Blood Satellite - 15 Minute Walk Like an Egyptianable Cities [＂brocc the idea of records＂]

00:00:00.000 as far back as i can remember i always wanted to be

00:00:07.760 blood satellite hey it's me buddy radiohead

00:00:20.380 i can't believe you opened with that i can't believe you opened with that

00:00:27.800 excuse me i'm so happy we have the show

00:00:31.920 guess what i'm bringing it back in case you didn't see our last live stream

00:00:37.720 it's the only thing i'm proud of from 2023 putty radiohead from the scare in the hose department

00:00:43.900 all right okay i'll let you have it you know what it's yours

00:00:49.920 i don't have a lot going on i don't have a lot going on

00:00:55.260 i was trying to rub two sticks together for this whole episode thing we got going on here

00:01:19.380 this show stuff

00:01:21.940 you mean for content for this week

00:01:23.480 this is what I came up with

00:01:26.060 let's talk about the last live stream

00:01:27.360 which was a test

00:01:30.620 that just turned into a live stream

00:01:32.580 somehow

00:01:33.000 hey everybody it's me

00:01:35.360 Putty Radiohead from the Scaring the Hose Department

00:01:37.480 for their number is legion

00:01:38.900 and wherever people live

00:01:40.760 there also live the mentally retarded

00:01:49.380 thank you see ya

00:01:55.600 i was actually i saw this video come across my desk and it was from it was originally from like

00:02:05.760 a conspiracy channel and then it gets passed around to just the everything sucks channels

00:02:12.040 right and it was a it looked like a real video i don't know what it was but it was about black

00:02:17.000 goo and they're saying they some mexicans pulled this out of the ground it's the one that looks

00:02:22.320 like it's alive right like if they poke it and it's moving around yeah you okay you've seen it

00:02:26.580 yeah i saw that it looks like a symbiote from fuck pick a science fiction franchise everyone

00:02:33.120 everything's got black goo and it all behaves the exact same way and then i said you know what

00:02:39.860 maybe it's not an alien but it's something what is that because they said they dug it out somebody

00:02:44.680 somebody in a reply had said it's like a type of uh of worm or something that and then it's

00:02:50.940 covered in oil and i'm like well that's kind of a i i kind of see where you would think that but

00:02:57.460 then if you like pause it and you look at the individual wriggling elements of it it doesn't

00:03:01.740 it seems like it's kind of splitting and changing shape and shit like so my thought was it might

00:03:07.760 just be uh because it's a really short uh focused clip it might just be like a blender yeah also no

00:03:15.640 one sources the sorcerers so you make a claim then someone says a source or they say actually

00:03:22.860 it's this and no one ever asks them for the source because i i would see someone to do that i'm like

00:03:27.480 okay what's that based on what's that worm it's just it's a thing everyone knows everyone knows

00:03:32.160 about worms with oil on them yeah i've never seen someone like a source a debunker before

00:03:37.920 everybody has seen this i mean the last time that my family was like taken over in their brains

00:03:43.040 chased me through the house with an axe and i had to call the cia and they wiped my mind it was

00:03:46.860 actually turned out it was just worms just worms and oil see here's the problem you called the cia

00:03:51.040 that was your first mistake that was a big mistake i have them on the speed dial something's going

00:03:56.160 wrong i better call the cia hello is this cia yeah there's worms there's worms in here can you

00:04:03.100 imagine if they had like a 911 number for the cia you could just call them so just they're slamming

00:04:08.940 the door they're slamming the door they're clawing at the door you're on your phone you're

00:04:12.640 trembling hello is this cia no this is putty radio hat this is the scare in the house department

00:04:18.060 but i couldn't find any other information like i saw the video i'm looking it up and

00:04:25.680 they use the phrase black goo and it's something i've heard mentioned in a lot of places just oh

00:04:32.000 of course i've got black goo over here i don't know what it was referencing so i was trying to

00:04:36.620 look it up and i can't find anything on it all i found was a bullshit wired article that was

00:04:42.560 referencing how it's referenced in other shows it's just something that's in the zeitgeist

00:04:47.200 and i'm like okay what like is this a thing i'm missing or is this just a

00:04:51.800 a mania and i don't know i can't really find it first of all i can't find anything

00:04:56.040 substantive all i can find are posts and every post that talks about black goo ends with a

00:05:02.240 bible verse and i'm like i'm not okay this is going to sound very unoptical for me but

00:05:08.140 if you're coming to me with a conspiracy theory or something fringe the moment you throw a bible

00:05:14.960 verse in there i'm checking out i'm reaching for the clicker and maybe that's my prejudice

00:05:20.440 but i you know it is kind of a weird thing right because it's like what do you

00:05:25.480 i don't know how many how many of these guys consider what they're doing when they quote

00:05:30.760 the bible verses i get maybe it's an it's an audience thing but like the bible has a without

00:05:36.420 getting into a theological thing it's like the bible has a certain degree of authority maybe

00:05:41.240 it's absolute authority to you but it also has kind of almost a category of authority like you

00:05:45.900 wouldn't you wouldn't try to settle an argument about particle physics using the bible right

00:05:50.300 you wouldn't try to settle an argument about like whether french or english cheeses are better

00:05:54.600 by using the bible so as soon as you invoke the bible it's like you kind of you're shutting the

00:06:00.380 door on the argument a little bit i don't know in a couple of different ways i don't like it and

00:06:04.440 it's not because i don't like the bible but it's like can you just not we're talking about aliens

00:06:08.220 you know we're talking about whatever talking about black goo what does ecclesiastes bring to

00:06:15.100 the table about about black goo yeah and then i'll search online every search engine i could do

00:06:21.560 and it's like the it's very loose it's like black is black goo 5g like what does that mean you can't

00:06:30.440 just you can't just put these two things on the table side by side and say look at that 5g black

00:06:36.260 like how do they relate what is that you don't know it's just thing you read two headlines in

00:06:41.180 your life and then you've connected those dots and now it's my problem yeah exactly i'm not i'm

00:06:46.820 open to the idea that black goo is 5g if you can explain it but they fucking can't i'm just reading

00:06:51.580 the bible again it was hilarious to me that they dropped the 5g they throw the 5g in fucking

00:06:56.840 everything now and it's great because it is like it's a harmonic frequencies and mind control and

00:07:01.760 it could literally be anything like it's it's gmos and it's mind control nanobots and it's

00:07:08.260 cancer and the covid vaccine and it's man it's fucking everything and all i could find on black

00:07:13.700 dude that's serious was graphene oxide and graphene oxide is a material it's a material that is

00:07:20.580 synthetic material that is used in manufacturing and it operates it's like a like silly putty

00:07:26.640 but it's metal and it's it's supposed to be this miracle this material first seen in 2004

00:07:34.100 is only one atom thick.

00:07:38.000 Found after peeling off transparent tape from graphite,

00:07:42.240 the mineral stuck to the tape was named graphene.

00:07:46.280 And it might be the first two-dimensional substance

00:07:50.680 ever discovered.

00:07:52.420 But don't be fooled by its size.

00:07:56.260 Graphene is 100 times stronger than steel

00:08:01.560 and powerful enough to repel most gases and liquids.

00:08:07.560 And the work that I'm presenting has been performed in the frame of the flagship project Graphene,

00:08:13.560 which is a large European project, a 10-year effort.

00:08:17.560 And within the flagship project there is a work package consisting of some one dozen groups or so,

00:08:23.560 dealing with health and environmental safety of graphene-based materials.

00:08:29.560 In these studies, we may speculate that the immune system can also sense two-dimensional

00:08:36.360 objects, which I think is rather fascinating, and actually use very similar mechanisms,

00:08:41.360 in this case net production and digestion, to destroy, as it were, these materials.

00:08:59.560 it's also it's really bad for you like it's very very toxic but i mean the idea look i'm

00:09:06.380 i don't want to be the guy to pour cold water and everything but like it's a to me it it does

00:09:12.720 kind of beggars belief that you would think that radio waves can turn an unaligned like

00:09:19.520 or an unorganized pile of goo into a complex intelligent machine i'm just thinking of like

00:09:25.520 the information density of that wave and do waves even work like that like can they target certain

00:09:30.740 parts of the goo isn't it all the same like there's too much it's too much you know i can't i can't

00:09:35.640 suspend disbelief if this was science fiction i would say gay like if it was a film i'd be shouting

00:09:41.700 gay in the theater and you're telling you want me to think it's real like come on you would look at

00:09:46.580 this and say oh this is the symbiote thing from spider-man this is a really silly lazy idea that

00:09:52.400 todd mcfarland came up with it is literally a todd mcfarland level idea we we haven't talked

00:09:59.540 about this about the twitter drama that i've gotten involved i've gotten myself hooked into

00:10:04.680 today another one i got myself into some mumbo jumbo again what happened okay because i'm gonna

00:10:13.040 i'm trying to figure out how i can make this content and not just make it me bullying someone

00:10:19.100 online you can't you can't but it's okay it's par for the course for podcasts so so there is

00:10:25.560 an individual in our scene by the name of evelyn oh the okay oh i know where this is going you know

00:10:35.960 oh that oh that this is a certified hood classic evelyn uh is a transgender individual and you

00:10:47.920 what i'm gonna i'm gonna do something i'm not gonna be mean i'm really trying because i've

00:10:52.400 because here's okay let's i'm really trying to beautiful mind this right now and the decision

00:11:04.020 tree in my mind is like there's so many pathways i can go down what i don't want to do is to make

00:11:10.320 fun of people who have platformed evelyn because evelyn has been platformed by some people that are

00:11:16.740 like, like Millennial Woes, who graciously had us on a millennial or Edward Dutton.

00:11:23.600 And that's kind of where I was getting at.

00:11:24.700 So Evelyn is a transgender individual who works for who's a part owner, I believe, of

00:11:30.920 Nomos Events, which is an event hosting organization that's hosted a few things that people might

00:11:36.860 have been to.

00:11:37.480 OK, and is all over right wing Twitter as an influencer, you know, someone who's posting

00:11:45.680 on twitter and um recently appeared on edward dutton show has been making the rounds on some

00:11:52.180 other people's shows i think even on jay burden's show jay

00:11:55.620 we love our jay bird well and now he's he's been downgraded from good to nice

00:12:03.740 now he's now he's nice you know what for some people that's a lateral move

00:12:08.960 well qualitatively i don't know oh he's moving from black bear to panda i mean

00:12:15.720 you know that's that's a matter of taste some might say that's a step up um but that that's

00:12:22.900 why i don't want to cast aspersions on that but i'll get to that in a second so this individual

00:12:27.660 has been raising their status his name's duncan by the way uh so duncan uh who is a gay man in

00:12:36.320 address let's you know let's start with that um has been making their eyes getting raising his

00:12:41.820 status and uh has been casting aspersions on that that's not that will not be the thing i say too

00:12:48.380 much this episode fuck okay you've already said it three times i have i said oh i suck tonight

00:12:54.960 kill yourself i i i tonight i choose not to suck so um as this duncan has been dealing with all

00:13:06.020 the people saying who the fuck is this fucking tranny this and that and it's like oh you right

00:13:11.580 wingers you right wingers are too intolerant and sharing memes about how it's actually the jews

00:13:18.300 who are convincing you to hate uh the transgender individuals the based transgender individuals

00:13:25.440 because of course trans transgender isn't bad but there are some based ones and evelyn is a

00:13:30.420 based one that's the argument being made it's very very defensive it's very why are you getting

00:13:35.700 mad at me why why are you getting all up in my grill and guts about this and i just i started

00:13:43.100 talking to evelyn on twitter and uh he said uh what the comment was actually i can just fucking

00:13:49.800 read it hold on so i'll just read the exchange so people can get the context here it says

00:13:54.840 moral of last week or so story 99 of anons are spiteful idiots and can't handle the fact that

00:14:01.900 they have zero say over who is and who isn't part of quote a movement they don't want anything

00:14:08.500 really to happen they just want to be involved and i said yeah i'm in a movement moving away

00:14:14.640 from you nigga unstoppable and then and then everyone says not much use if the rest of your

00:14:26.700 american friends aren't saying this to me i say it's going to be really fun tracking your ballooning

00:14:33.080 ego and desire for fame over the next little while then evelyn quote tweets me saying why

00:14:41.740 write this i've been here for a couple years now doing this work for pennies i don't ask for much

00:14:47.580 really unless of course not wanting to kowtow to a non-spurgs is somehow an ego problem uh to which

00:14:55.980 i had replied it's so funny how you're framing this first the fact that you are oblivious to

00:15:01.780 the well everyone likes me now so claim you just made then pivoting to explaining the avalanche

00:15:07.620 of backlash of your existence is just a spurgy conspiracy what you are asking for is fame and

00:15:15.060 that was me actually being pretty polite like what she's like i don't ask for much well what

00:15:19.600 you want is fame and this is kind of my angle what you want is fame in a space that is full of

00:15:27.240 right-wingers traditionalists fascists biodeterminists uh people really really into

00:15:33.280 fringe psychology like you are like you're not reading the room so this for you to act surprised

00:15:40.940 at this pushback at this reaction to you is delusional or you're a bad actor that's kind

00:15:47.600 of the angle i was taking uh the second angle which i did not make but i will make now because

00:15:53.260 i want to i i do believe this and i'm not trying just to be mean here but i said i'd say this to

00:16:00.180 evelyn right now you know what you are you see what you are every time you look in the mirror

00:16:06.540 and you know your pathologies deep down you do and you exist in this space so you've probably

00:16:13.740 heard it before. You probably have a better understanding of our opinion of transgenderism

00:16:18.540 and the facts about transgenderism. So you know that you are destined to flame out. This isn't

00:16:24.960 just a suicide, a 45% sort of thing, right? This is just you're destined to flame out. Either it's

00:16:30.400 a breakdown or it's some kind of pathological freak out because you people always do because

00:16:36.660 you are mentally ill. You are deranged. We don't say this from a place of hate. It's just you are

00:16:42.240 insane and what you're you're putting i do i do personally hate them but i mean you don't have to

00:16:49.120 but i i mean i do i i yeah well i i see them as a cancer um and so i'm what i would say and i'm not

00:16:56.720 trying to leverage anyone here or involve them but i do look at these individuals that have

00:17:02.200 platformed evelyn as somewhat naive and i see them i don't see this as a personality fault i see them

00:17:08.660 usually nice guys because it's very hard to when you're we might have opinions about people and of

00:17:15.620 groups but the vast majority of individuals even on the far right they don't want to be bullies

00:17:21.400 they don't want to be cruel they don't want to be mean to someone especially if it's in a one-to-one

00:17:25.060 interaction as much as you might hate tranny sometimes when you're confronted with one you

00:17:29.620 might just be polite and it's easy for me to especially the british who are terminally polite

00:17:35.300 so i don't think they secretly love trans like edward dunn like of all the guys who talks about

00:17:41.620 dysgenics and stuff like of course he would know the a to z of this entire thing but i think you

00:17:48.200 know they're not mean guys i am i am a bully and i'm saying that you are putting these perhaps

00:17:54.740 naive individuals in a position where they're going to make need to make excuses for you later

00:18:00.420 you're putting them in a position where when you do flame out when you do whatever insane shit

00:18:06.600 you're destined to do you're putting these guys in a position where they need to like

00:18:11.280 apologize or explain themselves or whatever and i think evelyn when you look in the mirror you

00:18:17.520 know that's going to happen you know you're using these people to try and get famous in a space

00:18:22.160 you know you have no right being famous and and i'll tell you this though i would and you tell

00:18:29.960 me if this is too too diplomatic i would be willing to entertain actually let me just

00:18:36.240 preface it by saying this evelyn has never said a smarter interesting thing

00:18:40.240 so that's important here evelyn is an annoying twitter person uh who's just just says dog shit

00:18:50.840 takes so if it were the case that evelyn was out here bringing some new theory or written a book

00:18:57.900 that's really groundbreaking i would still he hasn't but at least i would kind of see it but

00:19:03.140 this person is not bringing anything to the table here's something they could bring to the table

00:19:07.700 that might at least that permit their presence in a presence of prominence would be saying like

00:19:15.180 look i am transgender i know that i'm fucked up and busted and insane i don't know why i'm this

00:19:21.880 way but i you i'm gonna do i'm gonna use myself as an example i'm gonna try and unpack my

00:19:27.580 psychology. Maybe I was molested. Maybe I was raped. Maybe there's something wrong with me.

00:19:31.920 Maybe I am just a gay man in a dress. And let's unpack that. Why am I gay? Why do I feel like I

00:19:37.160 need to wear a dress? Be that case study. If you were coming out and saying, like, I'm going to

00:19:43.700 essentially dissect my own personality so weak, because I believe in what you guys say,

00:19:49.420 because I understand anti-transgenderism. I believe that transgenderism is a social cancer.

00:19:56.560 So in the interest of proving it's a social cancer, I will conduct a scientific study on myself.

00:20:02.620 That would be interesting.

00:20:04.700 But if you are a transgender and you're coming out and saying being a transgender doesn't matter and that maybe it's even tolerable, I'm sorry.

00:20:13.460 Go fuck yourself.

00:20:15.780 Get the fuck out.

00:20:18.300 And I would hear stories about Evelyn.

00:20:20.040 And I'm sorry, maybe I'm not being diplomatic as I thought.

00:20:22.700 But everyone who knows Evelyn would be in these chats, especially like Millennial Woes' chat, and he would get a perverted delight out of, you know, a tricking straight man.

00:20:34.800 So Evelyn has the appearance of a woman, you know, on the avatar there.

00:20:40.020 Like, there's like a glamour photo there.

00:20:41.700 At 720p, maybe.

00:20:45.520 Yeah, exactly.

00:20:46.580 So some guys would be like, oh, it's a girl.

00:20:48.500 You know how fucking horny these guys get on Telegram?

00:20:51.140 Yeah.

00:20:51.520 when when a girl walks in um and then they would say oh that's actually a guy and this evelyn would

00:20:57.520 get a think that's funny it's funny tricking straight guys i'm like and that's sick it's sick

00:21:04.420 because you need to understand that men generally hate that but especially right wing men like why

00:21:10.380 do you think that's funny it's because you're undermining masculinities because you're

00:21:14.740 undermining heterosexuality if you actually were on the side of these guys you wouldn't even swim

00:21:20.540 in those fucking waters you wouldn't even try that prank right because you're a not you're not

00:21:26.000 of this fucking space you are a fucking cancer sorry i've been going off you go i don't want to

00:21:30.960 be the diplomatic one i don't think that's fair like on their side and by their side i mean the

00:21:35.440 left-wingers of which this fucking guy duncan is one because he's not a woman he's a man in a dress

00:21:40.180 um if you so much as think if you say it's okay to be white you'll never get a platform on their

00:21:47.540 side so who are we like you say even the way you're framing it it's like these guys are just

00:21:53.200 being nice and naive we're being bullies no we're not being bullies we're being perfectly even-handed

00:21:58.360 in what is a it's a cultural war right we're being perfectly even-handed by saying i don't care how

00:22:05.060 right-wing or how smart you are you're fucking dead to me i i don't even look i don't i wouldn't

00:22:09.920 even accept a gay i don't i don't want to talk to a normal fucking fag let alone a gay who dresses

00:22:18.440 in women's clothes and says that it's okay for him to go in the girls washroom i want to hit that

00:22:23.660 person hard enough to put them in the hospital that's what i want to do to that person i don't

00:22:27.540 give a fuck about their politics this is just it's insanity and i the buck has to stop somewhere

00:22:34.460 Like, I don't know what, what it makes me feel very isolated seeing the number of people who I respected who are platforming guys like Duncan. And I don't get it. Like, I don't, I don't know why it's up to us to try to navigate the politics of this and like not step on anybody's toes.

00:22:53.600 To me, it's just an opportunity to say, well, that's great. I guess I don't have to worry about interacting with you anymore because you're the sort of person who thinks trans are legitimate.

00:23:03.880 You're the sort of person who, like, I don't want to, I'm not trying to throw people under the bus, but there's people on this list who will interact with and platform Duncan and who have not responded to our requests to work together or to talk on our show.

00:23:20.200 That is true.

00:23:23.600 There are people on this list who won't come on our fucking show, but they'll put a random fucking tranny who has done nothing and came out of nowhere, by the way, just showed up in the past 18 months.

00:23:36.420 Not that we're not old heads, but we've been around for five, six years.

00:23:40.040 So, like, fuck this.

00:23:41.760 No, honestly.

00:23:43.440 And you know what?

00:23:44.740 I'm not being a bully right now.

00:23:46.220 I'm being diplomatic.

00:23:48.120 I'm being fair and perfectly fucking reasonable.

00:23:50.880 If I wanted to be a bully, I could say all kinds of other arrestable things.

00:23:54.260 But I'm being fair when I say no, no, no, no, no, no.

00:24:00.560 What I hate is the sound of a Judas slam dunk.

