Verdict with Ted Cruz - A Look Inside Elon Musk's Vision： Complete Interview

00:00:00.000 This is an iHeart Podcast.

00:00:02.620 Guaranteed human.

00:00:04.160 Well, first off, welcome.

00:00:06.020 It is Verdict with Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you.

00:00:08.600 Happy New Year, Senator, to you as well and to everyone listening right now.

00:00:13.420 And we've got a really fun show that we're going to do today on New Year's.

00:00:17.380 And it deals with waste, fraud, and abuse that we talked about

00:00:20.200 that's now becoming a reality in Minnesota months ago

00:00:23.120 with your good friend Elon Musk.

00:00:26.020 Well, Happy New Year to everyone.

00:00:27.740 I hope you had a fantastic New Year's Eve.

00:00:29.520 I hope you stayed safe.

00:00:30.700 I hope you enjoyed time with your family.

00:00:32.640 You celebrated.

00:00:33.820 I hope you're ready now for an incredible 2026.

00:00:37.220 I hope that you accomplish something that really makes a difference,

00:00:39.960 that you make a difference in the lives of those around you.

00:00:43.540 You make a difference in the lives of your kids and your community.

00:00:46.620 And you make a real impact fighting for our country.

00:00:50.300 Our country is at a pivotal time.

00:00:52.560 And I hope 2026 is a time where you stand up and say,

00:00:55.720 I am going to stand up and defend our nation like so many patriots

00:00:59.180 who have preceded me.

00:01:00.400 On this New Year's Day, we're going to play one of my favorite podcasts

00:01:04.360 that Ben and I ever did.

00:01:06.060 And this was last year, last summer.

00:01:08.480 We interviewed Elon Musk.

00:01:09.780 Elon Musk is a good friend of mine.

00:01:11.260 We sat down with him for an hour in the White House,

00:01:14.520 talking to him about Doge and what he was doing with President Trump,

00:01:18.300 but also talking to him personally about who he is,

00:01:21.940 about how he built Tesla, how he built SpaceX.

00:01:25.100 We talked to him about AI and killer robots.

00:01:28.260 And it's a fascinating show.

00:01:30.180 And we present it to you right now in its entirety.

00:01:33.560 Make sure you download it wherever you get your podcasts.

00:01:36.820 It's a great episode.

00:01:37.940 It's out right now.

00:01:39.480 Verdict with Ted Cruz, wherever you get your podcasts.

00:01:41.700 Well, we're in the White House right now,

00:01:44.280 and we're here with my friend Elon Musk,

00:01:46.560 who really has not been doing much of anything,

00:01:49.100 has not made any news,

00:01:50.640 and nobody has noticed the impact.

00:01:54.580 Welcome, Elon.

00:01:55.520 Thank you.

00:01:55.920 Holy crap.

00:01:57.340 Yes, wow.

00:01:58.440 Let me just say...

00:02:00.640 Never a dull moment.

00:02:01.560 Never a dull moment.

00:02:02.860 The first 50 days the president has spent in office,

00:02:06.560 over the top,

00:02:07.400 and the first 50 days you've spent,

00:02:10.160 I don't think there's ever been anyone

00:02:11.680 to have an impact the way you have in the beginning.

00:02:14.560 Let me start with a question you know a lot about.

00:02:17.640 Which was worse,

00:02:18.800 the mess you found at Twitter

00:02:20.160 or the mess you found in the federal government?

00:02:23.380 Well, it's hard to compete with the federal government.

00:02:26.080 What surprised you about the federal government?

00:02:27.920 I assume you came in and assumed it was bad.

00:02:30.380 Is it worse than you expected?

00:02:32.780 It is worse than I expected,

00:02:34.900 but on the plus side,

00:02:36.100 that means there's more opportunity for improvement.

00:02:38.920 So, if you look on the bright side,

00:02:41.960 there's actually a lot of opportunity for improvement

00:02:44.340 in federal government expenditures

00:02:45.900 because it's so bad.

00:02:48.200 If it was a well-run ship,

00:02:49.920 it would be very difficult to improve.

00:02:52.340 So now it's like,

00:02:53.480 people say,

00:02:54.000 well, how will you figure out

00:02:55.640 how to save money in the federal government?

00:02:57.040 Well, it's like being in a room

00:02:58.140 where the walls, the roof, and the floor

00:02:59.960 are all targets.

00:03:02.640 You should in any direction,

00:03:04.140 you can't win.

00:03:04.680 Again, I'm sure you would agree.

00:03:08.640 So, a lot of folks have talked about like,

00:03:11.640 you can't win.

00:03:12.380 You can't win.

00:03:12.920 You can't win.

00:03:13.920 This is going in any direction.

00:03:16.400 A lot of the crazy expenditures,

00:03:18.320 things like,

00:03:18.900 like two million bucks

00:03:19.980 for sex change surgeries in Guatemala.

00:03:22.060 An essential.

00:03:23.980 You know, transgendered mice

00:03:26.700 and Sesame Street in Iraq.

00:03:29.180 A lot of that has gotten attention,

00:03:30.580 but some of the stuff you've told me about,

00:03:32.140 like, tell us about computer licenses

00:03:35.380 and government agencies.

00:03:37.100 So, most of what Doge is finding,

00:03:38.860 you don't need to be Sherlock Holmes.

00:03:40.420 It's very obvious, basic stuff.

00:03:43.160 So, in every government department,

00:03:45.860 I say every because we've not yet found

00:03:47.500 a single exception,

00:03:48.900 there are far too many software licenses

00:03:51.240 and media subscriptions,

00:03:54.420 meaning many more software licenses

00:03:56.680 and media subscriptions

00:03:57.760 than there are humans in the department.

00:03:59.280 Like you were saying,

00:04:00.660 like an agency with 15,000 people

00:04:02.300 might have 30,000 licenses.

00:04:04.020 Yes.

00:04:05.440 And even of the 15,000 employees,

00:04:07.900 a good chunk of them

00:04:08.620 hadn't used the license,

00:04:09.720 had never logged on

00:04:10.920 or used the application.

00:04:13.320 Yes.

00:04:14.100 We found entire situations

00:04:16.420 of software licenses

00:04:18.060 or media subscriptions

00:04:19.300 where there were zero logins.

00:04:21.980 Wow.

00:04:22.120 So, it had that.

00:04:22.880 And yet we were paying for it.

00:04:24.080 Yes.

00:04:24.400 So, the government was paying

00:04:25.140 for thousands of licenses

00:04:26.140 of software

00:04:27.340 or media subscriptions

00:04:29.020 and no one had ever logged in

00:04:30.780 even once.

00:04:32.040 Or like credit cards.

00:04:32.900 You found the same thing

00:04:33.680 with government credit cards.

00:04:34.880 We found that there are

00:04:35.900 twice as many credit cards

00:04:37.180 as there are humans.

00:04:38.840 Could you do that just to say?

00:04:39.860 And I still don't have

00:04:40.520 a good explanation

00:04:41.140 for why this is the case.

00:04:42.640 And these are $10,000 limit cards.

00:04:45.380 So, it's a lot of money.

00:04:47.100 Is it incompetence

00:04:48.320 that you're finding

00:04:49.060 or is this like

00:04:49.980 the biggest money laundering scheme

00:04:51.840 in the history of the world

00:04:52.960 that you're finding?

00:04:54.560 Look, I think it's mostly

00:04:55.820 if you say,

00:04:57.260 look, what's the waste

00:04:58.080 to fraud ratio?

00:04:59.500 Yeah.

00:04:59.680 In my opinion,

00:05:01.080 it's like 80% waste,

00:05:03.060 20% fraud.

00:05:04.280 But you do have

00:05:05.500 these sort of gray areas.

00:05:07.720 Yeah.

00:05:08.300 Example.

00:05:09.080 Example would be

00:05:09.840 so,

00:05:11.360 we saw a lot of payments

00:05:12.860 going out of treasury

00:05:14.140 that had no payment code

00:05:17.100 and no explanation

00:05:17.920 for the payment.

00:05:19.140 And then we're trying

00:05:21.060 to figure out

00:05:22.060 what that payment is

00:05:22.820 and we'd see that,

00:05:23.960 okay, that contract

00:05:24.820 was supposed to be shut off

00:05:26.160 but someone forgot

00:05:27.860 to shut off that contract

00:05:29.360 and so the company

00:05:30.540 kept getting money.

00:05:32.380 Wow.

00:05:33.080 Now, is that waste or fraud?

00:05:36.080 Both.

00:05:36.700 Both?

00:05:37.340 Yeah.

00:05:37.780 Yeah.

00:05:38.040 I mean, both.

00:05:38.560 It's sort of a gray area.

00:05:39.660 You're getting something

00:05:40.080 you're not supposed to get.

00:05:41.720 You're not supposed to get it

00:05:42.920 but the government

00:05:44.240 sent it to you

00:05:45.080 and nobody from the government

00:05:46.200 asked for it back.

00:05:47.940 Take, for example,

00:05:48.780 the $1.9 billion

00:05:50.260 given to Stacey Abrams

00:05:51.620 Yeah.

00:05:52.540 fake NGO.

00:05:53.440 Utter insanity.

00:05:54.800 Explain that

00:05:55.300 from the story.

00:05:56.780 That's corrupt.

00:05:58.400 That's just corrupt, I think.

00:05:59.780 That's paying off cronies

00:06:00.900 at that point.

00:06:01.580 1,000%.

00:06:02.140 Yeah, yeah.

00:06:03.080 And by the way, she knew.

00:06:04.500 Like, when you get $2 billion

00:06:05.520 you don't miss that.

00:06:06.900 That's not...

00:06:07.580 It's not an accident.

00:06:09.280 Allegedly, it was for like

00:06:10.720 environmentally friendly appliances

00:06:13.260 or something

00:06:13.720 and they've given like

00:06:15.360 100 appliances so far

00:06:17.120 for $2 billion.

00:06:18.460 It's a very expensive

00:06:19.200 toaster.

00:06:19.840 It's really nice.

00:06:20.700 It's one hell of an appliance.

00:06:21.940 That's some zero fridge.

00:06:23.280 Boy, it's nice.

00:06:24.240 Right.

00:06:24.440 This is obviously

00:06:25.480 one of the biggest

00:06:26.840 scam fraud holes

00:06:28.260 we've uncovered

00:06:28.980 which is really crazy

00:06:30.260 is

00:06:30.780 is that

00:06:32.340 the government

00:06:34.160 can give money

00:06:34.720 to a so-called

00:06:36.000 non-profit

00:06:36.700 with very few controls

00:06:39.220 and then that

00:06:40.000 and there's no auditing

00:06:41.480 subsequently

00:06:41.940 of that non-profit.

00:06:44.040 So there's no...

00:06:45.000 So this is where

00:06:45.600 with the, you know,

00:06:46.620 1.9 billion

00:06:47.180 to Stacey Abrams

00:06:47.780 who's...

00:06:49.420 They then give themselves

00:06:50.460 extremely lavish

00:06:51.420 like insane salaries

00:06:52.720 expense everything

00:06:54.520 to the non-profit

00:06:55.940 you know,

00:06:57.460 buy jets

00:06:58.160 and homes

00:06:58.860 and all sorts of things.

00:07:00.160 Live like

00:07:00.760 kings and queens.

00:07:01.480 Yes.

00:07:01.940 On the taxpayer dime.

00:07:03.000 Correct.

00:07:03.720 You mentioned...

00:07:04.820 And this is happening

00:07:05.080 at scale.

00:07:05.860 It's not just one or two.

00:07:07.100 We're seeing this everywhere.

00:07:08.540 Now, one of the things

00:07:09.340 you told me about

00:07:10.140 is what you called

00:07:11.640 magic money computers

00:07:13.780 at the current rate.

00:07:15.440 So tell us about it

00:07:16.500 because I never heard of that

00:07:17.240 until you brought that up.

00:07:18.760 Okay, so

00:07:19.340 you may think

00:07:20.580 that these

00:07:20.920 that the government computers

00:07:22.700 like all talk to each other.

00:07:24.740 They synchronize.

00:07:25.800 They add up

00:07:26.780 what funds are going somewhere

00:07:27.940 and it's

00:07:28.600 you know

00:07:29.820 it's coherent

00:07:31.480 that the

00:07:32.620 you know

00:07:33.100 there's

00:07:33.640 and that

00:07:34.740 and that the numbers

00:07:35.380 for example

00:07:35.820 that you're presented

00:07:36.400 as a senator

00:07:37.080 Yeah.

00:07:37.660 are actually

00:07:38.580 the real numbers.

00:07:39.900 One would think.

00:07:40.860 One would think.

00:07:41.400 They're not.

00:07:42.140 Yeah.

00:07:42.320 Okay.

00:07:44.840 I mean

00:07:45.320 they're not totally wrong

00:07:46.060 but they're probably

00:07:46.720 off by 5%

00:07:47.700 or 10%

00:07:48.320 in some cases.

00:07:50.280 So

00:07:50.680 I call a magic money computer

00:07:52.220 any computer

00:07:52.720 which can just make money

00:07:53.740 out of thin air.

00:07:55.320 That's magic money.

00:07:56.360 So how does that work?

00:07:57.580 It just issues payments.

00:07:59.940 And you said

00:08:00.380 there's something like

00:08:01.000 11 of these computers

00:08:02.400 at Treasury

00:08:02.960 that are sending out

00:08:04.120 trillions in payments?

00:08:05.760 They're mostly at Treasury.

00:08:07.320 Some are

00:08:07.840 with some

00:08:08.580 at HHS

00:08:10.460 some at

00:08:11.360 there's one

00:08:12.000 at one or two at State

00:08:13.200 there's some

00:08:14.500 at DOD.

00:08:16.100 I think we found now

00:08:16.900 14 magic money computers.

00:08:19.840 14, okay.

00:08:20.560 They just send money

00:08:21.580 out of

00:08:22.300 nothing.

00:08:23.760 You have an ability

00:08:24.760 to see

00:08:25.540 where leverage points

00:08:26.920 are

00:08:27.480 and

00:08:28.640 how things

00:08:29.940 actually happen.

