Western Standard - The Cory Morgan Show. March 29, 2021

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00:01:00.000 Let's get started.

00:01:30.000 Thank you.

00:02:00.000 Good morning. Welcome to the Cory Morgan Show for March 29th. It looks like March is going

00:02:12.000 out like a lion. It's windy and snowy. Well, we'll try and look on the upside. There's

00:02:18.120 been a terrible number of grass fires across Alberta this last couple of days. Hopefully

00:02:22.500 that snow knocks some of a little bit of that down. Just a bit of Alberta history got lost

00:02:28.260 the night before last too unrelated to the the grass fires directly but people familiar with

00:02:33.020 prairie towns might know the grange hotel in in carmangay albert i actually lived in carmangay

00:02:38.180 for a short period of time back in the 90s it was a classic prairie wooden hotel with the old

00:02:43.880 tavern they had a dusty old stuffed uh links in there if i recall and uh they'd shot a number of

00:02:51.260 movies there i believe it was a great set of course for a western set uh sadly the night

00:02:55.760 before last it did burn down those old wooden hotels really uh don't take fire well so a piece

00:03:01.840 of alberta history has been lost on the bright side you know nobody got injured apparently

00:03:06.300 which is really good because those places go up quickly so getting on with news today i'm going

00:03:14.300 to have two guests on through this show uh the first one will be on in about 15 minutes it's jay

00:03:19.480 hill he's the leader of the maverick party or interim leader i do want to clarify that and

00:03:25.580 they're getting geared up for their appearance in this first federal election for them.

00:03:30.600 There's a lot of questions to ask on where they're looking to go, what their

00:03:33.800 intentions are, what they hope to accomplish out of this. Comments, by the way, are welcome,

00:03:41.240 as are questions. I'll pass them on. Try to keep them short, though. I mean, if they're

00:03:45.320 very long and extended, I have difficulty getting them onto the guests. After Jay comes on,

00:03:50.500 we're going to have Derek Fromm, who's a lawyer who's worked. He's been politically involved in

00:03:55.280 a number of things. You might have seen him on Daniel's radio show in the past, or heard him at

00:03:59.100 least. He'd speak quite often to constitutional and individual freedom issues, and boy, we certainly

00:04:04.460 have a lot of challenges to our freedoms these days. So this show has been sponsored, by the way,

00:04:12.620 by, I'll get to that, kyronsway.com, and I'll spell it out for those listening on the podcast.

00:04:17.380 it's k-y-r-o-n-s-w-a-y.com it's a calgary business it penny runs it they specialize

00:04:26.340 in natural treatment of stress and anxiety you know if you want to avoid the the pill pushers

00:04:32.640 and some of the more conventional routes to deal with these things but of course you want to avoid

00:04:36.460 the other bad outcomes from stress and anxiety such as you know alcoholism and things such as

00:04:41.980 that. Check out Kyrensway.com. Penny might be offering just what you need. It could be for you

00:04:48.120 and make things better to get through these stressful and anxious times for all of us. And

00:04:52.940 these sponsors are really critical to us. We're getting these shows going.

00:04:57.400 We do need people to help. We don't take government funding. So, hey, if you want to

00:05:01.540 get your message out there and your company out there, by all means, get a hold of the Western

00:05:05.920 Standard. We'll be happy to set something up. It's a great way to get your local business out there

00:05:10.120 to local customers who really want to support them in these these crazed times during shutdowns

00:05:15.580 so uh yeah hello mike toff and uh somebody's saying sovereignty sovereignty and servitude

00:05:21.560 is a great podcast that's interesting we get to share a lot of things you know and you can discuss

00:05:26.180 things with each other in the comments comment scroll while you're at it as well i mentioned

00:05:31.560 danielle smith earlier by the way i should mention she's going to be on with recently freed pastor

00:05:38.000 James Coates that's going to be on tomorrow night. Those have been very popular specials.

00:05:42.220 Danielle's just fantastic. She's really enjoying herself now that she's been cut free from the 0.99

00:05:48.080 restraints of conventional media. You know, on talk radio, she'd spoken a lot of that since then.

00:05:53.900 You know, she was just, she was being told which guests she could have, which subjects she could

00:05:57.860 go on. It just wasn't for her. She couldn't handle that. I mean, Danielle cares about the issues.

00:06:04.120 she cares about these things she's not just a news reporter so she pulled away and she's been

00:06:08.080 doing fantastic for the western standard for all of us so tune in tomorrow night at six o'clock

00:06:12.020 it's another one of these specials that'll be her seventh that she's spoken to doctors on the

00:06:16.880 covet 19 to lawyers because she's touching issues that the mainstream media just won't they're

00:06:23.080 they're cowardly when it comes to these things and these are so important so be sure to catch 0.92

00:06:28.900 that with Danielle. I mean, they've just been riveting and fantastic. So I should get on and

00:06:35.340 check out. That is the top story, of course, all the time these days is COVID-19. And I'm just

00:06:44.040 fighting with my screen share. So let's see the latest breathless update on COVID-19.

00:06:53.360 there we go okay so alberta is reporting 644 new cases of covet 19 variants variants are now more

00:07:04.240 than one quarter of the active cases again the goal posts just always keep moving you know it

00:07:10.680 was it was deaths last year and that was hospitalizations because we were worried

00:07:14.320 about overwhelming our system and two weeks to flatten the curve and blah blah blah but every

00:07:18.780 time we achieve a benchmark every time something seems to go down they find a new thing to report

00:07:23.360 report on by fall it turned into the case demic we're reporting on cases cases cases because the

00:07:27.460 deaths just weren't warranting the massive damage being caused by the restrictions and shutdowns

00:07:33.500 so they worried about the cases and now the cases and the deaths have all gone down so now it's the

00:07:38.420 variant and they're on and on about this variant guys they've been telling us about the variant

00:07:44.220 since december you know this thing is if it was that brutal again i'm not one of those people

00:07:49.240 saying it doesn't exist i'm not saying pandemic doesn't exist i'm not saying the variants don't

00:07:52.500 exist but clearly it's not nearly as dangerous as they constantly keep trying to tell us it is but

00:07:59.780 this is what the headlines are this was I believe I took that yeah it's from CTV you know they're the

00:08:04.020 ones are going to report on the variants they're not going to talk about the fact that we're still

00:08:07.200 well under 300 hospitalizations which was the benchmark for opening on step three they're not

00:08:13.120 going to talk about the fact that ICU cases are uh 63 or 67 I believe you know so the the media

00:08:22.060 doesn't report on those things you know the fact that only one or two people are dying a day which

00:08:26.140 is tragic but typically they are in the 70s and 80s uh so let's look at these numbers these are

00:08:32.780 the projections that the government works on for those who can't see it uh it's a swooping graph

00:08:38.620 it's kind of like dr tam's rocket ship graph that that one her line shot right off the top of the

00:08:43.740 graph they've never made an explanation for that horrific and embarrassing piece of work that came

00:08:49.740 from what are supposed to be the top health officials in in canada so this is what we've

00:08:55.420 got but here's some hospitalization projections i should say that you know i guess there was some

00:09:00.460 small print on the side that this is presuming that there was going to be no measures or something

00:09:04.860 like that taken but they figured we're going to have 3600 hospitalizations you know this this

00:09:09.820 this deadline came a little while ago by now and and uh most of them were going to be of the variant

00:09:15.100 and we were just going to be of course catastrophe and bodies stacked like cordwood we're all going

00:09:18.940 going to die the usual stuff well right now we got 277 people in the hospital not one-tenth of what

00:09:25.940 they're projecting and yes we've still got some restrictions but you know and and they're still

00:09:29.540 causing a lot of uh stress and and damage and harm to businesses and and individuals uh there's a lot

00:09:36.500 of people out and about and if this variant was going to be that killer or that nasty that horrible

00:09:41.260 people are going to walmart they're going to home people why hasn't it taken off like they have with

00:09:46.640 their fear-mongering projections, their scary, scary things, their constant moving of the goal

00:09:51.160 posts and their excuses to keep us locked down. These guys should be fired. The projections have

00:09:57.280 been garbage since day one. I mean, I understand you've got a guess, but holy cow, this is terrible. 0.99

00:10:02.960 So let's look at the ICUs because, of course, that's what they said as well. We're setting up

00:10:05.840 field hospitals. We're going to run out of ICU space. We won't be able to manage it.

00:10:10.200 they projected back in January we're gonna be sitting over 800 people in ICU

00:10:16.440 there again they're gonna be flooded we're gonna be setting up ICUs in the

00:10:20.200 lobbies of 7-elevens or hotels or something because we just wanted the

00:10:23.300 space for all of these these people dying we got 63 people in ICU hey again

00:10:29.560 that's horrible for the 63 people who are in there for their families they're in

00:10:33.200 ICU they're clearly in dire straits this is dangerous this is scary but it's

00:10:37.540 nothing like what they keep telling us. They keep feeding us this crap that this is going to be the 0.98

00:10:44.240 plague, and it's not. It's not even close, and we've got to start calling them out more on this 0.98

00:10:49.740 sort of thing, or they're going to keep cracking down on us. There is just that inherent instinct

00:10:54.300 with government officials. They do like control. They want excuses to keep us under their thumbs,

00:10:59.540 and this pandemic has given them the gift of all excuses for this sort of thing, and then

00:11:06.020 once the government gets control, they do not like letting go of it. And we see that as they keep

00:11:12.560 moving the bloody goalposts. And then, you know, some people love to keep saying that,

00:11:17.660 oh, this is just due to the restrictions. If we didn't have the restrictions in place,

00:11:22.100 if people weren't behaving, we would be in the thousands and thousands.

00:11:25.700 Ah, what a load of BS. And you know, the great thing is, thank you. And I reported on them last

00:11:30.040 week. And it's absolutely true. You know, John Winslow has pointed out, and I know he's still

00:11:34.360 pushing to have my name changed. We'll talk about that another time. The ICU usage in all of 2020

00:11:39.060 was actually down compared to other years. If this is the great plague year, why, but how did the ICU

00:11:46.660 usage go down? And some are saying, well, it's because we kept people locked up so they didn't

00:11:51.160 get injured and end up in there. Well, that's another scary thing because then they'll say,

00:11:54.280 well, you know what? We found that it's so effective at keeping people out of ICU.

00:11:57.940 We should make it permanent. And there is, there are people now talking about the pandemic

00:12:01.800 restrictions being permanent. There's people talking about wearing masks forever because

00:12:05.100 we got this zero bar safety set. It's ridiculous, but this is where we're going. And just to finish

00:12:14.480 out, so if this was true, Texas, thank you. As they say, God bless Texas. I'm not a religious

00:12:21.100 man, actually, but all the same, bless them. They took the chance, them in Mississippi.

00:12:26.340 They said, that's enough. Things are going down. Things are getting better. We've got to recover

00:12:30.520 our economy we've got to let people have a life and weeks ago they got rid of all restrictions

00:12:37.000 and the usual experts they claimed zoom and gloom they said the world's gonna end texans are gonna

00:12:42.920 die by the masses they're gonna infect the country well their restrictions went away

00:12:48.440 and their numbers continued to decrease and go down and down and down it puts complete lie

00:12:53.880 to the the thought that these restrictions are the only things that's keeping it under control

00:12:58.520 if anything we've seen consistently the pandemic is real it is moving around but our restrictions

00:13:04.040 don't really seem to actually have a heck of a lot of impact on it the factors that affected

00:13:07.960 spread seem much more tied to weather patterns gatherings and meat packing plants we really

00:13:13.880 should study that because it really does seem to go wild through there but thankfully again we've

00:13:19.080 got those outside cases now that we can see them we can see sweden you know people love barking and

00:13:23.080 jumping up all over them and they were just thrilled when sweeten finally got crushed down

00:13:27.560 to the point where they imposed restrictions as well. But actually, now that we've got full one

00:13:33.340 year numbers and everything, they were not out of line with any other countries over there when it

00:13:37.140 comes to actually deaths and so on. I mean, they made some terrible mistakes in putting people

00:13:40.580 into senior centers who were infected. That led to some higher deaths in the early part of the

00:13:46.660 pandemic. It was a terrible judgment call on their part. But their general lack of restrictions didn't

00:13:52.180 cause the catastrophe that people are making it out to be. We need to move on from this stuff.

