Valuetainment - Episode 373： Why Mike Tyson Lost to Buster Douglas

00:00:00.000 30 seconds, one time for the underdog, ignition sequence start, let me see you put em up, reach

00:00:09.240 the sky, touch the stars up above, cause it's one time for the underdog, one time for the

00:00:16.240 underdog.

00:00:17.260 I'm Patrick Bedevi, host of All Entertainment, today I sit down with one of the most interesting

00:00:21.120 fighters of all time, the man who shocked the world when he knocked out Mike Tyson,

00:00:25.560 the first man ever to knock out Mike Tyson in Japan, and that's none other than James

00:00:30.180 Buster Douglas, get ready for a jam-packed interview.

00:00:33.720 James, appreciate you for being a guest here with us, thanks for coming out man, you got

00:00:38.240 an incredible story, I mean it's not every day somebody wakes up and you go against the

00:00:41.940 odds that way, they call it the greatest underdog fight of all time, the biggest upset of all

00:00:46.740 time.

00:00:47.200 Unbelievable.

00:00:47.900 There's a lot of upsets, you got the miracle on ice, you know you got when Ali went against

00:00:52.620 Foreman, they said there's no way in the world he can go against that punch, but yours was

00:00:57.560 a different story, you know, you were kind of quiet, you were vocal when you wanted to,

00:01:02.300 and like, you know, all these other events that took place which we'll talk about here

00:01:05.620 today that led up to the fight, but before we get into the story, you know, what are you

00:01:10.640 up to nowadays, what are you doing nowadays?

00:01:12.020 Well right now I'm just, I'm back at ground zero, where I started at in the boxing, you know,

00:01:18.480 amateur program in Columbus, Ohio, which the city runs, and I'm part of that now, and having

00:01:23.860 a great time working with the kids, it's like doing it all over again, but now I'm my father

00:01:28.480 who was the coach when I was a kid, now I'm the coach, and working with these young youth

00:01:32.960 who are coming up in Columbus.

00:01:34.840 Let me ask you, do you love the game?

00:01:36.760 Like, you know, some people kind of, because I know your father was also a boxer and you

00:01:40.200 kind of are a boxer, but do you love the game of boxing?

00:01:42.600 I love the game, I have a strong feeling for it, you know, you know, I really enjoy

00:01:50.080 the competitiveness of it, you know, the one-on-one, you know, so.

00:01:56.480 So are you more a one-on-one sport guy, or you also like the group sport?

00:01:58.960 Well, I like the group sports as well, but what driven me back to boxing was the competitiveness,

00:02:04.940 because, you know, I was playing ball in college, and, you know, sometimes something like two

00:02:09.900 or three of the guys wouldn't show up because of something they were going through, and you

00:02:13.760 would need them, and, you know, they wouldn't be there for you.

00:02:16.400 So that kind of drove me back to boxing, and that's why I came back to it as a pro, you

00:02:23.060 know, in 70, or in 81.

00:02:25.820 So, before we go into the whole leading up to you and Tyson, growing up, who was Buster

00:02:32.140 Douglas growing up?

00:02:32.980 If I was in school with James, who was James?

00:02:35.860 I was one of the basketball players, athletes, you know, in high school, and throughout my

00:02:42.600 adolescence as well.

00:02:45.060 You know, normal kid, you know.

00:02:47.340 Were you quiet?

00:02:49.260 Like, because there's parts of you that you talk smack, but it's like no one can get a

00:02:53.320 read on you.

00:02:53.840 Like, was this guy a smack talker?

00:02:55.400 Or if somebody ticked you off, you came out and said something?

00:02:58.700 Right.

00:02:59.060 I was sort of like in the middle.

00:03:01.360 You were in the middle.

00:03:02.100 Yeah, sort of.

00:03:02.800 So, Pete, you didn't have enemies?

00:03:03.740 You were kind of good with everybody?

00:03:05.700 Was that kind of you?

00:03:06.320 Yeah, culture.

00:03:07.260 You know, with everybody.

00:03:08.380 Got it.

00:03:08.920 Okay.

00:03:09.340 And how did you actually start picking up boxing?

00:03:12.480 Obviously.

00:03:13.240 Well, I started when I was 10 years old.

00:03:15.760 My father was a professional fighter.

00:03:17.660 He was the first National Golden Glove champion in Columbus, Ohio.

00:03:21.200 First ever?

00:03:21.940 First ever.

00:03:23.020 You know, that was like in 60, 66.

00:03:27.460 He won the National Golden Gloves in Chicago.

00:03:29.400 That's when it was a big tournament in Chicago.

00:03:32.620 And they took a team from Columbus.

00:03:34.080 Went to the Terrors Recreation Center.

00:03:36.040 Took a team to Columbus.

00:03:37.560 I mean, to Chicago.

00:03:39.280 And he was one of the winners who came back as a national champion.

00:03:42.920 And then he turned pro and had a pretty successful pro career.

00:03:47.540 Fought some of the top fighters in the world.

00:03:49.760 Then he got overlooked a lot of times because they didn't want to take a chance on him.

00:03:53.100 You know, they were like maneuvering their fighters to the title fight.

00:03:56.760 And they wouldn't take my father on him because he was too big of a risk.

00:04:00.780 So that's just the way they do it in the game, you know.

00:04:03.820 They just picked fighters that they felt really strongly that they could beat.

00:04:07.760 And then moved around my father a lot.

00:04:10.700 Was he like a real-life Rocky type of guy?

00:04:13.140 You kind of didn't want to fight him because he took heads off.

00:04:16.340 I mean, you see some of the highlights.

00:04:17.620 It just makes no sense.

00:04:18.940 And he was in great shape.

00:04:20.120 He was always in great shape.

00:04:21.380 And got you late.

00:04:22.940 He got a lot of late-round knockouts.

00:04:24.740 You know, the 8th, 9th, 10th round.

00:04:26.760 Yeah, he was sustained power.

00:04:29.360 And he was 160 pounds, 6 foot.

00:04:31.760 You know, middleweight.

00:04:32.680 He fought middleweight and light heavyweight, 75.

00:04:35.460 166 foot.

00:04:37.200 Was he a disciplinarian growing up?

00:04:39.200 Definitely.

00:04:39.760 He was very disciplined.

00:04:41.460 But was he tough on you guys?

00:04:42.640 Because I know you and your brother.

00:04:43.680 Was he tough on you?

00:04:44.740 Or did he kind of let you...

00:04:45.600 Not so much tough on us because he's seen your ability, your talent.

00:04:49.480 But he didn't really push you.

00:04:51.840 You know, he let it come to you.

00:04:53.740 You know, he always felt that I had the ability to be a good pro fighter, amateur fighter.

00:04:59.400 But, you know, he let me do it at my will.

00:05:02.600 And he really never pushed me, you know.

00:05:04.600 Would he push you guys?

00:05:05.420 Like, was there ever a moment in your...

00:05:07.200 I know the story about getting bullied.

00:05:08.740 But was there ever a moment where you kind of like, you know,

00:05:11.260 Dad, I'm getting bullied in school.

00:05:12.500 And he told you to go back and fight.

00:05:13.760 Do you have a story of a bully?

00:05:14.740 No, yeah, it was a story like that, but it wasn't his involvement.

00:05:18.160 It was my mother.

00:05:19.440 She was the one that made me go out and fight the bully.

00:05:22.320 You know, she slammed me on the ground and told me that if you didn't fight him,

00:05:25.540 I was going to have to fight her.

00:05:27.140 She literally did that.

00:05:28.180 Oh, yeah.

00:05:28.800 I came in the house sniffling, crying.

00:05:31.380 And, you know, she seen this because the school's right down the street.

00:05:34.080 We were on the same side, the same street as the school.

00:05:37.280 And I crossed the main intersection and was walking down the street.

00:05:41.080 And there was a group of kids behind me, and I was crying.

00:05:44.900 And, you know, when I came in and she seen it, the witness is on the doorway.

00:05:50.560 When I walked in, she grabbed me and slung me on the floor and, you know,

00:05:54.100 told me if I didn't go out there and fight that boy that I was going to have to fight her.

00:05:58.100 So it was like...

00:05:58.840 Did you leave the house or was it the next day that you fucking stayed?

00:06:01.080 The next day.

00:06:02.400 It happened over again, and I just stood up, dropped my books and said,

00:06:05.820 that's it, let's go.

00:06:07.240 And you went at it with them?

00:06:08.360 And I went at it with them, and that was history.

00:06:10.220 So was that the beginning?

00:06:12.500 That was the beginning.

00:06:13.240 It's crazy.

00:06:14.020 Yeah, because all of a sudden now, moms was bringing their kids over like,

00:06:17.320 your son, what did your son do to my kid?

00:06:19.960 You know, and then she had to tell me I just couldn't smack them

00:06:22.080 just because they said something to me.

00:06:24.280 Had to slow me down, you know.

00:06:26.720 Lula, right?

00:06:27.480 Lula Pearl Douglas.

00:06:28.560 Yeah, Lula Pearl.

00:06:29.140 Yeah, you watch her, the way she looks at you, man.

00:06:32.200 It was like when there's, you know, some scenes of how your mom actually looks at you.

00:06:35.960 You can tell like this woman loves this guy.

00:06:39.820 Right, she loved her boys.

00:06:40.440 I mean, obviously mothers love their sons, but the way she would talk about you,

00:06:43.760 the way she looked at you was a whole different story.

00:06:45.780 And so mom taught you toughness.

00:06:49.200 Did the technical side come from pops?

00:06:51.580 Oh, definitely.

00:06:53.120 You know, hold your hands up, moving, and the mental state as well.

00:06:56.680 The mental state.

00:06:57.240 Well, they both had a lot to do with that,

00:06:58.420 but he was the one that really put it into the ring aspect, you know, so.

00:07:03.060 Would you go and watch him fight?

00:07:04.260 Were you somebody, were you always there?

00:07:05.420 Yeah, I went to see him fight when he, later in his career,

00:07:08.200 when we went, I went to Philadelphia with him when he fought Matthew Franklin,

00:07:11.780 who became Matthew Sa Muhammad, world light heavyweight champion.

00:07:16.320 And I was at that fight when he fought at the Spectrum.

00:07:18.800 And I also went to the fight when he fought Tom LaBomba there in New York,

00:07:22.980 in the Garden, main event.

00:07:25.280 You know, he was a main event fighter, man.

00:07:27.020 And he always fought on the road.

00:07:29.600 And he always went to the backyard of the other fighters.

00:07:31.620 He didn't care.

00:07:32.420 What do you mean he always went to the backyard?

00:07:33.820 Well, you know, he went to their turf.

00:07:35.760 Oh, to them.

00:07:36.220 He went to them too.

00:07:36.700 You know, it wasn't like neutral zone.

00:07:40.200 It was like he didn't matter.

00:07:41.140 He'd go right in your backyard and fight you.

00:07:43.100 Let me ask you, was Bill, your grandfather, was,

00:07:45.860 is there a lineage of boxing?

00:07:47.280 Or no, he's the first one that picked it up?

00:07:48.440 I think my grandfather fought in the Navy.

00:07:51.560 You know, he fought as an amateur in the Navy,

00:07:53.580 and that's where my father picked it up from.

00:07:55.280 And then I just picked it up from my dad, so.

00:07:59.000 So it's almost like he was, obviously, living through you,

00:08:03.400 seeing what you were doing, you know, what you ended up doing.

00:08:05.440 Right, oh, definitely.

00:08:06.040 Because he turned me pro.

00:08:07.680 You know, I think I had my first 20 or so fights

00:08:11.020 was with my dad as a pro.

00:08:12.980 And then, after that, I got involved with John Johnson.

00:08:16.800 And that's where we just really took off

00:08:18.440 and started to make big waves.

00:08:22.060 And John Johnson, by the way, John Johnson,

00:08:23.640 he's got a personality of his own.

00:08:25.160 Is he always like that?

00:08:26.300 Is he always flamboyant, loud, like, you know, always cursing?

00:08:30.080 I mean, you watch him, you're like,

00:08:31.260 he needs a reality TV show himself

00:08:33.340 because he's so interesting just listening to him.

00:08:35.260 But let me ask you, James,

00:08:37.420 would you say you were a classic story

00:08:39.640 of a guy who had abilities,

00:08:42.400 but he needed somebody that got the best out of him

00:08:45.860 and he was able to do it with you?

00:08:47.240 Is that what it was with you?

00:08:48.640 Because it's almost like when you follow your career,

00:08:52.100 here's a guy that could be at the top and beat anybody.

00:08:56.620 Right.

00:08:57.140 You.

00:08:57.740 You could beat anybody.

00:08:59.020 Obviously, you ended up beating the guy that everybody feared.

00:09:02.040 You didn't just beat anybody.

00:09:03.320 You beat the guy ever.

00:09:05.380 Well, I beat some guys leading up to that, too.

00:09:07.400 Now, I wasn't just giving to them.

00:09:08.600 No, you were not.

00:09:09.340 There's a list of guys you went through.

00:09:10.620 I had to get into the top 10

00:09:12.080 and, you know, I fought some top competitors

00:09:14.260 because we were all in line to get a shot at the title.

00:09:17.180 Yeah.

00:09:17.520 So you had to beat one another

00:09:18.660 and then come out on top

00:09:19.860 to see who was going to become

00:09:20.920 the number one, number two contender.

00:09:23.140 I think you were ranked fourth when you fought Tyson.

00:09:25.280 Number two.

00:09:25.900 Oh, you were two when you fought Tyson.

00:09:26.860 I was fourth in one.

00:09:28.000 It was like three bodies,

00:09:29.660 three sanctioning bodies.

00:09:30.860 Got it.

00:09:31.200 I was two, three, and four.

00:09:33.400 Got it.

00:09:33.800 So you were the guy that everybody was.

00:09:35.660 Oh, man, it was like, you know,

00:09:36.440 I deserved a shot

00:09:37.280 because it wasn't like I was walking down the street

00:09:39.640 and I always say this.

00:09:41.180 Don King was driving down the avenue

00:09:42.680 and see me.

00:09:43.220 Hey, big guy, you want to fight for the title of the night?

00:09:45.260 I earned that shot.

00:09:46.560 Well, Don King was also not a big supporter of you.

00:09:50.320 He was, but he wasn't.

00:09:51.340 It would almost seem like he was a critic.

00:09:53.180 No, I was just a body for him.

00:09:53.760 He was just, yeah, that's what it sounded like.

00:09:55.340 By that time, Tyson was well proven

00:09:57.640 that he was legitimate.

00:09:58.580 And so I was just a sacrificial lamb, basically.

00:10:02.040 But you messed him up.

00:10:04.160 Like, you publicly.

00:10:05.400 Right, I kind of messed the plan up.

00:10:06.360 Yes, you did.

00:10:07.200 You messed the plan up

00:10:08.160 because that could have been a moneymaker

00:10:09.600 for many, many years to come.

00:10:11.360 Oh, yeah.

00:10:11.740 Oh, yeah, for sure.

00:10:12.120 You know, it's almost like you took his confidence away

00:10:14.640 because his invincibility left.

00:10:16.960 Because, you know, it's a different story.

00:10:19.180 When you have a guy comes up, you know,

00:10:21.700 I think Ali lost six fights.

00:10:23.500 I want to say he ended up being like 50-something and six.

00:10:26.400 So he had a few fights he lost.

00:10:28.200 Foreman lost.

