Canada handgun legislation & Bill C21
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Summary
Tony and Corey join me to talk about the Supreme Court challenge to Bill C-21, and why they think the government is trying to take our guns and make them worth zero. We also talk about why the government should be compensated for the value of our guns.
Transcript
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Hey there, Tony. It's good to see you back on the show again. It's been a while. As usual,
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it's under bad circumstances sometimes. Well, unfortunately, Corey, but that seems to happen
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to us a lot these days. It's just something to do with those guys in Ottawa, I think.
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I think it does. You might have caught part of my rant. I'm not typically very happy with them
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anyways. But I mean, you guys are national and rightly so, because I mean, there are firearm
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owners who are having their rights stepped on from coast to coast in Canada. This isn't just
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a Western issue. This is nationwide. I guess we'll start with it because I mean, the development of
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C-21 is a little newer. But first of all, I'd like to talk about you guys have launched a challenge
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when it comes to that handgun freeze, basically. Yeah, actually, the challenge is against not just
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the handgun freeze. The challenge is against all of C-21, because quite frankly, it wasn't written
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properly. There's a bunch of things that are black letter law in the writing of legislation.
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You have to do A and B in order to get C, and they have completely messed it up. We think we have
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decent grounds to declare the legislation null and void, and we're going to pursue that on a technical
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basis. But also, one of the things they did in there with the handgun legislation was the first
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thing they did was they reduced our handguns to a value of zero. And they did this because you can't
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transfer them in any way, shape, or form. So by making them untransferable, they now have a value
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of exactly zero. And when you pass away, the handguns obviously go to your next of kin, except this time
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they don't. They go to the federal government, and they don't have to pay compensation because the
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value is zero. Now, this is absolutely wrong, because they were the ones who made the value zero.
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And in doing so, they trampled all over existing Canadian legislation in this. And that's why we
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launched the challenge, because these things are worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. In fact, we're
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looking right now, 1.1 million handguns in Canada, give an average price of about $1,500, and do the math on
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that one. And you're quickly over a billion. And this is unconscionable that you can take,
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you know, $1.5 billion of generational wealth that belongs to the citizens of Canada, and make it
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disappear by going, poof, that's ridiculous. Who the hell thought that up?
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And firearms, I mean, they're property, they're an investment. I mean, some of them were handed down
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from people prior to us, some of us saved our money, and we purchased them. I mean, the property
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right aspect alone, I mean, never mind all the rest of whether this is effective legislation or
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making anybody safer or any of that. It's our property. And the government, as you said, I mean,
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it's a roundabout way to, I talked earlier, and I feel it's a theft, even if they compensate you for
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it. But their way of, okay, we're just going to turn the value to zero. Because as you said, if you can't
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transfer or sell something, it is de facto zero, then they'll take it for nothing. It's beyond the
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pale. Well, sure. And they're stuck in between a rock and a hard place, because there's legislation
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that's gone through the Supreme Court years and years ago, that say that if they're going to take
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your property, they got to compensate you fair market value for it. Well, these son of a bitches
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just reduced fair market value to nothing. Like, this is insanity. And we don't think this will
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withstand a court test. Courts tend to be pretty practical for the most part.
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Well, I certainly hope not. I mean, I guess this is something we want to get this resolved as fast
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as possible. But it's not the same as an immediate illegalization or seizure. So people still can hang
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on to their property until hopefully when this court challenge goes through and hopefully wins. What
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sort of timeline are you looking at with that? Well, you're looking for the challenge probably
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a year and a half anyway. I mean, there's all kinds of things that could happen. There's many,
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many, many chess pieces moving politically right now on this. Just yesterday, Saskatchewan said they
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aren't going to play and they're not going to let the citizens of Saskatchewan play either. So they're
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not even going to do anything with this thinking legislation. And we're expecting our friends in
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Alberta will do the same, possibly even New Brunswick, Yukon and Manitoba. We're still working
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on Ontario. And we still get a no comment out of the Ontario government. They're still not
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willing to stick their neck out far enough to say that we should be spending the billions of dollars
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it will cost to collect all these firearms and actually spend it on crime control.
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Well, yeah, I mean, there's again, so many levels. I mean, the amount of money being wasted on every
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level and kind of move on to the other firearms they're going after too. And we're talking about
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billions of dollars. I remember making this case a long time ago with the failed registry when they
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spent $2 billion on that, that pointless endeavor. How many crimes would have prevented perhaps if they'd put
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$2 billion into substance abuse treatment or mental health treatment or support, things like that?
