Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 1295 ｜ The Sad Truth Behind Meghan Trainor’s Surrogacy Story

00:00:00.740 What if I told you that the outrage that you're seeing to immigration enforcement is not organic, but is actually well-funded and well-orchestrated?

00:00:09.500 Also, Meghan Trainor just announced the birth of her new baby via surrogate.

00:00:13.960 This has sparked a new conversation about the ethics of reproductive technology.

00:00:18.480 We've got all of this and more on today's episode of Relatable.

00:00:30.000 Hey, guys. Welcome to Relatable. Happy Wednesday. Hope everyone is having a wonderful week so far.

00:00:36.380 I know it's a chaotic time. It is a tough time to be a Christian woman on social media.

00:00:42.320 There's a lot of pressure to think the right things, to say the right things.

00:00:46.500 And if you are finding yourself saying, hang on a second, I'm not sure that I can repeat the entire narrative that I'm seeing from these influencers or maybe even your favorite Bible study leader.

00:00:58.260 Or maybe you're wondering how they know all of the conclusions that they're coming to.

00:01:03.100 Well, you are in the right place because whether or not you agree with me, I want you to be a critical thinker.

00:01:10.160 I do not want the media to be able to dictate your feelings and your outrage.

00:01:16.220 And you're probably noticing a lot of the people that you follow don't typically weigh in about politics.

00:01:22.620 They spoke up in 2020 after George Floyd died and they're speaking up right now.

00:01:27.640 But all of this time in between when you've seen a lot of injustice happen, even when Biden was president, they didn't have anything to say.

00:01:36.540 And it's just curious how so many people, including those who call themselves Christians and conservatives, allow the liberal media to dictate when they get publicly angry about something.

00:01:48.560 Now, I want to tell you what's going on, and I hope that you'll think about this, and I hope that those in your life will think about this.

00:02:00.780 Stick with me as I tell you a lot of things that are happening and what's being reported by the media.

00:02:06.920 So according to Politico, ICE has conducted a deportation operation targeting families that include young children as a part of a massive expansion of the effort to detain moms and dads and kids who are here illegally.

00:02:23.220 Now, these were not hardened criminals.

00:02:25.780 These were, according to the American Association of Immigration Lawyers, quote, asylum-seeking children and mothers who are fleeing extreme violence in the Northern Triangle region of Central America.

00:02:38.320 So we're talking Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador.

00:02:42.140 This group goes on to argue this practice is a due process and humanitarian disaster and must end.

00:02:49.520 You've probably heard that from a lot of people in your life who are worried about what's going on, say that this is a due process issue.

00:02:57.020 The concern about due process stems from the fact that these home raids and detentions and deportations are not being done with an immigration court hearing, but rather decided by DHS agents, according to the ACLU.

00:03:10.960 They also point out that, unlike in decades past, 75% of those being deported do not get to go before a judge.

00:03:19.780 They're just shipped out of the U.S. back to their home countries where they may be facing threats of violence.

00:03:25.640 In fact, 87%, according to the ACLU, of the families detained reportedly have legitimate asylum claims.

00:03:33.920 Family detention has expanded at an unprecedented rate under the administration.

00:03:39.740 These cage-like centers constructed just for the purpose of detaining these families.

00:03:46.640 And the administration who did this bragged about this, saying ICE is committed to tough law enforcement that protects the safety and security of the American people.

00:03:56.200 This was ICE director John Morton.

00:03:58.540 These record-setting numbers, he said, are the result of strong, sensible enforcement programs and priorities and the dedication of thousands of ICE agents

00:04:06.520 and officers who work tirelessly every day to keep our community safe.

00:04:12.500 Can you believe that?

00:04:14.000 Deporting children, fleeing violence.

00:04:16.280 56 illegal immigrants have died in ICE custody.

00:04:19.340 And Tom Homan, who is directing these deportation ICE efforts, is getting a medal for this.

00:04:25.700 Just look at this.

00:04:26.960 I'm getting a medal.

00:04:29.120 Now, let's hang on a second.

00:04:31.800 I want to zoom out in this picture, put up the next full screen.

00:04:38.080 Hang on.

00:04:39.520 That's Barack Obama awarding Tom Homan.

00:04:43.220 That's Trump's current border czar.

00:04:45.780 And he was also the director of deportations under the Obama administration, here receiving an award from Barack Obama.

00:04:53.580 In fact, everything I just relayed to you happens not right now, happened not under Trump, but under President Barack Obama.

00:05:03.000 The target family raids that deported and detained women and children happened in January of 2016.

00:05:09.460 The foregoing of judicial warrants for home raids expanded drastically under Barack Obama.

00:05:15.440 Deporting those who claim to be seeking asylum expanded drastically under Barack Obama.

00:05:20.540 Family detention expanded drastically under Barack Obama.

00:05:24.400 And it was Barack Obama's administration that constructed the so-called cages in which children, mothers, and fathers were held.

00:05:31.860 56 individuals that were detained died under Barack Obama's watch.

00:05:36.980 And we can post all of the links for you in the description of this episode for you to explore and check out for yourself.

00:05:42.960 And there was clearly pushback and even demonstrations to protest Obama's deportation efforts, but there were no riots.

00:05:51.880 He was not called Hitler.

00:05:53.580 Homan was not called a Nazi then.

00:05:56.460 ICE were not called Gestapo.

00:05:58.460 There were not coordinated, well-funded efforts to impede ICE operations.

00:06:02.800 There were not widespread influencer campaigns convincing you that not only what ICE is currently doing is wrong, but also that ICE as an entity is illegitimate and that deportations are always fundamentally morally wrong.

00:06:19.780 And maybe you'll listen to this and you'll say, well, you know, it was always wrong.

00:06:24.800 There should have been more to push back against that.

00:06:27.960 It was wrong then and it's wrong now.

00:06:29.940 But I want you to think about why you didn't know about these things then.

00:06:36.480 Do you think it is possible that right now in this moment while Trump is president that your outrage is being manufactured?

00:06:44.980 Do you think it's possible that you and your favorite Christian influencers are being purposely agitated with emotionally provocative images and headlines to convince you that immigration enforcement is fundamentally wrong?

00:06:59.940 The killing of Renee Good and Alex Preddy were tragic and feeling strongly about their deaths is completely valid. 0.55

00:07:08.040 I also mourn their deaths.

00:07:09.620 I am not joining in any choir of people who is celebrating or feeling calloused about their deaths.

00:07:16.680 No one should feel calloused about the loss of their lives.

00:07:19.000 But we should also consider that the outrage-fueled chaos that led them to attempt to impede perfectly legitimate law enforcement operations in Minneapolis, which have occurred in the same manner for decades, was not organic.

00:07:35.160 Ask yourself why this violence and chaos is happening there in Minneapolis and not elsewhere.

00:07:42.060 ICE is conducting business in all 50 states right now.

00:07:45.640 Why don't we see this kind of deadly conflict in Austin or in Washington, D.C.?

00:07:51.460 Could it be because Minnesota politicians are purposely stoking this violence to score political points?

