Western Standard - WATCH LIVE： 2026 Alberta referendum night results

00:00:00.000 Thank you.

00:00:30.000 Thank you.

00:01:00.000 Thank you.

00:01:30.000 Thank you.

00:02:00.000 Thank you.

00:02:30.000 Thank you.

00:03:00.000 Thank you.

00:03:30.000 Thank you.

00:04:00.000 Thank you.

00:04:30.000 Thank you.

00:05:00.000 Thank you.

00:05:30.000 Thank you.

00:06:00.000 Thank you.

00:06:30.000 Thank you.

00:07:00.000 Thank you.

00:07:30.000 Thank you.

00:08:00.000 Thank you.

00:08:30.000 Thank you.

00:09:00.000 Thank you.

00:09:30.000 Thank you.

00:10:00.000 Thank you.

00:10:30.000 Thank you.

00:11:00.000 Thank you.

00:11:30.000 Thank you.

00:12:00.000 Thank you.

00:12:30.000 Thank you.

00:13:00.000 Thank you.

00:13:30.000 Thank you.

00:14:00.000 Thank you.

00:14:30.000 Thank you.

00:15:00.000 Thank you.

00:15:30.000 Thank you.

00:16:00.000 Thank you.

00:16:30.000 good evening everybody i'm josh andrus and welcome to the western standards live coverage of the

00:16:52.460 2026 Alberta referendums. Here we are, October the 19th, 2026. For the first time in Alberta's

00:17:00.920 121-year history as a province, Albertans are going to the polls to answer a question that

00:17:06.500 could set us on a path towards independence. We've survived two world wars, the Great Depression,

00:17:12.580 the National Energy Program, constitutional battles, economic booms and busts, and more

00:17:18.320 fights with ottawa than i could possibly count yet today albertans are being asked whether we

00:17:24.160 should remain a province of canada or begin the constitutional process towards a binding referendum

00:17:30.080 on independence today's vote is not a unilateral declaration of independence we're not waking up

00:17:36.800 tomorrow morning in a brand new country but make no mistake this is an extraordinary moment in

00:17:42.880 Alberta's political history here's what we know so far while most polling locations scheduled

00:17:49.440 closing for 8 o'clock p.m delayed openings forced elections Alberta to extend hours at a multiple

00:17:55.680 polling stations the latest extension keeps in station in Edmonton open until 10 o'clock p.m

00:18:02.240 by law no unofficial results can be released anywhere until every single polling location in

00:18:08.800 the province is officially closed for standard locations that did not begin

00:18:13.720 that did not experience delays counting begins right after they close at 8

00:18:18.340 o'clock for the 106 stations that experienced late openings or and had

00:18:23.260 their hours extended their local counts will not begin until their doors lock

00:18:27.700 at their new designated closing times up to 10 o'clock p.m. mountain time the

00:18:33.120 hand counting of alberta's 1.35 million advance and mail-in ballots actually

00:18:38.560 began earlier at 5 o'clock. The ballots for question 10, which asks whether Alberta should

00:18:44.340 remain in Canada or initiate the constitutional process for a binding referendum on independence,

00:18:50.160 will be counted first. The final tally is expected between 1 o'clock a.m. and 4 o'clock a.m.

00:18:56.640 The remaining nine questions regarding immigration in the Constitution will be hand-counted

00:19:01.200 sequentially in numerical order. Unofficial tallies for these are expected to be completed

00:19:06.780 and published by Wednesday. Whatever happens when the ballots are counted, we need to have

00:19:13.240 a serious conversation about how we got here. It starts with the grievances, which have been

00:19:19.500 almost completely lost in this debate. The actual reasons we're having this referendum in the first

00:19:25.420 place. Regardless of what happens tonight, Alberta is going to wake up tomorrow with essentially the

00:19:31.060 same problems it had today. The same constitutional disputes, the same questions about provincial

00:19:37.620 jurisdiction, the same economic vulnerabilities, and the same fundamental disagreements about

00:19:44.500 how this country is supposed to function. We spent months arguing about whether independence

00:19:50.000 is a good idea. We've heard about the risks, the uncertainty, the economic consequences,

00:19:55.140 the difficulties of negotiating independence. There are questions about currency, trade,

00:19:59.840 borders, pensions, treaty obligations, indigenous rights, and a thousand other things that would

00:20:03.780 need to be addressed. Nobody should pretend otherwise. But here's what I find so frustrating

00:20:08.900 about this entire debate. We've spent an extraordinary amount of time talking about

00:20:14.100 the consequences of leaving Canada and comparatively little time talking about the consequences

00:20:19.840 of things staying exactly as they are. Because the status quo isn't without consequences

00:20:24.700 either. There are economic consequences when investment decisions are complicated by

00:20:29.360 uncertainty over federal regulation. There are consequences when major infrastructure projects

00:20:34.580 become political battlegrounds. There are consequences when governments spend years

00:20:39.100 fighting over which level of government has the constitutional authority to make a decision.

00:20:43.760 And there are consequences when an entire region begins to lose confidence in the political

00:20:48.560 institutions that are supposed to represent it. These are not abstract questions. They

00:20:53.500 affect investment, jobs, and economic growth. They affect the ability of people in this province to

00:20:59.320 plan for their future now let's talk about how we got here alberta entered confederation in 1905

00:21:06.060 and unlike the original provinces alberta wasn't even given control of its own crown lands and

00:21:11.040 natural resources and unlike the original provinces oh that's a duplication sorry it

00:21:17.760 took another 25 years until 1930 before alberta finally obtained control over its natural resources

00:21:23.440 and that wasn't the end of the story far from it we had the national energy program in 1980

00:21:28.900 we had decades of disputes over energy policy, federal regulation,

00:21:32.880 and the ability to develop and transport our resources.

00:21:35.940 We've had repeated arguments over equalization

00:21:38.460 and the fiscal relationship between Alberta and the rest of Canada.

00:21:42.020 We've had disagreements about representation in federal institutions.

00:21:46.160 And we've had continuing constitutional battles

00:21:48.700 over just how far Ottawa's authority extends into areas of provincial jurisdiction.

00:21:54.480 Remember the Impact Assessment Act?

00:21:56.880 The legislation that Alberta fought all the way to the Supreme Court of Canada?

00:22:01.320 In 1923, the Supreme Court found that the federal impact assessment scheme was largely unconstitutional.

00:22:08.280 Alberta had been arguing that Ottawa was exceeding its jurisdiction.

00:22:13.800 And on substantial portions of that legislation, the court agreed.

00:22:17.600 Now, regardless of where you stand politically, I think that's an extraordinary example of exactly the kind of problem we're talking about.

00:22:26.160 A provincial government had to take the federal government all the way to the Supreme Court to establish limits on federal authority.

00:22:34.680 The constitutional division of powers is not some obscure technicality that only lawyers should care about.

00:22:41.280 It's fundamental to the Confederation.

00:22:44.580 Sections 91 and 92 of the Constitution Act, 1867, established the legislative responsibilities of Parliament and the provinces.

00:22:53.560 Section 92A explicitly recognizes provincial powers over natural resources.

00:22:58.660 These provisions exist for a reason.

00:23:00.840 Canada was not designed to be a unitary state governed exclusively from Ottawa.

00:23:05.060 It was designed as a country in which different orders of government

00:23:08.240 possess constitutionally protected areas of authority.

00:23:12.200 Surely any conversation about preserving confederation must begin

00:23:15.540 with whether its constitutional structure is being respected.

00:23:19.200 because national unity cannot simply mean that Ottawa gets its way.

00:23:24.140 Cooperative federalism cannot mean that provinces are expected to cooperate

00:23:27.740 while the federal government dictates the terms.

00:23:31.780 And respect for the Constitution cannot be something we invoke only

00:23:35.040 when it happens to support the position we already hold.

00:23:38.620 Now, I recognize that federalism involves overlapping responsibilities.

00:23:43.240 Environmental protection, for example, engages both federal and provincial powers.

00:23:47.720 And not every disagreement with Ottawa is a constitutional violation.

00:23:52.860 Now let me make another point.

00:23:54.940 Ottawa's grievances to Alberta's, Ottawa's responses to Alberta's grievances have been inadequate.

00:24:01.320 It's almost as if we are expected to forget about decades of abuse based on six months of revisionist history.

00:24:07.260 A memorandum of understanding, a few announcements about future cooperation, another commitment to discuss something at a later date.

00:24:14.260 Those things may have value, but Albertans are entitled to ask what actually changes.

00:24:20.260 What authority does the province gain? What economic obstacles are removed?

00:24:26.260 What guarantees exist that an agreement reached with one federal government won't simply be reversed by the next?

00:24:32.260 And most importantly, what is the long-term solution?

00:24:36.260 Because this is where history becomes important.

00:24:39.260 We've been arguing about the distribution of power within Confederation for more than 120 years.

00:24:45.080 We've had royal commissions, constitutional negotiations, first ministers' conferences, court challenges,

00:24:50.780 political movements built around Western alienation.

00:24:54.160 We've had governments elected on promises to stand up for Alberta.

00:24:58.460 Some of those efforts have produced meaningful changes.

00:25:01.560 Others have failed.

00:25:02.700 But the underlying arguments have persisted across generations.

00:25:05.860 And I think Albertans have every right to ask why.

00:25:09.260 why do we keep returning to these same disputes why does the relationship between alberta and

00:25:15.240 ottawa so frequently become a struggle over jurisdiction and control and what would it

00:25:19.460 actually take to resolve these disagreements on a lasting basis because this is the question that

00:25:25.580 i think people should be thinking about let's talk about what happens if alberta actually does vote

00:25:31.880 to begin the process towards independence i know what the polls say factoring out undecided voters

00:25:37.900 Research Co. has the Remain side pulling out a 77-23 win.

00:25:42.800 Leger is at 78-22, Polaris 76-24,

00:25:47.220 Ipso 75-25, and Abacus 74-26.

00:25:51.960 Meanwhile, Main Street Research and Angus Reid

00:25:54.760 have it a bit closer at 66-34.

00:25:58.400 There's a 12-point spread between the highest and lowest figures

00:26:01.440 for the Remain side.

00:26:03.080 That's the kind of spread that makes you wonder,

00:26:05.380 are they all wrong?

00:26:06.180 If Albertans vote to pursue independence tonight, something fundamental will have changed.

00:26:12.960 For the first time, the possibility of Alberta leaving Canada will have received a direct democratic endorsement from the people of this province.

00:26:21.200 Granted, this is a non-binding referendum beginning a process that could lead to a future binding vote.

00:26:29.220 There are questions about how a potential transition might work.

00:26:32.380 They do not diminish the political significance of the result.

00:26:36.180 Suddenly, a debate that has existed on the margins of Alberta politics for decades would have moved into an entirely different area.

00:26:43.800 That's worth considering.

00:26:45.780 What would this mean for Alberta's relationship with Ottawa?

00:26:49.020 What would it mean for the future of the United Conservative Party?

00:26:51.880 What would it mean for a conservative movement that has spent so much time arguing about whether independent supporters even have a place within it?

00:27:00.900 Danielle Smith would find herself in a particularly interesting position.

00:27:05.480 She's repeatedly described her vision as a sovereign Alberta within a united Canada.

00:27:10.120 A vote to pursue independence would raise a very straightforward question.

00:27:14.800 How does a premier who believes in remaining in Canada respond when the electorate expresses an interest in exploring a different constitutional future?

00:27:23.480 Does she begin establishing a formal process?

00:27:26.480 Does she seek a new mandate from the legislature?

00:27:30.280 Does she invite the federal government to put forward its own proposals for reform?

00:27:34.840 Those would be options. Those choices would help determine the direction of Alberta politics for years to come.

00:27:41.840 Here's something else. A successful independence proposal would not necessarily mean that every person who voted for it had abandoned the possibility of a better relationship with Canada.

00:27:51.840 Some might be committed supporters of independence, sure. Others might see the process as a way to force a more serious examination of the status quo,

00:27:59.840 giving the province serious leverage in an upcoming constitutional fight.

00:28:04.820 Others might simply believe that Albertans deserve a greater say of the political future.

00:28:10.060 Those motivations matter.

00:28:12.720 No referendum can tell us anything about why the people voted the way they did.

00:28:17.000 What powers should Alberta exercise?

00:28:19.560 How should its economy be governed?

00:28:22.280 What fiscal arrangements would best serve its residents?

00:28:25.860 How should democratic institutions be structured?

00:28:28.640 And what should the relationship be between Alberta and the rest of Canada?

00:28:36.500 There would be difficult questions, certainly, but difficult questions aren't necessarily reasons to avoid a political conversation.

00:28:44.360 For much of our history, as I've said, the argument has been about how Alberta fits into an existing constitutional arrangement.

00:28:51.800 A process of this kind would invite a wider conversation about what arrangements Albertans actually want.

00:28:58.640 It doesn't predetermine the outcome.

00:29:01.260 Canadian constitutional law makes it clear that a province cannot secede unilaterally,

00:29:06.120 and that a clear vote for secession on a clear question would create a duty to negotiate rather than an automatic right to leave.

00:29:13.740 That means the subject could move from political rhetoric into concrete proposals that Albertans can examine, debate, and eventually judge for themselves.

00:29:22.080 A vote to begin the process would open a new chapter of democratic debate.

00:29:26.160 So if Albertans vote to begin the process tonight, I think that the question tomorrow becomes a fascinating one.

00:29:34.240 What do we want Alberta to look like in the next 25, 50, or 100 years?

00:29:40.280 It's a good one.

00:29:42.480 But if Alberta votes to remain in Canada, what exactly happens next?

00:29:47.360 Does Ottawa interpret that as a vote of confidence in Confederation as it currently operates?

00:29:51.980 Does the federal government conclude that Alberta's grievances have been answered?

00:29:56.980 Does the independence debate simply disappear from the political agenda?

00:30:00.980 Now those who support independence also have an obligation to answer difficult questions.

00:30:06.980 They need to explain how an independent Alberta would operate,

00:30:09.980 how it would protect its economic interests,

00:30:12.980 how it would manage its relationships with Canada, the United States and Indigenous Nations,

00:30:17.980 and how the proposed alternative would actually address the problems its supporters have identified.

00:30:25.240 But Federalists have obligations too.

00:30:28.280 They must define what remaining in Canada means for Albertans.

00:30:32.080 Because if your argument is that Alberta is better off remaining in Canada,

00:30:36.320 then surely part of that argument ought to be explaining how Canada can be made to work better for Alberta.

00:30:43.120 What reforms are possible?

00:30:44.520 Which powers should be exercised by the province?

00:30:46.720 What changes are required to reduce the recurring jurisdictional conflicts?

00:30:51.620 What concrete commitments are federal leaders prepared to make?

00:30:55.380 Those are questions worth asking.

00:30:57.740 Not just today, not just during an independence referendum, but tomorrow, next month, and throughout the years ahead.

00:31:04.200 I worry that once tonight is over, some people will be eager to declare the entire matter settled.

00:31:09.980 That the voters have spoken.

00:31:12.040 That the debate is finished.

00:31:13.580 That we can all go back to business as usual.

00:31:16.720 But business as usual is precisely what so many Albertans have been questioning.

00:31:22.180 A referendum can settle a question on a ballot.

00:31:24.400 It cannot by itself settle the grievances to put that question on the ballot in the first place.

00:31:29.140 And that's something that both sides need to understand.

00:31:31.840 If Albertans choose to remain in Canada, that decision deserves to be respected.

00:31:36.160 If Albertans choose to begin the legal process towards another referendum, that decision deserves to be taken seriously as well.

00:31:42.440 the question before us tonight concerns alberta's constitutional future the question facing us

00:31:49.760 tomorrow is what we're prepared to do about it and that is a conversation that cannot end when

00:31:55.140 the polls close in a few minutes we will be going to the phones uh so if you have something to say

00:32:02.500 um i think the number is 1-866-479-WEST extension 711 and if i have that memorized uh that is

00:32:09.520 impressive uh 9378 should be west uh okay um but first i i do want to talk about something that's

00:32:16.840 been bothering me for quite some time the conservative movement in this country has

00:32:21.920 spent so much time trying to prove how patriotically canadian it is that somewhere

00:32:26.400 along the line it seems to have forgotten what it means to be conservative in doing so the

00:32:31.780 conservative movement has effectively self-immolated on the altar of canadian patriotism i don't think

00:32:37.320 that's an exaggeration limited government individual liberty provincial autonomy the

00:32:41.680 constitutional division of powers the idea that government exists to serve the people not the

00:32:46.820 other way around these are supposed to be the foundations of canadian conservatism now it seems

00:32:52.200 the defining question isn't whether you whether or not you believe in those principles it's whether

00:32:56.520 or not you're sufficiently patriotic whether you're canadian enough whether you're prepared

00:33:01.620 to stand up wave the maple leaf sing the national anthem and declare your undying devotion to

00:33:06.240 confederation and if you aren't well apparently you've got no business calling yourself a

00:33:12.080 conservative just ask jason kenny there's absolutely nothing wrong with loving canada

00:33:16.940 there's nothing wrong with believing in confederation but that being said there are

00:33:20.980 a lot of conservatives who don't feel the same way about canada that they did just 11 years ago

00:33:25.480 since when did conservatism require unconditional loyalty to a particular political arrangement

00:33:32.060 since when did defending the canadian federation become more important than defending the principles

00:33:37.880 upon which a federation is supposed to operate and when exactly did questioning the future of

00:33:43.460 confederation become an act of political heresy that's where we seem to have arrived we have

00:33:49.080 conservatives treating other conservatives as their mortal enemies because they dare to ask

00:33:53.360 whether the current constitutional arrangement is working for ottawa not because they want bigger

00:33:57.900 government, not because they want higher taxes, not because all of a sudden they've embraced

00:34:02.400 socialism and abandoned economic or individual freedom. It's because they've reached a different

00:34:09.120 conclusion about whether Canadian Federation can be reformed. A movement that spent decades

00:34:15.380 arguing against centralized government has members who now appear prepared to defend the existing

00:34:20.180 Federation at almost any cost. In some case, the loudest defenders of confederation seem

00:34:26.400 considerably more interested in condemning independent supporters than in addressing

00:34:30.260 the grievances that produced this referendum in the first place why what exactly does that

00:34:36.580 accomplish what does calling someone a traitor make auto like does it make ottawa more respectful

00:34:42.900 of provincial jurisdiction does kicking an independent supporter out of a political party

00:34:47.900 resolve a single constitutional dispute does denouncing independence build another pipeline

00:34:53.640 reduce federal interference, or give Alberta greater control over its economic future?

00:35:03.780 No, no, no.

00:35:06.500 Yet an extraordinary amount of political energy has been devoted to precisely this sort of thing.

00:35:12.420 Let us consider the calculation behind it.

00:35:15.480 For years, conservatives have been told that they need to prove that they're not the angry Westerners their opponents portray them as.

00:35:21.540 They need to be more moderate.

00:35:23.640 more acceptable, more respectable, more Canadian.

00:35:28.400 And so, in an effort to demonstrate their patriotism,

00:35:32.320 some have adopted the very definition of Canadian identity

00:35:35.360 that their political opponents have spent decades promoting.

00:35:39.540 Canada as an end in itself.

00:35:42.580 That's an extraordinary position for any Conservative to take.

00:35:46.640 This country isn't supposed to be an object of unconditional political worship.

00:35:50.880 It's a constitutional arrangement, a distribution of powers, a system of government designed to accommodate different regions, different interests, and different political communities within a single country.

00:36:05.600 and like any system of government it ought to be open to criticism its institutions should be

00:36:12.100 accountable its powers should be limited its legitimacy ought to rest on something more

00:36:17.520 considerable and substantial than demanding that everyone love it which brings us to the great

00:36:24.520 irony of the entire exercise for decades the conservative movement was arguably one of the

00:36:30.740 strongest political vehicles for keeping western alienation within the canadian political system

00:36:36.320 it gave frustrated westerners somewhere to go it offered a means of challenging ottawa without

00:36:42.860 necessarily abandoning canada and it promised that the federation could be made to work better

00:36:47.780 so what happens when the people who are supposed to defend provincial autonomy begin treating

00:36:52.800 demands for greater autonomy is politically suspect what happens when conservative parties

00:36:57.520 become so determined to protect national unity that they alienate the people whose grievances

00:37:02.460 they're supposed to represent? And what happens when those people eventually conclude that the

00:37:07.380 conservative movement no longer has any intention of fighting the battles it once promised to fight?

00:37:12.580 Well, perhaps we're watching the answer unfold right before our eyes. The movement is divided.

00:37:19.720 Morale is low. The federal conservatives are under immense pressure. Poliev looks like he's

00:37:26.900 Almost finished.

00:37:28.300 Here in Alberta, the independence debate is driving wedges through a coalition that was deliberately brought together to prevent the conservative vote from splitting.

00:37:35.800 All in the name of patriotism.

00:37:37.660 And for what?

00:37:38.580 A pat on the back from the same political establishment that has spent decades treating Western conservatives as an embarrassment?

00:37:44.980 The approval of people who aren't likely to vote conservative anyway?

00:37:48.760 An opportunity to demonstrate that whatever else might be said about us, at least we're good Canadians?

00:37:54.360 I don't think that's a particularly compelling political objective.

00:37:59.360 And I certainly don't think it constitutes a coherent conservative philosophy.

00:38:04.680 And that brings me to the question I think every conservative should consider.

00:38:08.760 If the price of being a good Canadian is abandoning everything that made you a conservative,

00:38:13.440 then what exactly are you being patriotic toward?

00:38:17.040 Whatever the answer, the consequences of this identity crisis are becoming increasingly difficult to ignore.

00:38:23.060 and you don't have to look very far to see them so again uh we are going to the phones tonight i do

00:38:29.700 want to hear your thoughts uh i just had to get that out because uh it's been on my mind for a

00:38:33.900 while for a while so you can call us now toll free 866-479-9378 extension 711 that's 866-479

00:38:44.480 west extension 711 john do we have any comments uh to put up there's a lot of comments i figured

00:38:51.840 there would be um don't worry canada france didn't see it coming either that is a fantastic

00:39:05.200 point and and at some point tonight we are going to put up our publisher president and ceo derek

00:39:11.260 phildebrand's comments uh from the independence debate at the canada strong and free networking

00:39:15.640 conference from thursday and that is exactly his point that the country in a way has lost

00:39:24.040 lost what we used to have and we've become overrun by you know distinct cultures that

00:39:32.680 for lack of a better term aren't pulling their weight and uh what's happening in france is just 0.96

00:39:39.500 i mean it's shocking what's going on over there um they've got riots in the streets and

00:39:44.820 yeah i i am concerned sometimes about you know montreal uh rioting um or maybe even

00:39:54.220 brampton uh yeah so anyways what else have we got here yep

00:40:00.940 canada's household debt is the highest in the g7 nations yeah actually that brings me to uh

00:40:17.420 that's a good point and i mean our government debt is exceptionally high as well and this is

00:40:24.140 the one thing that's frustrated me uh throughout this conversation is one of the the reasons that

00:40:31.320 people give for leaving the country is that or for remaining in the country is the enormous

00:40:38.620 amount of debt that our province would have to take on like apparently we have to share

00:40:44.620 our per capita debt not i mean this doesn't even factor in the fact that we have contributed

00:40:53.160 substantially more in tax dollars than we get back in federal spending but apparently

00:40:57.160 we're still on the hook and by the way that's not slowing down the federal government is spending

00:41:05.180 spending spending spending they're not raising the tax dollars the the economy in eastern canada

00:41:11.900 is not doing great i mean let's just face it like there's layoffs going on all over the place they're

00:41:17.180 shutting down factories the provincial government is trying to bail these companies out because

00:41:23.140 the trade war is crushing them so yeah we probably are on the hook for our share of the federal debt

00:41:29.540 but we paid more in taxes than we got back in spending the entire time so is that going to be

00:41:36.500 factored into the conversation i didn't hear anybody mention that i didn't hear jason nixon

00:41:39.880 mention that finance minister jason nixon um but yeah i mean not to mention our personal debt

00:41:48.900 We're the highest, like that commenter said, we're the highest in the G7.

00:41:55.820 And I'm willing to bet that that's another area that Albertans probably have less debt.

00:42:02.500 I mean, I could be wrong.

00:42:03.960 I'd have to double-check this. 1.00

00:42:05.260 But I'm willing to bet that Eastern Canadians have more debt than Western Canadians. 0.99

00:42:09.540 Can someone look that up for me? 0.98

00:42:13.220 What else have we got, John?

