00:02:45.480They were protesting against building this data center in Sturgeon County in northern Alberta, but when they talked about water use and land use and natural gas use and power use, that's not really what bothered them.
00:02:59.040I mean, for heaven's sakes, it's in a heavy industrial area surrounded by refineries and upgraders and the like.
00:03:05.220That's not really what motivated them.
00:03:54.080Who will get to space first, the Soviet Union or the United States?
00:03:58.140If the U.S. said, well, we don't want to go to the moon, no one should go to the moon.0.67
00:04:02.120Well, the Soviet Union was going to go to the moon.
00:04:04.340The analogy today would be China versus America.
00:04:07.660there will be artificial intelligence. There will be AI. The question is, will it be China or will
00:04:14.120it be America in the driver's seat? There are reasons to worry about AI for sure. But I'll tell
00:04:19.900you one thing, at least an American AI that's subject to the rule of law and hopefully some0.62
00:04:26.420rules about freedom and truth will be vastly superior to a People's Liberation Army weaponized
00:04:33.720AI. That's none of that has anything to do with should there be the construction of a computer
00:04:40.340center in northern Alberta. Anyways, Morinville, 200 people were worried about him. So I got their
00:04:46.020point of view, the anti point of view, the those who are against it. But I thought it would be good
00:04:52.140to talk to the man himself, largely responsible for arranging things from a regulatory point of
00:04:58.260It's a data center owned by Meta, which is the new name of Facebook, a $13 billion investment.
00:05:04.620But the reason Alberta was chosen had a lot to do with the cooler climate, the industrial land, but also the regulatory rules.
00:05:13.300What was incredible to me talking to the Minister of Innovation and Technology in Alberta, Nate Glubish, is that from conception to shovels in the ground was two years.
00:05:23.520I can't think of anything in Canada that's built in just two years. Pipelines take decades if
00:05:30.560they're even allowed at all. That shows you what can happen if the federal government is out of
00:05:35.280the way. Anyways, without further ado, please watch the following one hour interview with
00:05:41.760Nate Glubish, Alberta's minister in charge of AI data centers. We actually met up at the location
00:05:48.260of the data center under construction. Now it's not being constructed yet. They're preparing the
00:05:53.080land which is very muddy and boggy but you will see one of the things i emphasized in the interview
00:05:59.380is it's surrounded by refineries like it couldn't be in more industrial place i mean i don't think
00:06:06.220they make steel up there but they pretty much make everything else and it was a pleasure to spend so
00:06:12.020much time with him i'm grateful to him without further ado my one hour interview with alberta's
00:06:17.280minister in charge of AI. Take a look. So we're driving adjacent to the property where
00:06:26.520the big data center is going to be built. But I want to point out the place we're in. If you
00:06:32.220look forward, the entire horizon is dotted with refineries and upgraders and petrochemical works.
00:06:41.860I don't know what they all are, but this is the greatest concentration of high, heavy industry in Alberta and one of the most in Canada.
00:06:53.060Like this surely is larger than what remains of the steel and coal industry in Hamilton.
00:07:01.420There's no residential neighborhoods here.
00:07:05.280This is not pristine ecological land like an old growth forest.
00:07:10.020there's no there's no interest here other than heavy industry and out that
00:07:17.160side you can see a mighty railroad track being built like it's already steel and
00:07:24.900smoke and men and if you were to put a data center anywhere in Canada this
00:07:33.180would be it it's large parcels of land that are already zoned for heavy
00:07:39.940industry talk about access to oil and gas for energy I mean one of the things
00:07:45.000that comes to my mind is the anti everything people they say oh you can't
00:07:49.020export this I remember when professor Trudeau said there's no business case
00:07:53.220for exporting natural gas well fine then how about a data center will build a
00:07:59.640power plant to use Alberta's natural gas and it'll be in this heavy industry
00:08:05.320zoned area so it's not like a data center for example there's there's one
00:08:10.440in downtown Vancouver and I'm not against that data center at all I'm
00:08:13.960just saying if you wanted the best smartest place to put one you would put
00:08:18.960one in a place where there was no fathomable objection no one who works
00:08:23.460in this heavy industry heartland would say anything other than welcome to their
00:08:30.000new neighbors from Meta and there's one more wrinkle to it some of the protests
00:08:36.780against data centers recently have been in Hamilton have been in Vancouver it's
00:08:44.960hard to get out here it's hard to get to this place and I suppose you could drive
00:08:51.840or rent a bus or something but this is not a protest amenable place like
00:08:57.580downtown Vancouver is where the the vote latte mafia decides what gets built or0.54
00:09:02.580not this is Alberta this is rural northern Alberta maybe the hardest0.97
00:09:07.740working part of the country no disrespect to anyone else and it looks
00:09:13.500like they've been working for a couple of weeks now judging by one of the signs
00:09:17.880And they've already done an enormous amount of work and we're just about a half hour early for our meeting with the minister and the spokesman for the build.
