00:00:00.000I'm joined by Michelle Rempel. She is the Conservative MP for Calgary Nose Hill since
00:00:04.8002011. She is the Shadow Minister for Immigration. I'm pleased to have her now. She has been
00:00:14.440doing great work, I think, on Parliament Hill. At the very least, I think, trying to bend the
00:00:19.780Conservative Party to a much more realistic and practical outlook on migration. Thank you for
00:00:25.440coming, Michelle. Thanks for having me. And I'd say I think you're having an impact on the
00:00:31.180government itself. It might not be where we wanted to go, but there is at least bending in the right
00:00:36.200direction. Before we get into what's happening directly in Ottawa, I want to bring it maybe a
00:00:43.660little closer to home first. Alberta just had a series of referenda. Most people did not pay
00:00:50.720attention to any of them except for the big one. They were all kind of vegetables on the plate
00:00:54.380compared to the stake, I guess, but all five of the immigration-related questions passed, 52 to 58%.
00:01:01.800Do you think that's a mandate for the Alberta government to move on those items?
00:01:07.140Well, some of those policy decisions, the provincial government would already have,
00:01:13.740in theory, a scoped jurisdiction to be able to address some of those issues, right?
00:01:19.100I mean, the province does have jurisdiction to address how it deals with different, the delivery of different social programs and different services.
00:01:28.980So, I mean, that would be, I know better as a federal politician than to step into the jurisdiction of colleagues in the provincial government.
00:02:15.540So why don't we start with why those questions were on the ballot to begin with as a starting point. So from where I sit as somebody who is addressing the needs of my constituents who are in Calgary, but also addressing the issue of immigration as the Conservative Party's shadow minister writ large in Ottawa, I have been raising the issue of the fact that the federal government's decisions, very poor decisions to have mass immigration policies over the decades.
00:02:45.540last decade without any input from the provinces, material input from the
00:02:49.560provinces, have materially impacted areas of service delivery within the
00:02:55.380provincial jurisdiction. So you know if you want to stay close to home in
00:02:59.300Alberta, in Calgary for example, the Calgary School Board released statistics
00:03:06.100on English as a second language increasing significantly over the last
00:03:13.16010 years and the needs that weren't accounted for when the federal government set immigration
00:03:18.840levels there. If you want to go to Quebec, I've written about how the Supreme Court
00:03:23.560recently ruled in a decision, it was the Kenyinda decision, that Quebec had to provide daycare
00:03:29.720services to asylum seekers. So these are folks that don't have their asylum claims validated yet,
00:03:36.520but a lot of those folks crossed the border at Roxham Road. So where I have been advocating is
00:03:42.200saying that the immigration the federal immigration system is a dumpster fire and when the federal
00:03:47.560immigration minister and mark carney can't get that dumpster fire under control there are material
00:03:53.320impacts on the provinces which precipitate conversations like the one we're having
00:03:58.440so for me my job is to point out the failures and hold the government to account for failures
00:04:05.000at the levels at the at the federal level and then come up with solutions to that problem so
00:04:09.720So, you know, to the back end, first end of that statement, you're saying we're moving the dial on that.
00:04:13.740That's because we're putting forward concrete solutions and demanding them from the government.
00:04:17.480And frankly, I think, you know, when you talk about mandate, it's not just in Alberta.
00:04:22.360Across the country, people want change.
00:04:24.980They want this order and fairness restored in the immigration system.0.51
00:04:28.320And they want levels to go down because they see the impact that it's having on jobs, health care and housing.
00:05:07.180so first of all, 2026 is not 2015. In 2015, we had an economy that was growing. The per capita GDP
00:05:14.920of Canadians was largely kept pace with Americans. That delta has spread. We see a stagnant economy
00:05:22.640in the federal, federally today across the country. And so when you were setting levels in 2015 or
00:05:31.080earlier was a much different exercise in setting levels today, right? So I think a lot of people
00:05:36.420that compare apples to apples, I don't think anybody could say that the economy or cost of
00:05:42.000living today is close to where it was in 2015. Life was better in 2015 by those metrics.
00:05:49.260So when you have an economy that is structurally weak, we can buy a decade of liberal policy
00:05:56.240that is failing to create jobs, it's shedding jobs, that is failing to create houses,
00:06:01.980And then you couple even the same immigration levels over that structure, never mind juicing them to the levels that the Liberals have.
00:06:10.360Of course, there's going to be problems.
00:06:12.440So, you know, I just would push back on that and say conservatives always strive to match immigration levels with housing, health care and jobs, the capacity for newcomers to integrate into Canada's social, not just economic fabric.
00:06:26.200We don't see that today because the Liberals have, you know, institutionalized post-nationalism in even our justice system, right?
00:06:33.740You know, you and I have talked about the bill that I put in place to stop the two-tier justice system that we see judges giving lenient sentences to non-citizens convicted of serious crimes so that they avoid deportation.
00:06:48.220Well, you actually kind of preempted where I was going to challenge you back on again here in a positive way, actually.
00:06:56.200Generally, the Conservatives, they've become more comfortable talking about immigration.
00:07:01.220I think Conservatives have been long, uncomfortable talking about it because of the bad names that the media or the lefty parties will call them.
00:07:09.000To your credit and some of your colleagues' credit, you've gotten more comfortable doing it, and that's very positive.
