00:09:49.220I agree with you where it's like one of those scenarios where it's like she needs to go away for a long time.
00:09:57.020You know, the premeditation element of trying to kill your kids, no matter what influence of drugs and what cocktail, what you're going through, how much severe depression you're going through, everything else.
00:10:12.520To me, insanity defense should be reserved for, in my opinion, when you are totally out of touch with reality.1.00
00:10:23.880So if a mentally handicapped person kills someone because they don't even understand that they're hurting them or that they're killing a person, I get that there.0.99
00:10:32.220But a person who has enough, frankly, presence of mind to be able to kill one child, then another, then the other, and to wait until someone left the home to do it because otherwise they would be stopped.0.99
00:10:45.640That is a person with enough presence of mind to be punished for this crime.
00:10:50.760Let's get Cliff in before we go all the way down.
00:10:55.740Yeah, look, when I first read the headlines to understand, like you guys said, that she told her husband to leave the house, right?
00:11:01.380It's about as premeditated as it gets to plan, to conjure, to have him leave the house and have a woman strangle three of her own children immediately, you know, not even knowing what state it was.
00:11:11.780I'm thinking, yes, death penalty, 100 percent maximum sentence in a state like Massachusetts.
00:11:57.040but to tell your husband to leave the house, strangle your three kids, you belong locked up0.89
00:12:02.700in prison forever. That's, that's where I'm at. That's, that's right with it. Prison or some kind0.97
00:12:09.300of, um, you know, mental, uh, so I've, I've talked about this before. My, my dad, uh, worked at
00:12:15.360Cliff, you know, the Norristown state hospital in, uh, Norristown PA and, um, you know, his entire
00:12:21.100career, just under 30 years, um, which was a psychiatric hospital. It still is a psychiatric
00:12:25.560hospital it was much larger when the you know the asylums were more well funded and uh he did work
00:12:32.040in one of the buildings where the criminally insane um did take up residence and you know
00:12:38.680folks who were deemed unfit to stand trial uh john du pont was there for example my dad was there
00:12:45.560um so the guy who just went completely nuts and was like killing the olympic team and there's
00:12:50.120a whole movie about it i think it's called fox catcher it's pretty good movie actually
00:12:53.960and just kind of lining up the whole story and um you know and has worked with that so it's it's
00:12:59.800something i've always been aware of and it's you know as a society i i do think that you need a
00:13:05.320place for people like that um whether or not it's you know in this case chemically induced or
00:13:12.280whatever i think that every society throughout history is always going to have a certain quotient
00:13:17.240of people that for whatever reason uh have a break with reality and that's clearly what this was
00:13:25.400and and as such you need a place to stick those people to keep them away from everybody else
00:13:31.560and their own kids by the way indeed yeah let me make a plug here that i i feel like so many0.89
00:13:36.840politicians are scared to say which is we need to bring back these insane asylums i mean i just0.99
00:13:42.120That's what I'm saying. Yeah, exactly.1.00
00:13:44.540There's got to be a place. I mean, if you guys walk down the street of any major city, right, the amount of mentally disturbed people that are not just homeless, they're not just drug addicts, they're not just alcoholics.
00:13:55.100We've seen it on subways. We've seen so many cases. These people are mentally disturbed.
00:14:01.000And so, you know, these politicians want to always have compassion and especially the cities with these Democrat leaders.
00:14:06.760we need to fund these things again because some people do not fit in society and they're always
00:14:11.880genuinely annoys me i've got to be frank it annoys me because i've been hearing this cyclically for
00:14:16.520my entire adult life it'll go there's oh there's a bunch of vagrants who are committing crimes or
00:14:21.500people are doing dozens of crimes and getting arrested and then released and they're not being
00:14:24.940held that long and they're not being charged and this will get brought up and people will point0.99
00:14:29.400out oh well it's because we cleared out the asylums and when you bring that up what always
00:14:33.320then follows up is like liberals will come out and they'll say that was reagan's fault reagan's
00:14:36.940the one who emptied out the asylums yeah i don't know if that's true or not i think it's false but
00:14:42.020even if that's the reason okay ronald reagan has been dead for 22 years ronald reagan has not been
00:14:47.740in office since i've been alive you could refund them there's been democrat mono control of
00:14:55.080congress at the federal level there's been republican mono party control at the federal
00:14:59.400level there are individual states that are red or blue why doesn't somebody just do this just go
00:15:06.260and say we're gonna try to do it yeah funny enough blake it's actually it's actually jack
00:15:11.240nicholson's fault um because cuckoo's nest really one one floor of the cuckoo's nest yeah this whole
00:15:18.940the whole um defund the metal institutions push goes back to one floor of the cuckoo's nest
00:15:24.700And this, by the way, the same way that the anti-nuclear trend in the 1970s goes back to the film, The China Syndrome, which was also the name of my first band.
