00:07:00.800and were caught in this patriotic messaging
00:07:04.620that the Prime Minister's been putting out
00:07:06.520and weren't seeing clearly what the vote really is.
00:07:09.740And she said all 24 of them now have decided they're going to vote for option two to send the message that Alberta can do better, that we need to do better.
00:07:21.840Then here's our first question from Alberta Gamer.1.00
00:07:25.040So pretty excited to get their first question.
00:07:28.020Will independent Alberta return to an imperial system?
00:07:30.660As we all know, we are metric due to PET and his attempts to isolate us from the U.S.
00:07:38.020so any ideas there are we going to be in kilometers miles inches centimeters what are you thinking
00:07:43.460well it's interesting um two things one is i kept saying to myself when somebody can ask that
00:07:53.180question so now i know the answer it's now the levine show awesome um yeah and and then i think
00:08:04.040about what's my own personal preference and just you know and then I also observed that you know
00:08:09.980I deal with a lot of farmers and ranchers and and other people truckers and others and you know
00:08:16.500we're half and half you know there's still things that we we still talk about a two by four we still
00:08:21.500you know what I mean by two by four I don't know you know what I mean by two by six I have no you
00:08:27.460know I could do the conversion I guess to see how many millimeter or centimeters or it is or
00:08:31.860millimeters whatever you would do proper unit would be in metric um you know i still when we're
00:08:38.320working on something in the shop at the lake and my buddy says hey can you grab me a 916 socket
00:08:43.300i know what a 916 is so um gallons uh you know a hectare or sorry uh acres farmers still use acres
00:08:54.180everything's measured by the acre bushels an acre they don't i i don't find farmers say i say how
00:09:00.020your yield oh we got whatever bushels per hectare i just that's not a thing i hear so um the serious
00:09:07.620answer though and what the alberta transition council plan envisions is for for changes like
00:09:14.020that those should be decisions made by the new government of the new the new sovereign of alberta
00:09:24.020the new country of alberta if down the road we we get to independence that
00:09:28.340those types of questions should be made by the elected officials of the day
00:09:34.340and but the critical point is is that they would have the authority to change it because right now
00:09:40.500if ottawa decides that we're supposed to do something in a particular language we have to
00:09:45.940do it if ottawa decides that we're going to change back to imperial way if we decided we didn't want
00:09:50.580to we would have to do it the difference with what all of this is about this talk of independence
00:09:56.820It's not about separating or tearing apart or leaving this dramatic language that when you when you really sit and look at it, clear eyed makes no sense.
00:10:06.980You've heard me say, Jason, that independence for Alberta does not involve or separating or leaving does not involve the largest concrete cutting saws, hydraulic jacks and and and house dolly movers where we're going to lift Alberta up and move it somewhere.
00:10:25.340okay guys where are we going we're not going anywhere we're not leaving anything all that
00:10:31.020with all that independence if we went all the way to the end of it does is change where the
00:10:37.100decisions get made and who elects the people that make the decisions that determine the future
00:10:44.540prosperity and success for your children that's all the changes and so rather than having the
00:10:50.060politicians elected uh by ontario and quebec and them making decisions to stay in power which means
00:11:00.060pleasing the voters of quebec and ontario even at the expense of alberta
00:11:06.380that would change we would elect our politicians here and then we would enter into trade and
00:11:12.140mobility agreements uh on with the rest of the country with the other provinces
00:11:18.220And so we would have democratic accountability. We can unleash the power of our economy. We can unleash the energy of the youngest workforce in Canada, our entrepreneurial spirit, the privilege and advantage we have of our geography, where we're located. We can capitalize on all of that. We can't do any of those things right now because we're always at the whims of Ottawa.
00:11:44.040so as we're making our way through this and i liked how you talked about the future government
00:11:50.200would address issues like this because a lot of people are looking for definitive answers right
00:11:53.980now so let's just be careful when people are watching this at no time does the transition
00:11:59.220council or your paper say this will be these are all ideas and it's a thought experiment on how it
00:12:04.980can transition and you've always positioned it that in the future the government who's in power
00:12:10.320at that time this could be a starting point for them uh can you correct me if i'm wrong on this
00:12:15.200that this is more of a guidance for the future this is not in stone like what people should
00:12:19.360expect today yeah and it was the motivation for it came from as i reflected several months ago
00:12:28.000you know i realize that you know most people have normal lives and i i don't
00:12:33.920in other words i started working in government at a senior level uh with direct access to ministers
00:12:41.360in the premier's office dealing with complex problems and seeing how governments work
00:12:45.680uh in my 20s and then i became a lawyer i've studied political science i took a fascinating
00:12:51.440course in my honors level of my undergraduate degree at the university of alberta which would
00:12:58.560had been in about the late 80s 1980s uh what was taught by peter laugheed who was retired from
00:13:04.960politics at the time and the key members of his cabinet uh roy farron and these other people that
00:13:11.920you can look up merv leach and others and uh he took us behind the scenes of the negotiations with
00:13:18.320peer elliot trudeau he took us behind this on the on the charter and repatriation of the constitution
00:13:23.040he took us behind the scenes on what he tried to do to prevent there from ever being the equivalent
00:13:27.440of a national energy program by getting amendment to the constitution through section 92a and so on
00:13:32.880and just throughout my life experience and the projects i've been involved in i understand how
00:13:38.940governments can fix things how regulations can be changed and made so that like i was involved in
00:13:45.500the overhaul of the livestock and commerce legislation for the province and we were able
00:13:50.800to make the transaction costs lower and make it more efficient so i said okay i can see how it's
00:13:59.920possible without disruption and maintaining continuity for alberta transition from a province
00:14:07.280to its own sovereign country with all of the decision-making powers here in alberta but i don't
00:14:14.880think most other people will so i was like all right we i better bring together a group of
00:14:22.000experts on everything from banking monetary policy international trade agriculture oil and gas
00:14:27.760forestry rail trucking telecommunications aviation uh justice system you name it and
00:14:37.520And lay out in detail, boring, painful detail, the steps involved in Alberta transitioning from a province to its own country and changing the constitutional order and maintaining continuity so there's no disruption.