00:07:57.600 Could it be that nefarious anti-American organizations are looking to cause problems or funding this or stoking the flames of chaos and violence?

00:08:07.500 Could it be that your empathy is being weaponized by bad actors for bad ends?

00:08:13.800 Yes, I think it's possible.

00:08:16.580 So let's look into what is really going on because it's not as organic as it seems.

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00:09:24.620 Okay, Fox News Digital obtains signal group chats to show how activists are being used, are being mobilized to track, observe, and ultimately stop ICE operations.

00:09:44.100 And so we can put up full screen six.

00:09:46.340 This is the spreadsheet of what's going on.

00:09:50.540 Preddy and other members of the anti-ICE rapid response team, that's what they call themselves, the chat on Signal,

00:09:57.680 knew that ICE and Border Patrol agents would be at the location outside of Glam Dolls Donut Shop in South Minneapolis

00:10:05.140 because of group chats and spreadsheets that are tracking agents.

00:10:08.040 So that's the spreadsheet that you are looking at there.

00:10:10.900 They are keeping tabs on all of the ICE agents, and they are making plans together to try to impede their law enforcement operations.

00:10:19.160 Now, you'll remember that all of this was sparked mostly because of the reporting that was done by Nick Shirley,

00:10:26.040 who is an independent journalist who exposed widespread fraud among Somalian immigrants, some legal, I'm sure, many illegal. 0.84

00:10:35.500 They're using fake daycares, fake home health companies in order to funnel millions of dollars to themselves, in order to enrich themselves.

00:10:45.740 And then, of course, it seems like Democrat politicians are then getting those people to help fund their campaigns.

00:10:52.560 And so it's an absolute racket.

00:10:55.860 ICE kind of descended upon Minneapolis, not just in the past few weeks.

00:11:00.220 They've actually been there conducting operations for a while, but it certainly seems like it's picked up in the past few weeks.

00:11:06.180 And then you had people like Renee Good and all of these other people in Minneapolis trying to stop ICE from deporting the people who are there illegally.

00:11:15.120 And it's not just the Somalian fraudsters that they're trying to deport, as we'll get into in just a second. 0.91

00:11:20.480 It's a whole long list of illegal aliens who have committed heinous crimes. 0.87

00:11:25.720 And so people like Freddie, like Renee Good, are trying to stand in the way of ICE doing something that is completely legitimate and good for Minneapolis, by the way.

00:11:38.240 We've got this other full screen.

00:11:40.500 This is full screen seven.

00:11:42.700 And so they share pictures with each other.

00:11:44.680 They share information with each other.

00:11:46.580 They say backup needed at the Black Forest Inn. 0.99

00:11:49.880 I mean, these people, I mean, it's just absolutely stupid for so many reasons, one, to think that you should be impeding this completely fair operation, but also in thinking that you have the strength and the fortitude to do so without putting your life at risk. 0.98

00:12:08.200 It almost makes you wonder if the chaos and the martyrdom and the marketing that comes from that is the point. 0.98

00:12:16.220 Also, we've got this headline from CNN that actually points out that Alex Preddy had just broken a rib a few weeks earlier in a previous confrontation with federal agents just a week before his death.

00:12:32.960 Now, I am not saying that his previous conflict with ICE justifies him being shot in that moment.

00:12:40.900 When it comes to that particular tragedy, there are a lot of different details that are being revealed about what was going on.

00:12:51.700 I don't think that those who are saying it is 100% clear that this was unjustified the way that it's being shown, I don't think that we can say that with 100% confidence.

00:13:06.040 I think we have to wait to see what the investigation reveals.

00:13:09.480 Regardless, I have compassion for him.

00:13:12.540 I am absolutely devastated for his family.

00:13:14.880 He was made in the image of God.

00:13:16.120 I can acknowledge that, but I'm not going to come out and say, yes, it was 100% clear ICE was not justified in doing what they did. 0.97

00:13:23.120 The fact of the matter is, is that there was a lot of manufactured chaos and stupidity that led up to these preventable moments when these lives were lost. 0.89

00:13:34.400 And then we also have, we have some videos that will play of the riots that are going on. 0.98

00:13:41.540 Again, the chaos is the point.

00:13:43.900 This is before Alex Preddy was shot by federal officers.

00:13:50.400 And I want to show you another example of the chaos that's going on.

00:13:56.400 I know this seems like, oh, well, these are just peaceful protests.

00:14:00.400 But I'm going to read you a post that explains why something like this actually is not peaceful.

00:14:05.700 OK, so there is a post by someone on X that has over 30,000 likes.

00:14:22.380 I think it's very insightful.

00:14:23.720 This person says, chaps, there's a reason these demonstrations are these demonstrators are using whistles, horns and making so much noise in all the video clips you are watching. 0.99

00:14:34.160 They don't do these when protesting climate change or LGBTQ rights.

00:14:37.820 These sudden impulsive noises trigger the acoustic startle response.

00:14:41.540 It's a rapid involuntary reaction mediated by the brainstem involving muscle tension, elevated heart rate and adrenaline release.

00:14:49.140 That repetitive exposure from them fatigues neural pathways, but sustains heightened arousal, diverting cognitive resources from higher order tasks to basic threat monitoring.

00:14:59.960 It is an acute stressor activating the hypothalamic pituitary adrenal axis and sympathetic nervous system, which releases cortisol and adrenaline.

00:15:10.280 Long exposure to this stuff impairs prefrontal cortex function, critical for decision making.

00:15:16.740 Pair this with sheer annoyance.

00:15:18.020 These tactics are a low tech escalation of protest disruption rooted in documented physiological response to noise.

00:15:26.320 And so he is actually arguing.

00:15:28.560 He goes on to say it puts these officers on edge.

00:15:31.640 It's triggering them to act.

00:15:33.620 You know, when you are overstimulated, say you're a parent and you are trying to focus so closely on something on your phone that's taking a lot of effort, it's taking a lot of focus.

00:15:46.300 And you have a child that comes up to you and it's like, I don't know, constantly tapping your shoulders or is yelling in your face.

00:15:53.500 You kind of feel an extra sense of being like on edge in those moments or really it can be in any scenario.

00:16:00.920 Maybe you're at work and you're trying to focus something on your computer.

00:16:04.020 Someone comes up and taps you and it's just like one too many stimuli and it startles you or it makes you turn around quickly.

00:16:11.640 Whatever it is, your brain can get overloaded with these stimuli and it can put you on edge or it can make you more annoyed or react more harshly than you would otherwise.

00:16:21.840 And so he's arguing that is actually what they are trying to do.

00:16:26.320 They are trying to actually get these officers to act out so they can use that moment of conflict or violence to further get what they want, which, of course, is the retreat of ICE and the ending, the cessation of all immigration enforcement.

00:16:42.940 Politicians are also adding to aiding and abetting this chaos, including Governor Walz.

00:16:49.660 We've got Governor Walz comparing the Trump administration.

00:16:53.420 Now it used to be fascism.

