Verdict with Ted Cruz - BONUS - Daily Review with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton - Apr 24 2025

00:00:00.000 This is an iHeart Podcast.

00:00:02.460 Guaranteed human.

00:00:04.340 Welcome in Thursday edition Clay Travis Buck Sexton show.

00:00:09.640 I am live at a minor league baseball stadium in Knoxville, Tennessee, Buck.

00:00:15.160 There is no minor league baseball game going on.

00:00:17.880 There would seem to be no reason whatsoever why three different guys with leaf blowers

00:00:23.520 would need to be on a field with zero leaves.

00:00:25.900 But as I sat down to begin this broadcast, my eternal nemesis, people with leaf blowers, 0.51

00:00:31.960 maybe they're doing this just because they knew I was going to be broadcasting here.

00:00:36.080 There are three different guys with leaf blowers walking around out on the field,

00:00:40.880 and there are no leaves, and they're all blasting their leaf blowers as loud as they possibly can.

00:00:45.260 So if you hear that in the background, hopefully at some point their gasoline will run out

00:00:49.680 and their leaf blowers.

00:00:50.660 But I'm excited to be here.

00:00:52.300 I'm going to be doing a speech right after.

00:00:54.660 It's going to be fun.

00:00:56.120 Obviously, Knoxville is an awesome place.

00:00:57.960 We've got a big audience all over the place, but a lot of people up here are fans,

00:01:02.280 and so we're having a good time.

00:01:04.060 Buck, today, huge numbers of our audience will be watching something that you had no idea was going on

00:01:09.960 until I'm about to say it right now.

00:01:11.560 The NFL draft in Green Bay, Wisconsin is underway.

00:01:16.400 I will be watching this tonight along with probably 20 million or so other people,

00:01:21.820 many of whom are listening to us right now.

00:01:23.720 I believe Green Bay is one of our newest affiliates, if I'm not mistaken,

00:01:28.080 so we appreciate all of you up there in Cheddarland.

00:01:31.260 We were already very popular in the state of Wisconsin,

00:01:33.860 and we've had a lot of awesome friends that we've made in that state over the past several years,

00:01:39.460 but that should be an awesome scene.

00:01:42.340 Now, a bunch of different stories that are out there.

00:01:45.000 Let me give you a little bit of a roadmap of where we're headed.

00:01:46.900 Dana Perino, who, for my money, may be the nicest person in all of media.

00:01:52.720 That is the standard that I think she might well be able to win. 0.99

00:01:57.160 It's a tough standard.

00:01:58.160 There are a lot of super nice people, but Dana Perino, who many of you watch at America's Newsroom

00:02:01.880 every day on Fox News with Bill Hemmer, will be on with us at 1, and then I think this is going to be incredible.

00:02:09.020 I'm super excited for this.

00:02:10.620 Dr. Larry Arnn, the president of Hillsdale College, they had a fabulous interview with him

00:02:15.800 in the Saturday-Sunday edition, the weekend edition of the Wall Street Journal,

00:02:20.000 and there's been so much discussion about Harvard suing the Trump administration

00:02:25.040 over what the Trump administration is focused on there,

00:02:27.980 and they actually have a really good argument that is Hillsdale and Larry Arnn do.

00:02:33.740 They said, hey, the reason we don't take federal dollars is because we want complete independence.

00:02:38.680 When you take taxpayer money, you are giving up complete independence.

00:02:43.160 Why can't Harvard, with a $53 billion endowment, just say, thanks but no thanks, U.S. federal government.

00:02:49.200 We're concerned about our ability to have complete freedom when it comes to teaching as we see fit

00:02:54.860 and running the university as we see fit.

00:02:57.300 Well, the precedent is quite clear.

00:02:59.200 When you are allowing federal tax dollars to be used, you don't get that complete freedom.

00:03:05.140 We'll dive into that with him.

00:03:06.300 I think you guys are really going to enjoy it.

00:03:07.740 But, Buck, yesterday I got a lot of feedback from moms and dads out there

00:03:11.860 who were listening to us talk about the books that were being read in Montgomery County schools.

00:03:19.580 And, honestly, even I was – I knew that there were, like, kind of edgy books that were being pushed.

00:03:25.640 I went back after we talked yesterday, Buck, and looked at these books even more.

00:03:31.520 The fact that this has gone all the way to the Supreme Court, that parents would be saying, hey,

00:03:37.180 we need to object to what are being read to our five-year-olds and our six-year-olds at story time,

00:03:44.540 is, I think, emblematic of the country just losing its way.

00:03:47.520 And not only that, I went back and read more and studied on the Supreme Court discussion surrounding this case,

00:03:55.120 and I couldn't stop focusing, Buck, on Ketanji Brown-Jackson and the arrogance.

00:04:01.060 We may end up with a couple of cuts from her, the questions that she asked.

00:04:04.700 She – her defense of these books being read to five-year-olds that tell you, hey,

00:04:10.620 if you believe you're a boy and you're a girl, you're right, and your parents should treat you that way.

00:04:16.500 And sometimes we end up in situations where people get the gender wrong, meaning when you are born,

00:04:22.980 a doctor in the nursing room – in the delivery room is unclear of whether you're a boy or a girl.

00:04:28.940 This is what's being read to them.

00:04:30.340 And Ketanji Brown-Jackson said, well, if you don't like it, you should just switch schools.

00:04:36.600 This was her actual take.

00:04:38.020 Listen to this.

00:04:38.700 I guess I'm struggling to see how it burdens a parent's religious exercise

00:04:43.100 if the school teaches something that the parent disagrees with.

00:04:48.200 You have a choice.

00:04:49.080 You don't have to send your kid to that school.

00:04:51.120 You can put them in another situation.

00:04:54.480 This is one of the most arrogant things I have seen argued.

00:04:59.120 I would bet 95% of the people that are listening to us right now don't have great options

00:05:07.020 when it comes to just pulling your kid out of your local public school.

00:05:11.720 And so for her defense of this, Buck, to be, well, if you don't like it, you should just go to a new school.

00:05:18.580 First of all, they oppose school choice by and large.

00:05:21.380 But second, it's one of the most arrogant arguments I have heard that you should just change your public school.

00:05:30.100 Of course.

00:05:31.160 And what you see here is the continuation of this argument from the left that they aren't doing indoctrination 0.93

00:05:39.380 indoctrination and, in a sense, a secular religious training with all this transgender delusional nonsense, right? 1.00

00:05:47.660 This is – they've managed to try to kick God and faith out of public schools 0.98

00:05:53.860 and replace it with this Marxist credo of insanity.

00:05:59.900 And this is why they push the stuff that they do as hard as they do.

00:06:04.140 This is the big question, I think, Clay, we kept returning to yesterday.

00:06:07.540 Why is this so important to them?

00:06:09.580 It's clearly very important.

00:06:11.800 So much so that they are willing to look at parents – well, sometimes.

00:06:17.720 Look at parents in the eyes and say, yes, your kid needs to learn that doctors get the gender wrong at birth. 1.00

00:06:23.420 Like, we think your kids need to be read that in schools.

00:06:26.240 It is completely nuts.

00:06:28.120 But it also goes to one of the great things, I think, about the Trump administration right now

00:06:32.720 and one of the reasons why the left hates it so much.

00:06:35.980 And the more they despise either a person or a policy, the more important I think we all recognize it to be.

00:06:42.460 And that is, Clay, the forever regime, which is what the Democrats had set up for really certainly the last 20 years or so.

00:06:51.000 The forever regime of the deep state, people within the federal bureaucracy who are pushing a left-wing agenda,

00:06:57.300 the universities, which have become completely political monocultures of left-wing madness, media,

00:07:05.920 all these things together allow them to assert control at different levels of society, even if they lose an election.

00:07:13.660 Trump is going after that.

00:07:15.340 And I think it's critical that we see that for what it is.

00:07:17.820 He is going into the kitchen of the enemy and saying, you don't get to just cook whatever you want and call the shots anymore.

00:07:24.940 And that's really shaking them up.

00:07:26.840 That's beyond just what is Congress going to do, what executive orders are out there.

00:07:31.880 So I think that we're seeing, finally, after many years of saying, when are we going to take on the universities?

00:07:38.440 When are we going to start to enforce civil rights law in a way that is advantaged, let's just be honest,

00:07:47.660 advantaging conservative and Republican and right-wing points of view?

00:07:52.500 This has been a long time coming, and I think it's fantastic.

00:07:55.900 And I think that the fact that they're still trying to push this transgender nonsense on the kids in school 1.00

00:08:00.040 just shows you how completely bonkers they are, unrepentantly nuts. 0.99

00:08:04.060 What I said yesterday, Clay, sorry, I know I'm ranting here, but what I said yesterday, 0.93

00:08:07.980 if they could force your kids to learn this stuff or else, they would do so, and we all know it,

00:08:14.720 meaning that they would mandate this stuff if they could get away with it nationwide.

00:08:18.900 I'm talking nationwide, not just in one school district.

00:08:22.340 Have you ever been to an elementary school and read books to kids?

00:08:28.540 You're new in the dad game, so it would not surprise me if you haven't.

00:08:32.460 I volunteered at an underserved D.C. public school in a program a few times,

00:08:39.500 but I would think they were like ninth graders.

