00:01:00.000Hey, everybody. Welcome to a special broadcast just after our weekly live broadcast. I'm
00:01:13.040chatting with Franco Terrizano, the Canadian Taxpayers Federation. They put out a press
00:01:18.500release today on some stuff they got from a FOIP request that is really worth talking
00:01:24.360about in these tough times because we're just seeing so many areas of a double standard,
00:01:29.240as the common folks are struggling and the not-so-common folks seem to be still benefiting and doing well.
00:01:36.040So good to see you, Franco. Can you expand a bit on what you guys released today?
00:01:40.780Yeah, for sure. Well, thank you so much first for having me on, Corey.
00:01:43.520So we got Freedom of Information requests back from the Alberta government.
00:01:47.960And, you know, 2020 has been really such a tough year.
00:01:51.460But economically, it's clear that we're really not all in this together, right?
00:01:55.680So we've had people who have lost their jobs, we've had people who have taken pay cuts, we've had businesses close down their doors, but we found more than 7,000 provincial government bureaucrats that received a raise in 2020, right? During the lockdowns, during the economic nosedive. And why that's so important is that that means families and businesses who are struggling are going to have to pay higher taxes for this, right? And, you know, we are struggling. We need relief. We don't need bigger bureaucrat salaries here in Alberta.
00:02:26.340Yeah, well, at a time like this, we're all taking cuts.
00:02:47.420But really, that's just the tip of the iceberg, right?
00:02:49.240Because that freedom of information request that we put in, we also asked for the cost
00:02:53.760going back to 2015 for pay raises. And we found out that those costs are $245 million. So since
00:03:01.6602015, when the downturn really began in Alberta, Alberta taxpayers have had to pay an extra $245
00:03:08.720million for bureaucrat pay hikes in the provincial government. Yeah, and you would think with a,
00:03:16.180I mean, the scaling down has got to come soon. I mean, we've, everything else is contracting,
00:03:22.440We can't afford to keep increasing and increasing, not just the pay rates, but the numbers of these people.
00:03:28.140Do you think there might be a willingness on the part finally, though, for some of these for the government to show the will to start cutting things?
00:03:35.600And perhaps some of the union has to realize if we don't stop this excessive compensation for bureaucrats and some of these civil servants,
00:03:42.120that we're going to have to start just outright laying them off eventually.
00:03:45.020Well, I mean, Premier Jason Kenney has to tackle the labor costs here.
00:03:48.900Right. So by the end of the year, we're looking at one hundred billion dollars in provincial government debt.
00:03:53.820So the obvious question is, how are we going to pay for all of this?
00:03:56.420And it's just it's not fair to be asking struggling families who are having a tough time just getting groceries on the table,
00:04:03.460living from paycheck to paycheck or to go to small businesses and ask them to pay higher taxes because government bureaucrats and government union bosses don't want to take a pay hike.
00:04:12.940Right. So just in terms of fairness, it's time for the provincial government.
00:04:16.460it's time for kenny to cut back these costs but then we also have to look at the budget problem
00:04:20.620you know i talk about that 100 billion dollars in debt that we're going to have to pay back well
00:04:25.140you know the biggest expense the biggest day-to-day expense for the alberta government
00:04:28.980is this labor costs so as a really premier kenny um our finance minister travis taves they have
00:04:34.300very little option um to balance the budget if they're not willing to take some air out of these
00:04:39.900ballooning labor costs yeah so we're getting a well we've seen a lot of it with the do as they
00:04:45.980say, not as I do. And we'd really need to see some leadership by example. I mean, we've seen
00:04:51.180that with the recent vacationing elected officials and staffers. And now, again, we're seeing it with
00:04:57.700a different class of folks, but they're still enjoying job security, plus actual increases
00:05:04.060in compensation at a time like this. So you guys have also been pushing for something that might
00:05:08.620help spur our government to feel a little more inclined to listen to the electorate between
00:05:12.340elections uh can you expand a bit on that yeah so i mean we're all we're all upset with this uh
00:05:18.100this vacationing scandal right and we have every right to be upset here i mean these politicians
00:05:23.700they they they lock down businesses uh people people's jobs might be at risk from that they ask
00:05:29.300families to spend the holidays apart and then we find out these some politicians have been traveling
00:05:34.580abroad and you know people are really upset but the key is how are we going to move forward with
00:05:38.820this and at the kane taxpayers federation we think that this shows that we need recall legislation
00:05:44.340in alberta right because right now we have to wait until 2023 to hold politicians accountable
00:05:49.700and yeah sure um there was a cabinet minister that lost her position there and yes there was
00:05:54.660some mlas who lost their committee positions but at the end of the day the real question is should
00:05:59.300these mlas continue to be mlas and only albertans us voters only we have the right to make that
00:06:05.940decision and the only way that we can make that decision unless we wait for 2023 is by having
00:06:11.300recall well on a number of fronts i think we should have it i mean for one the ucp government
00:06:16.420promised to give it to us so uh you know we kind of want it before the end of your term it really
00:06:21.140doesn't mean anything uh in the same sense i could almost see this as a good time for
00:06:26.980jason kenny and the ucp fine to give it to us because he's under a lot of pressure we've seen
