Rebel News Podcast - We’ve filed a constitutional challenge to Saskatchewan’s lockdown laws

00:00:00.000 Well, another day, another lawsuit, but this time we're on the hunt.

00:00:02.980 We are taking the government of Saskatchewan to court.

00:00:06.140 We're challenging the constitutionality of their ban on political gatherings.

00:00:11.640 Wish us luck. I'll tell you where you can read the entire lawsuit, and I'll quote a bit to you.

00:00:16.740 Before I do, let me invite you to become a subscriber to Rebel News Plus.

00:00:20.560 That's what we call the video version of this podcast.

00:00:23.480 Plus, you get shows every week from Sheila Gunn-Reed, David Menzies, and now Andrew Chapados.

00:00:27.300 So that's a lot of content for just $8 a month.

00:00:31.200 Seriously, $2 a week. I think maybe we're undercharging.

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00:00:42.480 Okay, here's today's podcast.

00:00:57.300 Tonight, we've filed a constitutional challenge to Saskatchewan's lockdown laws.

00:01:05.760 I'll tell you about our project to open Saskatchewan.

00:01:09.360 It's January 27th, and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.

00:01:12.360 There are 76 hospitals in the province of Saskatchewan, and according to the latest statistics,

00:01:40.260 there are a grand total of 33 people in the entire province,

00:01:46.120 out of a population of nearly 1.2 million,

00:01:49.360 33 people who are in intensive care from the coronavirus.

00:01:53.800 So one person for every two hospitals in a province physically larger than France.

00:02:00.900 I'm not trivializing even a single death,

00:02:04.200 but I'm pointing out that it is not a crisis by any normal measure.

00:02:09.220 Like the rest of Canada, it's overwhelmingly a problem for the very old and very sick. 1.00

00:02:14.860 Again, their lives have value.

00:02:17.160 My point is, is that it is a disease that is focused on people in their 80s and 90s

00:02:22.580 who have other health problems.

00:02:25.340 So why are young, healthy people being locked up?

00:02:28.700 But it's the same story across Canada and indeed across much of the Western world.

00:02:34.160 Now, as you know, we have helped lots of individual citizens

00:02:37.800 who have received outrageous tickets and fines from the lockdown.

00:02:42.420 In the name of the pandemic, they've been given these abusive treatments.

00:02:46.560 Like in the Saskatchewan city of Prince Albert,

00:02:49.720 where the local mayor has had a long-running vendetta

00:02:53.400 against a particular church for years.

00:02:56.980 And so he used the pandemic as an excuse to give the church

00:03:01.200 the largest fine in Canada, $14,000.

00:03:06.700 He hates that church and he's using the pandemic as an excuse to smash it.

00:03:13.060 How did the fines come down?

00:03:14.420 How did you find out that you were levied some fines?

00:03:17.280 You had an evangelist, Ian Lavely.

00:03:20.660 He received a $2,800 fine plus a victim surcharge.

00:03:25.240 And your ministry received what I think so far is the largest fine issued in the country

00:03:33.180 for the coronavirus and breaking the regulations of a municipality

00:03:38.160 is $14,000 plus a victim surcharge or with?

00:03:42.720 10 plus the victims.

00:03:43.720 So, yeah, I was just contacted by Peter Ross from the health authority.

00:03:52.760 He said he wanted to talk to me.

00:03:54.540 I wouldn't, even if he said, I've got something for you.

00:03:58.520 I think he did say that anyways, but he didn't tell me he was going to give me a fine.

00:04:03.340 But, yeah, two weeks ago he contacted me and so I met him at my place of quarantining

00:04:13.600 and out at the farm and he basically gave me the ticket.

00:04:21.100 In a way, how the mayor is using the pandemic to go after his rivals,

00:04:26.740 that's a microcosm of the whole thing.

00:04:29.160 There is a problem with COVID-19.

00:04:31.080 It is a real problem, but by declaring a total emergency in the country

00:04:36.140 and putting everyone into crisis mode,

00:04:39.160 authorities now have powers to do a lot of things

00:04:42.080 that are completely unrelated to the actual problem.

00:04:46.480 And they're simply using these emergency powers to do all sorts of things

00:04:50.520 that would never be acceptable in normal times in a free society.

00:04:55.700 And now we're coming up on a full year of this,

00:04:58.820 so much for two weeks to flatten the curve, eh?

00:05:02.360 So we've helped individual people in Saskatchewan and all around Canada

00:05:06.220 with our Fight the Fines project.

00:05:08.160 We crowdfund lawyers to defend them, but that's reactive.

00:05:12.000 That's defensive.

00:05:13.540 It doesn't actually solve the problem.

00:05:16.180 It's like whack-a-mole.

00:05:18.260 The government will just find more people and just bring in more lockdown rules. 0.87

00:05:22.160 It won't end, will it?

00:05:24.960 Politicians love it too much.

00:05:27.220 I want to tell you about something we're doing to change that.

00:05:30.940 See, we booked a town hall meeting in Regina, Saskatchewan for last May, May of 2020.