00:10:29.100 Holyfield lost.

00:10:30.500 You know, a lot of these guys lost.

00:10:32.020 But the way Tyson was coming up, it was invincible.

00:10:35.480 It's like perfection.

00:10:36.740 Yeah, you didn't foresee anybody in the very near future

00:10:38.680 to beat him.

00:10:39.180 No way.

00:10:40.540 So, and that puts a kind of pressure of perfection

00:10:43.760 where, you know, when a person that sees everybody's telling

00:10:47.380 him he's perfect, when he loses,

00:10:49.260 how do you believe the people that are telling you

00:10:50.860 you're still perfect?

00:10:52.100 I'm not perfect.

00:10:52.840 I lost.

00:10:53.520 So Mayweather, yes, he has an undefeated career

00:10:55.920 and he talks about I'm the only guy that's beat Rocky Marcy

00:10:58.600 and whatever, the record that he owns for being undefeated.

00:11:00.780 Right.

00:11:01.300 But it's a different story of what you did with Tyson.

00:11:03.460 But the question I wanted to ask is,

00:11:05.500 how much of a role was it you finding somebody

00:11:08.560 that got the best out of you?

00:11:10.580 Well, getting with John was a big part of that

00:11:13.220 because, you know, I think we kind of connected,

00:11:16.420 you know, we believed in, I believed in him

00:11:18.760 and he believed in me and I seen that he was definitely

00:11:21.860 out to be a winner.

00:11:23.960 And he brought that spirit to the partnership,

00:11:27.300 you know, because he was a Woody Hayes guy

00:11:29.440 and, you know, he wasn't having it, you know,

00:11:32.220 either you're going to do this right

00:11:33.460 or we're not going to do it at all.

00:11:34.720 How did he talk to you one-on-one?

00:11:36.200 How, how, what was his language like with you?

00:11:38.260 For the most part, it was, you know, straight up,

00:11:40.740 you know, just conversation,

00:11:42.100 but you've seen the sincerity in his eyes and his voice.

00:11:45.800 But sometimes he could get real nasty and mean,

00:11:48.640 but it was very few times he did that,

00:11:50.360 but he did.

00:11:50.960 When he knew he did that, he was at his end.

00:11:53.040 How nasty?

00:11:53.740 Like, he gets pretty retarded, you know.

00:11:56.000 Like, okay, got it.

00:11:58.160 So no limit.

00:11:59.160 You know, throwing stuff and, you know.

00:12:01.380 In front of you.

00:12:02.120 Right, you know.

00:12:02.880 And he was upset.

00:12:04.260 Did you react to that?

00:12:05.240 Did that kind of make it?

00:12:06.100 No, I knew that it was legitimate,

00:12:07.700 that he really meant what he's saying.

00:12:09.300 He was expressing how sincere he was

00:12:12.640 and that, you know, that he wasn't,

00:12:14.380 he was just tired of the BS at times, you know.

00:12:18.180 So.

00:12:19.060 A lot of it wasn't directed at me.

00:12:20.980 It was just some of the things

00:12:22.240 that we had to go through to get to that point,

00:12:24.580 you know, because of the negotiations,

00:12:26.200 for example, between him and the promoter.

00:12:28.160 But was he ever like, you know,

00:12:29.840 you look at coaches and players, right?

00:12:33.120 You look at Tyson,

00:12:34.160 the relationship he had with Cus, you know.

00:12:36.180 You look at all these guys,

00:12:37.720 the relationship they have with somebody that comes in

00:12:40.060 that just knows how to get through them, right?

00:12:42.320 Right.

00:12:42.580 Would you say that was the case with him?

00:12:44.480 That was it.

00:12:44.720 That was John, yeah.

00:12:45.800 And what was the entrance to you?

00:12:47.720 Was it through your heart?

00:12:48.820 Was it through here?

00:12:49.680 Was it through belief?

00:12:50.700 Was it through.

00:12:51.300 Well, it was through my heart

00:12:52.260 and as well as my mind, you know.

00:12:53.880 It was like I'd seen the sincerity.

00:12:56.000 I felt he really meant it

00:12:56.980 and he believed in me, you know.

00:12:58.260 And then the things that I've noticed

00:12:59.740 that he had to go through

00:13:00.840 to get certain things for me

00:13:02.780 that when nobody believed in me,

00:13:05.800 you know, I'd seen the sincerity in it.

00:13:07.640 It was just that, you know,

00:13:09.160 you've seen the desire and the will

00:13:10.760 and sometimes it wouldn't work out

00:13:13.020 and he would be upset.

00:13:14.560 Was it negative motivation

00:13:15.980 or positive motivation?

00:13:16.840 Both.

00:13:18.320 For the most part, it was positive.

00:13:20.460 But what I'm saying is like,

00:13:21.300 hey, I don't think you really want it.

00:13:22.720 You know, I don't think this,

00:13:23.900 do you really want to be the champ?

00:13:25.420 Like, was it like that or?

00:13:26.700 Yeah, he did that.

00:13:27.660 That made me laugh

00:13:28.500 because that was kind of, you know, humorous.

00:13:30.240 So that doesn't do nothing to you?

00:13:31.400 Right, but, you know,

00:13:33.440 on the other hand,

00:13:34.600 it was just, you know,

00:13:36.100 where he would just be talking

00:13:37.680 and, you know,

00:13:39.080 I would see that it was just genuine.

00:13:40.820 But, you know,

00:13:42.460 he would kick up a fuss.

00:13:44.840 He'd kick up a fuss.

00:13:45.860 Yeah, he would.

00:13:47.060 Interesting.

00:13:47.820 So who was on your team?

00:13:49.160 Because I know it was him,

00:13:50.560 it was your uncle,

00:13:52.080 the assistant.

00:13:52.940 Who was your team?

00:13:54.260 It was John Johnson,

00:13:56.420 JD McCauley,

00:13:57.160 and John Russell.

00:13:58.440 What role did each play with you?

00:14:00.500 John Johnson was the manager

00:14:02.320 and JD and John Russell

00:14:05.300 were the trainers.

00:14:06.780 Really, John Russell

00:14:07.900 was like the trainer, trainer.

00:14:10.180 JD was my,

00:14:11.580 he got me up every morning to run

00:14:13.880 and he would talk to me spiritually

00:14:16.480 in the morning

00:14:17.860 and throughout my career

00:14:20.160 once we got together

00:14:21.800 about he knew that

00:14:23.160 he wouldn't be doing this

00:14:24.220 if he didn't believe in me

00:14:25.620 or knew that I could do it.

00:14:27.360 I knew you got the ability

00:14:28.440 to do this,

00:14:29.040 but you just got to maintain

00:14:30.580 your focus

00:14:31.320 and put the effort in

00:14:33.020 and it's going to happen for you.

00:14:35.040 Because I mean,

00:14:35.620 we'd get up at 5.30 in the morning

00:14:37.440 and run

00:14:39.400 and then in the mornings

00:14:41.500 his wife would be there,

00:14:42.540 our Betty would be there

00:14:43.460 driving the car,

00:14:44.820 having the lights on us

00:14:45.840 while we were running

00:14:46.760 down the street.

00:14:47.860 Wow.

00:14:48.640 So it was a task,

00:14:50.420 but we did it, man.

00:14:51.500 And I'm telling you,

00:14:52.320 it was in the wintertime

00:14:54.200 when the snow was,

00:14:55.500 everybody else was told

00:14:56.360 to stay in the house

00:14:57.240 because the weather's severe,

00:14:59.420 below zero weather

00:15:00.460 we'd be out there running.

00:15:01.840 Oh, I seen you running

00:15:02.700 with snow on your face.

00:15:03.600 Yeah, and that was like

00:15:04.580 the best, the best time.

00:15:06.320 Some of my best times

00:15:07.420 and best moments

00:15:08.200 on the run too.

00:15:09.620 So one was how-to,

00:15:11.960 your trainer,

00:15:13.020 one was business,

00:15:14.420 one was spiritual.

00:15:15.340 Is that a good way

00:15:15.920 of putting it?

00:15:16.380 Yeah, that was it.

00:15:17.140 That was it.

00:15:17.860 Yeah, we all worked together.

00:15:20.000 We all worked together.

00:15:20.780 Did they all each individually

00:15:22.720 know how to work together?

00:15:25.700 Yeah, they respected

00:15:26.880 each other's areas,

00:15:28.320 you know, grounds,

00:15:29.180 you know.

00:15:29.660 They would let one talk

00:15:30.980 at the time

00:15:31.400 when everybody

00:15:31.900 all mumble together,

00:15:33.380 jumbled together.

00:15:34.180 It was just,

00:15:35.460 you know,

00:15:35.700 they were out of mutual respect

00:15:37.020 for one another.

00:15:37.980 It was the idea like,

00:15:39.080 hey guys,

00:15:39.600 let's work together

00:15:40.380 to be able to move

00:15:41.100 this guy into a beat.

00:15:41.540 Right, and that was just

00:15:42.260 something that really

00:15:43.000 just gradually happened.

00:15:44.960 We all came together

00:15:45.760 for one main effort

00:15:46.880 and it was me.

00:15:47.660 And that made me feel

00:15:48.660 even better because-

00:15:49.680 I bet.

00:15:50.200 I knew the main goal was,

00:15:51.760 you know,

00:15:51.980 everybody was there for me.

00:15:53.160 It wasn't each other

00:15:55.440 but it was all-

00:15:56.780 Let me ask you,

00:15:57.560 something that JD did

00:15:58.640 and just out of curiosity

00:16:01.480 for myself,

00:16:02.100 I watched some of these guys

00:16:03.060 because at that time

00:16:04.360 when you were doing fights,

00:16:05.320 how much were you getting paid

00:16:06.320 per fight that you had?

00:16:07.440 Pre-pre-Holyfield,

00:16:08.740 pre-Tyson.

00:16:09.800 Well, it was like

00:16:10.680 a few hundred dollars

00:16:11.760 and $1,500,

00:16:13.020 $2,500.

00:16:13.900 So how much are they,

00:16:14.780 how much is JD making?

00:16:15.760 How much are these guys making?

00:16:16.680 Well, JD wasn't even

00:16:17.960 taking any of the money.

00:16:18.880 He said,

00:16:19.060 I'm just going to get it

00:16:19.760 at the end.

00:16:20.320 That's unbelievable.

00:16:21.400 Yeah, yeah.

00:16:22.260 He's just going to take it

00:16:23.580 at the end

00:16:24.040 when you become a champ.

00:16:25.540 Yeah, when you become a champ.

00:16:27.520 Is that a verbal agreement

00:16:28.900 or was it on paper?

00:16:29.640 Yeah, it was all verbal.

00:16:31.160 It was all verbal.

00:16:31.600 So these guys really believed in you.

00:16:33.040 Yeah.

00:16:33.140 Like they're 100%

00:16:34.040 James Foster Douglas.

00:16:35.920 Trusted me.

00:16:36.660 Did you ever,

00:16:37.420 because when you have a father

00:16:38.240 with that kind of a,

00:16:39.080 you know,

00:16:39.680 a presence,

00:16:40.500 that kind of a toughness himself,

00:16:42.140 did he ever push you around?

00:16:43.600 Like did you guys

00:16:44.180 ever have an altercation?

00:16:45.320 Was there ever a moment

00:16:46.120 where, you know,

00:16:47.740 you pushed it a little too far

00:16:49.080 and you got in your face

00:16:49.880 and you guys went at it?

00:16:50.660 Was there ever a relationship

00:16:51.720 like that?

00:16:52.180 I was never like that.

00:16:52.860 You know, for one,

00:16:53.560 it's just that,

00:16:54.360 you know,

00:16:54.560 I wouldn't do that to my dad,

00:16:56.000 you know,

00:16:56.240 because one,

00:16:56.980 it was Bill Douglas.

00:16:58.400 Then two,

00:16:59.120 it was my father.

00:17:00.680 You know,

00:17:01.040 it was just,

00:17:01.800 he was just that type of guy.

00:17:04.540 Did your mom play a big role in?

00:17:06.600 My mom played a wonderful role

00:17:08.200 in it because

00:17:08.840 she was the one

00:17:10.300 that made everybody else

00:17:11.660 shut up and listen.

00:17:13.960 She was the main.

00:17:14.760 And when it got too ridiculous,

00:17:16.220 if it ever did,

00:17:17.420 I would talk to her

00:17:18.340 and she would just,

00:17:19.580 like between me and my dad,

00:17:21.540 where it would be like,

00:17:22.360 I can't get through to him,

00:17:23.400 he's not listening.

00:17:24.620 I would be mom

00:17:25.540 and then she would come in.

00:17:27.220 Wow.

00:17:27.980 You know,

00:17:28.200 we would sit at the kitchen table,

00:17:29.720 me,

00:17:29.920 her,

00:17:30.080 and my father.

00:17:31.460 Even when I decided

00:17:32.400 to leave my dad

00:17:33.460 and go with John,

00:17:34.280 I had to bring her in

00:17:35.320 to talk.

00:17:36.700 You know,

00:17:37.000 she was like,

00:17:37.980 he was at one end,

00:17:38.940 I was at the other end

00:17:39.640 of the table

00:17:40.040 and she was in the middle.

00:17:41.300 She didn't say anything

00:17:42.080 but she was there,

00:17:42.940 her presence.

00:17:44.160 You know,

00:17:44.440 so that made me comfortable

00:17:45.560 where I knew

00:17:46.320 he wasn't going to

00:17:47.000 go off

00:17:48.120 in a way that I thought

00:17:50.400 maybe it could happen.

00:17:52.000 But,

00:17:52.440 you know,

00:17:52.740 everything worked out great.

00:17:54.280 And obviously,

00:17:55.320 in this case,

00:17:55.980 for her to be that effective,

00:17:57.180 your dad had a lot of respect

00:17:58.440 for your mom.

00:17:59.160 Oh,

00:17:59.400 most definitely.

00:18:00.460 Was it love?

00:18:01.280 Was it pure love?

00:18:01.980 Did you feel the love?

00:18:02.800 Yeah, pure love.

00:18:02.960 He loved her.

00:18:03.560 He loved her with no doubt.

00:18:05.120 Yeah,

00:18:05.320 that's obvious

00:18:05.800 because he could have easily

00:18:08.600 been an aggressive

00:18:10.320 cross-on-the-line type of guy

00:18:11.880 because a lot of times

00:18:12.640 boxers have that kind

00:18:13.580 of a reputation

00:18:14.100 for the fact that...

00:18:14.860 He was known for that.

00:18:15.200 He was known for that,

00:18:16.200 see,

00:18:16.460 because he would,

00:18:17.740 you know,

00:18:18.000 he had a strong personality.

00:18:20.420 Did he have a temper

00:18:21.100 as well or not a temper?

00:18:22.000 Yeah,

00:18:22.200 he had it all,

00:18:22.960 man.

00:18:23.200 He was a killer,

00:18:24.160 man.

00:18:24.860 Except with you guys

00:18:25.860 in the family.

00:18:26.600 Yeah,

00:18:27.080 you know,

00:18:27.520 that's what it was.

00:18:28.420 It was so nice

00:18:29.200 because he was silly

00:18:30.400 with us growing up.

00:18:32.160 He was a comedian,

00:18:33.680 you know,

00:18:34.000 but once he walked

00:18:34.660 out that door,

00:18:35.400 it was like he transformed.

