Western Standard - Mountain Standard Time - May 27 2021

00:00:00.000 Thank you.

00:00:30.000 Thank you.

00:01:00.000 Thank you.

00:01:30.000 and welcome to mountain standard time i'm your host nathan guida and today i'll be speaking a

00:01:53.000 little later with stewart parker president of the los altos institute about the relaxation

00:01:57.400 of restrictions that we're having in BC. Remember to like us on Facebook, follow us on YouTube and

00:02:02.640 take out a subscription online at the Western Standard, especially if you wish to continue

00:02:06.140 supporting the free voice of the West and of course content that isn't being subsidized by

00:02:11.020 the government. As mentioned previously, British Columbia is currently relaxing restrictions which

00:02:15.980 have been going on in one way or another since November of 2020, which feels like a million years

00:02:21.640 ago. I said before that I'm cautiously optimistic, not because I have any trust in our leadership,

00:02:27.400 but because those in charge might finally be feeling the heat from their oppressed populations. 0.91

00:02:34.060 Dr. Bonnie Henry might be citing falling case numbers and rising doses of the jab vaccine,

00:02:41.360 experimental treatment for those of you who are in favor of that language.

00:02:45.480 But the real story is that if British Columbia's economy and civil discourse descend any further,

00:02:50.140 there won't be a province left to save.

00:02:52.480 Ditto for the rest of the BC NDP, now suddenly changing tune,

00:02:55.920 singing the songs of new beginnings and reopenings after months of declaring it unsafe to gather

00:03:01.220 outside, let alone inside. There are some nonsensical items that have come out of our

00:03:06.780 pandemic response. Stuart will be on later to discuss this a little bit further. But in BC,

00:03:11.520 we have an interesting habit of calling certain industries essential in order to break strikes or

00:03:16.920 keep wages from being raised. This is not a hot take. The fact of the matter is, I think the best

00:03:22.680 example is probably the bc ambulance service they wanted higher wages and and better hours because

00:03:30.880 they weren't making enough on the hours they had or the seniority and displacement was pushing them

00:03:35.620 all over the place and so they made them an essential service and they couldn't strike

00:03:39.760 anymore but suddenly because they were getting overtime and stuff they were getting higher wages

00:03:43.760 it was absolutely bizarre all that has changed is that the motivation is different fly fishing

00:03:49.180 and restaurants are now essential to combat the impact of COVID-19. So we always kind of put cart

00:03:54.280 before the horse here in BC. But regardless of where you stand, whether you think that we are

00:03:58.440 opening up way too early or we should never have closed to begin with, the question becomes who

00:04:03.060 gets credit anyways? I can't imagine ever being the person to pose on a stack of corpses and

00:04:08.820 destroy businesses for that matter while proudly proclaiming victory. Yes, that's a morbid and

00:04:14.800 macabre image. But what else is there to say? That's what you're doing if you're in leadership

00:04:19.480 right now and declaring victory. We've beat the disease. Well, I mean, how many people had to die

00:04:24.260 for you to do that? Slash, how many things do you have to destroy to do that? Before we get too far

00:04:29.400 down that road, let's acknowledge that the lab leak theory is now being discussed openly in the

00:04:33.380 mainstream media, which would appear to mean that after a year, a year after Donald Trump,

00:04:38.060 President Donald Trump, former President Donald Trump now, and everyone else was telling us about

00:04:42.340 the wuhan lab the rest of the world has finally caught up that sounds like media collusion to me

00:04:47.960 that's why i'm proud to be a part of the western standard and outside the mainstream media off the

00:04:53.040 government payroll we do our own narrative here we do our own takes here and we don't bother with

00:04:57.700 nonsense so we're going to be taking in the comments a little bit today because for the first

00:05:02.000 half of the show uh we're we're going to be talking about a few different things one of the

00:05:06.200 big things we're going to talk about uh and we'll have my producer bring it up when he's got the

00:05:10.240 chance here uh is that we really are here we really are here the lab leak theory is is finally

00:05:18.420 on the docket and that is really kind of sickening in a sense because what it tells me i mean this

00:05:25.580 isn't an american show and this isn't even technically speaking a federalist show this

00:05:29.500 is of course the western standard and this is mountain standard time and i'm supposed to be

00:05:33.940 staying as bc centric as possible but but this does affect us here in bc because real people

00:05:38.820 paid a real price for this virus okay real people paid a real price i've paid a real price you've

00:05:44.780 paid a real price i lost my job because of covid you know i i was laid off and i i've suffered

00:05:51.460 through the lockdowns we're still in lockdown it may be slightly relaxed but we're still here so

00:05:55.020 we've all suffered real consequences from from the from what happened here the virus from china

00:06:01.600 as and the chinese virus as a certain former president used to call it and what i think

00:06:06.880 needs to be driven home is that if this is finally happening why scientists are suddenly more

00:06:11.660 interested in the lab leak theory of code 19's origin this is this is just how can you ever how

00:06:18.760 could you look at yourself in the mirror you know if you were one of the people that just decided

00:06:22.400 who was in authority somewhere else and just decided just because it was coming out of the

00:06:26.720 mouth of donald trump it was obviously a conspiracy theory that needed to be stopped

00:06:30.740 and now here we are uh six months after his presidency five months after his presidency has

00:06:36.400 ended and he was right a year ago calling it a you know a virus from China and the rest of it I'm

00:06:43.480 sorry I forgot to put my phone on mute but but seriously if this is what's happening if this is

00:06:50.280 if this is what's going on if people are are legitimately burying evidence in order to just

00:06:55.680 just to de-platform someone else just to keep them from being from being acknowledged or given

00:07:01.020 any kind of credit i don't i mean it's not really shocking in a sense but i just i i'm just i am

00:07:07.420 still shocked i mean i shouldn't be surprised but i am um i think i think that what i i'm going to

00:07:13.260 read through this a little bit and we can just kind of kind of see what's going on here so if uh

00:07:18.460 you guys can see it streamed over here i'm i gotta read it like it's on the screen here so

00:07:22.700 united states is closer than ever to beating covet 19 with half the country vaccinated more

00:07:27.180 restrictions lifting yes i know people don't like that that word but we're but we're as far as ever

00:07:33.100 from knowing how the virus which shut down the world came to be which is as frightening as

00:07:37.900 anything since there's growing suggestions that it didn't occur naturally as many experts have

00:07:42.780 long argued the us with increasing urgency is calling for more study for more studies warning

00:07:48.540 more study warning about the stakes for future pandemics and more openly considering the idea

00:07:53.580 that mistakes are an accident in a Chinese lab caused the COVID-19 pandemic.

00:07:58.220 The Chinese government says the case is closed. 0.99

00:08:01.700 I, yeah, right.

00:08:04.220 Apparently, the U.S. intelligence report found that several researchers

00:08:07.360 at China's Wuhan lab institute of virology fell ill in November 2019,

00:08:13.400 had to be hospitalized, a new detail about the severity of the symptoms.

00:08:16.780 It's not clear the researchers contracted COVID-19 in the lab strongly denied the report,

00:08:20.860 calling it a lie to push the so-called lab leak theory for the disease origin scientists affiliated

00:08:26.240 with the institute have previously said the institute did not come into contact with covet

00:08:30.800 19 until december 30th the u.s had actually provided some of the funding for the study

00:08:35.460 of the coronavirus and their transmission through bats which had made it to the wuhan institute of

00:08:41.140 virology so we're going to pause it right there and uh and just kind of think about this for a

00:08:47.780 moment i remember i was watching what was i watching the other day i think i was watching

00:08:51.780 tucker right i mean we all love tucker at least i hope most of us love tucker uh and you know he's

00:08:57.280 going on about gain gain theory and uh and and well and gain testing you know that that how how

00:09:04.320 quickly a virus can spread how effective is a virus and i mean you know a lot of people have

00:09:09.340 problems with fox news and that sort of thing but i i think i think what we got to be honest with

00:09:13.980 here is that if this if this is what gets to be proven to be true we we did just suffer a pandemic

00:09:23.120 that effectively was entirely preventable um people who were trained to build viruses to

00:09:29.160 kill people why you why you're building viruses to kill people i don't know like it sounds like

00:09:33.260 a kind of waste of time uh but fine the point is that you at least wouldn't want them to escape 0.99

00:09:39.520 a lab having a virus escape a lab would be really really bad and further to that i don't know why

00:09:45.140 you would be funding such virological if that's the way to or such virology uh when you you know

00:09:53.580 with with your taxpayers dollars and then some of those taxpayers aren't going to pay those taxes

00:09:57.580 again because they died so we're looking into it now we're seeing it now uh at least the mainstream

00:10:04.720 is finally on side with this. I know that many people I'm sure that are viewing this at home

00:10:08.940 are far more, far more, you know, comfortable with this idea because they thought about it a

00:10:15.640 long time ago. And certainly, certainly I had some, I had some suspicions about the nature of

00:10:20.840 the virus. And I did think that the virus came from not only from China and from Wuhan, but I

00:10:25.260 did think it came from the lab. But we just, I didn't think we had the definitive evidence for

00:10:31.080 But here we are. And not only that, we didn't just have the definitive evidence for it. We now have the definitive evidence that it's being paid for. It was bought and paid for by the U.S. government. And that's something to be said, something to be said.

00:10:45.820 So let's move on from that.

00:10:49.840 We're going to leave that behind for a little while.

00:10:54.440 Terry McKnight has got a good one there.

00:10:56.380 Not vaccinated.

00:10:57.460 It's an experimental jab.

00:11:00.000 Gain of function.

00:11:00.880 Yeah, thank you.

00:11:01.620 Not gain of problems.

00:11:04.160 Thank you, Pamela.

00:11:05.840 It's gain of something.

00:11:06.980 I know it's gain of something.

00:11:08.080 Sorry.

00:11:08.800 Should have had that in the show notes.

00:11:11.600 But we're going to pivot a little bit here to another virus.

00:11:15.820 that plagues us which is called uh you know political largesse and people being corrupt

00:11:21.420 so out there in ye olde we're trying to keep stuff bc centric today we have uh some news

00:11:28.640 that comes to us from i believe it's southern british columbia from abbotsford uh my producer

00:11:36.220 tells me and here's how it goes so the agenda uh abbotsford paid banman oh no that's probably

00:11:45.800 a relative of mine it's that's too bad uh my i'm related to mennonites and that family name is

00:11:56.040 actually kind of prominent but well that's too bad isn't it the agenda abbotsford paid bandman

00:12:01.720 sixteen thousand dollars while both an mla and a counselor so if we're looking for something to get

00:12:06.440 rah-rah mad about and luckily it's an ndp be uh scourged today but it's a liberal oh no well

00:12:14.120 federal liberal oh no well that's this isn't going well at all well i'm sorry guys but apparently

00:12:20.520 we're going to be scourging the bc liberals today oh well unlike some previous double duty politicians

00:12:26.200 new avidford mla bruce bandman continued to take his counselor's salary during the four months he

00:12:31.480 served in both positions following the provincial election i'm going to do the thing that we all

00:12:36.280 need to do when we hear this and i'm just gonna you know

00:12:38.680 why would you do this don't do this this is like the worst thing you can do

00:12:49.120 you're always going to get caught if you're watching this and you're in leadership and

00:12:53.380 you're doing this right now like cancel the other check don't do this this is bad

00:12:57.400 bannon was elected to the provincial legislator legislature in october but didn't resign his

00:13:02.520 councilor's seat until the end of february he was paid sixteen thousand four hundred and sixty

00:13:08.180 seven dollars by the city between the date of his election as mla and his resignation according to

00:13:13.540 documents obtained through a freedom of information requests politicians are allowed to hold both posts

00:13:18.800 and some like bamen attempt to do so but nearly every recent instance has ended in a new mla

00:13:23.460 resigning their local government post okay so that's interesting i thought that that would

00:13:28.420 have been outlawed i suppose that it i suppose that the reason perhaps it could be allowed for

00:13:35.900 is actually i'm trying to imagine what kind of instance that would be okay with i i think that

00:13:41.860 maybe the reason that might be allowed still and not illegal is that let's say that you got elected

00:13:48.660 as mla of a very small district in a very small town so let's think about that for a moment you're

00:13:55.380 For example, let's pretend somehow, some way,

00:13:58.740 Valemont and what's that called?

00:14:03.060 Barkerville, which has Wells, BC,

00:14:05.360 which is an actual municipality.

00:14:08.180 Wells, the village of Wells,

00:14:09.940 and I think the village of,

00:14:11.240 I think it's the town of Valemont.

00:14:12.660 The point is that both those places are extremely small.

00:14:15.020 So the chances of the person who was running for MLA

00:14:18.460 and the person who was running for mayor

00:14:20.520 could be the same person or pretty high.

