HANNAFORD： How China will Cubanize Canada's roads
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Summary
What are Canadian auto dealers supposed to do if nobody wants to buy electric cars? What will happen to the auto industry if nobody else wants electric vehicles? With Dan McTeague, president of Canadians for Affordable Energy, we discuss this and much more.
Transcript
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Good evening, Western Standard viewers, and welcome to Hannaford, the Western Standard's
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weekly politics show. It is Thursday, September the 11th. The Federal Liberals have a dream that
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Canada will one day run on electricity, not fossil fuels, and they have bent their whole approach to
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government in that direction, first under Justin Trudeau, and now under his former mentor,
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the present Prime Minister, Mark Carney. They want net zero carbon emissions by 2035,
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which is highly unlikely, and in particular it is demanding that only electric cars be sold
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after 2035. But what a lot of people don't realize is that they're phasing this in early. Until Mr.
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Carney announced a 12-month delay last week, auto dealers were expecting to be required by law
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in less than four months to make one-fifth of all passenger car sales electric. The ratio was to grow
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to 60% in 2030. As a result of the Prime Minister's delay, the program now launches January 1st,
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2027. But this all seems like craziness. What is the poor old dealer to do if nobody wants an electric
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vehicle? With me today to talk about is Dan McTeague, no stranger to the Western Standard.
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Mr. McTeague is President of Canadians for Affordable Energy. He used to be a liberal. I saw it on his
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Facebook page once. I don't know whether that's still there, Dan, but welcome back to the show.
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Good to be here, Mr. Hannaford. Nigel, it's great to have a chance to once again visit and speak and
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discuss the matters of great importance for all of us here at the Western Standard.
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So Dan, what are the dealers supposed to do if they're selling cars and nobody wants to buy them?
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Well, I've spoken to many. In fact, I guess I was one of those many Canadians who went out and
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purchased a vehicle back about a month ago. So the second quarter of 2025 was very strong for internal
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combustion engines, ICE vehicles, sales versus the electric vehicle purchases, which dropped 40 full
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percent, uh, comparing to last year's second quarter. So what dealers are supposed to do is
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what May had expressed to me is that they're, uh, they're faced with, uh, an absolute certainty of
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bankruptcy, uh, or at least laying off, uh, or funding themselves out of work, uh, should it come to that.
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And of course, uh, we hear from, uh, the Mark Carney government, they are going to pause this.
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I don't think there's any sense in pausing it. They should have scrapped it and made a decision to get
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rid of it once and for all, but such as the affinity, uh, the tenacity of the, uh, climate cult liberals
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who, uh, hold fast to the idea that, uh, you know, uh, an inert, um, product and inert gas like CO2,
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one of the three elements necessary for survival of life on this planet, water and oxygen being the other,
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holding fast the idea that we should demonize one is, uh, well worth putting, uh, economic, uh,
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distortions in place that would create not only car dealers going out of business and no one wanted
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to buy these things, but no market for it in the United States. Now that the Trump administration,
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first act of its government, uh, rightly got rid of the, uh, uh, the, um, uh, the inflation
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reduction act, the so-called IRA. I don't know why they call it that. Nevertheless, uh, it's kind of
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strange that, uh, no one picked up on that back in November. And now here we are today, uh, dealing with
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a full broad spectrum of dealers going out of business and auto manufacturers, especially
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here in Ontario, which I worked for one, um, possibly leaving the country or shutting down
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as well, because there's no way imposed mandates like this, uh, can be, uh, can be realistically made
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in an environment where no one wants these things. Well, okay. So I thought that the Canadian auto
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industry was always based on exporting to the United States. And, uh, if now that they want to
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make electric cars, there's no way that the Canadian market would ever be able to sustain, uh, demand for
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that many vehicles that would make manufacturing them economic. So are you saying that the auto industry
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is, uh, sunset industry in Ontario? It is as long as pursued this, uh, reckless and, uh,
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not well thought of short-sighted policy. Now, Nigel, I am not, uh, uh, on, uh, you know,
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unversed in this industry. Prior to being elected in 1993, I served as media relations officer for
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a little tiny company that happens to be today's number one manufacturer in the world and number one
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in Canada, Toyota Canada. And, uh, with two or three manufacturers here in Ontario, many of them
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built since the late 1980s, uh, at risk and at play are those kinds of plants that, uh, are going
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to be forced to say, Hey, follow the mandate. You have to sell only, uh, electric vehicles. You can
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only, uh, offer electric vehicles. They're not going that route. That's a company that basically
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put a line in the sand some time ago and said, yeah, we'll take the government grift. In other words,
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we'll take the mooch. We'll take the money. We'll take the public's money, much of it borrowed,
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uh, in, in terms of debt, but we're not going down that road. The rest of the world is not,
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therefore we're not. Practically speaking, you shouldn't either. There's other technologies
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out there that are just as good, uh, you know, maybe solid state batteries. If we're going to
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go that route or more efficiency out of internal combustion engines, melding that with the hybrids.