00:18:37.220 You know,

00:18:37.440 nobody never got to see

00:18:38.440 that side of my father.

00:18:39.320 Did you ever see him

00:18:39.980 get into a street fight

00:18:40.720 or no?

00:18:41.060 No,

00:18:41.300 he never got into

00:18:42.020 a street fight.

00:18:42.620 Was he that known

00:18:43.520 where people knew,

00:18:44.200 listen,

00:18:44.420 I'm just not going to

00:18:44.960 cross the line with this.

00:18:45.660 I'm not touching this guy.

00:18:46.620 He's going to kill me.

00:18:47.280 Yeah,

00:18:47.560 his boys all know him,

00:18:48.660 Dynamite.

00:18:49.560 And then the one

00:18:50.120 that really knew him

00:18:50.820 called him Grassman.

00:18:52.540 See,

00:18:52.780 that goes back to high school

00:18:53.920 when he ran track.

00:18:55.440 He ate before a track meeting

00:18:57.200 and was running

00:18:58.660 and got sick

00:18:59.400 and went out in the field,

00:19:00.940 the football field

00:19:01.800 and, you know,

00:19:02.900 and started throwing up.

00:19:04.060 And that's where

00:19:04.680 he got the nickname

00:19:05.880 Grassman.

00:19:06.620 Wow.

00:19:07.260 Unbelievable.

00:19:07.600 Was your dad

00:19:08.880 a man of faith

00:19:09.440 or was he more

00:19:10.280 just a disciplined,

00:19:12.300 military,

00:19:13.060 like, you know,

00:19:13.640 extremely hardworking guy?

00:19:15.620 Was he...

00:19:15.980 Extremely hardworking guy.

00:19:17.060 Hardworking guy.

00:19:17.880 Got it.

00:19:18.460 Got it.

00:19:18.980 So you transitioned

00:19:20.240 to the story

00:19:20.780 about you going home

00:19:21.560 and sitting down

00:19:22.220 with your mom

00:19:22.740 and your dad.

00:19:24.040 That's post-Tucker fight,

00:19:25.620 right?

00:19:25.800 I think it's right after...

00:19:26.880 Right.

00:19:27.140 Well,

00:19:27.260 that was when Johnny

00:19:29.260 and I had just gotten together

00:19:30.600 and we were just

00:19:32.040 making our plans

00:19:32.940 and doing what we were doing

00:19:34.160 and, you know,

00:19:35.460 transitioning

00:19:36.100 and becoming a team

00:19:37.580 and, you know,

00:19:38.920 my dad was,

00:19:39.620 you know,

00:19:40.760 calling him,

00:19:41.460 telling him that,

00:19:42.140 you know,

00:19:42.800 messing with one man's family

00:19:44.040 is not good

00:19:44.800 and then John immediately

00:19:46.400 wanted to shut it down

00:19:47.580 where it wasn't even

00:19:48.280 going to go

00:19:49.200 because he was afraid

00:19:50.220 of my father

00:19:50.800 because,

00:19:52.000 you know,

00:19:52.280 he felt...

00:19:52.500 What do you mean

00:19:52.820 messing with one man's family?

00:19:53.940 I don't understand.

00:19:54.260 Well,

00:19:54.520 it was like,

00:19:55.200 because that's when

00:19:55.840 I told my dad

00:19:56.540 that I was going to start

00:19:57.400 working with John.

00:19:58.660 Is this pre-Tucker

00:19:59.640 or post-Tucker?

00:20:00.560 This is pre-Tucker.

00:20:01.440 Pre-Tucker.

00:20:01.820 This is in the beginning

00:20:03.020 when John and I got together,

00:20:05.360 you know,

00:20:06.060 after probably,

00:20:06.840 what,

00:20:07.020 84?

00:20:08.440 And when we were

00:20:09.500 just getting together,

00:20:10.440 I told my dad

00:20:11.240 that I was going to

00:20:11.960 go another direction,

00:20:13.420 that I would no longer

00:20:14.220 need him to direct

00:20:15.520 my career.

00:20:16.240 I was going to let

00:20:16.980 John Johnson do it.

00:20:18.720 Was Tucker like,

00:20:19.840 at that time,

00:20:21.080 if you had to pick

00:20:22.020 a name,

00:20:22.560 so,

00:20:23.020 you know,

00:20:23.220 some folks watching this,

00:20:24.460 they don't know

00:20:24.780 who Tucker was at the time.

00:20:26.040 Who was Tucker

00:20:26.800 when you went against him?

00:20:28.360 He was the number one

00:20:29.220 contender

00:20:29.680 in the heavyweight division

00:20:31.060 in the IBF.

00:20:32.340 And at that time,

00:20:33.140 I was the number two

00:20:33.960 heavyweight contender.

00:20:35.460 Larry Holmes was supposed

00:20:36.740 to fight somebody

00:20:37.740 and didn't want to fight him

00:20:38.740 and then they stripped him

00:20:39.700 of that IBF belt.

00:20:41.220 So they had the number one,

00:20:42.320 number two contender

00:20:43.040 fight for the title.

00:20:44.080 Got it.

00:20:44.520 And that was Tucker and I.

00:20:46.700 And you had him.

00:20:48.320 Yeah, I was winning.

00:20:49.080 I was doing really well

00:20:50.080 in the fight.

00:20:51.120 But see,

00:20:51.540 that was,

00:20:52.140 my dad was involved

00:20:53.120 at that time

00:20:53.900 and it was a pretty

00:20:55.140 tough training experience

00:20:56.400 because he would come

00:20:57.900 to the gym

00:20:58.440 and wouldn't allow

00:20:59.000 nobody to say anything

00:21:00.160 but he was like

00:21:01.860 chief trainer

00:21:03.260 and, you know,

00:21:04.420 he'd say something

00:21:05.160 and then like

00:21:05.840 JD would say something

00:21:06.760 and then his dad would say,

00:21:08.100 well, you be quiet

00:21:08.960 and then they'd be like

00:21:10.640 arguing with each other.

00:21:12.120 So that was a tough

00:21:12.800 training experience,

00:21:13.920 you know,

00:21:14.180 that was,

00:21:14.960 wasn't a comfortable.

00:21:16.240 How much of it was,

00:21:17.600 I know he went into the fight

00:21:18.720 wearing his shirt name,

00:21:20.360 you know,

00:21:20.600 there's a scene

00:21:21.580 with him wearing

00:21:22.160 Bill Douglas shirt,

00:21:23.320 right?

00:21:23.620 Right,

00:21:23.780 everybody else had

00:21:24.440 James Douglas.

00:21:25.000 Yeah,

00:21:25.260 everybody had Bill Douglas.

00:21:26.080 How much of that was

00:21:27.360 for you

00:21:28.160 to kind of be like,

00:21:30.140 listen,

00:21:30.540 you know,

00:21:31.180 you know.

00:21:31.500 See,

00:21:31.720 I understood that.

00:21:32.960 That didn't bother you

00:21:33.820 at all?

00:21:33.920 No,

00:21:34.060 that didn't bother me

00:21:34.800 at all.

00:21:35.160 That was just my dad.

00:21:36.480 You knew him already.

00:21:37.480 Right,

00:21:37.860 yeah,

00:21:38.200 I was aware of that

00:21:38.980 but everybody else

00:21:39.800 was like,

00:21:40.180 whoa,

00:21:40.560 you know,

00:21:41.380 and I didn't really

00:21:42.180 come out until

00:21:42.740 after their fight.

00:21:44.080 So,

00:21:45.000 you know,

00:21:45.500 but that was just my dad.

00:21:47.520 That was just him.

00:21:48.400 So that didn't bother you

00:21:49.360 at all?

00:21:49.780 No,

00:21:49.860 that didn't bother me.

00:21:50.500 The only thing that bothered

00:21:51.240 me about the situation

00:21:52.260 was that he wouldn't get along,

00:21:53.660 he wouldn't conform

00:21:54.860 and relax and let people

00:21:55.980 be themselves.

00:21:57.500 You know,

00:21:57.720 he had a real tense.

00:21:59.300 Everybody was scared

00:22:00.080 to say anything

00:22:00.720 because they thought

00:22:01.420 they would get popped

00:22:02.180 or something,

00:22:02.740 you know.

00:22:04.100 Yeah,

00:22:04.640 because his presence

00:22:05.360 was that strong.

00:22:06.840 So when you had

00:22:07.520 the conversation

00:22:08.200 with Pops,

00:22:09.260 okay,

00:22:10.000 you beat Tucker,

00:22:12.260 you're going to go face off

00:22:13.420 and, you know,

00:22:13.800 champion the whole night,

00:22:14.980 right?

00:22:15.160 So you're right there

00:22:16.200 but then this happens,

00:22:17.960 I think 10th round

00:22:18.840 or whatever happens,

00:22:19.720 you lose the fight

00:22:21.100 and then post,

00:22:22.580 you go have the conversation

00:22:23.500 with your mom

00:22:24.180 and your dad

00:22:24.760 you have to sit down

00:22:25.760 and then immediately

00:22:27.720 what happened after that?

00:22:29.720 I had to go back

00:22:30.380 to the drawing board

00:22:31.680 and start over again

00:22:32.860 because at that time,

00:22:34.320 that's one of the times

00:22:35.240 Don was really backing me,

00:22:36.860 was pushing me

00:22:38.000 to win this fight.

00:22:39.960 You know,

00:22:40.200 then I ended up

00:22:40.900 coming up short

00:22:41.640 and then,

00:22:42.280 you know,

00:22:42.660 it was kind of like

00:22:43.700 threw me to the wayside.

00:22:46.440 You know,

00:22:46.780 I was just a pawn now.

00:22:48.640 But your trainers

00:22:49.240 were still loyal to you?

00:22:50.140 Oh yeah,

00:22:50.600 they were loyal.

00:22:51.300 They knew that I had

00:22:52.080 the ability to do it

00:22:53.280 and that it was just

00:22:54.540 had to be,

00:22:55.240 everything had to be right

00:22:56.260 which it has to be.

00:22:57.900 You know,

00:22:58.180 to go out there

00:22:58.840 and put it together

00:22:59.660 and do the things

00:23:00.640 to do to be champion

00:23:01.940 or win.

00:23:03.120 Post Tucker,

00:23:03.900 you go on a win streak.

00:23:05.080 Right.

00:23:05.520 A legitimate win streak.

00:23:06.740 Six fight win streak.

00:23:08.060 Yeah,

00:23:08.380 six fight.

00:23:08.840 And so,

00:23:09.620 who was the sixth fight

00:23:11.060 right before Tyson?

00:23:12.660 Oliver McCall.

00:23:14.200 So you go through all...

00:23:15.020 It was between

00:23:15.240 Oliver McCall

00:23:16.000 and Mike Williams

00:23:17.220 because they both

00:23:18.860 were top contenders

00:23:19.740 and I had to fight

00:23:20.380 both of them.

00:23:21.200 You went through

00:23:21.740 both of them?

00:23:22.260 I went through

00:23:22.640 both of them.

00:23:23.340 How intense was your

00:23:24.240 training at this time?

00:23:25.320 It was great.

00:23:26.060 Everything was going along.

00:23:27.620 You know,

00:23:27.980 the training was good.

00:23:29.020 The day,

00:23:29.400 everybody mentally

00:23:30.220 was focused

00:23:31.720 and comfortable.

00:23:33.000 You know,

00:23:33.260 it was just a big...

00:23:34.440 Everybody was relaxed.

00:23:36.720 You know,

00:23:37.100 we just got busy.

00:23:38.980 We don't have

00:23:39.300 no distractions.

00:23:40.640 Are you making money

00:23:41.420 at this time?

00:23:42.100 Yeah.

00:23:42.640 So you are making money

00:23:43.460 at this time?

00:23:43.920 Oh, yeah.

00:23:44.460 So the fights are...

00:23:45.400 The bouts are...

00:23:46.000 How much are

00:23:46.720 the fights you're fighting?

00:23:48.320 Oh,

00:23:48.620 purses.

00:23:49.060 Purses.

00:23:49.380 What are the purses?

00:23:50.200 Oh,

00:23:50.340 $100,000.

00:23:51.000 Okay.

00:23:51.320 Yeah,

00:23:51.580 so it was good.

00:23:52.760 So there's some money

00:23:53.580 being made with the purses.

00:23:54.660 Right.

00:23:55.080 Okay.

00:23:55.800 Got it.

00:23:56.120 So now,

00:23:57.180 you get to a point.

00:23:58.540 You won the sixth straight.

00:23:59.700 McCall or whoever it is

00:24:00.900 that you went.

00:24:01.520 Mm-hmm.

00:24:02.100 Then,

00:24:02.660 how does this lead

00:24:03.840 to the fight with Tyson?

00:24:05.280 Who reaches out?

00:24:06.320 Does Don call you?

00:24:07.320 What happens there?

00:24:08.060 Well,

00:24:08.140 we were supposed to go to...

00:24:10.080 Leading up to the February fight,

00:24:11.740 we were going to go to

00:24:12.880 October,

00:24:15.140 Canada.

00:24:16.380 He was going...

00:24:16.880 Tyson was going to defend

00:24:17.700 his title against Razor Ruddy.

00:24:19.220 And we were training

00:24:20.260 because we were going to fight

00:24:21.180 on the undercard.

00:24:22.900 And that fight fell through.

00:24:25.740 So then they moved on

00:24:26.900 to the next...

00:24:27.840 Next...

00:24:28.840 They came back

00:24:29.580 probably a month later

00:24:30.520 and said,

00:24:30.980 well,

00:24:31.780 we're going to fight in February.

00:24:34.120 And then,

00:24:34.940 turns out that it was...

00:24:36.260 They were putting me in

00:24:37.120 with Tyson in February.

00:24:38.380 We were going to go to Tokyo

00:24:39.440 because the fight

00:24:41.000 with him and Ruddick

00:24:41.960 was going to be in Canada.

00:24:44.500 But like I said,

00:24:45.020 that fight fell through.

00:24:45.960 So then the next fight

00:24:46.860 was me fighting Tyson

00:24:49.400 in Tokyo.

00:24:50.900 So you get the call.

00:24:52.300 Is this like...

00:24:53.540 Right.

00:24:53.960 John gets the call,

00:24:55.340 comes to the gym

00:24:56.160 and says,

00:24:56.480 we're next.

00:24:57.020 We got our shot.

00:24:58.120 What was the reaction

00:24:58.820 when you heard that?

00:24:59.460 It was great.

00:25:00.180 It was like,

00:25:00.760 you know,

00:25:01.320 upbeat.

00:25:02.560 And everybody was happy

00:25:03.360 about it.

00:25:04.720 You know,

00:25:04.900 and then it was like,

00:25:05.600 Tokyo,

00:25:06.060 like Tokyo,

00:25:06.600 because nobody here

00:25:07.520 in the United States

00:25:08.260 didn't want to fight.

00:25:09.880 So we had to just

00:25:10.840 take it over to Tokyo.

00:25:12.700 James,

00:25:13.080 I've heard a lot

00:25:13.600 of different reasons

00:25:14.140 why they went to Tokyo.

00:25:15.100 What is your assertion

00:25:16.080 on why they went to Tokyo?

00:25:17.260 Well,

00:25:17.440 they didn't think

00:25:17.860 it was going to be a fight.

00:25:18.980 They thought it was going

00:25:19.500 to be a quick one.

00:25:20.500 They couldn't sell it.

00:25:22.380 It's a hard sell.