00:14:57.900And so that what we're materially changing is where the decision-making power resides.
00:15:02.760Right now it's in Ottawa. We changed that to Edmonton so that we have a democratic accountability.
00:15:08.680And the more I worked on it in the previous months, the more it became clear to me, this is absolutely doable.
00:15:16.060Each transition step we know of, this is not like Elon Musk trying to put humans on Mars,
00:15:23.320where he has, to use old Secretary of State Rumsfeld said, there's known knowns, known unknowns.
00:15:32.760and then unknown unknowns right well elon musk has unknown unknowns and he has known unknowns
00:15:40.280we don't have that here we know exactly how many cats the security guards need to be at security
00:15:47.320screening to make sure i don't put a bottle of water in my carry-on bag at the calgary airport
00:15:52.920we know how many extra we need to have on during spring break and during christmas right we know
00:15:59.400all those details we know how many customs and border agents we need we know how many chairs
00:16:03.480they have and we know many pens they use of the year and all we have to do to maintain continuity
00:16:08.680there is pass an act that says those federal statutes are now alberta statutes on a transitional
00:16:14.440basis and everybody who's working at the airport now and under contract to the federal government
00:16:20.440on the day in the future alberta becomes independent you will now be working for the
00:16:24.760the Alberta government your job will be exactly the same your pay will be the same when you look
00:16:30.840at your bank statement or you're online to see what whether your salary got deposited instead
00:16:35.660of saying government of Canada it'll say government of Alberta and other everything else remains the
00:16:39.580same then once the new government's in place the government can say all right how can we improve
00:16:46.360the screening process at the airport how can we change the processes at the two passport offices
00:33:21.120You know, they have been great to Alberta,
00:33:22.700the husband who hasn't been nice to us.
00:33:25.500Do you think he's going to get even more
00:33:27.500let's not say violent but let's say retaliatory if we actually take the step towards independence
00:33:33.580no i don't think that he's going to retaliate or with the liberals retaliate but what i do think
00:33:40.700it gets us to the same spot which is there'll be no constraint on their no political consequence
00:33:50.620for them to fully exploit alberta and albertans to help prop up ontario quebec you know that
00:34:00.780they they don't need our vote they don't care because all they have to do is get the votes
00:34:06.060in ontario quebec because of the skew and and i have this graphic old school here oh i like that
00:34:12.060one you know the people were the tall so that's quebec and ontario because we only have one house
00:34:20.780they will always dictate the policies and laws for the other areas including us this little
00:34:27.100column in blue and um so that's the fundamental dysfunction it's not about not having enough
00:34:36.620discussions with ottawa or trying to lead lead not leave this is electoral math and that that
00:34:44.140area in the center will always be able to and it's been studied in political science in other
00:34:50.140countries where you have a concentration of people in one area there's a tendency to exploit the
00:34:55.180colonies and the people in the periphery because there's no negative political consequence and
00:34:59.500there's all this advantage they can complain all they want albertans can complain all we want we
00:35:03.900see nothing happens we held a jason kenny held a referendum on uh ending equalization 62 of
00:35:11.500albertans voted in favor of of that in 2021 and he explained at one of the debates he had to meet
00:35:19.660with me in may in response to an audience question they said well what happened with that like why
00:35:25.020didn't you get equalization fixed we had a referendum and he said well he said he sent
00:35:30.860a letter to the prime minister and he asked for a first minister's or a constitutional conference
00:35:36.620and the prime minister said no so then he said he wrote a second letter to um to the uh
00:35:44.780to the first ministers that's a fancy way of saying premier and they said no and he said that
00:35:49.980was the end of it and he since said twice at the debates i didn't even bring it up since the
00:35:54.220constitutional in in its current form is unamendable you know we had beach lake it failed we had
00:35:59.260charlottetown it failed there's only one pathway that forces the legally the government to the
00:36:05.020table to talk about changing the constitution there's only one pathway that fascinatingly
00:36:12.220puts alberta legally and positionally in the same position of power as the federal government which
00:36:20.300is by saying we are prepared to go and hold a future referendum on independence
00:36:29.740the supreme court of canada said in the 1998 reference case that if
00:36:35.020the people of any province hold a referendum and a clear majority say, yes, that's the direction
00:36:40.540they want to move in. It triggers a legal duty for the federal government, the provinces,
00:36:45.940and first impacted First Nations to sit around the table as equals and enter into good faith
00:36:52.580negotiations. That's a legal requirement. And there's a serious consequence to the federal
00:36:57.380government if they don't enter into good faith negotiations. So it's the only vehicle through
00:37:03.780which that's why i've said these other nine questions are a political gimmick on the
00:37:07.380referendum they all be ignored and there's no consequence the only question the only vote that
00:37:13.860you get to make on the 19th where there's a consequence where there's leverage where there's
00:37:18.980power where there's a pathway to fairness and true constitutional reform is voting for option two so
00:37:28.340that's that's what we're faced with i don't think they'll retaliate i think if too many people vote
00:37:33.700for option one um and it passes it will give permission and affirmation and clear the way
00:37:43.780for to for carney and ottawa to treat albertans as a blank check and write whatever cost on it
00:37:52.500they need to to help maintain power and win favor of voters in ontario in quebec and that frightens
00:38:00.340me for the future of my children and that's why we're here on you know thanksgiving monday me in
00:38:07.320a suit so you got me in a suit as well so i'm joining you on that one you and your wife have
00:38:14.300kids too so yes we do so we're here for for the long haul we want to make that future brighter
00:38:19.040i had a stockwell day and bruce bruce party do a couple debates and in edmonton stockwell
00:38:25.620He wasn't very, I don't think he read the reference decision, even though he was an MP at the time, even the leader of the official opposition, he wasn't very familiar with that large consequence that you're talking about there.
