Alex Jones Show - 20070223_Fri_Alex

00:00:01.000 Big Brother Mainstream media.

00:00:09.000 Government cover-ups.

00:00:11.000 You want answers?

00:00:12.000 Well, so does he.

00:00:14.000 He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.

00:00:18.000 And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.

00:00:25.000 In the Encyclopedia Britannica 1999 edition, if you turn to yellow journalism, it details William Randolph Hearst helping organize and stage propaganda for the Spanish-American War, the enactment of the Federal Reserve, and many other globalist imperial programs.

00:00:44.000 There's only one other media group in history known for being more associated with the government and propaganda.

00:00:51.000 That is, in history, still operating.

00:00:53.000 George Orwell, of course, fashioning the character Winston off of himself in the Ministry of Truth in a fictional nightmare future dystopia, fashioned the Ministry of Truth off of the BBC, where black is white, Up is down, left is right, and we are joined by Guy Smith, producer, director who made the Primetime Sunday program, 9-11 Conspiracies for the BBC.

00:01:21.000 He'll be with us for the entire hour.

00:01:23.000 Dylan Avery will be popping in, as well as Paul Joseph Watson from Sheffield, England.

00:01:31.000 Guy Smith, I appreciate you coming on.

00:01:34.000 No, a pleasure, Alex.

00:01:35.000 I don't know about yellow journalism, but I guess we just followed the evidence where it led us.

00:01:42.000 Oh, I was speaking of Hearst Publishing.

00:01:43.000 Certainly, you're a journalist.

00:01:44.000 You know about Hearst Publishing, right?

00:01:46.000 Certainly do.

00:01:47.000 And, yeah, Chertoff's cousin, the Homeland Security Director, telling me it wasn't a hit piece, and then it was.

00:01:55.000 I was talking about a previous Previous hit piece.

00:01:58.000 Guy, you told me over the phone that it wasn't a hit piece, but you also laughed and said you don't believe the stuff we've put out.

00:02:07.000 I mean, can you honestly say that this isn't an attempt at debunking?

00:02:11.000 Yeah, Alex, I really appreciate coming on your show, and I admire much of the work you do in talking about subjects that perhaps the mainstream media doesn't want to talk about.

00:02:22.000 But we didn't set out to do a hit piece, as you call it.

00:02:25.000 What we did is that we set out to investigate the evidence and to see where it led us.

00:02:30.000 And if it turned out that some of the conspiracy theories were true, I would have gladly said that in the film.

00:02:36.000 You know, we're not acting on behalf of any government agency, or, you know, we're not part of some conspiracy.

00:02:44.000 Is it funded and controlled by Tim Downing Street?

00:02:46.000 No, it's not actually.

00:02:47.000 The BBC is funded by the public through a licence fee system.

00:02:51.000 It's a complicated system which doesn't really operate, doesn't have any similarity to anything that operates in the States.

00:02:58.000 But basically, people who have a television in Britain have to pay a tax.

00:03:02.000 They pay that tax to the government and then the government hands it on to the BBC.

00:03:06.000 And just two years ago they made the director of the BBC resign and apologizing for putting out pieces claiming that Blair knew about WMDs and other things.

00:03:15.000 Now all totally admitted the BBC was right there.

00:03:18.000 Well, I mean, that's a whole different story.

00:03:21.000 But I mean, I can gladly talk about that if you like.

00:03:24.000 But I guess the main thing is to talk about the program that we made last night and, and that you said a hit piece.

00:03:30.000 And I'm saying, it's not a hit piece, what it's doing is investigating the conspiracy theories.

00:03:35.000 And we did that in an objective and a balanced way.

00:03:38.000 And we followed the evidence, we followed the trail.

00:03:41.000 And we followed where the trail led us.

00:03:43.000 A balanced way.

00:03:44.000 You had eleven debunkers.

00:03:46.000 We've timed it out.

00:03:47.000 You gave them at least three times more time than you gave the three 9-11 truthers. 0.97

00:03:53.000 Well, we talked to a lot of people on all sides of the debate.

00:03:59.000 It was almost 4-1, the time you gave them.

00:04:03.000 4-1, is that balanced?

00:04:05.000 Yeah, but Alex, you know that you carry a lot more weight than any debunkers, and when you come on air, you have a lot more impact than anybody who's an expert or anything like that.

00:04:16.000 Very condescending and sarcastic and complete.

00:04:21.000 You had your say in the film and you know many people will watch the program and they can make up their own minds.

00:04:27.000 Why did you interview me?

00:04:28.000 Why did you interview me for off and on for a week?

00:04:31.000 I know it had to be over 20 hours of footage and I was in there three minutes.

00:04:34.000 Well it wasn't actually a week.

00:04:36.000 I mean we came to Dallas and we met you on the Saturday.

00:04:39.000 You came to Dallas, interviewed me there, then you interviewed me in Austin in my studio, then the other studio.

00:04:44.000 Off and on for a week you were here.

00:04:45.000 No, it wasn't.

00:04:46.000 It was over two days, actually.

00:04:48.000 I mean, I can be absolutely quite certain about that.

00:04:50.000 that we interviewed you in Dallas and then we interviewed you the next day in Austin.

00:04:54.000 Josh Smith, stay there.

00:04:56.000 We're going to be right back on the other side of this break to walk through this.

00:05:00.000 It's here after a year in production and traveling to distant lands.

00:05:00.000 We appreciate it.

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00:08:00.000 He's the T-Rex of political talk.

00:08:04.000 Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.

00:08:08.000 Guy Smith, producer, director for the BBC, put together a well-done visual piece, well-produced.

00:08:17.000 Thank you.

00:08:18.000 Regardless, off and on for several days they interviewed me.

00:08:22.000 I would imagine it had to be twenty-something hours of footage.

00:08:26.000 So, let me just go back.

00:08:28.000 Let's be conservative and say it's ten hours of footage.

00:08:31.000 Why did you only use three minutes of me in there if it's so balanced?

00:08:37.000 I hate to disagree with you that we interviewed you for 10 hours or for 20 hours or over a week.

00:08:42.000 We filmed an interview with you, you made some very cogent points, and you're in the film.

00:08:50.000 What's the complaint?

00:08:51.000 Well, I mean, wait a minute.

00:08:52.000 I mean, you interviewed me for like three hours at the grass, you know, and you followed us around and we're taping off and on during a five-hour event at night, and the next day you interviewed me, you videotaped the two-hour radio show, then you interviewed me about two hours after.

00:09:04.000 I talked to you constantly on the phone for weeks before that.

00:09:07.000 But let's not digress.

00:09:08.000 There's a lot of points to make here.

00:09:10.000 My point is, are you denying that you had eleven debunkers and three 9-11 truthers in the film, and are you denying that they had a lot more time than we did?

00:09:19.000 No, I'm not denying that.

00:09:21.000 We interviewed three main conspiracy theorists, you, Dylan Avery and Jim Fetzer.

00:09:27.000 Your views represent many other people in America, I accept that, and likewise those of Dylan Avery and Jim Fetzer, and they had a good say in the program.

00:09:39.000 We gave them a lot of attention and a lot of opportunity to voice their views in the program.

00:09:45.000 And the program then went to investigate the claims that you and the other two guys are making.

00:09:50.000 And that's what we did in the program.

00:09:52.000 If it turned out that the trail that we followed led us to a different conclusion, we would have said that.

00:10:01.000 All I can report is what we found out.

00:10:04.000 In the end, people must make up their own views as to whether they want to believe us or they don't.

00:10:08.000 And if they don't, I accept that too.

00:10:10.000 I'm not trying to force this down anybody's throat.

00:10:13.000 I'm not trying to force anybody to accept what we're saying.

00:10:18.000 I'm just saying, look, this is what we did.

00:10:20.000 Why didn't you have, say, Kevin Ryan of Underwriting Laboratories, their own internal report said that 1,800 degree jet fuel couldn't melt steel that doesn't melt, and it was molten.

00:10:31.000 That's on record.

00:10:32.000 We have the aerial photographs and the firefighters.

00:10:34.000 It was molten four weeks later.

00:10:37.000 How does 1,800 degrees melt steel that non-structural raw steel doesn't start melting till 2,554 degrees structural hardened steel until 3,300?

00:10:48.000 And those are numbers people can just pull up instantly on any engineering website.

00:10:54.000 Why didn't you guys include that in your film?

00:10:57.000 Well, the reality is that we had 59 minutes and frankly we could have spent all day talking about just the Twin Towers.

00:11:05.000 We covered a lot of ground in the program.

00:11:07.000 Everything from the hijackers arriving in America before the attacks through to how the government tried to, the CIA and the FBI, tried to cover up their mistakes after the attacks.

00:11:18.000 So, you know, we only have 59 minutes, just as now we only have this one hour for this program.

00:11:23.000 There's not everything we can talk about.

00:11:25.000 So we decided to concentrate on some things more than others.

00:11:28.000 Now, clearly, one can make a whole hour just discussing the melting point of steel and exactly what happened to the Twin Towers.

00:11:33.000 But I guess the bottom line with the Twin Towers is, are you saying that they were demolished?

00:11:40.000 Now, if you were, then one has to look at why that happened and how that happened.

00:11:45.000 And we looked into that and we came to the conclusion that the evidence just doesn't support that conspiracy theory.

00:11:49.000 Okay, let me stop you right there.

00:11:50.000 Let me bring on Paul Watson from England, who's been writing articles, you may have even seen some, concerning the piece that you did.

00:11:56.000 You use a NOVA simulation in the piece.

00:11:59.000 That has been completely debunked by David Ray Griffin and others.

00:12:02.000 They claim there's no central steel columns.

00:12:04.000 They claim it was a hollow shaft.

00:12:06.000 Paul Watson, you want to comment on the NOVA piece?

00:12:10.000 Firstly, I would like to say that I actually counted 13 debunkers compared to so-called conspiracy theorists, so it was an even greater number.

00:12:10.000 Well, yeah.

00:12:19.000 And I would ask Mr. Smith, why, when we've had government officials, scientists, first responders, MI5 agents on this show talking about our side of the evidence.

00:12:30.000 Did he decide to give ten minutes to a producer of a sci-fi show that went off the air five years ago?

00:12:39.000 Mr. Smith?

00:12:40.000 Yeah, we decided to talk to Frank Spotnitz because he had very many interesting things to say about conspiracy theories.

00:12:47.000 It's as simple as that.

00:12:48.000 Basically, that it's a modern religion of delusionals.

00:12:53.000 Now, in the Nova piece, It shows... Paul, you've measured it and timed it.

00:13:00.000 Give him the exact seconds, and it comes out to about 55 seconds for the towers to fall, but in reality they fell in a little over 10 seconds, so even the NOVA piece is false, Paul.

00:13:11.000 Well, that's right.

00:13:12.000 If you take the conservative estimate and say the towers fell in 14 to 16 seconds, what we've got is Mr. Smith in the documentary near the beginning when he talks about controlled demolition.

00:13:24.000 He uses a graphic animation from Nova, which is a PBS scientific documentary, which depicts the collapse of the Twin Towers at a rate of 6 floors per second, meaning that the total collapse of each tower would have taken around 66 seconds.

00:13:42.000 So it's a patently false and misleading graphic to use and my question is, you know, will there be a retraction of this graphic which is blatantly false and misleading and only lends to the bias that was already decided on in dismissing questions about controlled demolition?

00:14:03.000 Mr. Smith?

00:14:04.000 That graphic wasn't misleading.

00:14:06.000 I don't know, you're talking about it coming from NOVA.

00:14:07.000 It was actually made by the BBC, that graphic.

00:14:10.000 Well, the point is it was used on the NOVA program as well, I don't know.

00:14:14.000 But the point is, if you're suggesting that the World Trade Center was demolished by explosives, then I would say, where is the cast iron evidence to back that up?

00:14:28.000 Let me stop you then.

00:14:31.000 Craig Bartmer, who was in the news, on record, giving citations, on the pile for 5 days, there when 7 collapsed, has reported, and I've got now over 15 firefighters and police coming on in the next week.

00:14:43.000 We're lining them all up for one show.

00:14:45.000 Hope you tune in.

00:14:46.000 It'll be 3 hours of witnesses.

00:14:48.000 That said, we were told, get back from 7.

00:14:50.000 They were going to bring it down so it wouldn't damage other buildings.

00:14:53.000 They were going to blow it up.

00:14:54.000 We have CNN with two cops going, get back, get back.

00:14:57.000 7's going to come down.

00:14:58.000 Get back.

00:14:58.000 They're bringing it down.

00:15:00.000 Okay?

00:15:00.000 We clearly have this over and over again.

00:15:03.000 In fact, right now, go ahead.

00:15:05.000 Let's first play the molten steel clip from New York TV.

00:15:08.000 Here are firefighters talking about molten steel like a foundry like lava.

00:15:12.000 Here it is.

00:15:13.000 You'd get down below and you'd see molten steel.

00:15:16.000 Molten steel running down the channel rails.

00:15:19.000 Like you're in a foundry.

00:15:20.000 Like lava.

00:15:22.000 Like lava in a volcano.

00:15:26.000 Okay, now let's play the next clip, just in case you've never seen these or heard these, and the videos are up on the website.

00:15:31.000 Here's CNN with two cops saying, get back, they're gonna bring it down, seven's coming down, they say it three times, here it is.

00:15:37.000 CNN.

00:15:39.000 Can you hear that?

00:15:40.000 Keep your eye on that building.

00:15:41.000 It'll be coming down.

00:15:44.000 The building is about to blow up.

00:15:47.000 Move it back.

00:15:48.000 Alright guys?

00:15:49.000 We are walking back to the building.

00:15:55.000 Okay, so we not only have that, and again, there's over 15 coming on the show, we've already had a bunch of them on.

00:15:59.000 I've interviewed Bartmer for a video for an upcoming film in New York, he can barely breathe.

00:16:04.000 Now, he tried to be interviewed by you, and you didn't want to talk to him, and he said that he was there, and they said, get back, they're going to bring the building down.

00:16:13.000 Now, you just heard clips, I'm asking you, why didn't you want to talk to a police officer?

00:16:18.000 Well, um, I don't know about that particular police officer, um, but... But you met him!

00:16:24.000 You met him!

00:16:24.000 He was there!

00:16:25.000 He went up in upstate New York to meet with you!

00:16:28.000 Uh, I guess he must have been one of the people who was at Dylan Avery's house.

00:16:32.000 I think that's probably what you're referring to.

00:16:34.000 Yes, yes, a police officer.

00:16:35.000 Yes.

00:16:36.000 Well, look, we could spend all day talking about whether there was molten steel or whether it was something else in the basement of the World Trade Center.

00:16:44.000 But what you have to do is to look at the bottom line theory.

00:16:47.000 Now, if you're saying those Twin Towers were demolished, I have yet to understand why they were demolished.

00:16:54.000 And how they were demolished.

00:16:57.000 All I can say is that the evidence that we have looked at just doesn't stack up.

00:17:00.000 I mean, is it really plausible that people would have flown two planes into these tin towers and laced them with demolition charges?

00:17:07.000 We're not saying that.

00:17:09.000 No, they were pre-placed.

00:17:10.000 What about seven?

00:17:11.000 No plane hit seven.

00:17:12.000 The CIA, the FBI, Defense Intelligence, it was a giant intelligence building and it had the command center FEMA claimed they were there the night before, then they tried to retract, and Giuliani, in congressional testimony, admitted they were running Tripod 2, a drill of an attack on the complex, so they'd already moved out the night before to the end of the pier.

00:17:32.000 But is it really plausible, do you think, that World Trade Center 7 would have been demolished, and five years later, nobody who was involved in planting those demolition charges wouldn't have spoken to their wife or girlfriend or come forward and admitted that they were part nobody who was involved in planting those demolition charges wouldn't have spoken Hold on, let me finish.

00:17:53.000 How did they have Tuskegee for 40 plus years? 0.57

00:17:56.000 Killing black men with syphilis secret. 0.96

00:17:58.000 The atomic soldiers, the ringworm children in Israel where they radiated 110,000. 0.96

00:18:03.000 The Manhattan Project kept secret with over 100,000 people involved.

00:18:07.000 Come on! 0.61

00:18:08.000 The people who were involved in that and black ops know they'd be killed the minute they went public.

00:18:13.000 Well, I mean, yeah, you talk about the Manhattan Project, and that's a very interesting example, but it's something that's quite different, because here, remember, 3,000 American citizens died, or American and citizens from other countries as well, including Britain.

00:18:28.000 So, you know, it's like, you seem to think that we're trying to cover something up.

00:18:33.000 You know, we're not covering anything up.

00:18:35.000 All we're doing is looking at the evidence in an objective, dispassionate way and trying to test whether it stands up to discrimination.

00:18:42.000 Guy Smith, no modern steel building, and you can show some two-story thing in England or some two-story thing that's tar-roofed in Chicago, no modern steel building has ever fallen.

00:18:53.000 Look at the Madrid, 100-foot white-hot flames, almost two days burning, no major steel members collapsed.

00:18:59.000 It's scientific facts.

00:19:01.000 This building 7 wasn't hit by a plane, had small fires and symmetrically collapsed.

00:19:07.000 You should give us evidence.

00:19:08.000 I just gave you the name of a police officer.

00:19:10.000 I just played CNN where they're saying, get back, they're going to bring the building down, it's going to blow up.

00:19:15.000 Now, what more?

00:19:16.000 I mean, I could go on for hours with these clips and you will not address it.

00:19:20.000 No, it's not that I'm not addressing it.

00:19:22.000 I'm just saying that I don't believe that that evidence proves that there was a conspiracy to demolish World Trade Center 7.

00:19:29.000 And it's something, you know, I accept that we're not going to agree on this.

00:19:32.000 And that's fair enough.

00:19:33.000 And I'm very happy to come on the program and talk about my view and say, look, this is what we found out.

00:19:39.000 If we had found evidence to show that it was demolished by explosives, you know, we would have put that in our film.

00:19:46.000 We're not trying to cover anything up here.

00:19:48.000 All I can say is that I don't believe the evidence that you're putting forward.

00:19:54.000 Alright, stay there.