00:05:38.760 It was our friend Patrick Moore, the co-founder of Greenpeace.

00:05:42.680 He had been invited by the city of Regina to give a speech at a conference for the city.

00:05:48.340 And then censors, deplatformers, cancel culture types, they jumped in and bullied the city into banning him.

00:05:56.940 And that's outrageous and unfair.

00:05:58.500 So I called up Dr. Moore and I said, don't cancel your trip to Regina.

00:06:02.640 I'll rent a big hall in town and we'll hold your speech anyways, that same night as planned.

00:06:10.560 And we'll keep the ticket prices really low and we'll make it a great night, get as many people out as possible.

00:06:16.520 And we did this and it worked amazing.

00:06:20.340 And well over a thousand people signed up, far more than the original conference.

00:06:25.540 We were making lemons into lemonade.

00:06:28.300 He was banned, but we replatformed it.

00:06:30.780 It was going to be great.

00:06:32.640 And that was scheduled for May of 2020.

00:06:35.020 Well, of course, the pandemic came in in March and no one knew just how bad it was going to be in those early days.

00:06:41.700 So when the giant auditorium we had booked called the Connectus Arts Center told us we had to postpone the event, we obviously agreed.

00:06:50.240 And most of our ticket buyers, our would-be audience, agreed too.

00:06:53.940 No one really knew what was going on.

00:06:56.260 That was in the early days.

00:06:57.980 Would we even survive the calamity?

00:07:00.420 Was this the new Ebola?

00:07:01.800 No one knew back then.

00:07:04.180 Well, within a few months, we pretty much knew.

00:07:07.660 You're going to be fine, statistically speaking, if you're a healthy person under 70.

00:07:13.700 If it makes you feel better, wear a mask or use hand sanitizer or whatever.

00:07:17.900 But we're going to be okay as a community, as a country.

00:07:22.600 If you're very old and very sick, take special precautions.

00:07:25.640 But we're going to get through this thing as a country.

00:07:27.740 So we asked the theater to reschedule the event for later in 2020, and they did.

00:07:36.660 But the province hadn't changed their rules banning indoor gatherings.

00:07:42.760 They only allowed a tiny number of people, and not for the purposes we had in mind, even though the Connectus Arts Center's main auditorium could hold over 2,200 people, they wouldn't let us have anyone in there.

00:07:58.440 So we rescheduled it again, and each time some ticket buyers asked for refunds, which is fair, and we gave it to them.

00:08:06.040 But as our audience got smaller, well, guess what?

00:08:09.560 We could actually socially distance inside that giant theater.

00:08:13.920 So individual families could sit far apart from each other in that main theater, certainly farther apart than they would in a Walmart or a Costco or on an airplane.

00:08:25.600 But the province just refused to update its original ban on indoor events like theaters.

00:08:32.980 Even though this wasn't like a rock concert or something like that.

00:08:35.720 It was a political town hall meeting, one that had already been banned by the city.

00:08:41.740 So this was very important.

00:08:42.880 And I'm not saying that music concerts and other things like that aren't important, too.

00:08:46.480 But legally speaking, constitutionally speaking, as part of our democracy, political meetings, the freedom to assemble and speak and to listen to Professor Moore, those are given a very high level of protection.

00:08:58.460 Those are actually called fundamental freedoms.

00:09:00.560 You can look them up in Section 2 of our Charter of Rights.

00:09:03.280 I think everyone has the right to meet and assemble for whatever reason.

00:09:06.800 That's my personal opinion.

00:09:07.740 But political speech about the problems of public life after a professor, Dr. Moore, had been censored and banned.

00:09:17.620 Well, that's the most protected speech in our Constitution.

00:09:20.380 So we wrote a polite letter to the health minister and to the justice minister of Saskatchewan.

00:09:26.560 And we said, look, we understand the need for public health, but we can do this.

00:09:32.020 Let me quote, given the large size of the main Conexus theater, it is possible to hold the event with all current ticket holders attending while maintaining social distancing between family bubbles.

00:09:44.600 Most ticket holders are couples or groups of four.

00:09:47.360 And based on our client's experience, it would be possible for every cluster of people to sit six feet away from the next cluster.

00:09:53.620 Certainly, seating would allow greater separation than is currently permitted on airplanes within the province of Saskatchewan where masks are required, but there is no social distancing.

00:10:03.500 Beyond this, Rebel plans to take other precautions, including providing multiple hand sanitizer stations in the lobby, providing a free mask to every attendee, screening all guests with a portable infrared thermometer, adjusting the reception and dinner events accordingly.

00:10:18.720 Rebel News is also prepared to take any other reasonable precaution that the government of Saskatchewan may require to allow this event to proceed.

00:10:26.160 You can see that letter in full on our website, opensaskatchewan.com.

00:10:31.920 So it was a friendly letter.

00:10:36.160 Constructive, wouldn't you say?

00:10:38.680 And we pointed out that it's frankly illegal for a government to just ban political gatherings.

00:10:44.980 There is no pandemic exception in the Charter of Rights.