00:08:30.900 So I remember back

00:08:31.780 I think it was September

00:08:32.440 or October of this year

00:08:33.580 before the election

00:08:34.760 we didn't know

00:08:35.180 who was going to win

00:08:35.820 and I was at your house

00:08:36.940 in Austin

00:08:37.640 we were talking about it

00:08:38.540 and you said

00:08:39.560 you said

00:08:41.000 look

00:08:41.180 I don't want a job

00:08:42.320 in Washington

00:08:43.120 and you said

00:08:43.660 all I want

00:08:44.200 is the login

00:08:44.700 for every computer.

00:08:46.320 And I remember

00:08:47.060 thinking at the time

00:08:47.840 that sounded kind of weird

00:08:48.820 like I just didn't get it

00:08:50.060 and I have to say

00:08:51.520 what's interesting

00:08:52.640 on this

00:08:53.480 if I would have thought

00:08:56.160 like okay

00:08:56.800 how do you reform government

00:08:58.140 like sort of the traditional

00:08:59.200 way to think about it

00:09:00.080 is okay

00:09:00.440 give me an org chart

00:09:01.340 let me sit down

00:09:02.200 with the people

00:09:02.560 who are running agencies

00:09:03.560 and what you saw

00:09:06.040 immediately

00:09:06.560 is to understand

00:09:07.480 what's really going on

00:09:08.840 get to the payment systems

00:09:10.300 get to the computers

00:09:11.480 yeah

00:09:11.940 like

00:09:12.640 why are

00:09:14.580 why is getting

00:09:15.900 to the computers

00:09:16.740 so critical

00:09:17.460 to understanding

00:09:18.300 what's actually happening?

00:09:20.620 Well the government

00:09:21.020 is run

00:09:21.460 by computers

00:09:22.300 so you've got

00:09:23.700 essentially

00:09:25.260 several hundred computers

00:09:26.720 that effectively

00:09:27.380 run the government

00:09:28.140 and if you want to know

00:09:30.000 did you know that Ben?