00:42:15.140 No callers yet, eh?

00:42:16.440 like there's a thousand people watching but we got nobody calling this is live you can call i

00:42:22.960 want to hear what you have to say uh again 866-479-9378 that's uh 866-479-9378 extension

00:42:32.700 711 um let's see what we got here

00:42:38.220 it looks like there's some debates in here

00:42:48.760 i don't think i can share the comments on the screen

00:42:55.660 oh we got a call on the line

00:43:00.040 can you hear me yes i can okay you're on the air

00:43:07.220 okay all right so uh i phoned and left a message actually so um basically i was my thought is that

00:43:17.040 the separatist movement needs to form a political party uh in the province well they're going to

00:43:25.460 have to do something if they form the government and we but we need some faces that represent the

00:43:31.820 the movement itself as opposed to like the people that have stood up and and done the talking

00:43:41.260 there are some of them they're very good some of them that you might not want to listen to but I

00:43:47.020 think if they're going to be serious they need to form some kind of a political party so that

00:43:54.320 people can um see exactly uh who we're looking at when what they're talking about yeah i can

00:44:02.260 comment on that uh western standard we did a readership and subscribers poll uh i sent it

00:44:08.320 out to everybody we got a couple thousand responses so thank you to everybody for doing that

00:44:12.200 but uh in september i asked uh a kind of a like who are you what voter intention poll

00:44:19.200 uh are you voting ucp ndp greens obviously there's not a ton of ndpers on our list but

00:44:26.180 uh one of the things that popped out at me is that i think uh the wild rose independence party

00:44:32.080 had you know six percent uh alberta republicans were at two percent but 91 percent uh of conservative

00:44:38.760 voters on our list uh were voting for the united conservative party i sent another one out uh

00:44:44.000 last week and i refined that question i cut out uh i just said any independence party would you

00:44:51.560 vote ucp ndp and amongst conservative voters it the split was it was down to 74 20 or 76 20 well

00:45:01.320 76 24 i there were some progressive tories but not too many uh like i think that kind of just

00:45:08.020 speaks to if if there's a way to and you never know i mean jason kenny uh has openly declared

00:45:15.460 that independent supporters should be kicked out of the party i think there's a lot of federalist

00:45:20.540 uh tories that that agree with that statement and it may come a time where you know these people are

00:45:27.280 effectively booted from the party and they're going to need something and in that case a single

00:45:32.540 united independence party probably that doesn't have a lot of the baggage of the other two

00:45:37.360 would effectively have that ability to create a new party but yeah i i i think that's possible

00:45:45.400 i think a leadership race in one of those parties could ease it out or i mean i i don't know what's

00:45:52.200 going to happen in the ucp um that's the real question dan the party board president uh rob

00:46:01.000 smith was rather unequivocal in declaring that uh independent supporters would remain

00:46:08.060 in the party um on the other hand

00:46:11.140 i don't know where the leadership's gonna go on this i don't know what the premier's response

00:46:18.740 is gonna be i don't know i don't know how hard they're gonna fight ottawa at all uh now that

00:46:25.980 the MOUs in play, the immigration thing is fascinating, but I mean,

00:46:30.220 it's really one of those things where there's a tremendous amount of

00:46:35.180 independent supporters in the UCP and how it,

00:46:40.680 how the party kind of deals with this after the results come in. I mean,

00:46:44.560 if it's a yes vote, it's a, or sorry, if option one wins tonight,

00:46:49.340 that's a completely different conversation, right?

00:46:52.400 uh the question then becomes where does dan how does the premier handle this uh how did does she

00:46:59.020 move to i i'm willing to bet they're completely unprepared if it does go that way we'll see

00:47:03.840 but um yeah is there anything else while i still have you on the line no oh yeah no i thought that

00:47:11.840 having a party like we don't have to reinvent the wheel i look at the province of quebec as an

00:47:18.560 example they have a separatist party i mean if you want to take over the ucp or they want to form

00:47:24.400 their own party we've had other parties like the wild roses example where which didn't pan out

00:47:30.880 um i would hate to see them start from scratch uh i think like especially if they you know get 30

00:47:38.560 percent or more that shows there's a quite an interest in them but they need to prove

00:47:42.880 and have a face, one person kind of a thing.

00:47:47.520 They need representation throughout the province.

00:47:51.060 You know, get political, I guess.

00:47:53.200 Yeah, no, I think.

00:47:54.920 I'll see where it goes.

00:47:56.340 Yeah, I think you're right.

00:47:57.280 What was your name again?

00:47:58.020 Sorry.

00:47:59.840 Oh, sorry, it's Mike.

00:48:01.120 Mike, I didn't get that off the top.

00:48:02.640 Thanks, Mike.

00:48:03.000 I'm supposed to ask for everybody's names when they call in.

00:48:04.920 So thanks for your call, Mike.

00:48:06.520 But, no, he raises an excellent point.

00:48:10.060 I mean, what does the independence movement do?

00:48:14.680 Does it, I mean, there's a lot of division in there.

00:48:20.500 Let's not kid ourselves.

00:48:22.160 But, I mean, like here at the Western Standard,

00:48:24.720 Cory Morgan has been an absolute force of nature the last few months.

00:48:28.580 Where does he end up?

00:48:30.680 Keith Wilson has emerged, or let's say re-emerged.

00:48:35.040 He gained some prominence in the battle over the, not the Impact Assessment Act, the Land Stewardship Act that the PCs were trying to bring in in 2011.

00:48:46.860 The Land Stewardship Act effectively gave the government of Alberta the ability to expropriate your land in order to run a, you know, power line through there or something like that.

00:48:56.540 And Keith, very prominent in the property rights.

00:49:00.080 He was prominent during the Bill 6 debate in 2015-16.

00:49:07.080 There's a lot of fantastic, capable political orators out there.

00:49:14.000 I mean, I try not to pump his tires too much,

00:49:17.200 but I think Derek Fildebrandt could be a part of that conversation.

00:49:20.060 I don't think he ever wants to leave here.

00:49:21.520 I think he's very happy at the Western Standard.

00:49:24.000 We're happy to have him.

00:49:26.820 Long smile there, just to drive that point in.

00:49:29.120 but you know it's it is interesting to to think about and to think about that but one of the

00:49:36.600 things that i didn't touch on is is yeah how fractured the independence movement is and uh

00:49:43.120 hold on is kent clark can we just like start putting yeah put the put the trader comment up

00:49:52.360 Put the traitor comment up.

00:49:58.860 That's exactly it. 0.98

00:50:02.940 If you disagree with the concept that Alberta has grievances in Confederate,

00:50:10.280 or if you agree, you're the traitor word.

00:50:13.880 That's it.

00:50:14.420 Traitor.

00:50:16.040 I'm willing to bet it's an anonymous account,

00:50:18.020 but that just, it just, it's one of those things where they,

00:50:20.600 They don't have the intelligence to actually come up with a logical argument.

00:50:24.260 So they're just going to throw the traitor word out there because, hey,

00:50:27.760 don't have a lot going up here.

00:50:29.520 Got another call on the line.

00:50:31.200 Are you there?

00:50:34.860 Hello.

00:50:35.640 Hi, what's your name?

00:50:38.340 My name is Dave.

00:50:39.800 Dave, thanks for calling in.

00:50:42.180 What do you got for me?

00:50:43.180 Yeah.

00:50:43.320 um i i you know i can see up there that you got the trader thing up

00:50:52.760 and i just i just that that is a moniker assigned to anybody who decides to think for themselves

00:51:02.360 and not and not simply follow the the narrative that's on the two mainstream news media channels

00:51:12.400 which is a you know pretty pathetic indictment of the of people's ability to think critically in

00:51:21.500 this country you know I can't tell you how damn mad I am at Ontario and Quebec for voting that

00:51:30.500 Justin Trudeau in not one not two but three times and here we are trying to decimate our industry

00:51:39.640 out here and people want to call us traders yeah it's pathetic we spent 11 years of justin trudeau

00:51:47.980 the impact assessment act the carbon tax by the way is still like we haven't got rid of that it's

00:51:53.720 still a thing uh you had the tanker ban like there's a laundry list of like legitimate concerns

00:51:59.740 and yeah our unemployment rate like not only were were they crushing our industries people were

00:52:06.960 losing their jobs losing their homes i don't know how many friends i have like i'm at that age where

00:52:11.240 all of my friends got married in like 2013 14 15 how many divorces do you think they lived through

00:52:17.680 you know what i mean like it's people's lives were absolutely destroyed during that recession

00:52:25.340 and the liberals not only did they not help us like they're bailing out eastern companies right

00:52:31.760 now because of this trade war that is what governments are doing where we bailed out with

00:52:36.700 justin trudeau absolutely not not only that they kept like we we had the highest unemployment rate

00:52:43.160 in the country and yet we were still net contributors into the unemployment insurance

00:52:48.500 plan we paid more into unemployment insurance than we took out during the entire recession

00:52:55.380 factor that how does that work do you think they gave us any peace of mind no anyway sorry i went

00:53:05.020 on a bit of a ramp there no all good like you know i i remember in 2014-15 i had the person

00:53:15.360 on my left let go i had the person on my right let go i had the person across the hall let go

00:53:22.280 then we moved buildings and then the person on my right got let go it was it was carnage

00:53:29.200 and and here's the thing like people have such a have such amnesia or short-term mem they have such

00:53:40.600 memory loss right where make no mistake mark carney wrote his book values that is who he is

00:53:52.260 And Mark Carney has been called out for lies multiple times in the media, Gordie Howe Bridge, how much steel do you buy, where we still haven't got the full story on the trade negotiations.

00:54:12.260 and I do not trust

00:54:14.740 that he didn't want them to

00:54:16.480 go south anyway

00:54:18.760 that he didn't have an interest

00:54:20.860 in settling it

00:54:22.380 or in getting a deal

00:54:23.740 this is

00:54:26.540 like the pendulum has

00:54:28.680 kind of swung from like the

00:54:30.720 idiocy of that

00:54:32.300 doofus Trudeau

00:54:34.940 but it's

00:54:36.920 not going to come back very

00:54:38.720 far in terms of

00:54:40.820 economics like

00:54:41.900 for me it's like i want to provide for my family i want an economy that works i want an economy

00:54:49.300 that you know takes advantage of the rich resources that we have as a country not just

00:54:56.200 as a province but we're so alone in this and not entirely saskatchewan's kind of right there with

00:55:03.500 us but yeah i yeah true true yeah i think i think we align with saskatchewan in a lot of ways

00:55:09.540 um there's also the crime right like i read i read the news story about those three guys

00:55:18.240 who murdered that couple who hired them to do home service and the and the judge today

00:55:25.800 the judge said that it would be cruel and unusual punishment to for them to not be eligible for 0.60

00:55:31.980 parole in 15 years like yeah i actually i was getting a haircut today it is so screwed up man

00:55:37.640 Yeah, I was getting a haircut today and the hairdresser was talking about crime and how, like, it's all circumstantial.

00:55:45.020 Like, if you're, if you have, like, if you have extenuating circumstances, let's say, quote unquote, intergenerational trauma, you are treated with a different set of consequences than if you're not.

00:56:02.640 like the entire justice system has effectively returned into a revolving door of crime you

00:56:10.980 commit an offense at breakfast you're let out of jail by lunch you can do it again by two o'clock

00:56:18.400 and then you know it's just this cycle and nothing has changed nothing like i walk around downtown

00:56:25.820 calgary and you know what there are days where i'm not comfortable outside i mean not very often but

00:56:32.400 i was in edmonton and my goodness like i lived there for a year i couldn't get out of there fast

00:56:36.880 enough it was an absolute just i feel like for people that i know that live there i genuinely

00:56:45.040 was genuinely concerned about their safety on a day-to-day basis like i couldn't help it

00:56:49.220 and this is the canada that we're supposed to defend is the canada that basically allows

00:56:56.920 violent offenders out of jail early on time sir because they had a tough childhood i mean as far

00:57:05.120 as i'm concerned a crime is a crime you rape someone you go to jail you murder someone you go

00:57:11.540 to jail you you know whatever like i mean it's insane and that is a like again like this status

00:57:22.760 quo like if if we vote to remain in this country which again polls seem to indicate that that's the

00:57:28.400 way it's going to go i don't know if we have any reporting yet but it's just an absolute train wreck

00:57:35.740 so yeah yeah like we actually need these changes genuinely and we're not gonna end up getting them

00:57:44.580 because again and that brings me back to your point about carney i don't know what mark carney

00:57:49.660 we're going to get tomorrow i mean if we vote to remain absolutely and mark carney sees that oh

00:57:56.520 wow it's uh let's say polar is right and it's 76 24 and we're sitting here at the end like okay

00:58:04.100 now what i mean what what are we going to get out of this is i mean there is a small chance that

00:58:11.180 carney continues on this path because it's working i mean it's hard to kind of argue that it isn't

00:58:16.200 working he's up in the polls substantially he's even got danielle smith claiming that mark carney's

00:58:21.520 key to success is stealing pierre polly has ideas i i don't know how i would feel about smith's

00:58:26.880 comments if i was pierre but i mean that that's that's the truth of the matter so yeah i mean

00:58:32.940 what mark carney we're gonna get tomorrow are we gonna get the same this mark carney or is mark

00:58:37.040 carney gonna look at the economic situation in ontario and look at donald trump and say well

00:58:42.680 these are up elbows up boys let's get them and what happens then our is our oil and gas all of

00:58:48.800 a sudden on the table in a trade war are we going to see export tariffs i mean i i think it's

00:58:54.980 possible because i don't trust mark yeah no and and nothing would surprise me like to me it

00:59:02.420 anything's on the table with these nut bars and and just just and if i if i may like circle back

00:59:11.100 to where i started about being a trader like who's the trader to who like you're you're you're openly

00:59:20.540 shutting down and and margin okay shutting down okay that's debatable but marginalizing and making

00:59:29.800 uncompetitive the industry that supports our province and and and supports much of the rest

00:59:36.440 of the country um and we're like we're not supposed to notice like who who's the traitor here

00:59:45.360 like i don't have i don't have a loyalty to the maple leaf i have a loyalty to my family

00:59:53.420 to provide for my family to have a job so that i can put bread on the table that's where my

00:59:59.960 loyalty is and sure like canada great okay like i have great neighbors i have a great community

01:00:07.540 but but but my first priority is having a job so that i can provide for my family

01:00:15.400 yeah and there's nonsense about and what do you call a kind of where you label people

01:00:24.060 as a traitor because they you know don't have total allegiance to ottawa and all the idiots

01:00:31.260 in ontario yep you know it's nonsense no i agree that's the word i was looking for yeah and it's

01:00:39.060 it's one of those things that i mean they're still federal liberals like i they can put on

01:00:44.940 this veneer for the last six months 12 months mark carney flies out to calgary does a big i

01:00:51.780 mean 7 000 people at BMO is pretty good i i hate to say it but it's it's just like it is demoralizing

01:01:00.000 to see that because deep down i don't trust them i just don't and one of the things that

01:01:07.220 frustrates me the most is watching the government of alberta effectively come to every just we're

01:01:18.900 going to come to a deal and they i'm like i can't stand it i every time smith has a press conference

01:01:24.160 with carney i just can feel it you know like i don't don't you dare i mean what are you selling

01:01:29.660 us out for this time it's frustrating and i think that the approach of the alberta government is

01:01:35.320 wrong i think that in the event that option two fails uh tonight tomorrow morning whenever we get

01:01:42.940 the final results we still don't have results as of right now just in case you're wondering

01:01:46.660 um i think that we are incredibly vulnerable i think that there's a lot of things that the

01:01:53.120 federal liberals can do we have a long 121 year history of it nothing has really changed other

01:01:59.620 than the fact that we voted to remain in canada we don't have the leverage the big threats gone

01:02:05.320 and uh anyways i did hear some beeping so uh thank you very much for your call dave uh we

01:02:11.840 appreciate it uh still waiting on results uh ballot number 10 is being uh is the first one

01:02:21.660 on the table uh i am guessing that uh the uh i don't know which edmonton station it was but

01:02:29.160 there was an edmonton polling station that had to stay open until 10 i know that they are still

01:02:34.100 letting people vote if you were standing in line at 10 o'clock i'm guessing that's still going on

01:02:38.760 My understanding is that the other, I mean, there's 106 that were polling stations that were late opening and therefore late closing.

01:02:51.080 There's 5,621 total.

01:02:53.600 So I am under the understanding that each of these polling stations began counting shortly after their polls closed.

01:03:01.280 So that was over two hours ago.

01:03:02.500 So once the results start coming in, I'm hoping they come in fast.

01:03:06.800 Otherwise, this is going to be a very boring night.

01:03:09.320 John, do we have a call on the line?

01:03:11.060 Hi, what's your name?

01:03:12.260 Sir.

01:03:13.720 Okay.

01:03:14.320 My name is Edward.

01:03:15.980 And the reason why I'm calling is because I'm watching a program right now about Watch Live

01:03:22.060 2026 Alberta referendum night results.

01:03:27.380 Yeah.

01:03:29.400 Okay.

01:03:30.700 I'd like to get on and speak with the gentleman, if I can.

01:03:33.920 You are on the air right now.

01:03:35.840 Live.

01:03:36.720 wait i'm watching your uh host talking to somebody else you might be delayed um but you

01:03:47.120 are speaking to me right now you are live on the air um okay all right do you want me to share with

01:03:54.100 you some thoughts yes okay first of all let me give you a little background i am a naturalized

01:04:03.560 american citizen i've been in the united states for over 50 years and basically i'm not sure if

01:04:10.480 you call me a conservative or liberal i can definitely tell you i'm not liberal i kind of

01:04:17.180 think of myself as being responsible and i've watched the uh way american politics have played

01:04:24.900 And I'm a Trump supporter

01:04:28.060 Okay

01:04:29.180 So let me get to my point

01:04:32.160 I want to give you a little background

01:04:34.160 Primarily because I want you to know

01:04:36.560 Where I'm coming from

01:04:37.520 Also I need to give you a little background

01:04:42.200 In terms of my experience

01:04:43.940 And what I've learned through life

01:04:46.540 And I'm retired

01:04:47.680 What I have a concern about

01:04:51.860 Alberta's separating from Canada, is that I'm not sure if you have a real plan.

01:04:59.800 And let me tell you what I mean by that. I looked up Alberta. I see that you have,

01:05:05.620 based on what I found, seven million people. And I see that you've had some in migration in the

01:05:13.240 last few years and you have uh i'm not sure how i say this but in the u.s as you know we had 20

01:05:23.660 million illegal immigrants that come in i don't know what your status is i don't know what your

01:05:30.620 makeup is i also looked at what resources and what assets you could provide the united states 0.99

01:05:36.220 Because the bottom line I see about you is that you are completely secluded if you leave Canada.

01:05:50.020 Okay, if I can quickly address the first point.

01:05:55.160 This is a referendum to start the process of holding a binding referendum.

01:06:01.240 There have been a couple of groups that have put out white papers on what an independent Alberta would look like.

01:06:08.200 And there have been reports from, you know, the Calgary Chamber of Commerce estimates the cost of Alberta independence at one hundred and seventy five billion.

01:06:16.120 The key issue driving this is the fiscal imbalances in Confederation.

01:06:22.240 Alberta contributes on average 15 percent of all federal taxes collected by the federal government.

01:06:27.860 we are paid our uh the federal government spends about 11.6 percent roughly of all federal um

01:06:37.600 spending in the province of alberta there's a difference of well four out of uh is it four

01:06:43.460 out of 11 or four to 15 whatever it's a 25 20 right like 30 maybe even that's how much money

01:06:51.920 the in federal taxes that we don't ever get back and so but in terms of a plan like yeah i mean

01:06:59.460 there isn't a plan but this isn't a referendum to leave like we aren't forming our own country

01:07:03.700 tomorrow this is a referendum to start that process it's it's kind of a referendum for

01:07:09.780 another referendum and then uh we'll start the negotiation because the constitution of canada

01:07:15.540 according to the clarity act does not give any province the unilateral right to secede so

01:07:20.100 yeah you're right you're right there isn't a clear plan um on the landlocked uh conversation

01:07:26.120 um i'm not going to go into the united nations or anything like that but what i am going to be

01:07:31.180 what i am going to go into is british columbia if alberta were to leave british columbia would

01:07:37.360 yes they would have an ocean but they would be separated by alberta from the rest of the country

01:07:43.120 um so that would beg the question what does british columbia do does british columbia just

01:07:48.600 agree to ship their uh products from the port of british columbia to eastern canada uh and pay a

01:07:57.400 toll at our border do they send everything around to the united states i i think the united states

01:08:03.680 might have something to say if british columbia all of a sudden was sending all of its stuff

01:08:07.340 but to uh through seattle or uh you know wyoming um but does or do they send it up north do we

01:08:16.980 you know risk the uh dangerous icy roads of northern alberta in the winter time to get

01:08:21.600 eastern canada the products it needs from asia it it's it is a a this this process has not

01:08:28.620 really gone on it's the beginning of a conversation and i think that's what a lot of people are

01:08:35.460 confused about they think that because alberta's voting uh to hold a referendum on independence

01:08:41.500 that we are along that path.

01:08:44.880 Sir, what is your name?

01:08:46.480 What is your name?

01:08:47.820 Josh.

01:08:49.920 Josh? Okay, I'm Edward.

01:08:52.320 Okay, I understand that because I've been watching

01:08:55.280 for the last three months, maybe four months,

01:08:58.980 about what's going on in Canada.

01:09:00.920 And I have something to say about Carney,

01:09:03.340 but I want to wait until the end to talk about that.

01:09:06.380 My basic, basically what I'm saying is this.

01:09:09.520 if you're the only province that succeeds or in some way break away from Canada

01:09:18.240 you're gonna be completely landlocked the only choice that you seem to have

01:09:22.720 right now is possibly to deal with the United States or possibly be a 51st

01:09:28.420 state and I'm being sarcastic by saying that and I'm not saying that that's good

01:09:32.560 for you or good for the U.S. Your oil, you're pumping, what, 4.3 million barrels a day?

01:09:40.800 Give or take.

01:09:41.400 Or maybe 4 million a day down to the United States. And I believe most of the oils are

01:09:47.640 refined in the Midwest. I don't think it's going all the way down to Mississippi. So

01:09:53.940 the problem that it's going to run into is that Trump signed a deal with Venezuela for

01:09:59.160 65 billion barrels of oil, probably indefinitely, because it's going to last hundreds of years

01:10:05.960 for U.S. consumption. You're the third largest, you have the third largest reserve in the world,

01:10:14.140 next to Venezuela and I think Saudi Arabia. The U.S. has a tenth in reserves in the world,

01:10:21.620 just probably about one-sixth to one-tenth of your reserves.

01:10:26.900 The bottom line is that if you can't cut a deal with the U.S.,

01:10:31.940 if you can't cut a deal with British Columbia, you're stuck.

01:10:35.780 You're landlocked.

01:10:37.180 Your resources that you have.

