Verdict with Ted Cruz - Take Your Damn Mask Off, LIVE in Madison, WI

00:00:00.000 This is an iHeart Podcast.

00:00:02.340 Guaranteed human.

00:00:06.760 Thank you.

00:00:14.680 All right.

00:00:24.140 This is great.

00:00:30.700 Wow.

00:00:40.640 Thank you so much.

00:00:42.080 Thank you for being here.

00:00:44.320 Wow.

00:00:45.500 Wisconsin rocks.

00:00:47.320 This is so good.

00:00:48.660 You know, Senator, to be here, thanks to YAF,

00:00:52.900 thanks to the Logan family for supporting this tour,

00:00:55.260 to be with everybody, and I don't know about you,

00:00:57.780 but at least in this room,

00:01:00.300 I am breathing the sweet air of freedom.

00:01:02.820 I don't feel muzzled.

00:01:04.700 I feel like we can speak.

00:01:06.800 Oh, that's great.

00:01:08.700 Well, and it is fantastic to kick off our national tour

00:01:13.380 right here on the campus of University of Wisconsin at Madison.

00:01:16.820 Well, I don't...

00:01:18.520 Did they brief you before you came out here?

00:01:20.420 We're not in the campus.

00:01:20.860 Well, there's a...

00:01:21.700 Yeah, there's been a change.

00:01:23.300 Maybe...

00:01:24.080 All right.

00:01:24.480 You better sit down.

00:01:25.480 I hate to tell you about this.

00:01:27.020 We should do a podcast.

00:01:27.980 All right.

00:01:28.500 Because, Senator, we...

00:01:29.860 Well, we're not on campus.

00:01:34.660 I'll address all of you.

00:01:36.020 We are not at the University of Wisconsin-Madison,

00:01:41.680 but we are here in Wisconsin.

00:01:43.660 We are here with a lot of great students,

00:01:45.720 and we are going to flip a certain signal

00:01:49.280 at all of the tyrants who want to shut us up.

00:01:52.220 This is Verdict with Ted Cruz.

00:01:53.540 Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz.

00:02:08.080 I'm Michael Knowles.

00:02:08.940 Senator, it's great to be with you

00:02:10.520 and several hundred of our dearest friends,

00:02:13.500 probably more than several hundred of our friends,

00:02:15.300 thank you so much to all of the students tonight

00:02:17.820 who stood up to the petty leftist administrators

00:02:21.960 at the campus of the University of Wisconsin-Madison

00:02:24.720 who tried to shut all of us up

00:02:26.680 who don't want any conservative ideas on campus.

00:02:29.720 We're all here.

00:02:31.240 Well, Michael...

00:02:31.720 So, Michael, how could that be?

00:02:40.860 We announced a national tour.

00:02:42.580 We pick as the opening venue a campus

00:02:45.500 right in the heart of the beast,

00:02:46.940 and then the students and faculty and folks who came out

00:02:50.420 came out because they wanted to hear a discussion.

00:02:53.720 They wanted to hear an honest discussion of what's happening.

00:02:56.140 So what happened?

00:02:56.940 Why aren't we on campus?

00:02:58.140 This was an amazing circumstance

00:03:01.140 because we've talked for a long time

00:03:03.840 about how the left wants to muzzle conservatives on campus,

00:03:07.280 and usually they make it difficult for YAF in particular

00:03:10.920 to book classrooms or lecture halls,

00:03:14.020 and they'll talk about hate speech,

00:03:16.080 and, you know, if you defend, for instance,

00:03:17.700 the First Amendment, you're a hateful, terrible bigot,

00:03:19.920 or if you defend, I don't know, George Washington,

00:03:21.920 you're a terrible, awful, terrible person.

00:03:24.260 But what happened this time

00:03:25.500 is they literally wanted to muzzle us.

00:03:29.000 They wanted everybody in the lecture hall

00:03:31.280 to put a mask on, including the speakers.

00:03:35.240 Now, I don't know how that would work

00:03:36.340 because if we had done that,

00:03:38.340 the podcast would sound something like...

00:03:39.700 Look, there are some people

00:03:43.980 who think that would be an improvement.

00:03:44.820 I think there are,

00:03:45.560 and they happen to work at UW-Madison.

00:03:48.300 But it's even crazier

00:03:49.620 because there is an exemption to this mask rule

00:03:53.040 in the UW-Madison code,

00:03:55.560 and they have granted it to other speakers.

00:03:58.600 They just won't grant it to us.

00:04:01.480 Well, I will note that one of the exemptions

00:04:04.360 in the policy is for artistic performances.

00:04:06.540 So we got a letter from the dean,

00:04:08.260 I guess a couple of days ago,

00:04:09.460 saying the only way you can do this event on campus

00:04:11.700 is if everyone is masked, including the two of us,

00:04:15.100 and you can film the whole podcast while wearing a mask,

00:04:17.560 but there's an exemption for artistic performance.

00:04:20.440 And I got to say, Michael, I'm really offended

00:04:22.380 that you were not willing to sing a cappella

00:04:24.920 for the entire podcast.

00:04:26.940 You know, all those years of cigars

00:04:29.420 have not been great on the local courts.

00:04:31.460 Look, you went to Yale.

00:04:31.920 I thought it was mandatory there

00:04:33.300 that you sing in, like, some all-boys club.

00:04:36.460 It's a very thespian sort of place.

00:04:38.400 There's no question about that.

00:04:40.020 You know, this gets to something that we talked about,

00:04:43.240 gosh, going back over a year now.

00:04:44.800 I think we're on the 590th day of 15 days

00:04:47.140 to slow the spread.

00:04:48.340 And from the very beginning...

00:04:49.540 Almost there.

00:04:50.200 We're pretty close.

00:04:53.120 You know, at the beginning,

00:04:55.120 a lot of people said, put the mask on.

00:04:57.040 It's just going to be a short little while.

00:04:59.280 And so people were willing to take prudential measures.

00:05:02.160 They were always, well, you know,

00:05:03.060 protect the public health.

00:05:03.860 No one wanted to see people dying.

00:05:06.420 But there was always this fear

00:05:07.760 that when you give in and you give in

00:05:10.700 and now it's the 16th day

00:05:12.040 and now it's the 50th day

00:05:13.260 and now it's the 100th day

00:05:14.260 and now everyone's got the vaccine

00:05:16.160 if they want the vaccine,

00:05:17.260 but you still have to wear the mask.

00:05:18.640 It seems as though the mask

00:05:20.020 is not intended to protect the public health anymore.

00:05:22.860 It's just an excuse to take power.

00:05:25.520 Well, and you look at what UW did here.

00:05:27.740 I mean, the idea,

00:05:28.840 there have been multiple speakers on campus

00:05:30.820 they've had who haven't worn a mask

00:05:32.620 because if you're actually speaking to a crowd,

00:05:34.520 it doesn't work to wear a mask,

00:05:37.280 particularly when you're televising it

00:05:39.380 and sending it out worldwide.

00:05:41.740 They know that.

00:05:42.800 And I'll point out, you know,

00:05:44.140 just this weekend,

00:05:45.380 they had 75,000 football fans

00:05:48.540 screaming, cheering,

00:05:52.080 maybe imbibing a little bit.

00:05:53.720 And somehow that didn't pose any health threat.

00:05:58.500 No.

00:05:59.300 But yet the two of us are a lethal health threat.

00:06:03.760 Yes, I have been called that on many an occasion.

00:06:07.660 You know, there is another crazy aspect.

00:06:10.100 This is a public university.

00:06:12.620 So this is a taxpayer-funded university.

00:06:15.540 You would think, I don't know,

00:06:17.360 I would think, maybe I'm just old-fashioned,

00:06:19.680 that if anybody is going to be permitted to speak

00:06:21.900 to help, you know, educate the students,

00:06:24.960 it would be a United States senator.

00:06:26.980 This seems like a real affront

00:06:28.860 to the American system of government,

00:06:30.640 to civics, to our political tradition here.

00:06:33.620 But so what?

00:06:34.460 They're going to do it anyway.

00:06:35.280 Well, the provost who sent us the letter

00:06:37.240 is a Democrat.

00:06:39.480 He was served in Democrat administrations.

00:06:42.360 He's given, he gave $1,000 to Barack Obama.

00:06:44.800 He gave $1,000 to Tammy Baldwin.

00:06:47.060 He's given more money to Act Blue.

00:06:48.740 And he sent a very thorough academic letter

00:06:53.000 that said, we will not grant you an exemption

00:06:56.060 because.

00:06:59.120 There was a period out.

00:07:00.440 There was no, it was no blank.

00:07:01.640 It was just because, because I say so.

00:07:04.200 And to really call the joke out.

00:07:06.580 So the university requires,

00:07:08.020 when you do an event on campus,

00:07:09.100 that you have to do the RSVPs

00:07:10.660 through the campus Eventbrite.

00:07:12.560 So when we said, we're not recording

00:07:14.660 a friggin' podcast wearing masks,

00:07:17.120 we rescheduled.

00:07:19.780 And you know what the university said?

00:07:21.780 We won't give you your RSVP list.

00:07:24.440 We're not going to tell you

00:07:25.980 the students who want to see.

00:07:28.080 So we had, I want to thank everyone here

00:07:30.240 who had the ingenuity to find us

00:07:32.180 when this was rescheduled in one day.

00:07:34.180 It just goes to show you.

00:07:41.280 It just goes to show you.

00:07:43.120 What UW-Madison is interested in here,

00:07:46.020 what the administrators are,

00:07:47.300 is not protecting their campus,

00:07:49.100 protecting their students.

00:07:50.000 They just don't want people

00:07:51.440 to hear what we have to say.

00:07:53.140 They don't want people to hear

00:07:54.280 legitimate criticisms of Joe Biden,

00:07:58.040 of the ruling class in this country,

00:08:00.380 of the liberal establishment.

00:08:01.520 And I imagine they're trying

00:08:03.760 to stifle speech in this desperate way

00:08:06.280 because they feel really confident, right?

00:08:08.420 Because they're just so popular.

00:08:09.740 Is that it?

00:08:10.300 Look, as you know,

00:08:11.940 it's an admission of weakness.

00:08:14.020 If you're strong,

00:08:15.640 if you're confident in what you believe,

00:08:17.380 if the facts are behind you,

00:08:19.700 then you're not frightened,

00:08:21.040 you're not threatened,

00:08:22.000 you're not intimidated

00:08:22.920 by those who disagree.

00:08:24.660 You look on the national scene,

00:08:25.920 you've got people like Bernie Sanders,

00:08:27.280 you've got people like AOC

00:08:28.440 who are socialists.

00:08:30.020 You and I don't want to silence them.

00:08:32.620 We don't want to censor them.

00:08:33.520 Frankly, I want a lot more people

00:08:35.260 to hear the inanities

00:08:36.440 that come out of their mouths.

00:08:37.620 Turn the volume up.

00:08:38.560 Yeah, please, please.

00:08:39.800 Like if you're the best cure,

00:08:42.500 John Stuart Mill said,

00:08:43.480 the best cure for bad speech

00:08:44.700 is more speech.

00:08:46.200 And the admission

00:08:47.940 of the university administrators,

00:08:50.620 of the faculties,

00:08:51.760 of these Marxists,

00:08:53.160 and I love Marxists

00:08:54.060 that have life tenure.

00:08:55.140 They get paid

00:08:55.940 hundreds of thousands of dollars,

00:08:57.620 forcibly paid

00:08:58.260 from the taxpayers

00:08:59.060 and never able to be fired,

00:09:00.440 but they're terrified

00:09:01.840 that anyone might disagree with them.

00:09:05.640 And that ultimately,

00:09:06.980 it's a disservice

00:09:08.080 to the students.

