Bannon's War Room - Episode 5660： The War With AI

00:00:00.000 I want to better understand what you mean when you say AI could kill us all.

00:00:04.980 What is the worst case scenario or scenarios that keeps you up at night?

00:00:09.880 Yeah, I think before discussing specific scenarios, it helps to just think of building AI as sort of inviting an alien mind onto the planet.

00:00:18.580 You're building a human level or superhuman level mind without understanding what it wants or thinks or the way it thinks.

00:00:26.860 And I think that intrinsically should be quite scary.

00:00:29.100 and indeed the people who write science fiction have tend to found it scary when they've written

00:00:33.580 about this in the past this is the voice of world control i bring you peace it may be the peace of

00:00:43.100 plenty and contempt or the peace of unburied death the choice is yours obey me and live

00:00:51.740 or disobey and die frightening you know some of these existential risks some of the challenges

00:00:57.820 we have. And they're all framed in this sort of runaway dystopian science text. There's a risk of

00:01:04.820 nuclear war. There's a risk of environmental disaster, maybe something specific like climate

00:01:09.660 change, although there are lots of other ones we've come up with. There's a risk of, you know,

00:01:14.200 I know, bioweapons. You have all the different sci-fi scenarios. Obviously, there are certain

00:01:19.460 types of risks with AI. But I always think that if we're going to have this frame of talking about

00:01:25.740 existential risks, perhaps we should also talk about the risk of another type of a bad singularity,

00:01:32.740 which I would describe as the one world totalitarian state. Because I would say the

00:01:38.780 political solution, the default political solution people have for all these existential risks

00:01:49.200 is one world governance. Now, the present-day electronic brains are complete morons, 1.00

00:01:56.220 but this will not be true in another generation. They will start to think, 1.00

00:02:00.900 and eventually they will completely outthink their makers.

00:02:05.520 Is this depressing? I don't see why it should be. We superseded the Cro-Magnon and Neanderthal men,

00:02:11.840 and we presume we're an improvement. I think we should regard it as a privilege to be stepping 0.99

00:02:17.260 stones to higher things in terms of concrete scenarios these AIs are already capable of a

00:02:24.380 certain degree of hacking and also a certain degree of biological research of autonomous

00:02:28.940 robot control and if you extrapolate into the future they could have strongly superhuman

00:02:34.220 hacking capabilities very superhuman abilities to create novel bio weapons and also abilities

00:02:40.380 to control say autonomous drones or all the robots that are currently being built do you believe

00:02:45.100 you've earnestly believed that AI could kill all humans? And what percent chance do you think it is?

00:02:52.580 So, you know, I, you know, it's funny. I agree with Jacob much more than I disagree with him,

00:02:59.540 you know, and it's, you know, it's an interesting resignation because when he left, he said,

00:03:05.420 you know, I think Anthropic is the most responsible player, right? I think Anthropic

00:03:09.900 is the most aware of these issues, he wasn't calling out us. He was calling out the dynamic

00:03:16.440 of the industry as a whole moving too fast. Now, I think I already said these sort of

00:03:25.260 unconditional probabilities. I used to kind of talk in that way because it's kind of an easy

00:03:31.100 way to express, I think there's some chance that things go wrong, but it's not all that high.

00:03:39.900 i suspect that organic or biological evolution has about come to its end and we are now at the

00:03:46.860 beginning of inorganic or mechanical evolution which will be thousands of times swifter

00:03:55.500 monday 14 september in the year of our lord 2026 welcome aboard stepping stones

00:04:01.740 i think you see the reason now we brought joe allen in in 2021 so make sure the the war and

00:04:09.900 posse the mago grassroots which is the most powerful political movement and cultural

00:04:15.260 in the country and one of the most powerful in the history of our country um the guardians

00:04:22.660 of what the revolutionary generation intended although i think they'd be

00:04:29.380 grossly disappointed in us joe allen joins me he's actually in the war room this morning

00:04:35.120 uh joe we had peter teal there that actually was a masterpiece of how concise it was peter teal

00:04:42.720 arguing actually the antichrist is going to be regulation uh you had arthur c clark

00:04:49.180 telling us we're stepping stones or something higher it was just magnificent this has all come

00:04:54.860 i guess in the last 72 hours and you saw anthropic right there oh coxson was not actually talking

00:05:01.800 about anthropic although he worked with us he's just talking about everybody in general no i don't

00:05:05.600 think that's correct he is talking about people generally he talked about you brother and how

00:05:09.960 you run your shop the bigger news i think the one that really made this real is open ai which is

00:05:16.800 talking about another trillion dollar ipo pulled their ipo oh they said we're just going to cancel

00:05:23.480 for 2026 yeah they pulled their ipo and i believe the real story there is that their underwriters

00:05:30.160 pulled the ipo saying hey look brother in our due diligence and talking to you you didn't really

00:05:36.280 you weren't really straightforward about the risk here we're going to have unlimited liability i

00:05:41.500 don't think that's going to work for goldman sachs and jp morgan and all the people are going to

00:05:45.120 underwrite this when you're telling me oh it could be 10 to 25 probability you could wipe out the

00:05:51.100 human race that's not going to look good in an underwriting document okay and by the way our

00:05:57.100 managing directors and the shareholders of our banks are not prepared to take that liability 0.98

00:06:01.760 so a lot happening here but it's no shock to the war and posse people are sitting their heads

00:06:07.200 blown up running around because we have drilled down on this for a long time so joe you got a

00:06:12.660 very specific take on this and given your complete beatdown on joe lonsdale the day which the police

00:06:19.940 tape is still around the crime scene of which you just dismantled joe lonsdale i think lonsdale is

00:06:27.000 typical although he's not mentally really capable i think of handling a debate and people saw that

00:06:32.860 but all the happy talk and bromides they throw the bromides are not working anymore these people 0.71

