Episode 2567: Trumpism Without Trump Is A Recipe For Disaster
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
174.45636
Summary
In this episode of War Room, host Steve Kambach is joined by Josh marshall, founder and editor of Talking Points Memo, and a shrewd analyst, to discuss how a former presidential candidate who served as a presidential candidate in 2016 is now running for president.
Transcript
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this is the primal scream of a dying regime pray for our enemies because we're going medieval on
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these people here's not got a free shot all these networks lying about the people the people have
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had a belly full of it i know you don't like hearing that i know you try to do everything
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in the world to stop that but you're not going to stop it it's going to happen and where do people
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like that go to share the big line mega media i wish in my soul i wish that any of these people
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had a conscience ask yourself what is my task and what is my purpose if that answer is to save my
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country this country will be saved war room here's your host stephen k bannett
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and the guy who got a pardon from trump who ran his 2016 campaign and they've been on and off too
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but steve bannon also in a sign that this seems to be somewhat orchestrated went publicly after murdoch
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to back trump okay murdoch here's the way it's going to be brother you've disrespected
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donald j trump long enough he hasn't been on fox news since he announced for presidency remember
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murdoch you've deemed trump's not going to be president well we've deemed that you're not
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going to have a network because we're going to fight you every step of the way
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the murdochs immediately have to start covering president trump
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pretty striking to see this all spill out there i mean you could have skipped some of cpac but those
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moments right there we wanted to show you because it's all out in the open on the one hand it shows
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the stakes of this thing and that this really is a channel to the republican primary base at a time
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where fox is under pressure to change while it's being exposed for being even worse than people
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thought on the other hand the question i'm about to take to my next guest is how weak of a former
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presidential campaign are you the former president running when your top people are out here publicly
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begging for one interview on fox news josh marshall joins me founder and editor of talking points memo
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and a shrewd analyst i i put that question and all the above to you sir you know the the one thing
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that occurs to me is you know we're all familiar with the hbo show succession which is a romanic
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laugh about the murdoch family and fox news and so forth and so many of the things that you've been
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talking about over the last few minutes each each few of them is like an episode of succession the you
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know the the zoom call uh the banning back and forth it's like these two old men i mean rupert
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murdoch is i think over 90 he's he's quite old but but you're 91 uh you know just just the the the back
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and forth and and you know one thing that comes out is this is what happens when you're a corrupt news
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organization right there are one of the benefits of being a real news organization is that you you
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keep basically on track by needing to cover the news right you're you're you're not you're not in
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in fights with the uh uh presidential candidate who you run or runs you or something like that or
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trying to get you know all this kind of stuff uh there's as you said earlier there are lots of
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problems with uh you know the big uh corporate news organizations but this this is something that
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generally keeps them on track is that you you you always know that you are supposed to report at least
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what you think is the truth at the moment right and that can change you can be wrong no one's perfect
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um but that's that's that's the that's the big thing that that jumps out to me one thing i want
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to mention it you know this has been as you mentioned murdoch has been back and forth on trump for a
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while they started off at the very beginning back in 2015 treating him as a joke he kind of went to war
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with with fox fox did with him but as soon as trump was the guy they got on board and i don't think
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there's any question that is what is going to happen again and you know another another part of
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this you have build on your point and then you finish that's why we're seeing this so early because
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they know they either stop trump in this primary early or a former president who's also donald trump
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becomes the nominee and then they're stuck with him in the general and they're stuck with what
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everyone would gird to be a january 6 sequel with more training and i'm not trying to be alarmist but
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but rupert murdoch is not dumb and he understands exactly what they're up against so we're flushing
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out earlier a fight that might have normally come later um so that builds on i think the point you
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were making i'll let you let you continue well and to that point they know that if he's the guy
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if he's the nominee they will have to not only support him but lie on his behalf right this is
