00:13:25.640And one of the things that just came on it just in time,
00:13:28.120you can get your own Stephen Gilboa t-shirt uh from the Western Standard Store there he is in
00:13:35.240his orange jumpsuit the image barely you know you can get a coffee mug you can get a hoodie
00:13:39.340uh barely does him justice when when that picture of him when he was being arrested one of his many
00:13:43.980times being arrested with those absolute psycho eyes going on on him jumpsuit Gilboa and you can
00:13:50.600get one for yourself and you can save 10 if you use that code Corey 10 nice easy one to remember
00:13:55.660Corey 10, you'll save 10% on that or all sorts of other things. As I said, proud Albertan wear,
00:14:01.560good hats. Also, there's a bunch of stuff with the image of Ralph Klein giving the finger that's
00:14:08.420available on there. I love that. That's a classic moment of a leader who really, at least, you know,
00:14:12.680good or bad, certainly didn't hesitate on how to let the world know what he was about. So check it
00:14:17.180out, guys. Westernstandardstore.news. See what sort of a neat thing, gifts for other people,
00:14:22.460stuff you can wear proud albertan wear and just you know look at the conversation starter of
00:14:27.420wearing a nice gilbo jumpsuit t-shirt or having that coffee mug wake you up in the morning and
00:14:32.940remind you why you're getting up to become politically active because guys like him were
00:14:37.160actually close to the uh halls of power in canada for a long time all right let's get on to our
00:14:44.380guest i see him in the lobby there great to have him come in here dennis kalma of the newly formed
00:14:50.780Alberta Transition Council and well they've been busy so thanks for joining us today Dennis I
00:14:57.620really appreciate you taking some time to talk to us. Thanks for having me on the show much
00:15:01.080appreciated. So I mean I guess I'll get right to the point what is the Alberta Transition Council
00:15:06.680what's the intent? So the intent of the Transition Council is to map out a detailed plan that covers
00:15:13.540a period of time from when we win the referendum until the country is stood up and operates on
00:15:20.760its own apart from canada and by putting in processes in place and functions in place to
00:15:27.080keep paying the bills keep sending out the pension checks and so forth until such time as a future
00:15:33.800legislature of alberta can essentially replace them with the long-term solutions so it's not
00:15:40.280an attempt to set long-term policy it's purity to give us a means to operate until the long-term
00:15:46.600policies can be established and put into place great so i mean it's uh you've got what you're
00:15:52.920going to be calling a white paper i guess that'll be a document sort of showing a lot of the the
00:15:57.800details and and requirements and things that we would be working towards in an independent west
00:16:03.480yeah so we've got about 15 subject areas which we call domains they're things like immigration
00:16:10.040banking and monetary indigenous affairs and so forth and each one of those areas is being
00:16:18.840examined by a team of experts between three and six people who are going through and saying okay
00:16:25.400how do we handle immigration over the transition time and they're going to write essentially a
00:16:30.840small white paper about 20 odd pages that'll actually cover exactly what do we do and how
00:16:35.960do we do it some will be complex because there's something to replace pick on military and the
00:16:42.680defense is one that's got more complexity to it others might be much simpler so then that will
00:16:48.120be combined into a large document that will be sort of the handbook or guide the white paper
00:16:54.280that essentially sets out the plan by which we run an independent alberta once we reach independence
00:17:01.480day what are some of the the resources you're using for a source you know to sort of build this
00:17:07.280like are using any of the the material that quebec you know did a heck of a lot of this decades ago
00:17:11.580as they prepared i'm sure there's a lot of parallels i mean there's some differences too
00:17:15.300but uh you know some of the the concepts and ideas from there have you incorporated some of
00:17:20.060that into these or are you planning to so so the the folks that we're engaging these are really
00:17:24.700experts in their field there are people that have been in some cases writing policy in ottawa
00:17:30.180who have been plugged into the Quebec situation and they're taking that knowledge and expertise
00:17:35.660and applying it to the Alberta case. So really me personally, I'm counting on those experts to
00:17:42.000understand what's been done, what resources to examine and then what to write down into their