00:19:54.000 I'd like to hear how you don't believe it and walk through things with Dylan Avery and Paul Joseph Watson on the other side.

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00:23:49.000 293 8024 that's 920 293 8024 and ask for Robert don't wait any longer to get your life back in order we don't need no education We don't need no thought control.

00:24:15.000 Welcome back, Guy Smith!

00:24:18.000 I appreciate him joining us, spending time with us today.

00:24:21.000 BBC producer, director.

00:24:22.000 Guy, I want to let Paul ask you questions.

00:24:26.000 Dylan Avery asks a question first.

00:24:27.000 We do appreciate your time.

00:24:28.000 And in the next segment, it's a long 15-minute segment.

00:24:30.000 This is just a quick five-minute one.

00:24:32.000 We'll let you run for a few minutes, and I'll shut up and hear what you have to say.

00:24:35.000 But I'd like you to answer this question, because we've answered yours.

00:24:37.000 I kept begging you, please let me cover Operation Northwoods, the official U.S. Constitutional government plan to carry out 9-11 style attacks to blame it on a foreign enemy.

00:24:46.000 I said Gulf of Tonkin was staged, now declassified, Operation Ajax in Iran.

00:24:52.000 That's so important that there is a past M.O.

00:24:54.000 You know, the people who try to debunk us always say, why would they do it?

00:24:58.000 What would they gain?

00:24:59.000 Trillions in oil, billions in opium, control, military contracts, domestic police state, just like Hitler burned his own Reichstag. 0.70

00:25:07.000 You told me no, Northwoods isn't going in here, it doesn't fit into it, it doesn't matter.

00:25:13.000 Now tell me why, if you made a film about the 9-11 Truth Movement, why you wouldn't cover the central issues of the history of government-sponsored terror and the history of plans to carry out terror against the American people.

00:25:25.000 Will you please answer that question?

00:25:27.000 Yes indeed, Alex.

00:25:29.000 Operation Northwood is fascinating, and from a historical point of view, it's a very interesting story.

00:25:36.000 But I have yet to see any evidence that links Operation Northwood to what happened on 9-11.

00:25:43.000 There's no doubt that the American government and other governments, no doubt the British government as well, has been involved in all sorts of operations in the past.

00:25:52.000 False flag operations, as you call it.

00:25:55.000 But I have no doubt.

00:25:56.000 I mean, as you mentioned, the Gulf of Tonkin is a very interesting example.

00:26:02.000 But I have no evidence, and I have yet to see any convincing theories that show that what happened with the proposal of Operation Northwoods was put into practice on 9-11.

00:26:15.000 Well, this is why it's important, Guy.

00:26:17.000 And you make a valid point.

00:26:19.000 This is why it's important.

00:26:20.000 Let's say a 6'2 grey haired man with a red birthmark on his left cheek is videotaped Robbing a bank and pistol whipping the clerk.

00:26:31.000 And then the police run through a database of mug books and they notice that a bank robber who fits that description got out of prison six months ago and lives in the area.

00:26:41.000 And they go by his house and they pull him over when he leaves and he's got the cash in the trunk.

00:26:46.000 If you've got people that have done this before and plan to do this, my goodness, I think that's pretty darn important.

00:26:52.000 What do you think?

00:26:53.000 Well, I think that Operation Northwoods was a very interesting subject.

00:26:58.000 You know, it's something that was talked about more than 40 years ago.

00:27:02.000 Just because there was this plan more than 40 years ago, which, you know, I don't deny, you're absolutely right, it existed.

00:27:08.000 Although, of course, it wasn't actually adopted by the President.

00:27:11.000 Well, it was green-lighted and Kennedy said no and then got his head blown off.

00:27:14.000 And let me guess, you don't think the government was involved in killing Kennedy, right?

00:27:18.000 Well, that's a whole other story.

00:27:19.000 I don't know, to be honest, because I haven't investigated the Canadian assassination.

00:27:23.000 Well, the debunkers are losing because 92% of Americans in major polls know the truth now, Guy.

00:27:28.000 Yeah, well, I don't know about JFK, to be honest, but what I do know is that I haven't seen any evidence that links Operation Northwoods to what happened at 9/11.

00:27:39.000 There's no doubt, as I said before, that there are lots of operations that have happened in the past that have been carried out by the American government and other governments that are very unsavory.

00:27:48.000 But that doesn't mean to say that 9/11 was one of those operations because I haven't seen the evidence.

00:27:53.000 If you show me the evidence, you know, then I'll believe it.

00:27:56.000 It shows that they've planned this before and they've carried out operations before.

00:27:59.000 What it shows is that 40 years ago there were people who thought that things like this could be done and should be done.

00:28:06.000 And then in 64 it was done with Tonkin and in 67 it was done with the Liberty and similar things, Operation Gladio in Europe, but let's just go back...

00:28:17.000 doesn't prove that the present occupants of the White House and I'm not defending them anyway I'm just saying I haven't seen the evidence why would British SAS members last year caught dressed up like Arabs driving around shooting people with plastic explosives but well let's just keep on Operation Northwoods remote all I'm saying is that just because there was this plan 40 years ago it doesn't prove that the current occupants of the White House dusted it off and put it into practice in 0.77

00:28:43.000 Even though PNAC said we need a helpful Pearl Harbor event and Brzezinski said we needed a Pearl Harbor event.

00:28:50.000 By the way, Brzezinski said two weeks ago in congressional testimony that there may be a false flag attack blamed on Iran in this country.

00:28:57.000 Well, I think the PNAC report didn't say we should have a Pearl Harbor event.

00:29:02.000 It said it would help, minus that catalyzing event.

00:29:06.000 And then Brzezinski said it would help.

00:29:08.000 I don't think it says actually it would help.

00:29:11.000 I think what it says is that it wouldn't happen unless there was a Pearl Harbor.

00:29:15.000 Gene, we want to invade these countries.

00:29:17.000 It won't happen unless this happens.

00:29:19.000 We need to use this disaster for a new world order.

00:29:21.000 Well, I mean, I hear what you're saying.

00:29:24.000 I guess people who disagree with what you're saying would say If it really was then a plot, why would the PNAC report writers publish their report in advance and put it all over the internet?

00:29:35.000 Because they're arrogant.

00:29:36.000 Stay there.

00:29:37.000 I apologize to Paul and Dylan.

00:29:39.000 We will go to you guys.

00:29:40.000 You can have the floor and questions for Guy Smith on the other side.

00:29:43.000 We'll be right back.

00:29:44.000 Thank you for joining us, guys.

00:29:45.000 Guy, stay with us.

00:29:45.000 We're on the march.

00:29:53.000 The empire's on the run.

00:29:55.000 Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.

00:30:00.000 Hey Jane, how's it going?

00:30:04.000 Gosh, I'm not doing so well.

00:30:06.000 Even though I'm doing everything I'm supposed to do, my blood sugar is way out of control.

00:30:11.000 Oh Jane, I'm sorry to hear that.

00:30:13.000 I have to monitor my blood sugar again.

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00:30:47.000 That's MyBloodSugarBreakthrough.com.

00:30:51.000 So Jane, what do you think?

00:30:52.000 I'm going to call Sucroblast to set up a free consultation right now!

00:30:57.000 Excellent, Jane! 0.96

00:30:57.000 He'll be glad you did. 0.96

00:31:01.000 The disciples asked Jesus in Matthew 24, What shall be the signs of thy coming and the end of the world?

00:31:06.000 You shall hear of wars and rumors of wars.

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00:31:12.000 And there shall be famines, disease, and earthquakes in many places.

00:31:15.000 We are living in this time of Earth's history.

00:31:17.000 Many people are trying to understand the climactic world events in light of human wisdom.

00:31:21.000 But without the wisdom of God, this is impossible!

00:31:24.000 2 Peter says, We have a more sure word of prophecy, and you do well if you take heed.

00:31:29.000 But first know this, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

00:31:34.000 The Bible says, would like you to receive this new offer, packet B, the unholy alliance. 0.95

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00:32:00.000 Hello, friends.

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00:33:00.000 Music In 1814 we took a little trip along with Colonel Jackson down to mighty Mississippi.

00:33:17.000 We took a little bacon and we took a little beans and we caught the bloody British in a town in New Orleans. 1.00

00:33:23.000 We fired our guns and the British kept a coming. 1.00

00:33:26.000 There wasn't as many as there was a while ago.

00:33:28.000 We fired once more and they'd forget to run it.

00:33:31.000 On down to Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

00:33:36.000 We looked down the river and we see the British come and there must have been a hundred of them beating on the drum.

00:33:42.000 They stepped so high and they made the bugles ring.

00:33:44.000 We stood beside our cotton fields and didn't say a thing.

00:33:47.000 We fired our guns and the British kept for coming. 1.00

00:33:50.000 There wasn't as many as there was a while ago.

00:33:53.000 We fired once more and they began to run him on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

00:34:02.000 We can take them by surprise.

00:34:03.000 If we didn't fire muskies till we looked them in the eye. 1.00

00:34:06.000 We held our fire till we seen their faces well.

00:34:09.000 Then we opened up our swirl guns and really gave them well.

00:34:12.000 We fired our guns and the breeze kept on coming.

00:34:15.000 There wasn't as many as there was a while ago.

00:34:18.000 We fired once more and they began to run.

00:34:21.000 Down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

00:34:23.000 Welcome back!

00:34:28.000 Our guest is Guy Smith, BBC producer, director.

00:34:31.000 We appreciate him coming on and letting us go over the piece that he put out.

00:34:37.000 And now I'd like to give Dylan Avery a chance to ask a few questions and then of course Guy can ask questions of him or make statements if he'd like and then Paul Watson to come back in.

00:34:47.000 Dylan Avery, producer of Loose Change 1 and 2.

00:34:50.000 That, by the way, we carry at InfoWars.com and PrisonPlanet.com, where you can watch for free at Google Video, as well as my film, Terror Storm.

00:34:58.000 Let's now go to Guy Smith.

00:35:00.000 Dylan, do you have any questions or comments for him?

00:35:03.000 Yeah, my first one is, how can I drop out of something I never attended?

00:35:09.000 Well, your narrator referred to me as a self-professed dropout, indicating that I actually went to college and stopped attending.

00:35:16.000 When in reality, I applied for Purchase College twice, and because the film program there is entirely selective, I was not selected.

00:35:23.000 So in all of your research, I found it interesting that you couldn't even get the facts about me right.

00:35:28.000 And of course, that's been one of the rumors is that you're this evil dropout.

00:35:31.000 I mean, you know, so is Bill Gates and Rush Limbaugh and Dick Cheney for that matter.

00:35:35.000 But the point is, is that you'd mentioned earlier you thought that would be in the piece.

00:35:40.000 Yeah, guy, you talk about he's a self-professed dropout, but you don't have video of Dylan saying he was a dropout because he never went to college.

00:35:47.000 Yeah, I know Dylan didn't go to college.

00:35:49.000 I guess the way we use the term dropout in English, I don't know about American, is somebody who doesn't go the conventional route.

00:35:57.000 It doesn't mean literally that you dropped out of college because I know that you... Let me bring Paul Watson up.

00:36:02.000 He's English, okay?

00:36:03.000 Let's bring Paul Watson from Sheffield on.

00:36:06.000 Paul, does dropout mean you never went to college?

00:36:09.000 No, drop out implies explicitly that you went to university and were not able to complete the course ergo you dropped out.

00:36:18.000 That's what it means in America, that's what it means in England.

00:36:20.000 Well, it can also mean that you drop out of a system or you drop out of society, you know, it can mean a lot.

00:36:27.000 Well, listen, I am a college dropout, even though I had a 3.8 grade average because I didn't need it.

00:36:33.000 Now, Steve Watson that works in our research department has a master's degree in political science and foreign affairs, so he thinks it's an inside job, too, but he has a master's degree.

00:36:43.000 Is it okay now?

00:36:46.000 I'm not trying to dissuade anybody from believing it's an inside job.

00:36:50.000 If you want to believe it's an inside job, that's fine.

00:36:52.000 That's up to you.

00:36:53.000 I fully accept that you have a right to think that.

00:36:58.000 All I can say is that we investigated the story.

00:37:01.000 We looked into it.

00:37:03.000 We didn't find the evidence that supports that theory.

00:37:06.000 That's all.

00:37:07.000 you know there's nothing more to it than that well you know what maybe Paul in Sheffield it means different so maybe somebody from London born and bred London call in 1-800-259-9231 let us know does drop out me never went to college because in my book that's not what it means and Paul says you're incorrect Come on Guy, we know it's a snipe at Dylan Avery.

00:37:29.000 You know, like he's some gutter snipe miscreant out there rubbing his oily hands together and attacking the beautiful crown's operation.

00:37:38.000 Well, I would say on the contrary.

00:37:41.000 We interviewed Dylan for the film and we showed how his film has had enormous impact and it's been viewed tens of millions of times all around the world.

00:37:48.000 And we were trying to make a serious point.

00:37:50.000 We were showing how now conspiracy theories can proliferate through the internet in a way that they couldn't have done in the past.

00:37:57.000 Do you think there should be some type of regulation to stop this type of hateful spread?

00:38:01.000 No, no, not at all.

00:38:03.000 I think it's a very healthy thing for society.

00:38:06.000 And I think it's great that you're talking about it, and that's why I'm very happy to come on your show.

00:38:12.000 Because I think it's good that we should talk about all these things.

00:38:14.000 I think that's really important, and that's why we made the program.

00:38:17.000 Okay, fair enough.

00:38:18.000 Dylan, any other questions?

00:38:19.000 Dylan, any other questions?

00:38:21.000 Man, Alex, I got tons of questions.

00:38:23.000 My first one is, you know, Guy, your narrator makes a lot of jabs about how we're disrespecting the family members and how we're going to continue to ask questions no matter how much it displeases the victims.

00:38:34.000 Have you ever heard of the Jersey Girls?

00:38:36.000 Maybe the Family Steering Committee?

00:38:38.000 Maybe Bill Doyle?

00:38:39.000 Maybe Bob McElveen?

00:38:41.000 The head of the biggest victim's family group who lost his son in the attacks said that he believes it's an inside job.

00:38:51.000 We have the transcript and the audio on PrisonPlanet.com and he said this last year and he said that more than half of his members believe it's an inside job.

00:38:58.000 So what do you say to that guy?

00:39:00.000 Well, what I say is that I accept that they have the right to that view.

00:39:03.000 All I can say is that we didn't come to that conclusion.

00:39:07.000 Yes, there'll be many people who are families of victims who support the conspiracy theories, claiming that it was an inside job.

00:39:14.000 The official story's a conspiracy theory, guy!

00:39:17.000 You claim two passports fell out of the sky at ground zero, unburned, and then the FBI had to retract that?

00:39:23.000 They planted those passports!

00:39:26.000 Well, I haven't seen any evidence to prove that those passports were found.

00:39:30.000 I've seen lots of theories on the internet.

00:39:33.000 No, the FBI has now said that they didn't find the passports.

00:39:38.000 You didn't know that?

00:39:39.000 Well, I think the passports, as I understand it, were found by passers-by and handed in to the FBI.

00:39:46.000 Oh my gosh, just like all the confession letters.

00:39:49.000 Hey, I tried to get you to talk about how the Dean of the Defense Language School said three of the hijackers trained in a secret program in 2000 in Monterey, California.

00:39:58.000 I tried to get you to cover Newsweek, where hijackers were reportedly trained at the Pensacola Naval Air Station.

00:40:04.000 I tried to get you to interview Mr. Springman, the former head of the U.S.

00:40:06.000 Embassy, who was told, let them into the U.S., they're really anti-terror fighters, and that their terror designation's a cover.

00:40:13.000 Guy, why didn't that make it in the film?

00:40:15.000 Well, there are over 50 different conspiracy theories around 9-11.

00:40:19.000 That's admitted, sir!

00:40:21.000 They started court-martialing the head of the Defense Language School until he said he would shut up about it.

00:40:28.000 I talked to him!

00:40:31.000 What's the bottom line that you're trying to say, Alex?

00:40:34.000 Are you saying that we're part of this conspiracy?

00:40:38.000 Well, I'm saying that just like people in Russia or Germany or China couldn't believe the government had gone bad and then later they had to admit it,

00:40:47.000 I think that you have a preconceived notion, a preconceived view, and I'm saying you disregarded most of the key evidence, like 44,000 US troops and 18,000 British troops massed in Tajikistan and Uzbekistan in the four months before 9-11, and Newsweek and Associated Press reporting that Bush, the day before the attacks, had the launch orders to attack Afghanistan on his desk.

00:41:10.000 Well, I mean, it's very difficult to answer some of these points, because what you're doing is you're quoting things that you claim that you've heard, and there's some things that are on the internet and... No, they're mainstream!

00:41:22.000 Okay, let me stop you right there.

00:41:24.000 What about the two FBI agents that went to prison for insider trading before 9-11?

00:41:31.000 Well, I don't know the details of that particular story, but I do know that there are a lot of stories that are circulating on the internet that are not based on fact.

00:41:43.000 They're based on supposition.

00:41:44.000 You're not basing that on fact.

00:41:46.000 You're not giving facts.

00:41:47.000 Let me just go back here.

00:41:48.000 Do you know where the story of the Israelis not being in the building came from?

00:41:51.000 It came from Harots and the Jerusalem Post, because Odigo instant messaging head said, yes, we got a call that something was going to happen, get our people out of the building, and most 9-11 researchers say that Israel clearly wasn't running the attacks.

00:42:05.000 May have been in some small support role because MI6, Mossad, Chinmet, CIA are all joined at the hip.

00:42:11.000 That's a real report that indeed there were warnings.

00:42:14.000 The Arabs weren't in the buildings either because they had warnings and there were locals doing insider trading.

00:42:19.000 Everybody seemed to know about it.

00:42:21.000 The buildings were at half capacity that day.

00:42:23.000 Well, all I can say, Alex, is that that's a view.

00:42:26.000 I don't share that view from the research that we've done.

00:42:29.000 What view?

00:42:30.000 Are you denying that Odigo's head was in the newspapers in Israel saying they got a warning?

00:42:34.000 Clearly showing they weren't involved because they were public, going, you know, we got warnings.