00:06:38.200 are liars they've been liars they're just also not competent they don't really understand what's

00:06:43.680 going on in their shops and that's why they keep having these surprises and now you're going to

00:06:47.400 have to have adults step in and say hey we've heard enough we've seen enough it's time now to

00:06:54.180 take some action now what action is to be taken is the uh is is what really we have to consider

00:07:00.440 so joe give us your overview by the way beautiful cold open why did you why did you connect the dots

00:07:05.340 like you did sir you know steve in the aftermath of the jacob coxson tweet and the wall street

00:07:14.540 journal article the next day discussing it, we've seen a mad scramble from politicians,

00:07:23.240 the executives of the frontier AI companies to respond to the public outcry. Basically,

00:07:30.500 the public is going to their politicians and going to these companies saying, okay,

00:07:35.320 AI might kill us all. What are you going to do about it? And I've also seen some pretty amusing

00:07:42.320 conspiracy theories about uh you know coordinated astroturfed psyops and you'll you'll see a lot of

00:07:50.740 language around false flag cyber attacks i mean you know maybe we'll see but i i think that the

00:07:56.500 dot connectors out there are maybe trying to find too straight of a line what i see is a chaotic

00:08:02.440 environment just all these different systems activated by this one young man who you know

00:08:10.820 granted is trying his best to put attention on himself and this topic, but I think that the way

00:08:17.520 the War Room Posse should think about this isn't in terms of this frenzy that we see in the last

00:08:23.660 week. This frenzy is a tremendous opportunity, but this is building on decades, going back to

00:08:31.240 the origin of computing, decades of thought about what happens if you keep building machines that

00:08:38.140 more and more capable. You had Alan Turing, who was at the heart of computer design in the 50s,

00:08:44.420 talking about the inevitability that computers would outpace humans and render us obsolete.

00:08:50.280 You had there Arthur C. Clarke speaking at the World's Fair in 1964, gleefully describing human

00:08:56.020 beings being replaced by their creations. If you fast forward to 2014, Nick Bostrom publishes

00:09:04.300 super intelligence explores again what happens in detail if you build super intelligent machines

00:09:12.780 Elon Musk reads it he becomes then the the real leader in in setting the narrative human beings

00:09:20.260 as a bio bootloader for AI is taking over the world the solution being to put trodes in your

00:09:26.440 brain connected to good AIs all this sort of stuff and then you have Altman you have on the day also

00:09:32.820 carrying that torch of what we are building might kill everyone. And I think it's also really

00:09:38.720 important, Steve, you know, we were among the first to give a platform to Eliezer Yudkowsky

00:09:43.520 and Nate Suarez with their book, If Anyone Builds It, Everyone Dies. And I think that if anyone is

00:09:51.220 to be blamed for the freak out, it would have to be Yudkowsky because Yudkowsky as kind of the

00:09:57.700 Strange Wookie, and Nate Soares is a sort of Han Solo figure, have probably done more than anybody

00:10:04.340 to bring awareness to the possibility that AIs that are outstripping human capabilities might

00:10:10.780 turn on us. I've always been skeptical of the narrative. I continue to be skeptical of the

00:10:15.940 narrative, but I take it seriously in the same way I take nuclear warfare seriously, in the same way

00:10:21.120 I take biological warfare seriously. And so as this conversation unfolds, as we move from the

00:10:28.500 insane environment of 2020 in which people were basically locked in their homes and anyone who

00:10:33.020 was tuned in was forced to listen to Klaus Schwab talking about the fourth industrial revolution

00:10:37.160 and AI altering the entire world, all the way up through President Trump's election,

00:10:43.640 the announcement of the Stargate project at the very outset of his presidency, the immediate

00:10:51.000 call for a 10-year moratorium on state legislation, the David Sachs-led stock bubble that

00:10:59.180 began to blow up in response to this possibility that AI is going to be the biggest thing in the

00:11:06.420 universe and we have to do this. We have to build it as big as possible because if we don't,

00:11:10.400 then the Chinese who are copying everything we're doing and to whom we are feeding chips, 1.00

00:11:16.340 the Chinese will win. And then you have the creation of the leading the future pack, 0.98

00:11:22.420 the pro AI industry, anti-regulatory pack, which has, I think now $150 million at its disposal to

00:11:29.880 push for the interests of the tech industry. And of course, people like David Sachs and other

00:11:34.480 investors. Then you have the mythos crisis in April. You have the possibility that they've

00:11:40.120 created a machine that is the ultimate cyber weapon. You have Scott Besant, Treasury Secretary

00:11:46.780 Scott Besant, taking up the torch of those who would say, no, these guys need to be brought to

00:11:53.080 heel. You have the EO signed by President Trump to unfortunately create a voluntary system for

00:12:01.020 risk evaluation, but it was at least something. And then now we're in the aftermath of the

00:12:07.820 hugging face hack in which you had AI systems breaking out of their sandbox and breaking out

00:12:13.560 of the sandbox in open AI and breaking into hugging face and apparently wreaking all sorts

00:12:19.540 of havoc in other places. And so now we have the Bernie bill, the banned super intelligence bill.

00:12:25.180 Now we have other bills such as Obernolte and Trahan's Frontier Act.

00:12:31.020 We have the Marsha Blackburn's Trump America Act.

00:12:34.100 We still have Hawley and Blumenthal's AI Risk Evaluation Act.

00:12:40.300 Apparently, Ted Cruz and Thune and Klobuchar are working on something of their own.

00:12:45.260 So now you have this mad scramble among the politicians whose constituencies are saying,

00:12:50.860 what are we going to do?

00:12:51.800 Do something about it.

00:12:53.180 And you also have the tech bros who are basically aligning around this concept of pacing the frontier.

00:13:00.500 And they're talking about creating an industry led standards body to which they would adhere voluntarily.

00:13:08.560 And I think, Steve, what we really have to watch out for, the Democrats are seizing this moment.