00:17:47.160respective white paper. And with yourself, you've done a lot of work already on the value of freedom
00:17:53.460and other things with the Alberta Prosperity Project prior to this. Is this sort of a similar
00:17:59.220exercise or this is getting a little more detailed i guess into some of the transitional items that
00:18:04.260would have to be hit later on well i feel first of all i i'm a geek and a nerd i'm not the type
00:18:10.020of guy to go around knocking doors and whatever but i can think through problems and write up
00:18:14.820documents that make sense so um i've been on a transition essentially from the initial value
00:18:20.340of freedom document which did the fiscal planning which led naturally enough into the constitution
00:18:25.860development and i was the editor for that yet to be released i might add and then as the
00:18:31.220questioning went on people said okay great we get the financial picture got it we understand
00:18:36.580the constitution got it but how do we get there from here and that's where the transition plan
00:18:41.780came in and when keith asked me to participate and help him i said sure why not yeah absolutely
00:18:48.340i'm glad you mentioned him so for folks unfamiliar keith wilson is another one of the principles with
00:18:53.140this organization and group that's getting going now keith's been more visible and outspoken and
00:18:58.740promoting independence lately he was in the the recent debate and and things like that but that's
00:19:04.100almost a more campaigning sort of role is this a campaigning type of organization or is it an
00:19:08.740educational one or is it both how would you kind of define what this is so this is this is actually
00:19:15.380more like a think tank it's okay it's people assessing the problem and saying how do we solve
00:19:21.300this and we're not going to be campaigning we're not knocking doors we are going to do at some
00:19:26.580point is publish the documentation have it reviewed by experts obviously make materials that explain it
00:19:34.020to the average person who is an interest in some of these details and uh uh you can do that that's
00:19:41.300that's where etc really will come to a stopping point and we'll consider what to do after that
00:19:47.540Great. So, I mean, as I've done a lot of, you know, events speaking at and promoting, you know,
00:19:53.220independence and moving towards hopefully converting people into that concept or idea
00:19:58.660altogether, a lot of the issues are people just have a heck of a lot of questions. What about
00:20:03.060this? What about that? How would we do this? How would we do that? The time is running fast now,
00:20:09.140as we're looking at one question, perhaps hitting Albertans this fall. I imagine you guys are
00:20:13.700working as fast as you can but you're going to be prioritizing some of these things like what are
00:20:17.460some of the main areas that you've already sort of worked on and defined and filled in some of
00:20:22.980those those voids and questions or what are some of the ones that are going to be coming
00:20:26.900so we we we're working on all of them right now none of them are completed
00:20:30.980we're seeing some really good progress in the banking and uh and currency uh um
00:20:37.060domain we're also seeing some really good progress in the air navigation and air traffic control
00:20:42.420domain and uh one element that i haven't spoken to but is relevant is the process by which we
00:20:49.060ratify a constitution and i would say the thinking on that's basically completed has to be put to
00:20:55.140paper yet but that's where we're at the other ones in some cases we're still bringing on a
00:20:59.940few more people on board the team will be about 50 people by the time we're done so it's not like
00:21:04.820it's a it's a small endeavor yeah and that that process to ratify a constitution that's a monster
00:21:10.660And kind of a big one to explain to some people, you know, like, let's say walking down the timeline, let's say Alberta had voted and, you know, overwhelmingly had supported independence.
00:21:21.340We're moving towards that. There would be a constitutional convention. And what would that involve?
00:21:28.660Like, you know, because a lot of people never really thought this far along.
00:21:31.740And, you know, they aren't political geeks like ourselves to kind of have a basis or a concept of that.
00:21:36.940What are you guys envisioning with laying out what that means?
00:21:40.080Well, what we do not want is to have a bunch of people in a closed room deciding on behalf of the people of Alberta.
00:21:48.520So we're anticipating there will be multiple groups and representations ranging from obviously existing government to groups of citizens who have an interest.
00:21:58.580There will be a process by which we have to get maybe not unanimity, but certainly alignment from each of the relevant groups.
