True Patriot Love - What Does Canada Actually Gain From India？

00:00:00.800 why does modi even care if he's doing business with us uh most of the business is coming out

00:00:05.200 of his country he's getting the uranium that he wants out of us separate of this deal and

00:00:11.440 essentially he doesn't have to take too much trade i don't even know how we make his visit list to be

00:00:16.640 honest with you how he landed in canada for any reason when he has so much trade going on in other

00:00:21.680 places certainly right across the border i guess that's why proximity

00:00:30.640 Hi, thanks for joining us.

00:00:32.380 Prime Minister Modi has just finished a visit with Prime Minister Carney.

00:00:36.340 And what does all this mean?

00:00:37.600 Was there some tough negotiation?

00:00:39.480 Have we done amazing trade deals with India?

00:00:42.100 To talk more about that, to give us an update on how that all came together,

00:00:46.460 Paul Micucci joins me.

00:00:47.440 Thanks so much, Paul.

00:00:48.320 Hey, Mike.

00:00:49.100 Hey, you know, it's interesting.

00:00:50.300 So they're talking about a comprehensive economic partnership agreement.

00:00:54.920 And they call it SIPA.

00:00:56.120 So I'm just going to call it for the show.

00:00:57.780 I'm going to call it a partnership agreement.

00:01:00.560 didn't know a lot about this trade so i had to kind of before the show i had to dig in and

00:01:05.840 find some numbers and i was shocked truthfully how little trade between our two nations we do

00:01:14.720 and it was interesting because when i dug into it mike india is like number 13 on the list of trade

00:01:23.280 that we do with other world countries throughout the world globally so i took a look and of course

00:01:28.400 everyone knows the united states is number one 926 billion dollars total trade between the two

00:01:34.880 countries in 25 and then you have the eu you have china mexico united kingdom japan germany south

00:01:43.280 korea vietnam italy at 17.5 billion france at 15 billion brazil at 14.7 billion the netherlands at

00:01:54.080 13.9 billion and then you have number 13th on the list is india the largest country in the world so

00:02:00.880 we took a look at it before the show 1.5 billion uh yeah almost 1.5 billion people yeah 1.5 billion

00:02:08.800 497 people per square kilometer compared to our whopping four yeah if you think about it in canada

00:02:15.440 we are four people per square kilometer and india is massive so kind of there's that population

00:02:21.280 uh perspective right it is massive but we're not doing a ton of trade so in fact paul we've sent

00:02:27.520 more money to the ukraine than we do in trade with india yeah yeah pretty much and and so

00:02:34.000 you know our imports are about 9.7 billion a year and given last year's stats so we we basically

00:02:40.400 brought into canada 9.7 billion of trade oh so most of that 13 billion was stuff we were buying

00:02:46.320 we were buying and basically we exported 13.9 billion it's interesting when you give the big

00:02:52.560 number that the u.s does my first thought was what is the u.s trading well it makes great sense

00:02:57.840 because there's a certain uh amount of productivity that is american owned that is in you know needs

00:03:06.080 resources that come out of india right and so it makes sense we're not really producing much

00:03:13.920 in the way of technology we're not producing uh engines we don't need the steel we don't

00:03:19.040 instead we're trading off pretty risky items actually uh one of the deals that i read was

00:03:25.680 we've just sold sold 22 million tons of uranium in this deal yeah a couple billion dollars worth

00:03:32.720 and that was his last visit right a very quick favor before we continue a large percentage of

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00:03:58.480 directly it takes just five seconds costs nothing keeps you informed so thank you now back to the

00:04:05.520 show so interesting mike dove into this and said okay how are people feeling at home because

00:04:11.840 you know i'm gonna i'm gonna just go into this for a minute because there was some

00:04:16.800 you know it's been a bumpy ride the last few years especially through the trudeau area because

00:04:22.720 you know you go back to 2010 when their trade talks started and then you go forward to continued