00:08:43.900 Hopefully you weren't reading books to them, which would be very funny.

00:08:48.240 No, I was helping.

00:08:49.880 It was like a homework help program.

00:08:51.680 I was just trying to think about this.

00:08:52.760 I have been to multiple schools over the years, and I bet a lot of you with young kids,

00:09:00.140 grandparents maybe as well, have been and gotten to sit in front of the kids and read books.

00:09:06.980 And my recollection is that when I've done it, the teacher, and the teachers have all been fantastic,

00:09:13.120 have said, hey, we've got two or three books that you can choose from.

00:09:17.500 If I brought a book like that in, if they had said, hey, Clay, you're reading for kindergartners today,

00:09:24.440 you can pick any book, I would see that as a direct attack in some way on the school district and on the kids.

00:09:32.780 If I walked in with those books that we were talking about yesterday and tried to sit down and read it,

00:09:40.160 not only would it be inappropriate, wildly, but it would actually, to me, be an assault on the school itself

00:09:47.440 and on those kids because there are ages, and this is why I think it's a wild book.

00:09:52.260 This case brings together Muslim, Jewish, and Christian parents who said this is unacceptable.

00:09:58.700 And I think everybody out there, five, six, seven-year-old kids, eight-year-olds,

00:10:03.300 what are you doing teaching gender ideology to them?

00:10:06.820 It's actually sinister, and it's nasty, and to me, it's diabolical.

00:10:12.820 I mean, this is close to evil.

00:10:15.440 And what you see is that they, and this has always been true of a lot of this gender cult stuff, 0.84

00:10:20.820 they want as many people as possible to be subjected to it and involved in it

00:10:26.000 because then you've been a part of the process.

00:10:28.940 This is one of the things that you saw also with COVID, I might just add.

00:10:32.000 They wanted you to police your neighbors.

00:10:33.560 They wanted you to be shouting at people to mask up. 1.00

00:10:35.680 They wanted you to be one of the useful idiots in that process 1.00

00:10:39.040 because then you're invested in the perpetuation of that system. 1.00

00:10:43.100 Any adult, any teacher, anyone who shows up at one of these meetings

00:10:47.380 in defense of this stuff is going to be very hard,

00:10:51.020 and especially if it's a parent who has pushed for this for their children,

00:10:55.380 very hard to get them to see the light and understand how bad this is down the line.

00:11:00.680 So they want to push it as fast as they can, as aggressively as they can,

00:11:05.000 because it's building the roster, if you will.

00:11:07.720 It's like forcing recruits onto their side,

00:11:10.820 which is obviously at the heart of what they're doing with these kids as well.

00:11:13.500 But it is essentially a secular religion of sorts is what they are pushing.

00:11:19.480 I mean, here's another experiment you could go on, Clay.

00:11:22.200 What if you said, okay, fine, I'm okay with my school district reading this stuff,

00:11:26.880 but also we're going to have some conservative children's books in there

00:11:30.120 that say that boys are boys and girls are girls, 0.76

00:11:32.900 and people that have problems in their head should go see adults

00:11:37.740 and speak to them about it and not expect everybody to cater to them.

00:11:41.320 Would that be okay?

00:11:42.300 I don't think so.

00:11:44.000 No.

00:11:44.800 And look, there are so many amazing kids' books that you can choose.

00:11:50.920 It's not as if there aren't 600, 1,000 Newberry, I think,

00:11:56.380 is the award-winning children's books.

00:11:59.660 It's actually, I would imagine, for a lot of you who have been elementary school kids,

00:12:02.980 tough, I mean, teachers, tough to pick what you read.

00:12:06.120 If I ask you right now, what are books that you just have a fond memory of from,

00:12:11.480 I'm talking your childhood, too.

00:12:13.020 I'm talking, I remember, I remember all the way back to the Very Hungry Caterpillar.

00:12:17.660 Some of you probably remember that one.

00:12:19.040 Yeah, classic.

00:12:19.940 James and the Giant Peach, Where the Wild Things Are, The Wind in the Willows, The Hobbit.

00:12:26.560 I mean, you go back.

00:12:28.360 Think about that, Clay.

00:12:29.400 Like, I mean, you could do the same thing, right?

00:12:30.680 You go back, you think, oh, well, you're talking about being, what, an eight-year-old?

00:12:35.200 So we're going back almost, what, 40, you know, 30, 40 years?

00:12:40.840 And you remember those books.

00:12:42.220 That's the kind of influence they had on your thinking at that time in those formative years.

00:12:48.160 The communists know this.

00:12:50.940 This is their little red book of gender madness that they're making teachers and kids hold up 1.00

00:12:59.940 and pledge allegiance to in these schools.

00:13:02.080 And that's why Ketanji Brown-Jackson is willing to make, she'll make any argument to keep this stuff.

00:13:06.340 Any argument.

00:13:08.280 I want to say one positive thing.

00:13:10.340 I mentioned this yesterday, and I'm not sure how many of you are familiar with it.

00:13:14.160 One of the greatest things that I've ever seen a celebrity do,

00:13:18.060 Dolly Parton has something called the Dolly Parton Imagination Library.

00:13:23.000 I'm not sure if it's only available to kids in Tennessee right now,

00:13:26.720 but they will send your kids free books, you know, the little engine that could.

00:13:33.300 We were signed up for this for our kids, and they were so excited to do it.

00:13:37.820 Dolly Parton did it, Buck, because she grew up in rural East Tennessee 0.99

00:13:41.820 and didn't have access to kids' books.

00:13:45.260 I mean, they're fabulous.

00:13:46.020 She's given, Buck, 277 million books to kids to be able to experience reading

00:13:54.400 that otherwise might not, that their parents could read for them.

00:13:57.260 As we remember, this is why Dolly Parton is the Queen Elizabeth of the Smoky Mountains.

00:14:04.980 She is amazing, Buck.

00:14:06.580 And I want to say something positive associated with this.

00:14:09.880 So I think it's available all over the United States.

00:14:11.880 It's imaginationlibrary.com if you're a kid, if you've got grandkids,

00:14:16.300 if you've got kids, or if you want to donate.

00:14:18.860 I don't know anybody at Imagination Library.

00:14:21.280 I'm just telling you that they have done amazing work.

00:14:24.160 And on the positive side, there are people trying to get uplifting,

00:14:28.600 normal books in the hands of kids to help them have, hopefully,

00:14:32.580 a lifelong love of reading, which both you and I would agree

00:14:35.500 is probably the best gift that a parent can give a child

00:14:39.380 because it works across the board.

00:14:41.880 Look, in times of adversity, it's really when you find out who your friends are.

00:14:45.160 People in Israel know they can count on most Americans.

00:14:47.720 Your ongoing support for the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews

00:14:51.400 proved positive of that.

00:14:53.200 Anything but normal right now in Israel, I saw it with myself, 0.99

00:14:56.560 the amount of bomb shelters that are needed,

00:14:59.440 the amount of first responders who need armored security vehicles, ambulances.

00:15:03.980 It's unbelievable in the wake of October 7th how much help they need

00:15:08.060 and how many of you out there, Christians and Jews,

00:15:10.400 have come together to take a stand with Israel.

00:15:13.120 You can call to make your gift to those in the Holy Land at 888-488-IFCJ.

00:15:19.380 That's 888-488-4325.

00:15:22.380 You can also go online to supportifcj.org to give that website, supportifcj.org.

00:15:31.660 Making America great again isn't just one man, it's many.

00:15:36.360 The Team 47 podcast.

00:15:38.620 Sundays at noon Eastern in the Clay and Buck podcast feed.

00:15:42.080 Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:15:45.900 Canadian women are looking for more, more out of themselves, 1.00

00:15:49.680 their businesses, their elected leaders, and the world around them.

00:15:52.800 And that's why we're thrilled to introduce the Honest Talk podcast.

00:15:56.520 I'm Jennifer Stewart.

00:15:57.700 And I'm Catherine Clark.

00:15:58.940 And in this podcast, we interview Canada's most inspiring women.

00:16:02.700 Entrepreneurs, artists, athletes, politicians, and newsmakers,

00:16:06.240 all at different stages of their journey.

00:16:08.420 So if you're looking to connect, then we hope you'll join us.

00:16:11.420 Listen to the Honest Talk podcast on iHeartRadio

00:16:14.040 or wherever you listen to your podcasts.

00:16:15.900 Welcome in, Clay Travis, Buck Sexton Show.

00:16:20.840 Appreciate all of you hanging out with us.

00:16:23.220 I'm in Knoxville, Buck's down in Miami.

00:16:26.120 We are having a fabulous Thursday with all of you.

00:16:29.800 Encourage you to go subscribe to the podcast.

00:16:31.640 If you haven't already, you can search out my name, Clay Travis.

00:16:33.980 You can search out Buck Sexton.

00:16:35.260 Also, you can download the iHeartRadio app.

00:16:38.160 Met a guy on Monday at the CAA World Congress of Sport at the bar.

00:16:44.160 I was getting a beer, and he pulled it up, and he said,

00:16:46.640 hey, I listened on the iHeartRadio app.

00:16:48.420 He was from Chicago.

00:16:49.540 Probably listening right now.