00:38:37.380So let me pull that up because it's actually one of sections 155 and 154 that you're referring to here, which is a unilateral declaration of independence.
00:38:48.460So the Supreme Court actually does cover that if bad faith negotiations start to transpire.
00:38:54.960And that's from any party, whether it's a province or the federal government or other, that it says right here that unilateral declaration of independence could be on the table.
00:39:06.440It may not be legal under the Constitution, but it's certainly a large consequence of the federal government if they proceed in bad faith.
00:39:13.500Yeah, and it's predicated on international recognition.
00:39:18.460And so, you know, this is where Alberta truly has power and leverage because if it were the case that, let's say, 88% of our trade was with the rest of Canada, then we would be very vulnerable if we found ourselves in a situation where we wanted to invoke paragraph 155 and make an announcement of a unilateral declaration of independence.
00:39:46.820but the fact of the matter is listen to this carefully 88 of our trade is with the united
00:39:52.260states of america and they've already made plain that they support the free will and the political
00:39:57.620determination of any province in canada including alberta and that would recognize the will of the
00:40:03.300people as constitutional you know as expressed through this constitutional process so they would
00:40:09.300give us recognition we can enter into a trade agreement with the united states we'll have more
00:40:13.540leverage in that trade agreement with the united states in a negotiation than canada ever will
00:40:18.900this idea of unity gives us strength i'm sorry it doesn't it actually makes alberta weaker
00:40:23.400uh and and the reason is is we have a resource economy the americans you can relocate as i
00:40:31.080mentioned earlier uh an auto plant from windsor to detroit you cannot relocate the third largest
00:40:40.400reserve of oil from Alberta to Nebraska or Oklahoma. You cannot relocate the millions
00:40:46.840and millions of acres of highly fertile agricultural land. You cannot relocate the youngest, or maybe
00:40:54.800you can do this one, and hopefully it doesn't happen, the youngest, most trained entrepreneurial
00:40:58.820workforce in the country. So we're in a phenomenal position. And the other thing is, and this is
00:41:05.260where another reveal of our Alberta being a powerhouse is both the Ontario economy would
00:41:15.000collapse, would collapse if trade stopped with Alberta. They need our energy every single
00:41:23.680day to supply both the refined products, natural gas, propane and crude oil and other things
00:41:30.400we send to them through the pipelines and they need that crude oil for their refineries to make
00:41:35.680gasoline for the cars on the 401 and diesel fuel for the trucks hauling manufactured goods back
00:41:44.080and forth across the borders and jet fuel for pearson airport etc if if we stop supplying them
00:41:53.200because they got hostile with us their economy would stop and not only that as i mentioned
00:41:59.920earlier we're the third most important customer we buy 30 million 39 billion dollars worth of goods
00:42:06.640we are responsible for hundreds and hundreds of thousands of jobs in ontario if they suddenly
00:42:13.120said because this is what the the the scary reports for the headlines everybody's been
00:42:18.400seeing are all based on they're expressly based on the idea the university calgary study
00:42:24.000and the calgary chamber of commerce they say that if alberta were to move to independence
00:42:29.040ontario could stop trading with us that's insane that wouldn't happen they can't are they good
00:42:35.680there's not enough maple trees to cut down for firewood in the winter right they would freeze
00:42:41.760uh that's just nuts and then similarly with british columbia 55 billion dollars worth of goods
00:42:50.320travel from british columbia eastward to markets east through alberta on our major highways and
00:42:57.440rail lines they have no alternative they can't put it all through the u.s and there's no route
00:43:03.200through the yukon in the northwest territories it all goes through alberta 55 billion dollars
00:43:09.120of their economy each year the fruits the wines the agricultural products the two by fours the
00:43:15.920osb the plywood the pulp and paper the mining products that have to go to smelters in quebec
00:43:23.040etc all have to go through alberta 900 000 containers of household and other manufactured
00:43:32.240goods that our economy is dependent upon that come in from asian markets get offloaded at prince
00:43:37.760rupert and the port of vancouver all travel through alberta right in fact when i left medicine
00:43:44.320hat on thursday night or friday morning after a town hall there uh before i even got to brooks
00:43:50.720and i got a little video of this i should put it up on one of my posts of a train coming and it was
00:43:56.160over a mile long and it was double stacked with those long containers and then within a few
00:44:01.440minutes there was another one over a mile long right the on the bc economy and then we supply
00:44:10.400on top of all of this we're just such a powerhouse and they ottawa's got us convinced that we're not0.95
00:44:17.280and we need their permission always and we don't and we shouldn't have to seek it but the lower
00:44:23.280mainland is completely dependent upon oil from alberta uh that goes to the burnaby refinery
00:44:29.760somebody said well um mr wilson that's now owned by the federal government and i'm like
00:44:37.360oh okay so an empty pipeline will help make gasoline hmm you be a smart liberal voter
00:44:47.280so uh anyway if that were to be disrupted if british columbia so back to this unilateral
00:44:54.240declaration right if we can maintain with certainty our trade with our largest trading partner which
00:45:01.600is pretty much guaranteed given the united states look what's happening with diesel
00:45:07.920it's going to cause trump and the republicans to lose the midterms the price of energy right
00:45:14.800like it's becoming absolutely clear it's the number one issue price of gasoline price of diesel
00:45:21.040and 55 percent of their imports come from alberta alberta supplies the united states with more energy
00:45:32.160with more oil than every other country in the world combined we have leverage our problem is
00:45:41.340ottawa constantly constraining us saying okay well you can produce a little bit more but you
00:45:47.520have to build the pathways which will be 20 to 30 billion dollars of taxpayer money because no
00:45:53.340industry will pay for it because nobody wants decarbonized oil right so we have this incredible
00:45:59.200leverage with the united states that gets weakened because carny needs to trade it off to prop up
00:46:06.340the manufacturing of economies of central canada and we're prevented from utilizing our superpower
00:46:15.460power of an economy and the dependency relationship that Ontario and Central Canada have on us
00:46:21.120because we supply energy and we're their third most important customer, and the land,
00:46:26.540continentally landlocked problem that British Columbia has, they're continentally landlocked.