00:15:35.700And it just became this like, oh my gosh, we can't have nuclear power, everyone's going to die.
00:15:43.700Same way One Flew of the Cuckoo's Nest, it came out in that era and suddenly it was like, oh, we have to shut down all the asylums, Nurse Ratched, they're so bad, they're so terrible,0.94
00:15:51.700terrible. You're going to have an Indian throwing a water fountain through the window. You know,1.00
00:15:55.120it's so bad. And, and they just, they just started doing it. And so you can, yeah, like Reagan was
00:16:01.860part of it, but there are lots of Democrats part of it too. It's like, whatever, right? We can,
00:16:05.400we can point out that there are things that Republicans and Democrats likewise have done
00:16:10.500that we disagree with. Nixon also had price controls, by the way, we disagree with that.
00:16:15.400And so, you know, the idea that we're going to sit here and play this partisan game with it,
00:16:19.680it's like, you're just kicking the can down the road rather than actually doing what we need to
00:16:23.820do. Exactly. But guys, I think we've speaking of kicking down the can down the road, we need to
00:16:30.900engage with who really belongs in the asylums, which is basically all of the, all of the true0.95
00:16:37.060crime podcast obsessives, or I don't know what else to describe it as, but this is the insanity
00:16:42.700around the case, Jack or Tyler, whoever, whichever of you has the better, maybe you can one up each
00:16:48.820other what's the most insane thing you're seeing people do where they're not even going with they're
00:16:53.260not even debating the question of okay does this qualify as the sort of murder where someone should
00:16:58.620go away they're they're embracing a truly alternate version of reality on this case right yeah tyler
00:17:03.940what do you well let's see what what are you seeing on reddit i i know i know you're a big
00:17:07.220side railed right you side uh sidelined you before i'm just scrolling through all of the debates that
00:17:14.340are being had about it. And again, it just is, it's kind of reminiscent of some of the things
00:17:19.760that we've seen in recent months. It's like people just like, you go to Reddit, you go to
00:17:26.820Reddit, you're basically going to the cancer factory to begin with. So, you know, like, you
00:17:31.460know what you're getting into, but I would like to hear what what's going on over there down at
00:17:35.180the old cancer plant. Well, I think some of these things are pretty obvious. So there's the,
00:17:41.700There's the baseline argument about, you know, the what was prescribed and there's a clear confusion about the facts.
00:17:53.940Right. And it looks like a big debate exists out there.
00:17:57.500And so a lot of this is a misunderstanding that all of the drugs that are on the list were prescribed to her at the same time.