00:42:38.000 I think what you've done here, Alex, is you've raised a very interesting and important point, and that is that much of what is on the internet about 9-11 is based on news reports.

00:42:49.000 Now, those news reports are not necessarily always accurate.

00:42:52.000 What happens, as we've seen with the conspiracy theory alleging that 4,000 Jews didn't turn up for work that day, is that the story gets into the media and then it gets twisted and distorted, like what we call in England, Chinese whispers.

00:43:06.000 And it just continues and proliferates and becomes more and more complicated.

00:43:11.000 And what we tried to do in our research was to go back to primary sources, to eyewitnesses, and we presented that information.

00:43:20.000 Now, I fully accept that many people who are listening to your program won't accept that.

00:43:25.000 All I'm asking people to do, I guess, is to watch our program with an open mind, Well, Mr. Smith says let people come to their own conclusions.

00:43:32.000 How is that possible when the program is laden with so much bias?

00:43:35.000 Let me get a comment for Paul Watson.

00:43:36.000 That's part of a good, healthy debate in a democratic society.

00:43:40.000 Sure.

00:43:40.000 Paul Watson, you've got more comments?

00:43:41.000 Well, Mr. Smith says, let people come to their own conclusions.

00:43:45.000 How is that possible when the program is laden with so much bias?

00:43:49.000 We keep hearing this word objective.

00:43:52.000 My question is, how can Mr. Smith justify using the strong implication on numerous occasions throughout the documentary that questioning the official story of 9-11 is insulting and hurtful to the victims?

00:44:06.000 How can he justify such a blatant and cynical attempt to emotionally sway the viewer when we've had Bill Doyle on the program, who is the largest representative, the largest group of 9-11 families, and it was a government cover-up in itself in the very hours after 9-11, The result of which, now we have a situation where 20% of the first responders are dying from that government cover-up.

00:44:29.000 And by the way, major medical institutions admit their lungs are full of asbestos and concrete, and we have the internal EPA documents where they were ordered to shut it down and cover it up.

00:44:40.000 That's been in all the major US newspapers, and we were called conspiracy theorists on that.

00:44:45.000 The truth is, every time the government does something wrong, they just say we're conspiracy theorists.

00:44:50.000 Mr. Smith?

00:44:51.000 Yeah, let me go back to the point that Paul was making.

00:44:54.000 Yes, there are some relatives who are very much in favor of what you're doing and suggesting that this is an inside job.

00:45:02.000 The majority!

00:45:03.000 But there are also many relatives of victims of 9-11 who find what you're doing deeply abhorrent.

00:45:10.000 But you claimed it was all of them!

00:45:12.000 You implied it was all of them!

00:45:14.000 It's the bias.

00:45:15.000 Well, I didn't imply it was all of them.

00:45:17.000 We said that we had talked to many relatives.

00:45:20.000 You did imply he's a dropout.

00:45:22.000 You did imply it was all of them. 0.98

00:45:24.000 You had some psychological test on there where basically you're a bunch of shut-in nuts and it's a religion.

00:45:29.000 And you had some fiction writer get up there from the Lone Gunman and the X-Files for the show, the producer, and basically say that it's a religion that we have.

00:45:39.000 No, sir.

00:45:40.000 Steel doesn't melt until over 2700 degrees.

00:45:43.000 And there were people in the wounds of those buildings, waving, begging for help, and then giant columns severed right next to them, and then there was molten steel.

00:45:51.000 That's a fact.

00:45:53.000 Well, I mean, again, I come back to the fundamental point.

00:45:58.000 You're saying that it was an inside job carried out by the American government to start a war for oil in the Middle East and in Asia.

00:46:08.000 I hear that view and I accept that there are many people who believe that view.

00:46:13.000 All I can say is that having looked at the story, having researched the story, having talked to many eyewitnesses, we don't come to the same conclusion in our program.

00:46:23.000 Hey, I've played eyewitnesses saying, get back, they're going to blow up the building, and I've got a bunch of other clips I can play.

00:46:28.000 I give the actual witnesses, I give names, we sent you police officers, we sent you people, and you didn't interview them, and you make these large, broad-brush statements about how you've disproven what we've said, and it isn't true.

00:46:41.000 Does Mr. Smith admit that there was a bias in editing before the editing of his program, and that he had already come to the conclusion Yeah, he told me that at P.F.

00:46:53.000 Chang's restaurant that he didn't agree with me about this stuff.

00:46:56.000 He doesn't agree about Dr. Kelly.

00:47:00.000 You're held to a higher standard as a BBC journalist to produce the Balance Programme and you've already come to a bias before you've even finished the filming.

00:47:08.000 Do you admit that?

00:47:11.000 We went into this project with an open mind.

00:47:14.000 And let's face it, if supposing during our research we had found that some of these conspiracy theories were true, We would have certainly put that into the film, because actually, it would have made a much more dramatic and sensational film.

00:47:26.000 We'd be all over the front page of the newspapers this morning.

00:47:29.000 Yeah, and then Blair wouldn't take a bunch of your funding again and make your director resign. 0.88

00:47:35.000 Nobody's trying to censor us.

00:47:36.000 Oh, come on! 0.99

00:47:37.000 Everybody knows they've been censoring the BBC!

00:47:40.000 Hell, in your country, they arrested Robin Page for saying that rural communities deserve rights! 1.00

00:47:48.000 I can absolutely give you an assurance that nobody is trying to censor what we were saying in this program.

00:47:54.000 And if we had found through our objective research some evidence to back up the theory that World Trade Center 7 was demolished or United 93 didn't crash at Shanksville, then we would have put that into the program.

00:48:08.000 I mean, will you help to smith?

00:48:09.000 Your conclusion is not based on the evidence.

00:48:11.000 They were based on portraying Dylan Avery and Alex Jones as a kind of religious cult.

00:48:15.000 You called Alex an evangelical preacher, basically.

00:48:19.000 And then you cut to the X-Files guy saying we're a religion.

00:48:24.000 Well, he didn't say a religion.

00:48:26.000 He was talking about why people believe in conspiracy theories nowadays, and I think he made a very valid point about how in the past we found it difficult to understand what was going on in our world, so we created myths, and now what we're doing is doing much the same sort of thing.

00:48:42.000 9-11's a myth! 1.00

00:48:44.000 Can I ask you a question, Alex?

00:48:45.000 Mr. Smith. 0.97

00:48:46.000 It's ridiculous.

00:48:47.000 NIST has given five different reasons building Sevenfell, and now they're saying it could have been because of explosions.

00:48:54.000 Can I ask you a question, Alex?

00:48:58.000 Sure.

00:48:58.000 Now, I hear what you're saying, and there are many people who will agree with you, but some of the people who oppose what you're saying and who disagree with what you're saying may ask this question, and that is, why is it that nobody in the five years since 9-11 who is involved in that conspiracy why is it that nobody in the five years since 9-11 who is involved in that conspiracy has come Because it would only take a few hundred people to run the op.

00:49:24.000 Many people that were involved, I believe they were involved in a simulation.

00:49:27.000 That's how they bootleg it.

00:49:29.000 And they've done this many, many times.

00:49:30.000 Let me give you an example.

00:49:31.000 Stop! 1.00

00:49:32.000 Let me ask you a question.

00:49:34.000 5,000 plus U.S.

00:49:36.000 troops died from 1959 to 1964 when the Vietnam War officially kicked off.

00:49:41.000 And they didn't announce until 1965 A year after the war was really on, that thousands had died in covert operations previously.

00:49:50.000 Thousands of U.S.

00:49:51.000 troops have died in Colombia in the last 10 years, and that's only barely come out.

00:49:56.000 Okay?

00:49:57.000 They covered up, until they wanted to, 5,000 dead U.S.

00:50:02.000 troops, just like the Russians covered up their true losses in Afghanistan.

00:50:06.000 So don't tell me for a minute they can't keep Black Ops secret.

00:50:10.000 I am absolutely convinced that if there was a Black Ops, as you say, on 9-11, it first of all would have involved not just hundreds but thousands of people.

00:50:21.000 And I'm quite sure that that Black Ops would have leaked by now.

00:50:25.000 That people, you know, tell their wives, they tell their girlfriends, they tell their priests they feel guilty about what they've done.

00:50:31.000 This was a black ops operation, if what you say is true, that was against the American people. 0.79

00:50:37.000 I'm absolutely certain that that story would have leaked out by now.

00:50:41.000 People would have talked.

00:50:42.000 It has been leaking.

00:50:44.000 It has been leaking with firefighters and police talking about how they were told to get back, that they were going to blow up Building 7.

00:50:50.000 And more and more is going to leak.

00:50:51.000 And people like Sybil Edmonds who want to talk have been gagged, and FBI agent Robert Wright has been told he'll be arrested if he tells people what he knows.

00:50:59.000 All he said is the Butch's vacation with the bin Laden.

00:51:01.000 It's here, after a year in production and traveling to distant lands.

00:51:08.000 My new film, Terror Storm, is complete.

00:51:10.000 Shocking declassified government documents prove that Western governments are orchestrating terror attacks against their own populations as a pretext to enslave them.

00:51:19.000 Terror Storm proves that not only was 9-11 an inside job, but the attacks of 7-7 in London were carried out by British intelligence.

00:51:26.000 Terror Storm chronicles the lies that took us to war in Iran, the White House program to disseminate fake news, NSA spying, secret police torture, the latest 9-11 information, and much, much more.

00:51:38.000 Terror Storm is the definitive guide to the history of government-sponsored terrorism.

00:51:42.000 It's an anthology of government crimes.

00:51:44.000 Terror Storm is a film that everyone who wants to be truly informed must see.

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00:52:57.000 Not yet available in Iowa.

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00:53:59.000 The End of the Day.

00:54:11.000 We appreciate you spending an hour with us.

00:54:13.000 We want you to know that we see what the piece did.

00:54:16.000 Tugging on the heartstrings.

00:54:17.000 Oh, look how we're putting all this out.

00:54:19.000 It's not going to work.

00:54:20.000 We're going to totally dissect it 110%.

00:54:23.000 But you didn't get into Pakistan ISI.

00:54:26.000 You didn't get into $100,000 wired to Muhammad Atta.

00:54:29.000 You didn't cover any of that.

00:54:31.000 And people are going to look at that.

00:54:35.000 Are you a little concerned now over the huge furor this has created, or do you like it?

00:54:39.000 No, not at all.

00:54:40.000 I think it's great that people are discussing this subject, and it's a really good thing that people are coming to their own conclusions.

00:54:48.000 And I absolutely accept that many people will believe that there are conspiracy theories that are true, and that's good, that's fine.

00:54:56.000 You keep using that little pacifier, your blanket, that it's a conspiracy theory, conspiracy theory.

00:55:03.000 No, corruption and evil in the global empire.

00:55:05.000 Do you believe there's a one world government being formed?

00:55:07.000 I mean, do you even know that's real?

00:55:10.000 Well, I don't know whether there's a one-world government being formed or not.

00:55:15.000 The brief of our program was to look at what happened at 9-11.

00:55:18.000 Yeah, but I mean, I had dinner with you.

00:55:20.000 You don't think Dr. Kelly was killed even when he said he was.

00:55:23.000 You don't think Diana was killed by the government even when she said it.

00:55:25.000 I mean, she said, Charles says he's going to kill me in a fake auto accident, and you just poo-poo that.

00:55:29.000 I mean, that'd be like if I said, Billy Bob says he's going to kill me with a battle axe, and I'm killed a week later and people saw Billy Bob walking away.

00:55:36.000 Oh no, Billy Bob's not involved!

00:55:38.000 Let's go ahead and go to Paul.

00:55:40.000 Paul, quickly, fire your final questions at his lordship.

00:55:44.000 Well, in a sense, Mr. Smith tags us with the label of conspiracy theorists when he supports the official conspiracy theory.

00:55:52.000 And in doing so, he uses a sole clip of a firefighter on 9-11 discussing damage to Building 7's sprinkler system, while omitting literally dozens and dozens of reports both footage and from the official firefighter tapes who reported bombs at all levels of the Twin Towers and Building 7.

00:56:12.000 And that is not part of his documentary which suggests clear bias because he's using individual clips to-- - Yeah, he keeps saying show evidence, we show it and then he ignores it. - The evidence that we presented in the program is the evidence that we believe to be credible There are many stories that World Trade Center 7 was demolished by explosives.

00:56:36.000 I have yet to see any credible evidence that stands that theory up.

00:56:40.000 Just as I have yet to see any... So the fact that it's bought in bombs is not credible?

00:56:44.000 You didn't even mention it.

00:56:46.000 You didn't even have to conclude that it was right.

00:56:48.000 You could have just mentioned it.

00:56:50.000 But it's not a balanced piece, Guy.

00:56:52.000 It's a biased piece.

00:56:54.000 And everyone can see that.

00:56:56.000 Well, it's interesting because as well as hearing from the likes of you, I've also had many emails and calls from people who are saying that we're giving too much air time to the conspiracy theories.

00:57:07.000 So I guess It's like one can't please everyone all the time.

00:57:11.000 No, no, we understand, and I appreciate you at least coming on this show.

00:57:15.000 Real fast, Dylan Avery, final question.

00:57:18.000 Yeah, you know, throughout the documentary and throughout this interview, Guy talks a lot about following the evidence and how he feels that he covers the 9/11 truth movement, when in reality, as you mentioned, Alex, there was a glaring omission from this BBC documentary that any objective documentary would have covered.

00:57:33.000 Although he lauded the fact that two of the hijackers live with a tested FBI informant, he refused to ask Senator Bob Graham why, on the morning of 9-11, He was meeting with George Tenet of the CIA and the head of the Pakistani ISI who had wired Mohammed Anna, the lead hijacker, $100,000 right before the attacks.

00:57:51.000 Yeah, the role of the Pakistani ISI is a fascinating story and that's actually something that we could well be returning to in another program.

00:57:59.000 We might be making a whole program about that connection between Pakistan and the hijackers. 1.00

00:58:04.000 Getting another bucket of white paint out for that, huh?

00:58:08.000 I'd say watch this space because that is a very interesting story.

00:58:12.000 Guy Smith, I appreciate you spending time with us, and I hope to get you back up in the future in the next few months as this develops.

00:58:18.000 Can we have you back on?

00:58:20.000 Yeah, I'd be happy to come back on.

00:58:21.000 And I think if I could just say one final thing very quickly, and that is the good thing, that it's great to talk about these subjects.

00:58:26.000 It's great to air different points of view.

00:58:29.000 It is.

00:58:30.000 I appreciate you coming on.

00:58:31.000 It's good to get us thinking.

00:58:32.000 I want to thank Paul Watson, Dylan Avery.

00:58:33.000 We'll be back tonight, 9 to midnight.

00:58:35.000 Back tomorrow, 11 to 2.

00:58:36.000 PrisonPlanet.com and InfoWars.com.

00:58:38.000 Google Terror Storm.

00:58:39.000 Terror Storm.

00:58:41.000 If you would like a copy of this show, come to GCNlive.com and reserve it today, or call toll-free 877-376-45.

00:58:47.000 Mainstream media.

00:58:47.000 Big Brother.

00:58:48.000 Government cover-ups.

00:58:53.000 Big Brother.

00:58:59.000 Mainstream media.

00:59:00.000 Government cover-ups.

00:59:02.000 You want answers?

00:59:04.000 Well, so does he.

00:59:06.000 He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.

00:59:10.000 And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.

00:59:19.000 We first interviewed him almost three years ago, and he's been on the case for a lot longer than that.

00:59:27.000 Yesterday, at the end of the broadcast, my radio producer walked in with the Salt Lake City Tribune headline, Nichols McVeigh had high-level FBI help.

00:59:36.000 Here is the Desert News headline, Nichols says bomb was FBI op.

00:59:42.000 We've known this from a massive mountain of confirmed evidence.

00:59:47.000 since just months after the horrible attack that killed 163 people back in 1995.

00:59:53.000 But now Jesse Trinidue, on the trail of who murdered his brother in federal prison, Kenneth Trinidue, and we have the horrible autopsy photos up on Infowars.com and PrisonPlanet.com, has literally been spending much of his life on this case, has literally been spending much of his life on this case, a successful attorney and lawyer counselor in his own And I just got in touch with him this morning after I learned of this last night.

01:00:22.000 I went on coast-to-coast AM and covered it.

01:00:25.000 And he joins us now for the next 30 minutes, and I hopefully will be able to line him up for an hour early next week so we can get into more detail.

01:00:35.000 He's given us some of the documents, the case.

01:00:37.000 Those are going up on Infowars.com right now.

01:00:40.000 This is bombshell material.

01:00:43.000 Literally, maybe once a year will my heart start beating faster with the story.

01:00:48.000 That's happening right now.

01:00:50.000 So joining us is Jesse Trinidou.

01:00:53.000 Thank you so much for joining us, sir.

01:00:55.000 Thank you for having me.

01:00:56.000 You, if I'm not mistaken, were the first one to broadcast this story back in 2004.

01:01:01.000 Well, now it's really broken wide open thanks to your work.

01:01:04.000 We've got three minutes before break and we'll come back in detail at all, but just out of the gate, tell us in a nutshell about yourself, about your brother, how you got involved in this case, and now the prison interview you did with Larry Nichols.

01:01:17.000 It's unbelievable.

01:01:18.000 Well, basically my brother was killed a few months after the bombing.

01:01:23.000 He had Been convicted of a federal crime back in the late 70s, had done his time.

01:01:30.000 He was paroled in 1988.

01:01:32.000 He had a dispute with his probation officer about drinking beer.

01:01:36.000 We challenged that and lost.

01:01:38.000 A couple months after the bombing, my brother is driving across the border.

01:01:42.000 He lived in San Diego.

01:01:43.000 He'd been over visiting friends in Mexico.

01:01:45.000 He's arrested, supposedly, for parole violation.

01:01:49.000 At the time, we didn't understand that it didn't make sense.

01:01:53.000 We assumed that was what it was for.

01:01:56.000 In hindsight, now it's clear that wasn't the case because the judge who sentenced him was in San Diego.

01:02:02.000 The crime was committed in San Diego.