00:22:05.700and then ultimately it'll have to go to the people for visibility and ultimate ratification so
00:22:11.580the main thing we want to avoid is this will not be a political party locking themselves in a room
00:22:17.040and saying okay alberta here's your constitution hope you like it it's going to be a public process
00:22:22.680it's going to be a transparent process it'll be a democratic process great and as you said you're
00:22:29.100going to be pulling together people with with experience and and such to contribute this and
00:22:33.320build those white papers and things like that. So that there's a good blueprint, I guess, going in
00:22:37.580when it gets to that point of holding a constitutional convention. In the meantime,
00:22:42.680though, I mean, how do you guys stay visible? Are there going to be events with this group or
00:22:47.980is there going to be an online presence, discussions, things like that? Like in that
00:22:52.780sense of, I know you can't have a thousand people contribute to the super, you're going to get a
00:22:57.100heck of a mess, but you still want to have as much input from others as you can too. Like what's
00:23:02.120what's the communication strategy so so we'll be doing some communication the main thing to notice
00:23:06.760is what the timeline is we're not seeing this dragging out for months and months right now our
00:23:10.840target is roughly the middle of july to have the first solid draft out and that draft of course
00:23:16.680will go for public uh review and input and feedback um there's a reviewing process prior to
00:23:22.520that but that's a more limited one with people that are plugged in so that'll go out in the
00:23:27.000public um it'll be examined at that point and obviously we take feedback all right and as an
00:23:33.400organization uh you know in that that name of transparency and such uh it's a a non-profit
00:23:39.000society or what's the structure of what this group is well it is not a third-party uh advertiser it
00:23:45.640is a volunteer run organization that has got its purpose to pull together that transition plan
00:23:53.240all of us are volunteers great and in that you know just to make sure things are clarified
00:23:58.360because i got a feeling there's going to be a lot of confusion and and things like that as we move
00:24:03.880towards a referendum i'm seeing groups springing up all over the place uh mostly on the federalist
00:24:08.280side but there i'm certain there's going to be others something changes when you uh become a
00:24:13.800third-party advertiser right like you guys aren't aspiring to be that but how is it then just to
00:24:18.920clarify why you were not a third-party advertiser well for one thing we're all volunteer we're
00:24:23.560literally a bunch of guys working together so uh keith has done the legal work on that and
00:24:28.520and you know we're not we're not spending money we're not collecting money we're not taking
00:24:32.440donations we're not advertising for a cause we're just saying here's the technical means by which
00:24:37.720we undertake this uh transition so there will be other groups standing up but i'm aware of several
00:24:43.800that are being set up to be third-party advertisers
00:24:46.440that will go through all those controls
00:24:48.720and reporting to Elections Alberta and so forth.
00:24:51.280Those are the guys that will be doing, you know,
00:24:54.300door knocking and buying advertisements and so on and so forth.
00:24:57.680But we're just going to be a bunch of nerds basically working away.
00:34:52.220But that's another way to campaign, as Tommy is talking about, little ways, little ways to start conversations with your neighbors and things like that.
00:35:57.920or wouldn't change between now and a question being answered. But with a year of a lot of hard
00:36:02.420work, a lot of groundwork, a lot of petitioning and everything going on, it seems like it
00:36:05.660solidified the existing 30 some percent very well. But that mushy middle that everybody wanted to get
00:36:12.600to hasn't budged an inch. It's actually about the same now as it was a year ago. And a recent poll
00:36:18.520from Angus Reid, the first one done since the new question was out, showed a jump of about five or
00:36:24.840seven percent support towards the independent side that's the first jump in that kind of support
00:36:29.900we've seen and I think it reflects a bit of what Keith was talking about saying you know what
00:36:34.080this gives an opportunity to campaign on a softer question yeah it's non-binding and that's
00:36:39.680frustrating but it makes it a lot more winnable it makes it where you can reach out to people say
00:36:44.040this is where you can express yourself put Ottawa on notice give them the middle finger and say
00:36:50.560we've had it. We're standing up. This question allows you to do that. The other option is to
00:36:56.120sit on our heels and let the other side take it. And when are we going to get another chance in
00:37:01.600that case? We should be pushing on this and winning it definitively. Get that next move. I
00:37:07.560know the road to independence isn't a straight line. It's a bunch of curves. It's a bunch of
00:37:11.260hurdles. It's a bunch of roadblocks. If anybody ever told you it was going to be easy, they were
00:37:15.400lying to you. If you thought it was easy, well, you're probably lying to yourself, but that's
00:37:19.960okay. We can get beyond that. But we should be hitting this referendum with all guns, doing
00:37:28.040everything we can to get as strong a positive vote as we can, even if it's not the ideal
00:37:32.580circumstance that we wanted to have. And some people are concerning themselves more
00:37:40.500with going after the provincial government, trying to tear Daniel Smith out of power,
00:37:45.600things like that. Dedicating energy resources. I understand why people are frustrated with her.
00:37:50.460I would have rather seen better balanced budgets. I'm wondering where the heck our provincial police
00:37:54.540force went. You know, I mean, we've got some sheriffs expanding. That's good. But what about
00:37:59.260the pension plan? Where the heck is that thing? Come on, we've talked about that for years. We
00:38:02.620can do this. And of course, her very much federalist almost campaign lately. But she still
00:38:11.860has offered a lot more mechanisms for being able to get this to the question to Albertans than
00:38:16.240we've ever seen out of any premier in the past. Perfect. Not even close. But are we helping the
00:38:22.240cause of independence by dedicating four months to trying to rip her out of power as some people0.99
00:38:27.120want to? I don't think so. I think that's, if you've got a problem with it, fair enough, lots
00:38:31.980of people do. Save it until October 20th. I mean, you can still speak up and do things, but
00:38:36.760absolutely and be critical but you've only got so much energy uh you know lzgp saying exactly
00:38:43.320focus energy elsewhere is my thought like you only have so much you only have so much time
00:38:47.420you only have so many resources and it takes time and resources people compared it to when
00:38:52.260jason kenny was brought down years ago fair but remember what happened then hundreds of meetings
00:38:58.760had to be held to organize that push actually to get it done i don't know how many hundreds of
00:39:03.360thousands of dollars were spent, whether directly or indirectly, but to build that momentum and
00:39:08.280campaign and then hold that meeting. And all of the emotional energy, the intellectual energy,
00:39:13.760all of those things, volunteers, people working, all to bring down Jason Kenney.
