Verdict with Ted Cruz - July 15, 2020


From Hong Kong to TikTok


Episode Stats


Length

22 minutes

Words per minute

166.8649

Word count

3,788

Sentence count

256

Harmful content

Misogyny

5

sentences flagged

Hate speech

19

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

Ted Cruz delivers a blistering attack on China's human rights abuses in Hong Kong and calls for China to do more to respect the rule of law, democracy, and human rights in their own territory. He also calls China the greatest geopolitical threat to the United States in the 21st century.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 This is an iHeart Podcast.
00:00:02.620 Guaranteed human.
00:00:04.440 Well, we Americans are all busy fighting each other.
00:00:07.360 Our enemies abroad, you know, our actual enemies
00:00:10.120 are taking advantage of this,
00:00:11.920 none more so than the nation that started all the chaos
00:00:14.860 in the first place, China.
00:00:16.860 But with the presidential election in full swing
00:00:19.220 and all the fights we've got going on,
00:00:20.980 is anybody going to be paying attention?
00:00:23.640 We'll get into it.
00:00:24.500 This is Verdict with Ted Cruz.
00:00:30.000 Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz.
00:00:33.700 I'm Michael Knowles.
00:00:34.960 Senator, I feel like America has been very introspective
00:00:38.660 over the past few months.
00:00:40.300 We're all arguing over what statues to keep up
00:00:42.720 and arguing over brands
00:00:44.400 and taking Aunt Jemima off of bottles.
00:00:47.200 Meanwhile, we do have actual enemies out there,
00:00:50.780 enemies who are encroaching on our interests,
00:00:53.220 who are trying to undermine our country.
00:00:55.540 Is anybody paying attention to that?
00:00:57.500 Look, it is a dangerous world,
00:00:59.440 and I got to tell you,
00:01:00.260 the enemies of America are thrilled
00:01:02.180 to see America ripping itself apart
00:01:05.120 and America divided.
00:01:06.440 And they're using this opportunity front and center.
00:01:09.700 Number one on that list is China.
00:01:11.740 You and I have talked about many times
00:01:13.700 how I think China is the greatest geopolitical threat
00:01:17.880 to the United States over the next century.
00:01:20.060 And China, where the coronavirus originated
00:01:23.640 in Wuhan, China,
00:01:24.620 and their deliberate cover-up and censorship
00:01:30.020 allowed it to spread across the globe,
00:01:32.760 allowed it to cost over a half million lives
00:01:35.140 and trillions of dollars in economic value.
00:01:38.940 China is using this opportunity right now 0.93
00:01:41.700 to expand its influence,
00:01:43.300 expand its power.
00:01:44.300 And while we're having rioting in our streets,
00:01:48.080 China is very quietly but very deliberately 1.00
00:01:50.920 crushing Hong Kong democracy beneath its jackboots.
00:01:55.600 And it's really dangerous.
00:01:57.660 Well, I want to get into some of these specific cases
00:01:59.840 because I feel they're not being covered at all.
00:02:01.960 I want to know if there's anything we can do about it.
00:02:04.140 You mentioned Hong Kong.
00:02:05.480 You know, Hong Kong is technically an administrative region.
00:02:09.400 So the idea being there's one country but two systems.
00:02:12.800 That's since the British gave Hong Kong back to China,
00:02:16.160 in my view, somewhat foolishly, in 1997.
00:02:19.400 Then there were these pro-democracy protests.
00:02:21.960 And now, while we're all distracted
00:02:23.240 with the lockdowns and the riots,
00:02:25.480 China has basically eliminated Hong Kong independence.
00:02:29.040 No, it has come in and just,
00:02:31.500 it has decided that it wants to make Hong Kong
00:02:36.340 essentially fully a part of China with no democracy,
00:02:39.780 with no freedom of speech,
00:02:41.100 with no individual liberty.
00:02:42.960 And that's directly contrary to the promise
00:02:45.340 that the Chinese government made
00:02:47.540 when Hong Kong reverted to China
00:02:52.060 from British governance.
00:02:54.060 And under US law,
00:02:56.560 so I introduced legislation in the Senate
00:02:58.300 that passed into law
00:02:59.380 that mandated the State Department
00:03:01.300 reassess whether China is complying
00:03:04.940 with the commitments it made
00:03:06.160 and whether China is protecting democracy
00:03:08.660 and freedom in Hong Kong like it promised.
00:03:11.680 And the State Department
00:03:12.500 just recently completed that assessment
00:03:14.320 and concluded, obviously correctly,
