Join Melanie Rizdin and Josie Martin as they discuss Canada Post employees who have been on leave of absence without pay since November 29th, 2021. They discuss the circumstances that brought hundreds of employees together to call for support.
00:00:00.000Hello, I'm Melanie Rizdin with the Western Standard. Thanks for joining me. And also joining
00:00:05.100me is Josie Martin. She is a Canada Post employee, as well as the founder and one of the contributors
00:00:14.160with Posties for Freedom. Now, if you are unaware yet, Canada Post employees, obviously through the
00:00:22.020federal mandates with the vaccine passport, have had restrictions on employees who have chosen to
00:00:29.780either not show their vaccine status or have chosen to be unvaccinated. They have been put on
00:00:36.460leave of absence without pay since November 29th, 2021. And so this group has been born out of that,
00:00:45.520Posties for Freedom. Thanks for joining us, Josie. And why don't you tell us a little bit
00:00:50.660more about the circumstances that brought, sounds like hundreds of employees together.
00:00:56.920Yeah, thank you so much for having me, Melanie. And yeah, so we started doing calls around the
00:01:05.660November timeframe. And we just saw this need for support throughout the community. So we started
00:01:11.360just hosting Zoom calls and trying to get our story out there and trying to get our friends connected
00:01:17.420with each other and to ensure that our colleagues and our peers were supported through this process.
00:01:22.160We didn't see this kind of action from the employer. So it was a lot easier to do it ourselves and be
00:01:29.000there for them. And we also didn't see this kind of, you know, reaching out from any of the union,
00:01:34.020any of the union at the Canada Post. So it felt it was really, you know, it would be really became a family out of us.
00:01:41.400Right. And so it looks like from what I've read, several thousand Canada Post employees were placed
00:01:50.100on leave without pay when this vaccine policy was put in place. And that has yet to be lifted.
00:01:58.860That's right. The announcement came out last week. And it was on Monday of last week that,
00:02:06.080you know, we had heard, you know, some rumors and Tuesday afternoon, they had their conference and
00:02:11.840we were a bit shocked when we started getting automated phone calls last Thursday telling us
00:02:19.500that we would be welcome back on their, on an orderly and safe transition on their timeframe.
00:02:26.300So you still are, are sort of unaware, or you don't know whether you're going to be invited back.
00:02:35.240You don't know when people just are not getting answers from this federal agency yet.
00:02:41.240They thought they mean they've sent a communication stating that they're working to suspend the practice.
00:02:50.780Again, Canada Post is called the practice, not a policy, but they're working to suspend their vaccination practice and that they will do so in a safe and orderly transition back to work.
00:03:03.260So they have indicated that they will be bringing people back to work, but they've also been very, you know, cautious as to the wording that they're using.
00:03:12.140And they're, they're, they're, they're stating, this is a suspension of the, of the practice and all employees have received a roll call.
00:03:20.140Like I said to that, they will be welcome back at some point, but we have not received any other communication as to what dates.
00:03:26.900It just said to wait for a call from your team lead.
00:03:31.620And you haven't received that call yet.
00:03:33.620Personally, I've received the call from the robot, but a lot of people have yet to receive any phone calls from their team leaders.
00:03:43.620A lot of people have reached out to their team leaders via text or, you know, by phone and some have gotten some answers, but they have not, nobody's been told what the return to date would be, or return to work date would be, sorry.
00:03:59.620Now, speaking of the, the terminology that's being used with regard to the federal vaccine mandates, you know, the word suspension would, would suggest that the vaccine mandates are now custom, like the norm.
00:04:16.620And so a suspension of the norm, right, would be, would be these, these instances where, where the unvaccinated can now fly, you know, workers, federal workers can now be returning to work.
00:04:29.620But, but you're right, that, that terminology of suspended versus lifted or, or abolished, I think has a lot of people concerned.
00:04:44.620Our group is concerned, not only for our group, but we're also concerned for the other Canada Post employees, right?
00:04:51.620So we, we have a feeling, we assume that this was a test to see, you know, what kind of compliance they can get from employees within the workplace.
00:05:00.620And we can see that, you know, most employees did comply with this.
00:05:04.620And so, you know, we're concerned because this may be lifted for a period of time, but what happens when something happens in the, in the fall time?
00:05:16.620If there's a new strain, if there's a new variant, you know, we, as employees feel we are at the mercy of these, these mandates.
00:05:26.620And, and this was never part of our original work contracts.
00:05:31.620Some of us have been working for this company for over 20 years.
00:05:35.620You know, some of us have perfect records with this corporation and, and have never even had any incidents at work.
00:05:44.620And so for the corporation to punish employees and put them on leave without pay, and then for them to, you know, just simply send a robotic call to welcome us back.