01:10:40.680 So the bottom line is it would be very difficult for you to negotiate

01:10:46.300 with the United States right now to negotiate a deal,

01:10:49.540 10-year deal 20-year deal whatever because if you can't move your oil and natural gas

01:10:56.800 through uh British Columbia okay I'm gonna jump in here because the issue that we face right now

01:11:03.240 is that we are already landlocked uh we've had issues in in building new infrastructure to

01:11:09.080 transport this resource for the better part of a decade even under Stephen Harper there was

01:11:15.560 delays at towards the end of his tenure it's it's one of it's really the key issue that's

01:11:22.020 driven this entire discussion um we are yeah you're right we are having a discussion about

01:11:26.920 leaving the country and the landlocked conversation becomes a part of it but

01:11:31.380 we can't get our product to tidewater as is i mean the federal government quote-unquote bought

01:11:37.580 us a pipeline as jason kenny now says but the reason they bought us a pipeline is because they

01:11:42.320 drove all the private investment out the door like we can't find private components for our

01:11:47.520 existing infrastructure projects the government's having to build everything and that's the issue

01:11:52.540 that's driven this entire conversation and and i i agree with effectively everything you're saying

01:11:57.780 so i don't want to sound like i'm you know criticizing your point i'm just kind of adding

01:12:02.640 to it in a way that you're right you have touched on the central point of this debate we are

01:12:08.180 effectively landlocked as is uh we'll see things might change in british columbia they go to the

01:12:13.240 polls on saturday i think but in alberta for the last decade we've had ndp governments in british

01:12:20.720 columbia that refuse to allow for oil to be tankered off the coast uh we have had federal

01:12:28.540 governments that have handcuffed every industry every development that we've had we've had the

01:12:33.960 ripping up pipelines to even to the east like we can't even get our product to market within our

01:12:40.260 own country that's what's driven this debate uh when it comes to the united states uh the

01:12:45.780 independence movement i would argue is divided there are people that do want to see a closer

01:12:52.680 relationship with the united states there are people that would probably jump for joy

01:12:57.440 if there was some kind of an offer on the table that would allow us to become american citizens

01:13:04.560 and especially if our canadian dollars would be honored in u.s dollars i think there'd be a lot

01:13:10.020 of people jumping at that as well uh and so there isn't a deal that won't go on the tape or that

01:13:15.380 people don't want to see but i think there's a lot of people in this province who take a look

01:13:22.700 at the united states and think you know what texas is a pretty nice place to live and or florida is a

01:13:30.800 pretty nice place to live or nevada or you know some of these these states that don't have income

01:13:36.120 tax uh that can manage to function as a state without extra charges i think there's a lot of

01:13:43.720 people that look at that and say man that's awesome and i think that there's an argument that

01:13:48.500 the united states is the united states and that states rights in the united states are fundamental

01:13:56.420 to the way that the country operates the this uh the the division of powers is effectively what

01:14:03.680 it's supposed to be in the canada we have a federal government that has increasingly centralized that

01:14:09.940 has taken power away from the provinces we've had to go to court to fight for basic you know

01:14:15.820 constitutional jurisdiction which is embedded in the constitution uh so yeah it is one of those

01:14:21.900 things where yeah i think there's a lot of people that would agree with that sentiment and and and

01:14:29.080 yes venezuela is a real threat venezuela's oil coming online early um if they can get it to

01:14:35.400 market faster than what they're projecting and and who knows i mean yeah you're building a lot

01:14:40.240 of stuff from scratch again because it's it's so dilapidated and and old and hasn't been used

01:14:45.520 forever but i mean in terms of infrastructure projects anything's possible they built a natural

01:14:52.000 gas uh plant and not a plant a uh terminal off the coast of germany in water in like six months

01:15:01.600 so yeah it is a venezuela is a threat so anyways uh yeah uh so it could be a threat or it could

01:15:10.560 an ally yes on how you look at it but let me get back to what you're saying josh you and i are

01:15:16.960 totally in agreement in many points and the one point i can tell you about the united states i

01:15:21.760 lived here for over 50 years i came from uh i i came here for school and i stayed ever since

01:15:28.400 but the bottom line itself is essentially this that i even despite the problems that are going on

01:15:35.520 with uh government with the two sides uh actually the three sides the democrats the uh republicans

01:15:43.680 and the independents it's still a much freer country we're a much at this point a more

01:15:50.480 opportunistic country uh i can tell you where i came from i would never have built and i'm not

01:15:57.600 rich by any means okay but i was able to build an essay that i'm fairly financially comfortable

01:16:03.520 i would never have done that working from and what i'm seeing in campus it you will not do that

01:16:10.980 and i could not believe how arcade your stupid financing is when you buy a home yeah no i agree

01:16:19.040 i agree anyways uh i appreciate the call um we'll uh open the lines again thank you very much

01:16:26.160 edward was it thank you edward for calling in and for your thoughts and yeah i think

01:16:30.160 like and honestly there's been a lot of talk about you know alberta's culture and how

01:16:34.900 you know in a way we are unique and and there's a lot of the things that edward was talking about

01:16:41.420 the you know the the economic freedom is founded in the ideals of the american revolution uh life

01:16:48.220 liberty and the pursuit of happiness and in canada we were essentially founded on the concept of not

01:16:54.820 being american but that's embedded in itself in different ways in in eastern canada that's just

01:17:01.460 kind of a part of reality um you know they it's very paternalistic the government should look after

01:17:08.660 you in the other way in alberta especially in our early history when we were first settling uh when

01:17:15.920 calgary was new and and in the 1880s 1890s 1900s all the way through the 1930s the majority of

01:17:23.980 settlers were american they came up from american america uh all four of my grandparents were born

01:17:30.500 here in alberta but you know their families all came originally through the united states

01:17:36.640 they that's just you know the fact of that's that's where that's where i come from and i'm

01:17:43.260 not the only one that that has those roots and and so the culture in alberta in a way especially

01:17:50.420 in its early years and to factor in the fact that ottawa is 3 700 and some kilometers away we've had

01:17:56.500 to be independent within confederation already so uh and the idea the entrepreneurial spirit and

01:18:04.180 pioneering spirit are very much legacies of this province i mean those talking points are used by

01:18:08.740 pierre polyev on a regular basis uh we have a call on the line uh go ahead hi am i on am i live right

01:18:16.980 now yes you are what's your name oh it's donald smith calling from vancouver from elder girls

01:18:22.820 british columbia the communist regime and province here where they support mutilating kids and all

01:18:30.100 that um yeah yeah yes they do trust me they do we have we have problems in this in this province

01:18:38.500 here but i'm from alberta but um i agree with the separation it's time to get it's time for alberta

01:18:44.180 to basically be their own province through their own system and all that stuff because

01:18:48.980 right now here in here in vancouver we just the here in vancouver we just had a municipal election

01:18:54.740 we have major far left lunatics now running the city is that what happened there yeah i saw

01:19:00.580 something about that yeah we have we have we have a city councilor named chuck city councilor

01:19:06.660 named communist sean or who is um who is a is an antifa member a palestine supporter

01:19:14.100 who supports the destroy calling cop pigs calling jewish people they should die and a whole bunch 0.81

01:19:19.780 of things and he still got elected and all these other idiots um who are in the uh uh what is in

01:19:27.780 the council like keep frying all them they're not they're just they're going to defund the police

01:19:33.060 they're going to cause problems we're going to have a portland oregon style we're going to have

01:19:36.800 a seattle style then it's just it's just it's just getting out of control out here i will point out

01:19:43.740 here if i if i can just jump in um i think yes that is a threat but at the end of the day uh

01:19:51.360 the municipalities are a creature of the province and if you get a change in government on saturday

01:19:59.500 The province will have a different set of objectives for the city of Vancouver.

01:20:04.000 And, yeah, there will be clashes.

01:20:06.020 I expect there to be clashes.

01:20:07.600 And, again, polls are really close.

01:20:10.660 Yeah, there's going to be clashes.

01:20:12.780 We just have that.

01:20:13.820 And we're having a presidential election, too.

01:20:15.680 I just don't support the conservative parties at all because half of them are a bunch of liberals and all that.

01:20:21.940 Like, they're liberals.

01:20:23.100 Basically, they said they're conservatives, but they're liberals and all that.

01:20:26.520 They don't care about people.

01:20:28.880 But I do agree with the conservative new beginning, because you've got to get rid of this socialist NDP government, David Eby, who doesn't care about the province, who doesn't care about people, doesn't care about jobs.

01:20:40.840 We have a huge deficit there.

01:20:42.640 There's a lot of homeless people, and it's just problems.

01:20:46.320 I'm actually thinking about coming back to Alberta very soon, moving, and just basically leaving my license for the adios and all that.

01:20:53.780 I had enough with this crap here. 1.00

01:20:55.780 I had enough of this so-called free, free Palestine river to the sea trash and all that stuff. 0.99

01:21:01.300 If you want to go chant that stuff, go back to Gaza and all that stuff. 0.98

01:21:05.520 We don't want this in this country.

01:21:07.340 I'm sorry.

01:21:07.800 I'm not being racist or anything like this.

01:21:09.300 No, I 100% agree.

01:21:11.380 And it's one of those things where, like, I mean, and I'm going to let you go.

01:21:17.080 We'll get another caller on.

01:21:18.360 Our phone lines are blowing up right now.

01:21:20.320 But thank you very much for calling in.

01:21:22.020 um but yeah i think you know it's it's one of those things that municipal governments say i

01:21:27.860 don't know like i calgary is an interesting take jeremy farkas went from conservative to

01:21:33.100 liberal i don't even know what he is now but um yeah and and yeah there's a lot of people in bc

01:21:40.320 that that do think about moving back to albert i mean there's a lot of people that retire out

01:21:44.620 to victoria i mean i have family that's retired out in victoria it's beautiful absolute beautiful

01:21:49.040 out there it's peaceful quiet but uh in in some cases you know obviously the the uh situation

01:21:57.160 uh you know it it's deteriorated like people are you know there was a boulevard in victoria

01:22:05.640 that i drove down that like in the middle like you know this divider it was all just homeless

01:22:13.020 people like camped people barbecues in the meridian like it was insane anyways we got a

01:22:19.740 call on the line uh can you hear me yes i can hi uh it's josh uh i'm sorry what's your name

01:22:29.740 you're on the air it's manny's manny's yeah you bet perfect all right go ahead standard yeah

01:22:38.620 I was listening to David Eby

01:22:42.420 And not Ed Menchie

01:22:43.580 And you know

01:22:44.480 They kept on saying

01:22:45.520 We could be considered as

01:22:47.860 Reason if this goes through

01:22:50.420 I'm a little bit worried

01:22:51.820 I'll talk to my wife and I

01:22:53.100 If people get charged if they vote for independence

01:22:56.400 Sorry what was that?

01:23:00.660 Can you get charged if you vote for independence?

01:23:02.900 Do you get charged?

01:23:05.200 Yeah

01:23:05.680 What do you mean you get charged?

01:23:07.100 like do you get like arrested for treason oh um no i i don't think so i mean if that's the case

01:23:17.760 then this entire publication will cease to exist because we're all in jail so i mean i hope not

01:23:23.420 but uh i i don't think so i think uh like a it's not it's it's not a binding uh referendum so the

01:23:32.440 Alberta government could effectively uh do it number two nobody should know how you vote I mean

01:23:38.460 like you can say how you voted but the only way to prove that you voted that way is to literally pull

01:23:44.140 your voting data and that's that is if anybody does that we are way past uh the point but yeah

01:23:52.560 I mean the term gets thrown around I think it waters the term down I mean what is the definition

01:23:57.920 of treason according to whatever that guy's name then i think we banned from the comments um

01:24:03.280 yeah i think it's but then again you look at nahad nenshi's uh rhetoric and it's all like way over

01:24:13.120 the top the dangerous ideas they're traitors they're like i mean it's just look i i get it

01:24:22.200 and you know what they're they're doing pretty well in the polls like although i think that's

01:24:26.100 more a function of the weakness in the alberta government that they've managed to make everybody

01:24:31.460 angry by both putting this referendum on the table and not convincing any of the federalists that

01:24:36.200 they weren't separatists and on the other hand all the separatist and then campaigning on the

01:24:42.100 remain side and so all the independent supporters so you've managed to wade into the middle of the

01:24:47.860 most fractious debate in the history of this province and aggravate both sides now i think

01:24:54.480 that the poll the people that are polling to vote the ucp are the ones who are going to vote ucp no

01:24:59.820 matter what they're not going to vote ndp they're going to vote ucp they're partisan they're good

01:25:05.240 people i like those people but you need a bigger coalition than that you need to be able to convince

01:25:10.480 like both sides of this and and at the end of all this like maybe it is a vote to to to leave or

01:25:16.620 maybe it's a vote to stay what happens if it is a vote to stay i mean does voting to stay mean that

01:25:21.980 we've sided with all the status quo federalists that really have no solutions does a vote to stay

01:25:28.040 mean that we get our alberta pension plan that we get an alberta police force does a vote to stay

01:25:32.520 mean nothing changes we abandon everything and we go back to the way things were i don't know

01:25:38.820 i mean that's a question but i think go ahead the fear tactics are i would say like it worked

01:25:46.640 on a lot of people like my wife and i were right right that we can get like targeted and our

01:25:52.960 businesses you know like um attacked which i've seen online like there are some businesses that

01:25:58.480 were attacked because they supported independence yeah um uh kind of like like paul's pizza there

01:26:04.160 and then i also uh was thinking that uh you know like i was watching rachel maddow on msnbc

01:26:10.880 I'm sorry to hear that.

01:26:11.860 I hope you're doing okay.

01:26:15.500 I'm doing just fine.

01:26:16.840 I was watching Rachel Maddow, and she brought it up,

01:26:18.940 and she talked about Jeremy Farkas, the mayor of Calgary,

01:26:22.860 and, you know, like how she supports Jeremy Farkas.

01:26:27.460 And I was just watching Jeremy Farkas,

01:26:29.060 and I'm a little bit scared to say something online

01:26:31.040 because you never know who's watching

01:26:32.760 or who could be trying to be threatening you

01:26:34.740 or new scare tactics against you. 0.81

01:26:36.760 But, you know, Christian, and for him to attack Christians,

01:26:40.640 the other day what are your thoughts on that and have you seen that i i did not see that um

01:26:49.520 i honestly i kind of i i hate to say this is going to sound very condescending to the people

01:26:57.260 in the mayor's office i kind of tuned him out like i mean yeah he's the mayor and you know

01:27:03.340 what there are certain things he does really well like i mean his community engagement like

01:27:06.860 i mean he was riding down water slides the other day i saw that like he showed up at our barbecue

01:27:11.400 and let us throw water balloons at him but yeah i i mean i was i i did not watch his speech i did

01:27:19.760 not see what he said i cannot comment if that's the line he took then that is absolutely over the

01:27:27.040 line i mean you know i grew up catholic i have a certain set of beliefs does that make me any less

01:27:33.360 than anybody else i don't think so i mean yeah i but i can't uh comment because i didn't actually

01:27:39.800 see the remarks but uh i i do believe that he said what do you think about the mayors of calgary

01:27:45.300 and edmonton teaming up with nahed menci and working alongside them and you know basically

01:27:52.580 bashing the the conservative party on a consistent basis it doesn't surprise me uh andrew knack

01:28:01.440 i mean he's he's about as left as they come uh he's the big infill guy right now like he wants

01:28:08.780 to see you know four to eight story condominium buildings being built in residential communities

01:28:14.640 right beside single uh family housing units and they've and and farkas like i don't know where

01:28:21.440 he's been at with that again like i kind of i've tuned him out but it doesn't surprise me municipal

01:28:26.280 politicians like and i don't know how it ends up this way like i do know that yeah public sector

01:28:32.800 unions play a huge role in getting out to vote the teachers union usually has a slate of candidates

01:28:38.340 that it needs to win for school board trustees so they all vote in unison and and on the right

01:28:44.960 we're a little bit more divided we're a little bit less organized we're a little bit more independent

01:28:48.580 and maybe that plays a role but municipalities throughout the province i think are to the left

01:28:53.840 of the people that are in it i mean i went to i used to work for the alberta government and i would

01:28:58.540 go to you know the rural uh teachers trustee conference and walk around like talking to

01:29:05.040 people and getting i'm just like getting the feeling from these politicians that they're

01:29:09.860 the most left you would get in the rural barhead community or the rural uh red deer community and

01:29:17.280 and you get to bigger cities it's it's 10 times worse the community associations are typically

01:29:23.340 further left and they're the busybodies they're the you know they're the they're the ones who

01:29:30.920 you know they want to get a stop sign changed on their street corner so they run for town council

01:29:35.200 i don't know if you've seen the modern family where uh julie bowen's character does that but

01:29:39.520 that's just the kind of makeup of it i think that part of it too and maybe this is just more from

01:29:47.180 an academia side of things uh i think academia post-secondary and primary is failing us uh i

01:29:54.560 think that i mean i went to the university of lethbridge uh and and shout out to francis

01:30:00.920 widdowson who is currently suing them for three million dollars i wish i thought of that uh 10

01:30:05.220 years ago but uh you know like it's it is incredibly uh you know you so you get all

01:30:13.200 these kids that you know they're they're the educated ones that have their university degrees

01:30:18.440 and gender studies or you know something like that and uh having trouble getting jobs so they

01:30:25.940 go into politics and they were probably involved in politics at the university level uh i know the

01:30:31.520 students union is basically a breeding ground for left-wing municipal politicians at the uofl i'm

01:30:37.060 sure it is at the ufc i'm sure it is at uh the university of alberta uh to me uh if you were

01:30:42.920 a students union representative at a post-secondary education institution in this province it should

01:30:48.820 disqualify you from claiming to be conservative i don't think you can be both but uh you know

01:30:54.440 there's people employed in the alberta legislature that came out of students union so who am i to

01:30:59.460 judge uh that would be patrick balkin uh he is in charge of hiring at the alberta legislature

01:31:04.420 for the united conservative party um but yeah i mean that's that's the problem

01:31:08.820 we have a pipeline of municipal politicians that graduated from post-secondary education

01:31:15.880 institutions these kids weren't the ones standing up to their professors they were the ones that

01:31:20.120 were tailoring their essay submissions to get a good grade for some social so they're not used

01:31:28.380 to fighting for conservative values so even the ones we get yeah you know like they're all right

01:31:35.140 what are your concerns with with the new city council plus the mayor being the green party

01:31:41.340 in vancouver do you think we're we're still going to be able to work with vancouver's

01:31:47.220 municipal and provincial level with them with oil and gas i think it's going to be a dog's

01:31:53.400 breakfast uh i think it already was going to be a dog's breakfast uh but then again like i mean in

01:31:59.640 this province as it is in bc the provincial government has an extraordinary amount of power

01:32:05.340 to uh wield over the municipalities municipalities are not in the constitution they don't really

01:32:12.360 legally exist other than by an act of the provincial legislature so it does concern me

01:32:18.680 they'll scream they'll shout but if you get a change in government provincially

01:32:22.420 Things will be a little bit different

01:32:25.280 At least in theory

01:32:26.620 I mean it depends on how tough the Conservatives are

01:32:29.680 If they get elected

01:32:30.900 But I mean and based on the

01:32:33.080 Exactly

01:32:33.380 There's an election happening on the 18th

01:32:37.040 And it's already started

01:32:38.300 So we'll see what happens

01:32:40.560 With that and hopefully we can

01:32:42.440 It'd be positive

01:32:43.360 What are your thoughts on Jason Stevens

01:32:46.180 The MLA for Red Deer

01:32:48.460 Basically

01:32:50.280 posting today that he will not be running

01:32:53.600 at third term.

01:32:55.340 I think he came to that decision a long time ago.

01:32:59.480 And honestly,

01:33:00.760 I don't blame him. He's been through a lot.

01:33:05.260 But I think that he represents

01:33:07.900 a view that is

01:33:10.040 underrepresented in the Alberta legislature,

01:33:14.000 that's underrepresented in caucus, and that is definitely

01:33:17.000 underrepresented, if not represented at all.

01:33:20.280 in cabinet um i it's so i i'm not saying that i'm shocked by this revelation

01:33:27.940 and to me the best politicians are the ones that only do eight years because they don't get tied up

01:33:34.600 in you know the they don't get dome disease and too comfortable uh i think it's going to be an

01:33:41.420 absolute loss uh for the united conservative party um and but i think the timing of the

01:33:50.500 announcement may be due to internal pressure um have you thought about running yourself

01:33:57.040 i think i would be disqualified uh because i agree with jason stefan i i maybe i don't know

01:34:06.240 i mean i do love what i do uh i love the western standard i you know for all the fighting that

01:34:14.160 derek and i have on a weekly basis like i consider him a brother and it would be very hard to leave

01:34:20.540 i went up to edmonton for a year to work for the alberta government i was policy advisor and

01:34:26.260 minister of education and child care office and a policy advisor in uh service alberta and red tape

01:34:31.820 production and look i i love dale nally yeah and you know what i had a lot i really did enjoy that

01:34:40.380 one uh surprisingly i wasn't sure but i quite like dale um but i just the bureaucracy like the the

01:34:47.480 amount of red tape that you're jumping through to get you know we have as an elected government we

01:34:53.880 were supposed to be implementing policies and we would get briefing notes from the department who

01:34:58.380 are supposed to be our employees basically telling us we can't do it for some bs reason that

01:35:03.600 involves catering to the alberta teachers association it was incredibly frustrating

01:35:08.260 it was incredibly frustrating watching cabinet tiptoe around the bureaucracy and not actually

01:35:12.940 defend themselves and like jason leaving to me is a blow to the united conservative party but it is

01:35:19.020 not a blow that shocks me at all i think the party needs to take a good long look at itself and i

01:35:26.480 mean you're losing to the ndp in the polls right now like that should not happen in this province

01:35:30.980 and i and i think that it's a lack of vision from the leadership and i think it's just a lot of it

01:35:36.440 is we have a lot of cabinet ministers that are so constantly fed left-wing talking points from

01:35:46.020 their own bureaucrats and they don't have the willpower to fight it that's what i see

01:35:52.180 what are your thoughts with premier smith um and and the way she's looking right now there's a lot

01:35:59.520 of concerns that you know she may not make it through she may not from what we've seen with

01:36:04.520 jeff ross on x what we've seen and kind of been seen online uh what are your concerns with premier

01:36:11.880 daniel smith i have deep concerns and a lot of it is i i don't think it's just jeff and mitch

01:36:19.020 that she needs to worry about i mean they're the loudest and i i would argue that they don't really

01:36:24.420 have i mean they don't have a ton of credibility i mean they spent like you had a referendum to

01:36:30.920 win and you spent the last six months hammering the premier not the right yeah i didn't agree

01:36:36.240 i wasn't a big fan of that at all i understand where they're coming from i get it i'm not gonna

01:36:42.380 to sit here and pretend that i'm not completely dissatisfied with the performance of the alberta

01:36:49.500 government over the last seven months she's going to have some explaining to do if this deal with

01:36:54.400 mark carney this mou does not produce substantiated results in a short period of time she's going to

01:37:00.200 have to explain that to everybody else i think that the effort of proving how canadian we were

01:37:06.800 has self-immolized or self-immolized whatever you lit yourself on fire they lit the party on fire to

01:37:13.020 prove how canadian they were because they were so afraid of being branded as separatists that

01:37:17.640 yes you have that 40 that's going to vote ucp no matter what that's just what they're going to do

01:37:23.680 they hate the ndp more than they hate anything else in the world i like those people but they're

01:37:29.240 also part of a broader tent and and i don't think that the premier's office has had a good vision i

01:37:34.300 I think that there was a point where I don't know what happened with Rob

01:37:37.780 Anderson,

01:37:38.160 but that free Alberta strategy in the Alberta sovereignty act,

01:37:40.980 I thought was an absolute home run.

01:37:42.880 I did.

01:37:43.660 I went into the other,

01:37:45.120 I went into Edmonton thinking,

01:37:46.320 man,

01:37:47.120 this is genius.

01:37:47.940 Like these guys have it set.

01:37:50.400 Like they've got,

01:37:51.460 they are,

01:37:52.100 you know,

01:37:53.380 this is the right call.

01:37:54.560 You know,

01:37:54.980 like we draw a line on Ottawa.

01:37:56.820 We stop signing these agreements.

01:37:59.580 First of all,

01:38:00.340 like,

01:38:00.620 especially on anything that it's expands the spending,

01:38:04.300 power the federal government like please stop if they're taxing more than they're giving us and

01:38:10.040 we're still signing up to get the money back why because nobody should say no to free money

01:38:14.140 no come on come on like that's just like it is there's no vision and and in order for the united

01:38:23.640 conservative party to remain united i think there needs to be a unifying vision and but if 50 percent

01:38:31.240 of Albertans vote with with the level of turnout that we're seeing if 50 percent of Albertans vote

01:38:35.980 to leave tonight different conversation entirely right like now she's gonna have to defend taking

01:38:42.340 the remain side well 50 percent of the entire province votes to leave different conversation

01:38:48.240 but in terms of what the expected results are I don't know I don't know I I'd like to see them

01:38:55.740 open the constitution go ahead what are your thoughts of the angus reed poll that just got

01:39:01.320 released that was posted by jeff rass a few moments ago that uh independence has a 56

01:39:08.340 chance of of succeeding 56 chance of winning

01:39:14.020 uh i've seen main street at 66 34 ladies and gentlemen please welcome to the state

01:39:23.720 i apologize or jeff's wrong which i hate to say it but i would not be surprised

01:39:29.640 um do you think we have this in the bag he thinks we have it in the bag we'll see i mean i look and

01:39:38.960 i said this off the top like you have pollsters that are coming in at 22 vote to leave you have

01:39:44.280 pollsters coming in at 34 to leave like that's a 12 gap like it's at the point where either nobody

01:39:51.980 knows what's going on and this is completely up in the air somebody's right somebody's wrong or

01:39:57.500 you know like it's completely it's completely like it could this could go a lot of ways but

01:40:04.600 oh i don't have as much hope as jeff does i really hope that this does go the right way but uh

01:40:14.020 yeah i and it worries me it worries me because yeah if this if the threat of independence is

01:40:23.920 off the table how vulnerable are we so anyways do we have any other calls john

01:40:29.580 oh sorry so do you think do you think that this is our last chance to make a good deal with

01:40:39.860 with just save Alberta, in a sense of Canada hasn't been working closely

01:40:46.000 with the United States enough.