00:04:30.960 trade talks going on and on uh there's an interim deal progressing in 2022 yeah they kind of as i

00:04:38.640 recall they kind of uh stamped a deal yes that was meant to go back to both governments and then the

00:04:45.440 najjar uh killings they're killing in the in surrey which then you know was a big hiccup canada pause

00:04:52.160 talks uh trudeau made allegations india denied the allegations uh we launched a full investigation

00:05:00.960 yeah by investigation there were four indian nationals charged uh rcmp allegations in 2024

00:05:10.320 uh six diplomats were expelled each way uh the hoag report uh names india's second most active

00:05:18.000 interference actor uh in the election interference then in 25 carney becomes the pm

00:05:26.880 uh modi in june of 25 modi and carney meet at the g7 uh and high commissioners are restored

00:05:35.120 so then it seems like everything starts to get back on track so let's look at that period of

00:05:39.280 time that's uh from 20 when did we begin that in uh this is what 15 years now yeah 2010 is when

00:05:48.240 you know the the talks kicked into into gear um and then you know it took us 15 years to get to

00:05:55.120 three 13 billion dollars in trade with the largest country on earth yes yes so and then from there

00:06:02.480 the g7 as we mentioned uh the g20 in johannesburg the partnership agreement starts to form um

00:06:10.880 there's joint statements uh the kamiko deal that's the uranium deal that you talked about

00:06:18.480 and then you know you hear all these uh ambassadors going back and forth you have

00:06:23.520 fourth round of negotiation fifth round of negotiation and now the you have the g20

00:06:29.200 coming up in miami in december i think the 12th to the 14th and modi is expecting to visit in that

00:06:35.440 time frame so now let's put this into perspective for a second and maybe you can help me understand

00:06:41.200 this why does modi even care if he's doing business with us most of the business is coming

00:06:47.440 out of his country he's getting the uranium that he wants out of us separate of this deal and

00:06:53.520 essentially he doesn't have to take too much trade i don't even know how we make his visit

00:06:58.240 list to be honest with you how he landed in canada for any reason when he has so much trade going on

00:07:03.820 in other places certainly right across the border i guess that's why proximity i think proximity i

00:07:09.600 think we have a lot of um indian canadians here so we have uh 1.9 million uh canadians that uh

00:07:17.580 are from india so i think you know there's families there's ties there's a number of reasons

00:07:23.180 it's mixed review so a lot of uh canadians uh when they did the i think angus reed uh took a

00:07:30.020 september 2025 survey and they said 51 said restoring ties was the right move 22 percent

00:07:36.980 disagreed um and that should come first 48 said uh choose chose trade and 52 percent

00:07:46.700 tro chose the rule of law yeah so in other words you know do you want their first discussion to be

00:07:53.260 to be about the rule of law or trade it was pretty much an even split so that you know that just

00:07:59.580 shows you um what the interest and what the response is from canadians on this right now

00:08:06.700 are they worried more about the and you've done shows on it mike on the infiltration of crime

00:08:13.100 from india to canada are they worried about trade between india and canada well i'll be honest with

00:08:19.340 you nine what what comes in three billion that we're buying basically yeah so four billion we

00:08:25.980 bring in four billion let's just use round numbers on it ten billion uh is i'm sorry ten billion is

00:08:32.700 imported we export four billion so we're making four billion dollars yeah on a potential problem

00:08:39.500 this is why i think it goes to canadians in the angus reed poll i mean who what other poll have

00:08:44.620 we seen about should we be doing trade with another country now this one makes some sense

00:08:49.100 just the us okay aside from that but i think that that is because of the uh certainly the the

00:08:57.340 enormous rise in population of the indian community in canada yeah simultaneously alongside that for

00:09:03.020 better or for worse for whatever reason came this crime element of extortion uh international uh 0.99

00:09:09.260 cartel trade um you know uh creating uh situations that are problematic for the police but under the