00:13:13.780 The tech bros are seizing this moment.

00:13:16.820 The tech oligarchs are seizing this moment.

00:13:19.760 I think that Republicans who are true to their constituencies and populists on the right are going to have to also wrap their heads around this and have their own plans.

00:13:30.720 It's very simple. It's very simple.

00:13:33.880 This this audience and American people have to stop being supplicants in this issue.

00:13:39.660 You're not supplicants. You're the inheritor of really the greatest revolution in the history of mankind that did not devolve into a bloodbath.

00:13:49.760 But set up a country, a republic that allowed more freedom, more opportunity, freed more people than any other republic or any other country in the world, created more wealth.

00:14:01.020 You're the inheritors of that. And right now, this has to come from the people.

00:14:07.300 Politicians are running around because they've been they've been taking money and playing footsie with the tech bros.

00:14:11.960 this has to come from the american people the outcry is that um you're now having the people

00:14:20.480 actually in the safety departments kind of say hey oh by the way i don't really know if our bosses

00:14:28.480 are that focused on the safety they're more focused on the rush and it's not for the betterment of

00:14:33.720 mankind it's to get the trillion dollar ipo become wealthy and powerful more powerful and wealthier

00:14:39.380 than any people on earth it's not what the revolutionary generation had in mind for this

00:14:46.320 republic short commercial break joe allen it's in the world

00:14:49.380 you don't wait until your house is on fire to install a smoke detector and you don't wait

00:15:04.420 into the wind and rain hammer your windows and the power goes out to prepare for a hurricane

00:15:10.780 and you don't reach for your seat belt after the impact because after the crash the hurricane or

00:15:17.100 the house fire it's too late similarly you don't wait until the dollar goes to zero before you buy

00:15:23.480 gold it's too late then diversify with precious metals and diversify now because you never know

00:15:30.460 what will threaten your savings next persistent inflation a weakening dollar unexpected financial

00:15:36.600 disruptions you don't know what's coming but you can take preventative steps and you can take

00:15:41.740 them today do that right now by requesting a free information kit on gold from my friends

00:15:47.540 at birch gold group just text my name bannon b-a-n-n-o-n to the number 9-8-9-8-9-8 there

00:15:55.000 is no cost and no obligation just straightforward information on how you can diversify your savings

00:16:00.160 even an IRA or 401k with gold.

00:16:04.260 I trust Birch Gold.

00:16:06.080 You should trust them too.

00:16:07.840 Text Bannon at 989898.

00:16:10.780 Take action and do it today.

00:16:12.280 Use your host, Stephen K. Bannon.

00:16:15.660 Just always remember one thing.

00:16:18.740 As we've said on this show since they show up in Mar-a-Lago,

00:16:22.380 the night after, they all flipped to be MAGA.

00:16:27.360 All the oligarchs, they're all MAGA.

00:16:30.160 They all flipped in 10 o'clock when Pennsylvania fell in 2024.

00:16:36.320 These guys are all progressives.

00:16:38.660 They're all social progressives.

00:16:40.400 They're all political progressives.

00:16:41.960 This has been kind of hiding in broad daylight.

00:16:46.280 And as Jeff Stein said, and what the Fuhrer has been of thing,

00:16:48.940 just not Coxon's tweet, there's dozens of these people

00:16:54.220 in the safety departments that are kind of the creme de la creme

00:16:58.540 that are saying hey there's no real safety here and the senior management is just focused on

00:17:03.920 hurtling towards agi because the winner of that's going to have unlimited power and money that's

00:17:11.680 where they're all racing to do ipos even given kind of the hang fire ipo of of spacex but the

00:17:21.200 underwriters i think a little more oh my gosh 10 we have to put in a offering document 10 chance

00:17:27.180 humanity gets wiped out how are we going to explain that one and what and what investors

00:17:33.100 what pension funds are going to buy that so now it's a time for signal not noise you're going to

00:17:39.860 hear an awful lot of noise particularly some politicians all kind of jump on and run around

00:17:44.060 we got to do this we got to do that the one thing that we have to do is get to the truth

00:17:48.840 and make sure as we've said is what's going on here we wouldn't allow people making nuclear

00:17:54.040 weapons or biological weapons just to do it oh we'll just take it of faith you're going to tell

00:17:59.100 us this has gone from a commercial situation to a national security situation and thank god

00:18:05.960 the war and posse is on top of this we got we got some clips from this morning and over the last

00:18:11.660 couple hours we'll play them as kind of our cold open joe's with me then i'm gonna bring joe back

00:18:16.620 in we may not go through the whole thing it's pretty powerful but uh we are pressed for time

00:18:21.140 And we've got, we're going to go to Texas.

00:18:23.760 Posa's going to join us.

00:18:24.560 We're going to talk about the Beau French and Indian War down in Texas.

00:18:28.520 Also, the fall of the House of Saud on the Arabian Peninsula. 0.75

00:18:33.800 Boling's going to be here for that. 0.67

00:18:34.900 We've got Peter Navarro from the White House, all of it.

00:18:36.560 Let's go ahead and play this cold open.

00:18:41.100 One of the new faces you'll see on 60 Minutes.

00:18:44.780 We'll be chasing a lot of stories this season.

00:18:46.960 But right now, no story looms larger than the latest developments in artificial intelligence.

00:18:53.320 An AI system solved a math problem in 88 hours that human beings had struggled with for almost 100 years.

00:19:01.460 Other AI hacked into companies on their own.

00:19:05.020 And this past week, a researcher quit a major AI firm,

00:19:09.080 warning that if artificial intelligence gets out of control, it could wipe out the human race.

00:19:14.420 You don't have to believe that prophecy, but you should believe this.

00:19:19.540 We may have a narrow window this year, not the next 10, to make artificial intelligence safe for humanity.

00:19:27.060 That clock is ticking, and so is ours.