00:05:58.620And, and, you know, after they've created, in my opinion, this, this atmosphere of division and, and, you know, they're, they're fostering this, this sort of division we're seeing in the workplace.
00:06:10.620And, and, you know, fostering these, you know, employees who think that, you know, working next to an unvaccinated person or somebody who didn't want to disclose their status, you know, God forbid would, would hurt them or their families.
00:06:24.620So they've fostered this sort of, you know, environment in the workplace.
00:06:29.620And I mean, how do we go back from all of this right now?
00:06:31.620It's very difficult for us to understand.
00:06:33.620And then for us to not feel that this is not going to come back in the fall.
00:06:37.620And I just, you know, it's very disappointing how this is all playing out.
00:06:42.620It's very disappointing to be an employee to be, to have my corporation that I've personally worked for for 14 years, choose a policy over, you know, the safety and the health of their employees.
00:06:55.620Well, and especially considering when you're looking at the statistics now, and you're seeing that really the statistics are showing that there is not a large difference in the chances of catching and or carrying
00:07:11.620or spreading COVID-19, whether you are vaccinated or not.
00:07:15.620So, so I think that, you know, that has to at some point come into the narrative that has to sort of start driving decisions and policy when truthfully you can go into work and you can catch COVID from the person standing next to you, whether they are vaccinated or unvaccinated, right?
00:07:36.620Like the, the carrying that, that has been sort of well shown that, you know, I know, I know that the idea is that the vaccines offer, offer better protection for severe outcomes and whatnot.
00:07:50.620But, but still, when it comes to transmitting to the people that we are working side by side with, I think that that, you know, that has to enter the conversation at some point.
00:08:03.620Again, it's all about the atmosphere that's been fostered in, in, in, in the work environment workplaces and, and, you know, the, the division that's been created.
00:08:14.620And I think, you know, post-ease of freedom has, you know, come from a place of unity and love and, you know, freedom of choice.
00:08:22.620So it's difficult for us to see beyond anything else, but I do, I do want to share that, you know, once these employees are, are, are returning to work, it's, it's not just, hey, come back to work now and everything's going to be okay.
00:08:38.620I mean, these employees are looking at thousands of dollars in, in arrears and pension payments that they would have had to, you know, that they have to give back to the corporation.
00:08:50.620Some employees have gotten, have, you know, quote unquote quit or resigned from their position under duress and are receiving invoices from Canada Post saying that they owe them money because of pensionable arrears and, you know, the benefits and everything.
00:09:05.620And so if I need, you know, extremely hard to understand how our corporation can put in a policy that puts its employees on leave without pay by force, because we weren't given a choice and then turns around and says seven months later, like, okay, you know, we're allowed to bring you back to work.
00:09:27.620However, when you come back, you're going to have thousands of dollars in debt and, and, you know, the people that are on leave without pay, they're receiving paychecks with negative $700 negative, you know, amounts because again, all of these, you know, employee benefits and everything have to be paid back.
00:09:45.620And when you're an employee that didn't ask for this leave, it's so depressing to be treated this way and to have all of these on top of the coercion and everything that we deal with on everyday society, you know, Canada Post respected provincial regulations when it, you know, when it was good for them.
00:10:07.620They respected federal regulations when it was, you know, when that's what they wanted to respect, you know, there has not been any consistency since November or since even October with this.
00:10:17.620You know, the masks were coming off in all of the provinces, but, you know, in Canada Post facilities, you still had to wear them.
00:10:24.620And so, you know, we, we have continuously reached out to, you know, the executives and management to find out, you know, what is the difference between, you know, being federally regulated and provincially regulated and how, what science do you have that, that supports the continuance of these masks and, and the continuance of these masks.
00:10:46.620mandates, even though they're lifting preventative, we never got any clear answers.
00:10:51.620We, you know, it's been very difficult for employees that want answers that just want to see some data that just want to understand how these decisions are being made.
00:11:01.620What kind of data are you looking at when you're making these decisions and, and do you know the impact that it's having on your workforce and do you care?
00:11:10.620Yeah, I think, you know, and it's, I'm going to go back to what you were talking about with these outstanding benefits and pensionable, the, how that's been accruing.
00:11:22.620And, and so, so essentially what you're saying is that, although you've been put on leave without pay, the company is still charging you for benefits or like, do you even have access to your benefits while you're on leave without pay?
00:11:42.620So 30 days after you're put on leave without pay, you lose access to your dental and your vision and then, you know, the health prescriptions continue to go on.
00:11:50.620But you have to pay that portion of an employee, you have to pay the employer portion.
00:11:55.620And then on top of that, you're also in charge of making sure because, you know, every two weeks when we receive a paycheck, technically when we're working, we have to make a pension contribution.
00:12:07.620And so while we're off, we're expected to make our contributions for not getting paid.