00:09:16.380 chargeable amount or you know you're not going to go to prison for very long for what's going on

00:09:20.540 here that's frightening to canadians they don't if you said to canadians okay look we're going to 0.68

00:09:27.260 have a a bigger thumb on india making sure they don't infiltrate or we can do four billion dollars

00:09:33.740 worth of business with them what do you want to do if you positioned it that way i'm pretty sure

00:09:37.740 canadians oh yeah would say no no we want to protect ourselves yeah it's the it's the rule

00:09:43.020 of law of course and so i think the more that question is asked the more the prime minister

00:09:48.140 uh prime minister carney is going to get forced down you know to make the rule of law the number

00:09:53.580 one issue at the table at this point so but you know it's interesting mike you know when i took

00:09:58.940 a look at india i was trying to figure out uh okay they're not trading with us right who are they

00:10:03.740 trading what are they trading with and what are they trading and what are they trading right so

00:10:08.220 they're a net importer by quite a bit so took a look at the 2000 which i was shocked about this

00:10:13.900 now does it really surprise me given where they're located and the population probably not but i know

00:10:20.140 they've got to be a massive consuming population but i thought they were actually producing more

00:10:25.420 so i thought they were producing more items that were actually then sold around the world and i

00:10:29.260 thought quite frankly that that was the reason that the country had seen such wealth so the the

00:10:35.500 you know the country has been very prosperous over the last decade really kind of changed um

00:10:41.740 the whole uh eco geopolitical landscape of the country for the good um so you hear you know

00:10:48.300 good news stories new developments very savvy business people coming from india so um basically

00:10:55.180 they imported 651 billion dollars into the country last year in 2025 but they exported 446 billion

00:11:05.340 yeah that's pretty significant uh yeah and i have to thank the guys in the back as they pulled this

00:11:09.740 up and so i said okay give me a feel for who they're buying from who they're who are they

00:11:14.620 importing from and that was what i was trying to figure out so i i delved into it and i had a

00:11:19.980 great article here um from daniel workman and it's the latest available country specific data shows

00:11:26.540 that 65 of the products imported in into india were furnished by providers in mainland china

00:11:33.740 making up 17 united arab emirates making nine percent russia making eight percent united states

00:11:42.460 making 6.6 percent saudi arabia 4.1 iraq 3.6 hong kong three singapore three uh three in south korea

00:11:53.180 japan three indonesia three and germany 2.5 it's amazing how much business they do with russia isn't

00:12:00.700 it oh yeah it's in china i mean i i get it i get the chinese connection just based on proximity

00:12:07.340 an amount of product but the russian one that that i find that a little shocking so from a

00:12:12.940 continental perspective three-fifths or 60.4 percent of india's total imports by value in 2025

00:12:21.260 were furnished by exporters located in fellow asian countries okay so their trading partners are

00:12:30.060 isolated primarily in their region we're not on that list so as far as you know products that

00:12:36.860 we're exporting to them of course because the lower value we're not on that list so there's

00:12:41.420 they're hemispheric traders yes so lots of opportunity for expansion but okay what are

00:12:46.620 they importing now so then i went okay what do they import so they import mineral fuels oil

00:12:51.980 sorry 209 billion electric machinery equipment 100 billion dollars gems a ton of gold in this

00:13:00.060 equation 93 or almost 94 billion machinery including computers 71 billion organic chemicals

00:13:08.140 25 billion plastics 22. animal vegetable fats and oils waxes 19 billion iron steel 16.5 billion

00:13:17.900 assuming that's from china mostly inorganic chemicals 15 and then you have optical technical

00:13:25.820 and medical apparatuses 15 billion so that's what they're bringing in so those are the items that

00:13:32.540 are going into the country now i think we have an opportunity on that uh on those items to get

00:13:39.660 increase our uh exporting to india definitely um and i think the uranium deal for energy is a good

00:13:47.260 example hey before we go any further please hit the subscribe button right now if you want the raw