00:46:30.800They can't ship stuff east unless coming through Alberta. So if we change the constitutional order,
00:46:37.040if we vote yes on october 19th for option two it'll create an opportunity for the federal
00:46:46.220government to understand we're serious about change here we're tired of this and we're not
00:46:50.720going to expose our children and our grandchildren to another national energy program and don't you
00:46:56.120dare bring in an export tax uh next month or the month after or at all uh we need to have serious
00:47:04.040reform you come and make a proposal to us as to how you're prepared to make this arrangement fair
00:47:09.880to unleash the power of our economy and if you ottawa failed to do so we can go ahead and have
00:47:15.720the actual succession vote the actual vote on whether we want to become independent and when
00:47:20.920we go into those negotiations we will be going into them with appear with a position of phenomenal
00:47:26.440strength and if they want to play silly bugger and engage in bad faith negotiations then we have
00:47:32.280the right as the supreme court of canada laid out in the paragraph 155 that you put on the screen0.56
00:47:37.720to seek unilateral declaration and uh enter into a advantageous trade arrangement with the united
00:47:46.040states because we'll be doing it from power in a fundamentally different position a week the
00:47:50.520weak position that ontario and quebec have because we're not a manufacturing based economy we're
00:47:54.680resource based and we will be able to enter into a trade and mobility agreement with the rest of
00:48:01.240canada because they need us more than we need them and we can enter into a very respectful
00:48:06.920relationship because i want one of the economists that wrote one of these scary reports actually
00:48:12.760expressly assumes that all of the multi-generation of workers of highly skilled workers that have
00:48:18.680come out of the maritimes and come into alberta and go up to the camps for a while or work on our
00:48:23.160major projects or shutdowns at refineries and other places that have lots of pipes
00:48:29.160um that they wouldn't want to come work here anymore and we wouldn't want them like it's just
00:48:35.240preposterous so if we unleash and change our relationship we can get rid of these terrible
00:48:40.840policies and biased laws that come out of ottawa we can chart our own path we can make alberta into
00:48:46.360a superpower and we can benefit the rest of the country it could be a wake-up call for the rest
00:48:51.560of the country as well and we can create more jobs in british columbia we can create more jobs in
00:48:56.680ontario quebec and the maritimes and we can create the most incredibly
00:49:01.960prosper prosperous and successful future for our kids too i've always found a peculiar argument
00:49:08.520keith uh when one side says it's going to get worse for you canada is going to treat you horribly
00:49:13.960it's kind of like you know the divorce analogy everybody uses here and saying well it's going
00:49:18.440to be difficult for you to see the kids and i'm going to talk to all our friends and tell them
00:49:21.480how bad you are nobody's going to talk to you anymore nobody's going to love you it's kind of
00:49:25.320taking that step like if you actually leave i'm going to make your life really really difficult
00:49:29.420i actually believe you know there might be a little bit of startup resentment or some challenges
00:49:36.400but i think we're going to be great neighbors i think in the end calmer minds will prevail
00:49:40.540and trade and negotiations will happen and there will be an economic corridor that actually allows
00:49:46.820trade to happen through alberta and we're going to be great neighbors um but all of this you know
00:49:51.940conversation ahead of time that how bad is Canada going to treat you uh isn't that an admission that
00:49:57.740we have a bad partner to begin with because we can't even talk about how good it could be if we
00:50:02.860work together in a different capacity I think this is just a good argument to go ahead and take that
00:50:07.740step forward because if they're threatening us now at this stage it's not going to get any better for
00:50:12.180us well it's so contradictory right you know Canada's great we shouldn't change be patriotic0.99
00:50:18.320canadians are great and by the way you haven't seen how much of a set of assholes they are if0.97
00:50:24.400you decide you're going to leave right it's like oh which is it you know and even if both are true0.99
00:50:29.520even if both are true we're still in an ideal position because the fact of the matter is the
00:50:36.460ontario economy collapses without alberta the fact of the matter is the british columbia economy
00:50:42.000collapses without Alberta like if we could actually say to British Columbia right now
00:50:47.640look we want your economy to continue to grow and sustain first of all sustain itself and not
00:50:55.120nosedive and we want to continue to provide you with these critical energy products every single
00:51:01.560day um but we would we want another pipeline to tide water and they say no and then we would be
00:51:09.640able to say okay here's the deal uh we are going to start restricting the number of trains that
00:51:17.300can run through alberta we are going to start restricting that all premier law heat had to do
00:51:22.780back in the day was threatened to curtail to constrain the supply of energy products
00:51:30.500through the pipelines to ontario by 15 that's all he said and boom they came to the table
00:51:37.540the current constitutional order doesn't allow us to do that this pathway that we're on starting
00:51:44.820with voting for option two does and that allows us to have an adult discussion with british
00:51:50.340colombians and and their government and i realize they're highly ideological i'm not naive about
00:51:57.300that but there would be a consequence to that and we can create that consequence because they're0.96
00:52:03.460creating a consequence for us right and we would be able to say no it's that's that's ridiculous
00:52:10.900we're going to have an adult discussion we are not going to let you harm our economy and give0.94
00:52:16.340you a free pass to run through ours right that is just ridiculous that's unfair that's an
00:52:22.660unreasonable position for us to take to turn a blind eye and say okay fine constrain our economy
