In this episode, I sit down with the Prime Minister of Canada, Justin Trudeau, to talk about his vision for the future of Canada's largest and most important province, Quebec. We talk about the need for a federal government that respects the sovereignty of its own people and respects the rights and liberties of its citizens.
00:00:22.320And so, you know, we've talked about where, so building those alliances, I find, has, you know, the two big decentralist provinces, to use that dirty word, but we've wanted different kinds.
00:00:36.600And in large measure, that is why Meech Lake and especially Charlottetown Accords failed.
00:00:42.300You know, Quebec and Alberta were the two leading areas of Canada that voted down Charlottetown, but we voted it down for very different reasons.
00:00:49.320Yeah, Albertans and Westerners broadly voted it down because it was seen as creating asymmetrical federalism, giving special deals to Quebec.
00:01:01.720And there was also some First Nations issues in it.
00:01:03.520There was, you know, it was a huge, huge agreement.
00:01:07.240But we voted it down for one set of reasons, being seen as overly appeasing Quebec.
00:01:12.720Quebecers voted it down, at least as I perceive it as, it didn't go far enough in defending Quebec's culture and autonomy.
00:01:53.460Yeah, but like, if failing independence, if independence is not successful, is there a kind of grand bargain, from your perspective, that you think you could make, that would make the Quebec nation happy and content within Canada, that would work for you?
00:02:12.600To the question, what does Quebec want, the answer is clear, crystal clear.
00:02:25.380Because it's the only model that gives a future to our specificity, linguistic and cultural.
00:02:31.660Other financial reasons have joined the reasons, but basically that's it.
00:02:37.580So, I mean, the only reason why federal prime ministers engaged into such complicated negotiations and talks was that they felt there was a direct threat to their power and their regime.
00:02:58.040They didn't do that in good faith because they just like to improve the life of Quebecers or Albertans.
00:03:04.000So, it might happen that as Quebec's sovereignty movement, independence movement, grows in strength, and probably Alberta's same movement grows in strength, you'll find federal politicians nervous saying, okay, let's renegotiate in good faith.
00:03:23.700I think we've been through that, and anything under self-determination in terms of our laws, our finances, and international relations will not work for Quebec because it will not work for our linguistic, cultural, and financial specificity.
00:03:41.200However, once it's done, so once Quebec declares independence, I think if Alberta declares independence, Quebec will follow, same here, vice versa.
00:03:55.400If Quebec goes, I think Alberta will say, okay, I'm also independent.
00:03:59.820In which case, we will talk to each other about what framework would be useful on a number of topics, but without the federal trying to grab money and grab power and defend their privileges.
00:04:14.940Without them, without interference and constant abuse of power since 1667, a constitution that we never voted or agreed upon, it's in direct link, it's really about the colonial regime for Quebec.
00:04:31.820So, I think it's the other way around, you become independent, and a bit like Norway and Sweden or Slovakia and Czech Republic or in many, like, of course, in the following days, I will not be wanting to negotiate with the federal, I will want to negotiate with other provinces who think actually mostly the same thing as I do about how it should work.
00:04:57.120It doesn't mean we agree on our priorities, but we agree that a framework that would show respect to our respective parliaments is much better than abuse of power based on an old and dysfunctional constitution.
00:05:14.400And you have to add to that that we were, during the patriation of the 1982 constitution, we were totally out of it.
00:05:23.320It's just the end of the contempt is a better start for a new framework than trying to deal with people who have been abusing their powers, begging them to stop abusing their powers.
00:05:40.600So, Justin Trudeau, out of the blue, but not out of the blue, you had a group called the Century Initiative on Bay Street, they decided that we need to be 100 million Canadians, based on whatever fluke economics.
00:05:54.640They don't consult anyone, they just start doing this by saying, hey, come to Roxham.
00:05:59.120And they changed the criteria at the airport, they really sabotaged our immigration system that was working well.
00:06:08.240They were warned by provinces, they were warned by their own public servants, you will create the worst housing crisis we've seen in decades, don't do it.
00:07:18.720Well, you know that the federal government cheated on the second referendum by bringing in people that were not from Quebec in order them to vote in a result that was so close.
00:07:46.800I mean, at some point, yes, there could be some kind of solidarity or some common understanding of the fact that serving genuine democracy is serving public good.
00:08:00.220And that's why when you're asking me about how the federal will react in terms of Clarity Act and so on, there's been so many instances where the federal cheated and was dishonest.
00:08:30.740And if you feel you have a common identity and common interests that are worth becoming a country, good for you.
00:08:38.720And it's not for me to have a judgment on it.
00:08:41.480But if I can be useful to democracy or if we can be useful to both our interests, economic interests in the short term and so on, why not talk instead of being in that weird equalization and federal framework where nobody agrees because the interests are just not compatible and the abuse of power is so constant it creates frustration.
00:09:05.080So I think in a way, the reason I'm here is exactly that so we can talk at least and see what positive could come in the next decades, given the decade we just experimented under the liberals, federal liberals.
00:09:20.860Well, I think this has been a fascinating conversation.
00:09:24.780I think this is the kind of conversation, the whole dynamic of it is not something that Quebecers, Albertans, Westerners or Canadians broadly are very used to.