00:16:55.540 Now it's too communist.

00:16:56.900 China saw seven political prisoners and we would ask them when we speak up and call out your government.

00:17:05.480 Is it bad?

00:17:06.560 And they said, well, in the short run, it's bad because they torture us.

00:17:10.480 But if you don't speak up, they will torture us and forget about us.

00:17:15.020 And the idea is right now is we have to be speaking up.

00:17:18.900 We have to call out your government.

00:17:20.340 The irony of Walz's behind a border, the irony of him using the security of a parameter, and some might call it a wall, while he is basically saying the country has no right to do that.

00:17:38.580 It's always like that with Democrats.

00:17:40.500 Democrats, the rules are for thee, but not for me.

00:17:45.840 It just makes me think when he is comparing the Trump administration to communist China, it makes me think that progressives really want a Tiananmen Square situation where they can get that iconic picture.

00:17:58.580 And this truly is an incredible, iconic picture.

00:18:01.540 You've got the person who is standing up to the tanks in communist China, such a horrific time in Chinese history when people continue to just be slaughtered and persecuted under communist rule.

00:18:18.000 And it looks to me like they are trying to create those images that can, again, be used to their policy ends.

00:18:27.340 We also, okay, so we're moving around here.

00:18:30.660 We've got, we first had fascism.

00:18:32.640 We went to communism.

00:18:33.820 We're back to Nazism. 0.96

00:18:35.940 Here's Walz, Sade.

00:18:37.720 We have got children in Minnesota hiding in their houses, afraid to go outside.

00:18:45.180 Many of us grew up reading that story of Anne Frank.

00:18:49.580 Somebody's going to write that children's story about Minnesota.

00:18:53.300 And there's one person who can end this now.

00:18:57.340 This has nothing to do with the Holocaust.

00:19:02.160 This has nothing to do with Nazi Germany.

00:19:05.220 This is nothing like that.

00:19:07.520 Jews were targeted because they were Jews.

00:19:10.140 There were other groups that were targeted as well.

00:19:12.260 But by and large, this was an anti-Jewish operation.

00:19:15.560 That is not what is going on here.

00:19:19.300 ICE is doing its very legitimate and good and overall compassionate and loving job.

00:19:27.320 of removing the people who are not legally here.

00:19:30.680 And I know people are saying, oh, well, they should just be removing the violent criminals.

00:19:34.900 I agree.

00:19:35.840 Let's prioritize the gang members and the murderers and the rapists and those people.

00:19:41.460 But they have every right and responsibility to remove every single person, no matter who they are, who is not a citizen of this country.

00:19:50.340 This is how you protect the sovereignty or the legitimacy of your country.

00:19:54.980 Every single nation has the right and responsibility to protect citizenship and to create the parameters of both citizenship and lawfulness and who gets to reside here and who doesn't.

00:20:08.520 That is like nation state 101.

00:20:12.320 Every nation has that right and that responsibility.

00:20:16.520 So comparing this to the Holocaust, to what Hitler did, you're igniting tensions.

00:20:21.780 You are hoping that people go out there and they fight the Nazis because they fancy themselves, you know, Bonhoeffer. 0.73

00:20:29.800 That's not what's going on here.

00:20:32.420 And so if Walls wants to continue to see this kind of chaos and conflict that is so tragically getting people killed, then he should keep up the rhetoric like this.

00:20:43.160 It's not just politicians.

00:20:44.960 Media is playing their very, very disturbing part in this as well.

00:20:49.780 We'll get to that in a second.

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00:21:57.600 All right.

00:21:58.740 So MSNBC did this very strange thing.

00:22:01.740 They're called MSN Now.

00:22:04.100 Now.

00:22:04.840 I don't know why.

00:22:06.120 But they decided to use this clearly doctored picture of Alex Preddy.

00:22:15.040 Okay.

00:22:15.300 So this is the original picture on the left.

00:22:19.420 And you can verify this with the other pictures that have circulated.

00:22:24.040 This is what he looked like on the left.

00:22:26.460 But this is the picture that they used on the right in the segment talking about him.

00:22:32.080 Here is that clip.

00:22:32.960 This time, it was 37-year-old Alex Preddy, an ICU nurse who cared for veterans.

00:22:39.420 Donald Trump and his cabinet, his administration, are demanding once again that you not believe your eyes and ears.

00:22:46.340 Now, why would they use this photo?

00:22:49.640 Let's put up the side-by-side again.

00:22:51.840 Where you've got him in the right side looking tanner, looking a little somehow like more muscular.

00:23:00.360 They changed his nose.

00:23:02.480 They changed his chin.

00:23:04.500 They made his face a little wider.

00:23:07.420 Why would they do this?

00:23:08.840 And I pointed this out on Instagram.

00:23:11.260 People got very upset with me.

00:23:13.460 People on the left, all the she-hers on Instagram got very upset when I pointed out that the guy, this is why they're doing this. 1.00

00:23:21.260 The guy on the left looks more like a left-wing agitator.

00:23:24.440 And the guy on the right looks like the persona that they are wanting to convey some kind of strong, brave veteran.

00:23:32.380 Now, for some reason, the she-hers got really angry and the they-thems got really upset when I said that.

00:23:39.180 As if I am the one who manipulated the image.

00:23:42.220 As if I am the one subliminally making the argument that you can only have compassion for a person when they're tan and when they're more handsome.

00:23:51.520 I'm not making that argument.

00:23:53.240 Like, you might be mad that I categorized him in that way, but that is exactly what they are trying to convey.

00:23:59.800 Like, why else do you think that they're doing this?

00:24:02.880 They're using this manipulated image because they know human nature, as superficial as it may be, is to feel more deeply for a child who is cute or a man who is handsome or a woman who is beautiful or an image of someone that looks more wholesome and looks more attractive in some way.

00:24:23.240 That is why they are employing this psychological operation.

00:24:29.700 If you have not watched or listened to Monday's episode, go back and do that.

00:24:33.520 But they are trying to target women specifically, knowing that we so often operate on our feelings, operate on those base instincts, and that we, like all humans, but I would say even more so, are very moved by an image.

00:24:50.160 More so than we are moved by an argument.

00:24:53.320 I mean, that's what effective propaganda is.

00:24:55.560 It is meant to paralyze your critical thinking abilities and just make you feel.

00:25:00.380 And whether you like it or not, whether you consciously or morally agree with feeling more compassion for someone who is more handsome or prettier than the other, like our instincts, I guess, are just wired in that way.

00:25:15.920 It actually takes, I think, Christian virtue to be able to say no matter what someone looks like, no matter what their background is, that person is made in God's image and they have innate value.

00:25:26.660 I don't have to be sure about the circumstances surrounding their death to say I wish that they were still alive and I think there should be a thorough investigation of all of this, whether or not this person is tan or has a chiseled jawline.

00:25:41.860 Trump is also saying that he wants a thorough investigation into this and he sent love to Alex Preddy's family.

00:25:50.540 I thought this was a good response.