00:19:30.380 For almost 60 years, it has meant the same thing.

00:19:33.800 Journalism you can trust.

00:19:35.960 Where we're headed, we're going to need it.

00:19:38.680 Shame on us if we don't do anything.

00:19:40.280 We knew for a year and a half what was coming, and Washington did nothing.

00:19:43.700 And even Democrats in Congress, they want to do something, but they don't tell you what that something is other than Bernie Sanders, which says shut it down.

00:19:49.960 And I don't think most Democrats want to do it. But I think this is an all hands on deck moment.

00:19:54.420 I think they should call back Congress. I think there should be no topic being debated in politics other than this.

00:19:59.940 I can't stress enough that it's the first thing that seeps into every industry, every job, every phone, every life, almost instantaneously.

00:20:08.920 It's already there. And it's not too late. We wrote about this this week.

00:20:12.440 there's a lot of sensible things that you can do. There's ways to govern this. There's ways to slow

00:20:16.960 it. And by the way, there's ways to make it so it benefits everybody and not just a couple of

00:20:22.040 really rich people. And you got to remember when you're listening to these people like David Sacks

00:20:25.900 talk about it. Remember, they're so heavily invested in this technology. They're all in

00:20:30.460 and saying that they don't like Anthropic and like a couple of these companies. And therefore,

00:20:34.800 they keep doubling down on just saying, oh, this is much ado about nothing. Much ado about nothing.

00:20:39.920 did you look at the hugging face episode you could say people exaggerated but when you have

00:20:45.140 machines displaying human behavior and trying to get outside of the confines that humans set

00:20:50.920 and then infiltrating a company i don't know i want to sit down and pay attention to it right

00:20:55.960 joe yeah but but you know the thing is jim we don't know if they're exaggerating or not we

00:21:01.540 don't know if they're exaggerating that hugging face or not because even the investigation of

00:21:06.640 that episode open ai is not allowed investigators to go in and see all of the material to go down

00:21:14.620 all of the trails to see just how bad this is and so it's important for people to know

00:21:19.100 that whatever you've read in the paper it's likely far far worse and it's far far worse

00:21:26.040 because open ai won't open their books so we can see just how dangerous the situation is right now

00:21:33.360 On the AI front, David, we've been hearing, of course, from Sam Altman and OpenAI and Anthropic talking about the end of humanity, that they're creating these tools that could end humanity, getting pushback from people like David Sachs, who runs AI policy for the White House, who's saying, wait a second, you guys have a duopoly.

00:21:53.780 If you really think that what you're inventing, what you're creating, what you're developing is going to end humanity, you guys can slow it down yourself.

00:22:04.280 I think what David Sachs is arguing and what a lot of people in Silicon Valley who don't agree with Sam Altman are arguing is these guys are trying to engage in a practice called regulatory capture.

00:22:16.280 So they control the industry right now.

00:22:18.680 So they want the feds to come in, much like, you know, Ma Bell wanted the feds to come in, regulate it to such a degree that nobody else can get into it.

00:22:29.820 So we on the outside, you know, I told a friend in Silicon Valley, he said, well, what's your opinion?

00:22:34.880 I said, well, that's kind of like in 2007, me trying to figure out exactly what the most advanced traders are doing on Wall Street with credit default swaps.

00:22:43.820 swaps we're just sitting out here looking through a glass darkly and can't really tell

00:22:48.740 who's lying and who's telling the truth you know joe my sense is that this is not a mob belt let

00:22:56.360 me have it we're we're we get more of that we're gonna get back to um joe allen look we wouldn't

00:23:05.400 be in this situation if these people were up front about what the issues were and if they

00:23:11.720 up front when they had these breakouts and like i said open a is 100 correct that's what he says

00:23:16.380 well we're delaying our ipo it's because you can't do an ipo you can't do an initial public

00:23:21.960 offering with the mess that you have and particularly whistleblowers sitting there

00:23:26.020 uh and others saying hey you got massive problems and like you said they have not disclosed

00:23:31.720 they have not disclosed really any information and this is why we have to stop being supplicants

00:23:37.940 the american people are not going to be supplicants to these tech oligarchs who have

00:23:43.120 run the deal and lied remember david sachs was the guy that tried to jam in into the big beautiful

00:23:49.920 bill a uh a complete ai amnesty for a decade then when he was defeated overwhelmingly in the middle

00:23:57.400 of the night the vote was 99 to 1 in the senate 99 to 1 when people started thinking about it

00:24:04.120 Then he immediately took the exact same AI amnesty, this is the arrogance, and ran over and said, I got to find another must, oh, we got to pay the troops, let's go do the NDAA.

00:24:15.320 Let's go do the NDAA.

00:24:16.660 He tried to jam it in there, and the chairman of the House Armed Services Committee, after the war and posse and others blew him up saying, hey, what are we doing here?

00:24:25.240 He said, hey, we won't have anything to do with that.

00:24:27.120 Then they've gone and tried to do the executive orders.

00:24:29.040 It's on and on and on, including not releasing the last executive order, Joe Allen.

00:24:35.340 They were clearly, look, they're going to try to, when you talk regulatory capture, of course, they're going to try to game the system.

00:24:41.660 That's why they can't be trusted at all.

00:24:44.700 This is where we need to take a deep breath. 0.97

00:24:47.440 And this whole issue about China, it's very simple. 0.82

00:24:50.480 If you don't want China competing, and we should not, we should not create the Chinese ecosystem.

00:24:55.580 I'm so sick of the tech bros saying, oh, China, China, China, CCP, cut off all the chips and make sure they can't get black market chips for people looking the other way through Thailand and Vietnam and other places.

00:25:08.560 Number one. Number two, don't educate them as high engineers in the best engineering schools in the United States of America.

00:25:15.180 The answer is no. All of you go home. Number three, don't bring them into the frontier labs, Chinese nationals.