00:24:20.880 that i can hear the crowd like this is not live but i know the crowd's gonna be cheering when you

00:24:26.320 say that because i i know when our guys get riled up about a judas point a point landing fuck

00:24:33.340 me me shuffling my notes like i just i just i want people to like me

00:24:38.360 look i i do too but i also no no but but but the irony is that people are gonna not like me if i'm

00:24:45.300 yeah that's that's the funny i mean that's that's an important thing to say though right

00:24:49.580 like you can't please everybody you can be on their side but you're going to alienate a lot

00:24:53.580 of our guys who actually think the same way we do and then if if if we say what we think then

00:24:58.040 we're going to alienate you know we're going to alienate woes to be honest if woes ever listened

00:25:02.560 to this even though we're not calling him out directly you know we're giving him we're giving

00:25:06.420 him the benefit of the doubt here but i mean definitely he's not going to have us back on

00:25:10.440 and maybe that's okay you know no hard feelings but like if you want to platform those types of

00:25:16.080 people um maybe your principles don't align with our also the claim will be made by some people of

00:25:22.780 why draw the line here like you know on the right we compromise so much even with guys like us you

00:25:28.800 know we've got stuff that going on in our lives that some people don't like for the also i'm

00:25:33.120 half ukrainian a lot of people think i should probably die or don't exist i they don't i don't

00:25:38.820 exist and should die you know there's a lot of stuff going on there but to me this one is a

00:25:43.920 no-brainer we can we can debate about lines we can debate about where line should we draw but i'm like

00:25:49.140 at the very least let's draw this one and we can keep going back and back and draw more lines but

00:25:55.940 this seems like an important one for me yeah and then like there's there's there's race stuff like

00:26:01.240 oh what about or the portuguese like this isn't just like are italians white or if someone is

00:26:06.800 like a quarter hispanic whatever the fuck bullshit we go on about like this has to be one at least

00:26:12.660 right yeah yeah yeah yeah like i would say if we want to talk about sexual degeneracy you could

00:26:19.620 say like okay what about like guys who like feet all right guys who like feet and like seriously

00:26:24.700 and that kind of as a joke but also guys who like feet tend to actually be psychos so like if a guy

00:26:29.600 likes feet maybe he needs to get looked at maybe he needs to get examined you know if a guy if a

00:26:35.120 guy it turns out that we get into the guy's stash and he's got a bunch of furry porn he shouldn't be

00:26:39.720 on porn anyways and if he is furry porn is pretty bad this is the kind of stuff like we're not going

00:26:43.360 to cut you off we're going to work we want to help you but this is clearly a problem like you need

00:26:47.980 you need help and you should probably step back from public speaking for a while yeah but the

00:26:52.540 tranny thing that is literally the maximum depth of any possible pit of sexual degeneracy possible

00:26:59.480 it is literally the absolute bottom it's down there i was going to say it's down there with

00:27:03.740 pedophiles no it's pedophiles it is yeah crossover the venn diagram between trannies and pedophiles

00:27:10.860 is just a circle yeah and also to me i explained this to someone the other day i was actually in

00:27:17.120 jay burton's chat um and i was like you know transgenderism as an identity is in fact a bucket

00:27:23.500 of a bunch of different pathologies because there's different types of transgender point is

00:27:27.040 they're all bad it's like pedophiles like there's different there's different types of people who

00:27:32.360 end up fucking kids they're like guys who were molested as kids themselves and then there's guys

00:27:37.360 there's this other type which are just super hedonists where fucking kids is just part of

00:27:42.740 their portfolio of degeneracies and then there's like the elites who do it as like i'm gonna force

00:27:48.840 myself to do it and then i get used to it like there's also but it's all bad just like with

00:27:53.220 transgenderism that while there's the auto gynophiles who are turned on by the thought of

00:27:58.320 themselves being women that's like contrapoints and uh philosophy tube that's like an extreme

00:28:03.500 narcissism then there's just like the extension of drag so it's just like you're a man in a dress

00:28:09.380 taking that as far as you can but then there and then there's like other like eunuch type stuff but

00:28:15.020 all of them are bad all of them are fundamentally broken and then they kind of feed into each other

00:28:20.340 and then they start mutating in that space so i'll tell you the cope that i had and i'll tell you

00:28:25.960 who put a javelin through my cope so on and i want to hear what you think about this so part of me

00:28:33.040 not part of me full me totality of me was saying well okay well in term in regards to where to draw

00:28:41.140 lines you know we talk about this whole strange political space of as if it's in a holistic space

00:28:48.620 when in fact it's a whole cluster of different people doing different things there's sort of

00:28:52.500 the intelligentsia intellectuals over here discussing ideas but then there's people

00:28:56.860 actually like training for combat over here then there's people starting businesses over here like

00:29:02.200 there's a whole bunch of people do different things and i started thinking like well okay

00:29:06.700 if like if i were to draw lines for who should join what those would be different like if i was

00:29:11.940 starting a business i would have a hard line actually i'd have a hard line against women

00:29:16.420 like i wouldn't start a business with women or gays or anything like that but i'm like well in

00:29:21.800 like an intelligentsia academic space maybe it's okay to have degenerates over there if they're

00:29:29.000 as long as they're engines of freaky new ideas because that's in essence how it's been throughout

00:29:34.200 time like you'll see just homosexuals pop up even in far-right and fascist circles in the theory

00:29:40.600 side and they've been tolerated to some degree but you wouldn't put them in charge of anything

00:29:45.480 you wouldn't put them you know you you could have like gay guys over here

00:29:50.760 writing books but you wouldn't have them in a platoon right now this is what something that

00:29:57.160 james o was saying um and he was going on about revealed preferences and it got me thinking he

00:30:03.960 said you know why must we separate you know the written page from who writes it like it doesn't

00:30:11.080 even make sense to discuss something as true if the hand that wrote it is degenerate or evil or

00:30:19.000 corrupt in some way first of all what is the likelihood of that happening what is the likelihood

00:30:23.320 of a total psychotic degenerate coming up with something that is true and good very little but

00:30:30.080 then even if they did should we even permit that you know i mean he started phrasing like that i'm

00:30:35.820 like you know what maybe it because it's fucking right here's i'm going to say something that's

00:30:40.540 just straight up anti-semitic you know but there's a reason why i would you know we sometimes traffic

00:30:47.080 in the ideas of jews on here like eric weinstein he says some interesting stuff i would never start

00:30:52.600 an organization with a jewish person because i know that their ethno-religious allegiances are

00:30:59.400 always going to be counter to mine and they might not reveal themselves right away when a long

00:31:03.160 enough timeline i know that they will put jewish identity above all else especially me if i'm not

00:31:08.600 jewish and there's no way around that there's no way that they will not have that sort of treachery

00:31:15.480 within them so you might as well not do it just like oh you can have like a base a based woman

00:31:20.240 around men i'm like on a long enough timeline she's gonna fuck all the guys and that is going

00:31:24.420 to ruin the dynamic that's why we don't do it so a lot of people don't like the phrase conservative

00:31:30.240 right and i think it's been sullied because conservatives are no longer conservative like

00:31:35.560 in the traditional sense of conserving something and this is this really cuts to the heart of

00:31:41.760 what's gone on and what has what has poisoned the idea of being a quote unquote conservative

00:31:47.020 which is when you conserve something it it doesn't matter that whether or not you understand the

00:31:55.440 thing if you you don't have to know where it came from you don't have to know how it works

00:31:59.960 you don't you just have to know the fucking rule and you follow the rule so and the reason it's

00:32:06.140 important to have that skill is because there's all kinds of things that were either figured out

00:32:11.820 by great men that you will never understand and you just need to follow their instructions or

00:32:16.340 they were figured out in an emergent way civilizationally over a thousand years and

00:32:21.760 that system only exists if we have the conservatives the people who conserve and we lose these things

00:32:28.360 so like you can make all kinds of like for marriage you can make all kinds of rational

00:32:32.660 arguments for why we don't need marriage you're thinking you're using your brain and saying this

00:32:37.100 is why we might not need it but the truth of it is you you need it i'm not going to explain it to

00:32:41.640 you i'm not going to even try to explain it to you it's just the fucking truth it's just true

00:32:46.520 and the same thing with trans i'm not a genius i'm not going to explain to you why trans are awful

00:32:51.180 they just are and that's it i'm chatting out you know what i mean because we never had them before

00:32:57.100 the reason we're conserving this we never had them before there is a body of evidence that's

00:33:02.580 suggests that they're fucked up they're they're pathological they rape kids that's enough that's

00:33:07.020 enough you don't need to think it through just stop stop stop letting them make arguments in

00:33:14.000 favor you know what i mean like the whole thing saying well i mean these gays they're awful and

00:33:18.000 they rape kids but maybe if one of them was a really good poet we could accept his poetry no

00:33:22.160 because you don't know what's in that poetry to say that is to say hubristically i think i

00:33:28.040 understand the depth of power that poetry has on the human mind over 200 years you don't okay you

00:33:36.600 fucking don't especially not into the future so you should burn all those books you should burn

00:33:41.120 them right now because you don't know what what that's going to do down the line and the same

00:33:45.400 thing with the trance you might not be able to see why this is bad right now you just need to have

00:33:50.440 that conservative inclination that it's bad and then just fucking burn it we're the only people

00:33:57.100 left that are doing this and somebody needs to do this yeah and also that's a very very good point

00:34:02.000 judas was not a fan of our foucault arc let's just say that let's just uh let's just say that

00:34:10.080 jokes on you because i only read foucault in like college and i don't remember any of it

00:34:15.360 jokes on both of us we don't listen to the show after um no but uh and also here's a tool for

00:34:22.840 some people to use i kind of mentioned this before but you should be suspicious if a person

00:34:28.400 with this identity which seems counter to your understanding of how things should be or ought to

00:34:36.780 be however you define that if they're coming to you and the first thing they say isn't that i

00:34:42.900 understand that what i am is bad then you should be suspicious like for example if you're in our

00:34:48.620 and there's some individuals in our space who are who have been homosexuals and are homosexuals

00:34:55.320 and there's some who own up to it and like i get that being gay is like wrong i'm trying to work

00:35:00.000 on it whether or not you believe them but that at least is something i can get but if there's a lot

00:35:04.760 of gay guys who show up in the space and they're like yeah i'm gay who cares i you can't be who

00:35:10.980 cares no there's no you need to understand why it's bad if you because if you're an intelligent

00:35:17.580 person and many of them are intelligent you must understand why it's bad if you don't that means

00:35:21.460 you're a bad actor and that means that you're going to try and slip something in poor choice

00:35:26.420 of words it's a perfect choice of words actually you're going to try and like cram something

00:35:35.180 in a sense you're trying to slip something in my drink and inject me with something you know

00:35:44.780 yeah but like later on like uh there's and to go back to my thing about conservation and

00:35:50.620 conservatism right like that's this exact process where we say you know we're dissidents i'm a

00:35:57.320 dissident i'll read countercurrents because 90 of what they say agrees with me except for the 10

00:36:02.640 about how gays are cool like that exact process is what happened to get us where we are today right

00:36:08.980 they didn't just walk in and say everything's fucked they went little by little in in uh you

00:36:15.600 know in magazines and in television stations and in churches that were preaching 90 of what you

00:36:20.620 agree with and then in the final 10 just slipping that little poison pill in there and then you you

00:36:26.440 adjust to it and then next year it's something else and next year it's something else well okay

00:36:30.940 so i'll i'll i'll play devil's advocate here the the thing that i often hear is you know we don't

00:36:37.640 we don't have a lot of talent on our side. You know, we don't have like for every one of our

00:36:43.060 magazines, there's 10 of theirs. So we got to take what we can get. And we got guys that are

00:36:47.700 doing out there. They're doing great work most of the time. And occasionally they're sucking some

00:36:50.980 dick. Maybe we just turn a blind eye to it. To which I say, uh, no, I look at it the other way

00:36:57.740 around. If we don't have a lot of, um, if we don't have a lot of media, if you're to say,

00:37:03.620 for example we're talking about online magazines or websites you know media places if with there's

00:37:09.660 10 to a 10 to 1 ratio from them to us that's you could look at it and say well that's because

00:37:15.160 we just don't have the talent or maybe it's because we do have the talent but it's a it's

00:37:20.120 a crowded room maybe the reason we have duncan evelyn and we don't have somebody better is

00:37:27.020 because we have duncan we need to get rid of duncan and in the vacuum somebody like let's

00:37:33.460 just keep, let's just keep re-rolling is essentially what I'm saying. Like there can only be in our

00:37:38.420 sphere because it's a small sphere. There can only be so many magazines. There's only so many

00:37:41.680 podcasts. There's only so many influencers before it gets crowded. And if you're going to let the

00:37:46.080 gays in, then it's, everyone's just going to leave. So we need to re-roll. We need to get

00:37:50.280 the people out and then just get some new ones. And if the new ones also happen to be gay job

00:37:54.840 molesters, get them out too. Get all of them out. Just keep fucking rolling until you find somebody

00:37:58.740 else yeah i mentioned this on the appearance that i did on the prudentialist stream which won't be

00:38:04.240 on this episode but the next one for people who didn't catch it on the audio version i was reading

00:38:08.960 an article uh i believe it was either from the jacobin magazine or the jacobite magazine i forget

00:38:16.280 which one it was one of those it was from many many years ago but it was written by a jewish

00:38:21.480 individual i think it was like an adl employee um because the stream we were on was discussing

00:38:27.300 the adl and jews generally but they'd made the claim like you know here's well all people don't

00:38:33.520 know about the far right a third of them are feds a third of them are petty criminals and a third of

00:38:38.540 them are homosexuals and a lot of people who are critical of the distant right as we know it were

00:38:44.100 kind of even among cells were circulating like hey ain't it the truth and in a sense i can kind

00:38:51.000 to see that because there there do seem to be a lot of gays and weird sex guys in the scene like

00:38:57.900 christ even in the groups that i've worked with that i don't really tell stories about

00:39:01.340 at least a couple of them like someone high up ended up being just a pervert in some way

00:39:06.840 like they were into like uh bdsm you know humiliation stuff and that's another way to

00:39:15.360 frame it right okay remove like the the gay stuff like if you knew a guy who was trying to run a

00:39:20.380 group and he knew he was into like having his balls crushed by stiletto shoes and having a

00:39:25.160 woman spit on him and call him a faggot would you think that they deserve not to be as a leader

00:39:30.580 right you know i mean like absolutely absolutely not and they should be outed as well yeah and

00:39:34.480 it's like don't get the fuck out we figure that out or just but usually there's something else

00:39:39.100 inside of them that has manifested itself sexually but i keep coming across this too and i've said

00:39:45.140 before i'm trying to reconcile some things in my mind here but i've said before i'm like we are the

00:39:50.200 only side that seems to actually be trying to out our degenerates every other side either turns a

00:39:56.380 blind eye or openly accepts them and so it might seem to us like there's more on our side but that's

00:40:02.640 just because we keep ferreting them out and i think you need to remind yourself why you keep

00:40:08.040 ferreting them out um and i think we stand more to lose by just you know you know i mean like

00:40:14.300 on one hand i'm i'm willing to enact a don't you know don't ask don't tell policy like if that's

00:40:20.600 what it is like if i don't know about i don't know how you would test for it but if some at the very

00:40:24.940 least if someone is out there openly admitting to it that that should be a problem right if someone

00:40:32.000 is secretly gay and they're trying to hide like you know i don't know what do i know the interesting

00:40:36.120 thing about sexual degeneracy with not all of it with some of it is if nobody ever finds out about

00:40:41.960 it it's between you and god isn't it right and that's kind of the issue with this is is not so

00:40:48.720 much that we're not hunting them down under the floorboards it's that the ones that are open about

00:40:53.800 it and are tacitly or openly defending it we're not outing them we're not throwing them in the

00:41:02.060 ditch right i don't i haven't met i mean maybe just because we travel in a small circle here

00:41:07.540 i have not met spoken or written to anybody in our circle who is any anything more than um

00:41:15.600 lukewarm on duncan the majority of the guys in our sphere viscerally hate this person and

00:41:22.860 everybody else is kind of like i would like to not comment i've never heard anybody who wasn't

00:41:28.780 somebody i already thought was a faggot defending duncan yeah the reason i brought it up on the show

00:41:34.180 i didn't want to just be a drama thing but it kicked off this sort of a struggle session as it

00:41:39.380 were about like okay like let's use this as a case study of like what could something like this be

00:41:46.760 allowed why or why not let's and i think you know you offered some very good ideas on like here's

00:41:53.660 how we should view it um irrespective even if evelyn wasn't involved but this is an ongoing

00:41:58.420 thing in our scene uh what identities to accept and where should the lines be drawn and i think

00:42:05.120 we kind of that's just what i'm it's going to be an ongoing thing i'm sure in the future

00:42:09.480 i hope um i've been making a lot more enemies lately so but it's it's such a funny thing to

00:42:16.300 try to measure though because it's like if you just want to have the biggest you know ratio deck

00:42:21.560 of friends versus enemies that you can get how do you do that if objectively the world is mostly

00:42:26.460 full of just fucking awful people it's hard also if in the future they're revealed like i don't

00:42:33.820 want to be a situation where something some news breaks that turns out they were bad the entire

00:42:39.860 time and no one said anything and everyone some people had an inkling that something bad would

00:42:45.960 happen that they would be treacherous or they would throw someone under the bus and that you

00:42:50.400 were just like oh i always knew they would i just didn't say anything well that just sounds like

00:42:53.440 cowardice to me so there is a level i get to where i'm like i i need to go on record on this

00:43:00.000 person and if i'm wrong because i've said something you know i've said a couple things

00:43:04.100 about like you know like individuals in their scene and then their fans have contacted me

00:43:08.620 and pled a case i'm like okay like i'll there's people that i disagree with and there's people

00:43:14.040 that i think are just like i i can't envision a world where working with you would be a benefit

00:43:20.560 or you've done something so bad i'm like i don't i want nothing to do with you i forget the guy's

00:43:26.040 name he's one of the guys in our scene and somebody who i didn't know that he was gay and

00:43:30.300 i'd listen to a few of his things and some of the guys like he's gay i'm like i'll throw this

00:43:33.200 fucking guy out and they're like no actually he left the scene a few years ago and he's kind of

00:43:37.180 struggling with it and he's trying to to turn around and essentially not be gay anymore i'm

00:43:41.080 like oh that's fantastic that's i wish him luck that's wonderful i wish everybody could follow

00:43:46.360 that model like just if you're gay then instead of making youtube videos how about first you stop

00:43:52.780 being gay like i don't mean that as like i want to kill you i mean like i'm praying for you buddy

00:43:56.840 like seriously i hope you get better i hope i hope this can be healed yeah so anyway i hope we spent

00:44:03.220 a bit longer on that than i intended to but we went down some interesting paths there and i'm

00:44:08.440 gonna try i got a segue for the next part you know this whole you know these individuals they

00:44:14.820 suffer from main character syndrome reminds me of this movie that i saw recently oh no are we

00:44:21.160 doing movie character movie corner i made a promise to myself a few weeks ago and i made

00:44:36.120 the promise while i was gearing up to watch the latest insidious installment i think it's insidious

00:44:43.480 five and i said to myself i i couldn't do it downloaded it i loaded it up saw the first few

00:44:49.960 seconds i'm like this isn't life this is this isn't a way to live and i made a vow that i'm

00:44:56.400 only gonna watch good movies uh and so i decided i'm just fuck fuck all this shit trawling to see

00:45:04.200 what's out there and i had a list of a bunch of good movies that i'd never seen before that we'll

00:45:10.580 talk about these in the next little while because i actually i think there's stuff to talk about but

00:45:14.320 like i've never seen the warriors before that's a good one yeah i've never seen uh big trouble

00:45:20.800 little china yep kurt russell classic phenomenal movies like all these fucking great movies old

00:45:26.760 documentaries this is one i got lined up that i want to talk about i think it's called the emperor's

00:45:32.800 naked army marches on the here's the summary of the movie it's it's an older documentary from like

00:45:39.880 the 70s or something it's about this uh japanese guy who fought in world war ii as the war was

00:45:46.500 ending him and his men were about to leave and for some for some reason i think it was

00:45:52.740 i think something happened where like his guys his men were killed by their own people for like

00:45:59.560 doing something or not doing something i'll talk about when i talk about the movie but his men were

00:46:04.140 killed by their own people and he survived and he's the main character of the documentary he's

00:46:09.600 an old man now he's like in his fucking 50s 60s he's japanese smoking cigarettes all the time and

00:46:15.320 he's going around and confronting all of like the colonels and the guys he found who issued the

00:46:21.720 orders and confronting them in like their homes they'd run restaurants now they they're just like

00:46:26.800 old men playing with their families and he goes with the camera crew and he sits down he's chit

00:46:31.840 chatting with them right and then he explains himself it's like you were responsible for my

00:46:36.560 men explain yourself and then if you don't explain it's just i'm gonna kick your ass and it's just

00:46:41.740 him going around japan beating the shit out of these old men they're just an old man it's like

00:46:46.340 a bum fights almost nice and he gets he's just going around and it's they're like you know

00:46:50.820 he's doing it for his men his men who were killed and there's interspice with him like

00:46:55.480 visiting their graves like he's haunted by it and it's this whole story about the trauma of war and

00:47:00.580 everything but it's him on a fucking mission like i don't want to beat the shit out of you unless

00:47:03.680 who apologize and he's beating them up in the front of their families and like their wives are

00:47:09.500 coming in it's an ugly fight because they're old men too and the American art the American like art

00:47:15.080 school kid is filming it yeah and I haven't seen I just saw clips I'm like I gotta see this front

00:47:20.780 to back but this is what I want to spend my time watching because you don't get that anymore but

00:47:26.720 this movie i want to talk about just because i think even in explaining this i love it it's just

00:47:33.980 a movie that's fun to explain it's a new one it came out recently so you can find this somewhere

00:47:38.880 i think it's on like apple movies it's called corner office and it's starring john ham john

00:47:45.580 ham and a bunch of other people from tv shows you might recognize it's got the guy who played

00:47:50.840 the indian brown kid from communities in there um and a couple other people um but john ham's the

00:47:58.420 star and uh the setup i'm just gonna explain to you what it is the setup is john ham main character

00:48:05.940 shows up at his new job one day he's walking in and he's narrating it he's there he's kind of

00:48:12.020 egotistical he's ambitious but he's first down his job and it's this big dystopian brutalist

00:48:19.360 building right and you never really know what they do there but he's working in an office and

00:48:24.380 everything's gray and oppressive and you're kind of expecting to learn what they do and you never

00:48:30.220 learn it's not important and to me let me just say this one of the things i loved about this movie

00:48:36.260 i think it was a scandinavian story i think it's based off of a book and i don't know for sure but

00:48:43.400 i think it was a scandinavian story and i'll tell you why because it's a certain type of story

00:48:46.900 it's a story that is very darkly comical and cynical and it's not afraid to just punish the

00:48:56.180 main character and treat you as like an idiot for thinking it would be anything else because the

00:49:03.260 entire time you're thinking like this this seems like that that show severance which is a fantastic

00:49:09.620 show where it's a conspiracy within the conspiracy and you're expecting some big conspiracy some big

00:49:14.860 reveal maybe something even supernatural that never arrives so i'm going to explain what the

00:49:19.340 movie is so he's walking in you're hearing everything from his perspective in his voice

00:49:23.540 he's narrating what's going on and uh gets in the building and he's just this sort of menial worker

00:49:29.560 but he he he's gonna be running the place soon he's sure of it he's gonna climb the ladder

00:49:34.320 and be the manager and uh he's kind of weird he's wearing glasses like he's john ham he's a handsome

00:49:39.900 guy he's dressed to be kind of schlubby um and he's getting to know people and uh he finds like

00:49:47.980 he's not doing as well as he thought he would he's not getting along with people like he thought he

00:49:52.200 would but he stumbles across this strange office it's it's at the kind of the end of a hall on a

00:49:59.800 door and he just goes in one day turns on the light and it's this like beautiful mad men style

00:50:06.340 massive office that like a boss would be in but everything the design and the aesthetics is so

00:50:12.220 different than the rest of the world he's in and then he it turns out he tells people about the

00:50:17.440 office and that office doesn't exist what the hell and but it does exist i've been in there

00:50:23.080 no one will acknowledge the room right i have gotten used to being one of the leaders

00:50:29.240 in my last job i was determined to build up the same position at work

00:50:35.000 That's how the coffee machine works. This is how the blinds work

00:50:39.460 Whenever anyone looked at me I fired off a broad smile a

00:50:44.000 Smile disarms your opponent and makes them doubt their own enmity. I stuck to my schedule when I first discovered

00:50:52.360 the room

00:50:54.300 There was something special about this place

00:50:58.060 Answer me truthfully. What is this room for? Don't drag me into this. I

00:51:02.060 i found a secret room and when i work in there i'm able to do anything a secret room it's just

00:51:07.660 that most people aren't able to see it were you on drugs and then he tries to take but he takes

00:51:14.800 people in there and after he shows them they treat him very very weird um and all this time in his

00:51:20.580 mind he's saying like with these people like they're playing a prank on me there's a conspiracy

00:51:24.220 here why are they against me they'll learn one day right uh it reveals very fast that the room

00:51:30.480 in fact doesn't exist and what happens is he what there's just a wall there he just sees a door

00:51:37.900 and when he walks in it's just him standing motionless and staring at the wall

00:51:43.000 it's some kind of like psychological break he goes through

00:51:46.920 which is a great way of intimidating his employees i know and he's just staring and then so people are

00:51:53.920 like talking to him he's like i gotta show you this room and then imagine doing that imagine

00:51:58.620 and you see this from his perspective

00:52:00.380 and the genius of the movie is I didn't like it at first

00:52:03.060 at first I'm like I don't get what's

00:52:05.040 going on here I don't really there's

00:52:06.800 I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop the other shoe

00:52:08.840 never really drops you're staying

00:52:10.860 with him the entire time he's convinced that everyone

00:52:12.960 is out to fucking get him

00:52:14.220 and but just

00:52:16.540 once you start imagining it from other people's

00:52:19.080 perspectives you seem

00:52:21.040 like I'm going to show you this office and then he

00:52:22.900 just stands there for like 15 minutes

00:52:24.960 and you're like hello

00:52:26.900 what

00:52:28.060 and then he shows people the room and they start treating him weird but it's not like they're

00:52:32.740 against him they're kind of worried about him but he's interpreting that as being hostile and

00:52:38.100 the genius of the movie is that there is no like secret conspiracy but like the way he goes about

00:52:46.320 it's like a character study of this type of guy and you realize that i've seen this type of guy

00:52:50.900 before the guy with main character syndrome and right up until the end of the movie it's so

00:52:57.140 fascinating seeing him deal with his boss because everyone in the office knows it's this weird thing

00:53:01.840 he does but he's actually more productive and he stay he starts staying late so he could like go

00:53:07.900 into that office when no one's around to finish his work and so he's like he's killing it like

00:53:13.380 he's crushing he's doing he's producing good stuff and his manager's noticing and his manager's in

00:53:19.460 the position where he's like he's like you you can't do this it's insane like everyone and he

00:53:25.240 as the audience member you're also thinking like maybe they should just let him do it right

00:53:29.440 why can't they why can't they just let him why can't he just come on as a treat maybe he's doing

00:53:34.140 great work maybe it's just a quirky thing but then you're also thinking no that's fucking insane

00:53:38.020 and once you start seeing it from the the office workers perspective it's like yeah we hired this

00:53:42.200 new guy who goes and stands completely emotionally staring at the wall for 15 minutes and then looks

00:53:48.460 at us like we're fucking assholes it's like i kind of get why you would be worried about that

00:53:53.400 And the manager is like in this buy-in where he kind of lets him do it for a while, but it's like, just keep it secret.