00:25:52.600 Here's Trump.

00:25:53.320 Do you believe that Alex Preddy's death was justified?

00:25:56.740 Well, you know, we're doing a big investigation.

00:25:59.080 I want to see the investigation.

00:26:01.200 I'm going to be watching over it.

00:26:02.600 I want a very honorable and honest investigation.

00:26:06.020 I have to see it myself.

00:26:07.780 He also posted on Truth Social on January 26th.

00:26:11.420 He said, Governor Tim Walls called me with the request to work together with respect to Minnesota.

00:26:15.900 It was a very good call and we actually seemed to be on a similar wavelength.

00:26:19.540 I told Governor Walls that I would have Tom Homan call him and that what we are looking for are any and all criminals that they have in their possession.

00:26:28.820 The governor very respectfully understood that.

00:26:30.940 And I will be speaking to him in the near future.

00:26:34.000 He said he was happy that Tom Homan is going to Minnesota.

00:26:37.880 He also points out what I said earlier, that they are seeing tremendous success when it comes to ICE operations in D.C., Memphis, New Orleans and other places that they have touched down.

00:26:52.160 And even in other places in Minnesota.

00:26:54.900 I mean, you'll remember that Minneapolis was the epicenter of chaos also in 2020.

00:27:00.260 So it just makes you wonder, like, what is going on with local politicians and local left-wing operations there?

00:27:07.380 Why do things always turn into this propaganda war and sometimes a hot war in Minneapolis specifically?

00:27:14.980 Something to think about.

00:27:17.140 There will be an investigation into what went on.

00:27:21.780 And I think there should be.

00:27:23.700 And I don't know.

00:27:25.340 There could be an officer that actually is indicted and convicted for murder here.

00:27:31.120 There will be due process that they go through in that.

00:27:35.500 But I think that we can say that we hope for the fullness of justice to be executed here.

00:27:41.140 And also say that we don't know everything.

00:27:45.240 Like, we just don't know everything.

00:27:48.460 And we can also acknowledge that this person was made in God's image.

00:27:53.000 Now, I want to get into the unbiblical response to what's going on and also the biblical response to what's going on.

00:28:00.660 Because if we put aside for a second what happened to Alex Preddy, we can acknowledge that that is tragic.

00:28:06.740 What I am actually seeing is a lot of people trying to invalidate the efforts of ICE in general, saying that ICE does not have a right to operate, that they should be abolished, that they should be defunded, that these people should not be deported.

00:28:22.000 I mean, you actually even saw Trump in that post saying that we're just looking for criminals who are also illegal aliens.

00:28:29.920 Well, actually, no.

00:28:31.740 Like, we should be just deporting everyone who is not here legally. 1.00

00:28:35.920 Now, you'll hear from the left, and I understand why this is very compelling.

00:28:39.700 We've talked about this many times before, citing different portions of the Bible to say, no, this is why we shouldn't be deporting people.

00:28:47.620 This is why we shouldn't be closing our border.

00:28:49.500 You've got Gavin Newsom, who, of course, is a theological giant.

00:28:53.640 He cited Matthew 25, 35 in response to the Trump administration's federal deportations.

00:28:59.660 And this verse says, for I was hungry and you gave me food.

00:29:03.080 I was thirsty and you gave me drink.

00:29:05.280 I was a stranger and you welcomed me.

00:29:08.580 And just by the way, this just reminded me, and we'll find a picture and we'll put it up.

00:29:13.120 But you'll remember, I wrote an article about this for World Magazine.

00:29:16.460 A few years ago, Gavin Newsom funded billboards in red states that were enacting pro-life laws, advertising California as a refuge for those who are seeking abortions.

00:29:29.980 And actually put a Bible verse up, love your neighbor as yourself, as his justification for inviting women who are looking to hire someone to slaughter their child to come to California to do so. 0.54

00:29:43.780 Okay.

00:29:43.940 So I'm not really interested in the theological interpretations of someone like Gavin Newsom.

00:29:50.780 That was just utter blasphemy.

00:29:52.860 You'll remember maybe that the late John MacArthur, a longtime pastor from California, actually wrote an open letter to Gavin Newsom very lovingly, but sternly and prophetically urging his repentance because of that gross act of blasphemy.

00:30:07.220 I think it's really important to note that Gavin Newsom right now, if he died right now, he would be going to hell.

00:30:13.120 Like, I think it's just really important to note that, that someone like that doesn't need to be wielding scripture at all.

00:30:18.940 And so I'm not interested in his interpretation.

00:30:21.080 But because some of you might also be persuaded by this, and because Tim Walls is also citing Matthew 25, 40, truly I say to you, as you did to one, the least of these, my brothers, you did to me, I feel the need to kind of respond to this for a second.

00:30:37.180 So if you look at Matthew 25 and the context of what Jesus is saying, he is talking about the persecuted church.

00:30:44.080 I've talked about this before, and Russell Moore said that it is Nazi language to point out this widely accepted interpretation of Matthew 25, which is that Jesus is talking about his persecuted brothers and sisters.

00:30:58.860 He is talking about persecuted Christians.

00:31:01.400 In other places, we are called to care for the poor in general.

00:31:04.920 But here, Jesus is talking about caring for those who are persecuted and who are mistreated in his name.

00:31:11.460 That's why he says, the least of these, my brothers.

00:31:15.620 So this is a complete misinterpretation and misapplication of Matthew 25.

00:31:21.760 You'll also hear people cite Exodus, that we should care for the foreigner.

00:31:26.080 Now, I want to point out a little bit of hypocrisy there, because the same people that point out the verse in Exodus that tells us to care for the foreigner, they reject the rest of Old Testament law giving when it comes to American policymaking.

00:31:39.220 Like, they will call me a Christian nationalist for saying, well, one of the Ten Commandments is thou shalt not murder, or pointing to Psalm 139 to look at the preciousness of life inside the womb. 0.56

00:31:50.560 That's scary Christian nationalism. 1.00

00:31:52.680 But they can go to the Old Testament and say, oh, well, God told ancient Israel to care for the foreigners, so we should too.

00:31:58.560 I just want them to pick a lane.

00:32:00.060 Like, if we're interested in applying all the biblical principles to American policy today, I say, let's go.

00:32:06.820 We also read in Exodus, Exodus 12, 49, there will be one law for the native and for the stranger who sojourns among you.

00:32:14.920 There is nowhere in the Old Testament or the New Testament that justifies the idea of illegal immigration, because, of course, illegal immigration is lawlessness.

00:32:23.680 It's anarchy. Lawlessness and anarchy are always depicted as satanic agents and satanic outcomes in Scripture.

00:32:31.820 Remember, the curse after the Tower of Babel, of people trying to build this building up to heaven to be more like God themselves, was a difference in language. 0.75

00:32:42.040 That caused chaos that was not good.

00:32:44.760 And now we're trying to actually do the same thing here in the United States, bringing a curse upon us.

00:32:50.060 We've got this very popular perspective on white evangelical Christian Instagram.