00:13:59.900 Ray Anderson saying, natural immunity is all we need, then back to living your life. Well,

00:14:03.640 and that's fair enough. And I mean, I believe in vaccinations myself. I don't know about the

00:14:07.720 efficacy of these, you know, and the degree of it. But one way or another, you got to get the

00:14:11.100 immunity, whether it's being exposed to it naturally and through life or through a vaccination. I mean,

00:14:15.740 if the vaccinations are working for the vulnerable people, for the ones who are elderly or have

00:14:19.640 pre-existing conditions yes by all means you know get a vaccination because this can kill you it is

00:14:26.120 not a minor bug there's no doubt about it but for a lot of us we just don't need that or we don't

00:14:31.500 need the restrictions i mean we can wait we can get out there and for a lot of us we're getting

00:14:35.280 that natural immunity as this this bug gets it makes its way around um i saw jay there in the

00:14:41.520 lobby shortly so he's going to be up pretty quickly here with us so get your questions on the

00:14:46.180 the Maverick party and Jay Hill as to what he might have to say was that Bill McKenzie's Russia

00:14:51.800 has more freedom than we do right now that's a distressing thought to think of isn't it

00:14:56.860 Russia is an interesting player one other news item I just saw recently before I came on I guess

00:15:01.520 that ship that's been blocking the Suez Canal has finally been moved after days and days and

00:15:06.940 you know I see such an interesting analogy out of that when we've allowed our supply chains

00:15:11.560 and our management to be bunged up with choke points like that and being reliant on single

00:15:17.420 sources of supplies for things. Because it just makes me think of Canada and our pipeline

00:15:22.700 circumstances and our energy infrastructure. When we made ourselves so dependent on the United

00:15:28.900 States for moving our products, and now that we've got a hostile American government against

00:15:33.860 oil and gas, we are up the creek. We can't get our stuff to Tidewater because we have a hostile

00:15:39.340 government in Ottawa and we're sitting on some of the world's greatest oil and gas resources

00:15:45.720 and we can't get them to any customers. That's the hazards that come with allowing your supply

00:15:51.800 chains to be limited with limited people going through. So as we see the Suez Canal, Europe is

00:15:57.280 in a great deal of trouble. This is going to have a whiplash effect with hundreds and hundreds of

00:16:01.460 these massive ships carrying consumer products, industrial goods, and so many important things

00:16:06.440 been held up for days and that backlog is going to take a while to get through. It certainly has

00:16:12.660 made a case for the importance of diversifying our production means, our distribution means,

00:16:19.620 and not letting all our eggs get into one basket. That tells us a heck of a lot about the risks of

00:16:26.060 our ongoing dependency with China too, which is really turning out to be a bad rogue player 0.93

00:16:32.000 on the world scene. But our Prime Minister really seems to have a giant blind spot and 0.85

00:16:38.460 has no worries about China while they hold our citizens hostage. So a certain Jay Hill will be 0.93

00:16:44.040 there in just a moment. So it's this from Lucy Lovelock. At what point are we able to move on

00:16:48.940 from the close contact issue? How long will it be the case that a kid in the class tests positive

00:16:54.640 but has no symptoms and that sends the kids and the teacher home for two weeks? Yeah, I know.

00:17:00.360 but it's crazy. And we're seeing all sorts of them. I mean, kids, if anything we've learned

00:17:04.040 from this are pretty much immune from this thing. I suspect we've got some certain people in

00:17:09.820 organized labor who just like that concept of not working for weeks at a time. So we have our guest

00:17:16.140 here, Jay Hill. He's on from the Maverick party. And thank you very much for joining us today,

00:17:23.760 Jay, it's good to see you. Good to see you, Corey. So yes, we'll get the camera adjusted a little bit

00:17:31.560 there. I've been on with my morning rant. I don't know if it's been stirring others up,

00:17:36.280 but it helps get my blood pressure going and I'm nice and wide awake for the day.

00:17:40.580 So we'll see you back. I'm an old Reform Party member of the past as well and

00:17:46.580 was one of the volunteers back in Preston Manning's day and then

00:17:50.740 helped out in art hangers riding and all the way up and of course your name and face was familiar

00:17:55.820 through those ranks back then and you retired and then here we are again you are back you have

00:18:02.900 taken the reins of the the maverick party and you're getting things geared up for a federal

00:18:08.900 election coming more than likely within the next few months most definitely almost by the end of

00:18:13.300 the year so maybe if you'd give us a little bit of background what was the progression of events

00:18:19.580 that led to the Maverick Party's formation

00:18:21.780 and your being at the head of it.

00:18:24.560 Sure, Corey.

00:18:25.380 I'll try to be as brief as possible.

00:18:28.680 The situation was that after the 2019 election campaign,

00:18:34.400 I became very disillusioned, disenchanted,

00:18:37.700 and disappointed in the election results.

00:18:41.080 I don't think there's been a more stark example

00:18:43.780 of the problem that Western Canada faces

00:18:46.160 than the results from that election in October of 2019, when largely Central and Eastern Canada

00:18:53.080 re-elected the government of Justin Trudeau. And what we saw then, it wasn't just Jay Hill,

00:19:01.540 it was a huge upsurge in anger and disappointment in Western Canada that basically their votes

00:19:10.220 didn't count. And I said at the time, Corey, that I effectively became a supporter of Western

00:19:19.320 independence following that vote. And so I started chatting with Peter Downing, who is the leader of

00:19:27.520 the Wexit movement and subsequently the Wexit Canada Federal Party, that they applied for

00:19:34.680 registration with the Elections Canada in January of 2020. And I started chatting with him and we

00:19:42.560 had a number of conversations back and forth. I urged him to differentiate between political

00:19:48.980 activism and the efforts that I believed it would take to start a alternative federal party,

00:19:55.880 Western party. And eventually that led to Peter deciding to go the activist route full-time

00:20:03.100 and he decided to step down from the leadership of WECSIC Canada.

00:20:09.560 I and a very small board of directors, all interim, of course,

00:20:13.800 because no one's elected us, we're just volunteers,

00:20:16.440 stepped forward the end of June.

00:20:18.560 And we immediately started to work to try to establish credibility

00:20:22.800 for this new political party and go through all of the mechanics

00:20:27.940 that are necessary to get a federal political party established,

00:20:32.800 albeit strictly a Western one. A number of things happened which forced us to change the name.

00:20:40.480 In mid-September, we changed the name from Wexit Canada to the Maverick Party.

00:20:46.440 Elections Canada accepted that name change. It became official on the 17th of September.

00:20:52.500 So we've had just over six months, Corey, to work on the myriad issues of establishing and

00:20:59.400 maintaining and growing a political party with only the support really of a few dozen people

00:21:06.640 doing 90% of the work at the core of the party. That's where we're at today. We've established

00:21:13.320 now 18 what's known as EDAs, used to be called constituency or writing associations, same

00:21:21.200 format, just a different name attached to it by Elections Canada. So we've established

00:21:27.760 18 now, and we're continuing to grow. We just recently, this past week, announced our first

00:21:33.960 three candidates, and we'll go from here. Great. So this was an evolution from the

00:21:41.640 Wexit movement that was a very explicitly independence-pursuing organization. So is

00:21:48.320 the Maverick Party's base tenet to the pursuit of Western independence then?

00:21:52.780 Well, our mission statement is twofold, and we call it our twin-track approach, Corey. We have

00:22:02.060 worked on, researched, and with the help of a constitutional scholar, professor at a university

00:22:10.300 that donated his time, we have drafted and made public five constitutional amendments

00:22:19.020 to Canada's constitution, which constitutes our option A, if you will. And that would be

00:22:26.940 building autonomy, building protection for the West through constitutional change.

00:22:35.420 The second track is the one that you're suggesting, which was the original track that

00:22:40.860 Wexit was on, which is independence for Western Canada. In other words, secession,

00:22:46.060 similar to what Quebec tried twice in 1980 and 1995, where you convince a province, in the case

00:22:56.540 of Quebec, it was one province, but in the West, it would be hopefully more than one, that would

00:23:02.060 seek support from the population, from the electorate in the form of a referendum on

00:23:08.460 independent. That's our second track. We say either or. We don't want to alienate anyone.

00:23:18.860 We still believe that there are a lot of Westerners that allow their heart to overrule their head,

00:23:26.140 if you will, in the sense that they want to remain Canadian. They want to give Canada every possible

00:23:31.980 opportunity to treat the West fairly and respectfully. They recognised that that would

00:23:38.060 only happen through modernising the country's constitution. As you know, it's been around since

00:23:43.740 the 1800s. Certainly, Maverick believes that it's high time that we did something about that.

00:23:50.860 If we wanted a more clear example, it would be this past week when the Supreme Court

00:23:57.180 ruled that Justin Trudeau's carbon tax is actually legal. It's legal for him to impose that on the

00:24:07.020 provinces. And of course, we all know that three provinces in particular fought that all the way to

00:24:12.620 the Supreme Court, Alberta, Saskatchewan, Ontario. So it's very clear now that without constitutional

00:24:20.140 change to protect the jurisdiction of provinces, we will continue to see those types of rulings

00:24:28.860 from the Supreme Court. So when Westerners say to me, well, you know, their eyes glaze over as soon

00:24:34.780 as you mentioned constitutional change, and now I have a very clear example, a recent example,

00:24:41.340 as I say, just of last week, where that is why it's necessary to see constitutional change if

00:24:48.780 if we ever want the West treated fairly.

00:24:52.420 Yeah, well, and the need for constitutional change

00:24:54.900 has been acute for quite some time.

00:24:57.180 Again, I'm just getting flashbacks to reform a lot.

00:25:01.260 When we were looking at Tripoli Senate

00:25:03.540 and things to, again, help entrench

00:25:05.400 some regional authority so we could represent ourselves,

00:25:10.400 unfortunately, it never got anywhere.

00:25:12.080 And that was back in the days of Meach Lake and Charlottetown,

00:25:15.500 which again, were attempts at constitutional change,

00:25:18.640 but they didn't get through, the formula is exceedingly difficult to get a change to our

00:25:23.560 constitution, as it should be. I mean, you don't want to do it on a whim, but do you really feel

00:25:28.260 that we could make significant constitutional changes sometime in the future? I mean, I know

00:25:32.260 we need to, or will lead to more desperate options, but do you think there's much chance?

00:25:38.500 Well, I would almost have to say that in consulting with constitutional scholars,

00:25:43.780 as you suggest, Corey, it's going to be extremely difficult. Nobody is downplaying the effort that

00:25:49.220 it'll take. And the willingness on those other provinces and the central government, both houses

00:25:56.020 of parliament, to accede to the need to modernize our constitution. So it's a huge hurdle for the

00:26:05.120 West to overcome. Having said that, so is independence. Under the Clarity Act, there's

00:26:12.660 a specific route that a province or a number of provinces could take to secede from Canada.

00:26:21.500 That's very clear. There's a legal process that can be followed, but it too is fraught with a lot

00:26:28.800 of pitfalls as you go along down that track. So basically, either track that the Maverick

00:26:35.600 is advocating for will be difficult. And we recognize that, but we believe that in that

00:26:43.420 old adage that every great journey begins with one step. We've tried the other route for over

00:26:49.600 100 years in the case of Alberta and Saskatchewan, largely supporting small C conservative or large

00:26:58.460 C conservative parties, and it's gotten us nowhere. I mean, we're still faced with things

00:27:03.360 like our pipeline, our energy market access is being denied on all fronts, whether it's through

00:27:10.880 British Columbia or Quebec or South now with Keystone. We have continued, I would say,

00:27:23.840 enemies at the federal level, at the federal government level, in how they impose things like

00:27:29.680 the carbon tax, like Bill C-48 and C-49, like how the formula for equalization, which is really

00:27:39.280 a misnomer, if you will. It's not equalization at all, it's just a transfer of wealth from the West

00:27:46.800 to the East. So there's a number of things that we believe can only be addressed by one of two ways,

00:27:55.280 either modernization, updating our constitution to protect the West or by the West moving towards

00:28:03.520 independence. And there's a lot of intermediate steps. And of course, the Fair Deal panel here

00:28:08.000 in Alberta addressed a lot of those. The UCP government in Alberta and the Sask Party government

00:28:16.800 in Saskatchewan has indicated they're willing to move on those issues that discuss that would

00:28:24.320 create more autonomy but in reality for the big changes as i've already touched on it will require

00:28:31.280 constitutional change or outright independence and it should be dawning on people after as i said

00:28:38.000 over a century of effort uh that uh it'll have to be one of those two ways and both of them are

00:28:43.600 extremely difficult yeah well getting anything significant accomplished or anything big of

00:28:49.440 course there's just no easy path that's that's life it's going to take some work and you can't

00:28:53.680 be afraid of it. I'm going to dive into one of the bigger parts of the hornet's nest though then,

00:28:57.840 because so C-69, C-48 really did devastate Western abilities to develop and export resources because 0.96

00:29:05.680 it's just made us an investment pariah. It set the bars for getting infrastructure, you know,

00:29:11.120 constructed way too high to be reasonable for anybody to take that chance. That's why

00:29:16.000 Prime Minister Trudeau took a chance on our behalf with the Trans Mountain because they

00:29:19.280 basically killed any possibility of a private enterprise doing that uh but moving on to

00:29:24.800 something that's before the house right now is cease 15 and and that's uh a bill it's before

00:29:30.320 committee and it's talking about uh a new first nations policy and that bill it speaks directly

00:29:38.080 to as stacy leeson here is putting a question she'd like to know what you think of the

00:29:41.600 un drip which is the united nations declaration on the rights of indigenous peoples and i know

00:29:47.440 it's a complex uh difficult area but it's a huge one that that if we bind ourselves to some of

00:29:53.600 those consultation requirements within that agreement we're really not going to get anything

00:29:58.160 done it doesn't serve the indigenous peoples terribly well either um not to mention when

00:30:03.600 it comes to independence options that's a big question mark hanging there is how do we uh

00:30:08.400 deal with with our you know native citizens who were in sort of a different status than the rest

00:30:13.760 of us? Well, as is the case with a lot of the issues that are facing the national government

00:30:22.560 and Canada as a whole, Corey, the Maverick Party, because we're in our infancy, as I said,

00:30:29.280 we're only just over six months old. We haven't taken positions on things like that. I think I

00:30:37.520 can speak for a lot of Western Canadians, not just Maverick members, when I say we have some very

00:30:44.320 deep concerns about UNDRIP and other UN initiatives. We have deep concerns about

00:30:53.920 how this whole pandemic has been handled globally, not just by our federal and provincial governments

00:31:01.120 in Canada. And I know you touched on it in your earlier statement before I came on your program.