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The last cut line I did when I worked at Toyota was for a little vehicle called, um, the tsunami.
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It later was, it was a high, it was a, uh, a two door, uh, prototype, which is really the basis for
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something called the Prius. And it's that model, the idea of hybrids with the engines that is now
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going to be the mainstay for that company, at least for the next 20 to 30 years.
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Now we can continue to roll against the current and deny reality, but, uh, for our friends in
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Ottawa who've never worked in Ottawa sector, never worked in the energy sector, obviously have never
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worked in the private sector, save and accept those who can walk around saying, well, I work for,
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uh, you know, a certain funds company as the prime minister does. Reality is biting the federal
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liberals and their friends in the block and the NDP really hard. No one wants these things.
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They're too expensive. They're impractical. And we don't have the money to build the infrastructure.
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Now, I think a lot of us have responded to this whole news, either by thinking it won't happen
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in the end. And certainly the fact that it's been pushed back a year sort of plays into that
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comfortable narrative. And the other is, well, you won't be able to buy a new gas vehicle, but you'll
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still be able to, you know, uh, in 20, in the last month of 2035, when I'm still able to buy or the 2034,
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when I'm still able to buy a gas powered car, that's when I'm going to get my dream car.
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Uh, I'm sort of whatever age I am now, and I'm going to make it last for 25 years.
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Now, a lot could change in government policy. And in fact, governments themselves could change
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between now and 2035. But on the basis of what you know now, is that realistic thinking?
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Are you going to still be able to run your gas job in 2035? Are they going to take all the gas
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pumps away? Well, it seems that's what they want to do. Uh, one of the things with the second carbon
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tax, which was never eliminated, called the second carbon tax back in 2019, 2020, it was proposed.
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Government tried to suggest that it was good. There's a benefit, a cost benefit analysis.
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Our good friend, economist, uh, well-noted economist, Ross McKittrick did a study for
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Canadians for affordable energy, in which he pointed out that for every dollar
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of benefit, there was $6 in cost, including a 1% drop in GDP and average costs are hit about
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12 to $1,300. And that's tax that refiners have to pay. In other words, they have to go to the carbon
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credit market in order to, uh, offset, uh, the, uh, the, the requirement that they drop emissions by 30%.
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Why? Well, because the technology doesn't exist for that, nor does, nor does it exist anywhere else
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in the world. So we're superimposing on Canada, not only that, which is unreal, but we're actually
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violating the law of thermodynamics. We're violating, uh, any principles of science, let
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alone any breakthroughs in technology. So, you know, I've said this before, and I've told to many
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people, it's cool to be trendy, but when it comes to the cost, the cost of the Canadian economy, our,
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our prosperity, our future, our industry, our manufacturing sector, our resource sector,
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if you want to throw those all out and cast them to the wind, that's fine. But how are you going to
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make the payments at the end of the week? How are you going to pay not only the massive debt the
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country has incurred, how are people going to have jobs when they've got nothing to offer? The rest of
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the world is not invested in the rest of Canada. Don't take my word for it. It takes 139 pennies to buy
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a US dollar. Do you realize that costs you and I 24, 25 cents a litre for gasoline? Our lack of
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purchase power because of these bad policies is having a cataclysmic effect. It's cascading into
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other areas of the economy, including high food prices, high energy prices, and really lower,
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uh, lower paychecks for most Canadians. So Dan, last week you placed an article in the
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Western Standard. You said this, our country is lacking the charging infrastructure to support an
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entirely electric fleet of vehicles. And we aren't building chargers anywhere near fast enough to
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close that gap. We're also in a period of serious electric grid insecurity. Even if you have the
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generators, you can't get, you can't move the power. So, and this insecurity is largely the result of the
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net zero nuttiness and anti-oil and gas policies enacted by our ruling class over the past decade or more.