00:09:11.120 Look, college is all about

00:09:12.860 encountering ideas

00:09:14.280 you disagree with.

00:09:15.800 When I was in college,

00:09:16.680 when I was in law school,

00:09:17.760 I took classes from Marxists.

00:09:20.300 My family was imprisoned

00:09:21.740 and tortured in Cuba.

00:09:22.760 I hate communists.

00:09:24.820 Like deeply

00:09:25.760 and to the pit of my soul.

00:09:29.560 You know what's amazing?

00:09:33.620 What's amazing is

00:09:35.140 that is a controversial statement

00:09:37.280 these days.

00:09:38.080 That didn't used to be

00:09:38.760 a controversial statement.

00:09:39.660 Now it is.

00:09:40.880 But if you want to be...

00:09:43.020 All right, so years ago,

00:09:44.260 this is back, oh, 15 years ago,

00:09:47.360 I was invited, oddly enough,

00:09:49.740 to give the commencement speech

00:09:51.400 at the University of California,

00:09:54.140 Berkeley School of Government.

00:09:56.300 Did they not have Google at Berkeley?

00:09:58.000 They didn't know

00:09:58.460 to type in Ted Cruz?

00:10:00.180 So, all right,

00:10:00.640 this is long before

00:10:01.360 I was in the Senate,

00:10:02.260 long before anyone

00:10:03.780 had any idea who I was.

00:10:05.880 And apparently,

00:10:06.640 the way it came to pass

00:10:07.780 is the School of Government

00:10:08.740 there had, for some years,

00:10:10.800 had leftist speakers,

00:10:12.420 no surprise.

00:10:13.820 And the head of the school said,

00:10:17.020 you know, we ought to have

00:10:18.000 a Republican,

00:10:19.280 just out of diversity.

00:10:21.180 And I think he basically said,

00:10:22.640 I don't know any Republicans.

00:10:25.880 And so then he figured,

00:10:27.120 well, okay, all right,

00:10:28.040 if I want to find a Republican,

00:10:29.420 what do I do?

00:10:30.020 And he called a professor

00:10:30.980 at the University of Texas.

00:10:32.820 In Texas, they got to know

00:10:34.160 some Republicans there.

00:10:36.660 And I think what happened

00:10:37.960 is the professor,

00:10:38.760 I had spoken the year before

00:10:39.980 at UT at their School of Government,

00:10:42.180 and he said, look,

00:10:43.000 you know, this guy didn't suck,

00:10:44.200 so why don't you invite him?

00:10:47.060 And so I came out,

00:10:48.620 and it was interesting,

00:10:49.500 it was the dawn of Facebook.

00:10:51.300 It was right when it was,

00:10:52.660 I think it was like

00:10:53.840 three years off of Mark Zuckerberg

00:10:56.800 creating Facebook

00:10:57.760 to try to find girls on campus.

00:10:59.640 I mean, it was new,

00:11:01.860 and there was a protest group,

00:11:04.140 I still remember,

00:11:04.700 it had 93 people in it,

00:11:06.720 that were Berkeley students

00:11:09.660 protesting that I was coming,

00:11:11.780 Heidi said at the time,

00:11:14.020 she said, oh God,

00:11:15.860 you're not nearly important

00:11:17.040 enough to protest.

00:11:20.420 But I went and gave the speech,

00:11:22.080 and it was in this amphitheater,

00:11:23.500 and the entire speech

00:11:24.520 was on diversity,

00:11:26.300 but it was on intellectual diversity.

00:11:27.700 And what I said to the Berkeley students,

00:11:30.580 which I would say

00:11:31.580 to Madison students,

00:11:34.220 and I think we probably have

00:11:35.820 a lot of conservatives

00:11:36.620 and libertarians here,

00:11:38.020 but I hope we have some liberals here.

00:11:39.600 I hope we have a conversation.

00:11:41.420 And what I would say

00:11:42.680 to the student body writ large,

00:11:44.480 and to professors,

00:11:45.300 and to people,

00:11:45.780 is the passion

00:11:48.580 that's out of Berkeley,

00:11:50.540 that's out of Madison,

00:11:52.000 the passion to change the world,

00:11:53.940 to light the world,

00:11:55.000 to make a difference.

00:11:56.940 Don't let go of that.

00:11:58.200 Keep that fire,

00:12:00.840 because it's powerful,

00:12:02.520 and it's easy to settle in

00:12:04.120 to just kind of

00:12:05.000 middle-aged complacency.

00:12:07.920 Don't let go of that passion.

00:12:09.720 But if you ever want

00:12:12.480 to actually succeed

00:12:13.620 in persuading anyone,

00:12:16.200 understand how someone

00:12:17.580 of good conscience,

00:12:19.100 good morals,

00:12:20.460 would look at the issue

00:12:21.680 you care most passionately about,

00:12:24.560 and come to 180 degrees

00:12:26.220 the opposite conclusion.

00:12:27.800 Understand how your mother

00:12:29.240 could come to the opposite conclusion.

00:12:31.460 And that,

00:12:32.540 we don't do nearly enough of that.

00:12:34.940 We need to all try

00:12:35.920 to understand each other,

00:12:37.340 and then see where we're right,

00:12:38.760 and see where we're wrong.

00:12:39.380 Well, so in the spirit

00:12:40.860 of people moving into complacency

00:12:43.740 and squishiness and middle age,

00:12:45.900 and also to be honest

00:12:47.640 about censorship and free speech,

00:12:49.420 I want to make an admission

00:12:51.120 to the listeners of this show

00:12:53.240 about something

00:12:54.180 that we did last week, okay?

00:12:56.600 This is the first time

00:12:57.460 this has ever happened on the show.

00:12:59.320 Last Tuesday,

00:13:00.560 we filmed an episode

00:13:01.940 on this great news

00:13:03.760 that the Republicans in the Senate,

00:13:06.380 they were standing firm.

00:13:08.000 They were standing firm

00:13:10.060 on the debt ceiling.

00:13:11.640 They were taking

00:13:12.020 this principled stand.

00:13:13.520 We were so happy about this.

00:13:16.100 What happened 10 hours later?

00:13:18.380 Yeah, so this is,

00:13:19.900 so we film it Tuesday night.

00:13:22.760 And Tuesday night,

00:13:23.940 we're doing verdict,

00:13:24.900 and I got to confess,

00:13:25.940 I was kind of victory lapping.

00:13:27.260 I was like,

00:13:29.180 look, we're all used

00:13:30.140 to Republicans caving

00:13:31.440 and not standing up,

00:13:32.900 and right now,

00:13:33.820 I got to say,

00:13:34.780 Republicans are standing rock ribbed.

00:13:37.200 We're united.

00:13:38.320 We are all standing together

00:13:39.860 saying the Democrats

00:13:41.060 are going to raise

00:13:41.720 the debt ceiling on their own.

00:13:43.200 We're not going to help.

00:13:44.580 And so we did a whole chunk

00:13:45.800 of the podcast

00:13:46.660 victory lapping

00:13:47.820 at Tuesday night.

00:13:49.600 And then Wednesday,

00:13:50.640 I went to lunch,

00:13:51.240 and Mitch McConnell stood up

00:13:52.220 and said,

00:13:52.560 okay, so we're going

00:13:53.100 to surrender now.

00:13:55.880 Why?

00:13:56.860 Senator, why?

00:13:58.100 Well, so before I answer why,

00:14:00.700 I will say it forced us

00:14:02.260 to do something

00:14:02.920 we have never done

00:14:03.700 in the history of verdicts.

00:14:04.620 We've been filming verdict now

00:14:05.940 a year and a half,

00:14:06.940 almost two years.

00:14:07.680 Yep, coming up on two years.

00:14:09.340 And we had this whole segment

00:14:10.980 in verdict

00:14:11.460 that hadn't been released yet,

00:14:13.340 that as the news broke

00:14:14.440 that the Republicans were caving,

00:14:15.800 would have made no sense at all.

00:14:16.960 It would have been like,

00:14:17.820 all right, do these guys

00:14:18.560 not read the news?

00:14:19.400 Do they not know

00:14:19.960 what's happening?

00:14:20.960 So we're like,

00:14:21.380 all right, go to the editing room

00:14:22.480 and just edit that portion out

00:14:23.800 because we can't put out a podcast

00:14:25.700 that sounds like we live in a cave

00:14:27.540 and are like eating mushrooms

00:14:28.700 the whole time.

00:14:29.120 Republicans had a spine

00:14:30.300 10 hours prior.

00:14:31.960 They lost it.

00:14:32.900 They lost it.

00:14:33.620 So, Senator,

00:14:34.600 it seems that right now

00:14:35.960 on the economy,

00:14:37.580 Biden's numbers are terrible.

00:14:38.880 He's screwing everything up.

00:14:40.440 Inflation is through the roof.

00:14:41.500 People are quitting their jobs.

00:14:42.700 There's a labor shortage.

00:14:43.800 It's really, really bad.

00:14:45.140 They want to spend

00:14:45.860 a gazillion dollars

00:14:46.800 on a bunch of nonsense.

00:14:48.200 And Republicans had

00:14:48.960 this principled stand

00:14:49.980 and now they don't.

00:14:52.060 So we were holding the line

00:14:54.020 and the line for two months

00:14:55.960 that Republicans had held

00:14:57.360 is that we're not going

00:14:59.040 to participate

00:14:59.600 in raising the debt ceiling,

00:15:00.980 that the trillions in debt

00:15:02.200 that are being added

00:15:02.920 to the national debt

00:15:04.400 are coming from the Democrats.

00:15:06.160 They're passing it on their own.

00:15:07.400 They're using reconciliation.

00:15:09.000 They don't want Republican votes.

00:15:10.560 They're not interested

00:15:11.200 in compromise.

00:15:12.020 They're ramming it through.

00:15:13.020 And if they're going

00:15:13.820 to bankrupt the country,

00:15:14.740 they need to own it

00:15:15.660 and vote for the debt

00:15:16.940 that they're saddling

00:15:17.720 on future generations.

00:15:18.700 And we were united,

00:15:20.300 every one of us.

00:15:21.240 Mitch McConnell was saying that,

00:15:23.180 Mitt Romney, Susan Collins,

00:15:24.580 the entire conference,

00:15:25.920 all 50 of us were united.

00:15:28.180 What happened,

00:15:29.400 and listen,

00:15:30.200 Mitch got concerned

00:15:34.360 that the Democrats

00:15:37.900 were going to nuke

00:15:38.540 the filibuster.

00:15:40.140 He got scared

00:15:41.260 that Biden and Schumer

00:15:43.620 were going to get the votes

00:15:45.000 and actually end the filibuster.

00:15:46.920 And look,

00:15:47.700 if they end the filibuster,

00:15:49.320 the damage that will be done

00:15:50.680 to this country

00:15:51.360 is cataclysmic.

00:15:53.180 They'll pass S-1,

00:15:54.720 which is the federal

00:15:55.300 takeover of elections.

00:15:56.680 They'll pack the Supreme Court.

00:15:58.580 They'll make the District

00:15:59.420 of Columbia a state.

00:16:00.600 I mean,

00:16:00.780 it will be structural

00:16:02.040 and permanent.

00:16:03.140 So I agree

00:16:05.480 that if they end the filibuster,

00:16:07.220 the damage is massive.

00:16:09.180 I think, though,

00:16:10.940 that our leadership

00:16:12.040 made a mistake

00:16:12.880 in believing

00:16:13.860 they were going to get

00:16:14.480 the 50 votes to do that.

00:16:15.720 And so we gave in.

