Western Standard - Carney clams up on Gordie Howe bridge deal

00:00:00.000 good evening i'm cory morgan senior columnist with the western standard and you're watching

00:00:29.920 the pipeline i know you usually have derek back here all bearded and gruff and doing the works

00:00:36.000 but you're getting a break from them for a second week in a row and you have me here this is our

00:00:40.080 weekly panel show with a few folks we'll break down some of the top issues the day and uh tell

00:00:45.600 you what to think about them or at least have our suggestions of them and there's lots to cover maybe

00:00:50.080 we'll start with our remote screen and bring in lindsey wilson she's uh coming in from elsewhere

00:00:57.120 to add her commentary to our discussion today hey lindsay how's it going fantastic thanks cory how

00:01:03.120 are you doing today very good very good enjoying summer see i'm tanning up i love it i love it i'm

00:01:09.920 darker than you i think right now love the sun right and then back in the studio here uh starting

00:01:17.200 right to my right uh as we say opinion editor emeritus nigel henniford it's nice to be to the

00:01:23.600 right of Cory Morgan. Good evening, everybody. And farther right, Dave Winnick, our intrepid

00:01:32.060 Calgary newsroom reporter and all things news. How's it going? Not too bad. How are you doing,

00:01:37.740 Cory? Good, good. So let's just dive into things. I will start with news. I guess, you know, global

00:01:45.640 is they've been having a hard time. Global media, I mean, they're tied with Chorus Entertainment.

00:01:50.760 I've been watching their share value for quite some time.

00:01:53.260 I believe about 10 years ago, it was worth about $14, $15 a share.

00:01:57.400 Now it's down to three cents.

00:01:58.680 Has been for probably a couple of years now.

00:02:01.180 So they're just cutting everywhere they can.

00:02:03.780 But they've really cut things in Alberta now.

00:02:06.780 Dave, you can lay out a bit what happened there.

00:02:09.540 Well, they said that they're shutting down all their offices, Global TV and Calgary for the time being.

00:02:13.780 They're relocating and consolidating everything in Toronto, which, like you said, I think part of that has to do with revenue.

00:02:20.340 And I'd like to know actually what their viewership and readership's been the last couple of years.

00:02:23.720 Because as you know, recently, 660 News Radio and Fan 960 as well were shut down in Calgary, just totally taken off the air midstream.

00:02:32.640 And basically, they were saying as well, viewership was down, revenues down.

00:02:35.420 So I think this is sort of a similar thing, Corey.

00:02:37.400 Like I said, I don't think any of the numbers have come out on what their exact viewership has been recently for Global.

00:02:42.240 So that'd be very interesting to find out.

00:02:44.000 Because that's got to be one of the main reasons I'm thinking.

00:02:46.160 Yeah, well, I mean, an issue with local coverage, local media outlets, it's difficult to make money in that market. Maybe, Lindsay, you could speak to this a bit. I mean, you used to write, I think, for the Cochran Eagle, didn't you? You know, little newspapers like that were actually still put out some great copy and had some good, but they're having a very tough time now, I imagine. Like, how does this bode for local coverage on things?

00:03:10.500 Yeah, I don't want to pick on Copern's newspaper, but certainly in the 10 years that I was there,

00:03:14.940 it was a very different time. And we had a very robust paper and, you know, our advertising was

00:03:20.680 doing well. And I was kind of there, like I was there from 2009 to 2019. And I really watched

00:03:25.860 that, that transformation. There's no other way to describe that it was, you know, when you went

00:03:32.060 from the big days of traditional, costly newspaper ads, and then with the advent of being online,

00:03:37.780 and newspapers just never really figured out the model, but we're really suffering.

00:03:41.540 Um, you know, I lament about this a lot. I've talked to you about this a lot, Corey, is where

00:03:47.300 do we go with journalism? Because yes, it's excellent that we have, you know, all these

00:03:52.100 online platforms and that we have all these independent voices, but, but who is there to

00:03:57.300 determine where the truth is coming from, right? So we have a lot of these so-called self-appointed

00:04:01.940 journalists but there's no metric there's no i mean regulatory body and i hate saying that because i

00:04:08.100 don't i'm typically not a fan of more government regulation with anything but we really have to do

00:04:13.060 something to stop this problem because it's not a viable industry it's been drowning for years

00:04:18.020 uh the transition to online we just we still can't figure out a business model that really works

00:04:23.300 um and we're seeing that now with radio it's i know the fan the fan was a big loss for

00:04:28.020 For Calgarians, we're really lamenting that one.

00:04:30.660 But I don't know, the centralization, it's just not good.

00:04:35.260 We need Albertans telling Albertans stories, that's for sure.

00:04:38.180 So I'm hopeful to see that there's going to be some news on the horizon

00:04:41.500 of some local markets kind of picking up where the space that this leaves.

00:04:47.080 Yeah, well, I think Lindsay makes a really important point there.

00:04:50.520 I mean, for all of our lives, we've tended to think that the news media are biased.

