10:17.500 to fight these

01:10:18.600 Christ enemies

01:10:19.440 when they're right here

01:10:20.340 amongst us

01:10:21.300 so yeah

01:10:22.620 the Jews

01:10:24.700 during this time

01:10:26.780 sort of

01:10:27.720 I think maybe

01:10:28.440 they had a survival instinct

01:10:29.740 and whoever

01:10:30.700 whether there was

01:10:32.280 a Christian

01:10:32.620 or the Muslim

01:10:33.160 was doing better

01:10:34.200 they probably would ally with

01:10:35.640 or try to be on that

01:10:36.640 be on their good side

01:10:37.900 which kind of makes sense

01:10:38.820 from a survivalist point of view

01:10:40.000 so Raymond

01:10:41.640 we've got to the point

01:10:43.180 where

01:10:43.560 we've got peak Islam

01:10:45.920 Islam is at its strongest

01:10:47.840 it is dominant

01:10:49.120 across

01:10:49.800 southern Europe

01:10:50.860 North Africa

01:10:51.820 the Middle East

01:10:52.560 we actually haven't though

01:10:53.440 just so you know

01:10:53.980 because I didn't even get into

01:10:54.840 the Ottomans

01:10:55.360 who conquer

01:10:55.860 southeastern Europe

01:10:56.840 we can talk about it or not

01:10:57.840 but I mean

01:10:58.420 that still isn't even

01:10:59.400 the peak yet

01:11:00.000 but okay

01:11:00.440 right

01:11:00.720 well I guess

01:11:02.620 what I want to take

01:11:03.820 this bit of the conversation

01:11:05.000 now is

01:11:05.600 Islam

01:11:07.020 is dominant

01:11:08.600 and remains dominant

01:11:10.380 for many many centuries

01:11:11.620 and as you say

01:11:12.360 all the way through

01:11:13.360 to the Ottoman Empire

01:11:14.440 it gets as far as India

01:11:16.380 the Mongols

01:11:17.360 at some point

01:11:17.960 right

01:11:18.260 you know

01:11:19.300 I was just

01:11:19.700 in Uzbekistan

01:11:20.780 a few

01:11:21.200 the great warlord

01:11:22.880 Timor Lang

01:11:24.620 yeah

01:11:24.980 well

01:11:25.260 they don't like it

01:11:26.180 when you call them that

01:11:26.960 Timor the Great

01:11:28.280 not the lame

01:11:28.940 yeah

01:11:29.340 they don't like you

01:11:30.000 calling him lame

01:11:30.580 Timor the Great

01:11:31.240 as far as the north of Russia

01:11:33.040 this guy conquered

01:11:33.860 one as far as

01:11:34.620 Byzantium in the west

01:11:35.720 as far as China

01:11:36.440 in the east

01:11:36.900 on the Mongols

01:11:38.000 the same

01:11:38.340 right

01:11:39.520 and then

01:11:42.140 we arrive today

01:11:45.460 if you're born today

01:11:46.640 your instinctive

01:11:48.440 understanding of

01:11:49.920 the Muslim world

01:11:52.320 is

01:11:52.840 it's

01:11:53.880 in the middle east

01:11:55.540 objectively speaking

01:11:58.060 technologically

01:11:58.840 quite backward

01:11:59.600 militarily

01:12:00.960 quite weak

01:12:02.060 not dominant

01:12:05.060 around the world

01:12:06.180 and is

01:12:07.780 at least on the surface

01:12:09.320 this is just how you would think

01:12:10.680 if you were born today

01:12:11.520 engaged in some sort of guerrilla warfare

01:12:14.220 against a much more powerful western force

01:12:17.360 that would be

01:12:18.760 not putting my own perspective on it

01:12:20.680 but that would be the impression you'd get

01:12:22.440 and you mentioned Bernard Lewis

01:12:24.400 he's obviously

01:12:24.980 you wrote a whole book about this

01:12:26.460 what went wrong

01:12:27.180 how do you get

01:12:29.600 from

01:12:30.640 bam

01:12:32.160 massive Islamic expansion

01:12:34.260 conquering all the bits of the world

01:12:36.580 that really matter

01:12:37.260 at that point

01:12:38.440 at least from a

01:12:39.220 you know

01:12:39.540 western perspective

01:12:41.000 to

01:12:42.780 the complete collapse

01:12:45.120 of that dominance

01:12:45.880 and where we are today

01:12:47.480 chances are

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01:13:43.080 Friday March 6th