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That's what you said. Where exactly do they think they're going to get the electricity
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to power the millions of battery-powered cars that they admit would still be out there and
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could be plugged in every night? Well, it's magical thinking. Yeah, magical thinking, I suspect, or maybe
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creative financing, which I think we're going to find a lot more about when Mark Carney tries to split the
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budget into two forms of deficit, a capital and an operational. Either way, we're in a massive debt
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and deficit situation. But, you know, I go back to some of my early works. I worked for a little,
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you know, writing called Pickering in Scarborough East. Here's a little symbol of that nuclear
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reactor that was built in 1965. How do you have the money to build reactors, much less the
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infrastructure to get energy from those reactors to the point, those terminals, where people need
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them, and then set up those terminals so people can plug them in? The demand would be three times
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what we have now. The Royal Bank of Canada in 2023 put out a report in terms of electrification of
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the country. A little bit of an issue connected to this. You got two and a half trillion bucks? I don't
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know if it does. That's more than 100% of the GDP of our entire Canadian economy. So again, people
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bandy these things out as if, you know, because it's a great idea, we can do it. But, you know,
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I'd like to have a million bucks in my bank account. I can't just magically go wave a magic wand and say,
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yeah, I got a million bucks, although the federal government believes it does, because that's the
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way it's spending money it doesn't have. The reality, I think, for many of us is that the infrastructure
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is one question that cannot be resolved. We just don't have the equipment, the financing,
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nor do we have the wherewithal. We don't have enough electricians. We don't have enough
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minerals to be able to mine and to bring out the copper and to provide all of what's required
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to make sure that there's 100% servicing of a 100% vehicle fleet in this country.
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It is delusional beyond any discussion for anybody to believe that in nine short years you can have
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this done. No other country would be that insane. Even Norway knows they can't do it because at night
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they tell people to stop, don't plug in your vehicles, especially during the winter.
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No, I think we need a bit of a dose of reality. Unfortunately, the only way that's going to
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come about is for those pink slips to be hit. A lot more Canadians because of the bad policies
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of government, not because of orange-haired men, bad south of the border, but because of our own
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narrow-sidedness and our short-sidedness in terms of these policies, which have no basis in fact,
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nor do they have any impact in terms of reducing so-called emissions.
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Now, it is always difficult to get inside the head of somebody else. And Mr. Carney is the person
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I'm thinking of here. He obviously cannot be unaware of anything that you have just said. He knows
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he knows better than any of us, I guess, how little money there is and how much debt there is.
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And that's probably why there's no liberty-ship crash-building program for generation and
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distribution. But I am suspicious that he may be okay with that. And I'm going to ask you whether,
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you know, you have the same job getting inside his head as I do, but I am suspicious that his green
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anti-carbon sentiments might be quite comfortable with an outcome where a lot less Canadians are a lot
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less mobile. Am I starting to lose my grip on reality here, going over the nut edge?
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Well, I can tell you what will change Mr. Carney very quickly is that the moment the country can no
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longer supply and afford and maintain a decent level of living for most Canadians and starts to
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whittle down prosperity and our credit gets downgraded. And yes, provinces like Quebec and Ontario,
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Manitoba and the eastern provinces like in Atlantic Canada wind up seeing their equalization
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payments cut back. I think that's going to be a very hard reality for many of these regions and
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many of these posers who for the past 10 years have offered us, you know, what amounts to shenanigan
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type politics that have no basis in economic reality or financial reality. Look, Mr. Carney's company said it all
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for me. Before he became prime minister, it moved to the United States. It bought the largest pipeline
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in the United States in the world, the colonial pipeline. It bought into future nuclear with
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respects to Brookfield's purchases of the once viable Westinghouse to get its nuclear division.
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It's purchased very heavily into heat pumps. There's no doubt in my mind that many of these people may
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believe very much in the fairytale nonsense that we're killing ourselves with CO2. But for people
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like Mark Carney, it's one step above that. It's how much money they can make out of it. So creating a
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carbon credit market unregulated based on nothing, based on absolute thin air, if we can even call it
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that, in which they're able to make riches, enormous riches, by penalizing those who don't conform
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with their idea that you have to cut back CO2. Look, I don't want to be pedantical. I certainly don't
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want to be rude about this, but people that are concerned about CO2 that damn well stop exhaling.