00:04:55.940 and so they have been

00:04:59.120 but there's one thing that you know

00:05:00.620 that if it's been through the newsroom office

00:05:03.080 they may have taken a slant on it

00:05:06.540 but at least they have ascertained

00:05:09.620 that there is a story there

00:05:11.440 you know

00:05:14.580 we're going to be going back

00:05:16.940 I think to the era 0.96

00:05:18.040 when people say the most ridiculous things 0.55

00:05:20.260 we're there already actually 0.98

00:05:22.980 people say the most ridiculous things

00:05:25.140 and somebody will believe them you know and one thing much as i personally don't like the 0.62

00:05:33.540 editorial position taken by the toronto star and much as i don't trust the cbc entirely

00:05:39.760 to give you a nuanced balanced story of things i do know that serious newspapers

00:05:46.000 are not going to run a story about somebody who ran into elders standing beside a

00:05:51.420 flying saucer with a rhinoceros in the background you know that there are certain basic things that

00:05:57.520 the old media can still do one of the interesting ones is that and i and i almost hate this except

00:06:04.900 that i realize that it's got its value they still define what is a story you know one of the

00:06:10.160 interesting things and one of the things that saddens me is that we might hear of the western

00:06:14.040 standard put out a story and it's the truth and nothing but the truth and it goes out and people

00:06:24.040 say hmm that's interesting 10 days later when the heritage media report the same thing people say

00:06:33.480 oh did you see in the paper that so it's got it's this unfortunate ability that they still have

00:06:39.720 unfortunate for our point of view to define what the story is um so when people like chorus

00:06:47.880 go out of business uh when newspapers go out of business that is what we lose and

00:06:57.720 i say this with some sadness because right now the our federal government is looking for ways

00:07:03.640 to, they call it to get rid of disinformation. That's one of the objects of several of the bills

00:07:11.320 that are going through the House right now. What's getting rid of disinformation? Well,

00:07:16.520 according to them, it could be things that here in Alberta we take very seriously and with good

00:07:20.840 reason. The newspapers, the regular press still has the ability to say, yeah, actually there is

00:07:25.960 a story here. Well, competition used to regulate things. I mean, if a publication was known for

00:07:31.000 misinformation over and over again eventually people would just stop reading or viewing or

00:07:35.320 listening to it but when you have fewer competitors out there to give those alternatives or to hold

00:07:40.520 yet their competitors and check it gets more difficult but another issue and i mean i know

00:07:44.600 like like dave you've got to pick which stories you're going to write which you aren't we're not

00:07:47.800 churning one out every few minutes the temptation or just the reality is too when we talk about

00:07:53.400 local coverage but you want to reach as broad an audience as possible a local story that might be

00:07:58.680 really important to southwest calgary is going to be placed farther down the back burner over

00:08:04.580 something maybe a provincial or national interest because you just have to get those clicks and

00:08:09.700 viewers and broadly do that so i mean this you know really changes the choices that are made

00:08:15.020 in newsrooms i was going to say like how exactly would they sort of people say in alberta that are

00:08:19.540 already skeptical about people that are running media in toronto take to this because for example

00:08:23.900 I mean, if they're doing a story, say, say, I don't know, of course, there's a story on Alberta politics after they've moved everything to Toronto.

00:08:31.100 Well, how do they know? Like, obviously, Alberta is very distinct politically, you know, culturally.

00:08:35.800 They're not going to have people on the ground that really understand what Albertans like are about.

00:08:39.900 So how exactly is that going to work really in essence when I think about it?

00:08:43.020 Because as you said, they're not local.

00:08:45.160 And I mean, they're going to probably tell it through a lens of, well, the reporter, let's be honest, is probably from Toronto, might not have ever been to Alberta.

00:08:51.300 So they're going to probably tell it from an already biased liberal lens.

00:08:54.520 And that's probably just going to get worse now because they don't have anyone on the ground in Alberta, in Calgary, etc.

00:08:59.180 Yeah, we're biased aside. It'd just be less good reporting on the ground.

00:09:02.660 Hopefully they get a couple of stringers.

00:09:04.540 That's what we used to, you know, even people like the Calgary Herald or the Edmonton Journal can't keep reporters everywhere.

00:09:11.340 So, you know, in Camrose, you'd have somebody give you a call and there was a drop fight in the back alley, you know.

00:09:17.420 that so so hopefully chorus will be able to keep that that is we'll just use social media why not

00:09:22.780 see a video on there somebody posted from calgary and that'll be it really yeah well i mean lindsay

00:09:28.300 i'll throw you the easy one what's the solution though where do we go right uh you know how do

00:09:33.420 we make sure people are informed with trustworthy sources of news well i mean first of all i want

00:09:38.700 to say that i'm not a fan of government regulation and and we see the bills c11 c18 and everything

00:09:44.780 you know just throttling free speech so i'm not a fan of the government regulatory approach but

00:09:49.500 you know i i would be open to something that's within the industry to have some real form of

00:09:56.380 accreditation and real accountability because you know when i went to journalism school and when i

00:10:01.100 was a reporter there was really something when i would make a mistake in a print article and the

00:10:09.180 next week i'd have to run a retraction on it right like there's something very humbling about having

00:10:13.660 to go through that experience and journalists don't have to go through that because you can

00:10:16.700 just hit delete backspace you can go into the back end of your website and you can change that

00:10:21.180 but when you come from that school and you come from being trained that way it just makes you

00:10:25.580 even more meticulous in your work and so when i look at kind of like this whole stratosphere we

00:10:31.180 have of online commentators uh from the left to the right and i see a lot of um disinformation

00:10:39.020 from both ends of the spectrum i do think we need to have some kind of um industry body that is is

00:10:47.260 having some level of monitoring this how do we do that and separate it from the government i i haven't

00:10:52.140 come up with that yet but i think we could put our heads together and find something because we need

00:10:56.140 something it is a little too wild west right now and uh and we can't we can't have this well it's

00:11:02.380 up to the individual consuming the news the onus is on these people to determine what is factual

00:11:07.580 not that's not fair that's that's not that's not a correct approach either but i think we need to

00:11:13.000 do something because it is too wild west right now lindsay i think you've said what a lot of people

00:11:18.100 think but i also have to take issue with you on that the day that you have to have a license to

00:11:24.160 be a journalist whether it is issued by the government or by a government-funded industry

00:11:28.760 body which is what we actually have at the moment that is the day that we say goodbye to people

00:11:36.060 having the right to free speech you've got to you you just cannot we better take it away from the

00:11:40.380 person is authorized to speak because they have the right opinions how but how do we do it that