00:25:24.480 You know,

00:25:24.700 I was winning,

00:25:25.460 but I wasn't...

00:25:26.200 By that time,

00:25:26.920 Tyson had such a,

00:25:28.180 you know,

00:25:28.760 fanfare,

00:25:29.740 and he was just

00:25:30.660 taking guys out,

00:25:32.860 you know,

00:25:33.380 that legitimate,

00:25:34.580 you know,

00:25:35.320 Spinks,

00:25:36.580 Holmes,

00:25:38.040 you know,

00:25:38.380 legitimate fighters,

00:25:39.580 and I wasn't in that ranking

00:25:41.680 as far as the public eye.

00:25:43.940 I was always right there

00:25:45.060 in the middle of it,

00:25:45.640 but like I said,

00:25:46.220 if you wasn't

00:25:46.520 decapitating anybody,

00:25:48.140 you didn't have a chance

00:25:48.960 against this man.

00:25:50.720 You know,

00:25:51.180 you didn't,

00:25:51.860 you know,

00:25:52.220 wasn't hitting people

00:25:52.940 with one punch

00:25:53.560 and knocking them out.

00:25:54.420 When the call was made

00:25:55.840 and he comes to you

00:25:56.840 and tells you,

00:25:57.360 listen,

00:25:57.640 we are next.

00:25:58.800 Was there a sense

00:26:00.020 of enthusiasm,

00:26:02.200 anxiety?

00:26:03.300 What was the emotions?

00:26:04.820 I mean,

00:26:05.040 or was it like,

00:26:06.200 okay,

00:26:06.500 it's good,

00:26:06.860 it's here.

00:26:07.560 I mean,

00:26:08.060 the smile says

00:26:08.720 a story right there,

00:26:09.800 so what did you think

00:26:11.440 when he said that to you?

00:26:12.400 I thought it was good,

00:26:13.400 but I know the reaction

00:26:14.280 to the,

00:26:14.880 you know,

00:26:15.080 everybody in the family

00:26:15.920 was like,

00:26:16.220 oh my God.

00:26:17.240 Yes.

00:26:17.840 Like,

00:26:18.240 you know,

00:26:18.520 my mom was getting

00:26:19.820 phone calls

00:26:20.840 and like,

00:26:21.440 Lula,

00:26:21.880 you know,

00:26:22.300 like,

00:26:22.760 is this happening?

00:26:23.780 Is this true?

00:26:25.100 You know,

00:26:25.380 because,

00:26:25.780 you know,

00:26:25.920 he was a menace.

00:26:26.680 I mean,

00:26:27.080 he's done some things

00:26:28.220 that were just incredible.

00:26:30.320 You know,

00:26:30.560 people that you thought

00:26:31.300 was going to really compete

00:26:32.340 with him,

00:26:32.700 he would just blow them out.

00:26:34.660 Were you at all afraid?

00:26:36.120 No,

00:26:36.440 I was there.

00:26:36.980 I fought under six undercards

00:26:38.920 and I co-featured

00:26:40.020 a couple of them,

00:26:40.820 you know,

00:26:41.240 meaning I fought

00:26:41.960 before he fought,

00:26:43.360 just before he fought

00:26:44.320 and,

00:26:44.640 you know,

00:26:45.720 successful.

00:26:46.780 But like I said,

00:26:47.840 like if you wasn't really,

00:26:49.600 you know,

00:26:50.000 bodily breaking bones

00:26:51.460 or something,

00:26:52.000 you wasn't even considered

00:26:53.280 to have a chance

00:26:54.240 against this man

00:26:54.980 because he was just like

00:26:55.800 a Terminator.

00:26:57.880 So,

00:26:58.320 the story is what?

00:26:59.140 The day he won

00:27:00.500 right before you won

00:27:01.740 a fight as well

00:27:02.400 in seventh round

00:27:03.180 and,

00:27:04.060 you know,

00:27:04.440 everybody was kind of saying,

00:27:05.540 wow,

00:27:05.760 listen,

00:27:06.020 Tyson did win,

00:27:06.660 but let me tell you,

00:27:07.260 here's what happened also

00:27:08.080 with James Buster Douglas.

00:27:09.160 He won a fight

00:27:09.660 the same exact day

00:27:10.800 that he had to fight.

00:27:11.920 Different places,

00:27:12.560 but you won the same fight.

00:27:13.760 No,

00:27:13.920 no,

00:27:14.200 on the car.

00:27:14.540 Same exact place?

00:27:14.980 On the car.

00:27:15.400 On the car.

00:27:15.820 On the car.

00:27:16.180 On the car.

00:27:16.560 Got it.

00:27:16.940 So,

00:27:17.280 you still had a talk,

00:27:18.680 like people,

00:27:19.280 some of the guys

00:27:19.920 that were in the world

00:27:20.580 were saying,

00:27:21.080 you know,

00:27:21.240 this guy's kind of

00:27:22.080 trying to make a climb

00:27:22.800 to get the fight.

00:27:23.680 Right.

00:27:24.080 So,

00:27:24.280 now you get the fight.

00:27:25.240 Okay,

00:27:25.500 so the fight's taking place.

00:27:26.800 You guys got to go to Tokyo.

00:27:29.020 Did you do most of your training

00:27:30.080 here pre-Tokyo?

00:27:31.220 I did here.

00:27:32.180 You did all the training here.

00:27:33.120 I had to go to Tokyo.

00:27:33.820 We had to be there

00:27:34.380 two weeks before.

00:27:35.700 I was on the training

00:27:36.440 I did in Tokyo

00:27:37.320 was the two weeks

00:27:38.060 before the fight.

00:27:39.140 And really,

00:27:39.620 it was like a week.

00:27:40.420 So,

00:27:40.580 that week before the fight,

00:27:42.140 then that week after the fight

00:27:43.140 is just basically

00:27:43.840 public workouts,

00:27:45.700 press conferences,

00:27:46.660 you know,

00:27:46.960 it's just a cool down period.

00:27:48.640 Just resting up,

00:27:49.460 getting ready

00:27:49.800 for the fight itself.

00:27:50.860 Is that typical,

00:27:51.460 by the way?

00:27:52.080 That's typical.

00:27:52.540 That's typical.

00:27:53.160 So,

00:27:53.380 right a week before the fight,

00:27:54.500 you're not really going

00:27:55.120 at the high level

00:27:55.740 of intensity.

00:27:56.440 No,

00:27:56.500 you're just cooling down

00:27:57.620 and relaxing

00:27:59.020 and building back your energy.

00:28:00.320 Your energy's building back up.

00:28:01.840 Got it.

00:28:02.160 Are you watching

00:28:02.740 any of the media

00:28:03.520 of what's being said?

00:28:04.400 Are you,

00:28:04.820 your family,

00:28:05.360 anybody watching?

00:28:05.960 I didn't have to.

00:28:06.260 It was everybody telling me,

00:28:07.420 you know.

00:28:07.900 And then when I did watch it,

00:28:08.900 it wasn't good.

00:28:09.700 So,

00:28:10.100 why would I even watch it?

00:28:11.040 So,

00:28:11.420 when you said you did

00:28:12.480 and it wasn't good,

00:28:13.240 like,

00:28:13.560 it discouraged you?

00:28:14.920 Were you getting upset?

00:28:15.680 Were you getting annoyed?

00:28:16.360 No, it was pissing me off.

00:28:17.160 It was pissing you off.

00:28:18.160 Right.

00:28:18.520 And I said,

00:28:18.960 the one thing

00:28:19.340 they're going to realize

00:28:19.980 about this fight

00:28:20.780 is that,

00:28:22.100 folks,

00:28:22.640 we're in the fourth round.

00:28:23.540 We're in the fifth round.

00:28:25.280 You know,

00:28:25.540 because they all thought

00:28:26.340 it was going to be

00:28:26.780 one or two,

00:28:27.860 two rounds.

00:28:28.660 Because,

00:28:28.960 I mean,

00:28:29.240 that's just how it was

00:28:30.260 with Mike.

00:28:31.240 Now,

00:28:31.600 you know,

00:28:32.080 when I remember your fight,

00:28:33.720 like,

00:28:33.980 when I remember the story

00:28:35.240 of what happened

00:28:36.100 with Buster Douglas,

00:28:37.100 I kept hearing about

00:28:38.500 where the motivation

00:28:40.100 came from.

00:28:41.000 Like,

00:28:41.440 where did this guy,

00:28:42.420 like,

00:28:42.660 you were taking punch,

00:28:44.220 like,

00:28:44.540 you were,

00:28:45.080 you were,

00:28:45.780 you were incredible

00:28:46.680 in that fight.

00:28:47.480 Like,

00:28:47.660 you were determined

00:28:48.600 to win this fight.

00:28:49.800 And then there's a story

00:28:50.980 of what happened

00:28:51.440 on January 18th,

00:28:52.600 1990,

00:28:53.260 which is 23 days

00:28:54.240 right before

00:28:54.820 the fight,

00:28:56.440 right,

00:28:56.780 when the story happened.

00:28:58.440 Walk us through

00:28:59.280 what happened there

00:29:00.060 and how you reacted to it.

00:29:01.400 A week prior to

00:29:02.180 my mother passing,

00:29:03.660 she came over to the house.

00:29:05.640 And,

00:29:06.040 you know,

00:29:07.380 I was there by myself

00:29:09.160 and,

00:29:09.760 and,

00:29:10.200 she came in,

00:29:12.300 we sat down

00:29:12.820 and she said

00:29:13.320 she just wanted

00:29:13.900 to talk about

00:29:14.720 the fight.

00:29:16.180 Because she went out

00:29:17.200 and bought that book

00:29:18.000 that Mike had out,

00:29:19.120 that Mike had out

00:29:20.100 just before our fight.

00:29:22.340 And,

00:29:22.740 you know,

00:29:23.420 it's a pretty

00:29:23.860 intense book.

00:29:24.820 You know,

00:29:25.640 how he is

00:29:26.560 and his mentality.

00:29:28.360 And,

00:29:28.380 and so she was

00:29:30.460 talking to me about

00:29:31.380 how I was,

00:29:34.000 you know,

00:29:34.380 how I,

00:29:35.240 she wanted to see

00:29:36.200 how I was thinking

00:29:37.820 and,

00:29:38.280 you know,

00:29:38.720 how things were going

00:29:39.560 with me.

00:29:40.060 Because I was going

00:29:40.720 through a lot

00:29:41.160 at the time too.

00:29:43.040 And then after we talked,

00:29:44.380 she was like,

00:29:44.920 oh my gosh,

00:29:45.500 you're so mean,

00:29:46.280 you know.

00:29:46.860 But she was satisfied.

00:29:48.400 She was convinced

00:29:49.120 that I was going to give it,

00:29:50.900 that I was focused

00:29:51.760 and really ready

00:29:53.060 to fight this fight

00:29:54.040 that I wasn't just

00:29:55.400 another one of the

00:29:56.500 sacrificial lambs

00:29:57.560 that everybody thought.

00:29:59.120 So she was convinced.

00:30:00.440 She told her girlfriend,

00:30:01.400 she said,

00:30:01.640 I'm not worried about Buster,

00:30:02.620 you're going to beat Mike.

00:30:03.620 You know,

00:30:03.820 and all of them came up to me

00:30:04.880 and told me that

00:30:05.500 after the fight.

00:30:06.760 Her friends,

00:30:07.580 you know,

00:30:07.820 two or three of her friends

00:30:08.760 came and told me,

00:30:09.300 your mother said

00:30:09.860 you was going to beat him,

00:30:10.680 Buster.

00:30:11.880 You know,

00:30:12.400 and they were like shocked

00:30:13.960 that she said that

00:30:14.920 because they hadn't seen

00:30:16.480 or heard of this guy.

00:30:18.760 You know,

00:30:18.960 because at that time

00:30:19.600 he was at the top

00:30:20.300 of his game.

00:30:22.100 You know,

00:30:22.520 so like I said,

00:30:23.740 she always believed in me.

00:30:24.860 Your brother tells a story

00:30:25.900 of your mom going to your dad

00:30:27.880 and talking to him

00:30:28.920 and saying,

00:30:29.380 hey, you know,

00:30:30.580 is this guy as bad

00:30:31.880 as people make him out to be?

00:30:33.760 Yeah, she said,

00:30:34.480 is he bad as you?

00:30:35.420 Is he bad as you?

00:30:36.300 Yeah.

00:30:36.660 He said,

00:30:37.300 yes,

00:30:37.760 yes he is, honey.

00:30:38.780 Yes he is, dear.

00:30:39.600 What is it going to be

00:30:41.860 with Buster?

00:30:44.400 And what did he say?

00:30:47.360 He said,

00:30:47.940 yeah,

00:30:48.160 he can do it.

00:30:50.900 Wow.

00:30:52.120 So,

00:30:52.680 who called you

00:30:53.660 when the event happened

00:30:55.100 with your mom?

00:30:56.540 J.D.

00:30:59.240 J.D.

00:30:59.720 called

00:31:00.120 because he was at the house

00:31:02.840 at my mother's

00:31:04.100 and father's house.

00:31:06.020 Then when I got over there

00:31:07.000 he was outside

00:31:07.940 because he didn't want

00:31:09.040 to go in

00:31:09.560 in the house

00:31:09.960 because of him,

00:31:10.580 my dad was on edge.

00:31:12.740 So,

00:31:13.280 I went and talked to him.

00:31:14.460 I mean,

00:31:14.660 went in there

00:31:15.100 and seen her.

00:31:15.700 And when I came

00:31:16.220 in the house

00:31:16.740 they were taking her

00:31:18.480 out on the gurney.

00:31:20.640 That's the first thing

00:31:21.500 you saw

00:31:21.820 when you came

00:31:22.240 in the house?

00:31:23.920 No,

00:31:24.200 the first thing

00:31:24.660 with my father.

00:31:25.380 Then when I went back,

00:31:26.640 when I walked in

00:31:27.940 and my brother Bill

00:31:28.900 then

00:31:30.400 they pulled her out.

00:31:35.860 I went in the bedroom.

00:31:37.140 She was on the bed.

00:31:38.020 They had her covered up

00:31:39.000 and I pulled on the cover

00:31:40.480 and I looked at her

00:31:41.600 but I couldn't really

00:31:42.280 pull this,

00:31:42.840 I mean,

00:31:43.680 you know,

00:31:44.080 do it.

00:31:44.700 So.

00:31:46.840 What was your immediate reaction?

00:31:48.160 That was my mom.

00:32:04.980 That was my mom.

00:32:10.340 Anger.

00:32:12.360 Anger was the first reaction?

00:32:14.520 Yeah,

00:32:14.920 I was pissed,

00:32:15.820 you know.

00:32:17.380 Because I was going

00:32:18.020 to do so much for her.

00:32:21.420 I got it.

00:32:22.100 So you were looking

00:32:22.640 forward to giving

00:32:23.260 for all these years.

00:32:24.120 Oh, yeah.

00:32:25.640 I was taking care of her,

00:32:27.360 you know.

00:32:27.700 Got it.

00:32:28.800 But this was the payday.

00:32:30.660 This is it.

00:32:31.580 I knew I was going to win.

00:32:32.900 I knew I felt strong,

00:32:33.920 felt good about it.

00:32:34.900 But I knew that

00:32:39.020 I had to stay strong.

00:32:42.620 That just made it

00:32:43.580 even more intense.

