Valuetainment - May 14, 2026


＂$900K Turned Into $121M＂- The Bitcoin Bet That Turned CZ Into A Crypto Legend

Hosted by
Patrick Bet-David
Mentioned
Bitcoin Ben Reeves Bobby Lee Binance Benjamin Reeves Centi Mark Zuckerberg Blockchain Info Steve Wozniak Lee Butcher Peter Smith Steve Jobs Theo Bontu Ron Cao Jack Ma Chen Bo He Yi Manufacturer Tuscaneiro Bitcoins and 2 more
＂150,000 Kids Are LEAVING＂ - Mamdani's NYC School CRISIS Is Worse Than You Think ＂China Is The ENEMY＂ - Ken Paxton DEFENDS Texas' AI Data Center EXPLOSION

Episode Stats


Length

22 minutes

Words per minute

187.4

Word count

4,232

Sentence count

298


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, Ronster chats with Bitcoin's first true billionaire, Satoshi Nakamoto. They talk about how he went from being a geeky kid in a rural village in China to building one of the fastest growing crypto-exchange companies in the world, and how he built a company that went from zero to $1B in a short period of time.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.080 Okay, when I sell my business, I want the best tax and investment advice.
00:00:04.820 I want to help my kids, and I want to give back to the community.
00:00:07.960 Ooh, then it's the vacation of a lifetime.
00:00:12.320 I wonder if my head of office has a forever setting.
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00:00:30.000 your story fascinating story you know before everybody learned about you with binance at the
00:00:35.880 time i think you guys went from zero to billion the fastest out of any other company that we had
00:00:40.580 and then reports came out you on twitter you have a massive following when it comes down to bitcoin
00:00:46.420 the comments you've made the stories of you selling your house for 900 000 all of that
00:00:50.740 but for some of the audience that maybe doesn't know before you became the business tycoon that
00:00:55.140 you are today. How does the story begin? Well, we trace back, right? I was born in a fairly rural
00:01:02.220 village in China. I grew up there, moved to a city when I was 10, and then moved to Canada when I was
00:01:09.400 12. And then I did high school there. I did high school in Vancouver, and then I started college
00:01:16.680 in Montreal, in McGill. Didn't graduate there. I did four years, and then my intern boss gave me
00:01:24.600 a job, and I delayed and delayed, and I never went back to McGill.
00:01:29.020 I started working.
00:01:30.780 And then I worked in Tokyo, New York, Shanghai, and then where else?
00:01:38.780 Singapore.
00:01:41.040 So I started as an IT guy and then turned into an entrepreneur.
00:01:47.020 I worked in Bloomberg in New York.
00:01:49.620 um and so i was always in the sort of thin financial tech fintech field um so um and then
00:01:56.920 i started a company i was a junior partner of a it company i started a company with six other
00:02:02.220 older guys um in shanghai in 2005 did that for eight years and then i came across bitcoin in 2013
00:02:09.360 um and i was like this is the this is the this is the future technology so at that time it was
00:02:14.460 actually pretty interesting because um i think there's three big technologies in my life there's
00:02:18.060 internet that's blockchain and at the time i didn't know what was next right at the time i
00:02:22.620 thought the next one was going to be like 10 15 years later now we know it's ai so i think this
00:02:26.940 is the three big technologies in my life um when the internet was happening i was too young to
00:02:31.600 really do anything meaningful with it um in the blockchain uh when blockchain is happening we
00:02:37.080 know we got lucky we founded a platform that's uh that's impactful that's useful and then so yeah
00:02:43.020 that's kind of how i came to be yeah well if i was in high school with you say you're 14 15 years
00:02:47.960 old who were you in high school we're in a class together who's cz i was a normal kid i was a bit
00:02:52.940 geeky uh i played a lot of sports um and um i was like you know asian kid in canada um that played
00:03:01.680 volleyball um that um just no more kid nothing i wasn't super smart i wasn't super um i wasn't
00:03:08.860 the best in any academics i was pretty decent in math and science um a bit weaker on the literature
00:03:14.280 like no english uh french i was very bad in french um uh yeah so but i was a normal kid yeah
00:03:21.160 did did people like did you know you're gonna do something special like was there something
00:03:26.340 where like one day i'm were you a driven kid or no no it was it was not it was no it was like
00:03:33.060 there was no indications i was anything special um i was just a normal kid yeah and i there was
00:03:38.480 never any indications oh this guy's gonna build a billion dollar company even were you a dreamer
00:03:43.760 Would you dream about one day, you know, I'm going to do this, make my family proud?