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again an issue you don't have to you don't have to grapple with if you're not a a corrupt uh news
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organization but what i was going to mention before is you know at just after um uh well a while after
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january 6th when fox was sort of going back and forth are we gonna are we gonna call arizona for him
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are we gonna support the big lie or not for a while he was sort of shadow banning them
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you know and there's all these different uh you know there's oann there i there's there's a half a
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dozen of them now newsmax there's all these other kind of fox clones and for a while he was like hey i'm
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gonna get behind one of these and i'm gonna take you guys out because you haven't been sufficiently
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loyal uh and and so so this this this this battle that is that is you know based on the corruption
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of both of them is it's it's really quite a a melodrama it really you know it's it's better than
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succession in a way and in some ways it's funnier if and if it weren't real oh yeah i was gonna say
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i'd say better and and so much worse uh but i know what you mean uh thanks say as the 2024
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republican primary chugs along i.e the hunger games no one seems to be willing to properly take on the
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field's biggest challenge donald trump nikki haley didn't even mention him by name at cpac but she was
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still heckled by attendees chanting trump after leaving the stage ronda santis didn't even go to cpac
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choosing to give a speech at the ronald reagan presidential library on the other side of the
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state of the other side of the country and trump is still dominating in the polls a recent you gov online
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poll has trump at 45 percent de santis at 29 percent haley is a distant third at four percent
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fernando amandi is a veteran democratic strategist and pollster based in miami carlos corbello is a
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former republican congressman of florida they both join me now fernando i will start with you
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i am not a believer in ron de santis i don't think that he has much of a chance i think that
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he is a media creation i think that that basically donald trump is going to clown him to no end and i
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think that what he has done in florida is not going to be particularly uh popular when he tries to sell
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it to the rest of the country but what say you as a pollster to the fact that he's the only person
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in the republican field right now that's within 20 points of donald trump and the unofficial
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straw poll at cpac okay well i think jason it speaks to the fact that seven march in the year
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of allure 2023 um we're gonna get i mean my teams need to cut the part where he johnson gets to cuts
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to the chase about the conundrum that all of the keebler elves and ronda santis are in uh which is
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quite a conundrum um there you see the um the the fight that matters right now i'm gonna give you
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signal not noise is to break the access of the uh oligarch wall street oligarchs the paul singers
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the um uh steve schwartzman's the ken griffins the tudor jones all these massive the guys that can
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write you a 50 million dollar check or 100 million dollar check and it doesn't change their lifestyle
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i'm talking about the biggest of the big the murderer's row of the wall street oligarchs
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that are in business with uh mitch mcconnell in the collaborationist senate and this is why by the
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way i tell you much they're in business with that they're they're darling their go-to girl is chris
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is cinema because she stopped uh the carried interest tax which we have to have and the carried
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interest tax is smart because that's just an income we need to get to the for the
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oligarchs the um repatriation of the assets that the federal reserve has uh has basically given to
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them we'll get to more of that later and deconstruct it but that that is so you get the
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oligarchs you've got the mitch mcconnell set of those collaboration as senators that gave biden all
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the wins plus that donors and most importantly the linchpin is murdoch who has essentially said
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i mean it's in the deposition they said we're going to turn trump into a non-person that's a quote
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we are going to turn trump into a non-person okay uh and we have to break that and we know that the
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speech at cpac and by the way thank president trump just put some very kind words about that it's up on
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my getter on his truth social uh about the speech and i think a link to it um right there and jason
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johnson who's a very smart guy he's a professor that sits in he's a contributor to uh by the way hates
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war room hates me hates all of it doesn't make doesn't mean he doesn't he's not quite perceptive
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uh he lays out the case about the conundrum of the kibble elves and desantis in this primary
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remember the iron triangle of murdoch and mcconnell and ken griffin is that um they will use any weapon
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at hand any instrument at hand before them whether it's glenn youngkin or ron desantis or nikki haley
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they will use any of the weapons before them to uh hopefully they think take a long shot and beat
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trump in a primary but if not doing that to damage him and then to support uh a newsom or a biden or