00:31:08.240 So, while I say that Maverick has some very deep concerns about this, we're not in a position where

00:31:15.600 we can take a definitive position at this time. Certainly, as I said, there's myriad issues that

00:31:22.400 we're grappling with right now. We recognise, as you just stated, it's very clear that the road to

00:31:29.120 independence for Western Canada is, as I suggested, fraught with a lot of potholes and pitfalls.

00:31:36.000 One of the greatest challenges, and I've been very clear about this, is our relationship with our Indigenous people in the West.

00:31:45.520 We would have to have a lot of negotiation with the various First Nations and Métis people to come up with a position and a plan moving forward so that they would feel as welcome in this new Western nation as all other Western Canadians.

00:32:06.960 So it would take a lot of work. We all know that. And it's one of the bigger challenges that would

00:32:11.920 come with a referendum on independence. We saw that in the most recent Quebec referendum. And

00:32:21.120 indeed, really it was because of some of the First Nations in Quebec saying, well, wait a minute,

00:32:26.800 just because all non-Indigenous Quebecers might vote for independence doesn't mean that we would

00:32:35.040 want to leave Canada and so that opened up a whole another debate during that referendum campaign,

00:32:42.880 Corey, and it really resulted in the Supreme Court recognizing a fundamental issue and that is that

00:32:49.600 if the country is divisible, if Canada is divisible and they determined that it was,

00:32:55.920 if you follow a certain process, then so too are provinces divisible and of course I've pointed

00:33:02.720 to the fact that even if the Lower Mainland and Vancouver Island of British Columbia might

00:33:07.600 vote overwhelmingly to stay with Canada and effectively become like Alaska is to the southern

00:33:13.600 48 states, that doesn't mean that the remainder, that's sort of the 90% of British Columbia,

00:33:22.320 wouldn't vote overwhelmingly to go the other route and join with Alberta and Saskatchewan and

00:33:27.120 potentially Manitoba and form a new nation. So a lot of questions, Corey, and not many answers,

00:33:34.320 but that's the best I can do at this point in time. Certainly, we intend to be wide open and

00:33:40.320 welcoming to our First Nations and to the Indigenous people of Western Canada and try

00:33:45.520 to negotiate with them. And the other point I'd just add to that is that I've often referred to

00:33:51.280 the fact that if you think that the majority of Western Canadians are unhappy with the way

00:33:58.000 Confederation works, that we're treated like a colony, still like back in the 1800s for Central

00:34:04.320 Canada, for this transfer of wealth. Imagine how the First Nations feel after all these years and

00:34:11.120 still being under the Indian Act and this paternalistic relationship with the federal

00:34:17.120 government so i think that they would be very open to a new relationship with a government uh

00:34:23.680 a government of western canada but it'll take a lot of negotiation yeah well and that was an

00:34:30.480 interesting thing you opened up because the the stalemate i guess you can almost say we have in

00:34:35.520 first nations issues uh due to that horrific document called the indian act i mean it's

00:34:40.960 outdated it's racist it it limits people on race-based policy and it holds them back

00:34:45.840 but it would take nothing less than something coming close to the point of independence to

00:34:49.740 have that opportunity to maybe redraft the entire agreement because the current agreement is failing

00:34:54.500 anybody who's worked on or spent time on on native reserves particularly the isolated ones

00:34:59.600 they're having a terrible time this is not a system that is serving them well at all it's

00:35:04.260 awful to to see people uh in that sort of condition when we're in such a prosperous nation obviously

00:35:08.680 the current system isn't working but we just it's like everything else we can't seem to

00:35:12.880 get anything done we butt our heads against the wall and we try through conventional means so

00:35:17.240 an independence push you know and it's just a nice way to frame it could be more opportunity

00:35:21.540 for a lot of positive changes aside from just equalization and local things exactly yeah no

00:35:27.940 that's exactly right so yeah and you'd mentioned bc and and uh you know partition like this is uh

00:35:36.160 something that people are arguing against independence quite often point out they say

00:35:40.080 well what if edmonton doesn't want to go and and what if uh you know how far and how small do these

00:35:46.000 uh do these cuts come like i and it's it's interesting questions and they're tough ones

00:35:50.960 to answer you know i look at switzerland i see it as a fantastic model they got all of those cantons

00:35:56.560 into a tiny little nation there and they've got a great deal of independence the cantons to canton

00:36:00.400 i could be pronouncing them wrong but it's their version of a province uh and it's run quite a bit

00:36:05.760 by direct democracy as some of them are very socialist leaning some are quite conservative

00:36:09.760 leaning and they still are managed to be bonded in one nation uh in a small geographic area uh

00:36:16.800 but still i mean how much would we want to slice and dice the west before it becomes dysfunctional

00:36:23.120 well i guess i wouldn't use that term of slicing and dicing i would say that uh what you you you

00:36:30.720 want to start from the premise that it's the the people of Western Canada that deserve to have a

00:36:36.080 say and all too often down through down through our the history of our country we have not had a

00:36:44.480 say and you only need to look at the results from past elections to see that by and large central

00:36:51.200 Canada with some support from the east determines who our government is going to be and how we're

00:36:57.040 going to be governed before we even get a vote, which really puts paid to this whole issue of

00:37:02.800 vote splitting, as it were. I think that the primary purpose of Maverick is to give people

00:37:14.800 an alternative and give them some means to express their opinion about the system that we're governed

00:37:22.640 by. I've taken to calling our system of democracy in Canada tyranny of the majority and having spent

00:37:29.720 17 years of my adult life, very proudly I might add as a representative for a constituency in

00:37:37.600 Ottawa as a member of parliament and later as a cabinet minister, I've of course witnessed

00:37:43.140 that situation up front. And what do I mean by tyranny of the majority? Well, it's very simple.

00:37:49.400 The vast majority of the seats and thus the power of Parliament is in central Canada.

00:37:56.540 And any party, and I go back to my earliest party, the Reform Party of Canada that I first ran for back in 1988.

00:38:06.140 And when we decided to expand eastward and become a truly a national party and eventually went through all sorts of macinations,

00:38:16.740 Canadian Alliance, the United Alternative, and eventually under Stephen Harper and Peter McKay,

00:38:22.820 we merged the Canadian Alliance with the Progressive Conservative Party of Canada to form the existing

00:38:30.140 Conservative Party. But what you end up with, and it's true of the People's Party under Max Bernier

00:38:36.260 as well, as soon as you're a national party under our system of government, then you must appeal to

00:38:42.580 where the votes are. It's just mathematics. It's not difficult for any Canadian to understand how

00:38:47.680 this works. So if you want to be government, and what party doesn't, other than the Maverick Party,

00:38:53.860 if you want to be government, then you have to appeal to those people in Central Canada.

00:38:58.220 And I would submit, Corey, that the views of the average Torontonian or Montrealer are

00:39:07.060 dramatically different than the average Calgarian, and even far more different than the average

00:39:13.860 farmer in Western Canada, the rural energy worker working on a drilling rig or what have you.

00:39:20.980 And we're never going to have a meeting of the minds. And so that's why Maverick Party has

00:39:26.340 limited itself to run only candidates in Western Canada, because we recognise that we want to

00:39:34.260 represent we want to be a true voice for western canadians and give them that alternative

00:39:40.100 for the first time and that's what we intend to do well that's great and i mean something you

00:39:47.220 know it can't be understood the amount of influence a party can have even if you aren't in office

00:39:51.700 some people might forget that but uh if you looked at the the chretien liberals they balanced the

00:39:58.020 budget they were actually quite fiscally responsible in a great number of ways and a large part of the

00:40:03.220 The reason for that was because the official opposition was breathing down their neck and pushing them on spending and items like that, and they were forced to act.

00:40:11.640 So, you know, it can't be dismissed the impact that reform had.

00:40:16.160 And as you spoke, though, I mean, the complete tone of reform changed absolutely once they started looking to try and get east of Ontario and all those.

00:40:25.140 Yeah, the Canadian Reform Alliance Party.

00:40:27.320 And I remember Guard was formed, I believe, by Bruce Stubbs, which was Guardians Against Reform's demise.

00:40:31.520 I mean, it was quite tumultuous because we felt that the movement we'd built was being watered down and would just turn into the same old thing.

00:40:39.320 And I hate to say it, it took a while, but that's pretty much what happened.

00:40:42.880 I mean, I don't see a lot to distinguish O'Toole's current conservatives from the old Mulroney PCs of the past.

00:40:51.620 I think that's a very accurate statement, Corey.

00:40:54.200 And it's certainly one that, you know, I readily admit today to being a slow learner.

00:41:00.600 I mean, I went through, as I say, 17 years of elected service, and it wasn't until the results of the 2019 election.

00:41:13.060 I mean, obviously, I had some inkling to what had happened during our conservative governments under Stephen Harper and subsequent to that with the 2015 first election of Justin Trudeau.

00:41:26.760 I might add that I think that I echo the concerns of certainly a lot of Western Canadians in how appalled I am that this gentleman is our prime minister.

00:41:39.180 I think he's the most unqualified, incompetent prime minister, certainly in my lifetime, if not the history of our country.

00:41:46.860 And for the people of central Canada, not all of them, obviously, you can't generalize in that sense.

00:41:53.340 but for the majority of the people of Central and Eastern Canada to continue to support this

00:41:58.080 individual is just appalling to the average Westerner. And we have this great divide now.

00:42:06.660 And then when we get decisions like the Supreme Court's decision last week, you know, it just

00:42:13.960 really inflames the sense of Western alienation and the disunity in our country because it really

00:42:27.400 does show in stark terms the disparity of thinking politically between East and West.

00:42:35.720 And so, yeah, I couldn't agree more with your statement. I mean, we have put some comments and

00:42:44.360 some posts on our Facebook page and on our website, really reinforcing what you just said,

00:42:51.000 whether it's with a cartoon or a meme or a post of some kind, just to bring home in stark terms,

00:42:59.560 the difference of opinion between East and West and Canada today.

00:43:06.240 Yeah, it does just flabbergast us and it shows that difference in thought. I mean, when we look

00:43:11.180 at this, we've got this prime minister who, you know, I hang my head in embarrassment with his 1.00

00:43:16.860 India trip when he was dancing around like an imbecile. He wore blackface not once, but three 1.00

00:43:23.120 times that we know of. I mean, that was not just a one-off, it was a parlor trick for this guy. 0.80

00:43:28.880 The scandals, SNC-Lavalin, the WE scandal, yet none of it seems to chip away at a Central

00:43:35.720 Canadian support, which really feeds that sense of futility we have out here when it comes to that.

00:43:42.420 Now, getting on further, though, I mean, so I don't want to knock the entire CPC. There's some

00:43:47.240 very good and outspoken members of parliament, even Pierre Polyev in Ontario, but getting out

00:43:54.820 to the west a great deal of good mps uh when i was with the wild rose party of course one of our big 1.00

00:43:59.940 turning points when when we moved forward was bringing in some floor crossers once they'd 1.00

00:44:05.300 hit the wall and in frustration does the maverick party have a plan or a policy or something in mind 1.00

00:44:10.660 if that becomes a consideration or an alter an option for them uh well we don't have a plan in

00:44:19.120 place per se, but maybe I'll touch on a couple of issues dealing with your question, Corey.

00:44:25.760 First of all, we want to make it very clear that we're not running against your local member of

00:44:31.360 parliament. We're not even going to run against Erin O'Toole or even Justin Trudeau for that

00:44:35.520 matter. We're going to try to suggest to Western Canadians where we are going to contest in certain

00:44:43.360 ridings, that their alternative in voting for a Maverick is a vote against a system that very

00:44:51.040 clearly doesn't work. As I said, I'm a slow learner, but I have learned that the system is not

00:44:57.200 working in the best interest of Western Canadians. And so that's going to be our message. It's not

00:45:01.920 going to be that Michelle Rempel or Blake Richards or up in my riding, Bob Zimmer, any of these

00:45:08.360 Conservative members of Parliament, they're good people. In most cases, I think that they're nice

00:45:12.900 people. They're hardworking people. So what we're doing is offering an alternative. If you believe,

00:45:19.140 as we do, that the system is at fault, not the individual, then yes, you have to vote differently.