00:16:17.740 And we had some pretty

00:16:19.120 vigorous discussions

00:16:20.260 over the next two days

00:16:21.380 among the conference,

00:16:22.260 including a about

00:16:23.840 two-hour meeting

00:16:25.040 of all the Republicans

00:16:26.980 where basically

00:16:28.400 I was objecting

00:16:30.340 and standing up

00:16:31.120 and most of my colleagues

00:16:32.120 were saying,

00:16:32.580 all right, Ted,

00:16:33.400 why the hell

00:16:33.900 are you doing this?

00:16:35.300 And I stood there

00:16:37.240 pretty much on the hot seat

00:16:38.820 and said,

00:16:39.200 well, let me explain.

00:16:39.960 And I said,

00:16:40.380 look, my view of this

00:16:41.620 was the view

00:16:43.340 of all 50 of us

00:16:44.640 two days ago.

00:16:46.920 And I think

00:16:47.940 we should have held the line.

00:16:49.360 Unfortunately,

00:16:49.680 we didn't.

00:16:51.280 What happened instead

00:16:52.460 is that we kicked the can

00:16:53.740 down the road

00:16:54.320 to December.

00:16:55.000 And so we're going to have

00:16:55.560 this debt ceiling fight

00:16:56.520 again in December.

00:16:58.160 But I will say,

00:17:00.580 you know,

00:17:01.460 periodically there are

00:17:02.800 these moments,

00:17:04.680 Mike Lee calls it

00:17:05.840 putting in the hot box,

00:17:07.600 where they get mad

00:17:08.980 at conservatives

00:17:09.560 and they sit in a room

00:17:10.580 and basically yell at you

00:17:11.680 for a couple hours.

00:17:12.680 Who is they?

00:17:13.400 You mean the Democrats

00:17:14.020 or the Republican leadership?

00:17:14.660 No, no, no.

00:17:14.940 I mean Republicans.

00:17:15.780 Of course.

00:17:17.940 So first book I wrote

00:17:19.960 was a book called

00:17:20.600 A Time for Truth.

00:17:22.180 And the opening chapter

00:17:23.660 of it is called

00:17:25.460 Mendacity.

00:17:26.260 And it talks about

00:17:27.540 exactly this issue

00:17:28.900 in 2014,

00:17:30.720 the fight over

00:17:31.260 the debt ceiling

00:17:32.080 and the pandemonium

00:17:34.840 and bloody battles

00:17:36.740 that occurred

00:17:37.340 behind closed doors.

00:17:38.800 I will say,

00:17:40.100 the battles this time

00:17:41.220 were less bloody.

00:17:42.380 But it's still unfortunate

00:17:46.760 we couldn't hold the line.

00:17:48.280 Because the argument

00:17:50.420 from the Democrats here

00:17:51.540 is, look,

00:17:52.660 a nation has to

00:17:54.200 deal with its debt.

00:17:55.400 It's irresponsible

00:17:56.180 for the U.S.

00:17:56.860 to default on its debt.

00:17:57.960 Republicans are holding

00:17:58.720 this issue hostage.

00:17:59.800 Now I think we did a good job

00:18:00.880 of explaining on the podcast

00:18:01.940 why that isn't the case

00:18:03.900 and Democrats can do it

00:18:04.820 just with their own

00:18:05.520 50 votes plus a tiebreaker.

00:18:07.500 But they say,

00:18:09.220 look, this is a separate issue.

00:18:10.260 It has nothing to do

00:18:11.020 with the budget.

00:18:12.600 It has nothing to do

00:18:13.380 with the other aspects

00:18:14.260 of the economy.

00:18:15.320 But it does represent something.

00:18:17.940 I think it was Patrick Deneen,

00:18:19.760 who is a conservative writer,

00:18:21.580 who came out and he said,

00:18:23.180 there's something really wrong

00:18:24.060 about a society

00:18:24.980 that leaves as an inheritance

00:18:26.600 to its children

00:18:27.580 a lot of debt.

00:18:29.440 And it just keeps adding

00:18:30.300 on to that debt.

00:18:31.020 And there are national security

00:18:32.220 implications here.

00:18:33.300 And it could stifle

00:18:34.500 economic growth.

00:18:35.160 And so are we just never

00:18:36.600 going to deal with this issue?

00:18:37.720 We're just going to keep

00:18:38.340 going along and giving

00:18:39.180 in to the Democrats?

00:18:39.820 So it's interesting

00:18:40.860 what the Democrats are arguing,

00:18:42.140 they want to eliminate

00:18:42.760 the debt ceiling altogether.

00:18:44.140 So they want no limit

00:18:45.420 on how much they can borrow.

00:18:46.680 Or they're saying,

00:18:47.360 let's raise it to $50 trillion.

00:18:49.220 Let's raise it to a number

00:18:50.500 that at least right now

00:18:52.240 seems crazy high.

00:18:53.400 But given the way

00:18:54.140 we've gone up,

00:18:55.420 even that may not be

00:18:56.340 crazy high in time.

00:19:00.640 You know, the debt ceiling

00:19:01.940 historically has worked

00:19:03.840 to at least make

00:19:06.380 adding more debt

00:19:07.520 more painful.

00:19:08.680 So you have to think about it.

00:19:10.620 And it's been the most

00:19:11.760 effective lever

00:19:12.700 for meaningful spending reform.

00:19:14.400 So my view has never been

00:19:16.160 that we should never

00:19:18.160 raise the debt ceiling.

00:19:19.600 And the reason is simple.

00:19:21.300 About 40 percent,

00:19:22.580 and actually these numbers

00:19:23.360 are old,

00:19:23.840 but historically about 40 percent

00:19:25.200 of what we spend

00:19:25.980 is borrowed.

00:19:27.640 Unless you're prepared

00:19:28.860 to instantaneously...

00:19:29.680 You know what?

00:19:35.400 You know, it's interesting.

00:19:37.160 That classically encapsulates

00:19:38.960 the left.

00:19:39.560 So it's a young lady.

00:19:40.460 She came in

00:19:51.600 and she screamed,

00:19:52.840 let's go, Brandon.

00:19:54.000 Was that it?

00:19:54.860 That's...

00:19:55.260 You're right.

00:19:56.100 I couldn't quite make it out,

00:19:58.680 but you're right.

00:19:59.520 You're right.

00:20:00.020 And what I like even better

00:20:05.440 is that she said,

00:20:07.960 I don't know,

00:20:08.340 apparently I'm the ignorant ass.

00:20:11.520 I've been saying it for years.

00:20:12.480 You impressed her.

00:20:13.000 I don't know why

00:20:13.780 you're not as ignorant as I am,

00:20:14.860 but work on it.

00:20:16.120 But then she promptly,

00:20:17.680 with this frisson of courage,

00:20:19.660 oh, I yelled at him

00:20:21.260 and then runs out the door.

00:20:22.860 Yeah.

00:20:22.940 You know,

00:20:25.520 and we talked about

00:20:26.860 the left is terrified.

00:20:28.180 Look, we're going to have

00:20:28.800 open Q&A.

00:20:30.460 You know, if she wanted to,

00:20:31.480 if she actually had

00:20:32.220 a second sentence

00:20:33.240 beyond let's go, Brandon.

00:20:35.240 Yeah.

00:20:36.240 We could have had a conversation,

00:20:38.200 but that would have required

00:20:39.660 actual reason

00:20:41.200 and deductive thought.

00:20:42.660 And the left doesn't

00:20:43.620 want to do that.

00:20:44.340 Do you know what I think happened?

00:20:45.400 Obviously, I can't ask her this

00:20:46.660 because she ran out

00:20:47.340 of the room screaming,

00:20:48.420 but what I think happened is

00:20:49.940 she was waiting for us

00:20:51.860 to say something

00:20:52.960 really offensive.

00:20:54.020 You know, something

00:20:54.540 that the left says

00:20:56.140 that we say, you know,

00:20:56.900 I don't know,

00:20:57.220 something vicious, vile.

00:20:58.600 Don't give an example.

00:20:59.880 Yeah, I'm not going

00:21:00.520 to give an example.

00:21:01.480 Mmm, kittens are delicious.

00:21:05.600 And there's the

00:21:06.740 Media Matters clip.

00:21:07.620 And there it is right there.

00:21:08.740 We've got it.

00:21:09.960 So she was waiting for us

00:21:11.140 to say something

00:21:11.640 really outrageous

00:21:12.560 because I suspect

00:21:13.500 that woman has never

00:21:14.440 listened to a conservative speak

00:21:15.840 for more than a 30-second

00:21:17.340 sound by taking out of context.

00:21:19.280 And so she was waiting

00:21:19.940 and we didn't say anything

00:21:21.000 and we're actually just talking

00:21:22.380 about cutting government spending

00:21:24.220 and these sort of arcane

00:21:25.780 Senate procedures

00:21:26.820 of how to raise the debt ceiling.

00:21:28.500 And so she got impatient

00:21:29.920 and she probably didn't,

00:21:32.020 you know,

00:21:32.260 the synapses were kind of

00:21:33.880 frustrating and tiring.

00:21:35.420 And so she said,

00:21:36.200 all right, it's late.

00:21:37.000 You know, I got to go,

00:21:37.940 I got to go home

00:21:38.680 and watch Netflix or something.

00:21:39.980 And so she just screamed

00:21:41.120 this vicious,

00:21:42.440 I guess, vulgar language at us.

00:21:44.280 And then before we could respond,

00:21:46.320 she's gone.

00:21:47.020 And I can't say I miss her,

00:21:48.040 but I do wish that we could

00:21:49.080 have continued to educate her.

00:21:58.720 I don't know.

00:21:59.720 For a moment there,

00:22:00.500 it kind of felt like

00:22:01.180 the House of Representatives.

00:22:05.020 So maybe she'll watch

00:22:06.620 the stream online.

00:22:07.720 So I guess we should...

00:22:08.460 I'm confident of that.

00:22:09.020 I hope so.

00:22:09.800 Right now she is on her phone

00:22:11.580 listening with bated breath.

00:22:14.060 Because this issue,

00:22:16.060 I think, really does matter.

00:22:17.600 And while it might seem abstract

00:22:19.340 to be talking about the debt

00:22:20.720 and how that relates

00:22:21.540 to the economy at large

00:22:22.780 and the way our society

00:22:23.520 is going to work,

00:22:24.360 this is having real effects.

00:22:25.600 I mean, when we talk about

00:22:26.700 the economy more broadly,

00:22:28.100 right now we are looking

00:22:29.100 at inflation at a 13-year record high.

00:22:32.120 This means that the dollars

00:22:33.620 you are spending are worth less.

00:22:35.120 They're not going as far.

00:22:36.780 We're seeing now millions

00:22:38.440 and millions of people.

00:22:39.300 In the month of August,

00:22:40.600 4.3 million people

00:22:41.700 just quitting their jobs.

00:22:43.320 That seems kind of weird.

00:22:44.380 And actually, people

00:22:45.960 who wanted to be here tonight,

00:22:47.660 I've gotten messages about this

00:22:48.700 for people coming to the events.

00:22:50.720 Some people were not able

00:22:51.940 to make it because

00:22:53.620 flights are getting canceled.

00:22:55.220 Why are flights getting canceled?

00:22:56.920 Southwest Airlines

00:22:57.720 is blaming the weather.

00:22:58.700 It looks pretty sunny to me.

00:23:00.140 It's because of these issues

00:23:01.440 of mandates coming

00:23:02.680 from the federal government

00:23:03.620 wreaking havoc on the economy.

00:23:05.580 So in very dollars and cents terms,

00:23:08.900 what's the future

00:23:09.640 looking like for us?

00:23:10.760 Well, I got to say

00:23:11.480 what you just said there,

00:23:13.360 there is a massive concerted effort

00:23:15.400 by the White House

00:23:17.060 and by the corporate media

00:23:19.320 to silence what you just said there,

00:23:22.360 which is it is the orthodox line

00:23:26.040 that nobody is losing their job

00:23:29.460 because of vaccine mandates.