01:40:47.980 Canada has been dragging their feet.

01:40:50.220 Canada's been losing their sawmills and mining left, right, and center.

01:40:53.840 Do you think this is the last hope that we'd have a fair deal with the United States

01:40:58.220 until the U.S. can't take it or bear Canada's decisions anymore to annex Canada?

01:41:03.980 i think that uh i think the uh price of patriotism might be high um and i said this earlier i'll just

01:41:14.940 repeat it um we there's a very good chance we vote to remain in the country and what we're

01:41:22.760 seeing out east right now is an economy that is not exactly flying on uh all-time highs uh we're

01:41:29.940 not doing fantastic uh in ontario ontario is seeing massive job losses factories closing

01:41:36.300 the the cost of the conflict with the trump administration is being born well i don't want

01:41:44.140 to call it unfairly because i think it's entirely fair that doug ford wears this

01:41:47.560 but it's being on it's being born largely by ontario uh by ontarians and let's say we vote

01:41:57.760 to stay and uh mark carney looks at donald trump and says elbows up what what's left on the table

01:42:05.600 that hasn't been thrown at him yet well it's oil and gas so yeah we vote to stay they throw an

01:42:11.300 export tariff on our oil and gas to elbows up we have downtown calgary gets hollowed out

01:42:16.880 unemployment hits the highs that we saw in 2015 16 yeah like there's legitimate fears that the

01:42:27.320 The Mark Carney we've seen over the last 12 months is, I mean,

01:42:32.380 not the real Mark Carney, but again, it's working well for him.

01:42:36.760 So why would he change? You know what I mean? So yeah.

01:42:39.860 Fair enough. Yeah. So.

01:42:42.480 Well, I just want to say thank you for your time. Great chat,

01:42:45.240 chatting with you and I support Western standard and Derek,

01:42:48.540 build the breath and all you guys. And I've, uh, I've,

01:42:51.420 I've met you personally a couple of times at, uh,

01:42:54.040 keenan bexby's event in at the stampede okay yep i don't know if you follow me or

01:42:59.240 yeah so my name is uh once again it's manny ball and i just want to oh manny yeah yeah yeah yeah

01:43:05.000 well thank you so much for calling um yeah no i have met you uh yeah so i appreciate taking time

01:43:11.660 that is mandy ball he is one of the most active voices uh yeah we can move on um yeah that is

01:43:18.400 mandy ball he is one of the most active voices in the united conservative party excellent questions

01:43:23.500 excellent conversation if you want to join the conversation call us now toll free 866-479-9378

01:43:30.440 extension 711 we're maintaining uh oh wow we got another one already uh go ahead

01:43:36.400 at some point i'm gonna need a break but we'll you know this is kind of fun uh can you hear me

01:43:42.020 hello can you hear me i can hear you good you're on the air what's your name

01:43:47.300 my name is trey from ontario well hi trey what do you what's on your mind

01:43:55.620 what's on my mind is we need this referendum to happen i want alberta to light a fire under

01:44:04.280 ottawa i've worked in the oil sector for suncor and an unnamed company i don't want a name because

01:44:10.540 I'm still working there right now, but I've been a part of the oil industry now

01:44:17.380 for more than 20 years, and I sympathize for Alberta.

01:44:21.400 And from what I can see, the way this country is going right now, I need change.

01:44:28.840 I want to see change so badly as a Canadian, and if it means Alberta is going to leave

01:44:33.480 or can leave, then that's what needs to happen because this country needs to change

01:44:38.600 needs to change for the better and it's the only way to light a fire under ottawa i agree i agree

01:44:44.120 and and again even out here like yeah there's all there's the hardened independent supporters that

01:44:51.960 i mean the premier well stephen harper said that it was zero percent of him when he was prime

01:44:56.520 minister i don't think that's ever the case i think there's always a latent 15 to 20 percent

01:45:01.560 of albertans that just hate canada and are ready to leave uh most of them congregated around the

01:45:07.320 the u.s border but i the country is in such a dire strait like alberta's economy is great

01:45:16.440 you know we're doing fantastic despite the warnings of the calgary chamber of commerce

01:45:21.220 uh which repeatedly over the last three years said that if we brought in the sovereignty act

01:45:25.560 or even had a referendum on independence our economy would go they've been wrong um but

01:45:32.760 yeah we've we've led the country in economic growth we've led the country in uh job growth

01:45:38.680 we've led the country in almost every measurable economic statistic over the last five years like

01:45:46.380 the rest of the country we are paying the freight uh we pay again 15 of all federal taxes yeah the

01:45:58.060 rest of the country i hope this is a wake-up call but what scares me is the result like the reaction

01:46:04.760 if we vote to remain and again the polls indicate that is going in the case but

01:46:11.060 just the rest of the country tomorrow morning wake up and say well alberta voted to stay

01:46:17.560 i guess they're good you know pat us i'm glad we went over that you know like you guys are good

01:46:23.680 right and just and it's just the same old same old that's what concerns me that's what i'm afraid

01:46:29.140 of and that's probably what's gonna happen as sad as that is to say and i don't mean to be a

01:46:36.840 doomsayer but how often do the people of ontario think about alberta i don't think they hate us i

01:46:42.860 just don't think they think about us i mean you watch sports now exactly yeah i mean like i they

01:46:47.820 don't think it's toronto toronto rogers shut down fan 960 and 660 so our sports radio station and

01:46:57.060 our actual news or no 660 was it 660 john i can't remember anyways the shutdown thing is that our

01:47:05.160 news stations two days after they exercised the option to purchase the toronto maple leafs and

01:47:10.740 then oh it is that is the way the country views us they don't give it they don't care they don't

01:47:16.300 look you have to you have to work in the oil sector or the energy sector as an ontarian to

01:47:24.320 understand what alberta means and what they're going through and the the unfortunate part is

01:47:29.640 that most people here don't and that's why they don't think about it and i i see it with my own

01:47:34.040 eyes i do my best to educate but i it's unfortunate that that's just the way it is well most and most

01:47:41.280 sorry i didn't mean to cut you off but most torontonians

01:47:44.620 they view anything outside of the gta as part of the environment like that's the green ones

01:47:52.260 and i think that was the frustrating part during like the early trudeau years is is you felt it

01:47:58.420 you know we felt it out here like we that disdain that center of the universe mentality like

01:48:04.440 our our unemployment rate's the highest in the country they don't care they don't care they got

01:48:10.320 you know more important things to worry about like the toronto maple leafs uh planning their

01:48:16.260 parade route in october and then well they never win the cup so yeah i mean they don't care i don't

01:48:25.240 really know what to say to that other than i don't i'd like i i think you're right the only way that

01:48:31.820 not talk about the leaves go ahead but i do think it's our year

01:48:38.300 like i would say honestly like i was it was it's refreshing to see the channel here because honestly

01:48:46.460 i was trying to watch the the referendum like uh poll numbers and cbc ctv all everything that's

01:48:53.580 bought by the liberal government is showing nothing i'm seeing zero votes one way or the

01:48:58.380 other you put the map and all i want to start and all i do want to all i want to see are the numbers

01:49:04.140 right and and i can't see them so i'm like are they suppressing the numbers because me i thought

01:49:08.700 maybe it's going in it's going in favor of alberta okay it looks like we don't know i don't trust

01:49:13.420 the government i i think where are you getting those ones elections alberta sorry uh cbc cbc

01:49:22.060 no i'm talking internally i'm doing two different things at once i apologize uh let's see unofficial

01:49:28.880 referendum results yeah i know i was on i was just on cbc the the tv channel oh we do have

01:49:36.920 1 000 uh reporting voting areas 10 of total votes counted option one currently

01:49:46.840 oh did we drop the call uh all right so we do have uh okay i am gonna have to let you go we

01:49:54.740 do have some results to report uh thank you very much for the call we're gonna pause this uh

01:50:01.060 just for a second uh we do have some results to report referendum results question number 10

01:50:07.820 should alberta remain a province of canada or should the government of alberta commence the

01:50:11.760 legal process required under the canadian constitution to hold a binding referendum

01:50:15.920 on whether or not alberta should separate from canada yes that is a mouthful option one alberta

01:50:21.460 should remain a province of canada 766 point uh 766 489 option number two uh to hold the

01:50:31.900 referendum uh 233 891 uh we just had another thousand come in so yeah we are at about 76

01:50:39.760 23 uh right off the gate here um it appears though that uh 70.62 percent of the advanced

01:50:50.180 voting is counted uh so uh that is uh you know what i thought that was going to be a little bit

01:50:58.000 higher on the uh independent side or sorry a little bit higher on the remain side so uh if

01:51:04.300 That's 70% of the advanced polling.

01:51:07.640 So that's 1.44 million valid votes have been counted so far.

01:51:12.080 Of the election day votes, 206,500, which is only 10.5%.

01:51:18.180 So I do want to proceed with a bit of caution here.

01:51:20.840 The numbers are coming in.

01:51:23.940 Mobile ballots, we have 24,009 that are valid.

01:51:28.520 uh and uh 1.18 of those i don't think that's going to really change the uh number and then

01:51:37.380 special ballot we've got 17 but again these numbers not the end of the world considering

01:51:43.060 that the advanced voting uh started like that count started at five o'clock so those numbers

01:51:47.380 are coming in right now um we do have some results on i'm going to refresh this really quick here

01:51:56.780 okay question one um do you support the alberta government taking increased control over

01:52:07.820 immigration for the purposes of decreasing immigration to more sustainable blah blah

01:52:11.720 uh yes is at 220 000 to 168 question number two yes appears to be winning this one is

01:52:20.200 should the government of alberta introduce a law mandating that only canadian citizens

01:52:24.320 permanent residents and individuals with an alberta approved immigration status will be

01:52:28.420 eligible for provincially funded programs such as health care education social services yes is at

01:52:33.260 132 000 no is at 108 000 that's another yes win question number three assuming that all canadians

01:52:40.560 and permanent residents continue to qualify for social blah blah blah do you support the alberta

01:52:46.160 government introducing a law requiring all individuals with a non-permanent legal immigration

01:52:50.420 status to resign in alberta for at least 12 months before qualifying for any provincially funded

01:52:55.380 social support programs that is in 68 000 to 54 000 in favor of yes so that is uh again we are

01:53:03.660 moving in the right direction in terms of yes votes question number four we have them on the

01:53:07.920 screen now so i uh you know what i'm on a roll assuming that all canadian citizens and permanent

01:53:13.580 residents continue to qualify for public health care and education as they do now do you support

01:53:18.060 the government of alberta charging a reasonable fee or premium to individuals with a non-permanent

01:53:22.640 immigration status living in alberta for their or their family's use of health care and education

01:53:27.220 system guy can we make these questions shorter next time uh we're 36 000 yes 33 000 no uh question

01:53:35.320 five here's a short haul look at that i can take i feel like i can take a break before i read this

01:53:40.200 do you support the government of alberta requiring a law or introducing a law requiring individuals

01:53:47.120 to provide proof of citizenship or such as a passport, birth certificate or citizenship card

01:53:51.780 to vote in a provincial election.

01:53:53.780 16,000 to 11,000 in favor of yes.

01:53:57.180 Now we have some no votes coming in.

01:54:03.420 Ooh, okay.

01:54:05.520 This is not good.

01:54:08.580 Do you support the government of Alberta working with the governments of other provinces

01:54:13.240 to amend the Canadian Constitution to provincial governments

01:54:16.140 and not the federal government's selected justices

01:54:18.460 appointed to provincial kings, bench, and appeal courts?

01:54:22.080 12,000 to 17,000.

01:54:23.760 Again, I'm throwing my hands up here because this is early.

01:54:27.320 70% of advance and mail-in ballots have been counted,

01:54:30.780 only about 10% of the election day,

01:54:34.280 but that is a 5,000 vote spread.

01:54:37.360 Question number seven, do you support the government of Alberta

01:54:39.440 working with other governments of other ruling provinces

01:54:41.940 to amend the Canadian Constitution to abolish the unelected federal Senate?

01:54:46.560 20,493 to 21,934.

01:54:51.400 Do you support the government of Alberta working with the governments

01:54:53.760 of other willing provinces to amend the Canadian Constitution

01:54:55.760 to allow provinces to opt out of federal programs that intrude

01:54:59.100 on federal jurisdictions such as health care, education, and social services

01:55:02.040 without a province losing any of the associated federal funding

01:55:05.340 for use in its social programs?

01:55:07.220 24,917 to 35,265.

01:55:11.480 And then finally, question nine. Do you support the government of Alberta working with the other governments of other willing provinces to amend the Canadian Constitution to better protect provincial rights from federal interference by giving a province's laws dealing with provincial or shared areas of constitution jurisdiction priority of federal laws with the province's laws as a federal law's conflict?

01:55:30.260 uh 33 000 to 41.6 000 so yeah again 70 percent of advanced polls are in and only 10.6 percent

01:55:43.420 of election day polls so we expect those numbers to change as we go um yeah i guess uh initial

01:55:54.540 reactions constitutional questions are not doing great um i mean

01:56:03.100 the opt-out thing i think was not explained very well uh

01:56:10.700 yeah i guess we're stuck with the fiscal imbalances uh for the time being so every

01:56:19.000 time you pay your federal taxes keep in mind that uh you voted or not you but uh lots of people

01:56:26.720 voted for that again early on in the results uh we will keep an eye on that as we move forward

01:56:34.300 to see if the gap widens or closes as the numbers come in um we so i can go through these numbers

01:56:45.300 right now it looks like calgary uh less polling stations are in calgary curry it looks like about

01:56:51.600 half of them are in um edmonton slow on the draw uh yeah erdy cochran's in

01:57:01.180 uh 34 of 92 so the rural ridings are coming in now

01:57:06.520 yeah uh highwood zero so far interesting i wonder if they stayed open late

01:57:15.300 option two i'm just going through the list of ridings right now to see if any of the provincial

01:57:28.900 ridings are leaning to the leave side it appears nothing yet but again this is advanced so uh it's

01:57:40.440 Still early in the night, we won't have final numbers.

01:57:42.840 You know what?

01:57:43.640 It is nice that the advance polls are in early

01:57:47.260 because we don't have to worry about the middle of the night shocker.

01:57:55.480 So, yeah.

01:57:59.620 What else have we got here?

01:58:03.820 I guess the phone lines are open.

01:58:07.660 If you want to call in, call in.

01:58:17.000 Oh, what's that in the corner?

01:58:18.840 Grand Prairie with Petey.

01:58:20.520 Wapiti.

01:58:23.940 We've got...

01:58:32.600 Yeah, but there's only three out of 81 reporting there.

01:58:35.280 So, we'll see.

01:58:40.440 3% reporting.

01:58:42.200 So, 70.

01:58:46.080 Looks like we've got La Glace.

01:58:49.940 I don't know how to pronounce that.

01:58:51.460 Community library.

01:58:52.940 So, that looks like one polling station reporting there.

01:59:02.640 Calgary Edgemont.

01:59:05.280 I clicked the wrong thing.

01:59:10.520 Oh, we got a call.

01:59:14.260 Can you hear me?

01:59:19.540 Hello?

01:59:21.640 We got dead air.

01:59:30.520 Oh, hello?

01:59:31.340 Oh, sorry.

01:59:34.480 We lost that call.

01:59:38.300 Okay.

01:59:39.180 I keep going to the wrong website here.

01:59:41.740 We're up to 11.7.

01:59:45.300 I am going to throw this into Excel and get percentages as we go.

01:59:56.000 So right now we are at 76 to 24, or 23.5.

02:00:00.620 It's moving marginally.

02:00:02.440 We're marginally increasing on the number of total votes reported

02:00:07.740 from the various voting areas and polling locations.

02:00:15.280 Still at about that.

02:00:18.840 Calgary, Acadia is in.

02:00:20.800 Only three.

02:00:23.600 Calgary, Curry again.

02:00:25.180 It's still 9,600 to 2,286.

02:00:29.300 calgary klein uh 15 000 to 2843 calgary varsity has not reported a single poll but calgary west

02:00:41.180 is in 18 000 to 4000 uh they've 30 out of 54 polls reporting edmonton beverly clairview is at one

02:00:50.240 um so we will be sifting through this data as the evening goes on

02:00:58.040 erdry cochran 34 of 92 in 14 9 to 7 900 so erdry cochran currently is at

02:01:12.020 i should have made an excel document before i did this 65 35 and erdry cochran so that's uh

02:01:20.600 65 in favor of Remain, Airdrie East, 31 of 73 reporting.

02:01:28.500 We've got, what's the percentage on that?

02:01:34.200 Does that thing have the percentages on it?

02:01:39.240 Okay.

02:01:50.600 Can you send me the link to that?

02:01:53.960 I'm using the official results, so unless they've got different results.

02:02:00.380 There's a call in line.

02:02:01.620 Well, let's go to the airwaves and see what your initial reaction is.

02:02:07.880 Hey, what's going on, man?

02:02:10.000 How's it going?

02:02:11.500 You're on the air.

02:02:12.540 What's your name?

02:02:14.400 It's going.

02:02:14.920 hey uh i'm calling you from down in texas which is its own country basically yeah you know what i

02:02:24.120 have an american until texas secedes t-shirt and i think it's uh it's hilarious but anyways go on

02:02:32.740 as needed me too because our our our um republic and our constitution states that we can can you

02:02:42.020 know leave the union we so desire and you know you guys should do what's that you guys could

02:02:52.280 succeed alberta's got plenty of resources you guys work with us anyway all the time and get 0.95

02:03:00.820 away from carney and the bunch of radical left retards because they're fucking europe up they're 0.96

02:03:08.100 trying to screw our country up left and right thanks for the call um yeah i don't really 0.98

02:03:16.580 obviously can't respond to that uh please if you are calling in do not use profanity

02:03:21.300 do appreciate the sentiment though um

02:03:24.100 it's kind of hard to make that argument right now obviously it is still early in the count

02:03:30.860 I am just pulling out the numbers by riding as I have them.

02:03:39.600 Not great.

02:03:41.800 But again, it's only early returns.

02:03:47.480 Some of these ridings, like Edmonton, some of these ridings are 93%, 98%.

02:03:53.920 Rural's coming in.

02:03:59.060 uh central peace not lee uh right now 32 of 60 polls reporting um 52 percent uh in favor of

02:04:09.000 remain to 47 that's the highest i've seen as of right now uh drayton valley devon 44.7 percent

02:04:17.260 to 55.3 percent it's actually uh you know not a bad number

02:04:23.240 port saskatchewan grand pro i don't have the percentages in there yet still going through

02:04:30.960 the list here um oh yeah grand prairie with pd is uh only reporting three polls so that

02:04:44.780 right now it's 61.9 percent in favor of leaving

02:04:49.240 there i've got all 87 all right let's sort now

02:04:58.520 okay as of right now

02:05:04.480 oh we got a call okay uh are she hi uh

02:05:19.340 What's your name?

02:05:19.960 Hey, what's going on?

02:05:21.900 My name is Brian.

02:05:23.020 Hi, Brian.

02:05:23.820 I'm the one who was calling Texas.

02:05:26.220 Okay, I'm going to ask you once, please do not use profanity.

02:05:34.040 Okay, no problem.

02:05:35.180 so like i was saying the the um radical left and socialists in this country basically are

02:05:46.160 communists they're trying to ruin everything and i'm sure it's the same way up in canada from what

02:05:52.200 i've seen carney is carney is not a good human being he's a globalist and you guys in alberta

02:06:02.220 If you go out and go on your own, you can depend on us to free trade with you guys and it'd be like a win-win situation.

02:06:14.220 Plus, we got a crap load of F-35s, bombers, missiles, rockets to keep you guys from getting annihilated or attacked by Russia, I should say, or China. 0.93

02:06:28.020 So, yeah, I hope that 1.00

02:06:30.640 I hope it works out where you guys

02:06:32.500 Succeed

02:06:33.720 I hope the referendum works where you guys

02:06:36.820 Are, you know, on your own

02:06:38.920 Because you'll do well

02:06:40.320 Yeah, I think that we're

02:06:42.700 Well positioned here

02:06:44.160 I think the problem that we've got

02:06:46.040 Is if we're looking at these numbers

02:06:47.980 That are coming in

02:06:49.660 It's kind of hard to

02:06:52.500 And you know what

02:06:54.300 I personally

02:06:56.140 i had my concerns about voting on this particular topic from the beginning uh you know in quebec

02:07:05.580 there's regularly conversation about winning conditions and and you don't vote on it unless

02:07:12.440 you're confident you can win and i don't think there was a lot of people that was confident that

02:07:17.760 this could win and now we're in this position and again early results but i'm not shocked at this

02:07:29.580 uh i was hoping for better numbers uh in some of the other votes but again you know it's early

02:07:36.340 voting this is just the advanced polls that are coming in right now um so i thank you for your

02:07:42.780 call um appreciate it uh do we have anybody else on the line you think sorry you think it'll work

02:07:50.060 thank you you think it'll work hey you think it'll work what independence

02:07:59.240 yeah do you think that you'll succeed in being able to you know believe the um

02:08:08.740 the um grips of ottawa right now no i'm sure this is over uh referendum i mean potentially

02:08:23.540 i think the winning conditions need to be there um i am particularly concerned i've i've always

02:08:31.680 believe that in order for alberta to leave confederation we need to try to like fix the

02:08:40.320 problem and uh thank you for your call uh i hear another beep on the line um we need to try and

02:08:49.620 fix the problem and like really try and fix the problem and i'm looking at the numbers coming in

02:08:54.940 in some of the other polls and you know i'm not exactly brimming with confidence right now

02:09:00.900 that being said it is still early uh do we have another caller john yeah okay send him through

02:09:08.180 oh hello you're on the air what's your name

02:09:15.100 chris how are you i'm good uh what's on your mind

02:09:20.380 uh i live in edmonton uh and i i live in a like definitely uh a more um

02:09:29.760 uh yeah like our our our mp is a liberal like i'll put it that way yeah i totally understand

02:09:37.960 and you know i um i i volunteered for the referendum uh i bought sorry i volunteered

02:09:44.460 for petitioning i registered as a scrutineer um i was out there in march and april and like late

02:09:52.660 february getting signatures and i had to do something for my kids uh they're both they're

02:09:58.720 twins they're last year university and they're going to plant their feet in business somewhere

02:10:03.680 and uh hopefully it's alberta but if you know if this doesn't work there i just i might not

02:10:09.820 team as much, but I want them to keep as much money for our grandkids as they end up doing.

02:10:15.200 But anyway, I've done the work, been enthusiastic about the movement, been grateful, experienced

02:10:23.880 reform when I was in high school, even helped elect Hugh Hanrahan back in the day.

02:10:32.140 But that's beside the point.

02:10:33.840 I'm more curious about what you think so far.

02:10:37.040 I mean, we're looking at the big municipalities right now.