00:45:27.380 The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expect a different

00:45:32.020 result. Well, we've been doing that for more than 100 years. Surely to goodness, at some point in

00:45:36.820 time, we have to decide that like the Bloc Québécois in Parliament representing only Quebec's

00:45:44.220 interests, we need members of Parliament in Ottawa representing only the West's interests. It just

00:45:51.300 makes sense given the difference of thinking and the reality, as you just said, that Central

00:45:58.320 Canadians continue to support Justin Trudeau despite all of the scandals, despite the hypocrisy.

00:46:05.040 And this is what really sticks in my craw. And I'll just use one example. But you could go down a long list of hypocritical positions that this gentleman has taken. The position that they are imposing with this recent Supreme Court ruling, they're imposing this national carbon tax against the wishes of at least three provinces.

00:46:31.000 and a lot of people, a lot of Canadian citizens, they're imposing this. At the same time,

00:46:36.640 they continue to import billions of dollars of oil from other countries that don't have

00:46:44.500 our environmental standards, that don't have our labour standards. You know, it's the hypocrisy

00:46:50.980 is just astounding. And yet, you know, this government, this Liberal government in Ottawa,

00:46:56.620 just shrugs their shoulders and says, well, just accept it.

00:47:00.760 Well, excuse me, Maverick Party is not willing to accept that hypocrisy anymore.

00:47:07.060 And that's really what strikes at the heart of it.

00:47:09.620 So like I say, we're not going to run against the Conservative MPs.

00:47:12.940 We're going to be running against a system that basically censors them

00:47:17.240 because the Conservative Party of Canada, under Erin O'Toole or any other leader,

00:47:23.620 If they want to be government, they have to appeal to where the votes and the seats are in central Canada.

00:47:29.400 We all know that.

00:47:31.120 And therefore, if we're going to change things, you've got to vote for the only party in western Canada that stands for real change, fundamental, substantive change, and that's Maverick.

00:47:44.580 Well, that's good.

00:47:45.540 And I mean, something that, you know, when Quebec comes up, Quebec is unapologetically in it for Quebec.

00:47:51.520 They don't beat around the bush.

00:47:53.420 they they speak up for themselves and they assert themselves and they rather than getting bitter

00:47:58.140 from it i've always said we should try to learn from them i mean we there's aspects of what they

00:48:03.340 do that we should emulate but when i led the uh alberta independence party way back when

00:48:09.660 i actually sat down and met with uh um richard marceau he was a member of parliament for quebec

00:48:15.020 with the bloc quebecois i knew him well yeah and it was a very interesting conversation with them

00:48:20.620 him and a great chat. And, you know, he was kind of sent by Gilles Duceppe. And we were interested

00:48:25.000 in Western and Quebec independence movements, you know, being in communication with each other.

00:48:31.280 My own membership of the party was furious to find out that I'd even spoken with him.

00:48:35.480 Unfortunately, there is some misgiving sometimes when it comes to any dealings with Quebec and

00:48:39.800 some, you know, hurt feelings, I guess, just over a lot of the politics over generations with this.

00:48:45.660 But is there, I mean, if we get a pizza parliament, that's something I think would almost be good for us if we had a, yeah, who knows which one is considered prime minister.

00:48:54.820 But if we got a number of parties that have to form coalitions to get things done, would Maverick consider things such as working cooperatively with the Bloc Republic or other members like that?

00:49:05.480 Well, I don't want to put the cart before the horse to use an old Western adage, Corey.

00:49:10.400 There again, I mean, I don't have a crystal ball, so I don't know exactly how that would unfold.

00:49:15.660 More often I'm asked about whether a small number of Maverick members of Parliament elected in the West could work with a minority Conservative government were the Conservative Party and Aaron O'Toole to be successful in their head-to-head battle with Justin Trudeau and the Liberals in Central and Eastern Canada.

00:49:36.920 Certainly, I would believe that, and it's part of our guiding principles, that a Maverick Caucus

00:49:46.040 of Members of Parliament is going to hold to one of our guiding principles, which is that

00:49:51.960 they will operate, they will speak, and they will vote in the House of Commons if the legislation

00:49:59.440 motion or whatever in front of the House of Commons is in the best interests of the West

00:50:05.120 and their constituents, full stop. That's how the Bloc Québécois operates, as you suggest,

00:50:10.480 and they make no bones about it. At the beginning of this most recent parliament,

00:50:18.320 the Bloc leader, when he was walking into the House of Commons, was stopped by the

00:50:22.800 inevitable media scrum and asked what his strategy was for the upcoming session,

00:50:30.800 the opening session of this parliament. He was very clear and very simple. He just said,

00:50:36.160 well, if it's good for Quebec, we vote for it. If it's not, we vote against it.

00:50:42.080 Pretty simple strategy. That's the strategy I hope that the Maverick MPs, if we're fortunate

00:50:51.360 enough to be elected in a few ridings in Western Canada, that's the strategy they will follow for

00:50:56.320 the west well it should be refreshing to get that unapologetic voice i just want to see somebody say 0.98

00:51:02.400 no we will not vote for that we will not support that because damn it it's gonna harm my 0.96

00:51:07.760 constituents and they're not under the thumb of a central leader who say please don't speak up on 0.97

00:51:12.560 that because it'll harm our chances here here and here well then our voice gets lost i mean

00:51:18.080 the point of parliament is to at the very least even if you lose the vote we spoke up we we talked

00:51:22.480 we got our viewpoint out there. Well, just on that point, Corey, I've often remarked since Bill

00:51:31.760 C-48, the Northern tanker ban, and here I've already mentioned the hypocrisy that exists in

00:51:39.020 Canada, that tankers come in and out of Eastern ports and down to St. Lawrence every damn day,

00:51:46.120 no problem, but for some reason off the north coast of the Pacific, we're not allowed to have

00:51:52.520 oil tankers. So, Bill C-48, that tanker ban that this government passed, Bill C-69,

00:52:00.520 you already mentioned, brought in even more bureaucratic hurdles for private sector companies

00:52:07.160 in the building of energy infrastructure, predominantly, other infrastructure as well,

00:52:13.720 but it's especially been called the No New Pipelines Act because it basically makes it

00:52:19.720 impossible. That's driven billions of dollars of investment out of Canada and the jobs with it.

00:52:25.880 How many Canadians are working south of the border now? It's just astounding,

00:52:30.200 and it's appalling as well. I've often remarked when people say, well, what good would

00:52:35.960 constitutional change? What difference would it make in my life? Now, of course,

00:52:40.120 as I already remarked in this program, just look at this most recent Supreme Court decision.

00:52:45.240 But look at Bill C-48 and C-69. Do you believe for a minute that if we had a Triple E Senate

00:52:51.080 to protect the interests of the lesser populated regions of the country like they have in the

00:52:55.240 United States and Australia, do you believe that those bills would have been passed that are so

00:53:00.600 clearly against the best interests of one region? Not a chance. And so constitutional change

00:53:09.880 does matter if you want to keep canada together then get involved with the maverick party and

00:53:16.120 support our option a if that's your choice if you're still not uh you know somebody that's

00:53:21.640 supportive of independence but get involved in one of the tracks because nothing is going to

00:53:27.160 change if people don't demand the change yeah well and the senate i mean it's just such a

00:53:34.120 it's an embarrassment to democracy i mean the way it's structured they're appointed they aren't

00:53:40.040 balanced by population or region i mean they're purely formulated just as a as far as i'm

00:53:46.040 concerned a political pasture uh for for well-connected people uh one of the things that

00:53:51.400 that i found even more odious and deceptive was when trudeau said we were taking the partisanship

00:53:55.800 out of it and these are now independent senators oh yes you just took the label off it and appointed

00:54:00.120 more liberals you you've cloaked your liberals these are stealth liberals but they're still

00:54:04.140 liberals and they're still going to do your bidding in there they're beholden to the person

00:54:08.100 who put them in and i worked in the united states a lot in the past at the oil field because it was

00:54:12.760 already going down here so if i needed to find contracts i had to go to texas and pennsylvania

00:54:16.600 and you know if we'd be having a beer and talking politics and i'd explain that our senators are

00:54:21.980 appointed they were appalled how can it doesn't even compute for them why on earth would you have

00:54:27.900 appointed people in such positions of authority. I wish I had a good answer for them. And we've

00:54:34.700 got more battles coming. So C-69 is a go-to to shut down Western development. And with that

00:54:40.420 hypocrisy again, yeah, the tankers fly up and down the St. Lawrence, you know, there's beluga whales

00:54:44.980 there. There's many concerns and populated areas, but apparently it's just British Columbia ones

00:54:49.640 that are a problem. But we're looking at, I've seen people proposing alternatives to get our

00:54:54.480 product to market. Like we are seeing the world is going to recover. We're seeing resource prices

00:54:59.560 going up. We're sitting on these great resources. If we could just get them out, it would help our

00:55:03.380 own recovery from this horrific year. And there's some creative ideas. The Alberta to Alaska rail

00:55:08.840 line was pitched and some were talking about it. And within days, Trudeau came out and said,

00:55:12.580 well, don't forget, that's going to be the C-69 is going to apply to that too. That was his way

00:55:16.180 of saying that's not going to happen. So they just cork our bottle no matter how we try. And I've

00:55:21.380 seen now some very detailed plans on potentially getting rail export to Hudson's Bay so we could

00:55:26.220 have tankers run our product out of Hudson's Bay to get it to markets, European markets and other

00:55:31.460 markets. They haven't responded to that yet, but I got a feeling if we try that, we're going to

00:55:35.240 have to fight tooth and nail to get that through too. Well, and that's why I've said that in many

00:55:40.020 respects, the West would be better off as far as marketing our energy resources. We'd be better

00:55:45.820 off as an independent country. We would have more authority. We would have more possibilities

00:55:50.960 than we do as provinces under Confederation as it exists today. And you're quite right.

00:55:58.240 Part of the policies that we've developed as Maverick, and as I've already indicated in many

00:56:03.280 areas, we have not yet put together our election platform on some key issues. But one of the ones

00:56:09.040 we have already passed as a board is this idea of energy corridors. You already described two of

00:56:17.120 them, if you look at a map of where Fort McMurray is and our oil sands, it wouldn't be difficult

00:56:26.160 to run a bit North West through the Yukon and tie in with the Alaska pipeline,

00:56:33.040 which is being underutilised now, and to make a deal and export some of our oil through Valdez

00:56:40.800 in Alaska, which has been exporting oil as we know for decades and decades.

00:56:45.360 The other is to run a corridor virtually straight east across Northern Saskatchewan and Manitoba to

00:56:51.040 Churchill and utilize that port. And as you say, make that a world-class port for the export of

00:56:59.440 oil tankers through the Hudson's Bay. And then of course, Keystone, British Columbia out through

00:57:06.480 Prince Rupert or Kitimat through Quebec. This is why, Corey, if people take the time to go to

00:57:15.200 maverickparty.ca and take a look at the five amendments that we've proposed to

00:57:20.240 the Canada's constitution, the first deals with market access, the second deals with provincial

00:57:27.200 rights. And I've been assured that if our second amendment had been in place,

00:57:32.800 The Supreme Court ruling the other day would have been different.

00:57:37.320 There's no way they could have passed that ruling that they did by that six to three vote

00:57:43.160 if our Second Amendment actually to Canada's constitution was in place.

00:57:48.440 So I urge people to take a look at the work that Maverick's been doing

00:57:52.580 in trying to achieve a greater autonomy, greater fairness, greater respect for Western Canada.

00:58:02.800 Okay, so we've talked a little bit about it. You touched on it a couple times. I'm sure you've heard it a thousand times, but you'll hear it thousands more at the doors when an election comes. How do you avoid the vote split? How do we avoid coming in with the best of intentions, but potentially coming out with a worse outcome than we went into the election with to begin with?

00:58:20.920 And Albertans in particular, you know, and there were a number of reasons for it, and that's a whole other show, but we ended up with an NDP government, the unimaginable for four years, due to us conservatives, you know, busy cutting each other's heads off and, you know, crawling over each other to try and win the golden prize there.

00:58:39.380 So how can you answer the people asking those questions?

00:58:43.400 How are you going to comfort them in knowing that they're not going to make things worse by casting a ballot for you?