00:03:48.240 Was there any thoughts like that with you?
00:03:50.780 No, I didn't have any of the, I wanted to be successful.
00:03:53.700 I wanted to do well, but I never dreamed of being a billionaire or like, you know, run a largest crypto exchange.
00:03:59.660 Like, that's just never, like, you know, I just wanted to like, no, have a, I want to be financially successful.
00:04:06.280 I want to have a successful career.
00:04:08.260 I want to build a good life.
00:04:09.700 I want to, I always worked hard.
00:04:11.800 But I wasn't dreaming like, no, I want to be the worst, I don't know, whatever ranking.
00:04:18.540 That just, that's not.
00:04:19.280 That wasn't you.
00:04:19.980 Yeah.
00:04:20.260 So I don't know if you read the book, Accidental Millionaire.
00:04:23.660 It was a book written about Apple, about Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak.
00:04:28.380 It was, I think it's a former employee that wrote, it's a little bit of a disgruntled guy that was saying bad things about him.
00:04:34.000 There's a different copy of it.
00:04:35.300 If you go to Accidental Millionaire and you put Apple, just go to images, you'll see which one it is.
00:04:40.140 Apple, that's the one right there.
00:04:42.740 Then they wrote a book called The Accidental Billionaire.
00:04:44.940 If you notice, it's only got 11 reviews.
00:04:46.660 This came out in 87.
00:04:47.740 It's actually a very good book.
00:04:49.200 For somebody in the space, Lee Butcher was actually a very good book I read.
00:04:53.000 Then the book came out called An Accidental Billionaire.
00:04:55.860 And that was written, I think, about Mark Zuckerberg, who, you know, he became a billionaire.
00:05:01.920 I don't know what they call it.
00:05:03.060 What's 100 is what?
00:05:04.220 Centi?
00:05:04.880 A hectare is 10.
00:05:06.140 Centi.
00:05:06.600 Centi, right?
00:05:07.160 So you're an accidental centi billionaire.
00:05:10.800 I'm not sure.
00:05:11.160 I'm not sure I'm Senti, to be honest.
00:05:13.780 I think the Forbes estimates are a bit off.
00:05:16.260 They're too high.
00:05:17.160 Okay.
00:05:17.580 Yeah.
00:05:18.240 But yeah, kind of accidental, yeah.
00:05:21.180 And how did it happen?
00:05:22.400 Because I know the story when you sold your property,
00:05:25.020 if you want to share that story,
00:05:26.020 when you sold the property and you bought all Bitcoin,
00:05:28.920 what got you to the point of saying,
00:05:30.520 I have to be able to get into Bitcoin?
00:05:33.220 I started learning about Bitcoin in 2013, right?
00:05:36.060 And at the time, I was like, what, 36, 37?
00:05:39.980 and then I was like okay this is this is the future technology this is bigger than the internet
00:05:45.700 and when the internet was happening I was too young so I was at 36 37 ish I wasn't gonna let
00:05:52.600 this opportunity pass by so I said look I just gotta get involved in this in this in this new
00:05:58.940 technology field I don't know what I'm gonna do first I don't know what I'm gonna do yet but I'm
00:06:04.760 gonna buy bitcoins first so I sold my house sold my apartment and bought bitcoin
00:06:09.860 So that was pretty clear to me.
00:06:11.620 That was a very long-term conviction.
00:06:12.960 Is this a $900,000 apartment?
00:06:15.340 Yes, this is a $900,000 apartment.