00:03:17.100 that no, they're not.
00:03:18.320 And that was even before the most recent
00:03:20.520 and most egregious crackdown.
00:03:22.820 And that should lead to a fundamental shift.
00:03:27.100 See, what China's trying to do 1.00
00:03:28.460 is use Hong Kong as a way
00:03:30.620 to get around US sanctions,
00:03:32.300 get around restrictions on trade with China,
00:03:34.160 get around all the barriers that apply to China,
00:03:38.160 use Hong Kong as this,
00:03:40.360 see, this is a free market oasis
00:03:41.780 that we control brutally
00:03:42.980 and you don't get to have your cake
00:03:44.760 and eat it too.
00:03:45.600 Because I have wondered this.
00:03:46.800 I've wondered why China cares so much 1.00
00:03:48.740 about poor little Hong Kong.
00:03:50.100 They're aggressing now in the South China Sea.
00:03:52.560 They're threatening the Philippines, 1.00
00:03:54.180 Malaysia, Vietnam.
00:03:55.780 They're flying over Taiwan,
00:03:58.320 threatening Japan. 0.87
00:03:59.720 And just most recently,
00:04:01.200 they seem to have invaded part of India.
00:04:03.260 Well, the interesting thing
00:04:05.260 about totalitarian dictatorships
00:04:07.100 is they are often much weaker than they seem.
00:04:11.040 And they're afraid of sunlight.
00:04:13.820 Sunlight is a really, really powerful thing.
00:04:16.440 And when it comes to China,
00:04:18.020 they're terrified of sunlight.
00:04:19.680 So back in October of last year,
00:04:24.100 I did a trip to Asia
00:04:25.900 and I traveled to Pearl Harbor
00:04:29.080 and then Japan and then Taiwan
00:04:32.080 and then India and then Hong Kong.
00:04:35.900 And it was envisioned really
00:04:37.980 as a friends and allies tour.
00:04:40.140 So these are all strong friends
00:04:41.680 and allies of America.
00:04:42.680 They all surround China. 0.99
00:04:44.120 And the entire topic of the trip
00:04:45.960 was how do we deal with Chinese aggression,
00:04:48.480 Chinese military aggression,
00:04:50.100 Chinese hostility,
00:04:51.160 Chinese economic bullying,
00:04:52.620 Chinese censorship,
00:04:54.320 Chinese theft of intellectual property. 0.80
00:04:57.060 You know, when I met with the leadership
00:04:58.540 of the Pacific Command at Pearl Harbor,
00:05:00.240 they described how militarily
00:05:01.820 China has as a national strategy 0.57
00:05:04.420 stealing our military technology,
00:05:06.920 stealing our R&D,
00:05:08.400 billions of dollars in leaps.
00:05:10.200 So they just steal from us
00:05:11.080 and they do it on the industrial side.
00:05:13.120 And, you know,
00:05:15.020 if you notice the countries I went to,
00:05:17.020 like China was furious
00:05:18.560 that I went to Taiwan.
00:05:19.880 They don't like to acknowledge
00:05:20.900 Taiwan exists.
00:05:22.420 They insist,
00:05:23.920 it's a fairly ridiculous thing
00:05:25.240 they call the one China policy
00:05:26.840 that most American administrations
00:05:28.940 have gone along with,
00:05:30.380 that they just pretend
00:05:31.540 Taiwan doesn't exist.
00:05:33.440 So I actually went to Taiwan
00:05:34.820 on Taiwan's national day,
00:05:36.940 which is where they celebrate
00:05:38.580 their independence,
00:05:39.500 which China pretends doesn't exist.
00:05:40.980 And I was the first senator,
00:05:42.920 I think in 34 years,
00:05:44.500 to be in Taiwan
00:05:46.160 on their national day.
00:05:47.340 And I joined President Tsai
00:05:48.780 in reviewing as a parade came by
00:05:52.640 and celebrating Taiwan's independence.
00:05:56.160 In Hong Kong,
00:05:57.500 I met with the protesters.
00:05:59.300 This was right after you had
00:06:00.360 2 million people
00:06:01.120 in the streets of Hong Kong.
00:06:03.040 And I met with the protesters.
00:06:04.500 By the way,
00:06:04.860 they're young student activists.
00:06:06.340 Many of them are, you know,
00:06:07.520 16, 17, 18, 19 years old.
00:06:10.980 A number of them
00:06:12.280 have faced physical violence
00:06:13.820 from the Chinese police state
00:06:16.640 brutalizing them.
00:06:18.740 And in the course of this trip,
00:06:20.380 I did a Sunday show
00:06:22.420 dressed in all black
00:06:24.080 and did a Sunday show
00:06:26.660 from Hong Kong live
00:06:28.500 in solidarity with the protesters
00:06:30.820 because the protesters
00:06:32.060 would dress in all black.
00:06:33.840 And all of that,
00:06:35.640 China is terrified.
00:06:37.220 You've got 1.3 billion people
00:06:41.800 in China
00:06:43.180 that are being controlled
00:06:44.460 by a communist dictatorship
00:06:45.980 that abuses their rights,