00:58:48.520 Well, the first is to just completely refute this whole idea of vote splitting in this first

00:58:55.120 election that Maverick's going to contest, Corey. First of all, I'm well aware of the issue of vote

00:59:01.000 splitting. Almost all of the vote splitting that resulted in three back-to-back Chrétien governments,

00:59:06.360 Liberal governments, existed in Central and Eastern Canada, predominantly Ontario. That's

00:59:12.260 where the vote splitting between PC candidates and Reform candidates resulted in a Liberal

00:59:17.180 coming up the middle and getting elected. So, we're not running down there, as I've already

00:59:21.340 said. So, that takes that two-thirds of the ridings in Canada out of the equation completely,

00:59:26.620 because we're not going to contest them. So, Mr. O'Toole can go head-to-head with Mr. Trudeau

00:59:31.080 down there, and we wish him well. Here in the West, we have done the research, and there's more

00:59:37.500 than 40 ridings in Western Canada out of the 104 that there are, where the Conservative incumbents

00:59:44.860 won by such massive majorities that even if you split their support right down the middle,

00:59:50.840 50-50 between a Maverick and a Conservative, you would not elect any other party. It's a physical

00:59:57.440 impossibility, mathematical impossibility that that would happen. So those are the ridings we're

01:00:02.600 going to target. As I said already a couple of times, we're only just a little over six months

01:00:07.500 old. We've just announced three candidates, so we're not going to be a great threat to anybody,

01:00:12.120 but we intend to run in those however many we can get organized in and I urge people that might want

01:00:18.880 to run for Maverick to submit your papers and go through the vetting process to become a Maverick

01:00:24.940 candidate in one of those ridings so there's 40 ridings roughly Corey where we can run and there's

01:00:32.080 no fear of splitting the vote except between a conservative and a Maverick okay no that's good

01:00:37.820 to know to get that to clear it up out there because there are western writings which could

01:00:41.560 be questionable as well of course i mean many in manitoba even one in calgary and and you know a

01:00:47.160 few in edmonton and certainly lord mainland bc has always been a political hornet's nest i mean things

01:00:51.680 could go any direction there i i just feel it'd be important for people to know i'm not casting

01:00:55.940 about to something that's gonna make things worse um what i i do feel in elections too i mean you're

01:01:03.040 hoping to win seats that's gonna be your goal but you can also you're influencing the the person

01:01:07.240 you're running against and they're going to have to take stances to either counter what you're

01:01:10.840 proposing or or potentially lose that support um well a lot of these things a lot of these things

01:01:17.800 are going to be handled differently in this first election whenever it comes if it comes this spring

01:01:21.720 or even this fall because of the infancy of of maverick uh then they would be in future elections

01:01:27.960 and one you already addressed one in the sense that you know is there any possibility of a sitting

01:01:32.840 Member of Parliament, a Conservative, effectively deciding, okay, I want to become a Maverick

01:01:38.920 instead of a Conservative, and has there been any outreach to them? Well, there have been

01:01:42.840 conversations, not by me personally, but by some of the board of Maverick with their incumbent

01:01:48.840 members of Parliament, but I don't foresee that happening, Corey, until we go through one election

01:01:53.800 cycle, prove the credibility of Maverick, prove that we're solid, that we're putting forward a

01:02:01.480 real credible alternative for Western Canadians. Then we might see some of those things. Then we

01:02:07.240 might see, as reform did in subsequent elections, that we will run in all of the Western ridings.

01:02:14.440 And then there will be a greater risk of vote splitting, obviously. But if you look at what

01:02:19.320 happened in 1993, when we elected our first tranche of 53 reform members of Parliament,

01:02:25.880 there wasn't much vote splitting in the West. People had already decided to switch their

01:02:30.680 allegiance, largely from the Progressive Conservatives to reform, and many of us won

01:02:36.120 massively. I won a majority mandate and went on to win a majority mandate in every election after

01:02:41.480 that. So the vote splitting became a non-issue very quickly once people switched their allegiance

01:02:48.600 from the Progressive Conservatives to the reform party. And I suspect that after we go through one

01:02:54.360 electoral cycle, one election, something like that could quite possibly happen with Maverick as well.

01:03:01.280 Yeah, well, and it takes time and it starts small.

01:03:03.780 I remember Deb Gray sitting as that lone member for Beaver River, I believe it was.

01:03:07.680 But that was that first crack in the armor to set up a beachhead and start organizing and rallying around and look what it turned into.

01:03:17.140 Perhaps if this election gets pushed into later fall or even, you know, we don't know.

01:03:21.740 There's another one of those beautiful things with our parliamentary system.

01:03:24.160 uh is there a plan then though for a formal convention for the maverick party to entrench

01:03:31.340 policies and print a leadership perhaps i mean all of those numbers of things that you're kind

01:03:35.200 of lacking i mean this has been a really difficult year to try and kick off a new party i mean

01:03:39.140 typically you'd be hitting the barbecue circuit all summer and you'd be holding town hall meetings

01:03:43.340 and you'd be shaking hands with people and meeting people and yes virtual organization gives a bit of

01:03:48.220 a means for that but it really handicaps the traditional organizational methods absolutely

01:03:53.020 I couldn't agree with you more. We have been under a huge handicap as you suggest, Corey,

01:03:59.260 trying to get this thing off the ground. There's enough challenges facing with the legalities,

01:04:05.580 the rules, regulations that a new party has to follow without also being confronted by this

01:04:11.740 lockdown that basically makes it impossible for folks like myself or the other board members to

01:04:19.260 get out and, as you say, hold everything from small coffee parties up to and including larger

01:04:25.420 rallies to try to get the name out. We've got some of our organised ridings, some of those 18 that I

01:04:31.740 mentioned that are already now out conducting some door knocking, all wearing the proper masks and

01:04:38.620 the whole business, doing it the right way, the right way according to the government at least,

01:04:44.460 And we're finding that 90% of people here, even here in Calgary, don't know about Maverick.

01:04:51.680 They don't even recognize the name or that we're a federal alternative to the traditional

01:04:56.260 party.

01:04:56.880 So we've got a huge hurdle because of being under these restrictions, these COVID restrictions,

01:05:04.220 as you're suggesting.

01:05:06.440 Yeah.

01:05:07.060 So going farther ahead, and as you said, this is a party, not an advocacy group.

01:05:12.000 And those are two different roles, two different things, even if they could share some common goals.

01:05:16.100 But we appear to be leading towards a fall referendum on equalization, which would be, again, it's one of those exercises where we're just kind of exerting our voices.

01:05:26.860 But unless Ottawa actually wants to do something about it, there's not much we can do.

01:05:30.740 But I think it's a great exercise to bring that issue to the head, to bring it to voters, almost a practice run for other referendums if we want to talk about it that way.

01:05:37.740 Would Maverick take a stance in that and be active within such an exercise?

01:05:43.660 Well, it's a bit early to tell.

01:05:45.460 I can tell you that we looked at the recommendation as we did all of the recommendations of the

01:05:50.620 Fair Deal panel that put forward those recommendations to Jason Kenney government here in Alberta.

01:05:59.040 We support the vast majority of them.

01:06:01.220 We're a little different of opinion, and we'll see where Jason and his government goes with the intended referendum on equalization.

01:06:12.960 We originally looked at, Corey, looked at what they're advocating, which is basically removing the clause in Canada's constitution that allows for or that doesn't allow for, I guess it demands the equalization principle.

01:06:31.540 and we decided as a party that we weren't going to go that direction, that the problems we have

01:06:40.360 is with the formula, not with the principle of sharing and we believe that the government,

01:06:49.080 if they follow through with that particular question, the removal of the principle of

01:06:53.380 equalization, they're going to unnecessarily run into problems where people are going to say,

01:06:58.360 well, what's wrong with the principle that provinces that have more wealth share with

01:07:04.880 provinces that don't? You know, I mean, that's the Canadian way that we're generous people that

01:07:10.680 we don't mind sharing. So, it isn't the principle that Maverick feels is at dispute here. It's the

01:07:18.260 formula. Why is it that all of the revenue from our oil and gas as a non-renewable resource

01:07:25.520 is included in the formula in a calculation of wealth.

01:07:30.740 And yet one of the biggest wealth generators for Quebec,

01:07:33.880 their hydroelectricity that they export much of it

01:07:37.420 to the Eastern seaboard of the United States is not included.

01:07:41.880 So I think that's where the problem and where the focus should be,

01:07:45.040 not on the principle of sharing, but on the issue of the formula itself

01:07:50.760 and that it's not right, it's anything but fair,

01:07:53.820 and that has become home in spades here in the last little while. I just want to

01:07:58.260 revert back to an earlier question that you had that I didn't really answer and that is

01:08:05.980 the whole issue of potentially people joining, other members of parliament joining

01:08:15.620 the Maverick Party, Corey. And as I said, I believe that down the road a piece,

01:08:23.300 once we've established our credibility, we could see more and more people that are willing,

01:08:27.500 not just members of parliament, but people from all walks of life that have been successful,

01:08:33.260 that are very guarded about attaching their name and their reputation, like yourself,

01:08:39.100 people like yourself uh you know coming out uh squarely behind maverick party and it'll take

01:08:45.100 some time for us to establish our credentials yeah well you're certainly at a formative point

01:08:51.580 i know it's made it difficult to make a lot of answers i appreciate that i mean you get that

01:08:55.660 that grassroots respect i mean you we can speak broadly about policies and issues but until it

01:09:00.860 can go to a membership to actually choose these things uh then then it's not really fair to commit

01:09:06.620 to something specifically anyways.

01:09:09.560 Well, and, you know, you have to have a certain,

01:09:12.440 and I think people recognize this, Corey,

01:09:15.140 you have to have a certain membership base.

01:09:17.440 You have to have a certain amount of financial resources

01:09:19.980 to hold a, again, it's all about credibility,

01:09:23.580 to hold a credible convention for policy,

01:09:27.540 to elect a permanent board of directors.

01:09:30.860 All of us are just volunteers, as I said earlier,

01:09:33.260 serving in a voluntary capacity.

01:09:35.000 We've all just stepped forward.

01:09:36.200 no one's elected us to anything and myself included as the interim leader so until we can

01:09:41.720 hold a convention hopefully this fall uh in one form or another maybe it'll have to be still

01:09:47.520 a virtual convention like the conservative just held i don't know i mean it's all a big unknown

01:09:54.000 at this point depends on the vaccinations and certainly there's lots of room for criticism

01:09:57.980 in that regard right now just another thing that mr trudeau is completely uh balled up is the

01:10:05.940 rollout of vaccination. Well, first of all, the procurement of them and then the administration

01:10:11.400 of them. So we don't know how the future is going to go, but you're quite right. Our goal would be

01:10:17.980 to have a full-blown convention, policy convention, establish a party constitution, bylaws,

01:10:25.060 all of those things, those mundane, boring, mechanical things that all political parties

01:10:31.220 at some point have to be seized with and then ultimately a leadership race to replace me

01:10:36.340 with a permanent leader. And I would hope that it'll be a very substantial generational change.

01:10:42.340 I'm 68 years of age. As I say, I've served for quite a while in the Parliament of Canada already.

01:10:47.620 I would love to see some young person, male or female, any possible ethnicity,

01:10:53.620 everyone's welcome in the Maverick Party, as some people like that step forward and contest

01:11:00.180 the leadership when the time's right and carry this party forward.

01:11:06.420 Well, that's great. No, we covered a lot of ground there over a good period of time. And

01:11:10.100 you've mentioned it a couple of times and I've seen others, a fellow named Greg Dick was

01:11:13.380 commenting, just saying, how do I get involved? How do I volunteer? And of course, as we know,

01:11:17.460 volunteers are just the core, most important part of a party organization and getting it rolling.

01:11:23.620 So maybe a little more information on where people can keep up with what you're up to

01:11:27.220 would get involved if they choose to. Absolutely. You can buy a membership,

01:11:31.860 you can make a donation, you can volunteer. All three, as you say, Corey, are absolutely at the

01:11:38.420 epicenter of any political movement and party, and that's at www.maverickparty.ca. That's our website.

01:11:48.820 We're also on most social media platforms, predominantly Facebook, but also on Twitter,

01:11:54.180 YouTube. I have a number, I think the last time I counted was like 28 videos that I've shot over

01:12:00.100 the last 8 months since we started this last June, explaining different things about Maverick Party.

01:12:08.500 As I say, one of our guiding principles is we welcome everyone, all walks of life,

01:12:14.340 all age groups, all ethnicities, First Nations, non-Indigenous, everyone is welcome in the Maverick

01:12:22.740 party. All we ask is that if you have a special personal agenda, park it at the door, come on

01:12:30.740 board to try and support our efforts to achieve greater autonomy for Western Canada, greater

01:12:37.760 fairness and respect. Great. Well, thank you very much, Jay. We'll be watching it closely in coming

01:12:43.820 months, and I'm certain we'll be talking again as issues progress and we move towards, well,

01:12:50.240 probably what's another crazy year. Certainly shaping up that way, Corey. Thanks so very much

01:12:55.880 for having me on your program and giving me the opportunity to explain a bit more about

01:13:01.160 Maverick Party. Great. Thanks, Jay. Thanks.