00:06:17.240 And when you bought it at the time, what was the average price of Bitcoin?
00:06:19.980 The average price I got in was about $600,000.
00:06:22.220 I got payments in installments, right?
00:06:24.440 So I bought it at $800,000, $600,000, $400,000.
00:06:26.760 So the average was $600,000.
00:06:28.400 So if we do $900,000 divided by $600,000 times $81,000,
00:06:33.820 you're looking at $121 million, give or take.
00:06:37.440 Something, yeah.
00:06:38.260 Just, yeah, about $100 million.
00:06:39.780 Selling a $900,000 apartment turned into $121 million.
00:06:43.500 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:06:44.940 The average person listening to this thinks that's crazy.
00:06:49.120 But what made you say, this is what I'm going to be doing?
00:06:51.200 That's a pretty bold decision to make.
00:06:52.780 That's a big risk to make.
00:06:54.900 Well, number one, I saw the clear future of the technology.
00:06:58.300 I don't know what it's going to be like exactly, but I know it's going to grow.
00:07:01.780 What made you say that?
00:07:02.900 Is it a paper?
00:07:03.820 Is it a white paper you read?
00:07:04.920 Is it someone's paper you read?
00:07:06.080 or back then there was much less materials about it um there was white paper that i read there was
00:07:11.740 a forum called bitcoin talk.org that i spent a lot of time on and then uh going to conferences
00:07:17.760 meeting meeting the people the community made a huge difference and also doing the first
00:07:21.920 transaction with bitcoin when when you when you install your own bitcoin wallet and you realize
00:07:26.620 wait a second this this is a network i can send money to anyone a full control there's no bank
00:07:31.780 involved there's no no other fees involved uh it's instantaneous um so once you realize that
00:07:38.200 it's like this is a technology for the future uh not only did i just sell the apartment um i actually
00:07:43.400 quit my job to look for a new job in this industry right so most people will say like no
00:07:47.620 those two combined are pretty high risk but i think as i know as i as i um detail in the book
00:07:52.840 risk is a risk is not based on the action it's based on your individual circumstance for me
00:07:58.940 my risk tolerance at the time was high
00:08:01.260 because I know I can get a job.
00:08:03.840 If like Bitcoin went to zero,
00:08:05.120 I can get a job in a bank.
00:08:06.740 I can get a job on Wall Street again.
00:08:09.320 That confidence came from what?
00:08:10.500 You're just pure skill set and knowledge.
00:08:12.260 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:08:12.740 So like, no,
00:08:13.920 by the time I learned about Bitcoin in 2013,
00:08:17.260 within 2001, 2005,
00:08:19.300 I was working in Bloomberg in New York.
00:08:21.780 And so I was in entrepreneurship
00:08:23.380 for eight years afterwards.
00:08:24.940 I thought my experience
00:08:26.000 and everything else have increased.
00:08:27.660 My value should have increased.
00:08:28.940 At the time when you sold your apartment and you quit your job, how much did you have in liquid cash?
00:08:33.720 Did you have some money?
00:08:34.880 Not very much because I put most of my cash into the company that was working before, and the rest of the cash was in the apartment.
00:08:41.640 Less than a half a million bucks.
00:08:42.960 Way less.
00:08:43.800 Actually, probably much less.
00:08:46.500 The apartment money was pretty much all I had.
00:08:48.380 The reason why I say this is it's not like you made the decision because you had a couple million dollars in a bank from a previous exit.
00:08:54.640 You're not rich at this time.
00:08:56.080 No, no, no.
00:08:56.500 Okay, so that's a risky decision right there.
00:08:59.060 But you trusted your ability on the way to work
00:09:02.160 and the skill set that you had
00:09:03.320 and the knowledge that you had.
00:09:04.100 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:09:04.720 So I didn't need the 900,000 to maintain my lifestyle.
00:09:08.640 Got it.
00:09:08.960 I can work for income that will maintain my life.
00:09:12.380 And you were a minimalist, even at that time.