00:06:47.680 that strips them of free speech,
00:06:49.480 that strips them of religious liberty,
00:06:51.700 that tortures and murders
00:06:53.700 Chinese citizens.
00:06:55.320 And the government is very scared
00:06:57.260 the citizens will get a taste
00:06:58.760 for freedom,
00:06:59.760 that they'll see what happens
00:07:00.840 in Hong Kong and goes,
00:07:01.840 hey, can't we have
00:07:03.040 some of that freedom?
00:07:03.840 That they'll see what happens
00:07:04.720 in Taiwan.
00:07:05.380 Taiwan is a wealthy,
00:07:07.060 prosperous place.
00:07:08.560 And the Chinese nationals go, 1.00
00:07:10.140 well, how come
00:07:10.780 we don't get some of that?
00:07:12.440 And it is a sign of weakness
00:07:15.120 on China's part
00:07:17.340 that they are so terrified
00:07:19.740 of the sunlight.
00:07:21.400 And I'll tell you
00:07:21.860 who had this insight
00:07:22.900 about a prior enemy,
00:07:24.180 which is Ronald Reagan
00:07:25.820 and the Soviet Union.
00:07:27.500 Soviet Union in the 60s
00:07:29.100 and 70s,
00:07:30.640 Democrats in Washington,
00:07:32.380 academics,
00:07:32.880 they're like,
00:07:33.620 oh, the Soviet Union 0.79
00:07:34.660 is unstoppable,
00:07:35.540 we can't keep up with it.
00:07:37.400 Reagan understood
00:07:38.460 the power
00:07:39.320 of shining a light
00:07:41.200 that it,
00:07:43.660 when Reagan said
00:07:45.380 the Soviet Union
00:07:46.900 is an evil empire,
00:07:49.220 all of Washington
00:07:50.580 was aghast.
00:07:51.980 When he said
00:07:53.340 that Marxism,
00:07:54.380 Leninism will end up
00:07:55.560 on the ash heap
00:07:56.620 of history,
00:07:57.820 that leadership,
00:07:59.120 that bully pulpit
00:08:00.560 was powerful
00:08:01.680 for undermining
00:08:03.420 the Soviet regime.
00:08:05.280 And when he stood
00:08:06.060 in front of the
00:08:06.560 Brandenburg Gate
00:08:07.300 and said,
00:08:07.640 Mr. Gorbachev,
00:08:08.600 tear down this wall,
00:08:10.500 those are the most
00:08:11.280 important words
00:08:12.120 any leader said
00:08:12.840 in modern time.
00:08:13.660 Well, I believe
00:08:14.500 Hong Kong
00:08:15.080 is the new Berlin.
00:08:16.520 And just as
00:08:18.060 that terrified
00:08:19.340 the Soviet leadership,
00:08:20.780 so too
00:08:21.440 does the prospect
00:08:22.620 of freedom
00:08:23.440 terrify the Chinese 1.00
00:08:25.200 communist government.
00:08:26.020 So you seem
00:08:27.060 a little bit
00:08:28.020 sunnier on all
00:08:29.180 of this than I do.
00:08:30.140 I've been feeling
00:08:30.900 kind of down about it
00:08:31.960 because China,
00:08:33.000 as you say,
00:08:33.500 they steal our IP.
00:08:34.780 They've kind of
00:08:35.360 taken over the tech
00:08:36.400 world now with TikTok.
00:08:37.760 You've got all
00:08:38.260 these 12-year-olds
00:08:38.980 who are compromising
00:08:39.820 our national security
00:08:40.880 with funny videos
00:08:42.020 on their phones.
00:08:43.100 Yeah.
00:08:43.320 You've got,
00:08:43.960 as we spoke about
00:08:44.740 with Nigel Farage
00:08:45.920 now months ago.
00:08:47.320 By the way,
00:08:48.140 for TikTok,
00:08:49.840 Michael,
00:08:50.100 are you and I
00:08:50.560 going to do
00:08:50.920 some dance move
00:08:52.280 and then switch places
00:08:53.480 or something?
00:08:54.140 I think,
00:08:54.600 well, because Senator,
00:08:55.200 you know,
00:08:55.460 I love national security,
00:08:56.740 but I also want
00:08:57.420 to get a lot of views
00:08:58.360 with like a funny
00:08:59.140 little dance.
00:08:59.840 So to me,
00:09:00.520 you know,
00:09:00.660 it's a tough debate,
00:09:01.420 but obviously
00:09:01.920 we've got to go
00:09:02.880 for the views.
00:09:04.060 And you know,
00:09:04.840 we spoke to Nigel Farage
00:09:06.780 on this Huawei question.
00:09:08.860 They've installed
00:09:09.320 a ton of 5G infrastructure,
00:09:11.660 telecoms infrastructure.
00:09:13.220 I guess,
00:09:14.240 you know,
00:09:14.640 I'm a little less optimistic.
00:09:16.440 It seems to me
00:09:17.060 like China is 0.82
00:09:18.040 really aggressing here.
00:09:19.660 Do you think
00:09:20.000 it's actually coming
00:09:21.320 from a place
00:09:21.920 of maybe being
00:09:22.720 a little bit
00:09:23.100 of a paper tiger?
00:09:23.880 So listen,
00:09:25.180 I'm actually
00:09:25.660 very optimistic
00:09:26.500 and that's not
00:09:28.160 to diminish
00:09:28.640 the threat
00:09:29.200 that China poses. 0.95
00:09:30.200 I think China 0.97
00:09:30.660 will pose a threat
00:09:31.460 for a very long time.
00:09:32.880 But the reason
00:09:33.740 I'm optimistic