00:18:05.820and that's from what i'm reading that's that's the that's the argument and the debate that that's
00:18:11.440not true that the facts of the case that have been coming out and again i haven't i haven't
00:18:17.020been watching this closely i know like very little about this i'm just reading you know
00:18:21.800third-party documentation of this on the worst platform well let's get let's get into a few of
00:18:27.540the other ones uh so like some of the specific stuff people are alleging um wait but but hold
00:18:33.080on hold on like and i'll just i'll even i'll respond to that though that these types of drugs
00:18:38.260just because they're um first of all you know mommy brain is real so when you have a child now
00:18:44.420i think her youngest was eight months she didn't just have the child um but she was in that in that
00:18:49.420you know one year window and that mommy brain is 100 real that all sorts of things happen1.00
00:18:54.960hormonally with women spiritually biologically all that uh when they have a child um that also0.98
00:19:00.640doesn't mean that, you know, it's okay to kill your kids. But the idea that you're taking those
00:19:07.740drugs at the same time you're experiencing all of that, you know, hormonal activity is going on
00:19:14.120is it, even if you took it one time, and so, you know, to the point of, oh, well, she's taking them
00:19:19.700exactly at the same time or together, they stay in your system. This isn't like, you know, like an
00:19:25.520aspirin or something like these are very serious anti-psychotic drugs Sarah he's had a circle I
00:19:31.380think Lamictal he said Colossopan it's just very serious mind-altering drugs so some of the
00:19:36.680arguments they're being made is that she kept going in seeing a specialist and then rejecting
00:19:44.700the drugs that were prescribed or saying that the drugs weren't working on her within just days after
00:19:51.340being prescribed the drugs and then she was being put on other drugs and then was she still just
00:19:57.140taking the other drugs still or from what i understand and again i don't know i'm not watching
00:20:02.160this closely but the answer to that is no but some people think that she was and and and therefore
00:20:08.840the the evaluators were doing her an injustice doing a severe injustice by
00:20:17.160just piling on more drugs when she had already been prescribed other drugs yeah there's a bit
00:20:22.600of that by the way guys this is this i just i just happened to click over this is now the lead
00:20:27.080story on daily mail like that's how big this case yeah no yeah if you're not paying attention this
00:20:31.560is just like a gigantic thing like this is there are people this is all they've been watching all
00:20:35.240week or all the past two weeks because i think we're on day 11 of the trial or so as we record
00:20:40.040this and okay i'll explain that article um when we get to that point but there's yeah there's
00:20:50.440We've been beating around the bush on this.
00:20:51.740So, guys, here's what's going on with the true crime people.
00:20:54.480So, we've said they're not, like, the defense is not contesting that she killed her kids.
00:21:00.220The prosecution is, there's agreement on just, okay, this is basically a medical case, a pharma case.
00:21:06.140Yes. But people online on TikTok, there are diehard Lindsay Clancy supporters who believe that she is has been framed from the start by her husband.
00:21:18.740And their main arguments for this are, well, let's let's read one of these, for example.
00:21:23.100Well, actually, Blake, I don't even know if you're looking at it, but that's literally what the the the lead story on Daily Mail is.
00:21:30.420All right. Yeah. Let's just get into it.
00:21:32.160So heinous slurs about Lindsey Clancy's ex-husband, Patrick, explode.
00:21:36.080Now his family is speaking out as murder trial grips America.
00:23:16.700So some critics have accused Patrick of missing warning signs and failing to protect his own children, which I, you know, I would certainly agree with.0.86
00:23:27.180But some have some cruel viral posts have suggested without evidence that Patrick was somehow involved in the murders.0.99
00:42:46.240And so they want a pill for anything, even a problem where it's really just you should toughen up, you should change your behavior.
00:42:54.640I think we talk a lot like we over we use overly therapeutic language for things like get therapy is an insanely common piece of advice for people on everything.
00:43:04.860And I just think a lot of problems would be, whether you could actually describe them in pharmacological terms or not, it might be more useful for the person if the common response was, you just need to behave better.
00:43:21.180Like, it's actually just morally wrong what you're doing as opposed to, oh, you actually have this disorder that we've classified in the DSM in these eight different ways.
00:43:32.900And I feel like America, for example, whenever we have that, you know, a mass shooting and we'll say America needs to be talking more about mental health.
00:43:42.420Well, we didn't have mass shootings 50 years ago and we were never talking about mental health then in comparison.
00:43:49.240Something about this all just seems off to me.
00:46:45.960And I think it points towards stuff that we're inclined to describe as like a highly clinical, technical mental illness are often social, they're manifestations of social trends that people hear, oh, this is what a person does when they're a little loopy.
00:47:00.520This is what a person does when they're depressed, when they're in distress after they have a baby, and that manifests.
00:47:05.700So to put it another way, for example, is a lot of postpartum depression caused by the fact that people talk about postpartum depression a lot?