00:09:27.000So we just thought we'd drive around. There is an enormous amount of economic activity already.
00:09:33.600Last point, when we were at the anti-data center protest a few days ago in Morinville, Alberta, there were some good people there, by the way, who were concerned about AI and its uses.
00:09:45.900and I respect that. But the organizer of the protest, Ben Burry, I asked him in particular,
00:09:52.620why are there no working men here? Why are there no representatives from the trades here?
00:09:59.300Because how dare you say to the local people here, you can't have good six-figure jobs in your trade.
00:10:08.320Why are you taking an anti-everything point of view?
00:10:12.900And Alberta has always been pro-work and pro-industry.
00:10:19.880And it's been stopped at every turn trying to export that.
00:10:24.740So it wants to build something heavy and industrial here.
00:10:29.420And those same anti-everything people want to shut it down.
00:10:32.840I don't know. I think there's something morally wrong with that.
00:10:35.180we're going to make our way now to where we're meeting the Minister of Technology for Alberta
00:10:40.000and the spokesman for the construction. We just want to talk about the facility
00:10:44.320because it looks like there are already, I would estimate, at least 100 people on site,
00:10:50.520including a lot of security, by the way. It's very interesting. I'm very glad we're here,
00:10:55.820and I'm grateful to the minister to agree to meet us. One of the largest industrial projects
00:11:00.200ever unveiled in canada is happening right on the ground i'm standing and it didn't take a dollar
00:11:07.380of government money i'm talking about the massive hyperscale data center being built by meta and its
00:11:14.760partners in northern alberta but you won't be surprised to hear this there's opposition to it
00:11:20.260too on sunday i was at an anti-data center protest in the town of morinville alberta and i was
00:11:26.620surprised by the turnout here take a look at this i know that you appeal to the right wing so i'm
00:11:32.040just going to say something that unifies everyone oh that's a good idea because i'm not here to be
00:11:36.900partisan believe it or not i'm here to present an issue that's simple okay is that everyone needs
00:11:44.580to breathe everyone needs to pay energy bills and everyone has information sovereignty the more that
00:11:51.400that is distorted the more that is controlled by different forces outside of your control
00:14:33.780Tell me about the heavy industrial region we're in.
00:14:36.320I was driving around earlier and I couldn't even count how many heavy industry refineries and upgraders and petrochemical plants there were.
00:14:44.180So this fits in a heavy industry site, doesn't it?
00:14:48.480Well, yeah, it all comes down to location, Ezra, because, of course, you don't want these things right next door to a residential district.
00:14:56.680You want to make sure that this is in a place that was always zoned for heavy industry.
00:15:01.300And so we're in the middle of what's known as the Alberta Industrial Heartland.
00:15:05.520This is where we have all of our refineries and all of our petrochemical processing plants.
00:15:10.280This is the same area where Dow's large ethylene cracker is being built, which was one of the largest investments in Alberta before this one.
00:20:31.500Well, I'm here to support anti-AI and data centers.
00:20:36.420And as a matter of fact, I've been pushing hard, you know, online to stop or just to get stuff like this happening.
00:20:44.280Would you call yourself a right winger or a conservative?
00:20:46.580i'm a skeptic or a dissonant i would i don't want to label you label yourself i'm a rebel news fan
00:20:53.940and i stand behind rebel news 110 now we have some worries about ai we don't understand it fully
00:21:03.520but one of the things that we came here today to to investigate was are these just anti-industry
00:21:11.140anti-oil and gas climate activists, because it sounded a bit like they were grafting on
00:21:18.780the anti-data center stuff to just anti-energy, anti-development stuff. Does that worry you?
00:21:25.920I think everyone's really concerned. This is very disturbing. We can see what's happening in the U.S.
00:21:32.320and it's destruction of society and all the freedoms.
00:21:39.540So there's a good guy. He probably votes conservative. He's a big supporter of Rebel News. But AI itself makes him nervous. I think he's worried about this future that is unknown to us. It's a new industrial revolution, but will it put others out of work?