02:10:39.240 yeah i'm not really hoping for a hail mary or anything but i know that more rurally and that

02:10:45.780 people that work there can run small businesses might have a say in this thing what do you what

02:10:52.300 do you like or hate about what you're seeing so far what i'm seeing so far yeah i again the advanced

02:10:58.180 vote predictable i yeah i kind of this is the way i thought it was going to be i i had genuine hopes

02:11:06.280 that the constitutional questions and that's the one that it is still early like the numbers that

02:11:11.980 are coming in there like yeah they've counted 421,791 ballots of question one and they've only

02:11:18.920 counted 89,000 of question nine so the numbers are early um but if we come out of this with

02:11:26.980 effectively the general public has rejected

02:11:32.060 any hope that we have of a constitutional changes then yeah i don't know what what we're looking at

02:11:43.660 i mean after i i and those are the ones i'm still i still have hope for um and again like

02:11:51.460 if you get one of these questions like i mean do you like the one that's winning right now it's

02:11:58.020 it's narrow but it's winning it's do you support the alberta government working with the governments

02:12:01.960 of other provinces to amend the canadian constitution to abolish the senate i mean

02:12:06.580 the second you open the constitution the entire like you know quebec's gonna have demands like

02:12:11.480 you can't you can't open the constitution and expect only to get one tweak fix it's just not

02:12:16.740 going to work that way so i i think if if there isn't an avenue to do this that being said like

02:12:24.020 i mean yeah it's the major centers are coming in uh the advanced polls are uh driving a lot of this

02:12:32.980 early uh so i mean there's still a lot of time uh to be yeah um and i'm not approaching that

02:12:42.460 question like from a position of skepticism like i'm a perpetual optimist i mean yeah you know

02:12:48.040 that's why that's why i was getting signatures you know like back in the day like or you know

02:12:52.400 like eight months ago or whatever it was but well and you know what like i i genuinely think that

02:12:59.400 people like you are you know so valuable to everything that we do and my heart uh is with

02:13:07.360 you right now um like i i will say i've had my issues with mitch and jeff but i've always

02:13:14.740 considered the membership of the alberta prosperity project to be it's it's essential

02:13:19.280 like it that is the life of it uh you can change the leaders and they have they've i mean

02:13:24.540 uh who was it before leighton gray was the head of it before i mean dennis moldry is still there

02:13:30.860 i mean it's it's not the leadership that's what drives it uh it's always been that

02:13:37.300 i've gotten to know so many people that have been involved in that over the years and

02:13:43.200 you know what they are true salt of the earth people and uh we're gonna have to have some

02:13:49.200 conversations about what happened and uh yeah but i don't want no matter what they're moving forward

02:13:58.460 No matter what happens tonight, good or bad, just moving forward, how do we keep this momentum going, frankly?

02:14:08.560 Because I think that there's far more people that just want a better life for all of us.

02:14:17.480 Like, whether it be the, you know, like the Hockey Night in Canada and Mr. Dressup, that doesn't exist anymore.

02:14:24.940 Or like, you know, just having Alberta get a bigger sale and, you know, like our outcomes.

02:14:32.920 But at the end of the day, you know, you can't take for granted whatever we say.

02:14:39.380 And, you know, we've gotten to the point, you know, post-COVID where we don't trust politicians anymore.

02:14:44.880 And, you know, the number 10 could get, you know, 50 plus 1%.

02:14:51.660 But if questions 1 through 9 or any one of those singular questions get, you know, like over that amount, it's easy for the government to say, well, we got more Albertans saying they want us to fix this.

02:15:04.500 So we're going to not worry about that.

02:15:07.280 Yeah.

02:15:07.840 If you follow my line of reasoning, I'll leave you to it.

02:15:10.260 I mean, it's going to be, it's, if this is, and again, it's, it's, it's early in the reporting.

02:15:15.640 Um, I don't know if anybody's called it.

02:15:17.420 I'm assuming someone's probably called the, uh, independence question by now.

02:15:21.440 Uh, CBC news, Alberta referendum.

02:15:27.620 If questions, and I'm going to pull up the numbers here.

02:15:32.260 So I've got them.

02:15:33.200 if questions six through nine

02:15:39.420 lose,

02:15:43.060 I don't think there's any way we come out of here calling this anything less

02:15:47.880 than an unmitigated disaster for the movement.

02:15:51.400 Yeah.

02:15:53.880 I think that,

02:15:56.060 I think that,

02:15:58.580 I think that 322 signatures,

02:16:01.840 is enough to call it a movement

02:16:04.900 because they weren't gathered easily.

02:16:06.800 This wasn't a polling station.

02:16:08.180 Oh, 100%.

02:16:09.320 And doing work in the freezing cold

02:16:11.420 and you can't dismiss that kind of enthusiasm.

02:16:14.240 I'm not dismissing that on behalf.

02:16:16.540 I wasn't doing it for nothing.

02:16:18.260 Yep.

02:16:18.700 And I feel like, you know,

02:16:23.600 like you build a building brick by brick.

02:16:27.960 Let me rephrase the way I said that.

02:16:30.000 I apologize.

02:16:30.360 Because what I was meaning was if these questions fail, it's an unmitigated disaster for Alberta Premier Daniel Smith.

02:16:39.300 Oh, sure.

02:16:41.460 Yeah, it's nothing to do with the volunteers or the people that went out and collected the signatures.

02:16:49.680 It was a monumental task to do what you did to get to this point.

02:16:55.200 And again, yeah, it's still early.

02:16:57.460 The numbers coming in, it's pretty overwhelmingly.

02:17:00.360 yeah uh it's you know yeah like it's never me it's what we and even for me i say they did like

02:17:09.860 i you know i put in a few hours a week yeah that's nothing i mean there's a lot a lot of other people

02:17:15.140 that did more and it's not about who did what and that's the great thing about this movement is that

02:17:19.860 like nobody cares uh we all just know that we align in a belief that we want something better

02:17:25.740 for not just us but more importantly for our our kids and uh yeah like uh i'm cheering for it and

02:17:34.780 i'm i'm not going to be deterred by any results i'll tell you that much no and i'm looking forward

02:17:39.580 to cory uh cory will be on at 6 a.m uh this morning so i i'm very much it's not

02:17:47.900 But it's from the position of the Alberta government

02:17:52.900 who effectively put this entire process into play,

02:17:59.060 then campaigned against the question and is now seeing,

02:18:05.500 yeah, like the other questions are doing better,

02:18:08.240 but they're still losing.

02:18:10.080 Although it looks like the gap is narrowing.

02:18:12.360 So, like, safety hatches for, like, the nine questions are a safety hatch for the premier, like, in fairness.

02:18:19.700 Yeah, like, she needed to win.

02:18:21.220 She'll win the immigration ones. 0.71

02:18:22.500 You get, if you got 50 plus 1% on question 10, like, option two, but then you got 60 on, you know, any of the other nine questions, then you say, I have a mandate from Nell Burns to pursue the results of question six. 0.97

02:18:40.920 You know what I mean?

02:18:41.580 it's like the perfect political escape escape hatch and in alberta the one thing i think

02:18:47.080 historically we don't like are shifty politicians and this whole charade to you know like to be

02:18:54.200 fair like doesn't sound terrible um you know it seems like uh carefully constructed because

02:19:01.600 nobody no citizen-led petitions that exceeded the quota had their questions asked and that's

02:19:09.240 important to note that is also important to note um the premier has been unequivocal that she will

02:19:15.260 not do this again but i don't know how people are going to wake up and feel tomorrow morning

02:19:20.640 i mean 24 of the electorate that votes in favor of this is still a substantial chunk of the ucp

02:19:28.300 voter base and the question then becomes like how do you how do you put the you know the lid back on

02:19:35.860 this now i mean i sat like yeah and i mean like i'm sure you know the number of attacks inside

02:19:41.960 the movement that you had from people that you thought were you know your friends that are

02:19:46.960 calling you a traitor or uh you know i don't even know what the worst was insignificant these are

02:19:52.860 internal attacks like for me the the you know you said the lid like to me the lid was when when

02:19:58.920 guys came out you know and it was cold and like you know fathers brought their sons and mothers

02:20:04.360 brought their daughters and they're like yeah we want a better life they're like guys that are

02:20:08.920 first generation canadians like me you know like uh came with their kids and they're like yeah we

02:20:14.920 uh you know like we we want something better like we came we came so that you know like if

02:20:21.400 if i worked my son my son might not have to work as hard that kind of thing and you know what like

02:20:25.720 for me i'm not stopping no i agree and i think that was from my opinion it could be 20 it could

02:20:32.280 be whatever like the point is that there's there's enough of us out there but there was a group of

02:20:38.120 people that stopped campaigning and started pointing a gun at the premier during this process

02:20:44.440 and like proverbial oh yeah that that aggravated me i mean i get the frustration i totally

02:20:54.200 understand why people are mad like and and you know looking at the nine i mean we're getting

02:20:59.640 oh i think we got a something something switched like it's just yeah i don't know how in my opinion

02:21:08.120 and it's solely my opinion but the nines of distraction like like in my opinion right and

02:21:15.000 you know we don't have to agree and we don't have to debate but you know for me that's what that is

02:21:19.720 but um i think for a lot of people it was almost like a people showed up to vote for option one

02:21:26.600 And I think morale was down, too.

02:21:34.220 It's...

02:21:34.780 I mean, how much can you take?

02:21:36.160 In the world today, we only have so much bandwidth, right?

02:21:38.860 Yeah.

02:21:40.520 And the Forever Canada did not have to report.

02:21:42.920 It's a good way to, you know...

02:21:44.900 I mean, I'd like a full investigation there.

02:21:48.100 We could talk all day about that.

02:21:50.280 We could talk all day about Thomas.

02:21:52.960 I don't want to hog your airwaves, my friend.

02:21:54.760 Yeah. So anyways, yeah, on that note, I do appreciate the call and thank you so much.

02:22:00.060 No, and I appreciate the amount of time that you give me. And, uh, and you know what, um,

02:22:04.460 thumbs up for everybody that went out there and, uh, did their best and you know what, um,

02:22:11.020 you know, not, not too many jobs that are worthwhile or ever really finished. So let's

02:22:14.860 get after it. Agreed. All right. Well, thank you very much for the call. Um,

02:22:19.500 have a good night sir you too thank you uh so uh i am going to give a quick update on the results

02:22:26.220 uh overall uh option one question 10 we are at 810,739 76.2 percent in favor of remaining in

02:22:39.640 canada and 252,603 in favor of independence roughly in line with what the polls are saying

02:22:48.820 I am seeing a slight uptick as more come in on the leave side, but it is very marginal.

02:22:55.980 We're talking about 0.2%.

02:22:58.180 So whether or not that, you know, some of the numbers come in that dramatically change it, it remains to be seen.

02:23:07.660 And question number one on the referendum ballot, 433 total ballots have been counted compared to 1,663,342.

02:23:21.640 57% of voters or 248,006 believe that the Alberta government should take increased control over immigration for the purposes of decreasing immigration levels.

02:23:36.700 So that is good news there. 0.99

02:23:39.640 Question number two.

02:23:41.260 Do you support the government of Alberta introducing a law mandating that only Canadian citizens and individuals with approved immigration status, such as permanent residents, will be eligible for provincially funded programs such as health care, education and other social services?

02:23:59.960 We have 166,475 in favour.

02:24:05.160 That is 55.26% of the 301 ballots currently counted.

02:24:17.040 Again, that is lower than the 434.

02:24:19.740 Question number three.

02:24:21.220 Assuming that all Canadian citizens and permanent residents continue to qualify for social support programs as they do now,

02:24:28.900 Do you support the government of Alberta introducing a law requiring all individuals with a non-permanent legal immigration status to reside in Alberta for at least 12 months before qualifying for any provincially funded social support programs?

02:24:41.260 92,697 in favor.

02:24:47.120 69,413 opposed.

02:24:50.640 That again, we'll see a drop off as only 162,000 ballots have been counted.

02:24:55.920 57 percent are in favor of question three question four again uh this is currently yes in the lead

02:25:05.040 53,682 ballots or 52.3 percent are in favor again only 102,596 ballots have been counted

02:25:16.500 this number will continue to go down although interestingly question nine has more ballots

02:25:21.240 counted in question six.

02:25:25.600 I thought that was going to be sequential. Actually, no, that would make sense if

02:25:28.400 some are finished. But actually, no. I don't know.

02:25:33.220 Anyways, question six. 44,457

02:25:37.680 ballots have been counted. 19,242 are in favor.

02:25:41.280 25,215 against. That is

02:25:44.580 56.7% against on question six. Do you support the

02:25:49.300 government of alberta working with the governments of other provinces to amend the canadian

02:25:52.860 constitution to have provincial governments and not the federal government selected justices

02:25:57.860 appointed to the provincial king's bench and appeals courts um question number nine is uh do

02:26:05.480 you think that the government of alberta should open the constitution to abolish the senate 28

02:26:09.760 9,141 for 27,772 against that's 50.3% against I mean this one like this is mind-boggling because

02:26:20.420 the equalization referendum that we had five years ago got 62% voting in favor of removing

02:26:27.060 the principle of equalization from the constitution and yet five years later in six months of or a

02:26:33.580 year of mark carney promising us the moon and not building anything we're at 50 like 50 percent on

02:26:40.520 the senate 56 percent against on um provincial court justices uh things could change uh question

02:26:50.800 number eight do you support the government of alberta working with the governments of other

02:26:53.900 willing provinces to amend the canadian constitution to allow provinces to opt out of

02:26:57.540 federal programs that intrude on provincial jurisdictions such as health care education

02:27:02.420 and social services without losing any of the associated federal funding

02:27:05.740 for use in its social programs.

02:27:08.240 Only 70,000 ballots are counted in this one.

02:27:12.060 Sorry.

02:27:13.760 That is 30,000 to 30 to 40,000 roughly.

02:27:18.780 So let me do a quick math check on this one.

02:27:24.960 That is 53% in favor.

02:27:28.980 and

02:27:30.960 something's wrong with my numbers here.

02:27:36.100 53

02:27:36.660 no, that's wrong.

02:27:38.960 Oh, I know why.

02:27:41.260 I did that completely wrong.

02:27:44.100 30,381.4

02:27:47.400 and

02:27:49.940 43%

02:27:58.960 uh to 57 and we'll keep that in again these ballots uh the down ballot i'm not as concerned

02:28:08.120 about it is early uh some of these are only at 56 000 whereas over a million independence questions

02:28:14.300 uh question 10 has been counted so these are still going to come in relatively fast and furious and

02:28:22.540 Finally, question nine, should we amend the Constitution to better protect provincial rights from federal interference by giving a province's laws dealing with provincial or shared areas of constitutional jurisdiction priority over federal laws when the province's laws and federal laws conflict?

02:28:45.700 44,335 for, 50,000 against.

02:28:49.300 Again, only 95,000 ballots are counted.

02:28:51.660 So if you factor in, yeah, it's still remarkably early in the day to be too heavily focused on the down ballot questions, especially all questions from like four down are less than 10% of the major questions.

02:29:20.740 So, but the big one, independence, 810,739 to 252,603.

02:29:27.800 That is 76.2% to 23.8.

02:29:34.240 I mean, I could keep repeating the numbers.

02:29:36.500 They're probably, they're getting a little better, but we might get to 24% in the next 20 minutes here.

02:29:48.400 Optimism.

02:29:50.740 i think actually like someone asked me if i was going to run i think physically being here and

02:29:58.480 being like somewhat dismayed by the results has actually got me permanently disqualified from

02:30:05.100 seeking a nomination in the united conservative party genuinely believe that like that is kind

02:30:10.800 of where i'm at with this entire thing like jason kenny i was uh actually i should get jackson's not

02:30:17.540 here jackson has the videos uh he's one of our reporters jackson lloyd uh after the debate at

02:30:23.860 the canada strong and free networking conference between us uh bruce party uh our publisher

02:30:31.420 president and ceo derrick fildebrandt and um uh jason kenny was on the other side and uh elana

02:30:40.020 lane i don't know how to pronounce her first name uh harper she's the candidate in calgary

02:30:43.860 confederation for the conservative party of canada uh i got a chance to show up at the scrum

02:30:50.620 uh he was uh doing a scrum and uh jason kenny has been probably the loudest proponent of alberta

02:31:00.140 independence the most condescending uh or sorry the loudest proponent of remaining in canada

02:31:04.580 probably the most condescending proponent of remaining in canada

02:31:07.740 uh he has been on the record stating that if you support option two you should be kicked or if you

02:31:15.320 support independence you should be kicked out of the party now he does not define what independent

02:31:20.600 supporter is i mean if you vote like me for option two today and it doesn't matter why you vote for

02:31:26.200 does that make you disqualified from holding a membership in the united conservative party

02:31:30.860 i don't know that wasn't defined but i asked him two questions the first of which uh and as we're

02:31:37.860 aware kenny has been on stage with uh liberal mp cory hogan uh he's been on stage with uh

02:31:46.380 ndp premier former ndp premier rachel notley i asked him first i said uh number one uh if

02:31:55.940 uh what do you say to conservatives that believe that you sharing a stage with former ndp rachel

02:32:05.660 notley disqualifies you from preaching about conservative values i phrased it a little bit

02:32:11.100 more journalistic-y but that was the gist of my question he said the separatists made me do it

02:32:16.520 uh so like really i mean yeah throw your entire philosophy out the window but the question i ask

02:32:22.460 that I think is going to be on my mind

02:32:24.360 the most heading into tomorrow.

02:32:27.220 Presumably, I think, I mean,

02:32:28.940 I've not gotten permission to call it.

02:32:31.800 I'm still waiting for that.

02:32:34.400 I think it's still too early.

02:32:37.360 But if Jason Kenney's position

02:32:43.740 that we should kick all the independent supporters

02:32:47.000 out of the United Conservative Party

02:32:48.840 is the primary motivation of the board and membership

02:32:53.840 of the United Conservative Party moving forward,

02:32:56.440 will that not contribute to a vote split

02:32:59.500 that will put the NDP in power?

02:33:04.280 Oh, we got a Comrade Casper.

02:33:07.700 Look at that.

02:33:10.820 Yeah, literal communist in my chat.

02:33:18.840 Anyways, I mean, yeah, like, he just had nothing.

02:33:24.220 Like, he, yeah, I, if that's what happens.

02:33:31.160 But, yeah, I do genuinely think that everybody that supported Option 2

02:33:37.640 will inevitably be headhunted by the powers that be.

02:33:45.460 Prove me wrong.

02:33:46.580 okay i don't want to go through the results again do we have a commercial or something we can go to

02:33:52.300 i've been on the air for like an hour and a half take a break all right uh did you actually finish

02:33:57.560 that commercial oh never mind uh all right uh let's put up uh we've got some explainers uh here

02:34:05.760 uh let's go to uh our uh alberta legislature correspondent will vassar uh put together a

02:34:14.300 series of explainers on the referendum and we'll go through them and just kind of run the first one

02:34:21.740 i guess let's start with the first referendum question which will ask albertans do you support

02:34:29.580 the government of alberta taking increased control over immigration for the purpose of decreasing

02:34:34.940 immigration to more sustainable levels prioritizing economic migration and giving

02:34:41.260 Albertans first priority on new employment opportunities what all does

02:34:45.700 that mean so let's break it down first taking more control over immigration right

02:34:52.840 now immigration is a shared responsibility between the federal and

02:34:57.100 provincial governments the federal government has most of the say they set

02:35:01.020 the levels and ultimately make the decisions on immigration but the

02:35:04.780 provincial government has a certain number of we're called provincial

02:35:08.260 nominees that they can nominate people to receive permanent residency based on economics

02:35:14.260 and the needs of their province.

02:35:16.760 So the government of Alberta wants more control.

02:35:19.780 They want more say over who gets to come into Alberta because they believe the Alberta

02:35:25.640 government knows best and they want to prioritize economic migrants because for a long time

02:35:31.800 under Prime Minister Justin Trudeau there was a shift away from economic migrants and

02:35:36.260 more towards temporary residents and students and asylum seekers they want to prioritize economic

02:35:43.220 migrants and they want to get immigration to a more sustainable level the numbers flared up under

02:35:50.580 former prime minister justin trudeau and the government argues that it burdens social services

02:35:55.060 here in alberta and there needs to be a stabling not only now but in the future so that's why they

02:36:01.060 They want to take control as well.

02:36:03.020 And then giving Albertans the first crack at jobs.

02:36:05.520 They believe that Albertans deserve to have the first opportunity.

02:36:10.980 There's a lot of temporary residents and immigrants who are taking the entry-level jobs they feel, 0.92

02:36:18.240 and they believe that Albertans should have the first crack at those. 0.99

02:36:31.060 Thank you.

02:37:01.060 The government of Alberta introducing a law mandating that only Canadian citizens, permanent

02:37:20.300 residents and individuals with an Alberta approved immigrant status will be eligible

02:37:25.040 for provincially funded programs such as health care, education and social services.

02:37:30.740 What does this all mean?

02:37:32.100 Well, currently temporary residents in Alberta are eligible for healthcare, enrolling their

02:37:37.820 children in Alberta's Public Education System , the Alberta Child and Family

02:37:44.500 Benefits Program, the Alberta Child Health Care Subsidy, Student Aid, and other similar

02:37:51.780 programs.

02:37:52.780 And the UCP estimates that this costs the province over $1 billion annually to provide these

02:37:58.440 services to temporary residents. Well, this all goes back to the mass migration that the UCP

02:38:05.020 is bringing up under former Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. When the government announced

02:38:10.160 the referendum in February, a large part of it went to the provincial debt. They argued that

02:38:16.160 the mass migration burdened the social services and the public services here in Alberta to the

02:38:22.180 point where the province couldn't keep up. And so the argument here is that these provincially

02:38:27.700 funded services are only going to be available to permanent residents and Canadian citizens who

02:38:32.920 have made commitments to being here in Canada long term, as well as individuals with Alberta

02:38:37.260 approved immigrant status. Now, the definition of that is not known right now. The government

02:38:42.180 has said they'll create that after the referendum, after they get the mandate. Basically, they're

02:38:47.880 going to make it so that temporary residents no longer qualify for these things automatically.

02:38:52.320 And subsequent questions will introduce ideas of fees.

02:38:57.700 Thank you.

02:39:27.680 that all Canadian citizens and permanent residents

02:39:30.440 continue to qualify for social support programs

02:39:33.440 as they do now.

02:39:35.200 Do you support the government of Alberta

02:39:36.840 introducing a law requiring all individuals

02:39:39.680 with a non-permanent legal immigration status

02:39:42.720 to reside in Alberta for at least 12 months

02:39:45.400 before qualifying for any provincially funded

02:39:48.120 social support programs?

02:39:50.040 First off, we'll start with the 12 months

02:39:52.880 is a number that the government's throwing out there.

02:39:55.600 They said that they'll work out what the actual time requirement is after the referendum, but they're saying at least 12 months.

02:40:03.600 And now to understand this question, you need to look at it as a follow-up to question two.

02:40:10.780 With question three, if the second referendum question passes, only Alberta-approved immigrant status,

02:40:18.140 temporary residents would qualify for the social support programs after the 12-month period.

02:40:24.000 other individuals without Alberta approved immigrant status would not qualify no matter

02:40:31.280 how long they've lived in the province if Albertans vote no to question two then question

02:40:37.780 three applies to every single temporary resident in Alberta regardless of if you have Alberta

02:40:43.880 approved immigrant status or not and the reasoning for this is because currently temporary residents

02:40:50.140 qualify for Alberta Child and Family Benefits, Alberta Child Care Subsidies, Student Aid,

02:40:55.920 and other similar programs. And the government estimates that Child Care Subsidies and the

02:41:01.040 Alberta Child and Family Benefits cost the province at least $100 million annually to

02:41:06.780 temporary residents. And so they want to get rid of that or help reduce it by requiring that

02:41:14.560 residents live in Alberta for at least 12 months,

02:41:17.260 meaning that they have paid into the tax system

02:41:21.160 from which these services are provided.

02:41:44.560 Thank you.

02:42:14.560 Thank you.

02:42:44.560 Thank you.

02:43:14.560 Thank you.

02:43:44.560 Thank you.

02:44:14.560 Thank you.

02:44:44.560 Thank you.

02:45:14.560 Thank you.

02:45:44.560 Thank you.

02:46:14.560 Thank you.

02:46:44.560 Thank you.

02:47:14.560 Thank you.

02:47:44.560 Thank you.

02:48:14.560 Thank you.

02:48:44.560 Thank you.

02:49:14.560 Thank you.

02:49:44.560 Thank you.

02:50:14.560 ...of CFSM 2026 here in Calgary.

02:50:19.080 This is called the Sovereignty Vote and the Path Forward.

02:50:22.380 You'll be hearing from four of the most eloquent speakers on this topic from both sides.

02:50:27.580 We are going to start, if you could please use your phones to access the QR code

02:50:34.780 and then log your vote either for or against Alberta independence.