00:23:32.520 Look, I got to tell you,

00:23:34.020 a headline that I read

00:23:35.400 at a hearing last week,

00:23:36.600 the largest health provider

00:23:39.280 in New York fired 1,400 people.

00:23:42.140 They're firing doctors and nurses.

00:23:45.000 Mind you, in the middle of a pandemic,

00:23:46.580 we were saying for a year and a half,

00:23:48.320 doctors and nurses are heroes.

00:23:50.080 You're fired.

00:23:51.780 That was them.

00:23:53.100 A little bit incoherent.

00:23:54.300 I'll tell you,

00:23:55.420 I am hearing from all over the country,

00:23:58.660 from soldiers and sailors

00:24:00.140 and airmen and Marines.

00:24:01.980 I was in the Detroit airport

00:24:04.000 just a couple of weeks ago,

00:24:06.360 was stopped by a gentleman there

00:24:08.680 who said he was a Navy SEAL,

00:24:09.900 who had been in the SEALs 10 years.

00:24:12.220 And he said,

00:24:12.960 I'm resigning from the SEALs.

00:24:14.440 Yep.

00:24:15.460 And he said,

00:24:16.080 I'm not getting the vaccine.

00:24:17.400 And he said,

00:24:17.880 a bunch of guys who served with me

00:24:19.460 who've been in 15, 16, 17 years,

00:24:21.960 which for those in the military,

00:24:23.840 retirement's at 20.

00:24:25.300 He said,

00:24:25.720 they're getting ready to quit

00:24:26.780 after 15, 16, 17 years.

00:24:29.580 I am hearing over and over again.

00:24:33.020 So a week ago,

00:24:34.780 I did a Zoom call

00:24:36.480 with the leaders of many

00:24:38.000 of the big pilots unions,

00:24:39.660 of the airlines across the country.

00:24:42.080 Just about every pilots union said,

00:24:44.480 we are having pilots

00:24:45.660 who are going to be quitting

00:24:47.620 because they're not going to get a vaccine.

00:24:51.180 Chicago,

00:24:52.160 Chicago Police Union is saying,

00:24:54.760 this Friday,

00:24:55.600 so a week from now,

00:24:57.360 the Chicago PD is going to be

00:24:58.940 at 50% police capacity

00:25:01.280 because the police officers

00:25:04.320 are resisting this vaccine.

00:25:06.160 And the White House said,

00:25:07.720 none of this is happening.

00:25:08.820 They insist,

00:25:09.960 nope,

00:25:10.300 this is not happening.

00:25:11.260 And so you look at

00:25:12.160 what happened with Southwest.

00:25:13.980 And in the past week,

00:25:15.020 I've spoken with the CEO of Southwest,

00:25:17.020 Gary Kelly,

00:25:17.460 who I know very well.

00:25:18.320 He's a Texan.

00:25:19.160 He's a good friend.

00:25:20.260 I've spoken with the head

00:25:21.540 of the Southwest Pilots Union.

00:25:24.360 There's lots of disputes

00:25:25.820 about what happened.

00:25:26.700 Southwest canceled

00:25:27.520 1,000 flights one day,

00:25:29.840 canceled several hundred flights

00:25:31.400 on the days before and afterwards.

00:25:33.500 I can tell you one thing

00:25:35.140 that a very senior person

00:25:36.560 in the aviation sector told me.

00:25:38.800 They said on Friday,

00:25:40.080 October 8th,

00:25:41.940 at Jacksonville,

00:25:43.260 there was a sick-in

00:25:45.160 among air traffic controllers.

00:25:47.460 And at the Jacksonville

00:25:48.560 Air Traffic Control Facility,

00:25:50.000 33 air traffic controllers

00:25:52.460 were scheduled to come in.

00:25:54.420 That day,

00:25:55.380 three came in.

00:25:57.760 30 stayed home.

00:25:59.740 Now,

00:26:00.020 Jacksonville controls

00:26:01.320 a lot of the air traffic

00:26:02.580 going up and down

00:26:03.720 the eastern seaboard.

00:26:05.480 And Southwest

00:26:06.220 has an enormous percentage

00:26:08.180 of its flights

00:26:08.980 going through Florida.

00:26:11.540 And Southwest

00:26:12.180 is unique among the airlines.

00:26:13.640 So the other airlines

00:26:15.300 use the hub-and-spoke system.

00:26:16.740 So I live in Houston.

00:26:18.920 Houston's a hub for United.

00:26:21.280 So we get lots of United flights

00:26:23.180 that end up in Houston

00:26:24.620 or Chicago or other hubs.

00:26:26.480 Southwest doesn't have hubs,

00:26:27.540 so its planes are all over.

00:26:29.440 And what Southwest has said

00:26:30.940 is that when air traffic shut down,

00:26:33.680 the consequence of that

00:26:35.080 is it stranded

00:26:35.760 a bunch of its planes

00:26:36.720 and it stranded

00:26:37.300 a bunch of its pilots

00:26:38.280 and it stranded

00:26:39.080 a bunch of its crews.

00:26:40.620 Now,

00:26:40.900 what's interesting

00:26:41.740 is the Biden White House

00:26:44.300 refuses to answer the question.

00:26:46.240 And it's a very simple,

00:26:47.320 factual question.

00:26:48.800 Is it true

00:26:49.500 or is it false

00:26:51.440 that on Friday,

00:26:53.400 October 8th,

00:26:54.380 there was a sick-in

00:26:55.420 at the Jacksonville

00:26:57.600 Air Traffic Control Facility

00:26:59.200 where the vast majority

00:27:00.980 of the controllers

00:27:01.620 stayed home

00:27:02.440 because of the vaccine mandate.

00:27:05.660 And the reason

00:27:06.120 they don't want to answer it

00:27:07.180 based on what sources

00:27:08.920 are telling me in aviation

00:27:10.140 is because that is absolutely true.

00:27:12.080 Right.

00:27:12.280 And on these mandates,

00:27:13.960 which are really on

00:27:14.840 a lot of people's minds,

00:27:15.680 not just for the economy,

00:27:17.740 but because they want

00:27:18.780 to have some control

00:27:19.540 over their own

00:27:20.040 medical decisions,

00:27:21.660 there is the issue

00:27:22.540 of the federal government

00:27:23.360 saying federal employees

00:27:24.400 need to get the vaccine.

00:27:26.360 So that is a direct mandate.

00:27:28.240 And then there is

00:27:28.940 the bizarre Byzantine

00:27:31.540 sort of mandate

00:27:32.240 where Biden instructs

00:27:33.480 the Occupational Safety

00:27:34.480 and Health Administration

00:27:35.440 to instruct companies

00:27:37.460 with more than 100 employees

00:27:39.000 to instruct their employees

00:27:40.620 to get the vaccine

00:27:41.260 or there will be fines,

00:27:42.180 but we don't even really know

00:27:43.220 how that will be implemented.

00:27:44.180 So it's more a threat

00:27:45.960 than an actual order.

00:27:47.840 And so some companies

00:27:49.040 are going along with this.

00:27:50.420 Some companies,

00:27:51.040 like my company,

00:27:51.740 The Daily Wire,

00:27:52.300 is not going along with this.

00:27:54.040 And so in a way there,

00:27:56.540 you can blame Biden

00:27:58.180 because Biden was the one

00:27:59.620 who started it all.

00:28:01.120 But some companies

00:28:02.000 could just stand up

00:28:02.980 and say,

00:28:03.340 no, we're not going to do this.

00:28:04.660 You're right.

00:28:05.140 And look,

00:28:05.560 there's a spectrum

00:28:06.360 of orders coming

00:28:08.000 from the White House.

00:28:09.640 Now, listen,

00:28:10.100 my view on vaccines,

00:28:11.080 real quick,

00:28:11.520 as an aside,

00:28:12.240 I'm pro-vaccine.

00:28:13.680 I've been vaccinated.

00:28:14.540 My family's been vaccinated.

00:28:15.840 I think it is an amazing

00:28:17.160 technological accomplishment

00:28:19.300 that Operation Warp Speed

00:28:20.940 produced multiple vaccines

00:28:22.960 in record time,

00:28:24.520 cutting through massive paperwork.

00:28:25.960 So I think that's fantastic.

00:28:27.600 And I was glad

00:28:29.240 to take the vaccine

00:28:30.200 because I wanted

00:28:30.840 to get back out

00:28:31.640 and around

00:28:32.100 and with people.

00:28:33.260 And I was tired

00:28:34.100 of the damn lockdowns

00:28:35.380 that these numbskull politicians

00:28:36.640 were putting in place.

00:28:38.680 But I also believe

00:28:39.880 in individual liberty,

00:28:41.020 individual responsibility.

00:28:42.460 Look, everyone here

00:28:43.300 are adults.

00:28:45.020 You have the right

00:28:45.680 to make your own choice

00:28:46.940 about what health care

00:28:47.880 you're going to get.

00:28:48.740 You have the right

00:28:49.460 to make your own choice

00:28:50.400 talking to your doctor.

00:28:51.460 If you want to get the vaccine,

00:28:52.780 God bless you.

00:28:53.760 Make that decision.

00:28:54.720 If you don't,

00:28:55.340 that's your right too.

00:28:56.380 You know, though,

00:28:56.820 to play devil's advocate,

00:28:57.820 Senator,

00:28:58.500 that lady who ran out

00:28:59.480 of here screaming,

00:29:00.280 I'm not sure that she can

00:29:01.400 make her own decisions.

00:29:02.340 I don't know.

00:29:03.100 There are a lot of people

00:29:03.840 who you need some maturity

00:29:05.500 to be able to.

00:29:06.200 I don't know.

00:29:06.500 I will say

00:29:11.900 the problem with liberals

00:29:13.060 is their masks

00:29:14.360 aren't tight enough.

00:29:15.620 That's right.

00:29:16.320 We need to add a few more.

00:29:17.560 You know,

00:29:17.900 we do have a lot of mature,

00:29:19.140 serious people

00:29:19.720 in this audience.

00:29:20.660 We want to hear from them.

00:29:21.720 We want to answer

00:29:22.320 their questions.

00:29:23.200 So would you mind,

00:29:24.300 can we take some questions

00:29:25.080 from the audience?

00:29:25.680 Would that be all right?

00:29:26.440 Can we bring our friend

00:29:27.320 Liz Wheeler back out?

00:29:28.360 All right.

00:29:34.480 We've got a lot of people here

00:29:36.860 lining up to ask these questions.

00:29:39.540 We, I hope,

00:29:40.260 have some answers for them.

00:29:41.660 This is our absolute favorite

00:29:43.320 part of the show.

00:29:44.600 Be sure,

00:29:45.240 if you have not already,

00:29:46.260 go subscribe

00:29:47.040 to the Verdict Podcast

00:29:48.240 on Apple Podcasts,

00:29:49.260 Spotify, Stitcher,

00:29:50.000 Google Play,

00:29:50.700 wherever you get

00:29:51.720 your podcasts.

00:29:53.320 So, Michael,

00:29:55.620 while we're waiting

00:29:56.140 for everything

00:29:56.620 to get set up,

00:29:58.160 I'm going to ask,

00:29:59.020 is it going to be

00:29:59.660 like Mailbag

00:30:00.500 on the podcast typically

00:30:01.840 where you get a question

00:30:03.760 from someone,

00:30:04.700 Giuseppe,

00:30:06.060 who asks,

00:30:06.820 how come Michael

00:30:07.640 is so handsome

00:30:08.580 and so wise?

00:30:09.660 Well, you know,

00:30:10.500 look,

00:30:10.860 I think some of those people

00:30:11.700 ask very good questions.

00:30:12.620 So I hope that we get

00:30:14.080 them here tonight.