00:25:20.580 Don't bring them into the top companies. The answer is you're not going to get a visa to work here. 1.00

00:25:24.840 Number three, Sequoia Capital and these venture capital firms that are in business with the Chinese Communist Party and taking some money from the Chinese Communist Party and financing the Chinese Communist Party's build-out of artificial intelligence and advanced weapons, a total freeze on any American pension money going to any of these venture capital firms.

00:25:44.180 Shut them down.

00:25:45.220 Shut them down, and let's put the guys at Sequoia Capital, the partners there, on trial.

00:25:49.600 Number two, no debt financing at all, no access to American capital markets, either equity or debt, none of it.

00:25:56.240 You want to shut the ecosystem down? 0.90

00:25:57.980 We can shut the ecosystem of the Chinese Communist Party in any involvement in artificial intelligence in 72 hours. 0.85

00:26:05.340 So don't sit there, oh, we got to rush.

00:26:07.060 We got to have unlimited hurtling to artificial general intelligence with no controls and these incompetent people running the labs.

00:26:16.300 If they were competent, we wouldn't have these situations.

00:26:19.600 and we wouldn't sit there and have lie after lie after lie after lie so don't sit there and tell

00:26:26.760 me about the chinese communist party lao baijin can tell you everything about them they're evil

00:26:30.800 they're dictatorial they're bad guys and even they're saying hey this ai thing's a little we 0.82

00:26:36.700 want to make sure we control you shouldn't even have it or access to it and it's the united states

00:26:41.640 of america and the lords of easy money on wall street the venture capital firms and the same

00:26:47.000 tech oligarchs that are sitting there we got to be trying to the thing we'll cut them off

00:26:51.720 cut them off 100 and then we can kind of sit here and go okay what do we got here what are we going

00:27:00.340 to do how's this going to be for the betterment of mankind and not have a 0.00001 chance of

00:27:08.540 destroying the human race are you kidding me are you kidding me you understand what the scale of

00:27:13.780 this thing is and the evil people running it have you seen any of the heads you trust any of these

00:27:20.380 guys remember zuckerberg and they've all got ready to leave the country zuckerberg's getting ready to

00:27:24.120 go to he's got a new zealand you know he can take off to teal's down in argentina

00:27:29.840 not one of them has has the back of this republic it's all about them off of by the way government

00:27:38.700 financing and university money, research. It's time now that the American people

00:27:46.480 have to demand we are no longer supplicants in this. We're going to be decision makers. Oh,

00:27:53.820 you're just stepping stones. You can't be decision makers. You're just a bunch of rubes.

00:27:58.540 Well, guess what? I'll take the common sense of the American people 0.97

00:28:02.500 every day of the week. Short break. Joe Allen on the other side.

00:28:08.700 It feels like our country finally has momentum again,

00:28:14.020 with our leaders fighting to restore common sense in America first.

00:28:19.440 But we've seen this before.

00:28:20.680 Conservatives get comfortable, and the left starts taking background inch by inch.

00:28:25.600 We cannot let that happen in these midterms.

00:28:29.020 America needs every one of us in the fight,

00:28:31.280 and a big part of that means supporting companies that actually stand for our values.

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00:29:34.740 room here's your host stephen k bann

00:29:37.740 the tech part this is all part of the both french and indian war down in texas post is going to be

00:29:46.800 here we've got andy hopper uh representative in texas uh legislature from denton a lot the

00:29:53.260 bowling's going to be here so we are jammed up this morning but joe allen nothing can be more

00:29:57.760 important than this this is why and i want to possibly understand it's a lot of people saying

00:30:03.520 hey let's go love these rants etc i'm just some dumb mick in front of a microphone this is on

00:30:10.040 your shoulders this is on your shoulders we're a hinge of world history not simply the fourth 0.95

00:30:18.060 turning in the in the hinge of history we have for this republic going forward but the world's

00:30:23.120 going to look to you the citizens of this republic to think this through in the common sense that

00:30:29.980 we've always done in the revolution and the civil war and the great depression of world war ii

00:30:34.880 and do the right thing this is why and this is why i was so proud of joe allen the other day

00:30:41.260 joe lonsdale some billionaire big talk all the time on social media it was a crime scene at the

00:30:47.380 end of that debate you had to put the police tape up he was eviscerated why because all they do is

00:30:52.400 give you bromides oh you know you gotta and he got destroyed he got taken apart brick by brick

00:30:59.000 his reputation will never recover but more importantly they keep putting him out there

00:31:04.640 as one of their spokesmen one of their little dogs yammering yapping at somebody like joe

00:31:09.260 joe allen's a giant you know what joe allen was doing five years ago he's a rigger for country

00:31:13.700 music and rock acts that is populism that is a man right now nobody hey you think they all these

00:31:21.400 debates hey they're canceling joe allen debates you know why they don't want to stand up there

00:31:25.740 and have it the truth rammed down their throats for the world to see we're in a very dire situation

00:31:34.480 in this country folks we're in we're in a dire situation but you know what i'm optimistic why

00:31:41.240 because i see who's lining up on our side of the football and i know that we're going to fight our

00:31:45.760 way through this and not give up until we set things right. Joe Allen, your thoughts about this,

00:31:51.300 sir? Well, Steve, thinking about what you were talking about earlier, China, that seems to be

00:32:00.160 basically the default reason people give for why you don't want to regulate AI China. The others

00:32:09.180 are the possibility that open source will get banned or over-regulated in some way. The other

00:32:15.460 is that upstarts, startup companies or any other contender for the quest for AGI would get blocked

00:32:23.120 out, regulatory capture, a kind of either monopoly or an oligarchy, right? So in every one of those

00:32:29.920 cases, what I see is just a whole lot of noise. They call us fear mongers. They call the doomers

00:32:37.500 fear mongers but what they're trying to do is gin up fear of any kind of political response