00:12:12.620Like, it just doesn't make any sense for us.
00:12:14.620Like I said, a lot of us are getting a paycheck with a negative on it.
00:12:18.620And we're just so confused and we don't get any answers.
00:12:22.620And when we ask, you know, it's just like, oh, well, we'll look into it.
00:12:26.620And, you know, it takes months to rectify things.
00:12:29.620And it's just, it's like I said, it's very difficult and very depressive for employees that are in this situation.
00:12:35.620Now, your unions, they are not, the union is not supporting employees with this.
00:12:42.620I mean, it seems, it seems incredibly, you know, as you mentioned, very frustrating to know that you are sort of being billed for things that you are not able to access.
00:12:53.620And while you are not being, you know, gainfully employed, are the unions being supportive at all in helping you?
00:13:01.620I think the unions are being supportive on paper.
00:13:06.620I think that they're putting this perception out there that they're doing something to help their membership and that the divide is so great and the fracture is so great.
00:13:17.620But, you know, there's not much they can do.
00:13:20.620I think one of the biggest unions at Canada Post has put an arbitration in and, you know, we have gone through this arbitration and with a fine tooth comb, we feel the experts that they used were not real experts.
00:13:37.620We felt that the people that they had, you know, quote unquote, defend their membership in one of the most dire scenarios we have all been in as employees.
00:13:50.620We're not, we're not there to represent the employees.
00:13:54.620It's almost as if they were agreeing during some of the papers, some of the, some of the arbitration decisions that we're reading.
00:14:03.620It's almost like they were arguing about what's more, what's a better way to do this?
00:14:10.620Is it through testing or is it forcing everyone to get vaccinated?
00:14:14.620And, and that's not the arguments here.
00:14:17.620And so again, it's just so heart disheartening for, for employees and membership who pay into these unions.
00:14:25.620Like these units are millions of dollars every year that get generated from their memberships.
00:14:29.620And some of them had a hard time getting their union dues waived for the period of time that they were off.
00:14:35.620So, you know, these are all things that I think are not many Canadians know that are going on.
00:14:43.620I mean, I'm sure a lot of Canadians know that people were on leave without pay.
00:14:46.620However, I don't think a lot of Canadians know that this is the kind of dynamics that we are dealing with employees on leave without pay.
00:14:55.620Now with Posties for Freedom, it looks like you have several hundred members that are part of this group.
00:15:04.620And because you are represented by unions, you can't seek other legal avenues to, to fight this.
00:15:13.620So, you know, at the beginning, we really allowed the process to take place.
00:15:18.620So we really had faith that, that the membership and the unions were going to do the right thing.
00:15:25.620And as Christmas came on and we didn't have any word about anything, we had very little communication.
00:15:32.620It became quite apparent to me and I'm not a unionized employee.
00:15:37.620However, you know, 90 some percent of Posties for Freedom is unionized employees.
00:15:42.620And, you know, it just became apparent that it wasn't, you know, going to be the outcome that we had would have liked.
00:15:51.620And it just became apparent that we were going to start having to look for another solution to try to stand up for ourselves.
00:15:58.620So it was either, you know, comply and just give in or, you know, continue to look for solutions.
00:16:04.620And so we hired Greywoke Spencer out of Cold Lake Alberta to represent us, including all of our union membership.
00:16:11.620And we feel confident that the, you know, that the claims and the allegations that we're making are, are outside the jurisdiction of the union at this point.
00:16:21.620And, you know, the arbitration is over and we just feel that the best thing for our group to seek some legal guidance and representation at this point.
00:16:31.620I mean, employees have no other options at this point.
00:16:37.620Well, certainly I, I know that your lawyer is Leighton Grey and I do, I do communicate with Mr. Grey quite often.
00:16:48.620So why don't you keep us informed about how things are going?
00:16:53.620And, and I will certainly follow up with Mr. Grey as well to, to sort of follow how things are going and just, you know, watch as, as the hopefully the federal mandates are lifted
00:17:05.620and more people can return to work and, and then of course, you know, hopefully we'll see more action from the union.
00:17:13.620How can people find out a little bit more about Posties for Freedom or, you know, perhaps there are postal workers that are watching this right now who would like to get involved with the group?
00:17:25.620So that was my main goal to do this today was raise awareness, obviously around, you know, what these are dealing with only without pay, not just postal workers,
00:17:35.620But I also wanted to share that if you know somebody that works for Canada Post or you're an employee of Canada Post and you've been negatively impacted by these mandates and by what's happened since November,
00:17:48.620you certainly go on postiesforfreedom.ca, sign up on our website, you can send us a message.
00:17:54.620We'll get back to you very quickly and we are accepting posties right up until the end of this week to join our legal action.
00:18:03.620And we want to say that we're also not just a legal action community.