Is Winnipegās Middle Class Quietly Disappearingļ¼
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Summary
For decades, Winnipeg has been the country s quiet bellwether. Not too rich, not too poor, not driven by oil like Alberta, not propped up by finance like Toronto. When policies work here, they tend to work nationally. When they fail here, the country usually feels it next. And right now, Winnipeg s middle class is under pressure. Home prices are climbing faster than wages, rent is spiking, grocery bills are crushing families, and public sector growth can t absorb everyone.
Transcript
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Hi, thanks for joining us. I'm Mike, this is TPL Media. Go to tplmedia.ca to support the network
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and see other great shows that are based on the things that Canadians are talking about
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right now. You know, for decades, Winnipeg has been the country's quiet test market,
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the economic bellwether. Not too rich, not too poor, not driven by oil like Alberta,
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not propped up by finance like Toronto, just a balanced working middle-class city.
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When policies work here, they tend to work nationally. When they fail here, the country
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usually feels it next. And right now, Winnipeg's middle class is under pressure. Home prices are
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climbing faster than wages, rent is spiking, grocery bills are crushing families, manufacturing jobs
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aren't what they used to be, and public sector growth can't absorb everyone. Young families
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are questioning whether stability is still possible in Winnipeg. Winnipeg used to be proof that you
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didn't need to live in Vancouver or Toronto to build a comfortable life. So if that model is
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cracking here, in Canada's most normal city, what does that say about the rest of the country?
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On today's show, we are asking the question, if the middle class is disappearing in Winnipeg,
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Well, Paul, it's, by the way, Paul Micucci joining me to have this conversation because our economy and
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just finance in general is in your purview here. So I appreciate you joining me on this.
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Winnipeg is potentially in some trouble, but not only that, it's kind of an indicator for the rest of
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Yeah, I think so, Mike. You know, the size, you know, we've talked about in the past, I think,
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you know, you and I before the show, Winnipeg and Ottawa were used as test markets to sort of
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symbolize what products, what was going to work in Canada. Economically, it was kind of the test
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bed because of the size, right? $100 billion economy, GDP, 1.5 million people. It used to be
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the average GDP per capita, but coming out of COVID, it's fallen to third last in Canada.
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It's a massive fall, quite frankly, because, you know, a working community,
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you'd think the productivity per Canadian would be high.
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But it's actually fallen quite a bit, which I was shocked to see, like, for example,
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Yeah. So the average GDP per capita, roughly around $75,000. They're at $64,000.
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And they seem to have historically had sort of a more steady economy. The GDP will level out
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over a longer period of time, rather than the spikes we see in, for example, Vancouver or Toronto.
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So is that, do you think, going to start to disappear based on this?
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Well, the interesting part, Manitoba itself is highly dependent on the United States.
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So export and import and export and imports are both three quarters of them are from the United States.
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So, you know, I was diving in it because I knew we were doing the show.
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So, you know, really, if you take a look at what we export, so we export to the United States pharma,
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And in a short period of time, when you showed me that number, I mean, it was year over year.
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From 24 to 25, $300 million just left the market.
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Now, that was, it's interesting because the State of the Union yesterday, when you were listening to Trump,
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you know, he is saying that, quite frankly, be prepared that pharma is going to come back into the United States in a big way.
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So if you're going to compete in that market, your margins are going to be lower.
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So even if the Canadian companies are going to produce pharma to go to the United States,
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he's not going to let it bill at as high a price or sell at as high a price.
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So he is really dictating what's going to happen in that marketplace.
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You know, it's interesting, Paul, as you say this to me, I'm starting to envision Winnipeg is sort of central in Canada.
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It has the major port, major hub there for logistics.
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A lot of what comes into Canada from the U.S. arrives over the border and into that by rail and trucking into that center.
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If we are not doing as much business across the border, that's going to fail.
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And it's only indicative of what we're not doing in business with the U.S.
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So as we watch Winnipeg, Manitoba on the whole, we're going to see first in places like that, things like tariffs having an effect, things like the economy failing, having an effect, because that port of distribution is going to slow right down.
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Yeah, well, you look at it, you know, what are their main exports right now?
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So we talked about pharma being number one, buses, public transport vehicles.
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So, you know, again, the U.S. is on this mission to build this all at home.
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We're building trains, not buses here in Canada.
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So, you know, again, that's something that the supply management chains with respect to rapeseed, which canola canola and everything happening with U.S. is about to change.
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I mean, right now, Winnipeg is heavily protected by Kuzma, right?