00:14:22.720 And let's imagine that the mayor did run for MLA,

00:14:24.760 But the fact is, if there isn't a mayor, there isn't quorum.

00:14:27.980 And so he has to sit as mayor or she has to sit as mayor for a few more months until they can elect a different mayor, because otherwise they won't have quorum.

00:14:36.160 That obviously is not the case when it comes to Abbotsford, because I'm guessing they have at least eight or 10 or maybe 12 councillors.

00:14:42.780 And that losing one guy who isn't the mayor is not going to affect quorum.

00:14:47.760 But this is a real problem in some other parts of the province where they don't achieve quorum.

00:14:53.240 They don't even have enough people in their village in order to stand for officer places.

00:14:57.960 If you've ever been a part of a non-profit, you've experienced this as well.

00:15:01.500 But we'll add this back to the stream and we'll just continue reading this story because this is kind of terrible.

00:15:09.040 Resigning their local government post.

00:15:10.620 On several occasions, such MLAs have attempted to keep their seat while forsaking their municipal salary.

00:15:17.460 Bandman told the Abbotsford News that he didn't do so because he continued to do his councillor job.

00:15:21.840 them and did attend nearly every council meeting while serving in both roles i like i get it

00:15:28.720 i understand but this is an interesting ethical problem actually like i'll throw this to the

00:15:35.040 comments i i know we don't i know we don't want the same person representing all of us all the

00:15:39.920 time then we could just go back to absolute monarchy and not have and not have parliaments

00:15:44.000 that being said i mean you know there are times where absolute monarchy sounds a lot smarter than

00:15:48.560 what we're doing right now with our technocratic theocracy but that's a different debate for another

00:15:52.400 time the point that i'm trying to draw here is that what what do you think do you think that

00:15:59.600 it would be fair if you're rendering services i guess if you're rendering services or you're

00:16:03.280 giving up your labor if you are if you're exchanging your labor for value right that's

00:16:07.120 what work is then and you're putting in the time and you're going to the meetings right if you're

00:16:11.600 doing all those things why don't you deserve a salary my answer would have been well you should

00:16:15.040 should have resigned your seat within you know a week or two at most a month since since you got

00:16:19.780 elected right so you transition somebody else into your role or at least give up all the papers and

00:16:24.580 everything and give that to somebody else hand it off to a staffer whoever and the bureaucrat and

00:16:29.460 then you get out of your municipal role and you go into your provincial role just like if you were in

00:16:33.320 a provincial role and you were going to a federal role or vice versa it doesn't matter whether you

00:16:36.720 were the prime minister of canada now you're the mayor of barry ontario like it doesn't matter

00:16:40.880 you you give away what you had before and you move on right within within a reasonable amount

00:16:45.940 of time maybe four months sounds like a reasonable amount of time but i don't know if anybody in the

00:16:50.820 comment section here would prefer that no you know what if you got elected to uh you know i'm sure if

00:16:58.560 you if you got elected you know or if you got elected to something or if somebody you know got

00:17:02.780 elected to something you'd be fine with them drawing both salaries let me know how you feel

00:17:05.780 about that so we're going to go back and kind of finish off this column here this article

00:17:09.860 serving both roles in april mayor henry braun told the absurd news that banman had surprised

00:17:18.260 the city by resigning because he initially indicated a desire to hold his seat through

00:17:21.920 the year thereby saving us for the cost of holding a by-election banman told the current

00:17:26.420 that he decided to resign his seat after learning more about the scope of his new job after some

00:17:30.760 soul searching with colleagues and friends and everyone else i really believe that the citizens

00:17:34.120 of avestrian deserve choose who they want sitting around the table that can dedicate 100 of their

00:17:39.560 efforts to that job. He said that he'd been able to put that effort in a job

00:17:43.620 while he served, but that his new MLA duties and the reconvening

00:17:47.760 of the House meant this time would be stretched too thin. I think

00:17:51.560 that's, I mean, it sounds like he learned his lesson, but it also

00:17:55.500 just, it's, I think that

00:17:59.200 this is kind of just a no-brainer. If you get elected to something else, you have to resign

00:18:03.480 your post somewhere else. That's just how it is. I mean, it's a biblical principle.

00:18:07.280 You can't serve two masters. You'll hate the one, love the other, blah, blah, blah. And it's a life principle. We don't believe in bigamy in this country. We don't believe in any of that. In fact, actually, if we could dig that up, I'm going to ask my producer over here if he can pull up the email we got the other day from our mutual friend, who shall go unmentioned, who was wanting us to get into this whole question of polygamy because there's a birth certificate situation in British Columbia where people are putting more than

00:18:37.280 more than one well a couple of different things but the biggest thing is they're putting more

00:18:42.720 they're trying to put more than one uh woman on a birth certificate uh which of course doesn't

00:18:48.740 make sense because only two parents can give birth to a child right you have a father and you have a

00:18:54.480 mother um because biologically that's how that works so in case anybody wants to anybody's worried

00:19:00.160 you know especially sometimes i have left-wing people on here people from different walks of 0.78

00:19:03.800 life and whatever, where I stand on the biology question, I believe there are only two genders,

00:19:09.020 I believe there are only two sexes, and that sex and gender are connected directly biologically.

00:19:13.840 I do believe that, of course, I mean, I have questions about what it means to really be a man,

00:19:20.060 I have questions in my life about how to meet challenges and be a proper provider to my beloved

00:19:24.880 and to be a proper father to my future family, like, that is a kind of, not dysphoria, but it's 0.51

00:19:31.500 dissonance you're trying to be the right person you have this ideal out here and you are here

00:19:36.620 over there and you've got a you've got to try and get from point a to point b you want to be the

00:19:40.300 ideal man and and you aren't and you know you aren't and you have to wrestle with that and and

00:19:44.860 i think this happens for women as well i think it's different for women because of the nature

00:19:48.540 of their biology but i do believe women struggle with this as well so that i don't have a question

00:19:53.660 about and i do believe that that struggle can get to the point where it is an outright psychological 0.64

00:19:58.140 uh you know issue and you have probably you have psychological damage because of it and mental

00:20:04.780 mental illness develops but i don't believe i don't believe that it's all you know it's all

00:20:10.300 the same that's nonsense of course not men and women are different and on your birth certificate

00:20:14.700 obviously there has to be one person who gave the male gamete and one person who gave the female

00:20:21.500 gamete or if you don't know who the other person is then you just list one of the parents that's it

00:20:27.420 uh and of course mothers can i think choose not to put the father on the birth certificate

00:20:32.940 in some cases the idea that you could put two women on the birth certificate seems a bit

00:20:39.420 nonsensical because as far as i know uh children aren't lego pieces and they aren't born in parts

00:20:44.620 and then you stick them together at the end and somehow they can gestate in two different

00:20:48.600 uh is it uteruses or uteri i don't know but the point is they can't gestate in two different

00:20:54.180 wombs uh and then be put together at the end after two women go into labor with the constituent parts

00:20:59.560 of of said people so that's uh let's let's go to this article here again i the way you see it on

00:21:06.380 the screen is different than how i see on the screen because i can't read it that small child

00:21:10.540 in polyamorous family can have three parents canadian court rules um a canadian judge has

00:21:16.540 ordered that all three adults in a polyamorous relationship should be registered as the parents

00:21:21.360 of child they are raising. Justice Sandra Wilkinson of the British Columbia Supreme Court

00:21:26.500 said that there was a gap in the law inside of the family's wish to have Olivia, Eliza,

00:21:32.380 and Bill recognized as the parents of their two-year-old son.

00:21:38.820 Ah, yeah, that doesn't work. You can't have two people. Well, you can't. Yeah, you can't have,

00:21:48.100 i mean you you can't have one you can't have three people on your birth certificate because

00:21:52.420 how could that work because one of those people did not do the biological things necessary which

00:21:58.660 is to say to have intercourse which resulted in conception gestation and of course pregnancy and

00:22:04.900 then the development of the child to the point of birth uh one of those people was not involved in

00:22:11.460 that uh because by by the reality of things you can't you can't do that it just doesn't work that

00:22:18.500 way so so we're going to try a different version of this story because uh the other one was giving

00:22:23.800 us a bit of a giving us a bit of a yeah well i mean paywalls i mean not that we know anything

00:22:28.900 about paywalls here at uh at yield yield standard we don't we don't do paywalls of the standard

00:22:37.060 right we do we do because we have no everybody else i think that we're consulting today is all

00:22:42.860 i mean we're we're fine referencing these other places because uh our taxes are paying for them

00:22:48.760 because i'm pretty sure everybody but us takes some form of government subsidy except for you

00:22:53.400 know if you're got a guy around your town that does the local minute mag thing right the crosswords

00:22:57.900 on the back and some funny jokes inside and one little community story that guy's not getting

00:23:02.140 paid by the government but everybody else is so that's uh that's kind of a problem um yeah

00:23:09.100 pamela is making the point that's what a step parent is no i i have no problem let's be clear

00:23:13.380 here i i actually i uh i want to be very clear here i'm adopted i'm adopted so i don't have

00:23:19.140 biological parents in the sense that i don't the people i was raised by are not my biological

00:23:23.320 parents i love them to death uh they are the world to me they're the only parents i've ever known

00:23:27.920 and i don't have a problem with the idea of there being even mixed family in the sense of you you

00:23:34.280 know maybe you are closer with your non-blood parental figure than you are with your biological

00:23:39.140 ones funny story i know someone like that i know someone like that quite well uh so that's not a

00:23:44.300 problem but but the issue that that's not what we're discussing here we're discussing the putting

00:23:50.080 on of a third person onto uh onto your birth certificate so not not not to not replacing

00:23:57.080 even one of them or or or acknowledging that hey this person who isn't my biological parent i want

00:24:02.760 them on my birth certificate because hey i i feel connected to that person i've i've seen i've seen

00:24:08.360 people try to do this and i acknowledge that and i think it's a beautiful thing for that step parent

00:24:13.080 or that person who's come into their life to feel acknowledged in that way but you can't have two

00:24:18.840 mommies and two daddies or a third a third parent that doesn't exist that doesn't that that's not

00:24:25.080 real. And so we're going to go back to the Alaska news here.

00:24:29.220 Okay, so the B.C. Supreme Court decision handed down April 23rd, but released

00:24:33.080 on Monday, describes three adults, Olivia, Liza, and Bill,

00:24:37.020 whose names were anonymized by the court, living together in a

00:24:41.140 committed polyamorous relationship since 2017. Okay.

00:24:45.440 That sounds like bigamy to me, and it sounds like a terrible time, and

00:24:48.840 I don't want my daughter to ever be in a polyamorous relationship, but

00:24:53.080 you do you boo I guess 1.00

00:24:55.640 when a year later

00:24:57.720 Eliza and Bill conceived a child

00:24:59.680 it was agreed that Olivia would be involved in the child's

00:25:02.020 life as a full parent

00:25:03.900 again as a

00:25:05.900 role

00:25:06.340 I don't like any of this

00:25:10.120 but as a role like as

00:25:11.920 in you know if my brother and sister

00:25:14.040 in law need me to take a lot

00:25:16.000 of care of their kid because they're ill or something

00:25:17.980 like that like sure of course I can be a

00:25:20.100 not full parent but I can be a

00:25:21.960 very serious parental figure in that person's life sure but we're not in a polyamorous relationship

00:25:27.680 obviously in naming themselves a triad the three adults describe themselves as having an equal

00:25:33.440 relationship with one another and the child olivia went as far as inducing lactation so she would

00:25:41.300 also be able to feed clark when he was born wrote madam justice sandra wilkinson referring to the 0.86

00:25:47.900 animized child. In fact, Olivia was the first 0.98

00:25:51.980 parent to feed Clark after he was born. All three were open with their

00:25:55.900 families about their polyamorous relationship and went on several

00:25:59.720 vacations together as a family unit after the boy was born over two years ago.

00:26:04.520 That openness, however, didn't always transfer into the workplace

00:26:08.000 out of fear of reprisal and discrimination, wrote the Justice.