00:52:29.060because they benefit too and so this is why i'm so motivated about this i can see with clarity
00:52:36.580how this can happen it's absolutely viable and one other thing on this point is that you know
00:52:44.260um i think we'll all be canadians and what i mean by that is um it's about changing the
00:52:51.380constitutional order so how democratic decisions and law making decisions get made in alberta
00:52:57.860and it's about transferring that power to alberta for all things related here so the politicians we
00:53:05.020elect can deal with criminal code can deal with immigration can deal with finance and not create
00:53:12.120print money like these guys are right now we can end equalization and we have full control over
00:53:19.540the decision making and we elect the politicians with full control over decision making on all
00:53:24.100legal topics here and at the end of the day though alberta as this political entity will still be in
00:53:34.560the geography of north america and still within the geography of canada in the same way that if
00:53:41.220you went and talked to someone in france or italy or the netherlands or germany um uh you know go
00:53:48.420back to prior to the european union prior to the european commission when europe was just what we
00:53:53.500were taught in school at least me uh as a as a place on a map and if you said to someone in
00:54:00.620france are you are are you european they would say yeah i'm a french citizen i was born and
00:54:05.340raised in france and i'm european then if you said to someone in in italy you know same thing
00:54:10.620are you are you european so i'd still be canadian alberto still within the area of canada we're
00:54:17.820changing the constitutional order so that we're not subject to these arbitrary decisions where
00:54:25.180ottawa gets to exploit us and our children and their future for the advantage they need to
00:54:32.380maintain in ontario quebec to stay in power that's what we're changing the confederation is broken0.94
00:54:38.380it made sense in 1905 to have treat alberta as a frontier dependent on ottawa treat alberta as
00:54:47.500a colony it makes no sense today i agree with that it's kind of like having an adult child in
00:54:53.340your basement it's time for them to grow up and move on their own it made a ton of sense when
00:54:57.900they were a baby and you needed to grow up but now we're like a bunch of adult children in the
00:55:01.980basement of canada and a lot of us and the adult the adult child in the basement you want to go to
00:55:07.660work and you want to work five days a week and you want to put in 10 hours and it's only letting you
00:55:11.660go to work two days a week and you're like i'm not achieving my potential you know yeah we're
00:55:16.940We're still restricted on time, can't have our girlfriend move in, we can't get married, we can't leave, all this kind of stuff.
00:55:22.860Let's jump back to the questions here.
00:55:25.360I think a lot of people, if they're sitting around the turkey table today, can look at it that way.
00:55:29.840It really is like we've gone past the time where we need Canada to kind of grow into a province.
00:55:35.040There was a time, we've grown up, and now it's like an adult child that's trying to leave.
00:55:40.160And then the parents are saying, well, you've got to take part of the mortgage with you and our credit card debt with you as well, because we spent it while you were around.
00:55:46.940Well, you can jump into that conversation another day, but I want to jump into a question here from Adventures. Is the 1982 constitutional process similar to this Alberta independence process? So what would be the transition when it comes to, say, the Constitution going from one to another? Would it be kind of similar to what we saw in 1982 where things were grandfathered in, courts were changing, there was a period of time where the courts were kind of moving from one direction to another, or would it just be overnight and sudden? What are your thoughts there?
00:56:16.940Well, the only change in 82 was at the very top of the org chart, you know, after the
00:56:23.620Prime Minister and the Parliament and the Supreme Court of Canada prior to 1982, there
00:56:27.900was the King and there was the Privy Council and, you know, the highest courts in England.
00:56:32.740And all that 82 did was, by repatriating the Constitution, is make Canada sovereign of
00:56:38.880itself and changed the role of, eliminated any role of the courts in England because
00:56:46.380prior to that you could appeal and many did decisions of the supreme court of canada to
00:56:51.740a higher court in england and it changed the rule from the king to purely ceremonial and symbolic
00:56:58.860so what we're talking about here though is very different which is um i guess in some respects
00:57:04.620there's a parallel but um right now the law making function for the criminal code for gun laws for
00:57:12.860immigration for censorship laws rests in ottawa what we would be changing is the constitutional
00:57:19.980order so that the law making authority for the criminal code and immigration and those other
00:57:25.580things would rest in edmonton at the legislature we're changing the constitutional border we're
00:57:31.900changing where the elected official is who has the power right now they're in ottawa and they're
00:57:39.260they have to be responsive if they want power to go where the votes are and where are the votes
00:57:49.380they're not outside of the ontario and quebec so it's always going to doesn't matter how nice we
00:57:57.220are doesn't matter how nice the prime minister's being right now because he wants you to to to to
00:58:02.860vote for stay the same on option one uh that's that's the fundamental problem that's our gravity
00:58:08.380That's our physics. That's our math. And this changes it. So that doesn't matter anymore because it's just Albertans electing our officials. And then we have trade and mobility agreements with the rest of Canada.
00:58:22.380We agree to have NAV Canada, which is a not-for-profit corporation, Edmonton airspace, air traffic control is the largest airspace in the world.
00:58:33.780We control from the Montana border up our borders on either side and then up into the other provinces and then all through the Arctic and Northwest Territories and so on.
00:58:44.740And they're going to want us to say, hey, you're going to keep operating NAV Canada at Edmonton, right?