01:13:09.020 Okay. Well, that was, you know, a good discussion at length. I see John Williams has been responding

01:13:15.300 in the uh comment section as well uh as stephanie asked you know can i buy a membership if i'm

01:13:21.580 already a conservative member yes you can with party memberships i mean that's your freedom you

01:13:25.900 can own as many memberships and whatever parties as you like uh that that's been one of the

01:13:29.780 challenges with party organizations and again as a wild rose or a member in the past some people

01:13:33.800 saying we should have a party policy making it illegal for a person to have another membership

01:13:37.780 well how do you find out where do you go down that rabbit hole uh the goal is to get people

01:13:42.820 and bring them in and if they happen to hold a membership somewhere else uh so be it it's where

01:13:47.200 they're going to participate and vote and and you know contribute and do those sorts of things that

01:13:52.080 matter um but jay's certainly got his work cut out for him along with all of the volunteers and

01:13:58.840 it's it's a questionable area there's a lot of question marks still hanging up there you know

01:14:04.060 will votes be irreparably split i mean if they stick to the the writings they had spoken of

01:14:09.980 then then it won't have that impact on it. But then in that case, will it have an impact on the

01:14:13.860 election? A lot depends on what comes in these these these next few months here and what sort

01:14:19.520 of events come along and how they do it. Bridget Frost, it says you just can't sit on multiple

01:14:24.840 party CA boards. Again, actually, well, it depends on what party enforces their own things from

01:14:29.960 within. But I mean, if you're openly on another board for another party, and you know, one of the

01:14:34.160 other parties finds out they're going to say, Hey, you know, what are you doing? Because there's

01:14:36.800 some inside information that can be shared grassroots organizing is something I don't

01:14:42.420 know masochistically I've been involved in since the 90s with reform with the wild rose party it

01:14:50.140 was Alberta alliance prior to that of course the Alberta independence party which I led to a

01:14:54.080 catastrophic loss in 2001 but it's essential it's something we really do in the west and we quite

01:15:01.400 often do it well so i i wouldn't dismiss uh where where the maverick party is going i mean they're

01:15:08.040 you know getting steps and stumbles like any other new movement would have but uh jay is of the old

01:15:14.040 school from under preston manning and as i said you know from the days of when deb gray was that

01:15:18.600 lone member sitting up there in beaver river uh they can turn that into something much bigger and

01:15:24.200 and with this uh frustration that we're seeing already hitting the wall you know and it just

01:15:30.520 just seems no matter what we do, nothing changes. It's refreshing to see another option. And then

01:15:37.000 Jenny saying, Corey, you need to come back. Well, I'm back. I'm here making noise through columns

01:15:41.260 and on this show and in other areas, but I don't belong in politics. I'm way too crabby. I don't

01:15:49.320 work well with committees and it would just be destructive. So, I mean, I'll certainly be

01:15:54.760 involved in politics from a commentary point of view and writing and speaking in many things,

01:15:58.620 But rest assured, I would make a terrible member of parliament or MLA or any of those things because I would be sure to be thrown onto the backbench for misbehavior in short order.

01:16:10.980 So speaking of misbehaving individualist minded folks, I've got Derek Fromm coming on.

01:16:16.980 As I'd said earlier, he's you might have heard him on Daniel Smith's show.

01:16:21.740 he'd worked with uh constitutional issues uh as a lawyer always outspoken on independence issues

01:16:28.120 and personal liberty issues which of course are near and dear to my heart uh glad to have you on

01:16:34.280 derek there's so much to cover and talk about see that magnificent seek justice shirt on you there

01:16:40.340 again that's right with any luck my uh internet uh hurt his internet will be behaving a little

01:16:49.100 better today than it was the other day. So we had a good long talk with Jay there on the Maverick

01:16:57.080 Party and their organization and where they're going for it. So that's one pronged approach to

01:17:01.120 the status quo that we're locked in within Canada. A number of issues came up. Where to go with you

01:17:08.520 is assuming what i think to start with recently in the news um maybe if you turn your phone down

01:17:15.640 just a little bit of feedback uh but i i have to go with headphones if that's helpful

01:17:24.280 perhaps if you could try those it might come in a little better

01:17:27.800 usually the echo cancellation stream yard works pretty well but maybe you're pretty good

01:17:33.400 you're plugged in

01:17:39.320 how's that going a little better

01:17:45.120 now we're still getting it oh wait seems to call that okay great there we go

01:17:51.160 and we can hear from you more clearly so the supreme court of canada ruling on the challenges

01:17:58.280 to the federal carbon tax there's a nice big legal area to dive into and start with

01:18:03.740 what seems to have gotten my backup the most on it was it really sounded like from these judges

01:18:10.880 that they acknowledged that the carbon tax wasn't constitutional it was an infringement on

01:18:17.780 provincial jurisdiction but they decided as justices that this issue was so pressing that

01:18:22.700 we will override and set aside provincial jurisdictions and impose this tax is my

01:18:28.200 interpretation kind of right of what happened there well yeah i i think it fundamentally is

01:18:36.580 as as all court decisions are and judges tend to be lawyers as well it um the language justifying

01:18:45.800 what you just said is much more convoluted and flowery and there is a history to it

01:18:50.980 but essentially at the end of the day, that's, that is what it boils down to is what you just

01:18:56.200 said. Yeah. So, I mean, a constitution, a charter of rights, these are supposed to be things that

01:19:02.360 vary only in the most extreme of circumstances. They're supposed to be to protect us.

01:19:07.660 Would we ever suspend any of those things? You know, section one of the charter gives that,

01:19:11.260 that clause. I can understand the rationale. I mean, an asteroid might hit or something and

01:19:15.220 we need to set aside a few things to get our stuff in order, but the burden of proof really

01:19:20.340 should be on the state to say why we have to you know it seems to be the other way around it's like

01:19:25.940 we're going to take away your rights and now you can try and make your case as to why we were wrong

01:19:30.300 and it seems to be a terrible reverse onus yeah and in this particular case that so we're talking

01:19:36.880 about the decision that came out i think it was last thursday and it's the greenhouse gas pollution

01:19:42.280 and pricing act the federal act we'll just call it carbon tax the federal carbon tax yeah so it

01:19:49.460 It actually, the arguments made, I think, all the way through the various courts that heard these, where this act was referred to by provincial governments, were all based on the Constitution Act 1867.

01:20:06.860 So 1867, that statute doesn't really have any Bill of Rights issues in it.

01:20:14.460 And really, the crux of the entire argument was quite simple.

01:20:19.460 There's two provisions in the Constitution Act 1867, and those provisions basically divide up all legislative matters.

01:20:29.640 So everything from health care, education, the military, banks, et cetera, et cetera, pretty much everything you can think of is divided up, divvied up between the feds and the provinces.

01:20:41.720 And at the end of the day, what happens is the Constitution says anything that isn't specifically addressed in these long lists of areas belonging to either the provinces or the feds goes back by default to the federal government.

01:21:00.860 And this is the residual clause.

01:21:02.320 and so when you read the decision which I suggest people actually pick the decision up and at least

01:21:09.040 read the head note which is a very good summary of you know the 300 pages of judicial writing

01:21:16.400 that follows but in the head note it explains the law quite clearly this residual clause so

01:21:23.460 things that aren't conceived of by the the framers of the constitution in 1867 those things reside

01:21:31.800 those legislative matters reside in the federal government. And so then the courts start talking

01:21:38.140 about national concern and whether or not greenhouse gas is a national concern. And

01:21:44.640 there's quite a thorough analysis. But the problem, in my opinion, is this,

01:21:50.800 is that when the Constitution Act was brought in by the framers in 1867, they considered it,

01:21:58.140 And it's very interesting.

01:21:59.680 John A. Macdonald at the time actually was saying things like, I can't even conceive of a dispute between the provinces and the feds on jurisdictional matters because the Constitution is so clear.

01:22:16.960 And arguably, it's clear at times.

01:22:19.620 But the problem is that, you know, life has gotten more complicated than 1867.

01:22:24.640 But the court has also, this may be controversial to some, but the court has also seemingly written itself new rules over time under the guise of what's called cooperative federalism, which basically says it's really hard for the feds and the provinces to get along.

01:22:44.380 So we'll let them take over, incidentally take over and enact legislation that trenches upon the other government level of government's authority.

01:22:53.540 Now, the Constitution is clear. They're watertight compartments.

01:22:57.400 The word exclusive occurs in the Constitution.

01:23:01.480 These powers belong exclusively to the feds or to the provinces.

01:23:06.400 And so the court in the intervening years, it's relatively a modern phenomena in the court.

01:23:13.160 they've developed this idea of cooperative federalism where they can dispense with the

01:23:18.620 word exclusive and ignore the concept of watertight compartments so that the feds can actually

01:23:24.220 bring in legislation it might only incidentally impact on provincial rights but we'll let it go

01:23:30.900 even though the constitution says that it shouldn't happen and john a mcdonald said it would never

01:23:35.800 happen so this is this is the problem we're at now because this federal carbon tax you know

01:23:41.400 goes into areas that are quite obviously and uncontroversially places where the provinces

01:23:47.760 have exclusive authority to legislate. But carbon tax is important because greenhouse gas transcends

01:23:56.840 borders and provinces working together, that's just not a practical reality. It would never work

01:24:07.440 Because, you know, let's say Alberta plays fair now and a future government might repeal a carbon tax.

01:24:15.160 So we have all the provincial government.

01:24:37.440 are we back was that was i gone oh there we go so yeah i'm having those those prettiest internet

01:24:58.120 things if i do you know vanish there just please by all means keep speaking you're a lawyer you

01:25:02.840 can go on at length. I know that. So more than just a lawyer, by the way, Derek is also, he's a

01:25:09.840 writer. He puts columns in the Western Standard, and this is branching off of a column that Derek

01:25:14.400 had writtenly put into the Western Standard. It is online at thewesternstandardonline.com.

01:25:20.940 We are behind a paywall these days for a number of the articles. It's not a terribly expensive

01:25:26.440 subscription, though. This helps us keep producing content, getting stuff out there without taking

01:25:31.320 government dollars as so many other media outlets are right now and i know it sounds you know people

01:25:36.340 get frustrated with paying to see something but think it wasn't that long ago you would pay 15

01:25:40.320 20 a month without thinking twice for a newspaper uh subscription and and getting it brought to your

01:25:46.060 door well this is 10 a month and it's right on your computer there's some fantastic news from

01:25:50.320 dave naylor uh mike damore is now set up up in bc we're going to be getting some great bc news going

01:25:56.340 and of course columns from Derek so there's my plug and interruption uh to to keep the gears

01:26:02.160 turning with those so we we'll move on and we got so many constitutional things going on one of the

01:26:07.140 things you pointed out was the the can be uh uh situation in health care because here's another

01:26:12.540 area again where we go to the courts provinces are trying to do different things and we seem to

01:26:17.060 hit roadblocks uh can you expand on that yeah so can be can be of course most people will realize

01:26:23.920 is a private surgical facility in british columbia and they have for years operated legally

01:26:31.680 because private health care is not illegal in that province and what they're doing is not illegal

01:26:37.680 and what happened to them was dr brian day the founder of the clinic ended up having to sue

01:26:45.040 the bc government now what led up to that was the nurses union got to be in their bonnet in bc

01:26:52.080 that can be was extra billing and that's a farce that just wasn't happening but the nurses union

01:27:00.940 sued the provincial government in bc saying bc enforce your own legislation against canby and

01:27:08.080 shut them down that's essentially what it was so in order to save his his clinic which the bc

01:27:13.940 government relied quite heavily on and still does for their workplace injury claims and you know

01:27:20.440 issues like that, Dr. Bay was forced to sue the BC government and initiate a constitutional

01:27:26.700 challenge. And I believe this whole journey started for him, I'm going to say 2009. And he

01:27:33.520 finally received a decision at the trial level last October, so October 2020. And essentially

01:27:44.900 what it was is a recapitulation of the Quebec Shawouli decision, but in the context of British

01:27:50.680 Columbia. And the result wasn't, it was an adverse decision for Dr. Day. And so I'm not exactly sure

01:27:58.900 what the plans are at this point. But I hope they have the means to initiate an appeal. Because

01:28:06.060 after looking at the decision, there certainly are grounds for appeal. But it taught me,

01:28:11.020 watching that litigation happen over the years taught me a lot about how governments work and

01:28:16.780 function when they're in litigation. And so this is a very important issue. And it's one that's

01:28:22.940 been decided in the context of Quebec already in the Shuley decision. So I believe 2005 off the top

01:28:28.560 of my head. Went to the Supreme Court. Legislation in Quebec was struck down as restricting Section

01:28:37.380 seven rights, section seven rights in the Charter. So that's life, liberty, security of the person

01:28:42.360 and the right not to be deprived thereof, except according to the principles of fundamental justice.

01:28:46.780 Kind of sad that I know that off by heart. But what ended up happening is a ban on private

01:28:53.560 insurance was struck down in Quebec as a violation of those rights in the Charter.

01:28:58.780 And so there was much this, there is much the same ban in BC. And the argument is essentially

01:29:04.880 the same as shawuli look it's this ban on private insurance in an otherwise open market because

01:29:11.240 health private health care is not illegal in an otherwise open market that prevents people

01:29:16.560 from getting timely health care services delivered and in fact preventing people

01:29:22.400 from getting timely health care not only endangers their life in many cases some of the plaintiffs

01:29:29.120 in Dr. Day's case, in fact, lost their lives during the 10, 15 years of litigation.