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whoever in the general murdoch and fox 16 let me be blunt they tried to kneecap trump with megan
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kelly at the first debate okay and breitbart we backed him off with the great matt boyle and uh
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tony lee we backed him off they were never that far in our camp trust me even when the numbers close
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murdoch was never they were always jiggy about that and after billy bush they completely flipped
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and the weekend before they told us they told me to my you know they also told me to my face they'd
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already done the polling murdoch made a decision there was gonna be hillary clinton there's gonna be
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foreign electoral votes this is gonna be a landslide we were down by five or six it was over
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okay and that's why paul ryan well that's one of the reasons paul ryan didn't come
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he wasn't there on that sunday beforehand he called us up and he says hey you're gonna lose
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wisconsin you're gonna lose again i can't be associated i already lost with romney i can't
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be associated with another national campaign loser and they backed out they didn't never had trump's
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back ever murdoch tweeted out in uh in uh in the summer of 15 i think it was july quote uh trump stop
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you're embarrassing yourself and the country murdoch's always said only after we won and he was
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rubbing up on jared uh those two rubbed up on each other that uh there was any kind of
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rapprochement and then as soon as as soon as 3 november they called it early boom they were out
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on trump you can read the depositions they never once said let's have an investigative reporter let's
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look at this math have we done our own analysis have we drilled have we drilled down and looked at
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this independently brought in a new team to look at like a team b to look with new eyes no no no effort
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whatsoever and then they said we're going to make this we're going to make trump a non-person well
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guess what we're making you a non-person we're not gonna have a bunch of foreigners uh and a bunch of
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foreigners uh you know intrude into america you've also you already done enough damage with iraq and
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afghanistan your cheerleading for the iraq war was was outrageous you're you're selling the lie and you
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talk about the election stealing uh you know oh we can't push that you know we can't uh you know trump's
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terrible all these people are awful we're not gonna have them back on terrible there's just
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terrible think about you never went and never did anything on the weapons of mass destruction lie
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that cheney sold the nation it was outrageous they're neoliberal neocons you have to understand
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there's a construct of the way the world operates its capital markets and its national security that's
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what's converging and conflating this crisis this collapse the the murdochs have that they're they're
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at the center of that their global media empire is at the center of that of the neoliberal
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neocon world order and that is what is collapsing before you you're the only ones that can keep it
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going because they need your taxes they need your pension funds they need the insurance companies
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that have your money and most importantly need your sons and daughters to go die on foreign battlefields
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on wars that are forgotten afterwards and have no victory that that's the tragedy for you know when
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mo was over in iraq you sit there every day you have no control it's all in god's hands we're sitting
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there what is this all for what am i doing is this is this the is this for the iraqis to have
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democracy so that a couple of years later they can sit there and go you know what we're gonna we're
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gonna sell the oil to the chinese communist party we're gonna have a huge output deal and guess what
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we're gonna convert it we're gonna only take it in in a chinese yuan you're not gonna convert into
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dollars to break the petrodollar that that's the reality of the world now we're gonna take a break
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we're gonna get up to great tucker did an amazing job last night uh bd's gonna be here but
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you know and hey i gotta tell it like it is you know hannity last night gives another softball
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hoochie coochie you know t-ball interview to uh to ron de santis and then plays trump's
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you know radio interview after that is like a big deal trying to trying to accommodate that's not
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accommodating this is not about hannity or any individual uh personality this is about the murdochs
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and their ownership and this about the murdochs and what they because they commanded they write the
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paychecks they command what happens this is about the murdochs trying to make trump a non-person and
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going to work for the democrats after they don't take him out in the primary this is the signal not
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the noise it's the thing that matters right now keep the main thing the main thing okay sure
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commercial break from revolver news darren b has been on this last night j6 the lies and
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again text bannon to 989898 is there seems to be a fundamental bind that republicans running in 2024