00:09:34.560 is suddenly
00:09:35.300 the world's noticed.
00:09:36.680 Nine months ago
00:09:37.680 when I was on
00:09:38.320 the Asia trip,
00:09:39.440 people in Washington
00:09:40.260 were dismissing,
00:09:41.140 why are you talking
00:09:41.800 about the threat
00:09:42.400 of China?
00:09:42.900 What's the threat here?
00:09:43.760 Oh, come on. 0.87
00:09:44.600 Look,
00:09:44.900 it was all about money.
00:09:46.020 It was all about
00:09:46.980 the Benjamins.
00:09:47.660 They wanted to make
00:09:48.360 big bucks in China
00:09:49.460 and there's
00:09:49.940 a big market there
00:09:51.080 and this COVID crisis
00:09:54.280 and China's responsibility
00:09:56.800 and culpability for it
00:09:58.200 I think has really changed
00:09:59.920 the way a lot of people
00:10:01.560 perceive the threat
00:10:02.720 of China.
00:10:03.740 And I think
00:10:04.280 the most significant
00:10:05.400 long-term policy consequence
00:10:07.580 from this pandemic
00:10:09.180 is going to be
00:10:10.280 a fundamental reassessment
00:10:11.600 of the United States'
00:10:13.120 relationship with China.
00:10:14.160 So that's a good thing.
00:10:15.760 I think China's a threat, 0.99
00:10:16.980 but I'm glad to see
00:10:17.860 some people finally
00:10:18.920 opening their eyes
00:10:20.300 and it is not
00:10:23.920 this similar.
00:10:25.660 I view it somewhat
00:10:27.280 like Churchill's efforts
00:10:31.740 in the UK
00:10:32.400 to point to the threats
00:10:34.360 of Nazi Germany.
00:10:35.280 Yeah.
00:10:36.140 And he wrote a book
00:10:39.580 while England slept
00:10:40.620 and talked about
00:10:41.820 how England allowed
00:10:43.020 Nazi Germany
00:10:44.000 to grow more and more
00:10:44.960 and more dangerous.
00:10:45.660 Now JFK actually
00:10:46.560 took that same title
00:10:48.220 and adopted it.
00:10:51.340 But that principle,
00:10:53.940 I think China 0.97
00:10:56.040 screwed up
00:10:57.520 by being so ham-handed
00:11:00.740 and deliberate
00:11:01.500 in covering up
00:11:02.660 a global pandemic.
00:11:04.200 There was,
00:11:05.500 10 years ago,
00:11:06.240 even five years ago,
00:11:07.400 this kind of consensus
00:11:08.820 among both parties
00:11:09.980 that a rising China
00:11:11.480 was good for everybody.
00:11:12.800 Oh, how wonderful
00:11:13.460 that they entered
00:11:14.200 the World Trade Organization.
00:11:15.660 How wonderful.
00:11:16.420 And I think
00:11:17.220 certainly in the last few months
00:11:19.080 we've realized
00:11:19.660 there are some seriously
00:11:21.000 negative consequences
00:11:22.100 to a rising China.
00:11:23.520 So you're right.
00:11:24.340 It is undeniable.
00:11:25.480 People are waking up to that.
00:11:26.500 That is a very good thing.
00:11:27.680 I want to get to
00:11:28.460 one mailbag question,
00:11:29.860 Senator,
00:11:30.380 because while people
00:11:32.360 may not want to watch
00:11:33.480 videos of us
00:11:34.240 dancing on TikTok,
00:11:35.860 they can find you
00:11:36.940 on a new social media platform,
00:11:38.760 which is coming up
00:11:40.800 in the wake of Twitter
00:11:42.240 becoming so aggressively
00:11:44.320 censoring of conservative content,
00:11:47.160 you have joined Parler.
00:11:48.920 So I have joined Parler.
00:11:50.380 Parler is a new social media app.
00:11:52.460 It's very similar to Twitter.
00:11:54.720 But what's interesting
00:11:55.540 is that Parler
00:11:56.340 is explicitly designed
00:11:58.320 to allow free speech.
00:11:59.680 I actually had a conversation
00:12:00.560 with their CEO
00:12:01.460 before I joined them
00:12:02.620 and talked to him
00:12:03.980 about what his vision
00:12:05.100 for the company was.
00:12:06.220 And he said,
00:12:06.860 look, we don't want to have
00:12:08.160 political censorship.
00:12:09.520 We want people
00:12:10.880 to be able to speak freely
00:12:12.120 and engage in debate
00:12:13.620 and disagree.
00:12:14.600 And I think that's fantastic.
00:12:16.180 And so I joined Parler.
00:12:18.720 And actually,
00:12:19.900 I put out a video
00:12:21.060 explaining why
00:12:22.040 that it was for free speech
00:12:23.220 that big tech
00:12:24.300 and Twitter
00:12:24.840 and Google
00:12:25.420 and YouTube
00:12:26.020 and Facebook
00:12:27.040 have been so shameless
00:12:28.140 in censoring views
00:12:29.640 they disagree with
00:12:30.540 that I was opening
00:12:31.840 a Parler account.
00:12:32.600 I put out a video
00:12:33.320 and I put it out on Twitter,
00:12:34.640 which I have to admit
00:12:35.900 was perhaps
00:12:36.780 mildly putting
00:12:38.240 a thumb in their eye.