00:09:31.160 No

00:09:31.380 like

00:09:31.760 yeah

00:09:32.440 so when somebody

00:09:33.500 like even when the president

00:09:35.020 issues an executive order

00:09:36.040 that's going to go through

00:09:36.840 a whole bunch of people

00:09:37.580 until ultimately

00:09:38.280 it is implemented

00:09:38.940 at a computer somewhere

00:09:39.820 and if you want to know

00:09:41.980 what the situation is

00:09:43.420 with the accounting

00:09:44.540 and you're trying to reconcile

00:09:45.240 accounting

00:09:45.700 and get rid of waste

00:09:46.540 and fraud

00:09:46.880 you must be able

00:09:47.900 to analyze the computer databases

00:09:49.300 otherwise you can't

00:09:50.420 figure it out

00:09:50.880 because all you're doing

00:09:52.640 is asking a human

00:09:53.480 who will then

00:09:54.560 ask another human

00:09:55.940 ask another human

00:09:56.600 and finally

00:09:57.080 usually ask

00:09:57.740 some contractor

00:09:58.780 who will ask another contractor

00:10:00.100 to do a query

00:10:01.040 on the computer

00:10:01.660 wow

00:10:03.020 that's how it actually works

00:10:04.640 so it's many layers deep

00:10:06.300 so the only way

00:10:07.980 to reconcile

00:10:08.420 the databases

00:10:09.100 and get rid of waste

00:10:09.760 and fraud

00:10:10.120 is to

00:10:10.940 to actually look

00:10:12.780 at the computers

00:10:13.200 and see what's going on

00:10:14.680 so you

00:10:15.140 that's what I call

00:10:16.220 that's

00:10:17.100 like

00:10:17.620 that's what I

00:10:18.900 when I sort of

00:10:20.280 cryptically refer to

00:10:21.200 reprogramming the matrix

00:10:22.280 you have to understand

00:10:23.480 what's going on

00:10:23.940 at the computers

00:10:24.340 you have to reconcile

00:10:25.080 the computer databases

00:10:25.960 in order to identify

00:10:27.540 the waste and fraud

00:10:28.160 I don't know

00:10:29.700 that there was

00:10:30.380 anyone

00:10:31.240 in congress

00:10:32.660 who understood

00:10:34.620 certainly myself included

00:10:35.780 who understood

00:10:36.320 the leverage

00:10:37.360 that comes

00:10:38.860 from the computer

00:10:39.860 and the data

00:10:40.740 in particular

00:10:41.520 that congress

00:10:43.000 would think about

00:10:43.780 give me a report

00:10:44.600 on what your expenditures are

00:10:45.900 rather than actually

00:10:47.580 getting into the pipes

00:10:48.720 and I think that

00:10:49.380 has been fascinating

00:10:50.560 that it's let you

00:10:52.020 uncover

00:10:52.780 a bunch of crap

00:10:53.800 that just nobody knew

00:10:55.120 yes

00:10:55.940 I mean in order

00:10:57.360 for money to go

00:10:58.080 to a bank account

00:10:58.860 it's not like

00:11:00.220 we're sending

00:11:00.600 truckloads of cash

00:11:01.540 all over the place

00:11:02.300 it's a

00:11:03.440 we're wiring money

00:11:05.000 right

00:11:05.280 we're sending money

00:11:05.880 through the ACH system

00:11:06.800 or through the SWIFT system

00:11:07.740 so in order for money

00:11:09.220 to flow

00:11:09.620 it's going to flow

00:11:10.240 electronically

00:11:10.720 so that's

00:11:11.860 that's what you need

00:11:12.360 to look at

00:11:12.700 you need to look at

00:11:13.180 the actual

00:11:14.260 electronic money flows

00:11:15.420 and Tesla

00:11:16.140 and all your companies

00:11:16.960 you have accounting

00:11:17.720 and you have

00:11:18.200 every expenditure

00:11:18.960 you have it coded

00:11:19.840 for what it's going

00:11:20.660 for

00:11:21.320 federal government

00:11:22.500 doesn't work that way

00:11:23.200 they don't code

00:11:23.680 what the money's going for

00:11:24.420 they do now

00:11:24.840 but they didn't

00:11:26.180 they didn't

00:11:27.420 and like one of the things

00:11:28.720 that you told me

00:11:29.980 you said if any company

00:11:31.080 kept its books

00:11:32.020 the way the federal

00:11:32.640 government does

00:11:33.520 they'd arrest the officers

00:11:35.200 and put them in jail

00:11:35.920 yes

00:11:36.300 if it was a public company

00:11:37.520 it would be delisted

00:11:38.160 immediately

00:11:38.640 it would fail its audit

00:11:39.700 and the officers

00:11:41.380 of the company

00:11:41.820 would be imprisoned

00:11:42.820 that's the level

00:11:43.860 of

00:11:44.840 malfeasance

00:11:45.360 in the federal government

00:11:46.180 unfortunately

00:11:46.820 it's

00:11:47.480 deliberately

00:11:48.480 or do you think

00:11:49.860 this is

00:11:50.180 incompetence again

00:11:51.120 it's 80%

00:11:52.040 it's 80%

00:11:53.160 incompetence

00:11:54.160 or

00:11:54.460 and 20% malice

00:11:55.840 if you look at

00:11:57.600 Doge now

00:11:58.420 and you look at

00:11:59.280 the government

00:11:59.700 and what you're finding

00:12:00.880 what percentage

00:12:02.440 have you guys

00:12:03.720 even gotten to

00:12:04.560 and how much

00:12:05.140 of it is

00:12:05.600 Mars

00:12:06.500 where you haven't

00:12:07.020 even gotten there yet

00:12:07.640 because there's so much

00:12:08.760 you're finding out here

00:12:10.000 I mean how many

00:12:10.640 you seem like a timeline guy

00:12:12.240 when you say

00:12:12.760 alright I want to get in there

00:12:13.440 and get all these

00:12:13.940 you know

00:12:14.520 numbers and things

00:12:15.700 how far are we

00:12:16.580 from the end game

00:12:17.400 where you've seen it all

00:12:18.980 been able to process it all

00:12:20.700 and fix it

00:12:22.660 I mean are we years away

00:12:23.800 months away

00:12:24.640 not years

00:12:26.320 I mean I'm

00:12:28.000 reasonably confident

00:12:28.660 that we'll be able to

00:12:29.740 get a trillion dollars

00:12:31.300 of waste and fraud

00:12:33.120 out

00:12:33.600 and that

00:12:35.640 meaning that

00:12:36.520 it will have

00:12:37.220 we'll have a net savings

00:12:38.980 in FY26

00:12:40.120 which starts in October

00:12:41.180 obviously

00:12:41.600 of a trillion dollars

00:12:43.900 provided we're allowed

00:12:44.900 to continue

00:12:46.320 and our progress

00:12:47.580 is not impeded

00:12:48.240 and we're very public

00:12:49.620 about what we do

00:12:50.500 yeah

00:12:50.680 you put it on the website

00:12:51.820 it's on the website

00:12:52.540 I don't know how we could

00:12:53.340 be more transparent

00:12:54.200 literally every action

00:12:56.040 we do

00:12:56.400 small or large

00:12:57.200 we put on the

00:12:57.980 doge.gov website

00:12:59.660 and we post on

00:13:01.040 the x handle

00:13:02.020 and when people

00:13:03.660 complain about it

00:13:04.460 and they say

00:13:05.580 oh you're doing

00:13:05.900 something on cost

00:13:06.420 I'm like well

00:13:07.000 which of these

00:13:08.000 cost savings

00:13:08.500 everyone knows

00:13:10.420 exactly what you're

00:13:11.100 doing

00:13:11.320 extreme transparency

00:13:12.540 I don't think

00:13:14.760 anything's been

00:13:15.580 this transparent

00:13:16.120 ever

00:13:16.440 so five years ago

00:13:18.340 you were a hero

00:13:19.780 to the left

00:13:20.500 you were cool

00:13:21.700 you had electric cars

00:13:22.920 you had space

00:13:24.020 and in five years

00:13:25.780 you've gone

00:13:26.360 I could go to a party

00:13:27.420 in Hollywood

00:13:27.800 and not get dirty looks

00:13:28.660 yeah

00:13:29.140 in fact

00:13:29.720 yeah

00:13:30.180 now you might not

00:13:31.680 even get invited

00:13:32.220 still get invited

00:13:33.480 but I don't know

00:13:34.020 if I should go

00:13:34.640 and I don't think

00:13:37.160 it's an exaggeration

00:13:38.200 to say today

00:13:39.140 after Donald Trump

00:13:41.340 the left hates you

00:13:43.360 more than any person

00:13:44.100 on earth

00:13:44.500 yes

00:13:45.340 I appear to be

00:13:46.400 number two

00:13:46.960 I mean

00:13:47.480 if you're judged

00:13:47.940 by the various signs

00:13:49.080 it's derangement

00:13:51.180 it's Trump derangement

00:13:52.680 syndrome

00:13:53.000 and Elon derangement

00:13:54.000 syndrome

00:13:54.300 how is that for you

00:13:55.660 that's a little bit

00:13:56.280 of whiplash

00:13:57.060 of going from being

00:13:58.420 like Mr. Cool

00:14:00.280 to the devil incarnate

00:14:01.780 in just a couple of years

00:14:03.060 is that

00:14:03.440 is that kind of weird

00:14:04.260 to experience

00:14:04.880 that transformation

00:14:05.560 yes

00:14:06.280 why do they hate you

00:14:08.100 so much

00:14:08.580 well

00:14:09.600 because we're

00:14:10.720 we're clearly

00:14:11.760 over the target

00:14:12.420 if those was ineffective

00:14:14.620 if we were not

00:14:15.580 actually getting rid

00:14:16.420 of a bunch

00:14:17.520 of wasting fraud

00:14:18.140 and a bunch

00:14:18.840 of that fraud

00:14:19.360 I mean

00:14:21.500 the fraud

00:14:21.800 we're seeing

00:14:22.400 is overwhelmingly

00:14:23.560 on the left

00:14:25.240 I mean

00:14:26.260 it's not zero

00:14:27.460 on the right

00:14:27.980 but these NGOs

00:14:29.840 are almost all

00:14:30.920 left wing NGOs

00:14:31.960 that are being funded

00:14:32.640 for example

00:14:33.160 yep

00:14:33.460 so

00:14:34.940 they hate me

00:14:36.900 because Doge

00:14:37.700 is being effective

00:14:38.480 and Doge

00:14:40.180 is getting rid

00:14:40.980 of a lot of

00:14:42.000 wasting fraud

00:14:43.040 that they were

00:14:43.520 that people on the left

00:14:44.900 were taking advantage of

00:14:45.900 that's what it comes out of

00:14:47.740 and the single biggest thing

00:14:49.740 that they're

00:14:50.200 that they're worried about

00:14:51.720 is that Doge

00:14:54.880 is going to turn off

00:14:56.340 fraudulent payments

00:14:57.520 of entitlements

00:14:58.520 I mean everything

00:14:59.500 from social security

00:15:00.620 medicare

00:15:01.240 you know

00:15:02.580 unemployment

00:15:03.200 disability

00:15:04.740 small business

00:15:06.120 administration loans

00:15:07.460 turn them off

00:15:08.500 to illegals

00:15:10.020 this is the

00:15:11.860 crux of the matter

00:15:12.560 yep

00:15:13.160 okay this is

00:15:13.860 this is the

00:15:14.540 this is the thing

00:15:15.880 that why they really

00:15:17.100 hit my guts

00:15:17.540 and want me to die

00:15:18.120 and do you think

00:15:20.000 that's billions

00:15:20.740 hundreds of billions

00:15:21.880 what do you think

00:15:22.280 the scale is of that

00:15:23.340 I think

00:15:24.140 across the country

00:15:25.040 it's in

00:15:25.640 it's well worth

00:15:26.420 of 100 billion

00:15:27.000 maybe 200 billion

00:15:28.160 so

00:15:29.960 by

00:15:32.380 by using

00:15:33.200 entitlements fraud

00:15:34.160 the Democrats

00:15:35.080 have been able to

00:15:36.000 attract

00:15:36.920 and retain

00:15:38.120 vast numbers

00:15:39.380 of

00:15:40.040 illegal immigrants

00:15:41.140 and

00:15:41.880 and by voters

00:15:42.700 and

00:15:43.240 and by

00:15:44.120 voters

00:15:44.780 exactly

00:15:45.280 the

00:15:45.820 basically

00:15:46.860 bring in

00:15:47.900 I don't know

00:15:48.880 10-20 million

00:15:49.740 people

00:15:50.820 who are beholden

00:15:52.160 to the Democrats

00:15:52.980 for government

00:15:54.020 handouts

00:15:54.500 and will vote

00:15:56.000 overwhelmingly Democrat

00:15:57.080 as has been

00:15:58.060 demonstrated in

00:15:58.620 California

00:15:59.000 this is

00:16:00.000 it's an election

00:16:01.560 strategy

00:16:02.000 yes

00:16:02.720 it's power

00:16:03.280 yes

00:16:03.860 and and it

00:16:04.660 doesn't take much

00:16:05.340 to turn the swing

00:16:06.020 states blue

00:16:06.640 I mean often

00:16:07.500 a swing state

00:16:08.080 might be won

00:16:08.720 by 10-20 thousand

00:16:09.860 votes

00:16:10.220 sure

00:16:10.460 so if the Dems

00:16:11.620 can bring in

00:16:12.140 200,000

00:16:13.140 illegals

00:16:13.800 and over time

00:16:14.560 get them

00:16:15.260 legalized

00:16:16.200 not counting

00:16:17.320 any cheating

00:16:17.780 that takes place

00:16:18.380 because there is

00:16:18.820 some cheating

00:16:19.260 but even without

00:16:20.560 cheating

00:16:20.960 if you

00:16:21.980 if you

00:16:22.280 if you

00:16:23.420 bring in

00:16:24.040 illegals

00:16:24.360 that are

00:16:24.640 10x

00:16:25.020 the voter

00:16:25.760 differential

00:16:26.220 in a swing

00:16:27.020 state

00:16:27.300 it will no

00:16:28.140 longer be

00:16:28.540 a swing

00:16:28.820 state

00:16:29.080 right

00:16:29.320 and the

00:16:30.780 Dems will

00:16:31.460 win all

00:16:31.900 the swing

00:16:32.180 states

00:16:32.520 just a matter

00:16:33.000 of time

00:16:33.380 and

00:16:35.220 America

00:16:35.880 will be

00:16:36.260 permanent

00:16:37.020 deep blue

00:16:38.000 socialist

00:16:38.340 state

00:16:38.820 the House

00:16:41.060 the Senate

00:16:41.700 yep

00:16:42.080 the presidency

00:16:43.400 and the

00:16:43.940 Supreme Court

00:16:44.340 will all go

00:16:45.160 hardcore Dem

00:16:46.040 they will

00:16:46.900 then further

00:16:47.260 cement that

00:16:47.900 by bringing

00:16:49.340 in even

00:16:49.780 more aliens

00:16:50.520 so you

00:16:50.840 can't vote

00:16:51.860 your way

00:16:52.140 out of it

00:16:53.600 their objective

00:16:54.740 is to make

00:16:55.240 it permanent

00:16:55.540 one party

00:16:55.860 socialist state

00:16:56.600 and it'll be

00:16:57.360 much worse

00:16:57.760 than California

00:16:58.240 because at least

00:16:58.720 California is

00:16:59.240 mitigated by

00:16:59.900 the fact that

00:17:00.580 someone can

00:17:00.920 leave California

00:17:01.400 you can go

00:17:01.820 to Texas

00:17:02.200 yeah

00:17:02.640 exactly

00:17:03.240 but they're

00:17:04.640 going to make

00:17:04.900 everywhere

00:17:05.500 California a bit

00:17:06.340 worse

00:17:06.600 by the way

00:17:07.040 the middle

00:17:07.360 of the pandemic

00:17:08.000 I spent

00:17:08.960 45 minutes

00:17:09.720 on the phone

00:17:10.240 with Elon

00:17:10.660 he was still

00:17:11.440 in California

00:17:12.060 I was walking

00:17:13.140 my dog

00:17:13.620 Snowflake

00:17:14.260 and trying

00:17:15.240 to convince

00:17:15.740 you