01:29:42.840 But the other thing is people suffer irreparable harm. And so one of the plaintiffs actually became

01:29:48.680 paralyzed permanently directly because of having to wait for healthcare that BC just couldn't

01:29:55.820 bothered to get around providing. Now, the reason this happens is because of healthcare rationing.

01:30:03.160 And this is hard for some people to hear when they're not already familiar with the facts.

01:30:08.820 But when government creates a budget on an annual basis, they try to decide how much healthcare

01:30:15.280 will cost them annually. Like any business owner would, government does the same. And you know what?

01:30:20.780 they have the same incentives as a business owner let's keep our costs down let's do everything we

01:30:26.300 can to do this and then you know what we we're budgeting a million dollars for this this year

01:30:30.840 so we're going to decide at the outset that we can only afford you know 30 000 hip replacements

01:30:36.840 i'm making that up 30 000 hip replacements well you know what if there's 35 000 people in bc that

01:30:44.580 need hip replacements 5 000 of them are going to have to wait and they wait and they suffer

01:30:50.460 and they don't get the actual medical care that they are paying for they pay for these services

01:30:57.960 and don't receive them so it's very important to look at it this way what bc is doing in that case

01:31:05.560 and other provinces do much the same thing now the legislation is a little different in every

01:31:11.520 province but what bc is doing is saying you have to get in line unless you can afford to pay out

01:31:19.460 pocket for private care so if you're not able to afford that you have to get in line with everyone

01:31:23.700 else and you don't have a choice and by the way we're not going to give you the health care

01:31:28.660 services that you're in waiting in line for and so you know our socialist friends in the ndp

01:31:36.500 sometimes make a good point let's just put more money into the system let's make 35 000 hip

01:31:42.740 replacements possible well that would help because then people wouldn't be suffering and waiting in

01:31:47.780 line but you know what you can't budget these things and you know the best way for demand

01:31:55.300 and supply to meet at a reasonable place is to allow for private investment and that private

01:32:01.940 investment in bc what dr day was hoping he would be able to do was strike down the legislation much

01:32:07.860 like truly that prohibited private insurance because then a private insurer could sell a

01:32:12.900 product to bc residents and if they were you know number 30 000 and one through 35 000 on that hip

01:32:21.060 replacement list they could rely on their private insurance and get private care and you know what

01:32:27.620 the queue for health care gets shorter it's more efficient people go back to work sooner people

01:32:33.220 suffer less and it doesn't cost the public assent and so he didn't win and that's a very big

01:32:40.740 disappointment and what i learned about the way government conducts itself in litigation is this

01:32:45.300 there is some i think last count i remember hearing there's 80 experts and uh the trial

01:32:52.500 was just winding up when justin trudeau was first elected as uh as prime minister and so

01:33:00.980 here's a good example has nothing to do with the federal government this is bc litigation

01:33:06.740 it's about a bc statute the plaintiff or the sorry the defendant is the bc government it's bc

01:33:13.220 plaintiffs has nothing to do with the federal government but the federal government inserted

01:33:18.340 itself as an intervener and brought two experts to the table one of the two experts was a professor

01:33:26.980 living in belgium who was going to put forward his expert report that health care public publicly

01:33:35.620 funded healthcare that mandates people wait in line for their treatment is so fundamental to the

01:33:43.400 canadian character canadians couldn't possibly imagine this legit or this uh statute being

01:33:49.400 struck down or modified by the courts it's lunacy but what happens then is this sort of expert comes

01:33:56.380 along and all of a sudden dr day and his legal team have to respond to it and so you know what

01:34:03.060 there's more costs. You've got to go find an expert to respond to, of all things, the ludicrous

01:34:07.720 argument from a Belgian professor that healthcare is so fundamental to the Canadian identity that

01:34:13.960 Canadians couldn't sleep at night if things were modified in any way. And so that sort of behavior

01:34:21.140 by the government intervener and by the BC defendant government, you know, played out

01:34:29.860 numerous ways at numerous times throughout the litigation, driving the costs up enormously.

01:34:36.120 And what should have been a relatively straightforward legal argument, coupled with

01:34:41.120 strong evidence from affected parties and some expert testimony showing that BC actually was

01:34:47.360 responsible for delivering health care and failed to do so in a timely way, it should have been

01:34:52.760 relatively straightforward and it should not have taken the years that it did. And I can't remember

01:34:57.940 offhand but it was something like 200 hours of trial time which is unbelievable and many many

01:35:06.640 many lawyers 80 experts which all have to be you know paid for their services and uh and so that

01:35:14.200 i mean that's just in my opinion dirty pool and that's really governments working against the

01:35:20.440 interests of the citizens for what for having their health care issues solved in a timely way

01:35:27.320 having individuals not suffer, not risk their life, liberty, and security of the person.

01:35:34.260 Basically, individuals asking the courts to vindicate their constitutional rights against

01:35:38.720 the government who is refusing to give them what they've been promised. And that's very troubling

01:35:44.980 to me. But it's a metaphor for so much that we see. In some ways, I think the carbon tax decision

01:35:50.900 is much the same thing because we have a court very willing to run roughshod over the clear

01:35:58.240 language of the constitution. And, you know, when you have 40 years of court decisions that are

01:36:03.940 subtly moving the goalposts, suddenly you find yourself in a very different location

01:36:08.920 than you originally anticipated. I used to like to give the analogy that

01:36:13.400 if you were in a big sailing vessel, let's say like the one who that was recently stuck in the

01:36:19.680 Suez Canal. If you were trying to chart a course from Halifax and sail directly to Dakar, okay,

01:36:27.840 on north coast of Africa, I believe. And, you know, like, oh, it's over that direction. Let's

01:36:33.600 chart our course. But let's say you're just out by a degree or two. Well, that degree, you know,

01:36:39.680 every mile that you travel, every nautical mile you travel, that degree of error compounds. And

01:36:46.880 And so by the time you arrive at what should be your destination, you find yourself in a very

01:36:51.900 different place than where you intended to go. And that's what court decisions on issues like

01:36:58.160 the carbon tax, issues like can be surgical clinics. That's the problem we face. And that's

01:37:04.120 the problem that I think not only conservatives, but liberty loving Canadians, free market Canadians

01:37:10.820 face, because there's an incremental change every time a court has a decision on something like this.

01:37:16.880 It is a ratchet. And like ratchets, ratchets are intended to go one direction only.

01:37:24.740 And so these court decisions have the effect of ratcheting things in one direction. And I think

01:37:30.060 Canada has been made poorer off by these sorts of things over time.

01:37:35.780 Yeah. And that's why I wanted to, you know, they seemingly almost unrelated, but they aren't

01:37:39.960 in that general theme of things. I mean, the courts should be actually standing up for the

01:37:44.660 rights of the individual is paramount and going under that presumption and asking others to

01:37:49.320 justify why they would intervene on the and infringe on the rights of the individual it's

01:37:54.020 going the other way around the government's infringing on the right and then you have to

01:37:57.920 plead to the courts to explain why your right should be respected and and they're losing it

01:38:03.020 the courts and i mean the costs of canada's health system our issue is the waiting list that's always

01:38:08.920 the issue that's what happens socialized medicine as you said is rationed medicine

01:38:13.560 we're seeing that with the impacts of the pandemic. It's interesting on how much stuff

01:38:18.680 comes together, because one of the things that they've been saying is the reason the hospitals

01:38:22.200 are becoming overwhelmed or at risk of it anyways, is because we jam everything into our hospital,

01:38:27.080 these giant public facilities, because it's the most efficient way when you have a single

01:38:32.120 provider, you might as well have it all in one building. But if you diversify your health

01:38:36.120 provision, you could have a number of clinics, specialty hospitals, places distributed all over

01:38:41.000 the place that you wouldn't have to close because you could segregate the hospital for infectious

01:38:46.520 cases but you could still have that knee replacement clinic or that cambry doing hernia procedures or i

01:38:51.960 think it was quebec that was doing the hernia ones that uh they had to go through their challenge

01:38:55.400 but instead we've got the centralized system again which is rigid inflexible can't respond

01:39:00.600 to pandemics like this and and they as you said the only solution to any of these issues is just

01:39:04.840 for the government to throw more money at them yeah yeah and that's that's really a sad state

01:39:09.480 and i think you're right like you you say that um that when when someone wants to challenge the

01:39:15.160 government on some of these some of these issues that it's like the onus has been shifted to the

01:39:20.520 individual to disprove what the government's position is and that's not the way certainly

01:39:26.200 in charter litigation so the charter is different than what what the greenhouse gas uh case was the

01:39:32.280 carbon tax case that was not a charter case but the charter is different than that but in

01:39:38.200 in reality, in a practical sense, it doesn't end up far from that very often. So one of my

01:39:46.300 favorite provisions in the charter, well, there's two that I think are quite wonderful tools for

01:39:52.260 freedom-loving individuals. And that's section two, which has all the traditional English

01:39:57.540 immunities like freedom of the press, freedom of religion, freedom of association, those sorts of

01:40:02.400 things. They're listed there. And then section seven, when you get into legal rights, which is

01:40:06.640 life liberty security the person now the way that constitutional law works is that tests

01:40:11.920 are developed by the courts to decide when an issue actually rises to the level of severity

01:40:19.280 to warrant state and or the court's intervention so if you read a court decision on on freedom of

01:40:28.240 expression the court will have developed a test like a three-point test or something like that

01:40:32.880 i can't remember it off the top of my head um for when someone's freedom of expression has been

01:40:39.440 violated and then they'll go through the test it's a it's a little bit of a

01:40:43.840 a shell game in some ways because it all depends on how you define things but

01:40:47.600 there's case law and how things should be defined so it's not completely arbitrary

01:40:52.400 but then if the court says well actually your freedom of expression was infringed you met the

01:40:57.120 test then it flips to section one of the charter which everyone's heard about recently because of

01:41:02.560 covid section one now section one is where the government is supposed to say okay we violated

01:41:10.160 your rights but we had a really good reason it it was necessary for us to do this and uh that's

01:41:17.680 that's where the onus is supposed to shift to the government and in the end i would say the

01:41:23.680 practical effect of that is well legally it does like it's a fact the government has to is does

01:41:30.720 have to prove its case at that point but the other side of it is when you look at you know hate to

01:41:35.920 sound like a marxist here but there is a sort of intimidating factor for lawyers and for plaintiffs

01:41:42.800 who are challenging the government when they look across the court and uh they see well this happened

01:41:48.720 to me once in ontario at the ontario court of appeal looked across the court and there was me

01:41:53.200 by myself against four government lawyers you're really up against a machine there is hate to say

01:42:03.940 it but a sort of power disparity between the two sides it's the individual fighting against the

01:42:09.280 state it's a david and goliath sort of moment and that's problematic too because although the law

01:42:16.860 very clearly states and the courts do function this way too that the onus shifts to the government

01:42:21.520 it becomes very difficult for a plaintiff to afford to interact with the government at that

01:42:29.740 level and explain why it is that the government's infringement of rights are not justified the

01:42:37.860 government has nearly infinite resources there's many experts who are very very qualified in the

01:42:45.740 government working for in the ag's offices they know what they're doing they're sophisticated

01:42:50.800 people and you run up against a lawyer who you know might work at a big downtown firm in Toronto

01:42:57.060 or Calgary but for the most part they're dealing with clients and they're not up on constitutional

01:43:01.540 issues and at the end of the day I mean they're running a business they're not looking at the

01:43:06.220 policy impacts of these things very often and it's very very difficult to prove the government wrong

01:43:14.280 and the other side is the the courts have really stacked the deck in favor of the government

01:43:20.380 winning at that stage. I have an ongoing beef with some of my conservative friends

01:43:26.460 about Section 1 and their view of parliamentary sovereignty. And it seems like many conservatives

01:43:35.420 have this idea of parliamentary sovereignty that I think is completely unsustainable

01:43:39.660 and antithetical to freedom. And that's meaning this, that parliament under the Westminster

01:43:48.220 system should be able to do whatever it wants. It's parliamentary sovereignty. We can't have

01:43:52.260 the courts interfering with what Parliament really wants to do. And there's no real historical

01:43:58.580 basis for this, by the way. If you look back, I'm kind of a pathetic person. I'm very concerned 0.97

01:44:05.280 about the history of this sort of sovereignty idea. And this history, this is a very modern

01:44:11.040 creation, the idea that Parliament can do what it wants and that it's unbound. Prior to Thomas

01:44:16.760 Hobbes and Jean Baudin, who are early Enlightenment philosophers, this idea didn't exist. And it was

01:44:23.500 the concept of a sovereign was that a sovereign was able to act in what seems to be an arbitrary

01:44:30.100 matter, and he was unencumbered. But back in those days, in the medieval period and leading up to the

01:44:36.940 modern era, sovereigns were actually bound, what they thought, by the authority of God. And so a

01:44:43.840 king was not truly able to do whatever he wanted his people would come around him and say look

01:44:49.960 what you're doing is an offense to god you can't do this and a king would conceivably listen or he

01:44:55.680 would be a bad king this idea of parliament being able to do whatever it wants is a wholly modern

01:45:03.320 creation that has not does not have a long history and i think is antithetical to the notion of

01:45:10.040 individual liberty and freedom and so what then happens is our courts when our courts get to the

01:45:18.660 section one they often often employ this phrase called a margin of appreciation and it's at the

01:45:26.780 same time the short court sewing uh showing some humility but it's also writing incidentally

01:45:33.280 writing, you know, a writ of do whatever you want to the government. This margin of appreciation

01:45:40.580 is the court saying, look, we're just a court. We didn't have two years to debate this like

01:45:46.820 Parliament did. There weren't public consultations with people brought in and experts consulted and

01:45:53.000 individual parties who were affected consulted. Parliament does a lot of work that a court is not

01:45:59.020 equipped to do. So in the lack of good evidence that Parliament should be able to do this,

01:46:06.320 we don't have good evidence one way or the other, so we're just going to let them do it.