01:02:04.000 His probation officer was in San Diego.

01:02:07.000 Any parole hearing would have to be in San Diego.

01:02:10.000 So he was sent to Oklahoma City for some reason and was dead two days later.

01:02:14.000 And we never had a A reason for it.

01:02:19.000 Now they claimed it was suicide, but he again had electrical burn marks, cuts, and bruises over his entire body.

01:02:25.000 It is truly grisly.

01:02:26.000 He was clearly tortured to death.

01:02:28.000 And he was, his throat was flashed.

01:02:31.000 In the, all while in federal custody.

01:02:35.000 And the government said it was, they tried to have his body cremated before we saw him, and then finally, We get him home, but we never had a motive, and that was difficult to say to people why the FBI especially would have killed him and tortured him.

01:02:50.000 Now, we're going to get to that later, but in the process of your investigation, you've now got the documents, the affidavit has been sealed, so you can't talk about certain names, but before it got sealed by the feds in a desperate attempt to block this evidence from coming out, We do have the names, we do have the information, because you were able to tell different news reporters about this, in particular the Desert News, Desert Rain News, before that happened.

01:03:17.000 So we're going to go over this after the break, but I want to get into how you got in contact with Larry Nichols, why he's now gone public, and by the way, his story fits exactly with what the FBI, police, investigators, and many others have brought forward in the What 11 plus years since the OKC bombing in 1995.

01:03:38.000 Our guest is Jesse Trinidou.

01:03:40.000 We'll be back after this quick break to detail this.

01:03:43.000 This story is ultra massive and incredibly important.

01:03:46.000 It's here after a year in production and traveling to distant lands.

01:03:59.000 My new film Terror Storm is complete.

01:04:02.000 Shocking declassified government documents prove that western governments are orchestrating terror attacks against their own populations as a pretext to enslave them.

01:04:10.000 Terror Storm proves that not only was 9-11 an inside job, but the attacks of 7-7 in London were carried out by British intelligence.

01:04:18.000 Terror Storm chronicles the lies that took us to war in Iran, a White House program to disseminate fake news, NSA spying, secret police torture, the latest 9-11 information, and much, much more.

01:04:30.000 Terror Storm is the definitive guide to the history of government-sponsored terrorism.

01:04:34.000 It's an anthology of government crimes.

01:04:36.000 Terror Storm is a film that everyone who wants to be truly informed must see.

01:04:40.000 Get your copy today at Infowars.com or PrisonPlanet.com or by calling toll-free 1-888-253-3139 or watch it right now online at PrisonPlanet.tv.

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01:06:55.000 He's the T-Rex of political talk, Alex Jones, on the GCN Radio Network.

01:07:00.000 It is the 22nd day of February, Thursday, 2007.

01:07:04.000 One of the most important broadcasts I've ever done.

01:07:08.000 It is the 22nd day of February, Thursday, 2007.

01:07:14.000 One of the most important broadcasts I've ever done.

01:07:17.000 It was almost three years ago that I interviewed Jesse Trinidad, whose brother Kenneth Trinidad was murdered.

01:07:24.000 That's how this lawyer got on the case.

01:07:26.000 And my God, does it fit him with all the other evidence we have.

01:07:29.000 Unfortunately, it shows that the Oklahoma City bombing of the Alfred P. Murrow building was an inside job.

01:07:36.000 Here's the headline out of the Desert News.

01:07:38.000 And before the filing was sealed, the reporters were able to see it.

01:07:43.000 Now, our guest is unable to specifically talk about the filing.

01:07:47.000 And the most shocking allegation, the 19-page signed declaration by Nichols, assertion that the whole bombing plot was an FBI operation that McVeigh let slip during a bout of anger that he was taking instructions from Former FBI official Larry Potts, who helped run the Ruby Ridge debacle, very senior, personal friends, very high level with the then FBI director.

01:08:13.000 McVeigh also said he was part of a secret military assassins team who had been recruited out of the military.

01:08:18.000 That's exactly the M.O.

01:08:19.000 we have from state police, local police, detectives and FBI.

01:08:23.000 This is absolutely off the charts, incredible.

01:08:26.000 And guess who got in and got this affidavit?

01:08:28.000 It is the man we're speaking to right now, Jesse Trinidad, who got in to see Larry Nichols, and that is a saga in and of itself.

01:08:38.000 Let's walk through it, please, sir.

01:08:40.000 Basically, I didn't start out to solve the Oklahoma City bombing.

01:08:44.000 I started out to find out who killed my brother and why.

01:08:48.000 It all started in the Probably December of 95 or January of 96 and I got an anonymous call.

01:08:55.000 The caller said that my brother had been killed by the FBI, that it was a case of mistaken identity, that it was an interrogation and got out of hand, that my brother fit the profile, the caller said.

01:09:06.000 Of a group who were robbing banks and to fund the tax, get the money to fund the tax on the federal government.

01:09:12.000 So somebody had a conscience and called you?

01:09:14.000 Called me.

01:09:15.000 And of course I dismissed it.

01:09:17.000 I thought it was far-fetched, unbelievable.

01:09:20.000 And then about six months later I read a story in the Los Angeles Times about a man named Richard Lee Guthrie who was found hanging in his cell while in federal custody.

01:09:30.000 He was supposed to give a tell-all interview the next day before he died.

01:09:35.000 About the Oklahoma City bombing.

01:09:37.000 He was a member of a group called the Midwest Bank Robbery Gang.

01:09:40.000 And the story said he had robbed banks to get money to attack the federal government.

01:09:45.000 And they didn't have a photograph of Guthrie, though, just the story.

01:09:48.000 And then shortly before he was executed, I received a message from Timothy McVeigh, who told me that when he saw my brother's photograph and heard what happened to him, he knew that the FBI killed my brother because they mistook him for Richard Lee Guthrie.

01:10:02.000 And Guthrie, I believe, was John Doe, too.

01:10:05.000 In the description for my Pejando 2 when my brother was picked up was white male, 5 foot 9, powerful upper body build, dark complected, believed to be in Canada or Mexico, driving mid-1980s Chevrolet pickup, dragon tattoo left forearm.

01:10:21.000 My brother comes across the border in San Diego in his friend's 1986 Chevrolet pickup, Five foot nine, powerful upper body build, dark complected, dragon tattooed left forearm.

01:10:33.000 The only other person I know of with that description was Richard Lee Guthrie.

01:10:36.000 So they clearly killed your brother and Guthrie in prison with the same classic hanging.

01:10:41.000 Hanging.

01:10:45.000 Unbelievable.

01:10:46.000 Please continue.

01:10:47.000 Well, as I said, we had, it was difficult.

01:10:51.000 To convince people my brother had been murdered.

01:10:53.000 Because no one likes to think the government of the United States does those kind of things.

01:10:57.000 But we have the autopsy photos.

01:10:58.000 Please describe those.

01:11:00.000 Well, he was head was smashed to the skull in three places.

01:11:03.000 His throat was slashed.

01:11:05.000 A stun gun burns all over his body.

01:11:07.000 Even the soles of his feet are bruised from being beaten.

01:11:09.000 He was beaten head to toe, front to back.

01:11:11.000 Tortured extensively.

01:11:12.000 And then he was, we now know, was strangled with a pair of plastic handcuffs.

01:11:17.000 After they'd beaten him to a pulp.

01:11:20.000 And obviously he couldn't tell him anything because he didn't know anything.

01:11:24.000 But that started me on the quest to... Like I said, I didn't start off to solve the bombing.

01:11:29.000 I started off to find the man who killed my brother.

01:11:32.000 But every trail has taken me back to the bombing.

01:11:35.000 And that's when I filed that lawsuit here in federal court in Utah.

01:11:40.000 Asking the judge to order the FBI to produce all documents related to a failed sting operation.

01:11:48.000 They were running in a white supremacist paramilitary training camp in eastern Oklahoma called Elohim City.

01:11:55.000 And that led to the bombing.

01:11:57.000 It got out of hand.

01:12:00.000 Let's walk through how you were able to get in touch with Nichols, how he tried to contact John Ashcroft, how the media was then blocked from ever being able to reach him, how you were able to get in, and what Larry Nichols told you.

01:12:11.000 Well, Terry Nichols reached out to me apparently before he contacted me several years ago.

01:12:18.000 He had written to Attorney General Ashcroft, volunteering to tell everything he knew about the bombing and the others involved.

01:12:26.000 Not only did no one from Attorney General Ashcroft's office followed up with Nichols.

01:12:32.000 They actually issued, apparently, an order barring him from all contact with the media.

01:12:37.000 It was thereafter that he reached out to me and I was able to get in to see him and spend a day and a half with him.

01:12:42.000 Describe how he reached out, what you had to go through to be able to meet with him, and what happened in an hour and a half meeting.

01:12:47.000 It was a day and a half.

01:12:49.000 Day and a half, excuse me.

01:12:51.000 Basically, I was able to come in under the radar.

01:12:53.000 I'm sure that if they'd known why I was there, I would never have gotten in.

01:12:57.000 But you're a lawyer, you're a counselor, that probably helped you out.

01:13:00.000 I'm sure it did, but the real story is that this man apparently wants to tell his story.

01:13:06.000 Now, I can't assure your audiences that what he says is true.

01:13:11.000 You, sir, have more knowledge about the... I mean, you're relating things about the history of the bombing case that I wasn't aware of, so you apparently have studied this a long time and know a lot about it, a lot more than I do.

01:13:23.000 Well, I made my first film about it in 1997, but I've just interviewed literally hundreds of experts on the subject.

01:13:31.000 Now, I know they've sealed this, but we can talk about what the press has reported and any other facets you feel comfortable in getting into.

01:13:37.000 What did Larry Nichols tell you?

01:13:39.000 What's in the affidavit?

01:13:42.000 That I don't feel comfortable talking about, but this I can tell you what is already out there in the public record as a result of this lawsuit, the lead meat.

01:13:51.000 Uh, to go see Mr. Nichols.

01:13:53.000 Sure.

01:13:53.000 Uh, when you sue under the Freedom of Information Act, there, for documents, government documents, there are two exemptions that are bulletproof that you cannot get around, that you will not get the documents.

01:14:06.000 National Security and... Well, that's, that's actually three.

01:14:09.000 That's, the other one, the other two are, uh, if there's an ongoing criminal investigation Or if the government has promised anonymity or confidentiality to informants.

01:14:22.000 I was fearful that the government would come back, the FBI would come back and say they had reopened the investigation.

01:14:27.000 In which case I would have gotten nothing.

01:14:29.000 Instead they came back and told the federal judge that they had promised confidentiality to four informants.

01:14:36.000 And please not to turn over any documents.

01:14:38.000 Well the judge said he would allow them to black the names out.

01:14:42.000 But to turn the documents over.

01:14:44.000 And the documents show that the FBI's informants were robbing banks and armored cars with Tim McVeigh to get the money to construct the bomb.

01:14:53.000 And that one of the four informants was actually the explosives instructor who taught them how to make the bomb.

01:15:00.000 Now to be specific here, this could be creating the history, the ledger, and this is what McVeigh said, they were staging fake robberies to create the illusion that it was an organic domestic group that was going to carry out the attacks.

01:15:13.000 Classic black ops, where they go out and engage in criminal activities as a smoke screen. 0.90

01:15:19.000 That's basically what some of the things that Nichols said.

01:15:24.000 Sure.

01:15:25.000 Classic black op, gladio type op.

01:15:29.000 Please continue.

01:15:31.000 The, as I said, the documents are, it's not me making this up, the documents show that at least as recently as two days before the bombing that they actually called Elohim City asking for help, and this was reported by one of the informants, that four months before the bombing another informant had not only reported the plan, but had said that they had actually scouted the target.

01:15:57.000 Now, Hal was one of the informants earlier, and she tried to warn them, and then they tried to arrest her and charge her, telling her to shut up.

01:16:05.000 They did prosecute her, but she wasn't convicted.

01:16:07.000 Yes.

01:16:07.000 I understand.

01:16:09.000 Please continue.

01:16:11.000 And, uh, so many of these things had, uh, I would not have gotten where I am today on this, but for people have, and I don't know who has done it, had leaked me copies of records.

01:16:23.000 There's a lot of feds that don't like killing kids in a daycare. 1.00

01:16:26.000 They're not going to put up with it.

01:16:28.000 And that made my case in front of the federal judges.

01:16:31.000 I had, unknown to the FBI, I had two copies, two documents already about this operation.

01:16:38.000 And so when I asked for the records, they came back, the FBI did, and reported to the judge that there were no such documents.

01:16:46.000 And then I filed those two copies, and then the FBI came back and said that they were fake, and I had an affidavit from an FBI agent who said they were real.

01:16:54.000 And with that, the judge lost all patience with the FBI.

01:16:58.000 They had no credibility with him.

01:16:59.000 And then later, didn't it turn out that similar documents and some of the same documents had been released before, but without some of the names blacked out, and then that proved they were real?

01:17:08.000 Yes.

01:17:09.000 Yes, they'd found their way out through another source, apparently.

01:17:13.000 Which confirms it.

01:17:14.000 They never denied the documents.

01:17:16.000 They now conceded.

01:17:17.000 And when they were ordered to produce them, to do a manual search, they came back and produced about 100 pages of them.

01:17:25.000 Where does it go from here?

01:17:26.000 I mean, where does your suit go?

01:17:28.000 How much danger is Nichols in?

01:17:32.000 Quite honestly, I'm afraid, I'm surprised he's still alive.

01:17:36.000 Not only is my brother dead, Guthrie dead, I had an eyewitness to my brother's murder and he was found hanging in his cell too.

01:17:43.000 Uh, people have a habit of dying off in this case.

01:17:50.000 But I guess you've got a serious beef, so you're way past Karen, they murdered your brother.

01:17:55.000 That, and I was smart enough to not keep anything a secret.

01:18:01.000 And I'm thankful to your show and others like you, sir, that this story got out there, because to me, that was my best insurance policy.

01:18:11.000 Oh, my heart was beating this morning just to get you on for my safety.

01:18:15.000 I mean, I know you cannot keep this type of stuff secret.

01:18:17.000 You've got to get it out immediately.

01:18:18.000 That's your insurance policy.

01:18:21.000 And I was surprised how quickly they were able to get everything sealed.

01:18:27.000 Final segment with you, sir, after this quick break.

01:18:29.000 Other key facets we'll walk through and delineate here with our guest, attorney-at-law Jesse Trinidou, whose brother was brutally tortured to death, Kenneth Trinidou.

01:18:43.000 The bottom line is, no man in the wrong can stand up against a fellow that's in the right and keeps on a-coming.

01:18:49.000 Texas Ranger Captain Bill McDonald, we'll be right back.

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01:22:51.000 I called our guest at about 8 a.m.

01:23:04.000 this morning, my time, and he was already at the office.

01:23:07.000 He's been there since 5 a.m.

01:23:09.000 Mountain.

01:23:10.000 He's very exhausted.

01:23:11.000 A lot of filings.

01:23:12.000 He's got his own practice, of course.

01:23:14.000 We really appreciate him spending time with us to come on today, and we're going to get him on for longer next week.

01:23:20.000 In the five minutes we've got left, Jesse Trinidou...

01:23:23.000 Where is your case going now?

01:23:25.000 What's going to happen with this 19-page affidavit that has been filed?

01:23:31.000 And what are some of the materials you sent us today that we posted on InfoWars.com?

01:23:35.000 Well, first of all, again, Mr. Jones, I want to thank you for, may have been the first, I think you were the first person to report this story back in 2004 and didn't say it was crazy.

01:23:47.000 What I filed that affidavit for was to get an order from the judge to allow me to take the deposition of Terry Nichols and to videotape that deposition.

01:23:56.000 That's the only way his story will ever get out there.

01:23:58.000 Good Lord, you have a video?

01:24:00.000 No, I said it's to get an order to allow that to happen.

01:24:04.000 To order the government to produce him and let me take that deposition and videotape that deposition.

01:24:08.000 You cannot tell that whole story in a declaration.

01:24:13.000 He's made that very clear to me.

01:24:15.000 I know you'd like to be able to tell us what you learned in a day and a half of interview with him.

01:24:19.000 The more important things are the documents that were attached to that affidavit that were sealed too.

01:24:26.000 Most of them were from the FBI and some were from Tim McVeigh's defense team outlining exactly what happened.

01:24:36.000 So the defense team knew?

01:24:38.000 Yes.

01:24:39.000 But Steven Jones didn't bring that out?

01:24:41.000 I don't think they were allowed to bring it out.

01:24:43.000 If I recall correctly, and I wasn't paying attention to the trial, that the judges would not allow any evidence of other people being involved.

01:24:49.000 Well, bottom line, Nichols and yourself are in grave danger while this is sealed, and I know you can't violate this federal proceeding in a seal order, but I mean, these documents, you just said it, the defense detailing inside job, did the federal documents detail that?

01:25:08.000 I read them that way.

01:25:10.000 Good.

01:25:11.000 I read them as others involved.

01:25:16.000 Bottom line, your educated inside view of this, off the cuff, why do you think the government was involved orchestrating this?

01:25:25.000 Well, I don't know if they intended it.

01:25:28.000 I think, my feeling is that the FBI had Fumbled the ball so badly at Waco and Ruby Ridge that I do remember this, that they were under constant pressure and criticism from Congress and from the media and from the public.

01:25:43.000 The ATF was close to being disbanded.

01:25:45.000 I think they put together this harebrained idea at Elohim City to lure in all these militia groups under the pretense of teaching them how to rob banks and armored cars and attack the federal government.

01:25:57.000 And I think they planned to catch them in the act.

01:25:59.000 I don't, for a moment, think they intended The bombing to take place?

01:26:04.000 Well, that's what the VATF tried to leak and claim.

01:26:08.000 The same thing every time they get caught in England with British Intel carrying out tax, they always claim they just missed it.

01:26:15.000 And let me tell you, sir, I've studied this.

01:26:18.000 They may tell some of their VATF that showed up in bomb gear a minute after the bomb went off, but for the insiders, they meant to bomb it the whole time.

01:26:26.000 You know, that building was blown from the inside out.

01:26:29.000 Well, I'm not an explosive instructor, but my personal view is that it got away from him.