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are going to face they have to say one way or another how they stand on the legitimacy of the
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2020 election if you come forward and say the 2020 election is legitimate and joe biden got elected you
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automatically lose the maga crowd if you come forward and say the 2020 election was not legitimate then
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you're acknowledging that donald trump should have been president so how do you justify running against
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the guy how are republicans how is nikki haley desantis or anybody else how are they going to run
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and answer that question well jason i think the issue is the point you brought up at the beginning
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of the segment let me have it okay uh that's professor jason johnson he's a contributor at msnbc very
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brilliant guy i think he's professor at morgan state um he just nailed that he's just nailed in 60
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seconds the conundrum of the keyboard elves and ron desantis in um a the republican primary right there
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i'm gonna play that a gazillion times over the next couple of months i want to bring in darren beady we
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got a lot to go through got some tucker stuff again but darren i want to ask you first um about this
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murdoch situation right because this is we got to get this sorted right now because you have the iron
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triangle of the big oligarchs on wall street the mitch mcconnell donor you know who most of the
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oligarchs but these these um collaborationist senators plus the murdoch apparatus with the
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murdochs and i'm not picking on any individual people at fox because murdoch runs this with an iron fist
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uh darren beady look i think it's important to understand the significance of honest signals
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in politics that means when it's down to the wire when it really matters who has who's back and you
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brought it up 2016 people forget so easily 2016 fox along with the entire institutional apparatus of
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the gop was vigorously opposed to trump and did everything it could to stop and was only after
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against all odds against the coordinated opposition of every powerful institution in the country
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if not the world that trump won that all of these people who did everything they could
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to stop him ingratiated themselves and to some degree this worked and people forgot
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what their true colors really were when it mattered and you're seeing this just come to the fore
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yet once again people like paul ryan people like mitch mcconnell people like the murdochs the whole
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institutional apparatus at fox of course they're opposed to trump they've always been opposed to
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trump it's just now in their estimation they don't have to kiss up to him they would rather put him down
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for good politically and they think they can do that by weaponizing people like you know potentially
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desantis against him and putting out a blackout on trump's media appearance and fox and that's
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another big difference is trump benefited tremendously as you know from earned media in 2016 there is a
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coordinated consensus across the board they will not make that mistake again the media will do
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everything it can to black out trump give him a blacklist from the media which frankly is all the more
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reason that i think he needs to get back on twitter it's the one thing you know one of the few things
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he has going for him in terms of media distribution is he has his powerful twitter account reinstated and
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the rest of the media is blacking him out as much as they can on behalf of these special interests he
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needs to get the word out because when he does the public's reminded why he's the only guy for the job
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and he reminded that us of that very powerfully in his tremendous cpac speech
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i took an hour yesterday and i would play part of my play my speech but i also went through the
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just the policy points i think i only got through six i mean that that thing and i tell the team over
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there you gotta i think we gotta highlight those there's 10 major policy announcements that speech
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that nobody else could do remember it's not just trump it's this audience it's trumpism it's populist
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nationalists they want that to stop these are neoliberal neocons that is that they are they
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are the washington generals to the democrats harlem globetrotters in this this is why it's taken us
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40 years to get here because it's always about unity and compromise and you can see that's where the
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biden would have no accomplishments it was not for the collaboration the senate and now you get
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mitch mccann saying his number one priority is ukraine and and making sure that biden gets all these
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spending deals done and you're going to see this on the debt ceiling everything that the populist
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nationalist movement is adamantly opposed to therefore and remember conservative inc you see
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i'm rolling in now and de santis and rubbing up on him and look mark halperin's got a piece up on
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newsmax uh and we're going to hopefully maybe get mark on here in the next couple of days he's still a
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brilliant a very brilliant uh political analyst he deconstructs the the the he deconstructs the