00:11:45.700 we could take it away from the government and it's not connected to the government that's the

00:11:49.160 challenge that i don't know because the only solution has been to regulate it through the

00:11:52.540 government and we know clearly that that's not working no i think what what the solution is

00:11:58.120 we all have to just what's the expression fight fight fight never let the right to publish what

00:12:04.860 you think is the truth i mean take it up with the courts later if you get it wrong and you slander

00:12:10.540 somebody but everybody has the right to free speech and when you start saying well you have

00:12:17.260 the right to free speech but only if we give you this driving license to go on the internet then

00:12:23.340 legitimate opinions are going to be silenced this takes us i don't i won't take you back to the you

00:12:29.180 know the canada of the colonial era but the case of joseph howe for those who know it is absolutely

00:12:34.060 indicative the government said he had no right to say what he said but he was right and proved it 0.97

00:12:39.660 so gee i'm glad you're on the show today that's uh this is this is well and a contemporary as we

00:12:46.620 kind of close off this part and humbling example i want to offer though with new outlets and new

00:12:51.500 ways of doing things and it's not a scam i'm sure derek would want me to pick but it's worth uh

00:12:56.300 showing the learning curve when the western standard was in its early years we chased a

00:12:59.980 story that turned out to be very inaccurate and we pit the publish button before we should have

00:13:06.620 and it led to a very embarrassing retraction and a whole bunch of other things which was

00:13:11.020 awful and not good a lesson we shouldn't have had to learn i guess but what i kind of take heart

00:13:15.740 from was our readers were furious and they let us know and our subscriptions took a hit like people

00:13:23.420 unsubscribed over that because they did not appreciate being fed something inaccurate

00:13:27.580 but that really let us know they are watching and there's a degree of self-policing from the

00:13:33.660 readers and viewers that if you are chronically and we aren't that was a one-off we learned very

00:13:39.440 well from that and certainly changed that never happened again but they're the ones who punished

00:13:43.540 us not a regulatory body or anything else they were saying if you're going to do that to us

00:13:47.220 you better find funding somewhere else because i'm not paying for a subscription so

00:13:50.940 gives a little bit of hope anyways i mean i i like to have some optimism so i'll i'll flip

00:13:57.220 into something different here fascist pancakes good lord on there i know i had to that's for

00:14:03.860 dave because he likes his his cheesy wordplay we don't have him here today uh i should probably

00:14:09.300 save this for a parting shot but you know fascist pancakes to me on the video they look fairly fat

00:14:14.660 what would coffee pancakes be like really thin enough it would be rationed and we would all be

00:14:22.980 on a diet anyone's but i mean mussolini was famous for his pancakes people don't know that

00:14:29.320 little tidbit but uh oh the italian breakfast they'd have at their stampede gatherings were

00:14:35.040 unknown but you know it gets to that you know the term fascist is being so liberally applied 0.58

00:14:44.460 thrown out at everybody people kind of laughed it off when this lunatic appreciation i shall let you

00:14:50.020 kind of lay out that story and where we're going probably talk about charlie kirk and whatnot

00:14:53.660 because they kept well it seems like the left now and labels everyone who disagrees with them on any

00:14:58.180 little thing fascist and these let's be honest these are people that don't know anything about

00:15:01.580 fascism or national socialism probably they don't know anything about any of these policies and i'm

00:15:05.200 trying to figure out how they'd figure that danielle smith is a fascist when she's pro-capitalist pro

00:15:10.200 free market it's like trump they go on about him being a nazi and he's buddy buddy with israel and

00:15:14.340 jews i'm like how exactly does this one work it's just basically just a term basically in my opinion

00:15:19.320 in essence, just to refer to someone as the big bad. 0.95

00:15:21.840 And it basically enables them, like you say, to dehumanize basically anyone they disagree with,

00:15:26.100 because Nazi apparently, obviously, well, is the big bad for the last eight years.

00:15:29.460 So then they think that it's okay to use violence against them.

00:15:32.180 That's basically what happened with Charlie Kirk. 0.96

00:15:33.500 They just kept referring to him as a Nazi, Nazi fascist. 0.50

00:15:36.100 And then look what happened.

00:15:37.260 Well, and the back story to this a little bit was at a pancake breakfast for K-Days in Edmonton,

00:15:41.840 Premier Smith was flipping pancakes and a lunatic chronic protester, some Michaela gal,

00:15:47.240 came up and and uh you know had a a fit and as she was dragged away yelled out f your 0.67

00:15:53.560 fastest pancakes but the thing that isn't as disturbing as this particular one fruit loop

00:15:59.300 doing this but some other elected officials embracing it uh you know lindsey i'm certain 0.91

00:16:05.140 you saw our uh member of parliament representing the ndp in edmonton proudly sipping from her

00:16:11.160 coffee mug she quickly had made to celebrate this little incident i think it was the first

00:16:16.520 image I saw when I clicked online that morning because this is about what three mornings ago or

00:16:21.280 something like that a few days ago now but I I watched it and then I watched it again and I think

00:16:26.680 I even I don't often comment but I did comment in I mean it's shameful it's disgusting uh for the

00:16:35.100 sake of the readers I'm just going to read the definition of fascism fascism is an authoritarian

00:16:39.400 authoritarian, ultra-nationalist political ideology that prioritize the nation above the

00:16:45.160 individual. It is characterized by dictatorial power, the suppression of political opposition,

00:16:50.960 and strict state control over society and the economy. None of which these things have been

00:16:56.800 displayed by our Premier Daniel Smith. So we like to throw around these terms. The left likes to

00:17:03.240 throw around fascists. And to be fair, the right likes to throw around communists. These things

00:17:07.900 are i think we're a little closer to communist communism in our society certainly than fascist

00:17:15.580 ideals in our society but this is so off base but what it really does it's so detrimental