01:13:44.300 to Wednesday March 11th

01:13:45.480 valid in store and online

01:13:46.660 alright so

01:13:51.700 let's go back a little

01:13:53.760 to the colonial era

01:13:54.780 because this is really

01:13:55.600 what you're describing

01:13:57.940 Islam stays dominant

01:14:00.080 and you're right

01:14:00.740 people forget that

01:14:01.900 Islam

01:14:02.560 especially the Ottoman Empire

01:14:04.060 was the powerhouse

01:14:05.380 you know

01:14:06.100 it's ingrained in people's mind

01:14:07.920 as if Europe was always super powerful

01:14:09.580 and everyone else

01:14:10.260 all these brown people

01:14:11.240 were just being abused

01:14:12.120 and scared of Europe

01:14:12.940 it was the opposite

01:14:13.980 okay as we discussed

01:14:15.380 but especially with the rise

01:14:16.580 of the Ottomans

01:14:17.300 and these guys last from

01:14:19.020 you know 1300s

01:14:20.220 to the 1900s

01:14:21.400 and in 1683

01:14:22.980 they're in Vienna

01:14:23.700 okay with two to three hundred

01:14:25.340 thousand fighters

01:14:26.260 surrounding it

01:14:27.120 so I mean

01:14:28.100 so keep that in mind

01:14:29.320 we started off

01:14:30.100 in the 600s

01:14:31.020 with Muhammad

01:14:31.420 and the first attack

01:14:32.520 on Christian territory

01:14:33.320 in 636

01:14:34.060 1683

01:14:35.460 now we're talking

01:14:36.740 a thousand years later

01:14:37.560 they're around Vienna

01:14:38.620 and they're using

01:14:40.720 the same logic

01:14:41.440 and rationale

01:14:41.980 and they're talking about

01:14:42.920 Islam and Jihad

01:14:43.960 and you have three choices

01:14:45.160 etc etc

01:14:45.940 okay

01:14:46.320 and it's not even just

01:14:48.060 at 1683

01:14:48.800 to bring it to this country

01:14:50.020 the United States

01:14:50.880 it's very first war

01:14:52.560 as a nation

01:14:53.380 in the

01:14:54.540 as a nation

01:14:55.960 meaning after

01:14:56.520 independence from

01:14:57.480 Britain

01:14:58.400 no need to rub it

01:14:59.940 yeah I was trying to

01:15:01.600 word it correctly

01:15:02.460 here

01:15:02.820 but after that

01:15:05.000 and now it's its own country

01:15:06.540 it's first wars

01:15:07.140 with Muslims

01:15:07.740 the Barbary Wars

01:15:08.880 and again

01:15:09.720 they're acting

01:15:10.480 exactly on the same logic

01:15:12.100 and Thomas Jefferson

01:15:13.120 this great paragon

01:15:14.600 of enlightened thinking

01:15:15.660 didn't know Islam

01:15:17.080 as well as

01:15:17.700 he should have

01:15:18.540 because when he met

01:15:19.220 with what the Barbary

01:15:20.500 pirates are doing

01:15:21.100 is actually attack

01:15:21.820 so this is very interesting

01:15:22.980 because it goes back

01:15:23.560 to the idea of Jizya

01:15:24.320 so a lot of these

01:15:25.980 European powers

01:15:26.800 and I'll get to

01:15:27.600 I'll get to your point

01:15:28.600 but I'm just trying

01:15:29.100 to build it up

01:15:29.580 to show you what happened

01:15:30.200 but a lot of these

01:15:31.380 European powers

01:15:32.320 instead of fighting

01:15:33.880 with the Barbary

01:15:34.660 Muslim pirates

01:15:35.400 of North Africa

01:15:36.040 whose entire economy

01:15:38.100 consisted of slave raids

01:15:40.100 and Europeans

01:15:40.700 as far as Iceland

01:15:42.340 they would go

01:15:43.000 and enslave them

01:15:44.360 started just paying them off

01:15:46.160 which the Muslims

01:15:47.120 took as Jizya

01:15:47.900 tribute

01:15:48.220 okay

01:15:48.760 now when the US

01:15:50.180 the United States

01:15:50.900 America

01:15:51.300 broke away from Britain

01:15:53.020 it was no longer

01:15:54.100 covered by

01:15:54.700 Britain's Jizya

01:15:56.540 payments

01:15:57.220 and once the Muslims

01:15:58.640 found that out

01:15:59.200 they started attacking

01:16:00.000 American vessels

01:16:01.300 in the Atlantic

01:16:02.100 and in the Mediterranean

01:16:03.060 and enslaving them

01:16:04.600 and engaging

01:16:05.260 all sorts of horrific

01:16:06.240 you know

01:16:06.980 abuses against them

01:16:08.020 I talk a lot about that

01:16:09.080 in one of my books

01:16:09.680 Sword and Scimitar

01:16:10.300 actually I have a whole

01:16:11.100 chapter about it

01:16:12.220 because if you really

01:16:13.300 read about what was

01:16:14.000 happening to European slaves

01:16:15.220 including these American ones

01:16:16.400 it was really sick stuff

01:16:18.100 anyway

01:16:18.540 so that's what provoked

01:16:19.900 the first war

01:16:20.620 of America

01:16:21.840 with the Barbary

01:16:22.300 but when Jefferson

01:16:23.300 and John Adams met

01:16:24.300 they tried to

01:16:25.040 you know

01:16:25.280 find a diplomatic solution

01:16:26.560 so they met with

01:16:27.320 one of the ambassadors

01:16:28.620 from Barbary

01:16:29.500 Abdul something

01:16:31.320 and they say to him

01:16:34.140 hey

01:16:34.300 why can't we just

01:16:34.980 have peaceful trade

01:16:35.740 and work together

01:16:36.340 etc

01:16:36.600 typical Americans

01:16:38.080 and he basically

01:16:39.580 he sounds like an ISIS guy

01:16:41.680 he goes

01:16:42.100 our prophet

01:16:42.940 and our holy book

01:16:43.840 says you are the infidel

01:16:45.000 you're the enemy

01:16:45.660 and it's our right

01:16:46.460 to plunder

01:16:46.900 kill and enslave you

01:16:47.920 until you acknowledge

01:16:48.860 Allah alone

01:16:49.800 okay

01:16:50.460 so my point is

01:16:51.800 just to give you

01:16:52.540 a sort of totality

01:16:53.480 we started in the 600s

01:16:55.020 this is now 1800

01:16:55.900 first war of America

01:16:57.480 same mentality

01:16:58.580 same logic

01:16:59.440 now

01:16:59.700 what's interesting

01:17:01.140 also about the 1800s

01:17:02.620 is

01:17:03.340 that same year

01:17:04.600 around

01:17:04.960 the first Barbary War

01:17:06.400 is around

01:17:07.200 I think 18 or 1801

01:17:08.360 it starts

01:17:08.820 but in 1800

01:17:10.220 Napoleon

01:17:10.780 enters Egypt

01:17:11.840 or I'm sorry

01:17:12.380 1798

01:17:13.080 and he easily

01:17:14.720 conquers Egypt

01:17:15.440 okay

01:17:15.900 and this is known

01:17:17.460 also as kind of

01:17:18.260 the beginning

01:17:18.560 of the colonial era

01:17:19.600 so the colonial era

01:17:21.020 you see Islam

01:17:22.320 go from this

01:17:22.940 super powerful

01:17:23.640 thing

01:17:24.760 and it starts

01:17:25.700 now

01:17:26.000 it becomes

01:17:26.600 now Europe

01:17:27.520 is super powerful

01:17:28.600 technologically

01:17:29.780 militarily

01:17:30.780 economically

01:17:31.640 and it starts

01:17:33.000 spreading out

01:17:33.680 and conquering

01:17:34.560 its former foe

01:17:35.700 people don't realize

01:17:36.720 this but to the

01:17:37.400 colonial powers

01:17:38.320 a lot of them

01:17:38.860 saw themselves

01:17:39.600 as crusaders

01:17:40.580 they were continuing

01:17:41.720 the war

01:17:42.360 I forget his name

01:17:43.440 is it Allenby

01:17:44.080 but some guy came

01:17:45.180 and you know

01:17:45.920 when they entered

01:17:46.460 and conquered Syria

01:17:47.340 went up to

01:17:48.120 Saladin's tomb

01:17:49.400 supposedly

01:17:49.880 and kicked it

01:17:50.360 and said

01:17:50.640 we're back

01:17:51.220 meaning you know

01:17:52.360 the Franks

01:17:52.880 or the crusaders

01:17:53.420 are back

01:17:53.980 so to a lot

01:17:55.180 of these Europeans

01:17:55.760 they still understood

01:17:57.160 it that way

01:17:57.620 but why it happened

01:17:59.640 I think because

01:18:00.900 the Islamic world

01:18:02.280 as I was kind of

01:18:03.500 telling you

01:18:03.820 its entire economy

01:18:04.800 was based on war

01:18:06.420 and plunder

01:18:07.180 and the slave system

01:18:09.240 okay

01:18:09.820 they never produced

01:18:11.080 anything

01:18:11.560 the way Europe

01:18:13.080 eventually went to

01:18:14.020 especially technologically

01:18:15.160 and militarily

01:18:16.060 so I think

01:18:17.240 once any Muslim

01:18:20.000 region power

01:18:20.920 is unable

01:18:22.160 to conquer

01:18:22.880 and plunder

01:18:23.440 it has no economy

01:18:24.280 and it starts

01:18:25.060 falling apart

01:18:25.740 and this happened

01:18:26.680 before

01:18:27.000 so the Ottoman Empire

01:18:28.520 still persists

01:18:29.340 and why does it persist

01:18:31.620 because it westernizes

01:18:32.480 whereas the rest

01:18:33.800 of the Middle East

01:18:34.540 you know

01:18:34.880 Egypt

01:18:35.340 which was by then

01:18:36.500 sort of run

01:18:37.320 by the Mamluks

01:18:38.160 and all these other areas

01:18:39.320 are completely now

01:18:40.360 just spent

01:18:41.400 you know

01:18:42.180 there's nothing to plunder

01:18:43.560 there's no economy

01:18:44.740 everything's falling apart

01:18:46.020 it's very easily

01:18:46.840 taken over

01:18:47.480 but the Ottomans

01:18:49.560 they westernize

01:18:50.580 which is ironic

01:18:51.760 because the Ottomans

01:18:52.600 were the chief

01:18:53.400 you know

01:18:54.480 standard bearers of jihad

01:18:55.740 they actually took

01:18:56.540 to jihad

01:18:57.140 and articulated

01:18:58.080 more than the Arabs

01:18:58.960 their forebearers did

01:19:00.300 that was their thing

01:19:01.500 okay

01:19:01.840 and you know

01:19:03.120 under Adatürk

01:19:04.000 they actually got rid

01:19:04.760 of the Arabic script

01:19:05.980 took the Roman alphabet

01:19:07.300 dressed in Roman attire

01:19:09.280 I'm sorry

01:19:09.860 not Roman

01:19:10.240 western attire

01:19:11.080 shaved the beards

01:19:12.400 et cetera

01:19:12.760 et cetera

01:19:13.020 so everyone became

01:19:14.100 westward looking

01:19:14.920 including you know

01:19:16.500 the Muslims who could

01:19:17.380 because that was the way

01:19:18.440 to you know

01:19:18.980 win

01:19:19.320 and the Islamic way

01:19:21.020 now that it

01:19:21.580 it kind of spent

01:19:23.740 it became a spent force

01:19:24.820 at this point

01:19:25.680 and it was kind of

01:19:26.620 an anachronism

01:19:27.600 really didn't have much

01:19:29.120 kind of

01:19:29.900 the way it did things

01:19:31.040 was no longer

01:19:31.660 going to work

01:19:32.260 in this new world

01:19:33.540 with Europe

01:19:34.380 the way it was

01:19:35.160 and so that's

01:19:36.860 so the colonial era

01:19:37.720 is a very important thing

01:19:39.500 to keep in mind

01:19:40.160 because you know

01:19:41.900 these

01:19:42.120 it's funny too

01:19:43.560 again here we go

01:19:44.380 the colonial

01:19:45.580 colonial era

01:19:47.220 and what happened

01:19:48.000 nowadays

01:19:48.940 is presented

01:19:50.080 so horrible

01:19:50.640 you know

01:19:50.920 these evil

01:19:51.600 European white guys

01:19:52.880 going into

01:19:53.560 you know

01:19:53.920 these countries

01:19:54.780 not just Muslim countries

01:19:56.020 India

01:19:56.420 and colonizing

01:19:58.100 but what's funny

01:19:59.480 is if you read

01:20:00.240 the written

01:20:01.080 the writings

01:20:01.980 of natives

01:20:02.880 from the colonial era

01:20:04.460 they talk about it

01:20:05.140 as the greatest time

01:20:05.860 this is the time

01:20:07.020 when we had learning

01:20:07.960 when we had medicine

01:20:09.240 when we had science

01:20:10.500 and technology

01:20:11.240 because the Europeans

01:20:12.360 also brought this stuff

01:20:13.420 with them

01:20:13.720 they did right

01:20:14.440 whereas you know

01:20:15.920 if you look at places

01:20:16.880 that Islam conquered

01:20:18.000 there's places in Spain

01:20:19.260 where they had that constant war

01:20:20.820 in the middle

01:20:21.220 you know you had the Christians

01:20:22.300 in the north

01:20:22.780 that are just

01:20:24.140 until now

01:20:24.880 like infertile

01:20:25.740 and just totally devastated

01:20:27.060 because

01:20:27.560 so at least

01:20:29.500 you know

01:20:29.780 the Europeans brought

01:20:30.540 all this stuff

01:20:31.400 and a lot of

01:20:33.240 this is the time

01:20:34.640 when

01:20:34.800 so here's an irony

01:20:36.000 you know

01:20:36.820 when I think of

01:20:37.600 when I think of

01:20:38.680 religion or whatever

01:20:39.900 someone becoming conservative

01:20:40.960 and clinging to the old ways

01:20:42.800 I just can't help

01:20:43.740 but think that

01:20:44.320 through time

01:20:45.140 things become more liberal

01:20:46.920 what's happening

01:20:47.980 is actually the opposite

01:20:48.740 in the Islamic world

01:20:49.540 if you go to the Middle East

01:20:50.860 in the 1930s

01:20:52.320 way way more liberal

01:20:54.140 and western looking

01:20:55.420 than anything today

01:20:56.460 the people weren't resentful

01:20:58.640 they were actually

01:20:59.360 trying to westernize

01:21:00.560 they dressed like westerners

01:21:02.760 the women

01:21:03.880 didn't have the hijab

01:21:05.140 they were decent

01:21:06.720 I don't mean in a promiscuous way

01:21:08.280 but they dressed

01:21:08.800 in dresses

01:21:10.060 and they looked good

01:21:11.520 men were in suits and ties

01:21:12.860 and they shaved

01:21:13.660 so Islam was sort of

01:21:16.260 Islam's appeal

01:21:18.120 it's the strong horse

01:21:19.620 and if you join us

01:21:20.940 you get all these benefits

01:21:22.360 that we were talking about

01:21:23.300 and once Muslims

01:21:24.820 start seeing that

01:21:25.720 that wasn't the case

01:21:26.600 it really fell by the wayside

01:21:28.260 and so that's why

01:21:29.460 I find it ironic

01:21:30.280 if you look at

01:21:31.220 you would think that

01:21:32.900 you know

01:21:33.260 in 2025

01:21:33.920 Muslims are going to be

01:21:35.340 more liberal

01:21:36.040 than in 1925

01:21:37.560 it's the exact opposite

01:21:38.740 and I find that

01:21:40.260 very interesting

01:21:40.780 and I think it starts

01:21:41.400 going to where

01:21:42.080 we're headed