02:50:40.300 And then at the end of the debates, we'll have you vote again

02:50:42.740 and we'll see if anybody's vote was swayed i of course am tristan hopper a reporter and columnist

02:50:48.740 with the national post and i'm not an albertan so that's why they brought me in here to moderate

02:50:53.940 this particular debate so we'll start by introducing um our panelists uh first of all

02:50:59.940 for the leave side we have bruce party he is a law professor at queen's university executive

02:51:06.180 director of wright's probe he drafted a 13 provision model constitution for an independent

02:51:12.340 alberta and he's consistently one of the handsomest advocates for alberta independence

02:51:19.620 the second handsomest advocate for alberta independence derek fildebrand president and

02:51:25.300 publisher and ceo of the western standard former wild rose and ucpl mla former alberta director

02:51:31.700 of the canadian taxpayers federation representing the remain side we have jason kenney he was

02:51:37.940 premier of alberta from 2019 to 2022 senior harper era cabinet minister and he co-chairs the business

02:51:45.380 campaign against separation with rachel notley and as part of vote to stay and elon harper

02:51:52.500 conservative party of canada nominee in calgary confederation leads the canadian corporate tax

02:51:57.460 practice at a national accounting firm so we're going to start off with our opening statements

02:52:03.780 these will be limited to four minutes and we'll be beginning with you mr party opening statement

02:52:09.060 for four minutes please this debate is not about independence independence is not on the ballot

02:52:22.820 not yet but do you know what is on the ballot the status quo

02:52:33.780 Notley, Nenshi, Kearney, Tenney, Paliyev, Harper, Smith.

02:52:49.400 That's the team.

02:52:52.480 Along with the academics, Legacy Media, CBC, Globe and Mail,

02:52:59.960 the unions the aboriginal chiefs some CEOs of some big companies this is the political

02:53:13.820 establishment they do not want you to vote for option two that's not because option two

02:53:25.280 is a threat to your interests, it's because it is a threat to theirs.

02:53:36.560 You've been promised change for decades. The firewall letter, the West wants in,

02:53:45.120 the Triple E Senate the equalization referendum Stephen Harper and Jason

02:53:53.460 Kenny had nine years what's the plan now what's the plan to fundamentally reform

02:54:05.360 the model of this country there is no plan the plan is more of the same the

02:54:14.520 plan is trust us. The plan is leave, not leave. There is no plan. I'm from Ontario. It's not my

02:54:29.040 place to tell Alberta what to do in its own referendum. But I can tell you that outside

02:54:36.400 alberta the only question that matters is question 10. option one on question 10 means

02:54:50.000 that everything is fine

02:54:54.240 alberta is happy those complaints that you may have made in the past don't worry about it it's all

02:55:04.240 good. Alberta is a resource colony of the Laurentian Empire. It always has been. The Laurentians

02:55:19.960 need your money. They do not need your votes. If you pledge to stay in Canada, your fate

02:55:33.800 is sealed your leverage is gone you will have embraced the status quo loyalty is reciprocal

02:55:44.360 if you are loyal to your country but your country disregards you and your interests

02:55:52.360 you are not a patriot. You are a patsy. On Monday, you have a chance to change the game.

02:56:07.000 Do not throw it away.

02:56:18.180 Ms. Harper, we'll have your four-minute opening statement.

02:56:21.260 Thank you.

02:56:22.360 Let me begin with something on which I suspect there is considerable agreement.

02:56:27.680 Alberta has legitimate grievances with Confederation, and Western alienation is real.

02:56:36.600 Albertans have argued with federal governments for decades about energy policy, equalization,

02:56:42.140 federal spending power, and respect for provincial jurisdictions.

02:56:47.640 Many of those concerns are well-founded.

02:56:49.940 but recognizing that there is a problem does not tell us what the solution should be.

02:56:58.260 We need to be clear between what can be changed by changing federal policy,

02:57:04.340 what Alberta can do using the powers it already has, and potentially even constitutional change

02:57:11.220 before we consider separation. When Stephen Harper became Prime Minister in 2006,

02:57:18.740 his government took a different approach to federalism greater respect for provincial

02:57:24.660 jurisdiction greater restraint in the use of the federal spending power the problems alberta faces

02:57:32.260 today are not the same as those faced 20 years ago the country the economy and the challenges

02:57:37.860 have changed but the underlying point remains the same governments matter environmental assessment

02:57:46.980 can change federal tax and regulatory policy can change the way ottawa uses its spending power

02:57:54.500 can change the previous conservative government operated precisely under precisely the same

02:58:01.460 constitution we have today but it made very different choices my friends on the other side

02:58:08.740 may say that because those choices didn't last canada can't be fixed i actually think it proves

02:58:15.780 something rather different. A different government can make different choices with different outcomes.

02:58:21.860 Additionally, Alberta has considerable room to act. The Alberta firewall proposals included a

02:58:27.940 provincial pension plan, provincial policing, provincial tax administration. One can agree

02:58:33.300 or disagree with those specific proposals, but they make an important point. There is considerable

02:58:39.460 room for provinces to assert themselves within confederation there may even be reforms that

02:58:45.940 alberta just excuse me decides they want to pursue that require constitutional change that's more

02:58:52.340 difficult but difficult is not the same as impossible so before changing the borders of

02:58:59.380 the country we should be precise about what problems we are solving for for which no other

02:59:06.580 remedy exists and which would actually require us to take the drastic step of changing our borders

02:59:15.620 and to be clear a referendum as i think bruce has said does not make alberta independent

02:59:21.700 a clear expression of support for secession on a clear question can begin the process of

02:59:27.060 negotiation but it does not determine the outcome debts assets borders indigenous and treaty rights

02:59:35.060 these terms would all have to be addressed. I want to be crystal clear today. I am not

02:59:41.620 defending the status quo. Alberta should insist on respect for provincial jurisdiction,

02:59:48.420 exercise the powers it already possesses, and make the case for reform where reform is required.

02:59:56.900 We have done so before. Alberta fought for control of its natural resources. It fought Ottawa over

03:00:03.860 energy policy western alienation produced a political movement that became the official

03:00:09.940 opposition and ultimately helped to produce a strong national government canada is not simply

03:00:19.300 a constitutional relationship and alberta has played a major role in helping to build this

03:00:26.100 country generations of albertans have built businesses raised families developed resources

03:00:30.980 that help power the canadian economy and serve this country in uniform alberta has spent a

03:00:36.580 century arguing with ottawa and i am not prepared to concede the argument yet

03:00:51.380 formatted opening statement from mr filibrand quebec's heart is for independence but her head

03:00:57.540 tells her that she must remain in Canada. Alberta's head knows that we can be independent,

03:01:03.540 but Alberta's heart is still very much Canadian. Most of you have already heard most of the economic

03:01:10.500 and fiscal and constitutional arguments for independence and so I won't dwell on them too

03:01:15.380 much here. It is in our hearts where the debate on independence hurts us the most. My earliest

03:01:22.500 ancestors in canada came here more than 300 years ago they conquered settled and built one of the

03:01:28.740 world's great nations but that nation is gone that nation is infected by a self-loathing suicidal

03:01:37.220 empathy that plagues most western nations but unlike the united states the united kingdom

03:01:43.060 france or germany there is precious little light at the end of the tunnel that gives us hope that

03:01:49.460 canada has the willpower to save itself only regionally concentrated pockets in alberta

03:01:55.140 saskatchewan quebec interior bc and rural ontario have any sense of nationhood left that they are

03:02:01.300 willing to fight for most of the rest of canada has consigned itself to die comfortably as a

03:02:08.820 globalized multicultural physical transfer zone nations are the greatest possible expression

03:02:14.660 of an extended family they have ties of kinship language faith tradition history culture and

03:02:22.420 heritage what ties do we now have left with much of the rest of canada those parts of canada that

03:02:30.820 have not already seen its population replaced have seen a critical mass of the canadian population

03:02:36.580 repudiate what makes them canadian they tear down the statues of our founding fathers they

03:02:42.420 acquiesced to the lowering of the maple leaf in self-flagellating shame for months to atone for

03:02:47.940 a genocide that we know was a hoax. They opened the floodgates of third world mass migration that 0.87

03:02:53.540 is destroying the inheritance passed on to us by our ancestors. And they call us racist when we

03:02:59.380 oppose it. They cheered the use of emergency war powers to violently and unconstitutionally crush

03:03:05.620 a peaceful protest of flag-waving Canadians, many of them Albertans, that were sick of having their

03:03:10.980 freedoms crushed on the altar of covid hysteria they were ashamed of the canadian flag until we

03:03:17.140 raised alberta's blue shield in defiance and now they have the temerity to call us unpatriotic

03:03:24.740 for wanting to save our part of canada that description of self-hating post-national

03:03:30.740 global citizens surely does not fit fairly the description describe the federalists that are in

03:03:37.220 this room or my debating partners on this stage but it does make up a very large portion of the

03:03:42.500 federalist campaign here in alberta and it makes up much of the electorate and governing class

03:03:48.020 outside of alberta and a few other like-minded pockets all that we are left with is a post

03:03:54.180 national state whose primary function is the transfer of wealth between peoples and provinces

03:04:00.180 the candidate that you love united by kinship language faith tradition history culture and

03:04:06.420 heritage is gone and if you search your hearts you will know that it is not coming back we are

03:04:16.020 trying to save our part of canada by declaring that our portion of it is proud of its inheritance

03:04:21.940 and is willing to fight to hand it to our posterity stronger than we found it

03:04:26.660 four minute opening statement from mr kenny well derek and i agree on at least one thing

03:04:39.660 which is that man liveth not by bread alone too often this debate seems to regard a country

03:04:47.020 as nothing more than a balance sheet a set of fiscal transfers when i as a canadian and a

03:04:53.900 conservative know that the first virtue as a conservative is the love of country. It is

03:04:59.460 patriotism. And that a country is so much more than simply a economic unit. It is a series of

03:05:07.640 intertwined mutual obligations and loyalties, not just to each other, but to previous and to

03:05:15.020 future generations. And I maintain that we have no right to rupture those obligations to the past

03:05:22.760 and to the future. Political theorists from the left to the right would say the only conditions

03:05:28.120 in which rupturing a country could be justified would be in serious, sustained conditions of

03:05:35.600 violent tyranny. And those who use that kind of language on the separatist side of this debate,

03:05:41.640 I think, are engaged in reckless demagoguery. And I saw my friend Ted Morton, the other Reddit

03:05:47.120 column the other day, saying that we have to vote yes to vote for option two to send a message that

03:05:52.460 won't accept how we've been treated for the last 50 years let me tell you what's happened to alberta

03:05:56.220 in the last 50 years we've gone from a population of 1.4 million to 5 million uh the vast majority

03:06:02.540 from where other canadians who joined us here making us the most canadian of provinces why

03:06:07.500 because this is the land of opportunity they wanted to join that opportunity society we've

03:06:12.220 seen our gdp grow five and a half fold in real terms from 65 to 360 billion dollars we've seen

03:06:19.260 our per capita GDP more than double in real terms. And our oil production, yes, increased from 1.3

03:06:25.420 to 5.2 million barrels a day. If that's losing, well, I'd like to see winning because it seems

03:06:33.660 to me that's enormous progress. Of course, we have legitimate grounds recently and historically

03:06:41.860 for alienation, legitimate grievances. You know what we've done about those? We didn't turn in

03:06:47.740 on ourselves and become a culture of whiners and complainers nothing could be less alberton than

03:06:52.780 that we fought for our interests we fought for federation the federation we found allies we

03:06:58.700 made our case we were persuasive and again and again we won premier brownlee won with the natural

03:07:04.460 resource transfer agreement 1933 when we ran into eastern banks for closing on our farmers alberta

03:07:12.300 had a government, Preston Manning's dad, who created our own bank. When Peter Lougheed faced

03:07:17.820 the National Energy Program, he created allies across the Federation, used our leverage in 1982,

03:07:24.940 secured Section 92 of the Constitution, exclusive provincial control over resources.

03:07:30.780 We developed our own oil sands against those who said it wasn't possible. And yes,

03:07:37.180 a Liberal government, Jean Cretchen, incented and approved those projects that led to a more

03:07:41.420 than doubling of our oil production. We wanted free trade and we helped to elect the Mulroney

03:07:45.900 government that gave it to us. Prime Minister Harper ended the Wheat Board monopoly,

03:07:51.980 appointed elected Alberta senators, eliminated the long gun registry,

03:07:55.660 brought in deregulation for major projects. When I was preparing you're dealing with the

03:08:01.580 problem of Prime Minister Trudeau, we found out allies, eight other provinces to sue the feds

03:08:07.260 over bill c69 and we won at the supreme court we won on the plastics ban and we won on the

03:08:12.860 emergencies act and now the premier is winning on the west coast pipeline the repeal of 80

03:08:18.220 of trudeau's laws uh and with we have a positive relationship with first nations in this province

03:08:24.460 that could be turned on its head and we may be two weeks away from a conservative

03:08:29.660 resource bc government that will open up new opportunities all of that is momentum instead

03:08:35.180 Instead of making the decision for a huge rupture, an enormous risk that will throw us into years of uncertainty, investor uncertainty, the outflow of capital, of people, half of Albertans who say they would leave if this province votes to separate, First Nations going from productive relationships to 40, potentially 47 Ocas across the country, I say let's lead and not lead.

03:09:05.180 this next section is our moderated exchanges this will take the form of one minute questions to

03:09:10.380 individual panelists followed by a 30-second rebuttal from the other side we will start with

03:09:15.420 mr party the supreme court says there is no unilateral right to secede if ottawa refuses

03:09:22.620 the terms of alberta independence what is the next plan one minute please the supreme court says there

03:09:30.300 is no unilateral right to secede and it also says there is no unilateral right to stop it

03:09:39.660 here's the story from the supreme court you pass a referendum on independence on a clear question

03:09:45.180 with a clear majority you then have a mandate to negotiate your departure and the government of

03:09:52.620 canada has an obligation to negotiate your departure all in good faith so the key is the

03:10:01.580 referendum now if as the question suggests the government of canada refuses to allow you to leave

03:10:12.940 that's not functioning in good faith and therefore all bets are off

03:10:19.100 and at that stage and only at that stage can you make a unilateral declaration of independence

03:10:27.920 and the 32nd rebuttal please well we would be thrown into just massive chaos and uncertainty

03:10:37.260 just one point first nations absolutely have been clear not that they will refuse to have

03:10:44.220 their counterparty in their treaties from the 1870s reassigned from Canada to Alberta.

03:10:51.760 Right now, we cannot develop our resources, our function, our economy

03:10:55.480 without the cooperation of First Nations.

03:10:58.820 And if instead we turn that into a period of extended conflict after this first vote,

03:11:05.580 it would be catastrophic for investor confidence for our economy just on that one point alone.

03:11:09.960 Mr. Phil de Brown, if the Leave side loses, 70 to 30, has not the leverage argument just been tested and failed?

03:11:21.220 One minute, please.

03:11:22.720 Well, I might surprise some in that I at least somewhat agree with statements I know my opponents here have made in the past,

03:11:31.740 that this referendum should not be used as a leverage argument.

03:11:35.400 I don't believe you.

03:11:37.340 You know, I grew up shooting from a young age.

03:11:39.540 you don't point a gun at something unless you intend to shoot it and I think that is applicable

03:11:44.220 here too and I do believe to its credit the people who put forward the referendum and the

03:11:50.320 Citizens Initiative that's why they had a clear question we don't have a clear question now

03:11:54.520 and there's reasons we got to this point if this does become a point of leverage it depends on how

03:12:02.060 we play it I think that with all due respect to the premier she made a terrible mistake in

03:12:06.560 scheduling the constitutional reform questions at the same time as an independence referendum

03:12:14.080 those should have been had right now and then an independence vote should have been scheduled

03:12:19.120 six months after give people a chance to vote on reform and put it to our other fellow canadians

03:12:24.400 to see if they pick us up on it and if not then we should have voted on it we've we've done it

03:12:28.960 pass backwards. And the 30-second rebuttal. Look, so if the vote of Alberta is that we choose to

03:12:37.740 remain, which I hope it will be, I think there's still a strong message that will have been sent

03:12:43.220 by the folks who chose to vote to leave. I think a remain vote should be understood narrowly.

03:12:51.420 Albertans will have chosen to remain in Canada, but this should not be interpreted as an endorsement

03:12:57.400 of the status quo.

03:13:01.400 This question is to no specific member of the Leave side.

03:13:06.120 Treaties 6, 7, and 8 cover nearly all of Alberta.

03:13:10.100 How would an independent Alberta deal with First Nations

03:13:13.100 who say they are staying with the Crown?

03:13:15.780 One minute, please.

03:13:17.680 Well, that is up to the powers that be in Alberta at the time.

03:13:22.740 It depends upon what kind of country the people of Alberta decide to have.

03:13:26.400 but let me make a constitutional point about the new alberta and this is again in accordance with

03:13:31.920 what the supreme court has said independence is a repudiation of the existing constitutional

03:13:39.600 order and in your negotiations on your departure there will be no conclusions predetermined by law

03:13:48.240 on any issue any issue the existing treaties are part of the existing constitutional order

03:13:56.400 in canada now alberta can choose to do what it thinks is best for the future country but these

03:14:04.560 things are not predetermined by law by the constitution or by the supreme court supreme

03:14:10.800 court is very clear about this if you are going to become independent you are reputing the canadian

03:14:17.520 constitutional order you are turning the page you have a blank slate you can determine for yourself

03:14:26.160 what your new constitutional order is to be send over to is a 30 second for a battle please i've

03:14:32.560 always appreciated bruce's honesty on this his position is that it's a tabula rasa we start from

03:14:37.600 ground zero the treaties expire uh and that's exactly why all 47 first nations and eight and

03:14:45.680 eight metis communities refuse to recognize this process if a punitive republic of alberta were to

03:14:53.200 abrogate were to see be seen as imposing itself as the new counterparty in those treaties or just

03:14:59.280 abrogating the treaties we would go from the essential relationships that we have that have

03:15:05.280 allowed us to become the third largest oil producer in the world and overnight that would be turned on

03:15:11.280 its head we would have rail and roadblock across the province that would be kryptonite for future

03:15:17.440 investment to go to uh next question to the leaf side uh it's not fair this is only a minute this

03:15:22.080 is quite a question but what currency pension plan and debt share would alberta have on day one you

03:15:28.560 have one minute well as we all know if if there was a clear question uh with a clear majority

03:15:36.320 voting for it uh the clarity act process at least leads us into negotiation and that would be

03:15:42.160 uh you know we should be under no illusions that's not easy that's not fast and it's messy

03:15:47.680 but these would be negotiated alberta pension alberta should have a pension plan for an

03:15:52.320 independent country or not for god's sakes we should have done this at least 20 years ago

03:16:00.000 the assets and liabilities uh between pensions and debts i mean let the canadian forces keep

03:16:05.920 uh you know broken down tanks and claims most of the cfa teams were built before even i was born

03:16:10.880 so you know there's some assets they can keep these get negotiated debt we'll take our fair

03:16:16.080 share based on per capita that i think that's actually probably one of the easier ones to

03:16:20.560 negotiate um the bigger question is if under you know we have a successful referendum and ottawa

03:16:27.680 does not negotiate in good faith and that is where we would come to more more troubled waters

03:16:33.120 about how we would divide this but i do believe alberta would have immense

03:16:36.560 leverage in these debates because a lot of law needs our money a hell of a lot more than we need

03:16:41.280 theirs okay look i advise on large transactions i'm a tax advisor um i can tell you that when i

03:16:52.320 hear the words we'll work out the details later that gives me a great deal of onionese and rarely

03:16:59.360 does that go well i would suggest the same is potentially true here now and just to make the

03:17:04.880 other point you know so currency what are we going to use probably the canadian dollar but we would

03:17:09.840 then have no say with the bank of canada we would be at the mercy of another sovereign nation i think

03:17:18.640 this leaves a lot to be desired a lot of uncertainty

03:17:21.440 One last nonspecific question to the Leaf side.

03:17:30.940 How would you answer reports of separatist contacts with operatives in the United States?

03:17:35.600 One minute please.

03:17:38.680 There's not much to respond to.

03:17:41.200 Unlike, you know, naturalist movements in other places around the world, there's no

03:17:45.880 clear hierarchy to Alberta's independence movement.

03:17:48.700 Anyone who wants to put up their hand and say, I'm a leader of it, can do it.

03:17:52.520 And so if a few self-appointed people go down and, you know, met with an intern who makes coffee to a, you know, to a first-term congressman from Wisconsin, I think that's unfortunate.

03:18:06.100 I don't think that's in the interest of Alberta.

03:18:09.820 I don't think it's in the interest of the independence movement.

03:18:12.000 But I think it is of zero consequence when someone who merely self-appoints themselves a leader and might jump up and down for the cameras does something like that because they have no authority to negotiate on behalf of Alberta or the independence movement.

03:18:28.020 30 second repel, please.

03:18:29.120 Well, that begs one of the biggest questions.

03:18:31.440 Who does have that mandate?

03:18:32.580 these guys are seeking a mandate to negotiate the rupture of the country and a massively complex

03:18:38.580 multi-year negotiation with no leaders with with a a bunch of warring micro factions in the

03:18:44.580 separatist movement they can't agree on even on their goals or their strategy who is it uh mitch

03:18:49.620 sylvester is suddenly going to be to pop up as premier of alberta we have a federalist government

03:18:54.180 one separatist mla apparently uh and nobody with a mandate to negotiate it would be utter chaos

03:19:02.020 And I should also add on... 0.85

03:19:04.000 Actually, I'm going to have to catch you up there.

03:19:05.640 Okay.

03:19:07.040 With you, because this question is for you.

03:19:10.200 Mr. Kenney, as Premier, you held a 2021 equalization referendum

03:19:14.200 that won 62% and changed nothing.

03:19:17.760 Why should Albertans believe fix it from within this time?

03:19:22.400 I don't agree that it changed nothing.

03:19:23.740 It created a clear fact that Albertans wanted reform

03:19:26.360 of the equalization program.

03:19:27.600 And I can tell you, while we didn't get a constitutional amendment,

03:19:30.980 around the table with the premiers uh they were suddenly very focused on alberta's interest the

03:19:36.020 premier of quebec in particular and my effort successful effort to get eight other provinces

03:19:41.700 including quebec to support us in our judicial reference our challenge of the c69 no more

03:19:46.580 pipelines law was part of that context where they wanted to have our back and support alberta given

03:19:53.540 the legitimate grievances we had over fiscal federalism including equalization 30 seconds

03:20:00.980 there's no what happened is we won on in the Supreme Court of Canada in the

03:20:04.700 judicial challenge of C-69 there's no plan there's no plan remember power is

03:20:14.480 never given and it was always taken the Canadian Constitution is impossible to

03:20:20.740 reform impossible to amend on any controversial subject except ironically

03:20:28.260 the secession of a promise question to Ms. Harper what would a federal

03:20:37.220 conservative government concretely change for Alberta that the

03:20:42.140 Constitution doesn't block so many things look government matters there's

03:20:48.180 no need to use suspending power of the federal government as aggressively as 0.96

03:20:52.620 liberals do and have. There is nothing that dictates the precise design of

03:20:58.560 federal regulatory and assessment regimes that can't be changed

03:21:01.860 legislatively. Even equalization is up for renewal. It's a five-year process.

03:21:09.100 It's up for renewal in March of 2029. There are significant changes. The

03:21:16.620 concept of equalization is guaranteed in Section 32 of the Constitution, but how

03:21:22.380 it's actually applied and enacted is not and i would say if you've been paying attention to

03:21:28.060 what's happening in quebec the the new premier of quebec was here some months ago and he opened with

03:21:33.660 the comment alberta we don't want your money i think that's an interesting point 30 seconds

03:21:46.140 albertans did vote to end equalization and it did establish a political fact of what

03:21:51.340 Albertans think and the same logic applies to an independence referendum but we have to ask

03:21:57.500 ourselves if 62 percent of Albertans voted for something eminently reasonable like removing

03:22:02.060 equalization from the constitution and we were met with crickets or derision how are we going

03:22:08.060 to be met with any other reforms Mr. Pierre Polyev stood on this stage just hours ago making the case

03:22:15.260 to Albertans to stay in Canada. And did he even mention the word equalization once?

03:22:22.540 In the last campaign, he stood on the status quo.

03:22:25.580 I'll have to wrap it up there. Let's go to Brandon.

03:22:26.780 There's a non-specific question to the Remain side. If almost half of UCP voters back leave,

03:22:33.740 what do you say to them on the morning after?

