BC Leaders Debate
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Summary
In this episode, the Western Standard's Alex McCall and Sean Elaine talk about the BC leaders debate and give their initial thoughts on the debate itself, as well as give their reactions to the moderator and questions asked.
Transcript
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i am a publisher of the western standard um we've just been watching the bc leaders debate
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and sean you need to put a headphone in your ear you at least one of you but i think it's sean uh
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you've been watching the bc leaders debate and uh we're here tonight uh i'm here tonight with
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alex mccall uh columnist for the western standard and uh sean elaine uh one of our digital uh online
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uh experts for the western standard uh he hails from uh he'll correct me if i'm wrong but
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from vancouver british columbia he is uh one of the leading british columbians in the western
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standard right now of course i'm here from calgary and uh so is alex mccall so uh guys uh uh welcome
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tonight uh you've been watching a lot uh maybe just first introduce yourself make sure we can
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everybody can hear everybody first well i guess i'm in the middle so i'll go first i'm alex mccall
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i'm in calgary as derek mentioned and i'm the defense columnist with the western standard
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i i hope my uh sound is okay on this i did turn my volume down hopefully that helps
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my name is sean elaine i grew up uh about an hour outside of vancouver i lived in alberta for about
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10 years and but now i'm back uh in bc again been here for over a year now and i do the uh digital
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social media uh and some digital marketing uh for the western standard very good all right guys well
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we've been uh listening to uh the debate uh for the last hour and a half uh from between what i think
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seems like four candidates uh without stealing alex's thunder it seems like uh four liberal
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candidates but uh why don't i open it up for you guys for your initial thoughts uh before we dive
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down into any of the details about specifics they said uh maybe just uh let's uh just give me your
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very highlights about uh the evening uh who won who lost uh if there is any of that
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you first alex oh sure uh so yeah i remember halfway through the the debate i think i texted
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derrick uh it's like there are three liberals on stage playing no true scotsman and arguing
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who's the the real liberal in the room and who's the real leftist that you should all trust and vote
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for uh so there wasn't that great of a diversity of ideas although on the overall winner uh i think they
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all did a fairly good job but uh premier horgan was clearly appealing to uh the green party supporters
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and saying you know vote for me i agree with a lot of the things the green party is doing and that way
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we can keep out the big scary capitalist liberals who are going to destroy the province uh and based
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on where the polls are today and the success of the conservative party in british sorry in new
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brunswick in their recent snap election i think horgan probably did a good job and probably won
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yeah you know i agree with that actually i wrote that exactly and here in my notes is
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horgan seemed to be going after the greens uh the most and looking for that green vote uh in fact
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i thought wilkinson didn't get that much uh time or time at all and speaking time i'm sure the they'll
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come out with the speaking of the amount of time spoken uh between the but i i i didn't think wilkinson
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fared that that well just because he i don't think he asserted himself much and really got his in front
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of there as much but maybe that's because horgan i found him mostly going after greens to get those
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green votes yeah uh yeah alex i didn't mean to steal your point it was a very good point but my only
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disagreement with there being three liberals on stage i'd say there was four liberals on stage
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uh the moderator i think uh what's her name um satchi curl if i'm not mispronouncing that she
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i think she did a good job in terms of keeping order of the debate it was certainly a lot less
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chaotic than said the u.s presidential debate with uh one angry man and one senile man but
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she did a good job keeping order but she was wildly involved in the debate the questions i found
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were particularly ideologically slanted to the far even radical left she she even went so far as to
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accuse all three candidates of having white privilege now that is possible uh because the theory you know
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intersectional ideology doesn't judge people as individuals it judges them on a on a on a hierarchy or a
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pyramid of grievances and victimhood uh so if you subscribe to intersectionality all three do have
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white privilege regardless of how woke either of them any of them might be but um but maybe give
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some thoughts on the the moderator and uh and the role she played let's start with you sean well uh
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yeah i i did find a lot of the questions in particular were for uh environmental or climate change
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and uh i know that there is definitely a lot of people that care about that but i'm thinking right now
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uh severely normal people they're most worried about jobs and economy i mean who just said the
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other the world health organization just said the other day in the last seven months the poverty rate