01:26:37.000 Well, either way, they're culpable.

01:26:39.000 I mean, you can't... To me, I think you stepped way over the line when your informants are robbing banks and armored cars.

01:26:39.000 Oh, yes.

01:26:46.000 Well, did you see the report out of the Orlando Sentinel where the Nazi rally was led and organized by an FBI informant?

01:26:54.000 I read that report.

01:26:55.000 I mean, I've seen this a hundred times.

01:26:56.000 In fact, I've never really seen a big case where it isn't the Feds running it.

01:27:02.000 Well, my experience, at least in this case, has been whenever you have three people who get together to criticize the federal government, two of them will be informants.

01:27:11.000 Absolutely.

01:27:12.000 We've got about a minute and a half left.

01:27:13.000 Any other key points you'd like to add, sir?

01:27:15.000 Other than that they've not denied it.

01:27:18.000 I mean, the accusations I've made against the FBI are that they set up this operation, that they had informants who robbed banks with McVeigh to fund the attack, that they had an informant who was the explosive instructor and taught them how to make the bomb, and they got away from them.

01:27:33.000 They have not once denied those accusations.

01:27:35.000 They have just begged this federal judge not to order the release of the documents.

01:27:40.000 Now, clearly, if I made those accusations against you, wouldn't you have denied them?

01:27:45.000 Then we have Danny Colson who claimed he got up there in just an hour or so from Dallas by car with the hotel receipt that he was there the night before.

01:27:45.000 Absolutely.

01:27:53.000 One other thing I might add is it's my understanding that the BBC is going to run an hour special on the bombing and perhaps the government's involvement.

01:28:03.000 It's going to be a total whitewash.

01:28:05.000 I was in the 9-11 piece last week.

01:28:06.000 Well, I didn't see it.

01:28:08.000 I don't know.

01:28:09.000 I haven't seen it yet.

01:28:13.000 It's supposed to be the 4th of March.

01:28:16.000 Okay, we got 20 seconds left.

01:28:17.000 Any other points, sir?

01:28:18.000 Other than I expect a hell of a fight from the Department of Justice over that deposition.

01:28:23.000 Trying to keep it sealed indefinitely?

01:28:25.000 Not let it happen.

01:28:26.000 Not let me be able to take Nichols' complete statement.

01:28:30.000 What's the time frame on getting that statement?

01:28:33.000 Whenever the judge hears the case and orders.

01:28:36.000 And rules on the motion.

01:28:37.000 Thank you so much for your courage, Jesse Trinidad.

01:28:40.000 Let me talk to you for one minute off air.

01:28:41.000 Thank you for joining us.

01:28:43.000 We're on the march, the empire's on the run.

01:28:46.000 Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.

01:28:54.000 Government is best which governs least.

01:28:56.000 Wake up and smell the fascism.

01:28:57.000 Being in government means never having to say you're sorry.

01:29:00.000 What part of unconstitutional do you not understand, George?

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01:29:54.000 Oh, wait.

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01:29:56.000 I get so tired of that girl's squeaky voice. 1.00

01:29:59.000 I'm sure the bed fan works, but that squeaky voice... Well, what's the bed fan?

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01:32:06.000 To paraphrase that passage in the Bible, there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed.

01:32:14.000 You throw something into the deepest depths of the ocean, it will one day be tossed back onto the shore.

01:32:21.000 Again, I just think about my job, what I do.

01:32:26.000 This morning, as I was scrambling, setting up this guest, and reading news articles, and going back and doing research, refreshing my memory, I just literally almost hit my knees and thank God that I'm in this position.

01:32:41.000 I never thought that I would be a radio broadcaster internationally.

01:32:47.000 I never thought I'd be a newshound. 0.98

01:32:48.000 I never thought I'd be doing what those old gumshoes did long ago, what the straw hat reporters did. 1.00

01:32:55.000 And here we are, 21st century front line muck records engaging the New World Order at point-blank range. 0.86

01:33:07.000 It's scary too to do what we do because we're going toe-to-toe with these guys.

01:33:11.000 We're going against them 110% to bring them down.

01:33:14.000 I would have been all over this story and been on the phone with Trinidou yesterday and I would have had Trinidou on Coast-to-Coast AM with me last night.

01:33:20.000 I didn't even think to call Coast-to-Coast AM to get on the show.

01:33:24.000 I didn't think to even call Trinidad, even though he was in the article, and I broke the story, as you heard him say, because I was too busy down at the law office filing lawsuits on someone, which makes me even madder at them for the lies they put out, that I have to spend all this money to get my good name back!

01:33:43.000 Excuse me.

01:33:44.000 me so excuse me It just makes me angry!

01:33:52.000 Because my time is so precious!

01:33:55.000 I am so frustrated because there's so many things that I need to do.

01:33:59.000 So many things we need to get done.

01:34:05.000 Alright.

01:34:05.000 Don't want to explode here on air.

01:34:11.000 There is so much happening, so much going on.

01:34:14.000 We've got Kevin Barrett in studio.

01:34:17.000 The Wisconsin professor who's been all over national and international television exposing 9-11.

01:34:22.000 And then I don't even know now if I want to have that Cliff Kincaid, neocons, conservatives clothing on in the third hour, but I've got him coming on just so you can hear the type of stuff these people put out.

01:34:41.000 So that's coming up.

01:34:45.000 And there is just so much going on.

01:34:47.000 I don't even know what to say.

01:34:50.000 Let me just read over these articles now to give you some more background on Oklahoma City, because this is a direct line into 9-11.

01:35:01.000 Nichols McVeigh had high-level FBI help.

01:35:07.000 Oklahoma City bombing conspirator Terry Nichols says a high-ranking FBI official apparently was directing Timothy McVeigh and the plot to blow up a government building and might have changed the original target of the attack according to a new affidavit filed in the U.S.

01:35:23.000 District Court in Utah.

01:35:25.000 The official and other conspirators are being protected by the federal government in a cover-up to escape its responsibility for the loss of life in Oklahoma.

01:35:34.000 Nichols claims in the February 9th lawsuit.

01:35:38.000 Affidavit for the lawsuit.

01:35:39.000 And let me just add, I was talking to Jesse Trinidad during that three minute break, and he added some more points.

01:35:46.000 He said that he was out of time, he had to go to court, but that he never has been called a kook, never been called a liar, never been demonized by the FBI.

01:35:55.000 They're just desperately trying to ignore him.

01:35:57.000 Well, the ignoring him is over.

01:35:59.000 The ignoring him is over.

01:36:04.000 The official and other conspiracists are being protected by the federal government.

01:36:09.000 Documents that supposedly help back up his allegations have been sealed to protect information in them, to protect the informants, such as social security numbers and dates of birth.

01:36:18.000 The U.S.

01:36:19.000 Attorney's Office in Utah had no comment on the allegations.

01:36:22.000 The FBI and Justice Department in Washington, D.C.

01:36:24.000 also declined comment.

01:36:25.000 Nichols does not say what motive the government would have to be involved in the bombing.

01:36:33.000 The affidavit was filed in a lawsuit brought by Salt Lake City Attorney Jesse Trinidou, who believes his brother's death in a federal prison was linked to the Oklahoma City bombing.

01:36:44.000 The lawsuit, which seeks documents from the FBI under the Federal Freedom of Information Act, alleges that authorities mistook Kenneth Trinidou for a bombing conspiracy And that guards killed him in an interrogation that got out of hand.

01:36:59.000 No, that's not what he says.

01:37:01.000 FBI went in and killed him and tortured him to death.

01:37:04.000 Trinidou's death a few months after the April 19, 1995 bombing was ruled a suicide after several investigations.

01:37:09.000 The government has adamantly denied any wrongdoing in the death.

01:37:12.000 Why didn't they publish the photos?

01:37:14.000 I know for a fact Trinidou gave them the photos.

01:37:17.000 They're up on InfoWars.com.

01:37:19.000 He's got the double point shock Wounds all over his body, under his arms, of course we don't post these, but genitals, feet, huge, what looked like electrical burns where the prods weren't working, so they just hooked something up to a wall outlet, uh, slit his throat, beat his whole head in, just, I mean, this guy's purple from end to end.

01:37:43.000 In the app today, but Nichols says he wants to bring closure to the survivors and families of the attack on the Alfred B. Murrah building.

01:37:52.000 Which took 168 lives.

01:37:54.000 He alleges that he wrote then Attorney General John Ashcroft in 2004, offering to help him identify all parties who played a role in the bombing, but never got a reply.

01:38:05.000 Nichols, serving a life sentence at the U.S.

01:38:08.000 Penitentiary Administrative Maximum Facility in Florence, Colorado.

01:38:12.000 McVeigh, who carried out the bombing, was executed in 2001.

01:38:16.000 McVeigh and Nichols were the only defendants indicted in the bombing.

01:38:19.000 However, Nichols alleges others were involved.

01:38:22.000 McVeigh told him he was recruited for undercover missions while serving in the military, according to Nichols.

01:38:28.000 He says he learned sometime in 95 that there had been a change in the bomb target.

01:38:32.000 It was going to be Nebraska, Omaha, Dallas.

01:38:35.000 They were looking at different places.

01:38:36.000 But there had been a change in the bombing target and McVeigh was very upset by that.

01:38:43.000 There, in what I believe was an actual slip of the tongue, McVeigh revealed the identity of a high-ranking FBI official who was apparently directing McVeigh and the bomb plot, Nichols says in the affidavit.

01:38:52.000 So again, two newspapers have seen this, now they shield it.

01:38:55.000 Too late!

01:39:02.000 Nichols also says that McVeigh threatened him and his family to force him to rob Roger Moore, an Arkansas gun dealer of weapons and explosives.

01:39:11.000 He later learned that the robbery was staged so Moore, who was in on the phony heist, could deny any knowledge of the bombing plot if stolen items were traced back to him, Nichols claims.

01:39:20.000 He adds that Moore allegedly told his attorney that he would not be prosecuted in connection with the bombing because he was a protected witness and there's federal documents.

01:39:28.000 Moore could not be reached for comment Tuesday.

01:39:32.000 Again, they did the research Tuesday.

01:39:34.000 It just came out yesterday morning, Wednesday.

01:39:36.000 It's now Thursday.

01:39:37.000 In addition, Nichols says McVeigh must have had help building the bomb.

01:39:41.000 The evidence that he and McVeigh built the day before the bombing did not resemble the one that ultimately was used, Nichols says, and displayed a level of expertise and sophistication that neither man had.

01:39:52.000 There's a lot more than what this article put.

01:39:54.000 You just heard the lawyer who's got the affidavit filed did the day and a half of interviews with him.

01:40:02.000 Now let's read the DesertNews.com story.

01:40:06.000 All these are up on InfoWars.com and PrisonPlanet.com with a whole bunch of pages of documents, federal documents, for the first time being posted at InfoWars.com right now.

01:40:19.000 In fact, I'm told they've been up for 30 minutes.

01:40:23.000 Oh, man.

01:40:25.000 Nichols says bombing was FBI op.

01:40:28.000 Boy, that's an interesting headline out of a mainstream newspaper.

01:40:31.000 Detailed confession filed in Salt Lake about Oklahoma City plot.

01:40:38.000 The only surviving convicted criminal in the April 19, 1995 bombing of the Alfred P. Murrow Federal Building in Oklahoma City is saying his co-conspirator Timothy McVeigh told him he was taking orders from a top FBI official and orchestrating the bombing.

01:40:55.000 Let me say that again.

01:40:58.000 ...him that he was taking orders from a top FBI official in orchestrating the bombing.

01:41:04.000 A declaration from Terry Lynn Nichols filed in U.S.

01:41:07.000 District Court in Salt Lake City has proven he wanted the most detailed confessions by Nichols to date about his involvement in the bombing as well as the involvement of others.

01:41:16.000 The declaration was filed as part of a Salt Lake City attorney Jesse Trinidou's pending wrongful death suit against the government for the death of his brother in a federal corrections facility in Oklahoma City.

01:41:28.000 Trinidou claims his brother was killed during an interrogation by FBI agents when agents mistook his brother for a suspect in the Oklahoma City bombing investigation.

01:41:37.000 The most shocking allegation in the 19-page signed declaration is Nichols' assertion that the whole bombing plot was an FBI operation and that McVeigh let slip during a bout of anger that he was taking instruction from former FBI official Larry Potts of Ruby Ridge fame.

01:41:59.000 Potts was no stranger to anti-government confrontations, having been the lead FBI agent in Ruby Ridge in 92, which led to the shooting death of Vicki Weaver, the wife of separatist Randy Weaver.

01:42:12.000 Potts also reportedly involved in the 51-day siege of the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas in 93, which resulted in the fire that killed 81 Branch Davidian followers.

01:42:22.000 He's now a former FBI agent, by the way.

01:42:26.000 He was an FBI agent.

01:42:27.000 Former retired.

01:42:28.000 Potts retired from the FBI under intense pressure and criticism for the cover-up of an order to allow agents to shoot anyone seen leaving the Weaver Cabin at Ruby Ridge.

01:42:36.000 When contacted, the FBI's main office in D.C.

01:42:38.000 said it would not provide immediate comment on Nichols' claims Tuesday.

01:42:42.000 Nichols claims that in December 1992, McVeigh told him that while he was serving in the U.S.

01:42:47.000 Army, he'd been recruited to carry out undercover missions for the Secret Assassination Squad.

01:42:53.000 What did I tell you, folks?

01:42:55.000 Men formerly associated with Special Forces.

01:42:59.000 In the next few years, I've had these guys following me, and they even threatened me.

01:43:04.000 Hey, man, I'm an American defending the Republic. 0.96

01:43:06.000 You do whatever you need to, criminals. 0.89

01:43:07.000 And you'll see what they'll do to you later.

01:43:11.000 In the next few years, the two men hatched a bombing plot in October 1994.

01:43:15.000 You think it's manly to kill people, don't you? 0.99

01:43:17.000 Kill good people. 1.00

01:43:20.000 You kill me, you got God to deal with, punks. 1.00

01:43:23.000 In the next few years, the two men hatched a bombing plot in October 1994. 0.98

01:43:28.000 McVeigh and I stole explosives From a quarry in Marion, Kansas, consisting of 8.5 cases of boxes containing 229 2.5-inch sticks of gel-type explosive known as Tovex.

01:43:41.000 Again, they told everybody it was fuel oil.

01:43:43.000 Ha ha ha!

01:43:44.000 Nichols wrote, adding that only a small amount was used in the actual bombing.

01:43:48.000 It was while traveling the gun show circuit that Nichols claims the two obtained bomb-making knowledge and materials used in the bombing.

01:43:55.000 And of course, that was an FBI informant teaching them for the diversionary bomb.

01:43:58.000 There were bombs inside.

01:44:00.000 One example is that McVeigh allegedly attended a gun show in Knob Creek, Kentucky in 93.

01:44:08.000 At this gun show, McVeigh had the opportunity to make contact with about 20 people who were bomb experts.

01:44:12.000 McVeigh told me that he himself had no knowledge about how to construct a bomb, but that he always wanted to gain more knowledge about how to conduct bombs.

01:44:19.000 "Struck bombs," Nichols stated.

01:44:21.000 Nichols says he knew McVeigh was building the bomb in November '94.

01:44:24.000 He left for the Philippines to get away from the area to avoid being implicated.

01:44:28.000 "I did not want to be present when McVeigh did explode a bomb.

01:44:31.000 Consequently, I left for the Philippines to be out of the country," he wrote.

01:44:34.000 This is basically the newspaper whitewash of all this, folks.

01:44:38.000 Now, the statement contradicts findings by Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, who studied the bombing, has made public last year, It indicated nickels had traveled to the Philippines to receive bomb training from impossible foreign terrorists. 0.72

01:44:49.000 Yeah, that's the Republican fallback.

01:44:51.000 They had Iraqi Republican Guard clearly involved.

01:44:54.000 This is how black ops work, folks.

01:44:56.000 You've got white supremacists, you've got militias, you've got sheet-dipped Special Forces McVeigh, you've got bank robbers running around.

01:45:03.000 But you've got Arabs at the scene and those videotapes have been sealed, but I've interviewed the police and others and FBI's on record saying they saw the sealed surveillance tapes showing the Arabs.

01:45:14.000 So then it gets so confusing, you're like, did the mob kill JFK?

01:45:18.000 Did the military?

01:45:19.000 Did the Cubans? 0.81

01:45:21.000 No, they're all involved.

01:45:22.000 That's how black ops work. 0.59

01:45:24.000 You have different levels of deniability.

01:45:28.000 Then you got bombs inside that Jane Graham, who was the head of HUD, was going through one of the maintenance sides to get up quicker.

01:45:35.000 She was late to work, and she saw guys drilling the columns, planting large sticks of gray butter the day before.

01:45:45.000 After hearing about the bombing of the Federal Building, which killed 168 adults and children, Nichols said he panicked when his name came up on the radio and he wanted to turn himself in, but not before hiding evidence, including explosives, using the bombing.

01:45:57.000 The claims made in the declaration have added yet more twist to the mystery surrounding the bombing.

01:46:01.000 Some familiar with the bombing's history, St.

01:46:03.000 Nichols' claims seem to indicate the FBI put McVeigh up in the plot as a draw for radicals, but that the situation got out of control and McVeigh became a runaway informant.

01:46:12.000 That is not what happened.

01:46:14.000 That's their fallback story.

01:46:15.000 It always is.

01:46:16.000 I mean, how many of those British bombings, oh, we didn't stop it in time.

01:46:21.000 Then you turn out the guy cooking the bombs, British intel, the guy driving it's British intel.

01:46:27.000 We've had those men on the show, by the way.

01:46:30.000 After reviewing the declaration, Rohrabacher told the Desert Warning News that Nichols' claims should be investigated, but a tree with extreme skepticism.

01:46:38.000 I need to caution people to remember that Terry Nichols is a mass murderer.

01:46:41.000 Of course, Rohrabacher a month ago was on CNN going, there's a conspiracy, a cover-up of Oklahoma!

01:46:46.000 Clinton, Clinton! 0.98

01:46:47.000 Clearly, Clinton was involved.