03:22:36.380 To respect democracy and to understand that if they continue, if people continue to push

03:22:40.940 the separatist agenda what they're going to do is uh perhaps for a generation divide the

03:22:45.900 conservative movement here in its heartland in alberta the vast majority of traditional

03:22:51.180 conservative voters and mainstream alberta voters do not want to end up locked into a permanent

03:22:57.260 political civil war arguing with their neighbors instead of focusing on growing and building and

03:23:02.940 moving forward they don't want to stare in the rearview mirror look at the calvary shaw by

03:23:07.340 election area i used to win 80 of the vote again when went to the new democrats a month ago in

03:23:13.260 part because mainstream conservatives have very little patience with this and i'm deep and you

03:23:18.140 now see the liberals today would win half of the federal seats in alberta so i would say

03:23:23.100 to conservatives we want to strength strengthen our voice let's come together behind mr paulia

03:23:29.100 behind premier smith and continue to fight for a strong alberta in united canada

03:23:37.340 That Forever Canada, the largest federalist organization in this campaign, did not have to apply with election finance law is besides the point.

03:23:48.820 If the Remain side wins, the independent side has to respect that.

03:23:53.240 But like in any election where you lose, you are not required to disband your political party and never try again.

03:23:59.980 that means that independent supporters in the UCP have to accept that and they have to accept

03:24:05.260 working within the UCP if that's where they want to be but the federalist side the UCP is in no

03:24:10.480 position to expel independence supporters. Unity for the UCP was hard fought and it shouldn't be

03:24:16.860 given away that easily. One more non-specific question to the Remain side. Does a big Remain

03:24:27.280 win help or hurt Alberta's leverage on equalization pipelines and the emissions

03:24:33.440 cap. One minute please. Look this seems to be one of the major arguments for the leave side that oh we

03:24:38.960 need the leverage just vote for the leverage and I reject that argument. Alberta is a major part of

03:24:45.520 the economic strength of this country. We're five million people and we have substantial

03:24:51.920 constitutional jurisdiction on our own as many of the as jason has referred to we've won a number

03:24:58.080 of important court cases that change the country i do not think that if we vote to remain that that

03:25:04.800 in any way hurts our leverage and in fact it potentially makes it stronger because we'll

03:25:09.840 receive more investment and more prosperity in this province 30 seconds what leverage have you

03:25:18.080 had over pipelines the past few months. It is the upcoming vote on Monday. Once that vote is done

03:25:26.100 and if LEED wins, that leverage will be gone. What leverage do you have over equalization?

03:25:34.280 Nothing. If you vote to stay in Canada, any imaginings of any leverage you have over any

03:25:41.440 of these things is gone these questions are to both sides so i'll ask them one side and there'll

03:25:51.520 be a one minute response followed by the identical response from the other side um the question which

03:25:57.360 i'm going to ask first the leave side if remain wins should the alberta pension plan and a

03:26:03.600 provincial police force still go ahead one minute jump it up i'll ask it to you afterwards okay

03:26:11.040 sorry i wasn't sure who that was going to oh everybody gets to answer one minute

03:26:18.400 oh sorry

03:26:21.840 well the short answer is yes why wouldn't you do that is this something you should have done long

03:26:26.880 ago what have you been waiting for this has nothing to do with the question of independence

03:26:33.280 this has something to do with what you are as a province you have the provincial jurisdiction to

03:26:38.000 do this why haven't you and if you do it you'll be further along the way more prepared to dive back

03:26:45.520 into the question of whether or not you ought to leave but right now to some extent you are

03:26:51.680 handcuffed by the fact you have not made use of the full range of provincial powers that you

03:26:58.080 already have the the first five questions on this referendum are questions about powers you

03:27:05.440 already have you should exercise them you should take a page out of quebec's book and go to town

03:27:13.440 and don't wait for permission stop the practice of waiting for permission to do things here's an idea

03:27:21.680 perhaps try to be less canadian

03:27:26.640 Well, I was going to say ditto, except the last sentence.

03:27:42.520 Bruce is absolutely right.

03:27:43.720 Why are we talking about this radical, divisive, massively risky prospect of tearing the country

03:27:50.300 apart when we haven't even begun to exercise the full range of our constitutional powers?

03:27:55.560 He's absolutely right.

03:27:56.600 don't we have but by the way coming out of the fair deal panel we began the work on uh assessing

03:28:02.040 the viability of a provincial police and pension plan and i believe that uh a pension plan uh would

03:28:08.920 be the single the alberta pension plan would be the single biggest fiscal win that this province

03:28:13.000 could make but those should be on the ballot right now but you know why they're not because all the

03:28:19.560 polls indicate that large majorities of albertans are opposed to both ideas so why do you think

03:28:25.400 they're actually going to accept the radical option of total rupture when albertans still not

03:28:31.000 have not yet been persuaded about the prudence of developing our own constitutional powers

03:28:36.760 such as provincial police and pensions let's do this the smart way incrementally you need

03:28:41.800 to persuade people uh on an incremental progress and it's deepening our provincial autonomy i think

03:28:48.680 we can but it takes hard work. Next question, first to the leave side, what margin settles

03:28:58.120 this question for a generation and what turnout makes it legitimate? One minute please.

03:29:04.280 It would take 100% on one side or another to shut everyone up for all time.

03:29:08.040 You know, to the point I made earlier, in every election, at least one candidate loses.

03:29:19.040 In Canada, that's often many candidates, and we don't expect people to disband their political

03:29:25.040 party, never run for office again, and ride into the sunset.

03:29:30.040 But, you know, if the Remain side has a convincing victory, the independent side owes it to the

03:29:37.040 owes it to the process whatever issues of fairness there may have been uh what it owes it

03:29:43.840 to uh the people of alberta to respect that decision and to reflect on how to go forward

03:29:49.680 and that does not mean another immediate referendum you would lose it uh one of the great

03:29:55.600 problems in the independence movement is it has not learned the lessons of luce m bouchard who

03:29:59.520 talked about winning conditions winning conditions were not set up here we just did it because we

03:30:05.760 wanted to do it and and and get the puck in the net so if we don't do it uh the independence

03:30:12.160 movement needs to think long and hard about how it wants to proceed it needs to think long and

03:30:16.320 hard about who gets to be a leader and speak for the movement in the future

03:30:24.080 same question over to this side what margin settles this question for a generation what

03:30:27.200 turnout makes it legitimate look i don't think anyone on this stage here today gets to decide

03:30:33.360 what that margin is i think the people of alberta will do that and i think we're hearing fairly

03:30:38.640 decisively through the polling that they're kind of done with this discussion i think there's a

03:30:44.960 strong will in alberta for people to focus back on key issues that a provincial government should

03:30:51.760 focus on next question this will actually be the final question we haven't actually talked about

03:30:59.680 but Quebec very much in this separatism debate.

03:31:02.640 Question for the Leave side.

03:31:04.380 Quebec has just elected a large PQ caucus,

03:31:07.760 Peltie Quebecois, or Partie Quebecois,

03:31:09.500 as it's set around here.

03:31:10.880 Does that make Alberta's hand stronger or weaker?

03:31:14.760 One minute, please.

03:31:16.640 I think, if anything, it makes it stronger

03:31:19.660 because it indicates that there is discontent

03:31:23.360 about the Canadian model.

03:31:25.760 There are more people than just Albertans

03:31:27.460 who don't want to be here.

03:31:29.460 And it doesn't have a direct effect.

03:31:31.440 It doesn't mean that it should affect what Alberta does

03:31:34.780 and what the timeline is and who gets there first.

03:31:36.780 I don't think it matters.

03:31:38.220 But here's the thing, Canada is in a lot of trouble.

03:31:43.340 It has become unhinged.

03:31:46.740 And there are people around the country

03:31:48.540 who understand that it is not fixable.

03:31:52.580 Now, how do you fix something that's not fixable?

03:31:56.060 Try taking it apart. 1.00

03:31:59.460 Alberta should leave. Quebec should leave. Start a cascade. Let the dominoes fall. And we will see 0.99

03:32:07.120 if in the face of an existential crisis, Canada has the ability to look itself in the mirror and

03:32:14.500 face up to its foundational problems. Maybe not even then, but you can at least give that a try

03:32:20.600 and see what happens.

03:32:27.100 Same question on the Remain side.

03:32:28.560 Quebec has just elected a large PQ caucus.

03:32:30.460 Does that make Alberta's hands stronger or weaker?

03:32:32.800 This was on the PQ, right?

03:32:34.540 Yes.

03:32:35.640 Well, look, the PQ is not,

03:32:38.720 there's not going to be a referendum in Quebec.

03:32:40.140 They won 28% of the vote.

03:32:41.760 They don't have a majority.

03:32:42.780 They don't have a mandate to do this.

03:32:44.100 And this is an interesting thing about Quebec politics.

03:32:46.240 They have a longstanding convention

03:32:47.460 that no government will launch a referendum

03:32:50.140 on something as divisive and consequential as secession without a clear legislative mandate

03:32:56.460 derived in an election. By the way, one of the better things that happened in the Quebec election

03:33:00.940 was the election of my great friend, Eric Zouane, to finally break the kind of the monolithic

03:33:07.260 left-wing dominance of Quebec political discourse. And how did he win those 19 seats?

03:33:12.940 Large part by saying he was going to fight against a referendum. And so I think we need

03:33:17.900 to learn from that here in alberta which is to say that if folks want to advocate for separation

03:33:24.620 they're welcome to do so as citizens it's a free society and they should do so in separatist

03:33:28.700 parties guess what they've been doing that for 45 years on the federal and provincial ballot in

03:33:33.980 alberta getting on average less than two percent of the vote one of those former leaders is on this

03:33:38.860 stage under our closing statements and uh the first closing statement for the remain side

03:33:47.500 is mr kenny again uh three minutes please

03:33:52.140 i think the most important thing that happens in this city every year is about to happen the first

03:33:57.340 week of november when hundreds of volunteers from all political persuasions uh pound crosses into

03:34:05.500 frozen soil along memorial boulevard 3300 of them to memorialize canadians southern albertans who

03:34:13.420 died in the defense of Canada and who lie buried in foreign cemeteries underneath

03:34:19.740 a crop underneath gravestones marked with the maple leaf we have an obligation to them

03:34:27.340 we have an obligation not to turn in on ourselves in endless anger bitterness and recrimination

03:34:35.420 and divisiveness not to create constant division in the society but to be who we are as Albertans

03:34:42.220 doers dreamers builders moving forward making friends making the case we now have super

03:34:48.380 majorities in every province including quebec and bc in support of increased oil and gas development

03:34:54.220 pipelines we have a federal government that's repealed 80 of the bad trudeau laws are things

03:34:58.700 perfect no they never will be they are not in any country but we have built here in alberta

03:35:04.300 despite the headwinds that we have faced despite the nep and the underrepresentation in the senate

03:35:09.900 despite the the despite the legitimate grounds of western alienation we have built

03:35:14.700 by far the most prosperous part of canada one of the most prosperous and successful societies

03:35:19.660 in all uh of the of the world why would we put that at risk by becoming a landlocked

03:35:25.900 statement with by the way there would be no negotiated settlement because the other provinces

03:35:30.460 wouldn't agree to the constitutional amendments there would be a unilateral declaration of

03:35:33.660 independence we lose automatic trade access to the rest of canada the rest of the world the bc

03:35:39.020 coast we end up in conflict with our first nations we end up with costs of 80 to 150 billion dollars

03:35:45.580 just when things are going in our direction i say let's build on this momentum let's lean into it

03:35:50.940 let's continue to make alliances across the federation to be a strong alberta that is

03:35:56.300 the leader of Canada instead of turning in on ourselves.

03:36:08.940 For the Leave side, your closing statement, Mr. Fildred.

03:36:13.100 Canada is a country worth saving. We all here agree with this. The pertinent question is,

03:36:19.500 can Canada be saved? On that, I am decidedly more pessimistic. One in four people in Canada

03:36:26.140 Canada is foreign-born, a proportion that we cannot possibly assimilate. 1.00

03:36:31.860 Canada's total government debt is $3.4 trillion and growing daily. 1.00

03:36:37.920 That is 109% of GDP.

03:36:41.080 Canadians now earn 62 cents for every dollar that Americans make.

03:36:45.400 Alberta has six times Nova Scotia's population, but only three and a half times as many MPs

03:36:51.260 and half as many senators.

03:36:54.380 We have proven incapable of building great things for more than a decade, and I count

03:36:58.680 myself skeptical that the former UN Special Envoy for Climate Change and Finance is going

03:37:04.000 to change that.

03:37:07.160 Have we all been so browbeaten that our only benchmark for greatness is building another

03:37:12.140 pipeline?

03:37:14.560 This is the measure of our success as a people.

03:37:17.700 Alberta sends 19 billion dollars, more to Ottawa than overseas back every year.

03:37:23.400 What happened to demanding fairness and equalization?

03:37:26.280 62% of Albertans voted for a constitutional amendment to remove it from the Constitution

03:37:31.800 in 2021.

03:37:33.760 And what was the response from Ottawa and the other provinces?

03:37:37.520 Silence.

03:37:38.520 At best.

03:37:40.640 Even our federal conservative representatives in Alberta promise the status quo.

03:37:47.340 From many quarters, the response was disdainful derision.

03:37:51.400 so what do we expect the response to be if Albertans vote for the four constitutional

03:37:55.720 amendments in Monday's referendum? Do we seriously expect Ottawa and the provinces to take us up in

03:38:02.040 good faith to reform the constitution? No, because the status quo works too well for too many of them.

03:38:10.920 No, because too many people see Canada not as a nation of people but as a multicultural

03:38:19.240 physical transfer zone where the job of the federal government is merely to move money from

03:38:24.440 one kind of voter to another the difficulty of alberta achieving independence is admittedly

03:38:30.360 great but the chances of canada significantly reforming itself are even smaller left-wing

03:38:37.960 federalists are clear alberta should stay and alberta should shut up conservative federalists

03:38:43.480 tell us that alberta should stay and get to work fixing canada but haven't we been doing that the

03:38:49.400 whole time haven't we been doing that since every election since the 1950s conservative federalists

03:38:58.360 need to answer one simple but important question how realistic is it that we can reform the

03:39:03.480 canadian constitution and restore canadian nationhood albertans must honestly ask themselves

03:39:11.800 does there exist enough genuinely nationalist canadians in other parts of canada that would

03:39:17.240 take up the call i wish it were so the reality is we are on our own strong people do not grovel

03:39:26.440 for crumbs for the master's table they take what's theirs i choose not to be a colony of

03:39:31.800 ottawa not of washington or of brampton i choose the remainder people they'll be here for another

03:39:36.120 300 years closing statement for the remain side ms harper three minutes thank you folks i think

03:39:50.360 we can all agree that alberta has legitimate grievances what we disagree on is about the

03:39:56.840 conclusion that that leads us to my friends on the other side look at those grievances

03:40:02.840 and conclude that canada can't change i would suggest that history has shown us that that's

03:40:10.360 not true i understand their frustration but i do not accept their conclusion

03:40:16.120 the proposition tonight isn't whether alberta could be an independent country of course it could

03:40:23.800 the question is would albertans be better off if it was separation would leave some of the

03:40:31.560 most important questions affecting our future to negotiation. The uncertainty we would be left with

03:40:39.240 is tremendous. But ultimately this debate is about the future we want to build for Albertans. It's

03:40:48.120 about creating opportunity so our children can build their futures here. It's about young people

03:40:55.160 being able to find good jobs afford to buy a house and build their lives here it's about building an

03:41:02.920 economy that is strong enough to take care of our most vulnerable albertans national unity requires

03:41:12.600 more than slogans from the federal government canada must give albertans reasons to believe

03:41:19.160 that confederation works for them and alberta should insist on it we are more than five million

03:41:25.240 people we produce the overwhelming majority of canada's oil and our economy matters enormously

03:41:33.320 to this country alberta does not come to confederation hat in hand asking for favors we come

03:41:41.160 with interests that canada simply cannot ignore so insist that ottawa respect provincial jurisdiction

03:41:48.920 insist that we get major projects built and our resources to world markets insist that the

03:41:54.440 provinces are given the fiscal capacity to meet their constitutional responsibilities

03:42:02.120 when ottawa gets it wrong challenge it when alberta can act for itself act and when canada

03:42:10.280 needs to change make the case for change because what matters isn't winning another argument with

03:42:18.120 ottawa it's what we leave for the generations who will follow us a strong alberta opportunity

03:42:26.440 for our children good jobs for our young people and a society that takes care of those who need

03:42:31.960 it folks there is plenty in this country worth fighting to change and there is plenty in this

03:42:41.240 country worth fighting to keep I hope that we will do so final closing statement from the leave sign

03:42:57.560 mr partner in your hearts there is a Canada that you know and love the true north strong and free

03:43:11.240 A land of opportunity, a fair country, wise leaders, sound institutions, and people who

03:43:22.040 hold the same values as you.

03:43:27.860 That Canada does not exist.

03:43:31.860 It is a figment of our memory and our wishful thinking.

03:43:39.800 Maybe once Canada was a free and noble country, maybe.

03:43:48.800 Today, it functions as a cartel held together by bribes.

03:43:57.400 Our leaders collaborate with foreign powers and global institutions to plunder what remains

03:44:04.780 of this country's prosperity.

03:44:07.780 institutions have become unhinged they have decided that the problem is you

03:44:17.160 Canada cannot be fixed within the model under which it operates the powerful

03:44:24.120 people will not allow it its Constitution is impossible to amend on

03:44:31.100 any controversial subject except as I mentioned except for the secession of

03:44:37.480 of a province now imagine that alberta had always been an independent country

03:44:44.400 prosperous free entrepreneurial would you choose to join the canada of today

03:44:53.500 the the collectivist woke overtaxed overregulated corrupt inefficient authoritarian confused

03:45:04.660 and delusional country that you see today?

03:45:07.940 Of course, the answer would be no.

03:45:12.520 If you wouldn't join,

03:45:15.420 then why would you promise to stay?

03:45:30.120 That concludes the debate,

03:45:31.760 the sovereignty vote and the path forward.

03:45:33.700 I'd like to thank our debaters, Bruce Pardee, Derek Fildebrandt, Jason Kenney, and Elon Harper.

03:45:39.860 Now, there will be a winner to this debate.

03:45:41.820 You have to scan in that QR code, and then these are Monk debate style rules.

03:45:46.820 Whoever moves the most votes from the beginning does win the debate.

03:45:51.300 I don't know if we'll be able to calculate that immediately, and whether there's any kind of trophy.

03:45:57.860 Aside from my hearty thumbs up.

03:46:00.320 But I've learned very much.

03:46:02.540 Thank you all for coming.

03:46:03.700 Thank you.

03:46:04.700 Thank you.

03:46:05.700 Thank you.

03:46:10.700 Thank you.

03:46:33.700 Thank you.

03:47:03.700 you

03:47:33.700 Let's start with the first referendum question, which we'll ask Albertans, do you support

03:47:55.540 the government of Alberta taking increased control over immigration for the purpose of

03:48:00.300 decreasing immigration to more sustainable levels, prioritizing economic migration, and

03:48:06.740 giving Albertans first priority on new employment opportunities.

03:48:11.060 What all does that mean?

03:48:12.500 So let's break it down.

03:48:13.780 First, taking more control over immigration.

03:48:18.380 Right now, immigration is a shared responsibility between the federal and provincial governments.

03:48:24.660 The federal government has most of the say.

03:48:26.380 set the levels and ultimately make the decisions on immigration. But the provincial government has

03:48:31.780 a certain number of what are called provincial nominees that they can nominate people to receive

03:48:37.480 permanent residency based on economics and the needs of their province. So the government of

03:48:43.920 Alberta wants more control. They want more say over who gets to come into Alberta because they

03:48:50.640 believe the Alberta government knows best and they want to prioritize economic migrants because

03:48:56.360 for a long time under prime minister justin trudeau there was a shift away from economic

03:49:01.080 migrants and more towards temporary residents and students and asylum seekers they want to

03:49:07.640 prioritize economic migrants and they want to get immigration to a more sustainable level

03:49:13.960 the numbers flared up under former prime minister justin trudeau and the government argues that it

03:49:19.640 burdens social services here in alberta and there needs to be a stabling not only now but in the

03:49:25.640 future so that's why they want to take control as well and then giving Albertans the first crack at

03:49:30.680 jobs they believe that Albertans deserve to have the first opportunity there's a lot of temporary

03:49:38.120 residents and immigrants who are taking the entry-level jobs they feel and they believe 0.86

03:49:44.840 that Albertans should have the first crack at those. Do you support the government of Alberta 0.98

03:49:51.640 introducing a law mandating that only Canadian citizens, permanent residents, and individuals

03:49:57.200 with an Alberta-approved immigrant status will be eligible for provincially funded programs

03:50:02.140 such as health care, education, and social services. What does this all mean? Well,

03:50:08.040 currently temporary residents in Alberta are eligible for health care, enrolling their children

03:50:13.600 in Alberta's public education system, K-12, the Alberta Child and Family Benefits program,

03:50:21.260 the Alberta Child Healthcare Subsidy, Student Aid, and other similar programs.

03:50:27.680 And the UCP estimates that this costs the province over $1 billion annually to provide these services to temporary residents.

03:50:36.100 Well, this all goes back to the mass migration that the UCP is bringing up under former Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.

03:50:44.200 When the government announced the referendum in February, a large part of it went to the provincial debt.

03:50:50.300 They argued that the mass migration burdened the social services and the public services here in Alberta to the point where the province couldn't keep up.

03:51:00.020 And so the argument here is that these provincially funded services are only going to be available to permanent residents and Canadian citizens who have made commitments to being here in Canada long term, as well as individuals with Alberta approved immigrant status.

03:51:14.160 Now, the definition of that is not known right now.

03:51:17.340 The government has said they'll create that after the referendum, after they get the mandate.

03:51:22.800 Basically, they're going to make it so that temporary residents no longer qualify for these things automatically.

03:51:28.280 And subsequent questions will introduce ideas of these.

03:51:34.560 Assuming that all Canadian citizens and permanent residents continue to qualify for social support programs as they do now,

03:51:42.120 Do you support the government of Alberta introducing a law requiring all individuals with a non-permanent legal immigration status to reside in Alberta for at least 12 months before qualifying for any provincially funded social support programs?

03:51:57.640 First off, we'll start with the 12 months is a number that the government's throwing out there.

03:52:03.340 They said that they'll work out what the actual time requirement is after the referendum, but they're saying at least 12 months.

03:52:11.320 and now to understand this question you need to look at it as a follow-up to question two with

03:52:18.520 question three if the second referendum question passes only alberta approved immigrant status

03:52:25.640 temporary residents would qualify for the social support programs after the 12-month period other

03:52:32.760 individuals without alberta approved immigrant status would not qualify no matter how long they've

03:52:39.640 lived in the province. If Albertans vote no to question two, then question three applies to

03:52:46.520 every single temporary resident in Alberta, regardless of if you have Alberta approved

03:52:52.040 immigrant status or not. And the reasoning for this is because currently temporary residents

03:52:57.840 qualify for Alberta child and family benefits, Alberta child care subsidies, student aid,

03:53:03.620 and other similar programs. And the government estimates that child care subsidies in the

03:53:08.760 Alberta Child and Family Benefits cost the province at least $100 million annually to

03:53:14.500 temporary residents. And so they want to get rid of that or help reduce it by requiring that

03:53:22.300 residents live in Alberta for at least 12 months, meaning that they have paid into the tax system

03:53:28.700 from which these services are provided. Assuming that all Canadian citizens and permanent residents

03:53:36.680 continue to qualify for public health care and education as they do now do you support the

03:53:43.020 government of alberta charging a reasonable fee or premium for individuals with a non-permanent

03:53:48.420 immigration status living in alberta for their and their families use of the health care and

03:53:55.540 education systems once again this is a follow-up to question two if albertans vote yes on question

03:54:05.660 2, this question would only apply to temporary residents and their families who have an Alberta

03:54:11.860 approved immigration status. All other temporary residents would still not qualify for education

03:54:19.660 and the health care system. They would have to pay the fees for it. And if Albertans vote no to 0.99

03:54:25.540 question 2, then this applies blankly to all temporary residents. The government's argument

03:54:32.400 that mass migration has placed a burden on Alberta's social services, education, and

03:54:40.240 health care system. They claim that there are 45,544 children.

03:55:02.400 Thank you.

03:55:32.400 Oh, am I in? Okay. All right. It is getting late. What an extraordinary evening it has been. Not all is lost. For the first time in 121 years, Albertans have gone to the polls to answer a question about their future within Confederation.

03:55:51.940 I think we can say safely that the independence debate is settled for now.

03:55:57.740 The current count has option one at 1,027,550,000 votes.

03:56:08.340 That's about 76.26% in favor of option one.

03:56:13.600 That is, Alberta should remain a province in Canada.