00:16:50.740 Appreciate him in the sports marketing universe.

00:16:53.960 And a lot of you out there listening on podcasts, 550-plus AM FM stations,

00:16:59.020 and also on so many different ways, including the iHeartRadio app.

00:17:03.480 And we bring in now Dr. Larry Arnn of Hillsdale College.

00:17:07.220 And speaking of ways to get your message out, Hillsdale has been phenomenal at getting the

00:17:12.220 message out about everything that they are doing.

00:17:15.120 And I had the good fortune to get to sit next to Dr. Larry Arnn at a Seattle, Washington

00:17:20.760 area Hillsdale College event.

00:17:22.920 And I read over the weekend a great weekend interview with you, Dr. Arnn, given all the

00:17:29.260 controversy surrounding Harvard and federal funding of universities and colleges out there.

00:17:34.640 You had a really good argument.

00:17:36.060 I want to let you make it for our audience.

00:17:38.260 The reason Hillsdale doesn't take federal dollars is to be completely independent.

00:17:42.660 Harvard has $53 billion in the endowment.

00:17:45.940 Why can't Harvard just say, hey, we don't need any of this federal government money.

00:17:49.380 We want to instruct in the best way that Harvard feels possible.

00:17:52.780 That seems like a pretty good case to me.

00:17:54.400 And you guys have done it at Hillsdale.

00:17:56.720 Yeah, thank you very much.

00:17:58.380 You're a sports guy.

00:17:59.220 And I really enjoyed talking to you that.

00:18:00.700 And I enjoyed your speech very much.

00:18:03.520 Yeah, so we live in what we think of as a liberal society.

00:18:07.980 That means free.

00:18:08.980 That means a lot of things have to go on in the society so that it can control the government.

00:18:14.180 And if the government, in detail, manages education, including higher education, then the society loses its independence.

00:18:23.460 And, you know, Harvard, which gets a lot of money from the government, I mean billions, they are living under hundreds of pages of detailed rules.

00:18:33.840 And they'd probably be better off without them. 0.83

00:18:35.460 But now they've met some rules they don't like, like don't scream, don't let the students scream dirty Jew at each other. 0.82

00:18:43.160 And they are rebelling about that.

00:18:45.740 And that's, you know, they're in an interesting spot, aren't they?

00:18:49.800 They're not the only ones either, Dr. Arn.

00:18:51.880 I appreciate you being with us.

00:18:53.020 There are a number of schools, Columbia University.

00:18:54.940 I could rattle off a few more if I thought about it, but some pretty big name educational institutions out there that have gotten on the wrong side of the Trump administration and therefore the federal government on some of these issues.

00:19:08.340 Do you think that their plan is to just try to batten down the hatches and ride it out and keep doing what they've been doing?

00:19:15.960 Because in the case of admissions, for example, the Supreme Court has been quite clear that some of these institutions have been engaged in unconstitutional discrimination in their educational practice and admissions practices.

00:19:29.120 And yet the understanding seems to be that they're just going to keep doing it and get federal dollars.

00:19:35.520 Yeah, there's something really bad about that.

00:19:38.780 I mean, first of all, the institutions we're talking about are some of the greatest universities in the world.

00:19:43.440 Harvard is the oldest in our country.

00:19:45.200 And it has been a treasure for a very long time, and it's still a very elite place.

00:19:50.720 But they got wedded to the idea that what color you are is some vital characteristic in your qualification to be a student.

00:20:00.680 And that's just wrong.

00:20:02.780 I mean, it's bad philosophy.

00:20:05.620 It undercuts the whole understanding of the academic task.

00:20:08.800 And as you point out, it's unconstitutional in a nation devoted to all men are created equal.

00:20:15.520 So there's, you know, and they are stubborn about it.

00:20:20.260 It's deeply ingrained.

00:20:22.660 It was amazing to me a year ago in the spring that they were having these demonstrations in favor of Hamas and, you know, river to the sea.

00:20:33.040 And they were oppressing Jewish kids. 0.89

00:20:36.140 I mean, abusing them and spitting on them. 0.95

00:20:38.680 And some of them were assaulted physically.

00:20:40.800 And they were certainly terrorized.

00:20:43.360 And they couldn't stop it.

00:20:45.780 And in Columbia, they suspended class.

00:20:48.480 At Harvard, there were major disruptions.

00:20:50.840 And I thought, at some point, these places are run by people who are in broad agreement with each other.

00:20:57.340 At some point, you'd think they'd say, this is embarrassing.

00:21:01.000 We should go back to class.

00:21:02.820 That's what we're here to do.

00:21:04.220 And they couldn't do it.

00:21:06.340 And that's just, you know, sad.

00:21:08.360 It made me sad.

00:21:10.200 Also surprised.

00:21:12.880 And, you know, they've got some problems.

00:21:16.060 Now, they are addressing those problems, they say.

00:21:22.260 And I sometimes doubt their capacity to do that.

00:21:26.980 And the Trump administration is demanding certain monitoring of them.

00:21:32.000 And that's what they're kicking about and rebelling.

00:21:34.340 And Harvard has sued the government.

00:21:36.880 And it's going to be a big legal fight.

00:21:39.600 And, you know, but think of the outcome.

00:21:42.340 If they win, it would mean that they're entitled to the money.

00:21:48.860 You can't stop it.

00:21:50.540 On the ground that they are discriminating and oppressing people because of their race and religion.

00:21:58.660 And, you know, the government may not monitor that.

00:22:03.400 Well, at the beginning of the show, you said what I think is the actual solution.

00:22:07.940 We need to decentralize very many things in America.

00:22:12.340 There's way too many rules coming from the top and making a uniform administrative system all over every kind of industry, all over the place.

00:22:22.300 And colleges should be funded in a wide diversity of ways.

00:22:26.820 You know, there's, like, really rich people in America.

00:22:31.260 And, you know, a lot of them give money to Harvard.

00:22:33.540 And a lot of them don't.

00:22:36.220 Well, the thing is, those rich people disagree with each other.

00:22:38.700 And so, if it's the government, it's a uniform rule for everybody.

00:22:44.640 And you have to have that sum.

00:22:46.960 But you don't have to have that so comprehensively.

00:22:50.940 And especially affecting something sensitive like education, which is, you know, where, what college is actually for,

00:22:59.440 is for young people to go and grow into excellent human beings in intellect and character.

00:23:06.680 And the definition of that is human.

00:23:09.980 And that means Jews and Arabs should both aim for that.

00:23:14.000 And the institutions of higher education should have practices and standards so that everybody pursues that and does it together.

00:23:22.300 The word college means partnership.

00:23:25.300 So, they've lost their way, in my opinion.

00:23:29.660 And I hope they find it.

00:23:31.520 But they're fighting very hard not to do it.

00:23:35.860 Dr. Larry Arnn with us right now.

00:23:37.640 Hillsdale College.

00:23:38.620 Fabulous school.

00:23:39.760 You've got kids out there.

00:23:40.680 Not a bad place to consider applying.

00:23:42.600 I'm in Knoxville, Tennessee right now, Dr. Arnn.

00:23:45.560 Basically, I can see the University of Tennessee campus nearly from where I'm broadcasting.

00:23:50.360 I'm curious how you would analyze this in your career as an educator.

00:23:55.380 It used to be that people looked down on big state schools in the South.

00:24:00.260 Tennessee, Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Arkansas, whatever school you want to use in the Southeastern Conference region.

00:24:09.760 Now, I hear all the time, and I bet you do as well, for Hillsdale applications, people in New York, L.A., Chicago,

00:24:16.840 who would have said in the past, oh, I would never send my son or daughter to the University of Alabama

00:24:22.780 or the University of Mississippi bragging about their kids going to SEC schools.

00:24:28.220 Because what you just referenced, these protests, they didn't stand for them in the South.

00:24:33.560 They didn't stand for attacking Jewish people in the wake of October 7th.

00:24:37.940 What does it say about the cultural shift in our landscape that big state schools in the South are suddenly desirable across the country

00:24:45.360 and small schools like yours in Michigan that are independent and classically committed to education

00:24:50.840 are surging in popularity, while places like Harvard, Yale, UCLA, Stanford,

00:24:57.160 that maybe in the past have been the absolute paragons of academic achievement, seem to be declining.

00:25:02.220 What does that tell us?

00:25:03.060 Isn't that something?

00:25:04.920 And, you know, that has to do with the politics of those states.

00:25:08.480 You know, Hillsdale is a special case because we don't take any money from the government,

00:25:11.540 and we're old and committed to certain things that we've been committed to for 182 years.

00:25:17.440 But those, you know, in a state like Tennessee or Arkansas, I'm from Arkansas,

00:25:23.960 you know, the government and several state legislatures, including in Tennessee,

00:25:28.520 have set up centers in those places where friends of mine are teaching now,

00:25:34.380 and they, you know, make sure they're sane.

00:25:37.480 But the general climate of those places is not so what?

00:25:44.260 The most elite places in America, and that it's not just in higher ed, it's the Ivy League,

00:25:49.480 but it's journalism, it's the government, it's big corporations,

00:25:53.120 they look at the world as sort of an engineering project, and we're going to remake the world.