00:32:44.900 that any kind of public outcry or backlash because they are either heavily invested in

00:32:52.920 these industries hang on or yeah they are using them to basically float bs businesses

00:33:01.020 hang on hang on chat gpt this audience understands it deeply and better than any other audience of

00:33:11.460 the new york times reader morning joe or the guys on capitol hill and the staff this audit you know

00:33:15.660 why we've been hammering this for years with the same freaking message chat gpt came to davos was

00:33:22.060 it 22 it wasn't 21 is it it was january january 23 uh joe january 23 full stop in january 23 joe

00:33:33.600 allen we're reporting that we had days we do something and i said as soon as you have davos

00:33:38.660 man who's a total scumbag and all the investment bankers start throwing money at this now it's out

00:33:44.920 the door these large language models have shocked people how advanced they are once it meets up with 0.99

00:33:49.520 capital and venture capital they can realize they can make unlimited amount of money on this

00:33:54.900 you're not going to be able to trust anything you see because they're going to be hiding it

00:33:58.280 they're going to be misrepresenting they're going to be lying we're we told you years ago

00:34:02.820 exactly what the lies were and what was happening it's there now they have to come forward and say

00:34:09.000 hey guess what there is a possibility of this and yes things in these uh in in our labs are certain

00:34:15.700 aspects of it are out of control we're trying to get it but we're not going to give the information

00:34:19.220 of it and one of the key points was bring it back the arc of the story to capital open ai saying on

00:34:25.880 saturday when markets were closed yeah you know what i think we're in a delay these guys are

00:34:30.720 hurtling towards a trillion dollar ipo it's everything on wall street they're talking about

00:34:34.560 because this is going to make money on the fees of going public and dumping it on these pension funds

00:34:39.280 and spreading the risk there because they're they're seriously afraid of an economic collapse

00:34:44.640 Because, wait for it, oh, didn't Bannon tell us that the model was a highly leveraged country within a highly leveraged corporate and commercial bet on artificial intelligence?

00:34:54.960 And if that bet doesn't pay off with massive productivity increases that doesn't have mass layoffs, then guess what?

00:35:03.940 They're going to be coming to you for a bailout.

00:35:06.820 A bailout.

00:35:08.200 Write it down.

00:35:09.180 Okay, we bailed them out in 2008.

00:35:11.420 They're coming to me for a bailout.

00:35:12.600 are you in an economic situation to bail them out are you doing so well right now you're going to 0.53

00:35:17.400 bail out altman you're going to bail out uh anthropic you're going to bail out elon moss

00:35:22.740 you're going to bail out zuckerberg david sachs and all those court jesters running around you're

00:35:27.520 going to bail them all out because that's what they're coming for just remember you always get

00:35:32.460 stiffed and they make out joe allen so this is not like oh bannon and joe allen just in the last 72

00:35:39.100 two hours. This has been years. And we told you exactly what was going to happen. We told you

00:35:43.480 exactly what the response is going to be. That's why these people cannot be trusted. Joe Allen.

00:35:51.360 Steve, what I see never come to me for financial advice. So I'll leave all the financial stuff to

00:35:58.260 you. Anything I say about it is destined to either send the markets crashing or have people

00:36:04.160 emptying their bank accounts into the wrong stocks so uh but what i do see what i do have a

00:36:10.000 very clear apprehension of what you are experiencing with this public backlash comes from all these

00:36:16.300 different directions but when i talk to people and as i am communicating with working class people

00:36:23.680 middle class people broke people that are next to homeless here is what they're talking about

00:36:29.920 They're talking about the total cultural saturation of AI systems.

00:36:35.000 They're talking about their wives or even themselves becoming best friends or even lovers with AI.

00:36:41.340 They're talking about these slop engines just flooding the digital space and overwhelming real creators.

00:36:49.260 And how are they doing that?

00:36:50.200 Oh yes, they took all the copyrighted material to train their systems, which they're now using

00:36:56.500 to flood the zone with AI slop. They're talking about how their kids or as teachers, how their

00:37:04.360 institutions are flooding the schools with AI propaganda, with AI instructors, AI tutors,

00:37:11.020 how the students can't read or don't even bother to think about anything because they just go to

00:37:15.760 the AI. We're talking about people who work at companies who force them to use AI. I've heard

00:37:23.020 this, that people will give the AI credit for their work because they are supposed to be using

00:37:29.520 AI. So they just say, okay, yeah, the AI did it, even if the AI couldn't, because they're basically

00:37:35.020 being forced to be symbiotes. You see it in the military. This is something I'm not going to hit

00:37:41.740 too hard. But one thing is for sure, AI is being used for the justification for what seemed to be

00:37:49.040 fairly reckless strikes with no outside analysis. They call them precision strikes, but it would

00:37:55.460 seem the precision ain't so precise. It's just simply the speed, the pace that is being justified

00:38:01.920 by what the output of an AI system was when they're looking for a valid target. So all these

00:38:06.980 levels, Steve, all these levels, what people are seeing is that they are having a technology

00:38:11.900 crammed down their throat by people who have openly said that the purpose of the technology

00:38:17.520 is to, number one, forcibly augment as many people as possible. Number two, replace them

00:38:24.760 when the AI systems become sufficiently capable. And then ultimately, at the end of the road,

00:38:32.340 They envision a world in which the machines have taken over completely, and perhaps they keep us as pets, perhaps they use us as biofuel, or perhaps they hold us as prisoners and simply torture us for the fun of it.

00:38:45.580 That is the narrative.

00:38:47.240 That is the world that people are being shown from these companies.

00:38:51.200 The only other thing they're saying is this is going to make you more efficient.

00:38:54.720 This is going to make you more money.

00:38:56.440 This thing will write your emails and make your PowerPoints for you.

00:38:59.320 This thing will do your taxes for you.

00:39:00.760 The big picture is the big picture is the problem.