00:17:21.660 you know i always keep one foot in the normal world right i'm out there with hockey parents

00:17:25.980 i'm out there with other moms my friends who are non-political and the reason that they don't show

00:17:30.860 up to vote particularly in municipal elections is because they feel like it's so hateful and

00:17:35.740 vitriolic so this like when we're starting to do things like this that are just so obscene

00:17:41.260 it's gross behavior it's certainly not appropriate for children it's just normalizing this really

00:17:47.180 heavy intense vitriol and it's so bad it translates to the electorate in such a negative and toxic

00:17:53.900 way it does not inspire people to get out and volunteer and door knock let alone to vote and

00:17:59.340 it does not do anything for democracy so i was really disappointed to see this and then i was

00:18:06.460 really disappointed to see some of the ndp constituency associations play on these words

00:18:12.860 of the here fascist pancakes and the branding and the the message behind that i just i was really

00:18:18.460 in shock they went with this i understand this party has become extraordinarily negative

00:18:23.180 under the leadership of nahed nenshi it's a very different tone than it was under uh rachel

00:18:28.220 Notley, but their polling is not doing so well for them. So I don't know why they think that

00:18:33.060 this negativity is being embraced by Albertans in general. I mean, it's really bananas.

00:18:38.740 I can't make any sense of it. You know, what I'm seeing here is

00:18:44.820 the outpourings, the outworkings of a book that came out in the 1960s, Rules for Radicals,

00:18:52.640 a guy by the name of Saul Alinsky. As you're going back, Lindsay, into your definition of

00:18:57.200 fascism, which is entirely accurate. 0.58

00:19:03.220 What did Alinsky say? 0.86

00:19:04.480 Alinsky said that if you want to change a democratic society, don't get into the war

00:19:10.340 of ideas because you will lose.

00:19:16.240 The democratic society is a good way to live.

00:19:19.400 So therefore you have to demonize your opponents.

00:19:23.980 You have to call them fascists, and fascists, as you just said, can mean anything you want

00:19:29.700 it to mean.

00:19:31.080 But it's always something bad.

00:19:34.080 This girl who uttered the phrase about the fascist plan case is not a debater.

00:19:40.780 She is an accuser.

00:19:43.540 And that is the way that, unfortunately, the entire political spectrum is now dividing.

00:19:49.860 I mean, I have to say that you mentioned that sometimes the right calls people communists.

00:19:55.180 They're probably right more often than they're wrong, but it's still not a well-argued, thought-out, carefully articulated commentary.

00:20:04.040 It's just, get out of my face, commie.

00:20:07.100 So we have, in other words, this society split down the middle.

00:20:13.840 Neither side knows much.

00:20:16.220 one side is particularly prone to violence because they are on the outside looking in

00:20:22.820 and you saw a perfect example of it that is actually extremely distressing for our democracy

00:20:28.640 right now well it's dangerous and and you know a lot of dangerous that thought exercise a lot

00:20:34.400 of people do you know if you could go back in time and you know find hitler and kill him before

00:20:38.600 world war ii would you do so and such unfortunately i think that's kind of the thing that comes into

00:20:42.960 the unhinged minds of the occasional person and when they've really actually convinced themselves

00:20:47.800 that this politician or that public figure may be the next mass murderer they feel that they're

00:20:54.180 you know they're they gotta screw loose they're they think they're doing the world a favor

00:20:57.340 by taking them out like we shouldn't tolerate this did you guys watch the video did you watch

00:21:02.380 the video of this yes i don't even want to say her name because i don't want to give any more

00:21:06.240 airtime to these lunatics so let's just not even say her name the person who's recording this i

00:21:10.760 watched it on that breakdown and the honestly I was left like I mean like that like the hair stood 0.63

00:21:17.640 up on the back of my neck because I thought if these people keep going like this somebody's

00:21:21.900 going to hurt this premier the rage like they're just you could feel this woman just shaking and

00:21:27.140 the rage towards the premier who's as always very calm and collected it's uh it's really disturbing

00:21:33.680 so um I'm not a big fan on government spending more on on a whole lot of things but I'm okay

00:21:39.280 with them upping her security detail for security for sure but as i said you know the names didn't

00:21:44.340 come up but i'm going to name them janice erwin and heather mcpherson who are both elected officials

00:21:49.320 on two levels of government who both celebrated this they celebrated it and propagated it further

00:21:55.160 you know that's a new level of irresponsibility i mean these are people who are at a different

00:22:00.600 level of of what should be a respectability they they would both get thrown out of the

00:22:05.120 legislatures that they speak in if they use that term on the floor to describe an opponent,

00:22:11.420 but they feel that they can embrace that sort of attitude right now.

00:22:14.300 So here's a question for you, Corey. What do you think it would have done for NDP popularity if

00:22:19.340 either one of those individuals had come out after the incident and said, look, we have our

00:22:24.080 disagreements with Premier Smith, and there are many. However, there are limits to what we're

00:22:30.980 prepared to support and this was way past anything that we could support we are sorry for the premier

00:22:37.000 having this awkward moment and we frankly have no sympathy for the person involved i think it

00:22:41.560 would have done them well with voters in their scores would have gone up yes right rational

00:22:45.540 people for the most part yeah what do you think that they actually believe this themselves or do

00:22:50.140 you really think that they are just pandering to like a certain part of their base and how big is

00:22:53.600 this it's like the far real radical left base of the ndp that would agree that daniel smith is a

00:22:58.380 fascist that's what i've been trying to figure out i don't know if you listen to heather mcpherson

00:23:01.360 i i yeah i mean erwin i she's actually pretty rational when she starts speaking you know 0.68

00:23:08.200 she is a bright woman she's definitely way over on the left fringe but mcpherson she's pretty 0.99

00:23:13.920 if you listen to her you're getting some pretty crazed rhetoric out of that lady so i i think she