00:17:15.880 come to

00:17:16.360 Texas

00:17:16.840 the commies

00:17:17.780 in California

00:17:18.420 can't stand

00:17:19.120 you

00:17:19.360 we love

00:17:20.300 you

00:17:20.440 we want

00:17:20.900 you here

00:17:21.260 and you

00:17:21.720 didn't quite

00:17:22.160 go then

00:17:22.560 but you

00:17:22.820 went not

00:17:23.180 that long

00:17:23.720 afterwards

00:17:24.320 I mean

00:17:25.140 the COVID

00:17:26.040 actions

00:17:26.500 almost killed

00:17:28.020 Tesla

00:17:28.340 because

00:17:29.440 every other

00:17:31.120 auto plant

00:17:31.640 in the country

00:17:32.120 was allowed

00:17:32.460 to open

00:17:32.840 but ours

00:17:33.780 which was

00:17:34.640 in California

00:17:35.240 was not

00:17:35.800 allowed to open

00:17:36.280 wow

00:17:36.560 so

00:17:38.320 they almost

00:17:38.800 killed

00:17:39.020 Tesla

00:17:39.320 so

00:17:40.220 as a

00:17:41.100 personal

00:17:41.880 matter

00:17:42.400 do you

00:17:43.800 ever

00:17:43.960 regret it

00:17:44.480 like

00:17:44.680 five years

00:17:45.280 ago

00:17:45.560 you go

00:17:45.860 to the Oscars

00:17:46.440 and we're

00:17:46.720 Mr. Cool

00:17:47.360 and now

00:17:48.020 you've got

00:17:48.940 death threats

00:17:49.500 every day

00:17:49.960 well these days

00:17:51.240 the Oscars

00:17:51.620 are boring

00:17:52.080 I wouldn't

00:17:54.240 want to go

00:17:54.560 God bless

00:17:55.200 the movies

00:17:55.600 they nominate

00:17:56.140 no one on

00:17:56.560 earth has

00:17:56.840 ever seen

00:17:57.360 could they

00:17:58.160 actually

00:17:58.480 nominate

00:17:58.880 a movie

00:17:59.180 that human

00:17:59.640 beings

00:17:59.940 go watch

00:18:00.540 I mean

00:18:01.340 how many

00:18:02.260 great movies

00:18:02.820 have come

00:18:03.560 out in the

00:18:03.940 last several

00:18:04.400 years

00:18:04.680 very few

00:18:05.600 depressingly

00:18:06.200 few

00:18:06.480 yeah

00:18:06.900 very few

00:18:07.500 last Oscars

00:18:08.540 came and

00:18:08.920 went

00:18:09.080 I didn't

00:18:09.320 watch it

00:18:09.740 there's

00:18:10.080 nothing

00:18:10.300 to see

00:18:10.640 I was

00:18:11.680 sad that

00:18:12.640 Gene Hackman

00:18:13.180 just passed

00:18:13.700 away

00:18:13.940 because

00:18:14.120 Unforgiven

00:18:14.640 was spectacular

00:18:15.600 but that was

00:18:15.980 a long time

00:18:16.400 ago

00:18:16.580 that Unforgiven

00:18:17.060 came out

00:18:17.600 you've mentioned

00:18:18.700 today here

00:18:20.360 and before

00:18:21.460 about the

00:18:22.260 possibility of

00:18:23.140 someone wanting

00:18:24.020 to take you

00:18:24.480 out

00:18:24.740 dealing with

00:18:25.660 the death

00:18:25.960 threats

00:18:26.380 we see

00:18:27.560 it's not in

00:18:28.140 my imagination

00:18:28.780 you can just

00:18:29.220 look on social

00:18:29.720 media

00:18:29.960 yeah

00:18:30.660 but like

00:18:31.100 is it

00:18:32.560 because

00:18:32.840 yeah

00:18:33.880 and look

00:18:34.240 I'm very

00:18:35.000 familiar with

00:18:35.540 and they've

00:18:35.880 got signs

00:18:36.340 there are

00:18:36.540 people with

00:18:36.920 signs and

00:18:37.480 demonstrations

00:18:37.980 saying that

00:18:39.520 I need to

00:18:39.800 die

00:18:39.980 do you

00:18:41.360 think

00:18:41.800 are these

00:18:43.100 just whack

00:18:43.800 jobs or do

00:18:44.600 you think

00:18:45.020 there are

00:18:45.620 foreign

00:18:46.940 sane people

00:18:47.840 do you think

00:18:48.880 there are

00:18:49.260 foreign entities

00:18:49.860 behind this

00:18:50.580 do you think

00:18:50.940 there are

00:18:51.140 domestic entities

00:18:51.840 behind the

00:18:52.520 threats and

00:18:53.200 also the

00:18:53.580 attacks to

00:18:54.160 Twitter

00:18:54.440 not Twitter

00:18:55.960 Tesla

00:18:56.920 I mean

00:18:57.600 you're

00:18:57.940 getting

00:18:58.260 Tesla's

00:19:00.020 charging

00:19:00.320 stations

00:19:00.780 lit on

00:19:01.120 fire

00:19:01.460 do you

00:19:01.780 think

00:19:02.260 that's

00:19:02.620 organized

00:19:03.000 and

00:19:03.440 paid

00:19:03.680 for

00:19:04.020 yes

00:19:05.140 at least

00:19:05.740 some of it

00:19:06.100 is organized

00:19:06.520 and paid

00:19:06.800 for

00:19:07.120 I think

00:19:08.600 by domestic

00:19:09.240 you know

00:19:11.440 basically

00:19:13.500 left-wing

00:19:14.200 organizations

00:19:14.700 in America

00:19:15.180 funded by

00:19:17.000 left-wing

00:19:19.280 billionaires

00:19:20.580 essentially

00:19:20.960 is it like

00:19:21.380 act blue

00:19:22.020 or what

00:19:22.600 act blue

00:19:23.260 is one of

00:19:23.600 them

00:19:24.400 you know

00:19:26.140 arabella

00:19:27.320 you know

00:19:27.660 the classic

00:19:28.080 it's funded

00:19:28.860 by the

00:19:29.380 you know

00:19:30.400 the blue

00:19:31.640 basically

00:19:32.520 the left-wing

00:19:33.680 NGO

00:19:34.620 cabal

00:19:35.640 how big of a

00:19:36.780 thread is this to

00:19:37.360 like what you

00:19:38.380 build at Tesla

00:19:39.000 I mean I

00:19:39.380 remember when

00:19:40.000 Tesla's came out

00:19:40.760 it was people

00:19:41.340 that they

00:19:42.220 didn't want to

00:19:42.540 have gas cars

00:19:43.560 a lot of it

00:19:44.340 was environmental

00:19:44.840 reasons

00:19:45.440 I jokingly said

00:19:46.660 I was like

00:19:46.940 I'm a Texas

00:19:47.900 guy I'm always

00:19:48.400 going to have

00:19:48.700 something that

00:19:48.960 burns gas

00:19:49.560 my kids

00:19:51.060 now

00:19:51.460 all three

00:19:51.960 of my boys

00:19:52.520 think that

00:19:53.440 the Tesla's

00:19:54.800 are awesome

00:19:55.540 the cyber truck

00:19:56.460 is the car

00:19:57.200 they want

00:19:57.620 their dad

00:19:58.100 to buy

00:19:58.420 which I

00:19:59.080 laugh

00:19:59.460 because I

00:19:59.860 never could

00:20:00.220 have imagined

00:20:00.620 that five

00:20:01.700 years ago

00:20:02.360 and now

00:20:03.160 I'm looking

00:20:03.640 at

00:20:03.880 we're at

00:20:04.320 the White

00:20:04.640 House

00:20:04.840 and the

00:20:05.120 President's

00:20:05.560 Tesla's

00:20:05.960 parked

00:20:06.180 right outside

00:20:06.640 the West

00:20:07.000 Wing

00:20:07.200 which is

00:20:07.560 the fullest

00:20:07.960 damn thing

00:20:08.480 you've

00:20:09.120 changed a

00:20:09.520 generation

00:20:09.960 when you

00:20:10.360 look at

00:20:10.700 my kids

00:20:11.120 are six

00:20:11.560 and eight

00:20:11.880 and they're

00:20:12.100 going dad

00:20:12.520 buy a

00:20:13.180 cyber truck

00:20:14.140 and I'm

00:20:15.020 considering it

00:20:15.920 that's a

00:20:16.440 that's a

00:20:17.040 full circle

00:20:17.840 in a weird

00:20:18.460 way

00:20:18.800 yeah

00:20:19.560 well I do

00:20:20.180 have this

00:20:20.420 theory that

00:20:20.760 the most

00:20:21.040 entertaining

00:20:21.380 outcome

00:20:21.740 is the

00:20:21.980 most likely

00:20:22.380 so

00:20:23.260 yeah

00:20:24.900 it seems

00:20:25.640 often to be

00:20:26.140 true

00:20:26.940 what twist

00:20:29.200 or turn

00:20:29.540 of fate

00:20:29.920 would generate

00:20:32.060 the highest

00:20:32.440 ratings

00:20:32.800 if we were

00:20:33.740 a TV show

00:20:34.360 what twist

00:20:35.760 or turn

00:20:36.020 of fate

00:20:36.280 would generate

00:20:36.680 the highest

00:20:36.980 ratings

00:20:37.280 there's a good

00:20:38.300 chance that

00:20:38.620 happens

00:20:38.940 well I will

00:20:39.760 say if

00:20:40.400 ActBlue

00:20:41.740 and Arabella

00:20:43.200 Network

00:20:43.540 ActBlue is a

00:20:44.060 huge scam

00:20:44.560 next level

00:20:45.100 do you think

00:20:45.640 it's foreign

00:20:46.240 money

00:20:46.480 Chinese money

00:20:47.200 where do you

00:20:47.700 think the

00:20:48.060 money in

00:20:48.440 ActBlue

00:20:48.740 is coming

00:20:49.140 from

00:20:49.340 how do you

00:20:49.660 figure that

00:20:50.080 out

00:20:50.400 well it's not

00:20:51.360 coming from

00:20:51.800 a whole bunch

00:20:53.100 of from a

00:20:54.140 groundswell of

00:20:55.200 public support

00:20:55.980 because when

00:20:57.440 individual donors

00:20:58.860 are looked at

00:20:59.320 in ActBlue

00:20:59.940 they eventually

00:21:00.900 turn out to be

00:21:01.600 like diehard

00:21:02.620 Republicans

00:21:03.040 people have

00:21:03.900 never given

00:21:04.240 money in their

00:21:04.680 life

00:21:04.920 so you're

00:21:05.780 going to track

00:21:06.060 down a bunch

00:21:06.460 of these

00:21:06.720 people where

00:21:07.460 it says oh I

00:21:07.960 gave $16,000

00:21:08.900 and they're like

00:21:09.720 I didn't give

00:21:10.260 $16,000

00:21:10.920 what are you

00:21:11.200 talking about

00:21:12.100 Republican

00:21:14.520 friends of

00:21:15.000 mine

00:21:15.180 found themselves

00:21:16.040 on the

00:21:16.320 ActBlue

00:21:16.640 list

00:21:16.920 they're like

00:21:17.320 it doesn't

00:21:17.820 want me

00:21:18.320 so that's

00:21:19.560 if it can

00:21:20.120 actually be

00:21:21.200 shown that

00:21:21.800 they are

00:21:22.060 funding fire

00:21:22.960 bombing of

00:21:23.580 Tesla charging

00:21:24.540 stations

00:21:25.080 that's objectively

00:21:26.660 a criminal act

00:21:27.400 that is funding

00:21:28.380 terrorist activity

00:21:29.260 and the statutes

00:21:30.360 make clear that

00:21:31.160 an incendiary

00:21:31.780 device

00:21:32.320 qualifies

00:21:33.400 so that's

00:21:33.920 things down

00:21:34.360 is a terrorist

00:21:35.160 activity

00:21:35.600 let me ask

00:21:37.120 AI

00:21:38.180 in 10 years

00:21:39.860 how is life

00:21:41.120 going to be

00:21:41.500 different because

00:21:42.180 of AI

00:21:42.600 for just a

00:21:43.740 normal person

00:21:44.480 well 10 years

00:21:45.920 is a long

00:21:46.220 time

00:21:46.580 in 10 years

00:21:47.660 probably AI

00:21:48.380 could do

00:21:48.960 anything better

00:21:50.040 than a human

00:21:50.460 can

00:21:50.800 cognitively

00:21:51.800 probably almost

00:21:52.880 I think

00:21:53.680 in 10 years

00:21:54.860 based on the

00:21:55.600 current rate of

00:21:56.060 improvement

00:21:56.500 AI will be

00:21:57.840 smarter than

00:21:58.400 the smartest

00:21:58.760 human

00:21:59.060 there will also

00:22:01.580 be a massive

00:22:02.920 number of

00:22:03.320 robots

00:22:03.780 so humanoid

00:22:05.280 robots

00:22:05.780 by the way

00:22:06.680 I gotta ask

00:22:07.200 how come

00:22:07.560 your robots

00:22:08.100 look so much

00:22:08.760 like the

00:22:09.080 creepy robots

00:22:09.740 for my robot

00:22:10.440 was that

00:22:11.400 intentional

00:22:11.880 or just

00:22:12.480 I was hoping

00:22:14.780 he was gonna

00:22:15.060 say yeah

00:22:15.480 just to mess

00:22:16.040 with you

00:22:16.500 it's not meant

00:22:18.580 to look like

00:22:18.980 any prior

00:22:20.760 robot

00:22:21.180 and we'll

00:22:22.300 iterate the

00:22:22.740 design

00:22:23.160 you'll be able

00:22:25.300 to have

00:22:26.000 a lot of

00:22:26.860 the robot

00:22:27.380 parts are

00:22:27.880 cosmetic

00:22:28.200 you'll be

00:22:28.660 able to

00:22:29.100 switch out

00:22:30.000 the kind

00:22:30.980 of snap

00:22:31.320 on cosmetic

00:22:32.140 parts

00:22:32.500 of the robot

00:22:32.920 make it

00:22:33.320 look like

00:22:33.580 something

00:22:33.900 else

00:22:34.120 if you'd

00:22:34.340 like

00:22:34.540 so

00:22:36.280 there'll

00:22:37.320 be

00:22:37.600 ultimately

00:22:38.640 billions

00:22:39.060 of

00:22:39.340 humanoid

00:22:39.680 robots

00:22:40.180 all cars

00:22:41.380 will be

00:22:41.620 self-driving

00:22:42.240 in 10

00:22:43.360 years

00:22:43.660 probably

00:22:45.260 90%

00:22:46.740 of miles

00:22:47.160 driven

00:22:47.420 will be

00:22:47.920 autonomous

00:22:48.660 autonomous

00:22:48.940 huh

00:22:49.200 wow

00:22:49.860 that fast

00:22:50.520 yeah

00:22:51.280 in five

00:22:52.240 years

00:22:52.580 probably

00:22:53.420 50%

00:22:54.440 of miles

00:22:54.980 driven

00:22:55.680 will be

00:22:55.960 autonomous

00:22:56.340 now if

00:22:56.760 AI will

00:22:57.380 be smarter

00:22:57.860 than any

00:22:58.360 person

00:22:58.820 how many

00:22:59.600 jobs

00:23:00.180 go away

00:23:01.180 because of

00:23:02.180 that

00:23:02.580 and what

00:23:03.620 do people

00:23:04.060 do if

00:23:04.620 you've got

00:23:05.020 millions of

00:23:05.460 people that are

00:23:05.840 losing their

00:23:06.280 jobs

00:23:06.600 like that

00:23:07.000 a lot of

00:23:07.640 people are

00:23:08.120 understandably

00:23:08.960 freaked out

00:23:09.380 about that

00:23:09.920 well

00:23:10.480 goods and

00:23:12.420 services

00:23:12.800 will become

00:23:13.640 close to

00:23:15.340 free

00:23:15.620 so

00:23:16.460 it's not

00:23:17.320 as though

00:23:17.500 people will

00:23:17.980 be wanting

00:23:18.420 in terms

00:23:18.760 of goods

00:23:19.020 and services

00:23:19.580 so why

00:23:21.320 is that

00:23:21.640 why are

00:23:22.540 goods and

00:23:22.860 services

00:23:23.180 free in

00:23:23.920 an AI

00:23:24.220 world

00:23:24.620 or close

00:23:25.560 to free

00:23:25.860 well you

00:23:26.720 have

00:23:27.120 tens of

00:23:29.380 billions

00:23:29.580 of robots

00:23:30.200 they will

00:23:32.640 make you

00:23:33.460 anything

00:23:33.780 or provide

00:23:34.380 any service

00:23:34.960 you want

00:23:35.360 for basically

00:23:37.620 next to

00:23:38.000 nothing

00:23:38.260 it's not

00:23:40.860 that people

00:23:41.220 will be

00:23:41.760 will have

00:23:43.080 a lower

00:23:43.320 standard of

00:23:43.700 living

00:23:43.840 they will

00:23:44.040 have

00:23:44.200 actually

00:23:44.420 a much

00:23:44.640 higher

00:23:44.860 standard

00:23:45.160 of living

00:23:45.580 but the

00:23:46.660 challenge

00:23:46.960 will be

00:23:47.980 fulfillment

00:23:49.620 how do

00:23:50.080 you derive

00:23:51.140 fulfillment

00:23:51.620 and meaning

00:23:52.100 in life

00:23:52.520 is Skynet

00:23:53.860 real

00:23:55.140 like you

00:23:56.060 get the

00:23:56.560 apocalyptic

00:23:57.120 visions

00:23:57.900 of AI