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uh reagan library speech and i'll be brutally frank it was a nothing burger when governor de
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santis is out there and you're you've got the chinese dropping war work they're sounding the
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war toxins you're in 1939 heading towards the um heading towards the uh third world war you want
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to be president united states versus you're running against a guy who gave us four years of peace and
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prosperity and you're at the reagan library you got to stand and deliver you got to talk about the
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collapse of the neoliberal neocon order you've got to i know it's uncomfortable because you still are
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a neoliberal neocon and i hate to be so brutally frank but you can tell that on these wishy-washy
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answers on ukraine when you're sitting there you can't play you can't play small ball you can't play
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yeah gavin newsom in florida in the california model versus the florida model i got that that's
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important i can see that but at the reagan library historic place and first off it's just it was a it
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was a lackluster speech compare the policy prescriptions and that look i get the woke stuff
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and all that we're one of the biggest supporters that we have all the parents rights movements on
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here i understand support and go against the corporations and i think governor santa has been
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a terrific governor but you ain't running for governor of america you're running to be commander
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in chief in a time of war you got to step it up and and you're a warrior you you you've been in those
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places look and i i keep saying i don't want this inner squad i don't want the murdochs to have an
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inner squad conflict here that damages i think ron de santis be a great secretary defense
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for president trump and i think that would position ron de santis to be one of the leading
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candidates in 2028 which is the rightful time we need we are in the early days of the kinetic part
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of the third world war and we we don't have time for on-the-job training and we can't how would you
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not and this one ticks me off so much about the murdochs why would you not have a guy on here that
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you haven't had on live until we forced you at cpac because you weren't going to do that why would
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you have an entity playing his interview that's so cheeseball you do an interview on the radio show and
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you play it up as some big exclusion on fox that's not good enough okay that's not good enough not
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good enough why would you not why would they not respect the audience to have a guy's opinion let's
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hear what he has to say he gave us four years of peace and prosperity against these same barbarians
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why don't we wouldn't you like to hear what he would want to do with the ayatollahs and the
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nuclear weapon wouldn't you want to hear what he'd do with erdogan wouldn't you want to hear what he'd
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do with the kgb the kgb ccp merger the last 24 hours ladies and gentlemen look at the look at
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the drudge mac daddy i've been posting them up on getter drudge has got it i mean the ccp is
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throwing down hard they're selling the war toxins they say hey we see the containment strategy trump
00:23:59.720
set up uh you guys keep on you're gonna have a problem okay they're in your face they're in
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a couple a couple points steve a couple points so you mentioned this is about trumpism this is about
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the movement it's not about trump himself i'll offer an addendum to that i i think fundamentally
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that's true but there's a crucial addendum and that is this that the moniker of trumpism after
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trump trumpism without trump is the false song to use a phrase that the establishment is using to
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neutralize and destroy both trumpism and trump the false song of trumpism after trump is what the
00:24:44.180
establishment is using to destroy both trumpism as trump because right now trump is the leader
00:24:52.360
of this movement trump is the once in a generation charismatic figure hold it yes give me give me
00:25:01.480
that again give me that again go slowly for me because hey everybody knows bd's my guy he's one
00:25:06.220
of the most brilliant theoreticians we got in this entire movement he was a genius in the white house he's
00:25:10.840
the most only guy had enough balls of a tenured professor or a guy at a major you know ivy league
00:25:16.440
or ivy league equivalent to to support trump and then he got you know they came after him because
00:25:22.000
he's so smart hit the rewind button and give me that whole thing again the addendum well very simple
00:25:28.380
it's ultimately about the movement it's ultimately about trumpism but this moniker that you hear of
00:25:36.320
trumpism without trump we want trumpism but not trump we want to move beyond trump that is the false song
00:25:45.680
with which the establishment is trying to kill both trumpism and trump the moniker of trumpism without
00:25:54.200
trump is the establishment's way of destroying both trump and trumpism and that's very important to
00:26:03.020
understand at the moment you cannot separate the unique charismatic talent of trump a generational
00:26:11.920
talent you don't see anywhere from the movement it's not enough anybody can get in front of camera
00:26:19.920
and read the script of talking points that are now revealed thanks to trump's success to be successful
00:26:27.560
and resonant with the public anyone can read a script and not anyone can govern competently
00:26:34.720
but competent governance is still a very different thing and a very far cry from being a once in a
00:26:42.540
generation charismatic political figure who started and still leads the most important political movement
00:26:50.360
in our nation's history and i think people need to understand that crucial distinction that is why the
00:26:59.000
establishment is doing everything it can to promote not they're not never trump anymore they understand
00:27:06.320