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has doubled and uh you know i i think when you start losing your home and you start losing your car
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because of what's going on then the environmental your environmental uh priorities they start to go down
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the list and and uh when you're looking for uh you know get enough money for when you're going to eat
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next that becomes a little more of a priority uh alex your thoughts on the moderator uh well there was
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one question which was basically almost a minute of insults towards the liberal leader and followed by
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don't you think you're a terrible paternalistic white man or something along those lines and i i i just
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was shocked i was i've never thought i would ever see a debate moderator uh take such a personal
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attack against a sitting politician i understand from a little research that there have been some
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there were some legitimate critiques uh of the opposition leader uh but to see them kind of
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summarize so aggressively and then phrased in a don't you think you're terrible for having done this
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kind of way was a little bit of a shock uh and clearly i'm not an unbiased moderated question
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yeah uh it was it was quite something um i think if we're going to come up with a headline for the
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debate we're going to call it two and a half white men
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uh yeah i i i think you both have a point uh i i think uh andrew wilkinson so kind of coming back to
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the overall your overall impressions andrew wilkinson i i mean uh from my own perspective and i think yours
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seemed like the least crazy in the uh in the cuckoo's nest but it's still pretty pretty wild a real
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shocking well should be shocking but isn't to those of us who follow this but a real shocking lack of
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any ideological or philosophical diversity you know you had labor left you had green left and social
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left uh all three varieties of the virtually the same thing with the same root ideologies um just
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andrew wilkinson being a little more different than the other two because he he knows that uh browbeaten
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conservatives and libertarians in bc theoretically have no other choice but to vote for him so he has to
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not openly antagonize them that much um but john horgan i think came across as by far the most
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confident he came across uh certainly as the most premier like i found i found it interesting none of
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them smiled at any point like they were all very dour and sure these are serious times but uh it was
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interesting normally in leaders debate you want to come across as friendly a little at least a little bit
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from time to time crack a smile at one point uh green leader sonya uh sesta now uh had a positive
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scowl the whole time i i really noticed her not smiling she had a scowl the whole time but even the
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other two um actually i should say there was an exception with horgan horgan uh horgan smiled uh for a bit
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uh as andrew wilkinson was speaking when was that i'm just looking at my notes here i think it was
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when andrew wilkinson uh committed the cardinal sin and admitted to being a graduate of the university
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of alberta that's uh that's a very good point yeah i you know it's hard to say there was a clear winner
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of claire loser um but i i i think the one who was the most confident at least was uh ndp leader
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and premier john horgan he seemed uh you know he's a big guy his shoulders looked like he was you
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know the shots are bouncing off of him uh i i you know there was certainly very far from a knockout
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tonight no one lost badly no one won badly uh but i'd say if there if there was a winner uh in relative
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terms it was probably john horgan uh what are your guys thoughts yeah i agree with that uh
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oregon came out uh as the clear winner uh and i mean in love respect too i mean he was the one to
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beat he's the one to be i mean they're they're looking at the last poll i seen was something like
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a 98 chance of majority so um i mean yeah he's confident uh wilkinson didn't he didn't uh get as
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as much air time and um and uh and it just seemed like the green one was the one that well horgan was
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going after anyway so i would definitely say horgan won that uh yeah there was a part in the debate
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where i noticed a a pattern and it was basically uh everything that's been good over the past couple
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of years was the result of the ndp government and everything bad was something that they inherited from
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the previous liberal government and no incumbent government has ever blamed any problem on the
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previous government and taking credit for everything good alex you're clearly this is clearly
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a new electoral innovation right yeah of course yeah uh john who would take credit for the sun rising
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and blame his predecessors for the sun setting yeah and when it comes to the site c dam i mean anything
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that goes wrong on that well you know he just blames the bc liberals you know well no it was their
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project it doesn't matter if it was if that was completely and he can get away with it so anything
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that goes wrong with bcm go over budget you just blame that on the liberals yeah the ndp sorry sorry the
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greens in bc really come across to me as if they were the ndp but not thinking they could win government