00:54:00.240 But he doesn't want to keep it secret.

00:54:01.900 He wants everyone to know.

00:54:02.860 And right up until the end, he ends up getting fired, right?

00:54:07.760 But right up until that last scene, he's convinced that he's doing such good work, he's going to force his boss to quit, and he's going to get his boss's job.

00:54:16.600 Like, he's cocky sitting in the office telling himself, like, he's going to come in, and I'm going to give him a choice.

00:54:22.460 either leave willingly or i call the security and then the boss comes with security like

00:54:26.520 i'm sorry i talked to the main guy and we can't let you gotta go

00:54:31.940 and it's just the reality comes crashing down on him and it's just but he never really admits it

00:54:38.060 and then it recontextualizes the whole thing like my god this guy really this entire time he has

00:54:44.100 just been insane i'm obsessed with that character i'm obsessed with like the the smugness he has

00:54:50.920 and the pretentiousness and the ambition that he thinks i can i why shouldn't they let me do this

00:54:56.720 but you never know what the work is like maybe the work's not fucking important yeah yeah that's

00:55:01.340 the other thing and to me it just i said it seemed like a scandinavian movie because it's so cold

00:55:07.300 and so like yes and then he gets fired and he dies he should i i want to see it now that actually

00:55:15.540 sounds like it's right up my alley that sounds good and and again if you go into it knowing

00:55:19.280 that's what it is i i wasn't on board with it until after the movie finished and then i thought

00:55:25.060 this is fucking amazing because then you think about because it's not like there's a twist

00:55:31.580 the twist would make you retroactively think about it the twist kind of comes early and it

00:55:38.120 forces you to enjoy it as if you're watching it the second time where you're seeing his co-workers

00:55:44.440 who are kind of concerned about him and then there's the scene right at the end that really

00:55:48.820 drives to home where he's being walked out to his car it's the snow in this big parking lot he's

00:55:53.640 carrying a box of his stuff escorted by security and then he's narrating it's still this delusional

00:56:00.100 thing he drops his box runs back up gets around them goes and goes right back into the room

00:56:05.440 and i guess it's implied that he like stays there forever right i think he's just in his own mind

00:56:10.680 but it kind of flashes everyone around him like everyone in the office is like gathered around

00:56:14.900 him and is worried about him like are you okay please you know come out come out it's like

00:56:19.400 oh these aren't bad people these aren't like cold office drones they're just regular nice people and

00:56:26.140 he's just like autistic and he spent the whole movie judging them and like making snide remarks

00:56:32.160 about them like he goes in the office the first thing he does like i'm gonna cycle i'm gonna

00:56:36.140 psychoanalyze everyone and he ends up like psychoanalyzing this like woman who's like yeah

00:56:41.240 she's like the main bitch in charge and but she doesn't even know that her child's drawing there

00:56:46.740 is incorrect like that's not what a house looks like like he's criticizing a child's drawing and

00:56:55.260 it's like that that's a comment on her ability to do her job it really does sound like the horror

00:57:00.220 of working with autists in the in the office that they think they're smarter than everybody else but

00:57:05.620 they're actually just fucking insane and you're everyone's cleaning up after them well this is

00:57:09.260 what i love because right now there is this trend in hollywood to glorify like severe autism in the

00:57:15.980 sense that everyone who listens to this show is of course autistic but there's this autism like oh

00:57:20.860 they're just sort of like delightful quirky people and like a lot of the people with asperger's that

00:57:25.280 i've known growing up they're very judgy they're awful i despise them they're the most like they're

00:57:31.200 so conceited and judgy and narcissistic and they're generally they're they always want to

00:57:36.460 tell these stories but you know albert einstein was had asperger's and all these different

00:57:40.800 geniuses had asperger's first of all no they fucking didn't second of all you're not them

00:57:45.220 you're an idiot your iq is like 85 your favorite thing is yugioh cards like what the fuck are you

00:57:50.540 talking about you don't like you're hyper focused on one thing if that one thing is physics cool

00:57:56.060 that's good here's the thing it's never physics it's all usually yugioh cards yeah it's always

00:58:01.940 some media it's always some horse shit that's really colorful and dumb but it and and i think

00:58:08.980 this movie really gets across that elitism where like he goes to the office party he deigns to be

00:58:14.940 there it's like why would i want to be here like no one wants to be there right everyone's kind of

00:58:20.300 dude trying to make the best of it but you're the guy you're the one who's figured it out like

00:58:24.800 on one hand there's the not understanding social cues but his thing and a lot of these guys is

00:58:30.460 you think the social cues are stupid like why should i have to do this why should i have to

00:58:35.140 try and be nice to people i don't want to be nice to people i want them to to understand how smart

00:58:40.060 i am and that's kind of like the joke of this like are you that smart and i think it's great

00:58:45.520 that it never really establishes what they're doing like it's just something with spreadsheets

00:58:49.140 something with emails you know and he's he's hyper focused on like little things like you

00:58:56.500 know someone's papers went over on my desk and you know how do i communicate what a grievous error

00:59:02.000 that was and then you know it's like they still tolerate it this entire time he's being tolerated

00:59:07.540 until he pushes it too far so in a sense if you've ever had an issue with a guy with asperger's

00:59:13.200 this is the movie for you it's the movie where they push it so far they get their comeuppance

00:59:17.800 that are just fired i love this anyway that's that if um i don't know how much we want to talk

00:59:26.640 about this but have you been following the this alien disclosure going on in mexico right now

00:59:32.920 yeah i just saw some clips of it yeah but i i was reading some of the uh some of the replies

00:59:37.340 on twitter it's kind of interesting but now mexico's congress is taking things to a whole

00:59:42.820 other level, shown the remains of what certainly looks like tiny aliens with elongated heads

00:59:48.780 and three fingers on each hand.

00:59:52.100 Controversial UFO researcher Jaime Mohsan presented them and said it's a clear demonstration

00:59:57.260 we're dealing with non-human specimens.

01:00:00.600 The hearing was told they were found in a Peruvian mine six years ago and are around

01:00:04.840 a thousand years old and were shown at Mexico's first public congressional hearing on UFOs.

01:00:11.620 yeah so i'm just going to read the thread i got here because it's been mentioned on a few sites

01:00:17.440 but this is the the thread i read on twitter by uh kanakoa the great so breaking alleged

01:00:25.420 mummified alien corpse is displayed at mexico's congress today suspected to be a thousand years

01:00:32.160 old let me just say this don't love that they're a thousand years old right out the gate um in

01:00:38.100 terms of disclosure yeah whatever uh ufo enthusiasts celebrated a remarkable event today

01:00:44.800 in mexico city's congress led by journalist and ufologist jamie mausan uh this official

01:00:52.500 gathering unveiled two alleged non-human corpses and there's video here there's videos circulating

01:00:58.200 about this um these diminutive mummified remains retrieved from cuzco peru are believed to be a

01:01:05.360 thousand years old and were showcased in windowed boxes um here's the important part he emphasized

01:01:11.340 that the non-human specimens had recently undergone examination at the autonomous national university

01:01:18.380 in mexico yielding dna evidence through radiocarbon dating so i saw that i'm like that's

01:01:24.760 a suspicious name for university it is i looked it up but it's a legitimate university the national

01:01:31.780 autonomous university of mexico it is widely regarded as a top research university in latin

01:01:37.360 america so like this is this might be like mit level stuff i just wanted to look at him like oh

01:01:42.920 is this some for-profit thing take thing no it's a legitimate university and that's kind of

01:01:48.900 um the main headline here because within that tweet there's a community note and the community

01:01:56.180 note reads the alien mummy from nazga is a hoax and a fraud promoted by the known mexican journalist

01:02:02.400 and ufo grifter jamie masson a little editorialized if you ask me but then some people said and they

01:02:09.420 linked some articles from livescience.com and some people wrote oh no that that's before this the

01:02:16.140 update that they're giving is they did the radiocarbon dating and like what's interesting

01:02:22.360 is during i was watching this live and she's showing actual you know scans of the aliens now

01:02:31.320 if you're trying to tell me those scans are fake sure you know but he's speaking to the mexican

01:02:36.480 congress that's something and he's showing like the skeletal scans he's showing x-rays

01:02:43.760 when i'm talking about skeletal scans x-rays and radiocarbon dating and all kinds of other shit

01:02:49.100 you know so i'm like well that that's new info and that's kind of relevant now if it is a hoax

01:02:56.300 then it's a new type of hoax then they have to prove that the the scans and the data he's

01:03:01.340 bringing is faked they only had three fingers and elongated heads x-rays of the aliens were

01:03:08.140 also shown and experts say one of the bodies has eggs inside of it hmm maybe we're gonna have alien

01:03:13.660 babies a lot going on in peru yeah right so the okay so i read that they were fabricated from

01:03:22.860 pieces of many other animals so to me like it's it wouldn't be that hard to make make the scans

01:03:29.440 up i mean they could just be computer generated too like who knows right um the bigger thing is

01:03:34.400 like you said that they're linking the university to this so it's if it is a legitimate institution

01:03:40.720 then uh i want to hear from them like i want to hear them say it and then if the university says

01:03:47.400 oh yeah for sure we did the the tests then either show us some evidence like show us the data

01:03:51.900 or then the the question is either it's it's real or um the government has something big enough to

01:04:01.000 cover that they would go to these great lengths to create a new fraud because this is that's the

01:04:07.800 kind of the joke about it is like um the u.s congress does their ufo reveal which everybody

01:04:12.880 kind of says like oh you're just trying to cover for for the bidens and you know the collapsing

01:04:16.840 economy um so what the fuck is going on in mexico that they have to pull out alien mummies

01:04:22.560 yeah well and also i think you touched on something there which is what i was going to

01:04:27.880 get to that the timing does seem odd that this is being discussed right after the ufo disclosure in

01:04:35.320 america i think that's relevant yeah right for sure like if you know the fact that they're a

01:04:40.820 thousand years old again don't love that but then also you know it's it's the timing is a bit

01:04:46.800 suspicious and you know you i don't think we are being unreasonable by saying what are they trying

01:04:52.000 to cover up you know what what's what is to be gained from this i would like to know a bit more

01:04:57.520 about that as well but uh yeah i don't see i'm looking at some of these images like you said

01:05:03.480 that i'm assuming that they're legitimate because keep in mind it's impossible to tell at first

01:05:08.840 blush for the lay person it's impossible to tell a difference between a legitimate

01:05:14.700 scientific medical scan and just bad cgi that's that that's the thing that i fall back to a lot

01:05:21.340 of times and people kind of looking at the alien shit and like oh that could be done this way that

01:05:25.420 could be done that way it's like nigga it's 2023 anything could be done anyway like probably half

01:05:29.540 the stuff you see on the news which is not kind of uh falsifiable on its face like a picture of

01:05:35.320 an airliner or just two people eating lunch is all is actually also all fake so i mean yeah it's fake

01:05:41.320 but like what kind of fake was it somebody fraudulent produced it or the government produced

01:05:46.980 it or the university produced it or like or maybe it's maybe it's all real yeah i got just a tweet

01:05:54.120 here that i think summarizes it perfectly someone just uh this is from roaming rn not justifying

01:06:01.200 their existence or endorsing who they are i've never seen before i just like this image it says

01:06:05.640 i don't know if i'm being distracted by vaccine deaths so i don't notice inflation or if inflation

01:06:11.360 is the distraction to ukraine money laundering or if ukraine is a distraction for rampant

01:06:16.140 pedophilia or if the pedos are distracting me from election fraud

01:06:19.440 maybe you know what would be so awesome if ukraine and the pedos and the economy

01:06:27.680 none of that's real it's all just distraction and the aliens are real the only real thing

01:06:33.620 is the alien actually the economy's fine there are no pedos and ukraine is at peace

01:06:38.140 wouldn't that be heard here first judas endorses modern monetary theory yeah

01:06:42.700 which isn't real by the way none of this is real none of this is real none of this matters

01:06:50.820 yeah i don't know i just saw that like we once again we're breaking our rule of not talking

01:06:57.160 about developing stories but i i do have a i'm not sure this will develop because that's what's so

01:07:02.140 interesting about the ufo stuff these stories never go anywhere like not long ago we had

01:07:07.840 the most uh serious mainstream ufo disclosure that i think has ever existed and nothing happens

01:07:16.780 and it's an election season you think someone would mention it no one's mentioning it so in

01:07:20.440 a sense i'm like you know the story is probably going to go nowhere because you never hear about

01:07:25.900 it again yeah so you might as well you might as the election like more than a year from now though

01:07:30.700 i don't know we talked election season because now election season is like 18 months but i mean

01:07:36.780 they're kind of gearing up.

01:07:37.880 I think this shit will come up like next summer or next spring when it

01:07:41.460 starts to get a little warmer.

01:07:44.120 I just wanted,

01:07:45.380 I got the sense that I'm being sold a new type of Indian guy.

01:07:48.980 Yes.

01:07:49.700 As I'm only sold new types of Indian guys around election season.

01:07:55.580 And this one,

01:07:56.800 he's about family values and he's a Hindu,

01:08:00.760 but you know what?

01:08:01.920 What's more American than being Hindu?

01:08:03.920 That's what I'm being told.

01:08:04.900 nothing right now i got a lot of people saying you know jesus studied with buddha okay thank you

01:08:14.000 those are different things but whatever you got a pile of those on your desk you're trying to not

01:08:20.400 look at the little notes that say jesus went all over the world uh he went to america

01:08:28.800 and founded mormonism he brought a bunch of fucking shit down i think anyway so anyway that's

01:08:34.840 just i'm noticing it might be election season i'm not going to pay attention to the election season

01:08:38.640 as far as i know it's happening right now i wonder if donald trump's going to talk about it

01:08:43.080 oh man that okay you know what i don't care if he wins but hearing donald trump make a speech

01:08:49.280 in like ohio about aliens would be the greatest fucking thing no hey a presidential debate between

01:08:56.800 biden and trump about aliens this is the debate we need for a nation nay a civilization whoa that

01:09:05.560 is post-democracy what if rfk got the nomination it was rfk versus trump on aliens like that would

01:09:12.940 i would just shoot myself like the world is a simulation i want to wake up there's no way

01:09:16.680 that's that can't be real let's do that what if rfk gets the nomination and shoots a bitch in the

01:09:23.140 back of the head what if what just spitball in here folks we're just workshopping it

01:09:33.680 what if rfk gets the democratic nomination and kneels on a black man's neck until he dies

01:09:40.960 hmm yeah what if what what if a lot of big what ifs there

01:09:49.920 what if rfk jr beats hillary clinton to fucking death

01:09:56.580 here's what we figured out long ago like you said at the top of this we've been at this for a while

01:10:06.180 It's not a threat if it's a what-if scenario.

01:10:09.040 Yeah, what if.

01:10:10.180 I just want to know.

01:10:11.460 I'm curious.

01:10:12.600 I was talking about this the other day that culturally, we've never been at a more exciting point for terroristic threats.

01:10:21.440 And the reason is that our broad acceptance of multiverses.

01:10:25.260 I said, yeah, what a concept.

01:10:27.920 Yes.

01:10:28.140 you said multiverse is too heady a concept for you know the main consumers of entertainment which

01:10:35.420 is women and children you're trying to tell what a woman a multiverse is even like seven years ago

01:10:41.380 she's calling the cops on you and you're getting your guns taken away now that's all anyone talks

01:10:47.020 about is alternate timelines multiverse is dimensions so now we could phrase whatever

01:10:52.100 threat we want in the form of

01:10:54.320 a multiverse proposition.

01:10:57.780 The moment we taught bitches about decision

01:11:00.280 trees was a moment we can

01:11:02.280 literally get away with

01:11:04.380 murder.

01:11:10.360 Speaking of a bunch of

01:11:12.260 bullshit bodies being dug up,

01:11:14.980 I got one. This is a couple weeks old,

01:11:18.260 but we've covered this on the show.

01:11:20.200 we posted a clip concerning this on our telegram and i believe on our twitter as well at legally

01:11:26.380 ironic and blood satellite show on telegram here's the headline for you uh from this year

01:11:33.240 no human remains found two years after claims of mass graves in canada go figure that's interesting

01:11:41.560 after two years of this is from the new york post after two years of horror stories about the

01:11:47.100 alleged mass graves of Indigenous children at residential schools across Canada, a series of

01:11:53.740 recent excavations at the suspected sites have turned up no human remains. Some academics and

01:12:00.440 politicians say it's further evidence that the stories are unproven. Now, maybe we can phrase

01:12:06.900 that a different way. It's not, it's a strange way of saying it's further evidence that the stories

01:12:12.940 are unproven as if there was already a lot of evidence that they're unproven what you're

01:12:19.400 saying is there's no evidence that it happened yes yes like there was no evidence and this is

01:12:26.740 further no evidence like there was we found further no evidence it is such a stupid way

01:12:33.780 to phrase it breaking additional no evidence found uh a group the other thing i like they're

01:12:43.440 already talking about it like oh they they intend to do more like this the one that was recently

01:12:50.100 done was not at oh fuck what was it cam loops not wet so wet right it was cam loops they no

01:12:56.840 dude i think they didn't they didn't do cam loops they did another one but everybody wants to talk

01:13:00.140 with cam loops because that's where like the 212 kids would or whatever but it's like they haven't

01:13:04.380 dug up cam loops but they're certain that they must be at cam loops even though they use the

01:13:08.120 same ground penetrating radar on every site and all the sites where it showed up like 100 bodies

01:13:12.780 that they dug up it's it's rocks but they're certain no it's definitely going to be this one

01:13:17.660 it's you know what it is it's literally the canadian holocaust like you you know like leading

01:13:22.320 up to the current holocaust story there were all of these other death camps but the death camps that

01:13:27.660 were investigated by the americans all had to get removed from the story because we have the

01:13:31.660 evidence that they weren't fucking death camps so the young death camps we have left now are the

01:13:35.980 ones that were taken by the communists who are the ones that wrote the fucking books on it and

01:13:39.900 allowed to happen it'll be funny the canadian soldiers first you know breaching the perimeter

01:13:45.980 of auschwitz prison and opening the gas chambers buddy it's just rocks it's a bunch of rocks

01:13:52.820 it's the couple of rocks all the ovens is full of fucking rocks

01:13:57.000 what about what about this room full of shoes i don't fucking know

01:14:02.260 jews don't wear shoes is she what is that what a boot is it a boot yeah yeah don't

01:14:13.740 don't never ask a man what he makes a woman her age or if jews wear shoes

01:14:19.680 another thing is gonna get your fucking guns taken away it's all right but no that's the

01:14:26.460 headline here so i'm gonna try and read this phrase some kind of indian gobbledygook i tell

01:14:33.740 you what i was in toronto not long ago last week and i had like some kind of aboriginal

01:14:38.700 writing on the side of a building i tell you i laughed until i stopped it's been so we got

01:14:45.020 It's like they just

01:14:54.720 tried to be Japanese but weren't good at it.

01:14:57.840 This is the name of a group. A group of indigenous people also

01:15:00.740 known as the Pine Creek First Nation, just say that, excavated

01:15:04.780 14 sites in the basement of Our Lady of Seven

01:15:08.640 Sorrows Catholic Church. Seven Sorrows is right. Near the Pine

01:15:12.640 creek residential school the so-called anomalies were first detected using ground penetrating radar

01:15:18.880 but uh reveal no remains to be found uh they were just a bunch of fucking rocks which to me

01:15:26.580 not only casts doubt on this entire story but on ground penetrating radar period because it would

01:15:35.680 seem that the only reason you would have ground penetrating radar is to have is to avoid shit

01:15:41.200 like this you know what i mean like i guess you can tell when there's like bedrock or something

01:15:45.600 but like like just have you seen have you seen ground penetrating radar it's a fish finder you

01:15:51.180 know what a fish finder is all it is is it shows like a blip and anybody who operates the system

01:15:57.240 will tell you the blip isn't a body it's just a change in like density and material makeup at

01:16:02.900 that spot it could be a hole it could be an aquifer it could be a rock it could be a stump

01:16:07.260 it could be fucking anything it could be anything so the fact the real story here is that the news

01:16:13.960 media will trot out ground penetrating radar and use the word proof in the same sentence just get a

01:16:21.340 fucking shovel man it's only six feet down christ yeah anytime and they were fighting digging them

01:16:28.300 up too and they did the same thing of course because you dig them up there they know there's

01:16:32.360 no bodies down there like this is this is the canadian holocaust they can't have evidence

01:16:36.980 because otherwise they lose their fucking story and that's the funniest thing it's like up until

01:16:42.620 now i guess none of these aboriginal families knew their kids were missing because you never

01:16:47.820 hear about it until you know what like i don't want to they'll say it's oral history but it's

01:16:51.840 like it turns out that we didn't really hear about it until recently because none of these families

01:16:55.820 noticed their kids didn't come home like i don't know like there's no evidence

01:17:00.100 you understand that like you you need to show me do they have a letter from the school saying

01:17:05.500 sorry we killed your kid none of them have that so it's like you really haven't noticed a dip

01:17:12.580 in the population or you would also know any of this stuff if they wrote anything down i don't

01:17:16.820 think the kids even existed to be honest with you i don't think the kids i don't think most

01:17:21.300 these kids are even real also like there's this idea that residential schools were just made for

01:17:26.720 like indian kids but it's like no they were residential schools it was for anyone who lived

01:17:31.480 in the area so you would have these residential schools that were full of white kids and they're

01:17:36.240 full of like whatever mishmash we're living out there like italian kids it's like oh they made

01:17:40.120 them learn english yeah they made a bunch of italian and ukrainian kids learn english too

01:17:44.040 because they're in fucking canada by the way i had to learn french we all had to fucking learn

01:17:48.980 french so suck my dick and so i think can you believe they made them forget their culture well

01:17:55.840 apparently not really what they did was teach you how to write it's not like they made you to forget

01:18:01.380 how to write in your language because you didn't have a written fucking language yeah you barely

01:18:07.020 even understood let me just say this also the europeans are the first people to actually learn

01:18:12.840 how to talk to birds we trained birds we trained hawks we have parrots so get spare me this shit

01:18:19.700 that you are the guys who are at one with nature and can communicate with animals no only white

01:18:25.060 people know how to communicate with animals the embarrassing thing is they've been sitting out

01:18:28.880 there in the woods talking to these fucking birds the whole time the birds are like what

01:18:32.300 what are you they were so happy when white people showed up shit finally somebody to talk to god

01:18:40.220 birds love white people everyone knows it and they don't they just try to ignore it like have

01:18:45.700 you seen an indian actually try and talk to a crow crow looks like i want to blow its fucking brains

01:18:50.500 out show a show a fucking indian guy a parrot what's he gonna do he's gonna short circuit he's

01:18:58.600 gonna his fucking brains are gonna melt out of his he's gonna do a hop skip and a jump into a

01:19:05.600 river full of logs i reckon but you show show a white guy a parrot he's gonna teach us some cool

01:19:10.740 shit to say immediately the thing they always bring up about the residential schools forcing

01:19:16.100 the kids to speak english and not be able to speak their home language is so weird because it's like

01:19:21.180 in any other case with an immigrant group right this is obvious like this is what you're supposed

01:19:28.360 to do because you're trying to integrate the person into your society so the only difference

01:19:32.320 here is that these people who were trying to integrate aren't immigrants they were actually

01:19:36.680 there before us it's like okay but the goal is identical you're taking people who are not

01:19:43.860 integrated in your civilization not because they came from another continent but because they came

01:19:48.040 from the hillside and you need to force them to read the bible and speak english and wear shoes

01:19:54.700 and yeah if you don't force them to they're going to regress this is called civilization

01:19:59.720 um and it's just wild that like we fought them they lost we had the the english decency to not

01:20:07.500 massacre them and we tried to integrate them at great cost and this is the thanks that we get

01:20:14.380 also let me just say we've covered this before in some level of detail but it's important to

01:20:20.260 recognize that they requested this the entire residential school system was done at the behest

01:20:26.300 of the aboriginal leaders because they had said look you guys are industrializing you're blowing

01:20:32.960 gold over the place we want to cut we want involved we're not going to let you push us to

01:20:37.300 the margins you better be giving us that education for free that that's the entire indian act that's

01:20:42.980 why it lasted so long that's why residential schools were there until the fucking 90s

01:20:47.480 because like the premise was something that indians fought for because what were you supposed

01:20:52.700 to do just like leave them in the woods that's that that would be the worst thing ever so it's

01:20:56.120 like okay we're going to teach you our language we're going to teach you skills we're going to

01:20:59.520 train you we're gonna teach you math you didn't have math you didn't have like you didn't know

01:21:05.260 how to read a fucking map sorry uh you didn't know how to like do do all kinds of shit so we

01:21:10.320 taught you for free and then you know not to relitigate this whole thing but anyway that's

01:21:17.320 that's the other thing is we and you're right we have been over it many times talking about

01:21:21.580 the aboriginals is not talking about like when we went to china or even when we went to india

01:21:26.640 when we dealt with the real indians as much as we hate indians they had some semblance of

01:21:32.000 civilization like they did have a written language they did have you know bricks you know and i think

01:21:40.160 and soap i think but like this is not this with the aboriginals they were literally living in

01:21:46.680 grass huts and did not have a written language we had to we had to make a written language for them

01:21:52.140 So let me just say this. The reason I brought this up isn't just a retread over this ground. It's that I was thinking about this the other day and I consider that what really ground my gears was the headline that gets lost in the wash here.