that's not going to work it never worked now they are for trumpism without trump because they know that
00:27:13.720
trumpism without trump right now means the end of both trump and trumpism
00:27:19.360
they they yes because they're harsh they don't it's a brilliant point they don't really mean
00:27:26.020
anti-trumpism okay we're gonna take a break bd's gonna be here and get into the tucker revelations
00:27:30.400
last night which i thought tucker did an extraordinary job given the political sensitivity of it and the way
00:27:35.900
you have to you have to juggle a lot of balls i thought he did a really excellent job in in in providing
00:27:41.700
the visuals with commentary uh and i know he did a good job because morning joe wasn't all over
00:27:48.600
if they thought they saw an opening here they'd be all over it they didn't want to talk about it
00:27:52.800
it's like it didn't happen um bd also says reading a script these guys gotta throw away the scripts
00:28:00.920
mickey haley reading mike pompeo reading ron de santis throw it away it's got to come from the heart
00:28:05.900
it's authenticity authenticity throw away the scripts okay bd next from revolver
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takeaway from the corpus of footage that we spent three weeks looking at it's that the january 6th
00:29:37.040
committee lied its members are liars and as the result of those lies course of liberties in this
00:29:44.620
country were eroded people went to prison they're in prison as of right now unjustly so those lies
00:29:50.800
had consequences so you have to ask yourself whatever happened to the members of the january 6th
00:29:55.200
committee these liars who hurt people and the country well let's see adam schiff is running for
00:30:01.280
adam kinziger got a job at cnn liz cheney somehow wound up a professor at the university of virginia
00:30:07.420
the august university of virginia they're all still there benny thompson oh listen to his wisdom but
00:30:16.140
they're liars and above all this video proves it here's another installment one of the enduring
00:30:26.480
mysteries of january 6th is the role that intelligence and law enforcement agencies played
00:30:31.840
in the events of that day we know there was some number of undercover federal agents in the crowd
00:30:37.320
at the capitol officials have since admitted that under oath but what exactly were they doing then
00:30:42.380
the january 6th committee worked hard to hide the answer to that question we do know from
00:30:47.220
contemporaneous videotape that a mysterious figure called ray epps encouraged the crowd to go into the
00:30:53.160
capitol for some reason epps has never been indicted for that but there's no question he did it we need
00:30:59.100
to go into the capitol under public pressure the january 6th committee finally interviewed ray epps
00:31:05.360
epps told the committee that he never entered the capitol and therefore never committed a crime
00:31:10.600
his text messages showed that at 2 12 p.m he boasted to his nephew that he had quote orchestrated the
00:31:17.740
protest at the capitol he admitted he helped get people there yet curiously congressional democrats
00:31:24.240
consider ray epps an ally not an insurrectionist tonight we can tell you that at the very least
00:31:30.440
ray epps lied in his sworn testimony to the january 6th committee epps testified that when he sent the
00:31:36.760
text messages to his nephew he had already left the capitol grounds to return to his hotel room
00:31:42.180
that is not true the surveillance footage we found shows that in fact ray epps remained at the
00:31:49.140
capitol for at least another half an hour you're seeing that on your screen now what was epps doing
00:31:54.800
there we can't say but we do know that he lied to investigators the january 6th committee likely knew
00:32:01.340
this too democrats had access to the same tape yet they defended ray epps no honest investigation would do
00:32:09.180
that but the point of the january 6th committee was never to investigate anything the point was to
00:32:14.960
stage a made for tv show trial from the opening moments the tone of the hearings was almost comically
00:32:21.220
overheated and polemical there was not a tragedy in american history that democrats didn't liken to the
00:32:26.800
protests of january 6th i'm from a part of the country where people justify the actions of slavery
00:32:33.980
the ku klux klan and lynching how staged and fraudulent was the work of the january 6th committee
00:32:40.920
democrats hired a good morning america producer called james goldston to dramatize the footage they
00:32:47.080
released they even dubbed in audio to make the pictures more sensational as in a docudrama
00:32:52.360
the networks carried it all live as if it were real lied about the police officer they claimed to revere
00:32:58.720
if they were willing to do that then their dishonesty knew no limits
00:33:03.380
and as you'll see in a moment that dishonesty did know no limits new surveillance video and just
00:33:11.640
admitted including new reporting on ray epps and what he was doing there and what he told investigators
00:33:16.900
he was doing there and how it's contradicted by the video evidence but first to assess what we just
00:33:21.680
saw charlie hurt of the washington times joins us now charlie thanks so much for coming up so if you
00:33:26.600
think and and you you you know you've really got to feel uh for brian sick dick who's passed away
00:33:32.800
um and you've got to wonder about anyone who would who who knew they knew that he was not murdered by
00:33:40.500
the mob but they've claimed it anyway for two years and it takes a very low kind of person to do that
00:33:47.540
to lie about a man's death like that for political advantage and this tapes this tape proves that's
00:33:52.760
exactly what they did no these people are truly sick uh they're they're uh you know you think you
00:33:58.380
you know you think you know how sick they are and then you see something like this and you realize
00:34:02.100
that they're uh there is truly nothing nobody uh no event nothing that they won't exploit as as joe
00:34:09.280
biden said oh no this is also about white supremacy and and you know nobody uh did you know nobody uh
00:34:15.960
comported themselves worse than the press did on this day and of course in the years afterwards
00:34:20.400
um and and okay i want to bring in i want to bring in uh darren beady of the uh of revolver
00:34:26.440
darren you've been all over the whole thing and you've been on tucker many times i know you've
00:34:30.860
worked with this team and i think they did a great job of threading the needle because they couldn't
00:34:35.220
use the facial recognition because as he said he's not an investigative um like doj he's not fbi he's
00:34:42.280
not j6 but i think what people are most shocked about is you and we didn't even get to this shot the
00:34:47.940
q anon shaman which is probably the most egregious um how did the committee have i mean this is
00:34:53.900
clearly illegal what they've done it's it's outrageous you got the fed's direction part
00:34:58.520
with the ray epps you got the lies on syknick which you were the one that really went back a
00:35:02.720
revolver and painstakingly told us that this was all a lie you got the q anon i mean it was so
00:35:08.380
outrageous it was so outrageous last night uh tell me your thoughts
00:35:12.980
well yes uh so much to cover i mean the footage of brian sicknick walking around the capitol just