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uh it's uh they really are just uh a slightly less pragmatic version of the ndp uh i mean none of us
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follow on the social uh the green left so it's hard for us to maybe empathize enough with how the green
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voter thinks in bc um just as when i you know read uh you know leftist call columnists talking about how
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how can anybody possibly be to the right of jason kenny in alberta he's already practically a nazi
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there is nothing to his right they clearly don't understand the way the way many of us think uh
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here in wild rose country so i i i admit that uh maybe we might not have the best perspective in
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thinking of the mentality of the green voter in british columbia but it really seems to me there was
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very little area of disagreement between the greens and the ndp uh just that the ndp are a bit more uh
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pregnant they're a little bit more captured by the deep state or the state and that uh you know once a
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decision is made and the bureaucracy has set on something that it's done i saw a little other
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difference what are your let's start with uh you alex on what are your thoughts on if if you're a
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a left uh green voter a small g green voter in bc uh really what what is the impetus for you to
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continue to support the greens or to con or to consider supporting the greens in bc as opposed to
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the ndp well that's a great question derek uh in any first pass of the post system it's good there's a
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natural uh encouraging aspect that uh forces you to support one of the two big parties or you risk
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splitting your side of the political spectrum and helping the other guy win uh and it's clear that
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john horgan was appealing to those green voters who might be in a place to split the vote and help
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the liberals win so he's trying to get that vote that green vote to go for him and the greens are
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currently sitting at around like two seats in the polls right now so it's very likely that if you
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believe in the green message if you want to elect someone who agrees with 80 of what you believe
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you're gonna have to vote ndp otherwise you could get a liberal candidate and i know i we in alberta
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hate this talk about vote splitting but in the realities of first past the posts that's what
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happens and there was a topic of questioning during the debate about pipelines and it seemed like they
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had very similar but slightly different answers if you'll remember the liberal leader said kept referring
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to protests have to be respectful and you have to fight the the issues in the courts you can't be
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blockading railways or pipelines that are under construction so that was one key difference
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whereas the greens on the opposite end of the spectrum were encouraging people it sounded like
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to blockade uh railways and pipeline projects and then the ndp in the middle were saying you know
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they kind of encouraged you to blockade alberta oil but please don't interfere with uh bc natural gas
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so they kind of tried to split the issue in some magical way sean uh if you're uh kind of a green
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left voter in bc uh you know we're trying to put our our hipster hat on here uh if you're a green
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left voter in bc uh what reason would you see to consider voting green as opposed to ndp at this point
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well you know that is an extremely tough question and and this one i'm about to say may not answer
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that question but but when when you look at the ndp and it's provincially and federally on how it used
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to be i mean their brand was uh we're a party for the working man and now whether or not that's true
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and i was different story but that was their brand and i believe that uh and over the past uh 10 years
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maybe even the last five years it's been taken over by green radicals and now i mean why would
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you try to i mean if you're i mean especially them being a a party that's been created by the unions
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it's in their constitution they have a non-voting seat right at the table that why would you try and
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block a pipeline that you're going to have so many of your union members you have jobs off of you know
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that just it doesn't make sense and actually i'm going actually a little bit more into that topic i
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think for the saskatchewan and alberta viewers the kind of impression i actually did get off of
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horgan though was uh when he answered that question was well we did everything we could we we brought
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it draw it all the way to the sec we gave it the old college try uh but in the end the ends the feds
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bought it and so that's it that's and i don't kind of got the impression that he's not going to be
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fighting it anymore um which is great news i hope and and well and then also i mean one of the
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reasons also because we believe it was funny it was because it was a minority government the green
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was holding them hostage and that was one of their big things that uh in fact holding all of
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canada hostage by a couple seats uh and that was one of their big things they were pushing so but why
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why would a green uh why would a green voter or why would someone vote green instead of ndp
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that's a different question because especially when you think like you mentioned about vote splitting so