00:25:59.920 And so they don't, you know, they've got very unusual views about a family and sex,

00:26:06.900 and it turns out that what's going on in America is that's not working with lots of people.

00:26:13.960 Like, you know, why, you know, we, you know, I think people ought to get married and have kids,

00:26:20.800 because it makes your life richer, and it's cool, and it's hard.

00:26:26.400 But if you do that, what do you think about the kids?

00:26:30.460 What do you want them to become?

00:26:32.180 They are produced by a relationship and a sacrifice that parents make for decades.

00:26:38.260 And so they don't want their kids' sex changed without their permission. 1.00

00:26:43.520 They don't want their kids taught that human nature is just a convention, and we can re-engineer it.

00:26:52.860 And so there's...

00:26:53.360 Dr. Arndt, can I just jump in really quickly to ask, because this is where I was going to take you anyway.

00:26:57.320 You're talking about the kids and what they're being taught.

00:26:59.640 I'm sure you saw the arguments before the Supreme Court.

00:27:02.460 We were talking about it on the show.

00:27:03.700 So what is going on in education where they want to read these very explicit

00:27:10.320 and very trans-agenda-focused books to very small children?

00:27:15.780 And this is widespread.

00:27:17.000 What is this?

00:27:18.120 Where does this come from?

00:27:20.360 Well, it's, you know, first of all, the intellectual roots of this movement are old, right?

00:27:26.800 That's, you know, they became explicit in 19th-century German historicism.

00:27:31.740 And they came into America through a movement called progressivism that's still with us today.

00:27:37.560 People use that word still today.

00:27:40.260 But what did they think?

00:27:41.360 What they thought was, there isn't a thing like human nature.

00:27:46.160 That word nature is a very interesting word, and it means a lot of things, but it starts with the Latin word for birth.

00:27:52.260 How we come to be and grow, and what we're like when we're grown.

00:27:56.680 But now, no, it's not that so much.

00:27:59.760 Now what we have is the idea that we understand a historical process that is liberating us and changing everything.

00:28:09.020 And because we have modern science, we can get control of the process, and we can re-engineer even ourselves.

00:28:17.400 And so, of course, then, the family has to be a target of that, and race is a target of that. 0.77

00:28:25.220 And in some versions of it, you know, like the difference between Nazism and communism is only one thing.

00:28:32.620 Nazism is mostly about race. 0.55

00:28:35.140 Communism is mostly about property and money.

00:28:37.280 And Nazism thinks if you've got the right genes, you're a superior being.

00:28:44.900 And communism thinks you are formed by what you do for a living and how you work.

00:28:51.640 And if you've got a lot of money, you're in one class.

00:28:53.380 And if you don't, you're in another.

00:28:55.360 And we have to transcend all that.

00:28:58.660 We have to overcome private property.

00:29:00.620 And what the Nazis think is, you know, if you've got the right blood, then you're superior.

00:29:08.160 Now what's interesting about both of those doctrines, because they're materialist doctrines,

00:29:13.400 what they do is upset the idea that any human child can come to know things objectively.

00:29:22.900 That's, you know, and human freedom hinges on that argument, which is a classical argument and a religious argument.

00:29:31.240 And all of the colleges, any college of any age, Hillsdale College, Harvard is the oldest one in America.

00:29:37.980 They were all founded on that idea that there's something, a spark in the human being that transcends his body,

00:29:46.560 includes his body and transcends his body, that makes it possible for him to learn objectively.

00:29:52.900 And if that, and see, what's interesting about discarding that argument is that you've discarded all the basis of reasoning.

00:30:01.760 In other words, if the Nazis are right, or the communists, they can't have objective knowledge of anything, see, 0.72

00:30:09.620 because they're just creatures of some material condition that drives them.

00:30:15.200 And, you know, those documents, those doctrines are very prevalent in the world.

00:30:20.100 They have led to two great world wars, you know, tens of millions of people killed over them.

00:30:27.960 So what you should do in a college is study them, understand them, and understand the alternative,

00:30:36.340 which is, you know, we study those things at Hillsdale College, but also we study the classics, right?

00:30:42.320 And then you become armed with a way to understand things that lets you evaluate the world.

00:30:51.940 And, see, that's another thing about these Ivy League colleges.

00:30:55.500 I noticed in the last year ago, last spring, that when they were demonstrating about Hamas and anti-Jews,

00:31:03.180 they would interview these kids, and they didn't really seem to know very much about it.

00:31:08.020 But, you know, they've just got doctrine, and they want their way right now.

00:31:14.840 But aren't they really there to learn?

00:31:17.320 Like, you know, it's a very interesting question, which, you know, turns out I work for a great historian who wrote about this.

00:31:24.300 Do the Jews, modern Israel, have a right to the land on which it is? 0.99

00:31:30.620 Well, first of all, that's a history that goes back, you know, Israel was founded in 1948.

00:31:36.860 How did that happen?

00:31:38.220 Where did that come from?

00:31:39.240 Who decided it, right?

00:31:40.840 In other words, there's a rich world of stuff to figure out about that.

00:31:46.220 And I don't think that's what they're doing at Harvard.

00:31:48.640 Yeah.

00:31:49.240 I think you're right about that.

00:31:50.440 We have to go to a commercial break.

00:31:51.900 I feel like we could just have you on talking for hours, and it would be phenomenal.

00:31:56.320 We need to have a longer-form conversation at some point with you.

00:31:59.300 In the meantime, if your kids are applying to colleges, I would suggest you could do way worse than Hillsdale.

00:32:05.220 Sir, we appreciate the time, and I encourage people to go read that Wall Street Journal piece,

00:32:09.420 which I thought really elucidated some very interesting and intelligent arguments as it pertains to academic freedom.

00:32:15.980 Thank you, Dr. Arn.

00:32:16.800 It was great to spend time with you in Seattle.

00:32:19.220 Thank you both.

00:32:20.300 Look, NFL draft, Buck is fired up.

00:32:22.680 You heard Dana Perino fired up.

00:32:24.540 Dr. Larry Arn, he's a big sports fan.

00:32:26.580 We had a great conversation in Seattle.

00:32:28.480 If you're fired up and want to have some fun with the NHL, with the NBA, with Major League Baseball underway,

00:32:33.520 heck, I'm sitting right now at a minor league baseball stadium in Knoxville, Tennessee,

00:32:37.600 just off the University of Tennessee's campus.

00:32:39.760 If you are a sports fan, you need to go get signed up right now.

00:32:42.380 PricePicks.com, code Clay.

00:32:43.860 You get $50 when you sign up, and whatever sport you love, you can play along with.

00:32:49.080 Rush loved sports.

00:32:50.740 I know many of you out there are huge sports fans as well.

00:32:53.460 All you have to do is go to PricePicks.com, put in the code CLAY, and you get $50 when you play $5.

00:33:00.900 You can play in California, you can play in Texas, you can play in Georgia.

00:33:03.780 Do it today.

00:33:04.460 PricePicks.com, code CLAY.

00:33:07.220 News and politics, but also a little comic relief.

00:33:11.100 Clay Travis and Buck Sexton.

00:33:13.400 Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:33:17.700 Welcome back into Clay and Buck.

00:33:21.040 We've got the market doing pretty well today, which I think goes to some of the anxiety that the media is trying to create about the Trump economy.

00:33:33.720 So that's one thing that I think we can at least take a moment here and look at.

00:33:37.980 But, Clay, you know, the Trump, there's other negotiations happening, not just on tariffs and the economy, but on Russia and Ukraine.

00:33:49.200 Now, there's some reporting that came out. 0.85

00:33:50.720 Senator Marco, I'm sorry, Secretary of State Marco Rubio has said that the reporting is total trash,

00:33:56.740 that they basically saying that they were willing to give all kinds of concessions to Russia and they're trying to take a shot at the Trump team that is negotiating with Putin.

00:34:08.920 There were some major strikes, rocket attack against Kiev or Kiev.

00:34:17.420 We're supposed to say like different ways, right?

00:34:19.440 But Kiev that have killed a number of people.

00:34:22.720 And Trump is ticked off about this.

00:34:24.820 He has been sounding the well, sounding not the alarm so much as just letting people know that letting Putin know this is unacceptable to him.

00:34:36.280 But there's also frustration with the Zelensky side of thing, Clay, because there's reporting that Zelensky does not want to give up officially Crimea,

00:34:47.580 which has been under Russian control and has been a part of the a fully a fully a fully functioned part of the Russian Federation now for many years before this administration even came along.

00:34:58.640 It goes back to the goes back to the Obama administration.

00:35:01.780 So here is here is Caroline Leavitt, White House press secretary, talking about this plate 17.

00:35:10.880 In order to make a good deal, both sides have to walk away a little bit unhappy.

00:35:14.900 And unfortunately, President Zelensky has been trying to litigate this peace negotiation in the press, and that's unacceptable to the president.

00:35:24.120 These should be closed door negotiations.

00:35:26.500 The president's national security team, his advisers, has exuded significant time, energy and effort to try to bring this war to an end.

00:35:34.040 The American taxpayer has funded billions of dollars in this effort, and enough is enough.

00:35:38.460 The president's frustrated, his patience is running very thin, he wants to do what's right for the world, he wants to see peace, he wants to see the killing stopped.

00:35:46.740 But you need both sides of the war willing to do that.