00:10:49.100 There just is.

00:10:49.600 And let me read a little bit more from the letter.

00:10:51.260 Dr. Moore's speech is an important public policy event.

00:10:54.500 His ability to speak freely and the opportunity for attendees to assemble and associate it as a constitutionally protected right.

00:11:01.880 The event came into being to counteract what Rebel News identified as a troubling act of censorship and deplatforming.

00:11:07.480 It has been delayed once to accommodate public health concerns, but with the pandemic being under control in Regina, with not one active case being confirmed,

00:11:16.580 whatever justification may have existed to prohibit events similar to this can no longer reasonably be said to exist.

00:11:22.600 With flights and movies being approved activities in the province, there simply isn't any reasonable justification for a continuing ban on this event.

00:11:29.560 Despite this, the government has to date refused to relax its lockdown restrictions.

00:11:34.900 Now, there are a handful of cases in the province again, but back then, the government had none, and they still wrote back and said,

00:11:45.200 no, no compromise, no timeline for opening up, no recognition that we know more about the virus now than a year ago,

00:11:54.360 and basically protect the long-term care centers, protect the seniors' homes,

00:11:58.400 but young people just are less likely to get this disease and are less likely to be affected by it.

00:12:06.300 No one under 20 in Saskatchewan has died from this disease.

00:12:10.580 For example, there's different degrees of risk.

00:12:14.620 We didn't know that a year ago.

00:12:18.500 There's no understanding that there must be a balance between the public health goals

00:12:22.540 and other societal goals, including our fundamental freedoms.

00:12:25.380 So we decided to challenge this ban on gatherings with a constitutional challenge.

00:12:32.900 We're suing the government in Saskatchewan.

00:12:35.180 We have standing in its rebel news.

00:12:37.320 We have the right to organize, the right to assemble and associate.

00:12:40.100 We signed a contract with the Conexus Arts Center.

00:12:42.600 Dr. Moore has the right to speak.

00:12:45.600 He has agreed to join the lawsuit, too, as a plaintiff.

00:12:48.200 And our paying customers have the right to hear.

00:12:50.800 They have the right to listen.

00:12:51.600 One of our ticket-buying guests, Leo Gamow, has agreed to be a plaintiff, too.

00:12:56.540 And last week, we filed the lawsuit in Saskatchewan.

00:13:00.220 You can see that on the website opensaskatchewan.com, too.

00:13:05.100 The lawsuit's only 10 pages long.

00:13:07.740 We've also filed affidavits from me, from Dr. Moore, and from Leo,

00:13:12.820 explaining how our rights have been violated.

00:13:15.240 I'd encourage you to go to opensaskatchewan.com to read them in full.

00:13:19.220 I think they're interesting.

00:13:20.180 There's some legalese in them, but it's not that bad.

00:13:24.300 I mean, it's a serious lawsuit filed by serious lawyers who know their constitutional law.

00:13:27.960 But I believe that the documents are accessible to anyone who just thinks about freedom.

00:13:32.700 Let me quote a little bit from the lawsuit.

00:13:34.720 So, I told you who the plaintiffs are.

00:13:37.180 Well, here's who we're suing.

00:13:38.400 The respondent is Her Majesty the Queen in right of Saskatchewan,

00:13:41.760 as represented by the Attorney General of Saskatchewan and the Saskatchewan Minister of Health.

00:13:45.800 The applicants seek judicial review and challenge the constitutional validity of the public health orders

00:13:54.500 issued by Dr. Saqib Sahab, most recently dated December 14, 2020,

00:14:00.160 or any subsequent or substantially similar order, the PHO.

00:14:04.180 So, PHO stands for public health orders,

00:14:05.860 which is the most recent of a number of orders previously issued under the Public Health Act.

00:14:12.300 And here's what we're asking for.

00:14:15.380 Remedy, that's what you call it.

00:14:17.740 The public health order is ultra-virus, the PHA,

00:14:20.680 so it's outside the powers of the government under the Public Health Act,

00:14:24.080 and an unjustifiable violation of the fundamental freedoms of expression,

00:14:30.260 assembly, and association, as well as freedom of the press.

00:14:34.400 As a result, the applicants seek, A,

00:14:37.340 an order or declaration pursuant to Section 52 of the Charter

00:14:41.000 that the public health orders is unconstitutional for infringing on Sections 2B, 2C, and 2D of the Charter,

00:14:48.140 is not justified under Section 1 of the Charter,

00:14:51.260 and is therefore of no force or effect.

00:14:53.440 So you've got to go a little slowly as you read this, but I think it's clear, isn't it?

00:14:56.860 I'll read a little more.

00:14:58.060 Further, or in the alternative, such remedy or remedies pursuant to Section 24 of the Charter

00:15:03.320 that this Honorable Court considers appropriate and just in the circumstances,

00:15:07.600 including damages suffered by the applicant due to the postponement or cancellation of the CAC event.