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00:14:03.740 all right back to the show even if you break down the mineral fuels and you look at you know the

00:14:09.660 crude oil and the petroleum gases coal processed petroleum all the things that they're doing we

00:14:16.140 have an opportunity to do things with them could we do it at the same price that's a good question

00:14:22.540 right because yeah the opportunity i think canada has a lot of trade opportunities but our pricing

00:14:29.660 is really out of whack with a lot of the world well we haven't to date now when you look at uh

00:14:36.060 imports of gems which they do a lot of gold of course like i mentioned was 58.9 billion diamonds

00:14:43.180 16.8 silver 9.2 and then it just goes into small metals but there's a lot of you know gold we are

00:14:50.940 in the north of uh canada northern canada we have a lot of gold reserves so yeah there are

00:14:56.940 opportunities whether it be uranium gold minerals we have things that we can look to actually

00:15:03.980 sell to india um you know as we look at this relationship you know we have to get it more

00:15:11.260 balanced because they're providing and then i said okay what are they making because then

00:15:15.100 it became very confusing to me mike is what are they what are they making and basically

00:15:21.000 where are they exporting it so almost 56 percent of their products are exported from india

00:15:28.660 to importers in the u.s so the u.s is heavily dependent on india they get india sells uh 20.8

00:15:38.180 percent of that 56 percent to the united states so they're their biggest biggest trade partner

00:15:43.480 trade partner from an exporting perspective from India to the U.S.

00:15:47.460 Then second is the United Arab Emirates, Netherlands, then China.

00:15:52.200 Again, big difference in importing and exporting between China and India.

00:15:58.020 As you saw, China was their number one importer into the country.

00:16:03.620 United Kingdom is three, and then it goes down the number of smaller countries,

00:16:08.540 all in the region, quite frankly, all in the same continent.

00:16:13.480 so you know you look at it you think to yourself okay i get it so what are they selling so they're

00:16:19.520 of course refining so they're doing quite a bit of refining of mineral fuels and they're selling

00:16:24.400 them that's what it is they're a reseller of of refined fuels yes they are doing quite a bit

00:16:29.660 electrical machinery equipment which makes sense that's what you always think of india for is

00:16:33.900 taking components and making lower end products and sending them into different markets into

00:16:39.800 markets yeah machinery and computers that makes sense um they do some redistribution of the gems

00:16:46.300 and materials so they um they actually have uh jewelry makers and what they do is they get that

00:16:53.340 gold they get those uh that uh different diamonds they make beautiful pieces and they send them

00:16:58.940 around the world and they have very distinct gold pieces oh beautiful gold beautiful even the color

00:17:04.380 of the gold the the consistency of the gold is much more pure i think in many ways it's a different

00:17:09.240 color gold than you see anywhere else in the world yeah and if you've ever been to an indian jewelry

00:17:13.320 shop in canada it's amazing and they have all these beautiful pieces that they have bollywood

00:17:18.800 stars wearing it's really it's something to see when you go in and get a chance and

00:17:23.200 they're highly secured they go in there's it's i'm always amazed when i go into a couple of them

00:17:29.800 that are here and i walk in the number of people shopping in these stores it's very part of the

00:17:35.700 culture the the the beautiful fine jewelry it's gorgeous very part of the culture yeah you know

00:17:41.340 you and I on any given day may not even wear a watch but yeah the value of those jewels and the

00:17:47.680 our artistry uh the artisanal value of it is very very popular in the Indian community I'm not

00:17:54.900 surprised that they're buying oh yeah um pharmaceuticals a big part of their exporting

00:17:59.800 so big pharmaceutical um highly educated uh community do a lot of pharma um so that's a big

00:18:07.280 part vehicles uh cereals i was uh shocked when i saw that so they export a lot of cereals

00:18:14.880 articles of iron and steel and then uh iron and steel yeah steel is a big deal out of india it's

00:18:22.700 what it is a major uh export canada even uh on occasion finds itself getting indian steel but

00:18:28.000 They do it through China.