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That's how you prevent crime. That's how you make people safer. Instead, they flushed it away on a
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$2 billion bureaucracy that served nobody. That's right. And when questioned under oath, the
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commissioner of the RCMP when asked, how many crimes has this solved? They said none that they were aware
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of. I mean, it's just, it's just one of these ultra left woke ideological things. That's a lot like
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unicorns and tooth fairies and stuff like that. And, and they think that because they, they put a
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regulation on it, criminals will stop misbehaving. I mean, it, it, it's just wishful thinking on, on every
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part. And you, you know, you can base your policies on, on fairy dust and unicorn snot, but quite
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honestly, it's not going to go anywhere. Right. And Canadians are buying into this. This is the part
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that's so absolutely amazing. The Canadians are buying into this nonsense. And we have to inform.
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I mean, it's just the reality is okay. The firearms owners are now a minority within the country,
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but it doesn't mean that they shouldn't have their abilities in that, but it does mean that
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the majority doesn't necessarily understand what comes with responsible ownership or the mindset
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again, with the vast, vast majority of people never want to hurt a fly. That's not why they
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got any firearms. Just actually one of my commenters also pointing out, you might've seen that video
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in a Calgary LRT station. They were shooting each other with a flare gun. Like criminals will find ways
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to get dangerous no matter what laws you put in place against the law abiding.
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Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, democracy is not based on the rights of the majority.
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Democracies are based upon the rights of the minorities. And, and quite frankly, we, we expect
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our governments to protect the rights of minorities. And if we're minority, that just means we need
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even more protection than we did before. Absolutely. And I wrote about it last week as well, because
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I've always felt it's been the liberal agenda since Cretchen's days and into today. They want to disarm.
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They want to take every firearm out of every Canadian's hands. And this is just the new move
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on to it. So rather than the registry route, now they're incrementally doing it through things like
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C-21 and they're taking advantage of tragedies. I mean, the timing's no mistake. Every time they make
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Yeah, that's right. So this time they're going after they've expanded it in committee. So this
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won't even get discussed in parliament. Basically hunting rifles.
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Right. And, and, you know, when you, when you look back at this, you're absolutely right. The goal is to
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completely disarm Canadian society. But if the people that they're disarming aren't the ones that are
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committing the crimes and they're not, and that all these people produces no positive effect
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on criminal activity in the country in any way, shape or form, and it doesn't,
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you have to ask yourself the big question. Why are they spending so much time and money to do this?
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Why do they need the public of Canada so effectively helpless?
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It's, it's, it's ideological. And, and, uh, I do believe, I mean, I, I, you know,
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an authoritarian is always nervous if the population is able to fight back if they push things too far.
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Right. Yeah. But what do you think they're going to do that's so bad
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that the Canadian people would rise up against them? I mean, this just, if you think about this,
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they're doing this for a reason. They're spending billions of dollars over decades to do this.
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And I don't think it's just because they've been influenced by a Hollywood movie. There's more to
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it than this. And they're not telling us what it is. No. And they're failing. I mean, the public,
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the firearm owners, we don't trust them. They, they can, uh, you know, re-categorize and legalize
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whatever they like. I suspect, and I won't counsel people to commit crimes, but a whole lot of people
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are not going to turn in their firearms. What it will do is turn those people into criminals,
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as far as the law is concerned. I mean, in reality, they're not harming anybody,
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but I, I can't see wide compliance with this. Not when it comes down to the hunting rifles now.
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No. And, and, you know, some, some of the firearms they've taken are, are put on the list. Incredibly
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common firearms. Absolutely. So common. You wouldn't believe it. And, and some of them,
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there's like half a million examples of one type of firearm and are all non-restricted. So how do you
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know where they are? Well, the answer is you don't. And, you know, when you're talking about
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compliance, well, you know, my office is sort of like a hub of what's happening with compliance.
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I haven't had a single person yet that say, oh yeah, I'm going to march right down there and give
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them my guns. And, you know, the, this compensation thing, this is wishful thinking. Like we, we put
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compensation into our lawsuit, not because we expect the government to give us money,
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but how else do we restore the value of the guns that they've devaluated? If there's a compensatable
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amount, when, when you perish, at least they're worth something at this point in time. And I think
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that the average Canadians here would stand straight up if they honestly found out how much money we're
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really talking about. With all the long guns that they've got now added into this and the handguns,
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we're looking at about a third of the guns in the entire country. And my guess, eight to ten billion
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That's just the bio. That's not the administration figuring out how to get these things, how to
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process, how to deal with it. I mean, and that's something to keep reminding Canadians of. Even if you
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don't have the firearms, even if you don't care if it's taken away from your neighbor. Okay. But are
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you ready to reach into your own pocket to pay for it? Because this is going to cost you.