00:23:58.400 how real

00:24:00.040 is the

00:24:00.440 prospect

00:24:00.880 of killer

00:24:02.200 robots

00:24:02.760 annihilating

00:24:03.600 humanity

00:24:04.100 20%

00:24:05.300 likely

00:24:05.740 maybe 10%

00:24:07.160 on what

00:24:08.060 time frame

00:24:08.600 5 to 10

00:24:09.640 years

00:24:09.920 so soon

00:24:11.280 like you

00:24:11.940 you see a

00:24:12.880 world where

00:24:13.360 that's possible

00:24:14.220 yeah

00:24:15.300 but I mean

00:24:15.940 you can look

00:24:16.220 at it like

00:24:16.600 the glass

00:24:17.260 is 80-90%

00:24:18.900 full

00:24:19.180 meaning like

00:24:20.400 80% likely

00:24:21.760 will have

00:24:22.920 extreme

00:24:23.920 prosperity

00:24:24.440 for all

00:24:24.980 now I guess

00:24:25.920 my view

00:24:26.400 we're in a

00:24:26.860 race

00:24:27.260 to win

00:24:28.520 AI

00:24:28.800 we're in a

00:24:29.360 race with

00:24:29.880 China

00:24:30.300 and my

00:24:31.300 view is

00:24:31.780 if they're

00:24:32.040 going to be

00:24:32.320 killer robots

00:24:32.940 I'd rather

00:24:33.300 they be

00:24:33.580 American

00:24:33.900 killer robots

00:24:34.520 than Chinese

00:24:35.100 how likely

00:24:37.360 are we

00:24:38.480 winning right

00:24:39.040 now

00:24:39.240 is America

00:24:39.660 winning right

00:24:40.220 now

00:24:40.420 and how

00:24:40.740 likely is

00:24:41.360 America to

00:24:41.860 win the

00:24:42.120 race for

00:24:42.800 AI

00:24:43.280 vis-a-vis

00:24:43.880 China or

00:24:44.400 anyone else

00:24:44.920 for the

00:24:45.620 next few

00:24:46.000 years I

00:24:46.400 think America

00:24:47.140 is likely

00:24:47.540 to win

00:24:47.880 then it

00:24:48.940 will be

00:24:49.380 a function

00:24:50.160 of who

00:24:50.520 controls

00:24:50.960 the AI

00:24:51.500 chip

00:24:51.780 fabrication

00:24:53.980 the factories

00:24:55.320 that make

00:24:55.640 the AI

00:24:55.980 chips

00:24:56.220 who controls

00:24:56.720 them

00:24:56.940 if they are

00:24:57.980 controlled

00:24:58.360 if more of

00:24:59.480 them are

00:24:59.660 controlled by

00:25:00.080 China

00:25:00.340 then China

00:25:00.820 will win

00:25:01.200 more of the

00:25:02.320 factories

00:25:02.860 that are

00:25:03.260 making the

00:25:03.720 AI chips

00:25:04.420 you think

00:25:04.940 that will

00:25:05.320 determine it

00:25:05.920 yes

00:25:06.540 and how

00:25:07.340 are we

00:25:07.600 doing

00:25:07.840 versus

00:25:08.380 China

00:25:08.700 on that

00:25:09.000 front

00:25:09.280 well right

00:25:10.260 now

00:25:10.600 almost all

00:25:12.500 the advanced

00:25:12.940 AI chip

00:25:13.740 factories

00:25:15.600 they call

00:25:15.940 them

00:25:16.120 fabs

00:25:17.240 are in

00:25:18.680 Taiwan

00:25:19.100 and what

00:25:19.620 if China

00:25:19.980 invades

00:25:20.300 Taiwan

00:25:20.680 what happens

00:25:22.700 if China

00:25:23.820 invades

00:25:24.240 Taiwan

00:25:24.600 what happens

00:25:25.660 to the

00:25:26.520 world

00:25:26.800 well if

00:25:27.480 they were

00:25:27.740 to invade

00:25:28.480 in the

00:25:28.860 near term

00:25:29.340 the world

00:25:31.100 would be

00:25:31.400 cut off

00:25:31.720 from

00:25:32.100 advanced

00:25:32.840 AI chips

00:25:33.380 and

00:25:34.080 currently

00:25:34.640 100%

00:25:35.540 of

00:25:35.860 advanced

00:25:36.260 AI chips

00:25:36.740 are made

00:25:37.100 in Taiwan

00:25:37.500 how fast

00:25:38.460 can we

00:25:38.740 put that

00:25:39.040 online

00:25:39.280 in America

00:25:39.620 and how

00:25:39.900 important

00:25:40.200 is that

00:25:40.420 for national

00:25:40.860 security

00:25:41.300 I think

00:25:42.200 it's essential

00:25:42.620 for national

00:25:43.040 security

00:25:43.460 and we're

00:25:44.820 not doing

00:25:45.120 enough

00:25:45.400 you're 53

00:25:46.400 years old

00:25:47.100 I'm 118

00:25:48.380 days older

00:25:49.020 than you

00:25:49.300 by the way

00:25:49.760 what the hell

00:25:50.260 have I done

00:25:50.640 in my life

00:25:51.180 I know right

00:25:51.760 53 years

00:25:53.140 old

00:25:53.520 you did pretty

00:25:53.840 well

00:25:54.160 well

00:25:56.200 so 71

00:25:57.540 was a great

00:25:58.020 year

00:25:58.260 and I was

00:25:59.360 December 70

00:26:00.060 so I was

00:26:00.440 just right

00:26:01.640 before

00:26:02.060 you were

00:26:02.780 the summer

00:26:03.140 of 71

00:26:03.800 I was born

00:26:05.700 69 days

00:26:06.380 after 420

00:26:07.140 wow

00:26:07.920 I did

00:26:09.480 ask Ben

00:26:10.100 this is true

00:26:11.100 look

00:26:11.400 you just

00:26:13.000 open up

00:26:13.320 the can of

00:26:13.720 words

00:26:13.940 I did

00:26:14.480 ask Ben

00:26:15.080 should I

00:26:15.440 show up

00:26:15.780 and pull

00:26:16.060 up a joint

00:26:16.580 and say

00:26:16.980 can we

00:26:17.680 beat

00:26:17.940 Rogan's

00:26:18.360 views

00:26:18.660 but I

00:26:19.160 was pretty

00:26:19.560 sure

00:26:19.960 it might

00:26:21.420 cause a

00:26:21.820 scandal

00:26:22.120 if we

00:26:22.660 spent

00:26:22.840 pot

00:26:23.060 in the

00:26:23.320 White House

00:26:23.700 it just

00:26:24.700 turned out

00:26:24.980 to be

00:26:25.120 like a

00:26:25.360 chocolate

00:26:25.620 cigar

00:26:25.940 yeah

00:26:26.660 let me

00:26:29.560 ask you

00:26:30.060 if today

00:26:30.820 was your

00:26:31.200 last day

00:26:31.620 on Earth

00:26:32.020 yeah

00:26:32.520 what

00:26:33.080 I'm not

00:26:34.080 suggesting

00:26:34.500 it's going

00:26:34.940 to be

00:26:35.140 but if it

00:26:35.540 were

00:26:35.740 what do you

00:26:36.040 think your

00:26:36.260 biggest legacy

00:26:36.760 would be

00:26:37.060 if everything

00:26:37.380 you've done

00:26:38.080 100 years

00:26:39.620 from now

00:26:39.980 what do you

00:26:40.280 think people

00:26:40.860 would remember

00:26:41.660 if it were

00:26:43.580 zero to today

00:26:44.660 and were you

00:26:45.220 ever going to

00:26:45.680 space

00:26:46.120 in the

00:26:47.460 distant future

00:26:49.020 100 or

00:26:49.840 1000 years

00:26:50.320 ago

00:26:50.620 if SpaceX

00:26:52.020 got humans

00:26:52.840 to Mars

00:26:53.260 that's what

00:26:53.840 they would

00:26:54.580 remember me

00:26:55.080 for

00:26:55.240 all right

00:26:56.200 final set

00:26:56.840 of questions

00:26:57.380 who's the

00:26:58.120 smartest guy

00:26:58.680 you've ever

00:26:59.020 met

00:26:59.260 you hang out

00:27:00.200 with some

00:27:00.500 brilliant people

00:27:01.100 like like

00:27:01.580 when you

00:27:02.120 look what's

00:27:02.800 a CEO

00:27:03.280 you look at

00:27:04.140 other than

00:27:04.640 yourself

00:27:05.160 what CEO

00:27:06.120 do you say

00:27:06.840 damn

00:27:08.220 that guy's

00:27:08.740 good

00:27:08.980 Larry Ellison

00:27:10.000 is very

00:27:10.280 smart

00:27:10.580 so I'll say

00:27:12.980 Larry Ellison

00:27:13.480 is one of the

00:27:14.520 smartest people

00:27:15.180 you know

00:27:17.420 Larry Page

00:27:18.220 I mean there

00:27:19.040 are a lot of

00:27:19.260 people that

00:27:19.560 are very smart

00:27:19.980 it's hard to

00:27:20.340 say like

00:27:20.700 you know

00:27:21.760 I think

00:27:22.160 to some degree

00:27:22.660 smart is

00:27:23.200 as smart

00:27:23.540 does

00:27:23.900 so

00:27:24.820 you know

00:27:25.760 what have

00:27:25.980 they done

00:27:26.660 that is

00:27:27.180 difficult

00:27:28.460 and significant

00:27:30.720 you know

00:27:33.060 Jeff Bezos

00:27:33.680 has done

00:27:35.020 a lot of

00:27:35.320 difficult

00:27:35.560 and significant

00:27:36.080 things

00:27:36.620 I mean

00:27:38.740 there are a lot

00:27:39.020 of smart

00:27:39.300 humans

00:27:39.660 I call them

00:27:40.660 smart for

00:27:41.100 a human

00:27:42.120 a lot of

00:27:42.780 people who

00:27:43.100 are in the

00:27:43.480 smart for

00:27:43.840 a human

00:27:44.080 category

00:27:44.600 all right

00:27:45.560 final lightning

00:27:46.260 round

00:27:46.660 Star Wars

00:27:47.840 or Star Trek

00:27:48.420 the first movie

00:27:49.640 I saw in the

00:27:50.100 theater was

00:27:50.500 Star Wars

00:27:51.020 so I think

00:27:51.740 it had a

00:27:52.060 profound

00:27:52.300 effect on me

00:27:52.920 I was six

00:27:53.780 years old

00:27:54.120 I think

00:27:54.740 imagine if

00:27:55.540 the first movie

00:27:56.680 you ever see

00:27:57.380 in a theater

00:27:59.040 is Star Wars

00:27:59.760 that's going to

00:28:00.140 blow your mind

00:28:00.600 best Star Wars

00:28:01.360 movie

00:28:01.700 Empire Strikes Back

00:28:04.160 the only objectively

00:28:05.620 right answer

00:28:06.240 I stood in line

00:28:06.940 for three hours

00:28:07.620 with my dad

00:28:08.200 to see it

00:28:08.580 on opening day

00:28:09.340 Kirk or Picard

00:28:10.840 I like them both

00:28:13.160 but Kirk

00:28:13.600 again objectively

00:28:15.320 right answer

00:28:16.060 by the way

00:28:17.020 James T. Kirk

00:28:18.260 is a Republican

00:28:19.660 and Picard

00:28:20.220 is a Democrat

00:28:20.820 and the left

00:28:21.640 gets very mad

00:28:22.400 when I say

00:28:23.100 that

00:28:23.420 best Star Trek

00:28:25.260 movie

00:28:25.580 I mean

00:28:26.600 the first

00:28:27.420 Star Trek movie

00:28:27.980 maybe

00:28:28.320 that's

00:28:29.400 in

00:28:29.580 Wrath of Khan

00:28:30.440 Wrath of Khan

00:28:32.580 actually

00:28:33.480 both Wrath of Khan

00:28:35.520 were pretty good

00:28:36.180 but yeah

00:28:36.900 the original

00:28:37.240 Wrath of Khan

00:28:37.840 Ricardo Montalban

00:28:39.560 revenge is a dish

00:28:41.460 best served cold

00:28:43.040 it is very cold

00:28:44.540 in space

00:28:45.440 although I will say

00:28:46.820 Wrath of Khan

00:28:48.200 is objectively

00:28:48.760 the right answer

00:28:49.540 but four is a sleeper

00:28:51.140 when they go back

00:28:51.780 to San Francisco

00:28:52.620 and go find the whales

00:28:54.960 and you know

00:28:55.980 Scotty picks up

00:28:56.860 picks up the mouth

00:28:58.620 and talks to it

00:28:59.280 then goes

00:28:59.580 a keyboard

00:29:00.240 how quaint

00:29:01.300 that's a sleeper

00:29:03.100 alright

00:29:03.340 last question

00:29:04.200 did Han shoot first

00:29:05.900 it seemed like

00:29:08.380 he shot second

00:29:09.060 this is verdict

00:29:10.260 and by the way

00:29:11.140 I apologize Ben

00:29:12.280 so Ben was a jock

00:29:13.400 and played tennis

00:29:14.100 at Ole Miss

00:29:14.760 and so

00:29:15.240 so occasionally

00:29:16.040 when we geek out

00:29:17.300 I love watching

00:29:18.400 y'all geek out

00:29:19.040 over there

00:29:19.440 he's still on

00:29:21.640 the question

00:29:21.960 I love it

00:29:22.520 he missed his

00:29:23.080 the alien missed

00:29:23.980 his basal shot

00:29:24.720 so why did he miss

00:29:25.700 his basal shot

00:29:26.320 must have been

00:29:26.800 because he got

00:29:27.360 shot first

00:29:28.280 now he's missing

00:29:29.240 a point blank

00:29:29.760 basal shot

00:29:30.420 unless they get

00:29:31.320 knocked or killed

00:29:32.360 but it's a question

00:29:33.120 of real consequence

00:29:33.920 which is

00:29:35.820 is Han Solo

00:29:36.740 simply a hero

00:29:37.740 or an anti-hero

00:29:38.660 and so I'm in

00:29:39.940 the Han shot first

00:29:40.760 category

00:29:41.320 I don't like

00:29:42.740 sanitized stories

00:29:43.480 he would have

00:29:44.020 had to have shot first

00:29:44.860 because otherwise

00:29:45.320 why would the alien

00:29:46.380 miss a point blank

00:29:47.600 range

00:29:47.980 are you ever

00:29:49.240 going to go to

00:29:49.800 outer space

00:29:50.340 is that thing

00:29:50.860 in your life goals

00:29:51.580 yeah I'd like to

00:29:52.540 go to Mars

00:29:52.900 at some point

00:29:53.360 and people have

00:29:54.240 said do I want

00:29:55.820 to die on Mars

00:29:56.400 and I say yes

00:29:57.980 just not on impact

00:29:58.760 now that's a very

00:29:59.880 good answer

00:30:00.380 the astronauts

00:30:01.860 on the space station

00:30:02.800 are they political

00:30:04.620 prisoners

00:30:05.100 some of them are

00:30:06.980 because

00:30:08.160 because you could

00:30:09.080 have given him

00:30:09.440 a ride back

00:30:10.200 and

00:30:10.420 Joe Biden said

00:30:12.820 no purely

00:30:13.460 for politics

00:30:14.180 yeah I mean

00:30:15.120 you know

00:30:16.300 there's been some

00:30:16.840 debate about this

00:30:18.200 online but

00:30:18.700 the thing is that

00:30:19.320 it was very

00:30:20.420 a very high level

00:30:21.120 decision so

00:30:21.940 it wasn't

00:30:23.140 really even a

00:30:23.780 NASA decision

00:30:24.440 it was just that

00:30:25.580 the Biden White House

00:30:27.820 did not want to

00:30:28.500 have someone

00:30:29.820 who was pro-Trump

00:30:31.680 rescuing astronauts

00:30:33.280 right before the election

00:30:34.240 so they pushed it

00:30:36.020 well if you're one

00:30:36.620 of those astronauts

00:30:37.200 you've got to be

00:30:37.660 pretty pissed off

00:30:38.320 about that

00:30:38.780 well if they're

00:30:40.380 a Democrat

00:30:41.260 yes

00:30:41.780 a Democrat

00:30:43.860 like everything's

00:30:44.980 fine

00:30:45.240 fair enough

00:30:45.780 so I think one of

00:30:47.400 them is a Republican

00:30:48.060 or a Democrat

00:30:48.820 so it depends on

00:30:49.620 which one you ask

00:30:50.360 well thank you Elon

00:30:51.340 this was awesome

00:30:52.720 and let me say

00:30:53.840 and by the way

00:30:54.680 I put out on X

00:30:56.880 the day before

00:30:57.800 yesterday

00:30:58.260 if you were having

00:30:58.880 a beer with Elon

00:30:59.540 and could ask him

00:31:00.200 anything

00:31:00.500 what would you ask

00:31:01.400 and got lots of

00:31:02.200 responses

00:31:02.740 the most common

00:31:04.320 response people said

00:31:05.420 is say thank you

00:31:07.360 look Texans

00:31:08.460 and the American

00:31:08.980 people appreciate

00:31:09.800 what you're doing

00:31:10.540 you don't have to

00:31:11.640 put up with this BS

00:31:12.460 and you're doing it

00:31:13.480 I'm grateful