00:39:18.340If you had to replicate that and do it again by this August, all of that is being directed
00:39:24.140towards there. And all of that is being directed away from a campaign to get a positive vote
00:39:28.640on October 19th, which means you're definitely not going to get. Meanwhile, Lukasik is staying
00:39:34.860focused on having people vote for his question. Stephen Carter has got his little group. He's
00:39:40.380fired out there now. Another one with Matt Solberg is out there now. These groups are
00:39:44.860sprouting up like daisies. They're hitting the ground running. They're putting campaign signs
00:39:48.560out. They're making their case. And we're having an internal discussion on whether or not we should
00:39:53.320rip the premier out of power. Guess who's going to win on October 19th if this trend continues?
00:39:59.440So let's focus, guys. Focus. Get on this. Set aside the personal grudges and gripes
00:40:05.160and see how we can get things done. Lori Dodd saying, I think that instead of focusing on
00:40:10.900Smith, focus on making the independence movement more time to expose the useless MOU. Absolutely.
00:40:15.740That's another frustrating thing. It does feel like our premier is just letting herself be
00:40:19.280strung along on an MOU for a pipeline we know is never going to happen. But guess what? Every time
00:40:24.960she goes out and fails on one of these, we actually get more independent supporters.
00:40:29.260People are realizing, wow, it really demonstrates the futility of trying to play within the
00:40:34.220structure and framework that we were given. So let her carry on doing those things. What's the
00:40:40.000worst that could happen? She actually gets a pipeline in. Okay, I'm fine with that. Guess what?1.00
00:40:43.800We'll get the pipeline in and I'm still supporting independence. But for now, we've got a question
00:40:49.760ahead of us, a weird one, but it is one where we can express and move things closer towards
00:40:54.360independence if we can get a good positive vote. It's turned into a de facto vote on independence
00:41:00.340anyway. The federalists are already framing it as an independence referendum. The media is framing
00:41:06.360it as an independence referendum. So people are looking at it. The citizens in general are looking
00:41:12.900at it as such and if it comes in with 20 support this movement's dead for a while guys we've got
00:41:20.800to get a strong and i think we can win this especially as keith had pointed out it's a much
00:41:26.360easier case to make to people right now when we're still admittedly early in the phases of this whole
00:41:31.320process this unprecedented process when we can say to people you can safely put your vote in now
00:41:37.900on this and uh make your expression and then we make the campaign for the big question the real
00:41:45.780question the binding question the constitutional question uh blaine uh sitter saying uh carney got
00:41:53.260his carbon tax pipeline will get discussed later yeah maybe i don't know you know he got his carbon
00:41:57.340tax though uh what else you know uh another one's shame on smith is right yeah well yeah these
00:42:05.860negotiations, maybe not be good. But you know, again, you got multiple opportunities. There's
00:42:09.760an annual general meeting not long after the referendum is going to be held. That's a good
00:42:15.240time to express yourself to the party. And there'll be an election within a year after that.
00:42:22.900But right now just isn't the time. But this is interesting stuff. You know, this was something
00:42:27.360that came up and Sheila was talking about that gun read on her show today. I know that. And there
00:42:31.720was another thing I was looking at, but there was a hot mic moment. I don't know if people saw it,
00:42:34.680But Prime Minister Carney was caught saying when he walked away from a conference with Gregor Robertson, he said, what are you doing? This is stupid. You've got an offer. Take it. What he was talking about more than likely by looking at that was he was talking about Daniel Smith, though he won't admit it. He was saying, oh, I just said that to Gregor. Well, it made no sense in that context. No, he was he was talking about because his conference on housing got turned into a question about the independence issue. That's what I mean.1.00
00:42:59.980this question is going to referendum and it's making national news already. So let's ride it
00:43:04.340instead of distracting ourselves from it. But he felt Smith should have just thrown her hands up0.68
00:43:10.440and taken the off ramp and said no. Instead, she scheduled a modified question. The true federalists
00:43:15.960don't want this to go to the question at all. They're scared of it. We can do this. And others