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And I've said this many times. If you think it's that problem, that much of a problem,
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and you're part of that problem, maybe it's time that you stop exhaling that we can make the point
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really salient that all of the policies Mr. Carney is advocating that he's written about in this book
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of values, which he seems not to be adhering to these days, sooner or later, the real Mark Carney
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is going to have to show up. And we have the two faces of Janus with Mr. Carney, like it or not,
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I think Canadians are going to start to see the real Mr. Carney very, very shortly, because Pierre
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Paulieff, thankfully, he's back in the House of Commons, he's going to hold his feet in the
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All right, Dan, you're starting to make me doubt the good faith of the Prime Minister.
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You know, it seems that the goal was always to have cars, electric cars manufactured in
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Canada, and we mentioned this before, that the American market for them will have dried up.
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So I'm wondering whether that is ever going to happen. So, Mr. Carney has strong ties,
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business ties with China, and we've also got a 100% tariff on Chinese electric vehicles,
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and an inconvenient retaliatory tariff on Canadian canola exports to China.
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Do you see a sort of a quid pro quo coming around here, where we end up with a market
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Yes, I do. I think that's the only option he has, because the Chinese know how to play the game as
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well. And their hit to the Canadian economy is significant and far more damaging than what the
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Americans are doing with their terrorists. I mean, at the end of the day, we're still dealing 95% of our
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goods with the United States, not just the automotive. But if we think we can create a
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brand new industry, a battery industry, we need 15 years to catch up. China did this 15 years ago,
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They decided they couldn't beat the West, including Canada, the United States and Europe, when it came
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to internal combustion engines and the ever-improving technology that brought emissions down, that brought
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pollution down, that brought fuel efficiency to levels that we had never seen. So the Chinese
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basically gave up on it, said, we can't replicate what they're doing. So we'll build electric vehicles.
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That's great. They have their place, Nigel. Golf carts would be a great point where I would say,
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hey, they do great on a golf course. They do great in downtown cities, perhaps, when you have to go from
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point A to point B, although you could use public transit. We spend billions of dollars on that every
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year. But they sure as heck cannot replace the efficiency, the reliability, the durability, and the
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economics of the internal combustion engine. Like it or not, some people just think it's an old-fashioned
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idea. I heard Flavio Volpe's father I knew quite well, sat with him in the House of Commons on my
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side many years. Auto parts guy came in, he would only say the CBC, the only people who want to not
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have EVs are people, I think he referred to them as, you know, people who want to have pickup trucks
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and dinosaurs. If that's the kind of mentality that still pervades the automotive sector and the power
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levers and institutions that make decisions in this country, then I think we are definitely going to
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see an auto sector doomed to its own failure. While companies like Toyota and Stellantis and Ford
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and Volkswagen and others are simply going to pack up and go south of the border. And Canadians,
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they'll have a choice. Yeah, they'll have their internal combustion engines, but there won't be one,
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you know, one scintilla of Canadian content, any of that stuff. That's because we backed the wrong
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horse and we continue to still back that wrong horse. And by a delay, we continue to say,
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maybe there's a hope. There's no hope. This thing is gone. It's done. It's history. It's toast.
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People need to really wake up and smell the coffee and maybe get their elbows down and start thinking
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for once. Well, so, so a lot of us are thinking about what is the last gasoline powered car that
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we're going to buy. I mean, if you like your gas car, then that is certainly something that you're
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thinking about. Oh, the Cuban station of Canada. Wonderful. No, I think it's going to be rough for
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a long time. People buy them from elsewhere, even their friends in Quebec. They're not stupid. The
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number one per capita purchasers of pickup trucks is in Alberta and Saskatchewan. It's Quebec. And so,
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you know, these guys can continue to be trendy and cool and row against the current, pretend they have
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support for these things. The public really knows where to go on this and they've made it very,
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very clear they did. So this, just the report this week alone, Nigel said everything. Internal combustion
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engine vehicle sales up 18% compared to the second quarter last year. EVs down 40%. And the only reason
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they're kept up is that because they're asking people who can't afford, who have to pay their taxes
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so these people can have a subsidy. If you have to subsidize the building of these things,
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you have to subsidize the infrastructure of these things, and you have to subsidize the purchase,
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this makes no economic sense. It sure as heck doesn't make any fiscal sense. So at the end of
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the day, I'm saying this whole vehicle EV mandate fantasy, a branch and extension of net zero,
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needs to be lined up on the 30 yard line and punted right through the end zone. The sooner, the better.