00:21:58.940What do you say to people who are uncomfortable or unfamiliar with AI, which is I think most of us, taking it out on the nearest physical thing?
00:22:10.900So they can't punch back at Mark Zuckerberg in person, but maybe they can oppose this data center as their way of saying, I'm against AI.
00:22:24.580Well, I would say, look, I understand that concern. I understand fear of the unknown. And when we talk about AI, a lot of folks haven't firsthand experienced how AI can make their life better, how it can make them more productive, how it can help them to earn more money, how it can take them to a more productive state.
00:22:44.780And so if you haven't experienced that firsthand, I can understand some of the hesitation.
00:22:49.560And when I talk to folks like that, I like to tell them a story about something that we've experienced inside the government of Alberta.
00:22:54.840Our goal is to become the most innovative jurisdiction in North America, the most AI native public service.
00:23:01.640And so we've invested heavily into training our personnel to say we want to equip you with the tools and the techniques and the training to be able to use AI.
00:23:09.300And so one of our one of my employees, his name is Harris.
00:24:37.520So our goal is to say, hey, how do we equip people like Harish all across the government of Alberta to be able to accomplish similar things every single day so that they're more fulfilled, so that they have more fun, so that they enjoy their job, so that they can eliminate the tedious, mundane parts of their job and instead focus on how do I do things that previously I wish I could do, but before were impossible.
00:25:00.840With AI, we can do what was impossible.
00:25:05.300And so my message to folks is, you can do this too. And we can help show you how. We can share our training, share our techniques, and we can lead by example.
00:25:15.540I think with AI, there's something else also. And my colleague Sheila Gunn-Reed says it's sort of like the space race during the Cold War.
00:25:23.960The Soviet Union and the United States were in a race to who could be in space first, who could land on the moon first.
00:25:29.140And it wasn't should someone land on the moon. It was who is going to get there first, the Soviets or America.
00:25:37.160And I think her point is China is moving so fast with AI and they don't have democratic processes and environmental processes.
00:25:47.280Chinese AI is quite far advanced. And I think one of the questions for data centers and for AI is not will it be here?
00:25:55.820it's will it be run by China or will it be run by the West,
00:26:01.380hopefully with some spirit of freedom and truth in it.
00:26:05.220And I think that that's sort of hard to wrap your head around.
00:26:10.680But I just don't think the genie can be put back in the bottle.
00:26:24.920Yeah, I think it's a fair point. AI infrastructure will be built. The question is where, and the question is who will be in charge of it. And my position is that we should want the West and nations who are friendly to the West to be the ones who are leading that charge, to be the ones who have the most sophisticated technology, the most sophisticated capabilities.
00:26:50.460And we should ensure that that is subject to Western laws and Western rules, you know, where we actually value the rule of law and we value freedom and we value a free market.
00:27:04.220And truth, you know, like that. That's what scares me about AI is that what if AI were owned by the Communist Party of China?
00:27:15.700I think these are reasonable things that folks should be thinking about in the big picture of AI.
00:27:20.460So if this infrastructure will be built, we should be asking, where should it be built?
00:27:25.080And I suggest that it should be built in Alberta.
00:27:29.260Alberta can and should be a cornerstone of North American AI infrastructure.
00:27:34.260And this way, we know that it is being built in our backyard, subject to Canadian laws.
00:27:42.380And we will see the economic benefit of the physical infrastructure as it is built and then operated and then maintained.
00:27:49.740But then that also will create a ripple effect in our economy in terms of the overall supply chain, in terms of local tech companies and researchers being able to use AI infrastructure that is based here and they can build the next generation of AI technologies.
00:28:06.060This is how we ensure that Albertans will be significant beneficiaries of an AI based economy.
00:28:13.500I want to talk a little bit more about that in a moment. But first, I think I skipped over the details about the things we mentioned before, the water, the air.
00:28:24.720I mentioned that this is a heavy industry place. That's not code for so it's OK to pollute.
00:28:30.000It's it's another way of saying this fits right in. This is not anomalous. This is probably the best place to put it.
00:28:36.880But what are some of the rules? Like a lot of the people I met at the protest, they would say, well, what about the air and what about water use?
00:28:43.500And I, of course, don't speak for MET.
00:28:46.280I didn't have all those facts at my fingertips.
00:28:49.660Do you want to tell me and through me to our viewers, what are the rules of thumb, not just for this, but for future data centers, too?
00:28:58.260Because I wouldn't be surprised if people say, oh, well, META has decided Alberta's the right place.
00:29:44.000So anybody who comes now, they will be last in line because they're the last ones to become approved for a water license.