00:15:14.500 C, a declaration that the public health order is unconstitutional for being inconsistent with

00:15:20.180 and contrary to Section 1E of the Bill of Rights,

00:15:22.880 and as such is of no force or effect.

00:15:25.400 D, an order or declaration that the public health order is invalid, unlawful,

00:15:30.460 and ultra-virus to the Public Health Act, and therefore of no force or effect.

00:15:34.860 So we're both referencing Trudeau's Charter of Rights and Diefenbaker's Bill of Rights.

00:15:41.080 That's a good Saskatchewan boy.

00:15:42.420 And here's the grounds we're suing on.

00:15:46.680 The grounds for the application, eight.

00:15:48.940 The applicants assert that the public health order is improper and ultra-virus the authority granted to the Ministry of Health

00:15:56.120 pursuant to the Public Health Act, as the Ministry of Health does not or cannot believe on reasonable grounds

00:16:03.120 in the prerequisites for issuing health orders prescribed in Section 45 of the Public Health Act.

00:16:08.100 Specifically, A, a serious public health threat does not exist in Saskatchewan,

00:16:13.800 and B, the restrictions set out in the Public Health Act are overly restrictive

00:16:17.980 and are not necessary to eliminate the risk to health presented by COVID-19 in Saskatchewan.

00:16:22.800 I know I'm getting in the weeds a bit, and there's some jargon here,

00:16:28.000 but I want to read the next couple of paragraphs to you, okay?

00:16:32.040 That's it.

00:16:32.560 I won't read any more.

00:16:33.300 You can read the whole thing at opensaskatchewan.com,

00:16:35.900 because what I'm about to read is how judges balance fundamental freedoms in Canada

00:16:42.720 with other goals that are also important, like public health.

00:16:46.320 So you've got to balance these things.

00:16:47.820 This isn't the first time a law has been challenged under the Constitution, under the Charter of Rights.

00:16:52.260 It's been on the books for almost 40 years, and over the years, courts have developed a test.

00:16:57.580 It's called the Oaks Test, named after a famous case,

00:17:00.420 and it guides governments and courts about how to carefully balance,

00:17:05.020 especially when they're violating our freedoms.

00:17:07.040 I mean, no one would deny our freedoms are being violated.

00:17:09.840 They would say it's justified.

00:17:11.200 Well, let me read this part.

00:17:12.480 I think this is the heart of the lawsuit.

00:17:14.020 Take a look.

00:17:14.320 In addition, the public health order unjustifiably infringes upon fundamental freedoms

00:17:20.560 protected by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

00:17:23.820 The Charter, part one of the Constitution Act.

00:17:27.100 And to that extent is of no force and effect.

00:17:31.000 Specifically, A, the public health order unjustifiably and unreasonably has the effect

00:17:37.000 or incidental purpose of restricting expressive activity,

00:17:42.200 causing a chilling effect on expression and activism,

00:17:44.680 and impairs the ability of the applicants in seeking or attaining the truth,

00:17:50.160 participating in social and political decision-making,

00:17:52.960 and achieving self-fulfillment, contrary to Section 2B of the Charter for Freedom of Expression.

00:17:59.020 B, public health order unjustifiably and unreasonably prevents the media from producing and publishing news,

00:18:06.540 and creates unconstitutional obstacles to media activities,

00:18:09.600 contrary to Section 2B of the Charter for Freedom of the Press.

00:18:12.560 C, public health order unjustifiably and unreasonably impairs the right to gather and engage in public life,

00:18:20.940 contrary to Section 2C of the Charter for Freedom of Assembly.

00:18:24.240 And D, the public health order unjustifiably and unreasonably impairs the right to join together for common goals,

00:18:32.340 contrary to Section 2D of the Charter for Freedom of Association.

00:18:35.880 The public health order is not rationally connected to the legislative purpose,

00:18:40.640 does not minimally impair fundamental rights, fundamental freedoms protected by the Charter,

00:18:46.000 and is not a proportionate response to the public health situation in Saskatchewan.

00:18:51.380 Therefore, the public health order is not reasonable or justifiable,

00:18:54.700 and is not saved by Section 1 of the Charter.

00:18:57.140 I'm almost done. Stay with me, folks.

00:18:58.640 Finally, the public health order also unjustifiably infringes upon the freedoms of assembly and association,

00:19:08.740 as protected by Section 1E of the Canadian Bill of Rights.

00:19:12.280 That's Stephen Baker's Bill of Rights.

00:19:13.940 Okay, I'm going to, sorry, that's a lot there,

00:19:16.380 but those phrases I just read through there,

00:19:19.280 and those terms like unjustifiable, unreasonable, not rationally connected, not proportionate,

00:19:24.640 those are the key words from the Oaks Test.

00:19:27.620 That's how the government has to be when infringing on a freedom.

00:19:32.340 They actually do have the power to infringe on your freedom if it's minimal, the least possible,

00:19:39.180 if it's rationally connected to their legislative purpose.

00:19:42.880 They have all these checks and balances on them.

00:19:46.280 They have to be the gentlest they can be.

00:19:49.460 They have to be reasonable.