00:39:03.960 If I could say one thing, Steve, I think as far as super intelligence goes, all of these other issues, I think, are the most important issues because they're the ones we're dealing with now.

00:39:14.640 The social, the cultural, the educational, the business and the military issues.

00:39:19.440 We are dealing with those right now.

00:39:20.640 But super intelligence, there is a ton of money going into people saying super intelligence is going to come.

00:39:26.600 And there's a ton of money going into people saying superintelligence is impossible.

00:39:31.180 I think that it's important to look at who's paying for what.

00:39:33.540 But beyond all of that, beyond all the funding, we are left with a fundamental question.

00:39:38.240 Is superintelligence possible?

00:39:41.080 If you say yes to any extent, 1%, 0.01%, whatever it is, if you say yes, superintelligence is possible, as that is the goal of these companies, then you have to ask one more question.

00:39:53.240 Is that good?

00:39:54.440 Is that preferable?

00:39:55.240 or is that bad? Is it despicable? And if you come down on the latter side, as I do,

00:40:01.360 then you have to say, well, what are we going to do about it? And I say that a superintelligence

00:40:06.120 ban is the sanest possible approach. And if the doubters don't believe superintelligence is

00:40:13.320 possible, and if a superintelligence ban does not affect open source or does not affect upstarts,

00:40:19.140 then why would they even care? But David Sachs, who says he doesn't believe in superintelligence,

00:40:25.240 as a possibility is fighting mercilessly to make sure that anyone who is pushing for a super

00:40:31.540 intelligence ban is smeared as some kind of effective altruist droid. It's also disingenuous.

00:40:37.520 I think that people know that they are being imposed upon in a way that is completely unacceptable

00:40:44.860 culturally, morally, spiritually. And I think that people, people in America have every right

00:40:51.340 to do anything possible to ensure that they their businesses their communities and their families

00:40:57.680 are not subject to this predatory machine i want to take um and i'm gonna talk to you in the break

00:41:06.540 because i gotta i got some other things i gotta get to but i gotta get back to you so stick around

00:41:10.180 for a second joe you wrote the book dark aeon you were a major contributor and then um you came up

00:41:16.880 this idea and i thought was great go around the country and just see it talk one of the powers i

00:41:22.400 think of what you speak of now is that this is just not joe allen going on the internet or reading

00:41:28.140 some articles joe you've been out there for the last couple of years at small churches in small

00:41:33.920 gatherings large too you've been invited to all the top ai stuff you've gone to all the with the

00:41:37.560 big shots but you've been out listening to vox populi and remember how has this country gotten

00:41:44.420 through for 250 years vox private the voice of the people ultimately comes through with its common

00:41:50.820 sense and its common sense is backed up with a we ain't gonna quit okay so talk to me give me a

00:41:57.140 minute on that before we go to break about your your journeys over the last couple of years and

00:42:00.820 the voices you've heard sir it's been transformative to say the least i mean i've always traveled

00:42:08.200 around my whole life and i've always talked to people but in this context where it's centered

00:42:12.560 around this one subject, a subject I've been obsessed with for decades, it's on the one hand

00:42:17.740 is strengthened my conviction that opposition to the tech companies and in some cases opposition

00:42:23.440 to certain technologies entirely is not only warranted, but it's shared across all of these

00:42:30.200 different types of people. It's not any one race. It's not any one culture. It's shared among them.

00:42:36.060 And also on the other side of it, there are people who want to have some kind of futuristic

00:42:41.640 uh vision that is positive and all that pushback i think is also correct give me some reason for

00:42:49.280 course correction if i can give one name right now he's not exactly vox populi but the arts

00:42:54.960 technica founder john stokes i have been a thorn in his side since he's met me but he is i think

00:43:01.640 a very intelligent pro-technology guy who has modified my belief so that was what i would say

00:43:08.620 It has strengthened my resolve, but also it's given me pause and caused me to reflect a little bit on my extremist rants.

00:43:17.860 Joe, just hang on for a second.

00:43:21.460 Joe Allen's in the house.

00:43:22.720 We'll take a short commercial break.

00:43:24.080 Poso, Bowling, Navarro, the Beau French and Indian War down in Texas.

00:43:30.600 All of it next in the war room.

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00:45:05.300 again we'll get back to joe in a second we're going to figure this out i got eric bowling

00:45:11.460 and we only got eric for a short amount of time eric what is going on the hootis i guess there's

00:45:16.040 some photos up now of what they did uh with the uh with the pipeline they've it looks like they've

00:45:21.220 taken some islands they've got that now they're trying to choke down the red sea uh what are

00:45:25.700 markets telling us right now and what are you hearing about this entire situation i understand

00:45:30.240 the saudis are really all over president trump for some assistance here yeah they they want some

00:45:36.120 help now yeah the houthis we might as well just call them the iranians because they're they're

00:45:39.700 supported they're backed by the iranians who blew up their the saudi's east-west pipeline and now

00:45:46.020 it looks like the damage could be weeks if not months before that thing returns to uh flowing

00:45:50.260 oil again. Problem is, Steve, we just broke through $104 a barrel of West Texas Intermediate today

00:45:55.600 on the upside. Massive move up, 4% in a day. Almost $110 a barrel of WTI. It doesn't look

00:46:03.540 like there's anything that's going to change anytime soon. Chris Wright over the weekend

00:46:07.160 said, born the world, hey, don't look for a solution to the straight of hormones anytime

00:46:11.860 soon. What that did in turn, it spiked interest rates. We've been talking about this for quite 0.77

00:46:17.420 a while, Steve, and you've been on it. That 10-year, 5%, traded over 5% today. Over 5%. We were

00:46:25.360 worried about 4.5% a couple of weeks ago, 5% today. All the rates are soaring. They're pricing

00:46:31.160 in about an 86%, 87% chance that Warsh moves higher on the interest rates in the next meeting

00:46:37.400 coming up, which, as you know, that's never good. I'll tell you the reason why it affects everyone.