01:46:11.380 To me, that's deeply problematic because that sounds to me like a court abdicating its role.

01:46:20.000 That's not judicial activism. That's something different. That's a court that abdicates its

01:46:26.380 responsibility to hold the government to account and you know there's other people that will say

01:46:33.260 well you know judicial review is a modern thing but i again i i wouldn't say that that's the case

01:46:39.740 there's a long history of laws not being enforced of laws being found um to be contrary to morality

01:46:49.560 and i mean the power of disallowance that the government has for it or that the queen has for

01:46:53.980 instance is a good example of that so i think the problem is there's some systemic problems where

01:47:00.860 the government has given much too easy a task to establish its case under section one

01:47:07.880 and the courts often and maybe rightly so maybe it's humility that's being shown

01:47:13.700 recognizing that they are ill-equipped to deal with these issues but the net result in the end

01:47:19.180 is that the government gets to do what it wants. And I think COVID is a great example of that.

01:47:25.320 Yeah, well, and getting on to a very critical historical right, which is free religion,

01:47:30.760 and we're seeing a pretty contemporary example going on right now. I mean, there's a reason it

01:47:35.240 was entrenched in the charter. There's a reason, I mean, historically around the world, you know,

01:47:40.180 oppression of religious groups, minorities, so on, has been some of the most horrific human actions

01:47:44.700 in history, which is why the framers of constitutions charters try typically in good

01:47:51.640 nations to protect these things. So Pastor Coates has been trying to, James Coates has been trying

01:47:57.200 to exercise that and holding services. He was spent a month in jail. He got released with a

01:48:03.240 $1,500 fine recently, but chided very heavily by the justice who sounds like he wanted to keep him

01:48:08.660 in uh former premier rachel notley went on a rampage uh because uh coats had held a service

01:48:15.400 yesterday and demanded that the government intervene and lock him up again um it's it's a

01:48:21.940 dicey area though it is uh difficult and uh now they're in a rock and a hard place but the fact

01:48:28.960 that they dropped most of the charges and backed off i'm getting a feeling that maybe they feel

01:48:32.900 is this a matter of the court of public opinion or did the government think they wouldn't be able

01:48:36.560 win if they went to an extended court challenge with this with pastor courts coats i should say

01:48:43.040 it's a good question i mean there's a lot there uh and it probably is relevant to to like the

01:48:48.880 restaurants and other such businesses that were given tickets under the public health orders here

01:48:54.000 in alberta um from my understanding is that there's probably not a lot of political will in edmonton

01:49:02.400 to see these people find or go to trial and my guess is that most of the fines will result in

01:49:13.680 not guilty pleas so when you get your fine plead not guilty send it provincial court

01:49:18.640 you'll get a court date scheduled a year and a half from now and between now and then this issue

01:49:25.120 will have gone away i hope and there'll be no political will in edmonton to see those carried

01:49:32.320 through and the charges will all be dropped but now coats is a different situation um i understand

01:49:38.640 that this is a confusing situation to people who don't understand either the religious mind

01:49:45.360 or who don't understand the actual risks of covid and rachel notley i believe does understand the

01:49:54.880 risks but she's playing a game because she knows her base well enough to know that her base one

01:50:02.080 they're not religious people they don't care they're likely big fans of the um irreligious

01:50:09.520 left and so she can take pot shots at religious people like coats as she chooses

01:50:18.700 and uh her her base won't care so it's a it's i think for her it's a political calculation 0.95

01:50:26.320 where she can stick a knife and grind it in Kenny's back because at the same time Jason

01:50:31.880 Kenny's in a tough political situation because I think he also knows better he can read the data

01:50:38.180 and he's making a political calculation to keep the restrictions in place as they are

01:50:43.460 and so I don't know what polling he has but looking at the data that's currently coming out

01:50:50.660 it seems puzzling to me but and this is a little aside so i grew up in a town of about 2 000 people

01:50:56.680 and so the other day i thought to myself well how big is covid in alberta currently

01:51:03.620 in in a scale that i could understand when i grew where i grew up and so 4.4 million people

01:51:11.200 i think we have less than 300 in the hospital so that roughly works out i think if i remember

01:51:16.620 correctly, to about 0.12 people in the town where I grew up. So less than one person,

01:51:25.520 significantly less than one person. This is the scale of the pandemic as we currently have it.

01:51:32.480 And I think, you know, even though there's talks of variants and other such things now,

01:51:38.580 and they're doing their best to work us up into a lather about it, but we can look across to

01:51:44.840 England, where the variant that's most dominant here is from, and it doesn't seem like it's had

01:51:50.180 all that much of an impact on the English population. So unless I hear why Albertans are

01:51:56.100 more inherently susceptible to this variant than people living in the UK are,

01:52:03.420 I'm not sure I should be all that scared about it. Jason Kenney knows these things. He's being

01:52:08.240 advised on these things and so it's a political calculation on his part but the other side of it

01:52:14.940 is he knows better he uh i mean i don't know personally but i i believe he's a religious

01:52:21.380 person i you know he talks about going to church and i've heard through mutual friends that he

01:52:29.260 once considered entering the priesthood if the political game didn't work out for him i mean this

01:52:34.240 is not an unbeliever. This is not Rachel Notley. And so I'm a little disappointed, but I think

01:52:43.040 what he's really hoping here is that it just all goes away and that he does nothing and people

01:52:48.500 forget. And I think that's a poor strategy. I think he needs to actually maybe take a stand

01:52:57.280 on this issue, but it is tough. Now, what James Coates has done, I think has been, you know, a

01:53:04.160 wonderful beacon on the hill, as it were, to Albertans. This is exactly what people like him

01:53:13.060 strive to do with their lives, to be positive examples. And before everyone gets all upset

01:53:18.560 about me casting him as a positive example, you need to do your homework and read or listen to

01:53:25.560 what he has written and said about this issue. His church did comply with the COVID regulations

01:53:31.560 until they became very convinced by reading the data, which we all are capable of, and your

01:53:39.340 responsibility is, as a good citizen of Alberta, to inform yourself about these things. He became

01:53:46.240 convinced that the risks are far overblown. And then they started monitoring their own congregation

01:53:52.200 and realized we have no evidence of any transmission happening here.

01:53:58.460 They're not harming people, is basically what he said.

01:54:01.240 So why would we give up something so important to us

01:54:06.520 for what essentially, in their case, is not based in reality?

01:54:14.880 And what's happened, too, is the religious mind is different.

01:54:19.480 And statists hate this.

01:54:22.200 Because people who are religious, much like the sovereigns of the medieval period,

01:54:30.300 statists think, we are a sovereign in this territory.

01:54:35.260 The state can do what it wants.

01:54:37.240 There's no authority above us.

01:54:39.160 James Coates disagrees.

01:54:40.500 He has an older view, a more historical view of the authority of the state,

01:54:45.360 where he says the state is responsible to God.

01:54:48.400 In fact, this is the same sort of view that MLK had, Martin Luther King had, when he very famously

01:54:53.720 said that it was a moral obligation to disobey bad laws. It's that the state is responsible to

01:55:01.700 God. And when the state gives you a rule that is contrary to what the rule of God is,

01:55:10.620 then it is the obligation of the citizen to disobey that rule.

01:55:14.120 you know what status like rachel notley can't abide that they have to crush that ideologically 0.99

01:55:21.400 that is that is kryptonite to rachel notley because suddenly she can't be the arbitrary 1.00

01:55:28.800 authority that you know controls the market controls what's good and bad in alberta 0.97

01:55:35.180 suddenly there's someone outside of her power that she has no sway over and socialists cannot

01:55:42.380 abide that and so that's why james coates is a pariah amongst that crowd and a hero amongst the

01:55:49.820 the liberty loving and conservative right because the conservative right and the liberty lovers

01:55:55.820 generally have a theory of law that says laws have a moral stance in them and when there is

01:56:03.900 a moral law in place it is the obligation of the individual to disobey it so coates has been a

01:56:09.660 wonderful example i think of someone who educated himself in his leading but is also importantly

01:56:16.780 willing to bear the consequences of his own actions which he has obviously done yeah and

01:56:23.580 and from that liberty loving perspective i mean i i am very much not a religious man

01:56:28.460 uh and if i were to go religious family tradition wise it wouldn't be christian i would go towards

01:56:33.660 probably. But I respect the free religion. I respect the right and ability of others to

01:56:39.940 practice it. And in having explained when you think of, I don't have that mindset, but I can

01:56:44.720 understand the mindset where people see a higher authority than government. I see a higher authority

01:56:50.740 of government too. It's me. They're looking at it as God. But either way, I won't abide by laws and

01:56:58.220 rules, I feel the government doesn't have the authority to impose upon me. And Coates did do

01:57:03.520 it fantastically. He did it peacefully. As you said, he did it thoughtfully. He wasn't going out

01:57:07.760 belligerently and trying to harm people or anything of the sort. It was a controlled move on his part,

01:57:13.140 which I'm sure is part of why it did scare the statists as much as it did. And I just think it

01:57:18.660 was a magnificent example that we can push back as citizens and we can make the government back

01:57:24.620 down i mean as you can see not lee is just doing cartwheels over the fact that that coach is is

01:57:30.240 still actually free to move about society uh you know rather than remaining imprisoned as he was

01:57:36.680 for a month so i hope he carries it on and that segues into kind of closing up for today

01:57:41.120 daniel smith is going to be speaking to pastor coach tomorrow night at six o'clock live and one

01:57:46.540 of her specials and i'm sure it'll be fantastic so he can explain for himself i mean assuming

01:57:50.440 Rachel doesn't manage to get him arrested before then. And, you know, and it should be very

01:57:57.380 informative and it's really something to look forward to. And again, from you, Derek, thank you

01:58:01.600 very much. I mean, there's just so much to unpack. There was a number of things I had written down,

01:58:04.840 we didn't get to them all. We'll have to do this again. I really wanted to get into the

01:58:08.200 Berington Declaration, but there's just, yeah, I know. The sheer incompetence of our public health

01:58:15.160 officials is yes so uh but there's just only so many hours in the morning so and uh i appreciate

01:58:22.160 you taking that time because i know you do have a busy practice as well and uh it was great and

01:58:27.660 informative where can people find uh more of your utterances and rantings aside from uh your legal

01:58:33.360 It'll work.

01:58:34.360 Well,

01:58:35.360 You can follow me on Twitter, but you might get a lot of stuff you don't care about.

01:58:39.460 Some of the music I listen to.

01:58:41.540 The other thing is, Western Standard is a great place.

01:58:44.420 I've decided that I'd like to do a lot of stuff regularly.

01:58:49.200 It used to be that I would try to write in the National College.

01:58:53.300 And I think the days I'm being concerned about that are gone,

01:58:59.700 and I'd like to see Western Standard go up.

01:59:01.880 And so that's where I'm looking for my record. 0.93

01:59:05.360 okay great i'm having a sound issue sounds like it's probably on uh my end with that darn internet

01:59:14.500 again that we tested yesterday and as somebody else pointed out y'all please have derek on again

01:59:18.720 to discuss the barrington declaration so you know i'll be nagging you to try and get you on for a

01:59:22.580 future show so thank you very much and thank you all of you have listened in the last two hours

01:59:27.600 this show is really starting to take off well i'm getting better at it and figuring out how to ask

01:59:32.060 these people the decent questions for the most part and get my ranting out of my system so my

01:59:36.180 poor wife jane doesn't have to listen to it all the time i'll be back again on friday uh for the

01:59:41.600 cory morgan show 10 till noon i'll have marcel latouche and another guest on at that time we'll

01:59:46.440 probably be doing the pipeline on wednesday uh and uh yeah we're expanding our digital presence

01:59:51.960 and reaching out there so consider subscribing thank you all very much and i will see you on

01:59:57.460 the next show thanks again derek thank you bye

02:00:02.060 Thank you.

Western Standard - March 29, 2021

The Cory Morgan Show. March 29, 2021

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