00:09:14.540 Yeah, I wouldn't call myself a minimalist.
00:09:16.760 I'm just pretty basic, right?
00:09:18.340 So I wouldn't like, you know,
00:09:19.620 if you look at my table,
00:09:21.200 it's got all kinds of camera gadgets.
00:09:23.140 I wouldn't like minimal, like very clean.
00:09:25.060 That's how I think of minimalists.
00:09:27.720 I'm just a normal, basic guy.
00:09:29.460 Got it.
00:09:30.080 I don't do anything fancy.
00:09:31.420 So when you found out Bitcoin,
00:09:33.280 was it like a three o'clock in the morning aha moment?
00:09:35.980 You're calling your friend, wake up, John.
00:09:37.500 I got to tell you something.
00:09:38.420 We're going to do something special.
00:09:39.880 Did you have a moment like that or was it gradual?
00:09:43.200 Well, a friend told me, a friend, Ron Cao,
00:09:46.240 told me about Bitcoin over a poker game.
00:09:49.780 It was a very friendly poker game.
00:09:51.820 And then afterwards, I spoke to another friend
00:09:54.160 who, his name is Bobby Lee.
00:09:57.260 He was just about to join.
00:09:58.780 Bobby Lee?
00:09:59.380 Yeah, he was just about to join BTC China,
00:10:01.780 which is at the time.
00:10:02.860 Not the comedian, Bobby Lee.
00:10:04.020 No, different Bobby.
00:10:05.840 When I think about Bobby Lee,
00:10:07.180 all I think about is Bobby.
00:10:09.080 The whole Theo Bond thing.
00:10:11.020 Not this guy, not this guy.
00:10:13.060 But yeah, so there was a couple of friends
00:10:15.100 who were around me.
00:10:16.700 They were getting pretty serious into Bitcoin.
00:10:19.000 I was like, okay, let me learn about this
00:10:20.600 a little bit more, yeah.
00:10:22.300 And so from there, is it, you know, inviting friends over,
00:10:26.920 guys, we're going to go do this, we're going to go do that,
00:10:29.380 or no, it was more, I got to go find a company to work for?
00:10:32.100 At the time, first, I spoke to a bunch of guys.
00:10:35.540 We tried to do a few different businesses.
00:10:37.780 Like, basically, like, let's do this and that.
00:10:40.420 I talked to a couple of friends in Taiwan who used to work for TSMC,
00:10:44.400 the Taiwan Semiconductor.
00:10:46.940 Manufacturer.
00:10:47.600 Manufacturer, yeah.
00:10:48.340 Right.
00:10:48.580 Basically, all the NVIDIA chips, all the AI chips,
00:10:50.360 80% of the worst chips
00:10:51.940 are manufactured there
00:10:52.760 we wanted to do
00:10:54.540 a Bitcoin mining chip
00:10:56.080 or a mining machine
00:10:58.120 but that didn't materialize
00:10:59.840 it involves a lot of logistics
00:11:01.420 which are not my specialty
00:11:02.680 how close did you guys
00:11:03.720 get to executing that?
00:11:04.980 not very close
00:11:06.000 we discussed business concepts
00:11:07.380 we had like
00:11:07.860 maybe even a business plan
00:11:09.260 but we didn't pull the trigger
00:11:10.420 I did a couple
00:11:12.240 like Bitcoin ATM machines
00:11:16.240 I actually sold a couple
00:11:17.460 but that also didn't
00:11:20.020 And then I said, okay, well, instead of trying to do a startup, let me try to work for a company first. And I bumped into a few guys at Blockchain Info, and then I joined them for a few months.
00:11:31.840 Big company, small company, startup?
00:11:34.100 Very small company. I joined as a third person there.
00:11:37.280 And who were they players? The other two guys, were they players in the Bitcoin space?
00:11:42.100 Well, the founder is a 20-year-old kid who wrote a website that attracted 20 million users.
00:11:51.420 Wow.
00:11:51.720 At the time, he was 20.
00:11:53.000 At the time, he was 21, 22, yeah.