00:29:50.780And that means that in a period of scarce water, if there's a drought, they're the first ones to be turned off.
00:29:57.000They're the first ones to be curtailed.
00:29:59.020So, you know, a project like META's, if they were using lots of water, they would never, it would never compromise households, households access to water.
00:30:08.220You're saying those who were here already would get priority rights if there was a shortage.
00:30:12.300That's the way Alberta's laws work today and always have worked.
00:30:15.120I never thought of Alberta having a shortage.
00:30:17.400There's the odd drought here and there, but I always thought Alberta had a lot of fresh water.
00:34:18.520And, you know, a lot of these critics, I see a lot of the same people who are AI critics, who were environmental critics, anti-oil critics.
00:34:28.880And, I mean, I remember Justin Trudeau saying there's no business case to export natural gas, which is crazy.
00:35:01.080Yeah. So, I mean, first, as you know, our government is very pro oil and gas, pro traditional infrastructure like pipelines.
00:35:08.000And I'm really proud of the work that Daniel Smith has done as our premier to make some inroads with the federal government to make progress with traditional pipeline infrastructure.
00:35:18.320But while that's happening, in addition to that, these data centers are an opportunity for us to develop a global demand for our gas without having to worry about whether we have enough capacity to export that.
00:35:33.660So what we are able to do is to convert that gas into electricity, convert that electricity to intelligence and export that anywhere on planet Earth at the speed of light through fiber.
00:35:42.940This is an enormous opportunity for us to exponentially increase demand for our natural resources, to ensure that we see investment, we see jobs, we see new royalty revenues to the province, new tax revenues to the province, all of which will then help to fund health care and education and public safety.
00:36:00.680Let's talk about that. You know, you've got all these folks working, so you've got the income tax, but you've got property tax, you've got, as you mentioned, royalty on natural gas.
00:36:26.420There is a public dollar side, but it's the benefits.
00:36:29.300Tell me about some of the expected revenues that the province will get from this.
00:36:34.500This is one of the things I'm really proud of, Ezra, because when we got started on this,
00:36:37.520A lot of folks were saying, oh, well, you're going to need to subsidize this.
00:36:41.340You're going to need to give tax credits.
00:36:42.880You're going to need to give all kinds of public dollars to attract this investment here,
00:36:49.040to be competitive with other jurisdictions that are doing those things.
00:36:52.880But I felt very confident, and the Premier felt very confident,
00:36:57.600they need electricity more than they need anything else.
00:37:01.060We don't need to give a single dollar of public resources to these companies.
00:37:06.040And so we held the line and we designed our regulatory environment to ensure that not a single dollar would be given.
00:37:13.500And so to now secure a 13 billion dollar investment from Meta on top of a four and a half billion dollar investment by Peminent and Kineticor to build a power plant that's going to help power this site without a single dollar of public investment is a significant deal.
00:37:31.220So it's 13 plus four, 17 billion dollars.
00:37:34.220That's staggering. That's bigger than any project that's contemplated right now.
00:37:39.620It's one of the biggest investments in Canadian history of any type.
00:37:43.620And we're really proud of that. We did it without having to subsidize it to make it happen in this jurisdiction.
00:37:48.720We could compete on the strength of our regulatory environment, our access to energy at scale,
00:37:55.500and a get-or-done business environment and a government that supports getting projects built responsibly.
00:38:04.220But to your point, Ezra, the money side is on the receiving side.
00:38:08.200This is the good news for Albertans, is that this one project, the Meta Project, is going to result in approximately $250 million of new benefits to Albertans.
00:38:18.020New tax revenues, new royalty revenues, new fees, and new, like, I'm not just talking about GDP growth.
00:38:25.240I'm talking about actual dollars in the bank benefiting Albertans coming in every single year for decades to come.
00:38:31.060This is one of the most successful economic development exercises we've ever undertaken.
00:38:38.060I feel that with AI, it's not actually a debate over water or over emissions.
00:38:46.060It's about, oh, my God, what is happening?
00:38:49.060And I think there needs to be a—and that's just my view.
00:38:52.060It's a bit of a fear of the unknown. I think that's correct.
00:38:57.060So we're talking about bring your own energy?