00:31:14.260 you're making a hell

00:31:15.560 of a difference

00:31:15.980 for this country

00:31:16.680 I appreciate you

00:31:17.880 and the Americans

00:31:18.640 appreciate you

00:31:19.440 thank you

00:31:19.900 it's essential

00:31:20.400 for the future

00:31:20.900 of civilization

00:31:21.500 otherwise I wouldn't

00:31:22.120 be doing it

00:31:22.680 yes

00:31:22.900 it's not like

00:31:23.440 I want to get

00:31:23.880 death threats

00:31:24.340 you know

00:31:24.840 no

00:31:25.120 what year

00:31:26.920 does man

00:31:27.740 first set foot

00:31:28.780 on Mars

00:31:29.260 I think the

00:31:30.460 soonest would be

00:31:31.540 29

00:31:32.420 29

00:31:33.240 yes

00:31:34.040 and I don't think

00:31:35.500 it's more than

00:31:36.080 two to four years

00:31:37.220 beyond that

00:31:37.820 and that's not

00:31:38.600 an unmanned

00:31:39.100 that's that's a

00:31:39.920 human being

00:31:40.720 putting his foot

00:31:41.760 on the surface

00:31:42.360 yes best case

00:31:43.420 would be 29

00:31:44.040 and what do you

00:31:45.000 what do you put

00:31:45.780 the odds

00:31:46.540 of finding

00:31:47.900 either alien life

00:31:49.280 or evidence

00:31:49.980 of alien life

00:31:50.760 I don't think

00:31:51.360 we're going to

00:31:51.620 find aliens

00:31:52.200 okay

00:31:52.600 but do we find

00:31:53.780 ruins

00:31:54.120 do we find

00:31:54.600 remnants

00:31:55.020 we may

00:31:55.740 we may find

00:31:56.500 the ruins

00:31:56.840 of a long

00:31:57.160 dead alien

00:31:57.640 civilization

00:31:58.200 that's possible

00:31:59.000 and we may

00:31:59.700 find

00:32:00.200 subterranean

00:32:01.640 microbial life

00:32:03.040 that's possible

00:32:03.760 all right

00:32:04.320 if man lands

00:32:05.280 on Mars

00:32:05.800 in 29

00:32:06.360 how soon

00:32:07.520 after that

00:32:08.280 do you land

00:32:09.160 on Mars

00:32:09.620 remains to be seen

00:32:10.620 I'm not sure

00:32:11.120 the important thing

00:32:11.920 is that

00:32:12.400 we build

00:32:13.940 a self-sustaining

00:32:14.840 city on Mars

00:32:16.100 as quickly

00:32:16.700 as possible

00:32:17.320 the key

00:32:19.060 threshold

00:32:19.580 is when

00:32:21.020 that city

00:32:21.640 can continue

00:32:22.980 to grow

00:32:23.380 continue to prosper

00:32:24.240 even when

00:32:25.220 the supply

00:32:26.060 ships from

00:32:26.720 Earth

00:32:27.020 stop coming

00:32:27.980 at that point

00:32:28.940 even if something

00:32:29.740 would happen

00:32:30.320 on Earth

00:32:31.260 it might not

00:32:32.600 be World War 3

00:32:33.460 but it might

00:32:34.020 be that

00:32:35.040 a bad virus

00:32:37.020 yeah

00:32:37.460 it might not

00:32:38.220 be anything

00:32:38.500 like say

00:32:40.180 civilization

00:32:40.720 you could die

00:32:41.060 with a bang

00:32:41.400 or a whimper

00:32:41.820 it may be

00:32:42.380 that civilization

00:32:43.080 dies with a whimper

00:32:44.280 rather than a bang

00:32:45.240 and simply

00:32:46.900 loses the ability

00:32:47.680 to send ships

00:32:48.720 to Mars

00:32:49.180 so you obviously

00:32:51.000 need Mars

00:32:51.540 to become

00:32:52.340 self-sustaining

00:32:53.100 and be able

00:32:53.760 to grow by itself

00:32:54.520 before the

00:32:56.420 resupply ships

00:32:57.060 from Earth

00:32:57.540 stop coming

00:32:58.100 that is the

00:32:58.840 critical

00:32:59.580 civilizational

00:33:01.020 threshold

00:33:01.520 beyond which

00:33:02.360 the probable

00:33:03.660 lifespan

00:33:04.040 of civilization

00:33:04.740 is much

00:33:05.480 greater

00:33:05.780 and how

00:33:06.460 close

00:33:06.880 are we

00:33:07.300 technologically

00:33:08.120 to be able

00:33:08.700 to do that

00:33:09.260 to have

00:33:09.840 a self-sustaining

00:33:10.800 settlement

00:33:11.700 on the surface

00:33:13.020 of Mars

00:33:13.380 I think it

00:33:14.060 can be done

00:33:14.420 in 20 years

00:33:15.120 but it would

00:33:15.700 take 20 years

00:33:16.420 so we're not

00:33:17.120 in 29

00:33:17.680 we're not there

00:33:18.540 what are we

00:33:19.040 missing

00:33:19.240 what are the

00:33:19.740 big technologies

00:33:20.500 we don't have

00:33:21.760 a few people

00:33:22.480 running around

00:33:22.960 the surface

00:33:23.460 in a hostile

00:33:24.400 environment

00:33:24.780 is not going

00:33:25.220 to make

00:33:25.440 it self-sustaining

00:33:26.040 so you're going

00:33:26.800 to need

00:33:27.000 on the order

00:33:27.540 of a million

00:33:27.920 people

00:33:28.360 maybe a million

00:33:29.420 tons of cargo

00:33:30.100 but you think

00:33:31.000 we could have

00:33:31.360 a million people

00:33:31.980 on Mars

00:33:32.420 in 20 years

00:33:33.080 yes

00:33:33.900 and what's

00:33:35.460 the technology

00:33:36.220 we're missing

00:33:36.880 right now

00:33:37.380 when you think

00:33:37.980 about a million

00:33:38.460 people on Mars

00:33:39.380 do we have

00:33:40.180 the ability

00:33:40.500 to get water

00:33:41.120 to get food

00:33:41.940 to keep them safe

00:33:43.460 what do we need

00:33:44.800 to make that happen

00:33:45.580 well you need

00:33:46.060 to recreate

00:33:46.500 the entire base

00:33:47.160 of industry

00:33:47.580 of Earth

00:33:47.940 so we're here

00:33:50.480 at the top

00:33:50.840 of a massive

00:33:51.680 pyramid of industry

00:33:52.740 that starts with

00:33:53.900 mining

00:33:54.620 a vast array

00:33:55.900 of materials

00:33:56.940 those materials

00:33:58.100 going through

00:33:58.660 hundreds of steps

00:33:59.760 of refinement

00:34:00.320 we grow food

00:34:02.260 obviously

00:34:02.720 we grow trees

00:34:04.800 we make things

00:34:05.440 out of the trees

00:34:06.160 there's

00:34:07.080 you know

00:34:07.480 you've got

00:34:07.920 you've got to

00:34:08.340 build all that

00:34:08.840 on Mars

00:34:09.240 and Mars

00:34:09.820 is a hostile

00:34:10.260 environment

00:34:10.720 it's

00:34:11.320 you know

00:34:12.040 it sometimes

00:34:12.420 gets above

00:34:13.140 zero

00:34:13.480 on a warm

00:34:14.000 summer day

00:34:14.580 near the equator

00:34:15.780 on Mars

00:34:16.240 it's quite cold

00:34:17.520 and how do you

00:34:18.440 prep for that

00:34:19.100 well in the beginning

00:34:20.240 on Mars

00:34:21.020 you have to have

00:34:21.660 a life support

00:34:23.760 habitation module

00:34:25.220 right

00:34:25.460 like you need

00:34:26.320 you can't just

00:34:26.820 live outdoors

00:34:27.380 you can't breathe

00:34:27.880 the air

00:34:28.220 like a dome

00:34:29.140 you think

00:34:29.580 is likely

00:34:30.040 yeah

00:34:30.320 glass domes

00:34:31.160 type of thing

00:34:31.660 have you identified

00:34:32.900 a location

00:34:34.460 on Mars

00:34:35.140 that is likely

00:34:35.860 to be ideal

00:34:36.960 for a habitat

00:34:37.580 what might be

00:34:38.900 Arcadia

00:34:39.380 Planetae

00:34:39.900 is one of the

00:34:42.120 one of the good

00:34:42.920 options

00:34:43.300 that's

00:34:44.180 one of my

00:34:45.320 daughters

00:34:45.560 is named

00:34:45.880 Arcadia

00:34:46.260 after that

00:34:46.860 and what makes

00:34:48.500 that attractive

00:34:49.140 my eldest son's

00:34:50.160 middle name

00:34:50.560 is

00:34:50.880 Aries

00:34:51.920 Mars

00:34:52.600 you've been

00:34:53.500 thinking about

00:34:53.800 this for a long

00:34:54.320 time if you're

00:34:54.780 naming your kids

00:34:55.440 around it

00:34:55.900 my eldest kid

00:34:56.740 is

00:34:57.060 middle name

00:34:57.860 is essentially

00:34:58.860 Mars

00:34:59.280 when did you

00:35:00.060 get the dream

00:35:00.560 like I mean

00:35:01.260 it's 20 now

00:35:02.300 2021 soon

00:35:03.300 this is a

00:35:04.120 decades old

00:35:04.880 yeah

00:35:05.420 dream

00:35:05.900 so like when

00:35:06.480 you were 10

00:35:07.020 did you look up

00:35:07.700 and say I'm

00:35:08.080 going to Mars

00:35:08.580 no

00:35:09.220 no I read a lot

00:35:11.660 of science fiction

00:35:12.200 books and

00:35:12.920 programming computers

00:35:13.880 but the first

00:35:15.500 following up the

00:35:16.300 first video game

00:35:17.080 that I sold

00:35:18.220 was a space

00:35:19.780 video game

00:35:20.280 called Blastar

00:35:20.920 maybe I was born

00:35:21.640 this way

00:35:22.040 how do you

00:35:23.380 how do you

00:35:25.220 become

00:35:25.800 Elon Musk

00:35:26.860 look you're

00:35:27.700 obviously smart

00:35:28.340 as hell

00:35:28.700 but there are

00:35:29.620 a lot of smart

00:35:30.900 people that don't

00:35:31.500 do SWOT

00:35:32.060 and you've

00:35:32.980 managed

00:35:33.520 everything you've

00:35:34.860 touched

00:35:35.220 has been an

00:35:36.140 extraordinary

00:35:36.540 success

00:35:37.300 yeah

00:35:38.140 yeah look I

00:35:40.040 mean that's

00:35:40.500 just objectively

00:35:41.180 right

00:35:41.500 so what has

00:35:42.300 led to that

00:35:42.940 because there

00:35:43.360 are other smart

00:35:43.840 people that

00:35:44.300 that's not

00:35:44.680 true and

00:35:45.500 they gaze

00:35:45.860 at their

00:35:46.080 navel and

00:35:46.440 they don't

00:35:46.720 do anything

00:35:47.400 so what

00:35:48.040 what do you

00:35:49.020 do differently

00:35:49.560 that makes

00:35:49.940 you so

00:35:50.220 effective

00:35:50.540 well I suppose

00:35:51.220 I have a

00:35:51.580 philosophy of

00:35:52.100 curiosity

00:35:52.600 I want to

00:35:53.420 find out

00:35:53.940 the nature

00:35:54.700 of the universe

00:35:55.180 understand the

00:35:55.720 universe

00:35:56.100 and in order

00:35:57.620 to do that

00:35:58.140 we have to

00:35:58.660 travel to other

00:35:59.180 planets

00:35:59.540 see other

00:36:00.560 star systems

00:36:01.080 maybe other

00:36:01.540 galaxies

00:36:01.940 find perhaps

00:36:04.020 other alien

00:36:04.500 civilizations

00:36:05.020 or at least

00:36:05.560 the remnants

00:36:06.020 of alien

00:36:06.620 civilizations

00:36:07.220 gain a better

00:36:08.720 understanding of

00:36:09.280 where is this

00:36:09.800 universe going

00:36:10.440 ready to come

00:36:11.020 from

00:36:11.260 and what

00:36:11.860 questions

00:36:12.340 do we not

00:36:13.080 yet know

00:36:13.680 to ask

00:36:14.260 about the

00:36:14.620 answer that

00:36:15.060 is the

00:36:15.340 universe

00:36:15.740 so let's

00:36:16.560 go back

00:36:17.160 25 years

00:36:18.760 late 90s

00:36:19.720 you're at

00:36:20.340 paypal

00:36:20.680 how do you

00:36:21.480 turn paypal

00:36:22.220 into the

00:36:22.620 success it

00:36:23.180 was which

00:36:23.860 which then

00:36:24.360 helped launch

00:36:24.940 you to the

00:36:25.300 next one

00:36:25.680 and the

00:36:25.860 next

00:36:26.060 yeah so I

00:36:26.800 studied physics

00:36:27.440 and economics

00:36:28.140 in college

00:36:28.900 which is a good

00:36:29.880 foundation for

00:36:30.620 understanding how

00:36:31.080 the economy

00:36:31.460 works and

00:36:32.000 how the

00:36:32.680 reality works

00:36:33.800 and then

00:36:35.160 was going to

00:36:36.560 do a phd

00:36:37.680 at stanford

00:36:38.200 in advanced

00:36:40.320 ultra capacitors

00:36:41.600 actually as a

00:36:42.860 potential means

00:36:44.340 of energy

00:36:45.780 storage for

00:36:46.480 electric transport

00:36:47.620 put that

00:36:48.840 on hold

00:36:49.200 to start

00:36:50.420 an internet

00:36:50.720 company

00:36:51.100 I essentially

00:36:53.060 came to the

00:36:53.380 conclusion that

00:36:53.800 the internet

00:36:54.120 was one of

00:36:54.680 those rare

00:36:55.220 things and

00:36:56.380 I could either

00:36:56.760 watch it happen

00:36:57.480 while a grad

00:36:58.240 student or

00:36:58.800 anticipate and

00:36:59.720 I figured I'd

00:37:00.120 always go back

00:37:00.620 to grad school

00:37:01.100 you know grad

00:37:01.760 school is going

00:37:02.140 to be kind

00:37:02.620 of the same

00:37:03.000 but I couldn't

00:37:05.080 bear the thought

00:37:05.540 of just watching

00:37:06.040 the internet

00:37:06.340 happen so I

00:37:07.380 wanted to be a

00:37:07.780 part of building

00:37:08.200 it so I

00:37:08.920 created an

00:37:09.980 internet

00:37:10.220 company we

00:37:11.540 did the first

00:37:12.100 maps directions

00:37:12.900 yellow pages

00:37:13.540 white pages

00:37:14.260 on the internet

00:37:15.540 I actually wrote

00:37:16.080 the first version

00:37:16.620 of software just

00:37:17.700 by myself in

00:37:18.740 95 and we

00:37:21.160 ended up selling

00:37:21.620 that to

00:37:22.340 compact Texas

00:37:23.740 company I

00:37:24.200 guess for

00:37:25.460 about 300

00:37:25.920 million dollars

00:37:26.360 in cash about

00:37:27.340 four years after

00:37:27.920 I graduated

00:37:28.420 wow so I

00:37:30.740 should say just

00:37:31.320 to preface that

00:37:32.160 I graduated with

00:37:33.180 about a hundred

00:37:33.580 thousand dollars

00:37:34.140 in student debt

00:37:34.740 so it wasn't

00:37:35.640 yeah you and

00:37:36.360 me both

00:37:36.740 yeah yeah

00:37:38.260 where's my

00:37:38.860 300 million

00:37:39.340 I'm right I

00:37:40.060 know and

00:37:41.560 when I first

00:37:41.980 arrived in North

00:37:42.480 America I

00:37:42.920 arrived with

00:37:43.380 $2,500 a

00:37:45.120 bag of books

00:37:45.680 and a bag

00:37:46.580 of clothes

00:37:47.020 all right so

00:37:47.740 you sell the

00:37:48.200 company for

00:37:48.660 300 million

00:37:49.340 how much does

00:37:50.060 that change

00:37:50.540 your life

00:37:51.000 well I got

00:37:51.520 21 million

00:37:52.440 dollars black

00:37:53.100 drag and

00:37:56.000 but I wanted

00:37:57.420 to do more

00:37:58.040 on the internet

00:37:58.440 so started a

00:37:59.900 company called

00:38:00.760 x.com which

00:38:02.200 merged with a

00:38:02.720 company called

00:38:03.280 Confinity which

00:38:04.780 is Peter Thiel and

00:38:05.560 Max Levchin

00:38:06.240 yeah and the

00:38:08.160 combined company

00:38:08.720 was actually at

00:38:09.360 first still called

00:38:10.060 x.com but we

00:38:11.120 later changed the

00:38:12.240 name of the