00:35:50.600 And unfortunately, President Zelensky seems to be moving in the wrong direction.

00:35:54.980 It's not looking great for the negotiations right now.

00:35:57.180 Let's just say what's going on here, Clay.

00:35:58.900 It's still early, but it's looking like this is there's there's there's a distance between the combatants on what a negotiation would look like.

00:36:07.500 And Trump is getting frustrated with both sides.

00:36:10.520 I think that's right.

00:36:11.920 And here's what we told you.

00:36:14.500 This is how this ends.

00:36:15.880 There's going to be a new line drawn.

00:36:18.260 You can argue about it however you want to argue about it.

00:36:22.540 I fail to see at this point, and I would love to have Zelensky on.

00:36:27.100 I'd love to have Putin on.

00:36:28.880 What is the point of continuing to fight?

00:36:32.680 We essentially have both sides dug in.

00:36:35.840 The lines are not moving very much.

00:36:38.300 To the extent that they are moving, it is a slowly inch by inch, yard by yard style advancement from Russia. 0.99

00:36:47.920 Ukraine is depleted significantly.

00:36:51.220 One thing they decided to do, Buck, and I don't know that we've talked about it that much on the program,

00:36:55.560 but based on the lessons of World War I and World War II, they actually have tried to not take 18 to 25-year-old men to fight

00:37:05.300 because when an 18 to 25-year-old man dies, most of the time those men have not had kids yet.

00:37:12.720 It's very sad to think about, but that wiped out entire generations of population in Europe

00:37:19.040 because so many young men who had not become fathers were the first to be drafted,

00:37:24.100 and Ukraine in some way is balancing that out by basically taking men 25 to 45, of which there are almost none left.

00:37:32.680 And what is the play here?

00:37:34.340 I really think that media need to be holding Vladimir Zelensky accountable here,

00:37:42.180 and I don't mean because I think he's the bad guy in any way.

00:37:45.100 I think Russia is the aggressor. 0.89

00:37:46.600 We all know that.

00:37:48.080 But what is Zelensky hoping for at this point?

00:37:52.380 What are his strategic goals and ambitions?

00:37:55.560 It doesn't seem to me like there are any, Buck.

00:37:58.020 I mean, can you even – what is he trying to get?

00:38:00.540 He's not going to get NATO.

00:38:02.240 He's not going to get the return of the border that existed prior to Russia's invasion.

00:38:08.140 What are his reachable goals at this point now that tens of thousands,

00:38:14.380 if not hundreds of thousands, of his fellow countrymen are dead?

00:38:18.120 I just don't understand why the war is continuing.

00:38:21.040 Well, I think that in his mind, their perpetuation of the war, one, means that he stays in power, right?

00:38:28.600 They have – under the Ukrainian constitution, they cannot have elections during a war.

00:38:33.220 We've heard this many times.

00:38:34.680 This is why he's declared martial law, and there's no way that anyone's going to be able to take over from him while that's going on.

00:38:41.720 So there's that incentive that I think has to be remembered as we're talking about what he seeks to have happen here.

00:38:48.440 And, Clay, I think that there's just – it's a little bit like the U.S. and Afghanistan, to be honest with you,

00:38:54.980 where the idea was if we just keep this going, maybe things will get better.

00:39:00.780 And that was not true in Afghanistan.

00:39:03.360 That was not true.

00:39:04.400 I was in Afghanistan in 2010.

00:39:06.520 Talk about it a little bit in the book, by the way.

00:39:09.640 And –

00:39:10.960 What is the title of your book, by the way?

00:39:12.840 What's the official title?

00:39:13.960 Have you told us?

00:39:14.560 The title not official yet.

00:39:17.560 We're still – there's a couple things that are getting in place, but it will be – it's very – it is definitely very –

00:39:23.460 it's a different vibe than balls.

00:39:27.540 This is going to be very funny.

00:39:29.060 Clay and I may have books coming out roughly around the same time,

00:39:31.920 and Clay's is going to be, like, very –

00:39:36.100 Clay's is going to be a lot of fun, and it's going to be very kind of –

00:39:40.060 and mine is going to be, like, a guy with a tweed jacket on and, you know –

00:39:44.220 And a pipe.

00:39:45.220 And a pipe, yes.

00:39:46.060 You've got the – what's the elbow pads on the tweed jacket, too?

00:39:50.780 So we're going in different directions here on – so that's good.

00:39:54.680 But, look, I think – I think that what you have with Afghanistan was a plan that was never going to get better, 0.99

00:40:01.600 but nobody wanted to be the one that stopped it.

00:40:03.780 Nobody wanted to be the one that said, you know what, everything that came before this didn't get us to where we want to be.

00:40:08.540 It becomes very deeply psychologically ingrained, right?

00:40:11.760 Well, if we just keep fighting, maybe there'll be a better day ahead, so why don't we just keep fighting?

00:40:16.900 I think that's where Zelensky is on this.

00:40:19.400 And now you could say, rationally, in what world –

00:40:22.860 well, the only one that I can see is if the United States and NATO actually get drawn into the conflict in some way,

00:40:28.120 which is what we are trying to avoid at all costs.

00:40:30.880 Right.

00:40:31.220 But he can't say that publicly, right?

00:40:33.240 He can't say that.

00:40:34.200 He can't say, well, if you guys create a protectorate of Ukraine against Russia, then we'll get a better deal.

00:40:40.880 I don't see how militarily, though, there's any option for him other than that that puts him in a better spot.

00:40:46.420 I agree.

00:40:47.280 And it feels to me like maybe we're headed towards some perpetually unresolved conflict,

00:40:53.420 almost like exists still in North Korea and South Korea, where they have the demilitarized zone.

00:40:58.300 Both sides have substantial facilities on either side of the demilitarized zone.

00:41:03.980 But I believe I'm correct.

00:41:05.740 You probably know off the top of your head, we've never had an official peace in Korea, right?

00:41:10.040 They just basically have kind of ended the war.

00:41:13.200 But I think technically they are still considered to be in conflict.

00:41:16.680 There was no grand peace accord that has been signed in Korea.

00:41:19.800 Yes, still technically in a state of war at whatever it is, the 38th parallel.

00:41:23.500 So for some part of me thinks that that might end up being the resolution in Ukraine.

00:41:28.960 I don't think it's ideal.

00:41:30.180 But you have some sort of security guarantee based on the mineral rights agreement that we have discussed,

00:41:35.760 which provides Ukraine some belief that the United States will help to provide security in addition with all the European countries.

00:41:43.640 And then Russia feels like they have this territory now.

00:41:48.380 You know, the real danger to Ukraine, and I felt this all along, if you look at the map, 1.00

00:41:52.920 is if Russia decides to try and take away Ukraine's ability to reach the water, right?

00:41:59.480 Basically, you would landlock them.

00:42:01.240 And they've kind of taken away a huge percentage of it through Crimea and more.

00:42:05.180 Yes.

00:42:05.780 Well, the geography here matters a whole lot.

00:42:08.340 Speaking of water and taking it away, we haven't discussed this yet on the show,

00:42:12.140 but you may have seen some of the headlines between India and Pakistan,

00:42:15.820 two countries that have a long history of really hating each other and have nuclear weapons pointed at each other.

00:42:25.100 And there was just a major terrorist attack in the cash.

00:42:29.060 Kashmir is this disputed region between India and Pakistan.

00:42:32.040 Pakistan, and there have been – there's a long – we've never really talked about this on the show.

00:42:36.980 There's a long history here.

00:42:39.180 Kashmiri militants, particularly Pakistan, likes to train these different terrorist groups that operate there in India.

00:42:45.140 They've been going at it here for a long time, firing artillery at each other, their militaries.

00:42:50.980 And in some places, this is – you're amazed that human beings are even up as high as they are fighting.

00:42:56.700 I mean, this is like – you'd think it would just be mountain goats up there.

00:42:59.340 I mean, they are way up, you know, 8,000, 10,000, 12,000 feet elevation.

00:43:05.280 They're firing artillery rounds at each other.

00:43:08.320 And there is now a – the president of – or prime minister of India has come out and said,

00:43:17.180 we're going to fight and find the terrorists wherever they are.

00:43:19.280 They've cut off water to Pakistan, is my understanding, through the Indus River.

00:43:26.880 And the entire Pakistani – well, a huge percentage of the Pakistani workforce is still agriculture-based.

00:43:37.340 And this is not a country that can afford to have a lot of its agriculture cut off.

00:43:43.060 So we're not even talking about – you made me think of this, Clay.

00:43:46.720 We're not even really focused on this right now that much in the West.

00:43:51.540 But if you're talking about a place, it is far more likely – and I hate having to say this out loud, but it is true –

00:43:57.800 it is far more likely that you would see a major escalation and a nuclear exchange between India and Pakistan

00:44:03.720 than anything going on right now in Russia, in my opinion, between the United States and Russia.

00:44:09.060 Like, these are two countries where if one side thinks they got the upper hand on the other side,

00:44:13.340 tackle nuclear weapons, I think the likelihood of that is higher than any feared escalation

00:44:20.520 between the United States and Russia with nukes.

00:44:22.540 I think that we've had a longstanding detente with Russia, the Soviet Union before that over nukes.