00:32:56.940 I won't post, like, the entire account, but this person posted, Jesus wasn't white.

00:33:03.380 Jesus wasn't American.

00:33:04.640 Jesus wasn't God and country.

00:33:06.100 He was God for the world.

00:33:07.200 He was an immigrant.

00:33:08.320 Nothing good could come out of Nazareth, they'd say.

00:33:10.500 He crossed cultural divides, et cetera, et cetera.

00:33:13.680 This is a straw man.

00:33:16.100 No one is claiming that Jesus was white.

00:33:18.100 No one is claiming that he was American.

00:33:22.300 No one is claiming any of these things to say it's just good sense for a country to have borders.

00:33:29.520 A city without walls is like a man without self-control.

00:33:32.600 That is a proverb that has a principle that still rings true today.

00:33:37.780 Read the book of Nehemiah.

00:33:39.160 Read Nehemiah 6 to see the wisdom of the walls that were built around Jerusalem in order to protect her.

00:33:46.040 The same is true today.

00:33:48.900 What do we always say?

00:33:50.120 That we were placed not in a jungle, but in a garden.

00:33:53.260 The difference between a garden and a jungle is order.

00:33:55.880 God is a God of order.

00:33:57.560 He created governments.

00:33:58.760 He created laws.

00:33:59.940 He created borders.

00:34:00.940 He created nations.

00:34:02.300 All of these things were his idea.

00:34:05.060 Now, can you believe in all of these biblically true things and also still have a problem with what happened with Alex Preddy, in your opinion?

00:34:13.920 Yes. 0.99

00:34:14.720 But do not allow your compassion to lead you to very stupid and evil places and advocate for borderlessness. 1.00

00:34:23.400 Remember, nations are like families. 0.99

00:34:25.900 Just as you are tasked with stewarding the lives and the protection of your children, so governments are tasked with protecting their people first.

00:34:34.700 Allowing unvetted strangers into your home does not make you a good neighbor. 1.00

00:34:38.600 It makes you a bad parent.

00:34:40.880 And just because you lock your door at night doesn't mean you hate your neighbors or hate your community or that you think all of them are murderers and thieves.

00:34:48.040 But you're thinking there might be one out there who is, so it's probably safe just to keep your door locked.

00:34:54.740 The same principles are true when it comes to caring for a nation.

00:34:59.360 And I also just want to remind you that while ICE is deporting all of these illegal aliens, that there are very real criminals who are being deported.

00:35:10.800 And we'll put some of their pictures up.

00:35:13.220 ICE reminds us of these people that they're deporting.

00:35:15.680 Many of them are sexual offenders. 0.63

00:35:18.220 Many of them serial drunk drivers. 0.99

00:35:21.060 Many of them have killed innocent people either accidentally or on purpose.

00:35:25.480 And these are the people that these protesters in Minneapolis are protecting.

00:35:29.780 And it's evil.

00:35:30.980 And I also just want to remind you that illegal immigration kills. 0.63

00:35:35.120 It kills unnecessarily.

00:35:37.300 We already have homegrown criminals here. 1.00

00:35:39.780 There is no just need to add to those by importing people who shouldn't be here. 1.00

00:35:45.300 I don't understand why this is hard for people to understand when they say, oh, well, you know, citizens commit crimes, too.

00:35:53.100 Sure.

00:35:53.320 Citizens commit crimes.

00:35:54.640 So is that your argument for importing more criminals?

00:35:56.860 I just want to show you some of the pictures of the people who have died very recently at the hands of illegal aliens, a.k.a. 0.95

00:36:04.240 people who should never have been here in the first place had we enforced just immigration law. 0.55

00:36:09.200 We've got Fletcher Harris and Skylar Provenza.

00:36:11.680 This is a sweet, young teenage couple who was killed by an illegal alien drunk driver.

00:36:18.360 Maverick Martin, a young boy.

00:36:21.020 Alex Wise.

00:36:22.640 You'll remember Kate Steinle.

00:36:24.820 Little Ivory Smith.

00:36:27.900 Remember Molly Tibbetts.

00:36:29.640 Remember Laken Riley.

00:36:30.900 Laken Riley brutally sexually assaulted and murdered by someone who snuck in under the Biden administration.

00:36:37.000 Look, all of these people, including Alex Preddy, including Renee Good, would be alive today if we had enforced common sense immigration law in the first place. 0.99

00:36:49.660 This is the sacrifice that we have decided to make, sadly, because we have stupid, lax immigration law. 0.94

00:36:57.680 OK, and it's really ugly and it's really sad, but this is why lawlessness and disorder when it comes to our nation and our protection and our security and our immigration process is so unjust and so wrong. 0.98

00:37:13.920 So just remember that.

00:37:15.380 I'm sure we'll be talking about this more, but I do want to move on to some things that I've been meaning to talk about for a couple of weeks now.

00:37:22.400 So we'll get into them in just a second.

00:37:23.940 Let me pause and go to our next sponsor for the day, and that is Alliance Defending Freedom.

00:37:29.700 Y'all, I love Alliance Defending Freedom so much.

00:37:32.460 I've had several of their clients on this show.

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00:37:51.020 They've represented so many young women who are fighting for fairness when it comes to women's athletics.

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00:38:32.040 All right.

00:38:33.060 Speaking of subjects in which women's compassion and empathy is weaponized for evil ends, surrogacy. 0.90

00:38:43.120 It's a subject that we've been talking about on the show for about six years.

00:38:46.940 Thanks to very wise women like Jennifer Law and Katie Faust for really bringing the ethical issues with this industry to so many people's attention. 0.97

00:38:56.280 We started talking about the ethics of hormonal birth control, the whole reproductive technology industry, including sperm and egg selling, surrogacy, IVF, and all of that a while ago.

00:39:08.140 When we first started talking about it, we got a ton of pushback, even from Christian conservatives.

00:39:12.840 And I understand why.

00:39:13.860 We like babies.

00:39:14.600 We want people to have kids.

00:39:15.820 And so if you don't think about it, you could justify an ends justify the means approach to having children.

00:39:23.100 But as you dig into the industry and just the practice itself, what it does to women's bodies, what it does to the physiology and psychology of babies, you see that it's actually a very disordered practice.

00:39:32.780 So whenever there is a celebrity that posts a picture glorifying this practice of surrogacy, I always use it as a way to kind of remind us that this is something that goes on and that is very, very harmful to both women and children.

00:39:47.020 So this time, it is singer Meghan Trainor.

00:39:50.420 And we can put up the picture that she has.

00:39:52.500 She shared a photo of herself holding her baby that she had through a surrogate.

00:39:57.440 She's having skin-to-skin contact after taking the child away from the woman who carried this little girl.

00:40:05.800 And look, images, as we've already talked about, we can put the image back up.

00:40:10.140 It's very powerful.

00:40:12.020 You see this image and it looks like a mother in her baby.

00:40:15.540 She's obviously very happy that happiness is sincere.

00:40:19.540 This really is her biological child.

00:40:22.200 So she loves this baby.