00:19:50.700 They have to be able to justify it.

00:19:52.060 They can't simply say, for example,

00:19:55.660 that even a huge auditorium like the Conexus Arts Center

00:19:58.400 can't have more than a handful of people in it for a political gathering.

00:20:01.940 That's just not how our freedoms work.

00:20:04.240 You have to justify every single infringement and prove it's proportionate

00:20:09.020 and prove it's rationally connected to your goal

00:20:11.060 and prove it's minimally impairing.

00:20:12.980 You have to do that or you're going to fail.

00:20:14.760 That's the law.

00:20:16.900 And you know what?

00:20:17.640 We know a lot more about the virus now than we did a year ago.

00:20:20.280 It's simply unacceptable to have a permanent ban on political gatherings and speeches

00:20:26.080 just because the politicians are scared.

00:20:30.100 The laws in Saskatchewan do not allow political gatherings at all right now.

00:20:35.300 That's just not how democracies work.

00:20:37.240 It's just not.

00:20:39.020 So we made the decision that we have to do more than just fight individual tickets and fines.

00:20:43.300 We have to be proactive.

00:20:44.660 We have to work to open all of Saskatchewan.

00:20:49.440 And if the politicians ignore us as they've been ignoring us, well, we have to go to court.

00:20:54.080 I'm confident in our lawyers.

00:20:55.900 They are experienced.

00:20:56.800 They support freedom.

00:20:57.940 And they're excellent on constitutional matters.

00:21:01.220 You tell me.

00:21:03.040 I'd like you to read this document.

00:21:05.240 Go to opensaskatchewan.com yourself and read the lawsuit and the affidavits.

00:21:09.080 And if you can help us, well, please do.

00:21:11.980 I don't want to tell you exactly how much we've spent on this lawsuit so far,

00:21:15.720 but it's safe to say it'll cost us between $100,000 and $150,000 for sure.

00:21:22.680 Or even more by the time we're done.

00:21:24.880 Obviously, we're not doing this for the money.

00:21:27.940 Our Patrick Moore speaking event wasn't about making money either.

00:21:30.860 It was about stopping the censorship of an intellectual and a scholar and an author

00:21:36.300 at the hands of a cancel culture mob.

00:21:38.400 Well, we beat that cancel culture mob by having our event.

00:21:42.540 But now we don't seem to be able to beat the public health lockdown.

00:21:47.480 So we have to go to court.

00:21:49.260 Not just for ourselves and our event, but for all Saskatchewan people.

00:21:54.280 It's just that we have standing there because we are personally affected.

00:21:58.820 It was our event.

00:22:00.300 We were gathering.

00:22:01.320 We wanted to speak.

00:22:02.220 We wanted to meet.

00:22:02.920 If you are from Saskatchewan or if you're from anywhere else that wants to see these

00:22:08.880 limits on our freedoms lifted, please read the lawsuit at opensaskatchewan.com.

00:22:14.040 And if you can, please consider contributing to our crowdfunding campaign to pay for our

00:22:19.080 constitutional lawyers.

00:22:20.300 I know I ask for help for our lawyers a lot, but there is so much to do.

00:22:24.820 And I think we have to do it in the courts because we see no courage amongst politicians.

00:22:29.300 We defend individual Saskatchewanians right now.

00:22:32.380 We do that, but it's time to free everyone in the province, not just a handful of people.

00:22:38.320 And hopefully, if we are successful, it will inspire people across Canada to take their 0.79

00:22:44.140 freedoms back.

00:22:45.740 Thanks for your support.

00:22:46.900 Now let's go open Saskatchewan.

00:22:49.220 Well, I acknowledge and I always have that COVID-19 poses a health threat, but it is not, thank

00:23:07.280 God, on the order of the Black Plague or Ebola.

00:23:10.960 In fact, we must learn to balance public health concerns with other concerns, economic concerns,

00:23:18.320 the concerns that the lockdown or the medicine, so to speak, the public health medicine might

00:23:24.900 be worse than the disease, the unintended consequences of shutting down the economy and

00:23:30.060 shutting down normal hospital access.

00:23:33.020 And one of the things that concerns me the most is the flattening, not of the curve, but

00:23:39.360 of our civil liberties.

00:23:41.080 We were told 15 days to flatten the curve.

00:23:43.580 We're coming up on the one-year anniversary of that.

00:23:47.260 And it's now illegal in many parts of Canada to gather in any numbers, in some places, even

00:23:53.760 to visit your own family.

00:23:55.760 And political gatherings, political protests in particular, have been shut down.

00:24:03.200 Well, as you know, Rebel News has filed a constitutional challenge to some of the lockdown rules in the

00:24:12.140 province of Saskatchewan.

00:24:14.180 We have standing there because for about a year now, we've been trying to have a political

00:24:20.980 gathering, an event where people in Saskatchewan can hear the other side of the story.

00:24:27.280 You might recall that our friend Dr. Patrick Moore, co-founder of Greenpeace, was invited

00:24:31.520 to speak at a conference convened by the city of Regina.