01:21:42.840 talking the bigger talk

01:21:44.460 about you know

01:21:44.880 the modern era

01:21:45.540 and I believe

01:21:46.560 a lot of that

01:21:47.060 actually has to do

01:21:47.740 with this

01:21:48.300 that in as much

01:21:50.320 as the West

01:21:51.060 exuded power

01:21:52.540 and confidence

01:21:53.180 Muslims followed it

01:21:54.680 and which is human nature

01:21:56.060 whoever you know

01:21:57.140 whoever is strong

01:21:58.080 or smarter than you

01:21:59.160 or whatever

01:21:59.580 you can learn from

01:22:00.840 you're going to try

01:22:01.360 to emulate

01:22:01.880 but once the West

01:22:03.540 sort of started

01:22:04.260 hating itself

01:22:05.460 and promoting

01:22:06.740 everyone else

01:22:07.520 so let's say

01:22:08.040 in the whatever

01:22:08.460 1960s

01:22:09.360 just to give a rough

01:22:10.400 date

01:22:10.840 where all of a sudden

01:22:12.040 now you know

01:22:13.000 it was all

01:22:13.660 how we're

01:22:14.240 the narrative became

01:22:16.680 Europeans are the horrible

01:22:17.640 people

01:22:18.040 everyone is great

01:22:19.480 and in fact

01:22:20.780 Islam is even better

01:22:21.900 and Islam is

01:22:22.880 what a wonderful religion

01:22:24.140 I think that actually

01:22:25.300 pushed Muslims back

01:22:26.360 so on the one hand

01:22:27.300 it actually

01:22:28.320 made them

01:22:29.780 disrespect the West

01:22:31.260 naturally so

01:22:32.200 it's very easy

01:22:33.560 to have contempt

01:22:34.860 and disdain

01:22:35.480 for someone

01:22:35.900 who just disrespects

01:22:37.060 themselves

01:22:37.400 and fawns over you

01:22:39.040 that's just human nature

01:22:40.160 and it also

01:22:41.240 sort of made

01:22:41.860 so it made them go back

01:22:42.880 they basically said

01:22:44.340 yeah you're right

01:22:44.880 you're just a bunch

01:22:45.660 of dirty infidels

01:22:46.340 so the theory became

01:22:47.660 and it was very well

01:22:48.480 articulated by an Egyptian

01:22:50.100 theoretician

01:22:51.160 of the Muslim Brotherhood

01:22:52.340 Sayyid al-Qut

01:22:53.120 who came to America

01:22:54.640 and he was kind of

01:22:56.400 a moderate Muslim

01:22:57.340 then he came to America

01:22:58.720 I think in the 50s

01:22:59.840 and he was just

01:23:01.000 scandalized by how

01:23:02.140 liberal Americans were

01:23:03.340 and you know

01:23:04.040 men and women

01:23:04.620 were consorting together

01:23:05.820 etc etc

01:23:06.480 so he developed this idea

01:23:08.200 which became very prominent

01:23:09.300 which is

01:23:09.760 you know

01:23:10.440 these infidels in the West

01:23:11.700 you can appropriate

01:23:12.680 and learn from them

01:23:13.500 technology

01:23:14.280 or science

01:23:15.460 things of this nature

01:23:16.460 but when it comes to

01:23:17.380 the greater metaphysical issues

01:23:19.380 religion certainly

01:23:20.440 we have to stick to Islam

01:23:22.160 and that was really

01:23:23.480 this is one of the

01:23:24.560 chief return

01:23:25.580 to Islam

01:23:26.380 so the idea is

01:23:27.580 yeah we can learn

01:23:28.360 from them secular

01:23:29.360 materialistic things

01:23:30.580 but as far as how

01:23:31.640 a society is governed

01:23:32.740 or structured

01:23:33.360 or how individuals

01:23:34.360 should live their lives

01:23:35.360 or even as collectives

01:23:36.540 this is of course Islam

01:23:38.540 and all the while

01:23:39.780 the West further promotes that

01:23:41.440 and sponsors that kind of thinking

01:23:42.820 and stifles its own heritage

01:23:45.320 and this is

01:23:46.280 my point is

01:23:46.940 you see how that's very different

01:23:48.060 than their forebears

01:23:49.540 the colonizers

01:23:51.240 the colonizers

01:23:52.440 were unabashedly proud

01:23:53.780 there's this famous story

01:23:55.140 I forget his name

01:23:55.940 but some general in India

01:23:57.900 during the colonial era

01:23:59.360 where they you know

01:24:00.080 he just saw some ruckus

01:24:01.720 and a bunch of Indians

01:24:02.880 who were going to burn

01:24:03.740 a woman alive

01:24:04.500 Sati I think it's called

01:24:06.240 where if a man dies

01:24:08.040 and his woman is still alive

01:24:09.160 they burn her on his pyre

01:24:10.400 and he found out what's going on

01:24:12.440 and he tried to ban it

01:24:14.160 and they said

01:24:15.240 well this is our custom

01:24:16.460 and etc

01:24:17.060 and he said

01:24:17.520 okay you do your custom

01:24:18.740 we'll do ours

01:24:19.400 and our custom is

01:24:20.280 when men burn women alive

01:24:21.760 we hang them all

01:24:22.520 okay so that kind of

01:24:24.440 perspective

01:24:24.960 the west had

01:24:26.460 which was respectable

01:24:27.840 from even from the adversary

01:24:29.620 whereas now it's completely gone

01:24:31.220 now it's oh yeah

01:24:31.900 you do whatever you want

01:24:32.940 you're right

01:24:33.400 your culture is superior

01:24:34.580 etc etc

01:24:35.260 and this of course

01:24:36.020 continues till this day

01:24:37.100 and I believe

01:24:38.100 that's what exacerbates

01:24:39.520 and brings out

01:24:40.800 the worst of Muslims

01:24:41.940 this is why

01:24:42.920 it's ironic

01:24:43.580 when you look in the west

01:24:44.560 and in Europe

01:24:45.140 oftentimes the Muslims

01:24:46.640 who are the most radical

01:24:47.480 are the second

01:24:48.060 third generation Muslims

01:24:49.260 and I think a lot of it

01:24:51.040 has to do with this

01:24:51.640 sort of symbiotic relationship

01:24:52.940 with sort of western

01:24:54.600 self-degradation

01:24:56.380 which only provokes them

01:24:58.500 to fall back more

01:24:59.680 on their own Islamic heritage

01:25:01.060 and have even more contempt

01:25:02.480 for westerners

01:25:03.640 even as westerners

01:25:04.920 fall over themselves

01:25:05.620 thinking oh I need to

01:25:06.960 you know appease him some more

01:25:08.440 that's how he'll like me

01:25:09.740 when it's of course

01:25:10.480 doing the exact opposite

01:25:11.500 well it's just on that

01:25:13.180 sorry France

01:25:13.600 just to finish on this

01:25:14.420 just on that

01:25:16.160 actually we were talking

01:25:17.220 France and I were talking

01:25:18.060 the other day

01:25:18.500 and we talked about

01:25:19.360 one of the reasons

01:25:20.260 that there does seem

01:25:21.100 to be a difference

01:25:21.900 in integration

01:25:23.440 in America versus Europe

01:25:26.200 and one of the reasons

01:25:27.740 is the first thing

01:25:28.740 an American

01:25:29.220 first generation American

01:25:31.040 does is teach his kids

01:25:32.240 to love America

01:25:33.020 at least historically speaking

01:25:34.500 that was the trend

01:25:35.900 in Europe

01:25:36.880 that sort of cohesive idea

01:25:39.640 of like well

01:25:40.240 you're one of us now

01:25:41.220 but like you better

01:25:41.960 be one of us now

01:25:42.880 doesn't really exist

01:25:44.260 in the same way

01:25:44.920 and I guess that's

01:25:45.700 what you're saying

01:25:46.200 yeah and it doesn't exist

01:25:47.460 because instead of being proud

01:25:50.140 of European or an American

01:25:51.300 and saying hey

01:25:51.940 join us be one of us

01:25:53.040 I would never do that

01:25:54.780 please stay your way

01:25:55.980 I mean here in America

01:25:57.100 for example

01:25:57.600 this is the same logic

01:25:58.620 behind wherever I go

01:26:01.300 I don't just see English

01:26:02.100 I see Spanish

01:26:02.800 and I see Arabic

01:26:03.420 and I see you know Hindi

01:26:04.620 it's kind of like

01:26:05.500 well most countries

01:26:06.780 it's actually perceived

01:26:09.020 as a sort of weakness

01:26:09.920 and it's not something

01:26:10.920 that makes these

01:26:12.200 immigrant people respect you

01:26:13.580 because that's not

01:26:14.180 how they would be

01:26:14.840 ever

01:26:15.140 if you come to their country

01:26:16.760 you will

01:26:17.260 you're the one

01:26:18.480 who's going to assimilate

01:26:20.020 that's the logic

01:26:20.980 and that makes sense

01:26:21.840 of course

01:26:22.280 so a lot of that

01:26:24.360 is why

01:26:24.840 and it's even worse

01:26:26.740 I think in Europe

01:26:27.400 than in America

01:26:28.080 one of the issues

01:26:29.500 it's not just

01:26:30.460 what you were saying

01:26:31.000 another thing is that

01:26:32.080 especially if it comes

01:26:33.700 to Muslims

01:26:34.120 the numbers are

01:26:34.980 so much smaller

01:26:35.600 and what's happening

01:26:36.820 in Europe

01:26:37.220 is they're just

01:26:37.980 they're ghettoized

01:26:39.260 there's so many

01:26:40.100 and they just

01:26:40.860 literally they live

01:26:42.220 amongst each other

01:26:42.900 they don't even speak

01:26:43.960 English

01:26:44.160 or whatever the language

01:26:45.120 let's say it's in the UK

01:26:46.340 English

01:26:46.800 they may go whole days

01:26:48.220 and weeks

01:26:48.520 without needing to speak

01:26:49.380 because everyone around them

01:26:50.740 just speaks their language

01:26:51.720 so they never assimilate

01:26:53.440 and then they become

01:26:54.340 sort of like a little enclave

01:26:55.560 or a little ghetto

01:26:56.500 and it's funny

01:26:57.980 because there's actually

01:26:58.780 a historical precedent

01:27:00.140 to this

01:27:00.800 and it's an Arabic word

01:27:02.860 which is called

01:27:03.400 rabat

01:27:03.940 it's a military term

01:27:05.180 and rabat is basically

01:27:06.800 remember how I was telling you

01:27:07.880 Muslim conquests

01:27:08.640 they go as far as they can

01:27:09.720 until they're stopped

01:27:10.920 now wherever they're stopped

01:27:12.320 they would form

01:27:13.080 fortresses and barriers

01:27:14.500 known as rabat

01:27:15.500 rabat is actually

01:27:16.600 like a word

01:27:17.060 connected to the idea

01:27:18.360 of a rope

01:27:18.920 or a tight chain

01:27:20.440 so they would form

01:27:21.560 these fortresses

01:27:22.280 and from there

01:27:22.920 they would continue

01:27:23.840 harassing the infidel

01:27:25.640 whenever they can

01:27:26.380 and just engaging

01:27:27.460 in terror tactics

01:27:28.240 or raiding them

01:27:29.120 etc etc

01:27:29.680 and their goal was

01:27:31.100 to eventually conquer

01:27:32.040 more land

01:27:32.500 what I find interesting

01:27:33.740 is a lot of these

01:27:34.540 Muslims in the European cities

01:27:36.700 they see themselves

01:27:38.380 actually as

01:27:39.280 and I've seen them

01:27:40.180 talk of themselves

01:27:40.920 as we are rabatists

01:27:42.500 okay

01:27:43.120 we are the jihadists

01:27:44.180 who are forming a chain

01:27:45.740 and now it's not

01:27:46.940 it's not just on the border

01:27:48.380 with infidel countries

01:27:50.260 it's right smack

01:27:50.880 in the middle of their cities

01:27:51.860 because they've been

01:27:52.700 allowed to come in

01:27:53.400 so they see themselves

01:27:55.740 as actually jihadists

01:27:57.760 and we're here

01:27:59.020 you see it all the time

01:28:00.200 where they just throw it

01:28:01.160 in the face of the natives

01:28:02.180 of Europe

01:28:02.540 you know

01:28:02.840 your country's gonna be

01:28:03.980 Muslim in a few years

01:28:05.040 you know

01:28:05.880 you guys

01:28:06.280 it probably will

01:28:08.600 due to demographic changes

01:28:09.980 and birth rates

01:28:10.920 and what not

01:28:11.540 it makes sense

01:28:12.780 and on that

01:28:15.520 uplifting note

01:28:16.600 let's talk about

01:28:19.460 the west as it is

01:28:20.360 because you've identified

01:28:21.560 the key points

01:28:22.460 you know

01:28:22.840 the confidence is in decline

01:28:24.400 birth rates are in decline

01:28:26.880 demographics are going to change

01:28:28.800 so

01:28:29.080 looking forward

01:28:30.680 and looking at the immigration

01:28:33.320 that's coming

01:28:33.820 but also Muslim birth rates

01:28:36.040 in the UK

01:28:36.840 and the west

01:28:37.300 more generally

01:28:37.920 what can we see

01:28:39.840 through this trajectory

01:28:40.960 and where do you think

01:28:42.640 is going to be

01:28:43.420 the final destination

01:28:44.680 as it were

01:28:45.260 again

01:28:47.500 that's gonna

01:28:48.080 I guess

01:28:48.500 depend on the nation

01:28:49.440 and the region

01:28:50.040 we're talking about

01:28:50.780 because

01:28:51.140 and here's the thing

01:28:52.020 I guess the first thing

01:28:52.960 I'd like to say

01:28:53.520 is what's happening

01:28:54.300 here's the difference

01:28:56.000 between Islam historically

01:28:57.240 and Islam today

01:28:58.060 the continuity

01:28:59.180 is that Muslims

01:29:00.000 are creating problems

01:29:00.860 okay

01:29:01.460 they did it historically

01:29:02.740 the violence

01:29:04.040 and the intolerance

01:29:04.780 and the supremacism

01:29:05.600 okay

01:29:06.120 and it's happening

01:29:06.820 now in the present

01:29:07.800 the difference is

01:29:09.020 historically

01:29:09.460 like I said

01:29:10.100 it was the jihad of force

01:29:11.540 right

01:29:12.000 they had no choice

01:29:13.100 no one was gonna let them in

01:29:14.440 so Europeans fought

01:29:15.440 tooth and nail

01:29:16.000 you know

01:29:16.660 fighting to the death

01:29:17.700 now

01:29:18.860 the problem

01:29:20.080 is

01:29:20.540 I think you mentioned it earlier

01:29:22.460 or I don't know

01:29:23.320 it was you Francis

01:29:23.860 but you talked about

01:29:24.760 Muslims

01:29:25.300 how they're very weak

01:29:26.320 right now

01:29:26.740 and you know

01:29:27.740 they're not

01:29:28.040 they're a weak force

01:29:29.400 why are they a problem

01:29:30.640 and the answer is

01:29:32.680 because the west

01:29:33.300 makes them a problem

01:29:34.120 or the specific country

01:29:35.940 in the west

01:29:36.440 let's say the UK