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i'm sorry i just can't get into the mind of a green party uh green party other than maybe
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maybe the more votes they get even if they know they're not going to win it may give them that
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confidence boost for the next election and maybe uh eventually they'll get there but
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i just can't get the mind of a green voter i think it's a protest vote at the end of the day
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yeah that could be it yeah you could be disgusted with both uh with uh ndp and liberals and just
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decide to vote green if you want more establishment than either of the two establishment parties you
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vote green yeah okay so i can also see environmentalists saying uh we didn't want this vote this election
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election during the covid crisis so as a protest to the guy who called an early election just vote
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green or stay home i i would think that would be a legitimate you know sonia uh uh first and i'll
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did talk about that fairly often uh andrew wilkinson a little bit less but he he was at it too
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uh that this is breaking the fixed election uh date law that this is just a power grab by john
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borgen uh my gut tells me this is not going to be quite the issue that it was when jim prentice
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broke the fixed election date 2015 because that was so nakedly a a power grab while he had swallowed
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uh two-thirds of the official opposition and appeared invincible but i um you know it it's hard to tell
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uh but but she she tried to make an issue of it but let's bring this back to uh something that's maybe a
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a little easier for uh at least our alberta brains to understand here although sean you're uh i'm not
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sure what you identify as can you half and half pardon me can you be uh bi-provincial i would say
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yeah that's probably a you're you're trans mountain okay we got it yep
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so um uh so we'll bring it back to something a little maybe easier to understand on this side of
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the rockies here um you know the bc liberals are a very funny and unique party in canada uh bc has
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traditionally had the ndp from uh or ccf for most of its history and then the other party the not
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hard socialist party and that's normally been a coalition of conservatives populist western reform
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kinds uh and what you might call moderate business liberals um you know gordon campbell in when i think
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it was 2001 that he was first elected he's someone that i i probably would have been pretty comfortable
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with uh maybe not great but by bc standards you'd say good enough you know he privatized the number of
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things or partially privatized some things he cut taxes he balanced the budget he was um after ralph
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cline and mike harris uh certainly the most conservative premier in canada or libertarian
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however you want to slice that um but the bc liberal party uh by the end of uh gordon campbell's
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tenure was back to being almost uh what you would consider a federal a moderate federal liberal it was
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it was definitively liberal it was just more more moderate than you'd get with the social justice
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hard left liberal with say a justin trudeau or stephan um so uh saw tonight was um you know we talked
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from this earlier that he's spit in the face of his conservatives or libertarians or western populists
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that are apparently a part of that coalition but uh you know we had four four liberals on stage or or two
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socialists and two liberals depending on how you consider the moderator um you know we had uh you
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know he was committed to not just the carbon tax but he was committed to obeying without question uh
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federal uh orders to increase provincial carbon taxes he didn't even bat an eye about that he had he
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showed no interest in joining the uh court challenge uh against the federal carbon tax he endorses the idea
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of carbon taxes uh and it says it'll be fine to go up because ottawa says so uh he committed he said
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repeatedly that money is cheap to borrow right now so the government should borrow money and continuing
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deficits uh these are things that would um not earn you the support of conservatives if he was say
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uh leader of the ucp or anything further right in alberta um maybe uh we'll start with you sean and then
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we'll go to alex about you know what are your thoughts on wilkinson's performance in terms of
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trying to keep that the anti-socialist coalition together uh for british columbia keeping together
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western populists uh conservatives and liberals and how do you think he performed in that task tonight
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well i don't think that uh there isn't really other any other choice for um libertarians and conservatives
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to vote for uh i mean there is a bc i don't know i think there's still a bc conservative party i know
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last election there was and but they were actually uh very anti-conservative uh there's i seen there
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was some of them that were posting um on their own personal facebook feeds like anti-harper stuff and so
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as far as i'm concerned i kind of wish that whole party would implode and just start over from scratch
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and to become a real conservative party uh the bc liberals do have uh a bit of an identity crisis
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i hear this a lot that people are that people are associating the bc liberals with the federal