01:46:49.000 But this goes deeper to the black-op government. 0.64

01:46:52.000 Ruby Ridge was planned under George Bush Sr.

01:46:54.000 George Bush Sr.

01:46:55.000 brought in the nearly 3,000 Iraqis.

01:46:57.000 Clinton brought in almost 2,000 more.

01:47:01.000 They were trained here by the CIA in the 80s, brought back in at the end of Desert Storm.

01:47:07.000 Source, Washington Post, LA Times, Society Press.

01:47:12.000 Then there's stuff like this, WorldNet Daily.

01:47:15.000 Was FBI early arrival in Oklahoma City?

01:47:18.000 Hotel receipts show top terror man showed up nine hours before blast.

01:47:23.000 Danny Colson was in the DFW of Dallas-Fort Worth metroplex area and he said that oh he couldn't get on a Southwest Airlines in time to fly up there so he drove and got there in a record two hours but then people reported he was there in less than an hour after the bombing.

01:47:39.000 Now that's on record.

01:47:40.000 Then it turns out he checked into a hotel Nine hours before the blast, the FBI's top counter-terrorism agent checked into an Oklahoma City hotel nearly nine hours before a truck bomb nearly leveled the Alpha P Murrah building, according to a receipt obtained by WorldNet Daily, despite claims that he was in Texas the morning of the attack.

01:48:07.000 The Embassy Suites Hotel, Danny Coulson, then director of the FBI's Terrorism Task Force, founding commander of the Bureau's Hostage Rescue Team, was dated April 19, 1995, with a check-in time of 0.20, or 1220 AM.

01:48:18.000 with a check-in time of 0.20 or 12:20 a.m.

01:48:24.000 Military time for 12:20 a.m.

01:48:30.000 His last name is spelled "Colson" on the receipt, but it indicates he is with the FBI located at 50 Penn Place.

01:48:37.000 Yeah, they misspelled on purpose.

01:48:39.000 The truck bomb exploded at 9.03 a.m., devastating half the building and killing 168 men, women, and children.

01:48:45.000 According to the receipt, Colson checked out of his hotel room at 4.06 April 27th at 11.16 a.m.

01:48:53.000 Now get ready for this.

01:48:54.000 They now have spun it and admit it.

01:48:56.000 The existence of the receipt and subsequent questions it raises surrounding the F.B.I.' 's official denial of prior knowledge of the O.K.C.

01:49:01.000 bombing was first reported by J.D.

01:49:03.000 Cash of the McMurton Oklahoma Daily Gazette, a small town paper that has been out front in the stories and O.K.C.

01:49:10.000 related reports.

01:49:11.000 Since the bombing, listen to this, officials of the Department of Justice have repeatedly assured victims that the F.B.I.

01:49:16.000 had no prior knowledge of any plot to bomb the Murrah Building.

01:49:20.000 My paper said Wednesday, however, evidence of Coulson's clandestine trip fits squarely with substantial bodies of details found in hundreds of pages of other official documents obtained via Freedom of Information Act requests.

01:49:32.000 The paper is evidence revealing weeks of planning by an elite corps of drug and counter-terrorism experts who were closely monitoring members of various far-right groups that considered religious extremists and threats to the safety and security of our nation.

01:49:44.000 So there's their spin.

01:49:46.000 They were shadowing them, yes.

01:49:48.000 And helping them rob banks, too.

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01:50:48.000 HerbalHealer.com, working with the power of nature.

01:50:56.000 It's here, after a year in production and traveling to distant lands, my new film Terror Storm is complete.

01:51:02.000 Shocking declassified government documents prove that western governments are orchestrating terror attacks against their own populations as a pretext to enslave them.

01:51:10.000 Terror Storm proves that not only was 9-11 an inside job, but the attacks of 7-7 in London were carried out by British intelligence.

01:51:18.000 Terror Storm chronicles the lies that took us to war in Iran, a White House program to disseminate fake news, NSA spying, secret police torture, the latest 9-11 information, and much, much more.

01:51:29.000 Terror Storm is the definitive guide to the history of government-sponsored terrorism.

01:51:33.000 It's an anthology of government crimes.

01:51:36.000 Terror Storm is a film that everyone who wants to be truly informed must see.

01:51:40.000 Get your copy today on Infowars.com or PrisonPlanet.com or by calling toll-free 1-888-253-3139 or watch it right now online at PrisonPlanet.tv.

01:51:52.000 Good morning, honey.

01:51:55.000 Wow, the weather is beautiful, the cabin is terrific, and it's the first day of our vacation!

01:52:01.000 Yeah.

01:52:02.000 Honey, is there something wrong?

01:52:04.000 Yeah, I just realized we forgot to pack the travel berkey system.

01:52:08.000 I can't drink this cabin water.

01:52:10.000 And what am I going to do when I'm out on the lake?

01:52:12.000 Now the whole vacation is ruined.

01:52:14.000 Honey, cheer up. 1.00

01:52:15.000 I brought our Sport Berkey Purifiers!

01:52:18.000 What?

01:52:18.000 Yeah, I know you're picky about not having pathogenic bacteria, organic chemicals, heavy metals or foul tastes and odors in the water, so I packed our Sport Berkey Purifiers!

01:52:29.000 You know, this is a terrific cabin, and wow, have you noticed the beautiful weather?

01:52:34.000 Don't ruin your vacation.

01:52:36.000 Get a Travel Berkey today for only $209.

01:52:37.000 Or get a Sport Berkey for only $39.

01:52:38.000 Call 888-803-4438.

01:52:38.000 That's 888-803-4438.

01:52:39.000 Or order on the web at berkeywater.com.

01:52:40.000 For only $39, call 888-803-4438.

01:52:44.000 That's 888-803-4438.

01:52:47.000 Or order on the web at BerkeyWater.com.

01:52:49.000 Travel Berkey not available in Iowa.

01:53:07.000 Coming up in studio, Kevin Barrett out there fighting the new world order toe-to-toe, exposing the inside job that is 9-11.

01:53:14.000 His new book, 9-11 in American Empire, Christians, Jews, and Muslims speak out.

01:53:18.000 Thank you.

01:53:19.000 Thank you.

01:53:21.000 Before we end this hour, I do want to remind all of you that I'm a documentary filmmaker, and my film, Road to Tyranny, was the first film out on 9-11.

01:53:32.000 I put out an emergency version of it that was only available for a few months two weeks after 9-11 which was just a presentation with video clips and three months later in early 2002 I released the three-hour film which right under three hours 45 minutes of 9-11 The Road to Tyranny is the definitive documentary on Oklahoma City alone.

01:53:56.000 Surveillance tape of the Iraqi Republican Guard hired by the CIA, brought in by George Bush Sr.

01:54:03.000 In case locals caught them, they were going to claim Arabs did it.

01:54:07.000 And I've interviewed the police, the state police.

01:54:09.000 They even arrested them.

01:54:10.000 They had bomb-making materials, the blue jogging suits.

01:54:13.000 They had the surveillance videos from the surrounding areas.

01:54:17.000 I have police surveillance.

01:54:18.000 They shot in the weeks before.

01:54:20.000 You also had white supremacists involved.

01:54:22.000 All these groups, so they could blame different groups for it later.

01:54:26.000 But it was entirely a government bombing with a diversionary provocateur truck bomb outside with explosives inside blowing the building out.

01:54:33.000 General Benton K. Parton's in the film.

01:54:35.000 All the clips, all the documentation, the newscast where they're reporting unexploded bombs and they're removing the bombs.

01:54:41.000 Governor Keating breaking it down.

01:54:44.000 You need to get road to tyranny just for the 45 minutes of the almost three hours.

01:54:51.000 We start the film with a history of government-sponsored terror.

01:54:54.000 We then go into Oklahoma City.

01:54:55.000 We, of course, go into the attack in 1993 where the FBI cooked the bomb, trained the drivers, provocateur-ed the whole incident with the attack there.

01:55:04.000 And then of course we go into 9-11 where they can't count on provocateurs anymore or patsies. 0.52

01:55:09.000 They just totally staged the event themselves and we walk through that and then show you why they wanted to do it, the police state and the wars they wanted to start.

01:55:17.000 And we said in the film in 2002 they're going to invade Iraq and they're going to invade other countries, Iran, Syria, because we went off the PNAC, documents themselves.

01:55:25.000 Early 2002, it is a testament.

01:55:27.000 The film just gets better with time, more and more accurate with time as things flesh out.

01:55:32.000 You need to get 9-11 The Road to Tyranny if you don't have it on DVD or VHS.

01:55:36.000 It's over three hours with the extras, but the film is close to three hours and it's got about, what, 30 minutes of extras at the end that I did.

01:55:46.000 Because it's more of a second edition later in 2002.

01:55:48.000 There's only been three editions of it, but that's the final edition of Road to Tyranny.

01:55:53.000 All three of my Police State films are now in a box set for $34.95.

01:55:57.000 That's 45% off.

01:55:58.000 Police State 2000, which shows the Marines trying to put you in camps, admitting they're trying to take your guns and put you in camps, and the FEMA camps, and the whole Police State grid, then Police State 2, the takeover, then Police State 3, total enslavement.

01:56:12.000 It's what one of the films is three hours long the others are over two so we're talking about Almost 10 hours of footage on those three DVDs in one box set available at InfoWars.com.

01:56:24.000 We've got 9-11 Inside Job, InfoWars.com, black baseball caps now available.

01:56:29.000 We've got 9-11 Inside Job black t-shirts now available.

01:56:32.000 We've got little FM transmitters you can plug into your computer and play the radio show for a couple houses around you or you can boost it with an antenna and go several hundred feet further.

01:56:42.000 Those are now available at InfoWars.com.

01:56:46.000 And your purchase of these items not only gets you more informed and to have these key tools on your shelf in your library, it supports what we're doing here in my growing staff and the different operations we've launched against the globalists in our war against their tyranny and dehumanization.

01:56:59.000 The toll-free number to call and order the films as well is 1-888-253-3139.

01:57:02.000 1-888-253-3139.

01:57:07.000 That's 888-253-3139.

01:57:12.000 You can also write to me.

01:57:13.000 I'm Alex Jones at 3001 South Lamar, Suite 100, Austin, Texas 78704.

01:57:20.000 And don't forget all my films.

01:57:21.000 You can watch them right now online at PrisonPlanet.tv, Great Activist Center, PrisonPlanet.tv.

01:57:27.000 Get your membership today.

01:57:29.000 Second hour, 70 seconds away with Kevin Barrett.

01:57:33.000 Copies of the preceding broadcast are available at GCNlive.com or call toll-free 877-376-45.

01:57:41.000 Blackbird.

01:57:44.000 Big Brother.

01:57:52.000 Mainstream media.

01:57:54.000 Government cover-ups.

01:57:56.000 You want answers?

01:57:57.000 Well, so does he.

01:57:58.000 He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.

01:58:03.000 And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.

01:58:11.000 Literally waging war on corruption.

01:58:16.000 Crashing through the lies and disinformation.

01:58:21.000 Monday through Friday.

01:58:22.000 Live from 11 to 2.

01:58:24.000 Central.

01:58:25.000 Standard.

01:58:26.000 By the way, I'm tired of forgetting.

01:58:26.000 Time.

01:58:28.000 I know my staff is listening.

01:58:30.000 Guys, get me the list of the five affiliates we got last week.

01:58:34.000 Because I keep saying I'm going to plug them, and I never get a proper list.

01:58:37.000 I hear the names, I thank the program directors, and then I just forget about it.

01:58:41.000 I want to get that and thank them before this hour ends, and I want to thank them on the Sunday show that's gotten a lot of new affiliates as well.

01:58:48.000 We're just so blessed, so thankful to God.

01:58:50.000 Big guest coming up, eyewitness to government operatives and the 7-7 bombings in 2005.

01:58:55.000 Right now, Mark in Canada.

01:58:57.000 Thanks for holding.

01:58:58.000 You're on the air.

01:58:59.000 How you doing, Alex?

01:59:00.000 Good.

01:59:00.000 Good, sir.

01:59:01.000 Big fanboy here.

01:59:02.000 Um, like Bobby, the caller before, I've been burning Terror Storm copies right now.

01:59:07.000 I've been handing them out in Ottawa.

01:59:09.000 I go for walks at night.

01:59:10.000 I give out Terror Storm and 9-11 Revisited.

01:59:13.000 Those are the two I've chosen, and I just take about eight or nine out at night, walk around.

01:59:13.000 Well done!

01:59:18.000 I always come home without them, so... I don't know if the people watch them, but... That's the best, is to fire and forget.

01:59:23.000 Carpet bombing, info war, is the best procedure. 1.00

01:59:25.000 Yeah, that's what I've been doing, so I'm doing my part.

01:59:27.000 I also went to a rally yesterday, my first protest, so that was kind of cool.

01:59:31.000 I have questions.

01:59:32.000 I've been trying to call him for a while, so these are kind of dated.

01:59:36.000 The bear-tainted HIV inoculation?

01:59:41.000 Yes, by design.

01:59:42.000 Is there anybody who has been looking into the WHO and the Red Cross, International Red Cross?

01:59:49.000 Red Cross was caught, it was all over Australian papers, knowing that it had AIDS in it, knowingly delivering it. 0.99

01:59:55.000 It's publicly admitted.

01:59:56.000 Okay.

01:59:57.000 Is there anybody who's tracking, though, the growth of the epidemic?

02:00:01.000 The Helios Society has tried to, they've been robbed once and there's been fire bombings as well of the doctor who worked in the prisons in Little Rock.

02:00:15.000 And so there's been some strange deaths as well.

02:00:18.000 So yeah, people have been trying.

02:00:19.000 But again, the murders and the fire bombings didn't stop it from coming out.

02:00:23.000 Okay, okay, excellent.

02:00:25.000 Would you ever have David Suzuki on your show to discuss global warming?

02:00:30.000 I don't know.

02:00:30.000 Who is David Suzuki?

02:00:32.000 David Suzuki is a big Canadian environmentalist.

02:00:35.000 He's been around for years.

02:00:37.000 Okay, now I've heard the name, I had to place it.

02:00:40.000 Did you hear my analysis of it?

02:00:42.000 Oh, I've listened to your show since Charlie Sheen came out, pretty much daily.

02:00:46.000 So what did you think?

02:00:47.000 Oh, I think you're bang on.

02:00:49.000 I'm just curious if he would agree with you about the solution that they're proposing, or if he would be saying it's not 3%, it's 10%, that kind of stuff.

02:00:59.000 Well, listen, that's not me just saying 3%.

02:01:01.000 I mean, there's a bunch of different studies, and even the UN study, you know, says, well, humans are 6% of it, but still is the tipping point.

02:01:10.000 The sun's heating up.

02:01:11.000 And then the point is, regardless, regardless, their solution of a global tax has nothing to do with it.

02:01:18.000 That's all I'm saying.

02:01:19.000 Yeah, no, I agree.

02:01:20.000 I agree.

02:01:22.000 My next question has to do with Ron Paul and Mike Rivera has been talking about the Jefferson Manual and that it takes one governor to start the impeachment procedures.

02:01:32.000 And that is starting up in New Mexico and several other states.

02:01:35.000 Okay, so Ron Paul isn't in a position to start that as well?

02:01:40.000 They already used it against him in his last campaign ineffectively when he came on my show and said Bush should be impeached.

02:01:47.000 That was already used against Paul, so I don't know if he will call for something like that, because then it would be misinterpreted by conservatives.

02:01:54.000 But certainly, he says anyone who voted for the war should be removed and impeached.

02:01:59.000 Okay, okay.

02:02:00.000 Next question, then nuclear non-proliferation treaty and the other thing that stipulates that the U.S.

02:02:06.000 can't supply aid to a country that is a nuclear power unless it allows inspectors.

02:02:12.000 That's another thing Mike Rivera was talking about.

02:02:13.000 Is that going to matter.

02:02:15.000 Is there any way that they can even enforce that?

02:02:18.000 No, no.

02:02:20.000 And you can't enforce it.

02:02:22.000 And the UN doesn't enforce it.

02:02:23.000 And Israel doesn't follow it. 0.75

02:02:25.000 And China doesn't follow it.

02:02:27.000 The point is, South Africa's got nukes, brother. 0.88

02:02:30.000 Listen, I appreciate your call.

02:02:32.000 Pakistan, India.

02:02:34.000 We'll be right back.

02:02:35.000 Stay with us.

02:02:37.000 Big guest.

02:02:38.000 I'm gonna leave you.

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02:05:44.000 Big Brother.

02:05:51.000 Mainstream media.

02:05:53.000 Government cover-ups.

02:05:55.000 You want answers?

02:05:56.000 Well, so does he.

02:05:58.000 He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.

02:06:02.000 And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.

02:06:06.000 Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen. ladies and gentlemen.

02:06:26.000 Now 8 minutes, 42 seconds into this second hour.

02:06:30.000 And for the balance of the hour, I'm extremely honored to be joined by Steve Watson of Infowars.net and PrisonPlanet.com from London, England, and Daniel Obuchacki, also joining us from England.

02:06:44.000 Now, let me just set the table here.

02:06:46.000 On the morning of 7-7-2005, three bombs blew up, destroying three different train passenger carriages, killing quite a few people, tragically.

02:06:59.000 Over an hour later, a bus that had been specifically singled out and redirected, and these reports had already come out by other witnesses, exploded.

02:07:11.000 Causing quite a few deaths and injuries.

02:07:14.000 And then it came out that the former head of Scotland Yard's Public Relations, Peter Powers, had been hired to run a drill for the exact same trains, exact same times, being bombed, the exact same day.

02:07:29.000 And we've had the actuary mathematics done on that.

02:07:32.000 It's in the trick of gillions.

02:07:34.000 That's 43 zeros, my friends, behind it.

02:07:38.000 That's many, many more times, billions of times more than all the grains of sand in all the world.

02:07:44.000 On 9-11, they're doing a drill, a flying hijack jets in the World Trade Center and Pentagon at the exact same time yet again as well.

02:07:52.000 It's always the same MO.

02:07:53.000 They do this in case other compartments of the government discover it.

02:07:56.000 The other operatives can just say, hey, we're taking part in a drill.