00:38:59.060energy yeah you know i love this phrase the premier uses bring your own power bring your own energy
00:39:06.180to people who want to set up a data center that's i haven't heard that before tell me a little bit
00:39:10.500about what that means yeah well one of the things that's important to us is you know that we had
00:39:13.940heard from folks who say we don't want data centers to cause a risk to our grid to cause uh
00:39:20.020stability issues with the grid and we agree right we want to make sure that albertans can rely on
00:39:24.820on their electricity grid and so one of the things we said is since data centers need so much
00:39:29.460electricity we want to prioritize projects that are going to bring their own generation
00:39:34.340and that's one of the things that about this meta project that was so interesting is that
00:39:37.860yes there is a portion of the site that will be powered by the grid but there's also there they
00:39:42.900are essentially building a 1.8 gigawatt power plant to serve their own needs on their own dime at
00:39:49.620their own cost at their own risk they're partnering with pembina and kinetocor to build that that
00:39:53.380power plant that's a four and a half billion dollar power plant so that's one of the ways that
00:39:58.900we're protecting the grid another way that we're protecting folks power bills because that's another
00:40:03.140concern we always get is well is my power bill going to go up and you know we had seen examples
00:40:08.740in in other jurisdictions where they subsidize the transmission infrastructure they paid for
00:40:14.180all kinds of electrical infrastructure and ratepayers ultimately bared the cost kind of like
00:40:19.940like when the NDP decided to phase out coal prematurely, you know, Albertans paid billions
00:40:24.720of dollars of costs for that. So what we decided to do instead is to make it very clear, if you
00:40:30.240cause a cost, you will pay for it. And so for example, you know, Meadow was able to secure
00:40:35.840access to some grid electricity for the first phases of their power project. They're paying
00:40:41.960over $100 million for the physical infrastructure to tie into that grid. Alberta ratepayers are not
00:40:48.100going to pay for that. We would not allow for that to happen. We looked to the examples in other
00:40:53.580jurisdictions. We saw the mistakes that were made. We legislated corrections to make sure that
00:40:57.540couldn't happen here before project even got off the ground. And as a result, Meta is going to be
00:41:02.340paying 100% of the infrastructure costs to be able to operate here and to essentially bring
00:41:07.500their own generation and to pay their own way for whatever grid electricity they have access to.
00:41:13.100So we've got very strict controls in there to protect grid stability and affordability
00:41:17.740And, you know, we're really proud of that diligence we put in.
00:41:22.020The final piece I'd put into Ezra is just the last little piece about the meta deal that I think is really interesting.
00:41:30.680Because they will be using a portion of the grid, they are going to be one of the largest rate payers for transmission fees in the entire province.
00:41:39.780And because they are also paying for all of the transmission infrastructure that's required to tie into that grid,
00:41:44.700That means that they're going to be paying over $100 million annually every year, which will reduce every other Albertan and Alberta businesses' transmission charges correspondingly.
00:41:56.200So you will likely see, what you will see is about a 6% reduction in the transmission fees for every other Albertan because of this one project.
00:42:49.240Now, when I think of the center of gravity of tech, I think Silicon Valley.
00:42:53.580I also think, OK, maybe Texas and SpaceX and stuff.
00:42:57.940Northern Alberta is not what pops to mind.
00:43:00.200But if META comes and if it's successful and if the regulatory lay of the land is the same for others, you could have.
00:43:09.600I mean, there are, would you say it's a plan or a strategy to attract other data centers in the area?
00:43:18.180So when we first launched our AI data center attraction strategy at the end of 2024, I set out our ambition was to attract $100 billion of data center investment within five years.
00:43:31.960But I think now you're seeing with a single project, you've got almost a little over $17 billion when you include the power generation on the data center from one project.
00:43:41.100All of a sudden, it doesn't seem so crazy.
00:44:03.820We've been leaders in AI research for over 20 years.
00:44:06.680We are now leaders in public sector AI adoption.
00:44:09.940It makes sense we should also be leaders in AI infrastructure to power government workloads, private sector workloads, researchers' workloads.
00:44:20.340And if we do it right, we can protect Albertans from some of the mistakes that happened in other jurisdictions who rushed there without doing their due diligence.
00:44:29.740But we can also ensure that Albertans will see significant financial benefit.
00:44:32.660Are there other companies that you're working with, even if you can't name them?
00:44:36.640Are there others who are saying, hey, this is moving forward, looks good.
00:45:54.560Now, I think that critic has dreams of a big bogged down red tape mess that drags things out for years, as frankly, the federal government is now famous for having killed several pipelines.
00:46:12.640God willing, the proposed Alberta, you know, God willing, Alberta's pipelines go forward.
00:46:17.620But I think that that criticism misunderstands what's going on here.