00:12:41.060 But the video
00:12:42.480 on Twitter
00:12:43.440 announcing that I was
00:12:44.680 opening an account
00:12:45.500 on Parler
00:12:46.100 has gotten,
00:12:47.100 I think to date,
00:12:47.820 1.1 million views.
00:12:49.840 So it's kind of interesting
00:12:50.880 that on the Twitter platform,
00:12:53.260 people are saying,
00:12:54.080 hey,
00:12:54.220 we want to be somewhere
00:12:55.200 where there's free speech.
00:12:56.680 That is.
00:12:57.280 And I hope
00:12:58.340 that more people join.
00:12:59.740 I was speaking to
00:13:00.620 my friend Dan Bongino,
00:13:02.020 who I know
00:13:02.860 is an investor in Parler.
00:13:04.080 And he told me
00:13:05.120 there are a lot
00:13:06.440 of people moving
00:13:07.080 over there right now.
00:13:07.840 I think when Twitter
00:13:08.460 censored the president
00:13:09.320 of the United States,
00:13:10.040 that was a bridge
00:13:10.900 too far for a lot
00:13:11.680 of people.
00:13:12.580 But I hope that
00:13:13.960 people continue
00:13:14.700 to do that
00:13:15.220 as an alternative.
00:13:16.280 I also hope
00:13:16.840 that we continue
00:13:17.500 to use the legal
00:13:18.480 means available to us
00:13:19.580 to stop the abuses
00:13:20.680 at Big Tech.
00:13:21.700 Speaking of legal
00:13:22.640 questions,
00:13:23.360 I want to
00:13:24.180 get to a question
00:13:26.100 that actually
00:13:27.000 harkens back
00:13:27.740 to another episode
00:13:28.600 we've done.
00:13:29.240 Actually,
00:13:29.480 I guess a few
00:13:29.920 episodes we've done.
00:13:31.480 You've been
00:13:32.120 pretty tough
00:13:33.020 on Chief Justice
00:13:34.400 John Roberts.
00:13:35.600 And this question
00:13:36.440 from Michael
00:13:37.360 wants to know
00:13:39.160 if this has
00:13:40.160 any personal
00:13:41.940 aspect to it
00:13:42.840 because you
00:13:43.900 and John Roberts,
00:13:44.780 it's not like
00:13:45.320 you've just
00:13:45.980 know each other
00:13:46.540 professionally.
00:13:47.840 You've known each
00:13:48.460 other for a very
00:13:49.300 long time.
00:13:50.620 Yeah,
00:13:50.860 no,
00:13:51.080 I know John Roberts
00:13:52.120 very well.
00:13:52.880 He is a personal
00:13:53.820 friend.
00:13:54.300 I've known him
00:13:54.660 25 years.
00:13:55.920 We both clerked
00:13:56.820 for the same
00:13:57.240 justice.
00:13:57.720 We both clerked
00:13:58.900 for Chief Justice
00:13:59.560 William Rehnquist.
00:14:00.320 He clerked
00:14:01.180 about 15 years
00:14:01.960 before I did.
00:14:03.640 And actually,
00:14:05.720 when I was
00:14:06.700 clerking for
00:14:07.460 Chief Justice
00:14:08.000 Rehnquist,
00:14:08.520 I remember my
00:14:08.980 co-clerks and I,
00:14:09.840 we asked the
00:14:11.780 chief,
00:14:12.180 we said,
00:14:12.720 who's the best
00:14:13.720 Supreme Court
00:14:14.240 advocate practicing?
00:14:16.380 And Rehnquist
00:14:17.340 chuckled and he
00:14:18.440 said,
00:14:18.740 you know,
00:14:19.660 I think I could
00:14:20.320 probably get a
00:14:21.220 majority of my
00:14:22.000 colleagues to say
00:14:23.500 John Roberts is
00:14:24.420 the best Supreme
00:14:25.020 Court advocate
00:14:25.620 alive.
00:14:26.920 And I got to
00:14:27.860 say,
00:14:28.020 I've seen him
00:14:28.420 argue a number
00:14:29.000 of cases.
00:14:29.620 I agree with
00:14:30.080 that assessment.
00:14:30.700 He is a
00:14:31.180 spectacularly
00:14:32.480 talented Supreme
00:14:33.780 Court advocate.
00:14:35.260 And he's
00:14:35.820 someone who,
00:14:37.060 when I was a
00:14:37.540 young lawyer,
00:14:38.240 John befriended
00:14:38.960 me during
00:14:40.760 Bush versus
00:14:41.420 Gore.
00:14:41.940 So I had
00:14:42.560 been on the
00:14:43.160 George W.
00:14:43.720 Bush campaign
00:14:45.020 down in Austin
00:14:45.920 and I'd been
00:14:46.520 doing policy
00:14:47.220 there,
00:14:48.200 but I was
00:14:48.720 part of the
00:14:50.320 team,
00:14:51.040 the legal team
00:14:51.800 in Bush versus
00:14:52.520 Gore in the
00:14:53.120 2000 recount.
00:14:54.860 And I called a 1.00
00:14:56.060 number of the
00:14:56.480 lawyers and asked
00:14:57.220 them to join us.
00:14:57.820 I called John
00:14:58.460 Roberts.
00:14:58.900 I called him
00:14:59.600 in his office
00:15:00.020 in D.C.
00:15:00.440 and said,
00:15:00.720 hey,
00:15:01.000 he was
00:15:01.340 practicing law.
00:15:02.580 I said,
00:15:03.000 can you come
00:15:03.560 down and
00:15:04.680 join us in
00:15:05.700 Florida and be
00:15:06.300 part of the
00:15:06.800 team?
00:15:08.000 In this case,
00:15:08.960 he came down.
00:15:10.560 He participated.
00:15:13.880 It's why what