00:26:11.600 We're going to stop right there for a moment and we're just going to think

00:26:15.740 about this a little bit uh and i don't think that works on a lot of counts but i'm a step

00:26:27.600 parent to three and i'm not on any of the various certificates and that's fine again no argument

00:26:31.900 here zero argument here i want to be clear that we're talking about trying to shoehorn in the idea

00:26:38.700 that a third fourth or fifth person in in a romantic polyamorous relationship is is somehow

00:26:47.960 can somehow be put on a birth certificate as if they also bore the child into the world that's

00:26:55.480 that's the difference here that's that's what doesn't make sense and and let's let's just kind

00:27:02.280 think about this for a moment really like let's just think about this i

00:27:08.440 as if as if this wasn't a disturbing enough story on several counts there's a there's a

00:27:13.080 there's a serious sadness there of i don't know what kind of injections or hormones you have to

00:27:17.960 take in order to induce lactation um and obviously for perhaps for women who are having trouble

00:27:23.400 breastfeeding etc that's a that's a valid form of of medication and treatment uh but obviously if

00:27:30.760 your body hasn't gone through the stages of pregnancy and therefore begun to lactate because

00:27:36.520 of course you've just had a child or having a child very soon if your body isn't going through

00:27:41.800 those stages and you force your body through the stages i can't imagine that being good for you

00:27:47.880 and finally something that kind of comes into mind here is one of the things that that really

00:27:53.080 changed not just through the story of christianity though we can get into the monogamy question and

00:27:58.440 christianity in a little bit here but more more importantly one of the things that uh

00:28:05.320 uh one of the things and yeah no pamela i acknowledge that i think that's i think you're

00:28:09.160 right there the operative word is definitely birth i completely agree the one of the things

00:28:14.120 that needs to be kind of understood here is that we got rid of there being just kind of a service

00:28:19.320 class that was this intimate right like having wet nurses like we got rid of that we stopped that

00:28:25.960 It still happens in some parts of the world, but there's still kind of cultural reasons for it, right? There's cultural reasons for it. And we don't have the same cultural reasons for that anymore. We do have kind of means of exchange. So there are women who cannot produce breast milk, and they purchase it from other women. And perhaps there are women who even donate such things.

00:28:48.980 Of course, we also have formula nowadays. So all of that sort of question, the biology of birth and lactation and motherhood and, of course, feeding the baby, all the pieces of that, like that all has interchangeable parts in a lot of ways.

00:29:03.600 But the fundamental issue here is that, like, we're not even talking about, well, I am, you know, some local sheik or something, and I have many, many women in my harem, and they're at different stages of having children anyways, so the one who doesn't have any children, who is not lactating anymore, I mean, or the one who just has trouble, you know, producing breast milk, now I just pass that baby off to the one who is always overly abundant in that area.

00:29:30.020 that's i mean there's a cultural reason for the way that happens and i'm not saying that that's 0.71

00:29:35.200 okay either i'm not a bigamist i'm not i don't think polygamy is okay and i think that canada

00:29:40.100 should do everything for the dignity of women absolutely there is such a thing as um as andropoly

00:29:47.700 or whatever that's paul that's polyamory of bizarrely men there uh being multiple men uh for

00:29:53.460 one woman instead of multiple women for one man i want to say i want to go that this is for both

00:29:57.800 sides men and women it should be one you know one one man one woman uh that's what i believe in

00:30:06.680 and and anything else other than that will be a denigration of the relationship i really believe

00:30:12.360 that i believe that that will undermine the dignity of the other human being um and men

00:30:18.520 are going to make certain comparisons between each other that i mean we don't have to discuss

00:30:22.040 that on this show but women also make certain comparisons between each other and i think if we

00:30:25.640 we went and asked women what they really thought of being in polyamorous relationships, and it's

00:30:30.220 the same with men, and how they feel treated, and how they feel, do they feel properly loved?

00:30:34.780 I think they'd be honest with us and tell us, no, I wish I had exclusivity. And I think anybody who

00:30:39.220 lives monogamy, as hard as monogamy can be, and as difficult as marriage is, I think they wouldn't

00:30:45.400 trade the exclusivity for anything in the world. And I hope not to trade it myself. I am looking

00:30:51.760 forward to being married. I'm looking forward to being exclusive with my future wife. The point

00:30:57.020 being that how does injecting yourself with hormones in order to lactate make sense as a

00:31:04.940 parental role thing if the child's not even biologically related to you and you're doing

00:31:11.820 this to kind of essentially pretend to be the mother of the child. It's not a, oh, I had to

00:31:17.400 assume this role because your mother died or I had to do this out of some kind of other necessity

00:31:22.580 it's like no this is a lifestyle choice in order for me to essentially act up the idea of being

00:31:29.560 your mother as if I carried you for the last I think it's nine solar months 10 lunar months right

00:31:36.120 40 weeks um you can that's that at that point at that point it's just like fur babies and everything

00:31:44.660 else that kind of comes bizarre out of out of I don't want to call them left wing just people

00:31:49.120 who assume that life is perfectly normal the way it's going um which it isn't it's not normal at

00:31:54.060 all it's not normal to to have polyamorous relationships it's not normal for people to

00:32:00.320 not want children uh it's not normal for life to be too expensive to have children it's not normal

00:32:05.520 to live in a world where people don't look twice at you if you're doing something that isn't

00:32:10.180 normative. That's not normal. It's abnormal, right? And what I guess I just can't quite swallow here

00:32:18.340 is that if you're not the mother of the child, and yet you're pretending to be the mother and child

00:32:24.460 to the point where you are literally injecting yourself with something in order to, or taking

00:32:29.700 a medication in order to feed the child non-naturally occurring breast milk, I kind of

00:32:36.480 have to sit there and think to myself like I think you're a little deluded I think that you've lost

00:32:42.420 your grip on reality and that doesn't mean that doesn't mean that there isn't a place for people

00:32:48.660 to help other people who are capable of producing breast milk and whatever else that's not they're

00:32:53.500 not debating that we're saying that you're in this relationship you know that this relationship is

00:32:58.420 a man and two women and a man having his choice between them as as he wills and that's that and

00:33:06.140 And, and the same as it would be for a woman with two men, a choice between them as she

00:33:09.820 wills. 0.64

00:33:10.840 And that, that in order to feel like you're part of this, and I don't even know if I want

00:33:16.740 to call it jealousy, but in order to feel involved in this process, instead of just

00:33:20.180 going and having your own man and your own family, you, you are literally pretending

00:33:25.120 to be the mother of this child to the point where you're manipulating your hormones. 0.67

00:33:29.340 That's pretty serious. 0.91

00:33:30.160 I think that's a problem.

00:33:31.320 I think maybe, you know, I don't know.

00:33:34.280 I would pray for that person, I guess.

00:33:37.980 Well, that's all for that question.

00:33:40.520 We've got a couple more news items up here

00:33:42.640 that we can segue to.

00:33:48.820 We have a couple of different news items up here.

00:33:51.680 I think one of the things that is important here

00:33:54.820 is a northern BC sort of thing.

00:33:57.100 Yeah, we can get into that, into the questions.

00:34:01.820 We're looking through the daily news update

00:34:03.600 that comes from victoria um it's so the victoria legislature for those of you don't know uh

00:34:09.820 produces of course uh you know daily daily updates when with what what has to do with

00:34:16.040 british columbia and it's it's good it's good it it's pretty it's pretty non-partisan which

00:34:21.040 is nice and this actually comes from my old stomping grounds uh uh the face yeah i know

00:34:28.040 it's asking us about facebook this comes from my old stomping as a prince george citizen so let's

00:34:31.920 take a quick uh you know and there and as a final point there's pamela making making the point that

00:34:39.080 not only not only that but what what model uh are these people displaying to the child this is

00:34:44.700 exactly it like what do you want your child to live in a polyamorous relationship or do you want

00:34:49.320 your child to have an exclusive loving monogamous relationship between a husband and a wife that's

00:34:54.960 that's what i want for my child um i don't want i don't want them to think that they're anything

00:35:00.000 less than than loved so northern bc gets a 2.3 million dollar injection for tourism projects

00:35:09.160 the word injections clearly on my mind today you get they get a bunch of money northern bc is

00:35:13.680 getting 2.3 million uh to fund 12 new tourism infrastructure developments uh northern so i live

00:35:19.680 in northern british columbia i think i've told you this before i live in prince george which is of

00:35:23.880 course bc's northern capital uh and we're basically in the dead center of the province it's an

00:35:28.640 interesting little town that's not little it's got 80,000 people we keep we keep seeing construction

00:35:33.640 it should be at 100,000 by now but the point is that it's got a few it's got a few thousand people

00:35:37.720 and uh what's what's kind of happening is northern bc is kind of changing in its development because

00:35:46.340 a lot of people from vancouver are coming up and buying up housing up here because it's cheaper

00:35:50.880 than it is vancouver but of course that's driving our housing prices to the roof that's not what

00:35:54.340 this is about. We'll get back to this in just a second. But the point is that the lifestyle around

00:35:58.760 Prince George is changing. It's really changing. You know, this was a mill worker town not that

00:36:05.260 long ago. This was an industrial town. And let's be clear, there's still industrialization and

00:36:10.380 stuff that happens here. There's still mills. There's still pulp mills. There's machine shops.

00:36:16.000 There's plenty of stuff going on around here. And there is a bit of a working class feeling,

00:36:19.820 you know, at some of the pubs in town and that sort of thing when they're open.

00:36:23.580 but but Prince George is changing into kind of the professional managerial class because

00:36:29.200 of course you can work from anywhere and if you wanted to get out of Vancouver before the pandemic

00:36:34.800 or after now you can move to Prince George and work remotely you can commute to Vancouver in an

00:36:39.760 hour via airplane you can be at waterfront in Vancouver you know if you got from the time you

00:36:46.380 get on the plane to the time you walk out at waterfront from the SkyTrain you could be

00:36:49.940 you could be in downtown vancouver in two ish hours especially if you got no no stowed bag right

00:36:56.360 you just got your carry-on for the day you can walk or for the next two days you just walk off

00:37:00.280 the plane and you're in downtown vancouver for the next three days and only took you an hour to get

00:37:04.100 there you don't even have to drive especially when you're on the skytrain so the point is that

00:37:08.900 that prince orge is changing and one of the things reasons it's changing is the difference

00:37:13.180 in demographics and those demographics want a different kind of reality when it comes to

00:37:18.100 well the cost of living and and well not the cost of living but the amenities around their cost of

00:37:23.220 living and so we'll get back into this right away northern bc is getting a 2.3 million dollar fund

00:37:28.600 to fund 12 new tourism infrastructure developments northern bc tourism association in partnership

00:37:34.540 with community destination management organizations local and regional governments first nations

00:37:39.860 non-profits and other partners have worked together to identify initiatives that will

00:37:44.880 enhance the region's tourism amenities initiatives underway in northern bc tourism

00:37:49.360 include investing in accessibility adaptations implementing comprehensive place making signage

00:37:56.300 and of course letting them tell their stories through cultural the first nations tell their

00:38:01.760 stories through cultural and wayfinding signage largest fund portion of funding has been allotted

00:38:07.080 to the northern bc tourism association alaska highway community society for one million to

00:38:12.440 develop and implement comprehensive side of waifi route for the great northern circle route which

00:38:17.480 i then maybe we could bring that up because i i'm actually kind of lost as to what that is

00:38:22.680 the route is more than a 10-day uh beginning print search and looping throughout northern

00:38:27.420 design showcase area parks attraction okay that's interesting so you just do a big

00:38:31.960 loop well i mean that's kind of obvious but i guess that i guess that what's trying to be

00:38:38.520 emphasized here is that i mean northern bc is changing and so we're getting some more and and

00:38:43.000 that's good i mean that's good like in the sense that i'm glad that we're getting we're getting

00:38:47.820 more signs and we're getting more parks and we're doing more stuff for parks that's all good news

00:38:51.820 i'm glad to hear that yep no but it's it is it is a lot of money though it is a lot of money

00:38:58.620 especially in a pandemic and it's probably all debt financed and the question becomes too how

00:39:03.460 soon before how soon before a lot of that stuff degrades too uh i i mean when you build a board

00:39:08.840 i love boardwalks we all love walking around lakes and stuff like that with a boardwalk

00:39:12.260 but the problem is that as soon as you build it you know and how how long is it going to take

00:39:16.640 before it's not properly maintained and of course the cost of lumber nowadays how much of a board

00:39:21.080 walker they're going to be able to build they'd be better off uh hiring somebody with a sawmill

00:39:25.920 uh to mill the boards at his hourly rate and that way they wouldn't be paying for the value

00:39:30.360 of the boards, it'd just be paying for the value of the labor.

00:39:32.980 But that's an important point.