00:46:22.160It would be like any factory. You don't have general public hearings about any given factory, do you? I mean, tell me what approvals were here. I suppose it was the zoning is the main one that this area was zoned for this.
00:46:40.960What do you say to someone who says there was no public input?
00:46:44.440My reflex would be to say, sorry, someone from the downtown city coming out here to Sturgeon County and saying, you can't build this.
00:46:51.880That's not part of our regulatory system.
00:46:54.640I'm sure you have a better answer than me then.
00:46:57.160Well, first, I would say, again, it comes down to location.
00:46:59.280And one of the reasons why this location just made so much sense is it's in the middle of the Alberta industrial heartland.
00:47:04.520It's been zoned for heavy industrial use for decades.
00:47:07.920and the consultation around that zoning happened decades ago.
00:47:13.100So to say there was no consultation is not exactly true.
00:47:17.560There was consultation when this property was zoned for these types of purposes.
00:47:33.800But, you know, furthermore, you know, before a project can get built,
00:47:37.220It still has to go through a very strict regulatory environment.
00:47:40.720Like just because we say just because we say that Alberta is a great place to get things done and to get things built, it doesn't mean that there's not checks and balances.
00:47:49.360We still have if you want to build a power plant, which most data centers sites are going to require, you need to go through the Alberta Utilities Commission and you still need to get approvals.
00:47:58.780you need to prove that your air quality after you are operating will meet all of our strict
00:48:06.260air quality guidelines, both on the site and in the surrounding areas. And compliance with that
00:48:11.860doesn't stop after you build it. Like that would be an ongoing obligation. There's very strict
00:48:18.620rules around noise. There's very strict rules around water. So we have all of these protections
00:48:24.260in place uh and that's and and there's also several opportunities for the public to voice
00:48:32.840their questions and their concerns into that process uh so all of those processes have been
00:48:38.520followed and our commitment to albertans is no project will move forward in alberta unless they
00:48:43.980follow our environmental guidelines i want to put one last thing in i really appreciate you taking
00:48:49.780so much time and it's sort of noisy in the background here but that's the sound of men and
00:48:54.000working by the way it's the sound of progress um one of the things that and I'm referring to this
00:49:00.320protest this was such an eye-opener to me of what people feel about these data centers is sometimes
00:49:05.780code for other things and one of the things I saw was they were demonizing CEOs of tech companies
00:49:13.200they had a picture of Peter Thiel a picture of Mark Zuckerberg a picture of Elon Musk
00:49:17.820with demonic eyes and and like there was a real um it was like you say it was a personification
00:49:25.720of anyone's feelings about a billionaire or a trillionaire this is the way to punch back
00:49:32.000and in truth a lot of those tech leaders are a little quirky i mean i i guess you gotta be to
00:49:40.440be a visionary and a builder like some of these and they've been in the public eye for so long
00:49:45.660you know there's a saying friends come and go but enemies accumulate you know some people
00:49:50.680some of these i think of mark zuckerberg of meta you know he in the past has been a censor on
00:49:57.780facebook and i myself have criticized him so there's a lot of focus on the individual ceos
00:50:07.700and i think a lot of that's being projected onto a factory here i think of kevin o'leary who's quite
00:50:14.500character but he's sort of like the bad cop on tv shows maybe he is there a way for data centers
00:50:23.320to have i don't know a different association with different people with different stories
00:50:30.780because i think that uh some jealousy of tech ceos and antipathy towards them i saw a lot of
00:50:40.460emotional hatred towards billionaires being transformed into opposition to a job site.
00:50:47.320And I wonder if there's a solution to that or if that's just the way it is.
00:50:52.940I definitely see a lot of the same, that personification issue that you've just described.
00:51:02.680And I think the approach that I'm trying to take with it is to just take a step back and
00:51:07.440say, let's remember what this is really all about.
00:51:10.220This is about ensuring that we can prove to the world
00:51:12.320that you can build large-scale AI infrastructure in Alberta.
00:51:37.540But then now we start having some made in Alberta, made in Canada sites that are owned by Albertans and Canadians, that are operated by Albertans and Canadians, that are being used to build the next generation of AI technologies that could create billion dollar, you know, 100 billion dollar companies right here in Alberta.
00:51:55.100You can't do that without the physical infrastructure.
00:52:00.400And my goal was to say, let's bring in other companies who, on their own dime, on their own pocketbook, are willing to build this infrastructure at their risk under our rules in a way where Albertans will benefit.
00:52:16.460We will then get more infrastructure built here, and that will create more opportunity for Albertans.