00:58:51.920and the ils and the radars and all those systems and the satellite guidance systems is like of
00:58:56.800course and all we'll need to do is say hey nav canada you currently have a contract with ottawa
00:59:04.560to do that um ottawa pays you a certain amount of money you then have all the employees the air
00:59:11.520traffic controllers the technical specialists the trainers uh you keep doing everything you're doing
00:59:17.680tomorrow nav canada all that's going to change is who writes you the check to pay everybody
00:59:25.200that's it and who you will negotiate any changes to that contract with when there's a need to go
00:59:32.560to a meeting to change that contract that nav canada has instead of flying to ottawa for that
00:59:38.960meeting it will be a meeting that occurs in edmonton so it's a similarity i guess in the
00:59:44.640the sense that 1982 was a change at the top of the org chart what 82 did was it took things off
00:59:50.340the org chart here we're just replacing ottawa and transport canada with edmonton and transport
00:59:58.200alberta i like the way you put that down there keith and every time you put that paper up it
01:00:03.800reminds me of this old saying of democracy is like two bowls and a lamb trying to vote
01:00:08.620on what's for dinner because you have two superpowers inside of canada and like the rest of
01:00:13.700us and you can say it's a democracy you can say there's votes but that's the same type of thing
01:00:19.060what are they actually voting for and what kind of say do we have so it's like two bowls and a lamb
01:00:22.940voting on what's for dinner um let me bring up this 4e canada canadian one ask keith if a binding
01:00:29.900referendum was to take place at this point would first nation's consent be needed as per fees
01:00:34.220ruling where he specifically referred to consent now i think this might be mixed up with leonard's
01:00:39.420ruling but in either case there's now this idea on the table that first nations consent is required
01:00:46.060and consultations required what are your thoughts there what was striking to me as a lawyer and a
01:00:51.980litigator of 32 years at the bar in reading both of those decisions is how both judges made an
01:00:59.660assumption a critical foundational assumption about something that wasn't in evidence and
01:01:06.620there's no historical evidence of and the historical evidence contradicts the assumption
01:01:11.740they made what am i talking about they assumed that if alberta moved towards changing the
01:01:18.700constitutional with order with ottawa changing how we elect our politicians electing them here
01:01:24.220instead of having to live under and seek permission from ottawa and allow ottawa to decide how much of
01:01:30.860our paychecks they keep uh if we made that change that that would automatically result in something
01:01:39.100bad happening to the treaties and all of it and let me demonstrate why that's false
01:01:44.860and and and very disappointing i was very disappointed in those courts that was that
01:01:49.100was political activism disguised as jurisprudence very disappointed and i'm glad that both decisions
01:01:58.060were appealed um or i think no the first one wasn't because it would have been moot because
01:02:02.940of the statutory change but otherwise it would have been appealed and the second one
01:02:06.620is under appeal right now to the court of appeal correct so um the critical piece is this is that
01:02:13.340the treaties endure constitutional change the treaties endure a change in the constitutional
01:02:20.700order the treaties were signed all of alberta is ceded land ceded means the treaties first page of
01:02:27.740each of the treaties six seven and eight say that the first nations the indians hereby
01:02:34.460seed surrender give up transfer assign all of their right interest in title in the lands in
01:02:41.180their treaty area from themselves at any claim they had to those lands to the crown to the
01:02:48.140government um that's what each of the treaties say and that aspect's been upheld so they no longer
01:02:55.420own the land or have aboriginal title claim to the land they still have traditional aboriginal rights
01:03:01.660but that's the right to hunt fish um and trap so um what happened though was in 1880s
01:03:10.700when these things were signed they were all executed and signed before the alberta became
01:03:16.140a province so in 1905 we had a change in the constitutional order of the lands where the
01:03:22.060treaties are six seven and eight and they went from the dominion of canada to the province of
01:03:27.260alberta what bad thing happened to the treaties what adverse effect did the treaties have
01:03:32.780none they carried on like it didn't even happen right and then in 1930 because of the
01:03:40.540the historical mistreatment of alberta and saskatchewan every other province owned their
01:03:46.860Their crown land, their unoccupied public land was owned by the provincial crown in Ontario and other provinces, British Columbia.
01:03:57.600But Ottawa treated, even from 1905, Alberta and Saskatchewan different.
01:04:03.040And Ottawa kept ownership of our public lands, of our unoccupied crown land, and our mines and minerals, and our water.
01:04:11.540A protest movement started in the 20s and said this isn't fair.
01:04:15.660and so ottawa responded with the 1930 natural resources transfer agreement and amendments to
01:04:22.000the constitution to change it so that all of the mines and minerals all the water and all of the
01:04:27.220unoccupied crown lands in alberta became provincial crown provincial ownership that's why the alberta
01:04:33.340government gets royalties and owns the oil and gas so what change occurred change in the
01:04:39.220constitutional order of all the lands again what bad thing happened to the treaties nothing no
01:04:44.380adverse effect they endured no derogation of rights then in 1982 the same thing we had a change
01:04:50.780in the constitutional order of canada and there was no negative effect on their rights so if
01:04:57.020albertans at some point in the future decide to move towards independence and exercise the legal
01:05:04.060pathway that the supreme court of canada said that every province has to exercise its choice
01:05:10.300about its political relationship its constitutional relationship with the rest of canada
01:05:17.820and we actually move in that direction and execute it the first nations there are 48 first nations
01:05:25.660on 148 reserves each of the first nations would have a decision to make they would gather their
01:05:33.180community and either use their elders or their band or however they make their community decisions
01:05:38.140and any one of them would have three choices they can either keep everything the same
01:05:43.140whereby their reserve lands are currently owned by the federal government a lot of people don't
01:05:49.400know that they think the first nations own the lands on the reserve they don't and i i've never
01:05:54.760thought that made sense but that's what the law is it's owned by ottawa uh the federal government
01:06:00.040and if they decide they want to keep that that way if one of the bands decide that's what they
01:06:06.000want nope they want i still want the land in my reserve owned by the federal government in ottawa
01:06:10.900and i still want it to be under the indian act no problem no that's fine they'll be crossing an
01:06:17.300international boundary notionally when they drive in and off the reserve we wouldn't need fences or
01:06:22.240gates uh it's all within alberta and um uh there's already the j treaty where the americans from the
01:06:31.2401700s allow the Mohawks and all First Nations to travel freely across the Canadian border into the
01:06:37.900United States without a passport because there was a recognition that the Mohawks crossed over
01:06:43.300from Quebec into New York State and Maine. So we already have a functioning system where First0.79
01:06:51.060Nations just hold up their treaty card and they're crossing international border into the United
01:06:56.340States. We can't do that. I can't do that. I got to show a passport and I got to answer a whole
01:07:00.300bunch of questions. Am I going for business? Do I have the right visa? They just go treaty card and
01:07:04.820it's like, have a nice day. Not how long are you staying? Where are you going? Have a nice day.