03:56:17.520 So pretty much everybody's called it.

03:56:20.800 I think it's fair to call it here.

03:56:22.620 But where we get interesting is questions one through nine.

03:56:29.820 Not all is lost.

03:56:32.320 And I say this because we're seeing a flip.

03:56:37.620 Earlier this evening, reports were rather grim.

03:56:41.100 It appeared that questions five through nine were in danger of losing, with the exception of the Senate.

03:56:47.860 We have seen the numbers flip.

03:56:52.320 On, let me, give me a second here.

03:56:55.560 Question number one.

03:56:58.680 Do you support the government of Alberta taking increased control over immigration for the purposes of decreasing immigration to more sustainable levels,

03:57:07.460 prioritizing economic migration, and giving Albertans first priority on new employment opportunities?

03:57:13.660 That number is 376,216 for yes. That comes out to 57% in favor, 43% oppose.

03:57:28.140 Question number two. Do you support the government of Alberta introducing a law mandating that only Canadian citizens, permanent residents and individuals with an Alberta approved immigration status will be eligible for provincially funded programs such as health care, education and other social services?

03:57:49.240 in favor uh 304,856 voting yes and keep in mind that the significant amount of the account

03:58:00.080 is still yet to come in uh for these questions even relative to the votes that we have on the

03:58:06.080 independence question uh 1.3 million uh votes have been counted on that i think that's about 44 percent

03:58:12.660 um what whereas for questions one and two uh we're at you know 657 000 so about half

03:58:20.420 question one question two 543 anyways uh 304 000 i mentioned earlier comes out to 56 percent to

03:58:28.820 44 percent opposed so that looks like so far uh again too early to call that one but uh

03:58:37.240 that looks like it is leaning in the yes direction.

03:58:44.220 Question number three. 0.52

03:58:46.160 Assuming that all Canadian citizens and permanent residents

03:58:49.140 continue to qualify for social support programs as they do now,

03:58:53.300 do you support the government of Alberta introducing a law

03:58:56.220 requiring all individuals with a non-permanent legal immigration status

03:58:59.820 to reside in Alberta for at least 12 months

03:59:02.220 before qualifying for any provincially funded social support programs?

03:59:06.360 235 000 out of 411 000 counts so that again still more to come in there that's 57 taking the yes

03:59:17.540 side question number four assuming that all canadian citizens and permanent residents

03:59:24.820 continue to qualify for public health care and education as they do now do you support the

03:59:29.760 government of alberta charging a reasonable fee or premium to individuals with a non-permanent

03:59:35.300 immigration status living in Alberta for their and their family's use of of the health care and

03:59:40.280 education systems 177.9 or 75,000 out of 316,272 comes up to 56.27 percent in favor 43.73 percent

03:59:55.180 opposed question number five do you support the government of Alberta and this is the last one of

04:00:03.340 the immigration questions do you support the government of alberta introducing a law requiring

04:00:07.840 individuals to provide proof of citizenship such as a passport birth certificate or citizenship

04:00:12.900 card to vote in an alberta election 153 362 in favor of 94 559 opposed this is the largest margin

04:00:25.700 of the in terms of percentage uh only 247 921 in so that is significantly less than the 1.35

04:00:34.000 million for question 10 uh but that is a 61.86 to 38.14 split uh so that brings us now to the

04:00:45.080 constitutional questions this one looked bad these ones look bad for a while um i

04:00:52.740 didn't have a lot of hope at for a while but you know these are these are absolutely essential as

04:01:01.220 well um this is really i mean in terms of the questions on the ballot the ones that leave us

04:01:08.500 in the best position to seek meaningful change from the federal government and the rest of the

04:01:16.380 country given what happened in quebec and and how that could define the political conversation in

04:01:26.020 this country for a long time i i do think that there's a very significant chance that we will

04:01:32.000 be going to be having real constitutional conversations at least i hope um anyways

04:01:40.640 question number six right now it's a narrow uh to the no side but again those this number has

04:01:49.780 been shifting uh this is the court's question do you support government of alberta working with

04:01:56.540 the governments of other willing provinces to amend the canadian constitution to a provincial

04:02:01.380 governments and not the federal government select the justices appointed to the provincial

04:02:05.200 king's bench and appeals court so this one is just to have the province pick the judges to

04:02:10.960 sit on the courts 91 865 in favor 93 950 opposed uh out so we are within a margin of about one

04:02:24.080 2,000 votes. That is 50.56 to 49.44% in out of 185,815 votes. Again, that is significantly

04:02:36.620 lighter than the 1.35 million in for question 10. Question seven. This one is 90,653 people

04:02:53.280 say that they support the government of Alberta

04:02:56.620 working with the governments of other willing provinces

04:02:58.780 to amend the Canadian Constitution

04:03:00.340 to abolish the unelected federal Senate.

04:03:03.020 So this is the one where we get rid of the Senate.

04:03:06.260 That gap has widened significantly.

04:03:10.540 We are at 51.96% to 48.04%.

04:03:16.860 Question number eight.

04:03:19.100 Do you support the government of Alberta working with the governments of other willing provinces to amend the Canadian Constitution to allow the provinces to opt out of federal programs that intrude on provincial jurisdictions such as health care, education and social services without a province losing any of the associated federal funding for use in its social programs?

04:03:40.660 so this one is uh you know we're in a margin of about four and a half thousand right now

04:03:47.520 180,000 in um this one is for like for example like we pay about 15 percent of all federal taxes

04:03:57.680 that are collected or collected in the province of Alberta uh the federal government sends back

04:04:02.640 transfers called the health and social transfers uh that go towards health care education and

04:04:09.440 effectively operate as an equalization program because we get back per capita funding. We don't

04:04:14.620 get back the 15% we send. We get back 11%, which is roughly the population, roughly 11. I think

04:04:23.320 it's probably 12 now. But yeah, so that is 88,526 to 92,740, 48.84% to 51.16. So we are getting

04:04:37.420 closer every time they change the count at some point i am hoping to see this number flip

04:04:43.520 number nine do you support the government of alberta working with the governments of other

04:04:50.860 willing provinces to amend the canadian constitution to better protect provincial

04:04:55.040 rights from federal interference by giving a province's laws dealing with provincial or

04:04:59.740 shared areas of constitutional jurisdiction priority over federal laws when the province's

04:05:05.500 laws and federal laws conflict oh that's a mouthful um what that one is is so there are

04:05:19.480 areas of jurisdictions such as for example the environment which has been the uh area in which

04:05:26.140 the province and the federal government have had the most uh difficulty in coming to an agreement

04:05:33.220 And what we ended up seeing from 2015 to 2021 was a federal liberal government.

04:05:43.140 Actually, no, last year, right before we started this independence conversation is when that stopped.

04:05:52.560 Yeah, the federal government uses their shared environmental jurisdiction to hammer through policies such as the Impact Assessment Act,

04:06:01.660 the carbon tax and so on and so forth we are right now within 20 votes or 28 votes

04:06:11.220 sorry 18 votes of seeing this one flip we are 50 50 96 927 in favor 96 945 against

04:06:24.500 We are within inches, and I think within minutes that one will flip.

04:06:33.780 So, I mean, it's not the end of the world tonight.

04:06:40.720 And I think that's something that we have to keep in mind as we head into tomorrow,

04:06:45.920 is that enough people, despite the incessant coordinated efforts

04:06:58.920 of the entire establishment to undermine the entire concept

04:07:07.700 of the grievances that we've had, we're getting 50-50.

04:07:14.900 i mean this is a divided electorate i think that's my take it's 50 50 i mean and i think

04:07:25.960 the polls and and i don't know if this is you know a reason to point things out now i'm not

04:07:31.560 going to talk about the the vast uh just sheer number of mail-in ballots uh relative to any

04:07:40.060 other election. I'm not going to get into that. But there are takeaways here. I think

04:07:46.540 if the resolution from the rest of the country is that Alberta grievances are real, they

04:07:57.560 should be taken care of. And again, yeah, it's early. But hopefully that's something.

04:08:04.640 But again, my fear is that they're going to see the results that come in and they're

04:08:08.960 just gonna pat us on the head and say you know well i'm glad that's over um but yeah uh that's

04:08:16.680 pretty much all i have to report uh john is there anything else that uh you need to add or can we go

04:08:23.120 back into commercial okay we're good all right i'll just smile at the camera

04:08:38.960 Thank you.

04:09:08.960 Thank you.

04:09:38.960 Thank you.

04:10:08.960 Thank you.

04:10:38.960 Thank you.

04:11:08.960 Thank you.

04:11:38.960 Thank you.

04:12:08.960 Thank you.

04:12:38.960 Thank you.

04:13:08.960 Thank you.

04:13:38.960 Thank you.

04:14:08.960 Thank you.

04:14:38.960 Thank you.

04:15:08.960 Thank you.

04:15:38.960 Thank you.

04:16:08.960 Thank you.

04:16:38.960 Thank you.

04:17:08.960 Thank you.

04:17:38.960 Thank you.

04:18:08.960 Thank you.

04:18:38.960 Thank you.

04:19:08.960 Thank you.

04:19:38.960 Thank you.

04:20:08.960 Thank you.

04:20:38.960 Thank you.

04:21:08.960 Thank you.

04:21:38.960 Thank you.

04:22:08.960 Thank you.

04:22:38.960 Thank you.

04:23:08.960 Thank you.

04:23:38.960 Thank you.

04:24:08.960 Thank you.

04:24:38.960 Thank you.

04:25:08.960 Thank you.

04:25:38.960 Thank you.

04:26:08.960 Thank you.

04:26:38.960 Thank you.

04:27:08.960 Thank you.

04:27:38.960 Thank you.

04:28:08.960 Thank you.

04:28:38.960 Thank you.

04:29:08.960 Thank you.

04:29:38.960 Thank you.

04:30:08.960 Thank you.

04:30:38.960 Thank you.

04:31:08.960 Thank you.

04:31:38.960 Thank you.

04:32:08.960 Thank you.

04:32:38.960 Thank you.

04:33:08.960 Thank you.

04:33:38.960 Thank you.

04:34:08.960 Thank you.

04:34:38.960 Thank you.

04:35:08.960 Thank you.

04:35:38.960 Thank you.

04:36:08.960 Thank you.

04:36:38.960 Thank you.

04:37:08.960 Thank you.

04:37:38.960 Thank you.

04:38:08.960 Thank you.

04:38:38.960 Thank you.

04:39:08.960 Thank you.

04:39:38.960 Thank you.

04:40:08.960 Thank you.

04:40:38.960 Thank you.

04:41:08.960 Thank you.

04:41:38.960 Thank you.

04:42:08.960 Thank you.

04:42:38.960 Thank you.

04:43:08.960 Thank you.

04:43:38.960 Thank you.

04:44:08.960 Thank you.

04:44:38.960 Thank you.

04:45:08.960 Thank you.

04:45:38.960 Thank you.

04:46:08.960 Thank you.

04:46:38.960 Thank you.

04:47:08.960 Thank you.

04:47:38.960 Thank you.

04:48:08.960 Thank you.

04:48:38.960 Thank you.

04:49:08.960 Thank you.

04:49:38.960 Thank you.

04:50:08.960 Thank you.

04:50:38.960 Thank you.

04:51:08.960 Thank you.

04:51:38.960 Thank you.

04:52:08.960 Thank you.

04:52:38.960 Thank you.

04:53:08.960 Thank you.

04:53:38.960 Thank you.

04:54:08.960 Thank you.

04:54:38.960 Thank you.

04:55:08.960 Thank you.

04:55:38.960 Thank you.

04:56:08.960 Thank you.

04:56:38.960 Thank you.

04:57:08.960 Thank you.

04:57:38.960 Thank you.

04:58:08.960 Thank you.

04:58:38.960 Thank you.

04:59:08.960 Thank you.

04:59:38.960 Thank you.

05:00:08.960 Thank you.

05:00:38.960 Thank you.

05:01:08.960 Thank you.

05:01:38.960 Thank you.

05:02:08.960 Thank you.

05:02:38.960 Thank you.

05:03:08.960 Thank you.

05:03:38.960 Thank you.

05:04:08.960 Thank you.

05:04:38.960 Thank you.

05:05:08.960 Thank you.

05:05:38.960 Thank you.

05:06:08.960 Thank you.

05:06:38.960 Thank you.

05:07:08.960 Thank you.

05:07:38.960 Thank you.

05:08:08.960 Thank you.

05:08:38.960 Thank you.

05:09:08.960 Thank you.

05:09:38.960 Thank you.

05:10:08.960 Thank you.

05:10:38.960 Thank you.

05:11:08.960 Thank you.

05:11:38.960 Thank you.

05:12:08.960 Thank you.

05:12:38.960 Thank you.

05:13:08.960 Thank you.

05:13:38.960 Thank you.

05:14:08.960 Thank you.

05:14:38.960 Thank you.

05:15:08.960 Thank you.

05:15:38.960 Thank you.

05:16:08.960 Thank you.

05:16:38.960 Thank you.

05:17:08.960 Thank you.

05:17:38.960 Thank you.

05:18:08.960 Thank you.

05:18:38.960 Thank you.

05:19:08.960 Thank you.

05:19:38.960 Thank you.

05:20:08.960 Thank you.

05:20:38.960 Thank you.

05:21:08.960 Thank you.

05:21:38.960 Thank you.

05:22:08.960 Thank you.

05:22:38.960 Thank you.

05:23:08.960 Thank you.

05:23:38.960 Thank you.

05:24:08.960 Thank you.

05:24:38.960 Thank you.

05:25:08.960 Thank you.

05:25:38.960 Thank you.

05:26:08.960 Thank you.

05:26:38.960 Thank you.

05:27:08.960 Thank you.

05:27:38.960 Thank you.

05:28:08.960 Thank you.

05:28:38.960 Thank you.

05:29:08.960 Thank you.

05:29:38.960 Thank you.

05:30:08.960 Thank you.

05:30:38.960 Thank you.

05:31:08.960 Thank you.

05:31:38.960 Music's still going.

05:31:57.020 Alright, we have an update.

05:32:00.980 the numbers on the independence question itself have not changed dramatically option one still

05:32:11.040 has a commanding lead i think we're all pretty much i mean sit been sitting around 24 all night

05:32:21.240 question one i'm not gonna bother reading them they're all long uh the first immigration question

05:32:27.900 58.54 in favor of for the province taking over immigration levels and

05:32:36.880 decreasing immigration to more sustainable levels number two are the do you support the

05:32:47.220 government introducing a law mandating that only Canadian citizens permanent residents

05:32:51.440 and individuals with an Alberta approved immigration status of access to provincially

05:32:57.040 funded programs such as health care education and other social services 406 uh that's at 56.83

05:33:05.060 yes 41 point or 43.17 no question three is uh basically setting a 12 month uh window uh that

05:33:19.140 you have to reside in alberta before you qualify for any provincially funded social

05:33:24.340 security or social support programs that is at 58.08 percent question four

05:33:33.480 um which is uh asking whether or not uh the government of alberta could charge of

05:33:41.240 a fee a reasonable fee or premium to individuals with non-permanent immigration status

05:33:46.320 for health and education is at 56.89%.

05:33:53.080 Question five is, should you provide proof of citizenship when you vote?

05:34:03.160 Pretty straightforward, 62.43% in favor.

05:34:07.820 Question six is, do you support the government of Alberta

05:34:13.600 working with other governments to have the Alberta government pick our judges is at 50%.

05:34:26.700 So that is, it's been going back and forth all night, but 50.24% to 49.76%.

05:34:34.020 That's $407,000, and there's still a lot coming in.

05:34:37.080 Question 7 was, should we abolish the Senate? That is at 53.26%, so that has moved again in the steady direction.

05:34:54.340 the one we've been watching uh which is should the government uh there's our question eight is

05:35:02.240 the one we've been watching should the alberta government work with the other provinces to

05:35:06.240 amend the constitution to allow provinces to opt out of federal programs that are provincial

05:35:12.040 jurisdiction it's finally just a few moments ago went in favor of the yes column that is the first

05:35:22.280 time all night that that's happened uh it is it has dropped below but we're we're sitting at a

05:35:29.480 300 vote margin uh we're keeping a very very close eye on that there's still lots to come in as you

05:35:35.960 can see by the map the bulk of rural alberta is dark blue in that um i can't imagine the two north

05:35:44.700 ridings uh and like the fort mcmurray riding uh i think the north one is grand prairie something

05:35:51.380 or Peace River.

05:35:52.520 I can't imagine that being dark red for long.

05:35:56.920 Edmonton still has votes to come in.

05:36:00.680 Still, Calgary has a few seats

05:36:04.000 that a lot of the numbers still need to come in.

05:36:08.600 For example, Fort McMurray.

05:36:11.800 Oh, shoot.

05:36:12.520 I pressed the wrong button.

05:36:15.140 Calgary Acadia currently has zero counted on question eight.

05:36:19.380 calgary beddington 237 calgary cross only 61 so a lot of calgary votes still to come in

05:36:26.740 calgary klein calgary law heed uh calgary bowler mccall uh quite a few votes have already come in

05:36:32.940 it's possible calgary klein is done counting uh their balances but i still think there's more to

05:36:37.600 come in margins are are relatively tight in the more uh suburban areas of calgary calgary fish creek

05:36:48.100 102 out of 216 so that's just under 50 but edmonton like edmonton city center which is the

05:36:56.800 uh i believe david shepard's riding for the ndp is 4,677 to 1762 so those people are perfectly

05:37:05.000 happy to give our money away um so that's edmonton uh but yeah the rural ridings uh like

05:37:16.040 Athabasca, Barhead, Westlock with 5,500 votes in is 4,000 to 1,450.

05:37:24.000 So pretty wide margins there.

05:37:28.000 Bonneville, Cold Lake, that's a 2-1 margin there with about 3,000 votes coming in.

05:37:35.860 Brooks Medicine Hat, roughly 2-1 margin.

05:37:38.360 So rural Alberta is on this issue coming in at roughly a 2-1 margin.

05:37:44.180 So question eight's the one that I think there's a bit of a silver lining here.

05:37:50.880 If the trend continues, we've seen it shift.

05:37:56.100 Yes, it's very, very tight right there, 49.9% to 50.1%.

05:38:01.340 That's really one of the key fiscal issues is the imbalances in federal funding.

05:38:11.540 like i said multiple times we pay more in taxes than we get back and the bulk of those

05:38:17.720 differences come in the health and social transfers we only get back per capita funding

05:38:24.400 but we put in much more than that so yeah that is uh very much a rural urban split on that

05:38:33.540 so yeah it's gonna this one

05:38:37.800 i mean it's clearly popular amongst the uh row ridings so it's going to be interesting to see

05:38:46.140 how smith kind of navigates this as we move forward uh cypress medicine hat i that one

05:38:52.260 it's it's a little bit tighter i'm surprised about that the fort mcmurray ridings again

05:38:58.480 and haven't really put much in.

05:38:59.700 Grand Prairie hasn't posted any results on this.

05:39:04.260 Innisfil-Sylvan Lake's only at 448 votes.

05:39:07.120 Leduc-Beaumont, Lesser Slave Lake,

05:39:10.300 Masquichese-Witasquan,

05:39:12.620 Moorinville-St. Albert.

05:39:14.240 Still votes to come in.

05:39:15.560 Neither Red Deer.

05:39:19.360 Constituency is reporting any results.

05:39:21.520 Rimby-Rocky Mountain House Sundry

05:39:23.020 is not reporting any results on this.

05:39:25.160 Sherwood Park's only at 612.

05:39:27.060 That looks about 50-50.

05:39:28.480 which is suburban Edmonton.

05:39:30.600 Spruce Grove, Stony Plain, only 134 results.

05:39:35.020 St. Albert, which is, well, Marie Renault is the NDP MLA for that riding.

05:39:42.960 Four of 60 reporting, 7,000 total in for that.

05:39:47.820 So that might be a pretty big number.

05:39:49.960 That is two to one the other way.

05:39:51.520 so my my estimation is this will be sitting around 50 50 for the evening um for the for the rest of

05:40:01.880 the morning i uh have been your host this evening my name's josh uh josh andrus and uh i will be

05:40:10.540 signing off and going to bed for a couple of hours before we reconvene tomorrow at 6 a.m cory morgan

05:40:18.660 or around 6 a.m.

05:40:20.920 I think Corey's getting here at 6.

05:40:22.300 I don't know how quickly we're going to be on the air.

05:40:24.740 But the goal is to be live with reaction tomorrow.

05:40:30.420 Derek Fildebrandt will be with us.

05:40:33.200 Corey, I think Nigel, Marty up north,

05:40:36.820 the entire Western Standard crew.

05:40:41.120 It's at 6.30.

05:40:42.360 Thank you.

05:40:42.760 It starts at 6.30.

05:40:44.080 So that'll be live.

05:40:45.840 um i guess we'll see you tomorrow and uh we'll probably keep the stream up just with the

05:40:54.140 uh referendum results for the rest of the evening might shut it down in an hour i don't know what

05:41:00.320 john's plan here is but i am done so thank you very much for being with us and we look forward

05:41:08.620 to picking through these results obviously the independence question has been thoroughly rejected

05:41:14.360 But, yeah, there's very much a silver lining here that, well, there's a very, very strong constituency that believes that provinces should be able to opt out of federal programs that intrude on provincial jurisdictions such as health care, education, and social services, especially given the associated federal funding for these programs.

05:41:39.940 And I think that kind of speaks volumes about some of the things that the Alberta government has been doing. Provincial Priorities Act being on the table, an act that is, in theory at least, and I'd like to see it used more, used to view these funding agreements through that lens.

05:41:57.700 um and again like if we were to opt out of the federal health transfer we would be able to raise

05:42:05.460 that tax revenue on our own and for an equal amount we'd be able to cut your tax rate by

05:42:11.920 for 30 for that portion of your tax revenue to keep funding the same i mean if we keep tax levels

05:42:23.900 the same we would be able to fund 40 more health care so yeah it's it's not a total wash uh so

05:42:33.960 take that uh as it will signing off i'm josh andrus director of operations of the western

05:42:40.000 standard have a good evening very morning whatever it is

05:42:53.900 Thank you.

05:43:23.900 Thank you.

05:43:53.900 Thank you.

05:44:23.900 Thank you.

05:44:53.900 Thank you.

05:45:23.900 Thank you.

05:45:53.900 Thank you.

05:46:23.900 Thank you.

05:46:53.900 Thank you.

05:47:23.900 Thank you.

05:47:53.900 Thank you.

05:48:23.900 Thank you.

05:48:53.900 Thank you.

05:49:23.900 Thank you.

05:49:53.900 Thank you.

05:50:23.900 Thank you.

05:50:53.900 Thank you.

05:51:23.900 Thank you.

05:51:53.900 Thank you.

05:52:23.900 Thank you.

05:52:53.900 Thank you.

05:53:23.900 Thank you.

05:53:53.900 Thank you.

05:54:23.900 Thank you.

05:54:53.900 Thank you.

05:55:23.900 Thank you.

05:55:53.900 Thank you.

05:56:23.900 Thank you.

05:56:53.900 Thank you.

05:57:23.900 Thank you.

05:57:53.900 Thank you.

05:58:23.900 Thank you.

05:58:53.900 Thank you.

05:59:23.900 Thank you.

05:59:53.900 Thank you.

06:00:23.900 Thank you.

06:00:53.900 Thank you.

06:01:23.900 Thank you.

06:01:53.900 Thank you.

06:02:23.900 Thank you.

06:02:53.900 Thank you.

06:03:23.900 Thank you.

06:03:53.900 Thank you.

06:04:23.900 Thank you.

06:04:53.900 Thank you.

06:05:23.900 Thank you.

06:05:53.900 Thank you.

06:06:23.900 Thank you.

06:06:53.900 Thank you.

06:07:23.900 Thank you.

06:07:53.900 Thank you.

06:08:23.900 Thank you.

06:08:53.900 Thank you.

06:09:23.900 Thank you.

06:09:53.900 Thank you.

06:10:23.900 Thank you.

06:10:53.900 Thank you.

06:11:23.900 Thank you.

06:11:53.900 Thank you.

06:12:23.900 Thank you.

06:12:53.900 Thank you.

06:13:23.900 Thank you.

06:13:53.900 Thank you.

06:14:23.900 Thank you.

06:14:53.900 We'll be right back.

Western Standard - October 20, 2026

WATCH LIVE： 2026 Alberta referendum night results

Episode Stats

Transcript