00:32:46.200 Was everybody coming

00:32:47.320 to you saying,

00:32:47.940 hey,

00:32:48.160 you know,

00:32:48.840 James,

00:32:49.460 this is,

00:32:50.020 you may want to

00:32:50.820 postpone the fight.

00:32:51.720 This may be not.

00:32:52.500 JD asked me.

00:32:53.540 He said,

00:32:53.860 well,

00:32:54.980 what do you want to do?

00:32:55.820 I said,

00:32:56.100 I'm going to fight.

00:32:56.820 I'm going to fight this fight.

00:32:58.420 Same.

00:33:00.680 You know,

00:33:01.080 it just made it

00:33:01.620 even more intense.

00:33:02.840 Did determination level

00:33:03.920 go to a whole different level

00:33:04.940 immediately?

00:33:05.520 It was already

00:33:06.140 it couldn't go no higher,

00:33:07.220 but it went higher,

00:33:08.100 you know.

00:33:08.500 It was there

00:33:09.160 the whole time.

00:33:10.300 I was in great shape.

00:33:11.380 I was ready to fight

00:33:12.240 three weeks,

00:33:13.880 three,

00:33:14.200 four weeks outside.

00:33:15.140 I was ready.

00:33:15.740 I was ready to go.

00:33:17.800 Had a great training.

00:33:19.860 That just made it

00:33:20.680 even more.

00:33:21.420 It just brought it

00:33:22.080 even together

00:33:22.560 even more.

00:33:24.000 The next 23 days,

00:33:27.080 like,

00:33:27.820 was every training

00:33:29.180 and everything you did,

00:33:30.640 was your mom

00:33:31.580 on your mind

00:33:32.040 the entire time

00:33:33.000 while you were

00:33:33.360 going through training?

00:33:34.160 Mostly after,

00:33:35.020 between before and after.

00:33:37.300 Once I was in the gym,

00:33:38.440 I was focused

00:33:38.920 on what I was doing.

00:33:40.500 But then afterwards,

00:33:41.180 it was the downtime

00:33:42.500 that was,

00:33:43.380 you know,

00:33:44.860 kind of tough.

00:33:46.220 So the downtime,

00:33:47.180 were you up,

00:33:47.660 you were down,

00:33:48.280 were you kind of like

00:33:49.160 trying to almost just...

00:33:50.200 No, I say the downtime

00:33:50.780 is when it's like

00:33:51.740 no training,

00:33:52.540 just relaxing.

00:33:53.180 Right, right.

00:33:53.760 But the downtime,

00:33:55.120 were you trying

00:33:56.320 to figure out a way

00:33:57.140 to hold it all together?

00:33:58.520 No, I was ready.

00:33:59.820 I was ready.

00:34:00.340 I just break down

00:34:01.180 sometimes by myself.

00:34:04.520 But it just encouraged

00:34:05.940 me even more

00:34:06.740 that, like,

00:34:07.240 I'm going to bust

00:34:07.940 this dude up.

00:34:09.320 When it was coming

00:34:10.300 to the fight,

00:34:10.940 did the media know

00:34:11.920 that this,

00:34:12.800 your mother had a stroke

00:34:14.020 and it passed away?

00:34:14.860 Or the media...

00:34:15.340 Yeah, everybody

00:34:15.800 knew about it.

00:34:16.640 Yeah.

00:34:17.940 That's when it really

00:34:18.800 looked bad for me

00:34:19.880 in their eyes.

00:34:23.540 You know,

00:34:23.940 how can they compete

00:34:25.020 with this mother

00:34:25.760 or with this mother

00:34:26.380 just passing?

00:34:27.640 So it really

00:34:28.340 didn't look good.

00:34:29.160 So they even

00:34:30.340 made the odds

00:34:30.940 worse to say

00:34:31.720 there's no way

00:34:32.500 or this guy

00:34:32.900 can win this fight.

00:34:33.840 Right.

00:34:34.600 It made it even,

00:34:35.380 you know,

00:34:35.880 a non-no contest

00:34:37.820 type of situation.

00:34:39.040 Wow.

00:34:40.040 Wow.

00:34:40.540 That's interesting.

00:34:41.280 So that's even

00:34:41.880 more fire.

00:34:42.600 They're heartless.

00:34:43.440 You know,

00:34:43.700 all they care about

00:34:44.380 is the story.

00:34:45.080 They don't know

00:34:46.140 significance.

00:34:46.820 They don't see

00:34:47.300 deep into what

00:34:48.220 was going on

00:34:48.840 or possibilities

00:34:49.600 that could happen.

00:34:50.300 Even with the event

00:34:51.340 the media

00:34:52.200 was being heartless

00:34:52.940 with the...

00:34:53.360 Well,

00:34:53.900 yeah,

00:34:54.440 you know,

00:34:55.840 it was just a story.

00:34:58.420 That's what I said,

00:34:59.100 heartless.

00:34:59.580 It wasn't like

00:35:00.300 any compassion

00:35:01.220 about the situation.

00:35:02.960 They were just

00:35:03.420 wanting to get this

00:35:04.320 story down

00:35:06.100 no matter what.

00:35:07.180 You know,

00:35:07.560 they didn't care.

00:35:09.320 Their main focus

00:35:10.040 was Mike anyway.

00:35:10.940 Leading up to the fight,

00:35:13.940 any other events

00:35:15.060 took place

00:35:15.540 leading up to the fight

00:35:16.240 or did that 23 days

00:35:17.420 go by very quickly?

00:35:19.660 Yeah,

00:35:20.060 I went by.

00:35:22.360 It was just,

00:35:23.200 you know,

00:35:24.700 same old

00:35:25.400 outside of my mother's

00:35:27.320 passing.

00:35:27.920 It was just,

00:35:28.680 you know,

00:35:29.500 just working out,

00:35:30.500 getting ready.

00:35:32.000 So fight day comes.

00:35:33.320 What are you thinking?

00:35:34.000 How are you feeling?

00:35:34.820 Feeling great.

00:35:36.060 You know,

00:35:36.500 I felt real good,

00:35:37.320 relaxed.

00:35:37.940 I couldn't wait

00:35:38.380 to get in there

00:35:39.080 because I wanted

00:35:39.980 to bust something up.

00:35:41.740 You were that

00:35:42.220 determined by me.

00:35:43.140 Yeah.

00:35:44.000 You literally

00:35:44.500 couldn't wait

00:35:44.940 to get in there.

00:35:45.740 Yeah.

00:35:46.620 Looking forward to it.

00:35:48.180 Was, was, was.

00:35:49.000 My brother Robert

00:35:49.740 was with me.

00:35:50.660 He would come in

00:35:51.240 and say,

00:35:51.580 Buzz, what's up, man?

00:35:52.700 How you feeling?

00:35:54.320 And I'd tell him,

00:35:55.020 man, I'm ready

00:35:55.320 to fuck something up.

00:35:56.340 And he'd be like,

00:35:57.080 he started laughing

00:35:57.920 and stuff.

00:35:59.200 All right,

00:35:59.700 deal with me, man.

00:36:00.720 Was your dad

00:36:01.340 at the fight as well?

00:36:02.260 No,

00:36:02.600 it was just Robert.

00:36:03.580 Robert the only one

00:36:04.240 that went over

00:36:04.620 with me,

00:36:05.300 you know,

00:36:05.680 and then the rest

00:36:06.280 of my family,

00:36:07.160 other,

00:36:08.280 my,

00:36:08.860 like,

00:36:09.180 John Johnson's wife,

00:36:10.420 his son,

00:36:12.140 and JD's wife

00:36:13.480 came over.

00:36:14.680 I don't know,

00:36:15.340 I think I don't bet

00:36:16.100 he was there.

00:36:16.860 So you're walking

00:36:17.360 into the ring.

00:36:18.540 You're into the ring.

00:36:19.140 Couldn't wait to get there.

00:36:19.980 So you're in.

00:36:20.880 He comes in.

00:36:22.240 You're looking at each other.

00:36:23.420 No,

00:36:23.620 I wasn't even looking at him.

00:36:24.560 I was just feeling

00:36:25.420 the ring out,

00:36:26.560 seeing where,

00:36:27.500 making sure it was solid

00:36:28.640 all the way around

00:36:29.640 and just ready to go.

00:36:31.300 I felt great.

00:36:32.320 In that moment,

00:36:33.260 are you wanting

00:36:34.660 to hurt him?

00:36:35.540 Are you determined

00:36:36.600 to implement

00:36:38.080 what you guys

00:36:38.880 have been training

00:36:39.380 in your training camp?

00:36:40.680 Is it just pure strategy?

00:36:42.320 Put the game plan together.

00:36:45.320 Go to work.

00:36:46.220 How are you coming

00:36:46.820 to nerves?

00:36:47.400 How are you coming

00:36:47.820 to nerves?

00:36:48.580 Oh,

00:36:48.760 you do that

00:36:49.280 just right,

00:36:50.140 you know,

00:36:50.440 once the bell rings.

00:36:51.340 Once you get in there

00:36:52.180 and you feel it,

00:36:53.260 everything,

00:36:53.820 you know,

00:36:54.100 that,

00:36:54.600 the main thing

00:36:55.540 with the nerves is

00:36:56.780 once you get in there

00:36:58.260 and you know

00:36:58.580 you're going to put

00:36:58.920 in the working effort,

00:36:59.740 there's nothing

00:37:00.320 to be nervous about.

00:37:02.340 You know,

00:37:02.500 you can lie

00:37:03.060 and tell everybody

00:37:03.760 using best training camp

00:37:05.660 you done had

00:37:06.280 and you feel really good

00:37:08.020 and didn't get in there

00:37:08.880 and that's when

00:37:09.280 all the truth comes down.

00:37:11.220 You ain't ready.

00:37:11.960 You've been bullshitting around.

00:37:13.160 You've been faking

00:37:13.640 everybody else out.

00:37:14.920 And this guy

00:37:15.460 looked ready.

00:37:16.740 You know,

00:37:16.920 that was the last thing

00:37:17.660 on my mind.

00:37:18.140 I was ready.

00:37:19.460 I was ready to go.

00:37:20.440 So the confidence

00:37:21.100 came from the level

00:37:21.880 of preparation

00:37:22.460 you had put in.

00:37:22.900 Exactly.

00:37:23.860 So fight starts.

00:37:25.280 You've never felt

00:37:26.180 his punch before.

00:37:27.740 What was the first time

00:37:28.720 he hit you

00:37:29.140 when you said,

00:37:29.880 I can take this.

00:37:30.960 I can handle this.

00:37:31.880 Did you,

00:37:32.520 was there a moment

00:37:33.240 you remember

00:37:33.720 when you took a punch?

00:37:35.400 Yeah,

00:37:35.760 it was just like

00:37:36.520 any other punch

00:37:37.300 that we had hit before.

00:37:39.340 It wasn't,

00:37:39.900 you know,

00:37:40.220 it was just

00:37:40.660 to see his speed.

00:37:42.420 And then

00:37:42.880 he's only like 5'10

00:37:45.120 and,

00:37:46.300 you know,

00:37:46.540 he ducks

00:37:47.100 and he gets down.

00:37:48.120 He kind of disappears.

00:37:49.620 He makes this quick move

00:37:50.640 to the left

00:37:51.080 or to the right

00:37:51.680 and you know

00:37:52.480 he's coming

00:37:53.000 and he's coming up

00:37:54.320 launching into you

00:37:55.720 with hooks

00:37:56.200 and right hands

00:37:57.160 and you just

00:37:57.840 got to be alert.

00:37:59.740 Was he the hardest

00:38:00.760 hitter ever?

00:38:01.580 No,

00:38:02.020 never.

00:38:03.000 He wasn't

00:38:03.440 the hardest hitter.

00:38:04.240 He wasn't

00:38:04.680 the hardest hitter?

00:38:05.380 No.

00:38:05.820 Seriously?

00:38:06.400 I'm serious.

00:38:07.120 Who was the hardest hitter

00:38:08.140 ever first?

00:38:08.380 I had a spiral partner

00:38:09.520 that was like

00:38:10.040 175 pounds

00:38:11.240 that was,

00:38:12.220 you know,

00:38:12.760 built like Tyson

00:38:13.640 and,

00:38:14.320 you know,

00:38:15.620 could hit really hard.

00:38:16.840 He was a great,

00:38:17.700 great friend of mine,

00:38:18.700 Darnell Hayes.

00:38:19.580 He was,

00:38:20.040 we came up together.

00:38:21.080 He hit really hard too

00:38:22.320 but he just,

00:38:23.260 you know,

00:38:23.880 didn't have to focus

00:38:24.680 and stuff,

00:38:25.340 you know.

00:38:25.920 I've been hit harder,

00:38:27.480 you know,

00:38:27.960 but it's just

00:38:28.720 his intensity,

00:38:30.580 Tyson's intensity

00:38:31.400 and determination

00:38:32.820 is what really

00:38:33.480 got him to where he was

00:38:34.740 because he was just

00:38:36.440 an intense guy.

00:38:38.120 Did the speed shock you

00:38:39.220 or was your,

00:38:40.980 Hayes,

00:38:41.280 was your training partner

00:38:42.240 fast?

00:38:43.240 Were you almost

00:38:43.860 were getting in the field?

00:38:45.120 I had three great

00:38:46.500 sparring partners,

00:38:47.480 you know,

00:38:48.320 and they were pretty

00:38:49.040 good fighters as well.

00:38:51.120 You know,

00:38:51.280 because you get guys

00:38:52.140 that are up and coming.

00:38:53.380 I went through a few

00:38:54.200 at first

00:38:54.720 but then when I got

00:38:56.040 these three guys,

00:38:57.200 they really worked out

00:38:58.800 and we kept them.

00:39:00.000 and they worked out

00:39:00.760 so they came to work

00:39:01.880 every day,

00:39:03.040 put it on me

00:39:03.760 and, you know,

00:39:04.540 got me in great shape.

00:39:06.060 So when the fight starts

00:39:07.920 and you fight him,

00:39:08.580 look,

00:39:08.900 pretty much every round

00:39:10.100 you took

00:39:10.540 except for the one that he,

00:39:11.820 I think the eighth round

00:39:12.580 he took.

00:39:13.100 Right.

00:39:13.540 But if you went six,

00:39:14.580 seven rounds,

00:39:15.040 you're taking every one

00:39:15.780 of them on points.

00:39:16.840 Right.

00:39:17.560 You're landing 53%

00:39:18.780 of your punches.

00:39:19.320 So it seemed

00:39:20.520 but when it was all over

00:39:22.500 and said,

00:39:23.220 all over and done with,

00:39:25.120 the scorecards

00:39:25.820 had me,

00:39:26.280 had it tied

00:39:26.880 or had me losing.

00:39:27.540 You gotta be kidding me.

00:39:28.480 Yeah,

00:39:28.760 it was incredible.

00:39:29.400 So if you don't

00:39:30.220 knock him out,

00:39:31.120 you may have a draw

00:39:32.320 or you may lose.

00:39:33.200 I wasn't going to have no draw.

00:39:34.280 I was going to lose.

00:39:35.460 You don't knock him out,

00:39:36.280 you lose.

00:39:36.740 Right.

00:39:37.200 Didn't look that way.

00:39:38.320 I know,

00:39:38.940 but it would have been

00:39:39.500 the biggest farce

00:39:40.360 in all history of sports.

00:39:42.760 Well,

00:39:42.900 it's common in boxing.