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Well, at this point, I guess it's reaching into your great grandchildren's pocket, isn't it?
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Yeah, there is. That's kind of a different discussion altogether. And I mean, I wonder about
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some of the other hiccups. I mean, this is kind of out of the blue, but have you ever been in
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communication with some of the First Nations communities? Like somebody had pointed out that
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apparently a lot of First Nations people use SKSs for hunting. I mean, it's a low priced,
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you know, very common actually carbine that people use. It's utilitarian. And that's a tool for their
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livelihood and survival on those isolated communities. You're going to be taking away
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something very important to them. And I don't think the government's thinking that through on the
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problem they'll have going after those. No, they aren't. And I don't even think they care.
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They're, you know, that they'll make a policy where they're not going to prosecute it in certain
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spots and on other places they will, but mostly it'll be a charge laid as opportunity presents
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itself to lay the charge. The thing with the SKSs, like I say, half a million of them in Canada right now,
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online restricted. I can tell you, honestly, both my kids got their first deer with an SKS.
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These things are absolutely perfectly acceptable hunting firearms. They work. They always work.
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They're inexpensive and very, very common. On First Nations, the first thing they banned were
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the Ruger minis, the series of mini rifles. And those minis were not banned in the first round of
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this gun control legislation. And the reason they weren't banned back then, I was around back then
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working on the legislation. The reason was, was because they were so ubiquitous within the first
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nations and they didn't want to get the first nations all riled up at them. And so they left
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the minis off the list, even though that was the time when it was still hot and fresh from the Montreal
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massacre. But now they've gone ahead, banned all the minis and banned all the SKSs. And quite frankly,
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I think they've got a tiger by the tail on this one. I don't think compliance will be anything.
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No, I mean, provinces won't cooperate. Our Chief Firearms Officer in Alberta, she's fantastic,
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actually. She's quite outspoken. She's not going to be helping along with this in Saskatchewan and
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certain other provinces. They don't want to take on this headache. They got better things to do.
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Well, I mean, all we can do though, we got to keep fighting back or we will lose. I guess,
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kind of before I let you go, I really appreciate the work you guys are always doing,
00:13:48.780
keeping people up to date. I like reminding people to the CSSA has, you do stuff other than
00:13:52.860
lobbying. I mean, you've got all kinds of resources there that a member has as a firearm,
00:13:56.780
whether it's videos for say firearm operation or different sports or things like that.
00:14:02.940
Your organization where I let you go. And the best insurance products for firearms owners
00:14:08.940
anywhere in the country. We also ensure firearms and hunter safety instructors all over the country.
00:14:15.420
And we have some really fantastic products. We're also offering the only, you know, first aid
00:14:22.380
courses that are developed specifically for shooting ranges. Lots of stuff. There's so many things I
00:14:29.020
can't take all this time to say them all, but we're always working hard for our members.
00:14:33.580
Right. And I just really appreciate the work you do. And again, I just like to remind everybody,
00:14:37.420
it's more than just lobbying. I mean, if you're a firearm owner, that's a resource. As you said,
00:14:41.180
everything from the insurance to safe firearm use. And yeah, like anything you take seriously,
00:14:46.220
you should join an association of others and then work together. Because if we don't stand up for
00:14:49.740
ourselves together, we're done for. Well, our track record speaks for itself. In 62 years of existence,
00:14:56.460
we have had exactly zero fatalities on our shooting ranges. Yeah. Excellent.
00:15:01.340
I bet you the police can't say that. You can't have a ski hill claim that. No, exactly. Exactly.
00:15:09.580
Yeah. So we're very, very safe. It reflects in our insurance rates. And you know, it's a wonderful
00:15:16.060
pastime for those people who've never tried it. They really should get out there and try it. They
00:15:20.540
fall in love with it right away. Great. Well, thank you very much for joining us today,
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Tony. And I know you got a lot to do. We'll, we'll be keeping an eye on it and we'll hopefully win
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this in the long run. Thank you, Corey. Great. Thanks.
00:15:35.980
Canadian Shooting Sports Association. Without the CSSA, our gun rights would have been taken long,
00:15:41.820
long ago. These guys are on the front lines, helping to draft smart and intelligent firearms
00:15:47.740
regulations and legislation in Canada. And more importantly, educating the public about how we
00:15:53.340
keep guns out of the hands of the wrong people to become a member. It's absolutely worth every penny.
00:15:59.500
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