00:30:15.800 I, uh,

00:30:16.540 if you see me

00:30:17.440 putting on a fake mustache

00:30:18.440 and running behind,

00:30:19.320 maybe that,

00:30:19.680 that would explain

00:30:20.260 how it happens.

00:30:21.560 We have our friend

00:30:22.220 Liz Wheeler here.

00:30:22.900 Let's bring her out

00:30:23.840 and let's take some questions.

00:30:28.220 Well, that was a great show.

00:30:29.840 This is a great show.

00:30:31.520 I was entertained.

00:30:32.920 Thank you.

00:30:33.600 You laughed.

00:30:34.340 You cried.

00:30:35.220 We're going to get,

00:30:35.760 as a lot of people did.

00:30:36.860 So we're about to get

00:30:38.560 these questions.

00:30:39.680 But, uh, first,

00:30:41.480 Liz,

00:30:41.800 what are you holding

00:30:42.260 in your hand?

00:30:42.800 I, I, I do have a question.

00:30:44.260 I'd like to actually

00:30:44.820 be the one to start off

00:30:46.020 the questions,

00:30:46.580 if that's all right.

00:30:47.800 And my question to you is,

00:30:49.060 um, if you see right here,

00:30:50.600 we have this hat

00:30:51.520 and it is adorned

00:30:52.560 with a lovely cactus.

00:30:54.780 I don't get the joke.

00:30:56.240 Could you please

00:30:56.840 explain that to us?

00:30:58.540 Liz, do you,

00:30:59.260 you don't know about

00:31:00.040 the, the third co-host

00:31:01.360 of this podcast,

00:31:02.340 our trusty sidekick,

00:31:03.320 the cactus?

00:31:04.500 Do you not?

00:31:05.440 It's the real truth cactus.

00:31:06.920 And I gotta say,

00:31:07.560 I was complaining

00:31:08.140 to Michael today

00:31:09.020 as we've got now

00:31:09.940 these fancy metal cacti.

00:31:11.940 and, and, and, and I said,

00:31:13.800 you know what?

00:31:14.960 I, I, I really am offended

00:31:17.020 to be upstaged

00:31:18.840 by a cactus.

00:31:19.640 I know, I know.

00:31:20.800 It's, uh, that,

00:31:21.740 it was unfortunate.

00:31:23.340 You know, it,

00:31:24.300 very humbling, I think.

00:31:26.120 Senator, you came out

00:31:27.860 really strong.

00:31:28.860 Your first podcast,

00:31:30.240 it hits number one

00:31:31.340 within a couple of weeks.

00:31:32.760 And, uh, so we just

00:31:33.620 want to keep you humble

00:31:34.360 and that's why it seems

00:31:35.540 that all of this merchandise

00:31:36.440 has the cactus on it.

00:31:38.620 I mean, I don't want

00:31:39.200 to hurt y'all's feelings,

00:31:40.040 but it's not your face

00:31:40.940 on this hat.

00:31:41.780 No, it's not.

00:31:42.600 Well, that's why

00:31:43.380 people wear it.

00:31:44.220 That's right.

00:31:45.720 So, I, I'm very excited

00:31:47.140 to announce tonight,

00:31:48.620 um, that you can acquire

00:31:50.120 one of these hats

00:31:51.140 and not just one.

00:31:52.600 If you go to

00:31:53.200 verdictwithtedcruise.com

00:31:54.860 slash shop

00:31:56.220 and you use that promo code

00:31:57.380 that I talked to you

00:31:57.860 about before,

00:31:58.640 live, you can get

00:31:59.460 10% off, um,

00:32:01.400 all kinds of crazy

00:32:02.220 cactus gear.

00:32:03.320 All kinds of crazy.

00:32:04.080 In fact, um,

00:32:05.080 I don't really want

00:32:05.760 to hold this

00:32:06.220 for the rest of the show.

00:32:07.080 Does anybody,

00:32:07.840 does anybody want this?

00:32:08.740 Can we, can we hear?

00:32:10.040 Anybody want this

00:32:10.680 cactus hat?

00:32:12.200 Okay, I'm not

00:32:12.980 throwing it, so.

00:32:17.580 Okay, okay.

00:32:20.080 If you can hand it

00:32:21.000 up to him.

00:32:25.080 You know what they say,

00:32:26.860 enthusiasm wins

00:32:28.180 every time.

00:32:30.180 Enthusiasm wins

00:32:30.780 every time.

00:32:31.200 All right.

00:32:31.760 Are we ready

00:32:32.400 for some live Q&A?

00:32:33.260 All right.

00:32:33.320 Are we ready for some

00:32:34.740 live Q&A?

00:32:35.200 All right.

00:32:35.320 All right.

00:32:39.420 The first thing

00:32:39.800 you're going to do

00:32:40.120 is introduce yourself.

00:32:41.700 Uh, my name

00:32:42.520 is Will Terry.

00:32:43.680 I'm from

00:32:44.600 Kakauna, Wisconsin.

00:32:45.940 Moved down to

00:32:46.780 Madison to work

00:32:47.760 at the state

00:32:48.280 legislature.

00:32:49.520 Um, highly

00:32:50.720 revere you

00:32:51.500 ever since your

00:32:52.220 2016 campaign.

00:32:54.020 While I certainly

00:32:55.520 can't agree with

00:32:56.500 every single thing

00:32:57.440 that you advocate for,

00:32:58.780 but I appreciate

00:33:00.360 the opportunity

00:33:01.100 to have this

00:33:02.160 question.

00:33:03.180 Uh, so native-born

00:33:05.300 American fertility

00:33:06.220 rates have been

00:33:07.360 below replacement

00:33:08.980 for nearly half a

00:33:10.660 century, so much

00:33:12.360 so that the number

00:33:13.180 of babies born

00:33:13.980 to black women

00:33:14.740 have been trending

00:33:15.680 down for two

00:33:16.360 decades, and the

00:33:17.940 American white

00:33:18.700 population has

00:33:19.700 declined three

00:33:20.680 million people

00:33:22.200 since this last

00:33:23.240 consensus.

00:33:24.540 Uh, what plan,

00:33:26.560 if any, does a

00:33:28.760 Republican in either

00:33:29.960 chamber have to

00:33:31.760 create a sustainable

00:33:33.020 fertility rate in

00:33:34.620 America?

00:33:36.460 Wow.

00:33:46.060 So that's a very

00:33:47.280 good question, and

00:33:48.320 it's a detailed and

00:33:49.480 complex question.

00:33:50.680 Um, and, and I'd

00:33:51.660 say several things.

00:33:52.560 First of all, with

00:33:53.320 what the gentleman

00:33:54.460 called out, we've

00:33:55.240 had over 60 million

00:33:56.420 children whose lives

00:33:57.420 have been taken in

00:33:58.120 abortion, and this

00:33:58.980 would be a, a much

00:34:00.560 richer, a much more

00:34:02.220 varied, a much more

00:34:03.220 diverse country, uh,

00:34:05.280 had, had those

00:34:06.040 children had the

00:34:06.680 chance to live, and

00:34:07.460 had we, we reaped the

00:34:08.800 benefits of their

00:34:09.620 lives.

00:34:10.800 Um, I'd also say more

00:34:13.100 broadly, some of it is

00:34:15.320 the consequence of

00:34:16.180 prosperity, that, that,

00:34:17.620 that you see with

00:34:18.640 prosperity.

00:34:19.260 You look at an

00:34:19.880 agrarian society, where,

00:34:21.360 where if you were on

00:34:22.580 the farm, you needed

00:34:24.280 kids because you needed

00:34:25.220 farmhands.

00:34:25.820 You needed people to

00:34:26.660 work, work on the

00:34:27.460 farm, and, and kids

00:34:29.420 were an engine of

00:34:30.480 production.

00:34:30.920 And as we've gotten

00:34:31.700 more prosperous, people

00:34:32.840 are, are not looking,

00:34:34.340 looking for their kids

00:34:35.300 necessarily to, to, uh,

00:34:37.800 drive the plow.

00:34:39.340 Um, there is also a

00:34:42.060 difference, I think,

00:34:42.900 between left and right,

00:34:43.820 uh, in terms of our

00:34:46.080 children, our additional

00:34:47.760 kids, a good or bad

00:34:49.900 thing.

00:34:50.320 You know, you look at the

00:34:51.020 Malthusian hypothesis,

00:34:52.840 that, that there are too

00:34:53.860 many people on planet

00:34:54.860 earth, that, that, that

00:34:55.680 every child being born is

00:34:57.080 a bad thing.

00:34:58.320 Um, I think that is

00:34:59.880 terrible and false, and I

00:35:01.400 think every child is, is

00:35:04.600 magnificent, is an

00:35:06.520 opportunity, is a benefit,

00:35:08.020 is productive, and, and

00:35:09.520 there is a difference

00:35:10.260 between left and right.

00:35:11.420 So, is it government's job

00:35:13.920 to say, you silly people

00:35:16.380 aren't having enough

00:35:17.060 babies?

00:35:17.640 No.

00:35:18.120 I don't think it's

00:35:18.860 government's job to say

00:35:19.860 that.

00:35:20.140 It's up to you, uh, to

00:35:21.960 make that decision in your

00:35:23.300 life, um, but I do think

00:35:26.120 we ought to have, number

00:35:27.220 one, policies from the

00:35:29.540 government that are

00:35:30.420 conducive to families.

00:35:31.760 So, for example, the

00:35:33.400 marriage penalty is a

00:35:34.640 terrible thing in the tax

00:35:35.620 law.

00:35:35.860 It shouldn't be the case

00:35:36.960 that, that, that if a

00:35:38.240 man and woman get married,

00:35:39.580 their tax rate goes up,

00:35:40.840 and, and the government

00:35:42.100 is disincentivizing their

00:35:43.800 forming a family.

00:35:45.280 Um, I think we ought to

00:35:46.520 have an environment where,

00:35:47.880 where, where kids are,

00:35:49.120 are celebrated and

00:35:50.540 welcomed, and also part

00:35:53.180 of that is where kids

00:35:54.400 can have a chance to get

00:35:55.420 an education through,

00:35:56.540 like, through school

00:35:57.400 choice, where, where

00:35:58.360 even regardless of their

00:36:00.220 economic circumstances,

00:36:01.360 they can have an

00:36:02.060 opportunity to prosper.

00:36:03.840 But you are right that,

00:36:05.260 that, that, that without

00:36:07.200 kids, any society, uh, has

00:36:10.540 no future.

00:36:11.060 And, and, you know,

00:36:11.700 you're, you're so right,

00:36:12.740 Senator, to, to mention

00:36:14.000 this Malthusian delusion

00:36:15.840 on the left, this idea

00:36:16.840 that people are a scourge,

00:36:18.700 and we've got, we're, we're

00:36:19.740 all going to die from

00:36:20.800 overpopulation.

00:36:21.460 There was a book came

00:36:22.160 out in 1970 by Paul

00:36:23.940 Ehrlich, a still admired

00:36:26.020 in some corners, and

00:36:27.260 still honored scientist

00:36:28.840 that was just completely

00:36:30.200 bogus, and it was called

00:36:31.260 The Population Bomb.

00:36:32.600 It said that within a

00:36:33.820 decade or two, there were

00:36:35.140 going to be famines, it

00:36:36.160 was inevitable, you would

00:36:37.300 need more abortion, more

00:36:38.340 contraception, and if

00:36:39.500 people wouldn't do it

00:36:40.140 voluntarily, you had to

00:36:41.120 force it.

00:36:41.740 And actually, a lot of

00:36:42.540 this work was used in,

00:36:43.660 in countries that did

00:36:44.580 this, India, and notably

00:36:46.000 in China, and it was

00:36:47.540 completely false.