00:39:44.060 It is.

00:39:44.300 It wouldn't be the first time

00:39:45.140 that would have happened.

00:39:45.900 And it was really common

00:39:46.880 a lot when my father fought

00:39:48.220 because it wasn't TV.

00:39:49.880 See,

00:39:50.080 it was just radio

00:39:50.920 and,

00:39:51.600 you know,

00:39:52.540 you weren't there.

00:39:52.680 You couldn't really see

00:39:53.340 what happened.

00:39:53.780 Yeah,

00:39:54.140 they just hear about it.

00:39:54.960 So was there a point,

00:39:57.000 was there a turning point

00:39:58.200 in the fight

00:39:58.940 where you said,

00:39:59.540 I'm winning this thing?

00:40:00.520 Yeah.

00:40:01.160 When was that?

00:40:01.980 Eighth round.

00:40:03.880 After you got up?

00:40:05.880 No,

00:40:06.580 the eighth round

00:40:07.300 is when I went out there

00:40:08.120 like,

00:40:08.380 shit,

00:40:08.580 this is over.

00:40:09.100 I done beat his ass.

00:40:10.900 And I got relaxed

00:40:11.820 that moment.

00:40:13.200 Went out there

00:40:13.740 and stopped fighting

00:40:14.440 and looking.

00:40:15.140 And then he caught me

00:40:15.860 with that shot

00:40:16.500 and it was like,

00:40:17.120 whoa,

00:40:17.520 shit,

00:40:17.800 he's still alive.

00:40:21.080 Were you almost shocked

00:40:22.480 when he got you

00:40:23.080 with the hook

00:40:23.580 or the other fight?

00:40:24.460 Yeah,

00:40:24.500 yeah.

00:40:25.280 I was like,

00:40:25.920 damn,

00:40:26.380 you know,

00:40:26.720 and that's when

00:40:27.400 I was on my back

00:40:28.260 looking up like,

00:40:29.100 oh,

00:40:29.480 fuck.

00:40:30.380 You know,

00:40:30.740 that moment,

00:40:31.320 that brief moment,

00:40:32.020 I wanted to have

00:40:32.480 a moment to reflect

00:40:33.540 in the middle

00:40:34.540 of a killer fight.

00:40:36.480 Wanted to have a moment

00:40:37.080 to reflect

00:40:37.740 and got caught.

00:40:39.240 So you're down.

00:40:40.040 So the intensity

00:40:40.780 was there.

00:40:41.540 He was ready.

00:40:42.100 He was looking

00:40:42.500 for the opportunity.

00:40:43.160 Yeah,

00:40:43.480 he was.

00:40:43.840 And he took it.

00:40:44.840 I think it almost

00:40:45.800 seemed like he knew

00:40:46.620 he's not going to go

00:40:47.280 the whole thing.

00:40:47.900 He's got to take you out.

00:40:48.920 So he almost

00:40:49.340 made it count

00:40:50.600 hoping you wouldn't

00:40:51.200 get up.

00:40:51.780 Right,

00:40:52.160 right.

00:40:52.580 And I seen

00:40:53.000 when I got up

00:40:53.640 and looked at him

00:40:54.320 and the air

00:40:55.260 just seemed to go

00:40:55.920 right out of him

00:40:56.620 like,

00:40:56.960 shit,

00:40:57.760 you know,

00:40:58.160 because I gave it

00:40:58.800 all I had on that one.

00:40:59.860 It's almost like

00:41:00.820 that was the tipping point.

00:41:01.920 It's interesting

00:41:02.340 you're saying that.

00:41:03.080 It's almost like

00:41:03.520 that was a tipping point

00:41:04.360 when you watched the fight.

00:41:05.820 Who did you say

00:41:06.480 in your corner

00:41:07.020 saying,

00:41:07.420 I got this,

00:41:07.960 don't worry about it,

00:41:08.540 I got this.

00:41:09.160 Did you tell somebody

00:41:10.500 in your corner

00:41:10.920 that it's over with,

00:41:15.800 John Johnson said

00:41:16.720 I pat him in the back

00:41:17.200 and says,

00:41:17.520 well then go get him.

00:41:18.200 You know what you're doing.

00:41:19.040 Yeah,

00:41:19.120 John Johnson said

00:41:19.940 he's scared to death.

00:41:21.060 He said he's scared to death.

00:41:22.280 Yeah,

00:41:22.300 John said Tyson

00:41:23.160 was scared to death.

00:41:24.100 Oh,

00:41:24.240 that was prior

00:41:25.800 to the knockdown

00:41:26.840 when he said that.

00:41:28.260 Let me ask you

00:41:28.960 this technical question.

00:41:29.960 You know the whole thing

00:41:30.680 where Don King

00:41:31.280 afterwards said

00:41:31.920 it's 13 seconds,

00:41:32.920 it's 12 seconds,

00:41:33.360 they put the whole video

00:41:34.240 and they started

00:41:34.660 doing the counting thing,

00:41:35.520 you know,

00:41:35.700 the spectacle that they did.

00:41:37.880 If he counted slow,

00:41:39.540 the ref,

00:41:39.980 because you know

00:41:40.300 they said the ref

00:41:40.960 counted really slow

00:41:41.860 with you

00:41:42.120 and really fast with him.

00:41:43.360 If he counted slow,

00:41:44.680 you seemed conscious

00:41:46.180 so you could have

00:41:46.880 gotten up whatever time.

00:41:47.800 You would just wait

00:41:48.500 until 8, 9?

00:41:49.320 Yeah,

00:41:49.380 I got up.

00:41:49.860 Okay.

00:41:50.220 I started to get up at 4

00:41:51.520 but then I just,

00:41:53.280 you know,

00:41:53.640 I remember my dad saying,

00:41:54.780 you know,

00:41:54.980 you just got to stay focused

00:41:56.100 and take the time.

00:41:57.860 Do a quick body check

00:41:59.020 because I was getting ready

00:42:00.380 to get up

00:42:00.700 and then I just laid back

00:42:01.640 and relaxed.

00:42:02.460 Which is what you're supposed to do.

00:42:03.480 Use the entire count

00:42:04.400 to kind of rest.

00:42:05.760 I knew I had 8 to get up

00:42:07.040 so at 8 I got up strong,

00:42:08.660 you know.

00:42:09.360 I did a quick body check

00:42:10.560 like I'm still here

00:42:11.520 and focused.

00:42:12.160 I know where I'm at

00:42:12.920 and, you know,

00:42:14.300 got on up.

00:42:15.420 So you go up,

00:42:16.460 you fight,

00:42:17.640 you throw the punches

00:42:18.880 and now all of a sudden

00:42:20.300 you knock him out.

00:42:22.580 Immediate reaction.

00:42:23.680 Are you saying it's over?

00:42:24.740 He's not getting up?

00:42:25.400 No, I thought he was

00:42:26.100 going to get up.

00:42:27.080 Only time I figured

00:42:29.060 it was over

00:42:29.600 is when I seen him

00:42:30.520 crawl to get his mouthpiece.

00:42:32.340 That's when I knew

00:42:33.020 he was incoherent

00:42:34.400 because we all know

00:42:35.760 that you got to get up

00:42:36.640 to get that count stopped.

00:42:37.840 And when I seen him

00:42:38.520 reaching for that mouthpiece,

00:42:39.740 I knew that he was hurt.

00:42:42.180 I was like,

00:42:42.720 oh, this is over.

00:42:43.680 First reaction.

00:42:44.640 It's over.

00:42:45.140 He's hugging him.

00:42:45.980 You know,

00:42:46.120 he's hugging the referee.

00:42:48.520 Dream come true.

00:42:49.800 You know,

00:42:50.280 I did it.

00:42:54.840 All the years of dreaming

00:42:56.320 and finally succeeding

00:42:58.580 was an awesome,

00:43:00.800 awesome experience.

00:43:02.220 I'm telling you,

00:43:02.840 it was a great,

00:43:04.100 great moment in my life

00:43:06.320 until, you know,

00:43:09.280 like hearing my name

00:43:10.040 called as the

00:43:10.560 undisputed heavyweight

00:43:11.380 champion of the world.

00:43:12.640 You know,

00:43:13.060 the hoopla,

00:43:14.260 all the team

00:43:15.280 coming in there

00:43:15.940 congratulating me.

00:43:17.960 And once we got out

00:43:19.660 the ring

00:43:20.180 and then got back

00:43:21.300 to the dressing room,

00:43:22.720 then the nightmare began

00:43:23.940 because then they started

00:43:24.880 saying,

00:43:25.420 came in and said

00:43:26.160 that they're protesting

00:43:27.380 the fight.

00:43:28.280 Were you surprised

00:43:29.120 that Don Kick

00:43:29.700 wouldn't do something

00:43:30.220 like that?

00:43:30.700 I was very surprised.

00:43:31.860 Oh, you were surprised

00:43:32.840 that Don Kick

00:43:33.320 would do something

00:43:33.840 like that?

00:43:34.560 Yeah.

00:43:34.980 He had a reputation

00:43:35.740 of being,

00:43:36.480 you know.

00:43:38.220 Yeah, calculus

00:43:38.700 but I knew

00:43:40.220 that he was,

00:43:41.720 but I didn't think

00:43:42.320 that was gonna,

00:43:43.680 I had no idea

00:43:45.260 it was gonna be like that

00:43:46.240 because it was

00:43:46.640 a legitimate win.

00:43:48.040 Did that take

00:43:48.620 any of the thunder out

00:43:49.400 or no?

00:43:49.860 You still felt

00:43:50.560 the victory in?

00:43:51.620 Oh, definitely.

00:43:52.460 I felt the victory.

00:43:52.560 Because I know

00:43:52.800 you went on Johnny Carson,

00:43:53.900 you were on all

00:43:54.360 these different shows.

00:43:55.320 Yeah, yeah,

00:43:55.540 it was definitely,

00:43:56.260 I knew he couldn't

00:43:56.840 take it because

00:43:57.620 it was on world class TV.

00:44:00.460 Now,

00:44:00.660 it was back in the day

00:44:01.540 where it was like radio,

00:44:02.980 he might have gotten

00:44:03.660 that off.

00:44:05.000 But by it being

00:44:05.780 on national TV

00:44:06.880 where the world

00:44:07.660 seen it,

00:44:08.280 it was like,

00:44:09.160 there's no way

00:44:09.540 in hell

00:44:09.840 they gonna go for this.

00:44:11.700 Everybody seen it,

00:44:12.760 you know,

00:44:13.120 and everybody

00:44:13.520 was celebrating as well.

00:44:15.460 Buster,

00:44:15.980 how much of this

00:44:17.060 do you think

00:44:17.720 had to do

00:44:18.380 with your mother's

00:44:19.120 passing 23 days

00:44:20.140 prior to that?

00:44:21.580 Or do you think

00:44:22.180 whether that happens

00:44:23.440 or not,

00:44:23.840 you're winning the fight?

00:44:24.760 Or do you think

00:44:25.180 that just gave you?

00:44:25.940 I had it going on

00:44:26.920 before that.

00:44:28.160 You know,

00:44:28.460 I was very positive

00:44:29.500 and like I said,

00:44:30.780 the training

00:44:31.340 was going really well.

00:44:33.540 But,

00:44:33.960 you know,

00:44:34.500 it was just,

00:44:35.240 you know,

00:44:35.660 something just added

00:44:36.400 to it.

00:44:37.780 But I was ready

00:44:39.240 to go prior

00:44:40.180 to that,

00:44:40.720 her passing.

00:44:42.020 So regardless,

00:44:42.880 you think you would

00:44:43.340 have won the fight

00:44:43.900 or you think

00:44:44.240 that kind of gave you

00:44:44.980 the tolerance

00:44:45.420 to endure a little bit

00:44:46.580 of pain?

00:44:47.020 I can't say

00:44:47.700 that anything,

00:44:49.560 something like that

00:44:50.420 would have been,

00:44:51.960 if it was going

00:44:52.740 any other way,

00:44:53.940 like if the training

00:44:54.660 was rough,

00:44:56.280 preparation was doubtful,

00:44:58.560 and something like that

00:44:59.480 would have happened,

00:45:00.100 it would have been over.

00:45:01.640 Literally.

00:45:02.340 It would have been

00:45:02.780 just like really

00:45:03.620 a reason not to continue.

00:45:05.660 But I was going

00:45:06.480 great and strong

00:45:07.460 and that just shows you

00:45:08.620 that everything

00:45:09.940 was going,

00:45:10.780 it was lined up.

00:45:12.900 That was the plan.

00:45:14.540 It just made it even

00:45:15.600 go through even more

00:45:17.560 because, you know,

00:45:18.520 if I wasn't having

00:45:19.180 a great training session

00:45:20.920 and things weren't

00:45:21.760 going well,

00:45:23.120 with her passing,

00:45:24.060 it would have really

00:45:24.540 dissolved it.

00:45:25.560 You know,

00:45:25.820 it made it be like,

00:45:26.700 well,

00:45:26.880 I know it ain't

00:45:28.000 going to happen.

00:45:28.540 Got it.

00:45:29.240 But by me having

00:45:30.040 a great training session,

00:45:31.140 we had been in the gym

00:45:32.060 for eight weeks,

00:45:34.520 you know,

00:45:35.500 leading up to that fight.

00:45:36.940 You know,

00:45:37.140 and then she passed

00:45:37.880 two weeks prior

00:45:39.060 to the fight.

00:45:40.540 First question

00:45:41.260 that was asked

00:45:41.700 right after the fight,

00:45:42.900 you gave love,

00:45:45.860 obviously,

00:45:46.200 to your mom

00:45:46.620 and immediately

00:45:47.660 you broke down

00:45:48.860 in that moment.

00:45:50.300 How many times

00:45:50.980 have you watched

00:45:51.580 that moment

00:45:52.240 with the fight?

00:45:52.920 Like,

00:45:53.100 have you yourself

00:45:54.520 ever sat down

00:45:55.400 by yourself

00:45:55.980 and watched the fight

00:45:56.840 from beginning

00:45:57.280 to the end

00:45:57.840 and seen how you react

00:45:58.860 to him?

00:45:59.160 Several times.

00:45:59.480 Several times.

00:46:00.220 Yeah.

00:46:01.280 By yourself.

00:46:01.920 No friends,

00:46:02.440 no brother,

00:46:02.960 nobody else around.

00:46:03.680 By yourself.

00:46:05.540 How do you react

00:46:06.580 when you watch

00:46:07.100 that fight now?

00:46:07.940 Like,

00:46:08.080 when you watch it,

00:46:08.800 what is your reaction?

00:46:10.200 It just takes me back

00:46:11.360 to every,

00:46:12.700 every moment

00:46:13.500 comes up.

00:46:15.120 Every movement,

00:46:16.440 every,

00:46:16.780 it all just

00:46:17.540 naturally just comes up

00:46:19.600 to where I just,

00:46:21.080 I see,

00:46:21.840 I feel the intensity

00:46:23.000 and what I was thinking

00:46:24.520 at that time

00:46:25.340 and determination.

00:46:27.260 It's a great feeling.

00:46:28.600 James,

00:46:29.000 you fly back,

00:46:30.000 your dad's not at the fight.

00:46:31.540 The first moment

00:46:32.280 you make eye contact

00:46:33.040 with your dad,

00:46:33.780 what's his reaction?