00:44:29.620 Clay, India and Pakistan, these countries hate each other. 0.99

00:44:33.420 I mean, just there's a longstanding history of these countries are at each other's throats.

00:44:38.100 Their entire militaries are basically squared off the border from each other between the two countries.

00:44:42.840 So think about it that way.

00:44:45.360 And this is why, ultimately, the Iran decision and North Korea and all these other countries, right?

00:44:51.280 I mean, you understand why they want nukes.

00:44:54.340 And this is why I'm not optimistic, unfortunately, that we're suddenly going to get a deal with Iran 0.71

00:45:02.240 where we feel like, oh, you know what?

00:45:03.900 The world's a safer place.

00:45:05.380 It feels to me like they're going to lie about everything having to do with their nuclear weapons policy

00:45:11.240 because it makes sense, right, logically for them to lie and get them.

00:45:15.600 Just so everyone knows, India has told all Pakistani nationals to, they had 24 hours to get out of the country. 1.00

00:45:22.220 So they're like, get the bleep out of here. 0.99

00:45:25.680 This is national power.

00:45:26.740 This is happening right now.

00:45:28.140 They have cut off the waters of the Indus River because they have, you know, the dams and locks and things.

00:45:34.780 They've cut off water, which Pakistan, by treaty, is supposed to have access to and needs for its agriculture.

00:45:42.720 It's a little, you know, if this continued, it would destroy their ability to feed themselves, the country.

00:45:50.380 So these are big moves.

00:45:52.020 Now, in Kashmir, I think 26 people were killed.

00:45:55.060 26 Indian nationals were killed.

00:45:56.940 So there was just a mass casualty terror attack in Kashmir.

00:46:00.320 India believes Pakistan is behind it. 0.98

00:46:02.540 India believes Pakistan is behind it. 0.98

00:46:04.260 And India is taking really aggressive steps right now.

00:46:07.380 So, you know, it's just interesting how we all get so focused on what's going on in this region or that region

00:46:12.500 this is getting barely a mention in most of the U.S. media.

00:46:17.980 And if you're asking me where is the likeliest place for a really nasty war to break out

00:46:22.900 where both sides have nukes and I think would be willing to use them under certain circumstances,

00:46:27.600 it's this part of the world right now.

00:46:30.760 And no one's even talking about it.

00:46:32.020 So, you know, Trump's got his hands full.

00:46:33.960 I think J.D. Vance was just in India this week, and we're hoping that there's going to be a treaty between

00:46:39.280 or a tariff, rather, agreement between the U.S. and India.

00:46:43.340 I think there's early.

00:46:44.660 Charlie Gasparino was reporting this morning that there looks like there's some agreement on that.

00:46:47.980 So, you know, a billion-plus person country that's going to have a better trade relationship with the U.S.

00:46:53.900 seems like a very – so that's on the positive side of things.

00:46:56.260 If J.D. Vance were a Democrat, Usha Vance going to India would have been a huge story 0.96

00:47:07.200 because her family is of Indian ancestry.

00:47:11.060 But as is, it got almost no attention.

00:47:14.620 Think about how much attention that would have gotten otherwise.

00:47:17.900 They almost didn't pay attention to it at all.

00:47:20.900 I thought that was a cool segment.

00:47:22.360 They have kids, three of them, that were on the trip with them.

00:47:25.240 I thought it looked – the coverage that I did see, which was limited, I was impressed by.

00:47:29.920 Look, we talked all about testosterone, how important it is for so many men out there.

00:47:34.860 If you don't want to end up like the Democrats, did you see the video?

00:47:40.180 I don't even know if Buck saw this yet.

00:47:42.340 Did you guys see the video of the governor of Wisconsin throwing a football?

00:47:46.280 It was one of the saddest things that I've ever seen,

00:47:48.640 and I have one of the worst golf swings of all time.

00:47:51.000 But he threw a football, they cut it, and then he's throwing a football to himself,

00:47:56.100 and they're trying to celebrate the fact that the NFL draft is happening in Green Bay.

00:48:00.440 And it was one of the least masculine throws I've ever seen in my life.

00:48:04.440 That's partly because there are no masculine Democrats. 0.79

00:48:07.360 They got Tim Walz's spirit fingers.

00:48:09.320 They got Governor Tony Evers in Wisconsin who can't even throw a football.

00:48:12.660 If you don't want to look like that, if you want to have some testosterone in your life,

00:48:16.240 if you need to go to Chalk, Chalk.com, our buddy Seton will hook you up.

00:48:19.440 They've got a male vitality stack proven to increase your testosterone levels 0.97

00:48:23.060 by as much as 20% in three months' time.

00:48:25.460 It's all natural.

00:48:26.820 Testosterone is your body's natural engine.

00:48:29.280 And if you have more testosterone in your body, you will have more energy.

00:48:33.020 You'll be able to accomplish more things.

00:48:34.960 You can go online and get hooked up today at Chalk.com.

00:48:37.460 That's C-H-O-Q.com. 0.98

00:48:39.360 My name, Clay.

00:48:40.700 Massive discount on any subscription for life.

00:48:42.960 You can cancel at any time.

00:48:44.300 No penalty.

00:48:44.760 No worries.

00:48:45.840 Chalk.com.

00:48:46.740 C-H-O-Q.com.

00:48:48.280 My name, Clay, to get hooked up today.

00:48:50.860 You ain't imagining it.

00:48:53.040 The world has gone insane.

00:48:55.440 Reclaim your sanity with Clay and Buck.

00:48:58.500 Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

00:49:03.540 Canadian women are looking for more. 1.00

00:49:05.600 More to themselves, their businesses, their elected leaders, and the world around them.

00:49:09.760 And that's why we're thrilled to introduce the Honest Talk podcast.

00:49:13.080 I'm Jennifer Stewart.

00:49:14.700 And I'm Catherine Clark.

00:49:16.000 And in this podcast, we interview Canada's most inspiring women.

00:49:19.680 Entrepreneurs, artists, athletes, politicians, and newsmakers.

00:49:23.220 All at different stages of their journey.

00:49:25.440 So if you're looking to connect, then we hope you'll join us.

00:49:28.660 Listen to the Honest Talk podcast on iHeartRadio or wherever you listen to your podcasts.

00:49:32.700 We're going to take a few moments to chat with our friend Dana Perino of Fox News.

00:49:39.180 You all know her.

00:49:40.260 She's got a book that just came out this week.

00:49:41.880 I wish someone had told me the best advice for building a great career and a meaningful life.

00:49:48.820 And perhaps we'll even get her to weigh in on flutes versus fiefs and other fascinating conversations today on the show.

00:49:56.400 Dana, thank you so much for being here.

00:49:57.700 Hey, I thought you were having me on to talk about the NFL draft.

00:50:02.080 Oh, no, that's my area of expertise.

00:50:05.780 Maybe you and I can do a whole segment where we discuss the draft.

00:50:10.160 Because Clay had to tell me that this was even happening.

00:50:12.540 So I had zero idea.

00:50:14.880 Actually, I love the idea.

00:50:16.720 Dana reads sports is one of my favorite parts of Fox News.

00:50:19.680 I love the idea of Dana and Buck trying to figure out sports-related issues.

00:50:25.440 Like, you guys, with no help, just come together and try to determine some sports-related conclusion.

00:50:31.660 I got to tell you, I really loved the – I love watching the NFL draft.

00:50:36.920 Because I like watching all the people, like, in the families and, like, their excitement.

00:50:41.040 I think that's so fun.

00:50:42.460 And live tweeting the draft is one of my favorite things to do.

00:50:46.540 So I'm going to make sure I'm doing that tonight.

00:50:47.900 Like, who wouldn't want to live in Arizona?

00:50:51.280 That sounds fun.

00:50:52.340 They got cute uniforms, too.

00:50:54.360 Yes.

00:50:54.860 I'll just tell you, I've actually never seen the draft.

00:50:57.220 So I think we've established that Dana's knowledge, Clay, of this exceeds mine substantially.

00:51:02.360 I've never watched an NFL draft in my life.

00:51:04.680 So maybe tonight will be my first time.

00:51:07.200 Dana, tell us about the book a little bit here.

00:51:10.020 I mean, you've had a huge career.

00:51:11.640 You were White House press secretary under Bush.

00:51:13.560 Now you're at the Five, Fox, doing all this amazing stuff.

00:51:16.480 What's the book telling everybody out there?

00:51:19.700 So it's called I Wish Someone Had Told Me, The Best Advice for Building a Great Career and a Meaningful Life.

00:51:25.560 And I've done a book before called Everything Will Be Okay.

00:51:28.980 And actually, I remember you all had just started your show together.

00:51:32.820 And when that book came out, you had me on.

00:51:36.000 And it was such a fun conversation.

00:51:37.380 I remember exactly where I was standing and where we did that.

00:51:40.380 And that book was really targeted to young women going through their quarter life crisis.

00:51:44.780 This book is post-COVID, and it is not geared just to young women.

00:51:48.720 I made it much more broad-based, and also because I have advanced in years since when I left the White House.

00:51:56.040 A lot of people that I mentored back then are still coming to me for advice, and they've become executives, moms and dads.

00:52:03.400 They are looking for the next step in their life.