00:23:19.000 might be able to or speculating uh you know i don't want to speculate on them being true believers

00:23:23.200 of an extreme ideology or i'm starting to become as irresponsible as they are i guess but but they

00:23:28.080 really should know better than to to promote this you know the way much as we disagree with mark

00:23:34.000 carney we do try to um express it by referring to him as mr carney and not as uh carney or mr

00:23:42.000 trudeau of course got several epithets directed as weibo we don't sell coffee mugs we don't sell

00:23:49.600 the coffee mugs no no but i mean and again you could search my twitter scroll i'm an inflammatory 0.98

00:23:57.360 jerk online. I call people a lot of things and make fun of them. I spoke of Trudeau being pegged 0.93

00:24:02.080 recently. I'll let others look up what that means. But the difference is, you know, out of all of

00:24:09.460 those things, I've never called him a communist. Because he isn't. He's many, many things. But

00:24:16.720 Trudeau wasn't a communist. So I just don't go there. So even somebody as belligerent as myself

00:24:22.480 knows better than to cross that bigger line, you know, because that would also be dangerously

00:24:27.680 dehumanizing Trudeau or Kearney, you know, trying to compare them to Mao Zedong or Joseph Stalin.

00:24:36.880 It's not a valid comparison to make with them. I call Trudeau an idiot, and I think I can make 1.00

00:24:41.320 a very good case for it. But communist, no. But that's where the rhetoric's going. I, you know, 1.00

00:24:47.120 it's always been around, I think, to a degree, but social media really helps inflame it.

00:24:51.980 Well, definitely. Well, let's get on to an easy subject, Trump. And we've got more tariffs or more tariff threats. I got to admit this, this broken record of this endless threats and back and forth and, and pushing, you know, between Trump and the federal government. What's going on now?

00:25:14.520 Well, I'll give you my best shot, Corey, but this is actually, as you said, a pretty big subject.

00:25:21.600 So back in Harper's time, there was a deal.

00:25:24.800 We were going to build a second bridge.

00:25:26.160 Right now, there's one in operation, the Ambassador Bridge,

00:25:29.660 and there's something like $4 billion worth of goods going backwards and forwards

00:25:33.860 over the Ambassador Bridge every single day.

00:25:37.580 That's what's at issue here.

00:25:39.940 So there's kind of a lot of eggs to have in one basket,

00:25:42.120 plus the American ownership of the Ambassador Bridge

00:25:46.100 didn't always make things easy for us.

00:25:49.920 So the decision was taken.

00:25:50.980 There would be a second bridge.

00:25:52.420 The deal was done.

00:25:53.880 We decided to call it the Gordie Howe Bridge,

00:25:56.140 a good sell in Canada for major project infrastructure.

00:26:01.020 And the deal was originally that Canada would get the tolls

00:26:04.220 until they had paid for the bridge

00:26:05.920 because we have permission to put the other side on American soil

00:26:09.680 they're not contributing to the finances of it well then they finished the bridge now mr trump

00:26:17.280 is is president and he the thing to know about there's a lot of things to know about trump and

00:26:23.760 in fact there's a chap just published a book uh called negotiating with trump and sort of

00:26:30.160 the quick calls notes on that is that he said look trump is not actually a long-term thinker

00:26:34.880 he'd like you to think he was but he's not he's opportunistic and he's always looking for a win

00:26:41.040 and the win is just for him it's like winning a is winning the soccer match or something like that

00:26:47.360 you play the game it's done you grab the trophy and you're on to the next thing this this is a

00:26:53.120 trumpian win so somebody said mr president the canadians have just built a bridge and we're not

00:27:03.440 getting anything out of it that is like lighting the blue touch paper and he was off and so we've

00:27:11.920 got a reason well i guess we need to have something i need a win give me money and i i gather the

00:27:18.960 original deal was that uh they were going to take 50 of the tolls and just take that much longer to

00:27:26.160 uh to build a thing you know unfortunately mr carney let that happen because we want wins as

00:27:34.400 well in this country and there are things that the americans want like critical minerals

00:27:43.440 like us taking a higher profile in continental defense

00:27:48.160 that we could have levered to get our own win but we didn't so we basically gave away the farm

00:28:00.460 this is how i interpret it um and the and uh mr trump's goal said all right if you're going to

00:28:10.580 roll over i'm going to walk over the top of you which is what he's doing right now mr trump's

00:28:16.520 And actions make perfect sense if you are an American, if you are a Canadian, that's something we should have been resisting more strongly.

00:28:24.420 Well, I mean, where, you know, this is one of the areas I'm not typically sympathetic to Mr. Carney, and I think he's done some terrible things in response.

00:28:32.200 I want to go into that a little later because he's kind of eating a whole lot of his own words or dodging eating his own words right now.

00:28:37.760 But what on earth do you do when trying to negotiate with somebody like President Trump?

00:28:43.560 are any agreements worth the value of what they were saying i mean it was 2012 when that agreement

00:28:48.780 came about uh you know like lindsey what's a prime minister supposed to do you know when you're

00:28:55.040 dealing with somebody like the orange man south of the border well i'll tell you what he's not

00:29:00.160 supposed to do is is to be reactive like you know premier ford is i mean all i really want to add

00:29:06.700 to this is that i really think and i love to see this western alliance that's shaping up certainly

00:29:11.720 with the the election of the new bc conservative um party leader carolyn finley and i think that

00:29:19.080 i think that her approach and premier daniel smith's approach is probably the most level-headed

00:29:24.000 right you don't take a knife to a gunfight don't poke the bear retaliatory tariffs are not where

00:29:29.780 it's at you know you're gonna have to give trump the win somehow or make you know at least the win

00:29:38.820 at least because that's how it is and you know he's bigger and bolder and and uh he he will win