00:07:13.940But it's been almost exclusively, and you're kind of poking a hole in my argument with your last statement,
00:07:20.700It's been almost exclusively just on the economic and the physical side, the fiscal and economic pressures it puts on, housing prices.
00:07:28.880Hasn't talked very much about the social problems with this.
00:07:33.740Very rapid demographic change, very rapid social change, changing the nature of our communities, and not just these economic and physical pressures.
00:07:43.320You did mention that there was problems now with social integration on this, to your credit.
00:07:48.280But overall, Conservatives have been very happy to touch that.
00:07:54.140And I want to start by framing the problem here as context for what I'm about to say.
00:08:01.980The Liberal government would love, because this is what they always do for folks like you and me and anybody else who has lists immigration as a policy concern in terms of how they would vote, they would love for us to point our fingers at the people making any of the issues that we're going to talk about as the fault of people who want to come to this country to build a better life.
00:08:24.220When in fact, it has been their decision, the Liberal government's decision, to advocate on behalf of wealthy corporations who have used an endless supply of foreign labour to depress wages and juice corporate profits.
00:08:43.120I think that it's really, and I don't think anybody listening to this podcast would either.
00:08:47.460Because we know that successive waves of immigration have built this country over time.0.54
00:08:52.280But where are things going off the rails?
00:08:54.940Well, where have Conservatives addressed some of the issues that you're talking about?
00:08:58.720First of all, I was in the House of Commons when the Liberals changed the language acquisition rules for people applying to become citizens.
00:09:06.020They changed the age range wherein you had to be proficient in one of Canada's official languages in order to become a citizen.
00:09:13.020They removed that. We pushed back on that hard.
00:09:15.420I was in the House of Commons. I led the debate on that.
00:13:07.200That's what the left always talks about.0.94
00:13:08.660Well, big immigration is the biggest lobby in Canada.
00:13:11.640It really is, especially when you look at the lobbyist registry.
00:13:14.260It's corporations that advocate for rule changes to make it easier for them to import labor that is tied to a job and a business,
00:13:23.680so that they can depress wages and not have the, not to fill their part of the social contract in
00:13:31.540Canada, which is training and providing opportunity for people who are already here, right? And I think
00:13:37.800that that's disgusting. We have, what I would love to see Canadians reject, and that I, you know,
00:13:43.380I know you talk about this a lot, is the concept that immigration is solely an economic policy.
00:13:49.800Think about that. Think about the dehumanization of that statement. Immigration is an economic
00:13:54.920policy. Think about the lack of self-determination in that statement. When in fact, there's cultural1.00
00:14:00.840aspects. Immigration should be a nation-building policy. And part of that is fulfilling the promise
00:14:06.840to Canadians and to people who come here that if you come to Canada, if you live in Canada,
00:14:11.720you have the prospect of becoming upwardly socially mobile in the economy, affording a house,
00:14:18.040raising a family. So, you know, anybody, any of these lobbyists that come in and say, oh, well,
00:14:23.200if we don't have immigration, you know, the economy is going to collapse. It's like, okay,
00:14:27.860well, what about labor mobility? What about skills training? What about making life more
00:14:31.980affordable so that people who are already here can afford to have a family and have more people
00:14:37.040in Canada? So big immigration is gross. Anytime I have, it's become like almost a gag and a1.00
00:14:44.740reflexive exercise for me when I have lobbyists in front of committee and they're just literally
00:14:49.520advocating for more workers just to depress wages without talking about any of those other issues.
00:14:54.720It's like, no, we're not going to keep tolerating this anymore. And we're going to, we've been
00:14:58.180calling it out and, and, you know, kudos to other people for doing so across the political spectrum,
00:15:03.480including labor unions who are starting to do that as well too.
00:15:07.580We're just about out of time. I want to sneak one last question in before I let you go.
00:15:12.000So, one of those questions put to Albertans was effectively asked if Ottawa should give Alberta Quebec-style control over selecting its own immigrants.
00:15:28.340Question to you. Should that be a yes or no?
00:15:32.100You know, I think that the federal government sure has messed up setting levels at the federal level.
00:15:36.920So, it's no wonder. It's not just Alberta or Quebec.
00:15:39.480almost every province is saying, hey, we need more control over immigration because we can't
00:15:45.580keep up. You know, even I would point to Ontario, they had to go to the federal government to get
00:15:49.080way more funding for housing refugees, for example, right? So I think that as long as0.91
00:15:55.220the federal government keeps messing up the immigration system writ large, of course,
00:15:59.820there's going to be more pushback from the provinces because that's where the impact
00:16:03.940lies in the provision of primary education, health care, other social services in Alberta,
00:16:10.580for example, would be AISH. So I understand it. I would also say at the same time that1.00
00:16:16.860in Canada, there's the reality of mobility of persons in the country. If you enter the country,
00:16:23.100you're not just tied to one place, depending on your type of entry permit. So that has to be
00:16:29.020taken into consideration, too, right? But, I mean, my job is...
00:16:35.340Are you able to give a clearer answer? I know you've provided a lot of context, but is it a yes?
00:16:41.840Yes. And Pierre Polyev was out saying that the day after the referendum. Of course, the answer is yes.
00:16:46.800I think it's just important because sometimes I've watched this conversation in the referendum