00:52:05.260 They're making big career transitions.

00:52:06.760 And so I realized I didn't have all the answers myself.

00:52:09.880 I interviewed over 40 people, many of the people here at Fox News, like Gutfeld, Harold Ford Jr., Jesse Waters, Sandra Smith, Jimmy Fela, you name it, they're in here.

00:52:22.180 But also, like, my college roommate, my husband, and Dierks Bentley.

00:52:29.200 That's who I was thinking.

00:52:29.920 Of course, I was thinking of Nashville.

00:52:31.380 I'm thinking Clay Travis, Nashville, Dierks Bentley.

00:52:34.100 To talk to them, everything from how to start, how to get your foot in the door, how to get a promotion, how to be intentional with your time and a work-life balance.

00:52:43.560 And I know, Buck, you're a new dad.

00:52:46.000 And I'm sure all of this is – I'm sure you'll be able to write a book of advice for dads anytime soon.

00:52:51.880 Oh, I would love that.

00:52:53.680 But I have to tell you, Dana, as I'm talking to you, it's always reassuring when I find out that my wife is actually listening to the show.

00:52:59.800 And she texted me and says, make sure you tell Dana that I got a lot out of her book, Everything Will Be Okay.

00:53:06.580 So Carrie Sexton is a fan of book one and now will be a fan of your most recent book, I am sure.

00:53:13.800 Your wife is so lovely.

00:53:15.560 Well, you know, I love hearing that.

00:53:17.040 And one thing I did find out, guys, is when Everything Will Be Okay came out.

00:53:21.520 It was a big success.

00:53:22.400 Everybody loved it.

00:53:22.920 But there were younger guys, especially around here at Fox, who are like, what about one for us?

00:53:28.520 And there's an insatiable need of young people who – they really want to be successful.

00:53:34.000 And they're just looking for us to give them the blueprint.

00:53:36.660 And we don't have the answers, of course.

00:53:39.360 One of the best things that I've learned and that I could pass on is that I really worried away my 20s for no reason.

00:53:45.240 I was so trying to plan out my life.

00:53:49.300 And everything that happened great in my life is not because I planned it.

00:53:53.240 And if you are an educated American, you already won life's great lottery.

00:53:58.100 And so all you have to decide is how hard do you want to work.

00:54:02.180 I think that's so well said.

00:54:04.020 And thanks for coming on, Dana.

00:54:05.340 I had a professor at Vanderbilt Law School, Larry Soderquist, who has since passed.

00:54:10.360 But he was an incredible business professor.

00:54:12.920 And his big thing to us when we were in law school – and I'm sure there's some kids out there that are going to grad school

00:54:19.180 or you're going to take the bar exam soon coming up this summer – and he said, you are already set.

00:54:26.640 He said, you guys have done the hard work of getting into law school.

00:54:30.240 He said, the question you have to decide going forward with your legal careers is how do you want to work this law degree?

00:54:38.800 He said, but you're never going to be homeless.

00:54:41.040 You're never going to be hungry.

00:54:42.220 The big concerns in life you have taken care of.

00:54:46.260 And you should think about that more than you do, all of you.

00:54:50.600 And I thought that perspective was super important.

00:54:52.540 And I think it reflects upon what you said where there are a lot of kids out there in their 20s.

00:54:57.080 They get out of school.

00:54:57.800 They get out of grad school.

00:54:58.900 They have these quarter-life crises.

00:55:00.420 I had one myself.

00:55:02.480 And they wonder what else is out there.

00:55:05.400 And I think this is an important lesson that you're trying to teach them is that, one, you're still going to be trying to figure out a lot of things when you're in your 30s, 40s, 50s, and 60s.

00:55:14.540 Nobody has all the answers.

00:55:16.020 But you're probably going to be okay.

00:55:17.300 Oh, absolutely.

00:55:19.540 And one of my favorite mentors was President Bush.

00:55:23.300 And I remember he would talk about the importance of not being so risk-averse, that America was built on people willing to take a risk and to be pioneers.

00:55:32.580 And I think about Elon Musk, right?

00:55:35.180 Like, he takes risks all the time, like landing rockets on chopsticks.

00:55:41.940 But because he was willing to take a risk, you can get great reward. 0.98

00:55:46.400 And I remember I was really hesitant to start my own business after I left the White House because I had a million reasons that were stupid, really, looking back. 0.96

00:55:54.360 And the president said to me, ask yourself this. 0.87

00:55:57.760 What is the worst thing that could happen to you if it fails?

00:56:01.040 So I sort of hemmed and hawed for a minute and he said, so you're telling me the worst thing that could happen to you, an educated American woman who was the White House press secretary, starts her own business, say it fails.

00:56:10.520 And the worst thing you have to do is go back and work for another PR firm?

00:56:14.300 That's the worst thing?

00:56:15.980 And he said, I'm not persuaded by that.

00:56:18.040 And that's really helpful to me.

00:56:19.520 I learned from Dr. Samantha Boardman when people are dealing with anxiety, and, of course, we all do, and also we're surrounded by young people who have a lot of it.

00:56:27.640 So you ask yourself, what's the worst thing that could happen, and what's the best thing that could happen?

00:56:32.480 And usually what happens is somewhere in the middle, and it can calm you down pretty quickly.

00:56:37.440 Yes, I think there's an old quote from one of the great Stoics that we suffer more in imagination than reality.

00:56:43.220 It might have been Seneca, or it's one of them.

00:56:45.560 So it's a version, you know, Dana's updating it for the 21st century, but this is very true.

00:56:50.200 Believe it or not, Jesse Waters, when I interviewed him for this book, Jesse Waters talks about the Stoics as well in this book.

00:56:57.840 Well, Jesse Waters and I are apparently brothers from another mother.

00:57:00.840 I had no idea.

00:57:01.860 Fun fact, Jesse doesn't even know this, but maybe he was in, I think it was like an English 101 class at Trinity College with my older brother at one point.

00:57:11.200 To give you a sense of what a small world it was.

00:57:12.820 Then Mason transferred and went to a different school.

00:57:15.460 But, yes, Jesse and I have been...

00:57:16.900 Give me the tea.

00:57:18.460 Yeah, Jesse and I have been ships passing in the night.

00:57:20.320 Mason assures me he might have popped his collar, but he was a very nice guy.

00:57:23.860 But, yes, we've got Dana Perino with us right now, and she's got a new book out, which you guys should all check out.

00:57:30.480 And her books have been huge successes up to this point.

00:57:34.100 So what's, you know, if you're looking now for the people out there who are going to be grabbing this book,

00:57:40.940 if there's one thing that you want them to really take out of it today, or rather one thing that they would read

00:57:47.340 and you hope they could apply to their lives as soon as possible, Dana, what would that be?

00:57:51.700 Well, I think we've covered a lot of it, and especially what I'm hoping is that when people read this,

00:57:55.600 they will realize they don't need to worry as much.

00:57:57.960 One of the reasons that you seek out a book like this is because you're trying to get some answers to things that are bothering you.

00:58:03.320 So I'm hoping that that is true, but I would also pass on this advice.

00:58:07.340 Most of the mentees that come to see me, they are definitely interested in professional guidance,

00:58:11.840 but they also are looking for meaningful personal lives.

00:58:16.140 They would love to meet somebody.

00:58:17.700 They want to get married.

00:58:19.080 They want to have families, and they want to find a work-life balance that will allow them to have a great, wonderful, meaningful life.

00:58:25.640 And my experience was unusual.

00:58:29.340 I met my husband on an airplane 28 years ago, and there's a million reasons why we might not have met

00:58:34.600 or that we could have talked ourselves out of it, but choosing to be loved is not a career-limiting decision.

00:58:41.400 It actually made all the difference for me, and I'm hoping that young people can take that away 0.92

00:58:46.540 and realize that investing in yourself in a commitment is a great way to enhance your life and your career.

00:58:53.460 I've got to wait.

00:58:54.300 I've got to reverse for a second here.

00:58:55.600 Take us into this.

00:58:57.120 This is a great story of romance.

00:58:59.040 You met your husband on a plane?

00:59:01.080 What was the first move here?

00:59:03.240 Did he spill his peanuts or his seltzer in your lap?

00:59:06.760 How did he get this going?

00:59:08.700 Well, okay, so it was 1997, so let's go in the way, way back machine.

00:59:12.420 Nobody had phones.

00:59:13.340 Nobody had AirPods, okay?

00:59:15.280 So I was carrying a book.

00:59:17.640 I was working for a congressman.

00:59:18.820 I was coming back from Denver, going Denver, Chicago, Chicago, D.C., and I was on an American Airlines flight.

00:59:25.640 I almost missed the plane because it was my first time driving out to the new Denver International Airport, which might as well be in Kansas.

00:59:31.920 It's so far away.

00:59:32.700 That's accurate.

00:59:33.300 And so the last two people to get on the plane were myself and this guy, and I sat down in the window seat, and he said, would you like me to put your bag up above?

00:59:45.220 British accent.

00:59:46.220 Strong move.

00:59:46.980 I thought you were cute.

00:59:47.460 Strong move.

00:59:47.740 Yeah, accents are helpful.

00:59:51.400 No wedding ring.

00:59:53.160 Handsome.