00:29:44.900 so why make it worse but retaliatory tariffs and you know like little things like what they did

00:29:50.340 in bc pulling all the american booze off the shelves like things like that don't really

00:29:54.940 that it just it just flames it just it uh fans the flames you know lindsay isn't it interesting

00:30:03.960 that Mr Carney will go to the wall for supply management so that we all pay more than we have

00:30:09.880 to for eggs and butter and milk and dairy products. He went as far as putting that into legislation

00:30:15.960 that whatever happened next, this was not up for sale. But he yields on important, he gives

00:30:23.080 important concessions on this bloody bridge. Where are his priorities? And you probably have a theory

00:30:29.800 on that. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if I have a lot to lend to that. I think both governments

00:30:34.200 are lying to us. It's the best I can come up with. It's easily a safe bet. Any more independent

00:30:41.400 journalists? Yes. I mean, you know, in trying to cover it, though, I mean, I'll go into that other

00:30:48.240 part. And, you know, David, there's something you get to work on. You can kind of hit for the first

00:30:53.160 time. I think this is one of the hugest stumbles, though. Carney's made since becoming prime

00:30:58.080 minister he's actually been pretty good at just staying steady he's not getting anything bloody

00:31:01.440 accomplished but he still seems to ride above things but he went sprinting from a press conference

00:31:07.560 he is hiding from questions right now he looks dejected and i mean i just think some of his

00:31:13.960 quotes only on july 16th saying there will be no toll or profit sharing until canada's debt is

00:31:20.500 repaid and the question people are asking because the agreement came up the new agreement came up

00:31:25.620 prior to that yeah so are you incompetent or are you lying mr prime minister and and uh he won't

00:31:31.540 answer the question because there's no good answer to it's probably a good possibility he was lying

00:31:35.540 but i mean i was looking here as well like apparently he said canada is now in a stronger

00:31:38.780 position than it was when the trade conflict began and trump started putting tariffs on us

00:31:42.480 months ago how does he figure that exactly like we have like you were talking about before how

00:31:46.600 do you deal with trump well trump always goes for the zero-sum game you basically are going to have

00:31:50.080 to let him have what he wants in order to get a deal otherwise he's just going to keep slapping

00:31:53.380 tariffs on you taking them off like he's been doing for several months now and i just don't

00:31:58.940 really know where it goes from here it's the whole idea as well like do we really want to keep pissing

00:32:02.740 off the americans when what is it 90 of our exports go to the states it's like that whole

00:32:07.300 what was it was it pierre trudeau that talked about the elephant and the mouse the economy

00:32:11.720 it's like the american economy is the elephant we're the mouse we're not going to do anything

00:32:15.700 basically against him like doug ford said i want to go to tariff war with him that's going to backfire

00:32:20.120 horribly like our whole auto industry that's struggling anyway is going to be gone if we keep

00:32:23.720 putting tariffs on everything that it's just i don't see how we come out of this except giving

00:32:27.600 trump basically what he wants really at the end of the day i mean we can maybe like finesse that

00:32:32.100 but and doug ford is is just out of control to be blunt i i saw brad waltz slapped him down nice and

00:32:39.200 hard online and scott moe did a fairly good thing too premier smith i think has been too too polite

00:32:43.500 to the individual right now because doug ford is threatening trump with our industries now we're

00:32:49.380 starting to get into a unity issue in Canada because Doug Ford's saying, he's claiming that

00:32:53.240 the Western provinces aren't pulling their weight, if you listen to that conference, with the trade

00:32:57.280 deal with the United States. And he's saying that, you know, our potash, our oil, our gas should now

00:33:02.920 be on the table to try and push back. It's nice. Thanks, Doug, for saying you're going to sacrifice

00:33:07.460 our industries, you equalization receiving bum, because you blew it with your negotiations and

00:33:13.820 putting money into subsidized battery plants that nobody wants in and out that we paid for as well

00:33:19.720 out there. And I tell you, for independence advocates like me, keep it up, Doug. It's gold

00:33:25.900 because every time you open your flaccid lips and put that crap out, my support goes up another few 1.00

00:33:32.000 percent. But there's a lot of ongoing damage being caused through this thing beyond just the north 0.99

00:33:38.200 south when doug ford starts taking it east west i'm sorry cory did you say that there is a politician

00:33:44.400 in ottawa or in ontario making decisions for us in alberta yeah i know it's unprecedented isn't it

00:33:51.820 i never heard of such a thing but i mean that that really turns this into a bigger mess we

00:33:58.680 are in the middle i mean this country is as disunified as it's ever been i think in any of

00:34:02.800 our lifetimes, except maybe some pre-confederation individuals around here. But it's really not

00:34:10.580 necessarily a responsible time to start stirring up the unity pot. And that's what Ford has gone

00:34:16.380 and done. You know, he was hand in hand recently with Premier Smith talking about maybe having a

00:34:21.700 pipeline going from Alberta to Ontario. Maybe that's why Premier Smith didn't speak up like

00:34:26.380 uh scott moe did and brad wall and in chastening ford but this is not responsible behavior well

00:34:34.240 he's not been responsible since uh trump came to the start of his second term he's been he thinks

00:34:40.960 that people who support him in ontario want him to be combative and to be you know mr carney thought

00:34:48.620 of the term elbows up luckily he dropped it fairly soon after but i guess mr ford has not had the

00:34:55.880 message because he just reacts the kind of things he said are designed it seems to draw their action

00:35:03.300 yeah you tell them doug well it's fine you can say that but it's not going to help back it up

00:35:10.780 yeah well you've got no force to back it up that's part of it i mean it's a tough spot you know it's

00:35:16.480 true when dealing with a bully i mean if you back down it's only going to get worse and trump does

00:35:20.700 respond i think better to people he respects who he feels are on some solid ground are you saying

00:35:25.260 any respects Doug Ford? No, not a bit. And that's part of the problem. So if Doug's kind of posture

00:35:30.460 like that and act like that, but with a man who doesn't, I think just getting to the point of

00:35:34.960 viscerally disliking him, it's only making it worse. But I mean, again, where the hell do you go?