00:52:20.980And I think the second part is just to say, look, if you want to look at some of these billionaires and criticize, like, why not spend some time looking at how can you use AI in your life to create more value, to create more wealth for you and your family, to create more opportunity for you and your kids?
00:52:49.800Let us show you how we've used AI responsibly.
00:52:52.720I told you the story about Harris earlier.
00:52:54.560We've had other stories where, you know, on a single project alone, we were able to save Alberta taxpayers $52 million on building something for the Department of Infrastructure.
00:53:02.300And we have dozens of stories like that that can happen every single year.
00:53:06.040So if we can save hundreds of millions of dollars for Alberta taxpayers, imagine what every Albertan could do if they were empowered with the same tools, technologies and techniques to use AI in their daily lives.
00:53:17.380That's what we're hoping to inspire and lead by example so that we can help Albertans reach the best versions of themselves and create the most opportunity and wealth for them and their families.
00:53:27.660I know we're almost out of time, but there's just one more political question I have for you.
00:53:32.960Until very recently, the word innovation was something that both the right and the left used in high tech, everything.
00:53:40.700Everyone wanted to be on the leading edge of high tech.
00:53:43.200But it feels like in the last couple of years, for certain parts of the left, they flipped against data centers and AI, even though that's obviously the center of gravity for that's where all the energy is on technology.
00:53:56.940You see Bernie Sanders, the governor of New York, Kathy Hochul has put a moratorium on.
00:54:02.380In this country, you see Wab Kanu, the premier of Manitoba, just pull the plug on a data center and just totally surprised the company.
00:54:11.240you have the leader of the NDP here in Alberta, Nahid Nanshi, who used to be an innovator guy
00:54:15.780himself. Now he's like a Luddite. Why have all the leaders of the hard left suddenly gone
00:54:23.580absolutely hard line on this? It's almost like they did it all together. What's motivating that
00:54:31.220and what's your response? Well, I can't really put myself in the shoes of the leaders of the
00:54:38.540left, I don't understand how they think. But if I had to guess, I think they don't like the tech
00:54:46.280companies. They don't like the tech billionaires, like you've mentioned, some of the frustrations
00:54:50.940that have come from, that you've heard from some of the protesters. They see some of the
00:54:57.600criticisms of data centers. And instead of being willing to do the hard work to understand the
00:55:02.160issues, to do the due diligence and to say, is there a responsible way to do this? Is there a
00:55:07.280better way to do this. Instead, they just say, this is bad. We don't want to do it. And then
00:55:11.620they choose to fight against it for cheap political points. We, on the other hand,
00:55:16.080we're willing to roll up our sleeves, do the homework, do the due diligence, spend the time
00:55:19.140to say, hey, we see the opportunity. If we get this right, Albertans will see enormous benefit.
00:55:23.580Therefore, it's on us to figure out a way to do this right. And so we put the time in. We did the
00:55:29.960work. We've developed a regulatory environment that makes sense and that finds that balance
00:55:34.280between protecting the environment, protecting Albertans' interests, ensuring that Albertans
00:55:38.540will benefit, while still making sure that Alberta is a place where we can build big
00:55:42.200things. We can dream big and make those dreams happen. That's what our conservative government
00:55:48.380here in Alberta is all about. We want to create opportunity. We want to ensure that Albertans
00:55:52.680will benefit from these types of investments. And we've created an environment that will protect
00:55:56.820that. My favorite part is that there's no taxpayer dollars involved. And then it was
00:56:01.640from conception to shovels in the ground in two years.0.90
01:02:24.760And I appreciate you being part of the conversation.
01:02:28.440And my favorite part today was seeing all these working men and women.
01:02:32.860And I defy any anti-AI activists to come and look them in the eye and say,
01:02:37.820you can't build this factory because I would rather have it out of sight and out of mind.
01:02:43.040And a very interesting day. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me, sir. Right on. Yeah. There he is, Nate Lubish, the Minister of Technology and Innovation. I'm standing at the southeast corner of the parcel of land that's going to host the Meta Data Center. It's a really big piece of land. But as you can see, it's not particularly interesting. It's not like an old growth forest or a pristine mountain glade. It's just a rough field. It's really boggy.