00:18:29.340 Right.

00:18:29.840 Yeah, exactly.

00:18:30.520 Yeah.

00:18:30.900 So the question becomes, I guess, you know, then the question for us right now is, how

00:18:36.000 do we want to move this relationship?

00:18:38.360 So we're about to enter into a partnership agreement.

00:18:41.180 We realize, quite frankly, given the stats we just went through, we're not big on, they're

00:18:46.780 not big on our list and we're not big on their list, right?

00:18:49.160 We're not hitting the top 10.

00:18:50.000 Did I say something controversial?

00:18:51.540 Yeah, sure.

00:18:52.280 No.

00:18:52.680 Forget it.

00:18:53.120 Not too controversial.

00:18:54.220 Forget it.

00:18:54.960 What?

00:18:55.540 Forget the trade.

00:18:56.220 i'll be honest with you it just doesn't seem it's a population of 1.5 billion people

00:19:03.800 they do an enormous amount of trade just to the south of us why why do we care well we care

00:19:11.480 because quite frankly with the u.s we now have this big hole in our trading

00:19:16.260 28 billion dollars and growing and so we have to find you know we do need to find other partners

00:19:23.960 to trade with now so part of the prime minister's constant traveling to different nations is trying

00:19:30.840 to fill that hole with goods and services that we can provide to other nations this is the biggest

00:19:35.960 nation in the world we haven't been able to figure this out i don't know if we are going to figure it

00:19:41.080 out quite frankly well if it's the beginning okay but there you know you have to think of india

00:19:46.360 india's having similar problems to what china is right now with with everything going over in iran

00:19:51.800 with the oil distribution with everything happening it's caused a total disruption in their

00:19:57.080 environment they have to be wondering and worried about the same things that the rest of the world

00:20:02.360 are do they start to try to make more at home do they start to try to not nationalize because they

00:20:09.400 are in you know they need items to come into their country to survive so they're importing is based

00:20:15.320 on bringing resources in to refine to remake to build that's how they made their marketplace so

00:20:22.040 now nationalism around the world is a real issue for them quite frankly so when the united states

00:20:27.240 says time out i'm going to build it at home india goes oh no yeah well you've seen it you saw the

00:20:33.880 expert you know their number one exporting uh partner trade partner is the united states now

00:20:39.320 they're starting to say time out now they'll find ways to to deal with that but they're looking for

00:20:45.080 other people to send we can't take more from them we have to get them we have to balance

00:20:50.360 our trade deficit with them right now so that really is the big part of that discussion

00:20:56.520 because as canadians do we need more probably not you know we're we already do if you think

00:21:01.960 about their list of items have oil we already do pharma when we do pharma fairly well in the

00:21:09.240 country we're decent at it um electronics we have a lot of electronic suppliers from around the world

00:21:16.200 quite frankly so a computer a phone uh cars yeah we have a huge car auto industry issue right now

00:21:24.840 we need to sell steel so so if they won't buy steel we don't need to buy steel we need to sell

00:21:31.000 steel we need to sell lumber so all the things we need to sell we need to sell minerals those

00:21:36.440 are the things that need to go out now that makes sense from our perspective so if they'll buy it

00:21:40.520 that's great if they're not going to buy it then will there be a lot more trade and i i i think

00:21:46.040 like that that is really the key partnership agreement discussion that's about to take place

00:21:51.000 and i don't i don't know if to you i'm a little i have a different sort of a bent on it i i don't

00:21:56.680 know if there's a resolution to it right now i don't know in this climate would there be an

00:22:01.880 appetite to change that yeah i don't know i mean it seems to me that uh just based on how little

00:22:07.640 we do in in in the way of business with india uh either we've either this is the beginning

00:22:13.720 of a relationship that is going to flourish into other trade but at the moment i don't i don't see