01:29:37.420 okay

01:29:38.200 all the problems

01:29:39.700 that the UK

01:29:40.420 is going through

01:29:41.120 for example

01:29:41.780 due to

01:29:42.260 or not just UK

01:29:43.240 much of Western Europe

01:29:44.240 it's all self-made

01:29:45.660 okay

01:29:46.300 and you know that

01:29:47.100 because I can look

01:29:47.760 at an eastern country

01:29:48.540 like Hungary

01:29:49.060 and it has none

01:29:50.000 of these problems

01:29:50.620 is that because

01:29:51.640 Muslims tried to invade

01:29:52.900 Hungary by force

01:29:53.840 and somehow the Hungarians

01:29:55.120 resurrected John Hunyadi

01:29:56.720 and they beat them back

01:29:58.100 no

01:29:58.640 they just said

01:29:59.180 no immigration

01:29:59.780 we don't want it

01:30:00.760 and guess what

01:30:01.620 no problem

01:30:02.260 so this is

01:30:03.580 I think

01:30:04.100 and this is why

01:30:05.160 a lot of people

01:30:05.560 get upset

01:30:05.960 I remember

01:30:06.480 I once wrote an article

01:30:07.640 because a lot of people

01:30:09.200 in the UK

01:30:09.600 were complaining about

01:30:10.320 you know

01:30:10.980 there's an Islamic invasion

01:30:12.220 Muslims are invasion

01:30:13.180 and I basically said

01:30:14.540 no

01:30:14.800 get your terms right

01:30:16.340 this is not an invasion

01:30:17.320 an invasion

01:30:18.100 is when people

01:30:18.900 come by force

01:30:19.700 and they're trying

01:30:20.380 to take it

01:30:20.760 this is an invitation

01:30:21.900 okay

01:30:22.620 this is an enablement

01:30:23.900 from your leaders

01:30:25.060 so I think it's very important

01:30:26.880 my point is to

01:30:27.940 I like to

01:30:29.160 when I look at a problem

01:30:30.040 you know

01:30:30.320 not veer off

01:30:31.440 kind of

01:30:32.120 in tangents

01:30:33.420 but get to the heart of it

01:30:34.420 and the heart of the problem

01:30:35.600 today with Europe

01:30:36.420 and Islam

01:30:37.240 it's really not the Muslims

01:30:38.640 I often give this analogy

01:30:40.180 where like

01:30:40.800 I say

01:30:41.800 imagine an enclosure

01:30:43.500 of zebras

01:30:44.000 and I all of a sudden

01:30:45.280 decide to put a lion

01:30:46.140 and lo and behold

01:30:47.420 the lion starts killing

01:30:48.340 the zebras

01:30:48.860 who's really at fault

01:30:50.420 me or the lion

01:30:51.420 I think it's me

01:30:52.320 the lion's a lion

01:30:53.740 okay

01:30:54.300 the lion's gonna do

01:30:54.900 what a lion's gonna do

01:30:55.740 Muslim's a Muslim

01:30:56.880 he's gonna have the

01:30:58.220 anti-infidel thing

01:30:59.560 going on

01:31:00.160 the tribalism

01:31:00.860 that I mentioned

01:31:01.360 okay

01:31:01.940 but why are they

01:31:03.500 being brought in

01:31:04.360 with all these

01:31:05.000 massive numbers

01:31:05.920 why are the native

01:31:07.280 Brits

01:31:08.020 let's say

01:31:08.660 or Europeans

01:31:09.360 in general

01:31:09.940 being their heritage

01:31:11.380 and their religion

01:31:12.080 and their cultures

01:31:12.800 being suppressed

01:31:13.700 to make room

01:31:14.800 for these people

01:31:15.920 in the name of

01:31:16.480 some sort of

01:31:17.080 amorphous tolerance

01:31:18.060 or you know

01:31:18.720 multiculturalism

01:31:19.620 which is obviously

01:31:20.360 not working

01:31:21.360 so my point is

01:31:22.180 the ultimate

01:31:23.080 if you want to talk

01:31:23.760 about trajectories

01:31:24.600 it depends really

01:31:25.340 on the countries

01:31:26.020 and it's actually

01:31:27.240 in a way

01:31:27.820 easily fixed

01:31:28.700 if the actual

01:31:30.420 supposedly

01:31:31.160 elected representatives

01:31:33.560 of these various nations

01:31:34.840 do the will

01:31:35.800 of the people

01:31:36.300 but they're not

01:31:37.140 and that's really

01:31:38.200 the issue

01:31:38.600 so I would tell people

01:31:40.500 you know

01:31:41.220 your Islam problem

01:31:42.260 is less about Muslims

01:31:43.380 and it's more about

01:31:45.020 the people

01:31:45.400 who are enabling

01:31:46.040 and empowering

01:31:46.660 and bringing them in

01:31:47.860 against your will

01:31:48.800 these are the people

01:31:49.680 who have the same names

01:31:50.560 like you

01:31:50.900 and they look like you

01:31:51.680 and they are apparently

01:31:52.600 you know

01:31:53.520 ruling in your name

01:31:54.720 but they're obviously

01:31:55.660 not

01:31:56.140 and it's you know

01:31:57.160 it's become very obvious

01:31:58.540 right now

01:31:58.940 so I think people

01:32:00.020 should look at the

01:32:00.780 ultimate source

01:32:01.540 of the problem

01:32:02.420 Islam is a problem

01:32:03.880 intrinsically

01:32:04.540 you can say that

01:32:05.380 but now there's

01:32:06.320 an instrumental

01:32:06.900 there's an instrumental

01:32:08.000 force empowering it

01:32:09.660 which is like I said

01:32:10.740 why in other countries

01:32:11.960 Poland and Hungary

01:32:13.100 it's not an issue

01:32:14.100 and you know

01:32:15.540 it can be fixed

01:32:17.300 or I mean

01:32:18.060 it's not going to be easy

01:32:18.680 now obviously

01:32:19.260 but something can be done

01:32:20.460 if the actual

01:32:21.340 elected officials

01:32:22.200 care to do it

01:32:23.460 but they don't

01:32:24.220 so but

01:32:24.860 so you've used

01:32:25.680 the example

01:32:26.100 of Poland and Hungary

01:32:26.980 and they're relevant

01:32:27.760 but don't you think

01:32:29.420 part of it as well

01:32:30.380 Raymond

01:32:30.720 is for want of a better

01:32:32.180 term

01:32:32.520 white guilt

01:32:33.240 you know

01:32:34.000 we went

01:32:34.720 the British went out

01:32:36.000 we colonized

01:32:37.040 we colonized

01:32:38.160 a lot of these countries

01:32:39.140 and a lot of the

01:32:40.240 Islamic immigration

01:32:41.200 into the UK

01:32:42.260 is from Pakistan

01:32:43.600 and Bangladesh

01:32:44.300 both former colonies

01:32:45.620 so that must play

01:32:46.780 its own role as well

01:32:47.720 oh yeah

01:32:48.100 the white guilt

01:32:48.800 but I mean

01:32:49.380 that is to me

01:32:49.940 the most contemptible

01:32:50.900 of all factors

01:32:51.600 that really needs

01:32:52.560 to go away

01:32:53.080 this is white guilt

01:32:54.140 I never understand it

01:32:55.120 you know

01:32:56.280 I did a recent

01:32:57.680 like study about

01:32:58.580 because we have

01:32:59.040 Columbus Day here

01:32:59.840 and all these people

01:33:00.980 get up

01:33:01.420 and oh you know

01:33:02.040 hemming and hawing

01:33:02.800 oh horrible Columbus

01:33:03.880 and what he did

01:33:04.400 to the natives

01:33:04.900 etc

01:33:05.180 in fact

01:33:05.720 and Muslims

01:33:06.220 are doing this too

01:33:07.000 and my point is

01:33:08.320 like talking about

01:33:09.140 living in glass houses

01:33:10.000 all their heroes

01:33:10.800 did far worse

01:33:11.720 than Christopher Columbus

01:33:12.660 so my point is

01:33:14.000 whatever the white man's guilt

01:33:15.820 it's

01:33:16.740 the same thing's been done

01:33:18.180 to him

01:33:18.780 and to everyone else

01:33:19.820 okay

01:33:20.300 whites were enslaved

01:33:21.220 by blacks

01:33:21.960 whites were

01:33:23.080 you know

01:33:23.700 conquered

01:33:24.600 and I told you

01:33:25.440 Muslims

01:33:25.960 Moors

01:33:26.660 as they were known

01:33:27.740 from North Africa

01:33:28.500 because of their dark skin

01:33:29.740 went all the way to Iceland

01:33:31.300 very fair people

01:33:32.580 and enslaved them

01:33:33.620 in the 1500s

01:33:35.300 and in

01:33:35.700 by England

01:33:37.360 there was a little island

01:33:38.280 maybe no

01:33:38.660 called Lundy

01:33:39.280 which actually was a haven

01:33:40.940 of Barbary pirates

01:33:41.980 who would actually

01:33:42.760 raid and enslave

01:33:44.300 British people

01:33:45.060 so my point is

01:33:46.120 this white guilt

01:33:46.940 is really manufactured

01:33:48.080 and it needs to be

01:33:49.700 you know

01:33:49.980 seen for what it is

01:33:50.780 if anything

01:33:51.640 I mean

01:33:52.200 being objective

01:33:52.880 I was just telling you

01:33:53.980 that the colonial era

01:33:54.960 which is the white man

01:33:55.760 they actually

01:33:56.940 okay

01:33:57.320 you can say

01:33:57.860 they conquered

01:33:58.480 whatever

01:33:59.280 the Muslim world

01:34:00.100 India

01:34:00.540 deep into Africa

01:34:01.440 but they actually

01:34:02.700 brought good stuff

01:34:03.640 with them

01:34:04.120 okay

01:34:04.580 which is why

01:34:05.320 the native population

01:34:06.200 speaks well

01:34:07.100 about that time

01:34:07.920 like they brought

01:34:08.860 science and technology

01:34:10.000 and you know

01:34:10.860 literacy

01:34:11.300 medicine

01:34:12.640 etc

01:34:13.080 okay

01:34:13.900 what did

01:34:14.740 now the other people

01:34:15.940 were talking about

01:34:16.680 that conquered

01:34:17.500 including conquered

01:34:18.520 Europeans

01:34:19.060 brought nothing but

01:34:19.880 death destruction

01:34:20.600 and slavery

01:34:21.160 okay

01:34:21.840 so when it's all

01:34:23.120 said and done

01:34:23.720 I don't think

01:34:24.400 there's much

01:34:24.920 for the white man

01:34:25.600 to really feel guilty

01:34:26.460 about

01:34:26.760 and I say this

01:34:27.540 as a guy

01:34:27.840 as a guy

01:34:28.320 who doesn't think

01:34:28.740 of himself

01:34:29.080 as white

01:34:29.520 by the way

01:34:30.320 okay

01:34:30.640 so I'm just

01:34:31.340 trying to be

01:34:31.620 as objective

01:34:32.080 as possible

01:34:32.720 and uh

01:34:33.900 and but see

01:34:34.500 the fact that

01:34:35.280 this exists

01:34:35.920 and I'm glad

01:34:36.340 you brought it up

01:34:36.860 just shows you

01:34:37.380 how far gone

01:34:38.380 so many white people

01:34:39.520 are

01:34:39.720 that they're so

01:34:40.300 caught up

01:34:40.720 in something

01:34:41.140 so silly

01:34:41.780 that all these

01:34:42.800 other peoples

01:34:43.400 who are not white

01:34:44.020 would never even

01:34:44.520 think

01:34:45.020 and shouldn't

01:34:45.680 think

01:34:46.000 of something

01:34:47.020 like that

01:34:47.580 to actually

01:34:48.280 govern how they

01:34:49.200 see the world

01:34:49.740 that oh

01:34:50.200 my forefathers

01:34:51.060 did something

01:34:51.480 so England

01:34:52.460 is bringing

01:34:52.940 Pakistanis in

01:34:53.960 because they feel

01:34:54.620 bad because they

01:34:55.480 colonized Pakistan

01:34:56.560 I mean that is just

01:34:57.620 such silly

01:34:59.420 and stupid thinking

01:35:00.300 Raymond

01:35:01.080 and you

01:35:01.740 you use the

01:35:02.500 example

01:35:03.060 and I mean

01:35:03.740 it was a

01:35:04.380 provocative example

01:35:05.320 of uh

01:35:06.300 zebras and a lion

01:35:07.680 and then there'll be

01:35:08.840 people who are

01:35:09.500 listening to this

01:35:10.100 or watching this

01:35:10.680 going yeah

01:35:11.000 but I've got a

01:35:11.580 Muslim mate

01:35:12.160 he's a nice guy

01:35:13.160 he's like

01:35:13.760 he's not like that

01:35:14.980 you know

01:35:16.240 isn't that

01:35:17.620 just a bit

01:35:18.420 reductive

01:35:19.160 and unfair

01:35:20.600 yeah yeah

01:35:21.420 no I'm not saying

01:35:22.480 that uh

01:35:23.140 every Muslim

01:35:23.800 is a lion

01:35:24.420 who's trying to

01:35:25.300 kill you

01:35:25.620 what I'm saying

01:35:26.180 is though

01:35:26.620 let's go with

01:35:27.360 okay the most

01:35:28.080 conservative estimate

01:35:28.880 I've ever heard

01:35:29.520 I often hear like

01:35:30.640 10% of Muslims

01:35:31.360 are radical

01:35:31.800 I mean I think

01:35:33.380 and I've heard a lot

01:35:33.860 of people say

01:35:34.200 it's more than that

01:35:35.040 okay but let's say

01:35:35.800 10 I think that's fair

01:35:36.880 and I think it's

01:35:37.580 important to delineate

01:35:38.620 what does actually

01:35:39.180 radical mean

01:35:40.020 okay well now

01:35:41.320 we're gonna

01:35:41.620 go down another

01:35:42.460 rabbit hole

01:35:42.900 but so radical

01:35:43.660 what it means

01:35:44.880 what people mean

01:35:45.540 by that is

01:35:46.040 this is the weird

01:35:46.840 crazy Muslim

01:35:47.540 who's not

01:35:48.000 not practicing

01:35:49.220 true Islam

01:35:49.840 he's doing this

01:35:50.500 crazy violent Islam

01:35:51.760 to me radical Muslim

01:35:53.440 is just a

01:35:54.300 fundamentalist Muslim

01:35:55.520 who's following

01:35:56.100 his religion to a T

01:35:57.000 okay

01:35:57.680 and the moderate Muslim

01:35:59.480 in this parlance

01:36:00.740 which is not accurate

01:36:01.600 is supposedly

01:36:02.220 the Muslim

01:36:02.660 who's practicing

01:36:03.560 good true Islam

01:36:04.720 to me the moderate Muslim

01:36:06.280 who exists

01:36:06.860 is actually

01:36:07.340 the nonchalant Muslim

01:36:08.360 who's not taking

01:36:09.160 his religion

01:36:09.640 all that seriously

01:36:10.500 so they exist

01:36:11.680 I do believe

01:36:12.280 that these two

01:36:12.900 distinctions exist

01:36:13.800 I just think

01:36:14.580 the words

01:36:15.200 are inaccurate

01:36:16.600 okay

01:36:17.220 it shouldn't be

01:36:17.720 a moderate

01:36:18.240 and a radical

01:36:18.980 it should be

01:36:19.960 a purist

01:36:20.620 and an observant

01:36:21.860 Muslim

01:36:22.220 which is the radical

01:36:23.080 and the nonchalant

01:36:24.380 secular cultural Muslim

01:36:25.620 okay

01:36:26.100 which is the moderate

01:36:26.700 and they exist

01:36:27.420 so now let's say

01:36:28.540 these

01:36:28.920 let's say 10%

01:36:30.860 are the observant

01:36:31.840 radicals

01:36:32.780 right

01:36:32.980 and I give you

01:36:34.640 that number

01:36:34.940 because that's

01:36:35.360 the smallest number

01:36:36.040 I've heard