00:47:45.720it's not perfect and you can't afford to be a man and talk publicly about oh my mental health1.00
00:47:50.580we all have bad days and good days and i believe that as a man you suck that crap up usually if0.98
00:47:56.000you're a man you have a lot of people relying on you to deliver your wife your kids possibly other0.99
00:48:01.260family members if you run a business every one of your employees yeah there's no time for men's0.58
00:48:06.880mental health you're an effing man get up put your effing shoes on and get out there and be a man
00:48:12.600and i just think that narrative has kind of been lost but i agree with dana white i mean sometimes
00:48:17.060you just got to toughen it up and deal with it you don't have to sit across from a therapist
00:48:20.800you don't have to just manifest in it you got to figure out solutions and times have to be tough
00:48:26.740to create those solutions well and that goes back to my point i originally kind of brought up which
00:48:31.560is you know men and for sure men are having way more psychotic breaks today than they were
00:48:38.900you know 20 30 50 years ago right so this is not just it's some of this is an application problem
00:48:47.300of you know modern conveniences and that like to that point is and i totally agree with you cliff
00:48:54.620is that you you usually can get over and work through most problems in life by like actually
00:49:01.100like committing yourself to work and doing the right things and keeping yourself busy enough
00:49:06.660where these things don't become, you know, mental, mental anguish in your head. And that's the point
00:49:13.460with, with women was that women had a lot more of that, right? Like, I mean, some of the question
00:49:19.540here is like, are women doing things that they really aren't built to do, which is, you know,0.99
00:49:25.500high performance jobs that they're thrown into that they, you know, have like, we're seeing all0.99
00:49:31.300the TikToks and things like that, that they are clearly communicating that they don't really want0.99
00:49:34.800And they wish they didn't have like those, those tick tocks that the show of like women like arguing for, you know, full time work weeks and things like that.0.99
00:49:45.120But, you know, even at home when they were at home, women pre the 40s or 30s when soap operas began and they were named soap operas because they advertise soap because of the listeners to the soap operas because they were cleaning out.0.99
00:50:00.620They were straight up like spot, like the show was brought to you.0.67
00:50:03.240they were all sponsored by soap. That's why they're called soap offers. And so because they
00:50:07.620were, they were washing floors by hand and they were scrubbing baseboards every day and they were
00:50:13.220boiling hot water so they could wash their clothes because they didn't have modern conveniences of
00:50:17.780modern washing machines. And they were cooking meals from scratch because there was no preparation
00:50:22.760convenience that existed. And so there's all these things that it's like the same, it's the
00:50:27.600same issue though right whether you're a man or a woman and you have you know mental ineptitude you
00:50:34.000have mental breaks you have you know crazy things that are kind of coming at because they're people
00:50:40.860aren't working as hard as they once were people and again that's actually that's some beauty of
00:50:45.820modern convenience people aren't working as hard and they're like with their hands all the time
00:50:51.180and they're on their phones all the time which means like i i do think social media psychosis
00:50:55.800This is absolutely central to this as well.
00:51:16.100Like how much time would you actually have
00:51:18.040for a cell phone and content on a cell phone
00:51:21.700if you were trapped in a field every single day?
00:51:25.060or again on your hands and knees scrubbing with water that you have to boil yourself
00:51:30.240over a flame like right like you wouldn't have as much time we the reality of most of our problems
00:51:36.640is they're self-created they're self-induced because you have so much time to be able to do
00:51:41.140those things well uh tyler two things on that uh first of all that's an absolutely brilliant uh
00:51:47.800point i was gonna make a different response um when you said they were not working as much
00:51:52.040But when you pointed out that you're talking about, like, manual labor, that's 100% true, because many of the things that you're describing there are also linked with increases in testosterone.
00:52:05.260And so when Roig Nationalist was here, and he was talking about his book, that's exactly what he was saying, that, you know, we used to do these things so much more as a society.