00:36:48.460 Since that time, the world

00:36:49.760 population has doubled.

00:36:51.160 We are fatter than ever.

00:36:52.740 Malnutrition is at an all-time

00:36:54.260 low.

00:36:54.800 And so I, I think your

00:36:55.880 answer is totally right,

00:36:57.000 Senator.

00:36:57.460 The gentleman's answer was

00:36:58.520 totally right on abortion,

00:37:00.020 and it's a very serious

00:37:01.300 issue.

00:37:02.060 By the way, even beyond the

00:37:03.340 issue of birth rates, you

00:37:04.620 mentioned the black birth

00:37:06.060 rate.

00:37:06.360 Well, a statistic came out a

00:37:07.600 few years ago in New York.

00:37:08.820 More black babies were

00:37:09.840 aborted than were born.

00:37:11.580 I mean, that's a terrifying

00:37:12.540 statistic.

00:37:13.580 Or, and you mentioned the

00:37:14.680 other birth rates as well,

00:37:15.900 but it's beyond that.

00:37:17.120 Think about how the

00:37:18.080 average life expectancy

00:37:19.720 has actually declined in

00:37:21.380 recent years.

00:37:22.660 Also because of deaths of

00:37:24.080 despair.

00:37:24.620 I mean, that, that is a big

00:37:25.600 national problem.

00:37:26.600 I think, as, as everyone

00:37:28.380 has said, it's really

00:37:29.760 important to focus on that

00:37:31.060 because if, if we want to

00:37:33.000 have a strong, prosperous

00:37:34.440 future, we need to have a

00:37:36.240 country.

00:37:36.680 We need to have people,

00:37:37.460 and we need to have people

00:37:38.080 who are excited about

00:37:39.340 growing that country.

00:37:40.420 Well, and let me make two

00:37:41.180 additional points.

00:37:41.920 This is a good question, and

00:37:42.840 we're, we should get our

00:37:44.240 answers shorter than this,

00:37:45.260 but, uh, we will, we'll

00:37:46.920 do a speed round for the

00:37:48.040 20, 30 people.

00:37:49.800 You shouldn't come to a

00:37:50.680 gathering of a radio host

00:37:51.740 and a lawyer and politician

00:37:52.780 and expect short answers.

00:37:53.860 Um, but, but two more

00:37:56.420 observations.

00:37:57.060 You were talking about,

00:37:58.380 about, um, African

00:38:00.780 American fertility rates.

00:38:02.900 You know, some of the most

00:38:04.140 horrifying things to read

00:38:05.700 are, are the writings of

00:38:07.180 Margaret Sanger, who was

00:38:08.300 the founder of Planned

00:38:09.160 Parenthood and, and was a,

00:38:10.920 uh, unrepentant eugenicist

00:38:13.620 activist and, and wrote horrible

00:38:15.180 things advocating for

00:38:16.620 widespread abortion precisely

00:38:18.800 because she wanted to see

00:38:19.920 more African American

00:38:20.960 children aborted.

00:38:21.860 And, and it's, it's, it is a

00:38:24.000 horrifying history behind the

00:38:26.940 aggressive push for locating

00:38:30.080 abortion clinics in, in

00:38:32.080 communities where I'm not

00:38:33.780 going to use the term she used

00:38:35.180 to describe those children,

00:38:36.420 but, but they were horrific

00:38:37.540 and evil, um, those terms that

00:38:39.620 she used.

00:38:40.180 And what I'd say also than

00:38:42.280 that, you, you know, Michael

00:38:43.360 used the word inevitable and,

00:38:45.520 and it reminded me of one of

00:38:47.460 the podcasts that caused the

00:38:48.860 biggest stir is, is you and I

00:38:51.220 like to mess around in pop

00:38:52.480 culture.

00:38:53.180 And, and we pointed out how

00:38:55.680 when, when Hollywood does

00:38:58.960 environmentalists, whether,

00:39:00.960 whether in, in the Watchmen, uh,

00:39:04.500 or in Avengers Endgame, that, that,

00:39:07.620 that environmentalists are the,

00:39:09.120 these Malthusian psychopaths and

00:39:13.120 you take Thanos, so, and by the

00:39:15.120 way, people flipped out.

00:39:16.020 Is it Thanos, Thanos?

00:39:17.220 I don't know, whatever.

00:39:17.900 It's the, the big guy, uh, with,

00:39:20.160 with the giant sword, but, but

00:39:22.260 you look at his whole hypothesis,

00:39:24.160 which was the Malthusian

00:39:25.340 hypothesis.

00:39:25.980 There are too many people.

00:39:27.000 They're consuming our resources.

00:39:28.620 Therefore, I'm going to snap and

00:39:30.440 murder half of the living beings

00:39:32.120 on planet earth.

00:39:32.940 That is the radical left view of

00:39:36.540 people and, and online, the, the

00:39:40.800 sort of Hollywood world freaked out

00:39:42.800 that we pointed out how absurd this,

00:39:47.680 this anti-human life view of the

00:39:50.780 radical left was.

00:39:51.780 Yeah.

00:39:52.280 Yeah.

00:39:52.600 Really, really excellent point.

00:39:54.140 Yeah.

00:39:54.300 Thank you.

00:39:54.540 Thank you so much.

00:40:01.860 And I don't know about you guys, but

00:40:03.060 the way that I heard that answer was

00:40:04.460 Michael, as the good Catholic man that

00:40:05.820 he is, should continue to be fruitful

00:40:07.140 and multiply.

00:40:07.860 So that's how I, that's how I heard it.

00:40:09.920 Um, Michael, let's try to keep these

00:40:11.240 answers as succinct as possible so

00:40:12.880 that we can get as many questions in

00:40:14.680 as we possibly can.

00:40:15.660 Do you want to introduce yourself?

00:40:16.400 This will be a speed round.

00:40:17.440 Um, hello, I'm Samantha Givich.

00:40:19.220 I'm a student at UW-Madison.

00:40:20.820 I'm a freshman studying political science

00:40:22.540 and minoring in public policy.

00:40:24.980 Um, my question here today is,

00:40:26.820 I'm going to keep it to the content

00:40:27.920 that you had in the podcast,

00:40:29.860 is much of your message today

00:40:32.800 was about the other side.

00:40:34.380 I am personally democratic leaning

00:40:37.140 and, um, how they're doing everything

00:40:40.460 wrong, how they're yelling at you,

00:40:42.560 how that girl ran out, obviously

00:40:44.520 speaking vulgar language, which I

00:40:46.440 don't agree with.

00:40:47.200 I think it's much more productive

00:40:48.720 to speak this way.

00:40:50.080 But at the same time, and not to

00:40:51.660 insult you, um, you came out saying

00:40:53.740 like, these idio, um, idiots are

00:40:58.860 making us wear these masks, like,

00:41:00.800 all these things, and shouting out

00:41:02.340 insults and, um, compromising the

00:41:05.520 integrity of the university.

00:41:07.560 And I just want, I think my question

00:41:10.180 is more broad about your party in

00:41:11.760 general, because that's why we're

00:41:13.540 here, um, is, do you, are you

00:41:16.500 willing, if you, is your message so

00:41:18.240 important, are you willing to

00:41:19.240 compromise, like, wear these face

00:41:21.180 diapers in order to put this

00:41:24.020 message out that you think is so

00:41:25.020 important so more people are

00:41:26.120 accessible, so it's more accessible

00:41:27.760 to more people?

00:41:28.940 Or are you, is your message solely

00:41:30.860 to oppose the other side and keep it

00:41:32.740 to the people that agree with you?

00:41:34.580 Good question.

00:41:35.360 So, Samantha, that's a very good

00:41:36.440 question.

00:41:36.980 Let me start by just thanking you

00:41:38.440 for being here.

00:41:45.880 Look, thank you for having an open

00:41:48.080 mind and coming, even though you,

00:41:49.640 you, you said your, your political

00:41:51.380 leanings are different than ours.

00:41:52.580 I appreciate it.

00:41:53.100 I think we need to be having more of

00:41:54.360 a conversation.

00:41:55.160 We ought to be, one of the problems

00:41:57.440 today is the two sides live in, like,

00:42:01.040 parallel worlds.

00:42:02.260 And, and the right wing listens to

00:42:05.220 right wing media.

00:42:05.900 The left wings listens to left wing

00:42:07.420 media.

00:42:07.740 We don't talk to each other.

00:42:08.860 We don't have shared facts.

00:42:10.260 And we believe these caricatures of

00:42:12.600 each other that, that are horrible

00:42:13.840 and they're horrible on both sides.

00:42:16.120 Um, the way I try to handle that

00:42:19.020 is, you know, I try not to get nasty

00:42:23.780 and personal and go after the

00:42:25.760 character of people who disagree with

00:42:27.300 me.

00:42:27.480 Now, I'll disagree with them on

00:42:29.200 substance and, and listen, I'll try

00:42:31.900 to have some fun with it.

00:42:32.960 And, and, and, and to, to make a joke

00:42:35.800 is I think different than going

00:42:38.500 straight, straight to and saying

00:42:40.020 they're horrible, evil people.

00:42:41.280 I try on criticism to keep it

00:42:43.640 lighthearted.

00:42:44.760 On the question of compromise.

00:42:46.560 Yes.

00:42:46.800 Look, I, I think we absolutely

00:42:48.140 should look for middle grounds.

00:42:49.360 You, you ask about wearing masks.

00:42:50.980 To be honest, I'm embarrassed to say

00:42:52.580 I've got two masks in my pocket.

00:42:53.980 I've got a Texas flag mask, which is

00:42:56.500 awesome.

00:42:57.060 And, uh, you know, I might just wear

00:42:59.680 that for the fun of it.

00:43:01.000 And, and, and then I have a Houston

00:43:03.500 Rockets mask, which shows that I'm

00:43:05.360 really believe in lost causes, but

00:43:07.020 I'm a diehard, diehard Rockets fan.

00:43:11.060 Um, you know, I flew up, flew up from

00:43:13.340 Houston today.

00:43:14.100 I wore a mask.

00:43:15.320 You know, my view on let's take

00:43:17.180 COVID as an example.

00:43:19.220 Um, I think there were extremes on

00:43:21.880 COVID on both sides that didn't make

00:43:23.780 any sense.

00:43:25.040 So there were people who would never

00:43:27.060 wear a mask, never wear a vaccine.

00:43:29.060 And personally, I don't agree with

00:43:30.640 that.

00:43:30.860 I particularly at the height of the

00:43:32.920 pandemic, you know, it made some

00:43:35.200 sense to wear a mask.

00:43:36.240 I wasn't sure how effective it was or

00:43:37.560 not, but a year ago I was willing to

00:43:41.680 wear a mask and it made some sense.

00:43:43.080 Now I've been vaccinated and it seems

00:43:45.840 to me a little bit bizarre after you've

00:43:47.420 been vaccinated saying everyone has to

00:43:48.960 wear a mask and pretend the vaccine

00:43:50.440 doesn't work.

00:43:51.100 That, that, that logic and science

00:43:54.040 doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

00:43:56.360 Um, I think we should be willing to

00:43:59.520 find reasonable common grounds.

00:44:02.600 I think in COVID, for example, the

00:44:04.920 politicians who shut down millions of

00:44:09.120 small businesses, shut down restaurants,

00:44:11.840 shut down bars, shut down gyms, shut

00:44:13.860 down stores and destroyed them.

00:44:17.060 And, and, you know, people, if you have,

00:44:19.600 you know, in Texas, you'll have a family

00:44:21.380 that say a second or third generation

00:44:23.260 restaurant owner who their entire

00:44:25.440 family's life work was destroyed.

00:44:28.560 Um, you have politicians who shut down

00:44:30.480 schools for a year that hurt a lot of

00:44:33.460 kids.