01:22:08.180 it's that something to the tune of 85 churches were burned in the wake of this um the churches

01:22:15.220 were burned in revenge of this happening and then of course all of the protests all of the defacing

01:22:22.780 all the statues of sir john mcdonald being pulled down and all this bullshit orange shirt day all

01:22:29.580 this stuff but it's the church burnings it's the church burnings that really got me and it's the

01:22:33.780 I THINK IT'S AN ACCEPTABLE ARSON THAT NO ONE IS REALLY BLAMING THE ABORIGINALS FOR THIS.

01:22:39.400 WELL, THEY'RE BURNING CATHOLIC AND ANGLICAN CHURCHES IN RECENT DAYS.

01:22:43.220 LEFTIST GROUPS ARE.

01:22:44.520 BUT CANADA'S LEADERS AREN'T CONDEMNING THE BURNING OF CHURCHES.

01:22:47.380 NO, THEY'RE ENDORSING THE BURNING OF CHURCHES.

01:22:49.840 THE HEAD OF THE BRITISH COLUMBIA CIVIL LIBERTY ASSOCIATION, A MONSTER CALLED HARSHOWALIA, TWEETED THIS,

01:22:55.880 QUOTE, BURN IT ALL DOWN.

01:22:59.000 THEN A CLOSE CONFIDENT OF THE PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA, JUSTIN TRUDEAU, A MAN CALLED GERALD BUTTS,

01:23:03.160 called the arson, and we're quoting now, understandable.

01:23:07.520 A woman called Heidi Matthews, meanwhile, of Harvard Law School,

01:23:10.960 described the attacks as, quote,

01:23:12.600 the right of resistance to systemic injustice, burning churches.

01:23:18.020 Red paint remains on the doors of Calgary's Grace Presbyterian Church.

01:23:23.000 Its pastor says the church is still not sure how best to respond.

01:23:27.660 We're even thinking about maybe leaving the paint up for a while,

01:23:30.360 just as a way of trying to cover this up.

01:23:32.600 but recognizing that we have a place in this in this story. Churches across the country have

01:23:39.880 been targeted in a series of vandalism or arson attacks in recent weeks following the discovery

01:23:45.240 of unmarked graves near residential schools operated by the catholic church. And everyone

01:23:50.600 knows that's what it was it was either them directly or as groups affiliated with them

01:23:54.200 maybe it was white people what I'm saying is that it's in the interest of revenge for this

01:24:00.200 and i was thinking you know we talk oh we always talk about things that could be done

01:24:06.440 um and how to organize and i'm like this seems like something that myself and maybe some others

01:24:14.440 could really sink our teeth into like i think this could actually be something that you hold

01:24:21.240 politicians to account over i know people are going to say why bother that's pissing in the

01:24:26.520 wind right but i really do think like maybe if you got a group of people together volunteers

01:24:32.480 to really hammer this point to your local mps your mpps whoever mayors whoever the fuck listen

01:24:40.220 like no these churches were burned and this is why and this is evidence that nothing was there

01:24:46.140 this is a bullshit fucking fraud and then there's actual property damage and it was a hate crime i

01:24:52.160 think you can make the case that it was a intolerance towards religion whatever the

01:24:58.100 language you need to cloak it in like this was obviously targeting christians and this was

01:25:02.300 obviously done by political activist groups like i want you to i want you to talk about it i want

01:25:08.800 you to drill this in the fucking press i want something to be done and maybe this is just uh

01:25:14.820 again maybe it's just pissing in the wind but i'm like this seems like something as an experiment we

01:25:20.300 could really try and hammer home just to remind people of what happened because it's insane how

01:25:27.460 much was you were targeted you're targeted for your faith by these hostile in groups and

01:25:34.400 individuals so like what are we going to do about it it'd be nice to go back and find all of the

01:25:39.100 people who because there were a lot of them like last year it was at last last summer was it last

01:25:44.500 summer that we had all the church burnings and there were a lot of people that were kind of

01:25:47.620 saying almost like a fuck around and find out attitude like well you know i'm not i'm not saying

01:25:53.180 you should burn churches but i mean uh this is what happens when you murder a bunch of kids i

01:25:56.880 guess that's what happens to your churches yeah at the time everyone knew that's why it was

01:26:02.020 happening so this is what you get it's just what you get for murdering all our kids well you know

01:26:06.580 what it turns out that is a fraud so not only is it a fraud that was meant to and was successful

01:26:12.940 in discrediting uh our whole civilization but it's a it is a fraud and it's false but also you

01:26:19.420 literally burnt churches down so somebody should pay like it at the very least the reputational

01:26:25.280 damage should be you know reversed back onto them they'll say you know this is what you get

01:26:30.780 well what do you get now yeah what the fuck you got i know what you should get i have some ideas

01:26:36.880 on what i would like to give you but i'm trying to come up with a reasonable answer like let's go

01:26:43.120 let's check everything we've tried let's try everything let's actually try the legal route

01:26:48.780 but i'm like well you guys didn't think anything you thought just property damage and arson and

01:26:54.980 targeting innocent people was acceptable and also funny there's a lot of things that i think would

01:27:00.700 be funny let's not talk about them right now but there's a lot of stuff that i think that i think

01:27:06.220 would be justified and funny that we could do back and it would be easy and it wouldn't take

01:27:10.900 that many fucking people but let's just try and like remind people what happened but i think

01:27:15.780 that's that's kind of why i wanted to bring it up anyway we got to move on we got to move on to

01:27:21.180 this will be the last book in our little i don't know what you would call it i didn't want to

01:27:27.660 become an mmt arg it was just supposed to be sort of a general economics discussion about stuff that

01:27:33.880 we hadn't come because you can discuss stuff from the past like what's being discussed now this is

01:27:37.940 like mmt is what any for everyone's talking about whether for it or against it right but i found

01:27:44.000 this other book that i think you'll like a lot more um there's parts of it that i disagree with

01:27:52.200 but there's a lot of good that's in here and i think it will cross a lot of boundaries for

01:27:56.960 listeners of the show who might be on the fence about some of the issues but the book is titled

01:28:02.680 geopolitical alpha the subtitle is an investment framework for predicting the future it's by

01:28:09.460 marco popic this was given to me by some people some more economics minded people in our scene

01:28:16.280 and this it's not really an economic theory it's not an ideology it's not really trying to tell

01:28:22.880 you how money works it's coming from the perspective of someone who's a bit more of a

01:28:26.940 speculator who's worked at investment firms and he's trying to tie together these two worlds

01:28:33.400 of economics and geopolitics and also behavioral economics and psychology and he does it in a very

01:28:42.740 interesting way because what i like about this is he's like you know what a lot of people like

01:28:49.040 to predict geopolitical events a lot of people like to forecast what's going to happen in the

01:28:53.840 world or retroactively explain why something happened he said well if you really believe

01:28:59.240 in what you're forecasting would you put money on it because there's ways if you're truly convinced

01:29:05.620 you know how the world works geopolitically you know which way the winds are changing

01:29:09.660 there's things you can bet on and you can make money on it you know you can you can tell if a

01:29:15.880 certain decision being made in a government is going to like tank their currency you can predict

01:29:22.760 that and bet against that market a lot of people don't a lot of people like to retroactively

01:29:27.880 say of course this was destined to happen well you know how many people are actually willing to

01:29:32.200 predict what's going to happen and put money on it and if you do think like that perhaps the way

01:29:39.560 the world works is less about holistic ideology and more about really subtle behaviors and i'll

01:29:44.440 explain what he means by that it is almost all the time that i've been right in markets has been

01:29:51.480 moving against the geopolitical relevance you know i know a lot of a lot of people find this

01:29:56.520 surprising when they talk to me the first time they're like oh he's a geopolitical guy he's

01:29:59.560 going to tell me how china u.s conflict matters how ukraine matters so this matters so that matters

01:30:03.560 and most of the time when i've had compelling geopolitical alpha views it's because i pushed

01:30:08.520 against the view that it matters because in the short term in the short term jay powell is so much

01:30:13.720 more powerful than vladimir putin and so i would argue that my entire book which is really a

01:30:19.240 framework for generating geopolitical alpha is cute and sexy and useful and people should read it but

01:30:24.680 the truth behind being a successful investment strategist off of politics and geopolitics is

01:30:30.200 finding geopolitical beta which is getting those huge macro shifts that are driven by paradigm

01:30:36.920 shifts in geopolitics and politics um where something that you've taken for granted for

01:30:41.800 like a decade is suddenly undermined so he kind of sets the stage by saying there's there was

01:30:49.080 was an old way of seeing economics and then there's a new way and this is sort of related

01:30:54.720 what we're talking about with mmt and he's not saying whether it's good or bad but i think you'll

01:30:59.640 like this part because it does seem obvious from where i'm standing anyway he's saying like you

01:31:04.500 know back in the mid 20th century laissez-faire economics was much more popular the reagan

01:31:10.680 thatcher type of economics it's very popular however in the modern era the more modern era

01:31:17.080 rather that won out over the previous form of economics which was like french socialist economics

01:31:23.000 after and that was after the fall of the soviets and stuff this was called the washington consensus

01:31:27.880 the washington consensus was this sort of american laissez-faire economic model the markets are king

01:31:33.240 and everything um and it kind of put capitalist economics as a standard and at that point 1980

01:31:40.040 saw this adoption of these best practices that many economists and journalists and kind of

01:31:46.520 professors have dubbed the washington consensus that was a really really important moment in

01:31:52.600 history and then from 85 to 90 the soviet union collapses so as the west is adopting these policies

01:31:58.840 of capitalism the alternative which is institutionalized socialism and communism

01:32:05.400 collapses and so then the rest of the world says well which which system work we'll take the

01:32:10.360 washington consensus and that's when the imf and the world bank starts propagating this set of best

01:32:14.920 practices around the world however with the end in this was written very recently in the past

01:32:22.680 couple years at the end of american hegemony the rise of political multi-polarity in the world

01:32:28.840 which we discussed with you know the the geopolitics books like uh peter zyhan and whatnot

01:32:34.920 uh and after we've reached the apex of globalization we're starting to see the end of

01:32:40.920 laissez-faire economics which defined the 2010s which kind of ended during the great recession

01:32:47.800 now what we're seeing is a new form of economics emerge that's more centrally planned and i think

01:32:53.640 you would find this interesting because you've kind of noticed this the scene you've noticed that

01:32:57.560 a lot of the conservatives and even look at the conservatives now and the far-right people

01:33:01.800 now more than ever i think there's more of an acceptance of what you and i might call socialism

01:33:07.640 like if you look at the i don't like it but it's a correct observation yeah if you look at the

01:33:12.280 republicans now you're seeing the republicans for the first time in christ i don't know like

01:33:15.700 half a century really open to the idea of socialist economic policy arguably centrally

01:33:21.480 planned he's like well guess what that's kind of happening everywhere whether you like it or not

01:33:26.680 and he said that's going to be one economic trend that's going to define the next 10 years for

01:33:30.860 better or worse so he's like if you're placing a bet bet on that um and he says one thing a lot of

01:33:39.640 the former economists aren't really equipped to deal with new economics he said you know what

01:33:45.980 the laissez-faire system and american dominance allowed economists to be very lazy he called it

01:33:52.300 the quant obsession uh the quantum session is you just you just look at market flows and mathematics

01:33:58.220 And this was, you know, when you watch stuff like, you know, the big short or anything to do with the housing crisis, you're used to economics talking about like we can remove everything and just look at data.

01:34:09.500 He says that era is ending. The idea where you can just look at graphs is kind of ending.

01:34:15.600 And you could do that because the markets were relatively stable because of American dominance and global multipolarity.

01:34:21.380 polarity and in a sense the end of globalization maybe not the end of globalization but like peak

01:34:27.960 globalization where more countries are involved and there's no one clear leader it's like

01:34:32.300 you cannot remove other factors from the equation so classical economists are not going to be

01:34:38.900 equipped to deal with this new world um he actually has a name for them he's called newtonian

01:34:45.200 investors newtonian investors are individuals attracted to investing through engineering

01:34:50.320 and mathematics and only look at economics through mathematical models uh he says this

01:34:55.680 is just as dangerous as ideologically driven people um and then you know because we deal

01:35:02.320 with those people who hate ideologies like if you're just data driven that's even worse because

01:35:06.000 you've got to factor in other stuff too if you go to um and a former member of the intelligence

01:35:13.340 world or a former politician they're rarely going to talk to you about what they can't do

01:35:19.560 because they've spent their whole lives trying to overcome that.

01:35:23.440 And, you know, like, that's why we elect many of these people.

01:35:25.900 That's why we hired them, so they can do better than their constraints.

01:35:29.300 And so they're wired in a certain way.

01:35:31.280 Then on the other side, you have the investment community.

01:35:33.220 When the investment community tries to approach geopolitics,

01:35:36.700 again, because the last 40 years were so clear for many investors

01:35:40.580 what they needed to learn, and they basically needed to get a CFA,

01:35:44.040 they needed to know how to value things, you know, mathematically.

01:35:47.400 Like it became very a mathematical routine kind of a job that very few of them really

01:35:54.280 looked at geopolitics and politics in a systematic way.

01:35:58.160 And so they started to think of geopolitics as a realm of voodoo, where you got to go

01:36:02.420 and find a former politician to tell you what's happening, you know?

01:36:05.860 And so you have this real mismatch in cultures where on one hand investors are extremely

01:36:11.160 systematic, framework driven, objective, quantitative. But when they're faced with

01:36:17.520 geopolitics and politics, they suddenly become like chicken on trail readers.

01:36:22.720 And he gives an example of how these people end up in charge. He says,

01:36:25.740 the problem with political consultancy firms is that they use the intelligence model where they

01:36:31.440 usually hire retired technocrats and policymakers, which means that they are decoupled from the

01:36:38.160 machine and have less access to the data that they would if they were not retired there.

01:36:42.820 And then they usually just regurgitate the news and don't do much analytics and research. So a

01:36:48.160 lot of these like financial firms, they hire like old bureaucrats to like tell them what's going on

01:36:53.180 and they don't know if the fuck's going on. You know, they know as they retire or they leave the

01:36:57.580 main arena that they're dealing with, they don't know much more than anybody else. They can kind

01:37:02.340 to give you their gut feeling but not much more than that um so he's talking about this new form

01:37:09.920 we need a new model to deal with the new economics and it can't just be mathematics and it can't just

01:37:14.640 be like retired bureaucrats and he's got this phrase that he says in the book that kind of

01:37:20.340 summarizes his entire worldview he says identifying a macro model for identifying political trends

01:37:27.480 is built on the following maximum because that's what you want to do you want to identify political

01:37:31.700 trends because the political trends will allow you to kind of chart the economics as well he says

01:37:37.380 preferences are optional and subject to constraint whereas constraints are neither optional nor

01:37:45.200 subject to preference so in other words he's like saying you know people can say what they want to

01:37:51.100 but there's certain material constraints that you can't fucking ignore and material constraints can

01:37:57.360 be defined in a lot of different ways but he says people can't think their way out of material

01:38:02.980 constraints he actually says material constraints birth thoughts this is kind of a marxist way of

01:38:08.280 looking at it but um he says if you know there's an interplay between the two but if you actually

01:38:13.300 look at the material constraints you will have higher diagnosticity than preferences for judging

01:38:20.360 political events so that don't just listen to what people say look at kind of the forces that

01:38:25.240 they're subject to and that might be you know pressures from different markets pressures from

01:38:30.480 how much land do they own or what's their industry like like they can say they want a revolution

01:38:35.780 can they have a revolution is it realistic that they can do it because you know like because what

01:38:42.300 they're saying will always come up against what they're able to do and it's easier to judge what

01:38:46.580 they're able to do in the short term than what their grand goals are and it's interesting that

01:38:53.360 But in an era driven by data, you would think that the more data you have, the more we should

01:38:58.940 be able to forecast political events or geopolitical events or an economy collapsing or a huge

01:39:05.500 year for growth or something like that.

01:39:08.000 But there's this line he has when he's referring to intelligence analysis.

01:39:11.900 It's given by the CIA's former director, Richard Hewer.

01:39:16.440 He says, having more information does not necessarily help one forecast.

01:39:21.260 That's where judgment kind of fills the gaps.

01:39:23.360 And the quality of information, which is measured by diagnosticity, is more important.

01:39:30.680 So it's like the more data you have flowing in doesn't really matter.

01:39:34.980 It's actually picking and choosing which data flows to look at.

01:39:38.360 And he says, an analysis of financial trends over the decades saw that each decade was kind of anchored by a big geopolitical event that had market forces dancing around it.

01:39:50.480 and you could more accurately um judge you can kind of like annihilate the concept of black

01:39:57.340 swans with proper geopolitical forecasting because that's one thing we never talked about when we

01:40:01.320 talked about black swans um there's this idea that black swans are inevitable but even nasim

01:40:07.020 talib makes a claim that you know black swans shouldn't be the standard like there's no reason

01:40:12.560 like there's certain things that are unpredictable but there's a lot of things that we think are

01:40:16.180 unpredictable that shouldn't be unpredictable yeah there's a lot of things that were predicted

01:40:20.980 by a lot of people and just the way society is organized those people weren't listened to so

01:40:25.140 yeah there's probably there's probably an upper limit of black swans that are just outside of our

01:40:29.360 you know abilities to predict but there's i would say there's a majority of them

01:40:33.480 could be predictive if society was organized and he gives a few examples in the book just

01:40:38.680 to contextualize what i'm talking about um some big ones that everyone got wrong

01:40:43.680 first one is no one foresaw donald trump winning the election how the fuck did that happen that

01:40:51.460 was a famous one where this every statistician was fucking wrong i don't think nate silver ever

01:40:58.000 recovered from that fucking nate silver i haven't heard that name he's been he's been running from

01:41:04.460 that ever since there's certain things so he's kind of he's giving you the scenario where like

01:41:11.200 a lot of times politicians will talk about big changes and revolutions. But the moment they get

01:41:16.820 into power, you don't see any of that shit happen. Part of it is they could be liars. A lot of them

01:41:23.180 are just, of course, liars saying whatever they can to get into power. But a lot of them might

01:41:28.300 genuinely believe it and get there and realize that the practicality of the situation is that,

01:41:33.440 look, okay, I get that you might want to be a sovereign entity. But if you're a sovereign

01:41:37.580 that means that your currency is going to collapse that's going to mean that capital flows turn off

01:41:43.440 and that the country is not going to exist anymore and those are like material like material concerns

01:41:48.220 would be like like oh if you make this country your enemy they stop giving you oil that's like

01:41:54.640 an easy one right so it's like you can talk like a big china does this all the time this is a k

01:41:59.940 perfect case study in china a lot of this anti-western sentiment anti-american sentiment

01:42:05.600 The people love hearing it.

01:42:08.640 But we talked about this with the disunited nations.

01:42:12.120 Do you foresee a world where China shuts itself off from the Western marketplace?

01:42:18.360 No, they can talk like they do.

01:42:19.700 They can talk like they hate the West and they want to create this whole new ecosystem.

01:42:23.860 But it's like you're into factually, practically, your entire economy is reliant on the American marketplace.

01:42:29.820 and anyone internally in China that seriously tries to threaten that will get shot in the back

01:42:35.160 of the head right now. Like, and that's a material concern. That's just like, that's where the money

01:42:39.860 is. That's where the trade is. Like you can't really turn that off. You can say you will,

01:42:43.620 but you actually went, what I would bet against that. You will make money if you bet against

01:42:49.540 China's bullshit and how they actually behave. Well, I mean that China has not tried to provoke

01:42:57.360 the US.

01:42:58.480 There's retaliatory tariffs, which everybody knew they were going to put them on.

01:43:01.540 It's face-saving measures.

01:43:04.220 You have a situation in Hong Kong, they are being very strategically patient about.

01:43:10.300 I think that's interesting.

01:43:11.800 I think it shows a degree of patient thinking, strategic thinking, same with rare earth.

01:43:17.860 They could have used that as a tool much more bluntly.

01:43:21.640 They just floated the idea, which we always knew was on the menu as one of the retaliatory

01:43:25.900 moves.

01:43:26.900 haven't targeted any American company more than they have over the last 10 years.

01:43:31.100 There hasn't been a tick up in official non-tariff barriers to trade.

01:43:34.780 In fact, what they've done over the last 12 and 18 months is try to accelerate the opening

01:43:38.020 of different sectors.

01:43:39.380 They are trying to placate the US by passing through some of the offers they've given previous

01:43:45.340 administrations like the Obama administration will expand our negative list, will put more

01:43:50.340 industries, will open up more of them.

01:43:53.300 They are doing that behind the scenes.

01:43:54.960 So I think that they could have been a lot tougher in the negotiations.

01:43:58.420 And I think their strategic patience suggests that maybe they have, you know, they've been

01:44:02.520 hit by President Trump.

01:44:04.380 And they're saying like, oh, well, maybe it wasn't our moment right now.

01:44:07.340 Maybe we need another decade.

01:44:09.780 Just like like North Korea, it's like, oh, they might nuke America, I'm like, I would

01:44:13.780 bet against that, like they, they're, even they're not that fucking stupid.

01:44:19.160 So imagine, imagine everyone kind of gets that.

01:44:21.220 imagine north korea in a bunch you can judge every country like north korea because come back to the

01:44:26.780 maximum like preferences are subject more to constraints than you might think and you can

01:44:31.360 bet easier based on the constraints another example was what they called a black swan event

01:44:37.280 no one could predict it was um everyone being wrong on the argentinian election um which was

01:44:43.400 people were believing insiders there was too many people listening to like the wrong types of people

01:44:48.540 of the inside of relaying too much information on perceived intelligence um he says there's a

01:44:55.900 system that he uses because he's trying to give you a practical model here he said the system

01:45:00.480 that he uses to gauge political capital and by political capital you mean let's say a leader

01:45:06.500 wants to do something and you're betting whether or not he can do it whether or not he can meet

01:45:12.200 those constraints he says here's the model to whether or not he can make the political decision

01:45:16.580 It's popularity, time and power, legislative math, like whether or not they control the Congress or the Senate or the Supreme Court, that stuff that's on a country by country basis.

01:45:28.460 The economic context, whether or not you're in a crisis or a recession or something, the support of special interest groups and kind of what he calls the global momentum.

01:45:39.840 them. These are all factored in together. So that's why you can look at something like Donald

01:45:44.140 Trump, where it's like, okay, he wants to do this. Well, how long has he been in power? Does he have

01:45:50.100 a lot of good capital, a lot of negative capital? Okay. Are they currently going through a recession?