00:24:36.320 Well, some people didn't want to hear what he had to say, so they launched a campaign to

00:24:41.880 de-platform him.

00:24:44.080 And to their eternal discredit, the city caved in, banning him, ripping up the contract that

00:24:50.560 they had signed with him.

00:24:52.200 I called Dr. Moore, an old friend of mine, and I said, no, no, no, save the date.

00:24:56.700 We'll book a facility, and we'll invite everyone who wanted to hear what you had to say to do

00:25:01.300 so, and we'll have a question and answer session at the end.

00:25:04.820 We booked the largest venue we could find, the Conexus Arts Center, which holds more than

00:25:11.260 2,200 people in their main auditorium.

00:25:15.400 Very quickly, we sold over 1,000 tickets.

00:25:18.340 I think it maxed out at close to 1,700, but then the pandemic hits, and we were told that

00:25:26.000 everything had to be shut down, two weeks to flatten the curve.

00:25:28.420 Well, that two weeks has turned into almost a year.

00:25:32.140 We've rescheduled and then rescheduled again, and we've written to the Ministry of Health

00:25:36.340 and the Ministry of Justice and said there must be some way to balance health with other

00:25:42.600 rights too.

00:25:43.380 Can we social distance?

00:25:45.820 Can we have masks and hand sanitizer?

00:25:48.300 Can we have temperature checks of everyone in the room?

00:25:51.420 Can we space things out in the auditorium so no one is within six feet of the others?

00:25:56.780 It's a big enough auditorium to do so.

00:25:59.180 Time and again, we were told by the government, no, and they have no plans to lift the bans either.

00:26:04.380 So we have filed a constitutional challenge based on our charter rights, our rights to

00:26:11.320 hear Dr. Moore, his rights to speak, the rights of people to gather, and to hear a political

00:26:17.240 message, especially a message that was deliberately censored by the government in the first place.

00:26:24.260 You can see that lawsuit in full at our website, opensaskatchewan.com.

00:26:30.880 And joining me now via Skype from his home in British Columbia is Dr. Patrick Moore, who is

00:26:38.460 one of the plaintiffs in this case.

00:26:40.540 Great to see you again, Dr. Moore.

00:26:41.800 Thanks for being here today.

00:26:43.500 Good to be back with you, Ezra.

00:26:45.080 You know, I was so excited about the speech we had organized for you.

00:26:49.580 We had over 1,600 tickets sold, and it was so symbolic that you were censored by the government,

00:26:56.580 and when we set up an alternative venue, so many people said, we want to hear from the

00:27:01.760 guy who they want to shut up.

00:27:03.700 And I was very proud to be affiliated with you and to fight for free speech.

00:27:07.620 I understand why everything was shut down because of the pandemic.

00:27:11.500 But the government shows no sign of balance between health and other interests like freedom

00:27:18.940 of speech.

00:27:19.660 What's your view on the subject?

00:27:20.960 My view on the subject, Ezra, is they should be willing to let me speak there if people

00:27:27.680 want to come and all the precautions are taken.

00:27:31.020 The Australian Open is going ahead this year in Melbourne, where they allow pods of up to

00:27:37.060 six people who are, you know, a unit that is exposed to each other regularly anyways, and

00:27:45.380 where they then social distance everybody in pods of one to six.

00:27:49.440 And why can't we do that in Regina, inside a huge auditorium?

00:27:55.960 There's no good reason for it.

00:27:57.980 So I believe that we should win this case and that I should be allowed to speak, especially

00:28:03.080 now that I've made a book out of the talk I was going to give, the book title Fake Invisible

00:28:09.620 Catastrophes and Threats of Doom.

00:28:14.420 And I would be very interested in hearing my story about how nearly all the scare stories

00:28:20.480 today are about things that are either invisible, like carbon dioxide, which is blamed for about

00:28:25.600 50 different bad things.

00:28:27.480 And then there's coral reefs and polar bears, which are so remote that nobody in the average

00:28:32.440 population can go and count the polar bears or see the coral reefs for themselves because

00:28:38.160 they're very remote.

00:28:39.000 So I want to give that talk to people and show them how all of these scare stories are

00:28:45.560 fake and invisible and the threat of doom is in the future.

00:28:50.800 So many of these scare stories are about the future, which hasn't happened yet.

00:28:54.600 In other words, they are speculation.

00:28:57.320 And yet they are talked about as if the scientists know for sure what's going to happen in the year

00:29:02.140 2,100 or something.

00:29:04.120 So I really do believe that the 1,700 people who signed up to hear me speak would like to

00:29:11.780 have that information and they deserve to have it.

00:29:14.880 And we can do this in a way that complies with all of the restrictions.

00:29:20.300 I think you're right.

00:29:21.160 And that's a very good point to point out sports events.

00:29:24.040 I mean, across Canada, kids hockey leagues are shut down.

00:29:28.820 Even outdoor rinks, we had that infamous case in Calgary where a young hockey player on

00:29:34.120 an outdoor rink was threatened with tasering by the police.