00:11:55.260 And how old were you at the time?
00:11:56.600 I was like 30.
00:11:57.860 I was 36, 37.
00:11:59.120 So a 36, 37-year-old goes, works for a 20-year-old to build a website with 20 million users.
00:12:05.140 Well, he already built the website.
00:12:06.980 I was just helping him, really.
00:12:08.240 Did you go in as an equity position player or no, just a regular person?
00:12:15.160 No, I joined without much equity.
00:12:17.320 I have an earn out to earn the equity, but I didn't stay that long.
00:12:21.780 I didn't stay more than a year, so I didn't have a year.
00:12:23.760 Did he end up becoming a major player?
00:12:25.480 Like, is he a known guy in Bitcoin today?
00:12:27.840 No.
00:12:28.440 Has he become very successful?
00:12:29.920 No.
00:12:30.940 His name is Ben Reeves.
00:12:32.480 He's the founder of the company, but he sold his shares later on for at least a few million.
00:12:38.240 probably double-digit millions.
00:12:40.080 But then he's a very low-key introvert.
00:12:42.820 So he stayed out of sight.
00:12:44.900 Got it.
00:12:45.280 Ben Reeves.
00:12:46.500 Is that part of blockchain.com?
00:12:48.780 I think they later renamed to blockchain.com.
00:12:52.560 This page doesn't talk about Ben Reeves.
00:12:54.800 But Ben Reeves is a true founder.
00:12:58.800 Benjamin Reeves.
00:12:59.660 Peter Smith and Benjamin Reeves.
00:13:00.700 Got it.
00:13:01.000 So what did you learn from what he did?
00:13:03.820 So now you're working there.
00:13:05.140 What did Ben do?
00:13:06.740 Because you're not there for too long.
00:13:08.100 Yeah, yeah.
00:13:08.500 How long were you there?
00:13:09.680 I was there for eight months.
00:13:10.560 And during that eight months, was it an accelerated learning curve of finding out everything with Bitcoin?
00:13:17.400 I learned a lot, actually.
00:13:18.840 Number one is the community is very dynamic.
00:13:21.640 So this guy, Ben Reeves, his only marketing was based on one thread on BitcoinTalk.org, which is a bulletin, like a virtual bulletin form.
00:13:31.600 That's what brought 20 million people.
00:13:32.980 Yeah. And then also blockchain info at the time didn't have a company. They don't use bank accounts. They don't have an office. They pay everybody in Bitcoin. They pay all the, you know, when we grew into like 18 people, we just, the company just paid every month, send some Bitcoin to all the employees. It's up to them to how they handle that Bitcoin, those Bitcoins. They didn't have an office. They didn't even have the company back then. So it's just like 18 people working together and they're still growing.
00:14:02.500 So I learned a lot of different stuff about blockchain, about crypto during that time.
00:14:08.120 Got it.
00:14:08.660 So did your idea of not having a headquarters kind of come from the experience here that you don't need it?
00:14:14.020 That definitely contributed to like when early on in Binance, I said, look, we don't need a headquarter.
00:14:20.260 We can pay everybody in crypto.
00:14:23.500 Yeah.
00:14:23.880 Got it.
00:14:24.460 So then from there, eight months later, what do you do next?
00:14:28.360 I actually joined a Bitcoin exchange in China, OKCoin at the time.
00:14:34.580 And then I learned a bit about how exchanges operate.
00:14:37.620 Exchanges are actually much closer to what I know best.
00:14:40.500 I've been dealing with trading systems quite a lot.
00:14:44.980 So actually, He Yi hired me into OKCoin.
00:14:49.660 So that's OKEx.
00:14:51.820 And then how long are you there with them?
00:14:53.280 I was there also just under a year.
00:14:55.540 Under a year.
00:14:56.140 Yeah.
00:14:56.560 So, yeah.
00:14:57.120 So this turned into a big company.
00:14:58.900 They got 5,000 plus employees.
00:15:01.240 This is San Jose, Calo.