01:45:55.920 He's got the Congress. He doesn't have the Senate. Does that matter? But also, do you have special

01:46:02.560 interest group supports? And that's something Trump never had. And people always forget that.

01:46:06.280 Also, you might recall a long time ago when we were talking about coups, whether or not a military could successfully take over a nation, you need the buy-in of a lot of special interest groups to grant you power.

01:46:22.800 And where a lot of coups fail is they forget about the church, they forget about the unions, they forget about the special interest groups, and that's where they fucking fail.

01:46:31.660 So you can actually look at the success rate, the success of whether or not a leader can do something, whether or not you can kind of detect if those groups are against him, which Trump unfortunately did.

01:46:42.900 And whether or not you like Trump, whether or not you think, well, he's got the he's got his people in Congress for a brief window of time.

01:46:49.820 It's like, well, he doesn't have all this other stuff. And that's I would bet against him doing a lot of what he wants to do.

01:46:54.960 So again, if you bet against Trump doing what he wanted to do, you'd make money on that.

01:47:02.860 And then there's other macroeconomic constraints that are bundled in there, too, like what's

01:47:07.940 the unemployment level?

01:47:09.540 What are the exports like?

01:47:10.880 What's the currency valued at?

01:47:13.660 So these are all constraints.

01:47:14.780 So before you judge whether or not a political action or a revolution or anything is going

01:47:21.180 to take place, run it through that list.

01:47:22.900 let's list the act the boring constraints the stuff that you can find data on and try and see

01:47:28.660 like the likelihood or whether or not they'll pull back at the last minute you know and you'll see

01:47:34.280 this with like boris johnson was a great example when like the brexit negotiations are explained

01:47:39.340 by this thinking like like you can watch in real time how these negotiations are like i'm asking

01:47:45.040 for this and then he pivots at the last minute because he realizes that he doesn't have this

01:47:49.200 where he doesn't have he they actually can't do what they wanted to say but they can do some

01:47:54.340 things like the entire brexit's explained by this also explains why everyone called brexit wrong

01:47:59.060 now why do they call brexit wrong well he introduces this theory that i like

01:48:03.260 and i've i've been thinking about it a lot but he calls it medium of median voter theory mvt

01:48:10.720 um and this is how he met he actually did predict trump winning and uh also brexit

01:48:18.020 while every single analyst believed it wasn't possible.

01:48:23.340 He had said, in essence, MVT, Media and Voter Theory,

01:48:27.020 dictates that people base their choices on single policy decisions

01:48:31.080 and within a single policy dimension.

01:48:35.360 And people kind of know this.

01:48:37.380 People think that every election is kind of a story.

01:48:39.540 There's a lot of people talking about a lot of things,

01:48:41.860 but there's usually one thing that the average voter cares about.

01:48:46.320 It's hard to tell what the average voter is in America, but it's still pretty much like a white guy, a white person.

01:48:54.060 You know, that'll change over time.

01:48:56.040 But especially for the Trump election, that was that was the one group that they said was not important.

01:49:01.520 The median voter is the voter in the middle or the most centrist voter, or you could say, in a way, the most typical voter in society.

01:49:09.140 And here, imagine you have a normal distribution of voters with a lot of individuals clustered here in the center, a smaller number with more extreme left-wing views and a smaller number with more extreme right-wing views.

01:49:23.220 What's the central issue of the day?

01:49:26.260 And imagine what their position on it is.

01:49:28.520 So, and he has got this line here.

01:49:30.700 He says, the median voter is the price maker.

01:49:33.400 Policies are price takers.

01:49:35.340 So, you know, they still try to figure out what the median voter cares about.

01:49:38.140 Now, in the case of Trump, he said, you know, on our side, on the right, we would say the issue of the day was, you know, migration, the great replacement.

01:49:49.780 And he says it kind of like that.

01:49:51.220 But what it really was writ large was globalism.

01:49:54.360 I think that's fair.

01:49:55.960 I think it's fair if you look at across the board what Trump was about.

01:49:59.320 It was a lot of anti-globalization.

01:50:01.760 And the migrant stuff is bundled up in that.

01:50:03.820 it's more trade protectionism bringing jobs back it's about you know being firm new tariffs

01:50:12.320 new walls we're not we're not going to be in this globalist world anymore it's anti-globalism

01:50:17.700 and a lot of people were on the same page about that it might not be explicitly about race but

01:50:22.400 race is bundled in there as well and that's why i think we talked about this on the show recently

01:50:27.180 and i think that's true do you think that's true first of all yeah yeah absolutely that's actually

01:50:32.420 a really good way to frame it and i'm kind of surprised it wasn't framed that way or it still

01:50:38.120 isn't you know often framed that way it would be better you know it doesn't explain everything but

01:50:45.200 you could place a bet on which way the winds you think are turning with the median voter

01:50:50.380 and kind of tell which which way you should be moving as well now might not predict every single

01:50:56.180 decision, but you can judge with accuracy certain outcomes. And so that's why we were talking before

01:51:04.300 and an interesting game to play, not a game, but just a thought experiment for people who are

01:51:10.000 listening to this or watching this and wanted something to think about later. Think about what

01:51:14.580 is the story right now? What is the median voter in America? And what is their single issue that

01:51:22.160 they're most concerned about and people might think it's and the single issue will usually

01:51:26.740 factor in economics and demographics and stuff because any big issue always does and let me know

01:51:34.560 what you think about this and i said this before but my idea is i don't know how to phrase it but

01:51:40.620 it's like media lies that sounds very reductive but what i mean it's like the one thing everybody

01:51:47.760 is talking about on any side is disinformation and misinformation that's all you hear from the

01:51:54.400 left that disinformation is a threat to our democracy all you hear from the right is the

01:51:58.800 media is lying to you everyone's lying to you the media itself what you might call the cathedral

01:52:03.740 whatever academia is in there too they're all saying that you're being lied to all the time

01:52:08.680 in fact that's all they fucking talk about so i think the issue of the day if i were to pull the

01:52:14.420 median voter would be something about like the veracity of information there's probably a better

01:52:20.520 way to explain it you know but like that would be it like how do we know we're not being lied to by

01:52:24.820 every single institution all the fucking time and i think any politician that really addresses that

01:52:31.800 they're going to climb to the top of the heap and it's interesting because i can't even imagine

01:52:37.240 how that would be approached but for that reason i think that's that's like uh that's a that's

01:52:44.340 the superconductor that's the room temperature superconductor right now in politics is how if

01:52:49.060 somebody could come in and actually create like a trustworthy institution that people from many

01:52:56.760 different spheres actually said yeah you know what for once i believe you like then i haven't heard

01:53:01.720 those words in 15 years so that'd be magic and like he says here like if you're taking the

01:53:07.900 temperature of the room if you're just trying to find what to bet on he says you know the right has

01:53:12.800 moved left on economics if we're using the left-right paradigm he says the left is not moving

01:53:18.060 to the center to outflank them um choose the left is choosing instead to go actually further left

01:53:24.360 but that means the entire zeitgeist we know right now has kind of moved leftward um away from

01:53:32.100 laissez-faire and free trade economics and he said this will define the pendulum swing in america

01:53:37.400 going forward even so even more so than europe because in europe like this is going to be

01:53:42.780 supercharged right now but like there there is no laissez-faire economics there is no conservative

01:53:48.900 economics that is effectively dead so you're no matter what you believe you're we're stuck riding

01:53:55.820 this pendulum swing until or maybe you don't believe in a pendulum swing but it's going to

01:53:59.980 go that direction until it stops i guess um he's got this graph here just to stay on the populist

01:54:08.180 thing that i found so interesting it's a graph of where you would find populism um on a map it

01:54:15.900 it has these two axis uh one is uh generational earnings and the other is uh the genie coefficient

01:54:23.480 basically it's a chart that charts uh social mobility so if you have less upward mobility

01:54:31.420 and more income equality that's kind of like the zone where you find populism that's the uk that's

01:54:37.500 the us and that's uh italy as well but you can like go down in upward mobility but more income

01:54:45.680 equality but you can't be a populist then so there's like this sweet spot where you find

01:54:50.060 populists where it's like high income equality but like no social mobility or something you know

01:54:57.120 i mean and and that's like such an interesting that's why it's so rare anyway and also you could

01:55:03.080 tech you might be able to include spain in there because spain's right on the edge outside of that

01:55:08.220 zone but these are also the people that are leading the charge and he says we talked about

01:55:13.460 the washington consensus the washington consensus was traditional laissez-faire economics this new

01:55:19.780 one is called the buenos aires consensus the shift towards economic populism because that's

01:55:25.000 what you can call it you can call it leftist economics but it's also economic populism

01:55:29.400 um which is in short modern monetary theory it's the belief that you can just inject cash and

01:55:36.300 credit into the economy and blow gold all over the place so you're gonna see the main proponents

01:55:42.780 of that like there's no surprise coming mainly from america and the uk and this side of the

01:55:48.660 you don't really hear like the real strong advocates coming out of like fucking ireland

01:55:54.740 or portugal you know um and there is uh one element that he talked about earlier one constraint

01:56:02.740 that you need to pay attention to and that's it's not the defining constraint but it's contributory

01:56:09.460 which is sort of mass global trends and this would be like um capitalism versus communism

01:56:16.820 You know, like it does. It is an effect where as capitalism was getting popularity in America, it did sweep through Europe. That's why it swept into Margaret Thatcher and these other places. There is kind of a domino effect. However, don't counter that domino effect every single time because that's what the Soviets counted on. They counted on domino effect really, really hard and it just didn't work.

01:56:40.480 You know, the Soviet Union is a great example of ideology versus material constraints.

01:56:46.820 It thought it could solve the material constraints, but it just couldn't.

01:56:50.180 And it really couldn't reconcile with that.

01:56:54.680 Just some other examples, just to illustrate what we're talking about.

01:56:58.040 It says, throughout the 2010s, journalists and Euroskeptics discuss whether Germany would leave the European Union.

01:57:05.020 But the macroeconomic constraints make Germany export dependent.

01:57:09.780 uh the euro devalued the deutsch mark which allowed them to trade more effectively and they

01:57:14.800 need the european market as a production sink so you know just with that in mind the likelihood of

01:57:19.300 germany ideologically leaving the eu for whatever reason is low and and frankly this is the problem

01:57:26.300 that a lot of eu countries are in where like they might hate the migration crisis of course they

01:57:31.840 don't think any a lot of them don't like but it's like can we still leave the eu we're stuck in this

01:57:36.340 fucking bind where like we we at this point to rejigger our own currency we we would fucking

01:57:45.260 collapse there's a lot of countries that benefit from joining the eu that are stuck there now

01:57:50.000 unfortunately no matter what economic you know or sovereignty argument you want to make

01:57:56.300 they're fucking if if you leave it up to policymakers they're always going to err

01:58:01.380 on the side of that status quo that doesn't lead to destruction

01:58:04.840 um and she says here the the macroeconomic demands of the european union uh the fear of

01:58:15.720 weakness and reliance on internal unity is more sustainable than idealist or utopian goals like

01:58:22.120 no matter what it's very difficult to make the case for most of these nations that they're

01:58:27.160 stronger on their own because there's a reason they did it like the whole reason the eu exists

01:58:31.760 is to kind of compete on an international stage

01:58:34.840 and have some kind of internal unity.

01:58:36.620 And maybe that's even ethnic unity,

01:58:38.840 whatever you want to call it, but it's there.

01:58:40.880 For example, like Paul Krugman

01:58:42.540 and a lot of others in America

01:58:44.440 were encouraging Greece to leave the European Union.

01:58:47.560 I talked about this earlier.

01:58:48.380 And devalue its currency to remain competitive.

01:58:52.720 However, it would need like an entire structural reform

01:58:55.800 to accomplish this.

01:58:57.180 And it doesn't export anything.

01:58:58.920 Greece's exports have been fucking decimated.

01:59:01.760 yeah i was about to say like you become committed like competitive at what like what they like

01:59:07.060 tourism like you don't you're already the tourist destination for europe that's not going to change

01:59:11.780 so like what what else do you guys do is devaluing your currency going to attract investment there

01:59:17.660 people are going to build factories there now no no why the fuck would you want to hire greeks

01:59:22.340 exactly it's like what are you going to do and you can make a case for like

01:59:25.940 greece as an ancient civilization but it's like these are the material constraints that

01:59:30.540 if you were to bet on them will probably predict what policymakers ultimately do and you can judge

01:59:38.900 that you can also judge the median voter theory like how passionate are the people really for this

01:59:43.800 movement you know um he makes a case here he says in the traditional model not traditional but the

01:59:52.340 previous model the washington consensus he says in a hegemonic unipolar moment like the washington

01:59:58.560 consensus, the conflict between absolute trade gains and relative trade gains tilt towards the

02:00:05.800 absolute. So that means that smaller states, smaller states tend to work on absolute trade

02:00:13.060 gains. Like I want to trade and I want to get something as a benefit. Whereas if you're a huge

02:00:17.300 power, you're willing to lose on a trade. You'll lose money on a trade deal with the country if it

02:00:24.520 means you can accumulate power in some other way.

02:00:27.660 So you'll offer more deals, you'll offer fewer tariffs,

02:00:31.020 things like that.

02:00:32.200 The problem is, and this also allows smaller countries

02:00:35.800 to become challengers in this model.

02:00:37.860 The problem is in a multipolar model,

02:00:40.360 nations become less sensitive to relative gains

02:00:43.440 and seek absolute gains.

02:00:44.560 So you start to see more tariffs.

02:00:45.720 You're going to see more cutthroat deals.

02:00:48.140 You're going to see more nations not trusting each other.

02:00:50.720 And that is why he's saying this model is necessary,

02:00:54.040 because we had it too easy before.

02:00:56.740 We had an entire system dominated by mathematicians

02:01:00.060 and retired bureaucrats who didn't really need to do much work

02:01:03.580 and didn't need to factor in geopolitics.

02:01:06.720 And just to bring us back to the start,

02:01:08.000 this entire model, geopolitical alpha,

02:01:11.220 it's a financial, and even if you might disagree

02:01:15.760 with some of the claims he makes

02:01:18.620 or where he's coming from on some things,

02:01:20.460 I think the entire purpose of this is very useful, because what he's saying is that the old way, we all intuit that the old way of handling economics is over. There's some kind of shift happening. And we need to change how we think about it. And he's saying we need to factor in geopolitical concerns as well, not just math, not just looking at graphs.

02:01:40.180 we have to look at like the psychology of the voters we need to look at the psychology of the

02:01:45.780 policymakers the relationship between those two and look at the prevailing wins globally like is

02:01:52.680 is there an economic for example the economic trend sweeping the europe right now is this sort

02:01:59.520 of economic populism and it would make not a lot of sense to bet against that right now whether

02:02:06.680 you like it or not whatever your ideology is similarly you can look at you know like what is

02:02:12.360 the war in russia between russia and ukraine really doing to like the energy markets and you

02:02:18.020 know things like that and i like that way of looking at it because it seems more nuanced and

02:02:23.020 seems more realistic and it makes you at people like asking these questions because it's like

02:02:27.900 well what are the data vectors for that what are the the information flows from that it's like well

02:02:32.320 here's the thing you don't need every single information flow you need a few key information

02:02:38.360 flows for example he says that you know our the way we used to uh try and judge these the way we

02:02:45.180 used to get information was looking for like insiders and intelligence people and he's like

02:02:50.280 you know they can help but if you rely too much on intelligence people you'll get a bunch of

02:02:53.600 bullshit because they get tricked more than anyways like you should look at is historians

02:02:58.740 like there's there's more types of data that you should be looking at that no one is looking at

02:03:04.680 right now he says academic ease the tip he gave was find someone who knows has an incredible depth

02:03:13.020 of knowledge about one specific thing if you're looking at an expert on policy makers fuck that

02:03:19.600 guy he knows less than anyone but you find an academic that has studied like agricultural

02:03:26.720 output in america for the past 100 years that guy can probably tell you more about the way the

02:03:33.540 winds are blowing in america than a guy who just watches a bunch of news see what i'm saying like

02:03:38.900 find find guys who know a lot about a boring thing who can tell you about like the context

02:03:43.620 the context of how that's changed over time that will give you more information on like what's

02:03:48.820 happening in america you know and then but those are the types of people that no one looks at

02:03:54.520 so find like rely on less information but more but but deeper and more specific information

02:04:01.300 and make bets based on that kind of like the way doctors do it like doctors you don't do a full

02:04:06.160 body scan when you find something wrong with someone like you need to know which symptoms

02:04:10.840 to prioritize because you'll get more information from that than just opening your mind to all the

02:04:17.100 data because even ai struggles with that as well um and he uses this to make some predictions over

02:04:24.900 the next decade or so so we can tell whether or not he's he's realistic or not his predictions

02:04:30.320 for the oncoming decades are america versus it's going to be america versus china still but

02:04:35.940 relatively constrained it won't be an outright trade war because that doesn't benefit either of

02:04:41.000 them we're going to see deglobalization that's what we're seeing right now when people talk

02:04:45.280 about friend shoring or reshoring of industries that is happening that will continue to happen

02:04:51.880 de-globalization is going to happen over the next couple decades um moving away from laissez for

02:04:58.780 capitalism due to multi-polarity and more of this economic populism that's that's here to stay

02:05:04.540 there's no way you're going to vote against that right now so you just need to figure out what

02:05:08.680 you're going to do about that and he says uh you know there's three lenses that he uses to

02:05:14.440 forecast geopolitical events and there are three levels of um accuracy he says look at these three

02:05:21.800 things discrete events like assassinations or protests cyclical events like elections or

02:05:27.480 summits and kind of figure out where they're going and then around the curve long-term

02:05:32.760 possibilities which are grouped by regional themes rather rather than specific countries

02:05:37.160 and i like that it's like don't just look at the country look at the region look at its neighbors

02:05:42.200 like what's france doing but what's france and germany and britain what's europe doing what's

02:05:47.540 north america doing it's not just what's iran doing what's the middle east doing that's where

02:05:53.240 you find the actual trend like there's more to looking at geopolit like really look at the

02:05:58.520 geopolitics look at entire areas look at eurasia like what's what's russia and like what's you

02:06:04.780 know india doing in relationship to china and all of asia doing shit like that so i like that i think

02:06:10.720 that's the right way to look at it because that once you look at that you'll understand what the

02:06:14.780 policymakers are thinking because that's what they're thinking about as well um

02:06:18.580 yeah so that's that's basically the book in a nutshell and uh first of all what did you think

02:06:25.920 about that i think that's probably more aligned with with your views would you say yeah i think

02:06:31.000 i think we probably agree there's a lot of interesting stuff in there um i like a lot of

02:06:35.560 the way that it's framed not sure about all of the conclusions but i mean i haven't read it so

02:06:40.160 it sounds good it's good i'd recommend people read it at least even if because there's some

02:06:44.420 there's one thing that he said in it that i didn't just i didn't agree with i didn't like

02:06:48.800 and it didn't really make sense to me he was saying like um he was giving the example of

02:06:53.600 donald trump and list listing the constraints of what he was dealing with to predict what he

02:06:59.380 couldn't do and he was he was applying material constraints to opinions like for example he's

02:07:06.100 saying he wants to put this law through but you know he had the constraint of that nancy pelosi

02:07:13.000 hated him and john mccain hated him and so he went up against that but i said well that's not

02:07:17.920 a material constraint because you had said that that's more of a preference he says preferences

02:07:23.020 can change material constraints can't but then you can't put people's attitudes as a material

02:07:27.740 constraint he did that like a couple of times so that made me question like that that example

02:07:32.840 doesn't make sense within your model because the idea is like a material constraint is something

02:07:37.040 you can't fucking control like you can't control that your country is like like that's the problem

02:07:42.800 that ukraine has like the material constraint of ukraine is that it's at the gates of europe

02:07:47.560 and that russia is there like that's going to inform no matter what it wants to do

02:07:52.160 ukraine could never realistically exist in a world where it's not in conflict with russia

02:07:57.580 that to me is more of a material constraint based on geography and it can never never

02:08:02.720 never exists without that so any decision it makes has to factor that in which like any nationalism

02:08:08.760 that ukraine comes up with has to factor in that it's always going to be at that inflection point

02:08:15.660 between russia and europe and then in russia and europe are always going to be at odds forever and

02:08:20.680 what do you do about that you know any national identity that doesn't factor that in the ukrainian

02:08:26.000 church ironically factored that in into its creation but you know that's sort of the thing

02:08:30.620 that we're talking about here and again it's not like a full 360 degree ideology but it's not

02:08:36.460 supposed to be an ideology it's more of a financial framework to say let's figure let's have a new

02:08:43.120 model to try and predict events something that you can bet on and you don't need to explain

02:08:51.420 everything that happens in the world to kind of bet on the probability of something happening i

02:08:56.440 i liked that way of looking at it right right right no that's a good thing a good way of looking

02:09:00.660 anyway that's that's the book i really like i'd recommend it geopolitical alpha we could probably

02:09:05.300 talk about it for a bit longer and i bet it'll come up in the future but again the existence of

02:09:10.080 the median voter theory really stood out to me and even as a thought experiment i would still

02:09:14.740 welcome people in your country wherever you're living try because the median isn't just the

02:09:20.420 average normie it's like you're you're factoring in all the extremes but because the median will

02:09:25.720 change year by year but like what is the average person thinking right now and what what is the

02:09:33.320 average person thinking and what does the average person need to have an opinion on and that's

02:09:39.320 something not a lot of people think about but that's something that can help you actually

02:09:42.880 predict where an election is going to go anyway that's that i'll let you go now because we gotta

02:09:48.500 to get going yeah cool i'll talk to you soon

02:09:52.240 i wonder if rogan would have you on because i saw you on tucker and you know tucker in a lot

02:10:14.780 the sense is kind of a I'd say he's a kingmaker you know like he will blast your ideas and you

02:10:20.820 were up there and you weren't rambling like a schizo well I mean the part of the thing is I

02:10:25.600 just refuse to sell myself right you know I I make no effort like engagement clout you know I would

02:10:33.080 never try to worm my way into Rogan if Rogan wants to call me because he heard about me that's fine

02:10:38.460 but I'm going to spend a grand total of zero seconds trying to be on Rogan I suspect that's

02:10:43.540 not true for most people so you probably need to work harder at it to get on rogan yeah like i

02:10:49.500 have a feeling that you wouldn't need to edit yourself very much for me i'd be going on rogan

02:10:55.320 i'd be staring sweating in the mirror telling myself don't talk about nuking the moon whatever

02:11:01.840 you do and that because he's going to ask you why and i'm not going to have an answer it just feels

02:11:06.180 right all right well i don't know man you got a new something let's see what's going on in the

02:11:13.200 moon don't tell me you don't want to know it's holla don't you know honestly i've been down the

02:11:19.200 road with so many moon theories i was joking with um a friend of mine uh the host of the

02:11:25.740 paranormies johnny monoxide i'm saying the moon landing conspiracies are almost the most acceptable

02:11:33.000 in polite society because i know some very serious very respected highly intelligent people

02:11:39.300 who hate conspiracy theories but they like all the moon stuff they'll talk to you for an hour

02:11:45.700 about how the moon landing was fake and how the moon is something's going on with that

02:11:49.000 huh well you know i was born right around the time of the moon landing so i i can't i can't say but

02:11:57.060 i i think it's not fake in any case let's get let's get the part that's like i'm not i'm not

02:12:01.460 even like a fake moon that's gonna lose me some listeners like oh here comes dimes talking about

02:12:05.700 the moon's real now. I'm just going to introduce you very quickly because we've been chit-chatting.

02:12:12.120 I'm here with a prestigious guest by the name of Charles Haywood, and he's an individual that I've

02:12:18.760 been following for quite some time. He is the maximum leader of The Worthy House, the founder

02:12:25.240 of foundationalism, creator of the Society for American Civic Renewal, a great many projects,

02:12:33.160 and a great interesting career path that took you to here.

02:12:37.060 And we'll get into that right now.

02:12:38.840 And first of all, I just want to thank you for taking the time to be here.

02:12:41.860 It is my pleasure.