01:07:10.600So we wouldn't need any border controls around reserves. So nothing would change if that's what
01:07:17.320they want. Alternatively, one of the First Nations might say, you know what? These guys in Ottawa
01:07:22.540have been pretty tough to deal with and they haven't really followed through on promises and
01:07:26.080they're a little bit incompetent and highly bureaucratic and it's really far away we'd much
01:07:30.000rather have alberta step in and have our meetings in edmonton would that be okay and the alberta
01:07:35.440government could say sure no problem if that's what you choose if that's what you as a first
01:07:41.040nations community choose then we're fine with it or somebody say hey these things were negotiated
01:07:47.760in the 1880s the world has changed like these things were not only these things were negotiated
01:07:54.160not even before the internet before eight track players and uh uh before you know like let's let's
01:08:01.680we want to enter into a modern treaty arrangement with alberta and so alberta could sit down with
01:08:07.600that particular first nation or five of them or ten of them or half of them whichever ones say
01:08:12.720that's what they want and negotiate a new arrangement but you see the critical piece
01:08:17.520here nothing changes unless they ask for it that's why i find it so disappointing that the courts
01:08:23.680engaged in an ideological assumption that it would be a certainty that there would be rights taken
01:08:30.880away that things would be taken without their consent that's just pure nonsense the historical
01:08:36.880evidence is clear you can have a change in constitutional order and no harm no derogation
01:08:42.880at all to the rights of the first nations so they have no veto like what would you even
01:08:49.600consult with them on you would go i'll do it right now good afternoon chief and members of
01:08:55.120the council i'd like to make you aware that if alberta does move forward and follow the
01:08:59.520constitutional pathway to um uh to independence and changing the constitutional order you will
01:09:06.100be at the negotiation table and if you want your treaty rights to remain exactly as they are today
01:09:11.840and your traditional aboriginal rights exactly as today that is exactly what would happen
01:09:17.000if you decide you want some change it will be open to you to propose it but if
01:09:22.940you want no change there will be no change do you have any questions how
01:09:27.180long did that take that what wasn't even a minute and a half you see what I'm
01:09:31.700saying absolutely I'm so disappointed in a few of these chiefs who are engaging
01:09:37.400in alarmism and scaring the members of their community needlessly into thinking
01:09:43.740somehow this is dangerous for them because it's not as i've demonstrated and i really do think
01:09:49.740a few of the chiefs at least are engaging in seeking political favor from ottawa by doing
01:09:56.060these protests because it makes no sense they've been complaining about ottawa and suddenly they're
01:10:02.300like you know teenagers at a rock concert ottawa ottawa ottawa it makes no sense but the historical
01:10:10.460factual record is clear i'm glad you laid that out because you're absolutely correct on everything
01:10:15.800you said there including the j treaty crossing the international border is no big deal this has
01:10:20.460been established for a long time and all the land is currently owned by the federal government which
01:10:25.400means a negotiation or some other arrangement needs to be done other than independence because
01:10:30.360independence is for alberta's land which has been laid out it doesn't include everything
01:10:35.660that's within the borders of Alberta, and that's fine.
01:10:39.120So those conversations can come later.
01:11:33.500and it's downloaded everything's free there you can read it online you can go
01:11:37.640and look at the chapters that you're interested in there's a digestible
01:11:41.360executive summary but the whole idea is that if Alberta follows its legal
01:11:47.120pathway and this is what Albertans decide they want down the road this vote
01:11:51.860is of course on the 19th isn't that vote about independence is about whether you
01:11:57.140want things to stay the same or whether you want improvements and changes option
01:12:00.680too but um if uh we get to that point where we are now we voted for independence we're out now
01:12:09.660in the negotiations those are being worked on the idea is that when everything's ready in place
01:12:14.840so the administrative changes are in place so that the pension plan your pension check will
01:12:20.640continue to arrive your veterans check will continue to arrive your uh your old age security
01:12:27.580check will continue to arrive that the staff the continuity is in place for the staff at the
01:12:35.020airports and the passport offices and the border guards to go to work the next day just like they
01:12:39.900did the day before when that's all in place alberta would pass a continuity act that would
01:12:45.980adopt as alberta law the federal criminal code the federal trademark act the federal bank act
01:12:53.380And they would make them Alberta laws. And then the new government of Alberta would go through the normal legislative and consultative processes to decide which parts of the criminal code they want to change, which parts of the Trademark Act they want to change, you know, this sorts of things, which parts of the Immigration Act do they want to change.
01:13:18.640So that's the idea is that continuity transition, transition with continuity, and then the democratic process to change any of the policies and laws. And the whole discussion about continuity on litigation and case law is very nuanced. It's described in there in detail. We spent a lot of time with some amazing legal minds, law professors and others involved in this process, retired judges.