00:15:15.020 he's doing right
00:15:15.920 now is so
00:15:17.920 heartbreaking.
00:15:18.720 And I,
00:15:19.940 a couple of
00:15:20.280 weeks ago,
00:15:20.740 gave a speech
00:15:21.320 on the Senate
00:15:21.840 floor that was
00:15:22.820 really critical of
00:15:25.080 John Roberts,
00:15:25.600 because I
00:15:26.020 think he has
00:15:26.940 been violating
00:15:28.580 his oath.
00:15:29.200 You know,
00:15:29.360 at his
00:15:29.740 confirmation
00:15:30.140 hearing,
00:15:30.840 he famously
00:15:31.500 promised,
00:15:32.500 he said,
00:15:32.840 judges should
00:15:33.460 be umpires
00:15:34.120 and call
00:15:34.700 balls and 0.99
00:15:35.320 strikes.
00:15:36.440 Well,
00:15:36.640 he hasn't
00:15:37.080 been an
00:15:37.680 umpire
00:15:38.060 recently.
00:15:38.720 He has
00:15:39.120 grabbed a
00:15:40.020 bat and
00:15:40.520 jumped into
00:15:41.000 the game
00:15:41.600 and he
00:15:42.360 keeps joining
00:15:43.120 with the
00:15:43.740 liberal
00:15:44.000 justices
00:15:44.780 in opinions.
00:15:47.440 You know,
00:15:47.640 if John
00:15:48.060 Roberts
00:15:48.420 weren't so
00:15:48.960 smart,
00:15:49.540 I'd actually
00:15:50.020 might be
00:15:50.480 more forgiving
00:15:51.060 of it.
00:15:51.660 But he
00:15:51.980 knows exactly
00:15:52.820 what he's
00:15:53.340 doing.
00:15:53.580 He knows
00:15:54.380 that he
00:15:55.820 is violating
00:15:57.340 his oath
00:15:57.940 to the
00:15:58.260 Constitution.
00:15:59.560 And it
00:16:00.160 saddens me.
00:16:01.120 It really
00:16:01.880 saddens me.
00:16:03.740 It was a
00:16:04.500 mistake for
00:16:05.160 him to be
00:16:05.500 appointed to
00:16:05.960 the court.
00:16:08.820 And I
00:16:09.420 gotta say,
00:16:09.920 by the way,
00:16:10.480 look,
00:16:10.700 I mean,
00:16:10.940 before I
00:16:11.540 was in
00:16:11.760 the Senate,
00:16:12.480 my career
00:16:13.460 was as a
00:16:14.400 Supreme Court
00:16:14.900 advocate.
00:16:15.700 Right.
00:16:16.860 You can't
00:16:17.600 be in the
00:16:17.940 business of
00:16:18.540 blasting Supreme
00:16:19.440 Court justices
00:16:20.240 if you ever
00:16:20.680 hope to go
00:16:21.080 back there.
00:16:21.600 I would
00:16:23.340 say I
00:16:23.820 have pretty
00:16:24.220 firmly burned
00:16:25.080 my bridges.
00:16:26.100 Yes,
00:16:26.580 I think
00:16:27.020 that's true.
00:16:27.580 I very
00:16:28.060 much,
00:16:28.600 you know,
00:16:28.820 I've long
00:16:29.340 hoped you
00:16:29.760 remain in
00:16:30.420 elected public
00:16:31.180 life,
00:16:31.620 but now I
00:16:32.180 hope so
00:16:32.580 really for
00:16:33.020 your bank
00:16:33.520 account,
00:16:34.020 too,
00:16:34.260 because,
00:16:34.700 you know,
00:16:35.540 I would
00:16:36.000 imagine that
00:16:37.060 it'll be a
00:16:37.640 lot tougher
00:16:38.080 after you've
00:16:38.660 been so
00:16:39.220 honest about
00:16:40.440 really what's
00:16:41.000 going on at
00:16:41.460 the Supreme
00:16:41.860 Court.
00:16:42.580 And not to
00:16:43.120 flatter you too
00:16:43.660 much,
00:16:43.900 I don't want
00:16:44.180 to do that,
00:16:44.720 but it is
00:16:45.800 refreshing to
00:16:47.060 hear,
00:16:47.960 given the
00:16:48.500 clubbiness of
00:16:49.240 Washington,
00:16:50.280 that you
00:16:50.860 haven't let
00:16:51.320 that personal
00:16:52.100 friendship get
00:16:52.720 in the way
00:16:53.180 of actually
00:16:53.800 defending the
00:16:54.360 Constitution and
00:16:55.400 saying what
00:16:55.820 needs to be
00:16:56.260 said about
00:16:56.980 what's going
00:16:57.380 on at the
00:16:57.700 Supreme Court.
00:16:58.360 Well,
00:16:58.760 it's sad and
00:16:59.980 it's frustrating.
00:17:01.860 And I'm tired
00:17:04.740 of Republicans
00:17:05.440 getting Supreme
00:17:06.320 Court nominations
00:17:07.060 wrong.
00:17:07.520 and I'm tired
00:17:09.460 of justices.
00:17:11.540 Justices in the
00:17:12.320 court, they only
00:17:12.820 grow one
00:17:13.220 direction.
00:17:13.700 They only
00:17:13.920 grow to the
00:17:14.360 left.
00:17:14.960 And the
00:17:15.340 reason they
00:17:15.980 do that is
00:17:17.980 all the
00:17:18.620 incentives are
00:17:19.460 to grow to
00:17:19.900 the left.
00:17:20.320 Because when
00:17:21.060 you vote with
00:17:22.520 the liberals,
00:17:22.960 you get
00:17:23.540 praised.
00:17:24.200 You get
00:17:24.520 praised in
00:17:25.160 the newspaper.
00:17:25.560 You get
00:17:26.140 praised in
00:17:26.940 the law
00:17:27.340 schools.
00:17:27.620 You get
00:17:28.000 praised in
00:17:28.680 the D.C.
00:17:29.660 cocktail party
00:17:30.420 circuit.
00:17:30.840 And they