02:07:59.000 It also bootlegs the funding It also creates chatter that confuses Echelon, Infopole 9, the NSA, MI6, the different listening stations.

02:08:09.000 So if they pick up on it, they can say, oh, that's just the drill, too.

02:08:14.000 And there are hundreds of points concerning the London bombing.

02:08:18.000 First they said that it was simultaneous and they said no it wasn't simultaneous.

02:08:21.000 It turned out they were correct.

02:08:23.000 It was simultaneous bombings on all three of the trains.

02:08:27.000 Something went wrong.

02:08:28.000 We had surmised from all the evidence something hadn't detonated on the bus.

02:08:33.000 People reported there was not an Asian man down there.

02:08:37.000 People reported that suddenly there was just an explosion.

02:08:40.000 Folks had reported that the bus had been singled out and diverted.

02:08:43.000 I talked to bus drivers who'd heard about it.

02:08:45.000 I talked to technicians who worked in that bus terminal about strange things and strange technicians working on that bus.

02:08:52.000 And so we, from the evidence we had, something hadn't gone off simultaneously in the bus, so they redirected it.

02:08:57.000 While they were redirecting it to make sure it went off from all the evidence we have, MI6, MI5, or some private agency that was carrying this out, clearly in collusion with the government, needed time to cover up what was happening with the bus because something had gone wrong.

02:09:12.000 So for an hour and several minutes, they were announcing a power surge had caused some type of explosions.

02:09:20.000 Now, you've got three blown up trains, dead people everywhere.

02:09:26.000 They're coming out, bleeding, dying, they're telling everyone bombs went off, and the police are saying, no, no, no, it's a power surge.

02:09:33.000 Meanwhile, black sedans, blue sedans, motorcycles are directing this particular bus, the Hackney bus, to Tavistock Park, Tavistock Square.

02:09:45.000 On board that bus is Daniel Obuchieke, and Daniel is there and he's now going to tell you what he witnessed.

02:09:56.000 And this is an eyewitness.

02:09:58.000 Now, other eyewitnesses interviewed by police, and again, most police aren't involved in this.

02:10:03.000 That's why we have Scotland Yard going.

02:10:04.000 We don't think these guys knew they had bombs.

02:10:07.000 We don't think that they were suicide bombers.

02:10:09.000 We think someone gave them these packages.

02:10:11.000 But then you've got the problem of one of the bombers' passports, ID cards being found at two different bombings, and somebody messed up in the planting.

02:10:20.000 You've got Benjamin Netanyahu being admitted to Associated Press at least 30 minutes before getting a call and being told, don't get on the trains, stay in your hotel room.

02:10:30.000 This is all on record.

02:10:32.000 You've got Giuliani there when this happens.

02:10:34.000 All very suspicious folks.

02:10:35.000 Same people, same players. 0.94

02:10:37.000 This is so disgusting.

02:10:40.000 And so we have Daniel there on the bus and he's going to tell you what he witnessed.

02:10:45.000 This is huge.

02:10:47.000 I cannot hype this enough.

02:10:49.000 I know Steve's working on a part two of this, so I want to bring up Daniel.

02:10:54.000 Daniel, thank you for coming on.

02:10:55.000 That's okay.

02:10:56.000 How are you doing?

02:10:57.000 Good, sir.

02:10:58.000 Tell us a little bit about yourself, and then give us a nutshell, give us a thumbnail sketch of what happened on that bus that morning, what you witnessed, and then any more details that you haven't already given us for the InfoWars.net story.

02:11:12.000 And I first want to say, thank you for your courage, sir.

02:11:15.000 Tell us first about yourself and how you got the courage to go public.

02:11:20.000 Okay, I'm just a regular guy.

02:11:22.000 I was born, bred, work in London and that day I was on my way to work in Old Street and there was some kind of disruption going on.

02:11:33.000 We were told it was a power surge and we were evacuated and that's how I became to be on the bus.

02:11:41.000 And then after that the bus left Houston full of passengers who were Also evacuated and the bus seemed to be going nowhere so I looked out because I was standing on the lower deck because I wasn't sure whether I was on the correct bus and then I peered ahead and I saw these two cars which were a Mercedes and a BMW blue and black which seemed to be in front of the bus holding it up

02:12:11.000 And it was diverted about four or five minutes later down towards Tavistock Square.

02:12:20.000 And I think the results are quite evident for everyone else to see what took place in Tavistock Square.

02:12:28.000 Please continue with once you got to the square what you saw.

02:12:32.000 Oh well, after the explosion you can understand I was on the floor so It took about five seconds till the noise had actually quietened down and then I just got up and then I ran and escaped and ran straight down the street.

02:12:53.000 After a few cases down the street I saw a man holding a camera.

02:12:59.000 It looked like a camcorder.

02:13:01.000 It was walking towards me, filming the bus itself.

02:13:06.000 I was confused by this and I stopped and skidded to a halt and looked Left, right, and what was going on.

02:13:14.000 Then I looked behind me and I saw the bus, the upper deck of which had been completely destroyed by the bomb explosion.

02:13:24.000 And then I just, I think at that point my mind must have just changed into some kind of, I was really not frightened, but I was aware that something, a myth was going on and I was just looking at the people moving into the actual space on the square.

02:13:48.000 There were guys who were hanging around.

02:13:50.000 There was a row of policemen who were just standing there in yellow fluorescent suits, jackets.

02:13:58.000 They weren't doing anything.

02:13:59.000 They were just watching.

02:14:01.000 There was this guy filming and I'm saying, what is going on here?

02:14:04.000 It was just not, it didn't feel right.

02:14:07.000 So, um, I actually went and helped some woman who had been walking beside the bus.

02:14:12.000 She was covered in blood and then I helped her to get some kind of help at the hotel which was further down the square and I passed this gentleman who seemed to have acquired some kind of injuries, but I can understand for the life of me how this was possible because he was 40, 50 meters away from the bus itself.

02:14:35.000 So he was making a lot of noise and trying to get people's attention, but I just saw his actual injuries as fake.

02:14:44.000 In fact, you write in your description that within 60 seconds he had a bandage on his head and there weren't even paramedics around him.

02:14:52.000 Exactly.

02:14:53.000 They hadn't even shown up yet.

02:14:55.000 Can you say that in your own words though?

02:14:56.000 I mean, describe it in detail for us.

02:15:00.000 Well, he had a bandage around his head and his trouser leg had been He was lit neatly along the seam and he was rolling on the pavement.

02:15:11.000 This was 50 metres away from the bus itself.

02:15:14.000 The bus bomb itself blew backwards so one lady who was at the back where I was standing, I was standing in the centre of the bus or by the window, she actually died and someone walking behind the bus also died.

02:15:29.000 So the bus blew backwards, the bomb blew backwards.

02:15:33.000 So this guy is just a complete Fake injury and he was just some guy who was I don't know what his role was specifically there were a lot of people observing I noted some people were running forward the medical staff and the medical professionals were you could tell who they were because they were trying to see what they could do for people half of them some people were just they weren't going to make it some people they were trying to do something for them but then there were these other people who were just

02:16:01.000 Watching, taking note, organizing people, moving things.

02:16:04.000 How many seconds, I mean, how long did it take you to get out of the bus, and then how long did it take you, could you say 60 seconds, to then notice that this guy is way up the street with a bandage on his head rolling around?

02:16:15.000 I left the bus within 12 seconds, I got down that street in another 10 seconds, so within 25 seconds I had witnessed the cameraman and about 15 seconds after that I actually noted this chap so it was within 45 seconds he was actually with some kind of headband and lying on the street.

02:16:40.000 I don't know how he got there because if it was a bus blast he must have been flung about 40 to 50 feet and that is not really feasible with the injuries which he was displaying.

02:16:54.000 And it was the wrong direction from the way the blast went.

02:16:56.000 Precisely.

02:16:57.000 How many operative types or police did you see when you got off the bus around you already staring at it?

02:17:03.000 Okay, there were about four...

02:17:07.000 Guys in blue bottoms and who had rucksacks, they were kind of foot soldier types.

02:17:14.000 There were about two or three people who were just standing in the doorway, just watching everything.

02:17:19.000 And there was another guy who was coordinating everything, coordinating, he was in plainclothes and coordinating police, when they finally came forward to actually do something.

02:17:32.000 Just all there waiting.

02:17:34.000 Oh, here comes the bus.

02:17:35.000 Boom! 0.99

02:17:37.000 Unbelievable, sir.

02:17:37.000 Please stay with us.

02:17:38.000 We've got Steve Watson waiting in the wings with other key comments and questions.

02:17:42.000 Your courage is amazing.

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02:21:59.000 Shalala.

02:22:01.000 Thank you.

02:22:03.000 Daniel Lobachecki is our guest.

02:22:05.000 Born and bred Londoner.

02:22:07.000 The little beats in me will die.

02:22:11.000 The miracle, for this is not America.

02:22:16.000 Daniel Obuchak, he is our guest, born and bred Londoner.

02:22:23.000 Talking during the break, it was just unbelievably powerful.

02:22:27.000 I remember making Terrorstorm and saying to Rob, my editor here in the office, I go, that photo looks fake.

02:22:35.000 Bandages all over his face, thinly placed, no blood except on his chest, and it looked like it was put on out of a ketchup dispenser, little squirters that you use just kind of dribble down the front.

02:22:50.000 And so many times my instincts are right.

02:22:53.000 Well, it turns out that's the individual that, within 60 seconds, was flopping around and prancing around in front of cameras and all the waiting police.

02:23:01.000 And notice that they didn't... all over every major newspaper in the world, all over every major television network in the world, every news program in the world, no one interviewed him, no one said, where is he now?

02:23:12.000 No one said his name.

02:23:13.000 Everybody else, they'd show bloodier bleeding.

02:23:16.000 A day later, they'd say, here's their name.

02:23:17.000 Not him.

02:23:18.000 And now the photo's being jerked.

02:23:20.000 everywhere and please relay and repeat the words you told me during the break Daniel please in your own words I'll lay this out yeah this guy he he was the one that got my kind of curiosity going because I walked past there with this escorting this woman who was hurt and then I saw him he had this bandage around his head

02:23:45.000 his leg seemed to his child's leg was torn and this was within 45 less than 60 seconds after the explosion A time before any medical staff had come forward and the thing about him was he just seemed so fake so I thought this man must have had prior knowledge, prior intelligence and he was positioned here.

02:24:11.000 For what reason?

02:24:12.000 I don't know.

02:24:12.000 Then I I conducted a search of my own online because a few days after the 7th of July, his picture, his image was everywhere.

02:24:24.000 And about a month ago I looked and it had been totally pulled.

02:24:28.000 I mean it wasn't on any of the BBC websites, it wasn't on any of the international news sites.

02:24:35.000 You just couldn't find this guy.

02:24:36.000 I actually spent about two days searching, and then I got two images of him, and that's what you see on WorldWideWebTheForceBomb.com, which is my site, where the truth and the facts of what happened in Tavistock Square that day are.

02:24:54.000 Now, again, your story meshes with all the other witnesses, all the other evidence we have, but I want to be clear before I bring Steve Watson up in the next segment, who wrote this with you, and I really am thankful for his great journalistic skills and your courage.

02:25:06.000 Going back, specifics, slow down, take your time.

02:25:12.000 When you see the blue and black Mercedes and the motorcycle cop and the discussion with the bus driver and it's redirected, let's go back to when they first directed you in the bus to Tavistock Square.

02:25:25.000 Okay, yeah, um, well, what do you want to know?

02:25:28.000 The bus was... Just slow down and describe everything to me.

02:25:31.000 Just slow down and tell me how they pulled up, what they did, what they, you know, what their body motions were like, just everything, what they looked like.

02:25:39.000 Okay, it left Houston Bus Station and proceeded down Houston Road.

02:25:44.000 It was supposed to go straight from Houston to Kings Cross, but these two cars were blocking its path.

02:25:52.000 And then after a short time, a police motorcyclist whizzed up on his bike and had a word with one of the drivers.

02:26:00.000 White men? 0.89

02:26:01.000 Black men? 0.91

02:26:02.000 Asian men? 0.62

02:26:02.000 What did they look like? 0.62

02:26:03.000 No, the police, the drivers were of European appearance.

02:26:09.000 The motorcyclist had a helmet, so he had a brief word with one of the drivers.

02:26:16.000 And I thought, okay, thank God for that.

02:26:18.000 This guy We'll tell the driver to go and then we can get to where we need to be going.

02:26:25.000 But instead of the police motorcyclist getting the cars to leave, they told him to leave and he just turned around and sped off.

02:26:34.000 Did you see them flash anything?

02:26:37.000 They didn't flash anything.

02:26:38.000 He waved something.

02:26:40.000 It could have been some kind of card or pass or something, but as soon as the police Who waved?

02:26:46.000 The driver of the blue Mercedes or the black?

02:26:49.000 The driver of the BMW.

02:26:52.000 And what color?

02:26:54.000 The BMW was blue, correct?

02:26:55.000 Blue, yes.

02:26:56.000 The driver of the BMW waved the motorcyclist away with some form of identification.

02:27:03.000 I only assumed he had some form of identification.

02:27:05.000 You saw him, something in the hand waved it.

02:27:07.000 Yeah, that was it.

02:27:09.000 Absolutely key.

02:27:09.000 Stay there.

02:27:12.000 Your debriefing will continue on the other side.

02:27:14.000 Steve Watson will join in.

02:27:16.000 This is absolutely vital, and we're trying to keep this man safe right now by him getting his entire story out in more detail.

02:27:24.000 I'm Alex Jones, battling the New World Order at point-blank range.

02:27:28.000 We're on the march.

02:27:37.000 The Empire's on the run.

02:27:40.000 Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.

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02:30:44.000 I know it was two years ago or a year and a half ago.

02:31:03.000 Amen.

02:31:04.000 Amen.

02:31:04.000 I I know that it's not big and spectacular like 9-11, but a lot of people died and it was used when the British nation was refusing to go along with the war in Iraq when Tony Blair had barely hung on to his position when he had lost almost the entire majority that the Labour Party had in Parliament.

02:31:26.000 And it came right when they were having their big G8 Summit in Glen Eagles.

02:31:31.000 And it was used as a grandstanding platform to say, see, the terrorists are hitting us.

02:31:36.000 We've got to get tough.

02:31:37.000 And every indices, every piece of evidence, even Scotland Yard and other police forces who had real detectives out were going, these guys weren't suicide bombers.

02:31:46.000 That's buried in the newspaper.

02:31:48.000 These guys, we think somebody planted this stuff on them or they didn't know.

02:31:51.000 They don't fit the MO.

02:31:53.000 There was a bomb under one of the trains, not in it.

02:31:56.000 Eyewitnesses said that.

02:31:58.000 You add all these, there's hundreds of points.

02:32:00.000 We put them in the film Terror Storm, that I hope you'll get from Infowars.com.

02:32:03.000 That's why it's so important we spend about 30 minutes of the two-hour film, or a little bit more than 30 minutes, in London, documenting this.

02:32:10.000 And we even show shots of newsstands.

02:32:12.000 We were there two weeks after the attacks.

02:32:15.000 And we show newsstands where there's literally like 15, 20 newspapers and magazines, and it's all Pictures of the bombing, and half of them are this guy with the thin, one layer of bandage.

02:32:27.000 Understand, folks, I've worked for a large animal vet.

02:32:30.000 My dad's a neurosurgeon.

02:32:31.000 I've been in hospitals.

02:32:33.000 I've worked around it.

02:32:35.000 I've worked in the medical field when I was in college as a dental assistant.

02:32:39.000 But even if you haven't, you know common sense.

02:32:42.000 You don't take thin gauze bandage.

02:32:46.000 One layer.

02:32:51.000 Later.

02:32:53.000 And if you even put that on a scuff on your knee that really doesn't bleed but kind of just seeps, you know, when you're playing touch football and you fall down on your knee and it just kind of seeps.

02:33:02.000 I mean, even if it was just seeping, just a microscopic graze, it would stick to his face.

02:33:10.000 No, it appears to be a cap, woven heavily on the top, and then just thin, thin one straps around his face, like it was some type of already woven helmet he just put on his head.

02:33:21.000 45 to 60 seconds after the blast, he's flopping around, way towards the front, 50 yards north of it.

02:33:29.000 There's other people videotaping, spook types walking around, and then no interviews with him, we never learn his name, he's just, you remember the guy with the bandage.

02:33:40.000 And those eyes have it all, ferret-like, scanning, calculating, and I just remember going, man, that is, something's going on, that doesn't look right.

02:33:50.000 And then he has like a potato, a ketchup bottle, you know, that you spray onto your potatoes, you spray onto your french fries, it, like a dribble on his shirt.

02:34:03.000 And you take movies like The Quiet American by Graham Greene, which is based on real events, they just changed the names.

02:34:09.000 That's when the Times of London reporter, who's based there in southern Vietnam, he's been recruited by the CIA guy, he doesn't know he's CIA, and the CIA guy is actually running terror attacks to blame it on the North to escalate the war.

02:34:24.000 This is before the war really kicks off in the late 19th century.

02:34:28.000 50s and it's based on true stories that really happened and then all of a sudden he doesn't know he didn't know the guy's CIA and some of these bombings blow up in the square and kill all these women and children and then he's running around the CIA guy giving orders in Vietnamese and the Times of London writer just goes and just leans back and realizes well literally the man you're listening to right now saw something just like you see in that movie

02:34:58.000 just like what you see in that fictionalized account of real events in Vietnam.

02:35:05.000 Okay?

02:35:05.000 That's why this is so important.

02:35:07.000 Daniel, I want to go to Steve Watson and bring him up for any questions.

02:35:11.000 He's been holding for 20 minutes.

02:35:13.000 But I'd like you to then talk about what happened in a nutshell after all of this.

02:35:21.000 What started happening from that point on, please, sir?

02:35:23.000 I will do.

02:35:25.000 Okay, yeah.

02:35:27.000 Well, it took the Police Investigating Anti-Terrorist Branch of Scotland Yard seven months to question me.

02:35:37.000 I actually called them, contacted the Emergency Information Hotline the following day, but they didn't get back to me until the end of January 2006.