00:39:35.120 So finally, as part of

00:39:36.500 Stronger BC's economic

00:39:38.460 recovery plan, the province's six tourism

00:39:40.560 regions have received a total of $13.6

00:39:42.680 million to create employment

00:39:44.640 opportunities, attract new businesses, and

00:39:46.520 increase economic diversification within

00:39:48.600 their communities. The targeted regional

00:39:50.520 tourism initiative is one

00:39:52.740 of three infrastructure investment programs

00:39:54.780 for tourism as part of Stronger BC,

00:39:57.060 including the Community Economic

00:39:58.860 recovery infrastructure program stronger bc uh they also have that of course that problem we

00:40:04.200 were talking with ekman about this the other week that there is that investment uh firm uh that's

00:40:09.520 basically being built by by the bc ndp uh it's got a bunch of people on there from the old ndp days

00:40:16.520 and who knows uh who knows what that's gonna how that's gonna go um it's it they're arguing that

00:40:24.680 they don't have to be transparent with the government uh and with the public about where

00:40:28.880 they're going to put that money because it might open up people to uh to judgment and that sort of

00:40:33.020 thing and and and be a well be a couple of different things but uh there's a there's a

00:40:38.880 bunch of problems with that so so this is interesting we're going to kind of pivot to

00:40:44.420 this last one here uh the CAG Canadian Association of Journalists and of course uh yeah Pamela Jones 0.97

00:40:53.860 it's basically corruption. Yeah, I mean, you're not wrong. Just a second here.

00:41:00.540 But those of you wonder, I actually just drink water. I don't drink coffee while I'm on these

00:41:04.440 things because it's already a long enough show and there's no commercial break. So there's no

00:41:08.100 way for me to kind of go off and, you know, head to the restroom if I needed it. So I just drink

00:41:14.140 water very slowly throughout these things. And if I had to drink coffee, I would be in trouble

00:41:19.040 because we all know coffee runs through you pretty fast.

00:41:22.180 So coalition, here we go.

00:41:25.020 CAG, CJFE, Coalition of News Organizations

00:41:28.760 Challenge RCMP Injunction.

00:41:30.840 All right, so a coalition of news organizations

00:41:34.280 and press freedom groups,

00:41:35.360 including the Canadian Association of Journalists,

00:41:37.420 plan to file a legal application

00:41:39.000 seeking the court's assistance

00:41:40.280 to allow journalists substantive access

00:41:42.040 to cover a demonstration against the logging

00:41:44.640 of an old growth forest currently taking place

00:41:47.240 in the Ferry Creek watershed near Port Renfrew, British Columbia.

00:41:51.380 Okay, we're back to the Ferry Creek stuff.

00:41:54.860 In addition to the CAG, the coalition includes Ricochet Media,

00:41:58.600 the Narwhal, Capital Daily, Canada's National Observer,

00:42:01.040 the Aboriginal People's Television Network, APTN.

00:42:03.980 That thing's been around forever.

00:42:05.780 I remember when that thing, I don't even remember when it got started,

00:42:08.180 but it's been around a long time.

00:42:09.560 Canadian journalists for free expression, the discourse, and Indigenews.

00:42:14.540 Interesting.

00:42:14.900 Over the past week, we've repeatedly seen the RCMP shift the goalposts on how it plans to allow journalists access in order to cover this important public interest story.

00:42:24.520 Every day is a new day with new excuses from the RCMP about why access is limited, enough is enough.

00:42:31.240 And that was from Brent Jolly, the CAJ president.

00:42:36.860 The RCMP have been using broad exclusion zones to interfere with members of the media for at least eight years across multiple provinces.

00:42:44.120 Legal precedent in the RCMP's own oversight body

00:42:46.420 say doing so is beyond the authority of the force,

00:42:48.720 but it keeps happening.

00:42:49.900 What's at stake here is nothing less

00:42:51.000 than the public's right to know.

00:42:52.480 I'm going to stop there.

00:42:53.760 Here's an interesting,

00:42:54.860 there was an interesting blog or article

00:42:57.240 or something that was written way back in the day.

00:42:59.320 And this was about,

00:43:01.120 I think this was the rally in Florida

00:43:04.500 for the Republicans,

00:43:06.780 back for Bush's second term,

00:43:09.740 I want to say.

00:43:10.340 uh it what happens is what what happened was they they controlled the media to the point where

00:43:18.980 uh it was just you were just in this little tent basically you're in this little tent

00:43:25.200 uh and you were stuck in that little tent and uh

00:43:30.500 i just need to double check uh this actually um could you make sure that we've sent the link right

00:43:39.760 yeah okay just double checking so they had this control opposition basically thing happened with

00:43:45.620 the media so they were in this little tent like this little tent city basically right they were

00:43:49.560 in all these little palisades or whatever those are called uh not palisades that's uh that's the

00:43:54.660 thing around around a fort uh pavilion is the word i was looking for uh they're in these little

00:43:59.880 pavilions but there's like this perfect wire mesh fencing right that's been kind of almost driven

00:44:03.860 into the ground into the asphalt and they see the president united states go in they see the

00:44:07.240 president united states and of course they're shouting at the president they'd like to talk to

00:44:10.500 they don't get to see any of the rallies it's all live stream to them out there on screens they don't

00:44:15.960 get to be in a press gallery inside of the uh the florida rally uh for the president and it's and

00:44:21.680 like this kind of control and a lot of they had a lot of police around to make sure that they

00:44:26.820 couldn't go anywhere look i respect our our friends in uniform i really do um

00:44:32.340 and uh what's uh what i want what i want to be clear about is i don't think that the rcmp

00:44:38.880 like the average member at rcm rcmp i don't i don't think the average constable or the average

00:44:46.180 our average corporal or sergeant it walks around thinking to themselves how do i you know intimidate

00:44:51.780 the press today i don't think they do that that being said i think the press doesn't earn any

00:44:55.980 points when it does go after RCMP for things like say wearing their carbine during July 1st as they

00:45:02.940 walk through the local park because that happened here in Prince George. I remember a local RCMP

00:45:08.980 officer getting quite upset and writing a letter. I didn't expect it to be published. He just wrote

00:45:14.020 it to the editor trying to correct the record and basically be like look like it's a lot easier for

00:45:19.460 me to take out somebody who is trying to hurt other people by using my carbine than it is to

00:45:25.100 use my sidearm you know a pistol is a lot harder to maneuver is a lot less accurate at distance

00:45:30.960 at range than a carbine is right then the c i think that would be the c8 because the c7 is

00:45:36.920 the full length rifle the c8 is the uh the shorter carbine but the point is that he published that

00:45:43.880 letter the local editor here and that was pretty funny it was a bit of a back and forth inside the

00:45:47.220 detachment over whether or not he should have written that letter but this is the point so

00:45:51.200 The journalists do themselves no favor by questioning the RCMP on the methods that they have at their disposal in order to do their best to keep us safe.

00:45:59.380 That doesn't help anything.

00:46:00.480 And it's not like the average constable has a vote on that.

00:46:03.200 They don't get to vote on that.

00:46:04.600 That's something their higher-ups told them to do.

00:46:06.720 The flip side of the equation is that the RCMP and all police throughout the world do have a legacy of trying to interfere with the media because they don't like bad press.

00:46:17.120 And who likes bad press?

00:46:18.100 Nobody does.

00:46:18.660 And so there's just people acting in their interest.

00:46:20.620 But in this respect, the Ferry Creek question is something that ought to be actually investigated pretty well, because there's some serious debase to be had.

00:46:31.200 I'm a First Nations person. We've talked about this on the show. I'm a First Nations person. I have a status card. I'm an Indian.

00:46:37.880 And I hold very particular views about economic development. I'm very pro-development.

00:46:43.460 very pro uh the ownership of development being uh for the aboriginal group that's developing it and

00:46:49.700 therefore then they can finally have that wealth and then that wealth can help their people and

00:46:53.380 then their people can be out of poverty that's a beautiful thing i want my brothers and sisters 0.99

00:46:57.540 out of poverty the issue here is that the irony of course is that there's a lot of aboriginal workers

00:47:02.900 here and then they're being protested against by non-aboriginals and and there's this weird kind of 0.95

00:47:08.580 double whammy of reverse racism and everything else where non-aboriginals are telling telling 0.52

00:47:15.140 aboriginals how to be an aboriginal and that they haven't they've disowned their heritage by cutting 0.94

00:47:20.260 down uh the trees and and making logs of them of course i mean again we're about that stuart parker

00:47:27.220 on he's going to have some some some takes for us when it comes to that question and other things

00:47:32.340 uh i i love trees too i just love them differently the point though is that i think when it comes to

00:47:40.140 the question of press access we can't have real discussions about this issue if the press doesn't

00:47:44.560 have access to it and so we need to be honest about that we need the press to have access to

00:47:49.180 things i'm i'm a i'm a stay-at-home journalist i don't i don't go out into the field either i would

00:47:55.220 like to go out into the field a bit more i think as things develop we're still getting a feel for

00:47:59.340 this show we're still just getting our feet wet this is episode 24 i believe so that's eight weeks

00:48:05.200 that we've been on the air uh we're very young we have and i've as i've said many times any

00:48:09.940 suggestions that you guys have we'd appreciate it uh so that we can do the best job we can for you

00:48:14.960 we're actually going to be moving the studio this weekend so that's going to be a whole thing um

00:48:19.400 hopefully where we broadcast from next uh has the same quality uh that we've had here so hopefully

00:48:25.860 that all turns out well but do be patient with us next week because we might have there might be

00:48:30.420 some technical difficulties as we work out some of the bugs we'll do our best to do some test

00:48:34.140 broadcast beforehand so that we don't have any problems but uh no and that is uh that is a good

00:48:40.260 suggestion there pamela uh clarence louis of the asoyos band has a lot of common sense we should

00:48:44.780 we should reach out to him we should make a note of that and so here we are uh with the question

00:48:51.560 of the press and the press needs access to things and uh we're just going to double check that

00:48:57.960 everything's good to go um and and the press needs access to things and you can't bar them

00:49:06.400 from things otherwise otherwise the people don't have their eyes and ears to know what the

00:49:10.560 government is doing and to know what authorities are doing and quite possibly quite possibly

00:49:15.180 leading to to uh abuse that's apparently and we're going to pivot to one last thing before we leave

00:49:23.360 here we're going to we're leave we're not leaving we're just going on to our guests which is stewart

00:49:27.480 parker this week rose west had something interesting to say this week rose west has become a

00:49:32.200 recent uh commenter of mine uh sounds like they want you to diversify to be more like them hence

00:49:38.400 vote like them uh that's in reference to what what's being changed around here when it comes

00:49:42.600 to infrastructure and the parks and stuff like that i i want to i want to be careful here because

00:49:47.560 i think there's a right-wing way and a conservative way to like parks okay i don't think parks are

00:49:52.660 just liberal ideas it's like saying libraries are liberal ideas okay uh libraries parks uh civil

00:49:59.380 civil uh services that are are are leisure based if there's a difference between a conservative

00:50:05.460 and a libertarian for that matter it is that the libertarian is always nattering away at something

00:50:10.800 and doesn't believe in leisure being a common good you get to go do that in your backyard but

00:50:15.400 the idea that anybody else might pay for your leisure uh is nonsense um that's that is a problem

00:50:22.560 i mean we conservatives believe in leisure and we believe that you know other people not that

00:50:27.520 other people pay for it but if we we all contribute to the pile right like i get leisure from walking

00:50:33.080 down my sidewalk well we all paid for that sidewalk right that's part of the common good

00:50:37.560 It's the same with riding in a, you know, the bike lanes don't need to be where bike lanes don't need to be. But bike paths in general, who doesn't love doing that with their kids? They want to go on a little bike ride. Who doesn't love going four wheeling somewhere in the back in the backwoods? Well, who's maintaining those? Who's maintaining the cabin where you're headed to? That's being maintained voluntarily by other backwoods people. That's good. You know, that's good. But that's exactly it.

00:51:06.720 it's it's common ground it's the and this is the thing it's the tragedy of the commons too

00:51:12.800 you submit for something you pay you pay money for something and somebody else ruins it and that

00:51:17.520 makes you feel very offended very betrayed and that hurts well exactly so this is why we have

00:51:23.040 police this is why we have all sorts of rules and regulations around how to treat things and what

00:51:28.000 happens if you abuse things but the best society is a voluntary society and that includes voluntarily

00:51:35.200 doing things that you might not see all the benefit of,

00:51:38.960 but someone else might.

00:51:40.280 And that person in turn, you know,

00:51:42.480 gets some mental relaxation, some reset

00:51:44.980 and some relaxation.

00:51:49.500 They go on to be a better citizen because of that, right?

00:51:54.000 And it's an interplay, right?

00:51:55.480 Your kid doesn't play on the soccer field all the time.

00:51:58.500 And there are people who are young students

00:52:00.120 who don't even pay taxes,

00:52:01.140 who go to the soccer field and play.

00:52:04.120 And that's that.