00:35:42.780 Yeah, exactly. I fear for a tariff being slapped on our stuff out in the West. I mean, part of what

00:35:49.040 I saw also out of Doug Ford, in my view, was dripping envy. Because yes, we have not been

00:35:55.400 hit as hard with the tariffs, with the potash and the resource items out here that the manufacturing

00:36:00.780 sector in central Canada has. But couldn't part of that be due to the fact that we didn't have

00:36:05.280 a premier who was constantly beaking over the border and ticking off the man who's going to

00:36:10.980 bring those in? I was going to say, well, sorry, go ahead. It could also be that actually the United

00:36:15.980 States once. Well, that's part of it too. The oil, the potash, whereas they'd be quite happy to make

00:36:21.780 their own motor cars. I was going to say as well, I think Alberta and Saskatchewan haven't taken

00:36:25.440 American liquor off the shelves. You think that maybe has something to do with it too? It's like

00:36:29.000 they've kept all the American products on there. I know it's a small thing, but I mean, Trump

00:36:32.200 probably is aware of that. And he's like, okay, well, they haven't done that. We want their oil

00:36:35.260 and gas. So it all plays one sort of role in the bigger picture, I guess, maybe. Well, I mean, yeah,

00:36:40.240 And the liquor removal is, you know, a symbolic thing.

00:36:43.780 I mean, it's certainly not, you know, crushing anybody except maybe Elizabeth May, who can't get her favorite bourbon any longer.

00:36:49.560 But aside from that, you know, the American producers aren't hurting out of this.

00:36:54.540 But those are the sorts of things that get under President Trump's skin.

00:36:59.400 And then he responds worse.

00:37:02.280 But again, fair enough, you look like you're capitulating if you don't do anything, though.

00:37:07.700 I mean, there's where I offer.

00:37:09.500 that initial point though there are things that we have that they actually do want

00:37:14.300 well yes but they're out here in the west and doug's talking about using those as his levers

00:37:18.780 that's right mr carney is capable of rising above that he is not an ontario representative he is a

00:37:27.740 canada representative and if it's in canada's best interests to remind mr trump that there

00:37:34.300 are things in saskatchewan that he would like there are energy sources in alberta that he would like

00:37:40.940 you know well and then that comes with the consequence then you know i'll light my hair on

00:37:45.340 fire uh fundraising for my little group that i got on the go will shoot up and and a referendum

00:37:51.820 that looks like it might be 30 to 40 support might start moving towards i didn't set this up

00:37:57.420 no but i'm going to steer everything into it hey i didn't put the url out for donations yet or

00:38:02.300 anything shameless plug for self-promotion but no i i'm warning them against doing it on my behalf

00:38:11.760 like this but that that's a part of the position that's difficult for the prime minister as well

00:38:16.940 i mean starting to use western resources as leverage you know there's going to be a pretty

00:38:22.360 swift response on the part of people on the ground out here but uh lindsey maybe you can

00:38:28.000 explain though, boy, Premier Smith's been uncharacteristically quiet on this whole thing.

00:38:33.700 What's going on there? I just think that she's in it for the long game. This is like flip-flopped

00:38:39.780 and, you know, we'll see, are these tariffs, is it coming, ahead, the bridge, all of this stuff.

00:38:46.220 I think she's in it for the long game. And I think she's done some really commendable work

00:38:51.380 developing good relationships, North and South. And I think, you know, maybe Premier Ford could

00:38:57.680 take note but um i'm not saying she knows more than we do but i like to think all elected officials

00:39:02.640 know more than we do and on some degree and we know more than them on others but uh yeah i think

00:39:07.760 she just sees like again you don't take a knife to a gunfight and like this too shall pass and

00:39:13.840 you know set trump up trump up for some kind of a win right get that bridge open let's just go

00:39:20.100 and yeah you're the big guy you win and i think um i think she's just being very patient and

00:39:26.380 her time with all of this. And diplomatically, Premier Smith has been quite smart all the way

00:39:32.560 through. I mean, since becoming Premier, I think for the most part. But I mean, she's also painted

00:39:38.380 herself into some corners here as well. I mean, often the role of a Premier in Alberta is expected

00:39:43.600 if, you know, not to be an independent supporter, but to take an adversarial role with the federal

00:39:48.540 government, at least be critical of them. But she's been very close with the Prime Minister

00:39:53.700 for a while which i think is costing her some conservative points out here i understand being

00:39:58.420 purely adversarial all the time isn't beneficial you have to work with who's in but eventually

00:40:03.780 she's going to start showing a little bit of teeth with ottawa that's part of why i wonder

00:40:07.540 maybe she hasn't spoken up on this when you've got an eastern premier threatening our resources

00:40:13.700 as a leverage bar yep uh that's that may be the job of the independent journalists to point that

00:40:21.220 But, oh, we will. 1.00

00:40:23.840 She's probably in a position where she's better off to stay a little bit quiet until after the referendum on this kind of business.

00:40:29.360 That's what I'm thinking is it has been a very charged time.

00:40:32.840 And there's, you know, at the end of the day, we want a better deal for Albertans, whatever way that ends up looking like.

00:40:38.560 But, you know, this is the democratic process and it's being put to, you know, this this referendum and these questions.

00:40:45.480 And I think probably just drawing more attention to that.

00:40:49.480 It's just, it's, it's a very divisive thing right now.

00:40:52.220 So strategically, if I was one of her advisors, I'd, I'd tell her to just hang back a little

00:40:56.780 bit longer, but you're right.