00:29:37.520 In the meantime, the NHL is allowed to play.

00:29:41.240 They're allowed to go to the gyms.

00:29:43.120 I just see in the newspapers today, there are two dozen film shoots going on in Toronto around

00:29:50.760 the city.

00:29:51.220 Obviously, if you've ever seen a movie production, there are 50, 100 people on set.

00:29:56.160 So those things are open for recreation and celebrity entertainment.

00:30:02.000 But when people want to gather to learn for political reasons, to hear your presentation,

00:30:08.540 there is no flexibility, not even the same rule.

00:30:11.700 All I would say is give us the same rules as the NHL gets.

00:30:15.140 Give us the same rules.

00:30:16.460 And I think that there's something special about political speech.

00:30:19.280 I think that, by the way, you should allow concerts and performances, again, follow some

00:30:24.700 reasonable precautions.

00:30:26.120 Let people choose their own.

00:30:28.220 Like, if people don't want to come, that's fine.

00:30:30.300 But the fact that there's no flexibility at all for political speech, but these other

00:30:36.020 recreational or entertainment things are allowed to go if they have the right lobbyists, I find

00:30:41.240 that contradiction erodes the rule of law.

00:30:45.220 I mean, why can't we meet to gather to hear political ideas?

00:30:50.980 And why can sports events, the professionals, meet and gather to make millions?

00:30:56.980 I just don't see the rule of law there, Dr. Moore.

00:31:01.660 Well, it's all very arbitrary, Ezra.

00:31:04.540 And that's because politicians these days are pretty darn arbitrary about the decisions that

00:31:10.020 they're making.

00:31:10.560 We simply do not have a good system of governance in this country at many levels.

00:31:17.780 And I don't know what is going to happen in the future.

00:31:20.320 I hope people wake up and realize that we're a democracy.

00:31:24.760 You know, being from British Columbia, of course, I've grown up.

00:31:27.840 I was born here and lived here all my life.

00:31:30.240 I've grown up with Western alienation, knowing that what British Columbia thinks doesn't matter

00:31:35.820 a hoot if as long as Ottawa and, you know, as long as Toronto and Montreal and Ontario

00:31:41.300 and Quebec agree on something, the rest of us are chopped liver.

00:31:45.160 So I'm very cynical about politics to begin with.

00:31:48.780 They say out here that Canada is a road from Ottawa to Montreal and back again.

00:31:53.420 And that's the size of it, you know.

00:31:55.580 So I just think that they're making a decision about whether I can speak or not on political

00:32:03.080 grounds.

00:32:04.380 So surely I should be allowed to have my political grounds.

00:32:07.640 And the political ground I want is in that auditorium in Regina where I can talk to people

00:32:13.140 who want to hear me speak.

00:32:15.060 That is what democracy is all about.

00:32:17.640 And yes, the COVID requires restrictions.

00:32:21.240 I totally accept that.

00:32:22.920 And I'm glad I haven't got it yet because I've been very careful and I live in a place

00:32:27.240 that's not so populated as downtown Toronto.

00:32:30.760 But just the same, we should be able to continue with life as normal to a certain extent.

00:32:37.660 And there must be a happy medium somewhere here.

00:32:41.200 Yeah.

00:32:41.460 Well, our Constitution, as it's been interpreted in the courts over the years, says that if the

00:32:48.060 government is to infringe our fundamental freedoms, they have to prove, the burden is on them to

00:32:54.700 prove that it's reasonable, that their infringements are rationally connected to their goal, that

00:33:00.700 it's the least infringement possible.

00:33:03.440 The government simply can't take away your freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, freedom

00:33:08.380 to do political gatherings.

00:33:11.940 They can't take those things away lightly.

00:33:14.620 And I fear that they have.

00:33:15.580 I'm so proud that you've agreed to be part of the litigation as a plaintiff, and you've sworn an affidavit in

00:33:20.760 support of the lawsuit.

00:33:21.920 I would like to invite all our viewers to go to opensaskatchewan.com.

00:33:26.520 You can read the entire lawsuit for yourself.

00:33:28.980 And you can also read our letters to the Department of Health and the Department of Justice asking,

00:33:36.220 suggesting reasonable accommodations to allow these events to proceed.

00:33:40.820 The answer has been a stonewall every time. 1.00

00:33:42.660 Dr. Moore, we're going to fight all the way because we believe in freedom over here, and

00:33:47.040 I think that we need to take this to a court.

00:33:49.600 And when that trial happens, I hope many Canadians are watching.

00:33:53.260 Thanks for being part of this.

00:33:55.240 Thank you, Ezra.

00:33:55.980 I'm on your side.

00:33:57.300 Right on.

00:33:57.680 Well, I'm on your side, and I'm so tantalized by what your speech will be like when we finally

00:34:03.680 return to Regina and give that speech in front of 1,600, 1,700 people.

00:34:09.180 That'll be a great day.

00:34:10.420 Thanks, my friend.

00:34:11.000 Thank you, Ezra.

00:34:12.620 Take care.