01:36:36.480 from people

01:36:37.140 who are serious

01:36:37.700 okay

01:36:37.980 so my point is

01:36:39.280 yeah

01:36:39.580 but when you bring

01:36:41.900 in millions

01:36:42.280 of Muslims

01:36:43.160 okay

01:36:43.720 what's 10%

01:36:44.440 of that

01:36:44.780 I don't know

01:36:45.600 what the population

01:36:46.300 let's say England

01:36:46.960 is but I know

01:36:47.580 4 million Muslims

01:36:49.280 okay

01:36:49.820 so you have

01:36:50.240 400,000 radicals

01:36:52.160 right

01:36:52.400 so you have

01:36:53.100 400,000

01:36:53.760 who might act

01:36:54.260 like a lion

01:36:54.760 and so

01:36:56.500 what does that mean

01:36:57.600 I agree

01:36:58.640 the other ones

01:36:59.380 don't

01:36:59.940 right

01:37:00.420 but you're

01:37:00.920 taking a chance

01:37:01.740 it's kind of

01:37:02.560 like saying

01:37:03.100 it's kind of

01:37:04.660 like saying

01:37:05.080 you know

01:37:05.340 I'm going to

01:37:05.680 give you

01:37:05.880 a jar of candy

01:37:06.880 and only

01:37:07.740 out of the

01:37:08.920 100

01:37:09.120 10 are poisonous

01:37:09.980 big deal

01:37:11.100 take a chance

01:37:11.940 they taste good

01:37:12.540 right

01:37:12.860 now again

01:37:13.960 all of us

01:37:14.500 these are

01:37:15.200 like you said

01:37:15.680 reductive analogies

01:37:16.720 and I understand

01:37:17.440 and I do believe

01:37:18.260 a lot of Muslims

01:37:18.880 who come

01:37:19.340 especially a lot

01:37:19.940 of them

01:37:20.120 like I said

01:37:20.560 come from

01:37:21.220 they come from

01:37:22.120 an Islamic background

01:37:22.880 but they're not

01:37:23.340 observant

01:37:24.200 okay

01:37:24.500 yeah I do believe

01:37:25.620 a lot of these

01:37:26.080 people come to

01:37:26.760 Europe

01:37:26.960 looking just

01:37:27.440 for a good life

01:37:28.140 and whatnot

01:37:30.280 and are not

01:37:31.040 necessarily dedicated

01:37:32.000 to conquering

01:37:32.820 and what I've

01:37:33.660 been discussing

01:37:34.140 I get all that

01:37:34.940 but it's

01:37:35.800 it's the numbers

01:37:36.820 and it's the fact

01:37:37.780 that they don't

01:37:38.220 assimilate

01:37:38.640 and the fact

01:37:39.140 that if it's

01:37:39.560 10%

01:37:40.120 10% is still

01:37:41.340 a humongous

01:37:41.960 number

01:37:42.340 if you said

01:37:42.880 it's 4 million

01:37:43.500 we're talking

01:37:43.840 400,000

01:37:44.840 and I

01:37:45.520 and again

01:37:46.020 I'm giving you

01:37:46.500 the 10%

01:37:47.000 I'm trying to be

01:37:48.000 kind of lenient

01:37:49.400 here

01:37:49.600 but I think

01:37:49.960 it's more

01:37:50.360 you know

01:37:51.040 maybe it's

01:37:51.400 20

01:37:51.700 25%

01:37:52.520 and you know

01:37:53.840 this because

01:37:54.380 if you listen

01:37:55.220 to what comes

01:37:55.720 out of these

01:37:56.120 mosques

01:37:56.600 including in the UK

01:37:57.420 it's the

01:37:58.260 radical variety

01:37:59.320 that is to say

01:38:00.900 the accurate

01:38:01.460 variety

01:38:02.120 so yeah

01:38:03.880 so this is

01:38:04.800 what makes

01:38:05.280 this kind

01:38:05.760 of a quagmire

01:38:06.400 and not an easy

01:38:07.280 thing

01:38:07.620 especially from

01:38:08.440 the western

01:38:08.980 liberal mentality

01:38:09.980 which wants

01:38:10.900 to help

01:38:11.320 the underdog

01:38:12.100 and in fact

01:38:13.040 there is

01:38:13.560 some

01:38:14.040 a lot of

01:38:14.580 them

01:38:14.780 are underdogs

01:38:15.680 but it comes

01:38:16.720 with a risk

01:38:17.340 and the risk

01:38:17.840 is what you see

01:38:18.560 happening in the UK

01:38:19.440 which is once

01:38:20.160 in a while

01:38:20.580 a Muslim man

01:38:21.380 gets up

01:38:21.760 and stabs

01:38:22.300 children

01:38:22.660 and people

01:38:23.320 and just

01:38:24.180 drives his truck

01:38:25.060 into some people

01:38:25.780 why does he

01:38:26.860 do that

01:38:27.240 well one

01:38:28.720 of the reasons

01:38:29.340 that most people

01:38:29.880 don't realize

01:38:30.340 is that the

01:38:30.880 Islamic State

01:38:31.800 in fact

01:38:32.940 always issues

01:38:33.800 these kind

01:38:34.620 of calls

01:38:35.640 telling them

01:38:36.320 to do

01:38:36.580 precisely that

01:38:37.520 it tells Muslims

01:38:38.640 that if you're

01:38:39.180 living in the West

01:38:39.840 terrorize them

01:38:40.900 don't forget

01:38:41.300 you're a member

01:38:41.980 of the Islamic State

01:38:42.960 and drive your

01:38:44.420 trucks into them

01:38:45.080 drive your cars

01:38:45.820 into them

01:38:46.260 go stab them

01:38:47.280 attack civilians

01:38:48.860 don't attack

01:38:49.600 military

01:38:50.440 in other words

01:38:51.260 attack whatever

01:38:51.780 is easy

01:38:52.280 and soft targets

01:38:53.320 so one of the

01:38:54.520 reasons is

01:38:54.900 they're instructed

01:38:55.540 to by these

01:38:56.600 Islamic radicals

01:38:57.900 and the other

01:38:58.420 is

01:38:58.580 where are these

01:38:59.220 Islamic radicals

01:39:00.140 where are they

01:39:00.700 yeah

01:39:00.980 everywhere

01:39:02.600 you mean ISIS

01:39:04.000 where are they

01:39:04.960 well I don't know

01:39:06.420 I mean

01:39:06.800 the one

01:39:07.640 there's a

01:39:08.620 they issue a magazine

01:39:09.800 that comes out

01:39:11.180 every couple weeks

01:39:12.120 and you know

01:39:12.900 comes online

01:39:13.760 in the dark net

01:39:14.640 and but

01:39:16.120 and that's another term

01:39:17.600 you know

01:39:17.800 when you

01:39:18.080 a lot of people

01:39:19.180 get caught up

01:39:19.640 okay I understand

01:39:20.360 there's bad guys

01:39:21.100 it's ISIS

01:39:21.660 it's Al Qaeda

01:39:22.340 it's etc

01:39:22.840 etc

01:39:23.080 I don't get caught

01:39:24.180 up in these

01:39:24.640 these kind of terms

01:39:26.160 because the issue

01:39:27.760 we're talking about

01:39:28.320 is ideological

01:39:29.000 and it transcends

01:39:30.000 these finite

01:39:31.000 organizations

01:39:32.000 that come and go

01:39:32.980 what about the

01:39:33.820 Muslim Brotherhood

01:39:34.560 well they're

01:39:35.540 they're known as

01:39:36.240 the sort of

01:39:36.660 granddaddy of all

01:39:37.500 these organizations

01:39:38.940 Al Qaeda was

01:39:40.260 you know

01:39:40.840 Eamon Zawahiri

01:39:41.520 I was telling you

01:39:42.440 about Sayyid Qutb

01:39:43.100 of Muslim Brotherhood

01:39:44.120 he's one of the

01:39:44.560 earliest Eamon Zawahiri

01:39:45.620 was also who became

01:39:46.660 the leader of Al Qaeda

01:39:47.460 was formerly

01:39:48.540 the Muslim Brotherhood

01:39:49.960 and the difference

01:39:50.780 that the Muslim Brotherhood

01:39:51.640 and these groups have

01:39:52.720 so for example

01:39:53.480 in the writings of

01:39:54.140 Eamon Al-Zawahiri

01:39:54.820 which I translated

01:39:55.560 from Arabic way way back

01:39:56.860 almost two decades ago

01:39:57.920 he complained about

01:39:59.900 the Muslim Brotherhood

01:40:00.520 because they're too patient

01:40:01.640 and they take a sort of

01:40:03.040 incremental approach

01:40:03.980 and they don't want to do

01:40:04.940 Jihad

01:40:05.340 which is in fact

01:40:06.660 what makes them more dangerous

01:40:07.640 so he was more representative

01:40:09.700 of the sort of ISIS thing

01:40:11.380 which is I want to do Jihad now

01:40:12.600 you know

01:40:12.840 I want to go kill the infidel

01:40:13.940 whereas the Muslim Brotherhood

01:40:15.660 is sort of

01:40:16.860 it's just a subversive

01:40:18.380 kind of power

01:40:19.240 and I don't know

01:40:20.140 if you know

01:40:20.360 but the FBI

01:40:21.580 actually caught

01:40:22.320 some documents

01:40:23.120 back in 2009

01:40:24.060 that actually

01:40:25.180 are from the Muslim Brotherhood

01:40:26.960 talking about

01:40:27.960 how they're waging

01:40:28.860 a civilizational Jihad

01:40:30.180 in America

01:40:30.880 trying to subvert

01:40:32.440 etc etc

01:40:33.240 and all these organizations

01:40:34.480 that are branches from it

01:40:35.520 like CARE

01:40:36.140 the Council on American

01:40:37.020 Islamic Relations

01:40:37.780 so these are the groups

01:40:39.220 that are engaged

01:40:39.680 in what I told you

01:40:40.260 the Jihad of the Tongue

01:40:41.140 the Jihad of the Pen

01:40:42.080 the Jihad of

01:40:43.220 you know

01:40:43.720 the money

01:40:44.080 they're all working

01:40:45.620 for the same purpose

01:40:46.500 that ISIS is

01:40:47.380 but through legal measures

01:40:48.860 you know

01:40:50.100 through propaganda

01:40:50.720 and what not

01:40:51.180 and I know that

01:40:51.800 to someone who is

01:40:52.780 as in depth

01:40:54.040 with all this stuff

01:40:54.800 as you

01:40:55.060 these questions

01:40:55.740 may sound kind of naive

01:40:57.200 but

01:40:58.320 what do they want

01:41:00.280 exactly

01:41:00.900 like

01:41:01.240 if they

01:41:02.140 keep

01:41:02.860 we just had

01:41:03.680 several terrorist attacks

01:41:05.720 actually

01:41:06.220 in the UK

01:41:06.820 just a guy

01:41:08.000 goes up to somebody

01:41:08.960 in the street

01:41:09.360 stabs them

01:41:09.900 no provocation

01:41:10.960 nothing

01:41:11.220 what is that

01:41:12.700 designed to achieve

01:41:13.660 what's the point

01:41:14.340 of that

01:41:14.620 that's actually

01:41:15.520 a good question

01:41:16.180 so on the one hand

01:41:17.940 and this is actually

01:41:19.700 really interesting

01:41:20.200 because there is

01:41:20.880 a school of thought

01:41:21.760 so I told you

01:41:22.460 about ISIS

01:41:22.900 issuing these

01:41:23.740 these directives

01:41:25.900 a lot of Muslims

01:41:27.880 in the Muslim world

01:41:28.500 tell you ISIS

01:41:29.100 isn't an Islamic

01:41:30.240 organization

01:41:30.720 it's actually working

01:41:31.860 for Western elements

01:41:33.400 to make people

01:41:34.840 hate Muslims

01:41:35.420 and honestly

01:41:36.920 when I see

01:41:37.580 because you asked

01:41:38.540 a good question

01:41:39.060 what is the point

01:41:40.000 in telling Muslims

01:41:40.920 go and stab people

01:41:41.820 what does that do

01:41:43.020 does that somehow

01:41:43.740 have a strategic purpose

01:41:44.960 all it does

01:41:46.080 is make people

01:41:46.520 hate Muslims

01:41:46.980 right

01:41:47.240 I mean that's

01:41:48.320 that's the logic

01:41:49.100 and I'm only

01:41:49.780 I'm not telling you

01:41:50.320 this is what I believe

01:41:50.940 but I've never

01:41:52.200 I've

01:41:52.580 the civilizational

01:41:53.960 jihad

01:41:54.400 via the Muslim

01:41:55.180 Brotherhood

01:41:55.540 that makes more sense

01:41:56.320 to me

01:41:56.640 than these organizations

01:41:58.360 who just say

01:41:59.520 hey

01:41:59.860 all

01:42:00.440 they literally

01:42:01.340 the Islamic State

01:42:02.800 once said

01:42:03.480 they issued

01:42:04.400 a kind of

01:42:05.820 one of their declarations

01:42:06.860 at the peak

01:42:07.980 of

01:42:08.200 you know

01:42:08.700 I think it was

01:42:09.380 the beginning

01:42:09.700 of the

01:42:10.160 when the Israeli

01:42:11.860 Palestinian stuff

01:42:12.860 a couple years ago

01:42:13.620 and they told Muslims

01:42:14.780 don't attack Israel

01:42:15.820 because if you do

01:42:17.000 you're going to only

01:42:17.940 empower Hamas

01:42:18.840 and they're not true

01:42:19.840 Muslims

01:42:20.300 and the PLO

01:42:21.220 okay

01:42:21.800 and instead

01:42:23.240 we want you

01:42:24.420 and then they attacked Iran

01:42:25.760 it was in the context

01:42:26.660 of

01:42:27.380 they killed like

01:42:28.560 a hundred people

01:42:29.100 in Kerman

01:42:29.480 and so they said

01:42:31.120 this is

01:42:31.420 we're attacking Iran

01:42:32.280 because

01:42:32.740 Iran's evil

01:42:33.800 stupid Shias

01:42:34.600 you know

01:42:34.980 Sunni Shia

01:42:35.560 and

01:42:36.380 why would you want

01:42:37.280 to fight Israel

01:42:37.900 and help these

01:42:38.800 other guys

01:42:39.500 like the PLO

01:42:40.180 who are not true Muslims

01:42:40.920 instead go to Europe

01:42:42.300 and do that

01:42:43.180 crash into them

01:42:44.400 decapitate them

01:42:45.500 and throw terror

01:42:46.740 in their hearts

01:42:47.180 and everyone

01:42:48.140 in the Arab world

01:42:48.740 said see

01:42:49.160 this is not

01:42:49.920 real ISIS

01:42:51.000 but on the other hand

01:42:52.820 what they are teaching

01:42:54.480 is in the Quran

01:42:55.540 so when they

01:42:56.580 so Quran 9-5

01:42:58.060 famously

01:42:59.020 it's known as

01:42:59.540 a sword verse

01:43:00.300 and it tells Muslims

01:43:01.580 it's actually

01:43:02.260 remember I was telling

01:43:02.800 about Jefferson

01:43:03.300 talking with an ambassador

01:43:04.620 he basically paraphrased it

01:43:06.440 that verse says

01:43:07.560 when you know

01:43:08.320 the forbidden months

01:43:09.020 have passed

01:43:09.660 wait

01:43:10.480 slay the idolaters

01:43:12.020 wherever you find them

01:43:12.980 the pagans

01:43:13.500 lay in wait for them

01:43:14.480 ambush them

01:43:15.200 terrorize them

01:43:16.020 okay

01:43:16.400 so what you're saying

01:43:17.440 is

01:43:17.660 and correct me

01:43:18.300 if I'm misunderstanding

01:43:19.060 this is not strategic

01:43:21.040 this is doctrinal

01:43:22.200 yeah

01:43:22.720 from

01:43:23.320 from the Islamic state

01:43:24.540 that's what I would argue

01:43:25.480 and this is why

01:43:26.040 a lot of other Muslim groups

01:43:27.360 who have the same goal

01:43:28.580 they'd like to see

01:43:29.800 Islamic hegemony

01:43:31.120 around the world

01:43:31.980 don't take that route

01:43:34.360 because to them

01:43:35.340 you're

01:43:36.160 even Al Qaeda

01:43:36.880 for example

01:43:37.480 which is ISIS

01:43:39.040 when I translated

01:43:40.640 the writing

01:43:41.080 so what they said