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You know, the good thing is on that front, you know, recently the Chinese negotiation by the prime minister has opened up that market, you know, his having to give up EVs and so many EVs in Canada, 49,000, whatever the number is, in order to get that market moving again.
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But again, you know, as things move forward and we get through Kuzma, how that impacts the U.S. is to be seen.
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Crude petroleum oils and oils obtained from, you know, the ground, the bitmys soils, electrical energy.
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We think, you know, that's the center of the universe and then offshore.
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So going and then coming back to Manitoba, you know, we have a net-net export-import relationship with the United States.
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So this is the one you and I talked about.
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Aircraft, spacecraft, parts, and then, of course, pork, pigs.
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And then, quite frankly, furniture, electrical transformers, converters, inductors.
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But essentially, what you're saying is Manitoba's business is with the U.S.
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That's where all of the business comes and goes.
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So right now, taking a look at a chart, I'm going to throw it up after the show.
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But this is as of June 2025, 71.6% of their trade, their exports, were with the United States.
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Only 5.5% was with China, 5.8% with Japan, only 3.3% with Mexico, and 1.2% with Australia, and then others.
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So heavily, heavily reliant, just like we are in the rest of Canada.
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But because of their size, their small GDP in the 1.5 million population, just like the test markets you saw in marketing, this is the test market where you're going to see the impacts the fastest.
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So if we watch, if we want to watch what's about to happen coming into the middle of the year, this is a market we should be paying close attention to to see the impacts.
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In fact, if you don't mind, I'm going to detour just for one second to talk about the test market that Winnipeg has been, just so that people understand what we're talking about.
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Fast food and retail products, McDonald's, Tim Hortons, all of these guys have historically tried products.
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You know, new menu items, pricing experiments, store formats even, national ad campaigns, and that in itself, advertising.
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Almost every ad campaign for every bank, every financial institution, every insurance company, any major communication that needs to be done between Canadians and their health, Health Canada and the rest of Canada, is all tested historically in Winnipeg.
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And, you know, then, Paul, the next thing is policy.
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So we test policy in Winnipeg historically because of the population, because of the disbursement of the population, but mainly because there's a healthy, consistent middle class of people that you can test on.
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The people that are going to go to Tim Hortons consistently, go to your restaurant, buy your brand, watch, they've got cable, they're watching your campaign.
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This was a good, solid test market because it was a solid lifestyle in Canada.
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Well, it was, you know, urban and rural kind of equally balanced.
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So, and a lot of farming, as we just noted from the products we listed in their export totals, and quite frankly, you know, more manufacturing bases.
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So, you know, we saw airplanes, spacecraft, all those things, generators, all real manual labor technical.
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And quite frankly, a lot of reasons for that, as we all know, is that, you know, the history of Canada, Eastern Europeans tended to migrate towards, you know, Manitoba, Saskatchewan.
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They all had a very mechanically based trade base.
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Or it was easy to get into that without a lot of jumping through hoops to get into an industry.
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A lot of, you know, I noticed in the trades that I deal with on, you know, a daily and a monthly basis, a lot of the really good heavy mechanics are coming still from Eastern Europe.
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So whether it's, you know, for trucks, whether it's for generators, that a lot of them come.
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And that just because that's what they learn as a trade going forward.
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Now, one of the other things that kind of struck me as we were talking about this, and as I was looking into my little bit of research into Manitoba,
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Winnipeg households are working more hours than they did a decade ago and taking home less share of income compared to previous generations.
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This is devastating to many people who are lifelong, multi-generational people living in Winnipeg.
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They've had a massive influx of immigration, which affects metro housing in Winnipeg.
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It's changed the dynamic entirely of what jobs are available historically to youth.
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And the health care system there, which many, it's, by the way, the largest employer by far, the largest industry by far, health care, is investing all kinds of money.
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But the wait times are still way too long for the amount of people that live in that city.
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So Winnipeggers right now, is that what you call these people, by the way?
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Like, Christophe, I don't want to offend anybody.
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I do think that I can commiserate because, yes, food prices are going up.
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That's really felt in a middle-class economy, things like food, things like taxes, you know, the housing costs going up.
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Any slight difference to the middle class, and it's devastating.
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So because of the urban-rural kind of connection, you have a lot of people who are, their incomes are dependent not so much on annual raises.
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So, you know, the better my crop does, the more money I have.
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So the economy kind of rises and falls based on the commodity pricing of whether it be wheat or whether it be, you know, swine, pigs, and pork.