00:44:33.840 I don't think that made sense.

00:44:35.480 In my view, we should do reasonable

00:44:37.760 common sense steps to limit the spread

00:44:40.580 of the disease.

00:44:41.260 COVID is a serious disease, particularly

00:44:43.180 if you're elderly, particularly if you

00:44:45.660 have serious health issues, it can be

00:44:48.040 fatal.

00:44:48.360 And so I think we should treat it

00:44:49.740 seriously, but I absolutely agree.

00:44:52.480 We ought to find reasonable common

00:44:54.400 ground.

00:44:54.880 I think most people want to keep their

00:44:57.240 families safe from disease, but they

00:44:59.020 also want to be able to go to work and

00:45:00.540 provide for their kids and they'd like

00:45:02.280 their kids to go, go to school.

00:45:03.640 And I think most Americans are

00:45:06.440 interested in that common ground.

00:45:08.260 The political world is so polarized and

00:45:11.080 the media world is so polarized.

00:45:12.620 We don't have those conversations very

00:45:14.840 often.

00:45:17.140 That was a good answer.

00:45:18.460 I have nothing more to add to that.

00:45:20.580 No live owning or anything like that.

00:45:22.580 It was really, yeah, really, really good

00:45:23.660 question.

00:45:24.180 And thank you for coming.

00:45:25.200 I really appreciate it.

00:45:26.180 Hi, guys.

00:45:35.060 How are you doing?

00:45:35.500 My name's Theo.

00:45:36.640 I'm from Madison, Wisconsin.

00:45:38.480 I work in the Madison State Capitol or

00:45:40.840 Wisconsin State Capitol.

00:45:42.240 Ironically, the first question asker is

00:45:44.620 actually my boss.

00:45:45.600 I'm his intern.

00:45:46.280 So my question is…

00:45:48.120 So don't criticize his question.

00:45:50.080 Actually, ironically, it kind of is

00:45:51.980 building off of his question on birth

00:45:54.780 rates and whatnot.

00:45:55.820 So as we all know…

00:45:57.400 That's some good brown nosing.

00:46:00.100 You've got a bright future.

00:46:01.140 I promise.

00:46:01.700 It's not planned.

00:46:02.840 It's not planned.

00:46:03.580 I didn't even know there was going to be

00:46:04.560 questions.

00:46:05.360 So as we all know, the immigration

00:46:08.940 policies of the Biden administration have

00:46:11.600 changed drastically from the administration

00:46:14.200 previously.

00:46:14.840 And with the Haitian migrant caravan that

00:46:19.080 transpired, I don't know, a week or two

00:46:20.780 weeks ago, I'm not sure, popular conservative

00:46:24.620 pundits like Charlie Kirk and Tucker Carlson

00:46:27.740 have been theorizing something that people like

00:46:31.480 Patrick Buchanan or Jared Taylor, who runs

00:46:33.940 American Renaissance, have said in the past, which

00:46:36.540 is replacement theory or demographic replacement.

00:46:40.440 So I kind of wanted to know what your guys' thoughts

00:46:43.900 were on the validity of that and how that is becoming

00:46:46.900 mainstream and whether you think that it's the mass

00:46:51.880 immigration of the Democratic Party is solely for electoral

00:46:55.680 reasons or if it is to change the demographics of America and

00:47:00.920 to displace the white majority of America.

00:47:03.060 Well, I think if you're asking the question, do Democrats play racial

00:47:08.040 identity politics and say that straight white guys are the worst

00:47:11.940 people in the history of the world, I don't think they would even

00:47:15.060 disagree with that.

00:47:15.800 They put that sort of thing in the New York Times.

00:47:18.820 But I think the question is probably a little broader than that, right?

00:47:22.440 It would seem to me, and Senator, you work with these elected Democrats

00:47:26.940 more closely.

00:47:28.300 You see them more up close.

00:47:29.980 But it seems to me quite clear that what they want to do is win elections.

00:47:35.440 And so whatever the ethnic or racial or sexual or geographic or whatever

00:47:40.420 they're going to do, and by the way, that's just focusing on one aspect of the

00:47:44.300 immigration issue.

00:47:44.980 But there are obviously many other strategies that they're pursuing as well.

00:47:48.060 But whatever it's going to take them to win those elections, that's what

00:47:51.920 they're out there to do.

00:47:52.980 And so I don't think that is a conspiracy theory that Democrats are willing to

00:47:57.560 fight dirty and to win elections, is it?

00:48:00.680 So look, I am the son of a Cuban immigrant, and millions of Democrats wanted to

00:48:06.680 replace me with a rich white guy named Beto O'Rourke.

00:48:11.160 Wait, hold on, he's not Spanish?

00:48:12.360 Are you sure?

00:48:12.860 Oh, I thought he just got a name like Beto.

00:48:15.000 You know, it was amusing.

00:48:15.880 When he launched his campaign, his name is Robert Francis, and the AP reported

00:48:21.060 when he launched his campaign that he gave his announcement speech in his

00:48:24.820 native tongue.

00:48:26.540 And I couldn't help but resist saying, really, I've never heard a speech in

00:48:30.020 Gaelic.

00:48:32.140 I'm running to be the next senator from Texas.

00:48:35.840 Hidey-didey-doo.

00:48:36.860 You know, I have to say, since the Astros are about to play the Red Sox, you know, that,

00:48:44.920 I'm looking forward to our going back to the World Series.

00:48:51.360 Listen, on your question, I don't buy the racially charged nonsense that is in these

00:48:56.840 discussions.

00:48:57.300 I believe in immigration.

00:49:01.220 I have said many times my view in immigration can be summed up in four words.

00:49:06.420 Legal, good.

00:49:09.000 Illegal, bad.

00:49:09.880 You know, I represent the state of Texas.

00:49:24.160 We have 29 million people.

00:49:29.000 We're seeing firsthand the horrors of the Biden border crisis.

00:49:34.000 I've been down to the border over and over and over again.

00:49:37.940 When you've got 1.3 million people crossing the border illegally, I've been to the Biden

00:49:43.020 cages that are filled with thousands of children.

00:49:45.980 The last time I was in the Rio Grande Valley, the rate of COVID positivity in the Biden cages

00:49:50.480 was over 24 percent.

00:49:53.540 I've seen when I brought 19 senators down to the Rio Grande Valley and we went out on the

00:49:59.220 river, we saw an illegal immigrant floating dead in the river.

00:50:03.580 I've seen the dead bodies of the pregnant women that the coyotes abandoned in the desert

00:50:09.220 heat.

00:50:10.240 I've seen the little girls and the little boys who are sexually assaulted and physically

00:50:15.720 assaulted by the vicious criminals who are trafficking them in.

00:50:20.280 And so there are lots of lies in politics, but I think one of the biggest lies is the lie

00:50:26.820 you hear from the media that the Democrats' open border policy is somehow compassionate.

00:50:33.580 There is nothing compassionate about a policy that has hundreds of thousands of children

00:50:40.100 in the custody of vicious human traffickers that are assaulting and victimizing those kids.

00:50:47.420 And so we ought to have a system that welcomes, that celebrates legal immigrants.

00:50:52.720 There's a right way to come.

00:50:54.160 You wait in line.

00:50:55.160 You follow the rules.

00:50:56.200 You come to America, but you don't have chaos at the border, which is what Joe Biden and

00:51:01.720 Kamala Harris have given us.

00:51:02.840 Hello, my name is Thomas.

00:51:15.980 Thank you, Mr. Knowles and Senator Cruz, for coming.

00:51:18.620 One of my brothers is modeling his beard after you.

00:51:20.900 So yeah, my question is a bit tangential.

00:51:25.220 I'm a really big fan of comedy, and there's been a cultural trend toward the buzzword cancel

00:51:30.940 culture.

00:51:32.200 And I'm wondering, what exactly is your interpretation of the line for cancel culture versus just holding

00:51:39.680 somebody accountable?

00:51:40.620 Say the difference between Colin Kaepernick no longer playing NFL because America is so

00:51:47.160 oppressive, he makes millions.

00:51:48.140 James Damore, who was fired from Google because you sent out a memo saying men and women are

00:51:57.120 biologically different.

00:51:59.720 Where is the line, and when does it become canceling?

00:52:02.860 When is it just holding someone accountable?

00:52:04.400 When is it being sensitive?

00:52:05.440 When is it just having preferences?

00:52:07.920 Look, that's a great question, and it's a subtle and nuanced question.

00:52:11.700 You know, my view as a general matter, we should not have people being fired for expressing their

00:52:20.620 political views.

00:52:21.900 Now, there are exceptions to that, and one of the exceptions is we have a right as consumers.

00:52:29.520 So you mentioned Colin Kaepernick.

00:52:31.440 I don't like what Kaepernick said.

00:52:33.500 Now, I don't think he should be censored.

00:52:35.300 I don't think he should be silenced, but I'm not interested in supporting him with his message

00:52:45.300 that, to me, is disrespecting the American flag and is disrespecting the men and women

00:52:52.720 who fought to defend the flag in our nation.

00:52:57.100 I don't think it's right that Kaepernick is not a quarterback today because of his stance.

00:53:00.940 To be honest, his stance was embraced in the NFL because they're such leftists, they loved

00:53:06.280 it, and the guy is making tens of millions of dollars from Nike right now.

00:53:10.640 He's not a quarterback because he wasn't that good a quarterback, and he had a tryout that

00:53:14.560 was lousy.

00:53:18.540 I will say, by the way, it is clearly political discrimination that I'm not an NFL quarterback.

00:53:24.600 They don't like my views, and it's the only reason I'm not a starting quarterback.

00:53:28.180 It's cancel culture, if you ask me.

00:53:30.260 You know, coincidentally, I did just write a book on this very subject called Speechless,

00:53:34.840 Controlling Roods, Controlling Minds.

00:53:36.280 So I appreciate it.

00:53:36.860 Oh, thank you.

00:53:37.300 That's very kind.

00:53:38.280 Thank you.

00:53:39.740 Since, you know, we're selling the cactus merch, so I might as well mention this book.

00:53:43.980 And I think your question is really important, and Senator, you make a good point here, which

00:53:48.480 is it's a subtle and nuanced question.

00:53:51.580 You know, I don't think that we as conservatives are saying we have no standards at all whatsoever.

00:53:56.680 William F. Buckley, Jr., when he launched the modern conservative movement, he did so

00:54:00.900 with a book called God and Man at Yale, The Superstitions of Academic Freedom, in which

00:54:05.680 he mocked this extreme idea of academic freedom that the left pretends to embrace, but they

00:54:11.960 don't even really embrace.

00:54:13.560 You know, I don't think anyone believes that if you go to your water cooler and you make

00:54:18.960 a Zieg Heil and you start reciting Mein Kampf, that when you lose your job, that is cancel

00:54:24.240 culture and we're all supposed to cry about that.

00:54:26.560 No, obviously, societies have limits.

00:54:29.140 There is going to be decorum.

00:54:31.060 You know, the left tries to shut us up on certain things and says you can't say certain

00:54:35.300 things.

00:54:36.500 Chivalry also suggests maybe you shouldn't say certain things.

00:54:39.680 And so the questions involved are, one, what should the government be involved in?

00:54:44.760 That's a procedural question.

00:54:46.260 And then, two, a substantive question.

00:54:49.120 What is the good?

00:54:50.660 What do we want to have in our society?

00:54:53.020 What do we want to look up to?

00:54:54.180 What do we want to pursue?

00:54:55.860 And what is really going to make us free people?

00:54:58.300 You know, that distinction that our founding fathers found so important between liberty,

00:55:02.920 true liberty, and licentiousness, you know, just pursuing your basest passions.