01:43:41.840 to the West

01:43:42.480 was we're doing this

01:43:43.440 because you attacked us

01:43:44.480 we're doing this

01:43:45.080 because you supported Israel

01:43:46.120 we're doing this

01:43:46.680 because you didn't sign

01:43:47.820 the Kyoto Protocol

01:43:48.680 it was always a grievance

01:43:49.960 seriously

01:43:50.540 it was a grievance

01:43:51.160 after grievance

01:43:51.940 and it had nothing

01:43:53.200 to do with doctrine

01:43:53.960 then the writings

01:43:55.400 I came across

01:43:56.100 this is my first book

01:43:57.000 the Al Qaeda reader

01:43:57.720 which came out in 2007

01:43:59.420 and the reason

01:44:00.220 it was kind of a big deal

01:44:01.260 at the time

01:44:01.620 I was working

01:44:01.960 in the Library of Congress

01:44:02.720 and I came across

01:44:03.540 these Arabic writings

01:44:04.420 by Osama bin Laden

01:44:05.280 and Eamon Zawahiri

01:44:06.520 and they said

01:44:07.020 now they sounded like ISIS

01:44:08.440 and it was

01:44:09.500 we hate them

01:44:10.400 not because of what they do

01:44:11.540 it's because they're infidels

01:44:12.600 and we have to hate the infidels

01:44:13.800 and we have to fight them

01:44:14.780 and we have to do jihad

01:44:15.660 okay

01:44:16.440 so even Al Qaeda

01:44:17.600 was smart enough

01:44:19.060 to you know

01:44:20.420 play the double game

01:44:21.460 and say

01:44:22.220 hey we're only doing this to you

01:44:23.680 because you hit us first

01:44:25.200 but ISIS

01:44:26.360 is so to me

01:44:27.580 I always say

01:44:27.980 they're refreshingly honest

01:44:29.140 but in a way

01:44:30.440 that doesn't really help

01:44:31.680 of the cause

01:44:32.500 as a lot of Muslims

01:44:33.720 point out

01:44:34.280 because what you're doing

01:44:35.440 is you're sort of exposing us

01:44:36.680 and yeah

01:44:37.620 when you go

01:44:38.040 and you stab toddlers

01:44:39.440 in the UK

01:44:40.120 or whatever

01:44:41.000 what is that

01:44:41.800 how is that helping

01:44:42.560 from a strategic point

01:44:44.140 so it's a good question

01:44:45.740 I suppose

01:44:47.340 the interesting question

01:44:48.360 for me

01:44:48.820 is how do we move forward

01:44:50.000 with given the realities

01:44:51.160 that we have

01:44:51.880 and

01:44:53.200 one thing

01:44:54.820 that I have some hope for

01:44:56.080 but I want to run it by you

01:44:57.260 and get your perspective

01:44:58.260 is

01:44:58.580 we do see

01:44:59.820 in some Middle Eastern countries

01:45:02.860 like the UAE

01:45:03.800 like Saudi Arabia

01:45:05.020 also in Central Asia

01:45:06.220 like I mentioned

01:45:07.140 I was in Uzbekistan

01:45:08.160 they don't tolerate

01:45:10.300 the

01:45:11.360 you might not agree

01:45:12.500 about the terminology

01:45:13.260 but they do not tolerate

01:45:14.600 violent jihadis

01:45:15.840 they themselves

01:45:17.480 know that they are

01:45:19.160 the first target

01:45:20.060 of these jihadis

01:45:21.020 and they actually deal

01:45:22.760 with the Muslim Brotherhood

01:45:24.060 they deal with

01:45:25.160 all of these terrorists

01:45:26.680 adjacent

01:45:27.160 or actual terrorist organizations

01:45:28.820 they don't allow

01:45:30.440 preaching

01:45:30.900 extremist versions

01:45:32.180 of Islam in mosques

01:45:33.400 in Uzbekistan

01:45:34.620 if you want to work

01:45:35.500 for the government

01:45:36.000 you can't have a beard

01:45:36.900 you can't wear

01:45:38.480 not just a hijab

01:45:40.120 you can't even wear

01:45:41.580 a headscarf

01:45:42.080 of any kind

01:45:42.680 if you're a woman

01:45:44.200 so

01:45:45.100 do you think

01:45:46.320 that there is some hope

01:45:48.180 that because of

01:45:49.460 this kind of thing

01:45:50.600 the Muslim world

01:45:52.280 the center of gravity

01:45:53.980 in the Muslim world

01:45:55.320 will move towards

01:45:56.860 a more

01:45:57.300 less extreme

01:45:59.820 and more moderate

01:46:00.640 version of the faith

01:46:02.460 you mean if more

01:46:03.540 Muslim nations act

01:46:04.440 more like Central Asian Asians

01:46:05.720 yeah

01:46:06.240 or like the UAE

01:46:07.460 or like Saudi Arabia

01:46:08.420 increasingly

01:46:08.940 right

01:46:09.220 do you think

01:46:11.480 that that will move

01:46:12.680 the center of gravity

01:46:13.740 towards a different

01:46:14.620 kind of Islam

01:46:15.400 and therefore

01:46:15.860 a different kind

01:46:16.420 of relationship

01:46:16.920 between Islam

01:46:17.740 and Christianity

01:46:18.360 yeah

01:46:19.220 if Islam can be changed

01:46:21.300 okay

01:46:21.760 and immediately

01:46:22.320 I'm struck with a quote

01:46:23.300 from the Encyclopedia of Islam

01:46:24.760 which was written by a jurist

01:46:26.520 and he said

01:46:27.380 Islam needs to be

01:46:28.700 completely made over

01:46:29.740 for the doctrine of jihad

01:46:30.980 which it defined

01:46:32.040 as what I defined

01:46:32.840 which is unprovoked warfare

01:46:34.260 to conquer the world

01:46:35.500 okay

01:46:35.820 he said it had to be

01:46:36.720 remade over

01:46:37.680 can that be done

01:46:39.100 I suppose

01:46:39.720 but it would not

01:46:41.580 it would no longer

01:46:42.160 really be Islam

01:46:43.100 and I think

01:46:44.040 I mean

01:46:44.360 if you look around

01:46:45.220 that certain versions

01:46:46.420 of Christianity

01:46:47.360 I mean

01:46:47.840 that's the case

01:46:48.380 that's not

01:46:49.240 historic Christianity

01:46:50.140 so I suppose

01:46:51.220 that can be done

01:46:52.680 you know

01:46:54.260 the examples

01:46:54.800 you gave

01:46:55.220 of these Central Asian countries

01:46:56.580 it's very interesting

01:46:57.260 because you know

01:46:58.440 they are nominal Muslims

01:46:59.500 but like you said

01:47:00.180 they're the first ones

01:47:01.100 who clamp down

01:47:02.260 on that stuff

01:47:02.880 because they will be

01:47:03.740 the first victims

01:47:04.500 it's even

01:47:05.340 the Muslim Brotherhood

01:47:06.320 is outlawed in Egypt

01:47:07.220 where it was born

01:47:08.160 right

01:47:08.680 but at the same time

01:47:09.780 Sisi and his government

01:47:10.680 pays a lot of lip service

01:47:11.900 and is engaged

01:47:12.980 in Islamizing

01:47:13.960 Egypt

01:47:14.840 and he will ally

01:47:16.180 with the Salafis

01:47:17.000 who are actually

01:47:17.700 more ideologically

01:47:18.640 draconian

01:47:19.220 than Muslim Brotherhood

01:47:20.020 so there's a lot

01:47:21.160 of kind of like

01:47:21.760 shifting back and forth

01:47:22.880 with how this works

01:47:23.900 but you know

01:47:24.860 the bottom line is

01:47:26.160 Islam is what Islam is

01:47:27.340 okay

01:47:27.560 and unlike other religions

01:47:29.220 it's very black and white

01:47:30.180 you know

01:47:31.060 the whole concept

01:47:32.080 the problem with

01:47:32.880 Western people

01:47:33.480 is they project

01:47:34.140 their own religion

01:47:34.960 kind of

01:47:35.500 and they're convinced

01:47:36.600 that for example

01:47:38.040 Christianity

01:47:38.600 is you know

01:47:39.400 separation of secular

01:47:40.360 and spiritual

01:47:41.520 you know

01:47:42.680 Caesar

01:47:43.040 and the coin

01:47:43.700 and whatnot

01:47:44.220 but that's not Islam

01:47:45.340 Islam is not

01:47:46.500 it's not about

01:47:47.500 the condition of your heart

01:47:48.580 and the relationship

01:47:49.160 you have with God

01:47:49.940 it's actually all about

01:47:51.340 the law

01:47:51.840 it's legalistic

01:47:53.600 and in fact

01:47:54.900 everything in Islam

01:47:56.480 there's five

01:47:57.720 you know

01:47:58.260 either it's forbidden

01:47:59.200 you can't do

01:47:59.880 it's disliked

01:48:01.040 you shouldn't do

01:48:01.720 but you can

01:48:02.900 technically

01:48:03.320 it's neutral

01:48:04.020 you can or don't

01:48:05.060 have to do

01:48:05.400 it's recommended

01:48:06.060 you should do

01:48:06.960 but you don't have to

01:48:07.660 or it's obligatory

01:48:08.620 everything in life

01:48:09.740 so Islam really

01:48:10.680 permeates

01:48:11.300 so can it change

01:48:13.080 can they re-articulate it

01:48:14.600 I suppose

01:48:15.160 but you're always

01:48:15.740 going to have

01:48:16.060 the hardliners

01:48:16.720 who say

01:48:17.040 hey

01:48:17.300 that's not

01:48:18.080 what our book says

01:48:18.880 that's not

01:48:19.280 what the Quran says

01:48:20.100 that's not

01:48:20.360 what Muhammad

01:48:20.800 said in the Hadith

01:48:21.720 so

01:48:22.980 I think it would

01:48:24.180 actually be easier

01:48:24.840 to just snuff it out

01:48:25.720 altogether

01:48:26.180 from Muslims

01:48:27.560 themselves

01:48:28.020 in other words

01:48:29.080 I always find

01:48:30.060 the apostate

01:48:30.840 more honest

01:48:31.940 with himself

01:48:33.040 or herself

01:48:33.680 than the moderate

01:48:34.740 Muslim

01:48:35.140 because the apostate

01:48:37.080 is kind of like

01:48:37.840 look

01:48:38.100 I'm not going

01:48:38.600 to kid myself

01:48:39.480 it is what it is

01:48:40.480 and I don't want

01:48:41.100 to be like that

01:48:41.740 whereas the moderate

01:48:42.680 you know

01:48:43.100 they engage in

01:48:43.780 all these

01:48:44.420 sort of

01:48:45.160 intellectual gymnastics

01:48:46.500 in their head

01:48:47.080 to get by

01:48:48.000 I mean

01:48:48.260 if Muhammad himself

01:48:49.400 in a canonical Hadith

01:48:50.420 says

01:48:50.740 whoever

01:48:51.620 the apostate

01:48:52.660 kill him

01:48:53.140 okay

01:48:54.920 or you know

01:48:55.980 or in the Quran

01:48:57.300 itself

01:48:57.800 you are allowed

01:48:58.440 to

01:48:58.640 it's permissible

01:48:59.600 for man

01:49:00.000 to have sex slaves

01:49:00.920 infidel female

01:49:01.980 sex slaves

01:49:02.420 as many

01:49:02.900 as your right hand

01:49:03.920 possess

01:49:04.380 okay

01:49:05.200 these sorts of things

01:49:06.460 if I'm a Muslim

01:49:08.020 and I don't want

01:49:09.120 to accept that

01:49:09.780 for example

01:49:10.320 you know

01:49:11.220 what do you do

01:49:11.860 with those verses

01:49:12.460 and I often watch

01:49:13.940 in Arabic

01:49:14.420 these clerics

01:49:15.560 and that's what they say

01:49:16.340 remember I was telling you

01:49:17.920 about the one guy

01:49:18.960 who was basically saying

01:49:20.080 yeah if you're married

01:49:20.760 to a Christian

01:49:21.200 you can

01:49:21.640 but you have to hate her

01:49:22.340 and lo and behold

01:49:24.220 a lot of the people

01:49:24.880 sitting there

01:49:25.320 were kind of questioning

01:49:26.160 like are you serious

01:49:27.020 and he finally gets frustrated

01:49:28.500 and goes

01:49:28.760 well it's written

01:49:29.400 you know

01:49:29.780 what do you do

01:49:30.200 with the verses

01:49:30.700 that I just quoted

01:49:31.540 including you know

01:49:32.240 you gotta hate

01:49:32.980 and Abraham

01:49:33.840 and what not

01:49:34.360 so the crux

01:49:35.420 of the matter

01:49:35.860 is the religion

01:49:36.560 itself

01:49:37.040 which is so easily

01:49:37.980 identified

01:49:38.640 and clear-cut

01:49:39.520 teaches what we call

01:49:40.980 radical things

01:49:42.000 okay

01:49:42.620 they're only radical

01:49:44.280 from our perspective

01:49:45.180 subjective perspective

01:49:46.620 they're not radical

01:49:47.340 from a Muslim point of view

01:49:48.340 well

01:49:48.520 but that's where

01:49:49.380 that's exactly the point

01:49:50.440 I'm putting to you

01:49:51.040 which is it clearly

01:49:51.840 is radical

01:49:52.500 from the perspective

01:49:53.320 of the rulers

01:49:53.880 of the UAE

01:49:54.620 from the rulers

01:49:55.220 of Saudi Arabia

01:49:55.900 it's radical

01:49:56.640 because

01:49:57.180 it's radical to them

01:49:58.580 because they can

01:49:59.500 suffer from it

01:50:00.180 because they're not seen

01:50:01.260 as legitimate Muslim rulers

01:50:02.800 right

01:50:03.420 and at the same time

01:50:04.400 they have to pay lip service

01:50:05.440 to Islam

01:50:05.940 so they're not

01:50:06.680 in other words

01:50:07.540 a lot of these rulers

01:50:08.520 are just not Muslim

01:50:09.360 at heart

01:50:09.800 obviously

01:50:10.260 but they govern Muslims

01:50:12.220 so they want to create

01:50:13.720 the most

01:50:14.340 you know

01:50:14.800 on the one hand

01:50:15.460 they want to be legitimate

01:50:16.240 and show their legitimacy

01:50:17.860 as hey

01:50:19.280 I can be your ruler

01:50:20.320 and which means

01:50:21.700 they have to kind of let

01:50:22.580 you know

01:50:22.900 let the pot

01:50:23.580 kind of steam

01:50:24.320 come out

01:50:24.760 a little bit

01:50:25.880 so the Muslims

01:50:26.760 can feel

01:50:27.100 this is actual Islam

01:50:28.380 and on the other hand

01:50:29.340 they've got to kind of

01:50:30.100 clamp down

01:50:30.700 on certain teachings

01:50:31.760 so that's why

01:50:32.800 a lot of these rulers

01:50:34.420 are often just

01:50:36.260 you know

01:50:36.660 denounced as

01:50:37.560 you know

01:50:37.940 puppets of the West

01:50:38.860 and not true Muslims

01:50:39.880 including the ones

01:50:40.540 in Saudi Arabia

01:50:41.280 who are actually

01:50:42.020 nominal Wahhabis

01:50:43.120 which is as radical

01:50:43.900 as you can get

01:50:44.700 and in fact

01:50:45.540 they do

01:50:45.980 disseminate

01:50:46.820 and play a huge role

01:50:48.400 in sort of

01:50:49.120 disseminating

01:50:50.380 jihadist literature

01:50:51.440 and they're still hated

01:50:52.660 and seen as pawns

01:50:53.640 of the West

01:50:54.200 Raymond

01:50:55.620 I'm going to ask

01:50:56.400 a provocative question

01:50:57.440 but I think

01:50:57.900 it's an important one

01:50:58.900 do you think

01:51:00.480 the religion of Islam

01:51:01.600 is compatible

01:51:02.380 with the West?