01:03:12.140there's no residential areas around you there's no tourism this is what it is
01:03:17.840going to be used for some heavy industry and I say that by looking just across
01:03:23.300the road at this enormous facility this is a terminal for oil tankers these are
01:03:30.520because pipelines have been stymied well they built a moving pipeline that you
01:03:36.200see every day across the prairies which are endless long trains with oil and
01:03:42.660other products from oil that is shipped out of Alberta and this terminal is where
01:03:50.160a lot of it gets done but even in the further distance you can see upgraders
01:03:54.200and petrochemical plants and refineries and it's sort of an amazing vista I
01:04:00.440really don't know any other place in Canada that we would be built up like
01:04:04.940this. And every one of the jobs here, and there are thousands, is a skilled trade. And I don't
01:04:16.360know what every job earns, but a lot of these higher end skilled trades are making a quarter
01:04:22.160million dollars a year. And this meta data center will probably not be as intensive an employer
01:04:32.120as, say, this rail terminal, but you never know.
01:05:22.100What a ridiculous and stupid thing to say.0.99
01:05:24.220But he managed to block exports in different ways for years.1.00
01:05:29.120Well, now there's a way for Alberta to sell that natural gas to customers right here.
01:05:35.320If Trudeau wouldn't let us sell to Germany and Japan and Ukraine and Korea, well, fine, we'll sell to companies right here and use it right here.
01:05:47.740You know, when I was at the anti-data center protest a week ago, I asked the organizer, why aren't there any working men here?
01:05:55.600Why aren't there any tradesmen? Why aren't there any labor councils? Well, it's sort of obvious why, because working people love this project. This is how Alberta does it. This is how Alberta has the highest standard of living of the country.
01:06:11.060And the NDP, which used to be a workers' party, and even the Revolutionary Communist Party, which was at the protest, their symbol, the hammer and sickle, they don't believe in those anymore. They don't actually believe in work anymore.
01:06:25.060I want to say that the problem I had with that protest was not their arguments against the data center, which were clearly fabricated.
01:06:37.060I mean, there's no genuine reason to oppose the data center for any environmental reason.
01:06:43.360It is a lighter touch than, frankly, a lot of these heavy industries around here.
01:06:48.560It really is going to be a delightful neighbor to the other industries around here.
01:06:54.960The only thing I had a tough time arguing and rebutting at this anti-data center rally
01:07:01.480was AI itself and what it means to people who will be left behind.
01:07:05.740And what was interesting about my conversation with Minister Glubish is that he had all the answers for the technical objections.
01:07:12.740What about power use? What about water use? What about, you know, electrical grid use?
01:07:19.740But there's an aesthetic, emotional part to this debate that no one has yet answered.
01:07:26.740I mean, I personally admire the technology and the tech CEOs, some more than others.
01:07:34.740but not everyone shares that view a lot of people are afraid that they will be
01:07:39.960left behind and that's not a problem that can be fixed or not fixed here in
01:07:45.540Sturgeon County in Alberta whether or not this data center goes or not is not
01:07:50.800going to solve those existential angst questions what's my purpose in life will
01:07:55.960I have a job what does it even mean to have a job when AI can do humans work
01:08:01.760better and faster than us those are all very challenging questions that probably
01:08:06.260have a spiritual component to them by the way but shutting down construction
01:08:13.100jobs and factory jobs now in Alberta now is not going to allay those fears and
01:08:22.040that's why one of my major criticisms of these anti data center protesters is
01:08:30.980is that what they're effectively doing
01:08:33.920is driving this construction to China.
01:08:37.420Because like the Soviet versus American space race,
01:08:42.440The only question is who will get there first.
01:08:45.100Somebody's gonna build these data centers,
01:08:47.380whether it's Huawei and the People's Republic of China,
01:08:50.460or whether it's Meta and the province of Alberta.
01:08:54.860And you simply can't put that genie back in the bottle.
01:08:58.300And maybe it would be nice if we could.
01:09:00.160Maybe it would be nice to go back before, you know, our cell phones took over all our free time and made us hooked on our phones all the time.
01:09:09.860Maybe it would be nice to go back a generation technologically, but that's not going to happen.
01:09:17.380And I think people are taking out their concerns about AI on a physical structure that, frankly, there's no better place in the world for it.0.74
01:09:28.820I guarantee you that data centers being built in China don't give a damn about the environment at all or workers rights.
01:09:36.820I can guarantee you that they're not being done as democratically and as responsive to the people as done here in Alberta.
01:09:43.820I'm going to keep following this story because we're going to have to.
01:09:47.820this is going to be the story of our generation what it means to live in a in the next industrial
01:09:55.420economy where so many things are done by computers and by machines but avoiding that is not something
01:10:04.860that can be achieved by shutting down this data center as the leftist plan to do i'm
01:10:10.140I'm going to keep thinking about this for a while.