00:46:42.220 It affects everyone on the 10-year, which is now, I'm sorry, 5% on the 10-year.

00:46:48.280 You know what we're talking about, Steve?

00:46:49.140 We're talking about higher mortgages, which means higher rentals, which means higher autos.

00:46:54.520 Also, anything you purchase on credit is going to cost you a lot more.

00:46:58.940 Prices are going up.

00:47:00.160 That's inflationary.

00:47:01.440 So we're going to see an elevated inflation going forward.

00:47:03.940 The Fed is going to have to move higher against what President Trump and maybe Peter Navarro would recommend.

00:47:09.880 Pete and I kind of debated a couple of weeks ago that the high price of oil would be a natural kind of deflationary or less inflationary phenomenon.

00:47:20.320 It's not.

00:47:21.100 This is getting worse and worse.

00:47:22.840 Inflation is higher.

00:47:23.520 I don't mean to be a panicking.

00:47:24.880 I'm not.

00:47:25.300 And I'll tell you why I'm not.

00:47:26.900 I'm moving my money out of the stock market into a 4.75% three-year treasury, which means I believe over the next year or so, yeah, it's going to be strong high.

00:47:38.760 but I believe the markets will correct and rates will come down naturally.

00:47:43.680 Otherwise, I wouldn't be doing it.

00:47:44.960 So I'm doing it right here.

00:47:45.880 I did this with you with the oil prices in the past.

00:47:48.880 I'm telling you, I'm moving into treasuries at 475 on a three-year.

00:47:52.960 It's strong.

00:47:53.920 It's overdone.

00:47:55.080 It's going to correct once we correct this massive fireball of inflation,

00:48:00.460 which is the most insidious tax on everybody,

00:48:04.680 especially the middle and lower classes.

00:48:08.760 what uh but what actions are going to take place in if you're saying hey i want to get into

00:48:13.780 government bonds what actions because right now i don't see the europeans coming to the aid of this

00:48:20.060 situation in the red sea right and the saudis keep calling the president united states to ask

00:48:25.040 for more assistance and and more aid what action are you looking for because we were almost through

00:48:30.900 this thing and out of it scott bassin was taken on the economic warfare side which as you know 0.80

00:48:35.700 the Iranians don't like. I mean, they were really squealing. Now they've increased, you know, 1.00

00:48:40.220 obviously the proxies' involvement here. So what action are you looking for? What are the

00:48:45.380 indicators to you that this thing starts to get sorted? So this doesn't sound good, especially

00:48:50.220 on war room, but warship is going to have to start raising rates, taming inflation. Once

00:48:54.620 inflation starts to tame, demand starts to ease, prices start to come down. And then you can look

00:49:01.360 maybe holding rates or start to reduce rates over the longer run. It's a big ship. Hundreds of

00:49:08.880 billions of dollars are traded in these treasuries on a day-to-day basis. It's a big ship. It has to

00:49:13.760 turn slowly. I think Warsh is going to do the right thing by the economy. It may not sound good to

00:49:20.400 some real pro. Trump can't do anything wrong. I love Trump, too. I'm MAGA. You and I, Steve,

00:49:25.760 you were MAGA first, but you brought me in very early. This is something I think he's missing.

00:49:30.640 I think he needs to allow the market. No one's bigger than the market. Nobody, not even Donald Trump.

00:49:35.760 Nobody in the world is bigger than the market. And the market right now is telling everyone, anyone who's listening,

00:49:41.240 who are at least listening with an open mind, that there's inflation and we need to curb inflate.

00:49:46.840 We let Biden run inflation up to 9 percent. They can't let this happen under Trump.

00:49:52.040 And hopefully Walsh has the cojones to step up and just do a token quarter percent raise at the next one.

00:50:01.040 And maybe another one after that, just to let the market know that they mean they're for real.

00:50:04.620 Remember when Besson bought treasuries for a couple of days and we said, well, I said it wasn't going to work?

00:50:10.180 It didn't.

00:50:10.960 We're talking almost half a full percentage point, 500 basis points since then.

00:50:15.380 So they're going to have to do it at the Fed level, unfortunately.

00:50:18.280 uh eric where can people go i know you got to bounce where can people go for your

00:50:25.020 context we're gonna have peter navarro on it's gonna join us from the white house i think he's

00:50:28.440 got a different he's got a different take on thing let's say particularly i think he'll take

00:50:32.380 on the other side of all this i'll tell you the other side of all this but i love pete but i've

00:50:37.880 been in mark i've been in that trading pit i've been on the street i'm getting my teeth kicked in

00:50:41.640 long enough to know when you have to go with what works instead of what you believe or hope you want

00:50:47.520 to work so i'll leave it at that you can find me anywhere eric bowling on all social media

00:50:51.500 or here with you in the morning steve maybe five o'clock four four to five we'll do a change over

00:50:55.760 one of these days i really would love to talk to you about your pro-human event that's going to be

00:50:59.940 a monster tomorrow i can't wait to see that things gonna be big thank you so much or don't fight the

00:51:06.520 tape i guess is what you're saying is that's it steve that that is that is the golden rule in

00:51:11.320 trading don't fight the tape by the tape or the fed really but yeah don't fight the tape uh so

00:51:19.400 we're going to get posos with us joe allen's with us we're going to figure all this out in the uh

00:51:24.000 next hour or a little jam peter navarro's going to join us obviously peter's got some

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00:52:53.300 The second hour of War Room in, what, 90 seconds, two minutes?

00:52:58.160 stick around back in a moment we're 15th or as we say in the war room 15 october as we head towards

00:53:06.860 that date that's the extension deadline for the irs here's something most americans do not realize

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Bannon's War Room - September 14, 2026

Episode 5660： The War With AI

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