00:46:35.980 Oh,

00:46:36.220 he just said,

00:46:36.720 you did it,

00:46:37.180 you did it,

00:46:37.640 baby.

00:46:39.020 So proud of you.

00:46:42.060 It was like,

00:46:43.720 he handed the ball

00:46:44.600 off to me

00:46:45.380 after he retired

00:46:46.620 and I took it all away.

00:46:48.440 All the way to the top.

00:46:49.600 I mean,

00:46:49.720 you took it to the pinnacle.

00:46:50.720 There's not above anything

00:46:51.780 heavyweight champion

00:46:52.640 against a guy

00:46:53.740 that's arguably

00:46:55.300 one of the most

00:46:56.140 feared boxers

00:46:56.980 of all time.

00:46:57.800 That's right.

00:46:58.060 Ali wasn't,

00:46:59.220 Ali was technical.

00:46:59.820 He was up there

00:47:00.200 with Sonny Liston.

00:47:01.360 Exactly.

00:47:01.820 That's what he is.

00:47:02.420 It's a whole different story

00:47:03.720 with what he did.

00:47:04.400 Yeah, no doubt.

00:47:04.960 No doubt.

00:47:05.400 So how does it feel,

00:47:06.740 how does it feel

00:47:07.100 knowing you beat

00:47:07.900 the most feared guy

00:47:08.840 in the world?

00:47:09.860 Oh, it's great

00:47:10.700 because I always knew

00:47:11.940 I had the ability

00:47:12.620 to do it

00:47:13.220 and then actually

00:47:13.900 succeed at it.

00:47:15.000 You know,

00:47:15.220 it was just like,

00:47:16.400 it was meant to be.

00:47:17.320 Was there ever

00:47:17.840 a doubt with you

00:47:18.520 or you're not a doubt guy?

00:47:20.300 Like,

00:47:20.540 were you a doubt person

00:47:22.200 yourself?

00:47:22.720 Were you ever questioning

00:47:23.480 your ability

00:47:24.280 to be able to pull it off

00:47:25.100 or no?

00:47:25.380 You had confidence?

00:47:26.040 No, I had confidence.

00:47:27.040 That's not your wiring.

00:47:27.900 No.

00:47:28.400 Interesting.

00:47:29.380 Very interesting.

00:47:30.240 Because 42 to 1, man,

00:47:31.500 I mean,

00:47:32.120 listen,

00:47:32.880 you break down math.

00:47:34.620 42 to 1,

00:47:36.020 that's not like,

00:47:36.900 you know,

00:47:37.160 a 10 to 1,

00:47:37.820 that's crazy Oz.

00:47:38.900 Like,

00:47:39.100 there's no way

00:47:39.520 that guy's going to win

00:47:40.140 10 to 1.

00:47:41.140 20 to 1,

00:47:41.920 it's an insult.

00:47:42.700 42 to 1,

00:47:44.580 it's like,

00:47:45.180 don't even go to the fight.

00:47:46.580 And really,

00:47:47.100 and really,

00:47:47.680 42 to 1

00:47:48.620 is basically like,

00:47:50.540 let's just put it there

00:47:51.880 because that's really

00:47:53.540 unbelievable.

00:47:55.080 Like you said,

00:47:55.780 unbelievable type of odds

00:47:57.100 because it wasn't even

00:47:58.540 books on it at all

00:47:59.680 on the fight.

00:48:00.360 That's why we were

00:48:00.880 in Tokyo.

00:48:02.400 You know,

00:48:02.680 it was just a quick one,

00:48:03.740 you know,

00:48:03.940 quick watch,

00:48:04.720 you know,

00:48:04.980 give him a little tune-up

00:48:05.940 before he goes

00:48:06.720 to the big fight

00:48:07.460 or something.

00:48:07.820 They said,

00:48:08.940 one person bet

00:48:10.560 $160,000

00:48:12.720 on Mike Tyson

00:48:13.820 to win

00:48:15.060 $4,000.

00:48:17.920 Somebody bet

00:48:19.020 $160,000

00:48:20.780 and if Tyson

00:48:21.780 would have won,

00:48:22.360 the winning

00:48:22.700 is only going to be

00:48:23.460 $4,000.

00:48:24.280 That's 42.

00:48:25.400 That's insane to me.

00:48:27.120 Yeah.

00:48:27.640 That's insane to me.

00:48:28.720 That means,

00:48:29.120 if somebody bet

00:48:29.720 $4,000 on you,

00:48:30.580 they win $160.

00:48:31.820 Right.

00:48:32.140 If somebody bets $160,000

00:48:33.160 on Tyson,

00:48:33.700 they win $4,000.

00:48:34.800 Right.

00:48:35.540 Incredible.

00:48:36.180 So,

00:48:36.300 and Vegas was saying

00:48:38.060 they only had a few people

00:48:38.880 that were betting on you.

00:48:39.740 Like,

00:48:39.880 literally,

00:48:40.240 nobody was betting on you.

00:48:41.380 You know,

00:48:41.580 one guy brags about

00:48:42.380 the fact that he did.

00:48:43.140 There's a group of guys

00:48:44.400 that like to brag

00:48:45.140 that I'm one of the guys

00:48:46.120 that bet on,

00:48:46.760 you know,

00:48:47.040 James.

00:48:48.280 Yeah,

00:48:48.560 that's incredible,

00:48:49.280 right?

00:48:49.460 42 to 1.

00:48:50.860 So,

00:48:51.100 then right after that,

00:48:52.300 you come home,

00:48:54.180 25,000 people show up,

00:48:55.740 Ohio,

00:48:56.320 craziness.

00:48:57.340 They cannot believe,

00:48:58.320 oh my gosh,

00:48:59.020 this guy pulled it off.

00:49:00.640 You know,

00:49:00.880 how are you

00:49:02.420 taken by your community now?

00:49:05.280 Like,

00:49:05.900 you know,

00:49:06.440 what was that reaction

00:49:08.040 when even the local places

00:49:09.300 you would go to,

00:49:10.000 the restaurant you would go eat,

00:49:11.260 the gym you would go to,

00:49:12.900 the coffee shop,

00:49:13.920 or places you typically go to,

00:49:15.360 the routine barber shop,

00:49:16.480 how were they treating you?

00:49:18.200 Awesome.

00:49:18.760 You know,

00:49:19.020 it was great.

00:49:19.720 It was like,

00:49:20.200 wow,

00:49:20.540 you did it,

00:49:21.100 man.

00:49:22.320 You know,

00:49:22.820 and then they would all say,

00:49:24.000 I knew after such and such a round,

00:49:26.460 you know,

00:49:26.740 I seen the determination,

00:49:28.420 you know.

00:49:29.040 Do you pay for coffee

00:49:30.440 when you go places,

00:49:31.200 do they take your money today?

00:49:32.600 Oh yeah,

00:49:33.120 they take my money.

00:49:33.760 They take your money today.

00:49:37.400 I was in Panama,

00:49:38.900 and I went to Roberto Duran's restaurant,

00:49:41.180 because you know,

00:49:41.640 when he won himself,

00:49:43.500 he was God,

00:49:44.460 in Panama,

00:49:45.600 and the story is like,

00:49:47.160 these guys welcomed this guy.

00:49:48.460 He became,

00:49:49.100 you know,

00:49:49.440 a mythical figure.

00:49:49.720 Oh yeah,

00:49:50.180 Roberto's a great guy.

00:49:51.540 I got to do,

00:49:53.380 I fought with Roberto,

00:49:55.620 Hector Camacho,

00:49:56.920 when it was comeback.

00:49:58.000 I got to hang out with him,

00:49:59.760 and Roberto's like,

00:50:00.640 a great guy,

00:50:01.420 man.

00:50:02.080 That's what a lot of people say.

00:50:03.380 He is,

00:50:03.840 one of the best fighters I've ever met.

00:50:05.320 You know,

00:50:05.540 he's a good guy.

00:50:06.300 Even Tyson says,

00:50:07.140 a lot of the things he picked up from Duran.

00:50:08.780 Like he says,

00:50:09.400 I learned a lot from Duran.

00:50:10.160 His intensity,

00:50:10.700 yeah,

00:50:11.120 I can imagine that.

00:50:12.580 Yeah,

00:50:12.920 he's a,

00:50:13.500 Roberto's a monster,

00:50:15.060 man.

00:50:15.200 Psychological monster.

00:50:16.780 Four-time champion

00:50:17.820 in four different weight classes.

00:50:19.740 That's insane.

00:50:20.940 Insane.

00:50:21.680 And he,

00:50:21.980 and it's like,

00:50:22.640 he started at 135 pounds,

00:50:25.020 went up to like 75.

00:50:27.660 And these times,

00:50:28.300 he was winning titles.

00:50:29.880 Incredible fighter,

00:50:30.740 man.

00:50:31.100 Yeah,

00:50:31.260 when you talk to pros,

00:50:32.440 and they say,

00:50:33.060 hey,

00:50:33.160 give me the top 10 of all time,

00:50:35.000 almost everybody has them on the list.

00:50:36.560 Oh,

00:50:36.780 no doubt.

00:50:37.380 Who are your top five?

00:50:38.340 Top five greatest boxers of all time?

00:50:40.300 Oh,

00:50:40.540 Ali,

00:50:42.200 you know,

00:50:42.640 my dad.

00:50:43.560 You put your dad on the list.

00:50:44.040 Carlos Monzon,

00:50:45.380 Victor Glendez,

00:50:46.860 Tommy Hearns.

00:50:48.520 Interesting list.

00:50:49.180 Yeah,

00:50:49.560 I mean,

00:50:50.080 it goes back.

00:50:50.680 Interesting list.

00:50:51.500 And if you ask me again tomorrow,

00:50:53.140 I'll tell you another 75.

00:50:55.160 Because it goes back.

00:50:56.540 Because like,

00:50:56.940 Jose Napoli's,

00:50:58.200 you know,

00:50:58.720 well-await champion,

00:50:59.800 great well-await champion

00:51:00.760 back in the 70s,

00:51:01.980 60s,

00:51:02.400 and 70s.

00:51:03.160 Sugar Ray Robinson.

00:51:04.260 You put Liston on that list?

00:51:05.460 You put Foreman on that list?

00:51:06.640 You put Frazier on that list?

00:51:07.640 Or no?

00:51:07.880 No,

00:51:08.400 I put Frazier on there,

00:51:09.560 but I wouldn't put Liston or Foreman.

00:51:12.580 You put Tyson top 10?

00:51:14.100 Yeah,

00:51:14.460 Tyson would be on the top 10.

00:51:16.240 Top 5?

00:51:17.180 Yeah.

00:51:17.800 Is he top 5 or top 10?

00:51:19.220 Top 6.

00:51:20.120 Top 6.

00:51:20.960 Got it.

00:51:21.640 Interesting.

00:51:22.280 Interesting on that.

00:51:23.020 And you're a fan today.

00:51:23.900 Are you following when there's fights?

00:51:25.000 Like,

00:51:25.080 did you watch a Ruiz fight?

00:51:26.360 Like tonight,

00:51:27.260 with Pacquiao and

00:51:28.920 the well-await champ.

00:51:30.520 That's going to be a good one.

00:51:31.820 But I'm going with Pacquiao.

00:51:33.540 I think he's going to take that kid

00:51:34.760 in the deep water,

00:51:35.960 late fight,

00:51:36.620 and drown him.

00:51:37.400 Yeah,

00:51:37.740 Pacquiao's an interesting beast.

00:51:40.240 Are you also from the narrative

00:51:41.580 that Mayweather

00:51:42.460 avoided the fight

00:51:43.560 with Pacquiao at his peak,

00:51:44.760 or you don't come from

00:51:46.000 that school of thought?

00:51:46.700 No,

00:51:47.140 no,

00:51:47.500 Mayweather's an incredible kid,

00:51:49.200 man.

00:51:49.480 He's three generations

00:51:50.580 of world champions,

00:51:52.840 you know.

00:51:53.440 Well,

00:51:54.260 his uncle was a world champion.

00:51:56.800 His father was a great fighter,

00:51:58.060 but he had

00:51:58.500 in and out of trouble.

00:52:00.300 But,

00:52:01.320 you know,

00:52:01.700 his lineages,

00:52:02.580 he's a long time,

00:52:04.140 you know,

00:52:04.500 historian.

00:52:06.180 He's definitely,

00:52:07.420 he did it right,

00:52:09.000 man.

00:52:09.760 And by the way,

00:52:10.600 the guy is,

00:52:11.580 you know,

00:52:13.300 he's a strategist.

00:52:14.780 I mean,

00:52:15.060 he's a street kid

00:52:16.300 that you would be like,

00:52:17.100 he's a punk.

00:52:17.780 The guy is

00:52:18.420 extremely smart

00:52:20.340 when it,

00:52:20.680 I know him and 50 Cent

00:52:21.640 would go back

00:52:22.200 and,

00:52:22.440 hey,

00:52:22.540 learn how to read

00:52:23.140 and do all this other

00:52:23.860 stuff they do.

00:52:24.860 But,

00:52:25.360 he knew how to control

00:52:27.040 the narrative very well.

00:52:28.180 Yes,

00:52:28.420 he did.

00:52:28.880 You got to give that guy

00:52:29.840 props for that side.

00:52:31.020 He fought my brother,

00:52:31.880 Artie,

00:52:32.280 in amateurs.

00:52:34.620 We took a team

00:52:35.460 from Columbus

00:52:36.020 up to Grand Rapids,

00:52:37.340 Michigan.

00:52:38.360 When you saw him

00:52:39.040 fight as an amateur,

00:52:40.440 even then,

00:52:40.940 did you say,

00:52:41.440 this guy's going to go

00:52:42.260 the distance?

00:52:43.180 No,

00:52:43.640 I was pissed

00:52:44.340 because he beat Artie,

00:52:45.500 but,

00:52:46.620 you know,

00:52:47.080 he wasn't even thinking

00:52:47.880 about it like that then,

00:52:49.220 but he's been a world,

00:52:50.180 he's been a champion

00:52:50.880 all his whole career.

00:52:52.120 Yeah.

00:52:53.060 Interesting.

00:52:53.900 So,

00:52:54.220 eight months after

00:52:55.020 your fight with Tyson,

00:52:56.560 you fight Holyfield.

00:52:58.120 And Holyfield's fight

00:52:59.720 doesn't end the way

00:53:01.180 you want it to end.

00:53:02.060 You end up losing that fight.

00:53:03.360 I wish I could've gave Holyfield

00:53:06.980 my best

00:53:07.520 because I knew he,

00:53:08.240 that's why I chose him

00:53:09.100 to fight.

00:53:09.880 I could've easily went

00:53:10.780 with Foreman

00:53:11.540 or someone else,

00:53:12.840 but I wanted to fight

00:53:13.580 Holyfield

00:53:14.180 and then,

00:53:15.900 you know,

00:53:16.780 continue to just destroy

00:53:18.180 these guys

00:53:18.740 that were supposed

00:53:19.340 to be,

00:53:19.960 you know,

00:53:20.740 top fighters,

00:53:21.660 you know.

00:53:22.600 But,

00:53:23.380 by the time

00:53:24.300 where I had to go

00:53:24.960 through,

00:53:25.240 see,

00:53:25.460 I went through

00:53:25.780 a long legal litigation

00:53:28.300 with Don King.

00:53:30.000 Right at the best moment

00:53:31.040 of that fight

00:53:31.540 was hearing my name

00:53:32.240 announced as a new

00:53:33.220 undisputed heavyweight champion.