00:15:02.280 How big of a company is this?
00:15:03.580 I think there are about 2,000 to 3,000 people.
00:15:05.640 Maybe 5,000.
00:15:06.440 I don't know.
00:15:07.300 I haven't, but they're still around.
00:15:10.140 They're a decent size exchange.
00:15:12.620 They're probably about, I would imagine like about 10 times smaller than Binance.
00:15:18.060 10 times smaller than Binance.
00:15:19.720 Yeah.
00:15:19.880 Even Coinbase.
00:15:21.720 I saw the numbers.
00:15:22.860 Even Coinbase is what, a third of your size?
00:15:25.320 Depending on how you calculate,
00:15:26.520 by trading volume,
00:15:27.480 they're much less than that.
00:15:31.780 But by Bitcoin reserves,
00:15:34.440 they're probably about,
00:15:35.280 I actually don't know the numbers
00:15:36.600 on top of my head anymore.
00:15:38.100 By Bitcoin reserves,
00:15:39.320 Coinbase has a decent Bitcoin reserves.
00:15:43.000 They started early.
00:15:43.840 Got it.
00:15:44.220 So from that company you go to from China,
00:15:47.160 how much longer after that
00:15:48.420 do you start Binance?
00:15:49.620 So I left that company.
00:15:50.500 That took me another,
00:15:53.300 I left that company in 2015
00:15:54.760 And it was two years later, in 2017, I launched Binance.
00:15:58.200 So at this point, when you're leaving and you're working at these different companies,
00:16:02.160 what is, are you sitting there saying, I'm eventually going to start something?
00:16:06.920 I'm eventually going to start something?
00:16:08.200 Or that's not even on your mind right now?
00:16:09.780 So in 2015, I said, look, I'm going to do my own startup, right?
00:16:12.880 So I, and I actually wanted to do a Bitcoin exchange, basically very similar to what Binance is.
00:16:18.320 But then the team I assembled, we only had tech guys and we don't have a marketing team.
00:16:23.820 And I wanted to do a Bitcoin exchange in Japan, and none of us spoke Japanese.
00:16:29.340 So I tried to raise money from VC investors, and they said, like, no, there's no way you can do this Bitcoin exchange thing.
00:16:34.180 But you can provide the technology for Bitcoin exchanges.
00:16:36.940 So we pivoted to a technology company providing exchange systems to other exchanges.
00:16:41.620 And we did that for two years.
00:16:43.400 And then it was 2017, we said, well, there might be a chance that we can pivot to running a Bitcoin exchange ourselves.
00:16:51.380 So 2015, we tried to do a Bitcoin exchange, but we were not quite ready.
00:16:58.060 Pre-17, are you a known player in the crypto world, in the Bitcoin world?
00:17:02.760 I think I had a bit of a reputation by 2017.
00:17:07.780 What would people say about you?
00:17:10.260 Who was CZ pre-starting Binance?
00:17:12.920 Like if somebody came up, like right now we talk about Ben Reeves.
00:17:15.320 If somebody said, hey, CZ in 2017 pre-Binance, what would they say about CZ?
00:17:19.180 They would probably say CZ is a technology guy, been involved in the crypto industry relatively early, and been in a senior position in a wallet company, senior position in an exchange company, and then built his own business as a technology exchange systems technology company.
00:17:40.980 That's probably what people would say, yeah.
00:17:43.100 Okay.
00:17:43.500 And so from there, now you have a reputation.
00:17:45.640 Are you at a point that if you start something, people want to work with you?
00:17:49.120 Generally, yes.
00:17:49.940 Okay.
00:17:50.320 So now you start Binance.
00:17:51.860 Yeah.
00:17:52.340 When you start Binance,
00:17:54.220 what were some of the big early meetings you guys had?
00:17:58.060 Like, you know, you think about the meeting
00:18:00.300 that everybody has seen with Jack Ma
00:18:01.800 when he's doing Alibaba
00:18:03.440 and he's there with, you know, five, six, seven guys.
00:18:05.500 I'm sure you've seen this video.