01:51:04.180 No it's not

01:51:04.820 and if you mean

01:51:06.320 by the West

01:51:07.020 the sort of

01:51:07.680 secular liberal West

01:51:08.840 it's certainly not

01:51:09.860 if the West

01:51:10.980 believes in

01:51:11.980 freedom of religion

01:51:13.120 and gender equality

01:51:15.320 and everything

01:51:16.000 that the West

01:51:16.620 you know

01:51:16.940 prizes

01:51:17.460 well in Islam

01:51:19.020 it's not

01:51:19.760 it's not that

01:51:20.500 there's a radical

01:51:21.240 interpretation

01:51:22.000 honestly it's not

01:51:23.160 like I told you

01:51:23.820 that's the observant

01:51:24.740 interpretation

01:51:25.340 which is that

01:51:27.160 so for example

01:51:28.080 you have to

01:51:29.960 okay

01:51:30.200 you have to hate

01:51:31.180 the non-Muslim

01:51:32.060 is that something

01:51:33.740 that you know

01:51:34.440 if you're living

01:51:34.880 in a liberal

01:51:35.300 Western secular society

01:51:36.540 you really want

01:51:37.700 a group of people

01:51:38.420 who are bound

01:51:39.360 to feel that way

01:51:40.380 towards you

01:51:41.020 how's that gonna work out

01:51:42.500 oh I know how it works out

01:51:43.500 just look at the UK

01:51:44.340 right

01:51:44.720 so there's

01:51:46.560 there are built

01:51:47.600 in teachings

01:51:48.580 in Islam

01:51:49.780 inherently

01:51:50.420 not a lot

01:51:51.040 I'm not saying

01:51:51.440 the whole religion

01:51:52.000 there's a lot of it

01:51:52.660 that's actually

01:51:53.360 neutral

01:51:54.220 maybe some of it

01:51:54.920 that's admirable

01:51:55.720 but there are

01:51:56.740 just enough

01:51:57.440 that bring it

01:51:58.880 at odds

01:51:59.560 with the things

01:52:00.900 that the West

01:52:01.720 actually prizes

01:52:02.840 okay

01:52:03.740 the

01:52:05.360 okay

01:52:06.360 killing blasphemers

01:52:07.460 or you know

01:52:08.640 attacking them

01:52:09.320 so in the West

01:52:10.260 freedom of expression

01:52:11.540 and art

01:52:12.280 and whatnot

01:52:12.740 and then

01:52:13.780 what was his name

01:52:14.520 Van Gogh

01:52:14.940 that guy gets killed

01:52:15.940 right

01:52:16.600 because well

01:52:17.460 in the Muslim world

01:52:18.620 everyone would agree

01:52:19.400 with that

01:52:19.720 and they would pat him

01:52:20.800 on the back

01:52:21.280 because that's what you do

01:52:22.400 so the religion itself

01:52:24.160 has built in

01:52:25.000 sort of mechanisms

01:52:25.700 that does make it

01:52:26.880 antithetical

01:52:27.460 to a lot of the things

01:52:29.100 that the West

01:52:29.760 prizes

01:52:30.480 and so

01:52:31.400 I guess the next question is

01:52:33.040 if it's

01:52:34.780 if it's completely antithetical

01:52:36.220 is it therefore

01:52:37.240 an existential threat

01:52:39.020 to the West

01:52:39.600 yeah

01:52:40.480 again

01:52:42.020 but again

01:52:42.820 it gets murky

01:52:43.620 when you realize

01:52:44.200 so what are we talking about

01:52:45.280 Islam

01:52:45.580 you know

01:52:46.040 I'm almost

01:52:46.600 it's kind of like

01:52:47.360 I'm anthropomorphizing it

01:52:49.680 as if Islam's a man

01:52:50.620 Islam is made up of Muslims

01:52:52.060 and I already readily agree

01:52:53.560 a lot of Muslims

01:52:54.280 are not real Muslims

01:52:55.460 are not observant Muslims

01:52:56.860 or cultural Muslims

01:52:57.900 or secular Muslims

01:52:58.780 you have a lot of that

01:52:59.820 I get that

01:53:00.800 and they

01:53:01.660 you know

01:53:02.640 presumably can assimilate

01:53:03.840 and I'm sure a lot of them do

01:53:04.860 but the problem is

01:53:06.320 you have

01:53:06.880 the teachings exist

01:53:08.500 and the teachings themselves

01:53:10.000 are the existential threat

01:53:11.300 because there will be people

01:53:12.700 who do adhere

01:53:13.980 to those teachings

01:53:14.680 and once they do

01:53:16.040 they become

01:53:17.100 the bad guys

01:53:18.160 okay

01:53:18.740 which

01:53:19.540 and nobody wants to see

01:53:21.040 it's funny

01:53:21.620 every time I look at

01:53:23.040 Muslims attacking someone

01:53:24.300 randomly

01:53:24.720 in Europe for example

01:53:26.380 and all of a sudden

01:53:26.920 it's dismissed as

01:53:27.560 oh he had mental problems

01:53:28.580 oh he had psychological issues

01:53:30.260 no he was actually

01:53:31.640 I mean

01:53:32.000 that's how we see it

01:53:33.080 but no

01:53:33.540 he was actually

01:53:34.100 following a directive

01:53:35.040 and something that breeds

01:53:36.440 a certain contempt

01:53:37.260 and hatred

01:53:37.660 for precisely

01:53:39.200 the kind of person

01:53:39.940 he attacked

01:53:40.540 okay

01:53:41.360 so

01:53:41.680 again

01:53:42.960 I'm not trying to say

01:53:43.900 that would be scaremongering

01:53:45.200 if I was sitting here

01:53:45.860 to tell you

01:53:46.180 every single Muslim

01:53:47.000 wants to kill you

01:53:47.840 no

01:53:48.240 they don't

01:53:49.140 I get that

01:53:49.660 you know how many

01:53:50.840 Muslims

01:53:51.700 that you can look at today

01:53:53.860 and you might be like

01:53:55.180 oh this guy dangerous

01:53:56.080 and then tomorrow

01:53:56.720 that guy converts to Christianity

01:53:58.100 but for 10 years

01:54:00.040 and I've known them

01:54:00.840 this guy has been conflicted

01:54:02.420 and for those 10 years

01:54:03.560 he was not even a Muslim

01:54:04.460 but and he was almost a Christian

01:54:06.200 so my point is

01:54:07.100 you don't know

01:54:07.800 there's a lot of these people

01:54:09.200 there's so much gray

01:54:10.140 and a lot of them

01:54:11.580 are not a threat

01:54:12.380 a lot of them are great people

01:54:13.440 okay

01:54:13.880 but again

01:54:14.880 you know

01:54:15.280 it's how do you differentiate

01:54:16.340 and how do you know

01:54:17.520 and and this is why

01:54:19.320 you know

01:54:20.180 it's it's nice

01:54:21.020 and it's good for the West

01:54:21.980 to not discriminate

01:54:22.820 okay

01:54:23.300 but on the other hand

01:54:24.240 by not discriminating

01:54:25.680 or just being intelligent

01:54:26.700 we're going back

01:54:27.900 to the analogy of

01:54:28.720 you know

01:54:28.920 a hundred um

01:54:29.800 you know

01:54:30.080 candies

01:54:30.480 and one even

01:54:31.320 is poisonous

01:54:32.140 and you know it is

01:54:33.060 and you

01:54:33.880 so okay

01:54:34.560 the 99 didn't cause the problem

01:54:36.360 but the one will

01:54:37.140 and that's why

01:54:38.200 you continuously have the attacks

01:54:39.560 that you continue having

01:54:40.360 because

01:54:40.700 in as much as you keep

01:54:41.860 taking these numbers

01:54:42.620 there's a percentage

01:54:43.660 that's going to come

01:54:44.580 with the violence

01:54:45.460 and those things

01:54:46.760 that are antithetical

01:54:47.560 to Western culture

01:54:48.420 so that being the case

01:54:50.200 the UK is in the situation

01:54:51.860 it's in

01:54:52.400 if you were advising

01:54:53.780 the UK

01:54:54.220 on this particular issue

01:54:55.600 what policies

01:54:57.000 would you put in place

01:54:57.980 what advice

01:54:58.560 would you give the government

01:54:59.500 yeah well

01:55:00.180 that's not that easy

01:55:00.940 because you know

01:55:01.520 the UK has really

01:55:02.840 dug itself deep already

01:55:03.980 it's one thing to say

01:55:04.960 hey we don't want to bring

01:55:06.020 in too many Muslims

01:55:06.900 okay

01:55:07.380 like these other countries

01:55:08.220 who were mentioning

01:55:08.680 but when you already have

01:55:10.280 what is it

01:55:10.580 you said four million

01:55:11.280 um

01:55:12.600 you know

01:55:14.080 it's uh

01:55:14.680 well first of all

01:55:15.500 anyone who's illegal

01:55:16.340 I would say

01:55:17.160 has to go

01:55:17.700 immediately

01:55:18.480 I mean

01:55:19.380 if you're there illegally

01:55:20.300 buy

01:55:20.720 no more

01:55:21.660 coming in

01:55:22.360 um

01:55:23.240 I would

01:55:23.520 I don't know

01:55:24.260 how they do this

01:55:25.120 but I would really

01:55:25.880 be monitoring

01:55:26.600 mosques

01:55:27.720 and the Islamic

01:55:28.740 kind of uh

01:55:29.760 programming

01:55:30.700 and what Muslims

01:55:31.500 are being exposed to

01:55:32.760 including on the internet

01:55:33.580 which I'm sure

01:55:34.060 is not so easy

01:55:34.760 so yeah

01:55:35.900 and this is

01:55:36.320 you know

01:55:36.640 and it's

01:55:37.000 at one point

01:55:38.020 you start wondering

01:55:38.660 is it worth all this

01:55:40.000 like what does a western nation get

01:55:42.120 from having to live

01:55:43.100 constantly on its toes

01:55:44.220 um

01:55:45.080 just to be able to live

01:55:46.480 side by side

01:55:47.280 with Muslims

01:55:48.100 but I guess

01:55:48.620 again in this case

01:55:49.560 I get it

01:55:50.020 because they're already there

01:55:51.140 right

01:55:51.740 um

01:55:52.440 but I would have no

01:55:53.440 I would have no compunction

01:55:54.660 or sympathy

01:55:55.080 for any sort of

01:55:56.000 radical preaching

01:55:56.820 I mean

01:55:57.660 I see in the UK

01:55:58.900 radical Muslims

01:56:00.020 screaming you know

01:56:01.260 like actual Islamic

01:56:02.740 jihadist stuff

01:56:03.620 and they don't get in trouble

01:56:05.060 but then when a

01:56:05.900 British person

01:56:07.000 fights back

01:56:07.740 they get arrested

01:56:08.340 okay

01:56:09.100 so this is what I'm telling you

01:56:10.180 this is the real problem

01:56:11.100 right now

01:56:11.480 and you know

01:56:12.400 so when you tell me

01:56:13.520 what advice I could give

01:56:14.720 how about start off

01:56:15.740 by um

01:56:16.340 just being objective

01:56:17.600 and without this

01:56:18.840 two-tier system

01:56:19.560 where you're actually

01:56:20.360 oppressing the natives

01:56:21.300 and empowering

01:56:22.400 those who are actually

01:56:23.880 you know

01:56:24.940 pushing for this sort of thing

01:56:26.020 the jihadist mentality

01:56:27.120 would you

01:56:27.820 would you do more

01:56:28.900 hardline approaches

01:56:29.940 for instance

01:56:30.360 something like

01:56:30.940 banning halal

01:56:31.920 banning uh

01:56:33.740 facial coverings

01:56:35.280 banning burqas

01:56:36.140 okay

01:56:36.900 the facial covering

01:56:38.280 is there's

01:56:38.840 that's a security reason

01:56:40.020 in fact in some

01:56:41.220 in Muslim countries

01:56:42.080 it's sometimes the case

01:56:43.180 women can't wear the hijab

01:56:44.820 because it's

01:56:45.420 sometimes you get a terrorist

01:56:46.380 like I said

01:56:46.900 in Uzbekistan

01:56:47.460 you can't wear

01:56:48.200 you can't wear

01:56:48.940 a full face cover

01:56:49.640 so that

01:56:50.340 yeah

01:56:50.660 for sure

01:56:51.380 there's no problem

01:56:52.100 with that

01:56:52.800 um

01:56:53.260 and

01:56:54.980 and you know

01:56:55.840 if there's a way

01:56:56.480 to stop

01:56:57.380 the sort of

01:56:58.020 de-ghettoize them

01:56:59.440 so they're

01:56:59.800 they do

01:57:00.360 possibly assimilate

01:57:01.460 instead of always

01:57:02.640 kind of living

01:57:03.180 closely knit

01:57:04.160 and it's like

01:57:04.620 I said

01:57:04.920 a small rebot

01:57:05.940 or a Islamic

01:57:07.220 fortification

01:57:08.000 um

01:57:08.800 it's not very easy

01:57:09.860 I mean I think

01:57:10.600 and especially for

01:57:11.600 especially for the

01:57:13.260 mentality that prevails

01:57:14.360 right now in the UK

01:57:15.200 and its leadership

01:57:15.880 like I said

01:57:16.740 they

01:57:16.960 you're asking me

01:57:18.220 let's say this is neutral

01:57:19.640 you're asking me

01:57:20.260 the measures they can take

01:57:21.260 they're still here

01:57:22.160 you know

01:57:22.980 where they're attacking

01:57:23.820 their own

01:57:24.360 and you can't

01:57:25.120 what country

01:57:26.100 tells its citizens

01:57:27.200 you can't

01:57:27.700 you know

01:57:27.960 wave your flag

01:57:28.760 I mean

01:57:29.660 you know

01:57:30.000 this is one of the things