00:40:58.040 Eventually something has to come through and, and, and she's going to have to, you know, 1.00

00:41:03.880 put her teeth in when it comes to Ottawa and not coming through with their end on things.

00:41:08.060 Yeah.

00:41:08.480 Well, we'll watch the coverage as this unfolds.

00:41:10.900 I, I, just to tie this into our legacy media outlets, our beloved stalwarts out there still

00:41:16.120 remaining. I read a CTV story on this today. And boy, do they ever bend over backwards to kind of

00:41:23.120 sugarcoat what seems to have happened with the prime minister. But the language, I had to cut

00:41:27.100 this out of the CBC story when they referred to CTV, I should say, which is becoming a little

00:41:33.880 better than CBC, it seems these days. But they referred to conflicting messaging and said that,

00:41:40.660 you know, the events contrasts previous comments made by Prime Minister Mark Carney is such nice

00:41:47.080 words to say he was lying through his teeth. And I understand that it's not the place of a news

00:41:52.140 outlet to come out and call the Prime Minister a liar. But holy cow, guys, contrasts previous

00:41:59.280 comments made by Prime Minister Mark Carney. I mean, come on. Which one of his speechwriters

00:42:05.800 gave you that one oh that's but i guess so delicate yes they reported on it a little bit they had to

00:42:13.080 i mean the bottom line is because it contrasted rather sharply so oh well that's the place for

00:42:18.520 me to go online and just remind people of how to translate that word salad well i'll tell you what

00:42:23.640 gory you know the the ctv has got the same global got the same issues to deal with as uh chorus i

00:42:32.600 don't think they're quite so far around the drain as chorus is but uh they're they're getting money

00:42:39.240 from the federal government through the fund well you want to be respectful i don't want to rock

00:42:45.320 that boat all right well let's get to the parting shots and a few things i i hope you have one

00:42:49.880 lindsay i'm not sure if you were prepped for this yes well let's let's i'll leave you with one on

00:42:55.720 on the liquor sales direct to consumer.

00:43:00.240 If I'm a big fan of this, right?

00:43:02.980 If we can trust Albertans to pick their own home insurance

00:43:06.380 and internet providers, I think that we can entrust them

00:43:10.560 to pick their purveyor for a bottle of vino.

00:43:14.380 Absolutely.

00:43:15.480 It's astounding that that had to be controversial.

00:43:19.360 All right, Mr. Winnick, what do you got?

00:43:21.540 This has to do with the Kerpan, the seek ceremonial blade.

00:43:24.880 I'm sure you guys know there was a big controversy about this Sikh man went into a good life fitness place in Windsor, Ontario and got turned away by the female employee because he was wearing it out in the open.

00:43:34.420 And this is bringing up a whole controversy relating to the legislation, which I think from the Supreme Court's 2006, the Maltani ruling that said that they can, Sikhs can have a kirpan on them, on their person in public places, but it has to be concealed.

00:43:48.820 so basically under clothing and you see so many videos now of them wearing it out in the open

00:43:54.060 and it's just bringing in like questions about are the rcmp going to start checking these kerpens to

00:43:58.800 see if they can be opened and unsheathed because they're supposed to not be allowed to do that or

00:44:02.420 able to do that they're supposed to be under clothing so people are wondering are the rcmp

00:44:06.200 going to start actually enforcing the supreme court's decision and they're going to maybe start

00:44:11.060 talking about maybe hopefully maybe re-looking at that legislation again because it's 20 years old

00:44:15.620 now so yeah well let's see yeah i think the first time i heard about it i was told by a 0.82

00:44:22.080 seeker look you can have one that small you can have one on a channel and that just goes in your 0.97

00:44:26.320 in your turban you know you've met your religious obligations so you know my parting my parting

00:44:32.700 shot has got to got to do with the federal government's ever increasing number of bills

00:44:38.880 that affect the way we think and what we're allowed to think and what we're allowed to say

00:44:42.940 we're not allowed to do keep an eye on bill c34 the digital safety act they're selling it

00:44:52.460 as something to keep young people from looking at internet pornography in fact they're creating a

00:45:00.960 new super office of the digital safety commissioner with no statutory rules everything to be

00:45:08.140 determined after the bill is passed by orders in council. In other words, the cabinet can just say,

00:45:13.320 we need to do this, we need to do that. And by the way, we can now define what hate speech is,

00:45:19.700 and you have no comeback against it through the law. This is very, very serious. Keep an eye on it.

00:45:26.920 All right. And I'll just hit with a quick one on our Honorable Paula Simons, Trudeau-appointed

00:45:32.700 senator who went on to a British Columbia

00:45:35.560 podcast and mentioned not once but twice

00:45:39.180 about going elbows up. And one of the two times, though,

00:45:42.040 wasn't even elbows up with President Trump. It was elbows up

00:45:45.100 against Albertans who were considering independence.

00:45:48.440 So really embracing that whole elbows up

00:45:50.920 attitude and at least showing us all why 0.95

00:45:53.780 a person like her had to be appointed to office because there's no bloody way 1.00

00:45:56.740 Albertans ever would have elected her to it.

00:45:59.380 Alright, I'll leave it at that. Thank you very much, Lindsay,

00:46:02.500 for joining us today to add a much-needed better-looking perspective

00:46:09.680 to our usual lineup here.

00:46:12.260 And Dave and Nigel, thank you very much.

00:46:15.840 It was a pleasure.

00:46:16.780 And, well, thank all of you for tuning in.

00:46:19.500 We will see you on the pipeline again next week at this time,

00:46:23.680 and I'm certain to have a whole new batch of issues to dissect for you.

00:46:27.580 So thank you again for tuning in, and we'll see you then.

00:46:32.500 We'll be right back.

Western Standard - July 23, 2026

Carney clams up on Gordie Howe bridge deal

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