00:17:32.200 used to
00:17:32.740 call, the
00:17:33.100 Supreme Court
00:17:33.640 reporter for
00:17:34.200 the New York
00:17:34.540 Times, her
00:17:35.040 name was
00:17:35.320 Linda
00:17:35.540 Greenhouse,
00:17:36.820 and they
00:17:37.180 used to
00:17:37.700 call that
00:17:40.240 the
00:17:40.480 greenhouse
00:17:40.920 effect, which
00:17:42.920 is Sandra
00:17:43.700 Day O'Connor
00:17:44.420 and Tony
00:17:45.120 Kennedy would
00:17:46.380 want to get
00:17:47.000 praised by
00:17:47.740 Linda
00:17:48.060 Greenhouse.
00:17:48.860 And so if
00:17:49.140 they voted
00:17:49.620 with the
00:17:50.020 left, they'd
00:17:50.560 get praised.
00:17:52.120 And I got
00:17:52.660 to say, as I
00:17:53.380 look at
00:17:53.740 Supreme Court
00:17:54.320 nominees, I
00:17:56.560 want someone
00:17:57.420 who doesn't
00:17:58.240 give a damn
00:17:59.220 if they're
00:18:00.320 being criticized
00:18:01.180 and beaten
00:18:02.000 with sticks.
00:18:02.680 The most
00:18:03.240 important
00:18:03.680 criterion is
00:18:04.900 show me
00:18:05.320 someone that
00:18:05.880 stood for
00:18:06.360 conservative
00:18:06.820 principles and
00:18:08.040 has paid the
00:18:08.820 price.
00:18:09.280 Show me
00:18:09.580 someone who
00:18:10.440 hates D.C.
00:18:11.880 cocktail parties,
00:18:12.660 doesn't want to
00:18:13.280 go to a party
00:18:14.480 in Georgetown.
00:18:15.840 It's the reason
00:18:16.680 with President
00:18:17.180 Trump for both
00:18:18.020 of his vacancies,
00:18:19.300 my number one
00:18:20.100 choice that I
00:18:20.760 urged him was
00:18:21.460 Senator Mike
00:18:22.040 Lee.
00:18:23.120 Because Mike
00:18:24.020 Lee, I've
00:18:24.720 seen firsthand,
00:18:26.160 he's devoted
00:18:26.720 his life to the
00:18:27.480 Constitution, and
00:18:28.600 if Mike Lee
00:18:29.280 had been there,
00:18:29.940 the chances
00:18:30.800 that Mike
00:18:31.440 Lee would
00:18:31.960 have written
00:18:32.340 the Bostock
00:18:32.980 opinion that
00:18:33.480 Neil Gorsuch
00:18:34.000 wrote, that
00:18:35.040 rewrote our 0.80
00:18:35.680 civil rights
00:18:36.220 laws, the
00:18:37.000 chances that
00:18:37.540 Mike Lee
00:18:37.880 would have
00:18:38.140 written that
00:18:38.540 are 0.00%.
00:18:40.300 And I know
00:18:41.020 that because
00:18:42.600 he's not
00:18:43.260 seeking the
00:18:43.840 praise of the
00:18:44.460 press or the
00:18:44.960 academy, and
00:18:45.720 we need to
00:18:46.640 stop getting
00:18:47.080 this wrong.
00:18:47.940 That's such a
00:18:48.460 good point.
00:18:49.080 I mean, just
00:18:50.140 that little bit
00:18:51.060 of wanting to
00:18:52.160 get the good
00:18:52.660 New York Times
00:18:53.360 article or
00:18:54.020 wanting them to
00:18:54.940 even not be
00:18:55.860 too harsh on
00:18:56.580 you, that is
00:18:57.200 very, very
00:18:57.960 corrosive.
00:18:58.520 Not a lot of
00:18:58.960 people can
00:18:59.320 stand up to
00:18:59.840 it, and we
00:19:00.600 need more of
00:19:01.900 them, and we
00:19:02.220 need all the
00:19:02.520 ones we can
00:19:02.880 get.
00:19:03.480 Last question
00:19:04.080 before we have
00:19:04.540 to go.
00:19:04.800 This is from
00:19:05.200 Publius.
00:19:06.200 I bet that's
00:19:06.700 not his name
00:19:07.420 at birth, but
00:19:08.220 that's the name
00:19:08.700 he's writing
00:19:09.040 under.
00:19:10.160 What are the
00:19:10.820 benefits of a
00:19:12.020 balanced budget?
00:19:13.140 I'm pretty sure
00:19:13.860 he's not the
00:19:14.360 first to use that
00:19:15.140 name.
00:19:15.480 That's right.
00:19:16.500 I've heard this
00:19:17.300 somewhere before.
00:19:18.160 I'm not sure
00:19:19.420 where.
00:19:19.840 I guess it ties in.
00:19:20.760 I mentioned bank
00:19:21.680 accounts earlier.
00:19:22.940 This is one that
00:19:23.780 comes up a lot,
00:19:24.620 and you don't hear
00:19:25.060 about it a lot
00:19:25.540 these days.
00:19:26.040 What are the
00:19:27.140 benefits of a
00:19:28.060 balanced budget
00:19:28.960 amendment?
00:19:30.420 So, great
00:19:31.180 question.
00:19:31.700 By the way, for
00:19:32.280 folks who are
00:19:32.800 listening, that
00:19:33.380 little comment
00:19:34.020 about Publius
00:19:34.700 has been used
00:19:35.320 before.
00:19:36.040 So, Publius
00:19:37.280 was the pen
00:19:38.020 name under
00:19:38.880 which the
00:19:39.260 Federalist
00:19:39.600 Papers were
00:19:40.060 written.
00:19:40.640 And so, it
00:19:41.900 was James
00:19:42.720 Madison and
00:19:43.360 Alexander Hamilton
00:19:44.220 and John Jay.
00:19:45.460 The three of
00:19:46.080 them wrote them.
00:19:46.980 They're basically