00:53:35.600 And then after that

00:53:36.260 it became a nightmare

00:53:37.180 because I was flying

00:53:38.860 all over the country,

00:53:40.760 you know,

00:53:41.160 trying to figure out

00:53:42.080 where the court case

00:53:43.320 was going to be at.

00:53:44.220 I was in front of lawyers

00:53:45.540 the whole time.

00:53:47.260 Why are you a part of it?

00:53:48.580 Because I had to

00:53:49.680 give my,

00:53:51.360 The 12-second deal

00:53:53.020 that they talked about?

00:53:53.700 Testimony.

00:53:54.920 I had to call you in,

00:53:56.780 lawyers call you in

00:53:57.740 and talk to you about

00:53:58.680 what was my side

00:54:00.900 or what did I,

00:54:01.940 my side of the story.

00:54:04.060 You know,

00:54:04.320 I was flying around

00:54:05.120 city,

00:54:05.680 state to state,

00:54:06.840 you know.

00:54:07.680 Why you though?

00:54:08.640 You're the fighter.

00:54:09.260 Wouldn't that be the federal,

00:54:10.260 wouldn't that be the,

00:54:11.760 you know.

00:54:12.560 I had three law firms

00:54:13.980 I had to start

00:54:14.680 to talk to about

00:54:15.640 because they didn't know

00:54:16.200 if the court case

00:54:17.600 was going to be

00:54:18.020 in Vegas,

00:54:19.680 LA,

00:54:20.320 or New York.

00:54:21.540 So,

00:54:22.020 there were three law firms

00:54:22.980 that I had to fly around

00:54:24.040 and talk to

00:54:24.940 about what happened

00:54:26.840 during the fight

00:54:27.580 and da-da-da-da-da-da-da,

00:54:29.020 the lawyer,

00:54:29.940 the contracts,

00:54:31.160 and,

00:54:32.120 you know,

00:54:32.360 then it being held

00:54:33.280 in New York,

00:54:34.460 you know,

00:54:34.900 it became very sad

00:54:36.380 and depressing.

00:54:37.360 Because it's all the way

00:54:38.100 to your fight

00:54:38.700 with Holyfield.

00:54:39.000 Yeah,

00:54:39.040 then it was like,

00:54:40.120 you know,

00:54:40.600 six,

00:54:41.160 eight weeks,

00:54:41.800 eight weeks,

00:54:42.380 ten weeks before

00:54:43.040 the Holyfield fight,

00:54:44.800 we settle out of court

00:54:46.360 and then it was like,

00:54:47.440 go right into training

00:54:48.360 and prepare

00:54:49.180 the defendant title.

00:54:50.320 You got paid,

00:54:50.880 you got a good payday

00:54:51.640 with the Holyfield fight.

00:54:52.820 that was pitiful

00:54:53.700 because it should have

00:54:55.040 been a lot more

00:54:55.620 payday.

00:54:56.200 You think it should have

00:54:56.840 been more than that number?

00:54:58.020 Well,

00:54:58.200 I'm just saying,

00:54:59.020 legitimately.

00:54:59.880 Continuously or?

00:55:00.600 Yeah,

00:55:00.900 if I'd have been,

00:55:01.740 if I'd have did it

00:55:02.400 like normal,

00:55:03.920 where you take a little

00:55:05.120 two or three month

00:55:05.900 vacation and then

00:55:07.360 prepare for your next

00:55:08.380 fight like any other

00:55:09.640 time.

00:55:10.620 But mine was nothing

00:55:11.420 like that because

00:55:12.140 I was in front of

00:55:13.540 the lawyer.

00:55:13.760 I had to fight

00:55:14.400 just to be called

00:55:16.440 the heavyweight champion

00:55:17.280 of the world

00:55:17.860 because Don King

00:55:19.180 was coming at me

00:55:19.980 with guns blazing.

00:55:21.440 How do you feel

00:55:22.160 about Don King today?

00:55:23.100 Like when you think

00:55:23.580 about Don King,

00:55:24.100 what do you think

00:55:24.480 about it?

00:55:24.820 What word comes

00:55:25.480 to mind with Don?

00:55:26.420 You know,

00:55:27.020 just,

00:55:27.460 you know,

00:55:28.620 just not too good.

00:55:29.880 It's not too good

00:55:30.720 because of how

00:55:31.640 everything came,

00:55:33.180 fell apart at the end

00:55:34.080 after I never

00:55:35.500 got a moment's rest

00:55:36.660 after I had to

00:55:38.320 defend the title,

00:55:39.260 I had to defend the title

00:55:40.240 to be called

00:55:41.580 the heavyweight champion.

00:55:43.260 You know,

00:55:43.520 because he made

00:55:44.200 such a big fuss

00:55:45.080 about it.

00:55:47.360 Does he have

00:55:48.020 any allies today?

00:55:48.880 Like,

00:55:49.060 I mean,

00:55:49.260 in the boxing world,

00:55:50.380 people like you,

00:55:51.440 does Don,

00:55:52.560 does anybody

00:55:53.260 like Don King?

00:55:54.540 I don't know.

00:55:55.400 I couldn't tell you.

00:55:56.220 Yeah,

00:55:56.440 it's interesting to see

00:55:57.320 because you hear

00:55:57.780 a lot of guys

00:55:58.280 tell their stories

00:55:59.040 and it's like

00:56:00.280 consistent.

00:56:01.000 It's not good.

00:56:01.460 No,

00:56:01.780 not when it comes

00:56:02.440 on to dealings

00:56:03.000 with him.

00:56:03.420 It's on a bad note,

00:56:04.160 yeah.

00:56:04.640 And he made

00:56:05.140 a few hundred million

00:56:06.120 dollars off of fighters.

00:56:07.220 A lot he made

00:56:07.740 obviously off of

00:56:08.600 Tyson,

00:56:10.160 but he made

00:56:10.800 money off

00:56:12.000 these different fights.

00:56:13.020 Yeah,

00:56:13.160 I know he got paid

00:56:13.640 $24 million

00:56:14.320 off the fight

00:56:16.120 with Holyfield

00:56:16.800 and then right

00:56:17.780 after that

00:56:18.360 you had some,

00:56:19.720 your health,

00:56:21.640 was that the whole

00:56:22.300 issue?

00:56:23.280 Yeah,

00:56:23.480 I said I got

00:56:24.220 depressed

00:56:25.620 and put on

00:56:26.100 a lot of weight.

00:56:27.420 Went into a

00:56:28.000 diabetic coma,

00:56:29.320 almost passed

00:56:30.460 and had to get

00:56:31.680 through that

00:56:32.260 and then I

00:56:34.000 got back on my feet

00:56:35.380 and came back

00:56:36.060 and started fighting

00:56:36.720 again.

00:56:37.740 And my real

00:56:38.180 little reason for that

00:56:39.080 was just to get

00:56:39.700 back healthy.

00:56:41.300 You know,

00:56:41.620 it's been good

00:56:42.160 ever since.

00:56:43.100 But you did win

00:56:44.020 a few again.

00:56:44.900 You went and won

00:56:45.620 six out of eight

00:56:46.560 or six,

00:56:46.980 I don't know

00:56:47.260 what it was.

00:56:47.840 Six fights.

00:56:48.820 Six fights,

00:56:49.500 yeah.

00:56:49.640 Winning streak.

00:56:50.480 So,

00:56:50.900 six fight winning streak.

00:56:52.200 And today

00:56:53.020 you're going back

00:56:53.880 to,

00:56:54.380 you know,

00:56:54.740 you're coaching

00:56:55.260 these kids,

00:56:55.960 you're working

00:56:56.320 with these kids

00:56:56.940 on the boxing side.

00:56:57.960 Is there,

00:56:58.400 are we anytime soon

00:56:59.760 going to see a movie

00:57:00.640 of James Buster

00:57:01.800 Douglas' story?

00:57:02.880 I hope so.

00:57:03.580 Hope so.

00:57:04.240 It's in the works now.

00:57:05.820 I mean,

00:57:06.060 you look at

00:57:06.520 Cinderella, man.

00:57:07.480 That's a movie.

00:57:08.220 That was a great movie.

00:57:08.940 That was a great movie.

00:57:09.840 That was a great movie.

00:57:10.840 But that's a movie.

00:57:12.520 You know,

00:57:12.940 that actually happened.

00:57:14.360 It did happen.

00:57:15.440 Right, yeah,

00:57:15.860 because it was like

00:57:16.440 heavyweight,

00:57:16.840 became a heavyweight champ.

00:57:18.260 Versus your story,

00:57:19.320 though?

00:57:19.740 I mean,

00:57:20.340 your story,

00:57:20.960 if I listen to your story,

00:57:22.380 your story's a

00:57:23.280 similar type of story.

00:57:25.020 Blockbuster.

00:57:25.840 It's a blockbuster story.

00:57:27.340 Yeah.

00:57:27.580 Somebody's got to

00:57:28.240 do your story.

00:57:29.020 Yeah.

00:57:29.560 Is there any talk?

00:57:30.260 Is there anything

00:57:30.880 in the works?

00:57:31.780 We got several things

00:57:33.560 in the works.

00:57:34.480 And,

00:57:34.500 like,

00:57:35.840 hopefully it's going

00:57:36.660 to happen here

00:57:37.200 in the very near future.

00:57:38.540 I'm excited about the future.

00:57:40.100 That's exciting.

00:57:40.660 James,

00:57:41.040 where can people find you?

00:57:42.240 Are you active on,

00:57:43.500 I don't know if you're

00:57:44.360 an active on social media guy.

00:57:45.880 Are you posting stuff

00:57:47.360 on Instagram,

00:57:48.100 Twitter,

00:57:48.620 Facebook,

00:57:49.220 anything?

00:57:49.900 Nah,

00:57:50.380 not really.

00:57:51.260 You're low-key.

00:57:52.080 Just low-key.

00:57:53.120 We got to get you

00:57:53.720 on Twitter and Instagram.

00:57:55.180 We got to get you

00:57:55.860 on Twitter and Instagram

00:57:56.580 so people can start

00:57:57.560 hearing the stories.

00:57:58.680 Yeah,

00:57:58.940 that'd be cool.

00:57:59.600 Yeah,

00:57:59.780 I think

00:58:00.220 it would bring back

00:58:03.040 a lot of the stories

00:58:03.820 because I bet

00:58:04.240 a lot more people

00:58:05.740 know you

00:58:07.040 and your story

00:58:07.900 and they remember

00:58:09.100 what you did

00:58:09.800 than you even know.

00:58:10.820 Oh, yeah.

00:58:11.580 I get fan mail

00:58:13.180 and stuff.

00:58:13.940 Still till today.

00:58:14.920 Yeah.

00:58:16.020 And that's pretty exciting.

00:58:17.020 I enjoy getting that.

00:58:18.600 Anybody that's,

00:58:19.460 I relate to you,

00:58:20.320 anybody that's an underdog

00:58:21.520 that's coming up,

00:58:22.420 you know,

00:58:22.600 you want to hear

00:58:23.080 other stories of underdogs

00:58:24.160 that overcame the odds

00:58:25.060 and 42 to 1,

00:58:26.920 it doesn't get bigger

00:58:27.880 than Dan.

00:58:28.400 Right.

00:58:29.300 So,

00:58:29.920 brother-

00:58:30.240 I really enjoyed

00:58:30.760 doing that too,

00:58:31.500 that 42 to 1 on ESPN.

00:58:33.060 Yeah,

00:58:33.260 how was that for you?

00:58:33.840 That was great,

00:58:34.560 man.

00:58:34.820 We had a good time.

00:58:35.800 Went back to Tokyo

00:58:36.660 and that was my first time

00:58:38.380 since the fight.

00:58:39.560 You know,

00:58:39.760 it was awesome,

00:58:40.600 man.

00:58:40.820 You know,

00:58:41.160 they done built it up

00:58:42.280 even more.

00:58:43.400 Sure.

00:58:43.480 Where when I fought in 90,

00:58:45.600 it was just a Tokyo dome

00:58:46.960 out there.

00:58:47.660 And then it was,

00:58:48.180 now when I went back,

00:58:49.720 you know,

00:58:50.060 last couple years ago,

00:58:52.080 they got a music park

00:58:53.660 out there

00:58:54.120 and a caluminium site

00:58:55.560 out there.

00:58:56.120 It's like,

00:58:56.600 filled in now.

00:58:57.880 Did you see anybody there

00:58:59.380 that was there at the fight

00:59:00.680 that talked to you?

00:59:01.460 Like,

00:59:01.620 was there any kind

00:59:02.280 of reminiscing moments

00:59:03.340 or no?

00:59:04.060 No.

00:59:04.800 Just walking around,

00:59:06.080 seeing where,

00:59:06.840 just imagining

00:59:07.500 where things were

00:59:08.300 reminiscing.

00:59:08.840 That's cool.

00:59:09.760 But it was a great trip.

00:59:10.700 They did a great job

00:59:11.320 with the documentary.

00:59:11.800 They did.

00:59:12.260 They did a great job.

00:59:12.780 Phenomenal job.

00:59:13.420 I was really impressed with it.

00:59:14.420 Very good job.

00:59:15.380 Yeah,

00:59:15.580 when I watched it,

00:59:16.260 I said,

00:59:16.520 you know what,

00:59:17.880 the footage they brought

00:59:19.880 and they caught

00:59:20.620 from the past

00:59:21.540 and stuff,

00:59:22.040 the way they put it together,

00:59:23.160 it kind of brought

00:59:25.520 the whole story together.

00:59:26.860 It's called 42 to 1,

00:59:28.200 right?

00:59:28.440 42 to 1.

00:59:29.020 42 to 1.

00:59:30.100 Correct.

00:59:30.260 Well, Champ,

00:59:31.380 appreciate you coming out,

00:59:33.300 man.

00:59:33.400 I really enjoy spending

00:59:34.320 this time with you,

00:59:35.660 man.

00:59:35.700 Thanks for having me,

00:59:36.460 man.

00:59:36.480 Yes,

00:59:36.740 definitely.

00:59:37.060 Thank you.

00:59:37.820 It's been a pleasure.

00:59:38.320 Pleasure's all mine.

00:59:39.240 Thanks, everybody,

00:59:39.960 for listening.

00:59:40.480 And by the way,

00:59:40.920 if you haven't already

00:59:41.560 subscribed to

00:59:42.240 Valuetainment on iTunes,

00:59:43.840 please do so.

00:59:45.100 Give us a five-star.

00:59:46.400 Write a review

00:59:47.060 if you haven't already.

00:59:48.000 And if you have any

00:59:48.540 questions for me

00:59:49.480 that you may have,

00:59:50.180 you can always find me

00:59:51.100 on Snapchat,

00:59:52.060 Instagram,

00:59:52.820 Facebook,

00:59:53.360 or YouTube.

00:59:54.040 Just search my name,

00:59:54.920 Patrick VidDavid.

00:59:55.780 And I actually do

00:59:57.040 respond back

00:59:57.900 when you snap me

00:59:58.780 or send me a message

00:59:59.900 on Instagram.

01:00:00.920 With that being said,

01:00:01.580 have a great day today.

01:00:02.680 Take care, everybody.

01:00:03.380 Bye-bye.

Valuetainment - September 30, 2019

Episode 373： Why Mike Tyson Lost to Buster Douglas - Untold Stories

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