00:52:05.200 Jonathan Spence is making the point to that leftists want to ban four-wheelers from

00:52:10.200 the backcountry happened hard happened here in Alberta with the NDP well I'm sorry to hear that

00:52:17.980 because it's kind of silly obviously four-wheelers are the only ways to are the only way to kind of

00:52:25.360 travel through some of the backcountry because it's just too expansive and horses cost a lot

00:52:30.160 of money but uh and that's and that's actually a good point there we'll leave that with rose west

00:52:36.640 and we'll do one quick uh one quick jaunt over to the canadian border question i'm all for parks but

00:52:41.300 not for slowly taking over local business by big misses and pricing locals out that that is a

00:52:47.460 brilliant observation okay that's a brilliant observation because parks can drive up property

00:52:52.460 assessments which in turn drive up taxes which in turn cause small businesses to have to move

00:52:59.200 that's true but the problem there is how do we tax that i i'm still struggling with this i would

00:53:09.360 like to have property taxes eliminated because i think they're redundant in the time we live in

00:53:13.160 your house is worth exactly what someone will pay for it and the idea that somebody from the

00:53:17.140 government is going to tell you what your house is worth is insane but at the same time how then

00:53:23.040 are we going to fund our regional districts i i personally think that there's just be merchant tax

00:53:27.740 out there with guests and stuff like that. But I'm willing to have that debate. So why don't you

00:53:33.160 put it in the comments? I love horses too, Pam. But how would you pay for the things we need to

00:53:45.260 pay for by changing the property tax system? Because that's exactly it. Municipalities depend

00:53:50.700 on property taxes. How do we take it from that property tax question and into a consumption tax

00:53:55.700 question that's that's that's kind of my my vote but uh we're going to take one last look here on

00:54:01.860 the news yeah i some apparently it might it might uh it might open i i doubt it uh but hey

00:54:16.420 it's a proven false this was fake news um let's take a quick look here uh reports that u.s

00:54:25.700 border to canada could reopen as soon as june 22nd uh untrue uh 10 pinocchios apparently

00:54:32.340 u.s government sources tell global news that reports they will unilaterally open the border

00:54:36.260 with canada on june 22nd are not true earlier on wednesday len sanders unknown immigration

00:54:41.420 are based in blaine washington said high level means have been held in washington dc on tuesday

00:54:45.080 and officials from the peace search port of entry were involved and what i was told is that

00:54:50.300 instructions came out of the headquarters that the border will be fully reopening

00:54:53.840 for June 22nd in just over three weeks. The

00:54:58.060 Canada-US border has been shut down for more than a year amid the ongoing COVID-19

00:55:02.020 pandemic. Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced last week the Canadian border will remain closed until

00:55:06.100 June 21st. Right now, about half of the Canadian population has received

00:55:10.160 at least one dose of the vaccine.

00:55:14.620 The border remains open for essential

00:55:18.280 travel to avoid disrupting the flow of food, medical supplies, and other crucial goods

00:55:21.400 between two countries.

00:55:23.360 So we're at 10 Pinocchios on that vote.

00:55:25.920 I'm sorry.

00:55:26.700 I apologize.

00:55:28.440 Well, not apologize, but to whomever made that comment, it's actually just at the top

00:55:34.180 there.

00:55:34.560 Who told us this?

00:55:37.220 Scrolling up just a little bit.

00:55:39.920 Oh, Pam.

00:55:40.640 I'm sorry, Pam, but you have been proven false.

00:55:44.620 That's whatever.

00:55:45.600 I mean, I said something the opposite of what it was.

00:55:49.200 And I mean, earlier today, I thought I was going to get to rag on an NDP and it turned out it was a BC Liberal.

00:55:53.580 So, I mean, we all make mistakes.

00:55:55.900 But the point is that I'm sure that the border with the United States will actually open not so long from now.

00:56:02.760 It might open as soon as September.

00:56:05.080 And I don't think that this has anything to do with the vaccine, the experimental jab or anything else.

00:56:11.220 I don't think it has anything to do with the case numbers.

00:56:13.180 I think at this point, one, I think a lot of the actions that were taken by all governments last year, let alone these two governments, the Canadian and the American one, was in order to oust Donald Trump from the presidency.

00:56:24.820 And that's been achieved by hook, by crook, and by a lot of weird, weird voting patterns that have never been seen before.

00:56:31.840 But we'll get into that another time.

00:56:33.000 Uh, but the bigger thing for me is that in, uh, and what's gone here, uh, gone on here with the

00:56:41.700 border, uh, the border has to reopen because people have to get across it and we can't have,

00:56:46.500 we can't have a closed border or else your economy is just going to suddenly fall apart.

00:56:50.760 I was a part of this last year. Last year, I was in an industry that was in tourism.

00:56:56.500 Uh, I was in a tourism, uh, job last year after I got laid off from COVID. I went up into Churchill,

00:57:02.480 manitoba and i was a guide up there and uh showing people polar bears and belugas and that sort of

00:57:07.600 stuff and 90 of our traffic is usually american 95 of our traffic is usually american they all come

00:57:14.560 up from the states they go through big touring countries that do adventure tourism and they get

00:57:18.480 shown the belugas in the summer and some bears if there's bears around and then into the uh early

00:57:22.960 fall winter early winter we're into we're into bear season and you see bears wandering around

00:57:28.800 on the ice it's really cute little cute bears and everything else that's pam it's totally okay i

00:57:35.680 shouldn't have called you out like that i'm sorry that was there's no need to no need to castigate

00:57:40.160 anyone i i made a lot of mistakes earlier so i not only do i forgive you i i apologize because

00:57:45.600 there's no need to it wasn't like you were claiming something you know you weren't talking

00:57:50.240 about space aliens or something like and even so like i mean this is a free expression show if you

00:57:54.160 want to talk about that stuff go ahead i might i might i might pick on you but you know it's your

00:58:00.480 comments you go ahead but again i'm sorry pan uh the point being that no here we are uh with the

00:58:07.360 u.s border still closed uh and the canadian border still closed and i think that what's going to

00:58:11.840 happen is we're not going to uh we're not going to continue down this road very long because people

00:58:20.800 because people just can't stand it anymore but also because the authorities understand that

00:58:23.840 that we're kind of we're kind of stuck. We're kind of done with the pro forma, you can only

00:58:29.180 put people through a war so many times, you can only put them through the crisis of the bombs

00:58:33.840 falling from the sky so many times people have about, depending on where you're counting from a

00:58:37.740 three, you know, to six to 10 to, you know, 15 or 18 month time limit on how long they can deal

00:58:47.320 with stuff like this. And we're going to be at 20-ish months when we, if we do fully open up

00:58:54.540 in September, we will have gone through a 20-month period of various curtailments of civil liberties

00:59:00.360 and some serious issues to our economy. And that's probably about as much gas as anybody has in the

00:59:06.620 tank to survive. Not saying like even economically, I just mean like the mental capacity, even your

00:59:13.560 healthiest people, 20 months is a long time. There are many wars that were longer than that. But

00:59:19.240 unlike that, where there was real developments, both positive and negative, this has been mostly

00:59:24.460 just a negative journey with a lot of civil liberties destroyed. So that's, yeah, Carol

00:59:31.700 Gallant puts a point. It's been 15 months, longest pandemic ever. Yeah. And I'm just kind of counting

00:59:36.540 out towards September there in the late fall. And this is the question. This is the question.

00:59:42.000 When is this all going to come together? I don't know. I'm going to just make sure that our guest is on deck. Ready for you. See if he's able to get here. And as I kind of play myself out here in this section, I think that, again, coming back to the central point that was made at the beginning here, I am cautiously optimistic.

01:00:10.340 But it's not because I somehow think that we've cured COVID or there never was COVID or we, you know, there's everybody suddenly our friend again or our authorities have woken up and realized how wrong they were.

01:00:26.960 It's the nature of power.

01:00:29.820 It's the nature of power.

01:00:31.360 Power always corrupts.

01:00:32.940 Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

01:00:34.520 And the thing that we need to remember is that absolute power doesn't just corrupt absolutely, but deeper than that, we have a kind of government that, I think we should remember this.

01:00:59.360 i think we should remember it this way the first world war started at a precise moment in time and

01:01:06.560 it started a precise moment in time and space because that's when the train schedules ran best

01:01:12.320 okay so train schedules determined that the beginning of world war one wasn't a shot being

01:01:18.240 fired on either side there of course was the assassination of archduke ferdinand but the there

01:01:22.960 was there was a a moment where the war had to begin and the way they picked that moment wasn't

01:01:28.960 even well i mean this is a good time to go to war because it's summer or whatever or this is a good

01:01:33.360 time to go to war because that's what god is telling us to do it's like no we are going to

01:01:38.320 war on this time this place this world right now because this is the train schedule that's when we

01:01:44.400 can get all the soldiers loaded in the train and ship them to the front and quickly invade as for

01:01:49.360 for germany going into france quickly invade uh france that's that we're going to do the schlieffen

01:01:54.800 plan and so the schlieffen plan was put all the soldiers onto the border and then march them

01:01:58.640 them across the border and take over France as quickly as possible. And that was determined by

01:02:05.240 none other than the train schedule. So that's where it all started, right? And we need to be

01:02:14.040 honest out there. Our guest is having some technical difficulties on this side. So I'm

01:02:20.620 going to continue discussing this question of technocracy. I really like coming back to the

01:02:24.720 question of technocracy because i really believe that it is actually the fundamental point of

01:02:29.760 everything right now it's technocracy now what is technocracy technocracy is is what we live in right

01:02:36.680 now and it's it's everything from them losing your duplicate form right for the third time it's it's

01:02:42.140 everything from they can't find that form they can't find uh you can't the printer's down and

01:02:48.020 all of a sudden that means the government grinds to a halt well we can't print off any more forms

01:02:51.840 for you to fill out it's like well i have my id here don't you just have a piece of paper i could

01:02:55.920 sign and deal with that um and that's and that's what we can do but in any case uh that's enough

01:03:01.360 of me ranting about technocracy and everything else we're gonna bring stewart parker on here

01:03:05.680 live uh he's coming to us from i'm trying to remember where exactly but uh he's gonna tell

01:03:11.140 us i'm sure uh hey you're you're you're at a you're at a hotel sorry about i'm sorry about

01:03:18.020 this nathan i am i'm still fixing my computer problems so i'm joining you from my phone so

01:03:25.100 apologies for the low sound and light quality here i'm going to try and get the actual proper

01:03:32.020 machine working uh imminently i understand anyway i um i had to make a business trip down to

01:03:41.360 vancouver so um you're um you're reaching me in the um sylvia hotel uh next to stanley park

01:03:49.540 oh well and we were just talking about parks you know one of my favorite hotels right there

01:03:54.680 steward is the english bay hotel uh because the english bay hotel let you rent an entire

01:03:59.760 apartment's worth of space for 150 a night it's really nice uh right next to the cactus club and

01:04:05.860 you and all your friends can go to the cactus club after you're graduated maybe have a little

01:04:10.120 bit too much and then everybody can fall asleep in the apartment uh hotel that is a pretty sweet

01:04:17.700 deal the sylvia similarly is shockingly affordable for no apparent reason so i guess vancouver

01:04:24.820 finally has a hotel glut i guess airbnb does ruin everything speaking of of airbnb and uh the slow

01:04:32.520 descent of late capitalism into complete insanity uh what what what do you think of our new reopenings

01:04:39.660 and everything else. I'm sure that the loosening of restrictions has brought warm the coddles of

01:04:44.340 your heart. Why not be a little more careful? Supposedly, we'll all be double vaccinated in

01:04:55.720 three months. What's the hurry? I think there was an epidemiologist who referred to Dr. Henry's

01:05:02.540 policies as the kill half the mice in the apartment plan and i think that's that's basically

01:05:12.140 it i was doing some sort of back of the napkin math uh yesterday we have quadrupled the death

01:05:18.540 rate of nova scotia and new brunswick um and even uh even higher comparison to uh newfoundland and

01:05:28.140 PEI. All in all, that adds up to 1,200 extra corpses in the past year, which is, I would

01:05:42.680 argue, not an insignificant number. This is not just about preventing people from having

01:05:51.780 a bad time uh there's something like this lives really are at stake and we're making decisions

01:06:00.820 about how many of our neighbors should die i think that people often um often want to complicate

01:06:08.760 things beyond that because it's distasteful to say how many of my neighbors should i kill

01:06:15.840 to make sure that the Cactus Club doesn't go bankrupt? 1.00

01:06:23.380 How many of my neighbors should I kill 0.95

01:06:25.800 to make sure the Ramada doesn't close? 0.96

01:06:32.260 And my numbers for that are very low. 0.98

01:06:37.580 I think that we are choosing to kill extra people

01:06:43.560 because the government doesn't want to guarantee loans to the hospitality industry and it doesn't 0.52

01:06:51.100 want to bail out the hospitality industry. And the thing is that BC's hospitality industry has

01:06:57.320 been setting the policies on COVID since the beginning. You can read it on the internet.