00:18:06.540 It's not black and white,
00:18:07.560 but it's old video where you can tell it's not a...
00:18:10.720 Did you have a meeting like that?
00:18:12.200 Where you said, guys, here's what we're building.
00:18:14.480 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:18:15.360 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:18:15.760 We had a meeting like that.
00:18:17.300 We said, look, let's build this thing called a crypto exchange, right?
00:18:22.900 And put the guys into a room and says, this is what we're going to build.
00:18:27.060 And I told him, look, I've been for the last, I don't know, 17 years in my career,
00:18:34.580 I've always been working on exchange systems.
00:18:36.400 And now I think this is the time to build it.
00:18:38.220 If I don't do this, I'm going to keep thinking about this for the rest of my life, right?
00:18:42.580 So if I don't do this today, I might try again two years, five years, 10 years later.
00:18:46.940 So it's something that we'll have to do sooner or later.
00:18:49.000 And now might just be the right time to give it a shot.
00:18:52.260 None of the other people objected.
00:18:54.380 Everyone's like, yeah, let's go for it.
00:18:55.680 Was everybody in?
00:18:56.940 Everybody was in.
00:18:57.700 So nobody's like, I don't know, CZ,
00:18:59.500 whether you're going to be able to pull this off.
00:19:00.780 Nobody doubted you.
00:19:02.460 On my team, nobody doubted.
00:19:04.200 Everyone's just like, okay, sounds good.
00:19:06.560 Let's go for it.
00:19:08.300 But when I tried to raise money from VCs,
00:19:11.740 no one invested.
00:19:13.320 Everyone's like, no, no, the exchange space is too crowded.
00:19:16.560 There's too many exchanges out there already.
00:19:18.300 You can't do it.
00:19:20.040 So that's the VC investors.
00:19:21.880 And then we did an ICO, initial coin offer.
00:19:24.420 I saw that.
00:19:25.240 And then everyone wants to buy the ICO.
00:19:27.780 This is the $15 million or something?
00:19:29.020 Yeah, this is the $15 million ICO.
00:19:30.500 It was like a stark contrast.
00:19:35.000 And it's $15 million.
00:19:37.220 Am I correct when I say it gave 4,100x return?
00:19:42.120 Yeah, pretty much.
00:19:43.880 So if somebody would have put $1,000, it's worth $4,300.
00:19:47.980 If somebody would have put $1,000 into it,
00:19:52.620 $4,100X would be what?
00:19:55.160 $40,000, $400,000, $4.1 million.
00:19:58.500 Yeah, yeah.
00:19:58.860 Just from $1,000.
00:19:59.920 Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:00.760 And even more, depending on the B&B price at different times.
00:20:05.000 Yeah, yeah.
00:20:05.780 But at the time, it was just crazy because we had a white paper
00:20:08.620 and people were willing to give us $15 million
00:20:10.780 for about half of the total supply of the coins.
00:20:14.740 Did anybody give money that was a player
00:20:16.940 where you're like,
00:20:17.600 oh, wow, that guy is willing to give us money?
00:20:19.540 Was there any players that got in?
00:20:21.080 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:21.840 Who were some of the big names?
00:20:24.260 Well, they're all crypto guys, right?
00:20:25.940 So this guy, his name is Shen Bo.
00:20:28.920 He runs, what's his company, Invictus.
00:20:32.600 He did a couple of different companies, I think.
00:20:35.200 China or Japan?
00:20:37.700 He was in China at the time.
00:20:38.980 He was in China, okay, got it.
00:20:39.940 and um so he when i when i when i asked him he just told me he just told me that no uh cz i'll
00:20:47.400 give you this much money this is before he read the paper he this is before he read anything he
00:20:53.580 just said oh cz you're gonna do a project i'm gonna support you i think he sent me i want to
00:20:59.380 say like 100 eth uh uh and the time was i don't know i forgot the price but you know he gave me
00:21:04.920 like a couple hundred thousand dollars.
00:21:06.400 Yeah, that's pretty wild.
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