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That's how the world works in their environment.
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So you're seeing, quite frankly, that that fluctuations up and down and down aren't matching the inflation levels that they're seeing on the other side, which the rest of Canada, you know, we see it in a different way when you come east because, quite frankly, more manufacturing-based.
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You're seeing a creep, but you're seeing, you know, our inflation, food prices, all those things increasing at more than our raises to our, not so much public sector, but our private sector.
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Our public sectors are still getting large raises because, you know, we're codependent on them.
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So every time someone who's an essential service says they want more money, you say how much.
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80% of families are working harder than 10 years ago, as I mentioned, to just stay in the game.
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And many middle-income families aren't seeing real wage growth.
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The meaning, meaning that that increased expense cuts deeply into their budgets, which also means they're not saving.
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And if you're not saving, you're not expanding life.
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You're not making a big purchase down the road.
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You're not getting your kids into a home if they need the assistance.
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So it's not that the middle class is disappearing.
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Well, you know, and it's interesting because I took a look at the top revenues.
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When you look at inflation and effects on economies, I first of all go to the top revenue-producing companies in the sector, in the area.
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So commercial banking is number one, which you can see raises in commercial banking are not, you know, they're private.
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So, you know, that's a net export, net import business in that basis.
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So quite frankly, on a commodity basis, they haven't seen, you know, it's been, as we've seen, it's been around 60.
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So there's horror stories on the West Coast on hospitals.
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Meanwhile, they're sinking so much money into them right now.
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For 1.5 million people, they're at like a crazy $100 million or something.
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Yeah, I think Wamp Canoe is like really maybe over skis on the health.
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Winnipeg had a lot of news about how long you'd wait for health care.
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The strain on health care, he's discovering quickly, you can't just throw money at it.
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But if he's listening or if someone's listening that wants to tell him about it, he should go look at what Quebec's doing right now.
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But, you know, they did acknowledge the problem.
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So, you know, and kind of read what's going on in Ontario.
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I think if you combine our Auditor General reports for what's going on in the health care with what Quebec is saying.
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I think you get a true story of what's happening in health care, even though as Canadians, we all want to put our head in the sand and forget about it and pretend it doesn't exist.
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Well, we want to do the virtuous thing, which is help each other and make sure each other's healthy, right?
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Having said that, money has to be put into the right places.
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And historically, it's really top heavy, I think, in the health care system, both at the pharmaceutical and the doctor end of it, the specialist end of it.
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Which, by the way, if you can get a specialist in any period of time that you need when you're lucky.
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The interesting thing, Mike, when you go down, and I'll just get to the top 10 here, but, you know, new car dealers, supermarkets and grocery stores, farm supplies, and then automobile wholesaling.
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It's interesting to watch kind of how their top revenue companies kind of drop off fast.
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And there aren't really a lot of, how do I say it?
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Anything to do with cars, you got to be worried right now.
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Well, there's a deal in place as parts go back and forth, taxes are removed.
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And if tariffs come into place, those industries are instantly impacted.
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And, you know, the top 10 employers in Manitoba right now is the government is number one.
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Number three is Maple Leaf Foods, which is, I guess, is important.
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BCE Inc., Manitoba Hydro, and Walmart, and then insurance company.
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So, at the bottom of the list, really, are the, at the bottom of the list, at the top
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The kind that pay enough to have a vacation, make sure that your kids can go to university,
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your house has a roof when it needs it, and life moves on fairly smoothly.
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But you're kind of gripping, you know, you're, at this point, you're kind of holding on because
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that U.S. relationship is in the balance right now.
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You know, that's been kind of something that everyone's been talking about over the last
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So, well, we stopped talking, but now all we talk about is tariffs, apparently.
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So, you know, that's what's challenging us right now.
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You know, one of the things that caught my attention was the, just the housing situation
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A typical home costs about $341,000 in Winnipeg, which means saving for a standard downsized
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home requires 13.6 months of income for a 20% down payment, up from 12.4 in just 2014.
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The money you have to put aside, now you have to jump through flaming hoops at the bank to
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make sure that you're good for the money because they let it go crazy for so long.
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The monthly mortgage payment now will eat 35% of after-tax income, up from 26% just a
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So, I mean, 10% over a decade is a significant, over a decade is not a long period of time
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for a family in Winnipeg to see a massive difference in what they have to do to survive.
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And now, if they are the prototypical city and we're seeing that indication there, first
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of all, it sounds to me like if the U.S. doesn't play nice, Manitoba gets hit hard.