00:38:12.640 company to

00:38:13.180 PayPal because

00:38:14.800 of all the

00:38:15.140 name changes

00:38:15.580 it's kind of

00:38:15.980 confusing but

00:38:16.700 the company

00:38:17.440 that people

00:38:17.720 know as

00:38:18.140 PayPal today

00:38:20.300 was actually

00:38:20.920 I filed those

00:38:21.900 incorporation

00:38:22.380 documents for

00:38:23.120 that company

00:38:23.540 interesting

00:38:23.940 yeah well

00:38:25.220 and as you

00:38:25.960 know Peter

00:38:26.840 Thiel and I

00:38:27.380 were buddies

00:38:28.020 back in the

00:38:28.880 mid 90s before

00:38:29.780 he went and

00:38:30.180 did any of

00:38:30.580 this but you

00:38:31.300 know I

00:38:31.540 became friends

00:38:32.220 with him when

00:38:32.560 he was a

00:38:33.160 corporate lawyer

00:38:33.900 in New York

00:38:34.440 and just sort

00:38:35.100 of a young

00:38:35.460 libertarian with

00:38:36.460 a lot of

00:38:37.020 dreams so it's

00:38:38.120 been a heck

00:38:38.720 of a journey

00:38:39.120 yeah yeah

00:38:40.340 and now

00:38:40.980 obviously Peter

00:38:41.560 was involved in

00:38:42.340 a coup you

00:38:43.720 know we had

00:38:44.320 a little sort

00:38:45.220 of knifing in

00:38:46.020 the senate

00:38:46.300 situation where

00:38:50.580 you know that

00:38:52.500 they did

00:38:52.840 coup me at

00:38:53.400 PayPal I

00:38:56.320 kind of

00:38:56.700 now did you

00:38:57.280 all make peace

00:38:57.880 after that

00:38:58.380 yeah yeah

00:38:58.740 yeah I mean I

00:39:00.300 was doing a lot

00:39:01.360 of sort of risky

00:39:01.980 moves that I

00:39:02.600 think ultimately

00:39:03.140 would have been

00:39:03.600 successful but I

00:39:05.160 then went on a

00:39:06.120 two-week trip

00:39:07.760 which was a

00:39:09.120 dual money

00:39:10.360 raising trip

00:39:11.400 and honeymoon

00:39:12.060 and said

00:39:12.640 not done my

00:39:13.560 honeymoon

00:39:13.940 earlier in the

00:39:14.760 year so I was

00:39:15.440 raising money while

00:39:16.060 doing it doing

00:39:16.520 honeymoon but I

00:39:17.420 was kind of

00:39:18.320 away that go

00:39:18.940 over by the

00:39:19.380 way it

00:39:20.140 worked it

00:39:20.920 worked there

00:39:21.600 you go kind

00:39:22.240 of it worked I

00:39:22.860 raised money yeah

00:39:23.640 yeah and we had

00:39:24.560 honeymoon there you

00:39:25.400 go so yeah

00:39:26.780 but you don't

00:39:28.060 want to be away

00:39:28.480 from the battle

00:39:29.020 when things are

00:39:29.940 scary so I was

00:39:32.620 not there to

00:39:33.140 assuage the

00:39:33.600 concerns of the

00:39:34.180 troops and

00:39:35.780 anyway we

00:39:39.000 passed things

00:39:39.640 up and have

00:39:40.780 been friends

00:39:41.540 nonetheless and

00:39:43.920 yeah these days

00:39:45.080 I'll like stay at

00:39:45.640 his house and

00:39:46.120 stuff so obviously

00:39:46.740 we're friends and

00:39:47.580 he's also invested

00:39:48.560 in most of my

00:39:49.460 companies

00:39:49.780 Canadian women are

00:39:51.540 looking for more

00:39:52.400 more out of

00:39:53.040 themselves their

00:39:53.840 businesses their

00:39:54.780 elected leaders and

00:39:55.880 the world around

00:39:56.460 them and that's why

00:39:57.300 we're thrilled to

00:39:58.000 introduce the

00:39:58.820 honest talk podcast

00:40:00.140 I'm Jennifer Stewart

00:40:01.480 and I'm Catherine

00:40:02.400 Clark and in this

00:40:03.440 podcast we interview

00:40:04.600 Canada's most

00:40:05.400 inspiring women

00:40:06.380 entrepreneurs artists

00:40:07.860 athletes politicians

00:40:09.140 and newsmakers all

00:40:10.540 at different stages

00:40:11.340 of their journey so

00:40:12.700 if you're looking to

00:40:13.680 connect then we hope

00:40:14.720 you'll join us listen

00:40:15.840 to the honest talk

00:40:16.580 podcast on iHeart

00:40:17.700 radio or wherever you

00:40:18.860 listen to your

00:40:19.280 podcasts all right so

00:40:22.120 2002 you start

00:40:23.580 SpaceX like how do

00:40:25.120 you start a rocket

00:40:25.920 company like what's

00:40:26.740 the first day where

00:40:28.420 you're like I want to

00:40:29.180 make rockets and I

00:40:30.140 want to go to Mars

00:40:30.740 like what do you do

00:40:31.520 on day one so I

00:40:32.640 think you have to

00:40:33.020 start with a some

00:40:34.260 sort of philosophical

00:40:35.060 premise in order to

00:40:36.380 have in order for

00:40:37.820 the in order to be

00:40:38.860 in order to be highly

00:40:39.800 motivated you have to

00:40:41.040 have some philosophical

00:40:43.300 foundation in my case

00:40:44.780 it was that that we

00:40:46.580 want to expand the

00:40:47.980 scope and scale of

00:40:49.400 consciousness to better

00:40:51.460 understand the nature

00:40:52.360 of the universe and in

00:40:54.620 order to expand

00:40:55.660 scale expand

00:40:56.640 consciousness we need

00:40:57.880 to go beyond one

00:40:59.200 planet if you're for

00:41:00.160 one planet there's

00:41:01.360 there's too much risk

00:41:02.340 you know hopefully

00:41:02.920 earth civilization

00:41:04.120 prospers very far into

00:41:05.420 the future but it

00:41:05.940 may not there's

00:41:06.640 always some risk that

00:41:07.420 we are we self

00:41:08.580 annihilate through

00:41:09.160 nuclear war or that

00:41:10.620 there's a big meteor

00:41:11.740 that takes us out like

00:41:12.700 the dinosaurs yep

00:41:13.480 there's always some

00:41:14.380 risk if all your eggs

00:41:15.080 are in one basket so

00:41:16.120 it's going to be better

00:41:17.100 if we're multi-planet

00:41:18.940 species and then once

00:41:20.220 we're multi-planet

00:41:20.780 species that the next

00:41:21.700 step would be to be

00:41:22.620 multi-stellar and have

00:41:24.140 civilization among on

00:41:26.340 many different star

00:41:27.200 systems so in 2001 I

00:41:29.420 didn't think that I

00:41:30.060 could I didn't think

00:41:30.920 I could sell a rocket

00:41:31.500 company so I I thought

00:41:32.760 I'd take some of the

00:41:33.320 money from PayPal and

00:41:35.820 in that case I think

00:41:36.520 it was about 180

00:41:38.080 million dollars after

00:41:39.140 tax something like

00:41:40.720 that and I thought you

00:41:42.340 know I don't need 180

00:41:43.480 million dollars so I'll

00:41:45.380 spend a bunch of it on

00:41:46.580 a philanthropic Mars

00:41:48.680 mission to get the

00:41:50.500 public excited about

00:41:51.800 going back to Mars or

00:41:53.000 going to Mars I should

00:41:54.100 say yeah Mars was

00:41:56.040 always going to be the

00:41:56.680 destination after the

00:41:57.440 moon right in fact if

00:41:59.440 you told people in the

00:42:00.040 night in 1969 that it

00:42:01.880 would be 2025 and we've

00:42:03.480 not even gone back to

00:42:04.240 the moon let alone it's

00:42:05.520 hard to believe let alone

00:42:06.640 Mars they'd be like what

00:42:07.980 happened in civilization

00:42:08.740 civilization collapse top

00:42:10.420 yeah like like there

00:42:12.360 would be incomprehensible

00:42:13.320 that we've not been to

00:42:14.320 Mars by now if you told

00:42:15.440 people this and after

00:42:16.620 landing on the moon in

00:42:17.180 69 why do you think in

00:42:18.640 50 years America never

00:42:19.720 went back to the moon

00:42:20.420 well we destroyed the

00:42:21.700 Saturn 5 rocket that

00:42:22.740 was that could take

00:42:23.920 people to the moon and

00:42:24.960 had the space shuttle which

00:42:25.760 could only go to low

00:42:26.400 orbit and then there

00:42:28.340 really hasn't been

00:42:29.140 anything to replace any

00:42:31.320 no vehicle has been

00:42:32.420 made since then that

00:42:33.840 can go to the moon or

00:42:35.300 to Mars until the

00:42:37.060 SpaceX starship rocket

00:42:38.440 yeah so can't go to

00:42:40.040 Mars if you don't have

00:42:40.660 the ride so I remember

00:42:42.040 you and I first met in

00:42:44.480 2013 when when I was a

00:42:46.720 brand new baby senator

00:42:47.640 yeah and I was still

00:42:49.160 down in the basement

00:42:49.900 office they stick freshman

00:42:51.680 senators in a basement

00:42:52.540 office kind of like

00:42:53.300 hazing yeah yeah it's

00:42:54.180 what's that sounds like

00:42:54.780 there are a hundred

00:42:56.440 senate offices but for

00:42:57.460 six months you stay in

00:42:58.240 the basement put you

00:42:58.720 in a place but it's

00:42:59.480 like wearing beans

00:43:00.140 they want you know

00:43:02.060 where you're supposed

00:43:02.620 to be you know I gotta

00:43:03.280 say now 13 years into

00:43:04.760 it I think there's a

00:43:05.260 lot of wisdom to doing

00:43:06.080 that but you were down

00:43:08.660 in the basement office

00:43:09.520 and I remember you were

00:43:10.200 coming and sitting down

00:43:11.080 with SpaceX and at the

00:43:12.220 time the Air Force was

00:43:13.860 not letting y'all bid to

00:43:14.960 launch satellites and so

00:43:16.200 you were coming and

00:43:16.780 saying look we got a

00:43:17.820 company I think we can

00:43:18.580 do a really good job of

00:43:19.420 this and yet we're

00:43:20.060 locked out of this it's a

00:43:21.720 little amazing to think

00:43:23.000 the journey SpaceX has

00:43:24.300 gone from then to now

00:43:26.100 yes it's hard to believe

00:43:27.780 that this is all real

00:43:28.460 because originally

00:43:30.600 it's consistent with my

00:43:32.520 belief that we need to

00:43:33.180 become a multi-planet

00:43:34.540 species I thought the

00:43:35.280 only way to do that

00:43:35.840 would be through NASA

00:43:36.640 so and I think I

00:43:38.680 thought well if I can

00:43:40.060 just get the public

00:43:40.580 excited about Mars then

00:43:41.960 they'll do a mission to

00:43:43.060 Mars and so initially

00:43:44.960 my thought was to have

00:43:46.040 to send a small

00:43:46.720 greenhouse with seeds

00:43:48.480 and dehydrated nutrient

00:43:49.780 gel then land the

00:43:51.240 greenhouse hydrate the

00:43:52.820 seeds and you see

00:43:53.820 these this sort of

00:43:54.880 money shot the money

00:43:56.220 shot would be green

00:43:57.180 plants on a red

00:43:57.780 background yeah I also

00:44:00.020 recently know that

00:44:00.600 money shot has a

00:44:02.100 different meaning in

00:44:02.780 some other arenas but

00:44:04.460 yeah I'm glad you did

00:44:06.300 it's a very different

00:44:08.120 story but what I'm

00:44:10.320 trying to say is the

00:44:11.660 the captivating shot

00:44:13.260 would be the green

00:44:14.920 plants on a red

00:44:15.500 background and that

00:44:17.020 hopefully that would if

00:44:18.200 we did something like

00:44:18.720 that that would get the

00:44:19.320 public excited about

00:44:20.120 Mars that would increase

00:44:21.060 NASA's budget and then

00:44:22.360 we could send people to

00:44:23.140 Mars so your original

00:44:24.300 dream was NASA to do

00:44:25.320 this yes not you no

00:44:27.320 the original original

00:44:28.060 plan was literally to

00:44:30.540 take a bunch of the

00:44:31.420 money from PayPal and I

00:44:33.660 guess by some people's

00:44:34.380 definition waste it with

00:44:35.960 no profit yeah on a

00:44:37.900 non-profit thing it took I

00:44:40.060 wanted to spend a whole

00:44:40.640 bunch of my money for

00:44:41.620 free to get NASA's budget

00:44:42.660 to be bigger so we can go

00:44:43.700 to friggin Mars right

00:44:44.640 wow that's what I wanted

00:44:46.660 so that was the holy grail

00:44:48.260 that's what I wanted I

00:44:49.200 was like so when did

00:44:50.220 you change directions

00:44:50.940 why am I going to go to

00:44:51.340 Mars that's what I wanted

00:44:52.620 no when when did it

00:44:54.120 strike you okay you're

00:44:55.480 gonna have to do this if

00:44:56.280 you want I'll tell you it

00:44:56.980 gets crazier all right it

00:44:58.280 gets crazier so so then I

00:44:59.720 couldn't afford any of the

00:45:00.740 U.S. rockets because as

00:45:01.620 you know the U.S. rockets

00:45:02.360 are way too expensive the

00:45:03.420 Boeing Lockheed Lockheed

00:45:04.680 rockets are crazy money I

00:45:05.700 didn't have I didn't even

00:45:06.940 even with 180 million is

00:45:07.980 no way I could have

00:45:08.460 afforded

00:45:08.680 how much were they back

00:45:09.420 then

00:45:09.700 well the that with with

00:45:13.040 the additional stage to

00:45:15.080 get to Mars it would

00:45:15.780 have been about like 80

00:45:16.520 million so technically I

00:45:17.720 could have afforded one

00:45:18.520 of them but I wanted to

00:45:19.940 do two in case one of

00:45:21.100 them didn't work yeah so

00:45:22.800 and then I didn't have

00:45:24.320 enough money for that yeah

00:45:25.100 and I was sort of

00:45:25.920 prepared to you know I

00:45:27.640 don't know ways to have

00:45:28.980 the money and I figured

00:45:30.940 if I had 90 million left

00:45:32.020 that'd be fine you know

00:45:33.100 but ideally not all of

00:45:34.780 it so I went to Russia

00:45:36.580 twice to try to buy

00:45:38.420 ICBMs how interesting

00:45:39.880 how'd that go and who do

00:45:41.680 you call the Russian

00:45:43.260 rocket forces do they

00:45:44.820 sell ICBMs does that

00:45:46.080 work yeah

00:45:46.780 you got to tell us a

00:45:49.260 story that I want to

00:45:50.060 know who I was out of

00:45:51.000 warhead turns out you

00:45:51.820 can buy anything in

00:45:52.460 Russia yeah I like

00:45:54.800 please walk me down that

00:45:56.340 I want to know how you

00:45:57.340 made that phone call and

00:45:58.540 when you get there how did

00:45:59.840 that work and what do you

00:46:00.620 tell your friends yeah

00:46:01.620 listen I'm I'm going to

00:46:03.040 Russian advice to my

00:46:03.760 ICBMs I I might not

00:46:05.100 return you know

00:46:06.080 depending on this

00:46:07.360 situation literally

00:46:08.800 yeah so it gets slightly

00:46:12.320 less insane when you

00:46:13.320 when you understand that

00:46:15.480 the Russians had to

00:46:17.720 demolish a bunch of their