01:07:03.660 you can go to the bc lobbyist registry and um look up uh my pal bill thielman and others uh

01:07:13.020 their lobbying work for um brewers vintners hoteliers and you can actually time uh certain

01:07:23.180 restrictions uh particularly the decision to uh i guess the the most the most obvious one would be

01:07:32.300 the decision to cancel the Prince Rupert quarantine and the Haida Gwaii quarantine.

01:07:39.080 There, there's really a smoking gun. He'll say, all right, well, there are some hotels that might

01:07:45.220 go bankrupt on Haida Gwaii, so I guess we need more people on Haida Gwaii to die.

01:07:52.580 You know, I think if there's one thing that this whole COVID experience has done,

01:07:56.980 is that across the political spectrum, people of various stripes have used the idea of the

01:08:04.320 sacredness of human life as part of their political rhetoric. And I don't think the

01:08:10.740 left and right are different on this. I think both groups have consistently used that as a

01:08:18.700 rhetorical point. And we can see that it's just nonsense. We can see that human life

01:08:26.780 is not sacred. It might be valuable, but clearly there's a value, a price tag that one can

01:08:32.480 put on it. And what's really shocking is that Bonnie Henry thinks that that's her job, 0.88

01:08:39.640 Because in other jurisdictions, it's the politicians who decide, you know, how many human lives to sacrifice for a business objective.

01:08:53.900 And she's been very explicit that business objectives are a part of her calculation.

01:09:02.060 And they form a significant factor.

01:09:09.640 Now, the thing is, you know, people go, well, why is this producing different policies in B.C.?

01:09:17.640 And the simple answer is that it is that we are a heavily, heavily indebted province.

01:09:28.480 And if you look at the sectors of the economy that are consistently reopened at a cost of human life, they're the sectors in which people are making monthly payments, not yearly payments.

01:09:46.560 And sectors where there's a seasonal productive period that you have to hit.

01:09:53.820 And so the hospitality sector is not like other provinces, especially in greater Vancouver, because you have crippling commercial property taxes and you have very significant levels of debt, mortgages and the like, and the banks aren't going to give you three months.

01:10:20.980 You look at a place like Nova Scotia and you see that although it too relies on tourism, you see nothing like the level of consumer debt, nothing like the level of monthly business property taxes that you have to ante up if you're operating on Robson Street or at Metrotown or something.

01:10:42.920 Now, I believe I've got my machine working here,

01:10:46.240 so I'm going to try and enter the studio again as a different version of me.

01:10:51.120 Very good.

01:10:52.580 Hey, look at that.

01:10:53.300 It's you.

01:10:54.580 All right, then.

01:10:55.840 I think I'll...

01:10:57.340 No video yet, Stuart.

01:10:59.300 No video yet.

01:11:00.320 All right.

01:11:00.880 Well, it'll take a little while to appear.

01:11:05.200 Sometimes computer companies give you too much choice about what you want,

01:11:10.480 and you choose something that is too cheap to work.

01:11:14.660 Anyway, so I think it's really important to recognize

01:11:17.860 that if we look at which parts of the economy

01:11:20.500 the government will make the biggest sacrifices for,

01:11:25.420 it's not a coincidental thing.

01:11:28.220 It's not a random thing.

01:11:30.420 And I see there is a blurry version of me over there.

01:11:36.040 Your computer's camera is not as high quality, I guess,

01:11:39.480 as your phone's camera.

01:11:40.260 Just hang on. I'm going to try one other thing

01:11:43.220 to see if I can make

01:11:45.160 this thing work properly.

01:11:49.640 All right.

01:11:51.620 Anyway,

01:11:52.680 sorry about this, Nathan. I really did

01:11:55.180 not anticipate 0.58

01:11:56.180 this level of nonsense. 0.60

01:11:59.300 One second.

01:12:00.700 Not a problem.

01:12:04.920 We do.

01:12:07.600 That's how it is. We don't have

01:12:09.180 commercials to break to.

01:12:10.260 yeah i know it's uh i mean in a way it's exciting live tv it recalls the 1950s but

01:12:18.680 uh there are only some parts of the 50s we want back probably not this part uh

01:12:24.600 worry about that yeah it's not a problem could you could you give us a little bit of uh of a

01:12:31.620 background on the question of essential uh because i was talking about it earlier that if i if i call

01:12:36.280 correctly it was the bc ambulance service who was decided uh to decided they wanted to agitate for

01:12:44.380 more wages and so they were trying to withhold services but of course that meant people would die

01:12:49.420 so the bc liberals i believe legislated them as an essential service which resulted in more

01:12:55.500 overtime which resulted in higher pay but they or danger pay or something and they and so they got

01:13:01.860 what they wanted but not the way they're supposed to get it they got it because they were made

01:13:05.220 essential. Can you can you explain a little bit more how in British Columbia, the relationship

01:13:09.840 between our government and the people under it sometimes gets very backwards when it comes to

01:13:15.320 these things? Well, so first of all, let me say that the definition of essential per this pandemic

01:13:21.520 is completely unrelated to the definition of essential in labor law. So there is absolutely

01:13:29.500 no similarity. That if you're declared an essential service for the purposes of COVID,

01:13:37.740 this has nothing to do with your designation as essential. So to give you an example,

01:13:46.000 this two days ago last year, sport fishing was declared an essential service.

01:13:52.100 so uh i think that gives you a sense of the breadth of essential so essential means anything

01:14:00.800 the government calls essential um to uh to deal with the finances of these two precarious sectors

01:14:09.380 of the economy now i'm in vancouver was it essential travel well there's a discussion of

01:14:16.880 this, where the provincial government

01:14:18.460 explains it. So the definition

01:14:20.920 of essential travel is

01:14:22.900 any travel you say is essential.

01:14:26.120 There is

01:14:26.960 absolutely no objective standard.

01:14:30.240 All right, there we go.

01:14:31.100 One second.

01:14:33.060 One second here. All right, I think

01:14:35.080 we've done it. 0.97

01:14:39.140 Oh, bloody hell. 0.99

01:14:47.680 You should be good to go, Stuart. 0.99

01:14:55.080 All right, let's try that again.

01:14:57.180 Very good.

01:14:58.280 So you're in Vancouver, and the debate of central travel goes on.

01:15:05.660 Sorry, could you say that again?

01:15:06.880 I just was getting my earbuds in.

01:15:08.980 No, no, not a problem.

01:15:09.840 The debate of central travel goes on as we travel to Vancouver.

01:15:15.400 We're live with Stuart Parker.

01:15:16.640 So they did actually pull people over the first weekend that they had the no non-essential travel between health regions.

01:15:29.800 And it's quite funny if you read the reports about it because it's the police having to coach people to use the word essential because they keep asking, like, well, why are you going?

01:15:42.500 and if you look up the definition of essential travel it is to do anything for work or as a

01:15:52.480 volunteer so the fact that i'm going to get my institute's bank account straightened out because

01:16:00.420 i can't do it from prince george um that vastly exceeds these standards uh for essential travel

01:16:10.040 under the order a lawyer friend of mine put it this way he said i would really struggle to see

01:16:17.080 how someone could violate this order ah that that essentially as long as you remember that word

01:16:24.840 essential it is impossible to violate the order so i think that um of course these orders do have

01:16:35.000 an effect they do reduce travel um but they reduce travel on a voluntary compliance basis

01:16:44.920 and the focus of the provincial health officer is to communicate with british colombians which

01:16:52.280 should also tell you something important so if you are a tourist from out of province

01:16:59.320 you will have heard nothing about the essential travel order your hotel reservation won't have

01:17:05.320 been cancelled your bus ticket won't have been cancelled and your hotel won't have notified you

01:17:12.280 that there's an essential travel order in effect so on the one hand lifting the restrictions uh

01:17:19.160 probably will uh kill some more people um but on the other hand really what restrictions

01:17:27.400 it's more lifting the fiction of restrictions will kill people because people respond not just 0.96

01:17:34.200 to fact but to fiction when the government is the one slinging it no it's true it's true you're back

01:17:43.000 in your hometown of vancouver uh obviously it's a little bit it's a little bit different than

01:17:48.280 the place you grew up in why don't you tell us a little bit about what how how the place was

01:17:53.480 when you were there uh in your youth and how it is now and and maybe some disappointment that

01:17:58.520 happened well um i mean i think a lot of people uh have had the experience it was funny i was um

01:18:08.360 uh i went down with uh my inventor friend who uh um needed to test again vastly exceeding the

01:18:18.600 essential criterion um my uh my friend art uh former city counselor and physicist uh built a

01:18:28.360 charging adapter for really old electric vehicles because you try and plug the new electric vehicles

01:18:36.840 if you try and plug old electric vehicles into the new charging stations um they overheat the

01:18:42.040 battery and the vehicle shuts down for the day so you have to like be very judicious and plug

01:18:47.960 and unplug and incompletely charge your vehicle and all this nonsense so art built a little adapter

01:18:54.200 so that he could charge his terrible terrible car so um in our 14 and a half hour drive to vancouver

01:19:04.440 where i got to discover all of these strange strange places bc hydro thinks they should put

01:19:10.360 a charging station um during that drive uh folks uh i ran into folks um who were talking about this

01:19:20.040 very thing that in fact now if you talk to vancouverites even if they haven't left vancouver

01:19:26.520 there is this incredible consensus that the city is getting worse um and of course the affordability

01:19:35.640 crisis sits at the heart of all this that you have a situation where people often talk about

01:19:44.200 real estate speculation there is no such thing as real estate speculation in vancouver

01:19:50.680 real estate in vancouver is as close to a sure thing as anything you can possibly imagine

01:19:59.240 the chances that if you buy a piece of property in vancouver and hold on to it

01:20:06.600 for two years there's a 100 chance that you will make money so there is no real estate speculation

01:20:13.960 there is simply buying real estate in vancouver is like purchasing um a um is like purchasing

01:20:23.720 securities right or you know it's actually more secure than purchasing securities stocks can go

01:20:29.960 down this is like buying a guaranteed income certificate but with eight times the interest rate

01:20:37.240 so if you can get into the market if you have that sort of million dollar minimum if once you've

01:20:46.520 cleared that um why wouldn't you use vancouver real estate instead of a bank there's absolutely

01:20:55.480 no reason not to do that and this means that vancouverites are divided into two groups

01:21:04.440 the rich and people who think living in vancouver is way too important um now if

01:21:11.720 If you're tied to Vancouver by work,

01:21:13.560 of course you can't leave.

01:21:16.100 And people are stuck on this horrible treadmill.

01:21:19.940 But in many ways, only certain kinds of work

01:21:22.900 can tie you to Vancouver.

01:21:25.360 When the NDP first got in,

01:21:30.260 I was invited by Sue Hamill,

01:21:34.340 the old party boss for Surrey,

01:21:36.700 to come to this public sort of conference

01:21:42.480 that her new lobbying firm was putting on,

01:21:44.960 because obviously you get out of the legislature

01:21:48.780 and you open a lobbying firm.

01:21:50.780 And so the last panel, and I'm so glad,

01:21:56.640 I'm so glad I stayed for it,

01:22:00.560 was three people sort of looking at the economic future

01:22:04.800 of BC in a kind of blue sky way. Except, of course, these folks were third-wayers. For

01:22:14.620 those who don't know the term, third-wayers are essentially pro-austerity social democrats.

01:22:25.940 So every social democratic party that was in power anywhere in the world in the 1990s

01:22:32.100 became a third-way party because everybody

01:22:35.400 loved austerity and deregulation in the 90s.

01:22:38.700 So you often don't hear people from that particular political

01:22:45.340 bent honestly describing the future they do see

01:22:49.340 and the future they want to see.