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liberals and they're actually two very separate parties and in fact uh you know when i uh growing up
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out here i i i knew that all i knew is i was a someone who my one of the biggest issues was to be
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fiscally fiscally uh conservative issues fiscally responsible keep deficits down keep the economy
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moving and uh at the time that was the bc liberals and also at the time i mean we had chretchen who
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uh i mean fiscally he was a fairly uh you know small city conservative kind of government certainly not
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like the liberals nowadays so i always thought that uh you know i always thought i was a liberal
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and it wasn't until i went to alberta and and uh i believe i started really paying attention alberta
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politics with redford and it turns out the conservatives there were the liberals so i
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had it really backwards there i had to figure out figure out that wow i'm actually a conservative i
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didn't realize that alex give me your thoughts on uh how you think uh andrew wilkinson did in trying to
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keep that uh anybody but uh green ndp coalition together tonight uh i think he did a fairly good
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job uh there were a couple decent proposals that he talked about like uh giving drivers in british
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columbia a private insurance option and breaking the icbc monopoly i know that's a big complaint for
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free market minded people in bc how the moderator called that privatization that yes choice is just
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total i think privatization is great i think it's crazy that the government owns anything uh period
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it's actually the government owns an insurance company and then it's positively marxist that it's
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a monopoly so they're going from marxist to crazy uh so sorry to interrupt but yeah people out here
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people in bc hate icbc uh icbc uh choice issue uh god what an awful uh moderator to call that
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privatization no privatization is what i would do if uh if i somehow you know killed someone and became
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the leader of a bc political party you know and pigs were flying and hell froze over um you know that
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that that would be the you know that's something i would talk about but uh yeah yeah back to your point
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icbc was you know yeah so they're talking about was there anything beyond icbc that can appeal to
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someone left sorry right of trudeau uh with andrew wilkinson uh in many ways it was the most right-wing
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option but it was still a kind of a classical liberal so there were things like uh the others were offering
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like free day care whereas the liberal plan was i think ten dollars a day day care so it was like
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the mo like there'd be a small copay and that's the most right-wing option uh on the table and bc
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liberals skinniest kid at fat camp yeah basically and on the icbc front i'd like to add that the ones
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on the extreme left they like to have it try to have it both ways because giving a private insurance
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option to regular folk is bad but they also have mused about forcing wealthy people into buying
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private insurance for ferraris and lamborghinis so having private insurance for rich people is good
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because it gets them off icbc uh and it's just it's just nonsense everyone should have access to uh to
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competition in the insurance market yeah all right well they talked about a lot of issues uh you know
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they got a lot a lot of environment in the real extreme end of things uh you know i already mentioned
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that the the moderator felt uh comfortable without uh questioning her uh her own presumptions that
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everyone there has white privilege uh i mean i suppose you can debate if white privilege is a thing
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uh but to accuse them all of having it regardless of their own backgrounds uh certainly it was a lot
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of balls i i'd say but uh you know there was a lot of stuff a lot of race a lot of indigenous issues a lot
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of um environment uh certainly one issue that's i think pretty unique to bc is money laundering uh and
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its connection with the housing market uh that's a long-standing issue i lived in british columbia i lived in
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victoria for the better part of the year uh after i finished university uh housing prices are are just
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wild in bc this this is an issue there they all talk about it and like to talk about how concerned
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they are but they don't seem to really have any any to do anything about it because frankly i'm not sure
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there is anything anyone can do about it unless your goal is to uh well i'm probably unconstitutionally
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banned foreigners from buying any property in british columbia uh sean maybe we'll just go to
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you for this one um because i i'm sure alex is probably just as stumped as i am you know really
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what is the how are british columbians viewing the uh the rental and property um actually this isn't
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just a bc issue this is probably just mostly a lower mainland issue no lesser extent victoria uh could
00:28:14.720
maybe you want to just kind of flesh this out a little bit and uh tell us how are british columbians
00:28:19.760
perceiving the issue and do they think any one of the three parties we saw tonight have any more
00:28:24.320
credibility than the others are yeah well this is a bit a long-standing issue um well and i don't think
00:28:34.640
any party can solve it the beast liberals had their chance the ndp has had their chance
00:28:39.840
uh in fact the ndp they did bring in uh some of the some restrictions but like they were actually