00:22:19.160 what we have to offer that they would take they got the uranium they need the which by the way i

00:22:24.280 should point out they're not taking uranium allegedly for weapons grade materials there's

00:22:28.760 two very different kinds of uranium for this uh uh purpose and they've signed a deal saying that

00:22:34.360 it's for energy so we're already providing them a certain amount of energy product could we be

00:22:38.840 providing them crude at a certain rate that's still profitable and if we did what does that

00:22:44.200 do for canada does it devalue the marketplace because it can buy uh crude cheaper at other

00:22:49.640 places you know through china and but at this point as you raised that point i was like you know

00:22:55.640 that is true the world is in a moment where getting fuel getting crude oh yeah shipping has changed

00:23:03.380 oil it's hard to do yeah yeah so they are in kind of a position they're in a position are we really

00:23:10.800 in a position to take on three billion dollars in uh sales two of which over uh you know a period

00:23:17.820 of time is one item i guess it just and probably a lot of canadians have the same question that i

00:23:24.220 have why do we bother well I think there's agri-supply I think a lot of it is food agri-supply

00:23:30.540 you know the two billion uh two sorry two million people that we do have of Indian descent in Canada

00:23:36.800 right now they do bring quite a few you know whether it's food supplies whether it's agri-supplies

00:23:41.560 they do bring things from India that they enjoy so I think there's a healthy robust market for that

00:23:46.580 oh okay that I can see I don't think that grows substantially I think that's kind of well we've 0.54

00:23:51.200 Yeah, we've hit immigration off.

00:23:52.940 We've capped that at the moment.

00:23:54.060 Exactly.

00:23:54.580 So I think that stays fairly stable.

00:23:56.500 So I think that trade will endure and stay in place.

00:24:00.860 Yeah, and you know, Mike, I was trying when going through the list,

00:24:04.440 and if anyone has any comments, I'd love to figure out what I'm missing,

00:24:09.280 whether it be LNG, oil, gas, whatever I'm missing on the list.

00:24:13.000 I'd love to know because I see this as basically maybe a nice visit,

00:24:18.420 maybe a visit that's very warm and cozy.

00:24:20.440 It feels like a diplomatic moment.

00:24:21.980 It feels like a diplomatic moment that maybe they can reach an agreement to deal with the rule of law and try to get those items, you know, packed away and off the table.

00:24:33.580 And then maybe there's some items over time from a mineral perspective that we can start to talk about.

00:24:39.140 But in the short term, I just don't see it, to tell you the truth.

00:24:43.740 Yeah, it's difficult to see this Modi visit as really beneficial to Canadians right now.

00:24:50.440 One thing I will say from a diplomatic standpoint, yeah, we were so far after the incident in Surrey, we were so far apart and driven further apart.

00:25:01.280 And actually, I think from a diplomacy standpoint, because we have so many Canadians that are of Indian descent now, new immigrants to Canada, in fact, that connection is nice for them, to be honest with you.

00:25:14.220 That Canada has a friendly relationship with their home country, that means a lot to Canadians.

00:25:20.060 of that descent I think so I can see the importance there but if this is just the beginning I'd be

00:25:26.000 curious to see where we head over the next five years yeah so December we'll do another show

00:25:30.540 because I'm interesting to see if there's a deal in a part in this partnership agreement what gets

00:25:35.100 signed what the deal is and quite frankly what components make up that deal now let's hope

00:25:41.160 there's a surprise there because as Canadians we sure need a surprise we could use a happy ending

00:25:45.880 we need to be importing more and we need to uh or exporting more and we need to uh have new partners

00:25:53.480 for sure so let's hope that opens up i do i do hope for a better future on this one absolutely

00:25:58.120 Absolutely.

00:25:59.120 Thanks, Paul.

00:26:00.120 Thanks.

True Patriot Love - September 30, 2026

What Does Canada Actually Gain From India？

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