01:22:51.420 Normally, in order for the NDP to retain its voter base,

01:22:56.280 it has to dishonestly describe the future it imagines

01:23:00.420 um the future it desires because there's a mismatch between the policies and the voter base

01:23:06.660 and new democrats will become offended if the ndp simply tells them what the policies they've

01:23:13.940 implemented are doing so i was listening to these three guys and it was a real like we're all amongst

01:23:20.340 friends here environment and of course i was a lobbyist for 30 seconds um it's not like i can't

01:23:27.220 pass in a crowd of lobbyists uh so you know know how to be polite but they had these panelists on

01:23:35.140 and they were talking about the affordability crisis in vancouver and they sketched out

01:23:42.660 a vision of the city and they talked about how like the future that they really wanted to see

01:23:49.060 was to make Vancouver like the Hong Kong area, the Pearl River Delta in China. We could have

01:24:02.980 like a megalopolis of 12 million people. We'd put a fixed link across House Sound. We'd

01:24:09.920 put a fixed link to Vancouver Island. We would surround Georgia Strait in concrete. And of

01:24:18.380 of course, this would be for the new LNG terminal in Squamish, the new LNG terminal in Delta,

01:24:29.180 and the new bitumen terminal in Burnaby for the Trans Mountain Twinning. And so we'd

01:24:38.240 have these millions of people and we'd have Uber and Lyft. But of course, there would

01:24:45.620 an affordability problem right because you see how people are living in hong kong

01:24:49.780 they're living in like a family in a five by ten foot room and one of the walls is made out of

01:24:55.700 chain link fence so i said well you know there's some real innovation in the construction industry

01:25:02.500 in vancouver um the smarter construction companies especially the ones that use temporary foreign

01:25:08.980 workers um are using um their workers to build a barracks for the workers to live in on the

01:25:19.060 construction site for the duration of the project and they started sort of blue sky in this thing

01:25:26.680 and they went you know um and then you know they don't have to live in vancouver because it's not

01:25:31.420 their kind of city anyway they can you know if they can be like rig workers right they can um

01:25:38.160 you know three weeks in one week off fly in fly out and they can live in like fort mac or kamloops

01:25:46.320 or prince george a town where like regular people live with their you know simple lifestyle and uh

01:25:54.880 and they're like and you know this is and then they went you know this is really the

01:25:59.920 the thin edge of the wedge because there's no reason not to do this with all um

01:26:05.280 um uh all sectors of the economy where wages are low we should move to a system where the person

01:26:13.360 serving you in starbucks doesn't live in the city uh because the wages that starbucks pays even

01:26:19.200 though they're better than some are are just too low to live on in vancouver now and real estate's

01:26:26.400 only going to get more expensive so we so soon every company will just you know for low wage

01:26:33.840 workers will have company housing and they'll fly their workers in and out.

01:26:40.720 And it's like, well, so that's what you see behind the curtain. What you see is a city

01:26:51.040 of people who are clearly, as G.K. Chesterton would say, unsatisfied that they are unique

01:26:59.860 in the eyes of god and so they need to so um and richard florida really is to blame for this and

01:27:11.860 he um not not entirely of course but but he he did apologize he's the guy who created the idea of the 0.58

01:27:16.980 creative class remember there are all those stupid books about the creative class 10 years ago anyway

01:27:22.500 richard florida of course i have a personal resentment i was gonna when i studied the 0.94

01:27:26.660 university of toronto i was going to be part of his exciting new institute think tank thingy

01:27:32.580 and then they canceled that and gave the money to richard florida set his institute up there and

01:27:37.780 florida you know is your classic sort of downtown urban elite um my my doctoral supervisor really

01:27:46.740 felt that uh that florida the urban studies theorist the most offensive thing was the chest

01:27:51.620 shaving but um i would say they're probably uh i would say the definition of the creative class

01:27:59.300 is um is more offensive because if you actually look at florida's definition of the creative class

01:28:06.100 most artists and musicians are not in it however all bankers are well right i mean that's robert

01:28:16.180 service and ts elliot so obviously the bankers are the new poets uh yeah i would agree the um

01:28:23.380 it is true i mean that that work is a bank teller apparently uh elliot invited his boss to uh some

01:28:30.400 event where he received a major literary award and uh the guy said um uh uh and so he was asked

01:28:40.300 by the person next to him at the table oh how do you know um how do you know uh elliot and said uh

01:28:46.540 oh he's um he's one of my tellers at at the bank and uh it was really it was yes i i'm just here

01:28:54.860 because i think it's important to support my employees hobbies um so leaving that aside

01:29:01.500 it is interesting that the sort of self-conscious urbanites um right not working in the arts

01:29:08.540 But they want that mantle of being part of some sort of fiction of a bohemian, urban, cosmopolitan world.

01:29:26.320 And so they create the material conditions to perform that.

01:29:31.260 But of course, in the process, they throw out all the artists.

01:29:35.040 Because they make things unaffordable.

01:29:37.360 i'm not aware of any actual artist who lives in an artist live workspace that they've zoned for

01:29:43.280 here um there just aren't that and there aren't that many millionaire artists uh so vancouver

01:29:51.840 i think as a project it's not my project and it's very clear that if there is not

01:30:01.040 a substantial shift in public policy that it will eventually spit out pretty much all of my

01:30:10.280 friends. Hopefully they'll join me up in the heart. You know, and it was really striking,

01:30:16.920 I have to say, when coming from having just moved within Prince George, coming down to Vancouver,

01:30:25.140 because the way that my neighborhood in Prince George is laid out

01:30:31.640 and the way people behave in it

01:30:33.380 is what Vancouver was like in my childhood.

01:30:38.880 So, you know, I came back to British Columbia in 2011

01:30:41.920 and like everybody else, you know, who tries to come home,

01:30:46.700 you find that your home is buried under the past,

01:30:49.940 that it's part of the past.

01:30:51.600 You can never go home.

01:30:52.820 But I do think that there are parts of the country that where people do, through accidents of economics and through some community spirit, avoid that track.

01:31:09.280 But I find it really curious that the very kinds of people and the very ways of living that actually made the Vancouver I grew up in possible are associated in the minds of the people in charge with the city's failure. 0.84

01:31:33.040 They think that the city will succeed when we have pushed out, you know, single income families living in trailers who draw hopscotch boards on the road, who play street hockey, things like this.

01:31:50.320 I think people really, I think that because we've so commodified culture, that people think that if you're not investing in, you know, those annoying rectangular glasses everybody in Vancouver seems to wear, then you failed to show this material marker of being part of a dynamic cosmopolitan place.

01:32:18.280 so anyway here i am i went to where i scattered my grandmother's ashes yesterday that was really

01:32:24.900 nice she loved stanley park and they've still failed to ruin it although a lot of people are

01:32:31.240 lighting their hair on fire over the bike lane there again classic

01:32:36.320 maybe maybe something else to kind of think about a little bit here is that i mean i remember i

01:32:44.280 wasn't even there that long either. It was about 10 years ago, probably at the height of my

01:32:49.320 university career, which was about halfway through, but that was the height of it socially.

01:32:54.760 I remember being able to drive into Vancouver from Langley in a reasonable amount of time.

01:33:02.560 Only a few years later, and that was after the highway expansions, I literally wouldn't

01:33:07.860 attempt to get into vancouver outside of before before 6 a.m or after 11 and before three so now

01:33:17.920 i i get up in prince george and and start driving before 5 a.m to be there in time to admit the

01:33:25.260 midday uh lax that there's no no traffic on the road things have gotten completely out of control

01:33:32.200 on that count but but further to that to your point of commodifying lifestyle i mean you did

01:33:37.800 you did you did a course on the nature of trailer park boys and what it meant for canadian identity

01:33:43.720 and that sort of thing like is that basically a dichotomy we're seeing here there's like authentic

01:33:48.440 communities that are kind of basically being displaced because of because of the cost and then

01:33:54.600 the only way the only way back into the higher echelons to kind of sell your soul into into

01:33:59.880 the cost of things well first of all i just just want to uh uh hit that traffic note because of

01:34:07.240 course you know we came in on the expanding highway and it's really so what happened of

01:34:15.160 course is what's called induced demand that if you don't change another variable increasing the

01:34:21.960 amount of pavement is a stop gap even with no population increase the mathematical properties

01:34:29.640 of how traffic works produces this induced demand. Until you build so much pavement, you're like

01:34:37.480 Houston, Texas, where there are like ring roads around bypasses around ring roads, you're always

01:34:45.720 adding pavement doesn't produce any medium or long-term effect. It only produces a short-term

01:34:54.440 resolution and urban planners in london figured this out in 1830 like they were giving papers at

01:35:02.840 the royal society by 1840 about the principle of induced demand and it's proven right every single

01:35:12.360 time houston really being the only outlying case because they just were willing to throw

01:35:17.960 an infinite amount of pavement at the problem. Interestingly, provincial governments see Vancouverites

01:35:27.800 angry with their traffic. And for very good reasons, Vancouverites blame their municipal

01:35:38.120 government. They don't blame the province. They don't blame the feds. They always blame

01:35:42.920 municipal government. And Vancouver city council does all of these weird symbolic traffic things

01:35:52.200 where they like turn point gray road into a private driveway for the super rich or they

01:35:57.800 build a really visible bike lane that screws up bus stops or whatever it is. But the decisions

01:36:03.880 are not huge decisions. But they're willing to take the profile of appearing anti-car.

01:36:12.280 and what this does is it creates reelection opportunities for provincial and federal

01:36:18.760 governments because people are angry it's congested and if the province or feds add a new lane to the

01:36:26.040 freeway there's an immediate relief it will take like two years for that thing to fill up and so

01:36:33.160 there's an immediate sense of relief and people reward you at the polls i remember last year

01:36:39.960 driving out of Vancouver and saying to my partner,

01:36:43.220 I can't believe the NDP is widening this freeway between Langley and Abbotsford.

01:36:50.880 No one in Langley and Abbotsford will ever vote for them.

01:36:55.040 Well, boy, was I wrong.

01:36:58.460 Langley and Abbotsford went another lane.

01:37:03.220 I mean, the NDP won Surrey by untolling a freeway on-ramp last time.

01:37:09.960 and it turns out you really just like can convert asphalt into boats like that has never changed

01:37:17.800 so with the bible in with the buick it's uh yeah it's a little unfortunate but of course

01:37:26.180 it's always short term but then that faith that serves everyone as well the um it's interesting

01:37:33.760 that the berard bridge has become less congested even though they've deleted two lanes uh you can

01:37:40.640 get across the berard bridge faster now despite a 30 reduction in lane capacity um people's habits

01:37:50.480 are strange and in vancouver you've got a lot of transportation options i'm sure that you know

01:37:58.000 uh you know there there is a semi-functioning sky train here there there is that stuff

01:38:04.960 anyway i'm sorry i i got off on induced demand because uh well i couldn't resist um you actually

01:38:11.200 had asked me a different question yeah i just i mean you've done a course on oh trailer park boys

01:38:20.000 yeah so i think that it serves everybody's interests particularly rex murphy's to

01:38:27.920 idealize industrial cities of medium size in canada's resource periphery and god knows

01:38:36.800 it's easy to do if you live in one i sing the praises of prince george to everybody um

01:38:44.720 you know and i think that it's very easy for people to

01:38:51.440 think that that idealization or that admiration

01:38:56.880 comes from some kind of backward-looking ethno-nationalist perspective, right? That

01:39:04.380 people will think that when you say Prince George, you mean whiteness or, you know, something like

01:39:09.680 that or Christianity or something like that. But ironically, places like Prince George and

01:39:19.560 fort mack are getting more diverse all the time from a linguistic religious etc standpoint right

01:39:27.160 and the mill towns of british columbia have had an admired seek minority for like a hundred years

01:39:36.360 um it's not like um these smaller centers are unfamiliar with what um linguistic or ethnic

01:39:47.000 diversity is. But the problem is that a place like Vancouver is becoming less familiar with

01:39:53.080 actual diversity. And the things that make us different from one another are a lot more than

01:40:03.940 people want to admit based on class. If you live in a world where everything costs money

01:40:09.500 and more and more things that were free are becoming commodified,

01:40:16.540 then there are so many more barriers to interaction across class

01:40:22.440 than there are interactions across language.

01:40:26.460 One of the things that I think makes Prince George an especially great community

01:40:30.940 is that there aren't standard lot sizes.