00:40:23.740 There is absolutely no doubt about that.

00:40:26.600 But Christians are not just called to feel.

00:40:28.620 We are not just called to see an image, to feel something, and then to make our decisions, especially big moral decisions that affect vulnerable children based on pictures that make us feel a certain way.

00:40:41.760 We've got to think more deeply than that.

00:40:44.320 And so this is how I responded on X, and it's kind of a kicking off point for what we're about to talk about.

00:40:50.880 Now, people are waking up to the fact that womb renting, which is what surrogacy is, is disordered and unethical.

00:40:58.380 Number one, the physiological bond created between a baby and the woman who carried her is necessary for the child's healthy development.

00:41:06.520 It is meant to continue after birth.

00:41:08.720 You see Megan doing skin-to-skin there.

00:41:10.700 But skin-to-skin with this woman, the woman who carried the child, not just anyone, regulates the baby's heart rate and makes the stark transition to the outside world more peaceful.

00:41:24.220 We somehow understand this when it comes to puppies and kittens, but not with human babies.

00:41:29.420 Puppies and kittens have to stay with the mom for eight plus weeks. 0.99

00:41:32.840 Yet when it comes to surrogacy, we take babies away from the only woman he or she has ever known.

00:41:38.600 Give them to people who, to them, are strangers.

00:41:42.180 And then number two, surrogate pregnancies are high risk for the surrogate and the baby.

00:41:46.740 They regularly result in preterm deliveries, late-term miscarriages, and NICU stays.

00:41:51.580 When moms hire a surrogate, they are transferring the risk that she would carry, so in this case that Megan would carry, to another woman and her child. 1.00

00:42:00.260 And then third point I wanted to make here, the surrogacy industry is inherently exploitative.

00:42:07.360 Women who need money sign hefty contracts, often with requirements to abort the baby if the parents so choose. 0.99

00:42:13.900 We have interviewed one of those surrogates to commodify their bodies. 1.00

00:42:18.140 There are no background checks for the parents who purchase these surrogates, which is why this is a method used in all kinds of child-buying schemes around the globe.

00:42:26.800 That's not what's going on in this story with Megan, but people should know that it is not all rainbows.

00:42:33.260 It is a very dark practice and industry.

00:42:37.340 So for those who don't know how surrogacy works, in this case, I assume that Megan Trainor used her own eggs. 1.00

00:42:43.580 So she has to pump herself with a lot of hormones in order to be able to ovulate artificially, and then they harvest the eggs from her body, and then they take this egg, and I suppose her husband's sperm, they put this together in a dish in a lab, and they make not just one embryo, but multiple embryos.

00:43:08.040 And typically, just like in the IVF process, these embryos are graded, and very often, especially in celebrity cases, you determine the gender of these embryos.

00:43:19.140 You determine if this embryo has some kind of special need, like Down syndrome or other kinds of chromosomal abnormalities.

00:43:30.680 Very often, these embryos who are not graded well, they're graded as weak or something else, they're thrown out.

00:43:38.460 Maybe they are forever frozen because you want a girl and you created six boys. 0.90

00:43:43.900 That happens very often.

00:43:45.380 Paris Hilton talked about having all of these embryos on ice because she wanted a little girl, and her embryos kept on being boys. 0.99

00:43:53.020 You even have fertility clinics or IVF clinics in places like California that can guarantee a certain eye color in the embryos.

00:44:01.600 All of this is possible.

00:44:03.500 This is all human experimentation that is happening completely legally in the United States because this industry is very lucrative.

00:44:11.900 So in this case, Meghan Trainor has probably made multiple embryos. 0.95

00:44:15.740 You transfer an embryo to a woman that you hire. 0.98

00:44:19.120 This is the surrogate.

00:44:20.240 The surrogate is typically not related to anyone, certainly not related to the child.

00:44:26.340 The surrogate has to be pumped with all of these artificial hormones so that the embryo will actually implant in her uterus. 1.00

00:44:33.960 And then she carries this child.

00:44:35.740 Because this is an unnatural process, this is very risky for everyone involved.

00:44:40.260 And the bond that's created between this baby and this woman knows the smell, knows the sound of the heartbeat, knows her voice.

00:44:48.500 All of that is very important.

00:44:50.240 In the psychological development of the child and creating that brokenness of bond on purpose at the moment of birth, I think is extremely unethical, immoral, and cruel.

00:45:01.540 Especially when we're talking about two men that are buying the eggs from one woman and then renting the womb of another woman, two separate women, and then taking that child away both from the biological mother and from the only body that he or she has ever known to put that baby on their hairy chest. 0.93

00:45:20.000 It's disgusting. 0.80

00:45:21.000 It is immoral in every single way.

00:45:23.840 Again, this is more cruelty that we show to human beings than we would ever show to puppies and kittens.

00:45:31.100 And it happens on a daily basis.

00:45:33.240 There was this other article that was going around a few weeks ago that I've been meaning to talk about, and it's from the Wall Street Journal.

00:45:40.600 Chinese use U.S. surrogacy industry for birth tourism. 0.96

00:45:45.700 I think that we have the headline to put up.

00:45:48.880 This article says,

00:45:50.020 A Wall Street Journal investigation revealed that an increasing number of ultra-wealthy Chinese individuals are using American surrogate mothers to have large numbers of children, sometimes dozens or even more than 100, in order to get U.S. citizenship.

00:46:06.300 Traditional birth tourism, where pregnant women travel to the U.S. to give birth so that the children are born citizens, has been dropping due to greater scrutiny and enforcement by authorities like the Trump FBI.

00:46:20.100 Now, birth tourists are taking advantage of the fact that the U.S., along with Ukraine, allows surrogacy for international clients, unlike most developed countries.

00:46:29.160 And so this is basically trafficking.

00:46:31.440 These women's bodies are being commodified. 1.00

00:46:34.320 Their wombs are being rented. 0.79

00:46:36.300 And these children are being used as pawns.

00:46:40.740 They are also being commercialized.

00:46:43.100 I mean, this is almost like a form of slavery that we're talking about here.

00:46:46.840 And then also when people say, well, you know, at least they consented to this.

00:46:51.760 Well, you can consent to being objectified, but objectifying a human being is still wrong.

00:46:58.580 The investigation into what was going on here highlighted the case of someone named Zhu Bo, a Chinese billionaire.

00:47:05.600 And the video game industry who has become a prominent example of this trans extremes. 0.99

00:47:10.500 Zhu sought legal parentage recognition for multiple children born via U.S. surrogates.

00:47:16.540 But in 2023, a California judge unusually denied his request in a system where such orders are normally granted routinely, leaving some children in legal uncertainty.

00:47:27.020 At the time, certain children were being looked after by nannies in Southern California while waiting for travel documents to leave the country.

00:47:34.660 These poor children.

00:47:35.580 I mean, think about how confusing and how disordered this is for them.

00:47:39.660 And again, this is happening to millions of people every year.

00:47:43.360 America is the wild, wild west for the reproductive technology industry.