00:52:14.940and as a and testosterone is a regulator it's also a strength there but it's a regulator
00:52:19.800so it's regulating that behavior uh so much more uh particularly in men but not just men
00:52:25.380in in women as well obviously we don't want to go full you know wmba with the testosterone here
00:52:30.380um but uh you know one of the things that i was going to point out is and i had a long conversation
00:52:36.340with uh mike cernovich about this the other day because you know talking about this case but then
00:52:41.280also talking about how you see you see a lot more of these what men do unfortunately which is even
00:52:46.800worse is family destructions and you probably see more men do family destruction rather than
00:52:52.880just straight up child killing where it's particularly associated with losing their jobs
00:52:57.460and you see a lot of high net worth high net worth men will lose their job or they get caught having
00:53:04.740an affair and you see a headline this you know like a couple times a week lately where suddenly
00:53:09.980they because they're all of their status is wrapped up in their job and that's kind of what
00:53:14.620i was saying a couple weeks ago when i was saying that you you know we shouldn't center our entire
00:53:18.700lives around capital and the accumulation of material wealth and status in that um then they0.97
00:53:26.060will go and like kill their children kill themselves kill their wife and and i think
00:53:31.660that that's a big part of it i think that that's it's people putting their you know wrapping their0.99
00:53:37.340entire lives around that material item i'm not saying that's what the lindsay clancy case i'm
00:53:42.540saying this is what you see when men commit these family destructions because they think oh my life
00:53:48.220is over and all of these people you know the wife the children they all exist because of me and if
00:53:55.900my life is over then their lives have to be over too and that's what creates this mental snap because
00:54:00.780I'm like, you know, I, I would just, you know, I would, I would be totally fine losing every
00:54:07.760single, they could zero out my bank accounts, you could zero out my social media. As long as I have
00:54:11.580my wife and kids, I'll be fine. I'll go get a job at a gas station. I'll go work at Wawa. I, I really
00:54:16.560would not care in the least, but for me, the reason I, I work and that I have anything
00:54:21.800is for my family, not the opposite. Yeah. And I think that's where everybody is,
00:54:28.060where it's like the lack of of uh priorities within society and again you can blame social
00:54:37.260media for a lot of this where it's like constantly the confusion of what's most important you know
00:54:42.700what's going to give you solace what's going to you know kind of bring you home what's most
00:54:47.960important right like whatever whatever's get each individual's getting bombarded with right now0.97
00:54:54.140whether you're a man or you're a woman but you know in particular i wonder women are getting0.88
00:54:58.200bombarded i think way more and i say this feeling bad for women because i think women are far more
00:55:03.640bombarded by this stuff um you know even in just conversations you know i'll have you know with
00:55:10.700with women in my life and with like friends uh of you know and spouses of of people it's like
00:55:19.020it's like there's like a total lack of priorities sometimes with some some people where they're
00:55:26.160they're not focused on those things that are most important which is again their family their kids
00:55:32.660their relationships right they're focused on a billion other things you know feeling depressed
00:55:39.280because of the the vacation that wasn't as good as the neighbors or you know not having the dress
00:55:46.040or the home or the flooring or the whatever right that's like that's being thrown at them on
00:55:51.920instagram you know the tick tocks have been just horrible because it's it's not just the the the
00:55:59.060short content that's just like silly goofy stuff but it's the commentary on again like that soap
00:56:05.600opera type stuff which is commentary and the constant what's happening online and and and
00:56:10.420wanting to know like what's going on online all the time with all these different things
00:56:13.840and it's just it's just brain rot and again it's just this misprioritization um that's again
00:56:22.540disproportionately affecting women and because they have more time on their hands and and i think
00:56:28.800the only answer they just invest more time in it i i do the only answer though is like to this point
00:56:34.160is like to me it's like is is that manual labor like the only answer for tyler force women into
00:56:41.180manual there we go all right society's problems we're gonna take women we're gonna delete their
00:56:48.140instagram and we're gonna make them do that old timey washing on the washboards i think men i0.71
00:56:53.740think men are falling yeah kind of for this too right because we don't do men don't do i don't do
00:57:00.220nearly enough with my hand like i'm not picking up a shovel every like once or twice a week and
00:57:06.480digging something I'm not doing project like and again this is part of why I'm like so anti
00:57:12.740you know this whole just like depend on cheap labor to do a bunch of stuff is like I think in
00:57:19.240America we're not teaching young young people particularly young men to do stuff early that
00:57:25.780they should know how to do like just basics like men and I think men actually yearn for this by