00:59:54.040 And he had a book called The Taylor of Panama by John le Carre.

00:59:57.480 I said, do you like that book?

00:59:59.600 So we started talking about books, and for two and a half hours we talked for a long time.

01:00:03.600 I remember asking him, what do people in Europe think about Bill Clinton? 0.97

01:00:07.120 And he said, they think he's a clown. 0.94

01:00:09.140 And I was like, oh, wow, we're going to get along great.

01:00:10.940 But then I remember looking out the window and saying a prayer to God that, I know I asked you to help me find someone, but he's much older than me.

01:00:22.580 He lives in England.

01:00:24.760 My career is on the right track.

01:00:27.060 I didn't think I would meet somebody on an airplane, but I couldn't eat, sleep, drink, concentrate, anything after I met him.

01:00:34.900 And about six weeks later, we had our first date when he was back in the States in New Orleans.

01:00:40.980 And six months later, I moved to England 28 years ago.

01:00:46.440 Wow.

01:00:46.600 What was the reaction when you told people, I'm just kind of curious, hey, I'm going to move to England.

01:00:52.780 I met a guy on an airplane.

01:00:54.940 Okay.

01:00:55.380 So you hit the nail on the head of one of the reasons I wrote the book, because one of the things I worried about in my 20s was, how am I going to get a job?

01:01:02.500 How will I succeed?

01:01:03.240 How will I pay my bills?

01:01:04.160 Then, how am I going to meet somebody?

01:01:05.600 Then, what are people going to think about me for wanting to be with this man who is much older than me, lives in England, and that I'm leaving my job and career to go live in England, and who knows what's going to happen to me?

01:01:17.660 And I worried myself to death.

01:01:20.220 And a woman, a family friend said, don't give up on this chance to be loved.

01:01:25.840 Can I throw something in there, Dana?

01:01:27.640 One superpower that I've learned is to not care what people think who don't matter to you.

01:01:32.940 You know what I mean?

01:01:33.780 No, but you know what?

01:01:34.480 It's so interesting is that we have to learn this lesson over and over again, because your parents teach you that when you're young, or maybe you learn it in Sunday school or from a teacher or from other friends.

01:01:44.540 And all of these young people are always thinking about what others are thinking about them and how they're being judged.

01:01:51.080 And what I remind them is that, actually, we all just think about ourselves all the time.

01:01:55.480 Nobody has time to think about you.

01:01:56.980 And, by the way, especially in a social media age, people are even more obsessed about how they're being perceived than they would have been in the past.

01:02:06.040 Quick question for you.

01:02:06.500 Wait, can I ask her a question?

01:02:08.120 Dana, do you think that women – I'm putting you on the hot seat a little bit here. 1.00

01:02:13.100 Everybody loves Dana Perino.

01:02:14.440 Everyone's going to love this book.

01:02:15.800 You're on the hot seat now.

01:02:17.360 Do women in this era care too much about men's height? 1.00

01:02:21.700 Gosh, you know, I am barely – I'm not even quite 5'1", so even Gutfeld is a little tall to me.

01:02:33.360 Just kidding.

01:02:34.220 He is not tall to me.

01:02:35.800 Do women care too much about height? 1.00

01:02:38.080 I mean, maybe.

01:02:39.220 I mean, I know that it's sort of awkward.

01:02:41.160 It depends.

01:02:41.720 I don't – you don't see a lot of women who are taller than – 1.00

01:02:43.840 How tall is your husband, Dana?

01:02:45.160 How tall is your husband?

01:02:46.080 Let's just go through this.

01:02:47.640 About – I would say 5'10".

01:02:49.840 Okay.

01:02:50.200 This is like – he's like tall, but not – you know, you didn't date – like you're not a 5'1 lady who married a 6'5 guy.

01:02:56.880 We've had some conversations on the show recently about this.

01:03:00.120 He's tall for someone from Scotland.

01:03:02.080 How about that?

01:03:03.180 Fair enough.

01:03:03.920 Fair enough.

01:03:04.640 Yeah.

01:03:04.940 I don't even know if that's just a shot at Scottish men, by the way, that you just – I wouldn't have –

01:03:09.380 Oh, that's just a fact.

01:03:09.840 That's tall for someone from –

01:03:10.760 Scottish men are short.

01:03:13.120 Is this true?

01:03:13.840 Yeah.

01:03:14.580 Yeah.

01:03:15.320 The book, by the way, is fabulous.

01:03:17.120 I have met her husband.

01:03:18.300 He is fabulous.

01:03:19.060 Dana has taken us out and watched Songwriter Nights.

01:03:21.780 I have to say, he would probably get canceled if he had a radio show.

01:03:26.060 He is great.

01:03:27.380 He is fantastic.

01:03:28.340 Well, hey, by the way, you're listening to a guy who may get canceled at any moment.

01:03:31.340 No idea what might happen from one second to the next.

01:03:33.320 Yeah, we got you.

01:03:34.600 The book is I Wish Someone Had Told Me.

01:03:37.460 Go ahead.

01:03:38.160 And Dana Perino, go buy it. 1.00

01:03:40.300 You're going to like it.

01:03:41.200 Dana, we appreciate the time.

01:03:42.340 You do fantastic work.

01:03:43.400 I love you guys.

01:03:43.880 Thanks so much.

01:03:44.700 Thank you.

01:03:46.140 Same to you.

01:03:47.200 Clay, I was struck by something as we're talking to Dana.

01:03:51.320 It is true.

01:03:52.500 My wife loves Dana.

01:03:53.780 Everybody loves Dana.

01:03:54.660 Her book is fantastic.

01:03:55.740 I'm sure the last book was fantastic.

01:03:57.960 I have a book title for you for your next book because we know the topic.

01:04:03.260 I have a title for you.

01:04:04.840 Do you want me to tell you the title now or when we come back?

01:04:07.200 I want to hear your title when we come back.

01:04:09.320 We've got a title for the book, and it's probably not going to surprise you, but I'm curious if

01:04:13.800 your title is somewhat similar to the title we've got an idea.

01:04:17.800 Now that you're telling me this, I feel like it could be, but just to be clear, Clay has

01:04:21.220 not told me the title of his forthcoming book.

01:04:23.620 I have a title in mind for him, and I think some of you are really going to like it.

01:04:27.140 So that's what we call a tease in the business. 1.00

01:04:30.880 When you switch, is it me or you who's supposed to read?

01:04:33.540 No, it's me.

01:04:34.260 It's me.

01:04:34.940 Oh, I blew it.

01:04:35.940 Sorry.

01:04:36.240 The leaf blowers are throwing you off, buddy.

01:04:38.380 I know.

01:04:39.140 The leaf blowers just track me everywhere. 0.70

01:04:41.740 I hate those guys.

01:04:44.260 Look, my family's coming down because now we've got my grandmother for my child.

01:04:51.220 My mom, my dad, they're all coming down this weekend, and you know what we're doing?

01:04:54.280 A steak feast Saturday night, courtesy of Good Ranchers.

01:04:58.440 Carrie and I have already picked out the cuts of meat that we're going to be serving.

01:05:02.380 I got an additional, because it's going to be a whole bunch.

01:05:05.320 My brothers, my sister-in-law, my mom, my dad, my sister.

01:05:08.720 We've got a whole squad here.

01:05:09.940 How do you feed a whole squad?

01:05:11.160 A Good Ranchers box, everybody.

01:05:13.280 We've got the meats picked out, rather.

01:05:16.200 They're going to be delicious because I eat Good Rancher stuff all the time, so I know it's top quality.

01:05:20.880 It makes it so easy for me.

01:05:22.380 I even got an extra sous vide bucket.

01:05:24.420 That's how much Good Ranchers meat I'm going to be making this weekend.

01:05:26.840 Try Good Ranchers yourself.

01:05:28.880 Support American Ranchers in the process.

01:05:31.300 You're going to love the meat, the chicken, the pork, the fish.

01:05:35.840 They've got all kinds of great stuff.

01:05:37.540 And they ship it all right to you in a box with just the right amount of dry ice, careful packaging,

01:05:41.700 to keep those products frozen and ready to enjoy just how you like it.

01:05:45.180 When you buy from Good Ranchers, you're supporting family farms and keep them thriving.

01:05:49.820 I'll post some photos and video and stuff of the amazing steaks I'm going to be cooking up this weekend.

01:05:55.080 Papa Speed, my dad, he's going to love it.

01:05:58.020 He's a red meat man.

01:05:59.520 Enter my name, Buck, when you go to GoodRanchers.com.

01:06:02.360 Enter my name, Buck, and you'll receive free bacon, ground beef, chicken nuggets, or salmon for a year and $40 off.

01:06:08.820 GoodRanchers.com.

01:06:10.340 Enter my name, Buck, is your promo code.

01:06:12.100 $40 off, plus free bacon, ground beef, chicken nuggets, or salmon for a year.

01:06:17.760 Stories of freedom.

01:06:19.240 Stories of America.

01:06:21.540 Inspirational stories that unite us all.

01:06:23.900 Each day, spend time with Clay and Buck.

01:06:26.740 Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

01:06:31.660 This is an iHeart Podcast.

01:06:34.140 Guaranteed human.

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BONUS - Daily Review with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton - Apr 24 2025

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