00:34:13.260 All right, you too.

00:34:13.920 Well, there you have it.

00:34:14.840 Dr. Patrick Moore, co-founder of Greenpeace, the author of a new book.

00:34:18.880 I can hardly wait to see his presentation.

00:34:20.500 It's called Fake Invisible Catastrophes and Threats of Doom.

00:34:24.040 That's pretty exciting.

00:34:24.940 You can learn more about our lawsuit at opensaskatchewan.com.

00:34:41.000 Hey, folks.

00:34:42.480 Welcome back on my show last night.

00:34:43.900 Harley writes, best episode ever.

00:34:46.660 I will be with you for this fight.

00:34:48.300 Harley, thanks very much.

00:34:49.500 I was mad because I felt it was unfair.

00:34:54.480 Lydia writes, wow, that's awesome.

00:34:56.920 I was intense with you, and then I started to laugh.

00:35:00.100 I laughed because I think it's great.

00:35:01.680 This is righteous anger.

00:35:02.680 I think it's necessary.

00:35:03.920 Went up against these kind of people.

00:35:05.680 Bullies need to be put in their place. 1.00

00:35:06.940 Yeah, I had a range of emotions, too.

00:35:09.000 Like, I knew I was a little bit cheeky when I said, why are you so mean and will you apologize?

00:35:15.000 It's a little bit cheeky, but I sort of meant it.

00:35:17.560 And their answers were not satisfactory to me.

00:35:20.640 And I was really, I don't know if outraged is the word, but the fact that they called me up

00:35:25.300 and didn't, obviously hadn't even talked to the cop, and it's so clear that just showing a torso

00:35:31.400 doesn't breach anyone's privacy, and that it was a promotional picture that they took. 1.00

00:35:36.440 It was just so stupid. 1.00

00:35:38.100 I thought, I don't know if they're that stupid. 1.00

00:35:40.280 If they're that stupid, that's shocking. 1.00

00:35:42.740 I think they're actually smart, playing dumb, just to get us. 1.00

00:35:47.820 Wendy writes, I do not like all Ezra's conjecture that Doug Ford directed this. 0.97

00:35:52.360 Like Rebel News is the biggest thing on his mind, there are many other possibilities.

00:35:56.260 The fact is, we really don't know, and asking someone to blur a name tag sounds like a reasonable

00:36:00.160 request.

00:36:01.100 The two lawyers were doing what lawyers do, representing their client.

00:36:03.740 There's no need to be so rude and aggressive over the phone, or to trash them in the monologue.

00:36:08.340 Ezra, I'm disappointed that you put this show on the air.

00:36:11.380 All right, well, I really appreciate you giving me your most clear criticism.

00:36:16.480 My first point would be that the name tag is blurred.

00:36:20.700 It's blurred.

00:36:22.280 If you go to fightthefinance.com and zoom in, you cannot see the name.

00:36:27.420 I know because I tried.

00:36:29.500 So my first point is, it is blurred.

00:36:32.840 I guess my second point is, it's blurred on the source photograph is from them.

00:36:38.580 And my third point is, they put the picture up as it is with the guy's face.

00:36:45.200 But I want to tell you that it is the law in Ontario and elsewhere in Canada, that a policeman

00:36:50.360 has to tell you their name and their badge number.

00:36:53.300 They can't be secret.

00:36:54.640 So that's not a thing.

00:36:58.040 If you say I was rude on the phone, I'm going to take a little bit of an objection there.

00:37:03.180 I was maybe a little cheeky, but I didn't raise my voice at them.

00:37:07.460 I certainly didn't swear at them.

00:37:09.420 I didn't call them names.

00:37:11.260 I said they were mean.

00:37:12.540 That's the closest thing.

00:37:13.420 I asked for an apology.

00:37:15.460 I asked them pointed questions.

00:37:18.580 But they're the ones who threaten me with four lawsuits.

00:37:22.840 So I don't think I'm going to accept the charge that I'd be mean.

00:37:29.020 But I feel great that you asked me those tough questions.

00:37:32.820 I really do.

00:37:33.580 And thank you for doing that.

00:37:35.820 Well, my friends, that's the show for today.

00:37:37.460 There's so much going on all the time.

00:37:38.760 Isn't there?

00:37:39.020 It's incredible.

00:37:39.960 We live in, as Dickens would say, the best of times and the worst of times.

00:37:43.380 I think that was Dickens.

00:37:44.580 Until tomorrow.

00:37:45.820 On behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters, to you at home.

00:37:48.460 Good night.

00:37:49.600 Keep fighting for freedom.

00:37:50.540 Thank you.

00:37:52.840 Bye.

00:38:00.380 Bye.

00:38:13.100 Bye.

00:38:15.180 Bye.

00:38:17.260 Bye.

00:38:19.320 Bye.

00:38:19.660 Bye.

00:38:19.880 Bye.

00:38:20.080 Bye.

Rebel News Podcast - January 28, 2021

We’ve filed a constitutional challenge to Saskatchewan’s lockdown laws

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