02:35:48.000 And I just felt it was as though they were trying to whitewash me, to make out that I was not even there, to actually completely dis... dis... make it look as though I was not...

02:36:01.000 Even on board the bus.

02:36:03.000 But it is on record that you were there, and there's an upcoming book concerning it.

02:36:06.000 Yeah, there is.

02:36:07.000 That's what the Fourth Bomb, the book, is about, and what I went through.

02:36:11.000 I had some surveillance, some... I don't know whether they were MI5, Anti-Terrorist Branch, or what government organization, but I had a lot of probing.

02:36:23.000 I even had... I even gave an interview with a journalist called Duffy, he was working for the Sunday Mirror, and he showed me a picture, this was a week after the actual 7-7, he showed me a picture of Hasib Hussain, and then he asked me, "Have you seen this person?" And I said no, and about a day or two

02:36:48.000 after that, then, Hasib Hussain was named as the bus bomber in the British press.

02:36:56.000 And let's be clear, none of the people on the bus said they saw any Asian men?

02:37:00.000 No, they didn't.

02:37:01.000 And I was downstairs, I saw no Asian guy.

02:37:05.000 None whatsoever.

02:37:05.000 In your own words, describe it.

02:37:07.000 Did you see any, and the other witnesses said they didn't, but did you see any Asian men?

02:37:12.000 None whatsoever.

02:37:14.000 None on board the bus.

02:37:16.000 None carrying a rucksack at Houston or on the bus or at Tavistock Square.

02:37:21.000 Off the charts.

02:37:25.000 Just absolutely off the charts.

02:37:27.000 I mean, now you describe this harassment as overt surveillance, I guess, to intimidate you.

02:37:27.000 Yeah.

02:37:33.000 Walk us through that, some of the stuff they did.

02:37:35.000 You started by following me when I came out of my office on lunch breaks.

02:37:44.000 They were waiting on the corner.

02:37:46.000 There's a place called the Honorable Artillery, um, Barracks, and that's ten minutes from where I worked, and that is where they kept all the dead bodies from the 7-7 attacks.

02:37:58.000 So the police outside there, every time I used to walk past, they used to, uh, Have something to say, call my name or something like that.

02:38:07.000 And I think it was just a campaign trying to put psychological stress and pressure upon me because obviously if it came down to me testifying, they want me to be deemed unfit to testify or something like that.

02:38:22.000 And I think they just didn't want a public inquiry anyway.

02:38:26.000 So they got their own way and there was no public inquiry.

02:38:29.000 Any other types of harassment?

02:38:30.000 And then let's talk about how you finally got your meeting with the police and what they did.

02:38:34.000 Yeah, well...

02:38:35.000 I was chased once in Aldgate.

02:38:38.000 A guy just came after me.

02:38:39.000 I had arranged to meet someone from the office, and then I got there, this guy came after me, so I actually ran into this building, and then he ran in there and followed me, and I actually hid in some offices.

02:38:54.000 What did he look like to me?

02:38:56.000 I mean, I'm not saying I'm a tough guy, but if somebody wants to run up on me, I'm gonna deck them.

02:39:00.000 I guess it's smarter to run, and explain to me what happened.

02:39:03.000 I mean, describe it in detail.

02:39:04.000 Yeah, he was actually there waiting for me.

02:39:11.000 That's the thing which threw me initially.

02:39:14.000 He was there waiting for me and as soon as I went past him he just set off across the road and came after me.

02:39:21.000 So I didn't run because I was scared of him because I'm not scared of any of these people.

02:39:27.000 I know, I'm not scared.

02:39:28.000 If they want to do what they want to do, go ahead and do it.

02:39:31.000 The truth is going to be out there, regardless.

02:39:33.000 So, I just tried to escape from him by ducking into some building, and then he followed me.

02:39:40.000 You know, I just thought here, see, and I'm stupid, my instinct was I would have gotten a fight, but you're smart because by then you knew it was police, and actually they would have then got you claiming you just assaulted an officer, and you know, the 50 cameras on you in the surveilled city of four and a half million would have all malfunctioned, and they would have claimed you assaulted an officer.

02:39:57.000 Yeah, precisely. 0.61

02:39:58.000 That's what they were trying to do all along.

02:40:00.000 Because they asked my flatmate whether I had any criminal convictions.

02:40:05.000 They were already delving into my background and my past.

02:40:10.000 Trying to find out whether I had any kind of dodgy or criminal past or tendencies or convictions.

02:40:18.000 And I think they were trying to use that as a kind of weapon with which they could find me.

02:40:24.000 That's what spooks and operatives and informants do.

02:40:24.000 It's a lever.

02:40:27.000 We know that out here locally.

02:40:30.000 Please continue.

02:40:32.000 I want to bring Steve Watson up.

02:40:33.000 You're just telling so much more now.

02:40:35.000 Steve, thanks for holding.

02:40:36.000 Any other key points you want to bring up here with Daniel?

02:40:41.000 I was just going to say, why do you think it is that the police didn't ask you to come in and give a statement straight away, but it was later revealed that They relied on the testimony of people who were at the scene, but you know, they were either injured or even unconscious in some cases.

02:41:03.000 And also, could you talk about some of the phone calls that you got from, you said you got some phone calls from different police departments across the country.

02:41:12.000 And you posted those up on your website as well.

02:41:15.000 Yeah, talk about that.

02:41:18.000 Yeah, they were from the West Yorkshire Police Constabulary.

02:41:22.000 They were the police constabulary investigating the four alleged bombers and one of them He decided to call me one evening and suggest something which I couldn't make out.

02:41:37.000 I said, hey, you've got the wrong number, guy.

02:41:39.000 But he continued and called the following day and I recorded it and posted it on the web.

02:41:44.000 It just says that I had a vehicle which was involved with transporting something or other to do with the investigation into the 7-7 bombings.

02:41:55.000 You know, I'll tell you what, I'll tell you what, I forgot to do this.

02:41:59.000 John, will you go to his website and uh...

02:42:03.000 And again, Daniel, give my producer at the network your website again.

02:42:08.000 We've got a link to it on Apple Wars.

02:42:10.000 World Wide Web.

02:42:11.000 The Fourth Bomb.

02:42:13.000 It's 4-4-4-t-h-bomb.com.

02:42:17.000 Yeah, go to thefourthbomb.com and I know I've listened to that a few days ago.

02:42:21.000 Where specifically is that clip so we can grab that right now and play it?

02:42:24.000 Yeah, it's if you go to one of the four boxes I think it's the third box.

02:42:33.000 You also got audio on the web and video from the police interrogating you.

02:42:41.000 Let's tell that story.

02:42:42.000 Finally, six months later, after demanding it, you get there meeting with them.

02:42:46.000 Tell us about that.

02:42:48.000 It wasn't as much as I had hoped it would.

02:42:53.000 They just took my details, but what they did was, um, he rushed through it.

02:42:58.000 It took four hours, but he rushed through it.

02:43:00.000 He was, it wasn't really as if they were depending on my information and eyewitness accounts.

02:43:07.000 as a vital part of their inquiry because, of course, they had already completed their inquiries or whatever they wanted to say were their inquiries months ago.

02:43:19.000 So what they did was they waited until they had worked out their story and then kept me running and then brought me in and just said, hey, okay, what's your story, just so that they could do their paperwork.

02:43:31.000 But that's all it was, just paperwork.

02:43:33.000 Tell folks about the diagram.

02:43:37.000 The diagram, are you talking about which one Because there's been quite a few.

02:43:42.000 Oh yeah, the bus diagram, which they, um, asked me to, um, sign.

02:43:48.000 The bus diagram which they asked me to mark out, um, where the people were sitting on the bus and where the people were standing and what happened on the bus, it, the diagram was the complete Wrong layout for the bus.

02:44:03.000 And I said to the anti-terrorist branch detective who was taking my statement, this is completely incorrect.

02:44:11.000 So by me signing this, that's just going to render everything which I've told you inadmissible.

02:44:20.000 So I think it was just a ploy.

02:44:21.000 They didn't really want my information, as you would understand.

02:44:28.000 Amazing.

02:44:29.000 Steve, there's a lot of other facets to this.

02:44:32.000 Any other questions you've got for the guest we have?

02:44:35.000 Yeah, I would also point out that, you know, Daniel had a shirt, which I believe he still has, with, you know, victim's blood on it, which should have been taken for forensic testing, but they weren't even interested in that either.

02:44:52.000 It's just they've worked out previously You know, a line to take on this, and they weren't deviating from the line, even though you've got, you know, a first-hand witness here saying this is incorrect.

02:45:02.000 You've got a layout of the bust which is incorrect.

02:45:05.000 I mean, if this doesn't tell us that we need an independent inquiry on this, then what else does?

02:45:14.000 Okay.

02:45:15.000 Knowing what you know now, knowing all the evidence concerning government involvement or black ops involvement, intelligence involvement in past attacks and in the 7-7 attack, seeing your bus erected by these shadowy government characters, seeing people on the ground seconds after it happened, the fake bandages, what do you think was really going on there?

02:45:38.000 Who do you think was behind the bombings?

02:45:41.000 Well, um...

02:45:43.000 I know who wasn't behind the bomb of the bus, but I couldn't really hazard a guess.

02:45:51.000 It was obviously someone with a lot of power higher up.

02:45:57.000 I've got to live out here, so it's quite obvious who did it.

02:46:02.000 Unless I can actually provide evidence.

02:46:05.000 That's what the website is about.

02:46:06.000 Putting the evidence out there so people can decide for themselves.

02:46:09.000 But who didn't do it?

02:46:11.000 Because you didn't see an Asian, no one else on that group said they did.

02:46:14.000 Yeah, Hafiz Hussain didn't do it.

02:46:16.000 Hafiz Hussain didn't blow up the bus, but hey, who did?

02:46:19.000 So, that's what we've got to find out.

02:46:22.000 And that's what we're all working towards.

02:46:24.000 And the truth will out.

02:46:26.000 That's one thing I know.

02:46:28.000 Everything you're doing, everything like-minded individuals are doing will feed to that.

02:46:35.000 Absolutely.

02:46:36.000 This is just off the charts powerful and again it fits with the other witness testimonies, all the other information we have.

02:46:45.000 How do you think individuals who did carry this out can live with themselves just killing innocent I don't think they, um...

02:46:57.000 really care.

02:46:59.000 They have a role, and they have an objective, and their goal is doing that.

02:47:05.000 If it kills people, they say, hey, that's just how it goes. 0.98

02:47:09.000 We're saving you from the evil terrorists and all the crazy people in the world who are out to destroy you. 0.91

02:47:16.000 So, they probably see their role as helping people, even though they're just killing people. 1.00

02:47:22.000 Yeah, we gotta kill a few so they'll accept security to keep them safe. 0.99

02:47:26.000 Exactly. 1.00

02:47:27.000 Totally sick!

02:47:28.000 Steve Watson?

02:47:30.000 Yeah, I mean, if we do delve into a bit of the evidence, we've got, you know, numerous advance warnings from other intelligence agencies, from French, Spanish, the Saudis, who said, you know, gave an exact time frame for this, and Scotland Yard themselves, who, you know, told the Israeli Embassy on the very morning, minutes before that it was going to

02:47:52.000 It was going to go off, and Benjamin Netanyahu, who was in a hotel on Tavistock Square, which is a point that is often missed, he was told to stay in the hotel, which, you know, that kind of proves that they had precise location information as well, so we need to keep working towards outing the truth on this.

02:48:13.000 Well, we need to put this guy's face up everywhere, and we've got, look, we've got technologies to scan his face, do a composite by reducing to the lines beneath the bandages.

02:48:24.000 I actually know some police sketch artists who can, we can use computer mapping to get this guy's face.

02:48:36.000 This is the type of stuff we'll cut it six feet under, but what the hell?

02:48:40.000 We gotta stop the murderers. 0.96

02:48:42.000 It's here.

02:48:49.000 After a year in production and traveling to distant lands, my new film, Terror Storm, is complete.

02:48:54.000 Shocking declassified government documents prove that western governments are orchestrating terror attacks against their own populations as a pretext to enslave them.

02:49:03.000 Terror Storm proves that not only was 9-11 an inside job, but the attacks of 7-7 in London were carried out by British intelligence.

02:49:10.000 Terror Storm chronicles the lies that took us to war in Iran, a White House program to disseminate fake news, NSA spying, secret police torture, the latest 9-11 information, and much, much more.

02:49:22.000 Terror Storm is the definitive guide to the history of government-sponsored terrorism.

02:49:26.000 It's an anthology of government crimes.

02:49:28.000 Terror Storm is a film that everyone who wants to be truly informed must see.

02:49:32.000 Get your copy today at Infowars.com or PrisonPlanet.com or by calling toll-free 1-888-253-3139 or watch it right now online at PrisonPlanet.tv.

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02:51:44.000 Big John.

02:51:47.000 Big John.

02:51:51.000 Every morning at the mine you can see him arriving.

02:51:54.000 He stood six foot six and weighed 245.

02:51:56.000 Kind of broad at the shoulder and narrow at the hip.

02:51:59.000 And everybody knew he didn't give no lift to Big John.

02:52:05.000 Big John!

02:52:08.000 Big John!

02:52:10.000 Big Bad John!

02:52:13.000 Big John!

02:52:17.000 Nobody seemed to know where John called home.

02:52:19.000 He just drifted into town and stayed all alone.

02:52:22.000 Didn't say much, kinda quiet and shy, but he spoke it all.

02:52:26.000 He just said hi to Big John.

02:52:30.000 Somebody said he came from New Orleans, where he got in a fight over a Cajun queen and a crashing blow from a huge right hand sent a Louisiana fella to the promised land, Big John.

02:52:44.000 Big John!

02:52:47.000 Big John!

02:52:50.000 Big Bad John!

02:52:51.000 Welcome back.

02:52:54.000 I tell ya, the courage of our guest, Daniel Obachiki, the courage of Steve Watson, they're over there in London in one of the biggest police states in the world.

02:53:05.000 I mean, you try to videotape on the street, they come over and tell you to shut it off.

02:53:08.000 They don't allow protesting now.

02:53:10.000 There's secret police everywhere.

02:53:12.000 It is certainly like something out of V for Vendetta.

02:53:16.000 But the good news is more and more is coming out.

02:53:18.000 You know, 80-something percent know they killed Diana now.

02:53:21.000 Eighty-plus percent know they killed Dr. David Kelly. 0.93

02:53:24.000 And everybody knows they're a bunch of criminals.

02:53:27.000 And you're coming down. 0.92

02:53:28.000 Your New World Order is going to fail.

02:53:31.000 And your big, fat German commander, Sachs-Coburg-Gotha, you know, just your criminality will be exposed.

02:53:41.000 And that's just the way it is. 0.54

02:53:43.000 I had to go public.

02:53:43.000 It was the only thing I could do.

02:53:45.000 We've got you for a few minutes here and then five minutes to the next.

02:53:47.000 I'm going to let you go.

02:53:48.000 Any other points that need to be made, please make them now.

02:53:51.000 And my final question, why did you go public?

02:53:54.000 When did you go public?

02:53:55.000 Daniel, give us that timeline.

02:53:56.000 I had to go public.

02:53:59.000 It was the only thing I could do.

02:54:01.000 They were constantly harassing me.

02:54:04.000 And even when I was trying to work and get jobs, they were getting in there and holding me, preventing me from gaining employment.

02:54:13.000 So I had to fight back somehow And the only way to get back is by making sure what it is they didn't want to be out there was out there.

02:54:23.000 So that's what the book, the forthcoming book, theforthbomb.com and the website, It's all about just to, it's actually something which is helping me as well, helping me get through it.

02:54:36.000 Now who's publishing this?

02:54:38.000 I saw a little note in your narrative that you exclusively gave us, sections of the book, but you mentioned that the publisher's like, well let's not get into the guy with the bandages, that's not too important.

02:54:48.000 What do you mean that's not too important?

02:54:50.000 I hope that ends up in the book!

02:54:53.000 He is referred to in the book but it doesn't actually enhance the story that much.

02:54:59.000 There is another guy who was in the square that day, an agent, who I'm going to put something on one of the Internet sites, like Google TV or something like that, which shows you he's actually directing the police and everything.

02:55:15.000 So that's going to...

02:55:16.000 Wait, wait, there's video of this?

02:55:18.000 I can't at the moment.

02:55:18.000 Tell us who he is.

02:55:20.000 I can't at the moment.

02:55:21.000 It will be with you soon.

02:55:23.000 As soon as it's ready, I'll just forward you the link.

02:55:26.000 What, did you find it off a local TV clip or something?

02:55:28.000 I mean, and you said that's the guy that was directing?

02:55:30.000 Or, I mean...

02:55:32.000 Well, it's going to be on those TV websites where you can download media.

02:55:38.000 I'm going to stick it on one of those.

02:55:41.000 I'm just trying to find out where you got the video.

02:55:44.000 It was actually televised on the British television.

02:55:47.000 I understand.

02:55:48.000 So that's what I just guessed is that later you saw the news and said, hey, that's the guy.

02:55:52.000 You've got a clip of it.

02:55:53.000 But if you're pulling pictures of the other one, you better get that up now and not wait until the book comes out. 0.99

02:55:58.000 I'm telling you, Daniel, you're not stupid. 0.98

02:56:00.000 I'm not waiting. 1.00

02:56:01.000 You know how dangerous this is. 0.99

02:56:01.000 You're not stupid. 0.99

02:56:04.000 They just screamed it on TV because they thought no one would recognize him. 0.99

02:56:08.000 But because I was there, I just jumped and nearly hit the ceiling when I saw that.

02:56:12.000 And you were able to record it.

02:56:14.000 Oh, this is again. 0.99

02:56:14.000 Again, they're arrogant. 0.99

02:56:16.000 Final segment, we'll play some clips when we get back of these strange phone calls and things.

02:56:16.000 Stay there.

02:56:22.000 I'm Alex Jones.

02:56:23.000 Stay with me.

02:56:25.000 This broadcast is available on MP3 CD format at GCNLive.com or call toll free 877-300-7645.

Alex Jones Show - February 23, 2007

20070223_Fri_Alex

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