00:47:48.380 And Christians in particular are way too silent about this because we want to pretend that this is being pro-baby.

00:47:54.860 Being pro-baby does not mean that you justify every means of creating a child.

00:48:00.580 We're not pro-rape, right?

00:48:02.180 And pro-rape or rape sometimes conceives a child.

00:48:05.300 So we don't support this ends, justifies, and means method to procuring children.

00:48:11.540 Children are a gift.

00:48:13.220 Children are a privilege.

00:48:14.660 Children are not a right. 0.97

00:48:16.520 You don't, you are not entitled to a child just because you get to pay for it.

00:48:20.660 And remember, these people don't have to go through background checks.

00:48:25.380 Children have a right to a mother and father.

00:48:28.160 Ideally, their mother and father.

00:48:30.320 But if not, then through adoption or some ethical means, which really is just adoption, whether it's a private adoption or through the state, they should still be entitled to a mother and father.

00:48:43.760 We are creating this grand social experiment at the expense of kids.

00:48:47.760 And it's just sad.

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00:50:08.440 What do we always say?

00:50:09.700 Children are always the unconsenting subjects of progressive social experiments, whether it comes to surrogacy or whether it is the redefinition of marriage and parenting or whether it's COVID lockdowns or whether it's abortion or whether it's even illegal immigration.

00:50:29.380 Children are the ones who pay the price for that and they don't have the political power.

00:50:34.960 They don't have the capital to be able to stop it.

00:50:37.760 And we see that here.

00:50:39.860 We don't really know the long-term consequences of a child being created to be taken away from the woman who carries him or to be raised motherless.

00:50:51.340 Christians are called to care for the fatherless, but motherlessness is really a historic anomaly.

00:50:56.120 It just doesn't happen very much.

00:50:57.540 But we've manufactured motherlessness by saying two men can pretend to be a mom and a dad and take a child away from his mother.

00:51:08.520 It's actually very sick and saddening.

00:51:10.520 This particular story that we were reading about in the Wall Street Journal, that guy, Zubo, the billionaire from the video game industry, their network was questioned about the number of this guy's children.

00:51:23.840 And the company, I don't know how to pronounce it, Dowie Network, confirmed that after years of surrogacy efforts in the U.S., he has only, only a little over 100 children.

00:51:38.440 OK, this is an immigration story.

00:51:41.040 This is a child trafficking story.

00:51:43.800 This is, I think, a form of prostitution story. 0.99

00:51:46.840 I mean, you're paying someone to use their body.

00:51:51.100 It is it is prostitution. 1.00

00:51:54.000 And so, I mean, this is should so obviously be unethical and illegal in every way.

00:51:59.980 It's hard for me to see.

00:52:01.420 Well, I can see why America wouldn't crack down on it.

00:52:04.420 It makes a lot of money.

00:52:05.580 And the reproductive technology industry is very powerful because of that.

00:52:09.520 There was a 2024 study published in the Journal of Fertility and Sterility by the American Society for Reproductive Medicine that analyzed international commercial surrogacy contracts in the U.S. from 2014 to 2020.

00:52:23.860 The study found that the percentage of gestational carrier cycles involving international parents nearly doubled from 2014, 22 percent to 20 to 39.7 percent in 2020, before dropping off slightly to 31.8 percent.

00:52:42.480 And the study showed that Chinese nationals accounted for 41.7 percent of these international surrogacy agreements, making them the largest group driving the rent-a-womb industry.

00:52:55.500 And so when you think about the stories that come across your feed, the woman who went through and then survived ovarian cancer was only able to have a baby by freezing her eggs and then using a surrogate.

00:53:09.400 Or when you come across this very sweet picture of Meghan Trainor, it's very easy for us to feel and to arrest our thinking and to say, you know what, I'm just not going to think about that because this person wanted a baby and I'm just glad they're happy.

00:53:23.380 But that kind of thinking that is so prevalent among all of us as women is actually what allows us to be silent and complicit in this widespread evil practice.

00:53:34.300 Now, I am a hardliner on this.

00:53:37.220 I think surrogacy is always wrong no matter what, because unlike an adoption, you are purposely creating the child to be separated from his mother or from the woman who carried him.

00:53:49.120 Like you are purposely creating that brokenness.

00:53:51.620 Whereas when a child is conceived and then adopted out or given to adoptive parents, that wasn't intentional.

00:54:01.140 The baby wasn't conceived with the intention of breaking that bond.

00:54:05.240 But when you're talking about egg selling, when you're talking about sperm selling, when you're talking about surrogacy, you are intentionally creating that brokenness in order to satisfy adult desires.

00:54:15.860 So you're sacrificing the well-being of a child on the altar of adult desires, and that is disordered.

00:54:22.820 Parents were created to put our desires last and put the needs of our children first.

00:54:29.000 And if you start that in a disordered way during conception, then you're not really set up well for the rest of your parenting experience.

00:54:38.980 Senator Rick Scott, thankfully, introduced something called the Safe Kids Act in November of 2025.

00:54:45.860 A bill that would prohibit foreign nationals from adversarial countries like China from participating in the U.S. commercial surrogacy industry.

00:54:53.840 And in January 2025, President Trump issued an executive order titled Protecting the Meaning and Value of American Citizenship, which has prompted a renewed examination of birthright citizenship, especially when it is acquired through legal loopholes rather than authentic connections to the United States.

00:55:10.620 Shortly after the executive order was issued, surrogacy organizations released guidance aimed at preserving the citizenship pathway.

00:55:17.440 That's good.

00:55:18.220 With immigration lawyers and agencies arguing that a child born to a U.S. citizen surrogate should still qualify for automatic citizenship.

00:55:25.560 That's not good.

00:55:26.560 Even if the intended parents are foreign nationals.

00:55:29.060 Like, how can you not see that that is just enabling and exacerbating human trafficking, international human trafficking?

00:55:35.740 I think they do see that.

00:55:37.880 I think surrogacy agencies are complicit in this, knowingly complicit in this, just the same way that Planned Parenthood knows that there are children, that there are girls being brought in against their will who are being trafficked, prostituted, raped to have abortions to cover up the men's crimes that are buying their bodies.

00:55:59.280 I think that Planned Parenthood knows that they sell fetal tissue to different organizations that are doing research.

00:56:09.840 And in the same way, I think that these surrogacy agencies are participating in evil knowingly.

00:56:17.700 And when you think about that women and children, consenting or not, are all kind of at the center of this scheme, of this objectification and commercialization of bodies scheme, it just makes you, again, go all the way back to the garden.

00:56:36.580 And I know we do this on every episode, but everything we talk about, like, reminds me of the order than the disorder that occurred when Satan tempted Eve.

00:56:46.920 And she said, yes, because of her lust, because of her mistrust of God, did God really say?

00:56:52.440 Obviously, Satan had it out for women, but Satan obviously has it out for children. 0.99

00:56:57.320 Satan is going to be defeated by a king who came to earth first as an embryo.

00:57:03.440 And Satan loves to prey upon the minds of children, the bodies of children.