00:19:47.400 newspaper editorials
00:19:48.640 under the name
00:19:49.840 Publius.
00:19:50.420 And so, that's a
00:19:51.000 name that is
00:19:52.100 fraught with
00:19:53.020 history and
00:19:54.640 great moment.
00:19:56.040 A balanced
00:19:56.720 budget amendment
00:19:57.300 would be
00:19:57.620 enormously
00:19:58.380 impactful.
00:19:59.260 And it's
00:20:00.000 something that
00:20:00.480 I have advocated,
00:20:02.520 fought for,
00:20:02.960 for eight years.
00:20:04.300 You know, most
00:20:05.040 of the states
00:20:05.800 have a balanced
00:20:06.900 budget amendment.
00:20:07.460 I think it's
00:20:07.740 something like 45
00:20:08.480 states have a
00:20:09.320 balanced budget
00:20:09.860 amendment.
00:20:10.200 In Texas, we
00:20:11.920 have to have a
00:20:12.520 balanced budget.
00:20:13.140 The Texas state
00:20:13.780 legislature can't 0.62
00:20:14.920 spend more than
00:20:16.140 it has in
00:20:16.540 revenue.
00:20:16.920 It can't spend
00:20:17.420 money it doesn't
00:20:18.020 have.
00:20:20.140 In Washington, a
00:20:22.420 balanced budget
00:20:23.200 amendment, official
00:20:24.040 Washington doesn't
00:20:24.900 want that.
00:20:25.360 Because the
00:20:26.380 government, the
00:20:28.080 way politicians
00:20:29.200 in Washington get
00:20:30.220 reelected is
00:20:32.040 spending money we
00:20:32.860 don't have.
00:20:33.640 And the way, by
00:20:34.340 the way, you get a
00:20:35.120 trillion dollar
00:20:35.820 appropriation bill in
00:20:37.600 ordinary times, much
00:20:38.660 less pandemic
00:20:39.320 times.
00:20:39.740 Let's just take
00:20:40.240 ordinary times.
00:20:42.040 A trillion dollar
00:20:43.000 bill is very easy
00:20:45.180 to get.
00:20:45.700 You just pay for
00:20:47.660 everything everyone
00:20:48.400 wants.
00:20:49.040 And you end up
00:20:50.120 getting all the
00:20:50.760 Democrats and half
00:20:51.600 the Republicans.
00:20:52.180 And never mind
00:20:53.300 that you're
00:20:53.580 borrowing the
00:20:53.960 money from
00:20:54.320 China and
00:20:55.160 bankrupting our
00:20:55.860 kids and
00:20:56.180 grandkids.
00:20:57.020 It's a great
00:20:57.640 way for politicians
00:20:58.500 to buy their
00:20:59.320 reelection.
00:21:00.500 It's the reason I
00:21:01.320 fought hard for a
00:21:02.260 balanced budget
00:21:02.780 amendment.
00:21:03.100 And I'll tell you
00:21:03.500 something that is
00:21:04.080 hand in hand with
00:21:04.880 that is a term
00:21:06.500 limits amendment.
00:21:07.100 I'm the author of
00:21:08.380 the term limits
00:21:09.300 constitutional amendment
00:21:10.280 in the Senate.
00:21:11.620 I would limit
00:21:12.140 House members to
00:21:13.300 three terms,
00:21:14.540 senators to two
00:21:15.340 terms.
00:21:16.500 And the reason
00:21:17.360 is it's much
00:21:18.160 the same that
00:21:18.940 Washington is a
00:21:20.000 corrupt swamp and
00:21:22.000 career politicians
00:21:23.620 who want to spend
00:21:24.220 their whole lives
00:21:24.920 here, that's where
00:21:26.160 they get the
00:21:26.700 incentive to just
00:21:27.640 spend and spend
00:21:28.360 and spend and
00:21:28.920 spend us into
00:21:29.400 bankruptcy.
00:21:30.280 Yes, and you
00:21:31.020 make this great
00:21:31.580 point on borrowing
00:21:32.300 from China because
00:21:33.420 when you don't have
00:21:34.880 something like a
00:21:35.480 balanced budget
00:21:36.020 amendment, what
00:21:36.580 happens?
00:21:37.020 You got to borrow
00:21:37.460 the money from
00:21:37.900 somewhere and
00:21:38.480 ironically, we're
00:21:39.580 borrowing the money
00:21:40.300 from our chief
00:21:41.060 geopolitical
00:21:42.160 adversary.
00:21:42.860 Kind of shows you
00:21:43.400 how the domestic
00:21:44.460 issues relate to
00:21:45.360 the foreign,
00:21:45.820 threats and vice
00:21:46.980 versa.
00:21:48.040 Too many threats
00:21:48.880 to count,
00:21:49.400 Senator, but
00:21:49.740 thank you.
00:21:50.180 That was a clean
00:21:51.960 trip through all
00:21:52.960 of them and
00:21:53.800 clarifies things,
00:21:55.520 even if it doesn't
00:21:56.560 make us feel all
00:21:57.400 that much better.
00:21:58.520 I guess that's the
00:22:00.040 problem of political
00:22:01.020 reality.
00:22:01.720 Much more to get
00:22:02.220 to.
00:22:02.380 We'll have to wait
00:22:02.820 until next time.
00:22:04.060 Senator, thank you.
00:22:05.440 I'm Michael Knowles.
00:22:06.100 This is Verdict with
00:22:06.880 Ted Cruz.
00:22:07.340 This episode of
00:22:17.580 Verdict with Ted
00:22:18.500 Cruz is being
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