01:57:30.820 that I often point out

01:57:31.500 if you want to know

01:57:32.040 how insane it is

01:57:33.480 in Europe

01:57:34.580 always look at

01:57:35.640 by analogy

01:57:36.300 other non-western regions

01:57:37.900 and guess what

01:57:39.220 you know

01:57:39.460 like I made this argument

01:57:40.920 recently

01:57:41.300 you know

01:57:41.840 I don't know

01:57:42.200 if you use the same

01:57:42.700 terminology

01:57:43.320 but in America

01:57:44.580 the ultra-right

01:57:45.280 is like the bad guy

01:57:46.580 this is like the

01:57:47.300 racist, xenophobe

01:57:48.900 you know

01:57:49.080 crazy patriot

01:57:49.940 and to me

01:57:51.340 the ultra-right

01:57:52.000 is actually

01:57:52.660 how everyone

01:57:54.120 outside the west

01:57:54.760 thinks and acts

01:57:55.440 they're all

01:57:56.620 if you go to any country

01:57:57.660 non-western

01:57:58.360 sub-saharan

01:57:59.460 Asian

01:58:00.180 Latin American

01:58:01.460 what we call

01:58:02.640 ultra-right

01:58:03.220 traditional

01:58:03.780 you like your country

01:58:05.080 you like your flag

01:58:05.980 that's what

01:58:06.560 that's normative there

01:58:07.940 and the ones

01:58:08.840 who support it most

01:58:09.560 are their own governments

01:58:10.560 that's what they want

01:58:11.600 you to be like

01:58:12.080 it's very weird

01:58:13.260 to go to a nation

01:58:14.620 like the UK

01:58:15.220 where oh

01:58:16.000 you're the bad guy

01:58:16.860 because you're waving

01:58:17.760 your nation's flag

01:58:18.980 but then these people

01:58:20.740 are coming in

01:58:21.420 waving their flags

01:58:22.460 including ISIS

01:58:23.260 and that's okay

01:58:24.760 I mean

01:58:25.680 so the UK's

01:58:26.980 problems man

01:58:27.780 they're just

01:58:28.260 kind of mind-boggling

01:58:29.820 I don't even know

01:58:30.380 where to begin

01:58:30.900 it's just

01:58:31.400 it's really warped

01:58:32.960 Raymond

01:58:34.160 on that happy note

01:58:35.120 we're going to ask you

01:58:36.340 our final question

01:58:36.980 before that

01:58:37.400 tell us about

01:58:37.880 your latest book

01:58:38.540 yeah

01:58:39.280 The Two Swords of Christ

01:58:40.440 thanks

01:58:40.840 the subtitle

01:58:41.800 is The Five Centuries of War

01:58:42.840 Between Islam

01:58:43.480 and the Warrior Monks

01:58:44.160 of Christendom

01:58:44.700 which comes out

01:58:45.260 it can be pre-ordered now

01:58:46.760 comes out later in November

01:58:48.220 so this book

01:58:49.840 is basically

01:58:50.640 a third of

01:58:51.120 it's my trilogy

01:58:51.960 I've been writing

01:58:52.660 books that deal

01:58:53.420 with the history

01:58:53.880 of Christendom

01:58:54.560 and Islam

01:58:55.320 and the first one

01:58:56.280 was Sword and Cemetery

01:58:56.980 which looked at

01:58:57.680 the general

01:58:58.380 kind of what we talked about

01:58:59.700 the second one

01:59:00.680 was Defenders of the West

01:59:01.660 which looked at men

01:59:02.640 so the first one

01:59:03.620 looks at decisive battles

01:59:04.640 between Islam

01:59:05.400 and the West

01:59:06.240 like Yarmouk

01:59:07.040 and Manzikr

01:59:07.580 which I mentioned

01:59:08.200 the other one

01:59:09.280 looks at decisive

01:59:09.880 Christian men

01:59:10.660 and a lot of people

01:59:11.680 like that second book

01:59:12.520 because it's

01:59:13.300 they're just shocked

01:59:14.320 that Western Christians

01:59:15.340 can act this way

01:59:16.160 but this book

01:59:17.500 is even more so

01:59:18.360 because this book

01:59:19.640 deals with

01:59:20.160 the warrior monks

01:59:21.000 the Templars

01:59:21.920 and the Hospitallers

01:59:22.940 and what their

01:59:24.940 rationale was

01:59:25.800 and I think what

01:59:26.680 people will find

01:59:27.300 interesting is

01:59:27.940 you know

01:59:28.320 on the one hand

01:59:29.240 these guys were

01:59:30.120 very militant

01:59:31.020 on the other hand

01:59:31.560 they were very Christian

01:59:32.580 more Christian

01:59:33.700 than your average guy

01:59:34.680 and to your average

01:59:35.920 Christian today

01:59:36.660 of course

01:59:37.120 the two don't mix

01:59:38.020 you know

01:59:38.780 there's what I call

01:59:40.160 doormat Christianity

01:59:41.340 which is what

01:59:42.660 kind of is very

01:59:43.360 prominent in the West

01:59:44.340 to be a good Christian

01:59:45.460 is essentially

01:59:46.380 to be a doormat

01:59:47.120 and it's easy

01:59:48.680 to be a doormat

01:59:49.320 too

01:59:49.580 you know

01:59:49.980 non-confrontational

01:59:50.920 so a lot of people

01:59:51.580 make a virtue of advice

01:59:52.680 you know

01:59:53.400 and they're non-confrontational

01:59:54.800 and they're cowardly

01:59:55.600 and they pat themselves

01:59:57.880 on the back

01:59:58.280 saying I'm just being

01:59:58.740 a good Christian

01:59:59.360 not so these guys

02:00:01.420 okay

02:00:02.020 so these guys

02:00:02.540 were immensely militant

02:00:03.640 and they really took

02:00:04.680 the war to Islam

02:00:05.840 and talk about

02:00:07.220 I kind of alluded

02:00:08.260 to it earlier

02:00:08.960 when we were talking

02:00:09.560 why the Crusades

02:00:10.220 failed because of numbers

02:00:11.460 it really came down

02:00:12.800 in the end

02:00:13.220 it was just these guys

02:00:14.020 and these were monks

02:00:15.260 and warrior

02:00:16.220 you know

02:00:16.560 holy warrior monks

02:00:17.900 essentially types

02:00:18.820 and so I think

02:00:19.900 people will be

02:00:20.600 fascinated at their

02:00:21.560 theological underpinnings

02:00:22.760 and one of them

02:00:23.820 which I get into

02:00:24.520 because and that's

02:00:25.240 the title of the books

02:00:26.040 the two swords of Christ

02:00:27.200 is are you familiar

02:00:29.300 with the verse

02:00:29.780 there's a biblical verse

02:00:30.720 where Jesus tells

02:00:32.140 his disciples

02:00:32.700 sell your cloak

02:00:33.940 and buy a sword

02:00:35.220 and they say

02:00:36.180 look Lord

02:00:36.680 here are two swords

02:00:37.480 and you say

02:00:37.920 that's enough

02:00:38.760 so to your average

02:00:40.640 modern day Christian

02:00:41.660 that has absolutely

02:00:42.480 no meaning today

02:00:43.140 it has nothing to do

02:00:43.980 with real swords

02:00:44.600 okay

02:00:44.900 to medieval Christians

02:00:46.800 especially

02:00:47.260 and a lot of

02:00:47.840 pre-modern Christians

02:00:48.640 in general

02:00:49.200 what that verse

02:00:50.460 meant is

02:00:51.100 you have two

02:00:52.260 we're facing two battles

02:00:53.480 as Christians

02:00:54.040 one against spiritual forces

02:00:55.600 and you need a spiritual sword

02:00:57.360 and one against physical

02:00:58.440 secular forces

02:00:59.260 and you need a physical

02:01:00.080 secular sword

02:01:01.200 so that was understood

02:01:02.580 by a lot of theologians

02:01:04.280 and that's what gave rise

02:01:05.620 to these sorts of military orders

02:01:07.380 and it was of course

02:01:08.220 also fused in the concept

02:01:09.480 of just war

02:01:10.360 but anyway

02:01:11.740 yeah I think it's going to be

02:01:12.780 an interesting book

02:01:13.440 to a lot of people

02:01:14.140 and it's going to be

02:01:14.660 eye-opening

02:01:15.160 at how Christians

02:01:16.720 used to behave

02:01:17.620 in the face

02:01:18.440 of these sorts

02:01:19.280 of existential threats

02:01:20.400 well with that

02:01:21.800 we're about to go to

02:01:23.060 triggerpod.co.uk

02:01:24.440 where our audience

02:01:25.220 get to ask you

02:01:25.880 their questions

02:01:26.540 but before we do

02:01:27.340 what's the one thing

02:01:27.980 we're not talking about

02:01:29.020 that we should be

02:01:29.640 before Raymond

02:01:31.180 answers a final question

02:01:32.340 at the end of the interview

02:01:33.560 make sure to head over

02:01:34.500 to our sub stack

02:01:35.340 the link is in the description

02:01:36.840 where you'll be able

02:01:37.760 to see this

02:01:38.760 is there a sect of Islam

02:01:40.820 that is non-violent

02:01:41.720 does not believe in jihad

02:01:42.820 and does not want violence

02:01:44.180 and to topple western powers

02:01:45.960 what I don't see very much of

02:01:48.980 is Christians in the west

02:01:50.540 being concerned about

02:01:51.780 the mass slaughter of Christians

02:01:53.360 in Africa

02:01:54.180 and the Middle East

02:01:55.180 do you have an explanation

02:01:57.740 of why that's happening

02:01:58.840 and not happening

02:01:59.840 what's the one thing

02:02:01.320 we're not talking about

02:02:02.360 that we should be

02:02:02.980 oh boy

02:02:04.560 you know I think

02:02:06.880 we've talked about

02:02:08.040 a lot of things

02:02:08.640 but it's something

02:02:09.360 I brought up

02:02:09.940 which I think is

02:02:10.760 the most important thing

02:02:11.720 never to forget

02:02:12.340 which is again

02:02:13.620 you know don't lose sight

02:02:14.500 of the real source

02:02:15.300 of the problem

02:02:15.820 and the Islam problem

02:02:18.060 in the west

02:02:18.480 it's not the Muslims

02:02:19.280 okay it's the policies

02:02:20.900 it's the policies

02:02:22.060 that actually enable

02:02:23.900 empower Muslims

02:02:27.020 and bring them in

02:02:28.180 by the millions

02:02:28.820 okay and that's actually

02:02:30.020 supposedly something

02:02:30.920 you can do about

02:02:31.840 assuming you know

02:02:33.080 you live under

02:02:33.720 some sort of democratic rule

02:02:35.260 or you have representatives

02:02:36.700 that you supposedly

02:02:38.300 elected

02:02:38.740 okay and if

02:02:40.700 it doesn't work

02:02:41.760 then there's something

02:02:42.400 else going on

02:02:43.240 and the problem

02:02:43.820 needs to really be

02:02:45.580 looked at a little closer

02:02:46.820 but the point is

02:02:48.400 a lot of you know

02:02:49.140 this isn't about

02:02:49.980 hating Muslims

02:02:50.680 that's not what

02:02:51.380 I'm trying to say

02:02:52.100 I'm trying to say

02:02:52.960 historically

02:02:53.460 there was always

02:02:54.400 a clash

02:02:55.080 you know the people

02:02:55.980 that I'm talking about

02:02:56.760 in this book

02:02:57.500 or just historically

02:02:58.480 if they thought

02:02:59.760 their descendants

02:03:00.840 are bringing Islam in

02:03:01.980 they just

02:03:02.640 I mean I'm sure

02:03:03.400 they're spinning

02:03:04.000 in their grave right now

02:03:04.880 because it just

02:03:05.240 wouldn't make any sense

02:03:06.120 to them

02:03:06.500 okay

02:03:07.020 so a lot of it

02:03:08.400 a lot of the problems

02:03:09.460 are just self-made

02:03:10.780 by the West

02:03:11.580 okay

02:03:12.280 Islam is weak

02:03:13.140 as you pointed out

02:03:14.060 earlier

02:03:14.340 Islam is inherently

02:03:15.200 weak right now

02:03:15.860 physically

02:03:16.220 economically

02:03:16.920 militarily

02:03:18.160 it can't do

02:03:19.360 what it does

02:03:20.080 but why is it doing it

02:03:21.260 it's because

02:03:21.740 Western elements

02:03:23.280 are making it

02:03:24.080 are empowering

02:03:24.980 and allowing it

02:03:25.600 so like I said

02:03:26.600 I like to

02:03:27.120 get to the heart

02:03:28.020 of matters

02:03:28.420 and in this

02:03:29.080 current case

02:03:29.960 it's not Islam itself

02:03:31.080 it's the West

02:03:32.560 head on over to Substack

02:03:34.540 where Raymond's

02:03:35.080 going to answer

02:03:35.500 your questions

02:03:36.280 there seems to be

02:03:39.120 a belief

02:03:39.500 particularly in

02:03:40.080 left-wing circles

02:03:40.860 that Islam spread

02:03:42.180 to billions of people

02:03:43.020 with flowers

02:03:43.600 and chocolate

02:03:44.140 my question is

02:03:45.580 in Islamic schools

02:03:46.600 and universities

02:03:47.300 is this how Muslims

02:03:48.420 understand their own

02:03:49.260 history

02:03:49.520 I love shopping

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TRIGGERnometry - December 14, 2025

The Real History of Islam with Raymond Ibrahim

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