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Farmers get no margin because the margins are similar to the tariffs.
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The taxes going back and forth on aerospace will be devastating and they'll take a pass on
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Uh, people will be out of work shortly in that scenario.
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So we need to figure something out with the U.S. for, for Winnipeg.
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But it also kind of indicates that the rest of Canada, when Mark Carney talks about, you
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know, everybody's going to have to breathe in, tighten the, tighten the belt a little
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I think what he's talking about is what we're seeing in, in, in Manitoba, Winnipeg specifically.
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And again, you know, I, I come back to look at the imports that we bring in in Manitoba.
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So, uh, as we talked about, uh, number one, uh, is turbo jets.
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So propellers, turbo jets, all the things that go into, um, number two or close by is harvesting
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So all the equipment we bring in farming tractors, number three, pesticides, number four.
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So those are all the things we're bringing in to make stuff to send to the U S yeah.
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All of those items we require to do business back into the U S pretty much.
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So all our heavy equipment, all our motor vehicles, uh, for passenger transport, all those parts
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So again, this is a symbiotic relationship where parts are moving back and forth across border.
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So these are all things we're bringing in that are making up and, and even the insulated
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wiring, uh, electrical, optical fiber cables that are all going into all the equipment that
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we're building, uh, uh, centrifuges, filtering of purified machinery, all that stuff is stuff
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we're bringing into, to, for oil and gas, for farming, for all those things we're using.
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We're not self-sufficient even so if it becomes difficult to do business with the U S, but
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we have business someplace else in the world, but we're still kind of out of the game because
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the items that we need to do the business with are suddenly taxed at a price that makes
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us no longer valid in the other markets we found we're priced out.
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Well, we are, and we'd have to go, I guess we'd have to try to, and here's the challenging
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part, which is what we're seeing in Winnipeg first, which is something we've talked about
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Our, our exporting is highly, highly dependent on the U S as we just talked about our importing
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So we can say, we're not going to import any of these things anymore, quite frankly, because
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Well, first of all, Trump has told us, I don't want you doing business with China, right?
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Maybe we do, but Japan is self-sufficient and manufacturing and certainly technology and
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We're probably not going to do a lot of business with them.
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Well, I don't know where this lands because there's really no market plus Trump isn't
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going to let us sell aerospace technology to people around the world is going away, right?
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So if we, if we, you know, if we still want to be in the agricultural business in Manitoba
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and we're getting, we're importing all our parts and products and heavy machinery from primarily
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the United States, then we have to go and figure out if we don't have any exports to the United
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States, which makes up 71% of this market, then we're not going to be able to import,
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Because we can't, we can't have, we can't not be able to sell it somewhere and have the
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So we have to be, we have to be making it at home, but then we're going to have to figure
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out where we source all of the material to do it with.
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So is, I guess that's the question, you know, at the end of the day, how much of our wheat
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And are we in the market in those countries at the price that we can offer it by the time
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Are we able to get it there in, you know, a fashion, I guess, if it's already processed?
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But if it's raw, no, we probably can't be in the market as easily in some parts of the
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world, like, you know, Australia, for example, or, you know, even as far away as, um,
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Asia, I don't know that our wheat products hold up.
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I guess if it is processed, somebody else could tell me on that, but I think you've got a
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Where do we go to source and to sell in enough time, in time to keep that middle class
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surviving, not just in Winnipeg, but across the country.
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Where, and where did, so, and, uh, not too much doom and gloom.
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Where did the depression, when you see all the pictures of the depression, where do you
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Because quite frankly, uh, as the market and the nationalism and the borders closed, the
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Because they need to farmers just, you know, and you think about it now, this season's done
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in the farm business, you know, they've started, you know, they've bought fertilizer.
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They've, you know, they've already figured out what they're doing for the upcoming summer
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You had to commit to get into pricing at that time.
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So you had to be in, you know, planning, be there, you know, so you're, you're planning
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So you're kind of, I'm going to get through this season come the fall.
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I'm going to make my decision up for next season.
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So, you know, you're always, uh, you know, a year to six months, six months to a year
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You have to be, to be in that market, like any business.
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So now they're sitting there watching this, they're going to watch Kuzma and then they're
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If they don't get a, if they don't have a decision, they're just going to stop.
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And then at that point, they're going to, the imports, uh, from anywhere else in the
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They're not going to be shipping anything other than the stuff they've made this year,
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And then again, that's why markets, when you see things sort of bogged down in smaller
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cities and, uh, uh, rural, uh, uh, communities, you see that quite frankly, because of the
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It's they have to be ahead of the game on pricing.