00:06:30.740with some Western Standard polling that Albertans want more done to these MLAs and elected officials
00:06:37.380who've been vacationing while we're locked in our homes due to their legislation. This way,
00:06:43.220in a sense, politically, he can hand it off. Say, well, it is up to Albertans. Here you go. Here's
00:06:46.720the legislation. If it really is that odious, you can fire your elected official. But I don't know
00:06:54.180if we're going to see that coming. It's a promise. They seem to have slid under the back burner. I
00:06:59.400think even on their website they made the recall promise disappear well i mean this this whole
00:07:04.100issue of how we deal with this should be up 12 birds right we shouldn't have to rely on backroom
00:07:09.240political brokering um and it really goes back to the important principle of the people are supposed
00:07:14.220to be the boss not the politicians and if the people are the boss then we should be able to
00:07:18.720fire them when they misbehave and you brought up another really good point here and that's that
00:07:23.600premier kenny when he was campaigning when he was trying to get her votes in 2019 he promised
00:07:27.900recall legislation um and then again last year in its february 2020 throne speech the government
00:07:33.960doubled down on that promise it promised recall legislation again and very importantly um it
00:07:39.360promised recall legislation extended to the local level now i mean fortunately premier kenny has
00:07:44.840recently said that they are going to be bringing forward recall legislation in the upcoming session
00:07:49.720so we're going to keep holding their feet to the fire there but another thing that we all need to
00:07:53.520watch out for is to make sure that we're actually able to use recall legislation right we need to
00:07:58.440make sure that the thresholds they're not so onerous uh so to make it that nobody can actually
00:08:03.280use this important tool yeah like when i was vp policy with the wild rose party we had recall
00:08:09.880and we adjusted and worked a lot on that one because it is a complicated one i mean you don't
00:08:13.880want to make it too easy because the day after the election suddenly you just got people from
00:08:17.760the other party out there running and starting the process and you don't want to set the bar
00:08:22.400so high that it's impossible. So it's a tough balance. But I mean, you know, finding a petition
00:08:27.860level can be can be done. That's reasonable. I mean, you only want to invoke if people have if
00:08:33.020they've done something so odious that we just can't wait two, three more years to get the chance
00:08:37.100to replace these people. Some people say, oh, petitioning is easy. Well, no, not if you've
00:08:42.460actually done it on the ground. Real petitions on a piece of paper. It is darn hard. A lot of people
00:08:46.820don't want to put their name on it. And it would be tough in a time like this when we're not allowed
00:08:50.880to go door to door so they certainly do have to make it achievable while not being too easy but
00:08:56.040it's not like it's ground we haven't studied before they know how to do this they just need
00:08:59.820the will well that's well that's right um and and so what it sounds like is going to be happening
00:09:05.400again nothing's set in stone yet we're still waiting to actually see the legislation but it
00:09:09.540sounds like it's going to be similar to british columbia so there's that 40 threshold there
00:09:13.880and you know it is important to have to strike the right balance but the 40 threshold is is too
00:09:19.840high and uh you know the canadian taxpayers federation we made a presentation to the alberta
00:09:24.800government's democratic accountability committee and we stressed that it had the thresholds need
00:09:29.520to be lower than 40 and we proposed a 25 threshold right and um so here's the key right bc has had
00:09:37.920recall legislation since i believe 1995 um there's only been one successful recall campaign there and
00:09:44.800And that's when they found out one of her MLAs was writing fake letters to the editor.
00:09:53.780And one of those reasons is because a threshold is too high.
00:09:57.520And, Corey, let me just make one more very important point about recall legislation, right?
00:10:01.720It's more than just about being able to force a by-election because recall legislation, I mean, it doesn't take a Ph.D. in psychology for someone to realize that a politician is probably going to think twice
00:10:13.600before they dip their hands into the taxpayer cookie jar if they have to face the voters tomorrow
00:10:19.020rather than in four years. Yeah, there's a preventative aspect to it. I mean, we'd rather
00:10:25.460not be recalling politicians all the time. We'd just like them to act like the rest of us in the
00:10:29.440working world. If we screw up bad enough, we're going to get fired. It's a simple concept. As you
00:10:35.380said, you don't need to be a psychiatrist or psychologist to figure that out. Well, I hope
00:10:40.360keep that pressure up because another thing i could see is they're going to throw it to another
00:10:43.720panel or another committee and death by committee like he's been doing with so many other aspects
00:10:47.720of his election promises right now is getting a little frustrating for a lot of albertans so
00:10:51.720hopefully you guys can keep holding their feet to the fire so they actually follow through on
00:10:54.840that in this legislative session uh where can we find more information on what uh you and the
00:10:59.400canadian taxpayers federation are up to these days oh well please uh please head over to taxpayer.com
00:11:04.840and go to our newsroom tab that's where we're keeping all of our information there and it'll
00:11:09.880give you some suggestions on what we're doing to hold our politicians accountable.
00:11:15.320Great. Well, thank you very much, Franco. I'm looking forward to seeing you guys
00:11:18.600keeping them accountable as much as we can with what we've got right now. And I'm sure
00:11:22.840we'll be talking again soon. Yeah, sounds good to me. Thanks, Corey.