01:13:45.080and we're very much alive to the fact that some people will have litigation still in the courts
01:13:52.100so we we've laid out in detail how that would work to maintain continuity and predictability
01:13:58.300and minimize uncertainty and just one of the things that I haven't had a chance to mention
01:14:04.320in some of the other ones is this passport stuff you know they're trying to scare everybody right
01:14:08.020you're going to lose your pension you're not going to lose your pension the pension's your pension
01:14:11.880if i right now i'm getting my canadian pension right now because i'm at that age i can
01:14:16.740it's my money i paid into it it came off my paycheck it's not someone else's money
01:14:22.780and if i move to calgary from edmonton i'll still get my pension if i move from edmonton
01:14:31.000to toronto i'll still get my cpp if i move to england i'll still get my cpp if i move to
01:14:41.760mexico and renounce my canadian citizenship i will still get my cpp just like hundreds of thousands
01:14:52.120if not millions of canadians have who through a quirk of their journey in life in their 50s or
01:15:00.880whatever moved to another country and took on another citizenship they still get their pension
01:15:06.460because it's theirs and on the citizenship issue they say oh you know the very nice canadians
01:15:13.980for the reason we need to remain unified if you leave might take away your passport right
01:15:21.500it's like okay what is it here little dr jekyll and mr hyde going on well legally they can't
01:15:28.060legally they can't they can't for one reason for for a couple of reasons one is
01:15:33.100um it's you cannot under the citizenship act they can only take your passport away today
01:15:41.820you can surrender it but if you don't surrender it they can only take it away if you obtained
01:15:46.180it through fraud so if you didn't do fraud it's it's solid now it is true that the parliament
01:15:53.780could try and amend the citizenship act and say we are hereby rescinding all of the
01:16:03.860passports of the nationals of the new country of of of um of alberta but they can't because the
01:16:15.300charter the charter has protections against the federal government making laws that discriminate
01:16:22.180and they list the things they can't discriminate against and one of them is national origin your
01:16:28.660national origin will be alberta at that point so they have no there's a constitutional block
01:16:35.780for them to take away your citizenship to take away your passport so it's pure fear-mongering
01:16:41.620it's despicable i wish the pro side would have engaged us in a serious discussion
01:16:48.820But all they've had is emotion and fear-mongering,
01:16:51.940scary stuff about economics that are just patent nonsense.
01:16:55.420You know, oh, Ontario will stop trading with Alberta.
01:17:14.460I won't get into it because we're coming up to overtime here.
01:17:18.820On our website, LetAlbertaDecide, LetAlbertaDecide.com, Pathway to Victory, a tool that you can use.
01:17:25.220Watch the little video how you can use your phone and text your friends to help them get out to vote.
01:17:31.640It's really important that people go to the advance polls.
01:17:34.720You and I are very concerned, Jason, about how poorly Elections Alberta has conducted itself in so many ways.
01:17:41.120And we just don't want, you know, the weather to be bad on Monday, October 19th.
01:17:46.94019th somebody driving up and seeing this lineup outside a school gymnasium in the rain going no
01:17:53.000I'm not going to go ahead in that line so get out and vote tomorrow if you can't go tomorrow
01:17:58.560go on Wednesday if you can't go on Wednesday go on Thursday if you can't go you know go on Friday
01:18:03.860or Saturday unless you're coming to our rally rally is really important I know you're going
01:18:09.480to be there and you're going to be doing some really cool stuff with the audience to for the
01:18:13.340live feeds and I'm really grateful you're going to be there to do that it's very important but
01:18:17.820we got some great speakers Saturday afternoon three o'clock the weather forecast is looking
01:18:22.880spectacular sun 17 3 p.m at the legislature ground Saturday the 17th if you're from out of town we
01:18:31.100still got some spaces on the buses some of them are starting to sell out some sold out yesterday
01:18:34.880but there's still spots we're going to add some routes along the way for some of the more long
01:18:39.180distance buses they got bathrooms and comfy chairs and tvs and wi-fi and all that and you'll have some
01:18:44.960fun with meeting some new people so if you want to take the bus save some costs and have some fun
01:18:51.340and park right beside the grounds you can do that but yeah i really encourage people to come out
01:18:55.880there's been so much propaganda and psychological stuff these push-pulls are total bs the prime
01:19:02.100minister wouldn't have done what he did today we're gonna get flooded this week they're doing
01:19:06.600real polling and they think we're going to win because we are yeah even jason candy is starting
01:19:12.200to change his opinion on that one and he's starting to get worried that we're going to win he went from
01:19:16.740not a chance and he double hockey stick to uh folks he might actually win this one uh keith
01:19:22.380thanks a lot to you and your wife for providing this uh for us on this particular holiday i want
01:19:28.480to look forward to seeing you on the 17th uh i might actually we're gonna see you tomorrow
01:19:32.900there's an event in calgary on the 13th right yeah great so that's with chris
01:19:37.700yeah let's talk over to go check out the website so we'll see you tomorrow keith
01:19:43.940tomorrow night i think it starts at 7 or 6 30 at the astoria in calgary you bet thanks so much
01:19:51.060for you doing this i'm very grateful you do phenomenal work you and your wife
01:19:56.100it's honored to have i'm honored to have had the chance to meet you first at the public inquiry
01:20:01.060i saw the hours you were putting in and getting accurate information out to people uh thank you
01:20:06.500again i appreciate your time keith you keep it keep it going and we'll talk soon have a good day
01:20:11.780thank you sir bye now well there you are folks uh get yourself ready if you're not advanced uh
01:20:18.340getting ready for the advanced voting you should if you haven't done the mail-in voting and you've
01:20:21.860confirmed your packages there then make sure you get into the advanced voting um it's all this week
01:20:26.820Okay. And yes, I saw a lot of questions in there, especially around the scrutineers. Stay tuned. There's going to be something announced shortly about the scrutineers. We're working hard as third party advertisers to make sure this election is fair. And we want to make sure that that letter that came out of Elections Alberta is addressed. So stay tuned on that one.
01:20:45.280And in addition to tomorrow with Let's Talk Alberta,
01:20:49.360we have an event because we are talking about the Transition Council work.