01:40:34.240 every lot appears to have been created ad hoc and has a different slightly different shape and size

01:40:41.000 to the lot next door well what does that mean in practical terms what it means in practical terms

01:40:47.060 is that my partner and i are renting the nicest house on the street not because we can afford it

01:40:54.380 but because they undervalued it and the estate agent sort of admitted in the middle of showing

01:40:59.100 us the house i guess we underpriced this but next door is a lot one-third the width

01:41:06.380 and it has just as much yard because there is a very old uh manufactured home on it and

01:41:15.980 that's where the one income family lives uh and you know it's great we have phenomenal next door

01:41:23.580 neighbors they helped us find the cat the other day and whatever and that's an experience that

01:41:28.220 be very hard to have in Vancouver. That the reason black Americans are more residentially 1.00

01:41:39.180 segregated from white Americans than at any time in American history is because 1.00

01:41:47.820 we are destroying mixed income neighborhoods. If you're part of a group that is more likely 1.00

01:41:55.260 to be working class, then your residential horizon is totally different than the residential

01:42:04.700 horizon of wealthier people. So the irony is that in a community like Vancouver,

01:42:16.380 meaningful forms of diversity are not that available. And that's because of all of the

01:42:22.620 different material barriers that have effectively segregated its population uh if you go to um uh

01:42:32.380 and of course because property developers are so in the driver's seat you get tremendous uniformity

01:42:40.380 by neighborhood it's not like toronto where there are just sort of eruptions of random density due

01:42:46.460 to a strange decision made by a city council or unilaterally you know where the dense places are

01:42:52.540 you where know where the non-dense places are and because you don't have variability in size of

01:42:58.060 residence you also end up age segregating your place so if um if there simply are no large

01:43:06.780 residences then families disappear uh you know if you um and of course that's what's happened

01:43:16.380 there are family neighborhoods and non-family neighborhoods in vancouver and talk about

01:43:23.340 none of your friends having kids how that might alter your horizon how that's going to impoverish

01:43:30.140 your world culturally and in terms of your ability to have new ideas that's where it's

01:43:36.140 going to happen so i use the trailer park boys course of course primarily to make a case against

01:43:42.460 calvinism and in favor of the roman catholic interpretation of saint augustine because i

01:43:48.780 think that's really mainly what the show is about but um it uh but in the course of doing that i

01:43:56.700 asked um folks to read a book by carol stack called all our kin it was a revolutionary piece

01:44:05.420 a scholarship from 1974 about the economic logic of being in the underclass. And so it's

01:44:15.620 a rebuttal to the idea of the culture of poverty. The culture of poverty theory is that, right,

01:44:23.600 poor people make financially irrational decisions. They don't know how to save money and what

01:44:29.920 keeps them poor is the culture of poverty well carol stack uh lived in um a african-american

01:44:42.960 social housing complex uh for two years as an anthropologist and what she found was

01:44:50.720 was high levels of economic rationality, that if people get, you know, their one-time score,

01:45:02.080 like season three of Trailer Park Boys, where Ricky gets $30,000 and spends it in 30 hours, 0.99

01:45:09.460 that, you know, this is stupid, this is economically irrational. Well, the reality 1.00

01:45:16.680 is that if you're in an underclass community, you've almost certainly borrowed a bunch of stuff

01:45:23.780 from your friends. You've almost certainly received gifts from your friends when they

01:45:30.500 won a small lotto ticket or got a severance package or whatever. And in fact, those gifts

01:45:38.140 are what keeps the lights on and those gifts are also the core of the community's social life

01:45:47.020 because nobody can otherwise buy everybody around at the bar or do these really basic things

01:45:56.380 and so you need these these injections of external money to keep that going and so

01:46:03.700 for the community, the rational thing is to try and hold all those windfalls inside it so that

01:46:11.300 they're spent internally. Now, Stack studied these people who decided they were going to

01:46:18.160 escape the culture of poverty. Well, that meant they had to save money. So that meant that they

01:46:25.520 stopped paying for things in the community. They hoarded their money and the community noticed.

01:46:33.700 and so they became more and more socially isolated from other members and um and then they left

01:46:42.980 and the problem is right there are certain stories where we only tell stories of success

01:46:50.900 or failure so when you tell stories about assimilation you're never the story nathan

01:46:57.000 right i'm never the story anybody who's successfully assimilated is not the story

01:47:03.560 which is why we say assimilation never works, because they could find us if it hadn't worked.

01:47:11.900 Well, the same is true about people who escape their class, right? We only tell the success 0.98

01:47:19.560 stories. We never tell the story of what happened to these folks in Carol's book,

01:47:26.260 because they went to town, they moved out,

01:47:31.320 they went to a higher rent place,

01:47:33.580 and one of them lost their job.

01:47:37.560 And the female member of the couple

01:47:41.760 had never really been working 0.99

01:47:43.920 because she had a bunch of childcare she was doing,

01:47:46.360 so her income was tiny.

01:47:50.420 And once they were on social assistance,

01:47:53.200 they had no choice but to move back home and there was this sense of like so the community

01:48:03.840 helped them and reconciled with them but there was a sense that these people had

01:48:13.160 taken out of the system irreplaceable resources and it was going to take a while for people to

01:48:19.740 forgive them and i think that we we only use the unit of the individual um in um in uh when when

01:48:33.920 we think about how the economy affects people but once you know you start looking at the shared 0.99

01:48:41.420 experience of that community one can see that poor people are no more economically rational no less 0.97

01:48:50.540 economically rational in general it's just that strategies really shift and it's one of the other 0.71

01:49:00.540 reasons that you want a mixed income community because there is a centripetal force pulling

01:49:07.500 people together. And when you have a community composed entirely of people going, I'm all right, 0.61

01:49:15.900 Jack, if you deprive a community of any materiality to its relations with each other, people don't

01:49:25.100 hold together so well. Bonds of loyalty, bonds of reciprocity, not all communities foster

01:49:39.460 them equally. And I think that's, of course, what you see in Vancouver. You see a community

01:49:46.780 that is turning away from reciprocity. It's great if you want no one to talk to you on

01:49:51.620 the street. I grew up in Vancouver, so I'm always freaked out when people talk to me

01:49:56.480 on the street. But this is a city where if privacy is the main thing you want in life,

01:50:04.300 you found Mecca. This is your home. But if one wants friends who are diverse, if one

01:50:15.940 wants communities that stick together then you come here and this place always feels like a

01:50:23.860 little bit more of a tragedy every year i think that's i think that's a very fair assessment it's

01:50:29.940 it's it's a very interesting way of putting some of the values i found in my own life

01:50:35.380 uh because i wasn't raised working class but but because of the economic realities that we live in

01:50:41.620 in i i became part of the precariat and the underclass um by by by class status not not

01:50:49.640 necessarily by a lot of other measures but by at least economic status and and some of my

01:50:54.560 relationships developed there and it's funny the way that you articulated that because i'm thinking

01:50:58.400 of the scenes in trailer park boys where you say well you're going to leave the park you're going

01:51:03.280 to leave the park like he's talking about leaving the park and so he's going to leave behind this

01:51:07.960 world they even build a fort around it at one point they put gates on it right they have they

01:51:12.680 have the spot where they're going to grow all of their bud and they and they have uh it protected

01:51:16.440 by a palisade like it there's this beautiful picture of of the solidarity of the underclass 0.99

01:51:24.360 yeah and i think not everybody in the underclass you know there are plenty of jerks everywhere 0.89

01:51:30.520 uh you know we don't want to romanticize a class solely on that basis but i do think that um 0.97

01:51:37.960 there is this funny exchange where your financial precarity brings you into a world where

01:51:46.080 your associations with other people um are intensified by the materiality of things

01:51:56.360 i mean the park also of course has to spend a lot of money on drugs um but uh they're really only

01:52:06.460 like two things that are beyond the pale in Trailer Park Boys, cocaine and weightlifting.

01:52:18.460 And it's interesting that these are like the two most transgressive behaviors.

01:52:24.620 But they're put in this dichotomy. The total condemnation of weightlifting

01:52:30.920 is about prison, because there are two activities. There is hockey, and there's weightlifting.

01:52:40.880 And one is a pro-social activity, and one is an anti-social activity. And, you know,

01:52:48.560 I don't think anyone needs to go into the explanation about cocaine. So, again, there's

01:52:55.100 just this sharp weed is good, cocaine is bad, one is pro-social, one is anti-social. And what I

01:53:01.880 really enjoyed about the course, which is available on Los Altos Institute's podcast channel,

01:53:09.440 all 13 episodes of the course you can download. But the show tells really moral lessons in a very,

01:53:21.300 very didactic way. And it's surprising. It's surprising that because it's a comedy and people

01:53:31.840 are breaking the law, that no one watches it with that lens. They will come away valuing certain

01:53:39.960 things more, but they don't see the show as didactic. I would argue that the first five

01:53:46.540 seasons of trailer park boys are the closest thing we have to a modern parable in canada

01:53:52.940 there are these very simple stories they pivot on a moment of grace but of course that's the

01:54:00.060 other reason they're hard to recognize we live in a society that doesn't see grace it and it doesn't

01:54:10.620 see the difference between um and so ricky as a character doesn't make sense to them right ricky 0.90

01:54:24.140 is a liar ricky is a drunk ricky's selfish and what makes him special is that there are these 0.89

01:54:33.020 transcendent moments of grace that manifest in his behavior where he'll make some extraordinary 1.00

01:54:39.660 sacrifice like kissing Mr. Leahy's ass so that his daughter can have encyclopedias. 0.98

01:54:48.460 The kiss of freedom, episode one, season three, is I would say the closest thing to be able to take 0.99

01:54:56.620 Augustine's city of God and jam it into a 22-minute sitcom. It's incredible. And so if one doesn't

01:55:07.740 have that perspective, if one has a perspective of, you know, well, you become more virtuous

01:55:13.660 through discipline, there is this incremental move upwards from being a bad person to being

01:55:19.580 a good person, grace doesn't make sense to you because it's unearned. And so bad people doing

01:55:31.500 the right thing all the time doesn't make sense to you. And so it's interesting that Barry Dunn,

01:55:40.700 whose association with the show is largely what seems to have infused it with this,

01:55:46.220 he just went back to practicing law. He never talked about what message he was trying to get

01:55:51.020 forward. But in the later seasons, that message gradually disappears because you don't have this

01:55:57.740 very disciplined intelligence there of course barry dunn plays ray and i think it's the ultimate

01:56:05.900 lampoon of earned grace ray has been collecting a disability pension for a disability he doesn't

01:56:15.420 have for 18 years so he's been committing insurance fraud for 18 years and part of this act involves

01:56:23.820 being in a wheelchair whenever strangers are around and you know he hops up out of the

01:56:28.860 wheelchair whenever you know he's among friends and gets on with at the time but by season five

01:56:38.060 he's been committing insurance fraud successfully for so long that he comes to view it as a form of

01:56:44.620 moral authority and he begins referring to himself in the third person as the guy in the chair you

01:56:52.860 lied to me, Ricky. You lied to the guy in the chair. But of course the chair is the lie in the

01:57:00.040 story. So they perform that very well. And of course, Ray is always in the background ranting

01:57:11.800 about Calvinism and how he's the only Calvinist. Sorry, Presbyterians. I try to limit how 1.00

01:57:19.360 politically offensive i am on the show so i'm just going sideways and being religiously offensive 0.89

01:57:23.840 uh but uh but there we are i think it's a good place to close out though because it is true

01:57:32.400 isn't it all we have all we have is each other and uh who of us when we actually look over our lives

01:57:38.020 and see the provision and providence that have been in it can really say that we earned that

01:57:42.840 Yes. Also, I'll close with Mr. Leahy's brilliant election speech. The one time he's forced to run for supervisor of the trailer park. Of course, his opponent is doing a sort of classic character attack campaign.

01:58:04.000 I still think the NDP actually could have won the 2005 provincial election if they'd used the same rhetoric, because the signs just say, Jim Leahy is a drunk bastard. 1.00

01:58:14.040 I and the NDP, Carol James could be premier if she'd just run on the slogan, Gordon Campbell is a drunk bastard. 0.97

01:58:19.480 But in any case, Jim Leahy has to get up and defend himself. 0.97

01:58:23.520 And he says, who among us, who even in the whole world doesn't have problems?

01:58:30.620 Who among us hasn't had a drink or two too many from time to time? Who among us hasn't had a puff

01:58:37.900 or two too many from time to time? Who among us hasn't passed out in their driveway and pissed

01:58:44.300 all over themselves? And the crowd is right with them. So there we are. We've all had these moments

01:58:53.580 of grace and of course the other sort. And the dance they have with each other is what binds us

01:58:59.420 together amen stewart parker president of los altos institute we're so thankful to have you on today

01:59:06.460 as we do every thursday at least for the second half and to tell us to tell us the moral stories

01:59:11.740 of the times we're in and what we might do about them thank you so much for being here thank you

01:59:18.540 well that was mountain standard time i'm extremely thankful for uh the participation

01:59:23.740 we've had today in the comments of course as i explained before we are moving the studio

01:59:28.460 this weekend. It's going to be a bit of a task. I can see my producer already beginning to rub

01:59:33.720 his brow and prepare his curses for later. We are going to do our best to be online next Tuesday,

01:59:40.340 9 a.m. Pacific, 10 a.m. Mountain. Do be aware that maybe the quality of the show might change a bit.

01:59:46.600 We might be on a different source of internet. We might have to wrestle with TELUS or Shaw or

01:59:50.420 somebody. But the point is that we care about you. Do send us a link to anything you'd like.

01:59:55.940 suggest guests use my email that's been displayed here before and thank you so much for tuning in

02:00:02.660 this was of course mountain standard time there's the email there do send anything along you'd like

02:00:07.700 to send this was mountain standard time i'm your host nathan guida we're going to catch you bright

02:00:11.420 and early next tuesday 9 a.m pacific 10 a.m mountain

Western Standard - May 27, 2021

Mountain Standard Time - May 27 2021

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