02:12:42.820 I am happy to be here.

02:12:43.680 I will note, we'll probably talk about it.

02:12:45.520 I'm not actually the founder of the Society for American Civic Renewal.

02:12:49.120 I am tangentially involved, but it is in fact an internet myth

02:12:52.860 that I am somehow the Svengali behind that organization.

02:12:56.300 Oh, okay.

02:12:57.120 My mistake.

02:12:58.160 But it's good that, hey, mistakes keep the eraser people in business.

02:13:03.160 but I still would like to talk about it because there's a lot of very interesting ideas that are

02:13:08.220 kind of floating around in orbit around you and like I'd mentioned at the start a lot of people

02:13:14.280 might know you from your appearance on Tucker Carlson show a few months ago you've been on a

02:13:19.400 great many podcasts and I guess to start I guess to start I guess ideologically and then we'll get

02:13:27.760 into your career in a second but this concept of foundationalism I think I'd like to set the stage

02:13:32.740 with that. If you could kind of go into foundationalism, what it means and what it

02:13:37.880 means to you. Well, foundationalism is my attempt to create an applied political philosophy that

02:13:44.780 may be of use in some future situation in America, more or less, though more broadly speaking,

02:13:51.460 the West. And the ideas flowed out of my penchant, I guess, for lack of a better term,

02:13:58.840 of writing book reviews. I started writing book reviews around 2015, and the book reviews

02:14:04.240 gradually became less book reviews and more vehicles for my thoughts about the world at large

02:14:09.040 or history or whatever the subject of the book was. I would talk about what was on my mind that

02:14:14.820 was generated as a result of reading that book. And over time, this coalesced around an idea.

02:14:20.900 I originally referred to it generically as a reaction, but it coalesced around the idea of

02:14:26.260 of a applied political philosophy called foundationalism actually the name was picked

02:14:31.320 by a reader of mine because on one of my reviews i'm like someone needs to give me a name for my

02:14:36.040 my budding political philosophy and so someone suggested that and i i ran with it but the

02:14:42.360 foundationalism isn't and uh people frequently mistake this i think an ideology in the sense

02:14:48.740 that it's not meant to be a self-contained political system that's going to solve everyone's

02:14:52.740 problems and lead to utopian happiness for everybody. It's simply a series of reality-based

02:14:57.960 guideposts that I think people who are structuring a political order in some future where the

02:15:03.940 existing political order has mutated, disappeared, broken down, what have you, which will happen

02:15:10.040 because it's inevitable in history. Whether that'll happen next year or 20 years from now or even

02:15:15.040 later, though I doubt that, we don't know when it's going to be, but the current political order

02:15:20.660 is not going to last forever.

02:15:22.880 And most betting people would say

02:15:23.960 it's going to end sooner rather than later.

02:15:26.220 It'll be replaced by some other political order.

02:15:29.340 So it's an attempt to set a series of principles

02:15:32.080 that are of use to people,

02:15:33.920 that get people thinking,

02:15:35.260 that can hopefully be applied in some way in the future.

02:15:39.100 In some ways, it's basically a thought experiment.

02:15:42.060 But it's also a way to be positive

02:15:46.060 in the sense that there's an awful lot of people

02:15:47.620 who complain about the situation of modernity, of current modern-day America. And complaint is

02:15:54.620 certainly justified. But after a while, complaint is just wailing. And wailing is kind of stupid.

02:15:59.960 You have to have a positive vision. Underpinning my positive vision isn't just the philosophy or

02:16:06.060 the points. I actually think that the average American, well, his virtue may have been eroded,

02:16:13.080 the average American, more than any other Western country, still has a lot to offer. I think the

02:16:17.580 country has a lot to offer, whether or not it exists as America, I don't know in the future,

02:16:22.000 but the people of America have a lot to offer in terms of civilizational achievement. So we

02:16:28.260 shouldn't just write that off because our current leader sucks so bad. We should think about what

02:16:33.700 we can do in the future once our current leadership has, as Lenin said, I think it was Lenin,

02:16:38.740 ended up on the ash heap of history. Well, it's a very interesting way to look at it because

02:16:43.180 so much time on our side is spent predicting the collapse of society or the end of the world. But

02:16:49.140 very few people have said, let's assume for certain that it will happen. What happens in

02:16:55.680 the next year, the next 10 years after that? And I think a lot of people would be interested to hear

02:17:01.280 because your career path has led you. You created a very, very successful organization,

02:17:07.320 a company. You sold that company. And on your website, you discussed that you're

02:17:11.860 sort of financially secure enough to pursue this ideology in the real world. And I was wondering

02:17:17.660 what that looks like. Well, I prefer the term fracture rather than collapse. Collapse implies

02:17:25.920 a Mad Max kind of environment, which I don't think actually exists in real life, except for a few

02:17:30.740 minutes, especially in the West. And we can talk about that separately. I think it's somewhat of

02:17:34.440 a mistake to think that I'm taking all my money and implementing foundationalism, is foundationalism

02:17:38.940 by definition can't be implemented in the current environment. I mean, there is a current political

02:17:43.100 system. There are people in charge. There's theoretically in America a constitution that

02:17:48.020 governs the country. Obviously, that constitution has been honored over the past, say, 60 years

02:17:53.340 more in the breach than in terms of reality. But there's a current political system. I'm not trying

02:17:59.300 to replace the current political system by myself in any way, shape, or form, is that's just kind of

02:18:05.120 a silly exercise. I mean, leaving aside the fact that you obviously can't overthrow the government

02:18:09.320 and the government doesn't like it. If you try to overthrow the government, it doesn't,

02:18:15.300 but the future will be, will reveal itself. At the same time, voting is a waste of time. That is,

02:18:21.900 I don't want to, I'm not trying to start a movement that's going to elect new, fresh new

02:18:26.600 politicians to Washington to implement foundationalism. That's equally a useless

02:18:30.760 kind of thing. Both because foundationalism is a radical break from the current system,

02:18:35.960 and because, as they say, the elections are all fortified nowadays. My prediction basically is

02:18:42.100 that at some point in the future, the current political system slash society slash system

02:18:47.820 is going to fracture to a greater or lesser degree, meaning that people will have to come up

02:18:52.680 with new ways of dealing with political structures and society as a whole. And if you look back over

02:18:59.820 the 20th century, or even longer, I mean, obviously, but just over the past 20th century,

02:19:04.080 you see that this happening to societies is the norm, rather than the exception. I think

02:19:09.360 Americans in particular have gotten this weird idea into their head that the system we have now,

02:19:15.260 leaving aside whether it how close it is to say the system we had in 1910, or 1920, the system we

02:19:21.220 have now is forever. And history teaches us that that's not the case. So the point of my doing

02:19:27.780 these things isn't to implement change. It's to make people think about the future in a productive

02:19:35.160 way that will ultimately lead to human flourishing in whatever the future brings us, which will

02:19:41.880 probably bring us unpleasantness at some level. And you want to have people prepared to implement

02:19:48.600 new structures if those are needed, if the old structures fall apart, which a betting man would

02:19:53.400 say that they will. But this isn't really a, I mean, this isn't a money-making endeavor.

02:19:59.060 This isn't, I don't, I'm not running, I'm not even running an organization. I have a website,

02:20:03.980 I write on the website. I think there's this weird myth that has developed that I'm, as I say,

02:20:10.460 a Svengali of, you know, pulling strings behind the scenes and funding a bunch of people. I can

02:20:16.660 assure you that I have a crap load of money, but I spent almost none of it on political actions.

02:20:23.840 I do give a lot to charity and so on, but political organization on anything other than a

02:20:30.160 local scale, building schools and so on, just isn't a winning strategy right now. What you want to do

02:20:35.240 is educate your children, make contacts with people locally and maybe on a broader scale,

02:20:41.420 you know twitter friends or something and see what the future holds so that people always kind

02:20:48.120 of default to the idea that a guy who wants to have a different kind of future is actively working

02:20:55.420 to bring that future about but that's obviously silly i mean why would you do that how would you

02:21:00.200 do that the whole point of this thing is is education plus i like to scribble and people

02:21:04.240 like my writing so why not yeah what i like about this model is it's less ideological and more just

02:21:10.120 about survival, which is something we talk about a lot on the show, which is the idea of making

02:21:16.020 new types of organizations that are designed to be what we might say anti-fragile rather than

02:21:21.540 spend all of our time trying to predict precisely how things are going to collapse. If you're

02:21:26.860 convinced things are going to collapse, you must really internalize that. I don't think some people

02:21:31.080 really do believe things are going to collapse or they do think and they think it's going to be a

02:21:35.240 Mad Max thing, like you say, but if you really internalize it, you have to kind of shake it off

02:21:40.240 and say, okay, let's assume that's true. What now? And now you need to think of kind of,

02:21:46.240 you know, in, I don't want to say inelegance, but the solutions to a novel problem will not

02:21:53.280 be familiar solutions. You know, new types of organizations, new types of orientations,

02:21:58.840 like, because we do live in unprecedented times is what I like to bring people back to. So a lot

02:22:03.640 of people are stuck in 20th century solutions to 21st century problems. And I think you have the

02:22:09.260 right approach, which is, like you said, you don't give out money because what would you even give it

02:22:14.620 to? Because those sorts of organizations don't even exist yet. But it's more, I think something

02:22:21.140 that's often brought up on our side is that a lot of individuals lack a positivistic view of the

02:22:27.520 future. And that's something we talk about a lot too. Everything's dystopian, everything is gloomy,

02:22:32.700 but there is a pathway to charting the course for your own survival on a regional or community-based

02:22:40.360 level. And really, I think the other thing I like about this is it forces people to think on a

02:22:45.540 community level because a lot of people in our political milieu are highly atomized, highly

02:22:52.220 individualistic. So they're very lonely, but they're thinking globally or they're thinking

02:22:56.760 internationally, right? But what they should be thinking is locally or regionally, not in

02:23:01.620 elections, but, you know, getting some kind of system where they're living before they think

02:23:07.460 about how they would be if they were president, you know? Yes, absolutely. I mean, I couldn't

02:23:12.600 agree more. The thinking globally thing is particularly pernicious because the fact is

02:23:17.800 that the rulers, the ruling class, the regime couldn't care less what it is the average person

02:23:24.200 thinks and the average person can have no possible influence. Whatever I may think, for example,

02:23:29.080 of the Ukraine war or to what degree America should be involved in the Ukraine war is a

02:23:33.760 complete irrelevancy to everything. And I can spend all my day long posting on Twitter about it,

02:23:37.500 but why? I mean, instead, I should be spending my time, as you say, becoming anti-fragile. I like to

02:23:42.980 use the term resilient. For example, I spent the previous three hours to this doing basically

02:23:48.980 enlarging my chicken coop for chickens because having eggs is a useful thing. And whether or

02:23:56.820 not eggs are available in the grocery store. It's just something, and it's also, it's grounding.

02:24:02.500 That is, if you spend all your time on Twitter complaining that X, Y, or Z should be done

02:24:07.320 differently about the Ukraine war, that's fundamentally not healthy compared to spending

02:24:11.260 your time chasing chickens around. I mean, I chase them around pretty badly, I mean, poorly in the

02:24:15.420 sense that I'm not very skilled with them, but you learn it by doing. That's a great example.

02:24:20.080 And one thing that I think people fall into, especially on our side, I don't want to sound

02:24:24.220 to come too hard on our side either because this happens on the left this happens with libs

02:24:28.560 happens everywhere but um people get kind of caught up in revolutionary fandoms they start

02:24:35.180 saying they start imagining what they would do in the situation and none of it is very practical

02:24:40.220 and my career experience i think yours as well and my co-host judas he everything goes okay what

02:24:47.920 do we do now what does this mean for me now what can we do and i think a lot of individuals on our

02:24:52.980 side and i'm not saying you know don't because you're a voracious reader so are many others so

02:24:57.340 so am i we cover a book every week on the show but for a lot of people it's very easy to get so

02:25:02.840 deep into theory and so deep into the esoteric philosophical side that you come out the other

02:25:07.220 side wanting to kill yourself and that's not where you want to be that yeah people do it because they

02:25:13.720 want meaning they want to feel like they have the key or they've been given the key or they're giving

02:25:17.900 other people the cue. But the key is there is no cue. I mean, that's the flaw of ideologies,

02:25:23.100 the thinking that some set of principles is self-contained and will lead to a perfect or

02:25:30.060 maximized future. But that's obviously false. History comes and goes. Good things happen to

02:25:35.760 bad people. Bad things happen to good people, whatever the reverse is. And the best you can do

02:25:42.500 is fundamentally not worry too much about it.

02:25:46.000 I mean, I'm very opposed to the size

02:25:48.080 and scope of modern government.

02:25:50.400 Okay, fine.

02:25:51.220 But first of all,

02:25:52.620 I'm unable to do anything about that.

02:25:55.000 And so in some future world,

02:25:56.920 I would ideally have a much smaller government.

02:26:00.960 But right now, there's nothing I can do about it.

02:26:02.640 So screaming at the sky that the government sucks,

02:26:05.700 while it's entirely true,

02:26:07.560 just isn't a very useful thing to do.

02:26:09.640 Now, I got one question here,

02:26:11.500 and i'm trying to remember there was a recently an article on you in the guardian yeah i was trying

02:26:16.880 to blow pull the curtain back on something um first of all um what did you think of that article

02:26:23.720 um it was pretty well trafficked and also i'm trying to remember whether this was that article

02:26:29.180 or if it was something on your site if it was from the article i apologize but i know there

02:26:33.580 was mention of the term warlord right was was that something you so the guardian article was

02:26:40.620 interesting it's written by some low iq antifa shill i can't remember his name uh but i mean

02:26:45.480 his entire shtick is working for antifa to dox people and so on which kind of a waste my time

02:26:50.480 because a i can't be dox because i'm a known person with who operates under my real name and

02:26:55.540 i'm essentially invulnerable i don't have any points of points of pain for that those these

02:27:00.880 people can't think can bring to bear so it's kind of a silly exercise but the the attempt of the

02:27:05.900 article was to to create this fictitious narrative in which i was the this rich shampoo magnate

02:27:15.880 funding secret uh right-wing organizations with an eye to becoming a warlord the warlord thing

02:27:23.520 is actually taken from my writings where i talk about in some post-collapse society were society

02:27:30.380 to collapse or fracture, not about warlords, but what I call the armed patronage network

02:27:35.380 as a social organizing device if the central government ever were to disappear on its own.

02:27:42.500 That is, if order were to break down, order is restored from the local level up until,

02:27:49.360 as I outline in a couple of different pieces, you come back to some larger set of states

02:27:55.680 or country.

02:27:57.260 So, I mean, that was a kind of obscure thought experiment

02:28:00.820 that I was thinking, I've talked about on my website

02:28:02.980 a couple of it, but he picked that out

02:28:05.780 and I actually specifically denigrated the term warlord

02:28:09.100 because I don't think warlordism is a thing.

02:28:11.860 And that is, I don't think warlordism can exist

02:28:13.720 in the modern West and certainly not in modern America.

02:28:17.220 But by stringing a couple out of context,

02:28:20.560 half quotes together, and then talking about

02:28:23.100 the Society for American Civic Renewal,

02:28:24.920 this nascent group which i i do have a small part in it makes it sound like rich shampoo

02:28:30.120 magnate charles haywood is is spending millions to build an army i mean although as john carrey

02:28:38.840 said way back when would that it were that i had this had this like supreme power and all these

02:28:44.460 minions really to do my bidding but the only minions i have ready to do my bidding are my

02:28:49.080 children and they they're pretty you know piss poor at actually doing my bidding so they could

02:28:54.080 be very destructive in a sense yes so when when work needs to be done and someone needs to be

02:29:00.460 bid to do it around here i have to bid myself to do it i'll have to pay someone who's non-political

02:29:06.480 to you know fix the drains although i'm actually pretty handy so i the article is kind of silly

02:29:11.160 weirdly it gets a lot of play on twitter but it got i got shockingly little traffic to my site

02:29:17.660 at the worthy house which is you know named i think in the guardian article and certainly it's

02:29:21.280 Which is interesting because I wanted to know how your life had been impacted by this hit piece.

02:29:26.900 What's it like on the other end?

02:29:28.660 Because it's a pretty big article, a pretty big institution.

02:29:32.220 It had no effect.

02:29:33.520 I mean, it was vaguely amusing, but like bizarrely, not only I get no traffic, I got no hate mail.

02:29:38.920 I mean, you can, my email address on the site is in the clear.

02:29:41.940 I mean, you can send me an email and, you know, or a comment on the site and no one did anything.

02:29:47.340 I mean, it was bizarre.

02:29:47.980 i expected at least a few people to say you know you fascist pig you deserve i mean i didn't get

02:29:52.860 anything it was kind of disappointing honestly it's funny that people talk about dead internet

02:29:57.400 theory but we've been talking about you know dead news media theory that they release these hit

02:30:02.400 pieces but if you actually look at the measurable social impact like maybe no one's reading this

02:30:07.660 stuff maybe these people just don't exist like it's a yeah i mean i think a lot and it actually

02:30:12.300 got picked up by a couple other sites like business insider and so on whatever that is exactly

02:30:16.160 and um i got a bunch of traffic on twitter because i james lindsey who i think i don't really know

02:30:22.340 much about lindsey but i think he's one of these intellectual dark web guys who wishes it was like

02:30:26.840 1996 again or something uh i i i put i put up on twitter because i was bored the something saying

02:30:35.760 and he had a prediction that the regime was going to isolate christian conservatives by

02:30:41.560 by aggressively pushing the homosexual agenda and and that this was going to just be an icbm aimed

02:30:47.760 at christians so basically people should disown christians and and endorse the homosexual agenda

02:30:52.580 that was a weird one well i just said this this prediction aged poorly right and then he's i'm

02:30:59.140 like and i literally forgot about it i mean i it's like so you know it got some traffic whatever

02:31:03.880 who cares i mean like a couple thousand views and you know a few comments fine just didn't

02:31:07.860 And the next morning, it got bigger because Lindsay jumps in.

02:31:11.960 Instead of saying, well, I didn't see it, he says, you're a retard.

02:31:16.120 And I'm like, and then he starts talking about my mom.

02:31:19.940 I'm like, what the hell?

02:31:22.120 I mean, it's very low IQ on Twitter.

02:31:24.200 So yeah, I get some traffic from that, but I still don't get any hate mail.

02:31:27.620 What strikes me as weird about Twitter as opposed to podcasts, which require more intellectual

02:31:32.480 engagement, say, or much less reading books.

02:31:34.560 it's like the unidentified and correctly so with the theory no enemies to the right which i wrote

02:31:40.380 a piece on in i am 1776 and some people are talking about this and it's interesting and

02:31:45.600 some of the evangelical left-wing evangelical types i'm not evangelical but they are attacking

02:31:50.920 me on on twitter for this no enemies the right thing and also for the lindsey thing and they

02:31:56.760 think i'm a christian nationalist whatever exactly that is but the no enemies to the right thing

02:32:02.200 was again this weird twitter one-off like rod drear who's this orthodox writer said something

02:32:07.860 and i was bored and i'd probably been drinking and i said who cares rod no enemies to the right

02:32:12.840 and then he starts writing like long butthurt pieces about what an asshole i am i'm like i just

02:32:19.580 don't get it like but that's that's a note a feather in your cap because i've been telling

02:32:24.000 rod drear he's a fucking piece of shit for a long time and he's never written a screed about me

02:32:29.900 well but he wrote two screens like the first one was like all about me without naming me and then

02:32:34.660 i complained on twitter that hey rod how about you have the decency and name me and then he like

02:32:38.520 really went off and then he blocked me because you know blocking shows he really went to engage

02:32:42.500 and i mean but my point is like they're like oh no both of these things that have gotten me a lot

02:32:47.740 more traffic than than the guardian piece are like things that i just said because i was bored

02:32:54.660 like like people all treat this as though it's some kind of important fight i think the no enemies

02:33:01.480 to the right thing is philosophically an important thing i wrote a long piece on it i'm actually

02:33:05.180 writing a follow-up piece to it but but i mean these people just shrieking low iq stuff on twitter

02:33:10.880 i mean it just it just seems like a waste of time and and back to the foundationalism thing the whole

02:33:15.600 point of my my site and foundationalism is for people who are willing to engage in and capable

02:33:22.500 of deep thought to think deeply about the future. That doesn't mean that everyone's going to agree

02:33:26.860 with me. Like I have a bunch of right-wing friends, shall we say, and they don't agree with me about

02:33:31.980 the 12 pillars of foundationalism frequently. They're like, well, I think that's probably not

02:33:36.620 right. But they don't write long butthurt pieces on Twitter about it. Yeah. You had mentioned

02:33:42.800 something prior to this about an armed patronage network, and that really sprung up at me when I

02:33:48.160 had first read it and i was just to clarify that for people that would be different than like a

02:33:54.460 militia or something right this is kind of more about yeah the armed pages network which is

02:33:58.960 originally kind of a joke sorry i didn't mean to cut you off go ahead no no i was going to go off

02:34:02.720 and say like you know for people we've covered this on the show like this idea wouldn't be that

02:34:08.540 alien for people who've really thought deeply about how nations are formed like you know in

02:34:13.800 hans herman hoppe and democracy the god that failed you know one thing i always come back to

02:34:18.240 is the question he has near the end of the book i think which is like when the state falls because

02:34:23.360 it's happened before when the state falls like in rome what remains well it's the people in

02:34:28.320 these configurations and these configurations tend to be community or town focused and then

02:34:33.660 they kind of generate up from that into city states and whatnot so that's how i interpreted

02:34:38.400 it anyway that's all it is i mean like malicious i mean first i mean i i don't really know anything

02:34:43.300 about militias yeah you occasionally read about them and and mostly the militias seem to be

02:34:48.000 obese middle-aged men with who are half federal agents you know talking about how they're gonna

02:34:54.680 do something i mean just seems silly i mean i'm awful guns and all but like forming a militia

02:34:59.780 just seems like the least wise thing one can do to say to me i want to start a militia just to

02:35:04.480 hang out with the fellas that's all i want to do just because i want a clubhouse and i want to get

02:35:09.680 away from this this this fuck the wife huh and i i think that's a large part of it and then you

02:35:15.600 have kind of the people who i mean you see these kind of people who just got obvious fed honey

02:35:20.800 pods and so on i mean like i don't want to get on the wrong side of the feds i'm i'm extremely

02:35:24.920 scrupulous about my legal compliance but but militia isn't even on my radar screen our patronage

02:35:31.140 network is as you say a social a thought experiment a social organizing device if central authority

02:35:36.840 ever breaks down, whether for a short period of time or a long period of time. And as I like to

02:35:41.660 say, the armed part is actually the least important. The patronage part and the network part is the

02:35:46.820 most important. So, for example, if the central government disappeared tomorrow, it would make

02:35:50.860 sense for me, and this is a thought experiment, as a rich guy with a bunch of land and other

02:35:55.940 resources to kind of to be the place around which people would coalesce in order to restore order.

02:36:03.560 And order doesn't mean just defense.

02:36:06.020 I mean, shooting at people.

02:36:07.060 It may be necessary, I suppose, if people attack you to shoot at you.

02:36:09.940 But you have to organize food distribution.

02:36:12.300 You have to organize if the central government disappears entirely or is away.

02:36:16.720 You have away for a long time.

02:36:18.020 You have to organize the administration of justice.

02:36:20.720 You have to administer social activities, marriages, weddings.

02:36:25.720 I mean, so ultimately, as you say, and Hoppe has written on this as well as other people,

02:36:30.040 The Armed Patriot Network, it's kind of a tongue-in-cheek name, though people seem to like it, is simply the idea that a social organizing device is on a small scale, groups of people coalesce around natural leaders who then provide organization and protection in exchange for providing order, because no one will abide in Mad Max type scenario.

02:36:52.440 Mad Max scenarios simply do not exist in the West, the end, never have, never will.

02:36:57.980 And even more or less possible in America where everyone's armed to the teeth, because it's very hard to run around being a predator, like a stereotypical warlord, like a Somali warlord.

02:37:11.440 You can't be a predator of everyone you're going after is armed.