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You could lose a crop, a disease, a bad situation.
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Um, so already farmers are taking a pretty big risk.
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You know, and now add to this, you know, they only make eight to 15% on average profit margin.
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So now if they're tariffed 10%, they have to find another market.
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If the U S dries up that quickly on that, they just can't afford to be there.
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But, but here's the, you know, and this is the question I'm starting to ask more and
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But, you know, you look at, you look at the numbers and we've talked about in other shows,
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like when, when you go, you know, uh, for example, Mexico, and I, and I'm pretty sure
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I'm pretty close to the number, but we did, we export about $6 billion.
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Canada, you know, the UK 30 something billion dollars, like the amount we export to the U S
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So like, you know, we're talking, we're talking, um, you know, an asterisk, uh, uh, uh, period.
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We're not talking, you know, something, uh, that we can just pass by.
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So, and, and that's where I'm, I'm getting concerned because the date for Kuzma is coming
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It's time to go in region by region and actually lay down a, a contingency plan to, to start
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to talk to people by region, what they're going to do.
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Um, I'm wondering if Carney comes back from his most recent trip, it's funny.
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He's got, uh, he's taking a premier with him on this one.
00:28:40.460
I mean, well, the premier with him, because the premier is smart enough to realize where
00:28:47.620
Where does he, you know, what he probably said, I'm coming with you.
00:28:53.260
So he's got to figure out how to push, you know, that industry out.
00:28:59.680
Also, you know, Saskatchewan, not to switch provinces, they're also pretty healthy historically.
00:29:07.960
Uh, that could be another test market in Canada, but we see the premier going, getting on a
00:29:13.080
plane and going with the prime minister and saying, I look, I need to know what you're
00:29:18.580
I, well, I've got to be doing business for my province.
00:29:20.960
Well, and honestly, I think it's, I think it's his constituents behind him.
00:29:25.580
I think the difference a little bit between the two provinces, you know, in Saskatchewan,
00:29:29.680
I think there's a big collective of business people behind him saying you get on the plane.
00:29:39.480
And then when he gets off the plane, I think there's a big constituents of people waiting
00:29:46.160
I don't think there's, I think it's a little different there.
00:29:48.720
I think, I think we're talking about two and you know, not to knock, not to, not to knock
00:29:53.760
Manitoba because I think they've had their challenges, but you know, they did have, um,
00:30:01.400
Oh, uh, um, well, there was, uh, Stevenson and then before that, uh, the missing premier,
00:30:06.960
the one that went to Costa Rica or somewhere for three quarters of the year.
00:30:23.000
Hey, listen, nobody said that there was going to be a premier's quiz at the start of the
00:30:33.880
So we were, we were in a kind of one of those areas where we, we, we had, you know, Biden
00:30:37.740
was in great relationship with the U S weren't worrying too much.
00:30:41.720
You know, we could spend three quarters of the year in the sun and, you know, be, you
00:30:46.260
know, calling everyone from, you know, FaceTime and doing all that cool stuff.
00:30:55.180
You can, you can hope that, uh, you know, the U S changes their mind, but.
00:31:00.140
You know, we saw last night if state of the union, you watched him.
00:31:11.080
I don't care what the Supreme court's going to do.
00:31:15.940
And quite frankly, if you decide you don't want to take my deal, I won't take any of
00:31:26.740
Yeah, I don't really, I have the power to do it.
00:31:33.600
And he's, that's, that's what he's willing to do.
00:31:36.580
So, and if that's the case, then there's not much choice, but we're going to take the
00:31:42.000
Maybe negotiate a little bit on the 10% in certain industries, but overall taxation back
00:31:49.640
and forth kills aerospace, kills agriculture, kills pharma.
00:31:53.720
Well, and also, you know, we're, we're at the point now, so this is, um, you know, the
00:32:00.900
Ukraine Russian war is still ongoing, but at some point that'll stop and the U S will
0.65
00:32:08.040
move in right to, to assume the materials and lands that they were promised under the
00:32:13.800
agreement that he, you know, that he didn't make Zelensky sign that we didn't.
00:32:18.720
So, you know, we gave the money without any hooks or conditions.
00:32:22.720
So, and they will move in and they will really working against our own interest.
00:32:28.340
We'll start to export and, uh, or, you know, or the U S will import as much as they can from
00:32:36.080
a country that they're supporting or they have supported, uh, imagine that our relationship
00:32:43.720
So then we'd have to shift, but these are all the plans.