00:35:21.620
reminds us before revolver news even changed the entire narrative on january 6th with our fed's
00:35:29.340
erection thesis and reporting we debunked repeated and severe and malicious lies pertaining to the
00:35:37.440
circumstances surrounding officer sicknick's death as tucker covered a bit in that segment
00:35:43.120
initially their story was he was bludgeoned to death with a fire uh extinguisher that was wrong
00:35:50.880
then they switched to a narrative where he was killed with by bear spray we actually did a heat map
00:35:56.960
image analysis comparative image analysis showed that hold it hold it hold it hold it hold it hold
00:36:01.980
darren darren darren darren darren please they're not wrong these were lies they had this footage
00:36:08.220
that's my point it's not it's not people make mistakes in reporting all the time this was done
00:36:13.400
on purpose they knew from the entire time they put that story out and and tucker had everybody on
00:36:18.640
there saying he's bludgeoned to death then they went to bear spray they knew it was a lie at the time
00:36:25.240
sir you agree yes well i mean not everyone who repeated the lie but the originators
00:36:31.960
of this false narrative i think knew it was a lie i think that's pretty clear because the evidence was
00:36:37.720
so so apparent all you had to do is a little bit of digging to see that the it was not bludgeoned to
00:36:45.040
death he was not uh you know killed by bear spray and so forth but this was these initial lies again this
00:36:52.780
was the prelude to the larger fed's erection these initial lies were used to amplify the severity our
00:36:59.320
original and first piece on january 6th was actually about the lies surrounding brian sicknick's death
00:37:04.920
the title of the piece was very carefully chosen with a full understanding of its severity and
00:37:11.200
connotations we called it maga blood libel because that's exactly what it was because the death of
00:37:17.760
sicknick was used to call it a deadly insurrection to reinforce the false narrative that this was a deadly
00:37:25.860
domestic terror attack that put january 6th in the same conversation absurdly as september 11th or you
00:37:35.820
know whatever you know kamala harris said it was like you know pearl harbor all these ridiculous things
00:37:41.560
but they needed the adjective deadly to even have a chance of selling that with a straight face and
00:37:48.680
they got that by lying about the circumstances surrounding sicknick's death the thing about epps
00:37:54.760
you know tucker's absolutely right the january 6th committee they were completely disingenuous
00:38:00.560
with respect to epps and nowhere does that come out more clearly than in the transcript of their
00:38:05.740
interrogation of epps himself so i pointed out and uh another appearance on this program what's
00:38:12.440
remarkable in this transcript is how some of the committee members to their credit are actually asking
00:38:18.400
intelligent questions adam kinsinger however he bends over backwards which is weird because he's
00:38:26.560
usually on all fours but this time he's bending over backwards to offer the most implausibly charitable
00:38:33.980
interpretation of inconsistency after inconsistency after lie on the part of ray epps ray epps is so
00:38:43.420
detached from reality he has such contempt for the truth that he said initially the reason i thought
00:38:50.400
to go into the capital was i thought it would be legal i thought it would just be open and we can go
00:38:55.540
in and they said well if you thought it would be legal why did you preface your remarks by saying
00:38:59.780
i'm probably going to go to jail for this i'm probably going to get arrested for this he said
00:39:04.200
well gee i don't know they said why do you think everybody immediately accused you of being a fed
00:39:09.800
because of your outlandish suggestions to go in the capital he said i don't think that really happened
00:39:15.080
my son doesn't remember that happening he even suggested that the footage the now iconic footage
00:39:21.940
of the crowd chanting fed and pointing right at ray epps he suggested that footage isn't real that it was
00:39:28.880
doctored that it was somehow edited in after the fact the transcript of this interrogation of ray
00:39:36.620
ray epps by the committee is really something to behold and there's one more thing to be said about
00:39:41.000
the committee and particular is chairman benny thompson it's often overlooked that benny thompson was not
00:39:47.480
only the chair of the january 6 committee he was the department of homeland security's stooge
00:39:53.840
within congress he was a seven-time chair of the homeland security committee why would the department
00:40:00.680
of homeland security of all institutions of all bureaucracies have this active interest in massaging
00:40:09.300
the narrative of january 6th i think it's very interesting to consider in light of a couple of things
00:40:14.860
one the dhs is the tip of the spear when it comes to the repurposing of the national security apparatus
00:40:22.420
domestically in order to silence suppress and destroy trump and his movement and secondly as we
00:40:29.920
recently learned the department of homeland security is the only bureaucracy with an intelligence agency
00:40:37.400
that has the imprimatur to operate domestically you know the cia is an intelligence agency technically
00:40:44.780
speaking they're only allowed to operate overseas technically speaking the fbi while it does do some
00:40:51.820
kind of work gathering information that you could call intelligence is a law enforcement agency and
00:40:57.860
therefore it's subject to the restrictions that are attendant to the law enforcement process the dhs is
00:41:05.460
the only organization that has this domestic intelligence agency which is very interesting to consider
00:41:12.340
in light of a statement made by ray epps's lawyer ray epps's lawyer who happens to be a nine-year veteran of
00:41:21.220
the phoenix fbi field office by the way ray epps's lawyer was doing this big tour that was picked up by
00:41:27.540
the j6 committee and adam kinsinger and others and lawyer was saying ray epps has nothing to do with the
00:41:33.920
fbi and ray epps for that matter had nothing to do with any law enforcement agency and you'll notice this
00:41:41.140
lawyer was clinging on to the term law enforcement agency for dear life why would that be could it have
00:41:49.120
something to do with the fact that the dhs is not a law enforcement agency military intelligence is not a
00:41:58.200
law enforcement agency and neither for that matter would any kind of private cutout organization
00:42:04.580
contractor work that is doing the bidding of those agencies be a law enforcement agency and this is
00:42:13.720
particularly interesting to consider in light of ray epps's lawyer's answer to another question when
00:42:20.120
asked okay you're saying he's not fbi he's not law enforcement agency can you tell us if he's involved
00:42:26.220
with any government agency period the lawyer's response is very telling if you read between the
00:42:32.200
lines his response was not to my knowledge now clearly the lawyer and epps had conversations about
00:42:39.220
ray epps's past and his potential involvement with government agencies how else would the lawyer be able to
00:42:46.940
so emphatically and explicitly deny epps's involvement with law enforcement agencies so it's clear that if the