00:57:31.060the way I I have had conversations with many men who are like man if I could just learn how to frame
00:57:35.660i would i would learn how to frame if i could just learn masonry i would do masonry if i could just
00:57:39.960learn how to which i will know you can do these things in fact it's easier than ever to learn
00:57:44.540basic electrical or like you know uh you know think plumbing like men like actually kind of
00:57:51.680want to do that stuff and the question is is like for me because i'm not a woman but like
00:57:57.120do women want to do those things and kind of the answer i get the vibe from is that like actually
00:58:04.640i think men are like probably more interested in doing those things the manual labor stuff that
00:58:09.500they're supposed to be doing than women are wanting to do in today's society well and that
00:58:13.900might be kind of controversial guys we're we're coming up on a very hard break a hard hard out
00:58:18.960but i do just want to add before we before we leave and cliff i know you got to run to uh just1.00
00:58:22.980the other element that there there are females out there who have now uh turned lindsey clancy1.00
00:58:29.280into a feminist icon they're holding her up and they are holding a rally a rally for
00:58:36.860lindsey clancy uh next week at the plymouth county superior court uh organize us in your
00:58:46.140city they're trying to turn that wear pink uh the peaceful support she deserved i'm like so you're
00:58:52.840saying i should go and maybe you know maybe i'll find a wife there you know the most damning thing
00:58:57.960that was done here was they made this on ai and whatever platform whatever ai platform enabled
00:59:03.140this deserves to be hit with tariffs yeah the only the only comment i was going to make is
00:59:11.800tyler the entire realignment away from you know society has pushed and you can push with tyranny
00:59:17.640as long as you want to push people away from manual labor but i think eventually the realignment
00:59:22.640i mean we're seeing it now you know these welders these plumbers any of these trades you know you
00:59:27.640can go to a 10-month apprenticeship and come out making six figures. And so you look at the cost
00:59:33.620of a college degree skyrocketing, the value of the college degree after you get out plummeting.
00:59:38.680And so I just think you're going to see a natural realignment because there's going to be a demand
00:59:42.300for this. So whether men want to do it or not, I think they do. I agree with you. You know,
00:59:46.760I think I'd love to learn some things. I'd love, you know, how to work on my car at a much higher
00:59:51.080level than I'm able to. But I feel like society has pushed us into so many of these things that
00:59:55.580looking down on manual labor because we've been told not to be the person stuck doing it but
01:00:00.620eventually these jobs are going to need to be filled and no i don't want cheap labor i want
01:00:04.040americans to take those jobs but that realignment is coming well and it's going to get worse with
01:00:10.960robots and you know ai and it's like this problem is not going to get better and and it and it's0.60
01:00:20.860even scarier when you think about again this battle i did never thought of that dystopia like
01:00:25.520i don't think isaac asimov ever had a book where it's the future robots are doing all the manual
01:00:29.900labor and what happens is everyone is in pods watching true crime podcasts all the time and
01:00:35.520what will even the crimes be because everyone will be so inert in their pods like who's going
01:00:40.340to even have the energy to get out and commit a heinous murder no but just like this self-crime
01:00:44.760self-harm self-harm no this is the whole point right like linds the lindsey's crime is going
01:00:51.680is the crime of the future which is it's it's going to be self-harm and the discussions and
01:00:56.080the deliberation will be over people's capability of being able to commit self-harm i just feel like
01:01:02.180people are going to be so cooked like we won't even have like people are going to barely be
01:01:07.280able to like get married and have kids sufficient to supply insane uh crimes for people to obsess
01:01:12.320over this is part of the problem you might need ai generated true crime this is the problem is
01:01:16.040that yeah i mean there probably will be that might help society we just ai generate fake crimes for
01:01:22.820people to fixate on and they'll just be debating whether whether this ai person should be convicted
01:01:28.560and we just won't tell them that it's all fake we already have fake crimes that people are debating
01:01:33.200it's called reddit that's true that's true and reddit's filled with robots everything is going
01:01:38.940to be robots all the way down Tyler AI generated crimes AI generated uh conspiracy theories AI
01:01:47.560generated podcasts we may we may be AI generated ourselves soon that's what they want that is what
01:01:54.080they want that's what the people want that's what the the overlords want the overlords want us if
01:02:02.140you want a vision of the future imagine a reddit thread going on forever cliff what did you cliff
01:02:07.760what reason no i just said it all comes back to reddit that's the full circuit moment full circle
01:02:12.620moment yeah uh cancer it's brain rot cancer the internet it's it's uh it is the cancer palace it
01:02:21.020is the cancer palace of the internet the cancer factory um guys i think is that our is that our
01:02:27.000hard break folks i think so we want a whole hour on this uh and as as you predicted blake uh cliff