02:37:14.700 Eventually, you're going to take a bullet in the face and that's going to be the end of your warlord career.

02:37:18.560 What people need in socially uncertain situations is organizing in order to avoid having to

02:37:25.620 shoot guns at people.

02:37:26.940 That's a good point.

02:37:27.820 And one thing I commented on before, it's that one interesting aspect of this political

02:37:34.540 space we're in is that there's a lot of people who either have leadership skills or believe

02:37:39.660 they have leadership skills, but a lot of them have plans.

02:37:43.080 For example, this would be relevant to people who want to go homesteading or there's talks

02:37:47.580 of let's, let's get a compound going, or let's take over town, there's all kinds of different

02:37:52.560 ways to do it. But the issue is that a lot of the guys who want to do this would be type A

02:37:58.760 leader types. And you can't really have a functioning ecosystem of just type A guys,

02:38:04.600 especially eventually, you need sort of a hierarchy built. And a lot of individuals are not really,

02:38:11.140 they might see themselves as leadership types or type A personality types. But they're very,

02:38:15.160 very bad at managing people. And I was wondering, in your perspective, as someone who has been a

02:38:23.640 manager and an owner of business before, what are some leadership characteristics or qualities that

02:38:29.000 you think would be essential for something like this? That's a good question, but I can answer

02:38:35.480 the question easily. The number one, well, number one and two, but the number one characteristic

02:38:41.660 that is desired by people who are under a leader

02:38:45.720 is that that leader be decisive.

02:38:48.820 And I found this out relatively early in my business career

02:38:51.340 and it's not obvious

02:38:52.240 and certainly not taught in business school.

02:38:53.860 And I went to business school,

02:38:54.800 so I know they don't teach it there.

02:38:56.560 The entire point of having someone in charge

02:39:01.420 is to alleviate the people who are being led

02:39:05.460 from having to make a bunch of decisions

02:39:07.480 because people don't want to make decisions.

02:39:09.440 That is, they do want to make some decisions. They don't want it to be micromanaged. But when they come to a person saying, I need a decision, and they get an instant decision that doesn't involve a lot of hemming and hawing, and, well, let's talk first about what you want, and let's do a 360 review, and let's take everyone's temperature.

02:39:28.340 People want decisions when they want decisions. So if you're able to deliver those decisions, the people you lead will be very happy with you. So again, I don't mean to say you need to make all the decisions that you shouldn't micromanage. You should give people a very wide amount of independence.

02:39:47.160 But the being decisive is extremely important for any leader.

02:39:54.740 And I think that the people who are type A are frequently decisive, but they're also

02:40:00.740 frequently very desirous of both micromanaging and second-guessing people.

02:40:06.900 And both those things are fatal to a leader.

02:40:09.280 In order to lead any significant group of people, you have to allow people a very wide

02:40:13.060 degree of independence.

02:40:14.960 That's a great way to put it.

02:40:16.720 And you'd also written about, and this is relayed to it, on one of your pieces on your

02:40:21.980 website about how young men these days are stuck in a holding pattern that a lot of them

02:40:27.880 feel like they should be doing something they don't know what to do.

02:40:31.160 And I was wondering, for those men, a great many of them who are probably fans of yours

02:40:35.720 are listening to this.

02:40:37.780 What would you recommend maybe as the next step to young men who are looking to get involved

02:40:43.900 or do something like this?

02:40:45.300 Yeah, it's very difficult because all of society is built around breaking down and tearing down young men. And every time something comes along that seems like it might help organize young men to self-improvement, that person or theory or whatever is attacked.

02:41:07.220 The clearest example of this is Jordan Peterson, who now is irrelevant because he no longer speaks to young men directly. He's been broken deliberately, I think. So now he talks vaguely about philosophy and a bunch of other things and thinks they're kind of tangentially related, whereas in the past, his target was young men, young lost men, how they can get meaning, how they can have rules for life, obviously, which was his first book.

02:41:33.720 And that's very dangerous, I think, to the regime for young men to have regained meaning and a sense of purpose. The problem is that it's not clear how one can offer to young men meaning and a sense of purpose when the avenues for implementing those things in real life are very narrow.

02:41:53.980 That is, you have, as a young man, you can't join the military anymore in order to self-actualize, for lack of a better term, for obvious reasons, because the military is designed for young men to be humiliated, spat upon, and made to shine the shoes of whichever tranny is in charge in the platoon.

02:42:15.560 And the other things that if you go into the corporate world, everything is hugely feminized, HR inheritance rule your life. So doing anything masculine is almost impossible in a corporate environment.

02:42:32.540 Maybe a little bit more possible in a small business environment, but the opportunities are more limited there.

02:42:38.360 And at the same time, young men are a wide range of vices are paraded in front of and funded for young men.

02:42:49.080 Here, smoke this weed, watch this porn, do all these things that make you innervated and fat and you have no meaning in your life.

02:42:57.960 just be sedated here, you know, feel free to, to take some extra fentanyl. So you become another

02:43:04.220 drug overdose death and it's not a problem anymore for us. So what young men can do is really, I

02:43:10.520 think the question of the hour. And I don't really have perfect advice. I have a long piece called

02:43:17.320 my advice to the young, where I do talk about this. I think fundamentally young men should seek

02:43:23.180 to enter a, they should seek to be resilient. So psychologically resilient, which means self

02:43:31.780 education, physically resilient, which means physical improvement, which is obviously a big

02:43:36.000 thing on the right. And they should try to get a job that is a resilient job as opposed to an email

02:43:42.660 class kind of job, which is both probably going to end and therefore is not resilient in the

02:43:48.840 anti-fragile sense, but also will suck the soul out of them and it'll lead to nothing good in

02:43:55.460 their life. The problem is that those jobs are all socially not prestigious. So especially for

02:44:01.360 a young man who's kind of on the professional managerial elite track, what does that young

02:44:06.240 man do? And I honestly don't have a great answer for that. I think that kind of goes back to what

02:44:10.520 we were talking about earlier, which is that a lot of this is kind of a waiting game. That is,

02:44:14.880 If you're a young man who's, say, 22 now, just to pick a random age, you should really hope that there's a societal fracture in the immediate future because you don't want to get to age 40 without opportunities opening up for you.

02:44:27.920 And they're not really going to open up for you if you're a young man who is masculine and desires to stay masculine as opposed to knuckle under to the feminized and narco tyranny that characterizes our regime today.

02:44:40.440 you you want something to change but you can't make it change it's not going to change because

02:44:46.900 you you you do something about it yeah i mean you get these psychos occasionally who decide

02:44:51.740 that shooting something up is going to going to change things but most of those people are actually

02:44:55.620 mentally ill there's used to be that a hundred years ago late russian empire and so on people

02:45:03.320 engaged in bad activities ideologically fortunately young men who are mentally stable don't do that

02:45:09.560 nowadays. And I'm not encouraging them to do it, obviously. But I can see it's very frustrating for

02:45:14.880 young men who don't know what the future holds to just kind of sit around and wait. And there's

02:45:21.300 really nothing else for it but to sit around and wait and engage in self-improvement and having

02:45:27.320 whatever degree of resiliency your circumstances allow. I agree with that completely. And this is

02:45:33.800 something we'd mentioned on the show before. And I'm curious to see what you think about it,

02:45:37.980 Cause some people push back on me with this, but, uh, what I encourage people to do, and

02:45:42.500 it sounds ironic given our listenership, but I would say if you're young, don't get into

02:45:47.980 online communities.

02:45:49.640 Um, now I'm in my mid thirties.

02:45:51.800 And so, you know, I grew up, uh, in a time that was kind of, there was chat rooms and

02:45:56.720 stuff, but it wasn't the deluge of information and fandoms is right now.

02:46:01.580 But I would always say for guys in their twenties, cause this is what I did.

02:46:05.380 I wasn't big in, you know, I had my political leadings, but I wasn't a activist type in my

02:46:12.040 twenties. I spent my twenties perfecting professional skills and trying to get laid

02:46:18.620 and experiencing, you know, like guy stuff, you know, and making a fool of myself in my twenties

02:46:24.080 in a space where it's okay to make a fool of yourself because you're in your twenties and

02:46:28.760 you're not leading a revolution yet when you're 22. And during that time, what you do is you

02:46:33.880 build up that network not only do you build your practical skills and your experience and your

02:46:38.700 wisdom but i would recommend to young guys that you know the more important thing rather than

02:46:44.420 meeting 1500 like-minded people online it's probably more valuable to meet four to seven

02:46:52.800 like-minded guys in your area and may get a crew get a crew of friends because that will allow you

02:46:59.860 to be more resilient long term than a bunch of like internet allies. And like me having like my

02:47:06.420 friends and you don't need to agree on everything, but you're more or less politically aligned or

02:47:10.340 more or less aligned on your values. But these are the guys who are going to give you something,

02:47:16.480 some stability. And I find it's a lot of young men who try and put a lot of expectations on sort of

02:47:24.040 online communities that they end up even more atomized and they feel alone at the end of the

02:47:28.860 Now, what do you think about that?

02:47:31.060 I totally agree with that.

02:47:32.460 I think it goes back to the localism point.

02:47:35.660 I think a lot of people associate localism with Wendell Berry or Joel Salatin or farming on the land and so on.

02:47:41.020 But localism, obviously, in its name, only means doing things locally.

02:47:45.180 And the number one thing you can do locally is have a community.

02:47:48.860 And for a young man, that means other young men.

02:47:51.460 Obviously, it means his family and other people he may know.

02:47:54.680 But fundamentally, young men want two things.

02:47:58.060 They want a group of other young men who they can associate with and who encourage each other to excel, support each other, and so on.

02:48:07.540 And they also want to get laid.

02:48:09.340 So those are the two things you seek for as a young man.

02:48:13.500 And I think one of the problems is that the internet is seductive because it's easy.

02:48:19.760 It doesn't require you to get out.

02:48:21.200 And it's not demanding on you.

02:48:23.260 the internet doesn't know that you packed on 20 pounds because you couldn't be bothered to uh

02:48:27.340 to get out of your basement whereas people who are local be like hey dude you know getting fat

02:48:32.300 are we so that's a great point actually there's no you know angled lighting online in the real

02:48:38.060 life and and this is but and this is the problem though that this sort of thing just like on a

02:48:44.340 grand scale jordan peterson's activities were discouraged on a small scale this is also

02:48:49.960 discouraged that it and it's discouraged in a variety of ways obviously people say oh look at

02:48:54.820 you you know right wing bodybuilder types or whatever it's also discouraged by by suggestions

02:48:59.680 that if you have close male friends well you must be gay you know the kind of thing yeah and so and

02:49:05.400 and that that's very deliberate this idea that that somehow men shouldn't be allowed to have

02:49:11.300 have male friends because that threatens pretty much everybody in modern society

02:49:17.720 small and great that is at an elementary school for example our kids go to a classical christian

02:49:24.280 school and you'd think it would be super based in the sense that not super based but not like

02:49:30.980 public schools but the we complain all the time that it's overly feminized even there they want

02:49:38.320 the little boys to act like little girls and so if a group i can assure you that if a group of

02:49:44.200 five little boys start putting their heads together and forming a club, even at a classical

02:49:48.900 Christian school, the administration will crack down on it hard. We can't have that. You know,

02:49:53.400 they're going to get up to no good kind of thing. And so you start that young enough and obviously

02:49:57.600 in high school and everything is designed around this, it makes it very difficult. So I think

02:50:05.200 that just reinforces your point. It's crucially important that a young man find a local group like

02:50:10.980 that that's fascinating to hear about your kids there because i remember even when i was growing

02:50:15.520 up kids boys are always trying to form a gang and we're not talking about the bloods and the

02:50:20.040 crips here but the idea of like five kids and maybe they give themselves a name and then they

02:50:24.380 go they do something as like a click or a unit and from the sounds of it that that's that itself

02:50:30.800 is being cracked down as maybe you know too nationalistic absolutely i mean i don't claim

02:50:37.000 to have my finger on the pulse of every school in the area but it's definitely true and they're

02:50:41.660 they're very i like the school and they get a great education everything everything's fine but

02:50:46.520 the the yeah at a very early age they admonish the boys don't play with sticks you know it's

02:50:54.300 aggressive uh you know kind of thing and you know and every and this is a problem i think

02:51:00.520 frequently with christians classical schools which are not all christian but generically

02:51:06.380 classical Christian schools, they tend not to have a lot of money. And so their teachers are

02:51:11.660 almost all women who are working on the side. So the male role models are few and far between.

02:51:20.780 And the default becomes feminized, not like a pernicious pussy hat kind of feminism, but a

02:51:28.680 soft, gentle, consensus-based, agreeable, let's all be kind to each other feminism.

02:51:34.500 and having any group of men is just inherently opposed to that because men advance by competing

02:51:41.940 with each other, by beating up on each other occasionally, by aggressive behavior of various

02:51:47.000 types. And obviously that has to be modulated by society at large. You don't want, you don't want

02:51:51.220 the men as the actual crips and the bloods, or if those are even still gangs nowadays. And,

02:51:57.080 but it's a big problem. So we, we aggressively encourage our, our boys to, to let's put,

02:52:05.700 how do I put it? Be masculine, obviously without beating up on their sisters kind of thing.

02:52:09.760 Well, that's interesting because I have a son that was born a few months ago,

02:52:13.420 and this is something that, thank you very much. Something I talk about, because this is kind of

02:52:18.140 the classic, you know, mother, father, husband, wife debate about how much to protect the child.

02:52:23.420 And just as you're saying that, I was kind of laughing to myself about all the wild shit that I used to do as a kid, just things that like as a father now, like, oh, just go play in the woods for three hours, you know, and what I would do is like you're jumping between cliffs and you're getting into stick fights and stuff.

02:52:40.780 but you know it is interesting that i was listening i forget what i was listening to

02:52:45.920 some kind of podcast but they're talking about how you know boys do need to process their feelings

02:52:52.360 but they need to do it in a male way that usually needs to be taught by a male and when they're

02:52:57.060 taught to process it in a very feminized way there's like this constant tension because it

02:53:02.220 doesn't make sense to them and i try and keep that in mind that's something i had to tell my

02:53:05.960 wife which was like you know boys are gonna fight and they need to they kind of need to do that and

02:53:10.960 they need to know what that's like because guys who've never been into a fight believe it or not

02:53:15.020 are more dangerous they get a straight sense of invincibility then they're the ones who pick up

02:53:19.880 guns because it's invincibility but weakness at the same time that tension but uh divorce from

02:53:25.780 reality if you're a man who doesn't grow up that way you live in this fantasy universe that's

02:53:30.980 fundamentally antithetical to your substance and no wonder that leads to bad things especially when

02:53:35.540 combined with all the other problems facing young men that we were discussing a few minutes ago.

02:53:40.020 And this is something that we have all these grand political and philosophical ideas. And

02:53:45.060 oftentimes when I speak to our listeners, we call them friends of the show, especially guys who are

02:53:51.340 younger than me, they'll say like, well, here's what we're dealing with on the ground. We can

02:53:55.060 talk about great economic movements, but if you're like a young guy, you feel like you're just in

02:54:01.700 this prison like you don't you can't meet girls the same way and like for me in my career i mentioned

02:54:08.980 before we started that i work in marketing i've worked in marketing for 10 years and i've worked

02:54:13.840 in a variety of agencies and we're client side and working in an office for those who haven't done it

02:54:20.480 is just as bad as or worse than you would imagine i mean up until like last year i kind of had a

02:54:27.820 I had to break from it because I'm like, I feel like my way of thinking has become so

02:54:32.880 feminized and polluted.

02:54:34.080 And here's how I knew when I could exist in that office and have small talk with these

02:54:38.260 people who are the worst people that I could imagine.

02:54:41.760 Like now I can have a conversation about a true crime podcast.

02:54:46.820 That's sick.

02:54:47.740 That's a sickness.

02:54:48.820 I got to get out of here.

02:54:50.760 True.

02:54:51.200 That's a good example.

02:54:52.460 I'm glad.

02:54:53.400 I mean, I left.

02:54:54.060 I used to be a big firm, mergers and acquisitions lawyer in Chicago.

02:54:58.200 I left that 20 years ago and did it for a couple of years.

02:55:02.380 I mean, I would never survive in that environment anymore.

02:55:04.540 I mean, even then, it was definitely getting corrupted in a variety of ways.

02:55:08.720 But I could basically be myself, at least at the law firm I was at, which for a variety

02:55:13.360 of reasons probably tolerated me more even then than some.

02:55:17.020 But I'd get fired instantaneously if I ever tried to get, if I came to a law firm nowadays,

02:55:21.660 the way that my personality and behavior are. And you, I, what I had told people about living

02:55:29.320 like that, and just to reference Jordan Peterson again, some people have made fun of me before,

02:55:34.340 because I always would say, you know, I'm not a fan of Jordan Peterson right now, but I would

02:55:39.140 always defend his early work. And I would say, Hey, he was doing a very useful thing. And the

02:55:43.880 line that I always give them, like, you know, there's might maybe like 10,000 young men,

02:55:49.380 young american men who would have committed suicide if not for him and maybe he set them

02:55:54.880 on a path that led them to something more interesting or radical or trad or whatever

02:56:00.020 but i'm like you need those those people to jail break them out of that so that do you agree that

02:56:05.260 he's lost he's lost that but he doesn't do that anymore it's interesting if you follow his path

02:56:11.360 like something happened when he had that uh time in russia something with his mind um is his

02:56:17.480 addiction to benzo like i see him like dressing very costumey right now too um i think what he's

02:56:23.080 and then he kind of signed on to the daily what was the daily wire i think so yeah so like i'm

02:56:28.480 not a guy who because and also like i find his maps of meaning stuff interesting because like

02:56:34.180 all that youngian mythology stuff like i genuinely find that stuff interesting some people don't but

02:56:39.720 so i'm like oh there's actually some interesting theory behind here he doesn't really talk about

02:56:43.860 that anymore but i don't know like people see him like he's dressed in a suit that looks kind of

02:56:48.600 like a batman villain i'm like that's odd it's odd stuff but i but my fingers off that pulse a

02:56:54.740 little bit so you know maybe well that's the problem like everyone's fingers off the pulse

02:56:57.860 which means that you know if it was just you and me don't maybe suggest that we're missing something

02:57:02.740 but it's everybody it suggests irrelevancy i did go to see him maybe a year and a half ago uh he

02:57:08.820 He came to Indianapolis, where I live, and he, you know, he was speaking to her, but

02:57:14.120 it was about his second book, not 12 Rules for Life, which is, I don't know, Maps of

02:57:20.480 Meaning, I guess, was his first one, one of his first ones, but whatever the second book

02:57:24.100 has, which I have a copy of but haven't read, he was going, talking about, more about those

02:57:28.500 rules, 12 new rules or something, but it was strange because he talked, it was, nothing

02:57:38.360 was that not a single thing was addressed to young men he avoided like the plague it was a lot of

02:57:43.380 kind of rambling but that was not the most interesting the most interesting thing was

02:57:46.780 there's clearly being manipulated by his daughter who was there yeah okay i'm glad you mentioned

02:57:51.740 that because um yeah something what kind of gave me a tip that something was happening was

02:57:57.600 earlier because i actually saw him uh on a speaking tour way way at the beginning because

02:58:03.140 what he was he's canadian so it was a bit easier to catch him uh back when like a ticket to seem

02:58:08.780 to speak was like 30 and now it's like 250 something like that um or maybe that's just

02:58:13.840 canadian whatever but um yeah once he signed on to a talent agency and he started wearing that

02:58:20.340 like a uniform like i'm wearing the same suit for every appearance and i've got these talking

02:58:25.200 points i said okay well he's he's made it to the mainstream that's one thing but then like the

02:58:30.200 relationship with his daughter was out there and there was something going on between them

02:58:34.280 like she's and she's hooked up with andrew tate for a while like there's there's odd things going

02:58:39.580 on i mean well the thing at this talk she kind of emceed it and she picked which questions he

02:58:47.100 would be asked but the most telling thing i because she was clearly kind of leading him

02:58:51.780 around by the nose this is after his russian thing so uh the most telling thing was that

02:58:57.980 at some point i can't remember why she had to recall one of the original 12 rules of order

02:59:04.220 and she couldn't remember it yeah so she doesn't care enough to even know what her i gotta assume

02:59:11.040 she's just in it for the grift and the money yeah at this point because i if the story is this might

02:59:16.280 very well be the story that he was looking to retire but then he thought you what i'm going

02:59:21.300 to get as much money out of this for my family for my daughter as i can you know maybe there's

02:59:27.240 something like an honorable grift in that but at the same time like you had said like i don't really

02:59:32.100 hear him talk about like young men it's more of that same tired uh marketplace of ideas very

02:59:39.040 general free speech stuff which it might have some play with people but i've i've kind of heard enough

02:59:44.660 of that at this point yeah i agree um but he'll i'll see him host uh host more interesting people

02:59:51.060 i saw douglas murray on his show recently and douglas where he's like a more interesting mind

02:59:56.420 than him right now yeah i mean it's not i'm not denigrating you know i push thought experiments

03:00:04.220 myself and foundationalism thought experiment pushing people to think is a valuable exercise

03:00:08.120 but he was doing something unique which he's no longer doing that's kind of what i was going to

03:00:12.500 get to where if i recommend something from jordan peterson it's going to be something older um and

03:00:19.080 i actually one thing i do recommend people and this is kind of tangential to it but he's got

03:00:24.240 some interesting videos on substance abuse um so for people who have like specifically alcoholism

03:00:33.380 so people are struggling with alcoholism he's that was his specialty for a while so he's got

03:00:38.820 some really interesting insight on that because i don't i don't drink anymore i've been sober for a

03:00:44.180 few years but i found when i was at my worst with drinking he actually gave some advice that actually

03:00:49.500 spoke to me and so i'm like you know what like give it seemed like he he had he really had a

03:00:54.780 genuine affection and care for the specifics of that i'm not and that that sounds awesome i mean

03:01:01.840 for people i mean there's a lot of people who need that and i'm not down on jordan pearson i just

03:01:05.140 think it's sad that that they sounding conspiratorial were able to get him off the path

03:01:12.720 that was dangerous to the regime of of organizing young men so you for back to your earlier point

03:01:19.420 on the path he was on pretty soon people would be forming local groups of young men who are

03:01:24.640 interested in jordan peterson and they would find each other through jordan peterson that kind of

03:01:28.780 thing is incredibly dangerous to the regime so i'm not saying that they they stuffed in full

03:01:33.580 benzos and threw him in a russian detox that fried his brain he more likely did that to himself

03:01:39.180 because i think he wasn't his personality he seems very sensitive to criticism yeah listen

03:01:45.760 yeah i'm completely impervious to criticism like yeah i mean it doesn't matter but some people are

03:01:52.580 very emotionally involved you know they want people to like them or something um and so he

03:01:59.100 got thrust into this position and he was the right man for some purposes but but not for every

03:02:03.360 purposes so that's just the way it goes i guess yeah what was interesting and i know people are

03:02:08.060 probably sick of me talking about jordan pearson but just to kind of reframe this into relevant to

03:02:13.020 what we're just talking about that i think what was interesting about him was he was and there

03:02:18.900 might there's other examples of this as well so just so people don't freak out but uh he was

03:02:23.000 granting young men a model to live by that wasn't within the context of women not really whereas

03:02:30.900 someone like an andrew tate when i look at their advice to young men it's always within the context

03:02:36.400 of women it's how to get women to subjugate women it's how to knock them around or whatever but it's

03:02:40.840 like it's not just an a priori male thing it's just like here's how you could you feel enslaved

03:02:47.440 by women here's how to make them your slave and buy a bugatti and shit and like and i'm like you

03:02:52.080 know that's still reactive in a sense yes it's a good point i mean it's not that jordan peterson

03:02:59.220 denigrates women in any way but it and he does mention women in the context of men obviously

03:03:04.920 because it's an important thing for men but revolving everything about men around women is

03:03:10.620 is very derivative and and kind of you know dumb for lack of a better term yeah and it's you know

03:03:17.220 it's funny though when i was in my early early late teens early 20s i was like hanging out with

03:03:21.980 some of those pickup artist guys um and for everyone kind of knows them um but what i found

03:03:29.280 was a piece of advice i went to actually a couple of their like free seminars immediately to try

03:03:33.860 and get you in. I'm like paying $1,500 to hang out with the main guy. I didn't do that, but there

03:03:38.860 was some advice that they gave guys back then that I was, cause I was, I was the target. Like

03:03:44.360 I was in a new city, a big city. I was by myself. I was very, very young and I just, I don't know,

03:03:49.520 what am I doing? And what they said was in the context of meeting women was like, if you want

03:03:55.200 to be desired, you must make yourself desirable. And nine times out of 10, you kind of know what's

03:04:01.360 wrong with yourself you know if you if you feel like you're fat you know you're fat get in shape

03:04:07.260 if you feel like you don't have skills get skills and you know using a woman as a band-aid to make

03:04:14.480 yourself feel better or to cover that up is not going to work in fact that's way way way worse

03:04:19.480 in the long run because then you're going to meet the exact wrong type of woman yes absolutely and

03:04:25.040 And yeah, I find a lot of the kind of alpha, like the red pill guy stuff, it gives them a lot of that.