00:57:09.300 Child sacrifice is a tale as old as time, something that God prohibited from the very beginning, but something that Satan loves.

00:57:17.360 So when I say children are always the subjects of progressive social experiments, that's not just a political statement.

00:57:24.080 I actually think it's a spiritual one, too, because the powers of darkness hate the innocence of children.

00:57:30.000 And Jesus Christ changed everything.

00:57:32.240 He changed everything because he came as a savior, not in the form of an adult warrior king that so many expected him to, but first as an embryo, and then was heralded by the kicks of an unborn John the Baptist, was worshipped in a manger as a newborn, and then against the protestation of his disciples said,

00:57:51.840 No, let the little children come to me, for such as these belong the kingdom of heaven.

00:57:56.360 Jesus and then his followers changed how the world saw children.

00:58:00.160 And so I think it is 100% the responsibility of Christians to continue to stand up for children from the embryonic stages onward.

00:58:08.880 Like, we understand that a life is a life no matter how small when it comes to abortion, but for some reason, a lot of Christian pro-lifers when it comes to IVF,

00:58:17.040 and when it comes to all these reproductive issues, just don't want to wade into it.

00:58:21.860 It's inconsistency, it's ignorance, and it's fear, and the time is done for all of that.

00:58:26.740 So let's start speaking up about the things that matter, especially on behalf of kids.

00:58:30.660 All right, I've got more to say about the biblical perspective on this, and that's where we'll end.

00:58:34.300 But let me pause, tell you about our last sponsor for the day, and that is Patriot Mobile.

00:58:37.820 I'm so thankful that Patriot Mobile is America's Christian, conservative, wireless provider.

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00:58:57.120 So many of these big companies are donating dollars to organizations that are directly working against us,

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00:59:27.200 I was thinking about this last night because we were reading in our Bible.

00:59:31.560 Actually, was that last night or this morning that we were reading in Genesis about Abraham?

00:59:35.920 It was just this morning.

00:59:36.980 Wow, it's been a long day.

00:59:38.260 We were, Chief Related Bro and I were reading about Abraham and Sarah and the decisions that he made based on fear and all of that.

00:59:47.360 And we were reading about Hagar and how Hagar was used basically as a surrogate, obviously in a different way.

00:59:54.120 They didn't have egg donation and egg selling back then. 0.66

00:59:56.680 But because Sarah couldn't have a child, they then used Hagar, the concubine, the slave woman, to have Ishmael. 0.75

01:00:07.100 And, you know, it's funny.

01:00:08.040 Whenever I'm arguing with Christians about the ethics of surrogacy, they'll point to this. 0.99

01:00:12.060 They'll say, well, surrogacy is in the Bible.

01:00:15.460 Look, mo' wives, mo' problems in the Bible. 1.00

01:00:18.480 Things are descriptive in Scripture that are not prescriptive.

01:00:22.640 So just because the Bible describes something doesn't mean that it is prescribing it.

01:00:28.000 And actually, we saw so much jealousy, so many problems, so much pain for Hagar and for Ishmael and for Sarah and for Abraham because of this situation.

01:00:39.560 You can read, I won't read all of this because it's long, but in Genesis 16, we read about this,

01:00:45.540 that really Sarai didn't trust the Lord, and that's why they used the surrogate.

01:00:50.380 And Sarai said to Abram, may the wrong done to me be on you.

01:00:54.860 I gave my servant to your embrace, and when she saw that she had conceived, she looked on me with contempt. 0.89

01:00:59.980 May the Lord judge between you and me.

01:01:02.600 But Abram said to Sarai, behold, your servant is in your power.

01:01:05.380 Do to her as you please.

01:01:06.520 Then Sarai dealt harshly with her, and she fled from her.

01:01:11.140 And then, of course, later we see that when Sarah actually was given a child by God, when she delivered Isaac,

01:01:19.480 she wanted nothing to do with Hagar and Ishmael and basically pushed them away, and they had to flee. 0.94

01:01:25.480 And so this caused all kinds of divisiveness and pain because they didn't trust the Lord and because they used surrogacy.

01:01:33.500 We also read in Genesis 30, when Rachel saw that she bore Jacob no children, she envied her sister.

01:01:39.620 She said to Jacob, give me children or I shall die. 0.98

01:01:41.900 Jacob's anger was kindled against Rachel, and he said, am I in the place of God who has withheld from you the fruit of the womb?

01:01:47.760 Then she said, here is my servant.

01:01:49.660 Go into her so that she may give birth on my behalf, that even I may have children through her. 0.61

01:01:56.440 And so the servant did so.

01:01:58.280 Then Rachel said, God has judged me and has also heard my voice and given me a son.

01:02:02.860 Therefore, she called his name Dan.

01:02:04.180 So this highlights, once again, the envy and the rivalry, again, that can come up because of the use of the servant as a surrogate.

01:02:14.820 I'm not saying that this describes every situation of surrogacy in the United States today, but this is not a prescription.

01:02:21.860 Remember that children are a gift from the Lord.

01:02:25.320 Psalm 127.3 says,

01:02:27.120 And so I think a lot of times we think that this is something that we are entitled to, but we are not.

01:02:39.040 And having children and desiring children is a very good desire, but we do not have an entitlement or a right to have or to fulfill all of the desires that we have on earth.

01:02:51.800 There are ethical ways to go about that, like through adoption and unethical ways to do that.

01:02:58.100 Remember that our bodies are a temple of the Holy Spirit.

01:03:01.520 And so renting them out or getting paid to use our body, even if it seems altruistic, but in a way that actually harms us and hurts a child, even for the benefit of parents who want that child, is not okay.

01:03:18.040 1 Corinthians 6.19-20.

01:03:20.700 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God?

01:03:25.880 You are not your own, for you were bought with a price.

01:03:28.160 So glorify God in your body.

01:03:30.780 So this underscores the sanctity of the body, opposing the commodification that comes through surrogacy.

01:03:36.660 So Meghan Trainor, I'm sure she loves her children.

01:03:39.460 I have no doubt about that.

01:03:40.600 And I'm sure that she is a great mom.

01:03:43.660 It's not about that.

01:03:44.960 It is about causing brokenness intentionally and service to your own desires.

01:03:49.760 No matter what we are talking about, that's always wrong.

01:03:52.860 But especially when it comes to sacrificing children.

01:03:55.580 And remember, the dark, dark world that is underneath the surface of pictures like that reproductive technology industry is trafficking children every single day in the name of just wanting to be a parent.

01:04:09.620 And Christians have the responsibility to speak out about that.

01:04:13.240 All right.

01:04:13.540 I want us to be Christian thinkers, not just Christian feelers.

01:04:16.660 The world needs that now more than ever.

01:04:18.940 We will be back here on Friday.

01:04:20.460 We will be back here on Friday.

01:04:46.660 We will be back here on Friday.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - January 28, 2026

Ep 1295 ｜ The Sad Truth Behind Meghan Trainor’s Surrogacy Story

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