00:28:47.360
punishing a lot of albertans for their holiday home uh in bc but uh uh you're right i'm well i'm no
00:28:56.160
expert on real estate but i think if there was a way to fix it it probably would would have been fixed
00:29:02.560
and it hasn't no party's done it yeah go ahead there's there's a very important thing that no
00:29:10.400
one mentioned in the debate which is supply and demand uh there's certainly a lot of nimbyism in
00:29:17.520
in the british columbia that prevents development uh we almost heard andrew wilkinson say it but he
00:29:23.760
only talked about supply he didn't want to talk about supply and demand and there was actually a
00:29:28.240
point in the debate where they were arguing about what developers were doing and in one
00:29:32.320
point uh john horgan said that they should stop developers from making like 500 square foot
00:29:38.400
a shoebox condominiums uh because the developers are taking advantage of young people on as a young
00:29:44.720
person who lives in downtown calgary in a 650 square foot condo uh young people want to live there build
00:29:53.680
them build more of them it'll make the price go down and i know that personally because i own my small
00:29:58.880
condo in calgary and the reason it's worth less than i paid for it other than the economic collapse
00:30:03.840
in alberta has also been that there have been other condos springing up left right and center when
00:30:08.960
there's a lot of supply the price stays stable or it goes down but nimbyism in vancouver is rampant
00:30:15.440
and none of the leaders on stage wanted to pick a fight with vancouver city hall over it
00:30:20.880
but you know those those 500 square foot apartments that's the only way young people can get into the
00:30:24.720
the housing market these days i mean i live like my front hallway yeah i mean i live uh and in fact
00:30:31.840
actually my place maybe even a little more than an hour outside of vancouver and the developer across
00:30:38.320
the street five acres developed a million dollars an acre and tearing everything down and just building
00:30:43.840
there right but i mean that's the price for um teardown million bucks an acre uh over an hour from
00:30:50.640
vancouver so the only way the young people can get in is those 500 square foot places i don't disagree
00:30:57.200
with anything the two of you have said i think a lot of this certainly is government policy uh but
00:31:01.920
there is also the elephant in the room that no one seems to talk about is that vancouver is a delta
00:31:07.280
butting up against the mountain there is a very physical limitation of space which is one reason
00:31:13.200
vancouver is such a vertical city uh calgary uh well i don't know we can build probably about 200 kilometers
00:31:22.800
in that direction uh 3 000 that direction well montana's that way so i don't know 500 that way yeah
00:31:34.480
and about 4 000 that way all the way to the lake uh calgary can grow literally forever there
00:31:43.040
is virtually no physical limitation to the growth of calgary uh but uh you know cities like toronto
00:31:50.480
or vancouver or montreal that have very serious geographic restrictions things are going to get
00:31:56.800
more expensive once you become a big city because things are going to both the buildings and the prices
00:32:02.320
are going to go up and uh that's just reality unless they're going they're proposing to start blowing up
00:32:09.680
mountains uh much more space well derek with respect there are plenty of ways you can undo nimbyism in
00:32:16.880
vancouver there's the greater vancouver area itself which includes the the neighboring cities uh which
00:32:22.880
are not very dense at all and could easily increase their population density with uh zoning reforms and
00:32:29.520
even vancouver proper uh don't ask me to quote all the laws but there are a number of laws that limit
00:32:35.760
development for things like oh you can't cast a shadow onto the ocean you can't interrupt the view
00:32:41.440
of the mountains you can't do this you can't do that you can't do this you have to apply and it takes
00:32:45.840
two years and millions of dollars to get a permit so there are plenty of ways you could build bigger
00:32:52.000
taller and more density even in vancouver no certainly but mountains and an ocean do present serious
00:33:01.280
physical obstacles i'm just putting that out there okay well let's uh we're gonna wrap it up uh we'll
00:33:06.480
leave uh closing i just say there's one more one more point on here i wanted to add sean i'm just
00:33:14.320
gonna say i'm gonna give you each a time for a closing comment okay so sean we will begin with you
00:33:22.800
okay so with the bc liberals like i said they've been known as the party to vote for on the for the one
00:33:31.040
for the best economy and budgets uh and everything else i think this is going to be a tough sell for
00:33:36.400
them this year uh this collection because i mean let's face it the ndp has ran three straight balanced
00:33:42.400
budgets i mean that's more than our conservative government in alberta can say uh and and frankly
00:33:49.040
it's a little shocking for an ndp government but hey hats off for i'd never wish for any government to
00:33:53.280
fail uh including the ones that i didn't vote for um but um and well considering i mean we're independent
00:34:00.080
but the economy is not bad so that's going to be a tough one for them to to run on this year and
00:34:05.840
frankly i think that that is probably one of the biggest issues for the severely normal british
00:34:11.360
colombians is economy and jobs and you know especially when they're getting their house repoed
00:34:17.280
and and their car taken away uh uh in these uncertain economic times so uh i do wish them luck
00:34:25.520
uh but uh i'm it's it's not looking like they're gonna win this election to be honest
00:34:32.880
alex your closing thoughts uh i i think uh one of the points that we talked about earlier was the
00:34:39.360
the liberals trying to maintain a big tent and i'm reminded of how the former liberal energy minister
00:34:46.320
endorsed leslin lewis for the conservative party of canada uh leadership so there is a big tent within the
00:34:54.160
liberal party uh but with these people voting out of protest or out of uh uh principle for the bc
00:35:03.120
conservative party that might hurt the liberals as well and all polling going in seems to say that
00:35:09.440
john horgan is doing a good job of siphoning votes among out from the green party and making the bc
00:35:16.240
legislature uh look like it's a two-party legislature so if john horgan can uh convince all the green voters
00:35:22.720
to just vote for him i think he's uh he's likely going to win this and during the debate the green
00:35:27.920
leader even pointed out you know the a thousand dollar covid relief uh check that was an electoral
00:35:34.400
promise not of a bill he brought to the legislature so you know people who are suffering are going to
00:35:40.640
think you know if i can vote for john horgan and get a thousand dollar check that might influence some
00:35:44.640
people very good all right gentlemen uh alex mccall a defense columnist for the western standard
00:35:53.440
and uh sean allain our social media manager for the western standard uh thank you very much for
00:35:59.520
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00:36:04.160
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00:36:33.360
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00:36:39.040
uh our two contributors joining us this evening uh thank you very much god bless the west all right thank