03:04:33.500 It gives them a lot of these Band-Aid solutions that kind of drive young guys insane.

03:04:38.620 And I hate seeing it because I still talk.

03:04:40.920 I'm sure you do, too.

03:04:41.720 You talk to them every day.

03:04:43.540 And I get back to the main point.

03:04:44.720 That's why I find you so interesting, which is that you're actually trying to jailbreak people from this grift, not only a political grift.

03:04:55.040 focusing on survival rather than ideology but also focusing on like the qualities that

03:05:01.020 the things that can actually get guys to acquire the characteristics of the man they want to be

03:05:07.760 rather than just like pantomiming them which is what a lot of these other guys do yeah pantomime

03:05:12.940 is a good term and i think but that's because people have lost a lot of social structures that

03:05:18.920 inculcated into young men behaviors that weren't pantomimes and so it's understandable obviously

03:05:24.460 that they seek out these red pill guys

03:05:27.220 or the internet or whatever.

03:05:28.640 I think what's less understandable is,

03:05:31.180 as you say, every man kind of deep down

03:05:33.360 knows what's wrong.

03:05:34.520 Not every man, probably some men

03:05:35.720 are either self-fooling enough

03:05:37.940 or not self-reflective enough,

03:05:39.900 but you kind of know what you need to do

03:05:42.000 and you kind of know the kind of women

03:05:43.860 you want to stay away from.

03:05:46.300 But I think the problem there

03:05:49.060 is that society, partially deliberately,

03:05:52.040 partially just as a result

03:05:53.220 of various social trends is so organized around preventing young men from taking the necessary

03:06:01.400 types of actions and offering, as I said earlier, these short-term pleasurable alternatives that

03:06:08.020 are very damaging in the long term, you can see why so many young men are lost.

03:06:14.400 I agree completely. And I know we're going to be getting up to time soon, but I wanted to ask you

03:06:20.140 one last question, because we didn't talk too much about your career leading up to this.

03:06:25.300 And that's something I have a deep interest in because of my general business acumen.

03:06:30.900 It sounded kind of pretentious. Anyway, anywho, but just let people know your pathway was,

03:06:36.800 it was the, you'd mentioned before, like a shampoo magnet. What was the story there?

03:06:41.600 Sure. I love telling the story. And I actually have a long piece on my blog of someone who's

03:06:46.240 interested about, I think I call it entrepreneurial success. But I have endless thoughts about

03:06:51.540 entrepreneurial success. And back to one of your earlier questions, I think if you have the right

03:06:56.140 personality and you're a young man looking to do things, entrepreneurship is definitely something

03:07:00.620 that you should consider, whether that's a small scale or on a larger scale, every person's

03:07:06.700 opportunities, talents, et cetera, are different. But I always wanted to run my own business.

03:07:12.220 I don't like other people telling me what to do.

03:07:14.880 And I managed to score well on a variety of tests.

03:07:20.560 And so I ended up at law school, at a prestigious law school and a prestigious law firm in Chicago.

03:07:25.940 I'm from Indiana.

03:07:26.980 My father taught at Purdue, so I wasn't interested in going to California or New York.

03:07:30.840 Chicago was the farthest I was willing to go.

03:07:33.000 And this was the 1990s or late 1990s, early 2000s, when Chicago hadn't turned into the hellhole that it is now.

03:07:39.700 So it was actually very enjoyable.

03:07:41.600 I had a great time in law school.

03:07:43.080 I had a great time in Chicago.

03:07:45.000 It's sad that it's kind of gone downhill.

03:07:48.200 But being a lawyer is not something I would recommend.

03:07:51.260 And I talk about this at some time.

03:07:52.940 I liked it.

03:07:54.440 I made money at it.

03:07:55.700 But you never get truly rich as a lawyer.

03:07:57.740 And more importantly, other people tell you what to do.

03:08:01.340 Ultimately, even though you can have a large degree of independence,

03:08:04.580 the fact is that when people are paying $800 an hour for your services,

03:08:07.920 they tell you what to do.

03:08:09.320 So whether they're polite about that or not. And so, I mean, I enjoyed it, but I didn't want people telling me what to do and I wanted to be rich. So I came back to Indiana and ultimately after doing a few things, I started a shampoo making business. That's the short form version.

03:08:26.700 It was really a contract manufacturer of mostly hair care products, styling products, care products, which are in the trade or shampoo, conditioner, things like that, styling products, which are things like pomade, fixatives, things that make your hair stand up kind of things.

03:08:44.580 As I talk about, I think it's in my Tucker Carlson interview, which is fairly well trafficked.

03:08:49.200 I was the North American king of black hair care.

03:08:53.060 And you would never know that, hear my name, because the company is a contract manufacturer, or was.

03:09:01.120 I sold it.

03:09:01.640 It doesn't exist anymore.

03:09:03.480 I sold its assets.

03:09:04.820 So there's no vulnerability there.

03:09:09.240 Most brands don't do their own manufacturing.

03:09:11.600 They outsource the manufacturing, but they don't like to advertise that.

03:09:14.960 But it wasn't that I planned to be the king of black hair care.

03:09:17.540 I just stumbled into that.

03:09:18.540 I started this business with literally nothing, no customers, a tiny fraction of the equipment needed, and just somehow stumbled into having an extremely large, not extremely large, but very large, and more importantly, very high margin.

03:09:33.640 That is, most people think that contract manufacturing is a low margin business.

03:09:37.100 That's simply not true if you're in the right area and you have the right functions, which is basically a value add, but does never compete on price.

03:09:46.380 then you're just a bitch we used to call that the bitch model and uh and so so it's very profitable

03:09:52.180 and i sold it for a bunch of money and you know now a bunch of people on the internet think that

03:09:56.360 i i uh i spend my days funding weird right-wing causes that they can't really specify when the

03:10:03.460 reality is i spend most of my days as a gentleman farmer raising bees and uh and tilling the land

03:10:08.660 to amuse myself and writing on my site. I mean, I suppose if I had like some super awesome secret

03:10:17.620 society that I thought was going to take over the world, I wouldn't fund it, but that's

03:10:24.000 unfortunately not what's going on. And for the most part, like I don't give money to politicians.

03:10:29.440 I don't give money to political things, except for a few political things. I much rather give

03:10:36.340 money to local charities, which is really where most of the money tends to go.

03:10:40.400 Well, that's a fascinating story. And it's something resonates with me because I know

03:10:45.980 in the Tucker interview, it's mentioned something that I try and press on people, especially

03:10:51.240 entrepreneurs, because that was going to be the next question about sort of advice for

03:10:54.440 young entrepreneurs. But what I would always tell people is I am attracted to what you

03:10:59.620 described as unsexy businesses. Those are the ones that tend to make the most money.

03:11:04.680 They're not the top of mind businesses.

03:11:06.640 Everyone wants to start a tech startup.

03:11:08.400 And I've worked, I've had them as clients and I've worked inside of them and it's not

03:11:13.100 what you think it is.

03:11:14.960 But it's like kind of the unsexy mid-level businesses that not only make the most money

03:11:22.800 and are the most stable, but I genuinely find more interesting and I find them more

03:11:27.360 useful to society.

03:11:28.580 Like if you get a good organization that's somewhere on the manufacturing pipeline, you'll learn more about how society functions than like a top level startup owned by Google.

03:11:42.000 Absolutely.

03:11:43.000 Yeah, I think that's totally right.

03:11:45.500 And that's something.

03:11:46.280 And you said that's kind of what attracted you because you wanted to get into it and say, I want to make a whole mess of money.

03:11:51.660 And you just kind of identified the sector or was there something that sort of drew you to hair care?

03:11:58.060 Well, it's totally random.

03:11:59.240 I only had one thing I wanted, which is to be rich.

03:12:02.960 Rich, rich, rich.

03:12:03.960 That's all I care about.

03:12:04.620 I don't want world peace.

03:12:05.560 I want to be rich.

03:12:06.640 And you need to have that.

03:12:08.460 Don't waste your time saying, I would like to give back, which I think is an odious concept.

03:12:14.160 Or I would like, and it is true that being rich allows you to be independent and some

03:12:18.000 other benefits.

03:12:18.760 But the goal of being an entrepreneur should be to be rich.

03:12:22.520 Because if you don't want to be rich, you just want to be your own boss, say, you're

03:12:27.160 going to have the drive necessary to make it successful. But I didn't care what it was. That

03:12:32.540 is, for a brief while, I ran a cabinetry making business, but that was mostly a stopgap while I

03:12:36.860 was looking for something else. The problem is that I discussed this in one of the pieces on my

03:12:41.580 site. It's difficult to find a business to buy, that everyone thinks that you can, I'm going to

03:12:49.200 find a business to buy that the owner doesn't really know what he's doing or he's going to

03:12:55.540 retire and he's not going to know how to value it. So I'll buy it for cheap. And because I'm this

03:12:59.600 smart guy, I'm going to make it much bigger and I'll be rich. That's just moronic, especially

03:13:07.080 with the internet. There are no undervalued businesses to buy. I mean, every Tom, Dick and

03:13:14.860 Harry out there, every small PE fund, every guy like you is looking around for businesses to buy.

03:13:21.240 So the only way to start a successful business without incurring a bunch of debt to buy a successful business and pray you can make it bigger while making the debt service, because I had almost no debt when I started this business, I didn't have any money.

03:13:34.340 I mean, I was dirt poor and I didn't have any savings.

03:13:36.940 My wife would just now she was pregnant with our second child.

03:13:39.560 And I'm like, I think I'll take my income to zero and and, you know, we have no savings.

03:13:45.320 And then I'll like borrow 20 grand to start this business.

03:13:48.320 And she's like, sure, honey.

03:13:49.960 But anyway, I was like, sure, honey, as it happens, it wasn't even an argument.

03:13:53.660 It just seems all insane.

03:13:54.940 But I was looking for a business to buy that was distressed, in essence.

03:13:59.880 So, for example, I would troll bankruptcy filings, local bankruptcy filings, using the federal court system, court filing system, which is called PACER.

03:14:10.940 I didn't find anything there, but there were ultimately.

03:14:13.100 And the week before, I'll tell in a second how I got into the shampoo business precisely.

03:14:21.240 No, but this is far more interesting, especially that story of you starting debt-free but also dirt poor and being in a position with a family, which is a lot of people will resonate with that.

03:14:32.320 And I think that's a fascinating element of the story.

03:14:34.860 Well, you have to be willing to take the risks and you have to have a supportive spouse.

03:14:38.580 But it's true that my risks weren't as great as some people, perhaps, because I did have

03:14:43.220 these fancy law and business degrees, so I could always have gone back to doing those

03:14:47.120 things.

03:14:47.800 So I say it was risky, but the risk was largely humiliation and having to dig myself out

03:14:53.240 of a financial hole, not so much that I would be literally homeless.

03:14:59.060 That said, you know, we didn't have any savings.

03:15:00.740 We don't have any rich relatives or parents or anything or even well-to-do parents.

03:15:04.780 And so so but the week before I started the shampoo business, I bid at auction on the assets of a concrete cutting and coring business, you know, big three foot saws that cut highway from highway holes for manholes or something like that.

03:15:22.500 And I was outbid and that probably would have been a terrible business for a variety of reasons.

03:15:26.180 But I could have been, you know, Haywood could have been one of those guys out there in the blazing sun using a concrete saw.

03:15:33.040 But I didn't get that.

03:15:34.800 And the next week, there was a contract, a similar contract manufacturing company that the owner and founder had died.

03:15:42.920 And the widow and son had tried to run the business and then run it into the ground.

03:15:46.880 They'd lost all the customers and the bank.

03:15:48.720 It wasn't a foreclosure.

03:15:50.260 Exactly.

03:15:50.840 It wasn't a bankruptcy.

03:15:51.580 see the bank basically said you know it was basically what's a deed in lieu or whatever

03:15:56.520 the term is where the bank auctions off off your stuff and you call it a day and uh and so i but

03:16:02.620 they were selling like six million dollars worth of equipment and i bought like 40 grand worth of

03:16:07.560 equipment so it wasn't like i bought a factory and i didn't there were no customers or anything

03:16:11.520 and so my wife is like well where are you going to put this i bought a tank for mixing up shampoo

03:16:16.080 and what's called a fill head which helps you fill bottles so you don't have to pour individual

03:16:20.940 bottles. My wife is like, where are you going to put this stuff? I'm like, I don't know. I'll

03:16:24.380 figure that out. And I put some of it in our garage and sublet a place and then went looking

03:16:29.480 for customers. And I mean, it all just seems completely insane in retrospect, but it worked

03:16:33.960 out because so much of what business is, is simply getting things done. You have to be decisive with

03:16:43.500 respect to what the questions that people who work for you ask you, but you also have to be decisive

03:16:49.060 about identifying what needs to be done and doing it.

03:16:52.580 And that's, most people simply don't do that.

03:16:55.400 They're comfortable with having a task list

03:16:59.260 that is not complete at the end of the day

03:17:01.620 and is not designed,

03:17:03.460 not completed at the end of the day

03:17:05.060 and is not designed to be complete.

03:17:06.940 That is to do everything that is necessary

03:17:08.900 to accomplish success.

03:17:10.860 So for example, one of the first things I had to do

03:17:12.920 when I sublet a place was rebuild the toilet

03:17:15.640 because who else was going to do it?

03:17:17.620 And I was certainly about to pay someone a couple hundred bucks to do it and take out the trash and do this and do that, mix the shampoo myself, do all these things.

03:17:24.760 And we didn't have any, I didn't have any employees at the beginning.

03:17:26.860 So eventually it came together, but I mostly learned by doing.

03:17:32.260 I didn't have any plan at all, I guess, to answer your earlier question.

03:17:34.940 It wasn't, it wasn't, I identified this sector.

03:17:37.080 It just randomly popped up and I became a shampoo guy.

03:17:39.640 Well, I like the angle that you took though, which is a lot of people when they start a business, and this is something I've been guilty of in the past too.

03:17:47.620 especially if they're of the mind where I'm like,

03:17:49.980 I need to start a disruptive business.

03:17:52.340 So you set such a high goal for,

03:17:54.500 I need to start a revolutionary business,

03:17:57.000 which is kind of silly,

03:17:58.220 but find a business that makes sense.

03:18:01.300 Find something that you can start on your own if need be,

03:18:06.420 because I've known a few guys who they start like,

03:18:08.760 okay, I'm gonna start a business.

03:18:09.740 I first, right at the gate, I got to hire 10 people

03:18:12.280 and I'm going to need a couple of interns to make it work.

03:18:14.780 and they and then you know they they get paralyzed by this crazy business plan that they've drawn up

03:18:21.000 for themselves because drawing up a business plan almost feels like you're running a business you

03:18:25.620 know you're like i did it i got a business plan um you know but but identifying and this is the

03:18:31.640 part of marketing that i like which is the marketing aspect finding the hole that needs to

03:18:37.000 be filled in the marketplace like what do people need what's a safe bet what's what's an unsexy

03:18:41.600 thing but you use it all the time like i i would have a joke not a joke more of a comment really

03:18:47.480 but then i would say that i i if i find someone at a party who started a tech startup i want to

03:18:54.380 be nowhere near them but find me a guy who runs a factory that makes doorknobs that guy's going

03:19:00.560 to have stories for days and he's probably going to be very highly intelligent and he's going to

03:19:06.360 have a charisma about him and not a fake charisma that a lot of these glorified salesmen have so

03:19:12.820 they don't have to impress a bunch of people i i will say that the the secret behind

03:19:18.020 entrepreneurial success aside from decisiveness and some of these other things i talk about

03:19:24.520 is realizing that the vast majority of other businesses even successful businesses are run

03:19:32.020 incompetently. So if you can simply be having a adequate level of competence, that is, you respond

03:19:39.340 to customer inquiries, you communicate with customers, you do what you say you're going to do

03:19:44.000 when there's a problem. These principles seem obvious, but it never ceased to amaze me. And I

03:19:49.960 have never understood why, take my business, the vast majority of my competitors were just

03:19:55.480 bone incompetent. And that's why we grew so rapidly in part because we were just better.

03:20:00.920 And it's not because I'm a great manager or a great identifier of talent, but I did have a great team. How I assembled that team is not clear to me because I'm not good at identifying talent. I'm not good at managing. But it wasn't just that I was competent, is my point. Everybody was competent and everyone was very independent in some of the stuff we talked about earlier.

03:20:20.860 But most businesses, your competitors are going to be incompetent, or if they're not overtly incompetent, they're going to be hampered by something. They'll be hampered by feminization. They're going to be hampered by a culture of risk aversion because the guy at the top isn't predictable. Another thing, I mean, a boss should always be predictable. Same inputs, same outputs, except once a year, I always lost my temper on principle, fake or not, just to show that I wasn't.

03:20:44.460 um but it's uh uh so it's my point is if you're willing to take the risk and do what it takes

03:20:52.180 and if you're competent you can get everything done it's surprising how much traction you'll get

03:20:57.360 simply because the customers of whatever it is you're selling are likely to be frustrated

03:21:02.900 particularly in a b2b kind of environment they're likely to be frustrated or at least some of them

03:21:07.260 are going to be frustrated by their current service and even though switching costs in

03:21:11.380 almost every industry are actually much higher than you would think, mostly in terms of risk

03:21:15.500 rather than out-of-pocket switching costs, they'll be willing to take a chance on you.

03:21:19.520 And if you can make it happen, then you get word of mouth. At the end of the day,

03:21:23.260 most B2B businesses are word of mouth and reputation is everything. So you can do it too.

03:21:29.080 You just need to put one foot in front of the other. That's what I noticed too, especially

03:21:33.040 with B2B, but even a lot of B2C stuff, it's the word of mouth. And a lot of marketing right now

03:21:38.180 um and advertising advertising is in a bit of a strange state right now generally especially

03:21:42.820 digital advertising but it's trying to either generate word of mouth or create the facade of

03:21:48.600 word of mouth and that's why influencer marketing has exploded as like influencer marketing is kind

03:21:54.960 of weird though i've got stories about that shit but it all comes down to fake numbers like across

03:22:00.200 the board most digital marketing i've begun to sour on because i became aware of just how fake

03:22:07.060 most of these numbers are they can't really be trusted but that's a whole other thing entirely

03:22:12.360 yeah it's fascinating I don't pay much attention to it I mean I see you know the Kardashians are

03:22:16.440 influencers but I'm so I'm so not in that world that it's completely indifferent to me well that's

03:22:22.540 because again this is why I like these sorts of businesses because you know I still have clients

03:22:27.420 now and I do the due diligence of if I'm running a digital campaign for them I will call them up

03:22:32.780 and say, now they're saying that you got 20 new phone calls this week. Have you received extra

03:22:38.400 phone calls? And sometimes they'll say no. And that's how I know Google is lying about their

03:22:42.080 call tracking. But like a lot of places don't do that. And just to add on to your point for young

03:22:47.800 entrepreneurs out there, if you approach this as a human and actually give a shit about dealing

03:22:53.960 with your clients or dealing with everything, you'll be shocked at how rare that is. And they'll

03:22:59.700 think you're trying to do something crazy by like calling them up and acting like hey is this

03:23:03.620 campaign working because i want it to work i'm invested in you succeeding not just taking your

03:23:08.460 money that doesn't happen a lot it's fascinating i mean i i think the direct approach actually does

03:23:15.620 make a lot of sense i mean i i started doing a lot of that ultimately when the company had

03:23:20.840 enough word of mouth that people were generally aware of the company even if they ever talked to

03:23:26.200 at that point especially you can contact people and they'll have heard a few so they'll be polite

03:23:33.380 and either they have a need or they don't so you basically win either way if you don't if you they

03:23:38.080 don't have a current need they'll remember that you're an organized guy who reached out to them

03:23:42.000 politely and asked if they had a need if they do have a need they're like well now that you mention

03:23:45.580 it i have some business for you it's just not that hard yeah honestly like that that's a great

03:23:50.560 point and that's something i would encourage again to bring this back to young entrepreneurs

03:23:54.280 guys who might want to follow in your footsteps or do something similar, like do not, and I've

03:24:00.460 dealt with some people recently like this, like don't undervalue picking up a phone and calling

03:24:05.460 people and just having a conversation that will stick in their memory more than a thousand

03:24:12.820 exposures to your ad, you know, because there's social proof established in that. And I would

03:24:17.920 apply that to anyone who's getting into politics, anyone who's doing anything, like just networking

03:24:23.380 sucks. Everyone hates networking, me more than anyone. But the only time my career has ever

03:24:29.640 gone well is when I actually just like showed up at a place or picked up a phone and called someone

03:24:33.580 that's paid off in spades later. It doesn't surprise me. And I mean, there's two kinds of

03:24:38.860 networking, right? There's fake networking, where you're basically looking to get something out of

03:24:43.080 somebody else. And you're not really interested in that person. And you don't really see it as

03:24:48.220 through a lens of reciprocity and that everybody can sense that right but if you it it's like the

03:24:53.940 thing that i'm old enough now that your friends from previous years or decades or whatever fall

03:25:01.620 into the two categories the kind who call you just because they want want to stay in touch and the

03:25:06.980 kind to call you when they want something yeah so you know you don't want to be that latter thing

03:25:11.500 and that doesn't mean they're not your friends still but it does it changes the the meaning of

03:25:15.900 friendship when the p when every time you hear from somebody it's because they want something

03:25:19.260 you you feel used and cheap and so yeah no that's a great thing and that's something that um

03:25:26.760 you know as as you accumulate wisdom that all becomes very clear and i guess being a

03:25:31.560 having a family changes that as well because you have less patience for useless people

03:25:36.740 because me and my wife were laughing at the other day it's like hey remember when we used to have

03:25:41.860 free time remember we used to just like hang out and do a thing like but you know when you have

03:25:47.840 kids and you have a family it's like yeah you know what the rest of the year looks like pretty

03:25:51.760 much what are you doing this weekend i ask i know exactly what i'm doing i'm not milling around

03:25:56.520 yeah exactly and and if you do find yourself at loose ends you kind of look at yourself

03:26:04.180 differently you're like why am i not doing something useful yeah especially as you get

03:26:08.060 older there's a panic that uh falls over you if you and that's a good panic to have that means

03:26:14.060 you're on the right track yes now i know you've got to get going now so i just wanted to thank you

03:26:20.020 once again for taking the time uh to talk to me i want to make sure everyone checks out the worthy

03:26:25.060 house at theworthyhouse.com um that's where you can find all your recent appearances all your

03:26:30.980 reviews and uh was there any other anything that i missed that you were wanted to plug

03:26:37.280 not a thing i think we were we were we covered a lot of ground and uh and uh you know clarified

03:26:44.240 a lot of things and i think it was very fun now and i want people to check out this site because

03:26:48.560 as someone myself who writes 5 000 word articles about things if you like that you're going to

03:26:55.340 really like charles's stuff it's very very good so once again thank you so much for taking the

03:27:00.600 time and I hope to speak to you soon. My pleasure. Thank you.

Blood Satellite - September 15, 2023

15 Minute Walk Like an Egyptianable Cities [＂brocc the idea of records＂]

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Transcript