00:46:19.360 ICBMs because of you know

00:46:22.180 salt talks like yeah

00:46:23.280 right because of basically

00:46:24.660 an agreement between the

00:46:26.120 United States and and

00:46:27.340 Russia to reduce the total

00:46:28.660 number of ICBMs sure Russia

00:46:30.320 was actually obligated to

00:46:31.700 scrap a bunch of their

00:46:33.000 ICBMs so you took the very

00:46:34.480 biggest ICBMs you could

00:46:36.100 convert those into a

00:46:37.220 rocket at an additional

00:46:38.360 stage and and send

00:46:39.680 something to Mars so

00:46:40.840 those are big enough with

00:46:42.000 one more stage to get to

00:46:43.580 Mars to send a small

00:46:45.000 payload to Mars yeah so

00:46:46.380 the SS-18 so you try to

00:46:48.400 buy ICBMs do you succeed

00:46:49.660 or no or do you figure out

00:46:51.560 you got to build your own

00:46:52.340 instead they kept raising

00:46:53.700 the price on me so because

00:46:56.500 I figured like look they

00:46:57.420 got to throw these things

00:46:58.020 in the scrapyard anyway

00:46:58.820 yeah you should get a

00:46:59.700 really good deal yeah

00:47:00.680 right so the price started

00:47:03.160 out at 4 million then the

00:47:05.820 next conversation they

00:47:06.580 were at 8 million then

00:47:07.900 the next conversation they

00:47:08.860 were at like 19 million and

00:47:10.600 I'm like this is before we

00:47:11.700 signed a contract by the

00:47:12.520 way was there another

00:47:13.200 bidder was there another

00:47:14.740 bidder or were you the

00:47:15.400 only one trying to buy

00:47:16.200 them I think I don't know

00:47:17.880 if there were other bids but

00:47:18.820 they didn't mention any

00:47:19.420 other bids yeah but I was

00:47:20.940 like man if the price is

00:47:22.020 increasing this much before

00:47:23.160 the contract sign yeah I'm

00:47:24.700 really going to get

00:47:25.220 fleeced after the contract

00:47:26.160 yeah so so I got pretty

00:47:28.200 frustrated there actually in

00:47:31.100 some cases we got into like

00:47:32.080 shouting matches in

00:47:33.040 Moscow so some guys shouting

00:47:36.640 at me in Russian I'm

00:47:37.880 shouting back at him and

00:47:38.620 I'm very glad that my

00:47:39.380 interpreter is like that

00:47:40.680 yeah that put it out really

00:47:42.020 badly you know I'm like so

00:47:44.100 you are all I mean you're

00:47:45.800 all in

00:47:46.120 in Moscow yeah

00:47:50.760 so uh man I should have

00:47:53.820 recorded that that would have

00:47:54.600 been wonderful how many days

00:47:56.100 were you there negotiating

00:47:57.000 that first time I mean was

00:47:58.300 this like ongoing yeah yeah

00:48:00.000 this this took place these

00:48:01.960 conversations took place

00:48:02.920 over probably six months or

00:48:04.520 so wow um so um and then

00:48:07.500 the final trip trip there was

00:48:09.420 with the uh with was with

00:48:11.460 Mike Griffin who later became

00:48:12.680 NASA administrator um I I

00:48:15.340 actually realized in the in

00:48:16.700 the course of this that my

00:48:17.840 original premise was wrong

00:48:19.460 that that America actually has

00:48:21.160 plenty of will to go to Mars

00:48:22.980 but needs that it just needs a

00:48:24.940 way to Mars um that is

00:48:27.900 affordable um and that doesn't

00:48:29.560 break the budget you know

00:48:30.440 as you know we couldn't even

00:48:31.420 get to the space station we

00:48:32.520 needed the Russians to to get

00:48:33.880 us to our own space station

00:48:35.020 that was embarrassing it

00:48:36.000 really was pitiful I'm not

00:48:37.480 sure most Americans know just

00:48:38.660 how much we were being

00:48:39.800 fleeced like I think they got

00:48:40.860 up to like 90 million dollars

00:48:41.860 a seat yeah wow yeah

00:48:44.020 before a seat that cost them

00:48:45.440 like that was pre-doge

00:48:46.420 obviously yeah but it was the

00:48:48.240 only it was pretty yeah it was

00:48:49.440 before SpaceX yeah but 90

00:48:51.760 million dollars a seat for a

00:48:53.160 seat that cost them 10

00:48:53.920 million is high yeah that's a

00:48:56.980 lot of money yeah so a few

00:48:59.060 months ago you and I were

00:49:00.580 down in Boca Chica with the

00:49:02.300 president for a starship

00:49:03.440 launch and it is incredible

00:49:05.780 what you built in Boca Chica

00:49:07.060 yeah you know five years ago

00:49:08.640 it was an empty beach at the

00:49:10.580 southern tip of Texas

00:49:11.300 it's a sandbar yeah and it's

00:49:13.080 now a city and a factory where

00:49:15.480 you're building a rocket ship a

00:49:16.760 month with with incredible

00:49:18.100 precision yeah but one of the

00:49:19.880 things you you said to me when

00:49:21.140 we were down there that really

00:49:22.120 stood out to me is is is you

00:49:24.000 said your philosophy on

00:49:25.600 intellectual property I've

00:49:26.940 talked to lots of CEOs they're

00:49:28.240 like oh yeah we fight to guard

00:49:29.540 our IP and you and you had a

00:49:31.060 very different approach what

00:49:32.080 what's what's your view of IP

00:49:33.780 patents for the week

00:49:35.320 patents for those who

00:49:37.880 innovate slowly I literally do

00:49:40.020 not know anyone else in

00:49:41.500 business who would say

00:49:42.300 something like that like like

00:49:43.340 it was a startling and and

00:49:45.760 and and what Elon said down

00:49:46.940 there is he said look this

00:49:48.320 stuff I assume everyone will

00:49:49.480 steal everything but by the

00:49:50.560 time they steal it will be five

00:49:51.700 generations beyond and it

00:49:52.760 won't matter yes at at Tesla

00:49:55.480 we actually open source a lot

00:49:56.620 of patents so we said our

00:49:57.460 patents are anyone can use them

00:49:59.280 for free really um yeah uh

00:50:01.900 the only we only do patents

00:50:02.900 at Tesla to it to avoid patent

00:50:05.840 trolls causing causing trouble

00:50:07.320 so we'll try to look ahead and

00:50:10.120 say okay patent trolls are going

00:50:11.460 to trial patent you know file

00:50:13.160 patents to block certain things

00:50:14.180 we'll file patents and then

00:50:15.220 open source that make it free I

00:50:17.060 mean I'm going to say patents

00:50:17.940 for the week now there are a few

00:50:19.360 uh cases in in say with

00:50:21.800 pharmaceuticals where it might

00:50:23.020 cost you a billion dollars to do a

00:50:24.400 phase three uh human file um but

00:50:27.000 then subsequently the drug is

00:50:29.080 very cheap to manufacture so

00:50:30.900 cases there are some in my

00:50:32.500 opinion which is massively

00:50:33.920 reduced what can be patented um

00:50:36.080 and and and say because the

00:50:38.220 whole point of patenting is is to

00:50:39.920 maximize innovation not inhibit it

00:50:41.780 um and in my opinion it's maybe

00:50:44.700 a controversial opinion uh most

00:50:46.440 patents inhibit innovation they do

00:50:48.040 not help it um but there are

00:50:50.240 cases I want to do want to single

00:50:51.700 out cases like where such as a

00:50:53.500 case three clinical trial it might

00:50:54.940 cost a billion dollars but the

00:50:56.100 then the drugs thereafter cost a

00:50:57.960 few dollars to a manufacturer and

00:51:00.300 and if you can then immediately

00:51:01.860 copy those drugs for a few

00:51:03.200 dollars no one will pay for the

00:51:04.360 billion dollars there's a free

00:51:05.120 rider prop free rider problem

00:51:06.600 yeah exactly so you have to

00:51:07.820 address the free rider problem but

00:51:09.340 other than that there should be no

00:51:10.340 patents the ideas are easy you

00:51:12.820 want ideas to flow maximum to

00:51:15.400 people to get there faster and do

00:51:17.280 things bigger the idea is the easy

00:51:19.220 part uh the heart execution is the

00:51:21.660 hard part as the old saying goes

00:51:23.600 it's one percent inspiration if not

00:51:25.980 less than one percent and 99 percent

00:51:27.620 perspiration but I'll say the

00:51:29.220 perspiration part you're really damn

00:51:31.020 good at also because you're making

00:51:32.920 you know the companies you're

00:51:34.160 building are actually building stuff

00:51:37.360 they're building cars they're

00:51:38.520 building spaceships they're building

00:51:39.680 things that if they don't work it's

00:51:41.000 a real problem and and yeah the

00:51:42.760 precision you manufacture things with

00:51:45.180 how do you get that level of

00:51:46.920 precision how do you get how do you

00:51:48.380 build a culture you're not you're

00:51:50.900 amazing at thinking outside the box

00:51:52.820 but but what's interesting is you're

00:51:54.580 you may even be better at

00:51:55.860 execution which is how do you

00:51:58.440 execute so effectively well I take a

00:52:00.460 physics first principles approach to

00:52:02.280 everything it's not as though I I

00:52:04.360 wanted to insource manufacturing it's

00:52:06.880 just that I was unable to outsource

00:52:08.780 it effectively so you know the idea

00:52:11.880 the beginning of Tesla was that we

00:52:13.400 would outsource almost all the

00:52:15.580 manufacturing but then it turned out

00:52:17.840 there was no there were no good

00:52:19.880 companies to outsource manufacturing

00:52:22.040 to which there wasn't really really

00:52:24.840 wasn't feasible outsource

00:52:26.180 manufacturing actually is the

00:52:28.460 exception of the rule and and just

00:52:31.400 over time we had to insource almost

00:52:32.880 everything for Tesla and same for

00:52:34.360 SpaceX I became very good at

00:52:36.180 manufacturing because I had to there

00:52:38.280 was no choice at this point I might

00:52:39.880 know more about manufacturing than any

00:52:41.940 any human ever has because I've

00:52:43.660 done so many I've manufactured so

00:52:45.400 many different things in so many

00:52:46.440 different arenas I think probably

00:52:48.580 more than anyone ever has look

00:52:50.540 that's that sounds like an

00:52:52.320 astonishing statement but it's not a

00:52:54.020 crazy statement and you're somehow

00:52:55.800 running Tesla and running SpaceX and

00:52:59.280 running X and running the boring

00:53:01.020 company and running Neuralink and

00:53:03.060 doing Doge how much do you sleep in a

00:53:05.500 given night about six hours on

00:53:07.180 average so about six so that's it

00:53:09.540 wouldn't have shocked me if you said

00:53:10.480 three or four so the next question

00:53:12.060 is how many hours do you work a day I

00:53:14.060 work almost every waking hour and

00:53:16.400 Ben he he's not kidding at that like

00:53:18.700 when Elon and I were first getting to

00:53:20.000 know each other I suggested I said

00:53:22.440 hey let's grab dinner sometime and I

00:53:24.340 don't know if you remember what you

00:53:25.020 said you said I don't eat dinner I

00:53:27.560 don't have social dinners right I

00:53:29.580 mean that yeah I mean you obviously

00:53:31.200 eat food but yes but the idea of like I

00:53:35.800 don't but it was it was just kind of

00:53:38.660 matter of fact what why would I go to

00:53:40.460 dinner like I you just you work uh

00:53:43.660 yeah I literally just thought I'll have

00:53:45.380 lunch and dinner abroad during meetings

00:53:46.900 and continue being how many nights have

00:53:49.860 you slept at your offices you think

00:53:51.780 your career percentage wise where you

00:53:54.000 say I just got to take this nap

00:53:55.700 basically because my body forces me to

00:53:57.540 and I got to get back to work fast and

00:53:59.360 efficiently without going somewhere

00:54:00.820 else well I guess it started out even

00:54:04.100 with the first company sub 2 which is

00:54:07.280 terrible name but the first internet

00:54:09.140 company um the we were able to rent an

00:54:12.280 office uh which was like in a leaky

00:54:14.280 attic essentially for $500 a month and

00:54:17.440 the cheapest um apartment we could find

00:54:20.240 was $800 a month so like and we only

00:54:23.320 had about $5,000 between our brother and

00:54:25.680 I so like we're not we'll just stay in

00:54:28.940 the office yeah so we got some um

00:54:31.280 couches that converted into beds um and

00:54:34.200 we'd uh kind of sleep at night and then

00:54:36.400 we just have like uh turn the beds back

00:54:39.100 into couches uh before anyone came and

00:54:41.680 then we'd shower at the YMCA down the

00:54:43.400 road and so that went that that that

00:54:45.400 literally was the for several months what

00:54:48.340 we did I was in great shape you know uh

00:54:50.960 work out at the Y um I still remember

00:54:53.140 that that YMCA uh at uh Page Miller

00:54:55.820 Al Camino uh in Palo Alto so that was a

00:54:58.780 long time ago so it's been I don't know

00:55:00.360 I've never thought to count it but uh

00:55:03.160 several hundred days maybe I don't know

00:55:04.860 so you're now the richest man on earth

00:55:07.100 do you still sleep at the office well

00:55:09.340 that's true maybe Mars we'll we'll find

00:55:12.200 someone else but I think if so if

00:55:14.200 someone is a sovereign head of a country

00:55:15.800 they're de facto richer by a lot do you

00:55:17.900 still sleep at the office now I've

00:55:19.680 sometimes slept at the office yeah as

00:55:21.680 always thank you for listening to

00:55:23.900 verdict with Senator Ted Cruz Ben

00:55:25.740 Ferguson with you don't forget to

00:55:27.100 download my podcast and you can listen

00:55:28.900 to my podcast every other day you're

00:55:30.220 not listening to verdict or each day

00:55:31.840 when you listen to verdict afterwards

00:55:33.100 I'd love to have you as a listener to

00:55:35.340 again the Ben Ferguson podcast and we

00:55:37.440 will see you back here tomorrow morning

00:55:39.480 this is an iHeart podcast

00:55:42.180 guaranteed human

Verdict with Ted Cruz - January 02, 2026

A Look Inside Elon Musk's Vision： Complete Interview

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