00:42:54.440
lawyer were in a position to deny involvement with any agency just as explicitly and just as emphatically
00:43:02.180
he would have left up the opportunity to do so but instead we have the absolute damning answer
00:43:08.780
not to my knowledge give me a break we all know it epps is the smoking gun of january 6 and we have
00:43:16.700
more fruit now than darren darren hang on for a second we're gonna get back we're gonna deconstruct
00:43:22.360
more of the tucker revelations also jim hoff is going to join us about the eric system
00:43:27.600
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testifying live we're cutting that uh this is a the bombshell is dropping all over over there about
00:46:11.960
the debt ceiling and about the interest rates is how it's going to impact you like cortez that's
00:46:15.600
why cortez now early he's going to come on later we got that we get uh the the the jim hoft up he's
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going to come on in a second big news on the election on election fraud clean up the elections
00:46:25.440
um darren if you can hang for a second i do want to bring mike davis and mike davis is uh we're
00:46:31.360
doing the we're doing the talkers of mike davis you should know he's not just doing his great job
00:46:36.440
in the supreme court and all these big issues happening there he's also all over the weaponization
00:46:41.640
committee and and these committees are quite frankly we're just not getting the traction i think
00:46:45.480
weaponization is so bad that axios has a huge story in fact if my team could go to getter
00:46:50.880
i put it up this morning axios had scoops all over about the the just and jim jordan's a good
00:46:56.180
man but man it's just not happening over there uh and also mike you're very close to what's happening
00:47:00.960
on jason give me your assessment first davis on tucker's revelations last night uh particularly
00:47:05.800
q anon shaman uh uh sitnik epps all of it sir yeah so the the justice department has a
00:47:15.340
obligation under the constitution to provide to defendants exculpatory evidence evidence that
00:47:23.540
tends to show their innocence and with these thousands and thousands of hours of capital
00:47:29.760
surveillance videos you have to ask what did the justice department do to obtain these videos and how
00:47:36.540
did they make these videos available to these january 6 defense attorneys particularly uh this jacob
00:47:44.480
chinsley uh his his counsel jacob chinsley pled guilty in a plea agreement back in september
00:47:52.140
of 2021 so the question you have to ask if you watch this tucker video uh these these tucker videos
00:47:59.820
last night this is clear exculpatory evidence that jacob chinsley should not be in prison for 41 months
00:48:07.580
this is clear evidence that the uh the capital police escorted him around you know you have this
00:48:13.320
mentally ill man who went went went on the senate floor but but but hang on hang on but you got you
00:48:19.540
got to help you got to help me out here everybody merrick garland knew they these guys know they all
00:48:25.360
had access to the footage the j6 or elected congressman nancy pelosi heard they had this footage
00:48:32.680
it's not just it's not just the q anon shaman itself but how do you what kind of country is this
00:48:38.720
russia during the moscow show trials how could they possibly not just presented j6 but in a criminal
00:48:45.620
proceeding i mean to me people that did this should go to prison how do they put an american
00:48:50.660
citizen when you have this footage of the of the of the capital police being an escort for the guy
00:48:56.860
it's like the praetorian guard one time he's got nine guys there they're they're taking him and trying
00:49:01.480
to find the doors of the senator open how it's not just that but how did people in authority
00:49:07.840
know this and then prosecute this man and put him in prison mike davis that is a very very good
00:49:16.480
question that i had been lighting up twitter on uh for for the last uh day and here's the issue
00:49:23.100
remember attorney general merrick garland says back on january 4th he puts out this statement
00:49:27.740
two years into the january 6th investigations how quote one of the largest most complex and most
00:49:33.540
resource intensive investigations in our history right okay so if that's the case didn't the biden
00:49:40.320
justice department including the fbi review this capital surveillance video these thousands and
00:49:45.680
thousands and thousands of hours did they not review this now i understand that they said to these
00:49:50.520
defense attorneys sure you can go to the capital and look at these videos well that's not good enough
00:49:55.240
right there there is a constitutional case called brady where the defense attorney that the prosecutors
00:50:00.900
have to turn over to the defense attorney's exculpatory evidence right they didn't do that here if you just
00:50:06.520
say here here's thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of hours of videos from many different
00:50:12.080
videos across the capital you know go find the needle in the haystack to help your client when you're a
00:50:16.860
solo practitioner a solo defense attorney trying to represent a client that's not fair that's not how it's
00:50:22.680
supposed to work especially when you have hundreds of fbi agents and they had how many prosecutors
00:50:28.340
working on this case in the biden justice department they should have they should have
00:50:32.620
handed to jacob chansley's lawyers this specific video that was shown on tucker carlson last night
00:50:39.120
and they should not have prosecuted him for the charges that they prosecuted him for he should not
00:50:44.240
be in prison for 41 months this yes people should people should lose there's no there's no jury there's no
00:50:51.680
jury of his peers in this country that would find the guy guilty if they'd seen that i don't even know
00:50:56.440
how they bring the case i think this is impeachable this the the criminals here are the justice department
00:51:03.700
lawyers that did this and the j6 panel beady jump in here for a second mike hang on with me to hold
00:51:08.520
through the break beady your your thoughts on this one in particular how they prosecute a guy
00:51:13.320
when the evidence of his innocence is right there yeah i mean it's it's very shameful the whole
00:51:20.480
the whole exercise i mean my understanding it varies between you know case to case as to the
00:51:27.000
january 6 cases but in general there have been many cases where it doesn't seem like the government has
00:51:32.580
been forthcoming at all with respect to potentially exculpatory evidence and what's even more unfortunate
00:51:39.040
is it doesn't seem like all of the uh defense lawyers the the on the council side are being as
00:51:47.320
aggressive as one might expect or hope to retrieve this type of exculpatory material especially material
00:51:54.680
that pertains to the possibility of instigation incitement provocation um and entrapment uh there's
00:52:04.520
some kind of hesitation maybe there's a sense that it would unnecessarily or counterproductively
00:52:11.040
aggravate the government but i think there needs to be a more aggressive push for all of this evidence
00:52:16.800
all of this footage and for it to be used as part of it okay hang on one second 90 second break
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