00:32:51.800
I know we don't want to talk about it, but it's not hard to find like, you know, preparing
00:32:57.240
for this show and I, you know, just for the, the people watching, you know, preparing for
00:33:01.600
this show is, you know, we pull the annual report of the, of the, of the province.
00:33:05.720
We sit down and look at the, you know, in import export associations, we pull the numbers.
00:33:13.500
You see where all these things are provided, um, you know, and you look at it and you say,
00:33:21.220
But at this point, let's like, let's start to actually talking, you know, intelligently
00:33:30.120
Well, you, you want to, I mean, if you take a look at Winnipeg is a good example.
00:33:34.180
If you take healthcare out of the mix, which we can't really afford to be, you take healthcare
00:33:39.960
to the mix aerospace out of the mix and even just a little bit of the farming and there
00:33:46.800
I think, you know, they can't, and then what does that mean federally?
00:33:50.120
Well, that means that we're going to be subsidizing the farmers, the aerospace, it, we're just
00:33:56.000
Well, these, you know, these people will pick up and move.
00:33:59.140
They have to, at this point they will, but because the aerospace will for sure.
00:34:03.080
Once those industries are leaving as they, as they start to, you know, move to other places
00:34:07.860
and they, they leave Winnipeg, quite frankly, you'll, you know, banks will close.
00:34:19.020
All those things will happen, you know, and you're, you're starting to see it's, it's
00:34:23.220
interesting what you're starting to see in market trends, even, even here in the East,
00:34:29.840
You know, you're seeing the composition of business is changing, you know, the Loblaws is
00:34:40.220
So they're not, you know, they're going to expand shoppers, but reduce the Loblaws
00:34:46.560
So, you know, they're, you're, you're going to see all these things happen as, as the
00:34:51.300
And then quite frankly, co-ops, farmer co-ops, equipment, all those things they'll reduce.
00:35:00.600
They started with housing, the cost of living, food and less hours to be paid for on an overtime
00:35:09.260
The healthcare industry grew, but they imported people to do it with.
00:35:13.220
And so really as our test market, as the prototype in Canada, it's a little frightening right
00:35:21.120
The, the teeter totter that, that Winnipeg is sitting on, we all are.
00:35:27.000
And probably with, maybe it goes down faster than anybody else, but it is indicative of
00:35:33.880
what we're going to see in every other province across the country.
00:35:38.100
That's why so politically, and then just, you know, before we wrap up, if I was, you
00:35:42.980
know, if I was on the political end and I was actually in power as a government right
00:35:47.540
now, I would be moving to places like Manitoba to get a plan in place.
00:35:51.780
Cause the last thing you want to do, it's, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
00:35:55.080
If you see Winnipeg and the province of Manitoba start to struggle significantly, the rest of Canada
00:36:01.740
will see it's coming in certain fashions and form, and then that'll be the domino that
00:36:07.620
And I think that's why you got to get a plan in place.
00:36:10.000
Maybe what we need to do is, uh, that's a great idea actually in my mind.
00:36:17.780
Let's say, okay, us, we're going to do everything based on our successes in Winnipeg and Manitoba
00:36:25.760
And if everything works out there, then we'll roll it out across Canada.
00:36:29.240
But until we come to this negotiation point in one of our bellwether provinces, we don't
00:36:37.500
And the first thing I would do, a big infrastructure project.
00:36:42.140
We're talking about huge infrastructure projects and other places in Canada right now.
00:36:47.260
This is a province that needs, needs a big win.
00:36:50.580
So, you know, I know we're talking about AI centers and energy and all that good stuff.
00:36:55.440
And if you use the resources of Manitoba and find a way to actually do something on a big
00:37:01.040
scale here that helps Canada from an infrastructure perspective, I think it makes sense.
00:37:07.220
Rather than losing people to other cities from Winnipeg that are qualified, keep them.
0.52
00:37:12.600
You have people who are heavily skilled from different countries to build turbines, to
00:37:22.740
Well, I think we solved another problem, maybe just for Winnipeg today.
00:37:25.900
Thanks for talking to me about this, because I think it's important, Paul, that as Canadians,
00:37:29.660
we understand there's indicators out there already right now that we need to look at.
00:37:34.520
And I do like the idea of making that test market where we begin to solve some problems.
00:37:40.100
And look forward to talking about it more as we proceed, because really the outcome here,
00:37:48.200
We have one tariff announcement, one Kuzma meeting left, and we'll be back at this table,