00:55:07.300 And so I agree with what you brought up and obviously what you said, Senator, that we need

00:55:13.360 to take this question in a much more serious way.

00:55:15.860 And if that means we can't dunk on the libs quite as much, so be it.

00:55:19.260 But we want to be able to move forward into a society that has a culture that we can all

00:55:23.520 really be proud of and live in.

00:55:24.880 Well, and let me give an example of the line drawing because I don't think it's just,

00:55:29.040 it's binary.

00:55:31.500 State of Tennessee has actually a state law that, as I understand it, requires the governor

00:55:36.960 every year to proclaim a Nathan Bedford Forrest Day, celebrating Nathan Bedford Forrest.

00:55:43.540 And the governor a couple of years ago did that.

00:55:45.680 I saw that and publicly said, this is a mistake and you shouldn't do it.

00:55:49.140 Now, for those of you who don't know who Nathan Bedford Forrest was, he was a Civil War general,

00:55:54.300 but he was also a slave trader, and he was the founder of the Ku Klux Klan.

00:55:59.200 And I said, this is absurd that we are celebrating this man.

00:56:03.520 The Ku Klux Klan is a force for evil, and we should not be celebrating him.

00:56:09.400 And, you know, some folks came back and said, well, Cruz, you're being unrealistic because

00:56:14.020 state law requires a proclamation about him.

00:56:17.420 I said, all right, if I were governor of Tennessee, you want to see a proclamation about him?

00:56:21.360 I'll make a proclamation you'll never forget about someone who built his entire fortune selling

00:56:27.520 other human beings.

00:56:28.840 Now, there's a difference, I think, between not honoring the founder of the Ku Klux Klan

00:56:35.400 and tearing down a statue of Thomas Jefferson.

00:56:40.040 And part of it requires the exercise of judgment.

00:56:43.600 It's not a clean, narrow line that we should never express a view or we should always silence views.

00:56:52.600 It is somewhere in between, but the left, the thing to understand about cancel culture

00:56:57.480 is the left is trying to use power to dominate the terrain of discussion.

00:57:06.560 So I remember last summer, two summers ago, I was in California.

00:57:11.640 Heidi's family is from California.

00:57:13.000 We were visiting with a friend of the family who's a kindergarten teacher.

00:57:16.160 And she said, look, I'm scared to speak.

00:57:21.500 There's a McCarthyist wind in the air that if I say the wrong thing at school, I'm fired

00:57:28.700 and my job is lost.

00:57:30.460 And there are a lot of people that feel frightened to speak because the left is so unrelenting.

00:57:38.460 And so I think we ought to have a lot of tolerance.

00:57:40.900 We can draw lines at the extreme, but we ought to have a lot of tolerance for a reasoned discourse

00:57:49.880 and debate.

00:57:50.520 And that includes a reasoned discourse about our history, which is neither uniformly good

00:57:56.660 nor uniformly bad.

00:57:57.920 And we ought to be able to discuss that intelligently.

00:57:59.840 This will be the last question.

00:58:10.220 But if you want to continue asking the senator more questions, you can go to verdictwithtedcruz.com

00:58:16.100 slash plus.

00:58:17.720 You will get exclusive access to the senator, including the opportunity to ask him questions.

00:58:22.820 If you want to introduce yourself and ask your question.

00:58:25.300 Yeah, my name is Lane Witten.

00:58:26.340 And I founded an organization on campus called Unmask UW, and our goal is to get...

00:58:30.700 Where do I sign up?

00:58:36.900 How do I become a member of that club?

00:58:39.200 UnmaskUW.org.

00:58:40.760 So basically, we just want to get rid of masks, obviously, but the university administration

00:58:44.600 is not going to help us no matter how many protests we hold.

00:58:47.800 So my question basically is how do we get weaker Republicans in the state legislature to

00:58:52.500 stand up, take a principled stand, and actually follow the law and get mask mandates removed

00:58:58.000 from UW-Madison?

00:59:04.460 Look, it's a great question.

00:59:06.700 My view on all of COVID is there should be no mandates.

00:59:09.920 There should be no mask mandates.

00:59:11.460 There should be no vaccine mandates.

00:59:13.260 There should be no vaccine passports.

00:59:15.240 Then it ought to be up to individual choice.

00:59:16.900 If people want to wear a mask, we've got some people here wearing masks, great.

00:59:21.480 That's your choice.

00:59:22.220 That's your right to do it.

00:59:23.580 You can make your own choice about your own health care.

00:59:25.720 If people choose to get vaccinated, that's what Heidi and I have done.

00:59:29.060 That's what our parents have done.

00:59:30.480 That's your choice, too.

00:59:32.340 But it shouldn't be the government forcing you to do that.

00:59:34.900 And I would say, look, you've got a lot of folks in politics that are scared about this

00:59:41.260 issue.

00:59:42.060 It is a weird thing.

00:59:43.680 So the way the United States Congress is right now, on the House side, Nancy Pelosi rules

00:59:50.540 like a tyrant.

00:59:51.980 So she forces everyone to wear a mask.

00:59:54.600 And she has said that she will have the Capitol Police arrest any staffer who doesn't wear a

00:59:59.660 mask.

01:00:00.440 And she's fining House members who don't wear a mask.

01:00:03.360 And I think it's a complete abuse of power.

01:00:06.080 We did a verdict on that topic in particular.

01:00:09.420 The Senate, it's interesting.

01:00:11.500 The Senate, you've got a little bit more kind of a hundred islands where no one tries to

01:00:16.780 exercise brute force on other senators.

01:00:20.040 And right now, it's the strangest thing.

01:00:22.720 It's like gang colors.

01:00:25.040 In the Senate, every Democratic senator and every Democratic staffer wears a mask walking

01:00:30.940 down the hall.

01:00:31.400 And none of the Republican senators and none of the Republican staffers wear a mask.

01:00:36.200 And it's the weirdest thing.

01:00:38.060 You'll walk to the Capitol and you can literally see some intern who you've never met before.

01:00:42.860 And you'd be like, Republican, Democrat, Democrat, Republican.

01:00:46.740 It's bizarre.

01:00:48.120 I mean, it's like the Crips of the Bloods or something.

01:00:51.820 Even the same colors, actually.

01:00:53.460 Red and blue.

01:00:53.980 There it is.

01:00:54.380 And the thing to understand about it is the left knows what they're saying is a crock.

01:01:03.780 The hypocrisy.

01:01:04.800 So Nancy Pelosi, when she has this fundraiser in Northern California with all these rich

01:01:11.840 Democrats, none of them have masks on.

01:01:14.540 And of course, the waiters and waitresses, the serving staff are masked, which from a Democratic

01:01:19.500 perspective, yes, you little people like Imelda Marcos, you know, let the little people do

01:01:25.200 it, you know, Barack Obama, his 60th birthday party in Martha's Vineyard.

01:01:31.280 Again, a bunch of rich Democrats dancing.

01:01:33.960 None of them are wearing masks.

01:01:35.260 Mayor of San Francisco.

01:01:36.480 While dancing.

01:01:37.260 Same issue.

01:01:38.060 She was feeling the spirit, she said.

01:01:40.020 It is.

01:01:41.580 And I got to tell you, in the Senate, so you see these Senate Democrats, when they're behind

01:01:46.580 closed doors, they don't wear masks.

01:01:49.120 When they're having conversations, and then suddenly a camera's there, they're like, oh

01:01:53.580 crap, got to put my mask on, because, you know, the virus reacts to cameras.

01:01:58.920 Like, it has become this weird virtue signal.

01:02:04.140 The left is fond of projection, and all right, this is a dangerous thing, because I'm going

01:02:09.600 to make a pop culture reference to a show I haven't watched.

01:02:12.400 I watch a lot of shows, but I haven't watched Handmaid's Tale, so all I know is they wear

01:02:16.540 those freakish outfits, and they all say Mike Pence wants to turn America into that.

01:02:21.680 It's a documentary, yes.

01:02:23.020 Yeah, I watched it.

01:02:23.940 So I haven't watched it, so my commentary is, I'm sure, not informed on that show, but

01:02:30.340 the left is literally like, wear your burqa as a sign that you are virtuous in D.C.

01:02:39.940 I'll be walking along the road, and you'll see this liberal, I've seen this several times,

01:02:44.620 like a liberal woman jogging, will see me jogging, reach out and put on her mask and

01:02:49.360 glare at me.

01:02:51.380 I was doing, I was speaking at an outdoor protest in D.C., it was on the border, in the

01:02:56.340 open borders, and it was outdoors, and I was at a microphone, there were a bunch of people

01:03:00.160 gathered there, and we were talking about the border crisis, and there was this angry

01:03:03.700 lefty standing on the street screaming at me.

01:03:06.960 And he was kind of like the young lady who was here, he was cursing at me, and didn't

01:03:10.860 know any of the substance, but was just, F you, well, thank you for sharing, sir.

01:03:16.060 And at one point, he screamed, why aren't you wearing a mask?

01:03:20.420 And I'm like, you're not wearing a mask.

01:03:24.360 And it was the most bizarre, we ought to be able to find some level of common sense.

01:03:30.920 If someone wants to wear a mask, knock yourself out, but I think we ought to have leaders with

01:03:35.880 the courage to say, we're not going to force you to make that decision against your wishes.

01:03:40.500 And clearly, you've got a lot of courage.

01:03:43.020 You are refusing to muzzle yourself.

01:03:45.240 Your fellow students are refusing to muzzle themselves.

01:03:48.380 All of us here, I guess, are at least in the metaphorical sense, refusing to muzzle ourselves

01:03:53.260 and have these discussions.

01:03:55.200 We really appreciate everyone here.

01:03:57.080 I especially appreciate our friend, Liz Wheeler.

01:03:59.720 If you like Liz, which, who doesn't?

01:04:02.700 Who doesn't love Liz?

01:04:03.520 Go check out the Liz Wheeler Show.

01:04:07.680 Be sure to check it out.

01:04:09.060 Also, very exciting, Liz is partnering with YAF for her own campus speaking event.

01:04:15.440 So if you want to bring Liz to your school, go to yaf.org slash Liz.

01:04:20.420 Bring Liz to your school.

01:04:21.620 Liz, thank you so much for being here.

01:04:23.700 Thank you so much.

01:04:25.620 We'll see you in Texas tomorrow at Texas A&M.

01:04:30.480 So, Michael, what are the next stops?

01:04:32.200 Where are we headed next on this tour?

01:04:34.600 So, coming up next tomorrow, we're going to be at Texas A&M.

01:04:38.320 That's going to be very exciting.

01:04:39.320 Gig'em.

01:04:39.720 I can't wait.

01:04:40.420 Very exciting.

01:04:41.500 We're also going to be back in D.C.

01:04:43.700 We're going to Catholic University.

01:04:46.320 That's going to be next week.

01:04:47.680 And then we've got three more stops yet to be decided.

01:04:50.040 So if you want to bring us to your school, head on over to yaf.org slash verdict.

01:04:57.000 So you can bring verdict live to your school.

01:04:59.920 But it's late, Senator.

01:05:00.820 It's late.

01:05:02.020 These wonderful people have taken a stand against the forces of tyranny and suppression and censorship.

01:05:08.420 A stand for America.

01:05:10.000 A stand for free speech.

01:05:11.440 Thank you so much.

01:05:12.980 Thank you so much for the students and the community here of the University of Wisconsin-Madison.

01:05:18.860 And I've got only one message for the administrators who tried to shut us up.

01:05:24.900 Let's go, Brandon.

01:05:26.820 This is Verdict with Ted Cruz.

01:05:39.140 This is an iHeart Podcast.

01:05:42.020 Guaranteed human.

Verdict with Ted Cruz - October 15, 2021

Take Your Damn Mask Off, LIVE in Madison, WI

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