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So, Dan, so far we've only talked about electric vehicles, but obviously our whole way of life
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is based on secure electricity supplies. What else might Canadians expect that hasn't been much
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talked about so far as Mr. Carney tries to take the carbon out of us?
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Well, I think Mr. Carney is going to have to have a real sit down with people who know better,
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and that carbon or at least human emissions of carbon are not the dreadful emergency catastrophic
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thing that it appears to be. The United States administration has just included several
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top scientists and economists who've said this fear mongering that has been the basis by which we
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have spent trillions of dollars trying to introduce renewables to make our energy availability vulnerable
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and unaffordable is not working. It's not working in Europe. It's certainly not going to be tried in
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China, and it's not going to be worked out in the United States. So there can be a little mix of that,
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but not the tens of trillions of dollars that have had to be committed that some are pretending we can
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commit to. In the next few weeks, Nigel, here in Canada, then that the argument is going to be
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he has to present a budget, and that's over $100 billion in deficit added to the $1.4 trillion
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already. That's only federal. Remember, the provinces are almost $2 trillion in debt collectively
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at a sub-sovereign level. I think the gig will be up. The bond rating agencies are going to look at
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that and say credit downgrade. And by the way, that means higher interest rates. That means less
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investment in the country. That means we're back to where we were in 1981 or worse speculation.
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Dear God. People ask me if this is part of a grander plan conceived at a higher level of
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international intrigue. This is the last question. I don't know what to tell them, but I do see the
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same kind of pressures to go electric in Europe and, of course, before President Trump in the United
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States. Is there a grander plan that we are aware of here in Canada?
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Oh, there has to be. But Canada is susceptible to it because it's basically had a leadership
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that said basically anything that goes, whether it be Davos or whether that be the United Nations,
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we're going to sign up to something that is scientifically and intellectually questionable
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at best. I say to people, you know, they say, well, you're not a climate scientist. Well,
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neither are they. But we have a lot of political scientists that think they are. And that's the
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problem is that we have a policy that's made and derived in another part of the world that's
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hurting another part of the world. Europe is on its knees. Europe doesn't have natural gas.
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It's got tons on its ground. It has to rely on the United States for LNG. Now that you had the
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blowing up of the Nord Stream pipeline and Russia, of course, invading Ukraine. That aside,
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in the geopolitical confrontation, you now have a circumstance where Europe is on its knees.
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Manufacturing is stalling. The quality of life is certainly in decline. People are having trouble.
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Nigel, you know this perhaps better than I do. Elderly are finding it difficult to stay warm in
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the middle of winter in the UK. It's not, you know, it's not a matter that gives us any comfort to say,
00:23:39.280
hey, we're in Canada, we have lots of resources. But the fact that we have turned our idea away from
00:23:44.320
being able to sell the world the rest of our great resources, not just talking oil and gas or agriculture
00:23:49.600
or mining, is a real tragedy. And whether that's the World Economic Forum pushing us on this net zero
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nonsense, which it is and the scam, or whether it is flooding the country with migration and going well
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beyond even our own advisors in our public service who said this is not the way to go. However we want
00:24:11.440
to conduct it, it certainly isn't something the public wants. Now, the public can be very ignorant in
00:24:15.440
many of these cases, but the public did not sign up for these programs. And I think we need a clear
00:24:19.680
definition election on net zero, which has led to significant decline in our standard living and an
00:24:25.920
era of unaffordability for just about everything. Don't take my word for it. Talk to anyone shopping
00:24:30.080
at the grocery stores when they're looking and saying, you know, and our good friend,
00:24:33.600
Sylvain Charlevoix professor, the food professor saying, you know, inflation on food continues to rise
00:24:38.400
faster than the United States, faster than most European countries. Can't say I haven't noticed
00:24:43.920
that myself, Dan. Dan McTeague is president of Canadians for Affordable Energy, a frequent guest
00:24:51.360
to this program, and a frequent contributor of his thoughts to the Western Standard. We appreciate
00:24:57.280
your insights, Dan, and thanks for being on the show today. Great to be here. Thanks for having me,
00:25:01.600
Nigel. For the Western Standard, I'm Nigel Hannaford.